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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:02,043 --> 00:00:05,003 This programme contains very strong language from the outset. 2 00:00:05,043 --> 00:00:07,723 ENGINE STARTS INDISTINCT CHATTER 3 00:00:07,763 --> 00:00:11,043 The purpose of this re-enactment today 4 00:00:11,083 --> 00:00:14,483 is an attempt to reconstruct the events of an incident 5 00:00:14,523 --> 00:00:17,243 which occurred in this location 6 00:00:17,283 --> 00:00:21,523 on the evening of Saturday 14th July 2001. 7 00:00:21,563 --> 00:00:24,323 Joanne, for the purpose of this video, 8 00:00:24,363 --> 00:00:27,443 can you tell me how you came to be at this location? 9 00:02:00,163 --> 00:02:03,323 "Police in Australia say they fear the worst 10 00:02:03,363 --> 00:02:07,923 "for a British tourist who disappeared after being attacked in a remote part of the Outback." 11 00:02:07,963 --> 00:02:10,723 "Peter Falconio was shot by a gunman 12 00:02:10,763 --> 00:02:13,683 "who attempted to abduct his girlfriend, Joanne Lees." 13 00:02:13,723 --> 00:02:17,203 "The search for Peter Falconio goes on." 14 00:02:17,243 --> 00:02:22,843 "A jury unanimously found Bradley John Murdoch guilty of murdering Peter Falconio." 15 00:02:22,883 --> 00:02:28,043 Bradley Murdoch will spend at least 28 years in prison. That's who did it. 16 00:02:28,083 --> 00:02:32,523 "I definitely did not do it. I'm not a fucking murderer." 17 00:02:34,963 --> 00:02:37,323 This was a real Agatha Christie thriller. 18 00:02:38,683 --> 00:02:41,043 No-one really knew quite what had happened. 19 00:02:41,083 --> 00:02:44,763 He says, "Shut up and I won't shoot you." 20 00:02:44,803 --> 00:02:48,683 Why didn't she see the body? How do you even know he's dead? 21 00:02:48,723 --> 00:02:51,643 No-one doubts me. It's only media. 22 00:02:51,683 --> 00:02:54,643 We will find the key to this. 23 00:02:54,683 --> 00:02:58,883 The answer to this case lies in the police file. 24 00:02:58,923 --> 00:03:02,003 People that think they know the story probably don't. 25 00:03:02,043 --> 00:03:06,403 Bang, I'm looking straight at this bloke I just seen in the paper. 26 00:03:10,283 --> 00:03:13,243 That's him, all right. Bad news, that bloke. 27 00:03:13,283 --> 00:03:15,963 I couldn't believe this had never seen the light of day. 28 00:03:16,003 --> 00:03:19,763 This case never goes away, it just sleeps for periods of time. 29 00:03:19,803 --> 00:03:22,563 Things like this just don't happen. 30 00:03:22,603 --> 00:03:26,923 Somebody knows what happened that night. Really knows. 31 00:03:28,563 --> 00:03:32,963 There is so much more to this story than people ever imagined. 32 00:03:45,443 --> 00:03:49,763 As matters stand, Brad Murdoch is going to spend the rest of his life 33 00:03:49,803 --> 00:03:54,883 in jail with no prospect of parole for the murder of Peter Falconio. 34 00:03:56,243 --> 00:04:00,523 Joanne Lees claims that Brad Murdoch shot Falconio, 35 00:04:00,563 --> 00:04:03,363 appeared at the side of the Kombi van, 36 00:04:03,403 --> 00:04:07,443 bound and tried to gag her, 37 00:04:07,483 --> 00:04:10,403 she escaped... 38 00:04:11,443 --> 00:04:13,763 ..he couldn't find her, 39 00:04:13,803 --> 00:04:16,403 he left the scene 40 00:04:16,443 --> 00:04:18,723 and then she was, some hours later, 41 00:04:18,763 --> 00:04:22,443 rescued by Vince Miller, the truck driver. 42 00:04:25,083 --> 00:04:27,323 This is a one-witness case. 43 00:04:27,363 --> 00:04:31,883 It revolves around Joanne Lees' version of events. 44 00:04:34,363 --> 00:04:37,923 When there's only one witness to any event, 45 00:04:37,963 --> 00:04:41,723 the credibility of that witness is everything, it's paramount. 46 00:04:42,883 --> 00:04:46,923 Because if you can unpick at that witness, the Crown case falls apart. 47 00:04:53,403 --> 00:04:58,243 Part of the reason the case is still being discussed 18 years on 48 00:04:58,283 --> 00:05:03,323 is because not everybody believes what happened. 49 00:05:03,363 --> 00:05:05,723 Nobody could find Peter. 50 00:05:05,763 --> 00:05:09,643 The whole story was almost unbelievable. 51 00:05:11,123 --> 00:05:13,723 In 2001, in the Northern Territory, 52 00:05:13,763 --> 00:05:17,483 I was the police media manager. 53 00:05:17,523 --> 00:05:22,443 Northern Territory was known as the crime capital of Australia. 54 00:05:23,563 --> 00:05:26,123 Stabbings were quite common. 55 00:05:26,163 --> 00:05:28,403 Bodies were found. 56 00:05:28,443 --> 00:05:30,843 And we had accidents, 57 00:05:30,883 --> 00:05:33,763 tourists being eaten by a crocodile, 58 00:05:33,803 --> 00:05:37,203 two Germans kidnapped and tied up to a tree, 59 00:05:37,243 --> 00:05:42,523 all of those things were part of my time at the Northern Territory Police. 60 00:05:42,563 --> 00:05:45,603 But certainly the Falconio case was the biggest. 61 00:05:47,683 --> 00:05:50,683 When I first heard about the Falconio attack, 62 00:05:50,723 --> 00:05:54,483 it was about five o'clock in the morning. 63 00:05:54,523 --> 00:05:57,683 There were lots of media starting to call already. 64 00:05:57,723 --> 00:06:03,083 Some of our colleagues say to us, "Just wait until the British press arrive. 65 00:06:03,123 --> 00:06:06,963 "Then you'll be totally overwhelmed." 66 00:06:13,163 --> 00:06:17,203 For 23 years, I was an Australian foreign correspondent 67 00:06:17,243 --> 00:06:19,763 for the UK tabloids. 68 00:06:22,283 --> 00:06:26,563 I was just putting the key in the door of my apartment 69 00:06:26,603 --> 00:06:30,563 when I got a call from the Mail On Sunday, "Go to Alice Springs." 70 00:06:33,203 --> 00:06:36,923 When I got to Alice Springs, we were getting very little information 71 00:06:36,963 --> 00:06:40,483 about what was a fantastic world story 72 00:06:40,523 --> 00:06:43,483 and still no body, no Peter Falconio. 73 00:06:44,483 --> 00:06:48,723 One of the things that wasn't understood in London by the editors 74 00:06:48,763 --> 00:06:51,043 was that the search area alone 75 00:06:51,083 --> 00:06:53,763 was six times the size of Britain. 76 00:06:55,043 --> 00:06:58,803 Having been sent by an English newspaper all that way 77 00:06:58,843 --> 00:07:02,883 to the middle of Australia, you were expected to get results. 78 00:07:02,923 --> 00:07:06,723 It was very frustrating for all of the press 79 00:07:06,763 --> 00:07:11,123 that we were not able to get an interview with Joanne Lees. 80 00:07:11,163 --> 00:07:14,603 Just like the police, we had nothing. 81 00:07:23,883 --> 00:07:26,643 My first encounter with Joanne Lees 82 00:07:26,683 --> 00:07:28,923 didn't exactly run smoothly. 83 00:07:28,963 --> 00:07:33,803 I was trying to get her to actually talk to the media. 84 00:07:33,843 --> 00:07:36,683 She was not interested at all. 85 00:07:37,683 --> 00:07:41,243 We were responding to media morning and night. 86 00:07:41,283 --> 00:07:44,083 Denise, can we... PHONE RINGS What? 87 00:07:44,123 --> 00:07:46,403 It was just non-stop. 88 00:07:46,443 --> 00:07:52,203 Denise, when you talk to Joanne, what reason does she give for not wanting to talk? 89 00:07:52,243 --> 00:07:56,043 I think, in all honesty, she's just daunted by the whole thing. 90 00:07:56,083 --> 00:08:00,003 Denise, she shouldn't be daunted by it. We're all very nice people. 91 00:08:00,043 --> 00:08:03,243 I don't think she trusted anybody 92 00:08:03,283 --> 00:08:08,483 because she was quite adamant about what she wanted to do without taking any advice. 93 00:08:08,523 --> 00:08:12,683 At this point, there is no photo shoot of Joanne, 94 00:08:12,723 --> 00:08:15,523 but she is going to supply a photograph 95 00:08:15,563 --> 00:08:19,523 of her and Peter in the van. 96 00:08:20,603 --> 00:08:23,963 At three o'clock, we are praying for. 97 00:08:24,003 --> 00:08:25,563 HE LAUGHS 98 00:08:26,763 --> 00:08:30,603 I remember she threw a photo at me and said, 99 00:08:30,643 --> 00:08:33,203 "Just give them that. That'll be enough." 100 00:08:34,443 --> 00:08:37,843 She had a strong interest in finding Peter Falconio, 101 00:08:37,883 --> 00:08:42,483 but she didn't seem to wanna help do that herself. 102 00:08:42,523 --> 00:08:47,443 Although the Falconio family, they did everything possible 103 00:08:47,483 --> 00:08:50,003 to help us find Peter. 104 00:08:50,043 --> 00:08:52,123 Joanne's asked me to read a statement out. 105 00:08:52,163 --> 00:08:55,363 "I'd like to ask people to concentrate their efforts 106 00:08:55,403 --> 00:08:58,603 "more on finding Pete than trying to speak to me. 107 00:08:59,563 --> 00:09:03,163 "I also want to say I'm not prepared to sell my story to the media." 108 00:09:05,163 --> 00:09:08,363 I hope you'll find my son. That's all I've got to say. 109 00:09:08,403 --> 00:09:10,843 Because I want to go back with him. 110 00:09:10,883 --> 00:09:13,603 I think it was really hard for them. 111 00:09:13,643 --> 00:09:17,963 Initially, of course, we were looking for a missing person, 112 00:09:18,003 --> 00:09:21,003 so there was hope that we would find Peter. 113 00:09:21,043 --> 00:09:25,483 But as that went on, I think the chance of finding him alive 114 00:09:25,523 --> 00:09:27,763 was harder. 115 00:09:28,803 --> 00:09:34,003 I felt particularly sorry for Luciano Falconio, 116 00:09:34,043 --> 00:09:37,163 the grieving father, who was bereft, 117 00:09:37,203 --> 00:09:39,563 and it was heartbreaking. 118 00:09:39,603 --> 00:09:42,123 I'll just let you wipe your eyes. 119 00:09:43,523 --> 00:09:45,763 I know this is hard. Thank you for this. 120 00:09:45,803 --> 00:09:47,963 You want to make an appeal to the Australian people, 121 00:09:48,003 --> 00:09:50,723 and if I can express, on behalf of them, 122 00:09:50,763 --> 00:09:53,123 we all want them to find your son. 123 00:09:53,163 --> 00:09:57,203 Somebody knows something. But if there is those people, 124 00:09:57,243 --> 00:10:00,003 I think they should come forward. 125 00:10:02,443 --> 00:10:05,003 The English press and the Australian press 126 00:10:05,043 --> 00:10:07,443 were under enormous pressure 127 00:10:07,483 --> 00:10:11,203 to get an interview at all costs with Joanne Lees. 128 00:10:11,243 --> 00:10:13,563 We searched high and low. 129 00:10:13,603 --> 00:10:16,283 We could not get Joanne Lees. 130 00:10:16,323 --> 00:10:21,123 And it didn't do Joanne any favours in her treatment by the press as a result. 131 00:10:23,963 --> 00:10:27,563 Journalists were frustrated about every occasion 132 00:10:27,603 --> 00:10:31,883 where Joanne Lees did something and they were not invited. 133 00:10:31,923 --> 00:10:35,883 "Joanne Lees was to conduct a re-enactment of the crime. 134 00:10:35,923 --> 00:10:38,403 "They shipped in this lookalike white ute, 135 00:10:38,443 --> 00:10:41,163 "placed a lone armed police officer inside 136 00:10:41,203 --> 00:10:43,563 "and got it to trail this Kombi van 137 00:10:43,603 --> 00:10:46,323 "with 27-year-old Joanne as passenger 138 00:10:46,363 --> 00:10:49,363 "and another officer playing her boyfriend." 139 00:10:49,403 --> 00:10:52,603 Joanne said she would do it provided there was no press. 140 00:10:53,963 --> 00:10:56,403 And the photographers did go out there, 141 00:10:56,443 --> 00:11:00,283 but they were kept about a quarter of a mile from the scene. 142 00:11:00,323 --> 00:11:03,283 The media, when they couldn't get any pictures of her, 143 00:11:03,323 --> 00:11:05,963 just chased her every chance they could. 144 00:11:07,683 --> 00:11:11,563 Quite ruthlessly. It was dangerous. 145 00:11:11,603 --> 00:11:14,883 She realised if she didn't do some press, 146 00:11:14,923 --> 00:11:18,523 they were just going to hunt her down, basically. 147 00:11:20,363 --> 00:11:23,923 We finally got the first press conference 148 00:11:23,963 --> 00:11:26,843 where we could talk to Joanne Lees, we thought. 149 00:11:33,523 --> 00:11:37,363 She's quite keen for no journalists to be in there at all. 150 00:11:37,403 --> 00:11:39,883 She doesn't mind if somebody else is asking the questions. 151 00:11:39,923 --> 00:11:42,923 She can't have it all her own way. We're either all in or all out. 152 00:11:42,963 --> 00:11:45,563 They're just not gonna be able to write a story. 153 00:11:45,603 --> 00:11:49,843 She demanded that there would only be one reporter 154 00:11:49,883 --> 00:11:54,003 and two cameras and she selected the questions. 155 00:11:54,043 --> 00:11:56,803 CAMERAS CLICK 156 00:11:56,843 --> 00:11:59,643 When we finally did see Joanne, 157 00:11:59,683 --> 00:12:03,043 she looked like Cleopatra coming out of a movie set. 158 00:12:03,083 --> 00:12:05,923 Such an ice queen. 159 00:12:11,043 --> 00:12:16,643 So the media seem to believe there's a certain way that women should behave after a traumatic event. 160 00:12:16,683 --> 00:12:19,363 They should show emotion. 161 00:12:20,363 --> 00:12:22,763 And she didn't cry. 162 00:12:24,283 --> 00:12:29,043 I always thought afterwards, had she cried, I think things would've been different. 163 00:12:35,003 --> 00:12:38,043 SHE CLEARS HER THROAT OK. 164 00:12:39,123 --> 00:12:43,083 I am feeling positive and strong and believe it's only a matter of time now 165 00:12:43,123 --> 00:12:47,763 before the man responsible for what has happened to Pete and myself is caught. 166 00:12:47,803 --> 00:12:51,363 I am confident that everything is being done 167 00:12:51,403 --> 00:12:55,963 and I'm hoping one of these leads the police are following up will lead to Pete being found. 168 00:12:56,003 --> 00:12:58,403 I am confident that Pete will be found. 169 00:12:58,443 --> 00:13:04,243 I have asked the police to tell me only positive news and remain hopeful of Pete being found. 170 00:13:04,283 --> 00:13:07,563 CAMERAS CLICK 171 00:13:08,643 --> 00:13:13,443 I would like to thank the public, the police and Paul for all of their support 172 00:13:13,483 --> 00:13:18,243 and I hope that people will respect now my privacy... CAMERAS CLICK 173 00:13:18,283 --> 00:13:20,803 ..and allow me to get on with my life. 174 00:13:22,403 --> 00:13:27,043 Joanne, what is your reaction to the doubt expressed about your story? 175 00:13:27,083 --> 00:13:29,483 OK. Anyone that's spoken to me 176 00:13:29,523 --> 00:13:33,723 or has been in contact, in contact with me, no-one doubts me. 177 00:13:33,763 --> 00:13:38,803 It's only the media that have questioned...my story. 178 00:13:38,843 --> 00:13:42,483 Why have you been reluctant to meet the press up until this stage? 179 00:13:42,523 --> 00:13:46,243 Because I find it all so overwhelming and intimidating. 180 00:13:48,803 --> 00:13:53,043 Do you have a particular problem with the British press and why is that? 181 00:13:54,163 --> 00:13:59,603 Erm... I've got a problem with all press that distort the truth 182 00:13:59,643 --> 00:14:02,003 and doubt my story, 183 00:14:02,043 --> 00:14:04,283 misquote me 184 00:14:04,323 --> 00:14:10,003 and, erm, making up false accusations and stories. 185 00:14:12,523 --> 00:14:14,683 Well done. Thanks. 186 00:14:16,963 --> 00:14:21,003 All she really talked about was she didn't like any press 187 00:14:21,043 --> 00:14:24,123 and she didn't like anything that was written about her. 188 00:14:24,163 --> 00:14:26,003 We were all stunned by that. 189 00:14:27,963 --> 00:14:32,163 I think that first press conference did lead to suspicions 190 00:14:32,203 --> 00:14:35,123 about whether she was involved. 191 00:14:35,163 --> 00:14:38,083 I don't think people trusted her 192 00:14:38,123 --> 00:14:40,403 and I think even some that did trust her 193 00:14:40,443 --> 00:14:42,883 probably trusted her less at that stage. 194 00:14:53,563 --> 00:14:57,803 The second press conference, she wore a very tight-fitting T-shirt 195 00:14:57,843 --> 00:15:00,243 which had "cheeky monkey" across it. 196 00:15:02,363 --> 00:15:05,723 I told her that she should change. 197 00:15:06,963 --> 00:15:10,763 And she said, "No, this is what I wanna wear. 198 00:15:10,803 --> 00:15:13,003 "It's not about me, it's about Peter." 199 00:15:14,483 --> 00:15:19,763 I'm not sure exactly what the media thought, but they definitely thought it was totally inappropriate. 200 00:15:22,243 --> 00:15:25,483 Joanne's not... That was the instruction, she wasn't going to say anything. 201 00:15:25,523 --> 00:15:31,643 Paul was the spokesperson for the family and Joanne. 202 00:15:31,683 --> 00:15:35,523 Is there anything you'd say to Peter if he could hear you now? 203 00:15:35,563 --> 00:15:38,603 Just hang in there. If you can hear us, just wait, 204 00:15:38,643 --> 00:15:42,403 you know, we'll see you soon. Any other questions? 205 00:15:44,883 --> 00:15:47,323 Thank you very much. 206 00:15:47,363 --> 00:15:51,683 When Joanne looked uncomfortable, wouldn't talk to the press, 207 00:15:51,723 --> 00:15:54,683 it looked as though maybe she did have something to hide. 208 00:15:55,843 --> 00:16:00,283 I think she had clearly gone through a traumatic incident. 209 00:16:00,323 --> 00:16:05,563 People didn't believe it because they didn't see how such a bizarre story could occur. 210 00:16:05,603 --> 00:16:08,163 The Falconio case went on for such a long time, 211 00:16:08,203 --> 00:16:12,283 we were relieved to hear when they caught somebody. 212 00:16:13,683 --> 00:16:17,923 I always thought that Joanne Lees was telling the truth 213 00:16:17,963 --> 00:16:20,083 and Murdoch was guilty. 214 00:16:27,403 --> 00:16:30,123 When I first started looking at this case, 215 00:16:30,163 --> 00:16:33,923 it just didn't ring true with me. 216 00:16:33,963 --> 00:16:39,323 Once we started digging our way through the police file... 217 00:16:41,003 --> 00:16:46,563 ..Victor rang me and said, "Mate, I've got this document here, 218 00:16:46,603 --> 00:16:49,363 "wait till you read it, it'll pin your ears back." 219 00:16:49,403 --> 00:16:54,283 I read it and I couldn't believe its contents. 220 00:16:55,883 --> 00:17:00,523 This document is just extraordinary. 221 00:17:07,163 --> 00:17:09,403 REPORTER: The final chapter in the murder mystery 222 00:17:09,443 --> 00:17:10,763 that's gripped two nations. 223 00:17:10,803 --> 00:17:13,723 Peter Falconio disappeared in the Outback, 224 00:17:13,763 --> 00:17:16,323 shot dead by Bradley John Murdoch in an ambush. 225 00:17:16,363 --> 00:17:18,603 A Darwin judge jailed Murdoch, 226 00:17:18,643 --> 00:17:21,843 saying he's shown no remorse for his crime. 227 00:17:22,883 --> 00:17:25,923 Ten years ago, Brad Murdoch asked me 228 00:17:25,963 --> 00:17:27,683 to re-evaluate his case 229 00:17:27,723 --> 00:17:32,203 to see whether there was any hope of any sort of further appeal. 230 00:17:32,243 --> 00:17:36,483 I had been a criminal defence lawyer for 28 years, 231 00:17:36,523 --> 00:17:40,363 and part of all that experience is your ability to look at evidence, 232 00:17:40,403 --> 00:17:43,923 to speak to witnesses, and you draw it all together. 233 00:17:43,963 --> 00:17:49,403 We have obtained Murdoch's file from his defence team. 234 00:17:49,443 --> 00:17:54,563 We are digging through to see where the holes are in the Crown case. 235 00:17:55,723 --> 00:18:00,323 The reason why we must question Joanne Lees, must, 236 00:18:00,363 --> 00:18:04,283 is that I think what she says 237 00:18:04,323 --> 00:18:07,083 doesn't stack up with what was found at the crime scene. 238 00:18:08,323 --> 00:18:10,123 No body. 239 00:18:11,283 --> 00:18:13,483 No weapon. 240 00:18:13,523 --> 00:18:16,323 No evidence of a firearm being discharged. 241 00:18:17,643 --> 00:18:20,923 They found footprints belonging to Joanne Lees. 242 00:18:22,003 --> 00:18:26,323 Where's Peter Falconio's footprints? Where's Murdoch's footprints? 243 00:18:27,603 --> 00:18:29,643 What you'd normally expect to find 244 00:18:29,683 --> 00:18:33,843 at an incident crime scene like this, well, there wasn't much. 245 00:18:37,123 --> 00:18:41,083 For ten years, we've been working towards a petition of mercy. 246 00:18:41,123 --> 00:18:44,963 It's a document whereby you set out 247 00:18:45,003 --> 00:18:48,243 everything you see wrong with the case. 248 00:18:48,283 --> 00:18:51,483 In my view, the most significant thing we found 249 00:18:51,523 --> 00:18:58,163 is what's called a SCAN report - Scientific Content Analysis Notes. 250 00:18:58,203 --> 00:19:02,163 The SCAN report was based on an interview 251 00:19:02,203 --> 00:19:04,403 the police did with Joanne Lees 252 00:19:04,443 --> 00:19:07,243 on the night of 15th July, 253 00:19:07,283 --> 00:19:10,643 that is the night after the event. 254 00:19:10,683 --> 00:19:13,603 SCAN are experts. 255 00:19:13,643 --> 00:19:16,163 They look at language, the use of words, 256 00:19:16,203 --> 00:19:19,043 for evidence of deception, 257 00:19:19,083 --> 00:19:21,563 to see whether they could reach a conclusion 258 00:19:21,603 --> 00:19:24,923 as to whether Lees... was telling the truth. 259 00:20:09,203 --> 00:20:13,003 I'm reading the SCAN report itself. 260 00:20:13,043 --> 00:20:16,803 The very first thing on page two that strikes me, she said... 261 00:20:31,043 --> 00:20:33,403 The SCAN report says... 262 00:20:52,163 --> 00:20:56,323 The unanimous conclusion of the SCAN practitioners was... 263 00:21:10,483 --> 00:21:15,083 On any assessment, this report is damning. 264 00:21:16,203 --> 00:21:20,723 I've often wondered why the SCAN report was never mentioned at trial. 265 00:21:22,123 --> 00:21:24,683 I would have cross-examined Lees on its contents. 266 00:21:37,283 --> 00:21:40,083 I was a police officer for 21 years 267 00:21:40,123 --> 00:21:43,243 and I work now as a trainer for SCAN. 268 00:21:43,283 --> 00:21:45,803 SCAN is used by police forces 269 00:21:45,843 --> 00:21:48,883 primarily in North America, to a lesser extent in Australia. 270 00:21:48,923 --> 00:21:53,443 The military intelligence use it, crime analysts, 271 00:21:53,483 --> 00:21:55,403 human resources for better vetting, 272 00:21:55,443 --> 00:21:58,483 to determine whether somebody's deceptive or truthful. 273 00:21:58,523 --> 00:22:01,683 The Northern Territory did do a SCAN report 274 00:22:01,723 --> 00:22:04,843 on Joanne Lees' interview. 275 00:22:04,883 --> 00:22:09,363 They concluded that this was a deceptive story. 276 00:22:11,003 --> 00:22:13,563 I did not agree with that 277 00:22:13,603 --> 00:22:15,643 for one moment. 278 00:22:20,203 --> 00:22:23,123 G'day, Bill. I'm Victor. Victor, how are you? Very good to meet you. 279 00:22:23,163 --> 00:22:25,323 I'm Fraser. Fraser, how are you, mate? Good. 280 00:22:29,403 --> 00:22:32,563 OK. I got the report. 281 00:22:32,603 --> 00:22:38,723 From my analysis, I was satisfied that she was telling the truth. 282 00:22:38,763 --> 00:22:42,523 This SCAN report has sat there 283 00:22:42,563 --> 00:22:44,603 since 2001 284 00:22:44,643 --> 00:22:47,763 and has never, ever been questioned. 285 00:22:47,803 --> 00:22:51,003 Now you're saying you think it's wrong. Yeah. 286 00:22:51,043 --> 00:22:53,963 She was telling the truth. With a couple of issues. 287 00:22:54,003 --> 00:22:56,123 One issue I had was when she talked 288 00:22:56,163 --> 00:22:59,003 about being put into the back of the vehicle, 289 00:22:59,043 --> 00:23:01,963 she reverted to present tense. 290 00:23:02,003 --> 00:23:04,683 Now, if somebody relates a story in the present tense, 291 00:23:04,723 --> 00:23:08,123 it's a good indication that they're fabricating the evidence. 292 00:23:08,163 --> 00:23:11,603 And this is one of the big problems with Joanne Lees' statement. 293 00:23:11,643 --> 00:23:14,883 Most of her statement in the interview was in present tense, 294 00:23:14,923 --> 00:23:17,883 which raises a red flag to an analyst. 295 00:23:17,923 --> 00:23:21,763 But it's discovered since that women in particular 296 00:23:21,803 --> 00:23:24,443 who are in violent crimes, particularly rapes, 297 00:23:24,483 --> 00:23:26,483 the event becomes a living memory 298 00:23:26,523 --> 00:23:29,483 and they'll relate it in present tense. 299 00:23:29,523 --> 00:23:32,003 So I was prepared to accept the present tense 300 00:23:32,043 --> 00:23:34,803 on most of her statement. That was my big concern. 301 00:23:34,843 --> 00:23:39,243 Right from the outset, there is a very large question mark 302 00:23:39,283 --> 00:23:42,163 over the accuracy of what happened that night. 303 00:23:42,203 --> 00:23:44,483 That's a legitimate avenue of inquiry, 304 00:23:44,523 --> 00:23:46,243 but not for the SCAN analyst. 305 00:23:46,283 --> 00:23:50,043 I'm only interested, as a SCAN analyst, at looking at the language, 306 00:23:50,083 --> 00:23:51,603 looking at the words used. 307 00:23:51,643 --> 00:23:55,443 I want to make it quite clear that if I had got that report then, 308 00:23:55,483 --> 00:23:58,083 I may have come to the same conclusion 309 00:23:58,123 --> 00:24:00,243 because of the present tense. 310 00:24:00,283 --> 00:24:05,803 What bothers me is that this has been taken as gospel for 18 years 311 00:24:05,843 --> 00:24:09,283 and then Bill bounces along and debunks it. 312 00:24:09,323 --> 00:24:14,043 Yet very fairly, very fairly, you're prepared to say 313 00:24:14,083 --> 00:24:17,083 if you'd looked at this back in 2001, 314 00:24:17,123 --> 00:24:19,523 you may well have reached a similar conclusion 315 00:24:19,563 --> 00:24:21,843 or a similar conclusion on some of the points. 316 00:24:21,883 --> 00:24:25,323 Yeah. Yep. OK. We're happy with that. 317 00:24:26,643 --> 00:24:28,323 Good on you. 318 00:24:28,363 --> 00:24:31,523 In my view, I think we can use the SCAN report 319 00:24:31,563 --> 00:24:34,723 as part of Brad's petition of mercy. 320 00:24:34,763 --> 00:24:37,283 I would have introduced the SCAN report 321 00:24:37,323 --> 00:24:39,923 right upfront as part of Murdoch's defence. 322 00:24:39,963 --> 00:24:42,483 This wasn't put before the jury 323 00:24:42,523 --> 00:24:45,243 and I think it should have been. 324 00:24:45,283 --> 00:24:49,443 It raises the question - did this bloke get a fair trial? 325 00:24:57,163 --> 00:25:00,163 In most crimes, if there's a murder, 326 00:25:00,203 --> 00:25:03,723 police automatically suspect a close member of the family. 327 00:25:03,763 --> 00:25:07,483 Nine times out of ten, that proves correct, it is a husband or a wife 328 00:25:07,523 --> 00:25:11,883 or somebody close to that person who's guilty of the murder. 329 00:25:11,923 --> 00:25:16,323 And, of course, in the Joanne Lees case, they would've had similar suspicions to begin with. 330 00:25:19,843 --> 00:25:23,723 Only one month after the attack, 331 00:25:23,763 --> 00:25:27,643 police had already discovered the inconsistencies 332 00:25:27,683 --> 00:25:30,603 in Joanne Lees' statements. 333 00:25:30,643 --> 00:25:34,083 One of the lead investigators, Jeanette Kerr, put together 334 00:25:34,123 --> 00:25:38,123 a list of improbabilities and inconsistencies in Lees' statements. 335 00:25:39,123 --> 00:25:41,483 So she re-interviewed her. 336 00:28:37,363 --> 00:28:41,643 In Lees' second statement, Lees claims that while she was lying face-down, 337 00:28:41,683 --> 00:28:44,243 she was able to grab hold of her attacker by the nuts. 338 00:29:18,283 --> 00:29:21,123 Originally, Joanne Lees told the police 339 00:29:21,163 --> 00:29:25,803 that her attacker had pushed her between the two front seats, 340 00:29:25,843 --> 00:29:28,563 into the tray at the back. She said... 341 00:29:33,243 --> 00:29:36,123 However, by the time the trial came around, 342 00:29:36,163 --> 00:29:40,243 she wasn't sure how she had got from the front to the back. 343 00:31:21,403 --> 00:31:24,123 Given Lees' demeanour 344 00:31:24,163 --> 00:31:27,443 and her general inconsistencies of her story, 345 00:31:27,483 --> 00:31:32,403 I'm not surprised that Lees was treated as a possible suspect. 346 00:32:24,043 --> 00:32:27,363 My name is Steve van Aperen and I'm a behavioural analyst 347 00:32:27,403 --> 00:32:32,203 and I specialise in how to read people and detect deception. 348 00:32:32,243 --> 00:32:34,643 In 14 years of police work, 349 00:32:34,683 --> 00:32:38,363 I've conducted more than 500, 600 interviews. 350 00:32:38,403 --> 00:32:40,803 I trained with the LAPD, 351 00:32:40,843 --> 00:32:43,563 their polygraph unit and scientific investigation division, 352 00:32:43,603 --> 00:32:47,643 I trained with the FBI, US Secret Service, LA County Sheriffs. 353 00:32:49,123 --> 00:32:54,203 As humans, we all lie. Often what happens is people won't lie to you, 354 00:32:54,243 --> 00:32:56,763 they'll edit the information they supply you with. 355 00:32:56,803 --> 00:32:59,523 So they lie by omission rather than commission. 356 00:32:59,563 --> 00:33:03,483 Some of the telltale signs of lying would be avoidance, 357 00:33:03,523 --> 00:33:05,603 defensiveness, attack. 358 00:33:05,643 --> 00:33:08,603 They might be shifting in the chair, there might be hand to face, 359 00:33:08,643 --> 00:33:11,163 blocking, masking, concealment behaviours, 360 00:33:11,203 --> 00:33:16,043 prolonged eye closure, increased blink rate, changes in tone, pitch, voice modulation. 361 00:33:16,083 --> 00:33:19,843 And their language will reflect doubt and uncertainty 362 00:33:19,883 --> 00:33:23,843 when they're concocting a story that didn't happen. 363 00:33:23,883 --> 00:33:28,603 I was contacted by Andrew Fraser and Victor Susman 364 00:33:28,643 --> 00:33:33,483 and they said, "We're just wondering if you could assist us in a particular case." 365 00:33:34,763 --> 00:33:37,883 So what I did was I analysed two types of footage, 366 00:33:37,923 --> 00:33:41,203 and that is the footage from the initial police re-enactment 367 00:33:41,243 --> 00:33:45,763 and also footage from an interview that Joanne gave to Martin Bashir in the UK 368 00:33:45,803 --> 00:33:47,963 some time after the disappearance. 369 00:33:48,003 --> 00:33:53,123 And the purpose of that was to compare the reactions and compare behaviour. 370 00:33:53,163 --> 00:33:57,123 Usually when I've dealt with victims, they'll tell you what happened and what they felt. 371 00:33:57,163 --> 00:34:00,163 And there'll be things like, "I can't believe I'm in this situation. 372 00:34:00,203 --> 00:34:02,843 "Will I ever see my family again?" They're inconsolable. 373 00:34:07,683 --> 00:34:10,763 During the re-enactment, she was quite robotic in the delivery, 374 00:34:10,803 --> 00:34:14,683 but only focusing on what was happening, not what her feelings were 375 00:34:14,723 --> 00:34:17,363 or emotions were at the time, which I find unusual. 376 00:34:17,403 --> 00:34:22,363 This is the only time that I actually saw her showing any emotion. 377 00:34:22,403 --> 00:34:24,963 SHE WEEPS 378 00:34:26,763 --> 00:34:30,963 She put her head down towards her knees and it sounded like she was crying. 379 00:34:31,003 --> 00:34:35,123 The difficulty there was I didn't actually see her crying because her head was buried in herlap. 380 00:34:35,163 --> 00:34:37,363 Can you tell me... 381 00:34:37,403 --> 00:34:40,443 ..what Peter was like as a person? 382 00:34:40,483 --> 00:34:42,803 He's the nicest person I've ever met. 383 00:34:45,923 --> 00:34:48,003 In the Bashir interview, 384 00:34:48,043 --> 00:34:51,003 she once again put her hands up and cried. 385 00:34:51,043 --> 00:34:52,643 OK. 386 00:34:54,163 --> 00:34:57,643 It sounds a little bit like she's crying, but once again, it's hard to tell. 387 00:34:57,683 --> 00:35:00,843 When she removes her hands, I don't see any tears on her face 388 00:35:00,883 --> 00:35:03,683 or smudged mascara or anything like that. 389 00:35:12,723 --> 00:35:15,883 Interestingly enough, I counted 51 occasions 390 00:35:15,923 --> 00:35:20,123 where she would use language of uncertainty. 391 00:35:20,163 --> 00:35:24,483 "I don't know, possibly, sort of, maybe," all that type of ting. 392 00:35:26,963 --> 00:35:29,603 If somebody's gone through a terribly traumatic event, 393 00:35:29,643 --> 00:35:34,563 sometimes people do forget things, but often I've found, in my experience, 394 00:35:34,603 --> 00:35:38,283 their memory hasn't been that changed as a result of it, 395 00:35:38,323 --> 00:35:41,723 they remember things with amazing clarity. 396 00:35:49,683 --> 00:35:53,683 When there's so many changes, it's difficult to believe what's true and what's not. 397 00:35:53,723 --> 00:35:59,643 A lot of the inconsistencies and conflict and contradiction raised a lot of flags. 398 00:35:59,683 --> 00:36:05,603 So it concerned me in that it might be telltale signs of deception. 399 00:36:05,643 --> 00:36:10,643 The question that everybody would want me to ask you... OK. 400 00:36:10,683 --> 00:36:13,963 ..did you kill Peter Falconio? SHE CHUCKLES No. 401 00:36:14,003 --> 00:36:16,603 What I'm looking for is how she reacts to that question. 402 00:36:16,643 --> 00:36:19,923 And interestingly enough, what she does is 403 00:36:19,963 --> 00:36:25,203 she smiles, she actually says, "No," shaking her head, 404 00:36:25,243 --> 00:36:29,043 so the body language reflects the spoken word, but there was a smile, which is interesting. 405 00:36:29,083 --> 00:36:33,923 The next question that I see is, "Do you know who killed...?" 406 00:36:33,963 --> 00:36:37,843 Have you any idea who did? No. 407 00:36:37,883 --> 00:36:41,763 This was really interesting. We got the conflict and contradiction in the body language. 408 00:36:41,803 --> 00:36:43,843 And you have to look very carefully. 409 00:36:44,843 --> 00:36:48,483 "No." Just a very slight, just slight head movement, 410 00:36:48,523 --> 00:36:52,163 which was contradictory to what she did in the previous response. 411 00:36:52,203 --> 00:36:56,283 Why is she doing that? Maybe she knows something that she hasn't let on. 412 00:36:57,363 --> 00:37:02,683 Having spent 14 years in the police and having assisted and worked on 81 homicide cases 413 00:37:02,723 --> 00:37:05,483 and studied behavioural analysis, 414 00:37:05,523 --> 00:37:11,523 I am not convinced that Joanne's version of events are believable. 415 00:37:40,083 --> 00:37:43,523 It appears that Joanne and Peter did have quite a strong relationship. 416 00:37:43,563 --> 00:37:46,083 They'd known each other for five years. 417 00:37:46,123 --> 00:37:49,883 They were dreaming of this worldwide trip. 418 00:37:50,883 --> 00:37:53,763 When they got to Australia, 419 00:37:53,803 --> 00:37:57,003 there were signs of friction within that relationship, 420 00:37:57,043 --> 00:37:59,643 given what we know now. 421 00:38:45,083 --> 00:38:47,563 In the pre-trial hearing, 422 00:38:47,603 --> 00:38:50,323 there was an unmistakable gasp in the courtroom 423 00:38:50,363 --> 00:38:55,163 when this sudden piece of surprise evidence emerged. 424 00:38:55,203 --> 00:38:58,123 It was a real bombshell, you know. People weren't expecting it. 425 00:38:58,163 --> 00:39:01,363 A murder hearing has ended with a sensational admission. 426 00:39:01,403 --> 00:39:03,523 She's on her way home to England 427 00:39:03,563 --> 00:39:07,963 after revealing she cheated on her boyfriend shortly before he disappeared. 428 00:39:08,003 --> 00:39:11,603 "Her evidence in the committal hearing for murder accused Bradley Murdoch 429 00:39:11,643 --> 00:39:16,083 "ended with a win for the defence, forcing her to admit she'd had an affair. 430 00:39:16,123 --> 00:39:20,803 "Ms Lees agreed it was with a man by the name of Nick during the couple's holiday." 431 00:39:20,843 --> 00:39:23,803 "Seven News understands Nick is a British backpacker 432 00:39:23,843 --> 00:39:27,683 "who worked in a Sydney coffee shop not far from Dymocks, where Lees worked." 433 00:39:27,723 --> 00:39:30,963 Lees was also asked whether she'd e-mailed Nick from Alice Springs 434 00:39:31,003 --> 00:39:33,123 in the days after Peter's disappearance, 435 00:39:33,163 --> 00:39:35,403 making plans to meet him in Berlin. 436 00:39:35,443 --> 00:39:37,763 She admitted she had made that suggestion. 437 00:39:39,563 --> 00:39:43,323 After the incident, Joanne Lees was put in a safe house 438 00:39:43,363 --> 00:39:45,803 and given a police chaperone. 439 00:39:45,843 --> 00:39:49,163 And that chaperone's job was to look after Lees, 440 00:39:49,203 --> 00:39:52,803 but also make minute notes 441 00:39:52,843 --> 00:39:55,563 about everything that was said and done during the day. 442 00:39:56,643 --> 00:39:58,883 That is when we found out about Steph. 443 00:40:03,483 --> 00:40:06,403 Police discovered that she'd been sending e-mails 444 00:40:06,443 --> 00:40:10,763 to a person called Steph, which was a pseudonym for Nick. 445 00:40:12,483 --> 00:40:17,883 She'd been writing to him and suggesting they meet in Berlin on holiday later on in the year. 446 00:40:17,923 --> 00:40:21,083 This was a couple of days after the shooting of her boyfriend. 447 00:40:22,523 --> 00:40:28,963 It cast a new dimension, perspective, on what she was really up to. 448 00:40:29,963 --> 00:40:33,483 How could she have been talking to a former lover, 449 00:40:33,523 --> 00:40:35,963 a lover she'd had an affair with in Sydney earlier, 450 00:40:36,003 --> 00:40:39,643 about getting together a bit later on in the year and meeting up in Berlin? 451 00:40:39,683 --> 00:40:43,083 It didn't add up. And that, of course, was significant evidence, 452 00:40:43,123 --> 00:40:45,563 which really went against Joanne's interest. 453 00:41:51,803 --> 00:41:54,363 So, she's had an affair. 454 00:41:54,403 --> 00:41:59,883 However, Joanne wasn't that keen on fessing up to it. 455 00:41:59,923 --> 00:42:02,163 Well, here's what she says at the committal. 456 00:42:02,203 --> 00:42:05,483 "Were you concerned about the police becoming aware of e-mails 457 00:42:05,523 --> 00:42:08,523 that you'd received from somebody called Steph?" 458 00:42:08,563 --> 00:42:10,803 And her answer, "No." 459 00:42:10,843 --> 00:42:15,443 "Who is Steph?" Joanne Lees, "I don't know." 460 00:42:15,483 --> 00:42:21,083 "Is not Steph the name of the pseudonym false name adopted to write to you through the e-mail 461 00:42:21,123 --> 00:42:24,283 "by somebody called Nick?" "Yes." 462 00:42:24,323 --> 00:42:27,203 "And who is Nick?" "A friend." 463 00:42:27,243 --> 00:42:32,043 "A friend from Sydney with whom you had a relationship?" "No." 464 00:42:32,083 --> 00:42:34,683 She is under oath. 465 00:42:34,723 --> 00:42:38,003 Lie number one. "Who's Steph?" "I don't know." 466 00:42:38,043 --> 00:42:41,483 "Did you have a relationship with him?" "No." 467 00:42:41,523 --> 00:42:44,923 Now, a lie under oath is perjury. 468 00:42:44,963 --> 00:42:49,683 The magistrate said it's hardly a matter of real relevance here, 469 00:42:49,723 --> 00:42:55,523 but you'd be saying to the magistrate, "Hey, I'm asking the questions here, 470 00:42:55,563 --> 00:42:59,003 "and I'm saying it's relevant because it goes to her credit." 471 00:43:03,203 --> 00:43:07,723 "She was asked if she had a particular friend called Nick." 472 00:43:18,323 --> 00:43:20,923 I think the Crown was trying desperately 473 00:43:20,963 --> 00:43:25,043 to downplay the Nick Reilly affair. 474 00:43:25,083 --> 00:43:28,363 And I would have taken a statement from him. 475 00:43:28,403 --> 00:43:31,523 So we keep digging, as we have for years, 476 00:43:31,563 --> 00:43:35,843 and we find Joanne Lees' phone records 477 00:43:35,883 --> 00:43:39,683 in the police file that never came out at the trial. 478 00:43:39,723 --> 00:43:43,203 Now, it has here Nick Reilly on 22nd May. 479 00:43:43,243 --> 00:43:47,443 And you have a look at the list of calls there. 27 calls. 480 00:43:47,483 --> 00:43:51,883 But it's just before they leave Sydney. Correct. 481 00:43:51,923 --> 00:43:57,283 And you can just see, day after day, two calls, eight calls, three calls, eight calls, two calls. 482 00:43:57,323 --> 00:44:00,883 And then we hit 16th June, 2001. 483 00:44:00,923 --> 00:44:03,603 So we're less than a month away from the actual incident. 484 00:44:04,723 --> 00:44:06,923 28 calls. 485 00:44:08,803 --> 00:44:15,563 A few days before Lees and Falconio leave Sydney on their trip of a lifetime, 486 00:44:15,603 --> 00:44:21,163 Lees and Nick Reilly call each other 28 times in one day. 487 00:44:21,203 --> 00:44:24,643 It's clear that the calls continue after they've left. 488 00:44:24,683 --> 00:44:28,123 This is significant because everything she says, 489 00:44:28,163 --> 00:44:31,763 she sort of downplays any relationship. 490 00:44:31,803 --> 00:44:36,123 I think these phone records suggest that this relationship 491 00:44:36,163 --> 00:44:39,883 was more than the one-off fling Joanne Lees would have us all believe. 492 00:45:01,603 --> 00:45:04,763 Joanne Lees has been presented to, 493 00:45:04,803 --> 00:45:08,603 and accepted by, the jury as a witness of truth. 494 00:45:08,643 --> 00:45:12,763 If the jury had seen the SCAN report, 495 00:45:12,803 --> 00:45:17,483 re-enactment, interviewed by Jeanette Kerr, phone records, 496 00:45:17,523 --> 00:45:22,483 you would say to the jury, "You must have a doubt." 497 00:45:23,843 --> 00:45:26,283 There's somebody out there with the key. 498 00:45:26,323 --> 00:45:31,003 Somebody knows what happened that night. Really knows. 499 00:45:31,043 --> 00:45:34,163 Perhaps the police hadn't got the right man. 500 00:45:34,203 --> 00:45:36,923 It's unlikely that that is Murdoch. 501 00:45:36,963 --> 00:45:39,283 There is a list of people of interest. 502 00:45:39,323 --> 00:45:42,203 He made the hairs on the back of my neck stand up. 503 00:45:42,243 --> 00:45:46,083 200% sure it was Peter Falconio. I was a metre away from him. 504 00:45:46,123 --> 00:45:48,403 Where's Falconio gone? 505 00:45:48,443 --> 00:45:52,443 Subtitles by Red Bee Media 53236

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