Original subtitles

perfect because my distinct honor to

once again administer the oath

to our second panel of the first day of

the citizens hearing

this panel will run until approximately

12 45. we'll have opening statements of

10 to 15 minutes maximum and then

questions of five to seven minutes uh so

miss Bill and you've already been uh

shared the oath so it's your option

whether to do it again but if the rest

of the panel could repeat after me I do

hereby affirm

but I will tell the truth

and nothing but the truth about the

truth to the members of this committee

the members of this committee today

thank you

we are for the second time this morning

honored to begin with Mr Dolan my

goodness uh thank you esteemed members

of the committee and I will keep my

remarks a little

um more mercifully brief than the last

time

um and I apologize for not having uh

this statement for you I will provide

that for you for the record

before we're before done here

I just want to point out that

researchers of UFO phenomenon have long

argued with each other

over many aspects of this phenomenon

but one conclusion that

I think all of us share at least serious

research is that is that it's become

that UFOs have become a central although

covert but a central component of U.S

history in the modern era and indeed of

world history but as everyone knows you

can't have much of a history that is a

reliable

factually based history without access

to documents

and it's the documents of the past that

enable us in the present to try to

puzzle through the complexities and

Define Solid Ground as it were

and yet it's easy for us to forget that

access to most of the key UFO documents

we now have came to us by way of

historical accident

and it happened to be a fleeting one at

that

all through the 1940s and 1950s and

1960s and well into the 1970s there were

many thousands of classified Pages

written about UFOs

of course the general public didn't know

about this and neither it appears that

many or maybe even most members of

Congress but then came the end of the

war in Vietnam and of course Watergate

and this was a certain key moment in

American history a moment in which the

United States Congress investigated the

intelligence Community for example

um and when it reopened the Assassin

investigation of the assassination of

President John F Kennedy and Dr Martin

Luther King Jr and there's

and it was a moment

in which Congress dramatically

strengthened the United States Freedom

of Information Act

enabling U.S citizens to petition their

government for documents not merely

relating to them personally but to the

nation in terms of broad issues of

public policy

well little did members of Congress

realize that of all subsequent Freedom

of Information Act requests the most

popular category would be related to

UFOs

and indeed during the late 1970s over

ten thousand pages

of documents relating to UFOs were

released

the party lasted until about 1982 when a

presidential order by Ronald Reagan made

foia substantially less user-friendly

and did not require many agencies to

reply in a timely manner at all

the result was a major ballooning in

costs to those people making requests

so the glory era of Freedom of

Information documents at least

pertaining to UFOs

came to an end

to this day more than half of all U.S

Declassified UFO documents

come from that period of time over 30

years ago

great for the Carter Administration

shame on the subsequent ones

and yet we remain fortunate I think

because the documents that we have thank

goodness

give us at least enough they gave us

enough of a history to hold on to they

give us enough Solid Ground and their

aggregate message is startlingly clear

UFOs have been the subject not merely of

interest to our nation's military and

intelligence Community but at times

at times the subject of concern and even

alarm

but how could it be otherwise when we

have report after report of violations

of sensitive airspace by objects that

defy any logical or conventional

explanation whether the scene was Los

Alamos during 1948 and 1949 or Oak Ridge

Laboratories from 1948 through much of

the 1950s or the many military bases

during the 50s 60s and 70s that reported

such events uh the question remains how

could this not be a matter of grave

concern to those parties responsible for

maintaining the Integrity of their

airspace

and not surprisingly we find the tone of

their memos and requests for information

to be appropriate

to the matter at hand here is one CIA

member from 1949 puts the matter in this

very succinct way quote information is

desired if this was some new or

experimental aircraft

or for any explanation whatsoever

and these statements are in fact typical

and the situation became so stressful to

the CIA and elsewhere that on December

2nd 1952 this is right at the very end

of the Truman presidency

the cia's chief of scientific

intelligence H Marshall Chadwell

wrote a classified memo to his boss that

was the director of the CIA Walter

Beetle Smith

and a key paragraph in this memo is as

follows

at this time

the reports of incidents convince us

that there is something going on that

must have immediate attention

sightings of unexplained objects at

Great altitudes and traveling at high

speeds in the vicinity of major U.S

defense installations

are of such nature

that they are not attributable to

Natural phenomena or known types of

aerial Vehicles end quote

I think this is a statement that bears

very close scrutiny

here is yet another comment by a

high-level U.S official that UFOs were

real

probably artificial

probably intelligently operated

and not apparently ours

and nor was there serious consideration

that these were Soviet

so I would ask if not American if not

Soviet if not natural phenomena

and if they appeared to be technological

and under intelligent control well we

begin to run out of viable options

it is access to documents such as these

that enable us to know with certainty

that UFOs were a matter of serious

concerned individuals at the highest

levels of U.S national security they you

know I would want to stress that I don't

think any of the formally Declassified

documents we have by themselves prove

that UFOs are ET I don't think any of

them do

um but I I would argue that if you take

the top

50

even the top ten that they make a very

powerful case I would say not even a

matter of speculation but a matter of

proof that

that the phenomenon was considered Real

by the responsible members of our

national security community that I would

say that is not a matter of debate or

speculation and really the questions

that we need to ask is why were they

considering it and did they form any

opinions themselves and getting at that

answer is a little more difficult but

nonetheless the bottom line is these

documents do prove this and it's

important because all of these levels of

concern were consistently voiced within

the classified world but they were not

given out publicly all through the 40s

and 50s and right up to our own era the

the formal public statements are always

the same there's nothing to this that it

may be interesting or may not but we're

not interested in we don't do UFOs

and uh

fortunately is

as the historical accident of Freedom of

Information turned out

those documents proved the lie to those

statements of denial

so today official pronouncements about

UFOs by the government and Military it

follows the exact same tone there's

really no difference between what they

say now and what they said 50 years ago

except they're a little less

insulting about it back back in the

early years a number of statements that

talked about people just kind of being

crazy psychopathological you don't hear

that anymore

but other than that it's really the same

type of tone unfortunately though that

we don't have the kind of access to

classified information on UFOs as we

once briefly obtained in the past

and yet enough genuine and recent UFO

accounts have become known to us many of

which involve U.S military that we can

see that very little has changed

something important is happening behind

the veil of the classified world my

question to you is how long

will current members of Congress and the

public at large be content to roll over

and be spoon fed nonsense by responsible

officials when in fact they deserve the

truth thank you

[Applause]

okay

good afternoon or good morning

distinguished members of and panelists

of the citizen hearing on unidentified

flying objects UFOs

my name is Jose Antonio nails and I'm a

Chilean American journalist who has been

actively involved in covering the

mystery of UFOs and its hypothesis of

extraterrestrial ET origin other

theories are also possible and should be

considered for the past 37 years

my very first article on this topic was

published in a small New York newspaper

on July 4 1977 conciding with the

beginning of my professional career as a

journalist in the United States

I was born in this country but my family

was from Chile my father worked for

several years in the United Nations in

the early formative years of this

International body during which time I

was born in New York in 1950. after

graduating from high school in Santiago

in 1969 I went to Europe and took a

semester on French language and

civilization at the sorbonne University

in Paris and later studied journalism at

the University of Chile in Santiago

I worked for a while as a science

journalist for a Weekly Magazine in

Santiago and also rode regularly for a

daily newspaper in the mid 70s where I

was one of the first journalists in

Chile to cover ecological or green

issues on a regular basis

this was however a period of great

turmoil in Chile following the military

coup of September 11 1973 the first time

that faithful date shows up in modern

history

I might add I might add so I took the

decision to claim my U.S citizen and

moved to this country where I have lived

ever since first in the Washington DC

area then New York for some 25 years

back to the Beltway where I lived in

Northern Virginia for about three years

and now the Phoenix Arizona area where I

moved in 2009 after I was hired to work

as a full-time paid journalist and

editor of open minds magazine and also a

writer for our website openminds.tv

another production and research

activities in ufology for the company

open minds production

the subject of UFOs is a contentions one

where many different views and attitudes

coexist sometimes in a friendly manner

sometimes in a more acrimonious way

but there is no doubt in my mind that

there's at least one conclusion we can

we can and should all agree UFOs are

definitely a global phenomenon they're

cited visually on film and on radar

reported investigators sometimes

officially sometimes by private

organizations and covered by both the

local and international media all over

the world

it doesn't really matter what is the

culture language religion ethnic Orange

and level of development and

technological capabilities of a country

UFOs have been reported everywhere from

Alaska to Chile and Argentina in the

Americas all over Europe Asia the Middle

East Africa Australia and the oceans

they are well-documented cases in many

parts of the world including Brazil

France Iran Russia Zimbabwe New Zealand

and many other countries

regardless of what turns out to be the

final origin of this mystery it has a

great potential of unifying the

different and often divided parts of our

world the reason is simple no matter how

big our ideological religious or

cultural differences are we would all

tend to unite in the face of an unknown

possibly extraterrestrial presence

it is for this reason that some efforts

have been made over the years to bring

the subject to the attention of the

United Nations organization

this International body despite its

flaws is the only organization that

truly represents all the nations of the

world and so it seems to be the logical

place where this issue could be dealt

with in a global formal and legal manner

I will outline briefly the history of

UFOs at the United Nations a subject

that I know very well firsthand since I

personally attended as a journalist the

famous historical UFO hearing before the

un's special political committee on

November 27 1978

this was the result of a two-year

lobbying effort by Sir Eric Gary the

prime minister of Grenada a small

Caribbean island which had gained

independence from Great Britain in 1978.

I'm submitting for the record a long

article detailing the history of UFOs at

the U.N which I published in the third

issue of open minds magazine in 2010.

grenada's UFO proportional proposal was

first raised officially prepped by prime

minister Gary and grenadas U.N

Ambassador Wellington Friday at a

meeting of the UN General Assembly

special political committee on November

28 1977.

Grenada proposed the quote establishment

of an agency or a department of the

United Nations for undertaking

coordinating and disseminating the

results of research into an identified

flying objects UFOs and related

phenomena

Grenada made further statements on

November 30 and December 6 1977.

in an earlier speech in October prime

minister Gary disclosed his own sighting

quote I have myself seen in an

identified flying object and I have been

totally overwhelmed by what I have seen

as a result of all this effort on

December 13 1977 the general assembly

adopted decision

32-424 which acknowledged the drivers

the draft resolution submitted by

Grenada

General Kurt balheim Dooley forwarded

decision

32-424 to the member states by a note

verbal on March 13 1978. however only

three governments responded India

Luxembourg and Seychelles and only two

specialized agencies International civil

aviation organization and UNESCO replied

with a flat no comments to offer

and the third Grenada launched a new

offensive in 1978 with the help of one

of the original NASA astronauts Gordon

Cooper among others

a group of recognized experts was

assembled by Gary to testify at a

hearing before the special political

committee on November 27 1978 which

became the high point of the Grenada

initiative

besides Sarah Gary and Ambassador Friday

who was now grenada's minister of

Education the hearing included testimony

by astronomer Dr jail and heineck the

former scientific consultant for the U.S

Air Force Project Blue Book who went on

to found the center for UFO studies

kufos Dr Jacques Valley Stanton Friedman

who is president at the citizen hearing

and a first-hand witness account by

Lieutenant Colonel Lawrence Coyne of the

U.S Army Reserve on the famous October

18 1973 UFO helicopter near Collision in

Ohio

a letter of endorsement by astronaut

Gordon Cooper who was then working for

the Walt Disney Company as vice

president of research and development

for Epcot was read into the record

besides mentioning his own sighting and

views on UFOs Cooper wrote that quote we

need to have a top level coordinated

program to scientifically collect and

analyze data from all over Earth

concerning any type of encounter and to

determine how best to interface with

these visitors in a friendly fashion end

quote

at a meeting of the UN General Assembly

on December 18 1978 decision

33-426 was adopted with the same heading

to the previous decision 32424

establishment of an agency or a

department of the United Nations for

undertaking coordinating and

disseminating the results of research

into an identified flying objects and

related phenomena end quote

the Grenada initiative was gradually

opening the door to UFOs at the U.N but

unfortunately the effort came to an

abrupt halt when the Gary government was

overthrown by a Marxist Revolution led

by Maurice Bishop of the new Jewel

movement in March 1979. ironically Gary

was in New York to meet with Kurt

valheim regarding decision 33426 when

the coup took place

some minor efforts to rekindle the UFO

initiative at the United Nations were

attempted by civilian investigators

since the Grenada coup of 1979 but with

no success whatsoever because only

Sovereign member country can bring this

issue back officially to the U.N and no

government has done so since the Grenada

initiative of the late 70s the good news

however is that we don't have to

reinvent the wheel the U.N decisions 32

424 and 33 4-6 are already on the books

and could be revived if there was

political will

in closing these opening remarks I want

to make a few important points

while it's true that the majority of UFO

sightings have mundane explanations a

fact recognized by most competent

investigators and scientists if you

really study with an open mind the

extensive Data Bank of UFO cases

collected worldwide during the last six

decades you will find a small percentage

of truly puzzling incidents that defy

any conventional explanation

the prevailing view among most

researchers and the media is that these

cases have an ET origin but this is not

the only explanation other theories

including interdimensional or multiple

universes have also been advanced even

time travel has been proposed in other

words UFOs would be our own devices from

the future coming back in time for

unknown reasons I realize all this

sounds like science fiction but think

for a minute didn't you see people

talking to each other at huge distances

while viewing themselves on a screen in

lots of sci-fi movies from the 50s and

60s well this happens now every day

through Skype in the internet similar

examples can be multiplied at infinitum

what is important is to look at all the

data without any preconceived ideas or

beliefs the late Dr heineck used to say

that UFOs were likely signaling the next

Scientific Revolution

but but we will never get there if we

don't study the phenomenon in a truly

comprehensive and unbiased way and I

might add with the proper resources to

do so

the political implications or

exopolitical as is now referred are even

bigger the alien can become a catalyst

to unify the people also of Earth to

realize that mankind must grow way

beyond our current limitations if we are

going to survive and prosper in the

future

many believe the open that open contact

will never happen in an open way unless

Mankind's level of Consciousness makes a

significant jump

let me finish with an appropriate quote

from Shakespeare's Hamlet

there are more things in Heaven and

Earth Horatio that are dreamed in your

philosophy thank you very much

good morning good morning congresswoman

and congressman and Senator Revell my

name is Dan Sheehan I am general counsel

for the committee I've been asked to

speak briefly here today to address a a

few different instances that have

occurred in my career

as an attorney that bear upon this

particular subject that have led to me

ending up being general counsel I was

also general counsel for the original

disclosure conference that we had in

2001. so I've been around for a while on

this particular area in it it arose

because I was a chief counsel for the

United States Jesuit headquarters in

Washington D.C here back in 1976 when

President Carter was elected president

and immediately after his election in

November of 1976 President Carter

called into his office the then Central

Intelligence Agency director who was

George H.W bush

and President Carter asked to be briefed

by the director of Central Intelligence

on the issue of UFOs

and in that meeting the CIA director

Bush asked the president-elect if the

president-elect would leave him in as

the Central Intelligence Agency director

and that he would promise that he would

never run for political office in his

life if Carter would agree to keep him

in as the director of the CIA Bush

wanted to at that time become more or

less like J Edgar Hoover it had become

at the FBI that he would remain that it

would be above politics that he would

remain in that position uh President

Carter reiterated his request for the

UFO information saying that he had his

own person in mind to be the director of

the Central Intelligence Agency

which happened to be Teddy Sorensen at

the time

and Bush at that time then refused to

provide the information to him saying

that he did not have adequate clearances

he was not the president yet and that he

should ask his own Central Intelligence

Agency director for that

uh but if he wanted to have the

information ahead of time that what he

could do is he could contact the Science

and Technology Committee of the House of

Representatives and they had an ongoing

relationship with the Science and

Technology division of the Congressional

research service that could go about

getting things Declassified to show him

that is what generated the request from

the Congressional research service to me

as the general counsel for the Jesuit

headquarters in the United States asking

if I could gain access to the Vatican

Library

to obtain the information that the

Vatican has in its library in its

classified sections to deliver to the

president for his review

I I did that I contacted the the Jesuit

who happens to be the head of the the

Vatican Library

requesting this information and much to

my surprise I was denied information

I wrote a second letter to them saying

look I I guess you must not know who we

are here this is the Jesuit headquarters

in the United States we have 10

provinces here in the United States more

than any other country in the world and

we're requesting this information to

share with the president

they still declined so I had to report

that to Marsha Smith who was the head of

the Science and Technology division of

the Library of Congress Congressional

research service

and she asked if I would be willing to

become a counsel special counsel to this

investigation that was being conducted

by the by the Science and Technology

committee I agreed to do this and I told

her that I would need to have access to

certain kinds of information that I

would like to have Declassified or get

to see it and she said what would you

like to see and I said well the first

thing I'd like to see is the classified

sections of Project Blue Book those

sections that have been referred to by

Mr Dolan earlier and uh and by Gordon as

not really available

much to our surprise I was granted

permission to see them

and they they brought them to Washington

and they brought them over to the

Jefferson building the extension to the

Congressional library before it was even

open the brand new building that they

built across the street remember and so

I was invited to come over there I went

over there no one else was in the

building they had security people at the

door uh and I went over and I was

brought downstairs into a room where

they had these shoe boxes uh with with

uh with microfilm in them and documents

Etc and in my review of those documents

I Came Upon photographs of unquestioned

UFOs was there any question about what

they were it wasn't a light in the sky

it wasn't a vague report about having

seen something going very fast by these

were photographs official United States

Air Force photographs some taken through

gun sites but another one of a crashed

saucer on the ground that it was there

was snow in the in the photographs it

showed a a the saucer had hit into a

field and had plowed across the field

and was stuck into a snow bank set up

about a 45 degree angle and I could see

in the photographs U.S Air Force

personnel

dressed in heavy parkas taking video

taking actually film with those two

cameras with a great big camera circles

on top the films like this so it must

have been in the 1950s uh and I I saw

this and I realized that I could see in

one of the photographs symbols that were

on the the Dome of the the UFO sticking

in the snow bank so what I did we had I

had one of those

they were the microfiche those little

machines you put the microfiche in you

cranked a little handle very high tech

this was and so what I did is they had

told me that I wasn't allowed to take

any notes when when I went in there the

two the two security men at the door

told me I was not allowed to take any

notes but I actually had a yellow pad

under my under my arm when I went in

like this and so when I went in and when

I saw these photographs what I did is I

I cranked down the the focus on the uh

on the machine so that I could get a

close-up view of these symbols that were

around the Dome of the the UFO and what

I did is I opened up the yellow pad and

I put the yellow pad in there and I

traced the actual symbols that were

along the base of the of the saucer and

then I closed it up and I said I think

I'd probably better leave now because uh

I have this so what I did is I put all

the stuff back into the boxes and I put

the little yellow pet under my arm and I

walked back out and the two security

guys said I I'd like my briefcase back

they handed me my briefcase and I

started to walk away and one of them

says what's that under your arm

and I said oh this is a yellow pad and

he opened it up and he leafed through

all the pages and there was nothing

there

and so because I'd put it on the inside

of the cardboard

uh and so I took that back with me to

Jesuit headquarters and I brought it to

Father Bill Davis who was my Superior at

the Jesuit headquarters and we then

agreed to go we gathered the all 54

of the major religious denominations

their Washington DC offices and we

brought them into a meeting and we

proposed to them from the Jesuit

national headquarters that we

established as a priority having the

churches try to ascertain what

information we could get and that we

would get the backing of the churches

and then go to the Vatican library and

see if we could start to address this

you know that is that is what we did in

Father Bill Davis when I and I asked him

this he he got puzzled and he reached

down and he pulled open the drawer out

of his out of his desk at the Jesuit

headquarters right over by Dupont Circle

1717 Mass Ave is where we were and he

opened up the door and he pulled out a

photograph

and he said this is a photograph that I

got from my sister her husband is a uh

is in the the tower in Seattle

Washington airport he's a he's a flight

controller and his best friend is a

commercial pilot and he took this

Photograph out of his window of the

commercial airline and he handed me the

photograph of this

so we showed this to the people at the

Washington interreligious staff Council

that we organized asking them if they

would make this a priority and they they

said are there any other subjects you'd

like to discuss instead of that that

they didn't want to address that at that

time

and what happened I was contacted then

by Marcia Smith who was directing the

investigation for President Carter at

the Congressional research service and

she asked me if I would go to meet with

the people at the jet propulsion

laboratory in California in the seti

program the search for extraterrestrial

intelligence and give them a briefing on

the theological implications

of contact with extraterrestrial

intelligence so I was privileged to

deliver a three-hour seminar to the top

50 scientists in the the seti program on

the theological implications of contact

with an extraterrestrial intelligence

and then in 1994 I was contacted by Dr

John Mack who was the chairman of the

Department of clinical Psychiatry at

Harvard Medical School because I'd

graduated from Harvard college and

graduated from Harvard Law School where

I was one of the founders of the Harvard

civil rights law review and I had gone

on to Harvard Divinity School

and he contacted me and asked me if I

would represent him because he had

written a book based upon his his

clinical assistance to high-level

military officials and others in the

country who had been sent to have

psychological background done on them

who had reported these direct contacts

with extraterrestrial vehicles of this

kind and when I met with him he had

written this book in the The Faculty

committee at Harvard University had

called him into a session with the with

the legal counsel from Harvard

University and the head of the dean of

the of the medical school

getting ready to challenge his his

tenure for his having written this book

that it was undermining the world view

of Harvard University

and uh so I we met with Lawrence

Rockefeller and Lawrence Rockefeller

agreed to fund what would really amount

to a grand rounds to present to the

Harvard faculty all of the basic

information that we had on the existence

of UFOs and they then dropped the

hearings

and said they didn't they didn't want to

have this hearings turned into a circus

now those those were my initial contacts

with them and so I I have delivered a

number of uh presentations to the

international UFO Congress over the the

years uh on the theological implications

of contact with an extraterrestrial

civilization

and as you may know the Vatican has now

uh started to issue press statements

they actually held a major press

conference talking about the fact that

in light of the more recent discoveries

of the increasing number of planets that

they now realize I have sons in

atmosphere and are in what they call the

Goldilocks zone it's close they're close

enough to their Planet their their son

in the Solar their solar systems but not

so far away that they're likely to have

potential life on them and as these

planets began to multiply the Vatican

has now held an official press

conference announcing that they in fact

have now taken the position that the

discovery of extraterrestrial

intelligence in a highly technologically

developed intelligence is not

inconsistent with Catholic theology

and that is that is what is going on

right now there are very high level

meetings going on right now with the new

pope

to discuss what positions are going to

be taken by the by the international

Catholic church with regard to the

theology my my understanding is as

former Chief counsel for the Jesuits

that the fact is that the Catholic

church does not want to be behind the

power curve on this issue and they

realize that with the increasing contact

and discovery of these additional

planets that it's going to become clear

within our generation within our

lifetimes

that in fact highly technologically

developed extraterrestrial intelligence

actually exists and the findings of the

Congressional research service that were

delivered to the president to President

Carter is that based upon all of their

analysis that they have come to the

conclusion this is an official

conclusion of the Congressional research

service that they have come to a 95

probability projection that there are

from two to ten highly technologically

developed extraterrestrial civilizations

within our own Galaxy

now and remember in closing they're in

our galaxy The Milky Way galaxy there

are 50 billion star systems

in our galaxy

and there are 50 billion

trillion galaxies

that are now known

the question in the abiding question and

it's the one that you and I discussed

last night Congressman Bartlett had

these vehicles developed the capacity

to transport Vehicles beyond the speed

of light

because if they have then all these

questions now become focused that that

means that they would be able to be here

come here and go and if they have then

all of these sightings that we've talked

about all these hundreds of witnesses

that we've talked about then are talking

about a very real phenomenon and I'll

close with this one observation when I

was I was legal counsel for the Iran

Contra investigations that we were the

ones that actually initially discovered

the Iran Contra weapons Supply

trafficking and when I delivered this

information to Peter rodino who was at

the time the chair of the Judiciary

Committee of the house

through Scott Armstrong Scott Armstrong

he's over a call was the staff person on

radino's staff of the Judiciary

Committee during the Watergate

investigations who discovered the taping

system in the White House that Alexander

Butterfield revealed this to Scott so I

went and brought this information to him

and because of his close relationship

with Peter rodino he delivered all of

the information we had about the

off-the-shelf Enterprise the involvement

of Poindexter and everyone else

and the response of Peter redino was he

said Scott he said my God he said if

what you're telling me is true about

this off-the-shelf Enterprise going on

delivering these weapons contrary to the

orders of Congress why then he said I've

been telling my constituencies that they

didn't like the way that American policy

was going that they should write a

letter to their congressperson

and if their congressperson didn't do

what they wanted them to do you should

vote for someone else for Congress

but if what you're telling me is true

Scott my God we haven't even been in

control

I'm not going to allow the Congress of

the United States to investigate

anything like that

and that's the issue that's before us

now

because if in fact we're not in Ultimate

control

and there is an extraterrestrial

intelligence of this type of

sophistication that's been visiting our

planet and entering our airspace and

outmaneuvering our aircraft it's

perfectly clear that from a political

Consciousness that abides inside our

executive branch and inside our

legislature

that is not something that they want to

share

with the American people because it

would ultimately undermine the

confidence of the governed

in their governors

[Applause]

my name is Lieutenant Colonel Richard

French

I am one of the writers of the original

Air Force Blue Book I was a student at

Oregon State starting in 1947 and in my

junior year I was asked what specialty I

wanted to be assigned when I graduated

an advisor told me about the office of

special investigations it sounded like

an exciting and glamorous job

so I volunteered Brigadier General Carol

and if a former FBI director of the of

the Washington District was commissioned

as an Air Force General and assumed

command of

The OSI

The OSI of course has also given the

added responsibility of investigating

the phenomenon of unidentified flying

objects The OSI assignment required that

I have final top secret clearance

granted before I could even report for

Duty

that caused a delay in my reporting

because I in fact am adopted in all of

my uh medical and birth records and all

that are sealed

after a year they straightened out that

mess

and I reported to do 20 and McCourt Air

Force Base Washington there my training

officer was a special agent named John

drayos

under his supervision I began

investigating uf5 UFO reports and

recording the incidents in the Air

Force's Blue Book

the most controversial UFO incident that

occurred in my early training and it

deserved special Mansion because of its

unique Factor

an f-100d pilot had was well they

launched the D's they launched them

normally in just in twos rather than

forms like tactical Fighters

anyway uh he pulled up on this UFO and

it was approximately uh 30 yards

directly behind the thing

the uh the after 86 today carries a

total of 36 two and a half

inch or two and a half let me get this

straight uh

carries 36 of those two and a half inch

uh

the rockets and they're carried in a pod

that drops and it drops in the

automatically pliers when it comes down

well he got the clearance to fire which

kind of surprised everybody and but he

blew that uh UFO eye of the sky but

there the problem is that uh

that is

the the recording of the incident well

let me get this exactly right

the UFO intercept violated the

prohibited Zone at the hanford's atomic

energy facility

he was a winged man and pulled up

straight ahead and was given a clearance

to fire when the when the weapon fired

the Pod dropped but his airplane

exploded

they uh they drug the Colorado River I

mean the Columbia River and that's 60

mile area and they never found a piece

or part or anything anything even

pertaining to it

and now the I mentioned that I had just

a very fast look at the magic report I

hope you people are familiar with it but

if you're not it is the original report

that was uh prepared President Truman

was a chairman the people who were on

that committee and I just didn't just

get a very quick look at it but I could

easily remember who they were because of

who they were

they they included the chiefs of the

president of course and also the Chiefs

of Staff of all of the Armed Forces arms

of the United States in other words the

chief of Naval operations in the head of

the Coast Guard and on and on

and that terminates my presentation

[Applause]

[Music]

we have about 10 minutes for each member

of the six of you and that'll take us to

1250.

and I've been asked by both the chair

and the co-chair to give time reminders

as we're approaching that 10-minute

limit for each of you so I'll do that as

gently as possible my understanding is

that there will be time cue cards

visible to the panelists here and to uh

the members back here so if we will

watch those and and and time ourselves I

remember a number of years ago I was

traveling in a car and had my car radio

on and there were two news accounts one

was that there were some UFO sightings

over New Mexico

and the other was that there had been

two mysterious deaths in New York City

that might have been citacosis and if it

was citicosis it might have come from

dried pigeon manure

so it was a serious suggestion that

maybe we ought to kill all the pigeons

in New York

well I listened to those two newscasts

and I thought gee if these flying

saucers are extraterrestrial I think I'd

wander around a bit up there and watch

for a while yet before I landed

uh you know as I said when we started

this it is really enormously arrogant

and presumptive to believe that we're

the most advanced civilization in the

universe

we still fight stupid Wars and kill each

other this has to be a better way

doesn't there

again I will reserve my question Until

the End uh my co-chair I I wanted to

mention one other thing all of the time

and there's a period there that's about

12 years but during that 12-year period

my primary job as a member of the OSI

was to debunk them in other words I I'd

come up with any kind of explanation

we'd say it was swamp gas or and you

name it anything that we could come up

with to apparently convince the general

public and maintain the secrecy level on

that and

some of my answers I I swear were absurd

but the swamp gas for instance they were

at that time there was an average of

about three a week UFOs had descended

into the Gulf Breeze Florida area if you

know where that is it's just the where

the Panhandle is

in Florida anyway I went down there and

we have observed them just regularly

just sit there every evening with a

cocktail and then they'd come

and

all right but what was it it was small

gas that's what that was my lie and I

made good on it

but that was my actual job

to be the most Artful lawyer on Earth

thank you very much so uh Colonel French

she did a good job of it obviously yeah

thank you

so for all four of you I have

starting to weigh on me

if um

transparency would reveal that uh

we really aren't in control

uh that there are actually as

intelligent or more like more than

likely more intelligent light life form

than humans

um

and that in so knowing and admitting

would be dangerous

how do we that's a closed Circle folks

so what do you recommend how do you

recommend we handle this

let's start with

the colonel who won't tell us it's a gas

form

well

I I see no other way to attack than to

come up with some kind of international

organization something along the line of

what we already have in him or some

similar governmental way and that

putting those people you know because

when you when you think about it this

confronts religion directly and very

firmly yeah and

we we do need some type of organization

something that we know this and if need

be to contact these people from another

University

you know it's a lot better if you say hi

buddy not try and shoot their tail end

off

so so uh reclaiming my time to go on to

you you um Daniel but let me add a piece

to this now

um

then

how will

the United States for one uh give up uh

our rights as an Our National Security

rights if we went on to uh

cooperate with the United Nations on

this yes this this is a this is a world

view issue that uh one one of the things

that I discovered after a number of

years in practice that the reason I

ended up going back to Harvard Divinity

School to study after spending a number

of years out practicing law

was that that this is a world view issue

that that people don't think about this

very often but the reality is there's a

spectrum of World Views that are shared

by our human family uh the political

manifestation of which or the political

philosophy of which is you have people

who are authoritarians you have people

who are reactionaries you have people

who are conservatives you have people

who are moderates you have people who

are liberals you have people who are

progressives then you have people who

are basically referred to as utopianists

uh who tend to be theological for the

most part but there's a whole eighth

world view there's an octave of World

Views and there's a new world view that

is in the offing right now and that is

the world view that is going to have to

be addressed by our human family once we

come to acknowledge that there are in

fact there's a super sophisticated

highly intelligent extraterrestrial

civilization and that there may be more

than one of these species okay I'm going

to reclaim my time because I wanted to

know how to get break through this thing

it's a new world view we have to we have

to construct a new world okay you're

gonna you're suggesting that we're gonna

take on a new world view if that's what

it takes to happen uh or if we're a long

way from that Tony Mr who nails

well you know every so often things

happen in the history of the world that

change that lead to a complete change

and

um that was the case when America was

discovered and it was called a new world

even though it was part of the same

world but at that time you know it

completely changed the Paradigm of uh of

the of the late medieval period and

there was even discussions whether you

know maybe the Earth Paradise was in

America or whether the natives Americans

had it sold it you know it was a whole

kind of uh huge discussion and

eventually obviously we're here so it

worked out in uh same thing when the the

atomic bomb was was released you know

dropped in Japan that changed the

Paradigm of that period so I think this

is the next Frontier and uh I don't

think it's going to be as as difficult

as it seems because we're kind of

conditioned already by by the by the

media and by the entertainment industry

I mean if even when I started this this

business of third world such as we could

call it a business this this Duty many

years ago it the attitude of people was

was very negative uh really UFOs were

considered like uh like a cookie subject

you know and now people if you ask a

Young Generation for them he says well

what's the big deal it's obvious that

there's life in the in the in the in the

universe so I don't know exactly how it

will happen but uh but it will and uh

and we will have to adjust and move

forward so I guess it's a good thing we

have the entertainment industry to turn

on people's imaginations Richard uh yes

thank you for this question it's very

important I often think you know no

parent is ever ready for their first

child but they happen anyway

uh disclosure of this reality you know

we may or may not be ready for it we

probably won't be ready for it frankly I

think that our society is going through

such a tremendous Revolution uh this

isn't 1990 certainly in the 1950 and so

we have capabilities today that I think

are forcing this issue out Wikileaks

didn't exist 10 years ago because it

couldn't exist it wasn't a global

infrastructure uh cell phone cameras all

of this this is all new so I think

something's going to happen is going to

force this out front and center and uh

my suspicion I can only guess is that

those people who have

knowledge on this and I think there are

such people must be aware they must be

aware that they cannot keep the secret

forever I think the wise thing to do

would be uh judiciously and responsibly

to begin allowing some of this

information out there maybe there are

controlled leaks today I do think that

when this issue this matter is out on

the table that doesn't mean all the

answers will be there it just means that

we'll be able publicly

uh without all the you know

joking and ridicule to be able to talk

about it as a public policy issue uh I

also think that this will necessitate a

geopolitical revolution you mentioned

the issues of U.S national security well

there's other countries in the world and

they're all going to be affected by this

and so it will have to be necessary for

there to be a true United Nation

something that actually works that

people can um

believe in because without that I think

it's just going to be do I have any more

time

two minutes that's the the next uh

discussion I would like to go from

we're worried about airspace how about

cyberspace

so

I'm mad

basically I mean my background is I have

more combat than

virtually anyone you'll ever meet I have

more than 800 combat missions 860 and

jet fighters

so I'm not afraid of battle obviously

the dumbest thing we could possibly do

is weaponize space and I've been in that

argument several times

and it would be absurd to do that thank

you thank you

cyberspace that uh one minute it's quite

it's quite clear that the technology

that seems to be at the disposal of this

civilization is able to access you know

if the FBI can tap into your internet

and then clearly they can too so they're

monitoring undoubtedly monitoring all

the communications that are going on and

I would dare say that there is a process

going on of Feathering into our culture

Information Technology

Etc that is going to soften this blow

that there's a process going on of

released information of contact

information

Etc and I find it based on 40 Years of

doing these kind of Investigations of

Watergate Iran Contra and others that

I've been directly involved in that

there's clearly going to be a decision

made by very high level people above all

of our pay grades here I say with all

due respect from Congress people that

there'll be a decision made to start

Feathering information into the the

culture to prepare our people for this

rather gradually which has been going on

now for the last 60 years

Congressman Kilpatrick

thank you very much I think I want to

start with the colonel

I served on the Air Force Academy board

for about six years in my 12-year

10-year 14 years in Congress started

building the Appropriations defense

committee first African-American woman

ever to serve there it's only been three

in the history of our two thousand year

country

it's outrageous we really believe that

women have something to offer so I

really appreciate your service

right right we come from a let's work

this out kind of thing so we wouldn't

have this problem if we win we control

the world

but um having said that

Colonel I really appreciate your service

your time your dedication 800 plus I've

been all over the world with the uh

defense department and it's been quite

quite an experience for me and it's

really capitalized and captured my

tenure in Congress really

why is it that when you were there

you couldn't talk about it everything

I've read and seen that everybody hush

hushed it I know wait wait let me do I

want you to do the whole question

the whole question I know and I know a

lot of it's you know from the

presidential right on down to the Joint

chief of staff and one of you all spoke

to that and we're going to get back you

didn't call it by that name but that's

kind of what it was uh that Truman had

exactly as a matter of fact why is it

now that you're at the table uh

discussing it with us acknowledging that

it is

he probably that's because I'm in my 80s

I've praise God okay Harris here is the

problem

and if you had a government job you had

to have you need to be in what they call

humanly reliable in other words you had

if you they thought you were a Maniac or

something you'd lose your wings and lose

your job and so forth so anyway I think

it's because of that the uh basically

the human reliability problem that the

fact

there there are some real lunatics in

various places and you can't identify

them well enough

and then they won't submit uh well they

have a problem with next they can if

they have a have a child that is ill

mentally

what do you do

you believe today that as you sit here

with us and former members of Congress

80 plus years of experience having uh

now before this committee whose time has

come

since 1968 there's been no hearing as

you know we're moving to that and I

don't know that the answer is another

hearing right now I'm afraid for that

um it I heard this discussion this

morning there's a lot of private things

going on I'd like to see Partnerships

private public I think that's when

Americans get our best bet when we come

together as a nation and a private

public kind of atmosphere

when you talk about what you just said

and I agree that it's urgent I think

somebody at the table mentioned coming

together and acknowledging it which we

haven't done as this country other

countries are beginning to do that and

some were mentioned this morning

um do you think the Air Force will ever

come to that point and is it a domestic

International

partnership that we need how how would

you begin it you know you come with the

credibility necessary and I don't think

we got much Choice it's something's got

to be done and you all have to help us

formulate that too I agree with that

thank you very much for your service

Mr Sheehan

you talked about which is worse that's

how you ended that Dynamic presentation

that you had which is which which is

worse do we try to put this together and

save ourselves with the world or do we

continue to put our heads in the sand

that it doesn't exist and you know that

it does I'm at a loss I you all are

giving us good information and we I

think um those in the audience want us

to come up with some kind of

recommendations and I can't have it both

ways you got to be solid it's a it's a

very difficult issue in the in the

because of the the job assignments when

a person is a congressional

representative for example and has the

duty of representing her or his

congressional district in the interests

that are there it's a job and as you

know a significant number of the

Congress people are lawyers they view

themselves as representing a certain

client base and the problem is is that

we represent if we represent a nation

state and we insist upon maintaining the

the special privilege of our citizens

the special access we have to resources

in the world Etc even to the detriment

of other other nation states we're still

at a level of Consciousness that is very

dangerous

talking too much yeah break it down for

me you gotta get me give me two three

points I mean we only have a lot of time

and I love everything you said yeah but

don't give it to me back we got to have

something to hold on to when you're

we're going to we're going to have to

yield some of our national sovereignty

to an inner to a global body like the

United Nations okay right there we're

not doing that I mean we got the

leadership presence now who'd only

acknowledge that exists so we're not

going to yield anything it's got to be

approached to it maybe we do it better

because we're former elected officials

public policy makers can't say it like

that because the wall goes up and you

don't get past it it's got to be a

better way to say that and begin to do

some of what you suggest and it'll come

probably through religious communities

that the the altering of Consciousness

with regard to an Angelic realm a

another dimension of reality that's

where most people categorize these types

of discussions that's where you worked

with the Jesuit yes a coordination

Coalition I think that's a good night

that's a good start because I think you

can't leave out Private Industry I think

you can't think about the universities I

mean it's got to be a major Coalition of

things and institutions in our country

and around the world that would come

together more than one time with experts

like yourselves and laymen like us and

others who have interest in the issue

because it is a world phenomenon and if

we keep acting like it doesn't exist

then we all lose the world loses that's

right so you know I know I think time is

urgent and I'm very new at the issue so

I'm just learning it even as a member of

the appropriate armed service committee

we tacitly touched it but then it goes

away even at the Academy where we're

outstanding young men and women who

dedicate their lives to this country and

they have some things that they look at

and then it's put away it's it's in the

it's in the Air Force Academy exactly

exactly how to address

I was going to go to the airport do you

feel the urgency do you all feel the

urgency and I'm going to ask um I'm

going to say your name wrong thank you

very much Mr she had the Earth is there

an urgency here are we just here just

just talking

normally people have put it away I mean

officially right governments but I think

in a way there is because the potential

uh is is it has a very good potential

like I said in my statement it could

really do the trick that anything else

everything else has failed you know what

do we do in this earth we have

tremendous problems uh besides this

issue uh environmental problems uh

um hunger and so on you know and somehow

we don't seem to be able to deal with

them as a as a world society there's

just too much

fighting and in ideological differences

and religious differences the issue of

religious is very important look at all

the recent uh problems we've had

internationally you know uh with certain

factions of the Islamic religion and all

that in fact I wrote an article in in

the magazine about the UFOs in Islam and

uh and with which is quite interesting

thing for me to to research that and

like all religions you know again you

have many factions within a religion uh

I do agree with with Daniel probably if

if the pope and in other religious

figures they might be the the way to do

it that that may do the trick rather

than the political will because you know

how politics are yeah I mean you know

better than we do how okay things again

I actually have a minute left thank you

very much for that just just some kind

of summary and try to understand it as

an appropriator

12 years on the federal Appropriations

Committee with a budget of nearly three

trillion dollars biggest being the armed

services of 700 billion dollars now

we're on our knees we don't have the

money for this or that could this

possibly be something that can save our

budget get more resources make it

Universal offer some kind of I'm looking

at it from Appropriations Point there's

got to be some coming together we spent

a lot of money doing a lot of things

that never happened quick answer I sit

here as an appropriator looking for

dollars to help save America First and

incidentally help the rest of the world

sorry to interrupt there anything that

can allow an object to loiter

indefinitely instantly accelerate and do

it all silently is using something

better than petroleum for it moving

around so there there must be whatever

that answer is there must be something

implicit in the reality of this

phenomenon that will actually be a game

changer and that's that's really one

hope we've got everything so messed up

in every other way looking at the world

we're not cooperating we're fighting but

if if this is real if there is a energy

Paradigm solution here in the UFO

phenomenon that by itself is worth every

single effort that we can make to get

that out in the open thank you thank you

thank you

thank you

thank you very much Senator gravel

it's not only the problem of the

Congress it's the problem of the

American people

which has been propagandized by the

Congress and its leadership that we are

superior As Americans to anybody else in

the world that's the problem if we're

going to have a global Community we must

put our humanness first before our

nationality

and and what what the testimony that I

read is that you're talking about a

paradigm change in global governance now

let me ask this as a favor to you to us

uh for this immediate hearing

would you Antonio get together with

Daniel and the others and draft draft a

resolution that we could decide upon at

the end of the hearings on Friday to

recommend the creation of a United

Nations agency

using the Granada precedent and already

the numbers the resolutions have been so

you draft that it's that doesn't have to

be 20 Pages it could be one page maybe

two paragraphs you draft this so that we

can get our hands around something in

this regard and then we'll have to make

a decision are we prepared as former

public officials as private citizens to

put our money where our mouth is and

that is to be globalist before we become

nationalists and that's the answer yes

so if you could provide us with that

documentary be deeply in your debt as on

this side of the table I would say I

could start that a little bit it because

there's a there's a provision in the

United Nations which is called unite

uniting for peace resolution and Henry

Kissinger told us about this in gov 180

at Harvard College and he said if the

world population ever finds out about

this we are all in trouble he said I was

kind of wondering who he met and he's

right yeah the government the leadership

is going to be in trouble once the

people wake up that's right but you need

a device and right now the device is the

knowledge that you're bringing forward

that we're trying to observe here so

first would you bring that resolution as

soon as you can we'll circulate it among

the members and the leadership of the

Paradigm research group and we can just

to seek to exciting now the question I

would ask uh Mr Dolan uh you mentioned

uh that the compendium of documents that

you're aware of uh has come about

through Freedom of Information Act has

come about by accident in many regards

is there anything out there that that

document wise backs up the Roswell

incident that is the crash and the

humanoids is there any document that we

could hand put our hands on yeah yes sir

there are there are a few very

interesting documents even uh as early

as July 1947 FBI

uh which was involved in investigating

the so-called flying saucers very

actively had a memo indicating that um

the uh debris or whatever was recovered

at Roswell was being transferred to

right field Dayton Ohio U.S Air Force

Headquarters

I think that's rather interesting

whatever this was if it was some kind of

balloon apparatus I think we could ask

why why would that be transferred to to

right field

so that's interesting there there are a

number of other

um

documents that talk about

rumors within the military discussions

of um

that's not good enough right no no

that's hearsay but regarding Ross but

there was in back in 1994 the general

Accounting Office of Congress was was

tasked with looking into the Roswell

incident

all right and this was on the initiative

of late representative Stephen Schiff of

New Mexico

whose constituents asked him to do this

and he and he did uh Schiff talked about

this at length about how the Air Force

and the Pentagon just stonewalled him

gave him nothing gave him a lot of

expletives as well uh in the process but

what the gaos investigation

was that the relevant records at Roswell

from the end of 1946 into I think

1948-49 were gone all the records that

they were looking for that they expected

to find were surprised not there

and uh there was no explanation given

these were records according to the GAO

that should not have been

ever removed they were permanent but

they were they were gone and the Air

Force by the way was very very Deft in

their handling of this because while the

GAO investigation was going on the

United States Air Force took the

initiative

and did their own study quote unquote

study in which they beat the GAO to the

punch in terms of publicity got their

own thing out there and said oh

yeah it was a classified balloon project

known as mogul

which was designed to test to see

whether the Soviets were detonating

their own atomic

uh it's a big big fat report it looks

very impressive when you actually read

it it's a

it's a load of fluff in my opinion but

that was their explanation they beat the

GAO to the punch and so they won the pr

warm good thank you the Mr Sheen would

you address uh briefly what is the

theological implication

briefly yeah it's uh coming coming to

grips with the full import of the

theological reality

uh is what undergirds all of this is

that for for each of us to recognize

that we are incarnated in in a material

form

but that there are other vibrational

frequencies at which there are other

dimensions of reality going on at the

same time uh our our theology is the

realm in which we deal with it it's a

category of knowledge in the Human

family in which we deal with other

dimensions of reality

what happens after death how did we get

here what are we doing here what's our

ultimate purpose these are things that

are raised by the UFO issue and that's

why I reiterate that it's theology it's

in the realm of theology that we have to

come to address this and when we when we

do what we're going to discover is that

we're going to draw down into our

culture

a lot of those same realities that for

example the Native American culture and

some of the Aboriginal cultures

understand that they are in a dynamic

relationship with other dimensions other

vibrational frequencies uh and that our

culture our culture has closed itself

off from that from the from the time of

the Enlightenment in trying to Define

ourselves as separated individuated

intellectual beings and that we're not

in a harmonious uh in in balanced

relationship with the rest of reality

the consequences of course are falling

upon us now because of the global

climate change that we're experiencing

the contamination of our environment by

ourselves and this is the crisis I think

one of the crises that's going to

confront us and that my sense is that

we're going to become much more if we

probe into the Theology of all of this

we're going to come to have a much more

profound appreciation for the Native

American culture and the Theology of the

Native American culture and the faculty

of of intuitional perception that our

human family has which is a faculty

that's evolving uh teleologically in our

culture and this is what Tejada chardan

has dealt with it within the Jesuits

it's a It's The Cutting Edge of modern

Theology and the insights that we've

gained now through quantum physics since

1923 to 1926 we have to integrate into

our scientific worldview the insights of

quantum physics and we have to begin to

readjust our basic worldview as I

pointed out before to evolve a new world

view that integrates these capabilities

thank you very much I yield back the

balance for my time

[Applause]

Congressman cook

I would like to start by asking Colonel

French you were involved in the uh

initiations of the Blue Book processes

because

could you elaborate a little more on

what you found out from that and

especially

so I have a better understanding of how

that uh

got stopped or discarded or what exactly

happened on the blue book and how long

did that go on I just need a better

understanding curve if you don't mind

too much but they asked about what

happened to the the results of the

accident at Alamogordo yeah well all of

that that was taken to what is called

the foreign technology division at

Wright-Patterson Air Force Base and what

was shipped there was physical debris uh

actually parts of some kind of airplane

another unusual aspect of it was uh

though the metal wasn't it wasn't any

thicker than cellophane I mean just but

you put it in your hand and you crush it

together and it flops right back into

shape with had it analyzed it didn't

come from Earth there's no known

we have no known source of whatever that

metal was

yes you've actually uh held some of that

yeah

and so is Marcel

I guess they want to sell but did the

same thing no

and uh and I understand from uh

from from the Roswell basically what's

generally called the Roswell incident uh

I realized there were several different

locations of

materials gathered up

there were dozens and dozens of

Witnesses on the materials and you're

clearly one of them and one of the

you know at least in terms of the

analysis of the materials not

necessarily

Gathering them up but

tell us about

were there Witnesses of any

uh has been referred to as a humanoid oh

yes but but and who because you don't

hear nearly as much about that but yeah

we're taken to the foreign technology

division there were if I remember it was

about eight or nine Corpses

and I'm more interested right now in the

witnesses to that I've read the accounts

but worth it there were many witnesses

of material I would point you to anyone

that can add to that except uh

Marcel okay because he he was the first

one to pick it up

went out to the crash Police Stopped the

pieces of the airplane

and there were specific markings on them

like they were identification numbers

for parts or something of that nature

but it would look like rather like

Arabic writing it didn't look like

anything from our

did Marcel indicate that he had actually

witnessed the humanoid part

I know he witnessed the uh

the answer over here well and please if

anybody can illuminate first of all

there are quite many many witnesses of

course who've gone on the record about

Roswell unfortunately we'll have a

Roswell panel here uh oh maybe I'm yeah

and there are a number of uh researchers

have specialized in that my question was

it started off as the blue book but Blue

Book was the U.S Air Force official uh

public investigative body of UFOs from

uh

1940 and actually it was it was a

successor of a couple of previous ones

started 1952 went up to 1969 when it was

closed down okay but it did include some

of the Roswell stuff it included nothing

at Roswell the blue book They're they're

no there's nothing okay so that was okay

well I just I asked about the blue book

and nothing that happened when did you

say it was uh closed down and what was

the reason at the end of 1969. what

happened in the 1960s is that the United

States had a big big wave of UFO

sightings 1965-66 made the news Gerald

Ford Congressman Michigan talked about

on the on a on the floor of Congress his

constituents had seen UFOs and he was

not satisfied with the answers that were

coming from the Air Force and the

pressure was really on the United States

Air Force to do something about this

they it's hard to remember because it's

so far back in time but the Air Force

was losing a lot of credibility on this

a lot of people were not believing the

Air Force explanations and swamp gas

became a big National joke at that time

and so really all the Air Force wanted

to do is get rid of UFOs and so what

they ended up doing was a contracted

with the University of Colorado

to conduct what was to be the the first

true public scientific investigation of

UFOs and and the whole attitude was

whatever Colorado comes up with that's

what we're going to conclude

and what what that that study did is a

that was a whole big mess and half the

scientists got fired Midway through the

project because they were Believers the

the man running at Edward Condon was an

absolutely dead set against any kind of

pro-ufo uh Pro ET

So based on that recommendation the Air

Force was able to wash their hands say

thank you very much and they said we're

out of the business we're not doing this

anymore there's no way to retrieve any

of the I just got to make sure I

understand this and I appreciate it

because you've illuminated this greatly

for me was there any way to find out

exactly what was in

the blue book at this point then

I'm looking for yes yes I mean well

the files they're still there they were

just saying they're absolutely being

covered up no no

we can still read those okay well I was

on that issue the problem is yeah and

the problem is that Russell stuff is not

in the Blue Book okay yeah now I've got

a better understanding of all that and

in the in the prior panel uh standing

Friedman referred to a memo by a general

Carol ballander in which he he stated in

closing Blue Book down in 1969 that UFO

reports affecting National Security were

not part of the Blue Book system so blue

book I do remember him saying that yeah

if I could turn to uh Mr huneus and Mr

Sheehan

religion has been brought up and implied

in terms of this whole thing several

ways and um

now you're not trying to say that just

because Pat Robertson has a particular

view or because uh popes in the past

have said things that clearly don't

agree with what you're saying is a

Jesuit right

that religion is somehow against the

idea of extraterrestrial life no in in

fact is quite the contrary that remember

religion relig Arrow the Latin

derivative of religion is to re-link

the whole idea of relinking uh the

intellect in electus the the root of

intellect is in electus the ability to

distinguish the difference between

that whole ability that we developed

somewhere between Australopithecus and

Homo erectus this intellectual capacity

we alienated ourselves in a separate

entity here behind our eyeballs from all

the rest of reality sure that's the

danger okay but I'm gonna kind of adjust

this a little bit

was there an implication that it's more

of the uh well let me just say this

going to Christian religions in specific

you think there's some bias against

the belief in extraterrestrial uh

because you were talking about maybe

we're going to have to accept this from

a different religious perspective or

something I think that within within one

of the features the unique features of

CR of Catholic christianology for

example is each of the World Views that

I'd pointed out that have political

implications there are subsets of

Catholic and Christian theology in all

of those so there's a reactionary

worldview that is fundamentalist that

everything is divided into good guys and

bad guys and the Satan in in Angelic

Realms and they've projected this

satanic reality that they have onto

extraterrestrials which is very very

dangerous well I would you know I'm not

in any way here to do missionary work

for my particular religious Faith or

certainly to speak for my religious

faith I'm a Mormon uh but on a

fundamental level many Mormons believe

it's consistent with doctors of the

church that there is life what's an

official outside the uh it's an official

Doctrine under the Church of Latter-day

Saints the actual belief in

extraterrestrial intelligence and I

wanted to make that point clear again

I'm not here for that no but it's true

but I'm I'm also

hey

I think and I think most Mormons believe

as I do on that yes would still say

that's still a leap

to say that we've had the visitation

and there's nothing in the religious

sense that would prohibit that

right but we need

as strong in evidence as we can to help

this panel open up some Congressional

hearings and by the way I'm not giving

up on the United States Congress yet I

don't think we have to go to the United

Nations maybe that might be a way

but let's also try to open this up at

the United States Congress yes level I

agree

[Applause]

the Catholic position on all this well

my grandmother's a Catholic that's all I

have to do with the Catholic Church

however

it's very important one thing that the

Catholic church has done and believe it

or not that commissioned the building of

a wide-angle lens to search the skies

for inbound UFO

it's in Tucson Arizona believe it or not

okay well thank you

thank you very much congresswoman Huli

what kind of

I mean the reaction over the last

30 40 years in the United States what

are what's the reaction and what's what

has happened in the rest of the world

what's going on have there been

sightings do they feel differently about

it than we've you know a lot of people

feel about it here what's happening

elsewhere well as I said in my statement

uh the one thing that I think even

Skeptics would have to agree is that the

UFO phenomenon is worldwide it doesn't

matter I mean it doesn't matter the

religion it doesn't matter the ethnic

origin the language the culture it has

been reported all over the world now

there are some sociological differences

as you would expect right from different

cultures but we see there's a quite a

rich history of UFO even UFO

investigations official investigations

and we will be discussing this in in in

in a few more sessions during this week

about investigations and we have in fact

with us some members from some of the

South American

agencies

so we've seen an opening uh in recent

years

particularly in some European countries

and and particularly in South America

now

or as it may seem it almost seems to be

good politics now in South America to

have a UFO investigation I know it

sounds awkward by the the Latin culture

is more obviously more open uh there's a

much less ridicule in the media and all

that about this phenomenon and so we've

seen a trend it started with Uruguay

back in the late 70s and we have a

representative that will be speaking

later in this week and then Chile Peru

Ecuador Brazil Argentina recently

announced the creation of of a UFO

agency within the Air Force what is

interesting about the South American

approach to this phenomenon from an

official point of view is that there's

not an adversarial relationship between

the official military agencies and the

civilian UFO cities or UFO groups

totally different from the United States

where we even in the days of Blue Book

there was always a big fight between

ufologists civilian ufologists and the

air force that was classic you know if

you read the history of UFOs in the

United States but in South America and

it used to be a little bit like that too

in South America not as bad as here but

now you see that they cooperate and they

usually what happens is because a lot of

these agencies they have a limited

budget a small budget so they call for

volunteers from the civilian community

and that Crea that shows us a model we

don't have to have an adversarial we

don't have to fight the government this

is a mystery we should all work together

in order to solve this mystery so that

that's at least some of what is going on

um but even Russia has had a lot of

official investigations even under the

Soviet Union there were committees uh

from the they were actually two

committees that were that were going on

in the late 70s and 80s one was a public

one uh through the Soviet Academy of

Sciences and the other one was a secret

one by the KGB and the ministry of

Defense the Soviet military

nobody knew about that one publicly but

the scientific one was or even

officially revealed even in the control

Soviet media

and then of course under Gorbachev in

the 1980s glasnost it opened up and the

UFO phenomenon became very very popular

in uh in in in in the late Soviet

society and into modern Russia so uh

China has had kind of a semi-official uh

organization called the China UFO

research organization we will have one

of its founding members here also

attending this hearing so yes you see it

all over the world in in other countries

actually have a more open attitude I

mean officially

so it provides a model also for the U.S

in my opinion for any of the panelists

um the other question I have one of the

other questions I have is

a lot of people when they talk about

this at least in this country are

ridiculed when they talk about it this

is you know Pooh pod you're you know

you're somewhere in outer space

um

what why I guess has there been some

organization or is it just are attitudes

in the United States tell me why there's

so much skepticism in this country

um I'll feel I'll try to feel that I do

find privately people are much more open

about this than they are when they're in

a public situation that's one thing

people discover that probably any of

these researchers and they discover oh

you research UFOs inevitably they will

say oh let me tell you about what I saw

last year five years 20 years ago so

those stories are out there and people I

firmly believe there is a true hunger

for knowledge on this once people

realize that there's something to it but

I agree with you in our public discourse

this is a third rail whether you are in

major Media or politics or Academia

they're all really the same in this

regard

I had a professor at UCLA called me a

number of years ago department chair

said well I really just want to let you

know I enjoy your books I said thank you

why are you whispering in the phone

which literally he was whispering and

you know he said the typical thing that

every Professor would say well my

Department's kind of political and you

know not go right so uh it's always the

retired ones who look for me

but um personally I I believe you know

the the the town the tone was set back

in the 50s and in fact the the top

skeptic debunker in the U.S at that time

was a Harvard astronomer by the name of

Donald Menzel

um Menzel wrote a number of books he was

like the the pit bull guard dog

maintaining Orthodoxy

uh that you know if some little

community college professor was going to

get out of line and talk about UFOs

here's Menzel Harvard astronomer who's

going to argue with Menzel and he'd slap

them down Menzel we learned years later

had a very very close relationship with

the National Security Agency very close

uh that does this prove that the NSA

used him in this capacity who knows but

these things this is how it looks

back in the late 1970s journalist Carl

Bernstein had the famous Rolling Stone

article uh in which he said there are

over 400 U.S journalists that I have

identified who had a covert relationship

with the Central Intelligence Agency uh

CIA promptly said well we don't we don't

do that anymore and if you read the

language carefully in their statements

especially in the 1990s they're very

lawyerly in their denials it's very

clear that there are relationships so

what I am suggesting and I guess this is

the conspiracy angle here but I I would

suggest that there are proxies

that work with National Security

elements

look it's an open revolving door in much

of our society anyway uh most of us is

out in the open but I think that there

are relationships friendly relationships

uh with academic

and with media and uh political as well

where where you have the herders

who basically keep the underlings in

line and every now and then someone gets

out of line and they have to be dealt

with but so I think that that's how the

culture is created and it has a top-down

effect and most people they don't want

to be Superman they have their jobs they

have got their family they got their

things they can't fight the machine so

they just they live their lives and hope

that someone else takes it on

there there are documents that Mr Dolan

can tell you about the internal

documents in the Air Force and others

where they consciously instruct their

officers to ridicule and debunk people

is a specific official policy inside the

Air Force people they know positively

have seen one of these things to try to

destroy their credibility yeah the

Robertson panel which is a famous CIA a

symposium that took place in January of

1953 in fact they used the word the bank

yeah it's in the document itself as the

colonel says you know specifically

assigned to go out and ridicule them and

tell them they're ridiculous and most

people can't stand up against that kind

of thing coming from authority figures

right

was the last Act of the Truman

Administration it was the last weekend

of Harry Truman's presidency that this

classified panel took place and it was

specifically related to UFOs very

interesting little historical factoid

there and as Daniel just pointed out its

conclusion was this is a necessary topic

and we must debunk it to the American

people this is not a good thing for them

to be uh thinking about

thank you and they're working with the

media to do that

from where was the balloon the Mogul

balloon that was supposed to have been

the Roswell incident from where was it

supposedly launched

that's yeah the Mogul

I thought they were White Sands

Alamogordo

that area we we have the record

I'm so sorry

from where

you know what a pie ball is it's it's a

high altitude balloon that they track

they launch them and then track them so

they can keep track of the upper air

currents but that if when it was

launched when uh Marcel launched the

thing he would have had probably

standing right in front of Base Ops

because that's where they send them up

from

from where base operations

you see the fighter squadrons your

bomber squadrons or whatever they have

their own particular area but Transit

airplanes always launched from base

operation how close is one of those to

Roswell

it's on Roswell base so that what

they're saying is that the balloon was

launched there and crashed there

yes

well I I don't I don't know where

exactly that it crashed see these

balloons were supposed to be determining

uh

possible uh Soviet nuclear detonations

uh

I'm just curious where they thought

because if it was launched somewhere

else the probability that landing at

Roswell was was vanishingly small you

know I had a course in advanced

statistics and it's vanishingly small

probability the the United States Air

Force in there 1994 reports it said

these were launched out of White Sands

and um

you know and that actually they had a a

schedule of of a number of these balloon

launches that uh went down and were

recovered so there were several that

were from

the spring of 1947 and in fact they uh

speculated that this wasn't really a

slam dunk but they they indicated that

the um

that they thought that they'd identified

the one launch that was in fact

supposedly the Roswell crash I'm trying

to remember the date on that as has been

mentioned the Curious Thing about all of

this is in the Gio report there was

nothing for them to look at because all

of the relevant information had been

destroyed they had no idea at whose

command had been destroyed and you know

this is very unorthodox it should have

been there

kind of interesting isn't it I was a

member of the uh of the Science and

Technology committee I think it was

simply called the science committee then

when the ship held this uh I thought it

was a hearing apparently it was a

briefing and it was what about 94 or

five I came to the Congress in 93 and I

remember his his interest in that when I

was first approached about this week's

activities I was cautioned that if you

do this you could uh possibly be

relegated to The Lunatic Fringe and this

may not be good for uh for your

potential activities for the rest of

your uh

political productive life I'm 87 in five

weeks I don't know how much remains

anymore

this but I said you know I'm going to do

this because I think there's a

constitutional very serious

constitutional issue involved here

whether There Are UFOs or not

whether they are extraterrestrial not is

really quite irrelevant

to whether or not there ought to be

hearings on this because the First

Amendment to the Constitution

says the right of the people to petition

the government for a redress of

grievances

Mr shiam doesn't just fall in within

that oh yes there's there's no there's

no doubt about this uh the but but the

fact the fact of the matter is in a

National Security State from from the

net passage of the National Security Act

of 1947 there has been an entire caveat

on the Constitution that things that

fall under National Security and when

Oliver North can sit right in front of

you say sure I lied to you the Congress

because this was a covert operation you

know that we're in charge you're not in

charge and so there's a there's an

entire National Security State kind of

uh subculture that believes that they

have the right not only to hold

information back from Congress but to

openly defy Congress when you pass the

Poland Amendment prohibiting them from

engaging in the covert operations

against they go ahead and do it anyhow

the danger is a National Security State

would and if it arose in the context of

the cold war with the Soviet Union we

should move very aggressively at the end

of the Cold War to try to disassemble

some of those structures of the National

Security State not try to create a new

one so that they went searching very

quickly for some ultimate other that

they had to find and they ended up

having you know Afghanistan or Iran or

Iraq

it's a it's a mindset and and it's that

that whole kind of retrenchment into a

defensive position in the face of the

ultimate other and it's a it's an

ultimate mindset that we have to try to

overcome and as I point out that it's

it's a theological issue because that is

a is a malfunction of our intellect

and it cuts us off from our harmonious

relationship not only with the rest of

the universe but all other intelligent

species in the universe and that's

that's what we have to address I think

it's a worldview issue for

thank you

for 20 years in the Congress I served on

the armed services committee and I

remember Eisenhower's caution as he left

office that we should be concerned about

the military-industrial complex I

understand that in the original draft it

was military industrial Congressional

complex and he didn't he didn't want to

be too political so he took out the

Congressional it's too bad he did that

because this really is a military

industrial Congressional complex the

F-35 is built in in 48 states there are

96 senators and I don't know how many

100 representatives to support the F-35

not because we may need it but because

it creates jobs

yeah and you know too many of us cannot

make cannot differentiate for between

jobs that consume wealth and jobs that

create wealth yeah it's

a front page of the Washington Post

today you look at the headlines of the

Washington Post and it says that the

sequester of kind of cut back on the

military budget the all the arguments

are coming out now we can't do that

because of all the jobs in the

employment you know I mean it's an old

it's an old saw we've developed a an

economy that is so Reliant upon military

spending that in fact it drives the

policies to go looking for adversaries

and if we lose the adversary of the

Soviet Union on December 31st of 1991

with the dissolving of the Soviet Union

that takes them less than a few years to

find another one and if you have to go

so desperately that you're looking to

Afghanistan in in Iran as being your

ultimate threat to the most powerful

nation in the history of the human

civilization there's a motive for that

and it's not because they're threatening

you

when we held a hearing on this in the

Congress about the economic effects I

wouldn't have the father was chairman I

wouldn't have held the hearing economic

effects of sequestration

and when it came time for my question my

five minutes I said suppose when we left

here tonight we broke all the windows

out of this building and we did that all

over Washington and overnight a crew

came in and replaced all of those broken

windows and we did this every day we

broke out all the windows and the crew

would replace them all wouldn't that

create a lot of jobs just think of the

jobs that that would create you know and

my question was do you think that would

have a long-term beneficial effect on

the economy I wanted to understand the

difference between jobs that create

wealth and jobs that consume wealth but

we've been talking about the

Constitution and why I'm here I'm here

because I think that the Congress owes

the American people a hearing on this

subject

that's right

you may be dead wrong there may be

nothing to UFOs that is irrelevant you

have a right to petition the government

for redress or grievances all of my

questions have been anticipated by my

colleagues thank you all very much for a

very good panel and we'll now stand in

recess for lunch thank you

[Applause]