Original subtitles

[narrator] Once upon a Christmas time,

in a big house on a hill,

there lived a man, his wife

and their eight children.

The family filled the house with their excitement.

Presents for everyone, particularly Ghislaine,

who's five on Christmas Day,

and, like the baby of any family,

has Daddy very much under control.

[chatter]

I can't do it.

OK.

When Father Christmas came last year, I was fast asleep,

and he put... I took my daddy's stocking away from his bedroom.

Then I hanged it up on my bed, then Father Christmas

put some toys in my daddy's... in my daddy's stocking.

[newsreader] Breaking news in the Ghislaine Maxwell trial.

She has been convicted

of helping American financier Jeffrey Epstein

sexually abuse teenage girls.

Ghislaine Maxwell just got convicted of five of six

of the serious counts against her,

including the most serious counts,

sex trafficking of a minor.

[reporter] Three of her siblings were inside there

to hear that verdict being handed down.

[reporter 2] She's from a dynasty that has known disgrace

and is now disgraced herself.

[reporter] Ghislaine Maxwell was the socialite

whose manners and magnetism

attracted princes and presidents.

[reporter 3] Prince Andrew was friends

with both Ghislaine Maxwell and Jeffrey Epstein

during this lurid chapter of abuse.

[reporter] The women who took the stand,

they say that Ghislaine Maxwell identified their frailties.

It was her charm and her magnetism

that made them feel safe.

[reporter 4] Ghislaine Maxwell faces

up to 65 years behind bars.

That could potentially be the rest of her life.

The road to justice has been far too long.

But today justice has been done.

[woman] The women were to take off their tops and bras

and present their breasts to the men.

It was really as if just being Ghislaine wasn't enough.

I began to see that there was a deficit there

which was being filled by being this charming host.

[woman 2] I said to Jeffrey, like,

"She has really masculine, aggressive energy."

And he said something like,

"Yeah, she's got a bigger penis than me."

[woman 3] She ferociously slammed the table,

and my court reporter looked at me and said, "I'm so scared."

I have been silent for 20 years.

I don't wanna be a victim.

I remember a little girl walking downstairs crying,

and she was wearing a uniform,

you know, and I'm like, "Whoa. She's a kid."

And she says to me, "They are nothing."

"They are trash."

[woman 4] I think there were signs

things were happening.

At what point, if she did,

did she see what was becoming of her?

[church bell rings]

[reporter] The football league's first elected lady director

is still, in fact, a student.

She's at Balliol College in Oxford,

studying French and history.

More than 40 years ago, I was president of the Oxford Union.

To make ends meet, I did some tutoring,

and one of my tutees

was Ghislaine Maxwell.

She'd been at Marlborough,

one of our top private schools in this country.

She hadn't done as well in her A levels

as she should have done,

and that's where I came in.

Ghislaine would sit there,

on the corner of the desk.

There was I, I was 21, she was 17,

and she knew she was uh, good-looking,

and she was very self-assured.

But she was incredibly bright.

She picked things up very, very quickly.

But the problem was she just didn't do enough work.

I vividly remember her showing me one essay

that was just two thirds of one side of paper,

and I was expecting sort of seven or eight pages.

Um, she'd probably written it in ten minutes on the bus.

There was a lot of pressure on her to succeed,

particularly as her father, Robert Maxwell,

he'd actually given money to Balliol back in the 1960s.

[ticking]

[presenter] Oxford United have gained a reputation,

justifiably, for attractive football,

but uh, that image is not just restricted to the pitch,

it goes all the way up to the boardroom,

and I'm delighted to welcome Ghislaine Maxwell.

Well, I actually went to a boys' school,

where there were something like a thousand boys and 40 girls,

and so the few girls that were there,

we decided to get together and get ourselves a football team.

And so I played midfield for them.

And we were very successful, as well.

I have a feeling you're a rebel till the end.

[laughs]

[woman] When I arrived at Oxford,

she was a very well-known name.

The name Maxwell was huge in those days

because of her father, Robert.

But she was also very rapidly, I think,

established as a person in her own right.

She was in the glossy magazines. She was in the newspapers.

I think there was always

something fascinating about Ghislaine.

What is this person like?

What is it like to be that famous?

[air horns blare, car horns beep]

[Mike Maloney] She was perceived

as the child who could do no wrong.

It's just one of these things that happened,

that father has a particular favorite child,

'cause Bob had nine children,

but she was the youngest,

and she was totally and utterly spoilt.

And I think she was spoilt from birth.

She said to me one day, she said,

"Don't forget, I'm Daddy's girl."

[whistles]

[reporter] Robert Maxwell is one of Britain's

most influential businessmen.

He was born Ján Ludvík Hoch in Czechoslovakia

to Jewish peasants who were swept away in the Holocaust.

Today he is the stormy petrel

of the international big business world.

Robert Maxwell now owns the Daily Mirror,

theSunday Mirror, theSunday People,

theSporting Life, and two Scottish newspapers.

[Maloney] And it was Bob Maxwell who introduced me

to his favorite daughter.

And she was lovely.

Very young, very attractive,

but very quiet, almost timid.

She was literally

the apple of his eye.

She'd be all lovey-dovey,

and go up and snuggle up to him,

or give him a kiss,

sit on his knee, things like that.

Especially if she wanted something,

money, gifts, luxuries.

She knew how to work her father,

let's say.

And that's exactly what Ghislaine did.

[newsreader] The old boys' network,

which leads from public school to Oxbridge

and then to the top positions of power,

is under threat from within.

Undergraduates at Oxford

have now started visiting state schools

in a bid to persuade more pupils to apply to go there.

[McElvoy] The Oxford of that time

was very marked still by distinctions

between class and birth and money.

I don't think she was entirely seen

as being of that top drawer,

families who'd been there for many generations.

[ticking]

[Dafydd Jones] Oxford had all these different kind of cliques.

There were the Oxford Union people,

who really seriously wanted to go into politics,

people like David Cameron and Boris Johnson.

Ghislaine had a-a different group

which were more uh, sort of famous household names,

like Hanson, Sainsbury's,

and she flirted and talked to those people.

One of the first times I photographed Ghislaine,

she was at the Bullingdon Point to Point.

She was dancing about, very physical, rushing around.

She was flirty with boys.

I remember clearly,

I don't think she was drinking at all,

and I remember quite a few people

ended up in the mud that day, but not Ghislaine.

[McElvoy] Ghislaine was ambitious.

Even within a world in which she already sat,

in the "glossy posse", she wanted to make her mark.

One good thing about her not being entirely from that world

within the English class system

was I think she was very easy at talking to people.

She had this extraordinary voice,

this very sort of low voice.

It was like a purr.

I think she also did quite enjoy being queen bee.

She always presented herself as more knowing,

sort of wise counsel to probably some quite giddy people.

Ah!

I met Ghislaine soon after I arrived

as an undergraduate at Oxford University.

[presenter] The jeunesse dorée of Oxford

hell-bent on enjoying themselves.

Those of a nervous disposition should now be warned

that they may well be looking at future prime ministers,

and chancellors of the exchequer,

and, God help us all,

a future minister of defense.

[Monbiot] And there was one set of people in particular

who were living life to the limits.

A lot of alcohol, there were a lot of drugs,

there was a lot of sex.

It was pretty wild.

And a lot of them had serious money,

and that's one reason I could never really be integrated.

And at its heart, among other people, was Ghislaine.

She was a great social organizer.

She knew everybody's name.

She did draw you in quite... quite literally,

sometimes grab you by the hand and pull you in and say,

"Right, come and meet this person and..."

And so she helped you to overcome your own shyness.

So she made you feel welcome.

Even though, in retrospect,

it's clear that I didn't really belong,

for that moment, I felt, "Oh, yeah, I'm here, I've arrived."

-Hello, hi. Lovely to see you. -Hello.

Come on in.

Greetings.

She was interested in sex.

-I mean, we have to say that. -Yeah.

I do remember one evening meeting her in uh, in Jericho,

at some sort of little houses

that people... students lived in.

And there is Ghislaine on the sofa with her hair.

She must have been smoking. I can't remember.

These incredible eyes, sort of like "zap".

You looked at her and you felt all the attention was on you.

So she managed to, even if...

whatever was going on behind the eyes,

you looked at her, and she was completely compelling.

I was trying to chat up this very beautiful girl,

and Ghislaine was very like a puppeteer.

Ghislaine said, "Now you should say this."

She prompted in this wonderful femme fatale-ish way,

with the cigarettes and the whole thing.

She realized that she could direct

a willing sort of, you know...

She knew what to say.

[Nicholas Stafford-Deitch] I first met Ghislaine in the early '80s

when I'd gone back to Oxford to do my master's degree.

I remember there was a party,

and she suddenly looked me in the eye and said,

"Will you take me out to dinner?"

She just injected it into the conversation

like she might say, "I like the shirt you're wearing."

Dinner started off perfectly normally.

But over time,

the conversation kept returning to her father,

and by about the halfway stage,

I think she was talking about nothing else.

I got an impression that here was a young woman

who, on one hand, was very sophisticated and confident,

but, on the other hand, I found someone

who was probably rather insecure at the same time,

because she seemed to rely so much on who her father was,

and I never really got to know anything about her.

[Monbiot] Ghislaine was outwardly very confident,

but there was always that sense

that there was something brittle, vulnerable, frantic,

beneath that socially confident exterior.

And I began to see that there was a deficit there,

which I felt was being filled

by being this charming host.

And then suddenly,

it happened almost overnight,

I just couldn't take it anymore.

What had seemed to me like this warm, funny,

exciting, inviting, thrilling social scene

suddenly seemed like a nightmare networking

of bright laughter and false friendship.

They were climbing the social ladder,

advancing their social position,

but actually they didn't seem to care for each other.

My feelings weren't focused on Ghislaine,

but I suppose because she was

particularly skilled in-in that scene,

and quite central to it,

to some extent she came to represent

what I then fiercely rejected.

I could see the skull beneath the skin.

[rousing music]

[Thatcher] There are many things to be done

to set this nation on the road to recovery,

and I don't mean economic recovery alone,

but a new independence of spirit

and a zest for achievement.

[Jones] Around that period of the early '80s,

the upper classes were celebrating,

and there were a lot of parties going on,

and it was also the beginnings of a sort of yuppie,

a new type of person developing

who was very entrepreneurial and selfish.

[interviewer] Today you're proud to be a yuppie?

Yes, all right, I admit it, I'm proud to be a yuppie.

[Jones] In London, I was working for theTatler magazine.

Ghislaine was popping up at quite a few parties.

Part of the crowd that Ghislaine was in

was quite a hard partying crowd.

Trinny Woodall, Susannah Constantine.

And they liked going out late and flirting with young men.

This was pretty close to the top set.

[Mariella Frostrup] I met Ghislaine Maxwell

a very long time ago in-in the 1980s,

quite shortly after I first moved to London from Ireland.

London, really, for me, was like a huge ladder

going right up to the sky,

a bit like Jack and the Beanstalk, and I just, you know,

was clambering up this endless, it felt like, ladder.

[cork pops]

And Ghislaine just happened to be one of the people

I sort of brushed up against on-on that path.

There was this really sparkly-eyed,

very interesting, fun woman

who seemed to be the sort of life and soul of the party in a way.

I remember being at a dinner

where Prince Charles was sat next to me.

They were a sort of elite, privileged crowd.

Either rich or titled, or both.

It was still a pretty sexist era.

There were women who-who would respond very differently to men

than-than to their own sex.

She wasn't like that, you know.

She was sort of one of the boys, in a way.

She just was comfortable with everybody.

And I'm not surprised if people did find her so appealing

that she brought them into a circle,

because there was something about Ghislaine

that made you want to bask in her light.

[Nicola Glucksmann] I remember Ghislaine as very beautiful, charming,

hugely entertaining, but slightly manic.

I was invited as a plus one

to a weekend party

at Headington Hill Hall.

Ghislaine was hosting herself.

She was always scanning the room.

At the end of the dinner, Ghislaine announced

that it was time for some games,

and she disappeared and came back with some scarves,

but explained that, um,

she was going to give each of the men a blindfold,

and they were to blindfold themselves,

and then the women were to take off their tops and bras

and present their breasts to the men.

And then the men would feel the breasts

and make an attempt to match the breast

by weight and... and cup size

to, uh, the woman who was attached to the breast.

It was all bundled up as fun.

Ghislaine was very relaxed about it.

This was a gift she was giving us.

I absented myself, I excluded myself,

and said I was tired,

and left, as did my friend,

but I was very struck

by how awful that... that idea was.

The notion that a woman would suggest a game

and... make it quite hard

for the other women not to play,

because you would have been the killjoy,

you're the one that doesn't join in, you're no fun,

I mean, that's sort of adult peer pressure.

Very difficult not to do it.

And yet if a man suggested it,

I... I don't think the women would have done it.

I mean, that experience really left me...

wondering, you know,

about what... what...

what was going on with her.

It seemed to betray a very odd attitude

to herself as a woman

and to the men around her.

It was really as if just being Ghislaine wasn't enough.

Flamboyant, vulgar,

insufferable, ruthless,

brazen, fiery, humorless,

impatient, intolerant, rude.

[laughs]

And this is an authorized biographer.

And he likes you. To how much of that do you plead guilty?

I plead guilty to all of it.

-[reporter] Can I have one more? -No, you cannot.

Jesus. Now, that's unwelcome visitor. Fuck off.

Come in?

[Maloney] He could bully people.

He could be a tyrant.

I mean, he was a tyrant to Betty, his wife.

He was a tyrant to the boys.

Betty'd talk about Sunday lunch at Headington.

He would start picking on one of the children, berating them.

Even hitting them with his belt.

And then having the audacity

to get them to write

a letter of apology to him.

Ghislaine would have operated

under these dreadful conditions.

But a lot of it was self-preservation.

Betty also told me about Ghislaine,

that Ghislaine was the one who got away with everything.

She got away scot-free.

Ghislaine's lifestyle was lavish.

It was the best of everything.

And if you think about it,

for a girl of that age coming onto the scene,

she's got a private plane to fly her from A to B,

she's got the use of a luxury yacht.

Having observed her for a number of years,

she was quite aware of what was going on.

I think she had the ability

to gloss over certain parts of life,

and take what she wanted,

and reject what she didn't want.

[ticking]

[Tim Walker] Bob looked at Ghislaine as if she was on a pedestal,

as if she was nothing less, frankly, than Princess Diana.

She, I felt, by contrast, looked at him with respect,

with concern, perhaps,

but also, I felt, with a degree of fear.

The voice that she used, interestingly, to Bob,

was different to the voice I saw her use to other people,

certainly myself.

It was coquettish.

Perhaps it was schoolgirl-ish.

It was a sort of singsong-y voice.

It was a strained relationship.

I got the impression

-she was a bit of a blank canvas -[Bob] Get out of here!

whose only sense of identity, I think,

was being her father's daughter.

I keep thinking about that in relation to Ghislaine.

If I'd had a father

to whom rules never applied,

nothing really mattered, or anything got in your way,

how I might have turned out.

[Anne-Elizabeth Moutet] Ghislaine was a spoiled brat.

She was abrupt, she was rude, and she was demanding.

I met Ghislaine when I was working

for theEuropean as Paris bureau chief.

She would walk into this office.

She came like a kind of sort of small tornado,

and-and she sort of had this hectoring voice.

The assumption was that if someone worked for her father,

that person was there to help.

She would come in and ask people to do things

that were completely unrelated to their jobs.

She would ask for her mother's car to be towed

when her mother had a problem.

Or one memorable time, she rang up the office,

"I'm at the Ritz and it's horrible."

"I want you to call them up and to say

that really they're below par."

She had energy.

There was a sort of impatience about her

that could be very positive,

and the negative was she was rude.

Captain, you might come and take this bag

from my secretary, would you?

[Walker] Throughout the time I was working there,

I-I saw them striving,

uh, Bob and Ghislaine.

For what they very much desired

was this acceptance in society.

[reporter] Much of Britain's elitist establishment

is not amused by Mr. Maxwell.

Ordinary Brits may take a shine to his rambunctious ways,

but to upper-class Britain, Captain Bob and his wife

remain still nouveau riche outsiders.

I suppose it was that he was, perhaps, somewhat vulgar.

It was that he wanted to be a member of the establishment,

but he wasn't quite.

He liked being photographed with people like Mother Teresa,

or better still, the queen.

I think he wanted the daughter,

in a way, he wanted to live his life through her,

as this sort of society figure that was accepted.

[Marina Cicogna] The Cicogna family is typical

aristocratic Milanese family.

These families have been around for quite a few centuries.

My name is Marina Cicogna.

Ghislaine Maxwell went out with my brother's oldest son.

She was Gianfranco's girlfriend.

Gianfranco died very young.

Gianfranco was extremely handsome, really.

He was like a film star.

They were very nice together, you know.

She seemed to me to be a normal, nice,

uh, well-brought-up English girl.

From what uh, people tell me,

Robert Maxwell was delighted

about the relationship.

Gianfranco was the kind of guy

uh, that he would have liked,

probably, as a son-in-law.

And I have to say, who wouldn't, you know?

He was a nice guy, he came from a good family,

he had a good education.

I think Gianfranco felt, from what I understand,

very spoilt by the Maxwell family.

I understand that if they go- went by a-a shop

and uh, he liked something,

he would find it in his room the next day,

which for a while flattered him.

I asked, why did the relationship

between Gianfranco and Ghislaine end after four years?

Gianfranco felt a little bit uncomfortable

with the fact that they were, you know,

giving him presents all the time,

and uh, he felt uh, that they felt

that he could be bought.

From what I hear, he thought it was too much.

But if he had been just him and Ghislaine,

uh, it would have been easier.

[McElvoy] I certainly think that there was a lot of trauma there

from her relationship with her father.

I think she actually had to work quite hard to please him.

She still had to turn up, I think, at his bidding,

at Headington Hall.

[guests chattering]

I can remember Ghislaine bringing people to meet him.

Her father expected it of her.

Ghislaine would be there, I think, bringing in friends,

and a lot of them

women in their 20s,

and a crowd who would liven it up

and make the party look- look great

in the pages of a sort of glossy magazine.

[play classical music]

Have you got drinks? Have you been...?

And then there would be Robert Maxwell

and his publishing cronies.

Then Ghislaine would sort of

bring someone to meet her father,

and the impression that you got was that

whether by preselection or whether she just had to choose.

And I think this was her role.

Who would he like to talk to?

Who would he find interesting?

It was more like a court.

She was playing a part which was way older than she was.

It sounds very privileged.

I think she had to earn her father's love.

And the similarities, that desire to please a man,

a powerful man, who also enabled her

to live the way that she wanted to live,

is really, I think, that's the thread for me

throughout all of this.

She's still, you know,

she's still the-the same person, in many ways,

but I think also, what has happened,

and what she's been involved in,

then something must have changed along the way.

And I think that's the hardest thing

to put your finger on here.

[ticking]

After Oxford,

I remember her wanting to try her hand at her own business.

She then started to fly to New York a lot,

and she had a life on both sides of the Atlantic.

It was also a time when a lot of very ambitious people,

there was a bit of a pipeline

from that Oxford set to New York.

I think she wanted to be seen to make a mark somewhere,

and in a sense having two cities at her disposal

probably suited her rather well.

[siren wails]

The new owner of the Daily News, Bob Maxwell. Bob...

[crowd cheering]

[Tim Walker] She was in New York,

involved in trying to make something of the paper

for an American audience.

She was often on the arm of her father, uh,

I think maybe as a kind of fashion accessory, almost,

'cause Bob probably thought that Betty,

to who he was then estranged,

wasn't a suitable person for him to be seen with.

Betty at that point was older,

and I think he liked being seen

in the company of somebody who was younger.

Bob and Ghislaine, they were almost like a team,

the two of them.

They seemed to have their own kind of language.

They seemed to be on their own wavelength, their own level.

And I think he saw her

as kind of his representative.

[Maloney] When I would see them together,

she was very dominant,

like a chip off the old block,

and would almost be playing a part,

almost copying her father.

The way that he wanted something,

he had a particular way of going about it.

She gained that knowledge from her father,

and now she was using it to her advantage with her father.

[Christina Oxenberg] I was at a wedding.

I was with my first husband.

And this was a-a wedding in America,

very fancy,

and out of the crowd

burst Ghislaine,

advancing on my husband.

And then she juts her, um,

generous chin my way

and says, "What is this?"

She loops her arm through husband's arm

and walks him off into the crowd.

She was clearly intent on being

the dominant member of the setting.

My first impression of her was that this is a ridiculous person

who has an inflated ego,

who thinks that she can be uh, rude

and there will be no consequences.

[Ken Lennox] I was working for theDaily Mirror at the time.

I was shown into the editor's office,

and he said, "Close the door."

"What I'm gonna tell you must not get out of this office."

"The old man's gone missing from the back of his yacht,

and there's a search going for him just now."

"You're going to go up onto the roof,

board the company helicopter."

"Your job is not to take photographs,

it's to look after Betty Maxwell."

Good evening.

The millionaire newspaper publisher

Robert Maxwell is dead.

He disappeared overboard from his private yacht

early this morning while cruising off the Canary Islands.

[reporter] Tonight, as the Lady Ghislaine lay at berth,

the gathering of Robert Maxwell's family was completed

with the arrival of the daughter

after whom he had named his fateful yacht.

[Lennox] When she came aboard and met Betty, her mother,

she was...

howling about her daddy.

Tears streaming down her face.

She was almost incoherent at that stage.

She kept calling, "My daddy, my daddy,"

you know, this sort of thing.

And uh, it was hard to listen to, you know?

It was... distressing.

Suddenly she's confronted with a huge disaster

which was way beyond anything

she would have been expected to cope with.

It was almost as if somebody had ripped her heart out of her.

I also want to take this opportunity

to thank all the many hundreds of people

who have sent

messages of support to us

at this very, very sad time.

[man] We are here today to bid farewell

to my father, Robert Maxwell.

Ghislaine was very, very upset at the funeral.

She wasn't crying floods of tears.

You could see her head was bowed

and she was in deep thought.

Was she thinking, "Crikey, you know,

what am I going to do now?"

Not only was she losing

her beloved father,

she was losing a lifestyle.

Now... who's going to supply all that?

[theme music]

Good evening. The headlines at six o'clock.

Robert Maxwell's business empire is collapsing tonight.

Mirror Group newspapers said that in the weeks before his death,

Mr. Maxwell removed £350 million from its pension fund

without apparent proper authority.

[reporter] In the four weeks since Robert Maxwell died,

it's become all too clear that he spent the past 20 years

proving those who said he was unfit to run a public company

absolutely right.

[Mariella Frostrup] The whole Maxwell story was toxic here.

It entered a room before she did.

[reporter] Sunday Mirror staff were not surprised to hear

that offices were bugged.

Everyone knew who she was,

what had happened, who her father was.

People believed they were hateful, awful people.

A Spanish judge says Robert Maxwell's death

appears to have been accidental.

[reporter] Speculation about the way he died has been intense.

Others want to uncover the facts of a death

which they see as suspicious.

It devastated their family.

And I think it really devastated Ghislaine.

[newsreader] Loss adjusters for the insurers of Robert Maxwell's life

believe he probably committed suicide,

although they say the evidence is not conclusive.

[Mariella Frostrup] I imagine that she went to America

to get away from that, to dump that baggage

and try and be unfettered and free again, and...

Yeah... That's not what happened, is it?

[ticking]

[Ghislaine] I'm extremely sad that my father is no longer here,

and for all the difficult times

for everybody that's been involved.

But I don't feel in any way

smaller or lesser than what I was before.

I remember phoning up a mutual friend

who'd gone round to see her

very soon after Robert Maxwell's death,

and who'd found her very distraught at home,

with Maxwell memorabilia, really, family photos,

but also sort of trophies of his business life

spread around her,

and absolutely determined

to oppose the version of events

that he'd committed suicide.

[Ghislaine] I always believe in the end that the truth will out,

and that uh, eventually

the true story, such as it is,

will be...

people will know more than...

than what they currently do.

It's- it'll take time. It'll take time, that's all.

[Christina Oxenberg] The next time I ran into Ghislaine,

it was in New York City in a restaurant.

She was much more demure.

She was much more subdued.

There was none of that arrogance.

And I thought, "Be nice."

"She's gone through something horrible."

"Let's give her a second chance."

Some time after running into Ghislaine,

she called me and invited me to a tea party.

I remember it was a hot summer day.

She kept declaring, "I am broke, I'm broke."

"Can you believe that this has happened to me?"

But the signs didn't add up.

She's um, in the smartest part of town.

I mean, if I'm broke and depressed,

I'm not throwing tea parties.

I'm, you know, at home in my pajamas, crying,

like a normal person.

There were three British girls there,

and then we had Ghislaine, the hostess,

and she's remarkably only wearing her panties.

But altogether shocking.

It was a white frilly bra

and underwear.

And she had paired this outfit

with a massive amount of very expensive jewelry

and a full face of makeup.

So it was clearly an intentional outfit.

She drew attention to it repeatedly.

But everyone was overlooking the fact

that it's completely abnormal.

None of us took our clothes off.

My takeaway was I was right the first time I met her.

The dynamic that she's always looking for is to be in control,

to be the- the most important person in the room,

and if she has to strip naked to do it, she'll do it.

[Jesse Kornbluth] I didn't know Ghislaine until the night she propositioned me.

In 1992 I ran into Ghislaine

at a party given by Joan Rivers.

And I'm standing to the side and Ghislaine comes over to me,

and within really three minutes,

what happened was so dazzling,

in this one sentence, which is,

"You know, if you lose 10 pounds, I'll fuck you".

The thing about Ghislaine propositioning me

when my wife was within four to five feet away

is that it was brazen.

It was so, as the Brits would say, cheeky.

Talk about a power play. That was a power play.

She was seducing me. She knew how to work a room of guys.

She was putting it out there.

If it didn't work with me,

it would work on someone else, right?

I was just a- a notch on her belt.

It never happened to me before. It never happened to me since.

It was a complete one-off,

but, then, so was Ghislaine.

There are many friends and people out there who- who help.

You can never have too many friends or too much help

in a situation like this.

[Anne McElvoy] It's always been a bit of a mystery

when Ghislaine Maxwell first met Jeffrey Epstein and how,

but we know they got together when she was in New York.

She met Jeffrey Epstein

and became involved

in a relationship with him,

very quickly after her father's death.

Epstein was probably one of them in those circles

who's respected most of all for getting very rich,

and that mattered to her.

I think she respected that,

and that was one of the things that...

that drew her to Epstein.

[Korbluth] The only sin in New York is not to have money.

Jeffrey could give, really, one of the- the best five minutes

that you're gonna find at a party.

He was engaging, he was ironic, he was witty.

He listened to you. He didn't look over your shoulder.

In the '80s, he told me some stuff he did,

like, sometimes he helped people

get money from African despots who had stolen their money,

and sometimes he worked with African despots

to help them keep the money they had stolen.

And I thought, "interesting guy".

I saw him again in his office,

which was large and empty.

If a computer was on his desk, it was invisible.

Uh, he was a sort of lord and master.

And I said, "Jeffrey, I need to see you work."

[Leland Nally] You know, Epstein as an enigma,

I mean, even close friends of his

had no idea where his money came from.

I know about Ghislaine Maxwell from an article that I wrote

where I called everybody in Epstein's little black book.

The book itself is Jeffrey Epstein's

personal contact book.

There's celebrities and scientists

and Nobel prize winners and influential business people,

and it's a- a very considerable cross-section

of the global elite, essentially.

[Nally over recording] The reason why I'm calling is 'cause you were uh, listed

as a contact in his contact book.

[Stuart Pivar] I was? Oh. I thought he knew my telephone number by heart.

[Nally] Stuart Pivar was one of the first people I talked to

who actually knew Epstein in any sort of real way.

[Nally laughs] Oh. Oh, really? So you did know him well.

[Pivar] Well, Jeffrey Epstein was my best pal for decades.

[Nally] Ghislaine came up firstly in the actual text of the book,

and also about a quarter of the people in the book,

I would estimate uh, knew her but didn't know Epstein.

In trying to figure out who Epstein was, I couldn't help but figure out

who Ghislaine Maxwell was as well.

[Pivar] He appointed me in charge of Ghislaine

while she was... well, profoundly,

almost suicidally... uh, depressed

from the death of her father.

He didn't want her to kill herself,

so it was my job to try to amuse her,

and to take to- to dinner and lunch and what have you,

until she finally came around.

[McElvoy] She said to someone I-I knew well,

that, you know, she felt that he'd saved her

after her father's death.

And I think that was partly emotional.

I'd like to think that I'll be able to do something positive.

I can't say what it is right now 'cause I'm working on it,

and until I've done it...

[McElvoy] I think she wanted a reason to ground herself in New York,

in society, have a purpose there, have a life there.

That relationship with Jeffrey Epstein offered that,

so she took that opportunity.

[Christina Oxenberg] In 1993, I had a strange little,

very short PR job,

and that's why I spent three months

in the company of Jeffrey and Ghislaine.

I had occasion to hear out of her mouth

an effort that she was making

to convince me that they were a couple,

but I knew that they weren't,

because I could see with my own eyes

that there was no reciprocity

of romantic feelings.

There was no lingering looks.

There was no touching on the... Nothing.

She was an employee. He was the boss.

Ghislaine's job was to bring her father's contacts,

deliver them to Jeffrey,

in return for giving her the life

that she always thought she would have,

lost, and was now replacing.

One day I say to her,

"Gosh, Ghislaine, how are you keeping yourself so thin?"

And she says, "Jeffrey likes his girls thin."

"How do you do it?"

And she says,

"Well, did you ever see anyone in a concentration camp

with any weight on them?"

And she's laughing in her delivery.

And she says "Well, they didn't eat,

so I call it the Nazi diet."

"I just don't eat."

This was too important to her.

Him, the job,

everything was, like, pathologically important.

Everything was for Jeffrey.

She did say to me, "The reason Jeffrey keeps me around

is I don't make mistakes."

That's when you start to realize,

well, what are we dealing with here?

Many people have lost their money,

you know, become impoverished.

They don't all turn to crime. It's not the next step.

What I realized, very late in the game, was...

she's evil, she's evil and she's dangerous.