All language subtitles for Duality.A.Graffiti.Story.2022.1080p.WEB.H264-AEROHOLiCS

[Dual] My name is Dual, short

from the word dualism.

Which to me was the idea that

every day I woke up

in this world that was

divided right down the middle,

there's two sides.

There was the positive

negative.

There was the black, white

there was the high, low.

There's was just everything was

divided up.

And at the same

time, myself, I was

living this kind of like dual

life of

having a regular nine

to five job,

serving coffee, printing

shirts, whatever it was

I was doing.

[Dual] And then at

night, I would transform and

turn into this alter ego and go

out and and put up the work

on the streets.

[Dual] Once you get into it, it'

hard it's a very addicting

thing, it's a very obsessive

thing.

Especially when it's just

individuals going out there

to try to get their name out

there as much as they can, as

big as they can, as you

know, as bright as they can, it

just ends up being this

competitive sport.

And then it pretty much

fed this crush, kill, destroy

mentality when I first started

doing graffiti where I was just

obsessed with wanting to see my

name on

everything around.

I'll probably never, ever

not want to write my name on

something like

it's an addiction for sure.

The illegal graffiti aspect

of of my

past work.

Kind of gave credibility,

it gave it more of a meaning.

It's amazing that there is that

opportunity to bridge

the gap from being

an illegal graffiti artist

to doing commercial work for

big companies.

[Jaber] I'm going to try to take

you toa place that has a light

source so we won't have to worry

that. You know what I mean?

Like, you'll have to

you know, adjust your

ISO pretty low, but...

So what color scheme

are we doing?

[Jaber] It all depends on how

much paint I have really.

Maybe greens?

Maybe.

Maybe not.

So I think that's the color

scheme I'm looking at.

Green fills

outline black,

highlights this is the

background, this

for a double.

I dont know what this will be

but this is bright.

[Jaber] Yeah, man, we got

Enemies. The police are our

enemies. The gang task force,

those areour enemies. Vandal

squad, those are our enemies.

They are trying to

incarcerate us.

[Jaber] They are not

appreciating this art. They are

saying "you're a criminal.

I'm trying to get ya.”

[Jaber] Graffiti is

a great love story, and it's

a great movie, it's a positive,

uplifting movie, but for a lot

of people, graffiti

is a tragedy.

It ruins their life, you know

what I mean? They get a felony

charge. They can't get a job.

They go to jail.

I know tons of people

that have gotten in trouble for

graffiti and it's just changed

their life.

You do a year in jail.

It's going to change your life.

You go to prison, it's going to

change your life.

[Jaber] So graffiti has a

horrible side to it.

And that is the

crime side.

The crime side is not always

glamorous.

It looks glamorous on

Instagram, but it's not,

not if you get in trouble.

[Jaber] I love graffiti with a

passion but graffiti

is not always the easiest

thing for a lot of people.

When I first got

into graffiti,

I definitely

got addicted to it.

It was definitely a drug.

Um, and

it's a drug that

you can be totally consumed

with because once you do some

graffiti, you just want to do

more. You know, once you finish

one piece, you're like,

OK, I know what I did wrong

here and what I want to do

right. What I want to change

and I want to try a different

color. I want to do another

one. So it's an

addictive behavior

that comes really strong.

And when I was younger,

I was definitely addicted.

I still am today,

but when I was younger, I

didn't know how to balance it.

And so I think

being addicted to graffiti

alienated me

from a lot of people and a lot

of relationships.

[Jaber] Sometimes you could be

very competitive and that

could change how you

look at each other and how you

talk to each other and how you

treat each other, and

slowly but surely you

end your relationships, because

you're so fucking

competitive

that you want to do better

graffiti than your friend that

you've known since you were

seven, you know.

[Jaber] But I think to other

people graffiti could be

something like, see, look,

there’s a car right there.

See it?

So that is probably

a train worker

or a bull,

which means.

That he is just doing a

round about check to make sure

nobody's painting these trains

like we just did.

[Meres] The adrenaline rush

is is a whole different sport.

[Meres] The heart pumping, the

idea of am I going to pull it

off and get away with it,

if you do get seen

and you have to run

the chase, the thrill.

[Meres] as a young kid, I would

go and explore either dead

tracks, which are like

freight lines

that are endless miles of

freight, where you you know,

you go in and you do pieces or

do rooftops.

You know, you climb up on a

rooftop and do something

at night or you do street

tagging, which is very quick in

and out.

You know, you can't be spending

more than a few minutes

on a spot and you have to look

out for potential cops

or whatever.

[Sloke] It's like a ninja in the

middle of the night man, you

know get in, get out, go back

the next day, take a flick of

your piece like your proud.

You know, you're like I painted

that. Now you would'nt go

around telling people you

painted it because it was

It was illegal.

[Jaber] You kind of have a

split personality in a way.

You have to be a Clark Kent and

a Superman.

You don't really want to tell

people that you're doing crimes

right if you're intelligent.

[Jaber] So you have to keep it

under wraps.

You have to live your daily

life and go to work or

whatever you do.

And then at night, you

put on your cape, a.k.a.

your mask and you go paint.

It's a dual personality

thing and that takes a toll

on your life.

[Sloke] I don't know why I do

graffiti man. I don't know why

that 31 years later, I'm still

writing my name on walls.

Other than the fact that,

I love it.

[Sloke] It's like a drug, I mean

once you get bit by that bug,

it's like good luck

quitting.

I got arrested and went to jail

for it like I kept doing it.

[Dual] You want to be seen

in your city, every possible

location, freeway, sign,

trash can, whatever it is

that you put your name on, you

want it to be all over the city.

[Dual] To me, a city not having

graffiti is basically a city

with no soul.

[Sloke]What it boils down to

for me is graffiti is about

style, your style

is a reflection of who you are.

[Jaber] The purpose of graffiti,

I think it's to explore

different ways to

make a letter,

to see all

the possibilities of what a

letter can look like.

[Meres] A graffiti art solely

the art of lettering

[Meres] From tags to

throw ups, which are quick

bubbly ways to get your name

out there,

to pieces which

are where you take the

lettering and kind of put a

little bevels and

kicks to it and nothing to

major and wild style,

which is lettering, but with

intricate kind of interwoven

bars and arrows that

that kind of camouflage the

letters.

[Sloke] The idea was like to get

your name up and

and have it stay up,

you know. But we all knew that

everything is temporary,

especially in this artform.

[Sloke] So graffiti, it was a

it was a means for people to

express their opinion

and to get their voice heard.

These are our streets and we're

taking it back.

[Reporter] I just saw you spray

paint your tag.

What are you saying

you do that?

[Unknown] I'm saying that that

I'm a person and that my name

should be recognized.

You know what im saying, I'm an

at least so I'm recognized for

something.

[Meres] We are going to leave

our name and we were here, you

know, it's like it's like your

stamp. I was here and

I'm moving along.

[Sloke] We did it for us.

We did it for the art form.

And we did it because we

we loved it, period.

It was fun, still is.

We didn't care that the public

didn't understand it.

We didn't care if the public

couldn't read what we wrote.

We did it for us.

This is who I am, you

know, almost like,

fuck the system.

[Jaber] I mean, graffiti in

general, you know, it is illegal

if it's on a legal wall,

it's not graffiti,

it becomes

labeled as art.

[Meres] Graffiti art and street

are two separate identities.

What ties us together is that

we, we are both

creating our art masterpieces

and putting them on

the street for the world to see.

[Sloke] Street art is like a

kiss the cheek, graffiti is

like a punch to mouth.

[Meres] Street art is done with

many mediums.

It can be done with stencil,

which is where you spray the

stencil and when you remove the

stencil, you're left with a

fine tuned image.

Chalk, paint brush, anything

goes with street art, in

some instances, graffiti

writers don't really care

for street art.

And me personally, I like art

in general. So as long

as it's good, Im for it.

[Never] I mean, in theory, I'm a

street artist, cause I paint on

the streets like murals are done

in public, but I

think where street art, the

name kind of got co-opted and

became synonymous with, like

stencils and stickers.

[Jaber] I consider myself a

graffiti artist first,

muralist and the street

artist, part time.

I got it into graffiti from

skateboarding, I was a skater.

It was kind of a trendy

thing to do, I guess is

have a tag and tag at the local

skate spots.

[Jaber] So when street art first

came out, it was to graffiti

artists, it was very similar to

rollerbladers vs skateboarding.

When rollerbladers came on the

scene, oh, they could skate

there just fine

doing the same damage,

but they're accepted.

Same thing when Street art

first came out to graffiti

writers, it's like, who the

fuck are these guys?

You know, they're using tools

that are very easy to do,

stencils, wheat paste.

They don't take the

time to learn the craft

and learn about can control

or even learn about lettering,

for that matter.

So the graffiti writers probably

didn't like the street art so

much. Through the years

they've kind of, you know,

kind of meshed and it's more

accepted.

But when they first came out,

it was like something to be

laughed at or something to be

criticized a little bit more.

[Jaber] The thing about the

graffiti writer is the graffiti

writer has a pretty big ego

and a lot of times the ego

is based on your

accomplishments or what

kind of

notoriety you have or what

kind of prolific attitude

you have. If you paint a lot,

if you put your ass at risk

all the time,

you're going to think that you

are more important.

And what makes

the graffiti writer a little

upset about the street artist

is that graffiti

artist doesn't think the

street artist has put in

that work.

[Jaber] Nowadays, you have a lot

of these street artists just

jumping right from the street,

if even that to the galleries,

they just jump right to the

galleries and say, I'm a street

artist and the gallery

people really don't know.

You could spend a month on the

street and they jump to a

gallery and say, yeah, I do

all this street art.

And so the graffiti writer

doesn't like that either.

Why would the graffiti artist

risk all this freedom,

spend all this time perfecting

their craft, and then all of a

sudden this guy over here

skips all those steps and

goes straight to the gallery

and makes money.

So there might be a little

jealousy there.

There might be a little
animosity.

There might be a little hate.

[Dual] You've got artists that

are just pushing the art form

of using a spray can

and taking it from just

writing your name on a wall

to creating fine

pieces of art with an

aerosol can.

And because of that now,

it's created a greater

acceptance of it to

where everybody

wants a wall painted

now.

So graffiti has become accepted

so, so much more.

It paved the way for

all the street artists that you

have now. And now you have all

these commercials on

TV by high end companies

that are using

graffiti and street art

to basically push their

products and to

have that hip factor, you know.

It's created a renaissance

of art where artists

are able to go out now and

create these

insanely large scale murals

in a short amount of time

where it would take back in

the day, Michelangelo, all

these masters

like years,

sometimes like, decades

of their lifetime creating

works.

Now you have these masterpieces

that are created out on

buildings that are skyscrapers

and hundreds of feet tall.

[Dual] We're here at the Lee and

Joe Jamil Skate Park downtown,

right outside of downtown

Houston.

Knocked this bad boy out in

three days.

We're looking at a hundred and

eighty two foot long

by four foot tall.

I think it's about 22

to eight by four

panels.

Yeah. Yeah.

What's up Barry?

How are you?

[Barry] Love the paint man.

I think this area already

you can see the connection

between skateboarding and art

all the time, just like the big

mural in the house.

We just need more of it.

But we need more art

everywhere. I'd like to paint

the whole damn park.

[Dual] Exactly.
[Barry] Take it easy.

[Dual] Alright have a good

one Barry.

[Barry] Hit me up sometime,

I'm always around.

[dual] Will do.

[Dual] Why the anonymity,

why don't you show us your face?

[Dual] I get these questions

a lot. Every day, all the time.

[Dual] I said, I can see that,

like, I started to write

right here.

whatever reason that I stopped.

[Laughing]

[Dual] Someone's flying a drone.

[Dual] Going back to the

graffiti aspect, when you're

doing this work that's illegal

and you're doing it unknown.

The mystery is like a huge part

of the attraction,

not knowing who an artist

is or what they look like

or anything about

them.

To me, that doesn't even really

matter, because what you're

seeing is the work.

[Dual] When you drive around

walk around, whatever it is, you

look up and you see the work,

you don't see

me pinned up on the wall

talking to you like

you see what I produce.

[Dual] Shit blew up on me,

that one's kind of messy.

That's probably the most

important part to me, of the

whole anonymity, because who

cares what the artist looks

like? It's all about the work.

[Unknown] This is a

Houston landmark.

[Dual] Yeah

[Unknown] This like these street

artist have great weight in

Houston and if you want

to have a bad reputation in

town, as the people who

gentrified this area

don't fuck that wall up.

[Dual laughing] exactly.

[Unknown] And he's like,

“alright.”

[Dual] Well that's good, because

I was telling him it's important

that we to have spots like this

around town, you know,

to give the artists the

opportunity to paint.

[Unknown] You know, why be

boring whenever you could have

more than just black and white.

[Dual] -Exactly.
[Unknown] -I like it.

[Unknown] -Gives more personalit
[Dual] -Yeah. It's expression.

It's different. And it's like

different people's styles and

different skills.

[Sloke] Graffiti gave

me a foundation

to build off of into

a career in art,

because the truth is I

when I when I stepped into the

the public arena, right.

When I went above ground,

[Sloke] now people know

the name and the face.

It was a whole new world to me.

And there was a lot of fear.

And I think that's what keeps a

lot of artists back is fear.

I'm going to take

what means the world to me

and put it out for everybody

to see, along

with that might come praise and

probably a lot of negativity.

But I'm going to take that leap

of faith and

I'm, you know, fuck my fear

and I'm going to put it out

there.

Out on this lovely Saturday

painting one of our walls that

we have here in town,

This spot

is pretty much a Hall of Fame.

It's a great wall for murals

and graffiti productions

and so forth.

Sometimes there's more politics

with legal walls than there is

on the streets.

The cops here are pretty cool

they used to stop us at first

but now they know

that we're trying to do

something really nice.

There's not a lot of walls left

here in Austin because of

development.

[Sloke] Why do I do graffiti?

Because I love it.

My heart's in it the good,

the bad, the ugly, the

blood, the sweat, the tears

the joy, the pain the suffering.

Being an artist for a living is

hard man, it aint for wussies.

My names Sloke, I'm based out

of Austin, Texas.

I paint graffiti and I do art.

I started writing graffiti in

1990.

I tried several names

in the beginning,

but Sloke is what stuck.

And one of the reasons I chose

that name was I really like the

letters.

Growning up in Austin

skateboarding, I would see

the graffiti in

the tunnels and the ditches

and I was attracted to it.

Wasn't necessarily the tags and

the bubble letters, it was more

of the piecing but in

order to get to the piecing,

you have to have a

tag and bubble letters

and you work your way up to

piecing and especially

wild style, wild style being

the complex, colorful lettering.

I feel like people do want

to see more art on the streets,

and I think that's a good

thing. I really do.

I mean, me personally, of

course, I'd rather see a mural

than a blank grey wall.

People are, I think, the

general appreciation of art,

it's starting to come out more

you see a lot of people taking

photos in front of them,

families, kids.

I mean, come on, man, who

doesn't like to do art kids

love art, you know what I mean?

[Charlie] Those are TKO guys.

I got multiple

Mez's. I got all of them. All
that jazz.

[Sloke laughing] You practicing
your Jaber head?

[Charlie] Yeah, Well Mez did one

I did the other.

Thankfully i'm much better than

I was back then.

[Sloke] Yeah, well Jaber's going
to be in this film.

[Bob] Who’s going to clean up

all this graffiti?

[Sloke Laughing] Catch this guy

on film man. This is the OG
right here.

I'm Bob,

Nathans old friend.

[Sloke] What's up brother?

[Bob] Very, very little I saw

you was going to be over here so

I wanted to come say hey.

[Charlie] This is a throw up by

famous Sloke One.

A throw up is basically a fat

version of your name mainly

used to get up quicker,

you know, for illegal

graffiti because it's all

round.

So there's not a lot of

preciseness involved.

It's just like kind of getting

up. But if you get really

good at throwies, it's

actually, in my opinion,

the best.

And Sloke's obviously

really good at throwies he's

He’s Sloke!

and I'm just super grateful

that I have this in my black
book now.

A lot of guys in here.

[Sloke] You can fill in all of

this right here.

[Charlie] Yes sir.

[Sloke] There you go,

Try, try a fade, just turn

it a little bit and skim it.

[Sloke] Good job man.

[Charlie] Thank you.

[Sloke] Yeah.

[Sloke] The more we can expose

the public to quality art,

the more it becomes appreciated

and it keeps it going.

[Meres] What's good y’all, Meres

One: CBS, OTM, SHK crew,

Born and raised in New York

City, been doing graffiti,

now 33 years

and counting, no breaks,

no days off.

[Meres] I've been drawing my

whole life from a young

kid I knew I had artistic

talent.

I'd like to get my bones up

there so I know if I'm sized

right, and then they go

in and start doing what I got

to do.

Swore I wouldn't paint in this

cold weather no more.

Here I am.

almost ready to step back

and see how horrible it looks.

I can live with that,

Fix it as I go.

I got to first

consciously experience

graffiti from

a gentleman who wrote Smurfy

after noticing

the Smurf face and starting

to pay attention to tags

and and the bubble letters,

which were background noise

started to register.

I said, you know what, I kind

of want to come up with a

iconic symbol as well.

And the light bulb was formed.

And originally started with one

face which grew to

four faces then

now thirty three years later,

I'm doing

16 faces in total.

Art for me has always been

my escape, my therapy.

Ways to calm down

from stress to vent.

I've learned over the years

early that with art

you could tell a story that

sometimes you can't tell

with words.

Hey, what up butthead?

Got my look out.

Always got to have a good look

out for you.

I try to change it

up every time, sometimes I

like it, sometimes I don't.

I don't like being stuck

on one style

or one flow.

You paint a picture and

people get it within a second.

Because of the cold weather

and the clog,

its got this thing spraying

like a skinny caps in some spots

Sloke, I'm jealous of your good

weather down there, just

letting you know that.

[Jaber] Some people just do

graffiti for their friends to

see and some people do graffiti

for the world to see for the

person that doesn't know shit

about graffiti.

I love doing comical graffiti.

I like painting fucking dicks.

I like painting big ass dicks

with happy faces on them

going by on a train.

So the guy that doesn't know

shit about graffiti looks at

that and just laughs

just has a good day.

Tells his friend at work,

Hey Ed, you

won't believe what I saw on a

train today.

It was a dick.

It's the little things in life,

you know.

[Jaber] I go by the White Ninja,

Jaber or El Ninja blanco,

so I got it into graffiti from

skateboarding.

I was a skater.

It was kind of a trendy

thing to do, I guess, is

have a tag and tag at the local

skate spots.

It was kind of just a hobby,

a little thing to do,

Graffiti culture was very

interested in how far

can they press letters.

How can they flex letters, how

can they make the best letters.

It was all about letters.

Characters were just something

on the side that

accented your letters.

I do a little bit of

everything, but I'm mainly

a graffiti writer.

I have a stencil I mess

with sometimes I

hang out with some people that

do wheat paste stuff.

So every once in a while we'll

do some wheat paste stuff.

But it's just that's not my

passion.

I keep it letter

based. I like doing different

letters.

Of course I have a moniker,

but realistically,

my graffiti career is based

on lettering and how many

letters I can do.

[Jaber] It's kind of strange for

me because I never really wanted

to be an artist for a living.

I just wanted to write my name.

But slowly

but surely, that's

what happened.

I just kind of got lucky,

right. And I fell into that

niche and I started doing

artwork for money.

Same thing happened when I

moved to Los

Angeles.

I'm a graffiti writer and I

don't think about art that

much. And then I answered

an ad to do

live painting

for rap groups, you know?

[Jaber] And then I booked it,

I booked that job.

So then I was on tour with The

Roots and I was on tour with

L.L. Cool J and De la Soul

A Tribe Called Quest and

all these amazing groups that

I've looked up to my whole life.

I never thought graffiti

would allow me to travel

with those type of people.

And then again, I was making

money doing art.

[Never] So, like when I started

doing murals, like when, you

know, you're a writer, you pick

spots, that are high visibility.

Like the more people see it,

the more fame you get.

It's like it goes hand in hand,

like whether it be higher up or

long lasting.

And it still a trip to me, like

seeing a spot where I used to

be stoked, to have like a tag

on like the curb right next to

it of the 100 foot wall.

its really a cool like

sense of pride.

[Never] Part of the things that

make grafitti artists so

recognizable are the repetition,

you do the same piece, you do

the same character, you do like,

you know, Jaber's head or like

Vox doing the same piece over

and over again. You see it, you

recognize it going forty five

miles an hour on the highway,

slower in L.A. traffic

But with me, I didn't want to

keep doing the same mural over

and over again. So I started

doing more like area specific

stuff. Like what teams

played by there. What movies

were filmed there.

What was a history of the area

like iconography on a wall

that doesn't necessarily tie

into where it's at.

And I want to make sure if I

paint a piece in Venice, it's

going to be very Venice.

If I do something in like

the Valley, it's gonna be a
movie

that was filmed in the Valley.

What could I do that really

everyone knows in that area,

and for me, especially growing

up in L.A., there's so many

sports teams and so many like

iconic sports moments and so

many movies, everything's

filmed here. So it's like there

was such a wealth of

information that I could keep

painting.

So I started to do more sports

murals a little bit, and then

Stuart Scott, the ESPN anchor,

passed and me and

Jaber and a few other guys were

going to paint and try figure

out what to do. And I was like,

let's just I'll do Stuart

Scott, he just passed. It was

before memorial murals had

really become a thing. We did

the Stuart Scott one I did his

portrait Jaber did the boo-ya

like his catch phrase.

And I didn't even have Twitter

anything that and dude like

my buddy made me one my phone

just blew off, like the battery

died from all the notifications.

It's so much faster to use

spray painting, and I'm still

comfortable with spray paint,

so I started transitioning like

laying out the base coat and

like sketching it in with

bucket paint and then going in

with the spray cans. Now, it's

pretty much everything can

if a walls big enough,

everything's can.

Before the Banksy movie, before

Instagram, before people were

posing in front of graffiti is

like a colorful backdrop for

their photos, like it

there was like an outlaw element

to it. And whereas

like some like, you know, like

motorcycle club culture has

kept that element, graffiti has

kind of been

changed in a way where it's

Chris Brown can pick up a can

and suddenly he's like a street

artist and it's like, you know,

no knock on him or anyone who

wants to paint, like, go for

it. But so, like, there was

graffiti, there was street art,

there was a part of our society

back then. But I think the

social media culture has shot

it to the forefront.

And it's kind of cool

that there hasn't been a reality

show that I know of about it yet

Everything else has been done.

But so far,

Charlie Hunnam sure be a tagger

and some Sons of Anarchy

spinoff soon enough.

Makes me happy that

some of these things will exist

like long after I'm gone.

[Dual] For the longest time, I

was convinced that to be a

successful artist

and to make it, you

have to have this masters,

right you got to have this

document.

[Dual] So coming out

of school with my bachelors

constantly, already making

work, having shows, solo shows

moving work,

I decide that I'm going to

apply for the

master's program there.

I go through the whole process.

You know, it's it's basically

all just fill out this whole

form, show them

your work, your artist bio,

your CV

of everything you've been in.

And I fill it all out, turn

it all in feeling

feeling pretty good and

confident that I can get into

the program, open up

my email one day

and I've got this letter of

rejection.

Oof. It

I'll be honest,

it felt like

it felt like a girlfriend

dumping you.

I think, for a few days,

possibly even a week, I was

just really bummed out about it

and I was like, what am I going

to do now? How am I going to be

this successful

practicing artist if

I don't have the master’s?

OK, I didn't make it into your

program. I'm about to just

bust my ass, grind

hard, grind harder than what

I've been doing and

make sure that my name is out

there everywhere and people are

seeing it.

[Dual] For me now the commercial

work I've definitely pushed,

I really, really pushed that I

want to be able to have as much

creative control

in the design process

as as possible.

I want my work, whether it's

canvas work or mural work,

to still have

impact and inspire

years and years down the line.

I can only hope that

there'll be artists that

started doing

whatever it is they do because

they saw my work just like

the same for me.

I saw other artists that I

saw doing stuff and I was like,

I want to do that.

I want to step it up.

I want to do take my art and

make it do this.

Everything I've learned here is

everything I've accumulated

throughout my journey

in a canvas or

in its composition, so to say,

take it, do whatever you want

with it, run with it, take

this little bit, change this

bit, you know.

[Dual] My work now,

if I had to describe it,

is oversaturated,

hard edged

juxtaposition

abstraction.

I just love painting, I just

love doing it like,

oh man, I got to keep I really

want to keep doing this and I

just want to keep pushing it

I don't care if I'm rich off of

it, that's not my point for

doing it. I mean, a lot of

times it's awesome to just talk

to people and they're like, but

you get to do what you love

to do and you get paid for it.

And I'm like that to me is the

most important part.

[Meres] You know, when I started

doing graffiti,

there was no legal outlet

to do street tagging, which

I enjoyed,

it came with headaches

from getting arrested for it.

And in the 80s,

like the the neighborhood

gang graffiti

activity was was high.

You know, when I started doing

graffiti,

it wasn't something

When you went to family

gatherings like, hey, I'm

getting into graffiti, your

family would be like, OK, cool,

get a good art job and

do your hobby stuff on the side.

And now it's come to a point

where graffiti is is

looked at as a profession

and people actually

get involved with the idea

that they can make a profession

out of either graffiti street

art. So it definitely has

changed and evolved.

Oh, my God.

Im done.

I wanted a place where everyone

could paint, a legal outlet for

graffiti piecing

from the best to the worst,

five points was the name I

chose at the time because

it wasn't a name that

put us under a label or

bracket.

I had no idea to where

it would go.

[Meres] Five points of New York

coming to one point to paint.

Five elements of hip hop,

all in one spot.

And by keeping

this name, we

wound up later on branching

out. And I started to

incorporate emceeing,

deejaying, beatboxing and

graffiti all

into one location

and brought everything as

a kid growing up in hip hop

that I would go to different

venues to see all

to one spot.

I mean, I was a little kid in a

candy store.

It was a miracle.

And everybody

that took the seven train and

is millions and millions of

of train goers

slowly started to get hooked

and enticed

to get off the train.

And they got to see that

graffiti, the

unknown art, the

art that, you know, gets

perceived as bad and

illegal. And it wasn't

such a bad thing and that the

artists that did it were

everyday people like you and me

and became,

you know, one of the epicenters

for for hip hop culture

in New York.

And it was free.

And for the people and by the

people.

[Sloke] Graffiti gave me

a foundation to

build off of into

a career in art.

I started out drawing

as a kid, it

progressed to graffiti

and then from graffiti, it

progressed to

abstract art on canvas,

doing more design like

expensive handbags,

shoes,

textile,

all of that. And I just started

branching off.

I paint everything man,

whatever paint can adhere to

I paint.

You know, it's I proved to

myself that I can paint my name

for decades in a variety of

styles and as much as I I

still love doing that.

I just don't limit myself to

one style of art.

I mean, all of the principles

of art and design apply to

graffiti art, you know, it's

universal.

It's just what you want to do

with it.

In 2010 during South

by Southwest.

We got slammed with a lot of

commission work.

And at the end of

South by.

Ray, Jaber and I

figured, why not put

our resources together and

start a mural company and

that's how all city branding

was formed.

We were doing work for CNN,

Nike, Google, Facebook,

it just made sense, you know,

we've all paid our dues on the

streets.

We've been around for a long

time. And,

you know, I think what other

better way to represent the

art form than people that

practice it and come from it.

So I

felt like there was

a lot of validation with that.

But at the same time, as an

artist trying to make the

money, you got to go with the

opportunities at and these

corporations are the ones with

the big budgets.

You know, I figured in this

line of work, you got to do

what you don't want to do in

order to do what you want to

do. And that's what

a lot of these jobs allowed.

[Jaber] I worked for beer

companies, vodka companies,

Google, Facebook,

a lot of tech related stuff.

Doing art for money is

not really my thing.

It's not what I

strive to do.

I just kind of fell into it.

So

I get to dictate what I

want to do a little bit more

than other people.

I have that luxury now.

Years ago, when I did not have

that luxury.

Yeah, I would, you know,

work. If I had to

work for a company, I would do

what they want to do and go

through the chain of command

and sometimes you have to

do that to survive.

I've worked with Sloke a bunch.

He was the boss.

You know, if he's the boss is

easy to deal with.

But if you have to deal with

somebody that hired you to do

a mural and they

don't know anything about mural

making or design or

color concepts, it's

kind of annoying.

I dislike working like anyone

else.

[Dual] There used to be the term

sellout,

you didn't want to sell out to

this bigger company or to this

commercial company, now

if you don't sell out, you're

not going to survive in this

world like there's

that term is obsolete now.

It's amazing that there is that

opportunity to bridge

the gap from being

an illegal graffiti artist

to doing commercial work for

big companies like

I think that I know

I myself am grateful for that

opportunity. And I'm sure other

artists around the world are

probably feeling the same, you

know, and none of that would

have happened if it wasn't from

them originally

painting trains

doing whatever illegal graffiti

they were doing when they first

started.

So it definitely brings this

value.

[John] Came across Dual, was

introduced to Dual.

He's a Houston

staple. He's an integral

part to the Houston street

scene, graffiti scene,

super talented artist.

I mean, obviously a huge fan of

his work. He's helping,

conveying and developing

our concept, you know,

through his work.

As far as graffiti and street

art goes, it is essential

to metropolitan culture,

right? No one wants to be in

like same

color, concrete jungle just

glass, steel,

concrete everywhere.

There's there's no life.

And it's nice to go places

and cities, Tokyo, Paris.

Right. New York, Chicago.

And see this blend of

street art.

Right. Graffiti tags,

whatever you want to call it,

you know, mixed with, you know,

commissions.

Kind of like what Dual does,

right. Like on this building.

I think it's essential

to life and culture

and the city.

[Dual] He came at me
with what he wanted

He told me, you know, he's

a fan of, Blade Runner,

Tron.

I was like, say no more,

man. I'm a huge fan.

Let me take it through my

filter and spit

it out. And then we both are

happy with the final product.

[John] You know, Dual has really

helped bring that element to

our business, and I think that,

you know, it's been an honor,

you know, especially this point

and moving forward, it's going

to continue to be an honor to

work with Dual.

[Dual] So to me, the reason

one of the main reasons I think

that these businesses now want

murals is

because it's current.

It's it's important.

Like I said, the renaissance of

this movement of murals

popping up on buildings

overnight,

large scale

has become such an important

thing. And it's such a trending

thing in society,

especially with social media.

Everyone wants to go take a

photo in front of a mural

and post it up on their

Instagram, and then they're

going to tag the location,

the artist, what

they're wearing, the ice cream

they're eating.

So it creates all this

connection and then and it just

keeps getting spread over and

over and over.

[John] So there's a super,

super cool element to working

with an anonymous artist.

Right. And people

get really excited, I think,

just to see Dual

on the street, people walking

up and they're like, oh, man,

you know, same thing when he

paints downtown.

One of them, you don't have

permission and you're

doing it without

anyone knowing where

here, you're getting funded and

given all the resources and

all the supplies

to be able to pull off this

feat. So it's

it's pushed the form in that

way where commercial

companies know they first of

all, they got the funding, they

got the money they got.

So they're just putting all

that into this and they're able

to create great works

of art on the building

that you would probably never,

ever really see happening

otherwise.

[Sloke] To be honest with you,

man, I got burnt out, I

really got burnt out on

commercial work.

All money is not good money.

And I started to feel

like I was basically

getting pimped out by

corporations.

I wasn't sure the money

was good. It was hard work.

There is no soul on it,

you know.

And I felt like I started to

lose why I got into this in the

first place.

And it cease to be fun,

and I really just stepped back

from it around that time.

Street art here was exploding

and every week there

was some new hotshot artists

that came out of nowhere

doing cute

and friendly murals around

town. And and honestly, man,

I just really the whole thing

turned me off.

You know, like I said, I come

from a different generation.

It's almost like this art form

became a novelty.

In this city, and I don't want

anything to do with it man.

I paint for me, and if the

public can enjoy my art, that's

that's the cherry on top.

But I'm paying for the public

either.

Some say, well, you paint

outside, isn't it public art?

Sure, I guess.

But isn't a billboard.

I mean, the same thing, depends

how you look at it.

It's crazy because one one

line could change everything.

It's a tough call, you know.

How do you juggle would you

love to do

with making a living, you

know?

And I'll revisit

it tomorrow

if I really feel, but right now

I'm feeling happy with it

because the bulk of the colors

is really

on the bottom right.

And that was the whole point.

That's why I,

that's why I have the

explosions going this way.

I always tend to go to the

right corner, but

that's one example of the

abstract styles that I do.

But I just I

really like these because,

they're therapeutic for me,

you know?

[Meres] Five points, you know,

which started early 2000s, grew

towards around 2010.

What started to happen in

in that area, Long Island City,

Queens, New York,

right over the bridge to

Manhattan, you could be in

Manhattan in like ten minutes.

Everything that's proximity

to Manhattan radiating outward

is the first things that

obviously get gentrified

because the city's Manhattan

is the heartbeat of of New York

that opened up for real estate

developers to

want to buy up all the

these factories and

eventually tear down the

buildings and build these

high rise towers

that exist now.

2010 or a little later,

the idea that 5 Pointz

might become extinct.

So aside from me

running 5 Pointz and

aside from me obviously

having a love of that

and I'm wanting

that to stay, I also living

in a neighborhood, don't want

to see a tower go up

two blocks from my house, which

puts a shadow on half of the

neighborhood.

A lawyer approached us at the

time in the loading dock

and knew of a law

called VARA,

Visual Artist Rights Act,

and she said

it's a way we could,

you know, give

more time to

try to save this

gem.

Also, if the law applied,

would ensure that we could save

and video and photo document

all the artwork on this

masterpiece properly

under law so that we could

preserve it for

the rest of eternity.

[Marie] One of the most famous

art destruction story of the

20th century is a destruction

of Diego Rivera's commissioned

mural at the base of

Rockefeller Center.

When he was retained

and contracted to do this

mural, he

gave a fairly rough sketch

and because of the political

time and his strong

beliefs, he decided

to include a portrait

of Lenin,

which did not meet the

expectation of the

Rockefeller's.

And ultimately the mural got

destroyed.

Fast forward to 1990,

a similar situation occurred

in San Francisco

with a tribute mural,

and it kind of

burst the law and

the need for the law, VARA

Visual Artist Rights Act

to make it simple

in United States the base,

of rights are

property rights, and the

concept of moral rights

does not really exist.

So VARA was very necessary

and was pushed by Senator

Kennedy and ultimately passed

and created as a new law.

Are we denying First Amendment

rights for individuals who want

to go over and destroy someone

else's art?

Visual Artist Rights Act,

protect artists, intellectual

property? And what does that

mean? It means that

an artist is entitled

to the rights and the

protection of their artwork.

As long as it's legal,

as long as it's signed, as

long as the author obviously is

alive, and as

long as it retains stature.

That obscure law

that was never used

at a trial with a jury

that never went to court,

per say, was for

the first time used in the

5 Pointz case.

[Meres] You know, the law was

presented, it was a

conversation between us,

the landlord and the judge,

so he tried to

have us work together to like,

hey, let's find a medium ground

and the judge.

As much as, he said to us, as

much as I appreciate the art,

it is this gentleman's

property. And I and I can't

find enough evidence to tell

him that you

can't develop your property

and build your towers.

That being said,

the law is still a law and you

have to give 90 days of time.

We could have saved

enough of that building

to fill a full museum

at another location

honoring five points.

[Marie] So twenty one artists

claim their VARA

rights and

first try to use VARA

to protect their art.

The owner of the property

has to give the 90 days

and at their own expenses

Artists have the time

to again document, remove.

[Meres] The judge ruled in his

favor and

expressed to him, the law

still is the law that you have

to give the 90 days notice

proceeded to go back into

chambers to craft

the verdict.

And you got to understand, a

judge writing a verdict

is no different than the artist

with a can creating a mural.

That's the time where he goes

back into his chambers and he

spends a lot of quality

time to really

put these words on

paper that will echo

through eternity in

legal cases to

follow.

I got a phone call, 730,

which woke me up.

I arrived at five points

to see

the devastation and

And I was disgusted.

It was it was it was gone.

[Marie] In the case of 5 Pointz

from injunction, where

the attempt was to preserve the

artwork and get the necessary

time by the end

of the injunction, the

landlord, the owner of the

building, went ahead and

painted everything white.

So he destroyed hundreds

of art and hundreds of

pieces.

[Meres] Before the judge was

able to craft and write his

verdict and release the

full verdict, the landlord

proceeded to hire

his workers to come and

overnight whitewashed

the entire industrial

complex.

All the murals around the

entire building,

the buff paint was watered down

so he could stretch the paint

and you could see the

murals coming through the

paint.

In the morning, by the time

I had gotten the phone call and

arrived, 5 Pointz

was pretty much annihilated

they had brought in, I'd say

probably about 40 workers to

to do this overnight without

permits under the

cover of darkness.

No different than a vandal,

what they accused us of being.

And pretty much.

pissed on the judge's verdict,

as well as all the art that

had been given him for

free.

Over the years, that

5 Pointz stood and

I felt, I felt horrible.

I felt like, you know.

I, you know, I was

just really let down and

I didn't believe he wouldn't

give us the 90 days, it

didn't make sense to me.

And that changed

everything. It became a

full blown criminal act

now and now

because of that, we had to

go to court.

[Sloke] So we're here at Castle

Castle Hill.

This is the old

we used to call the foundation.

It was basically a failed

property development

in the early 80s and

sat abandoned for decades.

There's a castle, there's an

actual castle here that used to

be the Texas Military Academy

back in the eighteen hundreds.

So back in the 90s, you know.

This place was fenced off and

my crew and I used to sneak in

here and paint on the walls,

you know, back then if you got

caught, you were definitely

going to jail.

What made me

transition

was getting arrested for the

third time for graffiti.

And going to jail for it.

Because when I was in jail for

graffiti, all I did was draw

envelopes for commissary.

OK.

And on the envelopes,

I did graffiti.

So I was really going to do

graffiti on the street.

I was going to be drawing

graffiti in jail.

You see what I'm saying?

So I had to find a way

to continue painting without

the consequences

When I got out of jail for the

third time for graffiti.

I started to make that

transition I call it

going above ground.

And I started to go more legit,

I remember my first mural's

I was knocking on business

doors going, Hey man, can I

paint your wall, here's my

portfolio.

I remember riding my bike.

With my backpack with my

portfolio, because back then we

had four by six photos.

And saying, hey, man, can I

paint a mural and sometimes

I did it for free, sometimes

I did it for supplies.

And I didn't set out to be

like, I'm going to be a

professional artist.

I just kept painting.

I mean, that's the reality.

I kept painting.

I never gave up.

I had some dark times in my

life and but graffiti

was always there.

And whenever I would get back

up after being knocked down,

I would immediately grab the

can because graffiti was my

release.

I mean, graffiti was what kept

me sane.

You know, whether it was

illegal or not,

just the act of creating,

you know.

Ya I was one of the first

artists to paint here in

2009, 2010.

Andi Scull from Hope,

approached me in 2010 about

painting here, you know, I was

a little reluctant

just because of the history

of the place.

For a while, you know, the

first year and a half,

it was it was definitely a

really nice place to peice.

It just turned into like.

An art hub for Austin

for a while, but

But word got out

and it became a tourist

attraction, it just

got really popular, you know,

and you had people from all

over coming and painting

It was almost like the prettier

the art

the quicker got written on.

Tourists came and it really

got kind of blown out of

proportions you know,

I mean, once TripAdvisor put

it on its top 10 list, you

know, it was out

of control.

Whatever you painted really

didn't last long.

You know, scribbled on by

tourists was almost like an

amusement park.

But everybody had a spray can.

[Laughs]

Yeah, kind of a shit

show, to be honest with you.

It definitely changed the art

scene here.

In good and bad ways, depending

how you want to look at it,

but, you know, it was

a cool place to paint while it

lasted.

You know, I think for the

neighbors around here, they

were glad to see you go, you

know, I mean, they had up to a

thousand people a day here it

was pretty wild.

And they shut down

about two years ago,

the property got sold and it's

about to be developed, but

snuck through the gate tonight

and rocked a little silver

piece. If you get caught

I heard the fines pretty high,

but it's a spot

I used to always paint.

I haven't really set foot on

here since it's been closed.

It's a lot of paint on these

walls.

[Jaber] So there's definitely

repercussions after I

spent that month in

jail, my life changed

drastically and,

you know, ended up working

out for me and I got lucky.

But at the time, you couldn't

tell me that.

At the time, I thought my world

was ending.

I've been a pretty prolific

graffiti writer,

you know, my whole career,

and in

the smaller cities, they

tend to look a little closer

into graffiti cases

At one point

they put my face

up on a wanted poster.

So I was walking around this

neighborhood, taking down these

wanted posters.

Somebody turned me in for the

reward.

I had a little radio show and

they arrested me at

the radio station for suspicion

of graffiti.

They had no charge on me.

They had no

video footage of me doing any

graffiti.

But they arrested me

and took me downtown.

They had a file on

me a thick file.

And they they're like, we're

going to talk about this file.

And I was like, no, I don't

have to talk about that file.

You can just house me or let

me go.

Instead of housing me,

they put you in a jumpsuit,

they give you a toothbrush.

You're going to be there for a

minute or

they book you and then they let

you go. They booked me and

let me go. But if they book

you, they're going to give you

a charge.

These motherfuckers made

up a charge, so

they made up a date and made a

charge.

So I'd have to come back to

court and just be in

the system, you know,

So I got the fuck out of that

state.

[Jaber] Graffiti writers, that's

why we have to keep a low

profile.

That's why we've got to be

reclusive. That's why

I think for me personally,

I liked it back in the 90s

when it was very secretive and

a small little circle, like

everybody looked at each other

and nodded like Fight Club

versus now where it's like,

what you write. Oh, that's

great. Let's paint this thing

red. You know, everything's

like social media

tech friendly. And, you know,

if you don't respond or you

don't act accordingly,

then you're a dick.

Well, back in the day,

everybody was a dick, you

know what I mean?

If you went into a yard, if you

went into a yard right now.

Back in the 90’s

and someone came out and said,

what do you write?

You say, fuck you.

You know what I mean? Punch em,

take their paint.

You know what I mean? That's

just it was a different

kind of vibe.

[News reporter] Federal appeals

court upheld a 6.7 million

dollar settlement after their

work at the famed 5 Pointz

art mecca in Long Island City

was destroyed in 2013

by a developer, all to make

room for luxury condos.

[Meres] Now, he broke the law

fully and the judge was like,

OK, you broke the law.

And he was found guilty of

violating VARA.

And the judge

at the time awarded the

maximum penalty.

It's been a hell of a ride.

It's been a horrible ride.

I love the positive

aspects of 5 Pointz.

I met artists from

all over the world that

I still share friendships with

and I don't regret

it. And I would do it all over

again just based on

the once in a lifetime

adventure it was.

And that's where we stand.

5 Pointz as a building

is gone, 5 Pointz,

the non for profit which I

created still

exists.

So 5 Pointz was a community,

5 Pointz was artists

from all over the world, all

different walks of

life coming to one

place, experiencing each

other's techniques,

experiencing each other's

cultures.

When when the

the whitewash occurred,

it was it was a slap in the

face, it was it was

it was hard for people to

understand the law

that was presented VARA

giving 90 days

for people to do a last

visit for, you know, forget

about the preservation site for

a fan of the

you know, 12 plus years that

art existed on a building to be

able to come and say

goodbye, get the last photo

in front of a mural.

I mean, a lot of people felt

robbed, the

things that could have been

saved would have ensued,

ensured that, you know,

your children's children could

have went to a museum and

experience 5 Pointz,

you know, and if the means is

there to to preserve it

and it's of no consequence

to the owner to allow the

artwork to be preserved.

Considering that the artwork

meant so much to New Yorkers,

it was almost

disgusting and a slap in the

face that that

respect wasn't given.

And I think the

a big part of this case

is that, you know,

because you may not

view it the way

the community had viewed it in

this case, and because you may

not view it as

art, that is worth

you having to abide

by a rule or give it respect

in terms of

coming up with a compromise

doesn't mean that you cannot

be punished for violating

those rights.

And it was in his decision to

act as my father and punish

me, you know,

and he broke the law in doing

so. And that's what led to

an excruciating seven,

eight year trial and a

lot of pain.

[Meres] It's a huge victory for

the artist. I mean, you know,

the creation of art,

the piece is a relationship.

We have the thought process

in our head of what we want to

put out,

the owner of the property

has the wall space that we

need.

The fans that come to

this property are potentially

customers.

We worked with CitizenM Brand

Hotel, who had followed

the case and are huge

supporters of art and

felt that what

was done to us was unjust

and had a meeting with us and

offered us that there

what would become a CitizenM

Bowery location.

For a collaboration,

that collaboration grew

not only from an outside

wall, which I created for

that hotel, and utilize

the stained glass style

that I birthed after

the destruction of 5 Pointz

in coming out of depression,

we also brought back some of

the valuable players

of five points to

tell the story of the Bowery,

which is

where the hotel is

over the years, and to

you know, give people a little

artistic taste of history

as well as a piece of

5 Pointz.

And it was a beautiful

collaboration.

{Meres] We created MoSA, Museum

of Street Art, which is a 21

floor walk down museum.

It took a lot of planning

because we insisted

in order to do it.

We wanted to do it free for

the public to enjoy.

No different than 5 Pointz

was for the people

by the people.

[Sloke] I think times are slowly

changing where people realize

these are valid art forms and

it is nice and it does take

work and does take skill.

[Sloke] What I’d like for you

do is to fill in all this.

Don’t worry about it.

Just try to stay in the line.

That section right here.

Because if you think about it,

how do things survive in life

with the younger generation,

they're going to be the ones

carrying it, but

it's up to the veterans

or the all the elders to pass

that torch on.

So I love seeing what's going

on today.

I try not to look at the

negative. I mean, there was a

time where I watched

this whole city changed

practically overnight when it

came to these art forms

and I watched money get

involved and I watched it

destroy friendships

and it became it went from

community to business.

And it was

it was hard to see.

And I saw it in a lot of other

cities, too.

But at the end of the day,

people got to eat,

[Sloke] this is what happens

[Sloke] this is what happens

long time.

This is from Mike from Torchy's.

Could you give us a quote to

properly graffiti or first

Torchy's it keeps getting

tagged, then we clean it,

paint it and it gets tagged

again?

Exactly.

[Sloke Laughs]
-Exactly.

[Sloke Laughs]
-Exactly.

That’s the way to keep it clean.

Put one of your pieces up on it.

[Dual] I spent years

on the streets putting

this moniker and his name out

there for people to start

to see and to like recognize,

I then wanted to

push my craft and kind

of take it to another level.

So I started to create

paintings and I wanted to push

it to this like more like

finer realm of art.

And even if

it doesn't ever really bring

huge success

and huge monetary

value, I still just want to be

able to wake up every day and

survive and make

art and

basically leave a

mark of myself

out there. You know,

whether it's with murals,

graffiti or these

paintings, these pieces will

eventually outlast me.

And someone will

be able to see these years

and years down the line.

[Meres] A kid 50 years from now

100 years from now

go to a museum and

actually see your paint stroke

and your technique.

I just embrace every

aspect and I push

it till my heart and

my brain tell me it's time for

change.

And then I go with the

flow. I pretty much go

with the direction of the wind.

And wherever it takes me.

[Never] I would want to tell

future generations, and even

current generations of writers

and artists like paint we

love, like whether it be just

doing letters, doing like a

moniker doing

you know character or doing

murals. Like if you do what you

love, you're actually gonna

push yourself harder and make

like I want to fine tune and

keep getting better and better

at it.

Do it because it's like why you

want to wake up in the morning

and get out of bed, like same

reason some folks spend all day

at the gym or spend all day at

the beach, like if I was a

surfer, I'd surf every day

until I got sick of and do

something else. Like I approach

paint in the same way.

And it keeps me inspired and

it's still fun for me.

And when it stops being fun,

I'll find something different

to do.

[Sloke] If I can do it, you can

do it. I'm not unique.

But there's so much more

than that post and those

comments in those likes,

you can't fake skill and you

can't fake experience, there's

no shortcuts to that.

I'm still learning and I will

hope to continue learning till

the day I die.

There's no plateaus man.

I know youngsters that I look

at them and I go, wow, man.

Like, stick with it

because you're good.

You know, a

lot of the what

took me five to seven years

to learn can now be learned in

two. And that's the way it

should be. Right.

Things should advance.

You know, the techniques

I mean I learned on Krylon

and Rust-O-Leum man, high

pressure stock caps.

You can't you learn to not

drip. You had to paint quick.

Nowadays the industry has

changed. You got low pressure,

high pressure. You got 20,

30, 40 caps to choose from.

That's all good stuff.

But you still have to put in

the work. You still have to

practice.

You know, you can't

substitute that.

There's no there's no shortcut

for the ten thousand plus hours

you need to put in.

[Jaber] There's nothing better

than creating

something and seeing somebody

see it and that and seeing

them smile, there's nothing

better than that.

The effect on another person

is very internally

rewarding,

but I don't know what I'm going

to leave behind.

I think about that

very often.

And I guess

the answer to that is what

I would prefer to leave behind

something that somebody could

laugh at or

somebody would be like, Oh, I

remember that fool, Jaber,

he crazy motherfucker.

Oh, he died shit. [Laughs]

I'm trying to influence people

just to do,

you know, just

get up off the couch and go

do it.

That's what I'm trying to

influence people to do.

And that's why I just do it all

the time.

[Meres] I've influenced many

I've had many influence me,

and I think it's important

to kind of leave

that little piece of DNA out

there in the universe so that

the artists to be can experience

not only your struggles, but

your your good times,

grow the story and

add their blueprint to it.

And I think that's priceless.

So I think we are the

storytellers. We are

the storytellers of the future.