All language subtitles for Myth.of.the.Zodiac.Killer.S01E01.1080p.WEB.h264-EDITH[eztv.re]_track3_[eng]

**

**

**

Man: Five murders.

Somebody who says he committed
all and will commit yet more.

Beeson:
The Zodiac Killer case

is a classic
unsolved American crime.

Jennings: The fact that we're
still here talking about him

50-plus years later
is a testament

to what he created
in terms of mystery.

Man: The Zodiac Killer
puzzled authorities

with a number of coded letters

sent to newspapers
and law enforcement.

Dr. Ho: The styles of
the letters, the cryptograms,

the fact that the Zodiac Killer
had information

that wasn't widely available
to the public...

all point to this being
one killer.

**

Butterfield:
I think the most logical
explanation is that one person

was responsible for the crimes
and the letters

and that that person
just got away with it

and hasn't been identified.

**

**

Horan: When you look
at the whole picture,

the ballistics don't match
from one case to the next,

the fingerprints don't match
from one case to the next,

the witness descriptions
and survivor descriptions

of the killer don't match.

Nothing actually connects
any two of these murders

to any other murder,
let alone to the letters.

But the more time that goes on,

detectives believe more and more
in the "Zodiac,"

and it really does start
to skew their investigations

toward certain suspects,
away from certain suspects.

**

Man: This description,
just to clarify,

was from the three students.

This is the sketch
from San Francisco.

Man #2: Not even close.

Chambers:
Never been interviewed

or never talked about her
to anybody.

That's why I wanted
to talk to you --

to set the record straight.

Jensen: I've never
talked about it.

If I am one of
the only witnesses,

I just assumed
he might come for me.

Woman: I just always think
about what she'd be like

if she had a chance to grow up.

[ Sniffles ]

Nock: I have to ask you.
Did you kill Darlene?

Nock:
This is the first time

the 32 Zodiac letters have
been analyzed in this way --

using computational linguistics
and artificial intelligence.

Horan: Unlocking the mystery
of those letters and ciphers

is the key to blowing
this whole case wide open.

The evidence proves...

there is no Zodiac Killer.

Man: Somebody says he committed
all five murders

and will commit yet more.

Man #2:
David Faraday. Betty Lou.

Two really good kids.

Man #3: Zodiac. The symbol
of terror in San Francisco.

Woman: I miss her so much.

[ Indistinct voices ]

-Good morning, sir.
-Good morning. [ Chuckles ]

Nock: Okay.
Why don't you settle in?

Man: Thomas Horan interview.
Take 1.

**

They had a complete lack
of communication.

Horan: I got interested
in the Zodiac case

because nobody has come close to
cracking this for over 50 years.

**

I originally started out
as an insurance investigator,

but I got tired of seeing people

get away with fraud
and even murder,

so I got into
educational publishing

and then eventually
went back to school

and got all my degrees

and became an English professor
and an author.

Along the way,
I've been a journalist,

and I'd worked in banks,
as well,

and I learned a lot
about forgery.

**

One famous element
of the Zodiac Killer story

is that the only evidence
police had

that there was a single person
committing these murders

was the Zodiac Killer letters.

"This is the Zodiac speaking."

Jennings: "I am the killer of
the two teenagers last Christmas

and the girl last 4th of July."

"I am the murderer
of the taxi driver."

Horan: I'd had some experience
reviewing homicide cases

as an insurance investigator,
and I was curious.

Did these letters really line up
with the actual evidence?

So I spent hundreds of hours
reviewing that material.

And the more I studied
these letters

and compared them to
the actual facts in each case,

I made a very surprising
discovery.

It wasn't just that the story
that we're all familiar with

about the Zodiac Killer
was wrong.

It's the truth about
the Zodiac Killer case

is more bizarre
and more interesting

than anybody ever suspected.

There was no serial killer.

There was no single killer
involved in these murders.

And the person
writing the letters

didn't commit
any of the murders.

The Zodiac Killer
is a fictional character.

He's a literary invention.

Nock: So you're telling me
that all the investigators,

all the reporters,
all the online sleuths...

Gary Francis Poste.

It's been William Grant.

Claiming that
he was the Zodiac Killer.

Nock: All the people that have
looked at the Zodiac case

for the last 50-plus years,
they've all got it wrong?

Bingo!

Falzon: It is my belief
that this is one man

who randomly committed
vicious crimes

for his own self-satisfaction.

**

Butterfield:
I believe that one person

was responsible for the crimes
and the letters

and that that person
just got away with it

and hasn't been identified.

**

Nock: I'm Andrew Nock, and
I've been making documentaries

since the 1990s.

And there's no more famous case
than the Zodiac murders.

Coming into this investigation,

I believed all the murders
were committed by one person...

and all those letters were
written by that same person --

the Zodiac.

**

You're plugged in live to
"The Stones Unturned Podcast."

Nock: So when I ran into
Thomas Horan's theory online,

it was shocking.

The three pieces
of the bloody shirt

actually prove the letters
are a hoax.

His theory
is the most compelling

and the most out-there
that I've ever heard.

**

Man: Duffy Jennings interview.
Take 1.

Nock: So, the theory
I'm investigating

comes from Thomas Horan.

He believes that the murders
were all committed

by separate
individuals.

Uh, well, I've never heard that,
first of all.

It's the first time
I've ever heard that.

I was recently asked
in an interview

if I would be willing to debate
Thomas Horan, and I said no.

You might as well debate
a ham sandwich.

Nock: What do you say
to this theory

that there isn't one killer
and one letter writer?

I think it's a really
interesting theory.

I mean, he calls it a hoax,
right?

Yeah. I was asked
by two or three people

to try to debunk
that theory.

And my initial response
was, "Why?"

This case is absolutely ripe for
something like a hoax theory,

where you have one entity
or person

or persons
committing the murders,

and then someone else
taking credit for the murders

by writing the letters.

Nock: That really surprises me,
considering I've read your book,

and the professor's theory
is nothing like yours.

It obviously is a contrastive
theory to mine,

but I liked a lot
of aspects of it,

and it's a theory that I would
personally more gravitate to

if I didn't already
have my own.

Falzon: The realm of possibility
is infinite.

You can come up
with any narrative you want.

But show me something
I could follow up.

Speculation --
that doesn't solve cases.

I'm asking you, prove it.

Nock: Exactly.
We have to prove it.

Let's go down the rabbit hole.

What if
there is no Zodiac Killer?

Horan:
We need to take another look

at each and every one
of these cases,

look at what
the real evidence was,

what the witnesses really said,

look into
the victims' backgrounds,

and find out who had a motive

to kill each and every one
of these people

instead of looking for a serial
killer who never existed.

**

**

[ Trolley bell dings ]

* It's the time of the season *

* When love runs high *

Richardson: The Summer of Love
happens in summer of 1967,

and by that time, there had been

a lot of
countercultural activity.

* It's the time of the season *

* For loving *

It was a story
built for television --

outlandish costumes,
very colorful,

young people
really enjoying themselves.

There was a kind of
youthful rebellion in the air.

Man: These were the so-called
flower children,

restless fugitives
from Middle America.

Come here to smoke dope,
dance in the streets,

and, in some marvelous
but undefined way,

change the world.

Jennings: All of that glow
of the Summer of Love

gradually wore off into 1968.

In '68, of course, we had
the Martin Luther King

and Bobby Kennedy
assassinations.

You had the big riots

at the Democratic Convention
in Chicago that fall.

So a lot was going on
in the country politically,

most of it geared toward
resistance to the Vietnam War.

**

Richardson: When the hippies
start heading for the hills

is when the scene
in San Francisco

loses its kind of
utopian spirit.

Very quickly the whole scene
kind of hardened.

It wasn't really about expanding
consciousness anymore.

* It's the time of the season *

Methamphetamine and heroin
and harder drugs

began to take hold.

[ Woman screaming ]

[ Siren wails ]

Well, the Zodiac Killer
enters the scene

right about this same time.

**

**

Butterfield:
16-year-old Betty Lou Jensen

and 17-year-old David Faraday

were out on what has been called
their first official date.

They told their parents that
they would be home by 11:00 p.m.

and they were going
to a school function.

**

Unfortunately, they decided

to go to Lake Herman Road
instead,

and they were still there
after 11:00 p.m.,

sitting in David's
Rambler station wagon.

[ Radio static]

**

At some point, another vehicle
pulled up alongside them...

**

...and a man got out.

**

**

[ Gunshot ]

There were shots fired
into the back window

and even into the roof
of the Rambler.

And at some point, the victims

escaped from the passenger side
of the car.

[ Gunshot ]

**

[ Gunshot ]

David Faraday was shot
once in the head.

And Betty Lou Jensen was shot
five times in the back.

She was found about 20 or so
feet away from the vehicle,

and the belief is that
the killer shot her in the back

as she was trying to escape.

Man: What has the investigation
brought up to date today?

Well, we checked -- we secured
the crime scene last night

and we searched the area

and we went back at daybreak
this morning.

Have you any idea of the motive
at all? Was it robbery?

There was no
robbery motive.

We have no motive
at this time.

Beeson:
There was no immediate claim
to that crime after it happened.

It wasn't until late July 1969

that there was even
a mention of that crime.

That was the first time
a letter was sent

where Zodiac took credit for it.

**

Horan:
The only so-called evidence

that does link
any of these murders together

is these letters,

but there's absolutely nothing
about the murder

of David Faraday
and Betty Lou Jensen

that would indicate
a random crime of opportunity

by some serial killer.

From studying
the witness statements

to ballistics evidence,
all the other evidence,

I have concluded that the killer

did not arrive
at the scene alone.

And I believe I can prove it.

**

Nock: We are on Lake Herman
Road, and we're going to look

for the first murder site
of David and Betty Lou.

Well, the reason
why I want to come here

with you, Thomas,
right now is,

you suggest that there were
two people in the car

that killed
David and Betty Lou.

It wasn't a lone
serial killer.

Which would completely
blow apart

the whole
Zodiac Killer story.

Right.

So, I printed out
the police sketches

that we're going to refer to
and we're going to try

and re-create the positions
of the cars,

the bodies,
and the bullet casings.

Let's see if that
tells us a story.

A story that most people
don't know.

**

Horan: In the so-called
Zodiac Killer case,

I can't stop thinking about the
fact that none of these people

and their families
ever got any justice.

And there's something wrong
with that.

There was a young lady.

We were friends,
and we dated a few times,

and we went to the University
of Illinois at the same time.

And several years later,
she was murdered by --

turned out to be
by somebody else I knew.

That was a tough pill
to swallow,

but at least her family
and her friends --

we know who did it.

He was arrested,
he was prosecuted,

he was sent to prison.

That doesn't bring back
the person that we lost,

but it brings some closure

and it does help the survivors
move on,

if we just know who did it.

**

Nock: Okay, that night,
an eyewitness named James

claims to have seen two cars
on Lake Herman Road.

What I have here is a diagram
James drew for the police.

He definitely
saw two cars --

a station wagon
and another vehicle.

James said that the cars
were about 10 feet apart.

And then a quarter of a mile
down the road,

he thought he heard a shot.

Okay, so, I'm gonna call in
part of our production team.

They're gonna bring in
another vehicle

to this position
right here.

Can you guys bring in
the other car?

Man: Copy, copy.

According to the police report,
Betty Lou was found

28.6 feet from the car...

and David only inches
from the car.

There were 10 bullet casings
found around their vehicle.

One casing in particular
was found 20 feet away,

near where the witness said
a second car was parked.

So let's do it from here.
That's good.

So, this is 20 feet
from the car, right here.

Right.
Okay.

So, explain to me
why this is significant.

Look where that
one shell casing is.

This suggests someone

got out of the passenger side
of the second car,

stepped around
right about here,

fired over
the top of his car,

into the back
of the station wagon.

**

That would be just about
exactly how far

a .22-caliber target pistol
would eject a shell.

Nock: So, how does this
demonstrate

that it was a second person
in the car

and not the driver that
shot David and Betty Lou?

Well, why would the driver

get out of the driver's side
of the car

and then walk around his car
all the way over here,

carefully put one over the top
of the second car

and into the back of
Betty Lou and David's car

and then walk back around and
get in his car and drive away?

That explanation
doesn't make any sense.

The most logical, the simplest
explanation is the killer

arrives in the passenger side
of the second car.

So he must have had
accomplices,

so this is not
a lone serial killer.

**

Horan:
Another myth of these murders

is that there was
no apparent motive.

But once we get to know the
victims, David and Betty Lou,

it turns out there was
an obvious and powerful motive

for someone
to murder these kids.

[ Bell tolling ]

Beeson:
David Faraday was a Eagle Scout.

He received a God & Country
Award from the Boy Scouts,

one of the highest awards you
can receive in the Boy Scouts.

He was on the wrestling team.

Betty Lou Jensen
was 16 years old,

and she was a junior
at Hogan High School.

Very pretty girl.

Her father worked
for Pacific Gas and Electric.

Two really good kids.

**

Watson: I met Betty Lou when
we were in the fourth grade.

This is me and Betty Lou
at sixth-grade graduation.

Is this Betty Lou
on the right?

The short one, yeah.

Here's another picture
of Betty,

but I don't know
when that one was taken.

"Diane, have fun,
you nut.

Good luck with the person
you want good luck with.

Love..." And she used to
sign things "BLJ."

She was very talented,
very artistic.

We were just always together.
So she was a real sweetheart.

She did not deserve this.

And I think this
was her first date.

That night, he was going to
ask her to go steady.

But they went out
on Lake Herman Road,

and that's where
it happened.

**

What do you think of the idea
that maybe they weren't

the victims
of a serial killer?

I guess I really had never
thought of it, you know?

Once they plant the seed,
that, oh, the Zodiac did it,

then you just kind of
convince yourself

that it must have been
the Zodiac.

Horan: This execution-style
double homicide took place

in Vallejo, right at the peak
of this wave

of violent drug dealing
and trafficking by biker gangs.

Man: The Hells Angels
for a whole generation

has been known as a
black-jacketed motorcycle gang

with a taste for violence.

Now the police authorities say

they have become
far more than that.

They've gone into
such moneymaking fields

as narcotics and prostitution

and have made millions
using methods

even more brutal
than the Mafia's.

**

Horan: David was not just
on the wrestling team.

He wasn't just an Eagle Scout.

He was a real leader.
He was a real hero type.

**

[ Indistinct conversations ]

According to the police reports,
witnesses told investigators

that a couple of days
before he was murdered,

David got into
a physical altercation,

almost a knock-down, drag-out
fight,

with this young punk
from his high school

at the pancake house
on Tennessee Street.

David said, "You're pushing
drugs at my school,

and I'm gonna put a stop to it."

**

In my opinion, that is
the motive for this murder,

that David was targeted by
these drug-dealing biker gangs,

and they had concluded
that he was a danger,

he was a snitch,
he was an informant,

or he was about to be,

and they decided
that he had to go.

Butterfield:
I don't think that what
David Faraday actually did

was that provocative
at that time.

It wouldn't be that unusual
for somebody

to confront somebody
about dealing drugs.

The more logical explanation
is that David Faraday

was just in the wrong place
at the wrong time

when the killer was trolling
for possible victims.

**

Nock: So, as you know,
I've also been talking

to Professor Horan
about his theories,

and he believes that
this murder involved

biker gangs in the area
selling drugs in Vallejo.

Beeson: It's plausible.
It's definitely plausible.

Because there's some guys
in Hells Angels, as we know,

would not hesitate
to take out,

you know, people that
they needed to take out.

But, then again, we go back
to the victims here.

I don't know if that
would have been enough

to justify murdering him
and his young date,

over the possibility of
being ratted on for drugs.

Why not cover your identity
and let Betty Lou live?

I mean,
Betty Lou was executed.

I cover crime
in Alameda County,

Contra Costa County,
basically the entire East Bay.

In the '60s,
especially the late '60s,

there was kind of
an explosion

of drug use and drug trafficking
in this area.

[ Siren wails ]

For instance,
in Solano County,

from 1967 to 1968,

drug arrests
went up by 400%.

You have to understand --

right now marijuana
is not that big a deal,

but back then, you know,
it was a prison offense,

you'd go to jail for possessing
small amounts of it.

And when you make
a drug, you know,

something that you can get into
that much trouble for,

it changes the caliber
of criminal

that's, uh --
that's distributing it.

[ Engines rumbling ]

The threat of being turned in to
the police is a pretty big deal,

and the way that biker gangs
and gangs in general

enforce their rules
is with violence.

**

[ Gunshot ]

So somebody snitching on you
or turning you in to the police

is basically a cardinal sin.

It's one of the worst things
you can do.

It's definitely plausible
that somebody

who was threatening
to turn in a biker-gang member

would end up dead.

One of the theories
that I've heard

over the years from criminals
and other people

was that there was
this drug dealer

who owned a ranch up in the
Richmond Hills, in that area,

who was responsible for the
Lake Herman Road shooting.

Nock: Wow. Really?

Yeah.

Butterfield:
At first, police didn't know

what to make of the murders
on Lake Herman Road.

Those kinds of shootings
were rare in that area.

**

Man: What kind of
youngsters were these?

The boy was an Eagle Scout.

The girl
was on her first date.

And there's no record
of any misbehavior

on either one of them.

We have several leads
that we're working on,

and some of them
have been expired.

We have ruled them out.

Horan: When police aren't able
to generate any solid leads,

fear really takes hold

in the Vallejo and Benicia
communities,

as Pierre Bidou talked about

in the 2007 documentary,
"This Is the Zodiac Speaking."

There was a real panic in
a small community like Benicia.

Benicia had a 10:00 curfew.
Well, that was off after that.

I would say
the paranoia in Benicia

lasted a good
six to seven months.

People were very concerned,
and it escalated every time

after another reported killing.

Nock: Why do you think
the police didn't follow up

on this suggestion
that this biker gang

was involved
in their murders?

Police are generally
pretty secretive.

There could be any number
of reasons.

But one thing you have to
keep in mind is...

the nature of policing
really changed

from now versus, you know,
the late '60s, early '70s.

It was basically
a situation where

if somebody
didn't see you do it,

it was very easy
to get away with murder.

There were no cameras.
There were no cellphones.

And DNA was just some
scientist's dream at that point.

**

Horan:
At first, the police did assume,

because there had been this wave
of drug-related violence,

that this must have had
something to do with that.

But then everybody's
telling investigators,

"Well, David and Betty Lou
didn't do drugs.

They didn't even smoke grass.
I mean, they didn't drink."

So, well, maybe that's not
what's going on.

But then a week
after the murders,

they receive two tips

pointing towards
possible involvement

of organized crime
and narcotics,

and they didn't follow up
on any of this.

Butterfield:
There's not a lot of information
about the drug dealer

or what happened in
the investigation into that,

but having spoken to some
of the original investigators

who were involved in that
particular investigation,

they didn't see any reason
to believe

that avenue of investigation
would be productive.

Man:
Why did this happen?

It was a senseless murder
I believe.

**

Horan: You had the lead
investigator, Les Lundblad,

who had only ever worked on
one homicide case before.

Les' partner,
Detective Butterbach,

he had more experience,

but neither one of them
had experience

with this kind of violence
and these kinds of gangs,

so they might not
have even really known

what kind of leads to follow up.

It's perfectly understandable
why these particular murders

might go unsolved
by these investigators.

**

**

Butterfield:
The next known Zodiac attack

occurred on the night
of July 4, 1969, in Vallejo.

**

22-year old waitress, wife,
and mother Darlene Ferrin

decided to go out with a friend
named Michael Mageau,

who was 19 years old.

They decided to go
to Blue Rock Springs Park,

which is just outside of Vallejo
near a golf course.

Darlene pulls into the park
and parks the car,

and they're talking
for a little while.

**

At some point, a car drove up

and parked behind
Darlene's Corvair.

The driver just sat there
and then drove away.

Just a short few minutes later,
another car pulls up behind them

as they're parked
in Blue Rock Springs Park.

A man gets out
of the driver's side,

and he's shining
a very bright flashlight,

and they think it's the police.

And without any warning...

...this man just starts
firing into the car.

[ Gunshots ]

[ Engine idling ]

Butterfield:
Darlene was shot several times,

much more than Michael Mageau.

Three teenagers drove up,

and they saw Michael Mageau
laying on the ground.

So those teenagers found a phone
and called the police.

That phone call was answered by
police dispatcher Nancy Slover

at the Vallejo
Police Department,

and she directed police
to that location.

Beeson:
The police finally arrive.

They're trying
to get information

out of Darlene Ferrin
about who did it.

But she was
so critically wounded

that she couldn't even speak
at this point.

[ Siren wailing ]

And then she winds up dying
on the way to the hospital.

Mike Mageau
is shot up really bad,

but he winds up surviving
that attack.

**

Horan: Mike tells police
that the shooter arrived

in a car very similar
to Darlene's 1963 Corvair.

So an APB goes out.

"Be on the lookout
for a brown car

and some kind
of 9-millimeter pistol."

Because Richard Hoffman
and other officers

discovered the shell casings,

and they're stamped,
"9mm Luger."

[ Police radio chatter ]

Butterfield:
Shortly after that,

Nancy Slover answered
another phone call

from someone who claimed
to be the killer.

[ Telephone rings ]

Beeson: If it was a crime of
passion or a drug deal gone bad,

why the phone call?

There was absolutely nothing
to gain from that phone call.

The preponderance
of my research

and things that I know,

it lines up perfectly
with a Zodiac crime.

Taking responsibility
by the phone call,

knowing the details that came in
on that phone call.

I think it really does solidify
that it's a Zodiac attack.

Horan: That's not true.

What we see
at Blue Rock Springs Park

looks more like
a killing in anger.

Like, really angry. Not just
taking a shot and running off.

This is pumping round after
round into Darlene's back.

[ Gunshots ]

Like, this person
really wanted Darlene dead.

Nock: But why would anyone
make that call?

Horan: Because if police believe
that the murders are related

and perpetrated
by a single killer

picking victims at random,

then it takes the heat
off of the person

who actually has a motive
to commit this killing.

[ Gunshots ]

I think Darlene was targeted
by someone who knew her.

Chambers:
Darlene was my oldest sister.

We were very close.

For being six years apart,
we were extremely close.

I idolized her.
I looked up to her.

I thought she was
everything I wanted to be.

She was friendly
and loved people.

And she loved her daughter
and her husband.

**

Nock: I'm on my way
to meet Dean Ferrin.

Dean was married to Darlene
when she was murdered in 1969.

I don't know
what Dean is gonna remember

from 50-odd years later,

but he hasn't talked too often
to researchers.

This must be the place.

**

Nock: So, how did you
and Darlene meet?

Well, I was a cook here
in the middle '60s,

and she was a waitress.

We just worked a lot
of the same shifts,

got to be friends, and...

We started dating while she was
living with this friend of mine.

We planned on
just settling down.

And then she was pregnant.

[ Engine idling ]

Butterfield:
There are a lot of questions

about why Michael Mageau
was with Darlene Ferrin,

who, of course,
was married at the time.

We don't know exactly
why they were together.

There's all kinds
of speculation

that they were
romantically involved.

And Michael Mageau
even said years later

that he was in love with her.

**

She liked to go out
and dance,

and I worked nights,

and it got back to me that,

"Oh, she's out here
whoring around."

And I don't believe that.

And some of the other --
her closer friends

said that wasn't true;

they're just a group
of girls going out.

Michael was a friend.
That's all.

Their relationship
was friendship.

So you think that
the websites and the books

have given your sister
a real bad rap?

Yeah, that's why
I wanted to talk to you,

to set the record straight
and tell everybody

how wonderful a sister
and mother she was and wife.

Darlene Ferrin had been married

before she married Dean Ferrin.

She was married to a man
named Jim Phillips,

and they apparently had
a rough relationship,

and she had been working

and trying to raise money
to get a divorce.

When we first met,
she was still married

and having a little trouble
with her husband

and wanted to
get out from under him.

They lived in a motel
on the edge of town,

and he wouldn't let her sleep
in the bed

and slapped her around
a little bit and...

Nock: When Jim and Darlene
broke up and she went with Dean,

was Jim upset?

Yeah, I think he was
kind of upset with that.

And I think he ended up
leaving town

'cause he couldn't
handle it.

Horan: If it's true
that Darlene is targeted

by a very personal motive,

the first person who comes
to mind would be the ex-husband,

and this particular ex-husband
does have a criminal record.

He owned a car just like
the one described by Mike.

He was known
to be stalking Darlene.

In my opinion, Darlene Ferrin's
ex-husband, Jim,

is the prime suspect
in her murder.

Nock: Do you think Jim
has anything to do
with Darlene's death?

I did at first.

I think he was mean enough
to definitely do it.

[ Gunshot ]

What kind of a person
was he?

Kind of strange. I mean,
he didn't talk a lot.

My folks didn't really
care for him that much.

I guess they thought he kept
Darlene, you know, to himself.

He seemed very capable of
doing something like this.

He was that strange.
He was definitely a weirdo.

**

Horan:
When the police wanted to talk

to Darlene's ex-husband,
they couldn't find him.

You know, nobody
had seen him in town,

and supposedly he didn't
have Darlene's address.

Nock: Do you have any evidence
that Jim Crabtree

was in Vallejo
the night of the murder?

I have never found
any evidence

that he was in town
around the time

Darlene was murdered.

It's very difficult to know
where Jim Phillips

has ever been.

To this day, I don't know.

He's supposedly dead,
but I can't confirm that.

**

Butterfield: After the shooting
at Blue Rocks Springs Park,

there was a lot of speculation
about what had happened and why

and what the motives were
and who the killer was.

But all of that changed
at the end of July 1969.

Horan: Just a couple of weeks
after Darlene's murder,

the newspapers start getting
these letters

taking credit for these murders.

**

Beeson: The Zodiac letters
that came out

on July 31, 1969,

forever changed the case.

Beeson:
On July 31, 1969,

there was three
different letters

sent to the
San Francisco Examiner,

San Francisco Chronicle,
and the Vallejo Times-Herald.

That was the first time

that anything was received
by the killer.

And at that point, he only wrote

the cross circle logo,
as we call it,

but the word "Zodiac"
was not used yet.

This is seven months after the
first crime at Lake Herman Road.

"Dear Editor, I am the killer

of the two teenagers
last Christmas

at Lake Herman

and the girl last 4th of July.

To prove this
I shall state some facts

which only I and the police
know.

Christmas. 1.

Brand name of ammo -- Super-X.

2. Ten shots fired.

I want you to print this cipher
on the front page of your paper.

In this cipher is my identity.

If you do not print this cipher
by the afternoon

of Fri, 1st of Aug, '69,

I will go on a kill rampage
Fri night."

**

Beeson:
All three letters were similar,

and they each contained
a part of a cipher,

a message hidden
in a cryptic code.

**

[ Siren wails ]

Butterfield: Of course, the
police were a little skeptical,

so they made a public
announcement asking the writer

to send another letter
with more information,

and the person complied.

And that was the first letter
to begin with the phrase

"This is the Zodiac speaking."

When he followed up with
what we call

the debut of Zodiac letter,

all jurisdictions believe
this was the actual killer,

by what he was revealing in
those letters about the crimes,

and they were very, very
motivated to break that cipher,

to see if it was
gonna reveal his name.

Oranchak: The first cipher,
which was solved

by Donald and Bettye Harden,
they did it completely by hand.

Over the course
of 20 hours' worth of work,

they were able to use
trial and error

to come up with
the right answer.

Beeson: It said, "I like killing
people. It's so much fun.

It's more fun than shooting
wild game in the forest.

Because man is the most
dangerous animal of them all."

Of course, it didn't lead
to who the killer was,

but they knew that they were
dealing with somebody

that wanted to take credit
for these crimes,

and they knew
they had something

really, really strange
on their hands at that point.

**

Nock: Why write a letter
to take credit for a crime?

Isn't that a really
risky thing to do?

I think the Zodiac Killer
is addicted to risk.

And he doesn't want to
actually get caught,

but he wants people to know

that there's one single person
behind all of these crimes

and that perhaps he is smarter
than the teams of policemen

and detectives who were all
trying to solve this puzzle.

Horan: What was the motive
for writing the letters?

The motive apparently
was to get this

three-part, coded message
published in three newspapers.

Well, if it's easy to crack,
what's the purpose

of putting it in code
in the first place?

Is there
some other message here?

Oranchak: A very real
possibility might be that Zodiac

hid a message
within the message.

There are well-known techniques
in cryptography

for doing such things.

One of them is called
null cipher,

where you look at something
that looks like a normal letter,

but if you look at, say,

every second letter
of each word,

it might spell
something significant.

And this was a technique
used a lot by prisoners.

They'll try to write letters
to people outside of the prison,

but they'll put hidden messages,
an order for a hit

on a rival gang member
or something like that.

So that's something
Zodiac could have known about.

**

Horan: As an English professor,
these Zodiac letters

were what got me interested
in the case in the first place.

They were fascinating.

They're short,
but they're very well-written.

And this series of letters,
very artfully crafted,

created this
compelling character.

He was cold,
calculating, ruthless.

He was perfectly conscious
of his actions.

He chose to be evil.

But the initial response
was skepticism.

No police spokesman says,

"Oh, my God.
We have this terror..."

No, they express a lot of
healthy skepticism.

But the public now
are getting information

from a person
claiming to be the killer.

I think the fear
was that the public

would believe these letters,

and I think
that's what happened.

The more time that goes on,

they believe more and more
in the Zodiac,

and it really does start
to skew their investigations

toward certain suspects,
away from certain suspects.

**

Darlene Ferrin --
her first husband was a guy

named James Phillips Crabtree.

He was a suspect at one point.

**

Butterfield: Vallejo detectives
eliminated him as a suspect

after talking to him.

Now, it's possible that
they could have been wrong,

but it's important to remember
that looking at the ex-husband

of a victim is basically
just standard procedure,

and he's part of what you might
refer to as the usual suspects.

**

Nock:
Is he passed away?

No.

I believe
he's still alive.

**

**

Can you first
tell me your name?

Jim Crabtree.

Should I develop a
"deer in the headlights" look?

I've read that your name
was also Jim Phillips.

Yes.

Tell me about when
you first met Darlene.

There were some people
that I went to high school

who were in San Francisco.

And a little girl
I grew up with

took me over
to the Haight-Ashbury.

Boom!

That's where I met Dee.

Everybody called her Dee.

She had a job at AT&T,
and she lived in the city.

She lived in the Haight-Ashbury
for a while, too.

And she lived in the city,
close to it,

because she wanted
to be close to her job.

When I met her,
I felt like I got lucky.

"Wow. I got lucky
with this pretty girl."

When we got together, we --

I decided we needed to go
to New York, and she agreed.

And then I got a job offer
in Albany.

So I went up there.

So you asked her
to marry you.

We just thought
we should get married.

So, how long
were you together?

Um, geez.
I don't know.

A year?

How was your relationship
with Dee?

I heard it was kind of
love/hate relationship?

Is that fair?
Or tumultuous?

No. No. [Bleep] no.

I don't get tumultuous
with people, except guys.

I don't get tumultuous
with women.

[ Chuckles ]
Are you crazy?

Nock: Did she ever talk to you
about the type of relationship

she had with Jim?

Chambers:
It was stressful, I thought.

She always tried
to play it down,

you know, and be happy
around me.

But I think that it was
not going anywhere good.

Why did you and Dee
break up?

I started realizing

that this is not a woman
I want to be with.

She's too, as we say,

accessible
to the male desires.

I should have probably
just put her on a plane.

But I felt responsible since I'd
taken her so far from her home.

"I'm gonna deliver you
back to your parents."

So that's what I did.

Came back.
Stayed in a motel there.

We were in that motel
about three days,

and suddenly
she's in love with a guy

in the International
House of Pancakes.

Oh, that's Dean, right?
Yeah.

So I felt like I could
get the hell out of there.

I drove off
in our Corvair.

And when I left,

I regretfully said,

"Whatever's happened here,

you're gonna get it back
nine times over."

For that,
I regretted that.

It just blurted out of my mouth.
I don't know why.

Well, there's --
She was shot nine times.

But that was like years
after I had seen her.

How did you find out that
Darlene had been murdered?

Well,
this highway patrolman

stopped me
for a taillight broken,

and I didn't have
my driver's license with me,

so I had to go to
the Santa Cruz County Courthouse

to show
my driver's license.

So I went up to the judge.
I showed him my license.

You know, I'm done here.

And I turned around,
and the entire courthouse

was filled
with uniformed police.

And four detectives
heading towards me

with their hands
on their guns.

They said,
"Well, come with us."

So they took me across the
street to another building.

**

One of them said,
"Did you know Darlene?"

And I said, "Yeah."

They said, "Did you know
she was murdered?"

"No.
I don't follow her scene."

You know?

So they said, "Well, we need
to look at your house."

So I said, "Sure,
but under the proviso

that you're not gonna
bust me for my dope."

They said,
"We don't care about the dope."

And I thought, "Oh, Jesus.
This is serious."

So they came to my house.

They took pictures
of all my books

about magic
and horoscopes

and the car and everything.

They put all this together.

So then they took me
to Vallejo,

where I did
writing samples.

Nock: So, they asked you
for a handwriting sample

because they thought you
may have written the letters

to the press
from the Zodiac?

Oh, yeah, sure.

The police were finally able
to talk to him

about six months
after the murder.

And by that time,
you have to understand --

it's just a couple of weeks
after Darlene's murder

that the newspapers
start getting these letters

from this guy
calling himself the Zodiac,

taking credit for these murders.

So now Jim doesn't just
have to be a good suspect

for Darlene's murder.

He has to be a good suspect
for all the murders,

and his handwriting
has to match the letters

in order for the police
to further investigate him.

**

Crabtree: I spent two or
three days in the jail there.

Everybody knowing
in the jail

that I had been arrested
as the Zodiac.

**

Why would the police
think that?

Aside from being the ex-husband,
what else did they think

connected you
to the Zodiac killings?

I think it was probably
because I was a cryptographer.

I worked with codes.
I didn't realize

that you studied cryptography
in the Army.

Yes, I was trained
as a cryptographer.

I had about three months

at Fort Gordon
Crypto School.

When those cops showed up,
I thought, "I'm [bleep]."

**

I'm a cryptographer.

I have books on magic.

I thought, "I'm [bleep]."

What was your alibi
when the police asked you?

Every 4th of July
during those years, I took acid.

And on that particular day,

I parked
my 1929 Ford truck

down at the foot
of Boulder Creek Road

outside of Boulder Creek,
California.

And I walked up that road,
spent the day up there

just playing in the mud
and the sun.

They asked me where I'd been,
and I told them.

**

Then I walked back down
that road. It's about 3 miles.

And as I came down,

there was a family
gathered here,

having 4th of July, and I said,
"Hey. Hi. How are you?"

And they waved,
and I kept walking.

Turned out that man
was a Federal Court judge.

[ Chuckles ]
And he did see me.

And he did wave at me.

I wasn't there.

Nock:
I have found no record

of a judge verifying
Jim's story,

but in the police reports,
I can see

that one of the investigators
on the case,

a sergeant named Mulanax,

independently interviewed
Jim's new wife at the time

and corroborated his alibi.

Remember, by the time
of Darlene's murder,

she and Jim had been broken up
for over two years

and both had remarried.

And they came back
and said, "Oh, he's clear."

Tell me
about this picture.

[ Chuckles ]

So, who's in
that photograph?

Oh, well,
that's Dee right there.

And they kept accusing me
of being this [bleep] guy.

This is a dork!
Dork! [ Chuckles ]

Nock:
Do you think Jim has anything
to do with Darlene's death?

I did at first.

I think he was mean enough
to definitely do it.

I want to show you
this picture.

I've seen that picture
quite a bit.

I thought it was Jim
because Jim has

similar characteristics
like that.

Tall and skinny.
And I think he wore glasses.

Crabtree:
I recognize the sweater

because I bought it for her
for Christmas as a gift

for going through, uh --

You can't really see it here,

but she had just had
a knee operation.

She fell. We were skiing
on Mount Shasta.

This is the doctor who did
the operation on her knee.

The guy's a goddamn dork.
It's an insult.

Look at that thumb.
Look at that guy's thumb!

That's not my thumb!
[ Chuckles ]

Can I show you
one more picture?

So I guess this is their proof
that it is you.

Yeah. Yeah.
They say that's your
high-school photograph,

and that looks like
the same guy.

Have you seen that
before?

Yeah, it is.
[ Chuckles ]

Whew! Jesus!

I was even more dorky
than I thought.

You know, people in
the Zodiac community say

that when you put it
all together

and you line up
these two images --

this mystery man
here with Darlene

and your high-school
photograph --

they look pretty similar.

Yeah. This is not me.
That's the doctor.

I have to ask you.
Did you kill Darlene?

Guy who was taking an acid trip
when she was shot.

You know?

[ Chuckling ]

I've heard that her family
absolutely said it was me.

You know?

Why, ain't you a little bitch?
Why'd you do that?

You know nothing about me.

What do you believe happened
that night to Darlene?

Oh, I think
this asshole did.

The Zodiac.
Whoever the Zodiac guy is.

You think that she was the
victim of a serial killer?

Oh, yeah, sure. Yeah.
I mean I think so.

I really don't know any of
the details about her world

because I was basically
just living my life.

So I really don't know.

**

Thank you, Jim.
Oh, it was fun.

Thank you for listening
to all this crap.

Of course.
Thank you, Andrew.

Thank you so much
for meeting with me

and talking with me and
setting the record straight.

Yes, well, I don't know
if I did that or not.

Well, that's what
we wanted to do, right?

Set the record on fire.

You know, something funny
happens when you turn 70.

What?

You don't give a shit
about what you say anymore.

At all.

[ Chuckles ]

**

Nock: Okay, I'm gonna call
Thomas Horan right now

and let him know
about this conversation

I just had with Jim.

[ Line ringing]

[ Click]

Thomas?
Yeah.

Jim Crabtree.

He -- You know,
we met with him.

Well, he had a lot to say,
and he did his best to,

you know, dispel the rumors
that he had anything to do

with Darlene's murder,

anything to do with
being the Zodiac.

He pretty much told me
his whole story

about being in the military,
being in a cryptography program.

I didn't know that.
Did you know that?

That was bullshit.
That was total bullshit.

He was a clerk typist,

and he was stationed in Germany
for a couple of years.

See, this is what
I'm confused about.

It was a very strange
conversation.

He did his best
to clear his name,

but then he said
a lot of things

that just fuels
the fire of speculation.

Like, he had
top-secret clearance,

that he was a top cryptographer
in the Army.

Why would he say that,

knowing that that would
link him to the Zodiac?

Right. Right.

He said the last thing
he said to her

after she had been
cheating on him in Vallejo

when they lived in a motel there
was that,

"It's going to come back
to you nine times over."

And that's the number of times
she was shot.

Right.
And, see, victim blaming

is classic behavior on
the part of the perpetrator.

I asked him about
his alibi of the murder.

He said he did acid.
It was a 4th of July tradition.

He went hiking
in Boulder Creek.

And that -- The Boulder Creek
does match up

with the police report.

The truth about him
makes him look guilty

or very suspicious of being
involved in Darlene's murder,

and nothing makes him
look innocent.

Now, that doesn't prove
he's guilty...
Right.

...but everything makes him
look guilty, and nothing --

There's nothing that
makes him look innocent.

Nothing.
Yeah, it's -- it's --

It's puzzling
and a little disturbing.

I've got --
I've got to be honest.

**

Horan: When you look
at Darlene's murder,

the most obvious suspect has to
be Darlene's ex-husband, Jim.

Maybe he's not guilty,
but you do have a prime suspect

who is worthy
of further investigation.

But by the time
the police catch up with him,

there's now
this runaway narrative

that the murders were committed
by one person

who's been writing
these letters.

And the police
couldn't prove that Jim

was the so-called Zodiac Killer,
so they lost interest in him.

**

The letters are probably
the number-one reason

none of these victims
ever got any justice.

And here's a perfect example.

If the letter writer
isn't the killer,

then we need to rethink

everything we know
about this case.

And unlocking the mystery
of those letters and ciphers

is the key to blowing
this whole case wide open

and proving if there
really was a Zodiac Killer

or if it's all a myth.

**

Nock:
The so-called Zodiac Killer

ultimately sent over 20 letters
and 4 ciphers to the media.

Many experts actually
put the number at 32,

and they have been analyzed
for fingerprints,

analyzed for DNA,
analyzed for trace evidence.

The handwriting has been
compared again and again.

So far, it's led to nothing.

So what's next?
That's the big question.

Thomas Horan believes
the letters could be the key.

I think if we're trying
to prove his theory

about multiple killers,
possibly multiple authors,

that's what we need to focus on.

There have been famous letters
that have recently been cracked

by new scientific methods.

Case in point -- Q of QAnon.

Their identity was solved

with the help of
computational linguistics.

Maybe that's the key
to this Zodiac case.

[ Line ringing]

Hi, Florian.
Hi, Jean-Baptiste.

-Hi, Andrew.
-Hi, Andrew.

Nock: I found the two professors
who used

computational linguistics
to help identify Q.

It's been a few weeks since
I sent you the Zodiac letters,

and what we're trying to
understand about these letters

is not so much who wrote them,

but whether or not one single
person wrote all those letters

or if there are multiple
letter writers.

I'm dying to find out
what you discovered.