Original subtitles

Hey, all you cool cats and kittens. It's me, Joel McHale.

And as you're all aware, we're currently in the midst of a global pandemic.

Tiger King fever!

Like you, I've devoured all seven episodes and I'm still craving more.

So, I called up Netflix and insisted on hosting a glitzy follow-up special

with the highest possible production quality.

They said, "We're gonna mail you an iPhone.

Knock yourself out."

So, we've gathered some of the key players

for a look back at the twists and turns of the Tiger King saga,

and we'll find out where their lives have taken them since the show ended.

What is it like outside the mulletted realm of Joe Exotic?

How does it feel when the world turns you into a meme?

And is the Wi-Fi signal at their home strong enough for a one-on-one interview?

Hmm. Those questions and more are about to be answered.

This is "The Tiger King and I."

How are you, man?

Oh, just living clean. Loving Jesus. What's up with you?

I'm clean living and loving Jesus, too. This is great.

Erik Cowie. He's one of my favorite people on the documentary.

He's deeply compelling. Erik, welcome to the after show.

-Thanks for having me. -Did you wash your glorious hair today?

No. What's the point, you know. I'm gonna get peed on every day, so...

Erik, this whole thing is possibly now

the biggest documentary in human history.

How has your life changed?

I haven't seen it. I really haven't.

-You haven't seen it? -Ten minutes.

No! No. And I need to, because, uh, that way,

I can have at least some semblance of ammunition for, you know,

some of the things that come out of people's mouths

or the me-mes or memes or whatever they're called.

Uh, you know, I... I don’t know where they're coming from or what...

You know, so... No, I haven't seen it.

Why haven't you seen it yet? I have to ask.

I work!

You need to tell Jeff and Lauren to give you a couple of hours off

to start in on this thing.

When was the last time you went out in public?

Like to a... You know, to a mall or a Walmart or something?

About three days ago.

It's rather odd, walking through the parking lot

and everybody's got their cell phones out and...

Yeah, I'm just a... just a fucking guy, you know.

And your current title remains Head Zookeeper?

Oh... Uh, yeah. Um...

Major asshole, uh... I don't know.

Do you have any regrets about your time with Joe?

Sure. Oh, yeah. Um...

Give me your top 200.

-No, I'm kidding. What's in the top five? -It... It's...

It's been in the back of my head. I think about it a lot.

A lot of times, when we put cats down and... And...

They used me because just by my appearance, or my voice, you know, uh,

I could get a cat up the side of a cage where we can dart it and tranquilize it,

so they could be put down and stuff.

You know, those cats trusted me up until the end

and somehow... Sometimes, I swear they're like,

"Dude, you let me down" kinda thing.

I could see it in their face and their eyes.

When you have to do that to a cat,

I assume there's a medical or a...

Or something's going on with the cat

that it can't continue to live.

Hmm, you would think. But no.

-Oh. -Even before all this happened,

Jeff asked me once, I mean, point blank, where do my loyalties lie.

And, you know, without hesitation, I said, "My loyalties..."

"I don’t care about you, I don’t care about Joe.

I'm here for the cats."

These are my kids out here. Every cat's different in their own

different, special little fucked up way. You know, so, it makes them endearing.

Who do you think had it better at the zoo, the animals or the workers?

The animals. Yeah.

Joe was just a... He was an asshole, man. I mean, you couldn't talk to him

and... without getting yelled at. I mean, he'd run people off in 20 minutes.

And just by the just absurdly crass things that would come out of his mouth.

And so, obviously, as you've just been saying,

you're still working with animals. And by that I mean, Jeff Lowe.

How is it working out working for him?

It's pretty relaxed.

I mean, there's not the random, uh, you know, yellings at, and just...

You know, just for no reasons. And pretty calm guy.

Have you met the nanny?

I just saw her booty and that's about it.

Now, I'm really shifting gears here, but do you think Joe should be free?

Do you think he should be a free man?

-No! Not no, but fuck no. -Yeah.

Twenty-two years doing federal time...

What's that guy, like 56, something like that?

He's gonna die in there, so...

-Yeah. -Good riddance.

Yeah. All right. Wow. That is...

Powerful statement.

Can you imagine what he must be like in jail right now,

now that he finally got what he wanted,

which was an extreme amount of fame and press?

I'm pretty sure they don’t have access to Netflix or anything.

-So he can't even get to see it. -Right.

I love irony. So, that's that.

This is a very serious question, Erik.

You're being compared to Vince Neil.

-Does... Are you flattered by that? -Oh, God.

-I fucking hate Mötley Crüe. -Does it...

Oh. wow. This is... You're hearing it now, Mötley Crüe. Wow.

They never been my thing. Uh-uh. Nah.

It was too... Too plastic, man. It was... Yeah, I'm sorry.

Yeah. Well, you're obviously...

You also have a much lower body fat percentage

than Vince Neil does right now.

I didn't say that. That came outta your mouth, okay?

That did.

And Vince probably will come after me. It'll be a slow walk to get me, but...

- Well, Erik,

you seem like, uh, the genuine thing.

You seem like a dang good guy.

Well, thanks, man.

Don't stick your hand in a cage anytime soon.

Do that every day.

Oh, okay. Well, just do it, you know, just a finger or two is fine.

Yeah. I've been down that road, too. It's really not that bad.

You know what I tell everybody?

People ask, "Does it hurt?" It's like, "Yeah, it hurts.

Until it stops, and then you're good."

Well, thank you again. Anything else you'd like to add?

No matter what anybody else says, okay, yeah,

all my teeth are jacked up. I'm sorry, I'm old, man.

It's what happens. It's gonna happen to you, too.

And no, I don’t do meth. I never have. I like sleeping too much.

I used to have a drinking problem. Now I do not.

So, ah, fuck all y'all, man.

These two Tiger King participants either stole the zoo or saved the zoo.

But either way you look at it, they have an open marriage.

It's Jeff and Lauren Lowe, everybody.

Thank you so much for coming on.

I have a big question for you, Jeff, right off the top.

How many Affliction t-shirts do you own?

I bet you I've got 60 or 70.

That's terrifying.

The zoo is shut down, obviously, right now, because of the pandemic?

-Yes. Mmm-hmm. -Yes.

Are the tigers keeping six feet away from each other?

Um, you know, most of them do. But every once in a while,

you'll hear some hanky-panky going on out there.

Some of them are breaking the rules.

And how's the nanny working out?

-The nanny's excellent. -She's hot.

Yeah, she's excellent. You've seen her.

Yeah. Oh, yeah.

The first thing it says when you type in "Jeff" now on Google,

it just says "Jeff Lowe Nanny."

We gotta look that up.

When you guys look back on the series...

Obviously, now it's the phenomenon.

Were you happy about how you were portrayed?

No. I mean, I think they tried to sensationalize the story a little bit

to give it a villain. And villain is right here.

You did say, Jeff, everybody starts out well with you and ends bad.

All these guys come to me when they're in trouble, like Joe.

And then as soon as I help 'em, and I no longer help them,

-they turn on me. -They backstab.

You know what, I'm getting used to it.

I don’t know where you found Allen,

but he's the most terrifying person I've ever seen on camera.

-You know, he's the kindest... -He is the sweetest.

He's the sweetest hitman you ever could hire.

He's got the eyes of a wolf, to me.

It scares the hell outta me.

A question from a Facebook fan.

"Whose brilliant idea was it for Allen to be filmed in the bathtub?"

I don’t have an answer for that. 'Cause when we saw that, we were like...

"What the hell is going on?"

I think Erik, for some reason, wanted to see Allen in a bathtub.

It was hot and terrifying all at the same time.

-Kinda slexy, wasn't it? -How many times have you guys watched it?

-One painful time. -One time.

We watched it, like two hours...

Like, oh, I don’t know, we woke up at probably about five o'clock

just to get a bit of a head start on it

before really anyone else watched it, just so we knew what we were facing.

Do you have more biker jackets than you do Affliction shirts?

I don’t think I saw the same jacket twice during the series.

-I have quite a few, um... -Yeah.

You know, and I started wearing the leather because of the tigers.

We don’t declaw, and my arms were just getting ripped all to hell, so I always...

Now, it's just that I'm Fonzie.

Jeff, how do you respond to people who say that Joe was set up?

It's a complete crock of shit.

You guys saw all the videos that Joe was posting.

-Joe was his own worst enemy. -Yeah.

He should have gone on the stand and testified against himself.

Those videos where he's shooting Carole, hanging Carole, blowing Carole up...

-The blow-up dolls. -...putting rattlesnakes in her mailbox.

"Who's gonna finish this bitch?" "Who's gonna go get this bitch?"

Joe didn't get set up. Joe killed the tigers,

he admitted to killing the tigers from jail.

-Um... Uh... -And they were healthy tigers.

-They were two to three years old. -He said they were sick.

They were beautiful, healthy tigers that he called over to the fence

and he shot 'em in the head because he needed the cage space.

So Joe goes out there and makes the room for these cats

by killing five beautiful, healthy tigers.

Do you remember, they said they found a bug,

the antenna that was coming out of the office?

-Were you there when that happened? -Oh, my God!

That's a crock of shit. That's a two-way radio antenna.

That's for our radio systems here.

I think that John Reinke put...

It's one of those magnetic antennas that... Josh Dial said that.

James Garretson implied that he had more dirt on you

as he rode off into the sunset on that jet ski to "Eye of the Tiger."

Wasn't that sexy?

-That was... -He is a sexy man.

Are you worried at all about that?

Not at all, because what James Garretson fails to remember is I know the truth.

-I know why he cooperated with the feds. -Yeah.

-It wasn't over a lemur. Trust me. -Exactly.

We went to my attorneys and my attorney said,

"You know what? With this information, I have to go to the feds."

Did you report James Garretson's hairdresser to the feds?

Yeah.

I gotta ask. Do you think Carole killed her ex-husband?

-Abso-fucking-lutely. -Yeah.

And there's no question in my mind that she did it

and, you know, we've claimed that for years and years and years.

What's more disturbing,

the fact that Carole may have killed her ex-husband

or her wedding photos with Howard?

Ooh!

I don’t even know what to say to Howard about that.

That's almost more disturbing than the murder.

Joe is obviously more famous than he ever could have possibly imagined.

How difficult do you think it is for him to be locked away right now?

Well, we're getting reports that he's trying to get to a computer

so he can respond to his fans.

You know, this is the notoriety and fame that Joe always wanted.

And it's pretty ironic that now he's stuck in a cage

and can't even enjoy it.

He's where he belongs and I would probably just tell him, you know, "Gotcha."

The USDA tried to take him down. PETA has tried to take him down.

-Humane Society tried to take... -Carole Baskin tried.

Carole Baskin spent $2.5 million trying to take him down.

And we're the ones that did it.

Would you guys do another series of episodes if it was offered?

I don’t know.

They can't attack me legitimately,

so they try to associate me to every criminal since El Chapo.

And it's just not fair.

Are you saying that you worked with El Chapo?

- Only to help dig the tunnels. - No.

He managed the zoo

and managed to keep up with Joe even though he has no legs.

John Reinke.

John, thank you for coming back. How are you doing?

I'm doing good. Thanks for having me.

Did you ever imagine anything like this?

No. No, I couldn't imagine. And I'm not a star.

I just done a documentary. I can't imagine how...

You're a star, not me. I can't imagine how y'all deal with this every day.

Well, I was a star... 2009 was a big year for me.

Everyone seems so committed to their jobs and they love the cats so much.

Would you say you were committed to Joe or the animals?

Definitely the animals.

When my legs actually got bad, and I had to have the other one amputated,

it kept me going. I looked forward to taking care of the animals.

Seeing the ones that I've raised and watched them grow up.

Animals don’t give you any crap, just people.

Yeah, animals don’t give you any crap, but they might bite you

and you might die from a tremendous tiger bite.

That's one of the slight hazards of the job.

Did Joe realize how important you were to the zoo?

To keep it going?

Um, I don’t think so. 'Cause numerous times,

he had told me that I couldn't run the zoo.

That I wouldn't know how to run the zoo.

Um, numerous times he told me that.

He always tried to keep everybody smaller than him.

Right. Did you ever say anything like,

"You don’t know how to pick a hairdresser"?

No, his mullet was pretty much... That was pretty much him.

That's his insignia so...

But you clearly loved... You liked working there.

You worked there for a long time and yet, Joe seemed to be quite an asshole.

And how do you rectify that?

Yeah, he just kinda just...

You just look at your day and you just go on with it.

We got into plenty of verbal fights,

um, but he was always belittling somebody.

I mean, always. I mean...

He just got to where it was all about the cameras

and he would fire somebody just because he needed to fire somebody.

Whoa. That...

Did you ever want to take one of your legs and throw it at him?

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I've threatened to beat him before.

The man done a lotta stupid shit.

I mean, towards the end, he got to where he's blowing everything up.

I mean, hell, he blew up my golf cart and my damn cabin. I mean...

-He did? -Yeah. Yeah.

Knocked the windshield out of my golf cart.

Blew a hole in my cabin. Yeah. Blew a window out.

Jeff Lowe took over the zoo from Joe. Did you get along with Jeff?

I did at first, but then he thought I was talking to Joe

while Joe was incarcerated.

And I quit the same day Joe quit

because Jeff and Dillon got in a fist fight in the parking lot

and they rolled around for 15 minutes,

and that's when I made my decision to leave the same day.

Yeah, and that's a very long fist fight, 15 minutes.

-That sounds like... -Yeah.

...two of the worst fist-fighters I've ever heard of.

A fan on Facebook wants to ask you

who the skeleton was in the passenger seat of your car?

That was my only friend at the time.

I'm an asshole just like Joe is. I mean, it's... You know, I just...

I don’t hang out with people because people stab you in the back.

Now that you're on the most popular documentary in history,

how has your... What is it like to go out now?

Uh, it's a lot different, actually.

You're just waiting on somebody to come up to you, uh...

They don’t care about the COVID.

They want to shake your hand, get a picture with you. Um, it's pretty crazy.

So, can they tell you're coming, 'cause they can see the painted legs?

- Do they immediately know it's you? - Yeah.

I mean, I haven't worn pants in...

I wore pants to the sentencing, but other than that,

I haven’t worn pants in decades. I don’t wear pants.

-So I got my legs all dressed up. -Right.

People need to see them.

Do you know that those pants are probably very valuable now if you still have them?

They probably are. I do still have them,

'cause I'm sure I'm gonna go back to court over this.

-It's not over. -You think you're gonna go back?

-Oh, yeah, I'm sure. -Because of Joe's appeals?

Joe's appeal.

I haven't heard an ending to this case yet, so, who knows.

Have you had any contact with Joe at all?

I have not.

I have refrained from contacting that man because he don’t know how to shut up.

And he'll just keep talking, and everything's recorded.

Now, I'm sure when this pandemic lifts, there's gonna be a movie of you guys.

So, who should play you?

- I'm sticking with Matthew McConaughey. - To play you?

Because a lot of people are talking about McConaughey to play Joe.

I... Yeah, I don’t know about that, you know...

-You have a new wife? -No, I have a girlfriend.

I'm actually not divorced yet 'cause of COVID, that all got put off.

If we get back to a normal routine, I can get divorced

and I have a new girlfriend now.

And how's it going?

It's going great. I'm the happiest I've been in a long time.

Is she like, "I can't believe I'm dating a celebrity"?

Yeah. We're both actually saying that. I don’t consider myself a celebrity.

I just think I'm a guy on a damn documentary. I don’t know.

The one person on this show

who should never have trouble getting hired anywhere.

He really gives it all for his job, Saff.

Saff, thank you for calling in.

It's a pleasure. Thank you for having me.

Has your life changed at all since it was released?

It has, in a sense of, um,

I don’t have any anonymity.

I have been recognized in public places, which is new to me.

When was the first time you were recognized?

I was walking through Walmart on a late-night run.

Should've only took me ten minutes,

but I was stopped three times, during a pandemic, in Walmart.

You clearly love the animals and you seem very committed to your job.

Were you more loyal to Joe or to the animals?

Definitely the animals.

It seemed like I was loyal to him,

I think, because he was the big head of everything.

But everything I sacrificed was for the animals.

Joe admitted to shooting some of the tigers, outright.

Were you outraged by that?

Yes, uh... Obviously, I was.

But at that point, it's out of my control.

Joe always had a way of explaining his actions.

So, "They were old, they were injured, they were suffering," is what we got.

After seeing all the episodes, has it changed your views

on whether these animals should be kept in captivity?

I never thought that they should be kept in captivity.

But I knew the reality of it,

and the reality of it is, they cannot be returned to the wild.

And there's not much of a wild for them to return to.

Saff, you identify as a man.

Were you upset when they kept referring to you as "she" on the show?

I don’t think it bothered me as much as it bothered everyone else.

Um, I didn't really pay it any mind.

One of the biggest moments in the show is when your arm is horribly injured.

And...

And you laugh. Yes, the horrible injury you suffered, it's hilarious.

I've seen a couple of interviews you've done

and you don’t seem to have any regrets about it getting taken off.

No, I don’t. I know I made the right decision when I made it

and I would make that decision over and over again.

So, no, I don’t have any regrets.

When you got injured, did you go, "Oh, no,

a man with a bleached mullet, who's not an EMT and dressed like one,

is gonna try to save my life"?

Yeah. No, I don’t think I even remember what he was wearing on the day.

I had more pressing priorities to worry about.

I assumed that it was almost instantaneous when it happened?

Or did the tiger fight you for your arm?

Oh, no. There's no fight between me and a 600-pound tiger. No.

It took all of 15 to 20 seconds maybe,

from the time he bit me to the moment he let me go.

Wow. Did you... Was it awkward with the cat afterwards?

Um, no, not for me, and I would never know from him.

We did have to obviously move him,

so his life did change drastically in that sense.

But he didn't look at your right arm and start licking his chops or anything?

Not in front of me. No.

Now, did you watch the actual footage of the attack?

I have. Over and over. Yes, sir.

Oh, my gosh! Over and over?

There was a time and place where we actually used it as a safety video.

Did he ever give you any money for that?

Or was he like, "No fuckin' way!"?

No, I mean, we didn't even have any further of a conversation than,

"This should be the one thing people need to see before they decide

if this is a career move they wanna make."

Can you tell us the story of the Thanksgiving dinner?

- Was there more to that than we saw? - Yes, there definitely was.

They showed him serving it,

but they never explained what he was doing.

He fed people for free, a full Thanksgiving dinner

that him and his family cooked, you know, for the entire night prior.

Every single year since I've been there, and I've been there for almost ten years.

I've seen him give the jacket off his back for people.

And I think that wasn't highlighted enough.

Joe did a lotta messed up stuff. That's a fact, and that's shown,

and now the entire world knows it.

But he did a lotta good things, too.

Who would you trust first again,

Joe Exotic or the tiger who bit your arm off?

The tiger. I never stopped trusting the tiger.

And this is a Facebook fan question.

Do you think that Joe deserves to be in jail?

I think, uh, justice was served.

But I still don’t wanna see that man die in prison.

Now, big huge serious question,

'cause the Internet has been casting this movie.

Who should play you?

I mean, I still go back to the kid

who played Johnny Tsunami just because of looks.

- Right. - I mean, he looks just like me, so...

I'm gonna pitch Ken Jeong that he should... He's just gonna...

- That would be so amazing. - ...have to have a lot of makeup.

'Cause you're very young, but he's a very old man,

so he's gonna really have to use some prosthetics.

When this young man wanted to pursue a career in politics,

no one told him that would mean sleeping in a zoo.

He's Joe Exotic's campaign manager, Josh Dial.

Josh, thanks for coming on. How are you?

Hey, I'm doing good. Glad to be here.

How long were you with Joe while the cameras were following you?

When the folks first started filming Joe, I was already working for Joe.

So, I've known the producers and directors, you know, since day one.

The way they did this documentary,

it's fair, it's balanced and I just think it's a wonderful production.

Right. I mean, it's funny 'cause Jeff Lowe has issues about how it's put together.

Well, the truth hurts. The truth hurts.

You obviously knew who Joe was

before you ever started working for him.

-How did you see him? -Sure.

What was your opinion before you met him?

That he was batshit crazy.

And I knew walking up to that zoo, looking for a job,

that I was gonna be working for a batshit crazy person,

um, who was very shady as far as his business dealings went.

Um, but I did it anyway. I mean, how often do you get to say,

"Hey, I'm running for governor,

and I want you to be in charge of my entire campaign"?

I mean, that's so hard to turn down,

especially since I'm a Political Science major.

I got a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity.

I got to hold baby tigers, lemurs, take care of baby animals in my office.

I once saw a guy get his finger bit off by a bear outside my office window.

I mean, stuff that I'll never see again in my life.

Josh, you lived at the zoo. What was it like?

The best part was the lions, every morning they did their roars.

So about seven, eight o'clock in the morning,

which would be time to get up anyways,

all the windows in the house would rattle with the noise

and the reverberation of the lions' voices.

Our alarm clocks was, you know, 30, 40 lions all roaring at once.

-It was amazing. -Yeah.

I only have two lions here at my house in Studio City, California.

That's not nearly as cool.

Did Joe ever try anything romantically with you?

No. No. Joe's type is young and dumb.

He wants them 17, 18 years old.

And me, as a 31-year-old person, I aged out about 12 years ago.

So I never had to worry about anything like that with Joe.

You were in the room when Travis shot himself.

Tell us about that.

The thing is, I had to go in that office every day

and sit in that same chair

and look at that bullet hole in the wall every day for a year-and-a-half

after Travis killed himself.

And I never was able to get counseling

'cause Joe didn't help me and neither did Jeff Lowe.

Um, so, what my plan is,

hopefully I might be able to raise some money,

enough to get me some counseling, get all my meds.

And once I'm back stable and ready to go,

I want to jump back into campaigning for sure.

Obviously, that moment is the most tragic moment of the whole show.

When he walked in, was he talking to you?

Yeah, we were talking.

He was telling me about his gun. Joe just bought him a Ruger.

He said, "Hey, you know, a Ruger won't fire without a clip."

And I said, "Really?" And he said, "Yeah."

Right then, he put the gun to his head and pulled the trigger,

to prove to me that it wouldn't fire without a clip.

However, it must have had one in the chamber.

Do you think he had any intention

of deliberately shooting himself in that moment?

No. No, 'cause I was looking at him in the eyes when he did it

and I could see the surprise and the fear in his eyes.

I could see that... I mean, basically, translated,

he's like, "Oh, crap. What did I just do?"

I mean, maybe five seconds of his eyes I could read it and then he was gone.

-Oh, my gosh. Uh... -Yeah.

Someone on Facebook asked, "Did anyone think to get Joe counseling

after Travis' death?"

Was that a thing that Joe even considered?

What Joe did is he spoke to a shaman.

Did that do anything, did you think?

No. I felt like it worsened his condition.

You know, I'm all for holistic approaches,

but sometimes you need real legitimate counseling and medication.

He wasn't getting it.

Were you surprised when he was found guilty on all 19 counts?

Uh, no. No, I wasn't. I wasn't.

People in Oklahoma hate Joe Exotic. He's gay. This is a very red state,

um, and us gay folk are very...

We're almost an endangered species here.

But other reasons, you know, animal violations, stuff like that.

Do you think Carole's sanctuary, as it's called,

do you think it's a better set-up than Joe's zoo?

Or do you see them as pretty much the same?

They're the same. They're all the same.

All these animal folks are the same.

All they care about is that money.

Has there been anything that was put out on the Internet

that you disagree with strongly?

I don't do drugs. Like, I've had a lot of people being mean to me,

like, saying I do meth and stuff. I guess 'cause I'm associated with Joe Exotic.

I've never touched the stuff a day in my life.

And that's really what hurts. I wanna clear that up.

Joe obviously wanted to be famous. And now he is...

- Sure. - ...probably more famous

than he ever imagined.

Do you think he even knows

- the scope of his fame now? - Oh, yeah.

He's communicating with some of his old fans,

and he's having them run Facebook pages.

So he's getting... He's getting all the messages people are sending.

All the money people are raising for him, he's getting all that.

Yeah. He's in the loop on this, and he's loving every minute of it.

-I guarantee that. -He is.

On camera, you said, "Fuck the feds."

-Are you... -Yeah, fuck the feds.

Are you worried about saying stuff like that?

Yeah, I mean, I am definitely. It definitely gives me some worry.

I don't know very many people that do like the feds.

I mean,

the federal government's failed us on so many levels.

So, you know, I have no problem saying it once again. Fuck the feds.

They need to be working for us. Their paychecks come from us.

Their tax money that they blow, it comes from us.

So I feel like I have every right as an American to say,

"Fuck the feds. Do your job."

You heard it, folks.

And now, let's hear from one of the men who captured Joe Exotic's heart.

One-third of the Tiger King throuple.

He was a man of few words and even fewer teeth.

But as you're about to see, that's all changed.

Well, some of that's changed. Here is John Finlay.

Now, there's something... I'm looking at you, there's something...

different-looking about you.

That's right. You're wearing a shirt.

No, I'm kidding. And congrats on your...

-teeth look amazing. -Thank you.

It took a while to get 'em, but once I actually got 'em,

it took me a while to get 'em to where I was able to really wear 'em.

And now I pretty much wear 'em all the time.

They look amazing. And the, uh...

I don't know what you call that, the goatee, the Van Dyke, is...

You look like a character out of a... A mythical cowboy,

like a mythical Western. I love it.

In the documentary, you had a lot of tattoos

and you had a big tattoo on the lower part of your stomach,

covering another tattoo. How is that healing?

You know, it is completely finished.

It's still kind of in the healing process.

But a lot of people are dissing the tattoo artist.

Really?

Oh, yes. They are dissing my tattoo artist, like, hard core.

-Why? -Because in the documentary,

they showed it not finished.

I've actually had it completely finished since then.

It looks 100 times better than what it did,

and it will be revealed, but I don't know when.

So you, obviously,

were in a relationship with Joe

and involved with a woman who worked at the zoo.

Were there a lot of people hooking up at the zoo?

From what I understand, yes.

I've seen a lot of relationships form because of it

and I've seen a lot of relationships end because of what was going on.

Would you say, "Meet me in the tiger cage number four

and we'll just try to avoid the 400-pound cat while we do it"?

How did it work?

I don't know anything about that.

Okay. All right. So, going back, so Joe,

he dedicated a song to you, and was it flattering?

Was it embarrassing? Was it alarming?

Do you remember the words?

Um, no, I don't exactly remember the words.

Some of them were bad. Some of them were great.

Some of them were just way off the wall.

And that, clearly not his voice.

There's been tons of press about it not being his voice.

That is not him singing.

How quickly did you watch the documentary

after it came out?

I actually watched it that night, and me and my fiancée

both binge-watched it in seven hours.

Wow! Netflix is very happy to hear that.

I had to know what was on it, and so did she.

And we had to be kind of prepared to know what was gonna go on.

How else are you supposed to know what's going on without watching something?

Were you happy about how you were portrayed?

No, I was not. I mean, I was portrayed

as a drugged-out hillbilly, and that was not me then.

I've been... At that time, I was four to five years clean.

So, you had quit while you were with Joe?

When my daughter was born,

I decided to never touch another drug ever again.

Very cool.

How old's your daughter?

She's four right now, almost five.

No tattoos yet?

Just a couple of placeholders, maybe?

Uh, none that I know of.

How do you tell somebody that you're falling in love with...

You go, "Hey, remember that guy

that ran for governor and he had that big cat zoo, and the bleached mullet?

Yeah? Well, I used to be married to that guy."

How does that go down?

You know, we've never held anything back from each other.

We tell each other everything that goes on.

The big distinct feature in your interviews was always

that you were shirtless.

So, why were you shirtless the whole time?

I got tattoos.

Why not show off and...

I mean, it was a little cold, but it was fun.

Yeah. Hey. Well, that's why I'm shirtless for this interview.

Right now, I'm gonna speak to Rick Kirkham.

You know Rick. He's the guy right at the beginning of the documentary

who looks like he's in some sort of badass Western.

He wears that cool hat. He smokes indoors.

It's Rick Kirkham, ladies and gentlemen.

- Uh, Rick, how's it going? - I'm doing fine.

A little cold here in Norway. How are you doing?

I'm well. What are you doing in Norway?

Why did you move there?

First, it was the farthest distance I could get away from Oklahoma

and that zoo.

Secondly, I fell in love with a Norwegian girl a few years ago

and thought I'd take advantage of the disaster

and just come marry her and move here.

Has Tiger King mania reached Norway?

Has Tiger King mania reached Norway? Let me just show you.

This is just the paper, the newspaper that came out yesterday.

Two pages of my picture on the front page.

-Yeah, it's hit Norway in a big way. -Wow.

It's number one in Norway.

I can't even take a walk down at the fjord

without somebody walking their dog, coming by pointing, going,

"That's him! That's him!" in Norse. "That Tiger King." You hear Tiger King,

if I walk through the mall.

Now, obviously, you've been producing for many years.

- Have you ever... - Yeah.

...been close to anything like this?

You know, when I worked at Inside Edition,

I started that show back in 1989,

I got used to having a little bit of fame. I was there for eight years

- and people pretty much knew who I was. - Mmm-hmm.

But I gotta tell you, nothing, nothing compares to this series.

This documentary series has... It's become a phenomenon.

Who's the more disturbed individual, Joe Exotic or Bill O’Reilly?

Wow! You know what? That is a great question, Joel.

Great question. Well, let's see.

I would say that Joe Exotic is more evil

and Bill O’Reilly is more of just an asshole.

How many years ago did you meet Joe?

Joe had put an ad on craigslist,

and it was such an outrageous ad.

This guy plays with tigers, he's a gay cowboy.

He shoots his guns. So I called him.

Straight out he said, "Rick, what the fuck do you want?"

on the telephone. I said,

"I wanna fucking come up and talk to you about your show."

And I went up that night and I sat down with him

and we talked about doing the show. And I didn't bring anything.

I was in the clothes I was wearing and, boom, I was living inside a crazy zoo.

When did you first realize the real danger

of his flamboyant persona?

I mean, what was the moment you went, "Oh, wait.

This might... This might all go away"?

You know, um, I began... About three months in,

I began to see him do things to animals that I knew was wrong.

And as I have admitted,

I sold out my own journalistic integrity by not just going to the authorities

or to an animal rights activist and saying,

"Hey. You need to come in and stop this guy."

Because the things that I saw were wrong.

There's a story that I've told a few people about a horse.

This old woman had a horse, in a horse trailer.

She pulled in one day, and she was really upset.

She was crying. And Joe turned around and said, "Rick, go grab the camera.

Videotape all of this."

And Joe went up and started giving her a hug.

She said, "Joe, can you please take care of my horse?

He needs to go out to pasture and he's old and can you give him a good life?"

And Joe's like, "I have plenty of land. Of course we will."

And she cried.

He said, "Unhitch the horse trailer, we'll bring it back to you tomorrow.

We'll give the horse a great little life out here."

No sooner did that lady get off the park than Joe said "Rick, follow me."

Walked right up to the horse trailer,

pulled the Western revolver out of his holster,

shot the horse dead and said,

"I don't take care of nobody's animals. And now, they're tiger meat."

And he had the horse cut up and fed to the tigers.

It was unbelievably cruel. Unbelievably cruel.

That's un... It's unreal.

Did you ever see him kill a lion or tiger?

I did. I saw him shoot two tigers, actually.

One of them because he was pissed off at the tiger

because the tiger nearly bit him one day. The guy was a cruel man.

Do you think he's skipping around his cell?

Or do you think he's punching the wall?

I'll be honest with you. I don't think Joe Exotic will leave prison alive.

I don't think he'll be able to stand it.

Even if he got out with good behavior in ten, 12 years, he won't live that long.

What's really eating him up is people like me

who are getting so much attention instead of him.

He doesn't get any of the money that's coming out.

He doesn't get any of the accolades, he doesn't get any of the opportunities.

He doesn't get anything. Except three meals a day.

Think about the amount of money he could make now

- just on appearances. - Yeah.

You know, the one thing that wasn't pointed out in the docuseries

that's really important to know, too, Joe was terrified of big cats.

He was scared to death of lions and tigers.

And in the shots that you see in there

where he's in with the two tigers, the white one and the other one,

the white one is blind and the other one is on tranquilizers.

It's idiotic to think how he's become famous

as "The Tiger King" when he's so terrified of big cats.

Wow! I did not know that.

What did you think of Joe's supposed plot to kill Carole?

I mean, he asked me to kill Carole one time.

But, you know, it was like a joke.

He was like, "I'll make you a rich man if you'll kill Carole."

"Ah. Ha-ha! Okay. Whatever." But that's when he got serious.

When I left the park and the zoo burned, the studio burned,

that's when Joe started downhill hard.

As it all shook out, do you regret feeding it at all?

I regret ever meeting Joe Exotic because...

I went in because I saw there was a great opportunity

for an incredibly wonderful show about big animals and this crazy zookeeper.

But I too was sucked in to the surreal world of Joe Exotic.

I will never get over... I still have nightmares, Joel.

I still have nightmares today. I had nightmares last night.

And since this docuseries has been back,

I've had more nightmares about having lived on that park.

-I want to put this chapter away. -Wow.

But it keeps getting bigger and bigger and bigger.

The one thing that I think that can come out of this docuseries that is good,

people are now going, "Free the animals."

I think that's the best thing.

As you've seen, the Internet has cast the movie.

Who would you like to play you?

I think the one person that's been brought up is Billy Bob Thornton.

I think he might make... He might make a good Rick Kirkham.

Well, there you have it.

I hope this satisfied your hunger for more stories

from the wild world of Tiger King.

We learned a lot today.

We discovered that Joe Exotic doesn't have many allies left amongst his old zoo crew.

We found out the hottest Tiger King celebrity hangout is Walmart.

And, most importantly,

we learned that there is no job offer that I'll turn down.

I'm Joel McHale. This is my couch.

And I'll see you at the end of the next documentary series

that becomes a surprise sensation during a global pandemic.

Thanks for watching.