Original subtitles

is our government in the possession of a

crash retrieval that was made not on

planet Earth we have a pretty good idea

where those things were taken it's not

the secret anymore that those things

have been retrieved

they've been retrieved all over the

world by special teams they've been

taken to the best lands

the Ukrainian researchers said you know

we see these UAP under all kinds of

visible conditions a lot of the time

lots of different locations

we also have the web telescope that can

look at such an object from a different

direction than the observatories on

Earth the myths are consistent with

oftentimes referred to as the gods and

there's a lot more going on here not

just on this planet but on other planets

I think this is the art of the Covenant

they were actually multiple arcs history

isn't what we've been taught and we're

going to get to the bottom of it

[Music]

foreign

the big picture and I would like to

welcome probably two of the most talked

about guys on the internet within this

subject and that is Mr Mike Barra and Mr

Richard dose which are both here with me

today thanks guys for for coming along

and uh it is a great opportunity to be

able to actually discuss about some of

the things in the big rules of the UFOs

or the UAP if that's we want to call it

now and uh and of course you come come

completely different backgrounds and I

like that well obviously it's going to

be interesting because your viewpoints

regarding some of these matters that

people have been facing and asking me

over the last three four years now most

people also know that they're the

subjects of UFOs UAP especially when

talking with families in like the

elephant in the room situation you know

well that has changed someone you know

because I can kind of go into my family

now going no no no no no you know

because

something ended up on the news saying

that UFOs uops whatever what they call

them are real

now what's the impact of that and I'd

like to find out first from Richard yeah

because from your background it was a

very visual background and I'm not going

to go into it because most of our

listeners if not all of them will

probably know your background

how did that impact you all of a sudden

it's all over the television people

might be asking questions

um was you aware that was coming was you

any inkling of that was going to happen

well going back uh some years before the

release

uh our group and I I'm a member of a

group of retired Intelligence Officers

former and retired Intelligence Officers

yeah and we've been together since the

late 90s

and we're trying to get disclosure out

and that's why I speak at UFO

conventions we met Senator Reid when he

was in the Senate Senator Harry Reid

from this is kind of where it started

yes right in the Senate he was a

majority leader actually at the time we

met him during the Bush Administration

we met him at a conference it was

somewhat

quasi-i-private conference in Salt Lake

City and he came in to be a guest

speaker and there's only there were only

about 80 people in the room and all

almost all of them were the retired

Intelligence Officers right and this was

in uh 19

2006 2007 time frame and he brought up

this he brought up the Nimitz incident

which is half it happened a couple years

prior to that and very few of us in the

room knew about it I mean there was some

other I didn't know about it at the time

but some others did and then jump ahead

uh we were invited to a small uh meeting

of a couple of us other Senators both

from he's a Democrat yeah uh to hear

your Democrat but also some Republicans

we went to Washington DC actually

Landover Maryland and we sat down and

talked in a room

and this is just before

the the the the atep stuff came out

right and then uh he didn't tell us it

was coming out

but he kind of heated that something was

the Navy was going to present something

okay and then of course it happened

um of course we were someone startled by

it the fact that it was almost

sanctioned and the way it was presented

yeah I'm straight to the newspapers

straight to the newspaper which is

unheard off normally especially those

newspapers ago but if you wanna yeah you

want to dig back after the release there

was a radio program in Washington DC a

morning show it was a male and a woman

and a man doing a show and they were

interviewing this

Pentagon spokesman all right and they

were you know they were asking all sorts

of questions about you know more

information can is more information

coming out and the spokesman said

and I'm most quoting him

we can only put out what the

intelligence agency gives us

and the quotes yeah so I thought that

was kind of odd that that statement was

made

um and of course Jump Ahead to no denial

though no denial and jump ahead to the

incident the Airing of it the analysis

of it

P I was never in the Navy I was Air

Force so but there were Intelligence

Officers had been in the Navy in fact we

have we had a a

Admiral a one-star Admiral a one stripe

Admiral they call him uh rear Admiral uh

Honor on our group and when he analyzed

the first thing he said was

when when the information came out that

the F A teens that were supposed to be

on alert protecting

hey we have contacts already wow that's

okay Richard yeah

my friends are just letting you know

they're around Richard

yeah

anyways yeah

he said

the startling information he got is

these two aircrafts are supposed to be

in the ready alert yes and they didn't

have any weapon systems on board

and now Jump Ahead to at that well they

didn't no no they didn't jump ahead to

the uh Navy Lieutenant who's now a bank

manager in Provo Utah who comes out he

was there at the time and says

two days before this happened some

civilians came on board the aircraft

ordered that all weapon systems be

turned off

the what the aircraft's unarmed For the

synthesis why do you think that would be

I don't know I'm gonna jump ahead to

Mike I think we

should've got a keen nose for these

things if you were you know you had us

you had a secret unmanned combat air

system yeah the joint unmanned combat

air system x47b that I was Consulting on

yeah 2003 or something

yeah or which is basically a drone uh

aircraft you know military drone not the

little kind that you fly around your

sailboat and put YouTube videos on but

the the big guy the big stuff but let's

say you had one that was more

sophisticated than than the publicly

being developed ones like like the one I

worked on and you wanted to test it it

seems to me that that you would test it

in probably a military testing range

which would be I don't know somewhere

off San Diego where this stuff all

happened and you probably wouldn't tell

your own military guys well is that you

were gonna test it yeah and and it's

weird because there's there's

descriptions of oh there was something

in the water that was that was there was

a bunch of foam or something in the

water there was like a ship or something

and they don't know what that was well

to me that's the carrier so what you do

is you you put this thing on a little

mini carrier to launch this drone you

probably launch it remotely you want to

test your systems and you want to see

how the military reacts so basically

it's just like when you've got the I say

an army Squad it goes out yeah hiking

the forest you're not going to tell them

halfway through that they're going to be

suddenly jumped by another team of

soldiers exactly you want another a

realistic thing to unfold to see how

people react exactly and the things I

see on the video are not more

sophisticated than the program I was

working on in 2003 and and so I would

say it's about the same performance

envelope and it looks like that's what I

think this really was yeah and now that

I know what he just sold us what Richard

just told us I'm like okay that

reinforces it even well yeah I mean it

does I mean the more you'll actually

look into this the more things start

screaming back again it isn't exactly

what it might be or wow he's being

explained yeah to be one interesting

thing I did come across was a document

an Israeli document official document

now there's really documents you know in

regarding UFO incursions and things they

don't hide the fact that they put UFO on

the documents you know they've never

been afraid to say UFO UFO UFO they've

done it many many times it was one on

2015. that talks about uh their their

pilots having to scramble

because of drones

CIA drones which were over their

facilities and it scrambled Jets to try

and chase them away but it was a waste

of time because he could never catch up

these are so fast that uh it you know if

you hadn't even said drones you'd

immediately think oh it's UAP or UFO

um but it was only the fact that they

actually said CIA drones and I thought

well why would they do that you'd have

no problem saying UFO in the back you

know many times before and but actually

saying CIA drones monitoring their

facilities and it was a waste of time

even them scrambling the jokes because

they were just outmaneuvered with

Incredible speeds yeah because the

airframe can take so much more than a

pilot can so yeah it's like a literally

like a video game there's a guy sitting

somewhere in a room in in California

flying this thing around probably

um or it could you know the artificial

intelligence is good enough that they

could probably just fly independently

but you know you assume there's a pilot

remotely connected well yeah satellites

and that airframe can do

can take far more punishment than a

human being can well remember when they

first saw the images and these are

detailed drawings which was first on the

first documentary from somebody who had

interviewed the pilots and they had

drawn for them

um how what they the Tic Tac looked like

and there was some unusual prong things

underneath it now they seem to have

disappeared on everything further

obscene I'm not I only originally saw

them in their kind of first bits of

information that came out and I did

actually look at them and I thought to

myself they look a lot like pit up tubes

they do you know strangely enough and

what for the audience do you know what

bits up tubes are anyways they were bits

up tubes are for and you tend to find

them on those type of

you know unmanned palleted Vehicles

right you know for the GPS and gives you

all sorts of different things and I

thought well it's got four of them up

you know and I thought that's unusual it

doesn't look I don't see many things

like that on what you might refer to as

alien Tech yeah yeah not a lot of

antennas and landing gear yeah yeah you

don't usually see that so yeah yeah but

you know there are people that said that

you know they've seen some of these

things and of course I've got some

recordings which we've seen from uh from

Mexico the children's of Mexico

um so there are some things flying

around and uh and they are unusual the

way they move and they are silent but

the big question is are they truly UAP

or UFOs as they want to say

why do you think what's what's the great

effort do you think now guys um I mean

why all of a sudden I mean we you know

we've been crying out for disclosure

many many people in this subject for

many years and when that happened

you know I mean they jump to the roof

they thought oh it's finally happening

but is it finally happening because you

know this is how we want to perceive

what disclosure is and is it even a

disclosure or is it some because many

people have suggested you know that who

I've talked to everybody is that there

has been these drone Wars happening

what's yours what's your take on the

Drone situation is it do we have all

these multiple countries like China or

in Russia now with their drones as well

which really look profound I've seen a

lot of the the blueprints and things you

know that from the designs of these

things but they're saying that you know

there's a lot of drone stuff happening

now well jump back to my early days in

intelligence in the late 70s and 80s at

Kirtland Air Force Base

a case that I ran uh

regarding Paul benowitz what he was

seeing yeah uh out there in a remote

area that test range area

was was drones it was the first very

very first

experimental uh project for the Air

Force with drones now back in those days

and Mike will know this because he

worked a Boeing the drones were launched

out of airplanes

yeah uh ec-135 airplanes which is

basically a 707 yeah yeah and and the

plane would have to be controlling it

it'd have to be in close proximity so

these drones are flying around and for a

ground Observer ah that uh there's a UFO

flying around that plane of course yes

yeah and so and that's what Paul

benewood saw the The Jump Ahead or take

not technology had Advanced now days if

you go out to Nevada if you can park

outside Creech Air Force Base you can or

if you if you go north and park outside

off you know

we just did a documentary around it so

we're going to see that here and you can

see drones flying all over the place and

they're highly sophisticated drones now

that's the future do you think I think

that's that's the uh I think that's the

same network I think uh you know Boeing

had that I think at least two projects

regarding don'ts that I knew of I might

work from longer than I yet yeah I

actually worked for out of college my

first job was with a subsidiary or

Boeing that sold the aircraft I didn't

have anything to do with the technology

oh right but I knew where the secret

building was you know where the secret

meeting was dude so

um but but I think the technology is is

going to be Advanced uh to the point

where you're going to take the pilots

out of the cockpit we have fighter

planes being tested a ton of paw and

Groom Lake

that are all remote their planes will

take off and they're controlled by the

ground controllers uh it's not gonna

we don't have to worry about gravity or

there's so much yeah the g-forces we

don't have it have to worry about any of

this stuff no so that actually puts away

the problem we've got to do in this sort

of inertia what's your take on it making

I'm working at Boeing on you you don't

come across drones well my take on this

stuff is did anybody watch Battlestar

Galactica have you heard of the cylons

have you seen Terminator 2 Judgment Day

I mean my God what are we messing with

but I mean I remember seeing in 2006 I

saw a presentation by a guy who worked

at a some Defense Agency uh and he

showed us pictures of them actually

splicing human brain cells neurons onto

computer circuit boards in 2006 okay so

that's 2006 nearly 20 years ago now 17

years ago 16 years ago yeah so if they

were working on that stuff then and that

would they just felt like it would

increase the performance of the of the

computer circuits by even greater

amounts or that they could then plug

this into a person and you know and this

is stuff that they they've been talking

about and working on for many many years

but I I just think to myself you know at

what point does does do you get Asylum I

mean at what point do you it's like it

and they do they always turn on their

creators yeah I know that we're getting

you know bits and Bobs that come through

on the press and stuff like that you

know well we've got computers now it can

beat us at jazz and all sorts of

different things and they're getting

better at them and better that's the

stuff we do now I always think to myself

you know well okay well how long does it

take until that to get to the mainstream

you know how you know what technology do

we currently have so many years 20 years

probably because yeah some years back

home I mean I started out in engineering

um and Telecommunications and signed a

couple of secret acts and I was working

on the guys nicknamed and bio boards

and this was 29 years ago and it was in

a it was a project between NATO Marconi

and it was something to do with three

large very large satellites unlisted I

believe uh satellites in orbit and the I

was working on the racking systems with

these cards and these cards will look

like the very large cars that you might

find in a in in a tower computer for an

example right but on them and why they

were called bio boards it's because this

the circuitry also had memory cells

which were biological biological memory

cells wow and I thought okay now I kind

of get it my nickname and bio boards you

know

um and it was all automated as soon as I

locked in these into the cabinet the

automated the link up directly to the

satellite satellites communicating with

them they flash out will you say flush

out the they they pair in a sense it's

like the old days of Bluetooth thing you

know they kind of pair and this thing

the satellite controls because

somebody's controlling the satellite to

tell the information to so somebody at

the other end is obviously dealing with

that right and they could I mean the

control of the satellites communicating

with this and I thought to myself

straight away wow this technology is out

uh I didn't know that's gonna be great

because it's going to be everybody's

computers I'm still waiting now and of

course you know I never talked about it

I never would ever talk about it because

I thought you know I signed two official

good sequel sounds not to do so

but um I remember about five or six

years ago I was reading on the internet

like IBM are going to be releasing

plasma memory cells and I thought Bingo

that's one they are and I thought well

if he's out on the internet I'm okay to

come across have you come across

technology have you ever heard oh yeah

let me let me tell you a story about

when I first came in intelligence in

1979 I went we we were deployed to do

something and I got up my first laptop

this is 19 late December 1979 79 we got

laptops made by IBM 1970. so it was it

was as big as a suitcase 70 pounds and

and we were able to send hyper burst

system only 100 bits on a message but

from one point to another or from one

computer to another so jump ahead when

was the first laptop in the early 90s

yeah so yeah the military

industrial complex will get the real

neat stuff before it ever is filtered

out into the Society of the public

sorts of Technologies right I mean how

many years ago when we heard about a rap

brain was flying a

um you know a military aircraft yeah you

know and testing and I think to myself

okay well that's what we do know now

it's out in the Press we know now but

how far are they really in advance is

the big question and of course if the

pushing all this into you know this

technology into drones that might

explain quite a number of things in

recent times what is interesting to me

is that you know we've moved away from

the old area one uh sorry Area 51

hypothesis that they're all hanging out

there and that sort of thing but I

thought to myself you know it is a

perfect place is it a new Area 52 in a

sense of speaking because you know

you're out at Sea you know nobody's can

see anything you know you haven't got

you know the ships normal ships passing

by or normal flights flying over it's

it's kind of a militarized testing

ground in a sense of speaking and I

think an ideal location to conduct those

tests because the Navy I'd have said if

you look through the history of UFOs

the neighbor has a very very strong

presence

in the subject of UFOs right from right

from the start you know

um and I thought to myself well that's a

perfect location yeah for the Office of

Naval intelligence has been involved in

studying this stuff for you know since

the 50s really I think I gave an example

in the talk yesterday about

um T Townsend Brown presenting he

presented to the Navy you know his

Flying Saucer idea so well I would have

thought that would have been the Air

Force but nobody no he presented well he

said I think actually his project the

cover of it said U.S Air Force but it

and it was a flying saucer but he

presented to the Navy and you know

that's interesting so the information

that came out for General people General

press or pizza Papa and people all

around the world saw the videos still

being pushed now and that's legitimacy

over these videos although I see timed

along as going back on tour yeah

I think you know when I look at those

things and I think to myself okay well

the average Joe blogs is not going to is

this is this is targeted for the average

Joe blogs it won't have any idea what

they're looking at you know to be honest

and it's to swing their opinion right

yeah which is why I think it's it's

really important that I I don't know I

feel compelled to point out reality

which is that there's nothing

exceptional about what's on these videos

these are questions that anybody should

be asking right but well but not

everybody knows to us no I mean I I just

I I have a really strong BS meter and

there's just something about it that

never felt right to me and then when

they brought forth certain spokesman

that I didn't really well you know my

view on this one you know yeah

can I I mean you don't want to say

Elizondo can I say that well he was

there but I mean the thing is he's a

he's an art he's an army

counterintelligence

I think I mean you've worked with Dr you

know Professor Hal putter yes I have

how's the nice guy and I don't think he

would have been sat there with that

180-foot screen behind him with a with

my minor blue if he well if he knew well

yeah here here's the

of course I was just I was a

counterintologist officer also I said

you were a grunt no but Army I

understand but I uh I ran uh we don't

call them disinformation operations we

call them deception operations with

misinformation but anyways if I if I was

going to plan something some kind of

operation involving the Tic Tac videos

uh

this would follow

well I would would have started yeah I

think I think there's so many aspects of

this that would cries out to uh

counterintelligence officers that this

is disinformation

and and why did some of the people well

you knew you saw the names of those guys

yeah on stage

it sounds real doesn't it do you think

they're not aware that there's someone

somewhere shouldn't have been doing the

checking somebody right well I think

that's the first thing I do if I'm going

to involve myself in anything true is

you know well what am I being part of

here what is it are you going to be

showing what photos where have they come

from you know be asking questions before

I want to put my face on International

television about it well I didn't

realize

the analysis until Mike's presentation

yesterday was just really extraordinary

I didn't I didn't realize all the uh

idiosyncrasies

uh that Mike brought out uh until then I

mean I knew I know there was were

questions but not as detailed as as

Mike's presentation was uh there's this

opens up a lot of questions now

I mean it really enforces my opinion

that it was all staged or it was being

conducted unbeknownst to the crew now

Kevin day I've known Kevin day he worked

in the uh combat operations center I've

I've spoke to him many many many times

seems like he's been sick he's very very

I mean I looked at his interviews and he

you know he was clearly bothered by this

yeah he was and and when these these two

civilians come in later on and and took

all the radar tapes

uh he talks about that that made me

suspicious who are they the Men in Black

you know honey we're told dude the

palettes weren't informed not to talk

about it but it was like Mike said if

some kind of an operation to test their

combat Readiness or whatever it is yeah

this is how you would do it because I

would have thought well you know what

what's happened here today stays here

and it doesn't go anywhere else and we

don't want you to talk about it that

would be the normal routine in the past

yeah you know if anything like that

happened because we know how it's

happening and the thing too is that you

know you have this um like

they sat on this stuff for like 10 or 15

years so they were waiting for the right

time to release this and put it out and

what writing for the right cast and crew

waiting for the right newspaper

cooperation because that has to have

been the thing is it's true it's an

attempt to create a narrative that's

transparently trying to create a certain

narrative and you know again I think

anybody I don't think I'm particularly

exceptional I think most

guys at no planes and stuff would look

at these videos and go I I don't think

that's Flying Saucer or an alien

spacecraft but

um there's this this narrative that's

trying to be created and and then you

start digging into okay well what's the

narrative well the narrative is aliens

bad because it's a tip and threat uh it

was in there right and so that's the

narrative alien's bad which they may be

I mean I think that aliens are kind of

like people there's probably some good

ones and some bad ones and I mean I

don't know I don't have any personal

experience thank God

so

um if it's aliens bad then is it part of

what Von broad talked about which is you

know the alien invade the fake Alien

Invasion scenario or actually but here's

the thing that really gets me about that

is okay if that's the track we're on

then that means that there's a conflict

behind the scenes that we're not seeing

between two sides and I'm not going to

call One the good and one the bad no I

think I think I know who the good guys

are but I I fully prepared to be wrong

yeah yeah but

um there's a side that I like and a side

that I don't like I'll put it that way

but then if if the guys that are in

power

are afraid of losing power then if that

if they've now pulled the trigger on

this doesn't that imply that they're

ready to go to that alien invasion

scenario which is the last thing and

that's a sign to me of desperation and

when people get desperate then that's

when you have

fake nuclear Wars and you know I mean

all the stuff that we're seeing in the

headlines today so I think that the

conflict

that's being displayed by the simple

publishing of this information and pass

it acknowledgment that it's real in some

sense uh it is actually fairly alarming

to my to my life a few things have

changed since then you know I mean

Alexander is not like with the ttsa

anymore

um well do they even exist anymore well

yeah exactly well only on paper I think

yeah learning a paper and I think uh Lou

is working for U.S space force yeah okay

oh he is okay I'm I'm dang I want one of

those space force jobs I want to be a

consultant I want one of those 174 000 a

year government consulting jobs so do

you think it's right it's gross guys or

do you think it's that's just you know

the thing is is that like I said there's

got to be more there should be more

drops to come there should be more stuff

coming I mean the Corbell video was

another one that got I mean I I

initially thought it's all about money

you know I mean because it usually is

right now yeah and uh defense money why

would the Pentagon cooperate with that

if it was just about money I mean well I

was thinking that you know what did he

want I mean maybe I mean I know that

he's been minding and I'm trying to get

you know the weaponizing of space and of

course there was a space trees yeah so

it's still stuck in the way of that sort

of thing and I know that would be the

efforts to do this on an official

capacity I'm talking about no I'm not

official yeah because there's probably

stuff already right okay

um but at some point something has to

become official

you know at some point to say okay this

is what he's going to be pounding and

that I can't imagine would be a lot of

money Trump was on that track yeah he

was talking about UFOs constantly almost

like every six months even you know and

and a lot of it was people asking him

questions but you know I think he's the

first president since Truman that has

admitted that he was briefed on UFOs and

I asked yeah I've been briefed on this

and that and the other thing and you

know he was very vague he was right very

general terms but he he kept bringing

back up this UFO subject uh and you know

Don Jr did an interview with him I think

in 2020 he asked him about Roswell and

he asked him about Area 51 and I he gave

some

evasive but nudge nudge wink wink answer

about it basically acknowledging that

yeah this stuff is out there and it's

it's important so I mean and then you

know we had the

changeover yes in public anyway I don't

know what's going on behind the scenes

but you know I think this is all signs

of uh tremendous conflict taking place

behind the scenes and I I Richard would

know more about it than me but I see it

from from the outside looking in I just

see conflict between at least two

factions yeah uh in intelligence about

which direction is this

or is this narrative going to go and and

I'm fascinated well you know that's

right I think it's a natural thing to

ask and and Challenge and you know

because we should get the information if

this is groundbreaking information it

should be out there and you should see

all the information that we requested

well and the things

the other thing don't they have any

better UFO videos

saying you know what he was aware that

there were lots of lots of photographs

taken in color photographs so you've not

seen any no and I mean people go back to

but but they saw 40 Tic Tacs in the air

descend for me

you have these reports of people saying

this stuff but we don't have any

evidence of that I know I can only

operate on the video that's put right in

front of me and my look at that I'm like

yeah Jerome you know well yeah

everything was good here's another

problem within government you have so

many different

agencies

that must come together and cooperate to

give up what they have in the files and

let me give you an example

a few months ago Lou alzando contacted

me and asked me if I would agree to talk

to somebody

within the Department of Defense

inspector General's office I said sure

all right I don't even hide I'll talk to

him so I had a couple conversations the

first conversation I had was a mediocre

I'm just interested in what I did they

they

kept referring to things they had about

me my my cases but nothing specific

a couple weeks later they call me and we

took and and one of the uh people I

won't mentioned his name but he wanted

to ask me questions about two Case Files

and he started talking to me about the

case files and I realized that he's

talking about cases that I did

and I said to him I said so drop this

open to me I said well well that is my

case I did that 1982. I said give me the

case number and I he gave it to me so

yeah yeah I did that case he said when

he started asking me

um around about questions not direct

questions because we're we're on the

phone

and I said well is that still classified

he said it the markings on it is

anybody's asking me encrypted questions

and I said well why don't you just read

the report

those questions are in there

well I can't because it's redacted

I said well what I said you're the

Department of Defense inspector

General's office and you can't get a

clear report from U.S intelligence he

said yeah I can't we can't they send us

stuff over but it's all redundant Lewis

obviously

defense Inspector General and they can't

get a clear report that's an example of

the bureaucracy within the Department of

Defense and within the government yeah

yeah he's surprising isn't that yes yes

so of course obviously they were trying

to get you more information about it

well they wanted me to come basically

come to work for him but I said no I'm

not interested uh I would how long ago

this is just a few weeks ago a few

months ago a month and a half ago we've

kind of been there and done it haven't

you realize yeah yeah yes you know yeah

and I just did I make a lot more money

on the outside

you're not gonna pay me yeah what I'm

making and why would you want to put

yourself back on this well and then of

course I would have to sign it NDA and

nah I would never do that and and and uh

maybe three or four days later they

contacted another person who was within

our group and did the exact same thing

to him because he called me up on Signal

everybody I don't know if everybody has

signals yeah somewhat secure he calls me

and he says you ain't gonna believe what

I just got a phone call I said well did

they call you yeah and they had my

reports too I said would they talk to

you about their report she said I told

them no I'm not going to talk about it I

said you fly me to Washington DC and

I'll do it but I'm not going to talk

about it even though he's trying to do

something then in the background and

well they're getting these cases that

are real about real UFOs I mean these

two cases that he had

were about actual contacts ET contacts

where we had pictures and we had uh

yeah we had evidence right and

so he he wanted to ask me these

questions about this case but I said

it's all in that report well it's

redacted don't you think maybe these are

just guys in in a job you know I mean

you know how things work you know but

Boeing Private Business Boeing was not

one company it was like four or five

companies yeah I remember one time when

I was at Northrop I I had to come in

because I worked for the for one side of

the company I had to come in to support

Engineers over the Christmas break who

weren't working so I'm supporting people

you know because that was how stupid

some of the rules were don't you think

it's maybe just some guy

who's curious who wants to find out

about oh I want to find out about UFOs

so maybe he's some guy who comes across

your game or has access to certain

levels

I mean does it do you think it really

represents does it represent a policy or

an agenda or a a you know it doesn't

seem objective by wanting to oh I'm

gonna pick this guy's brain well that's

a good a good good point that's an

excellent point I mean I know he worked

there but I don't know what you know if

whether he was officially complicated

because you know obviously there was the

other program the main program that was

it was all a tip was a smoker too but

how strong was a tip uh how much work

was required what position did he hold

well here's a problem the 20 million 22

million dollars what that

the actual as as Harry Reid

tells George Knapp it was

20 times that I can imagine okay because

that's interesting because I always had

that question it's like 22 million

dollars that's nothing I mean so I look

at it I'm like oh this is a money

laundering scheme for here yeah right

right I'm gonna I'm on a funnel 22

million dollars to my friend Bob Bigelow

he's going to contribute 236 000 or

whatever the maximum is to my campaign

and then I'm gonna retire and take all

that money and put it in my pocket

that's what I thought it was yeah but

now that you say that there was yeah

he's secretive much bigger budget said

yeah they were he was able to tap it you

know here he never explained fully

and of course you know about the the

safety deposit box and the key and the

death bed I'll tell you that story I

don't know okay but anyways the the

with the 22 million which was officially

appropriated yes by Congress yeah

you have black

projects black confidential monies they

call it so uh the intelligence Community

they uh are allocated a certain amount

of confidential funds which isn't really

tracked it could be 15 billion dollars

is for research and development uh

intelligence operations whatever

within that budget that's where a atip

got more money out of

and and although I don't know exactly

how much but Harry Reid said 20 times we

got 20 times that amount so you you know

do the math on that yeah and um but what

did they achieve what did the atip do

um

yeah it's classified but what do you

think

would you piece malice is Nimitz in the

Roosevelt case give us what whatever you

guys said we don't even know if those I

don't think we even really know that

those videos are related exactly

that's an absolute yeah that's the key

right there we don't even know that

those cases had anything to do with it

no that's right so what were they doing

what was it what was it all fall you

know I mean I'm not seeing anything and

I would assume if they did have it that

uh Elizondo and Co would have made an

effort to actually have their

information put out rather than you know

the the gimbal well you know I think

it's really important for anybody that's

in the subject you know because you know

they're going to start to really be able

to identify there's another problem yeah

that's right yeah the thing is you know

this discussion is really cool well

because so many so few people in the UFO

Community ask these questions and I'm

like am I the only guy because I used to

say it's frustrating because I used to

say you know what it was some of these

Blue Book officers blowing back in time

you look at these from the old cases I

think well you know what some of them I

mean they were great to be honest with

you but some of them at least asked some

questions you know and I think well why

aren't people asking the right questions

it's like uh acceptance just immediate

acceptance of it because everybody wants

FaceTime on CNN yeah

should have brought that up first

actually yeah

um you know I mean I I feel bad for

um Jeremy Corbell in a way because you

know he brought this video out and you

know he's on there talking about and

it's like I can blow away the argument

that's a flying saucerin about you know

like I did I mean I can do that and I I

wish that that people would run these

things by uh I think they're afraid of

being scooped though they're afraid I'll

take it and steal it and go out with it

first but I'm like dude I could have

just told him dude that's something with

a hot engine flying away from the the

ship and going over the horizon that's

all it is

it really is important that

people caught on at when you're during

your presentation was the direction of

the ship nobody realized that so many

people said to me well I didn't even

realize this ship wasn't going in that

direction something so simple yeah yeah

if you think if you just well they just

follow the narrative of what they've

been told right right which is actually

scary because I mean the whole essence

of what we're trying we try to do and

let's call it the UFO Community is is

get to the truth but if if people are so

willing to sort of accept what they're

told that's not what I want I want

people to question me I want because

they're gonna maybe make me dig some you

know or to a place that I didn't think

to go so well it certainly illuminated

that we have another issue yeah at large

and

um no this is not an easy one it's going

to be resolved because many people think

that we're going to get the truth

from the fish from an official Source

from the biggest newspapers from the

best reporters you know that they

obviously can't all be wrong well you

know what they're getting information

from somewhere you know and like I say

when those two and it had to be those

two newspapers that are involved and I

thought to resolve they wouldn't

normally touch the subject ever and all

of a sudden they're going to town on

this it looked like it was been kind of

set up you know it looked like okay

there's some agreement oh it looked like

that to you it's exactly okay there's

some agreement and then I expected

Leslie King to come forward and say oh I

understand that and say yes it's

definitely but she was kind of part and

parcel of that utilizing her to pass the

information forward and I thought well I

actually could draw a box of all the

people is involved in there you know and

it's a tiny little thing it was gaining

too much media coverage to be honest

with at least it's just everywhere he's

blindsided a lot of ufologist you know

and that maybe maybe what we want to do

you know it's just completely blindsided

because the fact is is that when he went

to Congress when we were talking looking

at this information

and when they were two it was turned

around and said he made me giggle

actually that oh well we need some we

need some more information we need to

look into this a bit more to try and

assess what's going on I was like uh

where have you been the last 70 years

you know surely we've got plenty of

information about what is going on

and I thought well you know and of

course eternally came in with a new word

UAP to cover the seen a little bit like

a bit of a boo-boo you know when the

government tries to change the language

I get very exactly the same way with me

same with me you would when UAP came out

and we asked and asked why you AP well

it covers more areas than just UFO why

you know well mostly it was known in the

meteorological industry yeah yeah

that's the good point see because it's

it's been in a meteorological uh uh

terminology for years yeah yeah yeah so

now we've kind of just drifted over this

video so the things the things such as

the discussions on the UFOs the old UFO

reports and things like that you know

they exist these evidence for them

they've got the information but that's

not likely to be shared so is it fooling

Congress it looks like feeling the guys

that are reading the doctors they

requested more information I'm not too

sure why inferior information how they

actually got but I doubt that it

probably would have got some really good

well let me tell you how the the

Congressional hearings went well they

were a flop as everyone knows the two

yeah I saw the videos they showed that

was that was a oh there's a there's one

on YouTube now about this I don't

remember who he is but he he really uh

uh put so much comedy into what these

guys are saying what these two people

were came to to a pentagon spokesman in

the other uh person came

to answer questions and they were

totally baffled by the questions now

there were groups of us we we already

submitted a number of questions my group

and and elizondo's group and so one

there's so many different questions that

everybody got to but listen to what the

response was when they said what about

the Roswell incident and they looked at

each other and said when was this what's

this what was it

and then and some of the other incidents

or crash retrieval uh well what they

were told I mean it was it was a joke

and then the hearing the Senate hearings

were supposed to occurred in September

of course they were

they were postponed until spring uh

they're going to continue well depending

on who uh wins the Senate and the house

but uh we have prepared better questions

and hopefully there's going to be people

and sitting behind in front of those

microphones that know something about

the historical aspect of this subject

matter yeah exactly yeah they will do I

mean of course it also what was

interesting also was a release of that

document of the projects the money

weather projects

Wormhole technology there's some very

interesting

projects listed there and

um I recognized the naming on them

because it fitted so well with some of

my research into the true aspects of UAP

you know and when we're talking about

you know um time latencies and

gravitational fun you know anomalies and

things like that

and I thought okay you know I can take

that on board that they're going to be

looking more into those sort of things

and then NASA came out and announced

that it was completely unusual now the

portals do exist which was part of the

MMS mission that they do screwed that

they they call it what's the name name

now is electron diffusion regions

and uh they sent uh they sent five I

believe them small satellites about the

size of a small Mini Cooper you know

size and they sent them up there

um for a number in about three years you

know looking at these and they

apparently stated officially that

they're sustainable

some of them are large

and they don't know if where they go to

you know if it's you've got to put

something in it right and yeah it comes

back I mean I mean the first thing

they'll do is send one of them through

you know find out now I did hear rumors

that they had done and uh but if you

don't know how truly

yeah this is the biggest problem but it

went very quiet there's no more

information from MMS about these these

um portals are real sort of thing you

know but that may be lent hand to some

of these discoveries because what we're

finding out in the UAP phenomena is that

they are manifesting on a lot of

occasions and demanifesting as if

they're one minute are there then that's

when they're not

um other people are reporting them

um there's a lot of fake stuff on videos

out there but you know there are

incidents where people are having that

but that's not just traditionalistic to

UFO phenomena it's it's mystical it's

ancient in times you know those stories

of things popping in and out of

realities you know and now we've got

Harvard professors going forward and

saying that now we know there's another

reality right next door to us and that's

when they asked by reporters how do they

know that and they said we can tell

about due to a gravitational anomalies

and I thought that was really

interesting so I thought Okay so we've

got all this money that's going into

these other special projects now have

you ever heard of these projects before

do you know anything about these

projects when when I was at uh Area 51

for the two time periods I was there

I I was a counterintelligence officer

for a lot of we're a highly classified

projects one dealing with time travel

um when uh and the other dealing with

um

trying to open shooting high energy

lasers and they

I'm not going to give away any secrets

here but they they they uh come on they

bombard a certain area with particular

types of of gases like argon and things

and then they shoot a laser into it

and this is supposed to open the portals

and they while I was there I I saw a lot

of this this type of activity

I don't know if they were ever

successful I wasn't I didn't everything

was compartmented I was the

counterintelligence officer but I never

got the results I never read the results

I didn't have access to the highly

classified r d report so I don't know if

they were ever successful I saw I saw

these things occurring especially time

travel one of which I thought was quite

extraordinary because they'd built at

Nevada Test Site

a huge magnets the two of the largest

maggots in the world are underground at

the Nevada Test Site

and they were again shooting lasers and

all sorts of things in to that and they

actually opened up

fabric of space at one particular time

but it's only open for a nam a second

and then if you try to push something

through there it's gonna you're talking

and things like that yeah yeah yeah well

I put off and I I've been at CERN and

I've been there twice watching different

things going on there that's

extraordinary what they can do there

I can imagine oh yes I know I know I can

also say that you know there are

time latences in in in residue phenomena

which is left by some forms of

manifestations not just on the uip stuff

but I mean on the Paranormal aspects of

things I mean you know apod stations has

repaired the newspaper from 1936

analyzed by the best guys in the country

in the UK they said yeah it's authentic

it's an authentic newspaper in mint

condition from 1936 that's the best way

we can describe it but it aged roughly

500 days per day

and it it wilted went Brown so quickly

it could work out because he got the

guys in from the newspapers and said

okay and this is kept in a sealed

container you know it's not just out in

the open this is a sealed container

and uh the best guys came in from the

newspapers and said well you know well

the degradation on this newspaper

you know we can say that uh to get it

from mint to this condition under the

period of time you've had it it's aged

500 days per day

uh and then it'll sort of to the point

where it's called a kind of caught up as

if you just found an old paper from 1936

in its got condition and that was

fascinating because they actually did a

full report on that so time association

with some of these things well

according to where they're coming from

whatever they be is has differences you

know which makes it really interesting

so also it's been in the news recently

is because this this one should be

straight on my mind

um Saturn between Saturn's rings unusual

moons yeah they'll see one there which

looks better very unusual well there's

this you know you know there was this

radio Source transmitter Source from the

1970s they used to call it the thing in

the Rings and I think I think actually

my old buddy Richard hogman wrote an

article about it for a news magazine

back in the late but now I've seen

something and now they're seeing

something and you know there's always

been the suspicion that that there's

something artificial there and you know

in the over complexities of the

hyperdimensional model you know Saturn's

very significant it's an inwelling point

a point where if you want to get out of

this solar system through some portal

means that that's a good place that

would be the place you would go

um and that Saturn has some you know

important connection we know it it

connects

um in a lot of Mythology and there's you

know it's probably fundamental reasons

for that in in terms of the physics of

how the large gas giants planets affect

Consciousness and physics and things

like that so

um they call some images look on the

internet now almost some of these um

Moon I know whatever it is whatever they

are yeah it shapes it's round and it's

got this Stone yeah it looks crazy you

know it's just like a mini satin

so the thing is though is that is that

at this point is it is it hours or

theirs I mean you know in the 1960s if

we spotted this we could probably say

it's somebody else's but now we've got

Technologies I think you know that I I

believe we we've demonstrated that

they could easily be our own stuff well

I mean I mean some of these things are

associated to publicly Tech Associated

to ancient old astrology

I mean what about Avila I mean well if

he's too many talks about obviously

that's very strange object that did a

flyby uh out from outside

went round and it seemed to have was it

made a course adjustment to get around

the Sun yeah yeah yeah

um

yeah and it you know came in so fast and

left so fast and appears to be this long

cigar-shaped object which there's just

no really good way that you can think of

to form that

um you know you think of rendezvous with

Rama or something like but it's not much

difference not much of our stretch to

looking at some of the um the very old

on small moons you know a lot to have

something or had something on them yeah

well like

um iapidus yeah is a one of the moons of

Saturn is is bizarre it appears to have

um

angular an angular makeup you know it's

it's like very evenly spaced Horizon

that goes in straight lines like uh Dojo

you know what out there has been busy

it's one time it's a busy place at one

time yeah and you know but who knows how

old

these things are they could have been

there for we can't imagine their length

of times we only measure our time behave

on Earth you know I mean 40 years ago me

working as long as that seems a long

time you know nothing to compare it to

no everything you know it's around us

and so I want to thank you gentlemen I

mean that's you know we are dealing with

some very unusual times at the moment

with the subjects of UAP shall we say

the new name uh we'll have to see that

where that's going you know but you are

you know what you'll be the guys I'll be

chunk I'll be honestly to try and figure

it out because like you say you're good

at identifying because you've been

involved in outside and basically you

just got a nervous for the BS mate I

mean yeah it's like you you and me We

Vibe because you're the same one you've

got to ask questions are you coming to

the subject and you do this it's about

asking questions it's not about standing

back and ignoring it no I come I come to

my increasingly bizarre conclusions

about the nature of uh space and the

aliens in the universe by asking a whole

lot of questions that's how I get there

you know okay I'm finally decided that's

a face on Mars after 150 questions you

know well thanks guys for for coming

along this is uh the big picture and

we've had uh Mike Barra and Richard

doses so do check into them they're

common across the UFO subjects all over

the world

um highly debated topics which very much

so for good reason

um and thank you for joining us