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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:03,960 --> 00:00:06,879 [eerie music] 2 00:00:06,960 --> 00:00:13,960 ♪ ♪ 3 00:00:21,480 --> 00:00:23,839 - It was 1977, and I was working as a photographer 4 00:00:23,920 --> 00:00:26,839 on "The Daily Mirror" newspaper. 5 00:00:26,920 --> 00:00:29,120 And I was doing the late shift. 6 00:00:29,199 --> 00:00:32,520 You'd be just sitting there on call 7 00:00:32,600 --> 00:00:34,039 waiting for anything to happen. 8 00:00:34,119 --> 00:00:37,200 Could be parties, celebrities, 9 00:00:37,280 --> 00:00:39,280 car crash, plane crash, murders. 10 00:00:39,359 --> 00:00:42,799 It could be absolutely anything at all. 11 00:00:42,880 --> 00:00:44,679 And then, quite late at night, 12 00:00:44,759 --> 00:00:48,600 this one call had come in from a family in Enfield 13 00:00:48,679 --> 00:00:52,759 saying that weird things have been happening in their house. 14 00:00:52,840 --> 00:00:55,359 Furniture had been moving around on its own. 15 00:00:55,439 --> 00:00:58,079 And, of course, nobody really believed it. 16 00:00:58,159 --> 00:01:00,399 A lot of people phone up newspapers 17 00:01:00,479 --> 00:01:02,679 and tell you all sorts of things, 18 00:01:02,759 --> 00:01:05,719 so we didn't know what to believe. 19 00:01:05,799 --> 00:01:09,439 But a second call came in where a neighbor had said 20 00:01:09,519 --> 00:01:13,480 that the police had seen things move around the house 21 00:01:13,560 --> 00:01:15,159 and they were convinced there was 22 00:01:15,239 --> 00:01:16,599 something strange happening in the house. 23 00:01:16,680 --> 00:01:23,680 ♪ ♪ 24 00:01:25,359 --> 00:01:28,359 - The local police reported seeing an armchair levitate 25 00:01:28,439 --> 00:01:30,680 across the Hodgson's living room. 26 00:01:30,760 --> 00:01:33,159 - It came off the floor, oh, 27 00:01:33,239 --> 00:01:34,879 maybe a half inch, I should say, 28 00:01:34,959 --> 00:01:37,439 and I saw it slide off to the right 29 00:01:37,519 --> 00:01:40,560 about 3 and 1/2 to 4 feet before it came to rest. 30 00:01:40,640 --> 00:01:42,640 Um, I checked to see whether or not 31 00:01:42,719 --> 00:01:44,239 it could possibly have slid along the floor. 32 00:01:44,319 --> 00:01:45,719 I placed a marble on the floor to see whether or not 33 00:01:45,799 --> 00:01:50,879 the marble would go in the same direction as the chair did, 34 00:01:50,959 --> 00:01:52,239 and it didn't, didn't roll at all. 35 00:01:52,319 --> 00:01:54,760 I couldn't find an explanation at all. 36 00:01:54,840 --> 00:02:01,879 ♪ ♪ 37 00:02:11,960 --> 00:02:15,319 - I drove up with the reporter, Doug Bence. 38 00:02:15,400 --> 00:02:19,479 We had no idea what we'd find when we got there. 39 00:02:23,159 --> 00:02:25,919 We pulled up at Green Street, Enfield, 40 00:02:26,000 --> 00:02:27,599 jumped out. 41 00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:34,120 ♪ ♪ 42 00:02:34,199 --> 00:02:36,159 The house looked perfectly normal. 43 00:02:40,759 --> 00:02:43,960 Didn't look anything-- anything special. 44 00:02:52,120 --> 00:02:56,560 Peggy Hodgson was a mother, single mother, 45 00:02:56,639 --> 00:02:59,560 trying to bring up a family of four on her own. 46 00:02:59,639 --> 00:03:01,120 She couldn't cope. 47 00:03:02,719 --> 00:03:04,919 - When I did see the dressing table moving, 48 00:03:05,000 --> 00:03:06,240 I just couldn't believe it. 49 00:03:06,319 --> 00:03:08,719 In fact, I pushed it back twice, 50 00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:11,599 and the third time, I couldn't move it. 51 00:03:11,680 --> 00:03:14,000 But while I was doing it and while I was in the room, 52 00:03:14,080 --> 00:03:16,319 I was literally trembling, 53 00:03:16,400 --> 00:03:17,759 and my mouth went completely dry 54 00:03:17,840 --> 00:03:20,800 because I didn't really know what I was up against. 55 00:03:23,360 --> 00:03:24,919 It's almost as though someone's standing there 56 00:03:25,000 --> 00:03:26,280 with an invisible hand and lifting it 57 00:03:26,360 --> 00:03:27,159 from one place to the other. 58 00:03:30,879 --> 00:03:33,719 - It was decided that I would go into the house 59 00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:37,159 first of all, and I planted myself 60 00:03:37,240 --> 00:03:40,240 right in the very far corner of the kitchen. 61 00:03:46,560 --> 00:03:47,919 Then the family came in, 62 00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:50,400 and nothing happened really. 63 00:03:50,479 --> 00:03:52,039 That was--that was it. Nothing at all 64 00:03:52,120 --> 00:03:56,039 until the last child, Janet, 65 00:03:56,120 --> 00:04:01,319 who was about 11 or 12, she was brought in. 66 00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:09,159 Suddenly things just took off, 67 00:04:09,240 --> 00:04:11,360 flew around the room as if you fired them out of a gun. 68 00:04:11,439 --> 00:04:15,599 You know, it was sort of marbles and LEGO bricks. 69 00:04:15,680 --> 00:04:17,519 They were really moving, hitting the walls, 70 00:04:17,600 --> 00:04:18,000 hitting windows. 71 00:04:20,959 --> 00:04:23,800 I remember Janet screaming and covering her face. 72 00:04:27,680 --> 00:04:30,879 She seemed to be the epicenter of everything. 73 00:04:34,120 --> 00:04:36,040 [child screaming] 74 00:04:37,199 --> 00:04:41,240 And then, suddenly I got hit by a LEGO brick. 75 00:04:41,319 --> 00:04:46,279 And it brought a lump up on my right eyebrow. 76 00:04:46,360 --> 00:04:49,120 If it weren't for having the camera up over my face, 77 00:04:49,199 --> 00:04:50,000 that force, I would have been blinded. 78 00:04:54,639 --> 00:04:58,120 I have no idea if any of those pictures are gonna come out. 79 00:05:02,399 --> 00:05:04,560 It was quite frustrating because it was just 80 00:05:04,639 --> 00:05:07,040 shots of the family there 81 00:05:07,120 --> 00:05:10,480 rather than seeing marbles whizzing across the room. 82 00:05:15,399 --> 00:05:16,959 Looking back at it, 83 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:20,000 I still haven't got the faintest idea 84 00:05:20,079 --> 00:05:22,560 of what happened in that house. 85 00:05:30,600 --> 00:05:36,480 [dramatic music] 86 00:05:36,560 --> 00:05:37,680 - Britain today is on the red line. 87 00:05:37,759 --> 00:05:41,240 [indistinct chanting] 88 00:05:41,319 --> 00:05:44,160 Confusion and anxiety are everywhere. 89 00:05:46,879 --> 00:05:49,519 As people search for meaning, 90 00:05:49,600 --> 00:05:53,040 many have become fascinated by the supernatural, 91 00:05:53,120 --> 00:05:57,040 the occult, and the paranormal. 92 00:05:57,120 --> 00:06:00,480 - Blockbuster horror films had people fainting in the cinema. 93 00:06:00,560 --> 00:06:03,079 - Beat down Satan under our feet! 94 00:06:03,160 --> 00:06:05,480 - And we've had regular reports 95 00:06:05,560 --> 00:06:07,800 of hauntings and possessions. 96 00:06:07,879 --> 00:06:14,879 ♪ ♪ 97 00:06:17,399 --> 00:06:19,480 - The Hodgson family from Enfield in North London 98 00:06:19,560 --> 00:06:21,720 aren't getting on too well with what they believe 99 00:06:21,800 --> 00:06:23,360 to be a poltergeist. 100 00:06:23,439 --> 00:06:25,360 - A poltergeist is a ghost 101 00:06:25,439 --> 00:06:28,439 which makes its presence known through noises. 102 00:06:28,519 --> 00:06:30,439 - Those who've studied the phenomenon say 103 00:06:30,519 --> 00:06:34,720 it concentrates its attention on adolescent children. 104 00:06:34,800 --> 00:06:38,000 11-year-old Janet Hodgson appears to be the focus 105 00:06:38,079 --> 00:06:41,240 of many of the strange happenings in Green Street. 106 00:06:44,079 --> 00:06:47,040 - I was a reporter for BBC "World at One" 107 00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:49,040 and "World This Weekend," and I was working 108 00:06:49,120 --> 00:06:52,360 on "World This Weekend" on the Saturday 109 00:06:52,439 --> 00:06:55,000 when "The Daily Mirror" had this headline: 110 00:06:55,079 --> 00:06:57,279 "The House of Strange Happenings." 111 00:06:57,360 --> 00:07:00,959 You don't usually get kind of ghost stories 112 00:07:01,040 --> 00:07:02,079 on the front page, do you? 113 00:07:04,319 --> 00:07:06,680 It wasn't necessarily news in the sense that-- 114 00:07:06,759 --> 00:07:09,600 not hard news anyway-- 115 00:07:09,680 --> 00:07:11,519 and I was threatened all day with, if nothing else happens, 116 00:07:11,600 --> 00:07:15,720 you'll have to go and cover this ghost story in Enfield. 117 00:07:15,800 --> 00:07:18,120 It's well known that when a reporter is sent out 118 00:07:18,199 --> 00:07:20,839 to a ghost story, absolutely nothing happens. 119 00:07:20,920 --> 00:07:24,759 I mean, it's really, you know, difficult to report on. 120 00:07:24,839 --> 00:07:27,240 So I didn't really want to do it at all. 121 00:07:27,319 --> 00:07:28,600 But in the end, nothing else happened that day, 122 00:07:28,680 --> 00:07:32,959 so I went out to Enfield on a Saturday evening 123 00:07:33,040 --> 00:07:34,759 and was quite skeptical 124 00:07:34,839 --> 00:07:37,279 and thought, well, what's gonna happen? 125 00:07:37,360 --> 00:07:40,279 [eerie music] 126 00:07:40,360 --> 00:07:46,920 ♪ ♪ 127 00:07:47,000 --> 00:07:50,000 I thought Mrs. Hodgson seemed a very sensible woman. 128 00:07:50,079 --> 00:07:53,639 She seemed very normal and ordinary and down-to-Earth. 129 00:07:53,720 --> 00:07:55,079 She had four children. 130 00:07:55,160 --> 00:07:59,519 Johnny was ten, Billy was seven, 131 00:07:59,600 --> 00:08:04,240 Margaret was 13, and Janet was 11. 132 00:08:04,319 --> 00:08:10,360 ♪ ♪ 133 00:08:10,439 --> 00:08:13,160 Mrs. Hodgson was divorced, and her husband wasn't there, 134 00:08:13,240 --> 00:08:16,519 and the family were obviously quite poor. 135 00:08:16,600 --> 00:08:20,279 And there didn't seem anything remarkable about the family. 136 00:08:20,360 --> 00:08:22,160 Just what was happening to them seemed remarkable. 137 00:08:27,399 --> 00:08:29,000 At the time, I was just focused 138 00:08:29,079 --> 00:08:30,879 on the fact that I needed to get something 139 00:08:30,959 --> 00:08:33,240 that could go on the program the next day. 140 00:08:36,279 --> 00:08:40,919 It's now about half an hour since the family settled down 141 00:08:41,000 --> 00:08:43,120 for the night, and Janet, who's the 11-year-old, 142 00:08:43,200 --> 00:08:46,240 the one we've been watching most, 143 00:08:46,320 --> 00:08:47,799 she now seems to be asleep. 144 00:08:47,879 --> 00:08:50,120 She's not really moving around very much. 145 00:09:04,519 --> 00:09:07,360 [knocking] 146 00:09:10,759 --> 00:09:13,759 [knocking continues] 147 00:09:17,919 --> 00:09:19,759 I was in the front room, 148 00:09:19,840 --> 00:09:21,960 and it was really quite loud 149 00:09:22,039 --> 00:09:24,960 and quite persistent sort of knocking. 150 00:09:25,039 --> 00:09:26,320 It wasn't like a knock on the door. 151 00:09:26,399 --> 00:09:28,080 It was like a knock on the wall, 152 00:09:28,159 --> 00:09:29,519 and sort of high up on the wall sometimes. 153 00:09:31,080 --> 00:09:33,080 [knocking] 154 00:09:39,440 --> 00:09:41,600 You could never tell where it was. 155 00:09:51,080 --> 00:09:52,200 [loud thud] 156 00:09:52,279 --> 00:09:55,200 [dramatic music] 157 00:09:55,279 --> 00:09:56,919 ♪ ♪ 158 00:09:57,000 --> 00:09:59,080 We've just heard a noise having come downstairs. 159 00:09:59,159 --> 00:10:02,360 We've just heard a noise upstairs. 160 00:10:02,440 --> 00:10:05,000 And the chair which was standing by Janet's bed 161 00:10:05,080 --> 00:10:07,639 appears to have moved. 162 00:10:07,720 --> 00:10:10,480 Now the chair was by the bed, and it's now by the door. 163 00:10:10,559 --> 00:10:16,840 Well, Janet appears to be sleeping quite peacefully. 164 00:10:16,919 --> 00:10:18,639 Well, I'm hoping I'm not getting the microphone 165 00:10:18,720 --> 00:10:20,360 shaking in my hand because that was rather 166 00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:22,440 an unnerving experience. 167 00:10:33,960 --> 00:10:36,279 - Roslyn, you're looking fairly fresh, I have to say, 168 00:10:36,360 --> 00:10:40,279 after that night and being up till 5:30 this morning. 169 00:10:40,360 --> 00:10:42,240 Are you persuaded? 170 00:10:42,320 --> 00:10:44,600 - I think I more or less am, yes. 171 00:10:44,679 --> 00:10:51,279 ♪ ♪ 172 00:10:51,360 --> 00:10:52,879 I couldn't explain what had happened that night. 173 00:10:52,960 --> 00:10:57,279 It did all seem extremely odd. 174 00:10:57,360 --> 00:10:59,639 And I thought there really was something strange 175 00:10:59,720 --> 00:11:01,360 going on in that house. 176 00:11:09,240 --> 00:11:12,759 - As a couple of "Daily Mirror" hacks, 177 00:11:12,840 --> 00:11:14,399 you know, we were out of our depth, 178 00:11:14,480 --> 00:11:18,600 so we had no idea what this was about. 179 00:11:18,679 --> 00:11:22,200 So we decided that the Society for Psychical Research 180 00:11:22,279 --> 00:11:24,159 had to get involved. 181 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:27,159 They'd studied this sort of stuff over the years 182 00:11:27,240 --> 00:11:29,639 in lots of different countries around the world, 183 00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:32,080 and they knew what they were doing. 184 00:11:32,159 --> 00:11:33,919 And we certainly didn't. 185 00:11:35,879 --> 00:11:42,879 ♪ ♪ 186 00:11:44,879 --> 00:11:47,039 - The Society for Psychical Research, 187 00:11:47,120 --> 00:11:49,559 which was founded in the 19th century, 188 00:11:49,639 --> 00:11:52,759 does research into a whole range of different types 189 00:11:52,840 --> 00:11:54,120 of alleged paranormal phenomena. 190 00:11:56,600 --> 00:11:57,799 So this can range through the whole gamut 191 00:11:57,879 --> 00:12:02,039 of apparitions, poltergeist, 192 00:12:02,120 --> 00:12:04,960 spiritual mediums, 193 00:12:05,039 --> 00:12:08,240 extrasensory perception. 194 00:12:08,320 --> 00:12:10,960 Just about you name any anomalous phenomena 195 00:12:11,039 --> 00:12:13,120 that you can think of, and the SPR is interested 196 00:12:13,200 --> 00:12:16,919 in investigating it in a scientific manner. 197 00:12:25,240 --> 00:12:28,360 My role in the SPR is the honorary 198 00:12:28,440 --> 00:12:32,279 archive liaison officer, which means that I basically 199 00:12:32,360 --> 00:12:36,039 collect archive material, catalog it, conserve it. 200 00:12:37,919 --> 00:12:41,639 Well, this is where I keep a lot of the paranormal, 201 00:12:41,720 --> 00:12:44,960 shall we say, archive. 202 00:12:45,039 --> 00:12:49,440 Up here we have the Enfield box, 203 00:12:49,519 --> 00:12:52,320 which has the items that were thrown around 204 00:12:52,399 --> 00:12:53,919 in a poltergeist-like manner. 205 00:13:00,120 --> 00:13:02,679 So here we have the LEGO bricks. 206 00:13:02,759 --> 00:13:06,320 And one of the first times that anything flew in the air 207 00:13:06,399 --> 00:13:09,879 was when a piece of LEGO brick hit the photographer, 208 00:13:09,960 --> 00:13:13,159 Graham Morris, brought up a bit of a bruise on him, 209 00:13:13,240 --> 00:13:15,120 and with such a volition 210 00:13:15,200 --> 00:13:17,000 that it couldn't have just been sort of chucked in the air 211 00:13:17,080 --> 00:13:17,799 and hit him on the head or something. 212 00:13:17,879 --> 00:13:20,240 It had to be thrown very hard. 213 00:13:20,320 --> 00:13:21,279 And at the time, everybody was in view. 214 00:13:21,360 --> 00:13:23,720 There were quite a few people there. 215 00:13:23,799 --> 00:13:26,559 So I don't think he ever managed to explain how, 216 00:13:26,639 --> 00:13:29,480 other than through some paranormal force, 217 00:13:29,559 --> 00:13:30,399 this thing managed to throw itself across the room 218 00:13:30,480 --> 00:13:33,039 and hit him. 219 00:13:33,120 --> 00:13:35,320 The posh words for this, psychokinetic energy, 220 00:13:35,399 --> 00:13:38,159 which means things that get thrown around, basically. 221 00:13:38,240 --> 00:13:40,000 The explanations are the same as they are 222 00:13:40,080 --> 00:13:41,799 for all of this sort of phenomena, 223 00:13:41,879 --> 00:13:44,919 ranging from fraud at one extreme 224 00:13:45,000 --> 00:13:47,240 to spirits at the other extreme, 225 00:13:47,320 --> 00:13:50,360 and plenty of other things in between the two. 226 00:13:50,440 --> 00:13:53,360 Fraud could have been, in an extreme circumstance, 227 00:13:53,440 --> 00:13:55,679 somebody palming a piece of the LEGO, 228 00:13:55,759 --> 00:13:58,519 waiting until they were pretty sure that nobody was looking, 229 00:13:58,600 --> 00:14:00,960 and then throwing it as hard as they could, 230 00:14:01,039 --> 00:14:03,000 aiming it at poor old Graham, 231 00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:06,320 it hitting him so that it brought up a bruise on him. 232 00:14:06,399 --> 00:14:07,960 Graham didn't know what was going on, 233 00:14:08,039 --> 00:14:10,159 so he contacted the SPR. 234 00:14:10,240 --> 00:14:13,399 And then the SPR contacted Maurice Grosse to say, 235 00:14:13,480 --> 00:14:16,240 you live relatively near-- he lived in Muswell Hill-- 236 00:14:16,320 --> 00:14:18,679 would you like to go along and investigate? 237 00:14:18,759 --> 00:14:20,879 Maurice had not been a member of the SPR 238 00:14:20,960 --> 00:14:23,240 before this case for very long. 239 00:14:23,320 --> 00:14:26,200 The first job that Maurice had in the SPR 240 00:14:26,279 --> 00:14:28,600 was actually the Enfield case. 241 00:14:30,320 --> 00:14:33,240 [soft inquisitive music] 242 00:14:33,320 --> 00:14:39,480 ♪ ♪ 243 00:14:40,960 --> 00:14:43,320 - My father was 20 in 1939, 244 00:14:43,399 --> 00:14:47,279 and he joined the Royal Artillery straight away. 245 00:14:47,360 --> 00:14:50,679 And in fact, he was in the expeditionary force 246 00:14:50,759 --> 00:14:53,000 to Dunkirk. 247 00:14:53,080 --> 00:14:55,039 He ended as an acting captain. 248 00:14:55,840 --> 00:14:58,960 And at the end of the war, 249 00:14:59,039 --> 00:15:03,559 he was in retail, designing and inventing. 250 00:15:03,639 --> 00:15:09,120 And then my father showed interest in psychic phenomena 251 00:15:09,200 --> 00:15:12,720 and joined the Society for Psychic Research. 252 00:15:12,799 --> 00:15:16,159 And after a period of time, 253 00:15:16,240 --> 00:15:20,679 he realized that the only way to really get anywhere 254 00:15:20,759 --> 00:15:25,519 with this subject was to research it on the ground. 255 00:15:27,200 --> 00:15:31,639 And he'd been badgering the secretary for a case. 256 00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:34,320 And the secretary had got in touch with him 257 00:15:34,399 --> 00:15:35,879 and said, Maurice, there's something going on 258 00:15:35,960 --> 00:15:37,440 in Enfield in Middlesex. 259 00:15:37,519 --> 00:15:39,759 Would you like to go and have a look? 260 00:15:39,840 --> 00:15:41,759 So he jumps at the opportunity. 261 00:15:41,840 --> 00:15:45,279 And he marshaled his resources, 262 00:15:45,360 --> 00:15:48,440 jumped into his car, and went off to Enfield. 263 00:15:48,519 --> 00:15:50,559 And there started the story. 264 00:15:50,639 --> 00:15:54,360 [music building] 265 00:15:54,440 --> 00:15:56,639 ♪ ♪ 266 00:15:56,720 --> 00:15:57,960 [knock on door] 267 00:16:04,799 --> 00:16:07,039 - I found chaos. 268 00:16:07,120 --> 00:16:10,279 And there were a lot of very, very frightened people there, 269 00:16:10,360 --> 00:16:13,279 so we sat down, and we talked about what was happening. 270 00:16:13,360 --> 00:16:16,120 And I began to realize that here we had 271 00:16:16,200 --> 00:16:20,159 a classic poltergeist case on our hands. 272 00:16:21,919 --> 00:16:24,000 - My father was a scientific, rational person, 273 00:16:24,080 --> 00:16:25,279 no one more so. 274 00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:31,879 Um, and he would have been looking at everything 275 00:16:31,960 --> 00:16:34,799 with a very critical eye, 276 00:16:34,879 --> 00:16:38,879 learning each hour, each day, 277 00:16:38,960 --> 00:16:41,080 and assessing each event as it came along. 278 00:16:43,600 --> 00:16:48,480 - I have actually seen myself marbles being thrown about 279 00:16:48,559 --> 00:16:50,480 because they'd been thrown at me. 280 00:16:50,559 --> 00:16:52,120 I've seen the door moving backwards and forwards 281 00:16:52,200 --> 00:16:55,600 as though the wind was blowing it. 282 00:16:55,679 --> 00:17:00,320 I've seen a T-shirt jump off the table onto the floor. 283 00:17:00,399 --> 00:17:02,240 The door chimes on the wall, 284 00:17:02,320 --> 00:17:04,640 I've seen them moving on their own. 285 00:17:04,720 --> 00:17:08,599 I've also experienced the reduction of temperature. 286 00:17:09,799 --> 00:17:14,200 - Janet was the focal point of activity. 287 00:17:14,279 --> 00:17:18,039 My father became clear about that from relatively early on. 288 00:17:20,200 --> 00:17:23,440 His enthusiasm was unbounded here. 289 00:17:23,519 --> 00:17:25,839 I mean, I would come back from a discotheque 290 00:17:25,920 --> 00:17:29,000 at 3:00 in the morning, and he'd be going off to Enfield. 291 00:17:32,720 --> 00:17:34,880 We have our morning debrief sessions over breakfast, 292 00:17:34,960 --> 00:17:36,920 and out would come the tapes, 293 00:17:37,000 --> 00:17:40,000 and he would tell me the stories, 294 00:17:40,079 --> 00:17:43,519 the new events, the progressions. 295 00:17:43,599 --> 00:17:50,599 ♪ ♪ 296 00:17:56,480 --> 00:17:59,960 [footsteps] 297 00:18:14,240 --> 00:18:16,200 - And it is one of the extraordinary coincidences 298 00:18:16,279 --> 00:18:19,599 that his very first case should be 299 00:18:19,680 --> 00:18:20,880 one of the most important cases 300 00:18:20,960 --> 00:18:24,400 in the history of paranormal phenomenon. 301 00:18:24,480 --> 00:18:27,279 [electric crackling] 302 00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:36,119 [eerie music] 303 00:18:36,200 --> 00:18:38,279 - We were there just about every night. 304 00:18:39,200 --> 00:18:42,000 It was too fascinating not to. 305 00:18:45,200 --> 00:18:45,839 - We'd be sitting in the sitting room 306 00:18:45,920 --> 00:18:49,960 for hours and hours 307 00:18:50,039 --> 00:18:52,519 just waiting for something to happen. 308 00:18:52,599 --> 00:18:55,440 And then, bang! 309 00:18:57,119 --> 00:19:00,960 Got upstairs to find this bed that turned itself sideways 310 00:19:01,039 --> 00:19:03,319 and was stood up against the wall. 311 00:19:03,400 --> 00:19:05,920 And we couldn't have done that between us, 312 00:19:06,000 --> 00:19:08,000 and let alone children. 313 00:19:10,440 --> 00:19:11,519 And heavy chests of drawers, 314 00:19:11,599 --> 00:19:15,480 big pieces of furniture would move. 315 00:19:15,559 --> 00:19:19,160 Chairs would slide across floors staying upright. 316 00:19:23,440 --> 00:19:28,839 My role then was to do sort of continuity pictures. 317 00:19:28,920 --> 00:19:30,440 So I'd go into the house, and I'd take a picture 318 00:19:30,519 --> 00:19:34,640 of each room, showing everything that was there. 319 00:19:34,720 --> 00:19:37,079 And then when something happened, 320 00:19:37,160 --> 00:19:39,240 piece of furniture moved or whatever, 321 00:19:39,319 --> 00:19:42,000 I'd be the first one to go back in and take a picture again. 322 00:19:44,440 --> 00:19:49,279 Everywhere Janet went, it seemed to follow her around. 323 00:19:49,359 --> 00:19:51,519 That was quite frightening for her. 324 00:19:51,599 --> 00:19:55,200 She hated that. 325 00:19:55,279 --> 00:19:57,039 There was just so much of it. 326 00:20:00,440 --> 00:20:05,240 We were seriously worried that somebody at some point 327 00:20:05,319 --> 00:20:09,440 could get hurt and could be badly hurt. 328 00:20:13,359 --> 00:20:20,319 ♪ ♪ 329 00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:33,000 [soft scratching] 330 00:20:36,799 --> 00:20:40,519 [ominous music] 331 00:20:40,599 --> 00:20:43,599 [loud scraping] 332 00:20:50,319 --> 00:20:53,640 - There's an old fireplace in the bedroom. 333 00:20:53,720 --> 00:20:57,240 Janet said to me, "I can hear this scraping sound." 334 00:20:57,319 --> 00:20:59,559 And she says, "Oh, my God, the fireplace is moving." 335 00:20:59,640 --> 00:21:04,880 And all at once, the front of the fireplace lifted up, 336 00:21:04,960 --> 00:21:06,960 and it lifted right over the double bed 337 00:21:07,039 --> 00:21:10,440 and right onto the side of the camp bed 338 00:21:10,519 --> 00:21:12,720 because Billy was next to me at that time. 339 00:21:14,680 --> 00:21:16,160 We just sat there looking at one another. 340 00:21:16,240 --> 00:21:18,480 We didn't know what to do. We were so scared. 341 00:21:20,680 --> 00:21:25,200 - A fireplace had flown across the room and almost hit Billy, 342 00:21:25,279 --> 00:21:27,640 the seven-year-old boy, in the face. 343 00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:33,240 It could have killed him. 344 00:21:36,720 --> 00:21:39,480 - The fireplace was a turning point as to my father. 345 00:21:39,559 --> 00:21:42,440 For the first time, it was dangerous 346 00:21:42,519 --> 00:21:43,640 and worried him hugely. 347 00:21:46,839 --> 00:21:48,799 - Mum was beside herself. 348 00:21:48,880 --> 00:21:51,519 Mum was trying to bring up four kids, no husband, 349 00:21:51,599 --> 00:21:54,119 and just didn't need it, you know. 350 00:21:54,200 --> 00:21:57,400 So it was just awful. 351 00:21:57,480 --> 00:21:59,519 It was just too much for her. 352 00:21:59,599 --> 00:22:02,279 [high-pitched ringing] 353 00:22:04,440 --> 00:22:05,920 Janet couldn't get away from it, couldn't shake it off. 354 00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:09,680 It was just always with her... 355 00:22:12,640 --> 00:22:13,119 Whatever it was. 356 00:22:32,680 --> 00:22:36,119 - As the activity gained in momentum, 357 00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:37,720 it changed. 358 00:22:39,960 --> 00:22:43,480 It became more intelligent. 359 00:22:43,559 --> 00:22:47,079 - Are you a male spirit? 360 00:22:49,319 --> 00:22:53,759 Knock one for no and two for yes. 361 00:22:53,839 --> 00:22:55,319 [two knocks] 362 00:22:55,400 --> 00:22:57,000 - Two. - It's two. 363 00:22:57,079 --> 00:22:57,960 You are a male spirit. 364 00:22:58,039 --> 00:23:01,240 Did you used to live in this house? 365 00:23:02,759 --> 00:23:03,839 [two knocks] 366 00:23:03,920 --> 00:23:06,119 You did. 367 00:23:06,200 --> 00:23:09,359 Was it--was it more than 50 years ago? 368 00:23:09,440 --> 00:23:11,440 [two knocks] 369 00:23:11,519 --> 00:23:12,559 Yes. 370 00:23:15,039 --> 00:23:18,440 Did you--did you die in this house? 371 00:23:18,519 --> 00:23:19,359 Did you pass on? [two knocks] 372 00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:21,720 You did pass on in this house. 373 00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:32,319 - That's when he realized he was dealing 374 00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:36,200 with some form of entity that could communicate. 375 00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:48,920 - What happened next was completely unexpected 376 00:23:49,000 --> 00:23:50,720 and very disturbing. 377 00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:54,200 - I want you to call out my name, 378 00:23:54,279 --> 00:23:58,039 my complete name, Maurice Grosse. 379 00:24:02,440 --> 00:24:05,920 - These voices came from Janet. 380 00:24:06,000 --> 00:24:07,680 And they were very strange and gruff 381 00:24:07,759 --> 00:24:11,039 and very deep like a grumpy old man. 382 00:24:12,920 --> 00:24:15,359 - Come on. Let me hear you say my name. 383 00:24:21,359 --> 00:24:22,640 - Maurice. 384 00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:26,119 Maurice. 385 00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:30,880 Maurice. 386 00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:34,599 - I thought, well, I've got to record that, 387 00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:36,759 so with Maurice Grosse, 388 00:24:36,839 --> 00:24:38,880 I went and talked to the girl. 389 00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:40,880 And the voice just started talking. 390 00:25:19,920 --> 00:25:21,599 - People say to me, where do the voices come from? 391 00:25:21,680 --> 00:25:22,680 I don't know. They were just there. 392 00:25:22,759 --> 00:25:26,000 Really strange. 393 00:25:26,079 --> 00:25:27,720 I've never known anything like it, 394 00:25:27,799 --> 00:25:29,000 but then that's true of most of the Enfield poltergeist. 395 00:25:29,079 --> 00:25:31,279 I mean, I've never known anything like it 396 00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:32,400 before or since. 397 00:25:39,079 --> 00:25:42,880 ♪ ♪ 398 00:25:42,960 --> 00:25:46,000 - I was a skeptic, absolutely skeptical, 399 00:25:46,079 --> 00:25:48,160 until I stepped into the house. 400 00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:51,400 And at about 9:00 in the evening, 401 00:25:51,480 --> 00:25:54,039 the kids were going to bed. 402 00:25:54,119 --> 00:25:56,079 [electric crackling] 403 00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:06,680 And the kids were in the room, the door was closed, 404 00:26:06,759 --> 00:26:10,880 and almost immediately this voice started, 405 00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:14,599 this old man's voice talking. 406 00:26:16,680 --> 00:26:18,960 I went into the room, and I was told 407 00:26:19,039 --> 00:26:22,039 I had to stand facing the door. 408 00:26:25,000 --> 00:26:28,200 I said to him, to the voice, I said... 409 00:26:28,279 --> 00:26:31,960 I want you to tell me whether you remember 410 00:26:32,039 --> 00:26:34,880 what happened to you when you died. 411 00:26:36,359 --> 00:26:39,480 And he said, "I'm Bill Wilkins..." 412 00:26:39,559 --> 00:26:42,039 both: "And I died 15 years ago. 413 00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:44,519 "I'm 72 years old, 414 00:26:44,599 --> 00:26:47,440 "and I used to live here. 415 00:26:47,519 --> 00:26:50,240 "Just before I died, I went blind. 416 00:26:50,319 --> 00:26:51,960 And then I had a hemorrhage..." 417 00:27:05,039 --> 00:27:09,079 - It had identified itself as Bill Wilkins. 418 00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:13,559 The intellect behind the voice was not Janet's. 419 00:27:13,640 --> 00:27:17,799 Can an 11-year-old child speak in a gruff old man's voice 420 00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:21,279 for literally an hour or more 421 00:27:21,359 --> 00:27:23,400 and not show any sign of distress, 422 00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:25,440 not cough, not splutter? 423 00:27:25,519 --> 00:27:28,279 You would say, that is impossible, 424 00:27:28,359 --> 00:27:29,400 and that's my position. 425 00:27:29,480 --> 00:27:32,440 Also, the chances of Janet even knowing 426 00:27:32,519 --> 00:27:35,920 what a hemorrhage was had to be close to zero, 427 00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:39,839 so we're talking about language and knowledge 428 00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:44,039 which was outside of Janet's experience or understanding. 429 00:27:47,359 --> 00:27:51,960 Obviously, the examination of the voice to try 430 00:27:52,039 --> 00:27:53,799 and discover what it was and where it was coming from 431 00:27:53,880 --> 00:27:56,079 was of paramount importance. 432 00:27:59,079 --> 00:28:01,240 They asked Janet to put some water in her mouth 433 00:28:01,319 --> 00:28:02,599 but not swallow, 434 00:28:02,680 --> 00:28:05,680 and then they put some tape over her mouth. 435 00:28:05,759 --> 00:28:09,039 So the water was in her mouth, and her mouth was taped shut. 436 00:28:09,119 --> 00:28:15,079 ♪ ♪ 437 00:28:28,119 --> 00:28:31,599 The voice was not coming from her. 438 00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:33,680 It was coming from behind her. 439 00:28:36,119 --> 00:28:39,880 - I could see the family deteriorating 440 00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:43,640 because the upheaval of not only 441 00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:45,519 what was happening in the house, 442 00:28:45,599 --> 00:28:50,960 but also having all these strangers coming to your house 443 00:28:51,039 --> 00:28:53,079 to do whatever they needed to do to prove 444 00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:54,920 that this thing was happening. 445 00:28:56,400 --> 00:28:59,480 Maurice Grosse was quite excited about the whole thing 446 00:28:59,559 --> 00:29:03,319 because this was suddenly taking on a different feel. 447 00:29:03,400 --> 00:29:08,880 And Janet, who was just completely mystified, 448 00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:10,599 wanted it to go away. 449 00:29:14,799 --> 00:29:16,400 There she is a 12-year-old girl 450 00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:19,720 being possessed by a 72-year-old man 451 00:29:19,799 --> 00:29:23,319 who died in a chair downstairs years before. 452 00:29:25,079 --> 00:29:27,880 This was taking over her life. 453 00:29:35,160 --> 00:29:37,039 [child screaming] 454 00:29:37,119 --> 00:29:39,559 Suddenly one night, there was this enormous scream 455 00:29:39,640 --> 00:29:42,359 and then a crash. 456 00:29:42,440 --> 00:29:46,200 Everybody rushed upstairs to see what had happened 457 00:29:46,279 --> 00:29:50,160 and found Janet lying facedown on the floor 458 00:29:50,240 --> 00:29:52,640 in a bit of a heap. 459 00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:54,039 Maurice asked her what happened, 460 00:29:54,119 --> 00:29:56,480 and she just said that there was someone there 461 00:29:56,559 --> 00:29:59,720 who had just grabbed her and thrown her out of bed, 462 00:29:59,799 --> 00:30:01,200 thrown her across the room. 463 00:30:01,279 --> 00:30:05,720 So I had to then try and photograph it somehow. 464 00:30:05,799 --> 00:30:08,839 [tense music] 465 00:30:08,920 --> 00:30:15,039 ♪ ♪ 466 00:30:15,119 --> 00:30:20,039 So I set up a camera on a tripod, 467 00:30:20,119 --> 00:30:22,319 corner of the room, flash gun. 468 00:30:40,839 --> 00:30:42,599 The camera was triggered by a cable 469 00:30:42,680 --> 00:30:45,799 that ran down the stairs into the room below 470 00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:49,720 where we were all sat with a tape recorder running 471 00:30:49,799 --> 00:30:53,160 where we could hear what was happening live in the room. 472 00:30:57,000 --> 00:31:00,039 And as soon as we heard a noise, 473 00:31:00,119 --> 00:31:01,440 I'd hit the button, it would take loads of pictures. 474 00:31:01,519 --> 00:31:03,359 [loud thud] 475 00:31:06,160 --> 00:31:12,160 ♪ ♪ 476 00:31:35,480 --> 00:31:37,039 When the pictures were taken, they were at least 477 00:31:37,119 --> 00:31:40,640 a sixth of a second between each frame. 478 00:31:40,720 --> 00:31:45,160 She started off flat in bed normally. 479 00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:48,160 The next shot, the covers had come away. 480 00:31:48,240 --> 00:31:50,839 Her arms were flat by her side. 481 00:31:50,920 --> 00:31:54,279 There is no picture of her between flat 482 00:31:54,359 --> 00:31:57,000 and coming out of the bed. 483 00:31:57,079 --> 00:31:59,720 There's not one picture of her climbing up 484 00:31:59,799 --> 00:32:02,799 or moving the covers down to get her legs out or anything. 485 00:32:02,880 --> 00:32:04,720 She's gone from that to that. 486 00:32:04,799 --> 00:32:06,720 - She's literally flying... - In a sixth of a second. 487 00:32:06,799 --> 00:32:10,039 - Was that a big distance that Janet was thrown? 488 00:32:10,119 --> 00:32:12,279 - Across a room, uh, 489 00:32:12,359 --> 00:32:18,319 you'd be looking at about 3 or 4 meters. 490 00:32:18,400 --> 00:32:20,200 That's quite a force to be able 491 00:32:20,279 --> 00:32:22,319 to pick up a 12-year-old girl. 492 00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:25,920 That could have done her some serious damage. 493 00:32:27,720 --> 00:32:30,200 Maurice, as soon as he'd seen the pictures, 494 00:32:30,279 --> 00:32:32,960 he then said, oh, they're levitating. 495 00:32:34,920 --> 00:32:37,960 But there were lots of different theories 496 00:32:38,039 --> 00:32:41,119 as to why they could or could not be levitation. 497 00:32:46,279 --> 00:32:47,640 - The number of people that have looked 498 00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:51,000 at that photograph and said, 499 00:32:51,079 --> 00:32:53,920 "She's just jumping." 500 00:32:54,000 --> 00:32:55,559 You know, you'll get people saying, 501 00:32:55,640 --> 00:32:58,039 should her knees be flexed and so on. 502 00:32:58,119 --> 00:33:00,319 You know, would her body be in that position? 503 00:33:00,400 --> 00:33:03,680 But I just looked at the face, and I thought to myself, 504 00:33:03,759 --> 00:33:06,759 mm, that's not someone who's playing. 505 00:33:08,440 --> 00:33:10,359 [ominous music] 506 00:33:10,440 --> 00:33:17,039 ♪ ♪ 507 00:33:18,960 --> 00:33:21,720 - It was reported by several people 508 00:33:21,799 --> 00:33:23,079 who had nothing to do with the family 509 00:33:23,160 --> 00:33:26,079 that they'd seen Janet floating 510 00:33:26,160 --> 00:33:28,160 around the upstairs bedroom. 511 00:33:34,839 --> 00:33:37,920 I went and interviewed two eyewitnesses, 512 00:33:38,000 --> 00:33:39,119 one of whom was the school crossing warden. 513 00:33:39,200 --> 00:33:42,440 The house was opposite the school. 514 00:33:42,519 --> 00:33:44,359 And she had looked up 515 00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:47,559 and seen Janet floating around the room. 516 00:33:47,640 --> 00:33:50,519 And she was very shaken by this, 517 00:33:50,599 --> 00:33:52,880 but she was prepared to be interviewed about it. 518 00:33:54,839 --> 00:33:56,680 - I was standing there looking, and all of a sudden, 519 00:33:56,759 --> 00:34:00,920 I saw the middle girl, Janet, 520 00:34:01,000 --> 00:34:03,519 going up and down in front of the window. 521 00:34:03,599 --> 00:34:05,359 Well, I thought that she was jumping 522 00:34:05,440 --> 00:34:07,039 up and down on the bed. 523 00:34:07,119 --> 00:34:10,840 But when I looked, she was horizontal, 524 00:34:10,920 --> 00:34:12,000 going up and down with her arms 525 00:34:12,079 --> 00:34:13,519 and legs going everywhere. 526 00:34:13,599 --> 00:34:18,480 And I suppose she did this about half a dozen times, 527 00:34:18,559 --> 00:34:20,280 and then it stopped. 528 00:34:22,599 --> 00:34:24,960 - What was interesting about all this 529 00:34:25,039 --> 00:34:29,039 was that people who had no skin in the game 530 00:34:29,119 --> 00:34:30,320 were prepared to be interviewed about it 531 00:34:30,400 --> 00:34:33,679 because they'd seen something so extraordinary. 532 00:34:39,079 --> 00:34:41,280 - The lollipop lady and the baker both believe 533 00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:44,400 that they saw Janet actually in the horizontal plane 534 00:34:44,480 --> 00:34:47,320 going up and down rather than this sort of straight up 535 00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:51,039 and straight down, almost like a triangle shape, 536 00:34:51,119 --> 00:34:53,559 which it looks like from Graham's photographs. 537 00:34:53,639 --> 00:34:55,519 If Janet was physically fit enough, 538 00:34:55,599 --> 00:34:58,719 which she possibly was, then there is a possibility 539 00:34:58,800 --> 00:35:01,440 that she could have been manufacturing this herself, 540 00:35:01,519 --> 00:35:03,280 and this sort of correlates, if you like, 541 00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:06,360 with "The Exorcist" film, which came out in 1974. 542 00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:09,039 Remember, this was all happening in 1977, 543 00:35:09,119 --> 00:35:11,760 and it's possible that Janet may have seen the film 544 00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:13,000 or seen clips of it somewhere or the other 545 00:35:13,079 --> 00:35:14,840 and that she was therefore trying to copy 546 00:35:14,920 --> 00:35:18,320 what was going on there. 547 00:35:18,400 --> 00:35:20,960 There were several members of the SPR who, 548 00:35:21,039 --> 00:35:23,760 without displaying a corporate viewpoint, 549 00:35:23,840 --> 00:35:28,400 as individuals felt that it was not real, the levitation. 550 00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:30,960 And they put that into print occasionally 551 00:35:31,039 --> 00:35:32,519 and defended their case. 552 00:35:32,599 --> 00:35:37,559 Maurice was very upset about some members being so hostile 553 00:35:37,639 --> 00:35:39,840 to his interpretation of what was going on. 554 00:35:39,920 --> 00:35:43,039 And so the controversy raged backwards and forwards. 555 00:35:43,119 --> 00:35:46,039 I think that a few members of the SPR felt 556 00:35:46,119 --> 00:35:49,840 that Janet's motive for levitating, 557 00:35:49,920 --> 00:35:51,199 if you want to call it that, 558 00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:53,039 was because she wanted to have fun. 559 00:35:53,119 --> 00:35:54,599 She wanted to draw attention to herself. 560 00:35:54,679 --> 00:35:55,760 She wanted to be special, 561 00:35:55,840 --> 00:35:57,880 because she was the star of the show 562 00:35:57,960 --> 00:35:59,559 for quite a bit at the time. 563 00:35:59,639 --> 00:36:00,760 And I think she probably enjoyed that 564 00:36:00,840 --> 00:36:03,039 as a break from some of the miseries 565 00:36:03,119 --> 00:36:04,719 that she was suffering in her childhood 566 00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:06,599 and at the time of her life. 567 00:36:15,119 --> 00:36:18,159 - I had been there up to four nights a week 568 00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:21,320 for months by the time we got 'round to the voices. 569 00:36:22,679 --> 00:36:24,559 It was getting a bit like a circus by then anyway. 570 00:36:24,639 --> 00:36:27,639 There were so many people coming and going in the house. 571 00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:29,000 All these experts were brought in, 572 00:36:29,079 --> 00:36:30,719 doctors and voice coaches, 573 00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:32,920 and all sorts of people that would be there 574 00:36:33,000 --> 00:36:37,000 to try and prove that she couldn't do this. 575 00:36:37,079 --> 00:36:38,800 It was crazy. 576 00:36:38,880 --> 00:36:44,159 It was like Victorians pitching up a Bedlam hospital, 577 00:36:44,239 --> 00:36:46,199 you know, and putting up scaffolding and looking 578 00:36:46,280 --> 00:36:48,679 over the wall and watching them for the afternoon. 579 00:36:50,239 --> 00:36:53,239 Janet wanted everything to go away. 580 00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:55,360 She was scared of the whole thing. 581 00:36:57,119 --> 00:36:59,199 I was really worried that she was gonna get 582 00:36:59,280 --> 00:37:00,079 seriously hurt at some point. 583 00:37:02,840 --> 00:37:04,400 - It did get worse and worse, 584 00:37:04,480 --> 00:37:06,440 and Janet did actually get quite ill. 585 00:37:08,039 --> 00:37:10,239 She was getting quite frightened 586 00:37:10,320 --> 00:37:14,039 by feeling that things were happening to her. 587 00:37:14,119 --> 00:37:16,840 She felt that something was pushing her around, 588 00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:18,760 pulling her out of bed, wrapping her in a curtain 589 00:37:18,840 --> 00:37:21,920 and nearly strangling her, making her fall down stairs. 590 00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:25,400 [soft dramatic music] 591 00:37:25,480 --> 00:37:29,000 She was put in the Maudsley for two months, 592 00:37:29,079 --> 00:37:31,960 which is a psychiatric hospital in South London. 593 00:37:32,039 --> 00:37:38,039 ♪ ♪ 594 00:37:56,119 --> 00:37:57,239 I visited her a week later, 595 00:37:57,320 --> 00:38:00,800 and she was calmer and more cheerful 596 00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:02,440 and said she was getting more sleep. 597 00:38:02,519 --> 00:38:04,119 And I think it was good for her 598 00:38:04,199 --> 00:38:06,280 to get away from the house 599 00:38:06,360 --> 00:38:09,639 because there were a lot of demands on her. 600 00:38:11,199 --> 00:38:14,199 The doctors gave her lots of tests, 601 00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:15,960 and they decided that she was just a normal child. 602 00:38:16,039 --> 00:38:19,480 There wasn't anything wrong with her. 603 00:38:19,559 --> 00:38:22,599 And she was discharged after six weeks. 604 00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:26,760 - After Janet got back from the Maudsley, 605 00:38:26,840 --> 00:38:28,039 the activity died down. 606 00:38:30,519 --> 00:38:32,159 It felt like it was time to go. 607 00:38:32,239 --> 00:38:34,360 It had run its course. 608 00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:35,000 That was it. 609 00:38:37,800 --> 00:38:40,960 Maurice was desperate to see it through to its end 610 00:38:41,039 --> 00:38:44,239 and found it very hard to leave it. 611 00:38:47,679 --> 00:38:52,559 It turned out that he also had a daughter called Janet, 612 00:38:52,639 --> 00:38:57,599 and she had died in a car crash recently, 613 00:38:57,679 --> 00:39:00,760 you know, just before he came along to the house. 614 00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:06,639 And he did mention that he was hoping somehow 615 00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:09,360 that it was his daughter trying to contact him. 616 00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:16,119 The chap who's coming along to try and solve 617 00:39:16,199 --> 00:39:20,559 the whole mystery was really being sort of sidetracked 618 00:39:20,639 --> 00:39:23,440 by this unfortunate incident 619 00:39:23,519 --> 00:39:24,679 that had happened with his daughter. 620 00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:31,760 - My sister, Janet, was two years younger than me. 621 00:39:31,840 --> 00:39:35,239 She decided she wanted to be a reporter. 622 00:39:35,320 --> 00:39:38,199 She had moved on to the Cardiff "Leader," 623 00:39:38,280 --> 00:39:39,760 and it was in Cardiff that she was killed 624 00:39:39,840 --> 00:39:42,519 in a motorcycle accident. 625 00:39:44,199 --> 00:39:45,880 When Janet died, obviously, 626 00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:49,760 the effect on my parents was profound. 627 00:39:49,840 --> 00:39:53,440 For my father, he found a practical outlet. 628 00:39:53,519 --> 00:39:58,199 He decided that he wanted to look at psychic phenomena, 629 00:39:58,280 --> 00:40:00,639 the paranormal, in more detail. 630 00:40:02,320 --> 00:40:05,480 When he arrived at the house, he was struck by the fact 631 00:40:05,559 --> 00:40:08,719 that one of the girls was called Janet. 632 00:40:08,800 --> 00:40:13,039 He didn't give it anything other than passing mention, 633 00:40:13,119 --> 00:40:15,920 the fact that she was called Janet. 634 00:40:16,000 --> 00:40:19,679 A lot of people thought it was terribly important. 635 00:40:19,760 --> 00:40:22,360 A lot of people tried to attribute to him 636 00:40:22,440 --> 00:40:25,679 an emotional connection to the case, 637 00:40:25,760 --> 00:40:28,239 to Janet, to what was going on-- 638 00:40:28,320 --> 00:40:29,639 entirely wrongly. 639 00:40:29,719 --> 00:40:32,599 It's an easy thought. 640 00:40:32,679 --> 00:40:34,599 But it wasn't one that was borne out, 641 00:40:34,679 --> 00:40:35,800 because at the end of the day, 642 00:40:35,880 --> 00:40:38,920 the entity was Bill Wilkins, 643 00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:40,039 not Janet Grosse. 644 00:40:42,679 --> 00:40:44,599 This was a statement of fact. 645 00:40:44,679 --> 00:40:47,719 So therefore, it should be verifiable. 646 00:40:49,079 --> 00:40:51,639 There was an extraordinary event 647 00:40:51,719 --> 00:40:55,079 that happens sometime later. 648 00:40:55,159 --> 00:40:58,599 My father was on a talk show on OBC, 649 00:40:58,679 --> 00:41:02,039 and they played some of the tape. 650 00:41:13,639 --> 00:41:16,039 - They had a phone call, and they said, 651 00:41:16,119 --> 00:41:17,400 a gentleman wants to speak to you. 652 00:41:17,480 --> 00:41:20,719 He says it's important. So they put him on, 653 00:41:20,800 --> 00:41:23,760 and he said, well, I know that voice. 654 00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:26,239 That was my father, Bill Wilkins. 655 00:41:29,480 --> 00:41:32,920 He did live in that house, went blind, 656 00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:35,639 had a hemorrhage, died downstairs, 657 00:41:35,719 --> 00:41:39,360 and he was buried in a cemetery down the road. 658 00:41:41,840 --> 00:41:45,159 "Treasured memories of dear husband and father, 659 00:41:45,239 --> 00:41:51,079 William Charles Wilkins, died 20th June, 1963." 660 00:41:51,159 --> 00:41:57,920 ♪ ♪ 661 00:41:58,000 --> 00:42:00,480 Do I believe in ghosts? 662 00:42:00,559 --> 00:42:03,719 It's hard to say no 663 00:42:03,800 --> 00:42:05,119 because I've had a conversation 664 00:42:05,199 --> 00:42:08,760 with Bill Wilkins, who's dead. 665 00:42:12,159 --> 00:42:16,039 It opens the door for such a question, 666 00:42:16,119 --> 00:42:19,039 and as a result, I can't close it. 667 00:42:34,239 --> 00:42:37,880 - The Enfield tapes are in that box. 668 00:42:37,960 --> 00:42:40,119 Those are the original reel to reels, 669 00:42:40,199 --> 00:42:41,840 and these are the Enfield cassette tapes 670 00:42:41,920 --> 00:42:44,719 that belonged to Maurice Grosse. 671 00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:46,920 So they're all in those boxes there. 672 00:42:47,000 --> 00:42:49,280 So these are the recordings that Maurice made 673 00:42:49,360 --> 00:42:53,639 of just about all the phenomena that occurred there 674 00:42:53,719 --> 00:42:57,840 from an auditory viewpoint between 1977 and 1979. 675 00:42:57,920 --> 00:43:00,000 - That's a long time. - Yeah. 676 00:43:00,079 --> 00:43:02,440 - Have you listened to all of it? 677 00:43:02,519 --> 00:43:05,960 - I've listened to all of the recordings twice. 678 00:43:06,039 --> 00:43:08,599 I would say hundreds of hours and approaching thousands 679 00:43:08,679 --> 00:43:10,000 of hours have been spent listening to it. 680 00:43:13,360 --> 00:43:15,840 I'm not happy with the voice at all 681 00:43:15,920 --> 00:43:18,400 because I think that it doesn't fit with me. 682 00:43:18,480 --> 00:43:21,559 I don't like the sort of things it was coming out with. 683 00:43:21,639 --> 00:43:22,760 A lot of the time it wanted to-- 684 00:43:22,840 --> 00:43:24,320 it swore a lot of the time, 685 00:43:24,400 --> 00:43:26,840 very bad swearing constantly, 686 00:43:26,920 --> 00:43:29,639 as if somebody is allowed to swear 687 00:43:29,719 --> 00:43:31,880 because they're not who they really are. 688 00:43:31,960 --> 00:43:33,039 So they can swear and get away with it 689 00:43:33,119 --> 00:43:35,679 because it's not me swearing, Mummy. 690 00:43:35,760 --> 00:43:37,920 It's the voice swearing. 691 00:43:39,400 --> 00:43:41,840 My overall thoughts about the case in Enfield 692 00:43:41,920 --> 00:43:45,079 are that I think that there was more playing about 693 00:43:45,159 --> 00:43:47,400 going on than Maurice believed there was, 694 00:43:47,480 --> 00:43:50,480 but I don't think it was all playing about. 695 00:43:50,559 --> 00:43:54,000 The incidents that I think from my own viewpoint 696 00:43:54,079 --> 00:43:58,280 have the most credit are things where things appeared on tape, 697 00:43:58,360 --> 00:44:00,280 so you could hear them-- alas you couldn't see them, 698 00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:03,039 but you could hear them, you could hear the reactions 699 00:44:03,119 --> 00:44:05,760 of the people, and you thought, well, 700 00:44:05,840 --> 00:44:10,239 there's something happening there that just doesn't fit. 701 00:44:10,320 --> 00:44:12,119 I do think some of the activities 702 00:44:12,199 --> 00:44:16,119 that occurred there were beyond our normal senses, 703 00:44:16,199 --> 00:44:20,239 and therefore needing to be investigated more. 704 00:44:20,320 --> 00:44:22,280 - I never want to do anything like this ever again 705 00:44:22,360 --> 00:44:23,719 because it was very disturbing. 706 00:44:23,800 --> 00:44:25,760 It was really worrying. 707 00:44:25,840 --> 00:44:29,000 It was dangerous and difficult, 708 00:44:29,079 --> 00:44:30,960 and you didn't know what was happening. 709 00:44:31,039 --> 00:44:32,800 And while it was extremely interesting 710 00:44:32,880 --> 00:44:35,280 to record it as an observer, 711 00:44:35,360 --> 00:44:37,840 it was very, very disturbing. 712 00:44:39,960 --> 00:44:41,039 - I don't mention it. 713 00:44:41,119 --> 00:44:44,840 I don't tell anyone I know. 714 00:44:44,920 --> 00:44:46,280 You know, I haven't told my wife. 715 00:44:46,360 --> 00:44:49,119 I hadn't told my daughters. 716 00:44:49,199 --> 00:44:51,840 I haven't told anyone really, 717 00:44:51,920 --> 00:44:53,440 because they wouldn't believe you. 718 00:44:53,519 --> 00:44:55,000 If you told them what happened, 719 00:44:55,079 --> 00:44:57,480 they'd just think you're mad. 720 00:44:57,559 --> 00:44:58,719 It's too strange. 721 00:44:58,800 --> 00:45:00,119 People can't get it into their heads. 722 00:45:03,079 --> 00:45:07,239 45 years later, I'm no closer now to knowing 723 00:45:07,320 --> 00:45:11,559 as I was on day one when I walked into the place. 724 00:45:13,679 --> 00:45:20,679 ♪ ♪ 52858

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