Original subtitles

[music]

[Justin Kreutzmann] Hey, Dad.

So, how long you had this place?

[Bill] Um, gee, I don't know, 10 years?

Something like that now.

'Cause you moved here right after

the Grateful Dead stopped, right?

Yeah.

I wasn't in any bands that were--

you know, I couldn't find any place to play

that was gonna get me off like the Grateful Dead did.

It seems like a great place to come

to get some solace and sort of...

It is, it's like time out.

It was really great because it was different.

That's the key word in that sentence,

that it was a different place.

I didn't have to be in the same old

rock-and-roll genre, the old rock-and-roll line.

You know, you get to do something different.

[Justin] Since 1965, my father Bill Kreutzmann

played drums in the Grateful Dead,

and I grew up with the band.

In 2015, as I watched the four surviving members

play their last shows together,

I couldn't help but wonder,

why did my dad choose the drums?

I'm not a drummer, but the drums

have defined my dad's life.

And to really understand him, I knew I needed to go talk

to other drummers and their families,

because I did know one thing for sure.

Drummers aren't like you and me.

[drums playing]

[Michael Anthony] Just like it takes a certain

charismatic person to be a lead singer,

a drummer is kind of more like going to the Stone Age, man.

You got a guy who's hitting things with a stick, you know?

[Stewart Copeland] Music is wired right into us,

and we're all really good at it.

Some of us take it to extremes,

because Homo sapiens, we favor specialists.

So, in this wonderful world in which we live,

I get to play it, and you get to listen to it,

but you're better at it than you think.

[Don Was] The drummer's role in the band

is really the same as everybody else's role

in the band, which is to advance the narrative

of the storytelling.

[wind chimes jingling]

[gongs ringing]

[Mickey Hart] Talking about drums and drumming,

it's the heart of me, it's what makes me whole.

[electronic drums melodically ringing]

It's about the rhythm of everything.

It's about the rhythm of life.

We're just antenna, you know,

picking up the cosmic rhythms

and trying to interpret it.

[drums playing]

[Matt Sorum] Every human and the limbs

that we use to play that instrument,

and the heart and the soul that goes into it,

and the energy, is gonna be completely different

from one guy to the next.

[drums playing]

[Taylor Hawkins] I wasn't shining at anything,

and the second I sat on the drums,

it was like a bolt of lightning went through my body,

and I'll never forget that day.

And never from that second on

did I not say this is what I'm gonna do.

[Adrian Young] I always wanted to be a drummer.

I wanted to be a drummer bad.

Ever since I was very little, I just dreamed about it,

and I just thought to myself, I have to do this,

I have to play drums,

and at some point I'm going to play drums.

If you would go around and ask a lot of drummers,

I would say that 99% of them

come from interesting situations family-wise.

[music]

[Adrian] We were a rock and roll family.

My parents were in a band,

a rock and roll cover band,

and we kinda lived

a rock and roll lifestyle.

So, I was constantly around, you know, rehearsals,

and gigs, and that's what I knew.

My parents got me into rock and roll, no question.

One minute was Led Zeppelin, next minute's the Beatles,

next minute's Steely Dan,

and it was just a part of our musical experience

on a daily basis at home.

I mean, what parent goes,

"Hey, little Johnny,

why don't you take up the drums?"

[imitating playing drums]

Like, that's kinda--

we weren't in a big house or anything like that.

So, I wasn't encouraged in that way.

Music was always in our house,

and I always loved music and loved drumming.

I was the youngest of three.

My sister played piano and my brother played guitar.

So, when I was seven, I started to listen

to my brother's records,

and I listened to that music, and I loved that music.

I wanted to play like that.

I wanted to play the new, aggressive, loud music,

I want it to be music that I like,

which I think is kinda normal for a young kid.

My parents got divorced when I was very young,

and internally I was feeling fear,

and you know, the abandonment stuff.

And right about that same time,

my brothers and I sat in front of the TV

and watched "The Ed Sullivan Show,"

and it was just like that.

When I saw Ringo, I was just like, that's it.

I was five.

I got this little drum for Christmas that year.

I used it as a real outlet,

and I really feel looking back in retrospect

that that's what it was.

You pick a road and go down it,

and for me, it was rock and roll.

Okay, this is-- yeah.

My-- this is like, you know, my-- my hang room.

All my little funny things that I've collected

over the years on eBay.

And I like to have drum heads made.

There's Matt Cameron, one of my drum heroes.

There's Perry Farrell, one of my rock heroes.

There's Chris Cornell, rest his soul.

There's a poster, a Foo Fighters poster.

It's the only Foo Fighter poster

I have in here, really, but...

And I always thought it was funny

'cause there was Dave, and then there's me down there.

Um, here's my daughter, Everly.

Hi, say hi.

What's going on? How you doing?

All right, yeah, make your way in there.

I mean, this is a question,

not probably for this documentary.

But for you, like, how stable was your--

did your home life seem?

[music]

[Justin] This is what my home life looked like.

Growing up in the Grateful Dead

wasn't exactly "Leave It to Beaver."

The only way to keep the family together

was to go on the road,

where we were surrounded by partying, drugs,

and all kinds of craziness.

The one constant was music.

From the moment I was born, I was surrounded by it.

Don't get me wrong,

I love music and I love musicians.

But early on, I knew I wasn't one of them.

For my dad, it was a different story.

So, drumming is something that...

[Bill] Yeah, I had to do.

I remember when I first started playing music,

it made me feel good.

It really made me feel good,

and it allowed me to escape.

It allowed me, if my parents were arguing or fighting,

which they used to do,

I could lay on the couch and listen to music.

And I'd listen to New Orleans music.

I got into that 'cause my mom's from New Orleans.

She taught at Stanford University,

a modern dance class.

She'd get me in the corner and try to get me

to play the groove, right,

which was just rather embarrassing.

I tried, but it wasn't happening.

[Mickey] Billy, his mom had a dance class,

and he played for the dance class.

And he always had to come down hard on the one

so the dancers could stay in time,

and that's why he has such a powerful bass drum.

Well, I like to play drums in a way

that lets you dance.

I don't-- it's not all jazz music

or anything off the wall, it's like,

I like to put some bottom line to it.

[Justin] So, it was drums that only called you?

You didn't try to try out another instrument?

[Bill] They always seemed to. I mean, I've seen pictures

of me at Christmas and stuff,

where my parents give me a drum,

and I knock the heck out of that.

I think all kids do that growing up.

Yeah, I got-- I have to hit--

I have to hit it before you bring it in.

[drum booming]

Wait a minute, wait a minute.

Whoa. Whoa!

Ahh! I love it.

My father was a drummer, and so was my mother,

rudimental drummers.

My father had won the world championship in 1939

at the 1939 World's Fair.

And my mother, in the courting process,

learned how to play drums.

And she got really good at it,

and she won a world championship as well

in rudimental drumming.

So, I started as a rudimental drummer

taught by my parents.

[Kofi Baker] My dad was totally wild,

and a very angry person.

So yeah, that comes out in his drumming completely.

People don't realize how in depth

my dad's drumming was.

It wasn't just, you know,

slamming rock drumming.

He was very intricate.

And Cream was like the Grateful Dead.

It was a jam band, and they jammed their asses off.

I mean, obviously, they were taking a lot of drugs.

I mean, my dad used to say they used to take LSD

before they played, which I don't know

how you could possibly get on stage

and perform tripping, but he...

[Justin] I'm gonna introduce you to some of the guys

- from my dad's band. - Okay.

And they can explain to you

exactly how you get on stage tripping.

Okay, I'm sure they can!

[drums playing]

When I was like, before I can remember,

like two, three, four, he would teach me paradiddles.

I do remember him going out the room

and I'd play the paradiddle, and I'd just keep going,

and my hands would hurt, and I think I was crying,

and it was just like, he'd forgotten about me.

And I'd keep doing it 'cause, you know,

I knew if I stopped and he saw me stopped,

I'd get, you know, smacked for it.

[Justin] My dad's approach wasn't nearly as aggressive

as Ginger's, but it was hardly subtle.

One day, I came home from school

and he had set up a huge drumkit

that took up my entire bedroom.

I finally had to break it to him,

I just didn't want to be a drummer.

[Jim Keltner] Well, my dad was a drummer.

[Justin] So, did your dad show you the first stuff?

Was he sort of your first drum teacher?

[Jim] Well, no. Which, you know,

that's kind of a natural thing, is your dad is--

Well, you've got the same situation.

Did your dad teach you stuff?

I would have in a minute.

Maybe you don't remember,

but I actually handed you some sticks.

I said, "Here, do a roll,"

and you could do a press roll right now.

I went, "Where'd you learn that?"

And said, "I've been watching you."

Remember that? You sat down,

I handed you the sticks, I swear to God,

and you just went and did the roll.

You didn't wanna be a drummer. I tried to get you

to be a drummer, but you didn't wanna do it.

You already had gotten into film.

My dad never gave me lessons,

and that's the thing, is people always go like,

you know, "Did your dad teach you how to play drums?"

No, he didn't.

Give it up for Nic Collins, everybody!

[Nic] I've been playing drums for as long as I can remember.

They got me a drum set I think when I was like two or three.

It was always something that was there,

and it was always something I enjoyed doing

and loved doing.

And it wasn't forced upon me,

which I think is, like, the most important thing.

In any situation, if your kid

is doing the same thing as you are,

you can't push it upon him.

You kinda gotta let them do what they wanna do.

[Jason Bonham] Nic Collins is an amazing drummer.

I don't think you'd say

he was Phil Collins' son

if you listen to him playing

with his own band.

[Nic] But you know, at the beginning,

there'd be times we'd play a show,

and it's like, "Do the 'In the Air' fill!"

And it's like...

[Jason] You can ask nearly everybody,

if you said to them, "What song is..."

[singing "In the Air Tonight" drum fill]

People would know it.

That takes a lot.

You know, how many drummers out there

where you can say a drum fill?

[Phil Collins] And it gives me great pleasure...

to introduce to you on the drums

my 17-year-old son, Nicholas Collins,

on the drums.

[cheers and applause]

[Jason] He plays his dad's stuff so well.

He'd be happier if I said

he was more like Taylor Hawkins,

and he would.

And the Foos, that would make him really happy.

[Nic] My dad always had terrible posture playing drums,

and he was having real bad issues with his neck,

and had an operation which caused his foot

to have this thing called drop foot,

where basically you lose kind of all sensation

or movement, you know, control over your foot.

You know, because of that,

he couldn't really play drums anymore.

It's worked out in a way where if that didn't happen,

I wouldn't have had the chance to do this tour with him,

and you know, it wouldn't have become this really great thing

that it has become.

But you know, I do kind of-- every now and then,

I'm like, "Man, I wish you could play drums."

I always get the question after the show, it's like,

"You know, what's it like to play with your dad?

And you know, it must be awesome."

And you tend to forget.

You know, I'll be playing, and I'll just have

one of those moments, I'm like, you know,

this is really great that I get to share

that moment with him.

It kinda symbolizes this whole kind of father-son thing,

where it's more than just about the drumming side of it.

It's the fact that, to be able to do that

and to share that moment with your child

is just really, you know, a great thing

that I have the honor of kind of sharing with him.

People compare you to your dad as in, you know,

what he does, obviously.

I want to be a drummer.

That's just-- that's what's gonna happen.

You know, you're gonna be compared to him.

I mean, I'm sure it happens, you know, with everybody.

I'm sure, like, Jason Bonham gets it with his dad.

- How are you? - Hello.

Hi, how are you?

- Hi. - Hello.

For years of my life as a kid,

I grew up with that, yes, one day it might happen,

when Zeppelin would get back together,

and me on drums, in a perfect world.

But there's still always something so special

about playing with those guys, and a lot of it

is that feeling I'm very close to Dad.

Being at 14 and losing your father,

at the time, such high pedestal,

you know, not only-- you know, later on in life

I realized musically, but high in life

as a role model, as a figure.

You're like, my dad's my dad.

And I did find some huge amount of closure, for me,

while playing the music.

[Michael] Let's put it this way.

Everybody wanted to be Jimmy Page or Robert Plant.

And the guys that weren't singing or playing guitar,

they played drums 'cause they wanted to be John Bonham.

[Matt] Nobody can replicate John Bonham.

The closest guy to it is probably his son,

and that's because he was born with that.

It would be like any other thing you inherit.

The closest I've ever heard the foot is Jason Bonham.

He's got a similar thing.

Does that come from the heart?

Does that come-- I believe so.

It's all something that you're born with,

and he was lucky to have the bloodline.

[Jason] I remember waking up one Christmas morning

and there was a kit at the bottom of the bed

Santa had brought.

I don't actually remember being taught as such.

I remember I couldn't reach the hi-hat pedal properly,

or I'd hit the rim for a rhythmical part

of the kick drum.

And that's kinda how it started.

[drums playing]

[Stewart] I guess old Sandy Nelson

got me into the drums business

with that track, "Let There Be Drums."

When I first heard that particular song,

I was 11 or 12,

awaiting chest hair, and that song came on.

[imitating drum beat]

And suddenly, adult masculinity was revealed.

[music]

[Sandy Nelson] I didn't really show much hope

in playing drums.

And in band room in high school,

I wanted to play piano.

And I'd play these fake little jazz chords,

it sounds real cool.

And the trumpet player said, "Do that in B-flat."

B-flat?

So, I went with drums for 60 years.

Hell with B-flat.

[Bill Gibson] Huey and the News,

we went to Los Angeles and cut our first record

at American Recorders where they cut

"Let There Be Drums" by Sandy Nelson.

[Justin] Oh my goodness.

[Bill] The drum set was there.

- Oh, really? - Yeah, it was in the studio

at the time.

I sure remember being 13, 14 years old

and hearing "Let There Be Drums," for sure.

You know, I'd listen to that a lot.

[Slim Jim Phantom] Sandy Nelson I believe was the first one

to have an instrumental kinda drum-featured track

that was in the pop charts.

He's very important.

"Teen Beat's" a really good one too.

[drums playing]

[Sandy] My first record "Teen Beat,"

the last part I stole,

an old Dixieland drummer, Ben Pollack,

And he used to take the stick and go...

[thumping]

The story is that John Bonham was wondering what I did.

And since it was not an overdub,

you know, he was wondering what it was.

John drove his son nuts, Jason,

by playing "Teen Beat" for two days.

[drums playing]

[Slim Jim] These guys to me were mythic.

Anyone that's on black-and-white television

I have a little bit more respect for.

And then, Jerry Allison, he's certainly one

that I can listen to any of those records randomly

and say, "I do that one.

"I must have listened to this one 100 times,

'cause I totally do that."

Certainly a lot of stuff I got from Jerry Allison.

[Jerry Allison] I think we were like some

of the first white men

to really be heavy into rhythm and blues

and liking it.

And I took drum lessons.

And I think Buddy Holly,

he and I played so much together

that we could sort of play together,

like, you know, we sort of felt the same licks.

[engine turning over]

[engine starting, rumbling]

[Tre Cool] All the old drummers

of all the old records that we love,

like Elvis Presley records, Little Richard.

Those guys are slaying.

You could hear-- anyway, they're turned down a bit,

you know, but you can--

Try to put yourself in the situation

where if you're standing in that room

and that band was tearing ass, how cool would that be?

Yeah, it'd be scary.

[tapping beat]

[Charles Connor] Can you imagine that sound

with a bass player doing that rigid thing,

doing that too, and on the piano?

And that beat...

Contagious like a drug, like coke,

and you're like a drug with 'em.

You know, if it wasn't for Little Richard,

there wouldn't have been a Michael Jackson

or no Prince.

We the guys that dug the ditches.

Richard is the architect of rock and roll,

and I say I was the bricklayer

as far as the rhythm's concerned.

Most drummers I know are like jazz drummers,

and they lower themselves to rock and roll.

But I was mostly, you know, just hillbilly music,

'cause that's what was happening around a little bit.

and I raised myself to rock and roll.

[Charles singing rhythm]

Making the earth quake. [continues singing]

I'm originally from New Orleans, Louisiana.

I was born in French Quarters.

And when I was about four or five years old,

I used to beat on my mother's pots and pans.

Like big gumbo pots sound like a conga

and bongo, and everything like that.

Now, this is no joke.

When I was playing in my bedroom,

I heard some kind of pot and pan outside,

and I looked outside, and there was a lady going,

"This is what I hear every day at 3:30,

'ging, ging, ging, ging!'"

I said, "Yeah, let's jam together."

She kept doing it, and I just laid down,

and it was like... [imitating drum beat]

And, uh, I didn't make friends with that neighbor.

[Charles] I used to make a lot of noise,

and they said, "Oh, don't do it,

the neighbors, no..."

So, what my daddy, he say,

"Well, he got to learn some kind of way.

Just have patience, he got to learn some kind of way."

I like to know that people were listening.

[laughing] You know?

Or they were hearing, I don't know if they were listening.

[pot banging]

[announcer] Nobody decides to be a drummer.

[woman] Ralph, please.

[announcer] You just find yourself drumming.

[woman] Ralph, please!

[announcer] It doesn't make you instantly popular.

Ralph, please!

No one asks you to play their favorite tunes.

Ralph, please?

But with endless practice...

Ralph, please!

...and fanatical persistence...

[both] Ralph, please!

...you can get there.

Your drumming isn't just noise anymore.

And you're not the only one who thinks so.

- [cheers and applause] - Ralph, please!

[Stewart] And we're playing at the Embassy Beach Club,

and I'm playing...

♪ We gotta get out of this place ♪

There's Janet McRoberts.

I'm 12, she's 15, and she's dancing to my beat.

'Cause at the time, I was a late developer,

skinny little kid.

I could never get Janet McRoberts' attention

any other way.

But there's this instrument, this music,

this thing, this force.

The feeling of connection, of making people move,

particularly Janet McRoberts,

that is really powerful juju,

and very inspiring.

We always have to remember, tempos are emotion.

The BPM comes from the heart rate.

You know, when you say BPM, 60 BPM,

you know, that's-- that's a melancholy tempo.

Why do we feel sad?

Well, it's slowing my heart rate down.

It's making me think melancholy,

ideas of sadness, and whatever.

And then, when you bring that tempo up,

now you're into 120, and all of a sudden,

"Okay, I'm dancing."

That's a perfect idea of, like, double the heart rate.

Now, we're grooving.

Right, and then bump it up a little bit more,

and now you get into heavy metal.

You know, you get into, like, "I want to break stuff."

It's all based on your heart and what you're feeling.

That's the importance of rhythm within the music

and what we do as drummers, I guess, right?

[drums playing]

[John Densmore] Won't work without the inner metronome.

You know, you gotta have that feel.

So, it's the internal heartbeat.

And that internal heartbeat

is what makes people dance.

And it doesn't matter whether it's reggae,

or hip-hop, or whatever the hell.

We all groove on one.

It will grab you.

It will grab you-- attract your attention.

It's something-- something that when--

like, "ohh!"

You feel it. The listener feels it.

I wonder if feel can be taught.

It could be maybe explained to somebody--

what to look for, how to get into the mindset.

It's not a matter of, "No, hold the sticks like this,

or practice your rudiments thus."

But the mindset of how to sink yourself

into the pocket, how to feel where it is,

it's possible that you could explain,

or at least improve on somebody to do that.

I think feel is something you have in you.

I think my feel naturally is a push.

Like, I'm an on-top drummer like Stewart Copeland.

My natural feel is to push a band.

It's just the way I am, it's the way I play,

it's the way I hear music.

You know, guitar was cool and everything,

but the drums, it's like, you hit this thing,

and you hit that thing with your hand,

and your foot with this.

And it makes this groove

where you just feel it in your heart.

[Taylor] I saw Steven Adler, the drummer of Guns N' Roses,

the original drummer of Guns N' Roses,

and this poor kat, he's been through so much, man.

And he had a coke stroke,

and he kinda has a speech impediment now.

And I never met him in my life.

And I'm like, dude!

And I, like, went up to him, and I hugged him,

and I just go, "Do you know how many lives

"you ruined with your drumming, dude?

"You know how many houses got destroyed

"because kids were raging as hard as they could

"because of that fucking album?

"Because of your drum beats, and 'Welcome to the Jungle,'

"it drove people fucking crazy.

"They wanted to fuck, and do drugs, and party,

"and kick the neighbor's dog around,

all because of your fucking drumming, man."

And he was so stoked,

and I hugged him for like 15 minutes.

[Mickey] Most of the rhythms that we have here

in popular music came to us from Nigeria,

from West Africa.

[pitched drums playing]

It came from the slave trade,

and everybody picked up on it

because these were the power rhythms.

These were the trance rhythms.

And that's what it was originally used for,

it was used for the gods.

Pray to the gods.

[music]

♪ Yeah! ♪

[John] In Haiti, the main rhythm of possession

which gets the dancers to go out,

is three against four.

And it kind of does something to the brain cells.

It messes with your equilibrium a little bit.

And that's the magic. That's the mystery.

[Stephen P.] I think about those early drummers.

They were listening to jazz.

They were ja-- that's how they grew up.

- Exactly. - That was their era of music.

- That's right. - It wasn't rock and roll.

That's right, so that's why they swing.

They were the stars of it, so they were swing drummers.

And then you think-- well, I mean, like I say,

the guys that have all the chops,

can a girl move her butt to it?

And that's my point as a drummer from Africa

- and a djembe. - These...

- You want people to move. - The Grateful Dead, you know.

- Exactly. - Stoner boys,

they fucking grooved on their drums.

- You want people to move. - And they were moving.

- But they swang. - Oh, hell yeah.

They weren't just a "boom-cha, boom-cha."

- No, absolutely. - They were beautiful swingers.

[music]

I call myself a four-sided schizophrenic,

because you have to have four separate ideas going, right?

And then a single thing here.

You have to be able-- it's more than patting your head

and rubbing your stomach, 'cause you're doing it

with four things.

And... and that sort of relates after a while.

When you get that down in music,

in drumming particularly,

then you get so you can be dancing.

And that is really fine, 'cause you sit back there,

and it feels just like you're dancing.

[music]

[Jerry Garcia] When me and Pigpen,

and we were talking about putting together

a, you know, like electric blues band

or something of that sort.

The only drummers that I really played with

around that area that I felt

really had a nice feel was Bill.

I get a phone call.

Who is it? It's Jerry.

And Jerry calls me and says, "Hey, you wanna be in a band?"

I said yes right then, I didn't hesitate, nothing.

[Jerry] So, I talked to him, and he was--

he was just as weird as ever,

and I really didn't understand anything he said.

He was just like... [speaking gibberish]

You know. "What?"

He said... [speaking gibberish]

And I-- okay, you know.

For something about this guy,

I knew that if I stayed with him,

it was gonna be a far out trip.

I mean, that's how powerful he is.

Not was, is.

I didn't realize what a truly strange person he was

until we started getting high together.

Then that was a whole other--

a whole other Bill jumped out, you know.

I said to myself right then, to nobody else,

I said I'm gonna follow this guy forever.

And I didn't know how true that statement was gonna be.

[Jay Lane] Your pops is a subliminal drummer.

In fact, your pops is a hypnotist.

You know why? 'Cause every time

I've went and said, I'm gonna check Billy out

and try to learn what he's doing,

he starts swinging that little pendulum,

and I start dancing around,

like woo-hoo, start having a great time.

Then it's like 2:00 in the morning,

I'm like, oh man, damn, I was gonna check him out.

[Mickey] No one rocks harder and sweeter,

and rolling and swinging than Billy Kreutzmann.

End of story.

There's nobody like him. Nobody.

[Bill] The music changed from when we first started

the first year or so until 1967,

which was a big change,

'cause I brought Mickey into the band.

You know, it was something I really wanted to do,

and it was great for me.

A lot of stuff got much freer with him.

[music]

[Steve Ferrone] There's really something about playing

with another drummer, it's an exercise.

The importance of listening to the other drummer,

or feeling the other drummer,

so that you don't walk on each other.

You're not trying to like step out front and be the guy.

You're just-- you got this whole zone

that you have to be in to play together.

To do that, you have to be able to listen.

You really need to be able to listen to the other drummer.

[Mickey] So, the possibilities in rhythm are endless.

Rhythms are endless.

Bill and I find rhythms where there was no rhythms before.

[Don Was] I think that there's something really unique

in the approach that Mickey and Bill have.

Like, really unique and really cool.

I think Mickey comes from kind of a trained...

I know he was in marching bands and that kinda thing,

and he's got all that technique

and all that approach to rhythm.

And I think he brought that

into Bill's trap drumming, you know.

And the two of them together, it's a really effective,

and musical, and sophisticated,

and original approach to the two-drummer thing.

[music]

[Mickey] When I do something, Bill is already sensing it.

When Bill does something, I've already sensed it.

You know, I know-- I know pretty much where he's going.

He surprises me, I surprise him.

That's the-- you know,

spending hours together in the groove.

I can't imagine how many hours Bill and I have clocked,

you know, in the groove.

And we go long distance. We play for six, eight hours.

[Justin] Mickey was like a second father to me,

and not just because he and Dad were always drumming together.

[cheers and applause]

Growing up in the '70s, the Grateful Dead

was like one big family.

But on the road, there wasn't any kids around.

The roadies watched over us as best they could,

but we had to fend for ourselves.

In fact, there are pictures of me at shows

with "Justin" written on my shirt.

That's so security could find me

when I wandered off during a show.

[Bill] You grew up in the thick of it, dude.

And when you were born, you know that story, right?

- No. - Oh, I better tell you.

You mean I never told you about being born?

I was just nervous as can be, and I was talking too much,

and I probably had a little whiskey or something.

And I'm talking away, and the doctor wipes you off

and hands him to me to shut me up.

Hands you to me. So, I'm holding my wet son

in my arms, loving him, and that's what happened.

And then, we were at Woodstock, and that's why you came

to Woodstock, 'cause you were such a young baby.

[man] Can those of you in the back hear well?

The warning that I've received,

the brown acid that is circulating around us

is not specifically too good.

[Justin] My dad's form of babysitting

was having me sit on the drum riser behind him

while he played.

[Taylor] Your dad probably loved it, 'cause you know,

it's nice to see your little one down there.

You know, my-- look at how my little girl is down there,

and my-- yeah, my boy

peeking his head up over my monitor.

[Bill] I liked it, 'cause I thought

you'd probably be interested in what I was doing

and what the whole band was doing.

When you were sitting right there, it was good.

[Justin] As I watch them rehearsing

for these final shows,

I couldn't help but feel nostalgic.

I was 45 years old now with children of my own,

and I found myself sitting on the drum riser

behind my dad again,

watching him and Mickey trade stories,

just like when I was a kid.

[Mickey] I hate to bring up bad memories,

but remember-- was it Mrs. Kreutzmann the third?

We were up all night playing drums,

and in the morning it was just me and you

in the living room?

And I said to you, "Don't you think--"

this is your wedding night--

"Don't you think we should stop drumming

and you should go see your wife?"

Remember? And we drummed all night.

- And it's in the morning. - That's how we are.

Wow, man.

Hey, have him turn your mic down a little bit.

- Okay. - It's a little bit loud.

[music]

I need an extra ticket.

[Reya Hart] I used to be a lot more sentimental about it.

When we were in that era of Fare Thee Well

and everything felt like it was coming to a close,

and this was gonna be the last time we heard this music,

it was an emotional rollercoaster,

and there was a lot of sentimentality about it.

[woman] Whoo! There's Mickey!

- [Mickey] They're my groupies! - Mickey!

Hey, Mickey!

- They're older now, but... - [Justin laughing]

[Reya] It was crazier as a kid

to try and make sense out of our whole world there.

I mean, I have moments now where like, you know,

"He's Gone," or something like that

that has like a personal connection to me,

where I, like, suddenly am transported into that place

where you feel like a little kid again.

Hart.

Here we are for the last time.

I won't be bugging you anymore with...

The last time until the next time.

[Mickey] Next time.

[Stephen P.] When you hear that the Dead

are together playing, even though members are gone,

it is the song, and the sound is still there.

It was a real night for me, a real Grateful Dead night.

And then, of course, to see another drummer,

and you wonder how he does it, and you go home and practice.

And so, as a 51-year-old,

what is still gonna make me work hard?

Other drummers.

Drummers teach other drummers.

We learn from each other's techniques,

and the good stuff, we pick up,

and we start, you know, playing 'em.

And if it feels good, we learn.

If not, we just let it go.

Yeah. Try it faster.

Mickey Hart taught me how to do the...

[singing drum rhythm] And you can't do that.

Because I was having trouble with that.

I was, you know, right, 13.

He kinda schooled me how to play that beat of Ringo's,

and to turn it around and get back into it,

'cause I was struggling.

So, I'm 95% self-taught in drumming.

[sticks clicking, music begins]

When I was auditioning for No Doubt

at 19 years old, I lied.

I said I'd been playing for eight years.

I'd been playing for one.

I didn't wanna be the weak link.

That was never gonna happen.

And so, I just focused as hard as I possibly could.

I just went straight tunnel vision,

I'm gonna make this right, and I'm gonna be as good

as I can fucking possibly be for this band.

And on the drums, Mr. Adrian Young.

[cheers and applause]

[music]

[Mickey] So, grouping is really important.

That's why there's the Grateful Dead,

that's why there's the Rolling Stones.

That's why there are bands,

because bands allow-- band head.

You're allowed to come together in rhythm as one

and deliver a powerful sonic punch.

So, that's what we do as drummers.

[music]

People who are coded for, that's in their DNA,

the thing that makes them whole,

things that make them happy,

these are the people that I take from.

And I can hear a happy drummer,

or a powerful drummer, or angry drummer.

There's all kinds of drumming.

Keith Moon was a power drummer.

He lasted just for a short bit.

He burned out-- drugs, booze.

But Keith Moon, top-of-the-line drummer.

He changed everything.

[music]

[John] Wild man.

I watched Keith at the Isle of Wight.

He conducted the drum set.

Little pianissimo for the tom-toms,

and fortissimo!

The most unique drummer I've ever seen.

Looks like he was gonna fall into the kit.

It was crazy. And perfect.

Wasn't Keith Moon the ultimate?

I mean, Keith blows up his drum set

on "The Smothers Brothers Show."

These guys were destroying their instruments

on live television. Amazing.

[cymbal crashing]

Wow! Oh my God!

He actually kicked this.

Look at this thing, man.

Inside these bags are Keith Moon's drums.

Mandy Moon, his daughter, just dropped them off.

So, she went to the Grammy Museum...

- Holy crap, dude. - ...and got these

- out of the Grammy Museum. - Wow.

So, these are the shells that were in the movie "Tommy."

I love hearing about the early, early, early Keith Moon,

where he would get on stage with those guys

and just whip it up.

- So yeah... - Man, he played--

even though he never took a lesson.

- He was just... - Anything goes.

[Stephen P.] He was an event. He was a force.

[Steven A.] He was exciting, it was an event.

He was every drummer in one.

[Chad] He was the first drummer that I ever heard

put crashes in the middle of fills.

Most guys... [imitating drum fill]

Bang, right? [continues imitating]

And I was like...

[Mandy Moon] I think probably 99% of his personality

went into his playing.

It was just over the top.

Keith got to express that, you know, hugeness.

My mom used to say he-- Keith was too big

for this world.

And I really do think that the drums

were the perfect vehicle for him, and Keith just--

like I said, had that perfect storm

of the personality, and the talent,

and this need to, you know, get it out, the energy.

And you know, and he loved being in a band,

that was his life.

- [man] Do you love The Who? - Very much.

More than-- more than I can say.

And I love The Who's audience,

because they are us.

When I go on stage, I let 'em know,

Jesus Christ, I love this band.

Just like our band, all the elements of The Who

fit like a glove.

[overlapping chatter]

The Singer Bowl, oh my God.

Why did that happen?

Were we opening for The Who, or were they opening...?

[Justin] No, they were opening for you.

They were opening for us.

I don't know why there was a riot,

but there was a riot.

People went nuts.

Something about The Doors

was like, what-- the feeling was,

"What the fuck's gonna happen tonight?"

[music]

♪ You know the day destroys the night ♪

♪ Night divides the day ♪

♪ Try to run, try to hide ♪

♪ Break on through to the other side ♪

♪ Break on through to the other side ♪

♪ Break on through to the other side, yeah ♪

The Doors are kind of a band

that causes major, like, "Mmm," or "Yes."

And I got really into The Doors when I was in high school.

I read the books, "No One Here Gets Out Alive."

You know, I took acid, I did the whole fucking thing.

I bought the t-shirt, you know,

took the full fucking ride.

There's like no other band like it.

They didn't have a bass player, there's this dork, like,

hunched over a keyboard,

and this sort of like stoned-out guitar player,

like, playing, like, sort of surf licks.

I think John Densmore is an underrated drummer.

He had the sensibility of a jazz drummer,

did the really good question, answering kind of stuff

that jazz musicians tend to do with each other,

and he would do it with the singer.

[John] Our lead singer was kinda dangerous,

which was the attraction.

Live theater, for an actor to keep it fresh,

they're always trying to find something new.

Well, this guy, it was new every night,

which was difficult, but also exciting.

And sometimes he'd be very subdued,

sometimes he'd be rolling around like a snake.

I had a lot of fun just going down the road with Jim.

♪ I found an island in your arms ♪

♪ Country in your eyes ♪

♪ Arms that chained us, eyes that lied ♪

♪ Break on through to the other side ♪

♪ Break on through to the other side ♪

♪ Break on through, break on through ♪

♪ Break on through, break on through ♪

♪ Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah ♪

♪ Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah ♪♪

[Taylor] I wonder if Jim Morrison

knew how lucky he was to have found that drummer.

- [Justin] Probably not. - Probably not, I would say.

But I mean, they really were fucking unique.

You know, self-destruction and creativity

don't have to come in the same package,

but sometimes they do.

[Steve F.] Robbie McIntosh, just, he was a great guy,

and a really, really good pocket drummer.

We were friends, we used to hang out.

I used to go around to his house.

And Robbie and Average White Band came over

and were playing at the Troubadour.

And there was a party one night,

and I was invited to that party,

but as fate would have it, I had to go to work.

Next morning, I got a phone call

from my drum tech, and he called me up

and said, "Hey, man, you know, Robbie's dead."

And I said, "What, they're drunk?"

He said, "No, no, no, Robbie's dead."

This guy offered him some cocaine,

and it was cocaine, and it was cut with strychnine.

Everybody else got physically sick,

and he kept it inside of him, it killed him.

It's that simple.

Even knowing what I knew with my friend dying like that,

never stopped me from-- from another 20 years

of-- being stupid, basically.

I've been in recovery now for 26 years.

You can just tell all the cautionary tales

that you want, nobody ever thinks

that that's gonna happen to them.

"I got it down, it's not gonna happen to me."

[cheers and applause]

[music begins]

[Stephen P.] I really love Ginger's playing.

The guts of Ginger Baker,

it's like being punched in the chest, you know?

[thumping]

I know he's a very strong personality,

and you can hear that in the drumming.

And that confidence, and his way is the way.

There's no other way.

[Justin] You got to jam with-- didn't Ginger come here?

Ginger Baker sat right there.

He played those drums right in here,

and I got one minute.

Check it out on YouTube.

[drums playing]

[music]

There I am, the moment has arrived

where I'm in a room with Ginger Baker,

and I'm banging on some-- and ahh!

I got-- I had the meter, that part.

But where's the phrase?

And it wasn't till looking back at the tapes later

that I realized... [imitating drum beat]

Kinda Afrobeat thing going on.

You could write a thesis just on his hi-hat work.

You see, this is what separates the students

from the masters.

All that cool stuff?

He was doing cool stuff with his foot.

In fact, my drumming's very weird.

I learned all the really technical stuff first,

and then I had to come back and learn the,

you know, the "buddilibups," you know, all those things.

And I never learned those,

I learned all the wild polyrhythm triplet shit.

I wasn't really paying attention to my dad's music.

You know, I mean, I grew up

with gold discs all over the house,

and my walls all different colors,

and every wall in the house different.

So, I thought that was normal.

[man] What's your favorite Who record?

Oh, that one.

Are they important to you at all?

Do you think any less of me because of them, you know?

Or did they sort of become me?

Have you seen my cats?

- No, I'd love to. - Tremendous, follow me.

Morris? [whistling]

[Mandy] I first started realizing that perhaps,

you know, my dad was something a little different,

by the way I was treated by teachers most of the time.

I think it made me-- yeah, I think it made me more shy,

because when you're young and people are asking you

a lot of questions, or seem to want to look at you, or...

Some kids had a different direction on it,

or take on it, that I think they kind of shunned you

because of it, it was sort of like,

that was just too much and too weird.

So, you kind of felt like an outsider,

no matter what, to be honest.

I remember my teachers

when I was in school coming up to me and saying,

"Hey, I think your dad played on this George Harrison album,

or this John Lennon album, or 'Dream Weaver.'"

Wow, okay, did he really?

And I didn't even know that either,

you know, so I was kind of growing up--

you know, I had to catch up with that.

You know, and it evolved

into, wow, yeah, Dad is really a famous guy.

I mean, he's played on a lot of these,

you know, amazing tracks.

We're all fans up here.

I know my dad was in the band, but listen, when I was a kid,

I was too close to it.

You got it way before I did, probably.

When your dad's in the band,

you're kinda like, "Yeah, whatever.

It's not like you were in the Beatles."

[laughter]

I did say that to him. I was a bad teenager.

I said, "You want to impress me, Dad?

You take me to see The Police."

I wanted to go and see The Police

when I was like 12, 13.

And he instantly got tickets and then got us backstage.

So, I knew he had some pull.

Sting's cool.

Stewart Copeland's better.

[music]

[overlapping chatter]

[Taylor] My brother handed me The Police,

"Zenyatta Mondatta," and he goes,

"This is the best drummer in the world right now," you know.

Which, he was right, actually.

[Adrian] What Stewart was doing that was pretty awesome

was finding a way to mix reggae and ska rhythms

in rock music, and doing his own version

with, you know, chops coming out of his ass.

He had it all, and has it all.

People have tried to emulate it,

and I'm one of 'em,

'cause he was such a mentor and an idol of mine.

I thought, I should just do this justice and just--

and try to play it the way that I've been hearing it

since 1978.

[Stewart] I left America when I was two months old

to Cairo, Egypt, and didn't get back

till I was 18.

So, musically, when you're that young,

it goes right into your DNA.

The cool thing is that decades later,

there's this thing called reggae.

And in the punk clubs in 1977, it's all the thing.

The only chill form of punk was dub reggae.

It's still hostile, it's still dark,

but it's chill, 'cause punk music,

just, there's no punk chill music.

The two things can't coexist.

And so, all the London bands

are trying to figure out reggae,

a rhythm where there is no one,

and the important beat, the fulcrum is three.

Nothing, two, three,four...

Two, three,four.

That's a whole different cognitive architecture.

Lucky for me, the Baladi rhythm,

the country Arabic rhythm,

the foundation building blocks of all Arabic music,

based on this... [imitating drum beat]

"Duh, duh-duh, three, four.

Two, three, four, nothing, two, three."

So, I've got this completely comfortable in that zone.

And so, when Sting started bringing songs in,

and we're hearing this cool dub,

and like, I'd like to get whatever that mojo is,

we wanna get that into our music somehow,

it just came really naturally.

[guitar playing]

[Slim Jim] The thing that first attracted me to the drums

was probably Ringo, who's my guy, you know.

I love him.

The idea of being in some traveling gang

was really what appealed to me.

And when the Stray Cats came together,

it felt like that gang,

it felt like-- not to compare, but it felt

like "Hard Day's Night" or something.

It was like a little gang that had their inside language,

and you were outsiders amongst the public.

Yeah, who's your favorite drummer?

My favorite drummer? Um...

- Beside yourself. - Ringo.

[cheers and applause]

Really, the most significant moment I had with a drummer

in the studio that was really life-changing,

was with Ringo Starr,

who may be the most underrated drummer

on the face of the Earth.

And I was handing out charts to the musicians.

I said, "You want a chart?"

He said, "No, show me the lyrics."

And... well, interesting, okay.

But he was-- he wanted to play to the story.

[Chad] Ringo Starr is one of the greatest drummers

of all time, in the greatest band of all time,

in my opinion.

What he's known for, to me,

every Beatles song feels good.

And that's the feel of it.

[Ringo] My dream, which I had at 13,

was to play drums, and which came true.

I am a musician, but I am a drummer.

I was not interested in pianos.

My grandparents had a piano.

I just loved the drums. It's just my instrument.

You know what I mean, it's just,

that's what I want to play.

And you know, I put them in a specific place

in my musical career

where I have sort of the style I've always promoted,

which was play with the singer.

But yeah, I'm a drummer.

And I would walk around Liverpool

looking in music stores just at the drums,

'cause we couldn't afford them in those days.

Anyway, my stepdad, he bought me

the first kit of drums which were like 20 dollars,

12 pound English.

Just started hitting them, I had no lessons.

And it was lucky in those days

that if you had the instrument, you were in the band.

[laughing] You know what I mean?

I couldn't get a job now, but then, you know.

And the next-door neighbor,

Eddie Clayton, he played guitar.

He's one of those guys that could play anything.

And then my friend Roy had an upright bass,

and we went out like that, I had the snare.

So, it just unfolded in its natural way

that I love the drums, I got the drums,

I played through the bands of Liverpool.

And you know where I ended up,

in the best band in the land.

[music]

♪ Back then long time ago when grass was green ♪

♪ Woke up in a daze ♪

[Don] And if you listen to his playing--

you know what's a great example,

is the Beatles song "Something."

He's playing like where a guitar player would play.

He's keeping the beat going, he's keeping the time,

but it's very musical,

and he's interacting with the singer.

And the singer's telling the story.

And that's-- that's what I think everybody

should be doing, and that's what I think

the best drummers do.

♪ Caresses fleeced you in the morning light ♪

[Chad] He came up with such amazing drum parts,

whether it's "Tomorrow Never Knows"

or "Come Together," I mean, a million beautiful,

unique, interesting drum parts that are hooks to songs.

♪ Fab, doo-doo-doo-doo ♪

♪ Long time ago when we was fab ♪

♪ Fab ♪

I was born left-handed, but my grandma

thought I was possessed by the devil.

And so, I can write-- I write with my right hand.

But that's all I do, so you know,

I saw a kit, I got a kit, we set it up

in the right-handed way, and I just got on 'em,

and that's how I play 'em.

To go down the toms, you'd have to cross over like that.

But it was kinda backwards, and it would limit him

to doing these kind of beats.

[Ringo] So, if you listen to anything I've done,

"da-da-da-da-da," there's always like a gap

to get into the fill.

And everyone's saying, "Oh, wow, how does he do that?"

Well, only out of necessity.

And when he'd do his fill, he wouldn't do it from here.

He would do it... from here, backwards.

From the floor to the tom,

and I just thought that was so cool,

'cause it was, you know,

something nobody else was doing.

[Chad] I was fortunate to be in a charity photoshoot

with him and a bunch of other drummers.

And Ringo was there at the shoot.

Super nice, and just, "Hey, nice--

thank you for coming," and I'm just like...

[stammering]

When you meet a Beatle, you know,

I don't get starstruck that often, but you're like...

You're like out of your body a little bit, you know.

Then the director said, "Could you play

one of Ringo's beats?"

And I'm like, okay, sure.

And he's, like, sitting behind in the garden there,

you know, with his wife.

So, I'm... [imitating drum beat]

I stop, and I'm-- you know, I'm still thinking like,

"Ringo Starr's behind me, play this--" you know.

And he goes, "That's not how it goes."

And I'm like... what?

He goes-- he goes, "No, no, no.

I'm left-handed. Just the left, just the left."

And I did it like that, you know, I'm like, oh, okay.

I got-- yeah, okay, cool.

You know, Ringo's telling me how to play his own beats!

I'm like, ahh!

And then later, the director told me--

'cause at one point he leaned over to his wife,

and he said, "That's more notes

than I've ever played in me life."

[laughing] Like, yeah.

You know, it's Ringo Starr.

The greatest.

[man] Yes.

I just wanna do one thing for my son.

Whoo!

- Thank you. - [cheers]

I don't do fills, so it's our loss.

[Jason] Ringo's story was the one

that my dad had never told me.

So... [laughing]

Ringo goes, "Yeah, your dad

"would call me up from LAX

and tell me that he was on his way."

And he goes, "And your dad had this habit

"of throwing me in my own pool.

I mean, he was a big lad," he goes, "I couldn't stop him.

So, I started to dress for it."

And so, Ringo would change his outfit quickly

'cause he'd know Bonzo was coming.

[cheers and applause]

Ladies and gentlemen, I'm sitting beside a guy

who is possibly the best rock and roll drummer on Earth.

Would you agree with that?

No, not really.

I'm sure you would agree with that, John.

Not at all.

No, he doesn't agree with that at all.

Yeah, and by the way, in the film there,

I noticed your son's a pretty heavy drummer.

Jason, isn't it? Are you envious?

- [John] Yes. - [laughter]

- Is he better than you? - Could be.

On that cheery note, ladies and gentlemen...

[Jason] So, in reality, Dad was normal.

So, it wasn't until I came to-- I actually came to Florida,

Tampa, '77, when they broke the Guinness Book of Records

at the time, and there was like 89,000 people there.

And I remember asking Dad who else was playing.

And he went, "No, just us."

And I was like... what? Really?

Okay. If you think so.

You know, and I was 11.

I didn't kinda-- I didn't get it.

But as a-- you know, the harnessing--

well, you know.

When it's-- when you don't know any different,

it's just Dad.

He wasn't the rock star at home, put it that way.

He was the everyday guy. He was Dad.

And when you only know him as Dad,

you didn't do your homework, that was it, off to your room.

So, as my friends go,

"Not so cool for a rock-and-roll dad, really."

[Justin] It had been 20 years since I'd seen

my rock-and-roll dad play a stadium show.

It was amazing to see how much the music

still affected both the fans and other musicians.

[music]

[Don] I was not like a Deadhead

and drove from show to show,

but I saw them play, like, in the '60s.

And I was blown away, because I was a jazz fan.

And I could see that what they were doing,

it had different-- the rhythms were different,

but the spirit of improvisation was identical.

[Taylor] And so, I saw them once.

At first, I was like, what's going on?

And everyone's like, you know,

passing food around to each other,

and like, the song's kind of starting,

but have they even started the fucking song yet?

They're like, jamming. Is everyone on stage yet?

I mean, like, everyone's throwing energy,

and you know, passing each other

doobies and shit.

And I'm like, oh, okay, they don't know

how they're gonna start this song.

They just do this, like, improvisational jazz thing.

And that got me good.

Now, whether I'm gonna say I'm a huge Deadhead,

not gonna say I'm a huge Deadhead.

But I love the chances they were taking

the whole time.

Three days after that show I had to go to Europe

to do a two-week tour with the Foo Fighters,

and I just started, like, taking a lot more chances,

and I had some of the best shows

I've had in a long time, if not ever.

I kept saying to Dave, our singer,

and our fearless leader, Dave Grohl,

I just kept going, fucking Dead show, man.

I'm telling you, dude.

It took me to new heights. I saw something.

[Justin] You'll never get him to a Dead show.

No, I'll never get Dave Grohl to a Dead show,

it's never gonna happen, I can't imagine.

But it really did-- it really did kind of--

I got it.

If you wanna see it work,

if you wanna see a situation work

that doesn't have any leader,

that doesn't have any plan,

or doesn't-- and is utterly formless, really,

from moment to moment, then-- and you know,

you don't have to guess about whether something

- like that will work. - Yeah.

We have it, and it's working.

We've learned to trust each other to the point

of saying, well, it's-- you know,

if Kreutzmann doesn't like it, it's no good.

- Yeah, yeah. - And that idea

comes from the idea basically that no idea

really makes it if you can't include everybody.

I got kicked out of the school band.

You know, like I was in the school band

percussion section, but you know, I--

just, I was bored to tears there.

You know, it was like--

I remember the theme from "Rocky"

was, like, the big-- was the big song at the time.

I just didn't give a shit about the theme from "Rocky."

You know, I wanna go home and learn, like, you know,

"Physical Graffiti." [laughing]

Which, you know.

I mean, it was like, ah, can we play, you know,

"Nobody's Fault But Mine," you know?

By the time I was in Phish, you know, if it had been like,

"Well, we're just a straight rock band, and it's all--"

you know, I don't know that it would have stuck for me.

Like, Trey, as a songwriter,

you know, has a very curious and open mind

about musical forms.

I could have ended up with my best friend

being a songwriter who just--

it's all about-- you know, like a Keith Richards guy,

"It's all about Chuck Berry, and you know...

don't stray from the path," you know.

Which again, there's nothing wrong with that.

It's just, you know,

we'd still be friends today, I'm sure,

but we might not be in the same band, you know,

'cause he'd be yelling at me, like, "Goddamn it,

put it on two and four," you know.

You know, so that-- that's just been

a really great stroke of luck

that, you know, the band I ended up being in

for 35 years is-- we are all like-minded enough

and opposite-minded enough

that it kept us all challenged.

[Bill] Do you like mangoes?

Is that one of your good ones, do you know?

- You ever eat it? - Whenever I think of mangoes,

I think of the scene from "Apocalypse Now"

when he goes to get the mango off the boat

- and the tiger comes out. - Uh-huh.

Well, we don't have tigers here.

I'm looking for the tiger,

is basically what I'm trying to say.

Since I wasn't connecting with my dad through music,

I found something else.

And it all started with "Apocalypse Now."

[Mickey] In 1978, Francis Coppola

came to Winterland to see us.

And after the Rhythm Devils, he came up to me

and he says, "I want my movie to sound like that."

And so, we played the percussion underscore

for "Apocalypse Now."

Francis wanted me to play the whole movie,

not just scene by scene.

He wanted me to go up the river in search of Kurtz.

And so, what we did, Billy and I,

we went up the river.

So, I had monitors all over the house,

in the bathroom,

in the living room, the kitchen.

You know, every place was another monitor

playing "Apocalypse Now,"

where every place I turn, I could see it.

And I kinda conjured the sounds that I was going to use,

because it was just a pass.

And of course, the beam was napalm.

Beautiful napalm.

Nothing can make a sound like napalm, like the beam.

As soon as Francis heard it, he's like, "That's it!"

[music]

He said, "I spent a quarter of a million dollars,

"and I couldn't get that sound,

and now you did it in 15 seconds."

Well, Francis, I had the right instrument

at the right time.

[beam strumming]

That movie was more than a movie.

Everybody was a part of it.

And it took a while, and we were so devoted

to that movie, everybody--

Francis' crew, Grateful Dead crew,

and Francis was trying to make a movie

that depicted the horror.

And we were really into it till the end.

And Francis became sick, in a way,

because of the movie.

At the very end, everybody was kind of Kurtz-ed.

[Justin] The reason I became a filmmaker

is watching you guys put that movie together,

and being around Gio and Francis.

And that movie-- thank you for being involved in that,

'cause that movie changed my life.

Yeah, me too, it changed my life.

It changed everybody's life.

[music]

[Justin] During "Apocalypse Now,"

my dad bought me my first Super 8 camera,

and I started shooting home movies.

But my home was backstage.

I got you that camera because my dad

had turned me on to home video,

to little Super 8s, right?

And I know that we'd had a lot of fun with that,

and you did those trick shots of making people go backwards,

and you know, reversing the film,

all that corny stuff.

But back then it was fun as hell.

And so, I got you a camera 'cause I thought

you'd be into it, and you were.

I remember we went out in the garage

and we did stop-action.

I showed you how to do stop-action.

And you loved it.

[Justin] While the other kids were having playdates

with their friends, I was on tour with my dad

learning about movies from Jerry Garcia.

[Bill] I was just always amazed about how much you knew

at such a young age.

And Jerry could converse all the time,

I was quite amazed.

Go through airports talking movies all the time.

[man] Justin Kreutzmann, the son of drummer

Bill Kreutzmann were busy most of the day

interviewing people for Justin's third video movie.

He's calling this movie "The Dead Weekend."

The Dead kids.

[man] Among his interviews were drummer Mickey Hart

and bassist Phil Lesh.

Well, they've been working hard.

This has been a hard-working crew,

and Justin-- oh, your camera's tipping.

- I know it is. - It's okay, Justin.

This is how you work out all the bugs, so they say.

♪ Ahh ♪

[Kofi] My whole life I've been, like,

just like trying to make my dad proud of me, right?

So, it's like you think,

"If I become the best drummer possible,

"he can't not see that.

Like, he's gotta be able to see that."

Of course, I don't think it worked.

I think he was always like, you know,

"You can't do that!"

I was doing the Cream stuff more just to please people,

you know, for-- you know, I'm Ginger's son,

okay, I'll play some Cream stuff for you.

But now, it's turned into being more about

keeping my dad's legacy alive.

[Jason] So, all I wanna say is welcome

to the Jason Bonham Led Zeppelin Experience.

It's my way of telling him...

Yes, thank you.

For giving me a gift, for making me play the drums

when I was younger, and I didn't wanna play.

For me giving me just that bloodline,

for just allowing me

to become something that I wanna do.

My dad at one point really thought

that I wasn't gonna play drums,

and that was the day before I never saw him again.

He came into my room, and...

You know, it's one of those conversations

that when I look back now, I go, did that really happen?

Was that the last conversation?

And it was just one of those things

where at that time, I'd become very, very good

at racing dirt bikes.

So, I remember him actually, you know, saying to me,

"You will start playing the drums again.

Please, won't you, yeah?"

He'd had a couple of drinks, so I was like,

"Yeah, yeah, whatever, Dad, yeah, yeah, shut up.

Of course, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah."

Just whatever, go to sleep, or do whatever.

But yeah, and then, you know, it was like he knew.

And then I never saw him again.

[Mandy] I didn't really grow up with him around.

When we have fathers on the road, we do--

you know, we miss out on that.

But they're doing their job, I understand that.

But the family life is, you know, it was gonna suffer.

It was-- you know, going on the road is tricky.

It's still tricky today, it's...

Leaving the family was the hardest.

So, that's the problem of being a traveling musician,

is you leave the family at home.

It's not great. So, it had to take some toll.

You had to let go, you had to just--

like, when you were leaving, you had to just let go

of all those feelings.

Okay, you had to really concentrate

on playing the music.

It was hard.

It was always great getting home and seeing you.

I had a lot of mixed emotions when we had our first child,

and being the first No Doubt band member to have a child,

because it was the first time in my life

I wanted to focus on something else

that needed my energy more than the band.

My wife and my son did come on the road with me,

but there were times when they couldn't.

And it was really, really hurting me inside my soul.

I had-- I had crazy--

and I look back on these thoughts,

they seem-- they feel irrational now.

But I had thoughts like, I think I need to stop

so I can do-- I can go be a dad.

Well, Eden, my son, understands

how music is good for other people.

So, he digs it that I go and play-- I play gigs.

But it's painful to the point

where, what else could I do with my life

to make sure I'm there for my kid?

[Mandy] I didn't communicate with Keith at all

when he was on the road, and he was gone a lot.

And unfortunately, when he was there,

I found him to be a bit scary.

When we were living with Keith, it was the unpredictability,

and that there were violent outbursts.

As I mentioned, you know, there was a lot of drinking,

and it just brought out the worst in him,

and you know, has brought out the worst in me.

So, like I said, I can understand to some degree.

But I'm afraid that that really kind of overshadowed

a lot of the time when he was at home.

So, you know, and now, as a grown-up,

I wish, you know, that hadn't been the case.

But when you're little, you can't really control

the situation like that, you know.

You just, you know, do what you feel,

and you can't, you know, go,

"Oh, I'd like to know him better."

It's just, it didn't work out that way when I was little.

[Justin] Of all the things that Dad and I have shared

over the years, drug addiction was the hardest.

Growing up with the Dead, drugs were everywhere.

But you know you've pushed it too far

when you walk into a room and Jerry Garcia

is leading your drug intervention.

Why Jerry? Dad couldn't be there

because he was in rehab himself.

[Lisa Nelson] It makes me sad, because I always think

of my dad as just playing those drums every day,

even I guess when he was drinking,

unless he was just like dead-drunk.

I mean, I've always had a special compassion for him,

because I always knew he was special.

I mean, just even when I was a little girl, I--

you know, with him losing his leg.

Then with his alcoholism.

You know, just like a lot of relationships,

we've had a lot of issues, and we're the people we are

because of what we were exposed to.

[Sandy] I was hooked on codeine for pain.

That led to more drinking, of course.

But I wasn't really a heavy drinker

before the accident, actually.

[Lisa] There's a lot of reasons why people

get into drugs and alcohol,

and I mean, obviously one of them is genetics,

which is definitely in our family.

[Sandy] I became a regular customer

at L.A. General Hospital detox,

and they had a prosthetic guy come over with a test leg.

It was so uncomfortable, I just took it off,

"I don't wanna wear that."

I looked over, there's this, like, 12-year-old kid

with a big grin with two artificial legs,

and he-- I thought, well, if he can do it, I can do it.

So, that was a little inspiration there.

[music]

♪ You stumble and fall ♪

I think working with Dad strengthened our relationship.

You know, he trusted me,

and that trust, man, really goes a long way.

[Jim] You know, to be a drum tech

is a real specific gig, you know.

And it's not for the faint of heart.

Whew, yeah.

[Jim] To this day, I think he remains

probably my best tech.

How'd I do?

What do you mean? You mean on the tour?

- Yeah. - Son, you're the best

- drum tech I ever had. - All right.

- That's what I like to hear. - I mean it.

I really mean it, you understand?

Thank you.

And it's a lot different than working

for just, you know, employee-employer.

I mean, this is my dad, and I'm working for him,

and so I really tried extra hard to make him happy.

[cheers and applause]

[Jim] Oh God, I gotta get ready.

- Here, okay, go, go. - [Eric] Shit, sorry.

And it was good for me to know where he was every night.

- [chuckles] - Yeah.

Those were some kind of crazy-- we won't go into that.

But one of the reasons why I had him out there with me

was because I could, you know,

kinda keep track of where he was.

[Eric] When you're driving straight,

it's against the law to weave unless you're drunk,

under the influence of alcohol.

This is soda. This is soda.

[man] Slow down, Eric. Slow down.

Just like he said, you know, in the beginning

it was a little rocky for me.

And, but you know what, Dad never gave up on me,

and... you know, the bond has never been stronger

- than it is today, man. - Yeah, I could...

- And I thank him for that. - I could never give up

on my number one, you know.

Every time I spoke to my dad, I couldn't tell him anything.

He didn't wanna know about my life,

he didn't give a shit.

And last time I saw him in Colorado,

I said, "Dad, do you even care about anything about me?"

'Cause he-- we had this argument,

and he goes, "No." And I was like, that's it,

and I just packed my drums and left,

and didn't see him until five or six years later.

♪ Come down off your throne ♪

♪ And leave your body alone ♪

I hope I don't get emotional, 'cause it's still a bit--

you know, sometimes I talk about my dad,

I get a little bit emotional.

But my dad was kinda hiding his real feelings,

from what I got from the last time I saw him.

Because the last time I saw him was really beautiful.

I actually got to talk to my dad.

He didn't-- he didn't blow me off,

he actually listened to me.

Probably 'cause he couldn't talk back much.

But I-- he kind of dropped his--

you know, his asshole-ness, and gave me his real self.

So, I do know he cared.

You know, I mean, it came across

in the last time I was with him.

Again, I'm trying not to get emotional here.

Still, you know, it's only been a few weeks.

But you know, I did get that closure with him,

where he actually gave me what I needed,

which was, you know, thank you, Dad,

you know, you do appreciate all the work,

and you do appreciate my playing,

and you do like me,

you know, which was, you know, really good.

♪ Somebody must change ♪

And then he died Sunday morning.

And I had to play a show that night.

You know, I had to do a gig, and it was really hard

because I was really emotional.

And it was real-- I'm just, like,

crying my eyes out, you know, trying to play this stuff,

and it was like, it's really hard to play

when you're that emotional.

[Justin] 'Cause you're playing Cream stuff, it's not like--

I mean, you're doing your dad's material.

- Right! - On like, the day he died.

Yeah, and I was just like, my drum solo, I was like...

And I was trying to say stuff, and I couldn't even--

I couldn't even get it out, you know, it was pretty bad.

So, I was just like, you know...

But at least I got that little bit, you know.

But you know, as I was saying,

it was just, like, so hard, 'cause he died Sunday,

and I was a mess for the rest of that tour.

I've been pretty much a mess talking about it since,

but you know, I'll try to get myself back together again.

[Justin] And this-- this film's about being yourself.

This film is about our dads.

♪ Can't find my way home ♪

[man] Two, three, four...

[music begins]

[Justin] I thought my drug intervention

was rock bottom,

but nothing compared to losing Jerry

five years later.

[Bill] There was a ton of loss.

Jerry died in '95, he died August 9th.

He was born on August 1, and that's pretty interesting.

That was like-- that's why we do that song

"The Days Between," from the 1st to the 9th.

That time-- that's the days between when he checks out.

My dad died a month after that.

And I was actually at my dad's house

when they called me about Jerry.

A month later, I had to go do my dad.

So, that was a tough year.

In those days I was surfing a bunch

up in Mendocino before I moved over here.

Yeah, I went out and surfed that day.

I couldn't talk to anybody when I got the news about Jerry.

I went out in the water, it felt really good

just washing over me.

[music]

[Justin] Jerry Garcia was much more

than just the guitar player in my dad's band.

He was a mentor and a friend.

His death was the single biggest loss

I've ever experienced, and it happened at a time

when a lot of us were nearing our breaking point.

[Bill] I was really pretty burnt out

after the Grateful Dead, you know,

dealing with all of the problems

of other people's disease and...

And having a band just go down in flames,

and being in public playing so badly.

It was really-- it hurt me a lot.

And I wasn't in good shape either,

I was probably part of that problem.

So, I came here, and I got healthy,

and I went and did the things you do to get healthy.

You get in the water a lot, you learn to surf,

you get the waves to push you around.

I had my first child when I was 30,

and things were pretty calm.

But in my late 30s, things started to get out--

I managed to keep my drinking under, you know,

just under control to some degree

when-- in my early 30s.

But my late 30s, it started to get more out of control.

So, about 39, I started trying to stop then.

So, I've been trying to stop drinking for 13 years.

I have three years at the moment.

It's been actually a huge part of my life,

and you know, I've wanted to end mine because of it.

Not saying that's what Keith did,

but I can understand the struggle with it.

And I think when I was younger I used it

as more of an excuse for my bad behavior.

Well, of course, I'm Keith Moon's daughter,

what do you expect?

You know, I think other people expected it of me,

so-- and I-- or at least I thought they did.

So, maybe that's kind of what Keith suffered from too.

Although I'm not him, so...

[chuckles]

[Lisa] This process getting ready for the interview

has just helped me with forgiveness.

I'm so thankful I was able to have this experience

now rather than later, because so many people

have these feelings, and forgiveness and all this

after the fact, meaning, you know,

when somebody is no longer with us.

And I'm just so grateful that I was able to have that--

to experience that before that time comes.

[Mandy] My kids are 17 and 20, so I've been a mom for a while.

But you know, I think it would have been fun

for him to meet his grandchildren.

And it sounds even strange for us to say

"Keith Moon's grandchildren,"

you know, when he's not alive any longer.

But they are, and they should embrace that too,

and I want them to embrace it.

I played bass a lot in high school,

and was in a band.

I fooled around on the drums,

but I think it's kind of what my mom says too.

I'm intimidated by the fact

that people know who Keith was,

and know that I'm related to him.

- Yeah... - So, I kind of don't--

yeah, I don't go for drums as much.

[laughter]

[Bill] This is sort of like what we were talking about

the other day with Lukas, my grandson.

You and I both are known for having some drug interference

and drug problems in our life.

And I was kinda concerned that if we're teaching Lukas

to be a drummer, which is great,

is he gonna go into that world of musicians

that I escaped from, in a way?

You know, escaped the drug problems.

I mean, is he gonna be able to get through all that?

I always wanted to talk to you about that,

because it would-- with his granddad

and his dad both having those kind of problems.

Good.

Is that the beat?

My parents, your grandparents,

alcohol was a main gathering point,

which is sad, but that was what it was,

and they'd get together and drink

and have what they thought was a great time.

I'd get up in the morning and finish the drinks for 'em.

Little kid, you know, going around, testing 'em.

It's also important when you teach your kids

about those particular problems,

is how you teach them, how well you say these things

and frame the information.

[Justin] Did we ever talk-- have that conversation?

I don't remember us, if we ever talked

about the pitfalls of...

Mm, we probably did, but you know.

- I probably wasn't listening. - [chuckles]

If we were falling, if we were going into the pits,

- nobody was listening. - Yeah.

[music]

[Justin] What was it like being on the road for 30 years,

and then you come to some place like this

where things move at a different tempo?

I was needing to heal, I was needing to get away

from all of the drug exposure and all the alcohol.

And this was a place to go for me.

It's a place-- this island particularly

is a really healing island.

It has a lot of feminine energy,

and it heals you.

It helps you feel better about yourself,

and it was a better idea.

And that's what I needed, so I came here.

And I just-- I learned about that

because me and Garcia would go diving all the time

down in Kona, and I just thought, God,

we both liked it here so much, why not go back?

And then that was one of the reasons.

It's a cool thing.

I mean, I could never leave here,

it's been at least-- almost 20 years or more now

that I've lived here.

So, it just saved my life, basically.

I don't have a better way to say it, but it did.

[Justin] One of the things I'm most grateful for

is that my dad is still around,

and I've had the chance to talk to him

about his passion for drumming.

I might not be a drummer,

but at least now I understand why he is.

[music]

[Stephen P.] Now, you think about your dad

and how many shows the Dead have played.

Your dad's done every one.

And that's a dance band,

people dance to the Dead uncontrollably.

They spin.

They're spinning in the bathrooms

at the Grateful Dead, they're spinning, you know,

in the hallway while they're buying merchandise.

I mean, they can't stop dancing.

Think about how many millions of people

have danced to the beat of your pop?

[music]

[John] That energy of the audience

and performer are gonna swing,

and wow, what's gonna happen?

And that's the magic. That's the mystery.

[Matt] The feeling that you feel as a drummer performing

is something that transcends meditation.

It brings you some place that you never really imagined.

Until you feel it, you don't know.

And for me, I still love to perform

and the feeling I get when I'm in the zone.

[Taylor] I mean, I don't know what it's like in the Dead,

especially since Jerry's been gone.

But you know, Dave's like my brother too.

Like, he really is. I mean, I could never

imagine us not getting together to play these--

these songs that he's created and we've created.

It'll be hard to play "All My Life" when we're 70.

So, just make it a little slower.

[Ringo] I discovered it when I was very young in hospital.

And I was there a long time, so to keep us busy,

every so often the teacher would come

with maracas, you know, a bell,

or a triangle, and a little drum.

I just fell in love then. I remember it so well.

It's just I love the drums, I just love the sound of them,

the depth of them, what they give me.

And you know what?

The band's only as good as its drummer.

[laughing] I might be biased.

But like, tell me, is there--

tell me a great band that doesn't have a great drummer.

Can it be a great band, drummer's okay?

Great band, guitar player is pretty good.

No, drummer, 'cause he drives that shit.

He's the engine, he's the heart.

Like, when I imagine a life without music,

it's like... there's nothing.

It's like music has been, like, this foundation

that has led me up to where I am now.

[Justin] Do you find that you might be a little obsessed

about drumming, to the extent that you might wanna do it

more than anything else in your life, or...?

I think that ship left a long time ago.

For that, I think that left just, like,

it went very far.

But you know what I think it is?

I think it's just desperately wanting to have friends,

and you know, it's like, whatever it takes, man.

You know what, I'll play the drums

on a cardboard box, dude,

as long as we can hang out, man.

You know? [chuckles]

[music]

[Justin] Bob Weir told me about a conversation

that Jerry Garcia had with Sting

in a hotel bar in Chicago.

They were arguing about whether drummers are born that way

or if they become that way.

It's the music version of nature versus nurture.

I think I finally have an answer for Jerry and Sting.

Drummers are born that way.

It's who they are, not what they do.

And for drummers like my dad, that will never change.

[music]

[Mickey] Big bang, 13.8 billion years ago.

That was the first downbeat.

Everything is about rhythm,

and that's the beginning of time and space.

So, it all came from there.

You know, the stars, planets, sun,

the moon, the Earth, us.

All of the rhythms that control us

come from the cosmos.

It's about creating a community

that allows for a rhythmic event to happen.

But it's really about the rhythm of life.

That's what drums and drumming are really all about.

[music]

[Justin] Well, I just wanted to thank you

- and give you a hug. - Yeah!

- I love you very much. - I love you too, son, so much.

- Thank you for doing this. - Yeah, man.