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It was a woman, and she was
laying on her folded clothes.
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00:00:12,054 --> 00:00:13,881
The Lady of the Dunes case
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00:00:13,882 --> 00:00:19,756
was one of the most notorious
unresolved homicides.
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00:00:19,757 --> 00:00:23,630
Chief Meads believed
if we could identify her,
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00:00:23,631 --> 00:00:26,589
it would immediately take us
to her killer.
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They had thrown away
the evidence.
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00:00:28,810 --> 00:00:32,684
I remember thinking to myself,
I'm back at square one.
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00:00:42,520 --> 00:00:45,393
I worked on this case
for 20 years.
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00:00:46,916 --> 00:00:52,746
When I retired, it was
difficult giving up the case.
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00:00:52,747 --> 00:00:56,315
There would be nights
I'd put my head on the pillow
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00:00:56,316 --> 00:00:58,404
and be thinking about it.
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00:00:58,405 --> 00:01:01,061
And thinking about
how to solve it.
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00:01:03,715 --> 00:01:07,195
I couldn't just let it go.
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00:01:07,196 --> 00:01:13,027
And as the years went by,
the mystique grew.
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The Lady of the Dunes, the,
I'll even say the legend of it.
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I didn't think it would
100% be solved,
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00:01:22,385 --> 00:01:24,473
but I never gave up hope.
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00:01:24,474 --> 00:01:30,218
To solve this case
was going to take someone
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with as much determination
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00:01:33,657 --> 00:01:37,227
as Chief Meads and myself
to take over.
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We did not make any headway.
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Until Meredith came along.
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00:02:14,134 --> 00:02:16,308
I spent well over a decade
working
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00:02:16,309 --> 00:02:19,746
as a criminal defense attorney.
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00:02:19,747 --> 00:02:23,229
I was a public defender
in primarily Boston.
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00:02:25,841 --> 00:02:29,669
And keep in mind, this was
Boston in the '80s and '90s.
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00:02:29,670 --> 00:02:32,630
And a lot of things
were suspect.
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00:02:35,242 --> 00:02:37,503
There were instances
of investigators looking
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00:02:37,504 --> 00:02:42,986
to close cases and not look for
the actual perpetrator.
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The victims are really not
the primary focus of the system,
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and I thought maybe I could make
some sort of difference.
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So I became a detective.
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00:02:58,786 --> 00:03:04,401
Came down to Provincetown and
was hired in January of 2011.
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00:03:05,837 --> 00:03:10,015
I took over the Lady of
the Dunes investigation.
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00:03:10,625 --> 00:03:13,843
The first thing I did
was scan the case file,
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00:03:13,844 --> 00:03:17,760
every bit of paper,
every little pink message
37
00:03:17,761 --> 00:03:21,940
that came in
for Chief Tobias or Chief Meads.
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It was daunting.
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I have this 38-year-old case,
and now she's my responsibility.
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00:03:32,690 --> 00:03:34,690
I began working
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00:03:34,691 --> 00:03:37,911
with the National Association
of the Missing and Unidentified.
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00:03:37,912 --> 00:03:41,741
It's basically a repository
of all the missing persons
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00:03:41,742 --> 00:03:44,439
that have been reported
and the unidentified bodies
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00:03:44,440 --> 00:03:48,095
that have been found,
so that when anyone
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00:03:48,096 --> 00:03:51,970
is looking for a loved one,
they can submit DNA samples.
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00:03:54,059 --> 00:03:58,281
And the ultimate hope is that
there would be a familial match.
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00:04:08,030 --> 00:04:10,509
In 2012,
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00:04:10,510 --> 00:04:14,643
I received a call from a police
department in California.
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00:04:14,644 --> 00:04:16,950
They were going through
their cold cases
50
00:04:16,951 --> 00:04:20,519
and came across the case
of missing persons
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00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:24,087
Stephen Packard
and Linda Lovell.
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00:04:24,088 --> 00:04:28,222
They came to Provincetown
during the summer of 1974
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00:04:28,223 --> 00:04:30,487
at the beginning of July.
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00:04:31,619 --> 00:04:35,273
They were last seen
hitchhiking out of Provincetown.
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00:04:35,274 --> 00:04:38,321
They were never seen again.
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00:04:39,453 --> 00:04:43,761
This is the most promising lead
we've had probably ever.
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00:04:48,026 --> 00:04:51,419
We made arrangements
to have Linda Lovell's
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00:04:51,420 --> 00:04:55,599
mother's DNA taken and examined.
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00:04:56,252 --> 00:04:59,951
Hopefully there would be a match
from the Lady of the Dunes.
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00:05:00,778 --> 00:05:04,258
Chief Tobias had brought DNA
into this.
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00:05:04,259 --> 00:05:09,004
Being able to pick it up at
that point was a huge advantage.
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00:05:10,614 --> 00:05:15,619
Fortunately, DNA was making
progressions at that time.
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00:05:16,968 --> 00:05:22,407
An exhumation had been done
around 2000 by Chief Tobias.
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00:05:22,408 --> 00:05:25,627
I knew that a sample
from that exhumation
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00:05:25,628 --> 00:05:28,761
had been sent
to Dr. Bruce Jackson,
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00:05:28,762 --> 00:05:32,939
the foremost geneticist
probably in the world.
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00:05:32,940 --> 00:05:36,682
And I knew a DNA profile
of the Lady of the Dunes
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00:05:36,683 --> 00:05:40,860
had gone to
the medical examiner's office,
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00:05:40,861 --> 00:05:43,602
and the medical examiner's
office had sent DNA
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00:05:43,603 --> 00:05:47,347
to the lab of Dr. Bruce Budowle.
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00:05:48,173 --> 00:05:52,090
He founded the FBI's DNA lab.
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00:05:53,657 --> 00:05:56,354
My contact at NamUs,
Lori Bruski,
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00:05:56,355 --> 00:05:58,051
took a look at the profile
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00:05:58,052 --> 00:06:01,054
Dr. Jackson had
for the Lady of the Dunes.
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00:06:01,055 --> 00:06:03,578
Because she is very thorough,
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00:06:03,579 --> 00:06:07,016
she also went
and pulled the profile
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00:06:07,017 --> 00:06:10,500
Dr. Budowle had
for the Lady of the Dunes.
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00:06:14,417 --> 00:06:18,507
I'll never forget that afternoon
when I received the call.
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I was in my office.
I answered the phone.
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She said, "Meredith,
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00:06:26,341 --> 00:06:30,953
these two DNA profiles from the
Lady of the Dunes don't match."
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00:06:30,954 --> 00:06:35,395
And I said to her, "What
do you mean they don't match?"
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00:06:36,004 --> 00:06:41,096
Meredith, these are
from two different people.
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00:06:42,924 --> 00:06:45,707
We didn't know
how that had happened.
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00:06:45,708 --> 00:06:48,493
We still don't know
how that happened.
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00:06:48,494 --> 00:06:51,670
We didn't know
if the correct DNA profile
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00:06:51,671 --> 00:06:54,716
for the lady in the dunes
was the profile
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00:06:54,717 --> 00:06:59,460
that Dr. Budowle obtained
or the profile
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00:06:59,461 --> 00:07:02,552
that Dr. Jackson had obtained.
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00:07:03,684 --> 00:07:06,119
We thought we had
an accurate DNA profile,
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00:07:06,120 --> 00:07:07,992
and it ends up we don't.
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00:07:09,167 --> 00:07:13,126
This was now in addition
to Warren having learned
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00:07:13,127 --> 00:07:15,737
that all the physical evidence
in the case,
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00:07:15,738 --> 00:07:18,871
meaning the jeans, the bandana,
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00:07:18,872 --> 00:07:23,353
the towel her head
had been resting on, her hair,
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the state police had
thrown it all away in 1989.
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00:07:28,926 --> 00:07:31,144
It was just,
are you kidding me?
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00:07:31,145 --> 00:07:33,974
What else can go wrong
in this case?
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00:07:43,724 --> 00:07:48,378
When we realized that
the DNA had been contaminated,
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00:07:48,379 --> 00:07:54,254
I knew that the only resolution
was to do another exhumation.
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I went to my chief, and it was
decided that's what we would do.
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00:08:04,266 --> 00:08:07,615
The medical examiner's office
had done the prior exhumation.
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00:08:07,616 --> 00:08:10,009
Guys, stay back, okay?
Stay back.
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00:08:10,010 --> 00:08:14,492
To circumvent any more
contamination that had occurred,
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00:08:14,493 --> 00:08:18,191
our 2013 exhumation,
it was different.
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It was supervised
by a geneticist, Dr. Jackson.
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00:08:23,851 --> 00:08:28,986
But I had no doubt that this
exhumation was done by the book.
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00:08:30,292 --> 00:08:33,554
So now that we knew
that we had the accurate profile
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for the Lady of the Dunes,
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we ran Dr. Jackson's
DNA against Linda Lovell,
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00:08:38,778 --> 00:08:41,345
the missing person
from California.
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00:08:50,704 --> 00:08:55,271
Unfortunately, the DNA
did not match the DNA
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00:08:55,272 --> 00:08:57,580
from the Lady of the Dunes.
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00:09:01,323 --> 00:09:04,063
But it wasn't a dead end.
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00:09:04,064 --> 00:09:06,544
We know we have
an accurate profile,
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00:09:06,545 --> 00:09:09,200
and now we can move forward.
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In 2014, the former chief left
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00:09:19,645 --> 00:09:24,344
and was replaced
by acting Chief James Golden.
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00:09:24,345 --> 00:09:28,696
There was definitely
a shift in the tenor and tone
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00:09:28,697 --> 00:09:31,309
of supervision of this case.
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00:09:33,703 --> 00:09:38,184
I had an active,
full caseload as a detective.
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I would work on this case after
work hours, on my days off.
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00:09:46,020 --> 00:09:48,629
And that's
when Chief Golden told me
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that I'd no longer be
able to get any overtime
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for working on this case.
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00:09:55,029 --> 00:09:56,637
A lot of cops would be like,
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00:09:56,638 --> 00:09:59,207
"Well, if I'm not getting paid,
forget it."
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00:10:00,338 --> 00:10:04,471
But, you know, it certainly
wasn't going to dissuade me
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00:10:04,472 --> 00:10:07,650
from continuing to work
on the case.
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In Massachusetts,
when there's a homicide,
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that homicide falls
under the jurisdiction
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00:10:15,701 --> 00:10:20,052
of the district attorney's
office and state police.
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00:10:20,053 --> 00:10:23,316
But local police are
still very much involved
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00:10:23,317 --> 00:10:25,059
in the investigation.
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00:10:32,675 --> 00:10:35,894
I had talked to
a facial reconstructionist
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00:10:35,895 --> 00:10:39,898
from Boston Police,
who had cutting edge technology
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00:10:39,899 --> 00:10:44,032
that had not been used
before, to enlist his help
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00:10:44,033 --> 00:10:47,385
to do reconstructions
of the Lady of the Dunes.
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00:10:51,346 --> 00:10:54,608
We were ready to hit the presses
with the new composite.
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We believe this to be a true
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and accurate representation
of the Lady of the Dunes.
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00:11:02,487 --> 00:11:04,705
But the head of
the State Police Detective Unit
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00:11:04,706 --> 00:11:07,362
said, "Stop this now."
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00:11:10,321 --> 00:11:13,107
There was no reason given
for stopping it.
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00:11:14,325 --> 00:11:19,502
Unfortunately,
and I'd say tragically,
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it was never released.
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I think her administration
did not want
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00:11:29,775 --> 00:11:33,038
the Provincetown
Police Department associated
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00:11:33,039 --> 00:11:37,653
with this case as much as I did
or Chief Meads did.
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00:11:38,393 --> 00:11:42,134
I can't say with
any certainty why.
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00:11:42,135 --> 00:11:45,485
Maybe so that none
of the evidence being lost,
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none of the contamination
will come out in public.
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00:11:51,319 --> 00:11:53,319
When I had this case,
I had a free hand.
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00:11:53,320 --> 00:11:56,235
I don't think Meredith had
the same free hand.
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She ran into roadblocks.
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It sent a clear message
that anything
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00:12:01,981 --> 00:12:05,157
that could lead to
the identification of
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the Lady of the Dunes
was going to be met
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00:12:08,465 --> 00:12:12,077
with resistance from the top.
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00:12:12,078 --> 00:12:16,736
We're getting into 40 plus years
into this case.
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00:12:17,214 --> 00:12:20,563
You have this almost panic
in your head
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that time is running out here.
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00:12:42,413 --> 00:12:46,198
Given the fact that
she was found deceased in 1974,
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00:12:46,199 --> 00:12:48,461
it seems like time is ticking.
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00:12:48,462 --> 00:12:52,421
I had my doubts that the case
was ever going to be solved,
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00:12:52,422 --> 00:12:55,775
that we would ever identify her.
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00:13:00,692 --> 00:13:04,871
A new kind of DNA evidence
called genetic genealogy.
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00:13:06,437 --> 00:13:09,569
Genetic genealogy
uses databases
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00:13:09,570 --> 00:13:13,225
like Ancestry, 23 and Me.
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00:13:13,226 --> 00:13:16,576
But the DA's office,
for whatever reason,
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00:13:16,577 --> 00:13:20,841
was completely opposed
to trying to get DNA done,
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trying to get forensics done,
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any kind of scientific work
being done.
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00:13:27,937 --> 00:13:31,547
Ultimately, in 2018,
I was told not
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00:13:31,548 --> 00:13:33,943
to work on the case by my chief.
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Chief James Golden
had been brought to heel
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00:13:40,296 --> 00:13:42,167
by the District Attorney's
office.
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00:13:42,168 --> 00:13:44,865
He said, "If she has a family,
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00:13:44,866 --> 00:13:47,302
watch, they'll turn around
and sue us
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00:13:47,303 --> 00:13:50,871
because it took so long
to identify her."
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00:13:50,872 --> 00:13:55,658
His attitude was that, you know,
they're in charge of the case.
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00:13:55,659 --> 00:13:58,446
Just leave it alone.
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00:14:03,146 --> 00:14:06,887
I was just disgusted.
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00:14:06,888 --> 00:14:09,890
You have a body
on your department.
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00:14:09,891 --> 00:14:11,805
And you just say,
186
00:14:11,806 --> 00:14:15,376
"Leave it alone and let that
woman rot in that cemetery."
187
00:14:18,858 --> 00:14:20,814
None of it makes sense.
188
00:14:20,815 --> 00:14:25,299
But politics unfortunately
played a role in this case.
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00:14:27,910 --> 00:14:31,956
You were dealing with
fragile male egos.
190
00:14:31,957 --> 00:14:34,480
You're dealing with
jurisdictional issues.
191
00:14:34,481 --> 00:14:37,526
And they don't like it,
especially from a woman,
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00:14:37,527 --> 00:14:41,313
especially from someone
from out of town.
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00:14:41,314 --> 00:14:46,059
Especially from, you know,
someone who's gay.
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00:14:46,668 --> 00:14:48,888
It's not appreciated.
195
00:14:50,977 --> 00:14:52,498
The district attorney's office,
196
00:14:52,499 --> 00:14:54,630
I don't believe wanted
this case solved.
197
00:14:54,631 --> 00:14:56,632
And I think the answer is
very simple,
198
00:14:56,633 --> 00:14:59,113
because of the evidence issue.
199
00:14:59,114 --> 00:15:00,723
They had thrown away
the evidence.
200
00:15:00,724 --> 00:15:03,117
They were going to look bad.
201
00:15:03,118 --> 00:15:05,163
I'm in this alone,
one hand behind my back,
202
00:15:05,164 --> 00:15:07,907
but basically, [bleep] you.
203
00:15:08,995 --> 00:15:12,041
I'm not stopping.
I owe it to her.
204
00:15:16,654 --> 00:15:18,654
At that point,
205
00:15:18,655 --> 00:15:22,486
my chief was actively attempting
to shut down my investigation.
206
00:15:24,488 --> 00:15:29,143
I was sitting at my desk, and
all of a sudden, sitting there,
207
00:15:29,144 --> 00:15:32,538
I realized, wait a minute,
208
00:15:32,539 --> 00:15:35,238
this happened
on national park property.
209
00:15:36,500 --> 00:15:40,111
Any homicide
that happens on park property
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00:15:40,112 --> 00:15:42,854
is the jurisdiction of the FBI.
211
00:15:43,594 --> 00:15:46,334
The FBI needs to get
involved here.
212
00:15:46,335 --> 00:15:48,425
This should be their case.
213
00:15:58,653 --> 00:16:02,307
And then the Golden State killer
was identified.
214
00:16:02,308 --> 00:16:05,179
Alleged Golden State killer
Joseph DeAngelo was arrested
215
00:16:05,180 --> 00:16:09,009
in April 2018
thanks to genetic genealogy.
216
00:16:09,010 --> 00:16:12,230
The case had remained
unresolved for decades.
217
00:16:12,231 --> 00:16:14,536
Using genetic genealogy,
218
00:16:14,537 --> 00:16:19,019
they were able to identify
the perpetrator in that case.
219
00:16:19,020 --> 00:16:21,981
That made a huge difference.
220
00:16:27,073 --> 00:16:30,770
The FBI was a little reluctant
to get involved.
221
00:16:30,771 --> 00:16:33,816
You know, I made it clear
to them, "Look, guys,
222
00:16:33,817 --> 00:16:35,601
you're not doing me a favor.
223
00:16:35,602 --> 00:16:40,823
This is your case.
This is your jurisdiction."
224
00:16:40,824 --> 00:16:45,611
I said,
"It's been almost 48 years.
225
00:16:45,612 --> 00:16:48,918
This is a chance
for you to solve this."
226
00:16:48,919 --> 00:16:53,097
You get to stand up
at that microphone and say,
227
00:16:53,098 --> 00:16:55,316
"Look at what the FBI did
to solve
228
00:16:55,317 --> 00:16:57,362
the Lady of the Dunes case."
229
00:16:57,363 --> 00:16:59,973
And you take all the credit
for this.
230
00:16:59,974 --> 00:17:01,759
Let's do it.
231
00:17:05,720 --> 00:17:08,547
I'm excited
but holding my breath.
232
00:17:08,548 --> 00:17:13,335
The analyst from the FBI
did the genetic genealogy.
233
00:17:23,085 --> 00:17:27,522
I was in Superior Court
on another case,
234
00:17:27,523 --> 00:17:29,568
and I found out
235
00:17:29,569 --> 00:17:33,311
that there was going to be this
meeting scheduled between FBI,
236
00:17:33,312 --> 00:17:37,665
Provincetown, State Police,
DA's office, for the next day.
237
00:17:38,927 --> 00:17:40,622
The level of hope
238
00:17:40,623 --> 00:17:45,149
and then disappointment
had happened so many times.
239
00:17:45,150 --> 00:17:47,501
This felt different.
240
00:17:48,632 --> 00:17:53,548
I heard the FBI had a name
for the Lady of the Dunes.
241
00:17:53,549 --> 00:17:56,205
It was surreal.
242
00:17:58,251 --> 00:18:00,338
It was personal for everyone.
243
00:18:00,339 --> 00:18:03,558
You know, wishing Chief Meads
could have known,
244
00:18:03,559 --> 00:18:07,651
wishing I were allowed to tell
Warren what was happening.
245
00:18:10,001 --> 00:18:12,611
Kind of feeling like after,
246
00:18:12,612 --> 00:18:16,093
you know, 11 years of bashing
your head against a wall,
247
00:18:16,094 --> 00:18:18,445
it was going to be worth it.
248
00:18:23,232 --> 00:18:26,364
I went home and just said,
249
00:18:26,365 --> 00:18:30,063
"I just want to stay alive till
11:00 tomorrow morning.
250
00:18:30,064 --> 00:18:32,718
I hope I don't die in my sleep
251
00:18:32,719 --> 00:18:36,724
because that would
really be lousy not knowing."
252
00:18:37,942 --> 00:18:40,421
In the end, the FBI,
253
00:18:40,422 --> 00:18:44,730
using a lab that
worked on genetic genealogy,
254
00:18:44,731 --> 00:18:49,302
came back with the DNA
that led them to her identity.
255
00:18:54,176 --> 00:18:56,133
It took nearly 50 years,
256
00:18:56,134 --> 00:18:57,743
but investigators
in Massachusetts
257
00:18:57,744 --> 00:18:59,527
have caught their break.
258
00:18:59,528 --> 00:19:01,790
We are standing here
today to announce
259
00:19:01,791 --> 00:19:05,751
that after nearly a half-century
of investigative efforts,
260
00:19:05,752 --> 00:19:09,885
we have identified the oldest
unidentified homicide victim
261
00:19:09,886 --> 00:19:14,760
in Massachusetts,
known as the Lady of the Dunes.
262
00:19:14,761 --> 00:19:16,459
She is...
263
00:19:30,212 --> 00:19:33,735
I was upstairs in the office
where I spend a lot of my time.
264
00:19:33,736 --> 00:19:36,260
The phone rings, and I noticed
265
00:19:36,261 --> 00:19:39,176
right on there that it said FBI.
266
00:19:39,177 --> 00:19:42,485
And I got nervous.
I got really nervous.
267
00:19:43,051 --> 00:19:45,225
They wouldn't tell me
anything on the phone,
268
00:19:45,226 --> 00:19:47,271
you know, just that,
"We're the FBI,
269
00:19:47,272 --> 00:19:49,231
and we need to talk to you."
270
00:19:49,449 --> 00:19:51,623
They pulled up
in a black Suburban,
271
00:19:51,624 --> 00:19:54,495
all the windows were darkened
out, windshield and everything.
272
00:19:54,496 --> 00:19:56,758
Just like on TV, man,
the doors opened up,
273
00:19:56,759 --> 00:19:59,457
four guys got out in suits,
and I started praying.
274
00:19:59,458 --> 00:20:01,328
You know, 'cause I thought,
275
00:20:01,329 --> 00:20:04,594
you know, apparently
I've done something wrong.
276
00:20:06,117 --> 00:20:09,858
We drove to the Detroit office,
and when we got there,
277
00:20:09,859 --> 00:20:14,735
they proceeded to tell me
that they had located my mom.
278
00:20:16,215 --> 00:20:17,736
I got really excited
279
00:20:17,737 --> 00:20:19,477
'cause I thought
I was going to meet my mom.
280
00:20:19,478 --> 00:20:21,870
I said, "Well, where is she?"
281
00:20:21,871 --> 00:20:25,570
He goes, "Oh, no, no, no, no.
Your mom's gone.
282
00:20:25,571 --> 00:20:29,443
And she's been gone for
a long time."
283
00:20:29,444 --> 00:20:31,140
And then that's when he said,
284
00:20:31,141 --> 00:20:36,886
"Well, we all knew her
as the Lady of the Dunes."
285
00:21:12,749 --> 00:21:17,099
We're in Livonia, Michigan,
an older part of Livonia.
286
00:21:17,100 --> 00:21:20,538
My mom and dad used to live here
and work at the plant.
287
00:21:20,539 --> 00:21:23,192
This used to be
Fisher Body Livonia.
288
00:21:23,193 --> 00:21:26,065
It opened up in '57 or '58.
289
00:21:26,066 --> 00:21:28,328
My dad came down from Lansing
290
00:21:28,329 --> 00:21:31,113
to be superintendent here
at this plant.
291
00:21:31,114 --> 00:21:33,290
My mom worked here,
my older sister worked here,
292
00:21:33,291 --> 00:21:37,948
my aunt worked here, they all
worked here at this plant.
293
00:21:41,169 --> 00:21:44,649
The auto plants were all running
big, and they needed people.
294
00:21:44,650 --> 00:21:47,393
And they hired a lot
of people from the south.
295
00:21:49,525 --> 00:21:52,265
There was a woman
that worked there.
296
00:21:52,266 --> 00:21:55,573
She said her name was
Ruth Smith.
297
00:21:55,574 --> 00:21:57,836
Pat, my older sister,
298
00:21:57,837 --> 00:22:02,188
and Ruth hung out quite a bit
and became really good friends.
299
00:22:02,189 --> 00:22:04,408
And Ruth got pregnant.
300
00:22:04,409 --> 00:22:09,238
Wasn't married,
it was the '50s, and, you know,
301
00:22:09,239 --> 00:22:11,895
she didn't know what to do.
302
00:22:12,592 --> 00:22:16,115
My mom and dad
were looking to adopt a baby.
303
00:22:16,116 --> 00:22:20,075
But they were older, and the
government wouldn't let them.
304
00:22:20,076 --> 00:22:22,426
So Ruth approached Dick
and Thelma and said,
305
00:22:22,427 --> 00:22:25,690
"Hey, you know, I know you,
you're great people,
306
00:22:25,691 --> 00:22:29,563
and I want you to take care
of my baby."
307
00:22:29,564 --> 00:22:33,306
And my mom and dad
were just so excited.
308
00:22:33,307 --> 00:22:35,308
That's gonna be
this house right there.
309
00:22:35,309 --> 00:22:37,878
That's the house
that I was born in.
310
00:22:38,922 --> 00:22:41,401
After Ruth came to my parents,
my parents,
311
00:22:41,402 --> 00:22:44,796
they rented a house
to take care of Ruth.
312
00:22:44,797 --> 00:22:47,233
And my mom and my dad and Ruth
313
00:22:47,234 --> 00:22:51,542
all agreed that when
it come time for me to be born,
314
00:22:51,543 --> 00:22:55,328
that my mom would give
her driver's license to Ruth
315
00:22:55,329 --> 00:22:57,243
and that my dad would take
Ruth down
316
00:22:57,244 --> 00:22:58,897
to the Garden City Hospital.
317
00:22:58,898 --> 00:23:02,596
And that's exactly
what happened.
318
00:23:02,597 --> 00:23:06,948
My birth certificate,
it said Thelma Hanchett,
319
00:23:06,949 --> 00:23:13,520
but it had Ruth's birth date
and the birth place for Ruth,
320
00:23:13,521 --> 00:23:16,871
with Chattanooga, Tennessee.
321
00:23:16,872 --> 00:23:20,745
My mom said right after
I was born, they came back here
322
00:23:20,746 --> 00:23:23,356
and Ruth come over
and said her goodbyes
323
00:23:23,357 --> 00:23:26,360
and my mom never ever
seen her again.
324
00:23:36,023 --> 00:23:37,849
Growing up as a child,
325
00:23:37,850 --> 00:23:42,201
I was mad at Ruth
because if I had a child,
326
00:23:42,202 --> 00:23:46,031
I would never give it away.
327
00:23:46,032 --> 00:23:48,425
I felt abandoned.
328
00:23:48,426 --> 00:23:51,560
And got in a lot of trouble.
329
00:23:53,562 --> 00:23:55,693
Breaking [bleep],
stealing
330
00:23:55,694 --> 00:23:57,521
I was rebelling,
I was trying to tell people
331
00:23:57,522 --> 00:24:01,178
I was mad, and the older I got,
the worse I got.
332
00:24:02,441 --> 00:24:08,880
And then, in 1972, Ruth reached
out to my sister Patricia.
333
00:24:08,881 --> 00:24:14,973
Richard has always wanted to
see his mother and meet her,
334
00:24:14,974 --> 00:24:17,758
but when Ruth came in,
talked to Pat,
335
00:24:17,759 --> 00:24:19,760
and she wanted to meet Richard,
336
00:24:19,761 --> 00:24:23,940
Richard was going through a very
bad point in time in his life.
337
00:24:24,637 --> 00:24:30,599
I was 13 years old,
I OD'd on PCP.
338
00:24:31,644 --> 00:24:36,255
I woke up in a hospital
two and a half weeks later.
339
00:24:36,256 --> 00:24:39,737
My older sister Pat
came to see me to let me know
340
00:24:39,738 --> 00:24:43,436
that Ruth was trying
to get a hold of me.
341
00:24:43,437 --> 00:24:45,220
I just blew it off,
342
00:24:45,221 --> 00:24:47,747
I didn't want anything
to do with anybody.
343
00:24:48,791 --> 00:24:51,488
Unfortunately, I think Pat
had to tell her what happened,
344
00:24:51,489 --> 00:24:55,145
that this is
why he doesn't want to see you.
345
00:24:56,364 --> 00:24:58,103
I'm kind of mad at myself
346
00:24:58,104 --> 00:25:02,762
because I had no idea
that was my only chance.
347
00:25:06,809 --> 00:25:11,116
My older sister, Patricia,
was a second mom to me.
348
00:25:11,117 --> 00:25:13,901
I idolized her.
349
00:25:13,902 --> 00:25:15,729
I don't know what the deal is,
350
00:25:15,730 --> 00:25:19,952
but there's been death
around me all my life.
351
00:25:26,481 --> 00:25:28,655
This is a newspaper article
the day
352
00:25:28,656 --> 00:25:31,660
that her ex-husband
murdered her.
353
00:25:36,186 --> 00:25:39,623
He barged into her home
and shot her.
354
00:25:39,624 --> 00:25:42,628
And then was killed
by the police.
355
00:25:46,196 --> 00:25:48,675
When my older sister
was murdered,
356
00:25:48,676 --> 00:25:52,374
I thought Ruth perhaps
would have been at the funeral.
357
00:25:52,375 --> 00:25:54,640
They were friends.
358
00:25:56,555 --> 00:25:58,467
I looked at all the books,
359
00:25:58,468 --> 00:26:00,557
and I looked for
Ruth Smith to see
360
00:26:00,558 --> 00:26:03,692
if her signature was in there.
361
00:26:04,693 --> 00:26:07,607
But it wasn't there.
362
00:26:07,608 --> 00:26:10,960
Deep down, I needed to know,
where is she?
363
00:26:23,364 --> 00:26:26,670
My mom died in 2013.
364
00:26:26,671 --> 00:26:31,241
And then younger sister Lisa
died in '17.
365
00:26:32,591 --> 00:26:35,243
And I found myself all alone.
366
00:26:35,244 --> 00:26:36,549
That's when I was like,
367
00:26:36,550 --> 00:26:40,468
"You know, where'd
everybody go?"
368
00:26:40,686 --> 00:26:42,601
Come on.
369
00:26:43,384 --> 00:26:45,645
He was lost.
370
00:26:45,646 --> 00:26:50,084
And I said, "Well, what if you
tried to find your mom and dad,
371
00:26:50,085 --> 00:26:52,872
you know, your birth parents?"
372
00:26:54,134 --> 00:26:58,878
So in December of '17, I got
him a DNA kit for Christmas.
373
00:26:59,618 --> 00:27:01,443
I said, "I bought you this
374
00:27:01,444 --> 00:27:03,924
because you've been
questioning a lot of things.
375
00:27:03,925 --> 00:27:08,276
But you have to look at,
it might be a downside, too."
376
00:27:08,277 --> 00:27:11,323
Maybe the family is--
don't want you around.
377
00:27:11,324 --> 00:27:13,327
It could be a Pandora's box.
378
00:27:14,502 --> 00:27:18,330
I took the DNA test, sent it
in, had to wait a couple weeks.
379
00:27:18,331 --> 00:27:21,857
And then I got the e-mail
that my results were in.
380
00:27:22,684 --> 00:27:25,034
And I'm getting excited.
381
00:27:25,992 --> 00:27:29,169
It gave me access
to the Ancestry database.
382
00:27:29,386 --> 00:27:31,212
My hair is standing on my arms.
383
00:27:31,213 --> 00:27:33,956
Wendy's behind me.
She's shaking.
384
00:27:34,696 --> 00:27:37,090
It immediately came back
with a match.
385
00:27:40,310 --> 00:27:42,789
I was shocked.
386
00:27:42,790 --> 00:27:45,359
I match a woman from Tennessee.
387
00:27:46,621 --> 00:27:51,365
This woman was my mom's
brother or sister's child.
388
00:27:52,932 --> 00:27:54,975
I sent her a message.
389
00:27:54,976 --> 00:27:59,284
It was really simple-- "The
system says you're my cousin.
390
00:27:59,285 --> 00:28:02,461
I was adopted.
I don't know who I am.
391
00:28:02,462 --> 00:28:04,637
And I'm looking for help."
392
00:28:04,638 --> 00:28:10,034
And within seconds,
she responded, "Oh, my God.
393
00:28:10,035 --> 00:28:13,082
I've been looking for you
my whole life."
394
00:28:17,478 --> 00:28:20,740
She just started
telling me things about my mom,
395
00:28:20,741 --> 00:28:23,658
my family, and who I am.
396
00:28:24,615 --> 00:28:28,617
It says, "She is our
beloved Ruth Marie Terry."
397
00:28:28,618 --> 00:28:32,317
And she sent me a picture.
398
00:28:32,318 --> 00:28:35,189
I was like, "Holy crap!
399
00:28:35,190 --> 00:28:37,714
That's my mom, there's
no ands ifs or buts about that!"
400
00:28:37,715 --> 00:28:39,413
It was just unbelievable.
401
00:28:44,331 --> 00:28:50,248
Then, three quarters
of the way down was the,
402
00:28:50,249 --> 00:28:53,773
"She's been missing
since the '70s."
403
00:28:53,774 --> 00:28:58,737
I was just crushed.
I'm like, "What?"
404
00:28:59,650 --> 00:29:00,998
You're at the top
of the mountain,
405
00:29:00,999 --> 00:29:03,263
and you've just slipped off.
406
00:29:04,133 --> 00:29:07,700
I wanted to know who she was,
what she was like.
407
00:29:07,701 --> 00:29:10,095
Everything about her
and her family.
408
00:29:18,887 --> 00:29:23,063
My father and my Aunt Ruth
were brother and sister.
409
00:29:23,064 --> 00:29:27,764
She looked like the lady
from "Gone with the Wind."
410
00:29:27,765 --> 00:29:30,941
She was just
this beautiful woman.
411
00:29:30,942 --> 00:29:33,946
Super bubbly. Larger than life.
412
00:29:35,686 --> 00:29:37,904
Aunt Ruth had fiery red hair,
413
00:29:37,905 --> 00:29:42,171
piercing blue eyes,
and an awesome smile.
414
00:29:45,305 --> 00:29:48,697
Aunt Ruth grew up
in a beautiful town,
415
00:29:48,698 --> 00:29:52,267
about 20 miles north
of Chattanooga.
416
00:30:03,323 --> 00:30:07,020
Got up this morning
to drive down to Tennessee.
417
00:30:07,021 --> 00:30:09,849
Boy I tell ya,
these Black Mountains down here.
418
00:30:09,850 --> 00:30:12,201
The scenery is just beautiful.
419
00:30:13,376 --> 00:30:16,508
I've talked to my Uncle Ken
and John and Jim
420
00:30:16,509 --> 00:30:18,466
on the phone a couple of times,
421
00:30:18,467 --> 00:30:21,384
but it's just not the same as
when you see 'em live.
422
00:30:25,606 --> 00:30:29,129
And they invited me
down to Tennessee.
423
00:30:29,130 --> 00:30:32,439
The Terry's
wanted to put on a reunion.
424
00:30:38,010 --> 00:30:39,792
- Ric-ard!
- Hey!
425
00:30:39,793 --> 00:30:41,359
- What's up, dude?
- Hey, man.
426
00:30:41,360 --> 00:30:43,491
- Alright, man. How you been?
- Good. How you been?
427
00:30:43,492 --> 00:30:45,276
Not too bad.
428
00:30:45,277 --> 00:30:47,452
- How you doing, honey?
- I'm good. How are you?
429
00:30:47,453 --> 00:30:49,367
- I'm good.
- Great to see ya.
430
00:30:49,368 --> 00:30:51,630
Thank you so much.
- You're welcome.
431
00:30:51,631 --> 00:30:55,984
Everybody there had nothin' but
kind words to say about my mom.
432
00:30:57,290 --> 00:31:00,769
I wanted to know who she was,
what she was like,
433
00:31:00,770 --> 00:31:03,557
the type of person she was,
all of those things.
434
00:31:05,211 --> 00:31:08,865
But there were things
that I needed to know, you know?
435
00:31:08,866 --> 00:31:11,217
What happened?
436
00:31:20,139 --> 00:31:23,925
My dad has told me stories.
437
00:31:24,273 --> 00:31:27,231
My cousins told me about Ruth.
438
00:31:27,232 --> 00:31:30,845
In a short period of time,
I learned who my mom was.
439
00:31:31,541 --> 00:31:35,719
She was a little country girl
for 14 or 15 years of her life.
440
00:31:37,286 --> 00:31:40,940
When my Aunt Ruth was probably
441
00:31:40,941 --> 00:31:44,596
1 or 2 years old,
her mother died.
442
00:31:44,597 --> 00:31:47,949
My Aunt Ruth was taken in
by my mother-in-law's family.
443
00:31:48,384 --> 00:31:53,257
I think she was 13 years old,
and she married Billy Ray Smith.
444
00:31:53,258 --> 00:31:55,650
They got married really young.
445
00:31:55,651 --> 00:31:58,090
And it just didn't work out.
446
00:31:59,743 --> 00:32:02,440
Their house is still there.
447
00:32:02,441 --> 00:32:06,226
So this is where
Aunt Ruth lived
448
00:32:06,227 --> 00:32:08,446
when she married
Billy Ray Smith.
449
00:32:08,447 --> 00:32:12,058
This is the last place that Ruth
lived before she left, isn't it?
450
00:32:12,059 --> 00:32:13,973
Uh, as far as I know.
451
00:32:13,974 --> 00:32:17,500
Uncle Ken might be able to
clarify that, but, yeah, likely.
452
00:32:20,025 --> 00:32:22,112
He was 19,
and she was 13.
453
00:32:22,113 --> 00:32:24,070
So her life probably
changed right then, huh?
454
00:32:24,071 --> 00:32:26,986
Yeah. I knew Billy Ray well.
455
00:32:26,987 --> 00:32:29,641
I worked with him
on the railroad.
456
00:32:29,642 --> 00:32:31,295
He was a nice guy.
457
00:32:31,296 --> 00:32:33,123
It wasn't too much longer
after that
458
00:32:33,124 --> 00:32:34,689
when she split for Michigan.
459
00:32:34,690 --> 00:32:36,909
Yeah.
460
00:32:36,910 --> 00:32:39,607
Their marriage dissolved.
461
00:32:39,608 --> 00:32:41,653
She wanted to get out
of Whitwell,
462
00:32:41,654 --> 00:32:45,964
and she wanted to make her own
life and strike out on her own.
463
00:32:46,877 --> 00:32:50,620
She wanted something better
than just a coal mining town.
464
00:32:52,579 --> 00:32:55,667
To the best of my knowledge,
she lived in Michigan for about
465
00:32:55,668 --> 00:32:57,756
two, two and a half years.
466
00:32:57,757 --> 00:33:00,324
Got a job, got pregnant.
467
00:33:00,325 --> 00:33:02,717
Ruth left right
after I was born.
468
00:33:02,718 --> 00:33:05,024
And I think that might
have been the deciding factor of
469
00:33:05,025 --> 00:33:07,333
why she left Michigan.
470
00:33:09,770 --> 00:33:12,077
She decided to go to California.
471
00:33:12,555 --> 00:33:14,729
From what I've heard
from others,
472
00:33:14,730 --> 00:33:18,257
she may have wanted to move
to California and be an actress.
473
00:33:19,432 --> 00:33:21,519
She was doing odd type jobs,
you know,
474
00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:24,263
house cleaning,
that type of stuff.
475
00:33:29,877 --> 00:33:33,574
She met this guy,
you know, he was wealthy.
476
00:33:33,575 --> 00:33:36,316
You know,
he was an "antiquity dealer."
477
00:33:36,317 --> 00:33:40,540
He appeared to be all the things
that she was dreaming for.
478
00:33:43,282 --> 00:33:45,543
I don't know
how long the relationship was.
479
00:33:45,544 --> 00:33:47,588
I just know that they met,
you know,
480
00:33:47,589 --> 00:33:50,157
and then shortly after that,
they got married.
481
00:33:56,034 --> 00:34:01,430
Nobody in the family knew
anything about the guy, really.
482
00:34:04,825 --> 00:34:08,392
In the spring of 1974,
I was 8 years old,
483
00:34:08,393 --> 00:34:10,570
and my Aunt Ruth came.
484
00:34:11,484 --> 00:34:13,397
The overall mood
that I remember,
485
00:34:13,398 --> 00:34:15,921
it was just excitement.
486
00:34:15,922 --> 00:34:18,532
Dad was excited
his little sister was in town,
487
00:34:18,533 --> 00:34:22,101
and she did introduce
her new husband to my dad.
488
00:34:22,102 --> 00:34:25,714
But I have no idea what happened
to Aunt Ruth after that week.
489
00:34:38,598 --> 00:34:43,731
A major break in the state's
oldest unsolved murder.
490
00:34:43,732 --> 00:34:48,086
A Jane Doe mystery
stretching back to 1974.
491
00:34:48,608 --> 00:34:52,697
After nearly a half-century
of investigative efforts,
492
00:34:52,698 --> 00:34:55,484
we have identified
the Lady of the Dunes.
493
00:34:57,834 --> 00:35:00,835
She is...
494
00:35:00,836 --> 00:35:03,318
Ruth Marie Terry.
495
00:35:05,233 --> 00:35:07,888
I just said, "There you are."
496
00:35:11,109 --> 00:35:13,587
During my years
investigating it,
497
00:35:13,588 --> 00:35:20,422
I never once thought what it was
gonna be like solving the case.
498
00:35:21,423 --> 00:35:27,473
That case had been part
of my life for 35 years.
499
00:35:27,908 --> 00:35:30,387
Even after I retired.
500
00:35:30,388 --> 00:35:35,219
I didn't realize how
omnipresent she was in my life.
501
00:35:40,747 --> 00:35:44,009
I'd go periodically.
502
00:35:44,010 --> 00:35:50,191
Either just sit there
by the grave or sit in my car.
503
00:35:50,974 --> 00:35:55,196
I didn't realize that I wasn't
the only one that did that.
504
00:35:55,936 --> 00:35:57,762
This is gonna sound
kind of crazy.
505
00:35:57,763 --> 00:36:01,026
It was almost kind of like
part of my identity
506
00:36:01,027 --> 00:36:03,898
that I was associated
with the Lady in the Dunes.
507
00:36:03,899 --> 00:36:06,249
And now she had been identified.
508
00:36:06,250 --> 00:36:09,556
Like there's a "before Ruth"
509
00:36:09,557 --> 00:36:11,558
when we had
the Lady of the Dunes
510
00:36:11,559 --> 00:36:14,867
and then there's like
an "after Ruth."
511
00:36:21,179 --> 00:36:26,704
So for 48 years, my Aunt Ruth
was the Lady of the Dunes.
512
00:36:26,705 --> 00:36:29,796
Until they had identified
her remains.
513
00:36:31,101 --> 00:36:32,971
That's hard.
514
00:36:32,972 --> 00:36:34,842
I never would have thought
515
00:36:34,843 --> 00:36:39,501
that our family would have been
part of a mystery like this.
516
00:36:40,633 --> 00:36:43,590
The detective started
speaking to me.
517
00:36:43,591 --> 00:36:47,942
They said
that they had identified her
518
00:36:47,943 --> 00:36:54,123
and that she'd been murdered
in Provincetown.
519
00:36:59,739 --> 00:37:02,872
I have a hard time
with this part.
520
00:37:07,050 --> 00:37:08,833
Before the FBI contacted me,
521
00:37:08,834 --> 00:37:12,184
I was having nightmares
for a few weeks.
522
00:37:12,185 --> 00:37:17,626
And the person in my nightmare
was violently hitting someone.
523
00:37:19,149 --> 00:37:24,109
And it just hurt.
It hurt down in my stomach.
524
00:37:24,110 --> 00:37:26,764
And uh, yeah.
525
00:37:26,765 --> 00:37:29,377
That's gonna bother me
till the day I die.
526
00:37:34,252 --> 00:37:38,254
The moment we learned her name,
Ruth Marie Terry,
527
00:37:38,255 --> 00:37:39,951
we just started digging.
528
00:37:39,952 --> 00:37:42,432
And now authorities are
asking for the public's help.
529
00:37:42,433 --> 00:37:45,086
The hunt for her killer.
530
00:37:45,087 --> 00:37:46,827
We find out who the victim is.
531
00:37:46,828 --> 00:37:49,919
And then it's like,
"Okay, now who killed her?
532
00:38:00,582 --> 00:38:03,279
Ruth had a great life
in California.
533
00:38:03,280 --> 00:38:05,890
Ruth and her new husband
came back to Tennessee
534
00:38:05,891 --> 00:38:08,111
in the early '70s.
535
00:38:12,986 --> 00:38:17,510
This guy was big,
burly, curly hair.
536
00:38:17,511 --> 00:38:20,515
He seemed more like
a beach bum to me.
537
00:38:24,127 --> 00:38:25,605
Dad didn't approve of him.
538
00:38:25,606 --> 00:38:29,568
Wasn't clean-shaven,
that turned my dad off.
539
00:38:32,571 --> 00:38:34,701
They called us
and said she was in
540
00:38:34,702 --> 00:38:36,616
with a new guy she had married.
541
00:38:36,617 --> 00:38:38,705
He was an antique dealer.
542
00:38:38,706 --> 00:38:40,968
They was traveling cross
country looking for antiques.
543
00:38:40,969 --> 00:38:44,755
He was sort of a heavy set guy
with gray hair.
544
00:38:44,756 --> 00:38:46,539
He looked kind of older, then?
545
00:38:46,540 --> 00:38:48,848
Yeah, he was older, yeah.
546
00:38:49,675 --> 00:38:53,720
But my wife, she just
sort of read people, you know?
547
00:38:53,721 --> 00:38:57,596
And she said he was
bad news for her.
548
00:38:58,292 --> 00:39:02,903
No, she didn't care for him, his
demeanor or what, I don't know.
549
00:39:02,904 --> 00:39:04,731
And after that, she left.
550
00:39:04,732 --> 00:39:07,519
That was the last time
we saw her.
551
00:39:09,695 --> 00:39:13,566
Her husband's
name was Guy Muldavin.
552
00:39:13,567 --> 00:39:18,223
Ruth showed up with him.
They met him briefly.
553
00:39:18,224 --> 00:39:20,312
Then she vanishes.
554
00:39:20,313 --> 00:39:22,795
I always wondered what
happened.
555
00:39:23,448 --> 00:39:25,404
My dad told her
whenever she got to
556
00:39:25,405 --> 00:39:29,062
where she was going to call,
make sure she got there safe.
557
00:39:29,541 --> 00:39:32,152
And apparently, he never got
the call.
558
00:39:33,153 --> 00:39:35,849
According
to this marriage certificate,
559
00:39:35,850 --> 00:39:39,418
six months before her
body was discovered on the Cape,
560
00:39:39,419 --> 00:39:42,595
she exchanged vows in
Reno, Nevada.
561
00:39:42,596 --> 00:39:46,730
Looking at the marriage records
for Guy Muldavin
562
00:39:46,731 --> 00:39:51,648
with Ruth Marie Terry,
we saw she used an alias.
563
00:39:51,649 --> 00:39:53,302
Teri Vizina.
564
00:39:57,133 --> 00:39:59,873
When I found out that
my mom was changing her name,
565
00:39:59,874 --> 00:40:02,485
my first impression was that
she was doing something wrong.
566
00:40:02,486 --> 00:40:04,967
She was involved
in something illegal.
567
00:40:06,186 --> 00:40:10,231
Why would she do that?
Is she on the run?
568
00:40:10,232 --> 00:40:13,062
Is she hiding from somebody?
569
00:40:13,672 --> 00:40:17,850
Did he set this up
so he couldn't be found?
570
00:40:21,941 --> 00:40:25,464
My dad, James,
was her older brother.
571
00:40:25,465 --> 00:40:28,075
Dad called Aunt Ruth's husband.
572
00:40:28,076 --> 00:40:29,816
Guy said he'd come home
from work
573
00:40:29,817 --> 00:40:32,473
and all of her stuff was gone.
574
00:40:33,082 --> 00:40:37,477
Guy told him
that she had joined a cult.
575
00:40:43,658 --> 00:40:45,832
Dad really didn't think
that she would just run
576
00:40:45,833 --> 00:40:49,401
off without letting him know
where she is.
577
00:40:49,402 --> 00:40:51,403
That wasn't like Aunt Ruth.
578
00:40:51,404 --> 00:40:54,103
Dad went on his search.
579
00:40:55,191 --> 00:40:57,714
From what this guy
she had married had said,
580
00:40:57,715 --> 00:40:59,631
she went back west.
581
00:41:01,894 --> 00:41:05,373
My father hired
a private detective
582
00:41:05,374 --> 00:41:08,202
to go find her in California.
583
00:41:08,203 --> 00:41:10,030
As far as I know,
584
00:41:10,031 --> 00:41:15,647
my father never looked
east at all for my aunt.
585
00:41:16,604 --> 00:41:19,259
Dad never gave up looking
for her.
586
00:41:20,913 --> 00:41:25,134
We only know what
Guy Muldavin had told dad.
587
00:41:25,657 --> 00:41:29,441
No one knew who
Guy Muldavin was.
588
00:41:29,442 --> 00:41:32,923
I just began working my sources.
589
00:41:32,924 --> 00:41:35,229
They are looking for
information about a man
590
00:41:35,230 --> 00:41:38,537
the victim married a few months
before she was killed.
591
00:41:38,538 --> 00:41:41,409
We found out he had
a very dark past
592
00:41:41,410 --> 00:41:43,890
that was hidden for decades.
593
00:41:43,891 --> 00:41:48,069
Who was Guy Muldavin?
Depends on who you ask.
594
00:41:53,423 --> 00:41:57,556
The story of Manzanita Rockwell
and Dolores Mearns
595
00:41:57,557 --> 00:42:00,559
unfolded in a strange manner.
596
00:42:00,560 --> 00:42:04,955
Just a charade of lies, mistruths.
597
00:42:04,956 --> 00:42:08,959
His eyes got dark,
and his look changed.
598
00:42:08,960 --> 00:42:12,440
Then they stumbled
upon what clearly was
599
00:42:12,441 --> 00:42:14,747
a gruesome crime scene.
600
00:42:14,748 --> 00:42:16,314
This guy's a fugitive
from the law.
601
00:42:16,315 --> 00:42:18,098
We need to find him now.
602
00:42:18,099 --> 00:42:23,234
And that was about 14 or 15
years before he had met my mom.
603
00:42:23,235 --> 00:42:27,978
It was this difficult
to bring it to a resolution.
604
00:42:27,979 --> 00:42:32,332
I had always said
there would be retribution.
48148
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