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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:07,920 --> 00:00:09,930 ♪ Dramatic, atmospheric music ♪ 2 00:00:21,140 --> 00:00:24,230 ♪ "Billie Jean" by Michael Jackson ♪ 3 00:00:26,100 --> 00:00:29,270 ♪ Mama se, mama sa, ma-ma coo sa ♪ 4 00:00:29,770 --> 00:00:32,220 ♪ "Beat It" by Michael Jackson ♪ 5 00:00:32,420 --> 00:00:35,130 There are two things in the music business: 6 00:00:35,210 --> 00:00:37,750 before Thriller and after Thriller. 7 00:00:45,580 --> 00:00:47,110 ♪ But you wanna be bad ♪ 8 00:00:47,310 --> 00:00:50,990 - ♪ Just beat it, beat it ♪ - ♪ Beat it, beat it ♪ 9 00:00:51,190 --> 00:00:54,010 ♪ No one wants to be defeated ♪ 10 00:00:54,210 --> 00:00:57,790 ♪ Showin' how funky and strong is your fight ♪ 11 00:00:57,990 --> 00:00:59,480 ♪ It doesn't matter... ♪ 12 00:00:59,680 --> 00:01:00,970 Mark. 13 00:01:01,470 --> 00:01:03,180 The first time I heard 14 00:01:03,260 --> 00:01:05,200 Michael Jackson's Thriller, he was pop, 15 00:01:05,280 --> 00:01:08,780 he was R and B, he was gospel, he was rock. 16 00:01:08,980 --> 00:01:10,250 It was everything that I loved. 17 00:01:10,330 --> 00:01:12,090 And bring all of these elements together... 18 00:01:12,170 --> 00:01:13,250 Dance and choreography 19 00:01:13,420 --> 00:01:15,190 and theatrical moments and the feeling, 20 00:01:15,270 --> 00:01:17,930 you know, like a musical, damn near. 21 00:01:18,130 --> 00:01:21,790 The magic of it... each track was better than the next. 22 00:01:21,990 --> 00:01:24,040 It was in your brain, and everybody knew it. 23 00:01:24,120 --> 00:01:26,000 For the 14th consecutive week, 24 00:01:26,080 --> 00:01:27,350 the best-selling album in the country 25 00:01:27,430 --> 00:01:29,690 is Michael Jackson's Thriller. 26 00:01:29,890 --> 00:01:31,250 If Thriller came out today, 27 00:01:31,330 --> 00:01:33,840 it would still be the greatest album ever made. 28 00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:37,370 It's the ultimate blueprint to modern pop music. 29 00:01:37,570 --> 00:01:40,010 I love the way that record is sequenced, right? 30 00:01:40,090 --> 00:01:42,240 "Wanna Be Startin' Somethin'." The title says it. 31 00:01:42,320 --> 00:01:44,770 He wanted to be starting some shit right now. He wanted... 32 00:01:44,850 --> 00:01:46,290 He's like, "I'm about to start some shit 33 00:01:46,370 --> 00:01:48,160 in the industry right now. I'm about to blow everybody up." 34 00:01:48,240 --> 00:01:50,060 This was literally the pinnacle of everything 35 00:01:50,140 --> 00:01:51,140 that began with him. 36 00:01:51,330 --> 00:01:53,590 "Thriller," "Beat It" 37 00:01:53,790 --> 00:01:55,010 and "Billie Jean." 38 00:01:55,210 --> 00:01:57,150 To this day, when "Thriller" comes on, I mean, 39 00:01:57,230 --> 00:01:59,230 there's not a Halloween that doesn't happen 40 00:01:59,400 --> 00:02:00,830 where you don't hear that song. 41 00:02:01,030 --> 00:02:03,910 But then you have "Human Nature," "P.Y.T.," 42 00:02:04,110 --> 00:02:05,910 and then you have "Lady in My Life." 43 00:02:06,050 --> 00:02:08,920 It became the biggest-selling album ever. 44 00:02:09,120 --> 00:02:12,590 Michael Jackson. Always keep one in the cab. 45 00:02:12,790 --> 00:02:14,430 This is history. 46 00:02:14,600 --> 00:02:16,130 I want to say it's Black culture, 47 00:02:16,210 --> 00:02:17,820 but it's-it's for everyone. 48 00:02:18,020 --> 00:02:19,570 Thriller is the biggest-selling 49 00:02:19,650 --> 00:02:20,390 album of all time. 50 00:02:20,590 --> 00:02:22,270 Thriller is a cultural phenomenon 51 00:02:22,360 --> 00:02:25,500 that's lasted four decades and seems determined 52 00:02:25,700 --> 00:02:27,640 to continue going forward. 53 00:02:32,110 --> 00:02:33,810 What takes your breath away is 54 00:02:33,890 --> 00:02:37,260 he had the ambition to become the biggest star in the world. 55 00:02:37,460 --> 00:02:39,870 And he did it. The fact that he had 56 00:02:40,070 --> 00:02:42,120 that dream, I mean, that-that goal, 57 00:02:42,320 --> 00:02:45,740 that's what's the remarkable story. 58 00:02:48,040 --> 00:02:49,900 ♪ Soft, curious music ♪ 59 00:02:50,100 --> 00:02:51,640 Ever since we were kids, 60 00:02:51,720 --> 00:02:55,570 we've always wanted to dance or keep the time to the music. 61 00:02:55,770 --> 00:02:57,010 And that's part of us. 62 00:02:57,210 --> 00:02:59,290 It's like, something we have to have. 63 00:02:59,460 --> 00:03:01,470 And it's in us, because I don't know 64 00:03:01,670 --> 00:03:04,310 what I would do if there was, wasn't music. 65 00:03:04,510 --> 00:03:05,990 Joe Jackson's role 66 00:03:06,140 --> 00:03:09,150 in his children's careers would give people a lot to talk about. 67 00:03:09,350 --> 00:03:12,070 The former steelworker had somehow gotten his family 68 00:03:12,270 --> 00:03:14,230 out of Indiana, groomed for stardom. 69 00:03:14,440 --> 00:03:17,450 ♪ "I Want You Back" by The Jackson 5 ♪ 70 00:03:25,330 --> 00:03:27,100 Now, here are five brothers 71 00:03:27,180 --> 00:03:29,940 from Gary, Indiana, ranging in age from ten to 18: 72 00:03:30,140 --> 00:03:31,230 The Jackson 5. 73 00:03:31,430 --> 00:03:34,860 ♪ Baby, give me one more chance ♪ 74 00:03:35,060 --> 00:03:36,310 ♪ To show you that I love you ♪ 75 00:03:36,390 --> 00:03:39,970 ♪ Won't you please let me ♪ 76 00:03:40,170 --> 00:03:41,390 ♪ Back in your heart ♪ 77 00:03:41,590 --> 00:03:45,080 ♪ Darlin', I was blind to let you go ♪ 78 00:03:45,280 --> 00:03:46,280 ♪ Let you go, baby ♪ 79 00:03:46,430 --> 00:03:48,000 ♪ But now since I see you... ♪ 80 00:03:48,200 --> 00:03:49,990 This poor man's life has been 81 00:03:50,070 --> 00:03:51,170 dissected completely. 82 00:03:51,370 --> 00:03:53,770 Is there anything anybody hasn't asked you by now? 83 00:03:53,910 --> 00:03:54,780 Um... 84 00:03:54,980 --> 00:03:56,110 ♪ Enjoy yourself ♪ 85 00:03:56,310 --> 00:03:58,990 ♪ Enjoy yourself, enjoy yourself with me ♪ 86 00:03:59,190 --> 00:04:02,070 ♪ Enjoy yourself, enjoy yourself ♪ 87 00:04:02,270 --> 00:04:04,680 ♪ Enjoy yourself with me ♪ 88 00:04:04,880 --> 00:04:06,410 ♪ You better enjoy yourself... ♪ 89 00:04:06,610 --> 00:04:09,260 Now, tell me, what do you think is the success 90 00:04:09,340 --> 00:04:11,080 of the Jacksons, yourself and the Jacksons? 91 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:14,770 I would say probably, um, togetherness. 92 00:04:14,970 --> 00:04:17,540 I can't think about Michael without thinking about 93 00:04:17,620 --> 00:04:20,430 The Jackson 5 and Motown and all of that, 94 00:04:20,630 --> 00:04:22,780 so it takes me a little further back. 95 00:04:22,980 --> 00:04:24,090 Takes me to Off the Wall, 96 00:04:24,170 --> 00:04:25,760 which is one of my favorite records. 97 00:04:27,780 --> 00:04:29,870 Welcome to WBLS once again, Michael Jackson. 98 00:04:29,950 --> 00:04:31,160 Thank you very much. 99 00:04:31,240 --> 00:04:32,640 The name of the album is... 100 00:04:32,720 --> 00:04:34,270 - Off the Wall. - Are you? 101 00:04:35,700 --> 00:04:38,190 We'll be back with Michael right after this. 102 00:04:38,270 --> 00:04:41,200 ♪ Lovely ♪ 103 00:04:41,400 --> 00:04:45,760 ♪ Is the feeling now ♪ 104 00:04:45,960 --> 00:04:48,370 ♪ Fever... ♪ 105 00:04:48,570 --> 00:04:51,390 I was not the biggest Jackson 5 fan. 106 00:04:51,590 --> 00:04:53,210 I was a serious pop music critic. 107 00:04:53,410 --> 00:04:55,620 And I said, "Well, it's cute what they're doing." 108 00:04:55,700 --> 00:04:58,130 ♪ Baby, baby ♪- ♪ ♪ 109 00:04:58,330 --> 00:04:59,650 You know, James Brown, 110 00:04:59,730 --> 00:05:01,450 Jackie Wilson, that's really nice. 111 00:05:01,650 --> 00:05:03,530 You know, it wasn't what I was interested in. 112 00:05:03,610 --> 00:05:05,620 And then Off the Wall comes out, 113 00:05:05,820 --> 00:05:07,660 and I was caught up in the excitement 114 00:05:07,840 --> 00:05:10,160 of learning more about Michael and his world, 115 00:05:10,360 --> 00:05:11,680 so I interview him separately. 116 00:05:11,760 --> 00:05:14,640 You interview the brothers all together, him separately. 117 00:05:14,810 --> 00:05:16,130 You know, he's nervous. 118 00:05:16,330 --> 00:05:18,030 He doesn't like to do interviews. 119 00:05:18,230 --> 00:05:20,050 He's sad, he's lonely, he says. 120 00:05:20,250 --> 00:05:22,950 He starts talking about his life. 121 00:05:23,150 --> 00:05:25,600 ♪ Soft, melancholy music ♪ 122 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:30,350 He was so hurt around 14 and 15 and 16, 123 00:05:30,550 --> 00:05:32,140 when his face changed. 124 00:05:32,340 --> 00:05:34,710 He got bigger. 125 00:05:34,910 --> 00:05:37,070 I mean, his face had broken out. 126 00:05:37,260 --> 00:05:38,380 He was so sad. 127 00:05:38,580 --> 00:05:40,340 People didn't care about him anymore. 128 00:05:40,460 --> 00:05:42,960 You know, adults would come into a party at some house, 129 00:05:43,040 --> 00:05:46,220 and they would be looking all around. "Where's Michael?" 130 00:05:46,420 --> 00:05:49,490 And they'd be walking right past him, you know? 131 00:05:49,690 --> 00:05:52,370 And he got the feeling that, "We don't care about you. 132 00:05:52,450 --> 00:05:54,890 We want that little kid." 133 00:05:57,980 --> 00:05:59,670 He was dead set on his focus 134 00:05:59,750 --> 00:06:03,050 to be, you know, Michael Jackson, solo artist. 135 00:06:03,250 --> 00:06:05,010 And he had to. 136 00:06:05,210 --> 00:06:07,680 He knew that it was time. He knew that... 137 00:06:07,880 --> 00:06:12,430 He was excited to have it all be on his own terms. 138 00:06:12,630 --> 00:06:15,670 You know, not with... not attached to anybody. 139 00:06:15,870 --> 00:06:18,060 And he knew that-that... 140 00:06:18,260 --> 00:06:20,360 that he was even gonna soar from that. 141 00:06:20,560 --> 00:06:24,360 Well, Off the Wall was an enormous success. 142 00:06:24,560 --> 00:06:27,920 It-it put Michael on the map as a solo artist. 143 00:06:28,670 --> 00:06:31,330 People forget that, before Off the Wall, 144 00:06:31,530 --> 00:06:35,750 there was a period between Motown and the Destiny album 145 00:06:35,950 --> 00:06:37,160 where people thought maybe 146 00:06:37,240 --> 00:06:38,980 the career of The Jackson 5 was over, 147 00:06:39,060 --> 00:06:42,730 that they were yesterday's news, forgotten boy band, really. 148 00:06:42,940 --> 00:06:46,240 So Off the Wall reestablished Michael as someone to watch. 149 00:06:46,440 --> 00:06:49,600 Off the Wall was just this incredible record, 150 00:06:49,800 --> 00:06:52,430 and we knew that Mike was coming back 151 00:06:52,630 --> 00:06:54,070 with something special because 152 00:06:54,150 --> 00:06:57,810 he didn't win everything that he wanted during the Grammys, 153 00:06:58,010 --> 00:07:00,210 and he only won one award, 154 00:07:00,410 --> 00:07:02,820 which was the R and B award at that. 155 00:07:03,020 --> 00:07:04,530 He thought he was gonna sweep. 156 00:07:04,730 --> 00:07:07,510 He thought for sure, "I got a pop smash here." 157 00:07:07,710 --> 00:07:11,350 So, when that didn't happen, he left there with a vengeance, 158 00:07:11,550 --> 00:07:14,640 just determined to do better next time. 159 00:07:14,840 --> 00:07:16,400 He was determined 160 00:07:16,590 --> 00:07:18,350 to change the way he was perceived. 161 00:07:18,550 --> 00:07:22,650 There were a lot of writings he did to himself, affirmations. 162 00:07:27,230 --> 00:07:28,590 I look in the mirror, 163 00:07:28,670 --> 00:07:30,380 and I would say over and over to myself... 164 00:07:30,460 --> 00:07:32,700 I'd take a deep breath, put my feet together, 165 00:07:32,900 --> 00:07:36,040 raise myself erect, strong like a... 166 00:07:36,240 --> 00:07:38,290 a hero warrior, and I'd say, 167 00:07:38,490 --> 00:07:40,640 "Biggest-selling album of all time, greatest seller," 168 00:07:40,720 --> 00:07:43,050 over and over to my mind, and look in my eyes. 169 00:07:43,250 --> 00:07:44,280 And I'd mean it. 170 00:07:44,480 --> 00:07:46,520 I'd say, "Biggest-selling album of all times." 171 00:07:46,600 --> 00:07:48,070 And I wouldn't accept anything 172 00:07:48,270 --> 00:07:50,720 unless this was exactly what I wanted. 173 00:07:50,920 --> 00:07:51,740 My attitude was: 174 00:07:51,940 --> 00:07:53,930 I want the biggest-selling album of all times, 175 00:07:54,010 --> 00:07:57,230 to break records, to do phenomenal work. 176 00:07:57,430 --> 00:07:58,980 I came in angry. 177 00:07:59,180 --> 00:08:00,580 Michael was writing. 178 00:08:00,660 --> 00:08:02,860 He was writing. He was fuming. 179 00:08:03,060 --> 00:08:05,050 He was still upset about 180 00:08:05,250 --> 00:08:07,740 this idea that he would be denied, 181 00:08:07,940 --> 00:08:10,430 you know, major awards for Off the Wall. 182 00:08:10,630 --> 00:08:12,510 I just remember all of the... 183 00:08:12,710 --> 00:08:14,550 the process of when they were doing it. 184 00:08:14,630 --> 00:08:16,350 And the, the excitement 185 00:08:16,550 --> 00:08:18,240 while they're recording, just, you know... 186 00:08:18,320 --> 00:08:20,040 just hearing tales, you know, as they're coming 187 00:08:20,120 --> 00:08:21,500 in and out of the studio with it. 188 00:08:24,120 --> 00:08:26,320 ♪ I said you wanna be startin' somethin' ♪ 189 00:08:26,520 --> 00:08:28,380 ♪ You got to be startin' somethin' ♪ 190 00:08:28,460 --> 00:08:30,480 ♪ I said you wanna be startin' somethin' ♪ 191 00:08:30,560 --> 00:08:32,130 ♪ You got to be startin' somethin' ♪ 192 00:08:32,210 --> 00:08:34,240 - ♪ It's too high to get over ♪ - ♪ Yeah, yeah ♪ 193 00:08:34,320 --> 00:08:35,720 ♪ You're too low to get under ♪ 194 00:08:35,800 --> 00:08:37,620 - ♪ Yeah, yeah ♪ - ♪ You're stuck in the middle ♪ 195 00:08:37,700 --> 00:08:39,510 - ♪ Yeah, yeah ♪ - ♪ And the pain is thunder ♪ 196 00:08:39,590 --> 00:08:40,810 ♪ Yeah, yeah... ♪ 197 00:08:41,010 --> 00:08:42,750 Westlake was a really great studio 198 00:08:42,830 --> 00:08:46,500 because y-you felt the facility had this warmth 199 00:08:46,700 --> 00:08:50,570 and this friendliness and this casual put-you-at-ease feeling. 200 00:08:50,770 --> 00:08:53,260 There was just the most incredible vibe. 201 00:08:53,460 --> 00:08:57,180 Where you could just be creatively free to-to take... 202 00:08:57,380 --> 00:08:59,950 take the music wherever you wanted. 203 00:09:02,500 --> 00:09:04,580 This is hallowed ground. I was... I was in here a lot 204 00:09:04,660 --> 00:09:06,440 'cause Quincy made a lot of records in here. 205 00:09:06,520 --> 00:09:08,880 Off the Wall was made in here. 206 00:09:09,080 --> 00:09:10,420 Certainly Thriller. 207 00:09:10,620 --> 00:09:12,000 Quincy worked in here a lot. 208 00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:13,210 Quincy influenced everything 209 00:09:13,290 --> 00:09:14,650 - we've ever done in our lives. - Yes. 210 00:09:14,730 --> 00:09:16,610 - Whether you can hear it or not. - Exactly. 211 00:09:16,800 --> 00:09:19,220 Depth of understanding of music. 212 00:09:19,420 --> 00:09:20,780 That's what makes Quincy Quincy. 213 00:09:20,950 --> 00:09:23,460 He's done big band. He's done small bands. 214 00:09:23,660 --> 00:09:25,920 He's done pop. He's done rock. 215 00:09:26,120 --> 00:09:27,320 He's done everything. 216 00:09:27,520 --> 00:09:29,630 So, just understanding all those different genres 217 00:09:29,710 --> 00:09:32,320 and-and how to fuse them all together 218 00:09:32,520 --> 00:09:33,860 is what gives you all these 219 00:09:33,940 --> 00:09:37,030 wonderful applications that you get on a Michael Jackson record. 220 00:09:37,230 --> 00:09:38,350 And that sound was ma... 221 00:09:38,440 --> 00:09:40,620 You know, Bruce Swedien had a lot to do with 222 00:09:40,820 --> 00:09:42,700 how that overall sound was... The echo 223 00:09:42,780 --> 00:09:46,110 and the reverbs and the... the way he would place things. 224 00:09:46,310 --> 00:09:47,690 And they were excited. 225 00:09:47,890 --> 00:09:49,370 As we were making the record, 226 00:09:49,480 --> 00:09:50,750 you could feel the excitement in the room. 227 00:09:50,830 --> 00:09:52,520 Knowing that we were doing something 228 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:54,380 that was gonna be special. 229 00:10:01,890 --> 00:10:03,640 Wow, I don't even know 230 00:10:03,720 --> 00:10:04,770 where to begin. 231 00:10:04,970 --> 00:10:07,420 I just remember coming here to this studio, 232 00:10:07,620 --> 00:10:10,150 which was like a second home, 233 00:10:10,350 --> 00:10:12,760 and coming in, listening to, 234 00:10:12,960 --> 00:10:16,220 the demos that Rod Temperton would provide. 235 00:10:16,420 --> 00:10:19,430 And we would just start to carve musically 236 00:10:19,630 --> 00:10:24,100 and-and work our way into the details of the demos. 237 00:10:24,300 --> 00:10:26,290 Rod Temperton. 238 00:10:26,490 --> 00:10:28,000 This guy was brilliant. 239 00:10:28,200 --> 00:10:29,710 I mean, he was deep. 240 00:10:29,910 --> 00:10:32,040 I love Rod Temperton. He wrote incredible songs, 241 00:10:32,120 --> 00:10:36,710 and he was a part of Quincy's, you know, tight team. 242 00:10:37,970 --> 00:10:40,370 We did a lot of funky sounds 243 00:10:40,480 --> 00:10:41,790 on "Baby Be Mine." 244 00:10:54,570 --> 00:10:55,940 Quincy was just looking for... 245 00:10:56,020 --> 00:10:57,650 He's always looking for something different. 246 00:10:57,730 --> 00:10:59,570 So we were brought in because it was... 247 00:10:59,750 --> 00:11:01,700 I think Quincy knew about MTV, 248 00:11:01,900 --> 00:11:03,780 and he was looking for a cinematic thing 249 00:11:03,880 --> 00:11:05,750 'cause Quincy came from film. 250 00:11:05,950 --> 00:11:08,231 When Michael would want... he-he knew things 251 00:11:08,390 --> 00:11:09,660 that he would want for sounds. 252 00:11:09,740 --> 00:11:12,440 And, he would put it on a record player and play it. 253 00:11:12,640 --> 00:11:14,880 And then I'd say, "Well, let me go get that other synth." 254 00:11:14,960 --> 00:11:16,440 So it would be in the truck, 255 00:11:16,520 --> 00:11:18,400 parked in the parking lot of Westlake, 256 00:11:18,480 --> 00:11:19,760 or it would be in the hallway. 257 00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:21,400 We had Anvil Cases lined up the hall, 258 00:11:21,480 --> 00:11:23,440 and we just basically took over the place. 259 00:11:23,610 --> 00:11:26,310 And we were creating sounds and using synthesizers 260 00:11:26,510 --> 00:11:28,680 in-in kind of a big way and replacing orchestra. 261 00:11:36,650 --> 00:11:38,630 So, one of the things that 262 00:11:38,710 --> 00:11:40,130 I noticed about Michael's development 263 00:11:40,210 --> 00:11:41,860 as a songwriter... I-I saw him getting 264 00:11:41,940 --> 00:11:43,570 more rhythmically and harmonically advanced, 265 00:11:43,650 --> 00:11:45,660 taking steps forward and forward and forward. 266 00:11:45,740 --> 00:11:48,770 His talent was not only developing as a singer. 267 00:11:48,970 --> 00:11:50,480 He developed as a... 268 00:11:50,680 --> 00:11:52,360 - as an entertainer. - Yes. 269 00:11:52,560 --> 00:11:54,190 It's funny you guys should have picked this room, 270 00:11:54,270 --> 00:11:57,700 'cause I'm walking through here, you know, and I-I just... 271 00:11:57,900 --> 00:11:59,730 you know, I'm just seeing. I can... 272 00:11:59,810 --> 00:12:01,280 I almost, um, channel him, 273 00:12:01,480 --> 00:12:03,350 - his spirit into this room. - Yeah. 274 00:12:03,550 --> 00:12:04,700 He had us prepared. 275 00:12:04,900 --> 00:12:06,680 - We were prepared. - No question. 276 00:12:06,760 --> 00:12:08,350 And he would come in ready to go. 277 00:12:08,430 --> 00:12:10,540 He was the kind of individual that, 278 00:12:10,740 --> 00:12:12,880 had a awesome work ethic. 279 00:12:13,080 --> 00:12:15,000 The process was 280 00:12:15,200 --> 00:12:16,530 quite a, adventure 281 00:12:16,730 --> 00:12:19,011 'cause most people forget that the first single 282 00:12:19,170 --> 00:12:20,860 from the album was "The Girl Is Mine." 283 00:12:20,940 --> 00:12:23,660 ♪ "The Girl Is Mine" by Michael Jackson & Paul McCartney ♪ 284 00:12:23,840 --> 00:12:26,620 Obviously, you had no bigger star in the world 285 00:12:26,820 --> 00:12:27,980 than Paul McCartney. 286 00:12:28,180 --> 00:12:29,950 And, you know, the pairing of Michael and Paul, 287 00:12:30,030 --> 00:12:32,980 what better flag waver to get a project started? 288 00:12:33,180 --> 00:12:35,710 ♪ Every night, she walks right in my dreams ♪ 289 00:12:35,790 --> 00:12:39,090 ♪ Since I met her from the start ♪ 290 00:12:39,290 --> 00:12:41,860 ♪ I'm so proud I am the only one ♪ 291 00:12:42,060 --> 00:12:44,330 ♪ Who is special in her heart ♪ 292 00:12:44,530 --> 00:12:46,620 ♪ The girl is mine ♪ 293 00:12:46,820 --> 00:12:49,260 Yeah, hit it, John. Hit it, John. 294 00:12:49,400 --> 00:12:52,920 ♪ The doggone girl is mine... ♪ 295 00:12:53,120 --> 00:12:54,640 So we get the call. 296 00:12:54,740 --> 00:12:56,310 It's, like, Paul McCartney and Michael Jackson. 297 00:12:56,390 --> 00:12:58,690 I mean, it just didn't get any bigger than that, 298 00:12:58,770 --> 00:13:00,630 so we were kind of like, 299 00:13:00,830 --> 00:13:02,660 "Holy shit. What are we gonna do? 300 00:13:02,860 --> 00:13:04,320 What's this gonna be all about?" 301 00:13:04,520 --> 00:13:06,870 When Paul McCartney walked in the room, 302 00:13:07,070 --> 00:13:09,000 there was a palpable change of energy of: 303 00:13:09,200 --> 00:13:11,160 "My God, that's Paul McCartney." 304 00:13:11,360 --> 00:13:14,420 ♪ Saying that she's yours, not mine ♪ 305 00:13:14,620 --> 00:13:17,400 ♪ Sending roses and your silly dreams ♪ 306 00:13:17,600 --> 00:13:19,380 ♪ Really just a waste of time ♪ 307 00:13:19,580 --> 00:13:21,780 ♪ Because she's mine ♪ 308 00:13:21,980 --> 00:13:24,620 - Beautiful. - Yeah. 309 00:13:24,820 --> 00:13:26,240 ♪ The doggone girl is mine ♪ 310 00:13:26,320 --> 00:13:28,660 Do that one more time, man, from the second verse. 311 00:13:28,740 --> 00:13:30,280 That was a wonderful day. 312 00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:32,530 For me, it was a day that changed my life. 313 00:13:32,610 --> 00:13:35,380 I was in the presence of the greatest, 314 00:13:35,580 --> 00:13:37,130 most successful people 315 00:13:37,330 --> 00:13:38,460 in the music business. 316 00:13:38,660 --> 00:13:41,490 Paul McCartney, Michael Jackson, Quincy Jones. 317 00:13:41,690 --> 00:13:43,550 George Martin was there. 318 00:13:43,750 --> 00:13:45,820 Because of its catchy melody, 319 00:13:45,900 --> 00:13:48,720 many think "The Girl Is Mine" was written by Paul McCartney, 320 00:13:48,800 --> 00:13:51,810 when, in fact, it was composed by Michael Jackson. 321 00:13:52,010 --> 00:13:54,420 ♪ Really just a waste of time ♪ 322 00:13:54,620 --> 00:13:56,540 ♪ Because she's mine... ♪ 323 00:13:56,740 --> 00:13:58,460 Once the music started flowing, 324 00:13:58,660 --> 00:14:00,610 it was like here's two old friends. 325 00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:05,090 ♪♪♪ 326 00:14:07,270 --> 00:14:08,680 ♪ The girl is mine ♪ 327 00:14:08,760 --> 00:14:10,240 ♪ Mine, mine ♪ 328 00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:12,260 ♪ Yes, she's mine ♪ 329 00:14:12,340 --> 00:14:14,450 - ♪ Mine, mine ♪ - ♪ Don't waste ♪ 330 00:14:15,640 --> 00:14:17,500 ♪ But we both cannot have her ♪ 331 00:14:17,580 --> 00:14:20,420 ♪ So it's one or the other ♪ 332 00:14:20,620 --> 00:14:22,920 ♪ And one day you'll discover ♪ 333 00:14:23,120 --> 00:14:26,220 ♪ That she's my girl forever and ever ♪ 334 00:14:26,420 --> 00:14:29,181 ♪ Don't build your hopes to be let down... ♪ 335 00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:31,520 Coming out of Off the Wall, 336 00:14:31,720 --> 00:14:32,750 the challenge was: 337 00:14:32,950 --> 00:14:34,530 Is Michael Jackson really a pop star, 338 00:14:34,610 --> 00:14:36,100 or is he just a big R and B artist? 339 00:14:36,180 --> 00:14:38,060 ♪ Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, whoo ♪ 340 00:14:38,260 --> 00:14:39,940 The way it worked was that 341 00:14:40,020 --> 00:14:42,000 you were a Black artist until you weren't, 342 00:14:42,080 --> 00:14:45,130 and you weren't when you got on the pop charts. 343 00:14:45,330 --> 00:14:46,180 Michael told me 344 00:14:46,380 --> 00:14:48,720 "The Girl Is Mine" was his sneak attack. 345 00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:51,810 He knew he wanted to cross over, and what better way to do it 346 00:14:52,010 --> 00:14:53,700 than to have Paul McCartney? 347 00:14:53,900 --> 00:14:55,350 I've heard it all before, Michael. 348 00:14:55,430 --> 00:14:57,470 She told me that I'm her forever lover, you know? 349 00:14:57,550 --> 00:14:58,550 Don't you remember? 350 00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:00,060 Well, after loving me, 351 00:15:00,140 --> 00:15:01,880 she said she couldn't love another. 352 00:15:02,080 --> 00:15:03,100 Is that what she said? 353 00:15:03,180 --> 00:15:04,940 Yeah, she said it. You keep dreaming. 354 00:15:05,100 --> 00:15:07,530 - ♪ I don't believe it, no ♪ - ♪ Mine, mine ♪ 355 00:15:07,610 --> 00:15:10,660 - ♪ The girl is mine ♪ - ♪ Mine, mine, mine ♪ 356 00:15:10,860 --> 00:15:12,410 - ♪ No, mine ♪ - ♪ No, mine ♪ 357 00:15:12,490 --> 00:15:14,730 ♪ She's mine, mine, mine, mine, mine ♪ 358 00:15:14,930 --> 00:15:16,660 ♪ Mine, mine, mine... ♪ 359 00:15:16,740 --> 00:15:18,200 So, that initial session 360 00:15:18,280 --> 00:15:20,940 with Michael and Paul happens in April. 361 00:15:21,140 --> 00:15:23,990 The actual formal sessions for Thriller 362 00:15:24,180 --> 00:15:25,770 didn't start for a couple months later. 363 00:15:25,850 --> 00:15:30,130 Yeah, Michael, did the demos at-at his home studio. 364 00:15:31,050 --> 00:15:34,470 Quincy invited me to go to Michael's house 365 00:15:34,670 --> 00:15:36,330 to listen to some demos. 366 00:15:36,530 --> 00:15:38,060 What I didn't realize was that 367 00:15:38,260 --> 00:15:40,790 we would be given our own private world premiere 368 00:15:40,990 --> 00:15:43,290 of "Billie Jean," "Beat It," "Wanna Be Startin' Somethin'." 369 00:15:43,370 --> 00:15:45,590 ♪ "Beat It" by Michael Jackson ♪ 370 00:15:45,790 --> 00:15:46,790 ♪ Beat it ♪ 371 00:15:46,980 --> 00:15:48,460 ♪ But you're driving me mad ♪ 372 00:15:48,610 --> 00:15:51,890 - ♪ So beat it, beat it ♪ - ♪ Beat it, beat it ♪ 373 00:15:52,090 --> 00:15:54,720 ♪ No one wants to be defeated ♪ 374 00:15:54,920 --> 00:15:58,710 ♪ Showing how funky, strong is your fight ♪ 375 00:15:58,910 --> 00:16:01,810 ♪ It doesn't matter who's wrong or right ♪ 376 00:16:02,010 --> 00:16:05,670 - ♪ Just beat it, beat it ♪ - ♪ Beat it, beat it ♪ 377 00:16:05,870 --> 00:16:08,010 ♪ No one wants to be defeated... ♪ 378 00:16:08,210 --> 00:16:10,150 Well, the songwriting process 379 00:16:10,230 --> 00:16:12,720 is something that's very difficult to explain 380 00:16:12,920 --> 00:16:14,400 because it's very spiritual. 381 00:16:14,530 --> 00:16:16,810 ♪ Who's wrong or right, just beat it... ♪ 382 00:16:17,010 --> 00:16:20,600 It's, it really is in the hands of God, 383 00:16:20,800 --> 00:16:23,290 and it's as if it's been written already. 384 00:16:23,490 --> 00:16:24,860 That's the real truth. 385 00:16:25,060 --> 00:16:28,050 As if it's been written in its entirety before you were born 386 00:16:28,250 --> 00:16:30,550 and you're just really the source 387 00:16:30,750 --> 00:16:32,550 through which the songs come. 388 00:16:32,750 --> 00:16:34,430 Really, because they're... 389 00:16:34,630 --> 00:16:37,080 they just fall right into your lap in its entirety. 390 00:16:37,280 --> 00:16:41,710 You don't have to do much, thinking about it. 391 00:16:41,910 --> 00:16:45,900 And I feel guilty having to put my name sometimes on the songs, 392 00:16:46,100 --> 00:16:47,820 but I-I do write them. 393 00:16:48,020 --> 00:16:51,010 I compose them. I write them. I-I do the scoring. 394 00:16:51,210 --> 00:16:53,090 I do the lyrics. I do the melody. 395 00:16:53,290 --> 00:16:56,760 But still it's... it's the work of God. 396 00:16:56,970 --> 00:16:58,240 "Startin' Somethin'" was wild. You know, 397 00:16:58,320 --> 00:17:00,160 he had all this... 398 00:17:00,240 --> 00:17:02,470 ♪ "Wanna Be Startin' Somethin' by Michael Jackson ♪ 399 00:17:02,550 --> 00:17:04,710 "Wanna Be Startin' Somethin'" 400 00:17:04,890 --> 00:17:08,360 has the frenetic percussion of Off the Wall, 401 00:17:08,560 --> 00:17:09,840 which is amazing because 402 00:17:09,940 --> 00:17:12,070 it's like, you have these incredibly tight drum grooves 403 00:17:12,150 --> 00:17:13,950 and these programmed beats now. 404 00:17:14,150 --> 00:17:15,910 I think that's why, for-for me, 405 00:17:16,110 --> 00:17:18,450 "Wanna Be Startin' Somethin'" is still my favorite. 406 00:17:18,530 --> 00:17:22,600 I remember just, being able to go out and do the demo 407 00:17:22,800 --> 00:17:24,160 at Hayvenhurst, yeah. 408 00:17:24,240 --> 00:17:25,980 He had it before we got there, 409 00:17:26,060 --> 00:17:27,390 and then h-he just, you know, 410 00:17:27,470 --> 00:17:29,060 shared it with us and we worked out the parts. 411 00:17:29,140 --> 00:17:30,440 And we just had to perfect it, 412 00:17:30,520 --> 00:17:32,340 because it's so rhythmic and all that. 413 00:17:32,420 --> 00:17:34,440 And so he knew the sound, he knew the... 414 00:17:34,520 --> 00:17:38,120 the rhythm that he wanted to hear and everything, 415 00:17:38,320 --> 00:17:40,160 so like I said, we were quick. 416 00:17:40,360 --> 00:17:42,790 - ♪ Too low to get under ♪ - ♪ Yeah, yeah ♪ 417 00:17:42,990 --> 00:17:44,330 ♪ Stuck in the middle ♪ 418 00:17:44,530 --> 00:17:46,230 - ♪ Yeah, yeah ♪ - ♪ And the pain is thunder ♪ 419 00:17:46,310 --> 00:17:48,050 - ♪ Yeah ♪ - ♪ Hard to get over ♪ 420 00:17:57,450 --> 00:18:00,540 There's a certain approach, you know, you want to take to... 421 00:18:00,740 --> 00:18:02,600 you know, to emphasize the feeling. 422 00:18:02,800 --> 00:18:08,020 I would say that Quincy helped glue those elements together 423 00:18:08,220 --> 00:18:09,980 and make an arc out of the progression 424 00:18:10,060 --> 00:18:14,180 of how the song started to... to the vamp at the end, 425 00:18:14,380 --> 00:18:16,530 and made it seamless, you know, including horns, 426 00:18:16,610 --> 00:18:18,530 which, of course, at-at first thought, 427 00:18:18,730 --> 00:18:20,110 would be considered too jazzy, 428 00:18:20,190 --> 00:18:22,280 but they blended perfectly well in the song later on. 429 00:18:22,360 --> 00:18:24,480 - ♪ Yeah, yeah ♪ - ♪ Too high to get over ♪ 430 00:18:24,570 --> 00:18:26,430 - ♪ Yeah, yeah ♪ - ♪ You're too low to get under ♪ 431 00:18:26,510 --> 00:18:28,640 - ♪ Yeah, yeah ♪ - ♪ You're stuck in the middle ♪ 432 00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:31,340 - ♪ Yeah, yeah ♪ - ♪ And the pain is thunder... ♪ 433 00:18:31,540 --> 00:18:35,510 But there's still that... 434 00:18:41,070 --> 00:18:42,850 And then at the end, 435 00:18:43,050 --> 00:18:44,410 when it goes a cappella to... 436 00:18:44,490 --> 00:18:46,250 ♪ Mama se, mama sa, ma-ma coo sa ♪ 437 00:18:46,450 --> 00:18:48,420 That, as a DJ... that is your best friend 438 00:18:48,620 --> 00:18:52,840 because then you start to mix in your next record 439 00:18:53,040 --> 00:18:54,920 and blending in whatever the biggest songs you have. 440 00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:56,630 ♪ Mama se, mama sa, ma-ma coo sa ♪ 441 00:18:59,000 --> 00:19:00,570 ♪ Mama se, mama sa, ma-ma coo sa ♪ 442 00:19:00,650 --> 00:19:02,430 - ♪ Hee, hee, hee ♪ - ♪ Mama se, mama sa ♪ 443 00:19:02,510 --> 00:19:04,260 - ♪ Ma-ma coo sa ♪ - ♪ Help me sing it ♪ 444 00:19:04,340 --> 00:19:06,010 ♪ Mama se, mama sa, ma-ma coo sa ♪ 445 00:19:06,090 --> 00:19:07,640 - ♪ Hoo, hoo ♪ - ♪ Mama se, mama sa ♪ 446 00:19:07,720 --> 00:19:09,310 - ♪ Ma-ma coo sa ♪ - ♪ Hee, hee ♪ 447 00:19:09,390 --> 00:19:11,020 ♪ Mama se, mama sa, ma-ma coo sa ♪ 448 00:19:11,100 --> 00:19:12,650 ♪ Mama se, mama sa, ma-ma coo sa ♪ 449 00:19:12,730 --> 00:19:14,330 - ♪ Sing it to the world ♪ - ♪ Mama se, mama sa... ♪ 450 00:19:14,410 --> 00:19:15,900 As a matter of fact, I asked him 451 00:19:15,980 --> 00:19:17,380 what "mama se, mama sa, ma-ma coo sa" meant, 452 00:19:17,460 --> 00:19:19,200 you know, while it was going down. 453 00:19:19,400 --> 00:19:20,990 He... "Well, it don't mean nothing. 454 00:19:21,070 --> 00:19:22,320 Just sing it, you know," and... 455 00:19:22,400 --> 00:19:23,970 Yeah, and there it is, 456 00:19:24,050 --> 00:19:25,990 because that was difficult to do, I'm telling you. 457 00:19:26,070 --> 00:19:28,210 He said, "I like singing with you all 458 00:19:28,410 --> 00:19:30,290 because you sound like me." 459 00:19:30,490 --> 00:19:32,940 He always thought our voices blended so well 460 00:19:33,140 --> 00:19:35,190 with-with his. 461 00:19:35,270 --> 00:19:36,520 "Wanna Be Startin' Somethin'" 462 00:19:36,600 --> 00:19:38,360 was like... it was like an opportunity 463 00:19:38,440 --> 00:19:40,030 to kind of get into his mind. 464 00:19:40,230 --> 00:19:44,120 And this idea of, like, "Billie Jean" 465 00:19:44,320 --> 00:19:47,020 and the fact that he was living kind of in this... 466 00:19:47,220 --> 00:19:48,250 this world where 467 00:19:48,450 --> 00:19:50,250 you didn't really know what was real or wasn't. 468 00:19:50,330 --> 00:19:51,980 ♪ "Billie Jean" by Michael Jackson ♪ 469 00:19:52,060 --> 00:19:54,030 ♪ She told me I was a lonely man ♪ 470 00:19:54,230 --> 00:19:55,440 ♪ And I felt sad ♪ 471 00:19:55,640 --> 00:19:58,150 ♪ She called my name, then she said hello ♪ 472 00:19:58,350 --> 00:20:00,800 ♪ All them who died ♪ 473 00:20:01,000 --> 00:20:04,910 ♪ And I sit in a cup in a ride ♪ 474 00:20:07,410 --> 00:20:09,520 ♪ It seems that you ♪ 475 00:20:15,880 --> 00:20:17,400 My mom had just bought 476 00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:19,840 a stereo system, and it had lights. 477 00:20:20,040 --> 00:20:21,050 The drums kicked in. 478 00:20:24,890 --> 00:20:26,620 And then... 479 00:20:26,820 --> 00:20:28,330 I mean... What? 480 00:20:28,530 --> 00:20:31,600 And I ran down the hallway just to hear closely 481 00:20:31,800 --> 00:20:34,770 what was... what was playing, what this record was. 482 00:20:34,970 --> 00:20:36,850 And it was "Billie Jean," and it was on 483 00:20:36,930 --> 00:20:38,290 and poppin' from there. 484 00:20:38,370 --> 00:20:41,660 It's actually kind of nasty, and you can hear the room mics 485 00:20:41,860 --> 00:20:43,190 and it's dirtier than you think. 486 00:20:43,270 --> 00:20:44,610 You know, you always have that moment where 487 00:20:44,690 --> 00:20:46,550 you fall in love with an artist for the first time. 488 00:20:46,630 --> 00:20:49,460 Really truly great, legendary artists, 489 00:20:49,660 --> 00:20:53,020 you have that same feeling over and over and over again. 490 00:20:53,220 --> 00:20:54,700 "Billie Jean" was that moment 491 00:20:54,830 --> 00:20:57,670 where I fell in love with Michael all over again. 492 00:21:03,090 --> 00:21:04,450 When Michael sings it, 493 00:21:04,650 --> 00:21:09,160 he puts the funk into it the way he does all the... 494 00:21:11,550 --> 00:21:13,880 and all the little stuff that he puts in. 495 00:21:14,080 --> 00:21:15,440 That gives it the syncopation. 496 00:21:15,520 --> 00:21:17,960 And if I just go... 497 00:21:18,160 --> 00:21:21,610 he's gonna go... 498 00:21:22,440 --> 00:21:25,030 ♪ She was more like a beauty queen ♪ 499 00:21:25,230 --> 00:21:26,720 ♪ From a movie scene ♪ 500 00:21:26,800 --> 00:21:28,450 ♪ I said, "Don't mind ♪ 501 00:21:28,530 --> 00:21:31,210 ♪ But what do you mean I am the one ♪ 502 00:21:31,410 --> 00:21:36,330 ♪ Who will dance on the floor in the round?" ♪ 503 00:21:37,210 --> 00:21:39,740 ♪ She said I am the one ♪ 504 00:21:39,930 --> 00:21:43,260 ♪ Who will dance on the floor in the round ♪ 505 00:21:46,680 --> 00:21:49,430 ♪ She told me her name was Billie Jean ♪ 506 00:21:49,630 --> 00:21:50,950 ♪ As she caused a scene ♪ 507 00:21:51,130 --> 00:21:52,450 ♪ Then every head turned ♪ 508 00:21:52,550 --> 00:21:54,080 ♪ With eyes that dreamed... ♪ 509 00:21:54,280 --> 00:21:56,730 Everybody loves toxic R and B. 510 00:21:56,930 --> 00:21:59,920 "Billie Jean is not my lover. She's just a girl 511 00:22:00,120 --> 00:22:01,360 who claims that I am the one"? 512 00:22:01,440 --> 00:22:03,230 Yeah, that's like, was it his side chick? 513 00:22:03,310 --> 00:22:05,490 You know what I'm saying? Was it some chick who, 514 00:22:05,570 --> 00:22:07,570 you know, he had an encounter with and got pregnant? 515 00:22:07,650 --> 00:22:09,890 Is this real, or is this some delusional fan 516 00:22:10,090 --> 00:22:12,480 who is saying that, you know, 517 00:22:12,680 --> 00:22:14,870 they had an encounter that they did or didn't? 518 00:22:15,070 --> 00:22:16,410 All of those things just led you 519 00:22:16,490 --> 00:22:20,070 to be more intrigued about an artist, right? 520 00:22:20,270 --> 00:22:23,380 But it was, like, urgent and R and B. 521 00:22:23,580 --> 00:22:25,190 It was... it was crazy. It was a... 522 00:22:25,270 --> 00:22:27,220 an amazing R and B record, and his lyrics... 523 00:22:27,300 --> 00:22:29,490 You know, "The kid is not my son," I mean... 524 00:22:29,690 --> 00:22:32,520 ♪ The kid is not my son... ♪ 525 00:22:32,720 --> 00:22:34,430 "The kid is not my son." 526 00:22:34,510 --> 00:22:37,500 That first... well, that... we-we like bad boys, 527 00:22:37,700 --> 00:22:39,230 so that made us love him some more. 528 00:22:39,310 --> 00:22:42,030 And then when I saw the video, I was losing my mind. 529 00:22:42,230 --> 00:22:43,880 I lost my voice, screaming. 530 00:22:44,080 --> 00:22:46,090 You know, it was about "Billie Jean." 531 00:22:46,290 --> 00:22:48,820 You know, him stepping on, you know, the-the pavement, 532 00:22:48,900 --> 00:22:52,450 it glowing and, you know, making you feel the magic. 533 00:22:52,650 --> 00:22:55,530 I'd storyboarded that, he would walk down the... 534 00:22:55,700 --> 00:22:57,680 the street and the paving stones would light up. 535 00:22:57,760 --> 00:22:59,540 And I showed him which 11 paving stones 536 00:22:59,620 --> 00:23:01,070 we could afford to have light up 537 00:23:01,270 --> 00:23:03,090 and therefore which ones couldn't. 538 00:23:03,290 --> 00:23:04,480 And he looked carefully at them, 539 00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:06,420 and-and I said, "Well, should we rehearse it?" 540 00:23:06,500 --> 00:23:08,620 And he said, "No, let-let's just do it." 541 00:23:08,820 --> 00:23:11,240 And we ran the playback, the music, 542 00:23:11,440 --> 00:23:13,930 and the chorus kicked in for "Billie Jean," 543 00:23:14,130 --> 00:23:16,440 and he began his dance movement 544 00:23:16,640 --> 00:23:18,450 down that street, and I'll never forget it. 545 00:23:18,530 --> 00:23:20,270 The-the camera actually steamed up. 546 00:23:20,350 --> 00:23:22,960 I could hardly even see him through the-the eyepiece 547 00:23:23,040 --> 00:23:24,050 because it was 548 00:23:24,250 --> 00:23:25,950 so exciting to watch. 549 00:23:26,150 --> 00:23:28,340 Michael is doing so much moving 550 00:23:28,540 --> 00:23:31,530 that Steve isn't even getting. 551 00:23:31,730 --> 00:23:33,450 There are several shots in "Billie Jean" 552 00:23:33,530 --> 00:23:36,850 where he's just being shot from the waist up 553 00:23:37,050 --> 00:23:39,860 and you can just see him doing all kinds of stuff. 554 00:23:40,050 --> 00:23:41,050 And it's like, 555 00:23:41,140 --> 00:23:42,420 "Why aren't you getting that?" 556 00:23:42,500 --> 00:23:44,340 But that's just how new 557 00:23:44,540 --> 00:23:48,380 the medium was to capturing dancers. 558 00:23:48,580 --> 00:23:50,320 Michael opened the door for that. 559 00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:51,870 ♪ I am the one... ♪ 560 00:23:52,070 --> 00:23:54,280 And every time they just kept freezing him in those brackets, 561 00:23:54,360 --> 00:23:56,400 and every time he'd walk, they froze him. 562 00:23:56,510 --> 00:23:57,910 And every time he said something, 563 00:23:57,990 --> 00:24:00,920 I just was losing my mind 'cause I loved him so much. 564 00:24:01,120 --> 00:24:02,230 But on "Billie Jean," 565 00:24:02,430 --> 00:24:05,420 we was like, "He is super-duper-duper sexy." 566 00:24:05,620 --> 00:24:08,070 - ♪ Not my lover ♪ - ♪ Don't call me, Billie Jean ♪ 567 00:24:08,270 --> 00:24:10,300 ♪ Billie Jean is not my lover... ♪ 568 00:24:10,500 --> 00:24:13,530 MTV refused to play "Billie Jean." 569 00:24:13,730 --> 00:24:16,140 They said, "Well, our network appeals to, 570 00:24:16,340 --> 00:24:17,660 you know, white teenagers, 571 00:24:17,740 --> 00:24:20,540 and this just really doesn't fit our format." 572 00:24:20,740 --> 00:24:22,060 ♪ hard rock guitar riff ♪ 573 00:24:22,260 --> 00:24:23,840 This is it. 574 00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:26,110 Welcome to MTV Music Television. 575 00:24:26,310 --> 00:24:27,310 I'm Mark Goodman. 576 00:24:27,500 --> 00:24:29,090 - I'm Martha Quinn. - I'm Alan Hunter. 577 00:24:29,170 --> 00:24:31,210 You'll never look at music the same way again. 578 00:24:31,290 --> 00:24:32,740 Turn it on! Leave it on! 579 00:24:32,940 --> 00:24:36,200 America, see the music you want to see. 580 00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:37,790 I want my MTV. 581 00:24:37,990 --> 00:24:40,190 Some prominent Black musicians are complaining 582 00:24:40,340 --> 00:24:42,450 that they are being left out of the video market, 583 00:24:42,530 --> 00:24:45,110 specifically the Music Television cable operation. 584 00:24:45,310 --> 00:24:47,880 It-it occurred to me, having watched MTV 585 00:24:48,080 --> 00:24:50,600 over the last few months, um, that it's-it's got a... 586 00:24:50,730 --> 00:24:53,890 it's a solid enterprise and it's got a lot going for it. 587 00:24:54,090 --> 00:24:56,700 I'm just floored by the fact that there's so many Bl... 588 00:24:56,780 --> 00:24:58,870 so few Black artists featured on it. 589 00:24:59,070 --> 00:25:00,230 Why is that? 590 00:25:00,430 --> 00:25:03,560 The fact is, quite frankly, we're a rock and roll station. 591 00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:07,250 MTV will deny this till the world ends, 592 00:25:07,460 --> 00:25:10,610 that they had nothing against Black artists. 593 00:25:10,810 --> 00:25:14,660 But they refused to, play Michael. 594 00:25:14,860 --> 00:25:17,160 In 1975, I was named 595 00:25:17,360 --> 00:25:19,430 president of the CBS Records Group 596 00:25:19,630 --> 00:25:22,350 and a vice president of CBS, Inc. 597 00:25:22,550 --> 00:25:26,230 No single record changed the business and my life 598 00:25:26,430 --> 00:25:30,070 as powerfully as Michael Jackson's Thriller. 599 00:25:30,270 --> 00:25:32,050 I screamed bloody murder 600 00:25:32,250 --> 00:25:34,680 when MTV refused to air his videos. 601 00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:37,430 They argued that their format, white rock, 602 00:25:37,630 --> 00:25:39,310 excluded Michael's music. 603 00:25:39,510 --> 00:25:41,560 I argued they were racist assholes. 604 00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:43,810 So Walter Yetnikoff said, 605 00:25:44,010 --> 00:25:45,020 "Really? Okay. 606 00:25:45,220 --> 00:25:46,560 If you don't play Michael Jackson, 607 00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:49,920 I'm pulling Billy Joel and everybody else that I have, 608 00:25:50,120 --> 00:25:51,200 off of MTV." 609 00:25:51,390 --> 00:25:53,400 I've never been more forceful 610 00:25:53,480 --> 00:25:54,700 or obnoxious. 611 00:25:54,900 --> 00:25:56,620 I've also never been as effective. 612 00:25:56,800 --> 00:25:59,790 With added pressure from Quincy Jones, they caved in, 613 00:25:59,990 --> 00:26:04,290 and in doing so, the MTV color line came crashing down. 614 00:26:04,490 --> 00:26:06,100 One of the most important 615 00:26:06,180 --> 00:26:08,880 things about Thriller was the doors that it opened 616 00:26:09,080 --> 00:26:12,470 for other artists to have the opportunity 617 00:26:12,670 --> 00:26:14,110 to get on the pop charts. 618 00:26:14,310 --> 00:26:17,180 Tina Turner. My God, Private Dancer. 619 00:26:17,380 --> 00:26:18,450 That's who it was. 620 00:26:18,650 --> 00:26:20,970 It was Tina, it was Lionel, it was Whitney, 621 00:26:21,170 --> 00:26:23,350 it was Michael and Prince. 622 00:26:23,550 --> 00:26:25,330 Revenues could just be crazy. 623 00:26:25,530 --> 00:26:27,750 ♪ Quiet, hypnotic music ♪ 624 00:26:27,950 --> 00:26:30,170 Thriller changes the dynamic 625 00:26:30,370 --> 00:26:31,760 and the culture. 626 00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:34,570 Michael shows the way that this is possible. 627 00:26:34,770 --> 00:26:36,570 Yeah, I-I grew up, 628 00:26:36,770 --> 00:26:40,370 during the time that Thriller was released, 629 00:26:40,570 --> 00:26:44,540 and MTV was just becoming a really big thing. 630 00:26:44,740 --> 00:26:47,610 I remember almost more vividly 631 00:26:47,810 --> 00:26:51,460 the amazing storytelling through the videos, 632 00:26:51,660 --> 00:26:54,070 which is pretty interesting 'cause I think here we are 633 00:26:54,150 --> 00:26:57,620 40 years later, and the music and the video 634 00:26:57,820 --> 00:27:01,140 is coming to life again for the next generation 635 00:27:01,340 --> 00:27:02,340 on TikTok. 636 00:27:02,510 --> 00:27:05,040 Michael Jackson's music has been available 637 00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:08,060 on TikTok since August 2020. 638 00:27:08,260 --> 00:27:10,500 I think there's a real rebirth 639 00:27:10,700 --> 00:27:14,740 of the music and the video from these songs on the album. 640 00:27:14,940 --> 00:27:18,050 And it is this new generation that's being exposed 641 00:27:18,250 --> 00:27:20,600 or engaging with the music. 642 00:27:20,800 --> 00:27:23,560 There are about ten million 643 00:27:23,760 --> 00:27:26,480 video creations on TikTok right now 644 00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:29,080 that include music from Thriller. 645 00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:32,320 There are 17 billion views 646 00:27:32,520 --> 00:27:35,720 of those ten million videos that exist. 647 00:27:35,920 --> 00:27:40,490 There are about two billion likes on those videos, 648 00:27:40,690 --> 00:27:42,600 so people putting a little thumbs-up 649 00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:46,440 or sharing or doing something to say, "I'm excited about this. 650 00:27:46,630 --> 00:27:49,000 I'm engaging with this-this music." 651 00:27:49,200 --> 00:27:50,440 Pretty massive numbers. 652 00:27:50,640 --> 00:27:52,290 They're hearing it for the first time. 653 00:27:52,370 --> 00:27:53,420 They're-they're like... 654 00:27:53,500 --> 00:27:54,730 You know, it's-it's the same feeling 655 00:27:54,810 --> 00:27:56,840 we maybe had when we watched the MTV video 656 00:27:56,920 --> 00:27:59,050 for "Thriller" or "Beat It." 657 00:27:59,550 --> 00:28:02,560 They're having that same experience 40 years later, 658 00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:04,550 but rather than just watch, they're actually 659 00:28:04,630 --> 00:28:08,890 then making something to engage with that music. 660 00:28:10,810 --> 00:28:12,580 I was kind of upset about 661 00:28:12,660 --> 00:28:16,630 the news I heard about MTV and how they weren't showing Blacks, 662 00:28:16,830 --> 00:28:18,150 and that kind of hurt me. 663 00:28:18,330 --> 00:28:21,390 So I wanted to do something that was so powerful, 664 00:28:21,590 --> 00:28:25,950 so strong that everybody would have to show it. 665 00:28:26,150 --> 00:28:28,600 But I wanted to tell a strong story. 666 00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:30,520 The story had to sell itself. 667 00:28:30,720 --> 00:28:33,520 And what... these so-called videos weren't doing that. 668 00:28:33,660 --> 00:28:35,920 They were terrible. They were just a lot of nothing 669 00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:37,780 put together just to sell a song. 670 00:28:37,980 --> 00:28:39,650 I wanted my things to be powerful. 671 00:28:39,730 --> 00:28:41,550 I wanted to stand out from everything else 672 00:28:41,630 --> 00:28:43,590 that when you see it, you run to the set 673 00:28:43,670 --> 00:28:45,470 and you're glued to it, watching it. 674 00:28:45,570 --> 00:28:47,030 I wanted quality. I wanted excellence. 675 00:28:47,110 --> 00:28:50,230 I wanted the best. I wanted to perfect perfection. 676 00:28:50,430 --> 00:28:52,020 One thing that I can 677 00:28:52,220 --> 00:28:53,230 always say about Michael 678 00:28:53,310 --> 00:28:55,750 is that you felt like there was a sense of culture. 679 00:28:55,870 --> 00:28:57,860 And the culture would span all the way 680 00:28:58,060 --> 00:29:02,620 from kind of like this Broadway, you know, more theatrical world, 681 00:29:02,820 --> 00:29:05,660 and then there was this other element that was cultural, 682 00:29:05,860 --> 00:29:07,520 that was almost like gangsters. 683 00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:09,660 ♪ "Beat It" by Michael Jackson ♪ 684 00:29:19,840 --> 00:29:21,720 You know, when you look at "Beat It" 685 00:29:21,900 --> 00:29:24,680 and the idea that the people of that era felt like, 686 00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:26,890 "He's speaking to us and with us. 687 00:29:27,090 --> 00:29:29,810 He's rocking with us. He's making music for us. 688 00:29:30,010 --> 00:29:32,190 We can dance to his music." 689 00:29:45,780 --> 00:29:47,870 It was an incredible move to decide, 690 00:29:48,070 --> 00:29:50,580 "We're gonna have a rock and roll record 691 00:29:50,780 --> 00:29:51,790 on this thing." 692 00:29:51,990 --> 00:29:54,440 "Beat It" was straight up rock and roll. 693 00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:56,100 Michael's idea with "Beat It" 694 00:29:56,180 --> 00:29:58,320 was to distance himself from Off the Wall, 695 00:29:58,520 --> 00:29:59,860 from the dance, disco. 696 00:30:00,060 --> 00:30:01,440 And Michael wanted to stretch. 697 00:30:01,520 --> 00:30:02,960 Creatively, he wanted to stretch. 698 00:30:03,040 --> 00:30:05,420 They wanted a crossover hit across the board. 699 00:30:05,500 --> 00:30:07,450 Rock, R and B, pop. 700 00:30:07,650 --> 00:30:10,720 They called me to come in with Michael and Quincy 701 00:30:10,930 --> 00:30:14,270 to do the... 702 00:30:14,810 --> 00:30:16,730 They want to go rock and roll, let's do it. 703 00:30:16,810 --> 00:30:19,920 You know, so I did it with all... you know, all-all that, 704 00:30:20,120 --> 00:30:21,750 doubled it and made it sound huge. 705 00:30:21,830 --> 00:30:23,820 And then I played the bass on it as well. 706 00:30:23,900 --> 00:30:25,740 I did play bass on that record as well. 707 00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:28,490 So I sat with them and made that swing, 708 00:30:28,690 --> 00:30:30,490 and when Michael was dancing in the room, 709 00:30:30,570 --> 00:30:31,740 I knew I was in the pocket. 710 00:30:31,820 --> 00:30:33,120 When he wrote "Beat It," 711 00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:35,850 he said, "I want a kind of guitar player on here 712 00:30:36,050 --> 00:30:41,000 that will attract young, white, teenage males." 713 00:30:41,210 --> 00:30:42,250 Eddie Van Halen. 714 00:30:42,750 --> 00:30:44,960 He said, "Well, what do you want me to do?" 715 00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:46,160 And Quincy said, "Well, 716 00:30:46,360 --> 00:30:47,450 I want you to be you. 717 00:30:47,650 --> 00:30:48,950 That's you right there." And he pointed 718 00:30:49,030 --> 00:30:50,910 to the famous, you know, Strat that he had. 719 00:30:50,990 --> 00:30:53,550 And he said, "I'm not gonna tell you what to play. 720 00:30:53,680 --> 00:30:54,680 You go be you." 721 00:30:54,840 --> 00:30:56,060 I mean, Eddie ripped 722 00:30:56,140 --> 00:30:57,850 these solos off one after the other. 723 00:31:12,120 --> 00:31:13,910 I remember, like, hearing 724 00:31:13,990 --> 00:31:15,460 the sound coming from Studio A, 725 00:31:15,660 --> 00:31:17,290 where he was doing the-the solo. 726 00:31:17,490 --> 00:31:18,540 It was so loud. 727 00:31:18,740 --> 00:31:19,840 I could... I just... 728 00:31:20,040 --> 00:31:20,880 It was just so loud. 729 00:31:21,080 --> 00:31:23,900 Bruce Swedien and Quincy brilliantly 730 00:31:24,100 --> 00:31:25,760 edited that solo together. 731 00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:27,840 I mean, I think I probably just loved it 732 00:31:27,940 --> 00:31:29,720 'cause, at that moment, it was probably everything 733 00:31:29,800 --> 00:31:31,890 that I ever loved in one song, you know? 734 00:31:32,090 --> 00:31:34,060 I've done way more time googling 735 00:31:34,260 --> 00:31:38,670 Lukather's tone on "Beat It" than, um, Eddie Van Halen's, 736 00:31:38,870 --> 00:31:40,880 because it's the tone that drives 737 00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:42,440 the whole record... That's the riff. 738 00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:46,420 It's the perfect way that, like, a rock guitar could ever sit 739 00:31:46,620 --> 00:31:48,840 over programmed drums in a... in a... 740 00:31:49,040 --> 00:31:50,410 like, a funky groove. 741 00:31:50,610 --> 00:31:52,090 I thought his videos were incredible. 742 00:31:52,170 --> 00:31:53,950 I mean, first off, the guy could dance. 743 00:31:54,030 --> 00:31:55,280 I mean, just being in the room, 744 00:31:55,360 --> 00:31:57,640 watching him groove while we're playing. 745 00:31:57,840 --> 00:31:58,930 That short film... 746 00:31:59,010 --> 00:32:00,250 You see, this whole movie, 747 00:32:00,330 --> 00:32:02,500 it's about a big fight that's about to happen, right, 748 00:32:02,580 --> 00:32:03,980 between two rival gangs, right? 749 00:32:04,060 --> 00:32:06,510 ♪ "Beat It" by Michael Jackson ♪ 750 00:32:16,550 --> 00:32:17,850 ♪ Beat it... ♪ 751 00:32:18,050 --> 00:32:20,650 He saw value in street culture. 752 00:32:20,850 --> 00:32:22,600 He wanted to try to figure out a way 753 00:32:22,680 --> 00:32:24,170 on how to incorporate it, and... 754 00:32:24,370 --> 00:32:26,590 and the beginning of it was "Beat It." 755 00:32:26,790 --> 00:32:28,310 The people that you see 756 00:32:28,420 --> 00:32:32,930 in that film are a mixture of dancers and street cats. 757 00:32:33,130 --> 00:32:34,640 And not only that 758 00:32:34,840 --> 00:32:37,700 is that you actually had real gangsters on set. 759 00:32:37,910 --> 00:32:39,500 Like, real Bloods and Crips 760 00:32:39,700 --> 00:32:41,880 and Vatos and all that, like, for real. 761 00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:43,790 There was such a magic 762 00:32:43,870 --> 00:32:45,210 in Michael and his movement. 763 00:32:45,290 --> 00:32:48,260 ♪ No one wants to be defeated, Lord ♪ 764 00:32:48,460 --> 00:32:51,720 ♪ Showin' how funky and strong is your fight ♪ 765 00:32:51,920 --> 00:32:54,870 ♪ It doesn't matter who's wrong or right ♪ 766 00:32:55,070 --> 00:32:56,540 ♪ Just beat it... ♪ 767 00:32:56,740 --> 00:32:57,820 You had B-boying 768 00:32:57,900 --> 00:32:59,350 that was going on in New York. 769 00:32:59,550 --> 00:33:00,760 You had popping and locking 770 00:33:00,840 --> 00:33:02,410 that was going down over here in California, 771 00:33:02,490 --> 00:33:05,770 and strutting and-and robotting, all them. 772 00:33:05,970 --> 00:33:07,400 So the guy that's vibrating 773 00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:10,320 in the "Beat It" short film with the... with the glasses on, 774 00:33:10,520 --> 00:33:11,680 his name is Robot Dane. 775 00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:13,140 This is the first ever 776 00:33:13,340 --> 00:33:16,120 street dance wave of the United States of America. 777 00:33:16,320 --> 00:33:19,390 ♪ Showin' how funky and strong is your fight ♪ 778 00:33:19,590 --> 00:33:20,780 ♪ It doesn't matter... ♪ 779 00:33:20,860 --> 00:33:22,410 The most relevant scene 780 00:33:22,490 --> 00:33:27,130 at the time, which either was breakdancing, locking, 781 00:33:27,330 --> 00:33:29,950 popping, waving, whatever it might have been, 782 00:33:30,140 --> 00:33:31,880 he's pushing the envelope forward, 783 00:33:32,080 --> 00:33:34,900 he's teaching us some things, he's informing us as artists, 784 00:33:34,980 --> 00:33:36,990 but also, too, as performers, 785 00:33:37,190 --> 00:33:40,710 he's letting us know that, "Yo, I want to be the baddest." 786 00:33:40,910 --> 00:33:42,810 As a fan or a critic, 787 00:33:43,010 --> 00:33:45,840 you're always looking for breathtaking moments, 788 00:33:46,040 --> 00:33:47,080 the time when you say, 789 00:33:47,180 --> 00:33:48,520 "I've never seen anything like that. 790 00:33:48,600 --> 00:33:51,740 I'm probably not gonna see anything like that again." 791 00:33:51,940 --> 00:33:53,360 The Motown show, 792 00:33:53,560 --> 00:33:55,910 that's what I think was the most important step 793 00:33:56,110 --> 00:34:00,450 in the whole Thriller process of making him the superstar. 794 00:34:00,650 --> 00:34:03,750 ♪ And I'll be there ♪ 795 00:34:03,950 --> 00:34:06,750 ♪ Whoo! ♪ 796 00:34:08,670 --> 00:34:10,190 Bob Jones was, 797 00:34:10,390 --> 00:34:13,220 vice president of publicity at Motown. 798 00:34:13,420 --> 00:34:14,420 He says, 799 00:34:14,590 --> 00:34:16,700 "We're doing a Motown show." 800 00:34:16,900 --> 00:34:21,890 I rented a tuxedo, and, I went to the show. 801 00:34:22,090 --> 00:34:23,210 People just went crazy. 802 00:34:23,410 --> 00:34:25,290 I was home in front of the TV. 803 00:34:25,470 --> 00:34:28,360 Waiting for him to take us there. 804 00:34:28,560 --> 00:34:30,080 First, we didn't know what he was gonna do, 805 00:34:30,160 --> 00:34:31,900 because he was up there with his brothers. 806 00:34:31,980 --> 00:34:33,970 The Jacksons leave, 807 00:34:34,170 --> 00:34:36,780 the brothers leave, and Mike stays out there. 808 00:34:38,070 --> 00:34:39,160 And in the audience, 809 00:34:39,360 --> 00:34:41,410 you could hear just kind of like: 810 00:34:41,610 --> 00:34:44,660 "What's-what's getting ready to happen now?" 811 00:34:50,250 --> 00:34:53,170 And, you know, Mike goes through the whole... 812 00:34:53,370 --> 00:34:55,670 "Those were some great times. I love the-the old songs." 813 00:34:55,750 --> 00:34:57,260 You know, th-those were good songs. 814 00:34:57,340 --> 00:34:59,120 I-I like those songs a lot, 815 00:34:59,320 --> 00:35:02,910 but, especially, I like... 816 00:35:03,110 --> 00:35:05,010 "Billie Jean"! 817 00:35:05,090 --> 00:35:06,720 the new songs. 818 00:35:06,800 --> 00:35:08,790 And then here comes 819 00:35:08,990 --> 00:35:10,070 "Billie Jean." 820 00:35:18,740 --> 00:35:21,700 The tape that you can see 821 00:35:21,900 --> 00:35:23,160 of "Billie Jean" 822 00:35:23,360 --> 00:35:27,920 and the stuff you see going on in the audience, 823 00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:32,460 it does not capture what was happening in that crowd. 824 00:35:32,660 --> 00:35:34,920 These people were going 825 00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:37,130 absolutely berserk. 826 00:35:37,630 --> 00:35:40,830 ♪ Who will dance on the floor in the round? ♪ 827 00:35:41,030 --> 00:35:43,470 Mike just turned it the fuck out. 828 00:35:43,670 --> 00:35:47,480 ♪ People always told me, "Be careful of what you do ♪ 829 00:35:47,680 --> 00:35:50,790 ♪ Don't go around breakin' young girls' hearts" ♪ 830 00:35:50,990 --> 00:35:52,090 ♪ Hee-hee ♪ 831 00:35:52,290 --> 00:35:54,800 ♪ And Mother always told me... ♪ 832 00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:57,970 I mean, he just laid a bomb on that room. 833 00:35:58,170 --> 00:36:00,680 ♪ "'Cause the lie becomes the truth," hey, hey ♪ 834 00:36:00,880 --> 00:36:03,120 ♪ Billie Jean is not my... ♪ 835 00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:04,810 I was at that show 836 00:36:05,010 --> 00:36:06,350 at the Pasadena Civic Auditorium. 837 00:36:06,430 --> 00:36:08,970 And he's moving different. He's got his own moves now. 838 00:36:09,050 --> 00:36:12,040 He's not so much doing what-what he learned growing up, 839 00:36:12,240 --> 00:36:13,690 and he was excited about it. 840 00:36:13,890 --> 00:36:14,960 ♪ Hee-hee-hee ♪ 841 00:36:16,250 --> 00:36:18,180 We just was happy to see 842 00:36:18,380 --> 00:36:20,220 Michael Jackson perform, period. 843 00:36:20,420 --> 00:36:22,550 Nobody seen the moonwalk coming. 844 00:36:27,720 --> 00:36:28,810 ♪ She says I am... ♪ 845 00:36:29,010 --> 00:36:30,370 He does the moonwalk. 846 00:36:30,450 --> 00:36:32,210 That's the breathtaking moment, okay? 847 00:36:32,370 --> 00:36:34,250 And after the show, I couldn't believe it. 848 00:36:34,330 --> 00:36:36,290 I had to go backstage and to ask somebody, 849 00:36:36,440 --> 00:36:39,280 "Was there a special trick floor? 850 00:36:39,480 --> 00:36:41,160 How did he do that?" 851 00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:44,080 You know, this was the performance 852 00:36:44,280 --> 00:36:46,490 that really changed space and time. 853 00:36:46,990 --> 00:36:49,540 A few of his dances, we call 'em timekeepers. 854 00:36:49,740 --> 00:36:52,250 And he created a whole vocabulary of timekeepers, 855 00:36:52,450 --> 00:36:53,890 whether it's with his hip... 856 00:36:56,390 --> 00:36:58,210 or with his... you know, his side, 857 00:36:58,290 --> 00:37:00,760 - stomping with the ankle. - That's right. 858 00:37:02,090 --> 00:37:04,760 Or he'll stomp with the foot. 859 00:37:07,300 --> 00:37:09,520 With that, you can sing. 860 00:37:09,720 --> 00:37:10,840 You see what I'm saying? 861 00:37:11,030 --> 00:37:12,220 And it looks like you're dancing. 862 00:37:12,300 --> 00:37:13,540 - But you're really not. - It's an illu... 863 00:37:13,620 --> 00:37:15,210 It's-it's a bit of a trick, right? 864 00:37:15,290 --> 00:37:17,230 And you go... you walk over here. 865 00:37:19,850 --> 00:37:20,850 And switch the mic, 866 00:37:21,040 --> 00:37:23,200 flip the coat, put the hand in the pocket. 867 00:37:23,290 --> 00:37:25,380 You could do a few things here and there that only... 868 00:37:25,460 --> 00:37:28,180 only you can do if you know your song and your music. 869 00:37:30,260 --> 00:37:31,300 You know, when you see 870 00:37:31,470 --> 00:37:33,980 him glide across the floor or pop, 871 00:37:34,180 --> 00:37:35,630 it's a special effect. 872 00:37:35,830 --> 00:37:37,920 He saw magic in that dance. 873 00:37:38,420 --> 00:37:40,610 Look at that... If you pause each moment, 874 00:37:40,810 --> 00:37:42,250 it's an iconic silhouette. 875 00:37:42,330 --> 00:37:45,260 It's the hat, it's the arms, it's the... 876 00:37:45,460 --> 00:37:47,140 it's the tapping of the leg. 877 00:37:47,340 --> 00:37:48,970 Right? The kick. 878 00:37:52,350 --> 00:37:55,960 To see a Black man standing on his toes, 879 00:37:56,160 --> 00:37:59,320 seeing that and not being conscious of it 880 00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:02,220 has made generations of Black, brown, 881 00:38:02,420 --> 00:38:05,970 white, whatever color kids feel like anything was possible. 882 00:38:06,170 --> 00:38:10,100 It's bigger than I think we, think and acknowledge. 883 00:38:11,990 --> 00:38:13,600 After Mike finished, 884 00:38:13,800 --> 00:38:16,270 the producer had to get on the microphone and say, 885 00:38:16,350 --> 00:38:19,280 "Ladies and gentlemen, please, please, 886 00:38:19,480 --> 00:38:22,150 gather yourselves and take your seats. 887 00:38:22,350 --> 00:38:24,180 We have more show to tape. 888 00:38:24,380 --> 00:38:26,090 There's much more show coming." 889 00:38:26,290 --> 00:38:29,470 And it took a minute for people to get their ties back together 890 00:38:29,670 --> 00:38:31,960 and the women to put their wigs back on. 891 00:38:32,150 --> 00:38:34,030 Okay, I have one question for you. 892 00:38:34,110 --> 00:38:35,960 Who was the unfortunate artist 893 00:38:36,160 --> 00:38:38,690 who had to come on... 894 00:38:41,150 --> 00:38:43,610 I don't remember. 895 00:38:47,490 --> 00:38:49,400 I think that was the moment that he had 896 00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:52,310 his breakout moment from the... from the group. 897 00:38:52,510 --> 00:38:54,980 That song, "Billie Jean," 898 00:38:55,180 --> 00:38:58,110 and the way he performed it on that night 899 00:38:58,310 --> 00:39:00,610 set the standard of what it was to be a megastar. 900 00:39:00,810 --> 00:39:03,340 The next day after the show, Fred Astaire called my house. 901 00:39:03,420 --> 00:39:05,050 He said, "I saw the show last night. 902 00:39:05,130 --> 00:39:07,210 I taped it. I watched it twice this morning." 903 00:39:07,400 --> 00:39:08,740 And he said, "You were incredible. 904 00:39:08,820 --> 00:39:10,990 You're a hell of a mover, and you really put them 905 00:39:11,070 --> 00:39:12,850 on their A-S-S," he said. 906 00:39:13,050 --> 00:39:14,160 And I said, "God, thank you. 907 00:39:14,240 --> 00:39:15,850 It's so wonderful for you to say that, 908 00:39:15,930 --> 00:39:17,180 'cause I think you're the best." 909 00:39:17,260 --> 00:39:20,150 And that was my r-reward, 'cause I think he's brilliant. 910 00:39:20,350 --> 00:39:22,230 ♪ Tense, hypnotic music ♪ 911 00:39:24,100 --> 00:39:25,520 To a classical dancer, 912 00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:27,550 it's about your line, it's about the shapes 913 00:39:27,630 --> 00:39:28,970 that you're-you're making. 914 00:39:29,170 --> 00:39:30,700 And Michael does that. 915 00:39:30,900 --> 00:39:33,770 That, to me, is very similar to a trained dancer, 916 00:39:33,970 --> 00:39:35,410 even though he wasn't trained. 917 00:39:35,570 --> 00:39:38,750 He would've been the ideal ballet dancer. 918 00:39:38,950 --> 00:39:40,520 The proportions of his body. 919 00:39:40,720 --> 00:39:45,050 He was lean, and long, um, and just had, like, 920 00:39:45,250 --> 00:39:47,360 a natural instinct when he moved. 921 00:39:47,560 --> 00:39:50,890 But there... but there was such precision and clarity. 922 00:39:51,090 --> 00:39:52,430 He was a perfectionist, 923 00:39:52,630 --> 00:39:55,980 and that's what dancers are. 924 00:39:56,180 --> 00:39:59,020 Um, you know, you don't commit that type of time 925 00:39:59,220 --> 00:40:00,770 and sacrifice your body, 926 00:40:00,970 --> 00:40:02,590 the injury, all of those things, 927 00:40:02,790 --> 00:40:06,030 if you don't have the passion for it and the love for it. 928 00:40:06,230 --> 00:40:09,010 And all of that sums up Michael 929 00:40:09,210 --> 00:40:11,680 as a dancer, as a performer, as an artist. 930 00:40:11,880 --> 00:40:15,040 Michael Jackson didn't invent dancing on film, 931 00:40:15,240 --> 00:40:16,370 but his particular synthesis 932 00:40:16,450 --> 00:40:19,020 of the Nicholas Brothers on one hand 933 00:40:19,220 --> 00:40:23,110 and Bob Fosse, Astaire, popping, locking, 934 00:40:23,310 --> 00:40:25,230 moonwalking... no one had ever 935 00:40:25,430 --> 00:40:27,400 put those elements together before like that. 936 00:40:27,480 --> 00:40:29,380 You can see it all the way through from 937 00:40:29,580 --> 00:40:31,400 "Billie Jean" and "Beat It" and "Thriller," 938 00:40:31,480 --> 00:40:33,550 all the way through to all of these other artists. 939 00:40:33,630 --> 00:40:37,140 Look at MC Hammer, "U Can't Touch This." 940 00:40:37,760 --> 00:40:41,730 Then you go forward to, like, Usher and Justin Timberlake. 941 00:40:42,310 --> 00:40:45,090 And then you go farther forward to Justin Bieber, 942 00:40:45,290 --> 00:40:47,400 Doja Cat, Bruno Mars. 943 00:40:47,600 --> 00:40:49,080 Michael is emulated. 944 00:40:49,230 --> 00:40:52,180 If you look at BTS, you can see it. 945 00:40:53,650 --> 00:40:55,770 I'm all in with BTS. 946 00:40:55,960 --> 00:40:57,060 I love those guys. 947 00:40:57,260 --> 00:41:00,060 Every move they do is all Michael Jackson. 948 00:41:00,260 --> 00:41:02,110 Michael created that. 949 00:41:02,300 --> 00:41:04,500 The entire K-pop wave, 950 00:41:04,700 --> 00:41:06,500 they've all studied Michael 951 00:41:06,710 --> 00:41:11,550 in terms of stage clothes, video clothes and stagecraft. 952 00:41:11,750 --> 00:41:14,410 There's a great video if you watch BTS. 953 00:41:14,610 --> 00:41:16,390 There's a lot of Michael Jackson. 954 00:41:16,590 --> 00:41:17,890 You see it in their dancing. 955 00:41:17,970 --> 00:41:21,040 ♪ 'Cause I, I, I'm in the stars tonight ♪ 956 00:41:21,240 --> 00:41:25,750 ♪ So watch me bring the fire and set the night alight ♪ 957 00:41:25,950 --> 00:41:30,450 ♪ Shining through the city with a little funk and soul ♪ 958 00:41:30,650 --> 00:41:35,010 ♪ So I'm-a light it up like dynamite, whoa-♪ 959 00:41:35,210 --> 00:41:39,060 ♪ Dyn-na-na-na, na-na-na-na-na, na-na-na, life is dynamite ♪ 960 00:41:39,260 --> 00:41:40,260 ♪ Dyn-na-na-na... ♪ 961 00:41:40,430 --> 00:41:42,600 So, the entire K-pop movement, 962 00:41:42,800 --> 00:41:45,340 they're students of the game. 963 00:41:45,540 --> 00:41:48,570 You can look at a number of millennial hip-hop artists... 964 00:41:48,770 --> 00:41:50,420 Polo G being one of them... 965 00:41:50,620 --> 00:41:53,680 23, 24 years old, from Chicago, 966 00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:56,280 yet he's very much in trance with Michael Jackson 967 00:41:56,360 --> 00:41:58,040 and he uses Michael Jackson music 968 00:41:58,240 --> 00:41:59,640 and imagery in some of his music. 969 00:41:59,720 --> 00:42:01,620 ♪ Ha, smooth criminal, Mike Jack ♪ 970 00:42:01,820 --> 00:42:04,390 ♪ And I still like to tote a four-five like Mike back ♪ 971 00:42:04,470 --> 00:42:05,980 It was just a night I was riding around, 972 00:42:06,060 --> 00:42:08,250 I was riding in my car, and I was just listening 973 00:42:08,330 --> 00:42:09,940 to Michael Jackson interviews. 974 00:42:10,140 --> 00:42:11,340 I wasn't listening to music. 975 00:42:11,420 --> 00:42:12,730 I was just listening to his interviews. 976 00:42:12,810 --> 00:42:14,510 And I just came up with this idea, like, 977 00:42:14,590 --> 00:42:18,680 maybe I should do, this song and this instrumental 978 00:42:18,880 --> 00:42:20,950 and just really mess everybody head up 979 00:42:21,150 --> 00:42:22,350 'cause I know they wouldn't 980 00:42:22,430 --> 00:42:23,970 be expecting that from a young artist. 981 00:42:24,050 --> 00:42:26,310 ♪ Tell me, Annie, are you okay? Screaming out, "No way" ♪ 982 00:42:26,390 --> 00:42:27,980 ♪ Tell me, Annie, are you okay? ♪ 983 00:42:28,060 --> 00:42:32,090 'Cause I remember my grandma had this same exact album. 984 00:42:32,290 --> 00:42:33,650 My auntie, who was her daughter, 985 00:42:33,730 --> 00:42:35,370 she was a big Michael Jackson fan, 986 00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:37,280 so she always had us listening to him. 987 00:42:37,400 --> 00:42:39,990 So I remember her having this one exactly. 988 00:42:40,190 --> 00:42:41,530 It's pretty wild. 989 00:42:41,610 --> 00:42:45,420 It says how powerful the imagery that Michael created was. 990 00:42:45,620 --> 00:42:47,860 ♪ Soft, atmospheric music ♪ 991 00:42:49,750 --> 00:42:51,110 On Thriller, 992 00:42:51,310 --> 00:42:53,110 his life was evolving, you know, 993 00:42:53,310 --> 00:42:56,660 and his vocal approach was different. 994 00:42:56,860 --> 00:42:59,220 There's vocalists, and there's stylists. 995 00:42:59,420 --> 00:43:00,950 Style wins. 996 00:43:01,150 --> 00:43:03,200 When you can hear a person sing 997 00:43:03,410 --> 00:43:06,020 and recognize them fr-from the first couple bars, 998 00:43:06,220 --> 00:43:07,900 you know you got something special. 999 00:43:08,100 --> 00:43:09,210 They have a special tone, 1000 00:43:09,290 --> 00:43:11,150 a special voice, a special delivery. 1001 00:43:11,350 --> 00:43:12,560 Now, Michael had all of that. 1002 00:43:12,640 --> 00:43:14,920 In just the way he loved to dance 1003 00:43:15,130 --> 00:43:16,570 and-and he loved to perform, 1004 00:43:16,650 --> 00:43:20,600 he turned all of that melody that he was so great with 1005 00:43:20,800 --> 00:43:22,270 into percussive melody. 1006 00:43:22,470 --> 00:43:24,660 Well, that's what he did. He would sing drum parts. 1007 00:43:24,740 --> 00:43:26,250 He would sing bass lines. 1008 00:43:26,450 --> 00:43:28,850 He would, all with his rhythmic inflections. 1009 00:43:28,970 --> 00:43:30,460 We call it "drums in your mouth." 1010 00:43:30,540 --> 00:43:32,560 He would beatbox. He was an amazing beatboxer. 1011 00:43:32,640 --> 00:43:35,110 But beatbox with melody and sing, you know, 1012 00:43:35,310 --> 00:43:36,380 not just beatboxing. 1013 00:43:36,580 --> 00:43:38,780 He would, you know, integrate melody with it. 1014 00:43:38,900 --> 00:43:40,720 And you can hear it on "Beat It," you know, 1015 00:43:40,800 --> 00:43:43,410 just the way he would attack each syllable. 1016 00:43:43,610 --> 00:43:46,560 ♪ Just beat it, beat it ♪ 1017 00:43:46,760 --> 00:43:48,650 ♪ No one wants to be defeated ♪ 1018 00:43:50,390 --> 00:43:53,550 ♪ Showin' how funky, strong is your fight ♪ 1019 00:43:53,750 --> 00:43:57,280 ♪ It doesn't matter who's wrong or right ♪ 1020 00:43:57,480 --> 00:43:59,970 ♪ Just beat it ♪ 1021 00:44:00,170 --> 00:44:01,260 ♪ Beat it... ♪ 1022 00:44:01,460 --> 00:44:03,620 I think of all of his melodies and his songs, 1023 00:44:03,820 --> 00:44:05,410 and they're completely percussive. 1024 00:44:05,490 --> 00:44:07,720 I mean, they're incredibly rhythmically hooky, 1025 00:44:07,800 --> 00:44:10,640 and, you know, all those songs, and the songs that he wrote 1026 00:44:10,760 --> 00:44:13,041 have these very aggressive staccato rhythms. 1027 00:44:13,140 --> 00:44:16,240 I feel like "Billie Jean" and "Wanna Be Startin' Somethin'," 1028 00:44:16,440 --> 00:44:17,800 they're really short and stabby. 1029 00:44:17,900 --> 00:44:20,050 They're always, like... there's a tiny bit of, like, 1030 00:44:20,130 --> 00:44:22,390 anger and, like, contempt in the... in the... 1031 00:44:22,590 --> 00:44:24,200 in the way that he's singing and writing. 1032 00:44:24,280 --> 00:44:26,440 ♪ I know I am someone ♪ 1033 00:44:26,550 --> 00:44:28,480 ♪ And let the truth unfurl ♪ 1034 00:44:28,680 --> 00:44:30,480 ♪ No one can hurt you now ♪ 1035 00:44:30,680 --> 00:44:32,440 ♪ Because you know what's true ♪ 1036 00:44:32,640 --> 00:44:34,300 ♪ Yes, I believe in me ♪ 1037 00:44:34,500 --> 00:44:36,360 ♪ So you believe in you ♪ 1038 00:44:36,560 --> 00:44:38,280 ♪ Help me sing it ♪ 1039 00:44:38,480 --> 00:44:39,630 ♪ Hoo-hoo! ♪ 1040 00:44:39,830 --> 00:44:43,580 The greatest soul singers are not afraid to feel the music, 1041 00:44:43,780 --> 00:44:45,950 you know, just do what the music tells them to do. 1042 00:44:46,030 --> 00:44:49,390 For all the new cats, all the new-school cats 1043 00:44:49,590 --> 00:44:51,960 that are going on record and ad-libbing, 1044 00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:53,290 and they say, like... 1045 00:44:56,750 --> 00:44:59,680 I'm sorry, Michael did that first. 1046 00:44:59,880 --> 00:45:01,530 I'll prove it to you. 1047 00:45:01,730 --> 00:45:05,310 ♪ So beat it, just beat it ♪ 1048 00:45:07,550 --> 00:45:08,550 ♪ Beat it ♪ 1049 00:45:10,430 --> 00:45:11,440 ♪ Beat it ♪ 1050 00:45:11,640 --> 00:45:14,170 Why was he yawning on a record, though? 1051 00:45:14,370 --> 00:45:15,480 It shows the freedom 1052 00:45:15,680 --> 00:45:17,710 and how comfortable he felt in the studio 1053 00:45:17,910 --> 00:45:19,540 without worrying about people's judgment 1054 00:45:19,620 --> 00:45:20,900 or, like, "Yo, what's that?" 1055 00:45:20,980 --> 00:45:23,070 Because you know he was bringing the freaking skills. 1056 00:45:23,150 --> 00:45:26,600 You knew he was bringing ultra talent and imagination, 1057 00:45:26,800 --> 00:45:28,480 for him to be like, "You know what? 1058 00:45:28,630 --> 00:45:29,850 I feel like yawning right here." 1059 00:45:32,410 --> 00:45:34,130 ♪ Beat it ♪ 1060 00:45:35,810 --> 00:45:37,850 I-I don't know what that one is. I don't know what... 1061 00:45:37,930 --> 00:45:39,800 I don't... but I love it. 1062 00:45:40,000 --> 00:45:42,050 And I'm listening to his ad-libs. 1063 00:45:42,250 --> 00:45:43,490 He's doing all that... 1064 00:45:45,980 --> 00:45:48,370 He's doing all this rhythmic stuff. 1065 00:45:48,570 --> 00:45:51,000 ♪ "Human Nature" by Michael Jackson ♪ 1066 00:46:03,920 --> 00:46:05,700 Michael had such a clear vision 1067 00:46:05,900 --> 00:46:07,720 of what he wanted, and Quincy, 1068 00:46:07,920 --> 00:46:10,240 he knows who wanted to work with each other. 1069 00:46:10,430 --> 00:46:11,660 There's a number of things going on. 1070 00:46:11,740 --> 00:46:13,690 We have "Beat It," drums being done 1071 00:46:13,890 --> 00:46:15,880 by Jeff Porcaro at Sunset Sound; 1072 00:46:16,080 --> 00:46:19,190 Steve Lukather in Studio B at Westlake; 1073 00:46:19,390 --> 00:46:21,800 Studio A, Quincy and Bruce. 1074 00:46:22,000 --> 00:46:24,320 Quincy's going back and forth between A and B, 1075 00:46:24,480 --> 00:46:25,570 across the hallway. 1076 00:46:25,770 --> 00:46:28,430 Then you add the E.T. storybook album, 1077 00:46:28,630 --> 00:46:31,580 and-and then... then it's just a lot going on. 1078 00:46:31,780 --> 00:46:33,850 Quincy had become friends with Steven Spielberg. 1079 00:46:33,930 --> 00:46:38,520 And I remember one day he... Steven invited Quincy 1080 00:46:38,720 --> 00:46:41,460 down to the set when he was working on E.T. 1081 00:46:41,660 --> 00:46:42,940 And, E.T. was there, 1082 00:46:43,100 --> 00:46:45,610 and the guys who were operating it at the time were there. 1083 00:46:45,690 --> 00:46:47,110 And I think somewhere in the course of it, 1084 00:46:47,190 --> 00:46:48,860 Steven had said to Quincy, said, "You know, 1085 00:46:48,940 --> 00:46:50,810 "I want to do a rec... we should do 1086 00:46:51,010 --> 00:46:52,550 a record of some sort." 1087 00:46:53,060 --> 00:46:54,580 So Quincy, I think, 1088 00:46:54,780 --> 00:46:56,260 came to Michael and-and said, 1089 00:46:56,350 --> 00:46:59,900 "Steven wants us to do the E.T. storybook album," 1090 00:47:00,100 --> 00:47:02,330 where Michael would narrate the story of E.T. 1091 00:47:02,410 --> 00:47:05,530 and Michael would write and sing a song for the album. 1092 00:47:06,030 --> 00:47:07,820 And Michael was a big fan, too, 1093 00:47:07,900 --> 00:47:09,200 so, "Quincy, let's do this." 1094 00:47:09,280 --> 00:47:12,540 So they started doing it in the midst of doing Thriller. 1095 00:47:12,740 --> 00:47:16,540 I've always loved film, and, 1096 00:47:16,740 --> 00:47:18,900 we're talking, in the stage of doing, 1097 00:47:19,010 --> 00:47:22,530 Quincy Jones and myself and Steven Spielberg, 1098 00:47:22,730 --> 00:47:24,570 working on a project. 1099 00:47:24,770 --> 00:47:26,800 The problem is nobody bothered 1100 00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:28,620 to call Walter Yetnikoff 1101 00:47:28,820 --> 00:47:30,970 and clear the rights because the album was 1102 00:47:31,170 --> 00:47:33,760 going out on Universal MCA's label. 1103 00:47:34,350 --> 00:47:37,560 I'll never forget, one day, I was at a-a meeting 1104 00:47:37,760 --> 00:47:40,150 and I get a call, so I get on the phone 1105 00:47:40,350 --> 00:47:43,590 and Walter says, "Tell Michael to stop kissing the monster." 1106 00:47:43,790 --> 00:47:45,780 "Walter, what are you talking about?" 1107 00:47:45,980 --> 00:47:47,300 "Stop kissing the monster!" 1108 00:47:47,380 --> 00:47:50,640 So, if you look at the E.T. storybook album, 1109 00:47:50,840 --> 00:47:52,410 Michael's got his arm around E.T. 1110 00:47:52,490 --> 00:47:54,820 They're like pals, and that's what Walter was talking about. 1111 00:47:54,900 --> 00:47:56,100 It wasn't just an album. 1112 00:47:56,180 --> 00:47:57,810 It was a whole box set with posters 1113 00:47:57,890 --> 00:48:00,540 and a picture of Michael with E.T. 1114 00:48:01,960 --> 00:48:05,190 So Walter filed an injunction against, 1115 00:48:05,390 --> 00:48:07,070 MCA and Universal 1116 00:48:07,270 --> 00:48:09,740 and made them take the album out of the stores. 1117 00:48:09,940 --> 00:48:12,460 It was already shipped. It was already a huge hit. 1118 00:48:12,630 --> 00:48:14,040 They had to pull the album back. 1119 00:48:14,240 --> 00:48:16,730 Epic wasn't happy, and they felt it was sort of 1120 00:48:16,930 --> 00:48:19,750 holding up their record, the-the Thriller record. 1121 00:48:19,950 --> 00:48:21,140 Yeah, they sued, you know. 1122 00:48:21,220 --> 00:48:22,910 "No, you can't have our artist, da-da-da-da-da." 1123 00:48:22,990 --> 00:48:25,400 You know, and Walter was litigious anyway, 1124 00:48:25,600 --> 00:48:27,740 and so he-he went... he went in hard. 1125 00:48:27,940 --> 00:48:29,530 And MCA responded hard, 1126 00:48:29,730 --> 00:48:31,240 and it was, you know, all hell broke loose. 1127 00:48:31,320 --> 00:48:34,010 And he said, "John, is he mad at me?" 1128 00:48:34,210 --> 00:48:36,770 I said, "What do you think, Walter?" 1129 00:48:36,970 --> 00:48:39,750 "You-you just sued him and Steven Spielberg 1130 00:48:39,950 --> 00:48:42,000 and Quincy Jones, and you wonder... 1131 00:48:42,200 --> 00:48:44,190 you're wondering if he's mad at you?" 1132 00:48:44,390 --> 00:48:48,150 And he goes, "What can I do to make it up?" 1133 00:48:48,350 --> 00:48:50,230 And I said, "You give him the owner... 1134 00:48:50,310 --> 00:48:51,860 ownership of his master recordings: 1135 00:48:51,940 --> 00:48:54,010 Off the Wall, Thriller and everything to come." 1136 00:48:54,090 --> 00:48:55,100 And he said, "Done." 1137 00:48:55,300 --> 00:48:58,500 To get your masters back in the middle of a contract, 1138 00:48:58,700 --> 00:49:01,270 I don't think had ever, ever happened. 1139 00:49:01,470 --> 00:49:03,630 ♪ "Carousel" by Michael Jackson ♪ 1140 00:49:03,830 --> 00:49:05,370 Rod came with his songs. 1141 00:49:05,450 --> 00:49:06,530 Michael had his songs. 1142 00:49:06,640 --> 00:49:08,060 And if those worked, they worked. 1143 00:49:08,140 --> 00:49:10,460 If they didn't, they-they went looking elsewhere. 1144 00:49:10,540 --> 00:49:12,680 ♪ I lost my heart ♪ 1145 00:49:12,880 --> 00:49:16,020 ♪ On the carousel ♪ 1146 00:49:16,210 --> 00:49:18,620 ♪ To a circus girl ♪ 1147 00:49:18,820 --> 00:49:22,500 ♪ Who left my heart in pieces... ♪ 1148 00:49:22,700 --> 00:49:24,960 "Carousel" was a great song, 1149 00:49:25,160 --> 00:49:27,441 and fortunately or unfortunately, you know, 1150 00:49:27,540 --> 00:49:28,900 there was only room on the album 1151 00:49:29,060 --> 00:49:33,410 for one mood like, "Carousel" or-or "Human Nature," 1152 00:49:33,610 --> 00:49:37,290 and "Human Nature" was the choice we had to make, you know. 1153 00:49:37,490 --> 00:49:38,930 Toto was big at that time. 1154 00:49:39,010 --> 00:49:41,210 Toto, who I just adored, 1155 00:49:41,410 --> 00:49:43,940 we worked together a lot, and, um, they sent over 1156 00:49:44,140 --> 00:49:47,530 two demos that they thought would be right for Michael, 1157 00:49:47,730 --> 00:49:49,320 and all of a sudden, there's... 1158 00:49:49,520 --> 00:49:51,590 at the end, there was all this silence. 1159 00:49:51,670 --> 00:49:53,110 And then it said... it said... 1160 00:49:53,190 --> 00:49:54,740 ♪ Why, why? ♪ 1161 00:49:56,920 --> 00:49:57,950 ♪ Why? ♪ 1162 00:49:58,150 --> 00:49:59,450 And-and I tell you, I get... 1163 00:49:59,530 --> 00:50:01,220 I get goose bumps just talking about it. 1164 00:50:01,300 --> 00:50:03,880 And I said, "What the hell is that?" You know? 1165 00:50:04,080 --> 00:50:05,560 That's what took "Carousel" out. 1166 00:50:05,760 --> 00:50:07,210 I said, "This is where we want to go," 1167 00:50:07,290 --> 00:50:09,840 'cause it's got such a... a-a wonderful flavor. 1168 00:50:10,040 --> 00:50:12,090 I'll tell you what. 1169 00:50:12,170 --> 00:50:15,380 Tonight, I want to do... 1170 00:50:16,010 --> 00:50:18,810 one of my favorite songs. 1171 00:50:19,010 --> 00:50:21,180 ♪ I touched her shoulder ♪ 1172 00:50:21,380 --> 00:50:24,960 ♪ She likes the way I stare ♪ 1173 00:50:25,160 --> 00:50:27,440 ♪ And they say, "Why?" ♪ 1174 00:50:27,640 --> 00:50:28,670 Everybody sing! 1175 00:50:28,870 --> 00:50:31,260 ♪ Tell them that it's human nature ♪ 1176 00:50:31,460 --> 00:50:34,860 ♪ Why, why does he do me that way? ♪ 1177 00:50:35,060 --> 00:50:38,180 The song that always haunts me is "Human Nature." 1178 00:50:40,260 --> 00:50:41,870 - Um... Yeah. - What a beautiful record. 1179 00:50:41,950 --> 00:50:43,330 That's-that's one of those records that you just say, 1180 00:50:43,410 --> 00:50:45,600 "I wish I would've did that record." 1181 00:50:45,800 --> 00:50:47,920 And that always, for me, is the... 1182 00:50:48,120 --> 00:50:50,360 the test of if I love it or not. 1183 00:50:50,560 --> 00:50:54,660 I remember one experience in the studio, 1184 00:50:54,850 --> 00:50:56,970 Rod Temperton, one of the writers on the album, 1185 00:50:57,170 --> 00:50:59,680 and he said, "Michael, if you only had three hits 1186 00:50:59,880 --> 00:51:02,480 off this album, would you not be happy?" 1187 00:51:02,680 --> 00:51:04,160 I said, "I'd be very angry." 1188 00:51:04,360 --> 00:51:05,960 And they all started laughing. 1189 00:51:06,160 --> 00:51:09,750 I said, "I expect eight hits off of this album. 1190 00:51:09,950 --> 00:51:11,210 Nine, all of 'em." 1191 00:51:14,020 --> 00:51:15,320 That is how I am. I'm sorry. 1192 00:51:15,400 --> 00:51:18,100 And my attitude was always reaching out for more. 1193 00:51:18,290 --> 00:51:19,890 Never being satisfied. 1194 00:51:20,090 --> 00:51:24,370 And right at this very moment, I'm on my fifth hit record. 1195 00:51:24,870 --> 00:51:27,230 Five. "Human Nature" is number ten. 1196 00:51:27,430 --> 00:51:31,070 And I've broken a record that has never been done before... 1197 00:51:31,270 --> 00:51:32,650 Five hit songs for one album. 1198 00:51:32,730 --> 00:51:37,670 Always reaching out for more, striving for excellence. 1199 00:51:40,630 --> 00:51:42,850 It's so engaging 1200 00:51:43,050 --> 00:51:44,810 because the idea 1201 00:51:45,010 --> 00:51:46,470 was to have something for everyone. 1202 00:51:46,550 --> 00:51:49,100 There was a song that I didn't really know too much about 1203 00:51:49,180 --> 00:51:50,370 that was called "Starlight," 1204 00:51:50,450 --> 00:51:52,810 and it was a disco song that Rod Temperton wrote. 1205 00:51:52,930 --> 00:51:56,740 You know, so it really evolved from 1206 00:51:56,940 --> 00:52:00,350 this click here at 1:18. 1207 00:52:00,550 --> 00:52:03,270 And so, okay, we lay the click down, and the idea was: 1208 00:52:03,460 --> 00:52:05,430 "Let's put it... let's put a new version down. 1209 00:52:05,510 --> 00:52:07,790 Let's put some tracks down and see where it goes." 1210 00:52:07,870 --> 00:52:09,900 So we-we started with this drumbeat. 1211 00:52:11,390 --> 00:52:14,670 Four on the floor, kind of dance song. 1212 00:52:15,130 --> 00:52:17,970 And then... backbeat. 1213 00:52:21,150 --> 00:52:22,740 Claps on the four. 1214 00:52:26,360 --> 00:52:29,680 And then the hi-hat part was like this. 1215 00:52:30,560 --> 00:52:32,440 Five, six, seven, eight. 1216 00:52:36,230 --> 00:52:38,690 And then open hat. 1217 00:52:40,490 --> 00:52:42,140 There we go. 1218 00:52:42,340 --> 00:52:44,660 And then the cowbell. 1219 00:52:52,830 --> 00:52:54,020 Here we go. 1220 00:52:54,220 --> 00:52:56,440 So, another thing about Michael and Quincy 1221 00:52:56,640 --> 00:52:57,380 is they like kind of like 1222 00:52:57,580 --> 00:52:59,660 a little bit of a feel to the music. 1223 00:52:59,850 --> 00:53:01,320 So, this is straight time. 1224 00:53:01,520 --> 00:53:04,350 And then we add a little bit of shuffle to it 1225 00:53:04,550 --> 00:53:08,430 so it just kind of pushes it a little bit like that. 1226 00:53:08,630 --> 00:53:09,630 So it's in. 1227 00:53:09,740 --> 00:53:14,250 And then the bass line ended up being kind of like a... 1228 00:53:14,450 --> 00:53:16,230 something I never would have expected, 1229 00:53:16,310 --> 00:53:18,840 like a little bit of a Latin rhythm, like... 1230 00:53:22,440 --> 00:53:25,080 Which sounded like a conga line to me, but... 1231 00:53:28,470 --> 00:53:30,370 And there was the-the opening. 1232 00:53:34,370 --> 00:53:37,420 ♪ "Thriller" by Michael Jackson ♪ 1233 00:53:41,920 --> 00:53:43,740 Just layering all the parts to "Thriller" 1234 00:53:43,820 --> 00:53:47,590 was one of the most fun sessions I've ever done in my life. 1235 00:53:48,140 --> 00:53:50,180 At 24, Michael had become more 1236 00:53:50,280 --> 00:53:53,060 than a master singer, dancer, songwriter. 1237 00:53:53,260 --> 00:53:56,000 He was a super salesman of his own mystique. 1238 00:53:56,200 --> 00:53:59,260 Michael's passion for world conquest was singular. 1239 00:53:59,460 --> 00:54:03,360 He lived, breathed, slept, dreamt and spoke 1240 00:54:03,560 --> 00:54:06,610 of nothing but number one successes. 1241 00:54:07,700 --> 00:54:09,510 Thriller stayed number one for months. 1242 00:54:09,590 --> 00:54:13,330 In the long period of its unprecedented success, however, 1243 00:54:13,530 --> 00:54:16,940 when it occasionally fell to second place for a week or two, 1244 00:54:17,140 --> 00:54:18,780 Michael panicked. 1245 00:54:18,980 --> 00:54:20,380 Hysterical, he'd berate me 1246 00:54:20,580 --> 00:54:22,930 for failing to pump up the promotion. 1247 00:54:23,130 --> 00:54:24,720 "I'm pumping, Michael," I'd say. 1248 00:54:24,920 --> 00:54:26,530 "I promise you I'm pumping." 1249 00:54:26,730 --> 00:54:28,090 And I was. 1250 00:54:28,640 --> 00:54:30,360 After Thriller had sold 1251 00:54:30,550 --> 00:54:32,810 about three or four million copies, 1252 00:54:33,010 --> 00:54:34,580 I got a call about 12 noon. 1253 00:54:34,780 --> 00:54:37,040 On the phone was the record company saying, 1254 00:54:37,240 --> 00:54:38,730 "Hey, listen, if you're not busy, 1255 00:54:38,810 --> 00:54:41,400 we need you to get over here right now." 1256 00:54:41,600 --> 00:54:45,110 Michael was going to be presented a-a plaque 1257 00:54:45,310 --> 00:54:47,300 for the-the Thriller record. 1258 00:54:47,500 --> 00:54:50,660 And we were wondering, why were we waiting? 1259 00:54:51,200 --> 00:54:53,560 In came Jane Fonda. 1260 00:54:53,760 --> 00:54:55,100 Jane? 1261 00:54:59,580 --> 00:55:01,570 I love Michael, and I admire him. 1262 00:55:01,770 --> 00:55:04,051 He's the only person I know that writes music 1263 00:55:04,190 --> 00:55:06,010 that you can dream to and dance to 1264 00:55:06,210 --> 00:55:07,660 and love to and work out to. 1265 00:55:07,860 --> 00:55:09,130 And I do all of 'em to it. 1266 00:55:09,210 --> 00:55:11,290 Come here, Michael. 1267 00:55:11,490 --> 00:55:12,970 In retrospect, I know 1268 00:55:13,070 --> 00:55:15,470 exactly what he was doing. 1269 00:55:16,060 --> 00:55:17,980 He understood the importance of having 1270 00:55:18,060 --> 00:55:21,960 a big white star giving him this plaque. 1271 00:55:22,160 --> 00:55:25,340 Michael has a number one single on the pop charts, 1272 00:55:25,540 --> 00:55:27,530 number one album on the pop charts, 1273 00:55:27,730 --> 00:55:30,910 number one single on the R and B charts, 1274 00:55:31,110 --> 00:55:33,350 number one album on the R and B charts. 1275 00:55:33,550 --> 00:55:34,990 And I think that starts... 1276 00:55:35,180 --> 00:55:36,980 that's sort of an historic record. 1277 00:55:37,180 --> 00:55:39,000 But I don't think we understood 1278 00:55:39,080 --> 00:55:40,520 where it was gonna go until 1279 00:55:40,640 --> 00:55:42,780 the "Thriller" video came out. 1280 00:55:42,980 --> 00:55:44,720 ♪ Suspenseful orchestral music ♪ 1281 00:55:47,010 --> 00:55:48,460 As far as the record company 1282 00:55:48,540 --> 00:55:50,680 was concerned, the album cycle was done. 1283 00:55:50,880 --> 00:55:52,660 They were thrilled with whatever it sold, 1284 00:55:52,740 --> 00:55:55,960 and Michael said, "No, no, we're gonna... we got more." 1285 00:55:56,160 --> 00:55:58,200 "Thriller," of all the songs on the album, 1286 00:55:58,350 --> 00:56:02,380 seems like you can do much more video-wise... 1287 00:56:02,580 --> 00:56:05,150 No, movie-wise... Than any of the songs 1288 00:56:05,350 --> 00:56:07,360 'cause of the story and all the visuals 1289 00:56:07,560 --> 00:56:09,760 and monsters and stuff. 1290 00:56:09,960 --> 00:56:11,400 And so I came up with an idea 1291 00:56:11,570 --> 00:56:14,120 of thinking that I really want to change, 1292 00:56:14,320 --> 00:56:17,670 metamorphosis into some other creature. 1293 00:56:17,870 --> 00:56:21,020 I... and I-I saw American Werewolf In London. 1294 00:56:21,220 --> 00:56:23,050 I really liked it. 1295 00:56:23,250 --> 00:56:25,740 And-and I said, "Who's the director who did it?" 1296 00:56:25,940 --> 00:56:27,440 And they said, "John Landis, John Landis." 1297 00:56:27,520 --> 00:56:29,440 I said, "Great. That's who we got to get." 1298 00:56:29,520 --> 00:56:31,590 So I said, "Get in touch with him." 1299 00:56:32,130 --> 00:56:34,160 So I get this call, and he says, 1300 00:56:34,240 --> 00:56:36,640 "Michael Jackson," and I really thought... 1301 00:56:37,140 --> 00:56:39,170 "Little Michael Jackson of The Jackson 5?" 1302 00:56:39,370 --> 00:56:41,230 I mean, I thought, "He's a kid," you know? 1303 00:56:41,310 --> 00:56:43,390 And he told me he had a song, "Thriller," 1304 00:56:43,560 --> 00:56:45,380 and he wanted me to make a video. 1305 00:56:45,580 --> 00:56:46,580 And I said, "Why?" 1306 00:56:46,770 --> 00:56:48,650 His brother showed him on the bus 1307 00:56:48,850 --> 00:56:51,660 the tape of American Werewolf, I think to scare him, 1308 00:56:51,860 --> 00:56:53,650 but he loved American Werewolf in London. 1309 00:56:53,730 --> 00:56:57,890 And he was obviously fascinated with Rick Baker's work. 1310 00:57:01,120 --> 00:57:03,000 And so he called me and said, 1311 00:57:03,200 --> 00:57:05,120 "I want to turn into a monster. Will you do it?" 1312 00:57:05,200 --> 00:57:07,570 And the record label wouldn't pay for it. 1313 00:57:07,770 --> 00:57:09,650 And, and we talked, and I said, 1314 00:57:09,790 --> 00:57:11,760 "Michael, you know, you shouldn't pay for this. 1315 00:57:11,840 --> 00:57:14,310 You shouldn't pay for it yourself." 1316 00:57:14,510 --> 00:57:16,330 And he said, "Branca, figure it out." 1317 00:57:16,530 --> 00:57:18,310 Nobody wanted him to do this. 1318 00:57:18,510 --> 00:57:20,640 This was entirely his own thing. 1319 00:57:20,840 --> 00:57:24,520 And everybody else... his people and the record company... 1320 00:57:24,720 --> 00:57:28,510 Said, "Next album. Let's... We've already... Michael, hello. 1321 00:57:28,710 --> 00:57:32,050 It's the most successful album of all time. We want..." 1322 00:57:32,250 --> 00:57:35,160 So they thought "Thriller" was outrageous. 1323 00:57:35,360 --> 00:57:37,580 Its budget was $1.2 million dollars. 1324 00:57:37,780 --> 00:57:40,260 That's at a time when the average music video budget 1325 00:57:40,380 --> 00:57:41,710 was only $50,000 dollars. 1326 00:57:41,910 --> 00:57:45,020 So I went... I went back to the office and thought about it. 1327 00:57:45,220 --> 00:57:47,860 And I thought up this idea of a making-of. 1328 00:57:48,060 --> 00:57:49,380 Went to MTV and Showtime, 1329 00:57:49,500 --> 00:57:51,820 and-and Michael was the biggest thing on the planet. 1330 00:57:52,000 --> 00:57:53,110 And I said, "We'll give you 1331 00:57:53,190 --> 00:57:54,790 a making of Michael's next video. 1332 00:57:54,960 --> 00:57:56,120 We need a million two." 1333 00:57:56,320 --> 00:57:59,020 And they came back, and they said yes. 1334 00:57:59,220 --> 00:58:00,490 We're trying to bring back 1335 00:58:00,570 --> 00:58:01,890 the motion picture shorts, 1336 00:58:01,970 --> 00:58:04,900 which we will do with... with "Thriller." 1337 00:58:05,100 --> 00:58:07,020 A lot of the videos... I hate to use the word "video" 1338 00:58:07,100 --> 00:58:09,650 'cause I like to think of it as a film, which it is... 1339 00:58:09,730 --> 00:58:13,530 We're doing a short film... A lot of 'em are so terrible. 1340 00:58:13,730 --> 00:58:16,210 And I wanted "Thriller" and "Beat It" to be a stimulant 1341 00:58:16,360 --> 00:58:19,680 for people to make better videos or short films. 1342 00:58:19,880 --> 00:58:24,230 I really did, 'cause, I mean, I love MTV, watching it. 1343 00:58:24,430 --> 00:58:25,770 You know, I think it's great, 1344 00:58:25,850 --> 00:58:28,500 but a lot of stuff I see, I'm not so crazy about. 1345 00:58:28,700 --> 00:58:30,630 He wanted to turn into a... 1346 00:58:30,710 --> 00:58:31,830 at first, a-a wolf man, 1347 00:58:31,940 --> 00:58:36,370 like the werewolf in American Werewolf. 1348 00:58:37,840 --> 00:58:41,660 His desire was to turn into a monster 1349 00:58:41,860 --> 00:58:43,120 on camera. 1350 00:58:43,320 --> 00:58:45,440 We had the character turn into 1351 00:58:45,640 --> 00:58:48,880 a four-legged hound from hell, a... 1352 00:58:49,080 --> 00:58:50,550 you know, a beast. 1353 00:58:50,750 --> 00:58:53,760 And Michael wanted to do that, and I told him, 1354 00:58:53,960 --> 00:58:55,910 "Michael, it would be so difficult 1355 00:58:56,110 --> 00:58:57,420 for you to dance with four legs, 1356 00:58:57,500 --> 00:58:59,830 you know, and for the puppeteers. 1357 00:59:00,030 --> 00:59:00,540 No." 1358 00:59:00,740 --> 00:59:02,270 So then it was gonna be 1359 00:59:02,470 --> 00:59:04,790 more of a traditional wolf man character. 1360 00:59:04,990 --> 00:59:09,190 And Rick Baker did the first design, and it was great 1361 00:59:09,390 --> 00:59:12,190 but truly terrifying. 1362 00:59:12,390 --> 00:59:14,360 And I said, "Aah! Whatever we have him 1363 00:59:14,560 --> 00:59:16,930 turn into, he's got to be attractive." 1364 00:59:17,130 --> 00:59:19,560 Scary but... 1365 00:59:19,760 --> 00:59:22,290 kind of cool and elegant, you know? 1366 00:59:22,490 --> 00:59:26,670 So his second design, he made him that "were-cat," 1367 00:59:26,870 --> 00:59:29,840 and it's a much more graceful design. 1368 00:59:30,040 --> 00:59:31,440 Are you all right? 1369 00:59:31,640 --> 00:59:34,050 Go away! 1370 00:59:35,810 --> 00:59:38,320 ♪ "Thriller" by Michael Jackson ♪ 1371 00:59:40,090 --> 00:59:42,090 Michael Jackson was 1372 00:59:42,170 --> 00:59:43,390 a very slight person. 1373 00:59:43,590 --> 00:59:46,370 99 pounds soaking wet. 1374 00:59:46,570 --> 00:59:50,380 So, how do you develop a presence on screen? 1375 00:59:50,580 --> 00:59:51,590 For "Thriller," 1376 00:59:51,790 --> 00:59:53,360 you know, it was supposed to be 1377 00:59:53,560 --> 00:59:55,920 a satire of a teenage horror film, 1378 00:59:56,130 --> 00:59:57,460 so he's in a letterman's jacket. 1379 00:59:57,540 --> 01:00:01,310 And then, with his red jacket for that theater, 1380 01:00:01,510 --> 01:00:05,100 I was trying to create a silhouette that was 1381 01:00:05,300 --> 01:00:09,790 sexy, masculine, impressive, 1382 01:00:09,990 --> 01:00:15,650 and... and gave him weight on screen. 1383 01:00:16,400 --> 01:00:19,140 So, with Michael's fascination 1384 01:00:19,340 --> 01:00:23,140 with monsters, I said, "Well, you'll become two monsters. 1385 01:00:23,340 --> 01:00:24,660 You'll become a werewolf," 1386 01:00:24,800 --> 01:00:28,810 and then when we decided on dancing zombies, a zombie. 1387 01:00:29,010 --> 01:00:30,600 Doesn't make sense, but who cares? 1388 01:00:30,680 --> 01:00:32,710 You know, it's a fantasy. 1389 01:00:33,500 --> 01:00:36,610 And he really enjoyed the process of the makeup, 1390 01:00:36,810 --> 01:00:39,590 and he really enjoyed wearing the makeup. 1391 01:00:39,790 --> 01:00:42,530 Most actors hate it, and he loved it. 1392 01:00:42,730 --> 01:00:44,540 He's so dynamic, Mike, 1393 01:00:44,740 --> 01:00:46,680 and he has such power and such charm. 1394 01:00:46,880 --> 01:00:50,480 As I had seen it, just looking at, you know, 1395 01:00:50,680 --> 01:00:53,210 "Can You Feel It" and everything I saw, 1396 01:00:53,410 --> 01:00:57,260 it's like, "Why isn't he being sexual?" 1397 01:00:57,460 --> 01:00:59,570 I mean, he's a rock star. 1398 01:00:59,770 --> 01:01:03,080 So one of the first things for me was 1399 01:01:03,280 --> 01:01:07,390 I wanted a girl to make him sexy 1400 01:01:07,590 --> 01:01:09,250 and to also... 1401 01:01:09,450 --> 01:01:13,290 to be gaga in love with him. 1402 01:01:13,490 --> 01:01:15,780 The big eyes, you know. 1403 01:01:15,980 --> 01:01:19,590 And I saw over a hundred actresses 1404 01:01:19,790 --> 01:01:21,710 and dancers and all kinds of people. 1405 01:01:21,860 --> 01:01:23,240 And when Ola came in, 1406 01:01:23,440 --> 01:01:26,120 one, she was desperate, desperate 1407 01:01:26,320 --> 01:01:29,560 to be with Michael Jackson, and she was adorable. 1408 01:01:29,760 --> 01:01:32,460 Michael Jackson isn't Michael Jackson 1409 01:01:32,660 --> 01:01:34,340 as a werewolf. 1410 01:01:34,540 --> 01:01:36,900 Michael Jackson is 1411 01:01:37,100 --> 01:01:39,900 another person totally with the mask. 1412 01:01:40,100 --> 01:01:42,820 And I like, you know, when he's so shy. 1413 01:01:43,020 --> 01:01:44,740 I have something I want to tell you. 1414 01:01:44,940 --> 01:01:46,660 The only time I really 1415 01:01:46,740 --> 01:01:49,140 explained something to him, I said, "You know, Michael, 1416 01:01:49,220 --> 01:01:53,170 I want you to know when you say, 'I'm not like other guys'..." 1417 01:01:53,370 --> 01:01:55,320 I'm not like other guys. 1418 01:01:55,510 --> 01:01:57,330 "it will get a laugh." 1419 01:01:57,920 --> 01:02:00,690 And he was clueless. He said, "Why would this get a laugh?" 1420 01:02:00,770 --> 01:02:02,880 I said, "Because you're not like other guys." 1421 01:02:02,960 --> 01:02:05,840 But at least he was prepared, 'cause it got a huge laugh 1422 01:02:05,940 --> 01:02:09,040 and... and so he was in on it. 1423 01:02:09,240 --> 01:02:12,250 You know, I think he would have been terribly upset otherwise. 1424 01:02:12,450 --> 01:02:14,540 From the beginning of the film, 1425 01:02:14,740 --> 01:02:17,020 going to the theater, 1426 01:02:17,220 --> 01:02:19,230 then you're walking out, and then Michael has 1427 01:02:19,310 --> 01:02:20,460 that cat-and-mouse sort of, 1428 01:02:20,540 --> 01:02:22,260 walk that he's doing with Ola Ray. 1429 01:02:22,420 --> 01:02:26,530 That's like an ode back to, classic, musicals, right? 1430 01:02:26,730 --> 01:02:27,850 The cat-and-mouse chase. 1431 01:02:28,030 --> 01:02:29,820 Right? Th-Then, you know, the-the man 1432 01:02:29,900 --> 01:02:31,620 playing up to the woman and all that. 1433 01:02:31,700 --> 01:02:33,180 And it's a dolly shot. 1434 01:02:33,260 --> 01:02:36,980 And I said, "Mike, here's what we're gonna do. 1435 01:02:37,180 --> 01:02:40,090 As long as Ola could keep the beat, 1436 01:02:40,290 --> 01:02:41,760 you do those lyrics, 1437 01:02:41,960 --> 01:02:45,010 you can never be more than this many feet away from her." 1438 01:02:45,210 --> 01:02:47,470 The big difference between 1439 01:02:47,550 --> 01:02:50,600 a costume designer and a fashion designer is, 1440 01:02:50,800 --> 01:02:53,810 for us, it's all about dramatic context. 1441 01:02:54,010 --> 01:02:55,490 So, where are they gonna be? 1442 01:02:55,680 --> 01:02:58,610 They're gonna be in an alley and a movie theater. 1443 01:02:58,810 --> 01:03:00,040 And what are they doing? 1444 01:03:00,120 --> 01:03:02,690 They're on a date, and Michael is gonna 1445 01:03:02,900 --> 01:03:05,800 be playful and be seductive. 1446 01:03:06,000 --> 01:03:07,570 She's dressed in blue. 1447 01:03:07,770 --> 01:03:08,850 She's cool. 1448 01:03:09,050 --> 01:03:11,810 She's relaxed. She's in jeans. 1449 01:03:12,010 --> 01:03:14,730 They did have a leopard print on them, 1450 01:03:14,930 --> 01:03:17,860 but, you know, tight jeans, little jacket. 1451 01:03:18,060 --> 01:03:19,520 She couldn't have been cuter. 1452 01:03:19,720 --> 01:03:21,440 I think, to the audience, 1453 01:03:21,640 --> 01:03:24,240 with what she's wearing and her attitude, 1454 01:03:24,440 --> 01:03:26,870 she's sending off every good vibe. 1455 01:03:27,060 --> 01:03:29,580 And I'll say, "Okay, well, that was fine. 1456 01:03:29,780 --> 01:03:31,310 I don't want fine. 1457 01:03:31,510 --> 01:03:33,750 You're Michael Jackson, 1458 01:03:33,950 --> 01:03:36,710 so it has to be great. 1459 01:03:36,910 --> 01:03:38,560 Because if you can't be great, 1460 01:03:38,760 --> 01:03:40,840 why the fuck do I have Michael Jackson here?" 1461 01:03:40,950 --> 01:03:43,470 So he goes, "Okay, John." 1462 01:03:43,660 --> 01:03:44,940 And he did the next take. 1463 01:03:45,020 --> 01:03:46,970 He was great! You know? 1464 01:03:47,170 --> 01:03:52,330 ♪ For you and I to cuddle close together, yeah ♪ 1465 01:03:52,530 --> 01:03:54,640 ♪ All through the night ♪ 1466 01:03:54,840 --> 01:03:57,730 ♪ I'll save you from the terror on the screen ♪ 1467 01:03:57,930 --> 01:03:59,250 ♪ I'll make you see... ♪ 1468 01:03:59,450 --> 01:04:01,940 Michael Peters and Michael Jackson 1469 01:04:02,140 --> 01:04:03,760 came up with the choreography, 1470 01:04:03,960 --> 01:04:05,720 and it's fascinating choreography 1471 01:04:05,920 --> 01:04:08,700 because the dancers were allowed 1472 01:04:08,900 --> 01:04:11,660 more rehearsal than usual. 1473 01:04:11,860 --> 01:04:13,410 At that point already, 1474 01:04:13,610 --> 01:04:16,750 Michael had established certain moves, 1475 01:04:16,950 --> 01:04:21,190 so my first instruction to Michael Peters was spooky, 1476 01:04:21,390 --> 01:04:23,530 and the second one was: 1477 01:04:23,730 --> 01:04:25,800 "I don't want any Michael move." 1478 01:04:26,000 --> 01:04:28,860 ♪ suspenseful orchestral music ♪ 1479 01:04:29,060 --> 01:04:31,280 ♪ "Thriller" by Michael Jackson ♪ 1480 01:04:43,460 --> 01:04:45,340 And they go into this 1481 01:04:45,540 --> 01:04:46,690 popping routine, right? 1482 01:04:46,890 --> 01:04:49,770 This goes back to the whole thing of where Michael Jackson 1483 01:04:49,940 --> 01:04:52,800 crosses the technique and the street world, right? 1484 01:04:55,490 --> 01:04:59,750 And he was so inspired by popping and waving and all that 1485 01:04:59,950 --> 01:05:02,710 so that he had to put them in the film. 1486 01:05:02,910 --> 01:05:04,800 How would a zombie dance? 1487 01:05:05,000 --> 01:05:07,070 And then looking at it, and it was... 1488 01:05:07,270 --> 01:05:08,880 it just made a lot of sense to me 1489 01:05:09,080 --> 01:05:12,600 that they weren't just locking or they just weren't popping 1490 01:05:12,800 --> 01:05:15,600 or they just weren't doing jazz dance. 1491 01:05:15,800 --> 01:05:19,710 The angles, the lines were all... 1492 01:05:19,910 --> 01:05:22,230 demented and crooked, and it... 1493 01:05:22,430 --> 01:05:24,900 I'd just never seen anything like that before. 1494 01:05:25,100 --> 01:05:27,710 ♪ 'Cause this is thriller ♪ 1495 01:05:27,910 --> 01:05:29,260 ♪ Thriller night... ♪ 1496 01:05:29,460 --> 01:05:31,320 On those zombies, 1497 01:05:31,400 --> 01:05:33,050 those costumes were just made of rags. 1498 01:05:33,130 --> 01:05:38,040 We call it aging, distressing and dying. 1499 01:05:38,240 --> 01:05:40,440 Then, of course, Rick Baker's work 1500 01:05:40,640 --> 01:05:43,860 was just masterful on everybody. 1501 01:05:44,060 --> 01:05:45,840 ♪ Thriller night ♪ 1502 01:05:46,040 --> 01:05:47,400 ♪ 'Cause I can thrill you more ♪ 1503 01:05:47,480 --> 01:05:51,150 ♪ Than any ghoul would ever dare try ♪ 1504 01:05:58,660 --> 01:06:01,750 This is a song about watching a movie. 1505 01:06:01,950 --> 01:06:04,060 Yo. A Blockbuster night. 1506 01:06:04,260 --> 01:06:05,780 He made a whole movie. 1507 01:06:05,930 --> 01:06:07,110 He entertained us. 1508 01:06:07,310 --> 01:06:09,190 He gave us R and B, he gave us horror, 1509 01:06:09,290 --> 01:06:12,410 he gave us sci-fi, but he gave it all to us in music. 1510 01:06:12,600 --> 01:06:13,930 He-he was just a-amazing. 1511 01:06:14,130 --> 01:06:16,070 After the video came out, 1512 01:06:16,150 --> 01:06:17,760 it tripled its sales. 1513 01:06:17,960 --> 01:06:19,660 They sold six million of these. 1514 01:06:19,860 --> 01:06:21,810 This made MTV a powerhouse 1515 01:06:22,010 --> 01:06:25,340 and then created this whole rock video business. 1516 01:06:25,530 --> 01:06:26,730 It was extraordinary. 1517 01:06:26,930 --> 01:06:28,730 And it's that moment when 1518 01:06:28,810 --> 01:06:30,820 the audience falls madly in love, 1519 01:06:31,020 --> 01:06:33,720 that the audience creates the icons. 1520 01:06:33,920 --> 01:06:35,590 He could write the songs. 1521 01:06:35,670 --> 01:06:36,830 He could produce them. 1522 01:06:37,030 --> 01:06:38,330 He could sing them. 1523 01:06:38,530 --> 01:06:39,820 He could perform like no other. 1524 01:06:39,900 --> 01:06:41,730 And he also was a fashion icon. 1525 01:06:41,930 --> 01:06:44,230 I've seen little tiny kids in red jackets. 1526 01:06:44,430 --> 01:06:46,630 I've seen old grandpas in red jackets. 1527 01:06:46,830 --> 01:06:48,250 I've seen girls in red jackets. 1528 01:06:48,450 --> 01:06:50,990 I've seen everybody wearing that jacket. 1529 01:06:51,190 --> 01:06:52,760 It was huge worldwide. 1530 01:06:52,960 --> 01:06:55,550 They were buying the leather jackets that Michael... 1531 01:06:55,630 --> 01:06:56,970 They were buying everything. 1532 01:06:57,050 --> 01:06:59,450 They were buying Michael Jackson posters, calendars. 1533 01:06:59,650 --> 01:07:02,210 ♪ Looks so much like Michael from head to toe ♪ 1534 01:07:02,400 --> 01:07:04,830 ♪ Put the mic in his hand and he'll steal the show ♪ 1535 01:07:04,910 --> 01:07:06,710 I love you, Michael Jackson. 1536 01:07:06,810 --> 01:07:08,410 Michael Jackson! 1537 01:07:08,560 --> 01:07:10,640 Anything with Michael Jackson on it 1538 01:07:10,750 --> 01:07:11,900 does continue to sell. 1539 01:07:12,100 --> 01:07:13,820 I work in a record store, and it still 1540 01:07:13,900 --> 01:07:15,820 just flies out of the store every week. 1541 01:07:15,900 --> 01:07:17,240 And we're talking about a record 1542 01:07:17,320 --> 01:07:19,810 that's a year and a half, almost two years old, 1543 01:07:20,010 --> 01:07:22,010 and people are still freaking out about it. 1544 01:07:22,130 --> 01:07:23,830 There have always been fan clubs, 1545 01:07:23,910 --> 01:07:25,450 Michael's fans more passionate than most. 1546 01:07:25,530 --> 01:07:28,610 This club calls itself the P.Y.T.'s. 1547 01:07:28,810 --> 01:07:31,690 We love you! We love you, Michael! 1548 01:07:31,890 --> 01:07:33,850 And if nothing else, "Thriller" was always 1549 01:07:33,960 --> 01:07:35,840 gonna be played in the month of October. 1550 01:07:35,940 --> 01:07:38,400 Like, there's this big thing in Mexico that happens 1551 01:07:38,480 --> 01:07:41,740 where, I'll tell you, the-the... every... people fly in for it. 1552 01:07:41,940 --> 01:07:44,710 They're all in their costumes, and they do 1553 01:07:44,910 --> 01:07:47,150 the "Thriller" dance, thousands of people. 1554 01:07:47,350 --> 01:07:49,190 And people are still, you-you know, 1555 01:07:49,390 --> 01:07:51,050 dancing to this song like it's... 1556 01:07:51,250 --> 01:07:52,890 like it was just done, like the... 1557 01:07:53,020 --> 01:07:54,980 like the short film just came out yesterday. 1558 01:07:55,060 --> 01:07:57,640 "Thriller," a long time coming. 1559 01:07:57,840 --> 01:07:59,280 Michael Jackson's "Thriller." 1560 01:07:59,360 --> 01:08:01,560 Probably the single biggest video 1561 01:08:01,760 --> 01:08:02,950 for MTV ever. 1562 01:08:03,150 --> 01:08:05,000 After their initial reluctance, 1563 01:08:05,200 --> 01:08:09,400 MTV became a huge supporter of Michael Jackson, 1564 01:08:09,600 --> 01:08:12,710 especially the "Thriller" short film. 1565 01:08:12,910 --> 01:08:15,280 They heavily promoted the premiere. 1566 01:08:15,480 --> 01:08:19,090 At some point, it felt like the "M" in MTV 1567 01:08:19,290 --> 01:08:21,800 stood for "Michael." 1568 01:08:23,050 --> 01:08:26,020 And everybody was talking about how they were gonna cut school 1569 01:08:26,220 --> 01:08:28,120 to go home to watch the "Thriller" video 1570 01:08:28,320 --> 01:08:32,690 because it was a twelve o'clock world premiere on MTV. 1571 01:08:32,890 --> 01:08:35,090 And he was acting, he was eating popcorn, 1572 01:08:35,290 --> 01:08:36,920 and then he turned into a monster. 1573 01:08:37,000 --> 01:08:39,280 There's something about music, I think, that has... 1574 01:08:39,360 --> 01:08:42,560 that triggers so many different emotions in people, 1575 01:08:42,750 --> 01:08:45,180 so you're tapping into all of that 1576 01:08:45,380 --> 01:08:48,210 to a larger and larger and larger audience, 1577 01:08:48,410 --> 01:08:51,370 and it just exponentially grew. 1578 01:08:52,920 --> 01:08:55,530 So, the spring of '84, 1579 01:08:55,730 --> 01:08:57,050 the record's already out, 1580 01:08:57,190 --> 01:08:59,700 it's already selling because Michael's now gone 1581 01:08:59,900 --> 01:09:01,970 from being a pop star to a phenomenon. 1582 01:09:02,170 --> 01:09:04,280 The Guinness Book of World Records is giving him 1583 01:09:04,360 --> 01:09:06,450 an award as the biggest-selling album of all time. 1584 01:09:06,530 --> 01:09:08,100 It's a thriller of a party tonight 1585 01:09:08,180 --> 01:09:10,020 for Michael Jackson at the Museum of Natural History. 1586 01:09:10,100 --> 01:09:11,940 That's where Jackson's being honored 1587 01:09:12,140 --> 01:09:14,370 for his album that's broken all the records. 1588 01:09:14,450 --> 01:09:16,420 This was the payoff for the fans tonight, 1589 01:09:16,500 --> 01:09:19,340 that momentary glimpse of superstar Michael Jackson 1590 01:09:19,540 --> 01:09:22,050 with his date for the evening, Brooke Shields. 1591 01:09:22,250 --> 01:09:25,040 Thriller, with 25 million copies sold, 1592 01:09:25,240 --> 01:09:27,030 was the best-selling album ever. 1593 01:09:27,530 --> 01:09:31,830 Today, we surpassed 25 million copies for Thriller. 1594 01:09:32,030 --> 01:09:36,110 Michael Jackson, the number one artist in the world! 1595 01:09:36,310 --> 01:09:38,290 Thriller eclipsed them all. 1596 01:09:38,370 --> 01:09:40,470 At one point, the damn thing was selling 1597 01:09:40,670 --> 01:09:41,690 a million copies a week. 1598 01:09:41,770 --> 01:09:44,930 Michael had become a global obsession. 1599 01:09:45,130 --> 01:09:47,580 And just think, you all came to see me. 1600 01:09:49,200 --> 01:09:52,940 No, I know why you're here, and with good reason. 1601 01:09:53,140 --> 01:09:55,210 To see one of the most talented, most popular 1602 01:09:55,410 --> 01:09:58,940 and most exciting superstars in the music world today, 1603 01:09:59,140 --> 01:10:01,030 Michael Jackson. 1604 01:10:01,230 --> 01:10:03,150 Michael, welcome to the White House. 1605 01:10:03,270 --> 01:10:04,990 But being with Michael 1606 01:10:05,070 --> 01:10:06,220 at that moment in time, 1607 01:10:06,420 --> 01:10:10,390 this is... "Thriller" is now out on television. 1608 01:10:10,590 --> 01:10:13,690 And there was Michael mania, you know. 1609 01:10:13,890 --> 01:10:15,180 He called me, and he said, 1610 01:10:15,260 --> 01:10:16,750 "Have you ever been to Disney World?" 1611 01:10:16,830 --> 01:10:19,560 So the park was open, and there were people walking around. 1612 01:10:19,640 --> 01:10:22,160 Here's Michael, here's Mickey and me. 1613 01:10:22,350 --> 01:10:26,680 Suddenly, we look around, 1614 01:10:26,880 --> 01:10:29,500 and there are people 1615 01:10:29,700 --> 01:10:34,330 as far as you can see in every direction... 1616 01:10:34,530 --> 01:10:38,000 Behind us, in front of us, around us... 1617 01:10:38,200 --> 01:10:41,150 And they're getting more and more hysterical. 1618 01:10:41,350 --> 01:10:43,240 "Michael! Michael!" 1619 01:10:43,440 --> 01:10:47,740 And you see Mickey Mouse is going like... 1620 01:10:47,940 --> 01:10:48,940 "Holy shit! 1621 01:10:49,090 --> 01:10:51,830 We're never getting out of this alive!" You know? 1622 01:10:54,290 --> 01:10:55,850 You know, Thriller was 1623 01:10:55,930 --> 01:10:58,390 the biggest album in the world, Michael was the biggest star, 1624 01:10:58,470 --> 01:11:01,380 and he wanted to go out and tour Thriller. 1625 01:11:01,580 --> 01:11:04,800 But Joseph... You know, Mr. Jackson... 1626 01:11:05,000 --> 01:11:07,010 Had other ideas. 1627 01:11:07,630 --> 01:11:10,750 He wanted to bring all the family back together. 1628 01:11:10,940 --> 01:11:12,060 He brought in Don King 1629 01:11:12,260 --> 01:11:13,760 as the recommended promoter of the tour. 1630 01:11:13,840 --> 01:11:17,000 And he got the brothers and Mrs. Jackson, Katherine. 1631 01:11:17,200 --> 01:11:19,730 Everybody was all for it. 1632 01:11:20,350 --> 01:11:23,240 Michael was hesitant, to be honest. 1633 01:11:23,440 --> 01:11:25,950 He felt like he had done Thriller on his own, 1634 01:11:26,150 --> 01:11:29,200 and he wanted to tour as a solo artist. 1635 01:11:29,400 --> 01:11:32,320 But he was persuaded to go along with it. 1636 01:11:34,080 --> 01:11:37,880 This tour is a bonanza of marketing, 1637 01:11:38,080 --> 01:11:40,210 so everybody wants to get in on this. 1638 01:11:40,410 --> 01:11:44,050 And Quaker Oats, you know, they had made a deal. 1639 01:11:44,250 --> 01:11:46,550 They had a tentative deal with the Jacksons 1640 01:11:46,750 --> 01:11:48,950 to be the sponsors of this thing. 1641 01:11:49,150 --> 01:11:53,160 And then Don King says, "Listen, I've already made a deal. 1642 01:11:53,360 --> 01:11:54,580 I made it with Pepsi." 1643 01:11:54,780 --> 01:11:58,100 ♪ "Billie Jean" by Michael Jackson ♪ 1644 01:12:04,480 --> 01:12:06,610 Michael was not into the sponsorship 1645 01:12:06,690 --> 01:12:08,530 'cause he-he said, "This isn't my thing. 1646 01:12:08,610 --> 01:12:12,430 I don't drink Pepsi. This is all for my family." 1647 01:12:12,630 --> 01:12:14,750 And Michael did not want to do the Pepsi deal. 1648 01:12:14,860 --> 01:12:17,170 ♪ You're a whole new generation ♪ 1649 01:12:17,370 --> 01:12:18,940 ♪ You're loving what they do ♪ 1650 01:12:19,140 --> 01:12:21,170 ♪ Put a Pepsi into motion ♪ 1651 01:12:21,370 --> 01:12:23,460 ♪ And that choice is up to you, hey, hey, hey ♪ 1652 01:12:23,540 --> 01:12:25,530 ♪ You're the Pepsi Generation... ♪ 1653 01:12:25,730 --> 01:12:28,730 'Cause he said to me, "Okay, Branca, listen to me. 1654 01:12:28,860 --> 01:12:31,100 I got to do this 'cause my family wants it, 1655 01:12:31,300 --> 01:12:33,200 but you have to write two things in the contract. 1656 01:12:33,280 --> 01:12:35,910 I'm never holding a Pepsi can. 1657 01:12:36,110 --> 01:12:37,390 I can't be 1658 01:12:37,470 --> 01:12:39,580 on the screen for more than three seconds." 1659 01:12:39,660 --> 01:12:41,310 So it's in the Pepsi contract, 1660 01:12:41,510 --> 01:12:44,460 no more than three seconds and never holding a Pepsi can. 1661 01:12:44,660 --> 01:12:46,670 So if you ever watch that commercial again, 1662 01:12:46,870 --> 01:12:47,870 you'll-you'll see. 1663 01:12:48,060 --> 01:12:49,440 It's interesting because 1664 01:12:49,520 --> 01:12:53,120 if Don King had not made the deal with Pepsi, 1665 01:12:53,320 --> 01:12:55,050 Michael's hair wouldn't have gotten burned. 1666 01:12:55,130 --> 01:12:57,770 I was actually at the Pepsi commercial, 1667 01:12:57,970 --> 01:13:00,520 and I had an all-access pass. 1668 01:13:00,720 --> 01:13:03,630 When I arrived at the Shrine Auditorium Downtown, 1669 01:13:03,830 --> 01:13:05,990 Michael and the Jacksons were onstage 1670 01:13:06,180 --> 01:13:08,740 performing "Billie Jean." 1671 01:13:10,360 --> 01:13:11,570 The audience had been invited, 1672 01:13:11,650 --> 01:13:13,680 you know, and they were told to scream 1673 01:13:13,880 --> 01:13:14,680 and the whole thing. 1674 01:13:14,880 --> 01:13:16,890 They didn't have to be instructed to do that. 1675 01:13:16,970 --> 01:13:18,350 They were crazy about, you know, 1676 01:13:18,550 --> 01:13:20,710 seeing the Jacksons and Michael there and... 1677 01:13:20,910 --> 01:13:25,780 They did a run-through, and after they came offstage, 1678 01:13:25,980 --> 01:13:27,670 Michael was just in a great mood 1679 01:13:27,870 --> 01:13:30,630 and he was having fun, fooling around. 1680 01:13:30,830 --> 01:13:32,550 And then they called them back out 1681 01:13:32,630 --> 01:13:34,990 and said, "We're gonna do this again." 1682 01:13:35,190 --> 01:13:37,660 And it went horribly wrong. 1683 01:13:37,860 --> 01:13:41,060 Filming the Pepsi commercial, there was a big explosion. 1684 01:13:41,260 --> 01:13:45,460 ♪ You're the Pepsi Generation ♪ 1685 01:13:45,660 --> 01:13:46,980 ♪ Guzzle down... ♪ 1686 01:13:47,180 --> 01:13:49,140 And it burned Michael's scalp 1687 01:13:49,230 --> 01:13:50,860 very severely. 1688 01:13:51,060 --> 01:13:53,720 The audience didn't know what was going on. 1689 01:13:53,920 --> 01:13:55,910 And when they took Michael offstage, 1690 01:13:56,110 --> 01:13:57,350 I went backstage, 1691 01:13:57,550 --> 01:14:00,410 and it was just absolute chaos. 1692 01:14:00,610 --> 01:14:03,130 They put him in a stretcher... 1693 01:14:03,330 --> 01:14:04,980 You know, an ambulance stretcher... 1694 01:14:05,060 --> 01:14:10,110 And they took him offstage to a paramedic truck. 1695 01:14:10,310 --> 01:14:14,720 And Michael Jackson was smart enough... 1696 01:14:14,920 --> 01:14:17,520 ...to be covered up, 1697 01:14:17,710 --> 01:14:19,680 but he had his glove out. 1698 01:14:19,880 --> 01:14:23,230 That was the photograph that went around the world 1699 01:14:23,430 --> 01:14:26,690 of him with the glitter glove. 1700 01:14:26,890 --> 01:14:30,240 People were crying, you know, in the audience. 1701 01:14:30,440 --> 01:14:32,320 And people were running with the ambulance 1702 01:14:32,400 --> 01:14:33,890 as it was taking him away. 1703 01:14:34,090 --> 01:14:36,330 It was just an incredible thing. 1704 01:14:36,530 --> 01:14:38,510 When I got home, it was all over the news. 1705 01:14:38,590 --> 01:14:40,600 Jackson was rushed to a hospital last night 1706 01:14:40,680 --> 01:14:42,680 after suffering second- and third-degree burns. 1707 01:14:42,760 --> 01:14:44,330 But his doctor said 1708 01:14:44,410 --> 01:14:45,790 the famous patient was doing well. 1709 01:14:45,870 --> 01:14:47,690 He slept several hours last night. 1710 01:14:47,890 --> 01:14:50,690 He was up watching TV at approximately one o'clock. 1711 01:14:50,890 --> 01:14:53,190 He's comfortable this morning, although he is continuing 1712 01:14:53,270 --> 01:14:55,030 to have discomfort in the scalp area. 1713 01:14:55,190 --> 01:14:56,630 People don't realize 1714 01:14:56,710 --> 01:14:59,770 he had to go to emergency treatment in a burn center, 1715 01:14:59,970 --> 01:15:02,270 and he was troubled by the pain from that burn 1716 01:15:02,470 --> 01:15:03,790 for the rest of his life, 1717 01:15:03,910 --> 01:15:08,540 which led to pain pills and whatnot to-to ease the pain. 1718 01:15:09,370 --> 01:15:11,420 Because he needed painkillers, 1719 01:15:11,620 --> 01:15:14,530 he was in pain, life couldn't stop. 1720 01:15:14,730 --> 01:15:17,740 He had a book full of things that he had to do. 1721 01:15:17,940 --> 01:15:21,430 You know, a schedule that just could not stop. 1722 01:15:21,630 --> 01:15:22,700 The opening of the Victory Tour 1723 01:15:22,780 --> 01:15:24,260 in Kansas City was a massive event. 1724 01:15:35,070 --> 01:15:36,380 It's at Arrowhead Stadium. 1725 01:15:36,460 --> 01:15:38,570 It's a giant football stadium. 1726 01:15:49,620 --> 01:15:51,580 - I love you, Michael. - I love you, Michael. 1727 01:15:51,660 --> 01:15:52,660 I love you so much. 1728 01:15:52,830 --> 01:15:55,490 This is gonna be the best concert of the century. 1729 01:15:55,690 --> 01:15:57,010 - Don't you think? - Definitely. 1730 01:15:57,090 --> 01:15:59,410 I have to ask Michael Jackson to marry me today. 1731 01:15:59,610 --> 01:16:02,130 We would do about anything to see Michael Jackson. 1732 01:16:17,860 --> 01:16:19,820 You're looking at a sneak preview 1733 01:16:19,900 --> 01:16:21,900 of what is perhaps the most controversial 1734 01:16:22,010 --> 01:16:26,290 rock concert tour in history, the Jacksons' Victory Tour, 1735 01:16:26,490 --> 01:16:28,460 opening tonight in Kansas City. 1736 01:16:58,530 --> 01:17:00,590 ♪ I said you wanna be startin' somethin' ♪ 1737 01:17:00,790 --> 01:17:02,910 ♪ You got to be startin' somethin' ♪ 1738 01:17:03,110 --> 01:17:04,880 ♪ I said you wanna be startin' somethin' ♪ 1739 01:17:04,960 --> 01:17:06,680 ♪ You got to be startin' somethin' ♪ 1740 01:17:06,760 --> 01:17:08,510 - ♪ Too high to get over ♪ - ♪ Yeah, yeah ♪ 1741 01:17:08,590 --> 01:17:09,870 ♪ Too low to get under ♪ 1742 01:17:10,070 --> 01:17:11,890 - ♪ Yeah, yeah ♪ - ♪ You're stuck in the middle ♪ 1743 01:17:11,970 --> 01:17:13,890 - ♪ Yeah, yeah ♪ - ♪ And the pain is thunder ♪ 1744 01:17:13,970 --> 01:17:16,190 - ♪ Too high to get over ♪ - ♪ Yeah, yeah ♪ 1745 01:17:16,390 --> 01:17:17,670 ♪ Too low to get under ♪ 1746 01:17:17,870 --> 01:17:19,690 - ♪ Yeah, yeah ♪ - ♪ You're stuck in the middle ♪ 1747 01:17:19,770 --> 01:17:21,860 - ♪ Yeah, yeah ♪ - ♪ And the pain is thunder ♪ 1748 01:17:21,940 --> 01:17:23,300 ♪ I took my baby to the doctor ♪ 1749 01:17:23,500 --> 01:17:25,520 ♪ With a fever, but nothin' he found ♪ 1750 01:17:25,720 --> 01:17:27,480 ♪ By the time this hit the street ♪ 1751 01:17:27,650 --> 01:17:29,330 ♪ They said she had a breakdown ♪ 1752 01:17:29,490 --> 01:17:31,250 ♪ Someone's always tryin' ♪ 1753 01:17:31,450 --> 01:17:32,930 ♪ To start my baby cryin' ♪ 1754 01:17:33,010 --> 01:17:34,690 ♪ Talkin', squealin', lyin' ♪ 1755 01:17:34,890 --> 01:17:36,850 ♪ Sayin' you just want to be startin' somethin' ♪ 1756 01:17:36,930 --> 01:17:38,970 ♪ I said you wanna be startin' somethin' ♪ 1757 01:17:39,170 --> 01:17:40,920 ♪ You got to be startin' somethin' ♪ 1758 01:17:41,000 --> 01:17:42,800 ♪ I said you wanna be startin' somethin' ♪ 1759 01:17:42,880 --> 01:17:45,600 ♪ tense synthesizer tones fading into drumbeat ♪ 1760 01:17:45,800 --> 01:17:48,580 ♪ "P.Y.T." by Michael Jackson ♪ 1761 01:17:48,780 --> 01:17:50,580 ♪ Where did you come from, lady? ♪ 1762 01:17:50,760 --> 01:17:52,750 The Victory Tour sold out in Kansas City. 1763 01:17:52,830 --> 01:17:55,440 Then it was on to Dallas, Jacksonville, 1764 01:17:55,640 --> 01:17:58,440 New Jersey, New York and Knoxville. 1765 01:17:58,640 --> 01:18:00,800 It's currently scheduled in some 13 cities 1766 01:18:00,920 --> 01:18:02,720 with more sites yet to be announced. 1767 01:18:02,860 --> 01:18:04,660 Preparations are well underway tonight 1768 01:18:04,800 --> 01:18:06,610 for the Jacksons' Victory Tour concert. 1769 01:18:06,690 --> 01:18:08,640 The Jacksons' massive stage was beginning 1770 01:18:08,720 --> 01:18:10,520 to take shape as early as Thursday. 1771 01:18:10,720 --> 01:18:12,200 There's not too many places 1772 01:18:12,280 --> 01:18:14,080 that you can stick a monstrous stage like this. 1773 01:18:14,160 --> 01:18:16,480 Most of the performances, more than 50 in all, 1774 01:18:16,560 --> 01:18:19,610 will be in stadiums like the Silverdome. 1775 01:18:19,810 --> 01:18:21,070 ♪ Pretty young thing ♪ 1776 01:18:21,270 --> 01:18:23,780 - ♪ You need some loving ♪ - ♪ TLC ♪ 1777 01:18:23,980 --> 01:18:25,530 ♪ Tender lovin' care ♪ 1778 01:18:25,730 --> 01:18:28,830 ♪ And I'll take you there, girl ♪ 1779 01:18:29,030 --> 01:18:31,640 ♪ Ooh-ooh, I want to love you... ♪ 1780 01:18:31,840 --> 01:18:33,600 The shows of the Victory Tour 1781 01:18:33,680 --> 01:18:35,230 were much more mainstream America, 1782 01:18:35,310 --> 01:18:39,010 and that was a testament to how big Michael had become 1783 01:18:39,210 --> 01:18:42,240 and to the penetration of the album. 1784 01:18:45,920 --> 01:18:47,450 The irony of Thriller is that 1785 01:18:47,530 --> 01:18:48,820 there was never a tour solely dedicated 1786 01:18:48,900 --> 01:18:50,790 to the biggest LP of all time. 1787 01:18:50,990 --> 01:18:52,440 The Victory Tour was a mix 1788 01:18:52,640 --> 01:18:55,710 of vintage Jackson family music and hits from Thriller. 1789 01:18:55,910 --> 01:18:57,540 But it was the Thriller material 1790 01:18:57,620 --> 01:18:59,940 that turned the crowd out every night. 1791 01:19:03,940 --> 01:19:06,030 ♪ Hee! Hoo! ♪ 1792 01:19:15,330 --> 01:19:17,590 ♪ She says I am the one ♪ 1793 01:19:17,790 --> 01:19:20,630 ♪ But the kid is not my son ♪ 1794 01:19:20,830 --> 01:19:24,000 ♪ No, no, no ♪ 1795 01:19:24,500 --> 01:19:27,600 ♪ Billie Jean is not my lover ♪ 1796 01:19:27,800 --> 01:19:32,270 ♪ She's just a girl who claims that I am the one ♪ 1797 01:19:32,470 --> 01:19:35,970 ♪ But the kid is not my son ♪ 1798 01:19:37,350 --> 01:19:39,360 ♪ She says I am the one ♪ 1799 01:19:52,200 --> 01:19:53,200 ♪ Whoo! ♪ 1800 01:19:53,400 --> 01:19:55,270 ♪ You know you ain't ♪ 1801 01:19:55,470 --> 01:19:56,900 ♪ Not my lover ♪ 1802 01:19:57,100 --> 01:20:00,480 - ♪ You know you can't ♪ - ♪ Not my lover ♪ 1803 01:20:00,680 --> 01:20:02,400 ♪ Because you are ♪ 1804 01:20:02,600 --> 01:20:03,960 ♪ Not my lover ♪ 1805 01:20:04,170 --> 01:20:06,240 ♪ 'Cause you're a silly girl ♪ 1806 01:20:06,440 --> 01:20:07,910 ♪ Not my lover ♪ 1807 01:20:08,110 --> 01:20:11,470 ♪ Billie Jean is not my lover ♪ 1808 01:20:11,670 --> 01:20:14,910 ♪ Billie Jean is not my lover ♪ 1809 01:20:15,110 --> 01:20:18,440 ♪ Billie Jean is not my lover ♪ 1810 01:20:18,640 --> 01:20:22,210 ♪ Billie Jean is not my lover ♪ 1811 01:20:38,580 --> 01:20:41,870 ♪ Billie Jean is not my lover ♪ 1812 01:20:43,040 --> 01:20:46,550 ♪ Billie Jean is not my lover ♪ 1813 01:20:46,750 --> 01:20:49,680 Michael has been nominated for 12... 1814 01:20:49,880 --> 01:20:53,580 12 1983 Grammy Awards. 1815 01:20:53,780 --> 01:20:55,370 The highest number in history. 1816 01:20:55,570 --> 01:20:58,810 ♪ "Don't Stop 'Til You Get Enough" by Michael Jackson ♪ 1817 01:20:59,010 --> 01:21:02,210 So we went to the 1984 Grammys 1818 01:21:02,410 --> 01:21:05,110 at the Shrine Auditorium. 1819 01:21:05,310 --> 01:21:07,320 I didn't get the feeling he was nervous. 1820 01:21:07,400 --> 01:21:08,770 I actually got the feeling that 1821 01:21:08,850 --> 01:21:10,570 he was excited. 1822 01:21:11,530 --> 01:21:14,850 And I don't think I had any idea 1823 01:21:15,050 --> 01:21:16,540 even the magnitude of it. 1824 01:21:16,740 --> 01:21:18,960 ♪ Keep on with the force, don't stop ♪ 1825 01:21:19,160 --> 01:21:21,480 ♪ Don't stop till you get enough, keep on... ♪ 1826 01:21:21,680 --> 01:21:23,640 Michael Jackson was nominated 1827 01:21:23,740 --> 01:21:25,170 for 12 Grammys overall, 1828 01:21:25,370 --> 01:21:28,920 including Album of the Year and Record of the Year. 1829 01:21:29,130 --> 01:21:32,420 ♪ And I feel on fire ♪ 1830 01:21:33,470 --> 01:21:36,220 ♪ Ain't nothin'... ♪ 1831 01:21:36,420 --> 01:21:38,760 The Record of the Year is... 1832 01:21:38,840 --> 01:21:40,060 "Beat It," Michael Jackson. 1833 01:21:40,140 --> 01:21:41,790 For Album of the Year... 1834 01:21:41,870 --> 01:21:43,250 The winner is... 1835 01:21:43,330 --> 01:21:45,270 Thriller! 1836 01:21:49,520 --> 01:21:51,490 ♪ Sensation ♪ 1837 01:21:51,690 --> 01:21:53,050 ♪ Sensation ♪ 1838 01:21:53,250 --> 01:21:54,730 ♪ Lovely where we're at... ♪ 1839 01:21:54,840 --> 01:21:58,700 Best Pop Vocal Performance, Male: Michael Jackson. 1840 01:22:02,050 --> 01:22:03,750 I made a deal with myself, if I win more... 1841 01:22:03,830 --> 01:22:05,650 one more award, which is this award, 1842 01:22:05,850 --> 01:22:07,630 which is seven, which is a record, 1843 01:22:07,830 --> 01:22:10,110 I would take off my glasses. 1844 01:22:12,380 --> 01:22:15,220 ♪ Ooh, keep on with the force, don't stop ♪ 1845 01:22:15,420 --> 01:22:17,640 ♪ Don't stop till you get enough ♪ 1846 01:22:17,840 --> 01:22:20,060 ♪ Keep on with the force, don't stop ♪ 1847 01:22:20,260 --> 01:22:21,910 ♪ Don't stop till you get enough ♪ 1848 01:22:21,990 --> 01:22:24,000 ♪ Keep on with the force, don't stop... ♪ 1849 01:22:24,080 --> 01:22:25,480 He deserved it. 1850 01:22:25,680 --> 01:22:28,110 You know, it was... it was due. 1851 01:22:28,310 --> 01:22:30,570 ♪ Don't stop till you get enough ♪ 1852 01:22:37,160 --> 01:22:38,790 In February 1984, 1853 01:22:38,990 --> 01:22:42,490 between Michael and Quincy, Thriller won a dozen Grammys. 1854 01:22:46,210 --> 01:22:48,020 Well, as we know, Thriller is 1855 01:22:48,100 --> 01:22:50,190 a huge, huge success... the album... 1856 01:22:50,390 --> 01:22:52,130 But... 1857 01:22:52,330 --> 01:22:54,010 the joy of doing something phenomenal 1858 01:22:54,090 --> 01:22:56,680 'cause everybody waiting to see the next big, 1859 01:22:56,880 --> 01:22:58,600 you know, Michael Jackson short. 1860 01:22:58,800 --> 01:23:00,870 And I thought "Thriller" was the perfect vehicle. 1861 01:23:00,950 --> 01:23:02,180 - We're gonna come out. - No. 1862 01:23:02,260 --> 01:23:04,020 - No one's gonna like it. - No, no, no, no, no. 1863 01:23:04,100 --> 01:23:05,690 But 40 years from now, Michael... 1864 01:23:05,890 --> 01:23:06,890 My part will be. 1865 01:23:07,040 --> 01:23:08,940 I don't know about you. 1866 01:23:09,140 --> 01:23:10,570 All right, and stop. 1867 01:23:10,770 --> 01:23:12,360 Cut. 1868 01:23:12,560 --> 01:23:14,340 Who's your biggest inspiration? 1869 01:23:14,540 --> 01:23:16,370 Who inspired you the most? 1870 01:23:16,570 --> 01:23:17,570 Michael Jackson. 1871 01:23:17,710 --> 01:23:19,640 Michael saw that he could 1872 01:23:19,840 --> 01:23:21,410 touch greatness with Off the Wall, 1873 01:23:21,490 --> 01:23:24,270 knew he was still going against racist radio 1874 01:23:24,470 --> 01:23:27,150 and people that wanted to put him in a box. 1875 01:23:27,350 --> 01:23:30,960 But you have to be so in the rarefied air, 1876 01:23:31,160 --> 01:23:35,950 .0001%, to even be able to, like, project yourself to that. 1877 01:23:36,150 --> 01:23:38,850 That idea that I can take 1878 01:23:39,050 --> 01:23:41,750 dance music and visuals 1879 01:23:41,940 --> 01:23:43,500 and turn the world on its ear, 1880 01:23:43,700 --> 01:23:47,830 that idea that he crystallized in "Thriller"... not going away, 1881 01:23:48,030 --> 01:23:50,520 and I don't think it's ever gonna go away. 1882 01:23:51,020 --> 01:23:52,380 So, whether it was 1883 01:23:52,520 --> 01:23:55,010 "Human Nature" and his amazing voice, 1884 01:23:55,210 --> 01:23:57,010 you know, "Beat It" and looking at 1885 01:23:57,210 --> 01:23:59,620 the references that were there, because every time 1886 01:23:59,820 --> 01:24:02,620 you saw a video, you got a new idea of, like, 1887 01:24:02,820 --> 01:24:04,850 who he was as an artist and what he was selling. 1888 01:24:04,930 --> 01:24:08,040 Right? There was his hair and his clothing, his wardrobe. 1889 01:24:08,240 --> 01:24:10,900 All of those things were informing the culture. 1890 01:24:11,100 --> 01:24:13,490 He was establishing the standard. 1891 01:24:13,680 --> 01:24:14,950 Thriller. 1892 01:24:15,140 --> 01:24:19,470 Man, there has never been anything like that. 1893 01:24:19,670 --> 01:24:21,700 Michael Jackson's Thriller. 1894 01:24:21,900 --> 01:24:23,700 ♪ Suspenseful orchestral music ♪ 1895 01:24:25,720 --> 01:24:27,600 What's the problem? 1896 01:24:28,680 --> 01:24:31,270 Come on, I'll take you home. 1897 01:24:42,820 --> 01:24:45,490 ♪ "Beat It" by Michael Jackson ♪ 1898 01:24:57,670 --> 01:25:00,870 ♪ They told him, "Don't you ever come around here ♪ 1899 01:25:01,070 --> 01:25:04,060 ♪ Don't wanna see your face, you better disappear" ♪ 1900 01:25:04,260 --> 01:25:07,580 ♪ The fire's in their eyes and their words are really clear ♪ 1901 01:25:07,780 --> 01:25:11,440 ♪ So beat it, just beat it ♪ 1902 01:25:11,640 --> 01:25:14,440 ♪ You better run, you better do what you can ♪ 1903 01:25:14,640 --> 01:25:18,030 ♪ Don't wanna see no blood, don't be a macho man ♪ 1904 01:25:18,230 --> 01:25:21,620 ♪ You wanna be tough, better do what you can ♪ 1905 01:25:21,820 --> 01:25:23,180 ♪ So beat it ♪ 1906 01:25:23,380 --> 01:25:24,970 ♪ But you wanna be bad ♪ 1907 01:25:25,170 --> 01:25:28,730 - ♪ Just beat it, beat it ♪ - ♪ Beat it, beat it ♪ 1908 01:25:28,930 --> 01:25:31,580 ♪ No one wants to be defeated ♪ 1909 01:25:31,780 --> 01:25:35,090 ♪ Showin' how funky and strong is your fight ♪ 1910 01:25:35,290 --> 01:25:38,530 ♪ It doesn't matter who's wrong or right ♪ 1911 01:25:38,730 --> 01:25:42,070 - ♪ Just beat it, just beat it ♪ - ♪ Beat it, beat it ♪ 1912 01:25:42,270 --> 01:25:43,490 ♪ Just beat it ♪ 1913 01:25:43,690 --> 01:25:46,020 - ♪ Beat it, beat it! ♪ - ♪ Just beat it ♪ 1914 01:25:46,220 --> 01:25:49,210 ♪ They're out to get you, better leave while you can ♪ 1915 01:25:49,410 --> 01:25:52,880 ♪ Don't wanna be a boy, you wanna be a man ♪ 1916 01:25:53,080 --> 01:25:55,840 ♪ You wanna stay alive, better do what you can ♪ 1917 01:25:56,040 --> 01:25:59,570 ♪ So beat it, just beat it ♪ 1918 01:25:59,770 --> 01:26:03,030 ♪ You have to show them that you're really not scared ♪ 1919 01:26:03,230 --> 01:26:06,080 ♪ You're playin' with your life, this ain't no truth or dare ♪ 1920 01:26:06,280 --> 01:26:08,200 ♪ They'll kick you, then they'll beat you ♪ 1921 01:26:08,280 --> 01:26:11,730 ♪ Then they'll tell you it's fair, so beat it ♪ 1922 01:26:11,930 --> 01:26:13,400 ♪ But you wanna be bad ♪ 1923 01:26:13,600 --> 01:26:17,110 - ♪ Just beat it, beat it ♪ - ♪ Beat it, beat it ♪ 1924 01:26:17,310 --> 01:26:20,130 ♪ No one wants to be defeated ♪ 1925 01:26:20,330 --> 01:26:23,430 ♪ Showin' how funky and strong is your fight ♪ 1926 01:26:23,630 --> 01:26:26,410 ♪ It doesn't matter who's wrong or right ♪ 1927 01:26:26,610 --> 01:26:30,960 - ♪ Just beat it, beat it ♪ - ♪ Beat it, beat it ♪ 1928 01:26:31,160 --> 01:26:34,020 ♪ No one wants to be defeated ♪ 1929 01:26:34,220 --> 01:26:37,440 ♪ Showin' how funky and strong is your fight ♪ 1930 01:26:37,640 --> 01:26:40,590 ♪ It doesn't matter who's wrong or right ♪ 1931 01:26:40,790 --> 01:26:43,700 ♪ Just beat it, beat it, beat it, beat it ♪ 1932 01:26:43,900 --> 01:26:46,280 ♪ Beat it, beat it, beat it ♪ 1933 01:26:50,830 --> 01:26:53,290 ♪ Beat it, beat it, beat it ♪ 1934 01:26:53,870 --> 01:26:55,960 ♪ Beat it, beat it, beat it ♪ 1935 01:27:00,460 --> 01:27:03,250 ♪ Beat it, beat it, beat it ♪ 1936 01:27:36,540 --> 01:27:40,150 - ♪ Beat it, beat it ♪ - ♪ Beat it, beat it ♪ 1937 01:27:40,350 --> 01:27:43,090 ♪ No one wants to be defeated ♪ 1938 01:27:43,290 --> 01:27:46,510 ♪ Showin' how funky and strong is your fight ♪ 1939 01:27:46,710 --> 01:27:49,660 ♪ It doesn't matter who's wrong or right ♪ 1940 01:27:49,860 --> 01:27:53,350 - ♪ Just beat it, beat it ♪ - ♪ Beat it, beat it ♪ 1941 01:27:53,550 --> 01:27:56,690 ♪ No one wants to be defeated, Lord ♪ 1942 01:27:56,890 --> 01:28:00,360 ♪ Showin' how funky and strong is your fight ♪ 1943 01:28:00,560 --> 01:28:03,670 ♪ It doesn't matter who's wrong or right ♪ 1944 01:28:03,870 --> 01:28:07,430 - ♪ Just beat it, beat it ♪ - ♪ Beat it, beat it ♪ 1945 01:28:07,630 --> 01:28:10,410 ♪ No one wants to be defeated, no ♪ 1946 01:28:10,610 --> 01:28:14,500 ♪ Showin' how funky and strong is your fight ♪ 1947 01:28:14,700 --> 01:28:17,000 ♪ It doesn't matter ♪150752