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In 1963 World in Action made a film
about these seven year old children
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they talked about their homes, their
schools and what they wanted to be
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they were filmed again
when they were fourteen
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we've brought them all
together to watch the films
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because this year
they are twenty-one
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what are they
doing now?
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How have they changed?
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What sort of people are they?
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Stop it at once!
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Give me a child until he is seven
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and I will give you the man
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When I leave the
school I'm going to..
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Colet Court
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and then I will be going to
Rossminster Boarding School
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if I pass the exam
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and then we think I'm going to
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Cambridge and Trinity Hall
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Well...
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before I'm old and that,
enough to get a job
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I'll just walk around and
see what I can find
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I want to be a jockey
when I grow up yeah
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When I leave school
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I'm going to The
Dragon School, I might
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and after I might go to
Charterhouse Marlborough
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What about university Charlie?
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I might go to Oxford
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What does university mean?
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Well...
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Well I don't think I
need to go to university
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'cause I'm not going
to be a teacher
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I don't think you have
to go to university
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if you want to
be an astronaut
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00:02:01,275 --> 00:02:03,132
When I leave this school
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I'm down for Heathfield
and Fairfield Manor
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00:02:07,271 --> 00:02:11,758
and then maybe I may
want to go to university
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but I don't know
which one yet
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I will buy myself a nice
new made house, you know
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One that's all
nice and comfy
39
00:02:20,331 --> 00:02:22,631
I'm going to work in Woolworths
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00:02:22,880 --> 00:02:25,783
Well, going to Africa
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00:02:25,784 --> 00:02:29,600
and try and teach people
who are not civilised
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00:02:30,259 --> 00:02:33,208
to be, more or less good
43
00:02:33,209 --> 00:02:36,060
When I grow up I'd like to
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00:02:36,061 --> 00:02:39,322
find out all about
the moon and all that
45
00:02:39,616 --> 00:02:43,265
It's just that the limitations
of such things as :
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What the audience
require and the time
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don't allow it to
be a real study
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I mean if we accept this
49
00:02:51,562 --> 00:02:53,472
then it....
50
00:02:53,473 --> 00:02:55,756
Okay I think it's probably
good entertainment
51
00:02:55,757 --> 00:02:57,810
I don't think we've
changed that much
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00:02:57,811 --> 00:03:00,370
I think we talk,
no I don't mean looks
53
00:03:00,371 --> 00:03:03,258
I mean the way we talk I don't
think we've changed that much
54
00:03:03,259 --> 00:03:05,491
Well you never lose an
Eastend accent do you
55
00:03:05,492 --> 00:03:08,280
I tell you what, as it goes
you've definitely changed
56
00:03:08,281 --> 00:03:09,481
- You think so yeah?
- In facial
57
00:03:09,482 --> 00:03:11,505
You haven't changed
a bit have you?
58
00:03:11,506 --> 00:03:13,058
Don't you think so?
I thought I'd got bigger
59
00:03:13,093 --> 00:03:14,513
You might be about
an inch bigger yeah
60
00:03:14,942 --> 00:03:16,802
- An inch?
- I know it's unbelievable
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00:03:16,803 --> 00:03:19,192
That's something I did notice,
the way our teeth have changed
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Teeth?
63
00:03:21,482 --> 00:03:22,482
Yes
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00:03:22,483 --> 00:03:24,896
- Mine were out like that and I had them
shoved back - Well I noticed the ears actually
65
00:03:24,897 --> 00:03:28,573
Have you not noticed that a lot of people...
your ears have been made real fun about them
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They've got they're
conclusions settled already
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00:03:33,654 --> 00:03:34,513
They must
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00:03:34,514 --> 00:03:38,594
...met here today
and we've seen the films
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00:03:38,595 --> 00:03:40,736
and we feel as if we know
everybody who is in the films now
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00:03:41,562 --> 00:03:44,106
has broken any class barriers
that could previously existed
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00:03:44,107 --> 00:03:46,922
and therefore the film itself has
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00:03:46,923 --> 00:03:48,484
possibly defeated its own object
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00:03:48,485 --> 00:03:50,544
- They do lead me on a bit don't they
- That's what I mean
74
00:03:50,545 --> 00:03:53,002
and they hype the
program up too much
75
00:03:53,003 --> 00:03:54,003
Yeah
76
00:03:54,004 --> 00:03:57,570
and make that
you're good and I'm bad
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00:03:57,571 --> 00:03:59,456
- Or
- Well Vice-versa I think
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00:03:59,457 --> 00:04:02,493
- No don't be silly
- No I really do, especially the "7" one
79
00:04:02,494 --> 00:04:05,190
People tend to read significance
into it that I don't think exists
80
00:04:05,191 --> 00:04:08,216
One of my friends for instance,
had me pointed out to him as...
81
00:04:08,217 --> 00:04:10,148
being destined to run the farm
82
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and being educationally pretty inept,
this is obvious from the film
83
00:04:15,170 --> 00:04:19,523
At seven Nicholas was at a one room
village school in the Yorkshire Dales
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00:04:19,524 --> 00:04:21,270
Do you have a girlfriend?
85
00:04:23,996 --> 00:04:27,049
I don't want to answer that
86
00:04:27,050 --> 00:04:31,072
I don't want answer
those kind of questions
87
00:04:32,515 --> 00:04:35,808
I thought that one would
come up because when I was
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00:04:36,563 --> 00:04:38,674
When I was doing the
other one somebody said
89
00:04:38,675 --> 00:04:41,884
"what do you think about girls?" and I
said "I don't answer questions like that"
90
00:04:41,885 --> 00:04:43,562
is that the reason
you're asking it?
91
00:04:43,563 --> 00:04:45,270
- yeah
- thought so
92
00:04:49,010 --> 00:04:50,746
The best answer
would be
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00:04:50,747 --> 00:04:53,824
to say that I don't answer
questions like that but I mean..
94
00:04:53,825 --> 00:04:56,481
you know it was what I
said when I was seven
95
00:04:56,482 --> 00:04:59,554
and it's still the most sensible
but I mean, what about them?
96
00:05:01,338 --> 00:05:03,369
Well you seemed at fourteen
97
00:05:03,370 --> 00:05:05,804
very shy of the whole
98
00:05:06,966 --> 00:05:09,078
sexual life, has that changed?
99
00:05:09,786 --> 00:05:11,734
I've tried to make a change yes
100
00:05:12,164 --> 00:05:16,760
a very definite conscious
effort not to be shy
101
00:05:16,761 --> 00:05:19,044
to be more outgoing
102
00:05:19,045 --> 00:05:25,274
and this is actually something I
can put a point to in my own past
103
00:05:25,275 --> 00:05:28,550
and think yes I did make my
mind up here, here and here
104
00:05:28,551 --> 00:05:31,554
that I was going to try and
change this, this and this
105
00:05:31,555 --> 00:05:34,146
"this" being basically
my confidence
106
00:05:34,147 --> 00:05:34,994
and my
107
00:05:34,995 --> 00:05:37,266
my sort of approach to
108
00:05:37,267 --> 00:05:39,170
well this is to
people in general
109
00:05:39,171 --> 00:05:41,920
When I grow up I'd like to
110
00:05:41,921 --> 00:05:44,730
find out all about the
moon and all that
111
00:05:45,160 --> 00:05:46,148
I mean
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00:05:46,149 --> 00:05:46,949
I'm not
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00:05:46,950 --> 00:05:50,761
when I said that I was interested in physics
and chemistry well I'm not going to do that here
114
00:05:52,386 --> 00:05:54,420
You might be able to
get... somebody to ex...
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00:05:54,421 --> 00:05:56,819
will you explain
this to me again
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00:05:57,166 --> 00:06:00,350
Nicholas is now in his
2nd year at Oxford University
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00:06:00,881 --> 00:06:04,192
Well I'm trying
to be a physicist
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00:06:04,193 --> 00:06:06,821
to fill in the detail of
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00:06:06,822 --> 00:06:09,282
whenever you meet
somebody at university that
120
00:06:09,283 --> 00:06:11,004
the standard
question is,
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00:06:11,005 --> 00:06:12,759
where are you and
what are you doing?
122
00:06:12,760 --> 00:06:15,877
and my answer is I'm at Merton
College and I'm doing Physics
123
00:06:15,878 --> 00:06:18,367
so it doesn't move up and
down and just rotates
124
00:06:18,368 --> 00:06:20,184
- OK
- Then you put it in
125
00:06:20,219 --> 00:06:21,256
We'll give it a whirl
126
00:06:21,257 --> 00:06:23,892
So what career are
you going to pursue?
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00:06:23,893 --> 00:06:27,917
It depends whether I'll be good
enough to do what I want to really do
128
00:06:28,671 --> 00:06:33,256
I would like if I can
to do research
129
00:06:34,627 --> 00:06:37,628
Are there any disadvantages in
coming from a small place like this
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00:06:37,629 --> 00:06:39,671
and preparing
yourself for Oxford?
131
00:06:39,672 --> 00:06:43,103
Well it's a rather
different background
132
00:06:43,397 --> 00:06:47,945
to go any where,
Oxford perhaps especially
133
00:06:48,835 --> 00:06:53,724
it is a rather more firm
foundation I would've thought
134
00:06:53,725 --> 00:06:55,332
as to your
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00:06:56,017 --> 00:06:58,513
character? I don't?
perhaps character
136
00:06:58,514 --> 00:07:01,093
than being brought
up in the city
137
00:07:01,401 --> 00:07:03,911
It's a fixed reference
point in a sense
138
00:07:03,912 --> 00:07:08,189
that sort of earthy life
and death cycle that you get
139
00:07:08,190 --> 00:07:09,857
living on a farm
140
00:07:09,858 --> 00:07:14,016
so when something dies it rots
and feeds back into the earth
141
00:07:14,281 --> 00:07:17,017
Sometimes it's helpful
142
00:07:17,018 --> 00:07:23,147
in a city where things that some people are
very concerned about seem quite irrelevant
143
00:07:23,453 --> 00:07:26,637
Is there a new strength
of your father as a farmer
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00:07:26,638 --> 00:07:29,088
that you think he's
trying to teach you
145
00:07:29,089 --> 00:07:33,870
Well you get a certain sort of
calmness in some situations
146
00:07:33,871 --> 00:07:37,961
take things as they come
you become resigned to things
147
00:07:37,962 --> 00:07:41,947
if the dog's chasing animals in the wrong
direction then you just have to put up with it
148
00:07:41,948 --> 00:07:46,509
if it won't do as it's told you
become resigned to these things
149
00:07:46,510 --> 00:07:50,438
I suppose yes that's
one possibility
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00:07:52,440 --> 00:07:53,140
come on
151
00:08:00,160 --> 00:08:01,276
come on lad
152
00:08:01,277 --> 00:08:03,572
I suppose of all the
seven year olds
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00:08:03,573 --> 00:08:06,140
the original ones,
you are the big success
154
00:08:06,687 --> 00:08:08,953
I am not inclined
to accept that
155
00:08:08,954 --> 00:08:11,094
Why? You wouldn't
agree with that?
156
00:08:11,095 --> 00:08:12,940
Well what have I achieved?
157
00:08:12,941 --> 00:08:17,893
I'm not really prepared to accept that
I've done anything very special yet
158
00:08:18,901 --> 00:08:21,621
I'd like to think that....I mean I'm
hoping that I might do at some stage
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00:08:21,622 --> 00:08:25,346
but I don't really think I've done anything
that you can call a great success
160
00:08:27,780 --> 00:08:31,543
It would seem really ridiculous to any
of my friends who watch this if I said
161
00:08:31,844 --> 00:08:34,811
"Christ aren't I a great
success, look at me"
162
00:08:34,812 --> 00:08:37,357
Well what? You know,
what success?
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00:08:38,309 --> 00:08:40,689
I can't think of it
in those terms
164
00:08:40,690 --> 00:08:44,304
I haven't done anything
that can be called success
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00:08:44,305 --> 00:08:46,585
nothing out of
the ordinary really
166
00:08:56,088 --> 00:08:58,266
Singing Waltzing
Matilda in Latin
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00:08:58,267 --> 00:09:00,749
at an exclusive pre-preparatory
school in London
168
00:09:01,044 --> 00:09:02,420
Charles
169
00:09:03,770 --> 00:09:04,909
Andrew
170
00:09:04,910 --> 00:09:06,202
and John
171
00:09:06,203 --> 00:09:09,325
I think it's not a bad
idea to pay for schools
172
00:09:09,326 --> 00:09:11,069
because if we didn't
173
00:09:11,070 --> 00:09:13,949
schools would be so
nasty and crowded
174
00:09:14,296 --> 00:09:16,328
Yes, so do I think so
175
00:09:16,329 --> 00:09:21,496
The poor people would come rushing
in and the man in charge of the school would...
176
00:09:21,497 --> 00:09:24,986
Would you think there's any truth
in the ideas behind the program that
177
00:09:24,987 --> 00:09:29,069
certain people have more options
than others and this is undesirable?
178
00:09:29,295 --> 00:09:34,743
It's certainly true that more people know
they have more options or imagine they have
179
00:09:34,744 --> 00:09:37,171
I think in practical terms
180
00:09:38,341 --> 00:09:43,065
the difference in numerical
number of options isn't that great
181
00:09:44,169 --> 00:09:48,634
the fact is that the three of us know that
there's a whole range of things we can do
182
00:09:48,635 --> 00:09:53,095
But the mere knowledge creates an option
in itself, so I think we do have more options
183
00:09:53,096 --> 00:09:57,215
and it is undesirable but it's
very difficult to correct
184
00:09:57,216 --> 00:09:59,981
I don't think it is
undesirable at all
185
00:09:59,982 --> 00:10:02,549
I think what's undesirable is
people who have had options
186
00:10:02,550 --> 00:10:05,490
don't make advantage of them,
take best advantage of them
187
00:10:05,491 --> 00:10:07,978
but I can't see there's
anything wrong
188
00:10:07,979 --> 00:10:12,226
as long as people don't abuse the
opportunities and privileges they've had
189
00:10:13,145 --> 00:10:18,471
If people behave responsibly
I think it's very good
190
00:10:19,193 --> 00:10:21,910
they're the sort of stability
and structure in society
191
00:10:21,911 --> 00:10:23,697
We've been taught
to expect more
192
00:10:23,698 --> 00:10:26,783
it's not that because we've
been to private schools
193
00:10:26,784 --> 00:10:29,315
we're not better
qualified necessarily
194
00:10:29,316 --> 00:10:31,186
- No
- Yes I agree with that
195
00:10:31,187 --> 00:10:33,075
It's a matter of expectations
196
00:10:33,076 --> 00:10:35,305
Yes I must say, all this
talk about opportunities
197
00:10:35,306 --> 00:10:39,150
something I did slightly
object to in the program was
198
00:10:39,151 --> 00:10:41,075
we were shown at
the age of seven
199
00:10:41,076 --> 00:10:46,079
outlining the academic career that
most of us did in fact pursue
200
00:10:46,963 --> 00:10:50,017
each sentence ended up
"John is at Westminster"
201
00:10:50,018 --> 00:10:51,803
Andrew is at Charterhouse
and everything
202
00:10:51,804 --> 00:10:55,944
implied that we just sailed through, merely
manifesting an intention at the age of seven
203
00:10:55,945 --> 00:10:59,401
we didn't show the sleepless nights,
the pouring over our books
204
00:10:59,402 --> 00:11:00,790
sort of, you know
205
00:11:00,791 --> 00:11:04,167
all the sweat and toil that
got us through to university
206
00:11:04,652 --> 00:11:07,526
it was presented as if it
was just part of some
207
00:11:07,883 --> 00:11:10,420
indestructible birth right that
we went to all these places
208
00:11:10,421 --> 00:11:14,895
and I thought that was unfair, they didn't
show us having to do beastly jobs in the holidays
209
00:11:14,896 --> 00:11:17,839
y'know, to make
ends meet and things
210
00:11:18,485 --> 00:11:22,637
it didn't give a very
real sort of...impression
211
00:11:22,638 --> 00:11:24,866
The three girls are earning
212
00:11:25,341 --> 00:11:31,023
income wise they're far better off than
I imagine all three of us are, certainly I am
213
00:11:31,024 --> 00:11:33,763
and background wise
214
00:11:33,764 --> 00:11:38,119
in terms of qualifications or the
means of achieving their ends
215
00:11:38,120 --> 00:11:40,925
they probably have just
as many options as we do
216
00:11:40,926 --> 00:11:42,175
Jaqueline
217
00:11:42,176 --> 00:11:44,676
how do you think about
coloured people?
218
00:11:44,677 --> 00:11:48,487
Well they're nice, they're
just the same as us really
219
00:11:48,989 --> 00:11:51,187
but, one thing
220
00:11:51,188 --> 00:11:54,697
it's only 'cause their
skin's brown and we're white
221
00:11:54,999 --> 00:11:57,119
sort of pinkish we are
222
00:11:58,797 --> 00:12:01,277
Jackie, Lynn and Susan
223
00:12:01,322 --> 00:12:04,196
they went to primary school
together in the Eastend of London
224
00:12:04,197 --> 00:12:06,383
Lynn chose to go on
to a grammar school
225
00:12:06,384 --> 00:12:08,691
and Jackie and Susan
to a comprehensive
226
00:12:09,053 --> 00:12:12,569
There is a danger that you would
get married at early twenties and
227
00:12:12,570 --> 00:12:15,575
have children quickly and
then be stuck at home
228
00:12:16,555 --> 00:12:17,959
have you any thoughts on that?
229
00:12:18,387 --> 00:12:21,273
- I don't really think about it much
- No
230
00:12:21,573 --> 00:12:24,295
I don't think I'd eh....
231
00:12:24,765 --> 00:12:26,717
get married to early
232
00:12:26,718 --> 00:12:28,749
I'd like to have
a full life first and
233
00:12:28,750 --> 00:12:31,115
- I'd like to enjoy myself before I...
- Meet people and...yeah
234
00:12:31,116 --> 00:12:33,927
Before you can commit
yourself to a family
235
00:12:33,928 --> 00:12:38,459
What would you do if you had
lots of money? about two pounds
236
00:12:38,460 --> 00:12:42,311
I would buy myself a nice new
made house you know
237
00:12:42,312 --> 00:12:45,259
one that's all
nice and comfy
238
00:12:45,566 --> 00:12:49,886
Jackie was married last year and
now lives on a new estate in Essex
239
00:12:50,074 --> 00:12:53,387
- It's a nice estate
- Yeah - Yeah not bad at all
240
00:12:53,388 --> 00:12:55,890
What are they like the neighbours?
Have you seen a lot of them or what?
241
00:12:55,891 --> 00:12:59,722
Well you know, to say hello
to more than anything, I mean
242
00:12:59,723 --> 00:13:02,477
we borrow things off of her,
which is just as well
243
00:13:02,478 --> 00:13:05,103
- That's what neighbours are for isn't it?
- Yeah right!
244
00:13:06,505 --> 00:13:09,676
Here, It's a similar colour scheme
down here moving up stairs isn't it?
245
00:13:09,881 --> 00:13:13,777
Yeah but this was more by
luck than judgement really
246
00:13:13,778 --> 00:13:16,346
- Was it like this when you came?
- No it was all white
247
00:13:16,347 --> 00:13:19,082
but you can imagine
the state it was in
248
00:13:19,083 --> 00:13:24,288
friends had some paint handy so Dad and Mick
just used the rollers and in a day it was done
249
00:13:24,289 --> 00:13:25,809
two coats, wallop!
that was it
250
00:13:25,810 --> 00:13:27,406
Susan is still single
251
00:13:27,407 --> 00:13:29,902
I work for a
travel company
252
00:13:30,343 --> 00:13:34,747
they don't deal with the public, they
deal with groups and company groups
253
00:13:35,211 --> 00:13:39,860
it's sort of incentive, holidays abroad
and conferences, that sort of thing
254
00:13:40,157 --> 00:13:44,266
which I like because
I like foreign places
255
00:13:44,548 --> 00:13:46,287
and I have to do eh....
256
00:13:46,288 --> 00:13:48,068
I do quite a bit of typing
257
00:13:48,069 --> 00:13:50,901
but a lot of my work is
involved in making bookings
258
00:13:50,902 --> 00:13:53,673
and dealing with hotels abroad
259
00:13:53,674 --> 00:13:57,253
I left school and started work...
260
00:13:57,254 --> 00:14:00,244
for an Australian bank
and I'm still there
261
00:14:00,913 --> 00:14:04,010
and I've been there what?
Three and a half years now
262
00:14:04,695 --> 00:14:07,431
I've done various
jobs within the bank
263
00:14:09,545 --> 00:14:13,231
I started off as a
telephonist-typist
264
00:14:13,232 --> 00:14:16,555
which was very interesting actually,
you'd be surprised the sort of calls you get
265
00:14:19,436 --> 00:14:22,994
Then I went on to work
the NCR machine
266
00:14:22,995 --> 00:14:25,722
which is the actual machine
that processes the accounts
267
00:14:26,337 --> 00:14:30,737
and counter work dealing with
clients money and things like that
268
00:14:30,738 --> 00:14:33,003
I'm going to work
in Woolworths
269
00:14:33,004 --> 00:14:39,185
Well I'm a school mobile librarian
and assistant to the young peoples office
270
00:14:39,186 --> 00:14:40,831
Which is where we are now
271
00:14:41,301 --> 00:14:45,598
and I've been here
since August last year
272
00:14:48,267 --> 00:14:51,479
Lynn is now married but still
lives and works in the Eastend
273
00:14:51,480 --> 00:14:55,068
I visit schools
with the van
274
00:14:55,069 --> 00:14:59,944
where they've not got position to
get into a local library for class visits
275
00:14:59,945 --> 00:15:01,785
I love working with children
276
00:15:01,786 --> 00:15:04,813
do you remember on the
last one I wanted to teach?
277
00:15:04,814 --> 00:15:06,901
Well I didn't get to that
278
00:15:06,902 --> 00:15:10,484
and seeing how it is
today I'm glad I didn't
279
00:15:10,485 --> 00:15:13,281
the job situation for
all teachers as it is
280
00:15:13,901 --> 00:15:17,585
and I think it takes a lot more
patience than I've actually got
281
00:15:17,586 --> 00:15:19,650
I'm much more at home here
282
00:15:19,651 --> 00:15:21,295
- Have I stamped yours?
- Yes
283
00:15:21,529 --> 00:15:23,349
I've not stamped yours
284
00:15:23,350 --> 00:15:24,977
Sleeping Beauty
285
00:15:26,674 --> 00:15:28,477
I've lost the stamp!
286
00:15:31,279 --> 00:15:33,101
Do you sleep like a beauty?
287
00:15:33,575 --> 00:15:34,794
What do you say?
288
00:15:34,807 --> 00:15:36,288
Thank you
289
00:15:36,474 --> 00:15:41,767
I definitely make a point in
reading all my new books I get in
290
00:15:41,768 --> 00:15:44,358
It's quite funny, I
take loads of books home
291
00:15:44,359 --> 00:15:47,767
and people come and say "who
are these kids books on the table?"
292
00:15:47,768 --> 00:15:50,476
- "They're mine"
- "Oh"
293
00:15:50,534 --> 00:15:52,360
Then they sort of shut up
294
00:15:52,361 --> 00:15:57,914
At the moment a career's probably
about the furthest thing from my mind
295
00:15:57,915 --> 00:16:01,493
and I don't really know what I'm aiming
for except to get the house together
296
00:16:01,857 --> 00:16:07,352
and that can take years, as fast as you replace
one thing something else needs replacing, so ...
297
00:16:08,083 --> 00:16:10,100
it could just go on like
that, I don't know
298
00:16:10,101 --> 00:16:13,213
Well admitting that
you're not a career girl
299
00:16:13,214 --> 00:16:15,753
does it mean that you're
therefore looking for a family?
300
00:16:15,754 --> 00:16:17,691
Oh I don't know,
I suppose I am
301
00:16:18,077 --> 00:16:20,414
But erm..
302
00:16:20,415 --> 00:16:22,767
every thing's not
that cut and dried
303
00:16:22,768 --> 00:16:25,385
it's not either
career or family or...
304
00:16:25,386 --> 00:16:29,057
but is what's in the middle, am I
just going to carry on as I am now? for?
305
00:16:29,058 --> 00:16:31,822
and end up .....on the shelf?
306
00:16:31,823 --> 00:16:34,827
or am I just going to get
married? could be any day, but
307
00:16:34,925 --> 00:16:37,458
I suppose Lynn is a career
girl in a way isn't she?
308
00:16:37,459 --> 00:16:40,713
Yeah she's more wrapped
up in her job than I think we are
309
00:16:42,081 --> 00:16:47,143
and you all three were sat there at seven and
she's gone that way and you've gone this way
310
00:16:47,144 --> 00:16:49,298
is there? can you?....
311
00:16:49,299 --> 00:16:51,434
think of any reasons
why that should be?
312
00:16:51,435 --> 00:16:55,935
I think just basic personality, Lynn's always
been that little bit different from us
313
00:16:57,207 --> 00:17:00,323
She's always been more serious
as far as studies are concerned
314
00:17:00,768 --> 00:17:04,158
I didn't feel like going to a
grammar school, I just er...
315
00:17:04,159 --> 00:17:07,665
you know, comprehensive school
it just seemed more friendly
316
00:17:07,666 --> 00:17:11,327
At that time that is, but
now a little bit different
317
00:17:11,328 --> 00:17:14,582
- Grammar school's fantastic
- If you say so!
318
00:17:15,187 --> 00:17:16,892
When I leave this school
319
00:17:17,084 --> 00:17:21,004
I'm down for Heathfield
and Fairfield Manor
320
00:17:21,443 --> 00:17:27,171
and then maybe I may want to go to
university but I don't know which one yet
321
00:17:32,466 --> 00:17:33,951
This is Susie
322
00:17:33,952 --> 00:17:37,349
the product of a private
education and wealthy parents
323
00:17:44,251 --> 00:17:46,927
What do you think about
making this program?
324
00:17:50,660 --> 00:17:53,700
I just think it's ridiculous, I
don't see any point in doing it
325
00:17:54,581 --> 00:17:55,957
Why not?
326
00:17:56,827 --> 00:18:00,317
What's the point of people going
into peoples lives and saying:
327
00:18:00,318 --> 00:18:03,357
"Why do you like this and why
don't you?" I don't see any point in it
328
00:18:03,358 --> 00:18:06,927
Well I didn't want to
do it when I was fourteen
329
00:18:07,341 --> 00:18:10,726
I know I was very difficult
because I was very anti doing it
330
00:18:10,727 --> 00:18:13,909
because I was pressurised
into doing it by my parents
331
00:18:16,093 --> 00:18:17,933
and I hated it
332
00:18:17,934 --> 00:18:21,073
and I vowed I'd never do it now
333
00:18:21,074 --> 00:18:22,821
but here I am
334
00:18:23,261 --> 00:18:25,453
I'd like to do...
335
00:18:25,454 --> 00:18:28,173
short hand typing
or something like that
336
00:18:28,174 --> 00:18:30,761
I left school when I was
sixteen, went to Paris
337
00:18:33,252 --> 00:18:36,067
went to secretarial
college and got a job
338
00:18:36,482 --> 00:18:39,777
What made you decide to
leave school and go to Paris?
339
00:18:40,897 --> 00:18:44,459
I just wasn't interested in school
and just wanted to get away
340
00:18:46,316 --> 00:18:48,379
and why did you choose Paris?
341
00:18:49,932 --> 00:18:52,393
I don't know, it was
my parents really
342
00:18:53,431 --> 00:18:59,157
Did you sort of feel the
need to get away? and why?
343
00:19:00,653 --> 00:19:03,095
Well I'd lived in
London or Scotland
344
00:19:03,096 --> 00:19:06,607
and I knew people who were going out
to Paris and so I thought I'd go as well
345
00:19:06,608 --> 00:19:09,088
Comparing yourselves to Susie
346
00:19:09,089 --> 00:19:11,275
who stands at the other
end of the social scale
347
00:19:11,276 --> 00:19:13,651
do you think you've had the
same opportunities as her?
348
00:19:15,064 --> 00:19:18,049
I've had the opportunities
in life that I've wanted
349
00:19:18,050 --> 00:19:20,973
I'd say I've had more
opportunities than Susie
350
00:19:22,255 --> 00:19:24,744
I'd say I've had more
opportunities than her
351
00:19:24,745 --> 00:19:27,167
in a different aspect to
what she's had them
352
00:19:28,005 --> 00:19:33,510
But eh, my life, I've been able to
do more or less what I wanted to do
353
00:19:33,871 --> 00:19:37,349
I'm not going to say it on
film, what i feel for her
354
00:19:37,350 --> 00:19:43,229
But I think she's been so conditioned into
what she should do and what she shouldn't do
355
00:19:43,230 --> 00:19:44,811
Yeah but I mean
356
00:19:44,812 --> 00:19:48,646
The whole thing is you're saying
"do we envy anything Susie's had?"
357
00:19:48,647 --> 00:19:49,347
No
358
00:19:49,348 --> 00:19:50,705
I mean I don't know
359
00:19:50,706 --> 00:19:54,023
I don't know what Susie's had,
what's Susie had that I haven't had?
360
00:19:54,491 --> 00:19:57,878
I mean, until I know that I can't
honestly say whether I envy her
361
00:19:57,879 --> 00:20:01,161
- She's had money and she's travelled
- I've got money!
362
00:20:01,162 --> 00:20:03,538
Maybe not enough but I've got it!
363
00:20:03,539 --> 00:20:07,566
I have been to Honolulu with
my father about two years ago
364
00:20:07,983 --> 00:20:09,871
for a couple of months
365
00:20:11,635 --> 00:20:14,710
which I didn't really enjoy
366
00:20:14,711 --> 00:20:19,079
there's nothing much out there, there's
no meet people my own age out there
367
00:20:20,033 --> 00:20:22,624
and I hated it and I
was glad to come home
368
00:20:25,236 --> 00:20:29,291
apart from that I've
been to France on holidays
369
00:20:29,292 --> 00:20:32,405
I'm going to Australia
in the summer
370
00:20:33,706 --> 00:20:35,412
for about two months
371
00:20:35,413 --> 00:20:39,268
otherwise I don't know where I'm
going to go and I'd like to go and travel more
372
00:20:40,798 --> 00:20:42,146
Why?
373
00:20:42,402 --> 00:20:45,315
Well I don't think there's any
point in sitting in your own country
374
00:20:45,316 --> 00:20:48,959
I'd like to see how people live
on the other side of the world
375
00:20:50,399 --> 00:20:52,929
Tell me about the
Australian trip
376
00:20:54,264 --> 00:20:58,181
Well I'm going in July for about
two months with my cousin
377
00:20:58,459 --> 00:21:00,966
her elder sister's
married out there
378
00:21:01,236 --> 00:21:04,980
and we're just going out to....
379
00:21:04,981 --> 00:21:07,354
see what it's like
380
00:21:07,372 --> 00:21:10,775
we're going to not work out there,
we're only going for two months
381
00:21:13,220 --> 00:21:16,278
We just feel if we don't
go now we never will
382
00:21:16,279 --> 00:21:19,954
We've got the opportunity and
the time to go now so we're going
383
00:21:20,357 --> 00:21:21,829
How are you going
to pay for it?
384
00:21:23,083 --> 00:21:24,907
Save up and go
385
00:21:25,803 --> 00:21:28,274
Do you get depressed
by money problems?
386
00:21:29,156 --> 00:21:31,640
No, why?
Why should you?
387
00:21:32,042 --> 00:21:34,395
- If you can manage on what you've got
- I refuse to get depressed over money
388
00:21:34,396 --> 00:21:37,542
- It's so easy to but why should you?
- I do, I do
389
00:21:37,543 --> 00:21:38,925
Why worry about it?
390
00:21:38,926 --> 00:21:41,506
When I reach the 18th day of the month
and my mortgage is due on the 20th
391
00:21:41,507 --> 00:21:45,534
and there's nowhere near enough money
in there, I get depressed about it obviously
392
00:21:45,968 --> 00:21:48,288
Suddenly thinking, oh my god what's
going to happen, you know
393
00:21:48,289 --> 00:21:51,228
But it gets there, don't
ask me how but you get it
394
00:21:51,649 --> 00:21:54,059
Do you think you've
settled down to young?
395
00:21:54,060 --> 00:21:54,653
No
396
00:21:54,654 --> 00:21:58,251
I've married and we do
things together, or...
397
00:21:58,864 --> 00:22:02,640
I go out on my own sometimes
with friends from work
398
00:22:02,641 --> 00:22:06,603
he does the same, what do
you mean by settled down?
399
00:22:07,810 --> 00:22:11,552
If you think that getting married
as far as we're concerned is a case of
400
00:22:11,553 --> 00:22:15,490
going to work, come home, cook tea for hubby,
going to bed, getting up, going to work
401
00:22:15,491 --> 00:22:17,313
you're totally mistaken
402
00:22:17,314 --> 00:22:20,260
Did you meet enough men
before you decided who to marry?
403
00:22:20,261 --> 00:22:22,349
I've been married
a year and...
404
00:22:22,966 --> 00:22:24,374
a couple of months
405
00:22:25,369 --> 00:22:27,983
you do think "christ,
what have I done?"
406
00:22:29,757 --> 00:22:33,237
- See I've still got my ideals
- and I'm being honest about it!
407
00:22:33,582 --> 00:22:38,596
and my husband thinks the same, at
times you think "christ, what have I done?"
408
00:22:39,453 --> 00:22:40,855
- But then if...
- But marriage...
409
00:22:40,856 --> 00:22:42,152
Marriage means a
different thing to me
410
00:22:42,153 --> 00:22:45,799
I've still got my ideals about marriage, I
don't know what it's all about, obviously
411
00:22:45,800 --> 00:22:47,894
So I've still got pictures of
412
00:22:47,895 --> 00:22:50,262
- Cosy evenings indoors...yeah
- With roses!
413
00:22:50,263 --> 00:22:53,309
She'd have cosy evenings
indoors with the central heating!
414
00:22:54,066 --> 00:22:55,329
Or lack of it!
415
00:22:55,330 --> 00:22:57,922
- Yeah, I've got a lot to learn
about .... getting married
416
00:22:57,923 --> 00:23:02,101
I mean, your parents split up
soon after you were fourteen
417
00:23:03,701 --> 00:23:06,285
What sort of influence,
effect did that have on you?
418
00:23:08,167 --> 00:23:12,370
Well I was the only child going through
their parents splitting up aged 14
419
00:23:12,371 --> 00:23:16,571
at a very vulnerable age
and it does touch you up, but...
420
00:23:17,575 --> 00:23:19,334
You know, you get over it
421
00:23:20,526 --> 00:23:23,007
There was no point in
them staying together for me
422
00:23:23,008 --> 00:23:25,403
if it was worse,
I mean the rows and...
423
00:23:25,404 --> 00:23:27,473
and it's worse
424
00:23:27,474 --> 00:23:30,457
so if two people can't live together
there's no point in making yourself
425
00:23:30,458 --> 00:23:32,684
even for the sake of children
426
00:23:34,692 --> 00:23:38,852
What is your attitude towards
marriage? for yourself?
427
00:23:42,992 --> 00:23:46,915
Well I don't know, I haven't given it a
lot of thought as I'm very cynical about it
428
00:23:50,361 --> 00:23:53,430
But then you get a certain
amount of faith restored in it
429
00:23:53,431 --> 00:23:57,769
I mean I've got friends and their
parents are happily married
430
00:23:57,770 --> 00:24:02,035
and it does put faith back into you
but me myself I'm very cynical about it
431
00:24:02,475 --> 00:24:03,674
Why?
432
00:24:04,209 --> 00:24:07,991
Because I think it kills
whatever love is
433
00:24:09,043 --> 00:24:11,538
it just seems to go wrong
434
00:24:11,902 --> 00:24:13,985
What do you base that on?
435
00:24:15,536 --> 00:24:19,708
Well, people I've seen,
people around me
436
00:24:19,709 --> 00:24:23,953
I mean I've got....not a lot of
my friends are married
437
00:24:26,666 --> 00:24:32,353
a lot of people who are 20,30 all seem to
be getting divorced and can't stay together
438
00:24:33,292 --> 00:24:36,584
and at the moment I just
don't really believe in it
439
00:24:37,068 --> 00:24:39,712
Why do you think people
can't hold marriages together?
440
00:24:41,616 --> 00:24:44,166
I don't know, I
really don't know
441
00:24:44,167 --> 00:24:47,753
I don't sort of sit down and
think "ooh ...analyse marriage"
442
00:24:47,754 --> 00:24:52,216
It's not something I've had to think
about whether I was going to get married
443
00:24:52,217 --> 00:24:57,201
and I've got no desire to at the
moment, I think twenty is far too young
444
00:24:57,942 --> 00:24:59,259
What was the wedding like?
445
00:24:59,627 --> 00:25:02,498
Our wedding?
a laugh!
446
00:25:07,062 --> 00:25:10,569
I wanted, white
wedding, all trimmings
447
00:25:12,586 --> 00:25:16,337
My husband would've been
satisfied with very little
448
00:25:16,338 --> 00:25:19,797
but being as we were
going into it as a full thing
449
00:25:19,798 --> 00:25:21,441
we went into it
450
00:25:21,660 --> 00:25:24,492
I had an all white
wedding, all white
451
00:25:24,493 --> 00:25:27,539
We were both in white and
my bridesmaid was in white
452
00:25:29,353 --> 00:25:31,533
It's a funny day actually
453
00:25:32,943 --> 00:25:36,613
because I suppose I was up somewhere
around the five o'clock mark
454
00:25:37,054 --> 00:25:39,277
and I spent all day preparing
455
00:25:39,278 --> 00:25:41,803
well all morning I should say
456
00:25:41,804 --> 00:25:44,422
and then sitting around
for about three hours
457
00:25:44,423 --> 00:25:48,263
just waiting for something to happen
then when it did happen I don't remember it
458
00:25:48,264 --> 00:25:49,292
So
459
00:25:49,293 --> 00:25:51,927
it was just complete
confusion really
460
00:25:52,639 --> 00:25:54,731
- It was a nice day though
- Oh yeah
461
00:25:54,732 --> 00:25:58,209
It was funny actually, you can
imagine some of the comments
462
00:25:59,689 --> 00:26:04,514
I was pleased I was there, it
seemed the right place to be
463
00:26:04,515 --> 00:26:07,932
I mean I was glad I was at her
wedding, I've known her a long while
464
00:26:08,990 --> 00:26:11,314
Did anything happen?
Anything funny?
465
00:26:12,785 --> 00:26:15,433
I can�t forget the cake
466
00:26:16,321 --> 00:26:20,900
It was horrific really, the cake
what happened to the wedding cake
467
00:26:21,147 --> 00:26:24,987
it was sitting right
in between Mick and myself
468
00:26:25,669 --> 00:26:29,955
suddenly the columns just completely
gave way and it just all fell into one
469
00:26:30,650 --> 00:26:33,329
- It was a nice cake though!
- Yeah it wasn't bad!
470
00:26:33,982 --> 00:26:36,519
I read the Financial Times
471
00:26:36,789 --> 00:26:39,691
I read the Observer and the Times
472
00:26:39,692 --> 00:26:41,531
What do you like about it?
473
00:26:41,532 --> 00:26:43,229
Well I like...
474
00:26:43,230 --> 00:26:47,655
I usually look at the headlines
then read about them
475
00:26:48,549 --> 00:26:49,740
about it
476
00:26:50,355 --> 00:26:54,261
I like my newspaper because
I've got shares in it
477
00:26:54,262 --> 00:26:59,154
- and I know every day what the shares are
- The stuff that misers like you like!
478
00:26:59,172 --> 00:27:03,604
But on Monday's they don't
move up so I don't look at it
479
00:27:03,605 --> 00:27:07,522
That's one of the troubles with this sort of
program, I don't really think that people like us
480
00:27:08,487 --> 00:27:11,537
Unless we're seven and being rather
funny, have very much to say that's...
481
00:27:11,843 --> 00:27:14,051
very interesting,
because I mean...
482
00:27:14,393 --> 00:27:15,961
we don�t know very much
483
00:27:16,215 --> 00:27:18,400
Well we didn't know very
much when we were seven
484
00:27:18,401 --> 00:27:19,918
- But we were still quite funny
- We were at least funny!
485
00:27:19,919 --> 00:27:21,891
- Yes! - Yes!
- In ourselves!
486
00:27:21,892 --> 00:27:24,724
I agree with John, all we
can say is what we think
487
00:27:24,725 --> 00:27:26,670
and if that's of interest to
people, good luck to them
488
00:27:26,671 --> 00:27:29,678
Yes and I can't believe it is
489
00:27:29,679 --> 00:27:31,221
More fool them!
490
00:27:31,222 --> 00:27:36,377
When I leave this school
I'm going to College Court
491
00:27:39,289 --> 00:27:43,643
then I would be going to Westminster
Boarding School if I pass the exam
492
00:27:44,672 --> 00:27:47,627
and then we think I'm going to
493
00:27:47,828 --> 00:27:50,091
Cambridge and Trinity Hall
494
00:27:50,459 --> 00:27:54,004
John is in his final year at
Christchurch Oxford, reading Law
495
00:27:54,005 --> 00:27:58,039
I do believe parents have a right to
educate their children as they think fit
496
00:27:59,087 --> 00:28:05,312
I think someone who works on an assembly
line in a car factory, earning a huge wage
497
00:28:05,313 --> 00:28:08,789
could well afford to send their children
to private school if they wanted to
498
00:28:08,790 --> 00:28:11,277
Just because..
499
00:28:11,278 --> 00:28:15,290
some sort of people perhaps don't
put that as high on their priorities as...
500
00:28:15,291 --> 00:28:17,801
having a smart car or something
501
00:28:17,802 --> 00:28:22,233
I don't think that's any reason
for abolishing public school
502
00:28:22,234 --> 00:28:26,216
I think an awful lot more people
could afford to send their sons to school
503
00:28:26,217 --> 00:28:28,525
You know, to fee paying school
504
00:28:28,526 --> 00:28:32,238
But they don't choose to,
and that's their choice
505
00:28:32,556 --> 00:28:35,243
I'm going to Charterhouse
506
00:28:35,529 --> 00:28:40,872
and after that,
Trinity Hall Cambridge
507
00:28:40,873 --> 00:28:44,227
Andrew is in his last year at Trinity
College Cambridge, reading Law
508
00:28:44,228 --> 00:28:49,428
I think if people earn their money
they should have a right to spend it
509
00:28:49,429 --> 00:28:52,138
an education is very important
510
00:28:52,139 --> 00:28:57,859
and you can never be sure of leaving
your children any worldly goods but
511
00:28:57,860 --> 00:29:01,240
at least you can be sure that once
you've given them a good education
512
00:29:01,241 --> 00:29:03,725
that's something that
no one can take away
513
00:29:03,985 --> 00:29:05,969
What about university Charlie?
514
00:29:05,970 --> 00:29:08,331
I might go to Oxford
515
00:29:08,754 --> 00:29:12,326
You're reading history at Durham
University, you didn't make Oxford
516
00:29:12,327 --> 00:29:14,267
What are your feelings about that?
517
00:29:14,268 --> 00:29:16,087
I don't mind at all
518
00:29:16,498 --> 00:29:18,225
In fact
519
00:29:19,907 --> 00:29:22,059
I'd say I'm pleased I didn't
520
00:29:22,060 --> 00:29:25,336
because it was very much a sort of
521
00:29:26,482 --> 00:29:30,333
sort of set of
Marlborough Prep School
522
00:29:30,334 --> 00:29:34,635
Marlborough, Oxbridge,
conveyor belt
523
00:29:34,636 --> 00:29:37,295
you get shoved out at the end
524
00:29:37,296 --> 00:29:38,853
and you...
525
00:29:39,149 --> 00:29:43,137
when you go to Oxbridge and it's
obviously not true in all cases but
526
00:29:43,138 --> 00:29:44,691
I think for the majority
527
00:29:44,692 --> 00:29:48,949
they mix with the same people
they were at school with
528
00:29:49,871 --> 00:29:51,871
So what attracts you to Oxford?
529
00:29:51,872 --> 00:29:54,725
Well first of all it's such
a beautiful place
530
00:29:54,726 --> 00:29:58,080
there's more to it than just
studying away at one's books
531
00:29:58,381 --> 00:30:00,741
I think it's very difficult
not to get something out of it
532
00:30:00,742 --> 00:30:02,395
there�s such a sort of...
533
00:30:02,396 --> 00:30:05,471
atmosphere of culture and...
534
00:30:05,915 --> 00:30:10,969
and timelessness about the place that
I think you do sort of mature an awful lot
535
00:30:13,679 --> 00:30:14,881
So what is Beagling?
536
00:30:14,882 --> 00:30:18,707
Beagling is the
hunting of the hare
537
00:30:18,708 --> 00:30:21,248
with a pack of hounds,
done on foot
538
00:30:21,503 --> 00:30:24,347
I mean a lot of people
seem to imagine
539
00:30:24,579 --> 00:30:28,063
a days hunting with either
fox to hunt or beagles
540
00:30:29,155 --> 00:30:32,741
unadulterated butchery.
I mean this just isn't true, I think
541
00:30:32,742 --> 00:30:35,607
I wish people had a more
realistic idea of what it's about
542
00:30:40,503 --> 00:30:42,815
The hounds are over there I think
543
00:30:43,531 --> 00:30:46,407
I saw them last streaming
along that hedge there
544
00:30:53,265 --> 00:30:55,202
- Frustrating isn't it?
- Yes
545
00:30:59,995 --> 00:31:02,765
I'm reasonably old fashioned about
some things but I mean
546
00:31:02,766 --> 00:31:06,557
I mean people who go on a lot about the
permissive society are missing the point
547
00:31:06,558 --> 00:31:10,047
if they think the only
thing that's wrong is sex
548
00:31:10,048 --> 00:31:16,139
I think you know, decreasing
respect for the family as a unit
549
00:31:17,827 --> 00:31:21,905
increasing dishonesty,
both in business....
550
00:31:21,906 --> 00:31:26,869
there used to be much more much stronger
developed ideas of commercial integrity
551
00:31:26,870 --> 00:31:31,644
than seem to be going around nowadays,
nowadays people seem to be out for themselves
552
00:31:34,672 --> 00:31:39,343
I really do think I suppose there is
an invasion by the American way of life
553
00:31:39,579 --> 00:31:43,055
which I think is a very sad thing
554
00:31:44,325 --> 00:31:46,976
Is that unstoppable?
That trend do you think?
555
00:31:47,429 --> 00:31:49,909
I think it really is
unfortunately, yes
556
00:31:52,027 --> 00:31:54,411
So where does that
leave your values?
557
00:31:55,959 --> 00:31:58,291
Well it leaves them with me
558
00:31:58,527 --> 00:32:04,571
and my future children whom
I shall implicate them in
559
00:32:05,123 --> 00:32:08,965
But do you not find
yourself isolated?
560
00:32:08,966 --> 00:32:10,365
That really doesn't matter
561
00:32:10,366 --> 00:32:14,143
If I believe my
principals are right
562
00:32:14,144 --> 00:32:16,719
and I'm doing the right thing
to bring my children up by them
563
00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:20,711
it won't matter to me whether
I'm living in the middle-ages mentally
564
00:32:20,712 --> 00:32:22,919
I shall do what's right
565
00:32:24,351 --> 00:32:27,765
Well when I was very small my
father always used to go ski-ing
566
00:32:27,967 --> 00:32:29,887
and he took me with him
567
00:32:30,161 --> 00:32:32,561
and we've been ever since really
568
00:32:32,750 --> 00:32:35,017
and how old or young were
you when you started?
569
00:32:35,238 --> 00:32:38,513
Oh about five, on tiny little ski's
570
00:32:39,590 --> 00:32:41,478
it was quite frightening then
571
00:32:41,479 --> 00:32:42,919
what is the appeal of it?
572
00:32:42,920 --> 00:32:46,725
Well the sort of freedom and
going in the snow and the mountains
573
00:32:48,129 --> 00:32:50,435
and the feeling of speed
574
00:32:50,436 --> 00:32:53,027
and getting away
from people if you can
575
00:32:53,337 --> 00:32:55,575
Do you save up to
come ski-ing or...?
576
00:32:55,576 --> 00:32:57,688
I don't but my father does
577
00:32:58,500 --> 00:33:00,357
as he pays for me
578
00:33:00,621 --> 00:33:04,981
Your parents have been
divorced since fourteen
579
00:33:05,271 --> 00:33:07,784
- Since you were fourteen
- That's right, quite recently yes
580
00:33:07,785 --> 00:33:10,273
Tell me about that and
the influence it's had on you
581
00:33:10,717 --> 00:33:12,767
Well not much
influence in fact
582
00:33:12,818 --> 00:33:15,517
because it's happened
when I'm quite old
583
00:33:15,518 --> 00:33:17,974
and I'm away from
home a lot anyway
584
00:33:17,975 --> 00:33:21,087
it's very sad of course
585
00:33:21,088 --> 00:33:23,561
but I don't think it has had
a great deal of influence
586
00:33:23,562 --> 00:33:26,588
if it had happened
when I was much younger
587
00:33:26,589 --> 00:33:28,727
it would've had much
more influence
588
00:33:28,728 --> 00:33:31,357
an adverse influence
I would've thought
589
00:33:31,358 --> 00:33:36,088
Did your parents divorce
leave any lasting mark on you?
590
00:33:36,892 --> 00:33:38,248
I don't know, I mean
591
00:33:38,249 --> 00:33:40,452
seen the film at fourteen so
592
00:33:41,282 --> 00:33:45,857
and that's of our closest time,
I would've thought it did but...
593
00:33:45,858 --> 00:33:48,115
don't talk about that anyway so...
594
00:33:48,116 --> 00:33:49,071
Why?
595
00:33:50,544 --> 00:33:52,591
I think it's unfair on them
596
00:33:55,461 --> 00:33:58,579
Very few parents I think,
bring up their children...
597
00:33:59,467 --> 00:34:04,115
with the intention of belittling them
or doing as little for them as possible
598
00:34:04,116 --> 00:34:04,953
I think
599
00:34:04,988 --> 00:34:07,659
you have to assume that most
parents do as much as they can
600
00:34:07,660 --> 00:34:10,150
given the circumstances
of the children
601
00:34:10,537 --> 00:34:13,239
and obviously things
could've been far worse
602
00:34:14,217 --> 00:34:18,216
Do you think it's changed your
attitude to marriage? or...
603
00:34:18,217 --> 00:34:20,645
It just means that
604
00:34:20,646 --> 00:34:24,410
because I was faced with that situation I
have an attitude which is a positive attitude
605
00:34:24,411 --> 00:34:28,106
rather than "well everybody else gets
married therefore I shall get married"
606
00:34:32,684 --> 00:34:37,372
My attitude would be that if
one is going to have children
607
00:34:37,373 --> 00:34:42,590
if you want to have children then
that's a very real reason for getting married
608
00:34:42,591 --> 00:34:44,509
but if you get married...
609
00:34:44,510 --> 00:34:47,634
it's an agreement to make the
thing work for eighteen years
610
00:34:47,635 --> 00:34:51,056
or however long it is until
the children have grown up
611
00:34:52,060 --> 00:34:56,829
no there's no point in just
sitting it out for eighteen years
612
00:34:56,830 --> 00:35:00,308
there's nothing worse than that, it would
be better for the parents to get a divorce
613
00:35:00,309 --> 00:35:02,236
I think people
614
00:35:03,240 --> 00:35:06,156
perhaps don't make
as much effort
615
00:35:06,157 --> 00:35:09,112
as they should have, or should
do to make marriages work
616
00:35:09,113 --> 00:35:12,366
it's very easy for me to say so as
I've never been in the position
617
00:35:12,664 --> 00:35:15,691
In what way should
people make more effort?
618
00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:21,526
I think people just take too much
for granted when they get married
619
00:35:21,527 --> 00:35:23,652
or used to, not now perhaps
620
00:35:23,653 --> 00:35:26,094
I mean, I don't know
about you for instance
621
00:35:26,095 --> 00:35:29,848
I know my mother,
she's said that
622
00:35:29,849 --> 00:35:32,300
she's spoilt really
623
00:35:32,301 --> 00:35:36,019
and she never realised how lucky
she'd been until she'd been divorced
624
00:35:36,020 --> 00:35:38,018
Up to about twelve
625
00:35:38,808 --> 00:35:40,598
maybe it's different with
other people, but
626
00:35:40,599 --> 00:35:44,476
I found that you're much
more attached to your parents
627
00:35:44,477 --> 00:35:47,601
once you come to about
thirteen, fourteen
628
00:35:48,605 --> 00:35:50,875
you're not quite so
attached to them
629
00:35:50,876 --> 00:35:54,863
I think the system of
having house captains
630
00:35:54,864 --> 00:35:55,981
is rather good
631
00:35:55,982 --> 00:35:58,430
because when somebody is naughty
632
00:35:58,431 --> 00:36:02,494
the house captain asks him and...
633
00:36:03,484 --> 00:36:05,677
and has a talk to him
634
00:36:05,678 --> 00:36:09,544
once I had a talk to Grevil,
he was in my house
635
00:36:10,587 --> 00:36:11,787
and
636
00:36:12,078 --> 00:36:18,619
I asked Sir if he could put him out of my
house because he was always getting minuses
637
00:36:18,963 --> 00:36:20,564
What did Sir say?
638
00:36:20,565 --> 00:36:24,392
Sir said that he would...
639
00:36:24,393 --> 00:36:26,544
we would see
about it this term
640
00:36:26,545 --> 00:36:29,669
Well I think it's a
very good system
641
00:36:29,670 --> 00:36:31,480
Have you had to speak to anyone?
642
00:36:31,481 --> 00:36:35,354
- Just because you are one I suppose?
- No, no I haven't!
643
00:36:35,355 --> 00:36:37,219
- You're not are you?
- But I am!
644
00:36:37,220 --> 00:36:40,546
Straw, Mac and Nessie got
three minuses in a day
645
00:36:43,013 --> 00:36:46,088
If I work in Law I should like
a reasonable amount of success
646
00:36:46,089 --> 00:36:49,030
I shouldn't like to be on the
bread-line which is all to common
647
00:36:49,031 --> 00:36:51,351
I'd like to be a Solicitor
648
00:36:51,352 --> 00:36:53,599
and, also fairly successful
649
00:36:53,827 --> 00:36:55,493
I only know what I
don't want and that's
650
00:36:55,494 --> 00:36:59,247
a nuclear family in a
semi-detached in Brentford
651
00:36:59,248 --> 00:37:00,921
Do you three see yourselves...
652
00:37:00,922 --> 00:37:04,375
staying in England, living in England,
making your careers in England?
653
00:37:05,213 --> 00:37:06,313
Yes
654
00:37:06,669 --> 00:37:09,789
Well the trouble is Law
is not really very exportable
655
00:37:10,750 --> 00:37:12,455
From my point of view anyway
656
00:37:12,456 --> 00:37:13,656
I quite like England
657
00:37:13,657 --> 00:37:17,798
'cause I can't say I really approve very
much of the sort people who emigrate
658
00:37:18,017 --> 00:37:19,932
I mean it's too
easy for people who...
659
00:37:19,933 --> 00:37:23,917
this is where I would agree with you
about people who have had opportunities
660
00:37:23,918 --> 00:37:27,670
I do think they've got a corresponding
duty to sort of put back....
661
00:37:27,671 --> 00:37:31,667
you know, people who have had
things going well for them
662
00:37:31,668 --> 00:37:36,361
really ought to stay and help the country
out when things aren't going very well
663
00:37:37,188 --> 00:37:39,492
I don't believe in all
this pulling one's money out
664
00:37:39,493 --> 00:37:42,783
but that's a moral point of view, I do believe
people have the right to live where they like
665
00:37:42,784 --> 00:37:44,423
and also to move
their assets around
666
00:37:44,424 --> 00:37:48,508
but on a moral level I do feel very
strongly that people shouldn't quit
667
00:37:50,053 --> 00:37:52,750
- Is that why you don't want to leave?
- Yes
668
00:37:53,153 --> 00:37:57,355
and also I can't imagine
anywhere so nice as England
669
00:37:58,534 --> 00:38:02,530
Probably stay in England for the reasons that
John put forward, I think one has a moral duty
670
00:38:02,837 --> 00:38:05,004
It sounds terrible
but, you know...if...
671
00:38:05,569 --> 00:38:08,682
It's up to one certainly
to make an attempt
672
00:38:08,683 --> 00:38:13,756
to put something back in to whatever
it is that you're doing in England
673
00:38:14,072 --> 00:38:17,961
Having used the various facilities that
are put out for you by the state
674
00:38:17,962 --> 00:38:21,325
I think the more you've
had out of the country
675
00:38:21,815 --> 00:38:23,958
the more privileges
you're born with
676
00:38:23,959 --> 00:38:26,399
the greater your duty is
677
00:38:27,968 --> 00:38:31,354
We chose two boys from a
children's home in Middlesex
678
00:38:31,355 --> 00:38:32,439
Paul
679
00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:35,095
Say you had a wife
680
00:38:37,008 --> 00:38:40,243
say you had to eat
what they cooked you
681
00:38:41,115 --> 00:38:44,315
and say I don't like
vegetables, well I don't
682
00:38:45,621 --> 00:38:50,468
and say she said "you have
to eat what you get"
683
00:38:50,504 --> 00:38:56,635
So I don't like vegetables so say she
gives me vegetables then that's it
684
00:38:56,636 --> 00:38:58,910
Well as far as I know my
mother and father got...
685
00:38:58,911 --> 00:39:01,373
well they separated
originally I think
686
00:39:03,097 --> 00:39:04,953
they eventually got divorced
687
00:39:05,221 --> 00:39:09,119
I went to the boarding school for one
year then we emigrated to Australia
688
00:39:10,223 --> 00:39:12,451
my father got remarried
689
00:39:14,179 --> 00:39:16,346
and how do you get on
with your step-mum?
690
00:39:17,011 --> 00:39:21,043
pretty well but like I said
before I'm just not close enough
691
00:39:21,044 --> 00:39:23,838
I'm not really close
to my father either
692
00:39:24,340 --> 00:39:27,168
Paul left the children's home
when he was eight
693
00:39:27,169 --> 00:39:29,807
Our other boy stayed
until he was thirteen
694
00:39:29,808 --> 00:39:31,158
Symon
695
00:39:31,921 --> 00:39:35,200
Was it difficult moving from the
home back to live with your mother?
696
00:39:35,201 --> 00:39:38,958
- You're still here after, eight years now?
- Yeah yeah
697
00:39:38,959 --> 00:39:41,757
Well I find it's comfortable
698
00:39:42,302 --> 00:39:45,755
See I can get on well with
my mother sometimes
699
00:39:46,834 --> 00:39:49,107
well that's good
because a lot of ...
700
00:39:49,108 --> 00:39:53,462
young children can't get on with their
parents at all at this time of the year, their life
701
00:39:54,191 --> 00:39:56,797
but I get on pretty
well with my mum now
702
00:39:58,315 --> 00:40:00,490
we talk very well with each other
703
00:40:00,491 --> 00:40:01,744
but it's..
704
00:40:01,745 --> 00:40:04,618
sometimes not quite
as mother and son
705
00:40:04,619 --> 00:40:06,477
sort of more like friends
706
00:40:06,478 --> 00:40:08,771
What sort of life does
your mother have?
707
00:40:08,772 --> 00:40:12,511
Well it seems hard, I mean
she's always been...
708
00:40:13,068 --> 00:40:14,569
nervous
709
00:40:14,570 --> 00:40:16,265
not all the time, but...
710
00:40:16,266 --> 00:40:20,743
she has periods of depression or deep
depression or whatever you want to call it
711
00:40:21,603 --> 00:40:24,633
that sort of makes me think
"well what happened there?"
712
00:40:25,053 --> 00:40:27,449
What effect has that
had on you do you think?
713
00:40:27,450 --> 00:40:31,552
Well it's made me very sort
of protective towards her
714
00:40:31,553 --> 00:40:34,804
I feel I've got to
help her all the time
715
00:40:34,805 --> 00:40:37,231
They say "Where's your
father then?"
716
00:40:37,232 --> 00:40:40,644
You know when your mums out at
work "Where's your father?"
717
00:40:40,645 --> 00:40:43,464
and I just tell them
I ain't got one
718
00:40:48,481 --> 00:40:50,907
What effect has that had on you?
719
00:40:52,206 --> 00:40:55,742
Well I don't think it's had
any effect on me, 'cause...
720
00:40:57,471 --> 00:41:00,225
what you don't have
you don't miss
721
00:41:00,226 --> 00:41:02,706
Twenty years ago
722
00:41:03,843 --> 00:41:05,323
when I was born
723
00:41:05,779 --> 00:41:07,648
an illegitimate child, you know
724
00:41:07,649 --> 00:41:10,658
that's something that's
only whispered about
725
00:41:11,106 --> 00:41:15,226
people feel strongly
about it in those days
726
00:41:15,227 --> 00:41:18,062
but nowadays it's..
727
00:41:19,296 --> 00:41:20,588
it's not a serious matter
728
00:41:20,589 --> 00:41:24,048
the serious point is whether you
stay with someone or you leave them
729
00:41:24,264 --> 00:41:28,063
We took Paul and Symon round the buildings
which were once the children's home
730
00:41:28,064 --> 00:41:31,626
I remember this path but I've
never walked on it was out of bounds
731
00:41:31,627 --> 00:41:34,947
the only place I saw this was
from out the windows and that
732
00:41:34,948 --> 00:41:37,519
- What was that there?
- That? That was eh...
733
00:41:37,520 --> 00:41:40,188
That was hospital juniors,
that's where we used to be
734
00:41:40,189 --> 00:41:41,696
- Really?
- Yeah
735
00:41:41,697 --> 00:41:44,106
I don�t like the big boys
736
00:41:44,107 --> 00:41:45,830
Hitting us and...
737
00:41:45,831 --> 00:41:48,234
and the staff is up
in the washroom
738
00:41:48,235 --> 00:41:51,431
sends the nurse out,
"well there's no talking"
739
00:41:51,432 --> 00:41:53,485
"No I wasn't talking today"
740
00:41:53,486 --> 00:41:56,212
Then Brown sent
me out for nothing
741
00:42:01,968 --> 00:42:03,470
Remember the tiles?
742
00:42:03,471 --> 00:42:06,172
- No not really
- Yeah I remember them when they were cleaner
743
00:42:06,173 --> 00:42:10,142
- I remember the two offices
- Yeah the doctors and the nurses
744
00:42:10,769 --> 00:42:12,452
Some things gone
745
00:42:12,453 --> 00:42:14,519
- The seats
- Yeah the seats
746
00:42:14,812 --> 00:42:17,437
The smell, the smells gone
747
00:42:18,227 --> 00:42:20,114
- Remember Midgely
- Yeah
748
00:42:20,115 --> 00:42:22,410
He was a real bastard
749
00:42:22,411 --> 00:42:25,010
I remember one night,
I forget what I actually did
750
00:42:25,011 --> 00:42:27,778
But he made me clean
all the shoes in the house
751
00:42:27,779 --> 00:42:31,057
there was about fifty pair of shoes
and took about two hours or something
752
00:42:31,508 --> 00:42:37,187
Well I feel like joining in
when there's already a fight
753
00:42:37,900 --> 00:42:39,728
Ah do you remember Froggy Page?
754
00:42:39,729 --> 00:42:40,734
No
755
00:42:41,531 --> 00:42:43,444
He was the tailor
756
00:42:43,445 --> 00:42:45,190
- I remember him
- Tailor?
757
00:42:45,191 --> 00:42:47,582
Yeah he was here for thirty-seven
years or something
758
00:42:47,583 --> 00:42:50,521
bent over backwards or bent
over forwards or something
759
00:42:51,204 --> 00:42:52,950
- The golf course
- Yeah
760
00:42:52,951 --> 00:42:56,212
Used to think about running away
over that when you'd get scared
761
00:42:56,213 --> 00:42:59,971
That's where the headmaster's son used to
shoot the squirrel's off the trees isn't it - yeah
762
00:42:59,972 --> 00:43:01,784
Do you remember the boy that
763
00:43:01,785 --> 00:43:04,170
in the senior part
764
00:43:04,171 --> 00:43:05,817
where my brother was, he
765
00:43:05,818 --> 00:43:09,619
he was sleeping one time and he
went out the second story window
766
00:43:09,620 --> 00:43:12,402
Oh the sleep walker,
Weaver, Robert Weaver
767
00:43:12,403 --> 00:43:14,546
- We all had to pray for him
- Yeah
768
00:43:15,992 --> 00:43:18,488
- Everybody said he had a steel plate in his head
- Yeah
769
00:43:18,489 --> 00:43:22,335
How have you got on with Symon? after
you haven't seen him for fourteen years
770
00:43:23,855 --> 00:43:26,896
Well I didn't recognise him at all
771
00:43:27,984 --> 00:43:31,520
I think we got along really well, I
don't know what he'd say to that but
772
00:43:32,570 --> 00:43:35,374
I found him very likeable
773
00:43:37,874 --> 00:43:42,508
He's just the sort of person who
if I could I'd like to do something for them
774
00:43:42,843 --> 00:43:47,370
Because I feel I've got, no offence to
him, but I feel I've got more than him
775
00:43:47,371 --> 00:43:49,360
It's just that it
seems to me that
776
00:43:49,911 --> 00:43:53,127
things have fallen
into line now for me
777
00:43:53,489 --> 00:43:56,758
Every thing's started to come
good, I've started to enjoy life
778
00:43:57,826 --> 00:44:01,585
and I've started to think
"well I'm not a no hoper"
779
00:44:01,586 --> 00:44:05,584
Because I think that's what
I've always thought about myself
780
00:44:05,585 --> 00:44:08,395
I know I didn't have
any confidence in myself
781
00:44:08,692 --> 00:44:11,524
despite what I said
when I was fourteen
782
00:44:11,525 --> 00:44:13,506
I've always lacked confidence
783
00:44:13,507 --> 00:44:16,312
I still do to a certain
extent but nothing
784
00:44:16,596 --> 00:44:20,052
nothing like I did say
when I was fourteen
785
00:44:21,268 --> 00:44:23,922
The job I'm in, I
mean, brick laying
786
00:44:24,882 --> 00:44:28,032
I mean I enjoy it,
it interests me
787
00:44:29,138 --> 00:44:31,225
and I'm very
content at work
788
00:44:33,495 --> 00:44:37,544
in June last year I was
made a junior partner
789
00:44:38,343 --> 00:44:41,509
though that was
through circumstances
790
00:44:41,510 --> 00:44:43,881
but I look at it this way
791
00:44:43,882 --> 00:44:45,829
I'm not great with my life
792
00:44:45,830 --> 00:44:49,034
but if I wasn't good enough and
my boss didn't think I was good enough
793
00:44:49,035 --> 00:44:51,327
he would've never made
me a junior partner
794
00:44:51,328 --> 00:44:52,988
as for the job
795
00:44:52,989 --> 00:44:54,589
you know, you build a house
796
00:44:54,590 --> 00:44:57,060
then you turn around and look
at it and say "well I did that"
797
00:44:57,061 --> 00:45:00,005
it's better than having
a whole row of figures
798
00:45:00,006 --> 00:45:02,323
it's substance you know,
there's something there
799
00:45:04,517 --> 00:45:08,641
Symon works in the freezer room of a
meat company near his home in Middlesex
800
00:45:09,939 --> 00:45:12,019
My job�s running away from me
801
00:45:14,713 --> 00:45:18,679
You do jobs which I suppose
are fairly routine and dull
802
00:45:18,680 --> 00:45:21,747
- Yeah
- What keeps you going during them?
803
00:45:22,863 --> 00:45:25,041
Oh it's definitely
the people there
804
00:45:26,061 --> 00:45:29,428
You work up a kind of team
spirit there, y'know what I mean
805
00:45:29,851 --> 00:45:31,709
You can .....
806
00:45:32,989 --> 00:45:35,595
think about all the work
you've got to do in the morning
807
00:45:35,596 --> 00:45:37,318
and you just don't want to go
808
00:45:37,319 --> 00:45:40,341
but once you get there
just sort of generally....
809
00:45:40,342 --> 00:45:42,935
I was going to say messing around
there, I won't say that
810
00:45:42,936 --> 00:45:44,497
the managers might see it
811
00:45:44,498 --> 00:45:46,073
sort of joking about
812
00:45:46,074 --> 00:45:49,433
they make you feel you
want to get the work done
813
00:45:49,434 --> 00:45:50,605
Go out and get some
814
00:45:52,001 --> 00:45:53,185
just ask for them
815
00:45:53,186 --> 00:45:56,575
and we always say
816
00:45:57,094 --> 00:46:00,197
when we come out of the chiller
we don't want to go back in
817
00:46:00,198 --> 00:46:03,089
but when we get
back in we get on with it
818
00:46:05,234 --> 00:46:07,467
So are you a good time keeper?
819
00:46:07,468 --> 00:46:09,033
Ah it depends
820
00:46:09,215 --> 00:46:11,065
Usually I try to get
to work early
821
00:46:11,066 --> 00:46:14,521
but I have periods of
where I just say "sod it"
822
00:46:15,246 --> 00:46:17,795
if I get there I get there
823
00:46:18,621 --> 00:46:21,303
I think the hardest thing
is to get up in the morning
824
00:46:21,304 --> 00:46:23,377
for me it takes a great
deal out of me now
825
00:46:23,378 --> 00:46:26,673
Do you never feel you should
be doing better jobs than these?
826
00:46:26,674 --> 00:46:28,714
Aren't you worth more than this?
827
00:46:32,477 --> 00:46:34,751
No I haven't really
828
00:46:34,752 --> 00:46:37,229
I suppose I just like hard
work, I don't know
829
00:46:37,230 --> 00:46:38,835
But eh...
830
00:46:39,809 --> 00:46:42,855
It's never really
sort of worried me
831
00:46:42,856 --> 00:46:46,115
I suppose it should
but it just hasn't
832
00:46:47,211 --> 00:46:49,941
and how do you see the
future as far as work goes?
833
00:46:53,168 --> 00:46:57,163
Well I know I can't stay at Walls
forever, I mean it's just not me
834
00:46:57,253 --> 00:47:01,292
I couldn't stay there for that
long, my mind would go dead
835
00:47:01,859 --> 00:47:03,315
But eh...
836
00:47:06,295 --> 00:47:10,037
I think if I really wanted to
I could learn a trade, even now
837
00:47:10,914 --> 00:47:17,281
Y'know if I really felt that I ought
to get out and do something different
838
00:47:17,282 --> 00:47:19,659
I could learn a
trade if I wanted to
839
00:47:20,347 --> 00:47:24,053
and what would you like to
be doing say in seven years?
840
00:47:28,543 --> 00:47:32,032
Well I couldn't really say I haven't
thought one year ahead yet
841
00:47:33,451 --> 00:47:35,819
I think I'm still sort
of young in my head
842
00:47:36,118 --> 00:47:38,716
I don't really sort of
take things seriously
843
00:47:38,717 --> 00:47:40,938
All I want out of
life is to be happy
844
00:47:40,939 --> 00:47:44,515
and when I say happy I want
to be happily married as well
845
00:47:44,516 --> 00:47:49,014
because I can't say I
don't want to get married
846
00:47:49,015 --> 00:47:50,661
because I think I do
847
00:47:50,662 --> 00:47:52,542
but I want to be
happily married y'know
848
00:47:52,543 --> 00:47:54,923
therefore I want to
make sure I think
849
00:47:54,924 --> 00:47:57,691
How would you define
happiness? What is it?
850
00:48:00,827 --> 00:48:04,026
Basically to me it's
the will to live
851
00:48:05,749 --> 00:48:09,333
I mean, me I literally
love life, I love people
852
00:48:09,334 --> 00:48:11,581
I mean I think
before I didn't
853
00:48:11,582 --> 00:48:14,144
I mean, when I
was fourteen I said
854
00:48:14,427 --> 00:48:16,921
I've forgotten what the
question was but I said
855
00:48:17,815 --> 00:48:19,496
something about I
want to be alone
856
00:48:19,497 --> 00:48:23,385
and when I said that I know
even now I meant that
857
00:48:23,386 --> 00:48:25,861
if someone had dropped
me out in the Sahara Desert
858
00:48:26,635 --> 00:48:29,627
I probably would've been happy
more or less if you get the point
859
00:48:30,603 --> 00:48:32,962
Whereas I'm not like that now,
I'd sooner be around people
860
00:48:32,963 --> 00:48:35,881
I don't like doing
things by myself
861
00:48:37,719 --> 00:48:43,349
and happiness to me is a love
for life and a love for people
862
00:48:44,717 --> 00:48:48,291
I think I admire people
with great determination
863
00:48:48,292 --> 00:48:51,435
y'know like people who just
come up from nothing
864
00:48:51,436 --> 00:48:54,089
they build up their life
from absolutely nothing
865
00:48:58,651 --> 00:49:00,907
I could say Muhammad Ali
866
00:49:00,908 --> 00:49:03,747
because he absolutely
came from nothing
867
00:49:05,129 --> 00:49:09,801
I mean you can't agree with everything
he says but his word goes down now
868
00:49:09,802 --> 00:49:14,343
he's the biggest thing in sport
he's one of the biggest things in life
869
00:49:16,579 --> 00:49:18,259
I mean people like him
870
00:49:19,805 --> 00:49:26,776
What when you look at yourself do you
think your weaknesses and strengths are?
871
00:49:35,836 --> 00:49:39,449
I think my main weakness is
I don't really take a grip of life
872
00:49:39,450 --> 00:49:41,068
I don't really look...
873
00:49:42,457 --> 00:49:46,945
I always look deeply into
it but it just seems to be ...
874
00:49:46,946 --> 00:49:51,364
just a sort of hobby with me, I
look at everything and I criticise it
875
00:49:51,365 --> 00:49:55,673
and I work everything out but
after that I just sort of leave it
876
00:49:55,674 --> 00:49:58,800
I find it hard to express
emotion most of the time
877
00:49:58,801 --> 00:50:01,367
although I'm getting
on top of that
878
00:50:01,368 --> 00:50:03,234
more happy now?
879
00:50:03,625 --> 00:50:07,928
just the simple things to say to Susan,
y'know "I love you" or something like that
880
00:50:08,441 --> 00:50:10,712
I mean I can tell
you about it but
881
00:50:11,487 --> 00:50:15,311
I really haven't been able
to say it freely to Susan
882
00:50:16,125 --> 00:50:18,557
I suppose that's a weakness
883
00:50:18,558 --> 00:50:20,053
Do you have a dream?
884
00:50:21,079 --> 00:50:22,173
A dream? not....
885
00:50:22,174 --> 00:50:27,747
Not so much a dream but I know
if I ever wanted to get on I could do it
886
00:50:28,663 --> 00:50:33,977
I mean I always feel that I've got something
inside me that would make me move
887
00:50:34,353 --> 00:50:36,241
But eh...
888
00:50:37,341 --> 00:50:40,539
I think what it is really is I'm just
waiting for an excuse to use it
889
00:50:40,540 --> 00:50:45,520
Y'know at the moment I feel
ok just getting on with my life
890
00:50:46,029 --> 00:50:48,190
just sort of keeping up
891
00:50:48,479 --> 00:50:51,359
but I know if I really
wanted to I could get on
892
00:50:52,003 --> 00:50:54,899
It'll only take a little
spark with me to do it
893
00:50:59,457 --> 00:51:02,572
Is it important to fight? Yes
894
00:51:13,581 --> 00:51:17,003
Would everybody please sit round
now and get on with their work
895
00:51:17,004 --> 00:51:19,887
I don't want to see
any backs to me
896
00:51:20,567 --> 00:51:23,750
Shouldn't be anybody turning
round, Tony do you hear aswell?
897
00:51:25,443 --> 00:51:27,439
Get on with your work in front
898
00:51:28,477 --> 00:51:30,027
Tony!
899
00:51:30,407 --> 00:51:32,040
Don't turn
round again
900
00:51:32,810 --> 00:51:35,961
I want to be a jockey when I grow up
yeah I want to be a jockey when I grow up
901
00:51:42,739 --> 00:51:45,989
Tony left his Eastend secondary
modern school at fifteen
902
00:51:45,990 --> 00:51:49,843
and became an apprentice at
Tommy Gosling's racing stables in Epsom
903
00:51:55,498 --> 00:51:58,525
This is a photo finish of
when I rode at Newberry
904
00:52:00,587 --> 00:52:02,035
I'm the one with the white cap
905
00:52:02,036 --> 00:52:05,721
I was beaten a length and a half
for third and had a photo finish
906
00:52:06,219 --> 00:52:08,881
so I took it out the box and
kept it as a souvenir
907
00:52:08,882 --> 00:52:10,921
Have you any other pictures
of you as a jockey?
908
00:52:10,922 --> 00:52:13,479
Yeah I've got a lot of them
909
00:52:13,921 --> 00:52:15,071
Show me that one
910
00:52:16,215 --> 00:52:18,919
That one when I was at Windsor
911
00:52:18,920 --> 00:52:22,100
that was my last ride on the old
horse, Sharrod Heath that was
912
00:52:22,341 --> 00:52:24,805
he was a lovely old horse,
I'll never forget him
913
00:52:24,806 --> 00:52:26,405
How many rides did you have?
914
00:52:26,851 --> 00:52:28,035
Only three
915
00:52:28,551 --> 00:52:29,885
Why was that?
916
00:52:30,117 --> 00:52:32,821
Well obviously if I was good
enough I would've had more
917
00:52:32,822 --> 00:52:36,879
that was the first day I ever
put myself in jockey silks
918
00:52:37,155 --> 00:52:39,155
that was my first ride ever
919
00:52:39,156 --> 00:52:40,914
How did it feel like?
920
00:52:40,915 --> 00:52:44,439
It feel like there's no words
that can explain how it felt
921
00:52:44,673 --> 00:52:47,338
that one was when I
was going to the parade ring
922
00:52:48,469 --> 00:52:50,623
They're not very good
923
00:52:50,624 --> 00:52:53,778
my brother, I mean he's not
no good at taking photos
924
00:52:53,779 --> 00:52:55,583
He's no Lord Snowdon
925
00:52:55,584 --> 00:52:57,433
But describe
the feeling, go on
926
00:52:57,434 --> 00:52:59,399
Describe, well....I mean I..
927
00:52:59,400 --> 00:53:02,430
Frankie Durr right, he was
told to look after me
928
00:53:02,431 --> 00:53:05,137
so I went in there I said "I
don't know my first ride"
929
00:53:05,138 --> 00:53:09,495
and he said "alright don't worry, your
boss has told me to look after you"
930
00:53:09,839 --> 00:53:10,785
and so
931
00:53:10,786 --> 00:53:12,891
I was changing into my silks
932
00:53:12,892 --> 00:53:16,175
and I felt good y'know, I could
see all the faces that I think
933
00:53:16,176 --> 00:53:19,759
and when I look at the newspaper I
think, Jeff Lewis, Frankie Durr and...
934
00:53:19,760 --> 00:53:23,288
I thought to myself all of a sudden I'm
in the same room getting changed
935
00:53:23,289 --> 00:53:24,884
Then I walked in the parade room
936
00:53:24,885 --> 00:53:26,576
the parade ring and eh...
937
00:53:26,577 --> 00:53:29,521
and all my family's there and
they're all going "Go on Tone!"
938
00:53:30,045 --> 00:53:31,676
and the boss came over and he said
939
00:53:31,677 --> 00:53:34,584
you've got to do this to the horse,
you hold him back, you go half pace
940
00:53:34,585 --> 00:53:36,865
keep your hands down,
keep him in the rails
941
00:53:36,866 --> 00:53:38,851
and I'm going "yeah
yeah" like, nod
942
00:53:38,852 --> 00:53:42,025
and all of a sudden when he
said "Jockeys please mount"
943
00:53:42,026 --> 00:53:43,723
and the bell went "Ding ding"
944
00:53:43,724 --> 00:53:46,716
and my heart just sunk
because I thought to myself
945
00:53:46,717 --> 00:53:49,185
Here I was yesterday
a sort of nobody
946
00:53:49,186 --> 00:53:52,235
and here I am today, I'm king like
947
00:53:52,236 --> 00:53:55,047
I felt king for one day,
well for ten minutes
948
00:53:55,048 --> 00:53:56,727
Do you regret not making it?
949
00:53:56,899 --> 00:54:00,708
Well I would've given my right
arm at the time to become a jockey
950
00:54:01,077 --> 00:54:02,863
But now...
951
00:54:02,864 --> 00:54:06,069
well I wasn't good enough,
it's as easy as that
952
00:54:06,070 --> 00:54:08,892
What will you do if you
don't make it as a jockey?
953
00:54:08,893 --> 00:54:10,503
I don't know
954
00:54:10,504 --> 00:54:13,369
If I knew I couldn't be
one I'd get out of the game
955
00:54:14,765 --> 00:54:16,373
wouldn't bother
956
00:54:16,374 --> 00:54:18,555
and what do you think
you would do then?
957
00:54:19,175 --> 00:54:20,789
Learn taxi's
958
00:54:21,365 --> 00:54:23,329
Taxi driver
959
00:54:29,541 --> 00:54:32,317
I will be a cab driver
right, how can I fail?
960
00:54:32,318 --> 00:54:34,607
I got one brother
taxi driver pulling me
961
00:54:34,608 --> 00:54:37,791
and the other brother pushing
me so I got to make it
962
00:54:38,191 --> 00:54:40,518
I will be a cab driver
and I know I will
963
00:54:40,519 --> 00:54:44,075
and I'm going to prove every person
who thinks I can't be a cab driver wrong
964
00:54:44,305 --> 00:54:47,872
and I'm going to get that
badge and put it right in their face
965
00:54:47,873 --> 00:54:51,599
just to tell them how wrong they
can be and how under estimated I am
966
00:54:52,938 --> 00:54:56,903
Doing the taxi knowledge means Tony
going out on his motorbike every day
967
00:54:56,904 --> 00:54:59,709
and learning the hundreds of
routes round the streets of London
968
00:54:59,710 --> 00:55:03,143
Well I can just get up, go on my
bike, do two runs, come home
969
00:55:03,144 --> 00:55:08,585
call them over then boom, I've done my days
work then I go
out here and earn my money
970
00:55:09,399 --> 00:55:11,928
Hackney Wick it's
my sort of living
971
00:55:11,929 --> 00:55:14,433
I can say until the time
I am a cab driver
972
00:55:14,434 --> 00:55:17,318
But mean my freedom's here and
that is the main thing what I want
973
00:55:17,585 --> 00:55:22,145
Tony spends his spare time at Hackney Wick
Greyhound Stadium placing bets for the punters
974
00:55:22,233 --> 00:55:24,271
Fifty-five to twenty Boris
975
00:55:35,441 --> 00:55:38,151
Five to one Cooladine
976
00:55:38,462 --> 00:55:40,105
Four and a half fifty's,
four and a half fifty's
977
00:55:42,335 --> 00:55:44,579
Poor-Sunshine fourteen to one
978
00:55:44,580 --> 00:55:46,276
Take it, take it!
979
00:55:46,830 --> 00:55:49,881
If your father gambles you always
looked upon how he gambles
980
00:55:49,882 --> 00:55:51,820
I tried my luck and
see what he does
981
00:55:52,522 --> 00:55:55,017
and I took it from there,
it's sort of in you
982
00:55:55,018 --> 00:55:59,263
some people drink and they can't get out of
drinking, some people smoke and can't stop smoking
983
00:55:59,264 --> 00:56:02,599
well I think I'm firmly on
the ground as a gambler
984
00:56:02,600 --> 00:56:06,277
I know you can't win gambling, putting
money on the dogs and horses, I know that
985
00:56:06,278 --> 00:56:09,893
But when you put other
peoples money on you can't lose
986
00:56:09,894 --> 00:56:11,384
What do they call you here?
987
00:56:11,385 --> 00:56:13,966
I reckon a pest, or
something like that
988
00:56:13,967 --> 00:56:17,735
'cause I'm always running and doing
everything that I shouldn't be doing
989
00:56:18,403 --> 00:56:21,469
I thought I was going to get
barred one day 'cause I used to...
990
00:56:21,470 --> 00:56:23,666
Well I don't mean to make
a nuisance of myself
991
00:56:23,667 --> 00:56:27,150
I mean if the other
patrons of the place
992
00:56:27,151 --> 00:56:29,981
they don't want to see a little
boy nipping between their feet
993
00:56:29,982 --> 00:56:32,448
running, putting a
bet on for a person
994
00:56:32,449 --> 00:56:35,073
You understand? they think "cor
what's he doing is he mad?"
995
00:56:35,074 --> 00:56:38,111
I mean I walk up there
I order the teas
996
00:56:38,112 --> 00:56:40,455
There could be eight people
in front of me, I just go...
997
00:56:40,456 --> 00:56:42,581
Can I have a tea please,
tea please, five times
998
00:56:42,582 --> 00:56:43,751
tea please
tea please
999
00:56:43,752 --> 00:56:46,759
and they've got to serve me before them
to get rid of me, do you understand?
1000
00:56:47,599 --> 00:56:49,424
So that�s how you've got to do it
1001
00:56:49,572 --> 00:56:52,086
Just keep on and on
and on and they go
1002
00:56:52,087 --> 00:56:54,921
"oh driving me mad, here you are,
get rid of him" it's as easy as that
1003
00:56:55,603 --> 00:56:58,784
That's the way to get on in
life, just be a noise, annoyed
1004
00:56:59,145 --> 00:57:03,898
annoyance all the time to a person and they go
"oh he's driving me mad, get him away from me
1005
00:57:03,899 --> 00:57:06,440
and more or less they
give you the first option
1006
00:57:06,441 --> 00:57:08,225
sort of find that
1007
00:57:08,461 --> 00:57:11,885
You're very short, has
that had much trouble?
1008
00:57:11,886 --> 00:57:14,197
Well a bird said
to me the other day
1009
00:57:14,198 --> 00:57:15,777
She said "ain't you small"
1010
00:57:15,778 --> 00:57:18,467
So I said "but you're ugly
at least I can grow"
1011
00:57:18,468 --> 00:57:21,707
What can they say to that? they
can't say nothing can they?
1012
00:57:21,708 --> 00:57:23,378
to a thing like that, or...
1013
00:57:23,379 --> 00:57:24,557
or example...
1014
00:57:24,558 --> 00:57:28,099
She said to me "Ain't you small" so I looked
at her tits and she was only about a thirty
1015
00:57:28,100 --> 00:57:31,187
I said "But you're not too big
either so we're both in the same way"
1016
00:57:31,493 --> 00:57:33,561
- Have you got a girlfriend?
- No
1017
00:57:33,729 --> 00:57:36,481
Would you like to
have a girlfriend?
1018
00:57:36,482 --> 00:57:37,307
No
1019
00:57:37,308 --> 00:57:39,005
Do you understand "The Four F's?"
1020
00:57:39,006 --> 00:57:41,183
Find the, feed them, forget them
1021
00:57:41,184 --> 00:57:44,244
for the other F I'll let you
use your own discrimination
1022
00:57:44,245 --> 00:57:45,063
I mean...
1023
00:57:45,064 --> 00:57:46,523
this one
1024
00:57:46,524 --> 00:57:48,457
I tried to do the three F's
1025
00:57:48,777 --> 00:57:50,611
but I couldn't forget her
1026
00:57:51,001 --> 00:57:53,567
I'd done the three F's
but I couldn't forget her
1027
00:57:53,568 --> 00:57:55,961
It sounds silly but that's
the only way I can put it
1028
00:57:56,199 --> 00:57:59,091
Tell me about the family,
are you fairly closely knit?
1029
00:57:59,332 --> 00:58:00,853
Well I love them all
1030
00:58:00,854 --> 00:58:04,142
There's not one I don't love more than
the other, other than my mum obviously
1031
00:58:04,143 --> 00:58:08,630
but your mum is the root of the
tree, you love your mum best
1032
00:58:08,631 --> 00:58:11,042
So what do you like about
living in the Eastend?
1033
00:58:11,043 --> 00:58:14,175
It's very sort of real,
there's nothing false
1034
00:58:14,395 --> 00:58:16,267
only the police!
1035
00:58:16,627 --> 00:58:20,735
I'm firmly placed and there's no way I can
see getting out, I wouldn't want to get out really
1036
00:58:20,736 --> 00:58:26,095
It's very hard to make it in the Eastend
because the roots are firmly stuck in the ground
1037
00:58:26,096 --> 00:58:28,345
and you've got to have a
big hard pull to get them out
1038
00:58:28,346 --> 00:58:30,437
So are there many
villains in the Eastend?
1039
00:58:31,209 --> 00:58:33,354
There has been in
the time I suppose
1040
00:58:33,355 --> 00:58:36,063
the originals were
the Kray twins
1041
00:58:36,064 --> 00:58:38,653
We're in Vallance Rd now, as
it goes they used to live here
1042
00:58:38,654 --> 00:58:41,847
in a house they used
to call Fort Vallance
1043
00:58:41,848 --> 00:58:44,291
'cause it was that hard
to get into I expect
1044
00:58:44,547 --> 00:58:46,503
Do you have much
to do with villains?
1045
00:58:46,504 --> 00:58:50,085
I can't say I have much to do,
I wouldn't say I'm a villain myself
1046
00:58:50,086 --> 00:58:53,221
I don't go thieving and don't do
anybody any harm fighting wise
1047
00:58:53,222 --> 00:58:55,023
I'm trying to say that
1048
00:58:55,024 --> 00:59:00,023
Wherever you go there's villains and whether
you mix with them or not it's up to you
1049
00:59:00,167 --> 00:59:03,351
Does it worry you the possibility
of becoming one of them?
1050
00:59:03,352 --> 00:59:05,473
How can I become a villain?
1051
00:59:05,474 --> 00:59:08,375
If it's not in there, it's not born
in there you won't become one
1052
00:59:08,376 --> 00:59:11,329
Don't you think you're going to
regret not having an education?
1053
00:59:11,506 --> 00:59:14,321
Where does that come into it?
it doesn't come into it in my mind?
1054
00:59:14,322 --> 00:59:18,391
Education is just a thing to say
"my son is higher than him"
1055
00:59:18,392 --> 00:59:20,707
or "my son had a better
background than him"
1056
00:59:20,708 --> 00:59:22,247
I mean
1057
00:59:22,248 --> 00:59:25,605
I'm as good or even better
than most of them people
1058
00:59:25,606 --> 00:59:28,011
especially on this program
1059
00:59:28,012 --> 00:59:29,004
I mean
1060
00:59:29,223 --> 00:59:31,016
On one of the trailers
you'll think
1061
00:59:31,017 --> 00:59:33,957
oh the Eastend boy and he
ain't got a no good education
1062
00:59:33,958 --> 00:59:37,811
but all of a sudden the Eastend boy's got a
car and a motorbike and he goes to Spain every year
1063
00:59:37,812 --> 00:59:39,127
and whatever
1064
00:59:39,461 --> 00:59:41,128
and have I worked for it?
1065
00:59:41,129 --> 00:59:42,780
No I'm here putting bets on
1066
00:59:42,781 --> 00:59:44,605
and you think "how
does he do it?"
1067
00:59:44,606 --> 00:59:46,870
and there's a boy,
who's he? and whatever
1068
00:59:46,871 --> 00:59:50,763
he's studying to be a
professor, he's making up things
1069
00:59:50,764 --> 00:59:53,419
They're mainly education, there's
no education in this world
1070
00:59:53,420 --> 00:59:55,587
Just one big rat
race and you've got to
1071
00:59:55,588 --> 00:59:58,449
kill your man next to you
to get in front of him
1072
00:59:58,625 --> 01:00:02,065
What do you think about trade
unions and things like that?
1073
01:00:02,066 --> 01:00:04,167
I don�t under know I don't
1074
01:00:04,611 --> 01:00:06,931
I don't know enough to know about
them if you understand me
1075
01:00:07,675 --> 01:00:08,903
I mean
1076
01:00:08,904 --> 01:00:13,207
I'm not a politician so let them worry
about what's coming for the next day
1077
01:00:13,493 --> 01:00:14,809
all I understand is
1078
01:00:14,810 --> 01:00:20,544
dogs, prices, girls, knowledge, roads, streets,
squares and mum and dad and love
1079
01:00:20,545 --> 01:00:23,467
that's all I understand that's
all I want to understand
1080
01:00:30,756 --> 01:00:32,087
Here you are
1081
01:00:35,269 --> 01:00:37,003
Come on three chase it
1082
01:00:37,710 --> 01:00:39,335
Come on boy
1083
01:00:39,836 --> 01:00:41,845
Go on three inside
1084
01:00:44,098 --> 01:00:46,043
Come on three???
1085
01:00:46,668 --> 01:00:48,857
He's checking everywhere....
1086
01:00:48,858 --> 01:00:51,413
Well going to Africa
1087
01:00:51,414 --> 01:00:55,817
and try and teach people
who are not civilised
1088
01:00:56,083 --> 01:00:59,343
to be more or less good
1089
01:00:59,344 --> 01:01:03,766
No I don't want to be a missionary because
I just can't talk about it to people
1090
01:01:04,442 --> 01:01:09,642
Y'know, I am interested in it myself
but I wouldn't be very good at it at all
1091
01:01:10,448 --> 01:01:12,272
and I wouldn't enjoy it
1092
01:01:13,018 --> 01:01:15,156
Why wouldn�t you be good at it
1093
01:01:16,607 --> 01:01:19,513
Well I'm just not
very good at...
1094
01:01:19,514 --> 01:01:24,658
at standing up in front of people and
making a speech or anything like that
1095
01:01:24,659 --> 01:01:27,301
I'd like to keep it
private, y'know
1096
01:01:27,302 --> 01:01:30,686
Is it possible you might ever
think of going to the church?
1097
01:01:32,672 --> 01:01:35,807
It is possible, I've
never said no definitely
1098
01:01:36,176 --> 01:01:40,019
But I wouldn't be doing it
after I go to university
1099
01:01:40,020 --> 01:01:44,407
I mean it's just possible in
ten years time I suppose
1100
01:01:46,224 --> 01:01:48,561
What would draw
you to the church?
1101
01:01:50,996 --> 01:01:55,609
I don't know, it wouldn't be dissatisfaction
with whatever I'm doing at the moment
1102
01:01:56,831 --> 01:01:58,580
In a way
1103
01:01:58,847 --> 01:02:02,226
If whatever I was doing I
was doing very successfully
1104
01:02:03,702 --> 01:02:07,128
then that would be a better reason
for going into the church really
1105
01:02:07,129 --> 01:02:10,691
or at least if I did go into the church
it would meant I was giving something up
1106
01:02:10,692 --> 01:02:12,007
But
1107
01:02:13,500 --> 01:02:17,685
I think the wrong reasons are if you
are dissatisfied with what you're doing
1108
01:02:17,686 --> 01:02:22,782
in the general sense
of doing a job badly or
1109
01:02:22,783 --> 01:02:25,177
a failure in some sort of way
1110
01:02:25,734 --> 01:02:30,219
Bruce is in his final year at University
College Oxford, reading mathematics
1111
01:02:31,043 --> 01:02:36,114
and by Eisenstien you can
show that this is irreducible
1112
01:02:36,760 --> 01:02:40,975
then you do a transformation
on this ???? x = to T+2
1113
01:02:41,894 --> 01:02:46,422
which you find is T cubed plus
17 squared plus 14 T plus 7
1114
01:02:47,138 --> 01:02:47,936
and
1115
01:02:47,937 --> 01:02:50,582
you observe that
seven which is a prime
1116
01:02:50,826 --> 01:02:53,370
divides the co-efficient
of T squared
1117
01:02:53,371 --> 01:02:56,152
T and the constant,
not T cubed
1118
01:02:56,309 --> 01:03:00,742
and seven squared doesn't
divide the constant term
1119
01:03:00,743 --> 01:03:02,926
so by Eisenstien
1120
01:03:02,927 --> 01:03:04,723
this is irreducible
1121
01:03:05,270 --> 01:03:08,751
so therefore two cross, two
by seven is of degree three
1122
01:03:09,019 --> 01:03:11,451
and that length
isn't constructable
1123
01:03:12,207 --> 01:03:14,327
from the quarry of
our original theorem
1124
01:03:14,328 --> 01:03:16,270
so therefore the
septagon's not constructable
1125
01:03:16,271 --> 01:03:20,102
Well that's a nice way of doing it,
particularly using Eisenstien down here
1126
01:03:20,103 --> 01:03:23,583
his test is very popular, he
was an interesting mathematician
1127
01:03:23,584 --> 01:03:26,701
What sort of job are
you going to try for?
1128
01:03:28,969 --> 01:03:33,206
Well there was one job, I'd
like to make maps really
1129
01:03:34,180 --> 01:03:37,586
and it's nice sort
of outdoor life
1130
01:03:38,586 --> 01:03:41,394
you go to...I mean
you travel around
1131
01:03:41,395 --> 01:03:42,534
and eh...
1132
01:03:43,003 --> 01:03:45,450
but there are very
few jobs like that going
1133
01:03:45,451 --> 01:03:49,330
I'm sort of qualified, a general maths
or science degree would do
1134
01:03:49,331 --> 01:03:51,504
or geography degree
1135
01:03:51,885 --> 01:03:53,438
But eh...
1136
01:03:56,404 --> 01:03:59,787
I think I've probably
missed it this time round
1137
01:04:00,032 --> 01:04:01,932
and eh....but that's only....
1138
01:04:01,933 --> 01:04:05,190
perhaps I won't like making maps,
it's something that I think I would do
1139
01:04:14,892 --> 01:04:18,840
Millbrook probably had a
great influence on me in a way
1140
01:04:18,841 --> 01:04:22,165
I mean I was absolutely shocked
rigid when I went to my prep school
1141
01:04:22,166 --> 01:04:24,972
and found people who
thought of doing things wrong
1142
01:04:24,973 --> 01:04:28,709
I never really upset anyone
or questioned authority
1143
01:04:28,710 --> 01:04:32,461
or misbehaved in any
of my two later schools
1144
01:04:32,462 --> 01:04:39,266
which may seem an ideal thing but it's probably
healthy to question why you have to do certain things
1145
01:04:39,611 --> 01:04:41,323
which I never did
1146
01:04:41,324 --> 01:04:45,376
Bruce was a border at this pre-preparatory
school from the age of five
1147
01:04:46,763 --> 01:04:48,935
Squad left foot in one place
1148
01:04:50,858 --> 01:04:52,455
squad breathe in
1149
01:04:52,456 --> 01:04:55,798
Well it is mainly this
lack of responsibility
1150
01:04:55,799 --> 01:04:57,397
for doing jobs given to me
1151
01:04:57,398 --> 01:05:00,622
people will say "why haven't you
done this? Look you've upset us"
1152
01:05:00,623 --> 01:05:06,549
I was secretary of bridge society,
chess society, cricket society
1153
01:05:07,005 --> 01:05:09,149
Scottish dancing society
1154
01:05:09,150 --> 01:05:12,484
and I didn't do anything for any
of them, they were all very angry
1155
01:05:13,227 --> 01:05:17,456
and I spent last summer
term in total seclusion
1156
01:05:17,457 --> 01:05:19,968
I saw maybe half a
dozen people all term
1157
01:05:19,969 --> 01:05:22,014
in my room, darting
across courts
1158
01:05:22,712 --> 01:05:26,742
people would say "I saw Balden
today" and they'd say "No? really?"
1159
01:05:27,938 --> 01:05:29,562
it was awful really
1160
01:05:29,563 --> 01:05:34,964
My hearts desire is to see my
daddy who is six thousand miles away
1161
01:05:35,373 --> 01:05:38,941
Y'know I've been getting
on well with my step-father
1162
01:05:39,512 --> 01:05:42,263
and I like seeing my
father occasionally
1163
01:05:42,523 --> 01:05:45,034
and he does come
over from Rhodesia
1164
01:05:45,035 --> 01:05:51,187
What effect has the fact that you've
seen very little of your father had on you?
1165
01:05:52,094 --> 01:05:55,159
Nothing really, I only
...something I regret that...
1166
01:05:55,160 --> 01:05:58,646
I didn't really get to
know him better at all
1167
01:06:00,766 --> 01:06:04,335
We've written and we're both very
bad writers, I'm probably worse than him
1168
01:06:05,308 --> 01:06:06,368
and eh...
1169
01:06:06,770 --> 01:06:10,948
that's something I regret is not
having a just a regular correspondence
1170
01:06:12,335 --> 01:06:14,929
because I think he's an
interesting man actually
1171
01:06:16,506 --> 01:06:17,994
and eh...
1172
01:06:18,744 --> 01:06:20,656
he probably regrets it as well
1173
01:06:20,657 --> 01:06:23,036
What do you think about
your own upbringing?
1174
01:06:23,037 --> 01:06:26,308
what have been the strongest
influences on that?
1175
01:06:27,656 --> 01:06:31,920
Probably to not let
down my mother really
1176
01:06:31,921 --> 01:06:35,940
because she's worked awfully
hard to get me through school
1177
01:06:36,728 --> 01:06:37,610
and
1178
01:06:38,206 --> 01:06:40,319
I haven't let
her down yet
1179
01:06:43,576 --> 01:06:44,620
then..
1180
01:06:44,621 --> 01:06:48,544
as far as...eh
...not having...
1181
01:06:48,967 --> 01:06:51,515
my mothers divorce
1182
01:06:51,516 --> 01:06:55,280
I don't think that really has the
effect that people imagine it to have
1183
01:06:55,702 --> 01:06:59,708
I mean I always have got
on well with my stepfather
1184
01:07:00,398 --> 01:07:05,642
and with my half-sister, so in
that sense I've had a family life
1185
01:07:06,006 --> 01:07:08,801
I'd help people
if I had a chance
1186
01:07:11,040 --> 01:07:16,086
Y'know by say giving a little bit of
money to charity or sponsoring things
1187
01:07:16,087 --> 01:07:17,740
or things like that
1188
01:07:17,741 --> 01:07:21,308
Well I took nine months off
1189
01:07:21,309 --> 01:07:23,587
between school and university
1190
01:07:25,188 --> 01:07:29,879
and there I taught at a school and
worked in the Banbury sewage works
1191
01:07:31,414 --> 01:07:33,717
two months
1192
01:07:34,104 --> 01:07:35,928
What sort of school was it?
1193
01:07:36,452 --> 01:07:39,812
Well I never like admitting this
but it was a handicapped school
1194
01:07:39,813 --> 01:07:42,421
I mean
1195
01:07:42,422 --> 01:07:46,187
it seems to present me as
wanting to do these things
1196
01:07:46,188 --> 01:07:47,922
I suppose in a way I do, and
1197
01:07:47,923 --> 01:07:51,736
I do get some satisfaction
from doing it, but....
1198
01:07:52,769 --> 01:07:55,226
I could so easily have
done something else
1199
01:07:55,227 --> 01:08:00,384
it was just almost an accident that
I ended up at the spastic school
1200
01:08:01,271 --> 01:08:02,720
and eh...
1201
01:08:02,721 --> 01:08:04,759
I'm glad I did it
because I enjoyed it
1202
01:08:04,760 --> 01:08:07,021
not for its....
1203
01:08:08,510 --> 01:08:11,662
I suppose slightly charitable
nature of the work, but
1204
01:08:12,556 --> 01:08:16,382
the people I met, work,
it was quite good
1205
01:08:16,383 --> 01:08:20,370
Why are you frightened of
presenting this image of yourself
1206
01:08:25,297 --> 01:08:27,353
It's...
1207
01:08:28,827 --> 01:08:31,588
It�s possibly because I
1208
01:08:32,886 --> 01:08:35,619
I don't know, I never
want to feel to proud really
1209
01:08:38,520 --> 01:08:43,032
I mean it's dangerous for
a start and it's so easy
1210
01:08:43,033 --> 01:08:43,618
and
1211
01:08:45,708 --> 01:08:49,764
it doesn't work in a way because I
can try and pretend to be humble
1212
01:08:49,765 --> 01:08:54,044
that's being proud in
just the same sort of way
1213
01:08:54,607 --> 01:08:57,484
I find it a very difficult
thing to avoid, pride
1214
01:08:57,485 --> 01:08:59,858
Tell me, are you interested
in politics at all?
1215
01:09:01,305 --> 01:09:04,628
Not as much as I was
1216
01:09:06,420 --> 01:09:10,756
I am about the only
socialist in my village
1217
01:09:11,347 --> 01:09:13,283
and I go into the pub
1218
01:09:15,370 --> 01:09:19,959
and sort of expect to stand up
and defend all socialist policies
1219
01:09:20,406 --> 01:09:22,841
sort of, this is
the village socialist
1220
01:09:22,842 --> 01:09:25,375
no, village idiot, sorry
1221
01:09:26,446 --> 01:09:29,519
you agree with all this immigration
so I stand up and defend it
1222
01:09:29,520 --> 01:09:33,143
and it's awfully hard work though
I think I'm going to give that up
1223
01:09:34,837 --> 01:09:38,735
So where do you stand
politically now then?
1224
01:09:39,878 --> 01:09:44,137
I'm still socialist but not as
energetically as I was I suppose
1225
01:09:46,759 --> 01:09:49,818
What do you think about the way
England's being run at the moment?
1226
01:09:54,527 --> 01:09:56,222
Well...
1227
01:10:00,081 --> 01:10:02,427
I'm glad the socialist's
are in power because
1228
01:10:02,793 --> 01:10:08,581
This illusive thing called freedom
is sort of rearing its head
1229
01:10:08,582 --> 01:10:11,513
and the conservatives
are pushing it forward
1230
01:10:11,514 --> 01:10:16,373
and I thought this
argument was smashed
1231
01:10:16,374 --> 01:10:19,323
at the early years of this century
but it seems to be coming back
1232
01:10:19,324 --> 01:10:21,885
and it really is exceptionally
dangerous because
1233
01:10:21,886 --> 01:10:24,257
the more you try
and defend freedom
1234
01:10:24,949 --> 01:10:29,189
you allow everybody to do
exactly what they like within limits
1235
01:10:29,190 --> 01:10:31,527
then the less you have
1236
01:10:31,763 --> 01:10:36,763
I mean there's no
freedom in living in a slum
1237
01:10:38,174 --> 01:10:40,166
It's alright you can say the
chap can do whatever he wants
1238
01:10:40,167 --> 01:10:42,977
he can get a better job or anything
but that's just not the case
1239
01:10:42,978 --> 01:10:45,376
the more you defend freedom
the less you have it
1240
01:10:45,377 --> 01:10:49,813
Well my girlfriend is in Africa
1241
01:10:49,992 --> 01:10:53,741
and I don't think I'll have
another chance of seeing her again
1242
01:10:53,742 --> 01:10:55,080
Have you got any girlfriends?
1243
01:10:55,081 --> 01:10:57,307
No, not yet
1244
01:10:57,684 --> 01:11:00,820
I'm sure it will come, but not yet
1245
01:11:00,821 --> 01:11:03,137
What is your attitude to sex?
1246
01:11:04,988 --> 01:11:10,521
Well it's not quite, normal
attitude to anti-sex
1247
01:11:18,065 --> 01:11:21,877
I mean I as it were
burnt my fingers a little
1248
01:11:24,165 --> 01:11:27,989
I don't feel as though I'm
missing anything now
1249
01:11:29,487 --> 01:11:31,813
I don't feel a need for it
1250
01:11:33,419 --> 01:11:37,516
and I'm quite happy at not
feeling a need for it really
1251
01:11:40,527 --> 01:11:45,211
I mean I do think a lot of people
think too much about it
1252
01:11:46,102 --> 01:11:48,100
What happened
when you burnt your fingers?
1253
01:11:53,793 --> 01:11:56,647
I'd rather not talk
about it really
1254
01:11:57,730 --> 01:11:59,714
well no in fact I don't
really mean that
1255
01:11:59,715 --> 01:12:02,451
I don't mean I don't
want to talk about it
1256
01:12:02,452 --> 01:12:05,510
it's just I'd need quite a long
time to think about it really
1257
01:12:06,257 --> 01:12:07,569
Why?
1258
01:12:12,215 --> 01:12:15,872
Well in the end I
decided the eh...
1259
01:12:18,114 --> 01:12:22,649
the effect, the pleasure, or...
1260
01:12:24,506 --> 01:12:26,858
just didn't seem
worth it really
1261
01:12:26,859 --> 01:12:29,123
didn't seem worth...
1262
01:12:40,562 --> 01:12:42,258
See I think there's
two different sorts
1263
01:12:42,259 --> 01:12:46,477
there's casual sex then there's
sex in love and marriage
1264
01:12:46,978 --> 01:12:48,590
and
1265
01:12:50,975 --> 01:12:53,149
casual seks is not...
1266
01:12:53,437 --> 01:12:56,219
I don't think it's quite as
widespread as people believed
1267
01:12:56,220 --> 01:12:58,065
because
1268
01:12:59,584 --> 01:13:04,347
if both the people treat it as
casual sex then I think it's alright
1269
01:13:04,960 --> 01:13:06,731
but
1270
01:13:08,573 --> 01:13:11,239
if you're sort of looking for
1271
01:13:11,240 --> 01:13:13,861
I don't know this may
seem awfully silly but
1272
01:13:13,862 --> 01:13:17,802
if you're looking for casual sex
but don't want to treat it as such
1273
01:13:17,803 --> 01:13:22,907
then it doesn't seem to be worth
the lies, I don't know the...
1274
01:13:23,967 --> 01:13:26,011
the sort of effort
1275
01:13:26,385 --> 01:13:29,285
- Is this what happened to you?
- I suppose in a way yes
1276
01:13:30,437 --> 01:13:31,658
Have you been in love?
1277
01:13:31,659 --> 01:13:33,169
No, no
1278
01:13:34,485 --> 01:13:36,835
and eh...
1279
01:13:37,503 --> 01:13:39,935
I think I'll probably have
to wait for that really
1280
01:13:39,936 --> 01:13:42,110
Play international wrestling
1281
01:13:42,111 --> 01:13:44,529
Yeah that's only at
summertime though
1282
01:13:44,530 --> 01:13:46,621
Yeah summer we can
go on the grass
1283
01:13:53,525 --> 01:13:56,598
Neil went to a comprehensive
school in Liverpool
1284
01:13:56,599 --> 01:14:00,966
got four A-levels then walked out
of Aberdeen university after one term
1285
01:14:00,967 --> 01:14:03,927
and is now doing
casual labour in London
1286
01:14:03,928 --> 01:14:08,352
I came to London I think because
I wanted to start a new life really
1287
01:14:08,543 --> 01:14:12,124
I'd left the university
in Aberdeen
1288
01:14:12,125 --> 01:14:14,459
in the end of nineteen
seventy-five
1289
01:14:14,651 --> 01:14:18,522
and I became conscious of the
fact that I was drifting around
1290
01:14:18,745 --> 01:14:24,625
which I suppose I'm still doing here but at
least I took the decision to move myself
1291
01:14:24,984 --> 01:14:30,473
and I think possibly there's more challenge in
London than there ever could be in Aberdeen
1292
01:14:31,570 --> 01:14:33,960
Peter, Neil's school
friend from Liverpool
1293
01:14:33,961 --> 01:14:37,439
is now in his last year at
London university, reading history
1294
01:14:38,017 --> 01:14:41,041
It was obviously a big step
1295
01:14:41,475 --> 01:14:45,285
it was exciting more than anything,
I mean that sounds corny but it was
1296
01:14:45,286 --> 01:14:47,258
Do you remember the
day you left Liverpool?
1297
01:14:47,259 --> 01:14:48,824
Yeah very well
1298
01:14:49,131 --> 01:14:51,931
It was pouring down with
rain, I remember that
1299
01:14:52,021 --> 01:14:55,708
just had the traditional send of from the train
station, my mum and dad were there
1300
01:14:56,423 --> 01:14:59,831
a couple of mates turned up at the
last minute, from the school to see me
1301
01:15:00,857 --> 01:15:03,493
- Catch a girl and kiss a girl
- Yeah
1302
01:15:03,889 --> 01:15:05,289
and what happens then?
1303
01:15:05,290 --> 01:15:08,377
- Well the girls are all screaming
- Yeah
1304
01:15:08,947 --> 01:15:12,582
and then we catch
them we kiss them
1305
01:15:12,583 --> 01:15:15,327
We're interested in
contrast with you and Neil
1306
01:15:15,328 --> 01:15:20,605
were you aware of differences
in home background at the time?
1307
01:15:20,606 --> 01:15:24,739
Oh sure yeah, I mean both Neil's
parents are teachers as you know
1308
01:15:25,439 --> 01:15:28,107
that's got to be a hell of
a difference for a start
1309
01:15:28,461 --> 01:15:31,552
I mean, I'm not knocking them
for a minute, they're very nice people
1310
01:15:31,743 --> 01:15:33,009
but eh...
1311
01:15:33,010 --> 01:15:37,987
there's obviously going to be some sort
of academic type atmosphere in the house
1312
01:15:39,066 --> 01:15:42,427
which I did notice
one or two times
1313
01:15:43,420 --> 01:15:44,924
but I think Neil
1314
01:15:45,221 --> 01:15:49,605
whether by design or just
by the situation he was in
1315
01:15:49,606 --> 01:15:52,023
was obviously going to
be under more pressure
1316
01:15:52,684 --> 01:15:57,835
I came to London and I
contacted an agency for squatters
1317
01:15:58,562 --> 01:16:02,642
and they were able to give
me the address of somebody
1318
01:16:02,643 --> 01:16:07,374
who was able to help people who were
looking for accommodation in the London area
1319
01:16:08,083 --> 01:16:10,952
and by a process of
chasing people around
1320
01:16:10,953 --> 01:16:14,113
I eventually managed to
find this place here
1321
01:16:14,950 --> 01:16:20,806
I wouldn't squat in a place which
I knew to be owned by somebody else
1322
01:16:20,807 --> 01:16:24,816
I wouldn't, certainly because
I knew if I had a place of my own
1323
01:16:24,817 --> 01:16:27,167
and found somebody
squatting in it I'd be disgusted
1324
01:16:27,168 --> 01:16:29,435
But this place
was empty
1325
01:16:29,709 --> 01:16:33,485
and I was simply offered a place to
live here and was very grateful for it
1326
01:16:33,747 --> 01:16:36,755
and I think in
questions of squatting
1327
01:16:37,037 --> 01:16:43,020
a bit of humanity is more important that
vain rules about who can live where
1328
01:16:50,969 --> 01:16:53,711
In contrast, Peter lives
in a flat in North London
1329
01:16:53,712 --> 01:16:55,417
sharing with three
other students
1330
01:16:55,418 --> 01:16:58,257
there have been three
guys living here originally
1331
01:16:58,397 --> 01:17:00,045
and one of them left
1332
01:17:00,285 --> 01:17:03,197
to get engaged,
virtually married
1333
01:17:03,515 --> 01:17:06,984
and the flat was meant
for four in the first place
1334
01:17:07,461 --> 01:17:10,461
so Dave and Trev asked Ian
and I if we'd like to move in
1335
01:17:10,462 --> 01:17:13,608
because we did 'cause we'd been
searching for a flat for some months
1336
01:17:14,217 --> 01:17:16,579
so we jumped at the
opportunity really
1337
01:17:18,443 --> 01:17:21,627
I've got my own room, I
can cook whenever I like
1338
01:17:22,372 --> 01:17:25,257
I haven't got a landlady to
tell me what time to come in
1339
01:17:25,258 --> 01:17:27,204
I've got my own front door key
1340
01:17:29,609 --> 01:17:32,748
and to tell the truth it's a lot better
than a lot of the accommodation I've had
1341
01:17:32,749 --> 01:17:35,583
over the last eighteen
months or so
1342
01:17:35,584 --> 01:17:37,845
it could be a bit warmer,
it's a bit chilly
1343
01:17:38,589 --> 01:17:40,220
but eh...
1344
01:17:41,623 --> 01:17:44,605
it's perfectly satisfactory
for the time being
1345
01:17:58,591 --> 01:18:00,767
These are obvious
restrictions, y'know
1346
01:18:00,768 --> 01:18:02,475
not able to cook for yourself
1347
01:18:02,476 --> 01:18:04,291
you've got to think
for yourself a lot more
1348
01:18:04,292 --> 01:18:06,429
but it's eh...
1349
01:18:07,093 --> 01:18:10,532
certainly not as exhausting or
wearing as I thought it would be
1350
01:18:10,533 --> 01:18:11,901
I mean, y'know...
1351
01:18:11,902 --> 01:18:14,314
coming up myself is a
challenge of some sort
1352
01:18:14,315 --> 01:18:17,370
we're going to have to split
two sausages into three now
1353
01:18:17,371 --> 01:18:22,553
Well once Caroline Tetford
said she loved me
1354
01:18:24,882 --> 01:18:28,708
and I'm going to marry
her when I grow up
1355
01:18:28,998 --> 01:18:33,082
I hate her, she's always getting
bad tempered and cross with me
1356
01:18:33,083 --> 01:18:33,988
- Does she?
- Yeah
1357
01:18:33,989 --> 01:18:37,044
She says "Neil Hughes, move
your desk forward"
1358
01:18:37,045 --> 01:18:40,742
and when I put it back she says
"Neil Hughes put your chair forward"
1359
01:18:40,743 --> 01:18:44,347
and she just gets into a
girly mood with me like that
1360
01:18:44,348 --> 01:18:48,942
Tell me about the period in your life when
you went to university and what happened
1361
01:18:48,943 --> 01:18:50,211
It was a very short period
1362
01:18:50,212 --> 01:18:51,151
I was only at university...
1363
01:18:51,152 --> 01:18:55,639
well I was only taking university seriously
for a matter of two or three months
1364
01:18:57,395 --> 01:19:01,509
maybe I went to the wrong university
or maybe university life didn't suit me
1365
01:19:01,890 --> 01:19:02,930
either way
1366
01:19:03,479 --> 01:19:06,619
I felt a very great need
to get out of the system
1367
01:19:08,223 --> 01:19:11,948
Well this is my final year so
I'm not in college that much
1368
01:19:11,949 --> 01:19:13,319
I don't have to be
1369
01:19:13,515 --> 01:19:16,427
so what I'm expected
to do is to be ...
1370
01:19:16,695 --> 01:19:19,822
laying out revision
timetables at home and..
1371
01:19:19,823 --> 01:19:21,252
working like a slave
1372
01:19:21,503 --> 01:19:24,197
which I'm not at the
moment, but I will be soon
1373
01:19:24,198 --> 01:19:26,688
I did make an
application to Oxford
1374
01:19:26,689 --> 01:19:28,006
but I didn't get in
1375
01:19:28,007 --> 01:19:28,991
and eh
1376
01:19:28,992 --> 01:19:31,661
well I think that's in the
past now and that's...
1377
01:19:31,662 --> 01:19:34,802
I don't know whether I would've
been any happier at Oxford
1378
01:19:36,535 --> 01:19:38,749
it always had been a
dream to get into Oxford
1379
01:19:38,750 --> 01:19:40,875
I think being as people
had encouraged me
1380
01:19:40,876 --> 01:19:44,216
because I knew famous
people having been to Oxford
1381
01:19:45,240 --> 01:19:47,901
I'd read memoirs written
by famous people
1382
01:19:47,902 --> 01:19:52,535
things such as Brideshead's Revisited
which was a great favourite
1383
01:19:54,147 --> 01:19:56,265
but these I suppose are
1384
01:19:56,743 --> 01:20:01,041
well they were dreams which
I had while I was at school and
1385
01:20:01,789 --> 01:20:04,787
I have to just get over the
fact that I didn't get into Oxford
1386
01:20:05,123 --> 01:20:07,459
probably because I didn't
approach the thing in the right way
1387
01:20:09,082 --> 01:20:10,492
Are you bitter about it?
1388
01:20:10,493 --> 01:20:12,933
I was very bitter at the time
1389
01:20:12,934 --> 01:20:16,238
maybe I still am but
I try to get over it
1390
01:20:16,635 --> 01:20:20,955
I think once I can get myself
going I can work solid, yeah
1391
01:20:22,005 --> 01:20:23,519
but it's the motive
1392
01:20:23,520 --> 01:20:26,912
which is very hard to acquire when
you're in the flat most of the time
1393
01:20:28,637 --> 01:20:32,068
it's hard to sort of look ahead to
next June and think of those exams
1394
01:20:32,955 --> 01:20:36,256
but I dare say I'll do it, get the
average type degree and...
1395
01:20:36,257 --> 01:20:37,929
I'm not worried
1396
01:20:38,619 --> 01:20:43,023
Is it a problem to you
motivating yourself generally?
1397
01:20:43,024 --> 01:20:44,697
Yeah it can be
1398
01:20:44,698 --> 01:20:48,052
I can look back on the day
and think "how I wasted that"
1399
01:20:48,439 --> 01:20:50,742
although I must've
enjoyed it at the time
1400
01:20:50,743 --> 01:20:54,055
What sort of influence did
your parents have on you?
1401
01:20:54,649 --> 01:20:57,689
Well they made me believe
in god from the start
1402
01:20:57,690 --> 01:21:00,279
which I certainly wouldn't
1403
01:21:00,280 --> 01:21:03,306
or I don't know even now
whether I believe in god or not
1404
01:21:03,307 --> 01:21:05,877
I've thought an awful
lot about it actually and
1405
01:21:05,878 --> 01:21:07,436
I still don't know
1406
01:21:07,725 --> 01:21:09,497
but still this was the
absolutely certain one
1407
01:21:09,498 --> 01:21:12,510
if one was to survive in the
world one had to believe in god
1408
01:21:12,511 --> 01:21:14,433
this was something
which was taught to me
1409
01:21:16,119 --> 01:21:19,153
always think of other
people first before yourself
1410
01:21:19,154 --> 01:21:22,313
to a ridiculous neurotic degree
1411
01:21:22,314 --> 01:21:24,397
which I think affected me
1412
01:21:26,557 --> 01:21:27,967
What do you mean by that?
1413
01:21:28,299 --> 01:21:31,722
Well this I suppose
is basic christianity
1414
01:21:32,385 --> 01:21:33,569
it's sort of...
1415
01:21:34,859 --> 01:21:38,126
if somebody slaps you on one cheek
let them do it on the other
1416
01:21:38,127 --> 01:21:40,824
almost literally taken
1417
01:21:41,786 --> 01:21:45,210
which gave me a few shocks
when I tried to put it into practise
1418
01:21:46,416 --> 01:21:48,282
- In what way?
- I don't think to be honest
1419
01:21:48,283 --> 01:21:50,366
to go back to that
question I don't think
1420
01:21:50,367 --> 01:21:54,304
I was really taught any sort of
policy of living at all by my parents
1421
01:21:54,305 --> 01:21:56,208
this was probably
their biggest mistake
1422
01:21:56,209 --> 01:21:58,296
that I was just left
to fend for myself
1423
01:21:58,297 --> 01:22:01,223
in a world which they seemed
completely oblivious of
1424
01:22:01,530 --> 01:22:06,115
and I found even when I tried to discuss
problems which were facing me in school
1425
01:22:06,662 --> 01:22:09,957
my parents didn't seem to be
aware of the nature of the problem
1426
01:22:09,958 --> 01:22:11,708
Were they ambitious for you?
1427
01:22:13,793 --> 01:22:16,714
Yeah but along set lines
which they had planned
1428
01:22:16,715 --> 01:22:19,208
I think they have often
said to me that they
1429
01:22:19,209 --> 01:22:22,926
they had seen me even from when I was
very young in a certain type of career
1430
01:22:22,927 --> 01:22:28,834
and possibly they'd never even thought
that anything else was vaguely possible
1431
01:22:29,277 --> 01:22:31,948
they probably imagined I would be
1432
01:22:31,949 --> 01:22:34,817
maybe a university lecturer or
1433
01:22:35,996 --> 01:22:38,716
a bank manager or
something like this
1434
01:22:39,613 --> 01:22:41,967
some kind of indoor work
1435
01:22:41,968 --> 01:22:46,120
which involved writing and
reading and this sort of thing
1436
01:22:46,414 --> 01:22:49,262
because they didn't take account
of the other side of my personality
1437
01:22:50,698 --> 01:22:52,058
but
1438
01:22:56,954 --> 01:23:01,715
I wonder how many parents really think
of their children as individual human beings
1439
01:23:03,340 --> 01:23:06,526
What are your feelings about
them now? Your parents
1440
01:23:08,028 --> 01:23:10,504
I'm glad they're there because
if I ever become homeless again
1441
01:23:10,505 --> 01:23:12,174
I will be able to go
back and live with them
1442
01:23:12,175 --> 01:23:13,962
they wouldn't object to this
1443
01:23:16,558 --> 01:23:20,094
I'm capable of getting on with
my parents perfectly well
1444
01:23:20,095 --> 01:23:28,446
If they are willing to let me live
as another adult in their house
1445
01:23:28,447 --> 01:23:31,492
and appreciate that I'm
living my own way of life
1446
01:23:31,493 --> 01:23:35,070
and that I am living there because I
can't think of anything else to do with myself
1447
01:23:38,191 --> 01:23:40,933
What do they think of
what you're doing now?
1448
01:23:42,462 --> 01:23:45,800
They accept it, I think now they
do accept that I'm the person I am
1449
01:23:47,531 --> 01:23:55,396
they see this as simply my attempting
to add more experience to my life
1450
01:23:55,397 --> 01:23:58,208
which satisfies me
1451
01:23:58,209 --> 01:23:59,886
Are they worried about you?
1452
01:24:01,213 --> 01:24:02,936
Probably yes
1453
01:24:06,770 --> 01:24:11,604
but no more worried now than they
were when I first left for university
1454
01:24:11,605 --> 01:24:14,271
that was probably the time at
which they were most worried
1455
01:24:15,731 --> 01:24:19,754
and we have in fact managed to
discuss a lot of personal things
1456
01:24:21,300 --> 01:24:23,972
which I felt at one time I'd
never be able to discuss
1457
01:24:25,032 --> 01:24:26,869
and therefore, as I say
1458
01:24:26,870 --> 01:24:30,124
it is possible for me to live for a
few weeks even a month or so at home
1459
01:24:30,693 --> 01:24:34,372
without there being
to much friction
1460
01:24:35,838 --> 01:24:39,428
So are you under
pressure to get a job
1461
01:24:39,429 --> 01:24:42,256
to think of what you're going
to do when you leave in June
1462
01:24:42,766 --> 01:24:45,972
Yeah I suspect I am from my
parents, they keep dropping hints
1463
01:24:46,370 --> 01:24:48,802
which is only fair I can
understand their feelings
1464
01:24:49,041 --> 01:24:50,516
obviously I've
got to get a job
1465
01:24:50,517 --> 01:24:53,083
I don't want to laze around on
the dole for months and months
1466
01:24:53,084 --> 01:24:54,682
you'd go mad
1467
01:24:55,806 --> 01:24:59,694
I just can't see what I'll be
doing in nine, ten months time though
1468
01:25:00,640 --> 01:25:03,112
Does that depress you
or does that excite you?
1469
01:25:03,415 --> 01:25:05,558
No it certainly
doesn't depress me
1470
01:25:06,667 --> 01:25:08,921
perhaps it does excite
me in a way yes
1471
01:25:09,973 --> 01:25:13,314
something will turn up, something
of that nature y'know
1472
01:25:13,747 --> 01:25:17,988
but obviously you've got to think
realistically about doing something
1473
01:25:19,578 --> 01:25:22,790
I mean I might be living in
cloud cuckoo land y'know
1474
01:25:24,297 --> 01:25:27,624
my mum and dad
might say "no son"
1475
01:25:27,625 --> 01:25:29,534
"you don't get a job you like"
1476
01:25:30,420 --> 01:25:31,780
I'd like to think I could
1477
01:25:31,781 --> 01:25:34,636
Well, we pretend we've got swords
1478
01:25:35,152 --> 01:25:37,872
we make the noises of
the swords fighting
1479
01:25:37,873 --> 01:25:40,165
and when somebody stabs
us we go "Arrrrrgghhh!"
1480
01:25:40,866 --> 01:25:44,847
What goes through your mind
when you saw those two films
1481
01:25:44,848 --> 01:25:48,472
when you were at
seven, bright and perky?
1482
01:25:48,876 --> 01:25:53,164
I find it hard to believe that I was ever
like that but there's the evidence
1483
01:25:53,165 --> 01:25:54,812
I wonder why I was like that
1484
01:25:54,813 --> 01:25:58,330
I wonder what it was inside
me that made me like that
1485
01:26:00,256 --> 01:26:03,759
and I can see even at fourteen and
I was beginning to get more subdued
1486
01:26:03,760 --> 01:26:06,194
and I was putting a lot more
thought into what I was saying
1487
01:26:06,195 --> 01:26:08,473
too a ridiculous degree
1488
01:26:11,036 --> 01:26:14,583
and probably when I was
seven I just..... I don't know
1489
01:26:14,584 --> 01:26:18,400
I lived in a wonderful world where
everything was sensation dumb
1490
01:26:18,401 --> 01:26:20,772
I could be happy like this I could
be miserable the next minute
1491
01:26:20,773 --> 01:26:22,618
and I didn't have
to plan for the future
1492
01:26:22,619 --> 01:26:25,790
I didn't have to worry about
having friends and all this money
1493
01:26:25,791 --> 01:26:28,440
because everything was
so mapped out for me
1494
01:26:29,864 --> 01:26:34,016
I don't know what sort of stumbling
blocks should be put in a child's way
1495
01:26:34,541 --> 01:26:38,087
to get him used to living
in the outside world
1496
01:26:39,046 --> 01:26:42,738
because I think maybe this is something
that was wrong in my upbringing
1497
01:26:42,739 --> 01:26:47,074
I didn't have enough obstacles to
get over, to toughen myself up against
1498
01:26:48,188 --> 01:26:50,633
I was unprepared for
things as they were
1499
01:26:50,634 --> 01:26:54,974
but looking back now I couldn't
think of what might have been done
1500
01:26:54,975 --> 01:26:59,032
and I certainly wouldn't start
writing educational theory about this
1501
01:26:59,033 --> 01:27:00,850
because I know how
personal a thing it is
1502
01:27:00,851 --> 01:27:03,486
and it probably wouldn't
work in anybody else's case
1503
01:27:04,712 --> 01:27:06,264
Would you like to
be seven again?
1504
01:27:07,664 --> 01:27:10,574
No because I'd know that I
had to be twenty-one again
1505
01:27:10,575 --> 01:27:12,638
I moved up to a
comprehensive school
1506
01:27:13,281 --> 01:27:15,263
I found it much
bigger of course
1507
01:27:15,264 --> 01:27:17,667
I found it hard to
settle into at first
1508
01:27:17,668 --> 01:27:21,348
but now I've been here a few
years I know my way around
1509
01:27:21,349 --> 01:27:24,002
I think it's a very good
idea to have competition
1510
01:27:24,003 --> 01:27:27,113
otherwise you might start
to relax and not try hard enough
1511
01:27:28,310 --> 01:27:33,638
Yes at that age I was very
conscious of having to struggle
1512
01:27:33,639 --> 01:27:36,056
because I suppose of what
parents and teachers were saying
1513
01:27:36,057 --> 01:27:36,984
they were saying
1514
01:27:36,985 --> 01:27:41,246
they said "you've got a brain you
must put all your effort into school work"
1515
01:27:44,089 --> 01:27:45,824
well what else could
they have said?
1516
01:27:45,825 --> 01:27:48,466
I would've probably been
just as angry, looking back
1517
01:27:48,467 --> 01:27:52,192
if they'd never encouraged
my intellectual efforts at all
1518
01:27:52,193 --> 01:27:55,494
When I get married I don't
want to have any children
1519
01:27:56,324 --> 01:27:57,396
because
1520
01:27:57,397 --> 01:28:00,174
they are always
doing naughty things
1521
01:28:00,175 --> 01:28:03,074
and making the
whole house untidy
1522
01:28:03,075 --> 01:28:05,935
Do you have any
great ambition, any dream?
1523
01:28:09,584 --> 01:28:11,010
I suppose I...
1524
01:28:11,304 --> 01:28:12,612
yes well...
1525
01:28:12,613 --> 01:28:17,212
I would like to be someone in a position
of importance and I've always thought this
1526
01:28:17,822 --> 01:28:21,642
but I don't think I'm the right sort of person
to carry the responsibility for whatever it is
1527
01:28:21,643 --> 01:28:24,171
I've always thought
well I'd love to be
1528
01:28:25,186 --> 01:28:28,052
possibly even love
to be in politics
1529
01:28:28,496 --> 01:28:29,764
Something like this
1530
01:28:29,765 --> 01:28:30,866
but eh...
1531
01:28:31,461 --> 01:28:36,992
I suppose that I'd probably find just as
tedious as all the other jobs I've done so...
1532
01:28:37,804 --> 01:28:40,348
What do you want out of life?
1533
01:28:45,227 --> 01:28:48,545
The satisfaction of knowing
1534
01:28:48,778 --> 01:28:52,807
that I've left some sort of imprint
1535
01:28:52,808 --> 01:28:55,609
rather than just
lived out my life
1536
01:28:56,963 --> 01:28:58,755
I don't know....
1537
01:28:59,387 --> 01:29:03,438
it's going to sound like an epitaph
I've left in memory of some people y'know
1538
01:29:04,651 --> 01:29:10,023
not that this guy worked, made a fair
bit of money, good house, died
1539
01:29:10,959 --> 01:29:13,455
I'd like to have done
something but...
1540
01:29:13,456 --> 01:29:16,357
then again it must be a
drop in the ocean I suppose
1541
01:29:16,358 --> 01:29:18,993
I mean who is going to remember
me in a hundred years time?
1542
01:29:19,030 --> 01:29:22,588
So is it that important,
how you live out your life?
1543
01:29:22,809 --> 01:29:25,946
but I would like to think
I'm going to do something with it
1544
01:29:25,947 --> 01:29:27,987
something positive
1545
01:29:27,988 --> 01:29:30,292
Do you and Peter have
the same values?
1546
01:29:30,293 --> 01:29:33,683
I think we both value
happiness and stability
1547
01:29:33,684 --> 01:29:35,483
I think most people do
1548
01:29:38,429 --> 01:29:41,003
But you've kicked against
the stability that's..
1549
01:29:41,838 --> 01:29:45,935
I don't think I ever had any
stability, to be quite honest
1550
01:29:46,837 --> 01:29:49,627
I can't think of any time
in my life when I ever did
1551
01:29:49,628 --> 01:29:51,813
I don't think I've been
kicking against anything
1552
01:29:51,814 --> 01:29:54,931
I think I've been kicking in
mid-air the whole of my life
1553
01:30:09,516 --> 01:30:11,091
It's only one more
1554
01:30:20,480 --> 01:30:22,982
What do they think
about each other?
1555
01:30:22,983 --> 01:30:24,821
and how would they act together?
1556
01:30:25,327 --> 01:30:29,587
to find out we invited them
all to one big party and joined in
1557
01:30:29,963 --> 01:30:32,493
#If I say that I love you#
1558
01:30:32,494 --> 01:30:34,939
#and you know it's true#
1559
01:30:34,940 --> 01:30:37,545
#if you said that you'd leave me#
1560
01:30:37,546 --> 01:30:40,651
#what would I do?#
1561
01:30:41,325 --> 01:30:45,869
#I'll let you back if you let me#
1562
01:30:45,870 --> 01:30:51,025
#I'll change your mind......#
1563
01:30:53,235 --> 01:30:56,755
Yes but they were a bit
too tough for my liking
1564
01:30:56,756 --> 01:31:00,965
so they hit me right in the back
and I've still got a pain there
1565
01:31:00,966 --> 01:31:05,017
The posh ones,
"Oh yes, oh yes, oh yes!"
1566
01:31:05,593 --> 01:31:07,737
they're nuts
1567
01:31:07,738 --> 01:31:10,571
you just have to touch them
1568
01:31:10,572 --> 01:31:14,130
Well some of them
were rather dirty
1569
01:31:15,439 --> 01:31:19,295
- What do you think about them?
- I played with them quite naturally
1570
01:31:19,296 --> 01:31:21,745
I think they were
rather nice really
1571
01:31:21,746 --> 01:31:24,149
What do you think
about rich people?
1572
01:31:24,150 --> 01:31:27,963
Well... not much
1573
01:31:28,767 --> 01:31:29,730
Tell me about them
1574
01:31:29,731 --> 01:31:33,903
Well they think they can do
everything without you doing it as well
1575
01:31:33,904 --> 01:31:41,933
and they think just because they're rich
they have to have people to do all their work
1576
01:31:41,934 --> 01:31:46,631
What would you do if you had
lots of money, about two pounds?
1577
01:31:46,632 --> 01:31:49,668
Me? I would help the poor
1578
01:31:49,669 --> 01:31:50,863
What for?
1579
01:31:50,864 --> 01:31:55,489
The poor, if you don't help
them they die soon wouldn't they
1580
01:31:55,490 --> 01:32:01,363
and every time we have a harvest
festival we send food to them
1581
01:32:01,364 --> 01:32:02,977
and once these two.....no
1582
01:32:04,103 --> 01:32:08,151
Susan and Janet Simpson went
round giving it out with Mr Floyd
1583
01:32:08,525 --> 01:32:11,022
- I don't think much of the accents
- Neither do I
1584
01:32:11,023 --> 01:32:12,699
Neither do I
1585
01:32:12,870 --> 01:32:15,422
it won't prevent
me liking them
1586
01:32:15,423 --> 01:32:16,596
Don't you ever
think to yourself -
1587
01:32:16,597 --> 01:32:18,702
Jump out of that suit,
come to the Eastend
1588
01:32:18,703 --> 01:32:21,463
throw the books in the corner
and do what you have to do
1589
01:32:21,464 --> 01:32:24,001
- I'd certainly throw the books in the corner
- Do you understand what I'm trying to say?
1590
01:32:24,002 --> 01:32:24,651
Yeah
1591
01:32:24,652 --> 01:32:27,863
- What are you going to do in life?
- I've really no idea
1592
01:32:28,063 --> 01:32:33,232
The idea of just living somewhere and
working for a living is just horrifying really
1593
01:32:33,233 --> 01:32:35,807
I mean, being a
student is very easy
1594
01:32:35,808 --> 01:32:38,693
I just postponed the decision
by going to university
1595
01:32:38,694 --> 01:32:41,556
I wouldn't say being a student's
easy, that's why I left school
1596
01:32:41,996 --> 01:32:44,296
- It was too hard
- Really
1597
01:32:44,297 --> 01:32:46,829
Who is to say what a
seven year old child is?
1598
01:32:47,971 --> 01:32:52,025
I don't think there's anyway you can do it so a
seven year old child could seem to be one thing
1599
01:32:52,026 --> 01:32:57,447
and you could always argue that the end
product was produced by what he actually was
1600
01:32:57,448 --> 01:32:59,523
rather than what
he seemed to be
1601
01:32:59,524 --> 01:33:02,779
- you'd normally use the total....
- Not a bookmaker but a....
1602
01:33:02,780 --> 01:33:05,331
- I'm always frightened they'd clear off
- What?
1603
01:33:05,332 --> 01:33:07,985
I'm always frightened they'd clear
off if they had a bad afternoon
1604
01:33:07,986 --> 01:33:10,113
No they're not like that,
they can always get hold of money
1605
01:33:10,114 --> 01:33:12,949
What fears do you
have for the future?
1606
01:33:12,950 --> 01:33:15,517
Well certainly the idea of,
as I was saying before
1607
01:33:15,518 --> 01:33:19,441
getting into a job and simply
getting stuck in it and that's it
1608
01:33:19,442 --> 01:33:22,195
without knowing
why you're doing it
1609
01:33:22,451 --> 01:33:27,517
but I would think now that this is the time
where I would think about something like that
1610
01:33:27,518 --> 01:33:29,077
and make sure
it doesn't happen
1611
01:33:29,078 --> 01:33:32,127
I really don't see how
one's life can be a failure
1612
01:33:32,128 --> 01:33:33,227
in that....
1613
01:33:33,228 --> 01:33:36,961
if I became a journalist
and got sacked at thirty
1614
01:33:36,962 --> 01:33:40,289
probably because I had grown out of it or I
had changed so I was no longer suitable
1615
01:33:40,290 --> 01:33:46,080
therefore I'd find something
else which I enjoyed
1616
01:33:46,081 --> 01:33:47,763
and which my talents
were suited to
1617
01:33:47,764 --> 01:33:51,573
No I have never suffered at all
1618
01:33:52,297 --> 01:33:58,439
never been driven to
despair or tears or....
1619
01:34:01,113 --> 01:34:03,053
I don't know, have
any of the others?
1620
01:34:03,054 --> 01:34:06,254
My strength is being
able to keep going really
1621
01:34:06,255 --> 01:34:10,517
and my weakness is not being able
to take any positive course of action
1622
01:34:10,908 --> 01:34:15,516
I suppose I tend to behave in the
fashion of the people that I'm with
1623
01:34:16,253 --> 01:34:19,667
in some circumstances I think that
can be quite a weakness sometimes
1624
01:34:19,668 --> 01:34:21,775
sometimes wish I didn't
1625
01:34:22,423 --> 01:34:27,974
occasionally look at myself and think "christ
you're a bloody fool, what are you doing now?"
1626
01:34:29,278 --> 01:34:31,299
and that sometimes disturbs me
1627
01:34:31,300 --> 01:34:33,579
We had a teacher at school
1628
01:34:33,580 --> 01:34:37,059
that his favourite ploy was....
1629
01:34:37,060 --> 01:34:41,106
"All you girls want to do is walk
out, get married, have babies
1630
01:34:41,107 --> 01:34:44,873
and push a pram down the road with a
cigarette hanging out the side of your mouth"
1631
01:34:46,220 --> 01:34:50,005
god if there was ever a sentence
I'd resent it would be that one - yeah
1632
01:34:50,006 --> 01:34:53,090
There's only one ambition
really I want a baby son
1633
01:34:53,091 --> 01:34:55,970
if I see my baby son that'll
be my ambition fulfilled
1634
01:34:55,971 --> 01:34:58,501
no one knows that,
only you now!
1635
01:34:58,502 --> 01:35:02,589
Well to me it is a dream
to be totally happy
1636
01:35:02,590 --> 01:35:05,527
I mean, I don't think
you can expect that but...
1637
01:35:07,995 --> 01:35:13,203
What happens if you don't make that?
If you don't ever find it? How will you cope?
1638
01:35:13,204 --> 01:35:16,405
I don't know, it
would be hard to say
1639
01:35:17,155 --> 01:35:21,343
the human minds very strong
and it can be very weak
1640
01:35:21,745 --> 01:35:25,369
and so you could crack up
from it and you could just
1641
01:35:25,705 --> 01:35:30,937
live your life out from day to day
and you could get over it I think
1642
01:35:30,938 --> 01:35:34,907
well not get over it but you'd
sort of cope with it I think
1643
01:35:35,338 --> 01:35:37,961
but what I'd do
I just don't know
1644
01:35:40,731 --> 01:35:44,171
I mean I want to be happy and
my dreams are all for happiness
1645
01:35:45,666 --> 01:35:47,855
but basically that's what
I want out of life
1646
01:35:47,856 --> 01:35:52,303
I always leave something inside
me, I always leave a bit behind
1647
01:35:52,765 --> 01:35:56,163
I always hold back a
bit with everything I do
1648
01:35:59,549 --> 01:36:03,097
just to sort of....something
to fall back on
1649
01:36:03,098 --> 01:36:07,260
I've always got something else to look
on if anything goes wrong anywhere
1650
01:36:08,535 --> 01:36:11,920
What is that something
you hold back?
1651
01:36:11,921 --> 01:36:14,319
I think it's a part
of my heart
1652
01:36:14,320 --> 01:36:16,843
What do you want
most out of life?
1653
01:36:18,015 --> 01:36:21,647
To be happy and
get on with life
1654
01:36:21,648 --> 01:36:26,170
you don't want to just sit
back and let it always pass
1655
01:36:27,729 --> 01:36:29,690
you could be run over
by a bus tomorrow
1656
01:36:29,691 --> 01:36:31,710
so you've got to make the
most of it while you've got it
1657
01:36:31,711 --> 01:36:35,219
Simply to be able to wake
up in the morning and feel that
1658
01:36:35,681 --> 01:36:38,109
this day was going
to be worthwhile
1659
01:36:40,470 --> 01:36:43,467
which is what I don't
feel at the moment
1660
01:36:56,245 --> 01:36:59,337
At the end of their very
special day in London
1661
01:36:59,338 --> 01:37:02,059
after their trip to
the zoo and the party
1662
01:37:02,597 --> 01:37:05,645
we took our children to
an adventure playground
1663
01:37:05,646 --> 01:37:07,914
where they could do
just what they liked
1664
01:37:10,250 --> 01:37:14,315
those from a children's home
set about building a house
1665
01:37:14,316 --> 01:37:18,659
The houses in Australia, the average
sort of living there will do me fine
1666
01:37:18,660 --> 01:37:19,956
I mean it's terrific
1667
01:37:19,957 --> 01:37:23,124
I often say I'm saving to
settle down with Yvonne
1668
01:37:24,027 --> 01:37:27,665
and then I think to myself "nah
I might buy a car instead"
1669
01:37:34,643 --> 01:37:36,267
There's Nicholas
1670
01:37:36,268 --> 01:37:39,367
You have to run fast
to stay where you are
1671
01:37:39,368 --> 01:37:42,667
to go forward you have to run very
fast indeed, or whatever the quote is
1672
01:37:44,219 --> 01:37:48,187
so I'll probably feel I'm
actually achieving nothing
1673
01:37:49,519 --> 01:37:51,097
and Tony
1674
01:37:54,015 --> 01:37:57,417
I don't want to change
because if I change
1675
01:37:57,418 --> 01:38:00,698
it proves the other Tony
Walker was all fake
1676
01:38:02,549 --> 01:38:03,610
Andrew
1677
01:38:04,169 --> 01:38:09,068
After I've qualified as a
Solicitor I'll have to rethink
1678
01:38:09,911 --> 01:38:12,343
I don't know at all what
will happen after that
1679
01:38:12,344 --> 01:38:13,733
and Bruce
1680
01:38:16,879 --> 01:38:20,737
It all springs from.....
1681
01:38:21,207 --> 01:38:24,295
loving god and christ I suppose
1682
01:38:24,953 --> 01:38:29,305
you try and do that as best as possible
and that leads your actions in life
1683
01:38:31,397 --> 01:38:32,762
John
1684
01:38:32,785 --> 01:38:37,226
I'd quite like to go into politics but
that's easier said than done
1685
01:38:39,867 --> 01:38:41,033
Susie
1686
01:38:42,020 --> 01:38:44,909
When you're a child you always think
how nice it would be to be grown up
1687
01:38:44,910 --> 01:38:47,035
and independent and things
1688
01:38:47,036 --> 01:38:50,536
but there are times when
I wish I was three again
1689
01:38:50,537 --> 01:38:53,139
Jackie and her friends
1690
01:38:58,721 --> 01:39:01,387
give me a child
until he is seven
1691
01:39:01,438 --> 01:39:04,131
and I will give you the man
1692
01:39:12,496 --> 01:39:16,178
this has been a glimpse
of Britain's future
144067
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