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Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:03,920 To be fair, it can't be much fun being a racist. 2 00:00:03,960 --> 00:00:06,040 You do all this stuff with them students, 3 00:00:06,080 --> 00:00:08,240 milking it about how much you've changed, 4 00:00:08,280 --> 00:00:10,840 how much of a better man you are now, yet you thought 5 00:00:10,880 --> 00:00:13,520 exactly the same way as I did when you were my age, didn't you? 6 00:00:13,560 --> 00:00:15,000 I'll tuck you in. 7 00:00:15,040 --> 00:00:18,480 What are you doing in bed with Dad? I was tired, Matthew. 8 00:00:18,520 --> 00:00:20,720 I'm going to commit a murder to begin a race war. 9 00:00:20,760 --> 00:00:22,520 Another MP, Rosie Cooper. 10 00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:24,240 I know who the informant is. 11 00:00:24,280 --> 00:00:26,640 It's this slug called Robbie Mullen. 12 00:00:26,680 --> 00:00:28,840 A lot of people won't forget what he's done. 13 00:00:28,880 --> 00:00:31,000 The police are here. It's about the boys. 14 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:32,840 Someone's made a threat against them. 15 00:00:32,880 --> 00:00:36,040 Listen, listen, look. I'm... I'm leaving here now. 16 00:00:36,080 --> 00:00:37,360 Where were these images posted? 17 00:00:37,400 --> 00:00:39,536 We found them on a thread in a mobile seized yesterday. 18 00:00:39,560 --> 00:00:42,160 We believe the original posts are linked to National Action. 19 00:00:42,200 --> 00:00:44,800 I'm sorry. He's gonna have to go. 20 00:00:44,840 --> 00:00:46,800 That's it now. We can't keep doing this. 21 00:00:46,840 --> 00:00:49,080 Robbie, this trial isn't far off now, lad, 22 00:00:49,120 --> 00:00:51,960 and you're going to have to demonstrate to the jury 23 00:00:52,000 --> 00:00:54,320 that you're not the same as Renshaw and the others, 24 00:00:54,360 --> 00:00:56,000 that they can trust you, 25 00:00:56,040 --> 00:00:59,000 cos you're different from them. 26 00:00:59,040 --> 00:01:00,200 Is this some sort of test? 27 00:01:00,240 --> 00:01:01,960 Sticking me in the middle of Nigeria, 28 00:01:02,000 --> 00:01:03,320 see how he handles it, yeah? 29 00:01:03,360 --> 00:01:04,680 You're scared, aren't you? No! 30 00:01:04,720 --> 00:01:06,480 Cos you want me to stand up in court 31 00:01:06,520 --> 00:01:09,240 and tell everybody that I'm a changed man and I'm not! 32 00:01:41,000 --> 00:01:42,520 Jack Renshaw, stand up. 33 00:01:44,840 --> 00:01:48,160 You've been found guilty of four counts 34 00:01:48,200 --> 00:01:52,360 of inciting a child to engage in sexual activities. 35 00:01:52,400 --> 00:01:54,280 You've displayed not one shred of remorse 36 00:01:54,320 --> 00:01:56,280 and the defence you put forward, 37 00:01:56,320 --> 00:01:58,360 that your phone had been hacked, was as lacking 38 00:01:58,400 --> 00:02:00,200 in evidence as it was credibility. 39 00:02:00,240 --> 00:02:04,320 These are very serious offences against minors, 40 00:02:04,360 --> 00:02:07,040 and in one case, a boy as young as 13, 41 00:02:07,080 --> 00:02:09,320 and society needs protection 42 00:02:09,360 --> 00:02:12,080 against predatory paedophiles like you. 43 00:02:12,120 --> 00:02:16,520 I impose upon you a prison sentence of 16 months. 44 00:02:16,560 --> 00:02:18,680 Take him down. 45 00:02:18,720 --> 00:02:21,840 Jack! We love you, son! 46 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:28,120 16 months. It could have been worse. 47 00:02:28,160 --> 00:02:30,160 God, it's going to be in the newspapers. 48 00:02:32,400 --> 00:02:34,560 The whole fucking world's gonna read it. 49 00:02:34,600 --> 00:02:36,600 The judge ordered reporting restrictions 50 00:02:36,640 --> 00:02:39,360 because of the upcoming trial for the plan to kill the MP. 51 00:02:39,400 --> 00:02:41,280 No detail from this case can be published 52 00:02:41,320 --> 00:02:43,120 until after that's taken place. 53 00:02:43,160 --> 00:02:44,640 What? So, they can't print it yet? 54 00:02:44,680 --> 00:02:47,000 We've got a bit of time. 55 00:02:47,040 --> 00:02:49,560 But the story will come out, Jack. 56 00:03:01,400 --> 00:03:04,240 I've got to warn you, it's a shithole in here. 57 00:03:04,280 --> 00:03:07,800 I live with four lads. Yous all stink. 58 00:03:09,160 --> 00:03:11,040 All right, lad? 59 00:03:11,080 --> 00:03:13,640 Yeah, I'm very well, thank you. How are you? 60 00:03:13,680 --> 00:03:15,520 Lovely. Yeah, what a beautiful day! 61 00:03:18,680 --> 00:03:20,960 Are you not going to eat that? 62 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:22,760 I'm not hungry. 63 00:03:23,840 --> 00:03:25,560 Save it for later. 64 00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:31,880 How are you feeling? 65 00:03:35,680 --> 00:03:37,520 Been doing anything exciting? 66 00:03:39,920 --> 00:03:41,600 Watching the telly? 67 00:03:41,640 --> 00:03:44,120 Any boxsets you'd like to recommend? 68 00:03:44,160 --> 00:03:46,600 I haven't been watching much telly. 69 00:03:46,640 --> 00:03:49,160 I've just... just been on the computer. 70 00:03:49,200 --> 00:03:51,400 What did you say? 71 00:03:52,600 --> 00:03:54,880 I've not been watching telly. I've been on the computer. 72 00:03:56,600 --> 00:03:59,240 You're being careful about what websites you've been going on? 73 00:04:01,480 --> 00:04:04,400 Robbie? You're telling me what to do again. 74 00:04:04,440 --> 00:04:06,000 Yeah, I am telling you what to do, yeah. 75 00:04:06,040 --> 00:04:07,800 Because if you've been getting in touch 76 00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:09,680 with any of your old pals from National Action 77 00:04:09,720 --> 00:04:10,800 or if you've been looking 78 00:04:10,840 --> 00:04:13,560 at some kind of Combat 18 website or the BNP 79 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:16,160 or whatever right-wing shite you used to look at, 80 00:04:16,200 --> 00:04:19,400 then this trial will collapse and you'll end up in prison. 81 00:04:19,440 --> 00:04:22,400 Where we're from, most people end up in prison anyway, don't they? 82 00:04:22,440 --> 00:04:25,080 Oh, what kind of comment's that, eh? All right, come on. 83 00:04:25,120 --> 00:04:26,560 Wish I was going to prison 84 00:04:26,600 --> 00:04:28,680 instead of standing in court grassing on people. 85 00:04:28,720 --> 00:04:30,240 Will you shut up about being a grass? 86 00:04:30,280 --> 00:04:32,760 Who are you trying to protect anyway? 87 00:04:32,800 --> 00:04:34,360 Jack Renshaw? 88 00:04:34,400 --> 00:04:37,040 Because he's just been convicted for grooming young boys. 89 00:04:37,080 --> 00:04:38,920 We've only got your word for that though. 90 00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:40,520 You could be trying to trick us. 91 00:04:40,560 --> 00:04:41,760 Why would I wanna trick you? 92 00:04:41,800 --> 00:04:44,320 I don't know. Why wouldn't you? Are you stupid or something? 93 00:04:44,360 --> 00:04:45,840 Stupid? Why am I stupid? 94 00:04:45,880 --> 00:04:47,320 You're an ungrateful little twat. 95 00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:48,440 Hey, that's enough! Yeah. 96 00:04:48,480 --> 00:04:50,320 Yeah, all of this. All of this?! 97 00:04:50,360 --> 00:04:52,880 Look at all this you've got here... Look, will you pack it in? 98 00:04:52,920 --> 00:04:55,400 Please, the two of you, you're worse than the boys! 99 00:04:55,440 --> 00:04:59,120 You, get in the shower. Wash your hair! 100 00:04:59,160 --> 00:05:02,520 And you, you can get the hoover out. 101 00:05:26,800 --> 00:05:28,200 I'm sorry 102 00:05:28,240 --> 00:05:30,360 if I sounded ungrateful before, but... 103 00:05:31,680 --> 00:05:34,200 I just don't like it. It's full of Blacks and Asians. 104 00:05:34,240 --> 00:05:35,720 Rob, come on. 105 00:05:35,760 --> 00:05:38,040 I know I'm not supposed to say things like that, 106 00:05:38,080 --> 00:05:40,000 but I can't help it. 107 00:05:40,040 --> 00:05:41,800 It's the way that I feel. 108 00:05:41,840 --> 00:05:44,320 Well, I know it looks bad but... 109 00:05:44,360 --> 00:05:47,600 No, what looks bad, lad, is if you get caught out lying. 110 00:05:47,640 --> 00:05:50,560 At least if you tell the truth, then no-one can trip you up. 111 00:05:52,760 --> 00:05:55,600 Are you expecting anyone? 112 00:05:55,640 --> 00:05:58,000 You're joking, aren't you? Nobody else knows I live here. 113 00:06:01,840 --> 00:06:03,520 All right? Yeah. 114 00:06:03,560 --> 00:06:05,520 Someone to see you, lad. 115 00:06:06,640 --> 00:06:08,040 Mill! 116 00:06:08,080 --> 00:06:09,280 Hello, baby! 117 00:06:09,320 --> 00:06:11,600 Hello! What you doing? 118 00:06:11,640 --> 00:06:13,680 B-b-b-b-b... Hello! 119 00:06:13,720 --> 00:06:17,560 Well, at least he's glad to see someone. How is he anyway? 120 00:06:17,600 --> 00:06:19,600 Unhelpful, angry. 121 00:06:19,640 --> 00:06:21,000 Suspicious. 122 00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:22,560 Well, his usual jolly self then. 123 00:06:22,600 --> 00:06:24,680 This could be end of us, you know that? 124 00:06:24,720 --> 00:06:26,320 I mean, if this all goes wrong, 125 00:06:26,360 --> 00:06:28,520 then our reputation is shot to pieces. 126 00:06:28,560 --> 00:06:31,440 So, it all hangs on a big, sulky racist from Widnes? 127 00:06:32,800 --> 00:06:33,880 It's not funny! 128 00:06:35,120 --> 00:06:36,440 She's got a point. 129 00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:39,840 You need to try and get out, you know, meet people. 130 00:06:39,880 --> 00:06:41,600 What, round here? 131 00:06:41,640 --> 00:06:43,640 Yes, round here. 132 00:06:43,680 --> 00:06:47,800 It's not doing you any good sitting in that flat all day by yourself. 133 00:06:47,840 --> 00:06:51,560 I've ruined my life, I know I have. 134 00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:53,280 You have not. 135 00:06:56,040 --> 00:06:58,320 What if they don't believe me, 136 00:06:58,360 --> 00:06:59,680 the jury? 137 00:07:00,760 --> 00:07:03,040 It's my word against theirs, isn't it? 138 00:07:03,080 --> 00:07:06,320 Yeah, but you're telling the truth. 139 00:07:12,200 --> 00:07:14,400 I don't wanna do it any more. 140 00:07:14,440 --> 00:07:16,480 That's the truth. 141 00:07:18,920 --> 00:07:21,560 I just wanna go back to the way things were before. 142 00:07:29,800 --> 00:07:33,320 Oi, what you playing at? Get to the back of the queue, bruv! 143 00:07:33,360 --> 00:07:35,160 I'm not eating. I'm not eating. 144 00:07:37,040 --> 00:07:38,680 You all right, Chris? 145 00:07:41,480 --> 00:07:43,480 How... How's it going? 146 00:07:43,520 --> 00:07:45,400 I've been hearing whispers about you. 147 00:07:50,120 --> 00:07:52,040 Look, they hacked my phone. 148 00:07:52,080 --> 00:07:55,200 They put all this stuff on it to destroy my reputation. 149 00:07:56,320 --> 00:07:57,880 It's all fucking lies! 150 00:08:02,560 --> 00:08:05,040 I mean, they're making me out like I'm some sort of paedo. 151 00:08:08,160 --> 00:08:11,040 Matthew Collins is behind it all. He's trying to destroy me. 152 00:08:11,080 --> 00:08:14,120 This could make us all look bad. 153 00:08:14,160 --> 00:08:16,640 That won't happen. 154 00:08:20,080 --> 00:08:22,000 I promise you that won't happen. 155 00:08:29,760 --> 00:08:32,640 He's got a big day in front of him tomorrow. 156 00:08:32,680 --> 00:08:35,640 Try and make him look respectable, Shimmy. 157 00:08:35,680 --> 00:08:37,040 I'll do my best. 158 00:08:37,080 --> 00:08:39,880 Who's at the bar mitzvah? 159 00:08:39,920 --> 00:08:41,680 That's my grandson, Reuben. 160 00:08:44,360 --> 00:08:46,040 I'll be honest with you, Matthew, 161 00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:47,920 he's got it tough. 162 00:08:47,960 --> 00:08:50,720 Him and his sisters, they go to the Jewish school. 163 00:08:50,760 --> 00:08:53,800 Whole place surrounded by barbed wire. 164 00:08:55,280 --> 00:08:56,400 Hold still. 165 00:08:56,440 --> 00:08:59,320 Three security guards on the door. 166 00:08:59,360 --> 00:09:01,440 It's the same with all the Jewish schools. 167 00:09:01,480 --> 00:09:03,000 That it should come to that, eh, 168 00:09:03,040 --> 00:09:04,760 in this day and age. 169 00:09:06,760 --> 00:09:08,880 Children having to cross barbed wire 170 00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:10,840 to go to school. 171 00:09:19,920 --> 00:09:22,040 He looks dapper, don't he? Yeah. 172 00:09:22,080 --> 00:09:24,400 You look really handsome, dead smart. 173 00:09:24,440 --> 00:09:26,440 How do you feel? 174 00:09:26,480 --> 00:09:27,920 Like a twat. 175 00:09:29,120 --> 00:09:32,640 Oh, no, like a used car salesman or something. 176 00:09:34,040 --> 00:09:36,320 I wouldn't buy life insurance off you. Stop it! 177 00:09:36,360 --> 00:09:39,280 Don't listen. Robbie, you look great. 178 00:09:39,320 --> 00:09:41,840 You look like someone who's doing the right thing. 179 00:09:44,840 --> 00:09:46,760 There he is! 180 00:10:22,000 --> 00:10:23,080 Hey. 181 00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:27,240 You all right? So, listen, Matthew can't be here, 182 00:10:27,280 --> 00:10:29,000 not until you've both given evidence, 183 00:10:29,040 --> 00:10:30,320 but he wanted me to tell you, 184 00:10:30,360 --> 00:10:32,040 you look better without the bum fluff. 185 00:10:32,080 --> 00:10:34,000 Come on, you'll be fine. 186 00:10:34,040 --> 00:10:35,720 In here. 187 00:10:37,000 --> 00:10:38,800 Sorry, mate, can I help you? 188 00:10:42,360 --> 00:10:44,480 Are you connected to the case? 189 00:10:44,520 --> 00:10:47,120 I'm connected with the defence. Oh, right. 190 00:10:55,760 --> 00:10:57,120 You know him? 191 00:11:00,600 --> 00:11:02,000 No. 192 00:11:02,040 --> 00:11:04,680 He's just trying to freak you out. Come on, let's get you some tea. 193 00:11:06,600 --> 00:11:08,320 Court will rise. 194 00:11:23,880 --> 00:11:28,200 Members of the jury, it will be alleged by the Crown 195 00:11:28,240 --> 00:11:30,640 that the defendants hold extreme views. 196 00:11:30,680 --> 00:11:34,160 All of you, I suspect, hold views 197 00:11:34,200 --> 00:11:36,600 which could be described as the very opposite of these. 198 00:11:36,640 --> 00:11:39,160 You're not racist, you're not homophobic, 199 00:11:39,200 --> 00:11:41,040 you're not anti-Semitic. 200 00:11:41,080 --> 00:11:44,640 But it is not a criminal offence in this country 201 00:11:44,680 --> 00:11:46,160 just to hold these views, 202 00:11:46,200 --> 00:11:48,480 however repulsive you feel they might be. 203 00:11:48,520 --> 00:11:51,360 We live in a free society 204 00:11:51,400 --> 00:11:55,000 and the law tolerates the holding of these opinions. 205 00:12:11,680 --> 00:12:16,000 Ladies and gentlemen, I appear on behalf of the prosecution. 206 00:12:16,040 --> 00:12:19,120 Mr Atkinson, I'm going to ask you to pause for a moment there, 207 00:12:19,160 --> 00:12:22,840 as we need to hear from Mr Jackson. 208 00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:25,960 What have you done? My lord. 209 00:12:26,000 --> 00:12:27,800 I don't care any more. 210 00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:29,200 It's too late for me. 211 00:12:29,240 --> 00:12:31,480 Thank you, my lord. I represent Mr Renshaw, 212 00:12:31,520 --> 00:12:33,800 and I would seek, with your leave, 213 00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:36,640 that you have him re-arraigned on counts one and two. 214 00:12:36,680 --> 00:12:38,960 If this is how you wish to proceed. 215 00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:41,680 It is how I'm instructed, Your Lordship. 216 00:12:41,720 --> 00:12:44,960 Jack Renshaw, will you stand up, please? 217 00:12:47,760 --> 00:12:50,760 You are charged on count one of this indictment 218 00:12:50,800 --> 00:12:54,960 of engaging in conduct in preparation of a terrorist act, 219 00:12:55,000 --> 00:12:58,600 namely the murdering of Rosie Cooper MP. 220 00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:01,760 Are you guilty or not guilty? 221 00:13:01,800 --> 00:13:03,200 Guilty. 222 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:09,840 On count two, you are charged with making a threat to kill. 223 00:13:09,880 --> 00:13:13,200 The particulars are that, on July 1st, 2017, 224 00:13:13,240 --> 00:13:15,200 you made a threat to Robbie Mullen 225 00:13:15,240 --> 00:13:17,720 that you would kill DC Victoria Henderson, 226 00:13:17,760 --> 00:13:20,080 intending that Robbie Mullen would fear 227 00:13:20,120 --> 00:13:22,280 that said threat would be carried out. 228 00:13:22,320 --> 00:13:25,240 Are you guilty or not guilty? 229 00:13:25,280 --> 00:13:26,800 Guilty. 230 00:13:33,560 --> 00:13:36,160 Renshaw's pleaded guilty to the plots to kill. 231 00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:38,640 What? Guilty? 232 00:13:38,680 --> 00:13:42,440 Well, but does that mean I don't have to give any evidence? 233 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:45,840 It's all over or...? Not quite, I'm afraid. 234 00:13:45,880 --> 00:13:47,720 They're all still on trial for membership 235 00:13:47,760 --> 00:13:50,840 and Lythgoe's facing one count of encouragement to murder. 236 00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:54,600 I reckon he's fallen on his sword to try and bury all the paedo stuff. 237 00:13:54,640 --> 00:13:55,680 Stupid. 238 00:13:55,720 --> 00:13:58,080 He at least had a decent shot at a defence, 239 00:13:58,120 --> 00:14:00,360 but now he's going to end up with life imprisonment? 240 00:14:00,400 --> 00:14:01,840 He wants the headline to be 241 00:14:01,880 --> 00:14:04,680 "Fascist martyr prepared to kill for the cause". 242 00:14:04,720 --> 00:14:07,080 And not "Fascist paedo trying to have sex with young boys". 243 00:14:07,120 --> 00:14:08,960 What about Lythgoe and Hankinson? 244 00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:10,720 He's trying to take the heat off them. 245 00:14:10,760 --> 00:14:13,640 Mr Atkinson, if you could pick up from where you left off, please. 246 00:14:13,680 --> 00:14:15,640 My lord. 247 00:14:17,000 --> 00:14:19,920 These defendants stand before you, 248 00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:24,960 accused of their continuing participation in National Action, 249 00:14:25,000 --> 00:14:29,360 a banned organisation that sought actively through fear, 250 00:14:29,400 --> 00:14:33,320 intimidation and violence to shape society 251 00:14:33,360 --> 00:14:35,920 in accordance with their beliefs. 252 00:14:39,000 --> 00:14:41,880 Mr Renshaw had purchased a machete 253 00:14:41,920 --> 00:14:43,880 with which to carry out his plan. 254 00:14:43,920 --> 00:14:47,200 The online marketing for that particular item 255 00:14:47,240 --> 00:14:49,040 describes it as offering 256 00:14:49,080 --> 00:14:52,520 "19 inches of unprecedented piercing 257 00:14:52,560 --> 00:14:55,840 "and slashing power at a market price". 258 00:14:58,760 --> 00:15:01,200 There is now no doubt, after his guilty pleas, 259 00:15:01,240 --> 00:15:05,040 that Mr Renshaw planned the murders of Rosie Cooper MP 260 00:15:05,080 --> 00:15:07,400 and Detective Constable Victoria Henderson. 261 00:15:07,440 --> 00:15:10,600 The Crown's case is that he was given permission 262 00:15:10,640 --> 00:15:12,640 to carry out the murder of Rosie Cooper 263 00:15:12,680 --> 00:15:16,120 by the then leader of National Action, Chris Lythgoe, 264 00:15:16,160 --> 00:15:20,080 in the name of that organisation. 265 00:15:22,720 --> 00:15:26,480 My lord, I call Robbie Mullen. 266 00:15:33,760 --> 00:15:36,320 Mr Mullen, it's time. 267 00:16:19,680 --> 00:16:23,240 Place your right hand on the Bible and read from the card. 268 00:16:28,680 --> 00:16:31,440 I... I swear by almighty God 269 00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:33,720 that the evidence I shall give 270 00:16:33,760 --> 00:16:36,560 shall be the truth, the whole truth 271 00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:38,520 and nothing but the truth. 272 00:16:48,120 --> 00:16:50,080 Could you confirm your name, please? 273 00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:51,600 Robbie Mullen. 274 00:16:51,640 --> 00:16:54,080 A little about you to start with, Mr Mullen. 275 00:16:54,120 --> 00:16:56,240 Where in the country did you grow up? 276 00:16:56,280 --> 00:16:59,920 Widnes, which is in the north-west. 277 00:16:59,960 --> 00:17:03,520 Your school days came to somewhat of an abrupt end. 278 00:17:03,560 --> 00:17:06,440 An incident involving you swearing at a teacher? 279 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:08,960 Yeah. 280 00:17:09,000 --> 00:17:11,200 And you've drifted from job to job since then, 281 00:17:11,240 --> 00:17:13,160 no real direction in your life? 282 00:17:14,280 --> 00:17:15,640 I suppose so. 283 00:17:16,880 --> 00:17:19,760 When did you join National Action? 284 00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:22,240 2015. 285 00:17:22,280 --> 00:17:24,080 The gentlemen sitting in the dock, 286 00:17:24,120 --> 00:17:28,040 are they all known to you through that organisation? 287 00:17:30,800 --> 00:17:32,240 Yeah. 288 00:17:32,280 --> 00:17:36,280 My lord, could Mr Mullen speak up, please? I couldn't hear his reply. 289 00:17:36,320 --> 00:17:38,120 Do try and project your voice 290 00:17:38,160 --> 00:17:41,600 to the back of the court, please, Mr Mullen. 291 00:17:41,640 --> 00:17:43,040 Sorry. 292 00:17:43,080 --> 00:17:44,600 Yeah. 293 00:17:46,920 --> 00:17:50,640 You and they were all members of the organisation before the ban? 294 00:17:50,680 --> 00:17:53,000 Yeah. And were you all still members 295 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:56,640 after the ban on National Action at the end of 2016? 296 00:17:56,680 --> 00:17:58,040 Yeah. 297 00:17:58,080 --> 00:18:00,240 After the ban, did there come a time 298 00:18:00,280 --> 00:18:02,280 when you had contact with Matthew Collins, 299 00:18:02,320 --> 00:18:05,720 who worked for the organisation Hope Not Hate? 300 00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:07,600 Yeah. For what reason? 301 00:18:09,320 --> 00:18:11,200 I couldn't tell you, really. 302 00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:13,560 I knew I just needed to get out of there... 303 00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:16,480 My lord, I'm sorry, he has a tendency to drop his head down, 304 00:18:16,520 --> 00:18:17,520 drop his voice down. 305 00:18:17,560 --> 00:18:21,160 Perhaps try moving a little closer to the microphone please, Mr Mullen. 306 00:18:24,760 --> 00:18:26,240 Sorry. 307 00:18:28,320 --> 00:18:31,280 On page 20 of the bundle, 308 00:18:31,320 --> 00:18:34,280 we can see an email you had screenshot-ed 309 00:18:34,320 --> 00:18:36,320 and forwarded to Matthew Collins. 310 00:18:38,040 --> 00:18:39,920 Yeah. It was an encrypted email 311 00:18:39,960 --> 00:18:42,320 you'd received from Chris Lythgoe, 312 00:18:42,360 --> 00:18:44,560 where he was talking about recruiting new members 313 00:18:44,600 --> 00:18:47,040 for National Action in towns in the north-west. 314 00:18:47,080 --> 00:18:48,480 Er, yeah. 315 00:18:49,680 --> 00:18:54,120 Largely white towns, and other - 316 00:18:54,160 --> 00:18:59,000 his words - "horrifically Paki-fied" towns. 317 00:19:01,720 --> 00:19:03,280 Yeah. 318 00:19:03,320 --> 00:19:05,560 Next page of the bundle, another email, 319 00:19:05,600 --> 00:19:08,400 this one after National Action had been banned. 320 00:19:08,440 --> 00:19:10,480 In it you ask Chris Lythgoe, 321 00:19:10,520 --> 00:19:13,960 "Are you staying leader of the overall group?" 322 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:16,800 And can you read his reply? 323 00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:20,880 "You're damn fucking right I am. 324 00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:24,520 "I'm the one person with a clear picture" 325 00:19:24,560 --> 00:19:26,880 "of where we're going long-term." 326 00:19:28,560 --> 00:19:33,400 So, in the period immediately after the ban, Lythgoe remained in charge? 327 00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:35,160 Yeah. 328 00:19:35,200 --> 00:19:37,080 And Matt Hankinson? 329 00:19:41,080 --> 00:19:44,160 He was Chris's second-in-command. 330 00:19:45,560 --> 00:19:48,360 He handled security and stuff. 331 00:19:48,400 --> 00:19:49,880 And after the ban? 332 00:19:52,320 --> 00:19:54,360 Carried on like before. 333 00:19:54,400 --> 00:19:56,280 They both did. 334 00:19:58,160 --> 00:20:03,320 Let's turn our attention now to the night of July 1st, 2017. 335 00:20:03,360 --> 00:20:06,200 Did Mr Renshaw say why he was going to kill 336 00:20:06,240 --> 00:20:08,480 Rosie Cooper and Victoria Henderson? 337 00:20:08,520 --> 00:20:12,240 We believed, at first, it was because he was depressed 338 00:20:12,280 --> 00:20:15,160 about going to prison for his hate speeches. 339 00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:19,680 But I now know that it was also because he'd been arrested 340 00:20:19,720 --> 00:20:22,440 for grooming young boys and it was about to come out. 341 00:20:22,480 --> 00:20:24,840 What was Mr Lythgoe's demeanour 342 00:20:24,880 --> 00:20:27,480 as Mr Renshaw outlined his plans? 343 00:20:27,520 --> 00:20:30,160 He seemed happy. 344 00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:33,080 Smiling, nodding his head. 345 00:20:33,120 --> 00:20:36,160 Did he mention the Home Secretary, Amber Rudd? 346 00:20:36,200 --> 00:20:37,640 Yeah. 347 00:20:37,680 --> 00:20:41,960 He said Jack should do her instead of Rosie Cooper. 348 00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:44,080 And what did Mr Renshaw say? 349 00:20:44,120 --> 00:20:48,040 He said she'd be too well protected. 350 00:20:49,360 --> 00:20:52,000 Did Mr Hankinson say anything? 351 00:20:52,040 --> 00:20:55,360 Yeah. He said, "You should do a synagogue." 352 00:20:55,400 --> 00:20:57,280 And I said there'd be kids there... 353 00:20:57,320 --> 00:20:58,960 My lord, again, I didn't hear any of that. 354 00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:02,240 And I'm afraid it's not just volume. He has quite a strong accent. 355 00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:04,200 I'm finding it difficult to understand. 356 00:21:04,240 --> 00:21:08,320 Mr Mullen, once again, I must ask you to speak up. 357 00:21:08,360 --> 00:21:11,320 If you mumble, nobody can understand you. 358 00:21:17,320 --> 00:21:20,000 So, you said there might be children in a synagogue, 359 00:21:20,040 --> 00:21:22,160 and what did Mr Renshaw say to that? 360 00:21:25,920 --> 00:21:27,680 He said, "All Jews are the same." 361 00:21:27,720 --> 00:21:31,120 "You don't class a rat by its age." 362 00:21:31,160 --> 00:21:34,560 He said, "Vermin is vermin." 363 00:21:49,080 --> 00:21:51,280 Mr Mullen, you made a statement to the police 364 00:21:51,320 --> 00:21:53,880 describing yourself in 2015, 365 00:21:53,920 --> 00:21:55,920 at the point you joined National Action, 366 00:21:55,960 --> 00:22:00,040 as a "bored young man looking for some identity or path to take". 367 00:22:00,080 --> 00:22:01,560 Is that right? 368 00:22:01,600 --> 00:22:03,040 If you say so. 369 00:22:03,080 --> 00:22:05,240 It's not me saying so. It's what you told the police. 370 00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:09,280 OK. After leaving school, 371 00:22:09,320 --> 00:22:11,400 you were unemployed and claiming sickness benefit 372 00:22:11,440 --> 00:22:13,800 for, erm... about four years? 373 00:22:15,440 --> 00:22:18,120 Yeah. I had a... a stomach problem. 374 00:22:18,160 --> 00:22:19,440 Were you sick? 375 00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:23,200 For about a year, on and off. For one year. 376 00:22:23,240 --> 00:22:25,640 So, you accept that for three of those four years, 377 00:22:25,680 --> 00:22:28,120 you were fraudulently claiming benefits then? 378 00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:30,240 It weren't that simple. 379 00:22:30,280 --> 00:22:32,320 Sometimes, I was sick, 380 00:22:32,360 --> 00:22:35,480 and then I got better. It came and went. 381 00:22:35,520 --> 00:22:38,280 Wearing your National Action hat, 382 00:22:38,320 --> 00:22:42,680 what would your reaction have been, say, to a young Somali teenager 383 00:22:42,720 --> 00:22:45,480 arriving in this country, going "on the sick", 384 00:22:45,520 --> 00:22:47,000 with false stomach problems, 385 00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:50,400 and fraudulently claiming three years of benefits? 386 00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:54,840 Dunno. 387 00:22:57,400 --> 00:23:01,280 What did you think of the murder of the MP Jo Cox? 388 00:23:01,320 --> 00:23:03,480 I thought the guy that did it was a weirdo. 389 00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:05,280 You were asked in your police interview, 390 00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:08,000 "Did you think she was a traitor?" What did you answer? 391 00:23:09,280 --> 00:23:10,640 I don't remember. 392 00:23:10,680 --> 00:23:13,800 Well, I can tell you. You said, "Yes." 393 00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:15,480 So, I obviously did. 394 00:23:15,520 --> 00:23:18,840 But does it say in that interview what time I was talking about? 395 00:23:18,880 --> 00:23:20,840 It doesn't really matter, does it, Mr Mullen? 396 00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:21,960 Well, it obviously does 397 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:24,080 because I was probably being asked 398 00:23:24,120 --> 00:23:27,400 what I thought about it before she was killed and not after. 399 00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:29,200 You regarded somebody like Jo Cox, 400 00:23:29,240 --> 00:23:31,600 with her stance on immigration, as a traitor, didn't you? 401 00:23:31,640 --> 00:23:35,200 Yeah, but that doesn't mean I thought she deserved to be killed. 402 00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:39,080 Thank you, my lord. No further questions. 403 00:23:41,160 --> 00:23:45,360 Mr Mullen, as you know, I appear for Christopher Lythgoe. 404 00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:47,720 After your expulsion from school 405 00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:50,520 and a succession of dead-end jobs, 406 00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:53,800 you found being a member of National Action exciting. 407 00:23:53,840 --> 00:23:56,040 It gave you purpose. There were finally people 408 00:23:56,080 --> 00:23:58,360 in your life that were listening to you. 409 00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:01,600 I suppose so. 410 00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:03,600 You told the police 411 00:24:03,640 --> 00:24:05,760 that the primary purpose of National Action 412 00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:08,920 was to start a race war 413 00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:11,400 and to "take our country back". 414 00:24:12,560 --> 00:24:14,600 Yeah. So, that must mean 415 00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:17,280 that, at that time, you shared those same views? 416 00:24:17,320 --> 00:24:19,200 I never said that I didn't. 417 00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:21,080 Please speak up, Mr Mullen. 418 00:24:21,120 --> 00:24:24,040 I never said that I didn't share those views. 419 00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:26,160 Anti-Jew? 420 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:30,760 At the time, yeah. 421 00:24:30,800 --> 00:24:32,240 Anti-Black? 422 00:24:32,280 --> 00:24:33,800 Yeah. 423 00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:36,360 Anti-Asian, anti any non-white? 424 00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:38,080 Yeah. 425 00:24:38,120 --> 00:24:41,040 Homophobic? You know what "homophobic" means? 426 00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:42,320 Yeah. 427 00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:45,760 He's the best witness the defence have got. 428 00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:47,800 So, you were for a white Britain 429 00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:51,160 by any means necessary, including violence? 430 00:24:53,720 --> 00:24:55,080 Yeah. 431 00:24:55,120 --> 00:24:57,040 Again, we can't hear you. 432 00:24:57,080 --> 00:24:58,560 Yeah. 433 00:25:05,320 --> 00:25:08,720 Are you still racist? Remember, you are under oath. 434 00:25:11,920 --> 00:25:13,320 Yeah. 435 00:25:13,360 --> 00:25:15,040 But less so. 436 00:25:18,800 --> 00:25:22,440 Now, you say you didn't like the way that things were working out 437 00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:25,760 with National Action, which is why you wanted to get out. 438 00:25:25,800 --> 00:25:28,080 And yet, after the murder of Jo Cox, 439 00:25:28,120 --> 00:25:29,880 after the organisation was banned, 440 00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:34,120 you still continued to attend meetings. Why is that? 441 00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:38,480 It wasn't that easy to walk away. Why not? 442 00:25:40,520 --> 00:25:42,760 I'd spent a lot of time with these people. 443 00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:49,120 They were my friends. 444 00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:52,120 Perhaps you were lonely? 445 00:25:54,040 --> 00:25:55,640 In a way, yeah. 446 00:25:57,080 --> 00:25:59,840 A lonely drifter with a dead-end life, 447 00:25:59,880 --> 00:26:03,360 in search of friendship and approval. 448 00:26:05,560 --> 00:26:07,600 No further questions. 449 00:26:07,640 --> 00:26:10,080 Thank you, Mr Aylett. Let's call it a day there 450 00:26:10,120 --> 00:26:12,840 and reconvene on Monday morning. 451 00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:35,480 And the doctor said you're getting stronger, 452 00:26:35,520 --> 00:26:37,640 and the nurses are well happy with you. 453 00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:40,240 Said I'll be able to take you for a little walk soon. 454 00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:46,320 No. No, not just yet. No, you can't have any Guinness yet. 455 00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:50,360 Hello, Matthew. 456 00:26:52,400 --> 00:26:53,840 All right, love? 457 00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:57,120 I've got T-shirts and clean underwear. 458 00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:03,040 We hadn't been down from Liverpool long. 459 00:27:03,080 --> 00:27:05,720 Yours was the first friendly face I remember. 460 00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:10,576 You know, our kid blamed me for me dad leaving, not you. 461 00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:13,280 He said, because I told my mum 462 00:27:13,320 --> 00:27:16,680 when I saw you and my dad in bed together, then I was a grass... 463 00:27:18,520 --> 00:27:20,800 and it was my fault that he left us. 464 00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:24,680 I'm sorry. 465 00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:28,000 I know now that my dad was to blame, you know. 466 00:27:29,480 --> 00:27:32,920 He was the adult. You were so young. 467 00:27:36,600 --> 00:27:40,520 You know your mum and dad's marriage was over long before I came along. 468 00:27:42,360 --> 00:27:46,280 But I suppose I was responsible for him moving out. 469 00:27:46,320 --> 00:27:48,560 Why are you still washing his pants? 470 00:27:51,840 --> 00:27:53,760 I don't know. 471 00:27:56,120 --> 00:27:58,960 Did you ever meet anyone else? 472 00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:05,360 Yeah. I married briefly to Ray. 473 00:28:08,560 --> 00:28:11,000 He wasn't your dad. 474 00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:15,040 He was very charismatic. 475 00:28:15,080 --> 00:28:16,800 He still is. 476 00:28:18,840 --> 00:28:21,320 I was in love with him. 477 00:28:29,520 --> 00:28:31,960 Leona, I don't know how to say this. 478 00:28:36,680 --> 00:28:38,920 I hated you when I was growing up. 479 00:28:40,320 --> 00:28:41,800 OK. 480 00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:44,040 And because you ran off with my dad 481 00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:45,960 and split our house up... 482 00:28:48,440 --> 00:28:50,280 and because you were Black, 483 00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:54,120 I used you as an excuse to hate all Black people. 484 00:28:55,480 --> 00:28:57,920 Well, to me, yous were all to blame. 485 00:28:57,960 --> 00:28:59,760 You know, my head was so warped. 486 00:28:59,800 --> 00:29:02,560 I was filled with so much anger and so much hate, I... 487 00:29:04,080 --> 00:29:06,440 I joined the National Front. 488 00:29:08,800 --> 00:29:10,320 Are you stupid? 489 00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:12,600 No, no, I'm not. No, Leona, honestly, 490 00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:15,920 I don't think like that any more. Look, I'm sorry, but... 491 00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:19,040 it's not me. Do you know what I mean? 492 00:29:19,080 --> 00:29:21,800 I've spent so long trying to put right what I did. 493 00:29:27,080 --> 00:29:28,880 So, what do you want from me now? 494 00:29:33,240 --> 00:29:35,080 Why are you telling me this? 495 00:29:37,240 --> 00:29:38,920 You want forgiveness? 496 00:29:40,280 --> 00:29:41,760 I think so. 497 00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:43,520 OK. 498 00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:46,800 I forgive you. 499 00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:51,800 But what about everybody else? 500 00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:21,400 Brenda? 501 00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:22,920 'I checked in on Robbie at the flat. 502 00:30:22,960 --> 00:30:25,040 'He's not there.' Shit! 503 00:30:25,080 --> 00:30:27,520 'Neighbour saw him Friday. He's legged it to Widnes.' 504 00:30:27,560 --> 00:30:30,120 Yeah. Yeah, that's definitely where he's gone. 505 00:30:41,240 --> 00:30:42,800 Is it that one? Yeah. 506 00:30:50,440 --> 00:30:51,560 Natalie? 507 00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:53,600 I'm Matthew Collins. I know who you are. 508 00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:55,760 We've just come to ask Robbie to come back to London 509 00:30:55,800 --> 00:30:57,880 to continue giving his evidence. He's not here. 510 00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:00,640 Don't fuck about. We've driven for over four hours to get here. 511 00:31:00,680 --> 00:31:02,080 Sorry about that. 512 00:31:02,120 --> 00:31:05,200 What's the point? None of them believe a word I'm saying anyway. 513 00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:07,880 Come back, lad. Renshaw's been convicted now. All you got to do... 514 00:31:07,920 --> 00:31:10,720 Stand there while they take the piss out of me, my pathetic life, 515 00:31:10,760 --> 00:31:13,720 the way I talk? It's not right, what they're putting him through. 516 00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:15,960 What the fuck has me getting kicked out of school 517 00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:18,240 or going on the sick got to do with anything? 518 00:31:18,280 --> 00:31:20,680 Robbie, come back. 519 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:22,920 I'm not coming back. Stop being so fucking selfish! 520 00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:25,880 You're behaving like a spoilt brat! OK, come on. 521 00:31:25,920 --> 00:31:28,360 No, look, there's people doing everything they can for you. 522 00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:30,480 I put my own family in danger for you. 523 00:31:30,520 --> 00:31:33,320 Now be a man and come back and finish what you started! 524 00:31:33,360 --> 00:31:35,080 Just fuck off! No, you fuck off! 525 00:31:35,120 --> 00:31:36,520 Matt, this isn't helping! 526 00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:38,560 Look, he's got to finish this, Natalie. 527 00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:40,800 He doesn't have to do anything. Now, please, 528 00:31:40,840 --> 00:31:43,240 my brother's made his decision. Please respect that. 529 00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:50,800 Fucking waste of time that was, wasn't it? 530 00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:09,640 I don't care what they say, Robbie. 531 00:32:11,320 --> 00:32:13,720 You're not the same as them other boys on trial. 532 00:32:19,800 --> 00:32:21,520 I think you're a good person. 533 00:32:25,640 --> 00:32:27,160 Night-night. 534 00:32:37,920 --> 00:32:39,840 Court will rise. 535 00:32:51,280 --> 00:32:54,200 Welcome back, ladies and gentlemen. We are ready to start. 536 00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:04,000 Hello? 537 00:33:04,040 --> 00:33:07,360 'The court's in session. No-one's seen him.' 538 00:33:07,400 --> 00:33:09,400 OK, keep us posted. 539 00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:14,440 He's not turned up. 540 00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:16,240 What did you say? 541 00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:18,120 He's not here. 542 00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:31,040 Hey, mate. 543 00:33:31,080 --> 00:33:32,600 All right. 544 00:33:32,640 --> 00:33:34,200 I knew you'd turn up. 545 00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:35,680 I see laughing boy's back. 546 00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:39,680 Don't worry about it. 547 00:33:47,280 --> 00:33:48,800 Hello? 548 00:33:48,840 --> 00:33:50,840 'I'm with him now. I told you not to worry.' 549 00:33:50,880 --> 00:33:52,920 All right. Nice one, mate. 550 00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:54,800 Thanks, ta-ra. 551 00:33:54,840 --> 00:33:56,320 Right, we're back on. 552 00:33:57,920 --> 00:33:59,720 Do you wanna go across? Yeah. All right. 553 00:33:59,760 --> 00:34:01,480 I'll see you later. See you in a bit, love. 554 00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:04,760 And wasn't it the case that night, Mr Mullen, 555 00:34:04,800 --> 00:34:07,240 that Mr Lythgoe and Mr Hankinson were both very drunk? 556 00:34:07,280 --> 00:34:09,400 It didn't seem like they were to me. 557 00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:12,720 When Mr Renshaw outlined his plans that night, 558 00:34:12,760 --> 00:34:15,720 how sure were you that he was being serious? 559 00:34:15,760 --> 00:34:17,120 100%. 560 00:34:17,160 --> 00:34:18,880 And Mr Lythgoe's reaction? 561 00:34:18,920 --> 00:34:21,680 He said something like, "Don't fuck it up." 562 00:34:21,720 --> 00:34:23,160 Are you sure of that? 563 00:34:23,200 --> 00:34:25,720 Could he not actually have said, by way of comment, 564 00:34:25,760 --> 00:34:27,360 "You'll only fuck it up"? 565 00:34:27,400 --> 00:34:30,160 No. It was "Don't fuck it up". 566 00:34:30,200 --> 00:34:33,440 You see now, I suggest that that wasn't said, Mr Mullen. 567 00:34:33,480 --> 00:34:35,000 Well, I suggest it was. 568 00:34:36,320 --> 00:34:37,640 After National Action 569 00:34:37,680 --> 00:34:39,120 had been banned... 570 00:34:39,160 --> 00:34:40,480 and things started 571 00:34:40,520 --> 00:34:42,560 to quieten down, isn't it the case that you started 572 00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:44,640 to look elsewhere for excitement? 573 00:34:44,680 --> 00:34:46,560 No, that's not the truth. 574 00:34:46,600 --> 00:34:49,280 You didn't want to go back to being that bored young man 575 00:34:49,320 --> 00:34:52,240 looking for an identity, did you? Which is why you sexed up 576 00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:54,240 what was actually said in the pub that night... 577 00:34:54,280 --> 00:34:55,360 That's ridiculous. 578 00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:56,760 So you had something exciting 579 00:34:56,800 --> 00:34:58,640 to offer your new friends at Hope Not Hate. 580 00:34:58,680 --> 00:35:01,040 No. Your friends who had sorted out 581 00:35:01,080 --> 00:35:03,496 a flat for you and the ones who took you on holiday to Dublin. 582 00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:05,640 It wasn't like that. Not a holiday holiday. 583 00:35:05,680 --> 00:35:08,080 You had to give them something nice and juicy, didn't you? 584 00:35:08,120 --> 00:35:11,480 Because they were the ones that were listening to you now, weren't they? 585 00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:13,440 I don't know what you're going on about. 586 00:35:13,480 --> 00:35:16,800 I'm not making anything up. I heard what I heard. 587 00:35:16,840 --> 00:35:19,040 And you weren't there, were you, mate? 588 00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:21,840 No further questions, my lord. 589 00:35:23,240 --> 00:35:25,760 Thank you, Mr Mullen. Is that it? 590 00:35:27,160 --> 00:35:29,280 Yes, you may stand down. 591 00:35:36,560 --> 00:35:38,360 Jack Renshaw is a hero! 592 00:35:38,400 --> 00:35:41,480 He's a nonce, mate, and he got exactly what he deserved, yeah! 593 00:35:42,960 --> 00:35:45,200 My lord, I call Jack Renshaw. 594 00:35:45,240 --> 00:35:47,440 In the pub that night, were you seeking permission 595 00:35:47,480 --> 00:35:49,360 from Chris Lythgoe and National Action 596 00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:51,080 to do what you had in your mind? No. 597 00:35:51,120 --> 00:35:54,920 Did he ever say to you, when you'd revealed your intentions, 598 00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:56,120 "Don't fuck it up"? 599 00:35:56,160 --> 00:36:00,160 No. That sounds like the workings of Mullen's fantasy. 600 00:36:00,200 --> 00:36:03,040 Were you drunk when you arrived at the pub that night? 601 00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:07,000 Yes. I was intoxicated and I was in a poor mental state. 602 00:36:08,200 --> 00:36:12,120 We were all very drunk, but Chris is very similar to me, 603 00:36:12,160 --> 00:36:15,080 in the sense that we don't normally show that we're drunk. 604 00:36:15,120 --> 00:36:17,360 You know, we talk more, talk louder, 605 00:36:17,400 --> 00:36:21,120 but, well, physically, we don't particularly look drunk. 606 00:36:21,160 --> 00:36:23,800 Thank you, Mr Renshaw. Could you wait there, please? 607 00:36:28,400 --> 00:36:30,920 Mr Renshaw, is it your hatred of the Jews 608 00:36:30,960 --> 00:36:34,000 what led you into extreme right-wing politics? 609 00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:35,640 Because you hate them, don't you? 610 00:36:35,680 --> 00:36:37,920 Yeah, I do. Do you accept 611 00:36:37,960 --> 00:36:40,240 that there were gas chambers? No. 612 00:36:43,120 --> 00:36:46,040 Do you accept the holocaust, that millions of Jews were killed 613 00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:48,240 by the Nazis during World War II? 614 00:36:48,280 --> 00:36:51,160 No, I do not. Where did they all go then? 615 00:36:51,200 --> 00:36:55,120 Most of them were put into concentration camps, 616 00:36:55,160 --> 00:36:58,960 but if you look at the statistics of Jews prior to the war 617 00:36:59,000 --> 00:37:00,680 and Jews after the war, 618 00:37:00,720 --> 00:37:03,440 the Jewish population actually increased. 619 00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:10,960 So, what was your plan? 620 00:37:11,000 --> 00:37:14,200 What were you going to do with this machete? 621 00:37:15,840 --> 00:37:18,320 I hadn't really thought it through. 622 00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:20,480 Chop Rosie Cooper's head off? 623 00:37:20,520 --> 00:37:22,720 Through the heart, or what? 624 00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:25,200 Probably the jugular. 625 00:37:25,240 --> 00:37:27,760 And what were you going to do with this machete on the jugular? 626 00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:29,160 Hack at it. 627 00:37:30,720 --> 00:37:33,200 You said earlier you couldn't really remember anything 628 00:37:33,240 --> 00:37:35,120 that had happened at the pub that evening? 629 00:37:35,160 --> 00:37:37,800 Just snippets. Just snippets. 630 00:37:37,840 --> 00:37:40,080 But do we understand those snippets to include 631 00:37:40,120 --> 00:37:42,880 that you can remember Mr Hankinson did not mention the synagogue 632 00:37:42,920 --> 00:37:44,960 as somewhere you might attack instead? 633 00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:47,080 That's right. And you can clearly remember 634 00:37:47,120 --> 00:37:51,320 that Mr Lythgoe did not say, "Make sure you don't fuck it up"? 635 00:37:51,360 --> 00:37:54,200 Yeah, because that's just not something he would say. 636 00:37:54,240 --> 00:37:56,120 Those snippets, by chance, you remember - 637 00:37:56,160 --> 00:37:57,560 the ones that help your friends. 638 00:37:57,600 --> 00:37:59,320 Curious that the rest of the conversation 639 00:37:59,360 --> 00:38:02,320 you were too drunk to remember. Is it that you're trying 640 00:38:02,360 --> 00:38:05,920 to protect your friends, Mr Renshaw? 641 00:38:05,960 --> 00:38:09,400 Is that why you're standing there now, lying to the jury? 642 00:38:14,040 --> 00:38:15,720 I haven't lied. 643 00:38:48,560 --> 00:38:50,120 Are you all right, Bren? 644 00:38:50,160 --> 00:38:52,800 You just make sure you do the fucking business in there, yeah? 645 00:38:56,360 --> 00:38:59,120 That's the twat who's giving Robbie grief. 646 00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:00,640 Is he? Yeah. 647 00:39:00,680 --> 00:39:03,040 He's been staring him out, trying to intimidate him. 648 00:39:05,320 --> 00:39:07,680 Hey, gobshite, why don't me and you go for a little walk 649 00:39:07,720 --> 00:39:09,040 after this, eh? Any time. 650 00:39:09,080 --> 00:39:11,120 Yeah, any time. Ready when you are. 651 00:39:13,640 --> 00:39:15,440 Mr Collins, 652 00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:18,520 at one point you, yourself, were a mole, weren't you? 653 00:39:18,560 --> 00:39:19,720 That's right, yeah. 654 00:39:19,760 --> 00:39:21,720 Er... I was a member of the National Front 655 00:39:21,760 --> 00:39:23,480 and then the BNP. 656 00:39:23,520 --> 00:39:27,400 I was passing information to an anti-fascist magazine. 657 00:39:27,440 --> 00:39:30,360 How did you first come into contact with Robbie Mullen? 658 00:39:30,400 --> 00:39:33,120 He wrote to me under a false name. 659 00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:36,600 You know, it was pretty clear that he felt trapped at National Action. 660 00:39:36,640 --> 00:39:38,640 It was like he was in a cult and he wanted out. 661 00:39:38,680 --> 00:39:41,520 Did he ever ask for any money for the information he gave you? 662 00:39:41,560 --> 00:39:43,080 No, none. 663 00:39:43,120 --> 00:39:44,680 Thank you. 664 00:39:45,920 --> 00:39:49,520 You took Mr Mullen on holiday, didn't you, to Dublin? 665 00:39:49,560 --> 00:39:51,880 I wouldn't exactly call it a holiday. 666 00:39:51,920 --> 00:39:55,000 He needed a breather. To be honest with you, we both did. 667 00:39:55,040 --> 00:39:58,920 Well, the situation was very tense at the time. 668 00:39:58,960 --> 00:40:01,880 Was that as a reward for coming up with some juicy titbits 669 00:40:01,920 --> 00:40:03,360 for your website 670 00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:04,960 and Hope Not Hate magazine? 671 00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:07,480 No. We felt like we had a duty of care towards him, 672 00:40:07,520 --> 00:40:10,320 you know, both for his physical and mental wellbeing. 673 00:40:10,360 --> 00:40:12,720 Well, because, as you said, you'd been there yourself. 674 00:40:12,760 --> 00:40:15,720 All those years ago, that anti-fascist magazine had paid 675 00:40:15,760 --> 00:40:19,080 for an air ticket for you to Australia, hadn't it? 676 00:40:19,120 --> 00:40:20,720 That's right, they did, yeah. 677 00:40:21,880 --> 00:40:24,480 Yeah, but there's a big difference between me and Robbie Mullen. 678 00:40:24,520 --> 00:40:27,160 You see, I ran off to Australia 679 00:40:27,200 --> 00:40:28,920 rather than be called up to face any trial 680 00:40:28,960 --> 00:40:32,280 because I didn't want to be accused publicly as an informant. 681 00:40:32,320 --> 00:40:35,800 You know, I didn't wanna be called a grass. 682 00:40:35,840 --> 00:40:38,320 You see, me and Robbie come from a similar background 683 00:40:38,360 --> 00:40:39,960 and we both know what that means. 684 00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:41,400 But he's got the courage 685 00:40:41,440 --> 00:40:43,800 to come back and face the people he's accusing. 686 00:40:43,840 --> 00:40:45,640 Very commendable, I'm sure. 687 00:40:45,680 --> 00:40:47,720 No, what I'm saying is... Thank you, my lord. 688 00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:52,840 What I'm saying is Robbie Mullen's a better man than me. 689 00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:04,160 Court will rise. 690 00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:07,480 Foreman of the jury, 691 00:41:07,520 --> 00:41:10,360 have you reached verdicts upon which you are all agreed? 692 00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:12,000 Yes. 693 00:41:13,560 --> 00:41:15,600 Will the defendants please rise? 694 00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:24,280 On count three, encouragement to commit murder, 695 00:41:24,320 --> 00:41:27,480 do you find the defendant, Christopher Lythgoe, 696 00:41:27,520 --> 00:41:29,800 guilty or not guilty? 697 00:41:33,120 --> 00:41:34,280 Not guilty. 698 00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:39,840 On count four, membership of a proscribed organisation, 699 00:41:39,880 --> 00:41:43,280 contrary to Section 11 of the Terrorism Act, 700 00:41:43,320 --> 00:41:48,280 do you find the defendant, Jack Renshaw, guilty or not guilty? 701 00:41:50,120 --> 00:41:51,320 Not guilty. 702 00:41:53,000 --> 00:41:57,680 On the same count, membership of a proscribed organisation, 703 00:41:57,720 --> 00:42:00,840 do you find the defendant, Matthew Hankinson, 704 00:42:00,880 --> 00:42:03,720 guilty or not guilty? 705 00:42:03,760 --> 00:42:05,400 Guilty. 706 00:42:07,400 --> 00:42:11,040 On the same count, membership of a proscribed organisation, 707 00:42:11,080 --> 00:42:14,000 do you find the defendant, Christopher Lythgoe, 708 00:42:14,040 --> 00:42:16,320 guilty or not guilty? 709 00:42:19,360 --> 00:42:21,200 Guilty. 710 00:42:27,080 --> 00:42:31,320 The idea that this country should be purged of its ethnic minorities, 711 00:42:31,360 --> 00:42:33,000 its Jews and homosexuals, 712 00:42:33,040 --> 00:42:37,400 and an ideological revolution imposed on the population by force, 713 00:42:37,440 --> 00:42:40,600 is both insidious and evil. 714 00:42:40,640 --> 00:42:44,520 Only a moment's thought is required to come to the conclusion 715 00:42:44,560 --> 00:42:46,760 that violence and repression 716 00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:49,240 on an unprecedented scale would be needed 717 00:42:49,280 --> 00:42:50,960 to achieve such a reign of terror, 718 00:42:51,000 --> 00:42:55,520 because so many right-minded people would rise up 719 00:42:55,560 --> 00:42:58,680 and oppose these monstrous plans. 720 00:43:13,320 --> 00:43:16,440 All right? Come in. You OK? 721 00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:20,080 Thanks for looking after him during the trial. 722 00:43:20,120 --> 00:43:21,680 Well, he did that himself. 723 00:43:21,720 --> 00:43:24,000 Nobody can persuade him to do anything he don't want to. 724 00:43:25,080 --> 00:43:26,360 All right. 725 00:43:26,400 --> 00:43:28,480 Ah, ta. 726 00:43:30,520 --> 00:43:32,320 Ooh. 727 00:43:35,480 --> 00:43:37,560 So, go on, then. 728 00:43:37,600 --> 00:43:40,000 What did they get? 729 00:43:41,440 --> 00:43:45,600 Renshaw got life with a minimum term of 20 years. 730 00:43:46,960 --> 00:43:49,880 Lythgoe got eight and Hankinson got six. 731 00:43:52,360 --> 00:43:56,840 Rosie Cooper, the MP, she thanked you at the trial. 732 00:43:56,880 --> 00:44:00,600 She gave a statement, saying how grateful she was for what you did. 733 00:44:00,640 --> 00:44:04,040 She's supposed to be meeting us at the House of Commons today. 734 00:44:04,080 --> 00:44:05,480 That's why I came down here, but... 735 00:44:05,520 --> 00:44:07,400 I was going to go along with you, wasn't I? 736 00:44:07,440 --> 00:44:09,680 Mm. Then why aren't yous going? 737 00:44:09,720 --> 00:44:11,880 Well, the police cancelled it this morning, 738 00:44:11,920 --> 00:44:14,680 and they told her she can't meet with Robbie. 739 00:44:14,720 --> 00:44:17,080 Why can't they just leave it be, eh? 740 00:44:17,120 --> 00:44:19,720 My mum's got Ellie and I wanted to do some shopping afterwards. 741 00:44:19,760 --> 00:44:21,320 I was looking forward to it. 742 00:44:21,360 --> 00:44:24,320 That's what happens to people like us, innit? 743 00:44:25,560 --> 00:44:27,680 Right, get your coat. 744 00:44:27,720 --> 00:44:29,600 What? We're going shopping, come on! 745 00:44:29,640 --> 00:44:32,080 We'll get the tube into town. Are you coming, Robbie? 746 00:44:32,120 --> 00:44:33,520 Absolutely not! 747 00:44:33,560 --> 00:44:35,240 Are you sure? 748 00:44:36,280 --> 00:44:37,600 Right. 749 00:44:38,640 --> 00:44:40,880 I'll see you later. Have fun. See you later. 750 00:44:40,920 --> 00:44:42,760 See you later, love. Cheers. 751 00:44:42,800 --> 00:44:45,440 Don't spend too much money! 752 00:44:45,480 --> 00:44:48,640 You don't fancy that, lad, no? No! 753 00:44:49,880 --> 00:44:52,240 I can't think of anything worse, myself. 754 00:44:54,640 --> 00:44:57,440 I don't think they believed a word I said, did they... 755 00:44:57,480 --> 00:44:59,280 the jury? 756 00:44:59,320 --> 00:45:01,040 I told you they wouldn't. 757 00:45:01,080 --> 00:45:03,520 Well, we got the guilty convictions we needed, didn't we? 758 00:45:03,560 --> 00:45:06,120 Got a couple of non-guilties too, though. 759 00:45:06,160 --> 00:45:09,240 Well, either way, they're all in prison, aren't they? 760 00:45:10,960 --> 00:45:13,840 Look, you stopped two women from getting murdered. 761 00:45:13,880 --> 00:45:16,040 Never forget that. 762 00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:22,080 You know, the best bit of the trial for me, Rob, 763 00:45:22,120 --> 00:45:25,440 was when they asked you was you still a racist... 764 00:45:27,200 --> 00:45:29,360 and you said, "Less so." 765 00:45:30,880 --> 00:45:33,080 You know, it's not just all about people like me 766 00:45:33,120 --> 00:45:34,760 being struck by bolts of lightning 767 00:45:34,800 --> 00:45:37,280 and suddenly seeing the world differently. 768 00:45:38,920 --> 00:45:40,600 It's about people like you... 769 00:45:42,160 --> 00:45:44,160 changing just a little bit. 770 00:45:47,960 --> 00:45:51,880 You know, in the words of the late, great Robert Nesta, 771 00:45:51,920 --> 00:45:56,240 "We all have a voice inside us that talks to us 772 00:45:56,280 --> 00:45:59,280 "and that's the voice we must listen to. 773 00:45:59,320 --> 00:46:01,720 "Because in everything you do, 774 00:46:01,760 --> 00:46:04,480 "there's a right way and a wrong way. 775 00:46:04,520 --> 00:46:06,560 "And if you listen good," 776 00:46:06,600 --> 00:46:09,040 "you'll know the right way." 777 00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:12,600 "Less so." 778 00:46:14,280 --> 00:46:17,640 I'll have that, lad. That's progress. 779 00:46:22,720 --> 00:46:25,080 Jo Cox. Thank you, Mr Speaker. 780 00:46:25,120 --> 00:46:28,000 It's a great privilege to be called to make my maiden speech 781 00:46:28,040 --> 00:46:31,760 in this most important of debates, and I congratulate many others 782 00:46:31,800 --> 00:46:34,280 who've made outstanding maiden speeches today as well. 783 00:46:41,440 --> 00:46:44,880 Batley and Spen is a gathering of typically independent, 784 00:46:44,920 --> 00:46:48,520 no-nonsense, proud Yorkshire towns and villages. 785 00:46:48,560 --> 00:46:51,920 Our communities have been deeply enhanced by immigration, 786 00:46:51,960 --> 00:46:54,440 be it Irish Catholics across the constituency, 787 00:46:54,480 --> 00:46:59,240 or Muslims from Indian Gujarat or Pakistan, principally from Kashmir. 788 00:47:06,280 --> 00:47:09,200 And whilst we celebrate our diversity, 789 00:47:09,240 --> 00:47:11,720 the thing that surprises me, time and time again, 790 00:47:11,760 --> 00:47:15,120 as I travel around the constituency, is that we are far more united 791 00:47:15,160 --> 00:47:18,000 and have far more in common than that which divides us. 792 00:47:27,400 --> 00:47:30,000 Subtitles by accessibility@itv.com 60943

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