All language subtitles for I AM A KILLER_S05E03_Lives Lost.en.closedcaptions

[ominous music playing]

[man] If I could revisit myself that day,

I would wanna tell myself
where this was gonna lead.

One split second
can determine the rest of your life.

What I did at 16, it scared me.

And I'll always carry the weight
of taking somebody's life.

[music continues]

I've been in prison
for 27 and a half years.

Do I feel like I deserve to get out?

No.

But would I like to be given
the opportunity and the chance

to make something better of myself
and not be known as just this?

Yeah, for sure.

[eerie music playing]

[man 1]
I think we could all be dangerous people.

[man 2] People say you're a monster.

[man 3]
I'm not sitting here saying I'm innocent.

[man 4]
I just murdered some guy in cold blood.

[music fades out]

[birds chirping]

[somber instrumental music playing]

I'll get this from behind you.

-It's gonna come over your head.
-Mm-hmm.

[music continues]

[Higinio] At such a young age,
you don't understand

the ramifications of what you've done

until you're older.

It took me a long time to actually
look at it from not my perspective,

but his family's,

and that for me
was the hardest thing, and it still is.

[music fades out]

[train bell ringing]

[somber acoustic guitar music playing]

[Higinio] I was born in Lovell, Wyoming.

I know I was there for a short period
while my mom was going to college.

So we moved from Wyoming to Washington,
which is mostly where I grew up.

It was, you know, a normal childhood
to an extent on the outside,

you know, for other people.

My mom worked
with all the neighborhood kids.

She'd take us and try to teach us
right from wrong.

And we would always be held accountable
if we did something bad.

[music fades out]

[foreboding music playing]

[Higinio] But my father was different.

He was abusive physically
and also mentally and emotionally.

I remember one time, I was seven or eight,
he beat me pretty bad

to where I couldn't go to school
for, like, three weeks.

My mom dealt with a lot,

but, uh, she stayed because of…
You know, she did love my dad.

But in case my dad became very abusive,

we used to sleep with our shoes on
so we would always be ready to leave.

Looking back at it now,
it's pretty drastic, you know?

To have to do that
just to feel like we could be safe.

[music continues]

[Higinio] My dad was into
the drug business, you know.

Like, he hid it pretty well
from, you know, my mom.

But I remember I went to the bathroom
one time, and I walked in there,

and my dad had a bunch of, you know,
what I know now were kilos of cocaine.

My dad was a master mechanic.

So we thought
that's where the money was coming from.

And I'm sure my older brothers
knew more than I did,

but I knew then for sure what my dad did,
you know, to make all that money.

Eventually, like, my older brothers
started getting into the gang lifestyle.

You know, following in my dad's footsteps.

And me being the youngest,

I thought being with my older brothers
was the safest place for me.

But growing up that young
in that kind of lifestyle,

it's pretty traumatic in itself.

I think I was 12, and I remember
standing on a corner one time

next to a friend of our family,

and someone just coming up
and shooting him in the face.

[dog barking]

[Higinio] After that was when my mom
decided to get us out of Washington,

away from my dad.

[music fades out]

[gentle melodic music playing]

[birds chirping]

[Higinio] We moved to Billings,

and right away,
we realized it was different.

It wasn't a big city, and my mom's like,
"This is where we'll be from now on."

She told us, "It's to get you guys
away from all that stuff."

That was her plan.
That's what she thought was gonna happen,

but that didn't work out too good.

[music fades out]

[tense music playing]

[Higinio] Word spread real quick
about what my dad did, you know?

Because I looked up to my dad,
and I seen the money, that was it for me.

I was like, "You know, this is maybe
something I do need to do."

And, uh, yeah, it became the norm,
you know, for me and my brothers.

My dad raised us to be men of the street.

Breaking into cars, stealing stereos,
and we started getting into fights.

[music intensifies]

And I remember the first fight
I got into in school. I got kicked out.

And then I remember
I got assault charges pressed on me.

And so that was my first incident actually
being in trouble with, you know, the law.

[music continues]

[music fades out]

[Higinio] When I got out of juvenile
is when things spiraled out of control.

[pensive music playing]

I went to live with my dad.

He started, you know, giving me

a lot of weed,
or a lot of coke, or a lot of meth,

and he was like,
"Here, you do what you want with it."

So I started selling meth.

My whole thing was to make money,
you know, 'cause that's what my dad did.

But a kid at 14 and 15
shouldn't have people calling him

all the time wanting drugs.

And I didn't realize that
what it was leading into was even worse.

[music fades out]

I had gotten to know
a couple of… of girls my age.

And they started to come around,
ask me if I could get 'em meth.

[somber music playing]

I remember one day, they had came over,
and, uh, one of the girls was crying.

I was like, "What's going on?"
She's like, "My dad smacked me around,

and he said he's gonna kill me."

She's like, "Can you help us
get out of town?"

I knew what it was like, you know,
to kind of be around that kind of stuff.

So I was like, "Okay."

I was like, "I can do that
if that's what you guys really want."

And they're like, "Hey," they said, uh,

"Are you gonna help us, you know,
pay for everything?"

And I was like, "No."

They're like, "There's a convenience store
by our house."

"You could go in there,
and you can hold up the store."

And they're still crying,
and they're like, "Can you help us?"

So I'm like, "Okay, I'll do it then."

[music fades out]

[ominous music playing]

[Higinio] We pull up on the back side
of this little complex.

And one of the girls gave me a gun.

It was, like, this old Ruger .22 handgun.

And I remember
before I had gotten out of the car,

I checked, you know, to see
if the gun was loaded, and it was empty.

And the girls were like,
"Don't worry. Nothing's in there."

[music continues]

I remember, uh, walking in the store.

I walked down the candy aisle.

And I grabbed a Butterfinger candy bar,

put it on the counter,

dug some change out of my pocket,
and paid for it.

[music builds]

So, you know,
I wind up pulling out this gun,

and he just put his hands up.
He's like, "Hey."

I was like, "Look, I need you
to empty the cash register."

He grabs the money and he hands it over,
and I grab it and stick it in my pocket.

And then I was like,
"Okay, now I need you to open the safe."

And, like, he wouldn't do it.
And he kept saying he didn't have the key.

So I… You know, I kept getting mad.

I was like, "You need to open the safe,"
I said, "Or I'm gonna shoot you."

I looked at the gun.

You know, I went to, like, scare him,
like I was gonna pull the trigger,

and I remember it going off.

[gunshot echoes]

And I just ran.

[music ends]

[somber instrumental music playing]

[Higinio] People say you should learn
to forgive yourself.

That's not possible.

I'll never forgive myself.

I… I… I can honestly say that, um,

even talking about it now,
it's, it's hard.

[sobs]

[music fades out]

[birds chirping]

[gentle piano music playing]

[woman] Higinio turned himself in.
That's what it's all about.

Being accountable
and accepting responsibility

for what you've done.

Everybody thought I turned him in
'cause I'm the law-abiding parent, but no.

My son decided to turn himself in.

I'm proud of him for being accountable.

My name is Carmen Gonzalez.

And I'm Higinio Gonzalez's mother,
and he is my youngest son.

[music continues]

[birds chirping]

People don't understand.
Higinio was the baby.

He had dreams. He had good grades.

He was kind.
He was compassionate. He was the good kid.

The other kids, they went the wrong way.

So, of course,
when Higinio committed his crime,

I just… I couldn't believe it.

I really went into a lot of emotional,
you know, denial and stuff,

but I think I lost them

because I was focused on survival
as a single parent.

And something that would have changed
my kids going into this life of crime

would have been
if I'd have picked a different father.

[ominous music playing]

Higinio's father was an abuser.

It was just so many years
of domestic violence and abuse.

I couldn't take it anymore.

So we moved here in 1992.

It was my chance to get away
from their dad and split up.

And then, it was two days later,
he showed up here.

So I really didn't get
any freedom in that.

[music fades out]

Eventually, he stayed here

and continued to be around my kids,
and to them, they just…

I mean, he was their father.
They idolized him.

For all my kids, I was so busy struggling
as a single parent to survive.

I think I got lost in a sense of
not realizing that I was losing them.

But I do remember that Higinio
was not a problem child for me at all.

So when I heard the police
were investigating a shooting,

and it was a young kid that did it,

never did I think
that it was going to be my son.

[somber music playing]

He told me he did it.
He goes, "It was an accident, Mom."

"I swear to God it was an accident."

I jumped up, and I threw the chair
to the side, and I said, "Mm-mm."

"You couldn't have done that. Not you."
And I cried. And I was angry at him.

It was just too hard.

He cried, and he just kept telling me
he loved me,

and I… I remember him sitting there

in that chair, just looking at me
with his big eyes.

I could just see how much
he knew he hurt me,

but he also…
I could see how much he loved me.

[music continues]

[Carmen]
Then everything fell apart for me.

All I could think about
was he was too young

or, you know,
what was going to happen to him, and…

You know, it's just like
my son had just died.

[birds chittering]

[music fades out]

[birds singing]

[Old West-style guitar music playing]

[man] My impression of Carmen Gonzalez

is that she is just
a stand-up quality person.

She was widely known as doing the best

that she possibly could do
to keep her family on the rails.

But I think that her recollection
is not quite correct.

She indicated that Mr. Gonzalez
turned himself in after this happened.

But she came to the police station.

She identified Mr. Gonzalez
as the shooter,

then the police went and got him.

He did not turn himself in.

[music continues]

My name is Joe Coble.

In 1996, I was a deputy
Yellowstone County attorney.

And at that time,
I prosecuted the Gonzalez case.

[music fades out]

I've handled a number of homicide cases.

This one really stays in my memory.

It was just so senseless,

and I think the community was shocked.

And I think the reason for that was
the clerk, Eric Pavilionis,

was an innocent man
who had no blame in any of this at all.

This was a guy who had four children.

[grimly somber music playing]

He had a full-time job,

and he worked in a convenience store
a couple of days a week

to help make ends meet.

He was doing everything
that he could for himself and his family,

and in the end, he was killed for it.

Mr. Gonzalez shot Eric

because he intended to shoot him
from the beginning.

There was no reason to pull that trigger.

That did not have to happen.

Which makes it a prosecutor's job
to push for the maximum penalty.

Mr. Gonzalez was a juvenile,

but I still made the recommendation
that the court impose life sentence.

And if I were in the same shape today,
I would do the same thing.

I thought it was appropriate then.
I think it's appropriate now.

[music intensifies]

[music fades out]

[Joe] It's a heavy responsibility
to ask for the court

to impose the sentence
that you think is appropriate.

One family is going to lose a son.

But you have to look at these cases

from the standpoint
of one family lost a father.

[somber music playing]

So we got the maximum sentence possible,

but it doesn't restore that family.

It doesn't make them whole.

[music fades out]

[melancholic music playing]

And there's a picture
of Daddy on Christmas.

That was your guys'
last Christmas together.

[woman] After Eric was killed,
every hour was a struggle.

Going to memorial service

and having my children
draw pictures to send with him,

and they each picked out…

[quavers]

…one of their favorite toys

and their stuffed animals to send with him

so that way he wouldn't be scared
when he was sleeping.

[music continues]

He's missed all of them going to school.

He's missed every father-daughter dance,
every walk down the aisle.

I mean, he missed it all.

And they missed it all.
They missed sharing that with him.

Nobody should have to grow up
without their dad.

[music fades out]

[gentle music playing]

[Fran] Eric was 27 years old
when he was killed.

I had him in my life
for eight years and two days,

and we lived a lifetime
in those eight years.

I feel we made a life,
and then it was taken away.

[music fades out]

The first time I ever saw
Higinio Gonzalez at the courtroom,

I was expecting to see… a monster.

I wasn't expecting
a nice, clean-cut young man,

but I felt like he did a very senseless,
unnecessary act.

So I wanted the punishment
to fit the crime.

I actually have to admit
I was shocked that he got life.

To me, that seemed like a lot,

but I think as a whole, we were very happy
with what the sentencing was

because it seemed to fit what we lost.

[gentle acoustic guitar music playing]

[Fran] I don't know that I really thought
about him throughout the years

because I've tried
to separate that part of life.

But a couple months ago,
when it was first reached out

to let us know
that this documentary was gonna happen,

I wondered why.

What does he want out of this, you know?

"Teen admits killing clerk."

"Claims the shooting was accidental."

"Convenience store clerk's killer
must serve at least 30 years."

[music continues]

What I think about
Higinio Gonzalez being paroled,

I feel that's up to
the judicial system to decide.

And if he goes up for parole,

I do believe that myself
and my children will attend just to hear

what he might have to say.

[music fades out]

[melancholic music playing]

[device clicks on]

[Higinio] You know, this whole time
of me being here,

you reflect on a lot of stuff,

and you reflect on a lot of the loss.

You know, I wish somebody
would visit me and tell me, "I love you."

You think about how long it's been
since I've had somebody to hug me.

And those are all things that, you know,
I want, but it comes with guilt.

And, uh…

the reason why it comes with guilt…

is because whatever I feel deprived of…

I've done that to them.

I did that to his family.
I did that to his daughters.

And the reason
why I carry so much guilt is, uh…

I'm still here.

But they'll never get a chance
to ever experience any of that again.

[device clicks off]

[exhales]

Not what I was expecting to hear.

I didn't think
he would take that on himself to feel…

the importance of what he did
to my life and to my girls' life.

Not everybody would do that.

And he didn't have to.

But it still doesn't change what happened.

[music fades out]

[discordant violin music playing]

[motorcycle hums]

[music becomes rhythmic]

[man] Does my brother deserve
to pay for his crime? 100%.

There's no doubt.

But I don't think
his sentence was appropriate.

I just don't.

People say, "You're a monster,"

but nobody stops to think
what made us that way.

We became a product of our environment.

But it doesn't mean
that we can't be reached.

It doesn't mean that we're not worthy.

And it definitely doesn't mean
that we can't change.

My name is Jesse Gonzalez,

and Higinio Gonzalez
is my younger brother.

[motorcycle engine shuts off]

[music fades out]

[Jesse] We were a tight family,

but, you know, the things that you see
on TV for the "perfect family"

were nothing close to what we had.
Nothing.

So, my dad was a drug dealer
for a long time.

As we got older, me and my older brothers,
we were all selling drugs for my dad.

So it was easy for my little brother

to follow me into the streets,
into the gangs, into the drugs.

And then, there's no way out.

It's either prison or a body bag.

[tense music playing]

After my brother went to prison,

I had a lot of anger and hate
and animosity towards the world.

I directed it out
on anybody and everybody.

It was me and my older brothers,

and we got wrapped up into street life,

and… and gang activity,
and stuff like that.

We were known for violence, drug dealing.

Anything and everything
that was in the streets criminal-wise,

we were known for it.

Out of everybody, I was the worst.

It just became
just like a snowball rolling downhill.

It just… It got out of control.

[music stops]

[melancholic violin music playing]

[music fades out]

[birds singing]

[somber music playing]

Every Tuesdays and Thursdays,

they have a new bus
coming in with new inmates.

And Boggs, the officer…

he looks in my room and he goes,
"I got a… I got a roommate for you."

And I'm like, "Great."

And old Boggs looks at me.
He goes… "You'll have a good time."

So I get up. I open the door.

And it's my brother's face.
[voice breaks, sobs]

[sobbing continues]

It was like we were five years old again.
We just ran.

Ran to each other and hugged.

[breath trembling]

[somber piano music playing]

We stayed up just drinking coffee
and eating candy. Just talking.

[sniffs]

Crying, reminiscing.

[sobs, quavers]

There was no violence. [sniffs]

No abuse. [sniffs]

We weren't walking on eggshells.

[sniffs]

Even though we were in prison…

[chuckles]

…those are the best memories I have.

[sobs]

[sobs]

We talked about change.

He would tell me
how he wishes he could take it back.

And I was still stuck
in being the tough guy and the cool guy.

And he would talk to me all the time.

"Why are you so hot-headed?
Why can't you talk things through?"

And his favorite line was,

"I'm doing enough time
for everybody in our family."

He said it so I would learn from
not just my mistakes, but his.

And he said it so I'd be a better man.

[music fades out]

[acoustic guitar folk music playing]

[Jesse] What's happening?

Good. Good.

After prison, life got better.

Right now, I own two flooring companies
and I own Junior's Pit Stop Auto Shop.

It's a body shop for cars,
and mechanics, and bikes.

Everybody that I hire
is usually a recovering addict,

or an ex-felon,
or somebody on probation or parole.

I honestly believe that sitting in prison
with my little brother

is why I am who I am today.

He changed his way of thinking,
and he pushed it on me.

I learned a lot from that kid.

And I've been around a lot of bad people.

None of them have the remorse,

the compassion, or the will to change
while they're in there

the way my brother has.

[motorcycle engine starts]

He went into prison,
he owned up to what he did,

and he's changed his life.

He's ready to start over.

[music fades out]

[dogs barking]

[ominous music playing]

[Joe] Deciding Mr. Gonzalez's parole
is not my decision.

It's not up to me, but I suspect
that a parole board should consider

whether he's taking
responsibility for his actions.

[device clicks on]

[Higinio] So, I remember
before I had gotten out of the car,

you know, I checked to see
if the gun was loaded, and it was empty.

And I remember, uh, walking in the store.

And I never, like,
directly aimed and pointed at him

like you would if you were trying
to actually hit something.

I went to scare him

like I was gonna pull the trigger,
and I thought, "If I pull this trigger,

he's gonna hear it shoot."

"But nothing's gonna happen,
but it's gonna scare him."

So I pulled the trigger.

And I remember it going off.

And I just ran.

I remember jumping in the car,

saying, "Why didn't you guys tell me
that there was a bullet in this gun?"

I was like, "I just shot that guy, man."

I didn't know they had put,
you know, one round in there,

and I didn't know that.

Because when they handed it to me,
I checked the magazine,

and I didn't think to check anything else.

[device clicks off]

[music fades out]

[Joe] What I just heard,
I had never heard before.

I reviewed the file from 1996,

and… what was said then

is not what was
on the recording that I just heard.

He's questioned, "Do you know
how many bullets were in the gun?"

His answer, "There was just one."

[tense music playing]

"I put the shell inside."

"I put the clip back in it,

then I looked at it, and I pulled
the little thing back and shut it."

Clearly, he put the bullet in the gun
and described having one bullet.

And he never mentioned anything
about not knowing the gun was loaded.

Also, he says that he never
pointed the gun directly at the clerk.

Well, it's just not true.

[foreboding music playing]

When the police arrived at the store,

they found surveillance video
which showed the entire transaction,

and it was shocking.

Mr. Gonzalez points the gun at Eric
and tells him to give him the money.

[Higinio] Hurry up!

-[Eric] Come take it.
-[Higinio] You do it, bitch!

[Joe] Eric cooperated.
He tried not to be threatening.

He could have been on a training video
for how to handle a robbery.

[Higinio] Open up the safe.

[Eric] I don't have keys to the safe.

-I don't have the keys to the safe.
-I'm gonna pump a slug in your ass, bitch.

He tells Eric
that he's going to shoot him,

which indicates to me that that's exactly
what he intended to do.

When he says that he was only trying
to intimidate the clerk,

that just doesn't match
what we see in that tape.

[music builds]

Mr. Gonzalez tries
to pull the trigger on that gun.

The gun doesn't fire.

Mr. Gonzalez turns the gun
towards himself, looks at it,

finds the safety, turns it off,
and shoots Eric in the chest.

[gunshot echoes]

[music fades out]

We see a man shot and killed,
and it's not Hollywood. It's real.

There's no way
that that can be an accident.

He clearly pulls the trigger
knowing that there's a bullet in that gun.

He admits that.

[somber instrumental music playing]

I suspect that he's been sitting in prison
for years, and years, and years,

and has told himself the same story
until he believes it.

But he's clearly not taking responsibility
for his actions.

He's clearly not accountable
for the things that he did,

and it appears as though he's just trying
to distance himself from his murder.

[birds chittering]

[music fades out]

[somber instrumental music playing]

[Higinio] I was 16 going on 17
when I committed my crime.

I pretty much thought my life was over.

And in the state of Montana,
there's no guaranteed parole.

I can be here for the rest of my life.

But I'm not who I was when I…
You know, when I did what I did.

[birds chirping]

[music continues]

[Carmen] People don't understand.
Higinio was the baby.

He had dreams.
He had good grades. He was kind.

He was compassionate. He was the good kid.

Everybody thought I turned him in
'cause I'm the law-abiding parent, but no.

My son decided to turn himself in.
He decided to come back.

I'm proud of him for being accountable.

I didn't turn myself in.

My mom turned me in,
but she won't admit it

because I think she thinks that it's like…
I'm gonna hate her or something.

I think that's what she's afraid of,
but I don't hold it against her.

I know how hard it was for her to do that.

And I think to this day,

she still doesn't wanna
come to terms with it.

And it's never gonna go away,
you know, the damage that I did.

[uneasy music playing]

[car engine starts]

[Higinio] I took somebody's life,
and it took a while to finally understand

how it made other people feel,
especially Eric's family.

And I think that's one of the main things
I wanna prove to everybody.

Regardless of how you grew up,
you can still change.

[Joe] He is clearly not taking
responsibility for his actions.

He's clearly not accountable
for the things that he did.

I reviewed the file from 1996.

Clearly, he put the bullet in the gun
and described having one bullet.

He pulls the trigger knowing
that there's a bullet in that gun.

It appears as though he's just trying
to distance himself from his murder.

[music fades out]

I could have sworn that they loaded it.

But he's saying that I said that,
you know, that I loaded it.

Like, I honestly don't recollect
that part of it,

you know, of me saying
that I loaded the gun.

[exhales]

I mean…

I don't know right now. It's kind of like…

I don't know, my head's in all kind of
different directions right now.

So I'm trying to, like,
wrap my mind around it.

I think that when I thought I could
pull the trigger that it would scare him

if he just heard the gun, like, you know,
just dry fire, just hear it click.

To try and scare him,
you know what I mean?

And that was the intent. You know? But…

Um…

[sighs]

I don't know. Maybe…

I think he's right.

I think he's right. I think I did know.

[somber music playing]

I think I did know,
and I just didn't wanna…

I just didn't wanna come to terms with it.

I won't ever be able to heal properly
unless I face it.

You know,
so coming to terms with it is tough.

I don't like how it feels right now,

but it's probably something
that I needed to hear.

You know, I'm trying to…

I'm trying to be the best me I can be.

And that… that makes me feel
like I'm not even close.

[sighs]

[sniffs]

[somber orchestral music playing]

[music fades out]