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This programme contains strong
language, scenes of graphic movie
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violence and discussions of a
sexual nature that some viewers may
find distressing
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The very first scene of Netflix's
House of Cards just blew me away.
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There's this crash and
Kevin's character,
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he's this powerful politician.
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He just runs outside of his house
to see what happened.
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Sh.
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There are two kinds of pain...
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The sort of pain that makes
you strong, or useless pain.
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Sort of pain that's only suffering.
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I have no patience
for useless things.
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It gives me goose bumps every
time I watch it.
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His acting in the scene
is incredible, and when I got
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the call that I was going to be on
the show, I thought, "Oh, my God."
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I was 23 years old when I started
House of Cards.
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I was young, I was naive,
and I got a great opportunity.
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I was like, if I get to work
with Kevin Spacey,
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like, that is...that is awesome,
that is so cool.
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Fortunately, I was lucky enough
to be part of Underwood's Secret
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Service, so that was Kevin
Spacey's detail.
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He would crack a couple
jokes and I would laugh.
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He was a very funny guy.
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I told him I had a girlfriend.
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He told me that he loved jazz
music and I just thought
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he was very friendly, outgoing.
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I absolutely was
still intimidated...
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..with, uh, the way that he
carried himself.
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I mean, the value of that one
person can have
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and just to see that person walking
around, he's worth millions.
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Every now and then, they'd let us
know that there's a speaking role
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for a Secret Service agent.
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I was honoured to be chosen.
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My whole body's tingling.
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I can feel that I'm sweating.
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I'm thinking, "This is my time,
this is my moment."
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They said, "Action."
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What if we don't send ships?
Just make a strong statement...
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I came in, I walked up to him.
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00:02:03,080 --> 00:02:05,200
We still have to offer the Chinese
an incentive to...
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00:02:05,240 --> 00:02:08,040
I whisper in his ear and he gave me
this look like, "Oh, my God."
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00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:09,560
..contingency plans in place.
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Already drafted.
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00:02:10,840 --> 00:02:12,640
And then we just walked
off set together.
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We do this little U-turn, and then
we're on the other side
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of the set and it's just me and him.
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I leaned in because he was saying
something to me, and then I felt
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something like something tickled me
just right below my zipper.
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And I was like, "What?"
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I looked down and I see
it's his finger.
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You know, his hand touched
my penis.
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Wasn't like us playing around
in the locker room,
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a little joke or a little tap.
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It was...it was sexual.
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I was touched, I was inappropriately
touched on set at work.
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00:02:51,080 --> 00:02:54,520
He just had these real dead eyes
looking at me, and I just felt
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like I was staring into, like,
a soulless...monster.
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And I'm just kind of, like,
in shock, like, "Wait, what?
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00:03:02,360 --> 00:03:03,640
"That's not cool."
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00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:05,400
You know, you hear, "Cut,"
and then boom, reset.
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Go right-back to doing
the scenes again.
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00:03:08,680 --> 00:03:12,720
I remember feeling this
overwhelming sense of guilt
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because I just felt
like it was my fault.
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And I just felt so, like,
disgusted with myself.
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That was the greatest day,
you know, on set for me.
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00:03:23,240 --> 00:03:27,880
And it very quickly turned
sour when I realised, like,
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if I potentially have to keep
working with this guy and I get
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more lines, is this something
that I'm going to experience
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on a regular basis,
and what power do I have?
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00:03:47,400 --> 00:03:51,000
The Oscar-winning actor Kevin Spacey
has appeared in court in London,
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accused of sexual offences
against four men
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between 2001 and 2013.
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The prosecutor claimed the Hollywood
actor was a sexual bully.
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Kevin Spacey has told a court in
London that he is a big flirt,
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but he denied behaving aggressively.
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The actor broke down in tears
as he was cleared
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of all nine charges.
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I would like to say that I'm
enormously grateful to the jury
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for having taken the time to examine
all of the evidence,
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and I am humbled by the
outcome today.
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The star leaves court
an innocent man.
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He will hope he can resume a career
that reached the highest levels.
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I was dancing with the devil.
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I wouldn't see it as
anything criminal.
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I just did think it was just kind
of, like, disgusting behaviour
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from a professional to have on set.
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It was cold in a way that almost
was inhuman.
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Men aren't supposed to let
this get under their skin.
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00:05:23,840 --> 00:05:26,400
So I went to Chatsworth
High School with Kevin.
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I would have been 16, 17
at the time.
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It was all about, "I can do this,
I can do this to you.
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"I'm Kevin Spacey."
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I'm lost.
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I have no idea where I am.
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I really don't.
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Ha!
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Yeah, this place has changed a lot.
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And then there it is,
Sunny Brae Avenue.
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This is the house in
Canoga Park where my brother
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Kevin and I lived.
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Yeah, there is the old
bedroom window.
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This is baby Kevin and myself
dressed up in a sailor's outfit.
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From that young age,
we had a real bond as brothers.
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You know, we used to play
outside and just run
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around with the neighbours.
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00:07:02,880 --> 00:07:07,880
We used to play in the fields
and hide in the grass
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and play kick the can.
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Those are some really fond memories.
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My father, he blamed the world for
all of his problems.
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And he was full of so much
hatred and...
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..he said that the Holocaust
never happened.
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He used to have these Nazi meetings
at the house.
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In my father's office,
he used to have a big Nazi flag
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hanging up on the wall.
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My father had a riding crop.
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And he used to beat
the shit out of me.
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Looking at it from my brother's
perspective, all he saw was Randy
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00:08:06,600 --> 00:08:09,520
got into trouble a lot
and he would just split.
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00:08:10,920 --> 00:08:16,600
I never saw my father ever lay
a hand on my brother, ever.
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00:08:16,640 --> 00:08:20,520
But Kevin didn't have
a normal childhood.
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He just found a way to survive
in an environment
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that was not a loving family.
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And I think acting was a way for him
to escape where he came from.
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You make a decision that you don't
need to graduate from Juilliard.
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You'll just take your life
into your own hands, right?
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00:09:14,280 --> 00:09:16,120
After two years. Yeah. Yeah.
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Although I do believe
that if I hadn't left,
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they probably would have asked me to
leave about four days later.
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I had no prospects, I had no agent,
I had no money.
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00:09:24,200 --> 00:09:27,600
But I thought I was ready to start.
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00:09:27,640 --> 00:09:29,600
This is a Teenage Idol cattle call.
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00:09:29,640 --> 00:09:31,080
Why do you want to be
a Teenage Idol?
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I want to act very badly, and that's
just a... It's part of it, you know?
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It's like I do an impression
of Johnny Carson,
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it's not really what I do.
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00:09:43,080 --> 00:09:45,320
This was 1981.
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I was working at the Public Theatre.
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It was a wonderful time in my life.
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Being in New York post college,
I was comfortably out
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00:09:54,840 --> 00:09:56,480
of the closet for the first time.
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00:09:56,520 --> 00:09:59,760
I had a boyfriend, and I just
sort of felt like New York
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was in front of me.
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Kevin was around the theatre a lot.
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00:10:07,840 --> 00:10:10,760
He was doing Free Shakespeare
in Central Park,
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so there was a production
that was in rehearsal.
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I was a spear carrier in my
very first Shakespeare job
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as a professional
in New York, out of Juilliard.
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And I played a tavern person.
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I played a guard, a spear carrier,
and I think a rock.
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And which was your finest?
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I think the rock was.
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He was this presence, you know,
very vague, vague presence.
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But he came into the office to use
the guest desk,
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and that's how I encountered him.
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I was on the phone
and Kevin Spacey walked in.
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He didn't acknowledge me,
he didn't look at me.
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00:10:52,960 --> 00:10:58,800
And I finished up my call and hung
up and looked over at him.
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And he still wasn't acknowledging
me, and I thought,
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00:11:02,160 --> 00:11:05,000
"I should say hello,
shouldn't he say hello?
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00:11:05,040 --> 00:11:06,920
"Am I interrupting?" Or whatever.
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00:11:06,960 --> 00:11:10,000
So I stood up and then he stood up...
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..uh, and, uh...
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00:11:13,360 --> 00:11:16,280
..began to approach and the...
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00:11:16,320 --> 00:11:19,440
There was nothing really odd
about that, except for the abject
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silence when he was standing
and walking,
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he was wearing a pair of pretty
tight jeans.
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He had a full scale erection.
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And he kept approaching and came
in front of me and pulled me
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up onto the desk.
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So I lost my balance, went back on
the desk and he was on top of me
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and he's pressing against me.
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It was just completely out of
the blue and completely wordless.
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Angry.
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There was no eye contact.
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There was nothing but force,
physical force.
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00:11:53,960 --> 00:11:57,760
And I'm pushing him off,
saying, "Get off me,
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"this is my office."
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00:11:59,440 --> 00:12:03,160
And he persisted before I was
able to push him enough
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00:12:03,200 --> 00:12:05,600
that he rolled off.
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He stood back up.
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He grabbed his coat and he stormed
out of the office,
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00:12:12,720 --> 00:12:14,280
slamming the door behind him.
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00:12:16,120 --> 00:12:20,880
I sat in my office for I don't know
how long, and I was shaking.
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00:12:21,840 --> 00:12:26,200
It was cold in a way that
almost was inhuman.
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I was really scared.
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00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:34,160
I never told my boyfriend
of the time.
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00:12:34,200 --> 00:12:39,480
I never felt I could tell
or should tell anybody.
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It was something I needed to bury.
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00:12:44,400 --> 00:12:47,920
I had to watch his career blossom
and now he's gaining
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even more power.
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00:12:49,480 --> 00:12:52,160
If he could do that to me
back when he had no power,
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00:12:52,200 --> 00:12:54,040
what's he going to do with that now?
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00:12:54,080 --> 00:12:55,800
What's he going to do
with that anger?
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00:13:05,040 --> 00:13:07,160
I sort of thought, well,
most of the actors I admired
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00:13:07,200 --> 00:13:08,720
really made their marks in theatre.
195
00:13:08,760 --> 00:13:10,360
And then Hollywood came knocking.
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00:13:10,400 --> 00:13:12,720
So I thought, well,
let me just try to do that.
197
00:13:16,840 --> 00:13:21,520
Kevin Spacey kind of erupted
in the '90s into being
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00:13:21,560 --> 00:13:24,480
this huge star, super fast.
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00:13:24,520 --> 00:13:27,080
How many films released in 1995?
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00:13:27,120 --> 00:13:29,000
Uh, four, Outbreak. Outbreak.
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00:13:29,040 --> 00:13:31,480
That was the first
and Swimming with Sharks.
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00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:33,040
The Usual Suspects.
Usual Suspects.
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00:13:33,080 --> 00:13:35,080
And a little film we did
called Seven.
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00:13:35,120 --> 00:13:37,400
I mean, does it get any
better than '95?
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00:13:38,400 --> 00:13:40,160
I'm an entertainment journalist.
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00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:44,480
Part of what I do now is more
investigative in nature.
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00:13:44,520 --> 00:13:48,440
So, you know, in the '90s,
there were a few examples
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00:13:48,480 --> 00:13:53,120
of Kevin Spacey bringing a woman
with him to certain events.
209
00:13:53,160 --> 00:13:56,080
There was no such thing as
an out gay actor
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00:13:56,120 --> 00:13:58,840
at the level of Kevin Spacey.
211
00:13:58,880 --> 00:14:03,240
Closest you could get was Rupert
Everett, who looked stunningly
212
00:14:03,280 --> 00:14:07,240
handsome and, by all rights, should
have had a very robust career.
213
00:14:07,280 --> 00:14:08,800
But he didn't.
214
00:14:08,840 --> 00:14:11,080
Ellen DeGeneres came out
in '97, you know,
215
00:14:11,120 --> 00:14:12,760
in real life and on her sitcom.
216
00:14:12,800 --> 00:14:16,040
For several years, her career
kind of bottomed out
217
00:14:16,080 --> 00:14:18,120
and she could not get much work.
218
00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:20,000
And again, that was seen as an
219
00:14:20,040 --> 00:14:22,240
example of why maybe coming out
220
00:14:22,280 --> 00:14:24,680
at that level was not a good
career move.
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00:14:26,440 --> 00:14:28,600
Besides, it was fun.
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00:14:28,640 --> 00:14:30,680
I got to make like I was notorious.
223
00:14:30,720 --> 00:14:35,440
The Usual Suspects really launched
Kevin Spacey as an actor in a way
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00:14:35,480 --> 00:14:39,040
that is hard to describe for
somebody who wasn't
225
00:14:39,080 --> 00:14:41,200
necessarily alive at the time.
226
00:14:41,240 --> 00:14:44,600
There was this whole campaign about
who is Keyser Soze,
227
00:14:44,640 --> 00:14:46,680
this mythic gangster?
228
00:14:46,720 --> 00:14:48,600
..burns down the houses
they live in.
229
00:14:48,640 --> 00:14:53,800
And because the entire movie
hinges on your ability to buy
230
00:14:53,840 --> 00:14:58,280
into Kevin Spacey's performance at
every moment, that really launched
231
00:14:58,320 --> 00:15:03,720
Kevin Spacey as this actor who an
audience couldn't ever quite trust
232
00:15:03,760 --> 00:15:05,400
but always wanted to watch.
233
00:15:07,960 --> 00:15:13,480
So, when Kevin Spacey won his first
Oscar for The Usual Suspects...
234
00:15:13,520 --> 00:15:19,040
And the Oscar is presented to
Kevin Spacey in The Usual Suspects.
235
00:15:22,920 --> 00:15:26,160
Well, whoever Keyser Soze is,
I can tell you he's going to get
236
00:15:26,200 --> 00:15:28,000
gloriously drunk tonight.
237
00:15:29,400 --> 00:15:32,920
It really was an announcement
for Kevin Spacey
238
00:15:32,960 --> 00:15:37,360
as really having reached a sort
of new pinnacle in the industry.
239
00:15:40,040 --> 00:15:43,680
In 1998, Kevin's cool,
kind of punk rock.
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00:15:45,920 --> 00:15:50,000
I'd come from a job working for
George Lucas in post-production,
241
00:15:50,040 --> 00:15:53,480
and the last film I worked
on was Saving Private Ryan.
242
00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:56,600
A friend of mine was in town,
he was a singer of
243
00:15:56,640 --> 00:16:01,920
a pretty big band, and we ended up
going to The Viper Room that night.
244
00:16:01,960 --> 00:16:04,520
Kevin Spacey's there,
he wants to meet the band.
245
00:16:04,560 --> 00:16:09,240
So, of course, I was over the moon
to meet him, you know?
246
00:16:09,280 --> 00:16:12,320
To me, he was just on such
a pedestal.
247
00:16:12,360 --> 00:16:14,440
I'm not going to lie,
I was starstruck.
248
00:16:14,480 --> 00:16:17,720
Like, we just boom,
like, hit it off.
249
00:16:17,760 --> 00:16:19,880
Like off to the races.
250
00:16:19,920 --> 00:16:22,200
I was telling him about
I went to film school
251
00:16:22,240 --> 00:16:25,040
after I got out of the Marine Corps.
252
00:16:25,080 --> 00:16:27,640
And, you know, I was kind of
throwing my hat
253
00:16:27,680 --> 00:16:29,440
in the ring as an actor.
254
00:16:29,480 --> 00:16:31,640
You know, he wanted to get
my headshot and resume
255
00:16:31,680 --> 00:16:34,880
and that we should potentially
work together.
256
00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:40,360
It felt amazing to have somebody in
the industry talk to me like that,
257
00:16:40,400 --> 00:16:43,120
somebody that's going to take
you under their wing.
258
00:16:44,200 --> 00:16:46,680
I was like, I can't even
believe this.
259
00:16:46,720 --> 00:16:49,200
Like, I'm a nobody.
260
00:16:49,240 --> 00:16:53,280
So we leave The Viper Room and,
you know, we just transferred
261
00:16:53,320 --> 00:16:57,160
the whole party to this big fancy
house in the Hollywood Hills.
262
00:16:57,200 --> 00:17:01,360
Kevin came up to me at one point
and he said, "Hey, there's
263
00:17:01,400 --> 00:17:04,640
"a great home theatre in this house,
and you should check it out."
264
00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:10,480
So I go with him upstairs, and
that's when things...
265
00:17:10,520 --> 00:17:13,040
I started to feel the energy shift
a little bit.
266
00:17:14,520 --> 00:17:17,600
And, uh, and he was like,
"Can I have a hug?"
267
00:17:19,400 --> 00:17:21,600
I was like, "Huh, OK."
268
00:17:21,640 --> 00:17:23,160
I guess that's an LA thing.
269
00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:27,240
I did not know at that point
that he was gay.
270
00:17:27,280 --> 00:17:33,200
So I kind of go into, you know,
give him a quick bro hug and, uh,
271
00:17:33,240 --> 00:17:39,720
and he just, you know, gets me
in this bear grip and he's kind of,
272
00:17:39,760 --> 00:17:46,920
you know, rubbing his, his whiskery
face in my neck and, um, you know,
273
00:17:46,960 --> 00:17:51,760
kind of grinding into me,
like, humping me.
274
00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:55,600
Just like, "Hey, whoa, man,
like, you met my girlfriend."
275
00:17:55,640 --> 00:17:58,920
Like, you know, "You know,
she's downstairs, like,
276
00:17:58,960 --> 00:18:00,520
"that's not cool."
277
00:18:00,560 --> 00:18:04,320
And he's like, "No, no, no,
it's OK, it's fine, you're OK.
278
00:18:04,360 --> 00:18:06,880
"You're good, don't freak out."
279
00:18:06,920 --> 00:18:10,000
I was like, "Dude, you know,
I was a marine, right?"
280
00:18:10,040 --> 00:18:13,000
And he goes, "Yeah, that's
half the attraction."
281
00:18:14,200 --> 00:18:17,200
I remember going down those stairs
and, like, being kind of shaky,
282
00:18:17,240 --> 00:18:18,880
you know, on my feet.
283
00:18:18,920 --> 00:18:23,640
My heart was racing,
full-on adrenaline dump.
284
00:18:23,680 --> 00:18:27,720
I've thought about what he meant
by saying, "It's OK," a lot
285
00:18:27,760 --> 00:18:33,280
over the years, because it is
a strange sort of thing
286
00:18:33,320 --> 00:18:35,520
to say in a moment like that.
287
00:18:35,560 --> 00:18:38,320
Is he talking to me?
Is he talking to himself?
288
00:18:39,880 --> 00:18:43,160
Did this happen to him at some
point in his life?
289
00:18:43,200 --> 00:18:46,640
And he's sort of - like, that's what
the person said to him?
290
00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:53,000
Shush him and soothe him over
by using those words.
291
00:18:53,040 --> 00:18:58,440
We have gotten so into a kind of
confessional in the last ten years
292
00:18:58,480 --> 00:19:01,320
of everybody sort of coming out
and talking about their lives,
293
00:19:01,360 --> 00:19:03,920
I think it's, um, for me,
it's not something
294
00:19:03,960 --> 00:19:06,880
I'm interested in doing and not
a line that I will ever cross.
295
00:19:06,920 --> 00:19:08,480
I haven't done a lot of publicity.
296
00:19:08,520 --> 00:19:11,160
I've kept it very close to my chest,
and that's important.
297
00:19:12,680 --> 00:19:16,040
I was just kind of nursing
a hangover and the phone rings
298
00:19:16,080 --> 00:19:17,920
like, "Hello, Scotter?"
299
00:19:17,960 --> 00:19:19,400
Scotter?
300
00:19:19,440 --> 00:19:22,280
And I recognise the voice, "Kevin?"
301
00:19:22,320 --> 00:19:24,760
He's like, "We should get
together and I'll get
302
00:19:24,800 --> 00:19:26,720
"your headshot and resume."
303
00:19:26,760 --> 00:19:31,040
You know, this wasn't just some guy,
this was Kevin freaking Spacey.
304
00:19:31,080 --> 00:19:34,800
And you do it happily, uh,
with joy in your heart.
305
00:19:34,840 --> 00:19:36,360
"Thank you, God!"
306
00:19:36,400 --> 00:19:39,040
Like, he really does care
about my career.
307
00:19:40,120 --> 00:19:43,320
And there he was,
standing on the corner.
308
00:19:43,360 --> 00:19:46,520
Right on that corner
there's a movie theatre,
309
00:19:46,560 --> 00:19:51,600
and, um, Saving Private Ryan
happened to be playing.
310
00:19:51,640 --> 00:19:54,560
So he's like, "Hey, your movie,
we should go see it."
311
00:19:54,600 --> 00:19:59,000
So I had this intuition that this
thing could go sideways
312
00:19:59,040 --> 00:20:04,160
in a myriad of ways, but
I also still was very much
313
00:20:04,200 --> 00:20:06,640
under the impression
that I was in control.
314
00:20:06,680 --> 00:20:12,480
Kevin grabbed a seat, like, way up
high, very hidden, very private.
315
00:20:12,520 --> 00:20:15,440
And I'm watching the movie.
316
00:20:15,480 --> 00:20:18,960
The first 20 minutes of
the invasion of Normandy.
317
00:20:19,000 --> 00:20:22,000
Like, it's shockingly,
you know, horrific.
318
00:20:23,720 --> 00:20:27,480
There's a guy picking up his arm and
people are on fire, and people
319
00:20:27,520 --> 00:20:30,760
are just dying in really
the most horrible ways
320
00:20:30,800 --> 00:20:32,000
you can die, like.
321
00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:46,040
All of a sudden, there's some
activity happening next to me
322
00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:47,720
and kind of glance over and...
323
00:20:48,720 --> 00:20:51,520
..Kevin's just pleasuring himself.
324
00:20:55,640 --> 00:21:01,080
You know, some of the most horrific
war footage ever recreated.
325
00:21:01,120 --> 00:21:05,000
Like, there's no way that
this is happening,
326
00:21:05,040 --> 00:21:10,480
that this guy is rubbing one out
during the invasion of Normandy.
327
00:21:13,240 --> 00:21:17,960
And finally he reaches over
and grabs my hand,
328
00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:21,000
and tries to get me to...to
help out.
329
00:21:21,040 --> 00:21:23,440
I was like, "No! This is crazy!"
330
00:21:25,080 --> 00:21:27,440
Every single guy you tell
this story to
331
00:21:27,480 --> 00:21:30,120
tells you a whole story, right,
of what they would have done.
332
00:21:30,160 --> 00:21:32,080
"Oh, I would have punched him
in the face,
333
00:21:32,120 --> 00:21:33,800
"and I would have kicked him,
and I..."
334
00:21:33,840 --> 00:21:37,360
And I'm like, "No. Actually, no.
No, you wouldn't have."
335
00:21:37,400 --> 00:21:41,280
Guys like myself, like,
you just really don't find yourself
336
00:21:41,320 --> 00:21:42,680
in those situations.
337
00:21:42,720 --> 00:21:45,720
So, it's so shocking.
And, I can only speak for myself,
338
00:21:45,760 --> 00:21:49,360
but your first reaction
is not violence.
339
00:21:49,400 --> 00:21:54,080
It's... You feel like you did
something wrong,
340
00:21:54,120 --> 00:21:55,720
you brought it on to yourself and...
341
00:21:57,200 --> 00:21:58,760
..you feel shame.
342
00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:18,160
Here's my mother and father,
and Kevin.
343
00:22:18,200 --> 00:22:21,600
And Kevin's got a face that's
like, "Eeeh!"
344
00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:26,400
The house was creepy.
345
00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:28,160
It was cold.
346
00:22:28,200 --> 00:22:30,720
It was violent.
347
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:34,800
So, I think for both me and Kevin,
348
00:22:34,840 --> 00:22:37,280
any time we could get
out of the house,
349
00:22:37,320 --> 00:22:38,960
we were out of there.
350
00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:48,600
I think that my outfits that I wear,
351
00:22:48,640 --> 00:22:50,040
and that I have been wearing...
352
00:22:51,560 --> 00:22:55,400
..for the last 50 years
are like costumes.
353
00:22:57,120 --> 00:23:00,200
It makes me feel comfortable and...
354
00:23:02,080 --> 00:23:03,400
..accepted.
355
00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:11,280
Another way to mask my internal
pain and suffering
356
00:23:11,320 --> 00:23:14,280
that I was going through
psychologically.
357
00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:18,480
That if I look different
and I dress different...
358
00:23:19,600 --> 00:23:22,240
..maybe people would never be able
to find out
359
00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:25,920
about my dark secret,
and maybe they would treat me better.
360
00:23:25,960 --> 00:23:31,960
And it takes me farther and farther
away from where I came from.
361
00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:35,760
And that...that makes me happy.
362
00:23:36,840 --> 00:23:40,680
I remember my favourite class
at Juilliard was mask class,
363
00:23:40,720 --> 00:23:42,920
and when you put a mask on your face
364
00:23:42,960 --> 00:23:44,640
and stand in front of a mirror,
365
00:23:44,680 --> 00:23:46,600
you suddenly don't see yourself.
366
00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:48,160
You see something else,
367
00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:50,200
and suddenly you become free.
368
00:23:51,680 --> 00:23:54,320
It was so revealing to hear him hint
369
00:23:54,360 --> 00:23:57,600
that his acting in some ways served
370
00:23:57,640 --> 00:24:00,560
the same purpose as my costumes.
371
00:24:06,440 --> 00:24:09,200
I started getting phone
calls from Kevin.
372
00:24:10,520 --> 00:24:13,000
You know, they were never like,
"Hey, come in for a casting,"
373
00:24:13,040 --> 00:24:14,040
or anything like that.
374
00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:18,320
It was always sort of like,
"Hey, pack your stuff,
375
00:24:18,360 --> 00:24:20,080
"we're going to Maui.
376
00:24:20,120 --> 00:24:21,880
"I have a room booked for us.
377
00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:24,400
"I'm at LAX right now.
I'm waiting for you.
378
00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:27,320
"I'm at the Beverly Hills Hotel,
sitting in front of a fire,
379
00:24:27,360 --> 00:24:28,960
"petting my black lab."
380
00:24:30,040 --> 00:24:31,920
Didn't return any of those.
381
00:24:34,000 --> 00:24:37,440
And then, finally, he got me.
382
00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:41,400
He calls and he's like, "Hey, Bruce
Willis is having a party tonight.
383
00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:43,280
"There's people there I want
to introduce you to."
384
00:24:43,320 --> 00:24:46,720
And I'm like,
"Oh, freaking Die Hard!
385
00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:49,160
"Oh, my God!
386
00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:51,520
"Ah, I want to meet Bruce!"
387
00:24:51,560 --> 00:24:54,560
So, I go to the hotel,
388
00:24:54,600 --> 00:24:57,520
I go up in the elevator.
389
00:24:57,560 --> 00:24:58,720
The TV's on
390
00:24:58,760 --> 00:25:02,720
and, at one point, he turns
the volume off,
391
00:25:02,760 --> 00:25:06,960
and it's like two characters
talking the scene,
392
00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:11,360
and he starts doing the voices
of the characters and accents.
393
00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:12,640
And it's the funniest thing.
394
00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:13,800
Like, I'm rolling.
395
00:25:13,840 --> 00:25:16,080
Like, it's hilarious.
396
00:25:16,120 --> 00:25:17,920
Of course, time is passing,
397
00:25:17,960 --> 00:25:20,240
and I'm, like,
"When are we going to the party?"
398
00:25:20,280 --> 00:25:23,880
And this was when he started sort
of letting me know, you know,
399
00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:28,080
in no uncertain terms, that there's
a glass ceiling in Hollywood.
400
00:25:28,120 --> 00:25:31,440
He was moving around in the back
and rubbing my shoulders,
401
00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:32,920
and, you know...
402
00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:36,840
And...if you don't pay the toll,
403
00:25:36,880 --> 00:25:40,560
you know, your sexual favours,
404
00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:45,560
you know, you'll...you'll have
a...you'll have a decent career,
405
00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:49,560
but you're not going to have
your name in lights, kind of thing.
406
00:25:49,600 --> 00:25:53,160
It really affected me on a level
that I never could have seen coming.
407
00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:57,040
The betrayal aspect of
thinking that
408
00:25:57,080 --> 00:26:02,360
somebody thought you had something
to offer the industry,
409
00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:03,800
and that you...
410
00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:07,000
..were a person of value.
411
00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:11,200
There is a humiliation that goes
along with...with being
412
00:26:11,240 --> 00:26:15,400
sort of treated like that,
objectified like that.
413
00:26:15,440 --> 00:26:19,080
You're being looked at
as an object,
414
00:26:19,120 --> 00:26:23,320
um, that you have nothing else
to offer the world.
415
00:26:23,360 --> 00:26:26,120
And I hope that people
can...can look at this and say,
416
00:26:26,160 --> 00:26:31,360
"Well, you know, that guy,
if he can tell his story
417
00:26:31,400 --> 00:26:35,000
"and, you know, he kind of seems
like maybe he's this tough guy
418
00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:36,840
"that...that can handle a lot.
419
00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:40,880
"But if...if he can show this level
of vulnerability,
420
00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:43,080
"you know, maybe I can, too."
421
00:26:43,120 --> 00:26:48,960
And that would be a good
first place to start healing.
422
00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:55,840
Fuck!
423
00:26:57,240 --> 00:26:58,720
Goddamn it!
424
00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:03,480
Fuck.
425
00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:14,600
Sorry.
426
00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:20,920
Well, that's what I wanted to avoid.
427
00:27:26,360 --> 00:27:30,640
I don't want this to be
a fucking victim thing.
428
00:27:30,680 --> 00:27:32,280
You know?
429
00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:43,640
I, er... No, it's important to me.
430
00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:45,680
Strength is important to me.
431
00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:48,640
It has been my whole life.
432
00:27:49,960 --> 00:27:54,160
Men aren't supposed to let this
get under their skin.
433
00:27:58,360 --> 00:27:59,920
At age 40,
434
00:27:59,960 --> 00:28:02,600
he's anything
but your typical movie star.
435
00:28:02,640 --> 00:28:04,880
It's also quite anonymous
436
00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:07,360
because people don't look at
the person on the scooter,
437
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:08,680
they look at the scooter.
438
00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:12,560
You don't want anybody to see
behind the mask of Kevin Spacey?
439
00:28:12,600 --> 00:28:17,040
I've always believed that the longer
an actor remains in the shadows,
440
00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:18,600
then the characters emerge.
441
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:22,600
I think there was at least
a contingent of people
442
00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:26,400
in the industry who had
a tacit understanding
443
00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:28,960
that Kevin Spacey was actually gay
444
00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:30,880
or, at the very least, bisexual.
445
00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:33,880
Kevin Spacey was asked
a couple times about it
446
00:28:33,920 --> 00:28:37,560
where he basically said, "It's just
something I will never discuss."
447
00:28:57,360 --> 00:29:01,880
And then there was a profile
in Esquire magazine,
448
00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:04,560
with the headline,
"Kevin Spacey has a secret."
449
00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:07,040
At the time,
450
00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:08,800
that was seen as outing him.
451
00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:14,800
His team was furious about
that piece and
452
00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:17,480
sort of considered it
an invasion of privacy.
453
00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:23,120
I think when you get into the world
of entertainment
454
00:29:23,160 --> 00:29:25,400
and entertainers who are closeted,
455
00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:28,400
the idea of outing
them as some sort of public good
456
00:29:28,440 --> 00:29:30,800
just doesn't really stand up to me.
457
00:29:30,840 --> 00:29:37,080
I think where things get tricky
is when an LGBTQ person is behaving
458
00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:40,240
in such a way that causes harm
459
00:29:40,280 --> 00:29:44,040
or hardship to other people.
460
00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:54,240
So, I was in all the school plays
461
00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:56,080
and musicals and drama camp.
462
00:29:56,120 --> 00:29:58,200
I was the drama nerd, for sure,
463
00:29:58,240 --> 00:30:01,080
and then wanted to come out
to Los Angeles,
464
00:30:01,120 --> 00:30:03,200
but it was too far for my mom.
465
00:30:03,240 --> 00:30:04,920
So I ended up in New York
466
00:30:04,960 --> 00:30:07,560
on this internship
on The Big Kahuna.
467
00:30:09,280 --> 00:30:12,640
It was the only time I worked in
a production where I was not paid.
468
00:30:13,800 --> 00:30:16,200
And it was almost like
it was like an honour to work
469
00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:17,880
on a Kevin Spacey movie.
470
00:30:17,920 --> 00:30:19,840
So, everybody was bowing to him.
471
00:30:19,880 --> 00:30:22,440
I mean, he was running the show.
472
00:30:23,520 --> 00:30:26,640
The first time he approached
me, he kidnapped me.
473
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:28,080
He said, "I'm kidnapping you
474
00:30:28,120 --> 00:30:30,200
"up to my dressing room to run lines
with me."
475
00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:35,480
Getting to run lines with him felt
like this is a dream come true.
476
00:30:38,400 --> 00:30:42,680
By the second week, he would kidnap
me off set to run lines,
477
00:30:42,720 --> 00:30:46,480
and he would just have the TV on
and wouldn't be interested
478
00:30:46,520 --> 00:30:50,160
in running any lines. And he would
complain about a sore shoulder
479
00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:52,080
and wanted me to rub his shoulder.
480
00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:54,000
And then he'd be lying on his couch,
481
00:30:54,040 --> 00:30:56,480
and he'd try to put my hand
on his crotch.
482
00:30:56,520 --> 00:31:00,240
He was clearly trying to get me to,
like, do sexual things.
483
00:31:00,280 --> 00:31:04,640
You know, touch me, and I would,
you know, carefully move him away.
484
00:31:04,680 --> 00:31:06,160
And I would always insert, like,
485
00:31:06,200 --> 00:31:08,040
I had a long-term girlfriend
at the time.
486
00:31:08,080 --> 00:31:11,920
But, you know, it felt like
a sexual conquest
487
00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:16,760
that, because I was straight,
it was more of a challenge,
488
00:31:16,800 --> 00:31:19,080
and that, you know, it's the chase.
489
00:31:20,800 --> 00:31:25,360
And that went on pretty much
till the end of the shoot.
490
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:28,120
I remember hearing,
"Well, yeah, everybody knows
491
00:31:28,160 --> 00:31:30,360
"if you don't want to go home
with Kevin,
492
00:31:30,400 --> 00:31:32,600
"don't be the last guy
in a bar with him."
493
00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:35,720
And I guess, you know, I could
have walked away at that point,
494
00:31:35,760 --> 00:31:40,080
and I felt like, you know,
I wanted to be in his good favour.
495
00:31:40,120 --> 00:31:43,920
And if all that meant was rubbing
his shoulders, I would do that.
496
00:31:48,720 --> 00:31:52,720
On our last day of filming,
we were in the bar drinking
497
00:31:52,760 --> 00:31:54,720
and I get up to pee and he goes,
498
00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:56,000
"Do you want to smoke some weed?"
499
00:31:56,040 --> 00:31:58,560
I was like, "All right." And
so he follows me into the bathroom.
500
00:32:00,200 --> 00:32:02,000
He's in between me and the door,
501
00:32:02,040 --> 00:32:05,240
and he just whips out his dick
and shoves his tongue in my mouth,
502
00:32:05,280 --> 00:32:07,680
and he wanted to finish.
503
00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:09,040
And, um...
504
00:32:10,920 --> 00:32:12,720
How am I going to get out of this?
505
00:32:14,040 --> 00:32:18,000
That moment, somebody started
banging on the bathroom door.
506
00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:22,160
He got very nervous, zipped
up his pants, bolted out of the bar.
507
00:32:24,720 --> 00:32:26,680
I remember my mom saying
508
00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:29,320
that I should call
the National Enquirer
509
00:32:29,360 --> 00:32:31,480
and, like, you know, blow the story.
510
00:32:31,520 --> 00:32:34,320
And I remember telling her, like,
"Mom, I'll never work in Hollywood
511
00:32:34,360 --> 00:32:36,760
"if I do that." You know, like,
"It'll ruin me!"
512
00:32:36,800 --> 00:32:39,560
I was in shock for months.
513
00:32:39,600 --> 00:32:42,800
But then I was like,
"OK, so that's how Hollywood is."
514
00:32:50,800 --> 00:32:53,920
Now Spacey is back with
a new film called American Beauty.
515
00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:56,840
The reviews, they're over the top.
516
00:32:56,880 --> 00:33:00,840
Steven Spielberg says one of the
best films he's seen in ten years.
517
00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:03,160
It's why he wants to make movies.
518
00:33:03,200 --> 00:33:04,960
Welcome back. Thank you.
519
00:33:05,000 --> 00:33:10,440
I remember just being
bowled over by that entire film.
520
00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:14,320
And at its heart was this sort
of everyman performance
521
00:33:14,360 --> 00:33:15,920
by Kevin Spacey.
522
00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:18,640
Lester, could you make me
a little later, please,
523
00:33:18,680 --> 00:33:20,280
because I'm not quite late enough?
524
00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:27,440
A man who has
the sort of sad sack suburban life,
525
00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:29,560
and feels very beaten down,
526
00:33:29,600 --> 00:33:31,120
and over the course of the movie,
527
00:33:31,160 --> 00:33:35,720
kind of reclaims his own sense of
self and his own sense of purpose.
528
00:33:43,040 --> 00:33:45,480
And the Oscar goes to
529
00:33:45,520 --> 00:33:47,680
Kevin Spacey in American Beauty.
530
00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:53,280
This is Kevin Spacey's
second Academy Award.
531
00:33:53,320 --> 00:33:55,480
He won an Oscar in 1995
532
00:33:55,520 --> 00:33:58,480
for his supporting role
in The Usual Suspects.
533
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:03,680
It really made clear, him winning
those Oscars so close together,
534
00:34:03,720 --> 00:34:08,960
just how meteoric a rise Kevin
Spacey had had within the industry,
535
00:34:09,000 --> 00:34:11,200
and I think with audiences
in general.
536
00:34:15,320 --> 00:34:19,280
To my friends, for pointing
out my worst qualities...
537
00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:23,640
..I know you do it
because you love me.
538
00:34:25,080 --> 00:34:27,720
And that's why I loved
playing Lester.
539
00:34:29,880 --> 00:34:34,320
Because we got to see all
of his worst qualities,
540
00:34:34,360 --> 00:34:37,040
and we still grew to love him.
541
00:34:39,640 --> 00:34:42,720
It's Kevin Spacey
at full-tilt power mode.
542
00:34:42,760 --> 00:34:46,520
He brings up his faults and all the
people that have told him
543
00:34:46,560 --> 00:34:50,200
about his faults, and that makes him
a better person.
544
00:34:50,240 --> 00:34:51,680
What is that about?
545
00:34:56,560 --> 00:34:58,120
Travis Aaron Wade.
546
00:34:58,160 --> 00:35:01,720
Yeah, I just finished a film
last year with John Travolta.
547
00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:04,280
I spent some time
in the Marine Corps.
548
00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:09,320
It felt very difficult to shake,
getting back as a civilian.
549
00:35:09,360 --> 00:35:11,080
My mom asked me a simple question.
550
00:35:11,120 --> 00:35:13,120
What do you love?
And I said, movies.
551
00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:16,920
And I was at the Golden Globes,
552
00:35:16,960 --> 00:35:18,920
all the glitz and the glam.
553
00:35:18,960 --> 00:35:20,240
My publicist was great.
554
00:35:20,280 --> 00:35:21,960
We, you know, we have the champagne
in hand,
555
00:35:22,000 --> 00:35:24,280
and she's like, "All right,
so this is where you network.
556
00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:26,840
And I look over
and it's Kevin Spacey.
557
00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:29,760
And he clearly was waving at me,
like he knew me.
558
00:35:29,800 --> 00:35:33,200
The walk to Kevin was slow motion.
559
00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:36,560
You just felt like
you were getting pulled in.
560
00:35:39,680 --> 00:35:41,960
First thing he says to me is,
561
00:35:42,000 --> 00:35:43,160
"Who are you?"
562
00:35:44,320 --> 00:35:46,520
I said, "Oh, I'm Travis Wade."
563
00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:50,760
And him and I just started laughing
immediately.
564
00:35:50,800 --> 00:35:53,640
And he goes, "Do you want to go
outside and smoke a joint?"
565
00:35:53,680 --> 00:35:54,880
If it was anybody else,
566
00:35:54,920 --> 00:35:57,560
I would have been like,
"Nah, I don't really smoke weed."
567
00:35:57,600 --> 00:36:00,200
But now you're standing
opposite of this actor
568
00:36:00,240 --> 00:36:03,960
who at this point now is basically
at the top of the game.
569
00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:07,240
He was somewhat known
as like the mayor of Hollywood.
570
00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:10,440
And I remember it was that moment
where there's a point
571
00:36:10,480 --> 00:36:13,200
in American Beauty with Wes Bentley
and him,
572
00:36:13,240 --> 00:36:15,280
where they're out back smoking.
573
00:36:15,320 --> 00:36:17,280
Well, my dad interferes
less in my life when I pretend
574
00:36:17,320 --> 00:36:20,520
to be an upstanding young citizen
with a respectable job.
575
00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:22,480
Lester.
576
00:36:22,520 --> 00:36:23,840
I'm choking.
577
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:25,200
We're belly laughing.
578
00:36:25,240 --> 00:36:27,640
We've got our hands
on each other's shoulder.
579
00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:30,320
Honey, this is Ricky Fitts.
580
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:33,920
This is Ricky Fitts...
581
00:36:33,960 --> 00:36:38,480
And, literally, I just felt like
I've just got a new best friend.
582
00:36:38,520 --> 00:36:40,880
He looks at me and he's like,
there's a party tonight.
583
00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:42,480
It's at my hotel.
584
00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:44,400
And you,
585
00:36:44,440 --> 00:36:46,480
I would love to come as my guest.
586
00:36:47,520 --> 00:36:49,240
I was really, at that point
in my life,
587
00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:51,000
looking for a mentor
in the industry,
588
00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:53,840
and I extremely trusted
that I may have just found one.
589
00:36:58,680 --> 00:37:00,520
He said, you know,
come up around midnight.
590
00:37:00,560 --> 00:37:03,720
And I go up to the top floor
at the penthouse.
591
00:37:03,760 --> 00:37:06,720
The door opens, and there he is.
592
00:37:06,760 --> 00:37:07,840
It's Kevin.
593
00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:12,880
He's in a bathrobe with a Scotch,
with a joint.
594
00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:17,360
There is nobody there but us.
595
00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:22,480
And I go, "Uh, are you...?
Are you sure people are coming?"
596
00:37:22,520 --> 00:37:25,080
He goes, yeah, people come in,
they come out. I'll let them in,
597
00:37:25,120 --> 00:37:27,280
and the party gets going
as the night goes on,
598
00:37:27,320 --> 00:37:28,440
and sit, sit, sit, sit.
599
00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:30,920
Then he started asking me
questions about my career
600
00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:33,800
and what I'd been working on,
and I told him the projects that
601
00:37:33,840 --> 00:37:36,800
I had booked and my experience
and my military.
602
00:37:36,840 --> 00:37:39,600
And he loved the fact
that I was US Marine.
603
00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:42,240
And I...I just remember
looking at him.
604
00:37:42,280 --> 00:37:46,040
In his eyes, there's a thing
that just draws you into Kevin,
605
00:37:46,080 --> 00:37:47,960
just like that snake
from Jungle Book.
606
00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:49,600
And I just remember just going,
607
00:37:49,640 --> 00:37:52,560
"Like, listen,
I probably should get going."
608
00:37:52,600 --> 00:37:54,160
His face just went very straight.
609
00:37:54,200 --> 00:37:56,400
He's like, "No. Stay."
610
00:37:56,440 --> 00:37:58,160
And I said, "I'm not gay.
I've never been with a man."
611
00:37:58,200 --> 00:37:59,800
He goes, "Even better."
612
00:37:59,840 --> 00:38:02,360
He goes, "Oh, darling,
there's nothing like flipping.
613
00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:05,160
"There's nothing like flipping
a US Marine who looks like you.
614
00:38:05,200 --> 00:38:06,680
"Come on, take your shirt off."
615
00:38:06,720 --> 00:38:08,680
And I was like, "Oh, boy!"
616
00:38:11,400 --> 00:38:14,560
It wasn't a fear that physically
I was going to be raped.
617
00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:19,320
It was more of a fear that if I
don't leave here in a good light...
618
00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:24,360
..this could cost me my career.
619
00:38:24,400 --> 00:38:29,160
He put his arm against the door,
and he - krr - locked it.
620
00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:33,600
And in that moment, I knew I was in
a sell-your-soul situation...
621
00:38:34,800 --> 00:38:38,000
..because this was something
that I did not want to do...
622
00:38:39,080 --> 00:38:41,800
..but it was something that
I was considering doing
623
00:38:41,840 --> 00:38:44,400
because of something that I wanted.
624
00:38:44,440 --> 00:38:46,760
And he's got me and he's doing
this on my shoulders.
625
00:38:46,800 --> 00:38:47,800
He's like rubbing me,
626
00:38:47,840 --> 00:38:49,600
but I'm holding him,
and I'm holding him strong.
627
00:38:49,640 --> 00:38:51,960
And he goes, "But you want to."
I go, "No, I don't!"
628
00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:53,880
And I grabbed his face,
629
00:38:53,920 --> 00:38:57,760
and I planted the biggest fucking
kiss right on his fucking lips.
630
00:38:57,800 --> 00:38:59,800
Not tongue, not making out.
631
00:38:59,840 --> 00:39:01,640
I went...
"Agh!"
632
00:39:01,680 --> 00:39:04,400
And I pushed his head back
and I went, "I'm leaving."
633
00:39:06,080 --> 00:39:09,440
And I got into the elevator and
I immediately pulled out my phone
634
00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:10,880
and I called my mom.
635
00:39:13,000 --> 00:39:15,120
Think about, like,
how many guys did it,
636
00:39:15,160 --> 00:39:19,360
went through and compromised
what they really wanted to do,
637
00:39:19,400 --> 00:39:22,240
or who they were fundamentally...
638
00:39:23,240 --> 00:39:25,280
..and did it and got nothing
out of it.
639
00:39:25,320 --> 00:39:26,600
That's got to be even more...
640
00:39:27,680 --> 00:39:31,760
Like, talk about just making you
go...
641
00:39:32,920 --> 00:39:34,480
..off the Richter scale.
642
00:39:38,680 --> 00:39:40,800
What had happened in that
bathroom...
643
00:39:42,040 --> 00:39:44,160
..I felt like was leverage for me.
644
00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:47,200
Like, "Hey, I didn't go
to the Enquirer.
645
00:39:47,240 --> 00:39:49,320
"I'm going to keep your secret,
646
00:39:49,360 --> 00:39:52,400
"and you're going to help me
make my career."
647
00:39:52,440 --> 00:39:54,840
And he'd only gotten more famous.
648
00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:03,600
He won the Oscar for
American Beauty,
649
00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:06,600
and I sent a fax congratulating him
650
00:40:06,640 --> 00:40:09,520
with my cellphone number on it.
651
00:40:09,560 --> 00:40:14,440
And that's when
that second chapter occurred.
652
00:40:16,360 --> 00:40:20,520
He invited me to the Soho Grand,
where he was staying.
653
00:40:20,560 --> 00:40:22,400
He spent, like, an hour grilling me
654
00:40:22,440 --> 00:40:25,880
about whether I had been followed
by...
655
00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:28,600
This white van had been trying to
get pictures of him
656
00:40:28,640 --> 00:40:29,880
with younger guys,
657
00:40:29,920 --> 00:40:32,120
and he was very, very paranoid
658
00:40:32,160 --> 00:40:35,120
that I was working for the press.
659
00:40:35,160 --> 00:40:36,320
At a certain point,
660
00:40:36,360 --> 00:40:38,040
he kind of realised that I was
telling the truth,
661
00:40:38,080 --> 00:40:41,040
and I wasn't trying to, like,
con him.
662
00:40:41,080 --> 00:40:44,600
And that's when he put my hand
on his crotch,
663
00:40:44,640 --> 00:40:46,800
and he clearly
wanted me to jerk him off.
664
00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:50,840
I was frozen in shock,
665
00:40:50,880 --> 00:40:54,360
so that stopped quickly,
and he jerked himself off.
666
00:40:55,560 --> 00:40:57,240
And I got up and washed my hands
667
00:40:57,280 --> 00:40:59,800
and bolted out of that hotel room!
668
00:41:03,560 --> 00:41:06,480
I left New York soon after that,
669
00:41:06,520 --> 00:41:09,040
then moved out to Los Angeles.
670
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:10,440
I was broke.
671
00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:13,000
I had spent the summer
writing a script
672
00:41:13,040 --> 00:41:15,400
I thought would be perfect
for him to produce,
673
00:41:15,440 --> 00:41:16,880
and so I reached out to him.
674
00:41:16,920 --> 00:41:18,600
I had come to terms with,
675
00:41:18,640 --> 00:41:22,280
"OK, I'm willing to do something
uncomfortable
676
00:41:22,320 --> 00:41:24,080
to get something out of it."
677
00:41:25,400 --> 00:41:29,600
That began the sort of...the booty
calls, you know, the late night,
678
00:41:29,640 --> 00:41:31,200
"Hey, what are you doing?"
679
00:41:31,240 --> 00:41:34,600
Which I kept sort of deflecting,
deflecting, deflecting.
680
00:41:34,640 --> 00:41:37,160
And finally, I took the call.
681
00:41:40,440 --> 00:41:42,240
Yeah. And straight away
he picked me up.
682
00:41:42,280 --> 00:41:43,880
Pulled up his Porsche.
683
00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:47,360
He was very stressed,
684
00:41:47,400 --> 00:41:49,160
I would say, like, anxious.
685
00:41:51,200 --> 00:41:53,800
You know, within minutes,
he had whipped out his dick.
686
00:41:55,400 --> 00:41:58,200
And I was like, "Well, I guess
I'm going to try to give him head
687
00:41:58,240 --> 00:41:59,480
"and see if that works."
688
00:41:59,520 --> 00:42:03,440
There was zero attraction
or interest in me being sexual.
689
00:42:03,480 --> 00:42:07,320
I mean, it felt like that was
something that I had to do
690
00:42:07,360 --> 00:42:10,480
to get to where I wanted to go.
691
00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:13,440
I think that lasted about
five to ten seconds.
692
00:42:13,480 --> 00:42:16,280
I kind of just gagged.
693
00:42:16,320 --> 00:42:19,680
Instead of him just stopping,
694
00:42:19,720 --> 00:42:24,600
he, you know, masturbated next to me
in the car as he was driving.
695
00:42:28,920 --> 00:42:30,400
And then as soon as he climaxed,
696
00:42:30,440 --> 00:42:32,280
he, like, became
this whole other person.
697
00:42:32,320 --> 00:42:37,600
He was like this
full-on entertainer, storyteller.
698
00:42:39,400 --> 00:42:41,160
He wanted to keep driving around
699
00:42:41,200 --> 00:42:43,640
and, like, talk to me
for three hours
700
00:42:43,680 --> 00:42:46,040
with, like, cum-stained pants.
701
00:42:47,080 --> 00:42:51,760
But that whole night, he never once
asked me anything about myself.
702
00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:54,040
He never asked me about my script.
703
00:42:54,080 --> 00:42:56,920
Every time I would try to bring
it up, he didn't care.
704
00:42:56,960 --> 00:43:01,000
And that's when it really hit me,
like, there was no quid pro quo.
705
00:43:01,040 --> 00:43:03,160
He was never offering me anything.
706
00:43:03,200 --> 00:43:06,560
It was almost like I got
to be in the graces of his company.
707
00:43:06,600 --> 00:43:11,040
And that's your gift for letting me
cum all over myself next to you.
708
00:43:14,480 --> 00:43:17,320
I don't know if it was a few days
later or whatever when he called,
709
00:43:17,360 --> 00:43:19,240
and I was like,
"You know what, Kevin?
710
00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:21,920
"I'm sorry but, like, I like women.
I'm not gay."
711
00:43:21,960 --> 00:43:25,960
And he lost his shit and screaming
on the phone like,
712
00:43:26,000 --> 00:43:27,520
"I just needed a friend."
713
00:43:27,560 --> 00:43:33,480
And clearly very upset that I was
insinuating that he was gay.
714
00:43:33,520 --> 00:43:35,560
It's one thing to be like,
"Don't tell anybody."
715
00:43:35,600 --> 00:43:37,720
It's another thing to be like,
"I'm not gay."
716
00:43:37,760 --> 00:43:39,400
You know what I mean?
717
00:43:39,440 --> 00:43:40,440
Um...
718
00:43:41,600 --> 00:43:44,280
And so I guess that made me
just feel bad for him.
719
00:43:45,320 --> 00:43:48,760
You know, it's like, "Wow, man,
you really, you don't know yourself,
720
00:43:48,800 --> 00:43:51,280
"and you can't be yourself.
And that sucks."
721
00:43:58,280 --> 00:44:00,440
I didn't think I'd ever
see him again,
722
00:44:00,480 --> 00:44:04,800
but where I was at - The Whisky Bar
at the Sunset Marquis -
723
00:44:04,840 --> 00:44:07,120
lo and behold, who shows up?
724
00:44:07,160 --> 00:44:08,880
And there's Kevin.
725
00:44:08,920 --> 00:44:12,960
And he comes over and, you know,
we all say hi,
726
00:44:13,000 --> 00:44:14,760
and he said he wanted to talk to me.
727
00:44:14,800 --> 00:44:19,120
So, as we're down at the end of
the bar, there's the two gay guys -
728
00:44:19,160 --> 00:44:22,240
not super flamboyant,
but you could tell they were gay.
729
00:44:22,280 --> 00:44:28,280
And Kevin notices them and he starts
doing these voices for them
730
00:44:28,320 --> 00:44:31,840
as if they're these over-the-top
drag queens.
731
00:44:31,880 --> 00:44:37,240
But kind of in a creepy way, like
really shitty, making fun of them.
732
00:44:51,600 --> 00:44:54,640
They were just regular guys
having a drink.
733
00:44:55,760 --> 00:44:56,960
It was shocking.
734
00:44:57,000 --> 00:45:01,600
I'm like,
"What the hell is going on here?"
735
00:45:01,640 --> 00:45:03,960
"What's he doing?"
736
00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:06,960
It was kind of
my first indication...
737
00:45:08,440 --> 00:45:11,800
..that maybe he was uncomfortable
in his own skin.
738
00:45:11,840 --> 00:45:15,480
Some sort of inner self-hatred.
739
00:45:16,560 --> 00:45:18,720
I think it...it speaks volumes
740
00:45:18,760 --> 00:45:21,000
about how he feels
about his own sexuality.
741
00:45:22,040 --> 00:45:25,840
It's...it's a part of him
that he doesn't like.
742
00:45:26,920 --> 00:45:30,200
Success is both a fantastic thing
743
00:45:30,240 --> 00:45:33,440
and a little dangerous, I think.
744
00:45:33,480 --> 00:45:36,520
And so I think that one
has to always try to keep success
745
00:45:36,560 --> 00:45:38,120
a little bit at bay.
746
00:45:38,160 --> 00:45:40,880
Another thing he's tried
to keep at bay are questions
747
00:45:40,920 --> 00:45:42,520
about his sexuality.
748
00:45:43,880 --> 00:45:47,040
But questions about his sexuality
would not go away.
749
00:45:47,080 --> 00:45:49,440
So he decided he had to respond,
750
00:45:49,480 --> 00:45:52,920
choosing the overtly heterosexual
magazine Playboy
751
00:45:52,960 --> 00:45:55,920
to publicly deny that he is gay.
752
00:45:57,600 --> 00:45:59,840
So, do you have a girlfriend?
753
00:45:59,880 --> 00:46:01,040
I... I...
754
00:46:03,400 --> 00:46:06,320
Uh, I've been in a relationship
for a while. Yeah.
755
00:46:06,360 --> 00:46:07,880
With whom?
756
00:46:07,920 --> 00:46:10,160
Um, her name is Diane.
757
00:46:11,800 --> 00:46:16,160
I would never judge Kevin Spacey
in terms of choosing
758
00:46:16,200 --> 00:46:19,080
not to be a publicly out gay actor.
759
00:46:20,440 --> 00:46:24,280
Well, being in the closet, for me,
I can only really speak for me,
760
00:46:24,320 --> 00:46:26,120
it's a very lonely place.
761
00:46:26,160 --> 00:46:27,840
It's a very scary place.
762
00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:30,840
It can be a very self-loathing
place.
763
00:46:30,880 --> 00:46:34,760
It is actively damaging
to your ability
764
00:46:34,800 --> 00:46:39,360
to have normal, healthy
relationships.
765
00:46:40,840 --> 00:46:45,440
Constantly being aware of your
own behaviour and checking it,
766
00:46:45,480 --> 00:46:51,080
and censoring it, and making sure
that at no point are you slipping
767
00:46:51,120 --> 00:46:54,200
or revealing who you are
or how you're behaving.
768
00:46:54,240 --> 00:46:59,880
It also does not in any way, nor
should it, excuse abusive behaviour,
769
00:46:59,920 --> 00:47:04,240
but it can illuminate our
understanding for what's driving it.
770
00:47:06,400 --> 00:47:10,360
I don't believe
that because you're unhappy
771
00:47:10,400 --> 00:47:15,480
with who you are that you can't come
out, that you're ashamed of it,
772
00:47:15,520 --> 00:47:19,760
whatever, that that in any way
justifies the kind of aggression
773
00:47:19,800 --> 00:47:21,200
that he was showing.
774
00:47:21,240 --> 00:47:27,600
Clearly, it was homosexual
in nature, but so uncalled for.
775
00:47:27,640 --> 00:47:30,120
Unnatural, inhuman.
776
00:47:30,160 --> 00:47:31,400
Uh, no.
777
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:33,920
That shows somebody
who's screaming for help.
778
00:47:42,680 --> 00:47:44,520
For at least some of the people
who were coming forward,
779
00:47:44,560 --> 00:47:48,400
they didn't feel like they could
make an allegation against
780
00:47:48,440 --> 00:47:54,200
Kevin Spacey, because to do so
would be tantamount to outing him.
781
00:47:54,240 --> 00:47:59,720
And that gets to the pernicious
nature of the closet.
782
00:48:02,960 --> 00:48:06,720
Even just the first reaction
when I told people that he was gay,
783
00:48:06,760 --> 00:48:09,840
you'd be surprised how many people
would tell me to my face
784
00:48:09,880 --> 00:48:11,000
that, "No, he isn't gay,"
785
00:48:11,040 --> 00:48:13,720
that, "You have misunderstood
or you misinterpreted."
786
00:48:15,400 --> 00:48:19,680
So, I just thought, "You know what?
I'm just gonna keep this to myself."
787
00:48:19,720 --> 00:48:22,400
But Dawn, of all people,
788
00:48:22,440 --> 00:48:26,600
could tell that something
wasn't necessarily right.
789
00:48:26,640 --> 00:48:29,720
So I was on the show,
doing background.
790
00:48:29,760 --> 00:48:32,560
I was part of Claire's
Secret Service team.
791
00:48:32,600 --> 00:48:34,960
I did, like, five seasons
on the show,
792
00:48:35,000 --> 00:48:41,160
and as each season progressed,
things got tenser...
793
00:48:41,200 --> 00:48:43,400
..especially when you see
794
00:48:43,440 --> 00:48:45,440
a hand in a position
795
00:48:45,480 --> 00:48:47,280
that should not be there -
796
00:48:47,320 --> 00:48:50,640
hand on the back, lower back,
or a hand on the leg.
797
00:48:50,680 --> 00:48:55,640
Women can tell when
there's something off,
798
00:48:55,680 --> 00:48:58,120
something going on that's not right.
799
00:48:58,160 --> 00:49:05,320
But what really concerned me was
when Daniel comes running over to us
800
00:49:05,360 --> 00:49:09,120
and he says,
"Dawn, you gotta hide me!"
801
00:49:09,160 --> 00:49:11,040
"What's going on?"
802
00:49:11,080 --> 00:49:12,400
"Kevin's after me."
803
00:49:12,440 --> 00:49:13,440
"What?!"
804
00:49:19,280 --> 00:49:23,280
I remember telling him
how I love boxing.
805
00:49:23,320 --> 00:49:26,640
You know, I was talking myself up
like I'm this tough guy,
806
00:49:26,680 --> 00:49:28,720
I'm this great boxer,
this great fighter,
807
00:49:28,760 --> 00:49:30,960
and he's not the least bit
scared of me.
808
00:49:32,840 --> 00:49:36,840
I felt that he actually
had the power to break me down,
809
00:49:36,880 --> 00:49:39,240
because of his role in the film
810
00:49:39,280 --> 00:49:42,160
and his role as executive producer
of House of Cards.
811
00:49:43,560 --> 00:49:44,720
That terrified me.
812
00:49:47,000 --> 00:49:48,520
Where is Daniel? Hey, Daniel.
813
00:49:48,560 --> 00:49:50,280
Daniel! Oh, my God!
814
00:49:52,680 --> 00:49:55,520
Oh, you...! Ooh, look at him!
815
00:49:58,480 --> 00:49:59,840
Oi!
816
00:49:59,880 --> 00:50:02,880
That night when you came
running over to us... Mm-hm.
817
00:50:05,040 --> 00:50:06,360
..it was like
818
00:50:06,400 --> 00:50:12,840
something majorly bad had to happen
for you to do that. Mm-hm.
819
00:50:12,880 --> 00:50:16,960
So I called the union and I said,
"You need to talk to Spacey
820
00:50:17,000 --> 00:50:20,640
"because he's a sexual harassment
suit waiting to happen."
821
00:50:20,680 --> 00:50:23,960
I honestly... I did not think
that it would get that bad
822
00:50:24,000 --> 00:50:27,320
or that it even had the potential
to get that bad
823
00:50:27,360 --> 00:50:30,680
until, like...
I mean, he groped me and...
824
00:50:30,720 --> 00:50:32,240
Yeah.
825
00:50:32,280 --> 00:50:33,840
Are you serious? Yeah.
826
00:50:33,880 --> 00:50:37,760
Like, stand up. Like, it was...
He groped you in the butt?
827
00:50:37,800 --> 00:50:41,320
No, no...
He groped you in the front? Yeah.
828
00:50:41,360 --> 00:50:44,160
I didn't know Spacey groped him.
829
00:50:44,200 --> 00:50:46,080
He was young.
830
00:50:46,120 --> 00:50:48,120
He was just new in the business.
831
00:50:48,160 --> 00:50:51,560
It's sad and it should not
have happened.
832
00:50:52,720 --> 00:50:53,720
And...
833
00:50:55,160 --> 00:50:57,840
..it pisses me off.
834
00:51:02,720 --> 00:51:07,240
When you are playing a leading role,
it is also a leadership role.
835
00:51:07,280 --> 00:51:10,040
I've always believed
that you have to come on to a set
836
00:51:10,080 --> 00:51:11,720
and be a part of creating
an environment
837
00:51:11,760 --> 00:51:14,000
where people want to do
their best work.
838
00:51:14,040 --> 00:51:17,600
And when I've seen examples
of people who...
839
00:51:19,040 --> 00:51:22,760
..you know, mistreat others
on a set or...um...
840
00:51:22,800 --> 00:51:25,000
..I call them out on it.
841
00:51:25,040 --> 00:51:26,720
Is that one of your philosophies
in life? Yeah.
842
00:51:26,760 --> 00:51:29,560
Just be one of the good guys?
Yeah.
843
00:51:32,080 --> 00:51:35,840
I'm Chloe Melas.
I'm an entertainment journalist.
844
00:51:35,880 --> 00:51:38,480
We were in the throes
of the #MeToo movement.
845
00:51:38,520 --> 00:51:42,720
The allegations against Harvey
Weinstein had just been published.
846
00:51:42,760 --> 00:51:45,320
And you were hearing
about allegations
847
00:51:45,360 --> 00:51:48,480
against other famous actors.
848
00:51:53,800 --> 00:51:57,000
I had just come back
from maternity leave
849
00:51:57,040 --> 00:52:00,360
and I had been back at work
maybe a week.
850
00:52:00,400 --> 00:52:04,080
I had all these hormones raging
and I just sort of channelled it
851
00:52:04,120 --> 00:52:08,240
into this Kevin Spacey
investigation.
852
00:52:08,280 --> 00:52:12,120
I started making phone calls
to as many people as I could find
853
00:52:12,160 --> 00:52:14,400
who had either worked on
House of Cards
854
00:52:14,440 --> 00:52:17,480
or who were working
on House of Cards.
855
00:52:17,520 --> 00:52:19,480
I had some people tell me that,
you know,
856
00:52:19,520 --> 00:52:22,440
Kevin Spacey had touched them
inappropriately,
857
00:52:22,480 --> 00:52:25,880
rubbing their shoulders,
a pat on the butt,
858
00:52:25,920 --> 00:52:28,120
a lingering hug.
859
00:52:28,160 --> 00:52:31,520
He would shake their hand,
and then on point of contact,
860
00:52:31,560 --> 00:52:34,640
he would then grab their hand down
to his crotch -
861
00:52:34,680 --> 00:52:38,520
what people described as a toxic
work environment that made them
862
00:52:38,560 --> 00:52:43,000
not want to work around Kevin Spacey
or fearful to be around him,
863
00:52:43,040 --> 00:52:46,840
worried that they might
get preyed upon next.
864
00:52:46,880 --> 00:52:51,640
I spoke to one young man who told me
that while he's in the car
865
00:52:51,680 --> 00:52:58,240
with Kevin Spacey,
Kevin put his hand down his pants.
866
00:52:58,280 --> 00:53:04,040
This is his dream job that's now
turned into a total nightmare.
867
00:53:04,080 --> 00:53:06,960
In the end, after speaking to
about 200 people,
868
00:53:07,000 --> 00:53:11,680
I got eight to agree to tell me
their stories -
869
00:53:11,720 --> 00:53:16,360
stories that would cause
the House of Cards show to collapse.
870
00:53:19,160 --> 00:53:22,000
Next thing you know,
there are these allegations
871
00:53:22,040 --> 00:53:26,800
coming from across the pond,
overseas, in the UK.
872
00:53:26,840 --> 00:53:29,840
Hollywood star Kevin Spacey
taking up his new role
873
00:53:29,880 --> 00:53:32,680
at one of London's
most famous theatres.
874
00:53:32,720 --> 00:53:37,000
He pulled me in very close
with his right hand,
875
00:53:37,040 --> 00:53:41,200
and he put his left hand
down by my bum.
876
00:53:41,240 --> 00:53:44,640
It's the best job I've ever had,
cos I get to bring people together
877
00:53:44,680 --> 00:53:46,680
and be a part of creating a family.
878
00:53:46,720 --> 00:53:50,240
I just felt so small.
879
00:53:50,280 --> 00:53:54,040
I started to get, like,
scared of coming to work.
880
00:53:54,080 --> 00:53:55,800
"Is it going to happen again today?"
881
00:53:55,840 --> 00:53:59,160
Kevin Spacey receives
an honorary knighthood
882
00:53:59,200 --> 00:54:01,640
for services to British theatre.
883
00:54:01,680 --> 00:54:06,400
If this is not criminal behaviour,
it is nonetheless bad behaviour,
884
00:54:06,440 --> 00:54:10,840
and that's why it needs to be called
out and it needs to be discussed.
885
00:54:10,880 --> 00:54:14,120
The message to Kevin has to be,
"It's over."
886
00:54:14,160 --> 00:54:15,640
You know, "It's over for you."
887
00:54:34,920 --> 00:54:37,920
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