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Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:07,040 They were shocking. 2 00:00:04,680 --> 00:00:09,520 They were horribly gruesome. They were 3 00:00:07,040 --> 00:00:12,360 bloody. People were being chopped up and 4 00:00:09,520 --> 00:00:14,120 battered with axes. And I'm 9 or 10, I'd 5 00:00:12,360 --> 00:00:16,760 never seen anything like this. It was 6 00:00:14,120 --> 00:00:19,840 amazing. Horror comics were, you know, 7 00:00:16,760 --> 00:00:22,160 to my little seven eight-year-old self, 8 00:00:19,840 --> 00:00:23,920 they were my pornography. This was the 9 00:00:22,160 --> 00:00:27,920 stuff that I knew I shouldn't be looking 10 00:00:23,920 --> 00:00:30,520 at, but you know, I couldn't give it up. 11 00:00:27,920 --> 00:00:32,080 They were sensational. 12 00:00:30,520 --> 00:00:34,440 They reached deeper and deeper into the 13 00:00:32,080 --> 00:00:36,320 Springboard barrel. The stories got 14 00:00:34,440 --> 00:00:38,840 bloodier and bloodier. Did it go 15 00:00:36,320 --> 00:00:41,200 overboard? Yeah, I think so in a couple 16 00:00:38,840 --> 00:00:42,160 of spots. I didn't write it, but I drew 17 00:00:41,200 --> 00:00:44,520 it. 18 00:00:42,160 --> 00:00:46,120 And I felt very bad about that. Mothers 19 00:00:44,520 --> 00:00:48,880 and fathers say, "I don't want my kid to 20 00:00:46,120 --> 00:00:48,880 read that." 21 00:00:49,840 --> 00:00:53,360 They were controversial. 22 00:00:52,400 --> 00:00:54,720 Well, 23 00:00:53,360 --> 00:00:56,640 do you think that this cover is in bad 24 00:00:54,720 --> 00:00:58,400 taste? He goes, "No, I don't think so. 25 00:00:56,640 --> 00:01:00,600 How would it be in bad taste?" And he 26 00:00:58,400 --> 00:01:02,440 said, "Well, if you showed the gore drop 27 00:01:00,600 --> 00:01:04,400 dripping from it." And they nailed him 28 00:01:02,440 --> 00:01:08,560 with that. 29 00:01:04,400 --> 00:01:11,040 And ultimately, they were outlawed. 30 00:01:08,560 --> 00:01:12,800 I think they were all completely shocked 31 00:01:11,040 --> 00:01:14,760 when the Senate subcommittee came 32 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:17,040 forward and said, "You people are the 33 00:01:14,760 --> 00:01:20,560 cause of juvenile delinquency." 34 00:01:17,040 --> 00:01:22,040 The horror comics were a very convenient 35 00:01:20,560 --> 00:01:24,720 target. 36 00:01:22,040 --> 00:01:27,120 And the powers that be took advantage of 37 00:01:24,720 --> 00:01:27,120 that. 38 00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:48,080 My name is William Gaines. 39 00:01:45,040 --> 00:01:50,240 On April 22nd, 1954, 40 00:01:48,080 --> 00:01:52,720 William M. Gaines, publisher of 41 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:55,000 Entertaining Comics, testified before 42 00:01:52,720 --> 00:01:57,040 the U.S. Senate subcommittee on juvenile 43 00:01:55,000 --> 00:01:58,480 delinquency. 44 00:01:57,040 --> 00:02:00,880 I was the first publisher in these 45 00:01:58,480 --> 00:02:04,400 United States to publish horror comics. 46 00:02:00,880 --> 00:02:06,320 I'm responsible. I started them. 47 00:02:04,400 --> 00:02:09,200 Some may not like them. 48 00:02:06,320 --> 00:02:11,040 That's a matter of personal taste. 49 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:13,000 It would be just as difficult to explain 50 00:02:11,040 --> 00:02:14,640 the harmless thrill of a horror story to 51 00:02:13,000 --> 00:02:16,480 a Dr. Wertham 52 00:02:14,640 --> 00:02:18,880 as it would be to explain the sublimity 53 00:02:16,480 --> 00:02:20,600 of love to a frigid old maid. 54 00:02:18,880 --> 00:02:22,920 What are we afraid of? 55 00:02:20,600 --> 00:02:24,400 Are we afraid of our own children? 56 00:02:22,920 --> 00:02:25,360 Do we forget that they are citizens, 57 00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:27,000 too? 58 00:02:25,360 --> 00:02:28,200 And entitled to the essential freedom to 59 00:02:27,000 --> 00:02:30,120 read? 60 00:02:28,200 --> 00:02:32,360 Or do we think our children so evil, so 61 00:02:30,120 --> 00:02:34,240 vicious, so simple-minded that it takes 62 00:02:32,360 --> 00:02:36,200 but a comic magazine story of murder to 63 00:02:34,240 --> 00:02:38,880 set them to murder, of robbery to set 64 00:02:36,200 --> 00:02:41,160 them to robbery? 65 00:02:38,880 --> 00:02:43,480 Just 4 years earlier, Gaines had 66 00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:47,560 revolutionized the medium by launching a 67 00:02:43,480 --> 00:02:50,240 new trend in comic books, horror. 68 00:02:47,560 --> 00:02:52,480 EC's graphically gory tales, while 69 00:02:50,240 --> 00:02:55,040 immensely popular with readers, would 70 00:02:52,480 --> 00:02:56,440 soon draw the wrath of both parents and 71 00:02:55,040 --> 00:02:59,080 politicians 72 00:02:56,440 --> 00:03:01,920 and threaten to destroy the entire comic 73 00:02:59,080 --> 00:03:01,920 book industry. 74 00:03:13,440 --> 00:03:17,400 It could be said that Bill Gaines had 75 00:03:15,560 --> 00:03:19,560 comics in his blood. 76 00:03:17,400 --> 00:03:22,040 His father, Max, was a pioneer in the 77 00:03:19,560 --> 00:03:26,280 medium, creating the first comic book, 78 00:03:22,040 --> 00:03:26,280 Famous Funnies, in 1934. 79 00:03:26,400 --> 00:03:31,840 4 years later, Gaines joined ranks with 80 00:03:29,120 --> 00:03:34,000 Superman publisher Harry Donenfeld and 81 00:03:31,840 --> 00:03:35,680 launched a new line, All-American 82 00:03:34,000 --> 00:03:37,800 Comics. 83 00:03:35,680 --> 00:03:40,400 Featuring such superheroes as the Green 84 00:03:37,800 --> 00:03:43,320 Lantern and Wonder Woman, the AA line 85 00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:47,519 was extremely popular with sales soaring 86 00:03:43,320 --> 00:03:50,600 to over 8 million copies per month. 87 00:03:47,519 --> 00:03:53,680 Comic books made Max Gaines a fortune. 88 00:03:50,600 --> 00:03:56,960 In early 1945, he sold his share of All 89 00:03:53,680 --> 00:03:59,280 American for half a million dollars. 90 00:03:56,960 --> 00:04:02,120 He created a new company, Educational 91 00:03:59,280 --> 00:04:04,600 Comics or EC, which published such 92 00:04:02,120 --> 00:04:07,040 sedate titles as Picture Stories from 93 00:04:04,600 --> 00:04:09,800 the Bible. 94 00:04:07,040 --> 00:04:12,040 Not surprisingly, EC's sales languished 95 00:04:09,800 --> 00:04:13,800 near the bottom of the industry. 96 00:04:12,040 --> 00:04:15,560 Educational Comics were pretty much like 97 00:04:13,800 --> 00:04:16,920 educational everything. Nobody wanted to 98 00:04:15,560 --> 00:04:18,720 buy them. 99 00:04:16,920 --> 00:04:20,320 Uh that's why slowly but surely 100 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:22,560 educational comics morphed into 101 00:04:20,320 --> 00:04:25,040 entertaining comics. 102 00:04:22,560 --> 00:04:27,760 Max Gaines changed his company's name 103 00:04:25,040 --> 00:04:30,080 and direction, but not its fortunes. 104 00:04:27,760 --> 00:04:34,040 Sales continued to lag as children 105 00:04:30,080 --> 00:04:34,040 ignored EC in droves. 106 00:04:34,280 --> 00:04:38,960 Bill Gaines also wanted nothing to do 107 00:04:36,360 --> 00:04:40,640 with his father's comic books. In fact, 108 00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:42,720 Bill wanted no part of the family 109 00:04:40,640 --> 00:04:45,200 business. 110 00:04:42,720 --> 00:04:47,360 Max Gaines had an explosive temper and 111 00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:50,120 Bill often found himself the target of 112 00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:51,560 his father's wrath. 113 00:04:50,120 --> 00:04:53,120 From all accounts, the relationship 114 00:04:51,560 --> 00:04:54,760 between Bill Gaines and his father was a 115 00:04:53,120 --> 00:04:57,200 very hard one and a very little bit 116 00:04:54,760 --> 00:04:58,560 abusive on the edge. Max Gaines had 117 00:04:57,200 --> 00:05:01,480 built his comic book company out of 118 00:04:58,560 --> 00:05:03,280 nothing and was very impatient with 119 00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:04,760 artists and writers and apparently with 120 00:05:03,280 --> 00:05:07,240 his son as well. 121 00:05:04,760 --> 00:05:09,520 He considered Bill the world's biggest 122 00:05:07,240 --> 00:05:11,680 klutz. 123 00:05:09,520 --> 00:05:12,919 And Bill often tried to live down to 124 00:05:11,680 --> 00:05:14,440 that. 125 00:05:12,919 --> 00:05:16,680 Max constantly said to Bill, "You'll 126 00:05:14,440 --> 00:05:18,520 never amount to anything." 127 00:05:16,680 --> 00:05:19,960 Bill did his best to stay out of his 128 00:05:18,520 --> 00:05:22,360 father's way. 129 00:05:19,960 --> 00:05:24,320 After a stint in the Army Air Corps, he 130 00:05:22,360 --> 00:05:28,000 enrolled at New York University to 131 00:05:24,320 --> 00:05:28,000 pursue his teaching credential. 132 00:05:28,080 --> 00:05:33,919 Then in 1947, tragedy struck. 133 00:05:31,760 --> 00:05:35,680 Max was killed in a boating accident 134 00:05:33,919 --> 00:05:37,240 near the family's summer home on Lake 135 00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:39,680 Placid. 136 00:05:37,240 --> 00:05:42,080 Prodded by his mother, Bill reluctantly 137 00:05:39,680 --> 00:05:43,919 took over the reins at EC. 138 00:05:42,080 --> 00:05:46,400 Bill was not enthusiastic about the 139 00:05:43,919 --> 00:05:48,360 idea. His father had been failing. The 140 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:50,000 business owed already about a hundred 141 00:05:48,360 --> 00:05:52,080 thousand dollars. 142 00:05:50,000 --> 00:05:54,920 Uh things weren't looking good when he 143 00:05:52,080 --> 00:05:57,320 came in. And uh Bill said, "How do you 144 00:05:54,920 --> 00:05:58,600 expect me to do this? My father didn't 145 00:05:57,320 --> 00:06:00,720 do it and he was a pretty smart 146 00:05:58,600 --> 00:06:02,840 financial guy." 147 00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:04,840 Gaines slowly learned the ropes and 148 00:06:02,840 --> 00:06:06,760 moved the comics more in line with his 149 00:06:04,840 --> 00:06:09,920 personal tastes. 150 00:06:06,760 --> 00:06:13,200 A turning point came in March 1948 when 151 00:06:09,920 --> 00:06:15,280 a 23-year-old artist named Al Feldstein 152 00:06:13,200 --> 00:06:17,480 knocked on the door at EC. 153 00:06:15,280 --> 00:06:18,680 I went down to see Bill Gaines and I 154 00:06:17,480 --> 00:06:20,640 showed him 155 00:06:18,680 --> 00:06:22,880 the the stuff I'd been doing and he got 156 00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:24,480 it very intrigued with them. My girls, 157 00:06:22,880 --> 00:06:26,720 they called them headlight comics 158 00:06:24,480 --> 00:06:28,840 because I did kind of new bio girls with 159 00:06:26,720 --> 00:06:31,240 tight sweaters, you know, Lana Turner 160 00:06:28,840 --> 00:06:33,800 movies. And so he gave me a contract to 161 00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:35,120 do a teenage book called going steady 162 00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:37,600 with Peggy. 163 00:06:35,120 --> 00:06:39,360 But before even one issue was published, 164 00:06:37,600 --> 00:06:40,800 the bottom fell out of the teenage 165 00:06:39,360 --> 00:06:43,360 craze. 166 00:06:40,800 --> 00:06:46,240 Feldstein agreed to tear up the contract 167 00:06:43,360 --> 00:06:48,800 and began working on EC's other titles, 168 00:06:46,240 --> 00:06:51,360 imitations of then popular romance, 169 00:06:48,800 --> 00:06:53,680 western, and crime comics. 170 00:06:51,360 --> 00:06:56,560 After a few years of doing this follow 171 00:06:53,680 --> 00:06:59,160 the leader thing, Feldstein and Gaines 172 00:06:56,560 --> 00:07:00,640 realized that this was not the way to go 173 00:06:59,160 --> 00:07:03,560 and they realized that they had a common 174 00:07:00,640 --> 00:07:05,880 love of the old sort of lights out Inner 175 00:07:03,560 --> 00:07:10,400 Sanctum radio shows. 176 00:07:05,880 --> 00:07:13,320 Bayer and Ice Yeast presents Lights Out 177 00:07:10,400 --> 00:07:13,320 everybody. 178 00:07:14,200 --> 00:07:17,760 Lights Out 179 00:07:15,840 --> 00:07:19,840 brings you stories of the supernatural 180 00:07:17,760 --> 00:07:21,880 and the supernormal 181 00:07:19,840 --> 00:07:24,200 dramatizing the fantasies and the 182 00:07:21,880 --> 00:07:26,040 mysteries of the unknown. One of the 183 00:07:24,200 --> 00:07:30,200 things that I was always fascinated with 184 00:07:26,040 --> 00:07:32,919 was the old radio horror shows from Arch 185 00:07:30,200 --> 00:07:36,240 Oboler like the Witches' Tale and Lights 186 00:07:32,919 --> 00:07:38,080 Out and Inner Sanctum. And I said, "Why 187 00:07:36,240 --> 00:07:41,000 don't we do kind of gothic horror in 188 00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:42,640 comics? Scare the pants off the kids." 189 00:07:41,000 --> 00:07:45,280 Eager to take the company in a new 190 00:07:42,640 --> 00:07:47,200 direction, Gaines agreed to test the 191 00:07:45,280 --> 00:07:49,480 waters of horror. 192 00:07:47,200 --> 00:07:52,280 Feldstein wrote two stories, The Crypt 193 00:07:49,480 --> 00:07:55,440 of Terror and The Vault of Horror, which 194 00:07:52,280 --> 00:07:58,000 ran in EC's crime comics. 195 00:07:55,440 --> 00:08:00,720 Sales improved overnight. Gaines 196 00:07:58,000 --> 00:08:02,920 immediately canceled EC's current line 197 00:08:00,720 --> 00:08:05,840 and launched what he called a new trend 198 00:08:02,920 --> 00:08:05,840 in magazines. 199 00:08:18,360 --> 00:08:24,560 In January 1950, The Crypt of Terror and 200 00:08:21,760 --> 00:08:27,200 The Vault of Horror hit the newsstands. 201 00:08:24,560 --> 00:08:30,560 Two other titles, The Haunt of Fear and 202 00:08:27,200 --> 00:08:32,800 Crime Suspense Stories, soon followed. 203 00:08:30,560 --> 00:08:35,440 After three issues, Gaines changed the 204 00:08:32,800 --> 00:08:36,919 title of The Crypt of Terror to Tales 205 00:08:35,440 --> 00:08:41,440 from the Crypt. 206 00:08:36,919 --> 00:08:41,440 It would become EC's biggest seller. 207 00:08:51,680 --> 00:08:56,560 Early stories featured standard scare 208 00:08:53,960 --> 00:08:59,440 fare, such as mummies, vampires, and 209 00:08:56,560 --> 00:08:59,440 haunted houses. 210 00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:06,160 Gaines and Feldstein soon developed 211 00:09:03,320 --> 00:09:08,720 their own signature. Simple tales of 212 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:13,280 good and evil, which culminated in an 213 00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:13,280 ironic, unusually deadly ending. 214 00:09:14,640 --> 00:09:19,040 Every one of those stories would have a 215 00:09:16,320 --> 00:09:22,360 twist. Most of those twists were the 216 00:09:19,040 --> 00:09:24,560 just dessert twists. That is, whenever 217 00:09:22,360 --> 00:09:26,680 there was a really bad person in these 218 00:09:24,560 --> 00:09:28,920 comics, they would indeed get their 219 00:09:26,680 --> 00:09:31,280 comeuppance, usually in the same way 220 00:09:28,920 --> 00:09:34,200 they were delivering it to others. 221 00:09:31,280 --> 00:09:37,000 In one story titled Taint the Meat, It's 222 00:09:34,200 --> 00:09:39,440 the Humanity, a mild-mannered butcher 223 00:09:37,000 --> 00:09:41,920 named Zack Grissle tries to boost 224 00:09:39,440 --> 00:09:45,400 profits by selling spoiled meat to his 225 00:09:41,920 --> 00:09:45,400 unsuspecting customers. 226 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:48,880 Pack your things, Sarah. We're leaving 227 00:09:47,800 --> 00:09:51,280 town. 228 00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:53,920 You're in trouble. They found out. I 229 00:09:51,280 --> 00:09:56,200 warned you not to sell horse meat. It's 230 00:09:53,920 --> 00:09:59,600 worse than that, Sarah. Four people are 231 00:09:56,200 --> 00:10:01,760 dead already. I sold them tainted meat. 232 00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:03,520 You You what? 233 00:10:01,760 --> 00:10:06,080 You're a murderer. 234 00:10:03,520 --> 00:10:08,880 I did it for us, Sarah. For you and me 235 00:10:06,080 --> 00:10:11,840 and Junior. Junior? He's eating at 236 00:10:08,880 --> 00:10:13,960 Herbie Horton's house. Horton? She 237 00:10:11,840 --> 00:10:16,200 bought some of it. 238 00:10:13,960 --> 00:10:19,560 I feel sick, Mommy. 239 00:10:16,200 --> 00:10:22,720 Junior, baby. 240 00:10:19,560 --> 00:10:26,560 He's dead, Zack. Dead. You killed him, 241 00:10:22,720 --> 00:10:28,720 too. Our son. Sarah, put down that 242 00:10:26,560 --> 00:10:30,760 knife. 243 00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:33,000 Good lord. 244 00:10:30,760 --> 00:10:36,720 Tainted meat? 245 00:10:33,000 --> 00:10:40,000 Tainted meat, anyone? 246 00:10:36,720 --> 00:10:41,960 EC pioneered dozens of new and ghastly 247 00:10:40,000 --> 00:10:44,680 methods of comeuppance. 248 00:10:41,960 --> 00:10:48,040 Villains were eaten by ghouls, skewered 249 00:10:44,680 --> 00:10:49,839 on swords, buried alive, stuffed down 250 00:10:48,040 --> 00:10:52,080 garbage disposals, 251 00:10:49,839 --> 00:10:54,480 even southern fried. 252 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:56,040 It gave new meaning to the term an eye 253 00:10:54,480 --> 00:10:59,320 for an eye. 254 00:10:56,040 --> 00:11:01,960 In EC Comics and in in much of horror, 255 00:10:59,320 --> 00:11:03,920 there's a code that that allows the bad 256 00:11:01,960 --> 00:11:05,440 guy or the evil force or whatever it is 257 00:11:03,920 --> 00:11:07,760 to be 258 00:11:05,440 --> 00:11:10,760 if not vanquished, at least put at bay 259 00:11:07,760 --> 00:11:13,280 at the end so we can walk out safely. 260 00:11:10,760 --> 00:11:15,520 Gaines and Feldstein mixed their horror 261 00:11:13,280 --> 00:11:18,080 with an element which would become an EC 262 00:11:15,520 --> 00:11:19,880 trademark, humor. 263 00:11:18,080 --> 00:11:22,400 Its source was quite often the story's 264 00:11:19,880 --> 00:11:24,240 narrator, a device they also borrowed 265 00:11:22,400 --> 00:11:27,320 from an old radio show. 266 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:29,720 I had remembered the old witch in 267 00:11:27,320 --> 00:11:32,440 Witch's Tale, and I remember her 268 00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:35,960 cackling and laughing and saying, "I'm 269 00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:38,920 103 years old today, Satan, and I've got 270 00:11:35,960 --> 00:11:41,440 a scary story to tell all my listeners." 271 00:11:38,920 --> 00:11:43,720 >> And now, Satan, 272 00:11:41,440 --> 00:11:46,520 if everybody'll just dust off them 273 00:11:43,720 --> 00:11:49,400 lights and make it nice and dark, we'll 274 00:11:46,520 --> 00:11:53,000 get right down to business. 275 00:11:49,400 --> 00:11:54,240 Draw up to the fire and gaze into them 276 00:11:53,000 --> 00:11:57,720 bugs. 277 00:11:54,240 --> 00:12:00,240 Gaze into them deep. 278 00:11:57,720 --> 00:12:02,360 Feldstein created a trio of ghoulish 279 00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:04,520 hosts who welcomed readers into the 280 00:12:02,360 --> 00:12:07,560 world of the macabre. 281 00:12:04,520 --> 00:12:09,760 The Crypt-Keeper, the Vault-Keeper, 282 00:12:07,560 --> 00:12:13,000 and the Old Witch. 283 00:12:09,760 --> 00:12:15,720 Greetings, heartlings. 284 00:12:13,000 --> 00:12:18,200 Yes, it's your feeder of foul flavors, 285 00:12:15,720 --> 00:12:22,720 the Old Witch, come again. 286 00:12:18,200 --> 00:12:24,280 Got a certain recipe for you this time. 287 00:12:22,720 --> 00:12:26,840 The humor was a very vital element of 288 00:12:24,280 --> 00:12:28,880 these books because if you took these 289 00:12:26,840 --> 00:12:30,280 stories out of context, there's some of 290 00:12:28,880 --> 00:12:32,520 them were pretty grisly and some of them 291 00:12:30,280 --> 00:12:35,240 were not children's fare. But by having 292 00:12:32,520 --> 00:12:36,520 them full of these bad horror puns and 293 00:12:35,240 --> 00:12:38,560 having the the host come in and 294 00:12:36,520 --> 00:12:40,320 wisecrack about them, they kind of took 295 00:12:38,560 --> 00:12:43,640 the edge off the horror. 296 00:12:40,320 --> 00:12:45,680 By using the horror hosts, EC kept a 297 00:12:43,640 --> 00:12:47,880 perspective on what they were doing and 298 00:12:45,680 --> 00:12:50,800 they reminded their readers that this 299 00:12:47,880 --> 00:12:53,160 was fiction and it was entertainment. 300 00:12:50,800 --> 00:12:57,400 Certainly, it was entertainment. The 301 00:12:53,160 --> 00:13:00,160 ghoul lunatics kept the comic horror 302 00:12:57,400 --> 00:13:02,640 books comic. 303 00:13:00,160 --> 00:13:04,640 This mix of humor and horror had a 304 00:13:02,640 --> 00:13:07,400 tremendous influence on children's 305 00:13:04,640 --> 00:13:09,240 author R.L. Stine. 306 00:13:07,400 --> 00:13:11,240 When I started writing these scary books 307 00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:15,160 for kids, 308 00:13:11,240 --> 00:13:16,720 I thought back to the EC Comics and how 309 00:13:15,160 --> 00:13:19,080 much I loved them and I tried to 310 00:13:16,720 --> 00:13:20,680 remember what it was about them that I 311 00:13:19,080 --> 00:13:22,640 loved so much. 312 00:13:20,680 --> 00:13:26,400 And I remembered that it was that 313 00:13:22,640 --> 00:13:28,160 amazing mix of horror and humor. 314 00:13:26,400 --> 00:13:30,280 There was always a funny twist. People 315 00:13:28,160 --> 00:13:32,800 were always making horrible puns about 316 00:13:30,280 --> 00:13:35,600 it. It was funny. And it's sort of what 317 00:13:32,800 --> 00:13:37,480 I try to do at a much gentler level in 318 00:13:35,600 --> 00:13:39,640 my books. You know, the whole thing was 319 00:13:37,480 --> 00:13:41,640 a big joke to Bill. He wanted to publish 320 00:13:39,640 --> 00:13:44,400 and have fun and see if he could do 321 00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:46,640 stories the way he liked to do it and 322 00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:48,880 hope that he made money. 323 00:13:46,640 --> 00:13:50,160 Gaines succeeded beyond his wildest 324 00:13:48,880 --> 00:13:52,160 dreams. 325 00:13:50,160 --> 00:13:54,520 Although his horror comics didn't match 326 00:13:52,160 --> 00:13:56,880 the total sales of Superman, they 327 00:13:54,520 --> 00:13:58,440 outsold almost every other comic on a 328 00:13:56,880 --> 00:14:01,320 percentage basis, 329 00:13:58,440 --> 00:14:03,080 propelling the company into the black. 330 00:14:01,320 --> 00:14:05,760 I think Dad was very surprised that they 331 00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:07,640 were as successful as they were. He knew 332 00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:10,240 that it was something that he liked and 333 00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:12,240 enjoyed, but he wasn't quite sure if 334 00:14:10,240 --> 00:14:14,920 anybody else would really enjoy it, too. 335 00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:17,800 So, I think he was surprised and and 336 00:14:14,920 --> 00:14:17,800 very happy. 337 00:14:29,880 --> 00:14:34,200 An avid reader of science fiction, 338 00:14:32,280 --> 00:14:38,440 Gaines followed the horror books with 339 00:14:34,200 --> 00:14:38,440 weird science and weird fantasy. 340 00:14:38,680 --> 00:14:44,080 Featuring futuristic tales of flying 341 00:14:41,040 --> 00:14:46,240 saucers and alien worlds, EC's science 342 00:14:44,080 --> 00:14:48,520 fiction books never attained the same 343 00:14:46,240 --> 00:14:50,320 level of popularity and success as the 344 00:14:48,520 --> 00:14:52,280 horror comics. 345 00:14:50,320 --> 00:14:55,760 Yet, they are considered by many to be 346 00:14:52,280 --> 00:14:55,760 classics of the genre. 347 00:14:56,680 --> 00:15:01,440 Although neither man had formal training 348 00:14:58,720 --> 00:15:03,320 as a writer, Gaines and Feldstein shared 349 00:15:01,440 --> 00:15:05,640 the title of editor. 350 00:15:03,320 --> 00:15:08,880 Together, they plotted most of EC's 351 00:15:05,640 --> 00:15:10,640 horror and science fiction stories. 352 00:15:08,880 --> 00:15:12,720 Gaines would come in with what he called 353 00:15:10,640 --> 00:15:14,480 springboards and they were story ideas 354 00:15:12,720 --> 00:15:16,520 which he got from reading other books, 355 00:15:14,480 --> 00:15:18,200 going to movies, and he would pitch them 356 00:15:16,520 --> 00:15:19,640 to Feldstein and Feldstein would turn 357 00:15:18,200 --> 00:15:21,800 down the first one and the second one 358 00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:24,240 and the fifth one. And someplace around 359 00:15:21,800 --> 00:15:25,360 idea number 14 Feldstein would get 360 00:15:24,240 --> 00:15:26,720 interested and said, "Yeah, I can make 361 00:15:25,360 --> 00:15:28,520 that work." 362 00:15:26,720 --> 00:15:31,240 Feldstein would then write the story 363 00:15:28,520 --> 00:15:33,320 himself, laying it out directly onto the 364 00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:35,720 illustration board, which the artist 365 00:15:33,320 --> 00:15:38,200 would use to draw the panels. 366 00:15:35,720 --> 00:15:40,320 Each horror book had four stories, and 367 00:15:38,200 --> 00:15:44,680 it was up to Gaines and Feldstein to 368 00:15:40,320 --> 00:15:44,680 create one new tale every day. 369 00:15:48,160 --> 00:15:52,800 Scrounging for plots, Gaines read 370 00:15:50,480 --> 00:15:54,920 everything he could get his hands on, 371 00:15:52,800 --> 00:15:57,120 liberally borrowing from some of the 372 00:15:54,920 --> 00:15:57,920 best writers in the field. 373 00:15:57,120 --> 00:15:59,600 Bill would come in with these 374 00:15:57,920 --> 00:16:01,600 springboards. He wouldn't tell me what 375 00:15:59,600 --> 00:16:05,160 source they were because he didn't want 376 00:16:01,600 --> 00:16:06,400 me to steal the story. And he brought in 377 00:16:05,160 --> 00:16:08,000 a couple of 378 00:16:06,400 --> 00:16:11,240 springboards for science fiction 379 00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:13,280 stories, and I liked two of them, 380 00:16:11,240 --> 00:16:15,760 and I combined them into something 381 00:16:13,280 --> 00:16:18,040 called Home to Stay. 382 00:16:15,760 --> 00:16:21,240 But Gaines' springboards turned out to 383 00:16:18,040 --> 00:16:23,680 be two existing stories by Ray Bradbury, 384 00:16:21,240 --> 00:16:25,680 then a best-selling author. 385 00:16:23,680 --> 00:16:29,480 Bradbury noticed the unauthorized 386 00:16:25,680 --> 00:16:30,839 adaptation and wrote to Gaines. 387 00:16:29,480 --> 00:16:32,960 We got a letter 388 00:16:30,839 --> 00:16:35,320 from Ray Bradbury, "Hey you guys, you 389 00:16:32,960 --> 00:16:37,800 neglected uh to pay me my royalties for 390 00:16:35,320 --> 00:16:39,040 the two stories you swiped." And Bill 391 00:16:37,800 --> 00:16:40,960 said, "Oh, you know, we didn't know how 392 00:16:39,040 --> 00:16:42,360 to get in touch with you." 393 00:16:40,960 --> 00:16:44,240 And he said, "But we'd love to pay you 394 00:16:42,360 --> 00:16:46,040 for it, and uh 395 00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:49,880 how about letting us adapt your stories 396 00:16:46,040 --> 00:16:52,720 into comics?" With Bradbury's blessing, 397 00:16:49,880 --> 00:16:54,800 Feldstein would go on to adapt 26 of the 398 00:16:52,720 --> 00:16:56,839 author's short stories. 399 00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:58,839 Each one became an instant comic book 400 00:16:56,839 --> 00:17:01,960 classic. 401 00:16:58,839 --> 00:17:03,400 Because he is our premier short story 402 00:17:01,960 --> 00:17:06,480 writer, 403 00:17:03,400 --> 00:17:08,120 uh his stories were made to order for 404 00:17:06,480 --> 00:17:09,760 EC. 405 00:17:08,120 --> 00:17:12,680 Every time you think of one of these 406 00:17:09,760 --> 00:17:15,040 stories, you tend to rank it as a 407 00:17:12,680 --> 00:17:17,439 masterpiece. 408 00:17:15,040 --> 00:17:19,800 Doing the Bradbury adaptations inspired 409 00:17:17,439 --> 00:17:21,480 me to be a better writer. And I think 410 00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:25,000 that's what you see he's really noted 411 00:17:21,480 --> 00:17:27,600 for was that we kind of elevated the 412 00:17:25,000 --> 00:17:28,680 level of storytelling 413 00:17:27,600 --> 00:17:30,800 to a 414 00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:34,480 greater height than it had been attained 415 00:17:30,800 --> 00:17:34,480 prior in comic books. 416 00:17:43,000 --> 00:17:47,560 EC's stable of artists included some of 417 00:17:45,680 --> 00:17:48,960 the most talented men ever to work in 418 00:17:47,560 --> 00:17:51,080 the field. 419 00:17:48,960 --> 00:17:53,240 Gaines gave them top billing allowing 420 00:17:51,080 --> 00:17:55,080 them to sign their pages and even 421 00:17:53,240 --> 00:17:56,800 publishing their biographies inside the 422 00:17:55,080 --> 00:17:59,160 front cover. 423 00:17:56,800 --> 00:18:01,080 More importantly, he gave them creative 424 00:17:59,160 --> 00:18:03,120 freedom. 425 00:18:01,080 --> 00:18:05,240 Early on I I said to Bill, you know, 426 00:18:03,120 --> 00:18:07,040 most comic books have a kind of a 427 00:18:05,240 --> 00:18:09,720 sameness to them. I said, "What we've 428 00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:11,680 got to do is encourage our artists to 429 00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:14,720 write in their own handwriting, 430 00:18:11,680 --> 00:18:17,240 not to imitate, but to each have their 431 00:18:14,720 --> 00:18:19,680 own style." 432 00:18:17,240 --> 00:18:22,640 The styles ran the gamut from squeaky 433 00:18:19,680 --> 00:18:24,720 clean to gothically grotesque. 434 00:18:22,640 --> 00:18:25,840 Into the latter category fell Graham 435 00:18:24,720 --> 00:18:28,200 Ingels. 436 00:18:25,840 --> 00:18:30,520 A painter by training, Ingels developed 437 00:18:28,200 --> 00:18:33,080 a special knack for horror which earned 438 00:18:30,520 --> 00:18:34,560 him the nickname Ghastly. 439 00:18:33,080 --> 00:18:36,680 Graham Ingels was the greatest guy at 440 00:18:34,560 --> 00:18:39,720 drawing walking dead, pieces of flesh 441 00:18:36,680 --> 00:18:41,560 falling from bodies. Uh he had this way 442 00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:43,160 of getting a texture on the on the 443 00:18:41,560 --> 00:18:45,000 people he was drawing that no one else 444 00:18:43,160 --> 00:18:47,400 ever got with this rotten color 445 00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:49,560 reproduction. Somehow you just felt 446 00:18:47,400 --> 00:18:52,680 things oozing out of pores when he drew 447 00:18:49,560 --> 00:18:54,520 things. Graham Ingels had this way of of 448 00:18:52,680 --> 00:18:57,560 drawing people 449 00:18:54,520 --> 00:19:00,800 and he made them look like melting wax. 450 00:18:57,560 --> 00:19:03,960 There was a feeling of decay about his 451 00:19:00,800 --> 00:19:06,160 drawings that that was just so so 452 00:19:03,960 --> 00:19:07,840 appealing in a very kind of under the 453 00:19:06,160 --> 00:19:09,640 skin way. 454 00:19:07,840 --> 00:19:11,880 I remember looking at his drawings when 455 00:19:09,640 --> 00:19:14,160 I was a kid and imagining I could smell 456 00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:14,160 it. 457 00:19:15,600 --> 00:19:21,040 At the opposite end of the terror 458 00:19:17,280 --> 00:19:21,040 spectrum was Jack Kamen. 459 00:19:21,320 --> 00:19:26,040 Jack Kamen was an illustrator, a very 460 00:19:24,000 --> 00:19:28,560 straight kind of illustrator, and he did 461 00:19:26,040 --> 00:19:30,480 very pretty girls. 462 00:19:28,560 --> 00:19:34,040 Everybody was nice and handsome. I 463 00:19:30,480 --> 00:19:36,800 called him the Father Knows Best artist. 464 00:19:34,040 --> 00:19:39,240 Kamen's style was best suited for EC's 465 00:19:36,800 --> 00:19:42,320 crime stories, which typically involved 466 00:19:39,240 --> 00:19:42,320 love triangles. 467 00:19:42,960 --> 00:19:47,760 EC often borrowed plot elements from 468 00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:50,160 James M. Cain, whose novels Double 469 00:19:47,760 --> 00:19:52,560 Indemnity and The Postman Always Rings 470 00:19:50,160 --> 00:19:53,240 Twice were made into very successful 471 00:19:52,560 --> 00:19:54,720 movies. 472 00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:57,800 >> do that. 473 00:19:54,720 --> 00:20:00,800 Fix everything for us. What? Brave is 474 00:19:57,800 --> 00:20:00,800 something to happen to Nick? 475 00:20:01,160 --> 00:20:05,960 Something like that. 476 00:20:03,920 --> 00:20:08,360 Both Postman and Double Indemnity 477 00:20:05,960 --> 00:20:11,600 featured a gorgeous wife who plotted 478 00:20:08,360 --> 00:20:14,000 with her boyfriend to kill her husband. 479 00:20:11,600 --> 00:20:16,840 Kamen's stories usually included both of 480 00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:16,840 these elements. 481 00:20:16,960 --> 00:20:21,480 I'm going to kill her, Jean, just like 482 00:20:18,800 --> 00:20:23,840 you want. I've made up my mind. 483 00:20:21,480 --> 00:20:28,440 It's the only way, darling. The only 484 00:20:23,840 --> 00:20:28,440 way. I knew you'd finally see it. 485 00:20:28,800 --> 00:20:34,400 Of course, in EC's world, as in Cain's, 486 00:20:31,960 --> 00:20:38,160 the wife and boyfriend would usually get 487 00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:38,160 it themselves in the end. 488 00:20:38,720 --> 00:20:43,720 Somewhere in between in the styles of 489 00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:47,760 Ingels and Kamen fell EC's other main 490 00:20:43,720 --> 00:20:49,920 artists, Johnny Craig and Jack Davis. 491 00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:51,840 Craig, the senior member of the staff, 492 00:20:49,920 --> 00:20:54,400 was one of the few artists who also 493 00:20:51,840 --> 00:20:56,160 wrote his stories. 494 00:20:54,400 --> 00:20:58,360 He became the man behind the 495 00:20:56,160 --> 00:21:00,920 Vault-Keeper, illustrating all of the 496 00:20:58,360 --> 00:21:02,360 covers for The Vault of Horror. 497 00:21:00,920 --> 00:21:04,360 Johnny Craig's characters had these 498 00:21:02,360 --> 00:21:06,400 severe perspiration problems whenever 499 00:21:04,360 --> 00:21:07,640 anything bad happened around them, and 500 00:21:06,400 --> 00:21:09,200 you could kind of feel that through the 501 00:21:07,640 --> 00:21:11,320 page. You you almost felt the page would 502 00:21:09,200 --> 00:21:12,640 get damp from all that sweat dripping on 503 00:21:11,320 --> 00:21:15,160 it. 504 00:21:12,640 --> 00:21:17,960 Unlike Feldstein and Gaines, who often 505 00:21:15,160 --> 00:21:20,720 poured on the gore, Craig focused on the 506 00:21:17,960 --> 00:21:24,000 terrors of the mind, the psychological 507 00:21:20,720 --> 00:21:24,000 aspects of horror. 508 00:21:34,160 --> 00:21:39,200 Considered EC's most popular artist, 509 00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:41,720 Jack Davis specialized in physical 510 00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:41,720 horror. 511 00:21:50,920 --> 00:21:54,640 But Davis, who would later become a 512 00:21:52,760 --> 00:21:57,240 highly successful humorist and 513 00:21:54,640 --> 00:21:59,280 commercial artist, also had an inherent 514 00:21:57,240 --> 00:22:01,440 comic style. 515 00:21:59,280 --> 00:22:05,000 He imparted a light touch on even the 516 00:22:01,440 --> 00:22:05,000 most horrifying scene. 517 00:22:05,760 --> 00:22:10,160 I love to draw cartoons and I'm not an 518 00:22:08,240 --> 00:22:13,280 illustrator. I think sometimes you 519 00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:15,920 illustrators draw just you know, the 520 00:22:13,280 --> 00:22:18,120 stock thing right there. But but if I 521 00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:21,400 see something, I'll put a cartoon 522 00:22:18,120 --> 00:22:23,120 movement on it, an action movement that 523 00:22:21,400 --> 00:22:26,760 that I would put on a cartoon and 524 00:22:23,120 --> 00:22:28,600 exaggerate maybe the hands and the feet 525 00:22:26,760 --> 00:22:32,440 and the expression, you know, and really 526 00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:34,800 go at it. That guy just makes me laugh. 527 00:22:32,440 --> 00:22:36,600 Uh even when he's drawn the a gross-out, 528 00:22:34,800 --> 00:22:38,560 he just makes me laugh. There's just 529 00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:40,120 something about Jack Davis's stuff that 530 00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:42,960 that really 531 00:22:40,120 --> 00:22:42,960 blows me away. 532 00:22:43,080 --> 00:22:48,840 Probably all of the artists 533 00:22:45,480 --> 00:22:50,680 who drew for EC did their best work of 534 00:22:48,840 --> 00:22:53,000 their careers 535 00:22:50,680 --> 00:22:55,840 during that short time that they were at 536 00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:57,840 EC. And that was no accident. That was 537 00:22:55,840 --> 00:23:00,320 because Bill found out what they liked 538 00:22:57,840 --> 00:23:02,440 to do and they built the stories around 539 00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:02,440 that. 540 00:23:16,440 --> 00:23:21,080 Two years into their reign of horror, 541 00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:22,440 Gaines and Feldstein continued to blaze 542 00:23:21,080 --> 00:23:25,440 new trails. 543 00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:27,600 In 1952, they launched a new title, 544 00:23:25,440 --> 00:23:29,640 Shock SuspenStories, 545 00:23:27,600 --> 00:23:31,360 which featured a series of stories they 546 00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:33,720 called preachies, 547 00:23:31,360 --> 00:23:37,520 moralistic tales which took on some of 548 00:23:33,720 --> 00:23:39,400 the most explosive issues of the day. 549 00:23:37,520 --> 00:23:41,160 What does it say, Dave? 550 00:23:39,400 --> 00:23:43,320 It it says, 551 00:23:41,160 --> 00:23:44,800 "Don't move in, Jew. 552 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:46,280 You'll be sorry. 553 00:23:44,800 --> 00:23:48,520 We don't want Jews in this 554 00:23:46,280 --> 00:23:50,480 neighborhood." 555 00:23:48,520 --> 00:23:52,560 Hate was the story of a group of 556 00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:55,560 neighborhood vigilantes who tried to 557 00:23:52,560 --> 00:23:58,120 scare a Jewish family out of town. 558 00:23:55,560 --> 00:24:00,920 The situation spirals out of control and 559 00:23:58,120 --> 00:24:03,120 the family is killed. 560 00:24:00,920 --> 00:24:06,400 The leader of the vigilantes, John, 561 00:24:03,120 --> 00:24:08,760 later makes a shocking discovery. 562 00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:12,960 I never intended to tell you, John. I 563 00:24:08,760 --> 00:24:14,520 never had to. Yes, you're adopted. 564 00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:16,880 Ma! 565 00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:16,880 Your pa- 566 00:24:17,360 --> 00:24:20,120 We're Jewish. 567 00:24:20,240 --> 00:24:25,520 Suddenly, the roles were reversed and 568 00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:28,600 the hater becomes the hated. John gets 569 00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:31,480 to experience his bigotry first hand. 570 00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:34,760 Can't you see how wrong we've been? 571 00:24:31,480 --> 00:24:37,560 Scram, Jew! 572 00:24:34,760 --> 00:24:40,200 I think Dad liked to be cutting edge. I 573 00:24:37,560 --> 00:24:42,960 believed that by touching on areas such 574 00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:44,600 as anti-Semitism was just his way of 575 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:47,280 pushing the envelope a little, seeing 576 00:24:44,600 --> 00:24:50,400 how far he could go. 577 00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:52,680 I was stunned by the implications of 578 00:24:50,400 --> 00:24:54,360 many of the stories they did. These were 579 00:24:52,680 --> 00:24:57,160 adult themes. 580 00:24:54,360 --> 00:24:58,960 And in a way, they were more shocking 581 00:24:57,160 --> 00:25:05,400 than the horror stories because they 582 00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:05,400 dealt with reality in a very direct way. 583 00:25:06,320 --> 00:25:10,960 Gaines and Feldstein also turned the 584 00:25:08,400 --> 00:25:13,600 spotlight on race relations, a topic 585 00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:15,640 which in the early 1950s was just 586 00:25:13,600 --> 00:25:18,440 beginning to bubble to the surface of 587 00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:21,240 public discussion. 588 00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:23,240 He's come home, Andrew. Our Joey's come 589 00:25:21,240 --> 00:25:25,320 home a hero. 590 00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:28,080 The whole town's proud of him, Arthur. 591 00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:30,520 The whole town, look at them. 592 00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:32,720 But Joey learns that Hank, the soldier 593 00:25:30,520 --> 00:25:34,920 who saved his life by jumping on a live 594 00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:38,520 grenade, was not good enough to be 595 00:25:34,920 --> 00:25:40,640 buried in the town cemetery. 596 00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:44,240 In the story's final page, Joey 597 00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:46,720 confronts the people of his hometown. 598 00:25:44,240 --> 00:25:49,840 I had a buddy in Korea. 599 00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:52,360 We fought for democracy together. 600 00:25:49,840 --> 00:25:54,840 He gave his life for that cause. 601 00:25:52,360 --> 00:25:56,360 But when his body was sent back here, 602 00:25:54,840 --> 00:25:59,200 it wasn't good enough to be buried in 603 00:25:56,360 --> 00:26:00,960 Fair Lawn Cemetery. 604 00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:03,280 It wasn't good enough because its skin 605 00:26:00,960 --> 00:26:05,640 wasn't the right color. 606 00:26:03,280 --> 00:26:08,000 What did he die for? 607 00:26:05,640 --> 00:26:10,200 What did I give my arm for? 608 00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:12,080 You say you're proud of me? 609 00:26:10,200 --> 00:26:13,560 Well, I'm not proud of you. 610 00:26:12,080 --> 00:26:17,160 I'm ashamed. 611 00:26:13,560 --> 00:26:17,160 I'm ashamed of you and for you. 612 00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:24,440 We were kind of 613 00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:26,120 appealing to better our society, and 614 00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:28,160 there were people out that didn't want 615 00:26:26,120 --> 00:26:30,480 to better our society. They wanted the 616 00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:34,160 status quo. 617 00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:36,600 In 1952, EC launched a new kind of comic 618 00:26:34,160 --> 00:26:41,160 book that would tackle the status quo 619 00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:43,280 head-on. Its title was simply Mad. 620 00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:46,400 Masterfully written and edited by Harvey 621 00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:48,000 Kurtzman, Mad initially spoofed EC's own 622 00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:50,120 comics. 623 00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:54,040 Kurtzman soon turned his sights to other 624 00:26:50,120 --> 00:26:56,360 targets, and Mad became a runaway hit. 625 00:26:54,040 --> 00:26:59,640 I think the third issue or so I did the 626 00:26:56,360 --> 00:27:01,520 Lone Stranger, and then the one that 627 00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:03,560 where Mad really took off was 628 00:27:01,520 --> 00:27:06,400 Superduperman. He did a take off of 629 00:27:03,560 --> 00:27:09,120 Superman, and it was hysterical, and and 630 00:27:06,400 --> 00:27:10,800 that was the beginning of Mad. 631 00:27:09,120 --> 00:27:12,600 By 1953, 632 00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:14,640 Bill Gaines had become one of the most 633 00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:17,000 successful publishers in the comic book 634 00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:19,040 industry, disproving his father's 635 00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:20,560 prophecy that he would never amount to 636 00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:23,120 anything. 637 00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:26,360 He was very, very proud that he was able 638 00:27:23,120 --> 00:27:29,320 to prove his dad wrong, and you know, 639 00:27:26,360 --> 00:27:32,560 turn a business that was 640 00:27:29,320 --> 00:27:35,800 suffering into an enormous financial and 641 00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:35,800 creative success. 642 00:27:57,360 --> 00:28:02,440 EC's success did not go unnoticed by the 643 00:28:00,280 --> 00:28:04,920 other publishers, who soon flooded the 644 00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:08,160 newsstands with imitations. 645 00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:10,800 By 1953, nearly a quarter of all comic 646 00:28:08,160 --> 00:28:13,320 books sold dealt with horror. 647 00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:15,360 Gaines, once the trend follower, was now 648 00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:18,280 the trend setter. 649 00:28:15,360 --> 00:28:20,400 The other companies did try to copy EC, 650 00:28:18,280 --> 00:28:21,960 but I think that they missed the point. 651 00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:24,440 They made the mistake of thinking that 652 00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:26,520 it was the gore and the sensational 653 00:28:24,440 --> 00:28:29,360 element that made these comic books 654 00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:32,640 successful. So, of course, they upped 655 00:28:29,360 --> 00:28:34,520 the ante on the gore. 656 00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:36,760 This constant competition and 657 00:28:34,520 --> 00:28:39,240 one-upmanship forced Gaines and 658 00:28:36,760 --> 00:28:41,160 Feldstein to raise the level of violence 659 00:28:39,240 --> 00:28:42,720 in their stories. 660 00:28:41,160 --> 00:28:45,040 Frankly, as they reached deeper and 661 00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:47,400 deeper into the springboard barrel, the 662 00:28:45,040 --> 00:28:49,880 stories got bloodier and bloodier. Did 663 00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:53,840 it go overboard? Yeah, I think so in a 664 00:28:49,880 --> 00:28:56,680 couple of spots. One spot was Foul Play, 665 00:28:53,840 --> 00:28:59,440 the story of a baseball team which exact 666 00:28:56,680 --> 00:29:02,680 grizzly revenge against an opponent who 667 00:28:59,440 --> 00:29:04,520 has murdered one of their teammates. 668 00:29:02,680 --> 00:29:05,760 There's no doubt about it. Satin's a 669 00:29:04,520 --> 00:29:07,200 murderer. 670 00:29:05,760 --> 00:29:09,000 Traces of poison are still on his 671 00:29:07,200 --> 00:29:11,840 spikes. 672 00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:13,520 This is a job for the police. 673 00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:15,920 No way. 674 00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:18,280 Let's take care of him ourselves, all 675 00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:20,280 way. 676 00:29:18,280 --> 00:29:23,000 On the last page, the killer is 677 00:29:20,280 --> 00:29:26,240 dismembered and his body parts used as 678 00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:26,240 baseball equipment. 679 00:29:26,560 --> 00:29:32,200 I think it's kind of a natural 680 00:29:28,480 --> 00:29:35,720 phenomenon to try and top yourself. And 681 00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:37,760 yeah, we did step into 682 00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:40,120 what might be called extremes in some of 683 00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:42,000 the stuff we did where we became a 684 00:29:40,120 --> 00:29:44,360 little gorier than we should have. I 685 00:29:42,000 --> 00:29:46,360 didn't write it, but I drew it. 686 00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:47,880 And I feel very bad about that. And of 687 00:29:46,360 --> 00:29:50,000 course, uh 688 00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:52,200 everybody really jumped on that because 689 00:29:50,000 --> 00:29:53,920 it was awful. But nowadays, it would be 690 00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:55,320 nothing. 691 00:29:53,920 --> 00:29:56,760 Those days, I guess it was really 692 00:29:55,320 --> 00:29:58,040 something and it 693 00:29:56,760 --> 00:30:00,960 mothers and fathers say, "I don't want 694 00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:03,440 my kid to read that." 695 00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:05,960 Stories like Foul Play encouraged 696 00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:07,920 critics to step up their attacks. 697 00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:10,560 The most vocal critic was Fredric 698 00:30:07,920 --> 00:30:13,000 Wertham, a New York psychiatrist who had 699 00:30:10,560 --> 00:30:15,400 worked with troubled teens. 700 00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:19,000 Wertham's attack on comic books began in 701 00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:22,280 1948 when he called the medium pollution 702 00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:25,480 from which children had to be protected. 703 00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:28,920 In the spring of 1954, Wertham's book 704 00:30:25,480 --> 00:30:30,640 Seduction of the Innocent was published. 705 00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:33,240 Promoted as the most shocking book of 706 00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:36,080 the year, it was a scathing indictment 707 00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:37,880 of all comic books. 708 00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:39,920 Wertham, of course, as a psychiatrist 709 00:30:37,880 --> 00:30:42,040 read everything into these comic books 710 00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:44,680 he could possibly could. Uh he talked 711 00:30:42,040 --> 00:30:46,920 about a homoerotic relationship between 712 00:30:44,680 --> 00:30:49,560 Batman and Robin. He talked about the 713 00:30:46,920 --> 00:30:51,440 lesbian tendencies of Wonder Woman. It 714 00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:53,720 was preposterous. 715 00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:55,840 Wertham saved his harshest attacks for 716 00:30:53,720 --> 00:30:58,240 horror and crime comics, which he 717 00:30:55,840 --> 00:31:00,840 alleged were a direct cause of juvenile 718 00:30:58,240 --> 00:31:03,120 delinquency. 719 00:31:00,840 --> 00:31:06,120 These claims touched off a firestorm of 720 00:31:03,120 --> 00:31:08,160 criticism against the comics industry. 721 00:31:06,120 --> 00:31:11,000 PTA and church groups organized 722 00:31:08,160 --> 00:31:13,760 boycotts. Others took even more drastic 723 00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:15,120 measures. There were comic book burnings 724 00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:16,760 that were of course reminiscent of the 725 00:31:15,120 --> 00:31:19,240 Nazi years. 726 00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:21,520 Nobody intended that precisely, but when 727 00:31:19,240 --> 00:31:23,480 you saw some of these ugly scenes of 728 00:31:21,520 --> 00:31:25,560 towns where they would get all the comic 729 00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:28,400 books together and just burn them up, it 730 00:31:25,560 --> 00:31:30,040 was quite frightening. 731 00:31:28,400 --> 00:31:32,280 The controversy quickly drew the 732 00:31:30,040 --> 00:31:34,440 attention of political leaders, and the 733 00:31:32,280 --> 00:31:36,880 US Senate Subcommittee to investigate 734 00:31:34,440 --> 00:31:38,640 juvenile delinquency agreed to look into 735 00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:41,520 the matter. 736 00:31:38,640 --> 00:31:43,800 Led by Tennessee Senator Estes Kefauver, 737 00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:46,960 the panel held hearings in New York City 738 00:31:43,800 --> 00:31:49,320 on April 21st, 1954. 739 00:31:46,960 --> 00:31:50,800 The star witness was none other than Dr. 740 00:31:49,320 --> 00:31:53,800 Fredric Wertham. 741 00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:57,080 It is my opinion 742 00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:59,880 without any reasonable doubt 743 00:31:57,080 --> 00:32:01,560 and without any reservation 744 00:31:59,880 --> 00:32:03,120 that comic books 745 00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:05,000 are an important 746 00:32:03,120 --> 00:32:09,680 contributing factor 747 00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:13,000 in many cases of juvenile delinquency. 748 00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:15,520 Wertham worked from an improper premise. 749 00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:18,480 That is, he decided that the troubled 750 00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:20,760 children that he was analyzing read 751 00:32:18,480 --> 00:32:23,320 comic books. Therefore, that was a 752 00:32:20,760 --> 00:32:24,680 source of their trouble. And of course, 753 00:32:23,320 --> 00:32:26,280 there were plenty of children reading 754 00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:28,520 comic books who were leading perfectly 755 00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:31,360 normal lives, and in fact most of them 756 00:32:28,520 --> 00:32:33,440 were very happy. As adults, we get to a 757 00:32:31,360 --> 00:32:34,520 certain age that all of a sudden we stop 758 00:32:33,440 --> 00:32:37,200 being 759 00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:39,480 inside, we stop wanting to take chances. 760 00:32:37,200 --> 00:32:42,640 We start being more afraid of the world 761 00:32:39,480 --> 00:32:44,040 and we start protecting our children. We 762 00:32:42,640 --> 00:32:46,240 don't realize what it was like to be a 763 00:32:44,040 --> 00:32:47,720 kid. And so, here comes Seduction of the 764 00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:48,880 Innocent. 765 00:32:47,720 --> 00:32:50,200 Claims that these comic books are going 766 00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:53,640 to turn 767 00:32:50,200 --> 00:32:54,760 us kids into juvenile delinquents. Well, 768 00:32:53,640 --> 00:32:57,480 poor guy, I have news for him. They 769 00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:59,920 turned me into a movie director. 770 00:32:57,480 --> 00:33:01,760 I didn't become a juvenile delinquent. 771 00:32:59,920 --> 00:33:03,960 This guy is dead wrong. 772 00:33:01,760 --> 00:33:05,520 Dead wrong. My name is William 773 00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:07,920 >> Although many of the attacks were 774 00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:10,320 directed at other publishers, Bill 775 00:33:07,920 --> 00:33:12,080 Gaines asked for and was granted 776 00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:13,160 permission to testify before the 777 00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:14,560 committee. 778 00:33:13,160 --> 00:33:16,960 I was the first publisher in these 779 00:33:14,560 --> 00:33:20,520 United States to publish horror comics. 780 00:33:16,960 --> 00:33:22,400 I'm responsible. I started them. 781 00:33:20,520 --> 00:33:25,280 Some may not like them. 782 00:33:22,400 --> 00:33:27,120 That's a matter of personal taste. 783 00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:29,080 It would be just as difficult to explain 784 00:33:27,120 --> 00:33:30,720 the harmless thrill of a horror story to 785 00:33:29,080 --> 00:33:32,520 a Dr. Wertham 786 00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:35,880 as it would be to explain the sublimity 787 00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:37,560 of love to a frigid old maid. 788 00:33:35,880 --> 00:33:39,400 My father was proud of the comics he 789 00:33:37,560 --> 00:33:40,920 published and I'm proud of the comics I 790 00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:42,960 publish. 791 00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:44,480 Gaines defended his books on the grounds 792 00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:45,960 of free speech. 793 00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:48,200 He told the committee that he felt 794 00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:50,160 constrained only by the limits of good 795 00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:52,800 taste. 796 00:33:50,160 --> 00:33:56,040 What happened was, of course, Bill was 797 00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:58,040 not a a student of 798 00:33:56,040 --> 00:34:01,160 or experienced enough 799 00:33:58,040 --> 00:34:02,840 to be able to parry some of the 800 00:34:01,160 --> 00:34:04,920 "When did you stop beating your wife?" 801 00:34:02,840 --> 00:34:06,840 questions that came flying at him after 802 00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:08,639 his testimony. 803 00:34:06,840 --> 00:34:10,840 One of those questions concerned a 804 00:34:08,639 --> 00:34:13,840 recent issue of EC's Crime 805 00:34:10,840 --> 00:34:13,840 SuspenStories. 806 00:34:14,120 --> 00:34:16,879 Do you think that this cover is in bad 807 00:34:15,520 --> 00:34:18,960 taste? And Bill said, "No, I don't think 808 00:34:16,879 --> 00:34:20,960 so. How would it be in bad taste?" And 809 00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:22,840 he said, "Well, if you showed the gore 810 00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:24,399 drop dripping from it." And they nailed 811 00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:27,000 him with that. 812 00:34:24,399 --> 00:34:29,600 The exchange made front-page news and 813 00:34:27,000 --> 00:34:30,800 turned public opinion decisively against 814 00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:33,480 Gaines. 815 00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:36,800 Bill's mistake was by volunteering to 816 00:34:33,480 --> 00:34:37,760 testify, he focused all the negativity 817 00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:41,320 on 818 00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:43,960 on himself and EC Comics. So, now the 819 00:34:41,320 --> 00:34:46,320 villain, the evil comic book publisher, 820 00:34:43,960 --> 00:34:48,720 now had a face and a name and that name 821 00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:50,440 was William M. Gaines. 822 00:34:48,720 --> 00:34:53,159 The Senate hearings quickly turned up 823 00:34:50,440 --> 00:34:56,080 the heat on EC. Wholesalers began 824 00:34:53,159 --> 00:34:58,120 refusing to handle Gaines' comics. 825 00:34:56,080 --> 00:35:00,280 Bundles were returned to the office 826 00:34:58,120 --> 00:35:02,400 unopened. 827 00:35:00,280 --> 00:35:04,440 Attempting to rally the other comic book 828 00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:06,680 publishers, Gaines proposed an 829 00:35:04,440 --> 00:35:07,600 association to fight the growing witch 830 00:35:06,680 --> 00:35:09,760 hunt. 831 00:35:07,600 --> 00:35:12,760 So, he called a meeting to say, "Let's 832 00:35:09,760 --> 00:35:14,280 fight this censorship as a group." And 833 00:35:12,760 --> 00:35:16,200 the other publishers had a wonderful 834 00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:18,000 idea about how to fight the censorship. 835 00:35:16,200 --> 00:35:20,120 "Let's get rid of the violence. Let's 836 00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:22,720 get rid of the horror. Let's wipe out 837 00:35:20,120 --> 00:35:24,680 all of the stuff that EC does and then 838 00:35:22,720 --> 00:35:26,640 we'll all be very happy." 839 00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:28,640 Gaines stormed out of the meeting 840 00:35:26,640 --> 00:35:32,200 leaving the other publishers to form the 841 00:35:28,640 --> 00:35:34,160 Comics Magazine Association of America. 842 00:35:32,200 --> 00:35:37,560 The group immediately outlawed the use 843 00:35:34,160 --> 00:35:38,720 of the words crime, horror, terror, and 844 00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:40,960 weird. 845 00:35:38,720 --> 00:35:44,560 All of which had figured prominently in 846 00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:44,560 EC's biggest sellers. 847 00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:50,240 The publishers also established a code 848 00:35:47,840 --> 00:35:53,320 of ethics which forbade all scenes of 849 00:35:50,240 --> 00:35:55,480 horror, excessive bloodshed, and gory or 850 00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:57,760 gruesome crimes. 851 00:35:55,480 --> 00:36:00,040 All comics which complied with the code 852 00:35:57,760 --> 00:36:02,000 would receive the association's seal of 853 00:36:00,040 --> 00:36:04,040 approval. 854 00:36:02,000 --> 00:36:06,520 Judge Charles Murphy, a New York City 855 00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:10,400 magistrate, was appointed the first code 856 00:36:06,520 --> 00:36:13,080 administrator, the comics czar. 857 00:36:10,400 --> 00:36:15,000 Ostracized by the other publishers and 858 00:36:13,080 --> 00:36:17,240 with no wholesalers willing to handle 859 00:36:15,000 --> 00:36:18,560 his comics, Gaines was forced to 860 00:36:17,240 --> 00:36:21,680 surrender. 861 00:36:18,560 --> 00:36:24,000 On September 14th, 1954, he announced 862 00:36:21,680 --> 00:36:27,640 that he was discontinuing his line of 863 00:36:24,000 --> 00:36:27,640 horror and crime comics. 864 00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:32,720 I for one do not believe 865 00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:35,840 I never have believed that comics are 866 00:36:32,720 --> 00:36:38,160 the cause of juvenile delinquency. 867 00:36:35,840 --> 00:36:39,800 I've taken this action 868 00:36:38,160 --> 00:36:41,760 based on a premise which has never been 869 00:36:39,800 --> 00:36:44,040 proven. 870 00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:46,120 However, I feel that the public 871 00:36:44,040 --> 00:36:48,120 must be served. If this is the way the 872 00:36:46,120 --> 00:36:51,600 public wants it, this is the way it'll 873 00:36:48,120 --> 00:36:51,600 have to be as far as I'm concerned. 874 00:36:51,640 --> 00:36:56,840 I was too young to pay attention to the 875 00:36:53,760 --> 00:36:58,280 the Kefauver hearings. All I knew is 876 00:36:56,840 --> 00:37:01,960 that 877 00:36:58,280 --> 00:37:03,800 one day I couldn't find my EC Comics 878 00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:06,320 anymore. And I was left with, you know, 879 00:37:03,800 --> 00:37:07,720 Superman and and Batman and you know, 880 00:37:06,320 --> 00:37:11,400 just you know, whatever whatever was 881 00:37:07,720 --> 00:37:14,320 left. Uh you know, they were good, but 882 00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:14,320 it wasn't the same. 883 00:37:23,560 --> 00:37:28,640 The new Comics Code put a dozen 884 00:37:25,680 --> 00:37:30,480 publishers out of business overnight. 885 00:37:28,640 --> 00:37:31,800 Gaines, however, was not ready to throw 886 00:37:30,480 --> 00:37:34,440 in the towel. 887 00:37:31,800 --> 00:37:36,760 Instead, he and Feldstein created a new 888 00:37:34,440 --> 00:37:40,440 clean line of comics, which they called, 889 00:37:36,760 --> 00:37:41,960 appropriately, their new direction. 890 00:37:40,440 --> 00:37:45,000 Although they refused to join the 891 00:37:41,960 --> 00:37:47,800 association, EC's new comics stuck to 892 00:37:45,000 --> 00:37:49,240 the letter of the code. 893 00:37:47,800 --> 00:37:50,680 Gaines tried putting out comics without 894 00:37:49,240 --> 00:37:52,360 the Comics Code symbol, and he didn't 895 00:37:50,680 --> 00:37:53,840 get on a newsstand. The books would be 896 00:37:52,360 --> 00:37:55,880 printed, they'd be shipped out to 897 00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:57,120 wholesalers, the wholesalers would just 898 00:37:55,880 --> 00:38:00,440 take them and ship them right back for 899 00:37:57,120 --> 00:38:01,640 credit, and Gaines was suddenly now 900 00:38:00,440 --> 00:38:03,000 uh unable to get his comics to the 901 00:38:01,640 --> 00:38:05,320 customers. 902 00:38:03,000 --> 00:38:08,400 Gaines had no choice but to swallow his 903 00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:10,240 pride and join the association. 904 00:38:08,400 --> 00:38:12,680 He had a difficult time, however, 905 00:38:10,240 --> 00:38:14,160 winning approval for any of his stories. 906 00:38:12,680 --> 00:38:16,120 Initially, when the Comics Code was 907 00:38:14,160 --> 00:38:17,840 started, its mission was to prove it was 908 00:38:16,120 --> 00:38:21,480 necessary. So, they started ripping 909 00:38:17,840 --> 00:38:22,960 stories apart, deleting things which in 910 00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:25,360 hindsight seem ridiculous. Most 911 00:38:22,960 --> 00:38:26,680 censorship drives seem ridiculous in 912 00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:29,040 hindsight, but these seemed especially 913 00:38:26,680 --> 00:38:31,800 ridiculous even at the time. 914 00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:34,000 I think that his his mission 915 00:38:31,800 --> 00:38:35,840 was to put us out of business 916 00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:38,080 or at least make it so impossible for us 917 00:38:35,840 --> 00:38:39,960 to publish that Bill would quit. 918 00:38:38,080 --> 00:38:41,760 Gaines quickly became frustrated with 919 00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:43,480 the code censorship. 920 00:38:41,760 --> 00:38:45,440 "This is what our forefathers came to 921 00:38:43,480 --> 00:38:46,840 America to escape." He told his 922 00:38:45,440 --> 00:38:49,360 distributors. 923 00:38:46,840 --> 00:38:52,000 Dad was a very good Indian chief, but he 924 00:38:49,360 --> 00:38:54,480 wasn't a good [ __ ] He didn't follow 925 00:38:52,000 --> 00:38:57,920 really well and to be in a position 926 00:38:54,480 --> 00:38:59,480 where he had to present his material and 927 00:38:57,920 --> 00:39:02,480 have someone else decide whether it was 928 00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:04,080 appropriate or not was very difficult 929 00:39:02,480 --> 00:39:06,240 for him. 930 00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:08,960 After a year of working under the code 931 00:39:06,240 --> 00:39:10,720 censors, EC finally headed out with 932 00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:12,080 Judge Murphy. 933 00:39:10,720 --> 00:39:13,480 We had a science fiction story about 934 00:39:12,080 --> 00:39:15,400 mutants 935 00:39:13,480 --> 00:39:18,240 that he completely refused to let us 936 00:39:15,400 --> 00:39:21,120 run. And so I brought a replacement 937 00:39:18,240 --> 00:39:24,040 story. The replacement story was called 938 00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:26,560 Judgment Day and had run 3 years earlier 939 00:39:24,040 --> 00:39:28,160 in Weird Fantasy. 940 00:39:26,560 --> 00:39:31,000 The story was one of Gaines and 941 00:39:28,160 --> 00:39:33,560 Feldstein's preachies, an allegory about 942 00:39:31,000 --> 00:39:36,120 racial tolerance. 943 00:39:33,560 --> 00:39:38,960 In it, a space investigator visits a 944 00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:40,960 planet inhabited by orange and blue 945 00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:43,000 robots to determine if they were 946 00:39:40,960 --> 00:39:45,000 advanced enough to join the Galactic 947 00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:47,120 Empire. 948 00:39:45,000 --> 00:39:50,280 You differentiate between blue robots 949 00:39:47,120 --> 00:39:52,360 and orange robots? Of course. Otherwise, 950 00:39:50,280 --> 00:39:55,480 there'd be trouble. Have to keep them in 951 00:39:52,360 --> 00:39:57,960 their place, you know. 952 00:39:55,480 --> 00:40:00,080 After determining that prejudice existed 953 00:39:57,960 --> 00:40:02,800 among the robots based on the color of 954 00:40:00,080 --> 00:40:04,360 their armor, the investigator concluded 955 00:40:02,800 --> 00:40:06,520 they were not yet ready to join the 956 00:40:04,360 --> 00:40:08,480 Empire. 957 00:40:06,520 --> 00:40:10,680 Upon returning to his spaceship, the 958 00:40:08,480 --> 00:40:13,680 investigator removed his helmet 959 00:40:10,680 --> 00:40:15,080 revealing African-American features. 960 00:40:13,680 --> 00:40:16,280 Well, Judge Murphy said, "No, you can't 961 00:40:15,080 --> 00:40:17,680 have that." 962 00:40:16,280 --> 00:40:19,720 I said, "You can't have what?" He said 963 00:40:17,680 --> 00:40:20,840 you can't have a black man. 964 00:40:19,720 --> 00:40:22,040 I said that's the point of the whole 965 00:40:20,840 --> 00:40:23,080 story. 966 00:40:22,040 --> 00:40:24,320 He said you can't have a black man. I 967 00:40:23,080 --> 00:40:26,280 said, "Where in the code does it say I 968 00:40:24,320 --> 00:40:27,600 can't have a black man?" 969 00:40:26,280 --> 00:40:28,800 Can't have a black man. He wouldn't let 970 00:40:27,600 --> 00:40:31,480 it go. 971 00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:34,080 Feldstein returned to the EC offices and 972 00:40:31,480 --> 00:40:35,720 informed Gaines of Murphy's edict. And 973 00:40:34,080 --> 00:40:37,680 Bill called up Judge Murphy and he said, 974 00:40:35,720 --> 00:40:38,840 "What's going on?" And Judge Murphy 975 00:40:37,680 --> 00:40:40,960 said, "You can't have a black man." I 976 00:40:38,840 --> 00:40:42,560 said and Bill said, "I'm calling a press 977 00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:45,440 conference and I'm going to 978 00:40:42,560 --> 00:40:49,120 make a big stink about the bigotry of 979 00:40:45,440 --> 00:40:50,640 the code." And he said, "All right. 980 00:40:49,120 --> 00:40:53,200 He can be a black man, but you've got to 981 00:40:50,640 --> 00:40:55,200 take the perspiration off of skin." Bill 982 00:40:53,200 --> 00:40:57,840 said, 983 00:40:55,200 --> 00:40:59,480 the four-letter word you and hung up on 984 00:40:57,840 --> 00:41:00,920 him and ran the story and I think that 985 00:40:59,480 --> 00:41:02,280 was the end of our 986 00:41:00,920 --> 00:41:04,240 science fiction 987 00:41:02,280 --> 00:41:05,960 comic book. 988 00:41:04,240 --> 00:41:08,760 Gaines had had enough. 989 00:41:05,960 --> 00:41:11,240 Judgment Day became the last story in 990 00:41:08,760 --> 00:41:13,080 the last comic book that EC ever 991 00:41:11,240 --> 00:41:14,800 published. The whole thing kind of 992 00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:16,840 crashed and burned. It slowly wound 993 00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:19,400 down. Unfortunately for Bill, he had an 994 00:41:16,840 --> 00:41:21,560 ace in the hole with Mad Magazine. 995 00:41:19,400 --> 00:41:23,840 Although Mad had started slowly when it 996 00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:25,680 was launched in 1952, 997 00:41:23,840 --> 00:41:27,520 3 years later it was selling like 998 00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:29,840 hotcakes. 999 00:41:27,520 --> 00:41:32,280 In the summer of 1955, 1000 00:41:29,840 --> 00:41:34,680 editor Harvey Kurtzman convinced Gaines 1001 00:41:32,280 --> 00:41:38,320 to change the 10-cent comic book into a 1002 00:41:34,680 --> 00:41:40,840 25-cent black and white magazine. 1003 00:41:38,320 --> 00:41:43,480 One year later, after a falling out over 1004 00:41:40,840 --> 00:41:45,640 ownership of the magazine, Gaines fired 1005 00:41:43,480 --> 00:41:47,400 Kurtzman and replaced him with Al 1006 00:41:45,640 --> 00:41:50,560 Feldstein. 1007 00:41:47,400 --> 00:41:52,920 Mad didn't miss a beat. Over the next 25 1008 00:41:50,560 --> 00:41:57,400 years, it became one of the most popular 1009 00:41:52,920 --> 00:41:57,400 and successful magazines in America. 1010 00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:10,960 In the mid-1980s, the Cochran reprints 1011 00:42:09,480 --> 00:42:13,400 caught the attention of several 1012 00:42:10,960 --> 00:42:15,720 Hollywood producers, including Joel 1013 00:42:13,400 --> 00:42:18,520 Silver, who had produced such hits as 1014 00:42:15,720 --> 00:42:20,640 Lethal Weapon and Die Hard. I remember 1015 00:42:18,520 --> 00:42:22,120 as a kid I would devour these comic 1016 00:42:20,640 --> 00:42:24,360 books. I mean, they were scary, they 1017 00:42:22,120 --> 00:42:26,280 were funny, they were just so special. 1018 00:42:24,360 --> 00:42:30,040 There was nothing else like them. So, we 1019 00:42:26,280 --> 00:42:32,200 pursued Bill Gaines and we said we'd 1020 00:42:30,040 --> 00:42:33,280 like to get the rights to Tales from the 1021 00:42:32,200 --> 00:42:35,480 Crypt. 1022 00:42:33,280 --> 00:42:37,840 Silver, together with partners David 1023 00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:40,040 Giler and Walter Hill, optioned the 1024 00:42:37,840 --> 00:42:41,800 rights with the idea of producing an 1025 00:42:40,040 --> 00:42:43,720 anthology film. 1026 00:42:41,800 --> 00:42:45,960 Directors Richard Donner and Robert 1027 00:42:43,720 --> 00:42:47,440 Zemeckis eventually became partners in 1028 00:42:45,960 --> 00:42:49,800 the project. 1029 00:42:47,440 --> 00:42:52,360 In the late 1980s, the group abandoned 1030 00:42:49,800 --> 00:42:54,440 the idea of a feature film and decided 1031 00:42:52,360 --> 00:42:56,440 to turn Tales from the Crypt into a 1032 00:42:54,440 --> 00:42:58,800 television series. 1033 00:42:56,440 --> 00:43:01,360 The pilot episode, directed by Robert 1034 00:42:58,800 --> 00:43:03,720 Zemeckis, was based on a story in which 1035 00:43:01,360 --> 00:43:06,360 a homicidal maniac, dressed as Santa 1036 00:43:03,720 --> 00:43:09,080 Claus, terrorizes a woman who has just 1037 00:43:06,360 --> 00:43:11,520 killed her husband. 1038 00:43:09,080 --> 00:43:14,120 During production, Silver and Zemeckis 1039 00:43:11,520 --> 00:43:16,320 sought advice from Bill Gaines. When we 1040 00:43:14,120 --> 00:43:18,200 showed the kind of the the rough cut to 1041 00:43:16,320 --> 00:43:21,320 to Bill, he said at the end of the show 1042 00:43:18,200 --> 00:43:23,120 she should be screaming her head off. 1043 00:43:21,320 --> 00:43:25,760 Oh, Carrie. 1044 00:43:23,120 --> 00:43:29,160 Thank goodness. See, Mommy? 1045 00:43:25,760 --> 00:43:30,600 I told you Santa would come. And he 1046 00:43:29,160 --> 00:43:31,920 didn't even have to come down the 1047 00:43:30,600 --> 00:43:35,240 chimney. 1048 00:43:31,920 --> 00:43:35,240 I'm out of men. 1049 00:43:48,080 --> 00:43:52,680 NAUGHTY 1050 00:43:49,800 --> 00:43:52,680 OR NICE. 1051 00:43:56,080 --> 00:44:01,920 HE WAS ABSOLUTELY involved in the 1052 00:43:59,400 --> 00:44:03,520 creation of the first episode. And and 1053 00:44:01,920 --> 00:44:05,960 we always looked at that episode as a 1054 00:44:03,520 --> 00:44:08,760 template for all future episodes. The 1055 00:44:05,960 --> 00:44:11,120 series producers, all of the comic 1056 00:44:08,760 --> 00:44:12,760 books, remained faithful to the EC 1057 00:44:11,120 --> 00:44:14,880 spirit. 1058 00:44:12,760 --> 00:44:17,480 If you read the stories in 1059 00:44:14,880 --> 00:44:19,440 the comic book and then you see our 1060 00:44:17,480 --> 00:44:20,880 versions of the stories, they're very 1061 00:44:19,440 --> 00:44:22,960 true to them. I mean, we really didn't 1062 00:44:20,880 --> 00:44:25,200 take a lot of liberties and we tried to 1063 00:44:22,960 --> 00:44:27,240 to kind of capture, 1064 00:44:25,200 --> 00:44:29,120 you know, the images from the comic book 1065 00:44:27,240 --> 00:44:32,800 and use those images almost like a 1066 00:44:29,120 --> 00:44:35,280 storyboard for for the shows. 1067 00:44:32,800 --> 00:44:37,560 The series also brought to life Gaines 1068 00:44:35,280 --> 00:44:38,960 and Feldstein's horror host, the 1069 00:44:37,560 --> 00:44:41,640 Cryptkeeper. 1070 00:44:38,960 --> 00:44:45,240 We all felt it was very important that 1071 00:44:41,640 --> 00:44:47,520 the Cryptkeeper be a part of the show 1072 00:44:45,240 --> 00:44:51,000 and cuz we loved the notion of this 1073 00:44:47,520 --> 00:44:52,320 little weird guy who was funny and 1074 00:44:51,000 --> 00:44:54,360 scary. You know, he could make you 1075 00:44:52,320 --> 00:44:56,160 laugh, but he could kill you. 1076 00:44:54,360 --> 00:44:57,800 Although he bore little physical 1077 00:44:56,160 --> 00:45:00,920 resemblance to his comic book 1078 00:44:57,800 --> 00:45:05,480 counterpart, the animatronic Cryptkeeper 1079 00:45:00,920 --> 00:45:05,480 did speak in the same punning patter. 1080 00:45:06,640 --> 00:45:11,480 Greetings, infesters. 1081 00:45:09,080 --> 00:45:14,040 I'll be with you in a moment. I was just 1082 00:45:11,480 --> 00:45:15,680 putting these gross profits away for 1083 00:45:14,040 --> 00:45:17,960 safekeeping. 1084 00:45:15,680 --> 00:45:20,520 You see, boils and ghouls, at 1085 00:45:17,960 --> 00:45:23,440 Cryptkeeper Financial, we can help you 1086 00:45:20,520 --> 00:45:26,920 get morgue for your money. Whether it's 1087 00:45:23,440 --> 00:45:30,120 mutual fiends you want or cold, horrid 1088 00:45:26,920 --> 00:45:33,000 cash, we can guarantee you'll corner the 1089 00:45:30,120 --> 00:45:33,000 market. 1090 00:45:33,400 --> 00:45:36,960 The key to the Cryptkeeper is that he's 1091 00:45:35,440 --> 00:45:38,560 comedy relief. 1092 00:45:36,960 --> 00:45:40,520 He sometimes can get a little ghoulish, 1093 00:45:38,560 --> 00:45:43,000 but never really over the top. He's 1094 00:45:40,520 --> 00:45:45,440 there to ease 1095 00:45:43,000 --> 00:45:47,800 the pain of being scared, perhaps. 1096 00:45:45,440 --> 00:45:49,680 Jack Wall is the president of Tales from 1097 00:45:47,800 --> 00:45:52,280 the Crypt Productions and is the 1098 00:45:49,680 --> 00:45:55,200 marketing mastermind behind the flood of 1099 00:45:52,280 --> 00:45:56,600 Cryptkeeper merchandise. 1100 00:45:55,200 --> 00:46:00,280 And I said there's no reason in the 1101 00:45:56,600 --> 00:46:02,360 world that the Cryptkeeper can't be for 1102 00:46:00,280 --> 00:46:05,120 Halloween what Santa Claus is for 1103 00:46:02,360 --> 00:46:07,240 Christmas? That was a tall order. 1104 00:46:05,120 --> 00:46:09,600 We're gaining on it. He is slowly but 1105 00:46:07,240 --> 00:46:12,520 surely becoming what I like to call 1106 00:46:09,600 --> 00:46:14,600 uh the world's undisputed icon of ghoul, 1107 00:46:12,520 --> 00:46:16,480 horror, and spooktacular fun. It was 1108 00:46:14,600 --> 00:46:18,560 just exciting that we were able to 1109 00:46:16,480 --> 00:46:21,960 create this 1110 00:46:18,560 --> 00:46:23,480 this kind of whole, you know, world out 1111 00:46:21,960 --> 00:46:26,440 of these 1112 00:46:23,480 --> 00:46:27,920 very secret, special, magical comic 1113 00:46:26,440 --> 00:46:29,840 books. 1114 00:46:27,920 --> 00:46:32,480 Once banished by parents and 1115 00:46:29,840 --> 00:46:35,480 politicians, Tales from the Crypt and 1116 00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:38,360 the other EC horror comics of the 1950s 1117 00:46:35,480 --> 00:46:40,480 have taken on the air of legitimacy and 1118 00:46:38,360 --> 00:46:42,640 earned their rightful place as a piece 1119 00:46:40,480 --> 00:46:44,760 of treasured Americana. 1120 00:46:42,640 --> 00:46:46,720 What's amazing is how much the EC books 1121 00:46:44,760 --> 00:46:48,280 are remembered. There were hundreds and 1122 00:46:46,720 --> 00:46:50,920 hundreds of comic books coming out every 1123 00:46:48,280 --> 00:46:53,760 month in the '50s that no one remembers, 1124 00:46:50,920 --> 00:46:57,120 that no one collects, that no one bases 1125 00:46:53,760 --> 00:46:59,040 current fiction on inspirations of. Uh 1126 00:46:57,120 --> 00:47:01,600 and yet these EC books seem to have 1127 00:46:59,040 --> 00:47:04,920 crept into the sensibilities of a whole 1128 00:47:01,600 --> 00:47:07,960 generation or two. They were so smart 1129 00:47:04,920 --> 00:47:11,080 and they were so interesting. And the 1130 00:47:07,960 --> 00:47:13,040 the art was so great and it was so well 1131 00:47:11,080 --> 00:47:15,440 done and the and and 1132 00:47:13,040 --> 00:47:17,840 they really were were so pure in what 1133 00:47:15,440 --> 00:47:20,160 they were. These EC horror comics are 1134 00:47:17,840 --> 00:47:22,480 classic. They're classic horror stories. 1135 00:47:20,160 --> 00:47:24,160 They're still wonderful today. And I 1136 00:47:22,480 --> 00:47:26,880 think this is why people love them. They 1137 00:47:24,160 --> 00:47:28,560 haven't dated at all. I think EC comics 1138 00:47:26,880 --> 00:47:32,040 are the greatest comics ever invented 1139 00:47:28,560 --> 00:47:36,800 because they dared to be appalling and 1140 00:47:32,040 --> 00:47:40,280 funny and crazy and witty all in one big 1141 00:47:36,800 --> 00:47:42,520 wild ball of human commentary. 1142 00:47:40,280 --> 00:47:44,760 Al Feldstein is considered to be one of 1143 00:47:42,520 --> 00:47:47,880 the most talented writers and editors 1144 00:47:44,760 --> 00:47:51,200 ever to work in comic books. 1145 00:47:47,880 --> 00:47:53,800 He retired from Mad Magazine in 1984 and 1146 00:47:51,200 --> 00:47:56,760 now lives on a ranch in Montana where he 1147 00:47:53,800 --> 00:47:59,040 paints wildlife scenes and recreations 1148 00:47:56,760 --> 00:48:01,600 of his famous horror and science fiction 1149 00:47:59,040 --> 00:48:01,600 covers. 1150 00:48:01,760 --> 00:48:06,960 I consider myself a very fortunate human 1151 00:48:04,440 --> 00:48:09,440 being in having had a career that I 1152 00:48:06,960 --> 00:48:11,800 loved, that I enjoyed doing. I'm 1153 00:48:09,440 --> 00:48:13,640 fortunate that I had the opportunities 1154 00:48:11,800 --> 00:48:17,480 presented to me 1155 00:48:13,640 --> 00:48:19,200 by Bill and his open creative 1156 00:48:17,480 --> 00:48:21,200 publishing. 1157 00:48:19,200 --> 00:48:22,520 He had a great 1158 00:48:21,200 --> 00:48:26,280 capacity 1159 00:48:22,520 --> 00:48:29,680 for letting people with talent shine. 1160 00:48:26,280 --> 00:48:33,160 And for that I'm eternally grateful. 1161 00:48:29,680 --> 00:48:35,040 William M. Gaines died in 1992. 1162 00:48:33,160 --> 00:48:37,040 To the general public, he is perhaps 1163 00:48:35,040 --> 00:48:40,200 best remembered as the colorful and 1164 00:48:37,040 --> 00:48:42,360 iconoclastic publisher of Mad. 1165 00:48:40,200 --> 00:48:44,520 But to fans around the world, he is 1166 00:48:42,360 --> 00:48:47,280 considered the heart and soul of the 1167 00:48:44,520 --> 00:48:49,600 company that forever changed the face of 1168 00:48:47,280 --> 00:48:51,640 comic books. Bill Gaines just didn't 1169 00:48:49,600 --> 00:48:53,000 give a damn. He liked his comics the way 1170 00:48:51,640 --> 00:48:54,640 they did them. 1171 00:48:53,000 --> 00:48:57,000 And uh if you wanted to go along for the 1172 00:48:54,640 --> 00:49:00,240 ride, great. And if you didn't, screw 1173 00:48:57,000 --> 00:49:02,640 it. He was absolutely thrilled with the 1174 00:49:00,240 --> 00:49:04,720 support from EC fans. You know, he came 1175 00:49:02,640 --> 00:49:06,800 into the business not knowing anything 1176 00:49:04,720 --> 00:49:09,280 about the comic book industry. And he 1177 00:49:06,800 --> 00:49:11,520 just did what he liked. And he was 1178 00:49:09,280 --> 00:49:12,920 amazed to find that everyone else liked 1179 00:49:11,520 --> 00:49:15,720 it, too. 1180 00:49:12,920 --> 00:49:18,600 Like her father before her, Wendy Gaines 1181 00:49:15,720 --> 00:49:20,920 Bucci has taken over the family business 1182 00:49:18,600 --> 00:49:22,440 and has become the guardian of the EC 1183 00:49:20,920 --> 00:49:24,200 legacy. 1184 00:49:22,440 --> 00:49:25,720 When I was younger, EC didn't really 1185 00:49:24,200 --> 00:49:27,600 mean a whole lot to me. I just knew it 1186 00:49:25,720 --> 00:49:30,080 was something that my dad had done at 1187 00:49:27,600 --> 00:49:32,040 one time. And as I grew older and 1188 00:49:30,080 --> 00:49:34,240 started to become familiar with the 1189 00:49:32,040 --> 00:49:36,080 material and read the old comic books, I 1190 00:49:34,240 --> 00:49:38,640 realized he was a genius and I never 1191 00:49:36,080 --> 00:49:41,080 knew it. He was way ahead of his time 1192 00:49:38,640 --> 00:49:42,640 and created something that he was very 1193 00:49:41,080 --> 00:49:45,240 proud of and we were all very proud of, 1194 00:49:42,640 --> 00:49:45,240 as well. 80617

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