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1
00:00:01,167 --> 00:00:02,969
There's an evil entity
in the house.
2
00:00:03,069 --> 00:00:05,205
You're about to see real
people...
3
00:00:05,305 --> 00:00:07,741
I was terrified
beyond belief.
4
00:00:07,841 --> 00:00:11,311
...reliving horrifying
paranormal encounters
5
00:00:11,411 --> 00:00:13,113
for the first time.
6
00:00:13,213 --> 00:00:15,382
I truly felt
it was like living in hell.
7
00:00:15,482 --> 00:00:19,252
When ghost children come out
to play.
8
00:00:19,352 --> 00:00:21,921
But that picture
turned out to be very evil.
9
00:00:23,289 --> 00:00:26,459
I buried this
for nearly 30 years.
10
00:00:26,559 --> 00:00:28,795
Be prepared to be afraid.
11
00:00:28,895 --> 00:00:37,237
(♪♪♪)
12
00:00:37,337 --> 00:00:41,341
(Typing)
13
00:00:43,476 --> 00:00:48,782
(♪♪♪)
14
00:00:48,882 --> 00:00:51,718
We purchased our property
in 1998
15
00:00:51,818 --> 00:00:54,220
and we tore down
the old home place
16
00:00:54,320 --> 00:00:57,524
and build ours
in September of '99.
17
00:00:57,624 --> 00:01:00,460
I quit my job
as a draftsman
18
00:01:00,560 --> 00:01:03,129
that I had been working for
almost 11 years.
19
00:01:03,229 --> 00:01:08,134
And quit to stay at home
and raise my little man.
20
00:01:08,234 --> 00:01:10,036
Jeremy was about 2-years-old
21
00:01:10,136 --> 00:01:11,871
when he had really started
articulating his words.
22
00:01:11,971 --> 00:01:12,939
I'd go back to him
and I'd say,
23
00:01:13,039 --> 00:01:14,541
"What are you doing, bub?"
24
00:01:14,641 --> 00:01:17,177
And he said,
"Playing with Eli."
25
00:01:17,277 --> 00:01:18,878
And I said,
"Who's Eli?"
26
00:01:18,978 --> 00:01:19,913
"My friend."
27
00:01:20,013 --> 00:01:22,315
Then I said,
"Oh, okay."
28
00:01:22,415 --> 00:01:25,852
And so I had been told
by many friends
29
00:01:25,952 --> 00:01:29,522
that had children that
they have imaginary friends.
30
00:01:29,622 --> 00:01:31,624
I'd be like,
"Okay, what's Eli look like?"
31
00:01:31,724 --> 00:01:33,693
He has the same colour hair
as aunt Tam,
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00:01:33,793 --> 00:01:35,061
which is a natural blond.
33
00:01:35,161 --> 00:01:38,465
My sister's
a very blond blond.
34
00:01:38,565 --> 00:01:40,433
"He has eyes your colour."
35
00:01:40,533 --> 00:01:41,468
So blue eyes.
36
00:01:41,568 --> 00:01:44,604
"And he wears belts
on his shoulders."
37
00:01:44,704 --> 00:01:46,139
I said,
38
00:01:46,239 --> 00:01:47,674
"That's pretty descriptive,
you know?"
39
00:01:47,774 --> 00:01:50,510
And he's like,
"He's my friend."
40
00:01:50,610 --> 00:01:55,048
I thought it was a normal result
of a only child.
41
00:01:55,148 --> 00:01:56,983
But Mandy
was about to discover
42
00:01:57,083 --> 00:02:00,253
there was nothing ordinary
about Eli.
43
00:02:00,353 --> 00:02:03,089
(Thundering)
44
00:02:04,357 --> 00:02:08,962
That day my son was at school
and I was home alone,
45
00:02:09,062 --> 00:02:13,066
cleaning house,
doing my normal mommy chores.
46
00:02:13,166 --> 00:02:16,369
(Child laughing)
47
00:02:16,469 --> 00:02:19,305
And I heard this
just little laugh,
48
00:02:19,405 --> 00:02:21,841
it was plain as day.
49
00:02:21,941 --> 00:02:23,843
(Child laughing)
50
00:02:23,943 --> 00:02:38,258
(♪♪♪)
51
00:02:38,358 --> 00:02:41,394
And I thought you know like,
"Did I just hear that?"
52
00:02:41,494 --> 00:02:42,996
(Child laughing)
53
00:02:43,096 --> 00:02:49,369
(♪♪♪)
54
00:02:49,469 --> 00:02:51,204
(Child laughing)
55
00:02:51,304 --> 00:03:11,224
(♪♪♪)
56
00:03:11,324 --> 00:03:20,867
(♪♪♪)
57
00:03:20,967 --> 00:03:22,468
Of course nothing's there.
58
00:03:24,537 --> 00:03:26,139
I didn't know
if it was paranormal
59
00:03:26,239 --> 00:03:29,209
or if it was my brain.
60
00:03:29,309 --> 00:03:31,477
And Mandy's doubts
would be tested again,
61
00:03:31,578 --> 00:03:33,513
just a few nights later.
62
00:03:34,814 --> 00:03:37,884
It was a normal week night uh,
63
00:03:37,984 --> 00:03:39,452
my husband was in bed
next to me,
64
00:03:39,552 --> 00:03:40,687
he was already asleep.
65
00:03:40,787 --> 00:03:42,121
My son was in bed.
66
00:03:42,222 --> 00:03:52,932
(♪♪♪)
67
00:03:53,032 --> 00:03:54,534
Mommy.
68
00:03:55,935 --> 00:03:58,671
And right in my right ear
on this side of the bed,
69
00:03:58,771 --> 00:04:01,941
it would sound like
a small child saying,
70
00:04:02,041 --> 00:04:03,910
"Mommy."
71
00:04:04,010 --> 00:04:05,812
I was terrified.
72
00:04:07,046 --> 00:04:09,649
And I was just like,
"What's my son doing up,
73
00:04:09,749 --> 00:04:11,017
what's Jeremy doing up?"
74
00:04:11,117 --> 00:04:14,754
You know I do the whole,
"What are you doing awake?"
75
00:04:14,854 --> 00:04:16,489
And he's not there.
76
00:04:18,858 --> 00:04:23,062
I did downplay a lot of it,
because I just figured that
77
00:04:23,162 --> 00:04:25,632
"Hey, unless
I have concrete evidence,
78
00:04:25,732 --> 00:04:29,569
unless I have it in front of me,
it doesn't exist."
79
00:04:29,669 --> 00:04:31,971
(Bed creaking)
80
00:04:32,071 --> 00:04:34,140
Mandy became more worried
81
00:04:34,240 --> 00:04:37,076
when she started to hear
adult voices too.
82
00:04:38,778 --> 00:04:41,114
On several occasions,
when I would be at home alone,
83
00:04:41,214 --> 00:04:45,685
I would hear what sounded like
muffled conversations
84
00:04:45,785 --> 00:04:50,690
between a male and a female,
almost as in an argument.
85
00:04:50,790 --> 00:04:54,927
(Indistinct whisperings)
86
00:04:55,028 --> 00:04:57,063
And I'd hear a footstep
down the hallway.
87
00:04:57,163 --> 00:04:59,966
(Footsteps in distance)
88
00:05:00,066 --> 00:05:01,367
Something in my son's room.
89
00:05:01,467 --> 00:05:04,103
He had this little
toy piano.
90
00:05:04,203 --> 00:05:06,839
(Music playing)
91
00:05:06,939 --> 00:05:08,508
I would hear playing music.
92
00:05:08,608 --> 00:05:22,822
(♪♪♪)
93
00:05:22,922 --> 00:05:26,592
I felt like
I was losing my mind.
94
00:05:26,693 --> 00:05:28,795
My husband would come home
from work,
95
00:05:28,895 --> 00:05:31,264
I would tell him these things
and he just you know,
96
00:05:31,364 --> 00:05:32,732
roll the eyes and be like,
97
00:05:32,832 --> 00:05:35,401
"You know what,
you're son's at school all day,
98
00:05:35,501 --> 00:05:36,536
you're alone,
99
00:05:36,636 --> 00:05:38,771
your brain's
creating these noises."
100
00:05:38,871 --> 00:05:41,040
I said,
"You're probably right."
101
00:05:41,140 --> 00:05:53,886
(♪♪♪)
102
00:05:53,986 --> 00:05:57,623
I have an old German
wooden music box.
103
00:06:00,593 --> 00:06:02,762
(Music box playing)
104
00:06:02,862 --> 00:06:04,697
And I'd hear it play.
105
00:06:04,797 --> 00:06:05,732
And I'd go in
106
00:06:05,832 --> 00:06:07,500
and the lid would be open
on my dresser.
107
00:06:07,600 --> 00:06:13,272
(♪♪♪)
108
00:06:13,373 --> 00:06:17,043
I know that that lid can't open
on its own.
109
00:06:18,411 --> 00:06:20,980
You have to open the hinge
of the music box
110
00:06:21,080 --> 00:06:22,648
to get it to play.
111
00:06:25,385 --> 00:06:26,419
Nobody was believing me,
112
00:06:26,519 --> 00:06:28,621
my husband just thought
I was a nutjob.
113
00:06:28,721 --> 00:06:33,459
And you know,
my son quit having experiences,
114
00:06:33,559 --> 00:06:36,095
he was already at the age
where nothing
115
00:06:36,195 --> 00:06:38,264
was really happening to him
anymore.
116
00:06:38,364 --> 00:06:39,365
And I thought,
117
00:06:39,465 --> 00:06:41,534
"Why am I still hearing
this stuff?"
118
00:06:41,634 --> 00:06:46,205
(♪♪♪)
119
00:06:46,305 --> 00:06:50,676
(Indistinct whisperings)
120
00:06:55,081 --> 00:06:56,616
So I was grasping
at straws,
121
00:06:56,716 --> 00:07:00,052
I was looking for any way
to get rid of it.
122
00:07:04,123 --> 00:07:05,758
(Child laughs)
123
00:07:09,662 --> 00:07:11,731
Just lashed out one day.
124
00:07:11,831 --> 00:07:13,766
Show yourself!
125
00:07:15,001 --> 00:07:16,369
Show yourself!
126
00:07:19,739 --> 00:07:23,743
There stood a boy,
about 4 or 5 years old,
127
00:07:23,843 --> 00:07:25,578
exactly what my son
described.
128
00:07:25,678 --> 00:07:29,715
(♪♪♪)
129
00:07:29,816 --> 00:07:31,484
(Screams)
130
00:07:33,920 --> 00:07:38,758
I just saw the kid
that my son described as Eli.
131
00:07:38,858 --> 00:07:44,464
(♪♪♪)
132
00:07:44,564 --> 00:07:45,465
It just--
133
00:07:45,565 --> 00:07:47,033
I'm thinking,
"Is this possible?
134
00:07:47,133 --> 00:07:48,868
Is this even possible?"
135
00:07:48,968 --> 00:07:52,605
And I was so torn with it,
136
00:07:52,705 --> 00:07:54,941
I was so scared,
137
00:07:55,041 --> 00:07:56,976
so many questions
unanswered.
138
00:07:57,076 --> 00:07:59,111
Um,
139
00:07:59,212 --> 00:08:01,781
I need to know
who this kid is.
140
00:08:01,881 --> 00:08:06,152
I need to know why he's here
and how did he die?
141
00:08:06,252 --> 00:08:10,289
Started looking at deed records
for the property.
142
00:08:10,389 --> 00:08:13,793
The family that lived there
in the 1860s and 1870s
143
00:08:13,893 --> 00:08:16,462
was in fact
the Derenberger family.
144
00:08:16,562 --> 00:08:18,931
They had came here
from Germany.
145
00:08:20,333 --> 00:08:22,835
They had 13 children.
146
00:08:25,238 --> 00:08:28,908
Noticed five of the children
had died on the property...
147
00:08:30,443 --> 00:08:32,111
from being beat.
148
00:08:34,480 --> 00:08:36,849
They had neck and head trauma.
149
00:08:39,385 --> 00:08:41,754
Started going through
the children's names.
150
00:08:42,889 --> 00:08:45,191
Elijah Derenberger,
151
00:08:45,291 --> 00:08:48,394
went by Eli Derenberger.
152
00:08:48,494 --> 00:08:51,264
I was floored.
153
00:08:53,199 --> 00:08:55,835
I had, you know concrete
evidence in front of me
154
00:08:55,935 --> 00:08:59,539
of what had actually happened
on my property.
155
00:08:59,639 --> 00:09:02,642
Child spirits are more likely
to stay earthbound
156
00:09:02,742 --> 00:09:04,477
after traumatic deaths
such as a murder.
157
00:09:04,577 --> 00:09:06,979
Because they're not really sure
where they are
158
00:09:07,079 --> 00:09:08,147
at the time of death
159
00:09:08,247 --> 00:09:10,683
and it's really difficult
for them to cross over.
160
00:09:10,783 --> 00:09:12,985
They're not really sure
of the process needed.
161
00:09:13,085 --> 00:09:14,987
Basically, child spirits
are also still looking
162
00:09:15,087 --> 00:09:15,988
for their parents,
163
00:09:16,088 --> 00:09:17,223
they're looking
for their loved ones.
164
00:09:17,323 --> 00:09:18,558
And when they cross over
165
00:09:18,658 --> 00:09:20,359
after traumatic deaths
like that,
166
00:09:20,459 --> 00:09:21,961
they are unable
to find their families.
167
00:09:22,061 --> 00:09:24,830
So often times they're wandering
and looking for an answer
168
00:09:24,931 --> 00:09:27,233
or a solution
on where their family is.
169
00:09:28,668 --> 00:09:30,369
Dealing with the spirit
of little Eli
170
00:09:30,469 --> 00:09:32,605
had been traumatic enough
for Mandy.
171
00:09:32,705 --> 00:09:34,307
But nothing
could have prepared her
172
00:09:34,407 --> 00:09:36,042
for what happened next.
173
00:09:38,945 --> 00:09:42,715
My husband had went to work,
son was at school,
174
00:09:42,815 --> 00:09:45,284
and I go into the bathroom
to get a shower.
175
00:09:45,384 --> 00:10:05,304
(♪♪♪)
176
00:10:05,404 --> 00:10:08,307
(♪♪♪)
177
00:10:10,543 --> 00:10:19,085
(♪♪♪)
178
00:10:19,185 --> 00:10:21,621
Mandy Joyce had uncovered
historical documents
179
00:10:21,721 --> 00:10:23,589
that appeared to prove
the existence
180
00:10:23,689 --> 00:10:25,891
of her son's
imaginary friend.
181
00:10:25,992 --> 00:10:27,393
Show yourself!
182
00:10:30,930 --> 00:10:32,131
(Screams)
183
00:10:32,231 --> 00:10:34,834
But things
were about to get worse.
184
00:10:34,934 --> 00:10:37,036
I go into the bathroom
to get a shower.
185
00:10:41,007 --> 00:10:44,810
Spirit's knocking stuff
off the bathroom shelves.
186
00:10:48,180 --> 00:10:50,149
And I just kept getting
more fear--
187
00:10:50,249 --> 00:10:51,584
Just I was so scared.
188
00:10:55,454 --> 00:10:57,790
I was praying,
I was praying to God.
189
00:10:57,890 --> 00:11:00,359
I was like,
"God just get me through this."
190
00:11:03,929 --> 00:11:07,633
And there stands the silhouette
of this man.
191
00:11:09,835 --> 00:11:12,805
He had a big tall hat,
but he was all black.
192
00:11:12,905 --> 00:11:33,092
(♪♪♪)
193
00:11:33,192 --> 00:11:35,795
(Screams)
194
00:11:37,930 --> 00:11:41,734
And I throw my hair up
in a towel,
195
00:11:41,834 --> 00:11:44,170
I throw on some
pajama bottoms,
196
00:11:44,270 --> 00:11:47,106
and he drove me out of my house
that day.
197
00:11:47,206 --> 00:11:49,275
When somebody leaves a home
or abandons their house,
198
00:11:49,375 --> 00:11:50,910
because
there's a haunting going on,
199
00:11:51,010 --> 00:11:52,878
it's possible that the spirit
kinda gains power
200
00:11:52,978 --> 00:11:54,280
from that situation.
201
00:11:54,380 --> 00:11:55,548
Um, at least psychologically,
202
00:11:55,648 --> 00:11:57,650
they feel that they've won
in that scenario.
203
00:11:57,750 --> 00:11:59,218
It's believed that
the best thing to do
204
00:11:59,318 --> 00:12:01,554
when you have a haunting
is to stay in the home,
205
00:12:01,654 --> 00:12:04,290
not to surrender your property
and your life to the spirit,
206
00:12:04,390 --> 00:12:07,026
but to confront that
and perform a house blessing
207
00:12:07,126 --> 00:12:08,561
and remove the haunting.
208
00:12:09,862 --> 00:12:11,030
I went to my friend's house
209
00:12:11,130 --> 00:12:16,135
and I was scared,
I cried all the way into town.
210
00:12:17,770 --> 00:12:20,172
And she said,
"You need to cleanse."
211
00:12:20,272 --> 00:12:23,576
She said, "Get a hold of Jackie,
you need to cleanse ASAP."
212
00:12:23,676 --> 00:12:25,010
When I go into a place,
213
00:12:25,111 --> 00:12:27,279
sometimes like pictures pop
into my head.
214
00:12:27,379 --> 00:12:29,048
And I just would see
like certain things
215
00:12:29,148 --> 00:12:31,050
whenever
I'd walk through her house.
216
00:12:34,653 --> 00:12:37,757
The energy just hits you,
it was so heavy.
217
00:12:37,857 --> 00:12:41,794
And just you can tell that
there was something--
218
00:12:41,894 --> 00:12:43,562
You always felt like
something was watching you.
219
00:12:43,662 --> 00:12:44,997
Or if you walked
around a corner,
220
00:12:45,097 --> 00:12:46,766
something was gonna pop out
at you.
221
00:12:47,833 --> 00:12:49,902
She told me that
there was a man.
222
00:12:50,002 --> 00:12:52,538
You know, you could tell that
that man was not nice.
223
00:12:52,638 --> 00:12:54,840
The father
was not a good person.
224
00:12:54,940 --> 00:12:59,311
That was very stern
and ruled with an iron fist.
225
00:13:00,613 --> 00:13:03,015
She smudged with smoke.
226
00:13:03,115 --> 00:13:07,219
We went to every room,
every corner of the house.
227
00:13:07,319 --> 00:13:09,021
And as we moved
through the house,
228
00:13:09,121 --> 00:13:12,057
it just got heavier and heavier,
the energy.
229
00:13:12,158 --> 00:13:14,293
And once we moved
230
00:13:14,393 --> 00:13:17,062
from the upstairs
to the downstairs,
231
00:13:17,163 --> 00:13:19,665
I could feel him there-
I knew he was down there.
232
00:13:19,765 --> 00:13:22,368
And once we got down there,
I just wanted to warn him,
233
00:13:22,468 --> 00:13:25,638
let him know
this is what's happening.
234
00:13:25,738 --> 00:13:29,542
He's somewhere around here
and he's not happy that--
235
00:13:29,642 --> 00:13:31,710
He's pissed
that we're doing this.
236
00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:39,919
I saw this black,
the same black wispy mist
237
00:13:40,019 --> 00:13:43,289
that I saw in this figure
in my bathroom.
238
00:13:47,159 --> 00:13:48,127
And the whole time,
239
00:13:48,227 --> 00:13:49,895
I'm just saying
the Lord's prayer.
240
00:13:49,995 --> 00:13:52,498
I'm saying a prayer
over my home,
241
00:13:52,598 --> 00:13:54,967
I'm saying a prayer over my son
and my husband.
242
00:13:57,937 --> 00:14:01,006
I saw it lunge out,
like as a hand.
243
00:14:01,106 --> 00:14:08,681
(♪♪♪)
244
00:14:08,781 --> 00:14:13,786
I had her help me to yell at it,
tell it it's leaving now.
245
00:14:16,789 --> 00:14:19,291
And then finally it just...
246
00:14:23,195 --> 00:14:24,129
...pooh!
247
00:14:24,230 --> 00:14:25,264
It's like a bubble pops.
248
00:14:25,364 --> 00:14:27,066
And it just lifts,
everything lifts
249
00:14:27,166 --> 00:14:28,968
and it's very light.
250
00:14:29,068 --> 00:14:32,504
And everything is just gone
and quiet.
251
00:14:32,605 --> 00:14:35,507
I learned that
spirits are very real,
252
00:14:35,608 --> 00:14:38,143
that not all spirits
are nice.
253
00:14:38,244 --> 00:14:40,746
I learned that
if you think it's there,
254
00:14:40,846 --> 00:14:42,081
you're not crazy.
255
00:14:44,817 --> 00:14:48,120
It may be hard to believe,
but Mandy got away lightly.
256
00:14:48,220 --> 00:14:50,856
At least the ghost,
of a murdered child in her home,
257
00:14:50,956 --> 00:14:54,126
did not psychically harm Mandy
or her family.
258
00:14:54,226 --> 00:14:58,597
Frank Madrid cannot say the same
of his experience.
259
00:15:04,436 --> 00:15:05,671
Take!
260
00:15:05,771 --> 00:15:13,245
(♪♪♪)
261
00:15:13,345 --> 00:15:17,950
Because my dad was in the navy,
we ended up in National City.
262
00:15:18,050 --> 00:15:22,888
National City is a city
that's close to San Diego,
263
00:15:22,988 --> 00:15:26,225
kinda like Victorian houses,
but small.
264
00:15:26,325 --> 00:15:30,629
And you know everything there
I remember, was just old.
265
00:15:30,729 --> 00:15:32,898
It had a good creep factor
to it.
266
00:15:38,070 --> 00:15:39,705
One day I was riding my bike
267
00:15:39,805 --> 00:15:42,708
and I saw this little boy
of this house
268
00:15:42,808 --> 00:15:44,476
that was on the corner.
269
00:15:44,576 --> 00:15:46,378
So I just rode over there
and said hi to him
270
00:15:46,478 --> 00:15:47,646
and we started talking.
271
00:15:47,746 --> 00:15:52,551
And he was kind of lonely
and scared.
272
00:15:52,651 --> 00:15:55,454
He was very quiet,
very introverted.
273
00:15:57,256 --> 00:16:01,293
The house that he lived in,
all the doors were boarded up.
274
00:16:01,393 --> 00:16:02,594
It was kind of strange,
275
00:16:02,695 --> 00:16:04,663
we didn't really think anything
of it.
276
00:16:04,763 --> 00:16:07,833
And then to hear the laughter
of this little kid.
277
00:16:07,933 --> 00:16:11,003
(Laughing)
278
00:16:11,103 --> 00:16:18,177
(♪♪♪)
279
00:16:20,012 --> 00:16:28,721
(♪♪♪)
280
00:16:28,821 --> 00:16:30,255
In 1967,
281
00:16:30,356 --> 00:16:33,158
Frank Madrid's family
had just moved to a new city.
282
00:16:33,258 --> 00:16:35,260
Making friends
after you're moving around a lot
283
00:16:35,361 --> 00:16:36,695
is uh--
284
00:16:36,795 --> 00:16:39,598
It's kind of hit and miss.
285
00:16:39,698 --> 00:16:43,168
Our father was in the navy
and we moved around.
286
00:16:43,268 --> 00:16:44,770
Um, Frank was born
287
00:16:44,870 --> 00:16:47,172
on the other side
of the country, in Virginia.
288
00:16:47,272 --> 00:16:49,641
I had no friends
in the neighbourhood.
289
00:16:49,742 --> 00:16:52,111
One day I was riding my bike
290
00:16:52,211 --> 00:16:55,180
and I saw this little boy
of this house
291
00:16:55,280 --> 00:16:56,982
that was on the corner.
292
00:16:57,082 --> 00:16:58,817
So I just rode over there
and said hi to him
293
00:16:58,917 --> 00:17:00,753
and we started talking.
294
00:17:00,853 --> 00:17:02,621
I thought
he was a friendly kid,
295
00:17:02,721 --> 00:17:06,725
I thought he was
kind of lonely and scared
296
00:17:06,825 --> 00:17:08,260
for some reason.
297
00:17:08,360 --> 00:17:11,930
He was very quiet,
very introverted.
298
00:17:12,031 --> 00:17:14,099
Said our goodbyes,
I went back home.
299
00:17:14,199 --> 00:17:20,672
(♪♪♪)
300
00:17:20,773 --> 00:17:21,974
And the next day,
I'm riding my bike
301
00:17:22,074 --> 00:17:24,176
and I see him again,
so went over
302
00:17:24,276 --> 00:17:26,011
and start talking to him.
303
00:17:26,111 --> 00:17:29,448
Our father was gone a lot
and everyone else
304
00:17:29,548 --> 00:17:31,216
was younger than he was.
305
00:17:31,316 --> 00:17:35,154
So he kind of latched onto
the first friend
306
00:17:35,254 --> 00:17:36,488
that he could make.
307
00:17:36,588 --> 00:17:39,391
Wanting so desperately
to have somebody
308
00:17:39,491 --> 00:17:41,894
to socialize with,
to play with.
309
00:17:41,994 --> 00:17:43,462
You know,
310
00:17:43,562 --> 00:17:46,632
I believe it got very intense
very quickly.
311
00:17:46,732 --> 00:17:49,668
And after a while
of talking to him a few days,
312
00:17:49,768 --> 00:17:51,003
you know
he started lightening up
313
00:17:51,103 --> 00:17:54,006
and you know,
we'd make each other laugh.
314
00:17:54,106 --> 00:17:56,041
And you know,
it was kind of like
315
00:17:56,141 --> 00:17:58,977
a normal child relationship
you know?
316
00:17:59,078 --> 00:18:01,647
We would play and laugh.
317
00:18:01,747 --> 00:18:03,482
Frank enjoyed
having a new friend,
318
00:18:03,582 --> 00:18:06,819
even one
who seemed a little strange.
319
00:18:06,919 --> 00:18:08,787
I never saw him
pick up anything.
320
00:18:11,190 --> 00:18:13,625
He would just use his fingers
for guns and stuff
321
00:18:13,725 --> 00:18:16,895
and I had plastic ones
and he never would touch those.
322
00:18:19,031 --> 00:18:21,400
There were some times
where I'd bring some toys over,
323
00:18:21,500 --> 00:18:22,568
so we could play,
324
00:18:22,668 --> 00:18:24,736
but he would never ever grab
any of 'em.
325
00:18:24,837 --> 00:18:26,138
He wouldn't play with them.
326
00:18:28,941 --> 00:18:30,576
He just seemed to be
kind of scared,
327
00:18:30,676 --> 00:18:32,144
that-- you know,
I think he was--
328
00:18:32,244 --> 00:18:34,746
It almost kind of seemed
like he was afraid
329
00:18:34,847 --> 00:18:38,650
that his parents would find out
that he was playing with me
330
00:18:38,750 --> 00:18:40,119
or my toys.
331
00:18:40,219 --> 00:18:42,688
So that's kind of impression
that I got from him.
332
00:18:42,788 --> 00:18:44,490
But being as young as I was,
333
00:18:44,590 --> 00:18:47,025
I really didn't pay attention
to it,
334
00:18:47,126 --> 00:18:49,661
because I didn't wanna lose
my friend.
335
00:18:49,761 --> 00:18:52,631
You know, I didn't wanna cause
any kind of problems.
336
00:18:52,731 --> 00:18:53,966
Nevertheless,
337
00:18:54,066 --> 00:18:56,201
it was becoming
increasingly obvious to Frank
338
00:18:56,301 --> 00:18:58,570
that his new friend
had something to hide.
339
00:18:58,670 --> 00:19:01,173
You know, you get tired,
and you work up a sweat,
340
00:19:01,273 --> 00:19:02,708
and get hot and thirsty,
341
00:19:02,808 --> 00:19:05,010
and you know,
just nonchalantly,
342
00:19:05,110 --> 00:19:06,879
"Hey, can you get
a drink of water?"
343
00:19:08,180 --> 00:19:09,715
"No."
344
00:19:12,551 --> 00:19:14,987
"Why can't I have
a drink of water?"
345
00:19:15,087 --> 00:19:17,322
"Well, you can't go
in the house."
346
00:19:17,422 --> 00:19:19,558
"Well,
why can't I go in the house?"
347
00:19:19,658 --> 00:19:20,993
"Because my parents
348
00:19:21,093 --> 00:19:24,530
aren't allowing anybody
in the house."
349
00:19:24,630 --> 00:19:27,466
I go, "Well, can you go get me
a drink of water?"
350
00:19:27,566 --> 00:19:29,968
"No."
351
00:19:30,068 --> 00:19:31,703
"Well, why not?"
352
00:19:31,803 --> 00:19:34,072
"'Cause I can't go in the house
right now."
353
00:19:35,240 --> 00:19:36,842
So you know,
354
00:19:36,942 --> 00:19:39,711
this is really confusing
to a little kid.
355
00:19:39,811 --> 00:19:41,213
You know
I want a drink of water,
356
00:19:41,313 --> 00:19:42,681
you won't get it for me.
357
00:19:42,781 --> 00:19:45,150
You know,
you kind of get a little upset.
358
00:19:45,250 --> 00:19:46,351
"Well, I'm gonna go home
359
00:19:46,451 --> 00:19:48,754
and I'm gonna get
my own drink of water."
360
00:19:48,854 --> 00:19:50,389
The argument
over the glass of water
361
00:19:50,489 --> 00:19:53,192
had an immediate impact
on the boys' friendship.
362
00:19:54,693 --> 00:19:56,728
Things did change after that.
363
00:19:58,163 --> 00:20:01,066
He was more withdrawn
into himself.
364
00:20:01,166 --> 00:20:03,602
And he didn't really laugh
anymore.
365
00:20:03,702 --> 00:20:07,539
We couldn't just have fun,
like we were having fun before.
366
00:20:08,807 --> 00:20:12,077
One day,
went over there to play
367
00:20:12,177 --> 00:20:14,813
and you know--
368
00:20:14,913 --> 00:20:17,482
So the first time in a long time
he was excited,
369
00:20:17,583 --> 00:20:21,086
'cause he told me,
"I found something."
370
00:20:21,186 --> 00:20:22,788
"Well, what'd you find?"
371
00:20:22,888 --> 00:20:25,457
"Well,
I found an axe over here."
372
00:20:25,557 --> 00:20:28,060
So we went over there
and he showed me
373
00:20:28,160 --> 00:20:30,862
where he found
this old small hatchet.
374
00:20:34,533 --> 00:20:37,302
And I remember it being just
you know,
375
00:20:37,402 --> 00:20:39,638
really old and ancient,
and rusty,
376
00:20:39,738 --> 00:20:43,075
and just laying there
half buried in the dirt.
377
00:20:43,175 --> 00:20:44,676
He told me you know,
"Pick it up,
378
00:20:44,776 --> 00:20:45,978
let's go chop something."
379
00:20:46,078 --> 00:20:47,946
I said,
"No, I'm not gonna pick it up."
380
00:20:48,046 --> 00:20:50,048
And he kind of got upset
381
00:20:50,148 --> 00:20:52,217
and he was,
you know really forceful.
382
00:20:52,317 --> 00:20:53,385
We picked the thing up,
383
00:20:53,485 --> 00:20:54,820
"Let's go over here
and chop some wood."
384
00:20:56,355 --> 00:20:59,391
To appease his request,
I was like, okay, pick it up.
385
00:21:04,730 --> 00:21:06,898
And followed him over
to this little log
386
00:21:06,999 --> 00:21:08,166
that was laying there.
387
00:21:10,736 --> 00:21:12,904
And he's telling me
to chop it
388
00:21:13,005 --> 00:21:16,241
and I'm thinking,
"I better not, you know?
389
00:21:16,341 --> 00:21:17,676
Why don't you chop?
390
00:21:17,776 --> 00:21:19,344
He goes,
"I can't."
391
00:21:21,179 --> 00:21:22,547
"Well, why can't you?"
392
00:21:22,648 --> 00:21:24,483
"I just can't."
393
00:21:25,784 --> 00:21:28,453
So I said,
"Alright, I'll chop it."
394
00:21:28,553 --> 00:21:31,423
So I got the axe and...
395
00:21:31,523 --> 00:21:43,235
(♪♪♪)
396
00:21:45,170 --> 00:21:53,879
(♪♪♪)
397
00:21:53,979 --> 00:21:57,115
It was 1967
in National City, California
398
00:21:57,215 --> 00:21:59,751
when young Frank Madrid
made a new friend.
399
00:21:59,851 --> 00:22:03,355
But his new buddy
had started acting very oddly.
400
00:22:04,956 --> 00:22:05,957
"Why don't you chop?"
401
00:22:06,058 --> 00:22:07,592
He goes,
"I can't."
402
00:22:07,693 --> 00:22:08,994
"Well, why can't you?"
403
00:22:09,094 --> 00:22:10,862
"I just can't."
404
00:22:12,297 --> 00:22:15,033
So I said,
"Alright, I'll chop it."
405
00:22:15,133 --> 00:22:16,735
So I got the axe and...
406
00:22:16,835 --> 00:22:29,748
(♪♪♪)
407
00:22:29,848 --> 00:22:34,519
The tip of the axe hit the dirt,
and the gravel, and the wood
408
00:22:34,619 --> 00:22:38,423
and I had some gravel
fly up into my eye.
409
00:22:38,523 --> 00:22:40,492
Immediately,
everything went white
410
00:22:40,592 --> 00:22:42,060
with big blobs of red.
411
00:22:45,364 --> 00:22:46,631
I ran home screaming,
412
00:22:46,732 --> 00:22:49,034
because I couldn't see
out of my eye anymore.
413
00:22:49,134 --> 00:22:52,170
The one thing that I remember
that I won't ever forget
414
00:22:52,270 --> 00:22:56,742
was the horrible laughter,
that he was laughing
415
00:22:56,842 --> 00:22:58,210
when I was running home
screaming.
416
00:22:58,310 --> 00:23:02,314
(Laughing)
417
00:23:09,721 --> 00:23:11,923
And that laughter followed me
all the way home.
418
00:23:14,126 --> 00:23:15,060
When I got home,
419
00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:16,528
my folks took me
to the hospital.
420
00:23:16,628 --> 00:23:21,500
And I'd had 9 major operations
on it
421
00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:23,802
and four minor ones
after that.
422
00:23:23,902 --> 00:23:26,004
They didn't have the technology
that they do these days,
423
00:23:26,104 --> 00:23:29,007
so they really couldn't have
reattach the retina.
424
00:23:29,107 --> 00:23:31,877
The incident left Frank blind
in his right eye
425
00:23:31,977 --> 00:23:33,845
for the rest of his life.
426
00:23:33,945 --> 00:23:36,915
Are you comfortable
taking your glasses off
427
00:23:37,015 --> 00:23:39,618
and talking about it,
'cause I'm--
428
00:23:39,718 --> 00:23:42,687
I can't see you,
but there I am.
429
00:23:42,788 --> 00:23:45,524
So um...
430
00:23:47,125 --> 00:23:49,861
...they were this.
431
00:23:49,961 --> 00:23:50,929
Plastic.
432
00:23:51,029 --> 00:23:52,330
(Laughs)
433
00:23:52,431 --> 00:23:57,035
(♪♪♪)
434
00:23:57,135 --> 00:24:00,572
When I would hear
about Frank's accident,
435
00:24:00,672 --> 00:24:04,075
it always was centred around
this boy on the corner.
436
00:24:04,176 --> 00:24:07,012
I mean there's just
so many things
437
00:24:07,112 --> 00:24:08,613
that I couldn't understand
at the time,
438
00:24:08,713 --> 00:24:10,382
because I was too young.
439
00:24:12,184 --> 00:24:16,154
And you think back
about things that happened.
440
00:24:16,254 --> 00:24:19,291
The clothing that he wore,
red and white striped shirt,
441
00:24:19,391 --> 00:24:21,493
blue jeans
rolled up at the cuffs,
442
00:24:21,593 --> 00:24:23,728
and the black piped
pop tennis shoes
443
00:24:23,829 --> 00:24:25,630
with the white balls
on the side.
444
00:24:27,232 --> 00:24:28,300
This kid,
445
00:24:28,400 --> 00:24:29,968
in all the days
that I've seen him,
446
00:24:30,068 --> 00:24:31,803
was wearing the same clothes
he wore all the time.
447
00:24:31,903 --> 00:24:38,877
(♪♪♪)
448
00:24:38,977 --> 00:24:42,247
The house that he lived in,
nobody lives there.
449
00:24:45,450 --> 00:24:47,018
It's abandoned.
450
00:24:48,386 --> 00:24:49,488
My childhood friend,
451
00:24:49,588 --> 00:24:52,657
this kid that
nobody else could see but me,
452
00:24:52,757 --> 00:24:54,693
was a spirit kid.
453
00:24:54,793 --> 00:25:05,704
(♪♪♪)
454
00:25:05,804 --> 00:25:07,105
Children
haven't been conditioned
455
00:25:07,205 --> 00:25:08,807
by their parents or society
456
00:25:08,907 --> 00:25:11,276
to not believe
in the paranormal.
457
00:25:11,376 --> 00:25:12,744
Well, it's part of their
reality, basically.
458
00:25:12,844 --> 00:25:13,945
Child spirits,
459
00:25:14,045 --> 00:25:16,414
when they're dealing
with human children
460
00:25:16,515 --> 00:25:19,084
really come across as valid
and legitimate.
461
00:25:19,184 --> 00:25:21,319
They don't seem to be a sprit
and the children
462
00:25:21,419 --> 00:25:23,655
are very open-minded
and accepting of them.
463
00:25:23,755 --> 00:25:24,890
He was very open to it.
464
00:25:24,990 --> 00:25:26,324
He was,
465
00:25:26,424 --> 00:25:28,260
I mean I don't wanna use
the word "desperate",
466
00:25:28,360 --> 00:25:29,427
because it sounds negative.
467
00:25:29,528 --> 00:25:31,630
But in this situation,
it makes sense
468
00:25:31,730 --> 00:25:33,565
that he was desperate
to make a friend,
469
00:25:33,665 --> 00:25:35,267
to have some kind
of companionship there,
470
00:25:35,367 --> 00:25:37,669
in a place
where he knew nobody.
471
00:25:37,769 --> 00:25:42,040
I think the little boy died
in that house
472
00:25:42,140 --> 00:25:46,444
and I think the parents
were so distraught about it
473
00:25:46,545 --> 00:25:48,513
that they moved away.
474
00:25:48,613 --> 00:25:50,715
And his energy is still there,
he's soul, his spirit,
475
00:25:50,815 --> 00:25:52,684
however you wanna say it.
476
00:25:52,784 --> 00:25:54,819
So he went to
what was familiar
477
00:25:54,920 --> 00:25:56,755
and what was familiar
was that house.
478
00:26:00,926 --> 00:26:02,127
And I never went
back to the house,
479
00:26:02,227 --> 00:26:04,563
to his house
to see if he was there or not.
480
00:26:04,663 --> 00:26:07,499
Um, I wanted to stay away
from that place,
481
00:26:07,599 --> 00:26:10,302
I didn't want nothing to do
with him or anything.
482
00:26:10,402 --> 00:26:12,137
I mean that laughter
was still in my head.
483
00:26:12,237 --> 00:26:13,738
And there's no way that--
484
00:26:13,838 --> 00:26:16,174
To this day,
I can't forget it.
485
00:26:16,274 --> 00:26:19,477
(Laughing)
486
00:26:20,645 --> 00:26:21,746
Many years later,
487
00:26:21,846 --> 00:26:24,215
Frank had another
paranormal encounter.
488
00:26:24,316 --> 00:26:34,826
(♪♪♪)
489
00:26:34,926 --> 00:26:37,696
It seemed like
we had met before.
490
00:26:37,796 --> 00:26:40,966
I go to talk to him
and as I'm talking to him...
491
00:26:45,637 --> 00:26:48,506
...he starts to fade
and I can see through him
492
00:26:48,607 --> 00:26:51,676
and then he just vanishes
right before my eyes.
493
00:26:51,776 --> 00:26:53,678
Just gone.
494
00:26:53,778 --> 00:26:54,946
Very well could be
495
00:26:55,046 --> 00:26:58,483
the little boy on the corner
as a man.
496
00:26:58,583 --> 00:27:01,286
It's possible that
the child spirit aged somehow
497
00:27:01,386 --> 00:27:03,922
on the other side
and returned to visit him
498
00:27:04,022 --> 00:27:06,424
to show him that you know,
here I am,
499
00:27:06,524 --> 00:27:07,692
I've grown up with you
500
00:27:07,792 --> 00:27:09,594
and it's good to see you again
type of scenario.
501
00:27:09,694 --> 00:27:12,364
But it's also possible that
that child sprit
502
00:27:12,464 --> 00:27:13,798
maybe had another spirit
503
00:27:13,898 --> 00:27:15,567
go and visit him
in an adult form,
504
00:27:15,667 --> 00:27:17,202
because
it was more socially acceptable
505
00:27:17,302 --> 00:27:19,170
or understandable.
506
00:27:19,270 --> 00:27:20,672
This gentleman
was just standing there,
507
00:27:20,772 --> 00:27:23,274
in the middle
of the road there.
508
00:27:24,576 --> 00:27:27,045
And looking directly
at Frank.
509
00:27:27,145 --> 00:27:29,314
There was some knowledge
of who he was.
510
00:27:29,414 --> 00:27:32,484
Since their childhood friendship
was so intense,
511
00:27:32,584 --> 00:27:35,053
that there would've been more.
512
00:27:35,153 --> 00:27:37,756
If the axe incident
was intentional,
513
00:27:37,856 --> 00:27:40,058
I would expect that person
to say, "Gotcha."
514
00:27:40,158 --> 00:27:42,727
And if it was unintentional
and if it was just a fluke,
515
00:27:42,827 --> 00:27:44,863
then I would
also expect to say,
516
00:27:44,963 --> 00:27:47,465
"I'm really sorry,
that that happened to you."
517
00:27:47,565 --> 00:27:49,634
And not just faded away
as he got close.
518
00:27:50,702 --> 00:27:52,904
There's just too much
unfinished business there.
519
00:27:53,004 --> 00:27:54,706
That's kind of an evil thing
to do.
520
00:27:55,974 --> 00:27:58,810
Frank will never forget
this episode of his life.
521
00:27:58,910 --> 00:28:02,447
His injury reminds him
of his ghostly friend every day.
522
00:28:02,547 --> 00:28:04,182
(Laughing)
523
00:28:04,282 --> 00:28:07,852
When people tell you
ghosts can hurt you,
524
00:28:07,952 --> 00:28:11,556
they can cause, in effect,
harm to you.
525
00:28:11,656 --> 00:28:14,259
That'll haunt me for you know,
as long as I live.
526
00:28:14,359 --> 00:28:16,127
It's just something like that.
527
00:28:16,227 --> 00:28:21,433
(♪♪♪)
528
00:28:21,533 --> 00:28:23,501
The presence
of the spirits of dead children
529
00:28:23,601 --> 00:28:25,403
should never be ignored,
530
00:28:25,503 --> 00:28:27,706
they are often the first sign
that a portal
531
00:28:27,806 --> 00:28:30,775
to the spirits world
has been opened.
532
00:28:36,414 --> 00:28:37,515
Number 1.
533
00:28:37,615 --> 00:28:47,959
(♪♪♪)
534
00:28:48,059 --> 00:28:51,029
My husband had lost his job
due to a back injury.
535
00:28:51,129 --> 00:28:55,033
I was diagnosed a long time ago
with Crohn's disease,
536
00:28:55,133 --> 00:28:58,436
but I'd gotten really sick,
couldn't work anymore.
537
00:28:58,536 --> 00:29:00,105
We needed a place to stay,
538
00:29:00,205 --> 00:29:02,707
so we decided
we'd take the house.
539
00:29:02,807 --> 00:29:06,711
It used to be what they called,
"veteran's housing."
540
00:29:06,811 --> 00:29:10,482
We had our first son together,
his name is Jordan.
541
00:29:10,582 --> 00:29:15,186
When we moved into the house,
the first thing I remember is
542
00:29:15,286 --> 00:29:17,989
we couldn't get our mattress
up the stairs.
543
00:29:18,089 --> 00:29:19,591
It was too narrow
of an area.
544
00:29:19,691 --> 00:29:21,960
We had to sleep
all on the sofa bed.
545
00:29:24,629 --> 00:29:28,633
I woke up to smelling
like flowers, like roses.
546
00:29:32,036 --> 00:29:34,773
I'm a Christian
and it was always said that
547
00:29:34,873 --> 00:29:38,743
if you smell flowers or roses,
it could be the Holy Spirit.
548
00:29:38,843 --> 00:29:41,312
So I tried to maybe think
it was something like that,
549
00:29:41,412 --> 00:29:44,616
but it didn't feel
refreshing.
550
00:29:44,716 --> 00:29:46,718
Because it smelt more like
when you go to a funeral home,
551
00:29:46,818 --> 00:29:47,752
like death.
552
00:29:47,852 --> 00:29:55,960
(♪♪♪)
553
00:29:56,060 --> 00:29:57,695
It reminded me of death.
554
00:29:57,796 --> 00:30:15,413
(♪♪♪)
555
00:30:15,513 --> 00:30:17,482
It was very uneasy.
556
00:30:17,582 --> 00:30:19,184
Um, it was uneasy
557
00:30:19,284 --> 00:30:21,452
that I made the statement
all the time that,
558
00:30:21,553 --> 00:30:23,087
"I don't feel like
this is our home."
559
00:30:24,823 --> 00:30:26,024
I can't put my finger on,
560
00:30:26,124 --> 00:30:28,660
I just couldn't figure it out
what it was about the house.
561
00:30:33,398 --> 00:30:35,366
The family had not been living
in the house long
562
00:30:35,466 --> 00:30:36,534
before Dawn noticed
563
00:30:36,634 --> 00:30:39,571
Jordan was displaying
some disturbing behaviour.
564
00:30:39,671 --> 00:30:44,342
Jordan was playing on the stairs
inside the hallway,
565
00:30:44,442 --> 00:30:48,746
at the bottom of the stairs
was a rocking chair.
566
00:30:50,114 --> 00:30:53,618
Jordan got in the chair
and would swing back and forth,
567
00:30:53,718 --> 00:30:56,454
and say,
"Baby hurt, baby hurt."
568
00:30:56,554 --> 00:30:59,257
(Baby hurt, baby hurt)
569
00:30:59,357 --> 00:31:00,391
Over and over again,
570
00:31:00,491 --> 00:31:02,493
and I'd say, "Jordan,
what do you mean by that?"
571
00:31:02,594 --> 00:31:05,029
(Baby hurt, baby hurt)
572
00:31:05,129 --> 00:31:07,432
And he said,
"The baby got hurt."
573
00:31:07,532 --> 00:31:08,566
He said, "Yeah,
574
00:31:08,666 --> 00:31:09,901
there's a little girl
standing there
575
00:31:10,001 --> 00:31:11,302
at the top of the stairs."
576
00:31:11,402 --> 00:31:15,974
(♪♪♪)
577
00:31:16,074 --> 00:31:18,142
And I had no idea
what he was talking about.
578
00:31:19,711 --> 00:31:21,980
(Baby hurt, baby hurt)
579
00:31:23,047 --> 00:31:25,884
And I said,
"I don't see her."
580
00:31:25,984 --> 00:31:28,086
He said,
"Look mama, there's Ally."
581
00:31:31,456 --> 00:31:35,393
Ally was my neighbour's daughter
that passed away.
582
00:31:37,362 --> 00:31:39,664
I had heard
about my neighbour's daughter
583
00:31:39,764 --> 00:31:42,333
probably about a month
after living there.
584
00:31:42,433 --> 00:31:45,670
She had died at 4-
she was only 4 years old.
585
00:31:45,770 --> 00:31:48,740
It was just some sort
of weird virus and medication,
586
00:31:48,840 --> 00:31:51,576
but she had died
in the house.
587
00:31:51,676 --> 00:31:54,279
Jordan did not know who she was
or her name.
588
00:31:55,480 --> 00:31:57,148
(Baby hurt, baby hurt)
589
00:31:57,248 --> 00:31:58,283
There was no way that he knew,
590
00:31:58,383 --> 00:32:00,084
but that wasn't the first time
he'd told me things
591
00:32:00,184 --> 00:32:02,186
that there was no way
he could possibly know.
592
00:32:07,492 --> 00:32:09,460
With Jordan's behaviour
on her mind,
593
00:32:09,560 --> 00:32:11,896
Dawn confided
in a new friend.
594
00:32:11,996 --> 00:32:15,934
She had ended up telling me
that she was into witchcraft.
595
00:32:16,034 --> 00:32:17,068
She started to say me,
596
00:32:17,168 --> 00:32:18,870
"Well, maybe
if you used tarot cards,
597
00:32:18,970 --> 00:32:20,505
you can get some answers."
598
00:32:20,605 --> 00:32:23,207
She gave me a book
and she gave me the cards
599
00:32:23,308 --> 00:32:25,510
and I took them home
and I started playing with them.
600
00:32:30,348 --> 00:32:32,850
I would ask questions
to the cards.
601
00:32:35,753 --> 00:32:38,289
I just kept wondering
if you know
602
00:32:38,389 --> 00:32:41,759
he was really seeing Ally,
what he was really seeing.
603
00:32:41,859 --> 00:32:47,465
(♪♪♪)
604
00:32:47,565 --> 00:32:50,034
It can be dangerous for people
to use spiritual divination,
605
00:32:50,134 --> 00:32:52,837
tools such as tarot
if they don't have the knowledge
606
00:32:52,937 --> 00:32:55,473
or know
how to use these items.
607
00:32:55,573 --> 00:32:58,409
You can open doorways,
hauntings can begin,
608
00:32:58,509 --> 00:33:01,412
entities can come through
and actually attach themselves
609
00:33:01,512 --> 00:33:04,349
to the people
that are using these tools.
610
00:33:04,449 --> 00:33:06,250
Dawn's dabbling
with the tarot cards
611
00:33:06,351 --> 00:33:08,720
seemed to make
the situation worse.
612
00:33:08,820 --> 00:33:09,988
With Jordan,
613
00:33:10,088 --> 00:33:12,256
his room was very uncomfortable
for everybody.
614
00:33:12,357 --> 00:33:13,925
Nobody could stay
in that room.
615
00:33:15,326 --> 00:33:17,195
(Floor creaking)
616
00:33:17,295 --> 00:33:19,330
Jordan didn't want to sleep
in that room.
617
00:33:19,430 --> 00:33:22,400
(Floor creaking)
618
00:33:22,500 --> 00:33:24,102
One time he told me
he saw a whole family,
619
00:33:24,202 --> 00:33:27,038
it was a mother, a son,
and a daughter
620
00:33:27,138 --> 00:33:29,040
with bullet wounds
in their head.
621
00:33:29,140 --> 00:33:35,913
(♪♪♪)
622
00:33:36,014 --> 00:33:37,949
And then all of a sudden,
all those were gone
623
00:33:38,049 --> 00:33:40,418
and the only there
was one he called, "the man".
624
00:33:40,518 --> 00:33:49,027
(♪♪♪)
625
00:33:51,629 --> 00:33:59,837
(♪♪♪)
626
00:33:59,937 --> 00:34:02,373
Dawn Pierce's family had moved
into a new home
627
00:34:02,473 --> 00:34:03,408
and immediately
628
00:34:03,508 --> 00:34:05,676
started experiencing
paranormal activity.
629
00:34:06,844 --> 00:34:07,812
Dawn's young son
630
00:34:07,912 --> 00:34:10,248
had started seeing the ghost
of a child.
631
00:34:10,348 --> 00:34:12,450
(Baby hurt, baby hurt)
632
00:34:12,550 --> 00:34:15,987
Then he started seeing
other phantoms in his bedroom.
633
00:34:16,087 --> 00:34:17,688
One time he told me
he saw a whole family,
634
00:34:17,789 --> 00:34:20,725
it was a mother, a son,
and a daughter
635
00:34:20,825 --> 00:34:22,894
with bullet wounds
in their head.
636
00:34:25,730 --> 00:34:27,665
And then all of a sudden
all those were gone
637
00:34:27,765 --> 00:34:30,301
and the only one there
was one he called, "the man".
638
00:34:30,401 --> 00:34:35,807
(♪♪♪)
639
00:34:35,907 --> 00:34:38,209
And the man
wasn't very nice.
640
00:34:38,309 --> 00:34:39,644
And the man said
some terrible things
641
00:34:39,744 --> 00:34:42,847
and the man told him
to tell me horrific things.
642
00:34:47,452 --> 00:34:48,753
He says the man told me
to tell you,
643
00:34:48,853 --> 00:34:50,888
"As long as you live here,
he's gonna keep you sick
644
00:34:50,988 --> 00:34:52,557
and make sure
you stay sick."
645
00:34:57,028 --> 00:34:59,664
My husband said,
"Why don't you throw a recorder
646
00:34:59,764 --> 00:35:02,433
in Jordan's room
and see what you get."
647
00:35:02,533 --> 00:35:04,402
So I said,
"Okay, that's a good idea."
648
00:35:04,502 --> 00:35:06,971
I put the recorder in the room,
nobody was home
649
00:35:07,071 --> 00:35:08,606
and I put it on top a bible.
650
00:35:12,610 --> 00:35:13,511
And when I went
651
00:35:13,611 --> 00:35:16,314
and I rewinded my recorder
and listened,
652
00:35:16,414 --> 00:35:19,750
I heard the worst,
I can't even--
653
00:35:19,851 --> 00:35:21,185
It still plays--
654
00:35:21,285 --> 00:35:22,753
It was like
the most bloodcurdling thing
655
00:35:22,854 --> 00:35:24,222
I heard it say.
656
00:35:28,392 --> 00:35:30,995
It was just like
the most evilest thing
657
00:35:31,095 --> 00:35:31,996
I've ever heard,
658
00:35:32,096 --> 00:35:34,632
like it's engraved in my brain
to this day.
659
00:35:34,732 --> 00:35:36,300
It was scary,
because I'm thinking,
660
00:35:36,400 --> 00:35:38,202
"What did I do
to open these doors?"
661
00:35:42,240 --> 00:35:43,374
Terrified,
662
00:35:43,474 --> 00:35:46,210
Dawn started looking into ways
of protecting her family.
663
00:35:46,310 --> 00:35:49,247
I just kind of learned about
some prayers of protection.
664
00:35:49,347 --> 00:35:51,048
And one of them was Psalm 91.
665
00:35:52,817 --> 00:35:54,285
My son was taking a bath.
666
00:36:02,026 --> 00:36:03,027
And all of a sudden,
667
00:36:03,127 --> 00:36:04,395
it was like
his eyes looked different,
668
00:36:04,495 --> 00:36:06,230
like he looked sinister.
669
00:36:09,367 --> 00:36:11,402
And he seemed to get
like super strong.
670
00:36:11,502 --> 00:36:14,572
And I knew it wasn't him.
671
00:36:14,672 --> 00:36:27,351
(♪♪♪)
672
00:36:27,451 --> 00:36:29,620
The Lord is my shepherd,
I shall not walk.
673
00:36:29,720 --> 00:36:32,990
He maketh me to lie down
in green pastures.
674
00:36:33,090 --> 00:36:35,259
(Screams)
675
00:36:35,359 --> 00:36:38,763
So I opened the bible
and I started reading Psalm 91.
676
00:36:38,863 --> 00:36:40,131
As I did,
677
00:36:40,231 --> 00:36:41,799
he started thrashing around
the tub
678
00:36:41,899 --> 00:36:44,402
and he's like, "You shut up,
you dumb whore, bitch."
679
00:36:44,502 --> 00:36:45,937
Called me all kinds of names.
680
00:36:46,037 --> 00:36:47,738
The Lord is my shepherd,
I shall not walk.
681
00:36:47,838 --> 00:36:50,675
He maketh me to lie down
in green pastures.
682
00:36:50,775 --> 00:36:52,076
(Growls)
683
00:36:52,176 --> 00:36:53,444
And eventually it stopped.
684
00:36:53,544 --> 00:36:55,213
It might've been
just one or two minutes,
685
00:36:55,313 --> 00:36:58,316
but it seemed like
the longest one or two minutes.
686
00:36:58,416 --> 00:37:00,051
And when it broke,
he started crying
687
00:37:00,151 --> 00:37:01,852
and he said,
"Mommy, mommy, that wasn't me.
688
00:37:01,953 --> 00:37:03,487
That wasn't me."
689
00:37:07,959 --> 00:37:09,360
When you're trying
to protect your child,
690
00:37:09,460 --> 00:37:11,796
you do anything
to protect them.
691
00:37:11,896 --> 00:37:13,831
But when you can't see
692
00:37:13,931 --> 00:37:16,901
or physically feel
what's attacking them,
693
00:37:17,001 --> 00:37:20,137
you feel hopeless
and helpless.
694
00:37:20,238 --> 00:37:21,305
At this point,
695
00:37:21,405 --> 00:37:24,041
Dawn was desperate
to get help for her son.
696
00:37:24,141 --> 00:37:26,611
And at that time,
that's when I met Joe.
697
00:37:26,711 --> 00:37:28,279
She was telling us that
698
00:37:28,379 --> 00:37:30,414
she believed
that her home was haunted
699
00:37:30,514 --> 00:37:32,250
and that her son
was seeing things
700
00:37:32,350 --> 00:37:34,185
and he was talking to spirits.
701
00:37:35,519 --> 00:37:36,621
Dawn had mentioned
702
00:37:36,721 --> 00:37:39,624
a couple of different smells
in the house.
703
00:37:39,724 --> 00:37:42,193
Just before
a spirit may show up,
704
00:37:42,293 --> 00:37:45,096
you will smell
a flower of some sort
705
00:37:45,196 --> 00:37:48,766
and it's usually roses
and lilacs.
706
00:37:48,866 --> 00:37:50,935
Jordan believed
that a little spirit,
707
00:37:51,035 --> 00:37:53,437
a little female
was speaking to him.
708
00:37:53,537 --> 00:37:56,941
A child could relate
to a child's spirit.
709
00:37:57,041 --> 00:38:00,444
The spirit of a girl
that had passed away
710
00:38:00,544 --> 00:38:02,346
was trying to come through.
711
00:38:02,446 --> 00:38:04,949
And the only way she could get
anybody's attention
712
00:38:05,049 --> 00:38:08,319
was to go at somebody
that was more on her mentality
713
00:38:08,419 --> 00:38:10,888
or more on her wavelength,
which would be another child.
714
00:38:13,090 --> 00:38:14,892
As the unravelling started
715
00:38:14,992 --> 00:38:16,727
and I started asking
a bunch of questions,
716
00:38:16,827 --> 00:38:19,997
then certain things were like,
"Okay, tarot cards."
717
00:38:22,066 --> 00:38:23,701
She had dabbled
into a few things
718
00:38:23,801 --> 00:38:24,769
and then everything
719
00:38:24,869 --> 00:38:26,671
was starting to get put back
into perspective.
720
00:38:28,072 --> 00:38:30,007
If somebody is playing
with tarot cards,
721
00:38:30,107 --> 00:38:31,542
they're divination tools,
722
00:38:31,642 --> 00:38:35,746
those are tools to communicate
with those that have passed.
723
00:38:35,846 --> 00:38:37,114
A lot of times
724
00:38:37,214 --> 00:38:39,517
people just play with cards
every so often,
725
00:38:39,617 --> 00:38:42,153
somebody makes a connection
and a door does open.
726
00:38:46,023 --> 00:38:47,692
We have this thing
in the paranormal
727
00:38:47,792 --> 00:38:50,027
that if something comes back,
728
00:38:50,127 --> 00:38:52,630
sometimes it could come back
two or three times worse
729
00:38:52,730 --> 00:38:54,699
than it was originally.
730
00:38:54,799 --> 00:38:55,766
(Screams)
731
00:38:55,866 --> 00:38:56,767
Yea, though I walk
732
00:38:56,867 --> 00:38:57,802
through the valley
of the shadow of death,
733
00:38:57,902 --> 00:38:59,437
I will fear no evil.
734
00:38:59,537 --> 00:39:01,605
It sounded like
that's what happened.
735
00:39:01,706 --> 00:39:03,074
(Ghostly Voice)
Get out!
736
00:39:04,842 --> 00:39:07,445
The game plan
was to go find something.
737
00:39:08,646 --> 00:39:10,414
Something was there,
we would try to pull it out.
738
00:39:10,514 --> 00:39:12,650
If not, we would like to get
some sort of evidence,
739
00:39:12,750 --> 00:39:14,051
just something to go on,
740
00:39:14,151 --> 00:39:17,388
to show us that
there is something supernatural
741
00:39:17,488 --> 00:39:18,789
happening in the home.
742
00:39:20,591 --> 00:39:21,792
We'd spent about,
743
00:39:21,892 --> 00:39:24,462
I'd say a good four
or five hours of investigating.
744
00:39:24,562 --> 00:39:27,631
The very last sequence
was in the basement.
745
00:39:27,732 --> 00:39:34,205
(♪♪♪)
746
00:39:34,305 --> 00:39:36,907
We set up cameras-
we set up our video equipment,
747
00:39:37,007 --> 00:39:38,542
we took lots of pictures.
748
00:39:38,642 --> 00:39:45,349
(♪♪♪)
749
00:39:45,449 --> 00:39:47,718
I didn't have a good feeling
going into the basement,
750
00:39:47,818 --> 00:39:50,087
I kinda felt--
751
00:39:50,187 --> 00:39:51,722
It's almost like
when you have the hair
752
00:39:51,822 --> 00:39:53,090
on the back of your neck
stand up.
753
00:39:53,190 --> 00:39:54,725
It was one of those things
and I'm like,
754
00:39:54,825 --> 00:39:56,527
"You know what,
let's go down here
755
00:39:56,627 --> 00:39:57,795
and let's check this out."
756
00:40:00,398 --> 00:40:01,565
Initially,
757
00:40:01,665 --> 00:40:03,467
I don't like to hit people
with prayer right off the bat.
758
00:40:03,567 --> 00:40:06,370
I don't wanna come off
as anybody that's too religious
759
00:40:06,470 --> 00:40:08,773
or trying to make something
out of nothing.
760
00:40:08,873 --> 00:40:10,674
...my shepherd,
I shall not want.
761
00:40:10,775 --> 00:40:12,510
But I felt compelled
to pray into the house,
762
00:40:12,610 --> 00:40:14,178
into the basement.
763
00:40:14,278 --> 00:40:15,746
And that's what we did.
764
00:40:19,116 --> 00:40:23,020
(♪♪♪)
765
00:40:23,120 --> 00:40:26,690
And when Joe had called me
about two days later
766
00:40:26,791 --> 00:40:28,259
and said, "I got something
to play for you,
767
00:40:28,359 --> 00:40:29,593
you gonna--
768
00:40:29,693 --> 00:40:32,196
you know it's gonna
knock your socks off basically."
769
00:40:36,801 --> 00:40:39,804
In the very end of the tape
just before it ran out,
770
00:40:39,904 --> 00:40:42,072
I heard us saying the prayer,
771
00:40:42,173 --> 00:40:43,707
"It's now a house of Christ
772
00:40:43,808 --> 00:40:47,478
and you are no longer
welcome here, evil spirit.
773
00:40:49,480 --> 00:40:51,048
And you know
you must obey our commands."
774
00:40:51,148 --> 00:40:52,249
(Entity groans)
775
00:40:52,349 --> 00:41:00,658
(♪♪♪)
776
00:41:02,993 --> 00:41:11,402
(♪♪♪)
777
00:41:11,502 --> 00:41:13,804
Dawn Pierce's life changed
when her son Jordan
778
00:41:13,904 --> 00:41:16,040
began seeing the ghost
of a child in their home.
779
00:41:17,107 --> 00:41:19,276
(Screams)
780
00:41:19,376 --> 00:41:20,778
After unsuccessfully trying
781
00:41:20,878 --> 00:41:22,913
to get rid
of the spirit herself,
782
00:41:23,013 --> 00:41:24,048
Dawn called in
783
00:41:24,148 --> 00:41:27,084
professional paranormal
investigator Joe Cetrone.
784
00:41:28,919 --> 00:41:31,956
At the very end of the tape,
just before it ran out,
785
00:41:32,056 --> 00:41:34,191
I heard us saying the prayer,
786
00:41:34,291 --> 00:41:35,726
"It's now a house of Christ
787
00:41:35,826 --> 00:41:39,330
and you are no longer
welcome here, evil spirit.
788
00:41:41,065 --> 00:41:43,000
And you know
you must obey our commands."
789
00:41:43,100 --> 00:41:44,368
(Entity groans)
790
00:41:47,071 --> 00:41:48,973
And right during that time,
791
00:41:49,073 --> 00:41:53,711
over what we were saying
was a loud growl,
792
00:41:53,811 --> 00:41:57,648
inhuman growl that sounded like
a mule being kicked.
793
00:41:57,748 --> 00:41:59,116
"And you know
you must obey our commands."
794
00:41:59,216 --> 00:42:00,851
(Entity groans)
795
00:42:00,951 --> 00:42:04,154
It was just the most
God-awful
796
00:42:04,255 --> 00:42:06,857
loud scream,
797
00:42:06,957 --> 00:42:09,894
like an animal
was being tortured.
798
00:42:09,994 --> 00:42:11,362
"And you know
you must obey our commands."
799
00:42:11,462 --> 00:42:12,730
(Entity groans)
800
00:42:12,830 --> 00:42:14,765
It is definitely
an inhuman sound
801
00:42:14,865 --> 00:42:17,334
that came over
that recorder.
802
00:42:17,434 --> 00:42:18,836
But I felt relieved,
803
00:42:18,936 --> 00:42:22,373
because it validated
what we'd been going through.
804
00:42:24,308 --> 00:42:27,144
There is something supernatural
happening in the home.
805
00:42:30,915 --> 00:42:33,284
Not long after
Joe had investigated the home,
806
00:42:33,384 --> 00:42:36,220
the Pierce family were spending
a normal evening together.
807
00:42:36,320 --> 00:42:37,321
Yeah, I'm gonna get you.
808
00:42:37,421 --> 00:42:41,425
(Jordan screaming and laughing)
809
00:42:43,027 --> 00:42:46,096
My husband, me, and Jordan
were in my bedroom,
810
00:42:46,196 --> 00:42:47,831
my husband
was on the computer,
811
00:42:47,932 --> 00:42:49,266
I was laying on the bed
with Jordan
812
00:42:49,366 --> 00:42:50,568
and I was reading through
the bible.
813
00:42:50,668 --> 00:42:52,536
And I started
to read it out loud to him.
814
00:43:01,679 --> 00:43:02,980
(Screams)
815
00:43:04,181 --> 00:43:06,584
And he started thrashing around
on the bed, and hitting me,
816
00:43:06,684 --> 00:43:10,754
and you know,
yelling obscenities.
817
00:43:10,854 --> 00:43:16,627
(♪♪♪)
818
00:43:16,727 --> 00:43:18,228
(Jordan screams)
819
00:43:18,329 --> 00:43:23,734
(♪♪♪)
820
00:43:23,834 --> 00:43:24,835
And I yelled, "Mark!
821
00:43:24,935 --> 00:43:26,370
Mark, come over here
help me."
822
00:43:26,470 --> 00:43:28,138
(Screaming)
823
00:43:28,238 --> 00:43:30,174
He came over
and he was restraining Jordan
824
00:43:30,274 --> 00:43:31,342
and he said to me,
825
00:43:31,442 --> 00:43:32,776
"Just keep reading,
just keep going."
826
00:43:37,748 --> 00:43:38,949
He was very strong
827
00:43:39,049 --> 00:43:40,985
and then all of a sudden,
he just stopped.
828
00:43:47,224 --> 00:43:50,027
Cried and again you know,
explaining that was not him.
829
00:43:50,127 --> 00:43:56,533
(♪♪♪)
830
00:43:56,634 --> 00:43:58,435
And I didn't know what to do
with Jordan at that point.
831
00:43:58,535 --> 00:44:02,606
I was just sitting there,
frustrated.
832
00:44:04,274 --> 00:44:07,978
And that must be hard for you,
you know?
833
00:44:08,078 --> 00:44:10,047
Were you blaming your son?
834
00:44:10,147 --> 00:44:11,615
I was blaming myself.
835
00:44:14,218 --> 00:44:15,886
What did I do
to open these doors?
836
00:44:15,986 --> 00:44:25,062
(♪♪♪)
837
00:44:25,162 --> 00:44:29,066
I felt like my curiosity
maybe opened it.
838
00:44:29,166 --> 00:44:30,134
But I knew that
839
00:44:30,234 --> 00:44:32,136
there was something there
from when we moved in.
840
00:44:34,605 --> 00:44:36,407
Things just weren't gonna get
any better.
841
00:44:36,507 --> 00:44:38,475
And we had had enough.
842
00:44:38,575 --> 00:44:46,150
(♪♪♪)
843
00:44:46,250 --> 00:44:48,218
We spent four years
in the house,
844
00:44:48,318 --> 00:44:49,653
so there were
a lot of different things
845
00:44:49,753 --> 00:44:51,021
that happened.
846
00:44:51,121 --> 00:44:52,156
He was young at the time
847
00:44:52,256 --> 00:44:54,291
and I thought
maybe he would forget,
848
00:44:54,391 --> 00:44:56,026
but he still
hasn't forgotten.
849
00:44:56,126 --> 00:45:00,864
(♪♪♪)
850
00:45:00,964 --> 00:45:03,367
(Evil laughter)
851
00:45:03,467 --> 00:45:05,436
(Screams)
852
00:45:05,536 --> 00:45:09,473
He was my first child
and um...
853
00:45:11,709 --> 00:45:13,577
...I just still blame myself,
854
00:45:13,677 --> 00:45:17,514
because he has problems
855
00:45:17,614 --> 00:45:19,683
with PTSD.
856
00:45:19,783 --> 00:45:21,819
And you can't tell
a psychiatrist,
857
00:45:21,919 --> 00:45:26,457
he wants to tell somebody
why he's the way he is.
858
00:45:26,557 --> 00:45:31,095
And instead,
he has to deal with medication.
859
00:45:31,195 --> 00:45:32,796
He'll be 13.
860
00:45:32,896 --> 00:45:35,399
But now he's been backed out
on sleeping on the couch,
861
00:45:35,499 --> 00:45:37,634
he doesn't want to sleep
in his own room.
862
00:45:37,735 --> 00:45:41,572
After what he's experienced,
he wants to go back in my room.
863
00:45:41,672 --> 00:45:43,674
He can't sleep
without the lights on.
864
00:45:43,774 --> 00:45:45,743
(Sniffs)
865
00:45:45,843 --> 00:45:50,114
Um, he can still hear things,
he can't see them.
866
00:45:52,416 --> 00:45:54,118
He's become
a little bit more closed off,
867
00:45:54,218 --> 00:45:58,856
but he's very paranoid,
very anxious.
868
00:46:01,492 --> 00:46:04,561
Um, a lot of anxiety.
869
00:46:04,661 --> 00:46:06,563
(Sniffs)
870
00:46:06,663 --> 00:46:09,666
I thank God that we did move.
871
00:46:09,767 --> 00:46:11,201
I didn't wanna keep
living there
872
00:46:11,301 --> 00:46:14,004
and lived to be tortured
every day.
873
00:46:14,104 --> 00:46:20,177
(♪♪♪)
64216
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