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This programme contains
strong language and adult themes.
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(SOMBRE MUSIC)
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Oh, there they are.
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After Leigh's death,
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I came across lots of letters which
she'd written to her children.
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It shocked me to the core
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that a mother could write a letter
like that to her daughter.
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One day in 2015...
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..I received a letter from the UK.
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On the front it says:
"Thinking of You."
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I opened it...
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and there was a picture
of a phoenix.
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"Like the phoenix
I will arise from the ashes,
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"and sleep will obey me
and visit thee never,
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"for my eyes are upon thee
forever and ever.
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"I have served my life sentence
of shame and blame.
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"Now it's your turn
to suffer the same."
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"Your nemesis, Lee Sabine."
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What the fuck?
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Who says that sh...?
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It really does make you think,
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what was going on in her mind
when she wrote these things?
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It seems it didn't take very much
to incur her wrath.
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Anyone who crossed her
was in danger.
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(ANGELIC THEME MUSIC)
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Every homicide is unique, but in
this case it was absolutely bizarre.
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So, we have an unidentified,
freshly-killed male body.
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May have been there for weeks,
possibly months,
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who's died from a blow to the head.
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At this point in the investigation,
Leigh Sabine is the prime suspect.
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Leigh had died three weeks
before the body was found.
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She didn't fit the profile
of a killer,
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but forensic examination of the
packaging wrapped around the body
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found a piece of hair that was
a positive match for Leigh Sabine,
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linking her to the murder.
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Now, I had reasonable grounds
to forensically examine her flat
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to see if there was any evidence
of a violent attack,
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to prove if the killer
is Leigh Sabine.
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(SOMBRE MUSIC)
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I attended the scene to look for
any forensics at all.
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Hair, fibres, blood, fingerprints.
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We looked everywhere.
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Skirting boards, architraving,
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behind cupboards,
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the boiler in the kitchen.
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Even the DNA team looked
under the floorboards for blood.
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We knew that the property
had been steam cleaned,
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and that a lot of the furniture
had been given away
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to neighbours and friends.
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I had the hoover.
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Rhian had some jewellery.
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Another friend, she had a frog,
which was a weight for a door.
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We cleaned the place up really well.
54
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You've got to keep searching
for that evidence.
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It is like finding a needle
in a haystack.
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(SOMBRE MUSIC)
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If you're charging me with assault,
he says to my mother...
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He gave them...
Come on, Jane.
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After I was charged
with assault on my mother,
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the shit hit the fan,
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and my parents disappeared again.
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Are you their mother?
No, I'm not their mother,
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and I've answered that one before.
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My mum says to Marty and I,
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"We can't keep living like this.
We're all going to the UK.
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"We've got air fares,
we've got all the tickets done.
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"We'll drop you at this hotel.
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"We'll pick you up at ten tomorrow
morning, and we're out of here."
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I thought, "I've still got a chance
at a family here," you know?
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Next morning, I was all pumped.
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Let's go! Went out.
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Nothing.
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It's just...no-one there,.
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And I waited and waited.
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And then I realised once again...
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"Yep, they've gone."
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Yeah.
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Just smacked me around a bit.
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Mm. Mm.
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And then Jane told me Marty
went to the UK with his girlfriend.
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Martin was very much involved
in helping them escape
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because he wanted
the relationship to continue.
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Oh, it's like someone's stabbed
you in the heart, really.
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I think all of us felt
that we were rejected again.
85
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We turned to drugs and alcohol
just to waste ourselves, you know,
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so that we didn't
have to think or feel.
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I went right back
to an abusive relationship
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and drug and alcohol abuse.
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There was no-one
and nowhere to turn to.
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We've never been a family,
we're just five people
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that have lived different lives,
but got the same name.
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The good thing is that you're
living with your parents,
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not relying on foster parents,
or anything,
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cos they never really treated you
the same as their own kids.
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It's just good
to have your own parents.
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When Martin went to the UK...
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..I never heard from him again.
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(INTRIGUING MUSIC)
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After two days,
looking for hairs, fibres, blood
100
00:07:08,320 --> 00:07:09,920
and fingerprints...
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..we found absolutely nothing.
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And whilst it was disappointing
to have no forensic evidence...
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..the report opened up a number
of theories in my mind.
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My first theory
was steam cleaning had taken place,
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so DNA and fingerprints
would have been destroyed.
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The second theory was,
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whilst we suspected the murder
had taken place within that flat...
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..it could have taken place
somewhere else altogether.
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Martin and I,
we lived with Leigh and John.
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They had this really nice apartment
in Reading.
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We had our own little space.
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Reading in the '80s,
it was just, like, wow!
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We were only young kids,
but we loved it.
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There were pubs everywhere,
pub culture was huge.
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The cars, the little cars,
the tiny streets.
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And then the bobbies on bicycles,
you know?
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Martin was a great pool player.
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We'd go down to the local pub
and he would thrash them all,
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the locals. (CHUCKLES)
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And it was, like,
"Yeah, that's my man." (LAUGHS)
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Martin became a different man
because he was happy
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and full of life, when he'd come in
and sitting around the dinner table
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and have a family to talk to.
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And they treated him
like he was the only child,
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like this long lost son
that had come back and returned,
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and very spoilt.
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He enjoyed being with his parents,
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but, again, there was that sadness
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that he didn't have his siblings.
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He felt he'd betrayed his sisters
and his brother by going to England.
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I couldn't believe he went.
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I know he wanted a mum and dad.
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We all did.
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He was just such a softie.
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He just wanted
that family situation.
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He wanted what everybody else has,
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but he had his blinders on.
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It just wasn't what he imagined.
139
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As the investigation went on,
something wasn't sitting right
with me.
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This body had been recently killed,
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but before it was found, Leigh Sabine
was weak, she was dying of cancer.
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Um, there was no way she'd have been
able to commit such an act.
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I started to go back
through the evidence,
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you know, review it with the team.
145
00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:10,000
Started looking at the body,
looking at the wrappings,
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and that's where I noticed
the Tesco carrier bag.
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Nothing unusual
about a Tesco carrier bag,
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only this one had a barcode on it.
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And the date
on that barcode was 1992.
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Er, you know, which was a
significant time away from 2015.
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00:10:25,640 --> 00:10:29,120
Now, I understand that people hold on
to carrier bags for a long time,
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but 20 years, I just
thought that was really unlikely.
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So, the body, er, when it
was found was wearing a pair
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of St Michael's pyjamas.
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00:10:40,120 --> 00:10:42,400
We spoke to Marks & Spencer
and what they told us
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was that those line of pyjamas
were discontinued in the early '90s.
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Initially, we believed
that this body is probably recent,
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yet everything else is telling me
159
00:10:54,680 --> 00:10:57,320
that this murder may have taken place
some years ago.
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Martin and I just settled
into local life.
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Martin had formed a really close
relationship with John.
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John would talk about how he missed
163
00:11:17,120 --> 00:11:20,360
sports days with his kids
and his sons.
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So, it was all happy families,
except for Leigh.
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She was jealous of the relationship
that Martin had with John.
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When I got home,
she'd either be, you know,
167
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loud and vivacious and happy.
168
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Other days she'd be like, you know,
really dark,
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moody, stroppy, short.
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And I'd think, "Ooh," you know,
"what's wrong with her?"
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Had she had too much to drink,
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or had they been fighting,
her and John?
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John was upset with not having
his other children around him.
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But it was the opposite for Leigh.
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It's almost like she'd had children
but they were more pets, you know,
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that she'd had and then discarded.
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She didn't have a motherly bone
in her body.
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(OMINOUS MUSIC)
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As investigators,
you think you're getting the story,
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00:12:24,760 --> 00:12:29,440
and then more information would take
you in a different direction.
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I went back to the pathologist
just to run through
182
00:12:35,400 --> 00:12:37,800
some of the things we were finding
and some of the things
183
00:12:37,840 --> 00:12:40,040
that were troubling me a little bit.
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00:12:40,080 --> 00:12:43,320
Could it be that the body
could have been there a lot longer?
185
00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:45,960
And the pathologist said
there were possibilities.
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00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:50,280
One thing which he did speak about
was the vacuum-packed theory.
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He explained, if that body had
been wrapped so tightly...
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(PARCEL TAPE RIPPING)
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..and around and round and round.
190
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Taped, sealed, bound,
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00:13:02,800 --> 00:13:05,960
and if it had been bound
with no air inside that packaging...
192
00:13:06,880 --> 00:13:11,080
..that would have prevented any
bacteria, prevented decomposition,
193
00:13:11,120 --> 00:13:13,280
kept the body really well preserved.
194
00:13:16,520 --> 00:13:19,280
It's almost far-fetched, isn't it?
195
00:13:22,240 --> 00:13:24,600
There was skin on the body,
there was hair on the body.
196
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The organs were intact.
There were no maggots.
197
00:13:27,400 --> 00:13:29,880
Right up until this point
of the investigation,
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00:13:29,920 --> 00:13:33,000
I'm working on the basis
this is a freshly killed male body...
199
00:13:33,960 --> 00:13:37,520
..but could this body have been
dead for quite some time,
200
00:13:37,560 --> 00:13:40,160
far longer
than we initially thought?
201
00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:41,480
(CAMERA SHUTTER CLICKS)
202
00:13:41,520 --> 00:13:43,520
When I spoke to the undertaker,
203
00:13:43,560 --> 00:13:46,120
the undertaker said,
"Oh, I've got a theory, Lynne.
204
00:13:46,160 --> 00:13:51,240
"She is proper vacuum-packed,
you know, like a piece of meat."
205
00:13:52,920 --> 00:13:57,160
He said, "I do think she's used
something to suck the air out."
206
00:13:58,520 --> 00:14:00,880
"Oh, I got the Hoover," I says,
"in the back of my car."
207
00:14:02,200 --> 00:14:04,120
I am so glad
it never went in my house
208
00:14:04,160 --> 00:14:06,760
cos that would have been
a horrible thought,
209
00:14:06,800 --> 00:14:09,200
to think that I had brought that
into my house.
210
00:14:10,160 --> 00:14:12,080
All of a sudden,
we were looking at a murder
211
00:14:12,120 --> 00:14:14,360
that had occurred many years ago,
212
00:14:14,400 --> 00:14:16,920
when the prime suspect, Leigh Sabine,
213
00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:20,680
was not too frail, ill,
to have committed such an act.
214
00:14:23,120 --> 00:14:26,120
After I found that Leigh
was at the centre of things,
215
00:14:26,160 --> 00:14:28,360
I started to reflect
216
00:14:28,400 --> 00:14:30,120
on something she'd told me,
217
00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:32,400
which I hadn't really registered
at the time,
218
00:14:32,440 --> 00:14:36,720
and it was that
one of her sons had died.
219
00:14:36,760 --> 00:14:42,120
And what I found strange was it
was almost like a throwaway remark.
220
00:14:43,200 --> 00:14:48,280
It didn't seem to be something
which bothered her a great deal.
221
00:14:52,080 --> 00:14:55,320
We'd been living together
for about six months.
222
00:14:55,360 --> 00:14:58,800
I came home from work,
and Martin said,
223
00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:01,440
"I've got to tell you something.
Mum wants you to move out."
224
00:15:01,480 --> 00:15:03,280
And I said, "What? What?"
225
00:15:03,320 --> 00:15:06,240
And he said,
"Mum doesn't want you here anymore."
226
00:15:06,280 --> 00:15:08,480
And I said, "Oh, my God!
227
00:15:08,520 --> 00:15:11,720
"What am I gonna tell Mum and Dad?
Where am I gonna go?
228
00:15:11,760 --> 00:15:14,240
"Like, what can I do?
But what have I done?
229
00:15:14,280 --> 00:15:17,080
"I haven't done anything."
And he said, "Yeah,
230
00:15:17,120 --> 00:15:21,280
"she's just gone off on one and
she doesn't want you to be here.
231
00:15:21,320 --> 00:15:23,120
"She wants you to move out."
232
00:15:23,160 --> 00:15:26,040
And I started crying.
I just didn't know what to do.
233
00:15:26,080 --> 00:15:27,840
(ARGUING)
234
00:15:29,720 --> 00:15:33,200
Martin was giving them what for,
telling them,
235
00:15:33,240 --> 00:15:34,920
"What the...is going on?"
236
00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:37,560
Why were they doing it again,
237
00:15:37,600 --> 00:15:41,520
and why were we
all the way over here in the UK
238
00:15:41,560 --> 00:15:43,560
for this to happen to him again?
239
00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:45,120
(ARGUING)
240
00:15:45,160 --> 00:15:49,960
It was the first time that I'd ever
really seen him that angry.
241
00:15:51,200 --> 00:15:55,200
He said, "If she goes,
I go too, and you lose me."
242
00:15:56,840 --> 00:15:58,880
John was very emotional.
243
00:15:58,920 --> 00:16:00,680
He was saying,
244
00:16:00,720 --> 00:16:03,640
"But, Leigh, you cannot do this."
Like, "Why are you doing it?"
245
00:16:03,680 --> 00:16:06,760
She just said, "Because I can."
246
00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:08,680
I thought, "What an evil bitch!"
247
00:16:10,560 --> 00:16:15,160
And Martin really saw his mother
for what she was.
248
00:16:16,840 --> 00:16:22,960
In that moment, I felt Leigh would
do anything to be in control again.
249
00:16:25,680 --> 00:16:27,840
I just remember packing my suitcase,
250
00:16:27,880 --> 00:16:29,880
and off we went
into the dead of night.
251
00:16:31,680 --> 00:16:34,040
I just didn't know what to do.
252
00:16:35,120 --> 00:16:38,800
Martin stood by me and he said,
"I'll never go back."
253
00:16:40,800 --> 00:16:44,680
After that,
Martin just went downhill.
254
00:16:44,720 --> 00:16:47,920
His whole life
just revolved around drinking.
255
00:16:47,960 --> 00:16:49,960
He would get really dark.
256
00:16:51,200 --> 00:16:54,000
Our relationship spiralled down,
257
00:16:54,040 --> 00:16:57,840
and so we just ended up breaking up.
258
00:16:57,880 --> 00:17:00,280
He moved back to New Zealand.
259
00:17:03,520 --> 00:17:06,800
And one day I get this phone call
out of the blue
260
00:17:06,839 --> 00:17:08,720
that Marty passed away.
261
00:17:12,160 --> 00:17:17,280
In 2000,
Marty had been found deceased...
262
00:17:18,319 --> 00:17:20,319
..and...
263
00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:24,760
..he had taken his own life.
264
00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:34,360
I couldn't believe
that Marty had pa...
265
00:17:34,400 --> 00:17:36,720
I just never thought
he would do that.
266
00:17:36,760 --> 00:17:40,760
He was just a fun,
easy-going, gentle soul.
267
00:17:40,800 --> 00:17:45,480
That really knocked me around
for ages, that,
268
00:17:45,520 --> 00:17:47,600
because I felt
like I'd let him down.
269
00:17:47,640 --> 00:17:50,200
Even though I'd had nothing
to do with him for years,
270
00:17:50,240 --> 00:17:52,360
I felt like I'd let him down.
271
00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:57,240
On the day of his funeral,
I just cried and cried and cried,
272
00:17:57,280 --> 00:17:58,960
and I just couldn't believe it.
273
00:18:00,680 --> 00:18:03,080
When he went back to the UK
274
00:18:03,120 --> 00:18:05,440
to see them
and they shit on him again,
275
00:18:05,480 --> 00:18:07,480
I totally believe
he never got over it.
276
00:18:07,520 --> 00:18:09,160
It might have been not the thing
277
00:18:09,200 --> 00:18:11,400
that drove him over
the edge in the end,
278
00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:14,480
but, man, it would have filled
the cup, you know?
279
00:18:16,640 --> 00:18:18,840
We all can only take so much.
280
00:18:19,720 --> 00:18:20,920
Yeah.
281
00:18:21,840 --> 00:18:25,920
Martin phoned me
a few days before he killed himself.
282
00:18:25,960 --> 00:18:29,320
He'd often phone every now and then,
he'd drunken dial.
283
00:18:31,280 --> 00:18:36,720
He called me by the nickname
he used to call me, you know,
284
00:18:36,760 --> 00:18:39,080
and I sort of said to him,
"Oh, Martin."
285
00:18:39,120 --> 00:18:43,160
I said, "Oh," you know. I said,
"Stop it!" I said, "You're drunk."
286
00:18:43,200 --> 00:18:46,240
He told me that he loved me
and that he'd always love me,
287
00:18:46,280 --> 00:18:48,800
and then that was it.
288
00:18:50,880 --> 00:18:54,400
In my heart of hearts now,
when I look back on that phone call,
289
00:18:54,440 --> 00:18:56,120
that last phone call,
290
00:18:56,160 --> 00:18:59,720
it was his goodbye,
that he'd had enough.
291
00:18:59,760 --> 00:19:02,120
He'd actually had enough.
292
00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:05,320
So, yeah...
293
00:19:06,440 --> 00:19:08,400
Sorry.
294
00:19:14,760 --> 00:19:18,320
I understand why he took his life.
295
00:19:19,440 --> 00:19:22,440
Not that I think it was right,
296
00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:25,360
but he felt it was right for him.
297
00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:28,000
He was tired of believing in people.
298
00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:31,600
No-one can hurt him where he is now,
so that's good.
299
00:19:33,080 --> 00:19:34,160
Mm.
300
00:19:35,720 --> 00:19:40,400
I could never forgive my parents
for what happened to Marty.
301
00:19:42,560 --> 00:19:46,440
They destroyed a beautiful soul.
302
00:19:54,400 --> 00:19:56,040
(PHONE RINGS)
303
00:19:57,760 --> 00:20:00,480
After Marty had passed,
304
00:20:00,520 --> 00:20:03,040
I received a phone call
and it's my mother.
305
00:20:03,080 --> 00:20:06,280
And she said somebody had
knocked on her door,
306
00:20:06,320 --> 00:20:08,240
and it was two policemen,
307
00:20:08,280 --> 00:20:13,440
and they had informed her
that her son had died.
308
00:20:14,480 --> 00:20:18,560
I said, "Yes," and I told her
how he had died.
309
00:20:18,600 --> 00:20:22,800
And she says,
"Oh. But why would he do that?"
310
00:20:22,840 --> 00:20:25,120
I was just speechless.
311
00:20:25,160 --> 00:20:27,560
It's, like, "What the fuck, lady?"
312
00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:30,120
It's, like...
313
00:20:30,160 --> 00:20:32,760
"Because of you."
314
00:20:40,000 --> 00:20:43,600
Not long after my mother passed away,
315
00:20:43,640 --> 00:20:47,560
Mary West was cleaning out
my mother's home,
316
00:20:47,600 --> 00:20:53,880
and came across all these letters
she had written to all us children.
317
00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:57,440
I just couldn't believe
what she was saying in them.
318
00:20:57,480 --> 00:20:59,680
Just crazy talk.
319
00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:03,360
Jane's ones were bad.
320
00:21:03,400 --> 00:21:06,360
Jane was the ugly duckling.
321
00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:08,040
Marty's ones were bad,
322
00:21:08,080 --> 00:21:11,920
calling him gutless and soft,
323
00:21:11,960 --> 00:21:14,640
and when she had him, he was weak.
324
00:21:18,200 --> 00:21:20,640
Children were a burden to her.
325
00:21:20,680 --> 00:21:22,720
She didn't care about any of us.
326
00:21:22,760 --> 00:21:24,800
Everything was about her.
327
00:21:26,680 --> 00:21:29,800
How could she write such horrible...
328
00:21:29,840 --> 00:21:32,000
horrible, nasty,
329
00:21:32,040 --> 00:21:34,160
mean, evil stuff?
330
00:21:34,200 --> 00:21:36,600
She had a whole life with no kids
331
00:21:36,640 --> 00:21:40,760
to do whatever she wanted to do,
enjoy her life.
332
00:21:40,800 --> 00:21:43,320
I just don't know why...
333
00:21:43,360 --> 00:21:45,520
why she had so much hate.
334
00:21:48,560 --> 00:21:50,440
Towards the end,
335
00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:54,320
she said to me, "You could write
my life story for me."
336
00:21:55,320 --> 00:21:58,600
It didn't appear that she had
a good upbringing herself.
337
00:22:01,360 --> 00:22:04,080
Leigh told me that she grew up
in the Rhondda,
338
00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:08,840
which is a mining valley
in South Wales.
339
00:22:08,880 --> 00:22:12,320
It was tough because, literally,
there was no money.
340
00:22:15,240 --> 00:22:18,000
Leigh had been abandoned
as a young child.
341
00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:22,200
Her mother had left her father
342
00:22:22,240 --> 00:22:24,560
when Leigh was about three,
343
00:22:24,600 --> 00:22:26,960
and Leigh had been taken into care.
344
00:22:27,920 --> 00:22:30,600
It had been a painful time for her.
345
00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:35,880
She used to say that she'd been
abused when she was in care.
346
00:22:35,920 --> 00:22:38,960
She didn't go into detail about it.
347
00:22:39,000 --> 00:22:43,360
It left her, as often happens
with children like this,
348
00:22:43,400 --> 00:22:46,440
as though she was
emotionally stunted.
349
00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:53,080
I felt she had never been taught
how to be a mother.
350
00:22:54,200 --> 00:22:58,480
When she was about 15,
she went to live with her aunt,
351
00:22:58,520 --> 00:23:00,720
and her aunt encouraged her to sing.
352
00:23:00,760 --> 00:23:05,320
Lee's aunt modelled her appearance
on the singer, Deanna Durbin.
353
00:23:05,360 --> 00:23:07,880
"I wanted to look nice
my first time out in Vienna."
354
00:23:07,920 --> 00:23:11,120
"Oh, now, looks very nice.
Very, very pretty."
355
00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:12,880
Bought her clothes,
356
00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:14,640
make up, etcetera,
357
00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:18,040
so that she did echo Deanna Durbin.
358
00:23:19,080 --> 00:23:23,400
That could have been when Leigh
tried to build up this persona,
359
00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:26,280
and rather than live
in the real world...
360
00:23:27,360 --> 00:23:32,240
..she chose to fantasise about
what she wanted her life to be.
361
00:23:39,400 --> 00:23:42,640
There was no doubt that
she was an absolute storyteller.
362
00:23:42,680 --> 00:23:45,920
The stories of her life
were totally mythical.
363
00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:50,600
She wasn't actually
Lee Sabine from New Zealand.
364
00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:52,720
We found out her name was Ann Evans.
365
00:23:52,760 --> 00:23:55,640
She was a lady who was born
in the Rhondda Valley in South Wales.
366
00:23:56,760 --> 00:23:58,800
She grew up in that area.
367
00:24:00,120 --> 00:24:03,200
Can you believe she lived in the
Rhondda? It's only up the road.
368
00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:05,800
A valleys girl?
Good God, well. I wouldn't have...
369
00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:10,760
I mean, you, obviously,
you can tell my accent.
370
00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:13,000
You would never have known
that from her...
371
00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:14,920
No, definitely not, no.
..Her accent.
372
00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:17,200
No fucking way.
373
00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:21,360
Fuck off! We always thought
she was from New Zealand.
374
00:24:21,400 --> 00:24:23,720
I would never,
never in a million years,
375
00:24:23,760 --> 00:24:25,760
have thought
that she was from Rhondda Valley.
376
00:24:25,800 --> 00:24:28,160
And they say you can't take
the valley out of the...
377
00:24:28,200 --> 00:24:30,800
the girl from the valley.
You can, obviously, yeah.
378
00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:34,840
Everything she said was untrue.
379
00:24:34,880 --> 00:24:36,240
Absolute lie.
380
00:24:36,280 --> 00:24:38,880
She just lived in a different world
to everybody else.
381
00:24:47,560 --> 00:24:52,280
I remember one day out of the blue,
my mother rang.
382
00:24:53,480 --> 00:24:56,880
She said, "Your father passed
a couple of years ago."
383
00:24:56,920 --> 00:24:59,520
And I says, "Oh, how did he pass?"
384
00:24:59,560 --> 00:25:03,320
And she said, "Oh, he had
a lot of medical issues."
385
00:25:03,360 --> 00:25:05,280
I says, "Oh, that's really sad."
386
00:25:05,320 --> 00:25:07,680
And she's,
"Oh, I never truly loved him."
387
00:25:07,720 --> 00:25:10,160
I hung up.
388
00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:12,000
Why she even felt the need
389
00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:14,360
to tell me she never truly
loved him, I don't know.
390
00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:21,240
I remember,
Lee and John had moved in.
391
00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:23,080
Would have been about '97.
392
00:25:23,120 --> 00:25:25,640
My father said, "New neighbours."
I said, "Oh, that's nice.
393
00:25:25,680 --> 00:25:27,240
"Have you met them?"
394
00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:30,280
"Yes." I said, "What's the matter?"
He said, "Oh, I don't like her."
395
00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:31,920
"Something about her
that I don't like."
396
00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:33,960
"She's too in your face.
Oh, I don't like her."
397
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:37,640
John was just...quiet.
398
00:25:37,680 --> 00:25:39,720
He was very quiet.
Sat in the background.
399
00:25:39,760 --> 00:25:43,280
He spoke,
but she did most of the talking.
400
00:25:46,080 --> 00:25:49,040
We did full proof of life
enquiries for John Sabine.
401
00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:51,800
DVLA, National Health Service,
402
00:25:51,840 --> 00:25:53,360
passport enquiries.
403
00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:56,720
John had only been living there
three, four months, at the most?
404
00:25:56,760 --> 00:25:58,560
He wasn't there long,
put it like that.
405
00:25:58,600 --> 00:26:01,560
There was only a handful of times
I ever had any interaction with him.
406
00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:06,200
I'd never met John Sabine,
but Lee said that he'd left her
407
00:26:06,240 --> 00:26:11,000
because, "Darling,
that's what Italian men do."
408
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:15,840
We were able to prove
that on the 10th of February 1997...
409
00:26:17,160 --> 00:26:21,040
..John and Lee Sabine had
moved into 57, Trem-y-Cwm in Beddau.
410
00:26:21,080 --> 00:26:25,120
Both of them
had signed the tenancy agreement.
411
00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:28,200
A couple of months later,
9th April 1997,
412
00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:30,320
he'd actually been physically seen
by a doctor,
413
00:26:30,360 --> 00:26:32,320
who recorded that meeting.
414
00:26:32,360 --> 00:26:34,360
But since April 1997,
415
00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:38,600
no-one had ever seen
or heard of John Sabine.
416
00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:42,920
When I looked back
at the death certificate
Mary West had uncovered...
417
00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:48,200
..it was for a John H Sabine.
418
00:26:48,240 --> 00:26:51,000
He was a male who was born in 1929.
419
00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:55,040
However, looking at this document,
John Sabine was born
420
00:26:55,080 --> 00:26:57,040
on the 5th August 1930.
421
00:26:59,080 --> 00:27:01,640
So, you had the same name,
John Sabine,
422
00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:04,320
both born in the London area,
423
00:27:04,360 --> 00:27:06,720
but the date of births
were actually out by one year.
424
00:27:09,080 --> 00:27:11,240
So, with all the best intentions
of Mary West,
425
00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:14,360
she'd had the death certificate
of a different person.
426
00:27:16,360 --> 00:27:19,840
After John had supposedly left her,
427
00:27:19,880 --> 00:27:21,640
when we went to visit my parents,
428
00:27:21,680 --> 00:27:25,040
as soon as you open the door,
this smell would hit you.
429
00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:27,440
It had to be coming
from Leigh's flat.
430
00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:29,600
I'd say to my mum,
"What on Earth is that smell?"
431
00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:32,000
"Oh, she's cooking curry."
432
00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:36,120
I used to say, "Mum, I cook
curry. It doesn't smell like that."
433
00:27:36,160 --> 00:27:38,160
It was a putrid smell.
434
00:27:38,200 --> 00:27:40,120
She'd put a load of potpourri,
etcetera,
435
00:27:40,160 --> 00:27:43,600
to hide the smell.
It didn't work, though.
436
00:27:43,640 --> 00:27:47,480
Now we're focussing on John Sabine
as the potential victim,
437
00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:50,920
but we had no definitive proof
that it was him.
438
00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:54,520
We needed the DNA from his children
439
00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:57,000
in order to establish identity.
440
00:27:58,880 --> 00:28:03,640
I got a phone call from the police,
and they want a DNA sample,
441
00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:05,520
so they can identify the body.
442
00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:08,160
And I said, "Good," and then
they contacted me back,
443
00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:10,280
and said,
"We don't need one off you.
444
00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:12,800
We got one off your brother.
445
00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:14,960
And then I says,
"But my brother's dead."
446
00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:17,000
"No, no, you've got a half-brother
over here."
447
00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:20,360
Excuse my language
but I thought, "Holy fuck!
448
00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:22,760
"What else is going
to come out of this?"
449
00:28:23,680 --> 00:28:25,800
We were starting to delve deeper
into John Sabine,
450
00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:28,840
pulling his army records,
and that's when we found out
451
00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:31,640
that he'd actually had two children
from a previous marriage
452
00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:34,160
that were living in the UK.
453
00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:36,320
(SHEEP BLEATING)
454
00:28:37,400 --> 00:28:41,520
I'm Chris Sabine, son of
John Sabine from his first marriage.
455
00:28:46,520 --> 00:28:48,080
I was about one years old.
456
00:28:48,120 --> 00:28:50,040
My sister would have been
about two and a half
457
00:28:50,080 --> 00:28:53,000
when my father abandoned us.
458
00:28:56,720 --> 00:28:58,520
Back in 2015,
459
00:28:58,560 --> 00:29:01,200
we were selling Christmas trees,
460
00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:05,120
and the phone rang,
and I picked the phone up.
461
00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:08,640
This Welsh accent said,
"Is Christopher John Sabine there?"
462
00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:13,160
They said, "We wanna come out
and do a test on you
463
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:17,440
"because we've found a body.
We think it's your father.
464
00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:20,440
"If we can come over
as soon as possible."
465
00:29:20,480 --> 00:29:22,840
I said, "When's that?"
They said, "Tomorrow morning."
466
00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:24,560
I thought, "Well, it's Saturday."
467
00:29:24,600 --> 00:29:26,800
A Sunday.
No, it was Saturday then.
468
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:29,600
Yeah.Then they said
they'll be over by the morning.
469
00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:31,520
They were here at nine o'clock,
ten o'clock?
470
00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:34,520
Nine o'clock.
In the morning? They did a DNA test.
471
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:38,080
Well, I was a bit stunned by it,
really,
472
00:29:38,120 --> 00:29:41,160
because you thought,
"What's happened?"
473
00:29:43,480 --> 00:29:46,720
My mother said
when I was one or two years old,
474
00:29:46,760 --> 00:29:49,480
my father came back
from the Korean War.
475
00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:51,960
He had shellshock.
476
00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:55,760
He was in hospital
for a long period of time,
477
00:29:55,800 --> 00:29:58,240
and he got friendly with the nurse.
478
00:29:59,160 --> 00:30:01,480
Next thing you know,
she got pregnant.
479
00:30:02,360 --> 00:30:06,360
At the time, John was 28
and Lee was 17.
480
00:30:07,640 --> 00:30:10,240
When my mother found out,
she decided, that's it,
481
00:30:10,280 --> 00:30:13,400
best thing he can do is sling his
hook, and told him to leave.
482
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:17,320
It were one of the worst things
in my life.
483
00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:20,280
I never grew up with a father.
There's a lot to miss.
484
00:30:25,560 --> 00:30:28,000
Officers went to see Chris,
485
00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:30,560
took a DNA sample kit,
which comprised of a mouth swab.
486
00:30:30,600 --> 00:30:33,720
We quickly fast-tracked them
to the lab.
487
00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:37,320
I was very conscious
this was someone
488
00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:39,720
who hadn't seen their father
for many, many years.
489
00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:42,640
We weren't sure
of their relationship.
490
00:30:42,680 --> 00:30:45,640
We weren't sure of the impact
that a match could have on Chris.
491
00:30:47,400 --> 00:30:51,160
In the mid-'80s, when I was
round about the age of 32,
492
00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:53,160
we get this phone call to say,
493
00:30:53,200 --> 00:30:55,840
"This is your father, John Sabine.
494
00:30:55,880 --> 00:30:59,120
"Would you like to meet me?"
I said, "Yeah, certainly."
495
00:30:59,160 --> 00:31:01,280
I couldn't believe it.
496
00:31:01,320 --> 00:31:03,600
We met for over a year,
and everything was nice.
497
00:31:03,640 --> 00:31:07,280
We went down every fortnight
to Reading,
498
00:31:07,320 --> 00:31:09,000
and we always went out for dinner.
499
00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:11,200
We paid one week,
they paid the following.
500
00:31:12,520 --> 00:31:15,920
It was very strange
cos going all through my life
501
00:31:15,960 --> 00:31:18,120
with no father,
all of a sudden I've got a father.
502
00:31:18,160 --> 00:31:20,040
I was really pleased to see him.
503
00:31:21,120 --> 00:31:23,360
I think he wanted to have a family.
504
00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:26,680
Not so much be a dad,
but have a family.
505
00:31:27,600 --> 00:31:31,040
As we got to know them both more,
506
00:31:31,080 --> 00:31:34,240
it appeared that she was
definitely the one in control.
507
00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:38,360
John agreed with everything
that she said.
508
00:31:38,400 --> 00:31:41,800
He would never stand up against her.
He wouldn't argue with her.
509
00:31:43,120 --> 00:31:44,960
She was a bit aggressive.
510
00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:49,000
One day, I rung up to say,
"I've got my first child."
511
00:31:49,040 --> 00:31:51,040
"You're a grandad now."
512
00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:53,800
And it's almost as if
he couldn't speak to me.
513
00:31:53,840 --> 00:31:56,320
And that was it.
Never saw him again.
514
00:31:57,480 --> 00:32:00,880
Which was strange cos I thought
John was very, very keen
515
00:32:00,920 --> 00:32:02,640
to have a grandchild.
516
00:32:02,680 --> 00:32:05,800
I don't think Lee at the time
wanted him
517
00:32:05,840 --> 00:32:07,960
to have any relationship
back with us.
518
00:32:08,000 --> 00:32:09,880
She's a very jealous person,
519
00:32:09,920 --> 00:32:11,800
and it was her way or no way.
520
00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:15,320
(UNSETTLING MUSIC)
521
00:32:21,000 --> 00:32:24,200
So, two days, we received
the results of the DNA test.
522
00:32:24,240 --> 00:32:27,120
DNA that we derived from Christopher
523
00:32:27,160 --> 00:32:29,840
had helped us
positively identify the victim.
524
00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:33,840
It showed that it was actually
his father, John Sabine.
525
00:32:37,400 --> 00:32:39,080
I was horrified.
526
00:32:39,120 --> 00:32:43,360
I was sad. I was all these emotions.
527
00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:46,160
Couldn't believe it,
but I could believe it.
528
00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:48,880
And I felt sorry for John.
529
00:32:49,960 --> 00:32:52,840
I thought, "You poor man."
530
00:32:52,880 --> 00:32:59,760
He wasn't perfect,
but I felt sad for my father.
531
00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:05,720
In the little time I knew him,
he always seemed placid to me.
532
00:33:05,760 --> 00:33:08,560
In New Zealand,
when the press were going,
533
00:33:08,600 --> 00:33:11,040
he would be just about crying,
you know.
534
00:33:11,080 --> 00:33:12,840
He was... It was too much for him.
535
00:33:12,880 --> 00:33:15,400
I want it left alone.
We'll leave 'em be.
536
00:33:15,440 --> 00:33:18,440
All you're trying to do
is to break the family up
537
00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:21,080
and cause a lot of problems.
Right, thank you.
538
00:33:21,120 --> 00:33:22,920
When I was told
to leave that home...
539
00:33:24,560 --> 00:33:26,960
..my father came running out
with a parrot.
540
00:33:28,320 --> 00:33:31,400
It was a hanging parrot
that sat on the swing.
541
00:33:32,480 --> 00:33:34,800
He had pulled that parrot
off the swing,
542
00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:37,200
and he gave it to me
and told me he loved me.
543
00:33:38,200 --> 00:33:42,440
And I think that's where this
softness I hold is there for him.
544
00:33:44,800 --> 00:33:49,680
I don't know that my mother
knew about this parrot,
545
00:33:49,720 --> 00:33:52,000
but she would have hated that.
546
00:33:57,120 --> 00:34:01,320
The theory was that John Sabine
was killed by Lee Sabine
547
00:34:01,360 --> 00:34:03,640
some time in 1997.
548
00:34:03,680 --> 00:34:06,160
But there was no hard evidence.
549
00:34:08,280 --> 00:34:10,280
Confirming the identity
of the body gave a number
550
00:34:10,320 --> 00:34:12,600
of investigative options to me,
551
00:34:12,639 --> 00:34:14,360
one being the media.
552
00:34:14,400 --> 00:34:16,320
You know, appealing for witnesses.
553
00:34:16,360 --> 00:34:19,040
I formally named
John Sabine as the victim
554
00:34:19,080 --> 00:34:21,880
and that was the first time
that his name had really gone out.
555
00:34:21,920 --> 00:34:25,400
Welsh police have discovered the
body of a man wrapped in plastic.
556
00:34:25,440 --> 00:34:30,199
John Sabine was last seen 18 years
ago.They lived all over the UK.
557
00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:32,760
They kept no close friends,
no close family members.
558
00:34:32,800 --> 00:34:36,600
If you do know anything about this
couple please call them on 101.
559
00:34:38,560 --> 00:34:41,480
The most interesting phone call was
from a lady called Valerie Chalkley.
560
00:34:42,760 --> 00:34:45,480
She'd been friendly with the Sabines
561
00:34:45,520 --> 00:34:48,280
when they returned from Australia
in 1984 and were living in Reading.
562
00:34:49,320 --> 00:34:55,000
She was a strange, strange person,
she really, she really was.
563
00:34:55,040 --> 00:34:57,600
Valerie Chalkley tells the story
564
00:34:57,640 --> 00:35:01,000
of how she lost touch
with John and Leigh.
565
00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:03,360
For a number of years,
she didn't speak to them,
566
00:35:03,400 --> 00:35:06,720
and she says, "I get a phone call out
of the blue and it's Leigh Sabine."
567
00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:09,080
And she put the date around 1997.
568
00:35:09,120 --> 00:35:13,040
Valerie Chalkley just asked her,
"How are you? How's John?"
569
00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:15,960
She said, "I've killed him."
570
00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:18,760
I said, "Er..."
She said, "Yeah, I've killed him.
571
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:21,400
"I've battered him with a stone frog
572
00:35:21,440 --> 00:35:24,160
"because he was getting
on my nerves."
573
00:35:25,200 --> 00:35:27,520
And I thought,
"Oh, she's having me on."
574
00:35:27,560 --> 00:35:31,360
She could out with statements
that were totally ridiculous,
575
00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:35,880
and you know when you feel a bit
of fool and think, "I feel a fool,"
576
00:35:35,920 --> 00:35:40,120
and if I said, "Is that true?" she'd
say, "Course it isn't," you know.
577
00:35:40,160 --> 00:35:43,120
Then she goes on
to talk about other things.
578
00:35:43,160 --> 00:35:45,840
Changed the subject completely.
579
00:35:47,120 --> 00:35:49,760
She was a show woman,
she really was.
580
00:35:49,800 --> 00:35:52,840
If she could have written
her life story,
581
00:35:52,880 --> 00:35:54,400
this is what she would have done.
582
00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:56,800
This is how
she would have wanted it.
583
00:35:56,840 --> 00:36:00,680
People talking about her,
leaving an impression.
584
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:06,360
Listening to what she told me,
I wasn't sure what to make of it.
585
00:36:06,400 --> 00:36:10,920
This was so bizarre, this
information. How credible was this?
586
00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:13,960
We weren't sure whether this was
the missing piece of the puzzle,
587
00:36:14,000 --> 00:36:17,040
this was actually it,
or whether it's a weird story.
588
00:36:18,240 --> 00:36:20,360
This ornamental frog
that has been used,
589
00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:24,360
potentially, as a murder weapon
to kill John, we have to trace it.
590
00:36:24,400 --> 00:36:26,640
How we gonna do that?
It's been 18 years.
591
00:36:32,085 --> 00:36:35,040
(GENTLE MUSIC)
592
00:36:38,800 --> 00:36:43,720
CID contacted me and asked me
if I'd ever seen this frog,
593
00:36:43,760 --> 00:36:47,640
and I said, "Well, it used to be
propping Leigh's bedroom door open."
594
00:36:48,800 --> 00:36:52,920
I just tasked the officers to go back
and speak to Lee's neighbours.
595
00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:56,640
We started doing some inquiries,
596
00:36:56,680 --> 00:36:58,440
and the very first place we go
597
00:36:58,480 --> 00:37:01,920
is to the resident downstairs
who was arrested as a suspect.
598
00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:05,240
That was a sensitive inquiry
cos Michelle James was quite upset
599
00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:07,520
over the fact that she'd been
arrested in this case.
600
00:37:08,560 --> 00:37:11,040
We ask her, "Is there any other
boxes belonging to Leigh?"
601
00:37:11,080 --> 00:37:13,400
She said, "Oh, I think
there's a box on top of my fridge."
602
00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:17,400
And there it was.
603
00:37:18,800 --> 00:37:21,640
Both our eyes lit up, you know,
thinking, "That it might be it."
604
00:37:24,440 --> 00:37:28,600
What the pathologist was able to do
was produce digital imagery.
605
00:37:30,520 --> 00:37:34,760
You could see where that frog
had been driven into the skull.
606
00:37:34,800 --> 00:37:36,960
It was a perfect overlay.
607
00:37:37,920 --> 00:37:42,120
My theory is, John Sabine
had gone to bed, fallen asleep.
608
00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:44,160
They may have had an argument
earlier that night.
609
00:37:44,200 --> 00:37:47,960
And then she's grabbed
that stone frog
610
00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:51,040
and she's attacked him with
some significant blows to the head
611
00:37:51,080 --> 00:37:52,840
which have ended his life.
612
00:37:57,280 --> 00:38:00,760
It just didn't seem real.
It's so far-fetched.
613
00:38:01,760 --> 00:38:04,400
18 years and no-one missed him,
you know?
614
00:38:04,440 --> 00:38:06,120
Oh, God.
615
00:38:07,280 --> 00:38:11,360
Part of me thinks that my father
was always feeling bad
616
00:38:11,400 --> 00:38:14,960
that he had left us again.
617
00:38:16,240 --> 00:38:22,320
I think she didn't wanna hear it and
hit him over the head to shut him up.
618
00:38:23,320 --> 00:38:27,120
She just disposed of him
like she did everybody else.
619
00:38:28,200 --> 00:38:30,040
She got away with murder,
620
00:38:30,080 --> 00:38:32,080
she got away with so much
in her life.
621
00:38:32,120 --> 00:38:34,920
You know,
I can't forgive someone for that.
622
00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:39,200
Our father loved her
unconditionally.
623
00:38:39,240 --> 00:38:42,720
He had nobody else,
so he stayed with her,
624
00:38:42,760 --> 00:38:45,480
and he paid a terrible price.
625
00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:57,080
This is the ring that my father John
had on him when they found the body.
626
00:38:57,120 --> 00:38:59,880
There's nothing much else.
627
00:38:59,920 --> 00:39:02,160
Nothing. Nothing at all, no photos,
628
00:39:02,200 --> 00:39:04,120
no nothing.
629
00:39:04,160 --> 00:39:06,280
At his funeral,
630
00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:09,600
there's nobody there.
Literally, nobody.
631
00:39:09,640 --> 00:39:13,240
It was as if he was a ghost
in the area that he lived.
632
00:39:13,280 --> 00:39:15,400
Nobody can ever recognise him,
633
00:39:15,440 --> 00:39:19,120
nobody ever saw him,
nobody ever interacted with him,
634
00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:22,640
but I think that's exactly
how she wanted it to be.
635
00:39:22,680 --> 00:39:26,120
It was, er, coercive control.
636
00:39:26,160 --> 00:39:28,760
A murder has been concealed
for some 18 years,
637
00:39:28,800 --> 00:39:32,480
and Ann Sabine kept up the facade
that John Sabine left her,
638
00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:34,960
or was with another woman,
or had, indeed, died.
639
00:39:35,880 --> 00:39:37,600
It's almost like Lee Sabine
640
00:39:37,640 --> 00:39:39,640
was thinking ahead
and setting traps for people.
641
00:39:39,680 --> 00:39:43,720
The stone frog was actually
sitting in Michelle's flat.
642
00:39:43,760 --> 00:39:45,560
Leigh's even told Michelle James
643
00:39:45,600 --> 00:39:48,560
this story
around the medical skeleton.
644
00:39:48,600 --> 00:39:51,360
It's really cruel, when you think of
what Michelle James went through.
645
00:39:52,440 --> 00:39:56,960
The impact that the murder
had on Michelle was quite appalling.
646
00:39:58,360 --> 00:40:00,080
If Lee had come clean,
647
00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:03,320
she was dying, she couldn't have
been brought to justice,
648
00:40:03,360 --> 00:40:06,320
but there would have been more
a sense of natural justice
649
00:40:06,360 --> 00:40:11,120
if other people hadn't had
to be implicated.
650
00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:14,480
TV: "Mr Sabine was never reported
as a missing person,
651
00:40:14,520 --> 00:40:17,520
"and the circumstances
of where his body was concealed
652
00:40:17,560 --> 00:40:19,800
"is part
of the ongoing investigation."
653
00:40:21,640 --> 00:40:26,200
Going into that flat,
I can't recall seeing a big freezer.
654
00:40:26,240 --> 00:40:29,520
I can't recall seeing an attic door.
There probably was.
655
00:40:29,560 --> 00:40:32,200
Was that body in the loft?
656
00:40:32,240 --> 00:40:36,280
I think it was under the divan bed.
657
00:40:38,160 --> 00:40:39,520
Under the bed? No way.
658
00:40:39,560 --> 00:40:43,280
The only other possible place it
could have been was in the garden.
659
00:40:43,320 --> 00:40:45,520
Now, whether
he was in the garden shed.
660
00:40:45,560 --> 00:40:49,200
The only feasible place
that it could have been stored
661
00:40:49,240 --> 00:40:52,120
was there was one sort of store
cupboard where the meter was kept.
662
00:40:53,040 --> 00:40:55,760
It would have had to be somewhere
where she could have access
663
00:40:55,800 --> 00:40:58,360
to the body and continually wrap it
664
00:40:58,400 --> 00:41:00,240
over a period of time, you know,
665
00:41:00,280 --> 00:41:03,360
to prevent the smells
and prevent any decomposition.
666
00:41:11,200 --> 00:41:13,200
(INTRIGUING MUSIC)
667
00:41:16,320 --> 00:41:19,840
But I absolutely felt
that she had duped us.
668
00:41:21,440 --> 00:41:24,640
She had this secret all along
and was hiding it from us.
669
00:41:26,640 --> 00:41:29,120
You don't think
you have a murderer in the midst,
670
00:41:29,160 --> 00:41:31,720
but, obviously,
there was one right on our doorstep.
671
00:41:35,680 --> 00:41:39,160
I felt angry with her afterwards
because she was an outsider
672
00:41:39,200 --> 00:41:42,880
who'd been accepted,
and she mocked that.
673
00:41:44,400 --> 00:41:48,160
And she boasted that,
"After I die I will be famous."
674
00:41:48,200 --> 00:41:51,440
And we laughed it off.
675
00:41:55,800 --> 00:41:58,480
She played a damn good part.
676
00:41:58,520 --> 00:42:00,720
An Oscar should have been awarded.
677
00:42:00,760 --> 00:42:03,080
She wasn't an actor; she was a liar.
678
00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:09,880
I do think she was evil, and those
children suffered because of her.
679
00:42:22,400 --> 00:42:24,840
I couldn't leave her
with all the glory
680
00:42:24,880 --> 00:42:27,680
of committing the perfect murder.
681
00:42:28,880 --> 00:42:33,960
Because this story
is not just about a murder,
682
00:42:34,000 --> 00:42:35,800
it's about our lives.
683
00:42:42,640 --> 00:42:48,120
I spent the majority of my life
trying to figure out
684
00:42:48,160 --> 00:42:50,520
why our parents might have left,
685
00:42:50,560 --> 00:42:55,000
and the reality
of what they did to us.
686
00:42:56,440 --> 00:42:59,640
All my life all I've wanted to do
is be part of a family,
687
00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:03,120
good, bad or otherwise. I just
wanted to belong to something.
688
00:43:03,160 --> 00:43:06,600
And all my life,
I never though we...I did.
689
00:43:09,200 --> 00:43:12,160
Last time I seen Lee-Ann
was about three or four years ago.
690
00:43:14,360 --> 00:43:16,200
Hey, sis!
691
00:43:16,240 --> 00:43:17,880
Jane the same time.
692
00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:19,960
(CHUCKLES) Hello!
693
00:43:21,560 --> 00:43:24,960
I always wonder what our family
would have been like
694
00:43:25,000 --> 00:43:27,120
if we'd stayed together.
695
00:43:28,240 --> 00:43:33,600
Did you guys know our mother was
abandoned when she was younger?
696
00:43:33,640 --> 00:43:36,160
Yep, she told Marty and I.
697
00:43:37,400 --> 00:43:41,440
I don't feel one ounce of pity
or sorrow or anything for her.
698
00:43:41,480 --> 00:43:43,800
Sorry, I don't.
699
00:43:43,840 --> 00:43:46,640
Why go and have five children
and leave them,
700
00:43:46,680 --> 00:43:48,320
when you know that pain?
701
00:43:48,360 --> 00:43:50,560
You know that pain of desertion,
702
00:43:50,600 --> 00:43:54,360
and yet she went and did it to us.
703
00:44:02,720 --> 00:44:05,800
But regardless
of what my mother did,
704
00:44:05,840 --> 00:44:07,720
we're breaking the cycle.
705
00:44:08,840 --> 00:44:13,000
I could never imagine putting my
kids through what I went through.
706
00:44:14,160 --> 00:44:15,840
My mother had a choice.
707
00:44:15,880 --> 00:44:19,480
Everyone's got to make a choice.
708
00:44:19,520 --> 00:44:21,840
Could have kept going
on the same route I was.
709
00:44:21,880 --> 00:44:24,480
I would either have been in jail
for the rest of my life,
710
00:44:24,520 --> 00:44:26,280
or I would have been dead.
711
00:44:27,760 --> 00:44:31,280
I knew that the only way out for me
712
00:44:31,320 --> 00:44:36,920
was if I had a child
to love and look after.
713
00:44:36,960 --> 00:44:38,840
That...
714
00:44:38,880 --> 00:44:41,400
That would save me.
715
00:44:41,440 --> 00:44:44,920
When you have a baby,
the love is instant.
716
00:44:46,000 --> 00:44:50,160
It's like the most amazing,
beautiful thing in the world.
717
00:44:50,200 --> 00:44:53,720
My kids were the best thing
that happened in my life.
718
00:44:57,880 --> 00:44:59,880
(SNIFFLES) Yeah.
719
00:45:07,880 --> 00:45:09,920
We've all come from a horrible place
720
00:45:09,960 --> 00:45:12,840
and done some amazing things
in our lives.
721
00:45:12,880 --> 00:45:15,080
You know, I own my own home...
722
00:45:16,080 --> 00:45:19,480
..got children, got a lovely wife,
you know.
723
00:45:19,520 --> 00:45:21,200
And I do love my wife.
724
00:45:21,240 --> 00:45:23,120
(LAUGHS)
725
00:45:23,160 --> 00:45:25,080
She wonders sometimes.
726
00:45:27,200 --> 00:45:31,400
I'm actually really proud of
the kids we've turned out to be.
727
00:45:32,720 --> 00:45:35,080
We're good kids. We have hearts.
728
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Unlike her.
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(POIGNANT MUSIC)
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