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Now, listen to this one.
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"The way scum like you helps
people like David Koresh,
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I hope all your children die of, uh..."
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- sheesh.
- Okay. Let's stay focused here, can we?
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Why do you insist on reading that crap?
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In case one of these maniacs
puts a bullet in my head
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like they all say they're gonna.
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Give the cops a good place to start.
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Yeah, I'm not sure they'd try too hard
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to solve a case of the
cop-killer defenders.
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- Oh, yeah.
- That's a dark thought.
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- Well...
- Shouldn't we be getting
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- security or something?
- Don't worry.
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I'll protect you from those
big mean letter writers.
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See, guys? Nothing to worry about.
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Jocelyn's got our backs.
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Let's get back to it.
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Wait.
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- Fan mail?
- What do you think...
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- Really?
- Yeah.
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- ... about that?
- "Dear fine sirs...
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I have been very..." all caps,
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"... interested in your case
defending those Davidians.
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There are lots of people like
me watching to see how this goes.
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Thank you for being such good patriots."
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Well, this is nice, isn't it?
27
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Let's see. I'm going bankrupt.
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My wife who I haven't
seen in over a month
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just filed for divorce.
I'm living in squalor.
30
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I'm getting about three
hours of sleep every night
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to fight a losing case
for a bunch of people
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who don't even like me,
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but when I hear the
praises of adoring fans
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like Tim McVeigh,
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makes it all worth it, doesn't it?
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Now, can we get back to work?
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- Synced and corrected by naFraC -
- www.addic7ed.com -
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You say you love America,
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but would you die for it?
40
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Would you kill for it?
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I mean, some things
are worth fighting for.
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I wanna talk today
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about making ourselves ready,
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emotionally steeling ourselves
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for the coming war.
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The war against White America!
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I want you to picture
what that's gonna be like.
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Picture...
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the tanks rolling up our drives,
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adrenaline coursing through your body.
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I want you to picture yourself
with your gun in your hand
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and your kids behind you.
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And I want you to picture that again,
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and again, and again
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until it become real to you.
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So that when the time comes,
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you won't hesitate to pull the trigger.
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Because having the
nerve to pull the trigger
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is precisely what...
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His granddaddy founded the Nazi party.
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- No shit.
- ... protect our home...
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I'd steer clear of 'em.
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He's not the kind of
guy you wanna mess with.
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00:04:04,837 --> 00:04:08,394
... to protect our
God-fearing way of life!
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We've heard it said that
David Koresh believed
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he was preparing,
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planning for a great war.
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Did he ever express those beliefs
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when he purchased these guns from you?
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I didn't deal with David,
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but I was aware of the philosophy, yes.
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Who did you deal with?
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I dealt almost exclusively
with Paul Fatta.
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And you're referring to defendant Fatta
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seated behind counsel over here?
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Yes.
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Did Mr. Fatta seem
knowledgeable when it came to guns?
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Inside and out.
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And how many guns did Paul Fatta
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purchase from you?
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About $90,000 worth.
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Exhibit 103.
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Can you tell us what this is
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and where you found it?
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We found it in the compound,
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in the chapel.
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And what type of weapon is this?
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It's an M-16 rifle.
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I carried one in Vietnam
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for 11 months and seven days.
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Because it's a military weapon
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built for war?
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That's right.
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Now, Ranger Boak,
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you've testified about
finding a lot of evidence here.
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Tell me this.
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Did you also happen to locate
the building's front doors?
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No, sir.
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Help me out here.
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You were able to find this BIC lighter
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but not two seven-foot doors?
102
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No.
103
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Why not?
104
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It must've burned with
the rest of the building.
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Burned? Both front doors?
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That's right.
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Uh-hmm.
108
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But in the months
leading up to the ATF's arrival
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at Mount Carmel,
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what did you observe
regarding their inventory?
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We observed a dramatic increase
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in their stockpile of weapons.
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So, they were buying guns
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but not selling them?
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Correct.
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I only have two questions.
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In your years of
observation and research,
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did the Davidians ever
obtain a weapon illegally?
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Not to my knowledge.
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Okay.
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And just one more thing.
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In your examination of all the evidence,
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I don't reckon you saw those
pesky missing front doors, did you?
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Lieutenant Caldwell,
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could you tell us what the Mag Bag was?
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The Mag Bag was a small tract of land
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located on Farm Road outside of Waco.
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It was where Mr. Koresh and
Mr. Fatta received shipments
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of weapons, ammunition, gun parts.
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And had you had
any previous interactions
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with David Koresh or Paul Fatta
that would lead you to believe...
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- Objection! Objection! Approach?
- ...that was the possibility?
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Judge, this is a transparent attempt
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to bring up my client,
Paul Fatta's past,
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which is entirely out of bounds.
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It's germane to this case, Your Honor.
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- Okay.
- Mr. Fatta and Mr. Koresh
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both have a previous charge
of conspiracy to commit murder.
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And the fact that he and his compatriots
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tried to kill a man in cold blood
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absolutely informed the ATF's
decision-making process...
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You mean your decision-making process.
143
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... when they decided to stage a
dynamic entry into Mount Carmel.
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Paul Fatta wasn't even there
when the tanks rolled in.
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He wasn't there a single
day of the standoff.
146
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- It doesn't matter if he wasn't there.
- And if Mr. Johnston wants to prove
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that there was some conspiracy,
he should do it with relevant evidence
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and not unfounded
accusations from the '80s.
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- Mr. Fatta is a defendant in this...
- Stop.
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I have already ruled
on this, Mr. Johnston.
151
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Yes, Your Honor.
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The defendant's previous charges
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are not in the purview of this case.
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- Objection sustained.
- Thank you. Thank you.
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You can't keep all your
skeletons in the closet.
156
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Neither can you, fucko.
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No further questions.
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Your witness.
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I only have one question.
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You wouldn't happen to
know where the front doors
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from Mount Carmel ended up, would you?
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No? Okay.
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Can I do for you, George?
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We're gonna settle this now.
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Settle what?
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Who's the real prophet.
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We're gonna see who can bring her back.
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Bring who back?
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My mother.
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Your lies put her in the ground.
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I just took her out.
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What are you talking about, George?
What do you mean you took her out?
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I dug her up.
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You dug up Lois's body?
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Why would you do that?
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Whoever can raise my
momma from the dead...
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will be the next true
prophet of Mount Carmel.
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Sheriff, what do you
mean you can't do anything?
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George dug up his own dead mother!
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- It's an abomination!
- Look, Vernon.
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00:09:50,211 --> 00:09:52,495
I drove by Mount
Carmel after you called.
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I didn't see any dug-up bodies.
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George told me himself!
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Yeah, George says a lot of crazy things.
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Unless you have actual evidence
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00:10:00,670 --> 00:10:02,838
of corpse abuse or some other crime,
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there's not much that I can do.
188
00:10:05,445 --> 00:10:07,176
Maybe the best course
of action is for y'all
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to stay away from Mount Carmel.
190
00:10:08,729 --> 00:10:10,846
Just leave George Roden be.
191
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He's the one that called me!
192
00:10:13,945 --> 00:10:15,974
I think he's fixing to come after us.
193
00:10:15,985 --> 00:10:17,179
Well, then you might wanna think
194
00:10:17,190 --> 00:10:19,458
about getting something
to defend yourself with.
195
00:10:25,253 --> 00:10:27,195
Mr. Cogdell. Mr. Cogdell.
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00:10:27,206 --> 00:10:30,137
Do you think it's the doors
that prove who shot first?
197
00:10:30,148 --> 00:10:31,608
I do.
198
00:10:32,136 --> 00:10:34,912
But, but those doors are also a symbol
199
00:10:34,922 --> 00:10:36,580
for all the questionable behavior
200
00:10:36,590 --> 00:10:38,718
the Federal government
has taken part in.
201
00:10:39,994 --> 00:10:41,685
Listen, listen.
202
00:10:42,096 --> 00:10:44,880
The ATF shows up with more cameras
203
00:10:44,890 --> 00:10:48,384
than a Hollywood blockbuster,
but there's no footage.
204
00:10:48,394 --> 00:10:51,554
They lose power at the morgue
so no autopsies can be done.
205
00:10:51,564 --> 00:10:53,889
Christ, they bulldozed
the whole crime scene
206
00:10:53,899 --> 00:10:56,068
and then they bleached
it for good measure.
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00:10:56,877 --> 00:10:59,437
This is what happens when
you have the architect
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00:10:59,447 --> 00:11:00,887
of a government raid,
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00:11:00,898 --> 00:11:02,995
the man who demanded the ATF
210
00:11:03,006 --> 00:11:06,385
go in with a hard entry, also
prosecuting the same case.
211
00:11:06,396 --> 00:11:07,519
You saying there's some sort
212
00:11:07,530 --> 00:11:09,323
- of government cover-up?
- No, I'm just saying
213
00:11:09,334 --> 00:11:11,906
that Bill Johnston has a vested interest
214
00:11:11,917 --> 00:11:14,869
in convicting these people,
that's for damn sure.
215
00:11:14,879 --> 00:11:18,247
I heard you with the
press saying I'm corrupt.
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00:11:18,257 --> 00:11:19,500
That's way out of bounds.
217
00:11:19,511 --> 00:11:21,583
It's called zealously
defending my clients.
218
00:11:21,594 --> 00:11:24,086
You can't win with the facts,
so you're trying to turn this thing
219
00:11:24,096 --> 00:11:25,456
into a government cover-up,
220
00:11:25,467 --> 00:11:27,630
and you're dragging my name
through the mud to do it,
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00:11:27,641 --> 00:11:29,550
like I had some ulterior motive.
222
00:11:29,560 --> 00:11:31,093
I sanctioned that raid
223
00:11:31,103 --> 00:11:33,596
because I was trying to save those kids.
224
00:11:33,606 --> 00:11:36,609
Save those kids with a forcible entry?
225
00:11:37,530 --> 00:11:39,727
I'm doing my job the
best way I know how.
226
00:11:39,737 --> 00:11:41,604
Now, you don't agree with it? Fine.
227
00:11:41,614 --> 00:11:43,537
But let's fight fair, Dan.
228
00:11:43,548 --> 00:11:45,274
You want me to fight fair?
229
00:11:45,284 --> 00:11:46,984
You've got the public, the press,
230
00:11:46,994 --> 00:11:49,153
and the United States
government behind you.
231
00:11:49,163 --> 00:11:51,499
And all I've got is a
booth at the Polo Lounge.
232
00:11:52,379 --> 00:11:55,618
I'm not gonna play with
one-hand tied behind my back.
233
00:11:55,628 --> 00:11:59,173
You want me to shut
up? Find those doors.
234
00:12:24,144 --> 00:12:26,023
Listen, when the prosecutor
starts picking fights
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00:12:26,033 --> 00:12:27,981
with you in the hall, it means
you're doing something right.
236
00:12:27,992 --> 00:12:29,352
Hmm.
237
00:12:29,655 --> 00:12:31,647
Yeah, yeah, except...
238
00:12:31,744 --> 00:12:33,193
Except what?
239
00:12:33,290 --> 00:12:35,200
You've been watching the forewoman?
240
00:12:35,211 --> 00:12:36,296
Um...
241
00:12:37,749 --> 00:12:39,727
juror number six?
242
00:12:40,343 --> 00:12:42,210
She's the poison juror.
243
00:12:42,341 --> 00:12:44,834
I can just tell. She's
itching to say the G-word.
244
00:12:44,974 --> 00:12:47,169
Yeah. Well, that's why we have 11 more
245
00:12:47,179 --> 00:12:48,722
because all you need is one.
246
00:12:49,824 --> 00:12:51,973
Jocelyn, you'd acquit
our clients, wouldn't you?
247
00:12:51,984 --> 00:12:53,551
Hell no.
248
00:12:53,561 --> 00:12:55,010
They're guilty as shit.
249
00:12:55,020 --> 00:12:58,518
- Just like their defense lawyers.
- Ow. Ow.
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00:12:58,622 --> 00:13:00,739
Number six, she's the top dog.
251
00:13:00,750 --> 00:13:02,517
- She could sway the rest.
- Listen, don't...
252
00:13:02,528 --> 00:13:04,979
don't worry about number
six. I'm gonna focus on her.
253
00:13:04,989 --> 00:13:06,355
I'm gonna make her
feel like the prettiest,
254
00:13:06,365 --> 00:13:07,857
most special juror in the world.
255
00:13:08,936 --> 00:13:10,595
Ask Jocelyn if I can't sweet-talk
256
00:13:10,606 --> 00:13:11,888
the legs off a chair.
257
00:13:11,899 --> 00:13:13,486
Dan, if you were half as charming
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00:13:13,497 --> 00:13:14,579
as you think you are,
259
00:13:14,590 --> 00:13:16,031
you'd be the best lawyer on earth.
260
00:13:16,041 --> 00:13:17,575
Ooh.
261
00:13:17,802 --> 00:13:18,922
Is that flirting? Is she flirting?
262
00:13:18,933 --> 00:13:21,348
- No, that is not...
- Jesus, Gordon!
263
00:13:21,359 --> 00:13:23,899
God. God! I gotta put a bell on you.
264
00:13:24,216 --> 00:13:25,875
Think I may have an answer for you
265
00:13:25,885 --> 00:13:27,626
on those front doors.
266
00:13:28,892 --> 00:13:32,361
Whoa. Is this Mount Carmel?
267
00:13:33,392 --> 00:13:35,384
What is this, Gordon?
What am I looking at here?
268
00:13:35,394 --> 00:13:38,095
This was taken at 3:55 p.m.,
269
00:13:38,105 --> 00:13:40,458
a couple hours after the fire started.
270
00:13:40,671 --> 00:13:44,063
And these are FBI agents
271
00:13:44,074 --> 00:13:46,609
loading something into a truck.
272
00:13:46,620 --> 00:13:48,563
Something about the
size and shape of a door.
273
00:13:48,574 --> 00:13:50,566
Yeah, which was so daggone important
274
00:13:50,576 --> 00:13:54,038
that they had to grab it
while the building was still smoldering.
275
00:13:56,550 --> 00:13:58,547
You crazy son of a bitch.
276
00:13:58,558 --> 00:14:00,185
- This is it.
- That's it.
277
00:14:00,490 --> 00:14:03,201
You think these are the front doors
being loaded into this truck?
278
00:14:03,212 --> 00:14:04,538
I do, Your Honor.
279
00:14:04,548 --> 00:14:06,373
This is absurd.
280
00:14:06,383 --> 00:14:07,795
That's not real evidence.
281
00:14:07,806 --> 00:14:09,672
You can hardly see
anything in that photo.
282
00:14:09,803 --> 00:14:12,033
I could say they're loading
Bigfoot into the back of that truck.
283
00:14:12,044 --> 00:14:13,411
- It's pretty blurry, Counselor.
- Well,
284
00:14:13,422 --> 00:14:15,038
uh, either way, the fact that the FBI
285
00:14:15,049 --> 00:14:16,882
was loading anything
into the back of a U-Haul
286
00:14:16,893 --> 00:14:18,551
while a building is still smoldering
287
00:14:18,562 --> 00:14:20,596
is information the
jury deserves to know.
288
00:14:20,606 --> 00:14:23,599
Your Honor, the defense
has obtained a blurry photo
289
00:14:23,609 --> 00:14:26,268
from a conspiracy theorist who
got it from who-knows-where.
290
00:14:26,278 --> 00:14:27,937
How do you know where I got it from?
291
00:14:27,947 --> 00:14:29,855
It wasn't in discovery.
292
00:14:30,343 --> 00:14:32,431
Are you spying on me?
293
00:14:32,918 --> 00:14:34,485
- Judge?
- Cogdell,
294
00:14:34,495 --> 00:14:35,778
get ahold of yourself.
295
00:14:35,881 --> 00:14:37,199
Besides,
296
00:14:37,358 --> 00:14:39,322
we have our own evidence
we'd like to submit
297
00:14:39,333 --> 00:14:41,408
which will address
these ridiculous claims.
298
00:14:41,419 --> 00:14:42,493
And what's that?
299
00:14:42,504 --> 00:14:44,160
We found the door, Your Honor.
300
00:14:44,171 --> 00:14:45,444
The door? What door?
301
00:14:45,455 --> 00:14:46,668
- What door?
- Yeah.
302
00:14:46,679 --> 00:14:48,238
The one you've been
asking about non-stop.
303
00:14:48,249 --> 00:14:51,200
The one you claim is gonna flip
this whole case on its head.
304
00:14:51,595 --> 00:14:53,361
We're bringing it in.
305
00:14:53,572 --> 00:14:55,115
Should put your concerns to rest.
306
00:15:05,693 --> 00:15:07,643
May it please the Court,
307
00:15:07,653 --> 00:15:09,103
the government would like to offer.
308
00:15:09,113 --> 00:15:12,157
Government Exhibit Number 728.
309
00:15:13,200 --> 00:15:15,192
Jesus, what a showman.
310
00:15:15,202 --> 00:15:17,194
You hear what he said earlier?
311
00:15:17,204 --> 00:15:20,322
That a conspiracy
theorist gave us the photo?
312
00:15:20,484 --> 00:15:22,658
Do you think they've got
the Polo Lounge bugged?
313
00:15:22,668 --> 00:15:24,994
We found the door in Sector F,
314
00:15:25,101 --> 00:15:28,163
approximately 40 feet
away from the building.
315
00:15:28,173 --> 00:15:30,499
And did you realize
it was the front door?
316
00:15:30,605 --> 00:15:32,986
No, sir. It was located so far away
317
00:15:32,997 --> 00:15:34,175
from the front of the building
318
00:15:34,186 --> 00:15:37,179
we classified it as a
piece of scrap metal.
319
00:15:37,324 --> 00:15:39,637
And when did you come to realize
320
00:15:39,648 --> 00:15:41,218
that it was the front door?
321
00:15:41,430 --> 00:15:43,846
When we re-canvassed the
evidence warehouse yesterday
322
00:15:43,856 --> 00:15:46,140
at your urging and found it.
323
00:15:46,150 --> 00:15:48,865
Now, does this door
324
00:15:49,306 --> 00:15:51,811
appear to have any bullet holes in it?
325
00:15:52,008 --> 00:15:53,343
No, sir.
326
00:15:53,602 --> 00:15:55,767
So there is nothing here
327
00:15:55,981 --> 00:15:59,104
that contradicts any of
the earlier ATF testimony
328
00:15:59,115 --> 00:16:01,864
stating that the Davidians fired first?
329
00:16:01,874 --> 00:16:03,122
No.
330
00:16:04,440 --> 00:16:06,808
Were you aware that the cult compound
331
00:16:06,819 --> 00:16:08,352
- originally had two front doors?
- Yes.
332
00:16:08,363 --> 00:16:09,980
We re-canvassed for that one as well,
333
00:16:09,991 --> 00:16:12,994
but didn't find it,
which wasn't surprising.
334
00:16:14,112 --> 00:16:15,280
Why not?
335
00:16:16,122 --> 00:16:17,671
It was still attached to the building.
336
00:16:17,681 --> 00:16:19,813
It melted when the building burned.
337
00:16:19,824 --> 00:16:21,315
Objection. Speculation.
338
00:16:21,326 --> 00:16:22,884
The witness has no first-hand knowledge
339
00:16:22,895 --> 00:16:24,887
that the other door melted.
340
00:16:24,897 --> 00:16:26,505
Uh-hmm. Sustained.
341
00:16:27,103 --> 00:16:28,136
All right.
342
00:16:28,746 --> 00:16:29,954
Ranger Boak,
343
00:16:29,965 --> 00:16:33,083
why do you believe the
other front door melted?
344
00:16:33,307 --> 00:16:36,565
Because the doors were
aluminum with foam cores.
345
00:16:36,575 --> 00:16:38,025
And it was subjected to temperatures
346
00:16:38,035 --> 00:16:40,235
in excess of 1300 degrees Fahrenheit
347
00:16:40,245 --> 00:16:41,779
during the fire.
348
00:16:41,790 --> 00:16:43,833
Aluminum melts at 1200.
349
00:16:44,208 --> 00:16:46,794
And why didn't this door melt?
350
00:16:47,907 --> 00:16:49,468
You see those marks?
351
00:16:50,671 --> 00:16:52,589
They're from the treads of a tank.
352
00:16:53,133 --> 00:16:55,626
And when the tanks penetrated
the compound entryway,
353
00:16:55,636 --> 00:16:57,753
we believe the door
got caught in the treads
354
00:16:57,763 --> 00:17:00,148
and was dragged to the
place that we found it.
355
00:17:00,159 --> 00:17:01,528
Well clear of the fire.
356
00:17:01,539 --> 00:17:02,800
Could you go get something for me?
357
00:17:02,811 --> 00:17:04,720
Now, Ranger Boak,
358
00:17:04,731 --> 00:17:09,068
you didn't realize that
this was a door initially.
359
00:17:10,317 --> 00:17:13,102
Is that common, to
miscategorize evidence?
360
00:17:13,185 --> 00:17:15,836
It's not common but it happens,
361
00:17:16,115 --> 00:17:18,985
particularly if there's a
large volume of evidence.
362
00:17:18,996 --> 00:17:23,445
Final question, were
you and the Texas Rangers
363
00:17:23,455 --> 00:17:25,781
part of a massive conspiracy
364
00:17:25,791 --> 00:17:29,294
headed by the Federal
government to hide this door?
365
00:17:32,158 --> 00:17:33,910
I reckon not, sir.
366
00:17:37,017 --> 00:17:38,956
No further questions.
367
00:17:40,475 --> 00:17:42,713
Sheriff said we needed proof of, um,
368
00:17:43,424 --> 00:17:45,065
what'd he call it?
369
00:17:45,812 --> 00:17:47,553
- Corpse abuse.
- Corpse abuse
370
00:17:47,564 --> 00:17:49,765
in order to do anything about it.
371
00:17:49,776 --> 00:17:51,071
Well...
372
00:17:51,750 --> 00:17:53,543
what if we gave him some proof?
373
00:17:55,255 --> 00:17:56,548
Like a picture?
374
00:17:57,847 --> 00:18:01,600
We can't just go to Mount
Carmel and snap a picture.
375
00:18:02,428 --> 00:18:04,211
George carries around an Uzi.
376
00:18:04,222 --> 00:18:05,505
He's...
377
00:18:05,516 --> 00:18:06,950
He's crazy.
378
00:18:07,884 --> 00:18:09,375
I mean, you heard the Sheriff,
379
00:18:09,386 --> 00:18:11,430
he said we might need to arm ourselves.
380
00:18:12,867 --> 00:18:14,317
So what if we did?
381
00:18:14,334 --> 00:18:15,392
All right.
382
00:18:15,403 --> 00:18:17,729
We'll take, uh, five of the Rugers
383
00:18:18,010 --> 00:18:20,966
and, uh, throw in some
of them camo suits too.
384
00:18:21,337 --> 00:18:22,421
You got it.
385
00:18:39,094 --> 00:18:40,178
We're here.
386
00:18:47,525 --> 00:18:49,175
All right.
387
00:18:49,942 --> 00:18:52,434
Everybody stay quiet and stay close.
388
00:18:52,445 --> 00:18:54,896
We're just getting a few
photos and then getting out.
389
00:18:54,907 --> 00:18:56,065
All right?
390
00:19:04,150 --> 00:19:05,907
Okay. Come on.
391
00:20:02,447 --> 00:20:03,772
Vernon!
392
00:20:05,888 --> 00:20:07,067
No. No, George.
393
00:20:11,123 --> 00:20:12,614
Go, go, go!
394
00:20:12,624 --> 00:20:14,449
You're trespassing!
395
00:20:14,459 --> 00:20:16,118
Sneaking around my property!
396
00:20:55,348 --> 00:20:56,581
George, no!
397
00:20:56,592 --> 00:20:57,825
Ah!
398
00:20:57,836 --> 00:20:59,671
Oh! Oh!
399
00:21:02,623 --> 00:21:03,724
You all right?
400
00:21:03,735 --> 00:21:05,393
Guess you got to learn how to shoot.
401
00:21:05,656 --> 00:21:08,301
Won't be the last time we
got to defend ourselves.
402
00:21:20,419 --> 00:21:21,963
Beast is coming.
403
00:21:28,450 --> 00:21:29,868
Drop your weapons!
404
00:21:30,743 --> 00:21:32,568
On the ground!
405
00:21:46,047 --> 00:21:49,133
ATF agents testified
406
00:21:49,654 --> 00:21:52,188
that the Davidians shot first
407
00:21:52,265 --> 00:21:54,549
and that those shots...
408
00:21:54,559 --> 00:21:56,867
went through the front doors.
409
00:21:58,105 --> 00:22:00,889
But the Davidians have
stated that it was the ATF
410
00:22:00,899 --> 00:22:03,944
who shot at them
through those same doors.
411
00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:08,522
But this door has no
bullet holes in it, correct?
412
00:22:08,532 --> 00:22:10,072
Not that I see.
413
00:22:10,083 --> 00:22:12,400
So it must be the other
door, the still-missing door,
414
00:22:12,411 --> 00:22:14,403
that was shot through and
it would be the other door
415
00:22:14,413 --> 00:22:18,083
that would prove which
side was telling the truth.
416
00:22:18,959 --> 00:22:21,211
Yes. It... it appears that way.
417
00:22:23,094 --> 00:22:25,711
Well, that's bad luck, isn't it?
418
00:22:28,761 --> 00:22:30,388
Uh, a moment, Judge.
419
00:22:34,006 --> 00:22:36,810
- Oh... shit.
- That's all I could find.
420
00:22:37,477 --> 00:22:39,827
So, you believe the other door melted.
421
00:22:40,105 --> 00:22:42,441
- Yes.
- Because it was made of aluminum.
422
00:22:43,933 --> 00:22:45,299
That's what I said.
423
00:22:45,310 --> 00:22:48,270
And those guns right there didn't melt
424
00:22:48,280 --> 00:22:51,440
because they're made of steel,
which has a much higher melting point?
425
00:22:51,450 --> 00:22:53,221
Yes.
426
00:22:53,885 --> 00:22:56,169
So if the other door was made of steel,
427
00:22:56,246 --> 00:22:57,747
would it have melted?
428
00:22:58,850 --> 00:23:00,185
No.
429
00:23:01,220 --> 00:23:04,181
Yet that door seems awfully heavy.
430
00:23:05,175 --> 00:23:07,721
Well, I mean, my daddy was a contractor.
431
00:23:07,732 --> 00:23:09,752
Uh, I'd help him demo houses.
432
00:23:09,763 --> 00:23:11,499
We pulled down a lot of aluminum doors.
433
00:23:11,510 --> 00:23:13,669
I could carry one under one arm.
434
00:23:13,732 --> 00:23:16,652
Sure didn't take three
men to pick one up.
435
00:23:17,684 --> 00:23:19,468
I... I couldn't speak to that.
436
00:23:19,478 --> 00:23:22,439
Well, then let me
ask you this, Ranger Boak.
437
00:23:24,483 --> 00:23:25,932
Is aluminum magnetic?
438
00:23:25,942 --> 00:23:27,180
Objection!
439
00:23:27,191 --> 00:23:30,810
Ranger Boak is a lay
witness, not a metals expert.
440
00:23:31,127 --> 00:23:32,692
I'll allow it.
441
00:23:33,466 --> 00:23:35,583
No, it's not magnetic.
442
00:23:35,907 --> 00:23:37,986
How about steel?
443
00:23:37,996 --> 00:23:39,841
I believe so, yes.
444
00:23:39,852 --> 00:23:41,677
So this refrigerator magnet,
445
00:23:41,933 --> 00:23:43,935
would it stick to aluminum?
446
00:23:45,358 --> 00:23:47,767
Um, no, it... it wouldn't.
447
00:24:17,656 --> 00:24:20,325
Do you still believe this
door is made of aluminum?
448
00:24:25,239 --> 00:24:28,659
No, sir, it looks to be made of steel.
449
00:24:29,323 --> 00:24:31,039
And if this door is made of steel,
450
00:24:31,049 --> 00:24:33,041
wouldn't it stand to
reason that the other door
451
00:24:33,051 --> 00:24:36,680
it was attached to
was also made of steel?
452
00:24:41,072 --> 00:24:43,574
The witness needs to respond verbally.
453
00:24:45,865 --> 00:24:46,991
Yes.
454
00:24:48,061 --> 00:24:50,011
So then, Ranger Boak,
455
00:24:50,022 --> 00:24:51,732
I'll ask you again...
456
00:24:53,419 --> 00:24:55,380
where is the missing door?
457
00:25:31,617 --> 00:25:32,691
Oh, hey.
458
00:25:32,702 --> 00:25:34,736
Do you... do you need the phone?
459
00:25:34,852 --> 00:25:36,770
Because I can wait, it's not urgent.
460
00:25:36,781 --> 00:25:38,074
Hello?
461
00:25:40,478 --> 00:25:42,062
No, go ahead.
462
00:25:43,268 --> 00:25:46,178
Hello? Hello?
463
00:25:46,335 --> 00:25:47,743
Hey, Daddy.
464
00:25:48,009 --> 00:25:49,284
Oh, Carol.
465
00:25:49,294 --> 00:25:50,670
Oh, it's so good to hear from you.
466
00:25:50,681 --> 00:25:52,840
- Are you safe?
- Yeah, yeah.
467
00:25:52,851 --> 00:25:54,349
I, I just wanted you to know that,
468
00:25:54,360 --> 00:25:56,457
that I made it to my
friend's place okay.
469
00:25:56,468 --> 00:25:58,803
You know, I didn't... I
didn't want you to worry.
470
00:25:59,097 --> 00:26:01,721
Yeah, that's good to hear
because I was worried.
471
00:26:02,254 --> 00:26:04,214
Your mom and I were both worried.
472
00:26:05,651 --> 00:26:07,476
When do you think we'll see you again?
473
00:26:07,613 --> 00:26:09,355
Uh, it's hard to say, you know,
474
00:26:09,366 --> 00:26:11,233
but I... but I should go
because there's someone
475
00:26:11,244 --> 00:26:12,860
waiting on the phone, so I, you know,
476
00:26:12,871 --> 00:26:14,697
I just didn't want you
to think I got lost.
477
00:26:14,778 --> 00:26:16,519
Well, hey, thanks for calling.
478
00:26:16,529 --> 00:26:17,812
You called...
479
00:26:17,822 --> 00:26:19,824
Hmm.
480
00:26:22,910 --> 00:26:25,027
Ah, that was Carol.
481
00:26:25,038 --> 00:26:26,696
She's still in play.
482
00:26:26,746 --> 00:26:30,137
You sure she's just not
looking to get more candy money?
483
00:26:32,458 --> 00:26:33,800
What's your name?
484
00:26:33,811 --> 00:26:35,029
I don't know you.
485
00:26:35,040 --> 00:26:38,118
Woo. Good girl. You taught her well.
486
00:26:38,129 --> 00:26:41,257
Okay, kiddo, we're
gonna get you to daycare.
487
00:26:43,997 --> 00:26:47,657
Government has charged
my clients with conspiracy.
488
00:26:47,913 --> 00:26:51,019
They claim that Paul
Fatta was a blood merchant,
489
00:26:51,523 --> 00:26:54,140
the architect of some violent plot
490
00:26:54,150 --> 00:26:56,495
when he was just a man
trying to run a business.
491
00:26:57,362 --> 00:26:59,854
But after what we saw today
I can't help but wonder
492
00:26:59,864 --> 00:27:03,201
if it's the government who shouldn't
be answering for their actions,
493
00:27:04,235 --> 00:27:06,714
if it's the government
who is conspiring against
494
00:27:06,725 --> 00:27:09,656
my clients, whose
only crime was leading
495
00:27:09,666 --> 00:27:12,335
a life the government
didn't agree with.
496
00:27:14,600 --> 00:27:18,205
And now that same government
refuses to take responsibility
497
00:27:18,216 --> 00:27:20,208
for its actions, and
in fact is willing to do
498
00:27:20,218 --> 00:27:22,777
whatever it takes to cover it up,
499
00:27:23,012 --> 00:27:26,381
even if it means
hurting innocent people.
500
00:27:26,886 --> 00:27:30,218
But that malfeasance, that arrogance
501
00:27:30,228 --> 00:27:32,297
has dangerous consequences
502
00:27:32,939 --> 00:27:34,182
for my clients
503
00:27:34,193 --> 00:27:36,111
and for the rest of this country.
504
00:27:36,884 --> 00:27:38,183
Lori Rae?
505
00:27:38,307 --> 00:27:40,633
- You're on the Waco jury, right?
- What?
506
00:27:40,743 --> 00:27:43,117
No, I don't wanna talk.
507
00:27:44,177 --> 00:27:45,960
The Constitution of the United States
508
00:27:45,971 --> 00:27:47,681
gives jurors great powers.
509
00:27:49,242 --> 00:27:51,284
I'm here to inform you of your choices.
510
00:27:56,461 --> 00:27:58,245
Please, leave!
511
00:27:58,256 --> 00:27:59,882
Please!
512
00:28:04,543 --> 00:28:06,091
I'm calling the police!
513
00:28:06,102 --> 00:28:08,345
You can make the right choice.
514
00:28:08,356 --> 00:28:10,139
Please!
515
00:28:35,219 --> 00:28:38,257
Before we get started,
I wanna make you all aware of something,
516
00:28:38,268 --> 00:28:40,287
five of our jurors had letters delivered
517
00:28:40,298 --> 00:28:43,762
to their homes this weekend
by a group called FIJA,
518
00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:46,927
the Fully Informed Jury Association.
519
00:28:47,416 --> 00:28:48,878
Pamphlets claim
520
00:28:48,889 --> 00:28:50,923
the rules of the court
don't apply to the jury
521
00:28:50,934 --> 00:28:53,505
and they can make up
whatever verdict they see fit.
522
00:28:53,516 --> 00:28:55,214
- To the jurors' homes?
- Yes.
523
00:28:55,225 --> 00:28:57,931
One of the jurors, juror number six,
524
00:28:57,941 --> 00:28:59,754
said she was practically accosted.
525
00:28:59,765 --> 00:29:01,892
She's pretty shaken up about it.
526
00:29:04,864 --> 00:29:07,252
Any of you all familiar with this group?
527
00:29:07,659 --> 00:29:10,081
- Are you asking us, Your Honor?
- I'm asking everyone.
528
00:29:10,092 --> 00:29:11,917
It just seems like the implication
529
00:29:11,928 --> 00:29:14,686
is that the defense
might benefit from this.
530
00:29:14,697 --> 00:29:16,146
I think you're reading into my question.
531
00:29:16,157 --> 00:29:18,024
I'm not implying anything, counselor.
532
00:29:18,035 --> 00:29:21,328
I'm just concerned that
if-if the jury thinks
533
00:29:21,339 --> 00:29:22,630
these people are aligned with...
534
00:29:22,641 --> 00:29:24,498
I will tell the jury
they have nothing to do
535
00:29:24,509 --> 00:29:26,167
with anyone involved in the trial.
536
00:29:26,177 --> 00:29:28,044
That would be much
appreciated. Thank you.
537
00:29:28,054 --> 00:29:30,797
So long as they believe
they can remain impartial.
538
00:29:30,807 --> 00:29:33,094
- Let's get started.
- Thank you.
539
00:29:48,587 --> 00:29:49,995
Your Honor, the government calls
540
00:29:50,006 --> 00:29:52,050
Kathy Schroeder to the stand.
541
00:29:59,076 --> 00:30:01,610
So you were a member of this group,
542
00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:03,385
a Branch Davidian?
543
00:30:03,968 --> 00:30:06,243
I was. Yes.
544
00:30:06,811 --> 00:30:08,646
This must be very hard for you
545
00:30:09,303 --> 00:30:11,722
to testify against your own people.
546
00:30:12,484 --> 00:30:14,455
Yeah, it is.
547
00:30:14,785 --> 00:30:18,613
When the ATF arrived on February 28th
548
00:30:18,836 --> 00:30:20,760
to serve their warrant,
549
00:30:21,138 --> 00:30:22,922
and a gunfight erupted,
550
00:30:23,141 --> 00:30:25,768
were you tasked with any kind of job?
551
00:30:26,048 --> 00:30:27,061
Yes.
552
00:30:28,233 --> 00:30:30,564
I was the one who made
sure that everybody
553
00:30:30,575 --> 00:30:32,942
had a gun and made sure that everybody
554
00:30:32,952 --> 00:30:35,144
had the right ammunition to go with it.
555
00:30:35,538 --> 00:30:36,946
- No! They're gonna kill you.
- Why?
556
00:30:36,956 --> 00:30:38,281
- I don't care!
- Give me that gun!
557
00:30:38,291 --> 00:30:40,283
Give me that gun!
558
00:30:40,293 --> 00:30:42,906
And why were you
entrusted with this job?
559
00:30:43,107 --> 00:30:44,650
I'd been in the Air Force.
560
00:30:45,172 --> 00:30:47,925
So it was like a military exercise?
561
00:30:48,302 --> 00:30:50,251
It was something we'd trained for.
562
00:30:50,261 --> 00:30:52,587
And the people
that you were passing out
563
00:30:52,597 --> 00:30:54,627
these weapons to, did they take them
564
00:30:54,638 --> 00:30:57,758
- with the intent to use them?
- Objection. Speculation.
565
00:30:57,769 --> 00:30:59,524
I'll rephrase.
566
00:30:59,704 --> 00:31:02,583
Was it your understanding
that the weapons would be used?
567
00:31:02,594 --> 00:31:04,098
Absolutely.
568
00:31:04,108 --> 00:31:06,059
And are some of the
people that you passed out
569
00:31:06,069 --> 00:31:08,613
these weapons to here today?
570
00:31:09,735 --> 00:31:11,153
Yes.
571
00:31:11,547 --> 00:31:13,607
Let's get specific.
572
00:31:13,618 --> 00:31:15,109
During the raid,
573
00:31:15,119 --> 00:31:19,047
did you have any
contact with Ruth Riddle?
574
00:31:19,315 --> 00:31:22,075
I gave Ruth a gun and nine mags.
575
00:31:22,502 --> 00:31:24,796
Can you identify Ruth Riddle?
576
00:31:27,852 --> 00:31:29,353
I'm sorry, Ruth.
577
00:31:29,872 --> 00:31:32,085
Let the record show that Mrs. Schroeder
578
00:31:32,095 --> 00:31:34,097
has identified Ruth Riddle.
579
00:31:36,215 --> 00:31:39,468
What contact did you have with
Clive Doyle concerning firearms?
580
00:31:40,840 --> 00:31:43,166
I gave Clive the .308.
581
00:31:43,282 --> 00:31:45,743
Can you identify Clive Doyle?
582
00:31:49,185 --> 00:31:53,022
Did you have any contact
with Livingstone Fagan
583
00:31:53,032 --> 00:31:54,816
concerning firearms?
584
00:31:54,826 --> 00:31:56,776
Livingstone was already carrying an AK,
585
00:31:56,786 --> 00:31:58,987
so I just made sure he had ammo.
586
00:31:59,181 --> 00:32:01,636
Did you have any contact with Paul Fatta
587
00:32:01,870 --> 00:32:03,904
concerning firearms?
588
00:32:03,915 --> 00:32:05,583
Not on the day of the raid,
589
00:32:06,061 --> 00:32:08,438
but he purchased the guns.
590
00:32:10,564 --> 00:32:12,973
So David Koresh
591
00:32:13,017 --> 00:32:15,844
instructed you to hand out
592
00:32:15,855 --> 00:32:18,482
the weapons Paul Fatta purchased
593
00:32:18,850 --> 00:32:21,175
to these defendants?
594
00:32:21,185 --> 00:32:22,187
Yes.
595
00:32:23,147 --> 00:32:26,514
We all had guns. You
get it? We all had guns.
596
00:32:26,524 --> 00:32:28,793
We all... we all knew what was coming.
597
00:32:30,107 --> 00:32:32,433
David always said, "If
you can't kill for God,
598
00:32:32,444 --> 00:32:34,404
you can't die for God."
599
00:32:35,304 --> 00:32:37,550
And was David Koresh willing to die?
600
00:32:37,880 --> 00:32:39,788
Of course.
601
00:32:39,811 --> 00:32:41,518
We all were.
602
00:32:42,449 --> 00:32:44,702
We were the army of God.
603
00:32:48,414 --> 00:32:51,157
Even, even David's name, David Koresh,
604
00:32:51,526 --> 00:32:53,862
that means "Beloved Death."
605
00:32:57,094 --> 00:33:00,213
So... when David Koresh
606
00:33:00,224 --> 00:33:03,434
believed he was dying
from his gunshot wounds,
607
00:33:04,087 --> 00:33:07,090
was there a plan in case he died?
608
00:33:09,343 --> 00:33:10,891
We were supposed to carry David
609
00:33:10,902 --> 00:33:14,197
out the front door on a stretcher.
610
00:33:17,136 --> 00:33:19,096
If he wasn't dead yet,
611
00:33:20,130 --> 00:33:22,117
we were gonna shoot him in the head.
612
00:33:23,114 --> 00:33:27,576
And then we were supposed to
open fire on the FBI agents.
613
00:33:28,823 --> 00:33:31,451
And why would you want to do that?
614
00:33:36,955 --> 00:33:39,082
To-to-to...
615
00:33:41,008 --> 00:33:43,469
to draw their fire.
616
00:33:44,936 --> 00:33:46,730
So they'd kill us all.
617
00:33:51,211 --> 00:33:54,464
See, you had to know the real David.
618
00:33:54,894 --> 00:33:57,313
He was never gonna surrender.
619
00:33:59,992 --> 00:34:02,242
Sorry.
620
00:34:02,652 --> 00:34:05,155
He was never gonna let us go.
621
00:34:07,700 --> 00:34:09,868
And how did you know that?
622
00:34:10,722 --> 00:34:12,056
Because...
623
00:34:13,553 --> 00:34:15,681
he'd conditioned us.
624
00:34:19,666 --> 00:34:21,376
Oh, he did.
625
00:34:25,471 --> 00:34:28,130
He conditioned us for years
626
00:34:28,440 --> 00:34:30,470
to believe that we were headed
627
00:34:30,481 --> 00:34:33,305
for an armed showdown with the...
628
00:34:33,423 --> 00:34:36,249
with the forces of the Beast.
629
00:34:36,260 --> 00:34:37,841
The Beast?
630
00:34:37,955 --> 00:34:39,947
From the Book of Revelation.
631
00:34:40,457 --> 00:34:41,745
So,
632
00:34:42,026 --> 00:34:45,115
when the ATF arrived at your door,
633
00:34:45,414 --> 00:34:47,949
you believed they were those forces?
634
00:34:48,226 --> 00:34:50,519
And you were ready for battle.
635
00:34:53,959 --> 00:34:55,702
Yeah, we were.
636
00:34:57,861 --> 00:35:00,405
And you were conditioned to believe
637
00:35:01,641 --> 00:35:04,645
that it would be a battle to the death?
638
00:35:06,632 --> 00:35:07,758
Yes.
639
00:35:08,485 --> 00:35:12,158
So, no matter what the government did,
640
00:35:12,641 --> 00:35:16,301
no matter how many chances
they gave the Branch Davidians
641
00:35:16,331 --> 00:35:18,272
to come out of Mount Carmel,
642
00:35:19,265 --> 00:35:21,059
you weren't coming out alive?
643
00:35:26,872 --> 00:35:28,364
No.
644
00:35:40,639 --> 00:35:42,307
It's not too late, you know.
645
00:35:43,542 --> 00:35:45,502
We could pick a different place.
646
00:35:46,796 --> 00:35:49,799
Bet most of those kids
never even heard of Waco.
647
00:35:52,032 --> 00:35:53,909
We kill a bunch of kids,
648
00:35:54,710 --> 00:35:57,754
who's to say we're any
better than the ATF?
649
00:35:59,130 --> 00:36:01,619
Yeah. Hello?
650
00:36:01,772 --> 00:36:03,889
Gary, Sanborn here.
651
00:36:03,966 --> 00:36:05,833
Oh hey, Alan, what's up?
652
00:36:05,844 --> 00:36:08,336
I need you on a
plane in a couple hours.
653
00:36:08,347 --> 00:36:11,465
I passed off the negotiations
team to Hendricks.
654
00:36:11,756 --> 00:36:13,741
It's not a negotiation.
655
00:36:13,751 --> 00:36:16,247
I need you in Texas ASAP.
656
00:36:16,258 --> 00:36:19,762
You're being called to testify
in the Waco trial tomorrow.
657
00:36:21,893 --> 00:36:24,039
What? The...
658
00:36:24,428 --> 00:36:27,421
the prosecution wants me to testify?
659
00:36:27,497 --> 00:36:29,666
No, the defense does.
660
00:36:30,310 --> 00:36:33,382
- The defense? Why?
- I don't know.
661
00:36:33,393 --> 00:36:35,969
Maybe they caught wind
of your little meltdown
662
00:36:35,980 --> 00:36:37,889
with the DOJ, where you said Waco
663
00:36:37,900 --> 00:36:39,475
was all the government's fault.
664
00:36:39,486 --> 00:36:40,934
That's not what I said.
665
00:36:40,945 --> 00:36:42,770
Well, either way,
666
00:36:42,780 --> 00:36:45,231
they want you on the stand tomorrow.
667
00:36:45,241 --> 00:36:48,880
Jesus. No, I... no, no.
668
00:36:48,891 --> 00:36:51,531
I don't have time for that, Alan.
Can you make it go away?
669
00:36:51,542 --> 00:36:52,784
No, I cannot.
670
00:36:52,795 --> 00:36:56,094
- It's a Federal subpoena.
- I... This is bad timing, Alan.
671
00:36:56,105 --> 00:36:58,889
I just got a CI into Elohim City.
672
00:36:59,254 --> 00:37:00,672
What?
673
00:37:01,318 --> 00:37:02,977
Whoa, whoa, whoa.
674
00:37:02,988 --> 00:37:05,625
Who the hell gave you
clearance to send a CI in there?
675
00:37:05,636 --> 00:37:07,206
I sure as hell didn't, Gary.
676
00:37:07,217 --> 00:37:09,000
If that unauthorized CI turns up dead,
677
00:37:09,011 --> 00:37:10,711
your career is over.
678
00:37:10,850 --> 00:37:13,634
I realize that. That's why
I can't leave right now.
679
00:37:13,644 --> 00:37:16,717
I don't like you
testifying any more than you do.
680
00:37:16,993 --> 00:37:20,584
You go down there and you show
that you know how to play ball.
681
00:37:20,595 --> 00:37:22,754
If you want support
out there in Oklahoma,
682
00:37:22,765 --> 00:37:25,758
then you're gonna have to show
us that you are a team player.
683
00:37:31,620 --> 00:37:33,296
Are you stupid?
684
00:37:33,678 --> 00:37:36,628
You had no right to do
this without talking to us.
685
00:37:36,639 --> 00:37:38,238
This right here is how
you lose our whole case.
686
00:37:38,249 --> 00:37:41,454
I'm sorry. Were you in there just now?
687
00:37:41,967 --> 00:37:45,293
Because Kathy Schroeder
just destroyed us.
688
00:37:45,384 --> 00:37:48,367
Look, our whole case is
built on self-defense,
689
00:37:48,378 --> 00:37:51,412
on the idea that the government
attacked the Davidians.
690
00:37:51,423 --> 00:37:53,506
But the jury is not gonna
give a shit about that
691
00:37:53,517 --> 00:37:55,718
if they think the Davidians
already had a death wish
692
00:37:55,728 --> 00:37:58,314
and were gonna kill
themselves no matter what.
693
00:37:58,944 --> 00:38:02,683
So our job, our most important job,
694
00:38:02,693 --> 00:38:05,519
is to show the jury that our clients
695
00:38:05,529 --> 00:38:09,200
were actual people,
people who wanted to live.
696
00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:12,902
And that the choices
the ATF and the FBI made
697
00:38:12,912 --> 00:38:15,738
are what resulted in
all those people dying.
698
00:38:15,977 --> 00:38:18,157
We could put their
friends on the stand...
699
00:38:18,167 --> 00:38:19,551
- No, no.
- ... their family.
700
00:38:19,562 --> 00:38:22,847
Come on. Somebody's mama
ain't gonna convince the jury.
701
00:38:23,172 --> 00:38:25,373
But if we can get a
badge up there and he says
702
00:38:25,383 --> 00:38:28,219
that these were real people,
people who wanted to live...
703
00:38:30,311 --> 00:38:32,053
then we're cooking with gas.
704
00:38:32,223 --> 00:38:34,924
So, just to be clear, you're gonna put
705
00:38:34,934 --> 00:38:37,646
a professional negotiator on the stand
706
00:38:38,168 --> 00:38:40,170
and hope you can get him to crack?
707
00:38:41,649 --> 00:38:43,265
It's a Hail Mary at best.
708
00:38:43,664 --> 00:38:45,226
Well, we need a Hail Mary
709
00:38:45,236 --> 00:38:49,407
and we need it to connect or we lose.
710
00:39:06,444 --> 00:39:10,417
I am so tired of people
spreading lies about David,
711
00:39:10,428 --> 00:39:12,878
especially when the lies are
coming from one of our own.
712
00:39:12,888 --> 00:39:14,255
How could she say those things?
713
00:39:14,265 --> 00:39:16,234
That we wanted this to happen?
714
00:39:16,604 --> 00:39:19,092
We wanted all the people we love to die?
715
00:39:19,103 --> 00:39:20,412
- It's insane.
- Uh-hmm.
716
00:39:20,423 --> 00:39:22,926
It's like letting
Judas write the Gospel.
717
00:39:25,004 --> 00:39:26,797
I'm gonna testify.
718
00:39:28,774 --> 00:39:31,266
Your lawyer is letting you speak?
719
00:39:31,369 --> 00:39:33,394
- Mine won't let me.
- Neither will mine.
720
00:39:33,405 --> 00:39:34,758
I don't care.
721
00:39:34,769 --> 00:39:37,318
I have a legal right
to testify if I want to.
722
00:39:37,329 --> 00:39:39,996
- We all do.
- Uh, she's right.
723
00:39:40,578 --> 00:39:43,116
It doesn't matter that
the lawyers said no.
724
00:39:43,127 --> 00:39:44,370
Legally, they can't stop us.
725
00:39:44,381 --> 00:39:46,453
And our lawyers are not listening to us.
726
00:39:46,464 --> 00:39:48,622
No one is listening to us.
727
00:39:48,632 --> 00:39:50,301
So we have to make them listen.
728
00:39:51,690 --> 00:39:53,191
I don't know.
729
00:39:54,820 --> 00:39:56,895
We are good people.
730
00:39:57,099 --> 00:39:58,934
Someone needs to say it.
731
00:39:59,783 --> 00:40:02,952
We're not monsters.
David's not a monster.
732
00:40:03,282 --> 00:40:05,764
The jury needs to hear
that David would never do
733
00:40:05,774 --> 00:40:07,485
anything to hurt us.
734
00:40:09,653 --> 00:40:11,030
He loved us.
735
00:40:13,450 --> 00:40:15,648
- Someone should say something.
- Uh-hmm.
736
00:40:42,233 --> 00:40:43,850
Hey, mama.
737
00:40:43,895 --> 00:40:45,720
What the hell were you thinking,
738
00:40:45,802 --> 00:40:47,762
shooting at George Roden like that?
739
00:40:48,749 --> 00:40:51,224
- Well, they let me go.
- And if they didn't?
740
00:40:51,235 --> 00:40:53,269
If they kept you in jail, you
think these friends of yours
741
00:40:53,280 --> 00:40:55,647
would still be there when you got out?
742
00:40:55,741 --> 00:40:58,984
- God told me that...
- Oh, don't give me that crap!
743
00:40:59,203 --> 00:41:01,152
They might buy this whole messiah thing
744
00:41:01,163 --> 00:41:02,696
you've been feeding them, but I remember
745
00:41:02,706 --> 00:41:04,031
when you were still pissing your bed.
746
00:41:04,041 --> 00:41:05,084
Stop!
747
00:41:13,732 --> 00:41:15,891
God speaks to me!
748
00:41:15,902 --> 00:41:17,711
- Vernon?
- He didn't choose you!
749
00:41:17,721 --> 00:41:19,421
He didn't choose Grandma!
750
00:41:19,431 --> 00:41:20,923
He chose me!
751
00:41:20,933 --> 00:41:22,046
Me!
752
00:41:22,057 --> 00:41:24,676
- Vernon!
- Not anymore.
753
00:41:24,687 --> 00:41:26,189
You gave me that name.
754
00:41:26,200 --> 00:41:29,612
But God's got bigger plans for me
than you could ever even thought of!
755
00:41:29,623 --> 00:41:31,115
Just get in the car.
756
00:41:31,235 --> 00:41:33,383
God's given me a new name.
757
00:41:33,512 --> 00:41:35,129
David Koresh.
758
00:41:35,239 --> 00:41:37,184
From now on, you will
call me by my name!
759
00:41:37,195 --> 00:41:39,733
I will call you by your given name!
760
00:41:39,743 --> 00:41:41,235
Your real name!
761
00:41:41,245 --> 00:41:43,950
David Koresh is my real name!
762
00:41:44,569 --> 00:41:46,895
Or do you think you
know better than God?
763
00:41:47,156 --> 00:41:48,951
And is it God then who told you
764
00:41:48,961 --> 00:41:51,124
to impregnate Rachel's little sister?
765
00:41:51,295 --> 00:41:53,079
What is she, 14?
766
00:41:53,090 --> 00:41:55,749
You were 14 when you had me!
767
00:41:55,759 --> 00:41:57,376
And I remember what it felt
768
00:41:57,386 --> 00:41:59,530
like to be a 14-year-old mother.
769
00:41:59,541 --> 00:42:01,492
You know how that felt?
770
00:42:01,623 --> 00:42:03,543
Like I was too young!
771
00:42:09,639 --> 00:42:12,969
I follow where God leads
772
00:42:13,237 --> 00:42:15,938
and if you can't get
with the program, then...
773
00:42:15,961 --> 00:42:18,078
well, then you'll never see
these grandkids of yours.
774
00:42:18,089 --> 00:42:20,415
How does that sound to
you? Is that what you want?
775
00:42:20,524 --> 00:42:23,391
And they'll ask me, "Daddy,
why don't I have a grandma?"
776
00:42:23,402 --> 00:42:25,686
And I'll say, "Oh, you do
have one out there somewhere,
777
00:42:25,697 --> 00:42:29,201
but she always had to know
best, better than God."
778
00:42:31,083 --> 00:42:33,425
Some souls just can't
be led to the spirit,
779
00:42:33,436 --> 00:42:36,314
no matter how hard you
scream and shout at them.
780
00:42:40,659 --> 00:42:41,986
Fine.
781
00:42:42,645 --> 00:42:44,814
Just get back in the car.
782
00:42:47,365 --> 00:42:49,784
Get back in the car what?
783
00:42:52,115 --> 00:42:54,325
Get back in the car, please.
784
00:43:00,719 --> 00:43:03,972
Get back in the car please, David.
785
00:43:05,871 --> 00:43:07,321
They're coming for your guns!
786
00:43:07,331 --> 00:43:08,772
They're coming for your kids!
787
00:43:08,783 --> 00:43:10,358
They're coming for your guns!
788
00:43:10,369 --> 00:43:11,991
They're coming for your kids!
789
00:43:12,002 --> 00:43:13,535
They're coming for your guns!
790
00:43:13,545 --> 00:43:15,204
They're coming for your kids!
791
00:43:15,214 --> 00:43:16,789
They're coming for your guns!
792
00:43:16,799 --> 00:43:18,332
They're coming for your kids!
793
00:43:18,342 --> 00:43:19,833
They're coming for your guns!
794
00:43:19,843 --> 00:43:21,377
They're coming for your kids!
795
00:43:21,387 --> 00:43:23,003
They're coming for your guns!
796
00:43:23,013 --> 00:43:24,546
They're coming for your kids!
797
00:43:24,556 --> 00:43:26,507
They're coming for your guns!
798
00:43:26,517 --> 00:43:28,008
- They're coming for your kids!
- Is it always like this?
799
00:43:28,018 --> 00:43:29,635
Been a circus since day one.
800
00:43:29,645 --> 00:43:31,512
I've been telling them
we need more support,
801
00:43:31,522 --> 00:43:34,515
especially after one of the
jurors was followed home.
802
00:43:34,525 --> 00:43:36,141
- What?
- These guys are coming here
803
00:43:36,151 --> 00:43:37,569
from all over the country.
804
00:43:55,255 --> 00:43:58,996
So, you gonna ask Noesner
about the missing door?
805
00:43:59,007 --> 00:44:00,718
Yeah, probably.
806
00:44:01,009 --> 00:44:03,103
Hey, where is everyone?
807
00:44:03,473 --> 00:44:05,965
Hmm, maybe the bus is late.
808
00:44:05,976 --> 00:44:07,985
Oh, shit. Now what?
809
00:44:09,521 --> 00:44:11,305
What's up?
810
00:44:11,316 --> 00:44:14,142
It seems we got a bit
of a mutiny on our hands.
811
00:44:14,153 --> 00:44:17,813
You're denying us our
constitutional rights.
812
00:44:17,824 --> 00:44:20,609
We have a 6th Amendment
right to self-representation,
813
00:44:20,620 --> 00:44:22,228
and you're denying us that right.
814
00:44:22,239 --> 00:44:23,939
Is this about testifying again?
815
00:44:23,949 --> 00:44:26,410
This is about speaking the truth!
816
00:44:26,744 --> 00:44:29,361
We're, we're good people,
and we just want the chance...
817
00:44:29,371 --> 00:44:30,904
Clive, we've talked about this.
818
00:44:30,914 --> 00:44:32,698
There's no way in hell
you're gonna testify.
819
00:44:34,126 --> 00:44:36,535
We already have an opinion on...
820
00:44:36,545 --> 00:44:39,214
All right. Stop. Stop! Stop!
821
00:44:43,126 --> 00:44:46,188
You wanna testify? You should
know what it's gonna be like.
822
00:44:47,122 --> 00:44:50,424
Mr. Fagan, you were a follower
of David Koresh, correct?
823
00:44:50,555 --> 00:44:52,426
- Yes.
- Did you believe him
824
00:44:52,436 --> 00:44:54,472
when he said the end times were coming?
825
00:44:54,544 --> 00:44:55,735
Yes.
826
00:44:55,758 --> 00:44:58,282
Is that why you were
preparing for battle?
827
00:44:59,429 --> 00:45:01,556
A spiritual battle.
828
00:45:02,089 --> 00:45:05,175
And were people gonna die
in this spiritual battle?
829
00:45:05,730 --> 00:45:07,222
Yes.
830
00:45:07,272 --> 00:45:09,441
Mr. Fagan, have you ever shot anyone?
831
00:45:11,736 --> 00:45:15,156
Mr. Fagan, you swore on
a Bible to tell the truth.
832
00:45:15,167 --> 00:45:17,618
Now, I'll ask you again.
Have you ever shot anyone?
833
00:45:17,628 --> 00:45:19,471
- Dan...
- No, no, no. They wanna do this.
834
00:45:19,482 --> 00:45:22,985
Mr. Fatta, in 1988, you
were in a gun battle?
835
00:45:24,454 --> 00:45:26,404
Yes.
836
00:45:26,415 --> 00:45:28,115
A battle led by David Koresh,
837
00:45:28,126 --> 00:45:30,493
for which you were both arrested.
838
00:45:30,575 --> 00:45:32,661
What crime were you charged with?
839
00:45:34,181 --> 00:45:36,965
- Attempted murder.
- Attempted murder!
840
00:45:36,976 --> 00:45:39,639
You were prepared to kill
for Mr. Koresh, weren't you?
841
00:45:39,650 --> 00:45:41,642
Because you would do
anything Mr. Koresh said.
842
00:45:41,652 --> 00:45:42,851
It wasn't like that.
843
00:45:42,861 --> 00:45:44,579
We made our own choices.
844
00:45:44,590 --> 00:45:47,249
So you had free will?
845
00:45:47,368 --> 00:45:50,194
- Yes.
- And what about you, Mr. Doyle,
846
00:45:50,258 --> 00:45:52,109
- were you brainwashed?
- No.
847
00:45:52,120 --> 00:45:53,612
So you made your own choices as well?
848
00:45:53,622 --> 00:45:55,364
- Yes.
- So you chose to let
849
00:45:55,374 --> 00:45:58,627
your 12-year-old daughter
marry a 30-year-old man?
850
00:46:02,967 --> 00:46:04,271
You don't understand...
851
00:46:04,282 --> 00:46:05,531
- And what about you?
- ... what we...
852
00:46:05,542 --> 00:46:08,530
You knew what was
going on. Did you say anything?
853
00:46:08,541 --> 00:46:10,294
You have to know the Bible.
854
00:46:10,305 --> 00:46:12,683
What about you? Did you say anything?
855
00:46:14,344 --> 00:46:16,342
Did you? Or maybe you didn't care
856
00:46:16,353 --> 00:46:18,049
because you had a son
instead of a daughter.
857
00:46:18,060 --> 00:46:20,642
- That's not fair!
- You are all complicit.
858
00:46:20,653 --> 00:46:23,474
You all saw, you knew, and
you didn't say anything.
859
00:46:23,485 --> 00:46:26,478
Do you know what the legal term
for these marriages of David's is?
860
00:46:26,488 --> 00:46:27,813
It's rape.
861
00:46:28,015 --> 00:46:29,702
It wasn't rape!
862
00:46:29,754 --> 00:46:32,139
It wasn't even sexual!
David married them
863
00:46:32,150 --> 00:46:33,641
in order to have children!
864
00:46:33,652 --> 00:46:36,395
Is that why he married
a ten-year-old girl,
865
00:46:36,406 --> 00:46:38,492
because she was so fertile?
866
00:46:43,755 --> 00:46:46,581
You are not guilty of the
crime you've been accused of.
867
00:46:46,697 --> 00:46:49,273
And what the government
did at Mount Carmel
868
00:46:49,344 --> 00:46:51,263
is an abomination.
869
00:46:53,049 --> 00:46:54,874
But you're not innocent either.
870
00:46:54,885 --> 00:46:57,211
And if you get up there to testify,
871
00:46:57,260 --> 00:46:59,804
that's all anybody will be left with.
872
00:47:16,362 --> 00:47:21,362
- Synced and corrected by naFraC -
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63884
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