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The National Rifle Association
has produced a film
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which you are sure
to find of great interest.
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Let's look at it.
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- It was the morning
of April 20th, 1999.
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And it was pretty much like
any other morning in America.
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The farmer did his chores,
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the milkman
made his deliveries,
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the president bombed
another country
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whose name
we couldn't pronounce.
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Out in Fargo, North Dakota,
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Carry McWilliams
went on his morning walk.
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Back in Michigan, Mrs. Hughes
welcomed her students
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for another day of school.
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And out in a little town
in Colorado,
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two boys went bowling
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at six in the morning.
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Yes, it was a typical day
in the United States
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of America.
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- Can I help you?
- Uh, yeah,
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I'm here to open up an account.
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00:02:00,006 --> 00:02:01,769
- Okay, what type of account
would you like?
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00:02:01,908 --> 00:02:05,105
- Um, I want the account where
I can, uh, get the free gun.
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00:02:05,244 --> 00:02:06,609
- Okay.
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00:02:06,746 --> 00:02:09,112
- I'd spotted an ad
in the local Michigan paper
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that said if you opened an
account at North Country Bank,
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the bank would give you a gun.
- You do a CD
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and we'll hand you a gun.
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We have a whole brochure here
that you can look at.
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Once we do the background check
and everything,
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00:02:22,328 --> 00:02:24,888
it's yours to go.
- Okay. Well, all right,
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00:02:25,031 --> 00:02:26,999
well, that's the account
I'd like to open.
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We have a vault, which
at all times we keep at least
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500 firearms.
- Five-hundred of these,
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you have in your vault?
- In our vault.
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00:02:33,873 --> 00:02:35,238
- Wow.
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00:02:35,375 --> 00:02:36,740
- We have to do
a background check.
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- At the bank here?
- At the bank,
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which we are a licensed
firearm dealer.
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- Oh, you are? You're a bank
and a licensed firearm dealer.
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00:02:43,483 --> 00:02:46,145
What do I put for "race"?
White or Caucasian or...?
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00:02:46,285 --> 00:02:48,082
- Caucasian.
- Caucasian.
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00:02:48,221 --> 00:02:53,090
- I knew you were gonna make me
spell the... Cau-ca-sian.
43
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Is that right?
- Yes.
44
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I don't think that's the part
they're gonna be worried about.
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"Have you ever been adjudicated
mentally defective
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00:03:02,235 --> 00:03:04,567
or have you ever been committed
to a mental institution?"
47
00:03:04,704 --> 00:03:06,535
I've never been committed
to a mental institution.
48
00:03:06,673 --> 00:03:08,038
What does that mean,
49
00:03:08,174 --> 00:03:10,438
"Have I ever been adjudicated
mentally defective"?
50
00:03:10,576 --> 00:03:12,942
- It would be something
involved with a crime.
51
00:03:13,079 --> 00:03:15,445
So if I'm just normally mentally
defective but not criminal...
52
00:03:15,581 --> 00:03:16,946
- Yeah, exactly.
53
00:03:17,083 --> 00:03:20,382
- There you go, Mike.
- Okay. Thank you very much. Wow.
54
00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:22,886
- I had one personally--
- That's a nice tension.
55
00:03:23,022 --> 00:03:25,081
- It is and it's
a straight-shooter,
56
00:03:25,224 --> 00:03:26,714
let me tell ya.
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00:03:29,328 --> 00:03:31,626
- Wow. Sweet.
58
00:03:31,764 --> 00:03:34,062
Well, here's my first question:
You think
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it's a little dangerous,
handing out guns in a bank?
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00:04:22,882 --> 00:04:25,976
- Ten-ho!
61
00:04:26,119 --> 00:04:28,917
- Each gun makes lots
of battle sounds.
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00:04:29,055 --> 00:04:32,252
Just press the trigger,
and listen.
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00:04:32,391 --> 00:04:34,154
- That sounds like a gun battle.
Over there.
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00:04:34,293 --> 00:04:36,761
- Is it real?
- Looks like real!
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Hey, it sounds like real!
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00:04:39,665 --> 00:04:43,032
- Right! The Sound-O-Power
military and western rifles
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00:04:43,169 --> 00:04:44,534
by Marx!
68
00:04:44,670 --> 00:04:47,662
- This was my first gun.
69
00:04:47,807 --> 00:04:51,675
I couldn't wait to go outside
and shoot up the neighbourhood.
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00:04:51,811 --> 00:04:54,302
Those were the days.
"I was born
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"in Michigan
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"and I wish and wish again
that I was back
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"in the town where I was born"
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00:05:02,789 --> 00:05:04,552
- By the time I was a teenager,
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00:05:04,690 --> 00:05:06,055
I was such a good shot
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00:05:06,192 --> 00:05:08,387
I won the National
Rifle Association's
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Markman award.
You see,
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00:05:11,097 --> 00:05:12,462
I grew up in Michigan,
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a gun-lover's paradise.
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And so did this man,
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00:05:16,502 --> 00:05:19,027
the Oscar-winning actor
and president
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of the National
Rifle Association,
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00:05:22,008 --> 00:05:23,703
Mr. Charlton Heston.
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00:05:27,446 --> 00:05:29,209
We come from a state
where everyone
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loves to go hunting.
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- Hah.
- Even the dogs.
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00:05:33,686 --> 00:05:37,144
- There were actually
two of the hunters at camp.
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00:05:37,290 --> 00:05:38,655
They thought
they'd get a few pictures
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of the dog dressed up
as a hunter
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00:05:40,860 --> 00:05:42,987
to kind of just have some fun
around camp.
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00:05:43,129 --> 00:05:45,154
And one of the guys
had the idea that,
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00:05:45,298 --> 00:05:47,562
"Why don't we sling a rifle
on the dog's back
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to make the pictures
a little more interesting.
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The victim was kneeling down
in front of the dog
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when the weapon slipped.
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The one round went through
the victim's shin,
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the right part of his shin,
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00:06:00,546 --> 00:06:02,605
and came out through
the back of his calf.
99
00:06:02,748 --> 00:06:06,240
- Was the dog hauled off for any
period of time by the police?
100
00:06:06,385 --> 00:06:08,080
- No, it wasn't. No.
101
00:06:08,221 --> 00:06:12,089
Um, in Michigan,
the law basically states
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that people can commit crimes
that animals
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aren't some... form of,
uh, you know,
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whatever that can
commit a crime.
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- An animal cannot commit a crime
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or be charged with a crime
in this state.
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- Exactly.
- Is it possible that the dog
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knew what it was doing?
- That, I don't know.
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I really wouldn't be able
to tell you that.
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The dog was cute
dressed up as a hunter,
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there's no doubt about it.
I mean, it was a funny picture,
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um, you know, to look at.
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It was... it was kind of neat.
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- Yup, this was the kind
of place I was from.
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A box
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of 270s.
- Coming up.
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There you go.
- Perfect.
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Oh, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa.
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Sorry about that, sorry.
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- So I've been discharged.
121
00:07:01,774 --> 00:07:03,799
- You don't need no gun control.
You know what you need?
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00:07:06,045 --> 00:07:08,411
We need some bullet control.
123
00:07:08,547 --> 00:07:11,414
We need to control the bullets,
that's right.
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I think all bullets
should cost $5,000.
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$5,000 for a bullet.
You know why?
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'Cause if a bullet cost $5,000,
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there'd be no more
innocent bystanders.
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[ clapping and cheering ]
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Every time
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somebody get shot, people are,
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"Damn, he must've
did something."
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See, they put $50,000's worth
of bullets in his ass!"
133
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And people'd think
before they killed somebody
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00:07:40,179 --> 00:07:42,044
for a bullet that cost $5,000!
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"Man, I would blow
your fucking head off --
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if I could afford it."
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I'm gonna get me another job,
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I'm gonna start saving some
money, and you a dead man.
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00:07:55,861 --> 00:07:59,797
You better hope I can't
get no bullets on layaway.
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00:08:02,101 --> 00:08:04,763
- Not far from where
Charlton Heston and I grew up
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00:08:04,837 --> 00:08:08,136
is a training ground
for the Michigan Militia.
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Why do you use the bowling pins?
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00:08:09,775 --> 00:08:12,903
- From a self-defence or
whatever tactical standpoint,
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it's a small target,
which also represents
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00:08:14,880 --> 00:08:17,906
the vitals on a...
on a human being,
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00:08:18,050 --> 00:08:19,517
if you ever had to shoot at one.
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00:08:21,787 --> 00:08:25,382
- The Michigan Militia
became known around the world
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when, on April 19th, 1995,
two guys living in Michigan
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who had attended
Militia meetings,
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00:08:31,497 --> 00:08:32,930
Timothy McVeigh
and Terry Nichols,
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blew up the federal building
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in Oklahoma City,
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killing 168 people.
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The Michigan Militia
wanted everyone to know
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that they were nothing
like McVeigh and Nichols.
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- This is an American tradition.
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It's an American responsibility
to be armed.
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If you're not armed,
you're not responsible.
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Who's gonna defend your kids,
the cops?
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The federal government?
No, none of them.
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It's your job
to defend you and yours.
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If you don't do it,
you're in dereliction of duty,
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00:09:03,996 --> 00:09:06,226
as an American. Period.
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- We're here to let them
know we're here to help.
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We're not the bogeymen
we're made out to be.
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We're here to help and defend
the people of this country.
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00:09:13,005 --> 00:09:15,064
- I'm sure you guys
are the kind of people
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that people would like
to have as their neighbour.
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00:09:17,376 --> 00:09:19,401
If somebody's in need,
you're there to help them.
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00:09:19,545 --> 00:09:21,911
- Pretty much. We're all normal
people. We all have regular jobs
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00:09:22,048 --> 00:09:24,175
and this is what we do
on our time.
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00:09:24,316 --> 00:09:26,910
- What kind of a job do you have?
- I'm a draftsman.
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00:09:27,053 --> 00:09:29,146
- How about you?
- Unemployed right now.
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00:09:29,288 --> 00:09:31,085
- Frank, what do you do
for a living?
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00:09:31,223 --> 00:09:32,588
- I work for
a heat trading company.
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00:09:32,725 --> 00:09:34,920
I drive a truck for 'em.
- Okay. How about you?
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00:09:35,061 --> 00:09:39,589
- I'm a real-estate negotiator
- Real-estate negotiator!
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- White collar all the way.
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00:09:41,901 --> 00:09:43,926
- You don't bring that with you,
though, do you,
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00:09:44,070 --> 00:09:45,435
when you're negotiating
the real estate?
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00:09:45,571 --> 00:09:47,163
- No.
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00:09:47,306 --> 00:09:48,671
- Where do you live,
in suburban--
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- Westland.
- So what do you have
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00:09:50,309 --> 00:09:52,607
in your home?
- Smith & Wesson 9-millimetre.
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00:09:52,745 --> 00:09:54,144
- Nine-millimetre?
- Yeah.
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00:09:54,280 --> 00:09:55,645
- And how about you?
- With hollow points.
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00:09:55,781 --> 00:09:57,146
- Twelve gage.
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00:09:57,283 --> 00:09:58,648
- Twelve gage at home?
- Yeah.
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00:09:58,784 --> 00:10:00,149
- How about you?
- M-16.
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00:10:00,286 --> 00:10:01,651
- At home?
- Yeah.
191
00:10:01,787 --> 00:10:03,345
At the ready.
- I don't agree with that,
192
00:10:03,489 --> 00:10:05,684
'cause you gotta worry about
where your arms are going.
193
00:10:05,825 --> 00:10:09,693
- I know where they're gonna go
when I aim and shoot.
194
00:10:09,829 --> 00:10:12,093
- Whose idea was the calendar?
195
00:10:12,231 --> 00:10:15,098
- That'd probably be Christian.
196
00:10:15,234 --> 00:10:18,101
- A picture's worth 1,000 words.
A) it demonstrates a level
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00:10:18,237 --> 00:10:20,569
of sophistication that you
wouldn't expect out of Militia;
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00:10:20,706 --> 00:10:23,334
B) you know,
199
00:10:23,476 --> 00:10:25,603
we're people too.
- Right.
200
00:10:25,744 --> 00:10:27,769
- And we have a lot of fun
with it.
201
00:10:27,913 --> 00:10:29,278
- Right.
- There was a fundraiser.
202
00:10:29,415 --> 00:10:32,316
It showed, um, that we're not
so serious, you know.
203
00:10:32,451 --> 00:10:34,919
We're not these conspiracy nuts
who wouldn't want our pictures
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00:10:35,054 --> 00:10:39,047
to get out. The idea...
it was a fundraiser, you know...
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00:10:39,191 --> 00:10:42,524
- I've had guns, um...
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00:10:42,661 --> 00:10:44,891
pretty much since
I was old enough to...
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00:10:45,030 --> 00:10:49,694
to have them. And I learned
how to use them, um...
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00:10:49,835 --> 00:10:51,427
You're silly!
209
00:10:51,570 --> 00:10:54,539
Uh, because being a female,
number one,
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00:10:54,673 --> 00:10:57,073
I felt it was important
to be able to protect myself
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00:10:57,209 --> 00:10:58,801
with the best means possible.
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00:10:58,944 --> 00:11:01,071
And one of those means
is having a gun.
213
00:11:01,213 --> 00:11:02,976
When a criminal
breaks into your house,
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00:11:03,115 --> 00:11:04,878
who's the first person
you're gonna call?
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00:11:05,017 --> 00:11:08,953
Most people will call the police
because they have guns.
216
00:11:09,088 --> 00:11:13,616
Cut out the middleman. Take care
of your own family yourself.
217
00:11:13,759 --> 00:11:18,219
If you're not going to protect
your family, who is?
218
00:11:18,364 --> 00:11:20,662
- We're not racist,
we're not extremist,
219
00:11:20,799 --> 00:11:23,893
we're not fundamentalist, we're
not terrorists or militants
220
00:11:24,036 --> 00:11:26,561
or other such nonsense.
- We're citizens.
221
00:11:26,705 --> 00:11:30,106
- We're just concerned citizens.
We have a desire
222
00:11:30,242 --> 00:11:32,176
to fulfil our responsibilities
and duties as Americans,
223
00:11:32,311 --> 00:11:35,109
and armed citizenry
is part of that.
224
00:11:40,319 --> 00:11:43,846
- What do you grow here?
- Right now, there's tofu beans,
225
00:11:46,392 --> 00:11:48,223
soy beans. Tofu-soy beans.
226
00:11:48,360 --> 00:11:51,420
- You're a tofu farmer.
- Yeah. Yeah, food farmer.
227
00:11:51,564 --> 00:11:53,054
I'm a food farmer.
- Food.
228
00:11:53,199 --> 00:11:55,793
- I grow food for people to eat.
229
00:11:55,935 --> 00:11:58,768
No herbicides, no pesticides
on that stuff.
230
00:11:58,904 --> 00:12:01,134
- Right. All natural.
- Right.
231
00:12:01,273 --> 00:12:03,503
- Yeah. Better.
- Certified organic.
232
00:12:03,642 --> 00:12:05,303
- Uh-huh. Healthier.
- Yeah.
233
00:12:05,444 --> 00:12:06,809
Basically, yeah.
234
00:12:06,946 --> 00:12:10,438
This is James Nichols,
the brother of Terry Nichols.
235
00:12:10,583 --> 00:12:13,609
James graduated from high
school the same year I did,
236
00:12:13,752 --> 00:12:15,151
in the district next to mine.
237
00:12:15,287 --> 00:12:17,755
On this farm
in Decker, Michigan,
238
00:12:17,890 --> 00:12:20,324
McVeigh and the Nichols
brothers made practice bombs
239
00:12:20,459 --> 00:12:23,292
before Oklahoma City.
240
00:12:23,429 --> 00:12:25,556
Terry and James were both
arrested in connection
241
00:12:25,698 --> 00:12:27,723
to the bombing.
[ TV news ]: U.S. attorneys
242
00:12:27,866 --> 00:12:30,460
formally linked the Nichols
brothers of Michigan
243
00:12:30,603 --> 00:12:32,503
with Oklahoma bomb suspect
Timothy McVeigh.
244
00:12:32,638 --> 00:12:34,401
Officials charged James,
who was at the hearing,
245
00:12:34,540 --> 00:12:37,236
and Terry, who was not,
with conspiring
246
00:12:37,376 --> 00:12:39,901
to make and possess
small bombs.
247
00:12:40,045 --> 00:12:43,071
- Terry Nichols was convicted
and received a life sentence.
248
00:12:43,215 --> 00:12:46,981
Timothy McVeigh was executed.
But the feds
249
00:12:47,119 --> 00:12:48,950
didn't have the goods on James,
250
00:12:49,088 --> 00:12:52,057
so the charges were dropped.
- I'm just glad
251
00:12:52,191 --> 00:12:55,092
to be out and free,
so I can get on with my life.
252
00:12:55,227 --> 00:12:56,592
- Did Timothy McVeigh
ever stay here?
253
00:12:56,729 --> 00:12:59,755
- Yes. Yes. He stayed here
several times.
254
00:12:59,898 --> 00:13:02,628
For the longest period, about
three months or so, I dunno.
255
00:13:02,768 --> 00:13:04,258
But, uh, he was a nice guy.
256
00:13:04,403 --> 00:13:06,166
- Decent guy?
- Oh, yeah.
257
00:13:06,305 --> 00:13:07,670
- They didn't find anything
on this farm.
258
00:13:07,806 --> 00:13:09,171
- As to what,
259
00:13:09,308 --> 00:13:11,173
bomb-making material?
- Any kind of explosives.
260
00:13:11,310 --> 00:13:14,768
- Uh, yeah, I had blasting caps,
dynamite blasting caps,
261
00:13:14,913 --> 00:13:17,108
dynamite fuse, black powder,
you know?
262
00:13:17,249 --> 00:13:19,444
For muzzle loaders and...
Sure.
263
00:13:19,585 --> 00:13:23,077
Diesel fuel, fertilizer, but,
uh, that is normal farm stuff
264
00:13:23,222 --> 00:13:26,453
that is no way connected
any way whatsoever to, uh,
265
00:13:26,592 --> 00:13:29,026
the Oklahoma City bombing
or bomb making.
266
00:13:29,161 --> 00:13:32,722
Them people - law enforcement,
if you wanna call 'em that -
267
00:13:32,865 --> 00:13:36,062
were here and they were shaking
in their shoes.
268
00:13:36,201 --> 00:13:39,398
They were physically shaking.
Scared to death.
269
00:13:39,538 --> 00:13:40,903
- Of?
270
00:13:41,040 --> 00:13:43,565
- Because they thought this
was gonna be another Waco.
271
00:13:43,709 --> 00:13:47,076
Because certain people...
272
00:13:47,212 --> 00:13:50,045
namely my ex-wife
and other people,
273
00:13:50,182 --> 00:13:53,242
said I'm a radical,
I'm a wild man,
274
00:13:53,385 --> 00:13:56,912
I got a gun under every arm,
down every leg and every shoe,
275
00:13:57,056 --> 00:13:58,421
every corner of the house.
276
00:13:58,557 --> 00:14:01,390
You say anything to me,
I'll shoot ya.
277
00:14:01,527 --> 00:14:04,553
If the people find out how
they've been ripped off
278
00:14:04,697 --> 00:14:09,760
and... and enslaved in this
country by the government,
279
00:14:09,902 --> 00:14:14,601
by the powers-to-be...
280
00:14:14,740 --> 00:14:18,938
they will revolt, with anger,
281
00:14:19,078 --> 00:14:21,273
with merciless anger.
282
00:14:21,413 --> 00:14:23,404
There'll be blood
running in the streets.
283
00:14:23,549 --> 00:14:25,312
When a government
turns tyrannical,
284
00:14:25,451 --> 00:14:28,579
it is your duty to overthrow it.
285
00:14:28,721 --> 00:14:30,086
- Well, why not use Gandhi's way?
286
00:14:30,222 --> 00:14:31,712
He didn't have any guns,
287
00:14:31,857 --> 00:14:33,654
and he beat the British empire.
288
00:14:33,792 --> 00:14:36,260
- I'm not familiar with that.
289
00:14:40,566 --> 00:14:42,158
- Oscoda has a bad habit
of raising psychos.
290
00:14:42,267 --> 00:14:43,632
Bad habit of it.
291
00:14:43,769 --> 00:14:45,259
- This is Brent.
292
00:14:45,404 --> 00:14:48,066
And this is his buddy DJ.
293
00:14:48,207 --> 00:14:49,902
They live in Oscoda, Michigan,
294
00:14:50,042 --> 00:14:51,907
across the bay
from the Nichols farm.
295
00:14:52,044 --> 00:14:53,409
Eric Harris,
296
00:14:53,545 --> 00:14:55,410
who would later go on
to commit the massacre
297
00:14:55,547 --> 00:14:57,412
at Columbine High School
in Colorado,
298
00:14:57,549 --> 00:14:58,914
spent part
of his childhood here.
299
00:14:59,051 --> 00:15:03,715
Eric lived on
the air-force base in Oscoda,
300
00:15:03,856 --> 00:15:07,121
where his dad flew planes
during the Gulf War.
301
00:15:07,259 --> 00:15:09,921
Twenty percent of all the bombs
dropped in that war
302
00:15:10,062 --> 00:15:13,122
were from planes
that took off from Oscoda.
303
00:15:13,265 --> 00:15:16,428
I asked Brent if he remembered
anything about Eric.
304
00:15:16,568 --> 00:15:18,593
- I never knew him,
but I knew of him.
305
00:15:18,737 --> 00:15:21,433
He left here before I got here.
I've only lived here seven years
306
00:15:21,573 --> 00:15:23,541
off and on.
- He was about the same age
307
00:15:23,675 --> 00:15:25,870
as you, so you must have people
in your class--
308
00:15:26,011 --> 00:15:28,673
- A friend of mine knows him,
he was in class with him.
309
00:15:28,814 --> 00:15:30,611
He's lived here all his life.
310
00:15:30,749 --> 00:15:33,377
- I went to school with him
and it shocked me to hear it
311
00:15:33,519 --> 00:15:35,043
on the news.
312
00:15:35,187 --> 00:15:39,283
That especially a kid from here
would be doing that.
313
00:15:39,425 --> 00:15:41,222
- I didn't last too long
in high school.
314
00:15:41,360 --> 00:15:42,725
I got kicked out,
I got expelled.
315
00:15:42,861 --> 00:15:45,227
- Why was that?
- I had a run-in with a kid
316
00:15:45,364 --> 00:15:48,731
one time and I pulled a weapon
on him, I pulled a gun on him.
317
00:15:48,867 --> 00:15:50,357
- What kind of gun?
- Nine-millimetre.
318
00:15:50,502 --> 00:15:52,697
I could've made a mess
out of that situation.
319
00:15:52,838 --> 00:15:54,738
- Could've been worse.
- Could've been a lot worse.
320
00:15:54,873 --> 00:15:56,534
- Could've been Eric Harris.
- It could've been.
321
00:15:56,675 --> 00:15:58,939
- So they kicked you out?
- Yeah, they kicked me out
322
00:15:59,077 --> 00:16:03,207
for 380 days or 165 days,
whatever a full school year is.
323
00:16:03,348 --> 00:16:06,715
- For the longest time, that's
what my plan was, to move out
324
00:16:06,852 --> 00:16:08,945
to Colorado.
- Colorado?
325
00:16:09,087 --> 00:16:11,487
- 'Cause I've got family
out there.
326
00:16:11,623 --> 00:16:13,818
Matter of fact,
one of my uncles is a janitor
327
00:16:13,959 --> 00:16:15,324
for Columbine School.
328
00:16:15,461 --> 00:16:16,826
- Really?
- Yeah.
329
00:16:16,962 --> 00:16:19,396
- After Columbine,
what was it like here in Oscoda?
330
00:16:19,531 --> 00:16:21,556
- My name was second-highest
on the bomb list,
331
00:16:21,700 --> 00:16:24,692
because of the reputation
you get in this town.
332
00:16:24,837 --> 00:16:27,362
- Why? You mean
they did a list of--
333
00:16:27,506 --> 00:16:29,531
- Of suspects.
- Of students who potentially--
334
00:16:29,675 --> 00:16:31,199
- Yeah.
- ...would call in a bomb threat
335
00:16:31,343 --> 00:16:32,708
after Columbine?
- Yes.
336
00:16:32,845 --> 00:16:34,710
- And you were number two
on the list?
337
00:16:34,847 --> 00:16:37,042
- I was second or third
on the list, yeah.
338
00:16:37,182 --> 00:16:40,709
- Why is that?
- Because the whole fact is,
339
00:16:40,853 --> 00:16:43,378
like I said, this town
really gets people down.
340
00:16:43,522 --> 00:16:45,888
- Yeah, but why
did they single you out?
341
00:16:46,024 --> 00:16:50,051
- Because I was a troubled kid.
- You were in trouble in school?
342
00:16:50,195 --> 00:16:52,095
- Oh, yeah.
Why did they put you
343
00:16:52,231 --> 00:16:54,722
number two on their list,
after Columbine,
344
00:16:54,867 --> 00:16:58,564
of the students
that could be a threat?
345
00:16:58,704 --> 00:17:01,537
Come on, there must be a reason.
- Well, okay. The thing is,
346
00:17:01,673 --> 00:17:04,073
I have a thing, it's called
the "Anarchist Cookbook."
347
00:17:04,209 --> 00:17:06,939
It shows you how to make bombs
and stuff like that.
348
00:17:07,079 --> 00:17:08,876
If there's anything
that went wrong,
349
00:17:09,014 --> 00:17:10,743
they're gonna come to me first.
350
00:17:10,883 --> 00:17:13,249
And I don't need that.
- Just 'cause you owned a copy
351
00:17:13,385 --> 00:17:15,410
of the book?
- Just because I own a copy--
352
00:17:15,554 --> 00:17:18,921
- Never made a bomb yourself?
- No. Oh, I've made 'em.
353
00:17:19,057 --> 00:17:21,582
It was nothing big; it wasn't
even as big as a pipe bomb.
354
00:17:21,727 --> 00:17:24,025
It was just... some make it
like a little tennis-ball bomb
355
00:17:24,162 --> 00:17:25,561
or something like that.
356
00:17:27,833 --> 00:17:31,792
Out of the "Anarchist Cookbook,"
the latest thing I built...
357
00:17:31,937 --> 00:17:34,531
I think, would have to be...
I think I made it, like,
358
00:17:34,673 --> 00:17:38,370
about a good five-gallon drum
of napalm.
359
00:17:38,510 --> 00:17:41,411
You know, homemade napalm.
360
00:17:41,547 --> 00:17:42,912
- Kids knew that
you were doing this?
361
00:17:43,048 --> 00:17:44,879
- Yeah.
- So you were number two, then,
362
00:17:45,017 --> 00:17:46,382
on the list.
- Right.
363
00:17:46,518 --> 00:17:48,383
- Who was number one?
- I don't know.
364
00:17:48,520 --> 00:17:52,047
They never told me that name.
Which kind of made me mad.
365
00:17:52,190 --> 00:17:54,715
'Cause I didn't make it
to number one.
366
00:17:54,860 --> 00:17:57,385
I know it's kind of silly,
but I guess
367
00:17:57,529 --> 00:18:01,226
it'd been kind of an ego thing,
knowing that I was number one
368
00:18:01,366 --> 00:18:04,802
at something in Oscoda, even
if it was a bomb-threat list.
369
00:18:04,937 --> 00:18:06,802
- Do you believe it was right
370
00:18:06,939 --> 00:18:09,237
to blow up the building
in Oklahoma City?
371
00:18:09,374 --> 00:18:11,569
I'm not saying you did it.
- No. No, no, no.
372
00:18:11,710 --> 00:18:14,076
- I'm just saying: was it right?
- Why was it "blowed up"?
373
00:18:14,212 --> 00:18:16,476
That's a good question. Why
was that building "blowed up"?
374
00:18:16,615 --> 00:18:19,413
And who blew it up?
- But if someone did it,
375
00:18:19,551 --> 00:18:21,075
it would be wrong.
- Yeah.
376
00:18:21,219 --> 00:18:23,687
- It is wrong to take the lives
of those people.
377
00:18:23,822 --> 00:18:26,120
- Yeah.
378
00:18:26,258 --> 00:18:30,524
I use the pen. 'Cause the pen
is mightier than the sword.
379
00:18:30,662 --> 00:18:35,156
But you always must keep a sword
handy, for when the pen fails.
380
00:18:35,300 --> 00:18:38,497
I sleep with a .44 Magnum
under my pillow.
381
00:18:38,637 --> 00:18:41,868
- Come on...
That's what everyone says.
382
00:18:42,007 --> 00:18:44,032
Is that true?
- It's true.
383
00:18:44,176 --> 00:18:46,371
- If we were to go--
- The whole world knows that.
384
00:18:46,511 --> 00:18:49,537
- ...look under your pillow right
now, would we see a .44 Magnum?
385
00:18:49,681 --> 00:18:51,205
- Yeah.
- Honestly?
386
00:18:51,350 --> 00:18:54,012
Would you take us and show us?
Right now?
387
00:18:54,152 --> 00:18:56,518
He took me into his bedroom,
but told the cameraman
388
00:18:56,655 --> 00:18:58,350
to stay out. Sure enough,
389
00:18:58,490 --> 00:19:01,550
there was a .44 Magnum
under his pillow.
390
00:19:01,693 --> 00:19:03,888
There it is. Okay.
Is it loaded?
391
00:19:04,029 --> 00:19:05,496
- Aye-yay-yay.
392
00:19:05,564 --> 00:19:07,327
- Okay. I believe you.
393
00:19:07,399 --> 00:19:10,334
NICHOLS HAS COCKED THE GUN
AND PUT IT TO HIS TEMPLE.
394
00:19:10,402 --> 00:19:12,700
[ laughing ]
Don't do that!
395
00:19:12,771 --> 00:19:14,466
You put the gun to your head.
- I know!
396
00:19:14,606 --> 00:19:16,801
- Jeez!
- I'm not gonna get hurt!
397
00:19:16,942 --> 00:19:19,672
- This is loaded.
- It's loaded, it's safe.
398
00:19:19,811 --> 00:19:22,746
You've got to pull the trigger,
pull the hammer and shoot it.
399
00:19:22,881 --> 00:19:25,748
- Mm, put the hammer back.
- No one has a right to tell me
400
00:19:25,884 --> 00:19:28,444
that I can't have it.
That is protected
401
00:19:28,587 --> 00:19:30,748
in our constitution.
- Where's it say a handgun
402
00:19:30,889 --> 00:19:32,754
is protected?
- No, gun. We should...
403
00:19:32,891 --> 00:19:34,415
Every citizen--
- It doesn't say "gun"!
404
00:19:34,559 --> 00:19:36,424
It says "arms."
- Arms. What is arms?
405
00:19:36,561 --> 00:19:38,756
- Could be a nuclear weapon.
- It's not these-- That's right,
406
00:19:38,897 --> 00:19:41,263
it could be a nuclear weapon!
- You think you should have
407
00:19:41,400 --> 00:19:43,766
the right to have weapons-grade
plutonium here on the farm?
408
00:19:43,902 --> 00:19:45,267
- We should be able
to have anything--
409
00:19:45,404 --> 00:19:46,769
- Should you have
weapons-grade plutonium?
410
00:19:46,905 --> 00:19:49,100
- I don't want it.
- But should you have the right
411
00:19:49,241 --> 00:19:51,607
to have it if you did want it?
- That should be restricted.
412
00:19:51,743 --> 00:19:54,234
- Ah! Ah, so you do believe
in some restrictions.
413
00:19:54,379 --> 00:19:58,281
- Well, there's wackos out there.
414
00:19:58,417 --> 00:20:01,443
"Happiness is a warm gun
415
00:20:01,586 --> 00:20:04,612
"Bang bang shoot shoot"
[ TV news ]: The town of Virgin,
416
00:20:04,756 --> 00:20:09,489
Utah, has passed a law requiring
all residents to own guns.
417
00:20:25,777 --> 00:20:28,075
- Cary McWilliams
proudly displays the target
418
00:20:28,213 --> 00:20:30,477
he used to pass
his shooting test.
419
00:20:30,615 --> 00:20:32,446
But the thing is,
he can't see it.
420
00:20:32,584 --> 00:20:35,576
He's blind.
421
00:20:35,721 --> 00:20:37,586
Cary has had a love affair
with guns
422
00:20:37,723 --> 00:20:40,783
since he first got his hands
on an M-16 as a teenager.
423
00:20:40,926 --> 00:20:45,090
- I'm actually most comfortable
with assault rifles.
424
00:20:45,230 --> 00:20:47,095
- Woo-hoo!
425
00:21:04,616 --> 00:21:06,709
- This is a great place
to raise your children.
426
00:21:06,852 --> 00:21:08,843
A really great place
to raise your kids.
427
00:21:08,987 --> 00:21:12,445
Very close-knit community
we have here.
428
00:21:12,591 --> 00:21:14,855
Everybody looks out
for everybody.
429
00:21:14,993 --> 00:21:17,018
- Good people.
- Good people.
430
00:21:17,162 --> 00:21:20,962
- This just happens to be
a place where two young men
431
00:21:21,099 --> 00:21:23,397
made very bad,
very wrong decisions.
432
00:21:23,535 --> 00:21:27,062
And there's been international
notoriety as a result of it.
433
00:21:27,205 --> 00:21:28,570
Other than that,
434
00:21:28,707 --> 00:21:30,902
I don't know that Littleton
is a lot different
435
00:21:31,042 --> 00:21:34,136
than a whole lot
of other suburban communities.
436
00:21:38,283 --> 00:21:40,581
Economic Development P.R. Video
437
00:21:40,652 --> 00:21:42,620
- Good morning, Mr. Edwards,
members of the board.
438
00:21:42,687 --> 00:21:45,349
I'd like to report that
I've found the perfect location
439
00:21:45,490 --> 00:21:48,357
for our new corporate office,
South Metro Denver.
440
00:21:48,493 --> 00:21:50,290
You can see,
441
00:21:50,428 --> 00:21:53,090
I don't need these.
Because South Metro Denver
442
00:21:53,231 --> 00:21:56,257
has about the same amount
of sunshine and precipitation
443
00:21:56,401 --> 00:21:58,164
as Southern California.
It's so incredible,
444
00:21:58,303 --> 00:22:00,828
you're just gonna have
to see it for yourselves.
445
00:22:00,972 --> 00:22:03,133
How's this look, Mr. Edwards?
446
00:22:12,884 --> 00:22:15,216
Denny Fennel
Home Security Consultant
447
00:22:15,287 --> 00:22:17,755
- We're south of Denver,
in a community called Littleton,
448
00:22:17,823 --> 00:22:19,791
and this house is pretty much
449
00:22:19,925 --> 00:22:23,258
your average middle-class
suburban home.
450
00:22:23,395 --> 00:22:25,226
The burglar or the rapist
is still here
451
00:22:25,363 --> 00:22:26,728
in the neighbourhood somewhere.
452
00:22:26,865 --> 00:22:29,561
And so citizens
sometimes think that...
453
00:22:29,701 --> 00:22:31,396
I have people tell me
all the time--
454
00:22:31,536 --> 00:22:35,267
- Where exactly is the burglar
or rapist right now?
455
00:22:35,407 --> 00:22:38,001
If I was to try and stab you
through this, right here,
456
00:22:38,143 --> 00:22:40,577
you're gonna have to be
really close. Right?
457
00:22:40,712 --> 00:22:42,737
- And here's the bottom line
on this.
458
00:22:42,881 --> 00:22:44,246
- What if I had a spear?
459
00:22:44,382 --> 00:22:47,840
- Now, downstairs is where
the safe-room was constructed,
460
00:22:47,986 --> 00:22:50,921
and this is a solid-core door,
a very heavy door.
461
00:22:51,056 --> 00:22:54,082
And now, the criminal
has to break through this door,
462
00:22:54,226 --> 00:22:55,750
so you've created
another barrier.
463
00:22:55,894 --> 00:22:58,727
- An axe would do it.
- An axe would do it.
464
00:22:58,864 --> 00:23:01,424
I think that Columbine
did a couple of things.
465
00:23:01,566 --> 00:23:05,764
One is that it changed how
we talk. That's the first thing.
466
00:23:05,904 --> 00:23:08,099
- How's that?
- Well, for instance,
467
00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:10,367
if I say "Columbine,"
everybody knows what it means.
468
00:23:10,508 --> 00:23:16,606
I don't have to explain to you
that Columbine...
469
00:23:16,748 --> 00:23:19,444
- Is... What's wrong?
- Nothing, I just...
470
00:23:19,584 --> 00:23:21,711
- What's wrong?
- I-- I just...
471
00:23:21,853 --> 00:23:25,550
sometimes Columbine bothers me.
I'll be fine. Just a minute.
472
00:23:25,690 --> 00:23:28,250
- That's okay, that's okay.
- Um...
473
00:23:32,364 --> 00:23:35,424
There...
there's something, um...
474
00:23:37,369 --> 00:23:43,069
something overwhelming about
that kind of... viciousness,
475
00:23:43,208 --> 00:23:50,239
that kind of predatory action,
that kind of indiscriminate, uh,
476
00:23:50,382 --> 00:23:52,782
killing.
477
00:23:54,019 --> 00:23:56,852
World's Largest Weapons Maker
478
00:23:57,122 --> 00:23:59,249
- This facility,
where we're located right now...
479
00:23:59,391 --> 00:24:01,359
Evan McCollum
Lockheed Martin Public Relations
480
00:24:01,559 --> 00:24:03,527
and two other major facilities
where our employees work
481
00:24:03,595 --> 00:24:05,927
are either in
or very near Littleton.
482
00:24:06,064 --> 00:24:10,091
So we have over 5,000 employees
at these facilities,
483
00:24:10,235 --> 00:24:12,601
quite a number of whom
live in Littleton,
484
00:24:12,737 --> 00:24:15,467
many of whom have children who
attend Columbine High School.
485
00:24:15,607 --> 00:24:18,440
I suppose in one way you could
say that what happened
486
00:24:18,576 --> 00:24:20,840
at Columbine High School
is a microcosm, uh...
487
00:24:20,979 --> 00:24:24,039
of what happens
throughout the world.
488
00:24:24,182 --> 00:24:26,514
- You know the signs
that we see around here,
489
00:24:26,651 --> 00:24:28,448
the ones that say:
"We Are Columbine,"
490
00:24:28,586 --> 00:24:32,147
is that how you,
Lockheed Martin, feels,
491
00:24:32,290 --> 00:24:34,053
that you're the biggest employer
here in Littleton,
492
00:24:34,192 --> 00:24:36,057
you're the biggest weapons-
maker? "We Are Columbine."
493
00:24:36,194 --> 00:24:38,890
- I think we probably
embody that spirit,
494
00:24:39,030 --> 00:24:41,055
that, yeah, we're all members
of this community
495
00:24:41,199 --> 00:24:43,895
and that it behoves us to help
one another and to reach out
496
00:24:44,035 --> 00:24:45,400
to assist one another, yeah.
497
00:24:45,537 --> 00:24:47,562
- He told us that no one
in Littleton,
498
00:24:47,706 --> 00:24:49,071
including the executives
499
00:24:49,207 --> 00:24:52,404
at Lockheed, could figure out
why the boys at Columbine
500
00:24:52,544 --> 00:24:54,239
had resorted to violence.
501
00:24:54,379 --> 00:24:56,074
- Why would kids do this?
502
00:24:56,214 --> 00:25:00,913
Uh, some of the root of that
probably has to do
503
00:25:01,052 --> 00:25:03,919
with their anger
about various issues
504
00:25:04,055 --> 00:25:06,421
and we became aware of a program
505
00:25:06,558 --> 00:25:08,355
that provides
anger-management training.
506
00:25:08,493 --> 00:25:11,553
And so we made
a $100,000 contribution
507
00:25:11,696 --> 00:25:14,563
to the Jefferson County schools
to use this training
508
00:25:14,699 --> 00:25:18,601
in the schools. We hope to help
both teachers and students
509
00:25:18,737 --> 00:25:23,231
learn alternative ways
to deal with anger.
510
00:25:23,375 --> 00:25:25,707
- So you don't think our kids
say to themselves:
511
00:25:25,844 --> 00:25:27,402
"Well, gee, Dad goes off
512
00:25:27,545 --> 00:25:29,775
to the factory every day
and, you know,
513
00:25:29,914 --> 00:25:33,577
he built missiles." These
are weapons of mass destruction.
514
00:25:33,718 --> 00:25:35,709
What's the difference
between that mass destruction
515
00:25:35,854 --> 00:25:39,381
and the mass destruction
over at Columbine High School?
516
00:25:39,524 --> 00:25:41,355
- I guess I don't see
that connection,
517
00:25:41,493 --> 00:25:45,395
that specific connection,
because the missiles
518
00:25:45,530 --> 00:25:48,363
that you're talking about were
built and designed to defend us
519
00:25:48,500 --> 00:25:51,628
from somebody else who would be
aggressors against us.
520
00:25:51,770 --> 00:25:54,000
Societies and countries
and governments do things
521
00:25:54,139 --> 00:25:55,902
that annoy one another.
522
00:25:56,041 --> 00:25:59,704
But we have to learn
to deal with that annoyance
523
00:25:59,844 --> 00:26:03,143
or that anger or that
frustration in appropriate ways.
524
00:26:03,281 --> 00:26:04,942
We don't get irritated
with somebody
525
00:26:05,083 --> 00:26:06,948
and just 'cause we're mad
at them, uh,
526
00:26:07,085 --> 00:26:10,987
drop a bomb or shoot at them,
or fire a missile at them.
527
00:26:13,058 --> 00:26:14,525
[ What a Wonderful World
by Louis Armstrong ]
528
00:26:14,726 --> 00:26:19,390
1953: U.S. overthrows
Prime Minister Mossadeq of Iran.
529
00:26:20,298 --> 00:26:23,995
U.S. installs Shah as dictator.
530
00:26:24,669 --> 00:26:27,866
1954: U.S. overthrows
democratically-elected
President Arbenz of Guatemala.
531
00:26:28,006 --> 00:26:29,803
200,000 civilians killed.
532
00:26:30,642 --> 00:26:35,170
1963: U.S. backs assassination of
South Vietnamese President Diem.
533
00:26:36,448 --> 00:26:40,646
1963-1975: American military kills
4 million people in Southeast Asia.
534
00:26:41,319 --> 00:26:44,152
September 11, 1973:
U.S. stages coup in Chile.
535
00:26:44,289 --> 00:26:47,156
Democratically-elected President
Salvator Allende assassinated.
536
00:26:47,492 --> 00:26:50,427
Dictator Augusto Pinochet installed.
537
00:26:50,795 --> 00:26:53,195
5,000 Chileans murdered.
538
00:26:53,698 --> 00:26:56,929
1977: U.S. backs military rulers
of El Salvador.
539
00:26:57,569 --> 00:27:02,029
70,000 Salvadorans and
four American nuns killed.
540
00:27:03,975 --> 00:27:08,537
1980's: U.S. trains Osama bin Laden
and fellow terrorists to kill Soviets.
541
00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:12,116
CIA gives them $3 billion.
542
00:27:12,250 --> 00:27:18,280
1981: Reagan administration
trains and funds "contras".
30,000 Nicaraguans die.
543
00:27:20,125 --> 00:27:24,926
1982: U.S. provides billions in aid
to Saddam Hussein for weapons
to kill Iranians.
544
00:27:26,064 --> 00:27:30,023
1987: White House secretly gives
Iran weapons to kill Iraqis.
545
00:27:31,836 --> 00:27:36,637
1989: CIA agent Manuel Noriega
(also serving as President of Panama)
disobeys orders from Washington.
546
00:27:38,176 --> 00:27:42,340
U.S. invades Panama
and removes Noriega.
547
00:27:43,515 --> 00:27:47,042
3,000 Panamanian civilian casualties.
548
00:27:47,552 --> 00:27:51,386
1990: Iraq invades Kuwait
with weapons from U.S.
549
00:27:51,523 --> 00:27:54,253
1991: U.S. enters Iraq.
550
00:27:54,392 --> 00:27:57,225
Bush reinstates dictator of Kuwait.
551
00:27:57,629 --> 00:28:01,759
1998: Clinton bombs
"weapons factory" in Sudan.
552
00:28:02,901 --> 00:28:05,665
Factory turns out
to be making aspirin.
553
00:28:06,070 --> 00:28:09,904
1991 to present: American planes
bomb Iraq on a weekly basis.
554
00:28:10,041 --> 00:28:15,411
U.N. estimates 500,000 Iraqi children
die from bombing and sanctions.
555
00:28:15,947 --> 00:28:21,943
2000-01: U.S. gives Taliban-ruled
Afghanistan $245 million in "aid."
556
00:28:22,820 --> 00:28:29,123
Sept.11, 2001: Osama bin Laden
uses his expert CIA training
to murder 3,000 people.
557
00:28:29,494 --> 00:28:31,462
[ end of What a Wonderful World ]
558
00:28:31,829 --> 00:28:35,856
[ screaming ]: Oh my goodness!
Oh my word!
559
00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:38,525
Oh my word!
560
00:28:41,839 --> 00:28:44,899
- South of Denver in Littleton,
on the grounds
561
00:28:45,043 --> 00:28:46,533
of the U.S. Air Force Academy,
562
00:28:46,678 --> 00:28:48,407
there sits
an actual B-52 bomber.
563
00:28:48,546 --> 00:28:51,538
The plaque underneath it
proudly proclaims
564
00:28:51,683 --> 00:28:54,174
that this plane
killed Vietnamese people
565
00:28:54,319 --> 00:28:57,015
on Christmas eve, 1972.
566
00:28:57,155 --> 00:29:01,785
It was the largest bombing
campaign of the Vietnam War.
567
00:29:01,926 --> 00:29:03,757
Just outside Denver
is Rocky Flats
568
00:29:03,895 --> 00:29:05,658
the largest plutonium-
weapons-making factory
569
00:29:05,797 --> 00:29:07,162
in the world,
570
00:29:07,298 --> 00:29:10,756
and now a massive
radioactive dump.
571
00:29:10,902 --> 00:29:12,961
A few miles away,
buried inside a mountain,
572
00:29:13,104 --> 00:29:16,232
is NORAD, which oversees
our nuclear missiles,
573
00:29:16,374 --> 00:29:18,001
many of which dot
574
00:29:18,142 --> 00:29:19,769
the Colorado landscape.
575
00:29:23,147 --> 00:29:27,413
And once a month, Lockheed
transports one of its rockets,
576
00:29:27,552 --> 00:29:28,917
with its Pentagon payload,
577
00:29:29,053 --> 00:29:30,577
through the streets
of Littleton,
578
00:29:30,722 --> 00:29:32,917
passing nearby
Columbine High School
579
00:29:33,057 --> 00:29:35,025
on its way to an air-force base
580
00:29:35,159 --> 00:29:37,252
on the other side of Denver.
581
00:29:37,395 --> 00:29:40,091
The rockets are transported
in the middle of the night,
582
00:29:40,231 --> 00:29:45,669
while the children of Columbine
are asleep.
583
00:29:47,572 --> 00:29:49,540
[ gunfire ]
584
00:29:54,312 --> 00:29:57,907
Largest one day bombing by U.S.
in Kosovo war
585
00:29:58,082 --> 00:30:00,050
- Twenty-two NATO missiles
586
00:30:00,184 --> 00:30:02,709
fell on the village
of Bogutovac near Kraljevo.
587
00:30:02,854 --> 00:30:06,346
Deadly cargo was dropped
upon the residential part
588
00:30:06,491 --> 00:30:07,719
of the village.
589
00:30:07,859 --> 00:30:10,885
- We're striking hard at Serbia's
machinery of repression,
590
00:30:11,029 --> 00:30:12,792
while making
a deliberate effort
591
00:30:12,930 --> 00:30:15,398
to minimize harm
to innocent people.
592
00:30:15,533 --> 00:30:19,629
- On the hit list were a local
hospital and primary school.
593
00:30:21,272 --> 00:30:23,740
- We all know there has been
a terrible shooting
594
00:30:23,875 --> 00:30:26,810
at a high school
in Littleton, Colorado.
595
00:30:26,944 --> 00:30:30,471
I hope the American people will
be praying for the students,
596
00:30:30,615 --> 00:30:32,412
the parents and the teachers.
597
00:30:32,550 --> 00:30:35,041
And we'll wait
for events to unfold
598
00:30:35,186 --> 00:30:37,347
and then there'll be
more to say.
599
00:30:39,123 --> 00:30:40,454
- Jefferson County, 911.
600
00:30:40,692 --> 00:30:42,159
- There's some boy at Columbine
High School, someone killed...
601
00:30:42,393 --> 00:30:44,088
- Do you know
if anybody's injured?
602
00:30:44,195 --> 00:30:45,719
- Yes.
- They've got pipe bombs,
603
00:30:45,830 --> 00:30:47,422
pipe bombs...
604
00:30:47,565 --> 00:30:49,192
- You're shitting me.
- I'm not.
605
00:30:49,334 --> 00:30:51,268
- Student hit in the spine
at Columbine.
606
00:30:51,402 --> 00:30:53,097
- Okay.
- We've got...
607
00:30:53,237 --> 00:30:55,171
- He's shot in the head.
- He's shot in the head?
608
00:30:55,306 --> 00:30:57,433
- Deputy cashier's office.
- We have automatic weapons,
609
00:30:57,575 --> 00:30:58,940
okay?
- Yes.
610
00:30:59,077 --> 00:31:01,602
- All right. Can you get us lots
and lots of paramedics?
611
00:31:01,746 --> 00:31:05,443
- So he's still under an attack?
- Yes, sir, the school is.
612
00:31:05,583 --> 00:31:08,108
- We got a couple of kids
out in the hall that are shot,
613
00:31:08,252 --> 00:31:11,119
so they're trying to get to
them. Do not let anybody else in
614
00:31:11,255 --> 00:31:14,053
until we tell them.
- Jefferson County 911.
615
00:31:14,192 --> 00:31:15,784
- Hi, it's Izzy Povich
at NBC News.
616
00:31:15,927 --> 00:31:17,758
We're calling about
the school shooting.
617
00:31:17,895 --> 00:31:20,455
We're on the air live
right now on MSNBC.
618
00:31:20,598 --> 00:31:23,066
Can you-- Is that something
you could just, literally,
619
00:31:23,201 --> 00:31:25,328
patch through to my desk,
620
00:31:25,470 --> 00:31:27,904
or you could tell us on the air?
I could put you through
621
00:31:28,039 --> 00:31:29,404
right now--
- I understand that...
622
00:31:29,540 --> 00:31:31,405
- Now they said he's gone
to the library;
623
00:31:31,542 --> 00:31:32,907
he stayed in the building.
624
00:31:33,044 --> 00:31:35,239
He's gone into the library
and he's in the building.
625
00:31:35,380 --> 00:31:37,405
- Hi, this is Stephanie Gold
from Dateline. How you doing?
626
00:31:37,548 --> 00:31:39,072
- Good, how are you?
- Fine, thanks.
627
00:31:39,217 --> 00:31:41,742
- I love your show.
- Oh, I'm so glad. Thank you.
628
00:31:41,886 --> 00:31:44,377
- I watch it every night.
- Thank you.
629
00:31:44,522 --> 00:31:47,252
- Jefferson County 911.
- Yes, I'm a teacher
630
00:31:47,392 --> 00:31:50,691
at Columbine High School. There
is a shooter here with a gun.
631
00:31:50,828 --> 00:31:53,422
He just shot out a window.
- Has anybody been injured?
632
00:31:53,564 --> 00:31:56,931
- Yes! And the school
is in a panic
633
00:31:57,068 --> 00:32:00,435
and I'm in the library.
I've got students down.
634
00:32:00,571 --> 00:32:02,266
Under the tables, kids!
635
00:32:02,407 --> 00:32:04,773
Heads under the tables!
I saw a student outside!
636
00:32:04,909 --> 00:32:07,002
Okay,
637
00:32:07,145 --> 00:32:09,943
I was on hall duty, I saw a gun!
"What's going on out there?!"
638
00:32:10,081 --> 00:32:12,777
He turned the gun straight at us
and he shot, and my God,
639
00:32:12,917 --> 00:32:14,282
the window went out.
640
00:32:14,419 --> 00:32:17,013
The kid standing there with me,
I think he got hit.
641
00:32:17,155 --> 00:32:18,520
- We've got help on the way,
ma'am.
642
00:32:18,656 --> 00:32:20,351
- Oh God!
- Stay on line with me.
643
00:32:20,491 --> 00:32:24,086
- Oh God!
[ gunfire ]
644
00:32:24,228 --> 00:32:26,526
- I think he's shooting
in the library right now.
645
00:32:26,664 --> 00:32:29,360
He's firing shots
from the library.
646
00:32:29,500 --> 00:32:31,127
- Firing shots in the library.
- ...our way.
647
00:32:31,269 --> 00:32:33,965
Do we need to leave?
Okay, hold on.
648
00:32:34,105 --> 00:32:36,198
- ...inside the cafeteria
649
00:32:36,340 --> 00:32:39,104
I'm gonna have to try and get
outta here and call you back.
650
00:32:39,243 --> 00:32:41,541
- I called in before,
trying to find out
651
00:32:41,679 --> 00:32:44,045
where I'm supposed to go
and they put me on hold
652
00:32:44,182 --> 00:32:47,049
for freaking ever!
- Hi, it's Wendy at CNN still.
653
00:32:47,185 --> 00:32:50,120
- Hi. We're just taking names
and numbers for the press.
654
00:32:50,254 --> 00:32:53,712
- Fox has somebody from
your office on now--
655
00:32:53,858 --> 00:32:55,382
- We've talked to
a bunch of people
656
00:32:55,526 --> 00:32:56,993
and we can only do so many,
657
00:32:57,128 --> 00:32:59,062
we got so many more calls
coming in.
658
00:32:59,197 --> 00:33:01,028
- I gotta get to my daughter
at Columbine.
659
00:33:01,165 --> 00:33:03,998
I've been trying for an hour, I
can't get anywhere near there...
660
00:33:04,135 --> 00:33:05,727
- Sir, okay, calm down, okay?
661
00:33:05,870 --> 00:33:08,065
- I think we're entitled
to information as parents
662
00:33:08,206 --> 00:33:11,175
on where our children are!
- We have a lot of units
663
00:33:11,309 --> 00:33:13,436
out there right now.
- I can't get anywhere near it.
664
00:33:13,578 --> 00:33:14,408
I wanna find out
665
00:33:14,545 --> 00:33:16,445
how to get in touch
with my daughter.
666
00:33:16,581 --> 00:33:19,311
How do I get information
on my daughter?
667
00:33:19,450 --> 00:33:20,974
- I don't have that information
right now--
668
00:33:21,118 --> 00:33:23,245
- Why in the hell not?
It's been over an hour!
669
00:33:23,387 --> 00:33:24,752
- My son is Eric Harris,
670
00:33:24,889 --> 00:33:26,914
and I'm afraid
that he might be involved
671
00:33:27,058 --> 00:33:28,719
with the shooting
at Columbine High School.
672
00:33:28,860 --> 00:33:30,760
- Involved how?
673
00:33:30,895 --> 00:33:33,921
- He's a member of what they're
calling the "trench-coat mafia."
674
00:33:34,065 --> 00:33:36,260
- Have you spoken to your son?
- No, I haven't.
675
00:33:36,400 --> 00:33:38,561
Have they picked up anybody yet?
- They're still looking
676
00:33:38,703 --> 00:33:42,195
for suspects. Your son
is with who? What gang?
677
00:33:42,340 --> 00:33:45,537
- They call them the "trench-coat
mafia". I just heard that term
678
00:33:45,676 --> 00:33:47,576
on TV.
- Stay low, because if you try
679
00:33:47,712 --> 00:33:49,737
to leave, I don't want you
to get shot.
680
00:33:49,881 --> 00:33:51,280
Stay very low and quiet.
681
00:33:51,415 --> 00:33:53,110
Low and quiet...
682
00:33:57,021 --> 00:34:00,047
- Everybody just stay quiet.
683
00:34:13,037 --> 00:34:16,438
- When the shooting was over,
Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold
684
00:34:16,574 --> 00:34:20,601
had killed 12 students
and one teacher.
685
00:34:20,745 --> 00:34:24,306
Dozens of others were wounded
by the over-900 rounds of ammo
686
00:34:24,448 --> 00:34:26,973
that were fired. It is believed
that the guns that they used
687
00:34:27,118 --> 00:34:30,554
were all legally purchased
at stores and gun shows.
688
00:34:30,688 --> 00:34:32,747
And many of the bullets
were bought
689
00:34:32,890 --> 00:34:36,257
at the Littleton K-Mart
just down the street.
690
00:34:36,394 --> 00:34:38,794
- Harris's diary also detailed
ideas about hijacking
691
00:34:38,930 --> 00:34:41,558
an airplane and crashing it
into New York City.
692
00:34:41,699 --> 00:34:44,099
Some may characterize that
as fantasy...
693
00:34:44,235 --> 00:34:49,605
- In the end, they turned
the guns on themselves.
694
00:34:49,740 --> 00:34:51,970
- And then he came
into the library,
695
00:34:52,109 --> 00:34:55,601
shot everybody around me,
then put a gun to my head
696
00:34:55,746 --> 00:34:58,647
and asked if we all wanted
to die and...
697
00:34:58,783 --> 00:35:00,808
- We started hearing shots
in the hall
698
00:35:00,952 --> 00:35:03,352
and then they came in
and they all told us
699
00:35:03,487 --> 00:35:06,012
to get under the desk
and we all got under the desk
700
00:35:06,157 --> 00:35:10,150
and then they started coming in
the library and opening fire...
701
00:35:10,294 --> 00:35:12,819
- I just started screaming
and crying and telling them
702
00:35:12,964 --> 00:35:16,229
not to shoot me.
And so he shot the girl,
703
00:35:16,367 --> 00:35:19,097
he shot her in the head
in front of me.
704
00:35:19,236 --> 00:35:23,502
Then he shot the black kid,
because he was black.
705
00:35:26,243 --> 00:35:28,507
- I have only five words for you:
706
00:35:28,613 --> 00:35:31,207
From my cold, dead hands.
707
00:35:31,349 --> 00:35:34,011
[ cheering ]
708
00:35:34,151 --> 00:35:35,812
- Just 10 days after
the Columbine killings,
709
00:35:35,953 --> 00:35:37,352
despite the pleas
710
00:35:37,488 --> 00:35:40,013
of a community in mourning,
711
00:35:40,157 --> 00:35:43,320
Charlton Heston came to Denver
and held a large pro-gun rally
712
00:35:43,461 --> 00:35:45,361
for the National
Rifle Association.
713
00:35:45,496 --> 00:35:48,829
- Good morning.
[ crowd ]: Good morning.
714
00:35:48,966 --> 00:35:50,331
Thank you all
715
00:35:50,468 --> 00:35:55,064
for coming and thank you for
supporting your organization.
716
00:35:55,206 --> 00:35:58,835
I also want to applaud your
courage in coming here today.
717
00:35:58,976 --> 00:36:03,345
I have a message
from the mayor,
718
00:36:03,481 --> 00:36:05,176
Mr. Wellington Webb,
the mayor of Denver.
719
00:36:05,316 --> 00:36:06,681
[ booing ]
720
00:36:06,817 --> 00:36:09,581
- No, no, no, no, no.
721
00:36:09,720 --> 00:36:12,746
He sent me this,
722
00:36:12,890 --> 00:36:16,849
and it says: "Don't come here.
We don't want you here."
723
00:36:16,994 --> 00:36:20,930
I said to the mayor,
"This is our country.
724
00:36:21,065 --> 00:36:24,660
As Americans we're free
to travel wherever we want
725
00:36:24,802 --> 00:36:27,771
in our broad land."
[ applause ]
726
00:36:36,013 --> 00:36:39,881
Don't come here?
We're already here.
727
00:36:40,017 --> 00:36:41,746
[ cheering ]
728
00:36:46,991 --> 00:36:49,459
- I am here today...
729
00:36:49,593 --> 00:36:53,085
because my son Daniel
would want me to be here today.
730
00:37:03,941 --> 00:37:07,570
If my son Daniel
was not one of the victims,
731
00:37:07,712 --> 00:37:10,476
he would be here with me today.
732
00:37:15,086 --> 00:37:18,920
Something is wrong
in this country...
733
00:37:19,056 --> 00:37:21,581
when a child...
734
00:37:21,726 --> 00:37:26,186
can grab a gun...
grab a gun so easily...
735
00:37:26,330 --> 00:37:28,730
and shoot a bullet...
736
00:37:31,836 --> 00:37:36,899
into the middle of a child's
face, as my son experienced.
737
00:37:38,509 --> 00:37:39,908
Something is wrong.
738
00:37:40,044 --> 00:37:44,913
But the time has come
to come to understand
739
00:37:45,049 --> 00:37:49,383
that a Tech-9 semi-automatic
30-bullet weapon
740
00:37:49,520 --> 00:37:52,114
like that that killed my son,
741
00:37:52,256 --> 00:37:54,383
is not used to kill deer.
742
00:37:54,525 --> 00:37:58,120
It has no useful purpose.
743
00:37:58,262 --> 00:38:01,595
It is time to address
this problem.
744
00:38:04,835 --> 00:38:07,395
- We have work to do,
hearts to heal,
745
00:38:07,538 --> 00:38:10,632
evil to defeat
and a country to unite.
746
00:38:10,775 --> 00:38:12,743
We may have differences, yes,
747
00:38:12,877 --> 00:38:16,904
and we will again suffer tragedy
almost beyond description.
748
00:38:17,047 --> 00:38:19,675
But when the sun sets
on Denver tonight,
749
00:38:19,817 --> 00:38:25,016
and forever more, let it
always set on we the people,
750
00:38:25,156 --> 00:38:29,855
secure in our land of the free
and home of the brave.
751
00:38:29,994 --> 00:38:33,361
I, for one, plan to do my part.
752
00:38:33,497 --> 00:38:35,021
Thank you.
753
00:38:35,166 --> 00:38:37,896
[ cheering and clapping ]
754
00:38:38,035 --> 00:38:39,696
- Or like when they had
their convention in Colorado,
755
00:38:42,506 --> 00:38:43,837
a week, whatever,
the month after Columbine,
756
00:38:43,941 --> 00:38:45,203
that was just stupid.
Just don't do that.
757
00:38:45,342 --> 00:38:47,970
Of course you have "the right
to," but what are you doing?
758
00:38:48,112 --> 00:38:50,876
Upsetting a whole city full of
people, why would you do that?
759
00:38:51,015 --> 00:38:54,212
- This is Matt Stone.
He grew up in Littleton
760
00:38:54,351 --> 00:38:56,546
and has fond memories
of Columbine.
761
00:38:56,687 --> 00:38:59,053
- Yeah, Columbine,
it's just a crappy school
762
00:38:59,190 --> 00:39:01,215
in the middle of a bunch
of crappy houses.
763
00:39:01,358 --> 00:39:03,326
- Matt and his friend
Trey Parker
764
00:39:03,460 --> 00:39:05,087
found a way to take out
765
00:39:05,229 --> 00:39:08,164
their anger of being different
in Littleton
766
00:39:08,299 --> 00:39:14,135
and turn it not into carnage,
but into a cartoon.
767
00:39:14,271 --> 00:39:19,538
"Just another Sunday morning
In my quiet...
768
00:39:19,677 --> 00:39:21,804
"Mountain town"
769
00:39:21,946 --> 00:39:24,312
[ music ]
770
00:39:24,448 --> 00:39:27,246
"You can see your breath
Hanging in the air
771
00:39:27,384 --> 00:39:29,511
"You see homeless people
But you just don't care
772
00:39:29,653 --> 00:39:33,020
"It's a sea of smiles
In which we'd be glad to drown
773
00:39:33,157 --> 00:39:35,648
"It's Sunday morning
In our quiet little
774
00:39:35,793 --> 00:39:37,954
"White-bread redneck
mountain town"
775
00:39:38,095 --> 00:39:40,029
- Columbine is a normal
high school--
776
00:39:40,164 --> 00:39:41,756
- Yeah.
- ...in a normal suburb--
777
00:39:41,899 --> 00:39:43,264
- Yeah.
- ...you know, basically.
778
00:39:43,400 --> 00:39:45,095
- Yeah. Painfully, painfully,
painfully normal.
779
00:39:45,236 --> 00:39:48,262
Just absolutely, painfully,
horribly average.
780
00:39:48,405 --> 00:39:51,135
Littleton in general is...
781
00:39:51,275 --> 00:39:54,608
I remember being in sixth grade
and I...
782
00:39:54,745 --> 00:39:57,111
had to take the math test
to get into Honors Math
783
00:39:57,248 --> 00:39:59,113
in the seventh grade.
And they're, like,
784
00:39:59,250 --> 00:40:01,445
"Don't screw this up.
Because if you screw this up,
785
00:40:01,585 --> 00:40:03,610
you won't get into Honors Math
in seventh grade.
786
00:40:03,754 --> 00:40:05,779
And if you don't get in
in seventh grade,
787
00:40:05,923 --> 00:40:08,118
you won't in eighth grade,
then not in ninth grade.
788
00:40:08,259 --> 00:40:10,454
And 10th and 11th grade
and you'll just die poor
789
00:40:10,594 --> 00:40:12,061
and lonely."
And that's it, you know?
790
00:40:12,196 --> 00:40:17,133
You believe, in high school -
and a lot of it is kids,
791
00:40:17,268 --> 00:40:19,463
but the teachers and counsellors
and principals
792
00:40:19,603 --> 00:40:24,063
don't help things.
They scare you into conforming
793
00:40:24,208 --> 00:40:27,075
and doing good in school by
saying: "If you're a loser now,
794
00:40:27,211 --> 00:40:28,906
you're gonna be a loser
forever."
795
00:40:29,046 --> 00:40:31,241
So that with Eric and Dylan,
people called them "fag."
796
00:40:31,382 --> 00:40:32,747
They're like, "You know what?
797
00:40:32,883 --> 00:40:34,908
If I'm a fag,
now I'm a fag forever."
798
00:40:35,052 --> 00:40:37,543
And you wish someone just
could've grabbed them and gone,
799
00:40:37,688 --> 00:40:39,918
"Dude, high school's
not the end of...
800
00:40:40,057 --> 00:40:42,617
A year, a year and a half,
was it? I don't even know.
801
00:40:42,760 --> 00:40:45,593
You just move out--
- No, no, they were two weeks
802
00:40:45,729 --> 00:40:48,755
away from graduation.
- Yeah, you're done.
803
00:40:48,899 --> 00:40:51,265
It's amazing how fast you lose
touch with all those people.
804
00:40:51,402 --> 00:40:54,269
They just beat it in your head
as early as sixth grade:
805
00:40:54,405 --> 00:40:56,100
"Don't fuck up.
'Cause if you do,
806
00:40:56,240 --> 00:40:57,764
you're gonna die poor
and lonely.
807
00:40:57,908 --> 00:40:59,933
You don't want to do that."
You're, like, "Fuck,
808
00:41:00,077 --> 00:41:02,102
whatever I am now,
I'm that forever." Of course,
809
00:41:02,246 --> 00:41:04,441
it's completely opposite.
All the dorks in high school
810
00:41:04,581 --> 00:41:06,947
go on to do great things
and all the really cool guys
811
00:41:07,084 --> 00:41:10,110
are all living back in
Littleton as insurance agents.
812
00:41:10,254 --> 00:41:13,121
Almost person to person,
it's completely that way.
813
00:41:13,257 --> 00:41:15,418
If somebody
could've told them that,
814
00:41:15,559 --> 00:41:17,857
maybe they would've
have done it, but...
815
00:41:17,995 --> 00:41:19,963
- I guess we'll never know
why they did it,
816
00:41:20,097 --> 00:41:22,031
but one thing adults
should never forget:
817
00:41:22,166 --> 00:41:24,726
It still sucks
being a teenager.
818
00:41:24,868 --> 00:41:27,029
And it really sucks
going to school.
819
00:41:27,171 --> 00:41:28,570
- What's your view
on high school?
820
00:41:28,706 --> 00:41:30,071
- Uh, I love it.
821
00:41:30,207 --> 00:41:32,175
Columbine Student Video
822
00:41:32,376 --> 00:41:34,901
Uh, I learn, I get picked on
by bastards who hate me,
823
00:41:35,045 --> 00:41:37,673
and the principal's a dick.
824
00:41:37,815 --> 00:41:39,942
- All right.
What causes school violence?
825
00:41:40,084 --> 00:41:42,075
- Uh... him.
826
00:41:42,219 --> 00:41:45,382
- Him?
- Yeah.
827
00:41:45,522 --> 00:41:48,423
- Yes, and after Columbine,
it really sucked
828
00:41:48,559 --> 00:41:50,083
being a student in America.
829
00:41:50,227 --> 00:41:52,354
[ TV news ]:
Since last spring's shooting,
830
00:41:52,496 --> 00:41:54,760
at Columbine High,
schools nationwide
831
00:41:54,898 --> 00:41:56,866
have extended
zero-tolerance policies,
832
00:41:57,001 --> 00:41:59,595
suspending and expelling
students for all kinds
833
00:41:59,737 --> 00:42:02,433
of behaviour considered unruly,
834
00:42:02,573 --> 00:42:05,098
or warning signs
of violence to come.
835
00:42:05,242 --> 00:42:07,938
This second-grader in Illinois
was suspended for 10 days
836
00:42:08,078 --> 00:42:09,773
for bringing a nail clipper
to class
837
00:42:09,913 --> 00:42:11,608
"That's a weapon,"
his school said.
838
00:42:11,749 --> 00:42:13,842
- An elementary school
suspended a first-grader
839
00:42:13,984 --> 00:42:16,282
for pointing a chicken strip
at a teacher in the cafeteria.
840
00:42:16,420 --> 00:42:19,014
The eight-year-old
was fooling around with a friend
841
00:42:19,156 --> 00:42:22,057
at lunch last week when he
pointed a breaded-chicken finger
842
00:42:22,192 --> 00:42:24,285
at a teacher and then said:
"Pow pow.
843
00:42:24,428 --> 00:42:26,623
- He pointed a folded piece
of paper shaped like a gun,
844
00:42:26,764 --> 00:42:28,959
and told his classmates
he was going to kill them
845
00:42:29,099 --> 00:42:31,294
during a game
of cops and robbers.
846
00:42:31,435 --> 00:42:34,302
- If this isn't a warning sign,
then what is it?
847
00:42:34,438 --> 00:42:36,565
- This Virginia high-school
student spent a month
848
00:42:36,707 --> 00:42:38,197
out of classes,
originally sent home
849
00:42:38,342 --> 00:42:41,038
for dying his hair blue.
- A high-school honour student
850
00:42:41,178 --> 00:42:43,237
from Michigan could be expelled
later today
851
00:42:43,380 --> 00:42:44,813
in a school-board hearing.
852
00:42:44,948 --> 00:42:47,416
Seventeen-year-old Jeremy Hicks
wore a Scottish
853
00:42:47,551 --> 00:42:51,214
bagpiper's outfit to his junior
prom that included
854
00:42:51,355 --> 00:42:54,756
a plaid kilt, a feathered hat
and a traditional knife
855
00:42:54,892 --> 00:42:56,655
known as a "skein dhu."
856
00:42:56,794 --> 00:42:58,318
- This T-shirt
857
00:42:58,462 --> 00:42:59,929
landed a high-school student
in court.
858
00:43:00,064 --> 00:43:02,157
She wanted to start
an anarchy club.
859
00:43:02,299 --> 00:43:04,426
- The little time-bombs
that are out there ticking,
860
00:43:04,568 --> 00:43:07,435
waiting to go off. And there are
many of them in every community.
861
00:43:07,571 --> 00:43:09,937
- Students in at least seven
different states
862
00:43:10,074 --> 00:43:11,632
have been suspended or arrested
863
00:43:11,775 --> 00:43:15,176
for talking about or planning
plots of their own.
864
00:43:15,312 --> 00:43:16,939
- It's almost
like guerrilla warfare.
865
00:43:17,081 --> 00:43:19,049
You don't know
from which direction
866
00:43:19,149 --> 00:43:20,480
the enemy will be coming.
867
00:43:23,287 --> 00:43:24,618
Marketing video from
Garrett Metal Detectors
868
00:43:24,721 --> 00:43:25,949
- Having a well-conceived
and strictly enforced dress code
869
00:43:26,023 --> 00:43:27,422
can dramatically improve
the safety of a school,
870
00:43:27,558 --> 00:43:29,617
and can ensure a positive
learning environment
871
00:43:29,760 --> 00:43:31,125
for everyone.
872
00:43:31,261 --> 00:43:33,525
As this student's appearance
demonstrates,
873
00:43:33,664 --> 00:43:36,724
having a lax policy about dress
makes it easy
874
00:43:36,867 --> 00:43:38,698
for a student
to conceal a weapon
875
00:43:38,836 --> 00:43:42,602
and makes it difficult
to identify intruders on campus.
876
00:43:42,739 --> 00:43:45,401
A dress code can reduce
weapons violations,
877
00:43:45,542 --> 00:43:50,002
relieve tensions between gangs,
reduce disciplinary infractions
878
00:43:50,147 --> 00:43:52,945
and generally improve
the atmosphere of the school.
879
00:43:53,083 --> 00:43:56,314
Our policy requires that
students tuck in their shirts,
880
00:43:56,453 --> 00:43:59,217
making the beltline visible
at all times.
881
00:43:59,356 --> 00:44:01,586
Our students may not wear
baggy pants
882
00:44:01,725 --> 00:44:04,751
or colours or insignias
that are commonly associated
883
00:44:04,895 --> 00:44:06,590
with gang activity.
884
00:44:06,730 --> 00:44:09,528
This policy
was a collaborative effort.
885
00:44:09,666 --> 00:44:13,124
- Yes, our children were indeed
something to fear.
886
00:44:15,339 --> 00:44:18,502
They had turned
into little monsters.
887
00:44:18,642 --> 00:44:20,837
But who was to blame?
888
00:44:20,978 --> 00:44:22,411
All the experts had an answer.
889
00:44:22,546 --> 00:44:26,073
- Angry, heavy-metal subculture.
890
00:44:26,216 --> 00:44:28,582
- Where were the parents?
- Violent movies.
891
00:44:28,719 --> 00:44:31,984
- "South Park." - Video games.
- Television. - Entertainment.
892
00:44:32,122 --> 00:44:34,716
- Satan. - Cartoons.
- Films. - Society. - Toy guns.
893
00:44:34,858 --> 00:44:37,759
- Drugs.
- Shock-rocker Marilyn Manson.
894
00:44:37,895 --> 00:44:40,830
[ all ]: Marilyn Manson.
895
00:44:40,964 --> 00:44:43,558
- Marilyn Manson has cancelled
the last five dates
896
00:44:43,700 --> 00:44:47,067
of his U.S, tour out of respect
for those lost in Littleton.
897
00:44:47,204 --> 00:44:49,604
But the singer
says artists like himself
898
00:44:49,740 --> 00:44:51,605
are not the ones to blame.
899
00:44:53,677 --> 00:44:55,440
- This is perhaps
the sickest group ever promoted
900
00:44:55,546 --> 00:44:58,276
by a mainstream record company.
901
00:44:58,415 --> 00:45:00,508
"I'm not a slave
902
00:45:00,651 --> 00:45:02,175
"to a god
903
00:45:02,319 --> 00:45:05,015
"that doesn't exist"
904
00:45:05,155 --> 00:45:06,918
- After Columbine, it seemed
905
00:45:07,057 --> 00:45:09,491
that the entire focus
on why the shootings occurred
906
00:45:09,626 --> 00:45:10,888
was because the killers
907
00:45:11,028 --> 00:45:13,258
listened to Marilyn Manson.
908
00:45:13,397 --> 00:45:15,262
Two years after Columbine,
909
00:45:15,399 --> 00:45:17,594
Manson finally returned
to Denver.
910
00:45:17,734 --> 00:45:19,565
- The Oz Fest
at Mile High Stadium
911
00:45:19,703 --> 00:45:21,898
brings shock-rocker Marilyn
Manson to Denver tomorrow.
912
00:45:22,039 --> 00:45:25,304
- There were protests
from the religious right.
913
00:45:25,442 --> 00:45:27,535
But I thought I'd go
and talk with him myself.
914
00:45:27,678 --> 00:45:30,078
- When I was a kid growing up,
music was the escape.
915
00:45:30,214 --> 00:45:32,079
That's the only thing
916
00:45:32,216 --> 00:45:36,050
that had no judgements.
You can put on a record
917
00:45:36,186 --> 00:45:39,485
and it's not gonna yell at you
for dressing the way you do.
918
00:45:39,623 --> 00:45:41,818
It's gonna make you
feel better about it.
919
00:45:41,959 --> 00:45:45,156
- Some will be so brash
to ask if we believe
920
00:45:45,295 --> 00:45:47,490
that all who hear Manson
tomorrow night
921
00:45:47,631 --> 00:45:49,861
will go out
and commit violent acts.
922
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:52,992
The answer is "no."
But does everybody
923
00:45:53,136 --> 00:45:56,071
who watches a Lexus ad
go and buy a Lexus?
924
00:45:56,206 --> 00:45:58,333
No. But a few do.
925
00:45:58,475 --> 00:46:01,774
- I definitely can see
why they would pick me,
926
00:46:01,912 --> 00:46:05,313
because I think it's easy
to throw my face on a TV,
927
00:46:05,449 --> 00:46:09,977
because I'm, in the end,
sort of a poster boy for fear.
928
00:46:10,120 --> 00:46:13,453
Because I represent
what everyone's afraid of,
929
00:46:13,590 --> 00:46:15,854
because I do and say
what I want.
930
00:46:15,993 --> 00:46:19,087
- If Marilyn Manson can walk
into our town and promote hate,
931
00:46:19,229 --> 00:46:22,096
violence, suicide,
death, drug use
932
00:46:22,232 --> 00:46:24,029
and Columbine-like behaviour,
933
00:46:24,167 --> 00:46:27,364
I can say, "Not without
a fight, you can't."
934
00:46:27,504 --> 00:46:32,999
- The two by-products of
that whole tragedy were, uh...
935
00:46:33,143 --> 00:46:35,611
violence in entertainment
and gun control.
936
00:46:35,746 --> 00:46:38,874
And how perfect that
that was the two things
937
00:46:39,016 --> 00:46:41,041
that we were gonna talk about
with the upcoming election.
938
00:46:41,184 --> 00:46:43,550
And also, then we forgot
about Monica Lewinsky
939
00:46:43,687 --> 00:46:45,552
and we forgot about...
940
00:46:45,689 --> 00:46:48,055
The president was shooting
bombs overseas,
941
00:46:48,191 --> 00:46:54,061
yet I'm a bad guy because I sing
some rock'n'roll songs.
942
00:46:54,197 --> 00:46:57,064
And who's a bigger influence,
the president or Marilyn Manson?
943
00:46:57,200 --> 00:46:59,828
I'd like to think me, but I'm
gonna go with the president.
944
00:46:59,970 --> 00:47:02,063
- Do you know the day
that Columbine happened,
945
00:47:02,205 --> 00:47:04,571
the United States dropped
more bombs on Kosovo
946
00:47:04,708 --> 00:47:06,573
than any other time
during that war?
947
00:47:06,710 --> 00:47:09,008
- I do know that and I think
that's really ironic,
948
00:47:09,146 --> 00:47:13,082
that nobody said, "Well, maybe
the president had an influence
949
00:47:13,216 --> 00:47:15,081
on this violent behaviour.
950
00:47:15,218 --> 00:47:17,413
Because that's not the way
the media wants to take it
951
00:47:17,554 --> 00:47:19,545
and spin it
and turn it into fear.
952
00:47:19,690 --> 00:47:21,555
'Cause then you're
watching television,
953
00:47:21,692 --> 00:47:24,525
you're watching the news; you're
being pumped full of fear.
954
00:47:24,661 --> 00:47:27,221
And there's floods,
there's AIDS, there's murder.
955
00:47:27,364 --> 00:47:31,027
You cut to commercial,
buy the Acura, buy the Colgate.
956
00:47:31,168 --> 00:47:33,534
If you have bad breath,
they're not gonna talk to you.
957
00:47:33,670 --> 00:47:36,366
If you got pimples,
the girl's not gonna fuck you.
958
00:47:36,506 --> 00:47:40,909
It's a campaign of fear
and consumption.
959
00:47:41,044 --> 00:47:43,035
And that's what I think
that's it's all based on,
960
00:47:43,180 --> 00:47:45,842
is the whole idea that:
keep everyone afraid,
961
00:47:45,982 --> 00:47:49,383
and they'll consume.
And that's really as simple
962
00:47:49,519 --> 00:47:51,749
as it can be boiled down to.
- Right.
963
00:47:51,888 --> 00:47:54,049
If you were to talk directly
to the kids at Columbine
964
00:47:54,191 --> 00:47:56,056
and the people
in that community,
965
00:47:56,193 --> 00:47:58,559
what would you say to them,
if they here right now?
966
00:47:58,695 --> 00:48:00,560
- I wouldn't say
a single word to them.
967
00:48:00,697 --> 00:48:02,562
I would listen to what
they have to say.
968
00:48:02,699 --> 00:48:05,327
And that's what no one did.
969
00:48:05,469 --> 00:48:08,063
- I'm Nicole Shleif.
- And I'm Amanda Lamontagne.
970
00:48:08,205 --> 00:48:10,173
- And you went to Columbine?
- Yes.
971
00:48:10,307 --> 00:48:12,400
- And you were with
Eric and Dylan?
972
00:48:12,542 --> 00:48:14,407
In their class?
- Yeah,
973
00:48:14,544 --> 00:48:17,069
we were in their bowling class.
- In their bowling class?
974
00:48:17,214 --> 00:48:19,079
- Yes.
- What's bowling class?
975
00:48:19,216 --> 00:48:22,913
- Just an elective you can
take for a gym credit.
976
00:48:23,053 --> 00:48:25,544
- Where's the educational value
of this, though?
977
00:48:28,158 --> 00:48:30,023
- Um... I guess
there isn't really any.
978
00:48:30,160 --> 00:48:32,025
- No, there's not.
979
00:48:32,162 --> 00:48:36,292
- I learned how to bowl a lot
better, that's for sure.
980
00:48:36,433 --> 00:48:38,526
- What were Eric Harris
and Dylan Klebold like?
981
00:48:38,668 --> 00:48:40,533
- Weird.
- Yeah?
982
00:48:40,670 --> 00:48:42,535
- I mean, not very social.
983
00:48:42,672 --> 00:48:44,537
- I didn't really know
who they were.
984
00:48:44,674 --> 00:48:48,166
- Not very social, just
kinda kept to themselves.
985
00:48:48,311 --> 00:48:50,643
- How good a bowlers
were Eric and Dylan?
986
00:48:50,781 --> 00:48:53,113
- When we played them,
987
00:48:53,250 --> 00:48:55,548
all I remember is they
were just, like, crazy.
988
00:48:55,685 --> 00:48:57,949
They would just chuck the ball.
- Chuck it down there.
989
00:48:58,088 --> 00:49:01,057
- Throw the ball down; didn't
really care how they bowled.
990
00:49:01,191 --> 00:49:03,352
- Yeah, they didn't really
care about their scores.
991
00:49:03,493 --> 00:49:05,461
Deputy Sheriff Steve Davis - What were
the suspects doing the morning of attack?
992
00:49:05,529 --> 00:49:07,190
I told you that I'd heard
that they were bowling;
993
00:49:07,330 --> 00:49:09,093
that's the only thing
I'm aware of.
994
00:49:09,232 --> 00:49:12,065
- So did Dylan and Eric
show up that morning
995
00:49:12,202 --> 00:49:14,261
and bowl two games
before moving on
996
00:49:14,404 --> 00:49:16,269
to shoot up the school?
997
00:49:16,406 --> 00:49:18,738
And did they just chuck
the balls down the lane?
998
00:49:18,875 --> 00:49:20,740
Did this mean something?
999
00:49:20,877 --> 00:49:23,903
- Um, I guess they went
to their favourite class.
1000
00:49:26,016 --> 00:49:27,540
- Why wasn't anyone
blaming bowling
1001
00:49:27,684 --> 00:49:28,844
for warping the minds
of Eric and Dylan
1002
00:49:28,952 --> 00:49:30,647
to commit their evil deeds?
1003
00:49:30,787 --> 00:49:35,156
Wasn't that just as plausible
as blaming Marilyn Manson?
1004
00:49:35,292 --> 00:49:37,192
After all,
1005
00:49:37,327 --> 00:49:39,192
it was apparently
the last thing they did
1006
00:49:39,329 --> 00:49:41,991
before the massacre.
1007
00:49:42,132 --> 00:49:44,862
But wait a minute. There's
lots of bowling going on
1008
00:49:45,001 --> 00:49:48,493
in other countries.
1009
00:49:48,638 --> 00:49:51,004
And don't they listen
to Marilyn Manson in Germany,
1010
00:49:51,141 --> 00:49:53,075
the home of sinister
Goth music?
1011
00:49:53,210 --> 00:49:55,337
- Some Gothic festival.
"Ah"
1012
00:49:55,479 --> 00:49:58,812
- Don't they watch the same
violent movies in France?
1013
00:50:02,786 --> 00:50:05,584
Most of the violent video
games are from Japan.
1014
00:50:08,225 --> 00:50:09,522
Many people in America believe
1015
00:50:09,659 --> 00:50:12,093
that it's the break-up
of the family unit
1016
00:50:12,229 --> 00:50:14,129
that's caused so many wayward
youth to turn to violence.
1017
00:50:14,264 --> 00:50:16,630
- I'll save you the trouble.
I'll run away and kill myself!
1018
00:50:16,766 --> 00:50:19,132
How would you like that?
You can't keep me here!
1019
00:50:19,269 --> 00:50:20,759
- But statistics show
1020
00:50:20,904 --> 00:50:22,997
that there are more
broken homes and divorce
1021
00:50:23,139 --> 00:50:24,834
in Great Britain
than in the U.S.
1022
00:50:24,975 --> 00:50:28,672
- It's official:
Fergie's marriage has ended.
1023
00:50:28,812 --> 00:50:32,407
- Liberals contend that it's all
the poverty we have in America
1024
00:50:32,549 --> 00:50:34,346
that causes all this violence.
1025
00:50:34,484 --> 00:50:36,577
But the unemployment rate
in Canada
1026
00:50:36,720 --> 00:50:39,587
is twice what it is here.
Of course, most people say
1027
00:50:39,723 --> 00:50:42,487
it's because we Americans
have a violent history,
1028
00:50:42,626 --> 00:50:44,856
a violent past.
Cowboys and Indians,
1029
00:50:44,995 --> 00:50:47,020
the Wild West,
1030
00:50:47,163 --> 00:50:49,097
a history of conquering
and bloodshed.
1031
00:50:49,232 --> 00:50:51,097
Well, if that's all
it takes to end up
1032
00:50:51,234 --> 00:50:53,464
with such a violent society
1033
00:50:53,603 --> 00:50:55,503
like we have in America,
how do you explain this?
1034
00:50:56,306 --> 00:50:58,706
GERMANS EXTERMINATE 12 MILLION
1035
00:51:00,944 --> 00:51:03,037
JAPANESE OCCUPATION OF CHINA
1036
00:51:06,683 --> 00:51:09,777
FRENCH MASSACRE IN ALGIERS
1037
00:51:12,756 --> 00:51:15,589
BRITISH SLAUGHTER IN INDIA
1038
00:51:17,027 --> 00:51:19,018
Yet in spite of all this,
1039
00:51:19,162 --> 00:51:20,527
how many people are killed
by guns each year?
1040
00:51:22,632 --> 00:51:24,725
In Germany:
1041
00:51:26,469 --> 00:51:28,130
In France:
1042
00:51:31,107 --> 00:51:33,405
In Canada:
1043
00:51:36,179 --> 00:51:38,147
In the United Kingdom:
1044
00:51:41,117 --> 00:51:43,142
In Australia:
1045
00:51:45,722 --> 00:51:46,950
In Japan:
1046
00:51:49,759 --> 00:51:51,659
In the United States:
1047
00:51:56,232 --> 00:51:59,998
- But that, to me, brings up
an important question:
1048
00:52:00,136 --> 00:52:02,604
Then what is so different
about Americans?
1049
00:52:02,739 --> 00:52:04,866
Tom Mauser
Father of Columbine victim
1050
00:52:05,075 --> 00:52:06,201
Are we homicidal in nature?
1051
00:52:07,611 --> 00:52:10,512
Because in Europe and Australia,
1052
00:52:10,647 --> 00:52:13,115
most other free-world countries,
they don't have this.
1053
00:52:13,249 --> 00:52:16,616
They don't have people who snap
and go on murderous rampages.
1054
00:52:16,753 --> 00:52:19,221
- Well, no, they're just like us.
They have the occasional person
1055
00:52:19,356 --> 00:52:21,620
that snaps and kills
a lot of people.
1056
00:52:21,758 --> 00:52:24,591
How about a British soccer riot?
Those aren't Quakers there,
1057
00:52:24,728 --> 00:52:26,719
- Every time that
I bring up comparisons
1058
00:52:26,863 --> 00:52:28,728
with other free-world countries,
what I hear is:
1059
00:52:28,865 --> 00:52:30,890
"Oh, our culture is so
different. We're so different."
1060
00:52:31,034 --> 00:52:33,059
And as you said, they have
violent video games,
1061
00:52:33,203 --> 00:52:36,070
they have violent movies,
they have alienated youth,
1062
00:52:36,206 --> 00:52:39,073
they - like us - don't have
prayer in schools.
1063
00:52:39,209 --> 00:52:43,441
What is so radically different?
What is it about us?
1064
00:52:43,580 --> 00:52:45,571
- What is it?
- What is it?
1065
00:52:45,949 --> 00:52:47,576
- What is it?
- What is it?
1066
00:52:47,717 --> 00:52:50,447
I don't know.
1067
00:52:52,889 --> 00:52:55,619
- Now, it's time for...
1068
00:52:55,725 --> 00:52:57,886
Hi, boys and girls.
Ready to get started?
1069
00:52:58,028 --> 00:52:59,962
Once upon a time, there were
these people in Europe
1070
00:53:00,096 --> 00:53:03,964
called pilgrims and they were
afraid of being persecuted.
1071
00:53:04,100 --> 00:53:06,728
So they all got in a boat
and sailed to the New World
1072
00:53:06,870 --> 00:53:09,532
where they wouldn't have
to be scared ever again.
1073
00:53:09,673 --> 00:53:12,437
- Oh, I'm so relaxed.
- I feel so much safer.
1074
00:53:12,575 --> 00:53:15,567
- But as soon as they arrived,
they were greeted by savages.
1075
00:53:15,712 --> 00:53:17,907
They got scared all over again.
- Injuns!
1076
00:53:18,048 --> 00:53:19,675
- So they killed them all.
Now, you'd think
1077
00:53:19,816 --> 00:53:22,376
wiping out a race of people
would calm them down, but no.
1078
00:53:22,519 --> 00:53:24,749
Instead, they started getting
frightened of each other.
1079
00:53:24,888 --> 00:53:27,049
[ both ]: Witch!
- So they burned witches.
1080
00:53:27,190 --> 00:53:28,555
In 1775,
1081
00:53:28,692 --> 00:53:31,456
they started killing the
British, so they could be free.
1082
00:53:31,594 --> 00:53:34,358
And it worked.
But they still didn't feel safe.
1083
00:53:34,497 --> 00:53:37,523
So they passed a 2nd amendment,
which said every white man
1084
00:53:37,667 --> 00:53:39,828
could keep his gun.
- I loves my gun, loves my gun.
1085
00:53:39,969 --> 00:53:42,767
- This brings us to
the genius idea of slavery.
1086
00:53:42,906 --> 00:53:44,840
You see, boys and girls,
the white people back then
1087
00:53:44,974 --> 00:53:47,306
were also afraid of doing any
work. So they went to Africa,
1088
00:53:47,444 --> 00:53:49,605
kidnapped thousands of black
people, brought them to America,
1089
00:53:49,746 --> 00:53:51,873
and forced them to work
very hard for no money.
1090
00:53:52,015 --> 00:53:53,880
And I don't mean no money like:
1091
00:53:54,017 --> 00:53:55,780
"I work at Wal-Mart
and make no money."
1092
00:53:55,919 --> 00:53:58,080
I mean zero dollars.
Nothing, nada, zip.
1093
00:53:58,221 --> 00:54:00,086
Doing it that way made the USA
1094
00:54:00,223 --> 00:54:01,918
the richest country
in the world.
1095
00:54:02,058 --> 00:54:04,083
So did having all that money
and free help
1096
00:54:04,227 --> 00:54:07,094
calm the white people down? No
way. They got even more afraid.
1097
00:54:07,230 --> 00:54:09,460
That's because after
200 years of slavery,
1098
00:54:09,599 --> 00:54:11,999
the black people now outnumbered
the white people in many parts
1099
00:54:12,135 --> 00:54:14,365
of the South. Well, you can
pretty much what came next.
1100
00:54:14,504 --> 00:54:16,404
The slaves started rebelling.
There were uprisings
1101
00:54:16,539 --> 00:54:18,234
and old masters' heads
got chopped off
1102
00:54:18,374 --> 00:54:20,672
and when white people heard of
this, they were freaking out.
1103
00:54:20,810 --> 00:54:22,607
They going:
- I want to live!
1104
00:54:22,746 --> 00:54:24,509
Don't kill me, big black man.
1105
00:54:24,647 --> 00:54:27,582
- Well, just in the nick of time
came Samuel Colt, who,
1106
00:54:27,717 --> 00:54:30,515
in 1836, invented the first
weapon ever that could be fired
1107
00:54:30,653 --> 00:54:32,416
over and over without
having to reload.
1108
00:54:32,555 --> 00:54:35,183
And all the settlers were, like:
- Yee-hah!
1109
00:54:35,325 --> 00:54:38,453
- But it was too late.
The North soon won the Civil War
1110
00:54:38,595 --> 00:54:43,123
and the slaves were free to go
chop the old masters' heads off.
1111
00:54:43,266 --> 00:54:45,496
Then everybody was, like:
- Oh, no, we're gonna die.
1112
00:54:45,635 --> 00:54:48,001
- But the freed slaves
took no revenge.
1113
00:54:48,138 --> 00:54:50,572
They just wanted
to live in peace.
1114
00:54:50,707 --> 00:54:53,301
But you couldn't convince
the white people of this.
1115
00:54:53,443 --> 00:54:56,435
So they formed the Ku Klux Klan
and, in 1871,
1116
00:54:56,579 --> 00:54:59,548
the same year the Klan became an
illegal terrorist organization,
1117
00:54:59,682 --> 00:55:03,379
another group was founded:
the National Rifle Association.
1118
00:55:03,520 --> 00:55:05,488
Soon, politicians passed
one of the first gun laws,
1119
00:55:05,622 --> 00:55:08,750
making it illegal for any black
person to own one.
1120
00:55:08,892 --> 00:55:12,123
It was a great year for America.
he KKK and the NRA.
1121
00:55:12,262 --> 00:55:14,127
Of course, they had nothing
to do with each other;
1122
00:55:14,264 --> 00:55:16,892
it was a coincidence. One group
legally promoted responsible
1123
00:55:17,033 --> 00:55:19,900
gun ownership; the other shot
and lynched black people.
1124
00:55:20,036 --> 00:55:22,231
That's the way it was till
1955, when a black woman
1125
00:55:22,372 --> 00:55:25,273
broke the law by refusing to
move to the back of the bus.
1126
00:55:25,408 --> 00:55:26,670
White people just couldn't
believe it.
1127
00:55:26,810 --> 00:55:29,973
- Huh? Why won't she move?
- What's going on?
1128
00:55:30,113 --> 00:55:33,048
- Man, all hell broke loose.
Black people everywhere demanded
1129
00:55:33,183 --> 00:55:36,914
their rights. White people had
a major, freaky-feel meltdown
1130
00:55:37,053 --> 00:55:39,544
and they were all, like:
- Run away! Run away!
1131
00:55:39,689 --> 00:55:41,714
- And they did. They all ran
fleeing to the suburbs,
1132
00:55:41,858 --> 00:55:44,326
where it was all white and safe
and clean. And they went out
1133
00:55:44,460 --> 00:55:46,325
and bought a
quarter-of-a-billion guns.
1134
00:55:46,462 --> 00:55:48,396
And put locks on their doors,
alarms in their houses,
1135
00:55:48,531 --> 00:55:50,726
and gates around the
neighbourhoods.
1136
00:55:50,867 --> 00:55:54,667
And finally, they were all safe
and secure and snug as a bug.
1137
00:55:59,809 --> 00:56:03,836
And everyone lived
happily ever after.
1138
00:56:15,091 --> 00:56:16,752
- Because if you turn on
the evening news,
1139
00:56:16,893 --> 00:56:20,624
America still seems
like a pretty scary place.
1140
00:56:20,763 --> 00:56:23,926
- Who is he? Is he dangerous?
What's he up to?
1141
00:56:26,870 --> 00:56:28,462
- What are you trying
to pull, man?
1142
00:56:28,605 --> 00:56:30,004
- Remember all the Y2Kscares?
1143
00:56:30,139 --> 00:56:33,472
Weren't we told that our very
society was about to collapse
1144
00:56:33,610 --> 00:56:35,100
because somebody forgot
1145
00:56:35,245 --> 00:56:37,179
to type in a couple of digits
on the computer?
1146
00:56:37,313 --> 00:56:39,611
- There's gonna be mass
chaos and confusion.
1147
00:56:39,749 --> 00:56:41,114
- Tonight, the countdown begins.
1148
00:56:41,251 --> 00:56:43,116
All day, store director
Rick Smith
1149
00:56:43,253 --> 00:56:47,485
watched consumers get Y2K ready.
- Batteries sell extremely well.
1150
00:56:47,624 --> 00:56:50,388
The lamp oil, generators.
1151
00:56:50,526 --> 00:56:52,619
- After sending the country
into a panic,
1152
00:56:52,762 --> 00:56:54,957
the clock struck midnight...
1153
00:56:55,098 --> 00:56:57,760
And nothing happened.
1154
00:56:57,901 --> 00:56:59,892
Or how about those killer bees
1155
00:57:00,036 --> 00:57:02,061
that were going
to attack America?
1156
00:57:02,205 --> 00:57:04,730
- We're almost certain
they'll arrive this year.
1157
00:57:04,874 --> 00:57:07,468
- Shmidt expects the Africanized
bees to reach Texas this year,
1158
00:57:07,610 --> 00:57:09,840
cross into Arizona in about
two to three years.
1159
00:57:09,979 --> 00:57:13,312
He's concerned because the
killer bee is overly aggressive.
1160
00:57:13,449 --> 00:57:15,917
- They will follow you
for half a mile.
1161
00:57:16,052 --> 00:57:18,577
- The bees never came.
1162
00:57:18,721 --> 00:57:21,189
Remember the first time
you heard
1163
00:57:21,324 --> 00:57:24,088
that someone had hidden a razor
blade in an apple at Halloween?
1164
00:57:24,227 --> 00:57:25,751
Before long,
1165
00:57:25,895 --> 00:57:28,159
kids were not permitted to go
out in the dark on Halloween
1166
00:57:28,298 --> 00:57:30,664
and go trick-or-treating
at strangers' homes.
1167
00:57:30,800 --> 00:57:32,859
- Many people say they won't give
out candy treats on Halloween.
1168
00:57:33,002 --> 00:57:35,664
It's too dangerous
and they're too scared.
1169
00:57:35,805 --> 00:57:37,272
- Well, guess what?
1170
00:57:37,407 --> 00:57:39,170
There never was any
razor blade in the apple.
1171
00:57:39,309 --> 00:57:41,402
In fact, only two kids
1172
00:57:41,544 --> 00:57:45,207
in the past 40 years have been
killed by Halloween candy.
1173
00:57:45,348 --> 00:57:47,578
And both of them were poisoned
on purpose by relatives.
1174
00:57:47,717 --> 00:57:49,275
- Bye.
1175
00:57:49,419 --> 00:57:51,853
[ reporter]: It was like
a scene from a horror movie.
1176
00:57:51,988 --> 00:57:55,287
This man was mowing his lawn
when a fox darted out
1177
00:57:55,425 --> 00:57:57,791
of the woods and attacked
his riding-mower.
1178
00:57:57,927 --> 00:58:00,191
- A warning about a popular
weight-loss supplement.
1179
00:58:00,330 --> 00:58:02,298
What you don't know
may kill you.
1180
00:58:02,432 --> 00:58:04,559
- You ride them every day,
but in an instant,
1181
00:58:04,701 --> 00:58:07,795
an escalator can mangle you
or a loved one.
1182
00:58:07,937 --> 00:58:11,304
- We reveal why you may be
riding on stairway to danger.
1183
00:58:11,441 --> 00:58:12,373
- You might want to take
some extra precautions:
1184
00:58:12,508 --> 00:58:15,033
keep a low profile,
don't go around dancing
1185
00:58:15,178 --> 00:58:17,738
with a bunch of Americans
in the streets.
1186
00:58:17,880 --> 00:58:20,678
Make sure that you don't draw
a lot of attention to yourself
1187
00:58:20,817 --> 00:58:22,148
and the fact
that you're American.
1188
00:58:22,285 --> 00:58:24,753
- Nation's top doctor says
one in five Americans
1189
00:58:24,887 --> 00:58:26,718
suffers some form
of mental disorder.
1190
00:58:26,856 --> 00:58:29,347
The surgeon general David
Satcher pleads with people
1191
00:58:29,492 --> 00:58:31,221
to seek help now.
1192
00:58:31,361 --> 00:58:34,990
- The media, the corporations,
the politicians,
1193
00:58:35,131 --> 00:58:39,192
have all done such a good job
of scaring the American public,
1194
00:58:39,335 --> 00:58:42,031
it's come to the point
where they don't need to give
1195
00:58:42,171 --> 00:58:44,162
any reason at all.
1196
00:58:44,307 --> 00:58:47,003
- Today, the Justice Department
did issue a...
1197
00:58:47,143 --> 00:58:49,577
a blanket alert.
1198
00:58:52,181 --> 00:58:55,275
It was in recognition of a
general threat we received.
1199
00:58:55,418 --> 00:58:58,546
Uh, this is not the first time
1200
00:58:58,688 --> 00:59:00,952
the Justice Department
have acted like this.
1201
00:59:01,090 --> 00:59:03,490
I hope it's the last.
1202
00:59:03,626 --> 00:59:07,528
But given the attitude of
the evildoers, it may not be.
1203
00:59:14,103 --> 00:59:16,003
- I just love these boulevards
down here, though.
1204
00:59:16,105 --> 00:59:17,697
You don't get this
in most of L.A.
1205
00:59:17,874 --> 00:59:19,171
South Central
Los Angeles
1206
00:59:19,375 --> 00:59:21,240
- How come whenever
I'm out here, though,
1207
00:59:21,310 --> 00:59:23,574
I turn on the 11-o'clock news
and I hear, you know:
1208
00:59:23,713 --> 00:59:26,079
"Tonight in South Central,
drive-by shooting."
1209
00:59:26,215 --> 00:59:28,080
Or: "Tonight in South
Central..."
1210
00:59:28,317 --> 00:59:30,683
Prof. Barry Glassner
Author, "The Culture of Fear"
1211
00:59:30,887 --> 00:59:33,082
...this, that or whatever. I mean,
they're not making that up, are they?
1212
00:59:33,222 --> 00:59:35,986
- No, they're not making it up,
but they're choosing
1213
00:59:36,125 --> 00:59:39,390
what they're covering. If you
turn on the TV, on the news,
1214
00:59:39,529 --> 00:59:41,895
what are you gonna hear about?
1215
00:59:42,031 --> 00:59:45,967
Dangerous black guys, right?
Unnamed black guy who, you know,
1216
00:59:46,102 --> 00:59:49,162
accused of some crime or...
- Right.
1217
00:59:49,305 --> 00:59:52,103
- You're gonna see pictures
of black guys doing bad things,
1218
00:59:52,241 --> 00:59:54,607
and hearing stories about black
guys doing bad things.
1219
00:59:54,744 --> 00:59:56,609
And we've heard this
our whole lives.
1220
00:59:56,746 --> 00:59:58,976
- Now, the suspect is a black
male in his twenties.
1221
00:59:59,115 --> 01:00:01,106
We are told he has
a large afro, sideburns,
1222
01:00:01,250 --> 01:00:03,377
he was wearing a
silver chain at the time.
1223
01:00:03,519 --> 01:00:05,612
- Police say the suspect
is a black man.
1224
01:00:05,755 --> 01:00:10,124
Six foot one, 160 to 180 pounds,
about 35 years in age.
1225
01:00:10,259 --> 01:00:12,921
- Suspect is a black male,
age 16 to 18.
1226
01:00:13,062 --> 01:00:15,030
- The suspect is
African-American.
1227
01:00:15,164 --> 01:00:16,461
Police believe--
- Police say--
1228
01:00:16,599 --> 01:00:18,965
- The black man--
[ several ]: Suspect--
1229
01:00:19,102 --> 01:00:21,229
- The suspect is a black male
- A black man.
1230
01:00:21,370 --> 01:00:23,600
[ various voices ]:
A black... black... black...
1231
01:00:23,739 --> 01:00:24,865
- A black man.
1232
01:00:25,007 --> 01:00:27,498
- Susan Smith drowns
her two children.
1233
01:00:27,643 --> 01:00:30,077
She tells people a black guy...
- Correct.
1234
01:00:30,213 --> 01:00:33,341
- Stole the car
and stole the kids.
1235
01:00:33,483 --> 01:00:36,008
And everyone, at first,
bought it.
1236
01:00:36,152 --> 01:00:39,144
- Some guy jumped into her car,
with her two kids in it.
1237
01:00:39,288 --> 01:00:41,381
Then he took off.
That's a black guy, she says.
1238
01:00:41,524 --> 01:00:43,958
- Black male?
- Yes, Ma'am.
1239
01:00:44,093 --> 01:00:46,857
- And I told them I loved them.
I hollered I loved them
1240
01:00:46,996 --> 01:00:49,123
And it's just a tragedy.
1241
01:00:49,265 --> 01:00:53,133
- The anonymous urban -
which means usually black -
1242
01:00:53,269 --> 01:00:55,100
male, comes by and does this.
1243
01:00:55,238 --> 01:00:57,365
It's the excuse
for all kinds of things.
1244
01:00:57,507 --> 01:00:59,065
- Charles Stewart,
a lawyer in Boston...
1245
01:00:59,208 --> 01:01:01,176
- Right, exactly.
- ...kills his pregnant wife,
1246
01:01:01,310 --> 01:01:03,642
says a black guy did it;
everybody buys it.
1247
01:01:03,779 --> 01:01:06,805
- The suspect described as a
black male about six feet tall.
1248
01:01:06,949 --> 01:01:09,179
Chuck and Carol Stewart
were robbed at gunpoint
1249
01:01:09,318 --> 01:01:11,183
as they left a Lamaze class.
1250
01:01:11,320 --> 01:01:13,311
It seemed the ultimate
urban nightmare.
1251
01:01:13,456 --> 01:01:15,720
- You know, the thing I love
about this country of mine,
1252
01:01:15,858 --> 01:01:18,349
is that whether you're
a psychotic killer
1253
01:01:18,494 --> 01:01:20,985
or running for president
of the United States,
1254
01:01:21,130 --> 01:01:23,564
the one thing you can
always count on
1255
01:01:23,699 --> 01:01:26,827
is white America's fear
of the black man.
1256
01:01:26,969 --> 01:01:29,836
- We've heard the stories
on the news and in the papers
1257
01:01:29,972 --> 01:01:31,837
and they have killed people.
1258
01:01:31,974 --> 01:01:33,669
Killer bees, also known
1259
01:01:33,809 --> 01:01:35,276
as "Africanized" bees.
1260
01:01:35,411 --> 01:01:37,675
- I'm scared. I'm really worried.
1261
01:01:37,813 --> 01:01:41,010
- Rose Shipley never expected a
nest of Africanized killer bees
1262
01:01:41,150 --> 01:01:43,345
to shack up across the street
from her.
1263
01:01:43,486 --> 01:01:46,512
- But I'm terribly allergic
to them and so are my grandkids.
1264
01:01:46,656 --> 01:01:48,214
- They're originally from
southern and eastern Africa.
1265
01:01:48,357 --> 01:01:52,054
Dr. Warrick Care brought some
to Brazil in 1956
1266
01:01:52,195 --> 01:01:54,186
and tried to mate them
1267
01:01:54,330 --> 01:01:57,094
with the European bee,
the kind that we're used to.
1268
01:01:57,233 --> 01:02:00,634
But they got loose and moved
to the southern United States.
1269
01:02:00,770 --> 01:02:02,237
- The main difference between
a traditional honey bee
1270
01:02:02,371 --> 01:02:05,431
and an Africanized bee is
the bee's aggressiveness.
1271
01:02:05,575 --> 01:02:08,738
If I was to do this
to an Africanized bee's hive,
1272
01:02:08,878 --> 01:02:12,041
I could have several hundred
stings in a matter of minutes.
1273
01:02:12,181 --> 01:02:14,479
- Danny Self raises the kinder,
gentler European bees,
1274
01:02:14,617 --> 01:02:16,107
and he's done the research.
1275
01:02:16,252 --> 01:02:17,947
- The only way that you can tell
1276
01:02:18,087 --> 01:02:20,817
the two of them, is doing
measurements on the body parts.
1277
01:02:20,957 --> 01:02:23,687
- Quite frankly,
the black community has become
1278
01:02:23,826 --> 01:02:26,158
entertainment for the rest
of the community.
1279
01:02:26,229 --> 01:02:27,662
- Meaning what?
1280
01:02:27,863 --> 01:02:29,125
Arthur Busch
County Prosecutor - Flint, Michigan
1281
01:02:29,198 --> 01:02:31,063
- The entertainment being
that the crime of the day -
1282
01:02:31,200 --> 01:02:33,065
you know, "If it bleeds,
it leads" -
1283
01:02:33,202 --> 01:02:37,070
gets to be the front story and
then that becomes the perception
1284
01:02:37,206 --> 01:02:40,573
and the image of
an entire people.
1285
01:02:40,710 --> 01:02:43,577
Which couldn't be further
from the truth, in my opinion.
1286
01:02:43,713 --> 01:02:46,580
In fact, you'll find, I think,
1287
01:02:46,716 --> 01:02:49,810
most African-Americans are quite
adverse to gun possession.
1288
01:02:51,887 --> 01:02:53,650
In suburbia, I think,
1289
01:02:53,823 --> 01:02:55,654
there's some notion that there's
going to be an invading horde,
1290
01:02:55,791 --> 01:02:59,818
come from either the city
or from someplace unknown,
1291
01:02:59,962 --> 01:03:03,261
to savage their suburban
community.
1292
01:03:03,399 --> 01:03:09,167
To me, not only is it bizarre,
but it's totally, uh...
1293
01:03:09,305 --> 01:03:11,773
unfounded.
1294
01:03:11,907 --> 01:03:13,534
And these pistols,
curiously enough,
1295
01:03:13,676 --> 01:03:17,112
weren't being taken off kids
in the city of Flint,
1296
01:03:17,246 --> 01:03:20,113
but were being taken off of kids
out in the out-county area,
1297
01:03:20,249 --> 01:03:24,049
in the suburban communities.
And--
1298
01:03:24,186 --> 01:03:26,051
- I didn't think that's
what you were gonna say.
1299
01:03:26,188 --> 01:03:29,055
I thought you were gonna say
that it's all these black kids
1300
01:03:29,191 --> 01:03:31,056
in the inner-city schools
that had these guns.
1301
01:03:31,193 --> 01:03:33,559
- No, that's...
1302
01:03:33,696 --> 01:03:38,565
We've never really had many
problems with guns in the city.
1303
01:03:38,701 --> 01:03:41,067
Not to say that we haven't;
we've had some.
1304
01:03:41,203 --> 01:03:43,068
But that's never been
the biggest problem.
1305
01:03:43,205 --> 01:03:45,571
The biggest problem has been
the gun possession
1306
01:03:45,708 --> 01:03:49,200
by these adolescents
in suburbia.
1307
01:03:49,345 --> 01:03:51,711
- How'd you get a gun?
1308
01:03:51,847 --> 01:03:54,577
- I stole mine. I stole it
from a friend of mine.
1309
01:03:54,717 --> 01:03:56,412
His dad owns a bunch of guns.
1310
01:03:56,552 --> 01:03:58,417
- What we're you doing
with the stolen guns?
1311
01:03:58,554 --> 01:04:00,419
- We went down to Detroit
and started selling them.
1312
01:04:00,556 --> 01:04:04,549
'Cause I can get, like, a buck
fifty a pop for a 9-millimetre.
1313
01:04:04,694 --> 01:04:07,561
- Oh, really. Who were you trying
to sell them to?
1314
01:04:07,697 --> 01:04:10,723
- Anybody that would really want
'em. Gangs and stuff like that.
1315
01:04:10,866 --> 01:04:14,029
- Gangs in the city of Detroit?
- Yeah.
1316
01:04:14,170 --> 01:04:15,933
- Black?
- Uh, predominantly. Yeah.
1317
01:04:16,072 --> 01:04:17,937
- Yeah. So now you're out now,
you're okay.
1318
01:04:18,074 --> 01:04:19,939
- Yeah, I'm free now.
I'm completely clear.
1319
01:04:20,076 --> 01:04:22,442
- You can keep selling guns.
- I can't keep selling guns.
1320
01:04:22,578 --> 01:04:24,375
It's getting too risky.
Everybody knows me up here.
1321
01:04:24,513 --> 01:04:27,380
People want guns, drugs or
alcohol, they come to my house
1322
01:04:27,516 --> 01:04:29,040
and that's just too much.
1323
01:04:29,185 --> 01:04:31,016
- Yeah, too much hassle.
- Yeah.
1324
01:04:31,153 --> 01:04:37,217
- My favourite statistic in all
the research I did discovered
1325
01:04:37,360 --> 01:04:41,456
that the murder rate had gone
down by 20%. The coverage -
1326
01:04:41,597 --> 01:04:45,055
that is, how many murders are
on the evening news -
1327
01:04:45,201 --> 01:04:47,396
it went up by 600%.
1328
01:04:47,536 --> 01:04:52,064
- The American people are
conditioned by network TV,
1329
01:04:52,208 --> 01:04:54,073
by local news,
1330
01:04:54,210 --> 01:04:56,075
to believe that
their communities are
1331
01:04:56,212 --> 01:04:59,079
much more dangerous
than they actually are.
1332
01:04:59,215 --> 01:05:01,080
For example, here,
in this community,
1333
01:05:01,217 --> 01:05:05,085
crime has decreased every year
for the past eight years.
1334
01:05:05,221 --> 01:05:07,382
Yet, gun ownership,
particularly handgun ownership,
1335
01:05:07,523 --> 01:05:09,388
is on the increase.
1336
01:05:09,525 --> 01:05:12,085
- Crime rates have been
dropping, dropping, dropping.
1337
01:05:12,228 --> 01:05:15,595
Fear of crime has been going
up, up, up.
1338
01:05:15,731 --> 01:05:18,097
How can that be possible?
It doesn't make any sense.
1339
01:05:18,234 --> 01:05:21,601
But it makes perfect sense
when you see what we're hearing
1340
01:05:21,737 --> 01:05:24,638
from politicians and seeing
in the news media.
1341
01:05:24,774 --> 01:05:26,799
- So we're, uh, we're right here
1342
01:05:26,942 --> 01:05:29,433
on the corner of Florence
and Normandie.
1343
01:05:29,578 --> 01:05:31,443
It's kind of Ground Zero
for the L.A. riots.
1344
01:05:31,580 --> 01:05:32,740
- Right.
1345
01:05:32,882 --> 01:05:35,908
- You know, if a couple
of white guys
1346
01:05:36,051 --> 01:05:38,144
would go down and walk around
South Central,
1347
01:05:38,287 --> 01:05:39,185
they're gonna get killed.
1348
01:05:39,321 --> 01:05:41,516
Which I can tell you
is a common perception.
1349
01:05:41,657 --> 01:05:44,057
The odds that something's
going to happen to us
1350
01:05:44,193 --> 01:05:46,058
are really, really slight.
1351
01:05:46,195 --> 01:05:48,060
Minuscule.
- Right. Okay.
1352
01:05:48,197 --> 01:05:50,062
- But you know,
if you look up there,
1353
01:05:50,199 --> 01:05:53,066
you get a different symbol
of the Hollywood sign.
1354
01:05:53,202 --> 01:05:55,067
It means something
very different
1355
01:05:55,204 --> 01:05:57,069
than the corner
of Florence and Normandie.
1356
01:05:57,206 --> 01:05:59,071
For most Americans
and most of the world,
1357
01:05:59,208 --> 01:06:02,075
it means glamour and Hollywood,
except that we can't see it.
1358
01:06:02,211 --> 01:06:04,076
- I can't see the Hollywood sign.
Where is it?
1359
01:06:04,213 --> 01:06:06,579
- Right. You can't see it because
of something that's probably...
1360
01:06:06,715 --> 01:06:08,580
much more dangerous for us
right now,
1361
01:06:08,717 --> 01:06:10,582
which is the stuff
we're breathing.
1362
01:06:10,719 --> 01:06:12,584
- The pollution that's blocking
the Hollywood sign,
1363
01:06:12,721 --> 01:06:14,279
we're breathing this.
1364
01:06:14,423 --> 01:06:17,085
That's far more dangerous than
all the other stuff the media's
1365
01:06:17,226 --> 01:06:19,057
telling us to be afraid of.
- Right.
1366
01:06:19,195 --> 01:06:21,925
- As we left the corner
of Florence and Normandie,
1367
01:06:22,064 --> 01:06:23,861
I noticed that a number
of helicopters
1368
01:06:23,999 --> 01:06:26,194
had appeared in the sky.
1369
01:06:26,335 --> 01:06:28,132
Within seconds, the news media
1370
01:06:28,270 --> 01:06:30,135
started to arrive.
- So what's the story here?
1371
01:06:30,272 --> 01:06:32,638
- I'm waiting.
I thought you would know.
1372
01:06:32,775 --> 01:06:34,640
- No, I don't know anything.
1373
01:06:34,777 --> 01:06:37,541
- The Sergeant just told me
there's a guy with a gun.
1374
01:06:37,680 --> 01:06:39,545
But they're not sure.
That's all they told me.
1375
01:06:39,682 --> 01:06:41,809
Since there's no action,
I'm not getting my camera down.
1376
01:06:41,951 --> 01:06:44,317
- I just happened to see the
chopper, going to another story.
1377
01:06:44,453 --> 01:06:46,819
- What story are you going to?
- It's a near-drowning.
1378
01:06:46,956 --> 01:06:48,480
- It's a drowning?
- A near-drowning.
1379
01:06:48,624 --> 01:06:50,489
- How about a story
about how you can't see
1380
01:06:50,626 --> 01:06:52,560
the Hollywood Hills
because of the pollution?
1381
01:06:52,695 --> 01:06:55,562
Could you maybe do a story
on that tonight?
1382
01:06:55,698 --> 01:06:58,667
- Pollution, that's rather good.
I find that good.
1383
01:06:58,801 --> 01:07:01,167
You can't see it. You can't see
anything around here.
1384
01:07:01,303 --> 01:07:04,170
- If you have to choose
between a guy with a gun
1385
01:07:04,306 --> 01:07:07,070
and a near-drowning of a baby -
you could only be one place--
1386
01:07:07,209 --> 01:07:08,972
- I go with the gun.
- You go with the gun, always.
1387
01:07:11,247 --> 01:07:13,078
Is it all over, here?
It's all over? All over?
1388
01:07:13,215 --> 01:07:15,080
- Not yet, not yet.
- Looks like it.
1389
01:07:15,217 --> 01:07:17,583
- Just wait for these sergeants
down here to come down,
1390
01:07:17,720 --> 01:07:19,585
'cause they got all the details.
1391
01:07:19,722 --> 01:07:21,587
- Okay. Hey, I was
just wondering -
1392
01:07:21,724 --> 01:07:25,023
I just got here to L.A. today -
I can't see the Hollywood sign,
1393
01:07:25,160 --> 01:07:27,025
down on the hills there,
down Normandie.
1394
01:07:27,162 --> 01:07:29,027
You can't see the sign
'cause of the pollution.
1395
01:07:29,164 --> 01:07:31,029
- Right.
- Is there anybody you can arrest
1396
01:07:31,166 --> 01:07:33,532
for polluting up the air?
- Absolutely not.
1397
01:07:33,669 --> 01:07:35,534
- Nobody?
- No.
1398
01:07:35,671 --> 01:07:37,070
- Why is that?
1399
01:07:39,008 --> 01:07:40,908
Why is that, Sergeant?
1400
01:07:47,383 --> 01:07:48,907
- He's fighting!
1401
01:07:49,051 --> 01:07:50,916
- For over a decade,
1402
01:07:51,053 --> 01:07:54,147
there has been one show
on American television
1403
01:07:54,290 --> 01:07:56,724
that has consistently brought
black and white people together
1404
01:07:56,859 --> 01:07:59,054
in an effort to reduce
our fears
1405
01:07:59,194 --> 01:08:02,061
and celebrate our diversity.
1406
01:08:02,197 --> 01:08:04,222
That show is Cops.
1407
01:08:07,603 --> 01:08:09,833
I went to see a former
producer of "Cops"
1408
01:08:09,972 --> 01:08:11,303
and executive producer
1409
01:08:11,440 --> 01:08:13,271
of World's Wildest
Police Videos:
1410
01:08:13,409 --> 01:08:15,070
Mr. Dick Herland.
1411
01:08:15,210 --> 01:08:17,075
- Look "liberal" up
in the dictionary
1412
01:08:17,212 --> 01:08:19,077
and I think my picture's
in there somewhere,
1413
01:08:19,214 --> 01:08:24,015
- So then, you know, why not be
compelled to do, you know,
1414
01:08:24,153 --> 01:08:29,022
a show that focuses on, you
know, what's causing the crime,
1415
01:08:29,158 --> 01:08:31,524
as opposed to just chasing
the criminals down?
1416
01:08:31,660 --> 01:08:34,026
- Because I think it's harder
to do that show.
1417
01:08:34,163 --> 01:08:36,097
I don't know what
that show would be.
1418
01:08:36,231 --> 01:08:38,028
Anger does well, hate does
well, violence does well.
1419
01:08:38,167 --> 01:08:40,533
Tolerance and understanding
and trying to learn to be
1420
01:08:40,669 --> 01:08:43,604
a little different than you were
last year does less well.
1421
01:08:43,739 --> 01:08:45,604
- Does less well in the ratings.
- Oh yeah.
1422
01:08:45,741 --> 01:08:48,539
- Maybe because we,
in the television business,
1423
01:08:48,677 --> 01:08:52,545
because we tend to demonize
black and Hispanic people,
1424
01:08:52,681 --> 01:08:54,546
then those watching it at home
are going:
1425
01:08:54,683 --> 01:08:56,548
"I don't want to help
those people.
1426
01:08:56,685 --> 01:08:58,550
I'm not going to do anything
to help them.
1427
01:08:58,687 --> 01:09:01,053
Because I hate them now,
because they may hurt me."
1428
01:09:01,190 --> 01:09:04,057
You know what I'm saying?
- I know what you're saying,
1429
01:09:04,193 --> 01:09:06,559
I'm not sure that's
what we're doing.
1430
01:09:06,695 --> 01:09:09,061
I'm not sure we're demonizing
1431
01:09:09,198 --> 01:09:13,567
black and Hispanic people, uh...
particularly.
1432
01:09:13,702 --> 01:09:16,068
I don't think we show
black and Hispanic people
1433
01:09:16,205 --> 01:09:19,572
as being criminals.
1434
01:09:19,708 --> 01:09:21,972
I'd like to say not more often,
1435
01:09:22,111 --> 01:09:24,079
but probably
they are more often.
1436
01:09:24,213 --> 01:09:27,649
But I certainly don't think...
We're certainly not trying
1437
01:09:27,783 --> 01:09:29,648
to demonize black
and Hispanic people.
1438
01:09:29,785 --> 01:09:32,583
- We show them on the news,
we show them on TV,
1439
01:09:32,721 --> 01:09:35,087
as pretty scary people.
1440
01:09:35,224 --> 01:09:37,954
- Yeah.
1441
01:09:38,093 --> 01:09:40,084
And I agree. I'd like
to see that reversed
1442
01:09:40,229 --> 01:09:44,097
as much as possible. I...
1443
01:09:44,233 --> 01:09:46,098
- Start tonight.
- Well, the thing is,
1444
01:09:46,235 --> 01:09:48,100
I don't know how
to start tonight.
1445
01:09:48,237 --> 01:09:50,102
I don't know how to tell
that story.
1446
01:09:50,239 --> 01:09:52,104
If I was smart enough
to do that...
1447
01:09:52,241 --> 01:09:54,607
- I'll pitch you one.
- Okay. All right.
1448
01:09:54,743 --> 01:09:57,109
- Um... um...
1449
01:09:57,246 --> 01:09:59,578
Do a show called not Cops
but Corporate Cops.
1450
01:10:02,418 --> 01:10:03,442
"Corporation man
Hey Corporate man
1451
01:10:03,585 --> 01:10:06,076
"We're coming out to get you
better run while you can
1452
01:10:06,455 --> 01:10:09,515
"We're coming out to get you
better run while you can"
1453
01:10:09,658 --> 01:10:11,626
- Uh... I love the idea.
1454
01:10:11,760 --> 01:10:15,127
I don't think it would make
very interesting reality TV.
1455
01:10:15,264 --> 01:10:18,631
Unless we can get those people
to get in their SUVs
1456
01:10:18,767 --> 01:10:22,134
and drive really fast down
the road away from the police.
1457
01:10:22,271 --> 01:10:24,364
- But I'm telling you,
everyone in America
1458
01:10:24,506 --> 01:10:26,371
who's got just your basic,
everyday job
1459
01:10:26,508 --> 01:10:28,976
is gonna love watching the boss
1460
01:10:29,111 --> 01:10:31,079
being chased down the street
with his shirt off,
1461
01:10:31,213 --> 01:10:32,612
thrown to the ground
1462
01:10:32,748 --> 01:10:35,615
and a knee to the neck. I tell
you, that is gonna get ratings.
1463
01:10:35,751 --> 01:10:38,618
- Yeah, I'm with you. And if
I can find a police outfit
1464
01:10:38,754 --> 01:10:42,588
that would prosecute corporate
criminals appropriately
1465
01:10:42,725 --> 01:10:44,590
and would go after them
appropriately... In other words,
1466
01:10:44,727 --> 01:10:47,594
what you do to a man who's
just stolen a lady's purse
1467
01:10:47,730 --> 01:10:49,595
with $85 to it,
1468
01:10:49,732 --> 01:10:53,099
than you need to do
an appropriate response
1469
01:10:53,235 --> 01:10:57,103
to a man who has just stolen $85
million from indigent people,
1470
01:10:57,239 --> 01:10:59,104
then, boy, we're gonna be
out there filming that.
1471
01:10:59,241 --> 01:11:02,108
But as a matter of fact,
when police go after the guy
1472
01:11:02,244 --> 01:11:04,109
who's just stolen $85 million,
1473
01:11:04,246 --> 01:11:07,113
they treat him like he was
a member of the city council -
1474
01:11:07,249 --> 01:11:10,616
as he may or may not be - and
it's not exciting television.
1475
01:11:10,753 --> 01:11:13,119
If you could get that guy
to take his shirt off...
1476
01:11:13,255 --> 01:11:15,120
- Right.
1477
01:11:15,257 --> 01:11:17,122
- Yeah, and throw his cellular
phone at the police
1478
01:11:17,259 --> 01:11:19,124
as they come through the door,
1479
01:11:19,261 --> 01:11:22,253
try to jump out that window,
then we'd have a show.
1480
01:11:22,397 --> 01:11:25,059
- You watch violence on TV
in a place like Canada
1481
01:11:25,200 --> 01:11:27,065
and you know it's not happening
next door.
1482
01:11:27,202 --> 01:11:31,070
You watch it here, and you know
it is happening next door.
1483
01:11:31,206 --> 01:11:33,071
- Right.
- I think that's...
1484
01:11:33,208 --> 01:11:35,073
I don't know what
the difference is,
1485
01:11:35,210 --> 01:11:37,075
but there's a big difference.
- Yeah, but why isn't...
1486
01:11:37,212 --> 01:11:39,077
Why isn't it happening
in Canada?
1487
01:11:39,214 --> 01:11:42,081
Why aren't there, you know,
10,000 murders a year?
1488
01:11:42,217 --> 01:11:45,084
- I don't know, but I want
to go to Canada to retire,
1489
01:11:45,220 --> 01:11:48,087
or something, 'cause it sounds
like where we want to be.
1490
01:11:48,223 --> 01:11:51,090
I'd like to find out what that
difference is. Wouldn't you?
1491
01:11:51,226 --> 01:11:53,126
- Yeah. Yeah, I'm trying
to find out.
1492
01:11:59,334 --> 01:12:02,098
Where are you supposed
to be right now?
1493
01:12:02,237 --> 01:12:04,102
- School.
- School.
1494
01:12:04,239 --> 01:12:05,706
- School.
1495
01:12:05,841 --> 01:12:07,706
- Aren't you worried about
what you're not learning?
1496
01:12:07,843 --> 01:12:09,708
- Nah, I'm mostly helping
everybody else in the class.
1497
01:12:09,845 --> 01:12:13,042
Then I barely get to do my work.
- How about you? You're not
1498
01:12:13,182 --> 01:12:16,208
worried about your education?
- Well, I've got the textbook.
1499
01:12:16,351 --> 01:12:18,876
- Why do you think
we have so many, uh...
1500
01:12:19,021 --> 01:12:21,216
gun murders in America?
- Uh...
1501
01:12:21,356 --> 01:12:24,553
I have no idea. People must hate
each other or something.
1502
01:12:24,693 --> 01:12:26,558
- Oh, you mean Canadians don't
hate each other?
1503
01:12:26,695 --> 01:12:29,562
- Well, we do but we don't go to
the point of shooting somebody
1504
01:12:29,698 --> 01:12:32,565
just to get revenge.
- What do you do?
1505
01:12:32,701 --> 01:12:35,067
- I don't know.
Tease them, maybe.
1506
01:12:35,204 --> 01:12:38,537
Make fun of them, ridicule them.
- Throw eggs at them.
1507
01:12:38,674 --> 01:12:41,575
- How many gun murders
in Sarnia this year?
1508
01:12:41,710 --> 01:12:43,575
- None.
- Last year?
1509
01:12:43,712 --> 01:12:45,577
- I believe we had one,
at the time.
1510
01:12:45,714 --> 01:12:47,579
- The year before that?
1511
01:12:47,716 --> 01:12:50,082
- I can't recall what we had
in the way of--
1512
01:12:50,219 --> 01:12:52,084
- Maybe one in the last
three years?
1513
01:12:52,221 --> 01:12:54,086
- Probably, yes.
- Mm-hm.
1514
01:12:54,223 --> 01:12:57,386
- Very low. Very low
for this city.
1515
01:12:57,526 --> 01:12:59,391
- Well, of course,
there's no murders here
1516
01:12:59,528 --> 01:13:01,393
because there's only
70,000 people
1517
01:13:01,530 --> 01:13:04,226
and it's the kissing
capital of the world.
1518
01:13:04,366 --> 01:13:06,698
So I went down the river
to another Canadian city
1519
01:13:06,835 --> 01:13:08,700
that was five times
as large as Sarnia:
1520
01:13:08,837 --> 01:13:12,204
Windsor, Ontario, just across
the river from Detroit.
1521
01:13:12,341 --> 01:13:16,141
I was sure there'd be
more murders in Windsor.
1522
01:13:16,278 --> 01:13:19,145
Ever hear of anyone being shot
by a gun in Windsor?
1523
01:13:19,281 --> 01:13:21,306
- No. No.
1524
01:13:21,450 --> 01:13:23,247
- You remember any murders here?
1525
01:13:23,385 --> 01:13:26,548
- Uh, there was one
a long time ago. Probably--
1526
01:13:26,688 --> 01:13:30,055
- How long ago?
- Oh...
1527
01:13:30,192 --> 01:13:32,057
- In your lifetime?
- In my lifetime,
1528
01:13:32,194 --> 01:13:35,652
probably around 15, 20 years
ago, there was one murder.
1529
01:13:35,797 --> 01:13:37,765
- In fact, this Windsor
policeman told me
1530
01:13:37,900 --> 01:13:39,265
that the only gun murder
1531
01:13:39,401 --> 01:13:41,562
he could recall in Windsor
in the last three years
1532
01:13:41,703 --> 01:13:44,069
was committed by a guy
from Detroit,
1533
01:13:44,206 --> 01:13:46,674
who had a stolen gun
from Minnesota.
1534
01:13:46,808 --> 01:13:50,608
With nearly 400,000 people
in the Windsor area,
1535
01:13:50,746 --> 01:13:55,012
there were simply no Canadians
shooting other Canadians.
1536
01:13:55,150 --> 01:13:56,640
I thought it might be time
1537
01:13:56,785 --> 01:14:00,653
for some fun facts
about Canada.
1538
01:14:00,789 --> 01:14:03,019
I hit the streets of New York
to find out what
1539
01:14:03,158 --> 01:14:05,524
the average American thought
about our friendly neighbour
1540
01:14:05,661 --> 01:14:07,094
to the north.
1541
01:14:07,229 --> 01:14:12,531
- Canadians don't watch as much
violent movies as Americans do.
1542
01:14:16,972 --> 01:14:18,599
- That's wrong.
1543
01:14:18,740 --> 01:14:20,833
Hordes of young boys,
all throughout Canada,
1544
01:14:20,976 --> 01:14:23,501
eagerly await the next
Hollywood bloodbath.
1545
01:14:23,645 --> 01:14:26,045
- Then one of the guy gets
his leg taken off.
1546
01:14:26,181 --> 01:14:29,048
- Oh, wow!
- And there was a lot of girls,
1547
01:14:29,184 --> 01:14:32,642
and naked at one point.
- I like that stuff.
1548
01:14:32,788 --> 01:14:35,814
- What movie did you see tonight?
- Sixth Day.
1549
01:14:35,958 --> 01:14:38,859
- With Arnold Schwarzenegger?
- Yeah.
1550
01:14:38,994 --> 01:14:40,859
- Did it make you want
to come out here
1551
01:14:40,996 --> 01:14:42,861
and play this shoot-'em-up game?
1552
01:14:42,998 --> 01:14:45,193
- Well... yeah.
1553
01:14:45,334 --> 01:14:48,064
- There's no poverty in Canada
like there is here...
1554
01:14:48,203 --> 01:14:50,171
in the States.
1555
01:14:50,305 --> 01:14:51,670
- Wrong again.
1556
01:14:51,740 --> 01:14:53,708
Mayor Mike Bradley
Sarnia, Ontario, Canada
1557
01:14:53,809 --> 01:14:55,504
- Actually, we've also had
a much higher unemployment rate.
1558
01:14:55,577 --> 01:14:58,205
When Michigan rate was running at 4%,
we were still at 8-9%,
1559
01:14:58,313 --> 01:15:00,304
We seem to have an institutional
unemployment rate.
1560
01:15:00,449 --> 01:15:02,679
- I think there'd mostly be
white people in Canada.
1561
01:15:02,818 --> 01:15:05,685
- Hmm... that's strange,
'cause when I'm in Canada,
1562
01:15:05,821 --> 01:15:08,346
I see black people everywhere.
1563
01:15:08,490 --> 01:15:10,355
And yellow people,
and brown people...
1564
01:15:10,492 --> 01:15:12,084
and 13% of the country is
non-white.
1565
01:15:12,227 --> 01:15:14,354
So the Canadians are
1566
01:15:14,496 --> 01:15:17,693
pretty much just like us.
And the reason that they have
(Toronto, Canada)
1567
01:15:17,833 --> 01:15:21,098
so few murders has to be
because they've got
1568
01:15:21,236 --> 01:15:23,534
so few guns.
1569
01:15:27,676 --> 01:15:30,440
What kind of guns do you own?
- Uh, I hunt.
1570
01:15:30,579 --> 01:15:33,047
I own rifles and shotguns,
and I own pistols.
1571
01:15:33,181 --> 01:15:36,548
- Mm-hm. So how many guns total?
- Uh... Probably about seven.
1572
01:15:36,685 --> 01:15:38,118
- Seven guns?
- Yeah.
1573
01:15:38,253 --> 01:15:40,050
- Do you have a gun?
- I have a few.
1574
01:15:40,188 --> 01:15:43,055
- How many guns do you have?
- Half a dozen.
1575
01:15:43,191 --> 01:15:46,558
- You could name how many people
that own guns, that you know?
1576
01:15:46,695 --> 01:15:49,391
Two, three, a dozen?
- More than that.
1577
01:15:49,531 --> 01:15:52,091
- There's a tremendous
amount of gun ownership.
1578
01:15:52,234 --> 01:15:54,065
We're a large country
geographically.
1579
01:15:54,202 --> 01:15:56,534
We grew up with hunting and
fishing being a tradition.
1580
01:15:56,671 --> 01:15:59,071
- In Canada, with a population
of just around 30 million -
1581
01:15:59,207 --> 01:16:01,072
there's about
10 million families -
1582
01:16:01,209 --> 01:16:03,074
and the best estimate is
somewhere in the region
1583
01:16:03,211 --> 01:16:04,974
of seven-million guns.
1584
01:16:05,113 --> 01:16:06,410
- Wow!
1585
01:16:06,548 --> 01:16:08,778
Canada was one gun-loving,
1586
01:16:08,917 --> 01:16:11,750
gun-toting, gun-crazy country!
1587
01:16:13,388 --> 01:16:16,289
Where can you get a gun?
- Uptown, any time I want.
1588
01:16:16,425 --> 01:16:17,653
- I see you're a Glock owner.
1589
01:16:17,793 --> 01:16:20,591
Where can I get a Glock
in Canada?
1590
01:16:20,729 --> 01:16:23,095
- Most gun stores'll sell 'em
to you
1591
01:16:23,231 --> 01:16:25,028
if you have the proper
permits and stuff.
1592
01:16:25,167 --> 01:16:27,158
- In fact, despite all
their tough gun laws,
1593
01:16:27,302 --> 01:16:29,065
take a look at what I,
1594
01:16:29,204 --> 01:16:31,798
a foreign citizen,
was able to do
1595
01:16:31,940 --> 01:16:33,737
at the local Canadian Wal-Mart.
1596
01:16:33,875 --> 01:16:36,537
Where's the ammunition at?
- Where's the ammunition?
1597
01:16:36,678 --> 01:16:38,077
- Yeah.
- Back here.
1598
01:16:41,716 --> 01:16:44,583
What kind are you looking for?
- You know, like, bullets.
1599
01:16:46,688 --> 01:16:48,349
That's right.
1600
01:16:48,490 --> 01:16:51,357
I could buy as much live
ammunition as I wanted to
1601
01:16:51,493 --> 01:16:53,222
in Canada.
You take American?
1602
01:16:53,361 --> 01:16:55,090
Do you lock your doors?
1603
01:16:55,230 --> 01:16:57,721
- No.
- Are you afraid of anything?
1604
01:16:57,833 --> 01:16:59,767
Sarnia, Canada
1605
01:16:59,868 --> 01:17:03,304
- Nah, not really, no.
- Do you lock your doors
at night?
1606
01:17:03,438 --> 01:17:05,303
- No.
- You don't lock your doors?
1607
01:17:05,440 --> 01:17:07,067
- No.
- Well, what do you...
1608
01:17:07,209 --> 01:17:09,473
Are you afraid of anything?
- Not really.
1609
01:17:09,611 --> 01:17:13,069
- Have you ever been broken into?
- Yes, I have. Yeah.
1610
01:17:13,215 --> 01:17:15,581
- What happened?
- They broke into my home.
1611
01:17:15,717 --> 01:17:17,582
I wasn't there. They broke in,
1612
01:17:17,719 --> 01:17:20,279
they stole some booze
and cigarettes and they left.
1613
01:17:20,422 --> 01:17:22,686
So I figure it must've been
some teenagers
1614
01:17:22,824 --> 01:17:26,590
out to have a little bit of fun.
That's all they took, though.
1615
01:17:26,728 --> 01:17:28,457
Just some booze
and some cigarettes.
1616
01:17:28,597 --> 01:17:30,462
- Have you ever been
a victim of crime?
1617
01:17:30,599 --> 01:17:32,533
- Yes.
- What kind of crime?
1618
01:17:32,667 --> 01:17:35,033
- Uh, I've had people walk in
while I've been sleeping
1619
01:17:35,170 --> 01:17:38,037
and vandalize my home
and steal from me.
1620
01:17:38,173 --> 01:17:41,040
- And that didn't want to make
you lock your doors at night?
1621
01:17:41,176 --> 01:17:43,667
- No. No.
1622
01:17:43,812 --> 01:17:46,474
- As an American with
three locks on his doors,
1623
01:17:46,615 --> 01:17:48,674
I found this all
a bit confusing.
1624
01:17:48,817 --> 01:17:51,251
Even here, in Toronto,
a city of millions,
1625
01:17:51,386 --> 01:17:52,853
people just didn't lock
their doors.
1626
01:17:55,290 --> 01:17:57,053
So you don't lock your doors but
we, Americans, do. Why is that?
1627
01:17:57,192 --> 01:17:59,820
- You must be afraid
of your neighbour.
1628
01:17:59,961 --> 01:18:02,054
- Do you ever leave your doors
unlocked at home?
1629
01:18:02,197 --> 01:18:04,563
- Yeah.
- Yeah, you do?
1630
01:18:04,699 --> 01:18:06,564
Where do you live?
- Right around here.
1631
01:18:06,701 --> 01:18:08,066
- Toronto?
- Around here.
1632
01:18:08,203 --> 01:18:09,864
- You leave your doors unlocked?
- Yeah.
1633
01:18:10,005 --> 01:18:11,870
- You'd think, as Americans,
1634
01:18:12,007 --> 01:18:15,568
that the lock is keeping people
out of your place.
1635
01:18:15,710 --> 01:18:19,077
We, as Canadians,
see it more as, uh...
1636
01:18:19,214 --> 01:18:22,581
when we lock the door, we're
imprisoning ourselves inside.
1637
01:18:22,717 --> 01:18:24,514
- You don't want to do that.
1638
01:18:24,653 --> 01:18:26,518
- Not really, no.
1639
01:18:26,655 --> 01:18:30,386
We don't want to... No.
1640
01:18:30,525 --> 01:18:34,017
- I decided to go unannounced
to a neighbourhood in Toronto
1641
01:18:34,162 --> 01:18:37,529
to see if this unlocked-door
thing was true.
1642
01:18:37,666 --> 01:18:39,896
Oh, hi. I'm sorry.
Just checking.
1643
01:18:44,673 --> 01:18:46,732
[ dog barking ]
Oh, hello!
1644
01:18:53,682 --> 01:18:55,047
- Oh, hi.
- Hi.
1645
01:18:55,183 --> 01:18:57,048
- Nobody locks their doors.
1646
01:18:57,185 --> 01:18:59,050
Nobody locks their doors
in this town.
1647
01:18:59,187 --> 01:19:01,985
- You want to lock?
- No, no, no.
1648
01:19:02,123 --> 01:19:04,057
Do you like living here?
- I like it very much.
1649
01:19:04,192 --> 01:19:06,490
- Yeah? And the T-shirt?
- The T-shirt too.
1650
01:19:06,628 --> 01:19:08,687
- This door was wide open.
And you're not afraid?
1651
01:19:08,830 --> 01:19:11,128
- Should I be afraid?
- I don't know. You live here.
1652
01:19:11,266 --> 01:19:13,325
- I don't think I'm afraid.
- You're not, are you?
1653
01:19:13,468 --> 01:19:15,333
Thank you very much.
- All right. No problem.
1654
01:19:15,470 --> 01:19:17,335
- I'm sorry about the intrusion.
- No, no problem.
1655
01:19:17,472 --> 01:19:19,838
- Thank you for not shooting me.
- No problem at all.
1656
01:19:19,975 --> 01:19:21,340
- Bye-bye.
- Okay.
1657
01:19:21,476 --> 01:19:22,534
- As an American,
1658
01:19:22,677 --> 01:19:24,975
I gotta say this all
seemed kind of strange.
1659
01:19:25,113 --> 01:19:26,876
Until I looked up at the TV
1660
01:19:27,015 --> 01:19:29,006
in the bar and noticed
what they watched
1661
01:19:29,150 --> 01:19:30,082
for their evening news.
1662
01:19:30,218 --> 01:19:32,812
- They're friends of ours.
1663
01:19:32,954 --> 01:19:36,082
We'll certainly listen to them
courteously and carefully,
1664
01:19:36,224 --> 01:19:39,887
but you don't just make war
just 'cause someone says so.
1665
01:19:40,028 --> 01:19:43,930
- The Canadians weren't being
pumped full of fear.
1666
01:19:44,065 --> 01:19:46,192
And their politicians seemed
to talk kind of funny.
1667
01:19:46,368 --> 01:19:48,359
Mayor Mike Bradley
Sarnia, Canada
1668
01:19:48,470 --> 01:19:50,768
- ...making sure they have good daycare,
assistance for their parents
1669
01:19:50,872 --> 01:19:53,102
when they're elderly and need
to be in an old-age home,
1670
01:19:53,241 --> 01:19:54,265
that they have proper
health care that insures
1671
01:19:54,409 --> 01:19:56,741
that they won't lose
their business or their house
1672
01:19:56,878 --> 01:19:58,641
because they can't
afford their medical bills.
1673
01:19:58,780 --> 01:20:00,577
That's how you build
a good society.
1674
01:20:00,715 --> 01:20:03,081
No one wins unless everyone
wins. And you don't win
1675
01:20:03,218 --> 01:20:05,345
by beating up on people
who can't defend themselves.
1676
01:20:05,487 --> 01:20:06,852
And that's been the approach,
unfortunately,
1677
01:20:06,988 --> 01:20:09,354
that's been spreading with some
of the right-wing governments
1678
01:20:09,491 --> 01:20:11,118
across North America.
They pick onto people
1679
01:20:11,259 --> 01:20:13,386
that can't defend
themselves and at the same time,
1680
01:20:13,528 --> 01:20:15,155
they're turning around and
giving financial support
1681
01:20:15,297 --> 01:20:18,266
and tax breaks and tax benefits
to people that don't need them.
1682
01:20:18,400 --> 01:20:21,631
- Where are the indigents in
the city? Where do they live?
1683
01:20:21,770 --> 01:20:24,568
- Uh... indigent... uh...
1684
01:20:24,706 --> 01:20:27,072
- You act like you've never heard
the word before.
1685
01:20:27,208 --> 01:20:29,073
- There's... We don't have that
problem here, really. It's...
1686
01:20:29,210 --> 01:20:30,575
- So I asked him,
1687
01:20:30,712 --> 01:20:33,078
"Could you at least take me
to a Canadian slum,"
1688
01:20:33,214 --> 01:20:34,681
and well...
1689
01:20:34,816 --> 01:20:37,979
this is what a ghetto
looks like in Canada.
1690
01:20:38,119 --> 01:20:41,247
Is this the same mentality that
says, with Canadians, if someone
1691
01:20:41,389 --> 01:20:44,825
gets sick, they should actually
be able to have health care?
1692
01:20:44,959 --> 01:20:46,824
- Yeah.
- Oh, definitely.
1693
01:20:46,961 --> 01:20:49,088
- Yeah.
- Yup.
1694
01:20:49,230 --> 01:20:50,595
- Why?
1695
01:20:50,732 --> 01:20:52,529
- Because!
1696
01:20:52,667 --> 01:20:54,532
- Human rights. Everyone's got
the right to live.
1697
01:20:54,669 --> 01:20:56,534
- You just came out of
the emergency room?
1698
01:20:56,671 --> 01:20:58,104
- Yes, I did.
1699
01:20:58,239 --> 01:21:00,605
- How much did you have to pay
for your treatment?
1700
01:21:00,742 --> 01:21:02,607
- The bill is covered
by our hospital plan.
1701
01:21:02,744 --> 01:21:04,609
- You're telling me you didn't
have to pay anything?
1702
01:21:04,746 --> 01:21:06,236
- No, I don't.
1703
01:21:06,381 --> 01:21:08,747
- I have family that lives
in the States.
1704
01:21:08,883 --> 01:21:11,249
They used to live in Canada
and moved over there.
1705
01:21:11,386 --> 01:21:14,617
And it's so different.
- They get afraid more easily.
1706
01:21:14,756 --> 01:21:16,621
- Oh, yeah.
1707
01:21:16,758 --> 01:21:18,623
Yeah, very much so.
1708
01:21:18,760 --> 01:21:22,628
'Cause everybody reacts
over there just like that.
1709
01:21:22,764 --> 01:21:25,562
They don't stop and think.
1710
01:21:25,700 --> 01:21:30,069
First reaction is pull the gun
out. "You're on my property."
1711
01:21:30,205 --> 01:21:33,572
You know, like...
1712
01:21:33,708 --> 01:21:36,871
I don't know. It's just
different over here.
1713
01:21:37,011 --> 01:21:38,876
- Where do you live?
- Detroit.
(Windsor, Canada)
1714
01:21:39,013 --> 01:21:40,571
- Come over to Canada here
for the night?
1715
01:21:40,715 --> 01:21:42,080
- Right.
1716
01:21:42,217 --> 01:21:45,311
- People are more open-minded
here, a bit more welcoming.
1717
01:21:45,453 --> 01:21:48,081
- Feel any difference when
you cross over to this country?
1718
01:21:48,223 --> 01:21:50,248
Be honest, now, come on.
- It's a lot lighter.
1719
01:21:50,392 --> 01:21:52,257
- The segregation over there
is definitely much more--
1720
01:21:52,394 --> 01:21:54,259
- In the United States.
- ...more intensified
1721
01:21:54,396 --> 01:21:56,261
in the States, yeah.
- Yeah.
1722
01:21:56,398 --> 01:21:58,457
- So you can... You can feel it.
1723
01:21:58,600 --> 01:22:00,761
- Almost like they just
let you be.
1724
01:22:00,902 --> 01:22:02,995
- That's Canada for you.
1725
01:22:03,138 --> 01:22:05,106
- Every time I turn on the TV
in the States,
1726
01:22:05,240 --> 01:22:08,607
it's always about a murder here,
a gunfight, hostile position...
1727
01:22:08,743 --> 01:22:12,110
- I just think the States, their
view of things is fighting.
1728
01:22:12,247 --> 01:22:14,112
That's how they resolve
everything.
1729
01:22:14,249 --> 01:22:17,116
If there's... there's something
going on in another country,
1730
01:22:17,252 --> 01:22:19,117
they send people over
to fight it and...
1731
01:22:19,254 --> 01:22:21,620
- They are the most powerful
country in the world, though.
1732
01:22:21,756 --> 01:22:23,553
- Canada's more just, like,
"Let's negotiate,
1733
01:22:23,691 --> 01:22:26,057
let's work something out."
Where the States is,
1734
01:22:26,194 --> 01:22:28,594
"We'll kill you and that'll be
the end of that."
1735
01:22:28,730 --> 01:22:33,565
- Um, if guns were...
If more guns made people safer,
1736
01:22:33,701 --> 01:22:36,761
then America would be one of the
safest countries in the world.
1737
01:22:36,905 --> 01:22:38,805
It isn't. It's the opposite.
1738
01:23:23,451 --> 01:23:25,419
- I heard that 911 call,
you know, on TV someplace.
1739
01:23:25,553 --> 01:23:27,418
It was horrible. It was just...
1740
01:23:27,555 --> 01:23:29,284
- 'Cause he kept asking,
"Where's the shooter?"
1741
01:23:29,424 --> 01:23:31,415
She said, "He's gone.
I need some help."
1742
01:23:31,559 --> 01:23:32,958
- The little girl was
in there too?
1743
01:23:33,094 --> 01:23:36,029
- She was on the floor, yes.
1744
01:23:36,164 --> 01:23:38,064
- And the police and
the medics came, or...
1745
01:23:38,199 --> 01:23:40,064
- By the time the medics were
here...
1746
01:23:40,201 --> 01:23:43,068
The medics had just come in
and I remember him stepping in
1747
01:23:43,204 --> 01:23:46,071
and taking over the room.
He said, "You have to leave."
1748
01:23:46,207 --> 01:23:48,072
- All right.
- And then when the meds come in,
1749
01:23:48,209 --> 01:23:50,575
when the police come in,
you're no longer in control.
1750
01:23:50,712 --> 01:23:53,579
They take over the building.
- Was she still alive then?
1751
01:23:53,715 --> 01:23:55,979
- Her lips had become
totally blue.
1752
01:23:58,586 --> 01:24:00,247
- Back in my hometown
of Flint, Michigan,
1753
01:24:00,355 --> 01:24:04,052
a six-year-old first-grade boy,
at Buell Elementary,
1754
01:24:04,192 --> 01:24:06,592
had found a gun
at his uncle's house,
1755
01:24:06,728 --> 01:24:10,061
where he was staying because
his mother was being evicted.
1756
01:24:10,198 --> 01:24:14,066
He brought the gun to school
and shot another first-grader,
1757
01:24:14,202 --> 01:24:17,228
six-year-old Kayla Rolland.
1758
01:24:17,372 --> 01:24:19,602
With one bullet that passed
through her body,
1759
01:24:19,741 --> 01:24:22,369
she fell to the floor
and laid there dying
1760
01:24:22,510 --> 01:24:25,968
while her teacher called 911
for help.
1761
01:24:26,114 --> 01:24:27,945
No one knew why the little boy
1762
01:24:28,082 --> 01:24:29,640
wanted to shoot
the little girl.
1763
01:24:29,784 --> 01:24:31,979
As if the city
had not been through
1764
01:24:32,120 --> 01:24:33,144
enough horror and tragedy
1765
01:24:33,288 --> 01:24:35,654
in the past two decades,
it was now home
1766
01:24:35,790 --> 01:24:38,918
to a new record: the youngest
school shooting ever
1767
01:24:39,060 --> 01:24:40,925
in the United States.
1768
01:24:41,062 --> 01:24:43,724
On the morning of the shooting,
1769
01:24:43,865 --> 01:24:47,824
it only took the helicopters
and satellite trucks
1770
01:24:47,969 --> 01:24:49,402
a half-hour to show up.
1771
01:24:49,537 --> 01:24:51,095
- They check in the truck.
1772
01:24:51,239 --> 01:24:54,174
You know, we're doing one
in 30 minutes again.
1773
01:24:54,309 --> 01:24:56,174
- This evening,
about seven o'clock,
1774
01:24:56,311 --> 01:24:59,041
will be a public memorial
service. Hundreds of people
1775
01:24:59,180 --> 01:25:02,513
will mourn the loss of little
Kayla, a tiny little girl
1776
01:25:02,650 --> 01:25:04,675
who loved pizza, teddy bears,
1777
01:25:04,819 --> 01:25:07,913
and who was taken away from us
much too soon. Gina?
1778
01:25:08,056 --> 01:25:09,921
- Good morning, Christine.
The funeral home now passing out
1779
01:25:10,058 --> 01:25:12,083
tens of thousands
of these pink ribbons
1780
01:25:12,226 --> 01:25:14,592
to support the young
girl's family.
1781
01:25:14,729 --> 01:25:17,095
Today will be an emotional day
and has been already,
1782
01:25:17,231 --> 01:25:19,131
remembering little Kayla.
1783
01:25:19,267 --> 01:25:21,132
Jeff Ross, Fox-2 News.
1784
01:25:23,671 --> 01:25:25,070
- Nice job.
1785
01:25:27,175 --> 01:25:29,541
- Yeah, Michelle, we're having
technical problems, okay?
1786
01:25:29,677 --> 01:25:32,703
Well, don't talk to me about it,
call our sat truck.
1787
01:25:32,847 --> 01:25:34,712
I need a haircut, man.
1788
01:25:34,849 --> 01:25:38,046
I'm a pig. A rug.
1789
01:25:38,186 --> 01:25:39,585
Here we go.
1790
01:25:44,692 --> 01:25:46,557
Some too choked up
even to speak about it.
1791
01:25:46,694 --> 01:25:48,559
There's a memorial service
scheduled here
1792
01:25:48,696 --> 01:25:50,561
for seven o'clock tonight.
1793
01:25:50,698 --> 01:25:52,563
We're live in Flint, Michigan,
this afternoon.
1794
01:25:52,700 --> 01:25:54,600
Jeff Ross, Q-13 Reports.
1795
01:25:59,207 --> 01:26:00,834
Thank you.
- Thank you.
1796
01:26:00,908 --> 01:26:02,876
- Want some hairspray?
1797
01:26:02,944 --> 01:26:04,912
- I kind of need it, don't I?
- Yeah, you do,
1798
01:26:04,979 --> 01:26:06,003
- I got some...
1799
01:26:06,080 --> 01:26:08,139
- I have some. I just didn't put
it in. I didn't have a chance.
1800
01:26:08,216 --> 01:26:09,911
I have hurricane-proof hairspray.
1801
01:26:09,984 --> 01:26:14,318
This man prayed for Kayla
then let the balloon go.
1802
01:26:14,455 --> 01:26:15,979
I say we have
the colour picture,
1803
01:26:16,124 --> 01:26:17,182
not the black-and-white.
1804
01:26:17,325 --> 01:26:19,190
Plenty of media here
that covered Columbine.
1805
01:26:19,327 --> 01:26:21,591
You know, there are
some networks, especially,
1806
01:26:21,729 --> 01:26:24,527
that go from, unfortunately,
tragedy to tragedy.
1807
01:26:24,666 --> 01:26:30,036
And, uh, I feel bad for them.
Because that's all they see...
1808
01:26:30,171 --> 01:26:32,162
The tragedies.
1809
01:26:32,306 --> 01:26:35,400
We're just trying
to crunch right now
1810
01:26:35,543 --> 01:26:37,534
for the five and the six.
1811
01:26:37,679 --> 01:26:41,740
Today, we're feeding
CNN and Fox, so...
1812
01:26:41,883 --> 01:26:46,047
- The national media had never
visited Buell Elementary,
1813
01:26:46,187 --> 01:26:49,054
or the Beecher school district
in which it sat,
1814
01:26:49,190 --> 01:26:51,556
or this part of Flint
ever before.
1815
01:26:51,693 --> 01:26:55,060
And few, if any, of these
reporters bothered to visit it
1816
01:26:55,196 --> 01:26:57,061
even when they were here now.
1817
01:26:57,198 --> 01:27:00,565
If they had ventured just
a block away from the school
1818
01:27:00,702 --> 01:27:02,567
or the funeral home,
they might have seen
1819
01:27:02,704 --> 01:27:05,070
a different kind of tragedy
that, perhaps, would contain
1820
01:27:05,206 --> 01:27:08,767
some answers as to why
this little girl was dead.
1821
01:27:10,745 --> 01:27:13,077
For over 20 years,
this impoverished area,
1822
01:27:13,214 --> 01:27:15,205
in the hometown
1823
01:27:15,349 --> 01:27:17,214
of the world's
largest corporation,
1824
01:27:17,351 --> 01:27:19,945
had been ignored as completely
as it had been destroyed.
1825
01:27:20,088 --> 01:27:23,421
With 87% of the students
living below
1826
01:27:23,558 --> 01:27:25,423
the official poverty line,
1827
01:27:25,560 --> 01:27:29,257
Buell and Beecher, and Flint,
did not fit into
1828
01:27:29,397 --> 01:27:31,558
the accepted and widely
circulated story line
1829
01:27:31,699 --> 01:27:34,293
put forth by
the nation's media.
1830
01:27:34,435 --> 01:27:38,633
That being the one
about America
1831
01:27:38,773 --> 01:27:40,673
and its invincible economy.
1832
01:27:46,114 --> 01:27:48,480
The number-one cause of death
among young people
1833
01:27:48,616 --> 01:27:51,813
in this part of Flint was
homicide. The football field,
1834
01:27:51,953 --> 01:27:55,150
at Flint-Beecher, was sponsored
by a funeral home.
1835
01:27:55,289 --> 01:27:58,918
The kids at Beecher have won
1836
01:27:59,060 --> 01:28:01,028
13 state track championships,
1837
01:28:01,162 --> 01:28:03,027
but they've never had
1838
01:28:03,164 --> 01:28:05,530
a home track meet.
1839
01:28:05,666 --> 01:28:07,566
Because around
the football field,
1840
01:28:07,702 --> 01:28:09,533
all they have is
this dirt ring.
1841
01:28:12,740 --> 01:28:16,267
Years ago, someone here
named the streets,
1842
01:28:16,410 --> 01:28:19,675
in this part of town, after
all the Ivy League schools,
1843
01:28:19,814 --> 01:28:23,113
as if they had dreamed
of better days
1844
01:28:23,251 --> 01:28:25,549
and something greater
for themselves.
1845
01:28:32,493 --> 01:28:35,860
- The children are doing well.
1846
01:28:35,997 --> 01:28:38,022
The faculty and staff
are doing well.
1847
01:28:38,166 --> 01:28:40,031
But we don't forget.
1848
01:28:40,168 --> 01:28:42,966
We don't forget.
1849
01:28:43,104 --> 01:28:45,470
Just don't want this happening
to anybody else, you know?
1850
01:28:45,606 --> 01:28:48,040
It's...
[ She sighs ]
1851
01:28:48,176 --> 01:28:50,041
- I know.
1852
01:28:50,178 --> 01:28:54,046
I know. I don't want it to
happen to anybody else either.
1853
01:28:54,182 --> 01:28:58,551
- Hmm...
- It's okay. It's okay.
1854
01:28:58,686 --> 01:29:00,313
It's okay.
1855
01:29:00,688 --> 01:29:02,087
It's okay.
1856
01:29:06,694 --> 01:29:09,094
I'm sorry.
- That's all right.
1857
01:29:12,200 --> 01:29:15,567
[ Charlton Heston ]:
...from my cold, dead hands!
1858
01:29:15,703 --> 01:29:18,570
[ cheering ]
- Just as he did
1859
01:29:18,706 --> 01:29:21,937
after the Columbine shooting,
Charlton Heston showed up
1860
01:29:22,076 --> 01:29:24,840
in Flint to have
a big pro-gun rally.
1861
01:29:24,979 --> 01:29:26,844
- Freedom has never seen
1862
01:29:26,981 --> 01:29:31,077
greater peril nor needed
you more urgently
1863
01:29:31,219 --> 01:29:33,346
to come to her defence than now.
1864
01:29:33,487 --> 01:29:35,079
- Before he came to Flint,
Heston was interviewed
1865
01:29:35,223 --> 01:29:38,522
by the Georgetown Hoya
about Kayla's death,
1866
01:29:38,659 --> 01:29:41,093
and even his own NRA website
talked about it.
1867
01:29:41,229 --> 01:29:44,255
- We wanted to let the NRA know
that we haven't forgotten
1868
01:29:44,398 --> 01:29:45,660
about Kayla Rolland.
1869
01:29:45,800 --> 01:29:48,268
How could they come here?
To me, it's like they're rubbing
1870
01:29:48,402 --> 01:29:50,427
our nose in it. I was shocked
1871
01:29:50,571 --> 01:29:52,266
and appalled that
they would come here.
1872
01:29:52,406 --> 01:29:55,671
- Heston was asked by a local
reporter why he came to Flint
1873
01:29:55,810 --> 01:29:58,176
after the tragedy at Buell,
1874
01:29:58,312 --> 01:30:00,177
and what did the NRA
have to say
1875
01:30:00,314 --> 01:30:02,339
about six-year-olds using guns.
1876
01:30:02,483 --> 01:30:07,352
- We spend $20 million every year
1877
01:30:07,488 --> 01:30:10,616
and then we teach you...
to five and six-year-olds,
1878
01:30:10,758 --> 01:30:13,625
we say, "If you see a gun,
don't touch it,
1879
01:30:13,761 --> 01:30:16,127
leave the room, call an adult."
1880
01:30:16,264 --> 01:30:18,789
- And then Moses himself
showed up.
1881
01:30:18,933 --> 01:30:20,798
- Right here in the city
of Flint?
1882
01:30:20,935 --> 01:30:22,800
- Right here in Flint.
1883
01:30:22,937 --> 01:30:24,837
- Were there people that wanted
you to try this child,
1884
01:30:24,939 --> 01:30:26,907
Arthur Busch
County Prosecutor, Flint, Michigan
1885
01:30:27,041 --> 01:30:30,067
or even try him as an adult?
- Oh... Oh, yeah.
1886
01:30:30,211 --> 01:30:34,079
There were people from all over
America that wrote and called
1887
01:30:34,215 --> 01:30:38,584
and sent mail and...
It was amazing to me, um...
1888
01:30:38,719 --> 01:30:41,586
groups that were affiliated
with the NRA -
1889
01:30:41,722 --> 01:30:45,590
groups, you know, people
that I call "gun nuts" -
1890
01:30:45,726 --> 01:30:48,593
writing me and telling me
what a horrible thing it was
1891
01:30:48,729 --> 01:30:53,098
that I had admonished homeowners
in our country
1892
01:30:53,234 --> 01:30:57,102
to be careful about bringing
weapons into their home.
1893
01:30:57,238 --> 01:31:00,605
They wanted this little boy
hung from the highest tree.
1894
01:31:00,741 --> 01:31:03,608
I mean, there was such
an undercurrent of racism
1895
01:31:03,744 --> 01:31:06,212
and hate and anger.
1896
01:31:06,314 --> 01:31:08,043
It was ugly.
1897
01:31:10,451 --> 01:31:11,975
- That's a picture that
the little boy that was involved
1898
01:31:12,186 --> 01:31:13,448
in the Buell-school shooting...
1899
01:31:13,587 --> 01:31:15,612
Once he was brought back here
to our office,
1900
01:31:15,756 --> 01:31:18,122
about 15 minutes after
the shooting took place,
1901
01:31:18,259 --> 01:31:20,727
I gave him some crayons to kind
of occupy him a little bit.
1902
01:31:20,795 --> 01:31:22,729
Michael Caldwell
Police Detective
1903
01:31:22,797 --> 01:31:24,697
He came over and drew
that picture for me.
1904
01:31:24,765 --> 01:31:26,892
Because at the time, I had
pictures right behind my desk
1905
01:31:27,034 --> 01:31:29,901
that my children had drew for me
and he wanted to draw me one.
1906
01:31:30,037 --> 01:31:33,438
- This is what he drew for you.
What did he say this was?
1907
01:31:33,574 --> 01:31:34,768
- That's him at his house.
1908
01:31:34,909 --> 01:31:36,706
- That's him at his house,
right here.
1909
01:31:36,844 --> 01:31:41,076
And why did you decide
to hang on to it?
1910
01:31:41,215 --> 01:31:44,082
- Because of the gravity of the
situation and what had occurred
1911
01:31:44,218 --> 01:31:46,584
and he asked me to hang that
behind my desk,
1912
01:31:46,721 --> 01:31:49,622
so I put it in a frame
and that's where it'll stay.
1913
01:31:51,726 --> 01:31:55,093
- Tamarla Owens was the mother
of the six-year-old boy.
1914
01:31:55,229 --> 01:31:56,628
In order to get food stamps and
health care for her children,
1915
01:31:59,934 --> 01:32:02,095
Tamarla was forced to work as
part of the state of Michigan's
1916
01:32:02,236 --> 01:32:04,568
Welfare-to-Work Program.
1917
01:32:04,705 --> 01:32:06,764
This program was so successful
1918
01:32:06,907 --> 01:32:08,602
in tossing poor people
off welfare
1919
01:32:08,743 --> 01:32:10,176
that it's founder,
1920
01:32:10,311 --> 01:32:12,176
Gerald Miller, was soon hired
1921
01:32:12,313 --> 01:32:15,339
by the number-one firm in the
country that states turned to
1922
01:32:15,483 --> 01:32:19,783
to privatize
their welfare systems.
1923
01:32:19,920 --> 01:32:23,686
That firm was Lockheed Martin.
With the cold war over
1924
01:32:23,824 --> 01:32:26,292
and no enemy left
to frighten the public,
1925
01:32:26,427 --> 01:32:28,292
Lockheed had found
the perfect way to diversify
1926
01:32:28,429 --> 01:32:30,056
and the perfect way
1927
01:32:30,197 --> 01:32:32,062
to profit from people's fears,
1928
01:32:32,199 --> 01:32:34,064
with an enemy
much closer to home:
1929
01:32:34,201 --> 01:32:36,601
poor black mothers
1930
01:32:36,737 --> 01:32:38,398
like Tamarla Owens.
1931
01:32:38,539 --> 01:32:41,508
- We've got a one-parent family and
the mother's travelling 60 miles.
1932
01:32:41,609 --> 01:32:44,169
Sheriff Robert Pickell
Flint, Michigan
1933
01:32:44,278 --> 01:32:46,473
An hour, an hour and a half
away to go to work
1934
01:32:46,547 --> 01:32:48,538
an hour, an hour and a half
to come home.
1935
01:32:48,616 --> 01:32:50,914
How does that help a community?
But that's part of the state...
1936
01:32:51,052 --> 01:32:52,952
you know, making parents
responsible, making them work--
1937
01:32:53,087 --> 01:32:54,987
- Welfare to work.
- Welfare to work.
1938
01:32:55,122 --> 01:32:57,113
That's a program
that ought to be stopped
1939
01:32:57,258 --> 01:32:59,123
because it really has no merit.
1940
01:32:59,260 --> 01:33:01,125
I think it adds more
to the problem
1941
01:33:01,262 --> 01:33:03,127
than it does to solve it.
1942
01:33:03,264 --> 01:33:05,095
- Really?
- I do.
1943
01:33:05,232 --> 01:33:07,097
- You're the sheriff
and you feel this way.
1944
01:33:07,234 --> 01:33:11,102
- I do, I do. I wish I could put
two parents in every home
1945
01:33:11,238 --> 01:33:12,796
and make every parent
equally responsible,
1946
01:33:12,940 --> 01:33:14,237
but I can't do that.
1947
01:33:14,375 --> 01:33:16,240
But we're not doing anything
by taking one parent
1948
01:33:16,377 --> 01:33:19,244
and putting them on a bus
and sending them out of town
1949
01:33:19,380 --> 01:33:21,871
to make $5.50 an hour.
1950
01:33:22,016 --> 01:33:24,814
- This is the bus that she was
forced to ride every day
1951
01:33:24,952 --> 01:33:26,817
in order to work off
the welfare money
1952
01:33:26,954 --> 01:33:28,854
the state had given her.
1953
01:33:32,193 --> 01:33:34,559
She, and many others from Flint
who were poor,
1954
01:33:34,695 --> 01:33:37,562
would make the 80-mile
round-trip journey every day,
1955
01:33:37,698 --> 01:33:40,258
from Flint to Auburn Hills,
in Oakland County,
1956
01:33:40,401 --> 01:33:44,770
one of the wealthiest areas
in the country.
1957
01:33:44,905 --> 01:33:46,770
Tamarla would leave
1958
01:33:46,907 --> 01:33:50,343
early in the morning
and return late at night,
1959
01:33:50,478 --> 01:33:53,845
rarely seeing
her young children.
1960
01:33:53,981 --> 01:33:57,075
- What's the point in doing that?
Where does the state benefit?
1961
01:33:57,218 --> 01:33:59,584
Where does Flint and Genesee
County benefit from that?
1962
01:33:59,720 --> 01:34:02,587
We have a child dead.
I think that may be, in part,
1963
01:34:02,723 --> 01:34:04,588
part of the problem.
1964
01:34:04,725 --> 01:34:08,092
We drove the one parent out.
1965
01:34:08,229 --> 01:34:12,097
Now, you or anybody else
that can tell me
1966
01:34:12,233 --> 01:34:15,100
that that best serves
the community,
1967
01:34:15,236 --> 01:34:17,932
I shake my head and wonder why.
1968
01:34:18,072 --> 01:34:20,666
- How long you been riding
the bus?
1969
01:34:20,808 --> 01:34:22,241
- I've been working here
1970
01:34:22,376 --> 01:34:24,537
just about three years now.
- About three years?
1971
01:34:24,678 --> 01:34:28,045
- Yeah. My brother...
I got my brother working here,
1972
01:34:28,182 --> 01:34:30,047
half of my neighbourhood
works out here.
1973
01:34:30,184 --> 01:34:33,642
Just about everybody I know
personally works in the mall.
1974
01:34:33,787 --> 01:34:36,551
In Flint, doing the same thing
I'm doing now,
1975
01:34:36,690 --> 01:34:39,557
they only pay minimum wage
in Flint. I come 40 miles
1976
01:34:39,693 --> 01:34:42,059
to make three or four
dollars more an hour.
1977
01:34:42,196 --> 01:34:45,063
- How much do you make an hour?
- I make 8.50 now.
1978
01:34:45,199 --> 01:34:47,064
- Is that enough
to pay the bills?
1979
01:34:47,201 --> 01:34:48,600
- No.
1980
01:34:48,736 --> 01:34:50,829
- So did you know Tamarla Owens,
1981
01:34:50,971 --> 01:34:53,872
the woman whose son
shot the little girl?
1982
01:34:54,008 --> 01:34:56,568
I think she rode this bus.
- I knew her a little bit.
1983
01:34:56,710 --> 01:34:59,076
Not real good.
- Nice lady?
1984
01:34:59,213 --> 01:35:02,580
- Yeah, she was okay. She came
to work every day, did her job.
1985
01:35:02,716 --> 01:35:05,082
She worked two jobs, so...
- She worked two jobs?
1986
01:35:05,219 --> 01:35:07,779
- She was trying
to make ends meet.
1987
01:35:07,922 --> 01:35:09,787
"We're going hopping
We're going hopping today
1988
01:35:09,924 --> 01:35:11,585
"Where things are popping...
1989
01:35:11,725 --> 01:35:13,852
- This is Dick Clark's
American Bandstand Grill,
1990
01:35:13,994 --> 01:35:16,963
where Tamarla worked
one of her two jobs.
1991
01:35:17,097 --> 01:35:18,962
"On the Bandstand
Bandstand"
1992
01:35:19,099 --> 01:35:22,591
- I think she worked in this room
here, as a bartender,
1993
01:35:22,736 --> 01:35:26,536
fountain-person making drinks,
making shakes, desserts.
1994
01:35:26,674 --> 01:35:29,302
- Was she a good employee?
- Yeah, she was.
1995
01:35:29,443 --> 01:35:32,412
She also worked at the Fudgery,
in the mall here.
1996
01:35:35,249 --> 01:35:37,717
- Dick Clark is
an American icon,
1997
01:35:37,851 --> 01:35:40,911
the man who brought rock'n'roll
into our homes every week
1998
01:35:41,055 --> 01:35:41,953
on American Bandstand.
1999
01:35:42,089 --> 01:35:44,455
- Every part of your life,
you can link up
2000
01:35:44,592 --> 01:35:46,492
to a part of music, usually.
So, as Dick says,
2001
01:35:46,627 --> 01:35:48,561
"It's the soundtrack
of our lives."
2002
01:35:48,696 --> 01:35:51,756
Music's the soundtrack
of our lives.
2003
01:35:51,899 --> 01:35:54,060
- His restaurant and the
Fudgery, here in Auburn Hills,
2004
01:35:54,201 --> 01:35:56,897
applied for special tax breaks
because they were using
2005
01:35:57,037 --> 01:35:58,902
welfare people as employees.
2006
01:35:59,039 --> 01:36:01,234
Even though Tamarla worked
up to 70 hours a week
2007
01:36:01,375 --> 01:36:03,240
at these two jobs
2008
01:36:03,377 --> 01:36:06,904
in the mall, she did not earn
enough to pay her rent.
2009
01:36:07,047 --> 01:36:08,912
And one week before
the shooting,
2010
01:36:09,049 --> 01:36:10,812
was told by her landlord
2011
01:36:10,951 --> 01:36:12,816
that he was evicting her.
2012
01:36:12,953 --> 01:36:15,444
With nowhere to go
and not wanting to take
2013
01:36:15,589 --> 01:36:19,116
her two children out of school,
Tamarla asked her brother
2014
01:36:19,260 --> 01:36:21,660
if they could stay with him
for a few weeks.
2015
01:36:21,795 --> 01:36:23,592
It was there that Tamarla's son
2016
01:36:23,731 --> 01:36:28,498
found a small 32-calibre gun
and took it to school.
2017
01:36:28,636 --> 01:36:31,036
Tamarla did not see him
take the gun to school,
2018
01:36:31,171 --> 01:36:34,038
because she was on a state bus
to go serve drinks
2019
01:36:34,174 --> 01:36:36,540
and make fudge for rich people.
2020
01:36:36,677 --> 01:36:39,305
"Bandstand"
2021
01:36:42,449 --> 01:36:44,314
I decided to fly out
to California
2022
01:36:44,451 --> 01:36:47,249
to ask Dick Clark what
he thought about a system
2023
01:36:47,388 --> 01:36:49,686
that forces poor,
single mothers to work
2024
01:36:49,823 --> 01:36:52,053
two low-wage jobs to survive.
2025
01:36:52,192 --> 01:36:56,060
I'm doing a documentary
on these school shootings
2026
01:36:56,196 --> 01:36:58,061
and, you know,
guns and all that.
2027
01:36:58,198 --> 01:37:02,066
And in my hometown of Flint
Michigan, which you know,
2028
01:37:02,202 --> 01:37:04,568
this little six-year-old
shot a six-year-old--
2029
01:37:04,705 --> 01:37:07,572
- Get in the car, Dave!
Watch your arm, watch your arm.
2030
01:37:07,708 --> 01:37:10,575
- Oop, sorry, sorry.
- I'm sorry, we're really late.
2031
01:37:10,711 --> 01:37:13,578
- Anyways, but the mother of
the kid who did the shooting
2032
01:37:13,714 --> 01:37:16,080
works at Dick Clark's
All-American Grill...
2033
01:37:16,216 --> 01:37:18,081
- Forget it.
- ...in Oakland County...
2034
01:37:18,218 --> 01:37:20,083
- Close the door.
- A Welfare-to-work program--
2035
01:37:20,220 --> 01:37:22,085
- Close the door.
- These people are forced...
2036
01:37:22,222 --> 01:37:24,019
Dick, no...
- Bye-bye. Come on, move over!
2037
01:37:24,158 --> 01:37:27,025
- I want you to help me convince
the governor of Michigan...
2038
01:37:27,161 --> 01:37:30,028
It's a Welfare-to-work pro...
These women are forced to work!
2039
01:37:30,164 --> 01:37:32,029
They've got kids at home. Dick!
2040
01:37:32,166 --> 01:37:33,793
Ah, jeez!
2041
01:37:33,934 --> 01:37:36,528
In George Bush's America,
2042
01:37:36,670 --> 01:37:39,400
the poor were not a priority.
2043
01:37:39,540 --> 01:37:42,236
And after September 11th, 2001,
2044
01:37:42,376 --> 01:37:44,844
correcting America's
social problems
2045
01:37:44,978 --> 01:37:46,878
took a back seat to fear,
2046
01:37:47,014 --> 01:37:49,744
panic and a new set
of priorities.
2047
01:37:49,883 --> 01:37:52,545
- One way to express our unity
2048
01:37:52,686 --> 01:37:56,554
is for Congress to set
the military budget,
2049
01:37:56,690 --> 01:37:58,555
the defence of
the United States,
2050
01:37:58,692 --> 01:38:02,526
as the number-one priority
and fully fund my request!
2051
01:38:07,201 --> 01:38:09,294
- We've been selling
a lot of chemical suits,
2052
01:38:09,436 --> 01:38:12,064
with the gloves and the hoods.
2053
01:38:12,206 --> 01:38:14,367
And we've been selling
a lot of gas masks.
2054
01:38:14,508 --> 01:38:16,703
- I'm trying to get one
for myself and my puppy.
2055
01:38:16,844 --> 01:38:18,607
[female reporter]:
Denis Marks and his wife
2056
01:38:18,746 --> 01:38:19,906
have been stocking up supplies.
2057
01:38:20,047 --> 01:38:22,106
- Weapons, ammunition...
2058
01:38:22,249 --> 01:38:24,046
[ male reporter]: Wal-Mart says
after September 11th,
2059
01:38:24,184 --> 01:38:26,516
gun sales surged 70%,
2060
01:38:26,653 --> 01:38:28,746
ammunition up 140%.
2061
01:38:28,889 --> 01:38:30,880
In Dallas, they're
already taking potshots
2062
01:38:31,024 --> 01:38:32,889
at Osama bin Laden.
2063
01:38:33,026 --> 01:38:34,891
- In the months following
the 9/11 attacks,
2064
01:38:35,028 --> 01:38:38,725
we, Americans, were gripped
in a state of fear.
2065
01:38:38,866 --> 01:38:40,800
None of us knew
if we too would die
2066
01:38:40,934 --> 01:38:43,300
at the hands of the evildoers,
2067
01:38:43,437 --> 01:38:44,927
or who might be sitting
2068
01:38:45,072 --> 01:38:47,905
next to some crazy guy trying
to light his shoes on fire.
2069
01:38:48,041 --> 01:38:49,599
The threat seemed very real.
2070
01:38:49,743 --> 01:38:53,042
- Sounds a little paranoid but
I'm not gonna take the chance.
2071
01:38:53,180 --> 01:38:55,148
Just trying to protect
myself and my family.
2072
01:38:55,282 --> 01:38:57,182
- Our growing fears were turned
2073
01:38:57,317 --> 01:38:59,285
into a handsome profit
for many.
2074
01:38:59,420 --> 01:39:00,819
- Mike Blake has seen
2075
01:39:00,954 --> 01:39:02,979
a 30% increase in sales at ADT
2076
01:39:03,123 --> 01:39:04,249
over the last month.
2077
01:39:04,391 --> 01:39:07,121
Most of the people he talks to
are still a little uneasy
2078
01:39:07,261 --> 01:39:09,422
over the September 11th
terrorist attacks.
2079
01:39:09,563 --> 01:39:11,827
- How are we afraid of all these
things, it's because
2080
01:39:11,965 --> 01:39:14,957
a lot of people are making
a lot of money off of it
2081
01:39:15,102 --> 01:39:17,093
and a lot of careers off of it.
2082
01:39:17,237 --> 01:39:19,262
And so, there's
vested interests,
2083
01:39:19,406 --> 01:39:21,772
a lot of activity
to keep us afraid.
2084
01:39:21,909 --> 01:39:24,571
- And what better way to fight
box-cutter-wielding terrorists
2085
01:39:24,711 --> 01:39:27,077
than to order a record number
of fighter jets
2086
01:39:27,214 --> 01:39:29,011
from Lockheed?
2087
01:39:29,149 --> 01:39:31,947
Yes, everyone felt safer,
especially with the army
2088
01:39:32,085 --> 01:39:34,178
doing garbage detail
on Park Avenue.
2089
01:39:34,321 --> 01:39:36,414
And the greatest benefit
of all of a terrorized public
2090
01:39:36,557 --> 01:39:38,582
is that the corporate
2091
01:39:38,725 --> 01:39:43,594
and political leaders can get
away with just about anything.
2092
01:39:43,730 --> 01:39:45,595
- I've never seen
a better example
2093
01:39:45,732 --> 01:39:47,597
of cash-and-carry government
2094
01:39:47,734 --> 01:39:52,194
than this Bush administration
and Enron.
2095
01:39:52,339 --> 01:39:54,204
- There were a lot of things
that I didn't know
2096
01:39:54,341 --> 01:39:56,206
after the World Trade Center
attack,
2097
01:39:56,343 --> 01:40:00,541
but one thing was clear:
whether it was before or after
2098
01:40:00,681 --> 01:40:04,447
September 11th, a public that's
this out of control with fear
2099
01:40:04,585 --> 01:40:07,145
should not have a lot of guns
or ammo laying around.
2100
01:40:09,256 --> 01:40:13,625
- Well, I was shot with a Tech-9.
2101
01:40:13,760 --> 01:40:15,625
- Nine millimetre?
2102
01:40:15,762 --> 01:40:17,662
- Yeah. Yeah, I was, uh...
2103
01:40:19,766 --> 01:40:21,631
I guess it was supposed
to be semi-automatic,
2104
01:40:21,768 --> 01:40:24,066
but it kind of seemed like
fully automatic to me,
2105
01:40:24,204 --> 01:40:27,401
from what I remember.
- This is Richard Costaldo.
2106
01:40:27,541 --> 01:40:31,568
And this is Mark Taylor.
Both of these boys were shot
2107
01:40:31,712 --> 01:40:33,907
the day of
the Columbine massacre.
2108
01:40:34,047 --> 01:40:38,108
Richard is paralyzed for life
and in a wheelchair.
2109
01:40:38,252 --> 01:40:42,086
And Mark is barely standing
after numerous operations.
2110
01:40:42,222 --> 01:40:44,588
- The kids at Columbine
had to pay a penalty.
2111
01:40:44,725 --> 01:40:46,750
We paid a penalty that day...
for this nation.
2112
01:40:46,894 --> 01:40:48,759
The way we look at it.
2113
01:40:48,896 --> 01:40:51,763
- Mark and Richard were disabled
and suffering
2114
01:40:51,899 --> 01:40:56,268
from the 17-cent K-Mart bullets
still embedded in their bodies.
2115
01:40:56,403 --> 01:40:59,634
As they showed me the various
entry points for the bullets,
2116
01:40:59,773 --> 01:41:02,105
I thought of one way
we could reduce
2117
01:41:02,242 --> 01:41:06,269
the number of guns and bullets
laying around. I asked the boys
2118
01:41:06,413 --> 01:41:10,281
if they'd like to go to K-Mart
to return the merchandise.
2119
01:41:13,253 --> 01:41:15,517
- Ready?
- You... you go.
2120
01:41:34,074 --> 01:41:38,033
K-Mart Headquarters
Troy, Michigan
2121
01:41:52,893 --> 01:41:54,258
- Hi.
2122
01:41:54,394 --> 01:41:56,259
- Excuse me, will you turn
the camera off, please?
2123
01:41:56,396 --> 01:41:59,263
- We're here to see Mr. Conaway.
- You have to turn the camera off
2124
01:41:59,399 --> 01:42:02,197
while you're in the building.
- Oh, okay, all right.
2125
01:42:02,269 --> 01:42:04,032
Okay, turn it off now.
2126
01:42:04,938 --> 01:42:07,202
[ One hour later]
- Hey, Michael.
- Hi, how are you?
2127
01:42:07,274 --> 01:42:09,765
- I'm Mary Lorenz. I'm director
of Media Relations for K-Mart.
2128
01:42:09,910 --> 01:42:12,105
- Oh, good. All right, good.
- How can I help you today?
2129
01:42:12,245 --> 01:42:15,112
- Well, I'm here today...
This is Richard Costaldo.
2130
01:42:15,248 --> 01:42:17,614
- Richard, nice to meet you.
- And this is Mark Taylor.
2131
01:42:17,751 --> 01:42:20,117
- Mark.
- And they're students
2132
01:42:20,253 --> 01:42:24,053
from Columbine High School.
They were shot at Columbine,
2133
01:42:24,191 --> 01:42:27,183
in the massacre,
with bullets from K-Mart.
2134
01:42:27,327 --> 01:42:30,023
- You came a long way.
All the way from Colorado.
2135
01:42:30,163 --> 01:42:34,065
- Yeah, I just...
I was thinking that...
2136
01:42:34,201 --> 01:42:36,066
since you stopped selling
the handguns and all,
2137
01:42:36,203 --> 01:42:40,071
it'd kind of make sense to stop
selling the bullets too.
2138
01:42:40,207 --> 01:42:43,074
- Our request is that you get rid
of nine-millimetre bullets
2139
01:42:43,210 --> 01:42:45,405
and that you don't sell them
in the store completely.
2140
01:42:45,545 --> 01:42:48,070
- We do carry... You probably
are aware of K-Mart -
2141
01:42:48,215 --> 01:42:50,581
hopefully, you're shoppers
at our stores -
2142
01:42:50,717 --> 01:42:54,585
that we do only carry, you know,
sporting firearms
2143
01:42:54,721 --> 01:42:59,590
and the accessories
that go with the hunting sport.
2144
01:42:59,726 --> 01:43:03,093
And we'll certainly take your
message to our chairman and CEO,
2145
01:43:03,230 --> 01:43:05,494
Chuck Conaway.
He's not here today.
2146
01:43:05,632 --> 01:43:08,192
- He's not here today?
- No. He's not here, actually,
2147
01:43:08,335 --> 01:43:10,895
this whole week.
- Not at all during the week?
2148
01:43:11,038 --> 01:43:13,905
Do you have a limit on the
number of bullets, ammunition,
2149
01:43:14,041 --> 01:43:15,906
that people can purchase?
- You know, I can't answer
2150
01:43:16,043 --> 01:43:18,102
these questions for you.
I'm not the merchandiser
2151
01:43:18,245 --> 01:43:19,644
who places those products
in our stores.
2152
01:43:19,780 --> 01:43:20,974
- Can we speak to that person?
2153
01:43:21,114 --> 01:43:23,173
- But I can get answers
to those questions for you.
2154
01:43:23,316 --> 01:43:25,807
If you leave your card, I could
get those answers for you.
2155
01:43:25,952 --> 01:43:27,419
- We don't want to leave a card.
2156
01:43:27,554 --> 01:43:29,715
The reason why
we can't take a card
2157
01:43:29,856 --> 01:43:31,756
and come back
is because Mark here,
2158
01:43:31,892 --> 01:43:34,759
he's got a K-Mart bullet
just an inch away... right?
2159
01:43:34,895 --> 01:43:36,760
- Yeah.
- From your aorta.
2160
01:43:36,897 --> 01:43:40,128
- In between my aorta and spine.
- Between your aorta and spine.
2161
01:43:40,267 --> 01:43:42,963
- I'm glad to see that
you're still able to stand.
2162
01:43:43,103 --> 01:43:45,571
- And I told him that somebody
here would listen,
2163
01:43:45,706 --> 01:43:48,072
somebody here would... would...
2164
01:43:48,208 --> 01:43:52,076
would take the request
seriously. Not just a PR person,
2165
01:43:52,212 --> 01:43:54,077
but somebody who has some
authority and can answer
2166
01:43:54,214 --> 01:43:56,648
some of the questions
that they want answered.
2167
01:43:56,783 --> 01:43:58,648
- K-Mart does care about this,
2168
01:43:58,785 --> 01:44:00,650
but I can't go any further
right now.
2169
01:44:00,787 --> 01:44:02,652
So until I make a call, um,
2170
01:44:02,789 --> 01:44:05,280
I'm gonna go back to the office
2171
01:44:05,425 --> 01:44:07,950
and see if there's anyone
in merchandising...
2172
01:44:08,095 --> 01:44:11,394
- Mary went back upstairs.
And two hours later,
2173
01:44:11,531 --> 01:44:14,398
she brought down this guy whose
job it is to buy the bullets
2174
01:44:14,534 --> 01:44:15,899
for K-Mart.
2175
01:44:16,036 --> 01:44:18,596
- Good. Stay out of trouble.
- Yes.
2176
01:44:18,739 --> 01:44:20,900
- We're not the ones in trouble,
guys.
2177
01:44:21,041 --> 01:44:23,100
Mark thought he'd show him
his bullet wounds.
2178
01:44:23,243 --> 01:44:25,040
Those are his bullet holes.
- Hm.
2179
01:44:25,178 --> 01:44:27,043
- From your bullets.
2180
01:44:27,180 --> 01:44:29,808
That's where the K-Mart bullets
went in.
2181
01:44:29,950 --> 01:44:31,815
- Well, take care.
2182
01:44:31,952 --> 01:44:34,546
- Is anybody else gonna
come down?
2183
01:44:34,688 --> 01:44:36,553
Is anybody else gonna come down?
Is that it?
2184
01:44:36,690 --> 01:44:38,920
- I'll check.
- Okay, thank you.
2185
01:44:39,059 --> 01:44:41,550
We waited around
a couple more hours
2186
01:44:41,695 --> 01:44:43,822
but no one else came down.
2187
01:44:43,964 --> 01:44:46,933
As we left the building,
Mark came up with an idea.
2188
01:44:47,067 --> 01:44:48,932
He suggested that we go
2189
01:44:49,069 --> 01:44:53,836
to the nearest K-Mart
and buy out all their bullets.
2190
01:44:53,974 --> 01:44:56,772
- Just take as many of those
as you can.
2191
01:44:56,910 --> 01:44:59,276
- Yeah, you can come around here
and look.
2192
01:44:59,412 --> 01:45:02,006
- What else do we have over here?
2193
01:45:02,149 --> 01:45:05,016
You got 357. Sure, I'll take 'em
all, take everything you got.
2194
01:45:05,152 --> 01:45:07,586
- So you're 17? You're what?
- Sixteen.
2195
01:45:07,721 --> 01:45:09,086
- Wait.
2196
01:45:09,222 --> 01:45:11,087
- Oh, shit!
2197
01:45:11,224 --> 01:45:13,522
- Oh, my God...
2198
01:45:13,660 --> 01:45:16,595
- Mark pretty much cleaned them
out of their ammunition.
2199
01:45:16,730 --> 01:45:19,961
And the next day, we decided to
go back to K-Mart headquarters
2200
01:45:20,100 --> 01:45:22,125
with all the bullets.
This time,
2201
01:45:22,302 --> 01:45:23,792
we brought the press.
2202
01:45:24,004 --> 01:45:25,335
- Our local first coverage
of south-eastern Michigan
2203
01:45:25,505 --> 01:45:27,029
continues now
with all-new stories.
2204
01:45:29,943 --> 01:45:31,968
- Coming up here on
our six-o'clock report,
2205
01:45:32,112 --> 01:45:33,841
a warning to everyone this
summer to watch out for snakes.
2206
01:45:33,947 --> 01:45:36,916
You'll hear from a mom who was
bitten by a rattlesnake.
2207
01:45:37,050 --> 01:45:38,915
- And also, students who survived
the Columbine massacre
2208
01:45:39,052 --> 01:45:42,544
are in town.
They are very angry with K-Mart.
2209
01:45:42,689 --> 01:45:45,658
- We're here to see Chuck
Conaway, the chairman of K-Mart.
2210
01:45:45,792 --> 01:45:47,555
- How you doing, sir?
It's always a pleasure.
2211
01:45:47,694 --> 01:45:51,061
Okay, uh...
2212
01:45:51,198 --> 01:45:54,099
They would like to speak
to Mr. Conaway.
2213
01:45:54,234 --> 01:45:58,000
- Here's the nine-millimetres.
2214
01:45:58,138 --> 01:46:00,663
These are the bullets
that are in both Richard
2215
01:46:00,807 --> 01:46:03,105
and in Mark's body right now.
2216
01:46:10,650 --> 01:46:11,674
- Move your group outside.
2217
01:46:11,818 --> 01:46:13,718
I'll have somebody here
in five minutes.
2218
01:46:13,854 --> 01:46:15,378
- Do me a favour,
don't block the door.
2219
01:46:15,522 --> 01:46:17,046
Just off to the side,
if you would.
2220
01:46:17,190 --> 01:46:18,748
- Will go outside and
somebody will come out.
2221
01:46:18,892 --> 01:46:19,950
- My name's Laurie McTavish.
2222
01:46:20,093 --> 01:46:22,653
I'm the Vice-president of
Communications for K-Mart.
2223
01:46:22,796 --> 01:46:26,027
I'm happy to deliver a statement
on behalf of the company.
2224
01:46:26,166 --> 01:46:29,533
What happened in Columbine,
Colorado, was truly tragic
2225
01:46:29,669 --> 01:46:31,534
and touched every American.
2226
01:46:31,671 --> 01:46:34,037
We're sorry for the...
2227
01:46:34,174 --> 01:46:36,233
disadvantage to this young man.
2228
01:46:36,376 --> 01:46:39,038
K-Mart is phasing out the sale
of handgun ammunition.
2229
01:46:39,179 --> 01:46:42,478
The business plan calls
for this to be complete
2230
01:46:42,616 --> 01:46:46,552
in the continental U.S.
within the next 90 days.
2231
01:46:46,686 --> 01:46:48,051
- Wow! Wow!
2232
01:46:48,188 --> 01:46:50,053
- K-Mart representatives met
with Mr. Moore
2233
01:46:50,190 --> 01:46:52,556
and the students from Columbine,
Colorado, yesterday,
2234
01:46:52,692 --> 01:46:55,559
and listened to their concerns
about the product
2235
01:46:55,695 --> 01:46:57,560
carried in K-Mart stores.
2236
01:46:57,697 --> 01:47:00,564
The company committed,
at the end of that meeting,
2237
01:47:00,700 --> 01:47:04,431
that K-Mart would have an answer
for them within a week's time.
2238
01:47:04,571 --> 01:47:07,438
- Well, the first thing we want
to do is thank you
2239
01:47:07,574 --> 01:47:11,066
for committing to no longer
selling handgun ammunition
2240
01:47:11,211 --> 01:47:13,076
in your stores.
And within 90 days--
2241
01:47:13,213 --> 01:47:15,579
- The process will be phased out
within 90 days.
2242
01:47:15,715 --> 01:47:18,081
- And after 90 days,
there will be no more selling
2243
01:47:18,218 --> 01:47:21,085
of ammunition that can go into
handguns or assault weapons.
2244
01:47:21,221 --> 01:47:23,416
- Firearm ammunition, will be...
We will not sell it,
2245
01:47:23,556 --> 01:47:25,421
after 90 days, in our stores.
2246
01:47:25,558 --> 01:47:28,356
- We greatly appreciate that.
- Thank you.
2247
01:47:28,495 --> 01:47:30,554
- Thank you very much. Thank you.
That's very brave.
2248
01:47:33,667 --> 01:47:35,328
Thank you. Wow!
2249
01:47:35,468 --> 01:47:38,699
That blows my mind. That's
more than what we asked for.
2250
01:47:38,838 --> 01:47:41,534
- It's remarkable.
- Yeah. Well, like I told you--
2251
01:47:41,675 --> 01:47:43,540
- I didn't think--
- Did you think?
2252
01:47:43,677 --> 01:47:45,542
- No!
- We're like, uh...
2253
01:47:45,679 --> 01:47:49,775
We're just getting ready to...
We're going to the airport.
2254
01:47:49,916 --> 01:47:52,544
The kids from Columbine had
scored an overwhelming victory
2255
01:47:52,686 --> 01:47:54,551
against K-Mart
and it inspired me
2256
01:47:54,688 --> 01:47:58,784
to do something that
I knew I had to do.
2257
01:47:58,925 --> 01:48:01,485
All I needed... was a star map.
2258
01:48:06,700 --> 01:48:09,066
[ ringing gate bell ]
2259
01:48:09,202 --> 01:48:11,102
[ phone ringing ]
2260
01:48:22,215 --> 01:48:24,012
- Hello?
- Mr. Heston?
2261
01:48:24,150 --> 01:48:26,015
- Yeah.
- This is Michael Moore.
2262
01:48:26,152 --> 01:48:27,517
- Yes.
- The film-maker?
2263
01:48:27,654 --> 01:48:29,519
- Yes, of course.
- Yes. How you doing?
2264
01:48:29,656 --> 01:48:31,021
- Fine, thank you.
2265
01:48:31,157 --> 01:48:34,024
- Listen, I was wondering
if maybe I could talk to you.
2266
01:48:34,160 --> 01:48:37,857
We're making a documentary
about the whole gun issue.
2267
01:48:37,998 --> 01:48:39,863
And I'm a member of the NRA.
2268
01:48:40,000 --> 01:48:42,525
I thought maybe we could talk
a little bit about--
2269
01:48:42,669 --> 01:48:44,534
- Tell you what, let me look
at my calendar.
2270
01:48:44,671 --> 01:48:47,037
I may be able to give you
some time tomorrow.
2271
01:48:47,173 --> 01:48:50,040
I have some people here now.
- Okay, well, how can I--
2272
01:48:50,176 --> 01:48:51,541
Pardon me?
- Hold the phone.
2273
01:48:51,678 --> 01:48:53,270
- Okay, thank you.
- Okay.
2274
01:48:53,413 --> 01:48:56,041
I can give you a little time
tomorrow morning.
2275
01:48:56,182 --> 01:48:58,047
I think that's Thursday.
- Yes.
2276
01:48:58,184 --> 01:49:00,550
- Let's say 8:30.
- Eight-thirty in the morning?
2277
01:49:00,687 --> 01:49:02,552
- Yeah. Okay?
- Okay. And just come here?
2278
01:49:02,689 --> 01:49:05,351
- Yes.
- Okay, good.
2279
01:49:08,661 --> 01:49:10,561
[ phone ringing ]
- Hello?
2280
01:49:10,697 --> 01:49:13,063
- Hi. It's Michael Moore here
to see Charlton Heston.
2281
01:49:13,199 --> 01:49:15,099
- Okay.
[ beeping ]
2282
01:49:19,205 --> 01:49:21,105
[ theme music from
"Mr. Roger's Neighborhood" ]
2283
01:49:34,721 --> 01:49:37,121
- Hi. Good morning.
2284
01:49:42,228 --> 01:49:44,594
How are you?
- Fine.
2285
01:49:44,731 --> 01:49:46,995
- Thank you very much
for agreeing to see me.
2286
01:49:55,241 --> 01:49:57,607
He took me out
to his pool-and-tennis house
2287
01:49:57,744 --> 01:49:59,609
so we could have a chat.
2288
01:49:59,746 --> 01:50:02,681
I told him that I was
a lifetime member of the NRA
2289
01:50:02,816 --> 01:50:04,943
and showed him
my membership card.
2290
01:50:05,085 --> 01:50:06,882
- Good for you. Well done.
2291
01:50:07,020 --> 01:50:08,885
- I assume you have guns
in the house here?
2292
01:50:09,022 --> 01:50:12,116
- Indeed I do.
Bad guys take notice!
2293
01:50:12,258 --> 01:50:14,123
- So you have them
for protection?
2294
01:50:14,260 --> 01:50:16,125
- Yeah. Sure.
- Have you ever been
2295
01:50:16,262 --> 01:50:18,127
a victim of crime?
- No. No.
2296
01:50:18,264 --> 01:50:22,030
- Never been assaulted or...?
- No.
2297
01:50:22,168 --> 01:50:24,966
- No violence toward you,
but you have guns in the house.
2298
01:50:25,105 --> 01:50:27,073
- Loaded.
- They're loaded?
2299
01:50:27,207 --> 01:50:29,573
- Well, if you really needed
a weapon for self-defence,
2300
01:50:29,709 --> 01:50:31,574
you need it loaded.
- Okay, but why...
2301
01:50:31,711 --> 01:50:33,576
why do you need it for
self-defence? Because--
2302
01:50:33,713 --> 01:50:35,578
- I don't.
- Yeah, you've never been
2303
01:50:35,715 --> 01:50:37,580
a victim of crime,
you haven't been assaulted.
2304
01:50:37,717 --> 01:50:39,582
- No, that's true.
- You haven't been, you know...
2305
01:50:39,719 --> 01:50:43,086
Why would you... So why not...
Why don't you unload the gun?
2306
01:50:43,223 --> 01:50:46,590
- Because the second amendment
gives me the right
2307
01:50:46,726 --> 01:50:48,591
to have it loaded.
- I agree.
2308
01:50:48,728 --> 01:50:51,094
I totally agree with that.
I'm just saying... I mean,
2309
01:50:51,231 --> 01:50:52,596
the second amendment gives me--
2310
01:50:52,732 --> 01:50:54,597
- Let's say it's
a comfort factor.
2311
01:50:54,734 --> 01:50:57,601
- It gives you comfort to know
that there's a loaded gun.
2312
01:50:57,737 --> 01:50:59,102
- Yeah.
2313
01:50:59,239 --> 01:51:02,106
- Comfort meaning that it allows
you to relax and feel safe?
2314
01:51:02,242 --> 01:51:04,107
- Not worry about it.
- Not worry, not be afraid.
2315
01:51:04,244 --> 01:51:06,041
- And I'm not really, but, uh...
2316
01:51:06,179 --> 01:51:10,616
I'm exercising one of the rights
passed on down to me
2317
01:51:10,750 --> 01:51:13,617
from those wise, old, dead white
guys that invented this country.
2318
01:51:13,753 --> 01:51:16,722
If it was good enough for them,
it's good enough for me.
2319
01:51:16,856 --> 01:51:18,517
- But you could still
exercise the right,
2320
01:51:18,658 --> 01:51:21,092
just by having a gun unloaded
and locked away somewhere.
2321
01:51:21,227 --> 01:51:22,387
- I choose to have it.
2322
01:51:22,529 --> 01:51:25,054
- What sort of strikes me
as interesting is that,
2323
01:51:25,198 --> 01:51:28,065
in other countries, where
they don't have the murder rate,
2324
01:51:28,201 --> 01:51:30,066
the gun-murder rate
that we have, that, uh...
2325
01:51:30,203 --> 01:51:32,068
many people say,
2326
01:51:32,205 --> 01:51:34,070
"Well, that's because
they don't have guns around.
2327
01:51:34,207 --> 01:51:37,074
It's hard to get a gun in
Britain or Germany or whatever."
2328
01:51:37,210 --> 01:51:41,078
But we went to Canada and
there's seven million guns
2329
01:51:41,214 --> 01:51:43,205
in 10-million homes.
- There won't be very long.
2330
01:51:43,349 --> 01:51:44,873
- But hear me out, though.
- Okay.
2331
01:51:45,018 --> 01:51:46,576
- Canada is a nation of hunters,
2332
01:51:46,719 --> 01:51:48,584
millions of guns,
2333
01:51:48,721 --> 01:51:51,588
and yet, they had just
a few murders last year.
2334
01:51:51,724 --> 01:51:53,589
That's it. A country
of 30-million people.
2335
01:51:53,726 --> 01:51:56,593
Now, why - here's my question -
why is it that...
2336
01:51:56,729 --> 01:51:58,720
that they've got all these guns
laying around,
2337
01:51:58,865 --> 01:52:00,730
yet they don't kill each other
2338
01:52:00,867 --> 01:52:02,732
at the level that
we kill each other?
2339
01:52:02,869 --> 01:52:05,099
- I think American history is...
2340
01:52:05,238 --> 01:52:07,604
uh... has a lot of blood
2341
01:52:07,740 --> 01:52:09,605
on its hands.
- And Germany history doesn't?
2342
01:52:09,742 --> 01:52:11,607
- No.
- And British history?
2343
01:52:11,744 --> 01:52:14,110
- I don't think as much.
- Oh, are you...
2344
01:52:14,247 --> 01:52:16,613
Germans don't have as much,
blood on their hands?
2345
01:52:16,749 --> 01:52:19,115
- Uh, they do, yes.
- The Brits, they ruled the world
2346
01:52:19,252 --> 01:52:21,618
for 300 years
at the barrel of a gun.
2347
01:52:21,754 --> 01:52:25,053
They're all violent people. They
have bad guys, they have crime,
2348
01:52:25,191 --> 01:52:27,557
they have lots of guns--
2349
01:52:27,694 --> 01:52:31,562
- Well, it's an interesting
point, which can be explored
2350
01:52:31,698 --> 01:52:35,065
and you're good to explore it
at great lengths,
2351
01:52:35,201 --> 01:52:38,068
but I think that's about all
I have to say on it.
2352
01:52:38,204 --> 01:52:41,071
- You don't have any opinion,
though, as to why that is,
2353
01:52:41,207 --> 01:52:43,072
that we are the unique country,
the only country,
2354
01:52:43,209 --> 01:52:46,076
that does this, that kills each
other on this level, with guns?
2355
01:52:46,212 --> 01:52:50,080
- Well, we have, probably,
more mixed ethnicity
2356
01:52:50,216 --> 01:52:53,583
than other countries,
some other countries.
2357
01:52:53,720 --> 01:52:55,585
- You think it's an ethnic thing?
2358
01:52:55,722 --> 01:52:57,587
- No, I don't. It's...
2359
01:52:57,724 --> 01:52:59,589
I wouldn't go so far
as to say that.
2360
01:52:59,726 --> 01:53:03,093
We had enough problems with
civil rights in the beginning.
2361
01:53:03,229 --> 01:53:07,097
It's... But, uh, I have
no answer for that.
2362
01:53:07,233 --> 01:53:09,599
- What do you mean, you think
it's a mixed ethnicity?
2363
01:53:09,736 --> 01:53:11,601
I don't understand.
2364
01:53:11,738 --> 01:53:13,603
- You said, "How is it that..."
- That we're unique.
2365
01:53:13,740 --> 01:53:17,608
- "So many Americans
kill each other?"
2366
01:53:17,744 --> 01:53:20,008
I don't know that that's true,
but, uh...
2367
01:53:20,146 --> 01:53:21,511
- Well, no, you know that.
2368
01:53:21,648 --> 01:53:24,549
We know we have the highest
murder rate with guns.
2369
01:53:24,684 --> 01:53:26,549
It's way higher
than any other country.
2370
01:53:26,686 --> 01:53:30,053
- The only answer I can give you
is the one I already gave you.
2371
01:53:30,189 --> 01:53:33,056
- Which is?
- Which is that we have, uh...
2372
01:53:33,192 --> 01:53:36,059
- Historically--
- ...a history of violence.
2373
01:53:36,195 --> 01:53:39,562
Perhaps more than most
countries. Not more than Russia,
2374
01:53:39,699 --> 01:53:42,566
not more than Japan or China--
- Not more than Germany.
2375
01:53:42,702 --> 01:53:47,196
- Not more than Germany,
but certainly more than Canada.
2376
01:53:47,340 --> 01:53:50,070
- I come from Flint, Michigan,
and last year,
2377
01:53:50,209 --> 01:53:53,076
a little six-year-old boy
took a gun into a classroom
2378
01:53:53,212 --> 01:53:56,181
and shot and killed a
six-year-old girl. And, uh...
2379
01:53:56,316 --> 01:53:58,511
it was really a tragic thing--
2380
01:53:58,651 --> 01:54:01,620
- This was a kid, though.
- A six-year-old, yeah.
2381
01:54:01,754 --> 01:54:03,187
Did you hear about this?
2382
01:54:03,323 --> 01:54:05,985
A six-year-old shooting
a six-year-old?
2383
01:54:06,125 --> 01:54:07,558
- Yeah.
- Well, here's my question.
2384
01:54:07,694 --> 01:54:08,592
After that happened,
2385
01:54:08,728 --> 01:54:10,593
you came to Flint
and held a big rally.
2386
01:54:10,730 --> 01:54:12,095
- Mm-hm.
2387
01:54:12,231 --> 01:54:14,597
- And, you know, I just--
2388
01:54:14,734 --> 01:54:17,100
- So did the vice-president.
2389
01:54:17,236 --> 01:54:20,103
- Yeah, but did you feel it was
being at all insensitive
2390
01:54:20,239 --> 01:54:22,605
to the fact that this community
had just gone through--
2391
01:54:22,742 --> 01:54:25,540
- Actually, I wasn't aware
of that at the time we came.
2392
01:54:25,678 --> 01:54:29,045
We came and did an
early-morning, uh... rally,
2393
01:54:29,182 --> 01:54:31,047
then went on to wherever
we were going.
2394
01:54:31,184 --> 01:54:34,051
- You didn't know at the time,
that this killing had happened?
2395
01:54:34,187 --> 01:54:36,052
- No.
- Had you known, would you have--
2396
01:54:36,189 --> 01:54:38,054
- Would I have cancelled
the... uh...
2397
01:54:38,191 --> 01:54:40,056
- Yeah.
- I don't...
2398
01:54:40,193 --> 01:54:41,558
Hard to say.
2399
01:54:41,694 --> 01:54:43,559
- It wasn't like it was
already planned.
2400
01:54:43,696 --> 01:54:45,561
I mean, the choice to come there
was made
2401
01:54:45,698 --> 01:54:47,563
after this horrible
killing took place.
2402
01:54:47,700 --> 01:54:49,065
- Yeah. Mm-hm.
2403
01:54:49,202 --> 01:54:52,069
- You know, had you know that,
would you have come?
2404
01:54:52,205 --> 01:54:55,072
- I don't know. I have no idea.
2405
01:54:55,208 --> 01:54:57,199
- Maybe not. Maybe not.
- Okay. Thank you.
2406
01:54:57,343 --> 01:55:00,574
- You think you'd like to just
maybe apologize to the people
2407
01:55:00,713 --> 01:55:03,580
in Flint for coming and doing
that at that time, or...?
2408
01:55:03,716 --> 01:55:05,581
- You want me to apologize...
2409
01:55:05,718 --> 01:55:07,583
me, apologize to the people
in Flint?
2410
01:55:07,720 --> 01:55:09,620
- Or the people in Columbine
2411
01:55:09,756 --> 01:55:12,088
for coming after
their horrible tragedy.
2412
01:55:12,225 --> 01:55:14,591
Why do you go to the places
after they have
2413
01:55:14,727 --> 01:55:17,093
these horrible tragedies? I'm
a member of your group here--
2414
01:55:17,230 --> 01:55:20,097
- Well, I'm afraid
we don't agree on... on that.
2415
01:55:20,233 --> 01:55:22,599
- You think it's okay
to just come and show up
2416
01:55:22,735 --> 01:55:25,033
at these events.
- No.
2417
01:55:25,171 --> 01:55:27,071
- You don't think it's okay?
2418
01:55:38,084 --> 01:55:40,780
Mr. Heston, just one more thing.
2419
01:55:40,920 --> 01:55:42,785
This is who she is -
2420
01:55:42,922 --> 01:55:45,516
or was. This is her.
2421
01:55:45,658 --> 01:55:47,523
Mr. Heston, please don't leave.
2422
01:55:47,660 --> 01:55:50,356
Mr. Heston, please,
take a look at her.
2423
01:55:50,496 --> 01:55:53,090
This is the girl.
2424
01:56:44,150 --> 01:56:47,551
I left the Heston estate
atop Beverly Hills
2425
01:56:47,687 --> 01:56:49,655
and walked back
into the real world,
2426
01:56:49,789 --> 01:56:53,020
an America living
and breathing in fear...
2427
01:56:53,159 --> 01:56:55,059
In your mind,
you imagine somebody
2428
01:56:55,194 --> 01:56:58,061
who might break into your house,
to harm you or your family.
2429
01:56:58,197 --> 01:57:01,564
What does that person look like?
2430
01:57:01,701 --> 01:57:04,534
- You. Her. Him.
The camera guy, anybody.
2431
01:57:04,670 --> 01:57:07,036
Could be a gun in the camera,
I don't know.
2432
01:57:07,173 --> 01:57:09,835
- Where gun sales were now
at an all-time high...
2433
01:57:09,976 --> 01:57:13,070
- Can shoot as fast as
Wesson semi-automatic.
2434
01:57:13,212 --> 01:57:15,180
- And where, in the end,
2435
01:57:15,314 --> 01:57:17,373
it all comes back to bowling
2436
01:57:17,517 --> 01:57:19,382
for Columbine.
2437
01:57:19,519 --> 01:57:22,044
- Three bowling-alley employees
shot to death Sunday night
2438
01:57:22,188 --> 01:57:23,587
at the AMF Broadway Lanes.
2439
01:57:23,723 --> 01:57:26,521
- There's nothing I really know.
I really don't know anything.
2440
01:57:26,659 --> 01:57:29,184
- Just that three people died.
- Right.
2441
01:57:29,328 --> 01:57:30,852
- In Littleton,
in a bowling alley.
2442
01:57:30,997 --> 01:57:32,555
I'm sorry.
2443
01:57:34,700 --> 01:57:37,965
Yes, it was a glorious time
to be an American.
2444
01:57:43,843 --> 01:57:47,540
"I see trees of green
2445
01:57:47,680 --> 01:57:50,046
"Red roses too
2446
01:57:50,182 --> 01:57:53,049
"I see them bloom
2447
01:57:53,185 --> 01:57:55,050
"For me and you
2448
01:57:55,187 --> 01:57:59,055
"And I think to myself
2449
01:57:59,191 --> 01:58:02,592
"What a wonderful world
2450
01:58:06,699 --> 01:58:10,066
"I see skies of blue
2451
01:58:10,202 --> 01:58:13,069
"And clouds of white
2452
01:58:13,205 --> 01:58:15,571
"The bright sunny day
2453
01:58:15,708 --> 01:58:18,074
"The dark sacred night
2454
01:58:18,210 --> 01:58:22,078
"And I think to myself
2455
01:58:22,214 --> 01:58:25,547
"What a wonderful world
2456
01:58:30,156 --> 01:58:32,021
"The colours of the rainbow
2457
01:58:32,158 --> 01:58:35,525
"All so pretty in the sky
2458
01:58:35,661 --> 01:58:38,027
"Are also on the faces
2459
01:58:38,164 --> 01:58:40,530
"Of the people walking by
2460
01:58:40,666 --> 01:58:43,533
"I see friends shakin' hands
2461
01:58:43,669 --> 01:58:47,036
"Sayin' How do you do
2462
01:58:47,173 --> 01:58:50,040
"They're really saying
2463
01:58:50,176 --> 01:58:52,041
"I love you
2464
01:58:52,178 --> 01:58:56,046
"I see babies cryin'
2465
01:58:56,182 --> 01:58:58,548
"I watch them grow
2466
01:58:58,684 --> 01:59:00,549
"They'll learn much more
2467
01:59:00,686 --> 01:59:03,553
"Than I'll ever know
2468
01:59:03,689 --> 01:59:07,557
"And I think to myself
2469
01:59:07,693 --> 01:59:11,094
"What a wonderful world
2470
01:59:15,201 --> 01:59:19,069
"And I think to myself
2471
01:59:19,205 --> 01:59:22,606
"What a wonderful world...
2472
01:59:32,218 --> 01:59:36,120
"And I say to myself
2473
01:59:40,226 --> 01:59:44,094
"What a wonderful
2474
01:59:44,230 --> 01:59:46,858
"World"
202358
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