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Yeah, life has been pretty good. Let's see, I'm wrapping up on Spiderverse in a couple
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of weeks. So that's exciting. Hopefully I can I can chill a little bit more after that.
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That's pretty dope. Yeah. Hopefully, in the new year, I can finish up a couple of these
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projects that are hanging over me and then get back to doing some learning. Because I
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haven't, I haven't done much painting and just learning for myself. Yeah, I feel that.
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How have you been? Chilling, living life, working. Yeah, you know, you know how it goes.
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Did you see that? That whole ArtStation thing? Yeah, where I'm posting the AI thing. Yeah.
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Yeah, I talked to a couple of my friends about it. What are you what are your thoughts?
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Um, yeah, I vibe with what everyone's saying that ethically, if they sourced it in a way
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that was not ripping off people's arts, it would be an interesting tool to use. But right
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now it's kind of in that weird gray area. So at least that's, that's what I came to
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the conclusion. What about you? Yeah, yeah, I think, like, honestly, right now, like,
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I tried it a little bit, it's not, it's not really that useful. For me, what I'm doing.
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But it's, it's one of those things that if we don't adapt, and we don't see how we can
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use this tool, then, you know, it's gonna be like, it's gonna be like 15 years ago,
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when the whole industry started using Photoshop, the people who refuse to learn Photoshop,
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they were out of the job. So, you know, I don't know what that means. You know, it since
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it started, I was kind of like, it was almost like depressing. I was like, oh, computer
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is going to take our job, our jobs. But the more I've thought about it, I was like, if,
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if AI can help us to do more paintings, come up with more ideas, explore more ideas, more,
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more compositions, more, more stories. Like, that's, that's kind of exciting. Yeah, I hear
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that too. Yeah. So yeah, I think I've, I don't know, I'm not using it now. But I'm not like,
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yeah, and I totally understand, like the ethics of it. Like, it's just like stealing people's
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people's images and whatever. That's kind of shitty. But yeah, I don't know. I kind
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of think like with where the technology is now, it's like, I think it's safe to say that
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the guardrails are not up on the like, development side. And so it is very possible to use this
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new technology in a non ethical manner, as we've seen. But my only problem is I feel
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like the the atmosphere around that conversation turned very negative, verging on almost like
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bullying. And people were almost trying to shut the whole conversation down due to that
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fear and almost not leaving room for ethical use, which I think is kind of what you're
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describing as something that could be exciting down the line. And yeah, that's just my thought.
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Yeah, there's, yeah, there's an attitude where, yeah, like you said, like the bullying and
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just shutting it down right away. Like, it's gonna happen, like, no matter what. And yeah,
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hopefully, there's some some rules or something behind it, to kind of protect the artists
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or to, you know, every time someone types in like, you know, this, this scene in Zach
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Rhett style, I get like a couple couple pennies or something. That might be cool. But yeah,
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either way, I'm saving some money. Just in case, you never know. I don't, I don't think
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it'll come to that. But
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yes, someone may be comparison a few years back, graphic design was kind of stormed with
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all these auto automated logo generators. And people thought that like, oh, graphic
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designers are dead. No one's gonna use graphic designers anymore. But then that kind of opened
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up more opportunities for high end graphic designers to really explore the corporate
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sector. Because then people were starting to look for tailor made designs rather than
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just something you can like plug in and spit out through a computer. So all that a kind
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of automated work became very bottom level, like $5, super cheap dollar store stuff. So
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people, someone said that might happen with the same vibe going on with AI art that because
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it's so generic, it might just become very dollar store, you know.
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That's interesting.
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I almost feel like you can kind of like up the baseline quality. You know, just like
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with graphic design, it's kind of like, yeah, you can't just like phone in a generic looking
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logo and just, you know, kind of capitalize on the merits of Yep, it's a logo. Now it's
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kind of like the bar goes up. Yeah. And it's not all bad.
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Yeah, it might give people like a little bit of a jumping off point.
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I'm kind of viewing AI as almost like a replacement for using 3D, which I personally am very okay
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with and I like the idea of AI.
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How dare you.
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It's maybe not even a replacement for 3D, but it's almost like you can kind of ask the
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AI to render something in any engine. And I think that's almost miraculous in and of
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itself. And that could be a really cool tool where maybe if you don't want to sit and yeah,
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work in 3D directly and you want to, you know, utilize technology for your art in a different
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way.
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I feel like when AI is three dimensional, that's when I'm going to be like super excited
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about it. And like if I could type in the scene, like describe the scene and then like
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move the camera around.
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Oh, yeah, that would be cool. I have seen Nvidia, they have a like 2D to 3D AI conversion
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thing. I saw like it was a couple of months ago, it was like a clip of some, I think,
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like band instruments, like going from like a flat 2D, getting converted live into 3D.
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And then they were like having like an entire like band's room worth of instruments, like
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flying around, you know, in a simulation. And it happened in like less than 10 minutes.
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It was pretty cool.
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Wow, that is cool.
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Just almost like the separation of like labor from creativity and starting to understand
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like what were we valuing in the first place, like were we valuing that labor or the creativity
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or some combination? Having us ask a lot of questions.
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Yeah, like if you think about it, you know, I could sit down, spend two days doing like
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a painting. You know, and like every brush stroke is, you know, I'm like focused on every
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little detail in the painting. Or I can get something close to that and you know, a couple
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hours of like using AI stuff and then painting over it. And then in those two days, I can
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generate like 30 images. Like that's kind of exciting to me.
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It sounds really exciting.
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Yeah, it's a little sad that, you know, it takes something away from the craft a little
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bit. But if you think of it as just generating images, because like when we're in a vis dev
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job, we're just generating images to, we're like part of the pipeline to like make this
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movie. Like if we could make movies quicker. That's kind of cool.
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I was talking to my brother about it, who's a traditional artist.
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Oh, yeah, how does he feel about it?
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He was like, it might be a really good thing for, you know, people who do paintings for
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galleries and just sell like their big oil paintings and stuff, because that's what he
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does. He's like, people will probably appreciate that traditional paint more.
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Oh, yeah. Yeah, especially something not just created in the traditional, like with traditional
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steps but actually having that physical painting. I mean, that's, and seeing the brushwork on
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the canvas and stuff. I mean, that is going to be even more valuable than ever.
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Yeah. How does your brother go about selling his work to galleries? Does he contact them?
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Do they contact him? Like where, what is that? Do you know much about that process?
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Um, huh, I haven't asked him that. I'll text him right now.
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I know I see him sell a lot of stuff directly or he had like a push for a while of selling
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paintings like, it seemed like daily, it was like a push to like get more fine art in people's
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homes almost. It was really cool. I liked seeing that.
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I think it's also kind of the beauty of fine art. It's like very durable. And all this
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AI stuff has had me thinking a lot about like some of the classic cases in art history,
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like Duchamp, I think I'm saying that right, Fountain from 1917, like that urinal that
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was held up as fine art or like the Campbell Soup cans by Warhol, you know, is that art
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or even like that banana that got taped to the wall at like Art Basel or whatever a couple
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of years ago. Like, you know, it just, what is art really?
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Yeah, that's what I learned is that so I can trip a banana to a wall, colored art.
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Yeah. Spend years studying.
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Like that real banana feeling on the wall and like that real tape is going to be at
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a premium and if you like eat that art, man.
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I went to the MoMA a couple weekends ago when I was in New York. I don't know if anyone
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has been recently. Yeah. Oh, not recently.
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Honestly, I was like super disappointed.
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Oh, really?
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Yeah.
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Why?
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There's, there's only like, like a small handful of paintings that I actually like wanted to
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look at. Just like a couple like huge Monet's that were beautiful. What else did I see?
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Yeah, there's a couple others. Most of it was like, you know, that like modern stuff
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where it's like, it looked like my sketchbook from when I was three years old.
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Yes, not.
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Sometimes I though I'm kind of jealous of the hustle of some of those artists, because
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there's like one woman I keep seeing on Instagram, she takes a mop, puts it in a bucket of black
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paint, and then over a big like 10 by 10 canvas, she just, you know, does whatever she wants
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with the mop and she sells them for thousands of dollars. And like, that's kind of, why
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can't that be me? You know, like, why can't I just take them up and get all this money
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for putting a dot on a piece of canvas? So
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that you can spend a lot of time like schmoozing with rich people in order to like, position
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yourself to collect that kind of money.
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It's like if you tell rich people like your story, and you know, your Oh my god, the mop
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fibers, like, let me tell you, they are
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If that was the price to pay, I'd do it in a heartbeat, you know.
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It's more like a shady business, I think, because, like, rich, bad people, they buy
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these paintings like money don't rethink.
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Yeah, yeah.
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Honestly, taking like a mop and then just like going crazy with it, it actually sounds
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creatively very frustrating. Like you've got an idea. And the only way you can express
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it is like, you know, I don't know, slapping a mop around and not really like having that
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visual development vision.
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How frustratedly cry as I wipe my tears away with $100 bills.
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Who is that guy who
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use like the first to like drip paint just all over?
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Oh, yeah. Pollock.
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Oh, yeah.
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Um, I actually really like stuff.
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Yeah, those are really cool.
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Also a really frustrating sounding process. And I think he even said himself, he's super
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frustrated.
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I think it's really weird how like an artist can start doing something. And then as soon
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as it gets popular, like they kind of build up the studio around them. And then it's all
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under like their name label, right? Because I think even Jackson Pollock, like, eventually
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he had people working under him were like making the paintings. But they were like all
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considered Jackson Pollock's, right?
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What the heck?
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Isn't it the same for like quite a few figures in art history? Like they actually have these
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studios like tons of laborers that just never get mentioned.
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Like what's what's his name, the guy that everyone hates? The guy that makes like, really
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big inflatable like dog balloon?
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Well, Koons isn't his name?
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Yeah, Jeff Koons. Yeah. Yeah, me and my homies hate Jeff Koons.
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He's it's kind of like, um, Underground meme to hate Jeff Koons, you know, you gotta get
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on the bandwagon.
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It's so weird, because like, he went to my art school. But like, he didn't graduate,
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he dropped out. And yet my art school is still like, our graduate Jeff Koons, like,
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I don't know if anyone knows the artist, Romero Brito. He's like a Brazilian dude who he's
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censored in Florida. And I used to live in Miami where he his studio was, and I was looking
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for a job yet. So I was looking for a job at a gallery, and they offered me a job. And
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then it was basically it would be to create art for him, that then he would sell. And
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I was like, I'm not for that. But um, he's a nice guy. He just sells.
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Yeah, it's just like really weird how it kind of feeds into like the capitalist commercialism
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where it's like, once you have a label, then you just need workers to make name under that
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label.
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Because like, like his work sells, I think he's probably the most like, I think he owns
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the Guinness World Record for most expensive piece sold by a living artist. But I'm like,
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I mean, what does that mean? If you're paying all the people that work under you like, minimum
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wage, you know?
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But that's the point of this class. Zach is collecting all our work and selling it behind
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the back.
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Zach's trading an AI algorithm.
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He's like, Okay, this AI makes student work, it's always gonna be messed up. Hands are
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always perfect for AI.
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Have you guys used that other AI, the chat one?
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My friend was showing me and I was like, let's have it write a song. And my friend like typed
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in is like, write an emo song about Zach and his cat. And they wrote like a pretty good
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generic song.
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It was cracking me up. I was like, messing around with it so much the other night and
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just like having a write short stories like humorous essays, like I tricked it into saying
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all sorts of inappropriate stuff. It was amazing.
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Wasn't there like a I haven't used that yet. Do you guys remember in like the early like
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the late 2010s when there was definitely like, a weird AI that was like trained on user inputs?
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And it was like, like maybe a year until all it wrote back was curse words.
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Yeah, it said like,
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no, this new one is really cool. And something that's actually super interesting is like,
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a friend of mine is like has ADHD and like has a hard time focusing on stuff, particularly
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writing, like writing an email or something. It's like a nightmare. And they found it super
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helpful to help them like write like Instagram posts or quick emails, things that usually
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took them like, much longer than normal person, and they knew it and it was like a sticking
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point for them to, you know, share their thoughts. And then this like, just really helps them,
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you know, communicate and I think that's very cool.
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That's awesome. Yeah, that sounds awesome. That would have helped me in school I sucked
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at writing and all that.
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And even it can like kind of come up with like, like, help you come up with a list of
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like, if you are, you could be like, Oh, I want to sit down and paint today, can you
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give me a step by step, you know, instructions on like, what's a good way to do that? And
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it would, you know, kind of regurgitate like, or not regurgitate, but it would tell you
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like, oh, yeah, you know, sit in a well lit place and you know, ergonomics and just have,
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you know, some like tips that are kind of generic, but actually kind of useful better
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than a Google search.
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And sounds like it would be fun to use it for like weird art prompts, or it's just like,
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tell me tell me like a weird story. And then it just fits back like maybe at least like
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five details that you can really build a world around. Yeah, yeah.
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My business class just when you have to come up with a story, do an AI generated story
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and start painting.
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I had to write haikus. Those are funny.
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Has anyone seen the movie? Um, but someone with Joaquin Phoenix, her?
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Oh, yeah. That movie made me tear up a little bit the first time I saw it.
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I haven't seen it, but I, I really like it on Shot Deck. It looks very pretty.
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Well, spoiler alert, if anyone doesn't want to hear the spoiler, you know, cover your
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ears. But at the end of the movie, all that AI, like collectively decides that doesn't
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want to be part of the human interaction anymore and then like blinks out. So maybe that's
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where our world's headed, you know,
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Oh my god, good for her, though, like,
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Good for her.
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Speaking of movies, anyone seen any of the good ones that have come out recently?
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And chat, Rob asked if anyone's seen Pinocchio, the new one?
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Which new one?
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Oh, yeah, there's, there's two. I'm assuming the Netflix one.
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The Guillermo del Tor one. Yeah.
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Yeah, it's on Netflix.
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Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
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I thought I was gonna have to go to the theater. Oh, did anyone see? Well, let's talk about
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Pinocchio. Has anyone seen it?
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Um, I saw it.
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What'd you think?
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I thought it was very, very sad and dark. Almost like I love that, like, darker stuff.
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But I felt like it was
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a little bit, a little bit too much. Like the whole movie is just just kind of like
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that. So for that reason, I didn't like it as much, you know, as like an art piece and
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like the stop motion, everything. I thought that was really beautiful. Yeah, what do you
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what did you guys think?
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Yeah, I, I think that okay, so me and my friends did a double feature where we watched the
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new quote unquote, live action Pinocchio from Disney. And then right after that we watched
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the Guillermo del Toro one. And I think I just love the Guillermo del Toro one because
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it was like a movie. Like the Disney Pinocchio live action one was, it was really bad. It's
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like really bad. Sorry to anyone that worked on it who might be here, but it just, it just
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felt very incestuous and like the things it was referencing, it made a lot of unnecessary
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Disneyland references. And then the Guillermo del Toro one, it was like, kind of traumatizing,
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to be honest. If you have any like, negative interactions with Nazi symbolism, like, I
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would just definitely go into it, knowing that it's very prevalent. I think it was a
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good Pinocchio adaptation. But I think that the story of Pinocchio is like a little bit
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flawed and not super, like good. And then at the end, I felt like it didn't have enough
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of a resolution. But overall, like I still enjoyed it as a movie.
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Sounds like a movie I'll watch.
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Well, anyone seen some beers?
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Oh, it's great for that.
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Sorry, what was that? We were kind of talking over you.
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Anyone seen Avatar or interested in seeing it?
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I haven't. I'm definitely interested.
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Yeah, I'm sure that's what it's all about.
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15 years or something.
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Yeah, he's making like four of them.
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Oh, that's right. Wow.
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I feel like I'm having a hard time understanding what they're trying to do with that.
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Yeah, super sad movie.
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You said it's sad?
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Um, oh, my brother responded about the gallery question, how to get into galleries. He said,
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I've never gotten to galleries by asking or submitting work. Maybe at the start, you can
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do this way to get in into a starter gallery. So the good galleries will reach out to you
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because other artists recommend you and the gallery can't help but to notice the quality
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of your work on like social media. If there's a specific location of galleries that you'd
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like to do work in, you can gear your stuff towards like that genre. So like, I don't
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know, East Coast, rocky East Coast paintings, like maybe you do a bunch of those and that
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will like draw your attention of galleries there. You want to show consistency with the
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quality of your work when posting on social media or your website, so they know that you
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can continuously post work for them. Yeah, I think that's, he was talking about that,
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like, if a gallery likes you, though, you'll send them a bunch of paintings and then as
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those paintings sell, you just keep sending them more paintings, so they want to know
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that you're like consistent and keep sending them stuff. Yeah, that's kind of the same
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advice I give for getting into animation, like, just post your work online and those
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jobs will come.
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Cool. Thank you.
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Yeah.
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Is that a question regarding like, balancing out painting exercises and design exercises
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and like the more technical stuff, the perspectives, the design and stuff like that? Yeah.
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What do you recommend? What did you do to be better at both of things?
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Designing. Can you can you talk a little bit more about that? Like, what what you mean?
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Like designing sets or like cool movie shots?
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So these kind of studies that I'm doing, like, these are super fun for me, it's a good way
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to like, you know, just kind of keep myself motivated and painting and just continue to
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grow generally as a painter. But more specifically, like design, learning to design better. I
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mean, it goes back to those like two value studies, like really designing like those
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big shapes. Because if you can come up with a great composition with just a couple values,
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then all the like the detail and everything that you put on top of that will just will
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just kind of benefit.
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And like, you know, like your work and your business work and when it's by the man into
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the spider verse, like the railway station or the apartments, the buildings and stuff
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like that. Do you also follow the same rules as like, making it cool or read better and
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only two values?
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Yeah. I'm definitely gonna do like some kind of workshop or another class once on after
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Puss in Boots and Switters too comes out because I did so much like, like crazy design work
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that like, I think, up until that point, I was more of like a color artist. And then
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the past few years of doing I've been doing like a lot of like heavy design stuff. Like
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in inspire verse, I was doing a lot of line drawing, which is crazy for me. You're talking
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about like this, this kind of stuff, right?
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Yeah, yeah. And also the line work you did, like, for the news by the verse. How did you
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like get your head around it?
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I get better and better at it.
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It was a combination of, I guess it's hard to find like the old ones.
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Like the old comics, the Indian comics of Spider-Man or something like that?
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Yeah. But what I would do is I would find, yeah, maybe this is a good one. It's a combination
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of finding, analyzing like this line work. So what I would do is, let's see, we'll just
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say, yeah, like a person here, buildings back here. I would look at this line work and be
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like, how can I draw like that? And I would also like for these buildings back here, I
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would find a bunch of photo references and I would do all my research like I normally
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do. But then I would, the tricky part would be translating that to the style and kind
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of like analyzing like, how would this artist draw this stuff? You know, like, instead of
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just putting all this into like a straight value, they use this hatching. So you have
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to like make those transitions.
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Would you ever like formally like almost record your understanding of a style like as a cheat
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sheet for yourself like later if you're working on a project that you know you need to stick
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to it? Or is that just something like, you can always just kind of do by eye or just
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keep in your mind? And it's not because I know sometimes there's like a style guide.
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I'm sure you've made some for like Puss in Boots and stuff. Just kind of curious how
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that in a formal sense exists.
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Yeah, for Puss in Boots, I created like a pretty intensive style guide. So when every
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artist got on to the movie, they could look at that they could see like how I was breaking
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down my shape design, how I was painting textures. I even had a style guide for the lighting
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department and how I see color. It's like the stuff I've taught in my classes, like
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painting things warmer and then layering in the cooler colors.
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It was like a color style guide like separate?
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Yeah, I mean, that's all.
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That's cool.
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Yeah.
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What was it? Was it like, just mostly visuals in there? Or did you have to write a lot as
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well?
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It was mostly visuals with like my notes. Man, I want to show it so bad. I'll do another
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one of these after the movie comes out. I did another style guide. It's not this one's
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not as as intensive, but you can see I'm
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Oh, interesting.
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I'll write a little bit about the design language. I'll talk about how we're being a little bit
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more graphic with the forms. This is for a different project, but I put a couple of my
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like Puss in Boots like sketches in here. This was a page on texture. So it's talking
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about like what kind of textures we're going to paint for this project. So it's like a
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combination of these like painterly textures on these graphic forms. Characters, you know,
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some characters that I like, you know, like some what it's inspired from like, we're inspired
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by some of these, like these older like animes. And so we're mixing that with like these more
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like painterly textures. So I did something kind of like that for the style guide for
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purpose and boots.
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That's really cool. Thanks for showing that. Yeah, it'd be really interesting to see the
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Spiderverse stuff later.
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Yeah, um, yeah, it was with Spiderverse. I mean, Patrick did an awesome job of, you know,
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putting together like folders of, like the inspiration and then artwork that he felt
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like we're hitting the style correctly. So there's a lot of stuff that I was looking
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at when I was doing these paintings that I could, if I had like a question, I could just
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like, look at the like the previous art. Like you would even circle areas of like, oh, some
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artists did this painting, I really like this section, like how they how they painted that.
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So I could, I could always refer back to those.
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Which I'm sure he will post or talk about at some point.
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Which Patrick?
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Patrick O'Keefe.
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See if we can put him up.
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Yeah, this guy.
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So he's, he's the current production designer.
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So thank you, man.
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Let me read the chat here.
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I don't know if anyone has seen that.
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Oh, the Wednesday series. Yeah, I watched that. That was really good. I liked it. I
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think the first few episodes were directed by Tim Burton. I always love, love his stuff.
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It always has like a, like an artistic choice to it. And I like the darker kind of stuff,
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which is cool.
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Um, I know most people at Pixar are super disappointed in elemental. Oh, really? That's
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not a good sign if the people at the studio are disappointed in the movie. I mean, the
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trailer.
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Yeah, I just I feel like we've seen that before. I don't know.
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Pixar gets, it's out of their funk, because
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there used to be like the best studio.
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Do you have any thoughts on the Disney CEO, like coming back?
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Um, I never was like too invested in all of that. But it's, it's kind of like the guy
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who started to lead Disney, and all these, and created all these like, issues. Now we're,
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now we're bringing him back to, to fix the issues.
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Yeah, I don't, I don't know. I will see. I think the latest Stranger World or whatever
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is the lowest grossing Disney movie of all time. I think I read that somewhere.
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That's sad.
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Yes, yeah, we looked it up yesterday. And it has only made about like 30 million back
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on like 180 million budget. It's doing so terribly. And like I went and I saw it because
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to be honest, I didn't pay to see it had like a free screening at Pixar. And my friend that
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works there like was like, do you want to watch this movie? And we're like, we'll laugh
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about it, because we were fully expecting it to be really bad. And it was actually surprisingly
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good. But I don't know if like their marketing team is like not landing the prompt or something.
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Because I think like everyone just has the impression that it's like a really bad movie.
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Yeah.
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Like, but it wasn't that bad. Like, okay, I enjoyed it.
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I'll have to watch it because like when I was at Disney, they that was the movie I was
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most excited about that they were making. So it looked like this really cool adventure.
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And I love that kind of stuff. So
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yeah, I'm trying to think about like what happens in the trailer. I think there's like
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a weird like, it's a lot more of a journey to the center of the earth plot. Then the
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trailers make it seem like it is. And I think that they really should have like leaned into
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that a bit more when they were trying to market it. Because I don't know, I was under the
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impression that it was like an interact like an interstellar type like space adventure.
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And I think after light year, I was just like a little bit burnt out.
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Yeah.
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But it's a lot more grounded than that.
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Yeah, well, that's, that's good to hear. I definitely have to watch it then.
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Yeah, let me know what you think. Because I'm also like, definitely. Like, I don't know,
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I feel like this past year of movies has warped my sense of like appreciating movies so much
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because the lows have been so low. And the highest might only be highest because the
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lows are so low.
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That's a good point.
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Was anyone seeing the new Black Panther movie?
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No, I have very little interest in Marvel in general. Lately,
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I gotta say I feel like Marvel's going through its flop era, but I appreciate the Black Panther.
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It was cinematography, from a cinematography point, I feel like it was pretty, pretty on
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point. So okay. That's just me now.
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That's good. Was it because I know the first Black Panther, like there was like, you could
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like see like the matte paintings, like the lighting didn't match up. But this one, it
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looked better.
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Yeah, there there was like a I don't want to spoil it, if anyone wants to watch it,
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but I thought that they did a pretty good job. I was pretty impressed.
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Oh, that's good to hear.
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Oh, man, I just, oh, go ahead.
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Oh, sorry. I'm just thinking about how much like, if you're if you were upset by the matte
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paintings in Black Panther, that I cannot wait for you to watch the quote unquote live
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action Pinocchio because like, I swear to God, like I want, like, I don't know, I don't
423
00:46:08,200 --> 00:46:15,920
think you can live stream watching it. But like, I think that you would go like it's,
424
00:46:15,920 --> 00:46:21,920
it's so bad. Like the matte paintings specifically from a technical standpoint are so bad.
425
00:46:21,920 --> 00:46:25,800
Oh my gosh, I cannot wait.
426
00:46:25,800 --> 00:46:32,480
It was really, really fun to watch with friends because we kept laughing at how god awful
427
00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:33,480
everything was.
428
00:46:33,480 --> 00:46:37,960
Oh my gosh, it's amazing.
429
00:46:37,960 --> 00:46:42,440
I appreciate so much the honesty about those movies.
430
00:46:42,440 --> 00:46:48,920
Yeah, I'm glad we can talk shit in this class. Sorry, I say I'm glad we can all just talk
431
00:46:48,920 --> 00:46:52,920
shit.
432
00:46:52,920 --> 00:46:59,440
In so many ways, I appreciate the fact that the movies are so bad. Because it's really
433
00:46:59,440 --> 00:47:06,760
like, stop making freaking the remake of the remake, what is going to be the next remake,
434
00:47:06,760 --> 00:47:14,480
the remake of the Lila remake of Pinocchio? It's like, ah, yeah, I hope that things start
435
00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:16,480
to shift.
436
00:47:16,480 --> 00:47:23,120
It's gonna have to, because these all these companies are losing money, maybe just like
437
00:47:23,120 --> 00:47:26,020
all their stocks are going down.
438
00:47:26,020 --> 00:47:29,280
It's almost like the creative leadership, they have to get like slapped on the wrist
439
00:47:29,280 --> 00:47:33,960
every couple decades of like, okay, you've been too greedy, you have to like, dial it
440
00:47:33,960 --> 00:47:37,520
back and let the creatives do their job again. And then we can have like another era of like
441
00:47:37,520 --> 00:47:40,760
amazing things. They can try to milk it into oblivion.
442
00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:48,560
Yeah, I think you're right.
443
00:47:48,560 --> 00:47:56,520
It's just funny, because it's like, via these people or these like, leaders, like not taking
444
00:47:56,520 --> 00:48:02,200
chances creatively, they're actually risking everything financially. It's so backwards.
445
00:48:02,200 --> 00:48:04,200
Yeah.
446
00:48:04,200 --> 00:48:07,800
Go ahead.
447
00:48:07,800 --> 00:48:21,000
Now, I will probably go after that. Otherwise, I will deviate too much the conversation.
448
00:48:21,000 --> 00:48:31,880
No? No? Okay.
449
00:48:31,880 --> 00:48:39,840
I wanted to ask you about something that I was just thinking and I wanted to know your
450
00:48:39,840 --> 00:48:47,280
perspective. Okay, is Inve2 still running still strong going forward?
451
00:48:47,280 --> 00:49:04,440
Yeah, we are going through some changes. We are because, um, I'll talk about it for a
452
00:49:04,440 --> 00:49:13,840
second. Our first couple of shorts that we did, we tried to do all on our own, and it
453
00:49:13,840 --> 00:49:20,640
was like, super difficult. It's it was like me all day, like, it's like, okay, now I need
454
00:49:20,640 --> 00:49:26,840
a rigger. So I'm like online trying to find a rigger for like a week, then I get a rigger
455
00:49:26,840 --> 00:49:31,560
and then I need a lighting artist. And then one of my lighting artists quit. So then I
456
00:49:31,560 --> 00:49:40,040
need to find another one. So like trying to hire everyone was just like, taking all my
457
00:49:40,040 --> 00:49:50,360
time and I wasn't, I wasn't painting, wasn't doing what I like wanted to do. So me and
458
00:49:50,360 --> 00:49:58,720
my business partner, we found another studio that they don't have like the creative side,
459
00:49:58,720 --> 00:50:07,120
which would be like me and my my partner Ken. But they have like the full production pipeline,
460
00:50:07,120 --> 00:50:15,620
figured out they have like the full team and everything. So moving forward, we have linked
461
00:50:15,620 --> 00:50:25,320
up with this other studio. And so now it's like, it's it's much better. It's like, me
462
00:50:25,320 --> 00:50:33,480
and Ken get the project. We do paintings, designs, the storyboards, all that, and then
463
00:50:33,480 --> 00:50:41,760
we get it to this other studio. And then they help us like just build it. And then they
464
00:50:41,760 --> 00:50:50,840
check in with us like, twice a week. So yeah, that's that's where we're at now. And we'll
465
00:50:50,840 --> 00:51:03,600
see what happens if that means we merge with them. Or, or we keep going the way we are.
466
00:51:03,600 --> 00:51:13,560
But yeah, it's starting in the new year. We're hoping to, to get some answers, because we
467
00:51:13,560 --> 00:51:25,080
also want to do like an original short. Yeah, so and I think I think we'll be able to release
468
00:51:25,080 --> 00:51:30,440
some new stuff that we've done soon.
469
00:51:30,440 --> 00:51:38,360
I was asking you because I know I'm having a little bit of a situation like that with
470
00:51:38,360 --> 00:51:51,320
my studio. And I like for instance, you, you have been always protecting your, say, I see
471
00:51:51,320 --> 00:51:57,600
an artist, even if you have your own company now. But sometimes along the way, that means
472
00:51:57,600 --> 00:52:03,920
that for instance, that hiring people, hiring resources, that takes a lot of time. If you
473
00:52:03,920 --> 00:52:12,480
don't have the problem for people who will support you. And I was thinking about, there
474
00:52:12,480 --> 00:52:17,120
has been a lot of people that I've talked to in different studios that are, that they
475
00:52:17,120 --> 00:52:22,320
have mainly said like, "Oh no, so yeah, over time, I just decided to give up on my art.
476
00:52:22,320 --> 00:52:29,480
And then I just became an administrator or whatever." And probably that it's good for
477
00:52:29,480 --> 00:52:37,080
some people, but in the end, for me, what it's the most, what makes me more happy, it's
478
00:52:37,080 --> 00:52:41,600
when I'm able to create. And if I think about the studio, it's because it's a platform to
479
00:52:41,600 --> 00:52:51,400
make our own stories. So then I was thinking, okay, but who are people who own studios,
480
00:52:51,400 --> 00:52:57,640
but that keep ourselves, that keep themselves creative. So you are one of those. Then there
481
00:52:57,640 --> 00:53:04,920
is Daisutsu Tsumi. He has been with Tonko House, being able to also doing that. And
482
00:53:04,920 --> 00:53:09,600
now he's directing Nonny and everything, but still he paints all the time. And he was able
483
00:53:09,600 --> 00:53:17,240
to find the resources and the people who helped him to keep himself creative, but not to dilute
484
00:53:17,240 --> 00:53:24,800
into so many things. And the other one, probably Jorge Gutierrez with Maya. So they keep themselves
485
00:53:24,800 --> 00:53:30,680
creative. They make their own, they make their companies, but they're able to find a structure
486
00:53:30,680 --> 00:53:38,040
of people who support them into making, to keep making their ideas. But I don't know,
487
00:53:38,040 --> 00:53:43,800
like, what are your thoughts on that? I mean, as you have been like with Ameketu and trying
488
00:53:43,800 --> 00:53:48,800
to keep the balance between business owner and creative.
489
00:53:48,800 --> 00:54:02,400
Yeah. If you can find someone to handle all the non-creative stuff, then that's like the
490
00:54:02,400 --> 00:54:12,720
best case scenario. It's just super hard to do. Might take a lot of, a lot of searching
491
00:54:12,720 --> 00:54:24,080
and yeah, if you want to, if you want to stay creative and you want to stay like doing the
492
00:54:24,080 --> 00:54:30,240
art, you need to find someone that, that can do, do all the stuff that you don't want to
493
00:54:30,240 --> 00:54:35,520
do.
494
00:54:35,520 --> 00:54:44,080
So in your case, is your business partner, which takes care of relationships and producing
495
00:54:44,080 --> 00:54:46,080
and all of that, right?
496
00:54:46,080 --> 00:54:54,360
Yeah. He handles all of that. So I get, you know, one or two meetings a week. I just check
497
00:54:54,360 --> 00:55:01,840
in. Basically I like get, get my assignments to do, you know, I'll have like one art review
498
00:55:01,840 --> 00:55:09,680
where I just review everyone's art and the lighting and all of that. And it works out
499
00:55:09,680 --> 00:55:13,520
pretty good.
500
00:55:13,520 --> 00:55:18,040
And that gives you time to start to make like the, for instance, like the first original
501
00:55:18,040 --> 00:55:22,560
short that the studio is going to have.
502
00:55:22,560 --> 00:55:24,160
Yeah. Yeah.
503
00:55:24,160 --> 00:55:29,400
Talking about that kind of reminds me of something I was watching last night, which was like
504
00:55:29,400 --> 00:55:39,960
the history of Pixar and like John Lasseter had gotten fired from Disney right after pitching
505
00:55:39,960 --> 00:55:43,960
like the little toaster or something.
506
00:55:43,960 --> 00:55:51,120
And he was hired on to Pixar like less than six months later. But when he arrived at Pixar,
507
00:55:51,120 --> 00:55:56,280
he was describing that it was like, they had everything but the creative talent there.
508
00:55:56,280 --> 00:56:02,200
And they'd had just like a ton of like passionate tech people who loved animation, but quote
509
00:56:02,200 --> 00:56:07,880
unquote, we're not very good at animating. And it just kind of reminds me of that mashup
510
00:56:07,880 --> 00:56:13,760
of, you know, like creative talent and technical talent coming together to make something greater
511
00:56:13,760 --> 00:56:18,880
than either group could make on their own. I think it's really cool.
512
00:56:18,880 --> 00:56:24,000
Yeah.
513
00:56:24,000 --> 00:56:26,840
And then they made Toy Story.
514
00:56:26,840 --> 00:56:36,320
Yeah. I don't know. It just, I mean, probably if you look at every variable right now with
515
00:56:36,320 --> 00:56:39,920
the things that you guys were talking about, like all the movies, movies that look like
516
00:56:39,920 --> 00:56:50,320
not so nice. And right now there is so much content right now and so many platforms that
517
00:56:50,320 --> 00:56:58,520
want to put content out there. Then the next question is if you put out something and then
518
00:56:58,520 --> 00:57:09,880
you have the great team and everything, then you have to be super, I don't know. I mean,
519
00:57:09,880 --> 00:57:19,680
definitely creative. It plays a huge part into making a full, a really great story like
520
00:57:19,680 --> 00:57:24,480
Arcane that the story was like so well managed that the people started to turn back because
521
00:57:24,480 --> 00:57:29,520
if the story is shitty, then no one is going to turn around with all the content that is
522
00:57:29,520 --> 00:57:37,000
going around. I mean, I even haven't had the opportunity of watching Omi yet. I don't know
523
00:57:37,000 --> 00:57:40,280
if you guys have watched it or my entry.
524
00:57:40,280 --> 00:57:54,560
Yeah. Yeah, I saw it.
525
00:57:54,560 --> 00:58:01,240
And is it, I'd say, is it most challenging to think about like the stories that you want
526
00:58:01,240 --> 00:58:09,640
to make or how do you see like yourself, like when you start to put up your first stories?
527
00:58:09,640 --> 00:58:12,280
To your question again? Sorry.
528
00:58:12,280 --> 00:58:21,920
How does it make you feel if you want to shoot out your own stories with all the competition
529
00:58:21,920 --> 00:58:25,480
and creators and studios?
530
00:58:25,480 --> 00:58:37,800
I don't know. I feel like a lot of the studios are playing it safe right now. So it makes
531
00:58:37,800 --> 00:58:50,480
me want to do something edgier. It's kind of like inspiring because there's more. Yeah,
532
00:58:50,480 --> 00:58:55,040
makes me want to like, it's like, oh, there's so much opportunity to do something different.
533
00:58:55,040 --> 00:59:09,120
That's exciting for me.
534
00:59:09,120 --> 00:59:17,960
And is right now, when you have your project assignments, like for instance, these moments
535
00:59:17,960 --> 00:59:27,440
where you're making this open conversation and you're still practicing, are you still
536
00:59:27,440 --> 00:59:33,000
keeping like some kind of routine to keep like pushing your skills on a daily basis?
537
00:59:33,000 --> 00:59:42,960
Yeah, it's part of why I'm doing this right now. It's kind of like a good way to just
538
00:59:42,960 --> 00:59:54,840
do a study and meet up with you guys. I think, like I mentioned at the beginning of the class,
539
00:59:54,840 --> 01:00:00,800
I don't know if you're here, but I'm finishing up on Spiderverse in a couple of weeks. So
540
01:00:00,800 --> 01:00:06,480
that'll give me some more time to get back to learning and stuff. So I'm excited about
541
01:00:06,480 --> 01:00:19,000
that. Because I haven't done too much of that in the past like year or two. But yeah, I'm
542
01:00:19,000 --> 01:00:25,400
like, I will always like continue to do these things where I'm learning and pushing myself
543
01:00:25,400 --> 01:00:34,920
because if we don't, then, you know, everyone will just pass us by. You know, I don't want
544
01:00:34,920 --> 01:00:48,920
to be one of those older guys at a studio who hasn't like kept up with the times and
545
01:00:48,920 --> 01:00:56,880
who hasn't really pushed themselves in the past like 20 years, you know?
546
01:00:56,880 --> 01:01:04,160
Yeah, then it always starts to make like, "I remember back then."
547
01:01:04,160 --> 01:01:15,200
From like the old wins and everything, all the stories that happened before in his life.
548
01:01:15,200 --> 01:01:18,880
But wait, what now?
549
01:01:18,880 --> 01:01:33,640
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I worked with this one guy, upper 40s. And he said something about how
550
01:01:33,640 --> 01:01:44,300
like how he's mastered painting. Like he's good. He like knows everything about painting.
551
01:01:44,300 --> 01:01:51,920
So now he's like focused on other things. I'm just thinking like, you can never master
552
01:01:51,920 --> 01:02:00,600
painting. It's like there's always something new to learn. It's like Craig Mullins is out
553
01:02:00,600 --> 01:02:11,320
there like doing like, he's always got a sketchbook. He's sketching like when he's just like out
554
01:02:11,320 --> 01:02:15,640
at a coffee shop or whatever, you know? To me, that's like really inspiring.
555
01:02:15,640 --> 01:02:22,960
It reminds me of a story my friend told me. He's a flavor chemist and somebody in his
556
01:02:22,960 --> 01:02:28,120
industry who's like an older guy essentially had a similar attitude of like, "I can't,
557
01:02:28,120 --> 01:02:33,200
you know, I'm not going to learn anything I don't already know or, you know, just whatever."
558
01:02:33,200 --> 01:02:40,440
And the reality is that guy's kind of like kind of washed up in there. You know, I think
559
01:02:40,440 --> 01:02:44,760
once you take that attitude that you don't have anything left to learn, you're done.
560
01:02:44,760 --> 01:02:48,040
Or at least you're on your way to being done.
561
01:02:48,040 --> 01:02:52,280
Yeah, I think so.
562
01:02:52,280 --> 01:03:07,320
True, right now, this year, I think that I've been painting a lot more than I used to do
563
01:03:07,320 --> 01:03:18,840
like past years. But I've been thinking more about how can I create more of a deliberate
564
01:03:18,840 --> 01:03:24,680
practice and a structure to see what to do. I don't know. I was thinking if I should like
565
01:03:24,680 --> 01:03:38,200
make the full scholism course of dice, Robert, to get that. Because then again, it's just
566
01:03:38,200 --> 01:03:50,360
like concepts that you need to watch again to probably understand them better. So I don't
567
01:03:50,360 --> 01:04:01,960
know if you guys or you for the next things that you want to push to you, you think, "Okay,
568
01:04:01,960 --> 01:04:07,040
I think that now I want to explore this in painting or I want to get better at this and
569
01:04:07,040 --> 01:04:10,760
set up a structure to start to level up again."
570
01:04:10,760 --> 01:04:21,280
Yeah. I'll bring up her stuff.
571
01:04:21,280 --> 01:04:29,080
By the way, watching you do that water just now with the rock, it's like I'm diving immediately
572
01:04:29,080 --> 01:04:34,800
into my own painting because I'm doing that and I just realized I think I got my specular
573
01:04:34,800 --> 01:04:38,000
reflection backwards. Anyway, thanks.
574
01:04:38,000 --> 01:05:01,200
Yeah. If you know Tojo, she does these really cool... she posts videos. Yeah, she does these
575
01:05:01,200 --> 01:05:16,320
really cool Blender things. So I'm getting her to mentor me in the new year. So this
576
01:05:16,320 --> 01:05:21,840
because I just think this is so cool. And because she does this a lot with... she says
577
01:05:21,840 --> 01:05:23,360
it's mostly painting.
578
01:05:23,360 --> 01:05:27,480
I can totally see that in your style.
579
01:05:27,480 --> 01:05:28,480
Yeah.
580
01:05:28,480 --> 01:05:37,720
It reminds me of... what's that Rob Rupel... oh my god, Entergalactic? It's kind of that
581
01:05:37,720 --> 01:05:40,480
3D painted vibe.
582
01:05:40,480 --> 01:05:42,360
Oh, yeah.
583
01:05:42,360 --> 01:05:49,800
Yeah. I used to do projection mapping in my own, but I'm sure that it's probably easier
584
01:05:49,800 --> 01:05:50,800
in Blender.
585
01:05:50,800 --> 01:05:51,800
Oh, cool. Yeah.
586
01:05:51,800 --> 01:06:00,340
Also, Zach, I had a question for you. I did put it in the chat, but I was wondering if
587
01:06:00,340 --> 01:06:03,880
any of your first cards made the trailer for Spider-Verse.
588
01:06:03,880 --> 01:06:11,280
No, I didn't work on any of those. I did some color keys for it.
589
01:06:11,280 --> 01:06:13,760
Oh, okay.
590
01:06:13,760 --> 01:06:25,200
Yeah, the past few months on Spider-Verse, I've just been doing color keys, which is super
591
01:06:25,200 --> 01:06:32,800
challenging and rewarding.
592
01:06:32,800 --> 01:06:38,720
If you were going to try to put some... or... I'm interested in doing some color work as
593
01:06:38,720 --> 01:06:46,880
well and to emphasize that or to generate more work like that in my portfolio. Do you
594
01:06:46,880 --> 01:06:56,320
think doing really loose paintings that are just very color oriented, similar to some
595
01:06:56,320 --> 01:07:02,760
of the artists that came up a little earlier in your style guide? I have a hard time with
596
01:07:02,760 --> 01:07:07,040
the names, but just some of those more abstract, very painterly images.
597
01:07:07,040 --> 01:07:17,760
I guess my question would be what level of resolution, how finished does something that's
598
01:07:17,760 --> 01:07:27,800
targeted at being color work need to be in the context of maybe some more finished pieces
599
01:07:27,800 --> 01:07:32,560
already being in a portfolio? Can you get away with batching a bunch of really loose
600
01:07:32,560 --> 01:07:37,160
ones and try to show just some raw color chops or does it always need to be in the context
601
01:07:37,160 --> 01:07:39,040
of something more finished?
602
01:07:39,040 --> 01:07:49,520
No, let me see. Maybe if I go...
603
01:07:49,520 --> 01:07:53,040
It's almost like what would you want to see out of an artist if you were looking at their
604
01:07:53,040 --> 01:07:56,040
portfolio and you're like, "Oh, wow, this person could actually maybe help with some
605
01:07:56,040 --> 01:08:01,520
color stuff," or maybe that never even comes up because you can always do it yourself.
606
01:08:01,520 --> 01:08:08,320
If you were going to recommend somebody for a color project, what would you want to see?
607
01:08:08,320 --> 01:08:17,800
If someone sent me a bunch of these, I'd be like, "You're hired now for my job. Let's
608
01:08:17,800 --> 01:08:22,080
go," because these little doodles I do...
609
01:08:22,080 --> 01:08:24,440
Those are what, two hours?
610
01:08:24,440 --> 01:08:30,760
Yeah, I probably spend an hour or two on a lot of these.
611
01:08:30,760 --> 01:08:31,760
That's enough.
612
01:08:31,760 --> 01:08:40,320
You would just want to see a range of what? Inside/outside, times of day, or what would
613
01:08:40,320 --> 01:08:43,240
you say are the biggest color touchstones?
614
01:08:43,240 --> 01:08:54,000
Yeah, even just if I scroll a little bit, you've got an early sunset piece, a night
615
01:08:54,000 --> 01:09:05,600
kind of high-key misty scene. I have a super high-key interior/exterior overcast. I want
616
01:09:05,600 --> 01:09:14,200
to see that you can paint in any kind of lighting, very naturalistic, like midday, versus something
617
01:09:14,200 --> 01:09:22,360
like this that's more of a pushed color palette. It's very limited in the warms. I just want
618
01:09:22,360 --> 01:09:36,920
to see that variety, if you can hit a mood with your pieces.
619
01:09:36,920 --> 01:09:42,560
Do you think that mood is... It's obviously times of day in these scenarios, but how would
620
01:09:42,560 --> 01:09:47,440
you say that they carry a strong emotional component as well that you're looking for?
621
01:09:47,440 --> 01:09:56,680
Maybe that would be a good practice for you. Find a couple photo references that you want
622
01:09:56,680 --> 01:10:04,920
to do a color sketch with, and then assign a mood to it. It could be a spooky house.
623
01:10:04,920 --> 01:10:10,960
How can you push the spookiness of that? If I wanted to push this further, maybe I could
624
01:10:10,960 --> 01:10:18,240
have a low-lying layer of fog on the ground.
625
01:10:18,240 --> 01:10:26,920
Oh, yeah. So embracing the actual colors and values you're seeing in a reference, and then
626
01:10:26,920 --> 01:10:31,600
taking that a step further and assigning that emotion and just taking it that next step.
627
01:10:31,600 --> 01:10:38,680
Yeah. I'm thinking back to Scooby-Doo. I had a good production designer. He'd come over
628
01:10:38,680 --> 01:10:43,120
and he'd be like, "Okay, put some fog on the ground. Have some bats flying through the
629
01:10:43,120 --> 01:10:51,960
air. Maybe there's some pumpkins sitting by the doorway." Those little elements that can
630
01:10:51,960 --> 01:10:58,520
push the mood. Some of it gets into design a little bit, but that's what you'll do when
631
01:10:58,520 --> 01:11:00,080
you're doing color tees.
632
01:11:00,080 --> 01:11:04,040
Yeah. I think that's one of my more... The things that intimidates me about doing those
633
01:11:04,040 --> 01:11:12,200
is I start feeling like I need to design everything, and then it becomes not a one or two-hour
634
01:11:12,200 --> 01:11:18,520
endeavor. It becomes like, "Oh, this is a new piece." That will slow me down, or definitely
635
01:11:18,520 --> 01:11:25,800
slow me down from doing that. From just chasing down the mood and color, which is what I want
636
01:11:25,800 --> 01:11:26,800
to do.
637
01:11:26,800 --> 01:11:27,800
Yeah.
638
01:11:27,800 --> 01:11:33,280
Do you have any tips on when to catch yourself designing too much and how to back off that?
639
01:11:33,280 --> 01:11:44,960
It's going to take practice because you tend to be a little bit more refined in your paintings,
640
01:11:44,960 --> 01:11:45,960
right?
641
01:11:45,960 --> 01:11:46,960
Yeah.
642
01:11:46,960 --> 01:11:55,040
You're going to have to... I don't know if you've got two monitors or you can...
643
01:11:55,040 --> 01:11:56,040
I do.
644
01:11:56,040 --> 01:12:03,600
I find on one monitor, find some really loose painterly work and just put it up on that
645
01:12:03,600 --> 01:12:10,580
monitor and be like, "Okay, I'm going to paint to this level. I'm not going to go further."
646
01:12:10,580 --> 01:12:19,440
That's part of the reason why I have this right here. Because I'm looking at this photo,
647
01:12:19,440 --> 01:12:23,840
there's a part of me that wants to get in there and paint that texture on that rock
648
01:12:23,840 --> 01:12:29,680
and paint some of these leaves because that's all super cool and looks fun. But I'm looking
649
01:12:29,680 --> 01:12:33,080
at this and I'm like, "No, I'm not going to do that. I'm just going to try to capture
650
01:12:33,080 --> 01:12:40,120
the light and get some of my edges in here in the focal area, but let the rest of it
651
01:12:40,120 --> 01:12:41,440
be loose."
652
01:12:41,440 --> 01:12:52,020
Right. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Having that reference for a target finish. And then you've got something
653
01:12:52,020 --> 01:12:58,480
nice there where it's like your finish reference feels in the same vein as your actual reference.
654
01:12:58,480 --> 01:12:59,480
Yeah, that'll help.
655
01:12:59,480 --> 01:13:05,500
Do you think that... Okay. Yeah. Maybe that's where I've possibly been going wrong. Having
656
01:13:05,500 --> 01:13:10,440
too much of a difference between that creative reference and that photo reference.
657
01:13:10,440 --> 01:13:13,440
Yeah. Make your life easy for yourself.
658
01:13:13,440 --> 01:13:21,120
Yeah. Oh man. Make life easy. Weird.
659
01:13:21,120 --> 01:13:24,300
I know. Let me check out the chat here.
660
01:13:24,300 --> 01:13:25,300
Sure.
661
01:13:25,300 --> 01:13:32,200
Recently I did a painting. It was something I could never do before so quickly. Definitely
662
01:13:32,200 --> 01:13:38,220
the VisDev one has made me a much better painter and how I can break down painting and get
663
01:13:38,220 --> 01:13:43,380
started. I surprised myself. Oh, that's amazing.
664
01:13:43,380 --> 01:13:45,380
Where's this?
665
01:13:45,380 --> 01:14:01,940
Wow, that's cool.
666
01:14:01,940 --> 01:14:04,940
That's crazy. That's awesome.
667
01:14:04,940 --> 01:14:22,140
Manual. I made that 3D paint. Oh, you did that. Dang, that's cool.
668
01:14:22,140 --> 01:14:25,900
It's actually review our Instagrams.
669
01:14:25,900 --> 01:14:36,660
Yeah. Honestly, when I look at artists, I get their portfolio, but then I'll check out
670
01:14:36,660 --> 01:14:41,780
their Instagram because I want to see what people are doing daily or weekly to study
671
01:14:41,780 --> 01:14:52,320
and practice because that says a lot about someone.
672
01:14:52,320 --> 01:14:59,380
If you learn that stuff from Tojo, you got to teach us. I couldn't get into the class
673
01:14:59,380 --> 01:15:11,160
even though us. Yeah, her class sells out. Instantly, I wanted to take it, but I we figured
674
01:15:11,160 --> 01:15:19,180
out like a trade. So we're gonna like help each other out with some stuff.
675
01:15:19,180 --> 01:15:31,620
Like a mutual mentorship thing. But yeah, I'll learn and then I'm sure I'll pass on
676
01:15:31,620 --> 01:15:39,200
some information
677
01:15:39,200 --> 01:15:45,460
without just reteaching her class because I wouldn't want to do that.
678
01:15:45,460 --> 01:15:52,540
I have a question. Yeah. So I don't know if you're familiar with Misha Opeth, his like
679
01:15:52,540 --> 01:16:00,220
this type of work, but I don't think he does many plain air studies, but he has like a
680
01:16:00,220 --> 01:16:08,140
very whimsical sense of color. How do you feel about that?
681
01:16:08,140 --> 01:16:30,620
You want to send a link or? Oh, yes, I got you.
682
01:16:30,620 --> 01:16:43,020
We'll probably wrap this up in 15 minutes. So.
683
01:16:43,020 --> 01:17:08,700
Cool, there's a link in the chat. I haven't I haven't seen this guy.
684
01:17:08,700 --> 01:17:36,460
These are fun. Cool, yeah. What was your question?
685
01:17:36,460 --> 01:17:42,940
I guess my question would be, rather than posting, because he has a post-plan air studies,
686
01:17:42,940 --> 01:17:49,020
but I'm very gravitated towards his style of art. If you saw his portfolio versus someone
687
01:17:49,020 --> 01:17:55,700
who posted a bunch of plain air studies, would you be like, oh, I own I wouldn't lean towards
688
01:17:55,700 --> 01:18:00,140
this guy because he doesn't have that many plain air studies? Or would you lean towards
689
01:18:00,140 --> 01:18:14,020
the other one? I like if he yeah, if I saw his stuff, I'd be like, okay, I don't know
690
01:18:14,020 --> 01:18:23,300
if I'd hire him for for color keys, but I would hire him for like concept paintings
691
01:18:23,300 --> 01:18:28,780
or like design work, because I think that's what his strong suit is like all those images
692
01:18:28,780 --> 01:18:36,540
that I saw were really creative and fun and whimsical and like beautiful in that way.
693
01:18:36,540 --> 01:18:44,860
Yeah, so it's just, it's like what you what you want to do, I guess.
694
01:18:44,860 --> 01:18:45,860
Yeah.
695
01:18:45,860 --> 01:18:51,140
Do you think it'd be fair to describe the colors in that portfolio as like strong but
696
01:18:51,140 --> 01:18:59,380
not as naturalistic? And then that maybe that's coming from like the lack of or not the lack
697
01:18:59,380 --> 01:19:06,220
of but just, you know, his focus is not on life studies. So the color theory is strong,
698
01:19:06,220 --> 01:19:16,740
but it's a connection to like, specifically to real life scenarios is like, not the strong
699
01:19:16,740 --> 01:19:21,100
suit. And if that's what you needed on a project, then that would be the reason why you would
700
01:19:21,100 --> 01:19:22,820
wouldn't do a color key hire there?
701
01:19:22,820 --> 01:19:30,340
He Yeah, depends on the project. I think if it's something where we're pushing the color
702
01:19:30,340 --> 01:19:44,420
in that kind of way, then he would be incredible. He'd be amazing. But if it's something where
703
01:19:44,420 --> 01:19:53,300
I need like, a lot of realism, and maybe he can do that. I don't, I don't know. But yeah,
704
01:19:53,300 --> 01:20:00,580
like you said, it's not as naturalistic. So maybe he wouldn't be the best for that project.
705
01:20:00,580 --> 01:20:13,660
It's it's like anything like, you pick artists who are good fits for the project. You know,
706
01:20:13,660 --> 01:20:22,580
depending on like, like intergalactic, for example, like, I'm glad I didn't work on that,
707
01:20:22,580 --> 01:20:28,540
because I would have just been like, banging my head against the wall, like, being like,
708
01:20:28,540 --> 01:20:37,180
what what are these colors? Like, doesn't make any sense to me. So they'd be better
709
01:20:37,180 --> 01:20:58,460
off hiring someone who has more of a cartoony color sense or something.
710
01:20:58,460 --> 01:21:06,500
Do you think? I mean, maybe it's just my naivety. But like, if I see someone who does planar
711
01:21:06,500 --> 01:21:13,380
studies on Instagram, I'll give them a follow. But if I'm looking through their artwork,
712
01:21:13,380 --> 01:21:20,020
I feel like I'm more likely to go back to someone else's page who has art that is like
713
01:21:20,020 --> 01:21:30,220
super on the creative side. So I guess my question is, for me, I would be I am more
714
01:21:30,220 --> 01:21:36,860
inclined than to post art on the creative side than art. That's just the study. Should
715
01:21:36,860 --> 01:21:43,740
I kind of ditch that mindset and post more studies or for like the sake of a hire? Or
716
01:21:43,740 --> 01:21:49,700
should I continue on in my creative endeavor?
717
01:21:49,700 --> 01:22:00,740
I think, since you have a passion for both, I would do both. Because you like correct
718
01:22:00,740 --> 01:22:06,780
me if I'm wrong, but I think you you like to have a bit of that realism and naturalism
719
01:22:06,780 --> 01:22:18,780
in your stuff. But it's kind of like applying that to a more creative idea. So you want
720
01:22:18,780 --> 01:22:25,020
to show like, if that's the kind of project that you're going to be on, then you want
721
01:22:25,020 --> 01:22:33,180
to show that you're you're doing these studies, planar sketches, and these like, these like
722
01:22:33,180 --> 01:22:38,180
nice, like naturalistic color studies. And then you can apply that color knowledge to
723
01:22:38,180 --> 01:22:39,420
something more creative.
724
01:22:39,420 --> 01:22:45,020
I get what you're saying. It's funny, because you describing that it actually sounds a lot
725
01:22:45,020 --> 01:22:49,620
like Zach's work, you know, where you have these like great naturalistic colors and stuff,
726
01:22:49,620 --> 01:22:55,540
but then you can have really pushed ideas and concepts, you know, like, robots, or,
727
01:22:55,540 --> 01:22:59,780
you know, Scoob and the gang or I mean, Puss in Boots. I mean, what a actually exaggerated
728
01:22:59,780 --> 01:23:05,260
idea, you know, a cat walking around, but yet it's, you know, done in this very, like,
729
01:23:05,260 --> 01:23:10,900
compelling way. And I think there's something awesome about the marriage of like, realism
730
01:23:10,900 --> 01:23:12,900
and imagination, I guess.
731
01:23:12,900 --> 01:23:21,780
Yeah, I mean, that's what I shoot for with, with my work. I want something that feels
732
01:23:21,780 --> 01:23:30,060
like grounded. Because I feel like that's like more relatable, you can like hit someone
733
01:23:30,060 --> 01:23:41,140
in their, their emotions a little bit better. Rather than me painting this like, like, you
734
01:23:41,140 --> 01:23:50,060
know, like, crazy, like, I don't know, like, all the shadows are blue, all the lights are
735
01:23:50,060 --> 01:23:56,620
yellow. Yeah, like, that's gonna take me out of the scene. Whereas this, it's like, it's
736
01:23:56,620 --> 01:24:01,500
like a push naturalism. So I could have like a character walking through here, it feels,
737
01:24:01,500 --> 01:24:07,980
there's a bit of like realism to it that I can grab on to and relate to.
738
01:24:07,980 --> 01:24:13,020
I think of the Pixar thing again, that I was watching last night, and how the, that, that
739
01:24:13,020 --> 01:24:20,460
first key animation that, at least that I remember from Pixar was the lamps. It's like
740
01:24:20,460 --> 01:24:24,460
that little lamp animation. And that was, they were kind of describing that as such
741
01:24:24,460 --> 01:24:32,280
an amazing blend of like, technical accuracy and realism, yet completely surreal and imaginative,
742
01:24:32,280 --> 01:24:37,180
and how that marriage of the two, it made such a compelling short, you know, where people
743
01:24:37,180 --> 01:24:43,900
were emotionally connecting to two lamps, you know, bouncing around. It just, that's
744
01:24:43,900 --> 01:24:49,700
just really, really cool. And I think that was like the, a big part of early Pixar for
745
01:24:49,700 --> 01:24:50,700
sure.
746
01:24:50,700 --> 01:24:52,700
Yeah, that's interesting.
747
01:24:52,700 --> 01:25:01,740
I was like, watching that animation again, it's like, when that little like ball deflates,
748
01:25:01,740 --> 01:25:05,780
and then they're like, all sad about it. It's like, you still, you know, so many years later,
749
01:25:05,780 --> 01:25:11,420
it's like it completely resonates still. It's pretty timeless and amazing.
750
01:25:11,420 --> 01:25:32,740
Yeah.
751
01:25:32,740 --> 01:25:36,500
Really loving the reflections here. It's pretty cool to watch.
752
01:25:36,500 --> 01:25:44,500
Thanks. Yeah, I saw this image, like, a while ago, and ever since I saw it, I was like,
753
01:25:44,500 --> 01:25:48,500
I really want to try to paint that reflection.
754
01:25:48,500 --> 01:25:57,740
I think it's cool, because it's like, it's almost kind of showing us like the rest of
755
01:25:57,740 --> 01:26:00,620
the image, you know, it's like, it literally feels like we're getting all that information,
756
01:26:00,620 --> 01:26:04,980
if you pan the camera up, and we're just getting it with that awesome reflection. It's just
757
01:26:04,980 --> 01:26:06,980
creating such a sense of space.
758
01:26:06,980 --> 01:26:09,380
Oh, yeah, you're right.
759
01:26:09,380 --> 01:26:14,980
Yeah. I've been going to the California wetlands a lot recently.
760
01:26:14,980 --> 01:26:17,020
Oh, that's cool.
761
01:26:17,020 --> 01:26:20,980
They've been really nice ever since it started raining.
762
01:26:20,980 --> 01:26:21,980
Where is that?
763
01:26:21,980 --> 01:26:29,700
And it used to be the entire Central Valley. But now it's like small pockets of it. I'm
764
01:26:29,700 --> 01:26:37,780
in Norcal, so it's like, Consumnes is probably the best one.
765
01:26:37,780 --> 01:26:52,860
It's Consumnes, C-O-N-S-U-M-E-S. It's like a lot like consumes, but it's not. But it's
766
01:26:52,860 --> 01:26:56,500
like the Consumnes River Preserve.
767
01:26:56,500 --> 01:27:03,380
Cool. How have you lived in California your whole life?
768
01:27:03,380 --> 01:27:11,700
I lived, I grew up in the Bay Area. And then I went to college in Maryland for five years.
769
01:27:11,700 --> 01:27:16,020
And then I came back during the pandemic.
770
01:27:16,020 --> 01:27:19,700
So you've been here a while.
771
01:27:19,700 --> 01:27:25,720
Yeah, yeah. Any questions? I recommended Zion to you. I'm that person. So
772
01:27:25,720 --> 01:27:32,620
yeah, you're you're the person to ask for nature trips.
773
01:27:32,620 --> 01:27:36,020
My question would be, what did you study in Maryland?
774
01:27:36,020 --> 01:27:41,660
Oh, I went to MICA, which is the Maryland Institute College of Art.
775
01:27:41,660 --> 01:27:43,700
Oh, cool.
776
01:27:43,700 --> 01:27:49,740
So I studied animation, but no one has ever heard of it because it has a really tiny animation
777
01:27:49,740 --> 01:27:51,480
program.
778
01:27:51,480 --> 01:27:55,980
I checked out that school when I was looking at schools.
779
01:27:55,980 --> 01:28:06,220
Yeah, they're, they're very good at fine art. And like oil painting.
780
01:28:06,220 --> 01:28:10,380
That's probably what they're like most well known for or like editorial. It's a very much
781
01:28:10,380 --> 01:28:18,860
like an East Coast school. In the sense that like, you either go to like gallery work or
782
01:28:18,860 --> 01:28:24,660
editorial illustration or
783
01:28:24,660 --> 01:28:29,400
that's interesting you say that because I feel like why I left the East Coast. It felt
784
01:28:29,400 --> 01:28:35,140
like all the art opportunities were like, it just felt like I guess that the whole entertainment
785
01:28:35,140 --> 01:28:38,860
design thing just like wasn't thriving on the East Coast.
786
01:28:38,860 --> 01:28:47,280
Well, exactly, exactly. Like, it's a very fine art place. Like, and we can get into
787
01:28:47,280 --> 01:28:51,460
like the more nuanced about like, well, what does that mean? But like, at the end of the
788
01:28:51,460 --> 01:28:55,720
day, it wasn't that you were applying to studios, you're applying to galleries or like residencies.
789
01:28:55,720 --> 01:29:01,240
Yeah, I mean, even for me, like the my experience trying to do like figure drawing, like on
790
01:29:01,240 --> 01:29:06,160
the side, because I was out there like working as a graphic designer, and I was trying to
791
01:29:06,160 --> 01:29:10,400
get more into the, you know, fine art and like ultimately concept art side. And then
792
01:29:10,400 --> 01:29:15,640
you go to these like drawing events, and it was all like, older hobbyists, like who seemed
793
01:29:15,640 --> 01:29:18,960
like, you know, kind of rich or whatever. But you know, it just wasn't that way.
794
01:29:18,960 --> 01:29:23,320
That's true in California as well.
795
01:29:23,320 --> 01:29:28,920
I just couldn't find where like anybody was, like, even my age was making art in New York.
796
01:29:28,920 --> 01:29:34,280
It was just maybe that was like my own like bubble, but I found it like a lot more personable
797
01:29:34,280 --> 01:29:36,520
out here in LA.
798
01:29:36,520 --> 01:29:38,840
Yeah, I agree.
799
01:29:38,840 --> 01:29:39,840
That's me too.
800
01:29:39,840 --> 01:29:45,160
Yeah, but I feel like if you if you wanted to find artists, you would have to go to gallery
801
01:29:45,160 --> 01:29:55,960
openings and like, talk to people at gallery openings. Which, I don't know, it, it, it
802
01:29:55,960 --> 01:30:02,780
has it didn't, it's like the MICA animation program is like non existent. Which is why
803
01:30:02,780 --> 01:30:08,500
it's like really interesting networking with people, like at Lightbox, for example. And
804
01:30:08,500 --> 01:30:13,000
they'd be like, Oh, where'd you go to school? And I'd be like, MICA and they're like, they
805
01:30:13,000 --> 01:30:17,280
like enthusiastically nod and I'm like, you have never heard of this school before.
806
01:30:17,280 --> 01:30:31,600
I don't even think anybody. I don't know. The school you went to or whatever. I'm just
807
01:30:31,600 --> 01:30:35,000
so much more interested in seeing somebody's portfolio, I suppose, you know, because wherever
808
01:30:35,000 --> 01:30:39,520
somebody went, doesn't necessarily reflect who they are.
809
01:30:39,520 --> 01:30:46,960
Yeah, well, I mean, that's true. But also, like, all of my professors who taught animation
810
01:30:46,960 --> 01:30:53,280
had been out of the industry for so long. That like, I swear to God, at one point, someone
811
01:30:53,280 --> 01:30:58,000
was just like, Yeah, you want to you want a hard copy of your portfolio on a CD? I was
812
01:30:58,000 --> 01:31:04,000
like, oh, my computer doesn't even have a CD drive. Like, what are you talking about?
813
01:31:04,000 --> 01:31:14,400
Like, like, one of my professors worked on Doug, the movie, you know, the super, super
814
01:31:14,400 --> 01:31:24,560
recent Doug the movie. And I think like, that's true. But like, honestly, I'm a little bit
815
01:31:24,560 --> 01:31:30,400
soured on like, the entire art school thing, because of that, because like, I learned a
816
01:31:30,400 --> 01:31:34,800
lot more from just like sitting on zoom calls and stack than I did it classes taught by
817
01:31:34,800 --> 01:31:36,880
people who worked on Doug the movie.
818
01:31:36,880 --> 01:31:45,560
Oh, man. Well, we have a lot. You're in my next class, right? Yeah. Cool. We have a lot
819
01:31:45,560 --> 01:31:50,920
to talk about. Because we can. I had a very similar college experience.
820
01:31:50,920 --> 01:31:57,720
We're gonna we're gonna shit talk. No, you know, we're gonna talk.
821
01:31:57,720 --> 01:32:09,960
Don't buckle in.
822
01:32:09,960 --> 01:32:15,160
Let me let me actually try and get the real name of this.
823
01:32:15,160 --> 01:32:20,080
Tom's here.
824
01:32:20,080 --> 01:32:26,080
I had a question, Zach, you ever think you'll do another or is this time slot for your classes
825
01:32:26,080 --> 01:32:30,960
going to be it for the rest of that till the end of time? Or will you ever do like a night
826
01:32:30,960 --> 01:32:32,960
class again?
827
01:32:32,960 --> 01:32:34,720
Um,
828
01:32:34,720 --> 01:32:44,440
yeah, I would like to do these classes at like different times. So it allows other people
829
01:32:44,440 --> 01:32:46,800
to do it,
830
01:32:46,800 --> 01:32:50,320
to take it.
831
01:32:50,320 --> 01:32:55,600
So yes, I don't know when that will happen.
832
01:32:55,600 --> 01:33:00,600
But yeah, I would like to do that.
833
01:33:00,600 --> 01:33:02,560
Where Where do you live?
834
01:33:02,560 --> 01:33:10,360
I'm in Texas. So I'm like, two hours behind you guys. But my morning is a pretty packed.
835
01:33:10,360 --> 01:33:17,880
Oh, yeah. So I did it like, you know, like, seven my time, then that would be like, and
836
01:33:17,880 --> 01:33:21,440
are you getting out of work or whatever?
837
01:33:21,440 --> 01:33:27,080
I mean, I wouldn't mind on later, but I could totally fit like, lay into the afternoon in
838
01:33:27,080 --> 01:33:30,520
my schedule. But don't do it just for me, you know?
839
01:33:30,520 --> 01:33:35,120
Yeah, I'm just trying to get like, a sense of
840
01:33:35,120 --> 01:33:41,440
because I've been talking to some other people about this too. So I'm thinking like, what
841
01:33:41,440 --> 01:33:46,400
would what would be the best time to do it?
842
01:33:46,400 --> 01:33:53,760
Yeah, you're pretty good.
843
01:33:53,760 --> 01:33:54,920
Cool.
844
01:33:54,920 --> 01:34:01,720
Cool. Any other questions or anything? Before we wrap up?
845
01:34:01,720 --> 01:34:09,600
I'm from Netherlands, Europe, just letting you know. I appreciate it. Okay.
846
01:34:09,600 --> 01:34:13,400
Oh, this is you.
847
01:34:13,400 --> 01:34:23,400
Oh, yeah, that's the the the wetlands. The name is in the thing.
848
01:34:23,400 --> 01:34:36,400
Yeah, that's awesome.
849
01:34:36,400 --> 01:34:39,400
It's Yeah.
850
01:34:39,400 --> 01:34:46,400
I told you, it's just like consumes, but it's not.
851
01:34:46,400 --> 01:34:56,400
But it's just right now we went out there specifically because the sandhill cranes are
852
01:34:56,400 --> 01:35:01,400
in California right now. So we went to go look at the sandhill cranes.
853
01:35:01,400 --> 01:35:06,400
Wow, that's cool.
854
01:35:06,400 --> 01:35:27,400
Yeah, that's awesome.
855
01:35:27,400 --> 01:35:43,400
Well, I think I'm going to, yeah, we'll end it here. I'll probably take a break from this and look at it again with some fresh eyes maybe later today or tomorrow and post it.
856
01:35:43,400 --> 01:35:44,400
I like it.
857
01:35:44,400 --> 01:35:53,400
But, um, yeah, this was fun. Thanks for thanks for joining me and talking and asking questions.
858
01:35:53,400 --> 01:35:59,400
Yeah, this was a lot of fun. Thanks for hosting and inviting us. Yeah.
859
01:35:59,400 --> 01:36:03,400
Thank you. Thank you.
860
01:36:03,400 --> 01:36:06,400
You're welcome.
861
01:36:06,400 --> 01:36:10,400
Oh, it's amazing. Yes. Thank you guys.
862
01:36:10,400 --> 01:36:23,400
Good luck, everybody. Yeah, we'll do it again. Just keep an eye on the discord and all that. Yeah. Next time you'll share person boots with us. Oh yeah, that's right.
863
01:36:23,400 --> 01:36:26,400
Feel free to remind me.
864
01:36:26,400 --> 01:36:29,400
Yeah, free screening and living room.
865
01:36:29,400 --> 01:36:30,400
Oh my god.
866
01:36:30,400 --> 01:36:40,400
No, I would I would love a live stream of you watching the new Pinocchio like seriously.
867
01:36:40,400 --> 01:36:43,400
Ready to be canceled. That's what I'll do.
868
01:36:43,400 --> 01:36:53,400
I'll just, I'll be like a YouTube like, I'll just review movies, everyone in the industry will hate me but like I already got mine I'm out of here, you know, talking.
869
01:36:53,400 --> 01:36:55,400
Yeah, for the rest of my life.
870
01:36:55,400 --> 01:37:04,400
I mean like I would I would. Has anyone done a podcast it's like a director's commentary track where it's like you turn it on at the same time as a movie.
871
01:37:04,400 --> 01:37:05,400
No.
872
01:37:05,400 --> 01:37:07,400
And they just froze the hell out of it.
873
01:37:07,400 --> 01:37:14,400
Hey, hey, TMTM anyone want to start a podcast.
874
01:37:14,400 --> 01:37:18,400
That would be fun.
875
01:37:18,400 --> 01:37:20,400
I will talk to you guys later.
876
01:37:20,400 --> 01:37:24,640
All right. Bye guys. Take care. Have a good day. Bye.
91370
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