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Did you feel anything at all
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00:00:36,332 --> 00:00:39,769
about the little
red room downstairs?
3
00:00:39,770 --> 00:00:42,685
That was like a secret room.
4
00:00:42,686 --> 00:00:45,209
And that was described as
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00:00:45,210 --> 00:00:47,385
the gateway to hell.
6
00:00:47,386 --> 00:00:49,779
If the red room is there,
7
00:00:49,780 --> 00:00:51,912
then there really is
something supernatural
8
00:00:51,913 --> 00:00:53,827
or satanic about the house.
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00:00:53,828 --> 00:00:55,306
I'm not sure.
10
00:00:55,307 --> 00:00:58,920
I think it was just a
concrete wall painted red.
11
00:01:04,142 --> 00:01:06,056
My name is Patty Commarato.
12
00:01:06,057 --> 00:01:07,971
I was friends with
Allison DeFeo,
13
00:01:07,972 --> 00:01:10,278
the girl who was murdered
with the rest of her family
14
00:01:10,279 --> 00:01:12,106
here in 1974.
15
00:01:12,107 --> 00:01:14,108
This is the red room.
16
00:01:14,109 --> 00:01:16,153
Nothing more than a storage area
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00:01:16,154 --> 00:01:19,896
where Allison and her brothers
and I used to keep toys.
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00:01:19,897 --> 00:01:22,159
Just red, you know?
19
00:01:22,160 --> 00:01:27,512
There's never any feeling
of spirit presence or ghosts
20
00:01:27,513 --> 00:01:30,168
or any sort of thing like that.
21
00:01:52,277 --> 00:01:54,279
Get out.
22
00:03:14,229 --> 00:03:15,838
Haven't you made a lot of money
23
00:03:15,839 --> 00:03:18,319
out of this story,
whether it is true or not,
24
00:03:18,320 --> 00:03:21,148
to the point where
people might well say
25
00:03:21,149 --> 00:03:22,497
they can't properly judge it
26
00:03:22,498 --> 00:03:25,456
because it's been a
profit-making enterprise
27
00:03:25,457 --> 00:03:27,023
to tell the story?
28
00:03:27,024 --> 00:03:29,025
We didn't write the book.
29
00:03:29,026 --> 00:03:30,374
But are you not
involved in the profits
30
00:03:30,375 --> 00:03:31,898
of the book in some way?
31
00:03:31,899 --> 00:03:33,464
We're involved with
32
00:03:33,465 --> 00:03:38,252
the author, Jay
Anson, on profits.
33
00:03:38,253 --> 00:03:40,994
There is also...
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00:03:40,995 --> 00:03:46,216
We've been accused on occasion
of fabricating a hoax.
35
00:03:46,217 --> 00:03:50,481
And it's very hard
to live a lie.
36
00:03:50,482 --> 00:03:54,442
To daily come up against people
who point a finger and say,
37
00:03:54,443 --> 00:03:56,226
"This can't be.
38
00:03:56,227 --> 00:03:59,534
"You went and you
bought this house
39
00:03:59,535 --> 00:04:01,101
"just to make a book,
40
00:04:01,102 --> 00:04:04,582
"to take your children
and to put them into this
41
00:04:04,583 --> 00:04:07,281
"and to stand them up
in front of the public
42
00:04:07,282 --> 00:04:09,065
"and let the public
ridicule them
43
00:04:09,066 --> 00:04:12,330
for the rest of their lives
for a few dollars." No.
44
00:04:18,380 --> 00:04:21,425
Our parents sold us
out for $275 a head
45
00:04:21,426 --> 00:04:25,386
for the children to be
depicted in the film.
46
00:04:25,387 --> 00:04:29,216
George became obsessed with
this moneymaking venture
47
00:04:29,217 --> 00:04:32,088
from this Amityville story.
48
00:04:32,089 --> 00:04:36,528
And he felt that it was
fine to add fiction to it.
49
00:04:37,965 --> 00:04:40,053
But I know what happened.
50
00:04:40,054 --> 00:04:42,011
You don't get to
play it off like
51
00:04:42,012 --> 00:04:46,015
you were a hero to the family
52
00:04:46,016 --> 00:04:48,889
when you're a perpetrator.
53
00:04:59,073 --> 00:05:03,728
In my closet, there
was a paneling
54
00:05:03,729 --> 00:05:09,430
that revealed an
area behind the wall.
55
00:05:09,431 --> 00:05:12,476
That would have been
where Ronald DeFeo hid
56
00:05:12,477 --> 00:05:18,221
the things that he was trying
to hide from his parents.
57
00:05:18,222 --> 00:05:23,226
Looking in there, there
was two bags of capsules,
58
00:05:23,227 --> 00:05:26,142
pills.
59
00:05:26,143 --> 00:05:28,362
Exactly what kind they were,
60
00:05:28,363 --> 00:05:29,972
I didn't find out
61
00:05:29,973 --> 00:05:35,978
until questioning George
way later in life.
62
00:05:35,979 --> 00:05:38,763
And he was really surprised
that I remembered.
63
00:05:38,764 --> 00:05:40,636
He said they were quaaludes.
64
00:05:43,639 --> 00:05:46,423
So now, I don't know
how quaaludes...
65
00:05:46,424 --> 00:05:48,251
I've never taken them,
so I don't know exactly
66
00:05:48,252 --> 00:05:50,253
how they'd react on the body...
67
00:05:50,254 --> 00:05:52,168
But I do know this:
68
00:05:52,169 --> 00:05:56,347
George had a very different
change in his demeanor...
69
00:05:59,785 --> 00:06:03,005
where he no longer
went into work,
70
00:06:03,006 --> 00:06:07,531
he no longer was
doing personal care.
71
00:06:07,532 --> 00:06:10,273
He became obsessed with
just sitting around the fire
72
00:06:10,274 --> 00:06:13,668
and obsessed with his
boats and his boathouse.
73
00:06:13,669 --> 00:06:17,020
And so to me, that
sounds like a drug binge.
74
00:06:18,543 --> 00:06:21,589
Mama!
75
00:06:21,590 --> 00:06:24,636
Oh, mama! Mama!
76
00:06:43,481 --> 00:06:46,353
We were going to do a sequel
77
00:06:46,354 --> 00:06:48,746
to The Amityville Horror.
78
00:06:48,747 --> 00:06:50,096
We're going to do a second book,
79
00:06:50,097 --> 00:06:52,489
absolutely non-fiction.
80
00:06:52,490 --> 00:06:56,232
We spent the money that we
made from the first book
81
00:06:56,233 --> 00:07:00,497
and from the movie to hire
the writer John Jones.
82
00:07:00,498 --> 00:07:03,500
And then subsequently
go back and interview
83
00:07:03,501 --> 00:07:05,241
all the other people
that had helped us
84
00:07:05,242 --> 00:07:08,201
and had been involved with us
85
00:07:08,202 --> 00:07:10,551
while we were in the
house and afterwards,
86
00:07:10,552 --> 00:07:13,293
telling their stories.
87
00:07:13,294 --> 00:07:15,382
George hired a ghostwriter
88
00:07:15,383 --> 00:07:16,513
for the second book.
89
00:07:16,514 --> 00:07:18,428
And he wanted me to come out
90
00:07:18,429 --> 00:07:21,692
and help with all of that.
91
00:07:21,693 --> 00:07:24,653
And that's when I
moved out to San Diego.
92
00:07:29,614 --> 00:07:32,703
George and Kathy
wanted my recollections
93
00:07:32,704 --> 00:07:36,446
of all these things
that had transpired.
94
00:07:36,447 --> 00:07:39,493
I actually went
out to California.
95
00:07:39,494 --> 00:07:41,364
It turns out,
96
00:07:41,365 --> 00:07:43,366
George seemed to think that
97
00:07:43,367 --> 00:07:45,586
whatever type of
entity was in the house
98
00:07:45,587 --> 00:07:47,370
followed them to California.
99
00:07:47,371 --> 00:07:49,764
And he said to me, "Well,
when we were on the plane
100
00:07:49,765 --> 00:07:52,506
"going to San Diego,
Missy was sitting there
101
00:07:52,507 --> 00:07:54,683
"and said, 'Oh, look,
Jody is on the wing.'"
102
00:08:01,777 --> 00:08:07,260
Missy had a very high
degree of sensitivity.
103
00:08:07,261 --> 00:08:10,698
She truly believed that
they were little playmates
104
00:08:10,699 --> 00:08:13,396
that were there.
105
00:08:13,397 --> 00:08:15,485
It was... it was frightening.
106
00:08:15,486 --> 00:08:20,622
It was very, very,
very, very frightening.
107
00:08:23,538 --> 00:08:26,366
The Warrens became
a part of our lives.
108
00:08:26,367 --> 00:08:28,585
They'd visit us out
in... Out in California
109
00:08:28,586 --> 00:08:30,631
when we were living there.
110
00:08:30,632 --> 00:08:33,286
And the Warrens
started testing us kids
111
00:08:33,287 --> 00:08:36,594
for psychic abilities.
112
00:08:39,641 --> 00:08:43,774
We were walking alone
with the children.
113
00:08:43,775 --> 00:08:48,605
And those innocent little
kids were relating to us
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00:08:48,606 --> 00:08:51,739
without us asking questions
115
00:08:51,740 --> 00:08:55,831
about things that occurred
to them in that house.
116
00:09:02,316 --> 00:09:03,620
I remember Father Ray
117
00:09:03,621 --> 00:09:06,797
coming to California one time.
118
00:09:06,798 --> 00:09:09,496
It was Father Ray that
suggested that we move out of
119
00:09:09,497 --> 00:09:12,194
the Amityville house.
120
00:09:12,195 --> 00:09:14,457
I felt safe around him.
121
00:09:14,458 --> 00:09:17,417
I remember I just ran
to him and jumped at him
122
00:09:17,418 --> 00:09:21,334
and he picked me up
and I... I just wept.
123
00:09:21,335 --> 00:09:25,903
I remember George asking
later, "Why'd you cry?"
124
00:09:25,904 --> 00:09:27,731
I did ask Father Ray,
125
00:09:27,732 --> 00:09:31,300
"Did you hear a
disembodied voice
126
00:09:31,301 --> 00:09:33,476
"telling you to get out?
127
00:09:33,477 --> 00:09:36,610
"Did you feel something
smack you in the face?
128
00:09:36,611 --> 00:09:37,959
Did that happen?"
129
00:09:37,960 --> 00:09:40,701
And he said "Yes,
that did happen.
130
00:09:40,702 --> 00:09:42,224
That's accurate."
131
00:09:42,225 --> 00:09:44,227
Get out.
132
00:09:46,360 --> 00:09:47,664
Get out!
133
00:09:47,665 --> 00:09:49,666
I vaguely remember it.
134
00:09:49,667 --> 00:09:51,886
I remember James Brolin,
that's the main thing,
135
00:09:51,887 --> 00:09:55,237
and flies or
something like that.
136
00:09:55,238 --> 00:09:57,326
Well, it was a
haunted house movie.
137
00:09:57,327 --> 00:10:00,896
So for me, it's how
well is it done?
138
00:10:03,812 --> 00:10:08,859
Haunted house movies,
they began in France.
139
00:10:08,860 --> 00:10:13,516
I guess the earliest
was George Méliès,
140
00:10:13,517 --> 00:10:15,953
1890s,
141
00:10:15,954 --> 00:10:20,480
and they've always been with us.
142
00:10:20,481 --> 00:10:22,830
It's always the same
kind of basic story.
143
00:10:22,831 --> 00:10:24,788
House is haunted.
144
00:10:24,789 --> 00:10:26,790
People come in.
145
00:10:26,791 --> 00:10:28,618
They get terrorized.
146
00:10:28,619 --> 00:10:31,012
They don't leave like
normal people would,
147
00:10:31,013 --> 00:10:32,841
they stay like movie people do.
148
00:10:36,932 --> 00:10:40,762
Horror is a great
allegorical genre.
149
00:10:43,330 --> 00:10:46,506
Everybody is afraid
in the entire world.
150
00:10:46,507 --> 00:10:47,986
We're born afraid.
151
00:10:50,902 --> 00:10:53,382
We are afraid of
the same things.
152
00:10:53,383 --> 00:10:55,559
It's a universal feeling.
153
00:10:57,605 --> 00:11:01,738
Humor changes sometimes
from country to country.
154
00:11:01,739 --> 00:11:03,436
The horror never changes.
155
00:11:03,437 --> 00:11:07,571
It's a powerful medium
when it's done right.
156
00:11:15,318 --> 00:11:18,973
Part of where the title
Get Out came from,
157
00:11:18,974 --> 00:11:21,715
this goes back to the
old Eddie Murphy routine.
158
00:11:21,716 --> 00:11:23,456
In The Amityville Horror,
the ghost told them
159
00:11:23,457 --> 00:11:24,805
to get out the house.
160
00:11:24,806 --> 00:11:26,546
White people stayed in there.
161
00:11:26,547 --> 00:11:29,462
Now that's a hint and
a half for your ass.
162
00:11:29,463 --> 00:11:30,854
A ghost say get the fuck out,
163
00:11:30,855 --> 00:11:33,074
I would just tip the
fuck out the door.
164
00:11:33,075 --> 00:11:36,425
And he did this Amityville
bit of like, "Get out."
165
00:11:36,426 --> 00:11:37,948
We got a chandelier
hanging up here,
166
00:11:37,949 --> 00:11:40,734
kids outside playing, it's
a beautiful neighborhood.
167
00:11:40,735 --> 00:11:41,735
We ain't got nothing to
worry... I really love...
168
00:11:41,736 --> 00:11:42,997
This is really nice...
169
00:11:42,998 --> 00:11:45,000
"Get out." Too bad
we can't stay, baby.
170
00:11:55,880 --> 00:11:57,446
I'm wondering if you ever saw
171
00:11:57,447 --> 00:11:58,969
Amityville II: The Possession?
172
00:11:58,970 --> 00:12:01,798
Please no, please.
173
00:12:01,799 --> 00:12:04,453
Please, please.
174
00:12:04,454 --> 00:12:05,802
No, life's too short
for some of this.
175
00:12:05,803 --> 00:12:08,632
Now, come on.
176
00:12:37,574 --> 00:12:40,141
I guess the light's
changing, right?
177
00:12:40,142 --> 00:12:41,490
Let me know when you're ready.
178
00:12:41,491 --> 00:12:43,492
I'm gonna just stick
this back there.
179
00:12:43,493 --> 00:12:45,668
Sound is speeding.
180
00:12:45,669 --> 00:12:48,062
Diane Franklin
interview, take one.
181
00:12:48,063 --> 00:12:50,412
- It's changing, right?
- Yep.
182
00:12:50,413 --> 00:12:51,371
Thank you.
183
00:12:55,505 --> 00:12:57,071
My name is Diane Franklin.
184
00:12:57,072 --> 00:12:59,552
And I was the actress
who played the daughter
185
00:12:59,553 --> 00:13:02,077
in the film Amityville
II: The Possession.
186
00:13:03,818 --> 00:13:07,081
The film is about a young family
187
00:13:07,082 --> 00:13:08,865
that moves to the suburbs
188
00:13:08,866 --> 00:13:10,737
trying to start a new life.
189
00:13:10,738 --> 00:13:13,000
I played Patricia Montelli,
190
00:13:13,001 --> 00:13:16,090
based on Dawn DeFeo.
191
00:13:16,091 --> 00:13:17,831
The minute they
come into the house,
192
00:13:17,832 --> 00:13:21,574
there is an energy
that is not normal.
193
00:13:21,575 --> 00:13:22,750
Take off your nightgown.
194
00:13:26,188 --> 00:13:27,493
There.
195
00:13:27,494 --> 00:13:29,712
And with that story,
196
00:13:29,713 --> 00:13:31,671
I don't think anyone
197
00:13:31,672 --> 00:13:36,023
has tackled the subject
of incest that real.
198
00:13:36,024 --> 00:13:39,722
The stories of the brother
who takes on this energy,
199
00:13:39,723 --> 00:13:44,119
taking on the poison of the
family and the household.
200
00:13:47,557 --> 00:13:50,559
She sees this monster
about to shoot her
201
00:13:50,560 --> 00:13:53,867
and she believes he won't
shoot me, he loves me.
202
00:13:53,868 --> 00:13:54,912
What are you doing?
203
00:13:58,481 --> 00:13:59,829
And if you just look
from where you are
204
00:13:59,830 --> 00:14:02,745
and just look at my hand,
it's out of the shot.
205
00:14:02,746 --> 00:14:04,747
- So look out the window again.
- Right.
206
00:14:04,748 --> 00:14:06,488
And just turn to
look at my hand.
207
00:14:06,489 --> 00:14:07,447
Just keep it there.
208
00:14:09,623 --> 00:14:11,711
Okay, and then walk to you.
209
00:14:11,712 --> 00:14:13,453
And then just walk towards me.
210
00:14:15,019 --> 00:14:16,759
Because of Amityville Horror,
211
00:14:16,760 --> 00:14:19,196
I don't believe I'll
ever get out of prison.
212
00:14:19,197 --> 00:14:21,851
You know, they made
a monster out of me.
213
00:14:21,852 --> 00:14:23,505
And the public is
terrified of me
214
00:14:23,506 --> 00:14:25,943
and they don't want me
back out on the street.
215
00:14:30,774 --> 00:14:33,602
I spent the years 2004 to 2007
216
00:14:33,603 --> 00:14:37,606
in prison with Ronnie DeFeo.
217
00:14:37,607 --> 00:14:40,130
In prison, they show
a lot of movies.
218
00:14:40,131 --> 00:14:43,003
But they never showed any of
the Amityville Horror movies
219
00:14:43,004 --> 00:14:45,788
in Green Haven because
Ronnie was there.
220
00:14:45,789 --> 00:14:48,095
And Ronnie would have
made a big old stink
221
00:14:48,096 --> 00:14:51,578
about how showing the movie
would put him in danger.
222
00:14:54,668 --> 00:14:58,540
He also blamed them for
his parole problems.
223
00:14:58,541 --> 00:15:00,586
An Amityville Horror movie
came out at the same time
224
00:15:00,587 --> 00:15:02,283
as his parole hearing.
225
00:15:02,284 --> 00:15:04,067
And he claimed that this made it
226
00:15:04,068 --> 00:15:06,592
absolutely impossible for
him to get a fair hearing.
227
00:15:06,593 --> 00:15:09,900
And that's why he
was denied parole.
228
00:15:13,687 --> 00:15:15,557
It's all because of
those fucking movies,
229
00:15:15,558 --> 00:15:18,778
not because he had
killed six people.
230
00:15:18,779 --> 00:15:20,214
You want me to look
out the window first
231
00:15:20,215 --> 00:15:21,998
and look at Neil's hand
and then walk into Neil.
232
00:15:21,999 --> 00:15:23,217
When he first told me
233
00:15:23,218 --> 00:15:25,611
that the mob rubbed
out his family,
234
00:15:25,612 --> 00:15:28,962
I of course nodded and
said, "Sorry that happened."
235
00:15:28,963 --> 00:15:31,573
It took about a
little over a year
236
00:15:31,574 --> 00:15:33,140
for him to start telling
me a different story.
237
00:15:33,141 --> 00:15:34,837
And go.
238
00:15:34,838 --> 00:15:36,839
Ronnie talked to me
in a hushed voice
239
00:15:36,840 --> 00:15:40,147
and he said, "You know,
it's really fucked up.
240
00:15:40,148 --> 00:15:42,976
"My sister, Dawn,
241
00:15:42,977 --> 00:15:44,760
"murdered my family.
242
00:15:44,761 --> 00:15:47,328
"The only way I survived was by
243
00:15:47,329 --> 00:15:49,678
"taking the gun away
and shooting her.
244
00:15:49,679 --> 00:15:51,158
"It was the worst
thing I ever did.
245
00:15:51,159 --> 00:15:52,203
It was horrible."
246
00:15:54,249 --> 00:15:56,685
I heard a roar. You
know, it was a gunshot.
247
00:15:56,686 --> 00:15:58,687
It was loud.
248
00:15:58,688 --> 00:16:01,951
I soon entered my father's room.
249
00:16:01,952 --> 00:16:06,956
I pushed the light
button on the wall there.
250
00:16:06,957 --> 00:16:09,393
I saw a hole in my
father's back... one hole.
251
00:16:09,394 --> 00:16:11,221
I ran across the hallway, right?
252
00:16:11,222 --> 00:16:13,702
And I saw my little
sister there,
253
00:16:13,703 --> 00:16:15,965
you know.
254
00:16:15,966 --> 00:16:18,054
I started really getting
crazy there, you know.
255
00:16:18,055 --> 00:16:21,101
I saw her... with
her head, you know...
256
00:16:21,102 --> 00:16:22,668
Blood running down
the side of her head.
257
00:16:22,669 --> 00:16:24,234
I ran upstairs then.
258
00:16:24,235 --> 00:16:27,324
The only one alive in
the house was my sister.
259
00:16:27,325 --> 00:16:29,065
I went off.
260
00:16:29,066 --> 00:16:30,763
I threw her across the room.
261
00:16:30,764 --> 00:16:32,852
She went flying, landed
in the bed on her stomach.
262
00:16:32,853 --> 00:16:34,201
That's when I grabbed the rifle.
263
00:16:34,202 --> 00:16:36,638
It was all one big motion.
264
00:16:36,639 --> 00:16:37,944
I... I killed her.
265
00:16:37,945 --> 00:16:41,121
I shot my sister in the head.
266
00:16:41,122 --> 00:16:42,731
Like I say, I just lost it.
267
00:16:42,732 --> 00:16:44,299
It just happened so
quick, I lost it.
268
00:16:52,350 --> 00:16:56,745
Over the years, Ron DeFeo
had several versions of
269
00:16:56,746 --> 00:17:00,314
how his sister, Dawn,
was one of the shooters.
270
00:17:00,315 --> 00:17:02,751
And this story changed
over the decades.
271
00:17:02,752 --> 00:17:06,276
It wasn't just one "Dawn
was involved" story.
272
00:17:06,277 --> 00:17:08,714
My father writes
in his book that
273
00:17:08,715 --> 00:17:10,759
he characterizes
the accusation that
274
00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:14,198
Dawn was one of the
killers as preposterous.
275
00:17:26,210 --> 00:17:29,125
He thought that it
was unlikely that
276
00:17:29,126 --> 00:17:33,695
a young woman who had no
known experience with firearms
277
00:17:33,696 --> 00:17:36,959
would be able to so expertly
move from room to room
278
00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:40,180
and in close range,
with just a shot or two,
279
00:17:40,181 --> 00:17:42,008
kill her siblings.
280
00:17:42,009 --> 00:17:45,752
So my father did not believe
the "Dawn is involved" story.
281
00:17:47,928 --> 00:17:49,972
When I heard him accuse Dawn
282
00:17:49,973 --> 00:17:51,408
of being part of the murders,
283
00:17:51,409 --> 00:17:53,976
I was just astounded.
284
00:17:53,977 --> 00:17:56,239
And I thought, "How dare you?"
285
00:17:56,240 --> 00:17:58,807
She did not have
that in her heart.
286
00:17:58,808 --> 00:18:01,419
She loved her parents.
She loved her siblings.
287
00:18:03,944 --> 00:18:06,162
He was just trying
to deflect, I think.
288
00:18:06,163 --> 00:18:09,818
Yeah, I just knew that
he was full of shit.
289
00:18:09,819 --> 00:18:13,039
I read about the
sequel, The Possession.
290
00:18:13,040 --> 00:18:15,389
I was so incensed. And I'm
trying to remember now.
291
00:18:15,390 --> 00:18:16,825
I'm pretty sure that
was the one where
292
00:18:16,826 --> 00:18:18,740
they tried to now
introduce the idea that
293
00:18:18,741 --> 00:18:20,524
there might have
been some incest.
294
00:18:20,525 --> 00:18:22,875
And I said this is
absolutely now obscene.
295
00:18:22,876 --> 00:18:26,922
They want to make a movie
about whatever that's not true,
296
00:18:26,923 --> 00:18:28,402
you know, call it
something else even.
297
00:18:28,403 --> 00:18:30,144
At that point, it's
really so exploitative.
298
00:18:45,855 --> 00:18:48,030
The Possession shows the
ways in which that story
299
00:18:48,031 --> 00:18:51,207
got out of the Lutz's hands.
300
00:18:51,208 --> 00:18:53,775
The sequel wildly
fabricates things
301
00:18:53,776 --> 00:18:56,952
because that's what we do
with stories like this.
302
00:18:56,953 --> 00:18:59,781
You can't tell the story
in a strictly factual way
303
00:18:59,782 --> 00:19:01,870
because no one... no one
really wants to see that.
304
00:19:01,871 --> 00:19:03,393
What was in this house?
305
00:19:03,394 --> 00:19:05,221
No.
306
00:19:05,222 --> 00:19:07,180
What evil could drive
their son to madness
307
00:19:07,181 --> 00:19:09,182
and destroy everything
and everyone he loved?
308
00:19:09,183 --> 00:19:10,923
Mommy!
309
00:19:10,924 --> 00:19:12,315
Dino De Laurentiis
put out a movie called
310
00:19:12,316 --> 00:19:14,056
Amityville Horror II,
311
00:19:14,057 --> 00:19:15,884
which they eventually
changed to Amityville II
312
00:19:15,885 --> 00:19:17,364
and did it without
our permission.
313
00:19:17,365 --> 00:19:21,411
Amityville II: The Possession.
314
00:19:21,412 --> 00:19:25,154
And that became a
12, 13-year lawsuit.
315
00:19:25,155 --> 00:19:26,460
So even if you have the rights,
316
00:19:26,461 --> 00:19:28,288
even if you're trying to do this
317
00:19:28,289 --> 00:19:30,072
the best way you possibly can
318
00:19:30,073 --> 00:19:32,596
and fix the stuff that's been
wrong or been said wrong,
319
00:19:32,597 --> 00:19:34,948
things will come along and
keep you from doing that.
320
00:19:50,093 --> 00:19:52,965
I remember as a
kid being in school
321
00:19:52,966 --> 00:19:55,837
and we were asked what our
parents do for a living.
322
00:19:55,838 --> 00:19:58,274
I didn't even know what
they did for a living.
323
00:19:58,275 --> 00:19:59,928
I remember asking George.
324
00:19:59,929 --> 00:20:01,277
And he said "I'm a writer."
325
00:20:01,278 --> 00:20:03,192
And I said, "What
do you write about?"
326
00:20:03,193 --> 00:20:05,847
And he said, "Things
that happened."
327
00:20:05,848 --> 00:20:07,283
And that was where he left it.
328
00:20:07,284 --> 00:20:11,853
Amityville became
George's whole project.
329
00:20:11,854 --> 00:20:13,115
It was his business.
330
00:20:13,116 --> 00:20:15,204
He kept the publicity up.
331
00:20:15,205 --> 00:20:16,858
That was his way of working.
332
00:20:16,859 --> 00:20:19,383
He supported his
family with Amityville.
333
00:20:21,559 --> 00:20:23,299
The progression that
George went through
334
00:20:23,300 --> 00:20:26,563
was like, very obsessive
335
00:20:26,564 --> 00:20:29,262
of the notoriety
336
00:20:29,263 --> 00:20:33,005
and getting out there
and his public image.
337
00:20:33,006 --> 00:20:35,094
Behind closed doors, he
was a very different guy
338
00:20:35,095 --> 00:20:39,315
than what he was
portraying publicly.
339
00:20:39,316 --> 00:20:42,362
I asked Kathy a couple of
times about the children.
340
00:20:42,363 --> 00:20:46,409
And she told me that
she was trying to
341
00:20:46,410 --> 00:20:50,544
shelter them from everything
that was going on.
342
00:20:50,545 --> 00:20:52,328
But I didn't think,
at that point,
343
00:20:52,329 --> 00:20:54,156
they were being sheltered.
344
00:20:54,157 --> 00:20:56,202
It was just too public.
345
00:20:56,203 --> 00:20:57,986
And when it happens to a family,
346
00:20:57,987 --> 00:21:01,033
usually they close the door
and they don't talk about it.
347
00:21:01,034 --> 00:21:03,122
Yeah.
348
00:21:03,123 --> 00:21:05,689
And unless these things
are talked about,
349
00:21:05,690 --> 00:21:08,344
they'll never be understood.
350
00:21:08,345 --> 00:21:10,390
When you would talk to
the family and the kids
351
00:21:10,391 --> 00:21:13,654
and I would ask them questions,
352
00:21:13,655 --> 00:21:16,352
they would not go, "Well, um..."
353
00:21:16,353 --> 00:21:18,050
They'd have the
answer right now,
354
00:21:18,051 --> 00:21:20,922
like they'd been schooled.
355
00:21:20,923 --> 00:21:22,924
I listened to James Brolin talk
356
00:21:22,925 --> 00:21:24,317
about how he met the kids
357
00:21:24,318 --> 00:21:27,320
and they sounded like
they were coached.
358
00:21:27,321 --> 00:21:29,713
We were in a situation where
359
00:21:29,714 --> 00:21:31,585
if we weren't on
our best behavior,
360
00:21:31,586 --> 00:21:33,500
we were gonna get the
shit knocked out of us
361
00:21:33,501 --> 00:21:35,415
when we got home.
362
00:21:35,416 --> 00:21:37,547
So to say that we were coached,
363
00:21:37,548 --> 00:21:40,028
the guy doesn't know what
we were going through.
364
00:21:40,029 --> 00:21:41,943
Ooh, "big star."
365
00:21:41,944 --> 00:21:44,380
Okay, so you made your
name off of that movie.
366
00:21:44,381 --> 00:21:46,427
You didn't live it.
367
00:21:47,297 --> 00:21:50,952
George was a former Marine,
a black belt in jujitsu.
368
00:21:50,953 --> 00:21:53,042
I had no defense against him.
369
00:22:04,271 --> 00:22:06,968
So George believed that,
370
00:22:06,969 --> 00:22:09,667
with my mind, I
could make him ill...
371
00:22:12,018 --> 00:22:15,064
even to the point where...
372
00:22:17,153 --> 00:22:18,719
he thought he was gonna die.
373
00:22:18,720 --> 00:22:21,374
And he came in and he started
beating the shit out of me
374
00:22:21,375 --> 00:22:24,944
for my thoughts.
375
00:22:26,684 --> 00:22:28,990
Killing him through
telepathy was just
376
00:22:28,991 --> 00:22:31,646
so fucking fucked up, man.
377
00:22:35,737 --> 00:22:38,173
And I really didn't plan
on talking about that.
378
00:22:38,174 --> 00:22:40,481
I need a minute, man.
379
00:22:45,094 --> 00:22:46,966
Holy fuck.
380
00:22:53,668 --> 00:22:57,410
If the Warrens found that
Christopher, in a sense,
381
00:22:57,411 --> 00:22:59,629
has some psychic ability,
382
00:22:59,630 --> 00:23:03,242
I can see where one step
could lead to another.
383
00:23:03,243 --> 00:23:05,592
Because George,
he was afraid that
384
00:23:05,593 --> 00:23:08,073
Christopher took
the evil with him,
385
00:23:08,074 --> 00:23:10,206
was possessed by the evil.
386
00:23:12,165 --> 00:23:16,603
George was kind of
constantly haunted.
387
00:23:16,604 --> 00:23:18,605
He would hear voices.
388
00:23:18,606 --> 00:23:21,521
We would be driving somewhere
389
00:23:21,522 --> 00:23:24,480
and he would turn around
while he was driving
390
00:23:24,481 --> 00:23:28,658
and yell at something
in the back of the car.
391
00:23:28,659 --> 00:23:31,183
He would be sitting in the room,
392
00:23:31,184 --> 00:23:34,142
and all of a sudden,
393
00:23:34,143 --> 00:23:37,712
he'd get up and start
screaming at something...
394
00:23:40,149 --> 00:23:43,673
telling these spirits or
whatever that was haunting him
395
00:23:43,674 --> 00:23:48,635
to go away, to not bother him.
396
00:23:48,636 --> 00:23:50,724
It gets to the point where
you're convinced that
397
00:23:50,725 --> 00:23:54,163
there is evil, there
is something there.
398
00:23:56,252 --> 00:23:59,864
It kind of felt like George
was acting possessed.
399
00:24:05,087 --> 00:24:09,090
I had found out I was
pregnant with my first child.
400
00:24:09,091 --> 00:24:11,527
And I didn't want
my unborn child
401
00:24:11,528 --> 00:24:14,400
to have to experience
anything like that.
402
00:24:14,401 --> 00:24:16,793
I was just frightened by it.
403
00:24:16,794 --> 00:24:20,101
I went back home to Brooklyn.
404
00:24:20,102 --> 00:24:23,104
I don't want anything to
do with Amityville at all.
405
00:24:23,105 --> 00:24:25,324
I don't want anything
to do with the Lutzes.
406
00:24:25,325 --> 00:24:29,763
And just... I never contacted
407
00:24:29,764 --> 00:24:32,114
George and Kathy
again after that.
408
00:24:47,564 --> 00:24:49,130
Book number two
409
00:24:49,131 --> 00:24:51,393
that he authorized
to have written,
410
00:24:51,394 --> 00:24:55,181
it talks about how he had
to go through an exorcism.
411
00:25:06,844 --> 00:25:08,410
In London, England,
412
00:25:08,411 --> 00:25:10,282
the Archbishop of
Canterbury's exorcist,
413
00:25:10,283 --> 00:25:12,806
Reverend Neil Smith,
414
00:25:12,807 --> 00:25:16,157
he performed for us what some
people would call an exorcism.
415
00:25:16,158 --> 00:25:18,334
I'd call it more of a blessing.
416
00:25:20,423 --> 00:25:21,902
But it was a rite of separation
417
00:25:21,903 --> 00:25:23,860
in the Anglican church.
418
00:25:23,861 --> 00:25:25,949
And it was a separation
from the house,
419
00:25:25,950 --> 00:25:28,517
from the effects of the house.
420
00:25:28,518 --> 00:25:29,953
He looked right
at Kathy and said,
421
00:25:29,954 --> 00:25:32,304
"You're still
affected by this."
422
00:25:32,305 --> 00:25:35,263
Beat down Satan under our feet
423
00:25:35,264 --> 00:25:40,443
and cause all evil
forces to depart!
424
00:25:42,532 --> 00:25:44,316
I've personally
observed exorcism
425
00:25:44,317 --> 00:25:48,972
both in Catholic circles
and evangelical ones.
426
00:25:48,973 --> 00:25:53,586
Exorcism can function
as a placebo ritual.
427
00:25:53,587 --> 00:25:56,328
And that that is then
going to aid them
428
00:25:56,329 --> 00:25:58,243
in their feeling of recovery,
429
00:25:58,244 --> 00:26:00,984
and it actually will
produce a physical sensation
430
00:26:00,985 --> 00:26:05,251
that could, in a way,
improve their condition.
431
00:26:18,960 --> 00:26:20,439
You don't need an exorcism
432
00:26:20,440 --> 00:26:23,616
because you lived
in a haunted house.
433
00:26:23,617 --> 00:26:27,229
You get an exorcism
because you've got demons.
434
00:26:29,579 --> 00:26:31,232
What is it like
to live with a man
435
00:26:31,233 --> 00:26:33,321
that's in need of an exorcism
436
00:26:33,322 --> 00:26:35,018
that's your stepdad
437
00:26:35,019 --> 00:26:37,630
who's treating
you like a stepson
438
00:26:37,631 --> 00:26:40,503
that doesn't care
who the hell you are?
439
00:26:42,679 --> 00:26:44,680
Christopher was always
looking over his shoulder,
440
00:26:44,681 --> 00:26:47,292
like, "Oh, I better not say
anything I'm not supposed to
441
00:26:47,293 --> 00:26:49,859
or I'll get in trouble."
442
00:26:49,860 --> 00:26:53,733
The thing that really
struck me most was that
443
00:26:53,734 --> 00:26:56,605
Danny would just
glare at George.
444
00:26:56,606 --> 00:27:00,696
He did not hide his feelings.
445
00:27:00,697 --> 00:27:02,698
If looks could kill,
446
00:27:02,699 --> 00:27:04,961
I mean, he would have had
laser beams towards George
447
00:27:04,962 --> 00:27:08,530
coming out of both eyes.
448
00:27:08,531 --> 00:27:11,359
Kathy had, from what I know,
449
00:27:11,360 --> 00:27:13,709
an abusive first husband.
450
00:27:13,710 --> 00:27:18,801
And it left her as a
divorced woman in the '70s
451
00:27:18,802 --> 00:27:21,064
with three children,
which, at that time,
452
00:27:21,065 --> 00:27:24,981
it was not exactly
looked well upon.
453
00:27:24,982 --> 00:27:29,812
So when George came along
and was willing to accept her
454
00:27:29,813 --> 00:27:32,902
and the children,
it was wonderful,
455
00:27:32,903 --> 00:27:34,556
from her point of view,
456
00:27:34,557 --> 00:27:38,386
that somebody wanted to
make them a family again.
457
00:27:38,387 --> 00:27:40,475
And she did everything she could
458
00:27:40,476 --> 00:27:42,347
to keep the marriage together
459
00:27:42,348 --> 00:27:44,872
because of the children.
460
00:27:47,004 --> 00:27:48,440
But you said you and Kathy
461
00:27:48,441 --> 00:27:50,529
weren't together anymore.
462
00:27:50,530 --> 00:27:55,316
And I was wondering if you can
say when you divorced and why,
463
00:27:55,317 --> 00:27:57,013
if it had anything
to do with this or...
464
00:27:57,014 --> 00:27:59,755
The reasons we got divorced
are really personal.
465
00:27:59,756 --> 00:28:05,370
We went in separate directions
about exposing the house.
466
00:28:05,371 --> 00:28:07,589
As far as Kathy is concerned,
467
00:28:07,590 --> 00:28:11,506
her point is that she
only wants to deal with
468
00:28:11,507 --> 00:28:12,768
the nonfiction part
469
00:28:12,769 --> 00:28:14,683
and does not believe that
470
00:28:14,684 --> 00:28:16,991
fiction also helps to do that.
471
00:28:20,429 --> 00:28:21,995
My mom became ill.
472
00:28:21,996 --> 00:28:26,086
She had a medical condition
and she needed help.
473
00:28:26,087 --> 00:28:28,131
I took up residence with her,
474
00:28:28,132 --> 00:28:31,484
started to care for
her until her death.
475
00:28:37,141 --> 00:28:38,577
That was when I decided to
476
00:28:38,578 --> 00:28:40,970
change my name
back to Quaratino.
477
00:28:40,971 --> 00:28:44,887
And so for several years, I
got to enjoy the anonymity
478
00:28:44,888 --> 00:28:48,370
of not being associated
with that story anymore.
479
00:28:51,721 --> 00:28:54,636
And then one day,
I got a phone call.
480
00:28:54,637 --> 00:28:56,682
And that's when I found out that
481
00:28:56,683 --> 00:28:58,553
George was getting ready
to make another movie.
482
00:28:58,554 --> 00:29:00,163
Next year, there will finally be
483
00:29:00,164 --> 00:29:03,384
an authorized sequel of sorts,
484
00:29:03,385 --> 00:29:05,473
Amityville Horror:
25 Years Later.
485
00:29:05,474 --> 00:29:08,433
- Is it real?
- Yes, it's in production now.
486
00:29:08,434 --> 00:29:10,696
And you're the first people
I'm telling in the media.
487
00:29:10,697 --> 00:29:12,785
And then I find out
that George's movie
488
00:29:12,786 --> 00:29:14,917
is gonna be about a Lutz
son returning to the house
489
00:29:14,918 --> 00:29:16,615
25 years later,
490
00:29:16,616 --> 00:29:19,139
killing him through telepathy
in the end of the movie.
491
00:29:19,140 --> 00:29:21,882
So I did whatever I could to,
like, stop what he was doing.
492
00:29:24,841 --> 00:29:26,713
I took to the internet.
493
00:29:29,890 --> 00:29:32,674
AmityvilleHorror.com
became available
494
00:29:32,675 --> 00:29:35,851
and I scooped it up.
495
00:29:35,852 --> 00:29:42,075
He sued me for what he said
was a trademark violation.
496
00:29:42,076 --> 00:29:45,861
I can't say that what I had
done actually stopped it,
497
00:29:45,862 --> 00:29:51,867
but I was making as much of
a ruckus about it as I could.
498
00:29:51,868 --> 00:29:55,610
All in favor, sign up
on my Facebook page
499
00:29:55,611 --> 00:29:59,875
and let's make history.
500
00:29:59,876 --> 00:30:01,748
Good night.
501
00:30:08,972 --> 00:30:12,888
I've made myself publicly
available on social media
502
00:30:12,889 --> 00:30:15,543
for about a decade now.
503
00:30:15,544 --> 00:30:19,982
I'm just really amazed at the
stories I hear from people
504
00:30:19,983 --> 00:30:22,594
that were greatly affected by it
505
00:30:22,595 --> 00:30:23,944
when it initially came out.
506
00:30:27,164 --> 00:30:31,864
People of my generation
or even older that, like,
507
00:30:31,865 --> 00:30:35,607
this story really
resonated with them.
508
00:30:35,608 --> 00:30:37,826
There's so many people
in the paranormal field
509
00:30:37,827 --> 00:30:39,611
that I have met
through the years,
510
00:30:39,612 --> 00:30:40,916
having gone to conferences,
511
00:30:40,917 --> 00:30:42,657
and I often ask people,
512
00:30:42,658 --> 00:30:44,833
"What's got you so interested
in the paranormal?"
513
00:30:44,834 --> 00:30:47,140
And so many people have told me,
514
00:30:47,141 --> 00:30:49,098
you know, "When I was
a kid, I saw your...
515
00:30:49,099 --> 00:30:51,493
I saw the movie
about your family."
516
00:30:57,586 --> 00:31:03,200
Enough about the story
resonates as real.
517
00:31:07,988 --> 00:31:10,599
And that's why it continues on.
518
00:31:12,601 --> 00:31:14,515
Why is it you feel like
people want to cling
519
00:31:14,516 --> 00:31:16,691
to this story?
520
00:31:16,692 --> 00:31:19,912
Partially because they have
fantasies that they believe in
521
00:31:19,913 --> 00:31:22,306
and partially because
there's money to be made.
522
00:31:24,134 --> 00:31:25,961
He holds the unique
title of demonologist.
523
00:31:25,962 --> 00:31:27,310
She's a psychic.
524
00:31:27,311 --> 00:31:28,790
Together they just
completed work as
525
00:31:28,791 --> 00:31:31,880
demonology advisors
on the upcoming film
526
00:31:31,881 --> 00:31:34,100
Amityville II: The Possession.
527
00:31:34,101 --> 00:31:35,929
Please welcome Ed
and Lorraine Warren.
528
00:31:38,235 --> 00:31:39,627
The Warrens,
529
00:31:39,628 --> 00:31:42,674
they made a career
for themselves.
530
00:31:42,675 --> 00:31:44,066
They highlighted the fact that
531
00:31:44,067 --> 00:31:45,633
they were involved in our story.
532
00:31:45,634 --> 00:31:47,026
What's the most famous case
533
00:31:47,027 --> 00:31:48,810
you've ever been involved with?
534
00:31:48,811 --> 00:31:50,812
Well, I would have to say
the Amityville Horror,
535
00:31:50,813 --> 00:31:52,988
since it's world renowned.
536
00:31:52,989 --> 00:31:56,122
Years later, I found
out that they had been
537
00:31:56,123 --> 00:31:59,125
the creative consultant
on multiple movies
538
00:31:59,126 --> 00:32:01,562
after the initial movie.
539
00:32:01,563 --> 00:32:05,567
And I didn't find that
to be, like, genuine.
540
00:32:08,222 --> 00:32:09,570
When The Conjuring opened
541
00:32:09,571 --> 00:32:11,572
in theaters in 2013,
542
00:32:11,573 --> 00:32:13,226
it was a box-office hit
543
00:32:13,227 --> 00:32:17,056
that raked in $137
million in the U.S.
544
00:32:17,057 --> 00:32:19,841
and terrified
audiences worldwide.
545
00:32:19,842 --> 00:32:22,105
This is as close to hell
as I ever want to get.
546
00:32:25,761 --> 00:32:28,197
People would attach
themselves to this
547
00:32:28,198 --> 00:32:30,678
in one way or another.
548
00:32:30,679 --> 00:32:33,855
Jay Anson, having been
penned as the author,
549
00:32:33,856 --> 00:32:36,075
is the one that's making
the big money on it.
550
00:32:36,076 --> 00:32:38,860
Last I know, he made,
like, 16 million on it.
551
00:32:38,861 --> 00:32:40,296
16 million.
552
00:32:40,297 --> 00:32:42,299
My parents made, like, 400,000.
553
00:32:44,911 --> 00:32:47,695
Get out!
554
00:32:47,696 --> 00:32:49,218
It's a remake that's
really worthy,
555
00:32:49,219 --> 00:32:50,698
simply because the
original doesn't...
556
00:32:50,699 --> 00:32:53,745
I don't believe,
holds up after time.
557
00:32:53,746 --> 00:32:55,094
Kill them!
558
00:32:55,095 --> 00:32:57,271
The greatest haunted
house story ever told.
559
00:32:59,621 --> 00:33:01,753
Catch them.
560
00:33:01,754 --> 00:33:03,929
Kill them.
561
00:33:03,930 --> 00:33:05,191
Catch 'em and you kill 'em.
562
00:33:05,192 --> 00:33:07,106
You catch 'em and you kill 'em.
563
00:33:07,107 --> 00:33:09,630
Ronnie DeFeo kept repeating
this over and over.
564
00:33:09,631 --> 00:33:11,763
I've never seen
anything like this.
565
00:33:11,764 --> 00:33:14,026
"How can I get a fair
hearing when all they know
566
00:33:14,027 --> 00:33:17,812
is that I catch
'em and kill 'em?"
567
00:33:17,813 --> 00:33:20,162
He was angry at Hollywood.
568
00:33:20,163 --> 00:33:23,339
He claimed that he should
have been compensated
569
00:33:23,340 --> 00:33:29,171
for his contribution to the
Amityville Horror movies.
570
00:33:29,172 --> 00:33:32,087
The Amityville Horror
really is supposed to be me.
571
00:33:32,088 --> 00:33:35,134
Because I'm the one that
572
00:33:35,135 --> 00:33:36,875
got convicted of
killing my family.
573
00:33:36,876 --> 00:33:38,180
I'm the one they say did it.
574
00:33:38,181 --> 00:33:39,922
I'm the one that's
supposed to be possessed.
575
00:33:42,316 --> 00:33:44,926
He had told me
about the mob stuff,
576
00:33:44,927 --> 00:33:47,755
and then said Dawn
killed the whole family.
577
00:33:47,756 --> 00:33:50,323
So I guess it's implied that
578
00:33:50,324 --> 00:33:52,892
he had acknowledged that
the mafia story wasn't true.
579
00:33:55,895 --> 00:33:58,418
From what I understood,
the father had
580
00:33:58,419 --> 00:34:00,899
legitimate connections
with the mafia.
581
00:34:00,900 --> 00:34:04,293
But this did not
spread to the son.
582
00:34:04,294 --> 00:34:06,208
The mob guys in the jail
583
00:34:06,209 --> 00:34:08,080
wouldn't have anything
to do with him.
584
00:34:08,081 --> 00:34:10,299
I mean, they actively
disliked him.
585
00:34:10,300 --> 00:34:12,693
They felt he was an
embarrassment to them.
586
00:34:12,694 --> 00:34:15,087
I don't believe organized crime
had anything to do with that.
587
00:34:15,088 --> 00:34:16,131
Anything.
588
00:34:16,132 --> 00:34:17,742
There were two major rules:
589
00:34:17,743 --> 00:34:19,265
you never killed
a guy in his house
590
00:34:19,266 --> 00:34:21,354
and you never killed him
in front of his family.
591
00:34:21,355 --> 00:34:24,792
That was the rule and you
didn't break that rule.
592
00:34:24,793 --> 00:34:27,708
The horror itself is my
family getting killed.
593
00:34:27,709 --> 00:34:30,058
I guess that's the only
really tragedy here.
594
00:34:30,059 --> 00:34:34,324
Everything else...
it's fantasy really.
595
00:34:35,412 --> 00:34:37,327
It's fiction.
596
00:34:46,772 --> 00:34:51,906
When Ronnie died in
2021, I felt really sad,
597
00:34:51,907 --> 00:34:55,736
which is kind of strange
because he's a multi murderer.
598
00:34:55,737 --> 00:34:58,434
He hadn't been, like, the
greatest guy I ever met.
599
00:34:58,435 --> 00:35:01,742
He was actually an
oddity, if anything.
600
00:35:01,743 --> 00:35:03,352
And I was surprised that he died
601
00:35:03,353 --> 00:35:05,746
a little younger than I thought.
602
00:35:05,747 --> 00:35:09,402
But he had been using
drugs his whole life,
603
00:35:09,403 --> 00:35:11,186
as a prisoner too.
604
00:35:11,187 --> 00:35:13,275
Also, of course, prison
is a stressful place
605
00:35:13,276 --> 00:35:14,495
and it wears on you.
606
00:35:41,435 --> 00:35:45,961
My grandmother was the
secretary to Father Ray.
607
00:35:46,832 --> 00:35:51,966
One of his annulment cases
was George's first marriage.
608
00:35:51,967 --> 00:35:53,489
She really documented everything
609
00:35:53,490 --> 00:35:57,102
because she just had a
bad intuition over time.
610
00:35:57,103 --> 00:35:59,887
And the intuition was just,
there's something there,
611
00:35:59,888 --> 00:36:01,410
but I don't know what it is.
612
00:36:01,411 --> 00:36:04,587
I was married previously
also to a Catholic.
613
00:36:04,588 --> 00:36:07,460
And as part of the annulment
proceedings for that marriage,
614
00:36:07,461 --> 00:36:09,897
I was called down to
the diocese office
615
00:36:09,898 --> 00:36:12,160
and interviewed.
616
00:36:12,161 --> 00:36:14,293
The annulment documents
617
00:36:14,294 --> 00:36:17,600
do reveal things
about George's past
618
00:36:17,601 --> 00:36:20,387
and have never been released.
619
00:36:26,915 --> 00:36:29,438
Yeah, so the letter, um,
620
00:36:29,439 --> 00:36:32,485
from the therapist
was quite interesting
621
00:36:32,486 --> 00:36:35,575
because of the fact that he
has the perspective from both
622
00:36:35,576 --> 00:36:38,883
George and his first wife.
623
00:36:38,884 --> 00:36:40,449
And she defines
her role as being
624
00:36:40,450 --> 00:36:42,930
a maid in his office
and in his home.
625
00:36:42,931 --> 00:36:45,325
He never allowed me
to open my mouth.
626
00:36:48,154 --> 00:36:50,851
Yeah.
627
00:36:50,852 --> 00:36:55,856
He'd proudly use terms
as, "I got her trained,"
628
00:36:55,857 --> 00:37:00,079
to defiantly state his
position in their marriage.
629
00:37:01,036 --> 00:37:04,343
"His rigid expansive
attitude appeared to conceal
630
00:37:04,344 --> 00:37:06,127
"a very frightened individual
631
00:37:06,128 --> 00:37:09,130
"who was most insecure
concerning his role
632
00:37:09,131 --> 00:37:11,220
as a male and husband."
633
00:37:13,309 --> 00:37:15,963
George has effectively
extorted money.
634
00:37:15,964 --> 00:37:18,139
She invested all of her savings,
635
00:37:18,140 --> 00:37:20,228
and he refused to allow her name
636
00:37:20,229 --> 00:37:24,493
to appear on the
title of the house.
637
00:37:24,494 --> 00:37:27,497
This is a little
uncomfortable to read.
638
00:37:30,109 --> 00:37:32,197
There is evidence that
he abused her physically
639
00:37:32,198 --> 00:37:33,502
on several occasions.
640
00:37:33,503 --> 00:37:35,678
Apparently, she required
medical assistance
641
00:37:35,679 --> 00:37:39,292
for injuries that were
inflicted by George.
642
00:37:42,164 --> 00:37:45,123
The feedback from the
medical expert, it says,
643
00:37:45,124 --> 00:37:47,386
"In this case, with
the preparation
644
00:37:47,387 --> 00:37:50,519
"I am able to state with
medical and moral certainty,
645
00:37:50,520 --> 00:37:53,522
"that at the time
of his marriage,
646
00:37:53,523 --> 00:37:55,481
"George Lutz was suffering from
647
00:37:55,482 --> 00:37:57,918
"a serious personality disorder.
648
00:37:57,919 --> 00:38:00,181
"This would appropriately
be diagnosed as
649
00:38:00,182 --> 00:38:03,359
antisocial personality."
650
00:38:21,508 --> 00:38:24,205
"George Lutz was
suffering from a serious
651
00:38:24,206 --> 00:38:26,947
"personality disorder.
652
00:38:26,948 --> 00:38:31,082
"His callousness and
selfishness is typical
653
00:38:31,083 --> 00:38:33,127
"of the sociopathic
654
00:38:33,128 --> 00:38:35,522
or antisocial personality."
655
00:38:37,654 --> 00:38:41,222
I'm kind of mystified
that somebody can be
656
00:38:41,223 --> 00:38:43,268
that much of a chameleon.
657
00:38:43,269 --> 00:38:48,490
I'm shocked that
he hid it so well.
658
00:38:48,491 --> 00:38:50,145
I really am.
659
00:38:55,585 --> 00:38:58,152
Antisocial personality disorder
660
00:38:58,153 --> 00:39:00,633
is a diagnosis that tends
to be given to people
661
00:39:00,634 --> 00:39:05,638
who have a blatant disregard
for the rights of others.
662
00:39:05,639 --> 00:39:08,336
These are people who
do not show empathy
663
00:39:08,337 --> 00:39:10,425
or remorse for other people.
664
00:39:10,426 --> 00:39:13,211
And they're oftentimes
believed to be manipulative.
665
00:39:13,212 --> 00:39:15,517
So they might
present differently
666
00:39:15,518 --> 00:39:19,521
or say different
things or shift facts
667
00:39:19,522 --> 00:39:21,655
when they're talking
to different people.
668
00:39:24,527 --> 00:39:27,616
In 2006, Dr. Hoge,
a psychiatrist,
669
00:39:27,617 --> 00:39:30,750
interviewed Ronnie DeFeo to
get a better understanding of
670
00:39:30,751 --> 00:39:32,795
how Ronnie DeFeo was presenting,
671
00:39:32,796 --> 00:39:35,190
how he was thinking
about the crimes.
672
00:39:36,670 --> 00:39:39,759
He believed that Ronnie
DeFeo was experiencing
673
00:39:39,760 --> 00:39:41,500
an antisocial
personality disorder,
674
00:39:41,501 --> 00:39:44,243
that he seems to be
more manipulative.
675
00:40:00,520 --> 00:40:02,738
Sometimes individuals try to
676
00:40:02,739 --> 00:40:07,482
give an excuse for violent
behavior or abusive behavior.
677
00:40:07,483 --> 00:40:10,355
"The devil made me do it" or
"I was possessed at the time."
678
00:40:10,356 --> 00:40:12,096
And sometimes these
individuals will
679
00:40:12,097 --> 00:40:14,489
even undergo exorcisms,
680
00:40:14,490 --> 00:40:18,711
as in the case of the
Lutz family stepfather.
681
00:40:18,712 --> 00:40:20,495
So that can be a
little bit puzzling.
682
00:40:20,496 --> 00:40:23,150
How do we interpret that?
683
00:40:23,151 --> 00:40:25,588
Our only answer is that
we're not totally sure.
684
00:40:38,514 --> 00:40:41,777
There was a tribe of Indians
called the Shinnecocks,
685
00:40:41,778 --> 00:40:45,303
and they used this land
as a sort of exposure pen.
686
00:40:45,304 --> 00:40:47,174
They put all the
crazy people here,
687
00:40:47,175 --> 00:40:49,263
and they left them here to die.
688
00:40:49,264 --> 00:40:51,787
The Amityville Horror film
689
00:40:51,788 --> 00:40:53,485
is the first time in cinema
690
00:40:53,486 --> 00:40:57,445
where the Indian burial
ground trope is used.
691
00:40:57,446 --> 00:40:59,186
That's why no one
692
00:40:59,187 --> 00:41:01,884
ever buried a human
being out there.
693
00:41:01,885 --> 00:41:03,364
You are thinking of
putting him out there.
694
00:41:03,365 --> 00:41:05,192
Don't deny the thought
hadn't crossed your mind.
695
00:41:05,193 --> 00:41:07,368
The Indian burial
ground trope...
696
00:41:07,369 --> 00:41:09,283
I like to call it the IBG...
697
00:41:09,284 --> 00:41:15,202
Is the idea that
if a place is built
698
00:41:15,203 --> 00:41:16,725
on an Indian burial ground,
699
00:41:16,726 --> 00:41:20,164
it is somehow more
haunted or evil
700
00:41:20,165 --> 00:41:21,861
or is going to inspire
701
00:41:21,862 --> 00:41:25,560
something really
dreadful to happen.
702
00:41:25,561 --> 00:41:31,392
And yes, the Shinnecock
Nation exists on Long Island.
703
00:41:31,393 --> 00:41:35,570
They would venture to the
area of the Amityville house
704
00:41:35,571 --> 00:41:37,790
for possibly hunting.
705
00:41:37,791 --> 00:41:40,402
But it wasn't really part
of their traditional land.
706
00:41:45,364 --> 00:41:48,583
The Indian burial
ground in movies
707
00:41:48,584 --> 00:41:51,151
is just such a cliché.
708
00:41:51,152 --> 00:41:55,155
But people love that
shit. They eat it up.
709
00:41:55,156 --> 00:41:57,157
The site is supposed
to be located on
710
00:41:57,158 --> 00:41:58,376
an Indian burial ground,
711
00:41:58,377 --> 00:41:59,812
and I believe they
actually had to
712
00:41:59,813 --> 00:42:02,336
repel a few Indian attacks
as they were building it.
713
00:42:02,337 --> 00:42:04,904
Why is it that the
Indian burial ground
714
00:42:04,905 --> 00:42:07,472
is always what people claim?
715
00:42:07,473 --> 00:42:09,648
This was their burial ground.
716
00:42:09,649 --> 00:42:12,259
Is it the white settler guilt?
717
00:42:12,260 --> 00:42:13,782
Whose burial ground?
718
00:42:13,783 --> 00:42:15,567
Mi'kmaq Indians.
719
00:42:15,568 --> 00:42:19,833
Is it this idea that there
has to be some kind of evil...
720
00:42:21,530 --> 00:42:25,969
to justify why we
took this land?
721
00:42:30,496 --> 00:42:32,845
Even popular ghost shows
722
00:42:32,846 --> 00:42:35,630
and the paranormal
hunters that go out,
723
00:42:35,631 --> 00:42:37,632
it's a very easy explanation,
724
00:42:37,633 --> 00:42:39,591
especially if
you're in the areas
725
00:42:39,592 --> 00:42:42,682
that are associated
with tribal people.
726
00:42:46,686 --> 00:42:47,947
Perhaps we can think
about this as a way
727
00:42:47,948 --> 00:42:49,557
of dealing with the kind
728
00:42:49,558 --> 00:42:52,821
of repressed and
unspoken complicity,
729
00:42:52,822 --> 00:42:53,996
especially in suburbia,
730
00:42:53,997 --> 00:42:56,477
as a way of trying to tease out
731
00:42:56,478 --> 00:42:59,437
some of the unspoken violence,
732
00:42:59,438 --> 00:43:02,441
the unspoken horror of
American history itself.
733
00:43:30,425 --> 00:43:33,340
The fact that so many people
wanted the story to be true
734
00:43:33,341 --> 00:43:35,690
or in fact believed
the story to be true
735
00:43:35,691 --> 00:43:38,780
is much more revealing and
is much more interesting
736
00:43:38,781 --> 00:43:40,541
than whether the story
itself is true or not.
737
00:43:43,525 --> 00:43:48,790
What really happened is that
we all joined in the story.
738
00:43:48,791 --> 00:43:53,752
It became something
that is self-sustaining.
739
00:43:53,753 --> 00:43:57,887
It became kind of
a feedback loop.
740
00:44:01,369 --> 00:44:03,979
You can come into a
space you think is yours,
741
00:44:03,980 --> 00:44:05,764
but it has history.
742
00:44:05,765 --> 00:44:08,289
There's traces, there's trauma.
743
00:44:12,554 --> 00:44:14,599
Did this actually happen?
744
00:44:14,600 --> 00:44:17,471
Maybe something did
happen that was demonic.
745
00:44:17,472 --> 00:44:21,388
We still don't know how to
reckon with historical trauma.
746
00:44:21,389 --> 00:44:24,566
It still rises up
to battle with.
747
00:44:28,309 --> 00:44:29,788
If you think about
buildings that have seen
748
00:44:29,789 --> 00:44:31,006
great violence or
great suffering,
749
00:44:31,007 --> 00:44:32,573
you think to yourself,
750
00:44:32,574 --> 00:44:34,358
"Maybe they should
be haunted."
751
00:44:34,359 --> 00:44:35,576
There should be something here
752
00:44:35,577 --> 00:44:37,491
because that way,
it would mean that
753
00:44:37,492 --> 00:44:39,581
all of that pain and suffering
hasn't been forgotten.
754
00:44:42,018 --> 00:44:44,629
She was shot in the head!
755
00:44:44,630 --> 00:44:47,588
I never thought it was
gonna be the basis of
756
00:44:47,589 --> 00:44:51,331
an enduring story that
we're still talking about
757
00:44:51,332 --> 00:44:52,941
nearly 50 years later.
758
00:44:52,942 --> 00:44:54,769
This has got to be the end.
759
00:44:54,770 --> 00:44:56,902
I don't understand why people...
760
00:44:56,903 --> 00:44:59,426
I don't know why people
are so interested in it.
761
00:44:59,427 --> 00:45:00,906
I guess because
it's a ghost story
762
00:45:00,907 --> 00:45:02,951
and people love ghost stories
763
00:45:02,952 --> 00:45:04,779
and they want to
believe they're real.
764
00:45:04,780 --> 00:45:07,565
You want to believe there's
something beyond our lives,
765
00:45:07,566 --> 00:45:09,784
something that's beyond us.
766
00:45:09,785 --> 00:45:13,962
Everyone in the world
that I've spoken to,
767
00:45:13,963 --> 00:45:17,879
if I mention it, know
about this story.
768
00:45:17,880 --> 00:45:21,143
They're fascinated by it.
769
00:45:21,144 --> 00:45:24,625
But the sad thing is
that he killed everybody.
770
00:45:24,626 --> 00:45:28,760
No! No! No!
771
00:45:28,761 --> 00:45:29,805
No!
772
00:45:31,720 --> 00:45:32,633
I think a lot of it's true
773
00:45:32,634 --> 00:45:34,461
and a lot of it's not.
774
00:45:34,462 --> 00:45:37,159
And I don't think there was a
demon in the house doing it.
775
00:45:37,160 --> 00:45:38,813
I think there's some
people in this world
776
00:45:38,814 --> 00:45:41,468
are as evil as demons.
777
00:45:41,469 --> 00:45:45,994
I believe it's
now been 32 movies
778
00:45:45,995 --> 00:45:49,128
that have attached the
name Amityville to them
779
00:45:49,129 --> 00:45:54,133
to capitalize upon this crap
that I went through as a kid.
780
00:45:54,134 --> 00:45:58,746
And none of those people give
a shit what really happened.
781
00:45:58,747 --> 00:46:03,577
George was embroiled in
one lawsuit after another.
782
00:46:03,578 --> 00:46:05,710
He had a lawsuit going with MGM
783
00:46:05,711 --> 00:46:08,800
over the 2005 remake.
784
00:46:08,801 --> 00:46:11,803
After that lawsuit was settled,
785
00:46:11,804 --> 00:46:15,154
May 6, 2006,
786
00:46:15,155 --> 00:46:17,636
George has a massive
heart attack...
787
00:46:19,551 --> 00:46:21,553
and dies.
788
00:46:23,772 --> 00:46:26,078
Ronnie still haunts me.
789
00:46:26,079 --> 00:46:30,517
Maybe I had a shot at
getting the truth out of him.
790
00:46:30,518 --> 00:46:32,084
I wanted to look him
in the eye and say,
791
00:46:32,085 --> 00:46:34,521
"What went down?"
792
00:46:34,522 --> 00:46:37,437
But we'll probably never know.
793
00:46:37,438 --> 00:46:38,873
And that's a shame.
794
00:46:38,874 --> 00:46:42,790
I feel like Ronnie
committed the murders alone.
795
00:46:42,791 --> 00:46:44,444
He's scum.
796
00:46:44,445 --> 00:46:46,446
And he's dead now and
he's rotting in hell.
797
00:46:46,447 --> 00:46:48,449
And that's my feeling.
798
00:46:52,148 --> 00:46:54,672
No doubt George was a victim
799
00:46:54,673 --> 00:46:57,718
of the karma that he put out.
800
00:46:57,719 --> 00:46:59,720
"I'm gonna make a
movie about my son
801
00:46:59,721 --> 00:47:01,984
killing me through telepathy."
802
00:47:03,899 --> 00:47:06,074
I'm not gonna tell
the story about
803
00:47:06,075 --> 00:47:09,861
what happened the
day that he did die.
804
00:47:09,862 --> 00:47:13,952
But that thing that he
wanted in the movie?
805
00:47:13,953 --> 00:47:16,477
Careful what you wish for.
806
00:47:28,968 --> 00:47:31,623
The house will continue
to be a time bomb...
807
00:47:34,234 --> 00:47:38,846
ticking away, ticking away.
808
00:47:38,847 --> 00:47:41,588
One fine day, someone
will move into that house
809
00:47:41,589 --> 00:47:47,551
who have some of the qualities
of young Ronald DeFeo Jr.
810
00:47:47,552 --> 00:47:50,729
And it'll start all over again.
811
00:48:12,011 --> 00:48:17,624
♪ You were always
Trying to mold me ♪
812
00:48:17,625 --> 00:48:20,975
♪ Mold me
813
00:48:20,976 --> 00:48:26,633
♪ But I'm not made of clay
814
00:48:26,634 --> 00:48:30,115
♪ Oh
815
00:48:30,116 --> 00:48:35,729
♪ You were always
Busy molding ♪
816
00:48:35,730 --> 00:48:39,080
♪ Molding
817
00:48:39,081 --> 00:48:44,696
♪ Dating girls Half your age ♪
818
00:48:51,572 --> 00:48:57,882
♪ I know you like
working With your hands ♪
819
00:48:57,883 --> 00:49:02,931
♪ But hands are for holding
58667
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