All language subtitles for Energy From The Vacuum 05_EN

In physics today.

There are some effects already established, well-established that prove, number one, the vacuum energy is there.

And number two, that not only does it interact, but number three, you can, in fact, get at least a little bit of it out of there in a measured experiment.

One of these, for example, is the "casimir effect".

To draw what that is.

Suppose I have two conducts in place.

These are very small, but I'm going to draw them pretty large so we can see them.

But I have two plates, conducting plates, very close together, but still separated, immersed in this vacuum flux.

These plates are being bombarded by all sorts of little bubbly particles appearing and moving.

While they're in existence they have lots of energy and they're moving with lots of kinetic energy and everything.

And then they just disappear.

They're little bubbles that bubble away.

But in this fiery cauldron, we have all sorts of frequencies and all sorts of things bombarding these plates.

So that's the first thing to realize, is the plates aren't just sitting in an empty space.

They're sitting in something that's really a boiling cauldron.

And they're being buffeted every which way by all kinds of frequencies and everything else.

A lot of energy going on, hitting these plates.

-In a practical sense, what are the plates are made of?

And are they placed...

They're conductive plates.

-Made of?

Could be copper.

They all use a special metal that's very pure to do the experiments because they want good experiments.

Now what happens is...

-It is the environment, there is, is it a special room or a special...

No, it's just, the criterium is it's sitting in the vacuum.

That's all you're worried about.

-Which for the common person would be just normal...

Empty space.

-Empty space.

Right.

-Just In a room.

Basically, what we have is in the laboratory, we have these two plates, conducting plates, sitting in what we would think of as empty space, nothing going on of any interest.

Well, it turns out because of the smallness, they're down to where they're directly interacting with these things.

And there is a lot going on.

These things act as a, in one sense, as tuned antennas, so to speak, from all of these many frequencies, infinite number of frequencies.

The distance across here selects out a set of frequencies, including their harmonics and all that fit between the plates.

Okay.

If we have an infinite number of frequencies and energy out here, we have a little bit lesser selected group inside here, we have an excess of pressure, so to speak, from the bombardment on the outside of the plates.

So these plates then are attracted or forced together.

There is an actual force between these plates which can be and has been measured.

"Casimir" did the, "Casimir" did the first experiments and all but the experiments in the, not too long back, were done very beautifully by another scientist here in the United States.

"Limuru" And the work is extraordinarily precise, extraordinarily beautiful, and has no question this effect exists.

This does produce some real energy and some real effects from the vacuum, but it's very, very small.

So its usefulness is, number one and clearly experimentally proved reaction to the virtual particle flux of the vacuum to produce some real energy, which is at least measurable.

So it's a proof of principle experiment.

It's not useful for the power industry, as far as I can see, unless somebody finds another variation of this thing that generates one heck of a lot more power.

In its present form, the experiment is not usable to generate power, but it does generate real energy.

It is measurable.

It has been very precisely measured and very carefully measured.

And it is there and it is a reaction with the vacuum.

-And they don't play any power to the plates or anything like that.

No, this is just two plates sitting in the vacuum.

You measure what comes into the plates from extra from the vacuum.

-Wow.

You don't have to, you don't have to put any power into it or anything.

It is a, of course, a very esoteric measurement problem.

So it's a really good problem that a physicist has to work on pretty hard to really do it accurately, but it has been done very accurately and there's no question about it being real.

-And patents have been awarded to "Mr.

Needham".

Somebody or.

Some folks have actually filed a patent, "Needham", for example, is one of them on the patent that pointing out that this does extract real energy from the vacuum.

And they have a couple of other variations they're looking at with, you know, different and antenotype arrangements.

So they can probably get a little bit more energy out.

But it's still, the problem with it is the amount of energy, the amount being taken from the vacuum so far at least is very small, but it's real.

The point is, it's like a small white crow.

It's still sufficient to prove that not all crows are black, even though it's a itty bitty crow.

It hasn't grown up yet.

Now the question is, how do we get him growing.

-Right So, but this is a "Casimir Effect".

It's a standard effect.

It's in you know, it's good physics has been good physics now for quite some time.

And the precise experiments to fully support this have been done and are in the literature.

So any really knowledgeable physicist will almost certainly agree with the fact that the "Casimir effect" is a demonstrated effect of energetic effects from the active vacuum.

-Very good, thank you, uh, essentially so is the standing wave that's creating the...

Yeah, basically the standing wave.

-So you kind of creating a different differential.

Is it kind of...

Well, what you're doing is you're sorting out frequencies from a whole batch of frequencies so that there's less frequencies.

Frequencies got energy, and I'm saying there's less energy and frequencies in between your place and the energy outside is bombarding them.

So you're not you're not balanced in forces.

Right.

You have the forces outside now being a little bit greater than the forces pushing back from the bombardment inside, and therefore, the plates appear to attract.

-Interesting.

They, in fact, are pushed together.

-Interesting.

Would you mind defining the dipole and then continuing on with the current standard of killing the dipole?

Okay.

-Thank you.

From the point we're coming from, where we want energy from the vacuum, usable energy to power lights and power motors and power homes.

We have to find a reaction.

Which can give us appreciable and hopefully electromagnetic energy from the vacuum.

Now, before 1957, we really didn't know precisely that there was such a reaction widely available.

But since 1957, we now know that.

It was the discovery of what's called broken symmetry.

"Lee" and "Yang" predicted it theoretically, particularly in 1956 and early '57, just the first part of '57, very short time frame there is when their work reached a pinnacle and the publications occurred, predicting, you know, real solid, broken symmetry.

What we're talking about is a broken symmetry in the virtual particle flux of the vacuum.

What that means is and this part is not just like this part, we've had a change in the vacuum.

That's what broken symmetry means.

And we've had a change big enough to be observable.

As "Lee" said, "any time you have a broken symmetry, something virtual has become observable".

So it means we have something now that is, at least in theory, is measurable.

It's big enough to be observed and measured, and broken Symmetry was that magic too that was predicted in '56 and '57.

But this was such an important prediction.

It was would be such a revolution.

Were it true that strong experimental physicists jumped on it immediately to prove it's either true or false, it was that important.

It had.

It needed to be done very quickly.

And they did.

And as a matter of fact, in February 1957, "Wu" and her colleagues, "Wu" has died recently.

"Wu" and her colleagues proved it experimentally, a very short period of time after the prediction, the impact and the implications of this to all of physics were so profound the Nobel Prize Committee also moved with unprecedented speed and awarded the Nobel Prize to "Lee" and "Yang" in the same year, in December of 1957.

So I'm trying to create the image of how sudden and strong a revolution this actually was and its immediate recognition.

One of those broken symmetries, one of those things that will take some virtual energy and change it into positive or observable energy that you can measure and detect was the broken symmetry of opposite charges.

So let's talk about a charge.

A charge is a very strange thing.

We really don't have a completely accurate definition of charge.

It's still a bit of a fuzzy concept, but we do know some facts about it and some of those we know way past the idea of charge back in the 1800s.

Particle physics in the 1900s has found out a lot about how charge behaves and how it ticks and how it interacts with things.

So if I have what we would call classically a charge, this could be just a single electron sitting in space.

It's not sitting in the empty space like we normally would consider it.

From the classical view, it's sitting in this boiling cauldron of virtual particle flux, just boiling every which way and bombarding it and little bitty tiny momentary photons being absorbed and being re radiated and all kinds of things.

Every time it absorbs a photon, it changes that into a little tiny differential of mass and so forth.

So there is a cauldron going on, and the charge itself is very dynamic.

As a matter of fact, if I place this charge in this cauldron in cold, empty space or preferably called the vacuum.

And suppose this is an electron, negative charge, surrounding it there will be a predominance of the opposite charges in these bubbles.

So I will have lots of little positive charges appearing and disappearing out here, everywhere at incredible speed.

Incredible speed.

Well, we know that if we have on opposite charges, we have what in classical theory is called force field lines.

Lines of force.

These are not yet force, but we do have lines of attraction and so forth.

Between these, there are opposite charges.

What we have is, we have what is now the broken symmetry of opposite charges, because I have one kind of charge here in the middle and around it is this huge screen of all these bubbles of opposite charges.

If I'm trying to look at this charge with an instrument or measure the charge, I'm not really measuring the charge.

I'm measuring through this green charges, which is infinite, by the way.

-Okay.

And the inner or what's called the bare charge, if I could get rid of all of this, green is also infinite.

But the difference is finite.

-Infinite in potential.

Not, infinite.

Really infinite.

Right now it's infinite.

-In energy?

In energy, unlimited energy.

No limit whatsoever in both sets of charges.

This entourage or this ensemble would be another word to say.

Is therefore involving two sets of infinite energy.

All kinds of flows of energy that's just unlimited.

So we have an incredible amount of energy going on here in just one single electron.

Remember, it's fields and interactions go out towards the end of the universe.

So it goes away, even if it's been around very long, it reaches out across the universe.

So we have this tremendous entourage, and our instruments cannot measure this internal charge.

We can only measure the difference what we see through this screen of opposite charges.

And that difference is the textbook value of the classic value of the charge of the electron.

-Okay.

That's what's printed in all the handbooks.

-The difference.

But the classical people stop right there.

The models stop right there with that difference.

If we want to talk about energy from the vacuum, we must go to the more modern knowledge.

Where we know what's going on is much greater than that.

And we know the only reason that we have any fields at all from this ensemble is this broken symmetry that was predicted and then proved, and a Nobel Prize awarded in 1957.

Because now I have all sorts of little dipoles that means one kind of charge on one end, separated at a distance from another charge that's a dipole or di-polarity.

And the broken symmetry of opposite charges are really the broken symmetry of di-polarity.

-What do you call broken symmetry?

Broken symmetry means it's not the same as it was before.

If it's being fed virtual stuff, something broken got up into the observable state, came up over the quantum threshold and it's real.

-Right, so that's what broken ...

Not everything is fish under the water anymore.

Some of them are whales that have jumped out of the water.

-So it's like a breakthrough.

It's a breakthrough from the vacuum up into the real, honest to God, ordinary world.

-Okay, that's alright, great.

So the importance of broken symmetry is it's a process for doing that.

And this means that this ensemble that we've just been talking about, one little old electron, is doing that, it's continuously absorbing this seething bubble energy, if you want to call it that.

The virtual state energy, changing that in the little bubbles of extra mass, just a tiny differential of mass.

And but that growth, because mass is unitary.

-So Is the physical from the invisible.

Yes.

And what it does is it keeps growing the differential.

You get one differential would be DM.

The first one that it absorbed would be DM for the total energy being absorbed.

DM one, well, then another one is absorbed.

So that's plus DM two.

M is the mass of this electron.

Then the third one is absorbed and is DM three and this stuff is just integrating because mass is just unitary.

You add some more, it adds just like throwing quarters on a scale.

-What's the D again?

The D is differential.

-Differential.

Differential, okay.

So as this process continues to add the addition of differential, which by the way, is what integration is mathematically.

This thing is integrating what would otherwise be disordered energy.

Cause there's no rhyme or reason to how these particles are absorbed.

But now they are.

They're ordered in the time in which they are absorbed by the mass and increase the mass.

When another increase in mass occurs, that mass, as you know, is energy.

The amount of energy in that mass is enough to make an observable photon.

This thing has just broke the surface and has become a whale which gets kicked out.

And this ensemble then emits a photon, a real or ordinary photon that will hit your film and record on your film and record on your instruments.

And right behind it is another and another, because the process just keeps going.

And another.

And another.

And these are photons.

Well, what the photons do when they continuously radiate out in a steady stream always replenished.

That's what we call a static feel.

Or if we're looking at the potential, it'll have a static potential.

It's not static at all.

It is steady state non-equilibrium.

So we have something which is freely pouring out real energy.

If you do not look at the vacuum and put all this crazy energy, the bubble energy, the virtual state energy, you appear to have violated conservation of energy law.

You have not.

Modern theory and science.

We know that is receiving the virtual stuff all the time.

So the energy is being input in a different form and its output in a very usable form.

The standard electromagnetic field and potentials associated with this source ensemble or the source charge.

-And that's what Daniel Lieb theorized.

And we've proved.

That's correct.

Now, they didn't go further and say this establishes the fields and all that.

The odd part of it is sometimes one part of physics doesn't talk to the other part, and it doesn't talk to electrical engineering and so forth.

The odd part is for over a hundred years, the problem of the source charge and how does it produces fields and all the energy associated with it has been unsolved.

It's what's called bas the most difficult problem in all of electro dynamics.

And if you take the classical view, it is difficult because you don't have any energy input.

You have a very steady output of flow of energy that just never stops, free.

-So they're viewed as a mystery.

And it's not a mystery.

That's right.

Because they can't dare say you are violating conservation of energy.

But in their model, their model doesn't recognize any source of energy input to it because it doesn't recognize the virtual state or, you know, particle physics, the bubbles.

It doesn't include them.

If the bubbles were not there, this thing would be creating energy and we would just have violated the conservation of energy law of the whole universe.

But that's not true.

It is continuously receiving energy.

Conservation of energy is very happy to remain intact.

The only problem is we have to understand the energy is now from an unusual source, but that's the source we are looking for.

-And thats...
The Active vacuum.

-That's the definition of broken symmetry.

Yes.

-Does an electron have mass?

Electron has mass, yes.

-But the photon has more?

No photon has no mass.

And the standard treatment in a curved space time.

If you want to get really technical, a photon can develop what we would call mass.

But in the standard treatment, the photon is massless, for a very simple reason.

If I visualize space time as flat and don't let it get curved and I have a photon.

Suppose I started out with a three dimensional object length, width and height, and I start to moving it.

The faster I move it, the more energy, kinetic energy it has.

But it also undergoes a contraction of the length along the line of motion and at the speed of light, that contraction reaches a length of zero.

And so now I have no mass, I have something that we would think looks like a flat plane moving at the speed of light.

That's usually the way they represent an electromagnetic wave, a plane wave, oscillations occurring in that plane.

But.

For our purposes, since we wish to power things, we now have something which pours out gobs of energy, lots of energy from the vacuum.

We have taken a tremendous jump from the "Casimir effect".

However, nobody pointed this out of how these fields are established and tied it back to the broken symmetry that got the Nobel Prize for "Lee" and "Yang" until actually the year 2000.

When I finally put it all together, I just took the bits and pieces like I do.

I went to particle physics and I found the pieces that already fit.

I didn't create all of this at all.

I just found it put it together, like putting pieces of a puzzle together and published it in the year 2000.

But this is the way the fields are made and established.

So.

It's nature's benevolent gift to us.

Nature has given us incredible numbers of absolute free energy generators.

that legitimately are taking the energy from the vacuum all the time and pouring it out as real, honest to God usable electromagnetic energy.

It's already there.

It's called a source charge, and it's this ensemble.

And how much energy can it pour out?

It's unlimited.

It's got two sets of infinite energy is working with.

So it can run forever.

The charges in the original mass in the universe been around for something like 13.7 billion years or so.

They have been doing this steadily for 13.7 billion years and they haven't run out yet.

They're still going at the same rate.

-All around us.

All around us.

So our problem now is we do not, contrary to the conventional wisdom.

we do not have to find the mechanism by which we can take energy from the vacuum.

Nature has given us that on a silver platter.

She has given us the things already doing it for us.

We now have to learn how to use it.

We want to collect this energy flow that's going out.

We want to pile up a bunch of charges so we get a lot more energy flow going out.

We don't want to mess with the charges in the dipoles, because if we kill the dipole, if we go back and kill our basic picture, we wipe this out.

We have no flow of energy.

The energy comes from the broken symmetry of opposite charges, and that's the dipole.

If we kill the dipolarity like we love to do in our own generators, we build, every time we're killing the dipolarity, we're shutting off the energy flow.

If we won't kill the dipolarity, any dipole, unless we want to throw away particle physics all together these days, any dipole will sit there for you and pour out of energy for the next 13.7 billion years.

So can you power your homes with energy from the vacuum?

Yes, but nature is not going to give it to you for free.

Once you understand the basic generator that nature has provided for you to use.

It's up to you to learn how to use the generators.

We're very crude there.

-So the concept is to take this model and multiply it or compress it into a larger volume.

That's right.

if we make enough electrons here or enough charges, a strong enough dipole.

it will produce enough energy flow that if we could only extract half of it or 1/10 of it or 1/1,000 of it, we could still power the United States.

The energy is there.

It can be taken from the vacuum and the mechanism for taking it has already been built by nature.

We don't have to rediscover it.

It's there.

And that Nobel Prize to "Lee" and "Yang" proves it.

An experimental work by "Wu" and so forth, and many others since then proves it also, experimentally.

So it's well established.

We just haven't cranked it into our electrical engineer.

And we're still using the 1865 stuff and 1880 stuff in our electrical engineering.

We are not using anything that has anything to do with the vacuum.

-So let's also go one step further and talk about the practical application of dipoles in current power systems and the killing of the dipoles.

Let's look at how, for example, an ordinary power system is really powered.

Because the electrical engineering model assumes correctly that all the fields and all the potentials are made from those source charges, they're produced by the source charges.

But erroneously, the model also assumes implicitly that the charge freely creates all that energy out of nothing at all.

So oddly, our electrical engineers are using a model today which assumes that every electromagnetic field.

Every electromagnetic potential and every joule of electromagnetic energy in this universe has been freely created from nothing at all.

-Magic.

Magic.

And I get it.

You've got to keep a sense of humor.

I get a chuckle out of it sometimes when these people start talking about perpetual motion and things like that.

Because the greatest advocates of a violation of the conservation of energy law are, in fact our electrical engineering departments, textbooks, professors and engineers, and they don't even know it.

They don't even question it.

They'd go, There is not so far as I can find out

A single book that you can go by that says:

"Here are the basic foundations assumptions in the present electrodynamics, classical Electrodynamics model we're using", like, for example, in electrical engineering, the "Maxwell- Heaviside" stuff.

And here are those that we already have found in physics to be wrong.

No such treatise or a book exists that I can find.

Now, you find some very fine scientists who point this out, "Wheeler", "Feynman" and so forth.

There's no force fields in back, and the model still assumes force field.

There's nothing there.

This has been known for a hundred years because it was destroyed in 1887.

The notion that force fields exist in space.

They haven't corrected the model since 1887.

And apparently.

This whole setup we have for our electrical power engineering and all, they have no intention of correcting the model for the next hundred years.

And it's seriously wrong.

-So the model, the current model assumes that the source charge comes from some magical.

The source charged creates energy out of nothing at all in their model.

There is no input to the source charge at all.

But they can't escape the fact that it has a steady input.

Why can't they escape it?

Because you can prove it experimentally.

You can certainly produce charge.

Let me show you.

At a point in the laboratory.

Suppose clever devil that i am.

We take this point, or some young grad student does this, real sharp and not much better than I would be at that.

We take a point in the laboratory and that's going to be the zero of our reference grid.

And every so often in measured intervals out here.

Since this is the thought experiment, we can be perfect.

We have perfect instrument packages at each point that can measure.

And since I can do this very conveniently, we will take the speed of light for one second.

Convert that to distance about 300 million meters.

Give or take a few.

And we're saying, regardless of how strong or how weak it is, these instruments are perfect.

We're going to measure it.

And so what I do is we begin being a thought experiment.

We can be perfect.

We instantaneously produce this charge in the laboratory.

Now, in real life, I can't quite do it instantaneously, and I have a little lead pulse.

We're going to just disavow that and throw that away.

What I'm interested in is what happens once this thing got formed.

So suddenly a charge appears at this zero point in the laboratory.

After one second.

The first instrument package reads.

Whatever the value of the field from that charge is spreading out, the photon density flux density at that point.

Is going to give the field intensity measurements and a potential intensity measurements here.

This instrument suddenly reads.

And it doesn't then die away.

It continues to read from now on.

If you wait a billion years, it will continue to read exactly the same value.

Okay.

That was one second.

The first instrument suddenly bang and it will read forever that amount, a field continually replenished and established there.

The second second, the second instrument package suddenly read.

The third one at the end of the third second.

And as the seconds pass, package after package after package.

Since this is a thought experiment, we ran these all the way up past the solar system.

If you wait one year.

There is a package out there just just beyond out there outside the solar system that suddenly reads.

And it will stay that reading as long as this charge stays in this lab right here and never varies and you don't destroy it.

So we can easily prove there is a continuous flow of energy strictly from the way the instrument package and on the real experiment.

We move in much closer, and we do it out to a certain length and that's good enough, proves the principle.

But it would work if we could do this in real life.

So we prove that there is a experimentally, we can easily demonstrate there is a continuous flow of energy from every charge.

Now the question is where that energy come from.

Cause we can integrate, you know, our engineers can do this very well.

They can take the instrument readings and they can integrate the energy density and they can come up with exact energy at any moment.

That's in that whole volume of space that's being filled with energy.

It gets thinner in density as you go out, of course, falls off as a square for the field.

And that's inversely as the square and inversely as the length for the potential.

But it does continue to remain non-zero to the end of the universe.

And so we have then incredible generators of energy.

Already with us called charges, source charges.

Which do take the energy from the vacuum and all the electromagnetic energy we have, all the field energy, all the fields, all the potentials come from those source charges.

And that comes from the vacuum.

Nothing we do has ever done anything but use vacuum energy.

And we called it electromagnetic field energy and electromagnetic potential energy.

-So it is like a permanent magnets.

Permanent magnet is a dipole.

So it's a, we call magnetic charge ,you see, a pole, a magnetic pole.

So what we have in a permanent magnet, we have a dipole, broken symmetry of dipole, of any dipole applies.

That permanent magnet is doing this process all the time.

But if the field is absolutely steady.

And you come and measure it, you come and measure it again and you come and measure it again.

Always be the same value at that same point.

You tend to think it's static.

Okay, let's reason about static.

Since this thing is flowing, you can't have a photon in space sitting still.

In free space, if there's a photon there, it's moving at the speed of light, or else we've got to throw away relativity.

Including special relativity.

We've got to get rid of it all together.

That's not true.

It is moving.

But the thing is, as "Tom Flandern" pointed out, you have two ways of looking at something static.

And he used a beautiful representation of a waterfall.

If the waterfall were truly static, it looks fixed.

If it's perfect, you know, assume a perfect one.

It looks beautiful and it's just always the same every time you look at it.

There it is.

Doesn't seem to have changed at all.

But every part inside internal part is in violent motion.

Moving on through and another part right behind it and then being replaced all the time.

So it is not a truly static waterfall that would be a frozen waterfall.

Instead, it's an unfrozen waterfall and in thermodynamics what it is, is a steady state flow.

It's a system in Non-equilibrium that is energy is steadily entering and steadily leaving, but it's doing so at a steady rate.

And the pure system definition of that is a non-equilibrium steady state condition.

And so in "Von Flandern’s" Unfrozen Waterfall.

Which is what a static field really is analogous to, we are looking at a non-equilibrium steady state condition.

Can we prove it?

Of course.

From our model, we just went through where the energy comes from out of the vacuum.

We have a steady flow of energy in this peculiar virtual state.

Into the charge being absorbed by.

Being transformed by the charge into this now observable photon energy that keeps flowing out of it at a steady rate.

It absorbs at a steady rate, changes it form, puts it out in another steady rate.

And that is the pure definition of a non-equilibrium steady state condition.

That extracts energy from the vacuum and turns it into real energy.

So we don't have to do the conversion.

I don't have to convert vacuum energy into real, usable, observable energy.

Nature already does every charge in the universe already does it, every dipole does it.

-So something like the "MEG" is just capitalizing on that.

Thats anything we do with electrical energy, we are capitalizing on what these charges are doing, taking the energy from the vacuum.

All the energy in any electromagnetic circuit comes from the dipolarities in the circuit.

The charges, you understand, in space establish their own dipolarities.

As we went through with the model of the charge in modern physics.

So everything is due to the dipolarities and is taking the energy right out of the vacuum.

It has nothing to do with cranking the shaft of the generator.

So what do we crank the shaft of a generator for in the first place?

Well, let's see.

Why don't we crank the shaft of a generator?

We have a nice generator here.

And if we're smart, we'll have a hydro electric.

River and turbine or something to turn the shaft so we don't have to pay for that, because that gets monotonous paying for all that.

But otherwise, we'll have to burn coal or something, heat boilers and make steam and run a steam turbine to crank the shaft.

And we've got to pay for a lot for all that.

But anyway, we have a shaft to the generator and we must continually crank the shaft of the generator.

And through electrical engineering and everything we have all absorbed with our mother's milk, you might say, as Einstein used the phrase.

The notion that it is this mechanical energy we crank into the shaft.

That gets translated from the terminals to go out into the external circuit up to all the loads and power everything.

That's not true.

That's not true at all.

First place.

I can't do anything in this, inside the generator with mechanical energy.

That won't get me a watt on the power line.

Power line doesn't transmit mechanical energy.

So I've got to change it to some kind of form, and other than that in the generator, because I want to work on charges.

Remember, every, all the energy comes from charges, if I want a flow of energy, I've got to separate charge it and get a dipole.

Well, if I turn this with the rotating field concept that Tesla gave us, if I turn this rotor inside this generator, I establish a rotating field.

Magnetic field.

Okay.

Now, I've transformed all the energy that I put in as mechanical energy into rotating magnetic field energy in this generator.

What does that do?

Doesn't go out on the power line.

It works on the charges inside the generator.

It forces the positive charges in one direction and the negative charges in the other direction.

So it gives us the dipolarity across the potentials of the generator.

-So we very crudely amplified the broken symmetry.

That's right.

It gives us the broken symmetry of the dipole by stablishing the dipole.

Okay.

We use all that magnetic field energy just to push that.

Because for a big circuit out there, it gets pretty hard to push it to establish the dipole because you have all these electrons ahead of you and behind you you've got to force all that apart.

To forms that dipolarity, but suppose you pay for that.

You pay enough share of the energy to get that done.

And you've got your dipole form.

Now, if you won't let anything happen to the dipole, the energy would flow from this generator forever.

How can I say that?

That is not perpetual motion.

Once I have the dipolarity, the energy is coming from the vacuum all the time.

Nature has been very kind and that's already proven in particle physics.

It is not in electrical engineering.

They don't even have an active vacuum to take any energy from.

They just wipe it out.

-They don't talk about it

So they think it came from the shaft energy.

It didn't.

Anyway, what happens is once I have the dipolarity established.

The dipolarity now interacting with a fierce vacuum and I did a good bit of charge, this is a big generator.

So I've got a lot of flow, got a lot of energy coming out of here.

So now there's a flow of energy going down.

This.

-Can be thousands of volts.

Thousands of volts, for example, going down this line, transmission line to go out there and power systems way down all over.

And so strange thing happens.

The two people who discovered energy flow which didn't exits.

That concept did not exist, energy flow through space during "Maxwell" time actually died in 1879, it wasn't born till the 1880s.

When it was created by "Pointing" and by "Heaviside" independently at the same time.

Interesting thing happens.

A little part of this flow of energy, which is around the conductors.

The conductors act sort of like a waveguide inverse.

To keep the flow of energy going along the path you want it to go.

So that's their function.

So the energy flows around here and the various charges and their fields inside the wire interact with it and divert a little bit of energy into the wires.

Little bit of that gets diverted in there, a tiny bit, a real tiny bit, maybe 1/10000000000000 of it.

That part that will diverge into the wire is the part that "pointing" considered.

He never considered anything but the energy that enters the wire.

He did not consider any of this or the process of the energy coming out.

Well, a very strange thing happens here beside Discovery that there's a big old energy component left.

After you diverge all the energy, you're going to diverge into the wires and that whole system.

There is far more energy than what you diverge that's still available, flowing outside of the wire.

It doesn't react with anything because it's in a curl form.

Divergence of the curl in flat spacetime is zero.

So it doesn't interact with anything normal in most spacetime is relatively flat that we function in.

So what we have is we have a very embarrassing thing.

This generator puts out maybe a trillion or 10 trillion times as much energy flow down the wire.

Well, most of it absolutely unused as what we put into the shaft of the generator.

See, this is not a big surprise.

Once we understand the source of the energy was really the vacuum.

It wasn't mechanical energy we put into the shaft.

But if you don't have that concept, if all you understand is what energy we put into the shaft, that's unthinkable.

Because now you seem to be creating energy out of nothing.

You have no source for this extra energy.

No, there is no vacuum born yet.

The active vacuum concept hadn't come in there in 1800s.

So they.

-But they knew the energy was there.

"Heaviside" knew it.

"Pointing" never had to bother with it because he never considered anything but the divergent component.

He never considered any other component of flow even being there.

And he considered all the energy came in here.

He got the flow wrong by 90 degrees, which "Heaviside" side correct it.

But "Heaviside" was a funny fellow.

He was a brilliant guy, it's his equations we use today and call it "Maxwell's equations" his truncation of them and his notation.

But he also never attended university.

And a lot of mathematicians and folks like that were always all over his case.

He created "Heaviside functions" and all kinds of brilliant things that they hated at first and later got established and used.

So "Heaviside" was a loner.

He was a hermit almost, and he died as a poor, starving hermit just in a little garret apartment, literally starved to death.

But anyway, he was honored eventually by the Royal Academy and everything else because of his great contributions.

But "Heaviside" discovered this extra component.

But he didn't dare, you know, just blatantly talk about it.

This moves us up to "Lorentz".

When we get up into the 1890 as the leading electrical scientist in the world was in fact "Lorentz".

"Lorentz" understood the work of both men.

But even the great "Lorentz" had some limitations.

If he tried to openly say that, yes, every generator we have is putting out enormously more energy than what we're putting in ourselves.

He'd have been tarred and feathered and put on a rail and ridden out of town.

And so he couldn't do that if he wanted to maintain his reputation and position and not be destroyed.

Nobody could.

So if you have a problem that you can't solve, we don't have the science born yet that will allow it to be solved.

But you are going to get crucified if you admit the problem.

Then the best thing you can do is eliminate the problem, which is what "Lorentz" did.

So "Lorentz" taught everybody to take the energy flow vector for the whole thing, integrated around a closed surface surrounding any point you want to choose anywhere.

And that does a neat thing.

Let's draw this closed surface all the way around this ball.

And I got some energy coming in here.

A little tiny bit of it gets diverged from that path.

The other large part goes right straight on through.

That integral will subtract the part that went through from the part to the end, and it'll only leave just the part that got diverged the "pointing component".

And every electrical engineer today is taught this little trick.

And the real purpose of this trick is not because it's the thing to do.

What it is it gets rid of an impossible problem they have refused to consider for over 100 years how to get a lot of energy out of the vacuum.

The question then is.

Can we really use this other, by the way, the "pointing" diversion flow.

Will in fact now match all the standard then we would go down and will power of the load.

We collect a lot of energy from the divergent flow of energy in here onto these electrons.

Flow in this current now, but all the current goes down the wire this way, comes back up through this way.

And so the voltage around the entire loop.

From the positive terminal to the negative terminal of this generator is exactly the same.

But opposite to the voltage the other way.

In one is the forward EMF pushing the current, the other is the current pushing back against the voltage, which is the back EMF.

You got to do work on it to make it go back up against the voltage, and when you do the chargers doing work on it destroys the dipole.

-The current return.

The current return, the equal current return.

And for the equal voltage.

That you have uphill "Lorentz's symmetric reengaging".

Which says.

That your forward EMF has been made equal to your back EMF and half of all the energy you collect in the external circuit.

Shall be used to do nothing but destroy the external source.

And his ability to take energy in the vacuum and give it to you.

So we kill the dipole, we get some energy in load, we kill the dipole.

Half the energy, kill the dipole, the other half, some of it got lost along the way in leaks, leakages and losses.

Less than half gotten the load.

So we use more to kill the dipole than we got in the load.

Well, to restore the dipole, you know, you've got to use at least equal amount of work on them to force them back apart.

-Brute force.

Brute force.

So you've got to put at least that amount of energy back in there if you had 100% efficient generator.

To force the charges back apart, restore the dipole and restore the flow of energy from the vacuum.

And that's more than what you got in the load.

The COP coefficient of performance, which is defined as.

The amount of useful energy I get out of work and out there in the load by the total amount I myself put in.

In this one, I myself will always have to put in more than what I get out in the load.

So the COP is less than 1.0.

The fraction there is less and more when you divide them.

So we specifically designed a system, a close current loop circuit where we make these two cards equal.

For the forward emf and back emf.

And we leave the generator wired in here.

So we can and will destroy the generators dipolarity and source of energy faster than we power the load.

So we always, to restore the dipolarity and keep taking energy from the vacuum.

We have to keep cranking the shaft of the generator and we're always going to be cranking it harder than the amount of stuff we get out in the load.

That is the stupidity of the present power systems we have designed for the last 100 years and built.

-No matter what is driving the load? The load is still there. You still have current return.

That's right.

Well, you don't have to.

There's no law of nature that says I have to use a closed current loop circuit test.

I went to a one wire circuit.

-Right. Right. So what? How does it?

Fire it into a capacitor on the other end and fired it back.

-In your projections of the future, assuming that we develop energy from the vacuum power sources, how does that fit in with the closed current loop system of using energy?

Oh, the first requirement to get an over unity electromagnetic system.

The first requirement is you must violate the closed current loop system.

That guarantees you have to put more energy in than you ever get out in the load.

You have to violate this, the way, there's several ways to violate it.

-But the short answer, is the load stay the same.The load is the load is the load.

Sure.

That's correct, that's no problem.

-Right. So.

Unless you want to power it with negative energy.

You want to design the load to be powered with negative energy.

Then the load will give you energy in addition to powering itself, it will take it from the vacuum.

-But using the current assumption of positive energy.

That positive energy, that's true.

The load is a load and an impedance is an impedance.

-Right. And so how does that, we still have to power the load

That's correct.

-And we still have to return the current.

No, we don't.

-We don't. Okay.

The only reason I return the current is they want to reuse it.

By the way, let's talk about current.

The current is not like water flowing through a pipe at all.

That's not what happens.

These electrons in these wires, the free electrons, are constantly hopping over one atom.

And hopping around and then hopping on to another atom.

They call that the "Drude Electron gas". "Drude" went through all of that back around 1900 or so.

And so what we have is an electron gas of these hopping electrons in the wire at any one time.

And when we put an energy flow down here, the flow runs through by all these charges.

Now it runs almost the speed of light.

If everything were perfect, it would run at the speed of light.

But we do have inductance, we have capacity and also it's a little bit less than speed of light.

That the actual potential, the actual energy flows down the wire.

Electrons don't flow like that on average, In an average little circuit, the electrons will flow about four inches per hour.

Hour, about four inches down the wire.

Because one has to pop and what you have is all the electron drift, on average it will drift a little bit in poppin and drift a little more.

It's a statistical thing of the drift that develops in these electrons.

The electron can't just take off down the wire because all the other electrons, gobs of them ahead of it, is repelling it.

So everything has got to interact with everything and do its hopping and its collisions and all.

And so you get a little drifting down the wire about four inches per hour.

As far as actual movement of the electrons down the wire longitudinally.

And you have the energy goes almost a speed of light.

Now one way to to violate all this stuff.

Suppose if you have a good conductor made of copper.

The response of the electrons to move in the current from the application of the voltage is so fast.

That you just have to consider it instantaneously.

Different people get different answers, but is up like 10 to the minus 16 seconds.

So incredibly short that, you know.

Forget about measuring the distance, the time between when you pop the voltage and when the car starts.

So effectively in normal circuits, we build copper wires and so forth.

The current goes as rapidly as we apply the voltage.

So we always got power going, we always got destruction of the dipole.

-If you got voltage, you got current.

But now suppose we slowed that down.

Suppose we froze those electron for a just a bit.

Like a millisecond, a thousandth of a second.

Oh, that's a long time for something that's flowing at the speed of light.

300 million meters per second.

That all you cut it down was 300,000 meters.

You see, that it could flow before your electrons would start if you just delayed them a millisecond.

So you've potentialized your home circuit with very little.

You know, there's always a teeny tiny little bit.

You don't quite get to zero, but with essentially zero curve.

If you built something that had a delay automatically in the conductors, you can do that.

If you dope this wire, if you take aluminum wire and doped with iron, 2% iron.

The numbers from the number crunchers come out looking like about a millisecond delay.

You can design that and change amount of iron and all that stuff until you get a millisecond delay.

We have to have an alloy now.

We want a nice equal alloy here.

We don't want particles stuck in everything.

If we have a nice alloy with about 2% of iron, give or take a little bit.

We can build a wire, which in fact will have about a millisecond delay.

Between the time you apply the voltage, if you very sharply apply the voltage.

And the time that any significant current gets going about a millisecond delay.

During that millisecond unless your, your circuit is greater than about 300,000 meters long.

That's 300 kilometers.

Normally, we don't use a circuit that big.

You can pontentialize that circuit with no current and no power and no work.

Energy's free.

Potential energy is free.

It doesn't cost you anything.

Come right out of the vacuum from your dipolarity and comes out free.

You only pay when you start doing work and dissipate energy and change it for more.

So what we would want to do is we want to get this circuit potentialized.

And we want to get this generator then disconnected and out of there before the current starts flowing.

We can do that.

Piece of cake.

You just got to have a metallurgical lab make that wire, which, unless you're going to buy a lot of it.

Is going to be frightfully expensive.

We looked into doing that and, you know, we weren't going to cough up 30 or 40,000 bucks to make that wire.

Unless you were going to get a lot of it made and so forth like that.

But for a research program in particular where people have their own metallurgy, you can do that and you can experiment with it.

Okay, what do we do?

We connect the generator very sharply.

And we immediately fired a voltage down the circuit and we potentialized a whole circuit.

Meanwhile, the current is frozen, its pinned, electrons are trying to get started down the wire, the iron and so forth is delaying them.

They're not moving.

So at that point we suddenly break loose the circuit from the generator, from the dipolar source.

We attach instead a semiconductor, a diode, that will only allow the current to flow this way.

And what happens is.

This circuit now with all this capacitance and all this potential its got and you can put this and that in there and experiment with how to do this optimally.

Whatever energy it has now collected, it will dissipate at least half of that in the load.

It'll discharge and power your load for free.

They cost you a little bit of switching cost.

You did not pay for an energy.

Meanwhile, you didn't destroy the dipolarity in the generator.

So you pop it again and you pop it again and you pop it again and you pop it again.

Now, in the real world, you do lose a tiny, tiny bit.

So after a while you're going to have to crank the shelf a little more.

But you're automatically in COP greater than 1.0.

You're going to have a lot more energy power in your load than you have to put into the shaft of the generator.

Now, that's a doable.

For example, if the Department of Energy really would get serious about innovative research.

This could be done by any of our national laboratories.

There's not a single one of them that will do this.

That's the last thing they wish to do.

They will work on hot fusion, they will work on fuel cells.

They will work on how to burn coal more efficiently, how to scrub it better, all sorts of things like that.

The last thing they will work on is anything that would change electrical engineering.

We're still stuck.

With a 100 and something year old model that's seriously flawed and everybody in the world is defending with his dying breath.

Instead of changing it like a scientist should do.

When the experiments refute the model.

The scientific procedure is to change the model.

Not seal the experiments as they did in cold fusion.

And not deny it, and continue to do business the old way so that we can maybe bankrupt the nation one of these days.

Because of the need for all and cost of energy.

But all of this is doable.

That's just one way that you could potentialize in static mode.

Disconnect your generator, Let the circuit now come alive and become a dynamic circuit.

And discharge the energy that it got for free.

But our engineers are taught that a static field is useless.

When it's the most precious thing we have.

There's pure flow of energy.

-It's a steady state flow.

That's right, its a steady state flow.

Use that flow for free from your dipolar source and don't kill the source.

That's the Ten Commandments put into one for free energy.

Don't destroy the source dipolarity because you're killing the extraction of energy from the vacuum.

You just never knew that.

...like section time with that storage element, which we were discussing the other day, in fact.

And there may be many other different devices or elements that can be dissolved or designed that will do the same thing.

I'm not trying to say that this is the only way.

-But in the same way of.

Right.

This is the basic approach that you have to think about, which is entirely different.

And foreign to the conventional engineer, electrical engineer, but you've got a positive and negative source of energy.

So what your controller does then is, it provides the oscillator and the timer...

Timing in here.

So what it's going to do is, is close the switch.

And energize the circuit and while that's closed, this will charge up from the energy here. But it's done quickly enough that no current.

We put an amperimeter in here. We should get virtually zero current.

So before current flows.

This switch is opened and the controller closes this switch.

And now you power the load with that, that much energy ,and it's just repeats and repeats.

That's all there is to it. It's really a DC that. A form of DC to DC converter.

But the difference is, the conventional circuit does the same thing.

But there is no switching. That's all one phase.

-Yeah.

Okay, you may have an on off switch or something, somewhere here.

But you can see now what you've got and you've got losses...

When you power the load, you'll never... The back EMF...

Will equal that and you'll never get more than, well, unity here through that load.

+Because also what you're doing with this circuit alternately, when you're switching and not allowing the current to take place before you can charge the storage device, you're not allowing anything to go back and it will destroy.

That's right. That's why the timing is critical here.

So you have to arrange it so that the storage element has to absorb the energy fast enough.

So you can switch off the dipole before the current starts to appear here.

If you just left it on, you would have this circuit.

Okay, essentially. Except the load would be this now. So you don't want to do that.

You've got to have the timing surge. And we know that when we just know one, well, we know two methods to do it.

One is a capacitor and "John" uses that technique, is a way to go.

The other is a coil that has, is made of a material that will slow down the relaxation time.

Which the relaxation time is what we're talking about with no current flowing during first initial time period when you turn it on.

Until you have a chance to open the switch and then switch it over.

The energy now is in here and we switch this one on and we put the energy into the load.

So this is what I was talking about, two phases.

*Would that be that called it would be a dope that was at 98% iron 2% aluminum.

Yeah. Now that's a little sensitive. According to "Tom" he, he hasn't defined.

*Published it in 1992.

Oh you did, okay

*I mean, that's how I knew it.

We know that if you can get a piece of wire that's made of 2% iron doped aluminum.

*Right.

That will give you something around a millisecond of relaxation, which is really too long.
+Just the wire of the circuit

+It's not to the storage device. The circuit, wire is you're talking about wich you have.

The wires could be copper.

+Okay.
*Okay.

But just inside here you just have a coil made of aluminum, that's just aluminum doped iron. That's all you need.

*But the problem is to manufacture that, you have to make it in an inert gas. And it's a really complicated.

Yeah, it's not a simple thing. You can't just run it into the lab and whip up a piece of wire with that.

So.

About that, that's all there is to it.

And it's just extremely simple once you understand the concept, and that's what "Tom" is trying to get across.

You have to change your thinking to from this type of circuit to this type of circuit with the two phases.

We're taught to do this.

It's over 100 years old.

And physics, you see.

At the time they put together the model.

It was the very best information we had.

Special relativity hadn't been born.

"Drude electron gas" wasn't known.

In fact, Electron hadn't even been discovered.

People didn't know there was such a thing as an electron.

The atom was a blob.

There was no structure in the atom.

as far as our models went.

-It clearly had energy.

That's right.

-They knew about energy.

That's right.

But the basic understanding that we've gone much further now in physics was not there.

If we'd have been back there in that day and age, we couldn't have done one bit better.

Maybe not as good because they did it real straightforward and real dedicated.

-And much like your own work they were studying phenomena.

That's correct.

-They were studying various kinds of energetic phenomena and defining and coming up with theoretical models to explain the phenomena.

What I've done is considered two things that come along at this late period when a lot of physics has been done.

It just had never been incorporated, has never made it out of the batch of physics where it was done.

Never did get really communicated.

People may say, Oh yeah, I've read about that, but that's it.

They never took it to mind and never changed the model.

So I had the good fortune that the physics is available, if you will go do some research and pull out the bits and pieces, it's there.

But it had never been put together and taken back over into electrical power engineering and start doing it in power.

The other advantage I had, I was very fortunate to be able to work with independent inventors who did have things working.

"Floyd Sweet", "Howard Johnson", "Frank Gordon" and people of that caliber.

I was able to work with inventors who actually had working prototypes or working experiments on the bench that did work.

Now, sometimes they were the devil in order to figure out what was going on and took years to do that.

But the experiments were there.

I was able to look at the phenomenology.

So if you have the phenomenology and if you have the basic modeling pieces needed.

It's not that difficult to find those pieces and deliberately keep fitting it to this phenomenology.

And let the phenomenology of the experiments be your filter.

That's called scientific method. It used to be anyway.

-Any newer than them that you find really useful since the discovery or the proving of broken symmetry?

Broken symmetry is widely used throughout physics today.

-Any more recent that you think is also

Oh yes.

The paper after paper after paper in the literature, since I don't gillions of papers and literature on symmetry and broken symmetry.

-But anything, any new discoveries that you find are equally as.

The new discoveries tend to be very esoteric.

For example, you now begin to question things like what form you have to think about reality in terms of.

-No, I mean, in terms of your interest in the.

Yes, there is.

For example, time come seriously and the question about what time is. You can use time as energy.

And time is just like nuclear energy.

It has the same energy density as mass when you convert it.

And so if you were to develop that aspect of it.

To use a little bit of time and convert it to energy, give up a little piece of time, that piece of time just a little bit.

Give you a lot of energy and it can be electromagnetic energy.

And so that's another way we will eventually go.

Another thing that drives you too, is you have to start considering negative energy as well as positive energy.

So it drives you directly in the actually hold before they become positrons.

So it drives you to the basic question because every conservation law is a symmetry.

You see.

And every time you have a broken symmetry, you have violated that conservation law, which means.

Looking at "Michael Leyton's" work, because we don't have the geometry right now to go that level.

But "Leyton" has given it to us in the late nineties.

If we use his object oriented geometry and better group theoretic methods.

We find that when we break symmetry, at one level we don't lose all that knowledge like we have always assumed.

What happens in nature is that knowledge is retained on a level.

But you create a new symmetry at the next higher level, and that source charge fits that exactly.

You break symmetry at the lower level, that is the virtual state.

You automatically generate a new symmetry, new conservation.

Up in the observable state called electromagnetic field energy, electromagnetic potential energy and so forth.

And it works.

So we have the gist of a new geometry that if we can crank that in and replace the old clean geometry from 1872.

If we can go to the much more modern geometry, object oriented geometry that "Leyton" has given us,"Michael Leyton".

We can now begin to get at many things like the source charge problem and things like that.

One more fundamental step than we ever were able to do before.

Now "Leyton's" work is being rigorously applied in robotics and things like that.

He gets, his stuff holds up and works a lot of times when the old claimed geometry just falls apart.

So it's good stuff and it's got plenty of experimental proof behind it.

But nobody has applied it yet to source charges and electrodynamics yet.

But it has a great field of application.

All I've done is point it out.

And the young fellows working on their doctorate thesis and the young post-grad will have to post-docs will have to do it.

But there's a whole field that hasn't been touched.

The Department of Energy should be up to it in their eyeballs, to their eyeballs.

They aren't.

They don't even.

They don't even recognize the term.

Because it's not the things they're doing already and already have set up.

Big organizations are like a big old ponderous ship.

You don't turn a ship on a dime that's full steam and moving ahead and all that way.

It turns over a long time.

And the same thing is true with any big ponderous organization.

It just turned very slowly, sometimes very frustratingly slowly.

But it can be turned, but it will always start from the young guys.

You know, it's so it's such a trite thing that historians of science just say it automatically.

Most of the science is done by people in their youth.

Einstein was a young Swiss patent clerk when he did relativity, for example, and things like that.

So.

The funny thing is.

To change the science, even though it's very slow, we have to get to the young people and get the message across to them.

Then they will come in.

I will look at the references they may make whatever changes have to be made to get it very precisely set, very precisely modeled.

And they will give us a new technology and a new science.

-So you think time can be used in the production of energy

Yes, I do indeed.

-Wow, That's really far...

There's no big deal in that.

When you have special relativity time, anytime you use velocity, you change a little bit of time into energy anyway, kinetic energy.

See, remember, you got to learn to think in a model that uses only one fundamental unit, energy.

Time is energy, is a function of energy.

So is mass, mass being energy doesn't bother us.

Now, after the atomic bomb and relativity and E was MC squared.

Even a grammar school kid knows that today.

But in this day, that was considered so shocking that it was almost unthinkable.

People would say, well, there's only ten or 12 people in the entire Earth who understand general relativity.

They would make statements like that.

And of course, that's trivial.

Once the young guys understand it, it spreads out.

Now you've got gillions of people that use it as a matter of course.

We're in an area where we need to make some changes of that nature.

And we can take energy from time, borrow a little time and use that up and get lots of energy.

We can modify a lot of the electrical power engineering stuff that we're doing.

Make that a much better model, remove some of the errors from it.

And suddenly we've got a whole vacuum set of energy.

Gobs of energy, and we've got this extra.

Tremendous component we're throwing away now from every generator and battery and everything else.

Available for use, the "Heaviside" compound.

So it's a rich energy field.

If we can ever get them to quit using.

The term innovative research, innovative science as a buzzword and actually use it as a scientific funded program.

And turn the young cats loose on it.

We have plenty of very experienced young people.

Fine training, excellent mathematical training, excellent theoreticians, excellent experimenters.

We have as fine a crop of young scientists we've ever had since we existed in this country.

We are not using them properly at all.

We're trying to put them in a cheese press and mold them into square heads.

They are forced to be now in fierce competition for dollars, for programs, for a post-grad program or to work on your doctorate.

-And we talked about it.

And we talked about the packages coming down.

You don't have any choice about the research.

It's already decided for you.

The faculty in the electrical engineering department or the faculty in the physics department at a leading university.

Doesn't sit down and decide what they're going to do in research.

They look at what's available to get funded to do.

And what they have to do.

And then maybe there's a tiny bit left over, somewhere of what we would like to do.

So what we're doing is really suppressing that scientific innovation.