Original subtitles

Thank you very much.

Thank you and congratulations

for being part of this huge crowd today.

They tell us ifs not another Vietnam

and then they wheel out Henry Kissinger

to tell us about it.

Henry Kissinger!

If it's not another Vietnam,

why would they bring Henry Kissinger?

What, was Goebbels not available that day?

Goering wasn't around?

Bring out Kissinger.

And he talks like he's really saying'

"We must very careful

or war will be averted. "

Unlike the U.S. Government,

I've never supported Saddam Hussein.

Nor have I supported the Shah of Iran,

Shamir, Sharon'

Suharto, Chiang Kai-shek,

Kristiani, ,

the Somozas' the Duvaliers,

Marcos, Batista,

Diem, Rios Montt,

Stroessner, Pinochet'

Sorezo, Park Chung-hee,

General Zia, The Sultan of Brunei,

Assad, King Fahd, General Zia,

Franco, Savimbi'

Lyndon Johnson, Richard Nixon,

Gerald Ford' P.W. Botha,

Margaret Thatcher, Ronald Reagan

or George Bush.

- Everything about him was honest and true,

and there was no bullshit.

There was no...

No fake anything.

- Oh, Barry Crimmins, oh my God.

Who's Barry? Barry who?

He was a guy...

who you heard about before you actually saw him.

This whispered-about presence.

I never met anyone like him.

- I went to Kentucky... I got into a big hassle.

I got caught smuggling books into Kentucky.

Got off on a technicality.

No one could prove they were books.

- Barry Crimmins was this weird mythical force

that was a judgmental sage of some kind that'

you know, I didn't quite get.

- You know, in the 80s and 90s there was, like,

this wave of comedy that was... the truth teller.

And I feel like people should claim him more.

Because I think he has much more of an influence

than anybody realizes.

Gruff, smart, annoying...

Like, invasive.

- You know, Barry should have been a super,

super, superstar, I suppose, if this was a just world.

- I was always very aware of this name and this presence of,

"If you really want to see somebody go to the edge,

you gotta go look for Barry Crimmins. "

But he wasn't putting albums out'

the internet wasn't there yet.

- He had integrity, you know, and he would...

He was a man of his word.

But he was, he was a nut job!

- Hold on a second. Watch...

Watch the kind of stuff I can do here.

Listen, I'm sick of listening to you yell.

I'm making a TV show here, okay?

And you're yelling.

Just get out. I don't like you.

He's like a, you know.

Like a guy in a John Ford movie, you know?

He's just this combination of sort of anger

and sentimentality, you know?

Which, you know, makes him fascinating but difficult.

- He would rip politicians, he would rip musicians.

Everything was fair game in his eyes.

- He's like a combination of Ambrose Bierce

and Charles Manson, if you're just looking at him.

Will Rogers and Mark Twain.

- Audie Murphy and Abby Hoffman.

- He looks a lot like Fidel Castro.

Noam Chomsky and Bluto.

- Everybody should just treat each other well...

Because there's a lot of pain out there.

And comedy has nothing to do with alleviating it.

It's just a distraction, man.

- I knew that he was a troubled guy'

that things were not easy for him.

They didn't seem easy for him ever.

When he was around he was always kind of nervous

and seemed fragile in a way.

But volatile.

- There's always so many people around making noise and stuff.

You never know what to do, really'

because your senses are constantly assaulted.

And your senses are being assaulted right now by me

because you're watching me on some electric thing.

And it's making us weird.

- His fuse was getting shorter and shorter.

- Fuck you. Fuck your family.

Fucking nine-year-old kid's giving me shit about politics.

Blow me, all right'?

But that wasn't the issue.

He has demons, Barry, you know'?

- I didn't know, I didn't know what made him tick.

But that's the way he was.

But I think...

There was a lot of personal things that happened in his life

when he was young that came out later.

This is...

Obviously I'm talking about Barry,

and you're Barry's sister and...

I don't know what's going on.

If you want to tell me, this would be the time.

God damn it!

- He lives in a nice house, nice stone fireplace.

Surrounded by trees in a very wooded area

m upstate New York.

Wide open fields.

Gorgeous nature.

- He is away from society' show business,

Wal-Mart, Top 40 radio, you know'?

He's like a wizard.

You know, he lives, he lives in the woods.

- I think it's good for him up there, too.

Chopping the wood.

It gives him a good outlet.

It's a lifestyle.

When you're 30 ifs okay

but at a certain age you start to get arthritis,

you want a dental plan, you know?

- I've been a mechanic for about 30 years

and that's how I got to meet Barry.

I was working on his cars and snowplowing for him,

and he always told me these things that he's done

and I've never believed him.

I usually don't let my customers be my friends

to a point where they come to my house

but Barry kinda broke through that.

- He's the finest person I've ever met in my life.

Bottom line.

- It's funny, the contrast of where he is

and commenting on what's happening in the world

is funny in itself.

It's like if Thoreau could have a computer.

Yeah, fuck this plan.

Well, there's a couple of things I really still feel

I have to accomplish,

and if I do I think I'll be able to put my little tile

in the grand mosaic of life.

And those two things are, of course,

I'd like to overthrow the government of the United States'

and I'd like to close the Catholic church.

- In a lot of ways I think Barry is his own worst enemy

when n comes to ms career.

He's rarely had an agent.

He can be incredibly stubborn.

He doesn't like to delegate.

He has a hard time trusting others.

So if you add all that up

and it's not a good mix for career advancement.

- Would you welcome now, in any condition,

Barry Crimmins. Bar.

- Been on sort of a health kick lately.

Lotta wars going on right now.

I think cable TV should pick up on it.

Start a cable war network.

All war, all the time.

- To take Barry and put him in between Jeff Dunham

and a guy doing MC Harmer yokes...

It was a very stark difference.

It wasn't exactly profitable

to be doing really harsh politi...

It was probably doing fun political stuff.

"Quayle's an idiot, Reagan's kind of", you know...

But he was, you know,

almost he was edging into Noam Chomsky territory,

but doing it in front of a neon, you know,

thing of Charlie Chaplin

with people drinking blender drinks.

- They're talking about putting Reagan on Mount Rushmore.

Wow, huh?

If they do that we'll have to raise a bunch of money

to buy Lincoln and Jefferson blindfolds.

If they're going to honor him they're going to put him on

the million dollar bill.

This way all his friends

will have something to remember him by.

Oh, that HUD scandal was nothing.

They created homelessness and got paid extra for it,

and I'm the jerk for pointing it out, excuse me.

Sorry America at home, too.

Those of you that still have one. Okay.

- Before like a lot of these guys like Bill Maher,

Jon Stewart, he was like one of the first guys

that really would nail that kind of thing.

So he was the always...

"I know you like Bill Hicks

but you gotta go find Barry Crimmins. "

- One of the questions I've always wondered about Barry

is how does he make any money'?

You know?

And I dare say this.

If you don't know anything about the lineage of Boston comedy

this place would not exist

if this guy didn't start where he started

way back in the 80s.

He's a nice man, he's a gentleman'

he's a funny man.

He's one of the best performers working today.

Please welcome Mr. Barry Crimmins.

Give him a nice round of applause.

Barry Crimmins.

- I became a vegetarian a long time ago.

You know what happened, I was...

I was eating a chicken leg which was a bone with meat on it,

and I was holding it with my hand,

which was a bone with meat on it.

My name's Barry Crimmins

and I'm from Skaneateles, fucking New York.

- Barry's childhood. Take 1 A&B count, mark.

- Okay, this is my childhood home. 27 Sta...

- Barry, turn over the other shoulder... - Okay.

- This is... - It's this one, right'?

- It's this one. - It's the brown one'?

- We've got the wrong house framed up.

Are you fucking kidding me'?

- Well, this is my childhood home.

27 State Street.

Centrally located in Skaneateles, New York.

Skaneateles is an Indian word that means

"beautiful lake surrounded by fascists. "

It's spelled S- K-A-N-E-A-T-E-L-E-S.

And when you can do that you're in the second grade.

It's changed over the years.

A lot of the fascists have died. New people have moved in.

- My father was the only Democrat in the damn town.

That's the truth.

- You know, while we only have one

24 hour Christmas ornaments shop,

but there's, you know, 15 or 16 others

and they have a Dickens festival at Christmas,

even though most of the people in town

that I grew up in would have rooted for Scrooge.

I come to my high school reunion.

I went to my 20th high school reunion

because I was on TV and stuff quite a bit around then.

But then a couple of the boys pulled me aside and they said

"Grimmer.

We gotta give you a chance to clear your name. "

And I go, "About what?"

"We heard when you were over in Boston

you done an AIDS benefit.

Now this isn't true, is it?"

"Yeah, I've done dozens of AIDS benefits. "

"Well, you're not a queer, are you?"

I'm whatever threatens you.

I'm a Communist with AIDS and I bite.

He hated school...

but he was a genius in my mind.

- You know, and he was probably smarter

then any of the teachers in there.

What's your rules of work?

- My rules of work are simple. A to Z gravity.

In other words, the worst first.

And in my case... childhood was the worst.

- He was born in Kingston, New York,

which was the first capital of New York.

On July 3rd so he was almost a firecracker but...

On the 3rd of July in Skaneateles

they have flares that they plant around the lake.

And Barry for years thought it was for his birthday

because it was the 3rd of July. That was kind of fun.

I didn't have to put too much out on his cake.

This is my brother,

my only brother and my biggest brother.

He's big, yes.

Everything was funny to Barry.

I mean, the news was funny to Barry.

- Oh, he had a great relationship with his father.

His father was very humorous.

And he'd say to me.

"I had some good jokes to give him.

Barry didn't want them. "

My mother,

we'd be leaning in and, you know, lecturing

and my brother would talk back to her

in a voice like John Wayne.

My mother... and we would just crack up, you know'?

Because it's my younger brother talking to...

"Get ahold of yourself, mom. "

- And we rode around all day in the back roads,

smoking cigars and drinking beers.

- Yeah, we went down to Watkins Glen.

H was 1973.

Grateful Dead playing,

The Band and The Allman Brothers.

So, you know, we get there the first night.

We're camping out in tents.

Huge thunderstorm comes up.

Crimmins is all of a sudden out of the tent

with an umbrella, looking for something.

You know, a beer or something, you know? Whatever.

I happen to be looking, peeking out of my tent

right at the same time.

All of a sudden this frigging lightning bolt comes down.

Just fries the friggin umbrella,

Goes off into everywhere.

He told me he was on acid.

Probably... well, yeah.

Crimmins is, like, running around going, like,

"Wow, did you see that?"

Anybody else would have been fried.

- It was a good, centrally located place

for an idyllic childhood.

Except unfortunately the Catholic church

was only three blocks up there.

- You know, we grew up in those years Catholic.

Being taken to church every Sunday.

Barry was always going to church really early

in the morning before everybody else.

It was almost like Barry was a servant of the church.

- There's these early morning services in all churches,

ostensibly because priests are supposed to say

a mass every day.

It's, like, apparently some sort of, like,

milking a cow thing, I don't know.

There was this priest, Father Neary,

who hated me and I couldn't figure out why

'cause I was a sincere kid trying to do my job.

But early on Neary gave me the old

pedophile shoulder rub thing.

He started that.

And I just hit him with an elbow. it was a reflex.

And so I get stuck serving mass with this monster every day.

And he was really scary.

He looked like Christopher Lee,

the guy who played Dracula.

I would come in through the basement

and I would creep in and be as quiet as possible

because he was terrifying.

And there he would always be sitting in this chair,

and the stained glass would be bathing him in this eerie

green and blue and red.

And I would be on the altar

and I would pour the water to wash his hands

and he would go, "Are you trying to drown me?"

I would ring the bell. "You know we don't need...

you're not working with the fire department. "

Every day, he just made my life miserable.

He tried to get me into his car a couple of times.

"You wanna go get an ice cream?" No thanks.

- Yeah, we went to the same high school in Skaneateles.

He was a couple of years ahead of me.

Big jock.

He just came up to me one day and just goes,

"Listen, I'm doing a comedy thing over at Under the Stone. "

I remember it so clearly,

just walking into that side door

down underneath the restaurant.

And, you know, I was in the middle of a comedy act

m Skaneateles. New York.

- I don't know if ifs the awful weather

or what but there's something about that area

of Central New York where people are just,

just hilarious.

And years later I was reading this book about

the Iroquois Indians'

and apparently Ben Franklin and Thomas Jefferson

thought they were fucking hilarious.

So, yeah, there was an ad, you know,

"Comedians Wanted" for a comedy open mic night happening.

The ad did say.

"Comedians Wanted, Bear Cat"

People called him Bear Cat.

I don't know if he referred to himself as Bear Cat

tn the text of this ad.

- Oh, n did in the ad. - n did say n?

- Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. - Oh, okay. So guilty.

- We did start calling ourselves Bobcat and Tomcat,

- directly kind of making fun of, making fun. - As a spoof.

I used to be a doctor,

but now I'm

- I was 16, you were 15 I think.

- We were in high school anyway.

High school knuckleheads. How old was Barry then?

He was in his...

maybe like 26 or 27 when we met him.

Yeah.

So you know Barry would be calling and my mother was,

you know, understandably curious and a little nervous like...

- Yeah, yeah. - "Who is this Barry Crimmins?"

"He runs the comedy show at the Old Stone Mill... "

"What's he doing calling here?"

"He wants to talk about the comedy show. "

'How OK! is he?"

"I don't know... 40? 45'? I don't know. "

He always seemed like an old guy.

You talked me into doing comedy.

"Hey, you're funny, you know what I mean?"

Ah, I don't know. You were always Bob

"Full Steam Ahead" Goldthwaite.

And I'm Tom "Let Us Not Be Hasty'

Let's Weigh All The Options" Kenny.

You know, that whole night and that experience, like,

you know, going up and then getting the validation

of this guy Barry Crimmins,

that did change the whole course of my life, I think.

- To see Barry in this environment

with the comedy made sense.

It was extremely funny.

I mean, I laughed to the point of tears.

And he said to me,

"I'm gonna make a living at this if it kills me. "

And that was shortly before he left and came here,

he came to Boston.

He called me and goes,

"I found the perfect spot.

It's a Chinese restaurant

that does country western line dancing four nights a week.

I'll be able to talk him into anything. "

- "I'm gonna start a comedy club here.

We're gonna make it five days a week. "

- He ran a club there that everybody wanted to work.

It was a great club.

- Might have been the best comedy club ever.

- He saw the comedy wave coming.

- The Connection was paying $15 bucks a set.

Barry paid $20.

Connection said, "Okay, we'll pay $20."

Barry paid $25.

Connection went to $25, Barry went to $30.

And the next thing you know, you're making $400 bucks

on a Friday night.

That was Barry.

He recognized talent.

He booked Paula Poundstone over there.

Sweeney and Lenny.

- Bobcat Goldthwaite was part of that.

Kevin Meaney, Rogerson.

Dennis Leary.

- He basically spawned all of these great humorists.

It was a family, a real family, not like a show biz family.

It was fucking cool.

- He knew something was happening.

- We didn't know what hit us and it turned out to be

the foundation of comedy nationally.

He would take the money,

like, what I was being paid, like, $30 bucks.

He'd have it crunched up, crunched up

and he would throw it on the floor.

He'd just throw it on the floor at my feet.

He'd go, "There!" Then he'd walk away.

Jokingly, like, you know'?

Over and over. Not just once.

- Of all the bigger-than-life characters,

Crimmins was the biggest.

And you could tell he was, like, in charge.

- He wasn't the most successful comedian in Boston;

he was, like, the president of the scene.

- He had become this guy that you could go to

and he understood your plight.

He understood my comedy.

Even though I didn't even understand it myself.

What's wrong with you people'? God... my eye!

- He just seemed to have extra knowledge of stuff in general.

So if he was giving you a compliment comedy-wise,

it was really...

it felt good.

- I mean, I remember we did a Ding Ho reunion one time,

and everyone was going on and on about what a great guy Barry was

and how he helped me do this and,

you know, I said, "Look, I don't think Barry likes me.

And, you know, that's just the way it is. "

And then afterwards for, like, every time I saw him,

"Yeah, I don't like you,"

"Yeah I don't like you, I don't like you,

what are you gonna do about it?"�

"I don't like you. "

- And he was very direct with comics.

He had quality control at the Ding Ho

m terms of who he booked.

- I love most of the comedians that I work with.

Almost every single one of them.

- The first time that I performed at the Ding Ho,

I brought about 40 friends from the neighborhood.

I was supposed to do 5 minutes.

H ran about 24 minutes.

I don't want to brag,

I'm not trying to make anyone feel uncomfortable,

but two years ago I went to Europe.

Huh!

Excellent country.

I was an open micer

and Crimmins is in the back going, "That's Clark!"

"That's Sweeney!"

"Do your own shit, Tingle!"

You know, I was demoralized.

And so he was saying the next day,

"You know, you really have to go through your stuff

with a fine-toothed comb

to make sure it's not derivative of other people. "

I think that was the first time I heard the word "derivative. "

- You could tell straight away that there were other comics

who respected mm

but were a little irritated by their having to respect him.

Does that make sense?

I was really scared of him.

He didn't have an open demeanor.

- I think the terror of Barry Crimmins being mad

made us funnier.

- You know what else made me mad this summer

when we sold the Statute of Liberty

to huge corporations?

I felt we could have fixed that with our tax payer's money.

I would... would you be real indignant about that

if they took tax money...

What, you would say "You took our hard-earned

tax payer's dollars and you fixed the goddamn

Statute of Liberty'?

Next thing you know you'll be defending the Constitution. "

They surrounded the Statue of Liberty on its birthday

with rich thugs in yachts.

H's looking down and saying

"I asked for huddled masses. What is this?

Who painted "Beatrice" across my crown?"

Liberty and justice for sale.

I got sucked in. I donated $100 bucks,

they sent me a Statute of Liberty tote bag.

I use it to smuggle baby Mexicans into the country.

- Barry, are you going to vote this year?

- Yes, I already voted in the primary

and I will vote, certainly.

- Ah, would you tell us who you voted for?

Um... no.

...No?

- He was a very lovable, capable,

straightforward comedian

that was able to smuggle stuff about authoritarianism

and consumerism into a seemingly

middle of the road set

that the audience would laugh at and then it was too late,

they'd already started laughing at some pretty

subversive, you know, apocalypse-culture

son of stuff.

- Can you believe Exxon actually called a press conference

to tell us that they're going to pass the cost of the oil spill

along to us, the consumers?

No kidding.

I was sure the vice presidents at Exxon would have insisted

on paying for the entire affair.

"No, no, no, your money's no good here.

Those otters are on me, I've got those. "

Did you hear what the Chief of Staff

for President Bush John Sununu said about this oil spill?

He said, "Hey, nobody ever mentions how much oil

didn't spill out of the Valdez. "

Once in a while you need an up guy

like John Sununu, you know?

Is the tanker half-empty'?

- I was always amazed that Barry knew the stuff that he knew.

Before the internet, before CNN.

I was like, how do you know who

the Defense Minister in Syria is?

How do you figure that stuff out'?

- I have to say, I know when it was politics,

like, on stage or even hanging out'

if he said something, I would say that,

two thirds of what he's talking about

I don't know what he means.

- I love the new pope, too. He's a wonderful man.

He's a wonderful man.

A leftist, according to his PR man from Fox News,

Greg Burke.

Good man.

Celibate-.

Doesn't do a thing with his penis,

his dirty, dirty penis.

And he's selled to us that he's this progressive man who'

who tells that we should help out the poor.

We should help them.

We should help the poor...

'cause God forbid the church sell a fuckin' chalice.

- I remember in the mid 80s, seeing him,

maybe before I even started, you know, doing comedy.

So he's smoking, he's wearing a jacket,

maybe a tie.

He's got this afro and his mustache.

You know, he's greasing the audience with some garbage

about this and that.

Then he does a few political jokes

and just sort of, like, nothing.

He's getting nothing.

And he's exasperated.

And then he just stops, defeated and goes,

"All right, there are three branches of government... "

And he starts a civics lesson.

- I think to be a guy who takes the world very seriously

and is outraged by bullshit,

to have been really politically aware

at the height of the mass hypnosis of the Reagan era,

must have been acutely distressing.

- Let's start with the part that is the most controversial.

A few months ago I told the American people

I did not trade arms for hostages.

My heart and my best intentions still tell me that's true.

But the facts and the evidence tell me it is not.

- Our international policies under Reagan are great.

Central American policies are tremendous.

If people are hungry, kill them.

- But this group of over 150 religious leaders,

each baring crosses with the names of people

they say were killed by Contras,

was among those in Washington vigorously opposing

the president's proposal.

- Well, you know, I had been going to Nicaragua

for the previous three or four years.

I was a big supporter of the Sandinistas.

Barry was very much on top of what was going on down there.

He had done a lot of material about the Iran-Contra affair.

- The President's so into pulling boats into harbor

I'm afraid he's going to pull the boats into harbor

in Nicaragua which would be a big mistake

'cause he mined that three years ago

and he's old and he forgets.

- So he was the perfect person to bring.

- One of the finest political satirists you will ever see.

Would you please say hello to Mr. Barry Crimmins.

Barry?

- What a tough summer its been in the United States.

We have this big presidential election coming up.

Of course the big problem is someone will win.

Just some rambling notes from a guy

kind a freaked out in another land.

The Contras, though, from what I understand,

I mean, they keep comparing them to the founding fathers

of the United States, Thomas Jefferson and stuff.

And from what I understand they're cocaine dealers.

I never read a quote from Thomas Jefferson,

"Come on in the men's room, I'll tighten you up. "

I thought I was just supposed to say no to drugs...

unless they're from the Contras, then just say, "Si. "

- He was loved down there. People liked what he had to say.

He, you know, gave the whole group credibility.

- I keep hearing about the Contras, the freedom fighters.

And I thought about it for a while and I realized they are:

some of them have been fighting freedom for what,

close to forty years now.

Whenever it rears its ugly head.

They don't get that joke at the comedy clubs in America.

So I'm in Nicaragua

and I'm in this field hospital with all these kids.

H's so hot'

they're so uncomfortable'

a lot of them with fresh wounds.

You could see they're wrapped up in gauze,

and there's blood coming...

I mean, it's, like, really heavy.

And every kid on one of these cots has lost a limb.

Lost an arm or a leg, or whatever.

And for whatever reasons they said,

"Okay, Barry, you address this group. "

So I tell them that they're not my enemies,

and what has happened to them does not represent

what an awful lot of people I know,

and have listened to what I've had to say on stage

and in public, does not represent us.

And I do not want to harm children.

I do not want to harm babies who have...

I do not want to harm you.

You're beautiful

and you've been... and my country did this to you.

And as someone who believes in freedom this is what I do.

I say this is wrong.

And I oppose this.

And I love you.

And I hate fucking Ronald Reagan

and the fucking bullshit PR campaign

that this country is about.

I fucking despise it.

And I don't like to hate and despise

but I do cause it's crap

and it kills and maims and harms innocents.

And there's tears coming down the kid's faces.

There's tears coming down everybody's faces.

And then I just said, "That's all I got.

I got nothing else to say. "

And the applause starts.

I have heard the sound of one hand clapping.

I've heard the sound of one hand clapping

and it haunts me, stays with me my whole life.

- Why don't you just ask me what you most want to know'?

I mean, he told me at one stage of the game that,

you know, someone might call to interview me

but nobody asked me to be filmed.

Okay? You understand?

And so, um, so when I understand I'm being filmed

then suddenly I'm thinking,

oh, I think I'm being asked to discuss something

very intense.

- Anybody who does any kind of political humor runs into this.

It's not for everybody.

And so it's a hard thing anyway,

coupled with the fact of personal experiences

that are hurtful and haven't been resolved.

And in terms of drinking'

was he trying to block something out?

I don't know.

He would have to be the one to diagnose that.

- I don't think I've ever seen Barry

without a beer in his hand.

I think that was, you know, that was it.

- I remember that distinctly, watching him on stage and...

First of all not believing how much he could drink

and go on stage.

This isn't going to be enough, by the way.

- He's the hardest drinking man who's not an alcoholic.

We would do the show

and after the show the core would stay.

We'd lock up.

There are fights.

And they were behind the bar, like...

the first thing I noticed about the Boston scene

is they had the keys to the bar.

This place is magic.

And there's been a lot of magic here.

Kind of like that.

When I was 19,

I was at the other club owner's party

and I had been drinking and then I took some acid.

And I might have done some coke that night,

I don't know.

I was a maniac.

I was blacked out

and I just ripped the VCR off the television

and threw it out the window in a snow storm.

I kind of just destroyed the whole place.

The next day I couldn't have been less popular.

Like, everybody kind of abandoned me.

I felt so alone. I felt horrible.

And Barry just reached into his pants pocket

and gave me a couple hundred bucks and he said,

"Why don't you go home

and figure out what you're going to do with your life. "

And I've been sober ever since.

- We left the Ding one morning, about 5:30, 6,

and we went to a place on Mass Ave and it was closed,

or we were there too early, and I said,

"Why don't we go to Julia Child's house?"

Welcome to The French Chef.

I'm Julia Child.

1- This is a cheese souffle.

- So we go down by the river where she lived,

and we pull in.

Pull into Julia Child's driveway.

Get out of the car, bang on the door.

"Julia! Wake up!

Make us breakfast, you fucking bitch!"

And Crimmins is going'

"We're gonna get arrested, this is where she lives. "

He looked at the mail, he goes, I said,

"Yeah, I used to know, I know used to deliver mail...

I was the paper boy, like, I was... "

And I go, and he goes, "You're out of your mind. "

And of course the whole house woke up

and we managed to evade the police.

- I remember one time being in the dressing room with Crimmins.

He used to talk like, you know,

"We're gonna make a difference here. "

And I'm like, "Uh... does anyone have any coke'?

Is there coke around?"

- The most insane thing that happened at the Ding Ho

is everybody became a cocaine addict.

- So Barry, as you know, hates cocaine.

- And we all kept it from him, you know'?

- You doing drugs? What kind are you on?

- Uh, cocaine. You want some'?

Uh, no thanks.

- "No, I'm not doing coke. No, no, no. " You know?

So, you know, "I gotta go to the bathroom again. "

You know'? And you go in.

Yeah,... Do I look all right?

And he knew it.

- I get in the cab one day to go to the Ding Ho,

where I worked for several years to make the place happen.

And someone says, "You going over there to get some blow?"

"Jeez, no, I'm going over for the prostitutes. "

- Interestingly enough, he wasn't the alpha.

The alpha was Lenny and the beta was Barry.

- And he was, you know, he was cerebral and did his politics,

and I was the exact opposite end of the spectrum.

'Cause I love women.

Women are probably the number one reason

why I'm not a homosexual today.

Okay, I blew one guy but I needed a ride real bad.

Ah, you're great.

I'm kidding you, I'm teasing you, folks.

I didn't need the ride. See, the thing is...

- He would overlook my, my, my right wing,

my right wing nut job stuff...

because I pulled people into the club.

And he was not a stupid man.

He saw me bringing people in, and so he says,

"We'll put up with your bullshit because you bring people in.

But you're wrong! You're wrong!"

There was the night I walked in with a chainsaw

and I fuckin' sawed one of the tables in half

and the fuckin' place- I said, "Any hecklers here tonight?"

And sawed the table m half.

And the fucking crowd went crazy,

and Crimmins was steaming, just steaming.

Couldn't wait to fucking get me.

And he says, "Are you out of your fucking mind'?

What if that fucking chain broke

and went up and sliced someone's fucking face in half?"

I go, "Wow, man, that would have been cool. "

But you know, in retrospect, he's right.

What if I hit a, what if I hit, like,

a screw or something, and the chain, like,

you know?

People, they don't want to maimed.

They want to laugh 'till they puke or piss their pants

but they don't want to be maimed, you know'?

I voted for Ronald Reagan.

To this day I think he was a great hero to me.

And I'm sure he was the Antichrist to Crimmins,

and he said so on stage.

But I'm testimony to the fact that his compassion,

his humanity, isn't restricted to people that agree with him.

- You know, we were very close and very different.

He's more about anger and I'm son of more about depression.

He's also one of the few people I know who gets

more articulate the angrier and more upset he gets.

- Forgive me, and if I seem like I'm threatening stuff

or going after stuff, I'm negative or whatever...

no, but there's just a lot of bullshit out there

and I have all week to notice it

and you guys don't so I just try to report to you,

and I mean well, and if I seem negative or whatever,

please, it just means I'm still in there pitching

and everybody else has given up so who's positive

and who's negative in that deal? I don't know.

- You may recall, in 2005, there was a woman,

Cindy Sheehan, who had lost her son in the war.

And she wanted to see George W. Bush.

And she went down to Texas

and she was waiting outside the ranch.

- I don't want any more children to die.

I'm a broken-hearted morn.

Why would I want one more mother

to go through what I'm going through

just because Casey is dead?

- It started off a little slow with seven people

and then Barry came down.

He was there for weeks.

I mean, he... I mean, hundreds and hundreds of media came

as a result of his efforts.

- I think he could also see what was happening'

how the media and other forces were coming

to kind of spread their own message.

He is deeply offended

that the world doesn't think these things

are as important as the world says they are.

He would like the world to be a principled place.

He would like politics to be an honorable profession.

He would like the world (o share his values.

And one of the ways it's expressed when he's on stage

is in the tremendous kindness that he shows

to the audiences he's screaming at.

You know'?

- Barry Francis Crimmins is fucking ashamed

of the United States of America right now.

You should all be... if you've got no fucking courage,

if you don't stand up against this bullshit,

and you don't believe, go read some Tom Payne

and then see what you should do right now.

You decide what you do right now because I'm embarrassed.

I'm embarrassed to live in a country

where everyone's cowed into bullshit.

"Oh, well, well, but you know in the end

we're still the greatest land- ♪

We suck right now.

The United States of America in 2004 sucks right now

and is an embarrassment.

So lets see if that makes the cut.

I hope it does.

If it does, you're watching a good movie.

- He stopped, I think, worrying about whether

he was being funny or not.

And the audience, rightfully was like,

"Who the fuck is that guy'?

Why is he yelling at us

because I don't know about where chalk comes from? "�

- What I couldn't do is, I always had to close shows

and would watch the acts on before me,

and I would watch the audience think they were great

and I'd hate the audience by the time I got out there

because it was, you know... you know,

"Where you from'? What do you do? You're a queer. "

You know those comics.

Why do women go to the bathroom in pairs?

Because they get hassled by drunk men.

Write an act, you asshole!

How come foreigners drive cabs and work at the 7-11'?

Because they're entry level jobs, that's why.

Same reason your great grandparents built the rail road.

Write a goddamn act!

I used to be proud to consider myself

a stand up comic but I can't.

I don't want the guilt by association.

- He doesn't do it on purpose but he can make you feel

a little small or guilty about having had a...

really a basically incorrect political idea

or notion about something.

- I didn't mean to insult you or anything...

well, I guess I meant to, like, inform you

but it came out as an insult.

I'm awful goddamn sorry for that.

- He doesn't even really like the word "comedy".

And, you know, having covered comedy for so long'

I can understand how he's sort of at odds with it.

I sometimes feel cheap,

that I'm up just up on the stage making people laugh.

It's kind of like testing your reflexes.

It's just a nervous reaction.

And I think he has always felt that way'

I suspect, as a comedian,

that he wasn't going up there just to make people laugh.

- Fucking I hate comedy, I really do.

Almost everyone involved with it, ya know?

I'm super-needy but blah, blah.

What did you think?

- And it was extremely stressful just watching him

because first people would be mad that

they're not really laughing.

Some people would leave.

And then there would be... some people would heckle.

Barry doesn't...

he doesn't suffer fools wisely.

He lays into those hecklers.

It is completely unbelievable. It's just beautiful.

Whoever it is doesn't know'

does-n'! know what he's doing, really.

He thinks he's just going to yell at the guy on stage.

He doesn't know the force, the energy,

that he's going to be crushed verbally for two'

three minutes maybe.

Just overwhelmed.

- Someone would say something and he would just go off.

What?

Did I vote for Carter?

In this most recent election?

Yeah, I was a die-hard.

Jimmy Carter?!

What, if I don't like Reagan, I have to like...

therefore it falls I like Carter. Fuck you.

You're like a college student, aren't you?

College students these days are real hip.

"I support the president.

I've got a computer in my dorm.

I've never gotten laid. I got drunk once;

I'm pretty sure the beer was bad. "

Fuck you. Fuck your family.

No, he kept going and going.

And then he would fuckin' beat them down so much.

Want some more?

Fucking gold boy? Fuck you. Fuck you.

Jesus, not tonight, not tonight.

- And he would do a litany of shit.

More facts and'

"Did you know this? And did you know that?"

And the people would go, "What the fuck, man?

It's a comedy show. "

Jimmy Carter?!

What, do you think I like Jimmy Carter'?

Jimmy Carter and his immediate family has never been seen in

public without mucus on some part of their body.

Carter's best plan to get the hostages out

is go out into the desert and attack ourselves

with helicopters.

You know what he promises?

"A government as good as its people. "

Apparently we suck.

"If you don't like Reagan, you like Carter. ll follows. "

Fuck you.

"Fuck you.

Fuck you, Mister Politic Boy.

That shit doesn't affect me. "

He goes, "It doesn't affect you?!"

- My impression of Richard Nixon:

"Where is that constitution?"

How come nobody ever shot that motherfucker?

Shoot him. Piss on his grave.

He would go into a rage.

And I said, "Barry, what the fuck?"

- There was something shaky and weird about him

but I couldn't put my finger on it.

- I don't know if a lot of people knew why at that point.

I don't 'think I did.

- I certainly wasn't the only one who noticed it'

but there was just... you knew that wasn't him.

And then when all that stuff happened with him,

you kind of understood, you know,

that self-protective shell that he put over himself for so long.

- I remember writing about it and talking to him and saying'

"You gotta cutout the clubs for a while.

The clubs just aren't working for you.

I don'! know what you're going to do next

but the clubs obviously aren't the right place for you. "

As I look back now in retrospect,

a lot of this makes sense.

- Okay. Mm-hmm. I love you.

- Okay. Bye, mom.

He's had some rough times

but he's like I am, you know?

I've had them, too, but I forget about the rough ones

and try and be happy that I'm alive and doing well.

- I knew my mother liked Black-Eyed Susans

and I would pull clumps of them out of the ground.

I didn't know that you were supposed to cut them off,

so I would bring them to her like clumps

with the roots still dangling, all full of dirt.

And because she liked it so much I kept doing it,

and I didn't realize she was getting kind of a kick out of me

being an idiot.

Now I feel bad about wiping out generations

of Black-Eyed Susans.

But, you, know, that's me, I find a way to ruin anything.

He was really a great boy.

- So this was dated back in early May of 1992.

"Barry Crimmins has been the social and liberal conscience

of the Boston comedy almost since its beginning.

His topical and political humor has always been

intensely personal and acidic.

Crimmins took both of those traits to a new level last night

in perhaps the most highly-charged

and soul-baring monologue ever staged

in one of the city's comedy clubs. "

That was amazing.

He got up at Stitches.

- It was just like a regular stand up comedy show.

And the crowd was good

and he was popular in Boston and everybody loved him,

you know, so they were all psyched.

- There was nothing funny about it,

as one might imagine.

"Near the end of the night'

after a rambling, scathing indictment

of almost every aspect of American government

and culture'

a clearly tortured Crimmins suddenly shifted topics. "

- Anytime somebody that you've known for a long time

discloses something huge and game-changing and...

it makes you rethink that whole person.

- "Since I was a little kid, he began,

I could never stand to see anyone innocent victimized.

I've always identified with victims and thought that was

because I was some white kid from a rich town

in upper state New York.

Only recently, Crimmins went on, did he really begin

to understand that wasn't the reason.

The room instantly grew as silent as a newly dug tomb. "

- So I'm a little kid... I'm a real little kid...

and I'm by all reports a sweet little kid.

Curly haired...

I mean, I remember everybody loving me.

I remember, you know, strangers doting on me'

and I remember trusting everyone'

and I remember delighting in, figuring out what's going on.

What, you know, day and night is,

and what, you know, the sun is.

I was a good little kid, you know?

And I deserved a break.

I was a sweetheart like every little kid. You know?

I deserved a break.

And I didn't know what was headed my way.

You know, my parents who weren't...

they just went out sometimes so they had a babysitter.

And, uh...

the babysitter kind of set me up

and made me like her a lot.

And then this guy started coming over

who was her mother's boyfriend or something.

You know, something that was an arrangement that wouldn't

have been formally discussed in the late 50s.

Sometimes you know who's not good.

And anyway this guy was not good.

And,you know, I can remember him, like,

touching my curly hair.

There was always, like, an attraction, you know'?

Like, I generally didn't mind but this guy...

there was something just wrong.

You know, I couldn't tell you now how many times.

I mean, I could never...

how many times or whatever but it was a number of times.

This guy would come over,

he would take me down in the basement and... rape me.

- Barry felt that it was key to interview you.

He actually said to me that you're his hero.

And that's in regards to...

ms rape.

- It's scary for anybody of any age to really see

someone who's gone, who's the face of evil,

who's like this nothing.

There's no soul there.

There's nothing. It's just so...

possessed by what they have,

what they feel like they have to do,

what they can't not do.

And I would of course scream and cry...

and... my face would get shoved into these couch cushions...

to muffle the noise.

Well, this sewed to suffocate me and I...

I would get asphyxiated and pass out.

This is...

a lot to ask of me.

Anyway, so... let's see...

So I was, like, five.

So I.. - even like a normal five year old,

I sneaked in the house, right?

And nobody was upstairs.

So I thought that was very strange, like,

you know, where's Barry?

Where's the babysitter?

So...

I went downstairs,

walked down the stairs and...

you know, I thought Barry was dead.

Then the babysitter saw me and yelled my name

and then Barry looked up at me...

And I ran and just... knew he needed help.

So I made it up almost to the top stair

and she got my foot'

and I was screaming, and I bit the babysitter.

Pretty hard.

- I read of this poor little girl in India

who was raped to death.

I think she was 3 years old.

Imagine that. I mean, I've been through some stuff'

but being raped to death...

Well, I mean, that's the end of your whole life.

And I just felt so badly for her,

felt so terrible for her.

And I was, you know, relating to it,

and I was just thinking, yeah, so, it could've been worse.

I had almost been raped to death a number of times.

- But it's that glance that gets you,

you know what I mean?

Life registers in, in... kind of visually on people, you know?

It's a glance that lasts a lifetime, you know?

Just like the glance from my brother, you know?

And I had to, like, belt out of there and run up some stairs

and what the hell'

and yet the whole world was changed for both of us

from that point on, you know?

- It was the most shocking thing I think in my life that I heard,

when I heard the whole story.

I mean, it makes you just revile humanity.

It makes you want to hug Barry and just... or fucking kill him,

you know, put him out of his misery.

And it just took a long time for me as his friend to get over it.

- To me it gave me a little bit of resolve

knowing the man that I do.

'Cause there was, there was always anger there.

There was always something.

- He's always seemed a little angry. - There was always...

- he was always pissed off at something, and... - And he'd show it on stage too.

- And it started to kind of fit into place.

- I do remember the headline in The Phoenix:

"Baby Rape. "

And it was, you know, something

that I don't think I understood,

fully comprehended at first.

It was like something that I myself would go'

you know, "Why, why would you, why are you talking about that?"

You know? "That was a long time ago.

Why bring that up?" You know?

And it wasn't until that I came to terms with my own sexuality

and my own abuse

that I looked back on that and said,

"Look at how courageous, you know,

he was to admit that and not be afraid. "

A lot of gay people here tonight?

Just me. OK.

You know, Lenny had called Crimmins

and told him that I was gay.

And then he called me and it wasn't...

he didn't even ask me, you know,

if I was or wasn't gay.

It was just, like, this kindness that he had that,

it would be okay if I was.

And I just continued to deny it, you know?

"No, I'm not, I'm not. "

Because that was my whole life, you know?

That, you know, you were just, like'

constantly hiding that you are who you are'

you know, so I couldn't admit it.

It took me a long time to, you know, come to that,

come to those terms'

and when I did, you know, I called Barry and it wasn't...

he didn't say, "I knew it," or anything like that.

It was just this kindness that he had,

and if it was anything that, you know,

if there was anything that he could do to help me,

you know, he would be there.

But you can be a football player.

You can be a fucking homo and be a football player.

How about that?

You couldn't do that years ago.

Now you can be a football player.

And everybody's going, "Oh my God, he's so brave.

He's so brave!

He plays football, and he's gay.

He's brave. That's brave. "

I'll tell you what's brave.

I told my wife I was gay. That's brave, alright?

That is brave.

- So many people said this to me:

"Well, are you talking to anyone about it?"

Yeah, I thought I was fuckin' talking to you.

You know?

But what they're really saying is go talk to the psychiatrist

who's then gonna... and I did, and you know'

they said, "Well, there's a variety of things... "

and basically they were just telling me

what drugs they could put me on

and for once in my life I turned down drugs.

- I was sitting in the offices of Moving Forward,

the news journal that I published and edited,

and answering phones,

and I get this call and it's Barry Crimmins.

So he told me a little bit about himself,

but it was very humble, you know?

He didn't get into, you know,

all this stuff about being a famous person

or, you know, anything like that.

He really just wanted someone to talk to.

He had been rejected repeatedly by numerous organizations

who were out there supposedly helping victims

of childhood sexual abuse and...

you have male survivors and you have female survivors

and generally the two mix quite well,

at least in my experience.

But there are, you know, both men and women

who don't want anything to do with the opposite gender,

you know, the gender that they were abused by'

and unfortunately Barry encountered a couple

of these people in Cleveland.

When Barry went to Cleveland

he kind of stopped doing comedy

and was looking for other survivors,

people like him who had been raped as a child.

And this was when AOL was in its infancy.

And they had all these chat rooms.

- You know, Barry called me up one night and he said,

"Lana," he said'

"Go here and then go here. "

You know, "Look at this. "

And I, I just went...

Wow, I couldn't believe, you know, what I was seeing.

- What he ended up finding was people exchanging

child pornography.

- You know, it's the first time these people

ever had a community.

You know, I mean, you really could never talk

to other child molesters or whatever.

And they're emboldened and living it up,

and when I first stagger in there,

I do what any normal person would do,

I just go, "Are you people crazy?"

- Somebody would in good faith send you a file

and expect something in return.

- They very often would start sending me child pornography

to show me how much fun I could have.

- He had gone to AOL repeatedly and said,

"Look what you're hosting, this horrible stuff. "

And they would just, you know, patronize him and say,

"Thank you for your help with this" and do nothing

'cause they were making a ton of money off of it.

- You know, we're used to broadband, okay?

I mean, you know, this...

when we were on dial-up modems, this was not a flat rate,

and if you spent a certain level of time online,

you got charged more.

- And one of the main things that these child molesters

talked about in these rooms was, you know'

they're spending a thousand, $1,200 a month to be on AOL.

- So Barry poses as two children

and stockpiled all this information

that was evidence... crime evidence.

That's what child pornography is.

- I make an account, and I make it two kids,

and they say "Our parents make us share...

our stupid parents make us share an account. "

- I just can't imagine kind of locking yourself away

and pretending to be, you know,

one of these people that caused him such misery

in order to set them up.

- If you've seen child pornography...

when you've seen a picture of a little kid

with curly red hair getting raped by a big guy

who looks exactly like him with curly red hair,

and the look on the kid's face and his eyes'

you can see, like, the humanity leaving the kid...

The loss, the... he's just shutting down

as much as he can while still being alive.

- I know that seeing what he saw

was something that he couldn't get out of his head.

- You know, he damaged himself to, like, save these kids.

And, you know, you talk about things that you can't unsee,

and he saw so much horrible stuff.

- I think that one of the things that's so extraordinary

about this is how physically sick Barry was.

- He told me he got down to something like 155 pounds,

which, you know, was probably a good 100 pounds lower

than he had been.

- He had a haunted, hollow look.

I've never seen anyone transform to a shadow of a person

like I saw him transform.

- As with most people who have been abused,

different things are gonna come back to you at different times.

Somethings going to trigger a memory.

A difficult, painful memory.

And I know that this did.

I know that this did that-.

- This guy contacts me and he says,

"I want you to take a pair of your underwear

and pee on them,

and... do you know what a Ziploc bag is?" I said, "Yeah. "

"Put them in a Ziploc bag and mail them to me. "

And I said'

"Sure, give me your address. "

I became aware of Barry

because my immediate boss instructed me

and another fellow prosecutor

to go out to his house and to speak to him.

He had something to (ell us.

We drove to Lakewood. It wasn't too far away.

It was in an apartment complex.

I remember we had to pound on his door a number of times

to get his attention.

He finally came to the door'

and we were met by a man who was fairly striking.

He had dark hair.

Unkempt, for sure.

- You know, here's Barry with a Che poster up.

A lifelong LSD enthusiast.

I'm sure they...

I don't know what they thought of Barry.

- He had been looking on the computer

and researching the sharing that was taking place.

People were talking to each other on computers

and at the time our office didn't even have computers.

We couldn't understand what he was talking about.

How were people communicating with each other on computers?

- Yeah, you can even talk with people all over the world

on chat lines.

- Don't they have chess games and stuff like that, too'?

- Yup. They got more stuff than you can imagine.

- It was clear that he had knowledge

about what he was doing,

but when we saw him, it didn't make sense.

He was a man that I could describe as crazed at the time.

He said that they were sending images of children

who were being raped

and images of children who were having sex with adults.

It's something that we had never heard of before.

We were shocked. We were astonished.

I mean, I left there fairly shaken

and not knowing how our office

was going to deal with that into the future.

He essentially left us with a big problem.

- I was thinking Frank Capra but feeling Don Knotts

as I began my testimony before the U.S. Senate

Judiciary committee.

My hand trembled so rapidly

that there were small craft warnings for my water glass.

- There's no excuse in presenting pornography

where children can get ahold to it.

- Senator Strum Thurmond, Pterodactyl, South Carolina,

Thurmond's genius may be that nobody ever

knows what the hell he's saying.

The indecency.

The lawlessness of pornography

being presented where children can reach it

should not be allowed under the law.

- I unsuccessfully stifled a huge grin

as he blathered some senatorial cordiality

that he was appreciative that'

"This here hearing was important

'cause it concerned children. "

- Our children are the future of this country.

- Senators Russell Feingold of Wisconsin,

Mike DeWine of Ohio and Paul Simon of Illinois

all boasted of their unfamiliarity with the internet.

This being 1995.

It seemed as if they took a certain manly pride

in how low tech they were.

- Most of the Senators who voted wouldn't have the foggiest idea

how to get on the internet in the first place.

- My children, if they were here'

would tell you that I'm computer illiterate,

so you're gonna have to kind of take" walk me through this.

- I have to say there is no one in this room

with the possible exception of Senator DeWine now

who is less competent in this area

of computers than I am.

- Each bravely disregarded his cyber illiteracy

and went on to espouse numerous platitudes

and make impassioned, ambiguous statements.

- You know, I'm not a lawyer, and I'm not going to say

that I know exactly where things fall within the Constitution.

- After hundreds of hours of documenting

things to sickening to relate,

my moment had arrived.

A man stepped up beside me.

After months of knocking on AOL's door,

I was suddenly face to face with Bill Burrington.

My name is Bill Burrington.

- America Online's Assistant General Counsel

and Director of Government Affairs.

Burrington was nattily attired and youthfully handsome

with male model, slicked back, wind tunnel resistant hair.

His shoes were worth more than my education.

So there I sat'

my heart pounding but in the right place.

Sitting in the sterile, formal environment

of the U.S. Senate hearing chamber,

I was haunted by the horrifying images

I had seen over the past seven months.

The children with the dead eyes and (he defiled bodies.

I wished everyone could see the pictures.

I wished no one could see the pictures.

And I thought about the kids who could still be protected.

My name is Barry Crimmins.

I'm a writer and a children's rights and safety advocate

residing in Lakewood, Ohio.

I'm also an adult survivor of childhood sexual abuse.

I go into this hearing with my suit and my Jerry Garcia tie on

and I look like a, you know, a marijuana grower

at his arraignment.

Much of the controversy surrounding the problems

of online pedophile centers on parental controls.

- Parental control protects the vast majority of families

where parents want to control what their children do.

In many cases, the parents themselves are the perpetrators

of these crimes.

This issue completely disregards the serious reality.

AOL constantly has rooms entitled "Family Fun,"

"Nudist Families," "Incest is Best,"

"Have Hot Step Daughter," and so on.

In these rooms, child pornography is traded

and incest is discussed and celebrated.

Many of the photos that are exchanged are purportedly

of people's own children.

- Mr. Crimmins rejects parental control on the basis

that some parents transmit images of their own children.

But we think this misses the point.

- I'm all for parental control software.

I was, I was mischaracterized as being against it.

I just pointed out a flaw in it'

that some parents abuse their children.

- He was angry, and they're not used to hearing anger.

And of course he was angry.

Look at what he'd just been through.

They weren't quite sure what to make of Barry.

I hope this will result in the arrest of numerous traffickers

m child pornography.

I also hope that it establishes that AOL has had a great deal

of prior knowledge as to how its service is being misused

and therefore AOL facilitates and profiteers

on these dastardly crimes.

- I think that there were some statements made that are,

are accurate and some that are a bit misleading

and we appreciate Mr. Crimmins involvement in this issue.

We want to make sure we have an accurate record.

We want to work with Congress to protect children;

empower parents to screen out unwanted material;

and preserve constitutional guarantees of free speech,

free press and individual privacy.

- These people are deluding themselves

if they think child pornography is protected speech.

It is not. It is crime evidence.

During his testimony,

he made several patronizing references to me,

and he attempted to dismiss as dated

many of the problems I described.

- Much of the activity that Mr. Crimmins has been involved

on America Online occurred early this year,

in January/February.

Last Monday afternoon'

I was sent numerous files of child pornography.

I attempted to forward it to AOL's post office boxes,

the toss adviser, toss email, they...

n said that n was unavailable

because it was full in both cases.

I don't know how much it would cost them to open up

another mail box for themselves.

And I haven't heard back about those files,

for example, and I very rarely do.

- Now, in your case, you did receive responses.

I've reviewed the correspondence and you received responses...

- I've received responses at times,

but I haven't received responses at other times.

And the more heinous it is, the less response I get.

It's like there's denial involved or something.

Well, there's no denial here.

We're trying the best we can to manage our growth.

- Mr. Burrington, let me make sure I understand

what your testimony is.

You mention that it's your company's policy

that if we've got a room full of pedophiles

and you see that going on, that you try to zap that out.

Is that correct?

- We truly have pretty much "three strikes, you're out"

at America Online, as a lot of the services do,

which is you are given a warning...

- I don't think child... people trafficking child pornography

should get three strikes.

I think they should get one strike.

I don't think that they deserve three strikes.

I think that's a heinous crime,

and I think one strike and you should be out

for child pornography.

- OK, let's take it, if I could...

- And all of a sudden I see Chuck Grassley

lean over to his aide and go.

"Who is this guy?"

And, you know, the guy goes,

"He's one of ours. "

Grassley's like' "Oh, OK, OK."

I had 'em.

And Burrington from that point on

had lost his very expensive footing.

I've explained this to AOL,

I've sent them extensive questions...

I've almost did an interrogatory...

for the past several months.

Their response has been arrogant and dismissive.

Barn/ continued, and the buzzer's going off.

How close are you to, uh...

- I'm getting there. I'm very close.

- OK, I hope so. - OK.

- Barry's just blowing right through 'em.

- It's not hyperbolic to state that AOL is the key link

in a network of child pornography traffickers

that has grown exponentially over the last several months.

What has recently taken place is nothing short

of the de facto decriminalization

of child pornography.

This is a full scale emergency'

and I'm here to tell the American people today

that not only are their children in danger

when they're on AOL'

they're in danger because of America Online.

Thank you.

- I remember not really getting the depth

of what Barry had been through

until I saw a list of the names of the chat rooms.

And when I sat with that list on my desk'

after I printed it out,

I just put my head down on my desk and sobbed.

And...

it wasn't only because of my own abuse,

you know, because I saw, you know,

"Daddy Does Daughter," and, you know,

just this vile, you know, representation of violence

against children.

But it was because I saw just in words

what Barry had been through.

- If you can judge a person by the enemies they make,

you know, my enemies are, like, NAMBLA and politicians.

Now, I can live with that.

- I think the important thing about Barry is his connection

with trying to make the world a better place.

That's the thing that never, never changes, you know'?

He's not become cynical about it.

He's not allowed it to sort of

poison the way he feels about people.

I always hit it off with Barry right from the beginning

because although he was political,

he wasn't sort of ideological.

- The most memorable show that I saw Barry Crimmins do

was he was performing with Billy Bragg

and it was a big tour that Billy was doing

with the Red Star Army'

and Barry Crimmins was really opening the show.

He was the emcee for the show.

- So we invite him on and he would, you know,

do the equivalent of a guitar solo.

He would do a couple of punchlines.

We'd break, he'd lay in there.

1,2,3,4.

- You know, Billy, a lot of people ask me...

You say you're from the United States,

But if I hate that country so much,

why don't I get out of it?

I say, "Because I don't wanna be victimized

by its foreign policy. "

- It was almost like a Socialist

sort of version of Laugh In where Barry would tell a joke

and then Billy would go back into a song.

I guess he was...

I guess he would've been the Goldie Hawn of it.

It's just funny where'

you know, I'm working in bars every night,

and we're just going, and we're telling our dick jokes

and going home or whatever, you know'?

So Barry wins this Peace Award from this Peace Abbey.

So I go to be at the ceremony or whatever

and it's... the two recipients... it's Barry and Maya Angelou.

You know?

So they had the ceremony'

and Gandhi's grandson is there

to present the award to Maya and Crimmins.

And... he's overweight.

Like, he's pretty overweight.

And I'm just, we're at the ceremony,

and Crimmins just whispers to me like,

"That's Gandhi's grandson.

He could lose a few. "

Let me ask you this:

Irish... religious upbringing?

- I'm a Catholic but it's in remission.

It's in remission?

Based on fear and real estate.

- Did your religious upbringing influence your politics,

do you think?

- Yes, those people mistreated me so much

that they made me start to believe in that kind of stuff.

I tweet the Pope every day demanding excommunications.

You know, we gotta have our hobbies.

I haven't been to mass in 43 years.

Our trial separation is over.

Please excommunicate me.

Chase away the Monday blahs by doing something new

like excommunicating me.

I know what you've done.

I know what you represent. Are you fucking kidding me'?

I go, send me... I'll know I'm in hell...

if there's Popes and Bishops there, shitbag.

Later on... this is now 40 years later...

and my friend John Considine calls me one day and says,

"Go online, check out the Syracuse Post-Standard

and there's a story about Neary in there.

And this guy Charlie Bailey has gone public

and talked about how

he had been tremendously sexually abused. "

- Barry's helped me by telling me, you know,

that, reinforces, that you'

you're told that you're the only one

and you feel like you're the only one.

And then Ban? saying, you know,

he had I'll n-ins with Neary, and...

you know, you feel a little bit good

that you found somebody else that's been in your shoes,

but then you feel awful that they exist, too.

These guys are masters at what they do.

I mean, they're...

I would swear to God they take a class somewhere

because what he did is he told my mother, he says,

you know, I would be upset after my counseling sessions

because it's really hard to be a priest

and there's a lot of pain and sacrifice involved

in becoming a priest,

so if afterwards I was upset or I was crying,

I was withdrawn, just ignore it.

Say a prayer over 'em and ignore 'em.

And this is all about 6 weeks worth of grooming

before he finally raped me.

- This piece of shit operated for years,

and was from church to church all over upstate New York,

harmed hundreds of children.

Countless little boys.

I know of probably 25, 26.

- I had been raped by a priest, when I was 12, 13 years old

and this guy's name was Thomas Neary.

I was in a deep, dark depression,

and I really didn't know what to do or where to go.

Sometimes I would type this priest's name in the internet

to see if there was anybody out there.

So I typed in his name and up came Barry Crimmins' name.

- If I ever saw anybody do that to a kid,

I would be over that fucking railing so fast'

smashing his head with a tabernacle or whatever

the lucky magic shiny shit they should sell

and feed the poor with.

I saw people keep their mouths shut and not break silence

and not take action when a child was being harmed

right in front of their eyes.

How much did that...

how much did everyone? silence embolden Neary?

He tested the waters with what he did to me in public

on that altar every morning.

He did Mo me.

If he could get away with that shit in public,

what do you think he could get away with in private,

And what he could get away with was raping kids

and making them swallow his filthy, fucking semen

and telling them it's Eucharist, that's it's the body of Christ.

Fuck him. Burn.

I hope there's a hell you fucking piece of shit, Neary.

I hope there's a fucking hell, and I hope there's an eternity,

and I hope they triple the time of it,

you fucking piece of shit.

Fucking Pope.

Fuck you, Pope! Fuck you, Pope!

And they find Francis of Assisi after a thousand years?

Oh. I'm so mad.

I mean, like, I fucking hate the Ca-

I mean, really, God bless everybody.

Nah, I don't mean to say that.

But I don't mean not to.

'Cause I don't like, you know I...

atheists are just so evangelical.

It's like you become.

You know, you become what you resist.

You're evangelists. You know, like, I don't care.

Telling me that we all gotta believe the fucking shit'

or I don't gotta believe the fucking shit,

or whatever the fuck it is.

Leave me the fuck alone!

I got tortured enough as a child dealing with

the fucking Catholic church.

And I don'( want to sign off on your fucking shit

or talk about it anymore!

I just wrote that.

"Many people are so overwhelmed by the thought of child abuse

that they'll do just about anything to change the subject

when it's mentioned.

The most common device these subject switchers utilize

is the ultimate decree.

They'll say, 'I think if someone gets caught abusing a kid,

they should be rounded up and killed.

Case closed. '

I wouldn't have wanted my rapist

put out of his own misery and into mine.

I started life without blood on my hands,

and I aim to keep it that way.

Had the man who had raped me on numerous occasions

not died in prison while serving his third term

for sexually abusing very young boys,

I might have gone to see him.

My personal revenge would've been to show him

that I did not become what I resisted.

And I hadn't grown into a cruel and heartless man.

I would've told him that he inflicted a burden upon me

that almost killed me.

And not just when I was nearly asphyxiated

during his savage assaults.

Then I would tell him that I was sorry that he had such

a miserable and wasted life.

Even if I supported the death penalty,

I wouldn't want child rapists killed simply because

they were once children themselves.

In all likelihood, they were abused children.

While most victims of childhood sexual assaults

don't grow to become pedophiles,

the vast majority of pedophiles

were sexually abused as children.

Who knows what would've happened to me

if I had been raped a few more times or a few years later. "

Now, if it had been five more times,

would I have gone over, would I be the rapist today?

Would I be the m... you know,

would I be the horrible person today?

I don't know.

So spiritually, I mean'

I feel like I have this huge debt to pay.

I feel like there's entire nations that feel like I do.

You know? There's entire nations.

And you know what, and that's why I don't give a shit about

American dreams or whatever 'cause,

I mean, you know what, I, that's who I am.

That's the country I am.

I'm of the country of the raped little kids.

I'm of the country of the fucking heartbroken.

And the screwed over.

And the desperate with no chance to be heard.

That's what country I'm from.

- People tended to believe that abuse in males

was exceptionally rare.

Well, I think we know now that's not the case.

And a lot of that is in large part to what Barry's done.

I mean, Barry has been very out there as a survivor.

- I've had some problems from when I was younger

from people you trusted very we'll

and they did some bad things to you

and he helped me get rid of that to a point

where I can focus on more of my family

than rather than have that be in my mind all the time.

That's one of the things he knows about my life

that there ain't a lot of people that know.

And, uh... he did that for me,

and I'm very thankful for him for that.

- Any chance Barry got, he was defending me

or he was telling the true story

'cause of course there were a lot of lies

and stuff out there about me'

but he was there to say.

"You know, I actually know Cindy Sheehan,

and this is the Cindy Sheehan that I know. "

- It started, like, on Memorial Day.

And I was just home, and I was, and he said,

"No Vet should be alone on Memorial Day.

You should have a... you should have some cook-out. "

So he bought me one of them big barbecue chickens

and some other stuff and it was...

and then, and then he left, you know,

he was like, you know, a ghost sometimes.

He would do stuff when I was asleep.

Sometimes I'd wake up and, you know,

the dishwasher is empty or there's something, you know'?

Ifs like, how'd this happen?

To me, prayer is behavior.

You don't stand on a mountain and say'

"I believe in God and you don't.

Therefore I'm saved and you're damned. "

Prayer is gestures.

It's trying to do the right thing,

always trying to weigh the right and wrong in everything

before you make a decision.

And Barry always does that.

- I think those of us who survived

have all learned coping skills.

I'm not sure when I first met Barry,

which probably was in the 80s.

İf he had all the coping skills stitched together.

He used to talk about being followed by the wolf.

The things he had yet to work out.

The rape. You know'?

The rage at some of the political things that happened.

- It's almost like there's a need in him to get back

what was taken from him then.

You know?

But the reality of that is there is no getting that back.

- I gotta tell you. You know what?

I don't give a fuck anymore.

I don't give a fuck. Let me tell you this shit.

Monday...

Monday, we went to the basement...

we filmed in the basement where I got raped as a little kid.

And so since then,

I don't know, I've been a little spacey.

You're gonna laugh. It's OK.

But I went.

You know, I went there.

I don't really go back there and hang around that often.

You know, I've done my quote unquote "work",

although there's always more to do sometimes.

And what I believe about that work for abuse survivors,

you have to go through things and not around them.

But "through" is a goal, you know?

You get "through" it.

I was given some sort of a gift, or I have some sort of a gift

or was born with it,

where I can convey things to people

they don't generally want to hear about.

If there were some grand rhyme or reason to things,

I could understand why I was gonna grow up

to be a big strong man who knew how to tell people stuff

they didn't want to hear and make 'em like it.

You know, not like what was happening

but make it accessible to people.

What I came to learn and out myself a break about

and many other people

is when you meet people and they behave oddly

or they have these weird quirks

or whatever it is they're doing,

if you figure out where they come from,

what happened to them, whatever their deal is,

you realize there's sanity at the source

and instead of this behavior being like insanity,

it's in fact ingenious.

It's a survival technique.

So, you know, I had my survival techniques.

There's no way... coming someplace where

what happened to me as a child, coming back to it,

does make your breath a little shorter

and you feel it a bit in your...

in the pit of your stomach.

Thais W? Hob; "�My.

It's a different place. Good.

So it's just sort of on, you know, sort of on this site.

You know... and I don't think we need to...

I don't think there's any need to build shrines to demons.

Um, I...

I hope that there's been a lot more good spirits here

than that one awful one...

and that generations of kids have grown up and visited

and played in that house

without anything happening to them

except things that should happen to kids.

They got a chance. They learned about life.

They had fun. They laughed.

And that's the only trepidation I would have about this

is I wouldn't want any kid that lives here, you know...

Although, we have to compromise a little bit

of children's innocence to keep them safe.

To tell them they must be protected...

YOU know?

There's no shrine to that maniac

who did those heinous crimes to me and my sister.

Maybe because even witnessing it'

you know, is severe violation of a young spirit or anybody.

Yeah.

Nothing special.

Just a basement.

You know, if that kid can survive that,

if I can survive what happened to me,

you can at least hear about it or think about it,

YOU know?

H's not that much too ask.

I know it's unpleasant, and I know that people give us,

"Oh, everybody is a victim. "

Well, I'm not a fucking victim. You know?

I'm not a victim. I was but I'm not anymore.

And, uh...

But I am a witness.

You know? And...

I'm my life's testimony.

You know, not only to what happens to kids,

but what you can go on to do and become,

no matter what they do.

Unless they kill you. You know?

But that was close in my case.

It was real close. But I'm here, I made it.

Thus, call me lucky.

OK?

And I'm not coming back here again.

- He might say that he hasn't changed

but when I first knew Barry he was just a raw nerve.

He still has that fire in him,

but it's a little less at the whole world

and at specific targets.

- You know who the biggest suck-heads in the world are?

The people who think they're clever,

that are like, "Well, I happen to be politically incorrect. "

And now you get to act like you're a cutting edge rebel

because you're reinforcing the oppressive status quo.

You sack of fucking rancid horse assholes!

- I remember from my youth thinking, like,

you know, this guy needs to be taken down a notch.

Do you know what I mean?

It's like, who does he think he is'?

And now ifs sod of like' well, someone should,

he should be taken up a notch, I think.

- He gives a voice to all those moments that you have

that, where you can't seem to articulate your anger at this,

this entity, this, this...

at the injustice in the world and how powerless we are.

But he's a reminder that you do have power.

- I think underneath the cynicism and the rage

is a sense of idealism and justice.

The child who first discovered

that everything they told him about society

was supposed to operate was untrue.

And that begins a life journey to reconcile that.

- I'm tired of being called a radical.

I don't think I'm radical. I don't think you're radical.

I don't think we're radical.

What's so radical about what we want?

We want peace.

We want economic justice.

We want civil rights.

We want jobs. We want hope.

We want public transportation.

I'm a radical?

No, I'm not a radical.

I don'! have 400,000 troops assembled in a desert

wearing scuba diving suits

to bring me more oil and I'm already choking to death on.

That's radical.

- People go, "Why do you have to say that you're gay'?

Why do you have to do that?"

Well, why don't I'?

Why shouldn't I be able to get up there

and tell people who I am'?

And why shouldn't Barry get up there

and tell people where he's come from

and his plight and his journey that he's been on'?

And that's what, that's what comedy,

that's where n comes from.

İt comes from, comes from jour...

it comes from a lot of places' but it comes from pain, too.

- My mother goes to me, please go to the priest.

Tell the priest that you're gay.

Please do that for me before I die.

Please, go to confession.

So I went to confession, and I told the priest that I was gay,

and it was very difficult to tell him that.

Uh, now we're dating, but so it worked out... really well

- Well, I'd never call Barry a saint.

And Barry...

you know, he always grumbles about God'

but I know I think half the reason why Barry's so funny

is a gesture of healing'

and it sounds kind of corny to put it like that.

You know what I mean?

But I think, really, it's from something deep inside him.

- He's like music. He's harmony.

He's nature.

He has an understanding what beautiful is,

and he has an understanding of what horrific is.

- You know, I'd like to sort of in many ways be more like Barry.

He's been wonderful to me

with all this problems that I've had.

He's always been there.

And he still calls me every day and always said'

"You can call me in the middle of the night if you need me. "

You know? So that's a wonderful way to feel.

- He's like a dancing bear that got loose

and now he's calling the tune.

He's got the deep voice.

He's shaggy-

And we always thought that deep voice and shaggy meant'

you know, a creature.

And he's a beat up creature.

But guess what?

That brain is completely, you know,

on the ball and the heart is enormous.

When I think of him, I just think of us smiling.

Like, it makes me smile like...

don't you think he's one of the smartest people

- you ever met in your life'? - Yeah, definitely.

- I can't think of anybody that I really respect

more than Barry.

Certainly a better person for having known him.

- Something that I've always remembered about him

is we cannot surrender being the rude, funny,

obnoxious truth tellers.

We cannot surrender that. That's our best weapon.

It's funny how you become

really best friends with people, you know?

So I just, I guess I love him.

I think I'd be remiss in not saying.

- There's no way we should've been the friends we were.

But we were really great friends

because he was really instrumental in, um...

he made me a lot of money.

I think of Barry as a relative

because what he thinks of me is really important.

But at the same time, he loves me unconditionally.

So it's very weird.

He's like a boat.

A nice, real nice sailboat or something like that.

If you have a chance to get on that boat,

get on it.

- Sometimes the most anti-religious people

behave the most religiously.

- We have to have enough guts to open up our ears,

to open up our hearts, and to listen,

look, watch and believe and testify'

to what really happens to innocence in this world.

We have to take care of innocence in this world.

And we have to be brave enough

to stand up and tell the truth

about what happens to innocence in this world.

So tell the truth.

Tell everyone the truth.

Tell anyone the truth

because your lives depend on it.

My life depends on it.

And people who really can't be heard really depend on it.

They really depend on it.

Thank you very much.

So I'm Barry Crimmins,

trying to be a good guy

but putting off a nasty aura most of the time

so that people don't go... to me all day long.

You know, there's so many people who've been through

what I have been through

and they are afraid to deal with anybody.

For whatever reasons I was only hurt so much

and then somehow I had a lifetime

where I was lucky enough,

like, my drug of choice was friends.

# Yeah, I know I got Religion

# It took me away

# It took me away

# Yeah, we're locating my...

- It's interesting to see that the same things

that he was thinking about back in the 90s

are essentially the platform that's being used

not only in our county but throughout the nation.

We have indicted over a thousand people

for sharing child pornography.

Hey, Goldthwaite.

You suck.

- There's these... there's nobody else like him.

He's just one of a kind.

- And I don't want to fawn over him 'cause he's,

you know, kind of a dick.

He's terribly racist.

I don't know if you knew that about Barry Crimmins.

It's something that we would fight about a lot.

- This is such an odd circum... because even his closest friends

don't know this side of Barry'

but we were both America's biggest hope in figure skating.

And we met m Montreal'

we were training for the Olympics...

it's kind of a cute image.

Crimmins calls me up,

and I get over to his house and he's not there.

And then I hear this clatter downstairs,

and he's down there'

he's got 20 can opener bottle openers

and he's just throwing 4 here,

goes in another room, and throws 4.

I say, "What the heH are you doing?"

He said, "I couldn't find a fuckin' beer opener

so I bought 20 of them

and I'm scattering them around (he house. "

So he'd never be shy a bottle opener again.

- I remember picking him up and I, you know,

I always had like, kitschy stuff in my car

like a frog on the dashboard

or you know some sort of stuffed thing,

and he'd go, "You're a grown man.

Why do you got toys in your car for?"

And he'd toss 'em.

He'd just, held chuck 'em right out the car.

And I never felt like I could go,

"Hey, don't do that. " I'd go, "Alright. "

You know, toss my stuff, I guess.

- He would pull into the front of my house on a Sunday morning

and really low toot the horn.

Not like a beep beep beep, but just a.

And I would wake up going,

"What is that? What's that noise?"

That's Barry Crimmins out front

'cause they don't sell liquor in Boston on Sunday.

So he wants me to drive him to New Hampshire.

And he would pull to the front of my house'

and I'd be like, "But Barry, my, my wife and my baby,

I really, I can't... "

He'd be like, "This is taking up time. "

- Because, you know... I mean, I have this problem

about being in show business.

I can feel shame and embarrassment,

and it's, like, really, like,

ruins you if you're in show business.

I'm such a bad actor,

I can't even be in a documentary about myself.

- Crimmins audition, James Franco.

- This... this mark?

- Yeah. - OK.

- And... you set? - Yeah.

Ready, and action.

- People say, "Barry, if you don't love this country,

why don't you leave it?"

Because I don't want to be a victim of its foreign policies.

Ugh.

Socialism is bad.

Yeah, I learned that in public school.

Public school is socialism.

Ugh.

I do not fear excommunication.

I demand it.

Fuck you, Crimmins!