All language subtitles for TMZ.Presents.UFO.Revolution.S01E02.720p.HEVC.x265-MeGusta

- The Air Force has been accused

from time to time of hiding
information about UFO.

What do you have to
say to that kind of thing?

Well, these charges
are absolutely untrue.

We've always honored
accredited media.

When they wanna investigate,

they're given specific sighting.

There is nothing to hide?

There is nothing to hide at all.

Bombshell
allegations that the US

has retrieved alien technology.

David Grusch, a
whistleblower who has accused

the government of withholding
information related to UFOs.

Grusch claimed the Pentagon

is hiding evidence of
non-human origin spacecraft.

Has given Congress
classified information.

Working on a secret

government UFO
crash retrieval program.

That has reportedly
found wreckage

of fully intact UFOs.

Something the Pentagon disputes.

- George Knapp and I
fought hard with a lot of others

behind the scenes to make sure

that this hearing could happen.

This was the
first time in history

you have actual whistleblowers

coming forward in
front of Congress.

Dave Grusch talked
about non-human biologics.

He knows where
UAPs were recovered,

that there are over
a dozen space craft.

Saying UAPs are in our airspace,

and they are, quote,
"Grossly under-reported."

This is being taken
very, very serious.

Congress is very much aware

that this is a
significant issue.

These things are having

an actual impact
on our military.

There are witnesses

associated with the government

who are concerned
about retaliation.

He detailed multiple
threats to his own life

and to other people
who are around him.

There's something going on

that they're trying
to keep secret.

I mean, that's obvious.

There is something
about these phenomena

that they do not want us
to know the truth behind it.

- So there has
been activity by alien

or non-human
technology and/or beings,

that has caused harm to humans?

- What I personally witnessed,

myself and my wife,
was very disturbing.

- My name is Jeremy Corbell.

Nobody that I have met knows

the true story, the true answers

about what UFOs
represent to humanity.

And it is part of
my life mission

to try to get
closer to that truth.

When people say you
can't handle the truth,

I don't buy that for one second,

we've always been
able to handle the truth.

Anytime you get resistance,

or anytime there's some
suppression, that fuels me.

It's a high stakes game
being a whistleblower.

There are covert
and overt attempts

to stop individuals from
speaking about what they know

when it comes to UAP.

People don't want
this information,

whatever it might
be, to be public.

They're gonna try to
dehumanize the messenger

to diminish the message.

That's old hat, that's old
trick, that's 101 disinformation.

People who know things,

especially top secret things,

I would say are at risk.

- Oh, fuck yeah, they are.

I wanna know your
thoughts on that.

- At being at risk?

- Yeah.
- I'm a journalist,

I'm untouchable.

You have an inspiring
amount of confidence

that journalists are safe.

- Gimme just a sec, okay?

The House Oversight
Committee is set to hear

from three witnesses
this morning.

Do you solemnly
swear that the testimony

you're about to give is
the truth, the whole truth,

and nothing but the
truth, so help you God?

- David Grusch coming forward

is a symbol of the
times we're in now.

It's a symbol of people
being sick and tired

of being lied to about the
presence of UFOs on planet Earth.

This is just next level,
this is just next level shit.

- I was informed in the
course of my official duties

of a multi-decade
UAP crash retrieval

and reverse engineering program.

- David Grusch had been
a soldier in Afghanistan,

and he worked on
the UAP task force.

So he had a very legitimate,

and very high level
intelligence background.

He knew, from talking
to high level people

in the intelligence community,
that the United States

had retrieved intact
craft not of earthly origin.

- Have you met with
people with direct knowledge,

or have direct knowledge
yourself of non-human origin craft?

- Yes, I personally
interviewed those individuals.

- There he is telling the
world, not only are UFOs real,

but we've been reverse
engineering them.

That not only the craft,

but there were biologics
associated with the craft.

We're talking pilots, we're
talking beings, people.

And if you understand what's
going on with the UFO topic,

people that are not from here.

- There are non-human pilot,

bodies of non-humans
recovered with these crafts,

which if substantiated
would, you know,

it would be one of the
most important discoveries

ever made on the planet.

If I was to tell you
about David Grusch

two years ago and
what he's come out with

in terms of the
allegations he made,

you would've think I'm mad.

You would've thought
I'm absolute crazy,

but this is where we're
at now in terms of reality.

- I have to be careful
what I say in detail

because there is an open

whistleblower reprisal
investigation on my behalf.

It was very brutal
and very unfortunate.

Some of the tactics
they used to hurt me,

both professionally and
personally, to be quite frank.

- He came forward
because he feared

for his personal wellbeing,
for his safety, for his life.

And so, this was a bombshell.

- As you know, I've suffered
retaliation for my decision,

but I am hopeful that my
actions will ultimately lead

to a positive outcome of
increased transparency.

- Have you had incidences
that have caused you

to be in fear for your life
for addressing these issues?

- Yes, personally.

- The idea that our
government could potentially

be retaliating
against whistleblowers

who want to come forward,

and not just
threatening their careers,

but also their lives.

I mean, this is a huge story.

Every American really
should be taken seriously.

- I do have knowledge of active

planned reprisal
activity against myself

and other colleagues and
it's very, very upsetting to me.

- Coming from where?

- Certain senior leadership
at previous agencies

I was associated with.

- If the government is
retaliating against David Grusch,

they're doing so for a reason.

And it wouldn't just be
because he's saying things

that they don't
like, that's terrifying.

Why would they be
retaliating against him

if what he's saying isn't true?

- There were certain
colleagues of mine

that were brutally,
administratively attacked.

And it, you know, actually
makes me very upset.

- Look, when you go
through this process,

it becomes very personal.

This is a real person,
I've gotten to know him.

I mean, he's been to my
house, he's met my family.

And it's not just somebody
you see on television,

there's real repercussions
to his life and his career.

- Has any of the
activity been aggressive,

been hostile in your reports?

- I know of multiple
colleagues of mine

that got physically
injured, and the activity-

- By UAPs, or by people within

the federal government?
- Both.

- With a guy like David Grusch,

when he made his
testimony, I said to my wife,

"This man will experience
death by 1,000 cuts."

It's the nail that sticks
out that gets hammered.

David Grusch came
forward with claims

the United States government
is attempting to leak

medical records
detailing his struggle

with post-traumatic
stress disorder

to the intercept in
order to discredit him.

- It doesn't surprise me,
but it is in the rule book

of how you try to
disassemble a witness.

So after the hearing, I
mean you could script it,

and the PTSD thing is
like the lowest hanging fruit.

If you want to
discredit the message,

you discredit the messenger.

- What I said in the article,
and what the documents

that I found under FOIA show,

is that his current wife
described him as an alcoholic

and said that he
has these episodes.

If you're gonna go in
for a medical procedure

and you find out the
surgeon is an alcoholic,

is that gonna factor
into your, you know,

assessment of whether
or not this person,

you know, has the
judgment that they need?

I think it should.

- You had somebody in
the intelligence community

that knew this information,

that told this reporter,

"hey, you ought to go
look at this arrest report,"

and the arrest report
documents the PTSD.

You had intelligence
community leaking this,

and I'm sure
they're interviewing

my third grade
girlfriend as we speak.

- The article itself
didn't even pretend

to not be a hit job.

- PTSD maybe is something
to kid about in Washington D.C.,

or to make fun of,
but I'll tell you what,

where I come from, we
take that stuff serious.

We value and honor our veterans,

and I knew they would do it.

- Is reporting on someone's
mental health crisis,

one that David GrUsch suffered

five years ago,
really fair game?

- It's interesting that
they would use PTSD

to discredit him for a war
veteran, that seems insane.

You're shaming someone for
seeking help from something

that most soldiers come
back and have to deal with.

That's really insane.

- One of the biggest
issues for individuals

suffering from it is
not receiving treatment

due to stigma
associated with that.

- They're despicable,
they're dirt bags,

but it's about power,
it's about control.

Could you imagine if
you had an energy source,

that those videos showed,

that doesn't send
off a heat signature,

what that would
do to the Pentagon?

They would get
all the oil barons,

they could eat their sand,
they could eat that oil.

It'd put 'em all outta business.

The war pimps at the Pentagon,
they'd have to go looking

for something else to do.

We wouldn't be fighting

these worthless
wars overseas for oil.

You're talking about
billions of dollars,

light years ahead of research.

So, yeah, you think they
wouldn't ruin your career for that?

- These are such
bullshit, little nitpicky

attempts to silence him

- Yes - And punish him

for what he had already shared.

He was very upset,
very depressed,

drinking too much, suffering
classic symptoms of PTSD,

and it spilled over.

I think his wife told police,

he wants to kill
himself, he needs help.

He was detained,
put him in a facility

to protect him for 24 hours.

This is serious, it's been
serious for a long time,

and it's been ignored
for way too long.

- George Knapp and I, we
know how the media works,

we can see how
the pushback works.

We know how the
disinformation campaign works,

and it's like just trying

to cut away at
people's credibility.

- To have that
particular moment,

the lowest moment in his life,

exploited and
exposed and ridiculed,

is the lowest of the low.

It's among the worst slime jobs
by a major news organization

that I have ever seen.

- Nobody was suggesting
that his accounts

of the retrieved craft and
other things that he said

to Congress were not true,
or were the products of trauma.

I guess that was the
impression that the article

was trying to give,

that there was something
wrong with his story.

- The intercept was created
by and for whistleblowers.

It was created in the wake

of the Edward
Snowden revelations.

It's in their mission statement,
this place is supposed

to be a safe haven
for whistleblowers.

- Their motive was
simply, it was reprisals.

They're sending a message,
they don't want David

to speak out and they
wanna muzzle anyone else

who wants to speak out as well.

- Mr. Grusch, finally, do you
believe that our government

is in possession of UAPs?

- Absolutely, based
on interviewing

over 40 witnesses
over four years.

- Did you have any
personal knowledge of people

who have been harmed or
injured in efforts to cover up

or conceal these
extraterrestrial technology?

- Yes, personally.

- There we go, boom.

There you are.
- I see you.

- Hey, what's up
buddy? How you doing?

- Good, good.

- I love the beard, man.
Fear the beard, bro.

- Yeah, well it's
heading into the winter,

and I like to keep my
face warm when it's windy

here out in Colorado, so.

- I just wanna call you,
man, and just kinda ask,

how's it been going since
you talked in front of Congress?

- Slow and steady, I mean,
there's some Congressional

interactions that I'm a part of
right now behind the scenes.

It looks like there's still
momentum, but, you know,

based on world events recently,

hopefully that doesn't
distract from this process, but.

- Yeah, so for you,
is there any moment

where you've kind of
regretted speaking up?

You kind of had to, right?

- Yeah, I mean I
saw that that was the,

you know, course
of action I had to do.

I mean, you know, I
don't, yeah, regret it.

It's, you know, I didn't
wanna live in the matrix

when there's stuff
like this that's being,

you know, hidden
from the world populace.

There were certain
colleagues of mine

that were brutally
administratively attacked.

And it, you know, actually
makes me very upset

as a leader, to see that
happen to other coworkers.

- I was talking with
the guys earlier today

and we talked a little
bit about reprisals,

not just the ones
that are private,

but the public ones, you
know, when they were attacking

in the Intercept
and shit like that.

We're just talking
about how hard

that must be to kind
of navigate all that,

but you've done a good job, man.

- Appreciate it, yeah, it's
always hard to, you know,

look at what the
armchair quarterbacks

and, you know, people
who don't even know you

wanna say about you.

So, it comes to the territory.

- Were they human or
non-human biologics?

- Non-human, and that was
the assessment of people

with direct knowledge
on the program

I talked to that are
currently still on the program.

- Other than the
retaliation, the threats,

the reprisals you are facing,

this is and was a
matter of principle to you,

that human beings have a
right to know this truth, right?

- Oh, 100%, yeah, I'm not
doing this for fame or fortune.

And it was not career-enhancing,

and I had to do it for my
further my own protection.

When it seemed like my
inspector general complaints

and my reprisal complaints
weren't gonna fully shield me

from, you know, ongoing

attacks behind the
scenes against myself.

Somebody had to do it
and I just decided to do that

for the good of the
people behind the scenes

that are with me on this.

- The way they tried to
attack you for your PTSD

and dehumanize you, do
you think that the people

that we know are coming forward,

people that have
filed IG complaints

to follow in your
footsteps, right?

Do you think they're encouraged
by how you've been treated?

- Some were
encouraged and inspired,

and obviously there were
a number of individuals

that went to the inspector
general after I went public.

But they certainly saw
like that hit piece on me

and other things and, you know,

that certainly frightens
anybody to, you know,

have that kind of stuff
exposed in your personal life

just because you're trying
to do something, you know,

hopefully magnanimous
for everybody else.

- Did you see a
reaction from everybody

when you were getting
kind of messed with?

- Yeah, I mean certainly loved
ones and people around me,

you know, are pretty pissed
off to see a lot of that stuff,

but I certainly
psychologically prepared

for kind of the basic attacks.

And, you know,
you're never fully ready

to kind of see that out
in the public sphere.

But, you know, I tried
to prepare myself for it.

- The attacks on you, and
some are very frightening

to your own physical wellbeing,

the world doesn't
know that story yet.

- Not yet, no, there
was stuff that happened

in my personal life when
I was still in government

that caused a lot of concern,
and I had to report that

to certain intelligence
community authorities.

- There's this hesitancy of
people to really commit to this,

I dunno what you call it, like
disclosure or confirmation.

Come hell or high water,
it's gonna happen, right?

- Yeah, there's plenty of
people that can back up

my allegations that I've,
you know, presented publicly.

And a lot of them talk
to the inspector general

that had that
firsthand knowledge,

or on these programs.

I don't, you know,
regret anything I've said.

Everything I've said is true
and accurate to my knowledge.

And I think it would be the
most courageous thing to,

you know, change the
tide on this and allow

a democratic process
to ensue to determine

what the public needs
to know or can know,

versus the way basically a,
you know, cabal of government

and, you know,
industrial partners decided

to have a truth
embargo on reality.

I'm excited that this is
where the work starts,

getting you up there
in front of Congress

and you standing there and
telling everybody what's up.

That's one step, but that's
now just the beginning

to the work that's gonna be done

about bringing people
forward and telling the truth

to the America
public about UFOs.

- Exactly, I know what I
uncovered with high confidence.

And, you know, I'm just
here to hold the government

accountable publicly
because I felt,

you know, that deep conviction.

But, you know, buckle up,

I guess we'll see if there's
any bumps in the road.

I'm driven by a
commitment to both

to truth and transparency.

I'm asking Congress to hold
our government to this standard

and thoroughly investigate
these claims, but as I-

- Are you personally
optimistic about that,

where we're going with this?

- On the UAP issue, yes, I
am liking where we're going.

I think there's a
lot of energy still,

and we just have to
deal with the politics,

especially in Washington
and Congress right now.

But overall, I'm pretty excited

for where things are heading.

- I think for a lot of people,

it's some sort of
ontological shock

to have this decorated
intelligence officer

who is a true whistleblower
standing up there boldly

and being like, "Look,
you've been lied to,

UFOs are real, we've been
reverse engineering these craft."

"Not only that, but there's
biologics associated with these,

all of this has been
hidden from you,

and it's time to end that."

And I think if we
keep pushing for that,

then we're gonna make
a lot of progress, man.

So, just thanks for
being loud about this.

I know you took a lot of
personal risk, but I got your back

and I know a lot of other
people do too, so, thank you.

- Yeah, you're welcome.

- The United States is not

particularly friendly
to whistleblowers.

For many years, it was
basically the kiss of death

on your career to come forward.

If you were a government
employee or a military person,

to come forward with something
that you knew about UFOs,

that was not a good
career move, that's for sure.

- There is an army of people
who either want to come forward

or are in process
of coming forward.

Now, I've personally spoken
to numerous individuals,

I mean, more than
I can say right here.

But the thing is, is
that a lot of people

are in a really
sticky situation,

even stickier than
David Grusch's.

- In my experience, I have
encountered a few moments

where very prominent individuals

have told me that
things are not safe.

Many years ago I had a
conversation with former astronaut

Edgar Mitchell of Apollo 14.

Five, four, three, two, one.

This is Houston,

you're a go for landing.

He was the sixth man
to walk on the moon.

And in talking about
the secrecy of this,

he was explicit with me.

Edgar said to me, "I know
of several people who've got

definite information about
alien bodies and technology,

but we'll never be able to
get them to come forward."

He said that the danger
to them, to their careers,

and to their
families is too great.

- These individuals
are oftentimes

still active in these programs.

Can you imagine being
just a normal person,

you've got a family,
children to take care of,

and you're thinking about,
is this that important to me

to be the person that
testifies to that degree?

I mean, it's a real question
you have to ask yourself.

- Dozens more of government
UFO whistleblowers

have come forward to
share information about UFOs

to Congress, the Pentagon,
and the inspectors general.

- I had another individual
who had an extensive amount

of classified history,
and all kinds of sensitive

compartment information, black
budget programs and the like,

who said to me, "When
you get to the certain level

of secrecy, you're
not even asked to sign

any NDAs or disclaimers."

He says, "It is known
that you will not talk again,

this is like the mafia."

It is understood, you do
not talk about these things,

or things will not
go well for you.

- One of the ways that
people are preemptively

pushed off track if they're
thinking about coming forward,

is putting them under review,

questioning their mental health.

All of this keeping their
clearances in a purgatory,

so they literally
can't leave the job

that they are
doing at that time.

- You know, you
research a subject like this

for a long enough
period of time,

you are going to come across

disturbing and shocking

pieces of information.

I remember close
to 20 years ago,

I was shown a series of
notes about alien technology,

and the attempt to
replicate that technology.

And in 2019, 13 years
later, those notes, all of them,

were leaked out to the public.

These were notes
written by Dr. Eric Davis,

a very brilliant, brilliant
man, who had an interview

in 2002 with an admiral
named Thomas Wilson,

who was Head of Intelligence
for the joint Chiefs of Staff

back during the administration
of President Bill Clinton.

They're known as the
Davis Wilson Notes.

When those notes
came out, I knew for a fact

that those notes were legit,
and I put myself out there

to publicly state
that that's real.

This is a conversation
about Wilson's failed attempt

to get access to a
program that was designed

to study and replicate a
genuine alien flying saucer.

Just think about that
implication for a minute.

I go out and I make this
statement, "That's real,"

and my God, you wanna
talk about a hornet's nest,

that is a mother
fucking hornet's nest.

When those notes
were were released,

you had a huge portion
saying, "That's a hoax,

that's nonsense, that's
disinformation, whatever,"

and I got a lot of personal
attacks during that time too.

Like, "Dolan's an
idiot, he's a fool,

he doesn't know
what he's talking about,

he's a liar," whatever.

Well, no, those notes
were absolutely real,

and researchers
absolutely understand

those totally are real.

- It also gets a lot darker,
the direct retaliation,

the physical threats, and
some of it's so diabolical.

To keep things secret,
people are silenced.

I don't know how
better to say that.

- When you go back through
the long history of this subject,

there have actually
been some very, very odd

and mysterious and
unexplained injuries and deaths

to certain
researchers over time.

And it makes you wonder, is
there something going on here?

- People often ask, well,
"Why was the government

so insistent in knocking
down these UFO stories?"

Because it did not wanna admit

that here was a phenomenon

that the government
couldn't protect us from.

They had aerodynamic properties

that exceeded
anything we could do,

and if they did turn
hostile, there was no way

that our government could
protect people around the world

from whatever
technology these things,

whatever they were, possessed.

And that apparently was
a big motivating factor

to ridicule them, to create
this stigma around it,

which persists to this day.

- The stigma attached to
UAP is real and powerful

and challenges
national security.

It silences commercial pilots

who fear professional
repercussions, discourages witnesses.

I urge us to put aside stigma,
and address the security

and safety issue
this topic represents.

- This idea of how
we stigmatize UFOs,

that was part of a disinformation
campaign to begin with,

to make UFOs part
of the laugh factory,

to make it something
that intelligent people

just don't talk about.

- Governor Christie,
do you believe

that the recent spike
in UFO encounters-

- I get the UFO question.

- Yeah, you do.
- Come on.

Have you seen spacecraft

made from outside of this world?

- Absolutely not, no.

Has anyone ever talked about

that with you?
- No.

- I feel bad for them if
they just try to laugh this off.

I'm not sure exactly
what causes smart people

to blind themselves
to try to fight,

to understand the
unknowable or the unknown.

Then we've incentivized
human beings to really take a look

at what's going on, what's
right in front of their face.

- If anyone would know
about aliens on earth,

it would probably be me.

- I would think.

- Yeah, I'm, you know,
very familiar with space stuff.

I've seen no evidence of aliens,

so I would
immediately tweet it out.

This is, for a
second, it'd be like,

that would be like an all time,

probably top tweet of all time.

Tell one guys, tough.

That's the jackpot.

- I have talked
to pilots myself,

and many see these things
and many don't report them

because there was a
stigma for many years.

If you report a UFO
on a commercial flight,

you go straight
to the psychiatrist.

Hey, did you see a
flying disc out by C17?

Oh, don't even start, Sue.

You're seeing flying
discs? Come on, Sue.

You don't see it, right?

You guys been celebrating the
holidays or anything, or what?

You having a
Christmas party today?

I have not seen anything, Sue.

And if I did, I
wouldn't admit to it.

- The airline companies
did not wanna hear about it,

and that was a policy,
do not report UFOs.

Many, many commercial
pilots have seen things

that they cannot explain.

We just had something
go right over the top

of us that, I hate to say this,

looked like a long
cylindrical object.

- I'm not even upset when
it comes to the naysayers,

the skeptics, the debunkers.

I think it's important
that we have dissent,

we have a lot of
different voices out there.

I mean, honestly,
it appears to me

to be like a mental illness,

where your presented information
such as witness testimony.

- Others have reached out to
me to share their experiences

both on the military side,

as well as the
commercial aviation side.

- To exclude that just to
come to the conclusion

you want to, but ultimately
the truth has a way

of just punching through that.

It just takes time.

Whatever Alien
that got in the closet,

do you think the
government is that competent

that they could actually
keep such a secret?

If we had an alien invasion,

more than the US government
would know about it,

we would know about it.
- Right.

We with cameras and smartphones.

- Yeah.

We are crowdsourcing
an alien invasion of Earth,

because everybody has a camera.

Well, it's moving.

It's fucking ridiculous.

Look at the way it's moving.

- So this is part
of the mystery,

that the pictures have not
been better over the years.

Even with all the advanced
technology we have,

and even the
videos that came out

with the 2017 "New
York Times" article,

were not crystal
clear closeup videos.

There's a whole fleet
of 'em, look on the ASA.

My gosh.

- So I guess the good news maybe

is that these are not
extraterrestrial things

that we have
recorded flying around.

It also always seems like
these videos they release

of these UAPs were shot
on like a baked potato.

Like, I'm confused
as to why the quality

of these images
aren't better yet.

- There's something
about this phenomenon

that seems to frustrate
good measurement

and good photography
and good imaging.

I don't know why, but it is not
something that's an accident

that, oh, you know,
everybody failed

to capture this proper image.

It is a hallmark of the
phenomenon that the pictures

don't really do justice to
what people say they've seen.

Are you serious?

Oh wow, another
one, a fourth one.

Wow.

- One of the things
I hear all the time

is that there's a
lack of evidence.

You've got this phenomenon

that is entering
into our digital age,

it's entering into an
age of social media,

into higher and higher
quality imagery and video.

You would expect
that we'd be getting

better video and
photographic evidence of this,

as our ability to
record stuff increases.

There is always,
of course, the idea

that whatever this is is
more intelligent than us,

and is very capable
of understanding,

if it wants to remain
secret, what that takes.

Yo, what is that?

Whoa, oh shit,

what the fuck was that?

- We are in Mexico City,
excited to testify later today.

Got in late last night,
hearing's today at four.

So pretty, pretty exciting.

Glad we're able to come in
and have this conversation.

I never thought I'd be in
Mexico City talking about this.

I certainly didn't think
I would be traveling

around the world, frankly
to discuss this topic,

but here we are.

Welcome to "Merged,"
I'm Ryan Graves.

Today I'm joined by Sinziana,
who has a background

in theoretical physics, and
we'll be discussing the science

behind UAP and what comes next.

Sinziana, thank
you for joining me.

Lieutenant Ryan
Graves represents

hundreds and hundreds
of pilots that are having

firsthand direct experiences,

where they are seeing
UFOs every day.

- In 2014, I was
an F-18 Foxtrot pilot

in the Navy fighter attack
Squadron 11, the Red Rippers.

UAP are in our airspace, but
they're grossly under-reported.

- Ryan Graves a
fascinating person,

he's a very brave person.

He was one of the
first people to speak out

about his anomalous
experiences and his encounters

with UAP as a fighter pilot
while he was still enlisted.

Ryan is the perfect
person to be talking about

air safety issues
with regard to UAP.

- I have been reaching
out to pilots globally.

I've spoken to pilots
in Central America,

South America, Europe, Middle
East, Eastern Asia, Australia.

These pilots are seeing the
same things that are being seen

off the Eastern seaboard,
off the Western seaboard.

Recognizing the need
for action and answers,

I founded Americans
for Safe Aerospace.

- This is an aspect of
the UFO phenomenon

that really caught
people's attention,

because if our
pilots are in danger,

if our pilots are having
these near misses,

then that's something we
have to take really seriously.

I received an invitation

from Congressman
Luna's office in Mexico City,

and that purpose was to
bring together various pilots

to put recommendations forward

for how reporting of
this should proceed.

And to encourage the
Mexican Congress to be able

to push forward and
recognition of this

as an aviation safety issue.

- Every country has sightings.

- This is something
that is global,

it permeates every part of
society all around the world.

Bam, what is that?

Anybody tell me what that is?

Individuals are having
these close encounters,

so the idea that we could
do something like this,

hopefully it gives permission,
it inspires other countries

to do the same, and
we're starting to see that.

- My expectations for
this hearing is simply

to be able to go in, talk
about my experiences,

share the lessons learned

that we've had in
the United States,

and to bring awareness to
what the pilots are going through.

I could see this being a
failure if it is dramaticized

or overindulged on the things

that we don't have
data to support.

This needs to be a very
data focused conversation

and discussion, and if
the conversation delves

into speculation, I believe
that could be a problem.

- This is important,
this is another country

taking the initiative and
bringing people together

in a professional setting and
talking about the UFO problem.

- The UAP are plenty,
are real, observed,

and not committed
by credible sources,

yet we know very
little about them.

Thanks to efforts like today,

we are starting to
see that change.

- You had good people talk
and that spread the information.

Then there was this moment,

and you saw this unveiling.

- That, you know, that was
an unfortunate development.

- If you even have a basic
understanding of anatomy,

it's very clear that these

are not real individuals.

What's your thoughts?

- I'm gonna, I don't
know, it's all, like I said,

I'm still processing
it bit, but,

yeah, maybe we
can, I'll circle back

on that one at some point.

To surprise the
attendees with something

that has not been scientifically
substantiated in any way,

for me, it was almost like I
was being pranked in a sense.

Just kind of disbelief,
I had no indication

that that would be brought
out in the hearing at that level.

And so for me, it was a
bit of shock and disbelief

and just disappointment
all happening at once.

- My honest reaction
to the alien corpses,

the alleged alien
corpses, total bullshit.

I'm not saying that we
don't have biologics,

that we don't have bodies,
pilots from these craft.

I know that to be true, but
this was just over the top.

It kind of felt like, here we
go, here comes the circus.

- Aliens have landed in Mexico.

- And I'm out again.

- If you've grown up
watching movies like "ET",

these corpses may
look very familiar to you.

Yeah, it looks like
"ET," you're right,

The alleged alien corpses
were found in Peru.

- I refuse to believe
that, A, Steven Spielberg

was so close in casting "ET."

But also, I am not
fear in alien invasion

if they are yay high.

- Here we are.

- Oh, I love this.

Two of 'em?
- There was two of 'em.

So always need a spare?

- Yeah, yeah.

- Did we procreate
with these things?

Oh, you're saying
back in the day,

somebody boinked an
alien, slapping cheeks?

Oh, smacking alien
cheeks, you're saying?

They've been shown
two desiccated bodies.

They look like me
when I'm hungover.

Just like that.

They just detracted from
the important message

that we were looking
to accomplish in Mexico.

There wasn't much talk of the
potential forward momentum

on aviation reporting
for UAP in Mexico,

and that really got drowned out.

So for me, that
was disappointing.

I don't wanna do it
in front of the bodies.

- Okay - For the interview.

So you can do it somewhere
else, or you can not do it.

- Whatever you want.
- Okay.

- So you don't want it?
- No.

- Okay, you want to do
it with him, just with him?

- Wherever, I can do
it with all the media,

but I don't wanna do
it in front of the bodies.

- Okay.

- I'll do it somewhere else.

I will change this, okay?
- But I don't wanna do that.

- Just gimme one second please.

- Okay.

- You know, it all comes down

to having genuine data
that can be fact checked

and confirmed by an
outside community.

And, you know, there was a
claim that these were studied

by scientists and this and that.

I've not seen any evidence
that any of this information

was peer reviewed in the least.

- I had access to that
data two years ago.

They came to me
and asked for my help,

and I was intrigued.

I think unfortunately
the way that it was done

does not give
one the opportunity

to go and check the methods.

They did it wrong,
unfortunately,

with the best intention,
but they did it wrong.

- None of the bones
articulate with one another,

they're a mishmash of
different human bones

from different parts of the body

that are all stuck together.

And quite unfortunately,
they're the result of grave robbers

going into ancient burial sites,

and taking the bones of
children to construct these things

and sell them and to
have them paraded around

to a global audience.

- Did you see the bodies?

That was... I did, I did.

I certainly did.

I mean...

- If you know someone
who wants to investigate,

just call me, okay?

- The way that that
hearing was handled,

for me, was a step backwards
because it's a conversation

where if you start
mixing the incredulous

and the unsubstantiated
with real pragmatic concerns,

that pilots and professionals
are dealing with,

it minimizes that safety
aspect and it draws the attention

to the more inflammatory side.

So for me, that's why
it's a step backward,

and it's those type
of actions that I think

kind of can slow
down that global uptake

of reporting on this topic.

And that's for me why
I was disappointed.

- The UFO community is
absolutely its worst enemy,

and partly because I think a
lot of people want to believe,

and they'll sometimes look
past clearly manipulated

documents, films,
even fake alien bodies

simply to perpetuate
that belief system.

This subject has always
been three steps forward,

500 steps back.

You have a fucking fake
little Mexican UFO baby.

They're doubling down.

- No, they're not.

Because I want to believe in
it so bad, that's the problem,

'cause it's so fun, you know?

The idea of spaceships
coming here from another galaxy.

- It takes away from legitimate
science that's being done

with regard to studying
this phenomenon.

But the more we talk about this,

it's important to
debate these things.

It's important to
call BS on a hoax

and talk about why it's a hoax,

and how do we move past this?

- But maybe a better way
to look at it is in a more

positive sense of, is to
say, that's not how it's done.

So should anything else
come along to be studied,

let's do it the right way.

- The UFO subject
has always been

a magnet for
sensationalist claims.

There are things going on
that actually are really bizarre.

And if you're a researcher
or just a serious student

of this, you're
often in the position

of walking a very fine line.

You're going into the
depths of the weird,

face it, get used
to it, it's the reality.

- It's been a
debate for decades.

Are aliens out there?

And have they ever
made contact with us?

- People are
often very reluctant

to talk about their
anomalus experiences.

Oh, what is it?

Be careful, be
careful. What is that?

Oh, what the ♪♪♪♪?

- However, partially due
to the work of Leslie Kane

and Ralph Blumenthal with that
amazing bombshell front page

"New York Times"
article back in 2017,

we're walking
into a new chapter.

And then with these
recent UAP hearings,

we find ourselves in
even another chapter.

- The stigma, the
ridicule, it's a real problem,

but it's not a problem
we can't overcome

because the
conversation is elevating.

- I see a huge uptick in people
that have been approaching

the community privately,
The Experiencer Group,

folks that feel more comfortable
at least wanting to know

other people that have
been in their situation.

And then another level of
people that are more willing

to talk about this
publicly, like myself.

- Whoa, whoa, -
It's hauling ass.

Wow, it's gotta be a
drone or something.

That's either a drone or a UFO.

Did you see how it
moved? That was incredible.

- An experiencer is anybody

that has had anomalous
experiences of any and all kinds.

That could be UAP encounters,

encounters with
non-human entities.

And that is kind of hard
for the general public

to often wrap their head around.

- The family says something
crashed into their backyard,

prompting them to call 911,

saying they saw
creatures walking around.

- There is a popular
conception that people

that have anomalous
encounters are kooks,

and that couldn't be
further from the truth.

What I found is
that we have people

that have had
high level positions

in Fortune 500 companies,
doctors, lawyers.

These are people that
have a lot on the line

in terms of their profession,
in terms of their families,

and often they can't talk
about these situations

that have happened with them.

- But the stigma comes in
because people don't wanna handle

that this is something real

that people have seen.

So you immediately, when
you poke your head up

and people say, "Okay,
this is what I saw,"

they're demoralized
almost instantaneously.

- One of the most
commonly reported types

is what's known
as the gray alien.

They have large
expanded crania, large eyes,

they have small reduced
faces, slim bodies.

They walk upright,
they can breathe our air.

- There's kind of
two classes of grays

that are often described.

There's one that's shorter,
usually between about

three and a half and
four and a half feet tall.

And there's another class
of grays that are taller,

between five and even
six and a half feet tall.

And interestingly,
the smaller grays

seem to be doing
more mundane tasks,

and the taller grays
seem to be having

more supervisorial positions.

Some people speculate that
the smaller grays are some form

of artificial intelligence,
that they might be some form

of biological drone
almost akin to a robot.

There was a situation when I
was about nine or 10 years old,

where I fell asleep
and I woke up,

and passed the foot of my bed,

there were two beings
that matched the description

of the small gray
non-human beings.

And I feel sometimes
reluctant to talk about it

because I know the
stigma attached to this.

One of them seems to be
floating above the floor somehow.

Initially, I actually
wasn't scared,

it was like a sense of
wonder, but that, you know,

that feeling was only
a couple seconds.

Very quickly, almost
at once, the being

off the foot of my bed
started moving towards me.

And as it started
moving towards me,

the other being raised its arm

that had this wand in
its hand towards me.

And at that point
I was terrified,

and I don't remember
what happened after that.

- Let's make no mistake here,

many, many, many people

have stated that they've
had such experiences.

Question is, if something
of that kind of a magnitude

happens to you, who do you tell?

You tell the police, do
you tell some scientists,

or do you tell your
brothers and sisters

or your parents or your
kids, your wife, your husband?

It's very difficult for
people to talk about this.

- This, I have a
hard time with this.

Why?

Because I don't wanna
believe it. I really don't.

Why?

Because I'm thinking, I
wouldn't mind it happening to me.

- I mean, it's totally made
me question what life's about.

And it's stirred
my life up a lot.

- One thing you find
across the board,

a remarkable
level of consistency

in what people have reported
with these experiences.

- What did they look like?

- I guess it's a pretty
typical description nowadays.

Very large eyes, hairless.

- Did they feel like they
were a living creature,

or did they feel like
they were a robot?

- Well, they were without
expression, I'll say that.

- When you really look
at the full picture of it,

you see a remarkable
cohesiveness

of description and of data.

That tells me that, very likely,

these people are
experiencing something real.

- It's been challenging
over the years

sharing these situations

with friends,
family, and others.

It's a difficult situation
because I lost friends.

I've had a lot of challenges
in talking with people

about my anomalous experiences.

There have been
a lot of situations

that I know of personally
where people have been shunned

by their own family groups

because they were
thought to be crazy.

There are people that
have lost their loved ones,

that have gotten divorced.

There are people
that have lost access

to their own children.

And that has even
more severe implications,

in that some of these
people that lose their families

or have lost their jobs
because word got around,

they lost their reputations,

and then some of those
people actually lost their lives.

There's a reason why we
need to get past this stigma

and why we need to be able
to talk about these situations.

- There's a mystery
here that's worth solving.

Whether it's everybody is crazy

and there's a
mass hallucination,

or that there is something here

that's just beyond our reach,

and do we have
then the necessary

scientific talent to address it?

- A pair of Harvard scientists
say a massive, fast moving

visitor to our solar system
may have been a probe

sent by an advanced
alien civilization.

- 'Oumuamua is the first

observed object to come from
outside of our solar system.

And get this, once it got
here, it behaved in ways

that scientists
can't quite explain.

- My name is Avi Loeb, I'm
the Director of the Institute

for Theory and Computation
at Harvard University.

In 2017, there was
an object detected

by a telescope in
Hawaii called pan stars.

And this object was moving
too fast to be bound to the sun.

- 'Oumuamua, is that right?

- Yes, that's the right thing.

- 'Oumuamua, which is an
object that we detected in space

that you believe could possibly
have been extraterrestrial

in origin, meaning from
some sort of a civilization?

- Right?

'Oumuamua was detected
as a near earth object

the size of a football field.

It became clear that it's
most likely flat in its shape,

very unusual for a rock.

Moreover, it was
pushed away from the sun

by some mysterious force,
which is also unusual for a rock.

That can happen
if you have a comet

that sheds mass and evaporates.

And there was no cometary
tail around this subject.

- First of all, this is
historic, this discovery,

because they've
never seen something

that's come from outside
of our solar system.

It has a shape that scientists
have never seen before,

and at one point it sped up
and they couldn't explain why.

So a lot of mysteries,
a lot of theories.

One of them now is somebody
came by to check us out.

- The question is, who
manufactured 'Oumuamua?

The more data we
collected about this object,

the more anomalous it
was, and it led me to suggest

that maybe it's pushed
by reflecting sunlight.

And for that, it had to
be very thin, like a sail.

And nature doesn't make
thin objects of that type,

and so I suggested
maybe it's artificial in origin.

Finding whether we are alone

is one of the most
fundamental question.

And unfortunately, the
situation is quite polarized

right now because mobs on
social media come together

to just attack me personally
and in a non-professional way,

and I find that disturbing

because this is the way
science should be done.

- Science is always
about narrowing the scope

of what the possible
answers might be.

The data can provide this,

and then you do successive
experiments to narrow the scope

until ET might be somewhere

within the scope
of that question.

Avi Loeb did exactly this.

- When you rule out the
impossible, whatever remains,

as improbable as it
is, must be the truth.

- They will go as far as
saying it's insulting to science

to actually suggest
this is alien.

As scientists, you provide
a theory, you offer evidence.

You don't say, "Well, you
can't prove your theory,

so this must be a
possibility as well."

And even they're
saying it's just click bait.

- Just click bait?

- Nevertheless, you
hear others claiming

that it's an
embarrassment to science.

This is unfortunate
because this is the way for us

to gain new knowledge,
we have to be open-minded.

- We need scientists on this.

Science used to be a realm

where you're
exploring the unknown.

That was the whole point, if
it's unknown, let's look at it.

But with this topic, you
see a resistance to that.

- This is really disappointing
to me that people,

instead of being
inspired, are trying to step

on every flower that
rises above the grass level.

- Jackie Faherty
is an astrophysicist

at the American Museum
of Natural History.

She says 'Oumuamua
did not give off any signals,

suggesting it was a spacecraft.

If you say that the top
10 lists of explanations

does not include alien
probe, what is on that list?

It's a comet.

- Or an asteroid.

- Or an asteroid, or a rock.

- So then where
is alien civilization

on the list of explanations?

- Well, I don't know, real low.

Real low, real, real low.

- Now, even scientists,
other scientists

in his discipline
came out and said,

"Oh, it couldn't possibly
be," or, you know,

"Avi's gone off the ranch."

No, he hadn't, he's just said

that it's within the scope
of possible answers.

- It is absolutely true to say
that the scientific community

has been not just skeptical

of UFOs for generations,

but I would say fairly
hostile, and an aversion.

And more than
an aversion, a fear,

a genuine deep-seated fear
of being tainted by this subject.

- When you get scientists
with that level of hubris,

it's really hard to
backtrack from there

and start considering
other possibilities.

Now, this thing's gotta
be like a ship, right?

That looks too much
like a spaceship.

- So, so the reason why
it's probably not aliens

is its trajectory around the sun

was completely determined
by gravitational forces.

- How do you know?

- Because we know,
we calculate this.

- Neil deGrasse Tyson
needs to grow up.

I think Neil deGrasse
Tyson is jealous,

you can publish that.

He's acting more like an
astrologer than an astronomer,

he's acting more like a priest.

Look at the people who
are the most against it,

they're actually not
practicing scientists,

they're opinion scientists.

When's the last time any of
these people have actually

been anywhere near a laboratory,

or near a measurement device?

- The signal we get
from it is elongated,

but it's probably a rubble
pile stretched into that shape.

Because you don't get that
by nature, you don't get that.

- Yeah, that's why it's manmade.

- Alien-made.
- Alien-made.

- You want that to be aliens?

Just fess up, you
want that to be aliens?

- Of course, I want that

to be aliens.
- Okay.

- These people should be
forced to give back their PhDs.

If you're not going
to honor your oath

of how you're gonna
address and approach data

and openness to ideas,

and you're gonna use
ridicule, you've lost.

- If this were aliens, - Yeah.

- In some kind of advanced
ship, it would be maneuvering,

because a tennis ball
would have that trajectory

moving at that
speed, that's all.

- Is there any chance
that's a tennis ball?

- No.

- Since then, of course,

the scrutiny became even bigger.

In the months and
years that followed,

the pushback intensified.

The problem is that scientists
are not seeking evidence,

they are not really studying

those objects that
look anomalous.

'Oumuamua could not
have been made by us

because it was passing
near us just for a few months

very quickly, faster than
any rocket that we can launch.

That's why we couldn't really
chase it when it was receding

away from us, and it came
from outside the solar system.

So, you know, I just do
one plus one equal two.

I say, okay, it
looks very peculiar,

maybe it belongs to
another civilization.

I attended a colloquium
about 'Oumuamua

at Harvard University,
and I left the room

after it was over with
a colleague of mine

that worked on space
rocks for decades.

That colleague said,
"'Oumuamua is so weird,

I wish it never existed."

To me, that's exactly the
opposite of the way scientists

should approach anomalous data.

It should be an exciting
opportunity to learn something new,

it should be inspiring.

That should be a situation
that we aspire to have.

So I actually see it as
a blessing, you know?

- I can't imagine why anybody
would be upset that it exists.

Like, I wish it didn't exist,
that's kind of hilarious.

- Because it takes you away

from your comfort
zone, you know?

There are lots of people who
imagine that we are unique

and special, obviously
that flatters our ego.

It's really important to
recognize that the earth

is not at the
center of the world.

So reality puts constraints
on our imagination,

but we need to adapt to
that and accept the verdict

of experimental data, evidence,

rather than have an
opinion to start with.

And unfortunately,
within the public,

lots of people have opinions.

- Here to introduce
itself to all of us,

interstellar asteroid,
'Oumuamua.

- Ah, hi guys.

I'm 'Oumuamua, I'm just
visiting your solar system.

You know, I'm
traveling, I'm on holiday.

- And in the scientific
community, you have exactly

the same situation
where scientists prefer

to argue that we are alone.

So that is the main
damage that I see

to innovation in science.

And, of course, it
suppresses our ability

to gain new knowledge about
our cosmic neighborhood.

- We at NASA are acutely aware

of the considerable
public interest in UAP.

However, it's critical to
understand any form of harassment

towards our panelists
only serves to detract

from the scientific process,

which requires an environment
of respect and openness.

- It is really disheartening
to hear of the harassment

that our panelists
have faced online,

all because they're
studying this topic.

- Scientists, they've got
reputations to protect.

They've got their
own intellectual turf

that they've taken
years and decades

and generations to build,

they're not just
gonna give that up.

- It's our job as
scientists to investigate

the great unknowns of
the universe around us.

By just brushing
this aside or saying,

"It's not real, it
doesn't exist," or,

"These are unidentified so
we can't know what they are,"

does a disservice to humanity.

People who know things,

especially top secret things,

I would say are at risk.

- Oh, fuck yeah, they are.

I wanna know your
thoughts on that.

- At being at risk?

- Yeah, - I'm a journalist,

I'm untouchable.

You have an inspiring
amount of confidence

that journalists are safe.

One of the US'
allies, literally-

- I know.

You seem very confident

that the journalist
badge protects you.

- Yeah, I don't know
what I'm fucking doing.

I mean, the truth of it, I've
been told by a lot of people,

you know, that I respect
that I'm in the hall of mirrors,

and watch your
fucking back, you know?

I know people have
suffered grievous injury

for reporting, I know that.

But, again, I don't know
man, I just, I've never...

I can't talk about all that.

I have been threatened before.

I haven been
threatened, straight up.

What are they gonna do?

Gimme just a sec, okay?

Man, look, I'm not
gonna stop pushing,

that's what's gonna happen,
whatever that looks like.

You know, it's not
just like we have a right

to know this stuff, we
have a need to know it.

Whatever that truth is, and
I'm not claiming to know it,

but I do know that I feel
a sense of duty to find out.

And I'm just gonna keep
pushing, I'm gonna fight

until the wheels fall off,
whatever that means.

One step, one day at a time.

So what do I want to happen?

I want the truth,

I'm going to fight
until the wheels fall off.

- As far as you and
George just doing your job,

there's plenty of
people in prison

that were just doing their jobs.

- Bob Lazar is a renegade,

one of the original
whistleblowers.

- Just be careful, don't
step on the wrong toes.

- A genuine disclosure of the
UAP UFO subject will show,

potentially at the
deepest levels,

a society that has
lived a foundational lie

for an entire human lifetime.

- From a newsman's perspective,

it would be the
biggest story in history,

the biggest story, period.

- Got a still image of something
called the Chandelier UAP,

does that ring a bell to you?

It does.

- I've come across a
number of direct witnesses

who have convinced
me that there are,

brace yourself,
human looking beings,

but they're not quite
like us, they're here.

- This is potentially world
conquering information,

technology that can change
the course of mankind.

But you could at least
admit the one thing,

that there is another
civilization visiting us.

At least come
to grips with that.

- If it comes out what it is,

it could be a really dark
moment for humanity.