Original subtitles

Oh, come in.

Hi, it's lovely to meet you. Come on in.

Lily? Yes.

And Franco.

Yes, correct. Nice to meet you.

Okay, wonderful. Please have a seat.

Thank you so much for being here. My name is Dr.

Penny Barber.

I've been working in therapy for quite a while since I graduated.

I started off in family therapy, and then maybe like six months ago,

I switched to human sexuality.

I feel like it's a much better fit for me personally. I just love helping

in that way.

What? Are you okay? I thought we were here because...

of grief therapy and because of you mourning your father.

Yes, that is what I had to tell her in order to drag her here today with me. I

had to tell the white lie, you know.

Oh.

Cat's out of the bag now.

Okay. Yeah. I'm just not sure how you can help.

Okay. Well, that is a first for me.

You know what? Since we have the session book.

I did have a background in family therapy before I started this.

Would you care to stay? Maybe we could talk about that and the disparity and

you both think you're here.

Yes, that's fine.

Yes, I'm willing to stay and talk. All right.

In that case, well, Lily, let's start with you. Could you tell me a little bit

about yourself?

Well, I'm just a stay -at -home mom.

Father did die about 18 months ago.

Okay. I'm sorry to hear that. And so I've just been

taking care of him and everything.

I go to church every weekend.

But there's not much to say.

How do you use anything?

Gardening? Yeah.

I like to go hiking and stuff like that, and I do, like, a little gardening and

stuff like that, but, you know.

But that's your focus on the home right now? Yes, yes.

Okay, I see that.

That sounds lovely. And, Franco, could you tell me a little bit about yourself?

Well, like she said, she's my stepmom, wife of my father who had just passed,

and, yeah, it's just us two now.

I don't do much, really. I just go to school, hang out with my friends, you

know, that normal type stuff, I guess.

All right. All right.

Well,

Lily, why were you told that you were here today? Well, because I

know he's still having trouble getting over his father dying and everything.

So I thought he wanted to come and, you know.

big thing going on about that, and I thought that would be very helpful, you

know, for a call to talk about that.

Were there any specific things that you thought that, of course, you wanted to

mourn your father.

Were there any particular behaviors that you were concerned about, or does he

seem like a red flag to you?

No, I mean, he just seems, you know, sad.

Yeah. Okay.

All right.

And Franco, why don't you tell me...

Why you asked your mom to come here today?

Well, ever since my father passed, I've noticed more than once, a

few times at this point, that usually not in character for her to do, I've

caught her staring at me in the shower a few times.

Oh.

And I've been a weird one to confront her about it, and I thought bringing her

here will probably be a good way of addressing that.

Okay.

So maybe there was an incident earlier where you were having a look at Franco's

shower. Is that true?

Well, you know, it happened one time.

I, you know, was walking by and I noticed the bathroom door

was open. He was in the shower.

I kind of happened to look.

But, you know, nothing happened. It was just, it just

happened. And I confessed and asked the Lord for forgiveness when I was in

church. And so, I mean, I'm totally fine.

I didn't see the harm in it.

I confessed.

She may have asked the Lord for forgiveness, but she never once spoke to

about it. You know, she knew I had caught her doing it.

Alright, what was that like? Like, what happened when you got

caught, Lily?

What would you say, what was that experience like? Yeah, I felt really bad

it, you know. I knew I should not have been doing that.

Okay. So, I just, I felt really bad about it, so.

And Franka says you didn't talk to him about that. Yeah, I'm embarrassed.

Really? About even bringing it up?

Okay, but Franco, you would have liked to address it? Yes, absolutely.

And I was embarrassed myself. That's why I couldn't do it myself and why I

decided to bring her here and trick her because I didn't want to openly admit as

to why.

Is there anything?

It seems like we had a little bit of a disparity in that Lily says this

once and Franco, you said this happened.

Yeah. A few times.

Maybe one time I let the door crack.

Definitely a couple other times, like, she had to open the door. I had to lock

in it, but she had to open the door. So, I guess I can take a little bit of the

blame for that, but... Is this a recurring issue, Lily?

Oh, you know, uh... I just maybe

peaked a little bit, but, you know, I...

I didn't mean anything by it.

I didn't mean anything by it. Okay.

Did that seem like a genuine thought when you heard that, in your opinion,

expert opinion?

Well, you know, maybe.

Let's talk more about the underlying issues of why this might have happened

in the first place.

Lily, have you been able to meet your sexual need since the death of your

husband?

Honestly, no.

No, I haven't.

Have you explored any masturbation?

Well, you know, I feel that's so private and everything.

You know, I just feel very uncomfortable talking about that.

Okay.

I mean, I am a professional, and, you know, clearly your son is concerned

you. I can leave the room if it makes him more comfortable.

Oh.

You don't have to do that.

I just, you know, I just, do you often have trouble discussing sexual matters

home? Yes.

We don't talk about that at all, no. At all? No. Okay.

Even after the passing of your father, if you have questions, you don't have a

source of information?

No, I just keep to myself, yeah.

Okay. All right. And can you tell me why that is?

What's the barrier here around discussing sexuality issues at home?

I just feel so uncomfortable.

Is there a place that discomfort is coming from? Is there something that you

would... Being a good church

-going woman, I just don't feel like that I should be discussing those

Do you feel like your religion is precluding you from a

frank discussion of erotic and sexual matters?

Yes.

Okay. Well, you know, I do regularly counsel Christians,

you know, Christian families and Christian people about, you know, their

personal matters. And, you know, I'm sure that if you do read in the Bible,

everyone likes to quote song to song.

You know, there certainly is a time and a place, and there are certain...

stories that are expected to go a certain way. And, you know, I feel like

is room for human sexuality within the Bible. You know, there's certainly a lot

of rules governing it.

And so I do feel

like I understand where those barriers come from. I really do. You know, and

where they're perceived and everything like that.

I do have some information on a...

Christian human sexuality group therapy that, you know, I might like to give you

at the end of our meeting today.

But until then, I would like to try

a few things.

Okay. Is that okay?

Mm -hmm. All right.

So when I was getting my certification and earning my diploma,

we did spend some time with hypnotherapy.

Which isn't a focus.

I haven't done much of it since school.

But I feel like in this very specific situation, it might really help you to

feel more open discussing these things. And you might get more out of the

session. It might be really freeing for you.

Hypnotherapy, like stuff you see in movies and stuff.

I would not say that the depictions of hypnotherapy I've seen in movies have

been accurate.

But, yeah, you know, kind of, you know, sure.

I mean, I'm sure if you were to sit in on our session, you know, and I started

doing it, you would recognize it. I would love to watch it.

Are you curious?

Well, the induction part of it is all pretty simple.

What I would do would be that I would sort of...

Get your attention and then sort of break down these barriers that you're

and talking about these things, not so that you can do anything that you don't

already want to do. You can't, like in films, hypnotize someone to do something

they don't want to do already.

But you can sort of help them become more their true self, like put them in a

state of suggestibility to themselves.

Okay. Which I think is the big difference between what you see.

In films and stuff, it's like, you know, I probably couldn't make you, like, rob

a bank.

Right. Probably not going to work.

But, you know, I've in the past seen other therapists use it to, you know,

help a father tell his daughter that he really does love her despite, you know,

something horrible that she's done that he might not approve of or, you know,

something like that. It's actually quite helpful to get people to stop smoking,

you know, things that they do want to do anyway. But sometimes you just need to.

reframe someone's thinking a little bit.

Okay. I'm willing to try. This will help.

Yeah. If you're open to it, I would like to give it a shot. Okay.

All right.

Well, wonderful.

Franco, I am going to ask you to bear with us. All right. Do your thing.

More focus on your mom a little bit right now.

So all hypnosis is really self -hypnosis.

And it's a state that you've probably experienced before, whether you've

experienced something called highway hypnosis, where, let's say, you're

from one familiar place, work, driving to another familiar place, home, and you

just kind of do it on autopilot.

Another example of a hypnosis that is commonly experienced by people is, say,

watching a movie. You know, you're focused on it. You can enter a movie

and you can sit down in the dark, be completely focused on the film, and not

even notice who is sitting right behind you.

All of your attention is focused on the screen.

So the first thing that I like to do is to get your attention.

And to do that, I actually think I would like to use a necklace.

I wasn't really prepared for hypnotherapy session today, so I don't

anything else.

Okay. But if I could just have you really focus right here on this jewel

here. And I'm not going to swing it back and forth. I'm just going to let it

dangle right here. And I want you to focus on your attention right there.

As you're doing it, I want you to start paying attention to your breath. Your

mind can hold up to six thoughts at once.

And one of them is going to be taken up by this pendant right here. And one of

them is going to be taken up by your breath. Just focus on breathing in and

And let your body relax.

You can move. You don't have to stay totally still when you're being

It's just like watching a movie. It's just like watching television. You can

feel yourself get comfortable. If you have an itch, you can totally scratch

If you want to take a deep breath or a breath or something anyway, you can do

that. You can take off your shoes. You could probably get fully undressed, and

it wouldn't matter. All you have to do is look at the jaw and look upon your

breath.

All you have to do is focus right there.

Do your best to focus right there and get comfortable.

Your body can move automatically and easily, and it won't distract you at

Anything else that you might hear, sounds of cars outside, your breathing,

breathing, your son's breathing, the temperature in the room, everything is

going to serve to augment this moment.

and serve to augment your focus on the stool.

As you focus on the stool, I want you, in your mind, on your own, I want you to

start counting backwards from 10 down to zero.

When you get to zero, I want your eyes to close, and I want you to sink into a

deep hypnotic.

Focus on the jaw.

Working down.

All the way in your head.

Good.

Excellent. What did you do?

Oh, my God.

All right.

Really ease yourself in a relaxed state.

I want you to feel all of your muscles becoming completely relaxed.

And again, you can move as you need to.

Anything natural that you need to do in your body is complete. Completely limp

and comfortable as though it is filled with warm liquid.

Completely relaxed.

Completely limp.

Excellent.

Now I want you to feel a state of relaxation and acceptance take over your

entire body.

As soon as you know that you are completely focused and that you are

susceptible to suggestions from your own subconscious mind, I want you to say,

I'm convinced.

I'm convinced.

Excellent. That was so easy.

That was the easiest thing in the world, just focusing.

Now, really, you are a sexual being.

And that's okay.

You have sexual need, and that's completely natural.

Lord God created you as a thankful creature, and he would not have given

these wonderful, beautiful feelings if you were not meant to explore them.

I don't want you to ever question anything that occurs to you naturally. I

you to feel completely at ease with yourself as a sexual woman and a sexual

creature.

I want you to feel open about expressing that sexuality and comfortable

expressing that sexuality.

As you feel comfortable and relaxed right now, that's how I want you to feel

when you are expressing sex and sexual.

I want you to remember the state that you're in right now, where you are

and open, and I want you to be able to return to it at the snap of my fingers.

I want you to know that this office is a safe place.

You can discuss anything here within these four white walls.

It is a safe space where you can explore your thoughts, your feelings, your

sexuality. And it's completely non -judgmental. And it's completely

And it's going to feel good to do so.

It's going to feel good to explore your sexuality.

I'm going to keep talking to you. Once you understand that it is completely

for you to explore your sexuality, and that the snapping of my fingers gives

permission to do so, I want you to say, I'm convinced.

It's okay for you to explore your sexuality.

It's okay for you to explore your sexuality. I'm convinced.

Good girl. That's a wonderful memory.

It's going to feel so good to explore your sexuality here in this office.

Now I am going to count back up from 0 to 10, and when I get to 10, I am going

to snap my fingers. You are going to be fully awake, and you are going to feel

focused and refreshed and eager to have an open conversation with me about sex.

0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5,

6, 7, 8, 9, 10.

Good. Hi.

How are you feeling?

I'm good.

You feeling okay?

Yes. All right. Good.

That's wonderful.

Okay. Let's continue our session.

I'm so glad that you were willing to do that.

Yeah.

I'm feeling great.

Oh, yeah?

You feeling relaxed?

Yeah. Okay.

All right. Awesome.

So, I thought we could revisit a few topics that we had discussed.

Alright, yeah, let's go for it.

So, Franco, can you tell me, in

plain English, without censoring yourself at all, what you think,

if anything, what you think your mom needs to be happy?

After what I just saw, um, in plain English, I said, uh, she needs to be,

she needs to be fucked. She needs to be pleasured. Um, obviously that's been,

uh, gone since my dad's passing. And that's exactly.

Okay. I think.

Uh, Lily, how do you feel about that very honest statement?

Well, I agree.

It's been a long time.

Yeah. Would you say that's something that's been missing from your life?

Yes, I would say so.

Okay.

Can I ask you, have what, if anything, have you been doing to take care of your

own sexual need?

No, I haven't been.

Because I feel like, you know, I shouldn't be doing that.

I'm afraid it's a sin.

Okay.

You know, there... Like so many things in the Bible, there are different

interpretations of it.

But I do have to ask you, whom do you think it's hurting for you to feel

pleasure?

I mean,

really no one, I guess. But I just feel like it's not the right thing to do.

There's still that restraint there, even though. But let's agree on that. Let's

say...

that we can say that it is not hurting anybody if Lily were to masturbate.

That's probably an accurate statement, right? Okay.

It's probably not going to burn down a hospital. Right.

Most likely. Right.

How much should she be masturbating, in your professional opinion?

Well, you know, as much as she wants to.

You know, and that varies for people. There's, you know, different statistics

that come out every few years. Somebody does a survey where they're like, oh,

how much do people, and the only consistency we find is generally that

do it a little bit less than men.

But not as much as you would think.

Or at least not as much as I would have thought in my 20s.

But okay, so you haven't really been masturbating.

When is the last time that you had an orgasm?

Probably way before his father.

Oh, and you said that was... 18 months ago.

18 months ago that he passed away.

So that's a while.

Yeah.

What is the longest in your adult life that you have gone without climaxing?

Probably six months.

Okay, so the 18 months since you died is the longest stretch, but a previous six

-month period, that's kind of a lot. You know, that seems like a lot to me.

All right.

Okay, let's try something else.

Thank you very much, by the way, for sharing this information with me. I know

that it can be difficult to do that, but I do want it to start to feel really

good for you to share.

Franco, let's have you stand here, and Lily, let's have you stand right there.

Okay.

Okay.

So, Lily, I want you to take a deep look. May I touch you, Franco?

Yes.

Take a deep look into your son's eyes.

I want you both to sort of, like, start breathing deeply into something that can

really...

make a connection between people is when they kind of think up their breath.

Okay. So what I would like you to do is I would like to take your hand, Franco,

and can I put this hand on your chest right here? Okay.

Right there, and same thing. Can I put your hand right here on his chest?

Okay. And I want you to just keep breathing deeply, and I want you looking

each other's eyes, and I want you to think up as much as you can.

So, Lily, there have been some instances with you peeping on Franco.

Thanks, Franco. How did that make you feel?

Was it a bad feeling?

No, I wouldn't say it was a bad feeling.

I would say the feeling, I don't know how quite to explain.

Not good, not bad.

Not a good feeling, not a bad feeling.

Yeah. That's okay. You know, it's okay if you can't be back lately or you're

thinking, so long as you're being open, I would say it's more important to be

open. Oh, yeah, like, if I wasn't trying to be open, I would say it was bad

right away, but her being my stepmom and everything, like, yeah, I was like,

this should feel bad, but that's where the confusion comes in, like, oh, why

don't I feel bad about it? Okay. I find it intriguing.

Okay. A way to put it.

That's a great way to put it. That's really beautiful.

Do you want me to thank yourself for sharing with you like that? Yeah.

That was really wonderful. Thank you.

And Lily, can you please tell me how it felt to

see Franco naked?

Well, at first it was a little strange.

Okay. But then I, I don't know, I just actually kind of

turned on by it. Okay.

All right. How does that feel to talk about that right now?

It's a little difficult, but I feel like I can and that I'm ready to talk about

it. You're feeling a little more open?

Yes.

Yeah, he tends to remind me of his father.

Okay.

I can see that. I can see you feeling those kind of feelings and rejecting a

little bit.

Completely normal.

It's not something we talk about very much, but it's very common.

Franco, you said that it would help your mom if she were to have

sex.

Yes. Right?

Okay. Do you feel like that's something that she needs? How do you feel like her

behavior would change if she was having sex?

Would she be... Probably more...

And better moods and more open, like she is now.

Happier and more open, more relaxed, maybe?

Yes. Would that be accurate? Okay.

All right, and that sounds good to you, to have a mom around the house who is

happy and relaxed and more open.

That sounds better?

Yes. Okay.

And you both said that it didn't feel bad when Lily

was... Taking a peek, as it were, meaning a little bit of a voyeur.

But it was a negative experience.

So I can understand how there would be a lot of outside influence for telling

me that it's a negative experience.

But if you're not feeling it that way, then I personally don't think that

there's a lot to be gained from wallowing in those negative feelings,

So, Franco, I was wondering if you would be willing to do something for me right

now. And what is that?

Well, I was wondering if you would maybe be willing to let your mom sort of

explore you more fully here right now.

And what do you mean by explore? Like, you want me to take my clothes off right

now? Very specifically, yes. I was going to start by asking you to take your

clothes off. That was going to be my step one.

All right.

And I know it can feel a little strange, but I do think it can be very helpful.

Well, I've seen what you've done so far, and you work your magic, so... Okay,

thank you.

Whatever you say, yeah, I'm in. Willing to take a risk? Yes.

Willing to play the game? Okay, thank you.

I appreciate your confidence in my ability.

Lily, would that be okay? Are you interested?

It definitely feels strange, but I guess if you think it will help.

I do think that it will help, and strange doesn't have to feel bad. So, of

course, if it does feel bad, you can say so.

And if it feels strange, you can certainly say so.

It's just all about communication.

Okay?

Why don't you, Lily, tell Franco exactly what you want him to do? I want you to

take your shirt off. I want you to take your shoes off. I want you to let me

touch your chest. You know, anything like that.

Okay. Can you take that power?

Sure.

Okay,

Franco. I want you to take your shirt off.

Okay.

And it's all on your camera right here?

Oh, yeah. I just use it to take notes in my sessions.

So it's okay for it to stay on?

Oh, yeah. I mean, like, it'll be in my files for me, you know.

No one else will see it. No, I don't generally allow people into my medical

files. Okay.

Oh, very private. Making sure.

Mm -hmm.

How long since you've been touched?

That's been a long time too.

You having a thought there, Franco?

Whatever the doctor suggests.

I always suggest open and honest communication and clear expression of

Seeing as she's seen me naked before, I think she should return the favor.

Good for her.

Okay.

That's some very beautiful lingerie for no one to see it.

Why, thank you.

May I?

Sure.

It's always good to ask. You never know. The answer might be yes.

The answer's no. That's okay, too.

Are you okay for you to explore each other as long as you feel you're

it?

Without having to worry about any judgment coming from anywhere else?

Don't want all of these repressions to build up into resentments or

neuroses.

Kind of get it all out.

Thank you.

You're being so affectionate, Lily.

I love it. I love seeing you enjoy yourself.

I'm so nervous when you first got here. I know. I feel so much better now.

Mm -hmm.

To your communicating, just kind of about words, just physically enjoying

yourself, connecting.

It's definitely been a long time.

But I'm glad we're able to do that.

Did you want to take these off?

Look at what a big step you've made, Lily.

I know.

I feel like I've come a long way already.

Completely naked.

You seem very relaxed.

Very calm.

I think you really helped me.

I try.

I feel definitely more relaxed now.

exploring each other so openly.

Do you mind if I kind of come in there and kind of like facilitate a little

Sure. Come on.

That's good.

I like to see more touching.

Eye contact is always nice.

That's good.

That's right.

Kissing, exploring.

Wonderful.

Vocalizing.

Leaning feeling.

And Franco, can you tell your mother how beautiful she is?

This is okay.

She's gorgeous.

And this is exactly what she needs.

Large breath.

And this tiny little wave, which is very full hip.

Really, it's okay for you two to talk about how your son looks.

I imagine that these pictorials didn't just happen.

You're so handsome.

I like how you two are using your hands to explore each other.

Your mouth a little bit.

Franco's using his mouth a little bit.

He needs to have a little bit more of an oral fixation.

Maybe you should just kind of go.

That whatever you want to experience, he's doing such a beautiful job in

communicating with your eyes and your body.

It's really gorgeous to watch.

It's quiet interaction.

Enjoying yourself?

I am. Yeah.

Are you guys?

I'm having, I mean, you know, my calling.

So I'm having a wonderful time.

It's always nice to have a successful session and seeing two people really

each other and come together.

You know, because they're coming together as a mother and son

or as partners in another way.

It looks like I feel great.

I feel more comfortable with you. You got more on our level with.

Clothing -wise. Okay.

Dr. Fiber, would you please?

Would you please be naked?

Yes. I think that I can accommodate that request.

I think that's doable.

I do enjoy facilitating.

Oh my God.

That feels so good.

If somebody had told you that your mom would be doing this last week, you

probably would have believed it.

Never.

I never would have imagined I would be doing this.

I'm pretty sure that it's okay for you to explore it.

There will be no negative consequences.

I really think that you can just kind of let go of guilt.

You're not hurting anybody.

In fact, probably quite the opposite.

I was going to ask you, Lily, if there were any specific parts of them that you

wanted to explore, but it seems like you found one.

Yeah. You seem very focused.

It looks like you're really enjoying yourself down there, Lily.

Is that a good place to be? Mm -hmm.

You know what I think?

Mm -hmm.

I think that I want you to look right here, and the church lady

has gone to church, Lily, and all that's left in her place, all those built -up

wants and desires, all that sexual craving, and I want it all

to come out in 5, 4, 3, 2, 1.

Is that an invitation?

Oh yes.

Oh, yeah.

Oh, yeah.

Oh,

yeah. Oh,

yeah.

Oh,

yeah.

She did just need to get fucked.

Yeah, honestly

That was amazing.

That was fun.

Yeah. Do you want to come over here?

I mean, I don't want to impose.

Okay. That's fine.

Do you want to share a little bit?

So gorgeous.

So steady.

Oh, that's so hot.

Look at that just sticking out.

I'm so enlarged.

Mm -hmm.

Mm -hmm.

Cut it.

Oh, yeah.

There it is. Oh, wow.

Oh my god.

Oh wow.

Oh my god.

You just kind of took that. That's a big dick.

Oh my god.

Thank you.

Thank you.

That was weird.

It's so good.

Thank you for watching.

That's so good.

Oh, it's right there. It's right on the clitoris. Oh my god.

Oh my

god!

Oh god, yeah.

mm -hmm

You have a

very talented son. Apparently I do.

I'm sorry.

um um

You were curious.

That is a lot of that. Oh, my God.

Nice. Yes.

It's beautiful.

It's beautiful.

Thank you.

Oh God, wow.

Oh my God.

You're ready to pick a question.

Better than I imagined.

I love watching you get what you need.

So fulfilling as a therapist.

Just to see a client get what she needs.

Come into your room.

You're happy?

I'm happy

I'm going to eat this.

Oh, yeah.

Oh, yeah.

Oh, that's

right. Oh, that's beautiful.

So gorgeous.

I'll see you together.

Really? I have one more question. Yeah?

Where do you think would be a good place?

Really? Yeah.

Really? That's not what I expected you to say, but okay.

Pretty face.

Yeah, I think I could do that. Yeah, I think you can.

I believe in you.

Give me a hug.

Yeah, I want you to come on my face.

I guess you were right.

I guess you were right.

That you two can do this whenever she needs it.

Whenever you need it.

That sounds good.

It's okay to get what you need if it sounds good for you.

Thank you both.

for being here today, for being present and so open to new experiences.

I really appreciate it. Thank you. And now

hopefully there's more open communication.

We don't need any more little white lies to get mom into therapy.

Right. I really do hope that this was nice for you and, you know, it kind of

like sinks in over the next week. If you two would like to make another

appointment, you can call myself.

Of course, and she would be happy to make one for you. Okay.

Definitely. I would love to see you again. I'll hope to see you in one to

weeks. Okay.

If you're open to it.

And, yeah, in the meantime, I will email you all the information that we talked

about. And any questions?

Are we forgetting anything?

I don't believe so. Okay.

We've covered just about everything.

All right. I couldn't think of anything either.

There is... a little washroom just down the hall if you would both like to get

cleaned up, which I'm assuming you especially would.

Yeah, I should before I go outside.

Probably.

And, yeah, I think that's it.

Okay, thank you so much.

Thank you. It was nice to meet you, too.