All language subtitles for Dateline.Secrets.Uncovered.S11E12.720p.WEB.h264-BAE.[eng]

- I'm Craig Melvin,

and this is
"Dateline: Secrets Uncovered".

- This really
was a soap opera.

- Unfortunately, it's my life

and it wasn't
a soap opera for me.

- It was TV's first
blockbuster trial,

scandalous and Sensational.
- Her sexuality,

that was the star
of the Pam Smart show.

- This explosion
of flashbulbs.

- It's "Body Heat."
It's "Fatal Attraction."

- Pamela Smart, accused of
bewitching a teenage student

into murdering her husband.

- Yes.

- I said, "God, forgive me".
I pulled the trigger.

- Now, more than
three decades later,

another look at the frenzy.
- It was just crazy.

- The trial.
- I made a mistake.

- Was killing your husband
one of those mistakes?

- No.
- The woman.

- It's not at all
who she is or was.

- And the case, some say,
changed the way

Americans witnessed justice.

- I don't know if enough
will ever be enough

for anyone in this case.

**

- Hello and welcome to
"Dateline: Secrets Uncovered".

An attractive young
high school employee

became the center of
a steamy murder trial

that gripped our nation.

Her name is Pamela Smart,
and she has secrets

she wishes the jury heard.

Now she is ready to
share them with you.

Here's Andrea Canning
with "Deadly Secret".

- You were
the biggest show in town.

- It was.
- Maybe in America.

- At the time.
- I mean, this story,

people couldn't
get enough of it.

- Nope.

When I look back at the footage,
I look like a baby.

You know, I look so young
and I look so afraid.

And that's exactly how I felt.

- Before the Menendez brothers,
before the Bobbitts

or Amy Fisher or even O.J.,

Pamela Smart was television's
first true crime celebrity.

- It's like I'm frozen forever
in my worst mistake,

and I'm judged forever
by my worst mistake.

And people think
there's nothing else to me.

- The story begins in
the old mill town

of Derry, New Hampshire.

Twenty-two-year-old Pamela Smart
had come home late from work

to find her
twenty-four-year-old husband,

Gregg, sprawled out
on the floor of their home.

- It's six days before
your first anniversary.

- Mm-hmm.

- Take us to
that-that night, that--

what happened
when you walked in the door?

- I saw Gregg on the ground

in front of the entrance
to the door.

I called for him,
and he didn't respond.

There was--

- Did you try to shake him or...
- No.

- You're just
calling his name?

- I called his name,
he didn't answer,

and I ran-I just ran that fast.

- You go to the neighbor and
what does the neighbor do?

Call 911?

- I don't even
remember after that.

- Daniel Pelletier was
the lead detective in the case.

- Well, the first two
officers arrived,

found Mrs. Smart outside.

She was yelling and screaming
that her husband had been hurt.

- It wasn't until
way after his--

the police were there,
his parents were there,

all of that, his father said,
"Why aren't you helping my son?"

And the police officer said,
"Because he's dead".

- What's that moment like?
- His father hit the floor.

I hit the floor.
His mother passed out.

It was just--
it was crazy.

- We later determined
through the medical examiner

that it was a gunshot wound.

The wound was actually at
the top left of his skull,

entered in through there.

- When I got to
her parent's house,

we both sobbed.

- Sonia Fortin-Simon
was a friend

of Gregg and Pamela Smart's.

- We-we laid there together
in her bed.

I was hugging her,

because she was in
a fetal position crying.

She was inconsolable,
just trying to figure out

who could have done this.

- It was apparent that
two people were involved

because of the way that things
were set up

and the amount of things
that were disturbed.

The, uh, stereo had been removed
from the stereo rack

and it was pulled out.

There were speakers piled up
by the rear door

where it looked like
they had exited.

There was, um, jewelry boxes
overturned.

- You know, it looked like
a burglary gone bad.

That's kind of what
we were hearing.

That's kind of
what we're seeing.

The police weren't
saying anything.

- Tami Plyler was a reporter

for the
"New Hampshire Union Leader".

- We had heard at one point that
they were looking for someone

who might have traded in
some jewelry;

we had picked it up
on the police scanner.

- But the burglary gone bad
theory had some problems.

- That didn't really make
a lot of sense

because the time of day

and nighttime burglary
in a neighborhood like that,

there were a lot
of residents there.

- It was looking
like an execution.

Maybe there was
more to the story.

- Police always
look at the spouse.

- Mm-hmm.

- They just have
to talk to them.

- Right.

- Did they interview you?
- They did.

I spent hours with the police.

I spent hours
at the police station

in the days after that.

- Did you feel like
you were a suspect?

- Not at all.

- Did you feel like they were
suspicious of you in any way?

- Not at all.

- Gregg Smart's
short life was over.

Now, as police tried to find out
who killed him,

life for his young widow

was about to enter
a strange new reality.

And what happened next
would raise questions

about justice and fairness that
are still being asked today.

- Coming up, students with
a deadly secret

about to be revealed.

- If they hadn't told people,

I'm not sure
how this would have turned out.

- And one of those students
had an intimate connection

to Pamela Smart.

- Somebody came and told me
that he had a crush on me

or something.

I thought it was cute,
but I wasn't interested.

- You're the grown up here.
- Right, I was sure it was.

And I kept...
- You're working for the school.

- I was not even
thinking about him

in any romantic way whatsoever.

**

- A well-liked young man
had been gunned down at home

in a quiet New England town.

Bill Spencer, who went on
to report for

NBC affiliate KPRC in Houston,

was just starting out
in New Hampshire

when he picked up the story
of who killed Gregg Smart.

- He has his whole life
ahead of him.

He's a successful
life insurance salesman,

he's got a beautiful young wife,
and he has been,

for some reason, shot to death
at the doorstep of his own home.

Why?

- Police were asking
the same question

and trying to learn more
about Gregg.

Sonia knew him well.

- Gregg was
the life of the party.

He was always big dimples,
smiling, having all the jokes,

and acting a little crazy.

- Police learned that
Gregg met Pamela

in New Hampshire
about four years earlier

when she was home for
a holiday break from college.

She and Gregg
got along so well

that he moved with her
to Tallahassee,

where Pamela was
a sophomore in communications

at Florida State.

- He followed you there?
- Yeah.

And we used to go a lot
to the beach and travel,

we went to concerts a lot.

I was working as
a disc jockey at the time.

- She had been in a couple
of my classes

and she was walking, um,
and had a Bon Jovi t-shirt on.

- That's when Amy Newman Bonczek
met Pamela and Gregg.

- And what did you say to her?

- And I said,
"Do you like Bon Jovi?"

And she's like,
"I love Bon Jovi".

She's like, "My boyfriend
looks like Bon Jovi".

- Gregg wasn't taking classes,

but Pamela
was a serious student.

- I was having some problems
in a few classes,

and she would take me
to the library.

She'd have index cards,
she'd have everything prepared,

and she taught me how to study.

- How was Pamela around Gregg?
What did he bring out of her?

- Even though he was shy,
she was also, you know,

they were just very sweet and
kind of cozy.

- By the time graduation
rolled around,

Pamela and Gregg were engaged.

They went home to New Hampshire,
got married.

Gregg cut his hair
and got a job with his dad

selling insurance.

Pamela, who dreamed of being
a TV reporter,

got a media job
with a local school district.

- You kind of had
it all together at twenty,

twenty-one years old?
- Yeah, I was trying.

I thought I was
doing all right.

- Amy imagined a big future
for Pamela.

- I knew that she was
gonna do great things.

And I told her that
the next time I saw her,

I knew she was gonna be famous
and I would see her on TV.

- And in fact,
a few days after the murder,

Pamela Smart was on TV

being interviewed
by reporter Bill Spencer.

- She was wearing a beautiful,
vibrant blue dress,

hair was all made up,
makeup perfect.

She looked gorgeous.

- Police watched Pamela
on television with unease.

- We had limited the information
that was going to Pamela Smart

because she had the propensity
to talk to the media.

She enjoyed talking
to the media.

- While reporters
worked the story,

police continued
working the case.

And then came a break.

It happened at a high school
where Pamela worked.

Kids there were
spreading a wild story.

- If they hadn't told people,

I'm not sure
how this would have turned out,

because I don't think
the police had that much.

- Some teenage boys
at the school

were telling people
they killed Gregg Smart

and used one of
their father's guns to do it.

A neighborhood kid
heard them talking.

He repeated the story
to the father,

who located his gun and
then made a tough decision.

- Ended up bringing it to
the Derry Police Department,

saying, "This may have been
involved in a murder".

Turned out it was
the gun that killed Gregg.

- Shortly after that,
three local high schoolers

were arrested for
Gregg's murder.

Bill Spencer made a beeline
for Pamela Smart's house.

- She looks frantic and,
um, incredibly emotional.

And I'm like, "But-but-but
this is great news.

I mean, they just
made the arrests.

I mean, the case
is wrapping up."

And she's like,
no, I-I can't talk, Bill.

I'm just too upset.
I'm too devastated.

- It was the first time
he'd seen her like that.

It didn't make sense.

But turns out, Pamela Smart
knew the kids under arrest.

She had an intimate
connection with one of them.

His name was Billy Flynn.

- At first, somebody came
and told me that he had--

he was a-- had a crush on me
or something.

I thought it was cute,
but I wasn't interested.

- You're the grown up here.

- Right, I sure was.
And I kept--

- You're working for the school.

- I was not even thinking
about him

in any romantic way whatsoever.

- They had worked together
on a school program

called Project Self-esteem,

when she was
helping some students

produce this goofy
orange juice commercial

as part of a competition.

There's Pamela on the left,
and that's Billy.

- And then where does it go
from there?

- Well, I didn't think
it was going anywhere,

'cause I was not interested
and I didn't care.

Looking back, I guess
I was flattered by his attention

because I felt like
at that point in my life,

kind of low still after
what had happened with Gregg.

- She says Gregg had
had a one night stand

with a woman he met in a bar.

Pamela says
she was feeling wounded

and Billy made her feel better.

Apparently much better.

- How did things
cross the line?

How did it get to that point?
- I knew it was wrong.

I felt like I didn't wanna be
attracted to him,

but I still felt like I was.

- She said the affair
lasted a few months,

but then she told Billy
it was over

after confessing it all
to Gregg.

- You were going to try
and make it work?

- Yes.

- How was Billy Flynn
acting throughout all this?

- Um, he was angry.
He was sad.

He was crying.

He was-- you know,
and I felt-- I did feel bad.

Like, I-I didn't intend to
hurt his feelings.

- Not long after that,
her husband was dead,

and the teenage student
she'd been sleeping with

was under arrest.

- It was a complete shock.

And then when I-
when I first heard it,

I thought, "Oh, my God,
they found out about the affair.

And now I'm somehow part of this
one way or another,

because I had this
relationship with him."

- The kids under arrest
may have been young,

but they were also tough,
they weren't talking.

But police were tougher,
and figured that

getting the teens to talk
was just a matter of time.

- Coming up...

- It's "Body Heat."
It's "Fatal Attraction."

It's what pours millions into
the theater every weekend.

And it's right here
in New Hampshire.

- The drama builds

as the student who shares
Pamela Smart's secret does talk.

- What was his version
of events to you?

- Pam had said to him that
they could never be together

unless Gregg was killed.

- I didn't realize the scope
of this thing

until the sex part came out.

**

- In the days after the murder,
Pamela Smart spent

a lot of time with police

talking about
her life with Gregg

and what happened
the night he was killed.

But she had left out
one important detail...

- If you're being interviewed
for hours, though,

one might think it's relevant
to say,

"I was having an affair".
That's a possible suspect.

- Looking backwards,
I should have said that.

But I did not think that
I knew someone

that was capable of murder.

It wasn't even
in my brain t-that

he had possibly
killed my husband.

- But even after teenager
Billy Flynn

and two of his friends
were arrested,

she still didn't say anything
about the affair.

- It was bad enough
that my husband was dead,

and I was trying to
go through all of this.

And then I had Gregg's parents
calling me up, saying,

"Well, how come these people
that you know killed my son?"

- The teenagers
kept silent for months,

but then the prosecution moved
to try them as adults,

and the stakes got higher,

according to lead prosecutor
Paul Maggiotto.

- That's when they were facing
life without parole,

and the idea
of cooperating

became all the more
relevant to them.

- That's when they admitted
they killed Gregg Smart.

But there was more to it.

Billy said Pamela
was involved.

In fact, the teen said
she was the mastermind.

- What was his version
of events to you?

- Well, basically that Pam
had said to him

that they could
never be together

unless Gregg
was killed.

- Police heard a story of
seduction and manipulation,

that Billy had become
spellbound by the sensuous

and more experienced
Pamela Smart.

He would do anything
for her.

Even kill.

- And the original plan
was for him to try

and find someone
to kill Gregg Smart.

And they really couldn't find
anybody to kill him, you know?

So eventually, Pam started
putting pressure on Billy

and said, "you got to
kill Gregg Smart,

and this is how
you can do it".

- Maggiotto says Billy tried
and failed a few times

to kill Gregg

and then asked
his friends for help.

- And for the life of me,
I'm not sure

why they agree to help him.

And they agree
to help him

in part because
Pam says to them,

"you can have whatever you want
out of the apartment".

And Billy tells them,
"she'll give you $1,000 each",

um, which Pam reneges on
with Billy later

and says,
"I'll give 'em $500 each".

- They said Pamela told them
when Gregg would be home,

and she made arrangements
to be gone.

They ransacked the house,
Billy shot Gregg,

and they all fled.

Exactly three months
after the killing,

police had
what they needed.

They drove to
Pamela's workplace.

- She said, "hello",
and I said, "hello",

and I--
she said, "what's up?"

And I told her,
"well, we have good news

"and we have bad news.

"The good news is we solved
the murder of your husband.

"The bad news is you're
under arrest for murder.

Stand up, turn around, and put
your hands behind your back."

- And she's being led
by the police into court,

and she looks so, to me,
um, powerless,

so helpless, vulnerable.

- The news morphed
in a nanosecond

from the story of a tragic widow
to the story of a black widow.

She was 22
and he was 16.

- Up until then,
it was a murder case,

and it had a lot
of interesting parts to it.

But, um, I didn't realize
the scope of this thing

until the sex part
came out

between Billy Flynn
and Pamela Smart

and all the sexual
manipulation.

- People looked back
at her early interviews

and picked her apart.

Her looks, her clothes.

Was she enjoying
the attention?

- This is a real live
soap opera.

- NBC News did a story
about covering the story

with Bill Spencer's boss,
then the news director of WMUR.

- It's "Body Heat."

It's "Fatal Attraction."

It's what pours millions into
the theater every weekend.

And it's right here
in New Hampshire.

- The tabloids loved it,

especially when these
pictures surfaced.

Pamela Smart
posing in a bikini.

She gave those pictures to
young, innocent Billy Flynn,

the story went.

Supposedly all part
of her seduction.

The story moved like wildfire
around the country.

- I went in a gas station,
I saw "Star" magazine,

and there was
their wedding picture,

and it called her
the Ice Princess

and that she had
murdered Gregg.

I just couldn't believe it,
and bawled my eyes out.

There was no way this was her.

- When the media
was talking about Pam,

I couldn't recognize
who they were talking about

because it's not the person
that I know.

- The families and friends
of Pamela and Gregg Smart

were about to face
a media onslaught,

and Pamela
was about to become

part of a new kind of
television phenomenon.

- She told me she was gonna
dance for me like that.

- What did "like that" mean,
do you know?

- Like, provocative.

Like a striptease
type of thing.

- Red hot testimony.

- What happened after that?
- We had sex.

- By that you mean intercourse?
- Yeah, we made love.

- Cold-blooded murder.

- I said,
"God, forgive me".

- After you said,
"God, forgive me,"

what happened?

- I pulled the trigger.

**

- Welcome back to "Dateline:
Secrets Uncovered".

I'm Craig Melvin.

Newlywed Pamela Smart
received widespread sympathy

after her husband
was killed.

But in a stunning twist,

police arrested her
for murder.

Now, all eyes were on
a New Hampshire courtroom

where Pamela's teenage admirer
was about to reveal his secrets,

taking jurors inside
their doomed love affair.

Will they believe him?

Back to Andrea Canning
with "Deadly Secret".

- It was the first week
of March 1991,

ten months after
Gregg Smart was killed

and Pamela Smart was on trial
for his murder.

Reporters from around the world
swarmed the courthouse

to cover the salacious story.

The woman accused
of seducing a teenage boy

and convincing him
and his friends

to kill her husband.

- All I can remember hearing
is this explosion of flashbulbs

going off like...
[imitating popping]

As she's being led
into the courtroom.

- What kind of impact
did it have on the trial,

all that attention?

- I mean,
certainly I think

the court had to take
certain precautions

to make sure things
didn't get out of hand.

- Pamela's defense attorney,
Mark Sisti,

says things had already
gotten out of hand.

- I felt as though the jury
was in shark-infested waters,

they hadn't been
sequestered.

Camera crews at that point
were running wild.

We had our own client chased
into the women's lavatory.

- That was the backdrop

as the state of New Hampshire
laid out its case.

- ...and fired
one fatal shot

into the head
of Greggory Smart.

Prosecutors contended
in their opening arguments

that Pamela Smart was
a calculating temptress,

a woman who lured
young Billy Flynn

with promises
of sex and money.

- Yeah, that's the gun
I got out of the drawer.

- One by one, the teens
who had already pleaded guilty

to second degree murder,
took the stand.

- In homes, bars, diners,
and barbershops,

the people watched as they
described an awful crime.

One admitted driving the others
to murder Gregg Smart.

As he told it,

the motive was money
for him and for Pamela.

He said Pam told them

there would be a big
life insurance payout

after Gregg was killed

and they would get
some of the money.

- The driver told the jury

how Pamela Smart issued
detailed instructions,

including no stabbing.

- But one of the teens

found a butcher knife
in Pamela's kitchen

and held it to Gregg's throat
as he attempted to rob him.

- At the center of this
R-rated courtroom drama

was the lovestruck
teenage killer, Billy Flynn.

He took the stand
on his 17th birthday

and testified about
how he and Pamela Smart

became intimate.

Flynn testified that

while Pamela's husband
was away on a ski trip,

she invited him
into her bedroom.

And then...

- She told me she was gonna
dance for me like that.

- What did "like that"
mean, do you know?

- Like, provocative.

Like a striptease
type of thing.

- What happened after that?
- We had sex.

- By that you mean intercourse?
- Yeah, we made love.

- On the stand, Billy went on
to say that the next morning,

Pamela Smart began
a different kind of seduction.

- She started crying,
and that got me upset.

And she was saying that

the only way that we're gonna
be able to be together

is if, um, you know,
if we kill Gregg.

"If you love me, do this,
'cause you'd wanna be with me."

Like that.

- Then what did you say to her
as she was saying this to you?

- I told her
I did love her.

You know, I loved
her very much.

- Billy testified that
the murder plot was planned

over the course
of at least two months.

You could hear
a pin drop in court

when the tearful,
doe-eyed high school student

described the killing.

- I cocked
the hammer back

and, um, I pointed
the gun at his head.

- After you pointed
the gun at his head,

what'd you do?
- I just stood there.

- How long was it?

- Um, a hundred years,
it seemed like.

I said, um,
"God, forgive me".

- After you said,
"God, forgive me",

what happened?

- I pulled the trigger.

- Viewers were like jurors

rendering a verdict
in real time.

- I feel sorry for the kids.

They're so young
and everything

and they've ruined
their lives.

- The story of the wedding ring
was devastating.

"Don't take that wedding ring,
my wife will kill me."

Oh, my lord.

- There's no soap opera
to this.

It's real stuff.

It's real stuff.

- If the testimony
from the young conspirators

wasn't enough,

prosecutors had Pamela
in her own words,

courtesy of
another student,

Pamela's intern,
Cecelia Pierce.

Prosecutors believed Cecelia
knew about the murder plot,

but they didn't have
enough evidence

to charge her
with conspiracy.

But police did convince
her to cooperate.

- When Cecelia Pierce
came on board

and, uh, she decided
to start cooperating with us,

she wore a body wire
and talked to Pamela Smart.

- Investigators hoped
Pamela Smart

would implicate herself
in Gregg's murder.

On the tapes,
she didn't come right out

and say, "I did it",

but she did sound like someone
worried about being arrested.

- On one recording,
Pamela implies

she knows plenty
about the murder plot.

- She also worries
about what would happen

if one of the teens
involved in the plot

started talking
to police.

- How critical
are those tapes?

- I'd tell you,
they're the nail in the coffin.

If you really want
the truth.

I mean, they're the nail
in the coffin.

- As he wrapped up
the state's case,

Prosecutor Maggiotto
warned the jury

not to be fooled
by Pamela Smart

the way Billy Flynn
and his accomplices had been.

- This woman counted on
from day one,

that if this case
ever came to court,

she could put herself
on the stand

with her background,
her intelligence,

with her ability
to answer questions,

and pull one over on you,
ladies and gentlemen.

- The prosecutors
had little doubt

that the always poised
Pamela Smart

was capable
of doing just that.

- As the TV cameras roll
and the nation watches,

Pamela Smart is about to do
something unusual

for a murder defendant:
talk.

- Yes.

- Yes.

- Pamela Smart
takes the stand.

- I made a mistake.

- You've made a lot of mistakes
so far in this case.

- I sure have.
Yes, I have.

- Was killing your husband
one of those mistakes?

- No, it wasn't.

- Was not getting
a divorce,

maybe that was
one of the mistakes?

You should have gotten divorced,
but you didn't?

- No, I didn't wanna
get divorced.

**

- Pamela Smart says the story
told by the prosecutor

was compelling fiction,

a tale meant
for the movies.

In fact, after the trial,
her story became a movie,

a breakout hit for
Nicole Kidman.

- If somebody can't remember
Pamela Smart necessarily,

you say, oh, the movie
"To Die For" with Nicole Kidman.

Oh, of course
I know that case.

- If you watch "To Die For",
people take that and they say,

"okay, this whole movie
is true.

And this person, Pamela Smart,
is a horrible individual."

- It's a very iconic movie.
- Yes.

And it helped
to freeze me

in the image
of my worst mistake.

- That mistake, Pamela says it
was sleeping with Billy Flynn,

not asking him
to kill her husband.

She denies that.

Pamela says the jury
was infected by a press

that caricatured her
as an evil seductress.

She says the tabloids
were full of lies,

like those bikini photos.

That they weren't shot
to tempt Billy Flynn,

they were taken for fun
with a friend

for a modeling contest.

- Somehow the narrative escaped,
or got created,

that I took these pictures
for Bill Flynn

and gave them to him
to seduce him.

And that's totally
a false story.

- By the time
Pamela took the stand,

there was a lot
to dig out of.

She had to testify in court
that, yes, she'd been

a school district employee
who'd slept with a student.

- Yes.

- Yes.

- Yes.

And then when I did,

I told him that I didn't
think it was right,

and that it was wrong and that
I wanted to be with Gregg.

And he kept saying,
why wouldn't--

why didn't I just
get a divorce?

And I said,
because I love Gregg.

- She said Billy didn't want
the relationship to end.

- He started crying,

and he said that he
couldn't live without me.

- I felt bad. I didn't
wanna hurt his feelings.

I mean, I still wanted to be
friends with him, and he's--

he was still
a nice person.

- And then, the prosecutor
pressed her about

why she didn't admit the affair
from the beginning.

- I did not want the whole
United States of America

to know that
I had had an affair.

I made a mistake.

- You've made a lot of
mistakes so far in this case.

- I sure have.
Yes, I have.

- Was killing your husband
one of those mistakes?

- No, it wasn't.
- Was not getting a divorce,

maybe that was
one of the mistakes?

You should have gotten
divorced, but you didn't?

- No, I didn't
wanna get divorced.

- You were so composed.

Someone in the media even
likened you to an ice princess.

- Mm-hmm. I think I was in shock
completely by it.

I was overwhelmed by
the media attention.

I was raised my whole life not
to be a cry baby, not to be,

you know, overly dramatic
or anything like that.

And, of course, when I was by
myself later on in the night,

I would be crying when I was
rewatching the coverage

or whatever, you know?

It was--
it was upsetting.

- From defense attorney
Mark Sisti's point of view,

Pamela was more arrested
development than Ice Queen.

- She seemed more like
a 14, 15 year old

playing the part
of an adult.

- He says another false image
that persisted

was Billy Flynn
and his friends

as innocent young boys
easily manipulated.

The attorney says in reality,
they were tough teens

who killed Gregg on their own

and then concocted a story
about Pamela's involvement

to shorten their sentences.

- The quote, "boys were boys"
is a myth.

The so-called boys
were certified

by the Attorney General's
office as adults,

with the sophistication
of adults

that would face trial
in adult courtrooms

and be punished with
adult punishments.

- He says it's outrageous
that they were housed

in the same jail for months
before trial.

Billy and the teen
who held the knife

were even in
the same cell.

- They had a long time

to get their stories straight,
if necessary.

- From the day that Gregg
was slaughtered

in his own living room,

to the day they stepped
into the courtroom,

they could prepare
for trial together.

- What do you say about the
motive the prosecution gives

about you wanting
your husband dead?

Life insurance--
- Well, no-- right.

- Or the infidelity--
- No one has ever explained

any kind of sufficient motive

for why I would want
to murder my husband

when I could
have just gotten divorced.

My parents lived in a beautiful
house right up the street.

We had no children
and no property or--

and there was
nothing to lose.

- Why would Billy Flynn
kill Gregg, kill your husband,

with the help of these
other teenagers?

- I think he felt like

that was the only way
he could be with me.

It was very clear that
as long as I was married,

I was never gonna
be with him.

- Looking back, do you think
there was anything

you might have inadvertently
said to Billy Flynn

or done that could have provoked
him into doing this?

- The only thing I ever said
was that I'm not--

I'm not gonna be with you

because I'm gonna
be with Gregg.

- Still, it's hard to
explain those tapes.

- Pamela told us there's
a story behind those tapes.

Her attorney says he warned her
that Cecelia might be wired,

but Pamela
talked to her anyway.

- The police weren't
giving me any information.

I was completely cut off.

- She says on those tapes
she's acting,

pretending to know
more than she did,

in order to pump Cecelia
for information.

- All I wanted to know was
did this guy kill my husband?

I had-- It's like,
I couldn't even sleep.

I had to know,
did he really do this?

Because I knew that if he
killed my husband,

I felt like it was
all my fault.

Whether I asked him
to kill him or not,

it was still my fault,

because if I would never have
had this relationship,

my husband would
still be alive.

- Pamela points out that a lot
of what's on the tapes

is hard to hear.

She also argues that the tapes
may have been edited,

and the transcripts given to
the jury for deliberations

were unreliable.
- All these years later,

we found out a secretary in the
Attorney General's office

made the transcription.

That would be like having
my mother make--

make the transcripts.

- Do you understand why people
hear those tapes

and believe that
you're guilty?

- I do. Right.
I do. I do.

- The verdict.

- Do you think it was fair?

- And more than
30 years later,

some are asking
that same question.

- A lot of forward, progressive-
thinking governors

are saying that this sentence
is archaic.

Enough is enough.

**

- The jury in
the Pamela Smart case

deliberated for 13 hours
before rendering its verdict.

- How say you? Is the defendant
guilty or not guilty

of the offense charged?
- Guilty.

- So say you all?
- Yes.

- Guilty, and Gregg's
parents agreed.

- Tell him that,
by God, she did do it.

- She got what she deserved.
- And she's getting-- yes.

- But Pamela's family
was heartbroken.

- Get the hell
out of the way.

- Do you think it
was fair, the trial?

- I want my son. No, no. Get
outta here. I want my son.

- Not at all. Do you?
Do you think it was fair?

Of course not. From the
beginning, it wasn't fair.

- The sentence was mandatory.

- I am required
and do hereby sentence you

to the New Hampshire State
Prison for Women

for the remainder
of your life

without the possibility
of parole.

- Life in prison.
- With no chance of parole?

- No chance for parole.

- Today, this is home
for Pamela Smart,

Bedford Hills Correctional
Facility for Women,

about an hour north
of New York City.

She filed appeals

on the grounds of excessive
pretrial publicity,

change of venue,
and jury misconduct.

The courts found no merit
in those appeals

and they were denied,

while one by one, the teens,
now middle-aged men,

have been paroled.

Billy Flynn,
who pulled the trigger,

was released in 2015.

He addressed the court then,
once again, in tears.

- I felt a tremendous
amount of shame.

- Do you think about
Billy Flynn, what he's doing?

All the other guys?
- I do sometimes, you know?

And it makes me angry,
but I'm a person

that doesn't wanna live in
bitterness and anger.

- In our interview,

what Pamela Smart
did want to talk about

was her sentence,
life without parole.

- I'm not even arguing
of trying my case again.

What happened happened,
you know, at trial.

And I was found guilty,
and I was sentenced,

and I'm in prison,

and I've spent nearly
29 years here now,

So at this point,
all I'm saying is,

is the sentence fair?

- That's the kind of question

many criminal justice reform
advocates are asking.

More and more states are
rethinking mandatory sentencing

and the value
of life without parole.

- A lot of forward, progressive-
thinking governors are saying

that this sentence
is archaic.

It leaves no room for any real
change in rehabilitation

and redemption or mercy.

- And if rehabilitation
is the goal,

Pamela Smart would say
she's the poster child.

- I have one master's in law
and one in English literature,

and I'm working on a doctorate
in Biblical studies right now.

- She's an inmate advocate,
studies music,

and she does this,
praise dancing.

- Praise dancing, which I do
often in church,

it makes me feel free.

It's one of the times here
that I do feel free.

- Friends who have
stood by her

have waged a social media
campaign

to get Pamela Smart out
of prison, #FreePamSmart.

They say it's unfair that the
person who pulled the trigger

and killed Gregg Smart
is free,

while Pamela is not.

- So legally, what's left?

- What's left is
I have a petition

in front of the
New Hampshire Governor.

I'm asking that my sentence
be reduced

to anything but life
with no parole.

- Why do you believe that you
should be allowed to walk free?

- I know if I get out of
prison tomorrow,

I'm gonna get a job, and I'm
gonna be a productive citizen.

And I just feel like
enough is enough.

- In the past, members of
Gregg's family have said

they oppose her release,

and as the convicted
mastermind,

she should serve more
time than the others.

Bill Spencer looks back on all
the years of news coverage

and sees a gaping hole.

- Don't forget
about Gregg Smart.

He's been overshadowed
for so many years.

This was a young--
from everybody I've talked to,

beautiful, young guy with his
whole life ahead of him

and so much promise.

Um, he should be here now.

- Pamela Smart filed yet
another petition

with the state of New
Hampshire in 2018.

She asked that her sentence
be changed

so she would be allowed
to have a parole hearing.

Andru Volinsky was a member of
the state's executive council

that considered her request.

- There were letters
from inmates.

There were letters
from family members.

I learned that she
accomplished a great deal

while in prison.

- More than 500 pages
about what a good person

Pamela Smart is.
And then...

- Ten little words blew
her chance at a hearing

to smithereens.

She again denied responsibility
for Gregg Smart's murder,

so the council voted
against her request

for a change of sentence.

- If Ms. Smart's petition
had omitted any reference

to whether she was guilty
or not guilty,

and had simply focused on her
good efforts while in prison,

I would have voted
for a hearing.

- I think it's-- The problem is
it's sort of unpopular

for a governor to say,
"okay, I'll let her go,"

when she's not taking
responsibility

for what happened.
- Well, actually,

I am taking responsibility
for what happened.

- But you know what I mean,
more direct responsibility--

- Right.
- That you ordered this murder.

- So I'm supposed to admit to
something that I didn't do

just to get out of prison?
I don't get it.

- Paul Maggiotto has strong
words for Pamela Smart.

More than once, he's
called her a sociopath.

- This is a personal opinion?
- It's a personal opinion.

I mean, I don't have
the ability to bring

a psycho-psychoanalyst to her
and interviewer questions,

but look at her behavior.

Okay, maybe she's
not a sociopath.

Whatever she is,
she's a sick woman.

- Pamela Smart
wrote you a note.

- She did. She wrote me
a note basically saying,

I've heard you say on the media
that I have no remorse.

And I do have remorse for what
happened with the boys,

and I do have remorse for
my husband's death.

And I wrote her back and
basically said,

I get you have that remorse, but
you've never expressed remorse

for planning the murder
or for taking, uh,

responsibility
for the murder.

- Will you ever say,
"I did this" Or, "I--

- No.
- "I told them to do this"?

- No, because I did not
tell them to do this.

I didn't ask them to do that,
and no, I will not.

- So far, all of Pamela's
petitions

to be considered for parole
have been denied.

But she says she'll never stop
trying to win her freedom.

- And that's all
for this edition

of "Dateline: Secrets
Uncovered".

I'm Craig Melvin.
Thank you for watching.