All language subtitles for Britains.TikTok.Murder.S01E02.1080p.AMZN.WEB-DL.DDP2.0.H.264-RAWR_track3_[eng]

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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:25,560 --> 00:00:27,640 Finally, the police get their person. 2 00:00:29,160 --> 00:00:30,759 {\an8}Winter Swan-Miller has been arrested 3 00:00:30,760 --> 00:00:33,040 {\an8}on suspicion of Stuart Crocker's murder. 4 00:00:35,680 --> 00:00:37,759 {\an8}She's taken into custody, 5 00:00:37,760 --> 00:00:40,280 and she's then transferred down to Hampshire. 6 00:00:41,920 --> 00:00:44,000 {\an8}After her fleeing to Birmingham, 7 00:00:44,600 --> 00:00:46,759 she could have been hidden for some time. 8 00:00:50,440 --> 00:00:53,359 I didn't think it would take long, really, 9 00:00:53,360 --> 00:00:55,479 for her to be arrested. 10 00:00:59,600 --> 00:01:02,480 Just because of the craving attention. 11 00:01:03,120 --> 00:01:04,759 You know, her being a naughty girl, 12 00:01:04,760 --> 00:01:07,719 and all the things that she portrayed on her TikTok videos. 13 00:01:07,720 --> 00:01:11,079 I'm going to be taking a break from TikTok for a bit, 14 00:01:11,080 --> 00:01:12,600 I think, because 15 00:01:13,800 --> 00:01:15,519 I've been a bad girl. 16 00:01:19,600 --> 00:01:21,440 We're into new depths of something here. 17 00:01:23,560 --> 00:01:25,359 My poor mate is dead. 18 00:01:25,360 --> 00:01:28,600 There is always two sides to every story. 19 00:01:46,280 --> 00:01:47,639 They took Swan-Miller 20 00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:50,120 to Basingstoke Investigation Centre. 21 00:01:50,960 --> 00:01:53,119 {\an8}On her record, they will have flagged 22 00:01:53,120 --> 00:01:54,440 {\an8}the fact that she's a drug user. 23 00:01:57,240 --> 00:01:58,799 It took a long time to interview her 24 00:01:58,800 --> 00:02:01,480 because she was high when she was admitted. 25 00:02:05,760 --> 00:02:08,079 During Swan-Miller's interviews, 26 00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:10,240 Most of the time she answered no comment. 27 00:02:11,160 --> 00:02:12,679 {\an8}But on one occasion, she said 28 00:02:12,680 --> 00:02:14,960 {\an8}that there was a dispute over the dog. 29 00:02:15,960 --> 00:02:19,679 She believed that Oblivion had been stolen or let out, 30 00:02:19,680 --> 00:02:21,320 and she was blaming Stuart for that. 31 00:02:26,400 --> 00:02:29,199 The police can hold an individual for 24 hours 32 00:02:29,200 --> 00:02:30,400 without charging them. 33 00:02:31,200 --> 00:02:34,759 If police run out of time, they have the ability to go to 34 00:02:34,760 --> 00:02:36,839 either a judge or a magistrate 35 00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:41,039 to ask to extend the time for questioning. 36 00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:42,760 And that's what happened in this case. 37 00:02:44,280 --> 00:02:46,919 So there's a huge amount of work that now goes on. 38 00:02:46,920 --> 00:02:48,199 You know, you're under the microscope 39 00:02:48,200 --> 00:02:50,120 and there are time limits that you need to follow. 40 00:02:50,920 --> 00:02:52,279 So when she was arrested, 41 00:02:52,280 --> 00:02:56,399 she had some jewellery, a ring, a watch, bracelet. 42 00:02:56,400 --> 00:02:57,519 They were tested. 43 00:02:57,520 --> 00:03:00,239 They were looked at as part of the whole forensic examination. 44 00:03:00,240 --> 00:03:02,639 And there were traces of Stuart's blood on it. 45 00:03:05,400 --> 00:03:06,799 So within the crime scene, 46 00:03:06,800 --> 00:03:08,719 there were notes around the body. 47 00:03:12,880 --> 00:03:14,519 The notes read things like, 48 00:03:14,520 --> 00:03:16,640 "seriously up and killed someone. 49 00:03:17,480 --> 00:03:19,999 I can't believe I stabbed him to death in the throat. 50 00:03:21,240 --> 00:03:23,599 The back on the neck, all the body. 51 00:03:23,600 --> 00:03:25,840 Then I choked him with my LV bag. 52 00:03:26,800 --> 00:03:30,119 Haha! Oblivion was rolling in his blood." 53 00:03:34,480 --> 00:03:38,119 The attack shows a real hatred towards the victim. 54 00:03:38,120 --> 00:03:39,519 You know, there's something that sparked 55 00:03:39,520 --> 00:03:41,320 this kind of violent attack on him. 56 00:03:42,720 --> 00:03:45,240 The handwritten notes were processed. 57 00:03:47,720 --> 00:03:50,239 And it was proved to be Swan-Miller's handwriting 58 00:03:50,240 --> 00:03:51,959 by a graphologist. 59 00:04:01,720 --> 00:04:04,199 I am one of the reporters 60 00:04:04,200 --> 00:04:07,640 on all the crime stories for Andover Advertiser. 61 00:04:08,480 --> 00:04:10,999 {\an8}There aren't many murders in Andover. 62 00:04:11,000 --> 00:04:13,799 {\an8}So, when this case came up, 63 00:04:13,800 --> 00:04:17,200 we knew that this was a big talking point in Andover. 64 00:04:18,760 --> 00:04:22,159 When Winter Swan-Miller was arrested from the Midlands, 65 00:04:22,160 --> 00:04:23,959 she was with another man. 66 00:04:23,960 --> 00:04:27,439 He was also arrested, as police believed 67 00:04:27,440 --> 00:04:30,839 he knew about the murder, and he was helping her. 68 00:04:33,680 --> 00:04:36,479 The police questioned this gentleman 69 00:04:36,480 --> 00:04:38,279 about how he knew Swan-Miller 70 00:04:38,280 --> 00:04:40,359 and what the nature of their relationship was, 71 00:04:40,360 --> 00:04:43,879 and he started talking about this woman who had turned up, 72 00:04:43,880 --> 00:04:48,560 referred by a friend of his, who needed somewhere to stay. 73 00:04:49,840 --> 00:04:52,479 {\an8}This man is facing serious charges now 74 00:04:52,480 --> 00:04:55,759 {\an8}of basically assisting an offender 75 00:04:55,760 --> 00:04:59,159 {\an8}and the fraud and the use of Stuart Crocker's card 76 00:04:59,160 --> 00:05:00,240 at cashpoints. 77 00:05:01,080 --> 00:05:03,600 This man was then charged by police. 78 00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:07,439 Swan-Miller was eventually charged 79 00:05:07,440 --> 00:05:09,879 with the murder of Stuart Crocker, 80 00:05:09,880 --> 00:05:11,159 which is the most serious offence 81 00:05:11,160 --> 00:05:12,399 that someone can be charged with. 82 00:05:14,000 --> 00:05:15,999 I think people were quite relieved. 83 00:05:16,000 --> 00:05:17,959 I think there was almost a sense of 84 00:05:17,960 --> 00:05:20,920 at least we found her, and is off the streets, 85 00:05:22,080 --> 00:05:24,759 and we're thinking, this is going to be a big case, 86 00:05:24,760 --> 00:05:26,159 {\an8}people are interested, 87 00:05:26,160 --> 00:05:28,679 {\an8}and they're coming to us for the information at this point, 88 00:05:28,680 --> 00:05:31,559 {\an8}because it hasn't been picked up nationally that much. 89 00:05:35,560 --> 00:05:37,560 We had a family liaison officer, 90 00:05:38,400 --> 00:05:43,360 {\an8}and she rang us to say that she had been charged. 91 00:05:44,800 --> 00:05:46,199 It was hard. 92 00:05:46,200 --> 00:05:48,279 For all this to happen was a shock 93 00:05:48,280 --> 00:05:52,679 how she had attacked our lives, basically, 94 00:05:52,680 --> 00:05:54,599 and changed the path of it. 95 00:05:58,040 --> 00:05:59,759 I was happy when I had heard 96 00:05:59,760 --> 00:06:01,960 that she had been caught and charged. 97 00:06:03,320 --> 00:06:07,040 {\an8}I think it was such an ordeal for me, mentally, 98 00:06:08,240 --> 00:06:11,720 to lose the one best friend I've had. 99 00:06:16,200 --> 00:06:19,359 I was also angry because I had also hoped that 100 00:06:19,360 --> 00:06:21,360 they would find her in a ditch. 101 00:06:35,760 --> 00:06:40,919 Swan-Miller's case was that she admitted killing Stuart, 102 00:06:40,920 --> 00:06:43,839 but that she didn't intend to kill him, 103 00:06:43,840 --> 00:06:46,199 or that she had a momentary loss 104 00:06:46,200 --> 00:06:48,119 as a result of some kind of breakdown. 105 00:06:50,560 --> 00:06:52,839 In effect, it meant there had to be a trial, 106 00:06:52,840 --> 00:06:56,359 and a trial required the prosecution to prove, 107 00:06:56,360 --> 00:06:57,599 beyond reasonable doubt, 108 00:06:57,600 --> 00:07:01,759 i.e., so the jury can be sure that she did commit it. 109 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:06,440 The police's work has barely started. 110 00:07:07,040 --> 00:07:09,199 They've got a suspect, they've charged a suspect. 111 00:07:09,200 --> 00:07:11,319 But there's still an awful lot to do. 112 00:07:12,840 --> 00:07:15,239 The police need to ensure that all the evidence stacks up 113 00:07:15,240 --> 00:07:16,679 and shows that she is responsible 114 00:07:16,680 --> 00:07:18,120 for the murder of Stuart. 115 00:07:19,120 --> 00:07:21,559 They will be pulling together all the witness statements. 116 00:07:21,560 --> 00:07:24,439 They'll be looking at the CCTV imagery that they have. 117 00:07:24,440 --> 00:07:27,279 They'll be looking at her social media accounts 118 00:07:27,280 --> 00:07:28,999 and the footage that they've taken from that. 119 00:07:29,000 --> 00:07:31,279 They'll be examining the notes that she's written. 120 00:07:33,000 --> 00:07:36,919 The defence will be speaking to psychologists, psychiatrists. 121 00:07:36,920 --> 00:07:39,679 They will be looking at any background behaviours. 122 00:07:39,680 --> 00:07:42,999 They'll also be trying to discredit Stuart, 123 00:07:43,000 --> 00:07:45,639 who, sadly, is not there to defend himself. 124 00:07:45,640 --> 00:07:46,799 And that's why it's really important 125 00:07:46,800 --> 00:07:47,919 we get the family there 126 00:07:47,920 --> 00:07:50,239 that can speak on behalf of the victim, 127 00:07:50,240 --> 00:07:52,520 but also the police investigation itself. 128 00:08:02,000 --> 00:08:03,719 I was aware that, you know, obviously, 129 00:08:03,720 --> 00:08:05,879 that the police have now got a suspect, shall we say, 130 00:08:05,880 --> 00:08:06,840 at this point. 131 00:08:09,040 --> 00:08:11,600 {\an8}Those that knew Swan-Miller, um, 132 00:08:12,520 --> 00:08:17,599 {\an8}I think were just hoping that this would be the end of it, 133 00:08:17,600 --> 00:08:20,279 and that she wouldn't be returning out. 134 00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:25,359 Then I thought, well, who's fighting for Stuart? 135 00:08:25,360 --> 00:08:28,359 The man's gone, you know, he'll be forgotten. 136 00:08:28,360 --> 00:08:31,160 And as a consequence, I found myself delving. 137 00:08:35,080 --> 00:08:37,719 So with Swan-Miller on the front page, 138 00:08:37,720 --> 00:08:41,160 this is the first time that we've got her custody shot. 139 00:08:43,080 --> 00:08:44,839 So we have a picture of her now, 140 00:08:44,840 --> 00:08:49,200 which looks vastly different to the pictures of her on TikTok. 141 00:08:50,720 --> 00:08:52,079 There's been several posts 142 00:08:52,080 --> 00:08:56,000 been put out on social media by police. 143 00:09:00,800 --> 00:09:02,919 And there's a lot of posts going around. 144 00:09:02,920 --> 00:09:05,839 There's a lot of speculation on social media 145 00:09:05,840 --> 00:09:07,800 across the whole country. 146 00:09:17,880 --> 00:09:21,879 And then people from Winter Swan-Miller's past life 147 00:09:21,880 --> 00:09:25,159 start commenting on different posts. 148 00:09:43,160 --> 00:09:44,239 And as my phone pinged, 149 00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:45,639 it started ringing straight away. 150 00:09:45,640 --> 00:09:47,959 So I've answered the phone, and my mum's like, 151 00:09:47,960 --> 00:09:50,759 "I knew there was something wrong about that Swan-Miller" 152 00:09:50,760 --> 00:09:52,280 She said, "look at what I've just sent you." 153 00:09:52,960 --> 00:09:55,399 And there she was, Swan-Miller's face, 154 00:09:55,400 --> 00:09:58,399 stabbed some poor man to death. 155 00:10:09,600 --> 00:10:12,399 My daughter Kelly, she got in touch with me to tell me 156 00:10:12,400 --> 00:10:15,599 that Swan-Miller had killed somebody. 157 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:16,640 Murdered someone. 158 00:10:17,640 --> 00:10:18,760 Stuart Crocker. 159 00:10:19,560 --> 00:10:21,239 She stabbed him many times. 160 00:10:24,040 --> 00:10:26,960 Swan-Miller, I just did not like the woman. 161 00:10:28,960 --> 00:10:31,280 She destroyed my daughter, Natalie's life. 162 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:33,480 She were evil. 163 00:10:35,000 --> 00:10:38,360 Naturally, as journalists, we're monitoring the comments, 164 00:10:38,880 --> 00:10:44,880 and sometimes they will lead to connections or better stories. 165 00:10:48,400 --> 00:10:51,479 So we're shocked to find out that Winter Swan-Miller, 166 00:10:51,480 --> 00:10:54,959 she's been married, she's, she'd been married to a woman. 167 00:10:54,960 --> 00:10:55,880 Natalie. 168 00:10:58,160 --> 00:10:59,879 We're starting to see this picture 169 00:10:59,880 --> 00:11:03,279 of Winter Swan-Miller's life before Andover, 170 00:11:03,280 --> 00:11:04,679 before Stuart. 171 00:11:10,760 --> 00:11:14,639 I got a message from Kelly Pashley. 172 00:11:14,640 --> 00:11:18,320 Kelly Pashley was Natalie Pashley's sister. 173 00:11:19,000 --> 00:11:23,639 So this reads, I quote, "I hope you investigate Swan-Miller 174 00:11:23,640 --> 00:11:27,399 because we came to the police in Derbyshire after my sister 175 00:11:27,400 --> 00:11:30,679 suddenly died of a brain haemorrhage 176 00:11:30,680 --> 00:11:32,600 caused by blunt force trauma. 177 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:37,039 Nothing was done, but she moved away, 178 00:11:37,040 --> 00:11:40,719 changed her name, and now a man has lost his life." 179 00:11:40,720 --> 00:11:42,280 This was referring to Stuart. 180 00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:45,239 This is what really prompted my interest, 181 00:11:45,240 --> 00:11:48,040 something that I felt I could investigate. 182 00:11:49,360 --> 00:11:50,879 It was suggested to me 183 00:11:50,880 --> 00:11:53,919 that the death of Natalie was not an accident. 184 00:12:00,720 --> 00:12:02,840 Natalie has been laid to rest. 185 00:12:03,600 --> 00:12:06,440 But I'm ashamed because she hasn't got a headstone. 186 00:12:13,120 --> 00:12:15,880 I've got end of life diagnosis. 187 00:12:17,400 --> 00:12:19,919 {\an8}But I want to see that she's got this stone on, 188 00:12:19,920 --> 00:12:21,400 you know, before I actually go. 189 00:12:25,320 --> 00:12:26,880 When Natalie was born, 190 00:12:28,000 --> 00:12:29,919 as soon as we had her, that was it, 191 00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:32,160 we fell in love with her straight away. 192 00:12:32,840 --> 00:12:34,679 And she got a bit older, 193 00:12:34,680 --> 00:12:37,400 she were more of a tomboy than a girl. 194 00:12:38,200 --> 00:12:41,959 She'd get up to playing football and all sorts of stuff, 195 00:12:41,960 --> 00:12:43,519 and she were rough and ready, 196 00:12:43,520 --> 00:12:46,879 which I loved about her, because she were funny. 197 00:12:46,880 --> 00:12:48,280 She weren't a girly-girl. 198 00:12:50,560 --> 00:12:54,199 Natalie came home one night, 199 00:12:54,200 --> 00:12:57,200 and she'd got this girl with her, called Swan-Miller. 200 00:12:58,800 --> 00:13:00,479 And things progressed. 201 00:13:00,480 --> 00:13:02,400 Natalie began to like her a lot. 202 00:13:03,160 --> 00:13:06,759 {\an8}When I first met Swan-Miller with my Auntie Nat, 203 00:13:06,760 --> 00:13:08,880 {\an8}she took us all out shopping. 204 00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:12,159 Wouldn't think anything of it. 205 00:13:12,160 --> 00:13:13,480 She was a happy person. 206 00:13:14,920 --> 00:13:17,759 {\an8}When I was younger, I used to follow Swan-Miller 207 00:13:17,760 --> 00:13:20,839 {\an8}on Instagram, 208 00:13:20,840 --> 00:13:23,880 and pictures with my Auntie Nat and whatnot. 209 00:13:24,400 --> 00:13:26,279 She's always seemed to have been 210 00:13:26,280 --> 00:13:29,679 very social media influenced, like. 211 00:13:36,040 --> 00:13:38,919 The relationship looks like a happy, 212 00:13:38,920 --> 00:13:42,199 normal, healthy relationship. 213 00:13:42,200 --> 00:13:45,000 There's lots of posts about love. 214 00:13:46,080 --> 00:13:48,520 It looks all bright and rosy. 215 00:13:49,400 --> 00:13:54,360 Natalie moved in with Miller and her mum, Blair. 216 00:13:55,120 --> 00:13:59,559 {\an8}Right, we're going up to start doing the challenge. 217 00:13:59,560 --> 00:14:01,719 My Auntie Nat and Swan-Miller they, 218 00:14:01,720 --> 00:14:03,319 they both seem genuinely happy, 219 00:14:03,320 --> 00:14:05,760 and I was happy to see that my auntie was happy. 220 00:14:07,200 --> 00:14:09,039 The next time we see her, she's married. 221 00:14:14,120 --> 00:14:15,719 No one knew about the wedding. 222 00:14:15,720 --> 00:14:17,880 No one was invited, it just happened. 223 00:14:18,840 --> 00:14:21,840 My daughter Natalie, she had her name changed to, 224 00:14:22,920 --> 00:14:25,079 Harper Swan-Miller. 225 00:14:25,080 --> 00:14:27,119 It were a farce, basically. 226 00:14:27,120 --> 00:14:30,639 It were just, oh, come on, let's get married type of thing, 227 00:14:30,640 --> 00:14:31,560 and that was that. 228 00:14:32,640 --> 00:14:36,200 My daughter can't even remember getting married to Swan-Miller. 229 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:39,119 She says it were like a dream, 230 00:14:39,120 --> 00:14:41,000 like it, it weren't real. 231 00:14:42,360 --> 00:14:45,159 I noticed things changing with my daughter. 232 00:14:45,160 --> 00:14:46,759 She came a bit withdrawn, 233 00:14:46,760 --> 00:14:48,280 not her usual self. 234 00:14:49,520 --> 00:14:52,640 After a period of time in the relationship, 235 00:14:53,720 --> 00:14:55,319 we were not seeing that at all. 236 00:14:55,320 --> 00:14:56,720 None of us were, she was 237 00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:00,359 cut off from the whole family. 238 00:15:00,360 --> 00:15:03,999 There was constant arguments between 239 00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:07,839 Swan-Miller and my Nana Lynn. 240 00:15:09,880 --> 00:15:14,599 I suspected that Swan-Miller was taking drugs 241 00:15:14,600 --> 00:15:17,200 and I think she was giving them Natalie as well. 242 00:15:18,120 --> 00:15:20,919 Natalie came to my home with Swan-Miller, 243 00:15:20,920 --> 00:15:22,999 and they were stood in my kitchen, 244 00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:25,480 and I said, "would any of you like anything to eat?" 245 00:15:26,080 --> 00:15:27,040 No, we're fine. 246 00:15:28,840 --> 00:15:29,919 And then a bit after it, 247 00:15:29,920 --> 00:15:32,519 it was like about 5 or 10 minutes later, 248 00:15:32,520 --> 00:15:34,520 Natalie's eyes started rolling. 249 00:15:35,920 --> 00:15:38,119 Natalie, she couldn't even respond to me. 250 00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:39,559 She couldn't even talk to me. 251 00:15:39,560 --> 00:15:40,919 And I went mad, and I said to her, 252 00:15:40,920 --> 00:15:42,840 "what on earth has she had?" 253 00:15:44,080 --> 00:15:46,239 Miller's laughing her head off. 254 00:15:46,240 --> 00:15:48,399 I said, "don't laugh, that's my daughter." 255 00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:49,879 I says, "I want to know what she's had." 256 00:15:49,880 --> 00:15:51,919 She says, "oh, I gave her such and such." 257 00:15:51,920 --> 00:15:53,879 I said, "you gave her what?" 258 00:15:53,880 --> 00:15:56,559 she says, "It was only a paracetamol and something else." 259 00:15:58,680 --> 00:16:01,239 So my mum were constantly arguing with Swan-Miller. 260 00:16:01,240 --> 00:16:03,160 Tell her what she's doing is not right. 261 00:16:03,720 --> 00:16:08,199 And then our auntie Nat would stick with Swan-Miller 262 00:16:08,200 --> 00:16:10,720 and say everything's fine, everything's fine. 263 00:16:11,760 --> 00:16:13,160 Things weren't fine. 264 00:16:14,480 --> 00:16:16,120 All the neighbours had been on about them. 265 00:16:16,800 --> 00:16:19,000 She'd been hitting on Natalie with a golf club. 266 00:16:20,840 --> 00:16:25,000 It seems that their dynamic in the household was very abusive. 267 00:16:26,520 --> 00:16:29,920 We've all seen burn marks on my auntie Nat's hands. 268 00:16:31,160 --> 00:16:34,839 So the images of the burn marks were sent from Nat 269 00:16:34,840 --> 00:16:36,599 to my mother, 270 00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:40,679 and I believe that was because my Auntie Nat was concerned, 271 00:16:40,680 --> 00:16:42,799 but didn't quite know how to explain 272 00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:46,000 that she was scared about what was going on in the house, like. 273 00:16:46,960 --> 00:16:48,319 Because she was getting abused. 274 00:16:52,040 --> 00:16:54,039 So if you think about coercive behaviour, 275 00:16:54,040 --> 00:16:57,039 {\an8}psychological abuse is often about isolating the victim 276 00:16:57,040 --> 00:17:00,199 {\an8}from their friends, their family and their social network, 277 00:17:00,200 --> 00:17:03,479 but also breaking down their sense of self-esteem, 278 00:17:03,480 --> 00:17:07,399 their confidence, then really activating their insecurities. 279 00:17:07,400 --> 00:17:08,639 Because what that does 280 00:17:08,640 --> 00:17:11,320 is create dependency on that person. 281 00:17:11,840 --> 00:17:14,119 Then, if we bring in physical abuse, 282 00:17:14,120 --> 00:17:16,599 that's about reinforcing the fact that 283 00:17:16,600 --> 00:17:19,679 there's consequences if this individual resists. 284 00:17:19,680 --> 00:17:22,359 [sinister music 285 00:17:22,360 --> 00:17:23,999 Natalie's sister, Kelly, 286 00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:28,039 {\an8}is quite rightly concerned about what's happening, 287 00:17:28,040 --> 00:17:29,719 {\an8}and she's still terrified, 288 00:17:29,720 --> 00:17:32,719 {\an8}frightened about what the future might hold 289 00:17:32,720 --> 00:17:36,320 if her sister continues in this abusive relationship. 290 00:17:39,880 --> 00:17:45,239 So she's starting to document incidents that are happening 291 00:17:45,240 --> 00:17:48,759 between Natalie and Winter Storm Miller. 292 00:17:48,760 --> 00:17:51,279 She's starting to keep text messages 293 00:17:51,280 --> 00:17:53,119 and pictures and screenshots. 294 00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:56,879 Russell was in touch with us. 295 00:17:56,880 --> 00:17:58,160 He's tracking things, 296 00:17:59,760 --> 00:18:02,599 and he's been speaking to Natalie's family, 297 00:18:02,600 --> 00:18:05,599 and they have shown WhatsApp messages 298 00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:08,999 and shared photographs that they have 299 00:18:09,000 --> 00:18:11,680 of Natalie in a really distressing state. 300 00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:16,760 My Auntie Nat was usually a chubby-ish girl. 301 00:18:18,360 --> 00:18:21,519 She sent pictures to my mum of her in the bath 302 00:18:21,520 --> 00:18:25,279 scrawny as anything, not looking like herself at all. 303 00:18:34,120 --> 00:18:36,199 {\an8}Here we can see personal text messages 304 00:18:36,200 --> 00:18:37,479 {\an8}that have been sent. 305 00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:42,880 {\an8}Harper, which we now know as Natalie, is texting her sister. 306 00:18:43,800 --> 00:18:46,599 Oh my God. WTF? 307 00:18:46,600 --> 00:18:48,279 Right, this is Kelly going, 308 00:18:48,280 --> 00:18:50,279 What on earth has gone on? 309 00:18:50,280 --> 00:18:54,080 Kelly is in disbelief at how her sister now looks. 310 00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:56,120 She's emaciated. 311 00:18:58,840 --> 00:19:00,039 Oh, she looked filthy. 312 00:19:00,040 --> 00:19:01,239 Really dirty. 313 00:19:02,240 --> 00:19:05,879 She was thin, her bones were showing and everything, 314 00:19:05,880 --> 00:19:07,480 and she looked scared. 315 00:19:08,560 --> 00:19:10,800 She was sleeping in the shed outside. 316 00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:17,839 The whole control went on for quite a while, 317 00:19:17,840 --> 00:19:19,280 about 2 or 3 years. 318 00:19:20,200 --> 00:19:22,119 It was really upsetting for me, you know, 319 00:19:22,120 --> 00:19:24,959 because last time I ever spoke to Natalie, 320 00:19:24,960 --> 00:19:28,719 Natalie was telling me they'd moved to Rotherham. 321 00:19:31,120 --> 00:19:33,359 Swan-Miller and my daughter Natalie, 322 00:19:33,360 --> 00:19:35,359 and her mother, Blair. 323 00:19:35,360 --> 00:19:36,600 We've got an house there. 324 00:19:37,360 --> 00:19:39,439 I said to her, I said, "well, 325 00:19:39,440 --> 00:19:41,200 when are you going to give me your phone number?" 326 00:19:41,800 --> 00:19:43,039 She says, "oh well, I'll give it you." 327 00:19:43,040 --> 00:19:44,599 She says, "I've got a new one." 328 00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:46,360 She says, "and I'll let you know what it is." 329 00:19:47,760 --> 00:19:49,600 So I waited... 330 00:19:50,200 --> 00:19:51,239 Nothing. 331 00:19:51,240 --> 00:19:54,240 No phone call, no social media. 332 00:19:54,640 --> 00:19:56,799 It were like, my daughter didn't exist, 333 00:19:56,800 --> 00:20:00,559 you know, she vanished off the face of blooming earth. 334 00:20:03,560 --> 00:20:05,079 It was the 11th of August 335 00:20:06,040 --> 00:20:07,280 2019, 336 00:20:07,880 --> 00:20:09,760 I got up on the Sunday morning 337 00:20:10,840 --> 00:20:11,880 to a phone call. 338 00:20:13,120 --> 00:20:16,959 It was Blair Miller, Swan-Miller's mum, 339 00:20:16,960 --> 00:20:19,160 to tell me that my daughter had passed away. 340 00:20:22,440 --> 00:20:24,439 I thought it was some sick joke. 341 00:20:32,360 --> 00:20:35,199 Natalie had been on a life support machine. 342 00:20:37,120 --> 00:20:39,879 Five days she was left there, 343 00:20:39,880 --> 00:20:46,119 and of course, the next of kin was the very only Swan-Miller. 344 00:20:50,160 --> 00:20:52,159 I found out that my daughter 345 00:20:52,160 --> 00:20:54,799 had been dumped by Swan-Miller 346 00:20:54,800 --> 00:20:57,760 in the hallway of the hospital, and just left. 347 00:20:59,440 --> 00:21:00,680 Just to die, really. 348 00:21:02,040 --> 00:21:04,719 The people in the hospital had actually said 349 00:21:04,720 --> 00:21:08,759 that they'd found this girl on a trolley in the hallway 350 00:21:08,760 --> 00:21:13,119 where she'd been seen whoever had rushed off 351 00:21:13,120 --> 00:21:14,480 and just left her there 352 00:21:15,280 --> 00:21:17,639 And then about five days into 353 00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:20,799 my auntie being on an intensive care ward, 354 00:21:20,800 --> 00:21:23,239 Swan-Miller tells them to turn the machine off. 355 00:21:32,240 --> 00:21:34,760 I felt guilty that I couldn't be with her. 356 00:21:35,560 --> 00:21:37,879 The people that were looking for my daughter 357 00:21:37,880 --> 00:21:40,400 didn't know her proper name. 358 00:21:41,240 --> 00:21:42,880 They didn't know she'd got a family. 359 00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:44,560 They knew nothing. 360 00:21:52,200 --> 00:21:54,879 The family say the next thing they're facing 361 00:21:54,880 --> 00:21:57,559 is the fact that they can't retrieve 362 00:21:57,560 --> 00:21:59,600 Natalie's body from the hospital. 363 00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:02,479 Winter Swan-Miller is the next of kin, 364 00:22:02,480 --> 00:22:03,919 she's the wife, 365 00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:08,439 and she hasn't collected the body 366 00:22:08,440 --> 00:22:10,679 or followed any of the processes. 367 00:22:10,680 --> 00:22:13,879 So now the family are not only grieving, 368 00:22:13,880 --> 00:22:15,959 they're also having to deal with a situation 369 00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:20,079 where they're facing unnecessary red tape and barriers. 370 00:22:22,520 --> 00:22:24,919 And it come to the point where my mum and me 371 00:22:24,920 --> 00:22:26,679 and Auntie Natalie’s father 372 00:22:26,680 --> 00:22:28,999 had to agree to pay for the whole funeral costs 373 00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:30,599 for them to release the body to us, 374 00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:32,359 and it was a period of about three weeks 375 00:22:32,360 --> 00:22:34,560 before we could even get her in the chapel of rest. 376 00:22:39,880 --> 00:22:41,279 So we had the funeral, 377 00:22:41,280 --> 00:22:43,599 we tried to invite Swan-Miller. 378 00:22:43,600 --> 00:22:46,199 She didn't want nothing to do with the funeral at all 379 00:22:46,200 --> 00:22:47,959 for some reason. 380 00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:50,319 She was avoiding all conversations, all phone calls. 381 00:22:50,320 --> 00:22:52,999 Didn't want to give us any of Nat's belongings at all. 382 00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:54,399 Nothing. 383 00:22:54,400 --> 00:22:58,359 There was definitely two different versions of events 384 00:22:58,360 --> 00:23:02,399 that Swan-Miller had told us regarding my auntie's passing. 385 00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:06,799 One of them was that she was in the garden cutting the grass, 386 00:23:06,800 --> 00:23:08,799 and she fell over and banged her head, 387 00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:11,199 and that's when she took her to hospital. 388 00:23:11,200 --> 00:23:12,559 And the other one was 389 00:23:12,560 --> 00:23:15,639 that she'd gone to sleep with a headache 390 00:23:15,640 --> 00:23:17,519 and just simply not woke up. 391 00:23:21,080 --> 00:23:23,359 There were some irregularities, 392 00:23:23,360 --> 00:23:25,439 shall we say, in the story, 393 00:23:25,440 --> 00:23:30,079 as to how Winter Miller's wife had been deceased. 394 00:23:30,080 --> 00:23:32,279 I'm collecting these notes, and I'm thinking, 395 00:23:32,280 --> 00:23:33,360 well, that's strange. 396 00:23:35,200 --> 00:23:36,479 With that insight, 397 00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:41,160 the mother and the sister challenged the coroner's report. 398 00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:48,039 The coroner, 399 00:23:48,040 --> 00:23:51,680 he says it was a rare bleed to the brain. 400 00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:55,880 I said, "well, how would that have happened?" 401 00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:58,679 He says, "well, we're not quite sure." 402 00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:00,439 I says, "I am." 403 00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:03,239 I says, "I think it's an hit to head, she's had. 404 00:24:03,240 --> 00:24:04,919 I want an inquest." 405 00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:08,400 "No, no, no, no, I'm not willing to perform one." 406 00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:10,480 He says, "at the end of the day, 407 00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:15,439 I've done my job, he says, and I've come to that conclusion, 408 00:24:15,440 --> 00:24:19,079 what happened and all the events that went surrounding it," 409 00:24:19,080 --> 00:24:21,560 he says, "And I'm happy that Natalie died that way." 410 00:24:26,320 --> 00:24:28,599 I understand the Pashley family are not happy 411 00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:32,519 with the coroner's report regarding Natalie's death. 412 00:24:32,520 --> 00:24:35,199 {\an8}But it's not just a question of being unhappy 413 00:24:35,200 --> 00:24:36,999 {\an8}because you think something's happened. 414 00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:40,960 {\an8}You need some solid evidence to change the coroner's view. 415 00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:49,239 When Natalie Pashley's family found out about, you know, 416 00:24:49,240 --> 00:24:52,279 the events that had unfolded with Stuart, 417 00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:56,840 this dossier, it was provided to Hampshire police. 418 00:24:57,880 --> 00:24:59,359 They were outlining abuse. 419 00:24:59,360 --> 00:25:02,399 They were outlining events that had happened. 420 00:25:02,400 --> 00:25:05,039 And they weren't just describing, 421 00:25:05,040 --> 00:25:07,279 there were visual photos. 422 00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:10,199 And I was told unofficially that, um, 423 00:25:10,200 --> 00:25:12,479 don't worry, this isn't the end of it, okay? 424 00:25:12,480 --> 00:25:15,800 There will be, you know, she's going to get re-arrested. 425 00:25:16,680 --> 00:25:19,359 Natalie's family was hoping that 426 00:25:19,360 --> 00:25:22,119 Natalie's story will be told as part of 427 00:25:22,120 --> 00:25:24,959 Winter Swan-Miller's trial, 428 00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:28,680 because they wanted Natalie's voice to be heard. 429 00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:31,959 The Hampshire police were calling my mum, 430 00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:34,639 asking her to be a witness in court. 431 00:25:34,640 --> 00:25:37,119 It was crazy. It was like, after all these years 432 00:25:37,120 --> 00:25:39,279 of putting something to bed, 433 00:25:39,280 --> 00:25:41,919 and having to accept that 434 00:25:41,920 --> 00:25:43,479 there was nothing that was going to happen, 435 00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:46,239 and my auntie had gone and that was it. 436 00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:48,199 And then all of a sudden, 437 00:25:48,200 --> 00:25:50,359 Swan-Miller was right in the forefront 438 00:25:50,360 --> 00:25:51,520 of all of our minds again. 439 00:26:21,120 --> 00:26:22,760 It was held at Winchester Crown Court. 440 00:26:30,600 --> 00:26:34,559 In the public gallery, there were many friends and family 441 00:26:34,560 --> 00:26:36,999 from Stuart Crocker, 442 00:26:37,000 --> 00:26:39,679 with Winter Swan-Miller in the dock 443 00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:41,960 for the murder of Stuart Crocker. 444 00:26:45,520 --> 00:26:48,959 {\an8}I wanted to see who Swan-Miller was in the flesh, 445 00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:50,519 because I wanted her to see 446 00:26:50,520 --> 00:26:53,999 from people that meant something to Stuart 447 00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:57,040 what she had done, especially to Joseph. 448 00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:00,400 I was incredibly anxious. 449 00:27:01,120 --> 00:27:05,880 {\an8}I wanted to hear what had happened in its entirety, 450 00:27:07,040 --> 00:27:09,399 and I wanted to take that burden on 451 00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:11,720 as perhaps some sort of punishment 452 00:27:13,120 --> 00:27:16,240 for not being there as much as I could have been for my dad. 453 00:27:17,800 --> 00:27:20,279 Given the evidence around the TikTok 454 00:27:20,280 --> 00:27:22,759 and forensic evidence, 455 00:27:22,760 --> 00:27:24,519 she had pleaded not guilty. 456 00:27:26,040 --> 00:27:28,519 {\an8}I was sitting inside the courtroom with a laptop. 457 00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:31,359 {\an8}I was reporting it live from the room there, 458 00:27:31,360 --> 00:27:34,239 {\an8}and it goes straight to the Andover Advertiser website, 459 00:27:34,240 --> 00:27:36,479 where people outside can just read 460 00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:38,360 what's happening inside the courtroom. 461 00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:41,959 The first stage of a trial 462 00:27:41,960 --> 00:27:45,240 is for the prosecution to present the case to the jurors. 463 00:27:45,880 --> 00:27:49,279 And the prosecution's case was that Winter Swan-Miller 464 00:27:49,280 --> 00:27:50,799 committed this murder 465 00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:53,399 in like with an intent to kill him, 466 00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:55,599 it was just plain murder. 467 00:28:02,120 --> 00:28:05,679 There were a number of witnesses were called to the courtroom. 468 00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:07,440 The main investigation officer, 469 00:28:08,520 --> 00:28:11,479 her examination and cross-examination 470 00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:13,679 went on for several days. 471 00:28:16,360 --> 00:28:19,519 What was shown in court was the TikTok video, 472 00:28:19,520 --> 00:28:22,719 which we now know to have been filmed at Stuarts flat, 473 00:28:22,720 --> 00:28:24,960 not long after she killed him. 474 00:28:31,080 --> 00:28:32,560 Well, hi guys. 475 00:28:33,480 --> 00:28:36,399 I'm going to be taking a break from TikTok for a bit, 476 00:28:36,400 --> 00:28:37,760 I think because 477 00:28:39,000 --> 00:28:40,959 I've been a bad girl. 478 00:28:40,960 --> 00:28:41,999 Hmm. 479 00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:46,320 I can only explain 480 00:28:48,840 --> 00:28:50,320 when the time comes. 481 00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:55,720 I had to do what I did because 482 00:28:57,120 --> 00:28:57,960 of my 483 00:29:02,360 --> 00:29:03,560 situation. 484 00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:08,200 The video showed her confessing to what she'd done. 485 00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:10,639 She was sat on the sofa 486 00:29:10,640 --> 00:29:14,959 {\an8}and her legs were actually over Stuart's body beneath her. 487 00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:24,239 Pretty horrific scene, by all accounts, inside. 488 00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:26,840 I'll give you my name. I'll give you my location. 489 00:29:28,520 --> 00:29:30,799 The prosecution say this was a calculated act 490 00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:33,119 that she undertook, 491 00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:35,560 and she was seeking that notoriety. 492 00:29:36,960 --> 00:29:40,799 I've never seen this type of admission before 493 00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:45,319 where somebody has committed a brutal act like she has, 494 00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:48,679 and then gone straight online to tell her followers 495 00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:50,039 about what's happened. 496 00:29:53,680 --> 00:29:55,079 It's certainly unusual. 497 00:29:55,080 --> 00:29:58,079 She doesn't look distressed when she's making this post. 498 00:29:58,080 --> 00:30:00,399 In fact, she looks quite pleased with herself, 499 00:30:00,400 --> 00:30:01,840 which is particularly worrying, 500 00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:04,760 but it is really unusual to see. 501 00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:15,799 The prosecution also showed in court 502 00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:20,519 a series of films of Swan-Miller talking into her telephone, 503 00:30:21,720 --> 00:30:23,119 which weren't posted anywhere. 504 00:30:23,120 --> 00:30:24,280 They weren't posted online 505 00:30:25,560 --> 00:30:28,280 saying things like, I killed the 506 00:30:29,320 --> 00:30:31,519 Swan-Miller can be heard saying, 507 00:30:31,520 --> 00:30:34,199 "these are the dogs they steal from me 508 00:30:34,200 --> 00:30:36,280 or tried to steal from me. 509 00:30:37,400 --> 00:30:39,280 I killed the . 510 00:30:40,040 --> 00:30:41,759 And there's another one that says, 511 00:30:41,760 --> 00:30:45,320 "I'm sitting in the same room as the old man that I stabbed." 512 00:30:46,200 --> 00:30:47,959 Powerful words. 513 00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:50,880 She was telling people that she had killed someone. 514 00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:56,079 So this is the other side of the social media persona 515 00:30:56,080 --> 00:30:57,600 of Winter Swan-Miller. 516 00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:01,320 Truly disturbing. 517 00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:08,759 In the court, prosecution also said that, 518 00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:10,799 on the day of the murder, 519 00:31:10,800 --> 00:31:13,199 there were videos of Winter Swan-Miller 520 00:31:13,200 --> 00:31:15,919 going to cashpoints to take money 521 00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:18,440 out of Mr. Crocker's bank card. 522 00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:24,600 We saw CCTV footages of her going to the Tesco. 523 00:31:25,480 --> 00:31:29,199 As she was leaving Andover, she had her luggage with her. 524 00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:30,880 She also had a dog. 525 00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:34,160 Oblivion. 526 00:31:39,520 --> 00:31:42,799 Forensics are called to court, and they give evidence 527 00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:45,679 that says Stuart's blood has been found 528 00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:48,479 on things owned by Winter Swan-Miller, 529 00:31:48,480 --> 00:31:51,199 such as her watch and her jewellery. 530 00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:58,399 The jurors were also told about a Louis Vuitton bag 531 00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:00,720 that Winter Swan-Miller had. 532 00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:05,959 There was DNA evidence on the strap, 533 00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:08,840 showing that she used to strangle him. 534 00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:12,200 That's pretty damning. 535 00:32:16,080 --> 00:32:18,519 So, the next thing presented to the court 536 00:32:18,520 --> 00:32:20,719 is that Swan-Miller's DNA 537 00:32:20,720 --> 00:32:23,879 has been found under Stuart's fingernails 538 00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:25,599 and in his underwear. 539 00:32:29,200 --> 00:32:32,119 There was also DNA of a sexual nature, 540 00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:35,959 which proved that they were engaged in a sexual act 541 00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:37,519 just before the incident. 542 00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:45,719 After the prosecution completed their case, 543 00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:48,159 it was the turn of the defence counsel 544 00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:50,799 to present Winter Swan-Miller's case, 545 00:32:50,800 --> 00:32:53,479 explaining this was not a murder, 546 00:32:53,480 --> 00:32:55,639 this was a manslaughter. 547 00:32:58,440 --> 00:32:59,719 When I sit as a magistrate 548 00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:02,799 where you sit as a judge and jury, 549 00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:04,679 you would listen to the prosecution case. 550 00:33:04,680 --> 00:33:06,520 That's what was always presented first. 551 00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:10,679 And you'd be, 552 00:33:10,680 --> 00:33:12,519 "oh, for God's sake, what are we doing here? 553 00:33:12,520 --> 00:33:14,199 They're so obviously guilty. 554 00:33:14,200 --> 00:33:15,440 What a waste of time." 555 00:33:16,120 --> 00:33:18,079 Then the defence would stand up. 556 00:33:18,080 --> 00:33:20,479 So it's definitely a game of two halves. 557 00:33:23,440 --> 00:33:25,959 So the defence said 558 00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:30,999 that Winter Swan-Miller had acted in self-defence, 559 00:33:31,000 --> 00:33:33,480 that Stuart had raped her. 560 00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:39,320 She had grabbed a knife and stabbed him in fear. 561 00:33:41,400 --> 00:33:44,919 Her argument was that she was the vulnerable victim 562 00:33:44,920 --> 00:33:48,720 and Stuart Crocker was the abuser and the manipulator. 563 00:33:52,560 --> 00:33:56,479 And this last moment was, she'd had enough, 564 00:33:56,480 --> 00:33:57,600 so she killed him. 565 00:33:58,960 --> 00:34:01,399 They said that from the evidence, 566 00:34:01,400 --> 00:34:03,559 the forensic could not prove that 567 00:34:03,560 --> 00:34:06,199 the sexual act was consensual 568 00:34:06,200 --> 00:34:07,880 or was it a sexual assault? 569 00:34:09,400 --> 00:34:13,479 The defence also said the number of stab wounds 570 00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:16,559 show that it was an act in panic, 571 00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:19,880 rather than a premeditated murder attempt. 572 00:34:26,000 --> 00:34:28,279 We followed the trial on social media, 573 00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:29,959 Swan-Miller was saying, 574 00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:32,319 Stuart Crocker raped her. 575 00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:34,480 All sorts of stuff, she'd come up with. 576 00:34:35,880 --> 00:34:38,120 It felt like the jury were believing her. 577 00:34:38,640 --> 00:34:40,079 I thought, oh, please, no. 578 00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:42,519 Just don't let her get away with this. 579 00:34:44,200 --> 00:34:46,319 After the accusations, 580 00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:49,559 Swan-Miller was fighting for her life. 581 00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:50,479 {\an8}I was worried 582 00:34:50,480 --> 00:34:55,719 {\an8}that people might fall for the victim statements 583 00:34:55,720 --> 00:34:56,720 she was giving out. 584 00:34:58,120 --> 00:34:59,439 She was intimating that 585 00:34:59,440 --> 00:35:01,559 something bad had happened to her. 586 00:35:01,560 --> 00:35:04,319 Imagine Stuart's family, his son. 587 00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:06,120 His ex-wife. 588 00:35:08,080 --> 00:35:10,200 What if this goes the wrong way? 589 00:35:11,000 --> 00:35:13,919 So that was a concern to me, the family, 590 00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:15,879 and probably to the police as well. 591 00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:20,119 We learned during the trial 592 00:35:20,120 --> 00:35:24,119 all these rapes and things that she kept saying would happened. 593 00:35:24,120 --> 00:35:26,039 None of them were ever confirmed. 594 00:35:26,040 --> 00:35:28,440 None of it was ever reported to the police. 595 00:35:29,840 --> 00:35:31,360 Knowing my relationship with Stuart, 596 00:35:32,600 --> 00:35:36,440 I can say hand on heart, no way would Stuart rape anyone. 597 00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:43,399 It's a really tricky position to be in 598 00:35:43,400 --> 00:35:45,079 as a prosecution team, 599 00:35:45,080 --> 00:35:47,799 {\an8}to try and disprove that that had happened, 600 00:35:47,800 --> 00:35:50,959 {\an8}particularly when it's one person's word against another 601 00:35:50,960 --> 00:35:53,440 and the other person is no longer with us. 602 00:35:55,520 --> 00:35:56,759 ... Second defence strategy 603 00:35:56,760 --> 00:35:58,240 was loss of control. 604 00:35:59,160 --> 00:36:04,239 Her argument was a fear for the fate of her dog 605 00:36:04,240 --> 00:36:06,239 as the trigger for loss of control. 606 00:36:06,240 --> 00:36:09,879 And if the jury accept that, 607 00:36:09,880 --> 00:36:11,119 it wouldn't have been an acquittal, 608 00:36:11,120 --> 00:36:13,519 but it would have been a downgrade from murder 609 00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:16,039 to voluntary manslaughter as the charge. 610 00:36:20,520 --> 00:36:23,840 So Swan-Miller's claims about the dog having been kidnapped 611 00:36:24,600 --> 00:36:27,160 on first sight looks sort of mad. 612 00:36:27,720 --> 00:36:31,119 Um, but you've got to remember that 613 00:36:31,120 --> 00:36:33,479 in the state and in the place 614 00:36:33,480 --> 00:36:35,999 that drugs can put an individual, 615 00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:38,039 people can become very paranoid. 616 00:36:41,520 --> 00:36:44,759 It turns out that Oblivion had escaped from the flat 617 00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:46,439 and was returned by a neighbour, 618 00:36:46,440 --> 00:36:48,399 but in her mind, this was the trigger 619 00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:51,040 for her attacking and murdering Stuart. 620 00:36:51,720 --> 00:36:54,719 The third defence strategy was diminished responsibility. 621 00:36:54,720 --> 00:36:57,719 Now this is, um, due to insanity 622 00:36:57,720 --> 00:37:00,799 or intoxication or all of the above. 623 00:37:03,160 --> 00:37:06,919 The jurors heard that she had a, 624 00:37:06,920 --> 00:37:08,839 like a difficult childhood. 625 00:37:08,840 --> 00:37:14,119 It was only seven months since the death of her mother, 626 00:37:14,120 --> 00:37:15,439 Blair Swan-Miller. 627 00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:20,879 She died due to overuse of prescribed drugs, 628 00:37:20,880 --> 00:37:24,799 which led to respiratory depression. 629 00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:28,399 So there was a lot of, um, mental health issues 630 00:37:28,400 --> 00:37:31,839 was going through, uh, her life during this time. 631 00:37:31,840 --> 00:37:34,159 So considering these factors, 632 00:37:34,160 --> 00:37:38,039 defence, uh, try to make it a point 633 00:37:38,040 --> 00:37:42,040 that she had a diminished responsibility in this incident. 634 00:37:45,440 --> 00:37:47,439 It was like a tennis game. 635 00:37:47,440 --> 00:37:49,879 The prosecution would present an evidence 636 00:37:49,880 --> 00:37:53,319 and then the defence would try to strike that down. 637 00:37:53,320 --> 00:37:56,119 I think the biggest thing for me that I found out 638 00:37:56,120 --> 00:37:58,279 when I went to court 639 00:37:58,280 --> 00:38:01,399 was the finer details of Winter 640 00:38:01,400 --> 00:38:04,479 and my dad's encounters together. 641 00:38:04,480 --> 00:38:07,960 Hearing about how she had control of his bank accounts, 642 00:38:08,880 --> 00:38:12,879 she would decide who he could call or text, 643 00:38:12,880 --> 00:38:16,839 how she would make him pay for alcohol and drugs, 644 00:38:16,840 --> 00:38:21,279 and the exploits she had with other men 645 00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:22,759 behind my dad's back. 646 00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:26,240 Hearing her defence was disgusting. 647 00:38:35,720 --> 00:38:40,559 After 12 weeks, we hear closing arguments, 648 00:38:40,560 --> 00:38:43,719 and we hear from her defence 649 00:38:43,720 --> 00:38:46,439 that she's not a monster, 650 00:38:46,440 --> 00:38:48,520 but she is a tragic figure. 651 00:38:49,600 --> 00:38:51,999 If I was the SIO, I'd be quite nervous, 652 00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:53,040 I think, in that trial. 653 00:38:53,560 --> 00:38:56,679 I normally go to trials very confident, thinking, 654 00:38:56,680 --> 00:38:58,279 we've got our person. 655 00:38:58,280 --> 00:39:00,119 The jury are going to see through all this. 656 00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:03,599 But for me, it just yeah, it was one of those ones 657 00:39:03,600 --> 00:39:05,000 that it could have gone either way. 658 00:39:06,000 --> 00:39:07,839 The jury has sent out. 659 00:39:07,840 --> 00:39:11,199 this starts three days of deliberation, 660 00:39:11,200 --> 00:39:13,279 ten hours of discussion 661 00:39:13,280 --> 00:39:16,000 until they finally come back with their verdict. 662 00:39:24,240 --> 00:39:27,120 Then the court's back in session. 663 00:39:31,720 --> 00:39:33,239 I sat down, 664 00:39:33,240 --> 00:39:35,280 mum was holding my hand tightly. 665 00:39:38,000 --> 00:39:39,760 There was loads of people there that day. 666 00:39:41,560 --> 00:39:45,679 And the jury are asked if they have come to their verdict. 667 00:39:45,680 --> 00:39:47,240 They've made their decision. 668 00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:53,879 It's guilty and unanimous. 669 00:39:59,680 --> 00:40:01,359 And as soon as the guilty verdict came up, 670 00:40:01,360 --> 00:40:03,640 I air punched and went, "Yes!" 671 00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:07,719 The judge issued the sentence, 672 00:40:07,720 --> 00:40:12,599 which was 23 years for the murder of Mr. Stuart Crocker. 673 00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:17,320 We were all ecstatic upon hearing it and 674 00:40:18,600 --> 00:40:20,199 seeing her shake her head 675 00:40:21,840 --> 00:40:24,240 at the fact that she's getting her sentence. 676 00:40:26,240 --> 00:40:31,880 I think Swan-Miller thought it was all going to go her way. 677 00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:36,079 Just relief that she didn't get away with it 678 00:40:36,080 --> 00:40:38,440 on some sort of made up, you know, stories. 679 00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:42,599 Thank God, 23 years, yes. 680 00:40:42,600 --> 00:40:44,639 Should have been 123 years. 681 00:40:44,640 --> 00:40:45,679 That's what it should have been. 682 00:40:48,440 --> 00:40:51,199 My mum, she was meant to be a witness for court, 683 00:40:51,200 --> 00:40:53,559 for Swan-Miller's trial, 684 00:40:53,560 --> 00:40:56,880 but they never called her up in the end for some reason. 685 00:40:57,800 --> 00:41:00,119 And so she was very disappointed by the end of it, 686 00:41:00,120 --> 00:41:01,639 when they hadn't got hold of her, 687 00:41:01,640 --> 00:41:03,799 and didn't invite her down to court. 688 00:41:08,760 --> 00:41:10,919 Natalie's family were probably hoping that 689 00:41:10,920 --> 00:41:13,799 it would come up as a potential, you know, 690 00:41:13,800 --> 00:41:16,719 is there anything suspicious here that happened here? 691 00:41:16,720 --> 00:41:19,799 Maybe they could, could get that looked at 692 00:41:19,800 --> 00:41:21,319 and investigated again. 693 00:41:21,320 --> 00:41:25,799 However, the murder trial was solely on Stuart Crocker 694 00:41:25,800 --> 00:41:27,479 and what's happened to him. 695 00:41:29,880 --> 00:41:32,639 It's difficult to really understand why 696 00:41:32,640 --> 00:41:36,639 Swan-Miller did what she did to Stuart on that particular day, 697 00:41:36,640 --> 00:41:39,239 but what I can take from that crime scene 698 00:41:39,240 --> 00:41:41,959 is this was a particularly personal attack 699 00:41:41,960 --> 00:41:43,680 and particularly vicious. 700 00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:47,279 She used him for money. 701 00:41:47,280 --> 00:41:49,879 She used him for shelter, 702 00:41:49,880 --> 00:41:53,119 and may have used him for sex as well, 703 00:41:53,120 --> 00:41:56,319 and for some reason or another, something happened 704 00:41:56,320 --> 00:41:59,159 where she decided she no longer needed him, 705 00:41:59,160 --> 00:42:01,080 and she carried out this vicious attack on him. 706 00:42:10,120 --> 00:42:15,119 Winter Swan-Miller, she'll be out in 2047. 707 00:42:15,120 --> 00:42:17,319 She'll be out when she's 59. 708 00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:23,279 Why did Winter Swan-Miller kill Stuart Crocker? 709 00:42:23,280 --> 00:42:27,199 Was her brain addled by all the class A drugs? 710 00:42:27,200 --> 00:42:29,999 Was it the fact that he had let her dog out, 711 00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:34,039 or was she doing it for fame for the influencer? 712 00:42:35,320 --> 00:42:38,639 I guess we'll never know, really. 713 00:42:41,040 --> 00:42:43,919 My main concern when I look back on this 714 00:42:43,920 --> 00:42:48,000 is that there were so many warning markers missed, 715 00:42:49,040 --> 00:42:51,359 I felt helplessness that Stuart had died. 716 00:42:51,360 --> 00:42:53,120 I feel it could have been prevented. 717 00:42:53,680 --> 00:42:55,039 This is a fallen comrade. 718 00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:56,200 This is a friend. 719 00:42:56,840 --> 00:42:59,039 Um, this is someone that 720 00:42:59,040 --> 00:43:01,520 nobody really was wanting to stand up for. 721 00:43:02,120 --> 00:43:04,520 Uh, you know, he'd lost his way a little bit. 722 00:43:05,640 --> 00:43:09,799 I would like Stuart to be remembered as a kind person. 723 00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:14,480 He was a good soldier, and he served his country well. 724 00:43:34,360 --> 00:43:36,119 I love the memories of me 725 00:43:36,120 --> 00:43:37,520 being able to cook him dinner. 726 00:43:38,480 --> 00:43:42,359 I love the memories of him pestering me on the phone 727 00:43:42,360 --> 00:43:45,240 for hours on end, even when I didn't want to be bothered. 728 00:43:46,240 --> 00:43:49,040 I love the memories we did have. 729 00:43:50,240 --> 00:43:51,240 The good memories. 730 00:44:00,800 --> 00:44:04,439 So this is my dad, Stuart. 731 00:44:04,440 --> 00:44:07,720 Uh, we plan to take him towards Scotland, 732 00:44:08,560 --> 00:44:12,359 where we're hoping to spread his ashes over a loch 733 00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:14,560 to honour his wishes. 734 00:44:16,320 --> 00:44:17,880 I'm not sure how I feel. 735 00:44:18,760 --> 00:44:22,519 It feels weird to hold your dad 736 00:44:22,520 --> 00:44:26,199 in two hands like this, I suppose, 737 00:44:26,200 --> 00:44:30,760 but I can take some joy in the fact that 738 00:44:31,800 --> 00:44:33,600 I've still got him close to me. 57697

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