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Today we're watching Argentina and Spain
in the World Cup final.
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00:00:13,420 --> 00:00:16,920
We're in Las Vegas, Nevada at the Mirage
Mega Mansion.
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00:00:17,300 --> 00:00:19,960
This is a winnable World Cup watch
weekend.
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00:00:20,380 --> 00:00:25,280
The winnable is essentially only fans
for the sports betting creator economy.
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00:00:25,680 --> 00:00:29,820
The guys in this house have made
millions of dollars on prediction
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00:00:29,820 --> 00:00:33,320
markets, probably eight figures just
over the course of the World Cup.
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00:00:33,840 --> 00:00:35,240
I like betting on Calci.
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00:00:35,480 --> 00:00:36,500
Training on Pauly Market.
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00:00:36,880 --> 00:00:38,180
Beginning of the World Cup.
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00:00:38,810 --> 00:00:42,210
You get to pick who you think is going
to win the whole World Cup.
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00:00:42,830 --> 00:00:48,350
So before I started, I put $5,000 on
Spain to win the whole thing.
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00:00:51,750 --> 00:00:55,350
So I put Spain to win.
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00:00:55,710 --> 00:00:59,590
When you wake up, you got to put on your
lucky underwear, take a deep breath, say
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00:00:59,590 --> 00:01:00,590
a prayer.
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00:01:01,310 --> 00:01:03,530
I think prediction markers are low-key
taking over the world.
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00:01:07,590 --> 00:01:12,010
Welcome to day four of flipping 1K into
10 grand on Polymarket. Now to an
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00:01:12,010 --> 00:01:14,870
industry skyrocketing in popularity,
Prediction Market.
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00:01:15,090 --> 00:01:16,190
What are you guys talking about?
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00:01:16,430 --> 00:01:20,030
Prediction Market app, dude. You know,
online peer-to-peer betting. $100 on
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00:01:20,030 --> 00:01:20,809
Kane to school.
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00:01:20,810 --> 00:01:26,770
Done. 10K on Jake Hall makes you
$90,000?
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There are two major players, Kaoshi and
Polymarket.
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They just really, really don't like each
other. Kaoshi has just posted its
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most... lucrative market ever who will
win the finals of the world cup it is
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shocking the extent to which prediction
markets have proliferated thanks to
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prediction markets you can now bet on
basically anything and i mean anything
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from taylor swift's wedding date to the
chances of an iran nuclear deal we're
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gambling on war the longtime
teleprompter operator for the president
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he's on leave now for alleged insider
trading the long-term vision is to
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financialize everything.
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This is my life. Me, just like
refreshing, refreshing, refreshing. This
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is the hyper-financialization or
hyper-gamification of our entire lives.
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The whole world, unfortunately, has
become somewhat of a casino.
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I've been writing about the prediction
markets for almost 25 years now.
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The first real prediction market that we
know of was started at the University of
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Iowa in the late 1980s. They started
with a really obvious one, how likely
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a candidate was to win a presidential
election.
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You would buy a contract in Michael
Dukakis if you thought Dukakis was going
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to win.
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00:03:03,160 --> 00:03:08,620
that market proved to be exceptionally
good, really better than almost all
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polls. And by doing so, they create this
really powerful kind of collective
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forecasting machine that taps into what
I call the wisdom of crowds.
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The basic idea of the wisdom of crowds
is that under the right conditions,
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groups of people can be remarkably
intelligent.
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So... If you can figure out ways to tap
into that wisdom of crowds, then you can
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actually create tools that will solve
problems. And even in some
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circumstances, and this would be where
prediction markets come in, forecast the
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future. This is how it works.
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Every prediction market starts with a
question.
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Let's say, will the US government
acknowledge the existence of aliens by
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2029? And that is a real market in
Kaoshi right now. So there are two
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options, yes or no.
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In a prediction market, there are always
two people trading against each other.
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So for you to make this trade, you would
buy shares of yes at 25% odds.
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Another person would have to take the
other side of that trade at 75%. The
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price in the market is always changing.
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And that reflects the changing opinions
of the people in the crowd.
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And you can cash out your bet at any
point.
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When the outcome is known, the winner
gets 100% of the payout and the loser
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gets nothing.
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Cauchy and Polymarket, they make money
by taking a transaction fee. The more
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people that bet, the more money they
make.
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You've got all of this enthusiasm over
World Cup and a betting bonanza. And
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Kalshi did more than $5 billion in
trading volume this week. Joining us,
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Tarek Mansour is a CEO and co-founder at
Kalshi. When he left MIT, he joined
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really the giants of Wall Street.
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Prediction markets are covering things
that are top of people's minds, things
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that are very kind of core and front and
center right now.
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And so sports have been an amazing
propeller.
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I mean, it's massive.
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I mean, $30 to $40 billion in volume.
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The growth has been incredible.
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A lot of people watch sports, so it's an
easy way to kind of understand what this
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is and get educated about prediction
markets.
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A big chunk of the users essentially
convert to other things, like the
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economy, politics, weather, culture.
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If you're not making money watching Love
Island, you're doing it wrong.
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You know, it's interesting. When we
started the company, it was 2018.
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This was a time where, you know, you saw
the sort of first wave of
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misinformation.
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polarization the country being driven to
the extremes social media
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was supposed to be a solution to that
but it ended up adding fuel to fire i am
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over it the beauty of prediction markets
is the incentive structure is the
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opposite the the incentive structure in
the system is true it's a truth that's
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coming from people with skin in the game
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And, you know, and you think about it,
right? Like, you sit sometimes at a
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dinner table at Thanksgiving, and
everyone has all these crazy takes, and
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you're like, hey, like, let's put $10 on
it. And all of a sudden, they get a lot
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more careful, right? The person that was
so certain about their belief and their
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opinion, all of a sudden, they're not so
sure anymore.
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It's objective.
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It's mathematical. It's statistical in a
way that all the other mechanisms are
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not. And I love math.
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I grew up in Lebanon with a single mom.
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I lived, you know, the way I describe
Lebanon is a very volatile country.
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In this sort of complex, constantly
evolving dynamic environment, I found
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math to be a refuge.
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And prediction markets are a bit of an
application of that. You want the people
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that are doing the research. You want
the people that are, like, very sharp or
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well-informed or smart. And imagine a
society where we basically tackle a lot
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of our big questions by thinking more.
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Another Capri Sun?
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Yeah. I just get nervous and I like
drinking Capri Sun.
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We're a bunch of people who bet and
trade on sports for a living and always
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trying to make as much money as
possible.
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In terms of placing this bet, yeah, you
know, you just get...
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Probably way too comfortable with moving
around large amounts of money.
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Since Prediction Markets started
offering sports trading, I've made mid
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-six figures.
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I remember not that long ago when if
Dayton lost 100 bucks, it would be
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pretty devastating.
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And now I think it would probably take
30 times to maybe even register.
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And that's worth it to you guys?
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Making a million dollars in like two
weeks?
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That seems pretty great to me.
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And he celebrates like LeBron James.
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Wait, Belgium just scored. Yeah, we
missed it. The prediction markets are
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faster than the streams, so Belgium
scored before we actually got to see the
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goal. Oh, you made so much. This is
crazy. DTM just made like $50,000 on
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that goal. Look at him. Doesn't even
feel a thing.
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The way it works, you have market
makers, and then you have market takers.
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And in the vast majority of cases, the
market makers are sharp or smart and the
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market takers are not smart in the sense
that they are making losing trades.
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I mean, Dayton used to work at Jane
Street.
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The people at Jane Street are often
described as mathematical.
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They're problem solvers in the most
advanced way.
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I mean, yeah, we're all.
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only able to make money because people
smarter than us haven't entered these
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markets yet.
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Describe your perfect counterparty. I
think it's just, like, someone who
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randomly, like, place orders and has,
like, zero information.
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Yeah, someone who just logs in and just
wants to bet on anything that they see.
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They're not making a sophisticated
choice as to what they're trading.
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They're just buying or selling.
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whatever it is that's in front of him.
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It's a fancy way of saying that he wants
to be against the 19-year-old who's
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randomly firing off.
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I'm 19 years old.
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I work as a chef and I like to bet on
Kashi.
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I think I've always been a little
more...
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impulsive and maybe adventurous than my
peers.
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A lot of my friends I grew up with
didn't want to do crazy things as much.
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Crazy things like what?
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Gamble away all their rent.
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When the Knicks made the finals, that's
when I would say started the peak.
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of how much I was putting into the call
sheet.
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I started with $1,000, you know, went up
and down, and then I borrowed another $1
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,100 from my roommate.
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You know, I lost it all, pretty much.
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00:10:37,340 --> 00:10:41,600
I don't understand, but this is going
very well.
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Gambling can be incredibly dangerous and
problematic for a lot of people. It's
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especially true for young people.
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I mean, we just saw Timothee Chalamet on
TV saying, sign up for Kalshi, it's
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00:10:54,870 --> 00:10:59,230
great. And one of the things that is
most dangerous, in my opinion, is an
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influencer saying how they paid their
rent by guessing the weather or some
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00:11:05,850 --> 00:11:09,250
person on YouTube talking about how easy
it is to get rich quick.
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The more people you expose to that
advice, the more people who are going to
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have serious problems.
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be spain against belgium in los angeles
this friday tonight i i'm i'm lucky in
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00:11:22,640 --> 00:11:28,120
boston and norway yeah we can see it the
final screen which which isn't much you
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know but now my portfolio is 300 and
it's pending payout but he is
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still smiling it has been the cause of
significant stress
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Like I haven't paid my rent for a month
because of this specifically.
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00:11:46,120 --> 00:11:50,140
You know, I can say no, it doesn't have
that much of a grip on me, but clearly
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it does a little bit.
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As of right now, I have $57 in my
checking account.
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Did you ever consider putting limits on
your Kalshi account?
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Yeah, there's a limit on my Kalshi
account.
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It's whatever I have in my checking
account.
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is the limit.
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All right.
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I'm going to hit the button in three,
two, one.
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My name is Dustin Galker. I'm the host
of this podcast, The Event Horizon.
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We're here to talk this week about
prediction markets.
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Over the course of the World Cup, Kaoshi
has had the biggest days it's had in its
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history. I don't think even I had a
sense of how big this would be for
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Kaoshi.
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Prediction markets are the fastest
growing industry this side of AI.
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I have no doubt about it.
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These companies have gotten big really
fast.
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Everything is disrupted by this. It's
like it's changed how we view the world.
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Polymarket kind of dominated for the
early 2020s. They're crypto native.
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and mostly unregulated offshore until
recently.
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Kalshi was doing this totally
differently.
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We spent four years getting regulated
before we launched a single product.
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We have more than a thousand markets
across politics, entertainment, culture.
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But the billions of dollars we're
hearing are not on real-world events
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that really matter.
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Sports are about 85 to 90 percent of
trading volume at Kalshi right now as we
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sit here.
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It may not be legally gambling, but what
is happening is 100% just gambling.
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Kentucky's attorney general is suing the
prediction market platforms.
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Accusing them of facilitating illegal
sports betting. That's what all these
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court cases are about.
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00:13:48,440 --> 00:13:51,940
Because gambling has always been the
purview of the state.
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00:13:53,880 --> 00:13:57,640
A year and a half ago now, Kalshi said,
we're going to offer this, but we're
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going to do it under federal law.
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00:13:59,000 --> 00:14:02,320
No different than other exchanges where
you can...
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00:14:02,650 --> 00:14:06,530
buy a stock or sell a stock we don't
have to worry about state laws we are
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00:14:06,530 --> 00:14:11,170
legally under the federal government and
that's it whether something feels and
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00:14:11,170 --> 00:14:14,930
looks like gambling doesn't necessarily
make it gambling speculation exists in
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all financial markets there's this
patchwork state-based solution where
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every single state is like some sort of
weird backdoor lobbying the cftc started
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off just being very hands-off then we
got a new chairman of the cftc michael
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selig And they became not just
hands-off, but an active proponent of
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the industry.
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What is he doing?
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I have to say this in a way that won't
get me in trouble. Let's see.
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Some people argue that it has to do with
corruption.
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Some people will say it's just
deregulation.
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I'm not here to pontificate on that.
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It's hard to, like, separate the fact
that Donald Trump Jr.
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is an advisor to both calci and
polymarket certainly the president his
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family has a vested interest in the
success of prediction markets and we
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have a cfdc that is being very friendly
now towards prediction markets
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there's
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agreements and and walls that are put in
place such that We're not dealing with
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any members of the president's family
when it comes to policy.
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We don't engage with the president's
family on any of these types of issues.
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So in my belief and understanding, there
is no sort of conflicts of interest.
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The prior administration didn't like the
prediction markets.
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I mean, that was very clear. They sought
to ban the product with respect to
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political prediction markets.
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The courts threw it out.
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And then we saw the gates open.
Prediction markets are absolutely
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exploding. Events in pop culture, in
tech, in sports, in climate, in the
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world, in literally anything you can
think of. I've been in the seat for
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about six months now, and there's no
clear rules of the road yet. We're
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trying to put those in place as soon as
we can.
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What's your message then to states who
are trying to limit prediction markets?
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The law is clear.
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The law provides that the CFTC has
exclusive federal regulatory authority
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over these markets because they are
national markets. To any state that
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seeks to circumvent federal regulation
and replace federal law with state law,
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we will see you in court.
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Bounced around this sort of startup tech
crypto scene for a while. This NYU
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dropout crypto bad boy.
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He's now a billionaire.
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I think that when people think about
prediction markets right now, all they
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think about is sports.
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I love sports.
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But I didn't start Polymarket for it to
be a sports site.
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Found myself in a lucky position.
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It was during the pandemic.
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I was broke.
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I was living in the Lower East Side.
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And I was like, when are things going to
open back up? When people talk about the
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vaccine, when's it going to be ready?
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when's shelter in place going to be
over? Are things going to go back to
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normal? And I was like, this idea of
information markets is the perfect, this
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is the perfect use case in the perfect
moment. And I think because of a mix of
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my nerdy passion of markets and this
sort of like academic literature about
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what today, you know, we think of as
prediction markets, plus maybe just
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enough creativity and being so broke
that I had nothing to lose.
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The triad of that, I was like, screw it,
I'm going to go build this thing.
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You know, when polymarket really glowed
up and became a thing, it was all about
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politics. I think the real watershed
moment, the inflection point, was during
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the first debate between Biden and
Trump.
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When Biden started stumbling with his
words,
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the polymarket for him dropping out was
skyrocketing.
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And the Polymarket for him winning was
tanking.
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And someone said to me, it was like a
really funny quote.
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They were like, Shane, there's really
two things that can happen here.
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Either he'll drop out and you build one
of the most important sites in the
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world, or nothing's going to happen and
you've lost all credibility. No one's
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ever going to take Polymarket seriously
again. And I was like, okay, let's see
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what happens.
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We are coming on the air at this hour
with breaking news.
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President Biden has just announced that
he is ending his reelection bid.
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When he dropped out, that was a moment.
Just a stunning announcement from... And
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then election day was this crazy moment
where the way that the market moved that
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night and called Trump winning when the
TV stations were still talking about,
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oh, it's neck and neck.
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At the very end, we find a tie
nationally. 49% for Harris, 49% for
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Trump. Harris having a slight edge over
Trump in the latest national poll, very
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slight. Polymarket was spot on the
entire time. Yeah. That was one of the
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00:19:20,460 --> 00:19:23,920
most gratifying moments ever, just
because the idea worked.
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00:19:24,200 --> 00:19:29,700
The idea worked, and from that moment
on, there was the level of credibility
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that Polymarket had and the way people
thought about it had just changed
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00:19:32,820 --> 00:19:33,820
entirely.
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00:19:38,800 --> 00:19:44,740
So prediction markets have gotten very
popular, but there hasn't been a steady
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evolution.
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00:19:46,620 --> 00:19:51,880
Another exotic idea from the Pentagon's
Defense Advanced Research Projects
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Agency, DARPA.
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A futures market, if you will, in
terror.
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00:19:58,240 --> 00:20:04,320
In 2003, the intelligence community was
planning on launching public markets in
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00:20:04,320 --> 00:20:08,060
geopolitical events called the policy
analysis market.
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00:20:08,640 --> 00:20:10,400
It was going to be open to anyone.
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00:20:10,680 --> 00:20:15,620
The hope was that the collective
judgment of that market would yield some
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00:20:15,620 --> 00:20:18,600
useful information for the U.S.
intelligence community.
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00:20:18,980 --> 00:20:23,940
What they mostly wanted to forecast were
things like the political stability of
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regimes or what was going to happen to
oil in upcoming years.
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But when they went to work and kind of
advertised the market, they also talked
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about things like whether or not there
would be a missile attack from North
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Korea or betting on assassinations.
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00:20:43,510 --> 00:20:48,430
There was this just massive backlash
against it. The federal government is
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00:20:48,430 --> 00:20:52,210
encouraging people to bet on and make
money.
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from atrocities and terrorist attacks.
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You're gonna make money if terrible
things happen.
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Why are we potentially creating an
incentive for people to, like, go out
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and try an assassination?
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00:21:03,720 --> 00:21:05,740
It is a tragic waste of taxpayers'
money.
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It will be offensive to almost everyone.
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And the amazing thing is, as soon as
there was any pressure, they folded. I
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00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:15,160
mean, the whole thing was over within,
like, two days.
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I think the main thing that has changed,
honestly, is that we are just much more
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comfortable with gambling.
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than we were 20 years ago.
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00:21:24,430 --> 00:21:28,750
So when you give people the chance to
bet on pretty much anything, it gets
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complicated really fast.
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00:21:30,330 --> 00:21:35,930
And it seems like there are three big
issues. Let's call them the dark side of
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00:21:35,930 --> 00:21:36,930
prediction markets.
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The first one is insider trading. A U.S.
Special Forces soldier who helped to
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00:21:42,010 --> 00:21:46,590
plan the January capture of Venezuelan
President Nicolas Maduro has been
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00:21:46,590 --> 00:21:50,630
indicted. Now pleading not guilty,
authorities say he won more than $400
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00:21:50,630 --> 00:21:54,490
,000 using classified information to win
on Polymarket.
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00:21:54,690 --> 00:21:57,850
Polymarket says it referred the
suspicious bets to the Department of
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00:21:57,850 --> 00:22:00,310
Justice. The second problem is the
problem of people...
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00:22:01,090 --> 00:22:04,150
gaming, the things that are used to
measure the outcomes.
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This involves tampered weather data.
321
00:22:07,110 --> 00:22:11,430
France's national forecaster has filed a
police complaint after detecting
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00:22:11,430 --> 00:22:15,290
suspicious temperature spikes at Paris'
Charles de Gaulle airport. Somehow the
323
00:22:15,290 --> 00:22:19,470
equipment was tampered with, maybe a
lighter, maybe a hairdryer, to give this
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00:22:19,470 --> 00:22:21,670
5 degrees Celsius spike in the reading.
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00:22:21,950 --> 00:22:25,290
Third, and I think by far the most
consequential, is when...
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00:22:25,840 --> 00:22:31,380
The existence of a prediction market
actually changes what people do.
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00:22:32,380 --> 00:22:37,160
There was a Cauchy market on whether or
not George Santos would show up at the
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State of the Union address.
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00:22:38,680 --> 00:22:42,480
I'm going to be there for the State of
the Union in the gallery, guys.
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00:22:42,860 --> 00:22:48,360
Santos had reportedly made a bet on
Cauchy on the no side of the contract.
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That is, he would not show up. During
the address, he posted...
332
00:22:52,010 --> 00:22:55,990
Watching State of the Union from an
airport TV was not part of the plan. By
333
00:22:55,990 --> 00:22:59,750
skipping the speech, sources say he
pocketed tens of thousands of dollars.
334
00:23:00,250 --> 00:23:02,950
I do think going forward, they're just
going to have to figure out how to
335
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manage this.
336
00:23:10,350 --> 00:23:17,230
All right, so where are we on requesting
materials from the
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00:23:17,230 --> 00:23:18,710
traders in Georgia?
338
00:23:33,360 --> 00:23:39,060
Any regulated financial institution is
going to face people who come to commit
339
00:23:39,060 --> 00:23:41,860
financial crime, whether it's money
laundering, whether it's insider
340
00:23:41,860 --> 00:23:43,500
trading, market manipulation, etc.
341
00:23:44,700 --> 00:23:49,080
So I lead our investigations and the
enforcement actions that we undertake.
342
00:23:49,930 --> 00:23:52,750
Our team's grown quite a bit in the last
year.
343
00:23:53,150 --> 00:23:58,170
We have about 15 to 20 employees,
individuals who are just focused on
344
00:23:58,170 --> 00:24:02,190
surveillance. We have individuals who
are surveilling for fraud, and then also
345
00:24:02,190 --> 00:24:03,190
a legal team.
346
00:24:03,330 --> 00:24:05,570
We've hired surveillance analysts from
the FBI.
347
00:24:06,050 --> 00:24:10,010
We have people with backgrounds with the
CFTC and the Department of Justice.
348
00:24:10,270 --> 00:24:14,790
There's been a significant increase in
our investigative and referral efforts
349
00:24:14,790 --> 00:24:18,890
over the last six months in particular,
just as the exchange has grown.
350
00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:23,340
surveillance algorithms are running over
every single trade happening on the
351
00:24:23,340 --> 00:24:28,120
exchange when they demonstrate some
anomalous behavior whether that's a very
352
00:24:28,120 --> 00:24:32,900
well-timed trade a pattern of very
well-timed trades a very significant
353
00:24:32,900 --> 00:24:36,940
price jump that occurs right after an
unusual trade all those things might
354
00:24:36,940 --> 00:24:41,600
trigger a trade that comes across my
desk or the surveillance team's desk so
355
00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:46,400
then There's probably 100, 150 each
quarter that are meaningful
356
00:24:46,400 --> 00:24:50,060
investigations that may lead to some
finding of wrongdoing or disciplinary
357
00:24:50,060 --> 00:24:54,200
action. And we've made dozens of
referrals to law enforcement.
358
00:24:54,960 --> 00:25:00,120
Any new product or evolution in
technology leads to really smart, bad
359
00:25:00,120 --> 00:25:02,620
actors figuring out how to game that
system.
360
00:25:02,980 --> 00:25:08,660
And the key is to try to stay one or
five steps in front of them at all
361
00:25:08,660 --> 00:25:11,500
times. You won't always succeed at that.
362
00:25:17,610 --> 00:25:20,250
This is one of the big things that I
spoiled myself with.
363
00:25:20,850 --> 00:25:23,710
This is paid for by prediction markets.
364
00:25:24,450 --> 00:25:30,970
With the press of a button, you can go
from a sunlit room to what becomes
365
00:25:30,970 --> 00:25:31,990
total darkness.
366
00:25:34,610 --> 00:25:38,730
Brought to me 100% by Kalshi. My wife
would not let me spend this money if it
367
00:25:38,730 --> 00:25:40,450
wasn't just, like, bonus money.
368
00:25:41,070 --> 00:25:46,150
Back in March of 2024, Kalshi really
started to hit the culture markets hard.
369
00:25:46,590 --> 00:25:50,230
In theory, their music and movie
markets, the way that you win them is by
370
00:25:50,230 --> 00:25:51,089
using math.
371
00:25:51,090 --> 00:25:57,570
So I turned a $10,000 deposit into over
$200,000 in about
372
00:25:57,570 --> 00:25:59,090
six or seven months.
373
00:25:59,290 --> 00:26:04,030
The most common plays that I would do on
Spotify is who will get number one
374
00:26:04,030 --> 00:26:05,470
during a given month.
375
00:26:06,390 --> 00:26:08,530
June 28th.
376
00:26:09,930 --> 00:26:12,950
I noticed some weird pricing on Olivia
Deen.
377
00:26:13,370 --> 00:26:18,030
Somebody thought that there was a more
than 11% chance Olivia Deen was going to
378
00:26:18,030 --> 00:26:19,030
get first.
379
00:26:19,310 --> 00:26:23,610
And I thought the true odds of Olivia
Deen getting first place naturally was
380
00:26:23,610 --> 00:26:25,710
zero. This was an old song.
381
00:26:25,950 --> 00:26:29,470
When I dug into the details, I was very
concerned.
382
00:26:30,090 --> 00:26:33,530
The data that I was looking at is the
top 200 songs.
383
00:26:34,290 --> 00:26:35,730
Most of them saw a drop.
384
00:26:36,170 --> 00:26:40,470
Two of them were newer songs, like newer
small songs. It's not unusual for those
385
00:26:40,470 --> 00:26:41,309
to go up.
386
00:26:41,310 --> 00:26:47,130
but for a well-established song to go up
almost 20 percent like this drake song
387
00:26:47,130 --> 00:26:53,710
did or seven percent like this olivia
dean song did this is a very strong sign
388
00:26:53,710 --> 00:26:59,590
that fraud was happening in theory
somebody is stream botting or stream
389
00:26:59,590 --> 00:27:05,540
boosting it's just artificial automated
ways of of listening to music where
390
00:27:05,540 --> 00:27:09,340
nobody's really listening to it they're
just trying to run up the numbers so at
391
00:27:09,340 --> 00:27:13,120
this point i had seventeen thousand
dollars that drake wouldn't get first
392
00:27:13,120 --> 00:27:16,860
place and i had thirteen thousand
dollars that olivia dean wouldn't get
393
00:27:16,860 --> 00:27:22,120
first place and i was quite worried so i
started sending emails i emailed cal
394
00:27:22,120 --> 00:27:28,940
shee i emailed spotify saying i was
completely convinced that the drake
395
00:27:28,940 --> 00:27:34,170
and olivia dean's streams were being
botted But they didn't seem to take it
396
00:27:34,170 --> 00:27:35,170
very seriously.
397
00:27:39,650 --> 00:27:46,350
Then the results come out, and I look at
who's in first place, and it wasn't
398
00:27:46,350 --> 00:27:47,350
Olivier Dien.
399
00:27:47,450 --> 00:27:49,050
And it wasn't Drake.
400
00:27:50,910 --> 00:27:52,230
It was Malcolm Todd.
401
00:27:56,250 --> 00:28:00,810
Like, what? That makes no sense. Malcolm
Todd wasn't even on the radar.
402
00:28:01,440 --> 00:28:02,440
as a possibility.
403
00:28:03,040 --> 00:28:08,580
And if you look at this chart, you can
see, boom, just this huge spike.
404
00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:13,180
So his streams went up by 70% in a
single day.
405
00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:16,940
And then they paid it out. And then I
was pissed.
406
00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:21,700
Spotify removed the streams.
407
00:28:23,620 --> 00:28:26,180
And they admitted that they were
fraudulent.
408
00:28:27,440 --> 00:28:33,510
But then in seeing how Kalshi handled
it, how they just stopped replying i
409
00:28:33,510 --> 00:28:39,590
liquidated my calci account so i
withdrew maybe 220 000 there
410
00:28:39,590 --> 00:28:45,150
are individuals who take a look at
something and say i can conclude this is
411
00:28:45,150 --> 00:28:49,210
bots and it's manipulation and they may
very well be right but from a legal
412
00:28:49,210 --> 00:28:53,530
perspective you need evidence to make
that determination you can't just say it
413
00:28:53,530 --> 00:28:56,970
looks like a duck and it quacks like a
duck so it is we're gathering the
414
00:28:56,970 --> 00:29:00,350
evidence we would need to make that
determination but that's pretty much the
415
00:29:00,350 --> 00:29:05,990
most that i can comment on in terms of
specifics about that okay patricio it's
416
00:29:05,990 --> 00:29:10,250
kind of the wild west right now
regulation has not caught up to what
417
00:29:10,250 --> 00:29:15,970
these markets are doing at all and as
long as it's the platforms basically
418
00:29:15,970 --> 00:29:20,250
policing themselves they're going to
grow as much as they possibly can
419
00:29:21,710 --> 00:29:26,710
Offer as many markets as they possibly
can and consequences be damned.
420
00:29:34,290 --> 00:29:38,250
It is day 11 of the U.S.-Israel war with
Iran.
421
00:29:38,670 --> 00:29:43,250
The strikes lighting up the night sky
and sending people rushing to shelter.
422
00:29:47,290 --> 00:29:48,970
My name is Emmanuel Fabian.
423
00:29:50,090 --> 00:29:53,810
I've been working for the Times of
Israel for around six years now.
424
00:29:55,150 --> 00:29:58,390
I basically cover everything related to
the Israeli military.
425
00:29:59,170 --> 00:30:04,050
I'm at this point covering the Iranian
attacks on Israel and Israel's attacks
426
00:30:04,050 --> 00:30:05,050
on Iran.
427
00:30:05,890 --> 00:30:12,870
On March 10th, there was one of several
missiles that day which struck outside
428
00:30:12,870 --> 00:30:15,070
the city of Bet Shemesh near Jerusalem.
429
00:30:16,910 --> 00:30:19,370
They reported there was no injuries, no
damage.
430
00:30:20,170 --> 00:30:25,110
There wasn't anything particularly
unusual in the grand scheme of things of
431
00:30:25,110 --> 00:30:26,110
this war.
432
00:30:27,070 --> 00:30:30,910
Much later that day, I get kind of an
unusual email, essentially asking me to
433
00:30:30,910 --> 00:30:32,450
change my earlier reporting.
434
00:30:32,710 --> 00:30:37,410
And they were claiming that the missile
that struck was fragments that were
435
00:30:37,410 --> 00:30:39,310
following an interception of a missile.
436
00:30:40,870 --> 00:30:45,500
And I respond to them and said, look,
Residents told me that they felt a
437
00:30:45,500 --> 00:30:47,880
massive explosion and a shockwave that
shook all their windows.
438
00:30:48,260 --> 00:30:52,280
And the army also confirmed to me that
it was a missile that struck the area.
439
00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:58,580
And then I started getting a barrage of
messages.
440
00:31:01,700 --> 00:31:07,400
They wrote here, if you do not correct
this by 1 a.m. Israel time, you're
441
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:09,840
bringing upon yourself damage you never
imagined you would suffer.
442
00:31:10,400 --> 00:31:12,580
You make us lose $900,000.
443
00:31:13,440 --> 00:31:15,380
We will invest no less than that to
finish you.
444
00:31:17,340 --> 00:31:21,060
It was scary at that point. I'm married.
I have a young daughter.
445
00:31:21,960 --> 00:31:24,860
I didn't know what this person was
actually capable of.
446
00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:29,840
At that point, it was very clear to me
that it was bets on polymarket.
447
00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:35,420
Essentially, the bet was, did Iran
strike Israel on a specific date?
448
00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:40,900
You can see that the amount of money
that was bet here reached $23 million.
449
00:31:42,600 --> 00:31:46,580
Those who had voted no were the ones
trying to convince me to change my
450
00:31:46,580 --> 00:31:48,240
reporting to say that it was
intercepted.
451
00:31:49,360 --> 00:31:52,540
But I was not going to change the story
and it was going to stay exactly how it
452
00:31:52,540 --> 00:31:53,540
is.
453
00:31:54,220 --> 00:31:56,620
It wouldn't surprise me if there are
many more cases.
454
00:31:57,620 --> 00:32:01,320
Journalists being threatened to change
their reporting, I don't think I'll be
455
00:32:01,320 --> 00:32:02,320
the last.
456
00:32:27,460 --> 00:32:30,060
Prediction markets are a cesspool.
457
00:32:30,260 --> 00:32:35,780
Even if it is legal, right, is there
something immoral or ethically
458
00:32:35,780 --> 00:32:40,400
questionable here about betting on
geopolitical events when lives are
459
00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:41,400
potentially at stake?
460
00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:46,060
We haven't done a good enough job in
terms of, you know, distilling why we do
461
00:32:46,060 --> 00:32:46,859
what we do.
462
00:32:46,860 --> 00:32:52,140
I know that we are probably in some,
like, vibe debt, maybe.
463
00:32:52,730 --> 00:32:56,810
in terms of just how people kind of
group PolyMarket in with a lot of other
464
00:32:56,810 --> 00:33:00,770
stuff. It's the latest allegation of
insider trading on prediction markets.
465
00:33:00,830 --> 00:33:04,810
Someone opened an account on PolyMarket,
and now they can make over a million.
466
00:33:04,950 --> 00:33:07,370
What are your thoughts on this? This is
just another coinkydink.
467
00:33:07,590 --> 00:33:09,510
Cash is proven itself for the last few
months.
468
00:33:09,850 --> 00:33:13,030
We are applying these rules. No matter
who it is, if somebody's going to try to
469
00:33:13,030 --> 00:33:14,030
cheat, we will catch them.
470
00:33:15,150 --> 00:33:18,530
It's not some sort of offshore thing
where it's done in the shadows. It's
471
00:33:18,530 --> 00:33:21,490
done right here in the middle of our
financial system.
472
00:33:25,230 --> 00:33:29,150
I know what happens in this office. Like
I know the conversation we have. I know
473
00:33:29,150 --> 00:33:33,270
what I care about and what drives me.
And you have to kind of oscillate
474
00:33:33,270 --> 00:33:37,630
between like cutting out the noise, but
also understanding people's criticism
475
00:33:37,630 --> 00:33:38,589
and concerns.
476
00:33:38,590 --> 00:33:42,290
Maybe there's things that you missed
that other people are flagging and maybe
477
00:33:42,290 --> 00:33:44,690
they hate you, but maybe they're
actually making some good points. This
478
00:33:44,690 --> 00:33:46,250
is inherently evil and bad.
479
00:33:46,470 --> 00:33:49,530
Do you think Kenzie's going to do the
splits? It feels nihilistic, right? It
480
00:33:49,530 --> 00:33:50,530
feels like.
481
00:33:51,130 --> 00:33:52,250
Why are we betting on everything?
482
00:33:52,550 --> 00:33:55,350
There's a place for prediction markets.
I think they should definitely exist.
483
00:33:55,570 --> 00:33:56,570
I think they have values.
484
00:33:56,670 --> 00:34:01,390
I just think there needs to be more
guardrails, more thought put into how
485
00:34:01,390 --> 00:34:04,030
this industry has come about and where
it's headed.
486
00:34:04,770 --> 00:34:09,790
Right now, it feels like all gas, no
brakes. When this is everywhere and you
487
00:34:09,790 --> 00:34:14,989
have a completely gamblified world,
people are not going to integrate it
488
00:34:14,989 --> 00:34:18,110
healthily into their lives. And I'm as
guilty of that as anybody.
489
00:34:20,090 --> 00:34:21,310
I'm kind of just letting it ride.
490
00:34:21,670 --> 00:34:27,489
When everything's a market, the
opportunities for cheating are basically
491
00:34:27,489 --> 00:34:32,510
endless. That's a reality that we're
gonna, you know, be facing now, and it's
492
00:34:32,510 --> 00:34:37,530
gonna be much more difficult to sort of,
you know, find what's true now, and
493
00:34:37,530 --> 00:34:38,670
that, I think, really worries me.
494
00:34:39,230 --> 00:34:43,510
With a couple months to go until the
midterms, we've already seen volume
495
00:34:43,510 --> 00:34:45,350
that's far exceeded 2024.
496
00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:54,659
What I'm most interested in about them
is their usefulness for forecasting the
497
00:34:54,659 --> 00:34:59,200
future. And these midterms are going to
generate a lot of interest because
498
00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:00,580
there's a lot at stake in them.
499
00:35:01,420 --> 00:35:05,860
And so in that way, this is kind of one
of the bigger tests of prediction
500
00:35:05,860 --> 00:35:06,860
markets.
501
00:35:07,960 --> 00:35:10,520
I think prediction markets have
definitely hit critical mass.
502
00:35:10,760 --> 00:35:13,500
The growth in the prediction market has
been so fast because they work.
503
00:35:14,480 --> 00:35:17,360
We're bringing the prediction markets
data next to the news, next to polls,
504
00:35:17,500 --> 00:35:21,000
next to everything else, so people can
look at everything and make their own
505
00:35:21,000 --> 00:35:22,000
independent assessment.
506
00:35:22,260 --> 00:35:26,080
I think that it's inevitable that
everyone will be looking at it to kind
507
00:35:26,080 --> 00:35:27,080
of understand what will happen.
508
00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:30,740
The only thing that you have to believe,
to believe that prediction markets are
509
00:35:30,740 --> 00:35:33,460
going to keep growing the way they've
been growing, is that there's going to
510
00:35:33,460 --> 00:35:34,800
be interesting news in the world.
511
00:35:35,540 --> 00:35:38,780
I feel like there's so much work left to
be done in terms of like the inventive
512
00:35:38,780 --> 00:35:41,540
side of prediction markets and what
could be that isn't yet.
513
00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:44,480
we're very committed to this vision
because we think it's one of the most
514
00:35:44,480 --> 00:35:48,540
important things we could be working on
and i feel like if i don't go and invent
515
00:35:48,540 --> 00:35:50,740
that or realize that vision it probably
won't happen
47520
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