All language subtitles for MasterClass Danny Elfman Teaches Music For Film - 18.Working With Directors

[MUSIC PLAYING]

When you're talking with
directors and listening

to directors-- because
if you're smart,

you're really doing more
listening than talking,

because you really want to
hear what they have to say.

You really want to do
it with illustrating,

because some directors
have a really

kind of deep musical
knowledge, and some

know nothing about music.

Of course, I always
hope for the directors

that know nothing about music.

It's much easier to
communicate, because if they

have been to Juilliard,
if they've studied music,

it doesn't mean shit
when they're telling you

about music that doesn't exist.

It's still all subjective.

You're talking about music that
does this and music that does--

and if they start talking
about a specific style of music

or composition,
most likely they're

leading you down a rabbit hole
that's going to go nowhere.

And you're going to
end up doing that,

and then having them go, no,
no, that's not what I mean.

I meant like this.

All that really matters is
you listen to their feeling.

How do they feel about it?

And that needs no
musical sensibility.

How do they feel?

Your job is to translate their
feelings about their movie

into music.

And the directors I have
with a vast musical knowledge

or with deeper musical
knowledge tend to be actually

more difficult. Warren
Beatty comes to mind,

because he's
actually a musician,

and he could play piano, and he
could talk about a scale, talk

about playing it in this
key versus that key.

I usually-- you know, I've
had half a dozen directors

who can talk that way,
and I just listen to them.

But when they talk about
keys and stuff like that,

it doesn't mean anything to me.

You know, when it--

when somebody starts
talking about this

should be in such
and such a key,

because such an key feels
that way, that's bullshit.

And when classical
reviewers are talking

about a composer composing
in a certain key,

that's also bullshit.

I mean, there is no
key that feels sad,

and there's no key
that feels happy.

You can turn any key
into anything you want.

So ideally, the director
is not giving you

very specific musical notation
ideas, but if they do,

you've got to listen,
be respectful, and try

to understand the gist
of what they're saying.

But then get down to what
you really care about,

is what's going to make
them feel what I want

them to feel at this moment.

[MUSIC PLAYING]

Very important-- your first
meetings with the director,

and especially when you're
playing the director

music for the first time.

It's like, in this moment,
you have to find a balance.

You have to reach deep
inside of yourself.

It's-- you have to make the
director feel several things.

One is that you're calm and
in control of the situation.

Two, very important, you have--

they have to feel that
you're listening to them,

that you're really listening.

And then when they
have questions for you,

you don't want to get
defensive and start

getting nervous and trying
to come up with answers that

feel phony, and you don't
want your sense of listening

to them feeling phony either.

You really want to try
to hear what they're

saying because
people will pick up

on your bullshit at this point.

And so you don't know
what you're going to find,

so you want to be open,
and that's the key word,

is like, they're
going to express, how

about this, how about that.

No matter what it
sounds like, just

be open to what they're saying,
because when they leave,

that's the first thing you're
going to be doing, is like,

how do I apply what they
just said to what I'm doing?

And it's not an easy thing.

You're going to find
a way to apply it.

Hopefully, if you're--
you have a sound,

you have something
that you feel is you,

you're going to try to find how
it applies through your sound,

and you're not going
to be imitative.

[INAUDIBLE] go,
oh, they want this.

I'm just going to
give them that.

and then they're going
to come back and go,

well, no, OK, I asked for
this, but not on the nose

literally just in
the way that I've

heard many times before this.

You want to try to find a way
to make it your own version,

but in what you're going to
play them the second time they

come is still, clearly to them,
acknowledging their thoughts.

And they might go, oh, yeah,
that's working a lot better.

And they might
go, for example, I

can hear that you're
coming into this zone,

but this part here, I
still have a problem with.

But you're making progress,
because now, they're like,

OK, this is better,
this is better,

but when I get to this
section, you're losing me.

And that's a good thing,
because now, you've

made progress with
this piece of music,

and now, your job is to go, what
is it about this section that

isn't working for them?

And it can be anything.

I mean, I've had moments
with the director

where I'm almost
ready to rewrite

a whole section of
a thing, and then

I just change the
instrumentation,

and I lost the trumpet.

And the director comes in-- oh,
my god, that's so much better,

and I'm sitting there--

I'm so glad that I
didn't rewrite it

because it really was just a
sound that was bothering them.

The way I see it is like this--

you've all been, or most of
you, to an optometrist's office,

and in the optometrist's
office, they're presenting you--

if you've ever had glasses, as
you know, they're going to go,

which looks better--

number one or number two?

You go, number two, and
then they go switch,

switch, switch, switch.

Now, which looks better--
number one or number two?

And you go, one more time.

Number one or number two?

Number two's a little sharper.

Switch, switch,
switch, switch, switch,

and you-- they work their
way into your prescription.

And sometimes, I feel it's the
same with directors and music

and presentations.

So it's better to do a little
too much and to be prepared,

because you don't want to come
out of a meeting with just,

no, nothing's working.

I'm still back to
the drawing board.

You want to come
away with at least,

this is working
better than this.

All right, it's given
me a clue, a road

to try to aim and
focus myself down.

So you want to get something out
of a meeting that's positive.

You know, unless it just--

it isn't.

But you want to find some way
to do that, so in my technique,

or how I work, is to
try to provide options,

because very often, I don't
even know myself how I feel.

I have three ways I'm playing
something, and I like them all.

And I want the director to say,
that, number two, and that's

actually part of the
fun of it as well.