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Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:05,758 --> 00:00:07,788 - Hello. - Hi, I'm Louis. 2 00:00:07,896 --> 00:00:09,476 I'm Louis. Oh, I can't shake your hand. 3 00:00:09,586 --> 00:00:11,686 [laughter] 4 00:00:11,793 --> 00:00:14,313 Louis narrates: For 25 years, I've been making programmes 5 00:00:14,413 --> 00:00:16,523 about life in all its strangeness... 6 00:00:16,620 --> 00:00:21,340 Stand by, information to follow. 7 00:00:21,448 --> 00:00:22,858 -..mystery... 8 00:00:22,965 --> 00:00:24,995 - Who are you? - I'm Louis. 9 00:00:25,103 --> 00:00:26,933 Who's Louis? 10 00:00:27,034 --> 00:00:28,624 -..and angst. 11 00:00:28,724 --> 00:00:30,974 You OK, Nikki? 12 00:00:31,068 --> 00:00:33,758 Louis narrates: Trying to make connections with people, 13 00:00:33,862 --> 00:00:36,482 who are in different ways, on the edge. 14 00:00:36,586 --> 00:00:41,236 Not all of us wanna be like this. 15 00:00:41,344 --> 00:00:43,664 Louis narrates: Recently, I decided to take a pause, 16 00:00:43,758 --> 00:00:46,278 and trawl through my old shows, 17 00:00:46,379 --> 00:00:49,099 looking again at some stories that stayed with me. 18 00:00:49,206 --> 00:00:50,826 - Yeah, this has stuff in it. 19 00:00:50,931 --> 00:00:53,241 Louis narrates: And to reach out to those I'd featured. 20 00:00:53,344 --> 00:00:56,104 - Look at you, Mr Beard-and-Moustache. 21 00:00:56,206 --> 00:00:57,856 I know, don't I look distinguished? 22 00:00:57,965 --> 00:00:59,965 Louis narrates: To see how their lives have changed. 23 00:01:00,068 --> 00:01:01,238 - You've been married six times, 24 00:01:01,344 --> 00:01:03,004 Henry VIII was married six times, 25 00:01:03,103 --> 00:01:04,793 so it's not unprecedented. 26 00:01:04,896 --> 00:01:05,856 [laughter] 27 00:01:05,965 --> 00:01:08,995 - Hey, how you doing? - Good, how are you? 28 00:01:09,103 --> 00:01:10,243 - Good. 29 00:01:10,344 --> 00:01:12,484 Louis narrates: From all the hours of programmes, 30 00:01:12,586 --> 00:01:14,306 I've teased out a handful of themes. 31 00:01:14,413 --> 00:01:18,523 - This is gonna be the start of the second American Civil War! 32 00:01:18,620 --> 00:01:21,070 White Revolution! 33 00:01:21,172 --> 00:01:22,142 Louis: Why did you run? 34 00:01:22,241 --> 00:01:24,861 - Because they shoot anybody, and they don't care who it is, 35 00:01:24,965 --> 00:01:27,275 point blank range they'll pull a gun out and shoot you. 36 00:01:27,379 --> 00:01:29,519 Louis narrates: All of which in different ways 37 00:01:29,620 --> 00:01:32,410 go to the heart of what it means to be human. 38 00:01:32,517 --> 00:01:36,207 What connection is there between a birth mum and a child? 39 00:01:36,310 --> 00:01:37,720 [crying] 40 00:01:37,827 --> 00:01:39,927 - Let me tell you something. 41 00:01:40,034 --> 00:01:41,484 If you came from the ghetto, 42 00:01:41,586 --> 00:01:44,066 your main focus should be making it out, 43 00:01:44,172 --> 00:01:45,342 taking your parents out, 44 00:01:45,448 --> 00:01:47,238 and being something with yourself, 45 00:01:47,344 --> 00:01:49,764 you can't understand that, then you ain't real. 46 00:01:49,862 --> 00:01:51,452 Louis narrates: Trying to figure out 47 00:01:51,551 --> 00:01:52,661 what I've learnt about life... 48 00:01:52,758 --> 00:01:53,858 [moaning] 49 00:01:53,965 --> 00:01:55,655 ..and about myself. 50 00:01:55,758 --> 00:01:57,068 - There's nothing I could say 51 00:01:57,172 --> 00:01:58,902 that would persuade you not to do that? 52 00:01:59,000 --> 00:02:01,690 - I'm gonna be like this until I can try 53 00:02:01,793 --> 00:02:05,283 to overpower my addiction. 54 00:02:26,172 --> 00:02:28,102 Louis narrates: I know I come across as British, 55 00:02:28,206 --> 00:02:29,236 I was raised in Britain, 56 00:02:29,344 --> 00:02:31,694 but I'm in fact half American, 57 00:02:31,793 --> 00:02:33,833 my Dad is American and every summer, 58 00:02:33,931 --> 00:02:34,791 we would go to America, 59 00:02:34,896 --> 00:02:37,236 and I would see my American family. 60 00:02:39,689 --> 00:02:41,099 And I've always had a fascination 61 00:02:41,206 --> 00:02:43,716 with American consumer culture. 62 00:02:46,931 --> 00:02:48,971 It's perfected the art of creating 63 00:02:49,068 --> 00:02:52,028 a kind of theatre of capitalism. 64 00:02:52,137 --> 00:02:55,307 A vast and tantalising spectacle 65 00:02:55,413 --> 00:02:58,413 where even your strangest and most forbidden desires 66 00:02:58,517 --> 00:03:02,477 are commodified and turned into a saleable product. 67 00:03:12,482 --> 00:03:16,832 Louis: So, it's not on these, not there, 68 00:03:16,931 --> 00:03:18,101 we'll try... 69 00:03:20,931 --> 00:03:22,451 [sighs] 70 00:03:22,551 --> 00:03:24,311 Director: What is it you're looking for? 71 00:03:24,413 --> 00:03:26,173 The porn folder. 72 00:03:26,275 --> 00:03:28,445 OK so this is porn-related. 73 00:03:30,586 --> 00:03:32,546 When we made the porn episode of 'Weird Weekends', 74 00:03:32,655 --> 00:03:35,755 which was the second episode we ever shot, 75 00:03:35,862 --> 00:03:39,482 it was mainly due to me having read a piece in the New Yorker, 76 00:03:39,586 --> 00:03:43,656 about male performers and how difficult they find it 77 00:03:43,758 --> 00:03:45,898 getting an erection for scenes, 78 00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:50,140 and the pressure that that entails and the way 79 00:03:50,241 --> 00:03:53,281 in which that takes a toll on the performers. 80 00:03:57,758 --> 00:04:00,378 Louis narrates: The San Fernando Valley, north of Los Angeles, 81 00:04:00,482 --> 00:04:05,592 the acknowledged world capital of pornographic films... 82 00:04:05,689 --> 00:04:09,619 It's an industry that revolves around images of women, 83 00:04:09,724 --> 00:04:12,904 my mission, to immerse myself in the less well known 84 00:04:13,000 --> 00:04:15,550 subculture of the male performers. 85 00:04:15,655 --> 00:04:17,925 Louis: So listen, I may be interested in actually, 86 00:04:18,034 --> 00:04:20,034 you know, trying it out as a lifestyle. 87 00:04:20,137 --> 00:04:21,207 - You want to get in a movie? 88 00:04:21,310 --> 00:04:22,970 - Yeah, maybe get in a movie, something like that. 89 00:04:23,068 --> 00:04:24,138 Could I do that, do you think? 90 00:04:24,241 --> 00:04:25,791 - Now, I mean how far do you want to go with this? 91 00:04:25,896 --> 00:04:27,756 - How far could I go, hypothetically? 92 00:04:27,862 --> 00:04:31,482 - You can go, if you can do it, you can go all the way. 93 00:04:31,586 --> 00:04:32,586 Louis narrates: At that time, 94 00:04:32,689 --> 00:04:34,379 if you wanted to make it as a porn performer, 95 00:04:34,482 --> 00:04:36,342 there was one agent who you had to go and see, 96 00:04:36,448 --> 00:04:38,238 and his name was Jim South. 97 00:04:40,448 --> 00:04:41,928 If I wanted to break in, how would I start? 98 00:04:42,034 --> 00:04:44,384 Is it people come in here and that's how it moves forward? 99 00:04:44,482 --> 00:04:46,722 Yeah, they come in here, they fill out an application, 100 00:04:46,827 --> 00:04:48,067 not a contract, 101 00:04:48,172 --> 00:04:51,972 we take a couple of just standing nude polaroids, 102 00:04:52,068 --> 00:04:53,718 we give him a magazine, 103 00:04:53,827 --> 00:04:55,657 tell him he needs to excite himself, 104 00:04:55,758 --> 00:04:58,618 we leave the room while he's doing it, 105 00:04:58,724 --> 00:05:00,414 he usually hollers "Jim!" 106 00:05:00,517 --> 00:05:03,857 and we hurriedly go back and take the pictures. 107 00:05:03,965 --> 00:05:06,685 You're interested in magazine work and movie work? 108 00:05:06,793 --> 00:05:08,243 - Yes. - OK. 109 00:05:08,344 --> 00:05:11,144 Now, first of all, for movie work, 110 00:05:11,241 --> 00:05:14,551 it does mean actual sex, actual penetration, 111 00:05:14,655 --> 00:05:16,135 you don't come, you don't get paid. 112 00:05:16,241 --> 00:05:17,141 - Is that right? 113 00:05:17,241 --> 00:05:19,141 You don't come, you don't get paid. 114 00:05:19,241 --> 00:05:20,141 - The bottom line is, 115 00:05:20,241 --> 00:05:22,761 you're supposed to be getting $250 for one sex scene, 116 00:05:22,862 --> 00:05:25,452 if you do the hard core and you don't do the pop shot, 117 00:05:25,551 --> 00:05:27,661 then they hire somebody which is called the stunt cock, 118 00:05:27,758 --> 00:05:31,208 which is a guy that comes in and just pops, 119 00:05:31,310 --> 00:05:33,620 you can be the greatest stud in the world in the bedroom, 120 00:05:33,724 --> 00:05:35,004 bottom line is when you're on a set, 121 00:05:35,103 --> 00:05:38,003 and the lights go on, it's a different story. 122 00:05:38,103 --> 00:05:39,453 In the world of porn, 123 00:05:39,551 --> 00:05:41,691 clearly there's a lot of opportunities 124 00:05:41,793 --> 00:05:43,833 for colourful participation, 125 00:05:43,931 --> 00:05:46,931 and I think we even had a chat like, 126 00:05:47,034 --> 00:05:51,724 would it be appropriate for me to actually perform, 127 00:05:51,827 --> 00:05:55,167 like have sex on camera, and quite evidently, 128 00:05:55,275 --> 00:05:58,545 that's really uncomfortable and weird, 129 00:05:58,655 --> 00:06:03,235 so then the next step down was, well, but I could get naked. 130 00:06:03,344 --> 00:06:04,864 - So, Steve. - Mmm? 131 00:06:04,965 --> 00:06:08,615 - Do I have to have wood for the picture? 132 00:06:08,724 --> 00:06:10,284 - If you can, great. - OK. 133 00:06:10,379 --> 00:06:11,759 If you can't, it's not a big deal, 134 00:06:11,862 --> 00:06:14,692 - don't worry about it. - OK, we'll do our best then. 135 00:06:14,793 --> 00:06:17,073 Louis: Hey, you know the polaroid of me 136 00:06:17,172 --> 00:06:20,662 naked from the porn episode, do you know where it is? 137 00:06:25,068 --> 00:06:26,238 Steve, I'm ready. 138 00:06:27,655 --> 00:06:28,545 - Put your arms like this. 139 00:06:28,655 --> 00:06:30,335 - OK, just tell me how you want me posed? 140 00:06:30,448 --> 00:06:32,308 - Pose like this, hands together, 141 00:06:32,413 --> 00:06:34,723 smile, very nice. 142 00:06:34,827 --> 00:06:35,997 - Say sexy things. 143 00:06:36,103 --> 00:06:39,143 - Don't move like that because I'll get the wrong idea. 144 00:06:39,241 --> 00:06:41,341 Smile, get dressed cowboy. 145 00:06:41,448 --> 00:06:42,828 - 21 after 2. 146 00:06:42,931 --> 00:06:44,591 - OK, this is how we're gonna do the scene. 147 00:06:45,689 --> 00:06:48,209 Miss Thing, walk off. 148 00:06:48,310 --> 00:06:50,210 - I'm supposed to give his dick a lick 149 00:06:50,310 --> 00:06:52,100 and say, and then say, "Do you wanna go out with me", 150 00:06:52,206 --> 00:06:55,756 why can't I just go, "You wanna go out with me?" 151 00:06:55,862 --> 00:06:56,792 - Yeah, yeah, yeah. - Huh? 152 00:06:56,896 --> 00:06:58,136 'Cause this is the power, you know. 153 00:06:58,241 --> 00:06:59,381 [moaning] 154 00:06:59,482 --> 00:07:01,552 Louis: Going into the world, I was embarrassed 155 00:07:01,655 --> 00:07:04,545 because I thought maybe I will think it's quite sexy. 156 00:07:04,655 --> 00:07:07,825 And it's sort of a relief when you're there and you realise, 157 00:07:07,931 --> 00:07:11,791 oh no, it isn't sexy at all, it's sort of, 158 00:07:11,896 --> 00:07:16,716 mechanical and perfunctory and it's like watching someone 159 00:07:16,827 --> 00:07:18,517 on a weights machine, do you know what I mean? 160 00:07:18,620 --> 00:07:19,970 Going up and down. 161 00:07:21,310 --> 00:07:23,100 The one thing that I've noticed about guys, 162 00:07:23,206 --> 00:07:26,546 is that they've come in very sweet, very open, 163 00:07:26,655 --> 00:07:31,335 very tentative, um, and almost tender at times, 164 00:07:31,448 --> 00:07:33,898 and then as you see them film after film after film, 165 00:07:34,000 --> 00:07:36,380 you kind of see that glazed look go over, 166 00:07:36,482 --> 00:07:38,792 and it's the look, it's the change, 167 00:07:38,896 --> 00:07:39,896 and you suddenly realise that 168 00:07:40,000 --> 00:07:41,210 you too could be a piece of meat, 169 00:07:41,310 --> 00:07:45,240 a hole in the wall, or whatever fantasy is inside their head, 170 00:07:45,344 --> 00:07:49,594 it's a degree of the, of the utmost impersonal. 171 00:07:49,689 --> 00:07:51,589 As fun as you'd think it would be, 172 00:07:51,689 --> 00:07:54,409 or might be, that's part of the con, it's not really. 173 00:07:54,517 --> 00:07:56,967 - Walk off. - You guys go off this way. 174 00:07:57,068 --> 00:07:59,448 Louis narrates: The male performers in straight porn 175 00:07:59,551 --> 00:08:01,551 were by definition less valuable, 176 00:08:01,655 --> 00:08:04,715 and they were paid less and it was harder to make a living, 177 00:08:04,827 --> 00:08:06,447 but one of the few who did make a living 178 00:08:06,551 --> 00:08:08,621 worked under the name John Doe. 179 00:08:08,724 --> 00:08:10,484 - I understand from talking to Susan a little bit 180 00:08:10,586 --> 00:08:11,856 that one of the biggest challenges 181 00:08:11,965 --> 00:08:13,755 is keeping what they call wood, is that right? 182 00:08:13,862 --> 00:08:15,622 A lot of guys don't have what it takes, man, 183 00:08:15,724 --> 00:08:18,454 because, you know, you're supposed to make love, 184 00:08:18,551 --> 00:08:19,591 make beautiful love, 185 00:08:19,689 --> 00:08:22,029 and that's not what you're doing here. 186 00:08:22,137 --> 00:08:23,897 - Do you get a lot of people coming up to you saying, 187 00:08:24,000 --> 00:08:26,340 "Hey man, I want to do your job," that type of thing? 188 00:08:26,448 --> 00:08:28,028 Yeah, you know, some of them are happy, 189 00:08:28,137 --> 00:08:30,067 some of them are standoffish, they look at you 190 00:08:30,172 --> 00:08:33,832 but they don't want to approach you, some of them... 191 00:08:33,931 --> 00:08:35,591 Some of them get cocky, you know, 192 00:08:35,689 --> 00:08:37,339 "I can do that. Oh yeah, you gotta go to work, 193 00:08:37,448 --> 00:08:41,308 "ha-ha, oh yeah right, you got to go to work, sure." 194 00:08:41,413 --> 00:08:43,103 - That must get kind of irritating in a way 195 00:08:43,206 --> 00:08:44,996 when people regard you, take your work seriously, 196 00:08:45,103 --> 00:08:46,623 they don't, they say, "Ah you just have sex." 197 00:08:46,724 --> 00:08:49,974 - No, it doesn't irritate me, I just stay home more. 198 00:08:50,068 --> 00:08:51,378 Louis: I'm gonna buy one of these 199 00:08:51,482 --> 00:08:53,932 with my first pay check as a porno guy. 200 00:08:55,517 --> 00:08:57,277 Well, you know what, with your first pay check... 201 00:08:57,379 --> 00:08:58,309 - Yeah? 202 00:08:58,413 --> 00:09:00,243 -..for the month, you actually could buy one of these. 203 00:09:00,344 --> 00:09:02,104 - Really? - Sure. 204 00:09:02,206 --> 00:09:04,546 - Do you think I could make it? - Yeah. 205 00:09:04,655 --> 00:09:05,965 - No. - Absolutely, man. 206 00:09:06,068 --> 00:09:06,968 - Why? 207 00:09:07,068 --> 00:09:08,338 I've seen a lot of guys come and go, man, 208 00:09:08,448 --> 00:09:11,758 but you're, you can do this. 209 00:09:16,931 --> 00:09:19,241 The main thing was to try and identify 210 00:09:19,344 --> 00:09:22,004 a male performer who was new to the business. 211 00:09:22,103 --> 00:09:24,003 And it was critical that that was the right person 212 00:09:24,103 --> 00:09:26,693 because the whole attempt was to see the industry, 213 00:09:26,793 --> 00:09:29,863 and the travails of the male performers hinged on 214 00:09:29,965 --> 00:09:32,475 the audience, kind of, identifying 215 00:09:32,586 --> 00:09:35,446 with the male performer that we followed. 216 00:09:35,551 --> 00:09:37,591 - You must be JJ? I'm Louis. - How you doing? 217 00:09:37,689 --> 00:09:38,859 - How's it going? - Oh, alright. 218 00:09:38,965 --> 00:09:40,965 - Can we come up? - Oh yes, come on. 219 00:09:41,068 --> 00:09:43,788 Jim South told me that you're the man to talk to 220 00:09:43,896 --> 00:09:45,276 about understanding the porno business 221 00:09:45,379 --> 00:09:48,309 because you're a successful young up-and-coming porno actor. 222 00:09:48,413 --> 00:09:49,973 - I guess. - Is that right? 223 00:09:50,068 --> 00:09:50,968 - Sounds good to me. 224 00:09:51,068 --> 00:09:52,548 - So can I hang out with you for a few days, 225 00:09:52,655 --> 00:09:54,895 - would that be alright? - Oh, please do. 226 00:09:55,000 --> 00:09:57,070 Louis narrates: He was two weeks into the business, 227 00:09:57,172 --> 00:09:58,212 he'd signed with Jim South, 228 00:09:58,310 --> 00:10:00,930 and he just seemed like a nice guy. 229 00:10:01,034 --> 00:10:03,864 A kind of can-do attitude, 230 00:10:03,965 --> 00:10:06,375 he had a work ethic and he was focused, 231 00:10:06,482 --> 00:10:09,002 and he seemed sort of vulnerable. 232 00:10:09,103 --> 00:10:12,523 So, in a way, it became JJ's story. 233 00:10:12,620 --> 00:10:15,550 So I went with JJ to the set of his next movie, 234 00:10:15,655 --> 00:10:18,205 which was the biggest one he'd done, up until that point. 235 00:10:19,586 --> 00:10:21,376 - JJ standing by, you ready? 236 00:10:21,482 --> 00:10:22,692 - Alright, we're ready to shoot. 237 00:10:22,793 --> 00:10:24,693 - Let's roll sound first to get up to speed. 238 00:10:24,793 --> 00:10:26,863 - How you feeling? Pretty good? 239 00:10:26,965 --> 00:10:28,205 - Yeah. - You got wood yet? 240 00:10:28,310 --> 00:10:30,240 - No. - When do you do that? 241 00:10:30,344 --> 00:10:31,834 - When I'm gonna have sex. 242 00:10:31,931 --> 00:10:32,831 [LAUGHTER] 243 00:10:32,931 --> 00:10:35,071 Director: let's go, places. 244 00:10:35,172 --> 00:10:37,452 - Hey, break a leg. 245 00:10:39,689 --> 00:10:43,479 - Sound speed marker, please. - 11 after take six, marker. 246 00:10:43,586 --> 00:10:46,476 - And action. 247 00:10:46,586 --> 00:10:48,306 - Pull out. - That's a cut. 248 00:10:48,413 --> 00:10:49,863 - I don't think we are gonna be able to do this. 249 00:10:49,965 --> 00:10:50,895 - No? Alright, fine. 250 00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:52,030 - We got to check on Mr wood? 251 00:10:52,137 --> 00:10:53,307 Louis: What's happening? 252 00:10:53,413 --> 00:10:55,313 JJ right now is having wood problems. 253 00:10:55,413 --> 00:10:56,313 - Really? - Yeah. 254 00:10:56,413 --> 00:10:57,343 - Why? 255 00:10:57,448 --> 00:10:58,898 - With all these people around, could you do it? 256 00:10:59,000 --> 00:10:59,930 - No. - I couldn't either. 257 00:11:00,034 --> 00:11:02,344 - OK there, JJ? - Let's go, JJ. 258 00:11:02,448 --> 00:11:04,338 - Are we there guys? 259 00:11:04,448 --> 00:11:05,718 Louis: You delivered in the end, right? 260 00:11:05,827 --> 00:11:06,717 Oh, yeah. 261 00:11:06,827 --> 00:11:08,517 - But what about, as far as... 262 00:11:10,103 --> 00:11:11,453 ..the man goes, you know, 263 00:11:11,551 --> 00:11:14,071 pretty solid? Wood? 264 00:11:14,172 --> 00:11:16,412 The end, near the end, yeah. Beginning, no. 265 00:11:16,517 --> 00:11:17,447 - Really? - Yeah. 266 00:11:17,551 --> 00:11:20,281 it's just, so many people, there's a lot of people, 267 00:11:20,379 --> 00:11:22,099 nervous kind of in front of Shanahan 268 00:11:22,206 --> 00:11:24,336 because he's a big director, as soon as you get nervous 269 00:11:24,448 --> 00:11:27,928 it's hard to work but, yeah, near the end he went fine. 270 00:11:28,034 --> 00:11:31,284 So in addition to the challenge of getting wood, 271 00:11:31,379 --> 00:11:34,589 there's also the worry about contracting an STD, 272 00:11:34,689 --> 00:11:38,449 and in fact while we were there, there was an HIV scare. 273 00:11:38,551 --> 00:11:40,691 We've had two positives in less than a week. 274 00:11:40,793 --> 00:11:42,243 - In what? - In HIV. 275 00:11:42,344 --> 00:11:45,144 I mean, now it's like, forget this, 276 00:11:45,241 --> 00:11:48,761 I'm not risking my life any more, you know, 277 00:11:48,862 --> 00:11:49,792 to make this much money, 278 00:11:49,896 --> 00:11:53,586 I can make this much more money, you know, doing other things. 279 00:11:53,689 --> 00:11:56,659 - What do you reckon, JJ, are you worried about these tests? 280 00:11:56,758 --> 00:11:59,858 No, I have a death wish so it doesn't really matter. 281 00:11:59,965 --> 00:12:01,405 [laughter] 282 00:12:07,034 --> 00:12:08,934 Louis narrates: The porn world felt like maybe 283 00:12:09,034 --> 00:12:10,834 the music industry would be like, with, 284 00:12:10,931 --> 00:12:13,831 kind of, glamour and young people, 285 00:12:13,931 --> 00:12:16,621 attractive young people and excitement and creativity, 286 00:12:16,724 --> 00:12:20,214 but then another part of it seemed to be bound up 287 00:12:20,310 --> 00:12:22,760 with a certain quality of self destructiveness, 288 00:12:22,862 --> 00:12:25,862 or dysfunction with people who were trying 289 00:12:25,965 --> 00:12:28,755 to figure something out about themselves. 290 00:12:28,862 --> 00:12:33,792 Or maybe who had been damaged in some way, 291 00:12:33,896 --> 00:12:35,856 or were trying to process something 292 00:12:35,965 --> 00:12:37,995 that they'd grown up with. 293 00:12:38,103 --> 00:12:39,933 I suppose, the open question was, 294 00:12:40,034 --> 00:12:42,764 to what extent that was helpful to them 295 00:12:42,862 --> 00:12:46,382 and to what extent they were being exploited 296 00:12:46,482 --> 00:12:49,862 or allowing themselves to be used, you know. 297 00:12:49,965 --> 00:12:53,515 Was it actually gonna end up being positive for them? 298 00:12:58,310 --> 00:13:02,380 In 2006, nine years after we made the documentary, 299 00:13:02,482 --> 00:13:05,002 John Doe took his own life. 300 00:13:06,655 --> 00:13:10,165 JJ and I stayed in touch and became friends. 301 00:13:10,275 --> 00:13:12,615 He left the porn industry, 302 00:13:12,724 --> 00:13:17,664 and became an IT consultant, and ended up moving to Ukraine. 303 00:13:17,758 --> 00:13:19,718 [Skype dial tone] 304 00:13:19,827 --> 00:13:21,617 There he is! 305 00:13:21,724 --> 00:13:22,694 - Hello. 306 00:13:22,793 --> 00:13:24,903 [laughter] 307 00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:28,340 - What was it that was appealing to you 308 00:13:28,448 --> 00:13:30,718 about the idea of working in porn? 309 00:13:30,827 --> 00:13:34,857 - Part of it was, 25 years ago Monday 310 00:13:34,965 --> 00:13:39,925 is when my son died, and after that point, 311 00:13:40,034 --> 00:13:43,034 I pretty much spiralled downward, 312 00:13:43,137 --> 00:13:46,377 basically standing at the bottom of that bottomless pit, 313 00:13:46,482 --> 00:13:48,722 and looking up and seeing there was no light 314 00:13:48,827 --> 00:13:49,757 at the end of the tunnel, 315 00:13:49,862 --> 00:13:51,792 You know, I was truly broken 316 00:13:51,896 --> 00:13:55,616 and that makes you do strange things, 317 00:13:55,724 --> 00:13:57,074 and one of the things I appreciate 318 00:13:57,172 --> 00:13:58,452 about the documentary is I think 319 00:13:58,551 --> 00:14:01,101 that's a very good capsule in time 320 00:14:01,206 --> 00:14:06,516 of where I was emotionally and mentally, 321 00:14:06,620 --> 00:14:08,170 exactly during that period. 322 00:14:08,275 --> 00:14:10,205 - John doe went on to kill himself. 323 00:14:11,034 --> 00:14:12,554 Did you know him at all? 324 00:14:12,655 --> 00:14:14,405 Yeah I mean, we weren't friends, 325 00:14:14,517 --> 00:14:17,517 but I've met him several times on different sets. 326 00:14:17,620 --> 00:14:20,550 Do you have a sense of what was behind it? 327 00:14:20,655 --> 00:14:22,615 The male performers I was friends with, 328 00:14:22,724 --> 00:14:26,384 there was always an underlying issue of depression, 329 00:14:26,482 --> 00:14:30,072 and when a man chooses to commit suicide, 330 00:14:30,172 --> 00:14:33,002 it's usually because of depression. 331 00:14:33,103 --> 00:14:35,933 Working in the adult industry is similar to a drug, 332 00:14:36,034 --> 00:14:37,314 you get that adrenaline rush, 333 00:14:37,413 --> 00:14:39,103 so I think it naturally attracts people 334 00:14:39,206 --> 00:14:42,516 that have some underlying craziness as it were, 335 00:14:42,620 --> 00:14:44,030 and that's not necessarily a bad thing, 336 00:14:44,137 --> 00:14:46,027 it's what makes us who we are. 337 00:14:46,137 --> 00:14:47,137 [baby crying] 338 00:14:47,241 --> 00:14:49,381 I heard a baby, which means maybe 339 00:14:49,482 --> 00:14:51,102 it's a good time to mention 340 00:14:51,206 --> 00:14:54,546 that you're not only now happily married, 341 00:14:54,655 --> 00:14:56,545 but you also have a young daughter. 342 00:14:56,655 --> 00:15:00,655 Congratulations. You've been married six times. 343 00:15:00,758 --> 00:15:02,718 Which, you know, Henry VIII was married six times, 344 00:15:02,827 --> 00:15:04,277 so it's not unprecedented... 345 00:15:04,379 --> 00:15:05,659 [laughter] 346 00:15:05,758 --> 00:15:08,098 ..but he was a little older. 347 00:15:08,206 --> 00:15:10,926 - It took a lot of failed relationships 348 00:15:11,034 --> 00:15:12,934 for me to truly understand who I am, 349 00:15:13,034 --> 00:15:15,934 who I need to look for and how to truly build 350 00:15:16,034 --> 00:15:17,594 a loving intimate relationship 351 00:15:17,689 --> 00:15:21,689 that's not just based on just carnal physicality. 352 00:15:28,034 --> 00:15:31,664 Louis: Tapes. Young people know about tapes. 353 00:15:35,068 --> 00:15:39,308 DJ Indo Smoke, Bay Area Rappers. 354 00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:45,450 I've been a fan of hip hop since the late '80s 355 00:15:45,551 --> 00:15:48,551 and I remember my friend Joe, Joe Cornish, 356 00:15:48,655 --> 00:15:50,025 made me a compilation tape, 357 00:15:50,137 --> 00:15:51,547 and it had on it a track 358 00:15:51,655 --> 00:15:54,375 called 'Paid in Full' by Eric B & Rakim. 359 00:15:55,482 --> 00:15:56,902 I fell in love with it. 360 00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:01,410 you felt like you were plugging into bulletins 361 00:16:01,517 --> 00:16:04,377 from dissident America, that it was telling you 362 00:16:04,482 --> 00:16:06,452 something important about the state 363 00:16:06,551 --> 00:16:09,211 of the disenfranchised youth of America, 364 00:16:09,310 --> 00:16:12,660 about racism in America, about structures of inequality. 365 00:16:13,758 --> 00:16:14,968 ♪ You are now about to witness 366 00:16:15,068 --> 00:16:17,238 ♪ The strength of street knowledge... ♪ 367 00:16:19,586 --> 00:16:21,926 Louis narrates: Then a year or two after that, 368 00:16:22,034 --> 00:16:25,034 NWA appeared, the first big gangsta rap group. 369 00:16:25,896 --> 00:16:27,066 ♪ Straight Outta Compton 370 00:16:27,172 --> 00:16:28,972 ♪ Crazy mother fucker named Ice Cube ♪ 371 00:16:29,068 --> 00:16:31,138 ♪ From that gang called Niggas With Attitude ♪ 372 00:16:31,241 --> 00:16:32,381 ♪ When I'm called off 373 00:16:32,482 --> 00:16:33,722 ♪ I got a sawed off... 374 00:16:33,827 --> 00:16:35,377 Louis narrates: It was intimidating, 375 00:16:35,482 --> 00:16:39,212 occasionally offensive, frequently misogynistic, 376 00:16:39,310 --> 00:16:40,790 but also, captivating. 377 00:16:42,482 --> 00:16:45,032 So I was curious about that tension 378 00:16:45,137 --> 00:16:47,237 between what was real and what wasn't, 379 00:16:47,344 --> 00:16:48,834 and whether the lyrics and the personas 380 00:16:48,931 --> 00:16:50,931 reflected their real lives, 381 00:16:51,034 --> 00:16:53,104 and how much of it was putting on an act. 382 00:16:56,241 --> 00:16:58,691 We filmed the episode in the South, 383 00:16:58,793 --> 00:17:01,143 which was then emerging in the new force in rap. 384 00:17:02,482 --> 00:17:05,792 There was a rapper, and impresario and mogul 385 00:17:05,896 --> 00:17:12,586 called Master P, who was making an absolute tonne of money 386 00:17:12,689 --> 00:17:16,619 by controlling the whole process of making the music, 387 00:17:16,724 --> 00:17:18,284 but also distributing the music, 388 00:17:18,379 --> 00:17:22,929 bypassing the major labels and had created an empire 389 00:17:23,034 --> 00:17:25,594 in the South, specifically Louisiana. 390 00:17:25,689 --> 00:17:28,409 I ended up going back to his house, 391 00:17:28,517 --> 00:17:32,857 he then lived in Baton Rouge, in a gated community. 392 00:17:32,965 --> 00:17:34,475 Do you want to shoot some hoops? 393 00:17:34,586 --> 00:17:35,786 Yeah, I'm not very good, 394 00:17:35,896 --> 00:17:38,236 I don't even know why I suggested to do this. 395 00:17:39,896 --> 00:17:41,656 - Oh yeah, you horrible. 396 00:17:41,758 --> 00:17:44,168 It all started right here with this tank right here, 397 00:17:44,275 --> 00:17:45,585 you got to be a soldier, 398 00:17:45,689 --> 00:17:48,139 and being a soldier you got to be able to keep it real. 399 00:17:48,241 --> 00:17:50,411 - What does that mean, 'keeping it real'? 400 00:17:50,517 --> 00:17:51,857 - Keeping it real, being yourself. 401 00:17:51,965 --> 00:17:54,205 - Being yourself? - Being yourself, I mean... 402 00:17:54,310 --> 00:17:55,480 some people take keep it real 403 00:17:55,586 --> 00:17:57,306 where they got to be the baddest person in the world, 404 00:17:57,413 --> 00:17:58,833 the hardest person in the world... 405 00:17:58,931 --> 00:18:00,721 - Yeah, like a gangster. - That ain't keeping it real. 406 00:18:00,827 --> 00:18:01,927 - Are the neighbours friendly? 407 00:18:02,034 --> 00:18:03,624 I knocked on all of them doors and told them 408 00:18:03,724 --> 00:18:05,724 that I'm here and I'm not going nowhere. 409 00:18:05,827 --> 00:18:06,967 - Did you seriously? - Yeah. 410 00:18:07,068 --> 00:18:09,168 And, yeah that doesn't sound reassuring, 411 00:18:09,275 --> 00:18:11,375 that sounds almost slightly threatening. 412 00:18:11,482 --> 00:18:13,412 Take it how you want to. 413 00:18:13,517 --> 00:18:15,617 Louis narrates: He'd been raised in one of New Orleans' 414 00:18:15,724 --> 00:18:18,244 most dangerous housing projects, 415 00:18:18,344 --> 00:18:22,074 and was now among the highest paid entertainers in America. 416 00:18:22,172 --> 00:18:28,282 His annual income was estimated to be $60 million a year. 417 00:18:28,379 --> 00:18:31,479 How much would you say you owe to, you know, the rap game? 418 00:18:31,586 --> 00:18:33,406 I owe all of it to the rap game. 419 00:18:36,448 --> 00:18:38,588 Who is this on this one, Master P? 420 00:18:38,689 --> 00:18:40,899 - That's me, these portraits are all of me. 421 00:18:44,241 --> 00:18:47,031 - This is my home recording studio. 422 00:18:47,137 --> 00:18:50,337 I look at this $800,000 chandelier and say, 423 00:18:50,448 --> 00:18:52,518 "Wow, I made it." 424 00:18:53,655 --> 00:18:55,065 Louis: These are your vehicles. 425 00:18:55,172 --> 00:18:56,862 do you ever worry that you'll be perceived 426 00:18:56,965 --> 00:18:59,305 as losing your credibility on the streets 427 00:18:59,413 --> 00:19:01,173 because you are so comfortable now? 428 00:19:02,172 --> 00:19:03,552 Let me tell you something. 429 00:19:03,655 --> 00:19:04,685 That's what I'm telling you 430 00:19:04,793 --> 00:19:07,073 about being a soldier and keeping it real. 431 00:19:07,172 --> 00:19:08,902 If you came from the ghetto, 432 00:19:09,000 --> 00:19:11,210 your main focus should be making it out, 433 00:19:11,310 --> 00:19:14,340 taking your parents out and being something with yourself. 434 00:19:14,448 --> 00:19:17,478 You can't understand that, then you ain't real. 435 00:19:21,655 --> 00:19:23,235 Louis: The back bone of the episode 436 00:19:23,344 --> 00:19:26,864 really turned out to be a character called Mello-T, 437 00:19:26,965 --> 00:19:28,895 who'd been a successful rapper, 438 00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:31,340 and unlike many of the people in Jackson, 439 00:19:31,448 --> 00:19:34,518 had enjoyed success in New York. 440 00:19:34,620 --> 00:19:37,480 They referred to him in Jackson as 'The Godfather.' 441 00:19:37,586 --> 00:19:39,656 Louis narrates: And what made him unusual as well 442 00:19:39,758 --> 00:19:44,788 was along side his rapping, he also claimed to be a pimp. 443 00:19:44,896 --> 00:19:46,306 - How you doing? - How you doing? 444 00:19:46,413 --> 00:19:47,793 - You must be Mello-T. - No doubt. 445 00:19:47,896 --> 00:19:50,306 - I'm Louis, Louis Theroux. - I heard a lot about you. 446 00:19:50,413 --> 00:19:51,903 - Good. - A lot about you. 447 00:19:52,000 --> 00:19:54,030 - Yeah, you're looking very, very smart. 448 00:19:54,137 --> 00:19:57,337 - This is just Mello's style, this is like, 449 00:19:57,448 --> 00:20:01,828 worldwide international Godfather gangster pimp style. 450 00:20:01,931 --> 00:20:02,901 - Yeah, yeah. 451 00:20:03,000 --> 00:20:04,450 - That's how I'm bringing it, you know. 452 00:20:04,551 --> 00:20:06,521 You know I'm in the music business 453 00:20:06,620 --> 00:20:09,520 but the scripple business, the prostitution business, 454 00:20:09,620 --> 00:20:12,550 that's been my business for the last three, four years. 455 00:20:12,655 --> 00:20:16,305 - That's stuff you do? Now? - Right, yeah. 456 00:20:16,413 --> 00:20:20,103 Right but it's the money, it's the money behind my music, 457 00:20:20,206 --> 00:20:24,206 it's the money that finances the studios 458 00:20:24,310 --> 00:20:26,480 that finances the music business. 459 00:20:26,586 --> 00:20:27,716 - Because in Britain, 460 00:20:27,827 --> 00:20:30,277 to be a pimp would be considered definitely... 461 00:20:31,448 --> 00:20:33,658 - Illegal, just like being a drug dealer. 462 00:20:33,758 --> 00:20:35,928 - Illegal and maybe immoral, well immoral, yes. 463 00:20:36,034 --> 00:20:37,144 - Same thing here. - Yeah. 464 00:20:37,241 --> 00:20:38,411 It's the same thing here, 465 00:20:38,517 --> 00:20:41,517 and you can go to the penitentiary for doing it, 466 00:20:41,620 --> 00:20:43,240 and you can get killed for doing it. 467 00:20:43,344 --> 00:20:45,384 Louis: Mello was a perplexing figure. 468 00:20:45,482 --> 00:20:46,692 Obviously the fact that he'd said 469 00:20:46,793 --> 00:20:49,763 he was a pimp was troubling, but at the time, 470 00:20:49,862 --> 00:20:52,002 in my naivete, I continued to think 471 00:20:52,103 --> 00:20:54,213 he might just be playing a role. 472 00:20:55,655 --> 00:20:57,895 Is this for, what's it called? 473 00:20:58,000 --> 00:20:58,900 [Mello starts rapping] 474 00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:00,930 ♪ This goes out to all the young folks ♪ 475 00:21:01,034 --> 00:21:02,244 ♪ You know what I'm saying 476 00:21:02,344 --> 00:21:04,624 ♪ Young kids thinking you want to get into this game ♪ 477 00:21:04,724 --> 00:21:06,284 ♪ Pimping 478 00:21:06,379 --> 00:21:07,659 ♪ True testimony 479 00:21:07,758 --> 00:21:10,068 ♪ It's where I want to be man for real ♪ 480 00:21:10,172 --> 00:21:13,692 ♪ You came from London just to hear my story ♪ 481 00:21:13,793 --> 00:21:16,903 ♪ I'm in the hood witness be the glory ♪ 482 00:21:17,000 --> 00:21:19,790 ♪ Now I'm a pimp and I gots to break a hoe man ♪ 483 00:21:19,896 --> 00:21:21,306 ♪ Ain't getting no educated 484 00:21:21,413 --> 00:21:23,283 ♪ But that's the way I make my dough man ♪ 485 00:21:23,379 --> 00:21:24,279 ♪ Now Louis 486 00:21:24,379 --> 00:21:26,789 ♪ I'm in this shit trying to be good ♪ 487 00:21:26,896 --> 00:21:29,406 ♪ I'm on my way they say to Hollywood ♪ 488 00:21:29,517 --> 00:21:32,407 ♪ I be pimping all night long trying to make my paper ♪ 489 00:21:32,517 --> 00:21:35,617 ♪ If my bitch come in short I have to break her ♪ 490 00:21:35,724 --> 00:21:38,834 ♪ This game was real man I ain't no lie ♪ 491 00:21:38,931 --> 00:21:40,831 ♪ This from the top of my head man ♪ 492 00:21:40,931 --> 00:21:42,591 ♪ Every night I could die damn 493 00:21:42,689 --> 00:21:44,589 ♪ Now I always be a G 494 00:21:44,689 --> 00:21:49,279 ♪ But I can't let these streets get the best of me ♪ 495 00:21:49,379 --> 00:21:51,689 ♪ I feel you, Louis. 496 00:21:51,793 --> 00:21:53,833 Louis narrates: With Mello-T, he was in a way 497 00:21:53,931 --> 00:21:58,031 the personification of that whole idea of well, 498 00:21:58,137 --> 00:22:01,547 are you rapping about something as a reporter, right, 499 00:22:01,655 --> 00:22:03,855 describing it, if you say you did something 500 00:22:03,965 --> 00:22:07,095 in a rap is that because you're describing a lifestyle 501 00:22:07,206 --> 00:22:09,586 and bringing the news about it to an audience? 502 00:22:09,689 --> 00:22:13,449 Or are you actually just boasting 503 00:22:13,551 --> 00:22:17,311 about doing terrible things, that you actually did do? 504 00:22:17,413 --> 00:22:18,693 As I spent more time with him, 505 00:22:18,793 --> 00:22:21,243 I realised he really was a pimp, 506 00:22:21,344 --> 00:22:24,074 and the line between the fiction and the reality 507 00:22:24,172 --> 00:22:27,932 was at best blurred, and maybe even non-existent. 508 00:22:28,034 --> 00:22:30,174 - Hi, how you doing? - This is Sunshine. 509 00:22:30,275 --> 00:22:32,585 - Nice to meet you. - Are you sunshine? I'm Louis. 510 00:22:32,689 --> 00:22:34,859 - Number one, this Fantasy. - Hi, Fantasy. 511 00:22:34,965 --> 00:22:36,275 - This is a couple of my girls. 512 00:22:36,379 --> 00:22:37,969 - How you doing? 513 00:22:38,068 --> 00:22:40,998 And, so are you having a rehearsal, 514 00:22:41,103 --> 00:22:42,833 I mean what is happening, this is odd, isn't it? 515 00:22:42,931 --> 00:22:45,551 [gunshots] 516 00:22:49,724 --> 00:22:50,864 Ooh, be careful with that, 517 00:22:50,965 --> 00:22:52,615 I don't think you should put it down there. 518 00:22:52,724 --> 00:22:53,974 - It's where I keep it. - Yeah. 519 00:22:54,068 --> 00:22:56,028 - I've been doing that since... - It could go off, though. 520 00:22:56,137 --> 00:22:57,277 - No it ain't gonna go, 521 00:22:57,379 --> 00:22:58,999 I've been doing it since 11 years old. 522 00:22:59,103 --> 00:23:01,523 - Yeah, you could shoot your testicles off, basically. 523 00:23:01,620 --> 00:23:03,590 - Baby, no man, there's where I keep it, 524 00:23:03,689 --> 00:23:05,899 that's where I keep it, I believe in coercive power, 525 00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:09,590 that's fear, and sometimes, man, that's the best understanding 526 00:23:09,689 --> 00:23:12,139 in the world, like when a woman got a pistol to her head, 527 00:23:12,241 --> 00:23:13,901 seems like she's gonna listen better. 528 00:23:15,344 --> 00:23:16,664 That's quite shocking. 529 00:23:16,758 --> 00:23:18,828 - Not really, not to me, 530 00:23:18,931 --> 00:23:21,591 everybody fascinated with the bad guy, 531 00:23:21,689 --> 00:23:24,309 everybody want to know, man, how it is to be a pimp, 532 00:23:24,413 --> 00:23:27,073 how it is to be a gangster, you know what I'm saying? 533 00:23:27,172 --> 00:23:28,342 But couldn't you just go ahead 534 00:23:28,448 --> 00:23:30,858 and rap about being a pimp and not actually be a pimp? 535 00:23:30,965 --> 00:23:33,335 - No, no it wouldn't work for me, 536 00:23:33,448 --> 00:23:34,588 you understand what I'm saying? 537 00:23:34,689 --> 00:23:35,549 - Why? 538 00:23:35,655 --> 00:23:36,585 I mean, it's just like me 539 00:23:36,689 --> 00:23:38,479 rapping about building computers, 540 00:23:38,586 --> 00:23:40,476 you feel what I'm saying, it ain't what I do, 541 00:23:40,586 --> 00:23:42,066 you know, but I break a hoe. 542 00:23:42,172 --> 00:23:43,482 - It's just, I thought it was like, 543 00:23:43,586 --> 00:23:45,966 you know, wrestling where, OK, they are quite strong 544 00:23:46,068 --> 00:23:47,618 but you're basically pretending to fight, 545 00:23:47,724 --> 00:23:49,934 - you're portraying a character. - not me, not me. 546 00:23:50,034 --> 00:23:52,104 - Do you know what I mean? - Not me. 547 00:23:52,206 --> 00:23:54,616 The character is real, you understand me? 548 00:23:54,724 --> 00:23:58,554 And this character who I am, might get me killed for real, 549 00:23:58,655 --> 00:24:01,445 straight up, and that's what's so real about my life. 550 00:24:01,551 --> 00:24:04,311 - That's got to be a bad thing? - No, it ain't no bad thing. 551 00:24:04,413 --> 00:24:05,553 Ain't nothing bad about dying, man, 552 00:24:05,655 --> 00:24:08,895 you understand, especially for the cause, you feel me? 553 00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:10,760 Straight up, I'm gonna be a hero, man, 554 00:24:10,862 --> 00:24:12,902 we'll be like the rest of them like Jessie James, 555 00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:15,830 and Billy the Kid and all of them, you understand me? 556 00:24:15,931 --> 00:24:18,141 [gunshots] 557 00:24:18,241 --> 00:24:20,661 Louis narrates: As shocking as gangster rap can be, 558 00:24:20,758 --> 00:24:24,858 in terms of the lifestyle it seems to promote, 559 00:24:24,965 --> 00:24:27,335 you've also got to remember that's the world 560 00:24:27,448 --> 00:24:29,998 that many rappers have grown up in, 561 00:24:30,103 --> 00:24:34,663 that's what they've seen all around them in the projects, 562 00:24:34,758 --> 00:24:39,138 but at the same time it is also true that, 563 00:24:39,241 --> 00:24:44,101 in putting so much emphasis on authenticity, 564 00:24:44,206 --> 00:24:48,276 there's a real danger that the music ends up, 565 00:24:48,379 --> 00:24:53,589 kind of making being a gangster a hallmark of realness, 566 00:24:53,689 --> 00:24:58,549 that that's something you almost have to aspire to be. 567 00:25:00,000 --> 00:25:01,930 You know and I still listen to it, 568 00:25:02,034 --> 00:25:06,074 I still like it, and I feel that you can't extract 569 00:25:06,172 --> 00:25:07,862 all the darkness, that's part of 570 00:25:07,965 --> 00:25:10,375 what makes it powerful and special. 571 00:25:10,482 --> 00:25:12,902 You know, I guess, some things in life, 572 00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:15,410 you don't arrive at a neat position on. 573 00:25:19,586 --> 00:25:23,096 Time went by, and I continued to be intrigued by Mello, 574 00:25:23,206 --> 00:25:24,996 I guess I was curious about whether 575 00:25:25,103 --> 00:25:26,623 he would change his life. 576 00:25:27,517 --> 00:25:28,897 Four years after filming, 577 00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:32,100 I went back and saw him again for a book I was working on. 578 00:25:33,448 --> 00:25:36,308 [Mello rapping] 579 00:25:40,758 --> 00:25:42,858 Louis narrates: He was still writing music, 580 00:25:42,965 --> 00:25:46,305 still pimping, and still saying he wanted to give it up. 581 00:25:47,310 --> 00:25:48,660 This saying that, you know, 582 00:25:48,758 --> 00:25:53,068 your past can be full of spots but your future is spotless. 583 00:25:54,241 --> 00:25:55,621 My future is spotless, 584 00:25:55,724 --> 00:25:59,864 now my past is maybe full of spots. 585 00:25:59,965 --> 00:26:01,685 Louis narrates: I remember saying to him, 586 00:26:01,793 --> 00:26:03,173 I'm confused, like, 587 00:26:03,275 --> 00:26:06,165 do you hate the game or not, which is it? 588 00:26:06,275 --> 00:26:12,445 And he said, "I hate the game, but I love to do it." 589 00:26:12,551 --> 00:26:13,831 Which is kind of deep. 590 00:26:16,586 --> 00:26:18,446 The world is set up in such a way 591 00:26:18,551 --> 00:26:21,721 that there are past times and pursuits 592 00:26:21,827 --> 00:26:25,067 that may be poisonous and dangerous 593 00:26:25,172 --> 00:26:27,172 and that know we're not supposed to get involved in 594 00:26:27,275 --> 00:26:30,855 by conventional morality, and yet, in spite of ourselves, 595 00:26:30,965 --> 00:26:34,855 we find ourselves drawn to them, and we can't resist. 596 00:26:40,689 --> 00:26:43,759 Like many people, I've always been fascinated by Las Vegas. 597 00:26:46,137 --> 00:26:49,857 A city dedicated to catering to our most secret 598 00:26:49,965 --> 00:26:52,095 and forbidden impulses, our lust, 599 00:26:52,206 --> 00:26:54,656 our gluttony, our greed. 600 00:26:56,068 --> 00:26:59,098 Obviously, there's gambling all over the world, 601 00:26:59,206 --> 00:27:02,026 but Vegas really does represent something 602 00:27:02,137 --> 00:27:06,657 very primal and fundamental to the American psyche 603 00:27:06,758 --> 00:27:09,718 or to American culture generally. 604 00:27:09,827 --> 00:27:12,757 I'm a fan of kind of altered states of consciousness, 605 00:27:12,862 --> 00:27:14,522 and worlds that feel different. 606 00:27:15,862 --> 00:27:19,902 I genuinely find it seductive and beguiling, 607 00:27:20,000 --> 00:27:21,340 like that world of the casino, 608 00:27:21,448 --> 00:27:23,338 like I understand some people might feel 609 00:27:23,448 --> 00:27:28,138 that it's really unappealing, kind of crass and garish, 610 00:27:28,241 --> 00:27:31,311 I like all of that, in certain doses. 611 00:27:34,068 --> 00:27:35,828 - Are you winning? 612 00:27:35,931 --> 00:27:40,031 - Oh no, ha-ha, not at all, negative 20 for the trip. 613 00:27:40,137 --> 00:27:42,827 -$20? - No, $20,000. 614 00:27:42,931 --> 00:27:44,001 - Whoa. 615 00:27:45,137 --> 00:27:46,277 - You winning? 616 00:27:46,379 --> 00:27:47,929 [LAUGHTER] 617 00:27:49,724 --> 00:27:51,864 - Are you winning? - Yeah. 618 00:27:51,965 --> 00:27:53,305 - Are you? - Yes. 619 00:27:53,413 --> 00:27:55,453 Louis narrates: Really, the back bone of the film 620 00:27:55,551 --> 00:27:58,141 was a businessman called Allan, 621 00:27:58,241 --> 00:28:02,241 who had a mattress company, based somewhere in Canada. 622 00:28:02,344 --> 00:28:05,414 Now what can you tell me about this guy that's coming in? 623 00:28:05,517 --> 00:28:06,967 This guy that's coming in, 624 00:28:07,068 --> 00:28:13,898 is one of my closest friends from Toronto, Canada, 625 00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:16,860 he's, we used to say he's the Mattress King, 626 00:28:16,965 --> 00:28:20,825 because he has the largest manufacturing plant 627 00:28:20,931 --> 00:28:23,281 for mattresses in all of Canada. 628 00:28:23,379 --> 00:28:25,239 This guys, like, he's a friend of yours? 629 00:28:25,344 --> 00:28:26,934 - Yes. - So, you don't... 630 00:28:27,034 --> 00:28:29,144 - He's a friend of mine, he's a high roller, 631 00:28:29,241 --> 00:28:31,071 one of the biggest high rollers. 632 00:28:31,172 --> 00:28:32,312 - Is he? 633 00:28:32,413 --> 00:28:35,793 And he's also godfather to my little girl, too, 634 00:28:35,896 --> 00:28:38,066 so it's a whole thing. 635 00:28:38,172 --> 00:28:41,312 - What's up, buddy. How you doing, you alright? 636 00:28:41,413 --> 00:28:43,103 Alright, you doing OK? 637 00:28:43,206 --> 00:28:44,786 Say hi to Louis. 638 00:28:44,896 --> 00:28:46,616 - How are you, Louis. - Nice to meet you. 639 00:28:46,724 --> 00:28:49,004 - Louis' from the BBC in the UK. - I've heard so much about you. 640 00:28:49,103 --> 00:28:51,343 Louis narrates: Once in a while he liked to cut loose, 641 00:28:51,448 --> 00:28:53,758 come down to Vegas for a wild weekend, 642 00:28:53,862 --> 00:28:55,282 get treated like a king. 643 00:28:55,379 --> 00:28:56,969 - This is home for three days. 644 00:28:58,586 --> 00:29:00,516 What do you think guys? This OK? 645 00:29:00,620 --> 00:29:02,310 - Seems quite nice. 646 00:29:02,413 --> 00:29:04,413 - It's about 15,000 square feet, this suite. 647 00:29:04,517 --> 00:29:05,617 Louis: 15,000 square feet? 648 00:29:05,724 --> 00:29:07,594 And this is all part of the deal? 649 00:29:07,689 --> 00:29:08,619 - This is it. 650 00:29:08,724 --> 00:29:10,454 - This is provided free? 651 00:29:10,551 --> 00:29:13,241 - This is the largest suite in North America. 652 00:29:13,344 --> 00:29:15,384 - Wow. - OK, that I know of. 653 00:29:15,482 --> 00:29:17,592 - And Allan gets it for as long as he's here 654 00:29:17,689 --> 00:29:19,549 and everything's comped in here. 655 00:29:19,655 --> 00:29:22,025 - It's all comped, complimentary. 656 00:29:22,137 --> 00:29:24,027 Allan: It's all about gambling, isn't it? 657 00:29:24,137 --> 00:29:26,717 - Is there any technique to where you're putting them? 658 00:29:26,827 --> 00:29:28,997 Are you basing that on a hunch, or? 659 00:29:29,103 --> 00:29:31,003 - Just picking what you feel. 660 00:29:33,896 --> 00:29:35,656 He's just got to cooperate. 661 00:29:36,965 --> 00:29:38,685 - He's not cooperating. 662 00:29:39,241 --> 00:29:40,591 - Sheesh. 663 00:29:42,620 --> 00:29:45,380 - That's bad. - Yeah, it is bad. 664 00:29:47,034 --> 00:29:48,694 - Ah, it's just warm up. 665 00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:52,000 Louis: At least we're having a good time. 666 00:29:52,103 --> 00:29:55,073 - Well you know, we don't like to lose money either. 667 00:29:55,172 --> 00:29:58,072 Right now, this is more money than some people make in a year. 668 00:30:00,275 --> 00:30:01,335 It's a lot of money. 669 00:30:05,724 --> 00:30:06,834 And do you know what they say, 670 00:30:06,931 --> 00:30:08,281 if you can't afford it, don't do it. 671 00:30:11,758 --> 00:30:14,448 It's 17, we got it. 672 00:30:14,551 --> 00:30:17,451 - How about that, now you're into some serious money. 673 00:30:17,551 --> 00:30:18,791 - Now you're up 50 grand. 674 00:30:18,896 --> 00:30:22,546 - Why not stop now, and then you're 50,000 up? 675 00:30:22,655 --> 00:30:26,235 Did I fly six hours to play for 20 minutes? 676 00:30:30,034 --> 00:30:32,414 If you stop now, would they kick you out of your suite? 677 00:30:32,517 --> 00:30:34,207 - No. 678 00:30:34,310 --> 00:30:36,970 No, they never do that because they know I'm a gambler. 679 00:30:39,275 --> 00:30:41,275 Louis narrates: Allan was a family man, 680 00:30:41,379 --> 00:30:44,279 but I think Vegas for him was a chance to step out, 681 00:30:44,379 --> 00:30:48,689 and kind of, sort of, be James Bond for the weekend. 682 00:30:48,793 --> 00:30:52,933 - Big, yeah, oh! 683 00:30:53,034 --> 00:30:54,974 Louis narrates: It was a case of spending, you know, 684 00:30:55,068 --> 00:30:56,828 the days with him, filming with him, 685 00:30:56,931 --> 00:30:58,931 but also trying to figure out, like, 686 00:30:59,034 --> 00:31:00,554 how much is he enjoying this? 687 00:31:00,655 --> 00:31:03,655 And there were definitely moments when I thought, 688 00:31:03,758 --> 00:31:06,238 this feels actually not that fun. 689 00:31:06,344 --> 00:31:07,764 Allan: Vacuum cleaners, 690 00:31:07,862 --> 00:31:09,972 these are vacuum cleaners at the Hilton. 691 00:31:10,068 --> 00:31:11,408 What is the appeal? 692 00:31:11,517 --> 00:31:13,237 If it's just random, you're just pushing a button, 693 00:31:13,344 --> 00:31:14,484 it's like working in a factory. 694 00:31:14,586 --> 00:31:21,336 - You're not really, we're just hoping 695 00:31:21,448 --> 00:31:23,308 that you're the one, to come to Vegas 696 00:31:23,413 --> 00:31:25,833 and have the opportunity of winning 697 00:31:25,931 --> 00:31:27,071 - Want me to put more money in? 698 00:31:27,172 --> 00:31:30,592 - It's quitting time, I have a meeting, 699 00:31:30,689 --> 00:31:33,479 so I'm gonna love you and leave you. 700 00:31:33,586 --> 00:31:39,446 I'll spin one more time, see I would have won there, 701 00:31:39,551 --> 00:31:41,451 but why you didn't win is because you changed, 702 00:31:41,551 --> 00:31:43,071 you were getting rid of your credits. 703 00:31:45,965 --> 00:31:48,475 [slot machine sounds] 704 00:31:48,586 --> 00:31:53,376 - Didn't you just say it was quitting time? 705 00:31:53,482 --> 00:31:56,762 - Yeah, we're just gonna spin one or two more times, 706 00:31:56,862 --> 00:32:00,002 just to make sure the machine is finished with me. 707 00:32:03,793 --> 00:32:05,243 You never know. 708 00:32:06,310 --> 00:32:07,760 That's a gamblers problem, 709 00:32:07,862 --> 00:32:09,932 when to quit. 710 00:32:10,034 --> 00:32:12,144 In the end, what I found myself thinking about 711 00:32:12,241 --> 00:32:16,101 was Allan's relationship with Richard, the casino host, 712 00:32:17,310 --> 00:32:20,450 and this tension between being his friend, 713 00:32:20,551 --> 00:32:24,001 but also Richard basically needing Allan 714 00:32:24,103 --> 00:32:26,103 to gamble as much as possible. 715 00:32:27,655 --> 00:32:29,685 - Hey, what's happening buddy? - How you doing? 716 00:32:29,793 --> 00:32:30,723 - We're doing OK. 717 00:32:30,827 --> 00:32:32,237 - I've been hearing rumours about you. 718 00:32:32,344 --> 00:32:34,694 - Well, are they good or bad? 719 00:32:34,793 --> 00:32:36,343 - 250 in the hole. 720 00:32:36,448 --> 00:32:39,478 - Ah, listen, I'd be happy with that, I think. 721 00:32:39,586 --> 00:32:40,856 - Really? Why, what happened? 722 00:32:40,965 --> 00:32:42,305 - It was a little nasty in there. 723 00:32:42,413 --> 00:32:43,933 - What happened? 724 00:32:44,034 --> 00:32:46,414 - Cards change. - 300,000? 725 00:32:46,517 --> 00:32:49,027 - Oh, I don't know. - 300,000? 726 00:32:49,137 --> 00:32:51,137 - Pesos? 727 00:32:51,241 --> 00:32:53,411 How did he make out, Richard? 728 00:32:53,517 --> 00:32:57,027 How did who make out, Allan? You got to ask him. 729 00:32:57,137 --> 00:32:59,237 He's going home with a heavy loss. 730 00:32:59,344 --> 00:33:00,594 What would you have liked to see, 731 00:33:00,689 --> 00:33:02,689 this isn't the ideal outcome for you, or is it? 732 00:33:02,793 --> 00:33:04,793 What would be the best outcome for you? 733 00:33:06,206 --> 00:33:07,716 - Well, just the fact that he comes in 734 00:33:07,827 --> 00:33:09,307 is the best outcome for me. 735 00:33:09,413 --> 00:33:12,173 Whether he wins or loses, it doesn't go into my pocket, 736 00:33:12,275 --> 00:33:14,615 I'm just here as a marketing guy to bring him in the building, 737 00:33:14,724 --> 00:33:17,694 and keep him at the tables as long as I can. 738 00:33:17,793 --> 00:33:19,863 Keep him at the tables as long as you can up to a point, 739 00:33:19,965 --> 00:33:22,895 so not so he hurts himself, or is... 740 00:33:23,000 --> 00:33:27,310 - No, I keep him at the tables for as long as I can, 741 00:33:27,413 --> 00:33:29,073 and that's whether he wins or loses, 742 00:33:29,172 --> 00:33:31,312 so it doesn't matter. 743 00:33:31,413 --> 00:33:34,283 My job is to bring certain players in 744 00:33:34,379 --> 00:33:35,659 and keep them at the tables, 745 00:33:35,758 --> 00:33:38,238 and keep them gambling on the property, that's all. 746 00:33:38,344 --> 00:33:41,384 with him and with a few others, my friends, 747 00:33:41,482 --> 00:33:42,382 they're friends of mine, 748 00:33:42,482 --> 00:33:44,312 they're more friends than they are players, 749 00:33:44,413 --> 00:33:45,793 it just happens I work here, 750 00:33:45,896 --> 00:33:47,336 and that's where they come to visit. 751 00:33:47,448 --> 00:33:49,688 Look at that smile, that's a million dollar smile, 752 00:33:49,793 --> 00:33:51,003 he can never lose. 753 00:33:51,103 --> 00:33:53,973 Slightly less than a million now. 754 00:33:54,068 --> 00:33:59,788 Listen, you know what makes a good person a good gambler, 755 00:33:59,896 --> 00:34:02,926 somebody that can, whether win or lose, 756 00:34:03,034 --> 00:34:05,074 they're still gonna smile. 757 00:34:05,172 --> 00:34:08,592 So fast forward a few years, one day, 758 00:34:08,689 --> 00:34:09,969 while browsing the internet, 759 00:34:10,068 --> 00:34:13,928 I come across a picture of an Uber receipt, 760 00:34:14,034 --> 00:34:17,594 and it says, thank you, your driver was Allan, 761 00:34:17,689 --> 00:34:20,309 and there's a picture of him. 762 00:34:20,413 --> 00:34:24,213 So naturally, I assume maybe he's lost his fortune, 763 00:34:24,310 --> 00:34:26,070 and maybe he's gambled it away. 764 00:34:28,896 --> 00:34:30,686 Then I checked with someone who knew Allan, 765 00:34:30,793 --> 00:34:34,033 and they said, oh no, he's still got all his money. 766 00:34:34,137 --> 00:34:38,517 He's just, he just liked to get out and give people Uber rides, 767 00:34:38,620 --> 00:34:40,170 as a way of meeting people. 768 00:34:46,034 --> 00:34:47,834 You know, I think there's a safety in Vegas 769 00:34:47,931 --> 00:34:49,621 being in the desert, right? 770 00:34:49,724 --> 00:34:52,484 It insulated from the rest of the country. 771 00:34:52,586 --> 00:34:55,656 I sort of regard it as a place that's fun to visit, 772 00:34:55,758 --> 00:34:59,448 but somewhere that you wouldn't want to be the, sort of, 773 00:34:59,551 --> 00:35:01,451 representative of what the broader society 774 00:35:01,551 --> 00:35:03,551 should aspire to be. 775 00:35:03,655 --> 00:35:08,025 That part of America that is catered to providing 776 00:35:08,137 --> 00:35:10,997 for your most basic impulses... 777 00:35:13,103 --> 00:35:15,213 ..and that there's a risk that goes along with that. 778 00:35:18,068 --> 00:35:20,028 You know, the risk is that you lose control... 779 00:35:22,793 --> 00:35:26,313 ..you get swept up in addiction. 780 00:35:30,655 --> 00:35:33,025 Louis narrates: After the Vegas show, 781 00:35:33,137 --> 00:35:34,617 I made more programmes that dealt with 782 00:35:34,724 --> 00:35:37,904 the extremity of American consumer culture, 783 00:35:38,000 --> 00:35:42,030 and just the vast array of opportunities 784 00:35:42,137 --> 00:35:45,897 to change yourself physically beyond recognition. 785 00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:48,790 And what is it about the work that you enjoy? 786 00:35:48,896 --> 00:35:51,376 You could not like your nose, have a big nose, 787 00:35:51,482 --> 00:35:53,862 and you can go and spend three years 788 00:35:53,965 --> 00:35:57,095 on a psychiatrist couch, and you'd come out 789 00:35:57,206 --> 00:35:59,206 maybe liking your nose better. 790 00:35:59,310 --> 00:36:01,590 I can do that in one hour, 791 00:36:01,689 --> 00:36:03,099 and you'll like your nose better, 792 00:36:03,206 --> 00:36:06,066 so that's the magic of plastic surgery. 793 00:36:07,482 --> 00:36:10,722 Pectoral implants, bicep implants. 794 00:36:10,827 --> 00:36:12,657 Louis: Yeah, and has all the work been done 795 00:36:12,758 --> 00:36:14,338 by Doctor Chugay? 796 00:36:14,448 --> 00:36:17,548 Except for a couple of my very, very early surgeries, 797 00:36:17,655 --> 00:36:19,445 back in 1987. 798 00:36:19,551 --> 00:36:22,001 May I ask your age, Steve? 799 00:36:22,103 --> 00:36:25,693 I am, I never talk about my age, 800 00:36:25,793 --> 00:36:28,413 but I am approaching a half a century old. 801 00:36:29,275 --> 00:36:31,025 - Quite remarkable. 802 00:36:32,310 --> 00:36:33,970 Louis narrates: And you also have the opportunity 803 00:36:34,068 --> 00:36:37,618 to remake your own mental landscape. 804 00:36:37,724 --> 00:36:39,694 I tend to see the American culture 805 00:36:39,793 --> 00:36:43,003 of psychiatric medication at its edges 806 00:36:43,103 --> 00:36:46,213 as a kind of surgery for the soul, 807 00:36:46,310 --> 00:36:48,830 a chance to remake your own personality, 808 00:36:48,931 --> 00:36:51,101 or your own sense of well-being. 809 00:36:51,206 --> 00:36:53,996 - Come on Hugh, don't worry. 810 00:36:54,103 --> 00:36:55,553 Have a seat, have a seat. 811 00:36:55,655 --> 00:36:58,655 - How do you do? I'm Louis, nice to meet you Hugh. 812 00:36:58,758 --> 00:37:01,858 - He takes extended-release Adderall. 813 00:37:01,965 --> 00:37:04,545 Adderall is an amphetamine that controls ADHD, 814 00:37:04,655 --> 00:37:09,275 which allows him to fidget less, and kind of focus more? 815 00:37:09,379 --> 00:37:12,169 - Exactly. And then the Tenex, 816 00:37:12,275 --> 00:37:15,025 which the doctor at the time had said might help control 817 00:37:15,137 --> 00:37:16,657 some of the impulses, 818 00:37:16,758 --> 00:37:20,238 and he takes for the bipolar disorder Seroquel, 819 00:37:20,344 --> 00:37:22,344 200 milligrammes of Seroquel in the morning. 820 00:37:22,448 --> 00:37:26,338 - Which is an antipsychotic? - Exactly. 821 00:37:26,448 --> 00:37:27,478 - Atypical. 822 00:37:27,586 --> 00:37:29,336 Louis narrates: All of it seemed to speak 823 00:37:29,448 --> 00:37:31,588 to this idea of America as a world 824 00:37:31,689 --> 00:37:34,549 in which every imaginable product was on offer, 825 00:37:34,655 --> 00:37:38,755 and every problem had a consumer solution, 826 00:37:38,862 --> 00:37:43,762 but always with the risk of going too far. 827 00:37:43,862 --> 00:37:48,212 Opioids are now the biggest drug epidemic in American history. 828 00:37:48,310 --> 00:37:52,170 I'd known about the opioid crisis for years and years. 829 00:37:52,275 --> 00:37:54,405 Newsreader: We spent some time in one city 830 00:37:54,517 --> 00:37:57,857 to get a sense of just how wide and deep this crisis is, 831 00:37:57,965 --> 00:38:01,715 and how opioids have changed the very fabric of life there. 832 00:38:01,827 --> 00:38:05,827 OxyContin, this prescription painkiller 833 00:38:05,931 --> 00:38:08,451 that has some opiates in it, 834 00:38:08,551 --> 00:38:11,551 it used to be referred to as 'hillbilly heroin', 835 00:38:11,655 --> 00:38:13,165 that was in the late '90s. 836 00:38:13,275 --> 00:38:16,475 Some patients may be afraid of taking opioids 837 00:38:16,586 --> 00:38:20,026 because they're perceived as too strong or addictive, 838 00:38:20,137 --> 00:38:23,407 but that is far from actual fact. 839 00:38:23,517 --> 00:38:24,717 I got my life back now, 840 00:38:24,827 --> 00:38:27,547 now I can enjoy every day that I live, 841 00:38:27,655 --> 00:38:29,475 I can really enjoy myself, 842 00:38:29,586 --> 00:38:32,656 and before, even a good day was hell, 843 00:38:32,758 --> 00:38:35,758 I mean I couldn't enjoy nothing, but now I can enjoy myself. 844 00:38:35,862 --> 00:38:37,972 Louis narrates: They used cheesy customer testimonials 845 00:38:38,068 --> 00:38:40,928 to proclaim the drug was safe, and of course, it was a myth. 846 00:38:42,000 --> 00:38:43,720 Big Pharma ended up being 847 00:38:43,827 --> 00:38:46,757 the biggest drug pushers in America. 848 00:38:49,689 --> 00:38:52,139 The area we were in, West Virginia, 849 00:38:52,241 --> 00:38:54,551 is particularly hard hit. 850 00:38:54,655 --> 00:38:55,785 First of all, you have jobs 851 00:38:55,896 --> 00:38:57,476 that take a lot out of you physically, 852 00:38:57,586 --> 00:38:58,926 welding and steel work, 853 00:38:59,034 --> 00:39:02,174 so you're already looking at quite a lot of people 854 00:39:02,275 --> 00:39:05,545 looking for pain killers and getting them. 855 00:39:05,655 --> 00:39:08,235 And then when the laws were tightened 856 00:39:08,344 --> 00:39:11,244 and OxyContin became harder to get, 857 00:39:11,344 --> 00:39:13,144 then people turned to heroin. 858 00:39:19,482 --> 00:39:21,412 - May I come in? - For sure, man. 859 00:39:21,517 --> 00:39:22,587 - Should I take my shoes off? 860 00:39:22,689 --> 00:39:25,169 - No, no, no, you're more than welcome man, for sure. 861 00:39:25,275 --> 00:39:27,305 You know, a lot of people migrate from 862 00:39:27,413 --> 00:39:30,003 dabbling with pain pills, right? 863 00:39:30,103 --> 00:39:31,143 That's what happened to me. 864 00:39:31,241 --> 00:39:33,481 I mean, it happens to everybody, that's what happens to... 865 00:39:33,586 --> 00:39:35,136 - Go on, how did it work in your case? 866 00:39:35,241 --> 00:39:39,661 - I got hit by a car and that almost killed me. 867 00:39:39,758 --> 00:39:40,658 - How old were you? 868 00:39:40,758 --> 00:39:43,758 It happened September 26 of 2010. 869 00:39:43,862 --> 00:39:47,172 - So this is seven years ago, you were about 26? 870 00:39:47,275 --> 00:39:48,715 - Uh, yeah, exactly. 871 00:39:50,758 --> 00:39:52,828 Louis narrates: The situation in Huntington was so bad, 872 00:39:52,931 --> 00:39:55,281 it seemed to be more or less the full-time job 873 00:39:55,379 --> 00:39:58,449 of the fire service to go around reviving people 874 00:39:58,551 --> 00:39:59,521 who were overdosing. 875 00:39:59,620 --> 00:40:00,970 [sirens blaring] 876 00:40:04,000 --> 00:40:06,790 - ..breathe for you, so you can do other things. 877 00:40:10,206 --> 00:40:11,716 [mumbling] 878 00:40:11,827 --> 00:40:13,657 - Hey Melanie, what did you take, honey? 879 00:40:13,758 --> 00:40:14,688 Melanie: Nothing. 880 00:40:14,793 --> 00:40:18,173 - No, that doesn't work, we gave you some medicine 881 00:40:18,275 --> 00:40:20,715 that only works if you took something, 882 00:40:20,827 --> 00:40:22,687 so did you do heroin? 883 00:40:22,793 --> 00:40:24,623 - I guess so, yeah. - Yeah. 884 00:40:24,724 --> 00:40:26,384 - Did you snort it? - Mmm. 885 00:40:26,482 --> 00:40:27,832 - Did you shoot it? - Mmm. 886 00:40:29,448 --> 00:40:30,998 I've done stories before where you arrive 887 00:40:31,103 --> 00:40:32,973 and you sort of have to work to get to the story, 888 00:40:33,068 --> 00:40:36,138 and maybe it's less than advertised, 889 00:40:36,241 --> 00:40:38,381 or not quite the same as advertised, 890 00:40:38,482 --> 00:40:40,762 but Huntington really was, well, 891 00:40:40,862 --> 00:40:43,552 it was as bad as people said it was. 892 00:40:44,275 --> 00:40:45,475 [dog barking] 893 00:40:46,655 --> 00:40:47,855 Louis: Hi there. 894 00:40:47,965 --> 00:40:49,685 Louis narrates: One of the people we focused on 895 00:40:49,793 --> 00:40:52,483 was a 25 year old woman called Katillia, 896 00:40:52,586 --> 00:40:55,026 who lived with her boyfriend Alvin. 897 00:40:55,137 --> 00:40:58,717 - You OK, Katillia? - Yeah, I'm fine. 898 00:40:58,827 --> 00:41:01,097 - I just needed to go to the restroom real quick. 899 00:41:01,206 --> 00:41:02,896 Louis narrates: I don't think she'd originally 900 00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:05,590 been prescribed OxyContin or a prescription drug, 901 00:41:05,689 --> 00:41:07,689 but I think one of her friends had, 902 00:41:07,793 --> 00:41:12,523 she dipped into his or her bag, recreationally, 903 00:41:12,620 --> 00:41:13,900 liked it and then carried on. 904 00:41:14,000 --> 00:41:15,310 Louis: I don't want to sound paranoid, 905 00:41:15,413 --> 00:41:17,663 but she's not, is she shooting up in there? 906 00:41:17,758 --> 00:41:19,828 - You OK? - Yeah, I'm fine. 907 00:41:19,931 --> 00:41:22,691 - Did you ask if I was shooting? - Yeah, she's shooting. 908 00:41:24,034 --> 00:41:25,934 - Are you doing it now? - Yeah. 909 00:41:26,034 --> 00:41:29,174 It's not, it's not, it's just like a rinse, 910 00:41:29,275 --> 00:41:32,065 I've already done my morning shot. 911 00:41:32,172 --> 00:41:33,592 It's something that kind of has 912 00:41:33,689 --> 00:41:37,239 a little bit of something in it that will kind of relax me. 913 00:41:37,344 --> 00:41:39,554 How many times do you shoot up a day then? 914 00:41:39,655 --> 00:41:43,685 I mean, it's at least six, seven. 915 00:41:43,793 --> 00:41:45,763 - How old were you when you first got involved 916 00:41:45,862 --> 00:41:50,142 - in a serious way with opiates? - Serious way? 917 00:41:51,103 --> 00:41:53,073 - When I was about 17. 918 00:41:53,172 --> 00:41:55,102 Was there anything going on in your life? 919 00:41:55,206 --> 00:41:57,276 Were you just partying in a normal way 920 00:41:57,379 --> 00:41:59,239 or was there something else going on? 921 00:41:59,344 --> 00:42:00,724 - Well growing up, 922 00:42:00,827 --> 00:42:03,027 my family does a lot of manual labour work, 923 00:42:03,137 --> 00:42:06,097 a lot of people would take medicine here and there, 924 00:42:06,206 --> 00:42:09,276 that would kind of keep them, keep them... 925 00:42:09,379 --> 00:42:11,689 - Functioning? - Yeah. 926 00:42:11,793 --> 00:42:14,793 Underneath it, she was so intelligent and charming, 927 00:42:14,896 --> 00:42:19,996 and seemingly capable of so much, that it was very sad. 928 00:42:22,068 --> 00:42:25,098 In her background, she'd been placed for adoption by her mum, 929 00:42:25,206 --> 00:42:27,826 raised by her great uncle. 930 00:42:27,931 --> 00:42:29,721 It was obviously really complicated, 931 00:42:29,827 --> 00:42:33,277 and then you add that to a culture 932 00:42:33,379 --> 00:42:36,029 in which these highly addictive prescription drugs 933 00:42:36,137 --> 00:42:41,067 are freely available, and you are being set up to fail. 934 00:42:42,517 --> 00:42:44,717 This could be anyone who could find their life 935 00:42:44,827 --> 00:42:46,617 turned upside down. 936 00:42:46,724 --> 00:42:50,794 It's you, it's me, it's your mum, it's everyone else. 937 00:42:50,896 --> 00:42:52,716 - How old are you, Edwin? - I'm 42. 938 00:42:52,827 --> 00:42:53,827 - 42? 939 00:42:53,931 --> 00:42:55,661 I mean I have a degree and everything. 940 00:42:55,758 --> 00:42:59,828 It's, I mean I had a business up until six months ago. 941 00:42:59,931 --> 00:43:01,521 - What sort of business? 942 00:43:01,620 --> 00:43:02,550 Computer business. 943 00:43:02,655 --> 00:43:06,065 I was doing network auditing and penetration testing. 944 00:43:06,172 --> 00:43:07,072 That's a good living. 945 00:43:07,172 --> 00:43:08,072 - It's a great living. 946 00:43:08,172 --> 00:43:09,382 I made a lot of money at it, I mean... 947 00:43:09,482 --> 00:43:10,382 - Did you? How much? 948 00:43:10,482 --> 00:43:14,832 At one point, I was making at least over 200,000 a year. 949 00:43:14,931 --> 00:43:16,451 - Are you serious? - Yeah. 950 00:43:16,551 --> 00:43:19,621 - Did you hear that Mickey? Edwin's a computer boffin. 951 00:43:19,724 --> 00:43:21,174 It kills movie stars, man, 952 00:43:21,275 --> 00:43:22,895 it doesn't discriminate on who you are. 953 00:43:23,000 --> 00:43:23,930 - Getting off of it, 954 00:43:24,034 --> 00:43:26,034 it's always waiting around the corner for you to stumble. 955 00:43:26,137 --> 00:43:27,687 Absolutely it is. 956 00:43:27,793 --> 00:43:30,313 There's no chemical solution for a God-sized problem, man. 957 00:43:30,413 --> 00:43:31,763 - No, there's not. 958 00:43:31,862 --> 00:43:33,692 I've stolen from my own kids to get high. 959 00:43:33,793 --> 00:43:38,243 I've let guys suck my dick to get high. 960 00:43:38,344 --> 00:43:40,624 I mean it's, you'll do whatever it takes. 961 00:43:40,724 --> 00:43:42,624 [mobile phone ringing] 962 00:43:44,068 --> 00:43:45,168 There's nothing I could say 963 00:43:45,275 --> 00:43:47,475 that would persuade you not to do that? 964 00:43:53,620 --> 00:43:56,660 - Add a lighter to that... 965 00:44:06,862 --> 00:44:11,072 It's not bad, I've had better, it's not bad. 966 00:44:11,172 --> 00:44:13,722 - How long are you good for now, do you think? 967 00:44:13,827 --> 00:44:16,277 Probably with this, maybe a couple hours. 968 00:44:19,448 --> 00:44:21,658 If I had something stronger, 969 00:44:21,758 --> 00:44:24,968 it would last a good six hours at least. 970 00:44:25,068 --> 00:44:27,308 This, just a couple of hours. 971 00:44:29,344 --> 00:44:34,034 - Right now, I'm gonna be like this until, 972 00:44:34,137 --> 00:44:40,307 until I can try to overpower my addiction. 973 00:44:46,068 --> 00:44:48,208 Louis narrates: Since I finished the film about Huntington, 974 00:44:48,310 --> 00:44:51,280 the situation continues to be awful. 975 00:44:51,379 --> 00:44:55,519 More than 100 people die every day in America 976 00:44:55,620 --> 00:44:58,410 from an overdose or opioids. 977 00:44:59,896 --> 00:45:01,516 Increasingly, what's been happening 978 00:45:01,620 --> 00:45:04,280 is local governments and state agencies have sued 979 00:45:04,379 --> 00:45:06,549 the big pharmaceutical companies 980 00:45:06,655 --> 00:45:09,095 for allowing their drugs to be abused, 981 00:45:09,206 --> 00:45:12,966 and for the cost of the public health crisis that's ensued. 982 00:45:13,068 --> 00:45:14,998 What I take from it is the ease 983 00:45:15,103 --> 00:45:18,763 with which people can be swept up in a situation 984 00:45:18,862 --> 00:45:23,662 not of their choosing, robbed of their free will, 985 00:45:23,758 --> 00:45:28,548 and made prisoners, of desires created in them 986 00:45:28,655 --> 00:45:31,655 by some outside entity. 987 00:45:46,896 --> 00:45:48,656 [Skype dial tone] 988 00:45:52,172 --> 00:45:53,722 - Hello! - Hey. 989 00:45:53,827 --> 00:45:55,377 Look at you. 990 00:45:55,482 --> 00:45:56,792 [giggling] 991 00:45:56,896 --> 00:45:58,446 You look different, you look younger. 992 00:45:58,551 --> 00:45:59,761 Is that possible? 993 00:45:59,862 --> 00:46:05,032 Younger, I couldn't. No, not possible with me, no. 994 00:46:05,137 --> 00:46:09,337 - Maybe heroin has life preserving properties. 995 00:46:09,448 --> 00:46:11,238 Ha-ha, probably. 996 00:46:11,344 --> 00:46:12,904 What happened after we left? 997 00:46:13,000 --> 00:46:14,970 - It got really crazy. 998 00:46:18,965 --> 00:46:20,655 - What had you been injecting? 999 00:46:20,758 --> 00:46:23,098 - Pretty much everything. 1000 00:46:23,206 --> 00:46:25,096 - Was it meth or heroin? 1001 00:46:25,206 --> 00:46:27,096 - Both. And crack. 1002 00:46:27,206 --> 00:46:29,826 And so you just went to the dark side? 1003 00:46:29,931 --> 00:46:31,311 Yep. 1004 00:46:31,413 --> 00:46:33,483 Forgive me if this is an intrusive question, 1005 00:46:33,586 --> 00:46:35,446 but are you clean now? 1006 00:46:35,551 --> 00:46:39,411 I mean, besides the casual drink here and there... 1007 00:46:39,517 --> 00:46:41,827 Yeah, I would count that as clean. 1008 00:46:42,758 --> 00:46:44,478 - You OK? - Yeah, I'm OK. 1009 00:46:44,586 --> 00:46:45,926 - Are you getting hot? - I'm just... 1010 00:46:46,034 --> 00:46:50,624 - No, I'm not getting hot. I need to move positions. 1011 00:46:50,724 --> 00:46:51,834 Show me around a bit. 1012 00:46:51,931 --> 00:46:55,341 I'd like to see a little bit, stand up and lift it up, 1013 00:46:55,448 --> 00:46:57,338 wave it around show me a few things. 1014 00:46:57,448 --> 00:47:00,068 Louis narrates: Katillia overdosed massively, 1015 00:47:00,172 --> 00:47:03,972 woke up, she'd been beaten up, she was on life support, 1016 00:47:04,068 --> 00:47:07,408 and as she explained it to me, she nearly died, 1017 00:47:07,517 --> 00:47:09,027 and that seems to have been 1018 00:47:09,137 --> 00:47:11,897 the trigger for her to change her life. 1019 00:47:13,310 --> 00:47:15,140 - Are we heading out back now? 1020 00:47:15,241 --> 00:47:19,001 - Yep. We do have tomato plants. 1021 00:47:19,103 --> 00:47:20,933 You do some gardening? 1022 00:47:21,034 --> 00:47:23,074 - Yeah, just tomato plants. 1023 00:47:23,793 --> 00:47:24,723 - That's nice. 1024 00:47:24,827 --> 00:47:26,547 - Got a tomato growing right here. 1025 00:47:27,275 --> 00:47:29,515 - There we go. 1026 00:47:29,620 --> 00:47:34,070 - That'll be good for at least one BLT in a couple of weeks. 1027 00:47:34,172 --> 00:47:35,762 [imitating British accent] 'Tomatoes'. 1028 00:47:35,862 --> 00:47:38,412 What I am pleased about is to see 1029 00:47:38,517 --> 00:47:39,447 that you are doing well 1030 00:47:39,551 --> 00:47:41,141 because I don't know that I knew for sure 1031 00:47:41,241 --> 00:47:44,451 which way you were likely to go when I filmed with you, 1032 00:47:44,551 --> 00:47:48,721 so I want to say congratulations on how far you've come, 1033 00:47:48,827 --> 00:47:52,967 you know, because you are an example of how it can happen. 1034 00:47:53,068 --> 00:47:55,168 - Thank you. I want to make sure 1035 00:47:55,275 --> 00:47:58,165 that what I've done it gets turned into something positive. 1036 00:47:59,827 --> 00:48:02,997 Because I have built back relationships 1037 00:48:03,103 --> 00:48:07,173 and I am gonna make sure I hold onto them, 1038 00:48:07,275 --> 00:48:10,405 mostly with family, people who are more important 1039 00:48:10,517 --> 00:48:12,547 than the people I was around. 1040 00:48:15,896 --> 00:48:19,476 To make mistakes and to occasionally self sabotage 1041 00:48:19,586 --> 00:48:20,686 or get in your own way, 1042 00:48:20,793 --> 00:48:22,723 I think is part of how you learn. 1043 00:48:22,827 --> 00:48:24,067 - Take care, Katillia. Thank you. 1044 00:48:24,172 --> 00:48:25,102 The idea, oh well, 1045 00:48:25,206 --> 00:48:28,756 people should just do everything in moderation, always, 1046 00:48:28,862 --> 00:48:31,242 I don't really believe that. 1047 00:48:31,344 --> 00:48:35,214 A, it's not realistic, but B, it's not really desirable 1048 00:48:35,310 --> 00:48:38,280 because one of the great satisfactions of life 1049 00:48:38,379 --> 00:48:40,479 is getting through scrapes, 1050 00:48:40,586 --> 00:48:42,206 making mistakes and then doing better. 1051 00:48:43,655 --> 00:48:47,655 It's inextricable from what it means to be alive. 1052 00:48:47,758 --> 00:48:50,378 Right now, there's nothing you could give me I'd do over this. 1053 00:48:50,482 --> 00:48:52,592 - Why? - Because I like this. 1054 00:48:52,689 --> 00:48:53,829 Whether it's an act or not, 1055 00:48:53,931 --> 00:48:55,551 you feel like they give a damn about you. 1056 00:48:57,586 --> 00:49:00,926 - Do you... Looking back, do you have regrets? 1057 00:49:01,034 --> 00:49:02,724 I don't feel that's healthy. 1058 00:49:02,827 --> 00:49:04,687 I think it's much better to look at, 1059 00:49:04,793 --> 00:49:06,553 instead of looking at something as a regret, 1060 00:49:06,655 --> 00:49:07,785 look at it as a lesson learned, 1061 00:49:07,896 --> 00:49:10,136 and look at it as something that will help build 1062 00:49:10,241 --> 00:49:12,621 who you are and help build your character today. 1063 00:49:12,724 --> 00:49:15,004 Because otherwise, there's just no point to go, 1064 00:49:15,103 --> 00:49:16,483 "Man, I wish I wouldn't have done that, 1065 00:49:16,586 --> 00:49:17,966 "I wish I wouldn't have done that," 1066 00:49:18,068 --> 00:49:20,588 because we can't change the past, we can't. 1067 00:49:20,689 --> 00:49:24,999 When my son died, inside, I was still in so much pain, 1068 00:49:25,103 --> 00:49:27,693 that working in the adult industry is almost 1069 00:49:27,793 --> 00:49:29,763 like a therapy, like a type of therapy 1070 00:49:29,862 --> 00:49:31,722 that helped me get through that stage of my life, 1071 00:49:31,827 --> 00:49:34,237 that I don't know what would have happened, 1072 00:49:34,344 --> 00:49:37,794 had that particular part of my life never occurred. 1073 00:49:37,896 --> 00:49:40,996 That's fascinating, I didn't expect you to say that. 1074 00:49:43,689 --> 00:49:46,309 Director: Take six, marker. 1075 00:49:46,413 --> 00:49:47,933 Louis narrates: Pleasure in general, 1076 00:49:48,034 --> 00:49:50,414 I think it's simplistic to imagine 1077 00:49:50,517 --> 00:49:52,967 there's, you know, exactly the right amount 1078 00:49:53,068 --> 00:49:56,408 of indulgence or risk taking, or naughtiness, 1079 00:49:56,517 --> 00:50:00,097 however you want to characterise that. 1080 00:50:01,448 --> 00:50:04,068 On one end, you're ruining your life. 1081 00:50:04,172 --> 00:50:08,032 Well, that's clearly bad, or dying of a drug overdose, 1082 00:50:08,137 --> 00:50:11,717 and then over here is leading a blameless life 1083 00:50:11,827 --> 00:50:14,927 that is utterly without any pith or grit, 1084 00:50:15,034 --> 00:50:19,974 you know, totally boring. 1085 00:50:20,068 --> 00:50:22,928 And so in between there, you've got to find your place. 1086 00:50:24,448 --> 00:50:25,688 Director: Where are you? 1087 00:50:26,448 --> 00:50:29,408 I'm about there. 1088 00:50:34,241 --> 00:50:35,591 A lot of martinis. 1089 00:50:35,689 --> 00:50:37,689 Captioned by Ai-Media ai-media.tv 80836

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