All language subtitles for SC Senate Hearing - USC Professor Dr. Phillip Buckhaults.en

so a little bit

so a little bit
of what am I doing here for those of you

of what am I doing here for those of you

of what am I doing here for those of you
don't don't know me um my name is Philip

don't don't know me um my name is Philip

don't don't know me um my name is Philip
baltz I'm a uh I have a PhD in

baltz I'm a uh I have a PhD in

baltz I'm a uh I have a PhD in
Biochemistry and molecular biology uh

Biochemistry and molecular biology uh

Biochemistry and molecular biology uh
I'm a I'm a cancer Gene jock uh

I'm a I'm a cancer Gene jock uh

I'm a I'm a cancer Gene jock uh
basically I do cancer genomics research

basically I do cancer genomics research

basically I do cancer genomics research
at the University of South Carolina and

at the University of South Carolina and

at the University of South Carolina and
what that means is that I'm kind of an

what that means is that I'm kind of an

what that means is that I'm kind of an
expert on all the ways that the human

expert on all the ways that the human

expert on all the ways that the human
genome can get fussed with during your

genome can get fussed with during your

genome can get fussed with during your
lifetime and which of those things cause

lifetime and which of those things cause

lifetime and which of those things cause
cancer and which one don't okay um so

cancer and which one don't okay um so

cancer and which one don't okay um so
technically that means that I'm very

technically that means that I'm very

technically that means that I'm very
very skilled in in the art of DNA

very skilled in in the art of DNA

very skilled in in the art of DNA
sequencing okay I can figure out the

sequencing okay I can figure out the

sequencing okay I can figure out the
sequence of things that I didn't know

sequence of things that I didn't know

sequence of things that I didn't know
what I was looking for um and I'm also

what I was looking for um and I'm also

what I was looking for um and I'm also
pretty good when I say I I mean the

pretty good when I say I I mean the

pretty good when I say I I mean the
people in my laboratory that you're not

people in my laboratory that you're not

people in my laboratory that you're not
going to hear their names but there's a

going to hear their names but there's a

going to hear their names but there's a
group of people that do this excellent

group of people that do this excellent

group of people that do this excellent
work um we're really good at at um

work um we're really good at at um

work um we're really good at at um
detecting foreign pieces of DNA in

detecting foreign pieces of DNA in

detecting foreign pieces of DNA in
places where they're not supposed to be

places where they're not supposed to be

places where they're not supposed to be
even if they're real low levels and we

even if they're real low levels and we

even if they're real low levels and we
used those skills during the pandemic um

used those skills during the pandemic um

used those skills during the pandemic um
to we invented the coid test that many

to we invented the coid test that many

to we invented the coid test that many
of you did a spit test okay that came

of you did a spit test okay that came

of you did a spit test okay that came
out of my lab because we were really

out of my lab because we were really

out of my lab because we were really
good at that kind of stuff and so I've

good at that kind of stuff and so I've

good at that kind of stuff and so I've
earned a fair amount of respect um in

earned a fair amount of respect um in

earned a fair amount of respect um in
the state of South Carolina and in this

the state of South Carolina and in this

the state of South Carolina and in this
body because we did a ton of coid

body because we did a ton of coid

body because we did a ton of coid
testing in the middle of the night when

testing in the middle of the night when

testing in the middle of the night when
people were afraid and we told them no

people were afraid and we told them no

people were afraid and we told them no
you don't have coid in your home or yes

you don't have coid in your home or yes

you don't have coid in your home or yes
you do so my qualif ation to comment on

you do so my qualif ation to comment on

you do so my qualif ation to comment on
this are both Technical and kind of

this are both Technical and kind of

this are both Technical and kind of
relational in the state of South

relational in the state of South

relational in the state of South
Carolina

um I'll cut to a very narrow theme here

um I'll cut to a very narrow theme here
but it does touch on lots of these

but it does touch on lots of these

but it does touch on lots of these
regulatory issues and I'll leave it to

regulatory issues and I'll leave it to

regulatory issues and I'll leave it to
you to expand on those if you want to

you to expand on those if you want to

you to expand on those if you want to
I'll try to stay in this Narrow Lane um

I'll try to stay in this Narrow Lane um

I'll try to stay in this Narrow Lane um
of some problems in the fizer vaccine um

of some problems in the fizer vaccine um

of some problems in the fizer vaccine um
as a case study for place in which

as a case study for place in which

as a case study for place in which
regulatory oversight could be improved

regulatory oversight could be improved

regulatory oversight could be improved
all right

all right

all right
so first of all let me say that my

so first of all let me say that my

so first of all let me say that my
interpretation of the literature is that

interpretation of the literature is that

interpretation of the literature is that
the fizer vaccine did a pretty good job

the fizer vaccine did a pretty good job

the fizer vaccine did a pretty good job
of keeping people from dying but it did

of keeping people from dying but it did

of keeping people from dying but it did
a terrible job of stopping the pandemic

a terrible job of stopping the pandemic

a terrible job of stopping the pandemic
the early Publications showed that um it

the early Publications showed that um it

the early Publications showed that um it
stopped infection but that only lasted

stopped infection but that only lasted

stopped infection but that only lasted
for like a month Dr B could you pull the

for like a month Dr B could you pull the

for like a month Dr B could you pull the
mic a little closer to you um staff's

mic a little closer to you um staff's

mic a little closer to you um staff's
telling me they having trouble getting

telling me they having trouble getting

telling me they having trouble getting
you on the recording okay okay thank you

you on the recording okay okay thank you

you on the recording okay okay thank you
um in in my professional evaluation of

um in in my professional evaluation of

um in in my professional evaluation of
the literature the fiser vaccine did a

the literature the fiser vaccine did a

the literature the fiser vaccine did a
pretty good job of keeping people out of

pretty good job of keeping people out of

pretty good job of keeping people out of
the cemetery but it sucked at stopping

the cemetery but it sucked at stopping

the cemetery but it sucked at stopping
the pandemic and um it was the best of

the pandemic and um it was the best of

the pandemic and um it was the best of
sucky options that we had and I still

sucky options that we had and I still

sucky options that we had and I still
believe that um it was

believe that um it was

believe that um it was
deployed mostly in good faith but there

deployed mostly in good faith but there

deployed mostly in good faith but there
were a lot of shortcuts taken because

were a lot of shortcuts taken because

were a lot of shortcuts taken because
the house was on fire and uh we could do

the house was on fire and uh we could do

the house was on fire and uh we could do
a better job next time time from the

a better job next time time from the

a better job next time time from the
lessons that we're going to learn here

lessons that we're going to learn here

lessons that we're going to learn here
that's my own personal view of this uh

that's my own personal view of this uh

that's my own personal view of this uh
but I'm also my philosophical bent here

but I'm also my philosophical bent here

but I'm also my philosophical bent here
is I'm sure many of you have heard of a

is I'm sure many of you have heard of a

is I'm sure many of you have heard of a
aam's Razer right choose the simplest of

aam's Razer right choose the simplest of

aam's Razer right choose the simplest of
explanations well there's another one

explanations well there's another one

explanations well there's another one
called hanlon's Razer which is never

called hanlon's Razer which is never

called hanlon's Razer which is never
attribute malice to that which can be

attribute malice to that which can be

attribute malice to that which can be
better explained by incompetence and so

better explained by incompetence and so

better explained by incompetence and so
I'm trying to be gracious here in many

I'm trying to be gracious here in many

I'm trying to be gracious here in many
in circumstances there could be malice

in circumstances there could be malice

in circumstances there could be malice
underneath but I'm trying to see just

underneath but I'm trying to see just

underneath but I'm trying to see just
incompetence to be gracious so the fizer

incompetence to be gracious so the fizer

incompetence to be gracious so the fizer
uh vaccine is contaminated with plasma

uh vaccine is contaminated with plasma

uh vaccine is contaminated with plasma
DNA it's not just mRNA it's got bits of

DNA it's not just mRNA it's got bits of

DNA it's not just mRNA it's got bits of
DNA in it this DNA is the DNA Vector

DNA in it this DNA is the DNA Vector

DNA in it this DNA is the DNA Vector
that was used um as the template for the

that was used um as the template for the

that was used um as the template for the
invitro transcription reaction when they

invitro transcription reaction when they

invitro transcription reaction when they
made the

made the

made the
MRNA um I know this is true because I

MRNA um I know this is true because I

MRNA um I know this is true because I
sequenced it in my own lab the vials of

sequenced it in my own lab the vials of

sequenced it in my own lab the vials of
fiser vaccine that were given out here

fiser vaccine that were given out here

fiser vaccine that were given out here
in Colombia uh one of my colleagues was

in Colombia uh one of my colleagues was

in Colombia uh one of my colleagues was
in charge of that vaccination program in

in charge of that vaccination program in

in charge of that vaccination program in
the College of Pharmacy and for reasons

the College of Pharmacy and for reasons

the College of Pharmacy and for reasons
that I still don't understand he kept

that I still don't understand he kept

that I still don't understand he kept
every single vial um so he had a whole

every single vial um so he had a whole

every single vial um so he had a whole
freezer full of the empty vials well the

freezer full of the empty vials well the

freezer full of the empty vials well the
empty vials have a little tiny bit in

empty vials have a little tiny bit in

empty vials have a little tiny bit in
the bottom of them he gave them all to

the bottom of them he gave them all to

the bottom of them he gave them all to
me and I looked at them we had two

me and I looked at them we had two

me and I looked at them we had two
batches that were given out here in

batches that were given out here in

batches that were given out here in
Colombia and I checked these two batches

Colombia and I checked these two batches

Colombia and I checked these two batches
and I checked them by

and I checked them by

and I checked them by
sequencing and I sequenced all the DNA

sequencing and I sequenced all the DNA

sequencing and I sequenced all the DNA
that was in the vaccine and I can see

that was in the vaccine and I can see

that was in the vaccine and I can see
what's in there and it's surprising that

what's in there and it's surprising that

what's in there and it's surprising that
there's any DNA in there and you can

there's any DNA in there and you can

there's any DNA in there and you can
kind of work out what it is and how it

kind of work out what it is and how it

kind of work out what it is and how it
got there and I'm kind of alarmed about

got there and I'm kind of alarmed about

got there and I'm kind of alarmed about
the possible consequences of this both

the possible consequences of this both

the possible consequences of this both
in terms of human health and biology but

in terms of human health and biology but

in terms of human health and biology but
you should be alarmed about the

you should be alarmed about the

you should be alarmed about the
regulatory process that allowed it to

regulatory process that allowed it to

regulatory process that allowed it to
get there so this DNA in my

get there so this DNA in my

get there so this DNA in my
view it could be causing some of the

view it could be causing some of the

view it could be causing some of the
rare but serious side effects like death

rare but serious side effects like death

rare but serious side effects like death
from Cardiac Arrest there's a lot of

from Cardiac Arrest there's a lot of

from Cardiac Arrest there's a lot of
cases now um of people having suspicious

cases now um of people having suspicious

cases now um of people having suspicious
death after vaccine it's hard to prove

death after vaccine it's hard to prove

death after vaccine it's hard to prove
what caused it it's just you know

what caused it it's just you know

what caused it it's just you know
temporally Associated um and this DNA is

temporally Associated um and this DNA is

temporally Associated um and this DNA is
a plausible mechanism okay uh this DNA

a plausible mechanism okay uh this DNA

a plausible mechanism okay uh this DNA
uh can and likely will integrate into

uh can and likely will integrate into

uh can and likely will integrate into
the genomic DNA of cells that got

the genomic DNA of cells that got

the genomic DNA of cells that got
transfected with the vaccine mix this is

transfected with the vaccine mix this is

transfected with the vaccine mix this is
just the way it works we do this in the

just the way it works we do this in the

just the way it works we do this in the
lab all the time we take pieces of DNA

lab all the time we take pieces of DNA

lab all the time we take pieces of DNA
we mix them up with a A lipid complex

we mix them up with a A lipid complex

we mix them up with a A lipid complex
like the fizer uh vaccine is in we pour

like the fizer uh vaccine is in we pour

like the fizer uh vaccine is in we pour
it onto cells and and a lot of it gets

it onto cells and and a lot of it gets

it onto cells and and a lot of it gets
into the cells and a lot of it gets into

into the cells and a lot of it gets into

into the cells and a lot of it gets into
the DNA of those cells and it becomes a

the DNA of those cells and it becomes a

the DNA of those cells and it becomes a
permanent fixture of the cell it's not

permanent fixture of the cell it's not

permanent fixture of the cell it's not
just a temporary um a temporary thing it

just a temporary um a temporary thing it

just a temporary um a temporary thing it
is in that cell and all of its progyny

is in that cell and all of its progyny

is in that cell and all of its progyny
from now on forever more

from now on forever more

from now on forever more
amen so that's why I'm kind of alarmed

amen so that's why I'm kind of alarmed

amen so that's why I'm kind of alarmed
about this DNA being in the vaccine it's

about this DNA being in the vaccine it's

about this DNA being in the vaccine it's
it's it's different from RNA because it

it's it's different from RNA because it

it's it's different from RNA because it
can be

can be

can be
permanent this is a real Hazard for

permanent this is a real Hazard for

permanent this is a real Hazard for
genome modification of Long Live sematic

genome modification of Long Live sematic

genome modification of Long Live sematic
cells like stem cells um and it could

cells like stem cells um and it could

cells like stem cells um and it could
cause theoretically this is all a

cause theoretically this is all a

cause theoretically this is all a
theoretical concern but it's pretty

theoretical concern but it's pretty

theoretical concern but it's pretty
reasonable based on solid molecular

reasonable based on solid molecular

reasonable based on solid molecular
biology that it could cause a sustained

biology that it could cause a sustained

biology that it could cause a sustained
autoimmune tact toward that tissue it's

autoimmune tact toward that tissue it's

autoimmune tact toward that tissue it's
also a very real theoretical risk of

also a very real theoretical risk of

also a very real theoretical risk of
future cancer in some people depending

future cancer in some people depending

future cancer in some people depending
on where in the genome this foreign

on where in the genome this foreign

on where in the genome this foreign
piece of DNA lands um it can interrupt a

piece of DNA lands um it can interrupt a

piece of DNA lands um it can interrupt a
tumor suppressor or activate an enogen I

tumor suppressor or activate an enogen I

tumor suppressor or activate an enogen I
think it'll be rare but I think the risk

think it'll be rare but I think the risk

think it'll be rare but I think the risk
is not zero and it may be high enough

is not zero and it may be high enough

is not zero and it may be high enough
that we are to figure out if this is

that we are to figure out if this is

that we are to figure out if this is
happening or not

happening or not

happening or not
and then again the the the autoimmunity

and then again the the the autoimmunity

and then again the the the autoimmunity
thing is not my wheelhouse I'm not an

thing is not my wheelhouse I'm not an

thing is not my wheelhouse I'm not an
immunologist but the cancer risk is

immunologist but the cancer risk is

immunologist but the cancer risk is
that's my bag I know this is a thing and

that's my bag I know this is a thing and

that's my bag I know this is a thing and
it is a

possibility okay A little nerdy science

possibility okay A little nerdy science
here the central dogma of molecular

here the central dogma of molecular

here the central dogma of molecular
biology is that DNA gets transcribed

biology is that DNA gets transcribed

biology is that DNA gets transcribed
into RNA okay and then RNA gets

into RNA okay and then RNA gets

into RNA okay and then RNA gets
translated into protein this is just how

translated into protein this is just how

translated into protein this is just how
life

life

life
runs why why does this matter well DNA

runs why why does this matter well DNA

runs why why does this matter well DNA
for the purposes of this discussion DNA

for the purposes of this discussion DNA

for the purposes of this discussion DNA
is a longlived information storage

is a longlived information storage

is a longlived information storage
device okay what you were born with

device okay what you were born with

device okay what you were born with
you're going to die with and pass on to

you're going to die with and pass on to

you're going to die with and pass on to
your kids DNA lasts for hundreds of

your kids DNA lasts for hundreds of

your kids DNA lasts for hundreds of
thousands of years um and it can last

thousands of years um and it can last

thousands of years um and it can last
for Generations if you and get pass it

for Generations if you and get pass it

for Generations if you and get pass it
on to your kids right so alterations to

on to your kids right so alterations to

on to your kids right so alterations to
the

the

the
DNA they stick around RNA by its nature

DNA they stick around RNA by its nature

DNA they stick around RNA by its nature
is temporary it doesn't last and that

is temporary it doesn't last and that

is temporary it doesn't last and that
feature of RNA was part of the sales

feature of RNA was part of the sales

feature of RNA was part of the sales
pitch for the vaccine the pseudo iDine

pitch for the vaccine the pseudo iDine

pitch for the vaccine the pseudo iDine
was supposed to make the RNA last a

was supposed to make the RNA last a

was supposed to make the RNA last a
little bit longer but still it's a

little bit longer but still it's a

little bit longer but still it's a
transient phenomenon we're talking hours

transient phenomenon we're talking hours

transient phenomenon we're talking hours
to days okay um and then proteins once

to days okay um and then proteins once

to days okay um and then proteins once
proteins are made they also don't last

proteins are made they also don't last

proteins are made they also don't last
forever they they last for hours to days

forever they they last for hours to days

forever they they last for hours to days
but something that makes its way into

but something that makes its way into

but something that makes its way into
DNA has the potential to last for a very

DNA has the potential to last for a very

DNA has the potential to last for a very
long time maybe a

long time maybe a

long time maybe a
lifetime so this is a picture of the

lifetime so this is a picture of the

lifetime so this is a picture of the
sequencing read that uh the sequencing

sequencing read that uh the sequencing

sequencing read that uh the sequencing
run that I did uh in the lab um from a

run that I did uh in the lab um from a

run that I did uh in the lab um from a
couple of batches of the fiser vaccine

couple of batches of the fiser vaccine

couple of batches of the fiser vaccine
and all those little bitty lines here

and all those little bitty lines here

and all those little bitty lines here
are the little tiny pieces of DNA that

are the little tiny pieces of DNA that

are the little tiny pieces of DNA that
are in the vaccine they don't belong

are in the vaccine they don't belong

are in the vaccine they don't belong
there they are not part of the sales

there they are not part of the sales

there they are not part of the sales
pitch or the marketing campaign and

pitch or the marketing campaign and

pitch or the marketing campaign and
they're there there's a lot of them this

they're there there's a lot of them this

they're there there's a lot of them this
little graph here in the middle is the

little graph here in the middle is the

little graph here in the middle is the
size distribution it Peaks around 100

size distribution it Peaks around 100

size distribution it Peaks around 100
base pairs 120 base pairs so the the DNA

base pairs 120 base pairs so the the DNA

base pairs 120 base pairs so the the DNA
pieces that are in the vaccine are short

pieces that are in the vaccine are short

pieces that are in the vaccine are short
little pieces 100 120 there's some that

little pieces 100 120 there's some that

little pieces 100 120 there's some that
are about 500 base pairs a few that are

are about 500 base pairs a few that are

are about 500 base pairs a few that are
even 5,000 but most of them are around

even 5,000 but most of them are around

even 5,000 but most of them are around
100 base

100 base

100 base
pairs um why is this

pairs um why is this

pairs um why is this
important because the probability of a

important because the probability of a

important because the probability of a
DNA piece of DNA integrating into the

DNA piece of DNA integrating into the

DNA piece of DNA integrating into the
human genome is unrelated to its size so

human genome is unrelated to its size so

human genome is unrelated to its size so
your genome risk is just a function of

your genome risk is just a function of

your genome risk is just a function of
how many particles there are so it's

how many particles there are so it's

how many particles there are so it's
like you know if you shoot a shotgun at

like you know if you shoot a shotgun at

like you know if you shoot a shotgun at
a washboard if you shoot a slug you have

a washboard if you shoot a slug you have

a washboard if you shoot a slug you have
some probability of hitting it and if

some probability of hitting it and if

some probability of hitting it and if
shoot Buckshot you have a bigger

shoot Buckshot you have a bigger

shoot Buckshot you have a bigger
probability of hitting it with some shot

probability of hitting it with some shot

probability of hitting it with some shot
right this all these little pieces of

right this all these little pieces of

right this all these little pieces of
DNA that are in the vaccine are

DNA that are in the vaccine are

DNA that are in the vaccine are
analogous to Buckshot um you have many

analogous to Buckshot um you have many

analogous to Buckshot um you have many
many thousands of opportunities to

many thousands of opportunities to

many thousands of opportunities to
modify uh

modify uh

modify uh
a uh cell of a vaccinated person um the

a uh cell of a vaccinated person um the

a uh cell of a vaccinated person um the
pieces are very small because during the

pieces are very small because during the

pieces are very small because during the
process they chopped them up to try to

process they chopped them up to try to

process they chopped them up to try to
make them go away but they actually

make them go away but they actually

make them go away but they actually
increased the hazard of genome

increased the hazard of genome

increased the hazard of genome
modification in the process

modification in the process

modification in the process
that's how this got

that's how this got

that's how this got
here um in my view uh somebody should go

here um in my view uh somebody should go

here um in my view uh somebody should go
about

about

about
sequencing DNA samples from stem cells

sequencing DNA samples from stem cells

sequencing DNA samples from stem cells
of people who are vaccinated and find

of people who are vaccinated and find

of people who are vaccinated and find
out if this

out if this

out if this
theoretical risk has happened or not I

theoretical risk has happened or not I

theoretical risk has happened or not I
think this is a real serious oversight

think this is a real serious oversight

think this is a real serious oversight
regulatory oversight that happened at

regulatory oversight that happened at

regulatory oversight that happened at
the federal level and somebody should

the federal level and somebody should

the federal level and somebody should
force this to happen somewhere Dr B if

force this to happen somewhere Dr B if

force this to happen somewhere Dr B if
you now are you capable of doing that

you now are you capable of doing that

you now are you capable of doing that
yeah it's we do that kind of thing but

yeah it's we do that kind of thing but

yeah it's we do that kind of thing but
in order for it to be trustworthy it by

in order for it to be trustworthy it by

in order for it to be trustworthy it by
the public this has to be done by lots

the public this has to be done by lots

the public this has to be done by lots
of people right okay um I'll talk to you

of people right okay um I'll talk to you

of people right okay um I'll talk to you
more about that later yeah this is our

more about that later yeah this is our

more about that later yeah this is our
our deal this is why I know this should

our deal this is why I know this should

our deal this is why I know this should
have been done at the federal level

have been done at the federal level

have been done at the federal level
okay um so we took all these pieces of

okay um so we took all these pieces of

okay um so we took all these pieces of
DNA and we used them to glue together

DNA and we used them to glue together

DNA and we used them to glue together
what the source DNA must have been this

what the source DNA must have been this

what the source DNA must have been this
is kind of again this is our what we do

is kind of again this is our what we do

is kind of again this is our what we do
in the lab all the time and and all

in the lab all the time and and all

in the lab all the time and and all
these little little red and green lines

these little little red and green lines

these little little red and green lines
here these are all independent little

here these are all independent little

here these are all independent little
pieces of DNA um this must have had

pieces of DNA um this must have had

pieces of DNA um this must have had
100,000 pieces of DNA in this this

100,000 pieces of DNA in this this

100,000 pieces of DNA in this this
sequencing run and you can put them all

sequencing run and you can put them all

sequencing run and you can put them all
back together and see what they came

back together and see what they came

back together and see what they came
from is this circle over here it's a

from is this circle over here it's a

from is this circle over here it's a
plasmid that you can go shopping online

plasmid that you can go shopping online

plasmid that you can go shopping online
to buy from agilant and it's clear that

to buy from agilant and it's clear that

to buy from agilant and it's clear that
fiser uh took this plasmid and then they

fiser uh took this plasmid and then they

fiser uh took this plasmid and then they
Clon Spike into it um and

Clon Spike into it um and

Clon Spike into it um and
they used it for in a process called

they used it for in a process called

they used it for in a process called
invitro transcription translation inv

invitro transcription translation inv

invitro transcription translation inv
vitro transcription where you

vitro transcription where you

vitro transcription where you
feed an RNA polymerase this plasmid and

feed an RNA polymerase this plasmid and

feed an RNA polymerase this plasmid and
it makes a whole bunch of mRNA copies

it makes a whole bunch of mRNA copies

it makes a whole bunch of mRNA copies
for you okay and then you take this mRNA

for you okay and then you take this mRNA

for you okay and then you take this mRNA
you mix it with the the lipid

you mix it with the the lipid

you mix it with the the lipid
nanoparticle transection reagent and now

nanoparticle transection reagent and now

nanoparticle transection reagent and now
you've got your mRNA vaccine but they

you've got your mRNA vaccine but they

you've got your mRNA vaccine but they
failed to get the DNA out before they

failed to get the DNA out before they

failed to get the DNA out before they
did this so these little pieces they did

did this so these little pieces they did

did this so these little pieces they did
they did make some effort to chop it up

they did make some effort to chop it up

they did make some effort to chop it up
so all these little pieces of the plasma

so all these little pieces of the plasma

so all these little pieces of the plasma
got packaged in with the RNA that's

got packaged in with the RNA that's

got packaged in with the RNA that's
clear as day what happened just from the

clear as day what happened just from the

clear as day what happened just from the
forensics of looking at the DNA

forensics of looking at the DNA

forensics of looking at the DNA
sequencing okay A little bit of a

sequencing okay A little bit of a

sequencing okay A little bit of a
regulatory note here

regulatory note here

regulatory note here
um the way you do RNA transcription in

um the way you do RNA transcription in

um the way you do RNA transcription in
vitro transcription reactions you have

vitro transcription reactions you have

vitro transcription reactions you have
to give it a DNA template okay and you

to give it a DNA template okay and you

to give it a DNA template okay and you
can give it a DNA template that is just

can give it a DNA template that is just

can give it a DNA template that is just
a synthetic piece of DNA that is only

a synthetic piece of DNA that is only

a synthetic piece of DNA that is only
the instructions to make the

the instructions to make the

the instructions to make the
RNA and that's what was done for getting

RNA and that's what was done for getting

RNA and that's what was done for getting
the um emergency use authorization and

the um emergency use authorization and

the um emergency use authorization and
the clinical trial it's called process

the clinical trial it's called process

the clinical trial it's called process
one if you look up that kind of stuff um

one if you look up that kind of stuff um

one if you look up that kind of stuff um
they made a PCR product of just the bits

they made a PCR product of just the bits

they made a PCR product of just the bits
that they wanted and then they did the

that they wanted and then they did the

that they wanted and then they did the
invitro transcription made a bunch of

invitro transcription made a bunch of

invitro transcription made a bunch of
RNA of that there was no plasma DNA to

RNA of that there was no plasma DNA to

RNA of that there was no plasma DNA to
contaminate the stuff that was used for

contaminate the stuff that was used for

contaminate the stuff that was used for
the trial but that that making that PCR

the trial but that that making that PCR

the trial but that that making that PCR
product doesn't scale the way that was

product doesn't scale the way that was

product doesn't scale the way that was
necessary to vaccinate the whole world

necessary to vaccinate the whole world

necessary to vaccinate the whole world
so a cheaper way to scale up the

so a cheaper way to scale up the

so a cheaper way to scale up the
production of this template is to clone

production of this template is to clone

production of this template is to clone
that PCR product into this plasma Vector

that PCR product into this plasma Vector

that PCR product into this plasma Vector
put the plasma Vector into bacteria and

put the plasma Vector into bacteria and

put the plasma Vector into bacteria and
then you grow up big Vats of the

then you grow up big Vats of the

then you grow up big Vats of the
bacteria they make a lot of the plasma

bacteria they make a lot of the plasma

bacteria they make a lot of the plasma
DNA for you then you use that plasma DNA

DNA for you then you use that plasma DNA

DNA for you then you use that plasma DNA
as the template to drive this

as the template to drive this

as the template to drive this
transcription reaction to make your

transcription reaction to make your

transcription reaction to make your
RNA

RNA

RNA
um and that's where how the

um and that's where how the

um and that's where how the
contamination ended up in the production

contamination ended up in the production

contamination ended up in the production
batches even though it was not in the

batches even though it was not in the

batches even though it was not in the
stuff that was used for the

stuff that was used for the

stuff that was used for the
authorization

authorization

authorization
trials so I know it's a little bit of

trials so I know it's a little bit of

trials so I know it's a little bit of
nerdy science but it has

nerdy science but it has

nerdy science but it has
regulatory implications for for you

guys

guys
um we can we can measure the quantity of

um we can we can measure the quantity of

um we can we can measure the quantity of
this stuff pretty easy in the lab this

this stuff pretty easy in the lab this

this stuff pretty easy in the lab this
is we're we're good at doing this kind

is we're we're good at doing this kind

is we're we're good at doing this kind
of stuff this is the same we made a

of stuff this is the same we made a

of stuff this is the same we made a
little PC a colleague of mine at at MIT

little PC a colleague of mine at at MIT

little PC a colleague of mine at at MIT
made you know from who who used to work

made you know from who who used to work

made you know from who who used to work
for the the broad Institute at MIT he he

for the the broad Institute at MIT he he

for the the broad Institute at MIT he he
made a little uh PCR test and we cloned

made a little uh PCR test and we cloned

made a little uh PCR test and we cloned
here this is similar to the PCR test

here this is similar to the PCR test

here this is similar to the PCR test
that you all took for the spit test okay

that you all took for the spit test okay

that you all took for the spit test okay
same same idea and same expertise behind

same same idea and same expertise behind

same same idea and same expertise behind
it and we can quantify exactly how much

it and we can quantify exactly how much

it and we can quantify exactly how much
of this stuff is in a vaccine or any

of this stuff is in a vaccine or any

of this stuff is in a vaccine or any
other tissue

other tissue

other tissue
and you know I estimate that there were

and you know I estimate that there were

and you know I estimate that there were
about two billion copies of the one

about two billion copies of the one

about two billion copies of the one
piece that we're looking for in every

piece that we're looking for in every

piece that we're looking for in every
dose and if you looked back at that map

dose and if you looked back at that map

dose and if you looked back at that map
I showed you where it's all these little

I showed you where it's all these little

I showed you where it's all these little
the the little piece that we're looking

the the little piece that we're looking

the the little piece that we're looking
for is just that little bit right there

for is just that little bit right there

for is just that little bit right there
okay but if you see 2 billion copies of

okay but if you see 2 billion copies of

okay but if you see 2 billion copies of
this there's about 200 billion of

this there's about 200 billion of

this there's about 200 billion of
everything else so what this means is

everything else so what this means is

everything else so what this means is
that there's probably about 200 billion

that there's probably about 200 billion

that there's probably about 200 billion
pieces of this plasma

pieces of this plasma

pieces of this plasma
DNA in in each dose of the

DNA in in each dose of the

DNA in in each dose of the
vaccine and it's encapsulated in this

vaccine and it's encapsulated in this

vaccine and it's encapsulated in this
lipid nanop particle so it's ready to be

lipid nanop particle so it's ready to be

lipid nanop particle so it's ready to be
delivered inside the

delivered inside the

delivered inside the
cell okay this is a bad

idea my conclusions from this

idea my conclusions from this
um we should check a bunch of people

ah my conclusions from this are I should

ah my conclusions from this are I should
learn how to run

learn how to run

learn how to run
PowerPoint um we should check a bunch of

PowerPoint um we should check a bunch of

PowerPoint um we should check a bunch of
vaccinated

vaccinated

vaccinated
people getting tissue

people getting tissue

people getting tissue
samples especially if we focus on harmed

samples especially if we focus on harmed

samples especially if we focus on harmed
people but that's not necessary we could

people but that's not necessary we could

people but that's not necessary we could
also just focus on regular unharmed

also just focus on regular unharmed

also just focus on regular unharmed
people people and see if this plasma DNA

people people and see if this plasma DNA

people people and see if this plasma DNA
is integrating into the genomes of any

is integrating into the genomes of any

is integrating into the genomes of any
of their stem cells it leaves a calling

of their stem cells it leaves a calling

of their stem cells it leaves a calling
card that is there one of the reasons

card that is there one of the reasons

card that is there one of the reasons
why I'm focusing on this is

why I'm focusing on this is

why I'm focusing on this is
because it's kind of different from a

because it's kind of different from a

because it's kind of different from a
lot of the other imagined harms where

lot of the other imagined harms where

lot of the other imagined harms where
you can't really prove it you can be

you can't really prove it you can be

you can't really prove it you can be
suspicious because of the timing but you

suspicious because of the timing but you

suspicious because of the timing but you
can't really prove it this one you can

can't really prove it this one you can

can't really prove it this one you can
prove it because it leaves a calling

prove it because it leaves a calling

prove it because it leaves a calling
card okay

card okay

card okay
um you find it in the stem cells of

um you find it in the stem cells of

um you find it in the stem cells of
harmed people

harmed people

harmed people
it's equivalent to finding a certain

it's equivalent to finding a certain

it's equivalent to finding a certain
type of lid in someone who is now dead

type of lid in someone who is now dead

type of lid in someone who is now dead
it's pretty reasonable to assume that

it's pretty reasonable to assume that

it's pretty reasonable to assume that
that's what caused

that's what caused

that's what caused
it uh the Royal we meaning you guys

it uh the Royal we meaning you guys

it uh the Royal we meaning you guys
should insist that the FDA Force fizer

should insist that the FDA Force fizer

should insist that the FDA Force fizer
to get the DNA out of the

to get the DNA out of the

to get the DNA out of the
booster and all future versions of this

booster and all future versions of this

booster and all future versions of this
vaccine I'm a real fan of this platform

vaccine I'm a real fan of this platform

vaccine I'm a real fan of this platform
okay I think it has the potential to

okay I think it has the potential to

okay I think it has the potential to
treat cancers I really

treat cancers I really

treat cancers I really
believe that this platform is

believe that this platform is

believe that this platform is
revolutionary and in your lifetime there

revolutionary and in your lifetime there

revolutionary and in your lifetime there
will be mRNA vaccines against antigens

will be mRNA vaccines against antigens

will be mRNA vaccines against antigens
in your unique cancer okay and but they

in your unique cancer okay and but they

in your unique cancer okay and but they
got to get this problem fixed okay and I

got to get this problem fixed okay and I

got to get this problem fixed okay and I
and I right now I think the financial

and I right now I think the financial

and I right now I think the financial
incentives are too great to just keep on

incentives are too great to just keep on

incentives are too great to just keep on
rolling with it and it's going to take

rolling with it and it's going to take

rolling with it and it's going to take
some encouragement to get it

out the regulation that allowed this DNA

out the regulation that allowed this DNA
to there in the first place I don't

to there in the first place I don't

to there in the first place I don't
think that this the amounts there

think that this the amounts there

think that this the amounts there
actually exceed the regulation

actually exceed the regulation

actually exceed the regulation
limits in some batches it may in in the

limits in some batches it may in in the

limits in some batches it may in in the
two batches that I looked at one of them

two batches that I looked at one of them

two batches that I looked at one of them
it was just under the limit and one it

it was just under the limit and one it

it was just under the limit and one it
was just over the limit my colleague in

was just over the limit my colleague in

was just over the limit my colleague in
Boston has looked at a fair number of

Boston has looked at a fair number of

Boston has looked at a fair number of
other batches and there's a handful that

other batches and there's a handful that

other batches and there's a handful that
are super high and there's a handful

are super high and there's a handful

are super high and there's a handful
that are super low but the fact that

that are super low but the fact that

that are super low but the fact that
there is a regulatory threshold for

there is a regulatory threshold for

there is a regulatory threshold for
amount of DNA allowed in a

amount of DNA allowed in a

amount of DNA allowed in a
vaccine is a throwback to an Era when we

vaccine is a throwback to an Era when we

vaccine is a throwback to an Era when we
were talking about vaccines that were

were talking about vaccines that were

were talking about vaccines that were
like a recombinant protein that you or a

like a recombinant protein that you or a

like a recombinant protein that you or a
dead virus you know attenuated virus

dead virus you know attenuated virus

dead virus you know attenuated virus
produced in in ch cells or something

produced in in ch cells or something

produced in in ch cells or something
like that and the DNA that might be in

like that and the DNA that might be in

like that and the DNA that might be in
it is naked DNA and you might have a

it is naked DNA and you might have a

it is naked DNA and you might have a
little bit in the vaccine that's not a

little bit in the vaccine that's not a

little bit in the vaccine that's not a
problem because naked DNA gets chewed up

problem because naked DNA gets chewed up

problem because naked DNA gets chewed up
immediately upon vaccination and there's

immediately upon vaccination and there's

immediately upon vaccination and there's
no real mechanism for it to get inside

no real mechanism for it to get inside

no real mechanism for it to get inside
to cells they inappropriately applied

to cells they inappropriately applied

to cells they inappropriately applied
that regulatory limit to this new kind

that regulatory limit to this new kind

that regulatory limit to this new kind
of seene where everything is

of seene where everything is

of seene where everything is
encapsulated in this lipid nanoparticle

encapsulated in this lipid nanoparticle

encapsulated in this lipid nanoparticle
it's basically packaged in a synthetic

it's basically packaged in a synthetic

it's basically packaged in a synthetic
virus able to dump its contents into a

virus able to dump its contents into a

virus able to dump its contents into a
cell so I'm thinking handlon razor here

cell so I'm thinking handlon razor here

cell so I'm thinking handlon razor here
okay I don't think there was anything

okay I don't think there was anything

okay I don't think there was anything
nefarious here I think it was just kind

nefarious here I think it was just kind

nefarious here I think it was just kind
of a dumb oversight and it's going to

of a dumb oversight and it's going to

of a dumb oversight and it's going to
take because the financial incentives

take because the financial incentives

take because the financial incentives
are so great to just you know sweep it

are so great to just you know sweep it

are so great to just you know sweep it
under the rug and the career incentives

under the rug and the career incentives

under the rug and the career incentives
of people that approved this are going

of people that approved this are going

of people that approved this are going
to be there's nothing wrong here you

to be there's nothing wrong here you

to be there's nothing wrong here you
know it's going to take some

know it's going to take some

know it's going to take some
encouragement to make people prove that

encouragement to make people prove that

encouragement to make people prove that
it's

it's

it's
okay but I really believe this was an

okay but I really believe this was an

okay but I really believe this was an
inappropriate application of an old

inappropriate application of an old

inappropriate application of an old
school regulation to a new kind of

school regulation to a new kind of

school regulation to a new kind of
vaccine and who knows maybe we'll check

vaccine and who knows maybe we'll check

vaccine and who knows maybe we'll check
a bunch of people and we'll find out for

a bunch of people and we'll find out for

a bunch of people and we'll find out for
sure that this is indeed not a problem

sure that this is indeed not a problem

sure that this is indeed not a problem
and that will do the public good if we

and that will do the public good if we

and that will do the public good if we
prove that Mr

prove that Mr

prove that Mr
chairman Senator

cash Dr we

cash Dr we
uh

uh

uh
appreciate all that you're saying

appreciate all that you're saying

appreciate all that you're saying
although we don't understand most of

although we don't understand most of

although we don't understand most of
what you're saying sorry I have a

what you're saying sorry I have a

what you're saying sorry I have a
limited amount of time someone down

limited amount of time someone down

limited amount of time someone down
there agreeing a lot so you must have

there agreeing a lot so you must have

there agreeing a lot so you must have
been a chemistry major or something but

um what what is going to help us is to

um what what is going to help us is to
know what what you can do like checking

know what what you can do like checking

know what what you can do like checking
a bunch of vaccinated people of course

a bunch of vaccinated people of course

a bunch of vaccinated people of course
that's what I can do right but we are

that's what I can do right but we are

that's what I can do right but we are
are not going to have any authority over

are not going to have any authority over

are not going to have any authority over
the

the

the
FDA to force fizer to do something I

FDA to force fizer to do something I

FDA to force fizer to do something I
mean that's a federal issue uh yes

mean that's a federal issue uh yes

mean that's a federal issue uh yes
unless you can explain to me how we

unless you can explain to me how we

unless you can explain to me how we
could do something at a state level you

could do something at a state level you

could do something at a state level you
know some of this is going to have to be

know some of this is going to have to be

know some of this is going to have to be
taken up by our Congressman right so

taken up by our Congressman right so

taken up by our Congressman right so
just and whatever your remaining

just and whatever your remaining

just and whatever your remaining
comments are just keep in mind that I

comments are just keep in mind that I

comments are just keep in mind that I
understand what what we can do and and

understand what what we can do and and

understand what what we can do and and
really these technical things you're

really these technical things you're

really these technical things you're
throwing out us as as a senator from

throwing out us as as a senator from

throwing out us as as a senator from
Green has already mentioned we're going

Green has already mentioned we're going

Green has already mentioned we're going
to throw right back at you because

to throw right back at you because

to throw right back at you because
there's no you're the expert so if

there's no you're the expert so if

there's no you're the expert so if
someone's going to do this

someone's going to do this

someone's going to do this
testing uh I don't know who we would

testing uh I don't know who we would

testing uh I don't know who we would
find to do it well other than someone

find to do it well other than someone

find to do it well other than someone
like you I can do it lots of other

like you I can do it lots of other

like you I can do it lots of other
people can do it um I've had a lot of of

people can do it um I've had a lot of of

people can do it um I've had a lot of of
um so coroners and pharmacists from

um so coroners and pharmacists from

um so coroners and pharmacists from
different states contact me I posted all

different states contact me I posted all

different states contact me I posted all
this on Twitter right and so people will

this on Twitter right and so people will

this on Twitter right and so people will
private message me and say I'd like to

private message me and say I'd like to

private message me and say I'd like to
send you some samples and then they say

send you some samples and then they say

send you some samples and then they say
oops State leg regulation will not allow

oops State leg regulation will not allow

oops State leg regulation will not allow
our coroner to send any samples for this

our coroner to send any samples for this

our coroner to send any samples for this
so there are some policy

so there are some policy

so there are some policy
issues that can allow this to happen or

issues that can allow this to happen or

issues that can allow this to happen or
impede it I don't know what they are but

impede it I don't know what they are but

impede it I don't know what they are but
I hear that there are mechanisms in

I hear that there are mechanisms in

I hear that there are mechanisms in
place that

place that

place that
will you know you can

will you know you can

will you know you can
encourage people to do things or not do

encourage people to do things or not do

encourage people to do things or not do
things but that's your wheelhouse not

things but that's your wheelhouse not

things but that's your wheelhouse not
mine all I can tell you is what I found

mine all I can tell you is what I found

mine all I can tell you is what I found
in the lab and the scientific

in the lab and the scientific

in the lab and the scientific
implications of it the policy implic and

implications of it the policy implic and

implications of it the policy implic and
what to do it is out of my it's above my

what to do it is out of my it's above my

what to do it is out of my it's above my
pay

pay

pay
grade Senator Garrett thank you for

grade Senator Garrett thank you for

grade Senator Garrett thank you for
coming today um I think I followed most

coming today um I think I followed most

coming today um I think I followed most
of what you said President Biden said

of what you said President Biden said

of what you said President Biden said
the other day that there was a new coid

the other day that there was a new coid

the other day that there was a new coid
vaccine that and this one really

vaccine that and this one really

vaccine that and this one really
works um there's no evidence to that as

works um there's no evidence to that as

works um there's no evidence to that as
far as I can tell I I understand that

far as I can tell I I understand that

far as I can tell I I understand that
and that's why I'm asking this question

and that's why I'm asking this question

and that's why I'm asking this question
is there some way you could get a hold

is there some way you could get a hold

is there some way you could get a hold
of one of those and do the do the same

of one of those and do the do the same

of one of those and do the do the same
study that you did on these vials to

study that you did on these vials to

study that you did on these vials to
make sure

make sure

make sure
that we're not using that that DNA

that we're not using that that DNA

that we're not using that that DNA
protein or whatever it is the DNA that

protein or whatever it is the DNA that

protein or whatever it is the DNA that
that that we don't need in to be

that that we don't need in to be

that that we don't need in to be
injected into these uh to our

injected into these uh to our

injected into these uh to our
constituents I would like to do that and

constituents I would like to do that and

constituents I would like to do that and
I will not get it unless I get a batch

I will not get it unless I get a batch

I will not get it unless I get a batch
and and find out that it's free of DNA

and and find out that it's free of DNA

and and find out that it's free of DNA
and then I'll take it myself but I don't

and then I'll take it myself but I don't

and then I'll take it myself but I don't
I don't have any way of compelling that

I don't have any way of compelling that

I don't have any way of compelling that
to happen so it was just basically a way

to happen so it was just basically a way

to happen so it was just basically a way
to save money by by doing it in such

to save money by by doing it in such

to save money by by doing it in such
volume that way without then taking it

volume that way without then taking it

volume that way without then taking it
back out later on

I think nobody thought about it I I

I think nobody thought about it I I
think it was reasonable to use the eoli

think it was reasonable to use the eoli

think it was reasonable to use the eoli
to blow up the plasma to make the stuff

to blow up the plasma to make the stuff

to blow up the plasma to make the stuff
and then the the pieces of the DNA are

and then the the pieces of the DNA are

and then the the pieces of the DNA are
of a very uniform and small size that's

of a very uniform and small size that's

of a very uniform and small size that's
evidence that they took efforts to try

evidence that they took efforts to try

evidence that they took efforts to try
to chop it

to chop it

to chop it
up and then they knew about it yeah yeah

up and then they knew about it yeah yeah

up and then they knew about it yeah yeah
they knew it and they took efforts to

they knew it and they took efforts to

they knew it and they took efforts to
chop it up they just didn't get it all

chop it up they just didn't get it all

chop it up they just didn't get it all
out but but having said that I guess

out but but having said that I guess

out but but having said that I guess
that they just didn't didn't think about

that they just didn't didn't think about

that they just didn't didn't think about
the the hazard for genome modification

the the hazard for genome modification

the the hazard for genome modification
cuz it's not all that expensive to add

cuz it's not all that expensive to add

cuz it's not all that expensive to add
another process to get it out well

another process to get it out well

another process to get it out well
that's what I'm saying it

that's what I'm saying it

that's what I'm saying it
it you know I can't get inside their

it you know I can't get inside their

it you know I can't get inside their
mind rushed too much and that's why I'm

mind rushed too much and that's why I'm

mind rushed too much and that's why I'm
saying these subsequent you know we've

saying these subsequent you know we've

saying these subsequent you know we've
heard testimony these subsequent you

heard testimony these subsequent you

heard testimony these subsequent you
know variant subsequent boosters etc etc

know variant subsequent boosters etc etc

know variant subsequent boosters etc etc
are leading to maybe not scientific yet

are leading to maybe not scientific yet

are leading to maybe not scientific yet
but at least collateral knowledge that

but at least collateral knowledge that

but at least collateral knowledge that
it apparently these things are causing

it apparently these things are causing

it apparently these things are causing
death and disability later on and also

death and disability later on and also

death and disability later on and also
the aging process which you heard about

the aging process which you heard about

the aging process which you heard about
a few minut there's a lot of suspicious

a few minut there's a lot of suspicious

a few minut there's a lot of suspicious
associations but I but it seems to me

associations but I but it seems to me

associations but I but it seems to me
that that before we can in South

that that before we can in South

that that before we can in South
Carolina you know give this new vaccine

Carolina you know give this new vaccine

Carolina you know give this new vaccine
a world around here seems to me that

a world around here seems to me that

a world around here seems to me that
that our people ought to be able to look

that our people ought to be able to look

that our people ought to be able to look
at that Mr chairman and see whether or

at that Mr chairman and see whether or

at that Mr chairman and see whether or
not it's got this DNA and if it does

not it's got this DNA and if it does

not it's got this DNA and if it does
fine tell everybody that's got the DNA

fine tell everybody that's got the DNA

fine tell everybody that's got the DNA
and the and the problems associated

and the and the problems associated

and the and the problems associated
there with then you got informed consent

there with then you got informed consent

there with then you got informed consent
correct okay but without that we don't

correct okay but without that we don't

correct okay but without that we don't
haveed I'm not I'm not really happy

haveed I'm not I'm not really happy

haveed I'm not I'm not really happy
about that Mr chairman and do what I can

about that Mr chairman and do what I can

about that Mr chairman and do what I can
to try to help knowing what I otherwise

to try to help knowing what I otherwise

to try to help knowing what I otherwise
knowing what I know now about this I

knowing what I know now about this I

knowing what I know now about this I
would still have recommended it to my

would still have recommended it to my

would still have recommended it to my
elderly parents okay but I probably

elderly parents okay but I probably

elderly parents okay but I probably
would not have given it to my daughters

would not have given it to my daughters

would not have given it to my daughters
okay and I I feel like my consent was

okay and I I feel like my consent was

okay and I I feel like my consent was
not as informed as it should have been

not as informed as it should have been

not as informed as it should have been
thank you yeah represent Morgan I almost

thank you yeah represent Morgan I almost

thank you yeah represent Morgan I almost
don't know where to start I'm I'm trying

don't know where to start I'm I'm trying

don't know where to start I'm I'm trying
not to talk because we're it's a hearing

not to talk because we're it's a hearing

not to talk because we're it's a hearing
and we want to hear you but you have

and we want to hear you but you have

and we want to hear you but you have
made so many questions come to my mind

made so many questions come to my mind

made so many questions come to my mind
um and one I should know but I don't

um and one I should know but I don't

um and one I should know but I don't
remember what percentage of vaccinated

remember what percentage of vaccinated

remember what percentage of vaccinated
people had this kind of vaccination do

people had this kind of vaccination do

people had this kind of vaccination do
you know off the top of your head like

you know off the top of your head like

you know off the top of your head like
the majority of people that took the

the majority of people that took the

the majority of people that took the
vaccine have this type because weren't

vaccine have this type because weren't

vaccine have this type because weren't
there multiple types of vaccinations you

there multiple types of vaccinations you

there multiple types of vaccinations you
could take the vast majority of people

could take the vast majority of people

could take the vast majority of people
got either fiser or Mna and and we're

got either fiser or Mna and and we're

got either fiser or Mna and and we're
talking about the F I'm talking about

talking about the F I'm talking about

talking about the F I'm talking about
fizer my colleagues have looked at madna

fizer my colleagues have looked at madna

fizer my colleagues have looked at madna
and it's in madna 2o in the few that

and it's in madna 2o in the few that

and it's in madna 2o in the few that
we've looked at it's just not quite as

we've looked at it's just not quite as

we've looked at it's just not quite as
high okay wow um with so you were here

high okay wow um with so you were here

high okay wow um with so you were here
today and you've come to present and you

today and you've come to present and you

today and you've come to present and you
notice this where could you have gone if

notice this where could you have gone if

notice this where could you have gone if
we didn't have this kind of ad hoc

we didn't have this kind of ad hoc

we didn't have this kind of ad hoc
hearing for this to come Twitter so

hearing for this to come Twitter so

hearing for this to come Twitter so
there's no deck there's no way for you

there's no deck there's no way for you

there's no deck there's no way for you
even at your level of expertise to say

even at your level of expertise to say

even at your level of expertise to say
hey red flag I I email I emailed the FDA

hey red flag I I email I emailed the FDA

hey red flag I I email I emailed the FDA
and I tweeted at them that's about the

and I tweeted at them that's about the

and I tweeted at them that's about the
extent of my resources

extent of my resources

extent of my resources
it's just fascinating to me that in a in

it's just fascinating to me that in a in

it's just fascinating to me that in a in
the state that we don't have some kind

the state that we don't have some kind

the state that we don't have some kind
of um I guess it goes to kind of the

of um I guess it goes to kind of the

of um I guess it goes to kind of the
entire thing that we're talking about is

entire thing that we're talking about is

entire thing that we're talking about is
that our state agency should have more

that our state agency should have more

that our state agency should have more
focus on our citizens health and you

focus on our citizens health and you

focus on our citizens health and you
know great CDC can send us stuff but

know great CDC can send us stuff but

know great CDC can send us stuff but
we'll make the decision and and there

we'll make the decision and and there

we'll make the decision and and there
should be a way for especially at your

should be a way for especially at your

should be a way for especially at your
level to get input to dhack when you

level to get input to dhack when you

level to get input to dhack when you
notice something like this immediately

notice something like this immediately

notice something like this immediately
and say hey deck you should consider

and say hey deck you should consider

and say hey deck you should consider
this and then they can come and tell us

this and then they can come and tell us

this and then they can come and tell us
immediately

immediately

immediately
hey we need to get authorization you

hey we need to get authorization you

hey we need to get authorization you
need to change this regulation to look

need to change this regulation to look

need to change this regulation to look
into this and it just seems like we'

into this and it just seems like we'

into this and it just seems like we'
totally dropped the ball in every

totally dropped the ball in every

totally dropped the ball in every
direction with the state prioritizing um

direction with the state prioritizing um

direction with the state prioritizing um
you know our decision- making on this

you know our decision- making on this

you know our decision- making on this
kind of stuff and and investigating into

kind of stuff and and investigating into

kind of stuff and and investigating into
it just letting the you know the federal

it just letting the you know the federal

it just letting the you know the federal
government take it and do a terrible job

government take it and do a terrible job

government take it and do a terrible job
so I had a lot of experience with DC

so I had a lot of experience with DC

so I had a lot of experience with DC
rolling out the saliva test okay so we

rolling out the saliva test okay so we

rolling out the saliva test okay so we
invented the saliva test and then we had

invented the saliva test and then we had

invented the saliva test and then we had
to deal with DEC to try to get it rolled

to deal with DEC to try to get it rolled

to deal with DEC to try to get it rolled
out for the state and it appear appear

out for the state and it appear appear

out for the state and it appear appear
to me that they were just

to me that they were just

to me that they were just
overrun they weren't prepared for what

overrun they weren't prepared for what

overrun they weren't prepared for what
this pandemic was through there's no

this pandemic was through there's no

this pandemic was through there's no
fault of theirs I thought I I told

fault of theirs I thought I I told

fault of theirs I thought I I told
people at the time that I felt like

people at the time that I felt like

people at the time that I felt like
these were Hobbits in the Shire that

these were Hobbits in the Shire that

these were Hobbits in the Shire that
were you know accustomed to take care of

were you know accustomed to take care of

were you know accustomed to take care of
small problems and now of a sudden we're

small problems and now of a sudden we're

small problems and now of a sudden we're
in the war of the ring and there are

in the war of the ring and there are

in the war of the ring and there are
Orcs at the gate and we're expecting

Orcs at the gate and we're expecting

Orcs at the gate and we're expecting
them to deal with this tremendous

them to deal with this tremendous

them to deal with this tremendous
Challenge and that's not who we put

Challenge and that's not who we put

Challenge and that's not who we put
there and that's not their fault I mean

there and that's not their fault I mean

there and that's not their fault I mean
it's just we were not prepared to handle

it's just we were not prepared to handle

it's just we were not prepared to handle
something of this magnitude so some

something of this magnitude so some

something of this magnitude so some
amount of Grace I think is appropriate

amount of Grace I think is appropriate

amount of Grace I think is appropriate
even though we could do better next time

even though we could do better next time

even though we could do better next time
by beefing up who's guarding the gates

by beefing up who's guarding the gates

by beefing up who's guarding the gates
if you if you had a tomorrow fixes to

if you if you had a tomorrow fixes to

if you if you had a tomorrow fixes to
the system what would they be that we

the system what would they be that we

the system what would they be that we
could I mean since you lived it and and

could I mean since you lived it and and

could I mean since you lived it and and
saw based on the research should we have

saw based on the research should we have

saw based on the research should we have
somebody actually checking up especially

somebody actually checking up especially

somebody actually checking up especially
on something that is being pushed

on something that is being pushed

on something that is being pushed
Statewide I mean State resources are

Statewide I mean State resources are

Statewide I mean State resources are
being used saying to take this vaccine

being used saying to take this vaccine

being used saying to take this vaccine
to hire people that are qualified to

to hire people that are qualified to

to hire people that are qualified to
tell the feds

tell the feds

tell the feds
no and that's not what we do here

no and that's not what we do here

no and that's not what we do here
usually in South Carolina we hire people

usually in South Carolina we hire people

usually in South Carolina we hire people
sometimes we say to the no to the feds

sometimes we say to the no to the feds

sometimes we say to the no to the feds
just to be ordinary because that's our

just to be ordinary because that's our

just to be ordinary because that's our
culture in South Carolina but many times

culture in South Carolina but many times

culture in South Carolina but many times
we say well I don't know what do other

we say well I don't know what do other

we say well I don't know what do other
people do and we hire people all over

people do and we hire people all over

people do and we hire people all over
that they ask well what does Clemson do

that they ask well what does Clemson do

that they ask well what does Clemson do
what does USC well what do they do over

what does USC well what do they do over

what does USC well what do they do over
in this other state instead of putting

in this other state instead of putting

in this other state instead of putting
people in place that we would have

people in place that we would have

people in place that we would have
confidence in saying no to the to

confidence in saying no to the to

confidence in saying no to the to
whatever the recommendations were we put

whatever the recommendations were we put

whatever the recommendations were we put
people in that we often encourage them

people in that we often encourage them

people in that we often encourage them
to not make too many waves and just go

to not make too many waves and just go

to not make too many waves and just go
ask the feds what they're doing and

ask the feds what they're doing and

ask the feds what they're doing and
that's not their fault that's the

that's not their fault that's the

that's not their fault that's the
culture that we

culture that we

culture that we
cultivated so I know that South Carolina

cultivated so I know that South Carolina

cultivated so I know that South Carolina
culture is no no no we're going to do

culture is no no no we're going to do

culture is no no no we're going to do
our own thing but in reality in terms of

our own thing but in reality in terms of

our own thing but in reality in terms of
actually doing stuff almost always we

actually doing stuff almost always we

actually doing stuff almost always we
people will say well what do they do

people will say well what do they do

people will say well what do they do
else in another state or what are they

else in another state or what are they

else in another state or what are they
doing at the FED level and I'll just go

doing at the FED level and I'll just go

doing at the FED level and I'll just go
along with it would it be and I'm not a

along with it would it be and I'm not a

along with it would it be and I'm not a
medical professional by any stretch

medical professional by any stretch

medical professional by any stretch
would it be realistic for anything that

would it be realistic for anything that

would it be realistic for anything that
is being promoted especially on a large

is being promoted especially on a large

is being promoted especially on a large
scale a vaccination that's you know

scale a vaccination that's you know

scale a vaccination that's you know
coming from who knows where to have it

coming from who knows where to have it

coming from who knows where to have it
be investigated by people in our state

be investigated by people in our state

be investigated by people in our state
such as yourself or is that would that

such as yourself or is that would that

such as yourself or is that would that
be too it it was reasonable to trust the

be too it it was reasonable to trust the

be too it it was reasonable to trust the
FDA even

FDA even

FDA even
though I have my doubts about their

though I have my doubts about their

though I have my doubts about their
independence now

independence now

independence now
everybody just trusted the feds to do

everybody just trusted the feds to do

everybody just trusted the feds to do
this and at the time that was kind of

this and at the time that was kind of

this and at the time that was kind of
reasonable but going forward I get

reasonable but going forward I get

reasonable but going forward I get
that's my question going forward is it

that's my question going forward is it

that's my question going forward is it
is it possible is it reasonable for us

is it possible is it reasonable for us

is it possible is it reasonable for us
to be able to have a system where we

to be able to have a system where we

to be able to have a system where we
could especially if it's being if the

could especially if it's being if the

could especially if it's being if the
taxpayer money is going to be used to

taxpayer money is going to be used to

taxpayer money is going to be used to
push it and tell people to get it that

push it and tell people to get it that

push it and tell people to get it that
we have it set up that it's

we have it set up that it's

we have it set up that it's
automatically tested basically or looked

automatically tested basically or looked

automatically tested basically or looked
into by scientists and medical

into by scientists and medical

into by scientists and medical
professionals in our state to determine

professionals in our state to determine

professionals in our state to determine
maybe it's in DEC maybe DEC has that

maybe it's in DEC maybe DEC has that

maybe it's in DEC maybe DEC has that
where they are required to look into it

where they are required to look into it

where they are required to look into it
and have their own um you know summary

and have their own um you know summary

and have their own um you know summary
or decision on whether or not it's safe

or decision on whether or not it's safe

or decision on whether or not it's safe
and effective since we know that CDC and

and effective since we know that CDC and

and effective since we know that CDC and
uh FDA and all these are not doing a

uh FDA and all these are not doing a

uh FDA and all these are not doing a
good job with it and I and I guess I'm

good job with it and I and I guess I'm

good job with it and I and I guess I'm
asking you as a professional are do you

asking you as a professional are do you

asking you as a professional are do you
hear that and think wow that's going to

hear that and think wow that's going to

hear that and think wow that's going to
cost an insane amount of money and good

cost an insane amount of money and good

cost an insane amount of money and good
luck or like no that's reasonable no no

luck or like no that's reasonable no no

luck or like no that's reasonable no no
the the actual like scientific

the the actual like scientific

the the actual like scientific
experiments are I don't think an insane

experiments are I don't think an insane

experiments are I don't think an insane
amount of money it's having

amount of money it's having

amount of money it's having
the the Regulatory and and Financial

the the Regulatory and and Financial

the the Regulatory and and Financial
Independence to like say no we're not

Independence to like say no we're not

Independence to like say no we're not
going to do it the way we're told until

going to do it the way we're told until

going to do it the way we're told until
we find out that it's okay when in

we find out that it's okay when in

we find out that it's okay when in
reality much of our support comes from

reality much of our support comes from

reality much of our support comes from
federal sources it's like if you have a

federal sources it's like if you have a

federal sources it's like if you have a
better idea for how to build the

better idea for how to build the

better idea for how to build the
interstate you kind of have to do what

interstate you kind of have to do what

interstate you kind of have to do what
the the federal people tell you

the the federal people tell you

the the federal people tell you
regardless right we because that's where

regardless right we because that's where

regardless right we because that's where
the money comes from for a lot of the in

the money comes from for a lot of the in

the money comes from for a lot of the in
Interstate infrastructure and I think

Interstate infrastructure and I think

Interstate infrastructure and I think
I'm not a policy expert but I I think

I'm not a policy expert but I I think

I'm not a policy expert but I I think
that a lot of financial support through

that a lot of financial support through

that a lot of financial support through
the Health Care system and and elsewhere

the Health Care system and and elsewhere

the Health Care system and and elsewhere
was tied to compliance to the federal

was tied to compliance to the federal

was tied to compliance to the federal
narratives and so I don't know that you

narratives and so I don't know that you

narratives and so I don't know that you
can create true

can create true

can create true
Independence you you could maybe create

Independence you you could maybe create

Independence you you could maybe create
some kind of

some kind of

some kind of
oversite that would enhance the public

oversite that would enhance the public

oversite that would enhance the public
trust in whether it was a good idea or

trust in whether it was a good idea or

trust in whether it was a good idea or
not but that's a different matter from

not but that's a different matter from

not but that's a different matter from
us being able to go our own way all the

us being able to go our own way all the

us being able to go our own way all the
time but that's your that's your leader

time but that's your that's your leader

time but that's your that's your leader
that's your area of expertise it's not

that's your area of expertise it's not

that's your area of expertise it's not
mine yeah but it is but it is possible

mine yeah but it is but it is possible

mine yeah but it is but it is possible
to have somebody look into vaccinations

to have somebody look into vaccinations

to have somebody look into vaccinations
and do similarly to what you did on this

and do similarly to what you did on this

and do similarly to what you did on this
I did this on my own money with free

I did this on my own money with free

I did this on my own money with free
student I mean yeah we this is not

student I mean yeah we this is not

student I mean yeah we this is not
terribly expensive to do these kinds of

terribly expensive to do these kinds of

terribly expensive to do these kinds of
tests but you know that has to be in a

tests but you know that has to be in a

tests but you know that has to be in a
system that that professors are not

system that that professors are not

system that that professors are not
going to be penalized for producing

going to be penalized for producing

going to be penalized for producing
results that are counter to what the

results that are counter to what the

results that are counter to what the
party line is supposed to

party line is supposed to

party line is supposed to
be and that you can create bubbles of

be and that you can create bubbles of

be and that you can create bubbles of
where the protection for people whose

where the protection for people whose

where the protection for people whose
job it is to check things and if they

job it is to check things and if they

job it is to check things and if they
come up with answers that nobody likes

come up with answers that nobody likes

come up with answers that nobody likes
they can still say them and and you have

they can still say them and and you have

they can still say them and and you have
to create these kind of protection

bubbles chairman yes ask him just a few

bubbles chairman yes ask him just a few
more questions

more questions

more questions
okay doctor if you are you planning to

okay doctor if you are you planning to

okay doctor if you are you planning to
publish these findings have you tried to

publish these findings have you tried to

publish these findings have you tried to
publish these findings in a journal no

publish these findings in a journal no

publish these findings in a journal no
and no they're

not as of now they are interesting and

not as of now they are interesting and
concerning but not they don't rise to

concerning but not they don't rise to

concerning but not they don't rise to
the level of a peer-reviewed

the level of a peer-reviewed

the level of a peer-reviewed
publication the most likely the best

publication the most likely the best

publication the most likely the best
possible outcome would be that I would

possible outcome would be that I would

possible outcome would be that I would
check a bunch of people find out it

check a bunch of people find out it

check a bunch of people find out it
never integrated and this is not a

never integrated and this is not a

never integrated and this is not a
problem and then it will never be

problem and then it will never be

problem and then it will never be
published because papers don't publish

published because papers don't publish

published because papers don't publish
negative results kind of the worst

negative results kind of the worst

negative results kind of the worst
outcome is I can check a bunch of people

outcome is I can check a bunch of people

outcome is I can check a bunch of people
and I find ow it integrated and it's

and I find ow it integrated and it's

and I find ow it integrated and it's
called these horrible things and yeah

called these horrible things and yeah

called these horrible things and yeah
then I'll get a paper and be

then I'll get a paper and be

then I'll get a paper and be
famous um but I'm hoping that that's not

famous um but I'm hoping that that's not

famous um but I'm hoping that that's not
the way it goes so you see how they're

the way it goes so you see how they're

the way it goes so you see how they're
in Academia for publication there are

in Academia for publication there are

in Academia for publication there are
all these perverse incentives in place

all these perverse incentives in place

all these perverse incentives in place
where the kind of thing you need to be

where the kind of thing you need to be

where the kind of thing you need to be
done

done

done
is is the kind of thing that does not

is is the kind of thing that does not

is is the kind of thing that does not
generate a publication you need a

generate a publication you need a

generate a publication you need a
regulatory body to check find no problem

regulatory body to check find no problem

regulatory body to check find no problem
and tell the public there's no problem

and tell the public there's no problem

and tell the public there's no problem
we checked and there ain't nothing there

we checked and there ain't nothing there

we checked and there ain't nothing there
that will never get published you know

that will never get published you know

that will never get published you know
or very sell it's it's hard to publish

or very sell it's it's hard to publish

or very sell it's it's hard to publish
negative results like that and that's

negative results like that and that's

negative results like that and that's
why academic science is not the best

why academic science is not the best

why academic science is not the best
place to do

place to do

place to do
it how long would it take to do what it

it how long would it take to do what it

it how long would it take to do what it
is you're talking about here about check

is you're talking about here about check

is you're talking about here about check
a bunch of vaccinated people I mean I

a bunch of vaccinated people I mean I

a bunch of vaccinated people I mean I
it's it's hard for me listening to all

it's it's hard for me listening to all

it's it's hard for me listening to all
this for the first time to to uh

this for the first time to to uh

this for the first time to to uh
calculate how alarmed you are and

calculate how alarmed you are and

calculate how alarmed you are and
whether in your personal opinion you

whether in your personal opinion you

whether in your personal opinion you
would hit the pause button on allowing

would hit the pause button on allowing

would hit the pause button on allowing
this new vaccine so to speak without

this new vaccine so to speak without

this new vaccine so to speak without
knowing

knowing

knowing
more how long's it take and and how

more how long's it take and and how

more how long's it take and and how
serious is it to to find out this

serious is it to to find out this

serious is it to to find out this
information before people keep taking

information before people keep taking

information before people keep taking
these

these

these
vaccines it it takes about 3 hours to

vaccines it it takes about 3 hours to

vaccines it it takes about 3 hours to
check a vial a vaccine to see if it's

check a vial a vaccine to see if it's

check a vial a vaccine to see if it's
got this in

got this in

got this in
it about a hundred bucks of

reagents and I'm not going to get it

reagents and I'm not going to get it
unless I find a a vial that I can check

unless I find a a vial that I can check

unless I find a a vial that I can check
ahead of time and make sure it's not

ahead of time and make sure it's not

ahead of time and make sure it's not
there and if it is there I'll take a

there and if it is there I'll take a

there and if it is there I'll take a
pass on

it thank you doc Dr bof thank you so

it thank you doc Dr bof thank you so
much for being here and I would like to

much for being here and I would like to

much for being here and I would like to
say that um I would sort of in the world

say that um I would sort of in the world

say that um I would sort of in the world
of coid that we've been dealing with

of coid that we've been dealing with

of coid that we've been dealing with
with all the lies and coverups and

with all the lies and coverups and

with all the lies and coverups and
misinformation out there I would almost

misinformation out there I would almost

misinformation out there I would almost
call you a

call you a

call you a
whistleblower um and Dr lead I think we

whistleblower um and Dr lead I think we

whistleblower um and Dr lead I think we
may have found our state's Surgeon

may have found our state's Surgeon

may have found our state's Surgeon
General here

General here

General here
no that's not my thank thank you for

no that's not my thank thank you for

no that's not my thank thank you for
your confidence in me but that's be

your confidence in me but that's be

your confidence in me but that's be
would like to say is as we wrap it up is

would like to say is as we wrap it up is

would like to say is as we wrap it up is
I do appreciate you um I understand um

I do appreciate you um I understand um

I do appreciate you um I understand um
where you are

where you are

where you are
employed and um you and I have had a

employed and um you and I have had a

employed and um you and I have had a
little conversation about how wonderful

little conversation about how wonderful

little conversation about how wonderful
tenure is and things like that but if

tenure is and things like that but if

tenure is and things like that but if
you experience any retribution or any

you experience any retribution or any

you experience any retribution or any
harassment for coming forward at this

harassment for coming forward at this

harassment for coming forward at this
hearing and testifying

hearing and testifying

hearing and testifying
would you please let us know because I

would you please let us know because I

would you please let us know because I
can assure you you will have an army

can assure you you will have an army

can assure you you will have an army
behind you to help with whatever may

behind you to help with whatever may

behind you to help with whatever may
come your way thank you very

much rep Morgan has one more question

much rep Morgan has one more question
and we've got to move along Dr jansy is

and we've got to move along Dr jansy is

and we've got to move along Dr jansy is
I think under a time constraint I should

I think under a time constraint I should

I think under a time constraint I should
have asked this so you didn't uh have

have asked this so you didn't uh have

have asked this so you didn't uh have
you haven't interacted with DEC about

you haven't interacted with DEC about

you haven't interacted with DEC about
this specific okay I was just wondering

this specific okay I was just wondering

this specific okay I was just wondering
if you had any I interacted with some a

if you had any I interacted with some a

if you had any I interacted with some a
couple of people at the FDA I just sent

couple of people at the FDA I just sent

couple of people at the FDA I just sent
them emails and said hey you want you

them emails and said hey you want you

them emails and said hey you want you
should look in this okay okay thank you

should look in this okay okay thank you

should look in this okay okay thank you
so much um next is Dr jansy Lindsay