All language subtitles for Murder.on.Middle.Beach.S01E02.Tables.and.Rooms.720p.AMZN.WEB-DL.DDP5.1.H.264-NTb

af Afrikaans
ak Akan
sq Albanian
am Amharic
ar Arabic Download
hy Armenian
az Azerbaijani
eu Basque
be Belarusian
bem Bemba
bn Bengali
bh Bihari
bs Bosnian
br Breton
bg Bulgarian
km Cambodian
ca Catalan
ceb Cebuano
chr Cherokee
ny Chichewa
zh-CN Chinese (Simplified)
zh-TW Chinese (Traditional)
co Corsican
hr Croatian
cs Czech
da Danish
en English
eo Esperanto
et Estonian
ee Ewe
fo Faroese
tl Filipino
fi Finnish
fr French Download
fy Frisian
gaa Ga
gl Galician
ka Georgian
de German
el Greek
gn Guarani
gu Gujarati
ht Haitian Creole
ha Hausa
haw Hawaiian
iw Hebrew
hi Hindi
hmn Hmong
hu Hungarian
is Icelandic
ig Igbo
id Indonesian
ia Interlingua
ga Irish
it Italian
ja Japanese
jw Javanese
kn Kannada
kk Kazakh
rw Kinyarwanda
rn Kirundi
kg Kongo
ko Korean
kri Krio (Sierra Leone)
ku Kurdish
ckb Kurdish (Soranî)
ky Kyrgyz
lo Laothian
la Latin
lv Latvian
ln Lingala
lt Lithuanian
loz Lozi
lg Luganda
ach Luo
lb Luxembourgish
mk Macedonian
mg Malagasy
ms Malay
ml Malayalam
mt Maltese
mi Maori
mr Marathi
mfe Mauritian Creole
mo Moldavian
mn Mongolian
my Myanmar (Burmese)
sr-ME Montenegrin
ne Nepali
pcm Nigerian Pidgin
nso Northern Sotho
no Norwegian
nn Norwegian (Nynorsk)
oc Occitan
or Oriya
om Oromo
ps Pashto
fa Persian
pl Polish
pt-BR Portuguese (Brazil)
pt Portuguese (Portugal)
pa Punjabi
qu Quechua
ro Romanian
rm Romansh
nyn Runyakitara
ru Russian
sm Samoan
gd Scots Gaelic
sr Serbian
sh Serbo-Croatian
st Sesotho
tn Setswana
crs Seychellois Creole
sn Shona
sd Sindhi
si Sinhalese
sk Slovak
sl Slovenian
so Somali
es Spanish
es-419 Spanish (Latin American)
su Sundanese
sw Swahili
sv Swedish
tg Tajik
ta Tamil
tt Tatar
te Telugu
th Thai
ti Tigrinya
to Tonga
lua Tshiluba
tum Tumbuka
tr Turkish
tk Turkmen
tw Twi
ug Uighur
uk Ukrainian
ur Urdu
uz Uzbek
vi Vietnamese
cy Welsh
wo Wolof
xh Xhosa
yi Yiddish
yo Yoruba
zu Zulu
Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:12,458 --> 00:00:14,250 What was your best recollection of coming home? 2 00:00:14,333 --> 00:00:15,375 Ali and I pulled up. 3 00:00:15,458 --> 00:00:17,667 I see these cushions up against the bushes-- 4 00:00:17,750 --> 00:00:20,375 So, you pulled back the same cushion, what happens? 5 00:00:21,083 --> 00:00:22,583 It's your mom. 6 00:00:25,000 --> 00:00:27,834 I'm doing a, um, documentary on Mom. 7 00:00:27,917 --> 00:00:29,959 Your mother was a very complicated person. 8 00:00:30,041 --> 00:00:32,750 She had a life that I had no idea she had. 9 00:00:33,125 --> 00:00:34,083 I think the police 10 00:00:34,166 --> 00:00:35,417 dropped the ball on your mother's murder. 11 00:00:35,500 --> 00:00:37,333 You can't get an answer if you don't have 12 00:00:37,417 --> 00:00:39,000 people looking in the right places. 13 00:00:39,083 --> 00:00:40,000 At the end of the day, 14 00:00:40,083 --> 00:00:41,166 we're not investigators. 15 00:00:41,250 --> 00:00:42,333 Hello, hello, hello. 16 00:00:43,542 --> 00:00:46,875 It could be any of us that you're talking to right now. 17 00:00:47,458 --> 00:00:50,750 Somebody, somewhere, knows something. 18 00:01:04,291 --> 00:01:07,458 - There's Madison, building his puzzle. 19 00:01:07,542 --> 00:01:09,000 With Daddy helping. 20 00:01:09,083 --> 00:01:10,750 - He does it all by himself. 21 00:01:13,125 --> 00:01:14,041 Hello? 22 00:01:14,125 --> 00:01:15,041 - Hey. - Hey. 23 00:01:15,125 --> 00:01:16,959 - Very good, Madison. 24 00:01:26,166 --> 00:01:27,917 - Yeah, I mean, I-- 25 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:30,083 there isn't a definitive answer 26 00:01:30,166 --> 00:01:31,792 to this murder, 27 00:01:31,875 --> 00:01:34,041 so I don't wanna lose you, 28 00:01:34,125 --> 00:01:36,291 because I don't know, you know? 29 00:01:40,834 --> 00:01:42,625 - You don't think they looked other places? 30 00:02:11,750 --> 00:02:13,583 Yay for Madison. 31 00:02:19,000 --> 00:02:20,500 Go show Mommy your puzzle, honey. 32 00:02:40,417 --> 00:02:42,583 - Ball? - Oh, I see. 33 00:02:42,667 --> 00:02:45,458 You want Mommy to get your ball? 34 00:02:45,542 --> 00:02:48,166 You want Mommy to get your ball? 35 00:02:48,250 --> 00:02:49,500 Good boy. 36 00:02:53,083 --> 00:02:54,667 What? You wanna get in there? 37 00:02:54,750 --> 00:02:56,166 You want me to put you in there? 38 00:02:56,250 --> 00:02:58,041 No? 39 00:02:58,125 --> 00:02:59,667 Then what do you want? 40 00:02:59,750 --> 00:03:01,750 You want your ball? 41 00:03:04,000 --> 00:03:05,000 That's a good boy. 42 00:03:05,083 --> 00:03:07,917 Maddy. Madison. 43 00:03:48,625 --> 00:03:50,542 Ours is a rich 44 00:03:50,625 --> 00:03:53,500 and variant land. 45 00:03:53,583 --> 00:03:55,500 We have bounties beyond those 46 00:03:55,583 --> 00:03:59,125 known to the people of any other day. 47 00:03:59,208 --> 00:04:01,417 And as responsible as anyone else 48 00:04:01,500 --> 00:04:04,208 for the care of these bounties 49 00:04:04,291 --> 00:04:05,875 is the woman 50 00:04:05,959 --> 00:04:08,083 in the American home. 51 00:04:10,667 --> 00:04:13,709 - WDRC-FM HD3 Hartford. 52 00:04:13,792 --> 00:04:17,750 - So the topic today, Ray, is gifting tables. 53 00:04:17,834 --> 00:04:19,750 - Ah, Gifting Table. That's right. 54 00:04:19,834 --> 00:04:21,583 And I had a friend involved in it. 55 00:04:21,667 --> 00:04:24,250 In the beginning, I would just hear her on the phone 56 00:04:24,333 --> 00:04:28,250 talking about soup and salad and appetizers 57 00:04:28,333 --> 00:04:30,250 and entrées and dessert. 58 00:04:30,333 --> 00:04:32,709 One time, I said, "Am I ever gonna get an invitation 59 00:04:32,792 --> 00:04:34,417 to this event you're planning?" 60 00:04:34,500 --> 00:04:36,250 She said, "No. 61 00:04:36,333 --> 00:04:37,959 "This is a women's empowerment group. 62 00:04:38,041 --> 00:04:39,917 "It's just for women. 63 00:04:40,000 --> 00:04:42,000 Pretend you never heard that." 64 00:04:46,834 --> 00:04:48,417 - I hope I'm not disturbing you 65 00:04:48,500 --> 00:04:49,458 by any of the questions. 66 00:04:49,542 --> 00:04:50,917 - No. 67 00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:52,083 I mean, I don't wanna be the one 68 00:04:52,166 --> 00:04:54,000 to drop the bombs here, you know? 69 00:04:54,083 --> 00:04:57,542 - I'm ready for bombs. 70 00:04:57,625 --> 00:04:58,917 You good? - Good. 71 00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:01,000 - Cool. 72 00:05:01,083 --> 00:05:03,333 - There we go. 73 00:05:03,417 --> 00:05:04,458 - Okay. 74 00:05:04,542 --> 00:05:07,792 So what were the Gifting Tables? 75 00:05:07,875 --> 00:05:11,458 - We had dinner parties once a week, 76 00:05:11,542 --> 00:05:13,291 and everybody would really get dressed 77 00:05:13,375 --> 00:05:16,959 and put on their best clothes 78 00:05:17,041 --> 00:05:19,083 and makeup and jewelry, 79 00:05:19,166 --> 00:05:21,458 and we just had a great time. 80 00:05:21,542 --> 00:05:24,125 It was just a club. 81 00:05:24,208 --> 00:05:26,125 - Why didn't I know about the Tables? 82 00:05:26,208 --> 00:05:29,625 Why do you think my mother kept that from me? 83 00:05:29,709 --> 00:05:31,250 Oh. 84 00:05:31,333 --> 00:05:32,792 I didn't know that you didn't know anything 85 00:05:32,875 --> 00:05:35,542 about the Tables, quite frankly. 86 00:05:35,625 --> 00:05:40,000 So I don't know. 87 00:05:40,083 --> 00:05:42,792 - Okay. 88 00:05:42,875 --> 00:05:45,875 Let's go back a little bit. 89 00:05:45,959 --> 00:05:48,333 How did you meet my mother? 90 00:05:49,917 --> 00:05:53,250 - Your mom was a little girl when I married Ed, 91 00:05:53,333 --> 00:05:55,875 your mom's uncle. 92 00:05:55,959 --> 00:05:59,375 We met in high school. 93 00:05:59,458 --> 00:06:01,208 It was meant to be. 94 00:06:01,291 --> 00:06:03,208 You know, he's the only man of my life. 95 00:06:05,500 --> 00:06:07,667 Your mom and I were really, really close, 96 00:06:07,750 --> 00:06:10,834 but I really met her more as an adult 97 00:06:10,917 --> 00:06:15,166 when she married your dad and moved to Madison. 98 00:06:15,250 --> 00:06:17,542 - What did you think of my dad? 99 00:06:17,625 --> 00:06:20,375 - I really like your dad. I really liked him a lot. 100 00:06:20,458 --> 00:06:22,875 Come on, Jeff. 101 00:06:22,959 --> 00:06:24,208 It's funny, 'cause I always tell 102 00:06:24,291 --> 00:06:26,041 all the people who married into the family, 103 00:06:26,125 --> 00:06:28,542 "This is one of the most overwhelming families 104 00:06:28,625 --> 00:06:30,166 you'll ever, ever meet." 105 00:06:30,250 --> 00:06:33,083 - Ali! Ali! 106 00:06:33,166 --> 00:06:36,542 - There's nobody crazier than your whole family together. 107 00:06:36,625 --> 00:06:39,542 I tried to see how long I could go 108 00:06:39,625 --> 00:06:41,709 without being in the family photograph, 109 00:06:41,792 --> 00:06:43,583 and your dad said, "Well, you're in the family," 110 00:06:43,667 --> 00:06:46,375 and I said, "I've never been in the family picture 111 00:06:46,458 --> 00:06:49,542 and no one has ever noticed." 112 00:06:49,625 --> 00:06:52,917 So your dad made me come down and get in the picture. 113 00:06:54,458 --> 00:06:56,375 We were the same age, your father and I, 114 00:06:56,458 --> 00:06:58,083 so I think that we had 115 00:06:58,166 --> 00:07:01,291 a certain connection. 116 00:07:01,375 --> 00:07:04,417 But I knew the good guy. 117 00:07:04,500 --> 00:07:07,000 Didn't know the bad guy. 118 00:07:07,083 --> 00:07:08,625 After the divorce, 119 00:07:08,709 --> 00:07:12,750 that's when her drinking started becoming a problem. 120 00:07:12,834 --> 00:07:15,750 She started plunging downhill. 121 00:07:18,875 --> 00:07:20,667 She said she was drinking 122 00:07:20,750 --> 00:07:24,583 until she passed out every night. 123 00:07:24,667 --> 00:07:27,375 I looked at her and I said, "Where's my Barbie? 124 00:07:27,458 --> 00:07:30,417 "My Barbie is a take-charge girl. 125 00:07:30,500 --> 00:07:32,041 Where'd she go?" 126 00:07:33,959 --> 00:07:36,542 - Yes. Absolutely. 127 00:07:36,625 --> 00:07:38,917 Your grandfather, Sandy, had it. 128 00:07:39,041 --> 00:07:41,000 He was sober for almost 50 years 129 00:07:41,083 --> 00:07:42,834 before he died. 130 00:07:42,917 --> 00:07:46,417 And all three of the girls, and the boys, no. 131 00:07:46,500 --> 00:07:48,458 Isn't that funny? I don't have it. 132 00:07:48,542 --> 00:07:50,834 You either inherit that gene, I guess, 133 00:07:50,917 --> 00:07:53,375 or you don't, you know? 134 00:07:53,458 --> 00:07:54,834 It was a real surprise for me. 135 00:07:54,917 --> 00:07:56,625 I didn't think your mother had it. 136 00:07:56,709 --> 00:07:59,375 But then I didn't think Cathy had it either. 137 00:08:01,500 --> 00:08:03,792 - Your mom was drinking a lot, 138 00:08:03,875 --> 00:08:06,166 and she was arrested for a DUI. 139 00:08:08,041 --> 00:08:09,792 I guess she came out of a blackout, 140 00:08:09,875 --> 00:08:12,625 and she doesn't know if she was driving the vehicle 141 00:08:12,709 --> 00:08:14,667 or if someone else was. 142 00:08:14,750 --> 00:08:16,291 Every night, I would call your mom. 143 00:08:16,375 --> 00:08:19,542 She would answer sometimes. She wouldn't answer sometimes. 144 00:08:21,750 --> 00:08:25,542 One night, she said, "I'm gonna die." 145 00:08:25,625 --> 00:08:29,083 And I said, "What do you mean, you're gonna die?" 146 00:08:29,166 --> 00:08:32,041 She said, "I need some help." 147 00:08:32,125 --> 00:08:34,208 And I said, "I'll see you in the morning." 148 00:08:35,875 --> 00:08:38,000 So I took her to treatment. 149 00:08:38,083 --> 00:08:40,583 And Grammy came and took care of you, 150 00:08:40,667 --> 00:08:42,500 and when your mom came home, 151 00:08:42,583 --> 00:08:45,125 she was a whole new woman. 152 00:08:45,208 --> 00:08:47,291 - How did you meet my mom? 153 00:08:47,375 --> 00:08:51,500 - I met her in an AA meeting. 154 00:08:51,583 --> 00:08:54,667 - What was my mom's early sobriety like? 155 00:08:54,750 --> 00:08:56,333 - Your mother 156 00:08:56,417 --> 00:09:00,333 was the most enthusiastic newcomer 157 00:09:00,417 --> 00:09:01,834 that I've ever known. 158 00:09:01,917 --> 00:09:06,542 She was magnetic, alive, and compelling, 159 00:09:06,625 --> 00:09:09,709 and a joy to be around. 160 00:09:09,792 --> 00:09:13,041 Let's say she and I walked into a room together, 161 00:09:13,125 --> 00:09:15,041 I'd walk in behind her, 162 00:09:15,125 --> 00:09:19,166 the reaction to her, it was always incredibly welcoming. 163 00:09:19,250 --> 00:09:20,375 - Really? 164 00:09:20,458 --> 00:09:22,625 - Where Barbara was, people wanted to be. 165 00:09:24,458 --> 00:09:26,834 - How would you describe her? 166 00:09:31,792 --> 00:09:35,083 - As a light. 167 00:09:35,166 --> 00:09:38,500 A shining light. 168 00:09:38,583 --> 00:09:40,875 She was instrumental in my sobriety. 169 00:09:40,959 --> 00:09:42,583 Very much so. 170 00:09:42,667 --> 00:09:44,917 She was the best and only friend 171 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:46,834 I really ever had. 172 00:09:49,625 --> 00:09:52,917 - She really loved the program. 173 00:09:53,000 --> 00:09:55,208 She cared about people. 174 00:09:55,291 --> 00:09:58,583 She loved sponsoring new girls. 175 00:09:58,667 --> 00:10:01,750 I think she knew that that was her purpose in life, 176 00:10:01,834 --> 00:10:04,333 you know, to help others. 177 00:10:05,625 --> 00:10:09,250 People don't realize, when you lose one person, 178 00:10:09,333 --> 00:10:11,000 how much it affects 179 00:10:11,083 --> 00:10:13,375 so many other people, you know? 180 00:10:13,458 --> 00:10:17,041 - Do you think we'll ever find out who did it? 181 00:10:17,125 --> 00:10:19,125 - I hope in my lifetime. 182 00:10:19,208 --> 00:10:20,959 You know, I'm 65 years old. 183 00:10:21,041 --> 00:10:23,250 I don't know how much longer I'm gonna live. 184 00:10:23,333 --> 00:10:25,583 But I would really like to know. 185 00:10:25,667 --> 00:10:28,500 You have a lot more time than I do. 186 00:10:32,375 --> 00:10:34,542 You okay, man? - Yeah. 187 00:10:38,250 --> 00:10:41,500 This is just groceries. 188 00:10:41,583 --> 00:10:44,333 Mommy got some milk, some potatoes. 189 00:10:46,834 --> 00:10:48,959 - That's the chicken for dinner. 190 00:10:49,041 --> 00:10:50,625 As she lives her life 191 00:10:50,709 --> 00:10:53,166 as the woman American, 192 00:10:53,250 --> 00:10:56,333 we often seem to charge her with the responsibility 193 00:10:56,417 --> 00:10:59,583 of getting more out of the family purse 194 00:10:59,667 --> 00:11:02,041 than is there. 195 00:11:02,125 --> 00:11:05,667 Her art of working with the family 196 00:11:05,750 --> 00:11:10,166 helps provide us with the daily necessities 197 00:11:10,250 --> 00:11:11,667 and, perhaps, 198 00:11:11,750 --> 00:11:15,750 some of our delightful American privileges of life. 199 00:11:17,250 --> 00:11:19,667 - When she got sober, 200 00:11:19,750 --> 00:11:22,542 was my dad paying any child support? 201 00:11:22,625 --> 00:11:24,208 - No. 202 00:11:24,291 --> 00:11:28,291 So she had nothing to help you two guys with. 203 00:11:28,375 --> 00:11:30,417 Nothing at all. 204 00:11:31,250 --> 00:11:35,625 - So how was she paying for us if she wasn't making money? 205 00:11:35,709 --> 00:11:39,000 - Your mother had an IRA 206 00:11:39,083 --> 00:11:40,667 that she was cashing out, 207 00:11:40,750 --> 00:11:44,125 and that's how she tried to make ends meet. 208 00:11:44,208 --> 00:11:46,375 - Is that why she joined the Tables? 209 00:11:46,458 --> 00:11:49,375 - Yes. She needed the money. 210 00:11:55,417 --> 00:11:57,542 - How did you meet Donna? 211 00:11:57,625 --> 00:12:00,542 - I became really introduced to her 212 00:12:00,625 --> 00:12:02,542 through the Gifting Tables. 213 00:12:02,625 --> 00:12:04,208 At that time, Donna was hosting 214 00:12:04,291 --> 00:12:07,750 all the Gifting Table parties at her house. 215 00:12:07,834 --> 00:12:10,291 - A mark. 216 00:12:11,792 --> 00:12:14,041 - I don't want you to hold back 217 00:12:14,125 --> 00:12:16,333 because I'm the person who's asking, 218 00:12:16,417 --> 00:12:17,333 if that makes sense. 219 00:12:17,417 --> 00:12:18,542 - Mm-hmm. 220 00:12:18,625 --> 00:12:20,375 By the way, I really loved your mother. 221 00:12:20,458 --> 00:12:21,375 - Yeah. 222 00:12:21,458 --> 00:12:23,375 - The whole thing was just so stupid. 223 00:12:23,458 --> 00:12:24,917 I mean, like, I'm the last person 224 00:12:25,000 --> 00:12:26,542 who's a fraud. 225 00:12:26,625 --> 00:12:28,834 All right. - Dude, you look fine. 226 00:12:28,917 --> 00:12:30,709 - All right. 227 00:12:30,792 --> 00:12:33,583 - How long have you known my mom? 228 00:12:33,667 --> 00:12:36,083 - I met her 229 00:12:36,166 --> 00:12:39,250 early on in the Tables. 230 00:12:39,333 --> 00:12:42,291 I think it was 2007. 231 00:12:42,375 --> 00:12:45,792 I invited a woman who invited Jill. 232 00:12:45,875 --> 00:12:48,667 That's how I met Jill and your mother. 233 00:12:48,750 --> 00:12:52,375 And it was a community of women. 234 00:12:52,458 --> 00:12:55,417 And so I thought it was a great thing. 235 00:12:55,500 --> 00:12:59,792 It was a very large part of my life. 236 00:12:59,875 --> 00:13:02,583 We raised money for so many people 237 00:13:02,667 --> 00:13:04,417 to help them. 238 00:13:04,500 --> 00:13:07,041 It was a good thing. 239 00:13:16,375 --> 00:13:18,125 - Check this out. 240 00:13:21,750 --> 00:13:25,291 This is the amount of money 241 00:13:25,375 --> 00:13:27,500 that each woman made. 242 00:13:31,208 --> 00:13:32,291 Wow. 243 00:13:32,375 --> 00:13:34,792 That's crazy. 244 00:13:34,875 --> 00:13:36,333 - They are called gifting clubs. 245 00:13:36,417 --> 00:13:37,458 - Gifting circle. 246 00:13:37,542 --> 00:13:39,125 - Ring leaders are telling members 247 00:13:39,208 --> 00:13:42,125 they can take in an extra 80 grand in cash annually. 248 00:13:42,208 --> 00:13:45,667 - When women were invited to these Tuesday night events, 249 00:13:45,750 --> 00:13:47,500 which were typically in someone's home, 250 00:13:47,583 --> 00:13:50,291 they would be told not to tell your husband, 251 00:13:50,375 --> 00:13:53,125 not to tell anybody about it afterwards. 252 00:13:53,208 --> 00:13:55,000 It was just women getting together, 253 00:13:55,083 --> 00:13:56,792 and it was all cash-based, 254 00:13:56,875 --> 00:13:58,959 and it was all terribly secret. 255 00:13:59,041 --> 00:14:00,625 - The talk was always about 256 00:14:00,709 --> 00:14:03,542 how to get more people into the food chain. 257 00:14:17,458 --> 00:14:19,041 - Should I stop filming now or can I keep going? 258 00:14:19,125 --> 00:14:20,417 - Keep going. 259 00:14:24,375 --> 00:14:27,667 - I have an appointment with Detective Mulhern. 260 00:14:27,750 --> 00:14:30,208 - Name? - Madison Hamburg. 261 00:14:31,125 --> 00:14:32,208 Awesome. 262 00:14:32,291 --> 00:14:34,917 Thank you so much. 263 00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:36,291 - Okay. He's on his way out. 264 00:14:36,375 --> 00:14:37,417 - Okay, great. - Thank you. 265 00:14:37,500 --> 00:14:39,333 - No, thank you. 266 00:14:41,000 --> 00:14:42,041 - Hey. 267 00:14:42,125 --> 00:14:43,375 - Good. How are you? 268 00:14:43,458 --> 00:14:44,458 - Good to see you. 269 00:14:48,250 --> 00:14:49,417 - Where do you want me to sit? 270 00:14:51,458 --> 00:14:52,625 - Cool. 271 00:15:56,542 --> 00:16:00,125 - Madison's been in there for two hours 272 00:16:00,208 --> 00:16:03,333 when he was only scheduled to be in there for one hour. 273 00:16:03,417 --> 00:16:05,333 Um... 274 00:17:48,125 --> 00:17:50,041 Hello. How's it going? - Hi. How are you? 275 00:17:50,125 --> 00:17:51,417 - Good. How are you? - Come on in. 276 00:17:51,500 --> 00:17:52,375 - Thanks. 277 00:17:52,458 --> 00:17:53,709 - How you doing on this hot day? 278 00:17:53,792 --> 00:17:55,375 - Good. Are we good to park over here? 279 00:17:55,458 --> 00:17:56,750 - Yeah, you're fine. 280 00:17:56,834 --> 00:17:58,417 - Cool. - Yeah, come on in. 281 00:18:00,250 --> 00:18:03,542 - So when did you become close with my mom? 282 00:18:03,625 --> 00:18:05,917 - When she moved up here permanently. 283 00:18:06,000 --> 00:18:08,208 I got closer with her, actually, 284 00:18:08,291 --> 00:18:10,917 when I went to a couple of the Gifting Table meetings. 285 00:18:11,000 --> 00:18:14,166 - Okay, so what is a gifting table? 286 00:18:15,625 --> 00:18:17,083 If you are going to give a party, 287 00:18:17,166 --> 00:18:19,583 plan that party around a purpose. 288 00:18:21,375 --> 00:18:23,750 - They called it a sisterhood. It was beautiful. 289 00:18:23,834 --> 00:18:27,125 It was like, you walk in, everybody was, like-- 290 00:18:27,208 --> 00:18:31,000 greeted you and they were kind and they were supportive. 291 00:18:31,083 --> 00:18:32,166 Plan for refreshments 292 00:18:32,250 --> 00:18:33,458 and entertainment. 293 00:18:33,542 --> 00:18:34,875 - With the Gifting Tables, 294 00:18:34,959 --> 00:18:38,166 you joined with a $5,000 gift to a woman. 295 00:18:39,542 --> 00:18:42,208 That put you in a bottom row position, 296 00:18:42,291 --> 00:18:44,959 which we had called appetizers, 297 00:18:45,041 --> 00:18:46,917 and then you were asked to find one or two people, 298 00:18:47,041 --> 00:18:50,000 preferably two, to follow you, 299 00:18:50,083 --> 00:18:53,792 and then you, as an appetizer, moved up to the next level, 300 00:18:53,875 --> 00:18:56,000 which we called the soup and salad level. 301 00:18:56,083 --> 00:18:57,583 You already have your two people behind you. 302 00:18:57,667 --> 00:18:58,625 Your job is done. 303 00:18:58,709 --> 00:19:00,000 You're just there to support 304 00:19:00,083 --> 00:19:01,333 the people that are behind you 305 00:19:01,417 --> 00:19:02,959 and make them successful. 306 00:19:03,041 --> 00:19:05,125 Now you move up to the next entrée position, 307 00:19:05,208 --> 00:19:06,458 and you needed to have eight people 308 00:19:06,542 --> 00:19:08,375 in the appetizer position. 309 00:19:10,834 --> 00:19:12,083 And then you're in the position 310 00:19:12,166 --> 00:19:15,250 to actually receive the eight gifts. 311 00:19:15,333 --> 00:19:17,125 Five times eight. 312 00:19:17,208 --> 00:19:18,959 $40,000. 313 00:19:19,041 --> 00:19:20,917 Dessert is receiving. 314 00:19:21,000 --> 00:19:23,667 It's when you get your just desserts. 315 00:19:27,041 --> 00:19:30,208 Make sure the party is fun for everyone. 316 00:19:30,291 --> 00:19:32,458 - The night you would get gifted, 317 00:19:32,542 --> 00:19:34,166 everybody was so creative. 318 00:19:34,250 --> 00:19:37,667 One girl put all the hundreds 319 00:19:37,750 --> 00:19:39,500 in a balloon 320 00:19:39,583 --> 00:19:41,875 and then popped it, and all the money flew. 321 00:19:41,959 --> 00:19:46,333 One woman made a necklace out of the money. 322 00:19:46,417 --> 00:19:48,834 - I remember the first time I brought cash home 323 00:19:48,917 --> 00:19:50,208 and I showed it to Ed. 324 00:19:50,291 --> 00:19:51,458 I just threw it on the bed 325 00:19:51,542 --> 00:19:53,375 and the $100 bills were just going all over the place. 326 00:19:53,458 --> 00:19:56,125 He said, "You mean this actually works?" 327 00:19:57,917 --> 00:20:00,709 It was a lot of fun. I mean, it really was. 328 00:20:00,792 --> 00:20:02,000 Think about it. 329 00:20:02,083 --> 00:20:05,500 Just raining $100 bills all the time. 330 00:20:05,583 --> 00:20:06,875 - Now the tables fall. 331 00:20:06,959 --> 00:20:08,667 Everyone's gifted. 332 00:20:08,750 --> 00:20:11,667 She goes off and follows the person that brought her. 333 00:20:11,750 --> 00:20:14,542 There goes her two women behind her. 334 00:20:14,625 --> 00:20:16,166 And then it starts all over again. 335 00:20:16,250 --> 00:20:18,250 So you have to bring people in. 336 00:20:18,333 --> 00:20:21,333 - Right. - Otherwise, it's gonna die. 337 00:20:21,417 --> 00:20:23,041 - You have to understand the timing here. 338 00:20:23,125 --> 00:20:25,542 - Now it's official. We are in a recession. 339 00:20:25,625 --> 00:20:28,834 - Jobless claims hit a 26-year high. 340 00:20:28,917 --> 00:20:31,208 - So this is the early part of 2008. 341 00:20:31,291 --> 00:20:33,125 Everybody needed money. 342 00:20:33,208 --> 00:20:36,125 People were losing their jobs left and right. 343 00:20:36,208 --> 00:20:37,250 They were terrified. 344 00:20:37,333 --> 00:20:38,750 How were they gonna make ends meet? 345 00:20:38,834 --> 00:20:42,000 They came on the Table, they weren't afraid anymore. 346 00:20:42,083 --> 00:20:43,083 I needed money just to pay 347 00:20:43,166 --> 00:20:44,375 for your uncle's health insurance, 348 00:20:44,458 --> 00:20:46,041 and that was the main reason why I was doing it, 349 00:20:46,125 --> 00:20:48,000 because, you know, we had to pay 350 00:20:48,083 --> 00:20:50,250 $2,300 a month just for health insurance, 351 00:20:50,333 --> 00:20:52,250 and that wasn't with medication. 352 00:20:52,333 --> 00:20:55,750 I will have to say, if you give a person hope, 353 00:20:55,834 --> 00:20:57,208 you change their life. 354 00:20:57,291 --> 00:20:58,458 I saw miracles happen. 355 00:20:58,542 --> 00:21:00,917 Conway was a miracle. 356 00:21:01,000 --> 00:21:02,750 - So who invited you? 357 00:21:02,834 --> 00:21:05,375 - Your mother 358 00:21:05,458 --> 00:21:07,875 and my aunt Jill. 359 00:21:07,959 --> 00:21:09,750 I was, like, coming into my own 360 00:21:09,834 --> 00:21:11,208 for the first time in my life 361 00:21:11,291 --> 00:21:13,417 and feeling a lot of support. 362 00:21:13,500 --> 00:21:15,792 It was different from AA. 363 00:21:15,875 --> 00:21:17,792 That's about staying sober. 364 00:21:17,875 --> 00:21:22,458 This is about how to live life and, you know, 365 00:21:22,542 --> 00:21:25,542 be a strong, healthy, happy woman. 366 00:21:27,500 --> 00:21:29,083 - I gotta tell you something. 367 00:21:29,166 --> 00:21:31,917 This is something that most guys don't get. 368 00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:34,834 It's really something that women get. 369 00:21:34,917 --> 00:21:36,959 Women get this, but guys don't get this. 370 00:21:37,041 --> 00:21:41,083 This gifting club and that sorority kind of a thing, 371 00:21:41,166 --> 00:21:43,125 they don't get it. 372 00:21:43,208 --> 00:21:45,625 - Did Chris know about the Tables? 373 00:21:45,709 --> 00:21:48,625 - We did tell him. 374 00:21:48,709 --> 00:21:49,917 He didn't like it at all. 375 00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:53,125 - I'm like, "That is-- what are you doing? 376 00:21:53,208 --> 00:21:55,083 You're gonna get in trouble for that." 377 00:21:55,166 --> 00:21:56,417 She's like, "Absolutely not." 378 00:21:56,500 --> 00:21:58,000 And I assured him. 379 00:21:58,083 --> 00:21:59,291 I said, you know, 380 00:21:59,375 --> 00:22:01,667 "Honest, Chris, it's totally legal." 381 00:22:04,083 --> 00:22:06,083 He said, "I don't know. I don't know. 382 00:22:06,166 --> 00:22:08,375 It's kinda scary." 383 00:22:09,875 --> 00:22:12,458 - Their MO was, "What we're doing is legal, 384 00:22:12,542 --> 00:22:13,959 but we don't want it to become illegal," 385 00:22:14,041 --> 00:22:15,750 and so that's why they did all these weird things, 386 00:22:15,834 --> 00:22:17,542 like have codewords for stuff. 387 00:22:17,625 --> 00:22:19,166 - We don't recruit. 388 00:22:19,250 --> 00:22:20,500 We invite. 389 00:22:20,583 --> 00:22:21,667 It is not an investment. 390 00:22:21,750 --> 00:22:23,709 Don't ever tell anybody it's an investment. 391 00:22:23,792 --> 00:22:25,208 It's a gift. 392 00:22:25,291 --> 00:22:27,208 - And my mom used to keep, 393 00:22:27,291 --> 00:22:29,792 like, tens of thousands of dollars 394 00:22:29,875 --> 00:22:32,333 in the freezer at home in bags. 395 00:22:32,417 --> 00:22:33,500 I remember that. 396 00:22:33,583 --> 00:22:34,792 They were exercising 397 00:22:34,875 --> 00:22:36,500 what they thought was a tax loophole. 398 00:22:36,583 --> 00:22:40,792 They're essentially mini pyramids, more or less, 399 00:22:40,875 --> 00:22:43,709 with the main difference being you got in, you got out. 400 00:22:43,792 --> 00:22:46,166 You got in, you got out. You got in, you got out. 401 00:22:46,250 --> 00:22:48,709 But in order for them to work, more people had to join. 402 00:22:48,792 --> 00:22:50,375 Right? 403 00:22:54,250 --> 00:22:57,542 - So I'm a new member. 404 00:22:57,625 --> 00:22:59,458 How do you introduce me? 405 00:23:00,500 --> 00:23:03,208 Choose your guests carefully. 406 00:23:03,291 --> 00:23:05,709 - I'll pretend you're my sister. 407 00:23:05,792 --> 00:23:09,375 You know that group of women that I've been involved with? 408 00:23:09,458 --> 00:23:12,709 Well, it'll be a great group of women for you. 409 00:23:12,792 --> 00:23:14,125 Very supportive. 410 00:23:14,208 --> 00:23:16,667 She said, "Well, would I actually make any money?" 411 00:23:16,750 --> 00:23:18,417 I said, "I haven't been in a table 412 00:23:18,500 --> 00:23:20,375 that somebody didn't make something." 413 00:23:20,458 --> 00:23:22,166 - If they seemed excited 414 00:23:22,250 --> 00:23:24,750 and didn't know how to get the money, 415 00:23:24,834 --> 00:23:27,125 suggestions were made. 416 00:23:27,208 --> 00:23:28,959 Like, maybe you could refinance your house 417 00:23:29,041 --> 00:23:31,500 or their boat or whatever they might have. 418 00:23:31,583 --> 00:23:34,333 Is there equity in something? 419 00:23:36,125 --> 00:23:39,083 - And then it made a leap about three or four years ago 420 00:23:39,166 --> 00:23:43,458 to Avon, Farmington, Simsbury, Canton, West Hartford. 421 00:23:43,542 --> 00:23:46,250 That's when I started to say, "Oh, my gosh. 422 00:23:46,333 --> 00:23:48,667 Someone's going to get in trouble here." 423 00:23:51,667 --> 00:23:54,875 - Your mom had a ton of people that followed her, 424 00:23:54,959 --> 00:23:56,875 and she had a ton of AA people that followed her. 425 00:23:56,959 --> 00:23:58,083 - Really? 426 00:23:58,166 --> 00:24:00,625 - That caused, I think, problems elsewhere. 427 00:24:00,709 --> 00:24:02,083 - Within AA probably? 428 00:24:02,166 --> 00:24:04,291 - Yeah, I don't think that it was-- 429 00:24:04,375 --> 00:24:06,709 I think it was frowned upon to bring that there. 430 00:24:07,875 --> 00:24:10,083 - Did you know about the Gifting Tables 431 00:24:10,166 --> 00:24:12,041 after the murder? 432 00:24:12,125 --> 00:24:14,083 - I knew about them before the murder. 433 00:24:14,166 --> 00:24:17,208 A number of people I knew were involved. 434 00:24:17,291 --> 00:24:20,458 At least one person felt 435 00:24:20,542 --> 00:24:23,500 that your mom had recruited people 436 00:24:23,583 --> 00:24:26,208 that she knew through the program. 437 00:24:28,917 --> 00:24:31,625 - Your mom's group grew, like, so large. 438 00:24:31,709 --> 00:24:35,458 And then she became the Donna. 439 00:24:35,542 --> 00:24:36,750 - Oh. That makes sense. 440 00:24:36,834 --> 00:24:39,250 - Because she was the one that they would all follow. 441 00:24:39,333 --> 00:24:40,291 Because they would split off, 442 00:24:40,375 --> 00:24:42,959 then she was Donna in that group. 443 00:24:43,041 --> 00:24:45,125 The network was a big thing 'cause they wanted to grow. 444 00:24:45,208 --> 00:24:46,417 You know, 'cause if it doesn't grow, 445 00:24:46,500 --> 00:24:48,500 it's not gonna work, right? 446 00:24:48,583 --> 00:24:51,333 - Did anybody realize how big it was going to get? 447 00:24:51,417 --> 00:24:53,917 - No, I don't think so. 448 00:24:54,000 --> 00:24:56,291 It was so funny because, like, you could drive down the street 449 00:24:56,375 --> 00:24:58,625 on a Monday night and you would be like, 450 00:24:58,709 --> 00:25:00,166 "Oh, look at all the cars at that house. 451 00:25:00,250 --> 00:25:01,667 I bet you there's a women's meeting there." 452 00:25:01,750 --> 00:25:03,000 Like, people knew! - Wow. 453 00:25:03,083 --> 00:25:05,458 - You know, like, that's how it was. 454 00:25:05,542 --> 00:25:07,875 But then it got out of control. 455 00:25:07,959 --> 00:25:10,792 People were inviting everybody. 456 00:25:10,875 --> 00:25:14,583 - It started to get scary when the group got big. 457 00:25:14,667 --> 00:25:16,333 I mean, there would be-- there was one night 458 00:25:16,417 --> 00:25:19,667 where we had, like, $90,000 in this house, 459 00:25:19,750 --> 00:25:22,166 and it's a bad economy. 460 00:25:22,250 --> 00:25:25,333 And I said, "You know, people could start 461 00:25:25,417 --> 00:25:26,834 getting hurt here." 462 00:25:26,917 --> 00:25:28,667 And so there was more of a need 463 00:25:28,750 --> 00:25:32,166 to be very cautious and quiet about these parties 464 00:25:32,250 --> 00:25:34,125 and who was being invited. 465 00:25:34,208 --> 00:25:38,458 And so we didn't just invite anybody to come. 466 00:25:39,959 --> 00:25:42,125 - They tried to target people 467 00:25:42,208 --> 00:25:44,375 who could afford the $5,000, 468 00:25:44,458 --> 00:25:46,375 but if you think about that, 469 00:25:46,458 --> 00:25:49,041 at some point, the game has to-- 470 00:25:49,125 --> 00:25:51,917 if you want the game to go on, you have to go to people 471 00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:54,083 that don't necessarily have the means, 472 00:25:54,166 --> 00:25:56,000 and you're gonna end up getting somebody 473 00:25:56,083 --> 00:25:57,917 who really needed that $5,000, 474 00:25:58,000 --> 00:26:00,041 and that meant a lot more to them 475 00:26:00,125 --> 00:26:03,875 than it means to someone who's got it sitting around. 476 00:26:03,959 --> 00:26:07,500 - Well, I then saw an online alert 477 00:26:07,583 --> 00:26:10,041 about something called the Gifting Table, 478 00:26:10,125 --> 00:26:13,834 and that it was a pyramid scheme, 479 00:26:13,917 --> 00:26:15,750 and there were those terms. 480 00:26:15,834 --> 00:26:19,375 Appetizer, soup and salad, entrée, dessert. 481 00:26:19,458 --> 00:26:21,208 And all the pieces fell in together 482 00:26:21,291 --> 00:26:22,542 in just a microsecond, 483 00:26:22,625 --> 00:26:24,542 and I thought, "Oh, boy." 484 00:26:24,625 --> 00:26:26,291 - The money that they are taking out, 485 00:26:26,375 --> 00:26:29,917 the $40,000, they're not paying taxes on, 486 00:26:30,000 --> 00:26:32,375 and so many of these conversations 487 00:26:32,458 --> 00:26:34,250 about this pyramid scheme 488 00:26:34,333 --> 00:26:36,917 taking place through e-mails and over the phone. 489 00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:39,125 - That's wire fraud. 490 00:26:39,208 --> 00:26:41,583 Anyone who was at the dessert level 491 00:26:41,667 --> 00:26:43,458 in Central Connecticut, 492 00:26:43,542 --> 00:26:45,792 they know who they are. 493 00:26:50,875 --> 00:26:53,542 - Someone made a call to the attorney general. 494 00:26:53,625 --> 00:26:56,542 And then that's how it all started. 495 00:26:56,625 --> 00:26:58,583 - What was the announcement on the TV? 496 00:26:58,667 --> 00:27:02,083 - Oh, it was that there was an illegal Ponzi scheme 497 00:27:02,166 --> 00:27:04,917 running on the shoreline 498 00:27:05,000 --> 00:27:06,917 called the Gifting Tables. 499 00:27:07,041 --> 00:27:08,959 I was like, "Oh, my God. 500 00:27:09,041 --> 00:27:10,583 Like, illegal"-- you know what I mean? 501 00:27:10,667 --> 00:27:13,250 Like, I was floored by it. 502 00:27:13,333 --> 00:27:16,500 I'm telling you, I think that it just scared a lot of people. 503 00:27:26,041 --> 00:27:28,000 - Thank you so much for making time for us. 504 00:27:30,667 --> 00:27:32,625 I've been making this documentary 505 00:27:32,709 --> 00:27:35,166 since my mother was murdered ten years ago. 506 00:27:35,250 --> 00:27:36,792 I've been making it for the past six years. 507 00:27:36,875 --> 00:27:39,625 - Yeah, I'm sorry about your mom's death. 508 00:27:39,709 --> 00:27:40,792 - Thank you. 509 00:27:40,875 --> 00:27:43,291 - And I guess it still hasn't really been-- 510 00:27:43,375 --> 00:27:46,208 - It's still unsolved. - Solved, yeah. 511 00:27:46,291 --> 00:27:50,166 - As you may know, she was a part of the Gifting Tables. 512 00:27:50,250 --> 00:27:53,500 So what sparked the investigation 513 00:27:53,583 --> 00:27:55,166 back in 2009? 514 00:27:55,250 --> 00:27:56,750 - There were complainants. 515 00:27:56,834 --> 00:27:58,500 There were enough complainants 516 00:27:58,583 --> 00:28:00,333 that it was really having an impact. 517 00:28:00,417 --> 00:28:03,667 We felt strongly that we had to act to protect others, 518 00:28:03,750 --> 00:28:06,542 if only to warn them that the likelihood 519 00:28:06,625 --> 00:28:09,625 of their actually making money here 520 00:28:09,709 --> 00:28:11,875 was very, very remote. 521 00:28:11,959 --> 00:28:15,792 What struck me about the Gifting Table was 522 00:28:15,875 --> 00:28:17,500 the abuse of trust. 523 00:28:17,583 --> 00:28:20,000 Women were enticed to join 524 00:28:20,083 --> 00:28:24,458 with this promise of sisterhood and bonding, 525 00:28:24,542 --> 00:28:28,333 and some of them actually exploited friends, 526 00:28:28,417 --> 00:28:29,667 perhaps unknowingly-- 527 00:28:29,750 --> 00:28:31,208 one who asked 528 00:28:31,291 --> 00:28:35,208 her fellow AA members to join, 529 00:28:35,291 --> 00:28:37,083 the urging 530 00:28:37,166 --> 00:28:40,208 that people take a second mortgage, 531 00:28:40,291 --> 00:28:41,583 sell their car, 532 00:28:41,667 --> 00:28:43,333 ask relatives 533 00:28:43,417 --> 00:28:46,417 for early inheritance. 534 00:28:46,500 --> 00:28:49,709 Really striking people where they lived. 535 00:28:49,792 --> 00:28:51,375 It had an emotional element 536 00:28:51,458 --> 00:28:54,750 that was unusual for a pyramid scheme. 537 00:29:00,291 --> 00:29:02,417 - Did you see Jill's note? - Yeah. 538 00:29:04,125 --> 00:29:05,291 - Oh, really? 539 00:29:10,208 --> 00:29:13,583 - This is November 14th, 2009. 540 00:29:13,667 --> 00:29:16,041 We win as one. 541 00:29:22,875 --> 00:29:24,000 I wonder who she is. 542 00:29:26,709 --> 00:29:28,583 "Really, it's not even a misdemeanor. 543 00:29:28,667 --> 00:29:30,291 "Be happy. All is good. 544 00:29:30,375 --> 00:29:32,083 Love you. Really, I do." 545 00:29:32,166 --> 00:29:33,083 Okay. 546 00:29:33,166 --> 00:29:34,250 This is in response 547 00:29:34,333 --> 00:29:36,041 to the attorney general in Madison. 548 00:29:36,125 --> 00:29:37,917 "What happened is the result of a situation 549 00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:39,583 "that was put into motion some months ago 550 00:29:39,667 --> 00:29:40,875 "by an anonymous woman 551 00:29:40,959 --> 00:29:42,417 "who went to the attorney general's office 552 00:29:42,500 --> 00:29:44,583 "stating that she had been scammed, 553 00:29:44,667 --> 00:29:46,166 "lost money, et cetera, et cetera, 554 00:29:46,250 --> 00:29:49,375 "and showed that office many of our sacred guidelines. 555 00:29:49,458 --> 00:29:52,417 Blumenthal's office now feels they must investigate." 556 00:29:57,667 --> 00:29:59,834 - Once that attorney general call went in, 557 00:29:59,917 --> 00:30:02,458 I think everybody was like, "See ya later." 558 00:30:02,542 --> 00:30:04,291 - Really? - Oh, I think a lot--yeah. 559 00:30:04,375 --> 00:30:06,959 Yeah, I think a lot of people were like, "No way." 560 00:30:07,041 --> 00:30:08,542 They were afraid, 'cause then at that point-- 561 00:30:08,625 --> 00:30:09,792 - There was an investigation. 562 00:30:09,875 --> 00:30:11,625 - I think people were questioning the legality of it. 563 00:30:11,709 --> 00:30:14,083 Because I don't think people even thought about it before. 564 00:30:14,166 --> 00:30:15,625 What happened was, 565 00:30:15,709 --> 00:30:18,125 one of the women complained about Barb. 566 00:30:18,208 --> 00:30:19,792 - Ah. - That group is the one 567 00:30:19,875 --> 00:30:21,583 that called the attorney general. 568 00:30:21,667 --> 00:30:23,083 - My mom's? - Yeah. 569 00:30:23,166 --> 00:30:25,750 And then everyone was mad at her. 570 00:30:29,000 --> 00:30:31,792 - Your mother told me 571 00:30:31,875 --> 00:30:33,333 that she wished she had never asked 572 00:30:33,417 --> 00:30:36,542 her friends from AA to be a part of it, 573 00:30:36,625 --> 00:30:39,375 because it got out of hand. 574 00:30:39,458 --> 00:30:40,417 And there were some women 575 00:30:40,500 --> 00:30:41,917 who were maybe not healthy enough 576 00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:44,000 to do the tables. 577 00:30:44,083 --> 00:30:46,542 And then they got angry, and then they started to-- 578 00:30:46,625 --> 00:30:49,500 you know, it became a real quagmire. 579 00:30:49,583 --> 00:30:53,000 And then the badmouthing against your mom 580 00:30:53,083 --> 00:30:55,834 for "preying" on women 581 00:30:55,917 --> 00:30:58,333 in AA for this. 582 00:30:58,417 --> 00:31:01,917 They really made a stink. 583 00:31:04,458 --> 00:31:06,834 - So my mother was actually one of the women 584 00:31:06,917 --> 00:31:10,208 who was inviting people through Alcoholics Anonymous. 585 00:31:10,291 --> 00:31:12,667 Where is the line crossed 586 00:31:12,750 --> 00:31:16,000 between people who are victims 587 00:31:16,083 --> 00:31:19,583 and people who are, I guess, criminals? 588 00:31:19,667 --> 00:31:22,417 - Well, let me talk in general. 589 00:31:22,500 --> 00:31:24,250 Pyramid schemes, 590 00:31:24,333 --> 00:31:27,000 in the end, they are doomed to collapse. 591 00:31:27,083 --> 00:31:29,709 Someone is bound to walk away, 592 00:31:29,792 --> 00:31:31,834 in effect, defrauded. 593 00:31:31,917 --> 00:31:34,542 The people who knowingly 594 00:31:34,625 --> 00:31:38,041 and deliberately profit from the schemes 595 00:31:38,125 --> 00:31:41,750 are criminal in their intent. 596 00:31:41,834 --> 00:31:43,875 Others who are victims, 597 00:31:43,959 --> 00:31:46,083 in effect, are chewed up by them. 598 00:31:52,792 --> 00:31:55,417 - Okay, everybody's-- come sit, honey. 599 00:31:55,500 --> 00:31:56,875 Or get a more comfortable chair 600 00:31:56,959 --> 00:31:58,083 and bring it over. 601 00:32:44,375 --> 00:32:45,750 - How do I share my screen? 602 00:32:48,291 --> 00:32:49,500 - Yeah, I got it. 603 00:32:51,375 --> 00:32:53,083 Do you see my beautiful face? 604 00:32:55,375 --> 00:32:57,125 - "Log into Facebook 605 00:32:57,208 --> 00:32:59,583 using the following code as your password." 606 00:33:09,291 --> 00:33:11,083 - Holy shit, dude. 607 00:33:11,166 --> 00:33:12,792 This is insane. 608 00:33:12,875 --> 00:33:16,208 Feels really weird logging in as my mom. 609 00:33:17,709 --> 00:33:20,000 I mean, just feel like a mindfuck. 610 00:33:25,083 --> 00:33:27,125 Oh, my God. 611 00:33:27,208 --> 00:33:31,500 There's unread messages from before she died. 612 00:33:31,583 --> 00:33:33,166 So there's no way 613 00:33:33,250 --> 00:33:35,500 the police have seen this, dude, right? 614 00:33:35,583 --> 00:33:37,500 - Correct. 615 00:33:37,583 --> 00:33:40,208 - I wonder what that message is. 616 00:33:40,291 --> 00:33:42,875 "Cathy gave me 20 for..." 617 00:33:42,959 --> 00:33:44,875 I wonder if that had to do with the Tables. 618 00:33:44,959 --> 00:33:46,208 - Yeah. 619 00:33:46,291 --> 00:33:48,875 - Am I, like, tampering with evidence right now? 620 00:33:53,291 --> 00:33:55,500 Did she ever express any safety concerns? 621 00:33:55,583 --> 00:33:56,709 - Yes, she did. 622 00:33:56,792 --> 00:33:59,542 She said that... 623 00:33:59,625 --> 00:34:03,667 she felt she was being watched... 624 00:34:03,750 --> 00:34:06,250 a lot, I wanna say, 625 00:34:06,333 --> 00:34:08,583 those last couple months. 626 00:34:08,667 --> 00:34:11,083 And your mom was in the receiving position 627 00:34:11,166 --> 00:34:12,417 when she was murdered. 628 00:34:12,500 --> 00:34:14,500 So she was a dessert. - Oh, wow, I didn't know that. 629 00:34:14,583 --> 00:34:15,959 - Yep. 630 00:34:17,834 --> 00:34:21,333 - Do you ever wonder, like, who could've done it? 631 00:34:23,083 --> 00:34:24,250 - Yeah. 632 00:34:52,792 --> 00:34:55,417 - So I used to do repairs, all that type of stuff. 633 00:34:55,500 --> 00:34:57,709 Last thing I did was put the mailbox up for her 634 00:34:57,792 --> 00:35:00,917 the day before all this happened. 635 00:35:01,000 --> 00:35:04,125 Somebody had broke it off and took it. 636 00:35:17,792 --> 00:35:19,250 - What is this? 637 00:35:19,333 --> 00:35:21,083 February 14th. 638 00:35:21,166 --> 00:35:24,041 "Jill and I are split. 639 00:35:24,125 --> 00:35:25,792 "She made it formal, 640 00:35:25,875 --> 00:35:27,291 "and I just wanted to keep it friendly, 641 00:35:27,375 --> 00:35:29,667 "and so far, it doesn't appear she does. 642 00:35:29,750 --> 00:35:31,750 "Her other problem... 643 00:35:31,834 --> 00:35:35,542 "her other problem and Shelley and I 644 00:35:35,625 --> 00:35:37,166 "want to continue to travel together, 645 00:35:37,250 --> 00:35:39,166 and Auntie isn't happy with that." 646 00:35:42,542 --> 00:35:44,750 "Jill and I are split." 647 00:35:56,709 --> 00:35:59,333 I went through my mom's Facebook 648 00:35:59,417 --> 00:36:00,625 Who is--or what is that? 649 00:36:00,709 --> 00:36:01,792 - "She made it formal, 650 00:36:01,875 --> 00:36:03,125 "and I just wanted to keep it friendly, 651 00:36:03,208 --> 00:36:07,250 and so far, it doesn't appear she does." 652 00:36:07,333 --> 00:36:10,000 Oh, yeah. 653 00:36:10,083 --> 00:36:11,834 There was this big e-mail that went out 654 00:36:11,917 --> 00:36:14,333 that Barb's group is the group of Madison. 655 00:36:14,417 --> 00:36:16,750 Jill, like, cut her off. 656 00:36:16,834 --> 00:36:20,333 Like, told her--like, sent her on her own, kind of. 657 00:36:20,417 --> 00:36:22,792 - Oh. - Jill didn't tell you that? 658 00:36:22,875 --> 00:36:26,000 - So why did Jill wanna split? 659 00:36:26,083 --> 00:36:29,458 - Your mom and Conway decided 660 00:36:29,542 --> 00:36:33,291 they wanted to invite Tracy, my aunt, 661 00:36:33,375 --> 00:36:34,834 Jill's other sister. 662 00:36:34,917 --> 00:36:35,834 - Mm-hmm. 663 00:36:35,917 --> 00:36:37,041 - She could never invite a woman. 664 00:36:37,125 --> 00:36:38,792 And that's what they were getting mad at. 665 00:36:38,875 --> 00:36:41,709 They felt that they were just inviting anybody on 666 00:36:41,792 --> 00:36:43,041 just to gift. 667 00:36:43,125 --> 00:36:46,667 So Jill's whole holy side was getting mad at Barb's side, 668 00:36:46,750 --> 00:36:48,834 who was actually just trying to get women 669 00:36:48,917 --> 00:36:50,667 and bring 'em in and whatever. 670 00:36:50,750 --> 00:36:51,709 - Yeah. 671 00:36:51,792 --> 00:36:53,875 - And so it turned into a big debacle. 672 00:36:53,959 --> 00:36:56,792 Jill just then split. - Wow. 673 00:36:57,959 --> 00:37:00,792 What was your relationship with Jill like? 674 00:37:07,458 --> 00:37:10,125 - Who invited you to the Tables? 675 00:37:31,792 --> 00:37:34,417 - Tracy and I don't get along. Never have. 676 00:37:34,500 --> 00:37:37,792 I didn't think my sister was appropriate for the Tables. 677 00:37:37,875 --> 00:37:42,250 They had my sister join their table, 678 00:37:42,333 --> 00:37:43,792 and my mother was sort of 679 00:37:43,875 --> 00:37:46,291 just trying to push my sister along. 680 00:37:46,375 --> 00:37:49,542 Yeah, I said, "Mom, who does she know 681 00:37:49,625 --> 00:37:50,750 that would be appropriate?" 682 00:37:50,834 --> 00:37:51,959 She said, "Oh, nobody. 683 00:37:52,041 --> 00:37:53,125 Her friends don't have any money." 684 00:37:53,208 --> 00:37:57,750 And I said, "And so, she's gonna be successful how? 685 00:37:57,834 --> 00:37:59,917 "She doesn't have a job, 686 00:38:00,000 --> 00:38:01,458 "she's depressed, 687 00:38:01,542 --> 00:38:03,250 "and she doesn't have any friends with any money, 688 00:38:03,333 --> 00:38:05,458 so how is she gonna be-- how's she gonna do this?" 689 00:38:05,542 --> 00:38:07,250 You can't invite anybody. 690 00:38:07,333 --> 00:38:10,291 It has to be somebody who has a chance at being successful. 691 00:38:10,375 --> 00:38:13,125 We're not just trying to get money for people. 692 00:38:13,208 --> 00:38:16,792 But as soon as they had their way, 693 00:38:16,875 --> 00:38:18,083 they could do anything. 694 00:38:18,166 --> 00:38:20,667 They did what they wanted to do to get the money. 695 00:38:24,417 --> 00:38:28,667 - Jill was pissed. Sent out a fucking e-mail. 696 00:38:28,750 --> 00:38:30,625 Said, "Fuck it." 697 00:38:30,709 --> 00:38:35,041 And it panicked a lot of the girls who were... 698 00:38:35,125 --> 00:38:37,125 Jill's Tables or Barb's Tables or-- 699 00:38:37,208 --> 00:38:39,458 everybody was kind of blended, 700 00:38:39,542 --> 00:38:41,792 and so to split was weird, 701 00:38:41,875 --> 00:38:46,250 and it caused a lot of fear and confusion. 702 00:38:48,083 --> 00:38:50,500 - Did my mom and Jill ever, like, 703 00:38:50,583 --> 00:38:52,291 talk after the split, or-- 704 00:38:52,375 --> 00:38:54,667 - No, I don't think they did. 705 00:38:54,750 --> 00:38:59,166 So that e-mail was, I think, in February. 706 00:38:59,250 --> 00:39:00,208 - Oh. 707 00:39:00,291 --> 00:39:02,542 - And Mom was in-- 708 00:39:02,625 --> 00:39:04,041 she was murdered in March. 709 00:39:04,125 --> 00:39:05,792 - Right. - Right. So March 3rd? 710 00:39:05,875 --> 00:39:07,000 - Mm-hmm. - Right? 711 00:39:07,083 --> 00:39:08,875 So yeah, there wasn't a lot of time 712 00:39:08,959 --> 00:39:11,625 in between the e-mail and that. 713 00:39:14,166 --> 00:39:15,792 - Where did my mom keep her money? 714 00:39:15,875 --> 00:39:18,041 - In the safe in the house. 715 00:39:18,125 --> 00:39:20,792 - How much money do you think was in the safe? 716 00:39:20,875 --> 00:39:23,500 - I will say anywhere from 5,000 to 20,000. 717 00:39:23,583 --> 00:39:25,375 - Could it have been more? 718 00:39:25,458 --> 00:39:27,041 - Sure. 719 00:39:27,125 --> 00:39:29,667 - Did she ever move the money? 720 00:39:29,750 --> 00:39:32,792 - I do remember your mom digging a hole. 721 00:39:32,875 --> 00:39:35,667 She said she put it in there. 722 00:39:35,750 --> 00:39:38,709 But at some point, she got paranoid that 723 00:39:38,792 --> 00:39:43,000 that money was gonna be taken from her. 724 00:39:43,083 --> 00:39:45,667 - Why was she so paranoid? 725 00:39:45,750 --> 00:39:48,542 Did something happen? 726 00:39:48,625 --> 00:39:53,250 - She...she was with 727 00:39:53,333 --> 00:39:54,750 someone from AA, 728 00:39:54,834 --> 00:39:57,667 and I had heard that they saw, like, 729 00:39:57,750 --> 00:40:00,500 a guy wearing a ski mask walk through the yard, 730 00:40:00,583 --> 00:40:02,792 but they didn't call the police. 731 00:40:07,166 --> 00:40:09,083 - I heard that 732 00:40:09,166 --> 00:40:12,875 you and my mom witnessed a man wearing a ski mask 733 00:40:12,959 --> 00:40:16,041 walk through our yard on 44 Middle Beach? 734 00:40:16,125 --> 00:40:17,834 - Right. 735 00:40:17,917 --> 00:40:20,083 It was the day before she was murdered. 736 00:40:20,166 --> 00:40:22,917 - The day before she was killed? 737 00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:24,333 - Yes. 738 00:40:24,417 --> 00:40:27,041 - That's terrifying. 739 00:40:27,125 --> 00:40:29,000 - We were having a luncheon. 740 00:40:29,083 --> 00:40:30,875 Out of my left field vision, 741 00:40:30,959 --> 00:40:34,083 I saw a gentlemen in a black ski mask 742 00:40:34,166 --> 00:40:37,375 walk from the left of the windows in the front 743 00:40:37,458 --> 00:40:39,417 going towards East Wharf Road. 744 00:40:39,500 --> 00:40:41,250 - Down the driveway or-- - Yes. 745 00:40:41,333 --> 00:40:43,792 - And he was look-- he looked into the house? 746 00:40:43,875 --> 00:40:45,834 - Right. - Oh, my God. 747 00:40:47,667 --> 00:40:49,917 - You know, Madison, I gotta tell you, 748 00:40:50,000 --> 00:40:51,583 you know, when that fight happened 749 00:40:51,667 --> 00:40:54,250 between Jill and Barb, 750 00:40:54,333 --> 00:40:58,875 it really tore us apart. 751 00:40:58,959 --> 00:41:03,750 - Did Aunt Jill and my mom... 752 00:41:03,834 --> 00:41:06,750 - They never made up prior to that. 753 00:41:06,834 --> 00:41:08,667 Never. 754 00:41:13,375 --> 00:41:15,458 - Did you have anything to do with the murder? 755 00:41:15,542 --> 00:41:17,250 No. 756 00:41:17,333 --> 00:41:20,834 - I have to ask everyone. - That's okay. 757 00:41:20,917 --> 00:41:22,583 No. No. 758 00:41:22,667 --> 00:41:24,417 That was--it would've been impossible anyway, 759 00:41:24,500 --> 00:41:26,333 but no. 760 00:41:26,417 --> 00:41:28,792 Mm-mm. No. 761 00:41:28,875 --> 00:41:32,750 Because we were starting a road trip on the third 762 00:41:32,834 --> 00:41:34,792 with your grandmother. 763 00:41:34,875 --> 00:41:38,792 And we decided we were gonna get up really early 764 00:41:38,875 --> 00:41:41,792 to avoid hitting any traffic, and by 4:00, 765 00:41:41,875 --> 00:41:43,834 we were in the car and heading down there. 766 00:41:43,917 --> 00:41:45,667 4:00 in the morning. 767 00:41:45,750 --> 00:41:49,208 So we got to your grandmother 768 00:41:49,291 --> 00:41:51,458 by 10:00 in the morning. 769 00:41:51,542 --> 00:41:54,000 - Did the police interrogate you? 770 00:41:54,083 --> 00:41:57,375 - The police interrogated me as soon as possible. 771 00:41:57,458 --> 00:42:00,166 "And where were you?" "Well, I was in a car. 772 00:42:00,250 --> 00:42:03,333 You can check my Speedpass if you want," you know? 773 00:42:03,417 --> 00:42:06,417 But yeah, I think I was their first major suspect 774 00:42:06,500 --> 00:42:08,667 because of this Gifting Table thing 775 00:42:08,750 --> 00:42:11,834 and there's--being this little rift between us 776 00:42:11,917 --> 00:42:14,667 at that moment in time. 777 00:42:14,750 --> 00:42:16,166 But it was very obvious 778 00:42:16,250 --> 00:42:18,750 that I couldn't possibly be there. 779 00:42:21,125 --> 00:42:23,500 - Okay. 780 00:42:23,583 --> 00:42:25,417 I'm gonna take a break. 781 00:42:25,500 --> 00:42:27,125 - All right. 782 00:42:30,458 --> 00:42:33,208 I can't believe you're asking all these questions. 783 00:42:33,291 --> 00:42:35,083 Oh, Maddy. 784 00:42:35,166 --> 00:42:38,208 Quite the quest here, baby. 785 00:42:38,291 --> 00:42:39,792 Don't know how you do it. 786 00:42:46,333 --> 00:42:47,875 - Maddy! 787 00:42:47,959 --> 00:42:50,208 Madison. 788 00:42:53,500 --> 00:42:55,208 Hi. 789 00:42:56,959 --> 00:42:58,083 Whoo! 790 00:42:58,166 --> 00:42:59,583 - Barbara Hamburg-- - Was found dead on her lawn-- 791 00:42:59,667 --> 00:43:01,333 - Dead at the scene. 792 00:43:07,792 --> 00:43:08,917 - Hi. 793 00:43:11,166 --> 00:43:13,166 - No. Why would I be up there? 794 00:43:15,834 --> 00:43:17,834 - I didn't understand. 795 00:43:19,834 --> 00:43:21,667 Give me a hug. 796 00:43:39,375 --> 00:43:41,125 - Yeah. 797 00:43:43,667 --> 00:43:45,750 When everything happened, 798 00:43:45,834 --> 00:43:49,333 I was, like, afraid of losing her. 799 00:43:52,041 --> 00:43:55,375 I would practice visualizing her face. 800 00:43:57,542 --> 00:43:59,166 And I'd call her cell phone 801 00:43:59,250 --> 00:44:01,375 just so I could hear her voice. 802 00:44:01,458 --> 00:44:04,125 Snowflakes. - Snowflakes! 803 00:44:07,291 --> 00:44:09,959 Look at those big blue eyes. 804 00:44:10,041 --> 00:44:13,792 - Just desperate attempts of not losing someone. 805 00:44:13,875 --> 00:44:16,458 - What a beautiful boy. 806 00:44:16,542 --> 00:44:19,166 What a beautiful boy. 807 00:44:21,375 --> 00:44:24,959 - Anyone I could turn to as, like, someone to lean on 808 00:44:25,041 --> 00:44:28,834 or someone to, like, help me through, 809 00:44:28,917 --> 00:44:31,542 the person I'm turning to could've orchestrated 810 00:44:31,625 --> 00:44:33,834 or done this. 811 00:44:33,917 --> 00:44:35,125 Could've ruined my life. 812 00:44:39,250 --> 00:44:42,458 Sometimes, you just feel kind of alone. 813 00:44:47,125 --> 00:44:48,875 - Bye-bye. 814 00:44:50,417 --> 00:44:52,166 Mwah. 815 00:44:52,250 --> 00:44:53,834 I got a kiss. 816 00:45:02,291 --> 00:45:03,792 - It was about 8:30 in the morning. 817 00:45:03,875 --> 00:45:06,667 I was still in my pajamas and bathrobe. 818 00:45:11,208 --> 00:45:12,750 - It was in May, 819 00:45:12,834 --> 00:45:15,458 and I was sleeping in bed. 820 00:45:15,542 --> 00:45:19,667 My husband was on a business trip. 821 00:45:19,750 --> 00:45:22,000 - My nephew looks out the window 822 00:45:22,083 --> 00:45:24,500 and he sees all these federal agents 823 00:45:24,583 --> 00:45:28,250 coming to the house with their flak jackets. 824 00:45:28,333 --> 00:45:31,250 And they went, "Is Jill Platt in the house?" 825 00:45:31,333 --> 00:45:33,208 - He was banging at the door, 826 00:45:33,291 --> 00:45:36,417 and I see all these men out there 827 00:45:36,500 --> 00:45:37,750 in uniforms or something. 828 00:45:37,834 --> 00:45:38,750 I thought, "Oh, my God, 829 00:45:38,834 --> 00:45:40,750 there must be a fire or something." 830 00:45:40,834 --> 00:45:43,041 And I went downstairs and I opened the door 831 00:45:43,125 --> 00:45:44,709 and I said, "May I help you?" 832 00:45:44,792 --> 00:45:46,875 He said, "Are you Donna Bello?" and I said, "Yes." 833 00:45:46,959 --> 00:45:49,917 And then a group of men came in 834 00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:52,041 with guns and-- 835 00:45:52,125 --> 00:45:55,250 and bulletproof vests on 836 00:45:55,333 --> 00:45:59,709 and they put handcuffs on me. 837 00:45:59,792 --> 00:46:01,208 I was in shock. 838 00:46:01,291 --> 00:46:04,583 - I said, "Don't you have any real crime to fight?" 839 00:46:04,667 --> 00:46:07,291 "This is a real cri"-- I mean, I could just see 840 00:46:07,375 --> 00:46:10,041 I, like, stabbed him in his eyeball 841 00:46:10,125 --> 00:46:11,125 when I said that. 842 00:46:11,208 --> 00:46:12,917 "This is a real crime." 843 00:46:13,000 --> 00:46:16,041 - So I thought, "This is so messed up." 844 00:46:16,125 --> 00:46:18,709 You know? "This is crazy. 845 00:46:18,792 --> 00:46:20,250 "Like, what is going on? 846 00:46:20,333 --> 00:46:22,750 This is a women's gifting group." 847 00:46:22,834 --> 00:46:24,917 - Bunch of women having dinner parties, 848 00:46:25,000 --> 00:46:26,583 giving each other money. 849 00:46:26,667 --> 00:46:30,417 I can think of worse things. 850 00:46:30,500 --> 00:46:32,500 - Do you think if my mom was alive, 851 00:46:32,583 --> 00:46:36,417 she would've been taken to trial? 852 00:46:36,500 --> 00:46:38,583 - If your mother was alive today, 853 00:46:38,667 --> 00:46:41,291 I don't know that any of us would've been taken to trial. 854 00:46:41,375 --> 00:46:43,458 The thing is, when your mother was murdered, 855 00:46:43,542 --> 00:46:44,834 they confiscated her computer, 856 00:46:44,917 --> 00:46:46,959 and when they confiscated her computer, 857 00:46:47,041 --> 00:46:50,417 they saw this business about the Tables. 858 00:46:50,500 --> 00:46:52,458 So then they turned all of this information over 859 00:46:52,542 --> 00:46:54,041 to the IRS. 860 00:46:55,875 --> 00:46:58,792 - Do you believe that the murder was a catalyst 861 00:46:58,875 --> 00:47:00,166 for the investigation? 862 00:47:00,250 --> 00:47:02,542 - Yeah. Yeah. 863 00:47:09,041 --> 00:47:12,166 - Had you heard about my mother's murder 864 00:47:12,250 --> 00:47:14,917 before starting the investigation? 865 00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:16,458 - So--no. 866 00:47:16,542 --> 00:47:19,458 Back in around March 2010, 867 00:47:19,542 --> 00:47:22,125 there was a detailed article 868 00:47:22,208 --> 00:47:24,333 published by the "New Haven Register" 869 00:47:24,417 --> 00:47:26,166 about the women's gifting tables 870 00:47:26,250 --> 00:47:28,208 that were operating on the shoreline of Connecticut, 871 00:47:28,291 --> 00:47:31,709 and that article referenced this murder. 872 00:47:31,792 --> 00:47:34,208 - Do you think if my mother was alive, 873 00:47:34,291 --> 00:47:37,500 she would've been a part of the investigation? 874 00:47:37,583 --> 00:47:39,417 - I can't say. 875 00:47:39,500 --> 00:47:42,000 - She broke the law, I think-- I think, 876 00:47:42,083 --> 00:47:44,792 by being a part of these gifting tables 877 00:47:44,875 --> 00:47:48,500 and possibly victimized women, maybe even unknowingly. 878 00:47:48,583 --> 00:47:51,250 If the women thought what they were doing was right, 879 00:47:51,333 --> 00:47:54,667 does that change what they were doing? 880 00:47:54,750 --> 00:47:57,000 - Well, the evidence ultimately dictated, 881 00:47:57,083 --> 00:48:00,917 you know, charges being filed 882 00:48:01,000 --> 00:48:03,875 based on their statements, 883 00:48:03,959 --> 00:48:05,709 their e-mails, 884 00:48:05,792 --> 00:48:07,208 you know, everything that we'd gathered 885 00:48:07,291 --> 00:48:08,709 in the investigation. 886 00:48:08,792 --> 00:48:10,500 - Two Guilford women convicted of running 887 00:48:10,583 --> 00:48:12,208 a Gifting Table pyramid scheme 888 00:48:12,291 --> 00:48:13,583 were sentenced today. 889 00:48:13,667 --> 00:48:15,709 Jill Platt will spend 4 1/2 years in prison. 890 00:48:15,792 --> 00:48:19,542 Donna Bello will spend six years behind bars. 891 00:48:19,625 --> 00:48:22,542 - I couldn't figure out 892 00:48:22,625 --> 00:48:23,709 how many years that was, 893 00:48:23,792 --> 00:48:26,208 because I couldn't even get to that point 894 00:48:26,291 --> 00:48:27,542 where I was thinking years. 895 00:48:27,625 --> 00:48:29,250 I just... 896 00:48:31,792 --> 00:48:33,375 And then I'm blank. Then I went blank. 897 00:48:33,458 --> 00:48:36,792 And I lost a lot of memory after that. 898 00:48:36,875 --> 00:48:38,750 - In tears, Bello and Platt both apologized 899 00:48:38,834 --> 00:48:40,041 in court today. 900 00:48:40,125 --> 00:48:42,250 The two were found guilty in February of wire fraud, 901 00:48:42,333 --> 00:48:43,875 filing false tax returns, 902 00:48:43,959 --> 00:48:47,417 and conspiring to defraud the IRS. 903 00:48:47,500 --> 00:48:50,625 - Well, I've lost my family, my own family, 904 00:48:50,709 --> 00:48:53,667 because I'm such a shame to them. 905 00:48:56,333 --> 00:48:58,291 That's because they're ignorant. 906 00:48:58,375 --> 00:49:00,875 They're all ignorant. 907 00:49:25,375 --> 00:49:28,709 - What's up? - Hey, man. 908 00:49:28,792 --> 00:49:29,959 - Hi, Kim. - Hi. 909 00:49:30,041 --> 00:49:32,625 How are you? - How's it going? 910 00:49:32,709 --> 00:49:34,792 How's it going? - Good. How's it going for you? 911 00:49:34,875 --> 00:49:37,208 - Good. - Yeah? 912 00:49:37,291 --> 00:49:39,083 Yes? 913 00:49:39,166 --> 00:49:41,333 What? What? What? - Oh. 914 00:49:41,417 --> 00:49:42,792 - How have you been? 915 00:49:42,875 --> 00:49:45,917 - Well, I got married. 916 00:49:46,000 --> 00:49:49,291 That was, what, two years ago? 917 00:49:49,375 --> 00:49:50,959 Mom's out of jail. 918 00:49:51,041 --> 00:49:53,917 Mom went to jail, and now she's out of jail. 919 00:49:54,000 --> 00:49:57,041 Right now, everything's good. Everybody's healthy. 920 00:50:01,709 --> 00:50:05,458 - Banksy, my spoiled cat. 921 00:50:08,458 --> 00:50:10,291 - You got out in November? 922 00:50:10,375 --> 00:50:12,166 - I came back in November. 923 00:50:12,250 --> 00:50:13,375 - Okay. - I got out last May. 924 00:50:13,458 --> 00:50:14,875 May 15th. 925 00:50:14,959 --> 00:50:17,208 - So it's been over a year? 926 00:50:17,291 --> 00:50:18,500 - Just. 927 00:50:18,583 --> 00:50:20,458 Mm. - Wow. 928 00:50:20,542 --> 00:50:23,458 - It's just a big adjustment, you know? 929 00:50:23,542 --> 00:50:27,041 My husband died two months before the trial. 930 00:50:27,125 --> 00:50:29,667 The last year of his life, he was not well 931 00:50:29,750 --> 00:50:33,500 and not taking his medication for his heart. 932 00:50:37,959 --> 00:50:38,875 - Whoo! 933 00:50:38,959 --> 00:50:41,333 - I do believe that your uncle died 934 00:50:41,417 --> 00:50:43,667 because he was so stressed out. 935 00:50:43,750 --> 00:50:46,709 - Hello, beautiful. - How are you? 936 00:50:46,792 --> 00:50:48,083 - We were married 43 years. 937 00:50:48,166 --> 00:50:49,750 So now, all of a sudden, 938 00:50:49,834 --> 00:50:51,875 I am on my own, 939 00:50:51,959 --> 00:50:53,709 have to figure it out, but you know what? 940 00:50:53,792 --> 00:50:57,875 I no longer-- I no longer worry about it. 941 00:50:57,959 --> 00:50:59,917 It's like, que será, será. 942 00:51:00,000 --> 00:51:01,875 What will be will be. 943 00:51:01,959 --> 00:51:04,834 What do you think, Banks? 944 00:51:04,917 --> 00:51:07,333 What do you think? 945 00:51:07,417 --> 00:51:12,250 - What's really impactful here are the human stories 946 00:51:12,333 --> 00:51:15,375 of greed, 947 00:51:15,458 --> 00:51:18,583 loss, remorse, 948 00:51:18,667 --> 00:51:23,041 and destruction of personal lives 949 00:51:23,125 --> 00:51:25,083 and friendships and relationships. 950 00:51:25,166 --> 00:51:28,750 - So... 951 00:51:28,834 --> 00:51:30,959 I'm trying to wrestle with the idea 952 00:51:31,041 --> 00:51:35,041 of whether or not my mother was a criminal, I guess. 953 00:51:35,125 --> 00:51:38,625 I don't know that she knowingly... 954 00:51:38,709 --> 00:51:40,875 she knew that the Tables had 955 00:51:40,959 --> 00:51:43,583 the outcome that they would have, 956 00:51:43,667 --> 00:51:46,583 but, you know, she made money off of-- 957 00:51:46,667 --> 00:51:47,750 - I wish I could help you... 958 00:51:47,834 --> 00:51:49,250 - Sure. - Answer that question. 959 00:51:49,333 --> 00:51:50,709 You know, I would also say, 960 00:51:50,792 --> 00:51:53,625 just on a very personal level, to you, 961 00:51:53,709 --> 00:51:56,959 there are... 962 00:51:57,041 --> 00:52:01,083 gradations of culpability when people break the law, 963 00:52:01,166 --> 00:52:02,834 so it's complicated. 964 00:52:02,917 --> 00:52:04,542 Life is complicated. 965 00:52:04,625 --> 00:52:06,458 I learned as a prosecutor, 966 00:52:06,542 --> 00:52:10,750 both as a U.S. attorney and as state attorney general, 967 00:52:10,834 --> 00:52:14,083 condemnation is easy, 968 00:52:14,166 --> 00:52:17,291 but breaking the law involves 969 00:52:17,375 --> 00:52:22,000 different degrees of moral responsibility. 970 00:52:32,083 --> 00:52:33,333 - Lucy, Lucy. 971 00:52:33,417 --> 00:52:35,583 Hey, everybody. - Hey, how's it going, Don? 972 00:52:35,667 --> 00:52:37,166 Nice to meet you. - Finally. 973 00:52:37,250 --> 00:52:38,750 Yeah, it's good to meet you finally, yes. 974 00:52:40,834 --> 00:52:44,250 Yeah, what time was the call to 911? 975 00:52:44,333 --> 00:52:47,625 - Between 11:30 and 12:00, maybe even 12:30. 976 00:52:47,709 --> 00:52:49,458 - A rough estimate right now would be, 977 00:52:49,542 --> 00:52:52,250 we're looking at about a two-hour window. 978 00:52:52,333 --> 00:52:54,625 We don't know if they were there waiting 979 00:52:54,709 --> 00:52:57,667 or she was expecting someone to come over. 980 00:52:57,750 --> 00:52:59,667 - So here's the house. - Mm-hmm. 981 00:52:59,750 --> 00:53:01,667 - It's covered with trees. 982 00:53:01,750 --> 00:53:03,000 There's a long driveway 983 00:53:03,083 --> 00:53:05,041 with a neighbor here and a neighbor here. 984 00:53:05,125 --> 00:53:07,291 There's a golf course right here. 985 00:53:11,500 --> 00:53:13,000 - So this is the drive right here, right? 986 00:53:13,083 --> 00:53:14,500 - The--yeah, this second one. 987 00:53:14,583 --> 00:53:16,542 - 34, here? Okay. 988 00:53:18,709 --> 00:53:21,834 - You can't see it at all from the street. 989 00:53:21,917 --> 00:53:24,375 - No. 990 00:53:24,458 --> 00:53:25,667 - I don't even-- 991 00:53:25,750 --> 00:53:27,542 - You had to know that the house was there. 992 00:53:27,625 --> 00:53:28,834 - Yeah. 993 00:53:28,917 --> 00:53:32,000 - That would be a high-risk point of entry. 994 00:53:38,500 --> 00:53:40,208 - Oh, there-- that's the house right there? 995 00:53:40,291 --> 00:53:42,375 - Yeah. - Okay. 996 00:53:42,458 --> 00:53:43,542 Wow. 997 00:53:43,625 --> 00:53:45,542 - It is wide open from this angle. 998 00:53:45,625 --> 00:53:47,041 - It is. 999 00:53:48,792 --> 00:53:50,208 The focus should be, you know, 1000 00:53:50,291 --> 00:53:52,709 was there a third dimension to this? 1001 00:53:52,792 --> 00:53:54,709 Was there something else going on 1002 00:53:54,792 --> 00:53:56,250 in your mom's life 1003 00:53:56,333 --> 00:53:59,166 that nobody knows or she kept a secret? 1004 00:53:59,250 --> 00:54:01,458 Was there something that we're missing? 1005 00:54:14,709 --> 00:54:16,166 - Who was that? 1006 00:54:30,125 --> 00:54:31,041 - Yeah. 1007 00:54:31,125 --> 00:54:33,959 What is this document? 1008 00:54:34,041 --> 00:54:38,333 - It's an excerpt of testimony to the grand jury. 1009 00:54:38,417 --> 00:54:39,917 - So this is something that's sealed 1010 00:54:40,000 --> 00:54:41,375 that we couldn't get before? 1011 00:54:41,458 --> 00:54:42,458 - Yeah. 1012 00:54:42,542 --> 00:54:44,542 I have no idea how Conway has this. 1013 00:54:44,625 --> 00:54:47,125 Because all testimonies in the grand jury 1014 00:54:47,208 --> 00:54:48,583 are supposed to be sealed. 1015 00:54:53,834 --> 00:54:55,917 - "There were some intimidating measures 1016 00:54:56,000 --> 00:54:57,792 "taken in the past few months. 1017 00:54:57,875 --> 00:55:00,792 "Members of the gifting tables have come to the meetings 1018 00:55:00,875 --> 00:55:04,125 "and presented themselves in intimidating ways. 1019 00:55:04,208 --> 00:55:06,834 "Conway Beach has come to meetings several times 1020 00:55:06,917 --> 00:55:09,291 "and shared in a meeting that there shouldn't be 1021 00:55:09,375 --> 00:55:11,125 "gossip, criticism, and judgment, 1022 00:55:11,208 --> 00:55:12,291 "and discussion about things 1023 00:55:12,375 --> 00:55:14,834 that people don't know anything about." 1024 00:55:14,917 --> 00:55:16,792 "Within the last week and a half, 1025 00:55:16,875 --> 00:55:19,041 was Ms. Beach near your residence?" 1026 00:55:19,125 --> 00:55:20,625 "Yes, sir." 1027 00:55:20,709 --> 00:55:22,291 "Explain to the members 1028 00:55:22,375 --> 00:55:23,917 of the Grand Jury what happened there." 1029 00:55:35,208 --> 00:55:36,458 "As you sit here today, 1030 00:55:36,542 --> 00:55:38,542 are you afraid of Conway Beach?" 1031 00:55:38,625 --> 00:55:40,500 "Yes, sir." 1032 00:55:40,583 --> 00:55:42,375 "Why is that?" 1033 00:55:48,417 --> 00:55:51,083 Wow. 1034 00:56:06,583 --> 00:56:08,417 - As you're doing this documentary, 1035 00:56:08,500 --> 00:56:10,125 I worry about you the most, 1036 00:56:10,208 --> 00:56:13,667 because you're finding out so many things 1037 00:56:13,750 --> 00:56:16,000 that I tried to protect you from. 1038 00:56:16,083 --> 00:56:18,166 And I just worry. 1039 00:56:18,250 --> 00:56:22,458 I hope you can process all of this... 1040 00:56:24,000 --> 00:56:27,875 And still love me. 1041 00:56:27,959 --> 00:56:31,083 As I will always love you. 1042 00:56:31,166 --> 00:56:32,750 - Watch out for the-- - Happy Thanksgiving. 1043 00:56:32,834 --> 00:56:34,375 Hazards are behind you. 1044 00:56:36,792 --> 00:56:38,542 - Some people can get to a point, 1045 00:56:38,625 --> 00:56:40,250 I don't care who it is, 1046 00:56:40,333 --> 00:56:42,333 where they can snap. 1047 00:56:42,417 --> 00:56:44,250 - Did you snap? 1048 00:56:44,333 --> 00:56:46,458 - I snapped. 1049 00:57:38,542 --> 00:57:40,709 - Flowers? You gonna get the flowers? 1050 00:57:40,792 --> 00:57:42,083 Okay. 1051 00:57:42,166 --> 00:57:44,625 Get the flowers. 1052 00:57:44,709 --> 00:57:46,083 Aww. 1053 00:57:46,166 --> 00:57:47,917 Oh. 1054 00:57:48,000 --> 00:57:49,750 Pretty flowers. 1055 00:58:06,875 --> 00:58:08,625 Oh. 1056 00:58:08,709 --> 00:58:11,375 Pretty flowers. 1057 00:58:29,917 --> 00:58:31,542 I'm so sorry. 1058 00:58:32,333 --> 00:58:33,917 Why are you sorry? 1059 00:58:37,166 --> 00:58:39,208 I haven't been back here in six years. 1060 00:58:39,917 --> 00:58:41,625 How has it effected our family? 1061 00:58:41,709 --> 00:58:43,500 I definitely do feel like there's a rift 1062 00:58:43,583 --> 00:58:44,709 because of the murder. 1063 00:58:44,959 --> 00:58:49,250 When your world is ripped apart it can do things to you. 1064 00:58:49,667 --> 00:58:53,125 If the person is still alive who did this to mom, 1065 00:58:53,208 --> 00:58:54,333 would you wanna say anything? 1066 00:58:54,417 --> 00:58:56,583 No. Do you wanna say anything to them? 1067 00:58:57,750 --> 00:58:59,000 I'm coming for you. 81564

Can't find what you're looking for?
Get subtitles in any language from opensubtitles.com, and translate them here.