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Hi, I'm Bob Lazar.

In December of 1988,

I was hired as a
senior staff physicist

by a U.S. defense
contractor called

EG&G Special Projects.

I was told that I
would be working

on an advanced
propulsion system

out in a remote area
of the Nevada test site

known as Area 51.

Myself and 21 other people

were responsible for back
engineering a technology

that originated
from another civilization.

Although this was a
highly classified project,

I was never comfortable knowing

that this secret was being kept
from the world.

As work there progressed,
I began to worry

that what I knew could
endanger my life.

Wanting to protect myself,

I decided to go public and
reveal the secrets of S4.

Since then, my story has been
told countless times

from people all over the world.

No one has ever been able to
show exactly

what I saw with my own eyes.

Until now.

Wow, that's a big carrot
you got there.

Well...

I'm sure they're gonna like
the greens too.

Come here, come here.

Boy!

Rockstar hair on it.

I get asked a lot if
I regret going forward and...

I have also said, for years,

"My mind goes back and forth."

If I go forward, I come
to this point

in my life,
if I could go back in time,

I do wonder what would
happen if I didn't go forward
and just

played along and didn't take

anyone out to the site
to show 'em and...

I don't know how things
would have turned out.

I don't know if that
would have been the

right thing to do anyway,

'cause it really
bothered me that

all this was being kept secret.

Ah, there's really no way
I can prove it

without revealing my identity
and getting myself into

more trouble than
I have already.

Exactly what's
going on up there?

Well, there's several, uh,

actually nine flying saucers,
flying disks

that are out there of
extraterrestrial origin.

They're basically being
dismantled but

some are, well,
in various stages of--

of completion built
from other parts

and they're being test flown

and basically just analyzed.

I was always interested in
science and engineering,

particularly things that

operated or controlled huge
amounts of power, like,

high-powered lasers,
rocket engines, jet engines,

explosives, things of that sort,

and started building small jet
and rocket engines

in my late teens.

I remember, um,

either buying this magazine or
I--

I might have been subscribed
to it at the time, but, um,

this is back when I was either
in high school or junior high.

And, um, yeah, I saw that...

...you know, a jet engine on
a go-kart going, "Well,

nothing's cooler than that,"
you know, when you're a kid.

Yeah, but I wanted to know
everything about that.

You know, a jet engine,
you-- you--

you could build
a jet engine and--

Anyway, I became fascinated
with all this and

the power and-- and whatnot.

And, um... you know, noted from
the article that there was a

guy named Eugene Gluhareff
and lived in

California somewhere and,

you know, time--
time went on, years go by, and

I moved with my parents
out to California and,

you know, I-- I think
at some point this--

this magazine popped up again,

you know, and I went...
"Wait, there's... that--

that guy's out here," you know,
and I looked and I--

I think it was in
Gardena, California.

I went, it's like a
30-minute drive.

So, you know, I just
drove out there

and, you know, here's, uh,

this guy's shop was
just in this little

kind of
disintegrating building,

you know, knocked on the door
and there's the guy.

And, uh, you know, we--
we start talking and um...

in-- in a short time,

you know,
he saw how interested I was

and explaining everything.

And we-- we became friends.

Then it was me constantly going

back and forth there and, uh--

and learning a lot about how--

how everything worked, you know,
supersonic aerodynamics
and the--

you know, the shock waves
that work inside, the ju--

stuff that you're not gonna

learn in high school
at that time.

And I became more and more
interested in--

you know, that really became
the basis,

the spark anyway,
of what got me interested in,

you know, that kind of
propulsion.

An old friend of mine, Jim,

he worked in the
same place I did,

Fairchild Electronics, and

came in one day and said,

"I went to the racetrack
last night."

I think it was
Orange County Raceway

"And they had jet cars.

It's just this big jet engine
with wheels on it.

And they were racing, you know,
fire is blasting out the back."

I-- And he said,
"Yeah, you gotta go."

And I went there.
I was, you know,

probably-- just my early 20s,
maybe 21 years old.

And, I-- you know, I thought.

"That is without a doubt
the coolest thing

I have ever seen."

And I immediately-- I have to
have one of those things.

And um, I think that was kind
of the seed that started it.

Well, it's so cool.
I lit it and I just see this car

pulling away from me. I said,

"Jeez, I wonder if I'm
gonna catch it."

Three...

...two...

...one...

...zero!

My wife had a Honda Civic.

And as it turned out, just
looking at it one day,

just the hatchback really looked
like a jet would fit in there.

I just started taking it apart.

And, uh, to her surprise,

there was a jet in there
in a short period of time.

But, uh, she was
okay with it and

kind of became a project
for a while.

And, uh, it turned out
to be pretty cool.

He also said he
worked as a physicist at

Los Alamos National Lab,

where he experimented with
one of the world's

largest particle beam
accelerators,

a half mile long behemoth

capable of generating
700 million volts.

Los Alamos officials told us

they had no records of
a Robert Lazar ever
working there.

They were either mistaken
or were lying.

A 1982 phone book
from the lab lists Lazar

right there among the other
scientists and technicians.

A 1982 clipping from the
Los Alamos newspaper

profiled Lazar and
his interest in jet cars.

It too mentioned his employment
at the lab as a physicist.

We called Los Alamos again.

An exasperated official told us

he still had no records
on Lazar.

Well, while working
at Los Alamos National Lab
in 1982,

the local newspaper did
a front page
story

on a jet car I had built.

Coincidentally,
Dr. Edward Teller

was giving a speech at
Los Alamos that same day.

One, two, three, four.

We don't want war.

Reagan...

...is our first president...

who had the courage...

to tell the American people...

a big part... of the truth.

When I arrived early
to hear his speech,

Dr. Teller was still
sitting outside

reading a story about me
in the newspaper.

I used that to strike up
a conversation

and we had a short
chat about the jet car.

Then later I listened
to his speech.

Now, I never met Dr. Teller
again, but in 1988

when I decided to re-enter
the scientific community,

I sent him a resume,
and inquired about a job.

Dr. Teller responded
by telephone

and told me that he was
no longer active,

but just functioned in a
chief consultant capacity.

He gave me the name of
a contact to call in Las Vegas.

I made that call and things
progressed from there

until I got into
the program at S4.

I had left the lab, moved back
and started sending out resumes

and that's when he said,
"I think I have" you know,

"I have something
you might be interested in."

And that's when he
directed me to EG&G and

their special projects
division is where

I had the interview and...

that was actually apparently
for yet another job.

And after my interview,
they said,

"You know, there's actually
a different position

that you might plug into
a little bit better."

So, you know, it was kind of a--
a bumpy road to S4, but

it's--
was all through, uh, Teller.

EG&G, which is where
Lazar says he was interviewed

for the job at S4,
also has no record.

It's as if someone
has made him disappear.

The consulting
engineering firm

of Edgerton,
Grumershausen and Grier,

these three together
with their staff

will conduct the
highly important

Teller Alpha experiment

devised in 1947 by
Dr. Edward Teller,

a University of Chicago
physicist

and Los Alamos consultant,

involves the Zero Tower and the
Teller Alpha reflectors.

He is not your typical, uh,

straight-laced science guy,

science nerd that, uh, might

typically be hired at a place
like Los Alamos or at S4.

So, you know,

if you wanted to hire a guy
who could think clearly

out of the box and help
solve problems,

but who could be discredited,
if you needed to do that,

Bob was probably the best person
in the country at the time.

He was perfect for it.

My name is George Knapp.

I'm an investigative reporter,

former anchor at KLAS-TV,

and I'm the guy who broke
the story about Bob Lazar.

high school reunion
or something.

- Yeah
-Look at you!

-Hey, it's good to see you.
-You too, man.

I get more UFO books than...
anybody in-- on the planet.

No doubt.

That's all CIA
secret history stuff.

I got some Emmys and...

"I got--

I got some
little Emmys out there."

Lazar, 51.

Lazar, Lazar, 51.

Uh, but it all starts with you,
so it's your fault

that my house looks like this.

Oh, I remember you
showed me a flying--

-There it is! With the
aliens inside.
-Yeah.

Yeah, I thought
that was really cute.

Let me start this way first,
so...

This is the first time
Bob and I have ever

-been on camera together.
-Mm-hmm.

You know, when I first met him,

he-- he came forward
and spoke to us

'cause he was afraid
for his life.

So I started trying to check out
what's on his resume,

where he had worked,
where he'd gone to school.

Um, started with the schools,
and...

...it was an immediate
roadblock.

You know, MIT and Caltech

both said, "We don't have
any record of him."

I thought, "Well, this series
could end right here, you know."

And then so this prompted
conversations with me and Bob,

and he explained some of
what was going on.

He said,
"Look, I worked at Los Alamos.

I was there. I was working in a

scientific capacity on
classified programs.

That is a fact."

And I decided, "Well, that's
what we'll focus on."

If he worked at Los Alamos

in a scientific capacity on
classified stuff,

this is a go.

And so I started a

COP correspondence
with Los Alamos,

and they were a pain in the ass
right at-- from the beginning.

"We don't have any record of him

ever being there
in any capacity. Sorry."

Then we had the phone book.

There he is in the phone book.

I sent it to 'em.
"Hey, folks, here he is."

"Yeah, we-- we can't find a--" I
think they called it a Z number.

"Can't find it. Sorry."

Then I had the
Los Alamos Monitor
front page story about

Bob being a physicist working
there. I sent that to 'em.

"Have you guys seen this?"

Los Alamos is a small town.

It's not like he could lie
about it on the front page

of the paper and
get away with it.

"Nope.
Sorry, we don't have him.

But maybe he worked
for Kirk Meyer."

So I started a correspondence
with Kirk Meyer.

This is a company that is a
headhunter.

They hire people.

They find, uh, people
to fill positions,

scientific and technical
capabilities

at places like Los Alamos Lab.

"You have records on a guy
named Robert Lazar."

And they said, "Yes, we do."
I said, "Can I get them?"

Said, "Yeah, if you get a
signed letter from him

or we can send them to him
or you with a--

with a letter with permission."

I said, "Great."
And sent it to 'em.

Weeks go by, no response.

Months go by, no response.

I'm writing back to him.

There's a-- I got a stack
of letters like this

to Los Alamos
and Kirk Meyer.

And I'm asking 'em,
"You said you had
the-- the records.

You said you had hired him.

You got him a job there.
Can I get 'em?"

And eventually,
it was a back and forth.

"Yes, we have 'em."

"No, we can't find 'em."

"No, we never had 'em."

I knew they were lying to me.

That really... is a key
moment for me

because I knew that
Los Alamos was lying to me.

And I knew that Kirk Meyer
was lying to me.

And it pissed me off.

He says he was hired
to work at an area called S4,

which is a few miles
south of Groom Lake.

At S4, he says,
are flying saucers,

antimatter reactors
and other working examples

of technology that is seemingly
beyond human capabilities.

Right. This-- this came
from somewhere else.

I mean, as bizarre as
that is to believe,

but I mean, it's there.
I saw it.

I know what the current
state of the art is and--

in-- in physics and it's--
it can't be done.

Groom Lake, Area 51.

The, uh, the installation
is surrounded

by the Groom Mountain Range

and there's a large dry
lake bed.

That's Groom Lake.

Just south of that is S4 and
Papoose Dry Lake.

The way it worked was they'd
call me at random days and

they'd say, "Mr. Lazar,
it is now such and such time.

We need you to come out today."

So I'd go out there.

I'd drive out to EG&G
Special Projects,

which was right in
McCarran Airport at that time.

I'd go through a
little security there

and then out on the tarmac

and board one of the
Janet flights.

They were only used
by the government

for going back and
forth to the test site.

Flight 363 Las Vegas Tower,

runway 26 right, line up
and wait, traffic downfield.

Flight 826 Ryder, I said.

1313 straight in at Bravo 5

and contact the ramp traffic
holds in position.

Hey, cross 26 right,
Bravo 5,

over to Rant House, 1330.

Now it's well known how
people get to Groom Lake.

The Janet planes are now
infamous, you know,

and the buses with the
blacked out windows.

But back then when Bob
first shared it with me

and we made it public,

the-- the general public had
no idea how that worked.

We put that out there.

Bob knew about it

and it would confirm, you know.

When I got to Area 51

off the plane and
into the facility,

there were very few people.

I just went into a--
a small building

and we had to sit down
across the desk from somebody

and they'd have a lot of papers
explaining what I was signing

and what I'm expected to do
and what I'm

expected not to talk
about, so on and so forth.

The next time I went out there,

they had a bus, a blue bus,

which was essentially a
Blue Bird school bus,

just painted navy blue
with the windows blacked out.

That I got onto with Dennis, who
was my supervisor at the time,

and we drove south to another
facility, now known as S4.

We're taken
by bus south of there.

The bus has the windows
blocked out of it

and they drive about

15, 20 minutes, something
like that, on a dirt road.

Every time I got on the bus,

I walked up and grabbed the

long chrome pole that's
right by the seat

and pretty much just
spun around and sat there

or close to the front.

Dennis always sat--
he never sat next to me,

he always sat across from me

and looked at me the whole time,

which was really uncomfortable.

Now, the windows were
blocked out, but

if I leaned forward, I can see
out the front window.

As we slowed down,
I could feel that we were--

we were slowing and turning
at the same time

when we came to
a stop.

When I got out of the bus,

I can see just desert around us.

I can see part of
Papoose Lake behind me

and then when I walked
around the front of the bus,

we were at the hillside and

Dennis was by me and all that
was in front of us was a door

and a security camera above it.

We're going into the facility
the first time.

It's a relatively small room
with a table and chair there.

There was a security guard
in the chair

and he acknowledged Dennis.

I walked in.

Behind him on the right,

there's the hand scanner.

First time I went in there
with Dennis,

obviously I had no badge,
it had to learn,

so we had to, you know,
train the machine,

but subsequent times when
I put my hand on there,

the light shines through
your hand and measures

the bones in your finger,

determines who you are

and your badge comes up
out of the slot.

Each door you have,
you have to swipe it

to get access to the room

and somewhere that records
the time you went in,

when you come out, etc.

On the front is a
picture of my face.

Uh, there is a big M.A.J.
written sideways on it.

I think they're locations

and they get-- they get
punched with a star

where you have access to them.

There's an employee number
on there.

There's a dark blue
and light blue

diagonal stripe
up in the corner.

The Department of Naval
Intelligence,

the stripes on the side.

And the s-- the
star punch that you saw...

Was on S4.

Yeah.

It's a long, desolate hallway,

for the most part, dimly lit.

Just a two-tone green
cinder block hallway.

Off to the right would be...
the nurse station,

which is just several steps
down that way.

But the main hallway,
when you open the door

and you look straight down,

pretty much goes
to a vanishing point.

It's a long, long hallway.

And you'll have doors
off to the left

that lead to the experimental
areas and the hangars.

Uh, the doors to the right
will be: bathroom and,

uh, the cafeteria, and then

once you pass the main hangar,
the big hangar,

I have no idea
what's past there.

There is a small medical
facility there.

Uh, it's the only female I saw,
ever, in the facility.

She explained that we are
potentially working with

a lot of unknown materials

and there could be sensitivities
or allergic reactions to them.

So she drew a small grid on the
bottom of my arm

and had a variety of

small needles with different
substances on them and

pricked a little area inside
each one of those squares,

uh, just to see, you know, if
I'd have any reaction to them.

I was also instructed
to drink this

liquid that I said
smelled like pine.

It's kind of an amber-colored
liquid, if I recall.

And, it did give me a reaction
that that evening,

I think I had stomach cramps.

But, I can't really say
that caused them.

You know, it's coincidental, so.

But I-- I can't
officially blame it on that.

When I first began at S4,

I would randomly be taken
into a small room,

which contained
a table, a chair,

and 120 or so briefings
in blue folders.

These reports appeared to be an
overview of alien information,

which could be used to brief
scientists from any field

about the scope
of the whole project,

and not just their specific
field of endeavor.

The file on top was
Project Galileo.

And as it turned out, that's
the project that I was part of.

And that clearly... referred
to reverse engineering

a recovered alien spacecraft.

My job in this program was to
be part of a back engineering
team.

Back engineering is the act of
taking a finished product

and tearing it apart to find
out what makes it tick.

The goal in this program
was to see

if the technology of the disc

could be duplicated with
Earth materials.

Dennis brought us into the lab.
He said,

"This is where you're gonna
be spending most of your time."

I can see it was a...
typical lab setup.

There was stuff, components,
everything all over the place.

And one guy in there,
Barry, who--

who got up immediately and was

clearly really happy to see me.

It seems like he used to work
with somebody else.

He had a lot to say,
he was excited

to show me everything and
bring me up to speed.

It was kind of like a
little kid at that point.

"Wait till you see this."

And, you know, he'd display

how the amplifier,

you know, operates connected
to the emitters and

how things operate, even though
they're not connected, and--

But yeah, he was... very anxious
to show me everything

and anxious to make
some progress too.

So this is where he said,

"We're focusing primarily on the

power and propulsion system
of the craft."

And I said, "Great,

w-- what... craft?"

I think he was holding off
intentionally,

telling me anything, because
what he wanted me to do

was to feel the gravitational
field on the reactor.

So he went over, he rotated the
emitter and the reactor was on.

He said, "Go ahead and
try and touch that."

And when I pushed
my hands on it,

that was the biggest
scientific shock I'd ever had

because there's nothing
in the world that can do that.

And he said, "That's what
propels the craft.

And that is a gravity
generator."

And that... was
the moment that...

I realized
what was going on.

Barry indicated that
what I saw there was

the propulsion system
in its entirety.

He started with the reactor and

the small hemisphere
on the plate.

said, "This is apparently
the power source."

To the left of that
on the ground

was what he referred to
as the amplifier.

And to the left of that

at 90 degrees, was a large pipe
looking object.

He said that was the emitter.

These function together
to produce

a gravity propulsion system.

The power base frequency was
created by the reactor.

The amplifier increased
its amplitude

and that was channeled
into the emitter

and focused or beamed,

wherever you want to
provide the propulsion.

Barry shut the system off
by rotating the emitter

and then he proceeded to
take apart the reactor to

show me it had components too.

When he did that,
you were able to touch

the hemisphere in the reactor,

remove the hemisphere and then
you can see a small tower

with a tube coming off of it.

That tower had a cap on it.

The cap slid off and inside...

was a triangular
piece of a...

...almost copper-colored...
material.

It had little slice marks on it

and that material turned out to
be element 115,

a super heavy element yet
to be discovered at the time.

To start up the reactor,
of course,

we need some element 115.

In fact, you need 223 grams,
which is just

under half a pound, machined
into a wedge like this.

And a piece of 115 this size
can be utilized as fuel

for a period of 20 to 30 years.

Element 115's melting point
is 1740 degrees Celsius

and its standard oxidation
state is plus 3.

The atomic radius of 115
is 1.87 angstroms.

The frequency of the carrier
wave for element 115's

gravity A wave is 7.46 hertz
at a one micron bandwidth.

This is the reactor,
and from what

we've been able to determine,
it's what powers the craft.

It's made of several components.

First is a removable hemisphere.

There's a tower,

and we'll call
our drift tube on the side,

a small cap,

that comes off,

and inside the tower...

...is what we think is the fuel,
element 115.

The fuel element is placed
inside the tower,

cap is placed on,

and then, as soon as the
hemisphere

makes a flat connection
to the base,

it'll create its own
gravitational field.

It becomes operational.

It will push your hands away

as soon as that's sat on there.

And the field is--
feels similar to... uh,

like poles of a magnet.

There's some elasticity to it.

You could push back on it
as hard as you want,

but-- and a--
a really important thing is

it's not transferring that force
to the base.

Even though this would move,

you can push on the field

and it wouldn't slide this.

I mean, if you had two magnets
with like poles

and you pushed on one,
the other one would go
sliding across the table.

That doesn't happen here.

Through X-rays,
we were able to determine

that there's a hollow tube

that goes around the base.

We assume that's something
like a cyclotron,

where particles are
accelerated around

and there's, if you wanna
call it an off ramp,

is the drift tube, comes up
and interacts in the tower

in some way to produce energy.

Now, this device doesn't produce
any heat at all.

It didn't produce one degree...
of temperature change,

no matter how much load
it was under.

To turn the reactor on...

...the-- all the components
in the craft

are connected in some way,

but not physically.

And we really don't know
how that is.

Um, if you take one
of the emitters

and you rotate it
past 20 degrees,

the reactor will turn on,

and you can no longer even
get your hands by it.

Conversely, to turn it off,
rotate... the emitter,

the reactor shuts down.

And assuming that's removing the
load from the reactor,

I think it's just load sensing.

It sees that the emitter and
amplifier wants power

and it turns on, but
the exact mechanism

that's taking place there is--
is completely unknown.

So I began to feel the field
about up here.

And at-- at this distance,
there's--

y-- there's no way you're moving
your hands any closer.

But, uh-- I guess the most
amazing thing is

leaning into it,
putting all your force on that,

no-- nothing moves at all.

And when the reactor's off,
you can easily slide it.

You know, so, that's--
that's really impressive.

We call this a gravity propelled
craft, a gravity generator.

And we're calling it
that because,

we know what--
we know the effects of gravity.

We know how it works.

Um, we don't know everything
about it, but...

...this produces an effect
similar to gravity.

So we're calling it that

because we don't know of
any other forces

that exist like that.

This could, of course, be

something other than gravity.

This could be a completely
other force

that we're just not
familiar with.

And we're just labeling it,
you know, as gravity propulsion,

a gravity field coming
off of here, uh,

just because that's all
we're familiar with.

Um, but...

keeping that in mind,

we tried to see if it was

possible to shield it

with, uh, different materials.

You know, we tried cardboard,
plastic, metal, everything.

And the field-- Eh--

The field
interacts with everything.

Um, and there's nothing really
that shields it.

So... um...

You know, it's-- again, it
behaves like

gravity does, but...

...it could certainly be
something else.

Part of the fear was based
in the fact that

they had said I was
replacing somebody

that was killed in the project.

They were being pressed to
produce some results.

And, I think,
from what I understand,

they cut into an
operating reactor

and it detonated.

It's not like it was a--

you know, a research project
where you're--

you're really into it.

It was-- it was exactly like
disarming a bomb...

...every single day.

That's what it was like,
because, a-- once again,

we had no idea what
we were working with.

And we were working with
absolutely tremendous

amounts of energy,

tremendous amounts of power,
in very condensed sources.

The slightest wrong move

could release a tremendous
amount of energy.

So as part of our investigation,

we go through all the
normal protocols.

We contact the U.S. Air Force
at Nellis.

I'm asking questions
about Area 51.

They won't answer any.

Um, later on, I asked them
about a place called S4.

I called the
Nellis Air Force Base,

with their public
information office,

somebody I had got to know
over the years,

"Do you have any place
called S4

on the Nellis Range?"

And the answer was yes.

And in fact, they said
there's more than one.

I said "Can you tell us
where it is?" "No."

"Can you tell us
what goes on there?" "No."

"But it's real?" "Yes."

And I asked them about
Papoose Lake.

"You got anything there?"
"No. Absolutely not."

"Nothing, ever." And I'd asked
people who worked out there,

anything at S4,
Papoose Lake. "Never, ever.

We don't even have a way to get
there. There's nothing there."

I knew that was not true.

You know, we eventually got
some satellite photos

that showed us there's a road
from Groom down to Papoose.

Why do you build a
road down there to

a place that doesn't exist
and there's nothing there?

The S4 installation is built
into the mountain,

and the hangar doors are
built on an angle

commensurate with
the slope of the mountain.

These doors are covered with
a sand textured coating

to blend in with the side
of the mountain and
the desert floor.

-So here's the entrance,
right here.
-Okay.

This is-- this is
the area where the--
the hangar doors are.

- Mm-hmm.
- -And then this is, let's say,

the side door, where
the mouse is here.

And as of the f--
25th of June 2024,

the terrain here is so, let's
call it beige or yellow,

- Mm-hmm.
- which was not like that.

Because if I click
on the timeline,

- you can go back in time in Google Earth.
- -Mm-hmm.

So... if I go just one notch,

- Mm.
- look at-- look at the difference

- in color of the terrain.
- Yeah, yeah-

That's the actual color.

And in the-- the 2022 version
of the satellite imagery,

you actually see detail here.

And if you get closer, you get--
you even see

- the Joshua trees and all that.
- Mm-hmm.

But if I bring
this back to the latest,

- look how-- Everything disappeared.
- -Everything disappears.

Which is clearly intentional.

But what it did is

you no longer-- so, you can
actually fade-- zoom out

you'll see this beige--

-Look how they--
-Oh, wow!

Isn't that in-- interesting?

Interesting.

-It's unbelievably intentional.
-It's-- it's unbelievable.

Look how incredibly--

-look how they
identified that area.
-Let's just pick

-Papoose Lake and fuck it up
-Yeah, did you-- you saw that?

-so you can't see anything.
-Yeah. So

- look at that.
- Yeah. It's just S4.

Exactly.

Isn't that something?

-Yeah.
-So now their mistake

is that as we zoom into
their washed out terrain

around the Papoose area
and about-- and around S4,

their new filter,
that they put in there

allows us to see...

- All right. Mm-hmm.
- the tracks,

- which you couldn't see earlier.
- Mm.

So now you have this
incredibly clear--

Yeah, they say where
no one ever drives, it's,

- it's to-- Yeah.
- Yeah.

And so you even have on
bordering the terrain area

and the actual dry lake,

if you get really close, you can

- Yeah, yeah.
- actually see the tracks.

Yeah, well, yeah, we
drove right along that dry lake.

That's unquestionably
where we were.

And so, interestingly,

we see the tracks,
which are literally

- right by S4.
- Yeah.

And then if you
go to this other road,

- see, there's a little road here.
- -Mm-hmm.

Okay, which is
very near S4 and we go here.

You can clearly see the tracks,
look at them

- going in every direction,
-Yeah, yeah.

and you--
look at all the-- the traffic.

- Yeah.
- Right?

Yeah, that's not one guy
driving around.

No, that's not
one guy dri-- exactly, so...

Again, there's
no public out there.

So, what are you doing? Yeah.

This is Google Earth,
so it's not like we're--

we're making this up.
This is online.

Anybody can actually go there
and actually do the timeline.

'Cause if I just click here
on 2022...

Oop, just let me do that.

- There. There you go.
- Yeah.

It's-- it's back to normal.

And now you can actually
see... the terrain.

Now we'll go into the more
interesting part

where...

there's a
series of photographs.

We already had gone through
this, about a year ago.

And there was a person who had

flown into the restricted
airspace out there

and had a very good quality
camera on board

-Mm-hmm.
-of his private plane,

and snapped about
eight to 900 images

of Area 51,
the Groom Lake facility,

Papoose mountain range,
Papoose Lake and all that area.

And-- and did
an incredible tour.

He even had the Nevada test site
where there's all the craters

of all the bombs that blew up.

And there's this picture,
that is publicly available.

It's been publicly available
now for over five years.

And this is a picture that was
taken at about 17 miles

from the Papoose Lake area,

where the hill is located, where

you said S4 was located.

Initially, the picture
was utilized

by a whole bunch of
people online saying,

"As you can see, whatever
Bob Lazar said was untrue.

-There's nothing there."
-Mm-hmm.

Obviously... the picture
doesn't show anything.

Well, all you have to do is
play with the contrast,

play with the-- the--

-the levels in the image.
-Mm-hmm.

And if you look carefully

in this version here,
where it's--

the contrast has been changed,

the-- as we zoom...

- ...look what you see.
- -Yeah, you can start seeing, uh...

- You see them clearly right there.
- -Yeah.

Yeah, the slanted
rectangular doors, yeah.

And what's
really interesting about it

is that if you look carefully...

They're like they're--
I mean, they're made

to not be visible.

-Yeah.
-So yeah, you wouldn't
expect them,

on a normal photo to show up.

I mean, they're trying to hide
them from satellite photos.

So, but, um, yeah, this seems to
be an effective way

of bringing that resolution out.

And if you look carefully,

the first one is slightly wider.

-Oh, that's a good point.
That's a big hangar.
-Then, that's--

Yeah. Hey,
that's a really good point.

-Look at that.
-Yeah, you can actually see it.

-Yeah.
-Look at the difference

between the-- the first one

and the second and the third.

-Yeah! I've never seen that.
-Yeah.

-Yeah. That's--
That's pretty cool.
-Yeah.

So it doesn't provide
the world evidence that

there were flying saucers there

-or it doesn't say--
-No, of course not.

Yeah. But it-- it is
incredibly interesting

that the image shows pretty much
exactly what you had said

- Mm-hmm.
- in 1989.

And if you hadn't been there,
and you hadn't seen that,

then you predicted something
that was pretty amazing.

Yeah. Yeah. Well, you could say
that about a lot of stuff.

I said-- yeah, yeah, right.

Everything I say just happens
to be the way it is.

But, uh, yeah, that's--
that's fascinating.

The second time
I went out to the site,

the bus, as it arrived
at the S4 facility

did not make the left turn
and slowed down.

It stopped in front of the hill.

And when I got out of the bus
and walked around to the front,

I can see a full view
of where we were working.

And this time I can see there
was a large hangar door open

in the side of the hill.

Inside the hangar door... was...

the sport model,
the flying saucer.

The first thing that went
through my mind is,

"Well, this explains all
the silly UFO reports

where we are making
a secret fighter

that's in the shape
of a flying saucer.

And... that's all
there is to it."

We walked into the hangar and
I was instructed to walk

with my eyes forward and

just enter the door at
the end of the hangar.

I slid my hand along
the side of the craft,

got reprimanded right
away for doing that.

But the craft itself had a part
of the hatch was removed, or...

I guess it's the entire hatch.

And you could see
right next to the hatch,

there was a backwards
American flag stuck on there.

Again, that kind of cemented
into my mind,

"Well, this is an
American product."

Why they put the backwards
American flag

on there, I'll never know.

But, um, anyway, we continued in

and, uh, I went into the lab
from there.

But that was the first time I
ever had contact with the craft.

Barry was showing me how, uh,

the field comes out
of the emitter

and what it can do.

And he took a
regular kitchen candle,

lit it, and he put it
near the mouth

of the, uh-- the emitter.

And...

when he rotated the emitter...

...the flame stopped flickering.

It just stood like it was a
photograph of itself.

Barry said, you know,

"What do you think is
unusual about that?"

I said, "Aside from the fact the
candle's not moving anymore?"

And he said,
"Just think about it."

I said, "Yeah, it's still

emitting light,
and it's not moving.

So the photons
are still moving."

But again, if it's
a gravity wave

coming out of there,
gravity bends light.

It should look distorted.

I should-- I should either
not be able to see it

or the whole image of it
gets bent or distorted, but,

how can the flame stop moving

and it still be emitting
light without any distortion?

So, these are some of the things
that really made me think,

"It's not a gravity wave.

There's something else
'cause it's not behaving

exactly like that."

So-- and also he
removed the candle

and then rotated the emitter.

I don't know if it was
another direction

or more of the same way,

but it made a little
black ball in the air

where no light was
esca-- escaping,

looking like a little
black hole.

But no, you could just tell
there was no light

at the focal point,
right in the air.

It was just, uh, a dark area.

So there it's affecting light,

but it wasn't in the
candle test before that.

So, it--

it's a really unusual,
unusual thing.

One time in particular that we
got somewhat mischievous,

we had a reactor operating
and the field

that develops around it
is somewhat elastic.

So, you can take and try and

push on the hemisphere with your
hands and you can't--

can't touch it. It repels like--

like poles of a magnet,
but somewhat elastic.

So, to demonstrate this,
Barry had a golf ball.

He threw it at the reactor,
and it didn't hit it.

It rebounded off and then
knocked the ceiling tile loose,

which we immediately panicked

because we knew Dennis
was coming back in.

So we had to scramble to replace
the ceiling tile and

clean up all the little
fragments of

particles that dislodged
from it.

I heard it a couple times
"Meet me in the big hangar."

And I don't remember if
it was Dennis or Barry

that also referred to where
the sport model was.

That hangar was the big hangar.

The hangar that housed
the sport model

was like a typical
airplane hangar

with the exception
of the angled

doors that
I mentioned before.

This hangar was equipped
with typical tools

and extensive electronic
equipment.

It also had a machine with
an X-ray emblem on it

and an overhead crane
rated at 20,000 pounds.

Equipment in this hangar was
marked with a black number 41

with a white circle around it.

Well, the hangar was lit by
mercury vapor lights.

I don't--
cone-shaped lights.

There was a countless number
of them on the ceiling.

Um, in addition to those, there
were, uh, tripod halogen lights,

dual head halogen lights set up.

And those really provided
a lot of bright light

for working close up and,

uh...
those were a lot more

useful than the overhead lights.

I had at least partial views

of the nine different discs
out at S4.

But the one I'm going to
describe to you now

is the one in which
I not only saw

two of the three
interior levels,

but I also saw it fully
functional in flight.

This particular disc appeared
to be in excellent condition.

And because of its
sleek appearance,

I nicknamed it
"The sport model."

Now, previously I had estimated
the sport model to be

about 15 feet high and
about 40 feet wide.

But since then I've
enlisted some expert help

from the field of
computer imaging.

And together we've
scaled the disc up

from the size of components
which I had a close look at

and could accurately
establish their actual size.

From this analysis
I'm now presenting to you

the most accurate
information I can convey

regarding the disc's
physical structure.

The sport model is 16 feet tall

and 52 feet 9 inches
in diameter.

The exterior skin of
the disc is metal,

which is the color of
unpolished stainless steel.

The sport model sits on its
belly when it's not energized

and not the stereotypical
tripod legs

that folklore usually
associates with
this type of craft.

As you can see the entry hatch

is located on the upper
half of the disc

with just the bottom
portion of the door

wrapping around the
center lip of the disc.

The interior of the disc is
divided into three levels.

The lower level is where
the three gravity emitters

and their wave guides
are located.

These are the
integral components

of the propulsion system

that are used to amplify
and focus the gravity "A" wave.

The reactor is located
directly above the three
gravity emitters

on the center level, and is in
fact, centered between them.

The center level of the disc
houses the amplifier heads

as well as the seats which
were too small and

too low to the floor
to be functional

for adult human beings.

The walls of the
center level are all

divided into archways.

At one point in time when
the disc was energized

one of the archways
became transparent

and you could see
the area outside of it,

just as if the archway
was a window.

Then a form of writing,

which was unlike any
alphabetic, scientific,

or mathematical symbols
I've ever seen,

began to appear on one side
of the transparent archway.

I was never given access to
the upper level of the disc

so I can't enlighten you as to
what the porthole-like
areas are

other than that, I can assure
you, they're not portholes.

Any time... I was in
the big hangar

my eyes were always focused
right on the sport model.

There could have been fires
going on on either side of me

and I would still have been
looking at it.

It-- It was that captivating.

When I was close to
the sport model,

I really focused on
the skin of the craft.

What it looked like,
how it changed, the color.

It has a small antenna looking
device which is actually

a waveguide, that protrudes
from the top.

It is like a pewter gray
in color.

It appears to be metal.

I felt it. It's cold.

It may not be. It might be some
advanced ceramic of some type.

So the body of the craft
had ripples.

The-- one of them we call
the insulation ring.

It was a dark black color.

The only thing on the outside

that was a different color
than the craft.

We call it the insulation
ring because

when the craft is in operation

there is a high voltage
detectable on--

on the skin of the craft,

but that high voltage is not
present above that ring.

The upper part of the craft
above the insulation ring

were what we call
the planar arrays.

Flat window-looking,
porthole-looking openings
in the craft.

They-- they were unusually dark.

Really dark. Almost looked like
holes, although there weren't.

It was theorized that they were
used to determine the craft's

location in space.

Each one of them,
looking out in space

apparently looking at star
positions or whatever e--

energy or light it uses to
locate its place.

Each one looking in a
different direction and then

some sort of computer, uh,

in the upper level that
takes that data

and figures out its location.

Again, I may be
completely wrong,

or the people that came up with
that may be completely wrong

but I would agree with that
just looking at it, that--

that it has to be something
along those lines.

I walked up to the stairs

that led to the entrance
of the craft.

I remember, climbing the stairs,
how excited I was,

to finally get to see
what's inside the craft.

When I got to the top of the
stairs I can clearly see

the reversed American flag
to my left.

The hatchway is
fairly small and I put

my hands on both sides of
it to bend down to go inside

and when I did, my hand was near

the reversed American flag so
I noticed the exact size,

it was just a little more than
a span, a little more than

you know, as far as
my fingers stretched

and I glanced down and
looked at the security guard

who was staring at me and
just kind of gave him a smile,

and, you know,
proceeded into the craft.

I was shocked at how sparse the
inside of the craft was.

Everything was the same color,
the same texture,

and it all appeared to be
the same material.

Virtually everything had a
radius of curvature to it

and everything looked like
it was molded together,

with the exception
of the reactor.

Even though there were
two tripod lights set up

inside the craft,
it was still very dark.

I've often described the
interior of the craft

as being very ominous.

I got to look inside and it had

really small chairs and
I think that was the first...

...confirmation I had,
that was just a shocking thing

because it-- every time before
that I was able to label it

"Well this is just...

...oh, a little advance that
a group of

scientists had
formed and, you know, they're

keeping it secret"
and, "Yeah, we could have built

a big disc like that,
that's no problem and

you know, we could have adapted
these to make it fly," but...

...why does it have little
furniture inside?

Essentially a little seat
and now and it--

And things began to click
together just all too fast.

I was in there with
my lab partner Barry

and there was also another team
working elsewhere in the craft.

While going over
the reactor placement

Barry drew my attention
to the archways

that all surrounded
the interior of the craft

explaining they were hollow,
and actually waveguides.

The waveguide, which...

terminates, is the antenna
looking object from the top.

Yeah, that kind of folds
down on itself so it

extends and retracts and that
sits on the top of the reactor

that essentially channels
the gravity wave up there

and into the superstructure
around the craft

so it's dispersed evenly.

While we were working
next to the reactor

I got a really good look
at the three seats

or what we assumed to be seats,

that were far too small to be
usable by an adult human.

You know, if you look
at the seats

what I call the seats,
the placement,

one of them,
the waveguide in the reactor

is directly in front of a seat.

Why would you ever do that?

I mean, either...
the guy that sits in that seat

is on reactor watch and
he just sits there and

makes sure everything
runs the all but...

it doesn't make any--
and that's the only one

that faces directly at the
panel that became transparent.

While we were working
on the reactor

I saw one of the archways
become completely transparent,

where I could see
outside the craft.

This immediately
caught my attention

and as I focused on it

half that archway turned
an opaque blue,

and black symbols
began to appear

on that blue portion
of the archway.

I'd never really seen
symbols like that before,

but my closest analogy to it

would be... Korean writing.

The symbols themselves
were not completely static.

They were slowly tilting
back and forth.

While that archway had my
attention, my lab partner Barry

whispered my name to me

to get my attention back to
where it belonged.

When I was in the craft... and

I was kneeling down by
the reactor and looked up at

the screen, Barry just said,

"Bob, Bob,"

you know, like,
"What are you doing?"

"That's not you," you know,
"look down here,"

which is what broke
my attention, to go there.

But yeah, and-- but when he--
my point was when he said it,

he-- he just kind of
whispered it.

It's like-- it's like you're
in a library,

- you know, so there's no--
- Mm.

no loud talking.
"Hey Bill,

get me--"
you know, it's just like...

So, I don't know the reasoning
behind that, but you know,

it's-- it's like a library.

I can see that the craft had
been worked on before

and probably for
quite some time.

One of the amplifiers had been
cut out with a plasma cutter.

Other teams were working
on the skin of the craft,

and there were lights, extension
cords, and other equipment

that were all over
the inside of the craft.

You had noticed
that one of the amplifiers

had been cut out of the craft.

Yeah.

You know, you said

"They must have
really been sure."

You had to been a hundred
percent confident,

that... you weren't gonna
ruin the operation of anything

if you went to the
lenghts to remove

an entire amplifier
out of the craft.

Now... look,

once you remove that out,

the craft can't operate in--
in Delta mode anymore,

which makes you wonder
if they did that...

intentionally, so it couldn't
operate in that mode, you know,

kind of the equivalent of
clipping a bird's wings,

keeping it, you know, so it

can't fly away anywhere.

Somewhere, someone, and probably
certainly more than one person,

uh, a group of people
agreed that,

"Let's go take that out,"

and they had a damn good
reason to do it.

But they must have been
absolutely convinced,

they knew what was going on.
Removed it.

Moved it into the lab,

and they were still able to
operate the craft without it.

So, that uh-- clearly a lot
went on before I got there.

At one point, Barry instructed
me to go behind the seats

and pointed towards a small

honeycombed hatchway,
flush with the floor.

We both crawled over
to the hatchway,

and Barry showed me where to put
my finger in and pull backwards,

and... the little honeycombed
hatchway collapsed,

leaving an opening in the floor,

big enough to
barely squeeze through,

and look down into
the lower level.

I was able to get the upper part
of my body into the hatchway,

and got a good view of the
three emitters, hanging below.

The lower level was very dark.

There was just enough
light coming in,

under the entrance hatchway,
to see the emitters

and the lower part of the craft.

The emitters were the only
things that were

a-- a different color.

They were black.

The bottoms of them...
were hollow

and you could see

some sort of copper
colored plates inside there.

They were hung by
large diameter tubes,

maybe three inches or so,

just like the waveguide

that extends down
onto the reactor.

When all three of the
amplifiers are being
used for travel,

they're in the Delta
configuration.

And when only one is
being used for travel,

it's in the Omicron
configuration.

So as far as propulsion,

the craft operates in
two different modes,

called Omicron and Delta.

Omicron meaning one and
Delta meaning three,

and that's referring to
how many of the amplifiers and

emitters are being used.

So in Omicron configuration, the
craft lifts off the ground

using one amplifier
and one emitter.

The other two emitters
can swing all the way up to

180 degrees out the side
of the craft,

and what that does
is cause distortion

in space and kind of
forces the craft

to fall into that distortion.

Kind of the opposite of the way
our aircraft work.

Instead of throwing material
out the back,

this causes some
sort of distortion

in front of it,
where it's drawn into.

The other mode of operation,
Delta configuration,

is really used when the craft
is outside the atmosphere

where it's sitting in
free space.

In that mode, the craft rotates
on its side.

It does a belly roll, and faces
the bottom of the craft

towards the destination.

The three emitters,
in the bottom of the craft,

focus on the destination.

They're brought up to power
and the craft makes a jump.

Now, the amplifiers don't
operate on a continuous fashion.

They pulse.

They produce a pulse of energy

and then require a recycle time.

It's somewhere around
10 milliseconds

or something like that,

but... then they essentially
can fire again

and make another jump.

So, in traveling to

a distant location,

the craft will make
several jumps.

It's never just one long jump,
you know,

across the galaxy or
something like that.

It's just a series of jumps
and that's--

that's how it moves.

When it arrives to where it is,

it'll get close to
the destination,

switch over to Omicron mode,

and... set down or cruise
around or whatever its plan was.

As I went through the other
folders, there was, uh,

another project called Sidekick,
which dealt

with any weapon potential
of this spacecraft.

That was w--
weapons applications,

and I knew a little bit
more about that.

That was because the-- the
gravity amplifiers were used

as a-- a collimating device to--
I mean, to-- to narrow the beam

of something that appeared to be
like a particle weapon.

And it seemed to be dealing
with an accelerated particle

of some kind that was focused
or held in place,

and prevented from dispersing by
the gravity amplifiers,

by the emitters, actually.

Project Looking Glass
had to do with using the...

gravity amplifiers
to distort time.

And, you know, th--
this isn't implying that

they were trying
to make a time machine,

but they were trying to create
a time differential,

whether it was in milliseconds
or fractions of a second.

But it had--
it had to do just with...

...that force distorting time.

Now, I mean, we weren't
a 100% sure that...

that was even gravity
what we were dealing with.

But anyway, the group that was
working on that was

attempting to see if that can
distort the flow of time.

The information in the overview
of Project Galileo
was accurate.

I read the overview and
later witnessed evidence

which proved it to be accurate.

So it is possible that

scientists involved
with other projects,

could have seen evidence
that these

other overviews were accurate.

But I can't make that
assertion.

To me, these reports were
simply words and pictures
on paper.

The hangars are all
connected together

and there are large bay
doors between each one.

And, uh, there were nine
total that I saw.

Uh, each one being different.

I was in the lab with Barry and
Dennis came in and said,

"We're conducting a test flight,
why don't you guys come out?"

We left the lab through
the side door,

which leads directly into
the-- the large hangar.

And when I opened the door,

all the doors between the
hangars were open.

And I looked down and I saw how
big the installation was

and that there were other craft,

in those other hangars.

I couldn't see very far because
they weren't well lit,

but it did go on
for quite a ways.

In the hanger adjacent to the
sport model was another craft

that sometimes I refer to as the

jello mold or the--
the bundt cake.

It looks like a bundt cake mold
without the hole in the middle.

It appeared to be made
of the same material

as the sport model, same color,
same sheen.

I couldn't see much
going on with it.

Again, this was just
a single glance.

The other craft looked like
a top hat or a straw hat,

straw carnival hat, uh,
with a large brim on it.

This one, same color,
same sheen,

apparently the same material,

also slightly smaller than
the sport model.

But this one wasn't laying flat
on the ground.

It was leaning on the wall.

And, what was interesting
about this one,

it had a hole,

in the side of the brim,
if you wanna call it that,

as if it was shot from
underneath with a projectile,

'cause you could see some
of the metal bent outward.

The craft was already outside
of the hangar.

There were some researchers and
some other security personnel

standing at the opening
to the hangar.

Everybody was looking
at the craft.

There was, uh, what appeared
to be a VHF radio

because what caught
my attention was

they were in communication
with someone in the craft

and... they were using
a conventional

VHF radio... to talk to them.

And I believe it was in the 140
or 150 megahertz bandwidth

because it said
right on the radio.

And knowing how
the craft worked,

it would be impossible
for it to receive

a radio signal through the
gravitational field.

I mean, it even--
it bends light around it.

There's no way a radio wave is
getting inside the craft,

yet they were talking,
uh, to it.

So I was really
perplexed by that

and for a minute just
focused on that

and looked at the craft and
wondered,

"You know, obviously there's
something I'm not getting here."

Dennis instructed me to
go out and I stopped,

looked at the craft that was
sitting on there and

began to lift off
the ground silently.

There was a little hiss from
a corona discharge,

kind of a bluish purplish
glow at the bottom,

uh, which dissipated
as it took off.

Once it was sitting in the air,

Dennis instructed me
to go further.

And I went out.

I didn't look up. I was just

walking forward and then looked
up under the craft

and I looked back at--

at Dennis and he motioned me
to come back.

And I started walking back.

I saw his hand go up...

...and he set the indicators for
me to look up and I looked up,

and the craft wasn't there.

And I looked over at Dennis

and he-- he s-- he motioned
for me to go-- go back

and I-- I looked and
as I moved forward,

the craft comes into view.

So you-- you could actually see
the photons bending around

the gravitational envelope
the-- of the craft.

You can see the sky
above the craft

bending and as you walk by,
it comes into view

and then out of view.
It's really--

It's-- It really leaves an
impression.

It's a pretty impressive
thing to see.

The hope was ...that...

...even something small
and insignificant,

what we would think
is insignificant,

but something small
that we can grasp,

if we really understood it...

...as opposed to
a big, complicated--

you know, like the entire
propulsion system.

But if you can find
a single piece and...

just understood exactly
how that worked and how

their science works, that
that would be the key

and it would-- the rest would
all fall down like dominoes.

Like, "Oh, we-- we got it."

You know, it's like...

You know, I have an
understanding of transistor

and then, "Oh, that's how-- and
a group of these makes an

integrated circuit and then an
array of these

and it's in the memory and
computer, I would--

We got it. It's-- It's done."

So we were hoping for that
chain reaction to take place.

Maybe it has, but, um, you know,
when I was there, it was just--

we wanna focus on some small

aspects of it,
and see what happens.

Right, they had a poster
and it looked like a

commercial poster almost,
like it was lithographed

and you could buy it at
a K-mart or something,

but they were all over the
place and it had the--

the disk that I coined the
term, the sport model

was lifted off the ground about
three feet at-- at, uh, area S4

on the dry lake there, and, uh,

the caption on the bottom said,
"They're here."

Looked like a commercially
printed poster

with the sport model
above the desert

floor that said,
"They're here" on it.

I-- I can't fathom
why they did that.

Or for-- Or where they did it,

but... it was there.
It was there.

Somebody made it,
"They're here" poster.

You know, I even-- I went up to
it and stopped and walked back

and looked at it and felt it.

And it was just--
it was just a poster.

And I-- I st-- to this day,
I can't imagine why

they did that,
but I wish I had one.

They were--
They were pretty cool.

This technology that you've
learned about thus far

was brought here by
some alien beings

from the Zeta Reticuli
1 and 2 star system.

Zeta Reticuli is a
binary star system,

which means it has two
stars and is located

approximately 38 light years
from Earth.

These beings are from
Reticulum 4,

which is the fourth planet
out from Zeta 2 Reticuli.

This is the way star systems

were referred to
in these reports.

They simply designate
the name of the star

and then number the
planets from the nearest

to the furthest from the star.

Our star, the Sun, was
designated as Sol,

and the Earth was referred to
as Sol 3,

because we're the third
planet out from the Sun.

These beings said that
man was the product

of externally corrected
evolution.

They said that man as a species

had been genetically
altered 65 times.

They referred to humans
as containers,

yet I don't know what
we're containers of.

These beings said that
they had been

visiting Earth
for a long time

and presented photographic
evidence

which they contended was

over 10,000 years old.

There was an exchange of
hardware and information

in central Nevada until 1979,

at which time there
was a conflict

which brought the program
to an abrupt halt.

The beings left, but were to
return at a 1623 date

and I don't know what
that date is.

With the remaining hardware
and information,
the U.S. government

started the
Back Engineering Program.

The parts that Bob read
that he was

least willing to talk to me
about, even back then,

that they had been involved
with our-- our DNA,

with our evolution as a species,

that they've been
tinkering along the way.

That's pretty disturbing stuff.

It-- It is disturbing stuff.

Gene Huff brings that up a lot.

I mean, I don't talk about it--

The main reason is because

when Barry and I did discuss
about their reports,

he said, "Take everything
with a grain of salt,

because they'll, you know,
intentionally inject

ridiculous things in there.

So if anything ever gets out,
they know exactly

who to track it back to."

There were references
to, you know, beings

or pilots or

whatever, and it s--
some entities that were

related to the craft,
but they were always

referred to as "the kids."

In the documentation,

you saw some pictures of--
of some creature,

an autopsy of some type.

Yeah, I did.
I saw, some sort--

if you even wanna call it some
sort of autopsy report.

- I don't know what a normal
-Yeah.

autopsy report looks like,
but...

Yeah, it had to do with a-- a
photograph and drawing of a

dead creature, with the chest
cut open in a T fashion,

the skin peeled back, and what
appeared to be one large

organ as opposed to a bunch
of smaller ones, as if,

I believe I said it before,

as if all the organs in our body
just grew together

and operated as one unit.

That's what it looked like.

And that's what it referred to.

The beings themselves are three
to four feet tall

and weigh 25 to 50 pounds.

Their bodies would
most closely resemble

a human toddler's torso,

if the child was emaciated
from hunger.

They have grayish skin
with large heads

with almond-shaped
wraparound eyes.

They have very slight nose,
mouth and ear positions

and are essentially hairless.

I believe I was leaving
the hangar

and walked up and glanced
through the window of one of the

other do-- doors as I was
proceeding down the hallway.

And what I saw was

two technicians or scientists
looking down

and had either one of the seats
or a model of one of the seats

with what I thought was a doll,

like a small creature or
something like that,

something that would be
designed to fit.

And I think they were
just sizing up

what kind of creature would sit
in a seat that size.

From what I understood, there
were Russians working there

right before I got
to the project.

And apparently there was some
big discovery made.

I-- I don't know what
it had to do with

or what project it
had to do with,

but it was a big deal.

And as soon as we
found that out,

we stopped the Russians
from working with us.

I mean, they were kicked
out of sight and, uh...

whatever cooperation we had

going on came to an end.
To me,

obviously Russia had
something we needed.

They must have had some other...

ET information, um,
some technology

maybe that was
compatible with this.

Maybe they had some other
craft or parts or some--

They had something
that we wanted,

where we'd go to the in--
unbelievable length

of allowing them,
not just the information,

but to be on site with us, so,

there-- there had to be
a good reason to do that.

Dennis instructed me
one day that

I'd be taking a piece
of element 115

to Los Alamos National Labs,
in New Mexico.

I left on one of their planes
from the test site

and while on the plane,

I was looking through
the documentation

and that's where I noticed, that
they had a code name for it.

It was LA-1000

and it was classified as
a new armor material.

And that's all that the
people at Los Alamos

were supposed to know,
that they were just machining

an armor material.

So I had to remain there,

while they were machining
the material

and return, with not
just the material,

but any waste material or
shavings back to S4.

The strange thing is
how it was packed.

It was packed in aerogel.

At the time,
I had never seen aerogel.

I had never heard of aerogel.

It's... essentially
silicon dioxide.

It's-- It's the
lightest known solid.

It's 98% air.

Why it was packed in this
material, I have no idea.

This contained-- had a
cutout for the 115 in it,

and then that was
inside of a lead case.

I can't explain why it was
packed that way at all.

You went public in the 1980s

and even in the interview with
George, you said you

had a piece of element
115 in a puck

with an X on it, or a plus on it

with a laser pointed at it.

Now, that was something that you
could have said,

"Yeah, I got a piece of
plutonium in my pocket."

- You know... and it's not true.
- Yeah.

- You know what I mean?
- -Right.

Because you did
say you had a piece back then

- and then you never said it again.
- -Yeah.

But you stopped saying it

because it was just like, just--

Yeah, I stopped
saying it because, yeah,

I had it too close to me.

Bob made sure to have the, uh--

the gel stuff in a
beaker and back.

- Yeah, aero-- the aerogel.
- Aerogel.

It was something
like pointing the

particle accelerator

at the 115 in a pocket,

with a target on it.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That was real.

That was real.

I know 115 doesn't exist

and a stable form of it is
non-existent and nobody's ever

seen it and the only wispy piece
of it that we've got now,

it only lasts microseconds

and then it's gone,
and it's radioactive.

Nothing like the stable form

that, uh, he describes
has been found by humans.

But he had a piece of it
and I don't care

whether people believe it
or not, he did.

And I saw an experiment
at his house, uh,

with a cloud chamber that
seemed to bend light.

Now, I'm not a physicist,
but it looked like it was

bending light to me and
that was impressive.

I know that when Bob thought
he was gonna die,

that he was gonna be killed
and there was good reason

for him thinking that.

He had that piece of 115 in this

pewter round disc thing

in front of his particle
accelerator

with an X in the middle
and if he was gonna go,

they were going with him.

I became concerned
as the days went on.

There were always cars parked
across from my driveway,

and normally there's
nothing there.

There's no traffic

and even driving places,

I was always being followed.

Even when my friend
and I went to the gym,

even he noticed wherever
we stopped,

a car would follow us anywhere.

I began to get a little
concerned and

took a few of my closest
friends, and told them,

"The job I had at the test site,

I want you to see
what's going on."

Working with Barry,
it became obvious

he had something
to do with

the test flight schedule.

And in-- on one occasion, he was
sitting across from me

and had a list of the test
flights, the dates,

the duration, and-- and exactly
what was going on.

I saw him working on it
and read it upside down,

seeing that every day
was a Wednesday.

And I asked him what it was,
he said

it was the test flight schedule.

And I said,
"What's with Wednesday?"

And he mentioned that
Wednesday was-- statistically,

was the least amount of traffic

on the adjacent highway
to the test site.

So there'd be the
least number of eyes

when they were
testing the craft.

So I knew when one
of the test flights was.

On a Wednesday night,
gathered everyone together,

we went out there, and
exactly at the prescribed time,

the craft rose up over
the ridge of mountains.

Everyone got to see it
maneuver and perform

and basically told everybody
what I was doing.

We rented a car, took my wife,
a few friends, and

drove out to this--
this place and...

turned the lights out and snuck
into a little area, and, uh--

uh, we all watched it.

A month before he ever
took us out there, you know,

they had him at arm's length
not calling him back to work

and he was suspicious about it.

You know, I knew what
he was doing and--

and I was looking at all the...

history, what happened in Russia
and the United States.

I said, "Man, I wanna be where
it's happening right now."

Bob says, "What are you doing
on Wednesday night?"

I go, "Nothing,"
because he knows

they're testing on
Wednesday night.

Well, my name's Gene Huff.

I'm a real estate appraiser.

I've lived in Las Vegas
for 44 years.

Been a real estate appraiser
about 40 years of that.

You know, for-- for someone just
watching this who doesn't know,

I'm sure they-- for them to
believe what I'm going to say,

they wanna know
something about me.

I've never been arrested

or convicted of any crime.

I've been a real estate
appraiser for 40 years.

There's never been one
complaint against me.

So as just a normal citizen,
I'd say I'm pretty upstanding.

I have had speeding tickets
in the past, though.

That's-- that's about
my biggest crime.

Gene Huff was the person
at the time, that I confided in

almost on a daily basis.

When I came back from S4,

I would tell Gene kind of
what happened.

You know, I was really concerned
about talking to anybody else.

And I just-- you know,
I picked Gene,

who was the closest friend
at that time in Las Vegas.

When he took us out
there, we went in Lear's RV.

It was Bob and his wife
and Lear and me and, uh--

We saw what we
could later identify

as a flying disc because
it has...

novel movements in the sky.

Helicopters and blimps and
airplanes don't do this.

You know, it-- it can float
around very softly

and then dart up
here and then be here.

And then you wouldn't
even see it move.

And now it's down here.

It moved around.
It did a step move.

It actually went up in the air
like this and hovered,

then dropped way down.

Then it just floated around
and cruised around.

And then it started coming up
the mountain range.

But again, I couldn't have said
that was a flying saucer.

It was an anomalous thing.

And-- and of course, Bob said
there's a static charge

that dances around
on the skin of the disc.

And as the disc gets
further powered up,

the brighter this discharge is.

When the craft is energized,
there's a-- a high
DC voltage on it.

That's just always
present there.

We knew there was
high voltage visually

when the craft takes off, but
it-- that it just appears to be

a byproduct of the way
the reactor's working.

So anyway, we did see, you know,
jumping around and Lear

had a good shot at it through--
through a telescope.

Good evening.
This is John Lear.

And today is March 22nd, 1989.

We're standing just about, uh,
eight miles due east of

Groom Lake, Nevada, the super
government, uh,
secret test site.

And just a few minutes ago,
we saw one of the government,

uh, extraterrestrial UFOs
fly over there.

Uh, we all watched it
for about, uh,

seven or eight minutes.

Right here, I have my
Celestron scope.

Uh, it's eight, uh, inches.

And I had, uh-- I had it
focused in for about 15
seconds

and saw for myself that in
fact, it was a disc.

We're going to,
uh, stay here for another

couple hours here to see
if we can show you folks,

uh, an actual, uh,
extraterrestrial flying saucer

being,
uh, flown by the government.

Okay, good luck.

No way, did you see
that move it did?

- No, I didn't.
- It was like--

it kept going, woo woo.

- Wow, look how bright it's getting.
- Look at it now.

- It's getting bright.
- Not bright enough for me to get the time of day.

Hey, hold on right here.

So is this the first time on
camera we're gonna talk about

what we actually saw the

second time out there,
me and you and Jim?

- Yeah. Yeah.
- Okay.

So this is going to be
the exposure.

- Yeah. That's right.
- You're gonna be the first
one to get this.

Two weeks later,
he takes us out there.

This must be...
April, whatever it was.

And it's Jim Togliani,
Bob, his wifey and me.

This time, we see the elliptical
shaped light down

by the mountains, which
would be the south of us.

And there it is.
And we can tell that,

"Look, we've seen it before."

And then without seeing it
move at all,

suddenly it's halfway between
us and the mountain range.

And then suddenly
it's much closer to us.

I'd say 75 yards away and
150 feet up in the air, maybe.

During the test flight,
when the craft rose up,

it made very abrupt moves
to the left and right,

and then, made a very
dramatic move toward us.

And I remember Gene Huff
looking at it,

even took a step back going,

"Oh my God," because it just--

it came from such a great
distance to so close so quickly.

Did that a couple of times.
I mean, to the point

it glowed extremely bright
when it did it.

In fact, so much so they
backed up behind the car

because they thought it might
explode or something.

So now after it jumps down
close to us,

it starts glowing brighter
and brighter and brighter.

And then what we never told
anybody until now,

it disappeared.

Now, this is all silent, by the
way, there's no noise.

And it was just gone.

Now, we did later see it
floating around

and go back down by the
mountains, by Papoose and...

it's like a-- like the movies,

it drops down behind the
mountains.

This was a thing that Bob
could not effect.

He had no idea that there
was gonna be a disk

out by way 375 that would come
that close to us,

power up and disappear
for all practical purposes.

He couldn't have made that
happen unless he was

in cahoots with somebody at S4.

But even then,
they wouldn't have known

where we were and
when we were there, and--

I still pose the question, is,
"Did they see us?"

Bob couldn't have
been working at--

at the lunchroom at Area 51.

And I just believe everything
he says,

and this would have happened.

He couldn't make it happen.

That proved, and I believed it
before that, but that proved,

uh, that's empirical evidence.

I saw a craft to do that,
thanks to him.

And it can't be denied,

but that's presuming
they believe me.

We got caught out there.

Uh, there were--

we got stopped by--
initially by the guards

that are out in that
area, uh, that

John Lear spoke about.
He was with us.

Then stopped right afterwards
by the sheriff who...

...I guess,
called in all our names

from our driver's licenses and
social security numbers,

whatever they do,
into Area 51 out there.

Yeah, we went out there
two or three times.

So we'd go out there in the dark

and you can't see your hand
in front of your face.

And we'd pull out there,
stand around.

And we're-- the first time
we were as quiet as possible.

By the second or third time,

we were making noise
and joking around and...

unbeknownst to us,
they had seen us pull up there.

We're going down the first road
in the Area 51.

We just went there
to park to see

if we could see
what was going on.

Then the Wackenhut guards,
who are the guys that guard

the outside of the base,
were watching us.

But we-- we didn't know it.

We're out there with
a telescope and

video cameras, and...

You know, Bob points
out that there's a

green light down
there on the road.

And then the green light
dropped from, like,

head level down to
the ground.

And we realized those were
night vision goggles.

And somebody just dropped their

night vision goggles
and we saw it.

There was five or six
security personnel there.

And one of them dropped
a night vision scope.

And we just saw it rolling down
the road to us going,

"What is that?"

And then when they saw they
dropped it,

they turned
the lights on, and...

everyone was there.

There were cars and
a lot of guys.

So it was, uh-- it was
very shocking.

But yeah, that's when we got
discovered.

You know, the consensus was,
if they find me,

there's gonna be big trouble.

So if I take off
into the desert,

they're just gonna look like

a bunch of tourists
that are out there.

So I ran out into the desert.

They got caught.

Everybody got questioned.

They eventually let them go.

There were four people there.

And then on their way out,

before they got to
the main road,

I joined up with them,
got back in the car.

We continued on and then

were stopped by
the local sheriff.

And the sheriff called it in
and he said,

"Yeah, I got five people here,"
and Wackenhut said,

"Well, there were
only four there.

Where'd you get the other guy?"

So he asked for everybody's ID
and we gave it to him.

So that's how they found out
that I was there.

As soon as they mentioned my
name, from what I recall,

they just said, "Okay,"
and they let everybody go.

And that's how--

That's how it went. Yeah.

Dennis contacted me in
the morning and said,

"Instead of going into S4,

uh, we're gonna go
to Indian Springs,"

which was an auxiliary
air force base,

you know, in that general area,
part of the test site.

So we went... to Indian Springs
that morning.

And, uh, that's where I was
debriefed and interrogated.

Literally said two or three
words the entire trip.

It's like a half hour,
45 minute drive.

The only thing he did say on the
way down there was,

"You know, when we said
this was highly classified,

we didn't mean that you can tell

your friends and
family about it."

And that was, I think,
the only thing he said.

There was someone at the
guard station to let us in,

and then someone
in the building and...

he left after that.

Guards there with M-16s
and guys

slamming their finger into my
chest, screaming in my ear.

Some people were pointing
weapons at me.

There were a couple
of guys in the room

that they sat me down with.

Um, and they were more angry
than anything else.

I don't think they exactly
knew what to say,

but they kept going over.

"Didn't you understand the
security briefings?"

And you know, one of the guys
had a sidearm, a rifle,

um, that he kept poking me with.

We had a story all made up
why I was out there

about me being dropped off
at the stop sign up on--

up on the top of the hill
and that I really didn't

go out there and I didn't
wanna and all that.

And the first thing that they
said when I got in,

uh, was, "Forget about the
stop sign story."

And we only talked about
that on the phone.

And it was just all too obvious
that the phone was tapped.

And eventually they brought up
the fact that they said,

"You know, we've been
monitoring your phone

and, uh, we've
been reviewing your--

you know, your clearance

and there've been
some problems with it.

Your wife's been having an
affair with your--

her flight instructor and
here's the transcripts."

And, you know, they just
kind of explained it,

opened a couple places and
was reading stuff into me,

some particularly
unpleasant areas.

And, um... I kind of put
most of this out of my mind.

They let me go after that.

And I think they were gonna
yank the clearance

anyway, because of
what was going on.

They were simply waiting to see
if it was something

that was gonna
fizzle out or not.

And apparently it wasn't.

It's something I don't like to
talk about.

It's upsetting... and it, um...

you know, it's probably the
least of what I remember

about the entire situation.

And that was essentially the
last day that I had ever worked.

But yeah, they were--

upset was...

...an understatement.

They shot at you,
somebody shot,

maybe as a warning, perhaps.

That's a good warning, I had my
back tire shot out on my car

as I was getting
on the freeway.

I was dropping some real estate
photos off at Gene Huff's office

on Eastern Avenue in Las Vegas.

And I drove down,
Charleston Boulevard went

completely across the valley.

And just as I was heading back,

heading toward the
freeway on-ramp,

another car kept

running up beside me.

And, you know, they'd fall back,

I'd move forward,
they'd fall back.

I thought it was some kid
trying to race me.

And they shot, they fired it.

They weren't--
They weren't trying to race me.

They were trying to shoot me.

They shot and hit the back tire,

uh, where Charleston Boulevard

curves-- the on-ramp
that goes on to I-15.

There's, uh, a big dirt area.

So instead of
following the turn,

I went straight into the
dirt and stopped

and was kind of petrified and
just froze there in the car

because I thought they had
pulled up behind me

and I was waiting to get shot.

And I just sat there for a long
period of time and realized

they had kept going.

So I kind of relaxed.

I went out and
looked at the tire

and I didn't have a spare.

I just got back in the car and
started driving up the on-ramp,

of course, you know,
with a shot-out tire.

You know, was it somebody
from the government?

Was it a random shooting?

Was it a gangbanger?

I-- I don't know.

But that-- that happened
at that time.

But you said, uh,

you were referred to
getting into trouble.

Have you had some repercussions?

Yeah, I've been
threatened with, uh--

uh, being charged
with espionage.

Uh, I've had my life
threatened by them,

my wife's life threatened
by them.

And, uh, I-- I mean, I don't
know where else you can
go from there.

I, at that time, you know,
had people following me,

was beginning to get scared
and at some point stayed at

John Lear's house and, you know,

was kind of hiding from
what was going on.

And he said, "Look, I know this
guy, George Knapp.

He's, uh... you know,
part of KLAS-TV.

He's an investigative reporter.

What you should do, you should
say all this stuff,

get it on the record.

Like that way, if anything
happens to you,

it's just gonna explode.

And the-- you know, maybe
they'll leave you alone."

And, you know, initially that
sounded ridiculous.

And eventually I said,
"I gotta do something.

So... okay."

So, um,

they came up to the house

and in John Lear's driveway,

we did that Dennis interview.

George Knapp attached
the name to Dennis to me.

That was my superior
at the time.

It was kind of a poke
in the eye to him.

I had heard about Bob in 1988.

Um, this guy, John Lear walks
into the TV station in 1987.

He had a stack of documents

and he pushed them
across the desk

to a guy named Ned Day.

Ned had broken a big story
about Area 51.

He and Bob Snowdall got this tip
from Lear and his associates

that there was a secret plane

being developed in
the Nevada desert.

Something that was
invisible to radar,

which sounded
preposterous at the time,

but turned out to be true.

Lear had credibility
with KLAS because

he had given us information
that turned out to be

this really big story.

It was John Lear
that introduced me

to George Knapp and...

John Lear was one of the first
people that I spoke to.

Actually, I think it was
Gene Huff, but John Lear had

a lot of connections and

familiar with a lot of,

Area 51 stories and
that sort of thing, so.

He was an unusual guy,
but a good friend

and had some, you know,
strange beliefs.

But he did direct me to,
uh, George Knapp.

And, uh, that was an important--
an important meeting.

I'm the anchor of the
five o'clock newscast.

And every night we would have a

five-minute live
interview segment.

It might be a local celebrity,
a comedian,

an entertainer, a politician,

somebody interesting who was
traveling through town.

And I remember the day
that it happened.

It's in May of-- of 1989.

Whoever our guest was, canceled.

We're scrambling to figure out
who we're gonna fill

this five-minute hole with.

And I thought about Lear.
Lear said he knew this guy.

It might work out there.
I had no idea who Bob was.

I had no idea what had been
going on in his life.

And so, I called up Lear
and said,

"Hey, you said your--
this guy might--

your flying saucer guy,

uh, might get a job out there.

You think he'd talk to us?"

And Lear says,
"I'll get back to you."

He calls back a couple
minutes later.

"Yeah, he'll do it."

George sent over his cameraman.

His name was Frank,
in a van, and

they set Bob up in silhouette
inside the van.

He told the story, you know.

There were nine flying

disks-- flying saucers, and--
and told the story.

And, uh-- And then it hit the
news and, man,

did their newsroom go crazy.

We send a live unit
up to Lear's house.

Uh, they arrange this interview.

We have to block out
this guy's identity.

We have to put him
in silhouette.

He used a pseudonym, Dennis.

Weren't exactly sure
what he was gonna say,

uh, but we started asking him
some generic questions

in our five o'clock newscast
and out this story spills

and the world changed.

Uh, there's really no
way I can prove it

without revealing my identity
and getting myself

into more trouble than
I have already.

The choice of Dennis
was an inside joke.

He says that's the name of his
superior at Groom Lake.

-It wasn't a joke to Dennis.
-He called right after,
he said,

"You have any idea what we're
going to do to you now?"

And I-- I said, "Well, no," and
he's yelling up the phone.

When he did this, I told, I--
I was astonished because

it was courageous when
he was on as Dennis

and silhouette on the news
and stuff.

I mean, I was amazed by this guy

'cause he was putting
it all on the line.

Look, they're doing
everything they can

to keep this
information secret.

And if they're gonna silence me,

whether it's something,
you know, ridiculous,

like try to hurt me, uh...

that would kind of prove
what I'm saying is true.

Why would this guy suddenly get,
you know,

murdered or hurt in some way?

And, um, it just kind of
seemed like

getting the information out
would be a good idea.

I used to always travel around.

I always held the weapon

and-- because
I mean, he's been shot at.

And I-- I was aware of that.

And I was-- I was willing to--

to fire back, you know,
that was my friend.

Mario, who drove a motorcycle,
was into racing and all that

came riding by one day
and was paralyzed

by the fact that there was a

jet dragster in his
neighborhood and

stopped his motorcycle and
immediately got out

and started talking to me,
and, you know.

From that point on, we kind of
became friends over time

and, you know,
still to this day,

he remains a really
good friend and, uh,

went through a lot of--
a lot with me, uh...

as all this unfolded
in Las Vegas.

He knew and I knew
that he was targeted.

And I mean, I-- I think even
before that, at one point

he was shot on the freeway.

You know, Mario was
with me frequently

because we go to the
gym every day and that's when,

you know, sometimes we park
the car, come back out,

all the doors, hoods and
back would be open,

even though we locked it
and checked it before we left.

But nothing would be taken.

You know, and there was a loaded
machine gun in the car

and wallets, but nothing
would be touched.

My phone was tapped.

We were being followed
all over the place.

I mean, I was being followed
'cause I was with Lazar.

The things that they were
doing to mess with his life

were really happening,
breaking into his house

and moving things around or
opening the doors to his car

and leaving the gun
sitting there or...

shooting at his tire or
just messing with him.

There's no way to convey
that to people

how real that was, uh,
unless you were there.

But that it was real.

We were scared and
there was pressure

on Bob and me

and our station to knock it off.

I got a call from Dennis Mariani

and he said, "We need to talk.

Let's meet at the
Union Plaza Casino."

After I got that call,
I spoke to Gene Huff,

my other friend Joe at the time.

I wanted some--
you know, finally

some other witnesses
to come with me.

And we all went to the
Union Plaza Casino.

I think it was around
eight o'clock or 8:30 at night.

If I recall, as I was walking

to where he wanted me
to meet him,

I passed not one, but two guys

that looked super familiar to me

like they were
security guards at S4.

And that really alerted me.

And I said something to Gene.

I said, "Something's--
something's weird here."

And I went up and I saw, um,
uh, Dennis playing at a--

I don't remember
what game it was,

but I went up alongside of him

and said, "Hey, Dennis."

And he didn't-- he wouldn't
even look up at me.

And I said, you know, "Okay."

And-- and walked away,

and connected up with Gene who
had eyes on him the entire time.

Bob sees Dennis at
a blackjack table.

This guy won't even look at him.

Now, if he was a complete
stranger that Bob wasn't

trying to pretend was Dennis,

he would have looked at him and
said, "Get out of here, buddy.

What-- you know," he-- he keeps
looking down at his cards and

he won't talk to Bob.

So Bob comes back
and tells me that.

I mean, we weren't behind the
slot machines for five seconds.

We looked back.
Dennis is gone.

So it was-- it was weird to
see him acting like this.

I wonder if those other guys
weren't supposed to be there.

They saw him and
he decided to shut up

and he really did want
to talk to me

or they were with him or--
something like that.

But why did his attitude
change so much between

when he called me,
"Hey, we gotta talk."

And I got there and now
I'm not-- I don't even exist.

So it almost made me think

somebody was privy to the
conversation, scared him.

And, you know, that--
that was it.

We all got back together,
Gene, Joe, and I,

we went back to the house, and
my house had been broken into.

So was this entire thing set up

just to get us out of the house
so they'd have access,

and, um, you know, who knows,
or was it a coincidence?

Did anything
happen at the house?

Like, they broke in,
did they take anything?

Yeah, they did.

As time went on,
my name became known,

but as far as the reception
from people,

for the most part, only
my friends and family

really believed my story

because they knew me
before and after

some, of course,
had seen the test flights.

And so there was no doubts
in their mind,

but the general public
certainly did not.

So, I looked like...

You know, just some hoaxster
or some, you know,

weird guy out there telling
strange stories.

The weeks and months
that followed that time

were very stressful and, uh...

...probably the--
the worst time in my life.

Um...

Take your time.

I tried to say, "I'm the same
guy who did these
other stories."

And I could not understand why
people did not believe it.

And it was important to me
at the time, like,

"Hey, I'm-- I'm
telling you the truth here.

I'm-- I'm telling you how
we went through this process

of what steps we took to tell
the Bob Lazar story."

And there were those who would
just-- would not look at it,

would not take it seriously.

And I could not understand it.

And it bothered me
in those days.

And it bothered me for a while,

but now we're looking
at 34 years later

and it doesn't
bother me a bit.

I do not give a shit

if people be--
believe Bob Lazar.

I know what I reported.

I know what he said.

I know he's telling the truth.

And I know there are
other people

that know it's the truth.

And I don't care whether, uh,

they wanna drag me or him
over the coals anymore.

Screw it.

Bob played a dangerous
chess game

with some very dangerous people.

And he made the first move.

They were astonished
that anybody had the

audacity to defy them.

And while they were thinking
about that, Bob went public.

And he forced their hand.
They either had to arrest him

and prove that what
he was saying is true,

or they had to let him go
and hope to exact

their revenge another time.

And I say this all the time.

A-- All this stuff is something
that happened to him.

It's not who he is.
Like he said before,

"I'd rather you not believe me
and leave me alone."

A lot of stuff that Bob said
turned out to be true

and was verifiable.

And it drives people crazy.

But, you know, the fact that

he knew about a place called S4.

You know, Nellis
confirmed that, it was real.

He wouldn't tell me
where it was,

but they confirmed
it was real.

That whole hand scanner thing
turned out to be real.

How did he know that stuff?

Uh, element 115. You know?

We still don't have a stable
form of it, but, you know,

it makes sense that it could
exist, uh, that

we have a reverse engineering
program, uh, that these

big defense contractors
have been conducting.

All that stuff coming out now,
it is true.

He knew about it.

How did he know?

Just making it up,
out of thin air.

The way it affected me,
I felt bad for him

because I knew who he was,
you know.

And what people were
saying about him.

I mean, there was a lot of
good people, but, um,

still, you always heard
the bad stuff.

It's like, "You know, no wonder

he didn't wanna talk
about it to anybody."

You know? He was very quiet
and-- and I understand that.

So we really didn't focus on
that at all.

It's just, let's do
what we wanna do,
have some goals in life

and things that we wanna do
and focus on that.

It's a quiet place,

way up in the mountains,
away from everything.

My wife has her barn
and arena out there.

The house is here,
and I have my lab at home.

And it's, you know,
it's sizable.

It's 1500 square feet.

It's bigger than the...
you know,

house I used to have in
New Mexico to live in,

but I can carry on
multiple experiments,

work on multiple projects,
all at the same time.

And uh, it's-- it's a blast.

I c-- I could almost
live in here, it's--

To me, it's the ultimate
man cave.

I spend more and more time

in here kinda working
towards retiring.

And, um--

Yeah, my wife is really--

my wife, Joy,
is really into horses.

And uh, so, she can be in her--
I call it her lab,

is, uh, the-- the horse lab.

And I'm in here and, you know,

we come and hang out
with each other, but

you know, we can have
a good time

by ourselves doing
our own thing.

This is Joy, my wife.

Are you filming?

Okay, let's start.

Cut!

This is my wife, Joy.

-This is my husband, Bob.
-Yeah.

We met um...

-In--
-23 years ago

in 2000, August, in Las Vegas.

We were introduced
by a mutual friend

and, um, it took us a while to
figure out that we were

okay to date each other.

He liked horses. He hated Vegas.

And... what was
the other reason?

-I don't know.
It was just time to move.
-He was very nice.

He was very nice.

-Which was the reason--
-That was the reason to move?

-No, no, no. Um...
-I was nice?

Yeah, so we left and then
we went

-to New Mexico...
-New Mexico.

And then Michigan,

and now we're here in the
mountains of Oregon.

I believe that some
of the technology,

it may be all... of the
technology should
be kept secret

until we have a handle on
everything, but certainly

the overview of what happened

just cannot be a secret from--

from anyone, not just the
American people, but the
rest of the world.

Let out the basic fact,
that we have these crafts.

At one time, uh,
aliens did at least visit

and dropped off something,
however they got here.

Uh, that there was
some contact made
and then cut it short.

You don't need to release
information on

the gravity generators,
the weapon potential, was--

which is enormous, and--
and so on.

And how-- how would it affect
life on Earth

if this stuff was
widely available?

That's tough to say.
I mean, you have

a different-- a completely
different mode of travel.

Uh... what happens when
you can play with time?

Uh, that gets into a-- a really

deep philosophical,
you know, question there.

But I mean, we could--
it would change

a lot of stuff,
change everything.

Oh yeah, it would change
absolutely everything.

Think it'll ever come out?

Personally, no.

I have yet to be able to
really prove my story.

I've been accused of
lying and fabricating

this story for many,
many years.

Although I've always said

there's no way for me
to prove my story,

I always thought it
was important to

let the world know
what I saw at S4.

There's no doubt in my mind
that these crafts exist.

I saw one, and was personally
inside one.

This is possibly one of the
biggest secrets,

if not the biggest secret,
held in the world today.

Prior to becoming involved
with the project,

I really never believed
in flying saucers.

I didn't follow
flying saucer stories,

read the literature
associated with it,

or pay attention to
any of the news reports.

My experience at S4 certainly
changed my outlook on all this.

And now I know for a fact

that we are not alone.

These original maps, uh, were
sent to us on behalf
of Gene Huff.

Gene Huff was kind enough
to order these

from the United States
government and have

these original maps sent to us.

These are from the United States
Department of the Interior

and these are maps of the
Groom Lake area,

the Ticaboo Valley as you
can see right here, and

the Papoose Lake area.

So these two are from
provisional editions of 1983.

And the one that
I have right here

is the one I was looking for.

This is the one of Papoose Lake.

So this one here

represents the exact
location where,

uh, S4 is supposedly located.

So you've got Papoose Lake
right here,

you've got the hillside
where the base is located,

obviously the United States
Department of the Interior.

And as I was looking at this,

what I noticed in the bottom
left corner, it said

"Compiled from aerial
photographs taken in 1968."

So, we had actually referred
to some of these

back at the beginning
of our project to

recreate the entire
landscape there.

But what I noticed on
the map when I got it

was it said,
"Map edited in 1989."

So on the bottom right corner,
it says "Papoose Lake, Nevada,

provisional edition 1989."

These are original maps.

These are numbered as well.

So these are not, uh--
these are not copies.

These are your
original ones from--

that you have to order
and pay for.

And I really wanna thank
Gene Huff for this.

And when you go
on their website,

and you get to see the exact
maps, you-- you can actually,

uh, see them and download them.

They have a stamp on
this particular one

of the Papoose Lake, uh, area.

And the provisional edition
was stamped May 1989.

And why that's important is
because it just so happened

that that is exactly when
Bob Lazar went public.

He went public with the Dennis
interview in May of 1989.

Do you believe

that it's possible
that the government will

come clean anytime soon with
what's really going on?

You know, I think probably

because of religion,
they'd be hesitant to do it.

Uh-- You got
the seat really well.

Bob! Bob!

Oh shit!

Don't do it!

W-- it's not gonna hurt you.

You have to keep
your options open and...

maybe they've narrowed
down or proven

you know, where they came from.

Somebody has to have
a lot more answers.