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Lot 20 is next.

The Mark Rothko "Orange, Red, Yellow,"

The Mark Rothko "Orange, Red, Yellow,"

Official YIFY movies site: YTS.MX

and $24 million starts.

$24 million, $25 million, $26 million, $27 million,

$28 million, $29 million, $30 million, $31 million,

$28 million, $29 million, $30 million, $31 million,

$32 million, $33 million,

$45 million, $53 million, $56 million...

$45 million, $53 million, $56 million...

Typically for a high-profile lot that we sell,

you're looking at two to three minutes would be sort of

an average time frame,

and for the Rothko, the bidding war lasted for seven minutes,

and for the Rothko, the bidding war lasted for seven minutes,

with over 50 bids made.

$74 million. What's that, $75 million?

$75 million, $77-million-5, and selling to Brett Spitter.

$75 million, $77-million-5, and selling to Brett Spitter.

Fair warning, all done at $77,500,000.

Fair warning, all done at $77,500,000.

Brett Spitter at $77-million-5.

Not only was this sale the world record for the artist,

Not only was this sale the world record for the artist,

at the time, it was the most expensive post-war and contemporary

artwork ever sold in the world.

artwork ever sold in the world.

I think he would have been appalled.

The auction prices now really reflect a culture in which

paintings are considered an investment

paintings are considered an investment

rather than something you really care about and want to live with.

He often said, "A painting lives in the eyes of a sensitive viewer,"

He often said, "A painting lives in the eyes of a sensitive viewer,"

and I think that particular audience was what he cared about.

I think Rothko is one of our great American artists.

I think Rothko is one of our great American artists.

A Rothko is deceptively simple and yet profound.

A Rothko is deceptively simple and yet profound.

There's nothing simple about Rothko's work.

There's nothing simple about Rothko's work.

It's actually very complex.

If you think it is simple, you should try to do it yourself.

I think my father really communicated the seriousness

I think my father really communicated the seriousness

of painting. The painting wasn't something just to look at.

It wasn't something that you appreciated because

It wasn't something that you appreciated because

it appealed simply to the senses.

I think he wanted the viewer to look inside themselves

and see what the painting brought out in them.

and see what the painting brought out in them.

I've known few people who have sat in front of Rothko for an hour,

I've known few people who have sat in front of Rothko for an hour,

and it has literally changed their life.

Mark Rothko's work opens you up in ways that you're not expecting.

Mark Rothko's work opens you up in ways that you're not expecting.

I used to think that Rothko paintings were just these

I used to think that Rothko paintings were just these

easy squares...

..and the longer I look at the Rothko paintings,

the more I see these worlds,

the more I see these worlds,

these kind of locations that he wants us to go to,

and I like that. Then it's open, you know?

What is my experience going to be is gonna be different than what

your experience is gonna be, and both of them are right.

your experience is gonna be, and both of them are right.

It's very unusual that he created something cohesively.

It's very unusual that he created something cohesively.

A century later, it can expand into a language

A century later, it can expand into a language

that we didn't know that we needed.

This chaotic time that we live in, the angst, the anxiety,

This chaotic time that we live in, the angst, the anxiety,

all of that is given a framework by Mark Rothko.

Today is a great time, great context to revisit a Mark Rothko

Today is a great time, great context to revisit a Mark Rothko

and sit in front of it for hours and hours.

and sit in front of it for hours and hours.

Well, I've played Mark Rothko on stage a few hundred times now

over the years, and I don't think I'll ever play as deep

over the years, and I don't think I'll ever play as deep

and as complicated a role again.

and as complicated a role again.

I think this is- This is my King Lear.

L-Look at the tension between the blocks of colour.

L-Look at the tension between the blocks of colour.

The first thing I connected with Mark Rothko was the fact that

he was an immigrant.

My parents were immigrants to the UK.

My parents were immigrants to the UK.

I think that particular mind-set of being taken away from your home

and going to a new country and all the issues and problems

and going to a new country and all the issues and problems

that you have to confront with that.

My father was born in Dvinsk, which was then a part

of the Russian Empire.

Dvinsk was part of the Pale of Settlement, which was this

Dvinsk was part of the Pale of Settlement, which was this

wide swath of land where Jews were allowed to live,

and anti-Semitism was rampant.

and anti-Semitism was rampant.

There was an incredible military presence in Dvinsk.

There was an incredible military presence in Dvinsk.

His brother Moise writes about the Cossacks running through town

on horseback and whipping the townspeople,

and Mark actually suggests that he has a scar on his nose

and Mark actually suggests that he has a scar on his nose

that was caused by such a whip.

My father's father and his two older brothers were conscripted into

My father's father and his two older brothers were conscripted into

the Tsar's army, and they decided that they would rather flee than fight.

It would have been very unlikely that they would have seen more than

It would have been very unlikely that they would have seen more than

a couple of winters in the army, so they decided to emigrate to the U.S.

My father left Dvinsk in 1913.

And they came by steamer to the U.S. and landed at Ellis Island.

And they came by steamer to the U.S. and landed at Ellis Island.

Between 1880 and 1924, 2.5 million Jews came to the United States

from Imperial Russia.

from Imperial Russia.

They fairly immediately got on a train to Portland, Oregon.

They fairly immediately got on a train to Portland, Oregon.

There was a relative, the Weinsteins,

who had already settled there,

who had already settled there,

and therefore it seemed like a likely place

for my grandfather to decide to try to settle.

"My mother fixed me up with one of those Buster Brown suits.

You don't know what it's like to be a Jewish kid dressed in a suit

You don't know what it's like to be a Jewish kid dressed in a suit

made in Dvinsk, not an American idea of a suit.

Traveling across America, not able to speak a word of English,

I could never forgive transplantation to a land

where I never felt at home."

Rothko arrives in this country as Markus Rothkowitz.

Rothko arrives in this country as Markus Rothkowitz.

It's an event that shapes his being his entire life.

And within less than a year of my father's arrival,

And within less than a year of my father's arrival,

my grandfather died, quite young, of cancer.

And Mark had to raise money for the family by selling newspapers.

And Mark had to raise money for the family by selling newspapers.

This was something that a lot of the immigrant kids did

and would come home beaten up because the other guys didn't want

and would come home beaten up because the other guys didn't want

another corner taken up.

He also got a job in his uncle's store,

He also got a job in his uncle's store,

the New York Outfitting Company in downtown Portland.

Things sometimes got quiet, and Mark would doodle or draw on

New York Outfitting wrapping paper.

His uncle happened to come by one day and say,

"Mark, what are you doing?"

and Mark would show him.

He says, "Uh-uh, you're not gonna be able to earn a living that way."

He says, "Uh-uh, you're not gonna be able to earn a living that way."

In high school, Markus Rothkowitz is a bit of a troublemaker,

In high school, Markus Rothkowitz is a bit of a troublemaker,

moody, intellectual, politically interested.

He's very aware of workers' rights,

He's very aware of workers' rights,

fair salaries, decent housing,

and he becomes known as a mouthy young man.

and he becomes known as a mouthy young man.

Mark Rothko graduated in three years from Lincoln High School,

Mark Rothko graduated in three years from Lincoln High School,

and there was an article in "The Oregonian" that noted that

three young men had gotten full scholarships to go to Yale University

three young men had gotten full scholarships to go to Yale University

from the graduating class of Lincoln High School.

The scholarships are withdrawn the second year because Yale

wasn't ready to have verbal, accomplished, politically inclined

wasn't ready to have verbal, accomplished, politically inclined

Jewish students in the middle of the bastion of WASP culture.

Jewish students in the middle of the bastion of WASP culture.

The second year, he supports himself by working in a laundry downtown,

and he works in a dining hall with all the swells.

and he works in a dining hall with all the swells.

He gets through his second year and decides that he can't go on,

and instead of coming home, he goes to New York.

and instead of coming home, he goes to New York.

In the art scene in New York in the '20s, it's unimaginably small.

In the art scene in New York in the '20s, it's unimaginably small.

I think everybody knew everybody, and to study modern art

in any sense, you really went to the Art Students League.

in any sense, you really went to the Art Students League.

It's a place where there were open studios and modelling sessions,

It's a place where there were open studios and modelling sessions,

and artists dropped in and connected,

got to know everybody on the scene.

got to know everybody on the scene.

"I went to New York to wander around, bum about, starve a bit.

"I went to New York to wander around, bum about, starve a bit.

Then one day, I wandered into an art class.

All the students were sketching this nude model.

I thought it was marvellous.

I thought it was marvellous.

I was intoxicated by it,

and right away I decided that was the life for me."

I think my father's approach was really a philosophical one

when I look back at how he made his decision to become a visual artist.

when I look back at how he made his decision to become a visual artist.

I think he was really searching around to look for what medium

I think he was really searching around to look for what medium

he could use to express the ideas and the emotions he wanted

to convey to the public.

My father became very friendly with Milton Avery, starting in the 1920s,

which was essential for him both to have a mentor,

which was essential for him both to have a mentor,

as an artist, someone he could really look up to and learn from and

spend time in their studio because he'd had no experience with that.

spend time in their studio because he'd had no experience with that.

The Averys actually fed him a great deal when he really had

barely 2 cents to scrape together in those early years and

particularly during the Depression.

particularly during the Depression.

I think that if you look at my father's figurative work from

that period, you can see a lot of indebtedness to Avery,

that period, you can see a lot of indebtedness to Avery,

who was painting figurative paintings,

but highly abstracted, highly stylised,

not looking to depict visual reality as we see it,

not looking to depict visual reality as we see it,

but to capture a feeling and emotion of time and place.

There are hundreds of early figurative works by my father,

There are hundreds of early figurative works by my father,

both on canvas and on paper.

His first paintings, that we know of are from those early years,

were not terribly promising.

were not terribly promising.

He doesn't seem to have a lot of facility right out of the gate.

He sticks with it for some reason, and it's a long career with

He sticks with it for some reason, and it's a long career with

wonderful twists and turns until he...

he becomes Rothko, until he finds himself, you could say.

he becomes Rothko, until he finds himself, you could say.

In the summer of 1933, Mark and his new wife, Edith,

In the summer of 1933, Mark and his new wife, Edith,

hitchhiked across the country to visit with family in Portland.

hitchhiked across the country to visit with family in Portland.

And where did they stay? Not with his mother, no.

With his sister? No.

They camped in the West Hills, somewhere in the West Hills,

They camped in the West Hills, somewhere in the West Hills,

overlooking the Willamette to the east side.

While they were up there, Mark painted the landscape.

While they were up there, Mark painted the landscape.

We saw an east side that had trees, and he gave these very sweet

We saw an east side that had trees, and he gave these very sweet

watercolour paintings to members of the family.

My family thought he was a little crazy sleeping out on the hillside

My family thought he was a little crazy sleeping out on the hillside

and hitchhiking across the country.

and hitchhiking across the country.

Whenever they came, I would have a brunch.

Whenever they came, I would have a brunch.

We had a deck outside of the house, and I'd gather all the family

that I could, and it was just a nice warm gathering.

that I could, and it was just a nice warm gathering.

I think my father's family never quite understood this whole idea

I think my father's family never quite understood this whole idea

of being an artist or certainly what his artwork was about,

and yet he remained very close to them.

They were central to his life.

They were central to his life.

That's my father, Moise. This is Albert,

That's my father, Moise. This is Albert,

and this is Mark.

I felt very close to him, even though I didn't see him very often

because he lived in New York, but I used to write letters to him.

because he lived in New York, but I used to write letters to him.

My mother used to complain that he never sent home any money.

But he was a poor starving artist.

But he was a poor starving artist.

My father's brothers were far more practical than he was,

and they went on to pursue careers as pharmacists,

and they went on to pursue careers as pharmacists,

which was the family business for a few generations,

and they were sometimes resentful that the youngest child went off

and they were sometimes resentful that the youngest child went off

in pursuing this crazy career as an artist when he had a mother to support.

Part of the family used to make fun of his paintings.

Part of the family used to make fun of his paintings.

His eldest sister honestly said to him at that time,

"I don't understand a thing about your art.

"I don't understand a thing about your art.

Mark, paint me a picture that I can understand."

So, as a dutiful brother, he did paint her a picture

So, as a dutiful brother, he did paint her a picture

that she could understand, a small picture.

It's always been remarkable to me that for the first 25 or 30 years

of his career, my father created so much artwork,

but it was all done nights and weekends

but it was all done nights and weekends

because he had a day job as a teacher,

and he was selling essentially zero paintings.

I think he must have questioned many times whether making art was

I think he must have questioned many times whether making art was

going to be the answer to what he was gonna do with his life.

We believe he struggled with depression, from everything

We believe he struggled with depression, from everything

we can piece together, in the very early 1940s.

We know he had a period, really at least a year,

We know he had a period, really at least a year,

when he did not really paint.

We also know at that time that his first marriage was not going well.

She viewed herself as a jewellery maker, as an artist.

She viewed herself as a jewellery maker, as an artist.

I don't think my father really considered her an artist,

and I think that was actually a source of a fair amount of tension

and I think that was actually a source of a fair amount of tension

between the two of them.

She wanted him to help her with her arts, and she felt she was

the one who was supporting the family, and he was set in pursuing

the one who was supporting the family, and he was set in pursuing

exactly what he was doing.

So I think it was a tumultuous relationship,

but his level of depression seems to have gone beyond

but his level of depression seems to have gone beyond

just being a reaction to what was going on around him.

Well, in the late '30s, my father was working on a series of

Well, in the late '30s, my father was working on a series of

paintings related to the New York subway.

It's a very strange and lonely scene in many ways, and, you know,

It's a very strange and lonely scene in many ways, and, you know,

that may reflect how he felt.

that may reflect how he felt.

In one way, New York was treating him well, but in another way,

it was a place where he was really struggling at the time.

They are very moving and disturbing images.

Figures almost hiding between and behind the columns,

very elongated, emaciated.

very elongated, emaciated.

There's a sense of maybe being in a catacomb.

And you can see almost the geometric configurations

And you can see almost the geometric configurations

that he's looking at and playing with,

that he will be doing in a purely abstract way 15 years later or so.

What we do here at the National Gallery, we're caring for

handmade objects that have ended up here in Washington, D.C.

handmade objects that have ended up here in Washington, D.C.

This incredibly rare treasured collection is ours to learn about,

to study, and to take care of.

to study, and to take care of.

The challenge of working with masterpieces is that they're irreplaceable.

There's a lot of responsibility on the conservator making right decisions,

There's a lot of responsibility on the conservator making right decisions,

using the right materials.

The picture I'm working on today is a late picture of a Rothko,

The picture I'm working on today is a late picture of a Rothko,

late 1969.

Picture sustained a few impact cracks from the reverse,

Picture sustained a few impact cracks from the reverse,

so the canvas was flexed and the slightly more brittle paint

on the surface cracked.

The cracks have slightly raised, and you can begin to see the white

The cracks have slightly raised, and you can begin to see the white

ground below this dark black paint.

What I am doing is just flowing the right black colour

What I am doing is just flowing the right black colour

into these cracks...

..so that you don't see them any more. The cracks just-

..so that you don't see them any more. The cracks just-

I mean, they haven't physically closed, but you no longer see

the white of a crack.

Reversibility is a key tenant of modern conservation,

with the idea being that everything we do can be safely undone.

So if you apply retouching for a loss, you want that material

So if you apply retouching for a loss, you want that material

to be very soluble 50 years from now if somebody ever needs to remove it.

to be very soluble 50 years from now if somebody ever needs to remove it.

A lot of what we do is, if you can get a picture to present well

in the gallery so that your eye keeps moving across the surface

in the gallery so that your eye keeps moving across the surface

and doesn't stop, you've accomplished a lot.

You've probably accomplished all you need to do.

Pretty much by the mid-'40s, Rothko evolved a way of painting

with very, very thin paint layers.

with very, very thin paint layers.

He stretches cotton duck canvas, and he seals it with rabbit-skin glue,

but he pigments the glue first,

but he pigments the glue first,

and then on top of that coloured layer,

then he'll work with very, very thin layers of oil paint,

very thin layers of handmade paints, where he's mixing pigment

very thin layers of handmade paints, where he's mixing pigment

in damar resin or he's mixing pigment in eggs.

If you look at any Rothko very carefully, you'll start to see

If you look at any Rothko very carefully, you'll start to see

variations in matte and gloss, variations in opacity,

and these all had to do with how he changes media.

and these all had to do with how he changes media.

I think the layering creates an aura about them.

I think they enticed us visually to enter them.

I think they enticed us visually to enter them.

The oil surface can almost push you away, the viewer,

The oil surface can almost push you away, the viewer,

whereas these layers that incorporate different materials

invite you in because some are shiny and some are not and some are

moving and some are not, and it's a...

moving and some are not, and it's a...

It's a much more engaging surface than something that's just flat.

For me, the best thing about working on Rothko is having developed

For me, the best thing about working on Rothko is having developed

this connection over many, many years, things I've worked on,

things I've instructed fellows and interns on.

things I've instructed fellows and interns on.

He's a very special painter to me.

Rothko changed his name in 1940 because of an offhand comment

Rothko changed his name in 1940 because of an offhand comment

by his dealer, who observed that she had too many Jewish artists,

and she couldn't offer him a show, and he realised that he could solve

and she couldn't offer him a show, and he realised that he could solve

this problem by shortening his name to Mark Rothko, American citizen.

this problem by shortening his name to Mark Rothko, American citizen.

My father and an Adolph Gottlieb began to work on

My father and an Adolph Gottlieb began to work on

a series of paintings which were highly influenced by Greek myth.

Whereas traditional American painting wanted to create the

sense of depth, the space of the real world on the canvas,

sense of depth, the space of the real world on the canvas,

Rothko and Gottlieb abandoned that, and they, in very modern,

contemporary voice, create a flat picture.

In 1943, there's a major exhibition in which Adolph Gottlieb and

Mark Rothko participate.

Mark Rothko participate.

It is the first foray by the modern painters of New York.

It is a gauntlet thrown down against the establishment of American art.

It is a gauntlet thrown down against the establishment of American art.

It's reviewed in "The New York Times" by Edward Jewell,

a conservative art critic, who pans the exhibition,

a conservative art critic, who pans the exhibition,

who finds in these fledgling modernists the immigrant voice,

who finds in these fledgling modernists the immigrant voice,

the non-American voice, and he's very critical.

Rothko and Gottlieb write a letter to "The New York Times,"

Rothko and Gottlieb write a letter to "The New York Times,"

which has now gone down in history because it's really

a manifesto and it's not just a complaint.

"We salute this honest, we might say cordial, reaction to towards

"We salute this honest, we might say cordial, reaction to towards

our obscure paintings,

and we appreciate the gracious opportunity that is being offered us

and we appreciate the gracious opportunity that is being offered us

to present our views.

We do not intend to defend our pictures.

They make their own defence."

They make their own defence."

"Times" publishes the whole thing, and midway through,

they articulate these five points.

they articulate these five points.

Number one, "To us art is an adventure into an unknown world,

which can be explored only by those willing to take the risks."

which can be explored only by those willing to take the risks."

Number two, "The world of the imagination is fancy-free

and violently opposed to common sense."

and violently opposed to common sense."

Three, "It is our function as artists to make the spectator

see the world our way, not his way." Hmm.

see the world our way, not his way." Hmm.

Number four, "We are for flat forms because they destroy illusion

Number four, "We are for flat forms because they destroy illusion

and reveal truth."

Number five. "There is no such thing..."

"as good painting about nothing."

"We assert that the subject is crucial..."

"We assert that the subject is crucial..."

"which is tragic and timeless."

"Sincerely yours, Adolph Gottlieb..."

"and Markus Rothko."

"and Markus Rothko."

It's wonderful.

I think it tells a lot about that particular time that it was written.

I think it tells a lot about that particular time that it was written.

It introduces language which will become the common language of

art studios in New York.

art studios in New York.

They were breaking away from a tradition, and in so doing,

you almost have to destroy the tradition you're breaking away from.

you almost have to destroy the tradition you're breaking away from.

It makes perfect sense to me that they would feel the way they did

because they were striking out, doing something new and different.

because they were striking out, doing something new and different.

They knew it, too.

In the mid- to late 1940s in New York, there was a new artistic

In the mid- to late 1940s in New York, there was a new artistic

movement emerging that was uniquely American,

and it came to be known as abstract expressionism.

A group of artists that included Jackson Pollock, Willem de Kooning,

A group of artists that included Jackson Pollock, Willem de Kooning,

Lee Krasner, Joan Mitchell, Clyfford Still,

along with Rothko and Gottlieb,

along with Rothko and Gottlieb,

and they were experimenting with the voice and the look of art.

Before this time, American painters, they travelled to Europe,

Before this time, American painters, they travelled to Europe,

then they went home, and nobody really heard of them again.

Right after World War Il, all of that changes.

Right after World War Il, all of that changes.

I think the abstract expressionists were interested in big ideas,

I think the abstract expressionists were interested in big ideas,

big concepts based in human energy and human response.

They launched into the abstraction.

They launched into the abstraction.

You're standing in front of a colour or standing in front of an abstract form

You're standing in front of a colour or standing in front of an abstract form

and standing in front of large paintings, I mean,

very large paintings.

I mean, it was just such a huge achievement or a challenge,

I mean, it was just such a huge achievement or a challenge,

excitement to paint something that large.

And this is the great moment for Rothko in which the physical act

And this is the great moment for Rothko in which the physical act

of painting becomes the picture the viewer experiences,

floating colour, wiping it, re-layering it to discover

the elegance of reflected light and colour.

the elegance of reflected light and colour.

These painters are the talk of the world, and, in some sense,

the centre of the art world shifts from Europe,

the centre of the art world shifts from Europe,

from Paris in particular, to the U.S. and to New York.

It's a huge moment that we're- We're still dealing with.

In the mid-1940s,

my father moves into his first purely abstracted style,

which has come to be known as the Multiforms.

which has come to be known as the Multiforms.

I believe my father in some way began to feel that the human figure

I believe my father in some way began to feel that the human figure

interfered with his ability to directly connect with his viewer.

"It was with the utmost reluctance that I found the figure could not

serve my purposes, but a time came when none of us could use

serve my purposes, but a time came when none of us could use

the figure without mutilating it."

There were a lot of ideas that he was playing out with the Multiforms,

There were a lot of ideas that he was playing out with the Multiforms,

and I feel a certain exuberance, in a refined way.

I mean, I don't think he was an exuberant person,

I mean, I don't think he was an exuberant person,

but I-I feel a sense of excitement in them, that he...

he was getting into something that was beginning to work.

There's a technical term called Nihonga,

which is Japanese-style painting.

Feel the paintings done on paper, stretched over canvas,

Feel the paintings done on paper, stretched over canvas,

starts with 80 to 100 layers of very thin mineral pigments,

starts with 80 to 100 layers of very thin mineral pigments,

just to get it started,

and, yes, I am directly quoting Rothko when I'm layering.

and, yes, I am directly quoting Rothko when I'm layering.

I think he would have loved the material of Nihonga.

It is slow art and slow work,

but I think part of the layering is

but I think part of the layering is

to capture that sense of time in the layers.

Mark Rothko not only painted in layers, but he thought in layers.

It's very clear from his writings.

It's very clear from his writings.

He was able to integrate and even construct a way

the colour fields work,

the colour fields work,

and these layers work in very subtle ways that

allow for a new world to open up.

allow for a new world to open up.

Just magical to me.

That doesn't make sense, but that's what you experience.

That doesn't make sense, but that's what you experience.

Mark Rothko painted the abyss...

..and he's inviting us to stand on that abyss.

..and he's inviting us to stand on that abyss.

Now, you can say that is a despair-filled experience,

but I think it's also an invitation to hope.

I don't mean this sentimental feeling of hope,

I don't mean this sentimental feeling of hope,

but I mean that it makes me want to go into my studio and paint,

and that is my act of hope.

and that is my act of hope.

My father met my mother shortly after his first marriage ended.

My father met my mother shortly after his first marriage ended.

Well, this photo, it's actually one of the few pictures I have

as a baby with my father,

as a baby with my father,

and there he certainly looks like a pretty doting father.

Maybe even at the age of 47, 48, he enjoyed having one of his own

Maybe even at the age of 47, 48, he enjoyed having one of his own

instead of just teaching children.

I would consider my father a very concerned father,

certainly a very loving and involved father.

In some ways, he is my vision of the classical father,

who was gone 9:00 to 6:00 and, you know, came home for dinner

and spent a little time with me in the evening.

and spent a little time with me in the evening.

Some of my fondest memories are actually Sunday mornings with him.

Some of my fondest memories are actually Sunday mornings with him.

My primary memories of them are sitting in bed, reading the paper,

My primary memories of them are sitting in bed, reading the paper,

always smoking, always smoking,

and their sheets had multiple, multiple cigarette burns

and holes in them.

and holes in them.

It's just- It's, like, that's literally burned into my memory.

In 1949, Rothko develops the style that will make him one of

the most recognised artists of the 20th century.

the most recognised artists of the 20th century.

He finds a format where he can make full and direct expression

of the ideas he's wanted to express for so long.

of the ideas he's wanted to express for so long.

For me, the excitement in '49 to '50 are the way he celebrates the edge.

For me, the excitement in '49 to '50 are the way he celebrates the edge.

Colour blocks come together,

and they begin to sit in relationship to each other.

It is that gap between in which the magic begins to develop.

It is that gap between in which the magic begins to develop.

There's a turning point in your life that you can just mark and say,

There's a turning point in your life that you can just mark and say,

"This is when I found my voice," voice that is a destination

of everything that you've done in the past,

and that is a fertile place for an artist.

He was always in self-doubt mode,

always struggled with his own internal voice.

always struggled with his own internal voice.

So when Rothko found his style,

So when Rothko found his style,

he settled in that place of belonging.

It represented the penultimate expression of that thing that Rothko

It represented the penultimate expression of that thing that Rothko

had looked for his entire life.

He found a place to live and celebrate

He found a place to live and celebrate

and a vehicle for his anguish.

My father and Pollock and de Kooning and Motherwell quickly become

household names through articles in places like Life Magazine.

household names through articles in places like Life Magazine.

Suddenly, these were the wunderkinds at age 50 of the art world.

By the '50s, when Rothko hits his stride, he starts to sell.

Betty Parsons Gallery represents him, and she does a series of

Betty Parsons Gallery represents him, and she does a series of

five shows, each of them more and more successful.

I was walking up to my house last week, and a couple was passing.

The lady looks inside my window and says,

"Ooh, I wonder who owns all those Rothkos."

"Ooh, I wonder who owns all those Rothkos."

Just like that, I've become a noun... a Rothko.

A commodity. An overmantel.A what?

A commodity. An overmantel.A what?

The overmantels, you know, those paintings doomed to become

mere decoration over the fireplace in the fancy-schmancy penthouse.

mere decoration over the fireplace in the fancy-schmancy penthouse.

Oh, they say to you, "I need something to work with the sofa."

You understand?

"Something bright and cheery for the breakfast nook, which is orange.

"Something bright and cheery for the breakfast nook, which is orange.

You got something in orange or burnt umber or seafoam green?

Here's a paint chip from the Sherwin-Williams.

Oh, and can you chop it down to fit the sideboard?"

Oh, and can you chop it down to fit the sideboard?"

In 1958, the Seagram's Corporation finished constructing

an amazing modernist building on Park Avenue,

an amazing modernist building on Park Avenue,

and within this modernist masterpiece,

there's going to be a beating heart

and it's gonna be a restaurant called The Four Seasons.

and it's gonna be a restaurant called The Four Seasons.

And architect Philip Johnson went to Mark Rothko and said,

"Why don't you create a series of murals that could go in our dining room?"

"Why don't you create a series of murals that could go in our dining room?"

The commission was $35,000, and in 1958,

The commission was $35,000, and in 1958,

that was a huge amount of money,

reputed to be the most an artist had ever been paid in America

for a series of works. My first murals.

for a series of works. My first murals.

Imagine a frieze all around the room, a continuous narrative filling

the walls one to another, each a new chapter,

the walls one to another, each a new chapter,

the story unfolding.

You look, and they are there, inescapable and inexorable.

I mean, of all the patrons who could have approached Mark Rothko,

I mean, of all the patrons who could have approached Mark Rothko,

Philip Johnson was unique because he was a provocative voice

in American design and American art, and Rothko admired him greatly.

in American design and American art, and Rothko admired him greatly.

So for him, it was the perfect combination of voices

creating modern art.

creating modern art.

The Seagram paintings,

they're an artist experimenting with much less colour.

they're an artist experimenting with much less colour.

This is an enormous challenge for an artist to take on,

an artist that's known primarily for colour.

He's doing something very different,

and I think they must have been very hard for him.

There is some question about what he was told, what he understood

about what the nature of that restaurant was going to be.

His story was that he would be painting for an employees' dining room and,

His story was that he would be painting for an employees' dining room and,

as an old Socialist, that made him feel, you know,

reasonably comfortable, but I think he may have known more than that.

reasonably comfortable, but I think he may have known more than that.

In the fall of 1959, they were invited to dinner at the restaurant,

In the fall of 1959, they were invited to dinner at the restaurant,

which since then had been completed, but I remember their coming home.

which since then had been completed, but I remember their coming home.

My father was so upset by his visit to the restaurant

that he came in yelling, you know, that he was absolutely going to

that he came in yelling, you know, that he was absolutely going to

withdraw from this, and I'm sure my mother was trying to calm him down.

Philip? This is Rothko.

Listen, I went to the restaurant last night, and let me tell you,

Listen, I went to the restaurant last night, and let me tell you,

anyone who eats that kind of food for that kind of money

in that kind of joint will never look at a painting of mine.

in that kind of joint will never look at a painting of mine.

Now, I-I-I'm sending the money back, and I'm keeping the pictures.

Ye... No offence.

Yeah, well, this is the way it goes. Good luck to you, buddy.

I think there must have been a liberation in that call,

I think there must have been a liberation in that call,

in realising it was the truest version of himself.

My father was nothing if not principled, and ultimately he cared

more about the well-being of his artwork and the expressive message

more about the well-being of his artwork and the expressive message

that he was trying to bring than the prestige of having

the Seagram commission and even the $35,000, which he sorely needed.

the Seagram commission and even the $35,000, which he sorely needed.

And so those murals, which he had laboured on for months

and started again and rebuilt just went into storage.

and started again and rebuilt just went into storage.

They effectively were hidden.

I think the Seagram mural process helped define Rothko

as an individual.

It comes back to his questioning, his politics, and his reality

as an artist, the artist as underdog,

as an artist, the artist as underdog,

as thorn in the side of society, as observer.

In 1964, my father was commissioned by the de Menil family of Houston

In 1964, my father was commissioned by the de Menil family of Houston

to create what was then going to be a Catholic chapel

on the University of St. Thomas campus in Houston.

on the University of St. Thomas campus in Houston.

I think my father felt that John and Dominique really understood

his seriousness as an artist and

his seriousness as an artist and

the deeper meaning or the deeper content behind his paintings.

"The magnitude on every level of experience and meaning of the task

"The magnitude on every level of experience and meaning of the task

in which you have involved me exceeds all my preconceptions,

and it is teaching me to extend myself beyond what I thought

and it is teaching me to extend myself beyond what I thought

was possible for me.

For this, I thank you."

It must have been a huge compliment to him.

It must have been a huge compliment to him.

Not only, in this case, was he given a space as he was at the Seagram's,

Not only, in this case, was he given a space as he was at the Seagram's,

here he had an opportunity for the space and the paintings

to work together, to take the works of art to another dimension.

to work together, to take the works of art to another dimension.

In order to create this space,

he found a carriage house on 69th Street in New York.

he found a carriage house on 69th Street in New York.

It allowed him to re-create three walls of the chapel.

I frequently saw him sitting and agonising about the paintings,

and I mean down to the inch, down to every layering of paint,

and I mean down to the inch, down to every layering of paint,

the exact heights of the different panels.

the exact heights of the different panels.

I visited my father in the studio many times as a child,

and although I never saw him paint, because he really did not

and although I never saw him paint, because he really did not

like people to watch him paint -

it was really a solitary journey for him -

he set up long rolls of paper for me to paint on and was very encouraging,

he set up long rolls of paper for me to paint on and was very encouraging,

and I was just thrilled to be in that space

and spending time with him.

I remember his warmth and his enthusiasm about me being there with him.

I remember his warmth and his enthusiasm about me being there with him.

The Rothko Chapel is very much dark paintings.

The Rothko Chapel is very much dark paintings.

An urban legend is that he painted these paintings 'cause he was so depressed.

They were a sign, an omen of his upcoming death.

They were a sign, an omen of his upcoming death.

I don't think it was that at all.

I look at it that it was a natural progression of where he was going.

I look at it that it was a natural progression of where he was going.

He had done so much with colour.

He was a master of colour and its ability to affect the viewer.

His next step was to take the challenge to eliminate it.

Could he still make paintings?

Could he still make works of art that had that effect?

Could he still make works of art that had that effect?

To enter into Rothko Chapel is

To enter into Rothko Chapel is

to enter into a person's soul.

It's kind of a Zen experience.

To be surrounded by these works...

To be surrounded by these works...

..and feel your way into a painting rather than seeing them,

..and feel your way into a painting rather than seeing them,

you can directly go to the emotions, the feeling,

and that's a contribution that I think very few artists have ever reached.

and that's a contribution that I think very few artists have ever reached.

The Rothko Chapel remains, I think, a very difficult space for me.

It's one that I don't walk into without thinking

It's one that I don't walk into without thinking

that I'm going to spend some time there.

The chapel doesn't just invite.

The chapel doesn't just invite.

It really demands the viewer to spend time

and think about the big questions.

I like being in the chapel because I like the sense of being with self,

and it's really a remarkable sensation to go in the chapel

and it's really a remarkable sensation to go in the chapel

that's quiet and cool and to sit and to just look at these paintings

that's quiet and cool and to sit and to just look at these paintings

and to see the daylight moving through it.

They're not individual paintings.

The work of art is the entire experience.

The work of art is the entire experience.

It's the space. It's the light.

It's the paintings.

It's a wonderful experience. I encourage everyone to do it.

It's a wonderful experience. I encourage everyone to do it.

Rothko finishes the chapel murals in 1967, and they go into storage.

Rothko finishes the chapel murals in 1967, and they go into storage.

The chapel won't open until 1971.

It was a moment at which he had completed the most important work

of his life, in his mind, and then in April 1968,

of his life, in his mind, and then in April 1968,

he suffers a dissecting aortic aneurysm.

he suffers a dissecting aortic aneurysm.

It is one of the most serious things that can happen to you,

short of a heart attack or stroke.

And for the next year and a half, he struggles.

And for the next year and a half, he struggles.

His doctor doesn't want him to work on canvas.

Physically, he can't lift his arms over 40 degrees.

Physically, he can't lift his arms over 40 degrees.

It's actually a small miracle that he survived this

because it was a significant- It was a large rupture.

Only mode of treatment was to lower the blood pressure fairly extremely,

Only mode of treatment was to lower the blood pressure fairly extremely,

and I think, you know, that not only exhausted him, but,

and I think, you know, that not only exhausted him, but,

you know, may have contributed in itself to his depression, as well.

After that time,

he really was limited in what he could do with his paintings.

he really was limited in what he could do with his paintings.

However, it's interesting because that was perhaps his...

One of his most prolific six to eight months of his entire career.

One of his most prolific six to eight months of his entire career.

He starts what have become known as the Black on Gray canvases,

as well as a series of ambitious large-scale works on paper.

as well as a series of ambitious large-scale works on paper.

And then, surprisingly, a group of large papers in pastels,

And then, surprisingly, a group of large papers in pastels,

which is perhaps the most amazing,

a real departure also from what he had ever done.

I believe now, looking back, that he was struggling with

an underlying depressive illness.

Certainly there were family problems.

Certainly there were family problems.

He had separated from my mother, which was difficult.

He was living in the studio, which must have been a difficult setting,

He was living in the studio, which must have been a difficult setting,

I think a depressing setting in a lot of ways.

On February 25, 1970, some time in the early hours of the morning,

as far as we know, my father took his own life, um...

as far as we know, my father took his own life, um...

..and he was found the next morning by a young man who had been

..and he was found the next morning by a young man who had been

assisting him in the studio during that period, and, um...

..only subsequently did my mother come to the studio and see him.

I was surprised, but not as devastated as when my mother

I was surprised, but not as devastated as when my mother

told me how it had happened.

My first reaction was that he had died of something related

My first reaction was that he had died of something related

to his illness.

My father had worked for four years exclusively on the chapel commission.

My father had worked for four years exclusively on the chapel commission.

He did not live to see it.

He died just as construction was beginning.

So all plans had been completed,

but he never was able to see the space himself.

but he never was able to see the space himself.

But he did have the experience of the mural in his studio,

so he certainly had a sense of it, and he was very proud of it.

so he certainly had a sense of it, and he was very proud of it.

He had his official portrait taken, obviously satisfied with them.

People definitely seek out the Rothko room here at Tate Modern.

I think we can confidently say that it's seen by millions

of people every year.

I think one would like to believe that there is a sense of

I think one would like to believe that there is a sense of

the longevity of the artist through this room.

It did become a space which is in tune with Rothko's own wishes

about it.

It is a place to decompress and to think about bigger issues in life.

It is a place to decompress and to think about bigger issues in life.

People are still obsessing about his work, and his work is still

being analysed and re-evaluated.

being analysed and re-evaluated.

I think he would have been very happy with that.

I mean, I think the fact that people are still engaged in a dialogue,

in a relationship with his work probably the best thing

in a relationship with his work probably the best thing

any artist could wish for.

Part of what he wanted was

future generations to find his work

so inspiring and challenging.

so inspiring and challenging.

And that impossibility of Mark Rothko is a puzzle

And that impossibility of Mark Rothko is a puzzle

that I want to be part of, to open up,

not to solve, but to open up to the next generation and beyond.

not to solve, but to open up to the next generation and beyond.

"The most important tool the artist fashions through constant practice

is the faith in his ability to produce miracles

when they are needed.

when they are needed.

Pictures must be miraculous."

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