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Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:20,000 --> 00:00:23,938 During my friendship with Louis Lester - and I think I can call it 2 00:00:23,968 --> 00:00:25,847 a pretty remarkable friendship - 3 00:00:25,848 --> 00:00:27,829 I made several attempts to interview him 4 00:00:27,892 --> 00:00:33,130 in my official capacity as Deputy Editor of Music Express. 5 00:00:33,131 --> 00:00:37,370 After all, I had championed his music and his band, 6 00:00:37,371 --> 00:00:41,089 given them a lot of publicity and rave reviews. What was more 7 00:00:41,090 --> 00:00:44,571 natural than to follow this up with a really major interview? 8 00:00:52,931 --> 00:00:55,609 I never got a chance to finish it though, 9 00:00:55,610 --> 00:00:58,609 before the terrible events that engulfed us all happened. 10 00:00:58,610 --> 00:01:02,609 But I firmly believe the fragments I got are worth publishing - 11 00:01:02,610 --> 00:01:06,211 especially as the conversation took such an unexpected turn, 12 00:01:06,212 --> 00:01:09,091 one I could never have predicted. 13 00:01:09,116 --> 00:01:18,105 Subtitles by MemoryOnSmells http://UKsubtitles.ru. 14 00:01:18,131 --> 00:01:22,171 However, there was a problem with interviewing Louis, as you will see. 15 00:01:35,011 --> 00:01:37,650 So, are you ready to do this? 16 00:01:37,651 --> 00:01:41,289 That depends. Depends on what? A few conditions. Conditions? What conditions? 17 00:01:41,290 --> 00:01:45,289 When I say something is not to be published, that means it's not to be published. You understand? 18 00:01:45,290 --> 00:01:47,369 I don't know, we'll have to see about that. 19 00:01:47,370 --> 00:01:49,249 Depends how exciting you are on the record. 20 00:01:49,250 --> 00:01:51,049 Well then, forget it. I've changed my mind. 21 00:01:51,050 --> 00:01:52,449 That was a joke, Louis. 22 00:01:52,450 --> 00:01:54,369 When I say - and listen to this, Stanley - 23 00:01:54,370 --> 00:01:57,649 that you're not going to print something, that's what it means. 24 00:01:57,650 --> 00:01:58,769 And you'd better not. 25 00:01:58,770 --> 00:02:01,689 You start by threatening me? I don't believe this! 26 00:02:01,690 --> 00:02:04,849 No, we start by making my conditions absolutely clear. 27 00:02:04,850 --> 00:02:06,849 Why don't we do it like on the wireless? 28 00:02:06,850 --> 00:02:09,649 Is that what you want, all the questions and answers written out, 29 00:02:09,650 --> 00:02:11,929 like some ridiculously stilted interview? 30 00:02:11,930 --> 00:02:15,889 "It must be exciting to be a well-known coloured musician in London, Mr Lester"? 31 00:02:15,890 --> 00:02:19,169 Now you've promised not to write anything I don't want... Did I promise? 32 00:02:19,170 --> 00:02:22,169 We both know that one of us is going to come out of this interview deeply 33 00:02:22,170 --> 00:02:26,289 regretting they agreed to it, and it may not be me, Stanley. 34 00:02:26,290 --> 00:02:28,411 You're trying to scare me now? You think I can't? 35 00:02:28,412 --> 00:02:30,530 I know you can't. 36 00:02:30,531 --> 00:02:31,931 I know I can. 37 00:02:37,411 --> 00:02:40,570 My parents were both from Jamaica, 38 00:02:40,571 --> 00:02:43,929 my mother's family had come to England 15 years before my father. 39 00:02:43,930 --> 00:02:46,729 He was a merchant seaman, travelled all over the world. 40 00:02:46,730 --> 00:02:49,849 That's what I started doing too, as you know - before I formed the band. 41 00:02:49,850 --> 00:02:52,529 I got my first job at sea, when I was 17... 42 00:02:52,530 --> 00:02:56,649 You're in a bit of a hurry to leave your parents there. Let's just stay with them for a moment. 43 00:02:56,650 --> 00:02:58,691 Your mother - what happened to her? 44 00:02:58,692 --> 00:03:01,570 My mother was in service. She was lucky. 45 00:03:01,571 --> 00:03:05,169 She had a job in a great house where there had been a tradition, on and off, 46 00:03:05,170 --> 00:03:08,209 of having coloured servants going back to the 17th century. 47 00:03:08,210 --> 00:03:10,649 There was a big picture somewhere in the house 48 00:03:10,650 --> 00:03:15,569 of one of the dukes, at the time of Charles I, with his black page standing behind him. 49 00:03:15,570 --> 00:03:17,369 Why was she lucky to be there? 50 00:03:17,370 --> 00:03:20,211 Because the lady of the house took an interest in her, 51 00:03:20,212 --> 00:03:22,530 which was very unusual - still is. 52 00:03:22,531 --> 00:03:26,089 And no, I'm not going to name her, because they're still very much 53 00:03:26,090 --> 00:03:29,369 around at the moment, not the lady in question, but the family. 54 00:03:29,370 --> 00:03:32,369 I read about their social engagements in The Times newspaper. 55 00:03:32,370 --> 00:03:36,209 Hmm, maybe they're about to have a great party and they'll ask for your band to play there, 56 00:03:36,210 --> 00:03:39,049 and you can return in triumph to where your mum worked. 57 00:03:39,050 --> 00:03:40,569 The thought had occurred to me. 58 00:03:40,570 --> 00:03:43,771 How did this duchess, or whoever, take an interest in your mother? 59 00:03:43,772 --> 00:03:48,410 Just in small ways, of course. She gave her books to read, 60 00:03:48,411 --> 00:03:52,249 she gave her Vanity Fair by William Makepeace Thackeray. 61 00:03:52,250 --> 00:03:55,049 My mother couldn't read, but didn't dare tell the lady of the house, 62 00:03:55,050 --> 00:03:57,769 so she taught herself to read, and then she read 63 00:03:57,770 --> 00:04:00,929 the whole of Vanity Fair and she gave it to me just before she died. 64 00:04:00,930 --> 00:04:02,649 Have you read it? I have, yes, 65 00:04:02,650 --> 00:04:05,251 although I have to admit I did have to start it three times. 66 00:04:05,252 --> 00:04:09,010 Anyway, your mum and your dad - were you close? 67 00:04:09,011 --> 00:04:11,609 No, that's all I want to say about them. Let's move on. 68 00:04:11,610 --> 00:04:14,969 That's twice you've tried not to talk about them. Is that all you're going to give me - 69 00:04:14,970 --> 00:04:16,169 your mum and Vanity Fair? 70 00:04:16,170 --> 00:04:19,369 Yes, this is off the record now, Stanley, and not to be printed. 71 00:04:19,370 --> 00:04:21,649 You're only allowed three. Who says? 72 00:04:21,650 --> 00:04:25,289 I'm telling you, you're only allowed three "off the records", and I'm counting. 73 00:04:25,290 --> 00:04:28,329 Are you sure you want this to be one of them? Yes. 74 00:04:28,330 --> 00:04:31,651 My mother had problems - especially when my father was away at the war. 75 00:04:31,652 --> 00:04:34,290 She was in a state of constant fear. 76 00:04:34,291 --> 00:04:38,129 She often screamed when she saw the postman walking down the street, or the telegraph boy. 77 00:04:38,130 --> 00:04:41,049 Yes, God, most hated boys, the telegraph boys. 78 00:04:41,050 --> 00:04:44,129 I thought about doing that after the war started. 79 00:04:44,130 --> 00:04:48,649 Watched them coming down the street, and I remember thinking, no, no. 80 00:04:48,650 --> 00:04:52,691 I never want to be one of those boys, constantly bringing news of death. 81 00:04:53,731 --> 00:04:57,291 You look surprised. I was surprised, that's, er... A bit serious for me? 82 00:04:57,292 --> 00:05:00,970 I didn't say that. You meant it though. Leave it. 83 00:05:00,971 --> 00:05:03,931 I should never have interrupted when you're talking about your mum. 84 00:05:03,932 --> 00:05:08,490 My mother... Well, her moods became more and more frequent. 85 00:05:08,491 --> 00:05:11,491 She went mad? That's why we're off the record, yes, 86 00:05:11,492 --> 00:05:15,210 but I wouldn't say she went mad - she was... 87 00:05:15,211 --> 00:05:18,090 locked inside her own world. 88 00:05:18,091 --> 00:05:20,211 Every night she yelled out at God, 89 00:05:20,212 --> 00:05:23,530 had this passionate conversation with Him. 90 00:05:23,531 --> 00:05:26,211 She thought that a black soldier, for some reason, 91 00:05:26,212 --> 00:05:29,810 a black soldier was more likely to be killed. 92 00:05:29,811 --> 00:05:33,091 I sometimes came across her, in the kitchen, quite naked, 93 00:05:33,092 --> 00:05:37,890 on her knees, praying, praying. 94 00:05:37,891 --> 00:05:40,610 I've never prayed in my life, Stanley, 95 00:05:40,611 --> 00:05:43,290 and I certainly never intend to do so. 96 00:05:43,291 --> 00:05:46,890 But her prayers, it did bring him back. 97 00:05:46,891 --> 00:05:54,171 Her great love. She only had eyes for him, always just for him. 98 00:05:55,611 --> 00:05:58,489 But then my father, he never really spoke about the war. 99 00:05:58,490 --> 00:06:02,129 Nobody wants to talk about the war. I know. It's as if, at the moment, 100 00:06:02,130 --> 00:06:05,251 there isn't a single person who wants to remember the war. 101 00:06:05,252 --> 00:06:08,970 We were lucky, so bloody lucky, 102 00:06:08,971 --> 00:06:12,010 to be young enough to just miss all that. 103 00:06:12,011 --> 00:06:13,771 I remember going down the river one day, 104 00:06:13,772 --> 00:06:17,210 just after the war had started, sunny afternoon, 105 00:06:17,211 --> 00:06:19,009 went down to the beach at Battersea 106 00:06:19,010 --> 00:06:21,529 where at low tide you can wade out into the river. 107 00:06:21,530 --> 00:06:24,811 The boats were all going past, still a lot of young men on them, 108 00:06:24,812 --> 00:06:27,810 taking their girls out on the water. 109 00:06:27,811 --> 00:06:31,049 And there was this one girl standing on the river bank, 110 00:06:31,050 --> 00:06:34,451 just above the beach. She had a young man with her, 111 00:06:34,452 --> 00:06:39,050 and her dog, and she tied the dog to a tree. 112 00:06:39,051 --> 00:06:43,850 And then they were kissing really passionately, just near me, 113 00:06:43,851 --> 00:06:46,891 and touching each other all over. I was only 11, 114 00:06:46,892 --> 00:06:49,771 it was a tremendous free show. 115 00:06:50,971 --> 00:06:53,810 And I... I watched it all. 116 00:06:53,811 --> 00:06:59,170 She says goodbye to him. He was in uniform, he was going to the war. 117 00:06:59,171 --> 00:07:00,491 And then he leaves her. 118 00:07:02,451 --> 00:07:07,370 She turns round, and the dog was gone, it'd managed to get free, 119 00:07:07,371 --> 00:07:10,489 so she starts running all over the park trying to find the dog. 120 00:07:10,490 --> 00:07:13,651 I decided to help her. I mean, after that wonderful show, 121 00:07:13,652 --> 00:07:16,090 that was the least I could do. 122 00:07:16,091 --> 00:07:19,570 And I remember so clearly, 123 00:07:19,571 --> 00:07:23,609 when I was helping to try and find her dog, how joyful she was 124 00:07:23,610 --> 00:07:27,811 at what had just happened, because he must have said how much he truly 125 00:07:27,812 --> 00:07:34,250 loved her, and yet how sad she was at the same time because he'd gone. 126 00:07:34,251 --> 00:07:36,249 She was so full of both those things at once 127 00:07:36,250 --> 00:07:39,169 and I could feel it so strongly because I was right next to her. 128 00:07:39,170 --> 00:07:40,529 And did you find the dog? 129 00:07:40,530 --> 00:07:43,729 Oh, yes, I found the dog. "Here it is!" I said, 130 00:07:43,730 --> 00:07:46,691 and she gave me a little kiss on the top of me head 131 00:07:46,692 --> 00:07:48,290 and she was gone. 132 00:07:48,291 --> 00:07:49,331 Funny... 133 00:07:51,611 --> 00:07:57,010 Often think about her, what happened to her, and if, er... 134 00:07:57,011 --> 00:08:00,170 well, if he ever came back. 135 00:08:00,171 --> 00:08:01,611 She was a beautiful girl. 136 00:08:04,131 --> 00:08:06,089 Sweet little story, really, isn't it? 137 00:08:06,090 --> 00:08:08,169 It is. So why are you looking at me like that? 138 00:08:08,170 --> 00:08:11,129 You tell me a story of your own, Stanley, hoping I'll open up to you. 139 00:08:11,130 --> 00:08:14,211 Maybe. But you're going to open up to me anyway, Louis. 140 00:08:15,611 --> 00:08:21,251 So, no brothers or sisters, and you're all alone living with your deeply religious mother? 141 00:08:21,252 --> 00:08:25,250 Yes. Do you have any brothers and sisters? I don't. 142 00:08:25,251 --> 00:08:28,411 That's a coincidence. Both of us being only children. 143 00:08:28,412 --> 00:08:33,410 Yes. Might explain something, of course, although I don't know what. 144 00:08:33,411 --> 00:08:37,529 And both your parents died in the flu epidemic - that must have been a devastating time. 145 00:08:37,530 --> 00:08:39,169 Are we still off the record? 146 00:08:39,170 --> 00:08:43,169 For heaven's sake, you can tell me about that. Both your parents die, you're incredibly upset. 147 00:08:43,170 --> 00:08:46,771 We are still off the record. Oh! Go on, if we have to be. 148 00:08:46,772 --> 00:08:50,650 It was in a way, devastating, of course. 149 00:08:50,651 --> 00:08:53,369 But in another way, I was already on my own. 150 00:08:53,370 --> 00:08:56,689 I had naturally seen very little of my father during the war 151 00:08:56,690 --> 00:09:00,409 and when he came back, he really didn't speak to me very much. 152 00:09:00,410 --> 00:09:03,489 And there was a time, shortly before he died, 153 00:09:03,490 --> 00:09:05,129 when we were walking along the street, 154 00:09:05,130 --> 00:09:07,649 and he stopped to buy toffee apples for both of us. 155 00:09:07,650 --> 00:09:10,529 I was a little old for toffee apples, I thought, 156 00:09:10,530 --> 00:09:12,609 but I realised that he wanted one, 157 00:09:12,610 --> 00:09:15,769 and he was pretending it was for me, the reason why he was buying them. 158 00:09:15,770 --> 00:09:18,809 We walked along a little way eating our toffee apples 159 00:09:18,810 --> 00:09:22,169 and I did think, here is a chance to talk to him about the war - 160 00:09:22,170 --> 00:09:24,291 got to try and talk to him about it. 161 00:09:24,292 --> 00:09:29,850 So I asked him about sleep. Was it easy to sleep in the trenches? 162 00:09:29,851 --> 00:09:32,409 Did he ever get used to it? And what did he say? 163 00:09:32,410 --> 00:09:34,771 He said he didn't really remember, even though 164 00:09:34,772 --> 00:09:38,810 it was only a year after the war. 165 00:09:38,811 --> 00:09:41,091 He didn't really remember about sleep. 166 00:09:43,211 --> 00:09:45,689 And we walked along together eating our toffee apples 167 00:09:45,690 --> 00:09:47,771 and that was the last time I ever spoke to him. 168 00:09:51,691 --> 00:09:54,169 Shall I tell you the brutal truth? The brutal truth? 169 00:09:54,170 --> 00:09:58,769 That sounds promising. Tell me the brutal truth, Louis, just as long as it's on the fucking record. 170 00:09:58,770 --> 00:10:03,169 This is on the record, but you won't want to print it. I'm sure I will. No, I know you won't. 171 00:10:03,170 --> 00:10:05,369 Thanks for providing the sandwiches, by the way. 172 00:10:05,370 --> 00:10:07,809 There's champagne. But at this rate, you're not going to earn it. 173 00:10:07,810 --> 00:10:10,649 Don't rush to judgment, Stanley. What is the brutal truth? 174 00:10:10,650 --> 00:10:13,691 It is that people don't like the idea of me being English, 175 00:10:13,692 --> 00:10:15,370 not even you. 176 00:10:15,371 --> 00:10:17,650 What have I done to deserve that? 177 00:10:17,651 --> 00:10:20,609 It's true, they prefer to think of me as an American. 178 00:10:20,610 --> 00:10:24,129 The most frequent question I get asked is, "Are you going back to America soon?" 179 00:10:24,130 --> 00:10:27,409 Yes, but that only proves what a novelty you are, not a minstrel band. 180 00:10:27,410 --> 00:10:31,329 I'm not sure that's what they mean when they ask that. Of course, many people are prejudiced, 181 00:10:31,330 --> 00:10:34,449 but there are many that aren't, and those numbers are growing. 182 00:10:34,450 --> 00:10:36,649 Is that Stanley Mitchell's own research? 183 00:10:36,650 --> 00:10:39,851 In a way, yes. It is my considered opinion as a professional observer 184 00:10:39,852 --> 00:10:42,330 of the current scene. 185 00:10:42,331 --> 00:10:45,730 Is that what you are, a professional observer? 186 00:10:45,731 --> 00:10:48,529 Anyway, if you were American, and you were there now, in quite 187 00:10:48,530 --> 00:10:52,291 a few states they'd put you in jail for sleeping with a white woman. 188 00:10:56,651 --> 00:10:59,609 I'm just going to sit here and eat your sandwiches 189 00:10:59,610 --> 00:11:02,049 until you move on to something else. 190 00:11:02,050 --> 00:11:04,609 I'm certainly not going to comment on that. 191 00:11:04,610 --> 00:11:10,129 Of course I'm not going to write about your personal life! D'you think I'm that kind of journalist? 192 00:11:10,130 --> 00:11:12,689 I'm quite offended. I will make one observation, however. 193 00:11:12,690 --> 00:11:15,931 It's that you, Stanley Mitchell, have never been to America. 194 00:11:15,932 --> 00:11:18,210 You are deeply fascinated by it, 195 00:11:18,211 --> 00:11:22,970 of course, but you have absolutely no idea what it's really like. 196 00:11:22,971 --> 00:11:25,370 I haven't been to America, yet, no. 197 00:11:25,371 --> 00:11:29,329 My mum hadn't heard an American accent until a couple of years ago when we went to the talkies. 198 00:11:29,330 --> 00:11:32,251 That was the same for most of the country. They hadn't heard it either. 199 00:11:32,252 --> 00:11:35,970 She said, "Oooh, so that's what they sound like!" 200 00:11:35,971 --> 00:11:37,490 Yes. 201 00:11:37,491 --> 00:11:41,331 To state the obvious, I have seen more of the world than you. 202 00:11:43,211 --> 00:11:48,330 So, Mr Lester, what's it like being a coloured musician in London now? 203 00:11:48,331 --> 00:11:51,251 This is off the record now, Stanley. Oh, for... 204 00:11:51,252 --> 00:11:56,050 When you are a coloured person, you are very visible, of course, 205 00:11:56,051 --> 00:11:58,849 and people make remarks all the time, you get used to it. 206 00:11:58,850 --> 00:12:00,929 Sometimes you can't ignore them, most of the time 207 00:12:00,930 --> 00:12:04,771 you find a way, or at least I do, of letting it slip past you. 208 00:12:04,772 --> 00:12:07,930 But at the same time you are invisible. 209 00:12:07,931 --> 00:12:10,130 Because you are coloured, 210 00:12:10,131 --> 00:12:12,651 you are obviously not a person of consequence. 211 00:12:12,652 --> 00:12:14,970 "Of course, how could he be!" 212 00:12:14,971 --> 00:12:18,929 So even if you hear something very private, people think you'll 213 00:12:18,930 --> 00:12:21,489 never know anybody important enough to repeat it to. 214 00:12:21,490 --> 00:12:24,089 And if you are a musician that is doubly true, 215 00:12:24,090 --> 00:12:28,331 because you are just providing the background sound to all these 216 00:12:28,332 --> 00:12:32,810 people's lives, so they often behave as if you don't exist 217 00:12:32,811 --> 00:12:35,609 and you get to hear some very intimate things. 218 00:12:35,610 --> 00:12:38,689 For instance, on some of the big ocean crossings, 219 00:12:38,690 --> 00:12:42,569 just after the financial crash, when I was playing in first class, 220 00:12:42,570 --> 00:12:46,969 I heard people talking about killing themselves right in front of me. 221 00:12:46,970 --> 00:12:50,171 And I heard other people laying out all their business plans, 222 00:12:50,172 --> 00:12:54,210 exactly how they were going to destroy their rivals. 223 00:12:54,211 --> 00:12:59,050 So I feel quite lucky in a way to have been able to eavesdrop on 224 00:12:59,051 --> 00:13:06,170 so many people, as part of the furniture of their lives. 225 00:13:06,171 --> 00:13:10,010 And now, because I have had success, 226 00:13:10,011 --> 00:13:12,569 people don't talk like that in front of me any more. 227 00:13:12,570 --> 00:13:15,531 Give me some more examples of what you've heard. You think I'm mad? 228 00:13:15,532 --> 00:13:19,530 I'm not sure about all this invisible, visible stuff. 229 00:13:19,531 --> 00:13:22,371 It's all a bit over-prepared for me, it's a bit too polished. 230 00:13:22,372 --> 00:13:24,650 But isn't that who I am, Stanley? 231 00:13:24,651 --> 00:13:28,769 A bit of polish is good. Oh, right, yes, the old Louis Lester polish - I forgot, of course! 232 00:13:28,770 --> 00:13:31,251 Well, answer me this then, Mr Louis Lester. 233 00:13:34,251 --> 00:13:37,370 Do you consider yourself a radical person? 234 00:13:37,371 --> 00:13:39,891 Somebody who has left-leaning sympathies? 235 00:13:39,892 --> 00:13:43,050 Well, generally I'm not a political person. 236 00:13:43,051 --> 00:13:46,009 Of course, we live at a time when there is a huge gap 237 00:13:46,010 --> 00:13:49,369 between the rich and the poor, and naturally like most reasonable 238 00:13:49,370 --> 00:13:52,409 people, I don't believe that's right, but I'm not a communist. 239 00:13:52,410 --> 00:13:55,929 I suppose I believe that there's never just one solution 240 00:13:55,930 --> 00:13:57,329 to any given problem. 241 00:13:57,330 --> 00:14:00,289 God help us. You're not talking to the Daily Express, you know. 242 00:14:00,290 --> 00:14:03,729 I'm very aware of that. They would have prepared for this interview a lot better. 243 00:14:03,730 --> 00:14:07,089 So what's your conclusion about how things are, from all this invisibility? 244 00:14:07,090 --> 00:14:10,849 The position you've been in, which you seem to regard as quite a lucky position? 245 00:14:10,850 --> 00:14:14,049 And you're going to yell at me, because it's so obvious. Probably. 246 00:14:14,050 --> 00:14:16,691 My conclusion is - there's a hell of a lot of ignorance 247 00:14:16,692 --> 00:14:18,450 about people like me. 248 00:14:18,451 --> 00:14:20,250 From most people? 249 00:14:20,251 --> 00:14:21,730 From everybody. 250 00:14:21,731 --> 00:14:23,969 From everybody? Well, fucking hell Louis, 251 00:14:23,970 --> 00:14:26,931 it's a good job we're doing this interview then, isn't it? 252 00:14:31,011 --> 00:14:35,610 # Come into the warm, it's Christmas 253 00:14:35,611 --> 00:14:37,289 # Time for you to toast your toes... # 254 00:14:37,290 --> 00:14:39,811 The feeling in the ballroom of the Imperial Hotel 255 00:14:39,812 --> 00:14:44,610 when the band played used to vary wildly from night to night. 256 00:14:44,611 --> 00:14:48,730 From high excitement to complete incomprehension. 257 00:14:48,731 --> 00:14:52,049 The performance I really wish I'd been there for was 258 00:14:52,050 --> 00:14:55,729 when they played to the old dowagers on Christmas Day as they tucked into their puddings, 259 00:14:55,730 --> 00:14:59,691 the old ladies looking to see if they'd been lucky and got a sixpence in their portion. 260 00:14:59,692 --> 00:15:05,010 Never had there been a more unlikely audience for jazz music. 261 00:15:05,011 --> 00:15:08,009 And yet, I'm told, there was a feeling of reasonable 262 00:15:08,010 --> 00:15:10,529 tolerance in the room, broken only by the shocking 263 00:15:10,530 --> 00:15:13,651 spectacle of members of the German Embassy walking out in protest. 264 00:15:16,291 --> 00:15:19,969 Which just helps to prove how powerful the right music can be 265 00:15:19,970 --> 00:15:22,171 when it confronts the wrong audience. 266 00:15:24,851 --> 00:15:27,451 # Come ye faithful, come, it's Christmas... # 267 00:15:31,851 --> 00:15:35,209 For some reason, you're not asking me the question you really want to ask. 268 00:15:35,210 --> 00:15:38,049 Oh, how very idiotic of me. And why am I not asking that question? 269 00:15:38,050 --> 00:15:41,289 I don't know, Stanley. I don't know why you're pussyfooting around. 270 00:15:41,290 --> 00:15:43,409 What is that question? This is off the record. 271 00:15:43,410 --> 00:15:45,809 That's three down, now. Come on, you've had your lot. 272 00:15:45,810 --> 00:15:47,169 We'll see about that. 273 00:15:47,170 --> 00:15:50,449 The question you're not asking is why are so many upper class people... 274 00:15:50,450 --> 00:15:55,049 No, not so many, that's quite wrong. Why are some upper class people, 275 00:15:55,050 --> 00:15:58,969 including royalty, so interested in jazz music and black musicians? 276 00:15:58,970 --> 00:16:03,089 Ah, well, I don't have to ask that question, for the very simple reason, I know the answer. 277 00:16:03,090 --> 00:16:07,569 You know? Yes, it's easy - cos they find it very sexually exciting. 278 00:16:07,570 --> 00:16:08,769 So that's the reason, is it? 279 00:16:08,770 --> 00:16:12,089 You can look me in the eye, and tell me that's not the reason? Go on, try. 280 00:16:12,090 --> 00:16:13,329 Some of that is true. 281 00:16:13,330 --> 00:16:15,329 What do you mean? It is the truth. 282 00:16:15,330 --> 00:16:19,091 If you're talking about Prince George. Certainly the princes, but not just the princes. 283 00:16:19,092 --> 00:16:23,610 It is exotic for them, that is the attraction, and a change. 284 00:16:23,611 --> 00:16:26,529 From the ghastly Jack Paynton, and all those terrible foxtrots! 285 00:16:26,530 --> 00:16:28,649 I agree about that, but if you want my opinion... 286 00:16:28,650 --> 00:16:34,209 That is why I'm here. They find in the music a chance to escape, for a minute or two, 287 00:16:34,210 --> 00:16:38,089 from all the rules and codes of behaviour they have to live by. 288 00:16:38,090 --> 00:16:39,931 But you love all that, don't you? 289 00:16:39,932 --> 00:16:41,370 Love what? 290 00:16:41,371 --> 00:16:44,929 Royalty. And all the rules of etiquette. Having to bow to them. 291 00:16:44,930 --> 00:16:48,329 Having the chance to talk to them for a few precious seconds, 292 00:16:48,330 --> 00:16:52,329 having to play for them, having to answer their dumb questions. I'm right, aren't I? 293 00:16:52,330 --> 00:16:54,209 It is an exciting challenge, 294 00:16:54,210 --> 00:16:57,049 putting on a performance for a royal audience, yes. 295 00:16:57,050 --> 00:17:00,411 Come on, I can't believe you just said that. You're not on the bloody wireless! 296 00:17:00,412 --> 00:17:04,010 And an honour too, of course, a great honour. 297 00:17:04,011 --> 00:17:07,449 "Mr Louis Lester says it's a great honour playing for the Royal Family!" 298 00:17:07,450 --> 00:17:10,531 Well, fuck me, Louis, that is the scoop of the century, right, Louis? 299 00:17:13,251 --> 00:17:15,689 # Trucking along and I'm happy to see you 300 00:17:15,690 --> 00:17:18,249 # Ain't right or wrong if I do or I don't 301 00:17:18,250 --> 00:17:20,411 # I'm holding on for a dance at the Voodoo 302 00:17:20,412 --> 00:17:23,090 # Crazy in the mood for love 303 00:17:23,091 --> 00:17:25,730 # Never say you won't be leaving 304 00:17:25,731 --> 00:17:28,850 # You can buy me time and teasing 305 00:17:28,851 --> 00:17:30,851 # You can show me ways of pleasing 306 00:17:30,852 --> 00:17:33,410 # Crazy in a mood for love 307 00:17:33,411 --> 00:17:36,129 # Crazy in love and I'm looking to make it... # 308 00:17:36,130 --> 00:17:37,969 Do you consider yourself famous? 309 00:17:37,970 --> 00:17:40,811 No. But you are quite famous, right at the moment. 310 00:17:40,812 --> 00:17:43,650 The band has had success. 311 00:17:43,651 --> 00:17:46,971 Jessie, our lead singer, has had great success, yes. 312 00:17:46,972 --> 00:17:51,650 So the band is famous? The band is well-known, at the moment, yes. 313 00:17:51,651 --> 00:17:55,649 What's the biggest change that fame has brought you? What can you do now you couldn't before? 314 00:17:55,650 --> 00:17:59,529 Well, being able to use the front entrance at the Imperial Hotel. 315 00:17:59,530 --> 00:18:03,169 Mmmm. Being able to call for a taxi, having some money, 316 00:18:03,170 --> 00:18:06,969 not having to worry about members of the band being deported 317 00:18:06,970 --> 00:18:10,251 because we have regular work. So you feel much safer, much more secure? 318 00:18:10,252 --> 00:18:14,690 Of course, as much as anybody can at the moment. 319 00:18:14,691 --> 00:18:18,771 Do you think you've had to be quite ruthless to get where you are? No, I don't think that, no. 320 00:18:18,772 --> 00:18:22,930 But your manager, Wesley Holt, was deported over a year ago, 321 00:18:22,931 --> 00:18:24,929 ending a long association between you, 322 00:18:24,930 --> 00:18:28,929 and that didn't seem to affect you that deeply. On the contrary, it was a very difficult time. 323 00:18:28,930 --> 00:18:33,129 Didn't seem to throw you off your stride at all. I wouldn't put it like that. 324 00:18:33,130 --> 00:18:36,409 We had many months when I felt the band was making no progress 325 00:18:36,410 --> 00:18:39,009 and we were going nowhere. As you well know, Stanley. 326 00:18:39,010 --> 00:18:41,129 And Wesley Holt? Do you know what happened to him? 327 00:18:41,130 --> 00:18:44,289 We've lost touch. You've made no attempt to find out what happened to him? 328 00:18:44,290 --> 00:18:46,329 Of course I have. I've made several attempts. 329 00:18:46,330 --> 00:18:49,409 There was a serious court case pending in the state of Illinois, 330 00:18:49,410 --> 00:18:52,769 wasn't there, for him? I believe so. I'm sure he didn't go back there. 331 00:18:52,770 --> 00:18:56,249 Do you know if he's dead or alive? I'm sure he's alive. 332 00:18:56,250 --> 00:18:57,971 So why haven't you heard from him? 333 00:19:00,931 --> 00:19:04,410 Because I think he may have felt that 334 00:19:04,411 --> 00:19:07,610 I could have done more about his situation. 335 00:19:07,611 --> 00:19:09,770 I'm not sure I could have done. 336 00:19:09,771 --> 00:19:12,009 Would you like me to find out what happened to him? 337 00:19:12,010 --> 00:19:15,091 Of course, if you think you can. Maybe I'll try my own line of enquiry. 338 00:19:19,451 --> 00:19:24,610 My point is, how has success changed you? Your personality? 339 00:19:24,611 --> 00:19:29,330 In my experience it changes most people. So how has it changed you? 340 00:19:29,331 --> 00:19:32,329 You've got to answer. You've got to allow me underneath the surface 341 00:19:32,330 --> 00:19:35,851 otherwise all this is pointless. How have you changed? 342 00:19:35,852 --> 00:19:37,930 I will answer that. Go on. 343 00:19:37,931 --> 00:19:40,769 But in this way, Stanley. And it's not what you're expecting. 344 00:19:40,770 --> 00:19:44,249 Surprise me, Louis. There has been a very interesting side 345 00:19:44,250 --> 00:19:48,249 to the little bit of fame we've had, something you could never guess at. 346 00:19:48,250 --> 00:19:50,449 And it'll give you a story. Marvellous. 347 00:19:50,450 --> 00:19:56,329 But you've got to do a bit of work for it first. You've got to speak to Carla, and to Jessie, 348 00:19:56,330 --> 00:20:00,289 and then you might know what question to ask. You're setting me tasks now? I am. 349 00:20:00,290 --> 00:20:04,169 Is this because I've started asking you awkward questions? No, it's not, 350 00:20:04,170 --> 00:20:07,529 it's because that's all the time I can spare you now. 351 00:20:07,530 --> 00:20:11,769 Jessie's impossible to talk to. She won't talk about herself, absolutely refuses to! 352 00:20:11,770 --> 00:20:13,731 Get Carla on your side and maybe she will. 353 00:20:13,732 --> 00:20:15,891 What's she going to tell me? 354 00:20:17,331 --> 00:20:19,851 Oh, you infuriating bastard. 355 00:20:22,851 --> 00:20:28,450 # Fog on the river, mist in my heart... # 356 00:20:28,451 --> 00:20:31,569 Carla always got very nervous before she sang. 357 00:20:31,570 --> 00:20:34,851 She had extraordinary presence but didn't seem to realise 358 00:20:34,852 --> 00:20:41,011 the effect she had on people, how much they were drawn to watch her. 359 00:20:46,531 --> 00:20:48,329 Did Louis say this was all right? 360 00:20:48,330 --> 00:20:50,889 He did. He said I had to talk to you. 361 00:20:50,890 --> 00:20:54,009 I can't see why. What are you going to find out from me? 362 00:20:54,010 --> 00:20:56,529 Well, I'm trying to do a really full interview about Louis 363 00:20:56,530 --> 00:20:59,609 and the success of the band and Louis believes strongly that 364 00:20:59,610 --> 00:21:02,689 you should be in the article. So do I, of course. 365 00:21:02,690 --> 00:21:07,089 I see. I'm interested in how success has changed you and the band, 366 00:21:07,090 --> 00:21:08,171 if it has, that is? 367 00:21:08,172 --> 00:21:13,610 Well, we've been so lucky, so very lucky, in all sorts of ways. 368 00:21:13,611 --> 00:21:16,051 I mean, not having to worry about food, 369 00:21:16,052 --> 00:21:18,370 about being hungry, for a start. 370 00:21:18,371 --> 00:21:19,689 Have you ever been hungry? 371 00:21:19,690 --> 00:21:22,649 On occasions, yes, like walking home after school. 372 00:21:22,650 --> 00:21:24,769 You've never been hungry, have you? 373 00:21:24,770 --> 00:21:26,491 Well, not like you, Carla, no. 374 00:21:28,251 --> 00:21:30,491 Well, the biggest difference for me, 375 00:21:30,492 --> 00:21:35,530 the very biggest difference success has meant to me, was going into 376 00:21:35,531 --> 00:21:40,570 Fortnum and Mason's and having three Welsh Rarebits, one after another, 377 00:21:40,571 --> 00:21:44,531 in a place that I could never have gone into, not in my wildest dreams! 378 00:21:44,532 --> 00:21:46,210 Never, ever, ever. 379 00:21:46,211 --> 00:21:47,690 Three Welsh Rarebits! 380 00:21:47,691 --> 00:21:51,491 It's rarebits by the way, not rabbits, which is a piece of cheese on toast - 381 00:21:51,492 --> 00:21:54,970 I know what Welsh Rarebits are, Carla. 382 00:21:54,971 --> 00:21:57,331 D'you know why it's called that? I don't know that, no. 383 00:21:57,332 --> 00:22:00,290 No, nor do I. I forgot to ask. 384 00:22:00,291 --> 00:22:04,529 Well, that's the biggest difference, three Welsh Rarebits, one after another. 385 00:22:04,530 --> 00:22:07,329 And that's it? That's why Louis wanted me to talk to you? 386 00:22:07,330 --> 00:22:08,809 To hear about cheese on toast? 387 00:22:08,810 --> 00:22:10,691 I thought you wanted to talk to me? 388 00:22:10,692 --> 00:22:13,770 Yes, I do, of course. Go on. 389 00:22:13,771 --> 00:22:16,891 Well, that's the biggest difference, that's what success has meant to me. 390 00:22:16,892 --> 00:22:18,930 What happens if it goes? 391 00:22:18,931 --> 00:22:23,849 Of course, I'm not saying that it will, but sometimes in showbusiness things don't go on for ever. 392 00:22:23,850 --> 00:22:26,851 How difficult d'you think it would be to go back? Go back where? 393 00:22:26,852 --> 00:22:28,370 To your life before. 394 00:22:28,371 --> 00:22:29,650 It would be easy. 395 00:22:29,651 --> 00:22:31,010 Would it? 396 00:22:31,011 --> 00:22:34,370 Yes, and I expect it will happen. One day. 397 00:22:34,371 --> 00:22:36,971 But before then, do you have a sort of dream where you may end up? 398 00:22:36,972 --> 00:22:39,970 Your own West End show? Hah! 399 00:22:39,971 --> 00:22:41,571 What does that mean, "Hah"? 400 00:22:43,411 --> 00:22:47,249 Louis told me if you asked me that question I should tell you about the man in our street. 401 00:22:47,250 --> 00:22:50,329 Louie's been coaching you how to answer my questions? 402 00:22:50,330 --> 00:22:54,769 He talked to me, yes. He said if you wanted to know the answer to that question, 403 00:22:54,770 --> 00:22:57,289 I should tell you about the man and the room. 404 00:22:57,290 --> 00:23:00,369 Well, I think I would have anyway, because that's what I believe. 405 00:23:00,370 --> 00:23:02,249 In the street where I grew up... 406 00:23:02,250 --> 00:23:05,169 Which was where? I'm not going to tell you that now, am I, Stanley? 407 00:23:05,170 --> 00:23:07,329 Why ever not? Because it's private. 408 00:23:07,330 --> 00:23:09,491 But it was in London? You can tell me that much. 409 00:23:09,492 --> 00:23:11,490 Yes, it was in London. 410 00:23:11,491 --> 00:23:13,930 Good! 411 00:23:13,931 --> 00:23:15,770 We didn't have much space. 412 00:23:15,771 --> 00:23:17,849 We didn't have very much space at all. 413 00:23:17,850 --> 00:23:20,809 There were six of us, my brothers and sisters and I, 414 00:23:20,810 --> 00:23:22,449 and we all slept in the same room. 415 00:23:22,450 --> 00:23:25,569 So a room of your own was a really special thing. 416 00:23:25,570 --> 00:23:28,329 So one day across the street, a man arrives. 417 00:23:28,330 --> 00:23:30,209 Mr Dunwoodie, he was called. 418 00:23:30,210 --> 00:23:33,611 He was from Scotland, although he didn't have a Scottish accent really. 419 00:23:33,612 --> 00:23:38,370 He was a short man, and he was so full of energy and life. 420 00:23:38,371 --> 00:23:41,129 And every time he passed us on the street he'd say 421 00:23:41,130 --> 00:23:45,609 "Hello children, what a day it is today. A lovely day, a day for great ideas!" 422 00:23:45,610 --> 00:23:48,091 So Mr Dunwoodie had two rooms of his own across the street, 423 00:23:48,092 --> 00:23:50,130 all to himself. 424 00:23:50,131 --> 00:23:53,449 And we soon found out that Mr Dunwoodie was working on this 425 00:23:53,450 --> 00:23:56,249 wonderful invention that was going to make him his fortune, 426 00:23:56,250 --> 00:24:00,489 and he said he was going to show it to us as soon as it was ready, 427 00:24:00,490 --> 00:24:02,889 and that's why he needed the two rooms. 428 00:24:02,890 --> 00:24:05,289 So when we saw him on the street, we'd call out to him. 429 00:24:05,290 --> 00:24:08,611 We'd ask him how it was going, if it was nearly ready yet. 430 00:24:08,612 --> 00:24:13,650 And he would always answer, "Nearly there, children, nearly there!" 431 00:24:13,651 --> 00:24:17,490 But after a few months, we couldn't wait any longer. 432 00:24:17,491 --> 00:24:21,689 You know what kids are like, we had to see this great invention. 433 00:24:21,690 --> 00:24:25,491 So we ran across the street and we knocked on the door. 434 00:24:25,492 --> 00:24:29,530 "Can we come in?" And he shouted, "Go away, children!" 435 00:24:29,531 --> 00:24:31,490 Well, we didn't go away. 436 00:24:31,491 --> 00:24:35,090 We tried the door handle, and it wasn't locked, 437 00:24:35,091 --> 00:24:37,211 and the door flew open and in we went. 438 00:24:37,212 --> 00:24:41,890 And all over the floor were these bits of metal, 439 00:24:41,891 --> 00:24:44,611 a terrible mess, little pieces and big pieces. 440 00:24:44,612 --> 00:24:48,570 Everywhere you looked, there were pieces of scrap metal. 441 00:24:48,571 --> 00:24:51,329 And Mr Dunwoodie, he was screaming at us. 442 00:24:51,330 --> 00:24:54,449 "Go away, you terrible children, go away right now!" 443 00:24:54,450 --> 00:24:56,131 And of course we ran away. 444 00:24:56,132 --> 00:24:59,690 And for days we didn't see Mr Dunwoodie. 445 00:24:59,691 --> 00:25:05,810 And when he did come out into the street, he looked so different. 446 00:25:05,811 --> 00:25:10,010 Pale, and older looking. 447 00:25:10,011 --> 00:25:14,450 His face was so, so terribly sad. 448 00:25:14,451 --> 00:25:17,490 And he never smiled at us again, not once. 449 00:25:17,491 --> 00:25:22,610 A little while later, he went away, disappeared, 450 00:25:22,611 --> 00:25:26,170 he took all of his bits of metal on an old cart. 451 00:25:26,171 --> 00:25:30,291 But I learnt from that a big lesson. 452 00:25:32,051 --> 00:25:37,050 You can have a dream, but you must never describe that dream to anyone, 453 00:25:37,051 --> 00:25:39,970 or let them see too closely inside of it, 454 00:25:39,971 --> 00:25:43,249 because one day they might burst through the door 455 00:25:43,250 --> 00:25:46,491 and you may have to see your dream through someone else's eyes, 456 00:25:46,492 --> 00:25:52,490 how it might seem to the world, and that can destroy it for ever. 457 00:25:52,491 --> 00:25:55,450 How strange. What's strange? 458 00:25:55,451 --> 00:25:59,691 Well, that Louis should coach you like this, make you tell me some kind of a fable. 459 00:25:59,692 --> 00:26:02,930 It's not a fairy story, it happened. 460 00:26:02,931 --> 00:26:04,609 I'm not saying it didn't happen, 461 00:26:04,610 --> 00:26:07,129 but I don't know who I'm meant to be in this story. 462 00:26:07,130 --> 00:26:09,889 I'm not going to try and destroy your dreams of success, 463 00:26:09,890 --> 00:26:11,889 for goodness' sake, quite the opposite. 464 00:26:11,890 --> 00:26:15,289 You know, I thought this was going to be easy, interviewing Louis and you. 465 00:26:15,290 --> 00:26:17,369 It's proving quite the bloody opposite. 466 00:26:17,370 --> 00:26:20,491 Well, I'm sorry I didn't give you the answer that you wanted. 467 00:26:20,492 --> 00:26:25,170 No, no. If you want to talk about things changing people, 468 00:26:25,171 --> 00:26:29,410 maybe you should talk to Jessie, of course. 469 00:26:29,411 --> 00:26:32,009 D'you think she'll talk to me? We'll see. 470 00:26:32,010 --> 00:26:36,491 If you could be gentle with her, and not get too impatient, Stanley. 471 00:26:36,492 --> 00:26:39,411 But do you think you can do that? 472 00:26:43,051 --> 00:26:46,690 # Stars burning brighter, I'm on an all-nighter 473 00:26:46,691 --> 00:26:49,850 # Serenading to a tune 474 00:26:49,851 --> 00:26:52,811 # I've popped the bull's eye in a celestial night sky 475 00:26:52,812 --> 00:26:55,250 # I'm dancing on the moon... # 476 00:26:55,251 --> 00:26:57,209 I always found Jessie unknowable, 477 00:26:57,210 --> 00:27:00,929 a mysterious little creature who seemed to have emerged into the world 478 00:27:00,930 --> 00:27:04,171 fully-formed without parents, brothers or sisters, 479 00:27:04,172 --> 00:27:06,450 or any past she would talk about. 480 00:27:06,451 --> 00:27:09,250 # Life is a glass of champagne 481 00:27:09,251 --> 00:27:12,051 # A silver souvenir will never cost me dear 482 00:27:12,052 --> 00:27:14,810 # In a starlit avenue... # 483 00:27:14,811 --> 00:27:17,409 Her tragic death has only deepened the mystery, of course. 484 00:27:17,410 --> 00:27:19,289 But I knew, the morning I spoke to her, 485 00:27:19,290 --> 00:27:22,409 I had to try and relax her if she was going to open up to me and give me a lead. 486 00:27:22,410 --> 00:27:25,929 So I encouraged her to bring some of her family out with her, and I tried 487 00:27:25,930 --> 00:27:30,371 to ask her as little as possible and be patient, something I find it very difficult to be. 488 00:27:39,531 --> 00:27:44,770 The letters I get are such a mixture, such a strange mixture. 489 00:27:44,771 --> 00:27:49,129 Everyday I wake up and think, "What surprise will there be today in the box?" 490 00:27:49,130 --> 00:27:52,131 I put them all, each new lot of letters, in this blue box - 491 00:27:52,132 --> 00:27:55,650 and then I go through them, without opening them, 492 00:27:55,651 --> 00:27:57,689 just looking at the writing on the envelope, 493 00:27:57,690 --> 00:28:01,809 deciding which I'll open first, and which maybe I'll never open. 494 00:28:01,810 --> 00:28:04,889 A lot of them, of course, are saying nice things about me, 495 00:28:04,890 --> 00:28:07,531 usually very nice, about how pretty my singing is 496 00:28:07,532 --> 00:28:10,050 and what a good dancer I am. 497 00:28:10,051 --> 00:28:12,610 I am a good dancer, I think. 498 00:28:12,611 --> 00:28:16,289 Not many people have written about that, Stanley, you know. Hmm! 499 00:28:16,290 --> 00:28:19,849 Then of course, there are the letters which are simply disgusting, 500 00:28:19,850 --> 00:28:23,049 about people thinking about me without my clothes on and that sort of thing. 501 00:28:23,050 --> 00:28:26,131 I wonder if Jack Paynton gets letters like that? 502 00:28:26,132 --> 00:28:28,050 I expect he does. 503 00:28:28,051 --> 00:28:30,771 It's not something one wants to think about, a naked Jack. 504 00:28:30,772 --> 00:28:34,490 I'm sure even Mrs Paynton has a problem with that! 505 00:28:34,491 --> 00:28:35,971 Sorry - I interrupted. 506 00:28:37,811 --> 00:28:40,809 Yes, well, there's one thing about these letters I really wish. 507 00:28:40,810 --> 00:28:43,809 It would be so much better if people sent pictures of themselves 508 00:28:43,810 --> 00:28:46,291 with the letters. Because I often think, 509 00:28:46,292 --> 00:28:49,050 after receiving a very peculiar letter, 510 00:28:49,051 --> 00:28:51,689 who could have written a letter like this? 511 00:28:51,690 --> 00:28:54,609 I wonder what he looks like? Or what this woman looks like? 512 00:28:54,610 --> 00:28:57,569 Because lots of women write to me too, it's not just men. 513 00:28:57,570 --> 00:29:02,129 I wish I had a picture of the man who sent me three boxes of peaches last week. 514 00:29:02,130 --> 00:29:04,089 Yes, I got three boxes of peaches. 515 00:29:04,090 --> 00:29:08,251 They were delivered to the hotel with a note saying "In Admiration". 516 00:29:08,252 --> 00:29:13,091 And a few weeks ago I got a little dog. I got sent a puppy! 517 00:29:14,611 --> 00:29:16,489 Couldn't keep it, of course - 518 00:29:16,490 --> 00:29:19,649 we're not allowed pets in our rooms at the hotel. 519 00:29:19,650 --> 00:29:24,089 But somebody is looking after it for me, and I will get it back one day. 520 00:29:24,090 --> 00:29:28,171 And sometimes, you know, Stanley, people write about their lives to me 521 00:29:28,172 --> 00:29:32,770 in such a way, all the most private things, and asking me 522 00:29:32,771 --> 00:29:36,411 for advice, and you can't really help them at all - I mean, I can't. 523 00:29:36,412 --> 00:29:39,010 No, you can't read them. 524 00:29:39,011 --> 00:29:41,170 I didn't say anything, Jessie. 525 00:29:41,171 --> 00:29:43,569 No, but I'm just making clear, nobody can read them, 526 00:29:43,570 --> 00:29:45,649 not even my letters from the Prince, 527 00:29:45,650 --> 00:29:48,329 and I've had several letters from the Prince, 528 00:29:48,330 --> 00:29:51,371 and those, of course, are the most special of all. 529 00:29:51,372 --> 00:29:55,730 Course. And, er, your parents? They must be very proud of you. 530 00:29:55,731 --> 00:29:58,491 Do they write to you often? I don't talk about my parents. 531 00:30:02,131 --> 00:30:05,051 My dad disappeared when I was three, I never knew him, 532 00:30:05,052 --> 00:30:07,610 I think he's dead now anyway. 533 00:30:07,611 --> 00:30:09,490 He was white. 534 00:30:09,491 --> 00:30:12,131 I think he worked in Covent Garden, you know, in the market. 535 00:30:13,131 --> 00:30:15,851 My mother, I'm not talking much about my mother either. 536 00:30:17,971 --> 00:30:19,611 She left, as well, when I was little. 537 00:30:21,451 --> 00:30:23,409 I was about eight when she went. 538 00:30:23,410 --> 00:30:25,291 She was a bit of a singer, too, as it happens. 539 00:30:26,491 --> 00:30:29,329 One of my few good memories of her is her singing to me when I was tiny 540 00:30:29,330 --> 00:30:33,091 as she said goodnight, but she didn't do it that often. 541 00:30:33,092 --> 00:30:35,971 She had many admirers, many men. 542 00:30:37,211 --> 00:30:38,611 Nearly all of them were white. 543 00:30:39,971 --> 00:30:41,529 They came and knocked on the door 544 00:30:41,530 --> 00:30:43,891 and gave me a little pat on the head. 545 00:30:43,892 --> 00:30:45,290 Really? 546 00:30:45,291 --> 00:30:48,929 She sang at Collins Music Hall, the one in Islington, 547 00:30:48,930 --> 00:30:50,649 so she can't have been that bad, can she? 548 00:30:50,650 --> 00:30:52,411 Did you ever go and see her in the theatre? 549 00:30:53,851 --> 00:30:55,450 Yes, I saw her once. 550 00:30:55,451 --> 00:30:57,131 I think it must have been at Collins. 551 00:30:58,131 --> 00:31:00,371 There were three of them, with my mum in the middle, 552 00:31:00,372 --> 00:31:03,290 singing a silly song about bananas. 553 00:31:03,291 --> 00:31:06,089 And I knew at once I wasn't going to be a singer like her. 554 00:31:06,090 --> 00:31:08,089 I was going to be a singer, I knew that much, 555 00:31:08,090 --> 00:31:10,049 but I was going to be completely different. 556 00:31:10,050 --> 00:31:11,971 She left us, anyway, me and my aunt. 557 00:31:13,051 --> 00:31:14,650 She left us. 558 00:31:14,651 --> 00:31:18,411 Suddenly, one night, she was gone, never was in touch. 559 00:31:19,851 --> 00:31:22,211 I haven't seen her for years. Maybe she's dead, too. 560 00:31:23,411 --> 00:31:25,090 You think I sound hard? 561 00:31:25,091 --> 00:31:26,851 I didn't say anything, Jessie. 562 00:31:26,852 --> 00:31:31,570 I know you didn't say anything. I'm asking you, do I sound hard? 563 00:31:31,571 --> 00:31:34,211 You sound like you haven't forgiven her. 564 00:31:35,971 --> 00:31:37,250 I haven't, no. 565 00:31:37,251 --> 00:31:39,129 I don't think I've forgiven either of them, 566 00:31:39,130 --> 00:31:40,491 but that doesn't mean I'm hard. 567 00:31:43,211 --> 00:31:45,129 After all, I owe everything to one man, 568 00:31:45,130 --> 00:31:47,729 and I always say that, I always make that clear. 569 00:31:47,730 --> 00:31:48,851 You mean Louis, I take it? 570 00:31:50,011 --> 00:31:53,169 Well, Louis too, of course, but no, I didn't mean him. 571 00:31:53,170 --> 00:31:56,291 I meant before him, there was my teacher in the East End, 572 00:31:56,292 --> 00:31:58,090 Mr Rabinowitz. 573 00:31:58,091 --> 00:32:00,330 He gave me singing lessons. 574 00:32:00,331 --> 00:32:03,131 Of course, I couldn't really pay him, not what he usually charged, 575 00:32:03,132 --> 00:32:05,330 not what he charged the others. 576 00:32:05,331 --> 00:32:09,610 My aunt paid what she could. He did a special rate for me. 577 00:32:09,611 --> 00:32:11,051 I wish he could see me now. 578 00:32:12,891 --> 00:32:16,089 I wish he could have been there when I sang for the Prince of Wales, 579 00:32:16,090 --> 00:32:17,731 and heard me singing on the wireless. 580 00:32:19,171 --> 00:32:22,689 I'd have given anything for him to be there, to be here still. 581 00:32:22,690 --> 00:32:23,971 But he died three years ago. 582 00:32:27,011 --> 00:32:28,251 His heart was broken. 583 00:32:30,411 --> 00:32:32,610 Who broke his heart, Jessie? 584 00:32:32,611 --> 00:32:34,331 Well, it certainly wasn't me. 585 00:32:36,211 --> 00:32:38,651 There was one girl who had lessons with him called... 586 00:32:40,211 --> 00:32:42,769 Well, I'll call her Annie, though that's not her real name, 587 00:32:42,770 --> 00:32:44,291 because you'll know her real name. 588 00:32:46,891 --> 00:32:49,691 She was very pretty, now she's beautiful. 589 00:32:51,371 --> 00:32:53,370 I don't know where she lived. 590 00:32:53,371 --> 00:32:55,090 Not round us, anyway. 591 00:32:55,091 --> 00:32:57,689 She came and had lessons with him twice a week. 592 00:32:57,690 --> 00:33:00,609 She was very good and he was really taken with her. 593 00:33:00,610 --> 00:33:03,169 I mean, he was in love with her, but he never would do anything 594 00:33:03,170 --> 00:33:05,851 with her, you know, which wasn't proper, wasn't right. 595 00:33:05,852 --> 00:33:08,570 He never took advantage of any of us. 596 00:33:08,571 --> 00:33:09,849 He was in love with her talent 597 00:33:09,850 --> 00:33:12,491 and how amazing she was when she sang, so he loved her. 598 00:33:14,451 --> 00:33:17,450 Anyway, Annie, the person I'm calling Annie 599 00:33:17,451 --> 00:33:19,009 has become very successful. 600 00:33:19,010 --> 00:33:22,169 She's starring in a revue right now in the West End. 601 00:33:22,170 --> 00:33:25,411 I probably shouldn't have said that, now you'll probably guess her name. 602 00:33:25,412 --> 00:33:27,610 I won't guess that, Jessie. 603 00:33:27,611 --> 00:33:32,410 Although she owed him everything, owed Mr Rabinowitz her career, 604 00:33:32,411 --> 00:33:34,730 she never answered his letters. 605 00:33:34,731 --> 00:33:36,449 And when he went to see her the first time 606 00:33:36,450 --> 00:33:37,609 she was in a West End show, 607 00:33:37,610 --> 00:33:39,609 she kept him waiting for ages at the stage door, 608 00:33:39,610 --> 00:33:41,529 and then she didn't even come down to see him. 609 00:33:41,530 --> 00:33:43,329 Instead she sent down a box of chocolates, 610 00:33:43,330 --> 00:33:46,609 and when he opened them, half of them had already been eaten! 611 00:33:46,610 --> 00:33:48,331 Imagine doing that to your old teacher! 612 00:33:48,332 --> 00:33:50,450 What a terrible thing to do! 613 00:33:50,451 --> 00:33:51,691 It broke his heart. 614 00:33:55,051 --> 00:33:57,411 He was my friend. I could never behave like that. 615 00:33:58,771 --> 00:34:01,489 I could never change towards people in that way, 616 00:34:01,490 --> 00:34:03,691 no matter what happens. People who have helped you. 617 00:34:05,371 --> 00:34:07,809 However much you get your head swollen by what people say 618 00:34:07,810 --> 00:34:10,771 in these letters, you mustn't believe them, you mustn't change. 619 00:34:12,931 --> 00:34:15,769 You know, some of them run down the street after me blowing kisses, 620 00:34:15,770 --> 00:34:17,331 just like Julian said they would! 621 00:34:18,371 --> 00:34:20,091 But I'm not going to change. 622 00:34:22,291 --> 00:34:24,929 Of course, just like the letters, the people that wait outside 623 00:34:24,930 --> 00:34:27,131 the hotel for my autograph, outside The Imperial, 624 00:34:27,132 --> 00:34:29,530 are such a mixture, too. 625 00:34:29,531 --> 00:34:32,769 But you can see their faces, so whatever they say to you, 626 00:34:32,770 --> 00:34:36,169 and sometimes they do whisper things that are a shock, 627 00:34:36,170 --> 00:34:39,051 whatever they say it isn't as strange as some of these letters. 628 00:34:41,171 --> 00:34:43,891 And you can smile at them and talk to them, and be friendly enough 629 00:34:43,892 --> 00:34:46,810 so it doesn't become anything worse. 630 00:34:46,811 --> 00:34:48,411 You understand what I mean? 631 00:34:48,412 --> 00:34:50,490 Yes. 632 00:34:50,491 --> 00:34:53,011 Oh, has Louis told you about the woman? 633 00:34:53,012 --> 00:34:54,331 What woman? 634 00:34:56,251 --> 00:34:57,410 No, he hasn't. 635 00:34:57,411 --> 00:34:58,571 He hasn't? 636 00:35:02,171 --> 00:35:05,929 I'm pleased to see today we're starting with champagne. 637 00:35:05,930 --> 00:35:07,449 Last time it never showed up did it? 638 00:35:07,450 --> 00:35:09,131 Well, today it's a bribe. 639 00:35:09,132 --> 00:35:10,570 I realise that. 640 00:35:10,571 --> 00:35:12,929 So I've been on the little mystery tour you wanted me to, 641 00:35:12,930 --> 00:35:15,089 and Jessie told me to ask you about the woman. 642 00:35:15,090 --> 00:35:17,011 So I'm hoping you're not going to muck about. 643 00:35:17,012 --> 00:35:18,290 Muck about? 644 00:35:18,291 --> 00:35:20,729 Yes. Hope you're going to tell me about her straight away. 645 00:35:20,730 --> 00:35:21,849 I will, in a moment. 646 00:35:21,850 --> 00:35:24,489 In a moment? Here we go again, bloody off the record business! 647 00:35:24,490 --> 00:35:25,889 What tiny bit of this interview 648 00:35:25,890 --> 00:35:27,809 am I actually going to be allowed to publish? 649 00:35:27,810 --> 00:35:29,649 I'm not saying this is off the record. 650 00:35:29,650 --> 00:35:32,569 You're not? Why not? It can't be that exciting then. 651 00:35:32,570 --> 00:35:35,609 It's just I know you won't have the guts to publish it. 652 00:35:35,610 --> 00:35:37,489 I'm not going to rise to that. 653 00:35:37,490 --> 00:35:39,129 You know, I've been very stupid now, 654 00:35:39,130 --> 00:35:41,889 and you don't often hear me say that. That's true. 655 00:35:41,890 --> 00:35:43,929 I forgot for a moment that you're a musician, 656 00:35:43,930 --> 00:35:46,609 and you're treating this interview a bit like your jazz music. 657 00:35:46,610 --> 00:35:49,009 You seem to be improvising, talking about this and that, 658 00:35:49,010 --> 00:35:51,251 and all the while I'm being led somewhere, aren't I? 659 00:35:51,252 --> 00:35:52,930 You are, yes. 660 00:35:52,931 --> 00:35:54,010 To the woman. 661 00:35:54,011 --> 00:35:55,491 To the woman, yes. 662 00:35:56,691 --> 00:35:59,449 What I meant by the interesting side of fame. 663 00:35:59,450 --> 00:36:01,371 This will never be in your magazine. 664 00:36:02,691 --> 00:36:03,889 I'll bet you £100. 665 00:36:03,890 --> 00:36:05,769 I don't bet, but who knows, if it's worth it, 666 00:36:05,770 --> 00:36:06,929 I might pay you something. 667 00:36:06,930 --> 00:36:08,609 Now, where did you meet this woman? 668 00:36:08,610 --> 00:36:11,849 I was dressed like this, getting ready to play in the ballroom. 669 00:36:11,850 --> 00:36:13,089 It was about two months ago. 670 00:36:13,090 --> 00:36:15,209 I was in a little room near Schlesinger's office, 671 00:36:15,210 --> 00:36:18,049 he lets me use it sometimes to get away from the band. 672 00:36:18,050 --> 00:36:19,851 'I was in a rather good mood, I remember.' 673 00:36:26,931 --> 00:36:29,051 'There's a telephone call for you, Mr Lester.' 674 00:36:29,052 --> 00:36:30,490 Thank you. 675 00:36:30,491 --> 00:36:31,570 'Hello?' 676 00:36:31,571 --> 00:36:32,970 Hello? 677 00:36:32,971 --> 00:36:35,249 'You don't know who this is, do you?' 678 00:36:35,250 --> 00:36:36,731 I have to admit I don't. 679 00:36:36,732 --> 00:36:39,130 'You've never noticed me, then?' 680 00:36:39,131 --> 00:36:41,090 Noticed you? Where? 681 00:36:41,091 --> 00:36:43,769 'But if you have to be told, then you haven't noticed me.' 682 00:36:43,770 --> 00:36:46,811 Well, if you told me your name, it might help. 683 00:36:46,812 --> 00:36:48,770 'You want to know my name? 684 00:36:48,771 --> 00:36:51,569 'How would that help if you haven't noticed me?' 685 00:36:51,570 --> 00:36:53,689 'Well, if you described yourself.' 686 00:36:53,690 --> 00:36:54,811 'Describe myself? 687 00:36:55,811 --> 00:36:58,250 'What if I told you I was naked? 688 00:36:58,251 --> 00:36:59,570 'Does that help?' 689 00:36:59,571 --> 00:37:02,211 Excuse me, I'm just getting ready for tonight's performance, 690 00:37:02,212 --> 00:37:03,250 so I will... 691 00:37:03,251 --> 00:37:04,609 'I'm sorry, don't ring off...' 692 00:37:04,610 --> 00:37:06,089 I shouldn't have said that. 693 00:37:06,090 --> 00:37:08,209 That was plain stupid, Mr Lester. I apologise. 694 00:37:08,210 --> 00:37:09,529 There's no need to apologise. 695 00:37:09,530 --> 00:37:12,649 'No, I do apologise, first of all because...' 696 00:37:12,650 --> 00:37:16,169 Well, I'm not naked, so it was pointless me saying that. 697 00:37:16,170 --> 00:37:18,131 Though depending on how long we talk, 698 00:37:18,132 --> 00:37:20,530 that situation can always change. 699 00:37:20,531 --> 00:37:21,691 I really must go now. 700 00:37:22,971 --> 00:37:24,649 I'm sorry, that was just a poor joke, 701 00:37:24,650 --> 00:37:27,849 and actually, I do have something very interesting to tell you, 702 00:37:27,850 --> 00:37:30,329 so I should stop spoiling it, shouldn't I? 703 00:37:30,330 --> 00:37:34,009 The point is, I'm, of course, a great admirer of your work, 704 00:37:34,010 --> 00:37:35,851 and I've sat in the ballroom at the Imperial 705 00:37:35,852 --> 00:37:40,810 and heard you play many times, and maybe I was there last night, 706 00:37:40,811 --> 00:37:44,609 sat quite close to the stage, wearing a rather revealing dress, 707 00:37:44,610 --> 00:37:46,009 and maybe you did notice me? 708 00:37:46,010 --> 00:37:48,369 When I'm playing, I don't see much from the stage. 709 00:37:48,370 --> 00:37:52,051 Oh, well, I'm sure you're concentrating on your music, 710 00:37:52,052 --> 00:37:53,530 Mr Lester, of course! 711 00:37:53,531 --> 00:37:57,091 I was just explaining what a devoted follower I am of your band, 712 00:37:58,171 --> 00:38:01,209 and perhaps at this very moment I'm telephoning 713 00:38:01,210 --> 00:38:04,929 from somewhere in the hotel, so I'm not too far from you. 714 00:38:04,930 --> 00:38:08,569 'But before you reply to that, let's leave all that vague, shall we? 715 00:38:08,570 --> 00:38:11,249 'Because I don't think I should tell you too much.' 716 00:38:11,250 --> 00:38:14,529 I think it's probably better that you don't know my name. 717 00:38:14,530 --> 00:38:15,929 I think it'll be safer for you, 718 00:38:15,930 --> 00:38:19,091 and a lot safer for me, if you didn't know my name. 719 00:38:19,092 --> 00:38:20,251 Safer? 720 00:38:21,851 --> 00:38:23,330 In what way safer? 721 00:38:23,331 --> 00:38:26,889 Oh, I keep saying things I oughtn't, things that make me sound bonkers, 722 00:38:26,890 --> 00:38:29,689 and that is precisely how I don't want to sound. 723 00:38:29,690 --> 00:38:32,771 'But yes, I think it would be much safer for both of us 724 00:38:32,772 --> 00:38:34,570 'if I remain anonymous.' 725 00:38:34,571 --> 00:38:37,051 I hope you don't think that's too cowardly. 726 00:38:38,211 --> 00:38:40,090 Do you think it's cowardly? 727 00:38:40,091 --> 00:38:41,131 I'm sure it isn't. 728 00:38:42,731 --> 00:38:45,050 But now, whoever you are, 729 00:38:45,051 --> 00:38:47,409 I really am in the middle of doing some work here, 730 00:38:47,410 --> 00:38:51,611 'so intriguing as it is to talk to an anonymous lady who may...' 731 00:38:51,612 --> 00:38:57,890 or may not be naked, I'm sorry, but I'm going to ring off now. 732 00:38:57,891 --> 00:39:00,011 If you ring off, you won't stop me. 733 00:39:02,651 --> 00:39:05,089 Blimey, I can't believe you did that! Why did you ring off? 734 00:39:05,090 --> 00:39:06,129 I had work to do. 735 00:39:06,130 --> 00:39:08,089 Of course, I forgot, you're always working. 736 00:39:08,090 --> 00:39:10,209 The next day, at exactly the same time, 737 00:39:10,210 --> 00:39:13,331 about an hour before we were going to play, the telephone rings again. 738 00:39:17,731 --> 00:39:20,411 And I warn you, Stanley, you're not going to like this. 739 00:39:20,412 --> 00:39:21,610 Why not? 740 00:39:21,611 --> 00:39:24,209 Because it's going to affect you personally. 741 00:39:24,210 --> 00:39:25,971 I left this bit out when I told Jessie. 742 00:39:27,091 --> 00:39:29,049 I'm flattered I'm getting it all. 743 00:39:29,050 --> 00:39:31,969 'How very unimaginative of you to ring off last night.' 744 00:39:31,970 --> 00:39:34,169 Well, I explained, I had work to do. 745 00:39:34,170 --> 00:39:38,131 Oh, you sound just like my husband, whom we will soon be talking about. 746 00:39:39,851 --> 00:39:43,249 Please don't ring off, it's important, promise me. 747 00:39:43,250 --> 00:39:44,651 I won't ring off, yet. 748 00:39:44,652 --> 00:39:48,331 Good. Now, are you wondering what I'm wearing? 749 00:39:50,531 --> 00:39:52,369 'Well, that was a long pause.' 750 00:39:52,370 --> 00:39:55,089 Come on, I'm rather an attractive woman. 751 00:39:55,090 --> 00:39:58,969 I can't believe you're not wondering how much or how little I'm wearing, 752 00:39:58,970 --> 00:40:02,531 especially as I hear you're rather partial to white women. 753 00:40:02,532 --> 00:40:05,850 'So, what do you think I'm wearing?' 754 00:40:05,851 --> 00:40:07,091 Before you tell me that... 755 00:40:07,092 --> 00:40:10,410 'Yes? What do you want to know, Mr Lester?' 756 00:40:10,411 --> 00:40:12,210 What do I call you, 757 00:40:12,211 --> 00:40:14,091 since you won't tell me your real name? 758 00:40:14,092 --> 00:40:18,370 Oh, good, I'm so glad you're not threatening to ring off yet. 759 00:40:18,371 --> 00:40:21,930 You can call me Josephine, 760 00:40:21,931 --> 00:40:24,450 'as in Napoleon and Josephine.' 761 00:40:24,451 --> 00:40:26,730 So, Josephine, 762 00:40:26,731 --> 00:40:28,129 'what are you wearing?' 763 00:40:28,130 --> 00:40:32,209 I'm sitting here in my petticoat, waiting for my husband to come back 764 00:40:32,210 --> 00:40:34,849 and take me to a very boring dinner party. 765 00:40:34,850 --> 00:40:36,011 So why did you call me? 766 00:40:36,012 --> 00:40:37,890 'I'm coming to that.' 767 00:40:37,891 --> 00:40:40,531 But I realise before you can take me seriously, 768 00:40:40,532 --> 00:40:44,090 you need somebody to vouch for me, 769 00:40:44,091 --> 00:40:46,769 so I'm going to hand the telephone now to somebody who you know, 770 00:40:46,770 --> 00:40:48,249 'but on one condition.' 771 00:40:48,250 --> 00:40:49,691 What condition is that? 772 00:40:49,692 --> 00:40:54,250 You must never make her tell you who I am. Do you promise that? 773 00:40:54,251 --> 00:40:55,650 I promise that. 774 00:40:55,651 --> 00:40:58,611 If you break your promise, it could be fatal for me, you understand? 775 00:40:58,612 --> 00:41:00,050 I understand. 776 00:41:00,051 --> 00:41:01,251 Good. 777 00:41:05,251 --> 00:41:07,851 Oh, it's going to be Pamela, isn't it? 778 00:41:09,171 --> 00:41:12,369 It's going to be one of her nutty, upper-class friends 779 00:41:12,370 --> 00:41:13,691 on the phone, isn't it? 780 00:41:18,091 --> 00:41:19,130 Hello, Louis. 781 00:41:19,131 --> 00:41:22,209 You've got to promise you won't try and make her tell you who this lady is. 782 00:41:22,210 --> 00:41:25,089 Oh, now I've got to promise, do I? What is this all about, Louis? 783 00:41:25,090 --> 00:41:26,729 Unless you promise I won't tell you. 784 00:41:26,730 --> 00:41:28,291 I'll have to promise, then, won't I? 785 00:41:28,292 --> 00:41:30,251 And mean it. I mean it. 786 00:41:31,451 --> 00:41:33,050 I mean it. 787 00:41:33,051 --> 00:41:34,329 Good evening, Pamela. 788 00:41:34,330 --> 00:41:36,571 I'm here with the person you know as Josephine. 789 00:41:38,371 --> 00:41:41,409 And she's got something to tell you which she hasn't told me, 790 00:41:41,410 --> 00:41:44,411 and which she won't tell you until I've left the room, 791 00:41:44,412 --> 00:41:48,970 but I'm letting you know she's not batty, not batty in any way, 792 00:41:48,971 --> 00:41:50,529 and I think what she's got to tell you 793 00:41:50,530 --> 00:41:52,211 might make you understand something. 794 00:41:52,212 --> 00:41:54,210 May make me understand what? 795 00:41:54,211 --> 00:41:56,489 Well, I'm guessing, of course, because I don't know 796 00:41:56,490 --> 00:41:58,329 what special thing she has to tell you, 797 00:41:58,330 --> 00:42:01,849 but I'm sure it has something to do with the world of my parents 798 00:42:01,850 --> 00:42:05,049 and their friends, and their country house parties 799 00:42:05,050 --> 00:42:06,931 and all the things they hate. 800 00:42:08,091 --> 00:42:12,649 'You know, of course, already, how they hate what they call niggers, 801 00:42:12,650 --> 00:42:16,889 'and they hate Jews, and they hate the Irish, and they hate the French 802 00:42:16,890 --> 00:42:19,609 'and the Americans, everything American, 803 00:42:19,610 --> 00:42:24,409 'and they hate musicians, and they hate actors, and they hate gypsies,' 804 00:42:24,410 --> 00:42:25,649 and they hate homosexuals, 805 00:42:25,650 --> 00:42:28,289 even though some of them are queer themselves. 806 00:42:28,290 --> 00:42:31,131 So many hates, and they find new ones all the time! 807 00:42:32,531 --> 00:42:33,851 And the funny thing is, 808 00:42:35,691 --> 00:42:39,490 and I mean funny in an awful way, 809 00:42:39,491 --> 00:42:43,370 they spend a lot of time in their beautiful houses 810 00:42:43,371 --> 00:42:46,010 with the most wonderful gardens, 811 00:42:46,011 --> 00:42:49,451 but they never look properly at what they've actually got! 812 00:42:50,571 --> 00:42:54,930 They move around their lovely, lovely properties 813 00:42:54,931 --> 00:42:58,610 with so much loathing going through them. 814 00:42:58,611 --> 00:43:01,330 My father, he had a good education, 815 00:43:01,331 --> 00:43:04,250 better than the one he provided for me. 816 00:43:04,251 --> 00:43:05,851 And do you know what he says? 817 00:43:07,171 --> 00:43:09,690 "Too many fucking pictures!" 818 00:43:09,691 --> 00:43:13,571 '"Too many fucking pictures on our fucking walls!" That's what he says.' 819 00:43:14,651 --> 00:43:17,129 Of course, I know I shouldn't talk about all the families 820 00:43:17,130 --> 00:43:18,691 whose houses I've been to like that, 821 00:43:20,091 --> 00:43:22,491 and probably I'm being so unfair, 822 00:43:24,411 --> 00:43:27,531 because they can't all be like that, can they? 823 00:43:27,532 --> 00:43:29,970 But, actually, I want to be unfair, 824 00:43:29,971 --> 00:43:33,530 because I want to make you listen to Josephine. 825 00:43:33,531 --> 00:43:36,010 I'm going to leave the room now. 826 00:43:36,011 --> 00:43:39,530 I'm handing the phone back, and I'm leaving. 827 00:43:39,531 --> 00:43:41,570 'She said all that to you?' 828 00:43:41,571 --> 00:43:43,010 She did. 829 00:43:43,011 --> 00:43:45,330 More than she's said to me. 830 00:43:45,331 --> 00:43:46,730 I bet. 831 00:43:46,731 --> 00:43:48,971 You will keep your promise, though? 832 00:43:48,972 --> 00:43:52,450 Not got a reason to break it, not yet. 833 00:43:52,451 --> 00:43:53,571 Are you still there? 834 00:43:53,572 --> 00:43:54,930 Yes. 835 00:43:54,931 --> 00:43:59,170 We're alone now, just you and me, Mr Lester. 836 00:43:59,171 --> 00:44:00,491 What do you want to tell me? 837 00:44:00,492 --> 00:44:06,290 Well, what I have to tell you is this, and God forgive me. 838 00:44:06,291 --> 00:44:10,970 I know - I'm not sure that I'm meant to, but I do know - 839 00:44:10,971 --> 00:44:14,291 that Pamela's brother Julian showed you a little hole that allowed you 840 00:44:14,292 --> 00:44:17,330 to spy on the freemasons in their temple 841 00:44:17,331 --> 00:44:19,531 in the basement of the Imperial Hotel. 842 00:44:19,532 --> 00:44:20,611 'Is that true?' 843 00:44:21,931 --> 00:44:25,691 'Oh, come on, Louis, because obviously I do know. Is it true?' 844 00:44:25,692 --> 00:44:28,291 Yes. It was in a linen cupboard. 845 00:44:29,931 --> 00:44:31,810 A linen cupboard? 846 00:44:31,811 --> 00:44:32,971 How wonderful! 847 00:44:34,011 --> 00:44:37,490 You, in a linen cupboard, spying on the masons! 848 00:44:37,491 --> 00:44:40,529 And, I think I can assure you, it's all right, 849 00:44:40,530 --> 00:44:43,531 they're not going to come and slit your throat for that, 850 00:44:43,532 --> 00:44:45,930 for spying through a hole. 851 00:44:45,931 --> 00:44:48,210 Well, not today, anyway. 852 00:44:48,211 --> 00:44:51,211 So, this is what I've got to tell you, Louis. 853 00:44:52,691 --> 00:44:54,730 My husband is a mason, 854 00:44:54,731 --> 00:44:58,929 just like Julian, and members of the government and Civil Service, 855 00:44:58,930 --> 00:45:03,331 and not forgetting all sorts of rich people from the City of London. 856 00:45:03,332 --> 00:45:06,410 And my husband is a member of the lodge 857 00:45:06,411 --> 00:45:08,731 in the basement of the Imperial Hotel. 858 00:45:09,811 --> 00:45:13,290 And of course they have their silly rituals 859 00:45:13,291 --> 00:45:17,210 and they exchange gossip, and I'm sure raise some money 860 00:45:17,211 --> 00:45:21,291 for charity, too, because, well, that is what they say they do. 861 00:45:22,611 --> 00:45:26,169 And so there are a lot of very important people down there 862 00:45:26,170 --> 00:45:29,769 in this basement, and in other basements across the city, 863 00:45:29,770 --> 00:45:31,811 because they like basements best. 864 00:45:33,251 --> 00:45:38,090 And it goes without saying it is a very powerful group, these lodges, 865 00:45:38,091 --> 00:45:40,250 a very powerful octopus, 866 00:45:40,251 --> 00:45:42,969 with its arms stretching out all over the place. 867 00:45:42,970 --> 00:45:46,969 And these people are not easily impressed, Louis, do you understand? 868 00:45:46,970 --> 00:45:48,571 I'm sure they're not, no. 869 00:45:48,572 --> 00:45:51,210 Not easily impressed at all. 870 00:45:51,211 --> 00:45:54,089 But just before the great financial crash, 871 00:45:54,090 --> 00:45:56,371 in the lodge that is in the basement of the Imperial, 872 00:45:56,372 --> 00:46:02,250 there was a new member who'd just joined, a little man called Mr Luke. 873 00:46:02,251 --> 00:46:06,770 And he did the most extraordinary thing. 874 00:46:06,771 --> 00:46:10,530 He prophesised the crash, and not just that, 875 00:46:10,531 --> 00:46:13,770 he was right about every firm that went under 876 00:46:13,771 --> 00:46:16,770 and every firm that managed to survive. 877 00:46:16,771 --> 00:46:19,969 He was advising all the other members of the lodge what to do 878 00:46:19,970 --> 00:46:23,409 with their stocks and shares, but nobody listened to him. 879 00:46:23,410 --> 00:46:24,931 'But Mr Luke was right.' 880 00:46:25,971 --> 00:46:27,931 He made money when everybody else 881 00:46:27,932 --> 00:46:30,530 was hurt by the most grievous losses, 882 00:46:30,531 --> 00:46:33,851 and naturally, everybody was amazingly impressed, 883 00:46:33,852 --> 00:46:37,570 because a lot of them had lost their whole fortunes. 884 00:46:37,571 --> 00:46:41,011 Of course, most of them still had their country estates, 885 00:46:41,012 --> 00:46:45,410 but life looked, for a time, rather uncertain. 886 00:46:45,411 --> 00:46:51,890 And here was Mr Luke, the wizard, whom nobody had listened to. 887 00:46:51,891 --> 00:46:57,170 But after a time, because he was such a funny little man, 888 00:46:57,171 --> 00:47:00,491 and his manners were very abrupt, they stopped holding him 889 00:47:00,492 --> 00:47:04,810 in such awe, and started referring to him as the Fluke. 890 00:47:04,811 --> 00:47:08,049 And even though we are in the middle of a great depression, 891 00:47:08,050 --> 00:47:11,971 most of the people found that they were still quite rich, 892 00:47:11,972 --> 00:47:16,850 that they could sell a few of their assets, and life was good again. 893 00:47:16,851 --> 00:47:20,529 And so not only did they not look to Mr Luke for advice, 894 00:47:20,530 --> 00:47:24,251 they began to ignore him, wish he wasn't part of the lodge, 895 00:47:24,252 --> 00:47:26,850 that he would go elsewhere. 896 00:47:26,851 --> 00:47:31,410 They began to refer to him as the Complete Fluke. 897 00:47:31,411 --> 00:47:35,010 And so he has remained, the Complete Fluke, 898 00:47:35,011 --> 00:47:39,371 who nobody really talked to, until a few weeks ago that is. 899 00:47:44,811 --> 00:47:46,091 'Are you still there?' 900 00:47:46,092 --> 00:47:47,210 Yes, I am. 901 00:47:47,211 --> 00:47:49,689 I'm sorry. I just had to stop for a moment. 902 00:47:49,690 --> 00:47:52,569 I thought my husband was coming back, and if my husband finds me 903 00:47:52,570 --> 00:47:54,691 telling you this, I shall be in terrible trouble. 904 00:47:56,651 --> 00:47:59,209 'No, it was somebody else, they've gone past,' 905 00:47:59,210 --> 00:48:01,411 although I ought to keep an ear out. 906 00:48:01,412 --> 00:48:05,330 My husband has very small feet, he creeps up. 907 00:48:05,331 --> 00:48:07,689 It's all right, I can go on. Do you want me to go on? 908 00:48:07,690 --> 00:48:09,289 If you want to go on, Josephine. 909 00:48:09,290 --> 00:48:10,929 Well, what kind of an answer is that? 910 00:48:10,930 --> 00:48:12,969 I am risking things to tell you this. 911 00:48:12,970 --> 00:48:14,971 Of course I want you to go on. 912 00:48:14,972 --> 00:48:16,730 So... 913 00:48:16,731 --> 00:48:20,890 Mr Fluke is ignored in the basement temple. 914 00:48:20,891 --> 00:48:24,489 "He was always so vulgar", people say to themselves. 915 00:48:24,490 --> 00:48:28,211 "He comes from trade, how did he ever become part of the lodge?" 916 00:48:28,212 --> 00:48:31,210 And then, suddenly, one day Mr Luke appears 917 00:48:31,211 --> 00:48:37,090 and says "I've joined another lodge, I won't be here anymore". 918 00:48:37,091 --> 00:48:39,690 And people are very relieved. 919 00:48:39,691 --> 00:48:43,370 But then he adds, "It's in a basement just like this, 920 00:48:43,371 --> 00:48:46,811 "but it is the most beautiful basement I have ever seen. 921 00:48:46,812 --> 00:48:49,010 "That is where my new lodge is." 922 00:48:49,011 --> 00:48:51,291 And of course everybody there is rather curious, 923 00:48:51,292 --> 00:48:53,170 and some want to know more. 924 00:48:53,171 --> 00:48:55,851 "You can come with me if you like," he says. 925 00:48:55,852 --> 00:48:58,050 "You are welcome to come." 926 00:48:58,051 --> 00:49:00,649 And this splits the lodge down the middle. 927 00:49:00,650 --> 00:49:04,289 And some think, "Well, what does he know that we don't?" 928 00:49:04,290 --> 00:49:07,891 And others think, "Good riddance, go away, horrid little man!" 929 00:49:09,651 --> 00:49:13,810 But this special temple really does exist, Louis, 930 00:49:13,811 --> 00:49:15,691 and it is extraordinary. 931 00:49:17,051 --> 00:49:19,811 'I can tell you where it is, its exact location,' 932 00:49:21,051 --> 00:49:23,611 but I think I'd better not. 933 00:49:25,011 --> 00:49:29,490 But, what I can tell you is, during the war, 934 00:49:29,491 --> 00:49:32,369 because of the airships and their bombs, there were some 935 00:49:32,370 --> 00:49:36,769 wonderful, subterranean apartments created in the City of London, 936 00:49:36,770 --> 00:49:39,929 where a few very rich families could scuttle down 937 00:49:39,930 --> 00:49:41,769 when there was a bombing raid. 938 00:49:41,770 --> 00:49:44,851 And out of these luxury apartments below the street 939 00:49:44,852 --> 00:49:47,490 is where the temple has been created. 940 00:49:47,491 --> 00:49:49,771 And that is where the Fluke has been going. 941 00:49:51,411 --> 00:49:55,209 "Come and follow me," says Mr Luke, "to this new lodge." 942 00:49:55,210 --> 00:49:57,691 And so some of the people, including my husband, 943 00:49:57,692 --> 00:50:02,050 from the Imperial lodge do follow, a few, just to have a look. 944 00:50:02,051 --> 00:50:04,611 And they go down the steps, below the pavement 945 00:50:04,612 --> 00:50:09,250 and into this special temple and it is indeed exquisite. 946 00:50:09,251 --> 00:50:14,330 And Mr Luke says, "If you join me here now in this lodge, 947 00:50:14,331 --> 00:50:17,651 "you must promise not to repeat what you are about to hear 948 00:50:17,652 --> 00:50:18,971 "to anybody, ever." 949 00:50:20,491 --> 00:50:23,009 And those that have followed him down there, 950 00:50:23,010 --> 00:50:27,251 look around them, see how special it is and feel they have to agree. 951 00:50:28,291 --> 00:50:29,850 They promise. 952 00:50:29,851 --> 00:50:32,771 I think my husband is the only one to have broken this promise 953 00:50:32,772 --> 00:50:33,851 by telling me. 954 00:50:35,211 --> 00:50:41,211 My husband is often rather drunk and thinks that I forget everything. 955 00:50:43,611 --> 00:50:45,250 'Josephine?' 956 00:50:45,251 --> 00:50:46,611 I'm still here. 957 00:50:48,771 --> 00:50:51,971 And then, after they have all promised, they say, 958 00:50:51,972 --> 00:50:54,850 "But what is it we mustn't repeat?" 959 00:50:54,851 --> 00:50:58,090 And the little man says, "Come next door," 960 00:50:58,091 --> 00:50:59,769 and they go into the room next door 961 00:50:59,770 --> 00:51:02,049 which has the black and white Masonic floor, 962 00:51:02,050 --> 00:51:05,851 but there is nothing else in it except an enormous travelling trunk. 963 00:51:06,971 --> 00:51:10,289 And my husband and the few that followed Mr Luke 964 00:51:10,290 --> 00:51:12,731 stare at the trunk as the door is shut behind them. 965 00:51:13,851 --> 00:51:18,490 And then the man they call the Complete Fluke says, 966 00:51:18,491 --> 00:51:22,410 "Something extraordinary is going to happen, very soon, 967 00:51:22,411 --> 00:51:26,130 "worse than you can ever imagine. 968 00:51:26,131 --> 00:51:27,651 "Many are going to die. 969 00:51:28,931 --> 00:51:31,491 "Many, many millions will die. 970 00:51:32,491 --> 00:51:36,331 "Old horrors will be repeated, and completely new horrors 971 00:51:36,332 --> 00:51:40,011 "beyond your wildest nightmares will start to happen. 972 00:51:41,091 --> 00:51:42,931 "Whole cities will be destroyed. 973 00:51:44,211 --> 00:51:47,691 "Families you know will die, your brothers will die, 974 00:51:47,692 --> 00:51:51,650 "their houses and businesses wiped out. 975 00:51:51,651 --> 00:51:56,049 "But since we here at this temple know it is coming, we can find a way 976 00:51:56,050 --> 00:51:59,329 "of staying alive, of protecting what we've got, 977 00:51:59,330 --> 00:52:01,771 "and of taking advantage of what will follow. 978 00:52:02,931 --> 00:52:06,091 "Because even in disaster, there is opportunity." 979 00:52:08,611 --> 00:52:11,730 "We can, and we will be, the lucky few, 980 00:52:11,731 --> 00:52:13,891 "if we do the following things." 981 00:52:15,651 --> 00:52:18,490 'Sarah, who are you talking to? 982 00:52:18,491 --> 00:52:21,131 'Nobody, darling, just having a good gossip.' 983 00:52:21,132 --> 00:52:23,650 Oh, God, Louis, my husband is back. 984 00:52:23,651 --> 00:52:25,171 I don't think he heard anything. 985 00:52:25,172 --> 00:52:26,530 'What's that? 986 00:52:26,531 --> 00:52:28,451 'Are you still on the telephone?' 987 00:52:29,691 --> 00:52:31,211 He can't have heard, can he? 988 00:52:32,211 --> 00:52:34,130 Louis? 989 00:52:34,131 --> 00:52:36,011 'I hope you hear from me again.' 990 00:52:38,371 --> 00:52:39,531 'Josephine?' 991 00:52:41,651 --> 00:52:42,971 'Hello. Who is there? 992 00:52:44,171 --> 00:52:45,211 'Hello? 993 00:52:46,651 --> 00:52:48,731 'Are you going to tell me who is there? 994 00:52:50,291 --> 00:52:53,331 'I would strongly advise you to tell me who you are.' 995 00:52:58,091 --> 00:53:00,290 So, what happened to her? 996 00:53:00,291 --> 00:53:01,330 I don't know. 997 00:53:01,331 --> 00:53:02,571 She didn't call back? 998 00:53:02,572 --> 00:53:03,771 No. 999 00:53:04,891 --> 00:53:07,091 Well, she was obviously completely barking. 1000 00:53:07,092 --> 00:53:08,650 Yes. 1001 00:53:08,651 --> 00:53:10,050 She must have been. 1002 00:53:10,051 --> 00:53:12,529 You know, the masons hold special dinners for installing 1003 00:53:12,530 --> 00:53:14,609 their Worshipful Master in the Imperial Hotel, 1004 00:53:14,610 --> 00:53:17,411 and they sometimes have music, too, would you believe. 1005 00:53:17,412 --> 00:53:20,090 Maybe one day they'll ask for you! 1006 00:53:20,091 --> 00:53:22,490 I doubt it. 1007 00:53:22,491 --> 00:53:24,571 But I'll certainly go and play to them if they do. 1008 00:53:24,572 --> 00:53:26,570 I'm really curious now. 1009 00:53:26,571 --> 00:53:29,769 Course, it isn't the Imperial masons that have this special temple, 1010 00:53:29,770 --> 00:53:30,891 the Imperial masons... 1011 00:53:30,892 --> 00:53:34,290 Are all perfectly jolly fellows! 1012 00:53:34,291 --> 00:53:36,210 Well, I doubt they're that, 1013 00:53:36,211 --> 00:53:39,211 but they're not the people she was talking about. I wonder who they are? 1014 00:53:40,371 --> 00:53:43,249 Wouldn't it be amazing to find that special luxury temple? 1015 00:53:43,250 --> 00:53:46,489 At least, discover exactly where it is. It would be. 1016 00:53:46,490 --> 00:53:48,329 Be careful of these people though, Louis, 1017 00:53:48,330 --> 00:53:50,969 you don't want to cross them in any way. 1018 00:53:50,970 --> 00:53:52,131 Yes, I realise that. 1019 00:53:54,251 --> 00:53:55,891 How could I ever cross them, Stanley? 1020 00:53:58,251 --> 00:54:00,691 So you're convinced she was just a crazy person? 1021 00:54:00,692 --> 00:54:02,211 Yes. 1022 00:54:03,331 --> 00:54:06,211 Having thought about it a bit, yes. 1023 00:54:07,211 --> 00:54:10,210 I think she found it rather exciting, 1024 00:54:10,211 --> 00:54:12,050 to try to scare me. 1025 00:54:12,051 --> 00:54:15,291 She was one of your aroused aristocrats. 1026 00:54:18,331 --> 00:54:21,211 Maybe, an aroused aristocrat. 1027 00:54:22,651 --> 00:54:24,810 Have you told me everything? 1028 00:54:24,811 --> 00:54:26,011 Yes. 1029 00:54:29,371 --> 00:54:30,531 Almost everything. 1030 00:54:33,051 --> 00:54:35,410 There was one last phone call. 1031 00:54:35,411 --> 00:54:36,491 There was? 1032 00:54:38,971 --> 00:54:40,171 A very short one. 1033 00:54:41,811 --> 00:54:43,691 'There's a call for you, Mr Lester.' 1034 00:54:43,692 --> 00:54:44,891 Thank you. 1035 00:54:46,371 --> 00:54:47,491 Pray for me. 1036 00:54:49,691 --> 00:54:51,451 Will you pray for me, Louis? 1037 00:54:51,452 --> 00:54:52,811 Josephine? 1038 00:54:54,371 --> 00:54:55,491 Josephine? 1039 00:55:02,571 --> 00:55:04,651 'Josephine!' 1040 00:55:12,091 --> 00:55:14,571 And that's the last I heard from her. 1041 00:55:14,572 --> 00:55:16,010 So where was she? 1042 00:55:16,011 --> 00:55:17,289 In some asylum somewhere? 1043 00:55:17,290 --> 00:55:19,809 Is that what she was suggesting, that they'd locked her up? 1044 00:55:19,810 --> 00:55:22,089 People don't do that to their wives anymore, surely? 1045 00:55:22,090 --> 00:55:24,891 Who knows what goes on in those big houses, Stanley? 1046 00:55:24,892 --> 00:55:26,490 Hmmm. 1047 00:55:26,491 --> 00:55:29,089 But it was that last call that convinced me 1048 00:55:29,090 --> 00:55:30,531 that she wasn't genuine. 1049 00:55:32,091 --> 00:55:35,329 I'm pretty sure it was just a game on her part. 1050 00:55:35,330 --> 00:55:37,091 A strange game to play, isn't it? 1051 00:55:37,092 --> 00:55:38,370 Yes. 1052 00:55:38,371 --> 00:55:41,090 But what I've worked out is this. 1053 00:55:41,091 --> 00:55:44,250 I think she probably loved watching the band. 1054 00:55:44,251 --> 00:55:46,491 She loved the music, all that is true. 1055 00:55:46,492 --> 00:55:49,970 She wants to escape the life she has, 1056 00:55:49,971 --> 00:55:52,209 but she knows there are several women in the ballroom 1057 00:55:52,210 --> 00:55:53,331 that feel the same. 1058 00:55:54,691 --> 00:55:56,091 She wants to be noticed, 1059 00:55:57,331 --> 00:55:59,611 so she summons up a sort of nightmare, 1060 00:56:01,451 --> 00:56:02,811 so I'll remember her. 1061 00:56:02,812 --> 00:56:04,370 And you have. 1062 00:56:04,371 --> 00:56:06,130 I have, yes. 1063 00:56:06,131 --> 00:56:07,851 And I know one thing, Stanley. 1064 00:56:09,811 --> 00:56:11,891 You are never going to publish this. 1065 00:56:14,811 --> 00:56:18,009 You're right, she must be merely some mad aristo, 1066 00:56:18,010 --> 00:56:21,611 some upper-class nutcase who simply wants to sleep with you. 1067 00:56:21,612 --> 00:56:23,810 Precisely. 1068 00:56:23,811 --> 00:56:25,811 Why else would she choose me to tell this to? 1069 00:56:26,891 --> 00:56:30,850 But just in case she isn't a complete madwoman, 1070 00:56:30,851 --> 00:56:34,289 you're not going to try to find out more from Pamela? 1071 00:56:34,290 --> 00:56:35,731 I gave Josephine my word. 1072 00:56:36,771 --> 00:56:38,851 No, I promised, remember? 1073 00:56:41,331 --> 00:56:43,011 See you in a few days, Stanley. 1074 00:56:48,571 --> 00:56:52,251 And then you can show me how much of this you've dared to write. 1075 00:57:04,891 --> 00:57:06,891 And then, of course, events engulfed Louis, 1076 00:57:06,892 --> 00:57:09,410 very soon after our conversation. 1077 00:57:09,411 --> 00:57:11,530 A matter of days, really. 1078 00:57:11,531 --> 00:57:13,369 And quite a big part of what happened to him 1079 00:57:13,370 --> 00:57:14,609 was connected to the masons 1080 00:57:14,610 --> 00:57:17,169 and their ability to look after their own. 1081 00:57:17,170 --> 00:57:20,329 Or at least that's my view of how Julian Luscombe was protected. 1082 00:57:20,330 --> 00:57:23,131 And that would have continued if Julian hadn't killed himself. 1083 00:57:27,211 --> 00:57:31,089 And as I write this, I'm not at all sure Louis wasn't right. 1084 00:57:31,090 --> 00:57:34,491 I may not have the guts to publish Josephine's story. 1085 00:57:34,492 --> 00:57:38,890 After all, Louis is safely out of the country now and I am not. 1086 00:57:38,891 --> 00:57:41,251 I am still here and have every intention of staying. 1087 00:57:42,331 --> 00:57:44,489 The masons have fled the Imperial at the moment, 1088 00:57:44,490 --> 00:57:46,329 because of its loss of reputation. 1089 00:57:46,330 --> 00:57:48,969 And that great big crumbling palace of a place, 1090 00:57:48,970 --> 00:57:51,371 which, for a couple of years, really burst with life 1091 00:57:51,372 --> 00:57:54,010 and was so full of possibilities, 1092 00:57:54,011 --> 00:57:56,729 is just hanging on like a beached creature, 1093 00:57:56,730 --> 00:57:58,931 hoping the next tide will make it buoyant again. 1094 00:58:00,211 --> 00:58:02,891 And if that happens, will the masons return? 1095 00:58:06,091 --> 00:58:10,731 One thing I can't stop thinking about is, does Mr Luke really exist? 1096 00:58:11,891 --> 00:58:14,891 Or was he a figment of this woman's imagination, as Louis believed? 1097 00:58:17,131 --> 00:58:20,129 At the moment I've kept the promise not to try to make Pamela 1098 00:58:20,130 --> 00:58:23,889 tell me more, anything that might lead me to Josephine. 1099 00:58:23,890 --> 00:58:26,211 Or at least, I've half kept the promise. 1100 00:58:27,211 --> 00:58:28,729 I've asked her in a roundabout way 1101 00:58:28,730 --> 00:58:31,131 and she said she hadn't a clue what I was talking about. 1102 00:58:33,051 --> 00:58:36,409 After her brother Julian's death, it is obviously an impossible subject 1103 00:58:36,410 --> 00:58:38,211 for me to really press her on. 1104 00:58:40,531 --> 00:58:45,051 But if Mr Luke does exist, does he really know something we don't? 1105 00:58:48,211 --> 00:58:52,011 Or is he a complete fraud, the Complete Fluke? 1106 00:58:58,771 --> 00:59:01,251 I think I might just try and find him. 1107 00:59:01,276 --> 00:59:48,523 Subtitles by MemoryOnSmells http://UKsubtitles.ru. 95707

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