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1
00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,920
To be fair, it can’t be much fun
being a racist.
2
00:00:03,960 --> 00:00:06,040
You do all this stuff
with them students,
3
00:00:06,080 --> 00:00:08,240
milking it about
how much you’ve changed,
4
00:00:08,599 --> 00:00:10,287
how much of a better man
you are now,
5
00:00:10,353 --> 00:00:12,360
yet you thought
exactly the same way as I did
6
00:00:12,400 --> 00:00:15,000
- when you were my age, didn’t you?
- I’ll tuck you in.
7
00:00:15,040 --> 00:00:18,480
- What are you doing in bed with Dad?
- I was tired, Matthew.
8
00:00:18,520 --> 00:00:20,720
I’m going to commit a murder
to begin a race war.
9
00:00:20,760 --> 00:00:22,520
Another MP, Rosie Cooper.
10
00:00:22,990 --> 00:00:24,560
I know who the informant is.
11
00:00:24,600 --> 00:00:26,640
It’s this slug called Robbie Mullen.
12
00:00:26,933 --> 00:00:28,840
A lot of people
won’t forget what he’s done.
13
00:00:28,880 --> 00:00:30,920
The police are here.
It’s about the boys.
14
00:00:30,960 --> 00:00:32,840
Someone’s made a threat
against them.
15
00:00:32,880 --> 00:00:36,040
Listen, listen, look.
I’m-I’m leaving here now.
16
00:00:36,080 --> 00:00:37,360
Where were
these images posted?
17
00:00:37,400 --> 00:00:40,000
We found them on a thread
in a mobile seized yesterday.
18
00:00:40,040 --> 00:00:42,160
We believe the original posts are
linked to National Action.
19
00:00:42,200 --> 00:00:44,800
I’m sorry. He’s gonna have to go.
20
00:00:44,840 --> 00:00:46,800
That’s it now.
We can’t keep doing this.
21
00:00:47,518 --> 00:00:49,080
Robbie, this trial isn’t
far off now, lad,
22
00:00:49,120 --> 00:00:52,354
and you’re going to have
to demonstrate to the jury
23
00:00:52,434 --> 00:00:56,000
that you’re not the same as Renshaw
and the others, that they can trust you,
24
00:00:56,622 --> 00:00:59,000
cos you’re different from them.
25
00:00:59,338 --> 00:01:00,705
Is this some sort of test?
26
00:01:00,812 --> 00:01:03,320
Sticking me in the middle of Nigeria,
see how he handles it, yeah?
27
00:01:03,360 --> 00:01:04,680
- You’re scared, aren’t you?
- No!
28
00:01:04,720 --> 00:01:06,480
Cos you want me to stand up in court
29
00:01:06,520 --> 00:01:09,240
and tell everybody
that I’m a changed man, and I’m not!
30
00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:42,520
Jack Renshaw, stand up.
31
00:01:45,446 --> 00:01:48,488
You’ve been found guilty
of four counts
32
00:01:48,601 --> 00:01:51,767
of inciting a child to engage
in sexual activities.
33
00:01:51,840 --> 00:01:54,284
You’ve displayed
not one shred of remorse
34
00:01:54,384 --> 00:01:56,280
and the defence you put forward –
35
00:01:56,320 --> 00:02:00,200
that your phone had been hacked – was
as lacking in evidence as it was credibility.
36
00:02:01,015 --> 00:02:04,320
These are very serious offences
against minors,
37
00:02:04,360 --> 00:02:07,040
and in one case,
a boy as young as 13,
38
00:02:07,551 --> 00:02:09,320
and society needs protection
39
00:02:09,360 --> 00:02:12,080
against predatory paedophiles
like you.
40
00:02:13,043 --> 00:02:16,520
I impose upon you a prison sentence
of 16 months.
41
00:02:18,170 --> 00:02:19,954
- Take him down.
- Jack!
42
00:02:21,000 --> 00:02:22,614
We love you, son!
43
00:02:26,013 --> 00:02:28,120
16 months. It could have been worse.
44
00:02:28,160 --> 00:02:30,540
God, it’s going to be
in the newspapers.
45
00:02:32,712 --> 00:02:34,560
The whole fucking world’s
gonna read it.
46
00:02:34,600 --> 00:02:36,600
The judge ordered reporting
restrictions
47
00:02:36,640 --> 00:02:39,360
because of the upcoming trial
for the plan to kill the MP.
48
00:02:39,400 --> 00:02:41,280
No detail from this case
can be published
49
00:02:41,320 --> 00:02:43,120
until after that’s taken place.
50
00:02:43,160 --> 00:02:44,640
What? So, they can’t print it yet?
51
00:02:44,680 --> 00:02:46,570
We’ve got a bit of time.
52
00:02:47,413 --> 00:02:50,037
But the story will come out, Jack.
53
00:03:01,886 --> 00:03:04,366
I’ve got to warn you,
it’s a shithole in here.
54
00:03:04,473 --> 00:03:07,800
I live with four lads. Yous all stink.
55
00:03:09,437 --> 00:03:11,040
All right, lad?
56
00:03:11,647 --> 00:03:13,640
Yeah, I’m very well, thank you.
How are you?
57
00:03:13,680 --> 00:03:15,520
Lovely. Yeah,
what a beautiful day!
58
00:03:19,813 --> 00:03:22,760
- Are you not going to eat that?
- I’m not hungry.
59
00:03:23,840 --> 00:03:25,560
Save it for later.
60
00:03:30,580 --> 00:03:31,880
How are you feeling?
61
00:03:35,933 --> 00:03:37,520
Been doing anything exciting?
62
00:03:39,920 --> 00:03:41,600
Watching the telly?
63
00:03:42,246 --> 00:03:44,120
Any boxsets
you’d like to recommend?
64
00:03:45,370 --> 00:03:47,440
I haven’t been watching much telly. I’ve just...
65
00:03:47,660 --> 00:03:49,160
just been
on the computer.
66
00:03:50,632 --> 00:03:52,412
What did you say?
67
00:03:53,010 --> 00:03:55,730
I’ve not been watching telly.
I’ve been on the computer.
68
00:03:56,670 --> 00:03:59,240
{\an8}You’re being careful about what
websites you’ve been going on?
69
00:04:01,480 --> 00:04:04,400
- Robbie?
- You’re telling me what to do again.
70
00:04:04,440 --> 00:04:06,000
Yeah, I am telling you
what to do, yeah.
71
00:04:06,040 --> 00:04:08,036
Because if you’ve been
getting in touch with any of your old
72
00:04:08,102 --> 00:04:10,344
pals from National Action,
or if you’ve been looking
73
00:04:10,424 --> 00:04:13,560
at some kind of Combat 18 website
or the BNP
74
00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:16,160
or whatever right-wing shite
you used to look at,
75
00:04:16,200 --> 00:04:19,908
then this trial will collapse
and you’ll end up in prison.
76
00:04:20,302 --> 00:04:22,730
Where we’re from, most people end up
in prison anyway, don’t they?
77
00:04:22,837 --> 00:04:25,080
- Oh, what kind of comment’s that?
- All right, come on.
78
00:04:25,193 --> 00:04:26,667
Wish I was going to prison
79
00:04:26,793 --> 00:04:28,680
instead of standing in court
grassing on people.
80
00:04:28,720 --> 00:04:30,663
Will you shut up
about being a grass?
81
00:04:30,757 --> 00:04:32,760
{\an8}Who are you trying to protect anyway?
82
00:04:32,991 --> 00:04:34,360
{\an8}Jack Renshaw?
83
00:04:34,524 --> 00:04:37,040
{\an8}Because he’s just been convicted
for grooming young boys.
84
00:04:37,080 --> 00:04:40,520
We’ve only got your word for that though.
You could be trying to trick us.
85
00:04:40,560 --> 00:04:41,760
Why would
I wanna trick you?
86
00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:44,320
- I don’t know. Why wouldn’t you?
- Are you stupid or something?
87
00:04:44,360 --> 00:04:47,320
- Stupid? Why am I stupid?
- You’re an ungrateful little twat.
88
00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:48,440
- Hey, that’s enough!
- Yeah.
89
00:04:48,480 --> 00:04:50,320
- Yeah, all of this.
- All of this?!
90
00:04:50,360 --> 00:04:52,880
- Look at all this you’ve got here...
- Look, will you pack it in?
91
00:04:52,920 --> 00:04:55,400
Please, the two of you,
you’re worse than the boys!
92
00:04:55,682 --> 00:04:57,640
You, get in the shower.
93
00:04:57,680 --> 00:04:59,120
Wash your hair!
94
00:04:59,500 --> 00:05:02,674
And you,
you can get the hoover out.
95
00:05:27,173 --> 00:05:28,200
I’m sorry
96
00:05:28,240 --> 00:05:30,680
if I sounded ungrateful before,
but...
97
00:05:31,680 --> 00:05:34,308
I just don’t like it.
It’s full of Blacks and Asians.
98
00:05:34,428 --> 00:05:35,720
Rob, come on.
99
00:05:35,821 --> 00:05:38,133
I know I’m not supposed to say
things like that,
100
00:05:38,227 --> 00:05:40,000
but I can’t help it.
101
00:05:40,433 --> 00:05:41,800
It’s the way that I feel.
102
00:05:42,788 --> 00:05:44,565
Well, I know it looks bad but...
103
00:05:44,672 --> 00:05:47,800
No, what looks bad, lad,
is if you get caught out lying.
104
00:05:48,160 --> 00:05:51,172
At least if you tell the truth,
then noone can trip you up.
105
00:05:54,422 --> 00:05:55,600
Are you expecting anyone?
106
00:05:55,640 --> 00:05:58,395
You’re joking, aren’t you?
Nobody else knows I live here.
107
00:06:02,113 --> 00:06:03,520
- All right?
- Yeah.
108
00:06:04,286 --> 00:06:06,046
Someone to see you, lad.
109
00:06:06,766 --> 00:06:07,933
Mill!
110
00:06:08,019 --> 00:06:09,380
Hello, baby!
111
00:06:09,466 --> 00:06:11,661
Hello! What you doing?
112
00:06:11,741 --> 00:06:13,680
B-b-b-b-b... Hello!
113
00:06:14,484 --> 00:06:17,663
Well, at least he’s glad to see someone.
How is he anyway?
114
00:06:17,817 --> 00:06:19,600
Unhelpful, angry.
115
00:06:19,640 --> 00:06:21,000
Suspicious.
116
00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:22,560
Well, his usual jolly self, then.
117
00:06:23,189 --> 00:06:24,680
This could be end of us,
you know that?
118
00:06:25,150 --> 00:06:27,011
I mean, if this
all goes wrong, then...
119
00:06:27,130 --> 00:06:28,737
our reputation
is shot to pieces.
120
00:06:28,844 --> 00:06:31,440
So, it all hangs
on a big, sulky racist from Widnes?
121
00:06:32,800 --> 00:06:33,880
It’s not funny!
122
00:06:35,120 --> 00:06:36,440
She’s got a point.
123
00:06:37,403 --> 00:06:39,989
You need to try and get out,
you know, meet people.
124
00:06:40,612 --> 00:06:41,720
What, round here?
125
00:06:41,803 --> 00:06:43,640
Yes, round here.
126
00:06:43,680 --> 00:06:47,800
It’s not doing you any good
sitting in that flat all day by yourself.
127
00:06:48,103 --> 00:06:48,996
I’ve...
128
00:06:49,096 --> 00:06:51,560
ruined my life, I know I have.
129
00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:53,280
You have not.
130
00:06:56,173 --> 00:06:58,320
What if they don’t believe me,
131
00:06:58,760 --> 00:07:00,080
the jury?
132
00:07:01,323 --> 00:07:03,150
It’s my word against theirs,
isn’t it?
133
00:07:03,260 --> 00:07:04,350
Yeah,
134
00:07:05,050 --> 00:07:06,797
but you’re telling the truth.
135
00:07:12,326 --> 00:07:14,400
I don’t wanna do it any more.
136
00:07:14,786 --> 00:07:16,480
That’s the truth.
137
00:07:18,920 --> 00:07:21,668
I just wanna go back
to the way things were before.
138
00:07:29,933 --> 00:07:33,320
Oi, what you playing at?
Get to the back of the queue, bruv!
139
00:07:33,360 --> 00:07:35,160
I’m not eating. I’m not eating.
140
00:07:37,479 --> 00:07:39,119
You all right, Chris?
141
00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:43,480
How-How’s it going?
142
00:07:43,707 --> 00:07:45,964
I’ve been hearing whispers about you.
143
00:07:50,120 --> 00:07:52,040
Look, they hacked my phone.
144
00:07:52,153 --> 00:07:55,500
They put all this stuff on it
to destroy my reputation.
145
00:07:56,293 --> 00:07:58,280
It’s all fucking lies!
146
00:08:02,773 --> 00:08:05,506
I mean, they’re making me out
like I’m some sort of paedo.
147
00:08:08,532 --> 00:08:11,040
Matthew Collins is behind it all.
He’s trying to destroy me.
148
00:08:11,841 --> 00:08:14,120
This could make us all look bad.
149
00:08:14,529 --> 00:08:16,269
That won’t happen.
150
00:08:20,660 --> 00:08:22,580
I promise you that won’t happen.
151
00:08:30,273 --> 00:08:32,640
He’s got a big day
in front of him tomorrow.
152
00:08:33,159 --> 00:08:35,640
Try and make him look respectable,
Shimmy.
153
00:08:35,680 --> 00:08:37,040
I’ll do my best.
154
00:08:37,948 --> 00:08:39,880
Who’s at the bar mitzvah?
155
00:08:39,920 --> 00:08:41,680
That’s my grandson, Reuben.
156
00:08:44,716 --> 00:08:46,736
I’ll be honest with you, Matthew,
157
00:08:47,036 --> 00:08:48,451
he’s got it tough.
158
00:08:48,591 --> 00:08:50,720
Him and his sisters,
they go to the Jewish school.
159
00:08:51,306 --> 00:08:54,346
Whole place surrounded
by barbed wire.
160
00:08:55,398 --> 00:08:56,400
Hold still.
161
00:08:57,131 --> 00:08:59,320
Three security guards on the door.
162
00:08:59,723 --> 00:09:01,654
It’s the same
with all the Jewish schools.
163
00:09:01,767 --> 00:09:04,767
That it should come to that, eh,
in this day and age.
164
00:09:06,946 --> 00:09:08,880
Children having to cross barbed wire
165
00:09:09,613 --> 00:09:11,326
to go to school.
166
00:09:20,326 --> 00:09:22,446
- He looks dapper, don’t he?
- Yeah.
167
00:09:22,546 --> 00:09:24,400
You look really handsome, dead smart.
168
00:09:25,033 --> 00:09:26,440
How do you feel?
169
00:09:26,779 --> 00:09:28,219
Like a twat.
170
00:09:29,120 --> 00:09:32,829
Oh, no, like a used car salesman
or something.
171
00:09:33,966 --> 00:09:36,305
- I wouldn’t buy life insurance off you.
- Stop it!
172
00:09:36,604 --> 00:09:39,211
Don’t listen.
Robbie, you look great.
173
00:09:39,320 --> 00:09:41,800
You look like someone
who’s doing the right thing.
174
00:09:44,340 --> 00:09:46,300
There he is!
175
00:10:21,393 --> 00:10:22,620
Hey.
176
00:10:23,797 --> 00:10:24,850
You all right?
177
00:10:24,950 --> 00:10:28,343
So, listen, Matthew can’t be here,
not until you’ve both given evidence,
178
00:10:28,435 --> 00:10:31,280
but he wanted me to tell you,
you look better without the bum fluff.
179
00:10:32,236 --> 00:10:34,960
Come on, you’ll be fine.
In here.
180
00:10:36,386 --> 00:10:38,040
Sorry, mate,
can I help you?
181
00:10:41,733 --> 00:10:43,846
Are you connected to the case?
182
00:10:44,126 --> 00:10:46,360
- I’m connected with the defence.
- Oh, right.
183
00:10:55,353 --> 00:10:56,360
You know him?
184
00:11:00,253 --> 00:11:01,333
No.
185
00:11:01,446 --> 00:11:04,148
He’s just trying to freak you out.
Come on, let’s get you some tea.
186
00:11:06,338 --> 00:11:07,560
Court will rise.
187
00:11:24,283 --> 00:11:27,440
Members of the jury,
it will be alleged by the Crown
188
00:11:27,480 --> 00:11:29,880
that the defendants hold
extreme views.
189
00:11:30,828 --> 00:11:33,400
All of you, I suspect, hold views
190
00:11:33,440 --> 00:11:35,840
which could be described
as the very opposite of these.
191
00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:37,273
You’re not racist,
192
00:11:37,373 --> 00:11:40,033
you’re not homophobic,
you’re not anti-Semitic.
193
00:11:40,710 --> 00:11:43,880
But it is not a criminal offence
in this country
194
00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:45,180
just to hold these views,
195
00:11:45,266 --> 00:11:47,720
however repulsive you feel
they might be.
196
00:11:48,494 --> 00:11:50,873
We live in a free society
197
00:11:51,290 --> 00:11:54,240
and the law tolerates
the holding of these opinions.
198
00:12:11,266 --> 00:12:15,240
Ladies and gentlemen, I appear
on behalf of the prosecution.
199
00:12:15,280 --> 00:12:19,385
Mr. Atkinson, I’m going to ask you
to pause for a moment there, as...
200
00:12:19,532 --> 00:12:22,080
we need to hear from Mr. Jackson.
201
00:12:23,446 --> 00:12:25,128
- What have you done?
- My lord.
202
00:12:25,207 --> 00:12:26,963
I don’t care any more.
203
00:12:27,080 --> 00:12:28,962
- It’s too late for me.
- Thank you, my lord.
204
00:12:29,035 --> 00:12:30,720
I represent Mr. Renshaw,
205
00:12:30,760 --> 00:12:32,977
and I would seek, with your leave,
206
00:12:33,080 --> 00:12:35,880
that you have him re-arraigned
on counts one and two.
207
00:12:36,521 --> 00:12:39,800
- If this is how you wish to proceed.
- It is how I’m instructed, Your Lordship.
208
00:12:41,421 --> 00:12:44,200
Jack Renshaw,
will you stand up, please?
209
00:12:47,375 --> 00:12:50,000
You are charged on count one
of this indictment
210
00:12:50,040 --> 00:12:54,200
of engaging in conduct
in preparation of a terrorist act,
211
00:12:54,240 --> 00:12:57,840
namely the murdering
of Rosie Cooper MP.
212
00:12:58,432 --> 00:13:01,000
Are you guilty or not guilty?
213
00:13:01,440 --> 00:13:02,440
Guilty.
214
00:13:05,878 --> 00:13:09,240
On count two, you are charged
with making a threat to kill.
215
00:13:09,280 --> 00:13:12,393
The particulars are that,
on July 1st, 2017,
216
00:13:12,480 --> 00:13:14,400
you made a threat
to Robbie Mullen
217
00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:16,960
that you would kill
DC Victoria Henderson,
218
00:13:17,346 --> 00:13:19,289
intending that Robbie Mullen
would fear
219
00:13:19,360 --> 00:13:21,520
that said threat would
be carried out.
220
00:13:22,129 --> 00:13:24,480
Are you guilty or not guilty?
221
00:13:25,406 --> 00:13:26,926
Guilty.
222
00:13:33,160 --> 00:13:35,400
Renshaw’s pleaded guilty
to the plots to kill.
223
00:13:37,226 --> 00:13:38,920
What? Guilty?
224
00:13:38,960 --> 00:13:43,150
Well, but does that mean I don’t have to
give any evidence? It’s all over or...?
225
00:13:43,689 --> 00:13:45,080
Not quite, I’m afraid.
226
00:13:45,120 --> 00:13:46,902
They’re all still on trial
for membership
227
00:13:46,975 --> 00:13:50,080
and Lythgoe’s facing one count
of encouragement to murder.
228
00:13:50,120 --> 00:13:53,840
I reckon he’s fallen on his sword
to try and bury all the paedo stuff.
229
00:13:53,880 --> 00:13:54,920
Stupid.
230
00:13:55,235 --> 00:13:57,228
He at least had a decent shot
at a defence,
231
00:13:57,315 --> 00:13:59,600
but... now he’s going to end up
with life imprisonment?
232
00:14:00,060 --> 00:14:01,315
He wants the headline to be
233
00:14:01,415 --> 00:14:03,920
“Fascist martyr prepared to kill
for the cause.”
234
00:14:03,960 --> 00:14:06,362
And not “Fascist paedo
trying to have sex with young boys.”
235
00:14:06,455 --> 00:14:08,233
What about
Lythgoe and Hankinson?
236
00:14:08,322 --> 00:14:09,960
He’s trying to take the heat
off them.
237
00:14:10,000 --> 00:14:13,174
Mr. Atkinson, if you could pick up
from where you left off, please.
238
00:14:13,327 --> 00:14:14,581
My lord.
239
00:14:16,360 --> 00:14:19,160
These defendants stand before you,
240
00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:22,468
accused of their continuing participation
241
00:14:22,595 --> 00:14:24,200
in National Action,
242
00:14:24,830 --> 00:14:27,708
a banned organisation
that sought actively
243
00:14:27,761 --> 00:14:30,935
through fear, intimidation and violence
244
00:14:31,050 --> 00:14:32,560
to shape society
245
00:14:32,600 --> 00:14:35,160
in accordance with their beliefs.
246
00:14:38,546 --> 00:14:41,253
Mr. Renshaw had purchased a machete
247
00:14:41,360 --> 00:14:43,120
with which to carry out his plan.
248
00:14:43,160 --> 00:14:46,440
The online marketing
for that particular item
249
00:14:46,516 --> 00:14:48,280
describes it as offering
250
00:14:48,320 --> 00:14:51,760
“19 inches of unprecedented piercing
251
00:14:51,800 --> 00:14:55,080
“and slashing power
at a market price.”
252
00:14:58,235 --> 00:15:00,440
There is now no doubt,
after his guilty pleas,
253
00:15:00,480 --> 00:15:04,280
that Mr. Renshaw planned the murders
of Rosie Cooper MP
254
00:15:04,320 --> 00:15:06,640
and Detective Constable
Victoria Henderson.
255
00:15:06,680 --> 00:15:08,379
The Crown’s case...
256
00:15:08,605 --> 00:15:12,069
is that he was given permission
to carry out the murder of Rosie Cooper
257
00:15:12,202 --> 00:15:15,581
by the then leader
of National Action, Chris Lythgoe,
258
00:15:15,975 --> 00:15:17,367
in the name
259
00:15:17,593 --> 00:15:19,493
of that organisation.
260
00:15:22,190 --> 00:15:25,720
My lord, I call Robbie Mullen.
261
00:15:33,306 --> 00:15:35,560
Mr. Mullen, it’s time.
262
00:16:19,326 --> 00:16:22,480
Place your right hand on the Bible
and read from the card.
263
00:16:28,352 --> 00:16:30,680
“I-I swear by almighty God
264
00:16:30,720 --> 00:16:32,960
“that the evidence I shall give
265
00:16:33,524 --> 00:16:35,800
“shall be the truth, the whole truth
266
00:16:36,226 --> 00:16:38,434
“and nothing but the truth.”
267
00:16:47,006 --> 00:16:49,320
Could you confirm your name, please?
268
00:16:49,706 --> 00:16:50,840
Robbie Mullen.
269
00:16:50,880 --> 00:16:53,279
A little about you to start with,
Mr. Mullen.
270
00:16:53,360 --> 00:16:55,480
Where in the country
did you grow up?
271
00:16:56,483 --> 00:16:59,160
Widnes, which is in the north-west.
272
00:16:59,660 --> 00:17:02,760
Your school days came
to somewhat of an abrupt end.
273
00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:05,680
An incident involving
you swearing at a teacher?
274
00:17:06,686 --> 00:17:08,200
Yeah.
275
00:17:08,240 --> 00:17:10,440
And you’ve drifted from job to job
since then,
276
00:17:10,514 --> 00:17:12,400
no real direction
in your life?
277
00:17:13,811 --> 00:17:14,880
I suppose so.
278
00:17:16,120 --> 00:17:19,000
When did you join National Action?
279
00:17:19,865 --> 00:17:21,480
2015.
280
00:17:21,520 --> 00:17:23,320
The gentlemen sitting in the dock,
281
00:17:23,966 --> 00:17:27,886
are they all known to you
through that organisation?
282
00:17:30,966 --> 00:17:31,986
Yeah.
283
00:17:32,133 --> 00:17:35,520
My lord, could Mr. Mullen speak up, please?
I couldn’t hear his reply.
284
00:17:35,560 --> 00:17:37,572
Do try and project your voice
285
00:17:37,659 --> 00:17:40,252
to the back of the court, please, Mr. Mullen.
286
00:17:41,306 --> 00:17:42,706
Sorry.
287
00:17:43,076 --> 00:17:44,209
Yeah.
288
00:17:46,653 --> 00:17:49,880
You and they were all members
of the organisation before the ban?
289
00:17:50,660 --> 00:17:52,652
- Yeah.
- And were you all still members
290
00:17:52,719 --> 00:17:55,880
after the ban on National Action
at the end of 2016?
291
00:17:56,813 --> 00:17:58,707
- Yeah.
- After the ban,
292
00:17:58,820 --> 00:18:01,570
did there come a time
when you had contact with Matthew Collins,
293
00:18:01,690 --> 00:18:04,960
who worked for the organisation
Hope Not Hate?
294
00:18:05,294 --> 00:18:06,840
- Yeah.
- For what reason?
295
00:18:08,560 --> 00:18:10,387
I couldn’t tell you, really.
296
00:18:10,480 --> 00:18:12,800
- I knew I just needed to get out of there...
- My lord,
297
00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:16,812
I’m sorry, he has a tendency to drop
his head down, drop his voice down.
298
00:18:16,925 --> 00:18:20,400
Perhaps try moving a little closer
to the microphone please, Mr. Mullen.
299
00:18:24,966 --> 00:18:26,306
Sorry.
300
00:18:27,740 --> 00:18:30,520
On page 20 of the bundle,
301
00:18:31,048 --> 00:18:33,520
we can see an email
you had screenshot-ed
302
00:18:33,560 --> 00:18:35,560
and forwarded to
Matthew Collins.
303
00:18:37,670 --> 00:18:39,599
- Yeah.
- It was an encrypted email
304
00:18:39,672 --> 00:18:41,694
you’d received from Chris Lythgoe,
305
00:18:41,780 --> 00:18:43,800
where he was talking
about recruiting new members
306
00:18:43,895 --> 00:18:46,317
for National Action in towns
in the north-west.
307
00:18:46,433 --> 00:18:47,864
Yeah.
308
00:18:49,354 --> 00:18:51,608
Largely white towns,
309
00:18:51,862 --> 00:18:53,360
and other –
310
00:18:53,706 --> 00:18:58,240
his words – “horrifically Paki-fied” towns.
311
00:19:01,407 --> 00:19:02,520
Yeah.
312
00:19:03,246 --> 00:19:07,781
Next page of the bundle, another email,
this one after National Action had been banned.
313
00:19:07,886 --> 00:19:09,770
In it you ask Chris Lythgoe,
314
00:19:09,883 --> 00:19:11,522
“Are you staying leader
315
00:19:11,707 --> 00:19:13,200
“of the overall group?”
316
00:19:13,240 --> 00:19:16,040
And can you read his reply?
317
00:19:18,039 --> 00:19:20,384
“You’re damn fucking right I am.
318
00:19:20,604 --> 00:19:24,025
“I’m the one person
with a clear picture
319
00:19:24,200 --> 00:19:26,120
“of where we’re going long-term.”
320
00:19:28,213 --> 00:19:30,741
So, in the period
immediately after the ban,
321
00:19:30,835 --> 00:19:32,640
Lythgoe remained in charge?
322
00:19:34,018 --> 00:19:36,618
- Yeah.
- And Matt Hankinson?
323
00:19:40,639 --> 00:19:42,426
He was Chris’s
324
00:19:42,580 --> 00:19:44,260
second-in-command.
325
00:19:44,986 --> 00:19:47,600
He handled... security and stuff.
326
00:19:48,160 --> 00:19:49,640
And after the ban?
327
00:19:51,526 --> 00:19:53,566
Carried on like before.
328
00:19:54,335 --> 00:19:55,520
They both did.
329
00:19:57,640 --> 00:20:01,880
Let’s turn our attention now
to the night of July 1st, 2017.
330
00:20:02,908 --> 00:20:05,454
Did Mr. Renshaw say
why he was going to kill
331
00:20:05,554 --> 00:20:07,720
Rosie Cooper and Victoria Henderson?
332
00:20:07,760 --> 00:20:09,866
We believed, at first, it was...
333
00:20:10,345 --> 00:20:11,958
because he was depressed...
334
00:20:12,038 --> 00:20:14,400
about...
going to prison for his hate speeches.
335
00:20:15,085 --> 00:20:17,400
But I now know that it was also because
336
00:20:18,141 --> 00:20:21,680
he’d been arrested for grooming young boys
and it was about to come out.
337
00:20:22,156 --> 00:20:24,080
What was Mr. Lythgoe’s demeanour
338
00:20:24,120 --> 00:20:26,720
as Mr. Renshaw outlined his plans?
339
00:20:27,819 --> 00:20:29,400
He seemed happy.
340
00:20:29,875 --> 00:20:30,977
Smiling,
341
00:20:31,437 --> 00:20:32,824
nodding his head.
342
00:20:32,950 --> 00:20:35,400
Did he mention the Home Secretary,
Amber Rudd?
343
00:20:35,762 --> 00:20:37,017
Yeah.
344
00:20:37,411 --> 00:20:38,338
He said...
345
00:20:38,637 --> 00:20:41,200
Jack should do her instead of Rosie Cooper.
346
00:20:42,174 --> 00:20:44,627
- And what did Mr. Renshaw say?
- He said...
347
00:20:45,080 --> 00:20:47,280
she’d be too well protected.
348
00:20:48,600 --> 00:20:51,240
Did Mr. Hankinson say anything?
349
00:20:52,000 --> 00:20:53,357
Yeah. He said,
350
00:20:53,657 --> 00:20:55,484
“You should do a synagogue.”
And I said
351
00:20:55,570 --> 00:20:58,263
- there’d be kids there--
- My lord, again, I didn’t hear any of that.
352
00:20:58,330 --> 00:21:00,266
And I’m afraid
it’s not just volume.
353
00:21:00,346 --> 00:21:03,272
He has quite a strong accent.
I’m finding it difficult to understand.
354
00:21:03,366 --> 00:21:04,536
Mr. Mullen,
355
00:21:04,623 --> 00:21:07,560
once again, I must ask you to speak up.
356
00:21:07,600 --> 00:21:10,560
If you mumble,
nobody can understand you.
357
00:21:16,740 --> 00:21:19,240
So, you said there might be
children in a synagogue,
358
00:21:19,326 --> 00:21:21,400
and what did Mr. Renshaw say to that?
359
00:21:25,219 --> 00:21:26,920
He said,
“All Jews are the same.
360
00:21:27,882 --> 00:21:30,617
“You don’t class a rat by its age.”
361
00:21:30,997 --> 00:21:32,040
He said,
362
00:21:32,361 --> 00:21:34,377
“Vermin is vermin.”
363
00:21:42,273 --> 00:21:46,666
Mr. Mullen, you made a statement to the police
describing yourself in 2015,
364
00:21:46,766 --> 00:21:48,600
at the point you joined
National Action,
365
00:21:48,640 --> 00:21:52,720
as a “bored young man
looking for some identity or path to take.”
366
00:21:52,760 --> 00:21:54,240
Is that right?
367
00:21:54,627 --> 00:21:55,720
If you say so.
368
00:21:55,760 --> 00:21:57,920
It’s not me saying so.
It’s what you told the police.
369
00:22:00,480 --> 00:22:01,960
- OK.
- After leaving school,
370
00:22:02,000 --> 00:22:04,926
you were unemployed
and claiming sickness benefit for...
371
00:22:05,366 --> 00:22:06,480
about four years?
372
00:22:08,265 --> 00:22:10,800
Yeah. I had a... a stomach problem.
373
00:22:10,840 --> 00:22:12,120
Were you sick?
374
00:22:12,540 --> 00:22:13,962
For about a year...
375
00:22:14,277 --> 00:22:15,880
- on and off.
- For one year.
376
00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:18,320
So, you accept
that for three of those four years,
377
00:22:18,380 --> 00:22:20,800
you were fraudulently
claiming benefits, then?
378
00:22:21,506 --> 00:22:22,920
It weren’t that simple.
379
00:22:23,606 --> 00:22:25,000
Sometimes, I was sick,
380
00:22:25,434 --> 00:22:28,160
and then I got better.
It came and went.
381
00:22:28,849 --> 00:22:30,960
Wearing your National Action hat,
382
00:22:31,632 --> 00:22:34,017
what would your reaction have been,
say, to a young
383
00:22:34,051 --> 00:22:35,977
Somali teenager
384
00:22:36,042 --> 00:22:37,304
arriving in this country,
385
00:22:37,381 --> 00:22:39,680
going “on the sick”,
with false stomach problems,
386
00:22:40,008 --> 00:22:43,080
and fraudulently claiming
three years of benefits?
387
00:22:46,319 --> 00:22:47,719
Dunno.
388
00:22:50,480 --> 00:22:53,960
What did you think of the murder
of the MP... Jo Cox?
389
00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:56,160
I thought the guy that did it
was a weirdo.
390
00:22:56,702 --> 00:22:59,442
You were asked in your police interview,
“Did you think she was a traitor?”
391
00:22:59,522 --> 00:23:00,680
What did you answer?
392
00:23:02,226 --> 00:23:03,320
I don’t remember.
393
00:23:03,663 --> 00:23:05,151
Well, I can tell you.
394
00:23:05,282 --> 00:23:06,480
You said, “Yes.”
395
00:23:06,520 --> 00:23:08,160
So, I obviously did.
396
00:23:08,392 --> 00:23:11,520
But does it say in that interview
what time I was talking about?
397
00:23:11,871 --> 00:23:14,640
- It doesn’t really matter, does it, Mr. Mullen?
- Well, it obviously does
398
00:23:15,232 --> 00:23:16,760
because I was
probably being asked
399
00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:20,080
what I thought about it
before she was killed, and not after.
400
00:23:20,120 --> 00:23:21,880
You regarded
somebody like Jo Cox,
401
00:23:21,920 --> 00:23:24,868
with her stance on immigration,
as a traitor, didn’t you?
402
00:23:25,001 --> 00:23:27,880
Yeah, but that doesn’t mean
I thought she deserved to be killed.
403
00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:31,760
Thank you, my lord. No further questions.
404
00:23:34,394 --> 00:23:35,400
Mr. Mullen,
405
00:23:35,654 --> 00:23:38,040
as you know,
I appear for Christopher Lythgoe.
406
00:23:38,626 --> 00:23:40,400
After your expulsion from school
407
00:23:40,440 --> 00:23:43,200
and a succession of dead-end jobs,
408
00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:46,480
you found being a member of National Action
exciting.
409
00:23:46,808 --> 00:23:48,720
It gave you purpose.
There were finally people
410
00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:51,040
in your life
that were listening to you.
411
00:23:52,853 --> 00:23:54,580
I suppose so.
412
00:23:54,673 --> 00:23:56,280
You told the police that
413
00:23:56,320 --> 00:23:59,573
the primary purpose
of National Action was to...
414
00:23:59,980 --> 00:24:01,600
“start a race war”
415
00:24:02,383 --> 00:24:04,080
and to “take our country back”.
416
00:24:05,500 --> 00:24:07,280
- Yeah.
- So, that must mean
417
00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:09,960
that, at that time,
you shared those same views?
418
00:24:10,367 --> 00:24:11,880
I never said that I didn’t.
419
00:24:11,920 --> 00:24:13,648
Please speak up, Mr. Mullen.
420
00:24:13,800 --> 00:24:16,720
I never said that I didn’t share
those views.
421
00:24:17,625 --> 00:24:18,840
Anti-Jew?
422
00:24:21,746 --> 00:24:23,440
At the time, yeah.
423
00:24:23,686 --> 00:24:24,920
Anti-Black?
424
00:24:25,713 --> 00:24:26,753
Yeah.
425
00:24:26,860 --> 00:24:29,346
Anti-Asian, anti any non-white?
426
00:24:29,846 --> 00:24:30,760
Yeah.
427
00:24:30,800 --> 00:24:32,136
Homophobic?
428
00:24:32,475 --> 00:24:35,076
- You know what “homophobic” means?
- Yeah.
429
00:24:36,160 --> 00:24:38,239
He’s the best witness
the defence have got.
430
00:24:38,332 --> 00:24:40,480
So, you were for a white Britain
431
00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:42,437
by any means necessary,
432
00:24:42,871 --> 00:24:44,797
including violence?
433
00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:47,649
Yeah.
434
00:24:47,773 --> 00:24:49,656
Again, we can’t hear you.
435
00:24:49,760 --> 00:24:51,240
Yeah.
436
00:24:58,353 --> 00:24:59,933
Are you still racist?
437
00:25:00,180 --> 00:25:02,132
Remember, you are under oath.
438
00:25:04,993 --> 00:25:06,393
Yeah.
439
00:25:06,926 --> 00:25:08,606
But less so.
440
00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:12,560
Now,
441
00:25:12,741 --> 00:25:15,701
you say you didn’t like the way
that things were working out with...
442
00:25:15,861 --> 00:25:18,440
National Action,
which is why you wanted to get out.
443
00:25:18,480 --> 00:25:20,760
And yet,
after the murder of Jo Cox,
444
00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:22,560
after the organisation was banned,
445
00:25:23,058 --> 00:25:26,800
you still continued to attend meetings.
Why is that?
446
00:25:28,079 --> 00:25:29,880
It wasn’t that easy to walk away.
447
00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:31,160
Why not?
448
00:25:33,586 --> 00:25:35,440
I’d spent a lot of time
with these people.
449
00:25:40,113 --> 00:25:41,800
They were my friends.
450
00:25:42,940 --> 00:25:45,093
Perhaps you were lonely?
451
00:25:47,126 --> 00:25:48,726
In a way, yeah.
452
00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:52,520
A lonely drifter
with a dead-end life,
453
00:25:52,827 --> 00:25:56,040
in search of friendship and approval.
454
00:25:58,513 --> 00:25:59,766
No further questions.
455
00:25:59,873 --> 00:26:02,666
Thank you, Mr. Aylett.
Let’s call it a day there
456
00:26:02,740 --> 00:26:05,193
and reconvene on Monday morning.
457
00:26:26,046 --> 00:26:28,320
And the doctor said
you’re getting stronger,
458
00:26:28,466 --> 00:26:30,553
and the nurses are well happy with you.
459
00:26:30,666 --> 00:26:33,413
Said I’ll be able to take you
for a little walk soon.
460
00:26:35,680 --> 00:26:39,000
No. No, not just yet.
No, you can’t have any Guinness yet.
461
00:26:41,926 --> 00:26:43,040
Hello, Matthew.
462
00:26:45,080 --> 00:26:46,520
All right, love?
463
00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:49,800
I’ve got T-shirts
and clean underwear.
464
00:26:53,246 --> 00:26:55,720
We hadn’t been down
from Liverpool long.
465
00:26:56,120 --> 00:26:58,400
Yours was the first friendly face
I remember.
466
00:27:00,639 --> 00:27:03,240
You know, our kid blamed me
for me dad leaving, not you.
467
00:27:04,367 --> 00:27:05,960
He said,
because I told my mum
468
00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:08,466
when I saw you and my dad
in bed together,
469
00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:10,500
then I was a grass...
470
00:27:11,594 --> 00:27:13,480
and it was my fault
that he left us.
471
00:27:16,060 --> 00:27:17,360
I’m sorry.
472
00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:21,193
I know now that my dad was to blame,
you know.
473
00:27:22,160 --> 00:27:23,785
He was the adult.
474
00:27:23,899 --> 00:27:25,600
You were so young.
475
00:27:29,813 --> 00:27:33,200
You know your mum and dad’s marriage
was over long before I came along.
476
00:27:35,635 --> 00:27:38,960
But I suppose I was responsible
for him moving out.
477
00:27:39,243 --> 00:27:41,240
Why are you still washing his pants?
478
00:27:45,579 --> 00:27:47,195
I don’t know.
479
00:27:49,615 --> 00:27:51,640
Did you ever meet anyone else?
480
00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:54,180
Yeah.
481
00:27:54,531 --> 00:27:56,371
I married briefly...
482
00:27:56,551 --> 00:27:58,040
to Ray.
483
00:28:01,980 --> 00:28:03,680
He wasn’t your dad.
484
00:28:05,960 --> 00:28:07,720
He was very charismatic.
485
00:28:08,179 --> 00:28:09,899
He still is.
486
00:28:11,647 --> 00:28:13,600
I was in love with him.
487
00:28:22,533 --> 00:28:24,973
Leona, I don’t know how to say this.
488
00:28:29,386 --> 00:28:31,600
I hated you when I was growing up.
489
00:28:33,376 --> 00:28:34,480
OK.
490
00:28:34,702 --> 00:28:36,720
And because you ran off with my dad
491
00:28:37,392 --> 00:28:39,352
and split our house up...
492
00:28:41,426 --> 00:28:42,960
and because you were Black,
493
00:28:44,229 --> 00:28:47,190
I used you as an excuse
to hate all Black people.
494
00:28:48,160 --> 00:28:50,600
Well, to me,
yous were all to blame.
495
00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:52,197
You know,
my head was so warped.
496
00:28:52,297 --> 00:28:55,450
I was filled with so much anger
and so much hate, I...
497
00:28:56,996 --> 00:28:59,120
I joined the National Front.
498
00:29:02,118 --> 00:29:05,242
- Are you stupid?
- No, no, I’m not. No, Leona, honestly,
499
00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:08,600
I don’t think like that any more.
Look, I’m sorry, but...
500
00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:10,573
It’s not me.
501
00:29:10,667 --> 00:29:14,480
Do you know what I mean? I’ve spent
so long trying to put right what I did.
502
00:29:20,033 --> 00:29:21,560
So, what do you want
from me now?
503
00:29:26,000 --> 00:29:27,906
Why are you telling me this?
504
00:29:30,153 --> 00:29:31,600
You want forgiveness?
505
00:29:32,993 --> 00:29:34,440
I think so.
506
00:29:35,186 --> 00:29:36,546
OK.
507
00:29:37,813 --> 00:29:39,574
I forgive you.
508
00:29:41,849 --> 00:29:44,480
But what about everybody else?
509
00:30:13,166 --> 00:30:15,600
- Brenda?
- I checked in on Robbie at the flat.
510
00:30:15,640 --> 00:30:17,793
- He’s not there.
- Shit!
511
00:30:17,906 --> 00:30:20,274
Neighbour saw him Friday.
He’s legged it to Widnes.
512
00:30:20,393 --> 00:30:22,800
Yeah.
Yeah, that’s definitely where he’s gone.
513
00:30:34,220 --> 00:30:35,860
- Is it that one?
- Yeah.
514
00:30:43,239 --> 00:30:44,240
Natalie?
515
00:30:44,280 --> 00:30:46,333
- I’m Matthew Collins.
- I know who you are.
516
00:30:46,419 --> 00:30:48,440
We’ve just come to ask Robbie
to come back to London
517
00:30:48,480 --> 00:30:50,560
- to continue giving his evidence.
- He’s not here.
518
00:30:50,600 --> 00:30:53,320
Don’t fuck about.
We’ve driven for over four hours to get here.
519
00:30:53,538 --> 00:30:55,680
- Sorry about that.
- What’s the point?
520
00:30:55,720 --> 00:30:57,634
None of them
believe a word I’m saying anyway.
521
00:30:57,701 --> 00:31:00,560
Come back, lad. Renshaw’s been
convicted now. All you got to do--
522
00:31:00,600 --> 00:31:02,806
Stand there while they
take the piss out of me,
523
00:31:02,908 --> 00:31:05,301
my pathetic life, the-the way I talk?
524
00:31:05,358 --> 00:31:07,385
- It’s not right, what they putting him through.
- What the fuck has me
525
00:31:07,451 --> 00:31:10,920
getting kicked out of school
or going on the sick got to do with anything?
526
00:31:10,960 --> 00:31:13,360
Robbie... come back.
527
00:31:14,089 --> 00:31:16,596
- I’m not coming back.
- Stop being so fucking selfish!
528
00:31:16,682 --> 00:31:18,560
- You’re behaving like a spoilt brat!
- OK, come on.
529
00:31:18,600 --> 00:31:21,040
No, look, there’s people doing
everything they can for you.
530
00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:23,253
I put my own family in danger
for you.
531
00:31:23,326 --> 00:31:26,000
Now be a man and come back
and finish what you started!
532
00:31:26,040 --> 00:31:27,760
- Just fuck off!
- No, you fuck off!
533
00:31:28,147 --> 00:31:31,240
- Matt, this isn’t helping!
- Look, he’s got to finish this, Natalie.
534
00:31:31,280 --> 00:31:33,203
He doesn’t have to do anything.
Now, please,
535
00:31:33,277 --> 00:31:35,920
my brother’s made his decision.
Please respect that.
536
00:31:41,480 --> 00:31:44,020
Fucking waste of time that was, wasn’t it?
537
00:32:00,733 --> 00:32:02,973
I don’t care what they say, Robbie.
538
00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:06,740
You’re not the same
as them other boys on trial.
539
00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:14,200
I think you’re a good person.
540
00:32:18,573 --> 00:32:20,093
Night-night.
541
00:32:24,800 --> 00:32:26,120
Court will rise.
542
00:32:37,640 --> 00:32:40,480
Welcome back, ladies and gentlemen.
We are ready to start.
543
00:32:49,560 --> 00:32:51,793
- Hello?
- The court’s in session.
544
00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:53,640
No one’s seen him.
545
00:32:53,680 --> 00:32:55,680
OK, keep us posted.
546
00:32:59,320 --> 00:33:00,720
He’s not turned up.
547
00:33:01,920 --> 00:33:04,400
- What did you say?
- He’s not here.
548
00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:17,966
Hey, mate.
549
00:33:18,320 --> 00:33:20,493
- All right.
- I knew you’d turn up.
550
00:33:20,653 --> 00:33:22,293
I see laughing boy’s back.
551
00:33:24,373 --> 00:33:26,373
Don’t worry about it.
552
00:33:34,053 --> 00:33:37,120
- Hello?
- I’m with him now. I told you not to worry.
553
00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:39,360
All right. Nice one, mate.
554
00:33:39,759 --> 00:33:41,346
Thanks, ta-ra.
555
00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:43,400
Right, we’re back on.
556
00:33:44,281 --> 00:33:46,170
- Do you wanna go across?
- Yeah. All right.
557
00:33:46,511 --> 00:33:48,317
- I’ll see you later.
- See you in a bit, love.
558
00:33:48,424 --> 00:33:51,040
And wasn’t it the case that night,
Mr. Mullen,
559
00:33:51,080 --> 00:33:53,520
that Mr. Lythgoe and Mr. Hankinson
were both very drunk?
560
00:33:54,129 --> 00:33:56,235
It didn’t seem like
they were to me.
561
00:33:56,369 --> 00:33:59,266
When Mr. Renshaw outlined his plans
that night,
562
00:33:59,372 --> 00:34:02,000
how sure were you
that he was being serious?
563
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:03,400
100%.
564
00:34:03,863 --> 00:34:06,917
- And Mr. Lythgoe’s reaction?
- He said something like,
565
00:34:07,143 --> 00:34:09,440
- “Don’t fuck it up.”
- Are you sure of that?
566
00:34:09,771 --> 00:34:12,182
Could he not actually have said,
by way of comment,
567
00:34:12,322 --> 00:34:13,640
“You’ll only fuck it up”?
568
00:34:13,680 --> 00:34:14,635
No.
569
00:34:14,702 --> 00:34:16,440
It was “Don’t fuck it up”.
570
00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:19,720
You see now,
I suggest that that wasn’t said, Mr. Mullen.
571
00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:21,280
Well, I suggest it was.
572
00:34:22,600 --> 00:34:24,922
After National Action had been banned...
573
00:34:24,982 --> 00:34:26,760
and things started
to quieten down,
574
00:34:27,082 --> 00:34:30,920
isn’t it the case that you started
to look elsewhere for excitement?
575
00:34:31,600 --> 00:34:32,840
No, that’s not the truth.
576
00:34:32,880 --> 00:34:35,560
You didn’t want to go back to being
that bored young man
577
00:34:35,600 --> 00:34:37,347
looking for an identity,
did you?
578
00:34:37,461 --> 00:34:40,520
Which is why you sexed up
what was actually said in the pub that night...
579
00:34:40,560 --> 00:34:43,040
- That’s ridiculous.
- ...so you had something exciting
580
00:34:43,080 --> 00:34:44,920
to offer your new friends
at Hope Not Hate.
581
00:34:44,960 --> 00:34:46,885
- No.
- Your friends who had sorted out
582
00:34:46,958 --> 00:34:49,760
a flat for you and the ones who took
you on holiday to Dublin.
583
00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:51,920
It wasn’t like that.
Not a holiday holiday.
584
00:34:51,960 --> 00:34:54,506
You had to give them something
nice and juicy, didn’t you?
585
00:34:54,586 --> 00:34:57,760
Because they were the ones that were
listening to you now, weren’t they?
586
00:34:57,800 --> 00:35:00,026
I don’t know
what you’re going on about.
587
00:35:00,179 --> 00:35:03,209
I’m not making anything up.
I heard what I heard.
588
00:35:03,316 --> 00:35:05,320
And you weren’t there,
were you, mate?
589
00:35:06,237 --> 00:35:08,120
No further questions, my lord.
590
00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:12,040
- Thank you, Mr. Mullen.
- Is that it?
591
00:35:13,707 --> 00:35:15,560
Yes, you may stand down.
592
00:35:23,040 --> 00:35:24,640
Jack Renshaw is a hero!
593
00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:27,760
He’s a nonce, mate,
and he got exactly what he deserved, yeah!
594
00:35:28,933 --> 00:35:31,480
My lord, I call Jack Renshaw.
595
00:35:31,520 --> 00:35:33,720
In the pub that night,
were you seeking permission
596
00:35:33,760 --> 00:35:35,640
from Chris Lythgoe
and National Action
597
00:35:35,680 --> 00:35:37,360
- to do what you had in your mind?
- No.
598
00:35:37,750 --> 00:35:39,210
Did he ever say to you,
599
00:35:39,290 --> 00:35:42,400
when you’d revealed your intentions,
“Don’t fuck it up”?
600
00:35:43,360 --> 00:35:46,440
No. That sounds like the workings
of Mullen’s fantasy.
601
00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:49,320
Were you drunk when you arrived
at the pub that night?
602
00:35:49,940 --> 00:35:53,560
Yes. I was intoxicated
and I was in a poor mental state.
603
00:35:54,480 --> 00:35:56,362
We were all very drunk,
604
00:35:56,655 --> 00:35:58,547
but Chris is very similar to me,
605
00:35:58,634 --> 00:36:01,360
in the sense that we don’t normally
show that we’re drunk. You know,
606
00:36:01,400 --> 00:36:04,015
we talk more, talk louder, but,
607
00:36:04,120 --> 00:36:07,400
well, physically,
we don’t particularly look drunk.
608
00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:10,080
Thank you, Mr. Renshaw.
Could you wait there, please?
609
00:36:14,819 --> 00:36:17,296
Mr. Renshaw,
is it your hatred of the Jews
610
00:36:17,402 --> 00:36:20,280
what led you
into extreme right-wing politics?
611
00:36:20,720 --> 00:36:23,416
- Because you hate them, don’t you?
- Yeah, I do.
612
00:36:23,810 --> 00:36:26,520
- Do you accept that there were gas chambers?
- No.
613
00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:30,797
Do you accept
the holocaust,
614
00:36:30,887 --> 00:36:34,585
that millions of Jews were killed
by the Nazis during World War II?
615
00:36:35,000 --> 00:36:37,440
- No, I do not.
- Where did they all go, then?
616
00:36:38,360 --> 00:36:41,400
Most of them were put
into concentration camps,
617
00:36:41,440 --> 00:36:43,720
but if you look at the statistics
618
00:36:43,820 --> 00:36:47,147
of Jews prior to the war
and Jews after the war,
619
00:36:47,567 --> 00:36:49,720
the Jewish population
actually increased.
620
00:36:56,440 --> 00:36:57,828
So, what was your plan?
621
00:36:57,960 --> 00:37:00,480
What were you going to do with this machete?
622
00:37:02,218 --> 00:37:04,600
I hadn’t really... thought it through.
623
00:37:04,640 --> 00:37:06,948
Chop Rosie Cooper’s head off?
624
00:37:07,561 --> 00:37:09,000
Through the heart, or what?
625
00:37:10,200 --> 00:37:11,542
Probably the jugular.
626
00:37:11,649 --> 00:37:14,040
And what were you going to do
with this machete on the jugular?
627
00:37:14,933 --> 00:37:16,360
Hack at it.
628
00:37:17,760 --> 00:37:21,400
You said earlier you couldn’t remember anything
that had happened at the pub that evening?
629
00:37:21,440 --> 00:37:24,080
- Just snippets.
- Just snippets.
630
00:37:24,720 --> 00:37:26,360
But do we understand
those snippets to include
631
00:37:26,400 --> 00:37:29,523
that you can remember Mr. Hankinson
did not mention the synagogue
632
00:37:29,657 --> 00:37:32,090
- as somewhere you might attack instead?
- That’s right.
633
00:37:32,197 --> 00:37:34,740
And you can clearly remember
that Mr. Lythgoe did not say,
634
00:37:34,833 --> 00:37:36,960
“Make sure you don’t fuck it up”?
635
00:37:37,046 --> 00:37:39,533
Yeah, because that’s just...
not something he would say.
636
00:37:39,592 --> 00:37:40,955
Those snippets,
637
00:37:41,069 --> 00:37:44,013
by chance, you remember –
the ones that help your friends.
638
00:37:44,103 --> 00:37:47,453
Curious that the rest of the conversation
you were too drunk to remember.
639
00:37:47,578 --> 00:37:51,667
Is it that you’re trying
to protect your friends, Mr. Renshaw?
640
00:37:51,814 --> 00:37:55,680
Is that why you’re standing there now,
lying to the jury?
641
00:38:00,460 --> 00:38:02,140
I haven’t lied.
642
00:38:35,052 --> 00:38:36,431
Are you all right, Bren?
643
00:38:36,520 --> 00:38:39,237
You just make sure you do
the fucking business in there, yeah?
644
00:38:42,703 --> 00:38:45,098
That’s the twat
who’s giving Robbie grief.
645
00:38:45,187 --> 00:38:46,685
- Is he?
- Yeah.
646
00:38:46,907 --> 00:38:49,494
He’s been staring him out,
trying to intimidate him.
647
00:38:51,893 --> 00:38:54,948
Hey, gobshite, why don’t me and you
go for a little walk after this, eh?
648
00:38:55,035 --> 00:38:57,840
- Any time.
- Yeah, any time. Ready when you are.
649
00:39:01,040 --> 00:39:04,857
Mr. Collins, at one point you, yourself,
were a mole, weren’t you?
650
00:39:05,280 --> 00:39:06,545
That’s right, yeah.
651
00:39:06,677 --> 00:39:09,720
I was a member of the National Front
and then the BNP.
652
00:39:09,800 --> 00:39:13,763
I was passing information to...
an anti-fascist magazine.
653
00:39:13,863 --> 00:39:16,640
How did you first come into contact
with Robbie Mullen?
654
00:39:17,120 --> 00:39:19,717
He wrote to me... under a false name.
655
00:39:19,883 --> 00:39:22,880
You know, it was pretty clear that
he felt trapped at National Action.
656
00:39:22,920 --> 00:39:24,920
It was like he was in a cult
and he wanted out.
657
00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:27,800
Did he ever ask for any money
for the information he gave you?
658
00:39:28,280 --> 00:39:29,360
No, none.
659
00:39:30,546 --> 00:39:31,706
Thank you.
660
00:39:32,320 --> 00:39:35,800
You took Mr. Mullen on holiday,
didn’t you, to Dublin?
661
00:39:35,840 --> 00:39:38,360
I wouldn’t exactly call it a holiday.
662
00:39:38,525 --> 00:39:41,545
He needed a breather.
To be honest with you, we both did.
663
00:39:41,688 --> 00:39:45,200
Well, the situation was very...
tense at the time.
664
00:39:45,696 --> 00:39:49,640
Was that as a reward for coming up
with some juicy titbits for your website
665
00:39:49,680 --> 00:39:51,239
and Hope Not Hate magazine?
666
00:39:51,312 --> 00:39:53,932
No. We felt like we had
a duty of care towards him,
667
00:39:54,032 --> 00:39:56,600
you know, both for his
physical and mental wellbeing.
668
00:39:56,640 --> 00:39:59,159
Well, because, as you said,
you’d been there yourself.
669
00:39:59,259 --> 00:40:02,069
All those years ago,
that anti-fascist magazine had paid
670
00:40:02,169 --> 00:40:05,504
for an air ticket for you
to Australia, hadn’t it?
671
00:40:05,633 --> 00:40:07,437
That’s right, they did, yeah.
672
00:40:08,308 --> 00:40:10,760
Yeah, but there’s a big difference
between me and Robbie Mullen.
673
00:40:11,155 --> 00:40:12,186
You see,
674
00:40:12,272 --> 00:40:15,200
I ran off to Australia
rather than be called up to face any trial
675
00:40:15,265 --> 00:40:18,560
because I didn’t want to be accused
publicly as an informant.
676
00:40:19,734 --> 00:40:22,401
You know, I didn’t wanna be called
a grass.
677
00:40:22,640 --> 00:40:26,240
You see, me and Robbie come from a similar
background and we both know what that means.
678
00:40:26,680 --> 00:40:30,080
But he’s got the courage to come back
and face the people he’s accusing.
679
00:40:30,560 --> 00:40:32,036
Very commendable, I’m sure.
680
00:40:32,156 --> 00:40:34,000
- No, what I’m saying is--
- Thank you, my lord.
681
00:40:34,040 --> 00:40:35,742
What I’m saying...
682
00:40:36,195 --> 00:40:39,120
is Robbie Mullen’s a better man than me.
683
00:40:48,760 --> 00:40:50,440
Court will rise.
684
00:40:52,833 --> 00:40:56,813
Foreman of the jury, have you reached
verdicts upon which you are all agreed?
685
00:40:56,919 --> 00:40:58,440
Yes.
686
00:40:59,840 --> 00:41:01,880
Will the defendants please rise?
687
00:41:06,928 --> 00:41:08,400
On count three,
688
00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:10,560
encouragement to commit murder,
689
00:41:11,109 --> 00:41:13,760
do you find the defendant,
Christopher Lythgoe,
690
00:41:13,800 --> 00:41:16,080
guilty or not guilty?
691
00:41:19,700 --> 00:41:21,213
Not guilty.
692
00:41:22,013 --> 00:41:26,120
On count four,
membership of a proscribed organisation,
693
00:41:26,453 --> 00:41:29,560
contrary to Section 11
of the Terrorism Act,
694
00:41:29,794 --> 00:41:32,497
do you find the defendant, Jack Renshaw,
695
00:41:32,617 --> 00:41:34,560
guilty or not guilty?
696
00:41:36,713 --> 00:41:38,447
Not guilty.
697
00:41:39,606 --> 00:41:41,143
On the same count,
698
00:41:41,263 --> 00:41:43,960
membership of a proscribed organisation,
699
00:41:44,000 --> 00:41:46,880
do you find the defendant,
Matthew Hankinson,
700
00:41:47,324 --> 00:41:49,577
guilty or not guilty?
701
00:41:50,678 --> 00:41:51,680
Guilty.
702
00:41:53,293 --> 00:41:54,759
On the same count,
703
00:41:54,859 --> 00:41:57,320
membership of a proscribed organisation,
704
00:41:57,360 --> 00:42:00,480
do you find the defendant,
Christopher Lythgoe,
705
00:42:00,626 --> 00:42:02,600
guilty or not guilty?
706
00:42:06,000 --> 00:42:07,480
Guilty.
707
00:42:13,293 --> 00:42:17,600
The idea that this country should be
purged of its ethnic minorities,
708
00:42:17,653 --> 00:42:19,280
its Jews and homosexuals,
709
00:42:20,000 --> 00:42:23,680
and an ideological revolution
imposed on the population by force,
710
00:42:23,745 --> 00:42:25,715
is both insidious..
711
00:42:25,875 --> 00:42:26,880
and evil.
712
00:42:27,208 --> 00:42:30,973
Only a moment’s thought is required
to come to the conclusion that
713
00:42:31,060 --> 00:42:33,040
violence and repression
714
00:42:33,080 --> 00:42:35,520
on an unprecedented scale
would be needed
715
00:42:35,560 --> 00:42:37,240
to achieve
such a reign of terror,
716
00:42:37,880 --> 00:42:41,879
because so many right-minded people
would rise up
717
00:42:42,012 --> 00:42:45,232
and oppose these monstrous plans.
718
00:42:59,860 --> 00:43:01,040
All right?
719
00:43:01,713 --> 00:43:03,180
- Come in.
- You OK?
720
00:43:04,477 --> 00:43:06,360
Thanks for looking after him
during the trial.
721
00:43:06,444 --> 00:43:08,125
Well, he did that himself.
722
00:43:08,312 --> 00:43:10,280
Nobody can persuade him
to do anything he don’t want to.
723
00:43:11,609 --> 00:43:12,640
All right.
724
00:43:13,320 --> 00:43:14,760
Ah, ta.
725
00:43:22,653 --> 00:43:24,160
So, go on, then.
726
00:43:24,493 --> 00:43:26,280
What did they get?
727
00:43:27,840 --> 00:43:29,430
Renshaw got life...
728
00:43:29,850 --> 00:43:32,358
with a minimum term of 20 years.
729
00:43:33,353 --> 00:43:36,160
Lythgoe got eight
and Hankinson got six.
730
00:43:39,240 --> 00:43:40,960
Rosie Cooper, the MP,
731
00:43:41,000 --> 00:43:43,120
she thanked you at the trial.
732
00:43:43,499 --> 00:43:46,978
She gave a statement,
saying how grateful she was for what you did.
733
00:43:47,600 --> 00:43:49,875
She’s supposed to be meeting us
at the...
734
00:43:49,961 --> 00:43:52,535
House of Commons today.
That’s why I came down here, but...
735
00:43:52,648 --> 00:43:54,573
I was going to
go along with you, wasn’t I?
736
00:43:54,655 --> 00:43:56,124
Then why aren’t yous going?
737
00:43:56,221 --> 00:43:58,160
Well, the police cancelled it
this morning,
738
00:43:58,960 --> 00:44:01,047
and they told her
she can’t meet with Robbie.
739
00:44:01,174 --> 00:44:03,360
Why can’t they just leave it be, eh?
740
00:44:03,400 --> 00:44:06,000
My mum’s got Ellie,
and I wanted to do some shopping afterwards.
741
00:44:06,040 --> 00:44:07,600
I was looking forward to it.
742
00:44:08,066 --> 00:44:10,600
That’s what happens to people like us, innit?
743
00:44:12,273 --> 00:44:13,960
Right, get your coat.
744
00:44:14,217 --> 00:44:15,880
- What?
- We’re going shopping, come on!
745
00:44:15,992 --> 00:44:18,360
We’ll get the tube into town.
Are you coming, Robbie?
746
00:44:18,400 --> 00:44:19,800
Absolutely not!
747
00:44:20,833 --> 00:44:22,406
Are you sure?
748
00:44:22,560 --> 00:44:23,880
Right.
749
00:44:25,320 --> 00:44:27,535
- I’ll see you later.
- Have fun. See you later.
750
00:44:27,655 --> 00:44:29,040
- See you later, love.
- Cheers.
751
00:44:29,279 --> 00:44:31,379
Don’t spend too much money!
752
00:44:32,903 --> 00:44:34,920
- You don’t fancy that, lad, no?
- No!
753
00:44:36,124 --> 00:44:38,520
I can’t think
of anything worse, myself.
754
00:44:41,220 --> 00:44:44,062
I don’t think they believed a word
I said, did they...
755
00:44:44,559 --> 00:44:45,560
the jury?
756
00:44:45,925 --> 00:44:47,259
I told you they wouldn’t.
757
00:44:47,360 --> 00:44:49,800
Well, we got the guilty convictions
we needed, didn’t we?
758
00:44:50,710 --> 00:44:52,400
Got a couple of
non-guilties too, though.
759
00:44:53,215 --> 00:44:55,520
Well, either way,
they’re all in prison, aren’t they?
760
00:44:57,699 --> 00:45:00,692
Look, you stopped two women
from getting murdered.
761
00:45:01,086 --> 00:45:02,320
Never forget that.
762
00:45:05,786 --> 00:45:06,852
You know,
763
00:45:06,963 --> 00:45:09,392
the best bit of the trial for me, Rob, was...
764
00:45:09,725 --> 00:45:11,720
when they asked you
was you still a racist...
765
00:45:13,792 --> 00:45:15,640
and you said, “Less so.”
766
00:45:17,575 --> 00:45:19,502
You know, it’s not just all
about people like me
767
00:45:19,575 --> 00:45:21,597
being struck by bolts of lightning and...
768
00:45:21,731 --> 00:45:24,031
suddenly seeing the world
differently.
769
00:45:25,319 --> 00:45:27,182
It’s about people like you...
770
00:45:28,633 --> 00:45:30,440
changing just a little bit.
771
00:45:35,166 --> 00:45:38,379
You know, in the words
of the late, great Robert Nesta,
772
00:45:38,606 --> 00:45:40,288
“We all have a voice
773
00:45:40,739 --> 00:45:42,520
“inside us
that talks to us,
774
00:45:43,052 --> 00:45:45,560
“and that’s the voice
we must listen to.
775
00:45:46,320 --> 00:45:48,184
“Because in everything you do,
776
00:45:48,297 --> 00:45:50,760
“there’s a right way
and a wrong way.
777
00:45:50,800 --> 00:45:52,840
“And if you listen good,
778
00:45:53,640 --> 00:45:55,320
“you’ll know the right way.”
779
00:45:57,619 --> 00:45:59,299
“Less so.”
780
00:46:00,618 --> 00:46:02,225
I’ll have that, lad.
781
00:46:02,524 --> 00:46:03,920
That’s progress.
782
00:46:09,166 --> 00:46:11,360
Jo Cox.
Thank you, Mr. Speaker.
783
00:46:11,466 --> 00:46:14,446
It’s a great privilege to be called
to make my maiden speech
784
00:46:14,560 --> 00:46:17,083
in this most important of debates,
and I...
785
00:46:17,183 --> 00:46:20,656
congratulate many others who’ve made
outstanding maiden speeches today as well.
786
00:46:28,006 --> 00:46:31,100
Batley and Spen
is a gathering of typically independent,
787
00:46:31,200 --> 00:46:34,800
no-nonsense, proud
Yorkshire towns and villages.
788
00:46:34,959 --> 00:46:38,285
Our communities have been
deeply enhanced by immigration,
789
00:46:38,358 --> 00:46:40,720
be it Irish Catholics
across the constituency,
790
00:46:40,784 --> 00:46:45,520
or Muslims from Indian Gujarat or Pakistan,
principally from Kashmir.
791
00:46:52,826 --> 00:46:55,526
And whilst we celebrate
our diversity,
792
00:46:55,626 --> 00:46:59,465
the thing that surprises me, time and time
again, as I travel around the constituency,
793
00:46:59,559 --> 00:47:04,280
is that we are far more united and have
far more in common than that which divides us.62335
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