All language subtitles for FBI True Season - 5 episode 1

- This is Ammon Bundy.

I normally do not do, you know,
a quick video like this.

But I felt it very important
that I do it

because of the circumstances.

- For many decades,
Cliven Bundy had been grazing

his cattle on federal land.

And he decided, I'm not going
to pay my grazing fees anymore.

We're talking
millions of dollars.

- And suddenly, you went from
this is a cattle issue--

--to you have somebody
in an overpass

with a scoped high-power rifle,

pointing it at a federal agent.

- Long gun.
Sidearm.

These guys are
coming on display.

They're calling
for people to come.

- We need your help.

- They're looking for a fight.

- We don't have the numbers.

And this is going
to be a bad outcome.

- In the FBI, we make
a lot of headlines.

# #

Drug busts,

mob stings,

terrorist takedowns.

- Get down! Get down!

- We understand why people
want to tell stories about us.

- Mark it.

- Freeze!
- FBI.

- FBI!
- Action!

- But they don't know
the half of it.

What really goes down,

we save that for each other

when we're talking
agent-to-agent.

# #

This is "FBI True."

- Explain to me
what Bunkerville is.

- Kristy Kottis is a
24-year veteran of the FBI.

She worked gangs,
crimes against children,

as well as human
and drug trafficking.

- What happened in Bunkerville
was something that

had been boiling for decades.

# #

Cliven Bundy had been
running his ranch

and grazing his cattle

on federal land
for many decades.

- Greg Bretzing followed
in his father's footsteps

when he joined the FBI
in 1995.

He retired as special agent
in charge of the

Portland, Oregon
field office.

- And at some point in time,
Cliven Bundy decided,

I'm not going to pay my
grazing fees anymore.

And case after case went to
federal court in which he lost

and was ordered to pay back
fees, pay interest,

or get his cattle
off the land.

And every time,
he refused to do so.

- So, Eric, when are you first
hearing about Bunkerville?

- It's back at headquarters,
actually on the Seventh Floor.

But I'd spent enough time
in my career out West

that I was familiar with the
territory, some of the issues.

Can the federal
government own land,

land rights, grazing rights?

It's sort of woven into
a lot of the Western states,

that relationship between
the federal government,

in this case, and people
that live and work the land.

- Eric Barnhart was a senior
advisor to the FBI director

before becoming special agent
in charge of

the Salt Lake City
field office.

- What about you, Greg?

- Well, I was a brand-new SAC
in Portland, Oregon.

And when we heard what was
going on down in Bunkerville

and the Bundys,
we knew we had some

of these same characters in
our division, in our territory.

So we watched it very closely,
the way it progressed,

the way it escalated.

- Tim, what about you?

Where were you when
Bunkerville started?

- I was in Eugene.

And my primary role was working
domestic terrorism cases.

- Tim Suttles was an
FBI crisis negotiation leader

with the Portland, Oregon,
field office.

- So when we're
talking grazing fees,

what are we talking about?

- We're talking millions
of dollars that were

back-owed to the government.

He's also putting too many
cattle out on the land.

They're destroying the land.

I think it was 1993 when
he paid his last

grazing fees to the government.

- So finally, in 2014,
the Bureau of Land Management

decided to take enforcement
action and got a federal judge,

sign a warrant that
allowed them to go

and collect the cattle that was
illegally grazing on the land,

which, of course, the Bundys
didn't take too kindly to it.

- Well, I've fought
this thing legally.

I fought it politically.

I fought it through the media.

And I will fight it on
the ground if I have to.

- They paint themselves out
as the small guy--

- Right.

- --being put upon by this
big federal government

that's heavy handed,

that's taking away
their rights.

- They start with
the premise of what

they want for themselves.

And then they go
through the buffet

and pick out things that
will support their case.

And most of the time,
it's fringe thinking,

to include federal
government doesn't

have the right to own land.

And it gets to just
the self-feeding.

And it's so hard to unwind.

- Did you guys quickly realize
that the FBI

would be getting involved
in this situation?

- BLM let us know what they
were going to be doing.

We knew they would be
executing a search warrant.

We knew that date,
the time, the location.

The BLM, working
together with others,

executed the search warrant,
advised the Bundys

that they were going
to collect the cattle,

and over a period
of several days,

began operations and sent
agents and officers out

to round up the
cattle and bring them

to a central
location where they

could then take that cattle,
cart it off,

and take it to auction.

And during that timeframe,
the Bundys, Cliven,

the dad, the patriarch
of the group,

and his sons, Ammon and Ryan--

Did a social media
campaign calling for help.

Asking militia members,
like-minded individuals,

to come and help them.

And it was always
bring your guns.

Bring your guns.

Come help us and
bring your guns.

They're calling for people
to come, and, in essence,

they're looking for a fight.

- We could monitor
social media.

We could see there was a
lot of people responding.

And, hey, I'll be there.
You know, I'm on my way.

It escalated really quick.

# #

- But over days,
you could see

more and more militia
showing up.

# #

- We're not talking about guys
coming with a concealed weapon.

We're talking about people
coming fully kitted out.

What does that look like?

- Long gun.
Bulletproof vest.

Side arm.
Extra magazines.

These guys are coming
on display, so not only

are there to pick a fight,
but they want to be on display

while they're doing it.

And it's important to remember,
when you call for help,

you're not picking
who you're calling.

You won't know who's coming.

But you tell them,
come and bring your guns,

and there's no way
you can control

what they're going to do.

- A lot of militias showed up.

There was a lot of
angst in that area,

you know, agents
being followed.

BLM agents were being harassed.

And there was guns
pointed at each other.

- I still remember very
clearly an individual lying

on an overpass with his long
gun in a sniper-prone position,

pointing that weapon
at the BLM officers.

- And you have no idea what
sort of discipline they have,

how that person is seeing
through the reticle.

What's going to cause them
to pull that trigger?

This person could be here
for a very bad reason.

- I know personally
the supervisor

in charge of that operation.

When they're pointing that
weapon at those officers,

they're pointing
at people we know.

And you can just imagine
what they're feeling,

with people and guns
shouting at them

as they're coming in and out
of the area

where they're collecting
the cattle.

It's their command post.

- Get back!
Get back!

- And it's basically
surrounded.

It evolved from
a law enforcement operation,

as Eric said,
to collect cattle,

to a near riot
almost overnight.

# #

- It was all hands on deck for
a lot of the surrounding areas.

The Portland division,

Las Vegas, California,

Salt Lake,

to dive into human intelligence,

dive into social
media intelligence,

because we need to find
a way to tamp this down

and deescalate it somehow.

all: No BLM!

No BLM!

No BLM!

- About three days in,
the confrontation with BLM

comes to a point where
Ammon Bundy is tased.

And that escalated
the confrontation

greatly at that point.

- Back up!
Back up!

- It lit social media on fire.

- I think he got the outcome
that he wanted.

It was a rallying cry.

- A real Wild West showdown,
federal agents

clashing with protesters, some
from armed militia groups,

who are arriving now from
all over the country.

- What are you seeing from
a case agent standpoint?

- Now, you're seeing a lot
more people head that way.

We were starting to
hear intelligence

from all over the country,

militias in Arkansas
and Florida heading that way.

- They're looking for
that viral moment.

- No BLM!

- Tell the American public
what you just saw, dude.

- Enemy aggressors.
This is the road I grew up on.

- They're looking for that spark
that they can use

to fan their flame
of discontent.

- Tell them what they did.
- They threw me to the dirt.

- And then they're
going to exploit it.

- Then I got hit twice.

Oh, my gosh, there's blood.

- They have it escalated so high

that they're now forcing
this confrontation.

They're in the faces
of the BLM officers.

They're antagonizing them.
They're taunting them.

They're not obeying
a lawful order

to the point where they start
heading to the pen

to start letting out the cattle.

# #

- We don't have the numbers.

And they're not
going to respect

our authority to be here.

- This is going to
be a bad outcome.

# #

- And on the federal
government side,

bringing more numbers in wasn't
an option at this point either.

Tempers were high.

Hey, hey, hey!

- There were already out there
a large number of armed people,

aching for a fight.

# #

This was a fight that was
going to be won another day.

And in order to avoid
bloodshed and a shootout

and innocent parties or
guilty parties being hurt,

a decision was made.

BLM officers gathered
their stuff and drive out.

# #

And of course, they're doing it
to the chorus of cheers

and applause
as they have driven

the federal government away,
and they kept their cattle.

- When it ended, I knew

that this was going to
give a lot of steam

to the militia movement

because they just beat
the U.S. government.

- We're going to kick
the BLM out of the state.

Kick all the other federal
agencies out of the state

that aren't authorized
to be here.

- They just won.

# #

- A week-long battle
between a cattle rancher

and federal officers
comes to a sudden end.

- What did they agree
to today, though?

- They agreed to
get out of here.

- When you get pictures
of the BLM agents

collecting their gear,
putting in their trucks,

and speeding out--

- There they go.

- --that is a picture-perfect
victory for the Bundys.

- Good morning, America!

- Cliven now has
a bigger pulpit.

He continues to give
interviews and tell his story,

get the narrative out there.

- 20 years ago, I could see
that the federal government,

the Bureau of Land Management,
the Forest Service,

the Park Service,
these people were only--

their only desire
was to eliminate

us ranchers off this land.

- But then he imploded
once he started

to opine on some
horrific views on race.

- I'm wondering,
Cliven Bundy is wondering,

about these people.

Now, I'm talking about
the Black community.

- And as quickly as
he came on the scene

and was given his moment
in the sun,

his true colors came out.

- And I've often wondered,
are they better off as slaves,

picking cotton and having
family life and doing things,

or are they better off
under government subsidy?

- And I think that was
the end of his media tour.

- That is when the leadership
of the Bundy family

transitioned from
Cliven Bundy, patriarch,

and firmly taken over
by his son, Ammon Bundy.

- And Ammon Bundy has
a more charismatic

"aw shucks" sort of person.

But I think what you had is,
you know, he could

be maybe the new messenger

now that the old man
had flamed out.

- Ammon Bundy took that as
an opportunity to proselyte.

And he took that story,

and he had a speaking tour
throughout the West.

He was in Idaho.

He was in Utah.
He went through Nevada.

And he told this story.

- But months and months,
then a year,

and then a year and a half
go by,

and no charges are brought.

So that then
leaves them emboldened

and looking for
their next fight.

- In an unrelated matter, in
June 2012, two Oregon ranchers,

Dwight and Steven Hammond were
convicted of committing arson

on federal land
in Harney County.

- And the fires set
by the Hammonds,

fires that
they admitted setting,

they put people's lives
at risk,

including the BLM firefighters.

- The Hammonds were
convicted of lighting

a fire that spread
to federal land

in protest over
cattle grazing rights.

- And the judge sentenced them.

There's a five-year
mandatory minimum

for arson of federal property.

He sentenced them
to less than that.

So that was appealed.

The appellate
court finally made

a decision in like
October of 2015,

said, no, the judge erred.

You need to serve the
rest of your five years

to both of them.

- Two Oregon ranchers
must go back

to prison for starting fires
that burned on federal land,

even though they already
served time for the charges.

- I don't know what to say.

It's just seems like
a little overreach

for having burned 127 acres.

- The Bundys were looking
for a rallying cry.

This was their rallying cry.

They were going to go
protect the Hammonds.

The Hammonds were supposed
to report to prison

to finish their sentence
on January 4 of 2016.

So in October of 15,
the Bundys start showing up.

# #

- These abuses to the Hammonds

will continue
to go on and on and on

if they are not put to an end
at this time.

- I spoke to Dave Ward.

Dave Ward was the sheriff
of Harney County.

And shortly after Ammon Bundy
and his brother

came into Burns,
they visited him in his office.

And Dave Ward told me,
initially,

they were very complimentary.

They let him know that he was
the sheriff of the county.

He was the highest elected
law enforcement official,

that it was his duty
to stand up and protect

these poor people,
the Hammonds,

who were being unfairly
treated by

an oppressive
federal government.

And Sheriff Ward said,
as long as I'm nodding

and just listening,
they're very kind.

You know,
they're very, very polite.

As soon as the sheriff said,

yeah,
I'm not going to do that,

Sheriff Ward said it was
remarkable how quickly

it went from polite and kind
to threatening.

And if you're not
going to do your job,

we'll do your job for you.

- They were pushing
for the sheriff

to protect the Hammonds because
he's the highest official

in the land because
they don't recognize

the federal government.

He has a duty to
protect them,

to keep them from going to jail.

- How far away from Burns
did the Bundys live?

- By car, eight-hour drive.

- They're eight hours
from their home.

- Yeah.

- And they've decided
to come into Burns,

speak to the sheriff there,
tell him his job.

- Right.

They're proposing to defy
the federal government,

to keep the Hammonds
from turning themselves

into the point of even
barricading them in their house

and preventing federal marshals
from taking them,

as if that was ever the plan.
- Right.

- But they were offended on
the part of a third party

that wanted really
no part of this.

- Right.

- The Hammonds
didn't want this.

- The plan was for them to
turn themselves in peacefully.

And they wanted to
interrupt that plan.

And, again, they're always
looking for that confrontation.

I like to call it,
they're looking for

the federal foil, somebody
they can push up against.

And that's what they're
trying to instigate.

- So when the
Hammonds didn't work,

and the Hammonds weren't as
cooperative as they would like,

they had to pivot
to something else.

- Ammon Bundy here.

There's been a lot of rumor
bouncing around about

what's going on
in Harney County.

And I am wanting to talk to
the individual, to the patriot,

that this is not a time
to stand down.

It is a time to stand up
and come to Harney County.

We need your help.

You need to get to Burns
on the 2nd or before.

We need your help.
Thank you.

- I remember I was dropping
my daughter off at the airport

to send her back to college,
January 2.

Been through a nice holidays.
New Year's is over.

She's on her way back.

And as I'm dropping her off on
the curb, my phone is ringing.

And it's the sheriff,

letting me know the Bundys,

still trying to cloak
themselves in the Hammond cause,

they organize
a parade and rally

in support of the
Hammonds before they turn

themselves in on January 4.

And the parade was, by all
accounts, largely peaceful.

A lot of people displaying
weapons and flags.

It made its way through
town and ended up

in the Safeway parking lot.

And that is where Ammon Bundy
gets up on his soapbox.

- For those that
understand that they

came to make a hard stand--

- Has a bunch of things to say.

- --those that know what's
going on here and have seen it

for many, many,
many, many years,

those who are ready to actually
do something about it.

- And towards the end, announces
that they're heading off

to the Malheur National
Wildlife Refuge.

And he calls on those there

to follow him out there
to take it over.

- I'm asking you to follow me

and go to the Malheur National
Wildlife Refuge.

And we're going to
make a hard stand.

- We've been watching
these guys now for months.

We saw what happened
in Bunkerville.

- No BLM!
- You need to leave.

- But we had no idea
that it was

in their plans to head out to
the refuge and take it over.

I don't think
anybody there knew

that this was Ammon's plan.

So they enter
the Wildlife Refuge--

# #

And start moving
into the offices,

start repositioning vehicles,

and start setting up
a defensive perimeter.

- Man, the people
better wake up,

get here,
and fight for your country!

Right now!

- We're not going to
fall into the same trap

that happened in Bunkerville.

- We need you to
bring your arms.

And we need you to come to

the Malheur National
Wildlife Refuge.

- They put armed men
in a 100-foot fire tower

with sniper rifles.

They took fire practice.

- Fire!

- The folks at the refuge said
if we can kidnap an FBI agent

we can end this on our terms.

- # What you gonna do #

# When the militia comes
after you, FBI? #