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One, three and five, but the last part of it...
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HE HUMS
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Oh. Just doesn't sound good.
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If you're in the harmony game, you learn to scorn harmonies like that.
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The harmony game.
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# Hello, darkness, my old friend
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# I've come to talk with you again... #
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Paul Simon and Art Garfunkel made their debut in the harmony game
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over 50 years ago.
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# Left its seeds while I was sleeping... #
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And it was this song, The Sound Of Silence,
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which catapulted them from obscurity to worldwide fame
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in the summer of 1965.
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# Within the sound of silence... #
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They grew up here, in Forest Hills, Queens, a suburb of New York City.
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They were neighbours and classmates at the local primary school.
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And they bonded here at Forest Hills high.
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Barely in their teens, they formed a band,
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and called themselves Tom and Jerry.
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Mindful, perhaps, that a pair of Jewish schlemiels
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called Simon and Garfunkel might not easily catch on.
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Their very first song was recorded in 1957.
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It was called Hey, Schoolgirl, and sold a modest 100,000 records.
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And you can hear echoes of their childhood heroes, The Everly Brothers.
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# Hey, schoolgirl in the second row
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# The teacher's looking over, so I gotta whisper way down low... #
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Their first album was released in October 1964.
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It was a synthesis of folk and rock, called Wednesday Morning, 3AM.
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And it disappeared without trace until one year later,
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one song, The Sound Of Silence, was resurrected and re-released
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with the inspired addition to the original recording
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of bass and drums and an electric guitar.
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# And the sign said the words of the prophets
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# Are written on the subway walls
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# And tenement halls... #
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And the rest, as they say, is history.
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# The sound of silence. #
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Tonight's film is an intimate, insider view
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of Simon and Garfunkel's final and most successful album.
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The miraculous Bridge Over Troubled Water.
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This is a portrait both professional and personal
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of two artists at the very peak of their powers,
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and at the moment of dissolution.
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The album, which was recorded in 1970,
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is a chronicle of the potency and fragility of their time together,
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and a response to a decade in American life
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of unprecedented turmoil and political unrest.
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The combination of the two is what makes Bridge Over Troubled Water
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so eerily powerful and effecting.
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- Did we go on stage before?
- No, no, no.
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Why Don't You Write Me, Feelin' Groovy...
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'With The Graduate becoming a hit and Bookends coming out,'
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at that point, we had four out of the top five albums.
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Feelin' Groovy, Scarborough Fair, Only Living Boy, At The Zoo,
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Emily, Anji, Sound Of Silence.
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'Oh, we were on top of the world, we were lucky sons of guns.
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'Our toes were twinkling.
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'There's nothing that brings out your talent than hit records.
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'It puts you in such a good mood,
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'that you rise to the height of your stuff.
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'You know that girls are available,
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'you know that the world is waiting
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'for the next thing you're going to put out.'
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The kids are doing it again, one year later, how long can this go on?
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Lew Burdette!
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THEY BOTH LAUGH
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'It was a marvellous time for Paul and Artie, and for me,'
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because each day was better than the day before.
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'They kept getting bigger and bigger and bigger.'
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CHEERING AND APPLAUSE
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Approaching the mic was really fun.
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Here comes something I really feel confident with,
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because the world is relating to what we're doing.
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# And here's to you, Mrs Robinson
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# Jesus loves you more than you will know
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# Whoa, whoa, whoa
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# God bless you please, Mrs Robinson
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# Heaven holds a place for those who pray
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# Hey, hey, hey
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# Hey, hey, hey... #
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'After The Graduate, Mrs Robinson, our confidence level was...
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'you know, very high.
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'And we thought, "Hey, why don't we do that?"'
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If we think it's a good idea, probably it is a good idea.
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It's a certain freedom that you get
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when you're, kind of, sitting on top of the world.
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# Stroll around the grounds until you feel at home
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# And here's to you, Mrs Robinson
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# Jesus loves you more than you will know
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# Whoa, whoa, whoa
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# God bless you, please, Mrs Robinson
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# Heaven holds a place for those who pray
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# Hey, hey, hey
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# Hey, hey, hey... #
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'When Simon and Garfunkel,
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'who were not called Simon and Garfunkel at the time,
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'auditioned for Columbia Records,
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'the engineer who was...recorded the audition was Roy Halee.'
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And he said, "If you sign those guys I would love to be the engineer."
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I'd just broken into Columbia Records as a mixer,
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and I was assigned to do their audition.
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And that's how I met them, that's how we started.
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And that was the Wednesday Morning AM album
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which became their first release.
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I was doing practically everybody in Columbia Records in the pop vein.
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In walked these guys, from nowhere, and just knocked me out totally.
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# I can hear the soft breathing of the girl that I love... #
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'I just wanted to work with them.'
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Just, "Put me from now on with Paul and Artie."
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You know. "You can have everybody else."
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Roy Halee was one of the great engineers of his time,
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and, er...and a genius with the echo.
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And he would...
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..play around with echo, you know, all the time.
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You'd come into the studio, he'd say, "Listen to this."
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You know, it was great to work with him.
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He...he was just thinking, and he was involved,
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and he had a tremendous enthusiasm.
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He had great energy.
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'I could actually sense what Paul Simon was thinking.
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'I was always thinking, what would go nicely,
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'what colour would be really beautiful in this song,'
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or very commercial in this song.
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We were, in truth, a threesome,
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and Roy Halee was the driver in many of these things.
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Because at this point in our lives,
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we were moving from the song to the record,
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and the record is sound itself.
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So we were playing with sound.
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That was the age when technologically,
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you could give them an amazing treat in their earphones,
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cranked out loud.
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And so, let's serve them
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the greatest sonic experience we could do.
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There's more than just the song going on.
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There was a certain thing, a chemistry that happened,
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I think, between the three of us. It just clicked.
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They were very comfortable, and I loved the sound.
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I thought... I'm classically trained,
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and I thought the sound was extremely classical-sounding.
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And at the same time, being very pop.
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With Simon and Garfunkel, he really invented, well...
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or he got the sound. And this was the sound.
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We would sing, uh...
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um...a take together on mic, on one mic.
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And when we got the take that we wanted,
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then we would double it, individually.
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I would sing my part individually, on mic,
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and Artie would sing his individually on mic.
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And when you combine them together,
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and they would be, you know, perfectly in sync,
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that's what Simon and Garfunkel sounded like.
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That was what the sound was.
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Without a doubt, that was the sound.
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Many times, I was talked into, by someone, you know,
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"Let's put them on separate tracks
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"so we have control later," you know what I mean?
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And that sound was never the same.
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Once you separated those two voices.
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The way they blended together in one point...
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The harmonic structure or whatever it was was magical.
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THEY HARMONISE
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HE WHISTLES
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# Do-do-do-do-do... #
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I know.
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# Ain't you got no rhymes for me? #
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'We'd do a show, come back to the Holiday Inn, sit on end of the bed.
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'Paul would noodle along with something he's writing,
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'I'd be listening and thinking of the record we're going to make of this.
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'And when three or four of them were ready to be recorded, every few months,
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'we would go in the studio and put 'em down.'
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Basically, I'd come in with a song and a lick and the two of us
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who had already learned our harmony and knew how to do it
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and Roy knew how to do it.
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Nobody gets dragged to the top of the charts.
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We were playing that game in those days.
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Delightfully.
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It was tough for a single would be what I think, but having finished Bookends,
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it was in of itself the beginning of a new album.
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The Boxer was written
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perhaps a year before...
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that album.
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We would go to get certain musicians like Charlie McCoy,
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playing the bass harmonica on The Boxer.
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That was done in Nashville.
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That was before we were all over the place.
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I'd played guitar with Fred Carter Jr.
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He was a really good picker and he made up the lick,
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that starts the top of the thing.
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But we were so locked in together playing this acoustic thing,
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we probably did two or three takes,
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it must have been like 5-6 minutes of straight boom.
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Travis picking locked.
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The harmonics of those two guitars -
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the way they beat against each other - there is a tone,
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beautiful tone that runs through that whole verse.
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# I am just a poor boy
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# Though my story's seldom told
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# I have squandered my resistance
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# For a pocketful of mumbles such are promises
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# All lies and jest
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- # Still a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest.
- #
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We would pitch to Roy as if he was our big brother
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and we were playmates, Paul and I, in the notes, the chords, the changes.
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And we'd serve up ideas to Roy
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and that was one - we went to the church at Columbia.
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We liked the tiled dome. We did our la-la-lahs,
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stacked up in harmony.
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All the la-la-lahs were done in that chapel at Columbia University.
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So this meant the field crew had to go to the chapel,
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set up all the machines. Well, they thought I was totally insane,
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which I probably was.
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# Lie-la-lie
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# Lie-la-la-lie-la-lie
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# La-la-la-la-lie. #
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It has that wordless chorus and, I tried to make up a chorus.
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But I couldn't think of anything,
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so I just left it at the lie-la-lie which is really a...
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one of the best things about it because from country to country,
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people sing that.
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When we went into the studio Artie said he wrote this little instrumental section.
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He sang it and it was really lovely so we said just put it in,
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we'll take that verse out.
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My melody was like a lot of melodies I wrote in our records,
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if you're the harmonist, you're always playing the game of given these chords and that main line,
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what would harmonise with it and stay in the chords.
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And what kind of games can you play with larger and smaller intervals where the melody...
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Bach played the same game.
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And we did it with a... a Bach trumpet, a real high trumpet.
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And a pedal steel, where we would take the attack off
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and blend the sound so that you couldn't tell what the sound was...
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And the mixture of those two sounds,
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I've had people from all over the world, honestly, ask me, what is that sound?
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How did you guys get that sound?
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Roy Halee had a great habit of walking around the studio in LA
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or New York, and he would clap,
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he would walk all over the studio clapping,
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and when he heard a certain echo,
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he would say put the drums here or put the mic here, whatever it was.
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Columbia Records at that time had fabulous hallways.
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Their hallways were their echo chambers.
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They were really, really fine.
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I bet Barbra Streisand's voice is still floating around somewhere in one of those hallways.
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You could put anybody in a hallway,
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those hallways - it was like putting them in a cave, it was incredible.
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He found a place right in front of the elevator doors,
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he said we'd do the overdub right here. I had these massive drums.
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So I set up a chair, headsets,
249
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and I was listening to # la-di-dah #,
250
00:15:50,280 --> 00:15:52,400
Bang! And I was smashing these two drums.
251
00:15:52,400 --> 00:15:56,680
Humongous explosions.
252
00:15:56,680 --> 00:16:03,240
And all in perfect synchronisation as my hands were coming down,
253
00:16:03,240 --> 00:16:06,760
the elevator door opened and there was probably an 85-year-old
254
00:16:06,760 --> 00:16:10,680
security guard standing there who thought he was just killed.
255
00:16:10,680 --> 00:16:15,240
He said "Whoa! what's going on here? What are you guys doing?"
256
00:16:15,240 --> 00:16:18,360
It was really funny. The guy was shocked.
257
00:16:18,360 --> 00:16:21,000
Can you imagine how loud that was!
258
00:16:21,000 --> 00:16:25,000
The Boxer was more, complicated from a technical standpoint.
259
00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:29,240
I could literally write a book on how that was recorded and created.
260
00:16:29,240 --> 00:16:32,680
We ran out of tracks, we had to run machines,
261
00:16:32,680 --> 00:16:34,480
you know, wild track things in,
262
00:16:34,480 --> 00:16:37,160
but can you imagine taking all of this back?
263
00:16:37,160 --> 00:16:39,280
Now we've got to mix this together.
264
00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:44,760
I got Columbia, by the way, to get us a 16 track machine on the strength of -
265
00:16:44,760 --> 00:16:46,920
I swear this is a true story,
266
00:16:46,920 --> 00:16:50,240
bringing Clive Davis into the control room,
267
00:16:50,240 --> 00:16:53,600
played the record for him and showed him how we had to do it.
268
00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:56,400
We got our 16 track machine.
269
00:16:58,680 --> 00:17:02,760
I thought that a record had a capital R from the moment I started making them.
270
00:17:02,760 --> 00:17:06,280
When you go into the studio and you're a kid at first,
271
00:17:06,280 --> 00:17:11,320
if you're 14, these are big concepts, the studio and making records.
272
00:17:11,320 --> 00:17:18,000
If you can put it on record, it might last for a long time if it is very good.
273
00:17:18,000 --> 00:17:26,160
I was one of the members of a group of musicians in Los Angeles, California called the Wrecking Crew.
274
00:17:26,160 --> 00:17:33,120
They were Hollywood's go-to band that made hit records.
275
00:17:33,120 --> 00:17:37,240
They were just astute about what's danceable and fresh.
276
00:17:37,240 --> 00:17:39,480
Somebody must have said along the line,
277
00:17:39,480 --> 00:17:43,720
you've got to try these guys because they are really really good.
278
00:17:43,720 --> 00:17:47,080
Well, they are more than good, you know.
279
00:17:47,080 --> 00:17:51,880
Those musicians, in my experience, were the most creative
280
00:17:51,880 --> 00:17:56,240
and the best players that you could possibly have in a studio.
281
00:17:56,240 --> 00:18:00,240
Roy Halee, who was pretty much on top of his game,
282
00:18:00,240 --> 00:18:03,800
knew the musicians who were making the records and so forth.
283
00:18:03,800 --> 00:18:06,280
You know what was fabulous about Hal too?
284
00:18:06,280 --> 00:18:09,200
The most creative percussionist on the planet.
285
00:18:09,200 --> 00:18:13,600
He would be doing a Sinatra session in the day
286
00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:16,560
and then he would go do a movie score at night
287
00:18:16,560 --> 00:18:20,200
and he would do Phil Spector, then he would come and work with us.
288
00:18:20,200 --> 00:18:22,600
Somehow they got to me.
289
00:18:22,600 --> 00:18:25,480
They wanted me and Joe and Larry.
290
00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:27,160
Joe Osborn and Larry Knechtel.
291
00:18:27,160 --> 00:18:32,320
The three of them, Larry and Joe and Hal worked as a unit very well
292
00:18:32,320 --> 00:18:35,960
and very quickly and understood each other.
293
00:18:35,960 --> 00:18:40,720
Joe and Larry and I - they used to call us the Hollywood Golden Trio.
294
00:18:40,720 --> 00:18:43,520
Or the HGT.
295
00:18:43,520 --> 00:18:49,400
They came from different musical backgrounds.
296
00:18:49,400 --> 00:18:52,240
But they meshed and they played on a lot of records,
297
00:18:52,240 --> 00:18:57,040
all the Mamas and Papas records, the Beach Boys records.
298
00:18:57,040 --> 00:18:59,520
They were the big LA studio band.
299
00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:01,840
I got involved with Paul and Artie
300
00:19:01,840 --> 00:19:05,720
when they started the Bridge Over Troubled Water album.
301
00:19:05,720 --> 00:19:09,120
98% of the time it was the three of us
302
00:19:09,120 --> 00:19:14,200
along with Paul would play and Art would do a scratch vocal
303
00:19:14,200 --> 00:19:18,960
so we got something to play to.
304
00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:22,440
It was basically that rhythm section.
305
00:19:25,520 --> 00:19:28,440
We're rehearsing the band for the concerts next week.
306
00:19:28,440 --> 00:19:31,880
HE HUMS
307
00:19:31,880 --> 00:19:35,960
HE SCATS
308
00:19:43,160 --> 00:19:46,280
# Cathy, I'm lost I said,
309
00:19:46,280 --> 00:19:50,400
# Though I knew she was sleeping. #
310
00:19:50,400 --> 00:19:54,400
This is new for us to be working with a band.
311
00:19:54,400 --> 00:19:58,080
We decided to take along to our concerts, the fellows
312
00:19:58,080 --> 00:20:02,120
who we've been making our records with for the last two years.
313
00:20:02,120 --> 00:20:05,720
These Life Savers were sent up here - whoever sent them, thank you...
314
00:20:05,720 --> 00:20:07,280
LAUGHTER
315
00:20:07,280 --> 00:20:12,760
On that 1969 tape of us being on the road,
316
00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:16,040
bringing in our band on the road for the first time,
317
00:20:16,040 --> 00:20:18,560
there's me on the record saying,
318
00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:22,600
"Here's a song you haven't heard yet" and I'm just so earnest and straightforward.
319
00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:24,440
This is also one of our new songs,
320
00:20:24,440 --> 00:20:27,040
it's called Bridge Over Troubled Water...
321
00:20:30,840 --> 00:20:34,880
'That's the name, folks - you react however you want.'
322
00:20:34,880 --> 00:20:36,920
PIANO INTRO
323
00:20:41,400 --> 00:20:46,080
# When you're weary
324
00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:52,040
# Feelin' small
325
00:20:53,240 --> 00:21:00,960
# When tears are in your eyes
326
00:21:00,960 --> 00:21:05,880
# I will dry them all... #
327
00:21:05,880 --> 00:21:07,800
It was quite amazing,
328
00:21:07,800 --> 00:21:10,960
the first few times that Artie sang Bridge Over Troubled Water,
329
00:21:10,960 --> 00:21:14,040
because people hadn't heard it.
330
00:21:14,040 --> 00:21:15,280
And, you know,
331
00:21:15,280 --> 00:21:18,440
he would say, "Here's a new song that's coming out on our album,"
332
00:21:18,440 --> 00:21:23,320
and he'd sing this song and people would...you know, like, erupt.
333
00:21:23,320 --> 00:21:27,240
'It worked in just about every room I've ever sung it in.
334
00:21:27,240 --> 00:21:30,240
'Small and big. It's a killer song.'
335
00:21:30,240 --> 00:21:39,080
That 1969 live album is a really good album.
336
00:21:40,040 --> 00:21:45,760
Erm... We really were good.
337
00:21:48,360 --> 00:21:53,720
# Tom, get your plane right on time
338
00:21:55,040 --> 00:21:59,680
# I know your part'll go fine
339
00:22:01,000 --> 00:22:07,200
# Fly down to Mexico
340
00:22:07,200 --> 00:22:12,960
# Da-doodin'-da doo-din' da-doodin'-da, and here I am
341
00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:17,600
# The only living boy in New York... #
342
00:22:17,600 --> 00:22:21,760
Well, if there's a theme that goes through Bridge Over Troubled Water
343
00:22:21,760 --> 00:22:24,800
about people leaving, or something like that
344
00:22:24,800 --> 00:22:27,520
it was certainly unintentional.
345
00:22:27,520 --> 00:22:30,720
And the songs were written over...
346
00:22:30,720 --> 00:22:35,440
you know, rather a long period, because The Boxer's on that album
347
00:22:35,440 --> 00:22:39,920
but that was recorded maybe a year or so before
348
00:22:39,920 --> 00:22:42,200
the rest of the album, but
349
00:22:42,200 --> 00:22:44,800
The Only Living Boy In New York
350
00:22:45,800 --> 00:22:53,160
was written about Artie going to make Catch-22 in Mexico.
351
00:22:54,120 --> 00:22:57,040
And "Tom, get your plane right on time" was cos
352
00:22:57,040 --> 00:22:59,760
when we were kids we were Tom and Jerry.
353
00:22:59,760 --> 00:23:04,280
That was our first record. Hey, Schoolgirl - Tom and Jerry.
354
00:23:04,280 --> 00:23:06,760
You've taken me into cheap sentiment.
355
00:23:06,760 --> 00:23:09,840
I don't want to play my friendship with Paul on camera -
356
00:23:09,840 --> 00:23:12,640
it's very deep, very private, and it's full of love.
357
00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:18,000
But yeah, those songs are about a friendship...
358
00:23:18,000 --> 00:23:21,480
I don't know how to talk about it, it's essentially a private,
359
00:23:21,480 --> 00:23:23,240
cherished thing.
360
00:23:23,240 --> 00:23:28,800
# Aaaaah, ah-ah-aaah... #
361
00:23:29,760 --> 00:23:33,480
'The Only Living Boy In New York, where you have all those huge voices,
362
00:23:33,480 --> 00:23:36,520
'that's, I think we sang...
363
00:23:36,520 --> 00:23:41,760
'I think we put, like, 12 or 14 voices on there.'
364
00:23:41,760 --> 00:23:47,160
Singing together. But we literally were standing in the echo chamber,
365
00:23:47,160 --> 00:23:48,840
in LA.
366
00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:53,560
I heard those voices... Rather than in the studio editing echo,
367
00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:56,280
let's go into the echo chamber and try it.
368
00:23:56,280 --> 00:23:59,800
Go physically into this echo chamber, into this room.
369
00:23:59,800 --> 00:24:04,080
We really sang that whole thing right in the echo chamber, and it's...
370
00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:10,200
..it really has a sound, you know. I mean, it really sounds big.
371
00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:15,760
# I know that you've been eager to fly now
372
00:24:16,840 --> 00:24:22,680
# Hey, let your honesty shine, shine, shine now
373
00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:28,160
# Da-doodin'-da doo-din' da-doodin'-da, like it shines on me
374
00:24:29,120 --> 00:24:32,640
# The only living boy in New York
375
00:24:33,600 --> 00:24:37,000
# The only living boy in New York... #
376
00:24:38,720 --> 00:24:41,960
Joe Osborn is the feature on that...
377
00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:44,520
Beside the song itself, obviously.
378
00:24:44,520 --> 00:24:48,360
The featured musician on that song, to me, is Joe Osborn,
379
00:24:48,360 --> 00:24:50,760
with that eight-string bass.
380
00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:55,960
He played an eight-string bass like a...guitar, he played like...
381
00:24:55,960 --> 00:24:57,760
Joe played like a guitar player.
382
00:24:57,760 --> 00:25:03,320
The reason I remember this part so well is I had to re-learn that part
383
00:25:03,320 --> 00:25:06,440
for a show in New York, for Bass Player magazine.
384
00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:11,000
And there would be spots that were very awkward
385
00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:14,120
to play. Going from one chord change to another
386
00:25:14,120 --> 00:25:17,280
would be just...not playable.
387
00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:21,160
And that was because of the parts
388
00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:24,560
that Roy had spliced together from different takes.
389
00:25:24,560 --> 00:25:27,280
Like those slides, and that melody he plays
390
00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:31,560
on that eight-string bass - it's like this big gorgeous horn.
391
00:25:31,560 --> 00:25:35,920
And Larry, of course, with the sustained organ part.
392
00:25:36,960 --> 00:25:38,480
Beautiful.
393
00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:42,560
And Hal, you know, with those drum fills, he used all those
394
00:25:42,560 --> 00:25:46,040
tubular drums - which he had just gotten, by the way,
395
00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:48,040
was just experimenting with them...
396
00:25:48,040 --> 00:25:51,080
You know, those tuned... Big array of drums.
397
00:25:51,080 --> 00:25:55,800
He played that. And of course, the voices in the echo chamber...
398
00:25:55,800 --> 00:25:58,040
Everything just came together beautifully.
399
00:26:01,360 --> 00:26:04,840
El Condor Pasa was a song that I heard
400
00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:08,920
when I was booked to do a week at a theatre in Paris.
401
00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:13,120
And one of the other groups was called Los Incas.
402
00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:15,960
And they played El Condor Pasa,
403
00:26:15,960 --> 00:26:20,120
which I used to hang around every night to hear them play that.
404
00:26:20,120 --> 00:26:24,080
I loved it, and I would play it all the time, and then I thought,
405
00:26:24,080 --> 00:26:27,280
"Why don't I just put words to it?
406
00:26:27,280 --> 00:26:30,080
"The track exists, we don't have to cut it again.
407
00:26:30,080 --> 00:26:33,560
"Let's just see if we can buy the track.
408
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:35,160
"And put words to it."
409
00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:37,920
Which is... And that's exactly what I did,
410
00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:40,400
because the song is hundreds of years old.
411
00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:45,280
It's a traditional Peruvian song,
412
00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:49,240
and almost like a national anthem of South America but certainly of Peru.
413
00:26:49,240 --> 00:26:52,840
I came back from Mexico in the middle of Catch-22
414
00:26:52,840 --> 00:26:55,480
and Paul said, "Listen to this track" -
415
00:26:55,480 --> 00:27:00,760
and played me Los Incas, playing this Peruvian melody.
416
00:27:00,760 --> 00:27:03,000
And I thought, "How magnificent."
417
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:09,520
# I'd rather be a sparrow than a snail
418
00:27:09,520 --> 00:27:12,520
# Yes, I would
419
00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:16,480
# If I could
420
00:27:16,480 --> 00:27:19,880
# I surely would... #
421
00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:23,920
Jorge Milchberg is the leader of that group,
422
00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:26,800
and he played what they call "el charango", I believe,
423
00:27:26,800 --> 00:27:28,560
it's an armadillo.
424
00:27:28,560 --> 00:27:32,840
The outside of an armadillo, with strings. An unbelievable sound.
425
00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:34,840
And then they would play these flutes.
426
00:27:34,840 --> 00:27:38,360
We just had to take the track that existed.
427
00:27:38,360 --> 00:27:41,320
You couldn't remix it or bring anything up, you just...
428
00:27:41,320 --> 00:27:44,440
That was the track, and then you put the voices on top of it.
429
00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:48,480
And Paul had a lyric over the melody,
430
00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:53,560
and I thought, "Wow, what a beautiful, colourful piece."
431
00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:57,920
To place it right after Bridge, is deft, I think.
432
00:27:57,920 --> 00:27:59,960
I enjoy that a lot, that transition.
433
00:27:59,960 --> 00:28:02,840
GUITAR INTRO AND CHEERING
434
00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:12,200
# Bye-bye, love... #
435
00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:15,200
When we were kids, I remember hearing the Everly Brothers,
436
00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:18,520
and we went to buy their record, and in order to buy their record
437
00:28:18,520 --> 00:28:22,400
we had to go get on a bus, get a transfer, get on another bus...
438
00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:27,200
Go all the way into Jamaica, to this record store - buy the record...
439
00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:30,920
Take the two buses back, listen to it,
440
00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:33,320
flip it over and listen to the other side,
441
00:28:33,320 --> 00:28:36,160
try and learn the harmonies...
442
00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:39,920
There's not too many, you know,
443
00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:43,400
singers that I can say I was really a fan.
444
00:28:43,400 --> 00:28:47,480
Bye Bye Love, if I can read us right back in the old days,
445
00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:51,400
sounds exactly like what we felt wanted to be in the album,
446
00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:57,040
to keep this thing full of surprise and variety.
447
00:28:57,040 --> 00:28:59,280
There was nothing like Bye Bye Love -
448
00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:03,280
we knew we did it pretty well from our earliest years.
449
00:29:03,280 --> 00:29:06,840
We brought it into our concerts, we loved that the audience
450
00:29:06,840 --> 00:29:11,240
would do a backbeat to it, and if we got record-making serious,
451
00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:16,360
we could help the 10,000 audience give us a nice, tight backbeat.
452
00:29:16,360 --> 00:29:21,400
And Roy had his machines backstage with the big cables fed in,
453
00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:25,480
and we put down various audiences and picked the best.
454
00:29:27,880 --> 00:29:29,680
I went with them,
455
00:29:29,680 --> 00:29:33,960
we went around to practically every college in the country and recorded.
456
00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:37,080
And all we recorded were the audience clapping.
457
00:29:37,080 --> 00:29:40,520
It was Paul's idea, "Wouldn't it be great,
458
00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:42,720
"instead of just handclaps in the studio,
459
00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:46,720
"let's go out and record an audience clapping."
460
00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:48,360
And that's how it came about.
461
00:29:48,360 --> 00:29:50,680
It's pretty much the way we recorded it,
462
00:29:50,680 --> 00:29:54,200
I think we might have enhanced it with, er...
463
00:29:56,520 --> 00:30:01,040
..handclaps. I think we might have augmented the handclaps and...
464
00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:05,800
..fooled around with the echo kind of things.
465
00:30:05,800 --> 00:30:12,480
But essentially that was a live recording,
466
00:30:12,480 --> 00:30:18,800
and a tribute to Don and Phil, those guys were our heroes, you know.
467
00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:21,080
And eventually we got to perform with them
468
00:30:21,080 --> 00:30:24,720
when we did the reunion tour in 2003.
469
00:30:24,720 --> 00:30:27,080
That was great.
470
00:30:30,280 --> 00:30:33,920
We loved, you know, playing with them.
471
00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:39,840
CHEERING AND APPLAUSE
472
00:30:41,120 --> 00:30:43,800
- NEWSREADER:
- In a scene described by one investigator
473
00:30:43,800 --> 00:30:46,160
as reminiscent of a weird religious rite,
474
00:30:46,160 --> 00:30:48,440
five persons, including actress Sharon Tate,
475
00:30:48,440 --> 00:30:51,040
were found dead at the home of Ms Tate and her husband,
476
00:30:51,040 --> 00:30:52,520
director Roman Polanski.
477
00:30:52,520 --> 00:30:55,800
We were living in this house on Blue Jay Way,
478
00:30:55,800 --> 00:30:59,800
that George wrote his song about, the summer of the Manson murders.
479
00:31:02,440 --> 00:31:06,800
And the town was really tense, especially up around there.
480
00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:13,280
And we were sitting around one night, my brother and Artie and me,
481
00:31:13,280 --> 00:31:16,800
and I think another friend, or two or three other friends,
482
00:31:16,800 --> 00:31:18,600
maybe six or seven people.
483
00:31:18,600 --> 00:31:21,840
Sort of just, you know, hanging out partying,
484
00:31:21,840 --> 00:31:28,920
and we started, like, pounding on things and making a rhythm.
485
00:31:28,920 --> 00:31:30,720
That is a vivid memory
486
00:31:30,720 --> 00:31:36,640
and it really comes through the cockles of the mind so easily.
487
00:31:36,640 --> 00:31:38,560
Why do I know that one so well?
488
00:31:38,560 --> 00:31:41,840
It was just so infectious from the start.
489
00:31:41,840 --> 00:31:46,840
We liked our Sony Sound On Sound tape recorder, big silver thing.
490
00:31:46,840 --> 00:31:49,520
Once we kicked on the reverb button,
491
00:31:49,520 --> 00:31:52,840
it gave you a kickback of every sound, quite loud and pronounced,
492
00:31:52,840 --> 00:31:55,960
and the kickback was a good quarter of a second.
493
00:31:55,960 --> 00:31:59,400
So you could play your Levi's on your thighs with your hands,
494
00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:01,720
as Paul and I did, into that rhythm,
495
00:32:01,720 --> 00:32:05,920
and work out a little pattern which has an accentuation to it.
496
00:32:05,920 --> 00:32:10,720
PERCUSSIVE INTRO TO CECILIA PLAYS
497
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:16,160
When the thighs had a pattern,
498
00:32:16,160 --> 00:32:19,800
and Paul's brother Ed was just giving us a solid 4/4
499
00:32:19,800 --> 00:32:22,880
on the piano bench, cos it's just a little cushioned,
500
00:32:22,880 --> 00:32:25,480
"Doo, doo, doo, doo."
501
00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:27,360
We were starting to like it.
502
00:32:27,360 --> 00:32:31,200
Stuey Scharf, our friend from the east,
503
00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:34,480
played a junky guitar that was around the house,
504
00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:37,280
with its strings tuned out, and he gave you a,
505
00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:39,320
"chun, ba-ba dum, ba-ba dum,
506
00:32:39,320 --> 00:32:42,160
"Ah, chun, ba-ba dum, ba-ba dum, ah."
507
00:32:42,160 --> 00:32:46,200
That was a wonderful quirky spike in our pattern.
508
00:32:46,200 --> 00:32:49,600
So we did that all night long or for a couple hours.
509
00:32:49,600 --> 00:32:52,360
Perhaps we lost track of time.
510
00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:57,640
And listening back to it,
511
00:32:57,640 --> 00:33:00,760
there was a section of about a minute and 15 seconds
512
00:33:00,760 --> 00:33:05,120
that was such a good groove that I said to Roy,
513
00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:08,880
"This minute and 15 seconds is so great
514
00:33:08,880 --> 00:33:12,480
"we should make a loop out of it."
515
00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:15,400
So, I mean, this is the days of analogue,
516
00:33:15,400 --> 00:33:17,320
so to make a loop out of it,
517
00:33:17,320 --> 00:33:20,920
you literally had to have a loop of tape
518
00:33:20,920 --> 00:33:27,640
between tape machines, and this minute and 15 seconds got repeated
519
00:33:27,640 --> 00:33:34,160
and became the rhythmic basis of it.
520
00:33:34,160 --> 00:33:37,840
They brought it back down to the studio and I said, "Woo!
521
00:33:37,840 --> 00:33:41,240
"We can do all kinds of things with this with reverb,"
522
00:33:41,240 --> 00:33:45,320
I love to play around with different reverbs and delays, which we did.
523
00:33:45,320 --> 00:33:47,080
"Chuk-achucka, chuk-achucka,"
524
00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:49,960
you know. And then the creative process started.
525
00:33:49,960 --> 00:33:53,000
# Cecilia
526
00:33:53,000 --> 00:33:55,080
# You're breaking my heart
527
00:33:55,080 --> 00:33:59,280
# You're shaking my confidence daily
528
00:33:59,280 --> 00:34:01,880
# Oh, Cecilia
529
00:34:01,880 --> 00:34:03,520
# I'm down on my knees... #
530
00:34:03,520 --> 00:34:07,240
And then just play the simple guitar.
531
00:34:07,240 --> 00:34:10,640
I don't when I wrote the song or how I wrote the song.
532
00:34:12,920 --> 00:34:20,040
Cecilia is the goddess of music. Anyway, I had the song.
533
00:34:20,040 --> 00:34:22,440
We sang it and it sounded like that straight away.
534
00:34:22,440 --> 00:34:25,080
We said, "Wow, that's...that's, you know, that's...
535
00:34:27,880 --> 00:34:30,520
"That's pretty hooky with a really good rhythm."
536
00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:34,240
# Making love in the afternoon
537
00:34:34,240 --> 00:34:36,200
# With Cecilia
538
00:34:36,200 --> 00:34:39,320
# Up in my bedroom
539
00:34:39,320 --> 00:34:40,400
# Making love
540
00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:43,880
# I got up to wash my face
541
00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:49,120
# When I come back to bed someone's taken my place... #
542
00:34:49,120 --> 00:34:54,200
I ran into a soldier coming back from Vietnam.
543
00:34:54,200 --> 00:34:56,280
He said, "When we heard that record,
544
00:34:56,280 --> 00:35:00,040
"we knew things were really changed in the States."
545
00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:04,600
Just that line. He said, "Woah, man. You can say that in a song now?
546
00:35:04,600 --> 00:35:08,520
"It's like a different country." Which never occurred to me.
547
00:35:08,520 --> 00:35:13,240
To me it was like an old joke. It seemed like some old joke.
548
00:35:13,240 --> 00:35:20,000
We went to the parquet floor of Columbia's Gower Street.
549
00:35:20,000 --> 00:35:27,000
Big studio, in '69. This is where you would have gone in Hollywood.
550
00:35:27,000 --> 00:35:33,200
There were no strings. It was Paul and I with bunches of drumsticks.
551
00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:35,400
We dropped them on the parquet floor.
552
00:35:35,400 --> 00:35:39,560
That was wonderfully ticky-tacky. That went into the record.
553
00:35:39,560 --> 00:35:41,320
In the mid-range.
554
00:35:41,320 --> 00:35:44,480
Then we sent Paul out on the xylophone that was
555
00:35:44,480 --> 00:35:46,320
hanging around the studio.
556
00:35:46,320 --> 00:35:48,560
He doesn't play xylophone but we said,
557
00:35:48,560 --> 00:35:53,080
"If Roy compresses the sound so that tonality is bleached out,
558
00:35:53,080 --> 00:35:55,880
"it doesn't matter what notes you play."
559
00:35:55,880 --> 00:35:58,520
# Oh, oh-oh,oh,oh
560
00:35:58,520 --> 00:36:02,960
# Oh, oh-oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh
561
00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:05,000
# Oh, oh-oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh... #
562
00:36:05,000 --> 00:36:07,960
In that particular case, that was a fun thing. That was like, "Wheee!
563
00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:09,360
"Let's have fun."
564
00:36:09,360 --> 00:36:14,360
But I still think they worked on one mic
565
00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:18,160
because I was so...obsessed with that.
566
00:36:18,160 --> 00:36:22,480
I really was. It was like an obsession. "What do you mean? No.
567
00:36:22,480 --> 00:36:23,720
"We can't do that!"
568
00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:28,040
Fun.
569
00:36:28,040 --> 00:36:32,920
When they were out in California in '68, they met Chuck Grodin.
570
00:36:34,920 --> 00:36:42,200
They also met at that time two television producers who
571
00:36:42,200 --> 00:36:49,680
laid out to them a marvellous format for them to present their music
572
00:36:49,680 --> 00:36:51,680
and a television special.
573
00:36:51,680 --> 00:36:54,880
I had met Art Garfunkel when we did Catch 22,
574
00:36:54,880 --> 00:37:00,720
I guess somewhere in the year prior to Songs Of America.
575
00:37:00,720 --> 00:37:05,720
My previous experience writing and directing in television was
576
00:37:05,720 --> 00:37:09,520
that I had been fired three times over a six-week period
577
00:37:09,520 --> 00:37:12,680
from Candid Camera.
578
00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:14,960
That was my total background.
579
00:37:14,960 --> 00:37:17,560
Hardly somebody who would be chosen to write and direct
580
00:37:17,560 --> 00:37:19,960
the Simon and Garfunkel special, the only one.
581
00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:23,280
At the peak of their fame, when Bridge Over Troubled Water.
582
00:37:23,280 --> 00:37:26,360
I had this idea, which I presented to Paul and Art
583
00:37:26,360 --> 00:37:30,400
that this special should reflect how it influenced what
584
00:37:30,400 --> 00:37:34,400
Paul was writing about - the Vietnam War, the Poor People's March,
585
00:37:34,400 --> 00:37:37,160
equal rights for people and how this feeds in to his songs,
586
00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:39,240
one way or another.
587
00:37:41,440 --> 00:37:44,400
Chuck had a take on helping with our show and was the director
588
00:37:44,400 --> 00:37:47,920
and stamping its nature.
589
00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:51,680
It has a lot of heart, it has a lot of sociological awareness.
590
00:37:51,680 --> 00:37:54,680
# Cathy, I'm lost, I said
591
00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:58,600
# Though I knew she was sleeping
592
00:38:00,520 --> 00:38:06,840
# I'm empty and aching and I don't know why
593
00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:10,400
# Counting the cars on the New Jersey Turnpike
594
00:38:10,400 --> 00:38:17,440
# They've all come too far, America
595
00:38:17,440 --> 00:38:24,160
# All come too far, America... #
596
00:38:25,480 --> 00:38:28,160
AT&T was the sponsor. I'd laid out for them.
597
00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:31,920
Every single thing that you see in the final version of
598
00:38:31,920 --> 00:38:33,960
this Songs Of America.
599
00:38:33,960 --> 00:38:35,720
Poor People's March, Cesar Chavez.
600
00:38:35,720 --> 00:38:40,640
Paul and I visited with Cesar Chavez, it was all down on paper.
601
00:38:40,640 --> 00:38:41,960
When it was finished,
602
00:38:41,960 --> 00:38:46,000
they sent their representative from NW Ayer Advertising
603
00:38:46,000 --> 00:38:47,400
and he was furious.
604
00:38:47,400 --> 00:38:48,960
He was livid at me.
605
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:50,800
I was alone in a room with him and he said,
606
00:38:50,800 --> 00:38:55,960
"You're using OUR money to sell YOUR ideology."
607
00:38:55,960 --> 00:38:58,800
I was 34 years old. I looked like I was 26.
608
00:38:59,960 --> 00:39:04,200
I really had no idea what he meant. I said, "What's my ideology?"
609
00:39:04,200 --> 00:39:06,480
He said, "Humanistic approach."
610
00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:12,720
I said, "You mean there are people against the humanistic approach?"
611
00:39:12,720 --> 00:39:15,440
He said, "You're goddamn right there are.
612
00:39:15,440 --> 00:39:18,320
"The southern affiliates of AT&T are not going to appreciate
613
00:39:18,320 --> 00:39:20,840
"seeing black and white kids going to school together.
614
00:39:20,840 --> 00:39:22,240
"They're not going to appreciate it.
615
00:39:22,240 --> 00:39:26,160
"This is going to offend a lot of AT&T southern affiliates."
616
00:39:26,160 --> 00:39:28,120
I thought I had just left the world.
617
00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:32,440
I think we were naive kids from the northeast who thought
618
00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:36,040
that's the way the world was and everybody thought that way.
619
00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:37,240
But they didn't.
620
00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:42,240
I must remind you that starving a child is violence.
621
00:39:44,320 --> 00:39:46,920
Suppressing a culture is violence.
622
00:39:48,960 --> 00:39:52,280
Neglecting school children is violence.
623
00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:56,920
Punishing a mother and her family is violence.
624
00:39:56,920 --> 00:40:00,560
This was a big awakening to me - the humanistic approach.
625
00:40:00,560 --> 00:40:04,080
Then they said, "We'd like you to make some changes."
626
00:40:04,080 --> 00:40:05,440
I said, "Like what?"
627
00:40:05,440 --> 00:40:09,320
"When Coretta King says poverty is a child without an education.
628
00:40:09,320 --> 00:40:14,280
"I'd like you to lower the volume on that." "I said, "To what level?"
629
00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:16,200
He said, "Inaudible."
630
00:40:16,200 --> 00:40:22,600
# I'd rather be a sparrow than a snail
631
00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:25,520
# Yes, I would
632
00:40:25,520 --> 00:40:28,360
# If I could
633
00:40:28,360 --> 00:40:32,480
# I surely would
634
00:40:32,480 --> 00:40:34,080
# Hmm-mm... #
635
00:40:34,080 --> 00:40:38,080
The sponsor, which was AT&T, really disliked it
636
00:40:38,080 --> 00:40:44,240
and withdrew their sponsorship, after having paid for the whole thing.
637
00:40:44,240 --> 00:40:47,080
The powers of centralised America had to find a mesh with
638
00:40:47,080 --> 00:40:53,680
how much Simon and Garfunkel want to talk about poverty in America.
639
00:40:53,680 --> 00:40:59,880
What our take is of the Vietnam War. That's essential to the show.
640
00:40:59,880 --> 00:41:02,800
We would hear a very interesting behind the scenes
641
00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:07,600
confrontation with Simon and Garfunkel and America as it was.
642
00:41:07,600 --> 00:41:11,360
Good evening. I'm Robert Ryan.
643
00:41:11,360 --> 00:41:13,360
Tonight, the Alberto-Culver company,
644
00:41:13,360 --> 00:41:17,800
makers of the famous Alberto VO5 products, bring you
645
00:41:17,800 --> 00:41:22,720
Simon and Garfunkel and their first TV special, Songs Of America.
646
00:41:22,720 --> 00:41:24,600
These two young men have attracted
647
00:41:24,600 --> 00:41:27,600
a tremendous following among the youth of America with
648
00:41:27,600 --> 00:41:30,240
their lyrical interpretation of the world we live in.
649
00:41:30,240 --> 00:41:33,520
Alberto-Culver just came up with 860,000
650
00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:37,320
and they had Robert Ryan, the late actor Robert Ryan,
651
00:41:37,320 --> 00:41:42,560
he came on before with a kind of apology, explaining, we feel that
652
00:41:42,560 --> 00:41:47,360
these two artists have earned the right to have their voices heard.
653
00:41:47,360 --> 00:41:50,320
It was like, "Don't look at me, boss.
654
00:41:50,320 --> 00:41:52,080
"We feel they've earned the right."
655
00:41:52,080 --> 00:41:57,920
By the end of the first commercial, the Robert Kennedy funeral train,
656
00:41:57,920 --> 00:42:01,000
one million people shut off the television set.
657
00:42:01,000 --> 00:42:04,320
One million people shut it off right there. They didn't want to see this.
658
00:42:04,320 --> 00:42:07,360
They thought they were getting a straight entertainment special
659
00:42:07,360 --> 00:42:08,600
and it was political.
660
00:42:08,600 --> 00:42:15,480
It was anti-war and it was. I guess it was liberal.
661
00:42:24,280 --> 00:42:27,840
# When you're weary
662
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:32,480
# Feeling small
663
00:42:34,480 --> 00:42:40,320
# When tears are in your eyes
664
00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:43,880
# I will dry them all
665
00:42:46,000 --> 00:42:48,960
It was the first time that Bridge Over Troubled Water was played
666
00:42:48,960 --> 00:42:54,120
and was played over footage of the trains that carried Jack Kennedy
667
00:42:54,120 --> 00:42:57,160
and Bobby Kennedy and Martin Luther King funeral
668
00:42:57,160 --> 00:43:01,240
so it was played over those three people.
669
00:43:01,240 --> 00:43:05,120
The sponsor said, "It isn't balanced."
670
00:43:05,120 --> 00:43:08,160
We said, "What isn't balanced about it?"
671
00:43:08,160 --> 00:43:10,960
They said, "Well, they're all Democrats."
672
00:43:10,960 --> 00:43:15,520
We said, "We think of them all as assassinated people, you know."
673
00:43:15,520 --> 00:43:18,120
# I will lay me down
674
00:43:18,120 --> 00:43:25,680
# Like a bridge over troubled water
675
00:43:25,680 --> 00:43:31,840
# I will lay me down... #
676
00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:39,800
We got a telegram from Ethel Kennedy after that.
677
00:43:39,800 --> 00:43:42,680
This is after Robert Kennedy had been assassinated.
678
00:43:42,680 --> 00:43:47,960
She appreciated that there were people out there...who were
679
00:43:47,960 --> 00:43:53,040
interested in people who needed somebody to reach out to them.
680
00:43:53,040 --> 00:43:59,840
We got hate mail. That was like the time of America, love it or leave it.
681
00:43:59,840 --> 00:44:04,080
We got plenty of that. "You don't like it here, get out."
682
00:44:04,080 --> 00:44:08,040
As far as the show did that night, it got killed by a Peggy Fleming
683
00:44:08,040 --> 00:44:12,640
ice skating special, which will tell you where the country
684
00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:18,440
was at much more than anything else that I can say.
685
00:44:18,440 --> 00:44:23,200
I guess, in retrospect, that's something to be proud of
686
00:44:23,200 --> 00:44:28,680
because we spoke up for who we were in our generation.
687
00:44:30,320 --> 00:44:31,800
That's who we were.
688
00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:35,520
We're staying in the Beverly Wilshire Hotel.
689
00:44:35,520 --> 00:44:37,760
I'd get my guitar and I'd head downstairs.
690
00:44:37,760 --> 00:44:40,600
I'd get in the elevator to go to the studio.
691
00:44:40,600 --> 00:44:43,480
In the elevators, they have newspapers.
692
00:44:43,480 --> 00:44:48,720
I'd see the headlines on the newspapers and I'd think,
693
00:44:48,720 --> 00:44:51,280
"Why am I going to make this album?
694
00:44:51,280 --> 00:44:54,200
"What's the point in this album, the world is crumbling?"
695
00:44:55,720 --> 00:44:58,960
Beethoven's, uh...
696
00:44:58,960 --> 00:45:01,680
..200th birthday is coming up, did you know that?
697
00:45:01,680 --> 00:45:05,080
Beethoven was writing this part,
698
00:45:05,080 --> 00:45:10,720
and parallel fifths were scorned, ironically.
699
00:45:10,720 --> 00:45:16,280
Beethoven said, "Where is there a law that says you can't write in parallel fifths?
700
00:45:16,280 --> 00:45:18,040
"Where did that law come from?
701
00:45:18,040 --> 00:45:21,440
"I'm writing parallel fifths, I say you can."
702
00:45:25,040 --> 00:45:26,760
He was a fool, Beethoven.
703
00:45:29,560 --> 00:45:32,880
Somebody else's 200th birthday is coming up in not so long.
704
00:45:32,880 --> 00:45:35,200
- 200th birthday?
- Yeah.
- Who's that?
705
00:45:35,200 --> 00:45:36,720
Americas.
706
00:45:41,000 --> 00:45:43,400
Think it's going to make it?
707
00:45:43,400 --> 00:45:47,040
For me, most of all, it has the vibe between Simon and Garfunkel,
708
00:45:47,040 --> 00:45:51,200
and when I look at it nowadays I go, "Gee, we were so bonded.
709
00:45:51,200 --> 00:45:56,840
"Our sense of humour is inside, we knew each other, what we're talking about."
710
00:45:58,600 --> 00:46:03,120
It comes off nice on-screen, it's like a scrapbook photo for me,
711
00:46:03,120 --> 00:46:06,000
it warms my heart to see this early Paul and Artie.
712
00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:08,560
My favourite moment is I'm sitting off-camera,
713
00:46:08,560 --> 00:46:11,400
I asked Paul if he had any other aspiration, "Like what?"
714
00:46:11,400 --> 00:46:14,320
I said, "Well, would you ever think of running for office?
715
00:46:14,320 --> 00:46:16,080
"You know, be President?"
716
00:46:16,080 --> 00:46:18,640
Oh, I don't know.
717
00:46:18,640 --> 00:46:20,320
Some days.
718
00:46:25,240 --> 00:46:27,200
Why are you smiling?
719
00:46:27,200 --> 00:46:31,200
- Some days you'd like to be President?
- Some days I wouldn't want to be President.
720
00:46:31,200 --> 00:46:35,000
What do you feel like the days you want to be President, why would you want to be?
721
00:46:35,000 --> 00:46:37,280
Straighten it all out.
722
00:46:37,280 --> 00:46:40,120
And get on back to my songwriting in peace!
723
00:46:43,480 --> 00:46:47,720
I would like to develop myself as an artist, as much as I could.
724
00:46:49,200 --> 00:46:53,120
And to be President, I just don't have time, really I don't.
725
00:46:53,120 --> 00:46:56,080
See, he wants to develop himself as an artist, Chuck.
726
00:46:56,080 --> 00:46:58,600
You have no time to be President?
727
00:46:58,600 --> 00:47:00,800
I feel I'd make the time.
728
00:47:00,800 --> 00:47:02,560
LAUGHTER
729
00:47:05,000 --> 00:47:08,600
You're singing against a B minor and B major on the track,
730
00:47:08,600 --> 00:47:11,360
- so I don't suggest you chord this...
- OK, what do we have?
731
00:47:11,360 --> 00:47:15,040
..it's going to be very dissonant, so what I suggest is you hold the F sharp.
732
00:47:15,040 --> 00:47:17,400
SINGING WITH PIANO
733
00:47:25,360 --> 00:47:28,800
- Did you get that, Mac?
- Yeah, that's around 23.
- Right.
734
00:47:28,800 --> 00:47:33,640
'So Long, Frank Lloyd Wright' was kind of interesting,
735
00:47:33,640 --> 00:47:37,400
the changes, the chord changes, because it's a Brazilian influence,
736
00:47:37,400 --> 00:47:41,240
but I don't know, really, how I did it.
737
00:47:47,680 --> 00:47:51,000
When I got the call to work on 'Bridge Over Troubled Water'
738
00:47:51,000 --> 00:47:54,200
they called me to work on 'Keep The Customer Satisfied'
739
00:47:54,200 --> 00:47:56,480
and 'So Long, Frank Lloyd Wright'.
740
00:47:56,480 --> 00:47:58,160
MUSIC PLAYS
741
00:47:58,160 --> 00:48:00,160
Love it.
742
00:48:00,160 --> 00:48:01,800
Love it, love it love it.
743
00:48:05,680 --> 00:48:09,760
I think it's a string quartet, it's kind of buried, as I recall,
744
00:48:09,760 --> 00:48:14,520
but very tasty - Jimmy's a fine musician, you know, a fine musician.
745
00:48:19,000 --> 00:48:20,360
That's it, we got it.
746
00:48:20,360 --> 00:48:23,400
'Artie was an architecture major at Columbia.'
747
00:48:23,400 --> 00:48:24,720
Yes, Mort.
748
00:48:24,720 --> 00:48:28,440
All right, I've had an interesting afternoon.
749
00:48:28,440 --> 00:48:32,720
And he loved Frank Lloyd Wright, so it was 'So Long, Frank Lloyd Wright'.
750
00:48:32,720 --> 00:48:34,120
You hear me on the end of it?
751
00:48:34,120 --> 00:48:36,920
# So long already... #
752
00:48:36,920 --> 00:48:40,320
So long, already, Artie!
753
00:48:40,320 --> 00:48:41,840
It's in the fade.
754
00:48:41,840 --> 00:48:47,680
You listen to it and you'll hear Artie, riffing over and over again,
755
00:48:47,680 --> 00:48:51,280
and this voice way in the distance saying,
756
00:48:51,280 --> 00:48:53,600
"So long already, Artie!"
757
00:48:54,880 --> 00:48:57,680
I'm out in LA and Paul said,
758
00:48:57,680 --> 00:49:02,160
"I've written what I think is my greatest song,
759
00:49:02,160 --> 00:49:05,240
"and I want to play it for you."
760
00:49:05,240 --> 00:49:06,960
And I'm sitting in a chair,
761
00:49:06,960 --> 00:49:10,480
and he played 'Bridge Over Troubled Water'.
762
00:49:10,480 --> 00:49:17,400
And, you know, if your around the music business all your life,
763
00:49:17,400 --> 00:49:20,760
every now and then, maybe once a decade,
764
00:49:20,760 --> 00:49:27,360
you'll hear a song that's so striking, so powerful, so unusual,
765
00:49:27,360 --> 00:49:30,960
and 'Bridge Over Troubled Water' was that for me.
766
00:49:32,040 --> 00:49:34,880
I have no idea where it came from.
767
00:49:37,120 --> 00:49:42,280
It just came all of a sudden, you know.
768
00:49:42,280 --> 00:49:47,000
One minute it wasn't there, and the next minute the whole line was there.
769
00:49:47,000 --> 00:49:49,240
It was one of the shocking...
770
00:49:51,360 --> 00:49:56,400
..one of the shocking moments in my songwriting career, you know.
771
00:49:56,400 --> 00:50:00,040
And at the time I remember thinking, "This is really...
772
00:50:01,280 --> 00:50:04,200
"..considerably better than I usually write."
773
00:50:05,200 --> 00:50:06,840
But that is how fast it came.
774
00:50:06,840 --> 00:50:10,000
HUMMING NOTES TO 'Bridge Over Troubled Water'
775
00:50:18,360 --> 00:50:23,320
All of a sudden I sang that line and I sort of just stopped.
776
00:50:23,320 --> 00:50:25,360
And then I sang it twice.
777
00:50:25,360 --> 00:50:27,440
I said, "Oh, you can sing it twice in a row."
778
00:50:27,440 --> 00:50:32,000
But that's a pretty long melody, especially for a pop song.
779
00:50:33,760 --> 00:50:37,680
And then I wrote the lyrics, and then I showed the lyrics to...
780
00:50:37,680 --> 00:50:41,440
I said to Artie, "I wrote this song and I think you should sing it."
781
00:50:41,440 --> 00:50:44,160
The hold damn song is a gem.
782
00:50:44,160 --> 00:50:48,400
I love running through the line from top to bottom
783
00:50:48,400 --> 00:50:51,400
and delivering Paul's intentions.
784
00:50:51,400 --> 00:50:58,040
"If you're down and out, let my lucky gift of a voice be a friend."
785
00:50:58,040 --> 00:50:59,680
"Lucky gift."
786
00:50:59,680 --> 00:51:04,040
You shake out the human condition so you can be as honest as you can
787
00:51:04,040 --> 00:51:06,520
about these beautifully written words.
788
00:51:06,520 --> 00:51:09,480
The first thoughts were, those lyrics are too simple.
789
00:51:09,480 --> 00:51:15,320
They're very - "When you're weary, when you're feeling small,
790
00:51:15,320 --> 00:51:22,000
"when evening falls so hard, I'll comfort you, I'll take your part" -
791
00:51:22,000 --> 00:51:23,720
they're just too simple.
792
00:51:24,760 --> 00:51:29,800
And, of course, that's what really made it...
793
00:51:29,800 --> 00:51:32,120
..so universal.
794
00:51:35,440 --> 00:51:38,840
I remember distinctly, Paul coming in the control room and he said,
795
00:51:38,840 --> 00:51:43,440
"I think I've wrote something really over the top, this is really good."
796
00:51:43,440 --> 00:51:47,600
And he sat and he played it and sang.
797
00:51:47,600 --> 00:51:49,680
And that's how it started.
798
00:51:49,680 --> 00:51:53,280
# When you're weary
799
00:51:53,280 --> 00:51:57,480
# Feeling sad
800
00:51:57,480 --> 00:52:04,120
# When peace is all you seek
801
00:52:04,120 --> 00:52:10,880
# I will be there, whooo
802
00:52:10,880 --> 00:52:16,480
# To bring you sleep... #
803
00:52:18,040 --> 00:52:22,320
Artie and I, and Roy Halee, were working with Larry Knechtel.
804
00:52:22,320 --> 00:52:25,680
Larry Knechtel was the piano player.
805
00:52:25,680 --> 00:52:29,960
And we spent two or maybe three days...
806
00:52:31,320 --> 00:52:35,360
..just making up the piano parts - because I wrote it on guitar.
807
00:52:38,040 --> 00:52:42,240
I showed Larry the song and he -
808
00:52:42,240 --> 00:52:47,920
mostly Larry, but all of us - sort of combined
809
00:52:47,920 --> 00:52:52,200
to make up what it is that we heard in terms of gospel piano.
810
00:52:52,200 --> 00:52:54,640
I sat at the piano at the end of each verse
811
00:52:54,640 --> 00:52:58,520
of Bridge Over Troubled Water and said, "Let's work out how we turn around."
812
00:52:58,520 --> 00:53:01,440
After the Like A Bridge Over Troubled Water set twice,
813
00:53:01,440 --> 00:53:07,200
how are we going to come around chord-wise to the quiet set-up of the next verse?
814
00:53:07,200 --> 00:53:11,120
So here was this piano piece that he wrote
815
00:53:11,120 --> 00:53:15,600
and it was, you know, beautifully written.
816
00:53:15,600 --> 00:53:22,160
Fortunately for us, he had an extensive knowledge of gospel music
817
00:53:22,160 --> 00:53:29,000
because we hadn't used him in that capacity before.
818
00:53:29,000 --> 00:53:32,040
In fact, he plays bass on a bunch of our records.
819
00:53:32,040 --> 00:53:35,560
Larry Knechtel had already put his part on.
820
00:53:35,560 --> 00:53:39,160
He and Art went in and did the piano part.
821
00:53:40,680 --> 00:53:45,720
And then we went in with the bass and drums and did overdub to that.
822
00:53:45,720 --> 00:53:52,040
And then we overdubbed the strings in the big studio in Hollywood.
823
00:53:52,040 --> 00:53:54,440
Ernie Freeman did the arrangement.
824
00:53:54,440 --> 00:53:56,600
I sent a demo to the arranger
825
00:53:56,600 --> 00:54:00,160
and the arranger came back and handed it out to everybody
826
00:54:00,160 --> 00:54:02,760
and it said on it, "Like A Pitcher of Water."
827
00:54:02,760 --> 00:54:06,480
You know? We said, "What is this?"
828
00:54:06,480 --> 00:54:09,560
He said, "Well, that's the song."
829
00:54:09,560 --> 00:54:13,280
So I thought, "Well...
830
00:54:13,280 --> 00:54:16,120
"that's how much attention he's paid to this demo -
831
00:54:16,120 --> 00:54:19,720
"he didn't even hear the words right!"
832
00:54:19,720 --> 00:54:21,720
He just heard "Like A Pitcher of Water."
833
00:54:21,720 --> 00:54:24,360
So I still have that framed at home.
834
00:54:24,360 --> 00:54:28,040
Then we went back to New York and we worked on Artie's vocal.
835
00:54:28,040 --> 00:54:32,000
That was the last thing we did - we went and worked on Artie's vocal.
836
00:54:32,000 --> 00:54:33,680
And here it goes.
837
00:54:33,680 --> 00:54:37,440
'That was his time to really show his chops.'
838
00:54:37,440 --> 00:54:41,360
# When you're weary. #
839
00:54:41,360 --> 00:54:45,000
The fact is from the moment I locked on to that melody
840
00:54:45,000 --> 00:54:46,880
and the fun of singing,
841
00:54:46,880 --> 00:54:49,320
it was a thunderous reaction.
842
00:54:49,320 --> 00:54:51,080
It always has been.
843
00:54:51,080 --> 00:54:56,520
# When tears are in your eyes
844
00:54:56,520 --> 00:54:58,880
# I will dry them all. #
845
00:54:58,880 --> 00:55:03,320
Art sang the song very powerfully.
846
00:55:03,320 --> 00:55:06,200
I heard Art do the song at the vocal mic,
847
00:55:06,200 --> 00:55:08,960
getting the sound for the mic
848
00:55:08,960 --> 00:55:13,160
and sung Bridge Over Troubled Water...
849
00:55:13,160 --> 00:55:16,880
a cappella and it was chill bumps.
850
00:55:16,880 --> 00:55:23,680
# ..And friends just can't be found
851
00:55:23,680 --> 00:55:31,920
# Like a bridge over troubled water
852
00:55:31,920 --> 00:55:36,400
# I will lay me down
853
00:55:36,400 --> 00:55:44,080
# Like a bridge over troubled water
854
00:55:44,080 --> 00:55:50,120
# I will lay me down. #
855
00:55:51,160 --> 00:55:53,800
It was a great two-verse song
856
00:55:53,800 --> 00:55:57,040
with the most heartfelt of lyrics.
857
00:55:57,040 --> 00:56:01,400
It needed nothing. But the record-maker in me
858
00:56:01,400 --> 00:56:05,600
loved the notion that these two verses could be a set-up
859
00:56:05,600 --> 00:56:09,160
for an as yet unwritten third verse
860
00:56:09,160 --> 00:56:12,360
and we could be calling this all runway material
861
00:56:12,360 --> 00:56:14,400
for a take-off that's waiting.
862
00:56:14,400 --> 00:56:19,480
Roy Halee and Artie said, "You have to write a third verse.
863
00:56:19,480 --> 00:56:23,200
"The song wants to be bigger. It wants to be a really big song."
864
00:56:23,200 --> 00:56:28,280
And I said, "No, it doesn't. It's a little hymn. It's just a little hymn.
865
00:56:28,280 --> 00:56:29,680
"That's the way I hear it."
866
00:56:29,680 --> 00:56:33,400
And they said, "No, no, really, you have to write a third verse."
867
00:56:33,400 --> 00:56:37,320
So I wrote a third verse in the studio, which I never do,
868
00:56:37,320 --> 00:56:41,960
you know, I always take a long time to write.
869
00:56:41,960 --> 00:56:44,240
But I wrote this one in the studio.
870
00:56:44,240 --> 00:56:49,200
- # Sail on, silvergirl... #
- Paul's mic?
871
00:56:49,200 --> 00:56:53,720
# Sail on by
872
00:56:53,720 --> 00:56:57,720
- # Your time has come... #
- Where's my mic?
873
00:56:57,720 --> 00:56:59,000
Hold it.
874
00:57:01,000 --> 00:57:08,080
# ..All your dreams are on their way
875
00:57:08,080 --> 00:57:12,600
# See how they shine
876
00:57:12,600 --> 00:57:15,160
# Oh
877
00:57:15,160 --> 00:57:19,440
# If you need a friend
878
00:57:19,440 --> 00:57:25,840
# I'm sailing right behind
879
00:57:25,840 --> 00:57:33,920
# Like a bridge over troubled water
880
00:57:33,920 --> 00:57:37,600
# I will ease your mind
881
00:57:37,600 --> 00:57:46,080
# Like a bridge over troubled water
882
00:57:46,080 --> 00:57:51,120
- # I will ease your mind.
- #
883
00:58:06,680 --> 00:58:10,240
Those wonderful words and that triumph
884
00:58:10,240 --> 00:58:13,040
of an airplane taking off...
885
00:58:13,040 --> 00:58:15,080
From the moment the song was written,
886
00:58:15,080 --> 00:58:19,680
and I had the great fun of execution, the two together worked.
887
00:58:19,680 --> 00:58:22,480
Well, I didn't think it was a smash,
888
00:58:22,480 --> 00:58:26,680
but I thought it was something really exceptional.
889
00:58:26,680 --> 00:58:31,280
I thought it was probably too long for a commercial record.
890
00:58:31,280 --> 00:58:35,160
It was all piano up until the last verse.
891
00:58:38,920 --> 00:58:41,120
It just...
892
00:58:41,120 --> 00:58:45,160
I didn't think that it was... I didn't think that it was a hit.
893
00:58:45,160 --> 00:58:49,400
I thought Cecelia was going to be a hit, which it was.
894
00:58:49,400 --> 00:58:52,480
So you always knew the animal called the single
895
00:58:52,480 --> 00:58:56,000
and knew what was an album piece that was really happening,
896
00:58:56,000 --> 00:58:58,320
this seemed the latter.
897
00:58:58,320 --> 00:59:01,240
As a single, too slow, too long.
898
00:59:01,240 --> 00:59:05,680
Clive Davis came in the studio, president of CBS, and said,
899
00:59:05,680 --> 00:59:07,760
"I want to get behind it all the way.
900
00:59:07,760 --> 00:59:12,680
"It's the title of your album. It is the first single.
901
00:59:12,680 --> 00:59:15,480
"Be unapologetic about such a slow song
902
00:59:15,480 --> 00:59:18,360
"because I'm going to get behind it with faith."
903
00:59:18,360 --> 00:59:21,720
I knew it was exceptional and...
904
00:59:24,160 --> 00:59:27,640
..the first time I heard it on the radio...
905
00:59:30,000 --> 00:59:33,400
..I knew that it was a hit because it sounded huge
906
00:59:33,400 --> 00:59:36,000
just with the voice and the piano.
907
00:59:36,000 --> 00:59:40,480
And if a song jumped out of the radio,
908
00:59:40,480 --> 00:59:45,440
that meant there was some kind of magic in the way you cut it.
909
00:59:45,440 --> 00:59:47,320
There was a moment in time
910
00:59:47,320 --> 00:59:50,240
when Bridge Over Troubled Water didn't exist at all,
911
00:59:50,240 --> 00:59:53,920
and then there was another moment when it did, or it started to.
912
00:59:53,920 --> 00:59:56,120
Where does it come from, what actually happens,
913
00:59:56,120 --> 00:59:58,360
were you in the shower one day?
914
00:59:58,360 --> 01:00:01,960
I was listening to some music by a gospel group
915
01:00:01,960 --> 01:00:04,360
called the Swan Silvertones.
916
01:00:04,360 --> 01:00:08,040
And I heard, uh...
917
01:00:11,080 --> 01:00:14,600
It was the music that was in my mind most of the time and every time
918
01:00:14,600 --> 01:00:17,560
I'd come home I'd put that music on and I'd listen to it
919
01:00:17,560 --> 01:00:20,760
and I think that must have subconsciously influenced me
920
01:00:20,760 --> 01:00:23,360
cos I started to go to gospel changes.
921
01:00:25,760 --> 01:00:29,200
HE PLAYS GOSPEL GUITAR
922
01:00:35,920 --> 01:00:37,960
And that's how that fell in.
923
01:00:39,680 --> 01:00:41,640
I write for various reasons.
924
01:00:42,760 --> 01:00:47,080
Some songs I write for the pleasure of writing a song.
925
01:00:47,080 --> 01:00:51,680
It doesn't have any great meaning, it's just a song.
926
01:00:51,680 --> 01:00:53,120
Songs are nice.
927
01:00:53,120 --> 01:00:57,000
Some songs you try and express yourself emotionally.
928
01:00:57,000 --> 01:00:59,480
Those are different songs for me,
929
01:00:59,480 --> 01:01:01,560
and they express what I feel
930
01:01:01,560 --> 01:01:08,440
and they relieve tensions that I feel when I express them.
931
01:01:11,640 --> 01:01:15,680
# Here is my song for the asking
932
01:01:17,080 --> 01:01:20,120
# Ask me and I'll play
933
01:01:20,120 --> 01:01:27,200
# So sweetly I'll make you smile
934
01:01:30,640 --> 01:01:34,200
# This is my tune... #
935
01:01:34,200 --> 01:01:38,640
I love that song, Song For the Asking is an under-appreciated gem.
936
01:01:38,640 --> 01:01:41,560
Of all of Paul's statements from the heart,
937
01:01:41,560 --> 01:01:43,760
this is one of the supreme songs
938
01:01:43,760 --> 01:01:46,000
I don't hear mentioned enough.
939
01:01:46,000 --> 01:01:49,240
I never hear it covered, why doesn't somebody do that,
940
01:01:49,240 --> 01:01:51,400
it's just a gem of a song.
941
01:01:51,400 --> 01:01:55,640
Song For the Asking which I think closes the record...
942
01:01:55,640 --> 01:02:00,400
Well that was my, one of my little solos, you know,
943
01:02:00,400 --> 01:02:03,760
I guess we were balancing out songs
944
01:02:03,760 --> 01:02:08,640
that were solos and songs that were sung together.
945
01:02:08,640 --> 01:02:12,640
And, er...
946
01:02:12,640 --> 01:02:14,680
it's a pretty sweet song,
947
01:02:14,680 --> 01:02:18,480
you know, straight ahead.
948
01:02:18,480 --> 01:02:21,160
Almost embarrassing.
949
01:02:21,160 --> 01:02:24,240
It's Paul's calling card, you know?
950
01:02:24,240 --> 01:02:26,280
When you think about what he's saying,
951
01:02:26,280 --> 01:02:29,040
here's my song for the asking, ask me and I will play.
952
01:02:29,040 --> 01:02:31,360
It's a great statement from a human being
953
01:02:31,360 --> 01:02:33,240
because thinking it over,
954
01:02:33,240 --> 01:02:36,520
I have been sad, I don't have to be this person.
955
01:02:36,520 --> 01:02:41,000
It's great stuff for a lover to say.
956
01:02:42,120 --> 01:02:46,440
Give me a chance and I'm dying to pour my heart out to you.
957
01:02:46,440 --> 01:02:52,640
Well, you know, I think in the notes of apology
958
01:02:52,640 --> 01:02:59,320
that show up in album after album, um, that's just to say
959
01:02:59,320 --> 01:03:02,920
I haven't forgotten what I did
960
01:03:02,920 --> 01:03:05,240
to various people.
961
01:03:08,480 --> 01:03:13,800
You know, I was not an angel, that's for sure.
962
01:03:13,800 --> 01:03:19,640
That is really the big break of Bridge Over Troubled Water.
963
01:03:19,640 --> 01:03:23,440
Up until then we sang all the songs together,
964
01:03:23,440 --> 01:03:26,480
but on Bridge Over Troubled Water there was like,
965
01:03:26,480 --> 01:03:30,760
well, Artie's singing almost all of Bridge Over Troubled Water himself
966
01:03:30,760 --> 01:03:32,440
and then I join in at the end,
967
01:03:32,440 --> 01:03:36,640
he's singing verses of So Long Frank Lloyd Wright,
968
01:03:36,640 --> 01:03:38,640
I'm singing the bridge,
969
01:03:38,640 --> 01:03:42,520
I'm singing Baby Driver sort of by myself,
970
01:03:42,520 --> 01:03:48,360
I'm singing most of Only Living Boy by myself then he joins in
971
01:03:48,360 --> 01:03:52,400
on the harmony, so we had begun to separate
972
01:03:52,400 --> 01:03:55,360
how we would have made albums.
973
01:03:55,360 --> 01:03:58,400
Separating the voices
974
01:03:58,400 --> 01:04:04,280
so it was more like a Beatles record than an Everly Brothers record.
975
01:04:04,280 --> 01:04:09,240
Where you knew the two voices
976
01:04:09,240 --> 01:04:11,920
and the two characters well enough
977
01:04:11,920 --> 01:04:18,800
that we could each have our own songs and, um,
978
01:04:18,800 --> 01:04:24,520
it would feel natural and that's the first time that we
979
01:04:24,520 --> 01:04:31,640
did that and probably would have been the pattern for the next album
980
01:04:31,640 --> 01:04:33,320
or two or however many albums
981
01:04:33,320 --> 01:04:35,760
we would have made had we stayed together.
982
01:04:35,760 --> 01:04:38,760
Um, it's just the way it worked out.
983
01:04:38,760 --> 01:04:42,320
Like Bridge, Artie was...that was his song.
984
01:04:42,320 --> 01:04:49,840
Paul said, that's your song, you can do that song, that's you.
985
01:04:49,840 --> 01:04:53,040
There were two things left off Bridge.
986
01:04:53,040 --> 01:04:57,600
One was a song called Cuba Si Nixon No...
987
01:05:01,480 --> 01:05:05,640
It was about a hijacking, about a guy hijacking a plane to Cuba
988
01:05:05,640 --> 01:05:08,760
and Artie really didn't like that song.
989
01:05:08,760 --> 01:05:12,760
- Standing up!
- We stay on the four.
990
01:05:12,760 --> 01:05:15,320
I was voting against it in those days,
991
01:05:15,320 --> 01:05:19,320
thinking it doesn't represent our more thoughtful selves.
992
01:05:19,320 --> 01:05:23,760
It was the only one Paul ever wrote in this fountain of delight,
993
01:05:23,760 --> 01:05:26,280
it was the only time I put my finger on a spigot
994
01:05:26,280 --> 01:05:30,480
and said, I have a hard time getting behind that lyric.
995
01:05:30,480 --> 01:05:33,120
All right, then start on the lower note.
996
01:05:33,120 --> 01:05:36,320
Just let me get the chords before I get the note.
997
01:05:36,320 --> 01:05:39,800
You sing it and get the vocals in your head and then I'll learn it.
998
01:05:39,800 --> 01:05:42,880
And then there was a Bach piece that Artie really wanted
999
01:05:42,880 --> 01:05:44,920
to put on the album and I really didn't want
1000
01:05:44,920 --> 01:05:49,360
to put a Bach piece on the album, and we argued about both of those songs and finally we said,
1001
01:05:49,360 --> 01:05:52,520
look, forget it, that's it, it's done.
1002
01:05:52,520 --> 01:05:57,400
Put it out the way it is and in a way, kind of interesting,
1003
01:05:57,400 --> 01:06:01,680
they were both indications of where we each wanted to go.
1004
01:06:01,680 --> 01:06:05,760
I wanted to go more towards something rough and political
1005
01:06:05,760 --> 01:06:08,760
and he wanted to go towards something classical.
1006
01:06:08,760 --> 01:06:12,600
I was hard-nosed about it in those days showing that we were
1007
01:06:12,600 --> 01:06:15,200
working together too much, we needed a rest.
1008
01:06:15,200 --> 01:06:18,920
Today I look at it and I go, it's a good rock 'n' roll song. It swings.
1009
01:06:18,920 --> 01:06:22,160
What's the problem? You can say these things.
1010
01:06:22,160 --> 01:06:24,800
In those days I thought Cuba, Si. Nixon, No -
1011
01:06:24,800 --> 01:06:29,520
"It's to too easy to mistake for simplistic political talk."
1012
01:06:29,520 --> 01:06:31,920
That's what I said in those days.
1013
01:06:31,920 --> 01:06:35,800
Where I was heading...musically,
1014
01:06:35,800 --> 01:06:41,080
or what I was interested in musically, was not a continuation of
1015
01:06:41,080 --> 01:06:46,880
The Everly Brothers two-part harmony
1016
01:06:46,880 --> 01:06:51,120
that we based our sound on in the beginning.
1017
01:06:51,120 --> 01:06:55,080
It was evolving and separating anyway.
1018
01:06:55,080 --> 01:06:59,040
And I think that would have been inevitable.
1019
01:06:59,040 --> 01:07:02,760
'I can't see myself doing this five years from now'
1020
01:07:02,760 --> 01:07:07,360
I speak of the whole spiritual sphere,
1021
01:07:07,360 --> 01:07:12,000
that whole...aspect about my life.
1022
01:07:14,600 --> 01:07:16,960
This entertaining....
1023
01:07:18,280 --> 01:07:19,960
..it has nothing to do with that.
1024
01:07:21,640 --> 01:07:27,240
To say that, yes, that's all I have to do is to be a professional songwriter...
1025
01:07:28,360 --> 01:07:31,440
..or as entertainers is inaccurate.
1026
01:07:31,440 --> 01:07:33,880
I'm doing a lot else, personally.
1027
01:07:33,880 --> 01:07:38,720
When Bridge Over Troubled Water was over, I wanted a rest from Paul.
1028
01:07:38,720 --> 01:07:42,320
The amount that we were in the studio and in each other
1029
01:07:42,320 --> 01:07:45,520
and duelling for what makes the great record that knocks
1030
01:07:45,520 --> 01:07:48,760
the kids out the most, that duel was tiring.
1031
01:07:48,760 --> 01:07:52,800
So I would've loved a rest from what we were doing.
1032
01:07:52,800 --> 01:07:55,920
No next project with Paul for a year, please.
1033
01:07:55,920 --> 01:07:57,000
But then...
1034
01:07:58,560 --> 01:08:00,240
..I loved where we were at.
1035
01:08:01,480 --> 01:08:06,480
When you say when it was over, you couldn't ask for a luckier place to be.
1036
01:08:06,480 --> 01:08:09,120
People really getting what you're doing
1037
01:08:09,120 --> 01:08:13,200
and you're invited to stretch out creatively and take the top higher.
1038
01:08:14,440 --> 01:08:17,000
This is what we're here for, no?
1039
01:08:17,000 --> 01:08:19,640
I think that there would've been one more album.
1040
01:08:19,640 --> 01:08:22,280
It would've been a very hard album to follow,
1041
01:08:22,280 --> 01:08:25,200
because there wasn't any way to get bigger than
1042
01:08:25,200 --> 01:08:29,080
Bridge Over Troubled Water, I mean that was grandiose...
1043
01:08:30,920 --> 01:08:32,960
..in all kinds of ways.
1044
01:08:32,960 --> 01:08:35,760
Gee, my memories of what you're talking about,
1045
01:08:35,760 --> 01:08:40,040
our era and the fun of making records that chased after
1046
01:08:40,040 --> 01:08:43,920
The Beatles, as creative and as wonderful sonically.
1047
01:08:43,920 --> 01:08:48,640
We used to think there are about ten aspects of record-making.
1048
01:08:48,640 --> 01:08:51,640
The grooves the musicians establish - very important.
1049
01:08:51,640 --> 01:08:55,840
The songs, its lyric, its melody, the changes,
1050
01:08:55,840 --> 01:08:57,200
the engineering.
1051
01:08:57,200 --> 01:09:01,480
Well, if you can do 80/90% of those things first rate
1052
01:09:01,480 --> 01:09:04,840
you can come out with a Good Vibrations.
1053
01:09:04,840 --> 01:09:09,080
So we were chasing after those wonderful records cos
1054
01:09:09,080 --> 01:09:12,200
the rock 'n' roll era of the '60s was open-ended at the top.
1055
01:09:12,200 --> 01:09:15,880
It was a very, very long-lasting,
1056
01:09:15,880 --> 01:09:23,240
rewarding experience dealing with two guys who...we all loved music.
1057
01:09:23,240 --> 01:09:27,480
I grew up with them, we all grew up together
1058
01:09:27,480 --> 01:09:30,880
so it makes it very special, they're like family.
1059
01:09:32,240 --> 01:09:36,480
When you hear their song, and you do their record,
1060
01:09:36,480 --> 01:09:40,240
it's almost a religious experience.
1061
01:09:40,240 --> 01:09:42,320
It's a wonderful, wonderful thing.
1062
01:09:42,320 --> 01:09:45,880
There's so many different things in this album.
1063
01:09:45,880 --> 01:09:51,200
It's not all just big orchestra sound, it's the rhythm sounds.
1064
01:09:51,200 --> 01:09:55,840
And the sounds in it are different.
1065
01:09:57,360 --> 01:10:01,520
And things that people want to learn and play.
1066
01:10:01,520 --> 01:10:07,560
Because I was focussing on record-making and writing songs
1067
01:10:07,560 --> 01:10:10,960
and blending with Artie, I never really paid attention
1068
01:10:10,960 --> 01:10:16,440
to like how unique the voice was.
1069
01:10:16,440 --> 01:10:19,560
You couldn't miss Art Garfunkel's voice.
1070
01:10:19,560 --> 01:10:23,520
It really was an extraordinary voice - and still is.
1071
01:10:23,520 --> 01:10:25,960
He turns me on and I turn him on
1072
01:10:25,960 --> 01:10:30,320
and when we met each other at 11, we'd give each other a charge.
1073
01:10:30,320 --> 01:10:35,320
I recognised him as the cool kid in the neighbourhood, the live wire.
1074
01:10:35,320 --> 01:10:37,360
And he recognised me as the same,
1075
01:10:37,360 --> 01:10:41,920
and we were buds right from the beginning and we turned musical immediately.
1076
01:10:41,920 --> 01:10:48,440
Our blend knocked us out as did our sense of humour
1077
01:10:48,440 --> 01:10:51,840
and sense of being unbounded by the Queens neighbourhood
1078
01:10:51,840 --> 01:10:56,240
but having a notion of taking it somewhere
1079
01:11:01,360 --> 01:11:06,200
# And the years are rolling by me They are rockin' evenly
1080
01:11:06,200 --> 01:11:09,240
# I am older than I once was
1081
01:11:09,240 --> 01:11:13,840
# And younger than I'll be that's not unusual
1082
01:11:15,320 --> 01:11:19,720
# It isn't strange after changes upon changes
1083
01:11:19,720 --> 01:11:22,320
# We are more or less the same
1084
01:11:22,320 --> 01:11:26,360
# After changes we are more or less the same
1085
01:11:27,600 --> 01:11:29,600
# Li-la-li
1086
01:11:29,600 --> 01:11:32,360
# Li-la-la-la-li-la-li
1087
01:11:32,360 --> 01:11:35,480
# Li-la-li
1088
01:11:35,480 --> 01:11:41,440
# Li-la-la-la-li-la-li La-la-la-li. #
1089
01:11:57,040 --> 01:11:59,600
APPLAUSE AND CHEERING
1090
01:12:32,400 --> 01:12:35,120
# When you're weary
1091
01:12:39,880 --> 01:12:43,520
# Feeling small
1092
01:12:43,520 --> 01:12:51,320
# When tears are in your eyes
1093
01:12:51,320 --> 01:12:59,200
# I will dry them all
1094
01:12:59,200 --> 01:13:04,480
# I'm on your side
1095
01:13:07,200 --> 01:13:12,480
# When times get rough
1096
01:13:12,480 --> 01:13:19,200
# And friends just can't be found
1097
01:13:19,200 --> 01:13:27,800
# Like a bridge over troubled water
1098
01:13:27,800 --> 01:13:32,680
# I will ease your mind
1099
01:13:32,680 --> 01:13:41,480
# Like a bridge over troubled water
1100
01:13:41,480 --> 01:13:53,040
# I will ease your mind. #
1101
01:13:53,040 --> 01:13:56,120
Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd
1102
01:13:56,120 --> 01:13:59,240
E-mail subtitling@bbc.co.uk 93205
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