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Moore: My work often
leads me to dark places ‐‐
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00:00:06,806 --> 00:00:11,711
violent crime, murder,
and the pain left behind.
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00:00:11,711 --> 00:00:14,214
But when I meet people
like Carla Brooks,
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00:00:14,214 --> 00:00:17,150
who triumphed over
a terrifying ordeal,
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I'm reminded of people's
inherent strength and goodness.
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This is all new for me,
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00:00:22,889 --> 00:00:24,524
and it's also
uncharted territory
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for the police
and for the courts.
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Not long after I met Carla,
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my techniques ‐‐ and it felt
like my entire career ‐‐
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were about to be put on trial.
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I'm CeCe Moore.
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For years,
genealogy was my hobby,
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and then it became my career.
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00:00:40,707 --> 00:00:42,642
Soon, I realized
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that the techniques I developed
to reunite families
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could also be used
to identify killers.
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Now my team and I
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help the police hunt
violent criminals.
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I'm a new kind of detective.
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‐‐ Captions by VITAC ‐‐
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♪♪
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When I first joined forces
with Parabon in April 2018,
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people were thinking about
genetic genealogy
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as a tool for a cold case.
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But it only took a couple weeks
for things to change
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when I first received
a new opportunity
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to really extend the boundaries
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of what genetic genealogy
could accomplish.
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That was the Carla Brooks case.
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Carla Brooks was 79 years old.
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She's lived in St. George,
a town in Southern Utah,
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for most of her adult life.
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I married Karl Brooks after
we'd gone together for a year,
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and that would've been in 1965.
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I was his queen,
and we never argued.
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He'd just say,
"Everything will be okay."
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So, that's the way it was.
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Miller: Karl died in 2015,
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and since then, Carla had been
living at their home
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in St. George alone.
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We never had any trouble up here
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in our little quiet
neighborhood.
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But then when this happened,
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it was, um...
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[ Clicks tongue ]
It was really horrific.
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On April 17th in 2018,
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I was in bed, I was asleep,
and it was dark,
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and there was just a night‐light
in my room.
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And a fellow came into my home,
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and, uh, he rubbed my shoulder.
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And just 'cause I was asleep,
I thought, "Well, that's Karl."
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But I turned around,
and it wasn't.
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And he put a rag in my mouth.
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And then he clenched it
like this
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and whipped me around
with my neck
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this way and that way
and this way.
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And I fought,
and I fought like a tiger,
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but I didn't win.
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After he had gone,
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I was so overwhelmed with it
and so hurt...
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[ Camera shutter clicks ]
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...and I cried.
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I just couldn't believe it.
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I had been raped.
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Wilson: Our police department
has 11 detectives,
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and each of those detectives
is assigned a certain area.
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There's sex crimes,
there's people crimes.
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I cover property crime ‐‐
thefts, burglaries.
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But on the week of
April 17, 2018,
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I was on call.
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And about 1:30 in the morning,
I was contacted
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to come in and process a scene
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and to conduct an interview
of the victim.
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A sexual assault
on a, uh, elderly female,
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to me, was extremely different.
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And I thought,
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how would
my own grandmother feel
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sitting down with a detective
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and describing in ‐‐ in full
detail a sexual assault?
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Brooks: They asked me
what color his hair was,
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how tall he was, how he got in.
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Wilson: Carla said that
he was a white male
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and had dirty blond
or dark curly hair
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and possibly in his 30s.
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She suspected that he came in
through the sliding glass door.
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This door, right here.
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He came through this door,
right here.
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I can't lock that door
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because it kind of
goes at an angle,
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so I can't lift it up
to put the lock on it
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'cause it's so heavy.
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Wilson:
After we interviewed Carla,
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we drove Carla
to the emergency room
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where a sexual assault kit
was administered.
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Moore: When I heard
the details of the case,
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I just couldn't imagine
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my mother, who's the same age,
being in that position.
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[ Camera shutter clicks ]
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Wilson: The crime scene
was rather simple
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because there wasn't
a lot to process.
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We documented that room
with photographs,
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and we fingerprinted
all the entryways,
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looking for any
additional evidence,
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and we didn't locate any.
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Once we were finished
processing the area,
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we left with one major piece
of evidence,
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and it was the DNA evidence
left by the suspect.
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In Carla's bed, police found
a large semen stain.
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Wilson: We bagged the sheets
as evidence,
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and we reached out to
our Utah State crime lab.
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They were able to build
the DNA profile,
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and they submitted that
into CODIS.
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We had to wait a few weeks
to get that information,
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but we were hitting any and
every kind of lead that we had.
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We conducted a canvass
of her neighborhood.
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We focused on people
who had surveillance systems
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or doorbell surveillance cameras
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in hopes that we would
catch a glimpse
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of any suspicious activity.
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But we weren't able to
establish any type of suspect.
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Miller: In today's world,
you usually see crimes
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that might have more
of an electronic trail.
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00:06:23,382 --> 00:06:24,884
Maybe there's
surveillance video,
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00:06:24,884 --> 00:06:26,819
maybe there were
cellphone records,
something like that.
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And in this case,
that just wasn't there.
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I was surprised that they had
so little other evidence
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outside the DNA.
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00:06:36,229 --> 00:06:38,364
Wilson: But I was still
pretty hopeful
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00:06:38,364 --> 00:06:41,200
that we would get a good hit
off of CODIS.
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00:06:41,200 --> 00:06:43,903
Miller: This is
a very egregious crime,
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and it seemed like someone
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who might have a criminal
history in the past.
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00:06:47,807 --> 00:06:52,578
But they got the results back,
and there wasn't a match.
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00:06:54,347 --> 00:06:57,617
Moore: CODIS is only as good as
what's been uploaded to it.
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According to some studies,
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CODIS is biased
toward minorities,
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00:07:01,788 --> 00:07:05,391
and people of African American
or Latin American descent
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00:07:05,391 --> 00:07:09,562
are disproportionately
represented in the database.
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00:07:09,562 --> 00:07:12,331
According to
the 2010 Census records,
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St. George is over 80% white,
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or, as I would define it,
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of primarily
Northwestern European ancestry.
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Wilson:
Three weeks after the attack,
we've exhausted all leads.
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I just had already
made up my mind
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that they'll never find him.
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00:07:28,214 --> 00:07:31,784
But what worried me
was that he would come back.
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And he knew
exactly where she was.
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Wilson: He was still out there,
so there is more people at risk
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wherever this guy went.
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We needed to catch him
as soon as we could.
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So, we had to do
something different,
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and so I started googling DNA.
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I thought if genetic DNA
technology can be used
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to solve cases
that happened 30 years ago,
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why can't it be used on a case
that happened three weeks ago?
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00:08:00,346 --> 00:08:03,516
It was definitely
out‐of‐the‐box thinking.
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00:08:03,516 --> 00:08:08,287
So, I really started looking
into genetic genealogy,
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and I came across and got
in touch with CeCe Moore.
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Moore:
This was not someone who had
been in contact with Parabon,
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so when Detective Wilson
reached out to me directly,
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that was a first,
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and it felt very,
very different.
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This was not a cold case at all.
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I had no idea that it would be
CeCe's first hot case.
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I was working on
exclusively cold cases.
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I knew that an active case
would be even more intense,
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but it felt extremely urgent,
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and it was a heavy burden
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knowing that this person
was still out there
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and could strike again
at any time.
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Moore: When Detective Wilson
wrote to me,
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I immediately responded,
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because I was really interested
in the possibility
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of such an active case.
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If active cases utilized
genetic genealogy going forward,
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thousands of cases
could come in to Parabon
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in the coming months and years.
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00:09:16,122 --> 00:09:18,925
And that is really exciting
to me.
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So, I knew it was a big deal
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because this case
could have a significant impact
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on the future of
investigative genetic genealogy.
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So, I decided I wanted to learn
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everything there was to learn
about this particular case.
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00:09:32,805 --> 00:09:35,074
Hi.
Hi. How are you?
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00:09:35,074 --> 00:09:36,275
Good.
Nice to meet you.
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00:09:36,275 --> 00:09:38,177
Nice to meet you.
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00:09:38,177 --> 00:09:40,613
I was kind of thinking
that we were going to
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have this wrapped up
in a week or two.
Mm‐hmm.
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00:09:44,650 --> 00:09:48,688
And when we got zero
results from CODIS...
Mm‐hmm.
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00:09:48,688 --> 00:09:50,356
...it kind of scared me
a little bit,
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00:09:50,356 --> 00:09:53,759
like, this ‐‐ I don't
want this to go cold.
Yeah.
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And, you know, honestly,
I was getting desperate,
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and, uh, I was surfing
the Internet
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for any type
of DNA information.
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00:10:01,033 --> 00:10:03,336
And I was like,
"Who's CeCe Moore?"
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00:10:03,336 --> 00:10:06,539
Mm‐hmm.
And I got to looking
into what you did.
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00:10:06,539 --> 00:10:07,907
It was
pretty impressive.
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00:10:07,907 --> 00:10:10,076
It was unusual
for someone...
Yeah.
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00:10:10,076 --> 00:10:13,479
...to reach out to me directly
versus through Parabon.
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00:10:13,479 --> 00:10:15,648
Well, Carla's incident,
in my opinion,
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00:10:15,648 --> 00:10:18,250
is everybody's
worst nightmare.
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00:10:18,250 --> 00:10:19,752
Did you know Carla before?
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00:10:19,752 --> 00:10:22,521
No, but the case
perked the community up.
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00:10:22,521 --> 00:10:25,958
She was a schoolteacher
for 30‐plus years, maybe?
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00:10:25,958 --> 00:10:27,793
Yeah, she seems
very beloved.
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00:10:27,793 --> 00:10:29,395
Did Carla inspire you?
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00:10:29,395 --> 00:10:32,631
She sounds like she was
a very unusual survivor.
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00:10:32,631 --> 00:10:34,166
Oh, absolutely.
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00:10:36,936 --> 00:10:38,671
It was clear that the person
that Carla is
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00:10:38,671 --> 00:10:41,040
made this have a profound effect
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00:10:41,040 --> 00:10:46,078
both on Detective Wilson
and the greater community.
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00:10:46,078 --> 00:10:50,783
Brooks: I came to teach
in St. George in 1964,
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00:10:50,783 --> 00:10:53,386
and then we built this home
in '71.
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00:10:53,386 --> 00:10:56,322
And it was wonderful
for the children
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00:10:56,322 --> 00:10:58,657
because there's all kinds
of kids up here,
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00:10:58,657 --> 00:11:00,726
and we had great friends.
218
00:11:00,726 --> 00:11:02,661
But it's changed so much.
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00:11:02,661 --> 00:11:07,033
Once Karl wasn't here,
it was very difficult.
220
00:11:07,033 --> 00:11:10,503
I've been through
lots of things,
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00:11:10,503 --> 00:11:13,272
but when this happened,
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00:11:13,272 --> 00:11:16,275
that's a whole different
situation.
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00:11:16,275 --> 00:11:19,145
[ Voice breaking ]
But my mother taught me
when I was young
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00:11:19,145 --> 00:11:21,414
to love everybody.
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00:11:21,414 --> 00:11:24,050
So, I just said,
"Well, if somebody
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00:11:24,050 --> 00:11:26,552
goes through
what I had to go through,
227
00:11:26,552 --> 00:11:29,121
then maybe I can help them."
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00:11:29,121 --> 00:11:31,357
News 4 Utah's Lauren Matthias
spoke with a woman
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00:11:31,357 --> 00:11:34,627
who says the attack
changed her outlook on life.
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00:11:34,627 --> 00:11:36,729
As Carla Brooks explains it...
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00:11:36,729 --> 00:11:38,264
Miller:
Days after the attack,
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00:11:38,264 --> 00:11:41,534
Carla was spending her time
doing activism.
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00:11:41,534 --> 00:11:43,135
Matthias: Carla says she wants
234
00:11:43,135 --> 00:11:44,537
to help other survivors.
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00:11:44,537 --> 00:11:46,238
She donated $5,000
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00:11:46,238 --> 00:11:47,339
to The Dove Center,
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00:11:47,339 --> 00:11:49,308
a shelter for women
in Southern Utah,
238
00:11:49,308 --> 00:11:52,611
as well as The Children's
Justice Center in St. George.
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00:11:52,611 --> 00:11:54,447
Carla is continuing
to raise money
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00:11:54,447 --> 00:11:57,650
to help organizations that help
survivors of sexual assault.
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00:11:57,650 --> 00:11:58,651
You can...
242
00:11:58,651 --> 00:12:00,286
Moore:
Carla, from the beginning,
243
00:12:00,286 --> 00:12:01,520
she had come forward,
244
00:12:01,520 --> 00:12:03,322
and I knew
who I was doing this for.
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00:12:03,322 --> 00:12:06,258
That's very unusual
in a rape case,
246
00:12:06,258 --> 00:12:08,561
that I would know
who the victim was.
247
00:12:08,561 --> 00:12:12,031
For Carla, her driving force
throughout her whole life
248
00:12:12,031 --> 00:12:14,066
had been helping other people,
249
00:12:14,066 --> 00:12:16,502
and that just continued,
250
00:12:16,502 --> 00:12:17,703
even as a survivor
251
00:12:17,703 --> 00:12:18,871
of sexual assault.
252
00:12:18,871 --> 00:12:20,272
I can imagine
253
00:12:20,272 --> 00:12:22,374
for someone like Carla,
who's elderly,
254
00:12:22,374 --> 00:12:24,643
from a tight‐knit
religious community,
255
00:12:24,643 --> 00:12:27,746
that it would be
especially difficult
256
00:12:27,746 --> 00:12:29,882
to have to report
a crime like this.
257
00:12:29,882 --> 00:12:31,183
[ Camera shutter clicks ]
258
00:12:31,183 --> 00:12:32,918
Wilson: When this happened,
people would tell her,
259
00:12:32,918 --> 00:12:36,555
"Hey, you don't need
to tell anybody about this.
260
00:12:36,555 --> 00:12:38,524
You don't need to
talk about it."
261
00:12:38,524 --> 00:12:43,562
I think, in a small place,
262
00:12:43,562 --> 00:12:49,735
you think, "Oh, I can't
say anything," you know?
263
00:12:49,735 --> 00:12:50,836
[ Camera shutter clicks ]
264
00:12:50,836 --> 00:12:53,572
But if you know
something's wrong,
265
00:12:53,572 --> 00:12:57,276
if you're trying to make
something better,
266
00:12:57,276 --> 00:13:00,513
there can't be any fear
in doing it.
267
00:13:00,513 --> 00:13:04,817
She's strong ‐‐ very strong.
268
00:13:04,817 --> 00:13:08,888
Huge example to ‐‐ to survivors.
269
00:13:08,888 --> 00:13:13,392
It was a top priority case,
for me and for my department.
270
00:13:13,392 --> 00:13:16,162
And, uh, I think
it was a top priority
271
00:13:16,162 --> 00:13:17,730
for the community, as well.
272
00:13:17,730 --> 00:13:21,600
I could understand why
the community was so motivated
273
00:13:21,600 --> 00:13:25,137
to find her attacker,
hold him accountable,
274
00:13:25,137 --> 00:13:26,739
and also to protect her.
275
00:13:26,739 --> 00:13:30,376
I absolutely wanted to help
identify this suspect
276
00:13:30,376 --> 00:13:32,811
for Detective Wilson
and for Carla.
277
00:13:32,811 --> 00:13:34,713
Greytak: And so that was
a decision we had to make
278
00:13:34,713 --> 00:13:36,949
was do we want to
prioritize this
279
00:13:36,949 --> 00:13:39,285
above people
who have been waiting,
280
00:13:39,285 --> 00:13:42,321
and we had this whole queue
of analyses
281
00:13:42,321 --> 00:13:44,757
that we needed to do
on all of these cold cases.
282
00:13:44,757 --> 00:13:47,226
But CeCe was looking at the
details of this case and said,
283
00:13:47,226 --> 00:13:49,728
"If we can find him now,
let's do it.
284
00:13:49,728 --> 00:13:52,898
Let's figure out who that person
is as soon as possible
285
00:13:52,898 --> 00:13:54,900
before they can do it again."
286
00:13:54,900 --> 00:13:58,604
There were dozens of cases
waiting for my attention,
287
00:13:58,604 --> 00:14:02,341
but we decided to push it to
the very top of the pile,
288
00:14:02,341 --> 00:14:07,780
no matter how difficult it is
and no matter how long it took.
289
00:14:07,780 --> 00:14:09,481
Using genetic genealogy
290
00:14:09,481 --> 00:14:11,617
for the first time
in an active case
291
00:14:11,617 --> 00:14:12,851
is historic.
292
00:14:12,851 --> 00:14:15,387
And I was excited
about how it could impact
293
00:14:15,387 --> 00:14:17,323
the future of crime solving.
294
00:14:17,323 --> 00:14:20,492
But I was also involved
in another historic event
295
00:14:20,492 --> 00:14:23,028
that could have
an even bigger impact.
296
00:14:23,028 --> 00:14:25,464
In the summer of 2019,
297
00:14:25,464 --> 00:14:28,934
the very first case that I ever
worked on for law enforcement
298
00:14:28,934 --> 00:14:32,004
was going to trial.
299
00:14:32,004 --> 00:14:33,205
Last year, I worked on
300
00:14:33,205 --> 00:14:35,374
the Jay Cook
and Tanya Van Cuylenborg
301
00:14:35,374 --> 00:14:37,743
double homicide
in Washington State.
302
00:14:37,743 --> 00:14:39,211
It had been over 30 years
since they had been murdered.
303
00:14:39,211 --> 00:14:40,980
Reporter: The investigation
moved to this area
304
00:14:40,980 --> 00:14:43,148
beneath the High Bridge
near Monroe.
305
00:14:43,148 --> 00:14:44,350
That's where the body
306
00:14:44,350 --> 00:14:46,252
matching the description
of 20‐year‐old Jay Cook
307
00:14:46,252 --> 00:14:47,686
was discovered yesterday.
308
00:14:47,686 --> 00:14:50,356
Cook and 18‐year‐old
Tanya Van Cuylenborg
309
00:14:50,356 --> 00:14:52,958
were first reported missing
November 19th,
310
00:14:52,958 --> 00:14:55,261
when they failed to return home
to Victoria, B. C.,
311
00:14:55,261 --> 00:14:56,662
from a trip to Seattle.
312
00:14:56,662 --> 00:14:57,830
Tanya's body was found
313
00:14:57,830 --> 00:15:00,199
alongside a rural road,
near Mount Vernon.
314
00:15:00,199 --> 00:15:04,003
In 1987, Jay and Tanya
were murdered,
315
00:15:04,003 --> 00:15:06,739
and investigators tried
everything they could
316
00:15:06,739 --> 00:15:08,574
to identify their killer.
317
00:15:08,574 --> 00:15:10,175
But very quickly,
318
00:15:10,175 --> 00:15:12,578
over a matter of only
a couple hours,
319
00:15:12,578 --> 00:15:14,680
the genetic genealogy pointed me
320
00:15:14,680 --> 00:15:17,850
right toward
William Earl Talbott II.
321
00:15:17,850 --> 00:15:19,451
His DNA matched the DNA
322
00:15:19,451 --> 00:15:22,221
found at the crime scene
30 years earlier,
323
00:15:22,221 --> 00:15:25,024
and the police department
arrested him.
324
00:15:25,024 --> 00:15:29,895
He denied having anything to do
with it and pled not guilty.
325
00:15:29,895 --> 00:15:33,098
The Talbott trial
was incredibly important
326
00:15:33,098 --> 00:15:36,101
for the future of this
revolution of crime fighting.
327
00:15:36,101 --> 00:15:37,836
We had had
some convictions already
328
00:15:37,836 --> 00:15:39,538
on cases that I had worked,
329
00:15:39,538 --> 00:15:41,473
but they were all
through guilty pleas.
330
00:15:41,473 --> 00:15:44,443
There had been no precedent set,
331
00:15:44,443 --> 00:15:46,612
so this was the first time
332
00:15:46,612 --> 00:15:49,848
where a judge and a jury
were going to weigh in.
333
00:15:49,848 --> 00:15:53,152
I knew that the outcome
could potentially dictate
334
00:15:53,152 --> 00:15:56,822
the future of genetic genealogy
in law enforcement
335
00:15:56,822 --> 00:16:00,025
and thus my work
for people like Carla.
336
00:16:00,025 --> 00:16:02,261
So, a lot was at stake.
337
00:16:02,261 --> 00:16:04,663
Everything was on the line.
338
00:16:07,666 --> 00:16:11,837
♪♪
339
00:16:11,837 --> 00:16:15,607
Moore:
It's very important to see
the outcome of these cases...
340
00:16:15,607 --> 00:16:16,775
[ Light switch clicks ]
341
00:16:16,775 --> 00:16:20,979
...because I get
emotionally invested in them.
342
00:16:20,979 --> 00:16:22,648
This is some raw footage
343
00:16:22,648 --> 00:16:25,017
of the
William Earl Talbott II trial
344
00:16:25,017 --> 00:16:28,687
that I was able to get access to
since I didn't get to be there.
345
00:16:28,687 --> 00:16:30,856
Bailiff: ...Linda C. Krese
presiding.Good morning.
346
00:16:30,856 --> 00:16:33,492
Very nice ‐‐ a female judge.
347
00:16:33,492 --> 00:16:36,695
Reporter:
A landmark trial opened today
in Washington State.
348
00:16:36,695 --> 00:16:38,964
The trail was cold
for three decades,
349
00:16:38,964 --> 00:16:42,234
then police mined
a public genealogy database
350
00:16:42,234 --> 00:16:43,869
and found a suspect.
351
00:16:43,869 --> 00:16:46,705
It's the first time
this controversial
forensics technique
352
00:16:46,705 --> 00:16:48,640
will be tested in court.
353
00:16:48,640 --> 00:16:50,576
The trial is expected to
set a precedent
354
00:16:50,576 --> 00:16:52,511
on the use
of family tree forensics
355
00:16:52,511 --> 00:16:54,012
in police investigations.
356
00:16:54,012 --> 00:16:55,748
The first case that I worked on
357
00:16:55,748 --> 00:16:58,584
was the first case
that went to a jury trial.
358
00:16:58,584 --> 00:17:01,053
Even though the Golden State
Killer suspect was arrested
359
00:17:01,053 --> 00:17:03,155
before William Earl Talbott,
360
00:17:03,155 --> 00:17:06,925
the William Earl Talbott II case
made it to trial first.
361
00:17:06,925 --> 00:17:09,094
If it hadn't been
for genetic genealogy,
362
00:17:09,094 --> 00:17:10,896
we wouldn't be
standing here today.
363
00:17:10,896 --> 00:17:15,634
Moore:
There were lots of eyes on the
William Earl Talbott II trial
364
00:17:15,634 --> 00:17:19,638
because the future of
investigative genetic genealogy
365
00:17:19,638 --> 00:17:22,708
relied on the outcome.
366
00:17:22,708 --> 00:17:25,377
Baldock:
In the fall of 2018,
367
00:17:25,377 --> 00:17:27,413
I was assigned to
prosecute the case
368
00:17:27,413 --> 00:17:29,415
against William Talbott.
369
00:17:29,415 --> 00:17:30,983
Frankly, it was the first time
I had even heard about
370
00:17:30,983 --> 00:17:33,652
genetic genealogy
as a new forensic tool.
371
00:17:33,652 --> 00:17:37,156
I started thinking about some of
the potential legal issues
372
00:17:37,156 --> 00:17:39,958
surrounding the use
of genetic genealogy,
373
00:17:39,958 --> 00:17:44,196
and one of the most obvious ones
is thinking about it
374
00:17:44,196 --> 00:17:47,199
from a legal‐privacy
point of view.
375
00:17:47,199 --> 00:17:51,570
Was the way that the police
got to Mr. Talbott
376
00:17:51,570 --> 00:17:53,705
a violation
of his right to privacy?
377
00:17:53,705 --> 00:17:56,975
Was uploading
this crime scene profile
378
00:17:56,975 --> 00:17:59,812
to a public DNA database,
379
00:17:59,812 --> 00:18:02,181
identifying relatives
and family members
380
00:18:02,181 --> 00:18:03,549
through the genealogy process
381
00:18:03,549 --> 00:18:05,918
somehow overreaching
by law enforcement?
382
00:18:05,918 --> 00:18:09,655
People are wary of having
that kind of data exposed.
383
00:18:09,655 --> 00:18:13,058
So, our goal was to make sure
384
00:18:13,058 --> 00:18:15,127
that genetic genealogy
was presented
385
00:18:15,127 --> 00:18:17,696
as really just another lead
386
00:18:17,696 --> 00:18:21,066
like the many others
the police had gotten before.
387
00:18:21,066 --> 00:18:23,902
Moore: I was scheduled to
testify as an expert witness
388
00:18:23,902 --> 00:18:25,170
in the Talbott trial.
389
00:18:25,170 --> 00:18:26,538
But at the 11th hour,
390
00:18:26,538 --> 00:18:28,373
I was informed
that they had decided
391
00:18:28,373 --> 00:18:30,275
I did not need to be a witness.
392
00:18:30,275 --> 00:18:32,778
We reached an agreement
with the defense
393
00:18:32,778 --> 00:18:35,981
to allow a detective,
Jim Scharf,
394
00:18:35,981 --> 00:18:39,151
to talk about the work that
Parabon and CeCe Moore had done,
395
00:18:39,151 --> 00:18:42,054
including the results
implicating Mr. Talbott.
396
00:18:42,054 --> 00:18:46,458
Moore: It's disappointing to not
be part of this historic trial
397
00:18:46,458 --> 00:18:47,993
and get to be up there
with the families
398
00:18:47,993 --> 00:18:52,631
and Detective Scharf in person.
399
00:18:52,631 --> 00:18:55,133
Harleman:
A genetic genealogist
was able to determine
400
00:18:55,133 --> 00:18:57,836
who contributed that DNA.
401
00:18:57,836 --> 00:18:59,705
One question you will not have
402
00:18:59,705 --> 00:19:04,109
is who was responsible for those
extremely violent murders
403
00:19:04,109 --> 00:19:05,811
of Jay and Tanya.
404
00:19:05,811 --> 00:19:09,481
And that could only be one
person, and it's Mr. Talbott.
405
00:19:09,481 --> 00:19:11,283
Reporter:
Talbott's lawyer told the jury
406
00:19:11,283 --> 00:19:14,319
the presence of DNA does not
mean his client is a killer.
407
00:19:14,319 --> 00:19:18,657
Genetic genealogy, that you
heard briefly about here,
408
00:19:18,657 --> 00:19:20,058
the prosecutor said
409
00:19:20,058 --> 00:19:24,129
it's a good tool
for catching perpetrators,
410
00:19:24,129 --> 00:19:25,731
which is inaccurate.
411
00:19:25,731 --> 00:19:30,302
It's ‐‐ It's a good tool for
giving prosecutors insight
412
00:19:30,302 --> 00:19:34,039
into who left particular
biological evidence.
413
00:19:34,039 --> 00:19:36,542
Whether that person
was the perpetrator or not,
414
00:19:36,542 --> 00:19:40,178
other evidence
would need to show that.
415
00:19:40,178 --> 00:19:43,215
Moore: If there was any type
of negative ruling
416
00:19:43,215 --> 00:19:45,784
regarding
the genetic genealogy use,
417
00:19:45,784 --> 00:19:49,187
if the judge disallowed it
in this case,
418
00:19:49,187 --> 00:19:51,723
this could make or break
what we're doing.
419
00:19:54,626 --> 00:19:57,529
I want to be able to
provide answers
420
00:19:57,529 --> 00:20:00,098
to the victims
and their families.
421
00:20:00,098 --> 00:20:01,767
Even if it's a very cold case,
422
00:20:01,767 --> 00:20:04,570
it always feels like
a race against time.
423
00:20:04,570 --> 00:20:09,441
But this was even one more step,
because with Carla Brooks' case,
424
00:20:09,441 --> 00:20:14,513
now it was potentially
a life‐or‐death situation.
425
00:20:14,513 --> 00:20:17,149
I felt a lot of pressure
426
00:20:17,149 --> 00:20:19,084
knowing that this person
was out there
427
00:20:19,084 --> 00:20:21,019
and potentially still active.
428
00:20:21,019 --> 00:20:24,189
So, I wanted to get
that DNA processing
429
00:20:24,189 --> 00:20:27,526
as quickly as possible
so I could jump right in.
430
00:20:27,526 --> 00:20:29,795
The only hurdle
that we had with this
431
00:20:29,795 --> 00:20:31,530
is the funding.
432
00:20:31,530 --> 00:20:36,435
But we ran it up the chain,
and we got it approved.
433
00:20:36,435 --> 00:20:39,304
I was able to go to the crime
lab up in Salt Lake City
434
00:20:39,304 --> 00:20:41,006
and pick up the sample,
435
00:20:41,006 --> 00:20:44,710
and I overnighted the sample
to Parabon.
436
00:20:44,710 --> 00:20:46,078
Armentrout: Most of the cases
437
00:20:46,078 --> 00:20:48,547
that were being analyzed
for genetic genealogy
438
00:20:48,547 --> 00:20:50,082
are decades old.
439
00:20:50,082 --> 00:20:52,050
This was a completely new thing.
440
00:20:52,050 --> 00:20:54,319
We pride ourselves in
innovating around here,
441
00:20:54,319 --> 00:20:55,854
but it was particularly exciting
442
00:20:55,854 --> 00:20:59,224
because this was our first
active genetic genealogy case.
443
00:20:59,224 --> 00:21:00,626
There was a definite urgency,
444
00:21:00,626 --> 00:21:04,129
not just with CeCe,
but with all of us involved.
445
00:21:04,129 --> 00:21:06,231
Moore: I really felt like
446
00:21:06,231 --> 00:21:09,534
if I didn't find him
in the next couple days,
447
00:21:09,534 --> 00:21:12,104
there was a good chance
that he could strike again.
448
00:21:16,508 --> 00:21:20,078
Moore: On the weekend
of July 6, 2018,
449
00:21:20,078 --> 00:21:23,815
I received the matches
from GEDmatch,
450
00:21:23,815 --> 00:21:26,952
and I didn't want
to wait another hour
451
00:21:26,952 --> 00:21:32,491
to try to help identify
Carla's attacker.
452
00:21:32,491 --> 00:21:35,560
So, our call rate was
really strong in this case.
453
00:21:35,560 --> 00:21:37,796
It was 98.4%.
454
00:21:37,796 --> 00:21:38,964
Now, why is it different?
455
00:21:38,964 --> 00:21:40,465
This is an active case,
456
00:21:40,465 --> 00:21:43,001
so this is a fresh DNA sample.
457
00:21:43,001 --> 00:21:45,303
There was a grouping of matches,
458
00:21:45,303 --> 00:21:47,773
and that is our first
genetic network.
459
00:21:47,773 --> 00:21:52,477
And the match at the top
was about 185 centimorgans.
460
00:21:52,477 --> 00:21:55,380
They're possibly second cousins
with this unknown suspect.
461
00:21:55,380 --> 00:21:57,082
Couple other possibilities.
462
00:21:57,082 --> 00:22:00,352
Every generation,
the shared amount of DNA
463
00:22:00,352 --> 00:22:03,088
is halved approximately.
464
00:22:03,088 --> 00:22:05,791
If they're second cousins,
they shared great grandparents,
465
00:22:05,791 --> 00:22:07,259
so I'm gonna make sure
I have the tree
466
00:22:07,259 --> 00:22:09,828
going back
to great grandparents.
467
00:22:09,828 --> 00:22:13,465
And there was a second
grouping of matches
468
00:22:13,465 --> 00:22:15,834
who shared DNA
with the unknown suspect,
469
00:22:15,834 --> 00:22:17,135
but they don't share DNA
470
00:22:17,135 --> 00:22:19,271
with the first
genetic network matches.
471
00:22:19,271 --> 00:22:21,239
This is genetic network #2 ‐‐
472
00:22:21,239 --> 00:22:23,175
the different branches
of the family tree.
473
00:22:23,175 --> 00:22:25,577
My top match is only sharing
474
00:22:25,577 --> 00:22:28,714
about 70 centimorgans
with this unknown suspect,
475
00:22:28,714 --> 00:22:30,382
so maybe a third cousin.
476
00:22:30,382 --> 00:22:32,551
So I'm gonna make sure
I have the tree going back
477
00:22:32,551 --> 00:22:33,285
to great‐great grandparents.
478
00:22:33,285 --> 00:22:34,853
So, now what do I have to do?
479
00:22:34,853 --> 00:22:37,889
I got to build
their family trees, right?
480
00:22:37,889 --> 00:22:41,159
Trying to find
their common ancestor.
481
00:22:41,159 --> 00:22:45,330
The common ancestral couple
for genetic network #1
482
00:22:45,330 --> 00:22:50,068
was Charles Morris
and Elizabeth Margaret Hanna.
483
00:22:50,068 --> 00:22:55,507
Charles Morris was born in 1875
in Boston, Massachusetts.
484
00:22:55,507 --> 00:22:57,943
He not only had three degrees
from Harvard
485
00:22:57,943 --> 00:22:59,611
and he practiced law,
486
00:22:59,611 --> 00:23:01,213
he even worked as secretary
487
00:23:01,213 --> 00:23:03,482
of the Woodrow Wilson
Businessmen's Committee
488
00:23:03,482 --> 00:23:05,283
for the League of Nations.
489
00:23:05,283 --> 00:23:07,686
And so, this was
a well‐established family.
490
00:23:07,686 --> 00:23:12,891
They had seven children,
six who lived to adulthood.
491
00:23:12,891 --> 00:23:17,362
So, for genetic network #2,
the common ancestors
492
00:23:17,362 --> 00:23:21,266
were Amos Holdeman
and Nancy Yoder,
493
00:23:21,266 --> 00:23:25,470
married about 1829 in
Bucks County, Pennsylvania,
494
00:23:25,470 --> 00:23:27,973
which, by the way,
I have ancestors from.
495
00:23:27,973 --> 00:23:29,975
They were both in
the Mennonite community.
496
00:23:29,975 --> 00:23:32,844
They had nine children,
all of whom lived to adulthood.
497
00:23:32,844 --> 00:23:34,780
So, that's a pretty big family.
498
00:23:35,814 --> 00:23:39,050
Next, what I have to do is start
building forward in time,
499
00:23:39,050 --> 00:23:40,685
doing that reverse genealogy.
500
00:23:40,685 --> 00:23:42,587
Coming down from
the common ancestors
501
00:23:42,587 --> 00:23:45,123
and building forward
is much more time‐intensive.
502
00:23:45,123 --> 00:23:47,425
Those trees just get huge.
503
00:23:47,425 --> 00:23:50,629
Somehow, those two genetic
networks I had identified
504
00:23:50,629 --> 00:23:52,764
had to come together
and triangulate
505
00:23:52,764 --> 00:23:56,001
in order for me to find
Carla's attacker.
506
00:23:56,001 --> 00:23:57,269
I was concerned on this case
507
00:23:57,269 --> 00:24:01,706
that that was going to be
really challenging.
508
00:24:01,706 --> 00:24:03,508
And I kind of hit a brick wall.
509
00:24:03,508 --> 00:24:07,145
And I'm just working and working
and working and working
510
00:24:07,145 --> 00:24:09,581
to try to get
that little glimmer of hope,
511
00:24:09,581 --> 00:24:12,651
that little glimmer of light
at the end of the tunnel,
512
00:24:12,651 --> 00:24:15,053
and I don't even stop to eat.
513
00:24:15,053 --> 00:24:18,089
So if I didn't have Lennart
putting food in front of me,
514
00:24:18,089 --> 00:24:19,558
I just wouldn't eat
for a few days,
515
00:24:19,558 --> 00:24:21,626
which is the way I used to be.
516
00:24:21,626 --> 00:24:24,863
I'd be a lot thinner.
[ Laughs ]
517
00:24:24,863 --> 00:24:27,199
I ended up
with two genetic networks,
518
00:24:27,199 --> 00:24:29,201
but there was a third aspect
519
00:24:29,201 --> 00:24:31,136
that was really important,
as well,
520
00:24:31,136 --> 00:24:33,538
and that is that I was seeing
lots of matches
521
00:24:33,538 --> 00:24:35,941
that had full
Puerto Rican backgrounds,
522
00:24:35,941 --> 00:24:37,075
and I thought,
"Oh, how interesting."
523
00:24:37,075 --> 00:24:38,710
It's certainly a clue
524
00:24:38,710 --> 00:24:41,446
because the unknown suspect
had to have
525
00:24:41,446 --> 00:24:43,548
some Puerto Rican ancestry.
526
00:24:43,548 --> 00:24:44,683
So that means
527
00:24:44,683 --> 00:24:47,519
that a descendant
is going to have to marry
528
00:24:47,519 --> 00:24:49,521
or at least have a child
with someone
529
00:24:49,521 --> 00:24:52,824
with a Latin American surname.
530
00:24:52,824 --> 00:24:56,061
So, when I follow
this hypothesis,
531
00:24:56,061 --> 00:25:01,366
in the first genetic network,
I found that Charles Morris Jr.
532
00:25:01,366 --> 00:25:03,702
married Dorothy Grace Rivera.
533
00:25:03,702 --> 00:25:04,970
Aha!
534
00:25:04,970 --> 00:25:06,471
That's promising.
535
00:25:06,471 --> 00:25:08,807
Dorothy's father
is William Rivera,
536
00:25:08,807 --> 00:25:10,609
born in Puerto Rico.
537
00:25:10,609 --> 00:25:12,477
Hallelujah.
538
00:25:12,477 --> 00:25:15,280
So, now that I found
the Puerto Rican ancestry,
539
00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:17,515
I can eliminate the rest
of the family tree
540
00:25:17,515 --> 00:25:19,684
for genetic network #1
541
00:25:19,684 --> 00:25:21,519
and focus in on that one branch.
542
00:25:21,519 --> 00:25:22,821
But there's always snags ‐‐
543
00:25:22,821 --> 00:25:25,390
always, always, always,
always snags.
544
00:25:25,390 --> 00:25:26,524
[ Laughs ]
545
00:25:26,524 --> 00:25:28,693
This family was based
on the East Coast,
546
00:25:28,693 --> 00:25:31,529
they were apparently
pretty happy where they were,
547
00:25:31,529 --> 00:25:33,565
so they weren't coming west.
548
00:25:33,565 --> 00:25:35,433
And I needed to find a family
549
00:25:35,433 --> 00:25:39,771
that somehow ended up
at least near St. George.
550
00:25:39,771 --> 00:25:42,274
I couldn't find them,
so I really needed to have
551
00:25:42,274 --> 00:25:43,642
that second genetic network
552
00:25:43,642 --> 00:25:46,177
point me
in the right direction.
553
00:25:46,177 --> 00:25:52,517
And I run into a great‐grandson
of Amos and Nancy Holdeman
554
00:25:52,517 --> 00:25:57,522
who dies in St. George in 1973.
555
00:25:57,522 --> 00:26:00,725
Ah‐ha‐ha! Finally! Finally.
556
00:26:00,725 --> 00:26:03,261
His name is George Monnett.
557
00:26:03,261 --> 00:26:06,698
I know that the suspect has
to be descended from him,
558
00:26:06,698 --> 00:26:10,835
and he also has to be descended
from genetic network #1,
559
00:26:10,835 --> 00:26:13,939
through Charles Jr.
and his wife, Dorothy Rivera.
560
00:26:13,939 --> 00:26:18,443
George Monnett ‐‐ his grandson
is about the right age
561
00:26:18,443 --> 00:26:21,546
to be the parent of our suspect.
562
00:26:21,546 --> 00:26:23,214
Who are his grandsons?
563
00:26:23,214 --> 00:26:25,483
Do they marry someone
from the Morris family?
564
00:26:25,483 --> 00:26:28,820
So, I find a granddaughter
of Charles Morris Jr.
565
00:26:28,820 --> 00:26:30,488
and his wife, Dorothy Rivera,
566
00:26:30,488 --> 00:26:34,159
who has the same
first name as the wife
567
00:26:34,159 --> 00:26:36,928
of one of the grandsons
of George Monnett.
568
00:26:36,928 --> 00:26:37,929
And I start thinking,
569
00:26:37,929 --> 00:26:39,564
"What if this is
the same person?"
570
00:26:39,564 --> 00:26:45,003
And she is indeed
that granddaughter.
571
00:26:45,003 --> 00:26:47,305
So, she had gotten from
the East Coast
572
00:26:47,305 --> 00:26:49,374
all the way over to St. George,
573
00:26:49,374 --> 00:26:51,609
married
George Monnett's grandson,
574
00:26:51,609 --> 00:26:54,746
and they had a family
of eight children ‐‐
575
00:26:54,746 --> 00:26:56,314
four boys and four girls.
576
00:26:56,314 --> 00:26:59,851
So, what this meant was
my genetic networks
577
00:26:59,851 --> 00:27:04,022
had all converged at this one
family that had four sons.
578
00:27:04,022 --> 00:27:05,790
When all the pieces
come together
579
00:27:05,790 --> 00:27:06,992
and it's in the right location,
it can't be a coincidence.
580
00:27:06,992 --> 00:27:10,462
The unknown suspect had to be
one of these four brothers.
581
00:27:15,700 --> 00:27:20,705
Moore:
The weekend of July 6, 2018,
I barely got any sleep.
582
00:27:20,705 --> 00:27:22,707
But in the end,
583
00:27:22,707 --> 00:27:26,411
I knew that it had to be
one of the Monnett brothers
584
00:27:26,411 --> 00:27:28,346
that was Carla's attacker.
585
00:27:28,346 --> 00:27:32,150
Wilson: On July 9th,
we were contacted by Parabon,
586
00:27:32,150 --> 00:27:36,554
and we were gonna have
a conference with CeCe Moore.
587
00:27:36,554 --> 00:27:40,291
I was amazed.
It's happening so quickly.
588
00:27:40,291 --> 00:27:42,994
When I was able to
provide these leads
589
00:27:42,994 --> 00:27:44,929
to Detective Wilson
and his team,
590
00:27:44,929 --> 00:27:49,000
it was the biggest relief
to date.
591
00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:54,139
We were looking at four
possible strong suspects.
592
00:27:54,139 --> 00:27:57,008
The Monnett brothers,
they all grew up here.
593
00:27:57,008 --> 00:27:59,677
Miller: The oldest brother
was Spencer Monnett.
594
00:27:59,677 --> 00:28:04,883
The police find out that Spencer
has a warrant here in Utah.
595
00:28:04,883 --> 00:28:07,485
Wilson: It's a small traffic
warrant, no big deal.
596
00:28:07,485 --> 00:28:09,254
So I decided to
give him a call,
597
00:28:09,254 --> 00:28:13,058
and he informed me
that he forgot all about that
598
00:28:13,058 --> 00:28:16,261
and was more than willing
and cooperative
599
00:28:16,261 --> 00:28:18,129
to get it taken care of.
600
00:28:18,129 --> 00:28:19,898
Moore:
Detective Wilson informed me
601
00:28:19,898 --> 00:28:21,699
that Spencer Monnett
was scheduled
602
00:28:21,699 --> 00:28:23,835
to come into
the police department,
603
00:28:23,835 --> 00:28:26,337
so I was on pins and needles.
604
00:28:26,337 --> 00:28:29,074
Miller: On July 28th,
Spencer showed up
605
00:28:29,074 --> 00:28:31,242
to the St. George
Police Department.
606
00:28:31,242 --> 00:28:33,411
When I get to the office,
607
00:28:33,411 --> 00:28:36,247
Spencer's in the interview room
with my sergeant.
608
00:28:37,682 --> 00:28:39,551
Hey, Josh.
609
00:28:39,551 --> 00:28:41,219
Hey.
Spencer.
How are ya?
610
00:28:41,219 --> 00:28:42,687
How you doing, man?
Good.
611
00:28:42,687 --> 00:28:45,090
Wilson: I had a warrant
for his DNA,
612
00:28:45,090 --> 00:28:47,158
and I was ready
to take that from him.
613
00:28:47,158 --> 00:28:52,363
Spencer is not a person who
has been in trouble before.
614
00:28:52,363 --> 00:28:54,699
He has no criminal history.
615
00:28:54,699 --> 00:28:56,801
But still, we didn't know
what was gonna happen.
616
00:28:58,503 --> 00:29:01,239
Married, single,
divorced?
617
00:29:08,646 --> 00:29:10,582
[ Laughs ]
618
00:29:14,519 --> 00:29:15,553
Oh.
619
00:29:17,055 --> 00:29:18,556
Oh, man.
620
00:29:52,991 --> 00:29:54,392
I was...
621
00:30:33,097 --> 00:30:34,699
[ Smacks lips ]
622
00:30:34,699 --> 00:30:38,069
He provided us
a full confession.
623
00:30:38,069 --> 00:30:40,071
My jaw was on the ground.
624
00:30:40,071 --> 00:30:41,105
I didn't expect that at all.
625
00:30:41,105 --> 00:30:42,707
He wasn't doing so good,
626
00:30:42,707 --> 00:30:46,077
and he was making
some wrong choices in life.
627
00:31:04,896 --> 00:31:06,531
I collected his DNA,
628
00:31:06,531 --> 00:31:09,601
and we sent that to
the crime lab for verification,
629
00:31:09,601 --> 00:31:11,803
and it came back as a match.
630
00:31:13,871 --> 00:31:18,309
There was no doubt that we had
identified Carla's attacker
631
00:31:18,309 --> 00:31:20,445
and that she was now safe.
632
00:31:20,445 --> 00:31:22,814
And I was really happy to hear
633
00:31:22,814 --> 00:31:25,383
that Spencer took responsibility
for what he did.
634
00:31:25,383 --> 00:31:28,753
Over a matter of only
a couple of weeks,
635
00:31:28,753 --> 00:31:31,789
he was stopped
before he hurt anyone else.
636
00:31:31,789 --> 00:31:33,391
Randall: Tight fit.
637
00:31:33,391 --> 00:31:38,096
I think he was ready to have
this off his shoulders.
638
00:31:38,096 --> 00:31:40,298
Spencer was charged with rape,
639
00:31:40,298 --> 00:31:43,067
object rape, burglary,
and assault.
640
00:31:45,203 --> 00:31:47,338
♪♪
641
00:31:47,338 --> 00:31:53,144
Wilson: We booked him into
the jail on July 28, 2018.
642
00:31:53,144 --> 00:31:55,947
I went over to Carla's house.
643
00:31:55,947 --> 00:31:57,515
Brooks: He knocked at the door,
644
00:31:57,515 --> 00:31:58,716
and I thought, "Oh,
he's just gonna come in
645
00:31:58,716 --> 00:32:01,552
to see if I'm doing okay."
646
00:32:01,552 --> 00:32:05,256
But he came right into my house,
and he had tears in his eyes.
647
00:32:05,256 --> 00:32:08,660
She's looking at me like,
"Why are you crying?"
648
00:32:08,660 --> 00:32:12,196
And he said, "We caught him."
649
00:32:12,196 --> 00:32:14,666
I was so grateful.
650
00:32:14,666 --> 00:32:18,002
[ Voice breaking ]
I knelt down and thanked
my Heavenly Father
651
00:32:18,002 --> 00:32:20,204
that they had caught him.
652
00:32:20,204 --> 00:32:21,873
It was a great feeling
to sit there
653
00:32:21,873 --> 00:32:26,077
and just look at her face and...
654
00:32:26,077 --> 00:32:29,047
feel pressure leave her body.
655
00:32:29,047 --> 00:32:31,115
It was unbelievable.
656
00:32:33,117 --> 00:32:34,919
Moore: It was clear
that genetic genealogy
657
00:32:34,919 --> 00:32:38,623
could be extremely powerful
and effective in an active case.
658
00:32:38,623 --> 00:32:41,259
We were able to provide
Carla and her family
659
00:32:41,259 --> 00:32:43,127
answers very quickly.
660
00:32:43,127 --> 00:32:45,697
It's a good example
of how we can avoid
661
00:32:45,697 --> 00:32:49,334
letting violent criminals
go free for years or decades,
662
00:32:49,334 --> 00:32:53,237
like they have traditionally
in these cold cases.
663
00:32:53,237 --> 00:32:56,774
However, at the time I was
working the Carla Brooks case,
664
00:32:56,774 --> 00:32:59,143
a judge and jury
had not yet ruled
665
00:32:59,143 --> 00:33:02,847
on the use of genetic genealogy
for law‐enforcement purposes,
666
00:33:02,847 --> 00:33:05,783
and a lot was riding
on how things were gonna go
667
00:33:05,783 --> 00:33:07,118
in the Talbott Trial.
668
00:33:07,118 --> 00:33:09,454
Reporter: Every day during
this double‐murder trial,
669
00:33:09,454 --> 00:33:12,457
Tanya Van Cuylenborg
and Jay Cook's family members
670
00:33:12,457 --> 00:33:14,092
sat in the public gallery.
671
00:33:14,092 --> 00:33:15,293
During the trial,
672
00:33:15,293 --> 00:33:17,261
the prosecution
presented evidence
673
00:33:17,261 --> 00:33:21,032
pointing to William Talbott
as the killer.
674
00:33:21,032 --> 00:33:23,101
Moore:
We know his DNA is a match.
675
00:33:23,101 --> 00:33:26,437
There's no question
that genetic genealogy
676
00:33:26,437 --> 00:33:29,707
led to the contributor
of that crime‐scene DNA,
677
00:33:29,707 --> 00:33:31,676
but it's up to the jury
to decide
678
00:33:31,676 --> 00:33:35,113
whether there is enough evidence
to convict.
679
00:33:35,113 --> 00:33:37,648
Is there still room
for reasonable doubt?
680
00:33:37,648 --> 00:33:40,618
Reporter: Attorneys making their
closing arguments Tuesday,
681
00:33:40,618 --> 00:33:43,187
but the defense saying
nothing other than DNA
682
00:33:43,187 --> 00:33:44,922
connects Talbott to the couple.
683
00:33:44,922 --> 00:33:46,958
If you are sitting
here thinking,
684
00:33:46,958 --> 00:33:49,994
"Where is the other
forensic evidence?",
685
00:33:49,994 --> 00:33:52,997
your answer is "not guilty."
686
00:33:52,997 --> 00:33:54,966
It's a cloud of dots
to begin with,
687
00:33:54,966 --> 00:33:59,871
but when you follow the dots,
you end up with a picture.
688
00:33:59,871 --> 00:34:02,974
And that's really the approach
689
00:34:02,974 --> 00:34:05,977
that I encourage you
to take in this case
690
00:34:05,977 --> 00:34:09,013
and find the defendant
guilty as charged.
691
00:34:09,013 --> 00:34:12,683
When a jury goes away
to deliberate on a case,
692
00:34:12,683 --> 00:34:15,887
it is nerve‐racking.
693
00:34:15,887 --> 00:34:19,457
Cohen: A first‐of‐its‐kind trial
is now in the jury's hands.
694
00:34:19,457 --> 00:34:21,793
Jury deliberations begin
in the morning.
695
00:34:21,793 --> 00:34:24,228
One attorney telling me
they should have a verdict
696
00:34:24,228 --> 00:34:25,229
by week's end,
697
00:34:25,229 --> 00:34:27,398
though it could take
much longer.
698
00:34:27,398 --> 00:34:31,369
Moore:
It was very difficult for me to
imagine what they were thinking,
699
00:34:31,369 --> 00:34:35,573
what they were going
to decide in the end.
700
00:34:35,573 --> 00:34:38,743
I didn't think this was
necessarily a sure thing,
701
00:34:38,743 --> 00:34:41,078
so I was nervous.
702
00:34:49,020 --> 00:34:51,122
[ Indistinct talking
on television ]
703
00:34:51,122 --> 00:34:55,660
There was a lot of eyes on this
trial, waiting for the outcome.
704
00:34:55,660 --> 00:34:59,464
Baldock: The jury deliberated
for about a day and a half.
705
00:34:59,464 --> 00:35:02,533
I didn't really know
what to expect.
706
00:35:02,533 --> 00:35:04,602
Moore:
Maybe the jury would decide
707
00:35:04,602 --> 00:35:07,438
there wasn't enough evidence
to convict.
708
00:35:07,438 --> 00:35:11,943
The jury returned with
a verdict on June the 28th.
709
00:35:11,943 --> 00:35:13,277
Moore: This is the family.
710
00:35:13,277 --> 00:35:16,948
These are the people
that I am most concerned about.
711
00:35:16,948 --> 00:35:20,818
I am sure they are
extremely nervous right now.
712
00:35:20,818 --> 00:35:25,122
After 31 years ‐‐
31 years of waiting.
713
00:35:25,122 --> 00:35:28,593
The State of Washington vs.
William Earl Talbott II,
714
00:35:28,593 --> 00:35:30,595
Verdict Form One.
715
00:35:30,595 --> 00:35:32,330
We, the jury,
find the defendant,
716
00:35:32,330 --> 00:35:34,232
William Earl Talbott II,
717
00:35:34,232 --> 00:35:37,201
guilty of the crime
of first‐degree murder...
718
00:35:37,201 --> 00:35:39,270
♪♪
719
00:35:39,270 --> 00:35:43,641
Moore: It ‐‐ You know, it is
impossible to put into words.
720
00:35:43,641 --> 00:35:45,810
Everybody here
followed the trial closely.
721
00:35:45,810 --> 00:35:47,278
It's an important milestone
722
00:35:47,278 --> 00:35:50,848
because now we have
a conviction by jury.
723
00:35:50,848 --> 00:35:54,018
As important as it is that there
was a conviction on a case
724
00:35:54,018 --> 00:35:56,954
where investigative
genetic genealogy
725
00:35:56,954 --> 00:35:58,923
was successfully applied,
726
00:35:58,923 --> 00:36:04,829
it's even more important that
this family has a resolution.
727
00:36:04,829 --> 00:36:06,364
I'm John Van Cuylenborg.
728
00:36:06,364 --> 00:36:08,599
I'm Tanya Van Cuylenborg's
older brother.
729
00:36:08,599 --> 00:36:11,168
Our family's very grateful
for all of the people
730
00:36:11,168 --> 00:36:13,604
that helped
bring this to fruition.
731
00:36:13,604 --> 00:36:16,908
CeCe Moore moved this case
forward very quickly.
732
00:36:16,908 --> 00:36:18,910
Steve Armentrout and Parabon,
733
00:36:18,910 --> 00:36:21,312
all of whom contributed
very significantly.
734
00:36:21,312 --> 00:36:23,381
And really, you know,
their core value
735
00:36:23,381 --> 00:36:25,216
in that genetic genealogy
community
736
00:36:25,216 --> 00:36:27,184
is about helping families,
737
00:36:27,184 --> 00:36:30,021
and I think that's what
you've seen them do today.
738
00:36:31,622 --> 00:36:35,393
Now, this one trial doesn't
put all of the questions
739
00:36:35,393 --> 00:36:38,462
about investigative
genetic genealogy to rest.
740
00:36:38,462 --> 00:36:40,598
There are other upcoming trials
741
00:36:40,598 --> 00:36:42,833
that may handle it
in a different way,
742
00:36:42,833 --> 00:36:44,769
so this is not the final word.
743
00:36:44,769 --> 00:36:46,404
Baldock:
There will be an appeal,
744
00:36:46,404 --> 00:36:49,874
and so a lot of the issues
that came up at trial
745
00:36:49,874 --> 00:36:51,542
will be tested then.
746
00:36:51,542 --> 00:36:54,478
Whether the case is submitted
747
00:36:54,478 --> 00:36:57,081
to the Supreme Court for appeal
after that
748
00:36:57,081 --> 00:37:00,318
won't be decided
for several more years.
749
00:37:00,318 --> 00:37:02,853
There will be challenges,
we can be certain of that,
750
00:37:02,853 --> 00:37:04,555
but we're very confident
751
00:37:04,555 --> 00:37:06,824
that genetic genealogy
as a practice
752
00:37:06,824 --> 00:37:08,693
is going to survive.
753
00:37:08,693 --> 00:37:11,729
Moore: I anticipate
that the outcome of this trial
754
00:37:11,729 --> 00:37:14,298
means that there will be
many more cases
755
00:37:14,298 --> 00:37:16,968
that will utilize
genetic genealogy going forward,
756
00:37:16,968 --> 00:37:19,537
and we should be able
to bring answers
757
00:37:19,537 --> 00:37:21,005
to thousands of victims
and their families,
758
00:37:21,005 --> 00:37:22,773
just like Carla.
759
00:37:24,375 --> 00:37:27,745
Brooks:
Spencer, he admitted to it,
760
00:37:27,745 --> 00:37:30,748
but then the next thing sets in.
761
00:37:32,116 --> 00:37:34,452
What's gonna happen now?
762
00:37:34,452 --> 00:37:36,687
Judge: I'm calling the case of
763
00:37:36,687 --> 00:37:41,726
the State
vs. Spencer Glenn Monnett.
764
00:37:41,726 --> 00:37:45,229
Moore: Months later,
when Spencer had his sentencing,
765
00:37:45,229 --> 00:37:47,732
Carla and her family
all attended.
766
00:37:47,732 --> 00:37:51,569
Spencer pleaded guilty
on February 28th.
767
00:37:51,569 --> 00:37:55,906
Carla also spoke at that
sentencing hearing.
768
00:37:55,906 --> 00:37:58,342
I'm Carla Brooks.
769
00:37:58,342 --> 00:37:59,877
Spencer, I'm glad
770
00:37:59,877 --> 00:38:03,881
that I couldn't see
your face that night...
771
00:38:03,881 --> 00:38:06,917
so I can look at you today
with no fear.
772
00:38:06,917 --> 00:38:14,058
I also want to say for you,
and for me...
773
00:38:14,058 --> 00:38:18,929
[ Sniffles ]
...that I forgive you.
774
00:38:18,929 --> 00:38:20,498
Moore: Carla's
such an amazing person
775
00:38:20,498 --> 00:38:22,633
that she publicly
forgave Spencer.
776
00:38:22,633 --> 00:38:25,803
I can't imagine what that
must have been like.
777
00:38:25,803 --> 00:38:27,571
I have wanted to
meet Carla Brooks
778
00:38:27,571 --> 00:38:29,440
for a very long time.
779
00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:31,976
I was really looking forward
to the opportunity.
780
00:38:31,976 --> 00:38:34,612
I hear it from so many
sexual‐assault victims ‐‐
781
00:38:34,612 --> 00:38:36,981
how ashamed they are,
how guilty they feel.
782
00:38:36,981 --> 00:38:39,150
I think Carla is such
a great role model
783
00:38:39,150 --> 00:38:43,454
to show that you don't
need to feel that way.
784
00:38:43,454 --> 00:38:45,723
Hello.
Hi. I'm CeCe.
785
00:38:45,723 --> 00:38:47,124
Oh, come on in!
786
00:38:47,124 --> 00:38:49,994
When I got your case,
I felt a lot of pressure
787
00:38:49,994 --> 00:38:52,596
because I was afraid that
he might strike again.
788
00:38:52,596 --> 00:38:54,298
I knew you were ‐‐
That's what I was afraid of.
789
00:38:54,298 --> 00:38:56,467
Right.
But Josh was the main one
790
00:38:56,467 --> 00:38:57,802
that talked with me,
791
00:38:57,802 --> 00:38:59,804
and he's been so good.
792
00:38:59,804 --> 00:39:02,106
He just never forgot me.
793
00:39:02,106 --> 00:39:05,209
When he came in,
he said, "We found him."
794
00:39:05,209 --> 00:39:06,877
I just went into shock.
795
00:39:06,877 --> 00:39:08,946
Because there's been
so many people
796
00:39:08,946 --> 00:39:11,182
who never get to find out.
797
00:39:11,182 --> 00:39:13,284
Did you feel safer
after that, then?
798
00:39:13,284 --> 00:39:14,518
Totally safer.
799
00:39:14,518 --> 00:39:15,920
Really?
Totally safer.
800
00:39:15,920 --> 00:39:17,755
It's amazing that
you were able
801
00:39:17,755 --> 00:39:20,524
to forgive Spencer
for what he did.
Well, thanks. Thank you.
802
00:39:20,524 --> 00:39:21,892
Right.
Says a lot about you.
803
00:39:21,892 --> 00:39:24,128
You can forgive,
but you don't forget.
804
00:39:25,796 --> 00:39:27,531
♪♪
805
00:39:27,531 --> 00:39:30,034
Moore:
Carla was at a place in her life
806
00:39:30,034 --> 00:39:31,802
where you wouldn't
expect somebody
807
00:39:31,802 --> 00:39:36,474
to kind of reinvent themselves.
808
00:39:36,474 --> 00:39:39,777
But yet, at 79, she wasn't done.
809
00:39:39,777 --> 00:39:44,815
She was willing to make a choice
that helped others
810
00:39:44,815 --> 00:39:47,685
rather than thinking of herself.
811
00:39:47,685 --> 00:39:51,922
We can still make a difference
in the world
812
00:39:51,922 --> 00:39:54,358
and fulfill ourselves
813
00:39:54,358 --> 00:39:56,227
and make our families
proud of us.
814
00:39:56,227 --> 00:40:02,967
♪♪
815
00:40:02,967 --> 00:40:05,903
You see it?
Yeah. See that one?
816
00:40:05,903 --> 00:40:09,273
I've been really lucky that my
family's been so supportive.
817
00:40:09,273 --> 00:40:14,011
My son hasn't always gotten
as much attention from me
818
00:40:14,011 --> 00:40:17,648
as maybe he would like
or I would like to give him.
819
00:40:17,648 --> 00:40:19,583
And so, there's definitely
been sacrifices
820
00:40:19,583 --> 00:40:22,086
that my family has had to make
and that I've had to make.
821
00:40:22,086 --> 00:40:25,456
You can see Jupiter,
and Saturn's right over there.
822
00:40:25,456 --> 00:40:27,124
Uh‐huh.
And there's the one
under Jupiter
823
00:40:27,124 --> 00:40:28,959
which is, like, Antares
or something.
824
00:40:28,959 --> 00:40:31,395
He still knows he's the center
of my world,
825
00:40:31,395 --> 00:40:35,366
but I finally feel like
I'm living my life's purpose
826
00:40:35,366 --> 00:40:38,269
because I'm able to use
genetic genealogy
827
00:40:38,269 --> 00:40:40,805
to bring answers
to victims and their families
828
00:40:40,805 --> 00:40:43,140
and to make society
a safer place.
829
00:40:43,140 --> 00:40:47,945
[ Nicky speaking indistinctly ]
830
00:40:47,945 --> 00:40:51,448
Genetic genealogy was never
intended to be a career.
831
00:40:51,448 --> 00:40:54,518
I could never have envisioned
it leading me here,
832
00:40:54,518 --> 00:40:57,588
but yet I somehow
ended up here.
833
00:40:57,588 --> 00:41:00,958
It's been
an incredible journey so far,
834
00:41:00,958 --> 00:41:04,829
and I don't think
that's going to stop.
835
00:41:04,829 --> 00:41:07,064
But who knows
what the future will hold
836
00:41:07,064 --> 00:41:10,534
for me, for my family,
for my career,
837
00:41:10,534 --> 00:41:12,903
and for genetic genealogy.
838
00:41:12,903 --> 00:41:20,244
♪♪
65667
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