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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:37,501 --> 00:00:40,273 - Hello, Miss Deborah. - Hi! 2 00:00:40,273 --> 00:00:42,285 Good to see you! 3 00:00:42,285 --> 00:00:43,905 Hi Joshua! 4 00:00:43,905 --> 00:00:45,345 - You knew we were coming, didn't you? 5 00:00:45,345 --> 00:00:47,590 - My name is Deborah Peagler, and I was convicted of 6 00:00:47,590 --> 00:00:50,140 first degree murder, sentenced to 25 years to life. 7 00:00:52,270 --> 00:00:54,727 - We have bad news and we have good news. 8 00:00:54,727 --> 00:00:58,059 Nadia Costa and I began representing Deborah Peagler 9 00:00:58,059 --> 00:01:00,580 shortly after California became the first state in the 10 00:01:00,580 --> 00:01:03,750 nation to adopt a law, specifically designed to 11 00:01:03,750 --> 00:01:05,590 help incarcerated survivors of 12 00:01:05,590 --> 00:01:07,570 domestic violence win their freedom. 13 00:01:07,570 --> 00:01:10,060 It's a huge problem, a national problem, probably an 14 00:01:10,060 --> 00:01:13,890 international problem and this law is just the first step. 15 00:01:15,090 --> 00:01:17,870 Debbie was connected to the murder of the man that abused 16 00:01:17,870 --> 00:01:19,760 her, but the evidence of that abuse was 17 00:01:19,760 --> 00:01:21,100 never presented to the court. 18 00:01:21,100 --> 00:01:23,710 And if she had been charged appropriately she would have 19 00:01:23,710 --> 00:01:26,810 served a maximum of six years in prison. 20 00:01:26,810 --> 00:01:28,680 Instead by the time we took her case, she had 21 00:01:28,680 --> 00:01:31,225 already been in for 20 years and been denied 22 00:01:31,225 --> 00:01:33,200 release by the parole board twice. 23 00:01:34,890 --> 00:01:37,360 - This isn't a case where Debbie Peagler didn't have 24 00:01:37,360 --> 00:01:40,420 anything to do with the crime, but when you look at all the 25 00:01:40,420 --> 00:01:43,440 facts and circumstances surrounding what occurred, 26 00:01:43,440 --> 00:01:46,540 any reasonable court, any reasonable parole board 27 00:01:46,540 --> 00:01:49,950 and any reasonable person, would conclude that she has 28 00:01:49,950 --> 00:01:52,670 served enough time and she should be released from prison. 29 00:02:04,382 --> 00:02:05,215 ♪ Jesus can work it out ♪ 30 00:02:05,215 --> 00:02:06,252 ♪ If you let him ♪ 31 00:02:06,252 --> 00:02:07,668 ♪ Jesus can work it out ♪ 32 00:02:07,668 --> 00:02:09,854 ♪ That habit that I had I had ♪ 33 00:02:09,854 --> 00:02:11,630 ♪ I just couldn't seem to break. ♪ 34 00:02:11,630 --> 00:02:12,782 ♪ To break ♪ 35 00:02:12,782 --> 00:02:15,351 ♪ I prayed and I prayed I prayed ♪ 36 00:02:15,351 --> 00:02:17,532 ♪ Lord don't let it be too late. ♪ 37 00:02:17,532 --> 00:02:18,365 ♪ Too late ♪ 38 00:02:18,365 --> 00:02:20,116 ♪ Then I turned it over to Jesus ♪ 39 00:02:20,116 --> 00:02:20,949 ♪ Jesus ♪ 40 00:02:20,949 --> 00:02:22,695 ♪ And I stopped worryin' about it ♪ 41 00:02:22,695 --> 00:02:23,528 ♪ About it ♪ 42 00:02:23,528 --> 00:02:25,095 ♪ I stopped worryin' about it ♪ 43 00:02:25,095 --> 00:02:25,928 ♪ About it ♪ 44 00:02:25,928 --> 00:02:27,626 ♪ I stopped worryin' about it ♪ 45 00:02:27,626 --> 00:02:28,459 ♪ About it ♪ 46 00:02:28,459 --> 00:02:32,260 ♪ I gave it over to the Lord and He worked it out ♪ 47 00:02:32,260 --> 00:02:34,427 ♪ Yeah ♪ 48 00:02:40,280 --> 00:02:44,290 Debbie Peagler was fifteen when she first met Oliver Wilson. 49 00:02:44,290 --> 00:02:47,610 In fact, her mother introduced her to Oliver. 50 00:02:49,230 --> 00:02:52,200 And y'know at first he came across as 51 00:02:52,200 --> 00:02:54,620 very charismatic and quite charming. 52 00:02:54,620 --> 00:02:57,050 - My mother met Oliver at an ABC market where she used to 53 00:02:57,050 --> 00:02:58,170 do her grocery shopping. 54 00:02:58,170 --> 00:03:01,230 I guess they interacted there. 55 00:03:01,230 --> 00:03:03,620 And she began to really like him. 56 00:03:03,620 --> 00:03:05,960 - He seemed to know that, the way to 57 00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:07,630 my heart is through my children. 58 00:03:08,600 --> 00:03:10,910 And that's how he won me over, by being good to 59 00:03:10,910 --> 00:03:12,820 Debbie at the very beginning, 60 00:03:12,820 --> 00:03:15,870 and accepting my granddaughter like she was his child. 61 00:03:19,800 --> 00:03:21,300 - The day I came home from school, 62 00:03:21,300 --> 00:03:23,540 and he was there playing with my daughter. 63 00:03:23,540 --> 00:03:25,440 And I thought, "He's kinda cute!" 64 00:03:26,767 --> 00:03:30,690 - My brother was one of the most charismatic people ever 65 00:03:30,690 --> 00:03:34,530 to walk this earth, but Oliver was the type of 66 00:03:34,530 --> 00:03:37,842 person, if you said "Tell me something about yourself," 67 00:03:37,842 --> 00:03:42,270 'bout an hour and a half later you would say to him, 68 00:03:42,270 --> 00:03:45,200 "Hold that thought, I'll be right back," because he would 69 00:03:45,200 --> 00:03:47,810 still be talking about himself. 70 00:03:48,763 --> 00:03:53,011 He used to model clothes because he was tall and slender. 71 00:03:53,011 --> 00:03:55,450 And I don't think he ever knew when 72 00:03:55,450 --> 00:03:57,340 he was not on the walkway. 73 00:03:58,630 --> 00:04:00,670 - As we spent time around each other and talked to each 74 00:04:00,670 --> 00:04:02,896 other, he was easy to talk to, and I saw that he really 75 00:04:02,896 --> 00:04:05,396 took to my daughter, that was a big thing with me. 76 00:04:06,360 --> 00:04:10,180 - He used to buy me a lot of things, designer clothes, 77 00:04:11,600 --> 00:04:15,940 toys, anything a little kid could wish for, I had. 78 00:04:15,940 --> 00:04:17,770 - His mother would cook big, big meals. 79 00:04:17,770 --> 00:04:20,250 And I would go over and help her prepare the meals 80 00:04:20,250 --> 00:04:23,000 and interact with her and I began to 81 00:04:23,000 --> 00:04:26,000 adopt his family as mine, because mine was so dysfunctional. 82 00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:31,880 If she was being abused or battered, it was a secret. 83 00:04:32,210 --> 00:04:34,280 Because at that point in time, 84 00:04:34,280 --> 00:04:37,030 I was being abused, and it was a secret. 85 00:04:39,800 --> 00:04:44,800 I was molested as a child, by my father and my uncle. 86 00:04:46,440 --> 00:04:50,010 What if that wasn't the example of manhood that he had? 87 00:04:50,010 --> 00:04:54,160 What if he didn't think that was acceptable behavior? 88 00:04:55,330 --> 00:04:57,770 - We'd go out to eat, or he'd take me to the mall, 89 00:04:57,770 --> 00:05:00,500 shopping, and just buy me anything I wanted. 90 00:05:00,500 --> 00:05:04,497 Money was like never an object, never a problem with him. 91 00:05:04,497 --> 00:05:07,610 It never dawned on me that he is not making this money 92 00:05:07,610 --> 00:05:11,500 from working at ABC Market, but I was young and kinda naive 93 00:05:11,500 --> 00:05:13,993 and didn't know anything about it. 94 00:05:13,993 --> 00:05:15,250 Until. 95 00:05:16,110 --> 00:05:17,300 Until one night. 96 00:05:18,701 --> 00:05:20,870 He said I wanna take you somewhere, somewhere special. 97 00:05:20,870 --> 00:05:22,000 I was like "Okay." 98 00:05:22,000 --> 00:05:24,777 I'm thinking it's gonna be a really nice restaurant, or 99 00:05:24,777 --> 00:05:28,190 another concert, because he's taken me to a concert before. 100 00:05:28,190 --> 00:05:30,650 - He was always tryin' to be like me. 101 00:05:31,560 --> 00:05:32,393 I tried pimping. 102 00:05:32,393 --> 00:05:36,620 And I found out that I wasn't made out for pimping. 103 00:05:36,620 --> 00:05:40,017 Because, pimping, you can pimp your momma, 104 00:05:40,017 --> 00:05:43,120 you can pimp your sister, you can pimp your daughter, 105 00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:47,290 you can't have no sympathy towards anybody. 106 00:05:48,130 --> 00:05:50,650 - On the way there he was telling me that he had came 107 00:05:50,650 --> 00:05:52,020 into some financial problems 108 00:05:52,020 --> 00:05:54,537 and he was about to lose his car, and he was having some 109 00:05:54,537 --> 00:05:56,365 money problems and he needed me to help him. 110 00:05:56,365 --> 00:06:00,070 And I was like, "Okay, sure, no problem." 111 00:06:00,070 --> 00:06:02,420 And that was like the end of that conversation. 112 00:06:03,530 --> 00:06:04,900 Who knew, I'm thinking, "Okay, he's gonna 113 00:06:04,900 --> 00:06:07,600 "take me to a job interview and get me a normal job," 114 00:06:07,600 --> 00:06:09,370 and I can help him like that. 115 00:06:09,370 --> 00:06:13,210 But no, he took me to that place on Prairie and Century, 116 00:06:13,210 --> 00:06:14,817 I'll never forget. 117 00:06:14,817 --> 00:06:17,097 Because there was a donut shop on that corner. 118 00:06:17,097 --> 00:06:21,160 And he introduced me to the two women, and then he left. 119 00:06:21,160 --> 00:06:24,690 And then they told me where to go, what room to take men to, 120 00:06:24,690 --> 00:06:27,430 how long to be in there, what to let the man do and what 121 00:06:27,430 --> 00:06:30,957 not to let him do and how much to charge him, and all 122 00:06:30,957 --> 00:06:34,220 this stuff and I am like freaking out. 123 00:06:34,220 --> 00:06:35,460 "What do you mean? 124 00:06:35,460 --> 00:06:36,790 "I am not going to have sex with that man, 125 00:06:36,790 --> 00:06:37,623 "I don't know that man." 126 00:06:37,623 --> 00:06:40,030 And they said, "Baby, yes you are. 127 00:06:40,030 --> 00:06:40,863 "Yes you are. 128 00:06:40,863 --> 00:06:42,701 "You're gonna make your man some money." 129 00:06:42,701 --> 00:06:46,100 And then he's getting undressed and I'm like on the 130 00:06:46,100 --> 00:06:48,550 bed cryin' like, "I cannot do this. 131 00:06:48,550 --> 00:06:49,610 "I don't wanna do this, 132 00:06:49,610 --> 00:06:52,730 "I don't wanna do this, I don't wanna do this, 133 00:06:52,730 --> 00:06:54,570 "and I can't do this and no." 134 00:06:55,993 --> 00:06:56,826 And the man's like 135 00:06:56,826 --> 00:06:57,659 "Don't you know what is going to 136 00:06:57,659 --> 00:06:59,077 "happen if you don't do this?" 137 00:06:59,077 --> 00:07:01,090 "Nothing's gonna happen." 138 00:07:03,449 --> 00:07:06,685 "No your pimp is going to beat you. 139 00:07:06,685 --> 00:07:07,890 "He's gonna do this." 140 00:07:07,890 --> 00:07:09,470 and he's describing all this horrendous stuff. 141 00:07:09,470 --> 00:07:13,800 And I'm like "No, Oliver would never do that to me. 142 00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:16,197 "No." 143 00:07:16,197 --> 00:07:18,620 Little did I know, yes he would. 144 00:07:19,520 --> 00:07:22,467 And yes he did, because I didn't go through with it. 145 00:07:22,467 --> 00:07:23,790 And when he came back to get me he was like, 146 00:07:23,790 --> 00:07:25,390 "How much money did you make?" 147 00:07:25,390 --> 00:07:26,610 And I was like, "None." 148 00:07:27,837 --> 00:07:29,300 "What do you mean none?" 149 00:07:29,300 --> 00:07:31,460 I said, "I'm not gonna do that. 150 00:07:32,430 --> 00:07:33,610 "I don't wanna do that. 151 00:07:33,610 --> 00:07:34,470 "No, no." 152 00:07:35,337 --> 00:07:38,840 "Okay," like nothing was wrong. 153 00:07:39,792 --> 00:07:41,370 And we went to his mother's house. 154 00:07:41,370 --> 00:07:42,800 Next thing I knew, he hauled off 155 00:07:42,800 --> 00:07:46,100 and slapped the crap outta me. 156 00:07:46,100 --> 00:07:48,840 I just balled up on a floor in a ball. 157 00:07:48,840 --> 00:07:49,800 I'll never forget he was 158 00:07:49,800 --> 00:07:52,130 just kicking me and kicking me and kicking me. 159 00:07:52,130 --> 00:07:54,440 And I was like, "Okay, okay, I promise, I promise, I'll do 160 00:07:54,440 --> 00:07:56,190 "it, I promise, I'll do it next time, I promise, I 161 00:07:56,190 --> 00:07:58,977 "promise, just don't, please please don't hit me no more, 162 00:07:58,977 --> 00:08:00,509 "please don't hit me no more. 163 00:08:00,509 --> 00:08:02,380 "Please just stop hitting me, stop hitting me." 164 00:08:04,260 --> 00:08:06,870 - Oliver continued to abuse and force Debbie 165 00:08:06,870 --> 00:08:08,620 to prostitute herself throughout her 166 00:08:08,620 --> 00:08:12,310 sophomore, junior and senior years of high school. 167 00:08:12,310 --> 00:08:14,140 - And it's amazing that throughout all that I still 168 00:08:14,140 --> 00:08:16,972 maintained my good grades, I still was an honor roll 169 00:08:16,972 --> 00:08:20,000 still was an honor roll student, still loved school. 170 00:08:20,000 --> 00:08:23,080 - She was acting different, you know she wasn't laughing or 171 00:08:23,080 --> 00:08:25,820 being the same Debbie that we'd always known her to be. 172 00:08:25,820 --> 00:08:28,681 Whenever he came around, or she even heard his voice, 173 00:08:28,681 --> 00:08:31,320 she just totally changed. 174 00:08:31,320 --> 00:08:34,920 - Not only was his abuse significant and severe, but 175 00:08:34,920 --> 00:08:38,640 he constrained every other aspect of her life, he 176 00:08:38,640 --> 00:08:41,540 controlled who she saw, who she spoke with, 177 00:08:41,540 --> 00:08:43,510 she couldn't have friends. 178 00:08:43,510 --> 00:08:45,010 - It had got to the point where he had stopped hitting me 179 00:08:45,010 --> 00:08:48,550 with his fists, he would make me lay on the floor or the 180 00:08:48,550 --> 00:08:50,840 couch or whatever, beat me with a bullwhip. 181 00:08:52,900 --> 00:08:55,890 And so I'd have whips all on my body. 182 00:08:55,890 --> 00:08:58,490 He would never, never hit me on my face. 183 00:08:58,490 --> 00:09:00,140 He didn't want to mess up the face because I had to be his 184 00:09:00,140 --> 00:09:03,290 perfect hostess for his friends, but I could easily 185 00:09:03,290 --> 00:09:07,220 where long sleeves or whatever to cover up the bruises. 186 00:09:07,220 --> 00:09:10,240 - Debbie tried to escape Oliver on numerous occasions, 187 00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:14,080 but he kept bringing her back by force or by death threats. 188 00:09:14,080 --> 00:09:15,500 And eventually Debbie ended up 189 00:09:15,500 --> 00:09:17,800 having a daughter with Oliver. 190 00:09:17,800 --> 00:09:21,250 And he eased up on the abuse when he saw that she was 191 00:09:21,250 --> 00:09:23,690 pregnant with his kid, and there was sort of a honeymoon 192 00:09:23,690 --> 00:09:26,950 period that followed, and part of that was he purchased 193 00:09:26,950 --> 00:09:29,268 life insurance, to tell Debbie "If anything happens 194 00:09:29,268 --> 00:09:32,370 "to me, you will still be able to raise my daughter." 195 00:09:32,370 --> 00:09:33,820 But that was short lived. 196 00:09:33,820 --> 00:09:35,870 And Oliver began dealing drugs in 197 00:09:35,870 --> 00:09:38,209 a big way and began using the drugs and Oliver became more 198 00:09:38,209 --> 00:09:40,810 abusive than ever before. 199 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:47,330 - I know how my child felt, cause I lived in it. 200 00:09:47,330 --> 00:09:49,760 So until you've experienced it you don't know, 201 00:09:49,760 --> 00:09:52,100 until you've walked in my shoes, you don't know. 202 00:09:52,100 --> 00:09:54,180 Until you've walked in her shoes, you don't know. 203 00:09:54,180 --> 00:09:58,510 Until you've gone through the abuse and the humiliation 204 00:09:58,510 --> 00:10:01,060 that they made us feel, you don't know how we feel. 205 00:10:02,610 --> 00:10:05,970 And my heart hurts for my child because I love her. 206 00:10:05,970 --> 00:10:07,110 And I didn't want her to go through 207 00:10:07,110 --> 00:10:08,660 the things I went through with. 208 00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:11,490 And I know how she felt. 209 00:10:17,180 --> 00:10:20,401 - So after Oliver's drug abuse really took off in a big way, 210 00:10:20,401 --> 00:10:22,940 Debbie and Oliver got an eviction notice. 211 00:10:22,940 --> 00:10:24,390 - That was my way out. 212 00:10:24,390 --> 00:10:26,040 And I convinced him, for him to go 213 00:10:26,040 --> 00:10:28,010 to his mother's house and for me to go to my mother's 214 00:10:28,010 --> 00:10:31,921 house, until we could get back on our feet and, be okay. 215 00:10:31,921 --> 00:10:34,550 And then I was, at that point I'm like, 216 00:10:34,550 --> 00:10:36,777 "I am so outta here, I am so not going back." 217 00:10:36,777 --> 00:10:41,490 Because the violence was, it was horrendous at that time. 218 00:10:41,490 --> 00:10:45,070 - Debbie had finally left Oliver and moved her and the 219 00:10:45,070 --> 00:10:47,537 children into her mother's home. 220 00:10:47,537 --> 00:10:50,380 - Oliver shows up with a couple of friends, they're all 221 00:10:50,380 --> 00:10:52,790 heavily armed with shotguns and pistols. 222 00:10:52,790 --> 00:10:55,609 - We were all in the house and you hear the adults screaming 223 00:10:55,609 --> 00:10:58,790 for all the kids to "Get down, get in the closets, lay 224 00:10:58,790 --> 00:11:02,710 "on the floor, don't get up until we come and get you." 225 00:11:02,710 --> 00:11:05,700 You know and finding out, y'know, that it was him and 226 00:11:05,700 --> 00:11:08,117 two of his friends outside of our house with guns 227 00:11:08,117 --> 00:11:12,010 y'know, threatening to kill whoever was in the house. 228 00:11:12,010 --> 00:11:14,010 - And the only reason that didn't happen is cause 229 00:11:14,010 --> 00:11:15,350 someone called the Sheriff's. 230 00:11:15,350 --> 00:11:17,270 - The police did arrest Oliver 231 00:11:17,270 --> 00:11:19,800 and he spent the night in jail, but right after 232 00:11:19,800 --> 00:11:22,429 that he was released and out on the streets. 233 00:11:22,429 --> 00:11:25,170 So she knew that the police were not going to help 234 00:11:25,170 --> 00:11:27,890 her, were not going to protect her family, and that 235 00:11:27,890 --> 00:11:31,420 Oliver was furious because the police had been called. 236 00:11:31,420 --> 00:11:35,457 - Most people of color do not trust law enforcement. 237 00:11:35,457 --> 00:11:39,980 Having her perpetrator arrested, having the perpetrator 238 00:11:39,980 --> 00:11:44,980 released the next day, this was common for many women. 239 00:11:46,560 --> 00:11:48,940 - It seemed as though the police looked at it like, 240 00:11:48,940 --> 00:11:52,080 "It's another black woman getting her ass whupped, by 241 00:11:52,080 --> 00:11:54,540 "her boyfriend, so be it." 242 00:11:54,540 --> 00:11:56,480 It was almost like it was a 243 00:11:56,480 --> 00:11:58,490 waste of their time, I guess you could say. 244 00:11:58,490 --> 00:12:02,130 - Even though I left him, and I was gone, there was no 245 00:12:02,130 --> 00:12:05,010 escaping him, there was no getting away from him. 246 00:12:05,010 --> 00:12:07,640 - I called the law with him and he has a gun, 247 00:12:07,640 --> 00:12:09,610 and they still let him out! 248 00:12:09,610 --> 00:12:11,610 So what was she to think, how was she to 249 00:12:12,453 --> 00:12:14,490 live, but fear for her life? 250 00:12:14,490 --> 00:12:19,080 - Debbie's mother suggested to Debbie she let Ramone Sibley 251 00:12:19,080 --> 00:12:22,600 and Little Timmy Lively make Oliver leave her alone. 252 00:12:23,480 --> 00:12:26,890 - Sibley and Lively were Crips gang members that controlled 253 00:12:26,890 --> 00:12:29,630 the area where Debbie's mom lived, it was their turf. 254 00:12:30,580 --> 00:12:32,280 And when Oliver showed up with a group of 255 00:12:32,280 --> 00:12:34,930 armed guys, threatening to kill everyone in their 256 00:12:34,930 --> 00:12:37,460 neighborhood, that was the last straw. 257 00:12:37,460 --> 00:12:39,460 That wasn't gonna happen on their watch. 258 00:12:39,460 --> 00:12:41,250 - And my mother was like "Why don't you just let, let 259 00:12:41,250 --> 00:12:43,880 "Ramone, Timmy and Ramone, you guys can take care of him. 260 00:12:43,880 --> 00:12:45,240 "Why don't you just take care of him, why don't you make 261 00:12:45,240 --> 00:12:47,380 "him leave her alone, I know you guys could." 262 00:12:49,120 --> 00:12:50,820 - Remain seated at all times. 263 00:12:52,623 --> 00:12:54,440 - The extreme I used to see him go to, 264 00:12:54,440 --> 00:12:57,260 grabbing her, choking her, socking her. 265 00:12:57,260 --> 00:12:59,530 He used to beat on her like she was a guy. 266 00:12:59,530 --> 00:13:00,420 You know? 267 00:13:00,420 --> 00:13:03,970 So two or three times I had to beat on 268 00:13:03,970 --> 00:13:05,780 him like he was a guy. 269 00:13:05,780 --> 00:13:09,790 You know, and just to, one, 270 00:13:09,790 --> 00:13:12,254 to try to protect her, and two, just to show dude that, 271 00:13:12,254 --> 00:13:14,220 this is what you're doing to her. 272 00:13:14,220 --> 00:13:19,220 He thought he was above ghetto law, street law. 273 00:13:19,899 --> 00:13:22,188 That these things you don't do. 274 00:13:22,188 --> 00:13:25,354 And I guess, you know, he thought since 275 00:13:25,354 --> 00:13:27,570 the Constitution say you can do what you want in the 276 00:13:27,570 --> 00:13:29,400 United States he figured he could do whatever the 277 00:13:29,400 --> 00:13:32,860 fuck he wanted and there was no consequences. 278 00:13:35,260 --> 00:13:36,870 - But I didn't want nobody to kill him, but I wanted 279 00:13:36,870 --> 00:13:38,670 somebody to beat the hell out of him. 280 00:13:40,300 --> 00:13:42,300 And I thought maybe if he got his behind whipped he'd go on 281 00:13:42,300 --> 00:13:44,430 about his business and leave my child alone. 282 00:13:46,412 --> 00:13:48,220 - And I was like, "You guys can make him leave me alone? 283 00:13:48,220 --> 00:13:49,470 "Can you make him leave me alone?" 284 00:13:49,470 --> 00:13:50,730 And it was like "Yeah, let us handle it, 285 00:13:50,730 --> 00:13:52,010 "we'll take care of it. 286 00:13:52,010 --> 00:13:53,551 "We'll take care of it." 287 00:13:53,551 --> 00:13:54,810 "Okay." 288 00:13:56,900 --> 00:13:59,277 - So this is the Sheriff's Office Report. 289 00:13:59,277 --> 00:14:04,130 Oliver Wilson was listed as John Doe number 191. 290 00:14:04,130 --> 00:14:07,080 There was dried blood around and coming from the victim's 291 00:14:07,080 --> 00:14:09,430 nose, mouth, and right ear. 292 00:14:09,430 --> 00:14:11,360 They were from the point of view of where 293 00:14:11,360 --> 00:14:14,957 the camera's shooting from now, and they scaled this 294 00:14:14,957 --> 00:14:19,070 fence and they came down, and they crawled down here, 295 00:14:20,000 --> 00:14:21,300 and they attacked Oliver. 296 00:14:22,620 --> 00:14:24,760 And the moment that happened, Debbie left. 297 00:14:26,140 --> 00:14:31,140 And Sibley and Lively continued to strangle Oliver. 298 00:14:33,070 --> 00:14:34,170 There was some discrepancies 299 00:14:34,170 --> 00:14:37,560 from their statements to the police of who did what. 300 00:14:37,560 --> 00:14:40,780 I don't know, obviously, and no one will know 301 00:14:40,780 --> 00:14:43,440 exactly what happened, but what we do know 302 00:14:43,440 --> 00:14:45,450 at that time that Debbie was not here. 303 00:14:45,450 --> 00:14:48,640 She had left, although she did bring Oliver 304 00:14:48,640 --> 00:14:52,670 here and we know that and she has expressed remorse 305 00:14:52,670 --> 00:14:57,670 about that, and has paid her dues for that act. 306 00:15:03,100 --> 00:15:06,110 - And even though I hated him and I was mad at him, 307 00:15:06,110 --> 00:15:08,010 I still didn't want him dead. 308 00:15:08,010 --> 00:15:09,810 I just wanted him to leave me alone. 309 00:15:17,480 --> 00:15:20,600 And that's all I keep saying, 20 years later. 310 00:15:20,600 --> 00:15:22,910 If only he woulda just left me alone. 311 00:15:31,370 --> 00:15:33,800 - After Oliver Wilson was killed, Debbie did receive 312 00:15:33,800 --> 00:15:36,958 about $17,000 in life insurance proceeds, 313 00:15:36,958 --> 00:15:39,780 most of which went to Oliver's mother and to pay 314 00:15:39,780 --> 00:15:42,765 for a very elaborate funeral for Oliver. 315 00:15:42,765 --> 00:15:46,186 And the Los Angeles County District Attorney's office 316 00:15:46,186 --> 00:15:49,410 took this evidence of life insurance as proof that this 317 00:15:49,410 --> 00:15:51,640 was a conspiracy and that Debbie had Oliver 318 00:15:51,640 --> 00:15:53,190 killed for financial gain. 319 00:15:55,100 --> 00:15:58,530 So Debbie was swept up into this prosecution and she was 320 00:15:58,530 --> 00:16:02,860 prosecuted by a group known as Operation Hard Core, which 321 00:16:02,860 --> 00:16:05,910 was this hard core gang task force because there were 322 00:16:05,910 --> 00:16:07,960 Crips gang members involved. 323 00:16:07,960 --> 00:16:11,750 This group had a hundred percent conviction rate 324 00:16:11,750 --> 00:16:13,880 Debbie was charged with first-degree murder by the 325 00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:16,750 District Attorney's Office, and they sought the death 326 00:16:16,750 --> 00:16:17,920 penalty against her. 327 00:16:19,200 --> 00:16:21,560 - They basically came to Debbie and said that 328 00:16:21,560 --> 00:16:24,105 "Unless you plead guilty, we will pursue 329 00:16:24,105 --> 00:16:27,850 "and get the death penalty against you." 330 00:16:27,850 --> 00:16:31,230 And they said the same to Ramone Sibley. 331 00:16:32,120 --> 00:16:34,600 But for Lively, he was a minor at the time. 332 00:16:36,720 --> 00:16:39,720 - Lively was sort of offered a deal, that if he testified 333 00:16:39,720 --> 00:16:43,080 against Debbie and against Ramone, he would be given a 334 00:16:43,080 --> 00:16:46,125 short sentence, if the case ever went to trial, which of 335 00:16:46,125 --> 00:16:49,197 course it didn't go to trial, and Lively in fact went in 336 00:16:49,197 --> 00:16:52,170 and out very quickly and went on to kill other people. 337 00:16:54,670 --> 00:16:57,640 But Debbie and Ramone Sibley took a plea deal 338 00:16:57,640 --> 00:17:00,630 to save their lives ended up going to prison for life. 339 00:17:12,240 --> 00:17:16,860 - And now I sit in prison, wondering was there a better way? 340 00:17:16,860 --> 00:17:18,160 Was there a different way? 341 00:17:19,513 --> 00:17:22,330 Like today I know there is, there's shelters, and people 342 00:17:22,330 --> 00:17:23,530 out there available now. 343 00:17:25,037 --> 00:17:27,360 Where were those people back then? 344 00:17:27,360 --> 00:17:30,930 - In 1983 when Debbie Peagler went to prison, the battered 345 00:17:30,930 --> 00:17:33,720 women's movement was still in its infancy. 346 00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:36,330 There were just starting to be battered women's shelters. 347 00:17:36,330 --> 00:17:40,230 It was the very beginning of having restraining orders. 348 00:17:40,230 --> 00:17:42,970 - Over time with committed activists, they started 349 00:17:42,970 --> 00:17:45,010 bringing victims out of the shadows to share their 350 00:17:45,010 --> 00:17:48,690 stories, and police became educated, and the general 351 00:17:48,690 --> 00:17:51,430 public became educated about this issue. 352 00:17:51,430 --> 00:17:54,140 - After being sentenced and going to prison. 353 00:17:54,140 --> 00:17:56,380 Five years pass, 10 years passed, people started 354 00:17:56,380 --> 00:17:58,260 talking about the Battered Women's Syndrome. 355 00:17:58,260 --> 00:18:00,170 They even started a domestic violence program at 356 00:18:00,170 --> 00:18:02,260 the prison and group therapy. 357 00:18:02,260 --> 00:18:04,491 - They're always talking about the victim 358 00:18:04,491 --> 00:18:09,491 that died in our case but we're a victim too. 359 00:18:10,580 --> 00:18:12,950 - He used to beat me in front of his friends. 360 00:18:12,950 --> 00:18:16,510 Beat me until I was black and blue, and this was 361 00:18:16,510 --> 00:18:18,850 the only way I could ever get away from him. 362 00:18:20,830 --> 00:18:25,090 - And it took me being in prison almost, 15, 363 00:18:25,090 --> 00:18:30,030 17 years before I even realized that I was a battered woman. 364 00:18:31,213 --> 00:18:36,213 And it's so funny that somebody else had to tell me I was. 365 00:18:36,630 --> 00:18:39,250 - When Debbie Peagler was sent to prison, the number of 366 00:18:39,250 --> 00:18:43,180 incarcerated women nationwide was less than 20,000 367 00:18:43,180 --> 00:18:46,380 In the years since, that number has just plain 368 00:18:46,380 --> 00:18:49,960 skyrocketed, so that today there has been a more than 369 00:18:49,960 --> 00:18:53,220 sixfold increase in the number of women in prison, 370 00:18:53,220 --> 00:18:54,710 in less than 30 years. 371 00:18:58,470 --> 00:19:01,000 Many of these women, especially those who are 372 00:19:01,000 --> 00:19:04,670 serving life sentences like Debbie, are incarcerated for 373 00:19:04,670 --> 00:19:08,700 a crime that is directly related to that abuse. 374 00:19:08,700 --> 00:19:10,230 - We need to put ourselves in the position 375 00:19:10,230 --> 00:19:13,452 of that individual, under those circumstances, 376 00:19:13,452 --> 00:19:15,710 faced with the choices they had. 377 00:19:18,370 --> 00:19:21,220 - After decades of advocacy, battered women in prison and 378 00:19:21,220 --> 00:19:23,490 their supporters on the outside were finally 379 00:19:23,490 --> 00:19:26,970 successful in getting this habeas law passed in California. 380 00:19:26,970 --> 00:19:29,170 It's the first law in the nation that allows 381 00:19:29,170 --> 00:19:32,172 domestic violence survivors to present their evidence, 382 00:19:32,172 --> 00:19:35,430 have their stories be heard, and finally have a real 383 00:19:35,430 --> 00:19:37,800 chance at winning their freedom. 384 00:19:37,800 --> 00:19:40,270 - I think it's astounding that California is 385 00:19:40,270 --> 00:19:44,000 the only state that is actually allowing cases 386 00:19:44,000 --> 00:19:46,870 to be reopened, because there are thousands 387 00:19:46,870 --> 00:19:50,690 and thousands of Debbies across the United States. 388 00:19:53,020 --> 00:19:56,320 - Even in California, the state is not providing these women 389 00:19:56,320 --> 00:19:59,080 with attorneys, and so the Habeas Project formed to 390 00:19:59,080 --> 00:20:00,950 connect women with attorneys who 391 00:20:00,950 --> 00:20:03,030 could take on these cases for free. 392 00:20:03,030 --> 00:20:05,068 That's how we found Nadia and Joshua for Debbie 393 00:20:05,068 --> 00:20:07,370 and they have been amazing. 394 00:20:08,510 --> 00:20:09,880 - Y'know, we're volunteer attorneys 395 00:20:09,880 --> 00:20:13,021 in Debbie's case, and besides that, I'm a Dad. 396 00:20:13,021 --> 00:20:14,670 I'm an Orthodox Jew. 397 00:20:14,670 --> 00:20:15,890 And I'm an attorney. 398 00:20:15,890 --> 00:20:18,170 That's my order of preference. 399 00:20:18,170 --> 00:20:19,520 Although, in reality I'm probably an 400 00:20:19,520 --> 00:20:21,990 attorney first and everything else second. 401 00:20:25,070 --> 00:20:27,970 - I'm a mom, of a little boy named Cole, and I was 402 00:20:27,970 --> 00:20:31,300 pregnant with him when I would go to prison to see 403 00:20:31,300 --> 00:20:34,290 Debbie or to see other witnesses like Ramone. 404 00:20:34,290 --> 00:20:37,120 But being a mom is the best thing I'll ever do. 405 00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:41,960 Before I was a lawyer I was a social worker for 406 00:20:41,960 --> 00:20:44,590 children's protective services and basically worked 407 00:20:44,590 --> 00:20:47,250 with families dealing with the kind of violence that 408 00:20:47,250 --> 00:20:49,660 Debbie and her girls suffered. 409 00:20:49,660 --> 00:20:50,860 I'm also a runner. 410 00:20:50,860 --> 00:20:54,050 I'm not fast but I like to go far. 411 00:20:54,050 --> 00:20:56,990 Usually with distances longer than a marathon, what 412 00:20:56,990 --> 00:20:59,180 they call ultra-runs or ultra-marathons. 413 00:21:00,390 --> 00:21:02,280 - Y'know, I've never run a marathon, I don't really 414 00:21:02,280 --> 00:21:03,950 believe in running unless there's like a group of 415 00:21:03,950 --> 00:21:04,940 people chasing me. 416 00:21:04,940 --> 00:21:08,220 But this case is starting to feel like 417 00:21:08,220 --> 00:21:10,700 a marathon, and it's all uphill. 418 00:21:10,700 --> 00:21:12,500 But you know, Debbie keeps us going. 419 00:21:13,436 --> 00:21:18,436 You know, in Judaism we have this prayer, matir ha asurim, 420 00:21:18,700 --> 00:21:20,550 to free those who are bound. 421 00:21:20,550 --> 00:21:23,020 It's one of our core principals that if someone is 422 00:21:23,020 --> 00:21:26,445 wrongfully imprisoned, we have an obligation to fight 423 00:21:26,445 --> 00:21:29,200 to free them, to liberate them. 424 00:21:29,200 --> 00:21:34,200 - When I met Nadia, and we began discussing the violence 425 00:21:34,220 --> 00:21:37,470 I'd been subjected to, and I remember telling her some of 426 00:21:37,470 --> 00:21:41,650 the details of the beatings, and I remember thinking, 427 00:21:41,650 --> 00:21:44,230 "She's looking at me like I'm a human being, 428 00:21:44,230 --> 00:21:45,540 "like she understands. 429 00:21:45,540 --> 00:21:48,440 "She isn't, looking at me in judgment." 430 00:21:48,440 --> 00:21:50,150 And then on one of her visits, 431 00:21:50,150 --> 00:21:53,995 Nadia brought another attorney with her, Joshua. 432 00:21:53,995 --> 00:21:56,200 And she introduced us. 433 00:21:56,200 --> 00:21:58,100 I looked at him and I was thinking to myself, 434 00:21:58,100 --> 00:21:59,997 "Okay, he's Jewish. 435 00:21:59,997 --> 00:22:02,490 This shall be interesting." 436 00:22:02,490 --> 00:22:03,790 Being that I'm a Christian. 437 00:22:03,790 --> 00:22:07,040 But then we sat down and started talking. 438 00:22:07,040 --> 00:22:09,700 At first I was apprehensive, not because of anything else 439 00:22:09,700 --> 00:22:12,230 besides the fact that he was a male. 440 00:22:13,200 --> 00:22:15,760 And to talk about the things that Oliver did to me, 441 00:22:15,760 --> 00:22:18,140 in front of a man was difficult. 442 00:22:19,214 --> 00:22:21,130 But then I watched him and he made eye contact 443 00:22:21,130 --> 00:22:25,730 with me, and his eyes told me that, "It's okay." 444 00:22:27,980 --> 00:22:30,910 - Whenever I talk to Debbie, or I'm getting into Debbie's 445 00:22:30,910 --> 00:22:33,590 mind about why she reacted the way she did to Oliver, 446 00:22:33,590 --> 00:22:37,160 and the way that she would become around him, it's so 447 00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:38,970 familiar, it's so personal to me. 448 00:22:38,970 --> 00:22:41,030 And that's obviously because of my mother's 449 00:22:41,030 --> 00:22:43,140 experience and my experience. 450 00:22:43,140 --> 00:22:48,140 When I was about nine, she met a refugee who was on the run. 451 00:22:48,620 --> 00:22:52,027 My Mom fell for him, and I remember they got 452 00:22:52,027 --> 00:22:54,100 into an argument and they were arguing, 453 00:22:54,100 --> 00:22:56,830 and I was upstairs in my little room. 454 00:22:56,830 --> 00:23:01,690 And I could just feel the anger and intensity 455 00:23:01,690 --> 00:23:06,690 in the room increasing below me until suddenly, 456 00:23:06,690 --> 00:23:09,950 there were bottles being smashed 457 00:23:09,950 --> 00:23:12,340 and he was just beating the hell out of my Mom. 458 00:23:12,340 --> 00:23:15,440 And I remember being this kid and wanting so desperately 459 00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:17,890 to go down and help my Mom, and at the same 460 00:23:17,890 --> 00:23:21,650 time being so afraid that I was gonna be killed. 461 00:23:21,650 --> 00:23:23,740 And then feeling guilty that my fear 462 00:23:23,740 --> 00:23:26,760 for my own safety was trumping helping my mother. 463 00:23:26,760 --> 00:23:30,050 And just feeling the shame and of course total panic and 464 00:23:30,050 --> 00:23:32,760 fear that my mother was gonna be killed. 465 00:23:32,760 --> 00:23:35,260 I feel in a certain sense, in those moments that she and my 466 00:23:35,260 --> 00:23:38,090 mother kind of metaphorically connect. 467 00:23:38,090 --> 00:23:40,480 Debbie's experience is in some way is an 468 00:23:40,480 --> 00:23:42,950 extension of what could have or would have happened, 469 00:23:42,950 --> 00:23:44,550 had my mother and I not escaped. 470 00:23:47,350 --> 00:23:50,947 - Like Joshua I also have experience with abuse. 471 00:23:50,947 --> 00:23:55,160 Unlike Joshua, I have not wanted to speak about this 472 00:23:55,160 --> 00:24:00,160 publicly and I still don't want to share details with it 473 00:24:00,370 --> 00:24:04,240 because of, it being a very private experience for me. 474 00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:09,240 However, it's been important for me to summon 475 00:24:09,790 --> 00:24:14,350 the courage to discuss what I can as part of this film 476 00:24:14,350 --> 00:24:17,480 in order to let people know that abuse doesn't just 477 00:24:17,480 --> 00:24:21,694 happen in South Central LA to young black women. 478 00:24:21,694 --> 00:24:24,410 It happens everywhere. 479 00:24:24,410 --> 00:24:27,460 It happened to me as a child and also as a young adult, 480 00:24:27,460 --> 00:24:31,030 all the time while I was living in affluent communities, 481 00:24:31,030 --> 00:24:32,830 and it was never stopped. 482 00:24:32,830 --> 00:24:36,100 It's one of the reasons that I became involved in Debbie's 483 00:24:36,100 --> 00:24:38,560 case and why we work for her freedom today. 484 00:24:40,340 --> 00:24:41,370 - They don't have to do it. 485 00:24:41,370 --> 00:24:42,820 They're not getting a dime. 486 00:24:48,347 --> 00:24:49,620 And they don't know me. 487 00:24:49,620 --> 00:24:50,650 I was a stranger. 488 00:24:50,650 --> 00:24:52,820 And they're spending so much of their 489 00:24:52,820 --> 00:24:56,860 time and money and efforts to get me out of here. 490 00:25:09,570 --> 00:25:14,220 - Okay, so this is Debbie free. 491 00:25:14,220 --> 00:25:16,370 Where she wants to be, where we want her to be. 492 00:25:16,370 --> 00:25:19,210 And when she gets out of prison she wants to hear the sound 493 00:25:19,210 --> 00:25:22,570 of the Pacific Ocean and that's where we want her to be. 494 00:25:22,570 --> 00:25:24,680 Sadly, she's still here. 495 00:25:24,680 --> 00:25:25,513 She's in prison. 496 00:25:26,770 --> 00:25:28,810 You go to the parole board and you say, 497 00:25:28,810 --> 00:25:31,300 "Hey, I may have done some bad things, 498 00:25:31,300 --> 00:25:32,990 "but I've been a great prisoner since I've been on the 499 00:25:32,990 --> 00:25:36,530 "inside, I'm rehabilitated, I'm ready to rejoin society." 500 00:25:36,530 --> 00:25:39,500 Parole board typically says, "No you're not." 501 00:25:39,500 --> 00:25:42,170 And the D.A.'s Office, the prosecutors who put you in 502 00:25:42,170 --> 00:25:44,460 in the first place, usually chime in and says 503 00:25:44,460 --> 00:25:46,430 "No, they're not, send 'em back." 504 00:25:46,430 --> 00:25:49,390 But even if the parole board finds you suitable, it then 505 00:25:49,390 --> 00:25:52,240 goes to the governor, and the governor nine times outta ten 506 00:25:52,240 --> 00:25:55,590 says "No, send her back to prison." 507 00:25:55,590 --> 00:25:57,700 The other route which is also remote is to go back to 508 00:25:57,700 --> 00:26:00,600 court, the court that sent Debbie to prison in the first 509 00:26:00,600 --> 00:26:04,530 place and say we want to file a habeas petition, 510 00:26:04,530 --> 00:26:07,340 a petition for writ of habeas corpus which says, 511 00:26:07,340 --> 00:26:09,400 something about the way Debbie was put in prison in the 512 00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:12,980 first place wasn't right and she should be released. 513 00:26:12,980 --> 00:26:15,880 So we would file this habeas petition to the court. 514 00:26:15,880 --> 00:26:18,380 Nine time out of ten the court just sends it back and 515 00:26:18,380 --> 00:26:20,680 says, "Nope, you're not getting out." 516 00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:24,030 The D.A. usually chimes in and says "Nope, send 'em back." 517 00:26:24,030 --> 00:26:27,060 So, it's a pretty bleak process to be able to, to get out. 518 00:26:27,060 --> 00:26:28,510 It's pretty impossible 519 00:26:28,510 --> 00:26:31,160 Now, fortunately for Debbie, and for untold number of 520 00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:33,290 women like her, there's a new law that says, 521 00:26:33,290 --> 00:26:35,570 "Hey, if you can provide evidence of 522 00:26:35,570 --> 00:26:38,470 "abuse, of battering, and you can show that that evidence 523 00:26:38,470 --> 00:26:40,580 "of battering is related to the reason you were put in 524 00:26:40,580 --> 00:26:43,190 "prison in the first place, you should be able to present 525 00:26:43,190 --> 00:26:45,780 "that to the court, and the court, for the first time, 526 00:26:45,780 --> 00:26:47,180 "should take you seriously." 527 00:26:47,180 --> 00:26:49,600 The other thing that the new law says is, if you present 528 00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:52,280 that evidence to the parole board, the parole board has 529 00:26:52,280 --> 00:26:55,030 to consider that evidence, side by side with what 530 00:26:55,030 --> 00:26:57,270 they're supposed to be looking at, which is 531 00:26:57,270 --> 00:26:59,290 has Debbie been a model inmate? 532 00:26:59,290 --> 00:27:01,150 And I'm hopeful that through what we've been able to 533 00:27:01,150 --> 00:27:03,970 document, that we should be able to show that she is 534 00:27:03,970 --> 00:27:06,330 suitable for release and that's certainly going to 535 00:27:06,330 --> 00:27:08,630 be bolstered by the footage that you obtained. 536 00:27:10,830 --> 00:27:15,670 - So, here we go, a six person film crew, four cameras, 537 00:27:15,670 --> 00:27:17,400 eight lights, all of this has been 538 00:27:17,400 --> 00:27:19,850 approved to come into the prison. 539 00:27:19,850 --> 00:27:22,660 There's a reason why you don't hear about stories 540 00:27:22,660 --> 00:27:25,220 like Debbie's, the Department of Corrections 541 00:27:25,220 --> 00:27:28,420 in this state and in many states does not allow the 542 00:27:28,420 --> 00:27:32,570 media to film the stories of specific inmates. 543 00:27:32,570 --> 00:27:35,730 Fortunately, Joshua and Nadia have decided that it's 544 00:27:35,730 --> 00:27:39,200 in Debbie's legal interest for her story to be documented, 545 00:27:39,200 --> 00:27:42,591 and so I've been brought in as her legal videographer. 546 00:27:42,591 --> 00:27:45,030 But that's not what's happening today. 547 00:27:45,030 --> 00:27:47,670 Today, we're making a separate documentary 548 00:27:47,670 --> 00:27:50,340 about inmates who rehabilitate themselves 549 00:27:50,340 --> 00:27:53,330 through various programs at the prison, so there's a arts 550 00:27:53,330 --> 00:27:57,190 and crafts program, there's a firefighter training program, 551 00:27:57,190 --> 00:28:00,450 we've even filmed the first ever behind bars bat-mitzvah. 552 00:28:02,450 --> 00:28:05,330 If it happens that Debbie Peagler is involved in some 553 00:28:05,330 --> 00:28:07,940 of the activities we film, so be it. 554 00:28:09,102 --> 00:28:12,341 ♪ Some say he is the great one the prophets spoke of ♪ 555 00:28:12,341 --> 00:28:16,423 ♪ Some even say that he's the man who was the son of God ♪ 556 00:28:16,423 --> 00:28:21,423 ♪ He the stranger, stranger, stranger from Galilee ♪ 557 00:28:25,543 --> 00:28:28,420 ♪ Hey the man from Galilee ♪ 558 00:28:28,420 --> 00:28:32,630 - As she's there, since she's been there, she's taking a 559 00:28:32,630 --> 00:28:36,220 negative situation and made it into a positive situation. 560 00:28:38,950 --> 00:28:42,180 - She works in an electronics manufacturing company, she's 561 00:28:42,180 --> 00:28:44,970 one of the highest paid employees in the prison system. 562 00:28:44,970 --> 00:28:47,630 - I'm in charge of everything that they build here, 563 00:28:47,630 --> 00:28:50,566 including the PC boards, those kits, all the harnesses, 564 00:28:50,566 --> 00:28:53,190 transformers, everything that they build in here, it's my 565 00:28:53,190 --> 00:28:55,890 job to identify those parts, make sure they're accurate, 566 00:28:55,890 --> 00:28:58,495 they're correct, and that it ships out on its date. 567 00:28:58,495 --> 00:29:03,096 - I met Deborah in prison, I was a heroin addict, in my 568 00:29:03,096 --> 00:29:07,660 addiction, really in it, that's all I knew. 569 00:29:07,660 --> 00:29:11,940 And she used to talk to me and talk to me and talk to me. 570 00:29:11,940 --> 00:29:14,020 She seen something in me, she told me I 571 00:29:14,020 --> 00:29:15,520 would overcome that addiction. 572 00:29:17,446 --> 00:29:19,130 - Dear heavenly father we just come together on this morning 573 00:29:19,130 --> 00:29:21,800 thanking you first of all, waking us up. 574 00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:24,180 Clothing our right mind, Lord. 575 00:29:24,180 --> 00:29:25,240 Father God, we thank you that we have the 576 00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:27,647 activities of our limbs, Father God, that we can use 577 00:29:27,647 --> 00:29:28,676 our hands and our feet. 578 00:29:28,676 --> 00:29:31,619 And we just continue to give you the honor, the glory! 579 00:29:31,619 --> 00:29:33,060 And the praise! 580 00:29:33,060 --> 00:29:36,480 - Today, I'm a drug and alcohol counselor, and I'm about to 581 00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:39,550 get my bachelor's degree, and I owe that to Deborah. 582 00:29:40,500 --> 00:29:43,510 - She's been a church leader for 15 years, she's taken 583 00:29:43,510 --> 00:29:46,480 sign language and actually interprets for the deaf 584 00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:50,020 inmates at the church services. 585 00:29:50,020 --> 00:29:53,480 - Receiving her Associate's Degree, Deborah Peagler. 586 00:30:00,190 --> 00:30:04,533 - I'm very proud of myself, my tenacity, my resilience. 587 00:30:04,533 --> 00:30:09,260 I try to be everyday an example, a mentor. 588 00:30:09,260 --> 00:30:11,200 I am a tutor of a few of the ladies that are getting 589 00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:14,480 ready to take their GEDs, and have taken their GEDs. 590 00:30:14,480 --> 00:30:16,590 So it's one of the things I really enjoy 591 00:30:16,590 --> 00:30:18,060 is helping someone else learn. 592 00:30:19,350 --> 00:30:23,420 - She has a lot of wisdom, not from God only, but I told her 593 00:30:23,420 --> 00:30:25,970 "I wanna to go to school, I can't read and write." 594 00:30:25,970 --> 00:30:27,780 And she's very intelligent, 595 00:30:27,780 --> 00:30:31,370 she is a very smart person, Deborah Peagler is. 596 00:30:31,370 --> 00:30:34,490 - I was able to help her learn to read and write. 597 00:30:35,720 --> 00:30:38,150 Eventually even acquire her GED. 598 00:30:38,150 --> 00:30:41,490 - She told me to go to school, and they'll take care of me. 599 00:30:41,490 --> 00:30:44,930 She told me that God has a plan for my life. 600 00:30:44,930 --> 00:30:46,380 - One more time, "Anointing." 601 00:30:47,288 --> 00:30:50,943 - Another thing Debbie has going for her at least in theory, 602 00:30:50,943 --> 00:30:52,570 for the parole board, are the 603 00:30:52,570 --> 00:30:55,120 sentiments of Oliver Wilson's family. 604 00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:58,160 - I don't believe I'm supposed to identify with her, 605 00:30:58,160 --> 00:31:02,060 somewhere in me, I'm not supposed to accept what has 606 00:31:02,060 --> 00:31:05,890 been done and I'm caught in the catch-22 607 00:31:05,890 --> 00:31:09,200 because maybe I shouldn't even be able to identify with 608 00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:13,500 it, maybe I shouldn't be able to understand it, but I do. 609 00:31:15,320 --> 00:31:19,820 And that's a terrible thing I think, for me to say. 610 00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:24,050 If it were not my brother, if it was 611 00:31:24,050 --> 00:31:26,970 some man that didn't have a face, that didn't really have 612 00:31:26,970 --> 00:31:30,896 a name, but I knew that he was doing these terrible things, 613 00:31:30,896 --> 00:31:35,896 then I would say, put me at the head of the fan club. 614 00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:40,580 I'd fight for you. 615 00:31:40,580 --> 00:31:42,490 I'd do what I could do to get you out. 616 00:31:45,380 --> 00:31:47,890 - Debbie has been up for parole. 617 00:31:47,890 --> 00:31:52,890 That hearing is very biased in favor of the prosecution. 618 00:31:53,090 --> 00:31:55,310 - I went before parole board, 619 00:31:55,310 --> 00:31:59,403 and here I sat, as Oliver's sister. 620 00:31:59,403 --> 00:32:02,659 And in my mind, the closest one to him, 621 00:32:02,659 --> 00:32:06,529 by way of age and growing up together. 622 00:32:06,529 --> 00:32:09,870 I poured my heart out to these people. 623 00:32:09,870 --> 00:32:13,000 And after pouring my heart out, they still said no, 624 00:32:14,159 --> 00:32:16,550 and refused to let Debbie go. 625 00:32:18,120 --> 00:32:21,681 - It seems to me they should have taken the family's 626 00:32:21,681 --> 00:32:25,340 opinion into consideration. 627 00:32:25,340 --> 00:32:26,670 Enough is enough. 628 00:32:26,670 --> 00:32:28,850 She's served a life. 629 00:32:28,850 --> 00:32:32,120 She doesn't have to suffer anymore, as far as I'm concerned. 630 00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:35,700 - She has been denied three separate times. 631 00:32:35,700 --> 00:32:39,018 - I've met parole board battered women's investigators, 632 00:32:39,018 --> 00:32:41,650 and why they can't find out the things that we 633 00:32:41,650 --> 00:32:43,610 find out so easily is a mystery to me. 634 00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:49,020 They have all the powers to go do that and yet they seem to 635 00:32:49,020 --> 00:32:51,680 not see some of the obvious things. 636 00:32:51,680 --> 00:32:54,350 It feels like they're trying to find reasons to 637 00:32:54,350 --> 00:32:56,946 deny it rather than trying to find reasons to 638 00:32:56,946 --> 00:33:00,115 support information that may be readily available. 639 00:33:00,115 --> 00:33:03,920 - So until the parole board acknowledges that she was a 640 00:33:03,920 --> 00:33:08,110 battered woman, she was abused, she's never gonna get out. 641 00:33:08,986 --> 00:33:12,890 - She winds up leaving that parole hearing just in 642 00:33:12,890 --> 00:33:14,940 disbelief, and not knowing where to turn. 643 00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:18,700 - If life happens to deliver a situation to you that you 644 00:33:18,700 --> 00:33:21,860 cannot handle, do not attempt to resolve it. 645 00:33:21,860 --> 00:33:26,048 Kindly put it in the something for God to do box, amen. 646 00:33:26,048 --> 00:33:30,893 - Initially, it was always, you know "I hope my Mom is 647 00:33:30,893 --> 00:33:35,893 "doing okay, and I wish she could come home and be with me." 648 00:33:37,300 --> 00:33:42,300 And then, you know, as I got older, it was like well, 649 00:33:43,630 --> 00:33:46,875 "Thank you Jesus that I have her to talk to on the phone." 650 00:33:46,875 --> 00:33:51,170 At least she's there for me in some other way, y'know. 651 00:33:52,190 --> 00:33:54,550 - Despite being behind bars, Debbie has really done 652 00:33:54,550 --> 00:33:57,140 everything in her power to be a good mother to both of her 653 00:33:57,140 --> 00:34:00,260 daughters, her oldest daughter Tikisha, who's currently 654 00:34:00,260 --> 00:34:03,000 serving in the Air Force in the Iraq War, and her 655 00:34:03,000 --> 00:34:05,850 younger daughter Natasha, whose father was Oliver Wilson. 656 00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:10,860 - My relationship with my Mom is very, very, very good. 657 00:34:11,999 --> 00:34:13,340 I think that due to the circumstances, 658 00:34:13,340 --> 00:34:14,923 it's the best that it can be. 659 00:34:14,923 --> 00:34:17,215 - Lord prepare. 660 00:34:17,215 --> 00:34:21,548 ♪ Lord prepare me to be a sanctuary ♪ 661 00:34:25,596 --> 00:34:27,416 - Pure and holy. 662 00:34:27,416 --> 00:34:29,567 ♪ Pure and holy ♪ 663 00:34:29,567 --> 00:34:30,533 - Tried and true. 664 00:34:30,533 --> 00:34:33,950 ♪ Tried and true ♪ 665 00:34:33,950 --> 00:34:35,444 - With thanksgiving. 666 00:34:35,444 --> 00:34:38,686 ♪ With thanksgiving ♪ 667 00:34:38,686 --> 00:34:39,910 - I'll be a living. 668 00:34:39,910 --> 00:34:42,765 ♪ I'll be a living. ♪ 669 00:34:42,765 --> 00:34:44,006 - Sanctuary. 670 00:34:44,006 --> 00:34:47,006 ♪ Sanctuary for you ♪ 671 00:34:55,760 --> 00:34:59,140 - It's hard, because I try to have such 672 00:34:59,140 --> 00:35:00,690 a strong relationship with her. 673 00:35:01,803 --> 00:35:03,400 But you can't. 674 00:35:04,520 --> 00:35:08,270 If I had to compare my Mom's and my Dad's loss, 675 00:35:08,270 --> 00:35:12,310 to figure out which one is harder, it's my Mom. 676 00:35:12,310 --> 00:35:15,130 Because it's a everyday pain you're dealing with. 677 00:35:15,130 --> 00:35:16,210 It's a everyday thing. 678 00:35:16,210 --> 00:35:17,730 It's constant. 679 00:35:17,730 --> 00:35:20,920 It's not something that, "He died. 680 00:35:20,920 --> 00:35:23,410 "Let's grieve, and move on." 681 00:35:23,410 --> 00:35:25,670 It's a grieving process that never ends. 682 00:35:29,403 --> 00:35:32,163 ♪ Seek me, and ye shall find ♪ 683 00:35:32,163 --> 00:35:35,493 ♪ They gonna give you a hard time ♪ 684 00:35:35,493 --> 00:35:38,554 ♪ Been waiting my whole life ♪ 685 00:35:38,554 --> 00:35:42,471 ♪ For someone to make it right ♪ 686 00:35:45,210 --> 00:35:47,510 - Debbie's case has been almost a full time job 687 00:35:47,510 --> 00:35:49,530 in addition to our regular legal practice. 688 00:35:49,530 --> 00:35:51,420 This is a private law office, 689 00:35:51,420 --> 00:35:52,770 this is not what we normally do. 690 00:35:52,770 --> 00:35:56,280 We do land use and real-estate, development law, 691 00:35:56,280 --> 00:35:58,904 you know, if you come to me I can get you zoned 692 00:35:58,904 --> 00:36:00,707 to be an airport if that's what you want. 693 00:36:00,707 --> 00:36:04,160 But I don't represent inmates, people charged with crimes, 694 00:36:04,160 --> 00:36:07,590 criminals, this is a whole new experience for us. 695 00:36:07,590 --> 00:36:10,100 - Joshua and I were almost paralyzed 696 00:36:10,100 --> 00:36:11,780 at the beginning of this case. 697 00:36:11,780 --> 00:36:14,460 How do you go about finding hospital records, 698 00:36:14,460 --> 00:36:17,680 police records, witnesses from 25 years ago? 699 00:36:17,680 --> 00:36:22,200 But then I realized that Debbie is in fact the key to this 700 00:36:22,200 --> 00:36:25,060 case, because as soon as you meet Debbie you want to 701 00:36:25,060 --> 00:36:27,410 help her and you want to be involved in getting 702 00:36:27,410 --> 00:36:30,360 her out of prison, and that's how we got Bobby. 703 00:36:30,360 --> 00:36:32,320 - It's Bobby Buechler, Debbie Peagler's 704 00:36:32,320 --> 00:36:34,420 investigator, and we spoke a few days ago. 705 00:36:35,410 --> 00:36:37,010 I'm in LA. 706 00:36:37,010 --> 00:36:38,870 We're all really different people 707 00:36:38,870 --> 00:36:41,730 Nadia she's this long distance runner, 708 00:36:41,730 --> 00:36:44,056 Joshua's this Orthodox Jew, 709 00:36:44,056 --> 00:36:48,570 and I'm the old man of the group I would say. 710 00:36:49,533 --> 00:36:53,627 I've been an investigator for approximately 25 years. 711 00:36:53,627 --> 00:36:58,380 Also I've worked as a journalist for New York Times, 712 00:36:58,380 --> 00:37:01,910 Vanity Fair, CBS Evening News, 60 Minutes, 713 00:37:01,910 --> 00:37:03,960 but primarily I'm a private investigator. 714 00:37:04,820 --> 00:37:06,580 - Before we hired Bobby we had a couple of other 715 00:37:06,580 --> 00:37:10,320 investigators on the case who were unable to find anything. 716 00:37:10,320 --> 00:37:12,952 We got Bobby, within 24 hours, documents started 717 00:37:12,952 --> 00:37:16,190 flowing in, and from those documents we began to get a 718 00:37:16,190 --> 00:37:20,080 sense of the real deficiencies in the D.A.'s case. 719 00:37:20,080 --> 00:37:22,910 - You know, we had heard from Debbie for a long time that 720 00:37:22,910 --> 00:37:26,180 Tikisha may have been molested by Oliver. 721 00:37:26,180 --> 00:37:29,740 But we were shocked when we learned that there was actual 722 00:37:29,740 --> 00:37:33,460 evidence of this in the police report that had been ignored. 723 00:37:46,030 --> 00:37:49,770 For so long this killing had been framed as simply about 724 00:37:49,770 --> 00:37:51,720 life insurance proceeds and to learn 725 00:37:51,720 --> 00:37:55,270 that the police knew also that he may have 726 00:37:55,270 --> 00:37:59,240 molested her was obviously very disturbing to us. 727 00:37:59,240 --> 00:38:02,090 - We knew that we had to talk to Tikisha 728 00:38:02,090 --> 00:38:05,470 about the alleged abuse, so when was rotated back to the 729 00:38:05,470 --> 00:38:09,490 United States between tours of duty, we went to see her. 730 00:38:09,490 --> 00:38:12,880 - I sat with Tikisha and asked her the very difficult 731 00:38:12,880 --> 00:38:17,880 question of whether she recalled Oliver ever molesting her. 732 00:38:18,120 --> 00:38:21,620 And she just looked off into the distance 733 00:38:21,620 --> 00:38:24,700 and tears welled up in her eyes, and then she shared 734 00:38:24,700 --> 00:38:28,493 with me very vivid recollections of what Oliver 735 00:38:28,493 --> 00:38:33,300 had done in terms of abuse to her as a young child. 736 00:38:35,620 --> 00:38:38,450 - The hearing transcript from Deborah's preliminary hearing 737 00:38:38,450 --> 00:38:43,450 in 1983 shows that the prosecution had only had one witness. 738 00:38:43,590 --> 00:38:46,180 - The judge characterized this witness' testimony 739 00:38:46,180 --> 00:38:50,030 as "pretty poor" and "extremely ambiguous." 740 00:38:50,030 --> 00:38:52,270 - What was fishy about this guy who called in 741 00:38:52,270 --> 00:38:55,350 Oliver Wilson's murder to the police was 742 00:38:55,350 --> 00:38:58,802 that he was initially only identified as "Deadman," 743 00:38:58,802 --> 00:39:00,770 which is a pretty weird name. 744 00:39:01,750 --> 00:39:04,370 We subsequently found out this was a nickname because 745 00:39:04,370 --> 00:39:07,450 used to drive dead bodies for the county coroner. 746 00:39:07,450 --> 00:39:09,040 - He was a drug customer of Oliver's, 747 00:39:09,040 --> 00:39:11,230 he was a friend of Oliver's. 748 00:39:11,230 --> 00:39:14,270 - But he waited many months to contact the 749 00:39:14,270 --> 00:39:16,700 police to tell them what he claimed he knew 750 00:39:16,700 --> 00:39:18,470 about the murder of Oliver Wilson. 751 00:39:18,470 --> 00:39:22,140 So when Bobby tracked him down he was in and out of 752 00:39:22,140 --> 00:39:23,800 the hospital with a life threatening illness 753 00:39:23,800 --> 00:39:27,680 and we thought, y'know, what better time to confront 754 00:39:27,680 --> 00:39:30,740 him and say, "What's the truth?" 755 00:39:38,580 --> 00:39:39,640 - I have cancer now. 756 00:39:40,490 --> 00:39:42,650 I don't know how much time I have left. 757 00:39:42,650 --> 00:39:44,850 So I just want the truth to be known. 758 00:39:44,850 --> 00:39:46,360 Debbie deserves to be free, 759 00:39:46,360 --> 00:39:48,090 she deserves the truth to be known 760 00:39:49,810 --> 00:39:52,650 I never volunteered that she was being beat up. 761 00:39:52,650 --> 00:39:55,300 Y'know, where he had whupping her with that bullwhip. 762 00:39:56,189 --> 00:39:58,125 Y'know, didn't let her answer the door, 763 00:39:58,125 --> 00:40:00,110 wouldn't open the door for nobody. 764 00:40:01,110 --> 00:40:05,100 Y'know, so it was rough for her, so. 765 00:40:06,180 --> 00:40:09,876 And I know, if that was rough for her in there, 766 00:40:09,876 --> 00:40:14,820 for 20-some years, her whole life is destroyed, man. 767 00:40:20,540 --> 00:40:23,030 - The other thing that we began to get from Tony was an 768 00:40:23,030 --> 00:40:26,080 explanation as to why he waited so long to contact the 769 00:40:26,080 --> 00:40:29,756 police, and apparently, for all the years that Debbie 770 00:40:29,756 --> 00:40:33,726 and Oliver were together, Tony had been deeply 771 00:40:33,726 --> 00:40:36,140 and secretly in love with Debbie. 772 00:40:37,810 --> 00:40:40,450 - Deborah was a beautiful, beautiful girl. 773 00:40:40,450 --> 00:40:41,920 I really loved her. 774 00:40:42,800 --> 00:40:46,650 I fell for her like Kennedy fell for Marilyn Monroe. 775 00:40:50,750 --> 00:40:53,600 - I didn't think he even liked me like that. 776 00:40:53,600 --> 00:40:56,480 Because I knew he had a wife, he had a wife and children. 777 00:40:56,480 --> 00:40:59,500 - Tony was trying to court Debbie, he wanted to be with 778 00:40:59,500 --> 00:41:02,290 her, but now that she was free of Oliver, 779 00:41:02,290 --> 00:41:04,140 Debbie went back to Tikisha's father. 780 00:41:05,110 --> 00:41:09,100 - I got jealous, and I told everything. 781 00:41:09,100 --> 00:41:12,451 Ripped my heart apart, so I'd rip her heart apart. 782 00:41:12,451 --> 00:41:14,710 I called Sheriff's. 783 00:41:14,710 --> 00:41:16,147 Homicide. 784 00:41:16,147 --> 00:41:20,510 I told 'em every thing that I knew, 785 00:41:20,510 --> 00:41:24,720 and I mighta added something to it. 786 00:41:26,820 --> 00:41:28,976 I tell you, whatever I told them, 787 00:41:28,976 --> 00:41:33,500 it worked because they had her within two days. 788 00:41:37,130 --> 00:41:41,470 - As bad as it was, what Tony did, what was even worse was 789 00:41:41,470 --> 00:41:43,850 for the D.A. to know that he was lying, 790 00:41:43,850 --> 00:41:45,570 and to put him on the stand anyway. 791 00:41:45,570 --> 00:41:47,460 - When he heard that they were gonna prosecute 792 00:41:47,460 --> 00:41:50,380 Debbie for the death penalty, he tried to back 793 00:41:50,380 --> 00:41:52,870 out but the D.A. wouldn't let him. 794 00:41:52,870 --> 00:41:56,150 In fact, he was arrested, and he was told that 795 00:41:56,150 --> 00:41:58,990 unless he testified against Debbie Peagler, 796 00:41:58,990 --> 00:42:01,660 they would vigorously prosecute him for an old 797 00:42:01,660 --> 00:42:04,170 felony charge that had basically been dormant. 798 00:42:06,220 --> 00:42:10,415 - They kept pushing, wanted me to say, that Deborah told me, 799 00:42:10,415 --> 00:42:13,300 after Oliver was killed, that she had pre-planned 800 00:42:13,300 --> 00:42:17,066 for him to be killed, that it was a murder 801 00:42:17,066 --> 00:42:20,310 for hire, and, no it wasn't. 802 00:42:21,270 --> 00:42:26,270 The regret is mostly that I didn't think about her 803 00:42:27,790 --> 00:42:32,790 being beat up or held hostage, being a ho. 804 00:42:33,900 --> 00:42:38,010 I didn't look at all that, for what she was going through. 805 00:42:38,850 --> 00:42:43,850 But I did it and I have to live with it. 806 00:42:53,780 --> 00:42:58,780 - I believe a tremendous injustice has occurred. 807 00:42:59,070 --> 00:43:01,710 - David Guthman is a recently retired prosecutor from the 808 00:43:01,710 --> 00:43:04,650 L.A. D.A.'s Office, and while he didn't have anything to do 809 00:43:04,650 --> 00:43:08,200 with Debbie's prosecution, he has significant experience in 810 00:43:08,200 --> 00:43:10,890 prosecuting death penalty cases in that office. 811 00:43:10,890 --> 00:43:12,810 So we gathered our materials up showed 812 00:43:12,810 --> 00:43:14,630 them to him and we asked him. 813 00:43:14,630 --> 00:43:18,927 - Was Deborah's level of culpability truly reflected 814 00:43:18,927 --> 00:43:22,220 with a conviction of 1st degree murder? 815 00:43:22,220 --> 00:43:23,920 Absolutely not. 816 00:43:23,920 --> 00:43:27,050 - In evaluating Debbie's case, David Guthman went to speak 817 00:43:27,050 --> 00:43:29,910 to the prosecutor at the LA D.A.'s office who is in 818 00:43:29,910 --> 00:43:33,510 charge of the parole unit that has custody of Debbie's file. 819 00:43:33,510 --> 00:43:36,580 He said "Come down and I'll let you look at the file." 820 00:43:36,580 --> 00:43:39,770 When I actually met with the prosecutor, he said, 821 00:43:39,770 --> 00:43:41,960 "I can't let you look at the file, but 822 00:43:41,960 --> 00:43:44,680 "I can tell you what's in the file." 823 00:43:44,680 --> 00:43:47,990 In the file there a memo, which typically is 824 00:43:47,990 --> 00:43:52,320 referred to as, an alibi memo. 825 00:43:52,320 --> 00:43:55,980 - An alibi memo is actually the prosecutor's own alibi as to 826 00:43:55,980 --> 00:43:58,617 why they are not pursuing death penalty where they had 827 00:43:58,617 --> 00:44:01,170 attempted to get the death penalty, and where they'd 828 00:44:01,170 --> 00:44:02,900 gotten approval for the death penalty 829 00:44:02,900 --> 00:44:05,600 from higher ups in the D.A.'s office. 830 00:44:05,600 --> 00:44:07,270 So it was shocking to us to discover 831 00:44:07,270 --> 00:44:10,202 that there was this alibi memo saying that the D.A. 832 00:44:10,202 --> 00:44:13,635 couldn't and shouldn't seek the death penalty because the 833 00:44:13,635 --> 00:44:16,650 D.A. did seek the death penalty. 834 00:44:16,650 --> 00:44:17,950 They threatened Debbie with the death 835 00:44:17,950 --> 00:44:20,650 penalty, and it was because of the death penalty threat 836 00:44:20,650 --> 00:44:24,447 that she took a plea to life in prison. 837 00:44:24,447 --> 00:44:28,320 - I'm sitting there hopefully with a poker face realizing 838 00:44:28,320 --> 00:44:30,575 that that memo was dynamite. 839 00:44:30,575 --> 00:44:34,940 And when I left that meeting I immediately called Deborah's 840 00:44:34,940 --> 00:44:38,640 attorneys and told them what was contained in that memo. 841 00:44:38,640 --> 00:44:41,280 - So according to David Guthman, this memo says, way 842 00:44:41,280 --> 00:44:44,860 back in 1983, the D.A.'s office had concluded that 843 00:44:44,860 --> 00:44:47,190 Oliver Wilson had molested Debbie's daughter, which is 844 00:44:47,190 --> 00:44:49,550 something we'd suspected but have never been able to 845 00:44:49,550 --> 00:44:53,310 prove, the D.A.'s office concluded that Debbie's 846 00:44:53,310 --> 00:44:56,250 motivation wasn't financial gain, which was their whole 847 00:44:56,250 --> 00:45:00,680 basis for prosecution back then, and the memo concludes 848 00:45:00,680 --> 00:45:03,730 that they had "veracity concerns" with the witness or 849 00:45:03,730 --> 00:45:06,840 witnesses required to prosecute Debbie. 850 00:45:06,840 --> 00:45:09,210 So back in 1983, they didn't even have a 851 00:45:09,210 --> 00:45:11,260 case against her, they had no evidence. 852 00:45:11,260 --> 00:45:14,450 So going into this big meeting with Steve Cooley 853 00:45:14,450 --> 00:45:16,890 and his top brass today, where we have all this 854 00:45:16,890 --> 00:45:18,610 documentation that Debbie was battered, 855 00:45:18,610 --> 00:45:20,300 I'm feeling really confident that this 856 00:45:20,300 --> 00:45:23,220 is gonna move them to do the right thing. 857 00:45:23,220 --> 00:45:25,920 - Getting the prosecutors to agree that Debbie should be 858 00:45:25,920 --> 00:45:27,880 released did not happen overnight. 859 00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:30,597 It took more than three years to get them, 860 00:45:30,597 --> 00:45:34,342 to see the light and it was at time that we were able to 861 00:45:34,342 --> 00:45:38,410 walk into that prison and give Debbie that letter. 862 00:45:46,536 --> 00:45:48,393 - Hello, Ms. Deborah. - Hi! 863 00:45:48,393 --> 00:45:51,056 Good to see you! 864 00:45:51,056 --> 00:45:52,590 Hi Joshua! 865 00:45:52,590 --> 00:45:54,453 - You knew we were coming, didn't you? 866 00:45:54,453 --> 00:45:55,286 - Yeah. 867 00:45:55,286 --> 00:45:57,270 - We have bad news and we have good news. 868 00:45:57,270 --> 00:45:59,390 The bad news is that you have 869 00:45:59,390 --> 00:46:01,670 apparently been incarcerated illegally. 870 00:46:01,670 --> 00:46:05,980 The good news is, the D.A. has agreed that 871 00:46:05,980 --> 00:46:09,760 your crime was voluntary manslaughter, which means 872 00:46:09,760 --> 00:46:12,860 your maximum sentence would have been six years, under 873 00:46:12,860 --> 00:46:15,670 the guideline, the penal code section which was in 874 00:46:15,670 --> 00:46:16,800 effect at the time. 875 00:46:16,800 --> 00:46:18,310 We're gonna work with you to explain what it means. 876 00:46:18,310 --> 00:46:19,630 - My God. 877 00:46:19,630 --> 00:46:21,150 - What the next steps are, and help you. 878 00:46:21,150 --> 00:46:23,330 - So this is from the LA District Attorney's Office. 879 00:46:23,330 --> 00:46:26,540 "You presented significant issues which were unknown or 880 00:46:26,540 --> 00:46:28,506 "unavailable at the time of trial. 881 00:46:28,506 --> 00:46:30,530 "Once the matter has been returned to the 882 00:46:30,530 --> 00:46:33,500 "jurisdiction of the Los Angeles Superior Court, this 883 00:46:33,500 --> 00:46:35,890 "office would be willing to offer a plea to one count of 884 00:46:35,890 --> 00:46:38,550 "voluntary manslaughter, in violation of penal code 885 00:46:38,550 --> 00:46:41,750 "section 1-92-A, with credit for the years of 886 00:46:41,750 --> 00:46:43,560 "imprisonment served thus far. 887 00:46:43,560 --> 00:46:46,495 "Such disposition satisfies our office policy of 888 00:46:46,495 --> 00:46:49,819 "requiring a plea to the charge which most accurately 889 00:46:49,819 --> 00:46:52,760 "describes the defendant's criminal conduct. 890 00:46:52,760 --> 00:46:55,550 "In context, it also serves the interests of justice." 891 00:46:55,550 --> 00:46:56,480 - My God! 892 00:47:00,895 --> 00:47:02,740 This is really happening. 893 00:47:03,575 --> 00:47:05,540 It's like, you knew it could happen, 894 00:47:05,540 --> 00:47:07,599 but it's really happening. 895 00:47:07,599 --> 00:47:11,130 - I remember reading it, y'know, tears coming in my 896 00:47:11,130 --> 00:47:16,130 eyes, it was just this overwhelming sense of 897 00:47:16,386 --> 00:47:19,530 relief, that we are finally 898 00:47:19,530 --> 00:47:23,970 helping Debbie unlock that, unlock that gate. 899 00:47:23,970 --> 00:47:24,820 - My goodness! 900 00:47:26,250 --> 00:47:30,630 I still cannot, I am so ecstatically happy, but I'm 901 00:47:30,630 --> 00:47:32,360 so trying to contain it, 902 00:47:32,360 --> 00:47:35,210 cause I so just wanna scream and run around the building. 903 00:47:36,450 --> 00:47:38,840 - When she told me that, y'know I was like, y'know, 904 00:47:38,840 --> 00:47:40,630 "Finally God, you answered my prayers" 905 00:47:40,630 --> 00:47:44,140 Y'know, this is what I really, really needed in my life. 906 00:47:45,100 --> 00:47:46,960 And I know that's, y'know, that's what she's 907 00:47:46,960 --> 00:47:48,980 been praying for and hoping for all these years. 908 00:47:48,980 --> 00:47:51,510 So it was just a sigh of relief. 909 00:47:52,709 --> 00:47:55,510 - It was just almost too much to take in at one time, 910 00:47:55,510 --> 00:47:57,180 because it was just so unbelievable 911 00:47:57,180 --> 00:47:59,300 that my sister is finally coming home. 912 00:48:00,410 --> 00:48:05,200 - I had absolute faith that that letter meant the D.A. 913 00:48:05,200 --> 00:48:06,860 would do the right thing, and that 914 00:48:06,860 --> 00:48:11,550 we would see our client released very shortly. 915 00:48:11,550 --> 00:48:13,350 I had no doubt that it would happen. 916 00:48:14,760 --> 00:48:17,590 - We filed our habeas petition based on that deal, 917 00:48:17,590 --> 00:48:19,767 and a few weeks after filing our habeas petition, 918 00:48:19,767 --> 00:48:22,530 we received a letter from someone else in the 919 00:48:22,530 --> 00:48:24,550 District Attorney's office who we never met before, 920 00:48:24,550 --> 00:48:27,170 saying "The deal is hereby withdrawn." 921 00:48:31,860 --> 00:48:36,710 - God, this just, it's so disheartening to have this letter, 922 00:48:36,710 --> 00:48:38,980 and then someone else come along, and says, 923 00:48:38,980 --> 00:48:40,580 "That letter means nothing." 924 00:48:42,450 --> 00:48:43,770 And someone that really doesn't have the 925 00:48:43,770 --> 00:48:46,190 authority or the power to say that. 926 00:48:46,190 --> 00:48:48,340 I don't get how that happened. 927 00:48:48,340 --> 00:48:50,410 - Our case has seriously called into question 928 00:48:50,410 --> 00:48:53,160 the judgment of District Attorney Steve Cooley. 929 00:48:53,160 --> 00:48:55,920 He broke a written plea agreement with us 930 00:48:55,920 --> 00:48:59,310 in order to instead align himself with prosecutors 931 00:48:59,310 --> 00:49:02,446 who have a well-established record of misconduct. 932 00:49:02,446 --> 00:49:04,080 - And while we don't know exactly what 933 00:49:04,080 --> 00:49:06,190 happened in the LA District Attorney's office, 934 00:49:06,190 --> 00:49:08,410 we do have several indicators. 935 00:49:08,410 --> 00:49:12,150 - One is, the D.A.'s office asked us to have Debbie waive 936 00:49:12,150 --> 00:49:14,860 all her claims against LA County because they knew of all 937 00:49:14,860 --> 00:49:18,160 the misconduct the D.A.'s Office had been involved in. 938 00:49:18,160 --> 00:49:19,830 We declined to do that. 939 00:49:19,830 --> 00:49:23,610 - And there's a woman named Lael Rubin who is the head of 940 00:49:23,610 --> 00:49:26,350 the Appellate Division, and she apparently became quite 941 00:49:26,350 --> 00:49:29,830 upset when we supposedly went quote "over her head" and 942 00:49:29,830 --> 00:49:32,440 directly went to Steve Cooley instead, because she thought 943 00:49:32,440 --> 00:49:34,460 it should go through her department. 944 00:49:34,460 --> 00:49:38,410 - Lael Rubin is best know for her embarrassing witch hunt 945 00:49:38,410 --> 00:49:40,170 of a trial called the McMartin Preschool 946 00:49:40,170 --> 00:49:43,170 prosecution in which Rubin relied on all kinds of false 947 00:49:43,170 --> 00:49:46,060 evidence and false testimony, and turned out to be one of 948 00:49:46,060 --> 00:49:48,720 the largest failed prosecutions in history. 949 00:49:48,720 --> 00:49:50,950 - All right, look, just because we are 950 00:49:50,950 --> 00:49:52,620 having some trouble with some evidence that 951 00:49:52,620 --> 00:49:55,250 doesn't make these people suddenly innocent. 952 00:49:55,250 --> 00:49:58,470 - Lael Rubin's participation in that case led HBO to make a 953 00:49:58,470 --> 00:50:00,860 made-for-TV movie called "Indictment." 954 00:50:00,860 --> 00:50:02,520 The Lael Rubin character is played by 955 00:50:02,520 --> 00:50:05,890 Mercedes Reuhl and she is clearly the villain. 956 00:50:05,890 --> 00:50:08,200 - There is a smoking gun out there. 957 00:50:08,200 --> 00:50:10,630 I know it, we just gotta find it! 958 00:50:10,630 --> 00:50:13,160 - Meanwhile, the letter that we received from the D.A.'s 959 00:50:13,160 --> 00:50:16,490 office purporting to withdraw the plea agreement that we 960 00:50:16,490 --> 00:50:19,330 had with the District Attorney's office was sent by 961 00:50:19,330 --> 00:50:22,030 a man named Curtis Hazel, the number three guy in the LA 962 00:50:22,030 --> 00:50:24,850 County District Attorney's office, who is purported to be 963 00:50:24,850 --> 00:50:28,070 an old fraternity buddy of District Attorney Steve Cooley. 964 00:50:28,070 --> 00:50:30,660 And his claim to fame was that he slept with a 965 00:50:30,660 --> 00:50:34,110 murder witness, who was a stripper, and the D.A.'s 966 00:50:34,110 --> 00:50:36,680 office kept Hazell's affair secret. 967 00:50:36,680 --> 00:50:39,260 The fact that Cooley has hand selected this group of 968 00:50:39,260 --> 00:50:41,755 misfits is so dispiriting. 969 00:50:41,755 --> 00:50:45,320 But we are going to fight it, we don't care how powerful 970 00:50:45,320 --> 00:50:46,420 they are in the D.A.'s office. 971 00:50:46,420 --> 00:50:48,740 We are not going to let them rip up our plea deal 972 00:50:48,740 --> 00:50:50,440 and keep Debbie in prison forever. 973 00:50:52,230 --> 00:50:54,980 - When we heard this news, and we began researching the 974 00:50:54,980 --> 00:50:58,070 issue, I never felt that kind of pervasive sense of 975 00:50:58,070 --> 00:51:00,200 hopelessness as I had before. 976 00:51:00,200 --> 00:51:03,360 Not only are we right, and so we can feel confident in the 977 00:51:03,360 --> 00:51:05,905 fact that "You guys know you did something wrong here," 978 00:51:05,905 --> 00:51:10,905 we have a case law that supports our position and I feel, 979 00:51:10,950 --> 00:51:13,760 it's not kind of this, often times, y'know how lawyers are. 980 00:51:13,760 --> 00:51:15,370 They don't have any kind of legal position at all, 981 00:51:15,370 --> 00:51:17,080 but they think if they argue effectively 982 00:51:17,080 --> 00:51:18,640 enough they can get around that. 983 00:51:18,640 --> 00:51:19,910 That's often what we do. 984 00:51:19,910 --> 00:51:21,070 - That's often what we do. 985 00:51:21,070 --> 00:51:23,190 - But here we actually have case law that 986 00:51:23,190 --> 00:51:25,620 says this is not acceptable. 987 00:51:25,620 --> 00:51:28,114 Obviously, y'know, we never know what's gonna happen, 988 00:51:28,114 --> 00:51:30,480 but what we will tell you is that we're here, 989 00:51:30,480 --> 00:51:32,580 and we can work through the process with you, 990 00:51:32,580 --> 00:51:35,150 and we have confidence in our abilities, and the fact that 991 00:51:35,150 --> 00:51:38,035 this is the just result it'll ultimately come 992 00:51:38,035 --> 00:51:40,560 to the fact that you will walk out of this prison. 993 00:51:50,831 --> 00:51:53,830 I walk through the front door past our receptionist and she 994 00:51:53,830 --> 00:51:56,540 stopped me and said, "I've been holding this for you." 995 00:51:59,150 --> 00:52:01,630 - The judge denied our habeas petition. 996 00:52:01,630 --> 00:52:04,220 The judge never heard from D.A.'s office, 997 00:52:04,220 --> 00:52:07,990 and the judge didn't even really appear to understand the 998 00:52:07,990 --> 00:52:11,820 new law that we filed it under or even read our papers. 999 00:52:11,820 --> 00:52:16,602 - When I found out that the D.A. reneged on his offer and 1000 00:52:16,602 --> 00:52:18,910 that my sister would not be coming home, 1001 00:52:20,926 --> 00:52:24,300 to be honest with you I got physically ill. 1002 00:52:24,300 --> 00:52:27,840 Because how can you get someone's hopes up so high, 1003 00:52:27,840 --> 00:52:31,740 after serving 20-plus years in jail, and then to 1004 00:52:31,740 --> 00:52:34,791 say, "Okay, well no, we changed our mind." 1005 00:52:34,791 --> 00:52:38,550 It was one of the biggest let downs of my life. 1006 00:52:40,110 --> 00:52:41,970 - But then, that's like the story of my life. 1007 00:52:41,970 --> 00:52:45,310 I go to board, I come back, I go tell people I got denied 1008 00:52:45,310 --> 00:52:47,984 and they're like hysterical and I have to comfort them. 1009 00:52:47,984 --> 00:52:49,981 I never really get a chance to 1010 00:52:49,981 --> 00:52:54,981 "Okay, wait hey, this should be the other way around." 1011 00:52:56,225 --> 00:53:00,060 I am not a robot, I'm a human being with feelings 1012 00:53:00,060 --> 00:53:02,610 and just because I don't wear my problems on my sleeve 1013 00:53:02,610 --> 00:53:04,380 or tell everybody about everything I feel 1014 00:53:04,380 --> 00:53:07,650 and go through doesn't mean it's not real. 1015 00:53:07,650 --> 00:53:08,590 That I don't feel. 1016 00:53:08,590 --> 00:53:10,060 I don't hurt. 1017 00:53:10,060 --> 00:53:11,190 Leave me alone! 1018 00:53:11,190 --> 00:53:13,030 Just let me be disappointed. 1019 00:53:13,870 --> 00:53:14,703 And I'm gonna be all right 1020 00:53:14,703 --> 00:53:16,740 I'll bounce back, don't I always? 1021 00:53:18,860 --> 00:53:22,788 - At most, Deborah should have been in, at most, for six 1022 00:53:22,788 --> 00:53:27,585 years, which was the maximum for manslaughter in 1983. 1023 00:53:27,585 --> 00:53:32,585 Having been in for 24, 25 years, most of her time, 1024 00:53:34,305 --> 00:53:38,080 she's been illegally incarcerated. 1025 00:53:38,080 --> 00:53:41,630 If anyone's breaking the law, the biggest lawbreaker has 1026 00:53:41,630 --> 00:53:46,630 been the D.A., the court system, the prison system. 1027 00:53:46,854 --> 00:53:51,800 It's really a crime after crime, that she's been 1028 00:53:51,800 --> 00:53:56,800 subjected to the bigger crime here, the bigger injustice in 1029 00:53:56,850 --> 00:54:01,470 this case is that to the extent that she was culpable 1030 00:54:01,470 --> 00:54:05,912 for anything at all, she served her time, decades ago, 1031 00:54:05,912 --> 00:54:10,912 and yet she's still in there, and it's just not right. 1032 00:54:12,970 --> 00:54:14,980 - All of this, the hundreds of thousands of dollars, 1033 00:54:14,980 --> 00:54:16,810 the three years of time, this will all be for 1034 00:54:16,810 --> 00:54:18,750 naught if we give up now. 1035 00:54:18,750 --> 00:54:19,651 - Yup. - That's it. 1036 00:54:19,651 --> 00:54:20,484 - Y'know? 1037 00:54:20,484 --> 00:54:23,902 I mean there is no other option at this point. 1038 00:54:23,902 --> 00:54:26,800 - I mean, the one thing I wanna say is, 1039 00:54:26,800 --> 00:54:29,720 we lost at the trial court, we get two more shots, 1040 00:54:29,720 --> 00:54:32,110 they get more and more remote. 1041 00:54:32,110 --> 00:54:34,890 We get one at the court of appeals, original jurisdiction, 1042 00:54:34,890 --> 00:54:36,520 boom, we lose there, we get one more 1043 00:54:36,520 --> 00:54:38,360 at the Supreme Court, boom, we lose there. 1044 00:54:38,360 --> 00:54:40,200 We possibly have some federal claim, 1045 00:54:40,200 --> 00:54:42,350 but forget it, there's no chance. 1046 00:54:42,350 --> 00:54:44,860 So, we only have two shots. 1047 00:54:44,860 --> 00:54:46,770 Because we're fighters, I think we have to fight, 1048 00:54:46,770 --> 00:54:48,925 I mean, assuming the D.A. tells us to screw ourselves, 1049 00:54:48,925 --> 00:54:51,622 there's nothing that says we can't go ahead and file some 1050 00:54:51,622 --> 00:54:55,383 suit against Los Angeles Superior Court, seeking specific 1051 00:54:55,383 --> 00:54:59,050 performance to force them to do their plea deal. 1052 00:54:59,050 --> 00:55:02,085 - The only way this is gonna work, is if we, 1053 00:55:02,085 --> 00:55:07,085 literally think of this as, at least in my own mind, 1054 00:55:08,053 --> 00:55:12,950 y'know, one step at a time, one step at a time. 1055 00:55:12,950 --> 00:55:15,900 I have to break it down, I just have to get distance, 1056 00:55:15,900 --> 00:55:18,750 away from this office and away from this case for a moment, 1057 00:55:18,750 --> 00:55:20,530 'cause otherwise I'll just lose it. 1058 00:55:22,100 --> 00:55:27,000 ♪ Being double-crossed ain't nothing new ♪ 1059 00:55:27,000 --> 00:55:31,667 ♪ Look around, child that's how they do ♪ 1060 00:55:34,830 --> 00:55:36,910 It's funny how running a marathon can really 1061 00:55:36,910 --> 00:55:39,210 teach you a lot of lessons, and help train 1062 00:55:39,210 --> 00:55:41,240 you for bigger things than a race. 1063 00:55:42,740 --> 00:55:44,930 Regardless of how painful, regardless of how much you 1064 00:55:44,930 --> 00:55:47,860 want to stop, as long as you keep moving, ultimately, 1065 00:55:47,860 --> 00:55:51,060 you're gonna get to that finish line, it's a fact. 1066 00:55:51,060 --> 00:55:54,680 And so that's kind of our strategy right now, is to 1067 00:55:54,680 --> 00:55:58,340 understand that this is a huge endeavor that we're 1068 00:55:58,340 --> 00:56:01,209 undertaking right now and. 1069 00:56:01,209 --> 00:56:02,042 No. 1070 00:56:05,100 --> 00:56:07,290 - You asked me, one of the last times you were 1071 00:56:07,290 --> 00:56:10,350 talking to me, about matir ha asurim, 1072 00:56:10,350 --> 00:56:12,640 this Hebrew prayer of releasing the prisoners. 1073 00:56:12,640 --> 00:56:14,983 And then I went up to services 1074 00:56:14,983 --> 00:56:17,661 two weeks ago and hit that line. 1075 00:56:17,661 --> 00:56:21,340 It totally brought this wave of emotion over me as I was 1076 00:56:21,340 --> 00:56:24,810 thinking about Deborah in that moment and what that meant. 1077 00:56:24,810 --> 00:56:28,660 And in my mind I always had it, like a cold rainy day at 1078 00:56:28,660 --> 00:56:31,710 Chowchilla with like Nadia and I and you with a camera, 1079 00:56:31,710 --> 00:56:35,110 and in this vision that popped into my head, my family 1080 00:56:35,110 --> 00:56:38,210 was there with me, and I was saying to my daughter 1081 00:56:38,210 --> 00:56:40,560 "This is what I do, this is my job." 1082 00:56:40,560 --> 00:56:42,913 And she would get it, she would see this, 1083 00:56:42,913 --> 00:56:46,166 woman coming out, probably crying and her family there. 1084 00:56:46,166 --> 00:56:48,790 She would understand, y'know, why I 1085 00:56:48,790 --> 00:56:52,580 spend the late nights doing this, and, and for me what it 1086 00:56:52,580 --> 00:56:55,120 means to be an attorney, cause she knows 1087 00:56:55,120 --> 00:56:56,870 intellectually, y'know, she knows that I'm an attorney 1088 00:56:56,870 --> 00:56:58,752 and that I help people. 1089 00:56:58,752 --> 00:57:01,710 She doesn't know that I usually help people get their 1090 00:57:01,710 --> 00:57:05,840 land entitled to build multi-family residential 1091 00:57:05,840 --> 00:57:08,290 units, but, y'know she would 1092 00:57:08,290 --> 00:57:09,390 be there to know that, 1093 00:57:10,809 --> 00:57:14,992 y'know that this what my job is, and this is, and 1094 00:57:14,992 --> 00:57:17,540 hopefully it'd be a memory that she'd take with her her 1095 00:57:17,540 --> 00:57:20,730 whole life to see this event. 1096 00:57:20,730 --> 00:57:21,563 So. 1097 00:57:23,030 --> 00:57:26,900 After I had that vision I kinda thought well 1098 00:57:26,900 --> 00:57:31,000 maybe, this portends what's to come. 1099 00:57:38,003 --> 00:57:39,300 - Hello? 1100 00:57:39,300 --> 00:57:42,380 Okay, that was Peter Hong from The LA Times. 1101 00:57:42,380 --> 00:57:43,380 They like the story. 1102 00:57:45,059 --> 00:57:49,350 - She was convicted of murder more than 20 years ago, 1103 00:57:49,350 --> 00:57:51,230 but tonight attorneys fighting for a battered 1104 00:57:51,230 --> 00:57:53,870 woman's freedom say there is a lot we haven't heard about 1105 00:57:53,870 --> 00:57:55,910 her story of abuse and desperation. 1106 00:57:55,910 --> 00:57:58,290 - In hand, we have a civil complaint that we're gonna 1107 00:57:58,290 --> 00:58:02,840 file, and it tells the whole story, and CBS News has a 1108 00:58:02,840 --> 00:58:04,750 two-minute slot on your story, 1109 00:58:04,750 --> 00:58:07,690 footage from Yoav is on the news. 1110 00:58:07,690 --> 00:58:10,609 - Tonight her attorneys charge that LA County prosecutors 1111 00:58:10,609 --> 00:58:13,140 went back on their word by backing out of a plea 1112 00:58:13,140 --> 00:58:16,088 agreement, and they have the correspondence to prove it. 1113 00:58:16,088 --> 00:58:18,040 It's right there in black and white. 1114 00:58:18,040 --> 00:58:19,800 The LA County District Attorney's Office told 1115 00:58:19,800 --> 00:58:22,560 Deborah Peagler's attorneys last summer, it's willing to 1116 00:58:22,560 --> 00:58:24,740 let her out of jail after 23 years. 1117 00:58:24,740 --> 00:58:26,290 The letter includes the name of 1118 00:58:27,264 --> 00:58:29,294 District Attorney Steve Cooley, and it's signed 1119 00:58:29,294 --> 00:58:31,244 by then Chief Deputy D.A. Curt Livesay. 1120 00:58:32,270 --> 00:58:34,640 - So, we're back to the drawing board. 1121 00:58:36,490 --> 00:58:39,530 The parole board has denied us. 1122 00:58:39,530 --> 00:58:43,420 The court, Superior Court has denied us. 1123 00:58:43,420 --> 00:58:45,540 The D.A. hates us. 1124 00:58:46,570 --> 00:58:48,500 - The prosecutors office refused comment 1125 00:58:48,500 --> 00:58:50,360 citing pending litigation, 1126 00:58:50,360 --> 00:58:54,650 that litigation filed today by Peagler's attorneys. 1127 00:58:54,650 --> 00:58:56,810 - We have asked parole board 1128 00:58:56,810 --> 00:58:59,430 to reconsider their last finding. 1129 00:58:59,430 --> 00:59:01,940 The D.A.'s Office, we're suing them to force 1130 00:59:01,940 --> 00:59:03,350 them to stick to their deal. 1131 00:59:03,350 --> 00:59:05,650 And we're appealing the Superior Court's denial, all 1132 00:59:05,650 --> 00:59:07,490 the way up to the Court of Appeal, in the hope that 1133 00:59:07,490 --> 00:59:10,140 they're gonna direct the court to do the right thing. 1134 00:59:12,390 --> 00:59:14,800 - Coming up here, we're going to meet two Bay Area attorneys 1135 00:59:14,800 --> 00:59:16,875 who decided to help out a domestic violence victim. 1136 00:59:16,875 --> 00:59:19,120 They thought it would just be a couple of months. 1137 00:59:19,120 --> 00:59:22,160 Five years later, they're still on the case. 1138 00:59:22,160 --> 00:59:25,070 - There's a reason that your case is going to draw 1139 00:59:25,070 --> 00:59:26,890 attention to this remedy. 1140 00:59:26,890 --> 00:59:31,540 - 25 years for a crime, unjustly put in prison 1141 00:59:31,540 --> 00:59:33,970 I want everybody who cares about something like this to 1142 00:59:33,970 --> 00:59:36,380 remember what I'm about to say right here. 1143 00:59:36,380 --> 00:59:40,440 W-W-W Free Debbie dot org. 1144 00:59:42,300 --> 00:59:44,860 For us, as outsiders coming in to help, coming in to help 1145 00:59:44,860 --> 00:59:46,510 bring awareness to the situation, 1146 00:59:47,773 --> 00:59:50,400 it inspires me to be dealing with people who, against all 1147 00:59:50,400 --> 00:59:55,400 odds, are pushing forward, against all odds are striving 1148 00:59:56,190 --> 00:59:58,840 to believe in miracles, striving to believe in truth. 1149 01:00:11,410 --> 01:00:13,540 - Nice to meet you, thank you so much for coming. 1150 01:00:14,579 --> 01:00:16,079 I'm so excited! - We are too! 1151 01:00:17,510 --> 01:00:18,800 - None of us are free. 1152 01:00:18,800 --> 01:00:21,250 While one of us are chained, none of us are free. 1153 01:00:22,300 --> 01:00:26,140 My case should matter to people outside of California 1154 01:00:26,140 --> 01:00:28,600 because my case isn't about me anymore. 1155 01:00:28,600 --> 01:00:30,280 It's about so many other people. 1156 01:00:30,280 --> 01:00:32,090 I represent the larger part of 1157 01:00:32,090 --> 01:00:33,880 the women's prison population. 1158 01:00:35,370 --> 01:00:38,711 ♪ You better listen my sisters my brothers ♪ 1159 01:00:38,711 --> 01:00:41,650 ♪ Cause if you do, then you can hear ♪ 1160 01:00:41,650 --> 01:00:46,650 ♪ There are voices still calling across the years ♪ 1161 01:00:47,340 --> 01:00:51,787 ♪ And they're crying across the ocean ♪ 1162 01:00:51,787 --> 01:00:55,247 ♪ And they're cryin across the land ♪ 1163 01:00:55,247 --> 01:00:59,939 ♪ And they will till we all come to understand ♪ 1164 01:00:59,939 --> 01:01:01,816 ♪ Understand ♪ 1165 01:01:01,816 --> 01:01:04,524 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1166 01:01:04,524 --> 01:01:07,098 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1167 01:01:07,098 --> 01:01:09,670 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1168 01:01:09,670 --> 01:01:11,751 ♪ If one of us is chained ♪ 1169 01:01:11,751 --> 01:01:15,190 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1170 01:01:15,190 --> 01:01:18,730 - Y'know, you have to applaud Deborah for strength. 1171 01:01:18,730 --> 01:01:21,090 When you've been locked up for that many years, 1172 01:01:21,090 --> 01:01:23,400 and then you're promised to be free. 1173 01:01:23,400 --> 01:01:26,380 And then you get your mind set ready, you get your heart 1174 01:01:26,380 --> 01:01:30,550 ready, and you get excited about the new world you're 1175 01:01:30,550 --> 01:01:32,909 about to travel and then they renege on it. 1176 01:01:32,909 --> 01:01:35,390 And everything changes. 1177 01:01:35,390 --> 01:01:37,898 Not only could it break you, but it 1178 01:01:37,898 --> 01:01:42,360 could totally change your viewpoint about justice, 1179 01:01:42,360 --> 01:01:43,760 what is the word? 1180 01:01:43,760 --> 01:01:46,280 It could change your viewpoint about God, 1181 01:01:46,280 --> 01:01:48,030 who is he, what is he doing? 1182 01:01:48,030 --> 01:01:50,000 It could break most human beings. 1183 01:01:53,860 --> 01:01:56,650 - Because I went through all this, all this pain, 1184 01:01:56,650 --> 01:01:59,230 and all this stuff is not in vain. 1185 01:01:59,230 --> 01:02:03,180 It's gonna be great for someone else. 1186 01:02:03,180 --> 01:02:05,860 - Since California is the only state that has this habeas 1187 01:02:05,860 --> 01:02:08,590 petition law on its books, if other states look at 1188 01:02:08,590 --> 01:02:12,430 California and the attention this case has in the media, 1189 01:02:12,430 --> 01:02:15,260 and the legal attention that the case would get if it's 1190 01:02:15,260 --> 01:02:18,050 decided at that level, then hopefully other states will 1191 01:02:18,050 --> 01:02:21,310 look at these cases, pass legislation in their states, 1192 01:02:21,310 --> 01:02:22,840 and use California as a model. 1193 01:02:24,600 --> 01:02:26,970 - There's a new law in California that will allow 1194 01:02:26,970 --> 01:02:29,740 some domestic abuse evidence in court that would have not 1195 01:02:29,740 --> 01:02:31,230 been allowed before, correct? 1196 01:02:31,230 --> 01:02:32,063 - That's right, in. 1197 01:02:32,063 --> 01:02:33,410 - And so that's what you wanna do is get this. 1198 01:02:33,410 --> 01:02:35,850 - In 1983 it wasn't relevant whether you were battered, it 1199 01:02:35,850 --> 01:02:37,890 wasn't even legally admissible. 1200 01:02:37,890 --> 01:02:40,824 - This document is the 1983 memo 1201 01:02:40,824 --> 01:02:43,700 written by the District Attorney. 1202 01:02:43,700 --> 01:02:47,390 - So Bobby finally got his hands on the D.A.'s alibi 1203 01:02:47,390 --> 01:02:51,660 memo from 1983 and we were amazed. 1204 01:02:51,660 --> 01:02:53,830 - Bobby won't say how he got it. 1205 01:02:53,830 --> 01:02:56,870 As he always likes to say, part of being a private 1206 01:02:56,870 --> 01:02:58,850 investigator is being an investigator, 1207 01:02:58,850 --> 01:03:00,620 and part of it is being private. 1208 01:03:01,900 --> 01:03:03,880 But I will tell you that the memo is 1209 01:03:03,880 --> 01:03:06,820 shocking and the information in that memo itself 1210 01:03:06,820 --> 01:03:09,920 could probably exonerate Debbie. 1211 01:03:09,920 --> 01:03:13,410 - It says that Deadman perjured himself on the stand, he 1212 01:03:13,410 --> 01:03:16,402 lied, that's their word, he perjured himself on the stand. 1213 01:03:16,402 --> 01:03:20,060 - This is certainly the smoking gun that supports the 1214 01:03:20,060 --> 01:03:21,890 position that we've already alleged. 1215 01:03:21,890 --> 01:03:24,611 - There's an enormous difference between saying 1216 01:03:24,611 --> 01:03:28,350 "There are veracity concerns with the witness or witnesses" 1217 01:03:28,350 --> 01:03:32,190 and saying "Anthony Reedburg committed 1218 01:03:32,190 --> 01:03:34,420 "perjury at the preliminary hearing." 1219 01:03:34,420 --> 01:03:37,841 - These people, to give her a life-top sentence, 1220 01:03:37,841 --> 01:03:41,490 did it, lied to her, for a win. 1221 01:03:43,360 --> 01:03:45,340 How fucked that is? 1222 01:03:45,340 --> 01:03:47,500 - And the memo goes on to say that he's an informant. 1223 01:03:47,500 --> 01:03:50,670 It turns out Deadman has been a paid informant for law 1224 01:03:50,670 --> 01:03:53,830 enforcement in Los Angeles County for decades. 1225 01:03:53,830 --> 01:03:57,130 These were facts that the D.A. was obligated to disclose in 1226 01:03:57,130 --> 01:04:01,762 1983, an obligation disclosure that has continued everyday 1227 01:04:01,762 --> 01:04:06,762 for 25 years, and the D.A.'s Office has kept it secret. 1228 01:04:09,940 --> 01:04:13,480 - Ms. Lopez an you make a statement as to why 1229 01:04:13,480 --> 01:04:16,470 the Los Angeles District Attorney's Office withdrew its 1230 01:04:16,470 --> 01:04:19,320 own offer made in writing to free Deborah Peagler? 1231 01:04:19,320 --> 01:04:21,380 - No, I think that all of the evidence 1232 01:04:21,380 --> 01:04:22,991 has been presented on that. 1233 01:04:22,991 --> 01:04:24,840 - Tracey, we've got a meeting to go to, excuse me. 1234 01:04:24,840 --> 01:04:25,730 - Excuse me. 1235 01:04:25,730 --> 01:04:27,530 - Ms. Rubin, do you have any comment as to why 1236 01:04:27,530 --> 01:04:29,300 the District Attorney withdrew the 1237 01:04:29,300 --> 01:04:30,934 offer for Deborah Peagler? 1238 01:04:30,934 --> 01:04:33,542 Do you have any comment as to why. 1239 01:04:33,542 --> 01:04:35,690 - I said we have a meeting to go to. 1240 01:04:36,570 --> 01:04:38,520 Why don't you try making an appointment 1241 01:04:39,810 --> 01:04:42,180 at a time that we can speak with you? 1242 01:04:42,180 --> 01:04:43,013 Thank you. 1243 01:04:43,013 --> 01:04:43,846 - I would love to do that. 1244 01:04:43,846 --> 01:04:44,970 Will you agree to an appointment? 1245 01:04:49,990 --> 01:04:52,440 It's almost as if they didn't want to talk to us. 1246 01:05:01,070 --> 01:05:04,011 - We need some ruling that the District Attorney is not a 1247 01:05:04,011 --> 01:05:09,011 party to argue on the other side of this, you know, 1248 01:05:09,230 --> 01:05:12,370 because they've withheld this information. 1249 01:05:12,370 --> 01:05:14,390 - They've got disqualifying interests all over this thing. 1250 01:05:14,390 --> 01:05:15,687 - Right. 1251 01:05:15,687 --> 01:05:16,520 It took us a year and a half, 1252 01:05:16,520 --> 01:05:18,350 but we finally won at the court of appeal. 1253 01:05:18,350 --> 01:05:20,937 They sent Debbie's case back down to lower court. 1254 01:05:20,937 --> 01:05:23,700 They ordered the court to give her her day in 1255 01:05:23,700 --> 01:05:25,520 court, and the first thing that we're doing is we're 1256 01:05:25,520 --> 01:05:29,001 moving to disqualify the entire L.A. D.A.'s office, 1257 01:05:29,001 --> 01:05:31,670 because of all the misconduct that they've been involved in, 1258 01:05:31,670 --> 01:05:34,700 going all the way back to 1983 and involving everyone all 1259 01:05:34,700 --> 01:05:38,100 the way up to the District Attorney, Steve Cooley himself. 1260 01:05:38,100 --> 01:05:40,950 These motions are very rarely granted, in 1261 01:05:40,950 --> 01:05:44,177 US history maybe a handful of times has a court thrown out 1262 01:05:44,177 --> 01:05:47,887 an entire D.A.'s office, in this case a thousand attorneys. 1263 01:05:47,887 --> 01:05:51,030 But we believe that the facts of misconduct 1264 01:05:51,030 --> 01:05:53,730 are so compelling that we've got a pretty good shot of 1265 01:05:54,919 --> 01:05:58,840 knocking the D.A.'s office out. 1266 01:06:00,675 --> 01:06:01,508 - So you want tell her the. 1267 01:06:01,508 --> 01:06:02,428 - We should probably start 1268 01:06:02,428 --> 01:06:03,261 with the best news first. 1269 01:06:03,261 --> 01:06:04,178 - The big news! 1270 01:06:04,178 --> 01:06:09,178 - In a 12-page written decision, Judge Ryan has 1271 01:06:09,430 --> 01:06:11,940 disqualified the entire District Attorney's Office, 1272 01:06:11,940 --> 01:06:13,731 all one thousand attorneys. 1273 01:06:13,731 --> 01:06:14,890 - Yay! 1274 01:06:14,890 --> 01:06:16,460 - And held that they're recused for 1275 01:06:16,460 --> 01:06:18,370 disqualifying conflicts of interest. 1276 01:06:18,370 --> 01:06:19,310 - Yay! 1277 01:06:19,310 --> 01:06:21,990 - And held that all of the senior D.A.s, including 1278 01:06:21,990 --> 01:06:25,540 Steve Cooley, Lael Rubin, John Spillane, Curtis Hazell, 1279 01:06:25,540 --> 01:06:28,328 Curt Livesay, they're all circling the wagons 1280 01:06:28,328 --> 01:06:31,370 to protect their professional reputations. 1281 01:06:42,430 --> 01:06:46,750 So that's, the big good news is that D.A. is off. 1282 01:06:46,750 --> 01:06:47,583 - Yay. 1283 01:06:47,583 --> 01:06:50,890 - Ryan's a great judge, the bad news is. 1284 01:06:50,890 --> 01:06:52,077 - Answered prayer. 1285 01:06:52,077 --> 01:06:54,420 - That the D.A. has an independent right 1286 01:06:54,420 --> 01:06:57,378 to appeal the decision, if they want. 1287 01:06:57,378 --> 01:06:59,070 - Which they probably will. 1288 01:06:59,070 --> 01:07:01,140 You think they will? 1289 01:07:01,140 --> 01:07:04,450 - A rational approach, for the D.A.'s perspective, 1290 01:07:04,450 --> 01:07:07,230 from the D.A.'s perspective is not to appeal because. 1291 01:07:07,230 --> 01:07:09,290 - But we're not dealing with rational people. 1292 01:07:09,290 --> 01:07:10,830 - Well, that's true. 1293 01:07:28,911 --> 01:07:29,807 - How are you? 1294 01:07:29,807 --> 01:07:30,640 - I'm okay. 1295 01:07:34,720 --> 01:07:37,450 About five months ago I started to feel ill, 1296 01:07:37,450 --> 01:07:39,250 like I had a cold or a flu. 1297 01:07:40,550 --> 01:07:44,090 And I went to the doctor, that was in November. 1298 01:07:44,090 --> 01:07:47,400 I went back in December, still 1299 01:07:47,400 --> 01:07:51,840 treated for cold, flu-like symptoms, nothing helped, 1300 01:07:51,840 --> 01:07:53,060 none of the medicine they gave me helped. 1301 01:07:53,060 --> 01:07:54,430 So I went back in January, 1302 01:07:55,370 --> 01:07:57,070 finally got a chest x-ray ordered. 1303 01:07:58,040 --> 01:08:03,020 Was diagnosed with pneumonia, and treated with antibiotics. 1304 01:08:04,630 --> 01:08:07,110 Still cough persisted, still didn't feel well. 1305 01:08:07,960 --> 01:08:10,820 See a doctor again, beginning of February, got 1306 01:08:10,820 --> 01:08:13,770 transferred out to the hospital, Madera Community Hospital, 1307 01:08:13,770 --> 01:08:17,440 series of tests ran, and, within, I'd say a 1308 01:08:17,440 --> 01:08:21,780 two-week period of time, was diagnosed with lung cancer. 1309 01:08:27,740 --> 01:08:30,000 - We don't know whether she got it from smoking cigarettes 1310 01:08:30,000 --> 01:08:32,550 20 years ago, or whether it's, as many of the inmates 1311 01:08:32,550 --> 01:08:35,800 believe, she was exposed to hazardous materials in prison. 1312 01:08:36,660 --> 01:08:38,967 Whatever the case, we probably never know, and it's 1313 01:08:38,967 --> 01:08:41,700 terminal, and we're in a race against time. 1314 01:08:43,830 --> 01:08:48,250 - I always worry that her last breath would be 1315 01:08:48,250 --> 01:08:51,230 inside those walls, instead of with us. 1316 01:08:52,430 --> 01:08:55,800 I feel like the least, there's no way I would have peace, 1317 01:08:57,220 --> 01:09:01,320 I can get peace outta this, if it happens that way. 1318 01:09:02,540 --> 01:09:04,440 - Everyone that we talk to are 1319 01:09:04,440 --> 01:09:07,180 praying for you, are supporting you. 1320 01:09:07,180 --> 01:09:10,460 We're getting phone calls from people we've never met, 1321 01:09:10,460 --> 01:09:12,820 who are calling and saying "what can we do," and. 1322 01:09:12,820 --> 01:09:13,653 - Wow. 1323 01:09:13,653 --> 01:09:17,030 - Your strength and perseverance in this is remarkable. 1324 01:09:19,128 --> 01:09:20,710 - I didn't really have a choice. 1325 01:09:20,710 --> 01:09:21,543 - Yeah. 1326 01:09:22,927 --> 01:09:26,920 I am privileged to work on your case. 1327 01:09:26,920 --> 01:09:31,570 Y'know it's maybe the most important thing I have ever done. 1328 01:09:31,570 --> 01:09:34,318 Every day I think about you and this case and what to do. 1329 01:09:34,318 --> 01:09:38,790 And I speak to Nadia and Joshua and Yoav and we are 1330 01:09:38,790 --> 01:09:41,550 constantly working and thinking. 1331 01:09:41,550 --> 01:09:45,690 All of a sudden this thing, you know this medical health 1332 01:09:45,690 --> 01:09:50,311 thing, this cancer sort of upped the ante enormously. 1333 01:09:50,311 --> 01:09:55,311 So now we are in like another gear and in some way we are 1334 01:09:58,240 --> 01:10:01,210 praying for some way that, you know, for that it works out. 1335 01:10:02,820 --> 01:10:05,280 - It's got to, I just do not want to die here. 1336 01:10:06,934 --> 01:10:08,184 I don't want to die here. 1337 01:10:11,320 --> 01:10:13,390 - The medical care that inmates receive in 1338 01:10:13,390 --> 01:10:16,110 California prisons is reprehensible. 1339 01:10:16,110 --> 01:10:18,440 And in fact a federal judge has determined 1340 01:10:18,440 --> 01:10:20,310 that it is actually unconstitutional. 1341 01:10:20,310 --> 01:10:23,170 So at this point in time we are driving down to get 1342 01:10:23,170 --> 01:10:25,790 Debbie's records but most importantly to be with Debbie 1343 01:10:25,790 --> 01:10:28,620 as she endures her first chemotherapy, which can be 1344 01:10:28,620 --> 01:10:31,540 horrifically painful even in the best hospital setting. 1345 01:10:32,830 --> 01:10:36,070 - It's kind of overwhelming sometimes cause here it is 1346 01:10:36,070 --> 01:10:38,000 y'know, we're attorney-client. 1347 01:10:38,850 --> 01:10:41,730 But we're really not attorney-client, we're like family. 1348 01:10:41,730 --> 01:10:43,861 They make me feel like they're my family, and 1349 01:10:43,861 --> 01:10:45,961 they don't make me feel like I'm a client. 1350 01:10:48,290 --> 01:10:50,430 And them being there with me during my first 1351 01:10:50,430 --> 01:10:53,220 chemo meant the world to me. 1352 01:10:57,021 --> 01:10:59,860 I don't know how I'm ever gonna repay them, 1353 01:10:59,860 --> 01:11:04,420 how I'm ever show them how much I appreciate them. 1354 01:11:33,740 --> 01:11:35,150 It's been horrible. 1355 01:11:35,150 --> 01:11:38,040 It's the worst thing anybody could possibly go through. 1356 01:11:41,560 --> 01:11:43,750 I still can't believe it. 1357 01:11:43,750 --> 01:11:44,583 Still. 1358 01:11:46,410 --> 01:11:47,650 But I'm just so weak. 1359 01:11:48,857 --> 01:11:52,550 I don't have any energy, and it drives me crazy. 1360 01:11:53,390 --> 01:11:55,877 Cause y'know I'm used to being busy 1361 01:11:55,877 --> 01:11:58,130 and having a life, and it's like now I don't have a life, 1362 01:11:58,130 --> 01:12:00,100 all I do is watch T.V. and sleep. 1363 01:12:10,270 --> 01:12:11,103 - Hey Natasha. 1364 01:12:11,103 --> 01:12:12,060 - Hi Joshua, how are you? 1365 01:12:13,400 --> 01:12:15,665 How you doin'? 1366 01:12:15,665 --> 01:12:16,930 - I want you to know that we're 1367 01:12:16,930 --> 01:12:18,990 not going to give up on your Mom. 1368 01:12:19,960 --> 01:12:22,530 I'm hopeful that, you know, we'll try to put together 1369 01:12:22,530 --> 01:12:25,100 the biggest and best package that we can on parole. 1370 01:12:25,100 --> 01:12:29,410 But also, as you know, she's been denied three times before 1371 01:12:29,410 --> 01:12:32,557 and they never really seem to give much of a reason. 1372 01:12:32,557 --> 01:12:36,150 So, it's kind of a shot in the dark. 1373 01:12:36,150 --> 01:12:39,460 - We appreciate the fight, the effort, the love, 1374 01:12:39,460 --> 01:12:40,630 we appreciate it all. 1375 01:12:40,630 --> 01:12:43,370 I know you'll fight as hard as we will, 1376 01:12:43,370 --> 01:12:46,347 if not harder to get us on board to get us 1377 01:12:46,347 --> 01:12:48,547 to where we want to be where she'll be home. 1378 01:12:49,470 --> 01:12:52,350 I think it'll be worth it, even if it's a day or a hour, 1379 01:12:52,350 --> 01:12:53,750 I think it will be worth it. 1380 01:13:01,931 --> 01:13:04,440 Lord, this is hard. 1381 01:13:04,440 --> 01:13:06,790 We've been fighting 27 years. 1382 01:13:15,950 --> 01:13:20,950 - What we need to do is to tell your story, and have faith 1383 01:13:21,431 --> 01:13:26,431 that in the end, you're gonna find peace no matter what. 1384 01:13:27,730 --> 01:13:29,510 You're gonna find peace no matter what because we're 1385 01:13:29,510 --> 01:13:32,780 telling a story that's accurate, and we're telling a 1386 01:13:32,780 --> 01:13:34,700 story that deserves to be heard. 1387 01:13:58,928 --> 01:14:01,450 - I feel like I'm suitable for parole because 1388 01:14:01,450 --> 01:14:03,940 I have a understanding of my crime, I know what I did. 1389 01:14:03,940 --> 01:14:06,240 I know what I did was horrible, 1390 01:14:06,240 --> 01:14:08,090 I can't take it back, I wish I could. 1391 01:14:10,670 --> 01:14:13,120 I know the impact that my actions have 1392 01:14:13,120 --> 01:14:18,000 had on not only my family, but his family. 1393 01:14:18,000 --> 01:14:20,450 I've made amends with the majority of his family. 1394 01:14:21,560 --> 01:14:23,650 I've reached out to them and 1395 01:14:23,650 --> 01:14:27,400 have received forgiveness and understanding. 1396 01:14:30,380 --> 01:14:31,580 I think because of that. 1397 01:14:34,544 --> 01:14:36,530 And the fact that my victim's family 1398 01:14:36,530 --> 01:14:38,790 does not oppose my release. 1399 01:14:38,790 --> 01:14:41,130 - The evidence before you shows that Ms. Peagler, 1400 01:14:41,130 --> 01:14:43,378 starting at the age of fifteen and continuing for years, 1401 01:14:43,378 --> 01:14:46,300 was subjected to horrific abuse 1402 01:14:46,300 --> 01:14:48,150 at the hands of Oliver Wilson. 1403 01:14:48,150 --> 01:14:50,610 And note that, that this evidence comes, 1404 01:14:50,610 --> 01:14:52,724 not primarily from Debbie Peagler, but from numerous 1405 01:14:52,724 --> 01:14:55,300 percipient witnesses who were present 1406 01:14:55,300 --> 01:14:57,275 and saw what she endured, 1407 01:14:57,275 --> 01:15:01,315 many of whom were Oliver Wilson's friends and family. 1408 01:15:01,315 --> 01:15:03,930 - For the record my name is Natasha Wilson. 1409 01:15:03,930 --> 01:15:08,930 I am the daughter of both the inmate as well as the victim. 1410 01:15:10,290 --> 01:15:15,030 I'm pleading and begging in the release of my Mom. 1411 01:15:19,656 --> 01:15:24,000 She's already given all that she can give. 1412 01:15:24,000 --> 01:15:27,724 She's done all that she can do to state 1413 01:15:27,724 --> 01:15:31,290 she's sorry, to right the wrong. 1414 01:15:31,290 --> 01:15:33,880 It's nothing else she can do or say. 1415 01:15:34,720 --> 01:15:37,610 It's hard sitting by the phone just 1416 01:15:37,610 --> 01:15:42,610 waiting for the answer, the solution. 1417 01:15:45,510 --> 01:15:48,080 This is the solution, it comes to this day. 1418 01:15:49,540 --> 01:15:52,920 I haven't had a relationship with my Mom that 1419 01:15:52,920 --> 01:15:56,890 I need to have because of her being in prison. 1420 01:15:56,890 --> 01:16:01,220 I just want one night with no limitations, one night where 1421 01:16:01,220 --> 01:16:04,910 I can do whatever, say whatever, hug her, talk to 1422 01:16:04,910 --> 01:16:09,610 her, just the basic, simplest stuff, eat dinner with her, 1423 01:16:09,610 --> 01:16:12,500 just, in my home, before she die. 1424 01:16:13,780 --> 01:16:18,780 Please don't let my Mom die inside this prison, I'm 1425 01:16:19,270 --> 01:16:22,250 just beggin' and pleadin' for just one day. 1426 01:16:24,159 --> 01:16:24,992 Please. 1427 01:16:48,070 --> 01:16:51,095 - Despite the negative circumstances, and like 1428 01:16:51,095 --> 01:16:54,380 we say, we've fully considered those 1429 01:16:54,380 --> 01:16:56,120 circumstances, and after weighing all the 1430 01:16:56,120 --> 01:16:58,912 considerations provided in Title Fifteen, the panel 1431 01:16:58,912 --> 01:17:02,830 finds you are suitable for parole because the positive 1432 01:17:02,830 --> 01:17:05,464 aspects of your case outweigh the other considerations. 1433 01:17:05,464 --> 01:17:09,842 Specifically, we find you suitable for parole, 1434 01:17:09,842 --> 01:17:13,934 based on the fact that you were were suffering from 1435 01:17:13,934 --> 01:17:17,020 intimate partner battering at the time. 1436 01:17:17,020 --> 01:17:18,988 We also have acknowledged your, 1437 01:17:18,988 --> 01:17:23,988 support in the community and in the institution. 1438 01:17:36,460 --> 01:17:39,325 - Well, in a bizarre narrative twist which is now typical of 1439 01:17:39,325 --> 01:17:43,070 this case, Debbie's fate rests in the hands of all 1440 01:17:43,070 --> 01:17:47,150 people, of a man who before he became governor, was best 1441 01:17:47,150 --> 01:17:50,050 known for portraying a merciless, robotic, killing 1442 01:17:50,050 --> 01:17:51,250 machine from the future. 1443 01:17:52,174 --> 01:17:57,174 Governor Schwarzenegger has received thousands of letters 1444 01:17:57,300 --> 01:18:00,640 in support of Debbie's release and only one letter 1445 01:18:00,640 --> 01:18:04,001 in opposition from D.A. Steve Cooley, 1446 01:18:04,001 --> 01:18:06,870 and we don't know what he's gonna do. 1447 01:18:11,610 --> 01:18:14,570 - If after all of the evidence that we have been able to 1448 01:18:14,570 --> 01:18:18,996 produce, that proves the abuse that she suffered, and 1449 01:18:18,996 --> 01:18:22,570 all of the evidence we have been able to present that 1450 01:18:22,570 --> 01:18:25,380 proves the amount of misconduct that occurred in 1451 01:18:25,380 --> 01:18:29,620 this case, combine that with the fact that she now has 1452 01:18:29,620 --> 01:18:33,390 stage IV lung cancer, if we are not able to take all of 1453 01:18:33,390 --> 01:18:37,562 that information and get for her that one day of freedom, 1454 01:18:37,562 --> 01:18:42,562 then to me I think the criminal justice system is 1455 01:18:42,834 --> 01:18:46,560 not only broken but perhaps, beyond repair. 1456 01:18:47,510 --> 01:18:50,340 But on the other hand, if we are able to 1457 01:18:50,340 --> 01:18:55,154 secure her freedom and give her, even just that one day, 1458 01:18:55,154 --> 01:18:59,895 with her family outside of those prison gates, then 1459 01:18:59,895 --> 01:19:03,860 what it says to me, is that there is hope. 1460 01:19:04,720 --> 01:19:06,130 - A controversial and long running 1461 01:19:06,130 --> 01:19:08,190 case regains the spotlight today. 1462 01:19:08,190 --> 01:19:11,020 - She's only been given days or months to live. 1463 01:19:11,020 --> 01:19:14,894 Deborah Peagler has served 27 years of a 25-to-life 1464 01:19:14,894 --> 01:19:17,730 sentence in prison for killing a man even 1465 01:19:17,730 --> 01:19:20,965 authorities acknowledge brutalized her and her daughters. 1466 01:19:20,965 --> 01:19:24,484 ♪ Am I gonna make the news tonight ♪ 1467 01:19:24,484 --> 01:19:27,161 ♪ Make an example of my life ♪ 1468 01:19:27,161 --> 01:19:30,158 ♪ Are you gonna leave me here to die ♪ 1469 01:19:30,158 --> 01:19:33,126 ♪ Or are you gonna save my life ♪ 1470 01:19:33,126 --> 01:19:35,860 - Free Debbie now! 1471 01:19:35,860 --> 01:19:37,950 - The victim's family, the Wilson family has no 1472 01:19:37,950 --> 01:19:40,130 objection to her comin' home, they even went to every 1473 01:19:40,130 --> 01:19:42,680 parole hearing for the last probably six or seven years 1474 01:19:42,680 --> 01:19:45,380 pleading with you all to let her come home, so if they 1475 01:19:45,380 --> 01:19:49,072 have no objection to it, who are you to keep her in there? 1476 01:19:49,072 --> 01:19:53,230 I mean she can do no harm, so please Governor Schwarzenegger 1477 01:19:53,230 --> 01:19:55,540 please, allow my sister to come home and 1478 01:19:55,540 --> 01:19:57,760 spend her last days with her family, please. 1479 01:19:58,930 --> 01:20:01,061 - The District Attorney himself Steve Cooley said, 1480 01:20:01,061 --> 01:20:03,950 "Well that's right," and, had agreed to a deal to 1481 01:20:03,950 --> 01:20:07,235 let her out, so for him to renege on his deal 1482 01:20:07,235 --> 01:20:09,690 is the first thing that really stinks here. 1483 01:20:10,964 --> 01:20:14,128 ♪ Am I gonna make the news tonight ♪ 1484 01:20:14,128 --> 01:20:17,072 ♪ Make an example of my life ♪ 1485 01:20:17,072 --> 01:20:20,904 ♪ Are you gonna leave me here to die ♪ 1486 01:20:20,904 --> 01:20:25,087 ♪ Or are you gonna save my life ♪ 1487 01:20:25,087 --> 01:20:26,100 - Can you count to five for me? 1488 01:20:26,100 --> 01:20:28,190 - One, two, three, four, six. 1489 01:20:29,570 --> 01:20:33,190 - Steve Cooley, can you answer for me, why you changed 1490 01:20:33,190 --> 01:20:35,658 your stance on the case of Deborah Peagler? 1491 01:20:35,658 --> 01:20:38,080 - You know that, that matter's under civil litigation, 1492 01:20:38,080 --> 01:20:39,410 we're not gonna discuss that. 1493 01:20:39,410 --> 01:20:42,580 Tonight's my night for attorney general, and, after all 1494 01:20:42,580 --> 01:20:46,406 it was a, assassination killing for insurance purposes. 1495 01:20:46,406 --> 01:20:50,960 - I'm sorry to belabor the point, but there's one piece 1496 01:20:50,960 --> 01:20:53,260 of evidence your office held on to for 1497 01:20:53,260 --> 01:20:55,260 25 years in the Deborah Peagler case. 1498 01:20:55,260 --> 01:20:56,930 Can you explain why that was 1499 01:20:56,930 --> 01:20:59,070 never turned over to her attorneys? 1500 01:20:59,070 --> 01:21:01,250 - Quite frankly, I don't know what you're talking about. 1501 01:21:01,250 --> 01:21:03,320 And if that's your only issue 1502 01:21:03,320 --> 01:21:06,390 then this interview is probably over. 1503 01:21:06,390 --> 01:21:08,320 We did appropriately. 1504 01:21:08,320 --> 01:21:09,320 Thank you very much. 1505 01:21:17,580 --> 01:21:18,870 - And here's Natasha. 1506 01:21:21,018 --> 01:21:21,851 Hi! - Hi. 1507 01:21:23,258 --> 01:21:25,420 - How was your flight? - It was good. 1508 01:21:25,420 --> 01:21:28,102 - Okay, so we're gonna go down here. 1509 01:21:28,102 --> 01:21:30,680 - Carla and Nadia is calling me. 1510 01:21:30,680 --> 01:21:32,960 - We have a little bit of change of plans. 1511 01:21:32,960 --> 01:21:35,312 I have an email from Nadia that I wanted. 1512 01:21:35,312 --> 01:21:39,060 - Yeah, she's calling me and my aunt's called me. 1513 01:21:39,060 --> 01:21:40,550 - And she did? 1514 01:21:40,550 --> 01:21:41,710 And did you speak to them? 1515 01:21:41,710 --> 01:21:43,180 - No, I haven't spoken to anyone yet. 1516 01:21:43,180 --> 01:21:46,660 - Okay, so this is a note, from Nadia. 1517 01:21:46,660 --> 01:21:51,660 It says, "The governor is declining to review, 1518 01:21:51,795 --> 01:21:53,850 "she is getting out." 1519 01:21:53,850 --> 01:21:54,683 - My God. 1520 01:21:56,545 --> 01:21:57,960 - And then there's an attachment letter which I'm 1521 01:21:57,960 --> 01:22:00,990 gonna get on this funky phone and I'll read it to 1522 01:22:00,990 --> 01:22:04,857 you, but basically, sometime in the next day, 1523 01:22:04,857 --> 01:22:08,980 two, three, she will be out. 1524 01:22:10,320 --> 01:22:14,040 Out, she will walk out the door of the prison. 1525 01:22:24,487 --> 01:22:27,220 - Thank you so much. - I'm so happy for you. 1526 01:22:27,220 --> 01:22:29,380 - Thank you so so so much. 1527 01:22:30,355 --> 01:22:33,090 Thank you so much. 1528 01:22:43,440 --> 01:22:46,760 - It's Saturday night, after the Sabbath, and a 1529 01:22:46,760 --> 01:22:49,870 few days before Debbie is supposed to be released. 1530 01:22:49,870 --> 01:22:53,430 And I just, I'm coming back online after my sabbatical, 1531 01:22:53,430 --> 01:22:57,110 my 25 hour sabbatical, and I'm just wanna check in and see 1532 01:22:57,110 --> 01:23:00,190 what I've missed over the last twenty-five hours and see if 1533 01:23:00,190 --> 01:23:03,590 we can get a more precise read on when Debbie's getting out. 1534 01:23:03,590 --> 01:23:06,980 Well, I just wanted to check in with you, I've been 1535 01:23:06,980 --> 01:23:10,260 offline for about 24 hours, and wanted to see if 1536 01:23:10,260 --> 01:23:12,760 you heard anything from Debbie or from the prison. 1537 01:23:17,284 --> 01:23:18,234 Who there with you? 1538 01:23:29,410 --> 01:23:31,970 Wow, that's fantastic news. 1539 01:23:34,610 --> 01:23:35,460 Okay, no problem. 1540 01:23:36,850 --> 01:23:40,950 Hi, how ya doin? 1541 01:23:40,950 --> 01:23:42,210 I'm fantastic! 1542 01:23:43,350 --> 01:23:45,970 Did they tell you what they were doing or did they? 1543 01:23:50,604 --> 01:23:55,330 I can't believe that they snuck you out like that. 1544 01:23:57,780 --> 01:24:01,451 I know, the only thing is, the sooner the better, but 1545 01:24:01,451 --> 01:24:03,871 we certainly would have liked to have been there, 1546 01:24:03,871 --> 01:24:07,870 but how did it go for ya? 1547 01:24:17,680 --> 01:24:20,470 You came to freedom in a Denny's parking lot? 1548 01:24:22,280 --> 01:24:23,113 Man. 1549 01:24:26,164 --> 01:24:31,164 Y'know I, this is, well, God works in mysterious ways. 1550 01:24:36,580 --> 01:24:38,600 I guess I just didn't. 1551 01:24:57,450 --> 01:24:58,283 That's amazing. 1552 01:25:01,650 --> 01:25:04,870 It makes it all worth it. 1553 01:25:04,870 --> 01:25:07,430 - Lookie here, we did it! 1554 01:25:07,430 --> 01:25:09,090 - We did it. - We did it! 1555 01:25:09,090 --> 01:25:10,772 - Welcome home. 1556 01:25:10,772 --> 01:25:11,760 - Thank you so much. 1557 01:25:15,626 --> 01:25:19,460 A lot better yes. 1558 01:25:20,510 --> 01:25:22,500 Beautiful sunset, look at the clouds. 1559 01:25:22,500 --> 01:25:23,650 It's beautiful! 1560 01:25:23,650 --> 01:25:25,490 We went and walked on the beach. 1561 01:25:25,490 --> 01:25:27,190 What made the experience even more special 1562 01:25:27,190 --> 01:25:29,840 to me, was the fact that Joshua brought his daughter. 1563 01:25:31,580 --> 01:25:34,230 She was born, right when Joshua took my case. 1564 01:25:34,230 --> 01:25:36,610 I'll treasure that in my mind, forever. 1565 01:25:37,820 --> 01:25:39,920 I feel such amazement right now. 1566 01:25:39,920 --> 01:25:41,040 That's all I thought about was coming 1567 01:25:41,040 --> 01:25:43,870 to the ocean while I was in prison. 1568 01:25:55,851 --> 01:25:57,268 Woah, woah, woah! 1569 01:25:58,442 --> 01:25:59,775 Whoa, got me! 1570 01:26:07,690 --> 01:26:09,320 - Personally I would love for Debbie to 1571 01:26:09,320 --> 01:26:11,890 continue to sue Steve Cooley and the D.A.'s office 1572 01:26:11,890 --> 01:26:13,900 for all their misdeeds and for the false 1573 01:26:13,900 --> 01:26:16,208 imprisonment and the malicious prosecution. 1574 01:26:16,208 --> 01:26:19,110 But after all we have been through Debbie feels like she 1575 01:26:19,110 --> 01:26:21,071 is done with legal battles and she wants to devote the 1576 01:26:21,071 --> 01:26:23,790 rest of her days to being with family 1577 01:26:23,790 --> 01:26:25,590 and friends and helping others. 1578 01:26:25,590 --> 01:26:29,100 And Debbie believes that God will take care of Steve Cooley. 1579 01:26:29,100 --> 01:26:31,641 - This was Los Angeles District Attorney 1580 01:26:31,641 --> 01:26:33,920 Steve Cooley on election night, declaring victory 1581 01:26:33,920 --> 01:26:35,970 in the race for state Attorney General. 1582 01:26:35,970 --> 01:26:39,690 - Although my highly paid trusted advisors say it may 1583 01:26:39,690 --> 01:26:42,190 be a little too early, I am declaring victory. 1584 01:26:45,888 --> 01:26:47,850 - Oops, he should have listened to his advisors. 1585 01:26:47,850 --> 01:26:49,897 This morning Steve Cooley conceded the 1586 01:26:49,897 --> 01:26:53,640 Attorney General's race to Democrat Kamela Harris. 1587 01:26:53,640 --> 01:26:56,262 - Harris will become the first woman and the 1588 01:26:56,262 --> 01:26:58,640 first minority to serve as California Attorney General. 1589 01:26:58,640 --> 01:27:00,658 Experts are saying it is an important step to 1590 01:27:00,658 --> 01:27:03,110 restoring faith in the criminal justice system. 1591 01:27:06,120 --> 01:27:10,720 - They imprisoned her body, but they did not imprison her 1592 01:27:10,720 --> 01:27:14,940 mind, or her soul, Deborah Peagler. 1593 01:27:17,480 --> 01:27:21,480 - I take every opportunity I can to share my story in 1594 01:27:21,480 --> 01:27:24,527 hopes that no one, no one, would ever have to suffer and 1595 01:27:24,527 --> 01:27:27,450 go through the things I've been through. 1596 01:27:29,030 --> 01:27:32,640 Nothing is going to stop me, not even this cancer. 1597 01:27:33,490 --> 01:27:37,050 And even after I pass, this film will continue on. 1598 01:27:39,667 --> 01:27:40,500 Telling my story. 1599 01:27:40,500 --> 01:27:42,720 Telling the story of others. 1600 01:27:43,573 --> 01:27:45,210 The kindness of strangers, people who did not even know 1601 01:27:45,210 --> 01:27:48,110 me, for the pursuit of justice. 1602 01:27:48,110 --> 01:27:48,990 I'll never stop. 1603 01:27:50,097 --> 01:27:50,960 - Everybody say Deborah! 1604 01:27:50,960 --> 01:27:51,793 - Deborah! 1605 01:27:56,230 --> 01:27:58,656 - I'm home. I have so much to be thankful for. 1606 01:27:58,656 --> 01:28:00,550 Since my release from prison, 1607 01:28:00,550 --> 01:28:02,000 just amazing things have happened. 1608 01:28:02,000 --> 01:28:04,510 Things I can't call anything else but miracles. 1609 01:28:04,510 --> 01:28:06,170 Number one, my health. 1610 01:28:06,170 --> 01:28:08,577 I have more good days than bad days. 1611 01:28:08,577 --> 01:28:10,740 What are you doin'? 1612 01:28:10,740 --> 01:28:11,764 Yeah? 1613 01:28:11,764 --> 01:28:13,030 What else? 1614 01:28:13,030 --> 01:28:15,960 The second thing is forgiveness. 1615 01:28:15,960 --> 01:28:17,990 I've experienced forgiveness from Oliver's family, 1616 01:28:17,990 --> 01:28:20,240 I've had the opportunity to be embraced by his mother. 1617 01:28:20,240 --> 01:28:21,990 And spending time with her, 1618 01:28:22,876 --> 01:28:24,810 such a spirit of peace was upon me. 1619 01:28:24,810 --> 01:28:26,040 His sister Zabrina. 1620 01:28:26,040 --> 01:28:28,810 And I can't even tell you how that feels. 1621 01:28:34,283 --> 01:28:35,116 Woah! 1622 01:28:37,454 --> 01:28:38,486 - I get to sit down and watch 1623 01:28:38,486 --> 01:28:40,240 Granny play with her grandkids. 1624 01:28:41,740 --> 01:28:42,573 What a joy! 1625 01:28:45,346 --> 01:28:47,110 I know, it's wonderful. 1626 01:28:48,444 --> 01:28:50,290 It's a wonderful feeling to have her here. 1627 01:28:50,290 --> 01:28:51,123 It really is. 1628 01:28:52,370 --> 01:28:54,270 Everything about it, and everything about 1629 01:28:54,270 --> 01:28:55,520 her is a dream come true. 1630 01:30:19,682 --> 01:30:23,434 ♪ There are people still in darkness ♪ 1631 01:30:23,434 --> 01:30:26,565 ♪ And they can't see the light see the light ♪ 1632 01:30:26,565 --> 01:30:31,565 ♪ If you don't stay its wrong that says it's right ♪ 1633 01:30:33,234 --> 01:30:36,436 ♪ We've got to try to feel for each other ♪ 1634 01:30:36,436 --> 01:30:39,987 ♪ Let our brothers know that we care ♪ 1635 01:30:39,987 --> 01:30:42,176 ♪ Got to get the message ♪ 1636 01:30:42,176 --> 01:30:46,236 ♪ Send it out loud and clear, loud and clear ♪ 1637 01:30:46,236 --> 01:30:48,283 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1638 01:30:48,283 --> 01:30:49,768 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1639 01:30:49,768 --> 01:30:51,237 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1640 01:30:51,237 --> 01:30:52,848 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1641 01:30:52,848 --> 01:30:54,404 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1642 01:30:54,404 --> 01:30:56,460 ♪ If one of us is chained ♪ 1643 01:30:56,460 --> 01:31:00,011 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1644 01:31:00,011 --> 01:31:01,691 ♪ It's the simple truth ♪ 1645 01:31:01,691 --> 01:31:06,691 ♪ We all need to just hear and to sing ♪ 1646 01:31:06,972 --> 01:31:09,830 ♪ None of us are free if one of us is chained ♪ 1647 01:31:09,830 --> 01:31:11,720 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1648 01:31:11,720 --> 01:31:13,899 ♪ No no no ♪ 1649 01:31:13,899 --> 01:31:18,899 ♪ Now I swear this salvation isn't hard to find ♪ 1650 01:31:20,750 --> 01:31:25,750 ♪ None of us as can find it on our own, on our own ♪ 1651 01:31:27,269 --> 01:31:30,668 ♪ We've got to join together ♪ 1652 01:31:30,668 --> 01:31:34,079 ♪ In spirit, heart and mind ♪ 1653 01:31:34,079 --> 01:31:37,391 ♪ So that every soul that's suffering ♪ 1654 01:31:37,391 --> 01:31:42,391 ♪ Will known they're not alone ♪ 1655 01:31:42,991 --> 01:31:44,195 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1656 01:31:44,195 --> 01:31:46,542 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1657 01:31:46,542 --> 01:31:48,414 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1658 01:31:48,414 --> 01:31:49,759 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1659 01:31:49,759 --> 01:31:50,742 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1660 01:31:50,742 --> 01:31:53,734 ♪ None of us are free if one of us is chained ♪ 1661 01:31:53,734 --> 01:31:55,624 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1662 01:31:55,624 --> 01:31:57,481 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1663 01:31:57,481 --> 01:31:59,452 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1664 01:31:59,452 --> 01:32:01,899 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1665 01:32:01,899 --> 01:32:04,312 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1666 01:32:04,312 --> 01:32:07,039 ♪ None of us are free if one of us is chained ♪ 1667 01:32:07,039 --> 01:32:11,298 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1668 01:32:11,298 --> 01:32:15,129 ♪ If you just look around you, look around ♪ 1669 01:32:15,129 --> 01:32:17,578 ♪ You're gonna see what I see ♪ 1670 01:32:17,578 --> 01:32:22,498 ♪ There's a world that's getting smaller each passing day ♪ 1671 01:32:22,498 --> 01:32:24,402 ♪ Passing day ♪ 1672 01:32:24,402 --> 01:32:28,588 ♪ Now it's time to start making changes, changes ♪ 1673 01:32:28,588 --> 01:32:31,561 ♪ And it's time for us all to realize ♪ 1674 01:32:31,561 --> 01:32:34,361 ♪ That the truth is shining bright ♪ 1675 01:32:34,361 --> 01:32:37,669 ♪ Right before our eyes, before our eyes ♪ 1676 01:32:37,669 --> 01:32:39,471 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1677 01:32:39,471 --> 01:32:41,306 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1678 01:32:41,306 --> 01:32:42,919 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1679 01:32:42,919 --> 01:32:44,545 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1680 01:32:44,545 --> 01:32:47,642 ♪ None of us are free if one of us is chained ♪ 1681 01:32:47,642 --> 01:32:49,322 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1682 01:32:49,322 --> 01:32:51,338 ♪ None of us, none of us ♪ 1683 01:32:51,338 --> 01:32:53,381 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1684 01:32:53,381 --> 01:32:54,838 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1685 01:32:54,838 --> 01:32:56,359 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1686 01:32:56,359 --> 01:32:58,072 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 1687 01:32:58,072 --> 01:33:01,398 ♪ None of us are free if one of us is chained ♪ 1688 01:33:01,398 --> 01:33:04,565 ♪ None of us are free ♪ 139884

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