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Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:00,960 --> 00:00:02,960 Five years ago I was... 2 00:00:02,960 --> 00:00:06,000 convicted of a dreadful crime that I did not commit. 3 00:00:06,000 --> 00:00:08,960 Don't touch me! The whole town's going to know! 4 00:00:08,960 --> 00:00:10,960 You're saying that there's no way... 5 00:00:10,960 --> 00:00:13,480 ..that Matthew Taylor could have been his biological son. 6 00:00:15,960 --> 00:00:19,160 GLASS SMASHING 'You spread lies which grew,' 7 00:00:19,160 --> 00:00:22,160 and ultimately landed Sally Wright in the dock 8 00:00:22,160 --> 00:00:23,960 and you in the witness box. 9 00:00:23,960 --> 00:00:25,960 They were together. I still believe that. 10 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:27,960 You got the job. 11 00:00:27,960 --> 00:00:30,960 I let them wear me down, I let them convince me. 12 00:00:30,960 --> 00:00:33,960 But wasn't our fault. We never asked for any of this. 13 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:35,960 You seem very concerned about her all of a sudden. 14 00:00:35,960 --> 00:00:38,160 But what about us? What about your own step daughter? 15 00:00:39,320 --> 00:00:41,800 Don't throw away the past. 16 00:00:41,800 --> 00:00:44,960 I was with a probationer, a lad called Aaron Holmes. 17 00:00:44,960 --> 00:00:45,960 And he'll confirm that? 18 00:00:47,320 --> 00:00:50,960 He's not yours. He never was. 19 00:00:51,960 --> 00:00:54,960 You come near Sam or my family again, 20 00:00:54,960 --> 00:00:56,960 I will destroy you! 21 00:01:15,960 --> 00:01:19,960 A few weeks ago, we had a bust-up over a bill. 22 00:01:19,960 --> 00:01:22,960 He's come in tonight, I've lost my temper... 23 00:01:22,960 --> 00:01:24,960 we've had a bit of a ding-dong, that's it, really. 24 00:01:26,000 --> 00:01:27,960 So we have two other witnesses 25 00:01:27,960 --> 00:01:29,960 who say it was a completely unprovoked attack by him. 26 00:01:29,960 --> 00:01:31,960 Well, obviously, they didn't see the whole thing 27 00:01:31,960 --> 00:01:34,640 because that's not what happened. 28 00:01:34,640 --> 00:01:36,960 Look, like I said, I'm happy to leave it there. 29 00:01:43,000 --> 00:01:45,960 So, are you going to tell him? 30 00:01:45,960 --> 00:01:47,960 Sam? 31 00:01:47,960 --> 00:01:49,960 Cos this is scary, Sal. 32 00:01:49,960 --> 00:01:51,960 Doesn't matter if the back door was unlocked, 33 00:01:51,960 --> 00:01:54,640 to walk in to someone else's house and attack them... 34 00:01:54,640 --> 00:01:56,960 Right, yeah... So you either tell him, 35 00:01:56,960 --> 00:01:58,160 and get her to back the fuck off, 36 00:01:58,160 --> 00:02:00,960 or we go to the police. 37 00:02:02,960 --> 00:02:05,640 OK. 38 00:02:05,640 --> 00:02:08,320 Are you saying he hasn't been back at all in the last few hours? 39 00:02:08,320 --> 00:02:09,960 No. 40 00:02:09,960 --> 00:02:13,000 So, any idea why he would have done this? 41 00:02:14,960 --> 00:02:16,960 Mrs Taylor? No. 42 00:02:16,960 --> 00:02:19,000 No idea why he walks out of your house, 43 00:02:19,000 --> 00:02:20,960 just a few hours after we've interviewed him 44 00:02:20,960 --> 00:02:22,960 about Matthew's paternity, 45 00:02:22,960 --> 00:02:24,960 and seeks out and assaults a local publican? 46 00:02:28,480 --> 00:02:29,960 No. 47 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:31,960 'Hi, this is Sam Wright. Please leave a message.' 48 00:02:33,160 --> 00:02:35,960 Hey, Sam, it's me. 49 00:02:35,960 --> 00:02:38,000 Can we meet? 50 00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:45,160 You've done your duty as a mate. 51 00:02:45,160 --> 00:02:46,320 We both have. 52 00:02:47,480 --> 00:02:49,960 She needs to go. 53 00:02:50,960 --> 00:02:52,960 Today. 54 00:02:54,800 --> 00:02:56,960 OK. I am off. 55 00:02:56,960 --> 00:02:58,960 Have a good one. 56 00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:00,960 You too. And, Beth? 57 00:03:00,960 --> 00:03:02,960 Try and have a normal day today, please. 58 00:03:06,960 --> 00:03:10,960 Er... Yeah, Mum, I'd love to have normal day. 59 00:03:10,960 --> 00:03:13,960 It's hard when you have the amount of shit in your head that I do. 60 00:03:13,960 --> 00:03:15,960 Most of it put there by you! 61 00:03:17,960 --> 00:03:20,640 DOOR OPENS AND SLAMS SHUT 62 00:03:23,960 --> 00:03:26,000 Hi. Oh, hi. 63 00:03:26,000 --> 00:03:27,960 Oh. 64 00:03:29,000 --> 00:03:31,640 Yeah. Well, erm... 65 00:03:32,960 --> 00:03:35,960 It's wooden floors so... 66 00:03:35,960 --> 00:03:37,640 Oh, Sal, I'm so sorry. It's OK. 67 00:03:37,640 --> 00:03:38,960 I mean, you don't have to go today. 68 00:03:38,960 --> 00:03:41,960 Jen, honestly, it's fine. 69 00:03:44,960 --> 00:03:46,960 Yeah, all very odd. 70 00:03:46,960 --> 00:03:48,960 My guess is it was about what we think it was. 71 00:03:48,960 --> 00:03:50,960 What, that Gary Walker is Matthew's father? 72 00:03:50,960 --> 00:03:52,960 And that he's never told his missus. 73 00:03:52,960 --> 00:03:55,960 Which obviously offers up some interesting possible motives 74 00:03:55,960 --> 00:03:58,960 for Walker too. Cos a lad turning up on the doorstep 75 00:03:58,960 --> 00:04:00,960 of your marital home one day and saying he's your long lost son, 76 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:03,800 it's not exactly Davina McCall territory, is it? 77 00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:06,160 Has he got any form? First thing I checked, 78 00:04:06,160 --> 00:04:07,960 for a DNA match against Matty primarily, 79 00:04:07,960 --> 00:04:10,320 but no, sorry, nothing on PNC. 80 00:04:10,320 --> 00:04:12,960 OK, well, pull him in anyway. 81 00:04:12,960 --> 00:04:14,960 If you're right and he never told his missus, we can use that. 82 00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:19,960 Right, the gifts and presents found in Matthew's bedroom. 83 00:04:19,960 --> 00:04:22,960 These were all originally ascribed to Sally Wright. 84 00:04:22,960 --> 00:04:25,160 She always said she bought him the books but nothing else, 85 00:04:25,160 --> 00:04:26,960 so who was the rest of the stuff from? 86 00:04:26,960 --> 00:04:29,160 Obviously, a trawl was done in the first investigation 87 00:04:29,160 --> 00:04:31,960 to see if the item's purchaser could be identified, 88 00:04:31,960 --> 00:04:34,320 but give it another sweep, Mia, 89 00:04:34,320 --> 00:04:35,960 see what was missed. Guv. 90 00:04:35,960 --> 00:04:38,960 Er, Sam Wright's alibi, where are we on that? 91 00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:42,160 So, too long ago for any CCTV of his car being where he says it was, 92 00:04:42,160 --> 00:04:43,960 which was heading to see Aaron Holmes, 93 00:04:43,960 --> 00:04:47,000 and unfortunately, there's no phone mast records either. 94 00:04:47,000 --> 00:04:48,960 So it's going to be down to Holmes confirming 95 00:04:48,960 --> 00:04:50,960 he was definitely with him. Basically, yeah, 96 00:04:50,960 --> 00:04:52,960 I'm trying to arrange a time to see Aaron later this week. 97 00:04:52,960 --> 00:04:54,960 Good stuff. 98 00:04:54,960 --> 00:04:57,960 Lastly, John Taylor is still AWOL. 99 00:04:57,960 --> 00:04:59,960 I want him found, please. 100 00:05:06,640 --> 00:05:09,320 Oh, my God, Sal. That is awful. 101 00:05:09,320 --> 00:05:12,960 Yeah, and so they basically asked me to leave because of her. 102 00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:15,960 So can you speak to her? Tell her to calm down, 103 00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:19,960 reassure her that I'm not back here to "steal her man"? 104 00:05:19,960 --> 00:05:22,960 For what it's worth, and this is absolutely not 105 00:05:22,960 --> 00:05:24,960 any kind of an excuse, but... 106 00:05:24,960 --> 00:05:26,960 she is under a lot of pressure at the moment. 107 00:05:28,960 --> 00:05:31,960 I mean, Beth's not an easy child, never has been, 108 00:05:31,960 --> 00:05:35,960 and things have seriously... flared up again the last few months. 109 00:05:35,960 --> 00:05:37,640 This re-trial... 110 00:05:38,960 --> 00:05:41,960 ..seems to have really affected her and just, erm, 111 00:05:41,960 --> 00:05:46,960 well, it's caused Karen a huge amount of worry and... 112 00:05:46,960 --> 00:05:50,960 As I say, I'm not excusing her behaviour at all, 113 00:05:50,960 --> 00:05:53,960 I'm... I'm just saying, it's very out of character. 114 00:05:54,960 --> 00:05:56,800 Sure. 115 00:05:57,800 --> 00:06:00,960 Just so you know, actually, you might want to tell her this. 116 00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:03,960 Jen and Alf wanted to call the police. 117 00:06:03,960 --> 00:06:05,960 And I persuaded them not to. 118 00:06:06,960 --> 00:06:09,960 Right. Yeah. Wow. 119 00:06:09,960 --> 00:06:13,960 Well, on her behalf, thank you. 120 00:06:13,960 --> 00:06:16,960 PHONE CHIMES Oh, sorry. 121 00:06:21,480 --> 00:06:23,960 Er... I've got to go. 122 00:06:25,960 --> 00:06:27,960 Right. 123 00:06:34,640 --> 00:06:37,960 Is there anything I can do, Sal? Oh, don't worry about me, 124 00:06:37,960 --> 00:06:40,960 I've got unlimited hot water between six and eight. 125 00:06:40,960 --> 00:06:41,960 I'm serious. 126 00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:46,960 Yeah, well, what do you think, Sam? 127 00:06:46,960 --> 00:06:49,960 Turn back time so it's me you're coming back to, 128 00:06:49,960 --> 00:06:51,960 to our lovely family home? 129 00:07:09,960 --> 00:07:11,960 I'm all right. 130 00:07:30,960 --> 00:07:32,960 SHE SOBS 131 00:07:47,320 --> 00:07:49,640 They said you were like a mad man. 132 00:07:50,960 --> 00:07:53,960 Broke a bottle, had to be stopped from stabbing him wi' it. 133 00:07:55,960 --> 00:08:00,800 You know, even... even when you were at your most troubled, John, 134 00:08:00,800 --> 00:08:03,960 I stayed with you, because I thought that deep down, you were a good man. 135 00:08:05,640 --> 00:08:06,960 Decent, loving. 136 00:08:08,800 --> 00:08:09,960 Kind. 137 00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:13,960 Well, maybe I never really knew you. 138 00:08:17,960 --> 00:08:20,960 So, let me tell you where we are, Gary. 139 00:08:20,960 --> 00:08:24,960 We think that John Taylor's assault on you 140 00:08:24,960 --> 00:08:28,960 was almost certainly connected to the fact that Matthew Taylor... 141 00:08:28,960 --> 00:08:30,960 was your son. 142 00:08:30,960 --> 00:08:33,960 HE SCOFFS No, that's... 143 00:08:33,960 --> 00:08:35,000 Well, I... 144 00:08:35,000 --> 00:08:36,960 I don't know where you've got that from, 145 00:08:36,960 --> 00:08:38,960 but that's not true. No-one... 146 00:08:39,960 --> 00:08:41,960 ..not your wife... 147 00:08:43,960 --> 00:08:44,960 ..not your kids, 148 00:08:44,960 --> 00:08:47,960 need know what we've discussed here today, 149 00:08:47,960 --> 00:08:49,960 as long as we feel you're being straight with us. 150 00:08:50,960 --> 00:08:52,960 So I'm going to ask you again. 151 00:08:54,160 --> 00:08:56,960 Was Matthew Taylor your son? 152 00:08:58,960 --> 00:09:00,960 No, he wasn't. 153 00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:03,320 This is a murder investigation, Gary. 154 00:09:03,320 --> 00:09:05,960 Which means if he was your son, it's pertinent to our inquiry 155 00:09:05,960 --> 00:09:08,960 and that means we'll do everything in our power to prove that. 156 00:09:10,960 --> 00:09:14,320 We will pull... your house apart. 157 00:09:16,960 --> 00:09:18,960 We will pull your life apart, 158 00:09:18,960 --> 00:09:22,960 and every single person in this town will end up knowing why. 159 00:09:24,960 --> 00:09:26,800 But if you cooperate, we will do our best 160 00:09:26,800 --> 00:09:28,800 to keep it contained. 161 00:09:31,960 --> 00:09:33,960 Was he your son? 162 00:09:37,640 --> 00:09:39,480 Yeah. 163 00:09:41,960 --> 00:09:43,960 Thank you. 164 00:09:48,960 --> 00:09:51,000 Ow! 165 00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:53,160 Don't say anything, OK? 166 00:09:57,960 --> 00:09:59,960 What was that all about? 167 00:09:59,960 --> 00:10:02,320 Nothing. Was that Bethany Moss? 168 00:10:02,320 --> 00:10:05,960 I actually only found out a few months before Matty died. 169 00:10:05,960 --> 00:10:07,960 And how did you find out? 170 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:10,960 Maria told me. Just came in the pub one day. 171 00:10:10,960 --> 00:10:14,000 Sorry, just going back, the original relationship with her, 172 00:10:14,000 --> 00:10:16,160 that was a serious thing, or...? 173 00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:20,960 A few weeks. 174 00:10:20,960 --> 00:10:22,000 A month at the most. 175 00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:24,960 And you were both married at that time? 176 00:10:26,640 --> 00:10:28,960 Her husband was away a lot, he was in the army. 177 00:10:30,960 --> 00:10:33,960 We had two little'uns 178 00:10:33,960 --> 00:10:36,320 so my missus would often go and stay at her mum's. 179 00:10:36,320 --> 00:10:38,480 It was the only time I ever... 180 00:10:39,960 --> 00:10:43,960 It's not who I am. OK, so scroll forward 16 years 181 00:10:43,960 --> 00:10:45,960 and Maria walks in to your pub and...? 182 00:10:45,960 --> 00:10:50,960 Apparently, John had found out and, God knows why, told the boy. 183 00:10:52,800 --> 00:10:54,800 So she felt that she had to tell me. 184 00:10:57,960 --> 00:11:00,960 And I was, erm... in shock. 185 00:11:00,960 --> 00:11:03,640 Obviously, I wanted to be decent about it all, 186 00:11:03,640 --> 00:11:06,160 to do the right thing by the boy, whatever that was, 187 00:11:06,160 --> 00:11:08,960 but I was also happily married. 188 00:11:08,960 --> 00:11:11,960 I knew that if I told her the truth, it would have messed all that up. 189 00:11:11,960 --> 00:11:13,960 And what happened then? 190 00:11:13,960 --> 00:11:16,640 Then Matty came by one night, just as I was locking up. 191 00:11:17,960 --> 00:11:21,960 And thank God Alison was away on a university trip with our eldest 192 00:11:21,960 --> 00:11:25,960 but... it was... awful. 193 00:11:25,960 --> 00:11:27,640 Why awful? 194 00:11:27,640 --> 00:11:29,480 This was my boy. 195 00:11:30,960 --> 00:11:33,960 And he was so upset and confused and... 196 00:11:37,960 --> 00:11:39,960 Just wanted to wrap my arms around him. 197 00:11:41,960 --> 00:11:43,960 Say sorry. 198 00:11:44,960 --> 00:11:48,960 What did he want? I think he was as confused as me. 199 00:11:50,960 --> 00:11:52,960 I mean, his dad had tried to stop him seeing me. 200 00:11:52,960 --> 00:11:55,960 Matthew told you that? Yeah. 201 00:11:55,960 --> 00:11:58,960 For a few weeks, I tried to meet up with him, 202 00:11:58,960 --> 00:12:00,960 to talk to him, help him through it all. 203 00:12:05,960 --> 00:12:07,960 Then it all got too much for me. 204 00:12:09,960 --> 00:12:12,960 Alison started to ask questions cos I kept disappearing. 205 00:12:13,960 --> 00:12:17,320 So I'm ashamed to say I told him that I couldn't see him any more. 206 00:12:18,960 --> 00:12:20,960 And how did he take that? 207 00:12:20,960 --> 00:12:22,960 Better than I thought. 208 00:12:24,960 --> 00:12:27,320 I told him that his real dad was the man that had raised 209 00:12:27,320 --> 00:12:28,960 and loved him for 16 years. 210 00:12:29,960 --> 00:12:31,960 Not me. 211 00:12:32,960 --> 00:12:34,960 OK. 212 00:12:35,960 --> 00:12:38,480 One last question, Gary. 213 00:12:39,960 --> 00:12:43,640 Where were you on the day your son was murdered? 214 00:12:57,640 --> 00:12:59,960 She said you gave her a dead arm. 215 00:12:59,960 --> 00:13:02,960 Well, she was in my way, I asked her to move and she didn't, 216 00:13:02,960 --> 00:13:04,960 so I pushed past her. 217 00:13:04,960 --> 00:13:07,960 So she's lying, then? 218 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:09,960 It happens. 219 00:13:10,960 --> 00:13:12,960 I had a look at your report card, Beth, 220 00:13:12,960 --> 00:13:15,960 it's not the first incident like this in the last few months, is it? 221 00:13:16,960 --> 00:13:19,960 And yet sitting here now, you don't seem like that sort of girl to me, 222 00:13:19,960 --> 00:13:21,960 not really. 223 00:13:23,960 --> 00:13:25,960 Look, sometimes when we lash out about things, 224 00:13:25,960 --> 00:13:28,960 it's actually because we're upset about something else. 225 00:13:32,960 --> 00:13:35,160 What I'm saying is, I can arrange for you to speak with someone 226 00:13:35,160 --> 00:13:37,960 from pastoral support, if you like. 227 00:13:40,160 --> 00:13:43,640 I'm fine. Really? 228 00:13:43,640 --> 00:13:44,800 Yeah. 229 00:13:45,960 --> 00:13:48,000 We done? 230 00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:49,960 Sure. 231 00:13:56,960 --> 00:14:00,960 How long till he's sober? I think we can write off tonight. 232 00:14:00,960 --> 00:14:02,960 Right, first thing, then. 233 00:14:02,960 --> 00:14:05,960 In the meantime, let's start chasing down Walker's alibi, 234 00:14:05,960 --> 00:14:08,480 and let's get him printed. OK. 235 00:14:08,480 --> 00:14:09,960 'I've Beth in tears upstairs.' 236 00:14:09,960 --> 00:14:11,960 Why? Your ex. 237 00:14:12,960 --> 00:14:15,960 What d'you mean "my ex"? She threatened her at school today, 238 00:14:15,960 --> 00:14:18,640 apparently, with expulsion. What?! 239 00:14:18,640 --> 00:14:20,960 Some kid lied that Beth had tried to hurt her. 240 00:14:23,960 --> 00:14:25,960 And we're sure it couldn't be Beth lying? 241 00:14:25,960 --> 00:14:27,960 Oh, here we go. Listen, I'm just saying... 242 00:14:27,960 --> 00:14:30,000 You're always defending her. Er, she does have a bit of history 243 00:14:30,000 --> 00:14:32,480 on that front. And of course, this is what she wants, 244 00:14:32,480 --> 00:14:33,960 you and I at each other's throats. 245 00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:35,960 What does that mean? 246 00:14:35,960 --> 00:14:37,800 She wants to break up our family, Sam, 247 00:14:37,800 --> 00:14:39,960 so she can get you back, she's obsessed with us. 248 00:14:39,960 --> 00:14:42,960 Says the woman who broke into her house and attacked her. 249 00:14:44,320 --> 00:14:46,960 Well, that was stupid... It was more than fucking stupid, 250 00:14:46,960 --> 00:14:49,960 Karen, it's actually scary. You stood in front of me yesterday 251 00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:51,640 and lied, very convincingly, 252 00:14:51,640 --> 00:14:53,960 about bloody Sal coming to the front door. 253 00:14:59,960 --> 00:15:03,960 Look, look, we shouldn't be rowing. 254 00:15:03,960 --> 00:15:06,960 This is a really difficult situation for both of us. 255 00:15:07,960 --> 00:15:09,960 But we can get through it, Sam, I know we can, 256 00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:12,960 if we just agree to be honest with each other. 257 00:15:14,960 --> 00:15:17,960 Yeah. Yeah, you're right. 258 00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:19,960 No more lies, from either of us. 259 00:16:01,960 --> 00:16:03,960 I'd done two tours in Kosovo. 260 00:16:05,960 --> 00:16:07,960 When I came back from the second... 261 00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:11,960 I wasn't in a good place. 262 00:16:12,960 --> 00:16:15,960 I was drinking too much, 263 00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:18,960 me and Maz were rowing all the time. 264 00:16:18,960 --> 00:16:20,960 So when I left for a third tour... 265 00:16:21,960 --> 00:16:24,960 ..I think she just needed someone to talk to, really. 266 00:16:27,960 --> 00:16:30,960 Cut to 16 years later... 267 00:16:31,960 --> 00:16:33,960 ..I'm at the doc's for a check-up on a cyst. 268 00:16:36,960 --> 00:16:38,160 Yeah... 269 00:16:39,960 --> 00:16:43,000 I learned I've been infertile all my life. 270 00:16:43,000 --> 00:16:44,960 Which wasn't so good... 271 00:16:44,960 --> 00:16:47,960 to find out everything you thought you knew about your family 272 00:16:47,960 --> 00:16:48,960 was a lie. 273 00:16:48,960 --> 00:16:50,960 Anyway... 274 00:16:50,960 --> 00:16:52,960 she said the relationship had been brief. 275 00:16:54,480 --> 00:16:56,960 A few weeks at the most. 276 00:16:56,960 --> 00:17:00,960 She also swore she'd never told Walker that Matty was his, so... 277 00:17:00,960 --> 00:17:02,960 really, if we kept it secret, it was like it never happened. 278 00:17:04,960 --> 00:17:06,960 Which is easier to say than do. 279 00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:08,960 Cos I was angry. 280 00:17:08,960 --> 00:17:12,960 With her, obviously, with Walker, myself... 281 00:17:13,960 --> 00:17:15,960 ..maybe even with Matty. 282 00:17:17,960 --> 00:17:21,320 And it all came at the absolute worst time. 283 00:17:21,320 --> 00:17:23,320 Me and him had started arguing a lot. 284 00:17:24,960 --> 00:17:27,480 He was going through a phase, I suppose, 285 00:17:27,480 --> 00:17:30,960 trying to work out who he was. And then one day... 286 00:17:32,960 --> 00:17:34,960 ..after a particularly nasty row... 287 00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:39,960 ..I told him that he wasn't mine. 288 00:17:42,320 --> 00:17:44,960 Which is without question the worst thing I've ever done. 289 00:18:16,960 --> 00:18:19,960 I mean, the second I said it I... 290 00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:21,960 wished I could've taken it back, but I couldn't. 291 00:18:22,960 --> 00:18:25,960 Did he get angry with you? With both of us. 292 00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:28,960 And how did you respond? 293 00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:32,160 Just... tried to calm him down, I suppose. 294 00:18:32,160 --> 00:18:33,960 I mean... 295 00:18:33,960 --> 00:18:36,960 I apologised repeatedly for telling him but... 296 00:18:36,960 --> 00:18:38,960 I was pissed and in pieces myself, 297 00:18:38,960 --> 00:18:41,000 I wasn't best placed to deal with it all. 298 00:18:41,000 --> 00:18:43,960 Did it ever get physical? No. 299 00:18:43,960 --> 00:18:46,960 Even though, as you said, you were both angry? 300 00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:50,960 Before I said it, I was angry. 301 00:18:50,960 --> 00:18:52,960 After, I was just ashamed. 302 00:18:54,160 --> 00:18:56,320 Over the next few days... 303 00:18:57,320 --> 00:18:59,320 ..things seemed to calm down a bit. 304 00:18:59,320 --> 00:19:00,960 Talked about it all more. 305 00:19:00,960 --> 00:19:03,800 Rationally, all three of us. 306 00:19:05,640 --> 00:19:07,160 And in the end, he said he wanted to meet him. 307 00:19:07,160 --> 00:19:10,640 How did that make you feel? Well, I'd created the situation, 308 00:19:10,640 --> 00:19:12,480 so I wasn't going to stop him doing what he felt 309 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:13,960 he needed to do at that point. 310 00:19:15,960 --> 00:19:19,960 So why d'you think that Matty might have told Gary Walker 311 00:19:19,960 --> 00:19:21,960 that you did try to stop him going? 312 00:19:22,960 --> 00:19:24,960 He's lying, I never stopped him. 313 00:19:26,640 --> 00:19:29,960 D'you know how Walker reacted? He wasn't interested, apparently. 314 00:19:30,960 --> 00:19:34,960 Saw Matt maybe a couple of times and then basically told him to fuck off. 315 00:19:34,960 --> 00:19:37,480 How did Matty take that? He got pretty cross. 316 00:19:37,480 --> 00:19:39,960 And then told me later that he threatened him. 317 00:19:39,960 --> 00:19:42,960 Threatened him how? Telling his wife who he was. 318 00:19:44,480 --> 00:19:46,320 And you never thought to mention that before? 319 00:19:47,960 --> 00:19:50,960 Well, we all thought we knew who'd done it by then, didn't we? 320 00:19:53,960 --> 00:19:56,960 John Taylor always said he was working at the time of the murder, 321 00:19:56,960 --> 00:19:59,320 and his foreman confirmed that, but, I just... 322 00:19:59,320 --> 00:20:00,960 Double check it, yeah? Yeah, will do. 323 00:20:00,960 --> 00:20:02,960 Oh, boss? Yeah? 324 00:20:02,960 --> 00:20:05,800 A message from Sally Wright to call. OK. 325 00:20:11,160 --> 00:20:13,160 Back in a bit. 326 00:20:29,640 --> 00:20:31,960 So this is dated just four months before Matthew's murder. 327 00:20:33,000 --> 00:20:34,960 And I'm guessing it got missed originally 328 00:20:34,960 --> 00:20:36,960 because it's in Beth's files and not Matty's 329 00:20:36,960 --> 00:20:39,960 and there was no obvious connection between the two, 330 00:20:39,960 --> 00:20:41,960 but, my God, it should have been spotted. 331 00:20:41,960 --> 00:20:44,960 So how old would Beth have been at the time? 332 00:20:44,960 --> 00:20:46,960 14? 333 00:20:46,960 --> 00:20:49,960 Sorry, but are you suggesting that a 14-year-old...? 334 00:20:49,960 --> 00:20:51,960 Oh, look, I'm not suggesting anything, 335 00:20:51,960 --> 00:20:54,960 I just wanted to give you the information. OK. 336 00:20:55,960 --> 00:20:57,960 You will see from the file, Beth Moss had a lot 337 00:20:57,960 --> 00:21:00,960 of pastoral input in the months, years after this. 338 00:21:00,960 --> 00:21:02,960 She's got a lot of behavioural issues. 339 00:21:04,960 --> 00:21:06,960 Some of the notes suggest her mum was a piece of work too. 340 00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:10,960 Karen Moss. 341 00:21:10,960 --> 00:21:12,480 I think it said in the original file 342 00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:14,960 that she was actually Matthew's social worker. 343 00:21:14,960 --> 00:21:16,960 Really? Yeah. 344 00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:18,160 Wow. 345 00:21:19,960 --> 00:21:23,160 OK, er... I'll look into all this, 346 00:21:23,160 --> 00:21:24,960 and I'll try and track down the teacher, 347 00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:26,960 see if he can remember anything. OK. 348 00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:30,480 And thank you for coming over, it make a real difference 349 00:21:30,480 --> 00:21:33,960 having a human connection to the case, I appreciate it. 350 00:21:36,960 --> 00:21:39,640 So... how are you doing? 351 00:21:40,640 --> 00:21:42,640 Hm. 352 00:21:43,960 --> 00:21:45,960 It's a journey. 353 00:21:45,960 --> 00:21:49,960 Well, look, if you ever fancy a cry-off or... 354 00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:52,960 tragedy top trumps, give me a shout, 355 00:21:52,960 --> 00:21:54,960 we could grab a pizza maybe. I mean, 356 00:21:54,960 --> 00:21:57,480 not as a... you know... just as... Thank you. 357 00:21:59,800 --> 00:22:02,160 I probably need to get my head into a slightly better place 358 00:22:02,160 --> 00:22:04,160 to be even half decent company, 359 00:22:04,160 --> 00:22:06,960 but when I feel a bit more sorted, yeah, I'd really like that. 360 00:22:07,960 --> 00:22:09,960 Right, great. Erm... 361 00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:15,960 I'll, er, I'll call you on this. Yeah. 362 00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:17,960 Thanks, Sally. 363 00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:23,960 PHONE VIBRATES 364 00:22:25,960 --> 00:22:28,960 Suzy. 'We've checked Walkers fingerprints 365 00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:30,480 'against the bottle that killed Matty.' 366 00:22:30,480 --> 00:22:32,960 And? We've got a match. 367 00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:34,960 I'll be right there. 368 00:22:42,800 --> 00:22:45,960 I sell Buckworth, I often stack the shelves myself 369 00:22:45,960 --> 00:22:47,960 so if my prints were on the bottle that killed him, 370 00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:49,960 all it means is... is that someone bought it from my pub. 371 00:22:49,960 --> 00:22:51,960 And by "someone" you mean? Anyone! Matthew? 372 00:22:51,960 --> 00:22:53,960 Look, how would I know? I've already said, 373 00:22:53,960 --> 00:22:55,960 I was in London on the day that he died. 374 00:22:55,960 --> 00:22:57,960 Yeah, we're still checking your alibi, 375 00:22:57,960 --> 00:22:59,960 but I want to go back over something you told us yesterday. 376 00:22:59,960 --> 00:23:01,960 When you told Matthew you couldn't see him anymore, 377 00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:04,160 you said he was fine with that? Yes. 378 00:23:04,160 --> 00:23:07,960 I mean, he was upset, of course, but he said that he understood. 379 00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:09,960 So he didn't get angry with you? No. 380 00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:11,000 Didn't threaten you at all? No! 381 00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:12,960 Didn't threaten to tell your wife who he was? 382 00:23:12,960 --> 00:23:16,160 No. We have evidence to suggest that he did. 383 00:23:16,160 --> 00:23:18,960 Well, he didn't. Look, he... He didn't! 384 00:23:20,640 --> 00:23:22,960 Look, I have let the boy down appallingly, 385 00:23:22,960 --> 00:23:25,960 I've had endless sleepless nights wondering if my behaviour 386 00:23:25,960 --> 00:23:27,960 in any way contributed to how his life ended, 387 00:23:27,960 --> 00:23:30,000 but I swear, I didn't kill him! 388 00:23:31,960 --> 00:23:33,960 Yeah, yeah, I can hold, no problem. 389 00:23:33,960 --> 00:23:37,160 And I wondered if I could ask you about a gift card purchase 390 00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:39,960 made in a Keswick shop in 2015. 391 00:23:39,960 --> 00:23:41,960 Yeah, that's right. 392 00:23:41,960 --> 00:23:45,960 So we understand you taught in St Luke's school in Keswick in 2015, 393 00:23:45,960 --> 00:23:47,960 and we just wanted to ask if we could have a brief chat 394 00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:49,960 with you at some point... Hello, there. 395 00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:51,960 Yeah, Mr Walker said he was in London, 396 00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:53,960 in a meeting with your brewery, however, so far, 397 00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:55,960 he's been unable to find any emails confirming that. 398 00:23:55,960 --> 00:23:57,960 So I was just wondering if there was any other way 399 00:23:57,960 --> 00:24:00,960 of confirming his presence there? Any internal mails... 400 00:24:03,960 --> 00:24:06,960 ..or old desk diaries, that kind of thing. 401 00:24:06,960 --> 00:24:08,960 I'm sorry, can I call you back in two minutes? 402 00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:10,960 Right, thanks, bye. 403 00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:15,960 I'm so sorry, it was a genuine mistake, 404 00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:17,960 I had two guys with the surname Taylor. 405 00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:21,960 working on that job. John Taylor, obviously... 406 00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:25,640 ..but also a Thomas Taylor. 407 00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:27,960 And looking back at it, on that specific day, 408 00:24:27,960 --> 00:24:30,960 what I thought then was a J, for John... 409 00:24:31,960 --> 00:24:34,160 I now think... 410 00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:35,960 might be a T. You think? 411 00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:40,000 It is. Right, so... 412 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:42,960 you can actually provide no definite alibi 413 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:44,960 for John Taylor on the day of the murder? 414 00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:47,960 Well, when you asked first time round, he wasn't a suspect, so... 415 00:24:49,320 --> 00:24:51,960 I never really double checked. 416 00:24:51,960 --> 00:24:53,960 But what I do know, 417 00:24:53,960 --> 00:24:56,000 is he adored that boy. 418 00:24:57,960 --> 00:25:00,320 And I can't believe for a minute 419 00:25:00,320 --> 00:25:02,960 he would ever have hurt a hair on his head. 420 00:25:16,640 --> 00:25:20,640 Where were you actually? Around town. 421 00:25:20,640 --> 00:25:22,960 After I ran out of money, 422 00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:25,960 wherever I've thought I could scrounge a can. 423 00:25:25,960 --> 00:25:27,960 Were you ever in Clement Park? 424 00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:31,480 Yes. Which we know from the original investigation, 425 00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:32,960 Matty was seen walking through, just an hour 426 00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:34,960 before his estimated time of death. 427 00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:38,960 So did you see him? Yes. 428 00:25:40,960 --> 00:25:42,960 Did you talk to him? 429 00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:46,480 Yes. 430 00:25:46,480 --> 00:25:48,960 Did you row? 431 00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:51,960 Yes. Did you then follow him? 432 00:25:53,960 --> 00:25:57,320 Why don't you just ask me? Did I kill him? 433 00:25:58,960 --> 00:26:00,960 Did you? 434 00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:04,960 Well, it was my defect that meant we couldn't have a child. 435 00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:08,960 My drinking that caused Maria's infidelity. 436 00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:13,960 My weakness that made me tell Matty he wasn't my boy. 437 00:26:15,960 --> 00:26:18,960 Now I don't know how exactly all that led to his death... 438 00:26:19,960 --> 00:26:22,960 ..but I'm pretty sure in some way it did. 439 00:26:22,960 --> 00:26:25,960 So, no, I didn't follow him, 440 00:26:25,960 --> 00:26:28,960 and I never laid a hand on him that day. 441 00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:33,800 But, yeah, I think in some way, with my failings... 442 00:26:34,960 --> 00:26:36,960 ..I did kill him. 443 00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:40,000 So you just describe a bullying incident involving Matty and Beth, 444 00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:42,800 do you remember any more detail, or...? 445 00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:47,480 Er, it was to do with him having stayed at her house once. 446 00:26:47,480 --> 00:26:49,960 Her mum was a duty social worker. Er, this was Karen Moss? 447 00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:53,960 Mm-hm, and she'd had him stay over for a couple of nights 448 00:26:53,960 --> 00:26:56,800 after he'd had a row with his dad. 449 00:26:56,800 --> 00:26:58,160 From what I could glean from him, 450 00:26:58,160 --> 00:27:01,960 he'd then seen Beth talking to some friends at school about it. 451 00:27:01,960 --> 00:27:03,960 OK, and he didn't like that? 452 00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:06,640 I think basically he felt that Beth had seen him 453 00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:09,960 at his most vulnerable, so, no, he didn't like it at all. 454 00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:12,960 And Matty Taylor was not a boy you wanted to cross. 455 00:27:12,960 --> 00:27:16,000 He was whip smart, super articulate, and he could be cruel, 456 00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:18,000 verbally, I mean. 457 00:27:18,000 --> 00:27:20,960 Very cruel. Right. 458 00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:23,000 And did you get the impression this was an isolated incident 459 00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:25,960 or do you think that...? Well, they were both 460 00:27:25,960 --> 00:27:28,960 pretty reluctant to discuss it, particularly her. 461 00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:31,960 But if I had to put money on it, I would say no, 462 00:27:31,960 --> 00:27:33,000 no, it wasn't. 463 00:27:35,160 --> 00:27:37,960 Loads on the school system about Bethany Moss 464 00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:39,480 over the last five years. 465 00:27:39,480 --> 00:27:42,960 Depression issues, anxiety issues, and then I found this. 466 00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:47,960 On the 8th June 2015, just two days before Matty's murder, 467 00:27:47,960 --> 00:27:50,000 she's admitted to St Mary's General, having taken, 468 00:27:50,000 --> 00:27:52,960 an accidental overdose of her mum's codeine. 469 00:27:52,960 --> 00:27:54,960 Accidental? Her mum told the hospital 470 00:27:54,960 --> 00:27:56,960 she'd thought they were over-the-counter herbal pills 471 00:27:56,960 --> 00:27:59,960 she sometimes gave her for stress. And how many did she take? 472 00:27:59,960 --> 00:28:01,960 Six. Who takes six stress pills? 473 00:28:01,960 --> 00:28:05,480 Well, the notes say on previous occasions she'd taken two. 474 00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:08,000 Her mum told the hospital that on this occasion she'd taken four, 475 00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:10,960 then got confused and then taken another two. 476 00:28:10,960 --> 00:28:12,960 MUTTERING Yeah, me neither. 477 00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:14,960 Which got me thinking. 478 00:28:14,960 --> 00:28:17,960 If that was my kid, and I thought Matty Taylor's bullying 479 00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:19,960 was to blame for a suicide attempt... 480 00:28:19,960 --> 00:28:22,640 Particularly when she'd given the lad a bed for a couple of nights 481 00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:24,960 just a few months prior. OK, great work. 482 00:28:24,960 --> 00:28:27,160 OK, I think we need a chat with Mum. Yeah. 483 00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:33,800 And you never heard of any bullying incident involving Matthew Taylor? 484 00:28:33,800 --> 00:28:35,320 No, sorry. 485 00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:37,960 And Bethany would say the same, would she, if we asked her? 486 00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:39,960 Of course. 487 00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:42,960 So... would you tell us, 488 00:28:42,960 --> 00:28:45,960 if you don't mind, about the incident 489 00:28:45,960 --> 00:28:48,960 that led you to taking your daughter to St Mary's General, 490 00:28:48,960 --> 00:28:50,960 two days before Matthew died? 491 00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:57,640 Er, so, I'd been taking codeine for some back pain I'd been having, 492 00:28:57,640 --> 00:29:00,800 and I'd very stupidly put the blister of pills 493 00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:01,960 in the same cupboard as some herbal pills 494 00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:04,960 I sometimes gave Beth for stress. 495 00:29:05,960 --> 00:29:07,960 She'd had a bad day at school, 496 00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:10,960 and before I got home from work, 497 00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:13,160 she'd gone to the cupboard, 498 00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:15,960 got the wrong pills out, and taken a couple. 499 00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:19,960 She was absolutely fine, I just took her to hospital as a precaution. 500 00:29:20,960 --> 00:29:22,960 Right. 501 00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:26,640 According to the hospital notes, 502 00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:29,480 she took six codeine tablets 503 00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:31,960 totalling 180 milligrams. 504 00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:35,960 Which is a potentially fatal dose for a child. 505 00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:37,960 Mm. 506 00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:43,960 We were very lucky. 507 00:29:49,960 --> 00:29:55,160 So the bad day that she'd had, what was that about? 508 00:29:55,160 --> 00:29:57,960 Oh, God, I don't remember. 509 00:29:57,960 --> 00:29:58,960 Really? 510 00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:01,000 Well, she's quite an anxious child so... 511 00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:02,960 So it was nothing to do with Matthew Taylor? 512 00:30:02,960 --> 00:30:05,960 No. He hadn't continued to bully her? 513 00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:08,960 No, she never mentioned anything like that to me. 514 00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:12,960 If a lad had done that to my child, bullied her to the point 515 00:30:12,960 --> 00:30:14,960 of taking an overdose... There wasn't an overdose. 516 00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:16,800 Especially a kid I'd let in to my own home... 517 00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:19,960 It wasn't an overdose. ..I don't know what I might do. 518 00:30:21,960 --> 00:30:24,480 SALLY: I don't know, just something suggesting 519 00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:26,960 that both Karen and Beth are now suspects. 520 00:30:26,960 --> 00:30:29,800 I can't do that, Sally! Why not? 521 00:30:29,800 --> 00:30:31,960 Because I just... I can't just make shit up. 522 00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:33,960 But you're a journalist. 523 00:30:33,960 --> 00:30:35,960 Funny. No, come on, 524 00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:38,480 you saw what the tabloids wrote about me. 525 00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:40,960 Well, exactly, it'd be a bit ironic 526 00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:43,960 if we now started to publish random, wild theories, 527 00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:45,960 particularly about a school kid. Oh, she's 19. 528 00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:48,000 Sal... All I'm asking you to do, Jen, 529 00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:50,960 is put their names out there and see what comes back from your readers, 530 00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:52,960 and that's exactly what you did with me... 531 00:30:52,960 --> 00:30:54,960 Even if I agreed with you, that is not how you do things! 532 00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:56,960 You owe me, Jenny! 533 00:30:56,960 --> 00:30:59,960 You owe me. 534 00:30:59,960 --> 00:31:02,960 In fact, this whole fucking town owes me. 535 00:31:02,960 --> 00:31:05,960 Sal, what you went through, 536 00:31:05,960 --> 00:31:07,960 that anger you must feel, every day, for what you lost... 537 00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:10,160 I didn't lose any thing! 538 00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:13,960 I lost nothing! 539 00:31:13,960 --> 00:31:17,960 It was taken away from me, it was fucking... 540 00:31:17,960 --> 00:31:19,960 stolen from me! 541 00:31:19,960 --> 00:31:22,640 I completely get it, OK. But this? 542 00:31:22,640 --> 00:31:24,800 This is not the way forward. 543 00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:28,960 This is not going to make you feel any better. 544 00:31:30,960 --> 00:31:32,960 SOBBING: Then what is then, Jen?! 545 00:31:38,960 --> 00:31:40,960 I mean it. 546 00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:42,960 You need to be honest with me, Karen, you really do. 547 00:31:45,960 --> 00:31:49,960 He had been so horrible to her. 548 00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:51,960 For nearly four months, she told me afterwards. 549 00:31:51,960 --> 00:31:53,960 And for no reason. 550 00:31:53,960 --> 00:31:55,960 He thought she'd talked about the nights he'd spent here 551 00:31:55,960 --> 00:31:57,800 but she hadn't. 552 00:31:57,800 --> 00:31:59,960 And it didn't matter how many times she told him that she hadn't, 553 00:31:59,960 --> 00:32:03,320 he still went at her. Every day. 554 00:32:03,320 --> 00:32:08,480 For 16 weeks solid, he made her life a complete misery. 555 00:32:08,480 --> 00:32:10,480 And I came home late from work one day 556 00:32:10,480 --> 00:32:12,960 and found her lying on her bed, half unconscious. 557 00:32:18,000 --> 00:32:21,960 And at the hospital, she told me... 558 00:32:21,960 --> 00:32:23,960 that it was an accident, but I knew it wasn't. 559 00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:29,960 And then the next morning, she finally told me... 560 00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:31,960 what Matty had be subjecting her to. 561 00:32:33,960 --> 00:32:37,960 The next day, I left her with my mum 562 00:32:37,960 --> 00:32:42,640 and I went to speak to him at his house. 563 00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:44,960 But he wasn't there, it was just his mum. 564 00:32:45,960 --> 00:32:47,960 And you spoke to her? I did, but I... 565 00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:51,960 I said it was work related, I just wanted a general catch-up. 566 00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:54,000 And then I left. 567 00:32:55,960 --> 00:32:57,960 And that's all that happened, I promise. 568 00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:05,960 I don't believe you. 569 00:33:05,960 --> 00:33:07,960 I promise. 570 00:33:13,480 --> 00:33:16,960 You need to tell me the truth, Karen, now, 571 00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:18,960 or I swear I'm walking out that fucking door 572 00:33:18,960 --> 00:33:20,960 and you'll never see me again. 573 00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:27,960 On my way back from his mum's, I saw him in the street. 574 00:33:27,960 --> 00:33:31,960 And? And I wanted to walk past. 575 00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:35,960 Because by this point, I'd realised that what I was doing was wrong, 576 00:33:35,960 --> 00:33:37,960 and it could cost me my job, 577 00:33:37,960 --> 00:33:40,960 so I went to walk past but then he saw me, 578 00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:43,960 and it was him who stopped, and it was him who started shouting at me, 579 00:33:43,960 --> 00:33:45,960 drunk, and saying stuff about Beth, 580 00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:48,320 laughing about what a "fat, ugly pig" she was 581 00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:50,960 and something inside me just snapped 582 00:33:50,960 --> 00:33:53,640 and I, I... I lost it a bit, I admit that. 583 00:33:57,960 --> 00:34:01,960 And so I crossed over and I shouted right back at him. 584 00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:04,000 I might even have grabbed him, I can't remember, 585 00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:07,960 it was all a bit of a blur, and... but, but, then I realised 586 00:34:07,960 --> 00:34:11,640 that I was being very stupid, 587 00:34:11,640 --> 00:34:15,960 and I turned and walked away. And that really is it. 588 00:34:15,960 --> 00:34:18,160 And you didn't follow him? Absolutely not. 589 00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:25,960 OK. 590 00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:27,000 You have to tell the police, Karen. 591 00:34:28,960 --> 00:34:30,960 What? You have to tell the police. 592 00:34:32,960 --> 00:34:35,960 I'm not telling the police. If you grabbed hold of him, 593 00:34:35,960 --> 00:34:38,960 if you had any contact with him at all, 594 00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:41,960 they might have found some stuff on his body 595 00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:44,960 that can connect you to him. Hairs, fibres, whatever. 596 00:34:47,960 --> 00:34:52,800 So... you need to tell them what actually happened. 597 00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:56,960 Because if they find all this out for themselves, 598 00:34:56,960 --> 00:34:59,320 I mean, they could come to all the wrong conclusions. 599 00:35:00,800 --> 00:35:01,960 No. 600 00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:04,960 You have to tell them, love, you have to. 601 00:35:14,960 --> 00:35:16,160 There you go. Lovely, thanks. 602 00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:18,320 Have a good day. 603 00:35:18,320 --> 00:35:20,640 PHONE RINGING 604 00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:29,960 Hello. 'Hey, Sally. 605 00:35:29,960 --> 00:35:31,960 'Just wondering why you didn't mention...' 606 00:35:31,960 --> 00:35:33,960 Bethany's mother is with your ex-husband? 607 00:35:36,960 --> 00:35:39,960 Because I didn't think that was relevant. 'Right.' 608 00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:41,960 'But now you mention it, I'm sorry, 609 00:35:41,960 --> 00:35:44,000 'yes, maybe I should have.' OK. 610 00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:47,960 'Maybe, let me be the judge of what is or isn't relevant.' 611 00:35:47,960 --> 00:35:50,480 Bye, Sally. 612 00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:06,960 Hey. 613 00:36:24,960 --> 00:36:27,960 It was never meant to end like it did. 614 00:36:27,960 --> 00:36:30,960 And how was it meant to end? 615 00:36:33,960 --> 00:36:36,000 Was there really nothing going on between you, ever? 616 00:36:37,960 --> 00:36:39,960 No, Anna, never. 617 00:36:41,640 --> 00:36:43,960 Never. 618 00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:46,960 The thing is, I did genuinely believe there was. 619 00:36:48,960 --> 00:36:51,960 That's... that's the only reason I made the kiss up. 620 00:36:54,960 --> 00:36:56,960 To get you sacked so it would stop. 621 00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:03,960 And then he was killed. 622 00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:06,960 And everything suddenly moved so fast. 623 00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:10,960 So, I am... 624 00:37:13,960 --> 00:37:15,960 ..sorry. 625 00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:18,960 But least one of us is free now. 626 00:37:31,960 --> 00:37:33,960 PHONE VIBRATING 627 00:37:44,960 --> 00:37:48,960 Hiya, Dave, everything OK? Yeah, sorry to call so late, boss. 628 00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:52,960 But Mills Brewery have forwarded four emails 629 00:37:52,960 --> 00:37:54,960 confirming Gary Walker arrived for a meeting 630 00:37:54,960 --> 00:37:58,960 in their Hammersmith office at 4pm on the day of the murder. 631 00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:00,640 Now, the meeting lasts an hour, 632 00:38:00,640 --> 00:38:02,960 and it's approximately five hours door to door 633 00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:03,960 back to the murder scene. 634 00:38:03,960 --> 00:38:06,160 Right, so he's completely in the clear. 635 00:38:06,160 --> 00:38:08,960 Yeah, looks like it. 636 00:38:08,960 --> 00:38:10,960 All right, thanks for letting me know, mate. 637 00:38:10,960 --> 00:38:12,800 All right, bye. 638 00:39:27,960 --> 00:39:30,480 Right, so what I don't understand 639 00:39:30,480 --> 00:39:32,960 is how can a kid with those kind of issues 640 00:39:32,960 --> 00:39:34,960 not appear on the radar of social services? 641 00:39:34,960 --> 00:39:36,960 Or at the very least an ed pysch department? 642 00:39:36,960 --> 00:39:40,320 I don't know, but Karen Moss would have had access 643 00:39:40,320 --> 00:39:42,960 to her daughter's records in her professional capacity. 644 00:39:42,960 --> 00:39:44,960 What, you think she could have deleted them? 645 00:39:44,960 --> 00:39:48,960 Why not, if they suggested some sort of trail back to Matty Taylor? 646 00:39:48,960 --> 00:39:50,960 Er, sorry to interrupt, Boss. 647 00:39:50,960 --> 00:39:53,960 Sam Wright's downstairs, says he needs to speak to you. 648 00:39:53,960 --> 00:39:55,480 Cheers. 649 00:39:55,480 --> 00:39:57,960 Right, see you in a bit. 650 00:39:59,160 --> 00:40:01,960 Hey. Hi, Sam Wright. 651 00:40:01,960 --> 00:40:03,960 DCI Braithwaite. Thanks, Grace. 652 00:40:03,960 --> 00:40:05,960 Do you want to, er... Yeah. 653 00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:10,960 OK, I know... 654 00:40:10,960 --> 00:40:15,800 Unequivocally, I know that my fiancee would never hurt a fly. 655 00:40:16,960 --> 00:40:19,960 But, er... 656 00:40:19,960 --> 00:40:22,960 she's not been entirely honest with you. 657 00:40:22,960 --> 00:40:24,160 For very understandable reasons, 658 00:40:24,160 --> 00:40:27,960 she thinks you would put two and two together and make five. 659 00:40:27,960 --> 00:40:29,480 But I think she's wrong to think that. 660 00:40:30,960 --> 00:40:33,960 So after a long discussion with her... 661 00:40:35,960 --> 00:40:37,960 and she's across all of this... 662 00:40:39,960 --> 00:40:41,960 ..I am here to tell you the truth. 663 00:40:50,960 --> 00:40:52,960 So, just to confirm, 664 00:40:52,960 --> 00:40:56,960 as per your original witness statement, Mr Holmes, 665 00:40:56,960 --> 00:41:02,000 approximately 5:35 to 5:50, 666 00:41:02,000 --> 00:41:04,960 Mr Wright was with you in a probation meeting 667 00:41:04,960 --> 00:41:06,960 in your flat in Castleton. Yeah. 668 00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:13,960 Are you double checking everyone or just Sam Wright? 669 00:41:18,960 --> 00:41:21,960 Yeah, well, no, I just wanted to confirm 670 00:41:21,960 --> 00:41:24,000 how many that you were asked to check? 671 00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:26,960 'Four.' Definitely? Four? 672 00:41:26,960 --> 00:41:29,960 'Yeah, yeah, I have the original notes in front of me, 673 00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:32,640 'four cards, all, unfortunately for you guys, 674 00:41:32,640 --> 00:41:35,960 'paid for with cash.' Yeah, no, well, so, listen, 675 00:41:35,960 --> 00:41:37,960 I mean, it looks like it was a bollocks this end 676 00:41:37,960 --> 00:41:40,320 and there were actually five cards, 677 00:41:40,320 --> 00:41:41,960 two were stuck together. 678 00:41:41,960 --> 00:41:45,320 Erm, anyways, so if I... if I give you all five numbers now, 679 00:41:45,320 --> 00:41:47,960 whichever one is not on your list, can you check it out for me, please? 680 00:41:47,960 --> 00:41:51,960 'Yeah, sure.' So, OK, "DF45..." 681 00:42:06,960 --> 00:42:09,320 No. I had no encounter with him. 682 00:42:10,960 --> 00:42:13,960 Right, so, why do you think 683 00:42:13,960 --> 00:42:17,960 your fiancee... told me that you did? 684 00:42:25,960 --> 00:42:28,320 Erm... 685 00:42:28,320 --> 00:42:30,960 I have no idea why he'd say such a thing. 686 00:42:30,960 --> 00:42:33,960 Well, we've also just spoken to Maria Taylor, 687 00:42:33,960 --> 00:42:36,160 and she has now confirmed she remembers you knocking on her door 688 00:42:36,160 --> 00:42:38,960 that day, asking after her son. 689 00:42:38,960 --> 00:42:40,960 Despite never having mentioned this before. 690 00:42:40,960 --> 00:42:42,960 Well, she was obviously in a state of shock, 691 00:42:42,960 --> 00:42:44,960 right after her son was brutally murdered. 692 00:42:45,960 --> 00:42:48,640 By the time she'd started to think at all rationally, 693 00:42:48,640 --> 00:42:50,960 Sally Wright had been charged. 694 00:42:50,960 --> 00:42:52,960 It never occurred to her to mention a 30-second exchange 695 00:42:52,960 --> 00:42:54,960 on her doorstep with his social worker. 696 00:42:54,960 --> 00:42:57,960 Well, she's lying. Cos I didn't go looking for him. 697 00:43:00,960 --> 00:43:03,960 It would be perfectly understandable, Karen, 698 00:43:03,960 --> 00:43:06,160 for you to have been mad with Matthew. 699 00:43:08,640 --> 00:43:11,000 I mean, what would any of us do to protect our children? 700 00:43:14,960 --> 00:43:17,960 Maybe this was just a moment of madness. 701 00:43:17,960 --> 00:43:18,960 No. 702 00:43:22,320 --> 00:43:24,960 I never saw him that day. 703 00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:29,960 There are numerous fibres taken from Matthew's clothing after he died. 704 00:43:29,960 --> 00:43:32,960 Hitherto unidentified hairs caught up in his school jumper and coat. 705 00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:34,960 Would you be happy for us check those against you? 706 00:43:36,640 --> 00:43:37,960 Yeah. 707 00:43:41,960 --> 00:43:43,960 Right hand. 708 00:44:13,960 --> 00:44:15,960 I don't know what to say any more, Sally. 709 00:44:15,960 --> 00:44:18,960 I've just got so much wrong and... 710 00:44:20,960 --> 00:44:22,960 I wonder if you can ever forgive me. 711 00:44:24,960 --> 00:44:26,960 Come in. 712 00:44:36,960 --> 00:44:39,960 PHONE RINGING 713 00:44:42,960 --> 00:44:45,960 'Hi, this is Sam Wright. Please leave a message.' 714 00:44:47,160 --> 00:44:48,960 All right, mate? 715 00:44:48,960 --> 00:44:53,960 It's Aaron... Holmes. Remember me? 716 00:44:58,960 --> 00:45:01,960 Listen, fella, give us a call some time, will ya? 717 00:45:03,960 --> 00:45:06,480 I think we need to have a little chat. 718 00:45:11,960 --> 00:45:14,960 I am not taking any lectures from you. 719 00:45:14,960 --> 00:45:16,960 I know where you were last night. 720 00:45:16,960 --> 00:45:18,960 ALARM BELLS RING 721 00:45:19,960 --> 00:45:21,960 This has to be for keeps, Sam. 722 00:45:21,960 --> 00:45:24,480 Why would you go to all that trouble... 723 00:45:24,480 --> 00:45:26,960 unless you had something to hide? 724 00:45:26,960 --> 00:45:29,480 This can't be about Karen any more. 725 00:45:29,480 --> 00:45:31,640 I won't be anyone's second best, Sam. 726 00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:32,960 Least of all yours. 727 00:45:32,960 --> 00:45:34,960 I'm sorry, Guv, but you're gonna want to see this. 728 00:45:37,000 --> 00:45:39,160 Subtitles by accessibility@itv.com 56736

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