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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:02,521 --> 00:00:03,481 - I wanna be a jockey when I grow up. 2 00:00:03,481 --> 00:00:06,841 Yeah, I wanna be a jockey when I grow up. 3 00:00:06,841 --> 00:00:08,601 - Last night, we followed the fortunes 4 00:00:08,601 --> 00:00:10,961 of some of the Seven Up children. 5 00:00:10,961 --> 00:00:14,761 - I must say, I mean, it's not easy being married. 6 00:00:14,761 --> 00:00:17,721 - When I get married, I'd like to have two children. 7 00:00:17,721 --> 00:00:19,961 I don't want to just suddenly find 8 00:00:19,961 --> 00:00:22,801 when the children have gone, I've got nothing to my life. 9 00:00:22,801 --> 00:00:24,761 - Tell me, do you have any girlfriends? 10 00:00:24,761 --> 00:00:26,481 - Well, not many. 11 00:00:26,481 --> 00:00:28,561 - What do you think about girls. 12 00:00:28,561 --> 00:00:29,521 - Well, not much. 13 00:00:29,521 --> 00:00:33,121 I don't really want to lose my children, any of them. 14 00:00:34,001 --> 00:00:38,281 - If I could change the world, I'd change it into a diamond. 15 00:00:38,281 --> 00:00:39,521 - Since I wasn't gonna be a farmer, 16 00:00:39,521 --> 00:00:41,641 I couldn't live here anymore. 17 00:00:41,641 --> 00:00:42,481 Choosing to leave here 18 00:00:42,481 --> 00:00:44,961 is like having your right arm ripped off. 19 00:00:48,041 --> 00:00:51,001 - Tonight, we'll see what's happened to the rest. 20 00:01:05,401 --> 00:01:08,641 - My heart's desire is to see my daddy. 21 00:01:08,641 --> 00:01:10,761 - I'm going to work in Woolworths. 22 00:01:10,761 --> 00:01:13,041 - What does university mean? 23 00:01:13,041 --> 00:01:16,601 - When I grow up, I want to be an astronaut. 24 00:01:17,921 --> 00:01:20,481 - This is no ordinary outing at the zoo, 25 00:01:20,481 --> 00:01:22,841 it's a very special occasion. 26 00:01:22,841 --> 00:01:24,201 We've brought these children together 27 00:01:24,201 --> 00:01:26,081 for the very first time. 28 00:01:27,521 --> 00:01:30,161 They're like any other children, expect that they come 29 00:01:30,161 --> 00:01:32,241 from startlingly different backgrounds. 30 00:01:33,601 --> 00:01:35,001 - Stop it at once. 31 00:01:35,001 --> 00:01:36,801 - We've brought these children together 32 00:01:36,801 --> 00:01:41,521 because we wanted a glimpse of England in the year 2000. 33 00:01:41,521 --> 00:01:43,281 The shop steward and the executive 34 00:01:43,281 --> 00:01:47,001 of the year 2000 are now seven years old. 35 00:01:50,121 --> 00:01:54,281 - In 1964, World in Action made Seven Up. 36 00:01:54,281 --> 00:01:57,241 We have been back to film these children every seven years. 37 00:01:57,241 --> 00:01:59,081 They are now 42. 38 00:02:16,041 --> 00:02:17,841 - Yes, speak up. 39 00:02:17,841 --> 00:02:18,961 - We'll march it both ways! 40 00:02:18,961 --> 00:02:20,321 - When he was seven, 41 00:02:20,321 --> 00:02:23,321 Bruce was at a pre-preparatory boarding school. 42 00:02:23,321 --> 00:02:26,241 At 14, St. Paul's in London. 43 00:02:26,241 --> 00:02:29,961 - They don't sort of enforce being upper class 44 00:02:29,961 --> 00:02:33,681 and things like that at St. Paul's, you know? 45 00:02:33,681 --> 00:02:36,081 They suggest that you don't have long hair, 46 00:02:36,081 --> 00:02:37,481 and they do get it cut, 47 00:02:38,601 --> 00:02:43,001 and they teach you to be reasonably well-mannered 48 00:02:43,001 --> 00:02:46,081 but not to sniff on the poorer people. 49 00:02:47,121 --> 00:02:47,961 - There is a property. 50 00:02:47,961 --> 00:02:50,281 - At 21, he was in his last year 51 00:02:50,281 --> 00:02:52,161 at Oxford reading maths. 52 00:02:52,161 --> 00:02:53,161 - And by Eisenstein. 53 00:02:55,081 --> 00:02:57,121 You can show that this is irreducible, 54 00:02:58,041 --> 00:03:00,521 then you do a transformation on this polynomial, 55 00:03:00,521 --> 00:03:02,361 x equal to t plus two. 56 00:03:02,361 --> 00:03:04,001 - Good, that's a nice way of doing it, 57 00:03:04,001 --> 00:03:06,241 particularly using Eisenstein down here. 58 00:03:06,241 --> 00:03:07,601 His test is very powerful. 59 00:03:07,601 --> 00:03:08,441 - Yes. 60 00:03:08,441 --> 00:03:12,201 Well, there is one job, I'd like to make maps really. 61 00:03:13,681 --> 00:03:15,681 I mean, it's a nice sort outdoor life 62 00:03:15,681 --> 00:03:20,441 and you go to, I mean, you travel around, 63 00:03:22,481 --> 00:03:25,001 but there are very few jobs like that going. 64 00:03:25,001 --> 00:03:27,801 You observe that seven, which is a prime, 65 00:03:27,801 --> 00:03:30,561 divides the co-efficient of t squared. 66 00:03:30,561 --> 00:03:32,241 I won't carry on with mathematics. 67 00:03:32,241 --> 00:03:33,521 I don't think I'll be a teacher 68 00:03:33,521 --> 00:03:35,041 And seven square doesn't. 69 00:03:35,041 --> 00:03:36,561 So, you're in the lead, you see 70 00:03:36,561 --> 00:03:38,801 because TSE caps got put to two pounds 71 00:03:38,801 --> 00:03:41,961 and could be caps, no problem at all, okay? 72 00:03:41,961 --> 00:03:43,321 Now, can you explain that just to Abdul 73 00:03:43,321 --> 00:03:45,361 'cause I want him to understand what it is. 74 00:03:48,961 --> 00:03:49,801 - Yes, sir. 75 00:03:49,801 --> 00:03:51,921 - At 28, he was teaching, 76 00:03:51,921 --> 00:03:53,961 immigrant children East London. 77 00:03:53,961 --> 00:03:54,801 - Abdul, times. 78 00:03:54,801 --> 00:03:57,121 I was working in an insurance company at the time, 79 00:03:57,121 --> 00:03:59,201 and I decided to go into teaching 80 00:03:59,201 --> 00:04:00,561 without any experience at all, 81 00:04:00,561 --> 00:04:02,081 and I didn't think they would allow somebody 82 00:04:02,081 --> 00:04:04,601 to walk in off the street into a classroom. 83 00:04:04,601 --> 00:04:09,601 Well, I'll go into Africa and try and teach people 84 00:04:09,601 --> 00:04:14,601 who are not civilised to be more or less good. 85 00:04:18,601 --> 00:04:21,641 - So, is this your missionary dream come true? 86 00:04:21,641 --> 00:04:23,761 - Well, not exactly. 87 00:04:23,761 --> 00:04:27,121 I've had the opportunity to come here for a term, 88 00:04:27,121 --> 00:04:29,161 and it just so happens the school I'm in 89 00:04:29,161 --> 00:04:31,841 has great links with this part of the world. 90 00:04:33,241 --> 00:04:36,441 - At 35, Bruce was teaching in Sylhet 91 00:04:36,441 --> 00:04:37,961 in Northern Bangladesh. 92 00:04:38,841 --> 00:04:41,721 - And then I've also got the chance to learn a bit of Bangla 93 00:04:41,721 --> 00:04:45,001 which is very difficult and I'm not doing very well at. 94 00:04:45,001 --> 00:04:48,161 - Bangladesh, Bangladesh, Bangladesh. 95 00:04:48,161 --> 00:04:49,241 - Bangladesh. 96 00:04:49,241 --> 00:04:50,161 - Bangladesh. 97 00:04:50,161 --> 00:04:51,321 - Bangladesh. 98 00:04:51,321 --> 00:04:52,521 - The straight line, yes, 99 00:04:52,521 --> 00:04:54,561 keep going, keep going, keep going. 100 00:04:54,561 --> 00:04:55,561 Right, yeah, till you hit, no, no, 101 00:04:55,561 --> 00:04:57,321 that's it, stop there, yeah. 102 00:04:57,321 --> 00:04:59,681 - At 42, Bruce is again teaching 103 00:04:59,681 --> 00:05:01,721 in the East End of London. 104 00:05:01,721 --> 00:05:03,761 - And then having positive points, what do you do now? 105 00:05:03,761 --> 00:05:04,601 - Turn 'em up. 106 00:05:04,601 --> 00:05:05,441 - Turn 'em up, okay. 107 00:05:05,441 --> 00:05:08,601 This is Bishop Chancellor Roman Catholic Girls' School 108 00:05:08,601 --> 00:05:10,561 in the East End of London. 109 00:05:10,561 --> 00:05:13,401 It's about 1,000 girls 11 to 18. 110 00:05:13,401 --> 00:05:15,281 I'll be over in a minute. 111 00:05:15,281 --> 00:05:17,961 And I've been here about five years. 112 00:05:17,961 --> 00:05:18,881 I'll just leave that for a couple of minutes. 113 00:05:18,881 --> 00:05:20,841 Well done, Malik, if you want to sit down anyway, thanks. 114 00:05:20,841 --> 00:05:23,001 It was a chance to go for promotion 115 00:05:23,961 --> 00:05:26,401 to be Head of the Maths faculty 116 00:05:26,401 --> 00:05:28,681 and to teach A level as well. 117 00:05:28,681 --> 00:05:30,601 Okay, all right. 118 00:05:30,601 --> 00:05:32,081 I didn't agree with the conservatives 119 00:05:32,081 --> 00:05:35,121 about what they were doing with the black people, 120 00:05:35,121 --> 00:05:36,961 you know, the racial policy. 121 00:05:38,961 --> 00:05:39,921 I'm an optimist here. 122 00:05:39,921 --> 00:05:44,201 I think we can show the way, if you like, for developing 123 00:05:44,201 --> 00:05:46,801 a sort of more harmonious multicultural society. 124 00:05:46,801 --> 00:05:49,521 Next thing we've got to do is copy that table down. 125 00:05:49,521 --> 00:05:50,601 Well, petrol. 126 00:05:50,601 --> 00:05:53,281 I'm quite pleased in a way that I know, 127 00:05:53,281 --> 00:05:57,481 say an Algerian fellow near where I live, 128 00:05:57,481 --> 00:06:00,921 he will say that in other countries in Europe, 129 00:06:00,921 --> 00:06:05,921 they're spat at and harassed and beaten up by the police. 130 00:06:06,201 --> 00:06:10,241 Here he says, "I walk down the street and nobody minds." 131 00:06:10,241 --> 00:06:15,241 Well my, girlfriend is in Africa and I won't, 132 00:06:15,361 --> 00:06:18,961 I don't think I'll have another chance to seeing her again. 133 00:06:18,961 --> 00:06:20,801 - Have you got any girlfriends? 134 00:06:20,801 --> 00:06:23,041 - No, no, not yet. 135 00:06:23,041 --> 00:06:26,241 I'm sure it will come, but not yet. 136 00:06:26,241 --> 00:06:29,681 I mean, I do think a lot of people think too much about it. 137 00:06:31,001 --> 00:06:33,241 I think I would very much like to 138 00:06:37,481 --> 00:06:40,681 become involved in a family like my own family for a start. 139 00:06:40,681 --> 00:06:44,201 That's a need that I feel I ought to fulfil 140 00:06:44,201 --> 00:06:47,001 and would like to fulfil and would do it well. 141 00:06:47,001 --> 00:06:49,161 Yes, I haven't got married or whatever, 142 00:06:49,161 --> 00:06:51,761 and I suppose that would've been something 143 00:06:51,761 --> 00:06:53,081 which I hoped would happen. 144 00:06:55,241 --> 00:06:59,121 You know, I suppose lots of reasons really, 145 00:06:59,121 --> 00:07:01,681 I don't suppose I've met the right person. 146 00:07:01,681 --> 00:07:02,881 - Well, you're getting on a bit. 147 00:07:02,881 --> 00:07:04,201 Are you getting worried? 148 00:07:04,201 --> 00:07:06,961 - Well, not particularly, I mean, I'm always optimistic. 149 00:07:06,961 --> 00:07:09,001 I mean, who knows who I might meet tomorrow, 150 00:07:09,001 --> 00:07:12,641 but I think that's the trouble with reserve. 151 00:07:12,641 --> 00:07:13,601 You're not rejected, 152 00:07:13,601 --> 00:07:15,361 but you never know what might have been. 153 00:07:15,361 --> 00:07:17,201 But I'm getting better. 154 00:07:20,081 --> 00:07:22,001 What does that look like? 155 00:07:25,041 --> 00:07:26,841 - It was when I think we were doing 156 00:07:26,841 --> 00:07:29,121 the school production of Annie, 157 00:07:29,121 --> 00:07:33,241 and Bruce was playing President Roosevelt, 158 00:07:33,241 --> 00:07:35,841 and I had to put on his stage makeup. 159 00:07:37,601 --> 00:07:41,761 Not many men will let you put on their makeup. 160 00:07:41,761 --> 00:07:43,801 - It gives me great pleasure to be here 161 00:07:43,801 --> 00:07:47,001 on this joyful and happy occasion 162 00:07:47,001 --> 00:07:51,201 to celebrate the marriage of Bruce and Penelope. 163 00:07:52,201 --> 00:07:55,601 ♪ When Christ shall come ♪ 164 00:07:55,601 --> 00:07:58,241 - Bruce and Penny married last summer. 165 00:07:58,241 --> 00:08:00,041 She teaches at Bruce's school. 166 00:08:00,041 --> 00:08:02,841 ♪ And take me home ♪ 167 00:08:02,841 --> 00:08:04,921 - I, Bruce Swain. 168 00:08:04,921 --> 00:08:06,521 - I, Bruce Swain. 169 00:08:06,521 --> 00:08:11,761 - Take you, Penelope Sarah Jane. 170 00:08:11,761 --> 00:08:12,761 - To be my wife. 171 00:08:12,761 --> 00:08:14,841 - So, how did he propose to you? 172 00:08:16,681 --> 00:08:20,321 - We were on the sofa and in the middle of a conversation 173 00:08:21,681 --> 00:08:23,521 about something completely different. 174 00:08:24,881 --> 00:08:28,801 He just asked if I'd like to marry him, 175 00:08:29,681 --> 00:08:31,081 and if I hadn't been listening carefully, 176 00:08:31,081 --> 00:08:32,441 I would have missed it completely. 177 00:08:32,441 --> 00:08:34,161 - To love and to cherish. 178 00:08:34,161 --> 00:08:35,601 - To love and to cherish. 179 00:08:35,601 --> 00:08:37,721 - Till death us do part. 180 00:08:37,721 --> 00:08:39,881 - Till death us do part. 181 00:08:44,121 --> 00:08:47,041 It was quite unusual really. 182 00:08:47,041 --> 00:08:50,801 We did a lot of it ourselves and we had the reception here. 183 00:08:53,161 --> 00:08:55,081 We didn't have a lot of things 184 00:08:55,081 --> 00:08:57,001 that you normally have at weddings like the cars 185 00:08:57,001 --> 00:08:59,401 and photographers and all that sort of thing. 186 00:09:01,521 --> 00:09:04,001 Everybody say, "Cover work!" 187 00:09:04,001 --> 00:09:05,921 We just planned what we wanted, 188 00:09:05,921 --> 00:09:07,841 and it all worked out very well in the end. 189 00:09:07,841 --> 00:09:09,321 It was a very enjoyable day. 190 00:09:13,241 --> 00:09:16,721 In practical ways, I'm better fed, better looked after, 191 00:09:19,521 --> 00:09:21,801 thanks to Bruce, generally better organised 192 00:09:21,801 --> 00:09:22,721 than I was before. 193 00:09:23,561 --> 00:09:27,081 He's very good at sort of financial organisation 194 00:09:27,081 --> 00:09:30,761 and running bank accounts and being sensible, 195 00:09:30,761 --> 00:09:32,561 that kind of thing, than I am. 196 00:09:32,561 --> 00:09:35,001 - First when we got married, one of the odd things was this, 197 00:09:35,001 --> 00:09:36,161 her mother said, "Oh good, 198 00:09:36,161 --> 00:09:38,401 "there's someone to look after Penny and cook her meals," 199 00:09:38,401 --> 00:09:41,161 rather than the other way round which sometimes happens. 200 00:09:43,841 --> 00:09:46,801 - What was the biggest shock about being married? 201 00:09:48,961 --> 00:09:52,081 - Well, I think three bags of clothes getting chucked out. 202 00:09:52,081 --> 00:09:54,161 Two of which didn't even make it to Oxfam. 203 00:09:55,081 --> 00:09:56,041 Is that right dear? 204 00:09:56,041 --> 00:09:57,161 - Yes. 205 00:09:57,161 --> 00:09:59,201 - But I suppose some of them were crusty old flares, 206 00:09:59,201 --> 00:10:02,121 I don't know, perhaps they deserved to get chucked out. 207 00:10:02,121 --> 00:10:03,841 - Does he think that the discovery of gold 208 00:10:03,841 --> 00:10:05,961 was a good thing for the Transvaal? 209 00:10:05,961 --> 00:10:09,241 - She's very determined and doesn't let things go, 210 00:10:09,241 --> 00:10:10,441 especially with school. 211 00:10:10,441 --> 00:10:13,561 She wants everything to be well done. 212 00:10:13,561 --> 00:10:18,001 I mean, she prepares lessons way into the future. 213 00:10:18,001 --> 00:10:19,081 - A lot of the monopolies 214 00:10:19,081 --> 00:10:21,521 were granted to Dutch. - She's very sensitive, 215 00:10:21,521 --> 00:10:26,521 responsive, and helps me act in a better way. 216 00:10:26,801 --> 00:10:28,921 I might become petulant or something, 217 00:10:28,921 --> 00:10:33,321 and it's somehow not appropriate in that situation. 218 00:10:33,321 --> 00:10:36,281 My heart's desire is to see my daddy 219 00:10:36,281 --> 00:10:39,201 who is 6,000 miles away. 220 00:10:39,201 --> 00:10:41,241 - For march that good ways! 221 00:10:41,241 --> 00:10:43,241 - I can remember being happy there. 222 00:10:43,241 --> 00:10:46,641 I can remember also being miserable 223 00:10:46,641 --> 00:10:48,521 because I can remember crying. 224 00:10:48,521 --> 00:10:49,681 - Squad, steady! 225 00:10:49,681 --> 00:10:50,721 - You know, I always seemed to be beaten, 226 00:10:50,721 --> 00:10:52,881 and I never used to understand why. 227 00:10:53,761 --> 00:10:54,961 - Squad, ho! 228 00:10:54,961 --> 00:10:56,161 - People possibly say 229 00:10:56,161 --> 00:11:00,001 I'm a little innocent at times or naive. 230 00:11:00,001 --> 00:11:01,121 I used to get worried about this 231 00:11:01,121 --> 00:11:06,121 and think perhaps I ought not to be taken in or deceived. 232 00:11:07,121 --> 00:11:08,401 I'm not talking about love now, 233 00:11:08,401 --> 00:11:11,201 I'm just talking about generally speaking. 234 00:11:13,681 --> 00:11:17,321 I think I do have a sort of greater level of confidence, 235 00:11:17,321 --> 00:11:21,521 especially in expressing myself, in holding opinions. 236 00:11:22,441 --> 00:11:25,041 I think if you're having a partnership with somebody, 237 00:11:25,041 --> 00:11:27,561 that definitely makes you more mature in a way 238 00:11:27,561 --> 00:11:29,921 because you're not thinking about yourself all the time, 239 00:11:29,921 --> 00:11:31,721 you're thinking about somebody else. 240 00:11:33,601 --> 00:11:35,961 - Extend the line here, and then after nought hours, 241 00:11:35,961 --> 00:11:38,401 you can see that it would 60 litres. 242 00:11:38,401 --> 00:11:41,521 - What ambitions do you have now? 243 00:11:41,521 --> 00:11:45,361 - I may become a senior teacher at some point here, 244 00:11:47,041 --> 00:11:48,681 but I don't really have aspirations 245 00:11:48,681 --> 00:11:50,841 to become a deputy head and a head teacher. 246 00:11:50,841 --> 00:11:51,681 - Why? 247 00:11:52,721 --> 00:11:56,441 - You do tend to move out of the classroom at that stage, 248 00:11:56,441 --> 00:12:01,441 and also, you have to go on courses in MA 249 00:12:01,481 --> 00:12:03,121 and educational studies and so on, 250 00:12:03,121 --> 00:12:06,641 and our lives are busy enough really. 251 00:12:08,041 --> 00:12:13,041 No, I'm in sort of a middle-aged mode at the moment 252 00:12:13,561 --> 00:12:17,681 where middle-aged content is the best description. 253 00:12:19,841 --> 00:12:21,281 - Go on, Carter. 254 00:12:21,281 --> 00:12:22,241 Do it! 255 00:12:22,241 --> 00:12:25,161 - Do it good, Carter, I am sure. 256 00:12:25,161 --> 00:12:26,921 - Who's going to? 257 00:12:26,921 --> 00:12:28,481 - How are you doing, dear? 258 00:12:28,481 --> 00:12:29,841 - Fine, thank you, dear. 259 00:12:29,841 --> 00:12:32,161 - If you saw me running around the cricket field now 260 00:12:32,161 --> 00:12:34,761 after a ball, it's just comical. 261 00:12:34,761 --> 00:12:37,801 It's just a lumbering old man, you know? 262 00:12:37,801 --> 00:12:41,801 No flowing swoop and hurling in at the ball. 263 00:12:41,801 --> 00:12:45,241 It's all gone, that lightness, that youth. 264 00:12:45,241 --> 00:12:46,161 It's just gone. 265 00:12:47,281 --> 00:12:48,241 - Not so fast. 266 00:12:48,241 --> 00:12:49,481 - I think so, yeah. 267 00:12:49,481 --> 00:12:50,921 I don't know whether they're gonna move any of them. 268 00:12:50,921 --> 00:12:53,681 - We may have children, I don't know. 269 00:12:53,681 --> 00:12:56,441 If in seven years' time or so, 270 00:12:56,441 --> 00:12:58,161 we're living in a slightly bigger house 271 00:12:58,161 --> 00:13:01,041 with a young family, that would be nice. 272 00:13:01,041 --> 00:13:03,201 I mean, I don't want to pin all my hopes on it 273 00:13:03,201 --> 00:13:04,481 and nothing happens. 274 00:13:05,561 --> 00:13:06,561 We are quite old. 275 00:13:06,561 --> 00:13:10,561 I can see bringing up, say, teenage children in your 40s 276 00:13:10,561 --> 00:13:12,881 might be a bit strange. 277 00:13:18,201 --> 00:13:20,721 - Looking back on your life, halfway through say, 278 00:13:20,721 --> 00:13:22,601 I mean, what regrets do you have? 279 00:13:22,601 --> 00:13:26,481 - Now, I'm married to a lovely person. 280 00:13:26,481 --> 00:13:31,481 That kind of takes out some regrets that may have been 281 00:13:31,561 --> 00:13:33,761 or I've missed my chance there or something, 282 00:13:33,761 --> 00:13:36,961 and you never know what the future will hold for you, 283 00:13:36,961 --> 00:13:40,001 and I think I'm lucky to have found Penny. 284 00:13:41,201 --> 00:13:44,281 - He's the nicest person I've ever met. 285 00:13:46,761 --> 00:13:51,161 He's just somebody you could rely on the whole time. 286 00:13:52,841 --> 00:13:54,401 - Oh, I might quote that some time. 287 00:13:54,401 --> 00:13:56,081 - Yeah. 288 00:13:56,081 --> 00:13:58,401 No, he's not the kind of man 289 00:13:59,681 --> 00:14:02,161 you would ever actually have any doubts about. 290 00:14:05,761 --> 00:14:08,921 - I don't like the big boys hitting us 291 00:14:10,081 --> 00:14:15,081 and the prefects sending us out for nothing. 292 00:14:17,281 --> 00:14:18,481 - When he was seven, 293 00:14:18,481 --> 00:14:20,881 Paul was in care at a children's home in London. 294 00:14:22,721 --> 00:14:25,841 Were you happy at the children's home in England? 295 00:14:25,841 --> 00:14:27,081 - We didn't mind that really 296 00:14:27,081 --> 00:14:29,161 'cause we didn't know what was going on 297 00:14:29,161 --> 00:14:31,041 'cause we were a bit young. 298 00:14:31,041 --> 00:14:33,561 Well, as far as I know, my mother and father got, 299 00:14:33,561 --> 00:14:35,561 well they separated originally, I think. 300 00:14:37,801 --> 00:14:39,721 They eventually got divorced. 301 00:14:39,721 --> 00:14:41,641 I went to the boarding school for one year 302 00:14:41,641 --> 00:14:43,401 and then we emigrated to Australia. 303 00:14:45,001 --> 00:14:46,321 My father got remarried. 304 00:14:47,681 --> 00:14:50,241 - Paul settled with his father and stepmother 305 00:14:50,241 --> 00:14:52,321 in a suburb of Melbourne. 306 00:14:52,321 --> 00:14:53,441 What mark has it left on you, 307 00:14:53,441 --> 00:14:57,321 the fact that you were brought up within a bad marriage? 308 00:14:57,321 --> 00:14:58,201 - The only thing I can say 309 00:14:58,201 --> 00:15:00,401 that I think might have come from that 310 00:15:00,401 --> 00:15:02,041 is just my lack of confidence 311 00:15:03,161 --> 00:15:06,681 and being able to show my feelings really, I suppose. 312 00:15:06,681 --> 00:15:09,361 - Would you like to get married Paul? 313 00:15:09,361 --> 00:15:10,481 - No. 314 00:15:10,481 --> 00:15:11,921 - Tell me why not. 315 00:15:11,921 --> 00:15:16,921 - I don't want like 'em, say you had a wife, 316 00:15:18,521 --> 00:15:22,361 they say you had to eat what they cooked you, 317 00:15:22,361 --> 00:15:26,041 and say I don't like greens, well I don't, 318 00:15:27,641 --> 00:15:32,401 and say she said, "You have to eat what you give." 319 00:15:32,401 --> 00:15:34,561 So, I don't like greens, 320 00:15:34,561 --> 00:15:38,961 say she gives me greens and that's it. 321 00:15:38,961 --> 00:15:42,481 I know I prefer to be alone really. 322 00:15:42,481 --> 00:15:46,281 I can't say I don't want to get married 'cause I think I do. 323 00:15:46,281 --> 00:15:47,681 But I want to be happily married, you know, 324 00:15:47,681 --> 00:15:50,041 and therefore, I want to make sure, I think. 325 00:15:50,041 --> 00:15:51,681 - What was it that you feel in love with, 326 00:15:51,681 --> 00:15:53,001 what is it about him? 327 00:15:53,001 --> 00:15:54,721 - His helplessness, I suppose. 328 00:15:54,721 --> 00:15:57,201 It was the motherly instinct in me 329 00:15:57,201 --> 00:15:58,681 to pick him up and cuddle him. 330 00:15:59,601 --> 00:16:00,441 He's also very good looking, 331 00:16:00,441 --> 00:16:03,481 I think, but he doesn't agree with me. 332 00:16:03,481 --> 00:16:06,241 In the summer, he's got this cute little bum in shorts. 333 00:16:07,521 --> 00:16:09,321 I mean, I can tell quite a few stories here, 334 00:16:09,321 --> 00:16:11,321 but the one that really irritates me the most 335 00:16:11,321 --> 00:16:13,881 is when we have an argument, he says, "That's it, leave me." 336 00:16:13,881 --> 00:16:16,881 And I say, "Fine, all right, I will one day." 337 00:16:16,881 --> 00:16:18,321 - So, how's married life been 338 00:16:18,321 --> 00:16:19,321 since I last saw you? 339 00:16:19,321 --> 00:16:20,761 - Shocking, shocking. 340 00:16:22,561 --> 00:16:25,241 - We had our 20th wedding anniversary this last, 341 00:16:25,241 --> 00:16:26,321 just before Christmas. 342 00:16:26,321 --> 00:16:27,481 - Which is a life sentence. 343 00:16:27,481 --> 00:16:29,041 - Yeah, everyone reckons 344 00:16:29,041 --> 00:16:31,681 that we should be out of jail by now. 345 00:16:31,681 --> 00:16:33,561 - By the time they were 28, 346 00:16:33,561 --> 00:16:37,001 Paul and Sue had two children, Katy and Robert. 347 00:16:38,441 --> 00:16:39,561 - Picked up a centre field, 348 00:16:39,561 --> 00:16:40,401 right where it's driven. 349 00:16:40,401 --> 00:16:43,321 - When we was 35, he brought his family to London 350 00:16:43,321 --> 00:16:46,361 for a holiday to show them where he had started out. 351 00:16:47,721 --> 00:16:49,921 - When we had Katy, when she was born, Paul said to me, 352 00:16:49,921 --> 00:16:51,681 "Oh, I'm glad I've got a daughter." 353 00:16:51,681 --> 00:16:53,601 He said, "When I'm an old man, 354 00:16:53,601 --> 00:16:54,441 "at least she'll be able to come up 355 00:16:54,441 --> 00:16:56,481 "and she'll be able to give me a kiss and a cuddle". 356 00:16:56,481 --> 00:17:00,401 - And she was also the shy one of the two, 357 00:17:00,401 --> 00:17:03,361 which had probably followed after me a bit. 358 00:17:07,961 --> 00:17:10,401 - Well, Katie loves to shop. 359 00:17:10,401 --> 00:17:13,601 We are starting to learn more of what we share alike 360 00:17:13,601 --> 00:17:14,961 'cause she's very much like Paul, 361 00:17:14,961 --> 00:17:17,561 and she doesn't quite know 362 00:17:17,561 --> 00:17:20,441 what she really wants to do just yet. 363 00:17:20,441 --> 00:17:22,201 I really love painting and art, 364 00:17:22,201 --> 00:17:26,441 and I love music and she really has taken to that, 365 00:17:26,441 --> 00:17:30,201 and she seems to have the creative flair. 366 00:17:30,201 --> 00:17:31,601 - What does university mean? 367 00:17:32,761 --> 00:17:34,801 I'm pretty happy with Katy. 368 00:17:34,801 --> 00:17:37,881 I'm not having a go at Robert, but I've got fears for Robert 369 00:17:37,881 --> 00:17:39,841 'cause he's struggling a little bit. 370 00:17:39,841 --> 00:17:41,681 He's had three teachers already 371 00:17:41,681 --> 00:17:43,921 that say they don't know how to motivate him. 372 00:17:47,561 --> 00:17:48,921 - Robert had started school, 373 00:17:48,921 --> 00:17:51,521 and he was having a few problems. 374 00:17:52,441 --> 00:17:54,601 He's a square peg in a round hole 375 00:17:54,601 --> 00:17:56,241 in the normal mainstream schools, 376 00:17:56,241 --> 00:17:58,761 so we've actually moved him now to another high school 377 00:17:58,761 --> 00:18:02,601 that's a community school which is much more relaxed, 378 00:18:02,601 --> 00:18:04,921 and as a family unit, we're a lot more calmer. 379 00:18:06,161 --> 00:18:07,761 - I was gonna be a policeman, 380 00:18:07,761 --> 00:18:12,321 but I thought how hard it would be to join in. 381 00:18:12,321 --> 00:18:14,241 I just haven't made up my mind yet. 382 00:18:14,241 --> 00:18:15,681 I was gonna be a phys ed teacher, 383 00:18:15,681 --> 00:18:18,001 but one of the teachers told me 384 00:18:19,161 --> 00:18:21,041 you had to get up into university. 385 00:18:23,081 --> 00:18:26,161 - At 21, Paul was working as a junior partner 386 00:18:26,161 --> 00:18:28,201 for a firm of bricklayers. 387 00:18:28,201 --> 00:18:32,441 By 28, he'd gone out on his own as a sub-contractor, 388 00:18:32,441 --> 00:18:33,561 but it didn't work out. 389 00:18:36,321 --> 00:18:39,321 - Well, I've gone from being stable in one, 390 00:18:39,321 --> 00:18:41,361 basically one job, which was the bricklaying 391 00:18:41,361 --> 00:18:43,881 to probably had about 10 or 15 jobs. 392 00:18:43,881 --> 00:18:47,081 I've never really counted them. 393 00:18:47,081 --> 00:18:48,161 Although, I haven't been sacked from jobs, 394 00:18:48,161 --> 00:18:52,241 I've just been, I haven't been able to settle. 395 00:18:53,801 --> 00:18:56,121 - Paul now works for a plastics company 396 00:18:56,121 --> 00:18:58,041 installing industrial signs. 397 00:19:00,761 --> 00:19:01,921 - I think I've got to a stage now 398 00:19:01,921 --> 00:19:04,841 I just want to stay in work. 399 00:19:04,841 --> 00:19:07,721 Two or three years ago, I tried to increase my skills 400 00:19:07,721 --> 00:19:11,761 and I went back to school and took a carpentry certificate 401 00:19:11,761 --> 00:19:13,801 because I wanted to go out and work as a carpenter, 402 00:19:13,801 --> 00:19:16,161 but I basically found there were too many good carpenters 403 00:19:16,161 --> 00:19:18,961 out of work for the jobs that were available. 404 00:19:18,961 --> 00:19:22,401 So, I didn't go too far with that. 405 00:19:22,401 --> 00:19:26,561 I suppose, partly it's my confidence in myself. 406 00:19:26,561 --> 00:19:30,001 The monitors up in the washroom sends the nurse out, 407 00:19:30,001 --> 00:19:34,001 well there's no talking, and I wasn't talking today, 408 00:19:34,001 --> 00:19:36,601 and Brown sent me out for nothing. 409 00:19:36,601 --> 00:19:39,561 I find it hard to express emotion most of the time, 410 00:19:39,561 --> 00:19:43,561 although I'm getting on top of that more now, you know? 411 00:19:44,561 --> 00:19:47,121 I mean, just the simple things to say to sort of Susan, 412 00:19:47,121 --> 00:19:49,041 you know, I love you, something like that. 413 00:19:49,041 --> 00:19:50,281 I mean, I can tell you about it, 414 00:19:50,281 --> 00:19:53,081 but I really haven't been able 415 00:19:53,081 --> 00:19:56,561 to say it freely to Sue, you know? 416 00:19:56,561 --> 00:19:58,721 - Is confidence still an issue with you? 417 00:19:58,721 --> 00:20:02,841 Yeah, yeah, unfortunately, I've learned to live with it, 418 00:20:02,841 --> 00:20:03,681 sort of accept it, 419 00:20:03,681 --> 00:20:06,961 but I've never really got on top of it fully, 420 00:20:06,961 --> 00:20:09,001 which is, it really annoys me, 421 00:20:10,561 --> 00:20:12,761 but I don't know what to do about it though. 422 00:20:14,881 --> 00:20:18,881 I'm more at peace around the horses and the animals. 423 00:20:20,361 --> 00:20:23,201 I can be upset, I can be on edge, come down to the horses, 424 00:20:23,201 --> 00:20:25,201 and within three or four minutes of being here, 425 00:20:25,201 --> 00:20:29,641 and I've forgotten everything, so it does calm you down. 426 00:20:31,441 --> 00:20:33,201 But I can be a pretty angry person, 427 00:20:34,081 --> 00:20:37,321 and you know, in the wrong circumstances, 428 00:20:37,321 --> 00:20:38,761 I can fire up terribly, 429 00:20:39,761 --> 00:20:42,601 but fortunately, it doesn't happen too often these days. 430 00:20:44,401 --> 00:20:45,761 - At the beginning of this year, 431 00:20:45,761 --> 00:20:48,441 Paul and Sue moved to another Melbourne suburb. 432 00:20:50,441 --> 00:20:52,081 - It's like living in a palace 433 00:20:52,081 --> 00:20:53,001 compared to our other house 434 00:20:53,001 --> 00:20:55,641 'cause it's nearly twice the size. 435 00:20:55,641 --> 00:20:56,761 - I think there's probably a few more 436 00:20:56,761 --> 00:20:59,361 professional people live around this area, I think. 437 00:21:01,121 --> 00:21:02,761 - So, you moved up the market a bit? 438 00:21:02,761 --> 00:21:04,321 - Yeah, yeah, we have 439 00:21:04,321 --> 00:21:06,681 'cause we got to a point where we paid the other house off, 440 00:21:06,681 --> 00:21:10,641 so you, I suppose, it's a form of forced savings too. 441 00:21:10,641 --> 00:21:12,681 I think we will have to tighten up. 442 00:21:16,441 --> 00:21:19,921 - We wouldn't manage just on Paul's wage alone. 443 00:21:19,921 --> 00:21:22,361 It's a difference sometimes between eating 444 00:21:22,361 --> 00:21:25,401 and not eating and just paying the bills, you know? 445 00:21:25,401 --> 00:21:29,121 Most people these days rely on two wages to survive. 446 00:21:30,401 --> 00:21:31,441 - I don't think it needs much. 447 00:21:31,441 --> 00:21:33,161 - I've been doing the mobile hairdressing now 448 00:21:33,161 --> 00:21:35,521 since Robert was a baby. 449 00:21:35,521 --> 00:21:39,241 - So boring cutting curly hair. 450 00:21:39,241 --> 00:21:41,601 - With this job, I mean, I go and I cut people's hair, 451 00:21:41,601 --> 00:21:43,081 but it's like going visiting all day 452 00:21:43,081 --> 00:21:44,081 and some of the people 453 00:21:44,081 --> 00:21:45,681 don't really want me there doing their hair. 454 00:21:45,681 --> 00:21:47,481 They just want to come and have a chat 455 00:21:47,481 --> 00:21:48,921 and tell them what I've been up to 456 00:21:48,921 --> 00:21:51,961 and for them to tell me what they've been up to. 457 00:21:51,961 --> 00:21:54,681 - I've got 23 three-penny pieces, 458 00:21:54,681 --> 00:21:58,841 and I don't know how many halfpenny pieces I've got now. 459 00:21:58,841 --> 00:22:01,321 - I spend, yeah, I spend. 460 00:22:01,321 --> 00:22:03,481 He doesn't save because I don't give him any to save, 461 00:22:04,321 --> 00:22:06,081 basically 'cause, you know, like I, 462 00:22:06,081 --> 00:22:08,201 you know, these days you don't get a pay packet. 463 00:22:08,201 --> 00:22:11,081 Well, I mean, I get money as I go, 464 00:22:12,561 --> 00:22:14,801 but Paul's wages is paid straight into the bank, 465 00:22:14,801 --> 00:22:16,761 and you know, it's really no money anymore. 466 00:22:16,761 --> 00:22:19,121 You don't see it, it's just straight into the bank, 467 00:22:19,121 --> 00:22:20,401 and then all the money comes out, 468 00:22:20,401 --> 00:22:21,921 and it's just pretend, isn't it? 469 00:22:21,921 --> 00:22:24,281 - I quite often joke that I think it's absolute myth 470 00:22:24,281 --> 00:22:26,201 that I actually get paid at all 471 00:22:26,201 --> 00:22:30,161 because I haven't seen any money for some years now so. 472 00:22:31,481 --> 00:22:34,441 - In their 20s, Paul and Sue sold up, 473 00:22:34,441 --> 00:22:38,161 bought an old van, and travelled across Australia. 474 00:22:38,161 --> 00:22:39,961 - I think it brought us closer together 475 00:22:39,961 --> 00:22:41,081 because we got to know each other 476 00:22:41,081 --> 00:22:43,241 and relied on each other so much. 477 00:22:44,561 --> 00:22:46,281 - When I was younger, I definitely wanted 478 00:22:46,281 --> 00:22:48,041 to move out of Melbourne. 479 00:22:48,041 --> 00:22:50,801 I would have only needed that encouragement from Sue. 480 00:22:50,801 --> 00:22:54,241 If Susan had been exactly the same, we wouldn't be here now. 481 00:22:55,321 --> 00:22:57,201 I think as I'm getting older, 482 00:22:57,201 --> 00:22:59,161 I'm more nervous about doing that. 483 00:23:01,761 --> 00:23:04,681 I still know there's a huge amount of space out there, 484 00:23:04,681 --> 00:23:08,481 and I don't know why, but obviously that's important to me. 485 00:23:10,561 --> 00:23:12,201 It's just such a beautiful country 486 00:23:12,201 --> 00:23:14,321 right down to even barren land. 487 00:23:17,801 --> 00:23:19,561 - What's the most fun in life at the moment 488 00:23:19,561 --> 00:23:21,521 for the two of you? 489 00:23:21,521 --> 00:23:23,281 - I'd say Christmas holidays. 490 00:23:23,281 --> 00:23:24,801 - Yeah, Christmas holidays. 491 00:23:24,801 --> 00:23:26,081 - Down at the beach. - Yeah. 492 00:23:26,081 --> 00:23:28,361 - With the kids, you know, 'cause they kids love it. 493 00:23:28,361 --> 00:23:29,721 - We had a great summer this year, 494 00:23:29,721 --> 00:23:32,561 and we had a whole week of great weather. 495 00:23:32,561 --> 00:23:33,721 - It's what a family should be, 496 00:23:33,721 --> 00:23:37,481 and that's why it stands out I suppose. 497 00:23:41,321 --> 00:23:42,761 I mean, I guess I do feel middle-aged, 498 00:23:42,761 --> 00:23:44,961 but I'm sort of pretty comfortable with it. 499 00:23:46,361 --> 00:23:47,681 I can always remember when I was younger, 500 00:23:47,681 --> 00:23:50,241 I always looked forward to getting older, 501 00:23:50,241 --> 00:23:54,841 and then even hopefully into the 80s that even, you know. 502 00:23:54,841 --> 00:23:58,081 It's never been something that's really worried me. 503 00:23:58,081 --> 00:23:58,921 - One of our ambitions 504 00:23:58,921 --> 00:24:00,561 was always just to grow old together. 505 00:24:00,561 --> 00:24:02,321 - That's true, we used to say that. 506 00:24:02,321 --> 00:24:03,481 - Yeah. 507 00:24:03,481 --> 00:24:08,041 I keep telling my children, isn't it nice to be loved 508 00:24:08,041 --> 00:24:09,201 and to know that someone loves you. 509 00:24:09,201 --> 00:24:11,321 It must be really sad for people out there 510 00:24:11,321 --> 00:24:15,081 that have no one that don't know they're loved, 511 00:24:15,081 --> 00:24:17,881 and each day, you know, sometimes you're coming home, 512 00:24:17,881 --> 00:24:19,761 and you think, "Well, they'll all be home," 513 00:24:19,761 --> 00:24:21,561 and it's nice to just come home. 514 00:24:23,601 --> 00:24:26,841 - Some people from Africa come here, 515 00:24:26,841 --> 00:24:30,561 but when they go, they put their clothes on. 516 00:24:32,641 --> 00:24:34,881 - Jackie, Lyn, and Sue 517 00:24:34,881 --> 00:24:36,601 all grew up in the East End of London 518 00:24:36,601 --> 00:24:38,921 and were friends in the same junior school. 519 00:24:39,961 --> 00:24:41,561 - Well, I've never been abroad. 520 00:24:41,561 --> 00:24:42,401 - Neither have I. 521 00:24:42,401 --> 00:24:43,441 - I have, I have. 522 00:24:43,441 --> 00:24:45,321 - Oh yeah 'cause you went on that cruise. 523 00:24:45,321 --> 00:24:46,481 - Yeah. 524 00:24:46,481 --> 00:24:49,201 - I've had the opportunities in life that I've wanted. 525 00:24:49,201 --> 00:24:51,161 - I'd say we've had more opportunities. 526 00:24:51,161 --> 00:24:52,721 - Yeah, right, you've made. 527 00:24:52,721 --> 00:24:55,281 I think that we all could have gone any way 528 00:24:55,281 --> 00:24:58,761 that we wanted to at the time within our capabilities. 529 00:24:58,761 --> 00:25:03,001 I mean, we chose our own jobs, 530 00:25:03,001 --> 00:25:06,121 we were able to choose our own jobs quite freely. 531 00:25:06,121 --> 00:25:08,001 Well, we only had a limited choice anyway, 532 00:25:08,001 --> 00:25:09,881 I mean, truth be told. 533 00:25:09,881 --> 00:25:10,681 - Yes, we did have a choice. - We didn't have the choice 534 00:25:10,681 --> 00:25:11,961 of private education 535 00:25:11,961 --> 00:25:12,801 - Oh, no. - because they couldn't 536 00:25:12,801 --> 00:25:13,841 have afforded it anyway. 537 00:25:13,841 --> 00:25:15,801 I wish I had wanted something that bad 538 00:25:15,801 --> 00:25:16,961 that I had to go for it, 539 00:25:16,961 --> 00:25:20,281 and I hope, I really hope my two want something 540 00:25:20,281 --> 00:25:23,401 and are hungry for it, you know, and they'll go for it. 541 00:25:23,401 --> 00:25:25,401 I'd love that, you know. 542 00:25:25,401 --> 00:25:26,921 - They have, I think, different things, 543 00:25:26,921 --> 00:25:28,401 I mean, technology has taken off so much 544 00:25:28,401 --> 00:25:30,601 in the last 10 years. 545 00:25:32,281 --> 00:25:34,041 - Yes, computers. - They have access 546 00:25:34,041 --> 00:25:36,721 to a lot more in some way, 547 00:25:36,721 --> 00:25:39,561 into an awful lot more than we had. 548 00:25:39,561 --> 00:25:41,561 I'm going to work at Woolworths. 549 00:25:41,561 --> 00:25:44,681 Well, I'm school Mobile Librarian and assistant 550 00:25:44,681 --> 00:25:48,921 to the young people's office, which is where we are now. 551 00:25:51,081 --> 00:25:54,001 - At 21, Lyn had set out on a career 552 00:25:54,001 --> 00:25:57,201 working in a mobile library in Tower Hamlets in East London. 553 00:25:57,201 --> 00:26:00,041 - I've not stamped yours, "Sleeping Beauty." 554 00:26:01,001 --> 00:26:03,921 Teaching children the beauty of books 555 00:26:04,921 --> 00:26:08,561 and watching their faces as books unfold to them 556 00:26:09,521 --> 00:26:10,961 is just fantastic. 557 00:26:10,961 --> 00:26:12,161 To work with children of that age, 558 00:26:12,161 --> 00:26:14,441 you've got to love them, and I love children. 559 00:26:16,241 --> 00:26:18,561 - Because of cuts in the education budget, 560 00:26:18,561 --> 00:26:21,481 Tower Hamlets closed the mobile library, 561 00:26:21,481 --> 00:26:23,441 and Lyn went to work in Bethnal Green. 562 00:26:24,681 --> 00:26:25,721 - One of the jobs that was going 563 00:26:25,721 --> 00:26:29,321 was divisional children's librarian and they based me here. 564 00:26:30,481 --> 00:26:33,521 They hadn't had a children's librarian here for nine years. 565 00:26:33,521 --> 00:26:35,801 You can draw better than I can. 566 00:26:36,721 --> 00:26:38,841 Right, the story I've got for you this morning 567 00:26:38,841 --> 00:26:43,841 is called "The Magic Bicycle," and it's all about Mark. 568 00:26:45,041 --> 00:26:48,841 I do regularly class visits with 19, 20 classes, 569 00:26:48,841 --> 00:26:51,801 more than that, coming in to the library. 570 00:26:51,801 --> 00:26:54,321 And within that, we do either a storytelling session 571 00:26:54,321 --> 00:26:55,601 or library skills. 572 00:26:55,601 --> 00:26:57,801 "But he couldn't ride it." 573 00:27:01,361 --> 00:27:03,441 I've been a governor on schools 574 00:27:03,441 --> 00:27:06,001 in Tower Hamlets for 12, 13 years, 575 00:27:07,081 --> 00:27:09,121 being Chair of Governors at the moment. 576 00:27:10,161 --> 00:27:11,961 - I've had the parent on the phone 577 00:27:11,961 --> 00:27:14,881 two or three times this week wondering what's happening. 578 00:27:14,881 --> 00:27:17,361 They wanted to come in and discuss with me 579 00:27:17,361 --> 00:27:20,441 and the coordinator about how well the project was going 580 00:27:21,841 --> 00:27:23,321 and to observe a lesson. 581 00:27:23,321 --> 00:27:25,081 - We've got a few problems with these knots. 582 00:27:25,081 --> 00:27:27,241 Can anyone think of another way? 583 00:27:27,241 --> 00:27:29,201 - Can you ever see yourself not working? 584 00:27:29,201 --> 00:27:30,041 - No. 585 00:27:31,601 --> 00:27:32,481 I like the excitement. 586 00:27:32,481 --> 00:27:36,001 I like the push of filling my life. 587 00:27:38,041 --> 00:27:39,321 It's stimulating. 588 00:27:41,921 --> 00:27:44,521 There are times I go home, I'm absolutely shattered. 589 00:27:46,721 --> 00:27:49,321 I go home, I go to sleep. 590 00:27:50,401 --> 00:27:54,241 - Well, I know he is hers and he loves her. 591 00:27:54,241 --> 00:27:56,561 - I don't, I love him. 592 00:27:56,561 --> 00:27:58,241 - I had an all-white wedding. 593 00:27:58,241 --> 00:27:59,721 All white. 594 00:27:59,721 --> 00:28:02,481 We were both in white and my bridesmaid was in white. 595 00:28:03,601 --> 00:28:06,721 I've been married a year and couple of months. 596 00:28:08,241 --> 00:28:10,561 You do think, "Christ, what have I done?" 597 00:28:12,681 --> 00:28:13,961 - See, I've still got-- - And I'm being 598 00:28:13,961 --> 00:28:15,161 honest about it. 599 00:28:16,841 --> 00:28:17,681 And Russ thinks the same. 600 00:28:17,681 --> 00:28:21,001 You think at times, you think, "Christ what have I done?" 601 00:28:22,201 --> 00:28:23,961 - Lyn married Russ at 19. 602 00:28:23,961 --> 00:28:27,001 They have two daughters Sarah and Emma. 603 00:28:27,001 --> 00:28:31,601 - We married young but because we wanted to go out 604 00:28:31,601 --> 00:28:35,241 and have fun together and grow together. 605 00:28:37,001 --> 00:28:39,481 - How do you manage to keep a career going 606 00:28:39,481 --> 00:28:41,441 and bring up a family? 607 00:28:41,441 --> 00:28:43,001 Hold a marriage together? 608 00:28:43,001 --> 00:28:45,441 - We've always had a very good partnership. 609 00:28:45,441 --> 00:28:46,921 I couldn't do it without him. 610 00:28:48,921 --> 00:28:52,441 Russ cooks during the week, I cook at weekends. 611 00:28:52,441 --> 00:28:54,241 It's not as if I'm going belting home 612 00:28:54,241 --> 00:28:56,801 because I've got to go and cook a meal for everybody. 613 00:28:56,801 --> 00:28:59,121 I know that when I get home, it's gonna be done. 614 00:29:00,721 --> 00:29:03,361 We're there together and we love each other, 615 00:29:04,561 --> 00:29:05,801 and we've never stopped. 616 00:29:08,081 --> 00:29:10,481 If I could, I would have two girls and two boys. 617 00:29:12,001 --> 00:29:13,521 - Yeah, right. 618 00:29:13,521 --> 00:29:15,521 - Used by a doctor in medicines 619 00:29:15,521 --> 00:29:17,481 and controlled doses is fine. 620 00:29:21,001 --> 00:29:25,241 50% of teenagers between 14 and 18 have tried drugs. 621 00:29:25,241 --> 00:29:27,481 - I think Emma is more like me. 622 00:29:27,481 --> 00:29:28,321 Sarah's much more placid. 623 00:29:28,321 --> 00:29:30,921 She's like Russ. - The wrong drug is deadly. 624 00:29:30,921 --> 00:29:32,601 - With the girls in their teens now, 625 00:29:32,601 --> 00:29:35,601 I've looked back and thought Emma is very much like I was. 626 00:29:35,601 --> 00:29:37,801 - Why am I using a wooden spoon, please? 627 00:29:37,801 --> 00:29:38,601 - The noise. 628 00:29:38,601 --> 00:29:41,361 - The noise, yes, we've got 16 people, 16 saucepans. 629 00:29:44,521 --> 00:29:46,481 - I mean, Emma has just done her GCSEs. 630 00:29:46,481 --> 00:29:50,161 She got 10 and gone back to sixth form college, 631 00:29:50,161 --> 00:29:51,321 doing A Levels. 632 00:29:52,361 --> 00:29:54,761 She doesn't know what she wants to do. 633 00:29:54,761 --> 00:29:56,161 - Excuse me. - Yup. 634 00:29:56,161 --> 00:29:57,681 - It is wonderful, except we got-- 635 00:29:57,681 --> 00:29:58,801 - She's got her own life now. 636 00:29:58,801 --> 00:30:02,361 She's building that life and she's making her own decisions. 637 00:30:02,361 --> 00:30:05,121 - Thing about Liverpool, we can drive so far. 638 00:30:06,481 --> 00:30:08,881 - We go through stages, the terrible twos. 639 00:30:11,241 --> 00:30:12,641 At the time, when you are going through them, 640 00:30:12,641 --> 00:30:13,761 it seems terrible, 641 00:30:13,761 --> 00:30:15,481 they're never ever going to end. 642 00:30:15,481 --> 00:30:16,321 Stir it. 643 00:30:16,321 --> 00:30:17,881 I know, sort of Mum and Dad would say, 644 00:30:17,881 --> 00:30:20,721 "Ah, but you know, don't worry, that will go, 645 00:30:20,721 --> 00:30:23,161 "you'll come through it to the next stage 646 00:30:23,161 --> 00:30:24,001 "and the next stage". 647 00:30:24,001 --> 00:30:25,561 And I think it's ongoing like that. 648 00:30:27,321 --> 00:30:29,241 I'd love to be able to talk to my mum and dad 649 00:30:29,241 --> 00:30:32,281 and say, "Really, did I really put you through that?" 650 00:30:32,281 --> 00:30:35,361 I remember some of it, and god, yes, I must have, 651 00:30:35,361 --> 00:30:37,001 but until you go through it with your own, 652 00:30:37,001 --> 00:30:38,761 you never, ever, realise 653 00:30:38,761 --> 00:30:40,721 what hell you put your parents through. 654 00:30:41,961 --> 00:30:45,361 - By the time she was 35, Lyn's mother had died. 655 00:30:46,281 --> 00:30:48,841 - She was a great friend to me as well as a mum, 656 00:30:48,841 --> 00:30:50,841 probably the best friend I'll ever have. 657 00:30:51,841 --> 00:30:53,521 It's only two years. 658 00:30:54,481 --> 00:30:55,681 To some, it probably seems, 659 00:30:55,681 --> 00:30:59,601 oh it's a long time, but it's not very long. 660 00:31:02,161 --> 00:31:04,481 The biggest area of my life that's changed 661 00:31:04,481 --> 00:31:07,561 since we last talked is I lost my dad, 662 00:31:08,761 --> 00:31:13,721 and literally just after 34 Up went out, he died. 663 00:31:15,401 --> 00:31:18,681 I mean, they looked after the girls while I worked. 664 00:31:18,681 --> 00:31:21,401 After mum died, the first thing dad said was, 665 00:31:21,401 --> 00:31:23,481 "That's my job now". 666 00:31:23,481 --> 00:31:26,361 And of course, suddenly we had neither of them. 667 00:31:27,561 --> 00:31:28,761 All right, watch it, you. 668 00:31:28,761 --> 00:31:30,801 - At 35, Lyn was having 669 00:31:30,801 --> 00:31:33,081 a health problem of her own. 670 00:31:33,081 --> 00:31:36,321 - They stuck all these tubes up inside me 671 00:31:36,321 --> 00:31:39,561 and discovered that I'd got these veins up here 672 00:31:39,561 --> 00:31:41,481 that shouldn't be there. 673 00:31:41,481 --> 00:31:42,361 - In your brain? 674 00:31:42,361 --> 00:31:43,201 - Mm-hmm. 675 00:31:44,601 --> 00:31:46,321 - And what can they do about it? 676 00:31:46,321 --> 00:31:47,881 - Not a lot at the moment. 677 00:31:47,881 --> 00:31:53,361 They're investigating other treatments, 678 00:31:53,401 --> 00:31:55,881 but the surgeon said that 679 00:31:58,481 --> 00:32:01,521 he doesn't want to operate at the moment because the risk, 680 00:32:01,521 --> 00:32:03,121 it's too near the optic nerve. 681 00:32:04,161 --> 00:32:05,241 Well, it's never gonna go away. 682 00:32:05,241 --> 00:32:09,921 I've still got this vein malformation, 683 00:32:09,921 --> 00:32:11,241 and it'll always be there. 684 00:32:11,241 --> 00:32:12,961 Obviously, I've had it from birth. 685 00:32:14,681 --> 00:32:15,841 Hello, Neil, it's Lyn. 686 00:32:15,841 --> 00:32:17,961 How'd it go last night, did you manage to get into it? 687 00:32:17,961 --> 00:32:20,921 There is a 1% chance that it could haemorrhage. 688 00:32:21,921 --> 00:32:25,361 I've got more chance being knocked down crossing the street, 689 00:32:25,361 --> 00:32:30,361 and in that perspective, I don't worry about it at all. 690 00:32:31,841 --> 00:32:32,841 Oh, it's just problems now. 691 00:32:32,841 --> 00:32:34,961 - And do you think about dying a lot? 692 00:32:34,961 --> 00:32:36,921 - No, doesn't worry me at all. 693 00:32:37,841 --> 00:32:38,921 My dad taught me that. 694 00:32:39,841 --> 00:32:41,921 He wasn't scared of death at all, 695 00:32:41,921 --> 00:32:44,601 and it's the people that are left behind 696 00:32:47,801 --> 00:32:51,641 that take the brunt of someone dying. 697 00:32:52,641 --> 00:32:55,241 That one was, yes, so they'll keep that back, 698 00:32:55,241 --> 00:32:56,841 and once the person that's reserved it. 699 00:32:56,841 --> 00:32:59,681 - Is there a spiritual side to your life? 700 00:32:59,681 --> 00:33:00,521 - Yes. 701 00:33:01,441 --> 00:33:02,401 - Can you talk about that? 702 00:33:02,401 --> 00:33:03,441 - No. 703 00:33:03,441 --> 00:33:04,921 - Why? 704 00:33:04,921 --> 00:33:06,881 - It's private, it's personal, it's me. 705 00:33:08,241 --> 00:33:10,641 It's part of what makes me up, makes me me. 706 00:33:13,041 --> 00:33:16,001 - Sometimes, things are not good, are they? 707 00:33:16,001 --> 00:33:18,601 And I know that you would've thought about that 708 00:33:18,601 --> 00:33:19,721 because at the moment. 709 00:33:20,681 --> 00:33:22,161 - Do you think morality 710 00:33:22,161 --> 00:33:23,281 has changed in your lifetime? 711 00:33:23,281 --> 00:33:28,161 - Yes, I think we've lost an awful lot of morality. 712 00:33:29,161 --> 00:33:32,561 A lot of values in my opinion have gone. 713 00:33:35,641 --> 00:33:38,081 - Like what? 714 00:33:38,081 --> 00:33:38,921 - Respect. 715 00:33:40,681 --> 00:33:44,361 There seems to be a great lack of respect for anything. 716 00:33:47,081 --> 00:33:48,921 I think that's what makes part of it hard 717 00:33:48,921 --> 00:33:52,961 bringing up children nowadays because our values are so high 718 00:33:52,961 --> 00:33:56,521 and actually expecting them to maintain those values. 719 00:33:57,721 --> 00:33:59,561 - Are you asking too much of them? 720 00:33:59,561 --> 00:34:01,641 - You do expect a lot of them, 721 00:34:01,641 --> 00:34:06,441 but I think, I think I'm flexible as well. 722 00:34:07,921 --> 00:34:09,321 I'm learning when to let go. 723 00:34:11,161 --> 00:34:12,681 ♪ If I say that I love you ♪ 724 00:34:12,681 --> 00:34:16,321 - I mean, for me, I'm lucky, yeah, everything's worked out. 725 00:34:18,961 --> 00:34:20,961 Unlike the girls, they've lost a relationship, 726 00:34:20,961 --> 00:34:23,241 and then they've gained new ones for them. 727 00:34:23,241 --> 00:34:25,601 For them, that's the way their lives have gone. 728 00:34:25,601 --> 00:34:26,441 - That's right. 729 00:34:26,441 --> 00:34:28,041 - Russ and I have been together a long time. 730 00:34:28,041 --> 00:34:29,841 - I actually envy you that. 731 00:34:29,841 --> 00:34:31,001 - Of course, we both do. 732 00:34:31,001 --> 00:34:32,201 - I do envy you that 733 00:34:32,201 --> 00:34:37,161 because I don't know how, whatever the reasoning behind it, 734 00:34:37,161 --> 00:34:41,401 you and Russ have made that work, 735 00:34:41,401 --> 00:34:43,481 and that was something that I failed at. 736 00:34:43,481 --> 00:34:46,001 - And me, yeah, it was a failure, definitely. 737 00:34:46,001 --> 00:34:48,601 - If we did all love Geoffrey, 738 00:34:48,601 --> 00:34:50,081 and we all want to marry him. 739 00:34:50,081 --> 00:34:50,921 - Yeah! 740 00:34:50,921 --> 00:34:55,441 - I think I know the one that he'd like best and that's her. 741 00:34:55,441 --> 00:35:00,001 - I don't think I'll get married too early. 742 00:35:01,001 --> 00:35:02,241 I'd like to have a full life first 743 00:35:02,241 --> 00:35:03,841 and meet people - I'd like to enjoy myself 744 00:35:03,841 --> 00:35:04,641 before I-- 745 00:35:04,641 --> 00:35:07,841 - Yeah, before you commit yourself to a family. 746 00:35:07,841 --> 00:35:12,161 - We had a teacher at school that his favourite ploy 747 00:35:12,161 --> 00:35:16,441 was, "All you girls want to do is walk out, 748 00:35:16,441 --> 00:35:18,841 "get married, have babies, and push a pram down the street 749 00:35:18,841 --> 00:35:21,841 "with a fag hanging outside your mouth." 750 00:35:21,841 --> 00:35:23,201 - Marriage means a different thing to me. 751 00:35:23,201 --> 00:35:24,921 I've still got my ideals about marriage. 752 00:35:24,921 --> 00:35:26,561 I don't know what it's all about. 753 00:35:26,561 --> 00:35:29,841 - Sue was 24 when she married Billy. 754 00:35:29,841 --> 00:35:32,321 They had two children, William and Katherine. 755 00:35:32,321 --> 00:35:34,041 - I think that to get married young, 756 00:35:34,041 --> 00:35:35,681 there must be things that you miss. 757 00:35:35,681 --> 00:35:40,161 You must miss that crucial stage of being yourself 758 00:35:40,161 --> 00:35:41,481 because the minute you get married, 759 00:35:41,481 --> 00:35:44,161 you're no longer a single being, 760 00:35:44,161 --> 00:35:47,081 you're a partnership and that should be the idea behind it. 761 00:35:48,361 --> 00:35:50,241 - By the time she was 34, 762 00:35:50,241 --> 00:35:52,561 she and Billy had divorced. 763 00:35:52,561 --> 00:35:54,281 - I've never sat down and thought, 764 00:35:55,801 --> 00:35:58,961 "What was it, was it this, was it that?" 765 00:35:58,961 --> 00:36:00,881 I just knew it wasn't working. 766 00:36:00,881 --> 00:36:02,121 I mean, there have been relationships 767 00:36:02,121 --> 00:36:05,761 when I could have settled, but they didn't feel quite right, 768 00:36:05,761 --> 00:36:10,001 so I've always come away and pulled away 769 00:36:10,001 --> 00:36:13,441 and just waited until the right one come along. 770 00:36:15,001 --> 00:36:16,041 If they ever do. 771 00:36:19,401 --> 00:36:22,321 Deep down I probably wish I wasn't having to do this. 772 00:36:22,321 --> 00:36:23,801 I mean, I'd like to still be married, 773 00:36:23,801 --> 00:36:28,681 and I'd like to have that steady relationship. 774 00:36:28,681 --> 00:36:29,961 But I'm the type of person 775 00:36:29,961 --> 00:36:32,001 that likes to go out and likes to have a good time. 776 00:36:32,001 --> 00:36:34,201 So, it's not that hard for me. 777 00:36:34,201 --> 00:36:36,481 But I think as you get into your 40s, 778 00:36:36,481 --> 00:36:40,761 you start thinking, "Well, maybe I should slow down a bit." 779 00:36:44,001 --> 00:36:46,281 I've been a single parent for a long while, 780 00:36:46,281 --> 00:36:48,241 and I've brought them up on my own really 781 00:36:48,241 --> 00:36:51,561 because Katherine was only two when Bill left. 782 00:36:51,561 --> 00:36:53,841 It's been extremely hard 783 00:36:53,841 --> 00:36:56,481 and sometimes it's been very lonely. 784 00:36:59,121 --> 00:37:00,041 - And do you think William 785 00:37:00,041 --> 00:37:01,521 misses not having a dad? 786 00:37:01,521 --> 00:37:02,481 - He probably does. 787 00:37:02,481 --> 00:37:05,281 He doesn't talk an awful lot about it. 788 00:37:05,281 --> 00:37:07,561 - It looks good. - So, charming. 789 00:37:07,561 --> 00:37:09,481 - He seems so together. 790 00:37:09,481 --> 00:37:13,001 He's quite deep, so he doesn't say an awful lot. 791 00:37:13,001 --> 00:37:16,081 He's got my dad, my dad's there. 792 00:37:16,081 --> 00:37:20,681 My children probably owe a lot to my mum and dad. 793 00:37:20,681 --> 00:37:23,201 I mean, my mum and dad have been absolutely brilliant. 794 00:37:25,681 --> 00:37:29,681 With William, I want him to have a really satisfying career. 795 00:37:29,681 --> 00:37:30,521 Get your tie done. 796 00:37:30,521 --> 00:37:32,881 Which is something that I've really had. 797 00:37:32,881 --> 00:37:34,401 For him, I would love that. 798 00:37:34,401 --> 00:37:36,321 Well for both of them, but particularly for him 799 00:37:36,321 --> 00:37:40,041 'cause he can go far if he puts his mind to it. 800 00:37:40,041 --> 00:37:41,881 You know, he may go to university, 801 00:37:41,881 --> 00:37:44,441 we have talked about it if he does well. 802 00:37:44,441 --> 00:37:45,601 He's capable of it. 803 00:37:47,201 --> 00:37:48,961 With Katherine, she talks about doing things 804 00:37:48,961 --> 00:37:51,321 like hairdressing and girlie things, you know, 805 00:37:51,321 --> 00:37:54,121 'cause she doesn't really know what she wants to do yet. 806 00:37:54,121 --> 00:37:56,441 She just wants to enjoy herself at the moment. 807 00:37:57,561 --> 00:37:59,721 I can remember being the same when I was her age. 808 00:37:59,721 --> 00:38:01,161 But she loves babies and she keeps saying, 809 00:38:01,161 --> 00:38:02,601 "Mum I want a," and I say, 810 00:38:02,601 --> 00:38:04,241 "Don't even think about it," you know. 811 00:38:04,241 --> 00:38:05,481 I hope not. 812 00:38:05,481 --> 00:38:07,881 It was very hard first of all when I gave up work, 813 00:38:07,881 --> 00:38:12,881 from having a fairly high salary to nothing was hard, 814 00:38:14,001 --> 00:38:15,561 but you get used to it. 815 00:38:15,561 --> 00:38:18,961 Whatever your circumstances are, you live in them, 816 00:38:18,961 --> 00:38:21,681 you get used to them and you cope, everybody does. 817 00:38:23,841 --> 00:38:25,081 - When her children were old enough 818 00:38:25,081 --> 00:38:28,281 to go to school, Sue started work again. 819 00:38:28,281 --> 00:38:30,161 She has an office job in the Law Faculty 820 00:38:30,161 --> 00:38:31,441 of the University of London. 821 00:38:31,441 --> 00:38:33,241 - Can I please have an examination form? 822 00:38:33,241 --> 00:38:34,281 - Yeah, sure. 823 00:38:35,641 --> 00:38:39,481 I've always worked, but anyone who's got teenagers 824 00:38:39,481 --> 00:38:40,801 knows how expensive it is, 825 00:38:40,801 --> 00:38:43,241 and there are times when I can't quite manage 826 00:38:43,241 --> 00:38:44,601 what I'd like to do with them, 827 00:38:44,601 --> 00:38:47,441 especially school trips and things like that. 828 00:38:47,441 --> 00:38:48,361 All right, thanks. 829 00:38:49,481 --> 00:38:50,481 Bye. 830 00:38:50,481 --> 00:38:51,761 I've got certain little savings, 831 00:38:51,761 --> 00:38:53,841 things that I do for them and policies 832 00:38:53,841 --> 00:38:55,561 and things that will come out when they're 21 833 00:38:55,561 --> 00:38:58,401 and hopefully things that when they get married 834 00:38:58,401 --> 00:39:00,321 or if they want a car. 835 00:39:00,321 --> 00:39:01,601 I mean, there are times that are hard 836 00:39:01,601 --> 00:39:02,721 when you are on your own. 837 00:39:12,641 --> 00:39:16,801 ♪ Your guitar ♪ 838 00:39:16,801 --> 00:39:20,041 ♪ It sounds so sweetly ♪ 839 00:39:21,601 --> 00:39:23,841 We've all got little secret dreams. 840 00:39:23,841 --> 00:39:26,681 I'd love to sing, along with millions of others. 841 00:39:28,761 --> 00:39:31,921 ♪ It's just the radio ♪ 842 00:39:33,881 --> 00:39:37,121 But I didn't want to give up work, 843 00:39:37,121 --> 00:39:41,001 and I didn't want to risk all that to follow the dream. 844 00:39:41,001 --> 00:39:43,321 ♪ Said you'd be coming back this way again, baby ♪ 845 00:39:43,321 --> 00:39:45,361 There are still lots of places that I want to go to. 846 00:39:45,361 --> 00:39:47,641 Lots of wild things that I want to do, 847 00:39:47,641 --> 00:39:49,001 jumping out of a plane. 848 00:39:49,001 --> 00:39:50,761 Silly things that you can do, 849 00:39:50,761 --> 00:39:52,561 but you just never seem to get round to. 850 00:39:52,561 --> 00:39:53,841 Just never seem to get round to it, 851 00:39:53,841 --> 00:39:56,881 but I think you should make sure you do. 852 00:39:58,481 --> 00:40:00,241 I'm just basically a happy person. 853 00:40:01,641 --> 00:40:03,201 I don't get upset in front of the kids, 854 00:40:03,201 --> 00:40:06,521 and that's important that I don't ever want to upset them 855 00:40:06,521 --> 00:40:08,361 because there have been times when I have been hurt 856 00:40:08,361 --> 00:40:10,961 over the last few years, but I've done my best 857 00:40:10,961 --> 00:40:11,841 to keep that from them. 858 00:40:11,841 --> 00:40:12,921 They don't need that. 859 00:40:14,241 --> 00:40:16,281 ♪ But you're not really here ♪ 860 00:40:16,281 --> 00:40:18,761 I'm with someone now which is nice, 861 00:40:18,761 --> 00:40:21,441 it feels right, but it's early days yet. 862 00:40:23,481 --> 00:40:27,681 Regrets, everyone wants to be a perfect parent, but I'm not. 863 00:40:29,481 --> 00:40:30,321 I do the best I can, 864 00:40:30,321 --> 00:40:32,001 and I can't say it's the worst part of me 865 00:40:32,001 --> 00:40:33,841 that I go out such a lot 866 00:40:33,841 --> 00:40:35,881 because I don't think that it hurts them. 867 00:40:37,121 --> 00:40:39,721 It's a completely different lifestyle I've got 868 00:40:39,721 --> 00:40:41,081 to what my mum and dad had, 869 00:40:41,081 --> 00:40:42,921 but they are just so there for me, 870 00:40:42,921 --> 00:40:44,401 and they're more responsible 871 00:40:44,401 --> 00:40:46,521 for the way my kids are than I am. 872 00:40:46,521 --> 00:40:49,041 ♪ I really do ♪ 873 00:40:52,921 --> 00:40:54,721 - Sue. 874 00:40:54,721 --> 00:40:57,441 - I would like to get married when I grow up, 875 00:40:59,241 --> 00:41:02,281 but I don't know what sort of boy, but I think one 876 00:41:06,841 --> 00:41:08,481 that's not got a lot of money 877 00:41:08,481 --> 00:41:12,801 but has got some money, not a lot. 878 00:41:12,801 --> 00:41:15,401 - Have you got any boyfriends? 879 00:41:19,401 --> 00:41:21,481 - That's personal, innit? 880 00:41:24,281 --> 00:41:26,161 - Don't like the way he came out with that. 881 00:41:26,161 --> 00:41:27,681 - We shan't tell him, shall we? 882 00:41:29,321 --> 00:41:31,481 - That was horrific really, the cake, 883 00:41:31,481 --> 00:41:34,041 what happened to the wedding cake. 884 00:41:34,041 --> 00:41:37,921 I mean, it was sitting right in between Mick and myself, 885 00:41:37,921 --> 00:41:40,401 and suddenly the columns just completely gave way 886 00:41:40,401 --> 00:41:42,281 and it fell into one. 887 00:41:43,321 --> 00:41:47,441 I would say on average, 19 is probably too young. 888 00:41:49,321 --> 00:41:51,281 - By the time she was 34, 889 00:41:51,281 --> 00:41:53,041 Jackie and Mick had divorced. 890 00:41:54,841 --> 00:41:58,841 - We decided ourselves, I mean, just between the two of us, 891 00:41:58,841 --> 00:42:00,761 we knew it wasn't going any further. 892 00:42:02,481 --> 00:42:04,481 We both knew, I think, at the end of the day, 893 00:42:04,481 --> 00:42:07,161 we would be happier leading our own lives. 894 00:42:07,161 --> 00:42:10,001 My mum 'cause she got five girls, 895 00:42:10,001 --> 00:42:12,521 she has seven years back luck, 896 00:42:12,521 --> 00:42:15,321 that's why she's got five girls. 897 00:42:15,321 --> 00:42:19,401 I'd like to be able to have a happy family, 898 00:42:19,401 --> 00:42:22,481 I mean, I know it's not possible to be happy all the time, 899 00:42:22,481 --> 00:42:24,801 but as much of the time that was possible. 900 00:42:25,681 --> 00:42:28,481 Go through there, that's the nursery. 901 00:42:28,481 --> 00:42:29,881 - Got any plans? 902 00:42:29,881 --> 00:42:30,841 - Do me a favour. 903 00:42:31,841 --> 00:42:33,481 - She and Mick decided early on 904 00:42:33,481 --> 00:42:35,241 that they didn't want children. 905 00:42:35,241 --> 00:42:37,721 - Well, do you sometimes feel like wringing his neck? 906 00:42:37,721 --> 00:42:41,081 - Basically, I would say because I'm far too selfish. 907 00:42:41,081 --> 00:42:45,001 I enjoy doing what I want when I want and how I want 908 00:42:45,001 --> 00:42:47,841 and certainly at the moment, 909 00:42:47,841 --> 00:42:51,721 I can't see any way around that. 910 00:42:52,721 --> 00:42:56,321 That's not to say that's a forever decision. 911 00:42:56,321 --> 00:42:57,121 Oh! 912 00:42:59,161 --> 00:43:02,641 And this one on, here we go! 913 00:43:02,641 --> 00:43:03,721 Oh, yeah! 914 00:43:03,721 --> 00:43:07,561 I had a brief, but very sweet relationship, 915 00:43:07,561 --> 00:43:09,241 the result of which was Charlie. 916 00:43:09,241 --> 00:43:10,321 Cor blimey, Charlie, you're supposed 917 00:43:10,321 --> 00:43:12,481 to be cleaning your teeth, not eating the brush. 918 00:43:12,481 --> 00:43:14,361 It's the best thing that could've happened to me, 919 00:43:14,361 --> 00:43:17,121 and I would never have believed 920 00:43:17,121 --> 00:43:20,481 I could've enjoyed a child as much as I enjoy him. 921 00:43:20,481 --> 00:43:23,001 Anybody that wanted to know just got told I was pregnant. 922 00:43:23,001 --> 00:43:25,281 I wasn't with the father, end of story. 923 00:43:26,201 --> 00:43:28,081 Oi, give us a cuddle. 924 00:43:28,081 --> 00:43:30,521 I don't really want Charlie to be an only. 925 00:43:30,521 --> 00:43:32,761 I'd love him to have brothers and sisters, 926 00:43:32,761 --> 00:43:33,841 but not necessarily loads of 'em, 927 00:43:33,841 --> 00:43:37,081 just one would do actually. 928 00:43:37,081 --> 00:43:38,201 Bed, Charlie Brown. 929 00:43:38,201 --> 00:43:39,761 Right, Charlie, there's yours. 930 00:43:42,481 --> 00:43:44,681 Please, eat it all up. 931 00:43:44,681 --> 00:43:46,361 - Oh! 932 00:43:46,361 --> 00:43:47,921 - And James. 933 00:43:47,921 --> 00:43:48,961 - Thanks, Mum. 934 00:43:48,961 --> 00:43:50,481 - Good boy. 935 00:43:50,481 --> 00:43:52,161 And last but not least. 936 00:43:55,281 --> 00:43:56,601 Gonna eat that one for me? 937 00:43:57,601 --> 00:43:58,881 - After her relationship 938 00:43:58,881 --> 00:44:00,721 with Charlie's father ended, 939 00:44:00,721 --> 00:44:03,241 she met Ian and had two more sons. 940 00:44:05,641 --> 00:44:07,881 Which one is the most like you, do you think? 941 00:44:08,801 --> 00:44:12,161 - At the moment, personality wise, probably James. 942 00:44:12,161 --> 00:44:15,441 He's the cheeky one, he's the one full of confidence. 943 00:44:15,441 --> 00:44:19,001 Charlie's the quieter one, Charlie's the grown up. 944 00:44:19,001 --> 00:44:21,521 Lee's an absolute bullet. 945 00:44:21,521 --> 00:44:23,241 If he wants to do something, he just does it, 946 00:44:23,241 --> 00:44:28,241 I mean, no fear of anything, but they are all good boys. 947 00:44:29,681 --> 00:44:31,681 You can take them almost anywhere. 948 00:44:31,681 --> 00:44:33,881 - Almost? - Almost anywhere, yeah. 949 00:44:35,681 --> 00:44:37,321 - And what is the most fun? 950 00:44:37,321 --> 00:44:39,721 - The little things that they come out with. 951 00:44:39,721 --> 00:44:42,201 The shear unexpected pleasure of them. 952 00:44:43,281 --> 00:44:45,401 I don't know, it's really hard to describe, 953 00:44:45,401 --> 00:44:50,241 but they come up with so many different comments. 954 00:44:50,241 --> 00:44:51,201 - Finished. 955 00:44:55,681 --> 00:44:57,401 - This is actually a place called Newmains, 956 00:44:57,401 --> 00:45:00,321 which is about a 40-minute drive from Glasgow, 957 00:45:00,321 --> 00:45:02,721 about 15-minute drive from Motherwell. 958 00:45:02,721 --> 00:45:05,041 - So, how did you land up here? 959 00:45:05,041 --> 00:45:07,361 - Well, because the boys dad's Scottish, 960 00:45:07,361 --> 00:45:08,721 and this is his hometown, 961 00:45:10,241 --> 00:45:14,041 and we decided that, I mean, Charlie was what, five, 962 00:45:14,041 --> 00:45:16,681 about to start school, and it was now or never. 963 00:45:16,681 --> 00:45:18,001 If we hadn't moved then, 964 00:45:18,001 --> 00:45:20,601 I don't think we would ever have done it, 965 00:45:20,601 --> 00:45:22,401 but obviously, I am glad that we did. 966 00:45:22,401 --> 00:45:23,881 There's a lot more here for the boys. 967 00:45:23,881 --> 00:45:26,441 They've got a lot more freedom here. 968 00:45:29,041 --> 00:45:31,601 The way the people treat each other and talk to each other, 969 00:45:31,601 --> 00:45:36,001 it's more like a village and that's a good advert, I think. 970 00:45:36,001 --> 00:45:36,841 A very good advert, 971 00:45:36,841 --> 00:45:39,761 I like it far more than I ever did London. 972 00:45:45,521 --> 00:45:47,921 - Not long after settling in Scotland, 973 00:45:47,921 --> 00:45:50,001 Ian and Jackie split up. 974 00:45:50,001 --> 00:45:51,481 - Thank you. 975 00:45:51,481 --> 00:45:52,361 - We're now living on our own, 976 00:45:52,361 --> 00:45:53,881 although he is a regular visitor 977 00:45:53,881 --> 00:45:55,721 and sees the children quite often. 978 00:45:58,401 --> 00:45:59,721 - Lee! 979 00:45:59,721 --> 00:46:00,881 - When any couple parts, 980 00:46:00,881 --> 00:46:03,401 and I don't care how good or how bad the terms are. 981 00:46:03,401 --> 00:46:04,801 - Lee! 982 00:46:04,801 --> 00:46:08,681 - There's always a tendency for recrimination, 983 00:46:08,681 --> 00:46:11,921 you know, just the usual petty, this was your fault, 984 00:46:11,921 --> 00:46:15,001 this was, you know, and blaming each other and that, 985 00:46:15,001 --> 00:46:18,121 and it took us a long while to realise 986 00:46:18,121 --> 00:46:20,481 just how much the boys were listening to us. 987 00:46:23,041 --> 00:46:24,881 They could so easily have grown up thinking 988 00:46:24,881 --> 00:46:27,761 that it was their fault and it wasn't, 989 00:46:27,761 --> 00:46:30,081 not in any way, shape, or form. 990 00:46:30,081 --> 00:46:32,641 They just happened to be the unlucky victims of it. 991 00:46:34,041 --> 00:46:35,761 - What would you do if you had lots of money, 992 00:46:35,761 --> 00:46:38,401 about maybe two pounds? 993 00:46:38,401 --> 00:46:42,401 - I would buy meself a new nice house, wouldn't I? 994 00:46:42,401 --> 00:46:45,201 One that's all nice and comfy. 995 00:46:45,201 --> 00:46:46,041 When Ian and I split up, 996 00:46:46,041 --> 00:46:48,241 I actually went into temporary accommodation, 997 00:46:49,161 --> 00:46:51,241 and I got housed a couple of miles from here, 998 00:46:51,241 --> 00:46:53,401 but that was furnished 999 00:46:53,401 --> 00:46:56,441 because I didn't have anything to take with me. 1000 00:46:58,361 --> 00:47:02,641 I was there seven weeks and they offered me this one, 1001 00:47:02,641 --> 00:47:04,081 and with the help of family and friends 1002 00:47:04,081 --> 00:47:07,401 and word goes out, "Jackie is needing some stuff," 1003 00:47:07,401 --> 00:47:09,841 and it all just suddenly arrived. 1004 00:47:09,841 --> 00:47:12,081 The poor, if you don't help them, 1005 00:47:12,081 --> 00:47:16,041 they'll sort of die soon, wouldn't they? 1006 00:47:16,041 --> 00:47:19,881 I think it might be a bit low on the ground, the snow. 1007 00:47:19,881 --> 00:47:22,041 I don't think there's enough there, do you? 1008 00:47:23,281 --> 00:47:24,841 I don't cope financially. 1009 00:47:24,841 --> 00:47:28,361 Without my mother-in-law stepping in to fill the gap, 1010 00:47:28,361 --> 00:47:29,521 I wouldn't be coping. 1011 00:47:32,241 --> 00:47:35,041 It's really hard to explain to anyone 1012 00:47:35,041 --> 00:47:38,641 who's not had to do it, but you may, 1013 00:47:38,641 --> 00:47:42,281 you get to a point where either that bill doesn't get paid 1014 00:47:42,281 --> 00:47:43,441 or your children don't eat. 1015 00:47:43,441 --> 00:47:45,561 So obviously. your children eat, 1016 00:47:45,561 --> 00:47:47,761 which means that either my mother-in-law pays the bill, 1017 00:47:47,761 --> 00:47:50,041 or she makes sure that my food's in for the following week 1018 00:47:50,041 --> 00:47:54,601 so I can pay the bills, but it's not easy to live like it. 1019 00:47:56,001 --> 00:47:57,721 Say, "Come on, swans!" 1020 00:47:57,721 --> 00:47:59,521 She's brilliant. 1021 00:48:01,041 --> 00:48:02,401 If I could have chosen a mother-in-law, 1022 00:48:02,401 --> 00:48:04,801 she was the one I would have chosen. 1023 00:48:04,801 --> 00:48:05,801 She's great for me. 1024 00:48:05,801 --> 00:48:08,481 She's absolutely brilliant with the children, 1025 00:48:08,481 --> 00:48:12,801 and she's just always there when I need her to be. 1026 00:48:12,801 --> 00:48:15,481 Ah, ah, ah, ah, ah, you leave him alone. 1027 00:48:15,481 --> 00:48:17,201 At the moment, I mean, 1028 00:48:17,201 --> 00:48:20,401 a career's probably about the furthest thing from my mind. 1029 00:48:20,401 --> 00:48:22,121 I don't really know what I'm aiming for 1030 00:48:22,121 --> 00:48:24,401 except to get the house together. 1031 00:48:24,401 --> 00:48:27,521 My father had a reasonably good education. 1032 00:48:27,521 --> 00:48:29,841 He never went to the local comprehensive, 1033 00:48:29,841 --> 00:48:34,841 but at the same time, I don't think he was too worried 1034 00:48:35,681 --> 00:48:37,921 which way I decided to go. 1035 00:48:37,921 --> 00:48:40,001 Oh, I've no doubts I could have done more. 1036 00:48:43,841 --> 00:48:44,881 Certainly when I was younger, 1037 00:48:44,881 --> 00:48:47,401 it was probably laziness that stopped me. 1038 00:48:47,401 --> 00:48:48,241 Oh! 1039 00:48:48,241 --> 00:48:49,081 When we did the last programme, 1040 00:48:49,081 --> 00:48:50,521 I think there was actually a comment 1041 00:48:50,521 --> 00:48:52,001 my father made at the time 1042 00:48:52,001 --> 00:48:54,841 was maybe he should have pushed me a little bit harder. 1043 00:48:54,841 --> 00:48:58,521 And I think maybe in retrospect, he should have done, 1044 00:48:59,681 --> 00:49:01,321 and that's probably the one thing 1045 00:49:01,321 --> 00:49:04,161 that I will do with mine that he didn't do with me. 1046 00:49:04,161 --> 00:49:06,881 I think I should push 'em just that little bit harder. 1047 00:49:08,241 --> 00:49:10,801 James, you watch, you're catching up to him. 1048 00:49:10,801 --> 00:49:11,921 Go on, Lee. 1049 00:49:11,921 --> 00:49:14,161 I was working up here until very recently, 1050 00:49:15,241 --> 00:49:18,881 but they've discovered that I've got rheumatoid arthritis, 1051 00:49:18,881 --> 00:49:21,561 so at the moment, that's put work on hold. 1052 00:49:23,401 --> 00:49:25,001 It's painful, very painful, 1053 00:49:25,001 --> 00:49:27,481 particularly my hands, my feet, and my shoulders. 1054 00:49:28,361 --> 00:49:31,681 It can be almost crippling at times. 1055 00:49:33,081 --> 00:49:35,241 I get tired, and that obviously makes life awkward 1056 00:49:35,241 --> 00:49:36,481 at home with the children. 1057 00:49:36,481 --> 00:49:38,161 - I wanna see. 1058 00:49:38,161 --> 00:49:39,001 - No, you're not. 1059 00:49:39,001 --> 00:49:40,761 Well, there is certainly no cure. 1060 00:49:40,761 --> 00:49:42,881 At the moment, they're trying to stem it 1061 00:49:42,881 --> 00:49:44,521 so that it gets no worse. 1062 00:49:46,241 --> 00:49:48,041 Whether we're having much success at that, 1063 00:49:48,041 --> 00:49:49,281 it's still quite early days, 1064 00:49:49,281 --> 00:49:50,481 so I really don't know at the moment. 1065 00:49:50,481 --> 00:49:53,241 I certainly don't feel that great at the moment. 1066 00:49:57,881 --> 00:49:58,721 Are we ready? 1067 00:49:59,801 --> 00:50:02,841 One, two, three, go! 1068 00:50:03,961 --> 00:50:06,521 Swimming is one of the best things for arthritis. 1069 00:50:06,521 --> 00:50:08,801 It can help as long as you don't overdo it, 1070 00:50:08,801 --> 00:50:12,001 but having said that, I'll pay for it tomorrow. 1071 00:50:12,001 --> 00:50:13,361 I'll be stiff tomorrow. 1072 00:50:18,761 --> 00:50:21,201 I shouldn't really lift Lee. 1073 00:50:21,201 --> 00:50:23,081 If Lee wants a cuddle, he should sit on my lap, 1074 00:50:23,081 --> 00:50:25,081 and I should cuddle him on my lap, 1075 00:50:25,081 --> 00:50:27,601 but how do you tell a four-year-old, no you can't lift them. 1076 00:50:27,601 --> 00:50:30,081 I mean, I can't stop being his mum 1077 00:50:30,081 --> 00:50:31,361 just because I'm not well. 1078 00:50:36,321 --> 00:50:38,281 - Do you remember those scenes at 21 1079 00:50:38,281 --> 00:50:40,921 when you were showing them round the house 1080 00:50:40,921 --> 00:50:42,481 at East Chiltern. - East Chiltern, yeah. 1081 00:50:42,481 --> 00:50:44,081 - Boy, we've gone a long way, haven't we? 1082 00:50:44,081 --> 00:50:44,921 - Just a bit. 1083 00:50:44,921 --> 00:50:47,921 Oh god, in fact, don't flash back to that 1084 00:50:47,921 --> 00:50:50,001 at this point please. 1085 00:50:50,001 --> 00:50:51,881 Just the double chins and the age, 1086 00:50:51,881 --> 00:50:55,121 and I mean, the funny part about is 1087 00:50:55,121 --> 00:50:56,161 is that you don't think about your age 1088 00:50:56,161 --> 00:50:58,721 until you think about something like that. 1089 00:50:58,721 --> 00:51:02,161 I mean, when you think about how many years ago that was, 1090 00:51:02,161 --> 00:51:04,361 and it was all so new and fresh. 1091 00:51:05,601 --> 00:51:07,081 I mean, I've done exactly the same now. 1092 00:51:07,081 --> 00:51:09,201 I've just started all over again, 1093 00:51:09,201 --> 00:51:11,241 but with three children in tow this time. 1094 00:51:12,321 --> 00:51:13,881 But that's life. 1095 00:51:13,881 --> 00:51:15,881 - So much hope then, wasn't there? 1096 00:51:15,881 --> 00:51:17,161 - There still is. 1097 00:51:18,041 --> 00:51:19,081 Oh, there still is. 1098 00:51:19,081 --> 00:51:20,601 Don't make that mistake, Mike. 1099 00:51:20,601 --> 00:51:21,841 I am in no way, 1100 00:51:23,481 --> 00:51:25,681 I am down and I am depressed about my illness, 1101 00:51:25,681 --> 00:51:28,441 but I'm certainly not down and depressed about my life. 1102 00:51:29,681 --> 00:51:33,481 Nothing's gonna do that, I've got three wonderful boys. 1103 00:51:33,481 --> 00:51:36,201 I've got a loving family around me. 1104 00:51:36,201 --> 00:51:37,801 I mean, I'm lucky. 1105 00:51:37,801 --> 00:51:38,641 There are a lot of people 1106 00:51:38,641 --> 00:51:41,241 that are a damn sight worse off than I am, a lot of people. 1107 00:51:44,441 --> 00:51:46,961 - Well, we pretend we've got swords, 1108 00:51:46,961 --> 00:51:49,721 and we make the noises of the swords fighting, 1109 00:51:49,721 --> 00:51:52,161 and when somebody stabs us, we go, "Argh." 1110 00:51:54,201 --> 00:51:56,561 - Neil grew up in a Liverpool suburb. 1111 00:51:58,241 --> 00:52:00,561 - In the winter, if you live in the country, 1112 00:52:00,561 --> 00:52:03,001 well it was just all wet and there wouldn't be anything 1113 00:52:03,001 --> 00:52:08,001 for miles around and you'd get soaked if you tried to go out 1114 00:52:08,961 --> 00:52:11,801 and there's no shelter anywhere except in your own house. 1115 00:52:11,801 --> 00:52:15,561 But in the town, you can go out on wet wintry days 1116 00:52:15,561 --> 00:52:17,761 'cause you can always find somewhere to shelter 1117 00:52:17,761 --> 00:52:19,921 'cause there's lots of places. 1118 00:52:19,921 --> 00:52:22,321 - At 14, he was at a local comprehensive school. 1119 00:52:22,321 --> 00:52:25,201 - I think it's a very good idea to have competition, 1120 00:52:25,201 --> 00:52:26,561 otherwise you might start to relax really, 1121 00:52:26,561 --> 00:52:27,761 and not try hard enough. 1122 00:52:29,321 --> 00:52:30,841 Being in Set One, it's very, very hard 1123 00:52:30,841 --> 00:52:32,241 to keep up with the leaders. 1124 00:52:33,161 --> 00:52:35,081 I never have the time to relax at all. 1125 00:52:36,361 --> 00:52:38,601 - Neil had dreams of going to Oxford, 1126 00:52:38,601 --> 00:52:40,001 but he didn't get in. 1127 00:52:40,001 --> 00:52:42,121 Instead, he went to Aberdeen University 1128 00:52:42,121 --> 00:52:44,481 but dropped out after a term. 1129 00:52:44,481 --> 00:52:47,361 At 21, he was living on a building site 1130 00:52:47,361 --> 00:52:49,201 and living in a squat. 1131 00:52:49,201 --> 00:52:50,201 - I came to London 1132 00:52:50,201 --> 00:52:54,561 and I contacted an agency for squatters, 1133 00:52:54,561 --> 00:52:57,681 and they were able to give me the address 1134 00:52:57,681 --> 00:53:00,801 of somebody who was able to help people 1135 00:53:00,801 --> 00:53:03,521 who were looking for accommodation in the London area. 1136 00:53:04,801 --> 00:53:06,881 - You kicked against the stability. 1137 00:53:08,121 --> 00:53:11,801 - I don't think I ever had any stability to be quite honest. 1138 00:53:12,961 --> 00:53:15,881 I can't think of any time in my life when I ever did. 1139 00:53:15,881 --> 00:53:17,761 I don't think I've been kicking against anything. 1140 00:53:17,761 --> 00:53:20,441 I think I've been kicking in mid-air the whole of my life. 1141 00:53:22,161 --> 00:53:24,241 - At 28, he was homeless 1142 00:53:24,241 --> 00:53:26,481 wandering around the west coast of Scotland. 1143 00:53:28,201 --> 00:53:30,441 - If the state didn't give us any money, 1144 00:53:30,441 --> 00:53:32,361 it would probably just mean crime, 1145 00:53:32,361 --> 00:53:35,161 and I'm glad I don't have to steal to keep myself alive. 1146 00:53:37,281 --> 00:53:40,001 If the money runs out, well then for a few days, 1147 00:53:40,001 --> 00:53:42,601 there's nowhere to go to and that's all you can do. 1148 00:53:42,601 --> 00:53:45,481 I simply have to find the warmest shed I can find. 1149 00:53:46,921 --> 00:53:48,881 - How do people regard you here? 1150 00:53:50,441 --> 00:53:52,881 - Well, I'm still known as an eccentric, 1151 00:53:54,641 --> 00:53:58,441 as I have been since about the age of 16 or so. 1152 00:54:00,721 --> 00:54:02,481 I'm not claiming that I feel 1153 00:54:02,481 --> 00:54:06,121 as though I'm in some sort of Nirvana, 1154 00:54:06,121 --> 00:54:08,561 but I'm claiming that if I was living 1155 00:54:08,561 --> 00:54:11,361 in a bedsit in suburbia, I'd be so miserable, 1156 00:54:11,361 --> 00:54:12,961 I'd feel like cutting my throat. 1157 00:54:14,041 --> 00:54:17,241 - At 35, we found him living on a council estate 1158 00:54:17,241 --> 00:54:20,361 in the most northerly part of Britain, the Shetland Islands. 1159 00:54:21,361 --> 00:54:23,521 - The nice thing about here is that you can cut yourself off 1160 00:54:23,521 --> 00:54:26,481 when you want because there are people living around, 1161 00:54:26,481 --> 00:54:28,081 but they're pretty quiet people. 1162 00:54:29,041 --> 00:54:31,521 It's an environment which sustains me, 1163 00:54:31,521 --> 00:54:33,121 it's one in which I can survive. 1164 00:54:34,241 --> 00:54:36,761 I still feel my real place is in the world 1165 00:54:36,761 --> 00:54:38,921 where people are doing what the majority of people do. 1166 00:54:38,921 --> 00:54:40,881 And the reason I don't feel safe is 1167 00:54:40,881 --> 00:54:42,241 because I think I'm getting more and more 1168 00:54:42,241 --> 00:54:44,641 used to this lifestyle, 1169 00:54:45,561 --> 00:54:47,641 which eventually, I shall have to give up. 1170 00:54:49,401 --> 00:54:51,161 - And what would you like to be doing, 1171 00:54:51,161 --> 00:54:53,161 say, in seven years? 1172 00:54:53,161 --> 00:54:54,401 - I can think of all kinds of things 1173 00:54:54,401 --> 00:54:55,241 that I'd like to be doing. 1174 00:54:55,241 --> 00:54:58,761 The real question is what am I likely to be doing. 1175 00:55:05,761 --> 00:55:07,401 - What are you likely to be doing? 1176 00:55:07,401 --> 00:55:09,441 - And that's a horrible question. 1177 00:55:10,841 --> 00:55:13,241 I tend to think most likely the answer 1178 00:55:13,241 --> 00:55:16,841 is I'll be wandering homeless around the streets of London, 1179 00:55:16,841 --> 00:55:19,081 but with a bit of luck, that won't happen. 1180 00:55:24,601 --> 00:55:27,561 Some of the considerable disadvantages 1181 00:55:27,561 --> 00:55:30,441 that residents of Trowbridge state area have 1182 00:55:30,441 --> 00:55:33,161 in comparison with those in other parts of Hackney, 1183 00:55:34,001 --> 00:55:36,881 first of all, they are geographically isolated. 1184 00:55:36,881 --> 00:55:39,961 They're separated from most of Hackney by-- 1185 00:55:39,961 --> 00:55:41,961 - At 42, he's a Liberal Democrat 1186 00:55:41,961 --> 00:55:44,081 member of Hackney Council. 1187 00:55:44,081 --> 00:55:45,601 He was elected two years ago. 1188 00:55:47,681 --> 00:55:49,561 - While I was in Shetland, I felt very strongly 1189 00:55:49,561 --> 00:55:52,241 that I should become involved in politics 1190 00:55:52,241 --> 00:55:54,441 simply because I felt I was not achieving anything 1191 00:55:54,441 --> 00:55:57,041 in the ways I really wanted to, 1192 00:55:57,041 --> 00:56:00,161 and I could see decisions being made politically 1193 00:56:00,161 --> 00:56:02,961 by people I felt were not competent to make them 1194 00:56:02,961 --> 00:56:04,881 and who I felt were not representing 1195 00:56:04,881 --> 00:56:07,481 the majority of the public and I felt angry. 1196 00:56:07,481 --> 00:56:10,481 And I felt in my own small way, I gotta get in there. 1197 00:56:10,481 --> 00:56:12,521 And I think more people should. 1198 00:56:12,521 --> 00:56:14,561 I think that it's only apathy 1199 00:56:14,561 --> 00:56:16,721 which leads to bad government at any level. 1200 00:56:18,481 --> 00:56:20,001 - It's like a million miles away 1201 00:56:20,001 --> 00:56:21,201 from the Shetlands here. 1202 00:56:21,201 --> 00:56:22,561 How have you coped with that? 1203 00:56:22,561 --> 00:56:24,121 - That is one aspect of it. 1204 00:56:24,121 --> 00:56:28,321 Certainly adjusting to London after all that period away, 1205 00:56:28,321 --> 00:56:30,561 even though I'd been back occasionally for visits, 1206 00:56:30,561 --> 00:56:32,281 was extremely difficult. 1207 00:56:32,281 --> 00:56:34,081 It became progressively easier. 1208 00:56:34,081 --> 00:56:36,561 The first six hours were an absolute nightmare, 1209 00:56:36,561 --> 00:56:38,401 and then the first week was pretty bad, 1210 00:56:38,401 --> 00:56:41,561 and I suppose it took me a year or so to adjust. 1211 00:56:45,321 --> 00:56:46,801 I suppose, I would. 1212 00:56:46,801 --> 00:56:49,481 Yes, well, I would like to be somebody 1213 00:56:49,481 --> 00:56:50,841 in a position of importance. 1214 00:56:50,841 --> 00:56:52,441 I've always thought this, 1215 00:56:53,401 --> 00:56:55,001 but I don't think I'm the right sort of person 1216 00:56:55,001 --> 00:56:56,521 to carry the responsibility for whatever it is. 1217 00:56:56,521 --> 00:56:58,441 I've always though well I'd love to be, 1218 00:57:00,681 --> 00:57:05,121 possibly love to be in politics or something like this. 1219 00:57:05,121 --> 00:57:09,481 The question of longterm sickly delegation, 1220 00:57:09,481 --> 00:57:11,721 as you'll be aware, Chair, the Liberal Democrats oppose. 1221 00:57:11,721 --> 00:57:13,881 - Do you have any nerves when you stand up 1222 00:57:13,881 --> 00:57:17,761 and give speeches or make arguments or defend positions? 1223 00:57:17,761 --> 00:57:19,641 - Yes, of course, and if I didn't, it would be wrong, 1224 00:57:19,641 --> 00:57:23,121 and the councillor who has no nerves is not doing his job. 1225 00:57:25,081 --> 00:57:27,921 It becomes slightly easier after the first time, 1226 00:57:27,921 --> 00:57:29,961 and I'm glad you didn't record my first speech 1227 00:57:29,961 --> 00:57:32,241 because most of the chamber walked out, 1228 00:57:32,241 --> 00:57:35,161 and I determined like Disraeli to say something, 1229 00:57:35,161 --> 00:57:37,001 like well, "You're not listening now, 1230 00:57:37,001 --> 00:57:38,721 "but one day, you will hear me." 1231 00:57:38,721 --> 00:57:40,081 But unfortunately, most of the chamber 1232 00:57:40,081 --> 00:57:43,161 had already walked out, so it was hardly worth saying that, 1233 00:57:43,161 --> 00:57:44,161 and also, I didn't believe 1234 00:57:44,161 --> 00:57:46,081 that it would necessarily be the case. 1235 00:57:48,281 --> 00:57:51,001 Well, I'm going to take people to the country 1236 00:57:51,001 --> 00:57:54,641 and sometimes take them to the seaside, 1237 00:57:54,641 --> 00:57:57,921 and I'll have a big loudspeaker in the motor coach 1238 00:57:57,921 --> 00:58:02,601 and tell them whereabouts we are and what we're going to do 1239 00:58:02,601 --> 00:58:07,361 and what the name of the road is and all about that. 1240 00:58:07,361 --> 00:58:09,481 - Do the days seem long for you? 1241 00:58:09,481 --> 00:58:10,681 - They can do. 1242 00:58:16,441 --> 00:58:18,441 - Do you have any friends anywhere? 1243 00:58:18,441 --> 00:58:20,521 - I've some good friends still in England. 1244 00:58:20,521 --> 00:58:23,921 Father God, we thank you for the love 1245 00:58:23,921 --> 00:58:27,041 that you show to us all in creation. 1246 00:58:28,241 --> 00:58:31,001 We pray that that love may grow 1247 00:58:31,001 --> 00:58:34,801 and take root wherever Bruce and Penny 1248 00:58:34,801 --> 00:58:37,321 find themselves from now on. 1249 00:58:37,321 --> 00:58:39,481 We pray that you will give them both 1250 00:58:39,481 --> 00:58:41,841 understanding and patience. 1251 00:58:41,841 --> 00:58:45,281 - I think it was just after the 28 programme. 1252 00:58:45,281 --> 00:58:46,881 There was organised a dinner 1253 00:58:46,881 --> 00:58:49,441 just to say farewell to everybody really. 1254 00:58:50,961 --> 00:58:51,801 I don't think the idea 1255 00:58:51,801 --> 00:58:54,881 was that we would get to know each other and become friends 1256 00:58:54,881 --> 00:58:57,201 and see each other in the meanwhile, 1257 00:58:57,201 --> 00:58:59,801 but I think Neil turned up without much notice. 1258 00:58:59,801 --> 00:59:00,801 I can't really remember. 1259 00:59:00,801 --> 00:59:01,641 - I came down from Scotland. 1260 00:59:01,641 --> 00:59:02,841 - Okay, right. 1261 00:59:02,841 --> 00:59:06,321 And I don't think anywhere had been arranged 1262 00:59:06,321 --> 00:59:07,161 for him to stay. 1263 00:59:07,161 --> 00:59:09,241 I think there was for all those, 1264 00:59:09,241 --> 00:59:10,921 you know, I'm not exactly sure what happened, 1265 00:59:10,921 --> 00:59:14,081 and I said, "Well, you can always kip on my spare bed." 1266 00:59:16,121 --> 00:59:17,481 - I think that the time 1267 00:59:17,481 --> 00:59:20,281 between my moving to London from Shetland 1268 00:59:20,281 --> 00:59:22,081 and actually finding my own accommodation in London 1269 00:59:22,081 --> 00:59:24,361 must have been round about two months, 1270 00:59:24,361 --> 00:59:26,281 and all that time I stayed with Bruce. 1271 00:59:28,001 --> 00:59:29,601 - And was that difficult? 1272 00:59:29,601 --> 00:59:30,841 - Not at all. 1273 00:59:30,841 --> 00:59:32,241 He was the model host, 1274 00:59:32,241 --> 00:59:34,841 although he did always insist on measuring 1275 00:59:34,841 --> 00:59:37,641 the amount of bathwater there was in the bath. 1276 00:59:37,641 --> 00:59:41,441 I'm not quite sure why that was, I never actually found out. 1277 00:59:41,441 --> 00:59:44,041 - I hope you don't mind me saying this, but you know, 1278 00:59:44,041 --> 00:59:47,841 like he'd find the fridge a bit noisy, so he'd turn it off. 1279 00:59:47,841 --> 00:59:50,681 Or if I had to hoover, he'd walk round the block or. 1280 00:59:50,681 --> 00:59:53,201 - Well, I didn't basically stay in. 1281 00:59:53,201 --> 00:59:54,721 - No, no, no, no, that's true. 1282 00:59:54,721 --> 00:59:59,401 - No, I accept that I wasn't the model lodger in every way 1283 00:59:59,401 --> 01:00:01,441 and however that only emphasises 1284 01:00:01,441 --> 01:00:02,281 how patient you actually were. 1285 01:00:02,281 --> 01:00:03,121 - No. 1286 01:00:04,081 --> 01:00:06,401 - How has Bruce helped you? 1287 01:00:06,401 --> 01:00:08,841 - Well, he has just been a good loyal friend, 1288 01:00:08,841 --> 01:00:12,001 and I appreciate what he has tried, 1289 01:00:12,001 --> 01:00:14,321 done to help me to set up in London 1290 01:00:14,321 --> 01:00:19,001 and just been someone to talk to when the need has arisen. 1291 01:00:19,001 --> 01:00:21,681 When I grow up, I want to be an astronaut. 1292 01:00:21,681 --> 01:00:25,481 If I can't be an astronaut, I think I'll be a coach driver. 1293 01:00:26,321 --> 01:00:27,161 This is probably linked up 1294 01:00:27,161 --> 01:00:28,161 with the fact now that I want to travel. 1295 01:00:28,161 --> 01:00:30,441 I mean, my thoughts haven't really changed that much, 1296 01:00:30,441 --> 01:00:32,721 but I definitely would like to be a coach driver now. 1297 01:00:34,841 --> 01:00:36,761 I've trained to be a teacher 1298 01:00:36,761 --> 01:00:38,921 of English as a foreign language. 1299 01:00:38,921 --> 01:00:41,401 I've been on a number of training courses, 1300 01:00:41,401 --> 01:00:42,641 and I did an Open University degree. 1301 01:00:42,641 --> 01:00:45,281 That was perhaps the longest of all. 1302 01:00:47,601 --> 01:00:49,321 It was an Open University BA. 1303 01:00:51,321 --> 01:00:53,041 I took a number of subjects. 1304 01:00:55,321 --> 01:00:56,921 This is all background I suppose 1305 01:00:56,921 --> 01:00:58,521 and really perhaps you'd like to know 1306 01:00:58,521 --> 01:01:01,321 whether I've done any work and the answer is no. 1307 01:01:01,321 --> 01:01:02,801 - Another one? - There you are. 1308 01:01:02,801 --> 01:01:04,921 There will be plenty in the next few weeks. 1309 01:01:04,921 --> 01:01:05,841 - I know all about. 1310 01:01:05,841 --> 01:01:07,961 - All Neil's political work is voluntary, 1311 01:01:07,961 --> 01:01:10,601 like the canvassing he did for the Liberal Democrats 1312 01:01:10,601 --> 01:01:12,721 at last year's Winchester By-Election. 1313 01:01:12,721 --> 01:01:13,561 - Thanks. 1314 01:01:13,561 --> 01:01:15,761 - He lives entirely off State Benefit. 1315 01:01:17,481 --> 01:01:18,921 - I haven't had any paid work 1316 01:01:18,921 --> 01:01:21,841 apart from a couple of interim government schemes. 1317 01:01:21,841 --> 01:01:25,321 I worked in a local community theatre for about six months. 1318 01:01:26,561 --> 01:01:29,201 I worked as a gardener, fairly inevitably. 1319 01:01:30,241 --> 01:01:31,881 - Does it worry you, living off benefits, 1320 01:01:31,881 --> 01:01:32,961 living off the state? 1321 01:01:32,961 --> 01:01:33,881 - Yeah, of course. 1322 01:01:34,961 --> 01:01:36,681 I feel as I am a drain on people 1323 01:01:36,681 --> 01:01:38,761 who are working hard to provide the money. 1324 01:01:38,761 --> 01:01:39,841 It's not that I don't think 1325 01:01:39,841 --> 01:01:41,681 there shouldn't be a benefit service. 1326 01:01:42,721 --> 01:01:44,641 I think there should be work for all 1327 01:01:44,641 --> 01:01:47,001 or for as many who want to do it, 1328 01:01:47,001 --> 01:01:51,041 and I'm not satisfied with efforts that have been made 1329 01:01:51,041 --> 01:01:53,401 to provide work for those who want it. 1330 01:01:54,361 --> 01:01:58,081 When I get married, I don't want to have any children 1331 01:01:58,081 --> 01:02:02,201 because they're always doing naughty things 1332 01:02:02,201 --> 01:02:04,761 and making the whole house untidy. 1333 01:02:06,121 --> 01:02:08,121 I don't know what the best age is for falling in love 1334 01:02:08,121 --> 01:02:10,921 and maybe when you're in love in your teens, 1335 01:02:10,921 --> 01:02:11,761 you really are in love 1336 01:02:11,761 --> 01:02:14,481 and when you think you're in love later on, you're not. 1337 01:02:14,481 --> 01:02:18,121 Or maybe I'm still not old enough to really fall in love. 1338 01:02:19,361 --> 01:02:23,361 I always told myself that I would never have children. 1339 01:02:25,961 --> 01:02:27,481 - Why? 1340 01:02:27,481 --> 01:02:32,401 - Because, because, well because children 1341 01:02:32,401 --> 01:02:34,681 inherit something from their parents, 1342 01:02:34,681 --> 01:02:38,521 and even if my wife were the most high-spirited 1343 01:02:38,521 --> 01:02:41,561 and ordinary and normal of people, 1344 01:02:41,561 --> 01:02:44,401 the child would still stand a very fair chance 1345 01:02:44,401 --> 01:02:48,721 of being not totally full of happiness 1346 01:02:48,721 --> 01:02:52,681 because of what he or she will have inherited from me. 1347 01:02:54,641 --> 01:02:55,761 Well, I'm not married. 1348 01:02:57,001 --> 01:02:59,241 I value all experience, 1349 01:02:59,241 --> 01:03:03,641 and I feel this part of my life hasn't happened. 1350 01:03:05,001 --> 01:03:08,561 I'm not homosexual, therefore I do hanker 1351 01:03:08,561 --> 01:03:10,881 after a stable relationship with a woman. 1352 01:03:10,881 --> 01:03:13,001 I have never been able to achieve that, 1353 01:03:13,001 --> 01:03:16,841 and I think I'm somehow deficient in my ability 1354 01:03:18,641 --> 01:03:20,961 to react to certain of the needs of others 1355 01:03:20,961 --> 01:03:23,641 through not having had that relationship. 1356 01:03:26,001 --> 01:03:30,641 I feel, especially sometimes when I'm on my own, 1357 01:03:30,641 --> 01:03:33,401 that I'm losing touch with the way other people live. 1358 01:03:35,721 --> 01:03:38,441 - Do you worry about your sanity? 1359 01:03:42,081 --> 01:03:44,081 - Other people sometimes worry about it. 1360 01:03:45,481 --> 01:03:46,361 - Like who? 1361 01:03:51,081 --> 01:03:55,241 - As I said, I sometimes can be found behaving 1362 01:03:55,241 --> 01:03:57,641 in an erratic fashion. 1363 01:03:58,481 --> 01:03:59,921 Sometimes get very frustrated, 1364 01:03:59,921 --> 01:04:02,561 very angry for no apparent reason. 1365 01:04:02,561 --> 01:04:04,241 For a reason which won't be apparent 1366 01:04:04,241 --> 01:04:06,321 to other people around me. 1367 01:04:06,321 --> 01:04:08,321 - Do you ever think you're going mad? 1368 01:04:08,321 --> 01:04:10,041 - Oh, I don't think it, I know it. 1369 01:04:16,201 --> 01:04:19,041 We don't like to use the word mad. 1370 01:04:21,161 --> 01:04:23,841 I think most people are mad here really. 1371 01:04:23,841 --> 01:04:26,241 My health has been a lot better more recently 1372 01:04:26,241 --> 01:04:27,921 than at other times in my life. 1373 01:04:27,921 --> 01:04:32,201 Maybe being busy has been part of the cure. 1374 01:04:36,001 --> 01:04:41,001 And I think my Christian faith has helped me. 1375 01:04:41,681 --> 01:04:44,481 - I can actually say, now, many thanks for the prayers. 1376 01:04:44,481 --> 01:04:46,441 They were really nice, they were thoughtful. 1377 01:04:46,441 --> 01:04:50,321 - I also believe as my friends who have been so loyal 1378 01:04:50,321 --> 01:04:52,881 have got to know me more better and better, 1379 01:04:52,881 --> 01:04:55,121 and there is always room for getting to know people better, 1380 01:04:55,121 --> 01:04:58,401 that they themselves have been able to show support 1381 01:04:58,401 --> 01:05:01,121 and sympathy in the most appropriate ways. 1382 01:05:04,081 --> 01:05:05,921 - Is this a good time in your life? 1383 01:05:05,921 --> 01:05:07,641 - Yes, probably, I've never been busier, 1384 01:05:07,641 --> 01:05:10,201 and I've never been in contact with so many people. 1385 01:05:11,361 --> 01:05:12,481 - Now, the one thing I do have say 1386 01:05:12,481 --> 01:05:14,121 is please put all the leaflets 1387 01:05:14,121 --> 01:05:15,841 right through the letterboxes. 1388 01:05:15,841 --> 01:05:18,081 - I feel incredibly grateful for the opportunity 1389 01:05:18,081 --> 01:05:19,681 to do what I'm doing. 1390 01:05:19,681 --> 01:05:21,721 I'm grateful to the people that elected me. 1391 01:05:21,721 --> 01:05:23,721 I hope I haven't let them down. 1392 01:05:25,961 --> 01:05:27,401 I hope I will be re-elected, 1393 01:05:27,401 --> 01:05:30,761 and that depends on my performance in the last two years. 1394 01:05:32,001 --> 01:05:34,881 - In May, he was re-elected for another term. 1395 01:05:36,561 --> 01:05:38,161 - I don't think there's a councillor in the country 1396 01:05:38,161 --> 01:05:39,921 who wouldn't like to see themselves as an MP, 1397 01:05:39,921 --> 01:05:41,721 and yet they say every politician 1398 01:05:41,721 --> 01:05:43,681 wants to be Prime Minister. 1399 01:05:43,681 --> 01:05:45,761 But I'm quite happy at the moment 1400 01:05:45,761 --> 01:05:48,121 doing my council work trying to serve 1401 01:05:48,121 --> 01:05:51,681 what I perceive is a very great need in Hackney. 1402 01:05:51,681 --> 01:05:53,761 Well, I suppose I've done many more things 1403 01:05:54,961 --> 01:05:57,481 than on previous occasions, 1404 01:05:57,481 --> 01:06:01,121 but whether I've changed inside, I can't say. 1405 01:06:06,881 --> 01:06:08,761 - What's the most enjoyable thing in life 1406 01:06:08,761 --> 01:06:10,601 for you at the moment? 1407 01:06:10,601 --> 01:06:12,801 - I think it's looking to the future. 1408 01:06:17,881 --> 01:06:20,841 - Well, that's a change for the better, isn't it? 1409 01:06:21,721 --> 01:06:24,241 - Well, perhaps that's just because I'm getting old. 1410 01:06:29,121 --> 01:06:30,601 I think it's me believing that things 1411 01:06:30,601 --> 01:06:34,081 can't be so bad in the future as they have been in the past, 1412 01:06:36,281 --> 01:06:39,161 and I think there are certain short-term objectives 1413 01:06:39,161 --> 01:06:40,721 I have here in Hackney, 1414 01:06:40,721 --> 01:06:45,481 and if I can achieve a few of those, then I'll be pleased. 1415 01:06:48,801 --> 01:06:50,001 - Wee! 1416 01:06:55,441 --> 01:06:57,401 - What effect has it had on you 1417 01:06:57,401 --> 01:06:59,321 being in these films, do you think? 1418 01:06:59,321 --> 01:07:02,081 - It's funny because before the films start, you think, 1419 01:07:02,081 --> 01:07:04,561 what on earth have I done with the seven years 1420 01:07:04,561 --> 01:07:05,561 that I could possibly say. 1421 01:07:05,561 --> 01:07:07,441 What can I talk about that I've done, 1422 01:07:07,441 --> 01:07:09,281 and you panic, you think, "I should have done something. 1423 01:07:09,281 --> 01:07:10,761 "I should have done something dramatic." 1424 01:07:10,761 --> 01:07:13,481 You know, I was hoping I'd win the lottery last night 1425 01:07:13,481 --> 01:07:18,201 so that I could come on and say, but life's not like that. 1426 01:07:18,201 --> 01:07:20,161 - Well, I mean we were talking 1427 01:07:20,161 --> 01:07:21,041 about my ambitions as a scientist. 1428 01:07:21,041 --> 01:07:22,921 I mean, my ambition as a scientist 1429 01:07:22,921 --> 01:07:24,761 is to be more famous for doing science 1430 01:07:24,761 --> 01:07:25,841 than for being in this film, 1431 01:07:25,841 --> 01:07:27,681 but unfortunately, Michael, it's not gonna happen. 1432 01:07:27,681 --> 01:07:30,081 - I have met some of the most interesting people 1433 01:07:30,081 --> 01:07:32,081 who I am still in contact with, 1434 01:07:32,081 --> 01:07:34,921 and this includes people in different parts of the world. 1435 01:07:36,801 --> 01:07:39,401 And one or two particularly close friendships 1436 01:07:39,401 --> 01:07:42,521 have been forged through the programme. 1437 01:07:42,521 --> 01:07:43,361 Although I had to say, 1438 01:07:43,361 --> 01:07:46,561 I was very suspicious when the initial contact was made. 1439 01:07:46,561 --> 01:07:47,561 - I mean, I don't think I'd ever 1440 01:07:47,561 --> 01:07:48,761 have kept a record of my life 1441 01:07:48,761 --> 01:07:52,441 in the way that we have with this programme so, yes, 1442 01:07:52,441 --> 01:07:55,361 I mean, I enjoyed doing it, but it's not, 1443 01:07:56,441 --> 01:07:59,081 it's not something that sort of takes a great precedence. 1444 01:07:59,081 --> 01:08:01,001 - If you came and asked me 1445 01:08:01,001 --> 01:08:03,001 if you could do this to my children, 1446 01:08:03,001 --> 01:08:04,641 I certainly wouldn't be enthusiastic. 1447 01:08:04,641 --> 01:08:05,601 I think it's something 1448 01:08:05,601 --> 01:08:10,601 that I wouldn't want to wish on someone particularly. 1449 01:08:11,521 --> 01:08:15,241 - I think for the first 40-odd years, 1450 01:08:15,241 --> 01:08:20,241 it's restricted me because I was always shy to start with 1451 01:08:21,001 --> 01:08:23,521 and knowing that people were gonna be looking at me 1452 01:08:23,521 --> 01:08:27,241 and watching me, rather than do something 1453 01:08:27,241 --> 01:08:30,921 that's gonna look stupid, I've always pulled myself back. 1454 01:08:30,921 --> 01:08:32,921 - There's a lot of baggage that gets stirred up 1455 01:08:32,921 --> 01:08:35,601 every seven years for me that I find quite, 1456 01:08:35,601 --> 01:08:38,761 that I find very hard to deal with, 1457 01:08:38,761 --> 01:08:41,001 and I can put it away for the seven years, 1458 01:08:41,001 --> 01:08:42,201 and then it comes round again, 1459 01:08:42,201 --> 01:08:44,001 and the whole lot comes tumbling out again, 1460 01:08:44,001 --> 01:08:46,441 and I have to deal with it all over again. 1461 01:08:46,441 --> 01:08:49,681 - It hasn't changed my choices in life. 1462 01:08:49,681 --> 01:08:52,361 I haven't though, "Well, I have to be doing this by then," 1463 01:08:52,361 --> 01:08:55,481 or, "How will this seem to others," or so on. 1464 01:08:55,481 --> 01:08:58,681 It's just a kind of periodic little intrusion. 1465 01:08:58,681 --> 01:09:01,521 - It's the only time, when you're a cabbie, 1466 01:09:01,521 --> 01:09:03,401 instead of you picking up a celebrity 1467 01:09:03,401 --> 01:09:06,521 and saying "Hello you're Paul Gasgoigne, ain't ya?" 1468 01:09:06,521 --> 01:09:07,921 And when they go, "I know you," 1469 01:09:07,921 --> 01:09:10,481 and they turn the tables on you, you know. 1470 01:09:10,481 --> 01:09:11,561 - And do you like that? 1471 01:09:11,561 --> 01:09:14,161 - It's not a question of like it, I'm used to it. 1472 01:09:14,161 --> 01:09:15,961 I don't mind it. - You do like it. 1473 01:09:15,961 --> 01:09:18,401 - It has to be said that I bitterly regret 1474 01:09:18,401 --> 01:09:20,321 that the headmaster of the school 1475 01:09:20,321 --> 01:09:21,481 where I was when I was seven 1476 01:09:21,481 --> 01:09:25,841 pushed me forward for this series because every seven years, 1477 01:09:25,841 --> 01:09:29,601 a little pill of poison is injected into. 1478 01:09:29,601 --> 01:09:30,441 - Oh no. 1479 01:09:31,361 --> 01:09:32,721 - Well, it's the truth. 1480 01:09:32,721 --> 01:09:36,001 - Being honest, I think despite all the things 1481 01:09:36,001 --> 01:09:37,681 that I might have said over the years 1482 01:09:37,681 --> 01:09:39,841 about, "Oh, coming again" and that sort, 1483 01:09:39,841 --> 01:09:41,561 I think there's a certain amount 1484 01:09:41,561 --> 01:09:44,201 of excitement there too underlying, 1485 01:09:44,201 --> 01:09:46,561 I'm old enough to admit it now I suppose. 1486 01:09:46,561 --> 01:09:47,401 You know? 1487 01:09:47,401 --> 01:09:50,041 No, it probably is a bit of good fun, I think. 1488 01:09:50,041 --> 01:09:52,961 - Some of us don't see family from one year to the next, 1489 01:09:52,961 --> 01:09:55,201 seven years on, and I think that's how we all feel 1490 01:09:55,201 --> 01:09:58,841 about each other, but we're linked and that can never go. 1491 01:10:00,761 --> 01:10:03,841 - At the end of their very special day in London 1492 01:10:03,841 --> 01:10:06,921 after their trip to the zoo and the party, 1493 01:10:06,921 --> 01:10:09,921 we took our children to an adventure playground 1494 01:10:09,921 --> 01:10:12,361 where they could do just what they liked. 1495 01:10:14,721 --> 01:10:17,601 Those from the children's home set about building a house. 1496 01:10:30,001 --> 01:10:30,841 There's Nicholas. 1497 01:10:38,081 --> 01:10:39,161 There's Tony. 1498 01:10:45,841 --> 01:10:46,681 Andrew. 1499 01:10:52,401 --> 01:10:53,201 And Bruce. 1500 01:11:02,281 --> 01:11:03,121 Suzi. 1501 01:11:10,401 --> 01:11:12,041 Jackie and her friends. 1502 01:11:18,361 --> 01:11:21,201 Give me a child until he is seven, 1503 01:11:21,201 --> 01:11:23,121 and I will give you the man. 1504 01:11:31,841 --> 01:11:35,801 This has been a glimpse of Britain's future. 117676

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