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At the time I made the film,
The Exorcist,
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I had never seen an exorcism.
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More than four decades later,
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I witnessed the oneyou are about to see.
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You asked me earlier,
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-if I was ever gonna do
anything else...
-Right.
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...about the devil,
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-and you seem concerned...
-Yeah.
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...when you asked me that.
Why were you concerned?
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People ought to stay away
from the subject as much
as possible.
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The more you open yourself,
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to thinking about this stuff
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and you start feeling
about this stuff,
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the more room you allow
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for the supernatural
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power of evil to come in.
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There are more than
60 million people in Italy.
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According to twoof the leading newspapers,
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and the major television channel,
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500,000 Italians see an exorcist every year.
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This woman is one of them.
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Her name is Christina.
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She's 46 years old
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and lives 200 milessouth east of Rome,
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in a small mountain village.
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She's an architect
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that can't work.
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She's said to be possessed
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by the Devil.
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Father Gabriele Amorth,
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has been the exorcist for the diocese of Rome
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for 31 years.
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He has exorcised Christinaeight times without success.
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This will be her ninth.
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In the fall of 1972,
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I came to Georgetown,
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here, in Washington D.C.,
to film The Exorcist.
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The Exorcist is a novel
by William Peter Blatty,
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inspired by an event
that took place
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in 1949,
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when Blatty was an undergraduate
here at Georgetown University.
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Right now we are on the campus
of Georgetown University in
Washington D.C.
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We're on the main campus,right by the front,
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and in one of those classrooms,
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I listened to a Jesuit Priest.
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He was teaching a
theology course, new testament.
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Father Eugene Gallaghar began to
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go off on a case ofpossession and exorcism and
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that's where I first heard about possession.
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On this quiet little street,
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in this quiet town called,
Cottage City, Maryland.
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This is the house
where the 1949 case began.
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Where Luther and family
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whose 14 year old son
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was said to be possessed.
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00:04:14,712 --> 00:04:17,757
He was examined by doctors
and psychiatrists,
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who could not determine
the cause of his disturbing
afflictions.
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00:04:23,179 --> 00:04:26,891
And so, priests from
the Catholic Dioceses,
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in Washington D.C. were
brought in to perform
a series of exorcisms
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at this very house.
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The boy was later transferredto Alexian Brothers Hospital
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in St. Louis,
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where he was eventually
liberated.
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Bill Blatty believed in the
truth of this case when
he wrote his novel,
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and later, his screenplay
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of The Exorcist.
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And so did I,
when I directed the film.
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And lo and behold,
I then read it
in the Washington Post,
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and I was very excited about it.
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And I thought,wouldn't it beabsolutely marvelous
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if one could write
a non-fiction account...
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of this.
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Provided it was authentically
something
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paranormal and inexplicable.
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What a tremendous re-affirmation
of faith that would be.
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There would be a fantastic...
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well, what are we waiting for?
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And...
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many, many, many years later,
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it all came back to me.
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And I was determined
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to write that story
but as non-fiction.
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And I finally was able to
track down,
with great difficulty,
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the original exorcist
in that particular case.
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His name was,Father William Bowden.
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He's a Jesuit.
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He was very eager to help me.
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And apparently, a promise
of absolute silence
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and confidentiality had
been given to the family
of the possessed boy.
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And he asked that, that
be lifted because this was
a very very good cause.
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It was very apostolic work
that was going to be done, and
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I went to the family,
and they said no,
they wanted no part of it.
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Now I was more convinced
than ever,
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since they were not
publicity mongers,
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going on Heraldo,
or whatever,
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that this thing
really had substance to it.
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And, he utterly galvanized me,
Father Bowden did, with one
sentence in his letter.
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At the bottom, after explaining
how sorry he was
that he couldn't help me,
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and after pleading with me,
"Please don't write about
this case".
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"Don't tell anything
that I've told you."
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He said, "One thing however
I can tell you,
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"the case which I was involved
with was the real thing."
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I had no doubt about it then,
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I have no doubt about it now.
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And that was all I needed.
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This is the house at
36th and Prospect
in Georgetown
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that we used as the exterior
of the McNeil house in the film.
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00:07:08,302 --> 00:07:13,057
Now, the house doesn't
look today the way it looked
back in 1972,
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and that's because
we had to build a false front
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from the end of this house
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to the end of the fence
down there,
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to bring the house closer
to the steps.
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Now, on the second floorof that false front
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was the exterior of Regan's bedroom,
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from which Father Karrascould make his final leap.
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These steps are just
a few feet away from the house.
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They are now officially known
as, "The Exorcist Steps".
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For me, the steps and Georgetown
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are the spiritual home
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of The Exorcist.
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I've always been fascinated
by the nature of good and evil.
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And the possibility of
demonic possession.
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But the opportunity for me
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00:08:01,856 --> 00:08:04,901
to witness and film
an actual exorcism,
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00:08:05,735 --> 00:08:09,614
came about 45 years
after I had made the film.
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And completely by accident.
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00:08:13,826 --> 00:08:15,495
Or was it providence?
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00:08:16,245 --> 00:08:18,581
Father Amorth,
in his first memoir,
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wrote about The Exorcist film
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and he said it was
his favorite movie.
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I guess, of course.
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He said that the, um,
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00:08:28,466 --> 00:08:30,676
special effects were
a little over the top,
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00:08:31,177 --> 00:08:34,805
but he said that
it helped people
to understand his work.
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And so, when I wrote asking
if I could meet with him,
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he immediately agreed.
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At the age of 18,
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Gabriele Amorth fought his first battle against evil
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when he joined the Italian Resistance
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against the fascist dictator,Mussolini,
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and the Nazi alliance.
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He was awarded the Medal of Liberation bythe Italian Government.
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00:09:00,748 --> 00:09:02,500
But it was 10 years later,
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before he found his calling
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and was ordained a priest
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in the society of Saint Paul.
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Thirty years after that,in 1986,
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he became the chief exorcistof Rome
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and dedicated his lifeto helping those he believedwere possessed.
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Each morning, he would respondto the hundreds of letters hereceived every week
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from around the world.
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From those with spiritual diseases.
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And he became one of the mostbeloved figures
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in his native country.
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He performed his first exorcisms
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at the Cathedral of St. John Lateran.
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At the complex know as theChurch of the Holy Staircase.
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These 28 marble steps,
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now covered in wood,
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are the steps that led upto Pontius Pilate's house.
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They were brought to Romein the forth century
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and they can only be climbedon your knees.
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Marian Luther climbed these steps on his knees
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and heard a revelation,
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a voice saying,
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"The just shall live by faith."
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Through this door, Father Amorth entered a small private chapel
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where he conducted his exorcisms
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until the noise drove awaythe faithful.
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In April of 2016,
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I came to Rome to interviewFather Amorth
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for a magazine.
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00:10:37,094 --> 00:10:38,846
At the end of our conversation,
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I asked him if he might
ever allow me
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to witness and film
an exorcism.
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Permission to do this had never
been granted by the Vatican.
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He took a moment
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and then he said,
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"Let me think about it."
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A few days later,
I heard back from him.
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He would allow me to film
Christina's ninth exorcism
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on May 1st,
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but, with no crew, no lights,
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only a small video camera,
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alone.
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I had no idea
what to expect.
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But before witnessingChristina's exorcism,
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I met a woman who had been successfully exorcised
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by Father Amorth.
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This is her story.
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00:11:31,357 --> 00:11:33,692
[speaking Italian]
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I first met Father Amorth
ten years ago, when my sister
need his help.
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00:11:42,451 --> 00:11:45,621
She was suffering
a spiritual disease.
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He asked to see her
medical records.
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He wanted to be sure it was
a spiritual problem,
not a psychological one.
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00:12:04,557 --> 00:12:11,355
I first realized there was
something wrong when I went with
a friend to a sanctuary.
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When they began to celebrate
the Mass,
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I started having unusual
symptoms.
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I cried, my body shook...
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00:12:32,960 --> 00:12:38,007
and I fell into a trance.
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She called and asked me to come
to her home as soon as possible.
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She was out of control.
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00:12:46,098 --> 00:12:51,103
I started screaming like crazy.
Someone called the police.
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00:12:51,520 --> 00:12:53,939
The police came but they
wouldn't come in.
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00:12:54,440 --> 00:12:59,737
They were terrified to hear
me scream.
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00:13:00,279 --> 00:13:02,656
She showed extraordinary
strength.
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00:13:03,365 --> 00:13:07,745
And her body began to transform
into something that was not
human.
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00:13:08,204 --> 00:13:14,585
Paolo told me I was slithering
on the floor...
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00:13:15,419 --> 00:13:20,966
speaking a strange language.
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00:13:23,344 --> 00:13:29,558
The fact that I was crawling on
the floor must have been
shocking.
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00:13:30,726 --> 00:13:35,231
She looked like a wild animal.
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00:13:35,814 --> 00:13:42,196
And her belly was swollen
like a balloon about to burst.
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00:13:43,697 --> 00:13:50,704
And her strength was not
possible for a woman of
her size and age.
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00:13:53,249 --> 00:13:58,754
After many episodes, my brother
took me to Father Amorth.
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00:13:59,255 --> 00:14:05,219
When she first met
Father Amorth, she went into
an extreme panic state.
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00:14:06,554 --> 00:14:13,519
He told me to take her to a room
where his assistants were
waiting.
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00:14:15,104 --> 00:14:18,774
That's where the first
exorcism took place.
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00:14:19,191 --> 00:14:25,906
Father Amorth was funny
and ironic.
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00:14:27,032 --> 00:14:33,080
He didn't frighten me.
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00:14:33,873 --> 00:14:40,045
He helped me understand what
was happening to me.
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00:14:41,714 --> 00:14:43,841
It took almost eight months.
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00:14:45,175 --> 00:14:51,891
The first exorcisms were
the most violent.
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00:14:51,974 --> 00:14:58,063
She had incredible strength.
It took four of us to hold
her down.
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00:14:59,565 --> 00:15:06,488
During the second exorcism,
Father Amorth had to tie her
to a bed.
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00:15:10,951 --> 00:15:17,750
During the last two exorcisms,
the intensity of her strength
was decreasing.
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00:15:21,879 --> 00:15:26,258
After her fourth exorcism,
Father Amorth told her
it was over.
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00:15:26,425 --> 00:15:28,427
She was liberated.
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00:15:29,386 --> 00:15:36,018
The moment he told me
I was liberated...
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00:15:39,104 --> 00:15:45,945
I felt relieved of an enormous
weight inside me.
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00:15:49,657 --> 00:15:56,538
After she was liberated, he
wanted to make sure I was okay.
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00:15:57,164 --> 00:16:02,962
Because sometimes the evil
spirit passes from one person
to another.
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00:16:03,837 --> 00:16:08,300
So he exorcised me.
It took him fifteen minutes,
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00:16:08,384 --> 00:16:12,513
and at the end, he told one
of his famous jokes:
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00:16:12,846 --> 00:16:16,642
"Compared to what I usually
deal with, you're bursting
with health."
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00:16:17,810 --> 00:16:20,604
Paolo stayed
in contact with Father Amorth
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00:16:20,938 --> 00:16:23,691
and began to assist himwith other exorcisms.
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00:16:24,483 --> 00:16:28,320
It was Paolo who recognizedChristina's symptoms
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00:16:28,404 --> 00:16:29,863
in this church.
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00:16:34,410 --> 00:16:38,205
We heard screamsin the church
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00:16:38,539 --> 00:16:43,085
during the celebrationof the Eucharist,
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00:16:45,129 --> 00:16:49,883
which possessed peoplecannot tolerate.
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00:16:52,261 --> 00:16:57,891
She was in incredible pain
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00:16:57,975 --> 00:17:02,479
writhing on the floor.
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00:17:03,522 --> 00:17:07,317
Father Amorth asked me to meet
her and bring her to him.
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00:17:09,528 --> 00:17:12,990
Having moved from the
Church of the Holy Staircase,
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00:17:13,323 --> 00:17:16,702
Father Amorth continued his work at his residence.
247
00:17:17,119 --> 00:17:19,121
The home of the Polene priests.
248
00:17:19,788 --> 00:17:22,875
Where on May 1st, 2016,
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00:17:23,333 --> 00:17:28,839
he invited me to witnessChristna's ninth exorcism.
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00:17:31,884 --> 00:17:35,012
Christina, why are you here
to see Father Amorth?
251
00:17:37,222 --> 00:17:42,686
I wanted to be free of the evil
spirit and I was looking
for help.
252
00:17:43,187 --> 00:17:47,733
I was treated by another priest,
but Father Amorth is the best
in hi field.
253
00:17:48,442 --> 00:17:50,611
Do you believe
that you're possessed?
254
00:17:52,446 --> 00:17:56,867
Not at first, but then things
happened that made me
believe it.
255
00:17:59,244 --> 00:18:06,085
I kept putting it off until
I came to a point of no return.
256
00:18:07,544 --> 00:18:12,591
Then God brought me
to Father Amorth.
257
00:18:13,258 --> 00:18:17,262
Did you ever try to seek
doctors or psychiatrists?
258
00:18:19,515 --> 00:18:23,268
The psychiatrists couldn't help
me, I had a spiritual disease.
259
00:18:23,352 --> 00:18:29,066
Demonic possession can hide
behind other diseases.
260
00:18:29,650 --> 00:18:36,406
I would have attacks, often on
dates related to Jesus...
261
00:18:37,032 --> 00:18:43,914
A life of pain and suffering.
262
00:18:48,252 --> 00:18:52,047
Cristina is possessed bythe devil.
263
00:18:58,679 --> 00:19:02,057
The devil's power
is supernatural.
264
00:19:03,308 --> 00:19:08,856
He speaks and acts through her.
265
00:19:09,690 --> 00:19:13,819
Possessed people have
incredible knowledge.
266
00:19:14,653 --> 00:19:21,034
They speak languages
they wouldn't know.
267
00:19:26,498 --> 00:19:27,958
How can you be sure
268
00:19:28,667 --> 00:19:30,919
that Christina is possessed?
269
00:19:31,420 --> 00:19:38,343
I can only be sure when I
perform an exorcism
270
00:19:43,307 --> 00:19:50,230
and provoke reactions that are
unique to a possessed person.
271
00:20:47,871 --> 00:20:50,415
Father Amorth
begins every exorcism
272
00:20:50,916 --> 00:20:53,460
by thumbing his noseat the devil.
273
00:20:58,715 --> 00:21:01,218
In the room are Christina's family,
274
00:21:01,718 --> 00:21:05,055
and other prieststo assist Father Amorth.
275
00:21:26,535 --> 00:21:29,663
Pray for us Saint Joseph...
276
00:21:29,746 --> 00:21:31,498
Padre Pio...
277
00:21:32,624 --> 00:21:34,543
Padre Candido...
278
00:21:34,626 --> 00:21:37,546
the Blessed Alberione...
279
00:21:41,133 --> 00:21:46,555
In the name of Jesus
and the Virgin Mary...
280
00:21:53,186 --> 00:21:59,026
Give us the power to fight
against the Devil.
281
00:22:19,671 --> 00:22:26,636
Leave her! In the name of
the Father, the Son and the
Holy Spirit.
282
00:22:43,945 --> 00:22:48,366
Stop it! No! No!
283
00:22:51,620 --> 00:22:55,624
Hold her tight here, please.
284
00:22:55,749 --> 00:22:57,542
Stay away from her!
285
00:23:00,670 --> 00:23:05,342
Stop holding her.
286
00:23:19,940 --> 00:23:25,028
God, vanquish this
ancient enemy.
287
00:23:35,372 --> 00:23:42,212
Lord, repel the Devil's power.
288
00:23:56,351 --> 00:24:03,358
With this holy oil, I anoint
your body and soul.
289
00:24:39,269 --> 00:24:44,524
Holy Virgin... Archangels...
Saints... Heal Cristina.
290
00:24:46,860 --> 00:24:53,783
May she receive God's grace
and be free from the evil one.
291
00:25:07,923 --> 00:25:14,221
Free her from witchcraft,
black magic and Satanic Masses.
292
00:25:41,289 --> 00:25:47,045
Break every tie with Satan
and his followers.
293
00:26:07,691 --> 00:26:13,196
Free her from sin, envy,
jealousy, treachery and disease.
294
00:26:18,034 --> 00:26:22,122
Never! Don't touch her!
295
00:26:32,465 --> 00:26:35,176
She belongs to us!
296
00:26:40,682 --> 00:26:45,812
Send the priest away!
I can't stand it!
297
00:27:08,752 --> 00:27:13,131
Cristina, return to the church
where you belong.
298
00:27:15,258 --> 00:27:17,635
She belongs to me!
299
00:27:30,398 --> 00:27:32,108
Surrender!
300
00:27:46,831 --> 00:27:48,166
Stop!
301
00:28:05,433 --> 00:28:10,063
I am Satan! Stop this!
302
00:28:34,838 --> 00:28:39,801
The devil is guilty
in the eyes of God.
303
00:29:31,644 --> 00:29:37,901
Surrender to the Word of God.
304
00:29:37,984 --> 00:29:43,448
Surrender to the Virgin Mary.
305
00:29:45,116 --> 00:29:49,662
Surrender to Jesus.
306
00:29:57,337 --> 00:30:01,716
-Get out now
-Never!
307
00:31:13,872 --> 00:31:19,127
When did you possess her?
308
00:31:21,254 --> 00:31:23,631
Answer me!
309
00:31:23,715 --> 00:31:26,092
When did you possess her?
310
00:31:34,183 --> 00:31:38,855
Evil spirit,
you are damned forever.
311
00:32:26,736 --> 00:32:28,696
It's you who are damned!
312
00:33:15,243 --> 00:33:18,788
I command you to leave her!
313
00:33:18,913 --> 00:33:21,499
I am Satan!
314
00:33:41,936 --> 00:33:44,731
Tell me your name.
315
00:33:44,814 --> 00:33:46,649
Satan!
316
00:33:46,774 --> 00:33:48,693
How many are you?
317
00:33:48,776 --> 00:33:51,904
We are legion!
318
00:34:05,501 --> 00:34:08,629
In the name of God,
when are you going to leave?
319
00:34:08,713 --> 00:34:10,757
Never!
320
00:34:18,473 --> 00:34:22,560
Leave this daughter of God!
321
00:34:34,781 --> 00:34:38,868
God condemns you, evil spirit!
322
00:34:40,411 --> 00:34:45,625
She is mine!
She belongs to me!
323
00:35:02,558 --> 00:35:07,438
We are armies! Armies!
324
00:35:16,656 --> 00:35:23,412
The Virgin Mary will destroy
you, Satan!
325
00:35:52,233 --> 00:35:56,612
Set her free!
326
00:36:39,822 --> 00:36:46,078
In the name of the Father,
the Son and the Holy Spirit,
enough!
327
00:36:48,206 --> 00:36:52,835
Do you need something
to drink?
328
00:37:00,176 --> 00:37:02,470
How do you feel?
Are you still alive?
329
00:37:15,024 --> 00:37:17,068
Let us all thank God.
330
00:37:28,037 --> 00:37:30,790
Neil, what do you make
of what you've just seen?
331
00:37:31,082 --> 00:37:32,583
Absolutely amazing.
332
00:37:33,125 --> 00:37:36,420
So, there is a...
333
00:37:38,714 --> 00:37:41,884
major force at work
within her somehow.
334
00:37:42,468 --> 00:37:45,096
I don't know the underlying
origin of it
335
00:37:45,721 --> 00:37:47,265
but there's an amazing force.
336
00:37:47,348 --> 00:37:52,812
It's interesting to see
that she is not
337
00:37:53,980 --> 00:37:59,151
separated from the environment,
she's not in a catatonic state.
338
00:37:59,944 --> 00:38:01,570
She's responding to the priest.
339
00:38:01,946 --> 00:38:03,781
It didn't appear
to be hallucinations.
340
00:38:04,407 --> 00:38:08,160
She appeared to be engaged
in the process but resisting.
341
00:38:08,828 --> 00:38:12,957
Yeah, it really looks
something authentic and real.
342
00:38:13,291 --> 00:38:17,378
People who have very severe pain
343
00:38:17,712 --> 00:38:19,714
sin syndromes, total body pain,
344
00:38:20,006 --> 00:38:22,508
for some reason. It can be
even cancer, it could be other.
345
00:38:22,967 --> 00:38:27,013
There is a treatment for it,
it says, "intervenes in the
singulum",
346
00:38:27,763 --> 00:38:29,932
they have still the pain
347
00:38:30,141 --> 00:38:31,475
but they don't care about it.
348
00:38:32,143 --> 00:38:35,521
So they can tolerate it.
It's the emotional aspect
of pain.
349
00:38:35,896 --> 00:38:40,067
It is probably what she's
describing when she tells you,
total body pain.
350
00:38:40,192 --> 00:38:43,779
It may not be really
physical pain that she feels
but she experiences
351
00:38:44,238 --> 00:38:45,323
as physical pain.
352
00:38:45,531 --> 00:38:49,035
Always she is, all the time,
these paroxysms of aggression.
353
00:38:49,744 --> 00:38:52,371
I don't understand again
what she was saying exactly,
354
00:38:52,455 --> 00:38:55,833
it's not necessarily directed
toward the priest or is it,
I'm not sure
355
00:38:56,292 --> 00:38:59,670
but she is like
a caged animal in a sense.
356
00:39:00,338 --> 00:39:03,924
Is this some kind
of brain disorder?
357
00:39:04,216 --> 00:39:07,386
It looks like the state
that we call
358
00:39:09,764 --> 00:39:10,973
delirium.
359
00:39:11,057 --> 00:39:14,518
Which is an agitated
disconnection from
360
00:39:15,311 --> 00:39:17,521
normal behavior and
from the environment.
361
00:39:18,814 --> 00:39:23,986
Illogical, often very
powerful and energetic.
362
00:39:24,445 --> 00:39:26,781
Often requires restraint.
363
00:39:27,073 --> 00:39:29,325
But delirium, you may see
the struggling,
364
00:39:29,867 --> 00:39:33,746
you may see some shouting
and yelling but this powerful
365
00:39:34,246 --> 00:39:36,540
guttural voice, that does seem,
366
00:39:37,249 --> 00:39:39,293
that seems like it's coming
from somewhere else.
367
00:39:41,087 --> 00:39:43,839
When you tell Cristina what she
did while she was possessed,
368
00:39:43,964 --> 00:39:48,886
she says, "That wasn't me."
369
00:39:52,306 --> 00:39:53,474
She doesn't even remember it.
370
00:39:58,354 --> 00:40:05,319
The devil's assaults are not
constant. Sometimes they can
be brief.
371
00:40:10,324 --> 00:40:17,039
And not recur for weeks
or months.
372
00:40:20,376 --> 00:40:27,174
At other times, there can be
assaults on a daily basis.
373
00:40:27,258 --> 00:40:33,305
And when these happen,
the person goes into a trance.
374
00:40:33,764 --> 00:40:39,437
During the rest of her day,
she lives and acts normally.
375
00:40:39,520 --> 00:40:46,360
But she has constant
physical or mental suffering.
376
00:40:49,989 --> 00:40:56,829
Because she's still
in a frail state.
377
00:41:03,627 --> 00:41:10,593
Even when assaults are absent,
her nervous system remembers
everything.
378
00:41:13,137 --> 00:41:16,223
and therefore she continues
to suffer.
379
00:41:19,768 --> 00:41:21,562
The day of the exorcism,
380
00:41:21,812 --> 00:41:25,441
happened to be Father Amorth's91st birthday.
381
00:41:28,319 --> 00:41:30,863
He was happy, and so was I,
382
00:41:31,280 --> 00:41:34,533
because it looked likeChristina was cured.
383
00:41:36,702 --> 00:41:40,289
Ladies and gentlemen, thank you.
God bless you. I bless you.
384
00:41:40,748 --> 00:41:44,710
Now you can go
bless yourselves.
385
00:41:45,211 --> 00:41:48,422
Do you think she could have
been better helped by
brain surgery,
386
00:41:48,547 --> 00:41:50,382
than this religious ritual?
387
00:41:50,591 --> 00:41:51,842
I would say, unlikely.
388
00:41:52,343 --> 00:41:55,554
-How man surgeries have you
performed? Brain surgeries?
-Well,
389
00:41:56,430 --> 00:41:58,098
More than 5,000
390
00:41:58,349 --> 00:41:59,517
over the years.
391
00:42:00,893 --> 00:42:03,854
Brain tumors,
traumatic brain injury,
392
00:42:04,647 --> 00:42:06,690
ruptured brain aneurysms,
393
00:42:07,816 --> 00:42:09,985
infections affecting the brain
394
00:42:10,945 --> 00:42:13,322
and I haven't seen
395
00:42:13,822 --> 00:42:14,865
this kind of...
396
00:42:15,449 --> 00:42:19,161
this kind of consequence
from any of those disorders.
397
00:42:19,620 --> 00:42:24,542
Are you prepared to say that
there's such a thing as
exorcism and
398
00:42:24,833 --> 00:42:26,252
demonic possession?
399
00:42:27,253 --> 00:42:29,755
Here's the point.
You have to believe it
400
00:42:30,089 --> 00:42:32,174
in order to go through it.
401
00:42:32,758 --> 00:42:34,677
If someone does not believe
402
00:42:35,427 --> 00:42:36,679
that they are possessed,
403
00:42:37,304 --> 00:42:39,139
-they will not do this...
-Yeah, yeah, but...
404
00:42:39,223 --> 00:42:43,310
...but they will have an MRI,
they will see a psychiatrist,
they will
405
00:42:43,727 --> 00:42:46,772
possibly, I don't know,
an operation...
406
00:42:46,855 --> 00:42:50,150
But people are very much
context dependent.
407
00:42:50,234 --> 00:42:56,073
I mean, you probably will not
have this in somebody who has
no religious background.
408
00:42:56,156 --> 00:42:59,326
-Right.
-Meaning that the religion
that they absorb,
409
00:42:59,994 --> 00:43:01,620
the things they absorb,
410
00:43:01,954 --> 00:43:04,540
they obviously change
their brain.
411
00:43:04,957 --> 00:43:07,376
You're asking me if I believe
in exorcism,
412
00:43:07,459 --> 00:43:10,337
I only look at it as
a behavioral phenomenon.
413
00:43:10,671 --> 00:43:15,593
If I were a Catholic priest
okay, or a Jewish Rabbi,
414
00:43:15,718 --> 00:43:17,261
I may have
a different explanation.
415
00:43:17,761 --> 00:43:20,014
Can I categorize it?
Maybe.
416
00:43:20,431 --> 00:43:21,724
Can I know how to treat it?
417
00:43:21,807 --> 00:43:22,683
No.
418
00:43:22,891 --> 00:43:24,935
So, something is happening
to her, it's clear.
419
00:43:25,519 --> 00:43:27,563
But maybe she puts into it
420
00:43:27,730 --> 00:43:30,107
the religious context
in which she grew up.
421
00:43:30,482 --> 00:43:33,402
'Cause they believe obviously
they know what's wrong with her.
422
00:43:33,527 --> 00:43:35,154
She's possessed by the devil.
423
00:43:35,446 --> 00:43:37,489
Are you religious at all,
yourself?
424
00:43:37,573 --> 00:43:39,491
Oh, come on, you're gonna ask me
this type of question?
425
00:43:39,700 --> 00:43:42,578
I thought this was about this,
not about me.
426
00:43:42,661 --> 00:43:45,539
no, but what is your thought
about god, for example.
427
00:43:45,789 --> 00:43:50,002
I do believe that there is
a limit to human understanding.
428
00:43:50,711 --> 00:43:53,922
And there's really a limit
behind this limit,
429
00:43:54,548 --> 00:43:57,593
I'm willing to place an entity
called god.
430
00:44:00,137 --> 00:44:04,975
Dr. Fried shared
with me this three-dimensional,color coded image
431
00:44:05,059 --> 00:44:06,352
of the human brain.
432
00:44:07,436 --> 00:44:09,897
The red section controls movement.
433
00:44:10,314 --> 00:44:12,733
The green controls vision.
434
00:44:13,609 --> 00:44:17,821
The light blue and dark bluesections control language.
435
00:44:19,198 --> 00:44:23,827
That yellow sectionis a tumor in the left temporal lobe.
436
00:44:25,371 --> 00:44:27,373
This tumor can cause seizures
437
00:44:27,456 --> 00:44:31,835
that result in hallucinationsand language problems.
438
00:44:33,253 --> 00:44:37,508
Is it possible that thiscould be the cause of whatwe call,
439
00:44:37,966 --> 00:44:39,468
demonic possession?
440
00:44:40,594 --> 00:44:42,971
I've never seen anything
like that before.
441
00:44:43,263 --> 00:44:46,016
But I've only practiced
neurology for 35 years.
442
00:44:47,267 --> 00:44:52,189
I believe that these are
behaviors that are generated
in her brain.
443
00:44:52,439 --> 00:44:53,941
How it's done and what it is...
444
00:44:54,858 --> 00:44:56,026
can't say.
445
00:44:56,235 --> 00:44:59,696
In patients who have seizures
that emanate from
the temporal lobe,
446
00:45:00,447 --> 00:45:04,284
one of their manifestations
in between the seizures is that
they can become
447
00:45:04,618 --> 00:45:05,994
hyper religious.
448
00:45:06,537 --> 00:45:09,748
Uncertain what the cause
and effect is here but that's a,
449
00:45:10,207 --> 00:45:15,587
that is a coincidental linkage
between those two phenomena.
450
00:45:16,213 --> 00:45:19,675
You don't think that you could
451
00:45:20,592 --> 00:45:24,138
take this woman into the normal
452
00:45:25,681 --> 00:45:28,016
procedures in neurology
453
00:45:28,475 --> 00:45:31,186
and cure this affliction?
454
00:45:32,062 --> 00:45:34,565
Only if this proved to be
some kind of a seizure,
455
00:45:34,815 --> 00:45:36,525
which I don't think
it really is.
456
00:45:36,608 --> 00:45:39,862
Do you have any belief
in exorcism
457
00:45:40,487 --> 00:45:42,823
as a possible treatment?
458
00:45:43,407 --> 00:45:45,451
I have an open mind
about these things
459
00:45:45,534 --> 00:45:48,537
because I have seen plenty
of things that have occured
460
00:45:48,620 --> 00:45:53,250
during my career and my lifetime
that were not explainable at the
beginning and have
461
00:45:53,542 --> 00:45:55,210
rational basis now.
462
00:45:55,752 --> 00:45:59,006
There are plenty of things
that we don't understand
that are real.
463
00:45:59,131 --> 00:46:01,175
For example, radio activity.
464
00:46:01,383 --> 00:46:04,511
Right, we can't see it,
we don't know what it is.
465
00:46:05,137 --> 00:46:08,140
Once it was revealed
that this exists
466
00:46:08,223 --> 00:46:10,976
and the good and the harm
that it can do,
467
00:46:11,393 --> 00:46:13,061
that was a whole other
field of science.
468
00:46:13,479 --> 00:46:18,108
Are you open to the possibility
that an exorcism could relieve
this?
469
00:46:18,484 --> 00:46:22,863
Well, let's make it analogous
to a person who believes in
psychiatry.
470
00:46:23,989 --> 00:46:25,657
Works with a psychiatrist.
471
00:46:26,783 --> 00:46:29,661
Takes the advice,
suggestions, input,
472
00:46:30,037 --> 00:46:32,331
no medications, nothing else,
it's just
473
00:46:32,456 --> 00:46:35,417
two individuals working on
474
00:46:35,959 --> 00:46:37,586
a problem that one of them has.
475
00:46:38,045 --> 00:46:43,675
If the patient is open and
willing to participate,
476
00:46:43,926 --> 00:46:48,013
I think the benefit
can be realized by that person.
477
00:46:48,263 --> 00:46:49,389
Through exorcism?
478
00:46:49,890 --> 00:46:51,934
Through that process
of interaction.
479
00:46:52,309 --> 00:46:55,312
If we don't understand it,
it doesn't mean
it doesn't exist.
480
00:47:16,333 --> 00:47:19,836
Given our scientific
and medical backgrounds,
481
00:47:19,962 --> 00:47:23,715
do we count it as
the possibility
482
00:47:24,341 --> 00:47:27,761
of there being something that's
483
00:47:28,136 --> 00:47:30,931
spiritual or supernatural
in nature.
484
00:47:31,348 --> 00:47:33,308
It takes the form
of disturbed behavior.
485
00:47:33,392 --> 00:47:36,603
When someone says your supposed
to do something, the right thing
to take care of yourself,
486
00:47:36,687 --> 00:47:37,896
so she's doing
487
00:47:37,980 --> 00:47:40,607
the right thing by her family
and everyone else
488
00:47:40,691 --> 00:47:42,526
to try to get herself better.
489
00:47:42,609 --> 00:47:44,027
...hurting her,
it could be helping her.
490
00:47:44,111 --> 00:47:46,989
Would it better for her
to see a psychiatrist in Rome?
491
00:47:47,823 --> 00:47:50,826
The question is,
what kind of psycho-therapy
492
00:47:50,909 --> 00:47:52,619
or intervention does she need.
493
00:47:52,703 --> 00:47:56,665
And they have a certain idea
that the way you deal with this
494
00:47:56,748 --> 00:47:59,459
is by getting rid of that
completely negative
495
00:47:59,793 --> 00:48:01,587
side of her experience.
496
00:48:02,421 --> 00:48:04,172
Perhaps in the case
of some people,
497
00:48:04,339 --> 00:48:07,426
getting rid of it completely
in this ritualistic way
is quite good.
498
00:48:07,509 --> 00:48:10,053
Well, what do you think this is?
Unconscious fraud?
499
00:48:10,220 --> 00:48:13,140
No. No. No...
500
00:48:13,765 --> 00:48:18,145
So... Okay, this is called
the dissociative reaction or
501
00:48:18,562 --> 00:48:20,272
-culturally...
-Dissociative Trance Disorder.
502
00:48:20,522 --> 00:48:24,776
-Dissociative Trance Disorder.
-DSF and trance in possession
disorder in ICD.
503
00:48:25,193 --> 00:48:26,987
So, it's a recognized...
504
00:48:27,070 --> 00:48:29,406
It's a recognized diagnosis
worldwide.
505
00:48:29,865 --> 00:48:31,658
It has some cultural variation
506
00:48:31,742 --> 00:48:33,493
but it's basically
the same thing.
507
00:48:33,577 --> 00:48:36,872
She is doing something
and everybody is participating
508
00:48:36,955 --> 00:48:39,374
in a ritual
that they all agree is
509
00:48:39,666 --> 00:48:41,293
the right way
to look at the world.
510
00:48:41,376 --> 00:48:45,297
Part of what may work
particularly well
for some people in that setting
511
00:48:45,380 --> 00:48:47,007
is that everybody in the room,
512
00:48:47,174 --> 00:48:50,177
they actually believe this is the frameworkof reality.
513
00:48:50,427 --> 00:48:53,472
This is what is it and we must do this.
514
00:48:53,555 --> 00:48:54,389
The Placebo Response.
515
00:48:54,473 --> 00:48:58,060
The gaining of the idea that
if you believe something to
be likely to work,
516
00:48:58,143 --> 00:48:59,311
the more likely to work.
517
00:48:59,519 --> 00:49:01,313
I have a issue right now
on my unit,
518
00:49:01,563 --> 00:49:03,190
who's similar to this
in some ways.
519
00:49:03,273 --> 00:49:06,777
She says she's possessed
by the devil. She speaks
in a bizarre voice,
520
00:49:07,069 --> 00:49:08,820
she hasn't attacked anyone but
521
00:49:08,987 --> 00:49:10,739
she comes from
a religious background.
522
00:49:10,864 --> 00:49:12,366
It's Protestant,
rather than Catholic.
523
00:49:12,616 --> 00:49:15,744
But it might be more the
Charismatic Pentecostal
Protestantism.
524
00:49:15,827 --> 00:49:18,580
So it would be fit,
she has a history of trauma,
525
00:49:18,955 --> 00:49:21,416
and I can say what we're doing
for her on the unit, is
526
00:49:21,500 --> 00:49:23,752
we're treating it
with medication. We're
527
00:49:24,002 --> 00:49:26,421
giving her psycho-therapy,
creating a safe environment.
528
00:49:27,005 --> 00:49:29,216
We're seen her before,
this runs its course
529
00:49:29,466 --> 00:49:30,550
and she gets better.
530
00:49:30,634 --> 00:49:34,179
And we don't take a position
on during the treatment on,
531
00:49:34,262 --> 00:49:35,847
is this really Satan
bothering you,
532
00:49:35,972 --> 00:49:38,809
or is this you really being
tormented by your illness.
533
00:49:38,934 --> 00:49:41,978
The person is expressing
a pathology
534
00:49:42,062 --> 00:49:43,939
that is understood
as possession.
535
00:49:44,022 --> 00:49:45,732
She understands it
as possession.
536
00:49:45,816 --> 00:49:47,109
She group
understands possession.
537
00:49:47,401 --> 00:49:51,154
Our field of psychiatry
can understand it
a possession
538
00:49:51,238 --> 00:49:54,241
just on the virtue
of what she is presenting.
539
00:49:54,408 --> 00:49:55,492
The phenomenon,
540
00:49:55,742 --> 00:49:57,869
without having to take
any kind of stance
541
00:49:58,286 --> 00:50:00,414
on whether there actually are
542
00:50:00,497 --> 00:50:02,040
demons, spirits, because
543
00:50:02,666 --> 00:50:04,793
this kind of possession
is attributed to
544
00:50:05,711 --> 00:50:09,673
Arabic spirits,
Jewish dead people
545
00:50:10,090 --> 00:50:11,341
Christian dead people,
546
00:50:11,800 --> 00:50:13,301
forces, animals...
547
00:50:13,385 --> 00:50:16,054
all over the world,there are many differentkinds of possessions.
548
00:50:16,138 --> 00:50:18,807
She just has a certain belief
in the origin of the possession.
549
00:50:19,474 --> 00:50:20,976
It was a revelation to me,
550
00:50:21,476 --> 00:50:23,562
that the psychiatric diagnosis
551
00:50:23,854 --> 00:50:25,355
of Christina's condition
552
00:50:25,731 --> 00:50:26,898
is recognized
553
00:50:27,232 --> 00:50:29,901
around the world
as demonic possession.
554
00:50:30,736 --> 00:50:34,614
I've never met anyone that
I would say, "Oh that person
needs to be exorcised."
555
00:50:34,698 --> 00:50:36,700
I think that phenomenon exists.
556
00:50:36,783 --> 00:50:39,161
I think it's extremely rare
but I think it exists.
557
00:50:39,327 --> 00:50:42,497
And I'll say this,
speaking of auxiliary Bishop
of this region...
558
00:50:43,206 --> 00:50:44,916
I get people writing to me,
559
00:50:45,000 --> 00:50:48,962
concerned about a loved one,
concerned about a son
or a daughter.
560
00:50:49,296 --> 00:50:50,630
Somebody concerned
about himself.
561
00:50:50,797 --> 00:50:52,591
I got these strange things
going on,
562
00:50:52,841 --> 00:50:53,675
what should I do?
563
00:50:53,759 --> 00:50:56,344
So, I get those letters
in this very place.
564
00:50:56,803 --> 00:50:58,805
So, I acknowledge
the reality of it.
565
00:50:59,222 --> 00:51:02,976
Would you have any misgivings
about
566
00:51:03,518 --> 00:51:08,523
recommending a person in
extreme spiritual disease
to an exorcist?
567
00:51:08,732 --> 00:51:10,859
Or would you recommend
they see a psychiatrist?
568
00:51:11,443 --> 00:51:13,904
I think in our case today,
we would want to eliminate
569
00:51:14,154 --> 00:51:16,573
the physiological,
the psychological and in fact
570
00:51:16,656 --> 00:51:20,786
what happens in a church,
we have teams of people that
will look in a particular case
571
00:51:21,161 --> 00:51:23,455
and that team will involve
usually a physician,
572
00:51:23,705 --> 00:51:27,375
usually a psychologist,
psychiatrist, etc.
and a priest.
573
00:51:28,710 --> 00:51:33,089
But, the natural has to be
eliminated before we get
to the supernatural.
574
00:51:33,256 --> 00:51:36,134
If I started crawling
up the walls...
575
00:51:36,218 --> 00:51:40,305
-Yeah. Yeah.
-And, or, moving around on the
ground like a snake...
576
00:51:41,598 --> 00:51:43,350
-What would you do?
-I'd call the police.
577
00:51:45,268 --> 00:51:48,230
If I tell you that someone
has within them...
578
00:51:48,939 --> 00:51:50,941
they are possessed by a demon,
579
00:51:51,358 --> 00:51:53,485
what goes through your mind?
580
00:51:53,693 --> 00:51:55,779
I think what goes through
my mind is that there are
581
00:51:55,862 --> 00:51:58,698
more things in heaven and earth
that are dreamed of
in your philosophy.
582
00:51:58,865 --> 00:52:01,117
This is a strange world
that we live in
583
00:52:01,201 --> 00:52:05,997
and to a degree we can know it
and control it and we can
analyze it,
584
00:52:06,248 --> 00:52:09,042
but there's a dimension
to this world that is strange.
585
00:52:09,292 --> 00:52:11,127
And beyond our capacity
to control.
586
00:52:11,378 --> 00:52:12,963
This person's possessed
by a demon.
587
00:52:13,296 --> 00:52:15,715
Does that make sense in
scientific terminology?
588
00:52:16,049 --> 00:52:17,133
Probably not.
589
00:52:17,926 --> 00:52:20,887
But having walked through
the scientific, all the way,
590
00:52:21,221 --> 00:52:23,181
do I come to a limit
where I say,
591
00:52:23,723 --> 00:52:26,852
maybe there's something beyond
what I can manage here.
592
00:52:27,394 --> 00:52:31,606
And I should be open to that
if it manifests itself.
593
00:52:32,148 --> 00:52:34,526
Can you accept
the idea
594
00:52:35,026 --> 00:52:38,196
of demonic possession
of a...
595
00:52:38,947 --> 00:52:41,533
a demon, a devil, Satan
596
00:52:41,616 --> 00:52:45,495
taking over the soul
of another human being.
597
00:52:46,079 --> 00:52:48,290
That's not the devils
taking over your soul,
598
00:52:48,373 --> 00:52:50,083
that's the devil,
or whatever you wanna call it...
599
00:52:51,543 --> 00:52:52,627
seizing your body.
600
00:52:52,711 --> 00:52:54,588
The way they take over
the soul
601
00:52:54,754 --> 00:52:56,882
is by tempting you to sin.
602
00:52:57,173 --> 00:52:59,968
That's how they get you
'cause you're using your
freewill to do evil.
603
00:53:00,886 --> 00:53:04,180
What is the conslusion
you came to
604
00:53:04,431 --> 00:53:08,685
finally when you completed
your last book.
605
00:53:08,768 --> 00:53:12,772
How do you have the universe
that we've got with so much
evil in it?
606
00:53:13,648 --> 00:53:17,193
When you got a good god
and a magnificent god,
607
00:53:17,319 --> 00:53:19,070
then how does this evil occur?
608
00:53:19,279 --> 00:53:22,365
I believe that a trans-human...
609
00:53:24,159 --> 00:53:25,869
power of evil exits.
610
00:53:27,078 --> 00:53:31,541
Do you believe that there is
inherent evil
611
00:53:32,125 --> 00:53:34,169
in all of us, let's say.
612
00:53:34,502 --> 00:53:36,713
Evil is like a shadow,
it's like a parasite.
613
00:53:37,088 --> 00:53:39,049
So, it is never inherent evil.
614
00:53:39,424 --> 00:53:41,927
The devil is good
615
00:53:42,302 --> 00:53:46,014
that's to say in his being,
in his intelligence,
in his will,
616
00:53:46,348 --> 00:53:47,474
in his...
617
00:53:49,184 --> 00:53:52,103
ontological integrity,
the devil is good.
618
00:53:52,479 --> 00:53:54,356
But the goodness
is become warped.
619
00:53:54,814 --> 00:53:57,692
If a person does not believe
620
00:53:59,361 --> 00:54:02,072
and yet they manifest
these symptoms,
621
00:54:02,447 --> 00:54:04,574
can they be exorcised?
622
00:54:04,658 --> 00:54:08,578
Well, I wouldn't say
in the full sense of the term,
doing a full exorcism.
623
00:54:08,745 --> 00:54:11,748
Someone is really possessed
by a dark power,
624
00:54:12,082 --> 00:54:13,500
their own personality
has been kind of,
625
00:54:14,000 --> 00:54:15,877
put on hold with
sermon suspense.
626
00:54:16,336 --> 00:54:19,089
And what's being addressed
is the demon within them.
627
00:54:19,589 --> 00:54:21,216
Speaking to the devil,
I mean, heck,
628
00:54:21,424 --> 00:54:23,259
people like Father Amorth,
maybe can do that.
629
00:54:23,343 --> 00:54:25,303
I would never dare to do it.
630
00:54:25,387 --> 00:54:27,180
I'm not there spiritually.
631
00:54:27,263 --> 00:54:29,057
I think that's
a very dangerous thing.
632
00:54:30,517 --> 00:54:31,434
What did you say?
633
00:54:31,518 --> 00:54:33,186
-I wouldn't do it.
-Wouldn't do what?
634
00:54:33,478 --> 00:54:34,813
Speak to the devil.
635
00:54:34,896 --> 00:54:36,898
-I mean, if I--
-As in, an exorcism?
636
00:54:37,065 --> 00:54:39,901
I don't think I'd be
any good at it.
I wouldn't wanna do it.
637
00:54:39,985 --> 00:54:40,944
-And...
-Why not?
638
00:54:41,611 --> 00:54:42,862
I think it's dangerous ground.
639
00:54:42,946 --> 00:54:44,364
You gotta be really really holy.
640
00:54:44,572 --> 00:54:45,824
It's in the scriptures.
641
00:54:45,949 --> 00:54:48,952
-I know but Jesus... absolutely.
-Jesus exorcised demons.
642
00:54:49,035 --> 00:54:52,914
But that's why the church is
very careful to choose very
holy people.
643
00:54:53,456 --> 00:54:55,125
-And...
-And you're not?
644
00:54:55,917 --> 00:54:58,294
I don't think
I'm ready for that.
645
00:54:58,586 --> 00:54:59,587
I'd be afraid.
646
00:54:59,671 --> 00:55:03,925
How much higher can you be
than the Bishop...
647
00:55:05,510 --> 00:55:08,179
No, I'm not joking, I'm...
648
00:55:08,263 --> 00:55:11,391
I'm really impressed with
your saying that.
649
00:55:11,975 --> 00:55:16,730
-But, you mean there's
a higher level of spirituality?
-I do.
650
00:55:16,813 --> 00:55:20,775
Yeah, you wanna find someone
who is really at a higher level
of spiritual attainment
651
00:55:20,859 --> 00:55:23,403
and that's a dicey business.
652
00:55:23,486 --> 00:55:25,488
I mean, getting in
close quarters with the devil.
653
00:55:25,864 --> 00:55:26,948
-This why...
-Why?
654
00:55:27,073 --> 00:55:29,659
-Well, because he's the devil...
-You have the power of Jesus.
655
00:55:29,826 --> 00:55:31,786
I do indeed, but,
656
00:55:32,746 --> 00:55:35,415
the church wants someone
who is really personally holy
657
00:55:35,498 --> 00:55:37,876
to wield that power
most effectively.
658
00:55:38,001 --> 00:55:43,548
So you think it would have
been possible for the demon to
enter you?
659
00:55:43,798 --> 00:55:44,883
Sure it's possible.
660
00:55:45,216 --> 00:55:46,551
I think the much more
likelier...
661
00:55:46,634 --> 00:55:48,344
Is it a part of your
belief system?
662
00:55:48,428 --> 00:55:50,430
Sure. I mean it's possible.
Yeah.
663
00:55:50,764 --> 00:55:55,351
Has it ever occured to you
that all of this work that
you've done
664
00:55:55,435 --> 00:55:58,813
could expose you to possession?
665
00:55:59,147 --> 00:56:01,608
The year I was
finishing off,
The Prince of Darkness,
666
00:56:01,858 --> 00:56:06,237
I had a attack of
serious depression.
667
00:56:07,030 --> 00:56:10,200
and it seems to be that
the fact that all the
evil forces you know...
668
00:56:10,450 --> 00:56:11,826
it wasn't possession,
it was just...
669
00:56:12,202 --> 00:56:14,412
one of the causes of depression.
670
00:56:14,746 --> 00:56:17,957
But it was certainly very
depressing to work with evil
all the time, you know.
671
00:56:18,291 --> 00:56:22,003
So, I had this very
serious depression and um,
672
00:56:22,629 --> 00:56:27,342
that's why I say to people
don't concentrate on the devil,
I did it and I
673
00:56:28,009 --> 00:56:29,135
probably wouldn't do it again.
674
00:56:29,511 --> 00:56:32,013
Concentrate on the good,
concentrate on god,
675
00:56:32,097 --> 00:56:33,765
concentrate on the positive
676
00:56:33,932 --> 00:56:37,393
and don't think that much
about the evil side.
677
00:56:37,811 --> 00:56:41,523
What you said to me
is one of the most interesting
678
00:56:41,898 --> 00:56:44,984
statements I have ever heard
from a man of your
679
00:56:45,276 --> 00:56:46,694
position and standing.
680
00:56:46,861 --> 00:56:51,074
Which is, I don't think
I'm ready to deal with
the devil.
681
00:56:51,199 --> 00:56:52,367
No, I'd be afraid of it.
682
00:56:52,450 --> 00:56:54,869
I'd be afraid of it.
I need a lot more spiritual
683
00:56:55,203 --> 00:56:57,956
training and a lot more
spiritual maturity.
684
00:56:58,039 --> 00:56:59,958
No, and I don't mean that
in some flip way.
685
00:57:00,041 --> 00:57:02,127
-I understand...
-I'm already a material person
but
686
00:57:02,210 --> 00:57:03,211
I don't think...
687
00:57:03,586 --> 00:57:07,382
I think you need to be really
at a high level of spiritual
attainment
688
00:57:07,715 --> 00:57:09,551
to enter into the list with
the devil.
689
00:57:11,678 --> 00:57:13,179
Before everyone left,
690
00:57:13,346 --> 00:57:16,015
Christina's family askedfor her father
691
00:57:16,307 --> 00:57:18,184
to be blessed by Father Amorth.
692
00:57:23,356 --> 00:57:28,111
It's okay now. Let's pray
for your papa.
693
00:57:54,721 --> 00:57:56,431
It was a shocking moment.
694
00:57:57,265 --> 00:57:59,267
Christina was not cured.
695
00:58:04,647 --> 00:58:07,942
Once again she fellinto a trance state.
696
00:58:30,840 --> 00:58:33,218
When her mothersat for her blessing,
697
00:58:33,343 --> 00:58:34,802
it only got worse.
698
00:59:08,169 --> 00:59:11,714
The man
in the foregroundis Christina's boyfriend.
699
00:59:11,881 --> 00:59:13,258
Davidge.
700
00:59:14,008 --> 00:59:15,301
Wait!
701
00:59:17,887 --> 00:59:22,976
It seemed to me thather reactions were evenmore violent than before.
702
00:59:31,901 --> 00:59:34,028
This is an actual exorcism.
703
00:59:34,571 --> 00:59:36,823
It's different fromall the movies.
704
00:59:37,490 --> 00:59:39,534
This is not fiction.
705
00:59:39,659 --> 00:59:42,203
It was harrowing to witness.
706
00:59:50,003 --> 00:59:53,548
There are many peoplewho suffer like Christina.
707
00:59:53,923 --> 00:59:56,884
From what they believeis the same affliction.
708
00:59:57,719 --> 00:59:59,554
But where doesthis come from?
709
01:00:00,096 --> 01:00:05,143
Is this reallythe random invasionof an external evil force?
710
01:00:21,451 --> 01:00:24,203
And then suddenlyit was over.
711
01:00:26,039 --> 01:00:27,248
But for how long?
712
01:00:29,876 --> 01:00:31,711
Father Amorthhad taken sick,
713
01:00:32,086 --> 01:00:33,504
and was in the hospital.
714
01:00:34,130 --> 01:00:35,465
But I made an appointment
715
01:00:35,548 --> 01:00:37,800
to meet withChristina in Rome.
716
01:00:38,134 --> 01:00:40,720
To do a more in-depthinterview with her.
717
01:00:41,554 --> 01:00:44,223
She called myline producer Francesco,
718
01:00:44,641 --> 01:00:46,392
and rescheduled the meeting
719
01:00:47,018 --> 01:00:48,436
to a small town.
720
01:00:49,020 --> 01:00:51,356
200 miles south-east of Rome
721
01:00:51,981 --> 01:00:53,816
called Alatri.
722
01:00:54,776 --> 01:00:57,528
Alatri is an historic village
723
01:00:58,029 --> 01:00:59,238
perched on a hill
724
01:00:59,489 --> 01:01:01,658
overlookingdistant mountains.
725
01:01:02,950 --> 01:01:05,036
The central partof the village
726
01:01:05,495 --> 01:01:08,706
is surrounded bymassive Etruscan walls,
727
01:01:09,666 --> 01:01:11,959
pieced togetherwithout morder.
728
01:01:12,752 --> 01:01:15,338
Like a giant jigsaw puzzle.
729
01:01:17,173 --> 01:01:20,510
The narrow alleywaysand Cobblestone streets
730
01:01:20,718 --> 01:01:22,929
are lined with small houses.
731
01:01:23,513 --> 01:01:27,600
Many of them areadorned with oil paintingsof the Saints.
732
01:01:29,102 --> 01:01:30,853
This is a religious town
733
01:01:31,187 --> 01:01:32,980
in an old-world way.
734
01:01:36,776 --> 01:01:38,486
We had to walk about a mile
735
01:01:38,945 --> 01:01:40,488
upto the top of the hill.
736
01:01:41,072 --> 01:01:44,117
To the acropoliswhere the meetingwas to take place.
737
01:01:46,244 --> 01:01:48,204
Within it is the Cathedral.
738
01:01:49,580 --> 01:01:51,666
Considered a sacred place.
739
01:01:52,250 --> 01:01:54,669
We were to meetChristina in the park,
740
01:01:55,044 --> 01:01:57,922
in front of the12th Century basilica.
741
01:01:58,965 --> 01:02:00,675
We arrived on time.
742
01:02:00,842 --> 01:02:02,677
But Christina wasn't there.
743
01:02:03,553 --> 01:02:04,679
And so we waited.
744
01:02:05,680 --> 01:02:08,224
It was a 120 degreesin the shade.
745
01:02:09,225 --> 01:02:12,145
Francesco called Christinaon her cell phone.
746
01:02:12,520 --> 01:02:15,189
She answered quicklysounding angry.
747
01:02:15,523 --> 01:02:17,275
"Where are you?"She screamed.
748
01:02:17,900 --> 01:02:20,194
"We're at the park,"Francesco answered.
749
01:02:20,278 --> 01:02:21,446
"Where are you?"
750
01:02:22,196 --> 01:02:24,031
"I'm whereI told you I'd be."
751
01:02:24,323 --> 01:02:26,075
"At Santa Maria Maggiore.
752
01:02:26,284 --> 01:02:28,411
The churchin the town square."
753
01:02:29,662 --> 01:02:31,914
I didn't takemy camera inside.
754
01:02:32,749 --> 01:02:35,668
So this is my memoryof what happened.
755
01:02:35,752 --> 01:02:39,380
On July 4th, 2016.
756
01:02:39,964 --> 01:02:43,593
When Francesco and Ientered the church,
757
01:02:46,429 --> 01:02:48,514
it was freezing cold inside
758
01:02:48,806 --> 01:02:50,892
and we were trappedin a living nightmare.
759
01:02:52,852 --> 01:02:54,353
Christina was screaming.
760
01:02:54,437 --> 01:02:57,815
She slithered on the floorin a cheap plastic chair.
761
01:02:58,024 --> 01:03:00,526
Pulling her boyfriendDavide with her.
762
01:03:02,195 --> 01:03:05,448
He tried to hold her aroundthe waist and throw.
763
01:03:05,531 --> 01:03:08,117
"Give us back your film!"He shouted at me.
764
01:03:08,242 --> 01:03:11,037
"No! I want it shown,"she screamed
765
01:03:11,120 --> 01:03:12,914
in the voice of the demon.
766
01:03:13,206 --> 01:03:14,415
I was terrified.
767
01:03:14,916 --> 01:03:18,795
Davide stared at me,"If you don't give itback to us,
768
01:03:19,003 --> 01:03:20,254
we'll kill you.
769
01:03:20,338 --> 01:03:23,424
We'll find your familyand we'll kill you all!"
770
01:03:27,804 --> 01:03:30,890
It was the first time anyonehad threatened my life.
771
01:03:31,724 --> 01:03:34,060
Francesco and Ileft the church.
772
01:03:34,602 --> 01:03:35,812
Left Alatri.
773
01:03:37,104 --> 01:03:40,358
For a half hour,neither of us said a word.
774
01:03:40,900 --> 01:03:43,945
The sweat and the fearwere clinging to us,
775
01:03:44,612 --> 01:03:46,030
all the way back to Rome.
776
01:03:52,995 --> 01:03:56,332
At the end of July, 2016,
777
01:03:56,499 --> 01:04:00,002
before he could performChristina's 10th exorcism,
778
01:04:00,503 --> 01:04:04,131
Father Amorth contractedpneumonia while he wasin the hospital.
779
01:04:05,424 --> 01:04:07,885
Two months later, he died.
780
01:04:09,846 --> 01:04:12,723
Thousands of peoplecame from all over Italy
781
01:04:13,015 --> 01:04:14,183
to his funeral.
782
01:04:17,562 --> 01:04:23,192
We are grateful to Father Amorth
for the good he did in the
name of Christ.
783
01:04:23,860 --> 01:04:30,575
In 1991, Father Gabriele
gathered a group of exorcists
from around the world to Italy.
784
01:04:35,997 --> 01:04:41,878
Some of them are with us
today.
785
01:05:17,914 --> 01:05:21,417
He once told me he could not
wait to reach heaven,
786
01:05:21,500 --> 01:05:23,920
so he could beat the devil
with a cane.
787
01:05:24,587 --> 01:05:27,048
When he passed away...
788
01:05:30,009 --> 01:05:34,138
I had a lot of
different feelings.
789
01:05:34,847 --> 01:05:41,812
I wouldn't call it pain. It was
like when you lose someone
close to you.
790
01:05:45,900 --> 01:05:52,615
But I didn't feel bad that thisperson who helped me so muchis gone.
791
01:05:54,408 --> 01:05:57,328
It's like he's still here.
792
01:06:01,040 --> 01:06:03,459
I don't think he's gone.
793
01:06:25,523 --> 01:06:26,607
I hope to see you.
794
01:06:26,691 --> 01:06:29,402
Will you tell, Father, "I hopeto see you on the 30th."
795
01:06:38,244 --> 01:06:40,997
He was the mostspiritual man I ever met.
796
01:06:42,081 --> 01:06:45,459
Like everyone who knew him,I'll never forget him.
797
01:06:46,877 --> 01:06:48,421
He enriched my life.
798
01:06:53,426 --> 01:06:55,052
But what about Christina?
799
01:06:56,262 --> 01:06:57,555
As of this moment,
800
01:06:58,097 --> 01:07:00,516
Christina's suffering
continues.
801
01:07:01,142 --> 01:07:04,145
I've reached out to her
without success.
802
01:07:05,021 --> 01:07:06,605
Friends in Italy tell me,
803
01:07:06,981 --> 01:07:09,442
she's continued
to pursue exorcism
804
01:07:09,900 --> 01:07:11,318
with local priests.
805
01:07:11,861 --> 01:07:15,156
But Father Amorth was
in a class by himself.
806
01:07:16,323 --> 01:07:17,616
Like the doctors,
807
01:07:18,117 --> 01:07:21,912
I can't tell you exactly
what's wrong with Christina.
808
01:07:23,247 --> 01:07:24,582
My own belief,
809
01:07:25,041 --> 01:07:29,503
is that there is a far deeper
dimension to the universe.
810
01:07:30,588 --> 01:07:32,339
We know there is evil.
811
01:07:33,382 --> 01:07:35,092
There is also good.
812
01:07:35,968 --> 01:07:37,553
And if there are demons,
813
01:07:38,804 --> 01:07:40,431
there must be angels.
66921
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