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Morris: Its birth...
serendipitous.
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00:00:04,838 --> 00:00:09,710
Its life...
shrouded in mystery.
3
00:00:09,743 --> 00:00:12,146
Understood by few...
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00:00:16,584 --> 00:00:19,120
...feared by many.
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He ate him? He literally
cut him up and ate him?
6
00:00:21,222 --> 00:00:24,058
Yeah.
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Morris: I've been fascinated
by psychoactive drugs
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00:00:26,460 --> 00:00:28,229
my whole life.
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00:00:28,262 --> 00:00:32,466
I love to study their chemistry
and impact on society,
10
00:00:32,500 --> 00:00:34,802
and my work has allowed me
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00:00:34,835 --> 00:00:38,172
to investigate extraordinary
substances around the world.
12
00:00:38,206 --> 00:00:41,442
Yet there are still
mysteries that remain.
13
00:00:44,178 --> 00:00:45,513
PCP's something like
an alternate reality.
14
00:00:45,546 --> 00:00:46,814
You see something.
15
00:00:46,847 --> 00:00:48,382
It's like knowledge.
You can see something.
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00:00:48,416 --> 00:00:50,484
And once you see that,
you can't never go back.
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00:00:50,518 --> 00:00:56,190
This is PCP...as you've
never seen it before.
18
00:00:58,359 --> 00:01:01,795
**
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00:01:21,915 --> 00:01:26,620
I'm in New Mexico to visit
the home of Timothy Wyllie...
20
00:01:26,654 --> 00:01:28,456
Hey. Great to meet you.
-Great to see you.
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00:01:28,489 --> 00:01:32,526
Yeah. Welcome to the, uh,
to the shack. Yes.
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Morris: ...a spiritualist
and founding member
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00:01:35,196 --> 00:01:36,830
of The Process Church,
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who used PCP
to inspire his artwork
25
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and the mythology in which
the Garden of Eden serpent
26
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is revealed to be
an ancient race
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00:01:45,439 --> 00:01:48,176
of space gypsy philosophers.
28
00:01:50,178 --> 00:01:52,313
I had taken
some PCP think--
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thinking about the Adam
and Eve myth.
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I said, "What do we know
about Adam and Eve?
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Who the hell
is the serpent, you know?"
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00:02:00,321 --> 00:02:03,491
And my pen
started working.
33
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And so each of the pages
I did using PCP.
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You tune in, and you can
feel the undertow,
35
00:02:12,433 --> 00:02:15,503
what's going on underneath,
this reality,
36
00:02:15,536 --> 00:02:19,640
which is just, like,
a heartbeat away.
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00:02:19,673 --> 00:02:23,177
When I first came
across PCP,
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00:02:23,211 --> 00:02:26,247
that would have been
probably in the mid...
39
00:02:26,280 --> 00:02:28,449
No, the early '80s,
I would say.
40
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I thought immediately,
this --
41
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this is something
very different.
42
00:02:31,385 --> 00:02:32,686
I mean, I'd had experience
with acid, you know,
43
00:02:32,720 --> 00:02:33,921
with all of that.
44
00:02:33,954 --> 00:02:37,958
All the standard,
um, entheogens.
45
00:02:37,991 --> 00:02:39,593
But this is something
very strange.
46
00:02:39,627 --> 00:02:41,729
This is something different
because with --
47
00:02:41,762 --> 00:02:45,433
with your normal
entheogen, um, it --
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00:02:45,466 --> 00:02:46,767
in a sense,
you can feel your body,
49
00:02:46,800 --> 00:02:48,369
and you can leave
your body, right?
50
00:02:48,402 --> 00:02:51,605
You're somewhere else.
51
00:02:51,639 --> 00:02:53,607
With this
particular molecule,
52
00:02:53,641 --> 00:02:55,309
the sense I get
is you go up.
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00:02:55,343 --> 00:02:58,379
You take the --
you take it with you.
54
00:02:58,412 --> 00:03:01,449
Morris: Dissociative anesthetics
are a chemically diverse class
55
00:03:01,482 --> 00:03:04,418
that share an ability
to disconnect the user's body
56
00:03:04,452 --> 00:03:05,953
from their mind.
57
00:03:05,986 --> 00:03:10,324
In 1956, the chemist
Vic Maddox
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00:03:10,358 --> 00:03:12,626
serendipitously
discovered PCP,
59
00:03:12,660 --> 00:03:13,961
and, one year later,
the drug was being tested
60
00:03:13,994 --> 00:03:17,431
as an anesthetic
in human surgeries.
61
00:03:17,465 --> 00:03:20,634
But dissociative effects limited
its clinical application,
62
00:03:20,668 --> 00:03:22,303
and it soon found a home
63
00:03:22,336 --> 00:03:25,339
with non-medical users
on the street.
64
00:03:25,373 --> 00:03:28,609
When you smoke it, everything
goes into symmetrical patterns.
65
00:03:28,642 --> 00:03:30,344
It's like gears will...
66
00:03:30,378 --> 00:03:33,013
Like, gears come
together like this.
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00:03:33,046 --> 00:03:35,449
You -- you understand
the gear wheels.
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00:03:35,483 --> 00:03:38,586
Morris: And those people used
the drug to explore
69
00:03:38,619 --> 00:03:43,291
strange realms of the mind that
are otherwise inaccessible.
70
00:03:43,324 --> 00:03:44,725
When did you first decide
that you wanted
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00:03:44,758 --> 00:03:46,860
to smoke PCP and
interact with dolphins?
72
00:03:46,894 --> 00:03:49,363
What was the motivation
for doing that?
73
00:03:49,397 --> 00:03:53,834
I'd always been interested
in dolphin intelligence.
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00:03:53,867 --> 00:03:55,703
Using PCP,
especially with,
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00:03:55,736 --> 00:03:59,607
uh, dolphins,
was just wonderful.
76
00:03:59,640 --> 00:04:01,542
Um, you can just
go straight into,
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00:04:01,575 --> 00:04:03,377
you know,
communication with them.
78
00:04:03,411 --> 00:04:04,878
How would that manifest?
79
00:04:04,912 --> 00:04:07,047
What would be an --
an example?
80
00:04:07,080 --> 00:04:09,683
One of the questions I --
telepathic questions
81
00:04:09,717 --> 00:04:12,353
I had asked was,
82
00:04:12,386 --> 00:04:15,556
how do you convey information
down through time?
83
00:04:15,589 --> 00:04:17,758
How do you store
information?
84
00:04:17,791 --> 00:04:21,562
And I was out, um,
about waist-deep one time.
85
00:04:21,595 --> 00:04:23,297
There was a dolphin
kind of swimming out
86
00:04:23,331 --> 00:04:24,898
about 10 or 15 feet away.
87
00:04:24,932 --> 00:04:28,836
And I had the impulse
to pick up a sand dollar.
88
00:04:28,869 --> 00:04:30,671
And when I looked
at the sand dollar,
89
00:04:30,704 --> 00:04:35,676
the impression
that came was
90
00:04:35,709 --> 00:04:37,745
that these sand dollars
91
00:04:37,778 --> 00:04:41,849
are information
storage devices.
92
00:04:41,882 --> 00:04:45,619
In other words,
dolphin can project,
93
00:04:45,653 --> 00:04:47,455
uh, 'cause they --
94
00:04:47,488 --> 00:04:50,391
they use sound
to project images.
95
00:04:50,424 --> 00:04:52,460
They project
that image onto that
96
00:04:52,493 --> 00:04:54,795
and it stays within,
right?
97
00:04:54,828 --> 00:04:59,032
'Cause when shells grow,
they grow, um, holographically,
98
00:04:59,066 --> 00:05:01,034
if you know
what I mean.
99
00:05:01,068 --> 00:05:04,338
Um...
-I don't know.
100
00:05:04,372 --> 00:05:06,374
It's a really interesting idea.
-Well, the shell will --
101
00:05:06,407 --> 00:05:09,343
will retain this information
as it grows.
102
00:05:09,377 --> 00:05:11,879
So another dolphin
will come along later,
103
00:05:11,912 --> 00:05:15,683
will ping that
with the same, uh, frequency,
104
00:05:15,716 --> 00:05:17,017
and they will receive
the information
105
00:05:17,050 --> 00:05:18,619
stored in the shell.
106
00:05:18,652 --> 00:05:19,753
So this was something --
107
00:05:19,787 --> 00:05:21,489
this was a realization
that you had?
108
00:05:21,522 --> 00:05:22,856
This was.
Yes.
109
00:05:22,890 --> 00:05:24,124
You were on PCP,
110
00:05:24,157 --> 00:05:25,593
you picked up
a sand dollar,
111
00:05:25,626 --> 00:05:27,528
and you understood
its significance
112
00:05:27,561 --> 00:05:28,996
in recording information
for dolphins.
113
00:05:29,029 --> 00:05:31,499
I was -- I was
in this telepathic bond
114
00:05:31,532 --> 00:05:34,535
with the dolphins
while this was happening.
115
00:05:34,568 --> 00:05:36,970
Wow.
Wow.
116
00:05:37,004 --> 00:05:39,907
That's an amazing story.
117
00:05:42,075 --> 00:05:45,746
Morris: Timothy is about
to snort PCP hydrochloride,
118
00:05:45,779 --> 00:05:48,416
and I'm hoping to learn more
about the qualitative effects
119
00:05:48,449 --> 00:05:51,619
of the drug as he dissociates.
120
00:05:54,588 --> 00:05:57,124
Well, I always -- I always like
to say a little blessing.
121
00:05:57,157 --> 00:05:58,792
A blessing to our trip.
122
00:05:58,826 --> 00:06:01,562
Thank you very much,
123
00:06:01,595 --> 00:06:03,997
and thank you, molecule.
124
00:06:04,031 --> 00:06:06,700
May we have a --
a wonderful time together.
125
00:06:14,141 --> 00:06:15,576
Okay.
Be careful.
126
00:06:15,609 --> 00:06:16,810
Just one more.
Just one more.
127
00:06:16,844 --> 00:06:18,479
I mean, it's up to you,
of course.
128
00:06:18,512 --> 00:06:20,414
But I'm amazed that
you can tolerate this much.
129
00:06:20,448 --> 00:06:21,849
I just would hate --
I would feel bad
130
00:06:21,882 --> 00:06:24,852
if you were to feel, uh...
Okay, okay, okay.
131
00:06:24,885 --> 00:06:26,620
We're all responsible
for ourselves.
132
00:06:26,654 --> 00:06:28,456
-Okay.
-Don't you lay that on me.
133
00:06:31,725 --> 00:06:33,961
Can you feel
the effect of it now?
134
00:06:33,994 --> 00:06:36,029
-No. Mnh-mnh.
-Really? No effect?
135
00:06:36,063 --> 00:06:38,499
-Not now.
-Wow.
136
00:06:38,532 --> 00:06:40,934
Amazing.
137
00:06:52,613 --> 00:06:55,015
Let's see where
that gets us.
138
00:06:58,185 --> 00:07:01,121
Let's have a look
at how this particular
139
00:07:01,154 --> 00:07:04,792
substance,
um, affects.
140
00:07:04,825 --> 00:07:07,127
I guess this is
performance art.
141
00:07:07,160 --> 00:07:10,063
But I have nothing
to perform.
142
00:07:10,097 --> 00:07:12,766
It's such a personal,
private thing.
143
00:07:12,800 --> 00:07:14,502
You know, when I do
something like that,
144
00:07:14,535 --> 00:07:17,004
you know...or that.
145
00:07:17,037 --> 00:07:19,673
Well, in for a penny,
in for a pound, I guess.
146
00:07:19,707 --> 00:07:21,542
I don't know
what I'm doing.
147
00:07:28,949 --> 00:07:30,584
I can feel it.
148
00:07:30,618 --> 00:07:32,085
-You feel something now?
-Yeah.
149
00:07:32,119 --> 00:07:35,623
A lightness of spirit.
-I'm glad you're feeling it.
150
00:07:35,656 --> 00:07:36,857
I was about to say...
-No. I'm --
151
00:07:36,890 --> 00:07:39,026
I'm starting
to get a little buzzed.
152
00:07:39,059 --> 00:07:43,030
My -- my limbs are much
more plastic, uh, than normal.
153
00:07:43,063 --> 00:07:45,065
I feel more like this.
154
00:07:45,098 --> 00:07:46,900
The extraordinary thing
about this substance
155
00:07:46,934 --> 00:07:50,938
is how it completely
gets rid of any pain.
156
00:07:50,971 --> 00:07:53,574
Oh, yeah.
157
00:07:53,607 --> 00:07:55,108
Wallach:
There's some similarities
158
00:07:55,142 --> 00:07:56,610
with some other drugs,
159
00:07:56,644 --> 00:07:57,811
but there's no question
that PCP induces
160
00:07:57,845 --> 00:07:59,847
a unique altered state.
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00:07:59,880 --> 00:08:02,750
Morris: To gain further
insight into PCP,
162
00:08:02,783 --> 00:08:06,286
I visited my friend
Jason Wallach,
163
00:08:06,319 --> 00:08:08,956
an expert on the chemistry
of dissociative anesthetics.
164
00:08:08,989 --> 00:08:12,192
Jason has synthesized
over 100 PCP derivatives
165
00:08:12,225 --> 00:08:15,228
and studied their pharmacology.
166
00:08:15,262 --> 00:08:18,165
PCP,
scientifically speaking,
167
00:08:18,198 --> 00:08:20,934
is, um, phencyclidine,
168
00:08:20,968 --> 00:08:23,170
uh, which is
a single chemical.
169
00:08:23,203 --> 00:08:25,906
It is completely
synthetic and man-made.
170
00:08:25,939 --> 00:08:28,175
To this date, it's never
been found in nature,
171
00:08:28,208 --> 00:08:30,644
nor have, um,
even derivatives of it.
172
00:08:30,678 --> 00:08:33,046
Victor Maddox, who was actually
doing research into
173
00:08:33,080 --> 00:08:35,983
completely unrelated compounds
pharmacologically,
174
00:08:36,016 --> 00:08:38,185
he was looking
for opioid analgesics.
175
00:08:38,218 --> 00:08:39,753
Painkillers.
176
00:08:39,787 --> 00:08:41,254
And when he was performing
one of the reactions,
177
00:08:41,288 --> 00:08:43,256
he noticed that it
produced a product
178
00:08:43,290 --> 00:08:45,926
that was different
from what he expected.
179
00:08:45,959 --> 00:08:48,061
And when he did, he did
some follow-up experiments,
180
00:08:48,095 --> 00:08:51,665
one of those
of which produced PCP.
181
00:08:51,699 --> 00:08:56,036
Dissociative drugs all bind
to the NMDA receptor.
182
00:08:56,069 --> 00:08:57,304
It's expressed throughout
183
00:08:57,337 --> 00:08:59,206
the entire central
nervous system
184
00:08:59,239 --> 00:09:01,208
and it plays
a number of roles,
185
00:09:01,241 --> 00:09:05,646
particularly in sensory
processing, learning, memory.
186
00:09:05,679 --> 00:09:08,115
So what these drugs
do is block
187
00:09:08,148 --> 00:09:10,818
this normal signaling
pathway in the brain.
188
00:09:10,851 --> 00:09:13,787
Uh, phencyclidine
is the active component.
189
00:09:13,821 --> 00:09:16,223
It's definitely
the psychoactive drug
190
00:09:16,256 --> 00:09:18,692
that's causing
the desirable effects.
191
00:09:21,228 --> 00:09:23,964
-How are you feeling?
-I feel like sitting down.
192
00:09:23,997 --> 00:09:25,833
Yeah?
Let's sit down.
193
00:09:30,070 --> 00:09:33,106
Yes, that last one
popped me over the edge.
194
00:09:33,140 --> 00:09:34,808
I mean,
the fact that I feel,
195
00:09:34,842 --> 00:09:37,978
and I suspect you feel part
of the land right now.
196
00:09:38,011 --> 00:09:39,212
Yeah.
197
00:09:39,246 --> 00:09:42,015
I feel I'm growing
out of the land.
198
00:09:42,049 --> 00:09:45,318
But it's such
a subjective sense.
199
00:09:45,352 --> 00:09:47,320
It's powerful,
200
00:09:47,354 --> 00:09:52,392
but it, you know,
it's not transferable.
201
00:09:52,425 --> 00:09:55,963
I mean, speaking personally,
for me,
202
00:09:55,996 --> 00:10:00,634
these substances are,
um...are internal substances.
203
00:10:00,668 --> 00:10:03,103
You know, they're --
they're something
204
00:10:03,136 --> 00:10:04,805
that happens inside.
205
00:10:04,838 --> 00:10:07,374
Morris: What do you think
would happen to society
206
00:10:07,407 --> 00:10:10,844
if dissociatives
never were discovered?
207
00:10:10,878 --> 00:10:13,013
I don't know.
208
00:10:13,046 --> 00:10:16,216
PCP was an accident,
you know?
209
00:10:16,249 --> 00:10:17,751
It wasn't...
210
00:10:17,785 --> 00:10:20,654
Well, what is
an accident, you see?
211
00:10:20,688 --> 00:10:22,089
I mean,
an accident is some --
212
00:10:22,122 --> 00:10:25,025
is simply something
that happens
213
00:10:25,058 --> 00:10:27,761
that people don't understand
the causation.
214
00:10:27,795 --> 00:10:29,162
Yeah.
215
00:10:32,032 --> 00:10:34,234
Everything happens
intentionally.
216
00:10:39,740 --> 00:10:40,908
Yeah.
217
00:10:40,941 --> 00:10:42,743
Morris:
Timothy is a rare example
218
00:10:42,776 --> 00:10:45,746
of an outspoken PCP proponent,
219
00:10:45,779 --> 00:10:47,047
someone who's used the drug
220
00:10:47,080 --> 00:10:50,150
to inspire his artwork
and philosophy.
221
00:10:50,183 --> 00:10:52,085
But stories such as Timothy's
222
00:10:52,119 --> 00:10:54,922
are seldom depicted in the news.
223
00:11:14,007 --> 00:11:18,078
Morris: PCP is more commonly
associated with cannibalism
224
00:11:18,111 --> 00:11:20,981
and superhuman strength
225
00:11:21,014 --> 00:11:24,251
than medicine
and mind expansion,
226
00:11:24,284 --> 00:11:26,887
the unsurprising result
of 50 years
227
00:11:26,920 --> 00:11:28,956
of PCP scare stories
228
00:11:28,989 --> 00:11:31,024
and other negative reporting.
229
00:11:31,058 --> 00:11:33,861
Man:
It definitely can kill people.
230
00:11:36,229 --> 00:11:38,932
Morris: So I went to visit
David E. Smith,
231
00:11:38,966 --> 00:11:41,234
a doctor who witnessed PCP use
232
00:11:41,268 --> 00:11:43,070
on the streets
of San Francisco
233
00:11:43,103 --> 00:11:46,974
long before the drug
became a media sensation.
234
00:11:49,142 --> 00:11:51,912
Morris: PCP is this
misunderstood drug,
235
00:11:51,945 --> 00:11:54,381
and it seems as if
it's almost always been
236
00:11:54,414 --> 00:11:55,983
a misunderstood drug.
237
00:11:56,016 --> 00:11:58,385
We were really the first
to identify it
238
00:11:58,418 --> 00:12:00,353
because all the new drugs
239
00:12:00,387 --> 00:12:04,124
came out here
in the Haight-Ashbury.
240
00:12:04,157 --> 00:12:07,060
In the Panhandle,
they had this big concert.
241
00:12:07,094 --> 00:12:08,962
Uh, about 1967,
242
00:12:08,996 --> 00:12:11,464
and they threw out
these capsules,
243
00:12:11,498 --> 00:12:13,333
and people
would take 'em.
244
00:12:13,366 --> 00:12:15,936
But we found,
when the individuals
245
00:12:15,969 --> 00:12:17,404
started
having a bad trip,
246
00:12:17,437 --> 00:12:20,407
they weren't bad trips
like LSD.
247
00:12:20,440 --> 00:12:22,009
They were rigid.
248
00:12:22,042 --> 00:12:23,977
They were catatonic.
249
00:12:24,011 --> 00:12:25,512
They were violent.
250
00:12:25,545 --> 00:12:29,116
The classic talk-down
is you engage the person,
251
00:12:29,149 --> 00:12:31,551
get the mind off the thing
that's bothering them.
252
00:12:31,584 --> 00:12:33,453
But when you tried
to engage
253
00:12:33,486 --> 00:12:35,956
the person with PCP...
254
00:12:35,989 --> 00:12:38,058
[ Screaming ]
255
00:12:38,091 --> 00:12:40,027
...basically,
the sensory input
256
00:12:40,060 --> 00:12:42,162
that went out
became something else,
257
00:12:42,195 --> 00:12:44,064
and they became
very agitated.
258
00:12:47,100 --> 00:12:50,070
Morris: Dr. Smith walked me
to the Panhandle to show me
259
00:12:50,103 --> 00:12:55,108
where he first encountered
a PCP intoxication.
260
00:12:55,142 --> 00:12:56,910
It was there.
261
00:12:56,944 --> 00:12:58,245
That's where
the concert was.
262
00:12:58,278 --> 00:13:01,014
Right there.
Hippies dancing.
263
00:13:01,048 --> 00:13:06,153
And that tree is where
I saw my first bad PCP trip.
264
00:13:06,186 --> 00:13:08,455
She does a face-plant
in the dirt.
265
00:13:08,488 --> 00:13:11,158
-Right here?
-Right there.
266
00:13:11,191 --> 00:13:12,860
Falling facedown
in the dirt
267
00:13:12,893 --> 00:13:14,394
is not something
you're supposed to do.
268
00:13:14,427 --> 00:13:18,331
And I said this is a different
type of drug reaction.
269
00:13:18,365 --> 00:13:22,836
I got a sample of the urine,
had it tested.
270
00:13:22,870 --> 00:13:27,474
And that's when it
came back as PCP.
271
00:13:27,507 --> 00:13:32,980
I hallucinate.
I see things.
272
00:13:33,013 --> 00:13:37,617
I like it.
273
00:13:37,650 --> 00:13:39,586
I didn't think
a dissociative anesthetic
274
00:13:39,619 --> 00:13:42,122
would be the drug that
this population would want.
275
00:13:42,155 --> 00:13:46,326
But the problem is, you give
a drug a name, the peace pill.
276
00:13:46,359 --> 00:13:48,161
Or if you're a biker,
the hog.
277
00:13:48,195 --> 00:13:50,197
And they respond
to the pill
278
00:13:50,230 --> 00:13:51,865
and the culture
and the name
279
00:13:51,899 --> 00:13:54,501
rather than any understanding
of the pharmacology of it.
280
00:13:54,534 --> 00:13:58,071
Morris: Since the clinical use
of PCP was discontinued,
281
00:13:58,105 --> 00:14:00,507
it's appeared on the street
in many forms.
282
00:14:00,540 --> 00:14:03,010
First, there were
capsules and tablets,
283
00:14:03,043 --> 00:14:05,078
often called peace pills.
284
00:14:05,112 --> 00:14:08,315
Later, there is crystalline
PCP hydrochloride,
285
00:14:08,348 --> 00:14:10,984
referred to as angel dust.
286
00:14:11,018 --> 00:14:13,987
And most recently, liquid
solutions of PCP freebase
287
00:14:14,021 --> 00:14:16,223
that are used
for dipping cigarettes,
288
00:14:16,256 --> 00:14:20,493
often called sherm stick or wet,
289
00:14:20,527 --> 00:14:23,997
which brings me to Kensington
in East Philadelphia
290
00:14:24,031 --> 00:14:27,100
to meet Craig and Kelly.
291
00:14:27,134 --> 00:14:29,569
This is where I get high,
you know, hang out.
292
00:14:29,602 --> 00:14:32,539
-You want to smoke by people?
-No, there's no one over here.
293
00:14:32,572 --> 00:14:34,674
I usually sit over here
by the rocks.
294
00:14:34,707 --> 00:14:37,010
Over here by this,
uh, gate.
295
00:14:40,280 --> 00:14:41,681
The best way
to smoke it is, like,
296
00:14:41,714 --> 00:14:43,383
right after they just dipped.
Like, they just dipped.
297
00:14:43,416 --> 00:14:45,185
-Yeah, it's still wet, though.
-It's still wet, though.
298
00:14:45,218 --> 00:14:46,619
Morris: Can't they just bust
into flames, though, that way?
299
00:14:46,653 --> 00:14:48,121
-If you light it with a lighter.
-Yeah.
300
00:14:48,155 --> 00:14:49,456
You have to light it off
another cigarette.
301
00:14:49,489 --> 00:14:50,958
If she just -- like,
if I just took this lighter
302
00:14:50,991 --> 00:14:52,192
and just put that lighter to it,
it's gonna...
303
00:14:52,225 --> 00:14:53,393
It would, like, burst
into flames.
304
00:14:53,426 --> 00:14:55,462
Like, it's gonna,
like, poof up.
305
00:14:55,495 --> 00:14:57,197
Tell me about when you
first started smoking it.
306
00:14:57,230 --> 00:14:59,499
I'm curious about it.
-I can't even really tell you
307
00:14:59,532 --> 00:15:01,401
how I first --
first started smoking it.
308
00:15:01,434 --> 00:15:02,970
It just, like --
it just happened.
309
00:15:03,003 --> 00:15:04,271
Like, I smoked
a dipper one day,
310
00:15:04,304 --> 00:15:05,438
and it was
like, "Oh, shit."
311
00:15:05,472 --> 00:15:07,040
Like, "Well, damn."
312
00:15:07,074 --> 00:15:09,176
That shit will take you
to a whole 'nother place.
313
00:15:09,209 --> 00:15:10,577
We was just getting high.
I'm talking...
314
00:15:10,610 --> 00:15:12,612
We were smoking, like,
ounces of this shit in a week.
315
00:15:12,645 --> 00:15:14,381
Like, we was
just getting high.
316
00:15:14,414 --> 00:15:18,318
Like, just dip, smoke,
dip, smoke, dip, smoke.
317
00:15:18,351 --> 00:15:20,053
We weren't even smoking
the whole damn thing.
318
00:15:20,087 --> 00:15:21,588
It's half gone,
we throwing it.
319
00:15:21,621 --> 00:15:23,356
Dipping another one.
We was just getting high.
320
00:15:23,390 --> 00:15:24,992
Like, "Oh, my God.
321
00:15:25,025 --> 00:15:26,593
Damn, like, we got to
stop smoking, bro."
322
00:15:26,626 --> 00:15:29,429
Like...and that shit lasted
for all of 2 hours,
323
00:15:29,462 --> 00:15:30,730
and we went and got
some more of that shit.
324
00:15:30,763 --> 00:15:32,265
Like...
It was just what we did.
325
00:15:32,299 --> 00:15:34,501
It was a fun thing.
We -- we got money.
326
00:15:34,534 --> 00:15:35,702
We was just gonna
smoke and get high.
327
00:15:35,735 --> 00:15:37,470
Like...
-What is the benefit
328
00:15:37,504 --> 00:15:39,039
that you feel
when you smoke
329
00:15:39,072 --> 00:15:41,041
that makes you want to
do it every day?
330
00:15:41,074 --> 00:15:42,542
Um...
331
00:15:45,145 --> 00:15:46,479
I don't know.
332
00:15:46,513 --> 00:15:48,448
She dipping off.
333
00:15:48,481 --> 00:15:51,251
It'll do that to you, though.
It'll get you quiet.
334
00:15:51,284 --> 00:15:52,585
She about to get spacey.
335
00:15:52,619 --> 00:15:54,621
She in the matrix
right now.
336
00:15:59,059 --> 00:16:01,094
-Are you gone?
-Yes.
337
00:16:01,128 --> 00:16:02,329
Is it good to be gone?
338
00:16:02,362 --> 00:16:04,397
Yes.
339
00:16:04,431 --> 00:16:06,166
When do you think
you'll be back?
340
00:16:06,199 --> 00:16:09,569
I don't know.
341
00:16:09,602 --> 00:16:11,271
Gone.
342
00:16:11,304 --> 00:16:13,173
Wallach: At this high dose,
343
00:16:13,206 --> 00:16:16,343
the person becomes completely
catatonic and anesthetized.
344
00:16:16,376 --> 00:16:19,179
It's only as the drug
begins to be metabolized
345
00:16:19,212 --> 00:16:22,115
and broken down that the levels
allow them to wake up,
346
00:16:22,149 --> 00:16:23,450
and then they're
still high enough
347
00:16:23,483 --> 00:16:26,419
to be in this dissociated state.
348
00:16:26,453 --> 00:16:27,754
-Oh.
-You good?
349
00:16:27,787 --> 00:16:29,756
-Yeah.
-Watch my arm.
350
00:16:33,093 --> 00:16:35,028
Kensington is, like,
our black market for drugs.
351
00:16:35,062 --> 00:16:36,696
It's just, you need a drug,
you go to Kensington.
352
00:16:36,729 --> 00:16:38,365
You gonna find
that shit.
353
00:16:38,398 --> 00:16:40,667
-Where does it come from?
-The wet?
354
00:16:40,700 --> 00:16:42,335
-Yeah.
-What you mean?
355
00:16:42,369 --> 00:16:44,137
Like, personally?
Like, where?
356
00:16:44,171 --> 00:16:45,405
Like, who bringing this shit in?
I wouldn't be able to tell you.
357
00:16:45,438 --> 00:16:47,807
-Who makes it?
-Who the fuck knows?
358
00:16:47,840 --> 00:16:49,809
It got to be somebody --
It can't be nobody in here
359
00:16:49,842 --> 00:16:51,811
'cause you got
to be a chemist
360
00:16:51,844 --> 00:16:54,081
to make that shit up.
361
00:16:54,114 --> 00:16:56,483
You don't need glassware.
You can do it in buckets.
362
00:16:56,516 --> 00:16:58,285
But what you do
need are chemicals
363
00:16:58,318 --> 00:17:00,720
that are not just bought
at the hardware store.
364
00:17:00,753 --> 00:17:04,291
Morris: The synthesis of PCP
can be a formidable challenge
365
00:17:04,324 --> 00:17:05,725
for clandestine chemists.
366
00:17:05,758 --> 00:17:09,462
Wallach: Piperidene,
magnesium, cyclohexanone.
367
00:17:09,496 --> 00:17:12,199
Morris: All the chemicals
used to manufacture PCP
368
00:17:12,232 --> 00:17:13,566
have been watched
by law enforcement
369
00:17:13,600 --> 00:17:16,636
for decades,
which raises the question --
370
00:17:16,669 --> 00:17:21,308
"Who's making PCP,
and where does it come from?"
371
00:17:21,341 --> 00:17:23,543
All the PCP in the country
can be linked
372
00:17:23,576 --> 00:17:25,778
directly back
to southern California.
373
00:17:25,812 --> 00:17:27,314
They're cooking multiple
hundred gallons
374
00:17:27,347 --> 00:17:28,781
of PCP at a time,
375
00:17:28,815 --> 00:17:30,350
and it gets shipped
by planes,
376
00:17:30,383 --> 00:17:33,686
trains and automobiles
every single day out of L.A.
377
00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:36,323
In Los Angeles,
I met with Frank Lyga,
378
00:17:36,356 --> 00:17:39,259
a narcotics detective
who dedicated 16 years
379
00:17:39,292 --> 00:17:42,762
to hunting down and arresting
PCP manufacturers.
380
00:17:42,795 --> 00:17:44,497
PCP, what I
find so fascinating,
381
00:17:44,531 --> 00:17:46,533
is that it's real
organic synthesis.
382
00:17:46,566 --> 00:17:48,435
You're not working with things
that you bought at CVS.
383
00:17:48,468 --> 00:17:49,869
You're working
with real chemicals.
384
00:17:49,902 --> 00:17:51,338
Well, that's --
that's you as a --
385
00:17:51,371 --> 00:17:53,306
as a chemistry
background.
386
00:17:53,340 --> 00:17:55,808
The average person
that manufactures PCP
387
00:17:55,842 --> 00:17:57,344
is third
and fourth generation
388
00:17:57,377 --> 00:17:59,612
down the line,
and they got a recipe.
389
00:17:59,646 --> 00:18:03,150
It's amazing how they come up
with some of this stuff.
390
00:18:03,183 --> 00:18:04,751
We then went inside
to look at photos
391
00:18:04,784 --> 00:18:08,621
from his biggest bust.
392
00:18:08,655 --> 00:18:12,159
This was and is and probably
will continue to be
393
00:18:12,192 --> 00:18:14,494
the largest
PCP seizure in history.
394
00:18:14,527 --> 00:18:16,496
This guy's lab site was
395
00:18:16,529 --> 00:18:19,399
in a small village
about an hour and a half
396
00:18:19,432 --> 00:18:21,401
northeast of Las Vegas,
up in the mountains.
397
00:18:21,434 --> 00:18:24,304
His full job every day
was to make PCP.
398
00:18:24,337 --> 00:18:25,605
This was packaged
for sale.
399
00:18:25,638 --> 00:18:27,174
This was actually
how we got the guy.
400
00:18:27,207 --> 00:18:29,309
So he was hydrogenating
the pyridine
401
00:18:29,342 --> 00:18:30,810
in the same operation?
-Yeah. Yeah.
402
00:18:30,843 --> 00:18:32,445
That seems
pretty sophisticated.
403
00:18:32,479 --> 00:18:34,414
He bought everything
in bulk
404
00:18:34,447 --> 00:18:36,449
because this was
his full-time job.
405
00:18:36,483 --> 00:18:37,717
We seized 100 --
406
00:18:37,750 --> 00:18:39,652
roughly 130 gallons
of finished PCP
407
00:18:39,686 --> 00:18:41,488
and enough chemicals
to make about
408
00:18:41,521 --> 00:18:44,824
1,500 gallons
of finished PCP.
409
00:18:44,857 --> 00:18:48,628
The gangs control PCP,
and the old gang wars
410
00:18:48,661 --> 00:18:50,397
from the '80s,
the Bloods and the Crips,
411
00:18:50,430 --> 00:18:52,432
the blue and the red,
412
00:18:52,465 --> 00:18:54,867
doesn't apply to this
level of criminal.
413
00:18:54,901 --> 00:18:56,669
You have
a source of piperidine,
414
00:18:56,703 --> 00:18:58,838
I have a source for PMB,
we're friends.
415
00:18:58,871 --> 00:19:01,241
You're a Crip.
I'm a Blood.
416
00:19:01,274 --> 00:19:04,644
It's green now.
We're making money.
417
00:19:04,677 --> 00:19:08,515
A gallon of PCP in L.A.
goes for $12,000 to $17,000.
418
00:19:08,548 --> 00:19:10,417
That same gallon
in New York,
419
00:19:10,450 --> 00:19:11,818
Philadelphia, Maryland,
420
00:19:11,851 --> 00:19:14,521
goes for $35,000
to $65,000.
421
00:19:14,554 --> 00:19:16,289
Do you ever feel bad
for these people,
422
00:19:16,323 --> 00:19:19,826
or think that maybe they --
they're not bad people?
423
00:19:19,859 --> 00:19:21,794
No.
Not at all.
424
00:19:21,828 --> 00:19:22,962
You don't have to be
a bad person
425
00:19:22,995 --> 00:19:24,431
to do
criminal activities.
426
00:19:24,464 --> 00:19:26,533
We follow the rules
and the laws.
427
00:19:26,566 --> 00:19:28,568
Nothing personal.
I catch ya, I catch ya.
428
00:19:28,601 --> 00:19:30,670
If I don't catch ya,
I don't catch ya.
429
00:19:30,703 --> 00:19:32,972
Why do people use it?
430
00:19:33,005 --> 00:19:34,641
I have no idea.
431
00:19:34,674 --> 00:19:36,709
I don't drink,
and I don't smoke.
432
00:19:36,743 --> 00:19:38,811
Never have.
Never did drugs 'cause,
433
00:19:38,845 --> 00:19:40,447
my whole life,
I wanted to be a cop.
434
00:19:40,480 --> 00:19:43,250
I wanted to be a dope cop.
But that's me.
435
00:19:43,283 --> 00:19:44,484
Yeah.
436
00:19:44,517 --> 00:19:47,320
I can't talk
about anybody else.
437
00:19:47,354 --> 00:19:49,589
At some point, someone
had to figure out
438
00:19:49,622 --> 00:19:51,258
this bucket method.
439
00:19:51,291 --> 00:19:53,360
They had to go to the
original articles written
440
00:19:53,393 --> 00:19:57,230
by the chemist who discovered
PCP, Vic Maddox,
441
00:19:57,264 --> 00:19:59,732
and they had to adapt
his synthetic route
442
00:19:59,766 --> 00:20:02,369
for clandestine manufacture.
-Right.
443
00:20:02,402 --> 00:20:05,472
So I'm curious
about who that was.
444
00:20:05,505 --> 00:20:07,374
There's one family
in South L.A.
445
00:20:07,407 --> 00:20:09,476
that basically started
the PCP epidemic
446
00:20:09,509 --> 00:20:11,878
in the '70s.
447
00:20:11,911 --> 00:20:15,482
And they are like
the godfathers of PCP
448
00:20:15,515 --> 00:20:16,716
in South L.A.
449
00:20:16,749 --> 00:20:18,351
I'm very curious
about this family.
450
00:20:18,385 --> 00:20:19,719
I'm not gonna mention
the names at all.
451
00:20:19,752 --> 00:20:20,987
They're not
the sorts of people
452
00:20:21,020 --> 00:20:22,355
that would want
to talk to us on camera.
453
00:20:22,389 --> 00:20:23,623
Oh, no.
They wouldn't talk to you.
454
00:20:23,656 --> 00:20:24,891
That's why I'm not
gonna give you a name.
455
00:20:24,924 --> 00:20:26,793
Hansel and Gretel.
456
00:20:26,826 --> 00:20:28,661
Morris:
Frank's tantalizing tales
457
00:20:28,695 --> 00:20:30,963
of clandestine synthesis
made it clear
458
00:20:30,997 --> 00:20:33,533
that I had to hear
about the process firsthand
459
00:20:33,566 --> 00:20:35,368
from a professional cook,
460
00:20:35,402 --> 00:20:40,039
with the hope that I could
obtain their secret recipe.
461
00:20:47,547 --> 00:20:50,450
You have reached
the voice mailbox of...
462
00:20:52,018 --> 00:20:54,721
Yeah, we've had a lot
of difficulty finding someone
463
00:20:54,754 --> 00:20:57,557
who would be willing
to synthesize PCP on camera,
464
00:20:57,590 --> 00:20:59,926
which isn't entirely surprising.
465
00:20:59,959 --> 00:21:02,061
-Hello?
-Hey, what's going on?
466
00:21:02,094 --> 00:21:04,030
This is Hamilton.
-Oh, how you doing?
467
00:21:04,063 --> 00:21:05,632
Good.
How are you?
468
00:21:05,665 --> 00:21:07,634
But this guy that we met
with the other night,
469
00:21:07,667 --> 00:21:10,403
he seemed like
a perfect person to speak with.
470
00:21:10,437 --> 00:21:13,673
Uh, he's only been out
of prison for about 100 days,
471
00:21:13,706 --> 00:21:16,409
and he seems conflicted
about whether or not
472
00:21:16,443 --> 00:21:18,345
he wants to have anything
to do with us.
473
00:21:23,950 --> 00:21:27,454
This clandestine PCP cook,
who I'll call Flaco,
474
00:21:27,487 --> 00:21:32,091
was caught manufacturing PCP
and spent 28 years in prison.
475
00:21:32,124 --> 00:21:34,727
So who do you think
was the first person
476
00:21:34,761 --> 00:21:38,731
that brought this information
into South Central L.A.,
477
00:21:38,765 --> 00:21:42,034
the first person to give
the recipe to people
478
00:21:42,068 --> 00:21:44,871
so that they could make it
in underground labs?
479
00:22:19,906 --> 00:22:21,508
Would you say
that it's fun,
480
00:22:21,541 --> 00:22:22,642
something that
you enjoy doing,
481
00:22:22,675 --> 00:22:24,110
something that,
you know,
482
00:22:24,143 --> 00:22:25,645
while you're doing it,
it was exciting?
483
00:22:25,678 --> 00:22:28,080
It was...
484
00:22:44,130 --> 00:22:45,932
Have young people
come up to you
485
00:22:45,965 --> 00:22:48,801
and asked you
about a recipe
486
00:22:48,835 --> 00:22:51,538
or asked you to teach them
what you know?
487
00:22:59,479 --> 00:23:01,180
Do you keep it secret
because you don't want
488
00:23:01,213 --> 00:23:03,115
other people
competing with you
489
00:23:03,149 --> 00:23:05,452
or you don't want them
getting hurt?
490
00:23:10,222 --> 00:23:11,824
Morris:
But when the conversation
491
00:23:11,858 --> 00:23:13,760
turned
to phenylmagnesium bromide,
492
00:23:13,793 --> 00:23:15,828
he couldn't help but talk shop,
493
00:23:15,862 --> 00:23:18,665
and I couldn't help but listen.
494
00:23:18,698 --> 00:23:19,966
So 400 grams.
495
00:23:19,999 --> 00:23:22,101
Sorry, say that...
It was 400 grams?
496
00:23:22,134 --> 00:23:23,703
4,000.
497
00:23:23,736 --> 00:23:26,806
Oh, so 4,000 grams.
498
00:23:31,711 --> 00:23:33,946
In order to understand
a street drug,
499
00:23:33,980 --> 00:23:35,515
it's vital to understand
500
00:23:35,548 --> 00:23:38,017
the technique
of a street chemist.
501
00:23:38,050 --> 00:23:40,553
So I took Flaco's recipe
to the lab
502
00:23:40,587 --> 00:23:41,988
with a small modification
503
00:23:42,021 --> 00:23:45,091
that ensured the final product
would be legal.
504
00:23:45,124 --> 00:23:46,559
The idea behind this experiment
505
00:23:46,593 --> 00:23:48,561
is to mimic the so-called
bucket method.
506
00:23:48,595 --> 00:23:51,698
Instead of 32-gallon
Rubbermaid trash cans,
507
00:23:51,731 --> 00:23:54,100
we're going to use Pyrex beakers
508
00:23:54,133 --> 00:23:57,136
under controlled
laboratory conditions.
509
00:23:57,169 --> 00:23:59,171
In under 30 seconds,
510
00:23:59,205 --> 00:24:01,608
I'm going to tell you
exactly how to manufacture
511
00:24:01,641 --> 00:24:03,476
PCP, or, in this case,
512
00:24:03,510 --> 00:24:07,880
the morpholine derivative
of PCP, PCMO.
513
00:24:07,914 --> 00:24:09,215
Sodium bisulfite is added
514
00:24:09,248 --> 00:24:10,883
to an aqueous
cyclohexanone solution,
515
00:24:10,917 --> 00:24:12,184
precipitating an adduct
516
00:24:12,218 --> 00:24:13,753
that's subject
to nucleophyllic attack
517
00:24:13,786 --> 00:24:15,522
from lone pair electrons
on the morpholine amine,
518
00:24:15,555 --> 00:24:17,056
forming a solution
in which the hemi-aminol
519
00:24:17,089 --> 00:24:18,991
and aminium ion exist
in equilibrium.
520
00:24:19,025 --> 00:24:20,593
The aminium carbon
521
00:24:20,627 --> 00:24:22,028
undergoes nuceophyllic attack
from cyanide.
522
00:24:22,061 --> 00:24:23,863
You can smell the cyanide
in the air right now.
523
00:24:23,896 --> 00:24:25,197
Just the quantity
that we're using
524
00:24:25,231 --> 00:24:26,265
now is enough
to kill several people.
525
00:24:26,298 --> 00:24:27,600
Wallach: Oh, many people.
Yeah.
526
00:24:27,634 --> 00:24:29,669
-Everyone here.
-Yes.
527
00:24:29,702 --> 00:24:30,870
Morris: This is fun.
528
00:24:30,903 --> 00:24:32,572
Producing an alpha-amino nitrile
529
00:24:32,605 --> 00:24:34,707
which is isolated from
the aqueous reaction mixture
530
00:24:34,741 --> 00:24:37,143
and re-dissolved
in ether for a reaction.
531
00:24:37,176 --> 00:24:38,845
In solution,
the alpha-amino nitrile
532
00:24:38,878 --> 00:24:40,547
is in equilibrium
with an aminium ion,
533
00:24:40,580 --> 00:24:41,948
which undergoes
nucleophyllic attack
534
00:24:41,981 --> 00:24:43,716
from phenyl-magnesium bromide,
535
00:24:43,750 --> 00:24:47,687
driving the reaction
toward the formation of PCMO.
536
00:24:49,689 --> 00:24:51,223
This was what would be sold,
537
00:24:51,257 --> 00:24:54,293
and this is what we could dip
a cigarette into, um,
538
00:24:54,326 --> 00:24:56,763
and would be the final product
539
00:24:56,796 --> 00:24:59,131
that could be sold
on the street level.
540
00:25:00,867 --> 00:25:03,570
Morris: Flaco's method works
for clandestine manufacture
541
00:25:03,603 --> 00:25:05,738
of PCP, but it results
542
00:25:05,772 --> 00:25:08,274
in the formation
of cyanogenic impurities
543
00:25:08,307 --> 00:25:11,944
and a product that's more toxic
for the end user.
544
00:25:14,781 --> 00:25:18,084
After our interview,
Flaco resumed manufacturing,
545
00:25:18,117 --> 00:25:20,186
but tragically died
10 months later
546
00:25:20,219 --> 00:25:22,689
after his lab caught on fire.
547
00:25:33,332 --> 00:25:35,935
Morris: Strolling through
a Santa Monica playground,
548
00:25:35,968 --> 00:25:38,971
I ran into a quartet
of PCP enthusiasts
549
00:25:39,005 --> 00:25:40,940
sharing an afternoon smoke
550
00:25:40,973 --> 00:25:43,209
and decided to ask
them a question
551
00:25:43,242 --> 00:25:45,745
that had been on my mind.
552
00:25:45,778 --> 00:25:49,882
Have you ever done anything
crazy or regrettable on PCP?
553
00:25:49,916 --> 00:25:52,051
Crazy,
but not regrettable.
554
00:25:52,084 --> 00:25:54,353
But I seen some people
who do some humil--
555
00:25:54,386 --> 00:25:56,956
like, humiliating things,
take their clothes off,
556
00:25:56,989 --> 00:25:59,091
you know,
stripping down.
557
00:25:59,125 --> 00:26:02,228
As people dip, sometimes
it's too much of a downer.
558
00:26:02,261 --> 00:26:04,597
Sometimes it hits you.
559
00:26:04,631 --> 00:26:06,666
And sometimes
it picks people up,
560
00:26:06,699 --> 00:26:08,635
and they go crazy, you know?
561
00:26:08,668 --> 00:26:11,270
People's loved ones got to
call the police on 'em.
562
00:26:11,303 --> 00:26:13,740
Do you all know
about Big Lurch?
563
00:26:13,773 --> 00:26:15,074
What?
564
00:26:15,107 --> 00:26:18,377
This guy, Big Lurch,
who ate one of his friends?
565
00:26:18,410 --> 00:26:21,614
He ate him? He literally
cut him up and ate him?
566
00:26:21,648 --> 00:26:23,950
Yeah.
567
00:26:23,983 --> 00:26:26,018
Morris:
Big Lurch is a Texas rapper
568
00:26:26,052 --> 00:26:30,322
who ate his friend
Tynisha's lungs in 2002.
569
00:26:30,356 --> 00:26:32,024
He described his state of mind
570
00:26:32,058 --> 00:26:35,261
in an interview from prison
with Geraldo Rivera.
571
00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:50,677
Rivera:
Do you know that, uh,
572
00:26:50,710 --> 00:26:52,879
you were actually
chewing on her flesh,
573
00:26:52,912 --> 00:26:54,781
allegedly,
when the cops came?
574
00:27:04,957 --> 00:27:07,827
Yeah, we never heard
of no Big Lurch, you know?
575
00:27:07,860 --> 00:27:10,296
Why? What's up?
From PCP, he ate somebody?
576
00:27:10,329 --> 00:27:12,098
Yeah.
Yeah, he was a big PCP...
577
00:27:12,131 --> 00:27:15,134
Man, he was a sick puppy from --
form the get-go, then, you know?
578
00:27:15,167 --> 00:27:16,836
The craziest thing
is to get naked
579
00:27:16,869 --> 00:27:17,904
and want to fight
with the police.
580
00:27:17,937 --> 00:27:19,739
That's it.
581
00:27:19,772 --> 00:27:21,140
You know, police shoot somebody,
kill somebody or whatever,
582
00:27:21,173 --> 00:27:23,876
but not no shit like that.
I want to eat.
583
00:27:23,910 --> 00:27:26,078
You know, too much
zombie movies, man.
584
00:27:26,112 --> 00:27:28,447
You see what I mean?
585
00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:31,183
The radio call came out.
A tall woman dressed in a --
586
00:27:31,217 --> 00:27:33,319
in a red dress
walking in traffic.
587
00:27:33,352 --> 00:27:35,021
The radio car arrived,
588
00:27:35,054 --> 00:27:37,456
and he was naked,
covered in blood.
589
00:27:37,489 --> 00:27:39,058
He had her heart
under his arm.
590
00:27:39,091 --> 00:27:40,727
-He had her heart under his arm?
-You know that?
591
00:27:40,760 --> 00:27:41,961
I did not know that.
592
00:27:41,994 --> 00:27:43,763
His hear--
her heart was in his armpit.
593
00:27:43,796 --> 00:27:47,233
Wow.
594
00:27:47,266 --> 00:27:49,268
At least
that's what I was told.
595
00:27:49,301 --> 00:27:51,971
Wow. I've been pen pals
with him for years.
596
00:27:54,240 --> 00:27:57,476
-Really?
-Yeah.
597
00:27:57,509 --> 00:28:00,112
That case is an anomaly.
598
00:28:00,146 --> 00:28:03,115
It's few and far between.
599
00:28:03,149 --> 00:28:07,319
Very rarely do we see
anything of that nature.
600
00:28:07,353 --> 00:28:10,322
Morris: The brutality
of the Big Lurch case
601
00:28:10,356 --> 00:28:12,458
overshadows the fact
that the vast majority
602
00:28:12,491 --> 00:28:15,327
of PCP users
are non-violent.
603
00:28:15,361 --> 00:28:18,164
But a powerful
dissociative anesthetic
604
00:28:18,197 --> 00:28:23,035
can combine dangerously
with certain personality types.
605
00:28:23,069 --> 00:28:24,370
Craig: You got a motherfucker
that's, like...
606
00:28:24,403 --> 00:28:25,872
He thinking about
killing somebody,
607
00:28:25,905 --> 00:28:27,006
or he think about
robbing somebody,
608
00:28:27,039 --> 00:28:28,107
or anything he thinking
about doing,
609
00:28:28,140 --> 00:28:29,742
he smoke a dipper
or two,
610
00:28:29,776 --> 00:28:31,443
you know,
really putting his mind
611
00:28:31,477 --> 00:28:33,079
on that shit,
he gonna go do that shit.
612
00:28:33,112 --> 00:28:35,414
And then you fucking might
not even remember it
613
00:28:35,447 --> 00:28:36,916
'cause, like, you --
you black out.
614
00:28:36,949 --> 00:28:38,250
Like, a lot of the times,
you don't even,
615
00:28:38,284 --> 00:28:39,518
like, be realizing
what you're doing
616
00:28:39,551 --> 00:28:41,253
'cause it'd have you
acting off raw emotion.
617
00:28:41,287 --> 00:28:43,255
Like, when you hear somebody,
they committed suicide,
618
00:28:43,289 --> 00:28:44,924
it wasn't 'cause
PCP made 'em do it.
619
00:28:44,957 --> 00:28:47,126
They was already going through
some shit in their head.
620
00:28:47,159 --> 00:28:48,861
That's how
that shit happens.
621
00:28:48,895 --> 00:28:50,930
It's like, that little voice
that tells you not to do shit?
622
00:28:50,963 --> 00:28:53,365
It goes away.
623
00:28:55,501 --> 00:28:59,405
With regards to reports
of PCP causing violence,
624
00:28:59,438 --> 00:29:01,440
it has not been
found to be true.
625
00:29:01,473 --> 00:29:03,109
Scientific studies
that were done
626
00:29:03,142 --> 00:29:05,277
that looked at this issue
closer found
627
00:29:05,311 --> 00:29:07,413
that there wasn't
a major association
628
00:29:07,446 --> 00:29:09,816
between PCP use
and violence.
629
00:29:09,849 --> 00:29:11,483
But that doesn't mean
it doesn't happen.
630
00:29:11,517 --> 00:29:12,952
And as with any drug,
631
00:29:12,985 --> 00:29:15,154
some people
have violent responses.
632
00:29:15,187 --> 00:29:18,825
You know, the individual
taking it is a huge factor.
633
00:29:18,858 --> 00:29:20,159
And few individuals have
634
00:29:20,192 --> 00:29:23,863
a more fascinating story
than Christ Bearer.
635
00:29:29,268 --> 00:29:31,303
[ Hip hop music plays ]
636
00:29:35,341 --> 00:29:37,576
Christ Bearer is
a rapper affiliated
637
00:29:37,609 --> 00:29:40,579
with the legendary Wu Tang Clan.
638
00:29:40,612 --> 00:29:45,017
But in 2014, he made
a private decision
639
00:29:45,051 --> 00:29:48,320
that thrust him
into the public eye.
640
00:29:50,857 --> 00:29:53,092
Bearer:
My first PCP experience.
641
00:29:53,125 --> 00:29:56,328
And I went through the streets,
and I was like, "Yo.
642
00:29:56,362 --> 00:30:00,900
I see what the fuck
that people see,"
643
00:30:00,933 --> 00:30:02,468
you know what I mean?
644
00:30:02,501 --> 00:30:04,436
PCP's something like
an alternate reality.
645
00:30:04,470 --> 00:30:06,072
You can see something.
It's like knowledge.
646
00:30:06,105 --> 00:30:07,406
You can see something,
and once you see that,
647
00:30:07,439 --> 00:30:09,041
you can't never go back.
648
00:30:09,075 --> 00:30:11,210
It's, like, you could be
exposed to too much truth,
649
00:30:11,243 --> 00:30:13,312
and it can make you nutty,
you know what I'm saying?
650
00:30:13,345 --> 00:30:16,448
-Yeah.
-I tried, uh, meth
651
00:30:16,482 --> 00:30:18,050
and a couple other drugs,
652
00:30:18,084 --> 00:30:21,120
but PCP was something
that it was just --
653
00:30:21,153 --> 00:30:23,255
just clarity.
654
00:30:23,289 --> 00:30:26,192
Could you tell me
the story of that night?
655
00:30:26,225 --> 00:30:30,196
Um, to a degree.
To a degree.
656
00:30:30,229 --> 00:30:31,630
So that night, when I --
657
00:30:31,663 --> 00:30:34,566
I had some PCP,
and I was definitely,
658
00:30:34,600 --> 00:30:38,104
um, I was
watching cartoons.
659
00:30:38,137 --> 00:30:41,373
And to me,
for some reason,
660
00:30:41,407 --> 00:30:44,610
life turned
into a cartoon.
661
00:30:44,643 --> 00:30:48,580
So it was kind of like,
"Well, this is..."
662
00:30:48,614 --> 00:30:51,383
And I had three, um,
baby mothers, and they all...
663
00:30:51,417 --> 00:30:52,985
uh, had restraining orders
on me
664
00:30:53,019 --> 00:30:54,120
so I couldn't see
any of my kids.
665
00:30:54,153 --> 00:30:55,587
But I figured, "Man,
666
00:30:55,621 --> 00:30:57,924
I keep on having these babies
by these girls."
667
00:30:57,957 --> 00:30:59,525
I was thinking they just,
kind of groupies
668
00:30:59,558 --> 00:31:01,327
and then once they have
the baby by me,
669
00:31:01,360 --> 00:31:02,594
I'm trapped,
and they say,
670
00:31:02,628 --> 00:31:04,263
"Hey, I'm gonna need
this amount of money
671
00:31:04,296 --> 00:31:05,932
for you to be
in their life."
672
00:31:05,965 --> 00:31:08,600
It started being, like,
society that was just --
673
00:31:08,634 --> 00:31:12,504
just dragging me down
into a -- a vortex.
674
00:31:12,538 --> 00:31:14,340
I could not stop.
Women say,
675
00:31:14,373 --> 00:31:16,075
"Men think with their
little head too much.
676
00:31:16,108 --> 00:31:17,509
They always think
with their little heads."
677
00:31:17,543 --> 00:31:21,147
So I said,
"You know what?
678
00:31:21,180 --> 00:31:23,682
I got something
for these bitches.
679
00:31:23,715 --> 00:31:25,351
I'm gonna cut off
my little head
680
00:31:25,384 --> 00:31:27,954
and be forced to only think
with my big head."
681
00:31:27,987 --> 00:31:31,357
And that was clear as day to me,
and I acted upon it.
682
00:31:31,390 --> 00:31:33,592
I went to the kitchen
with a kitchen knife,
683
00:31:33,625 --> 00:31:36,695
and I chopped it off.
684
00:31:36,728 --> 00:31:39,465
I didn't think, "I'm gonna
be famous from this."
685
00:31:39,498 --> 00:31:42,434
It was just a personal thing
in my life I felt I needed,
686
00:31:42,468 --> 00:31:44,336
and it should make
a difference.
687
00:31:44,370 --> 00:31:46,238
And it was kind of like,
"I'm dying anyway, man."
688
00:31:46,272 --> 00:31:47,439
Let me say my last
sets of missing words,
689
00:31:47,473 --> 00:31:49,175
what's going on.
690
00:31:49,208 --> 00:31:51,277
And I said a couple things
to everybody in the room.
691
00:31:51,310 --> 00:31:53,145
And I was like,
"Yeah, fuck it."
692
00:31:53,179 --> 00:31:56,315
I jumped off the balcony
and shit, you know what I mean?
693
00:31:56,348 --> 00:31:58,450
Two-story balcony.
So I hit the ground.
694
00:31:58,484 --> 00:32:01,587
I kind of con--
I was unconscious for a second,
695
00:32:01,620 --> 00:32:03,189
but then I realized,
"Yo, I'm not dead."
696
00:32:03,222 --> 00:32:05,424
I was, like, "Yo,
fuck this shit.
697
00:32:05,457 --> 00:32:07,093
Yo, guess what?
698
00:32:07,126 --> 00:32:08,460
I'm gonna fucking...
699
00:32:08,494 --> 00:32:11,964
Yo, nobody's got shit on me.
Watch this shit.
700
00:32:11,998 --> 00:32:13,966
I'm finna to turn
the world upside down,
701
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:15,667
and people are gonna
really fucking understand
702
00:32:15,701 --> 00:32:18,971
who God is
'cause I promise you,
703
00:32:19,005 --> 00:32:21,073
he is I, and I is him."
704
00:32:21,107 --> 00:32:22,374
Next thing you know,
I'm in the morning.
705
00:32:22,408 --> 00:32:25,177
It was all over
my bedroom, like, "Yo.
706
00:32:25,211 --> 00:32:26,745
What the fuck's going on?"
You know?
707
00:32:26,778 --> 00:32:28,480
So people can say,
"Oh, that nigga did that.
708
00:32:28,514 --> 00:32:30,349
He chopped off his shit.
What a idiot."
709
00:32:30,382 --> 00:32:32,484
It -- it actually
was a genius plan,
710
00:32:32,518 --> 00:32:34,286
I feel, you know?
711
00:32:34,320 --> 00:32:38,624
I really loved my
9 1/2 inches that I had.
712
00:32:38,657 --> 00:32:41,393
At the same token, uh,
manhood is not determined
713
00:32:41,427 --> 00:32:43,195
by what's
between your legs,
714
00:32:43,229 --> 00:32:44,696
and that's my mission
to show.
715
00:32:44,730 --> 00:32:47,333
Sentient thinking being's
what makes you a man.
716
00:32:47,366 --> 00:32:48,634
We don't live
in a society.
717
00:32:48,667 --> 00:32:51,203
We live in a sex-ciety.
You feel me?
718
00:32:51,237 --> 00:32:52,571
I do.
Absolutely.
719
00:32:52,604 --> 00:32:54,140
No, I understand
completely what you're saying.
720
00:32:54,173 --> 00:32:55,541
It makes a lot of sense.
I think it's, like,
721
00:32:55,574 --> 00:32:57,143
the sort of thing
where people hear the story,
722
00:32:57,176 --> 00:33:00,379
and it's just hard for them
to mentally grasp.
723
00:33:00,412 --> 00:33:03,782
Would you feel comfortable
showing us any of the --
724
00:33:03,815 --> 00:33:05,717
the -- the wound
or anything like that?
725
00:33:05,751 --> 00:33:07,053
Is that something
you want to show,
726
00:33:07,086 --> 00:33:08,654
or is that
a more private thing?
727
00:33:08,687 --> 00:33:11,357
Um, yeah.
Of course.
728
00:33:11,390 --> 00:33:13,625
I'd be...
Shit, why not?
729
00:33:17,663 --> 00:33:19,765
Fuck no.
Stop playing, man.
730
00:33:19,798 --> 00:33:21,267
-Okay.
-Fucking show you this for?
731
00:33:21,300 --> 00:33:22,534
A bunch of dudes
in here.
732
00:33:22,568 --> 00:33:24,236
Why'd I do such a thing?
733
00:33:24,270 --> 00:33:25,704
Why'd I do such a thing,
man?
734
00:33:25,737 --> 00:33:27,506
But, yo, if you guys
can guarantee me
735
00:33:27,539 --> 00:33:29,508
a million dollar kickoff,
736
00:33:29,541 --> 00:33:31,177
I'll -- I'll show you
a wound right now.
737
00:33:32,578 --> 00:33:34,313
I.O.U.? Okay.
If I could --
738
00:33:34,346 --> 00:33:36,448
if I could be true
to that,
739
00:33:36,482 --> 00:33:39,451
I would show you
the fucking wound.
740
00:33:39,485 --> 00:33:41,420
Every problem,
there's a solution.
741
00:33:41,453 --> 00:33:43,655
Of every positive,
there's a negative, you know?
742
00:33:43,689 --> 00:33:46,692
So I definitely
always know that,
743
00:33:46,725 --> 00:33:50,162
even if something negative,
there's a 2% positivity.
744
00:33:50,196 --> 00:33:52,664
If you just focus on that
2% positivity,
745
00:33:52,698 --> 00:33:54,433
you gonna grow it,
you know?
746
00:33:54,466 --> 00:33:56,835
Yeah. Absolutely.
Yeah.
747
00:34:03,742 --> 00:34:07,379
Morris: PCP is a drug popularly
associated with violence,
748
00:34:07,413 --> 00:34:09,181
but the medical
literature establishes
749
00:34:09,215 --> 00:34:12,184
no clear causal link
to such behavior.
750
00:34:12,218 --> 00:34:16,222
Unpredictable behavior,
however, is the norm.
751
00:34:16,255 --> 00:34:17,789
Craig: Everybody's mind
is different.
752
00:34:17,823 --> 00:34:19,858
Seen this man that's rumbling
a broom, fucking with this shit.
753
00:34:19,891 --> 00:34:22,428
He told me to my face,
754
00:34:22,461 --> 00:34:24,130
"He's --
it's a man over there,
755
00:34:24,163 --> 00:34:25,864
and he's rumbling the broom.
He rumbled the motherfucker."
756
00:34:25,897 --> 00:34:27,599
And he looked like
he was losing, if you ask me.
757
00:34:27,633 --> 00:34:29,301
-He rumbled a broom?
-He -- they was fighting.
758
00:34:29,335 --> 00:34:30,569
Him and the broom.
He was fighting some...
759
00:34:30,602 --> 00:34:32,104
In his mind,
he was fighting somebody.
760
00:34:32,138 --> 00:34:33,605
He was fighting the broom
in all actuality.
761
00:34:33,639 --> 00:34:34,773
What was he doing
with the broom?
762
00:34:34,806 --> 00:34:36,408
He was fighting
on the floor.
763
00:34:36,442 --> 00:34:37,843
He was literally on the floor,
throwing punches.
764
00:34:37,876 --> 00:34:39,811
You see his face, he look
like he was taking punches.
765
00:34:39,845 --> 00:34:42,681
Like, in his mind,
he was fighting somebody.
766
00:34:42,714 --> 00:34:45,317
Like, he -- he really
was fighting the broom.
767
00:34:45,351 --> 00:34:46,618
Like, smoke that shit,
768
00:34:46,652 --> 00:34:48,387
and depending on
what your mind is like.
769
00:34:48,420 --> 00:34:50,189
You got some sick shit
in your mind?
770
00:34:50,222 --> 00:34:52,658
Yeah, it -- it could be
a bad experience for you.
771
00:34:53,792 --> 00:34:56,495
[ Cellphone rings ]
772
00:34:56,528 --> 00:34:59,898
-Yo.
-Yeah, dawg. Hey, man.
773
00:34:59,931 --> 00:35:02,868
Um, I'm, uh,
I'm over here with,
774
00:35:02,901 --> 00:35:06,205
uh, this crew from Vice,
775
00:35:06,238 --> 00:35:10,542
and they're interviewing me
about PCP, and I'm...
776
00:35:10,576 --> 00:35:12,511
[ Both laughing ]
777
00:35:17,283 --> 00:35:19,918
Morris: Steve-O is best known
for his role on "Jackass",
778
00:35:19,951 --> 00:35:23,789
who is also an avid user
of dissociative anesthetics.
779
00:35:25,357 --> 00:35:26,925
After his mother's death,
780
00:35:26,958 --> 00:35:30,396
he made a film called
"PCP Saved My Life"
781
00:35:30,429 --> 00:35:31,930
that chronicled
the relationship
782
00:35:31,963 --> 00:35:35,867
between PCP and his
grieving process.
783
00:35:35,901 --> 00:35:38,870
PCP saved my life.
784
00:35:38,904 --> 00:35:41,207
Morris: So, I saw your movie,
"PCP Saved my Life."
785
00:35:41,240 --> 00:35:44,210
-Oh, right. Right.
-I really liked it.
786
00:35:44,243 --> 00:35:45,744
Cool, man.
I mean, it was what it was.
787
00:35:45,777 --> 00:35:49,781
It was a nice little
social experiment, I guess.
788
00:35:49,815 --> 00:35:51,817
But it's an unusual
take on PCP.
789
00:35:51,850 --> 00:35:54,653
Almost everything that you hear
about the drug is negative.
790
00:35:54,686 --> 00:35:56,822
Right.
791
00:35:56,855 --> 00:36:00,259
I don't know if I would
class that experience
792
00:36:00,292 --> 00:36:01,460
as entirely positive,
793
00:36:01,493 --> 00:36:05,297
but it had
its positivity, I guess.
794
00:36:05,331 --> 00:36:07,199
It seemed positive.
795
00:36:07,233 --> 00:36:08,867
Yeah.
796
00:36:08,900 --> 00:36:10,469
'Cause here's the deal,
okay?
797
00:36:10,502 --> 00:36:13,572
I smoked PCP for 5
fucking days in a row.
798
00:36:13,605 --> 00:36:16,742
The reason for this video
is so that no one watch--
799
00:36:16,775 --> 00:36:19,278
no one watches it
and then smokes PCP.
800
00:36:19,311 --> 00:36:22,714
I did my service to the world
by smoking PCP.
801
00:36:22,748 --> 00:36:26,318
I was asked, "When was
the last time you cried?"
802
00:36:26,352 --> 00:36:28,554
Which was,
"When my mom's brain blew up
803
00:36:28,587 --> 00:36:31,857
from an aneurysm
on October 10, 1998."
804
00:36:31,890 --> 00:36:34,460
People would just bring it
to me wherever I was at.
805
00:36:34,493 --> 00:36:37,229
I smoked so much of it,
and, uh,
806
00:36:37,263 --> 00:36:40,399
what I remember
was profound hallucinations
807
00:36:40,432 --> 00:36:41,767
of my mother
808
00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:45,337
who had passed away
3 1/2 years before that.
809
00:36:45,371 --> 00:36:47,005
Just, I had a lot
of intense grief
810
00:36:47,038 --> 00:36:48,840
over losing my mom.
811
00:36:48,874 --> 00:36:51,743
Tonight's show is
for my fucking mother.
812
00:36:51,777 --> 00:36:54,913
And I want you to scream
louder than that for her.
813
00:36:54,946 --> 00:37:00,919
You repeat after me --
"PCP saved my life."
814
00:37:00,952 --> 00:37:04,490
Audience:
PCP saved my life.
815
00:37:04,523 --> 00:37:06,992
Steve-O: Fuck yeah, it did.
816
00:37:07,025 --> 00:37:08,594
But later,
817
00:37:08,627 --> 00:37:12,864
and after I had vowed
to never do it again,
818
00:37:12,898 --> 00:37:16,635
I really got into
a darker place with it.
819
00:37:16,668 --> 00:37:20,038
Man, dude.
We're all gonna die.
820
00:37:20,071 --> 00:37:25,477
I think I'm gonna die,
like, soon.
821
00:37:25,511 --> 00:37:28,947
There was one experience
where I was sitting there,
822
00:37:28,980 --> 00:37:31,783
and I had all my drugs
on that table.
823
00:37:31,817 --> 00:37:33,385
It was
a big, swiveling chair,
824
00:37:33,419 --> 00:37:35,354
and I remember looking
at all these drugs,
825
00:37:35,387 --> 00:37:37,623
thinking to myself,
"I'm killing myself.
826
00:37:37,656 --> 00:37:39,925
I mean, just, like,
there's no longevity in this."
827
00:37:39,958 --> 00:37:44,596
And then I thought,
"I don't care if I die."
828
00:37:44,630 --> 00:37:46,865
And I leaned down
to do more drugs,
829
00:37:46,898 --> 00:37:50,402
and right then,
the chair I was in just spun.
830
00:37:50,436 --> 00:37:54,940
Like -- like as if, like,
a big, powerful, strong,
831
00:37:54,973 --> 00:37:57,576
invisible man was
standing next to it and --
832
00:37:57,609 --> 00:37:58,944
and just spun it.
833
00:37:58,977 --> 00:38:01,680
Like, I was almost
thrown out of it.
834
00:38:01,713 --> 00:38:04,916
And the message that
I gleaned from that was,
835
00:38:04,950 --> 00:38:06,485
"Think again.
836
00:38:06,518 --> 00:38:09,921
It's very important
that -- that you care.
837
00:38:09,955 --> 00:38:11,490
That -- that you not die."
838
00:38:11,523 --> 00:38:13,925
And so you think it was
a sort of PCP entity
839
00:38:13,959 --> 00:38:15,961
that was protecting you
on some level?
840
00:38:15,994 --> 00:38:17,596
Yeah. Yeah.
And to this day...
841
00:38:17,629 --> 00:38:19,998
I mean, now I haven't done drugs
in over 7 years.
842
00:38:20,031 --> 00:38:25,837
And I truly believe
that drugs like this,
843
00:38:25,871 --> 00:38:29,741
uh, erode barriers that --
844
00:38:29,775 --> 00:38:31,510
that -- that...
845
00:38:31,543 --> 00:38:35,414
between us
and the spirit world.
846
00:38:35,447 --> 00:38:37,516
You don't -- Wow.
That's really good.
847
00:38:40,085 --> 00:38:43,822
It seems like PCP generates
some good stories.
848
00:38:43,855 --> 00:38:45,457
Sure.
That's something
to be said for it.
849
00:38:45,491 --> 00:38:47,859
Yeah, you know,
I was just thinking, too.
850
00:38:47,893 --> 00:38:49,661
I wonder, uh...
851
00:38:49,695 --> 00:38:52,030
Do you feel like you,
um...
852
00:38:52,063 --> 00:38:54,533
Do you have any kind
of a conscience about,
853
00:38:54,566 --> 00:38:57,369
like, making it sort of sound,
like, kind of cool?
854
00:38:57,403 --> 00:39:00,105
Like, maybe people are gonna
see this and think,
855
00:39:00,138 --> 00:39:02,374
"God, I want that
to happen to me."
856
00:39:02,408 --> 00:39:04,410
I don't know 'cause,
even if we tried,
857
00:39:04,443 --> 00:39:08,447
it's hard to make
a pro-PCP story.
858
00:39:08,480 --> 00:39:09,881
That's the quote
of the day.
859
00:39:09,915 --> 00:39:13,752
"It's hard to make
a pro-PCP story."
860
00:39:13,785 --> 00:39:14,986
That's great.
861
00:39:15,020 --> 00:39:17,889
It's tough to make PCP
look good.
862
00:39:23,995 --> 00:39:25,531
Most people who do PCP, yo,
863
00:39:25,564 --> 00:39:27,165
they got some emotional shit
with them, dawg.
864
00:39:27,198 --> 00:39:29,034
Like, re--
I noticed that shit.
865
00:39:29,067 --> 00:39:31,670
There's always something
they trying to escape.
866
00:39:34,640 --> 00:39:36,174
That's why motherfuckers
is the way they is.
867
00:39:36,207 --> 00:39:38,710
That's why we on the drugs
that we on, bro.
868
00:39:40,812 --> 00:39:44,716
Whether it be weed or --
or drinking.
869
00:39:44,750 --> 00:39:47,152
I think everybody needs
some type of escape.
870
00:39:47,185 --> 00:39:50,622
[ Man yelling indistinctly ]
871
00:39:50,656 --> 00:39:51,890
Craig: Bro, you look around.
872
00:39:51,923 --> 00:39:53,925
Like, you see
how we live out here.
873
00:39:53,959 --> 00:39:55,461
I don't watch the news no more.
874
00:39:55,494 --> 00:39:56,695
I already know
what the fuck happened.
875
00:39:56,728 --> 00:40:00,666
The -- the news
is like a re-run.
876
00:40:00,699 --> 00:40:02,734
A man shot
in North Philadelphia.
877
00:40:02,768 --> 00:40:05,504
Another three men slain here.
878
00:40:05,537 --> 00:40:06,772
The shit like that, it --
879
00:40:06,805 --> 00:40:09,641
it start to get to you
after a while.
880
00:40:09,675 --> 00:40:11,510
If smoking and dipping
is gonna take you away
881
00:40:11,543 --> 00:40:12,744
from this shit for 6 hours,
882
00:40:12,778 --> 00:40:14,646
that's what motherfuckers
is gonna do.
883
00:40:26,992 --> 00:40:28,494
Morris:
It's hard to find a drug
884
00:40:28,527 --> 00:40:31,930
that people regard
more negatively than PCP.
885
00:40:31,963 --> 00:40:35,133
But its reputation
is undeserved.
886
00:40:35,166 --> 00:40:37,703
It's a drug that had
acknowledged medicinal use
887
00:40:37,736 --> 00:40:40,005
in anesthesia and psychiatry,
888
00:40:40,038 --> 00:40:42,140
and a drug that can serve
as the basis
889
00:40:42,173 --> 00:40:46,545
for new therapies in the future.
890
00:40:46,578 --> 00:40:50,115
Dissociative drugs,
they have therapeutic effects.
891
00:40:50,148 --> 00:40:52,017
It's just that separating
those effects
892
00:40:52,050 --> 00:40:54,920
from the side effects
has been the biggest issue.
893
00:40:54,953 --> 00:40:57,856
But what we can do is develop
better derivatives
894
00:40:57,889 --> 00:40:59,190
that have less
side effects,
895
00:40:59,224 --> 00:41:01,793
and -- and those are
in clinical trials now.
896
00:41:01,827 --> 00:41:04,062
And many people
have been funded
897
00:41:04,095 --> 00:41:05,931
to investigate
derivatives of PCP
898
00:41:05,964 --> 00:41:07,899
because
they are important.
899
00:41:07,933 --> 00:41:09,735
They're important
to a whole range
900
00:41:09,768 --> 00:41:11,637
of therapeutic avenues,
901
00:41:11,670 --> 00:41:15,507
including neuropathic pain,
neurodegenerative diseases,
902
00:41:15,541 --> 00:41:18,544
stroke,
epilepsy, tinnitus.
903
00:41:18,577 --> 00:41:21,780
I mean, you know,
the list goes on and on.
904
00:41:21,813 --> 00:41:26,618
PCP opened up all
these different doors.
905
00:41:26,652 --> 00:41:29,788
Maddox was obviously
a brilliant chemist,
906
00:41:29,821 --> 00:41:32,290
and I think that's best
exemplified by the fact
907
00:41:32,323 --> 00:41:33,859
that he followed through
908
00:41:33,892 --> 00:41:35,961
with this
serendipitous discovery,
909
00:41:35,994 --> 00:41:37,996
and that was PCP.
910
00:41:38,029 --> 00:41:40,532
Many medicinal chemists
and pharmacologists
911
00:41:40,566 --> 00:41:41,867
have spent
their entire careers
912
00:41:41,900 --> 00:41:43,669
following up
on Maddox's discovery.
913
00:41:43,702 --> 00:41:45,571
I mean, that alone
is significant.
914
00:41:45,604 --> 00:41:47,739
Certainly, I've spent
the last 6 years
915
00:41:47,773 --> 00:41:50,809
or so, you know,
following up on it
916
00:41:50,842 --> 00:41:53,178
and looking into the structure
activity relationship
917
00:41:53,211 --> 00:41:56,114
of these compounds,
many of which he made.
918
00:41:56,147 --> 00:41:59,651
Do you think we, as a country
and as a society,
919
00:41:59,685 --> 00:42:02,721
owe Dr. Maddox an apology?
920
00:42:02,754 --> 00:42:04,222
I think, you know,
921
00:42:04,255 --> 00:42:07,225
maybe the media
should apologize to him.
922
00:42:07,258 --> 00:42:10,762
Maybe they should bring him
a bouquet of flowers.
923
00:42:10,796 --> 00:42:12,798
Yes.
Somebody certainly should.
924
00:42:14,700 --> 00:42:17,268
So...
925
00:42:17,302 --> 00:42:19,070
Somebody
certainly should.
926
00:42:32,050 --> 00:42:34,252
Morris: This bouquet of flowers
is for Victor Harold Maddox,
927
00:42:34,285 --> 00:42:36,354
the chemist who discovered PCP.
928
00:42:36,387 --> 00:42:38,590
It contains 25 white roses
929
00:42:38,624 --> 00:42:41,259
to signify
the 25 hydrogen atoms,
930
00:42:41,292 --> 00:42:44,863
17 black roses
for the 17 carbon atoms,
931
00:42:44,896 --> 00:42:47,633
and one blue rose
for the nitrogen atom.
932
00:42:53,839 --> 00:42:56,708
Vic Maddox made
a scientific breakthrough
933
00:42:56,742 --> 00:43:00,612
when he accidentally
discovered PCP,
934
00:43:00,646 --> 00:43:03,949
paving the way for the study
of NMDA receptors
935
00:43:03,982 --> 00:43:08,053
and revolutionizing
the history of anesthesia.
936
00:43:08,086 --> 00:43:11,056
Wyllie: Everything happens
intentionally.
937
00:43:11,089 --> 00:43:12,891
Nothing
is left to chance.
938
00:43:15,026 --> 00:43:18,630
E.F. Domino once said
that humans,
939
00:43:18,664 --> 00:43:21,332
in their never-ending
quest to explore
940
00:43:21,366 --> 00:43:27,005
and discover, may yet find
a pot of therapeutic gold
941
00:43:27,038 --> 00:43:30,208
at the end of a spectacular
and, at times,
942
00:43:30,241 --> 00:43:34,312
rather dismal PCP rainbow.
943
00:43:36,982 --> 00:43:38,383
On behalf of a world
944
00:43:38,416 --> 00:43:42,053
that has misunderstood
your greatest discovery,
945
00:43:42,087 --> 00:43:44,990
I'm sorry, Dr. Maddox.
946
00:43:45,023 --> 00:43:46,391
I'm sorry.
72043
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