Original subtitles

This is London Court.

Here is a news flash.

The German radio has just announced that Hitler is dead.

I'll repeat that.

The German radio has just announced that Hitler is dead.

Adolf Hitler.

Today, we know him as the embodiment of evil.

guilty of the worst crimes known to humanity.

But it didn't start out like this.

There was a time when people worshipped him, went to war for him,

and were willing to die for him.

Now, with populist leaders thriving once again,

We're looking at Hitler from a different perspective.

Through his friends, his admirers, his enablers.

Only then can we learn the lessons from history.

So we've unearthed interviews with the people who knew him best.

From a former classmate.

To those who were by his side when he tried to conquer the world. Okay,

running.

Most are Nazis.

Some complicit in war crimes.

Few can be trusted.

I do not want to excuse myself. I just want to... An old man has no other

interest but the truth, the historical truth.

But when we see Adolf Hitler through their eyes, perhaps we can grasp who he

and what made him possible.

First time I called on him, it was in the morning.

I walked through this very cold entrance hall, a winding staircase, and then

somebody opened the door.

Then I came into this little room. It was very, very narrow, incredibly

Just enough to put a wall and pretend it's a room.

And there you saw him.

This is the voice of Putzi Hamstengel, a wealthy businessman and a major player

in the rise of Adolf Hitler.

Their first encounter comes soon after Hitler has become leader of the far

-right party, the Nazis.

There are now very few people alive who knew him intimately, but there is one

such person who, night after night across many years, played Wagnerian

Hitler in his flat.

Now, tell me, Dr. Hamsteingl, what first attracted you to Hitler?

When I heard this man for the first time in a very noisy meeting,

I, in his trench coat and with the entire perfume of a...

The past struggle in him, in his language, in his gestures. I absolutely

myself irresistibly drawn to him.

The trouble was, Germany has never been known for its orators. And Hitler

was the superbest man to address hungry crowds.

He crushed any man with his voice. He had a wonderful resonance up here.

And that will never be repeated in 10 ,000 years.

After defeat in the First World War, Germany is at rock bottom.

Hitler calls for a national renewal.

Putzi and his wife Helena are impressed by his charisma and conviction.

They throw open their doors to him.

This is the very room where Hitler came to visit you many times, I believe.

Yeah, surely.

Believe me.

It's very often that I think he's still in the room. Who else did he sit?

Usually at the opposite of the fire.

He came practically every day, and the house still had this huge studio,

which he loved.

Anything that was big in which he could pull, of course, back and forth and back

and forth and popping and popping.

He was absolutely convinced about himself.

He couldn't stand anybody who wanted to talk, and he was the one who talked. You

have to listen to this.

In Booker's book, he claims that Hitler was a mother to him. What do you think

of that?

Well, I should say, in a way, he was.

In the way he was.

I mean, as far as he was able to be in love with anyone, maybe I was one of the

ones that perhaps he was in love with.

He had a great habit of sort of opening these big blue eyes, which he had. He

had big blue eyes, and he used them. And then he would have a tortuous, austere

way of hand -kissing and so on.

He could lay it on.

Oh, he could lay it on. He really could.

And I remember I was sitting on the sofa and he sank to his knees and put his

head in my lap and said, I only have someone to look after me.

And I said, well, I don't find a lovely wife and marry and so on. I can never

marry because my life is dedicated to my country.

By 1923, the Nazis were still a minor party, one of many.

But Hitler dreams of turning it into a national force.

Putzi, who's been to college in America, provides inspiration from an unlikely

source.

One of the things Hitler learned from you, I believe, or you told him about...

The cheerleaders at Harvard. Oh, yeah.

This is an essential thing to get the audience to underline your

propaganda.

Harvard,

Harvard, Harvard.

And so it became... He was impressed.

Oh, yeah.

One evening, I played this here for a change to Hitler.

The line of crimson.

Ah, you can't prevail.

See, cheers for power and love.

The line of crimson. At that

moment, Hitler jumped up and said, Hamsting, das brauchen wir. That's what

need for March.

Now with its rousing anthem and a bold Nazi banner, disillusioned young men

flocked to the military wing of the party, the stormtroopers.

Like many Germans, Hitler has been radicalized by defeat in the First World

He had spent four and a half years as a frontline soldier and had been shattered

by news of Germany's surrender.

Elizabeth Pott is one of a handful of friends who knew Hitler before the war.

She remembers the effect it had on him.

Did you personally see Adolf Hitler after the war?

Yes, yes.

Did he change?

Yes, he changed.

Externally, of course, very much.

But he is still... How should I

express myself?

It's not sad, but...

I also spoke a little with him sometimes, right?

About the end of the war, the loss, that made him tremble.

Bad. He didn't want to believe that so many Germans were so brave, right?

And that made him harder.

It made him harder.

Bitter too?

Hitler's bitterness has been stirred up by a popular conspiracy theory.

The war wasn't lost in battle.

Left wing politicians and Jews were to blame for the surrender and the

humiliating peace agreement that followed.

Hitler vows to avenge this betrayal.

And you often heard him ranting about Judaism.

Oh, yeah.

Absolutely.

This wasn't just a political thing. It was something personal.

It began as personal, and then he built it up. Yes.

In November 1923, Hitler, Puzzi and the Nazis try to overthrow the left -wing

government.

They stage an insurrection in a Munich beer hall.

Violence breaks out.

The revolt is put down.

But Hitler is now a wanted man.

On the day of the Putsch, when it was all over, And a disastrous failure.

Hitler fled to your house?

Yes, without telling me a word about it.

Why did he come to you?

The magnetic influence of...

Your what?

Female beauty.

He was injured, was he not?

Yes, he had a hanging shoulder.

This collarbone was broken.

But when the police surrounded the whole house, and the game

was up, and out comes the revolver, and he said, Oh, I'll be damned if I

surrender. I'll make a end. And he had this revolver, and my wife, knowing the

jiu -jitsu, I'll show you what to do. You have the revolver, and

she looks up in the sky.

That is the crypt.

See, that's the wage standard.

I would like a few more details, if I could, on the suicide in your house.

I just went up and took it away from him without any trouble at all. He didn't

struggle. I shouted at him. I said, what do you think you're doing after all

your idea of saving the country and you take your life and leave all your

workers behind?

They're looking for you, too.

I would like to make a straight, direct question

to you, Mr.

Hanfstengel. You, or your wife, were the means of saving Hitler's life.

I get the impression that you're proud of that. But as, from our point of view,

you can imagine it would be a very good thing if Hitler had died.

To be sure, at the time, I felt I wouldn't have done it if I hadn't felt I

saving Germany. I tried to save the man who appeared to me as the one saviour.

The Hitler that Puzzi and Helena recall is given to self -pity and melodrama.

But he also has a dream.

And they love him for it.

To understand the appeal of Adolf Hitler, we are seeking out his friends.

This is one of them, filmed after the Second World War, undergoing a

denazification programme.

Winifred Wagner was the daughter -in -law of the famous German composer

Wagner, and was once one of Hitler's closest confidants.

For decades, she refused to speak publicly.

But one day, in 1975, she finally breaks her silence.

Winifred Wagner, page 1.

I mean,

we old National Socialists invented a new cover name after the war, because

couldn't talk about him in public, and if you wanted to talk about him, then we

called him USA.

That means in German, unser seliger Adolf.

Die haben mich benarscht behalten da bei der Spruchkammerverhandlung, dass ich

eben Hitler und Politik nicht gleichsetzte. Das kam eben für uns

in Frage.

Es war eine rein menschliche, persönliche und vertrauliche Bindung

zwischen uns, die auf der Grundlage der Verehrung und der Liebe zu Richard

Wagner beruhte.

Winifred first meets Hitler in 1923.

He was just the

What can I say?

On the one hand, of course, he was a fascinating and interesting person.

He told us, that was not him, absolutely not.

Hitler's charm is working for him.

And it's about to pay dividends.

In 1924, Hitler stands trial for his violent insurrection.

He delivers a rambling four -hour monologue from the witness stand.

But his supporters hang on every word.

He was the victor over the judges, oh man.

He just wiped that floor with an hour. The whole bunch.

By force of argument or force of... By force of argument and personality of

spark over paprika and all that.

Hitler's stand against the establishment makes him a household name.

The judge, a Nazi sympathiser, hands him the minimum possible sentence.

He'll spend just nine months in jail.

Far from finishing him, Hitler's legal woes have elevated him in the eyes of

followers.

Nazi party member Ilse Hess is a regular prison visitor.

What can you remember of the prison?

In Landsberggarden, there's a little house, and that is called the Festung.

were political prisoners.

They were allowed visitors every day, and I always went on Saturday, and

I had nearly two or three hours.

Hitler enjoyed my coming up.

You know this?

Famous picture of Hitler in the festival in Landsberg. It was me.

Photos smuggled out of prison keep Hitler in the public eye while Winifred

Wagner rallies round.

Hitler's book Mein Kampf is his vision for creating the perfect Germany.

and it's packed with extremist and racist views.

One idea is to sterilize the mentally ill.

Another, to eliminate so -called inferior races.

His main target, Jews.

Hitler's followers go along with it, while his propaganda team, including

journalist Joseph Goebbels,

read the word.

Working in Hitler's publicity department is Hermann Esser.

In these early days, friends claimed to remember a collaborative Hitler.

But he sees himself as a man of destiny.

Did you take it seriously?

When he said that, you believed him?

Yes, we believed him.

Absolutely. He must have been most convincing.

Yes, there was something special.

Hitler

knows

that children make the easiest converts and the most loyal followers.

Joining the Hitler Youth in 1925 is teenager Baldur von Schirach.

Later, he'll go on to lead the organisation, overseeing the

millions of Germans.

This is von Schirach being released from prison after serving 20 years for

crimes against humanity.

No one

knew better than him

where the seductive powers of the Fuhrer could lead.

Alder von Schirach, leader of the Hitler Youth, found a member of the inner

court of Adolf Hitler.

is alive and well and living here in secluded estate in southwestern Germany.

And tonight, for the first time, he talks fully about the years with Hitler

led to that sentence.

Herr von Schirach, I want to start by talking, if we can, about Adolf Hitler

a man, in the sense that when you first met him, for instance, what were the

qualities he had that immediately impressed themselves upon you?

I met him in the opera.

And my father, who once directed the

opera in Weimar, was interested in Hitler,

who was brought into our box and presented to my father

because he was so well informed about music.

And he invited him to tea for the next day.

That's how it started, yes.

And what were the first things you noticed about Hitler?

In the theater, he was dressed very correctly in a dinner jacket,

and he was very

impressive in a certain

shyness that he had, good manners.

a little bit shy, and he really, in many

ways, during my first start in politics,

always advocated me and treated me like, I should

use this expression, a political father, yes.

He really did. He was capable of acts of friendship like that. Yes, he was very

capable of friendship and very true to his friends.

If you had to give a one -sentence or a two -sentence summary of Hitler's life,

or of Hitler, what would be the most important thing you feel you would want

say about him and his life?

Mr. Frost, is a very difficult question to answer in one or two sentences.

I shall try it.

A man without measure.

A man with great gifts.

A man who in some ways

could be considered a genius.

But because he had no sense of measure, he could not

succeed.

That's the answer.

It was a difficult question, but I do not know how else I

could make a sort of panel of this fabulous monster, yes?

Even after 20 years behind bars, Hitler youth boss, Baldur von Schirach, is

happy to praise his former mentor.

Others play a canny again.

Meet Albert Speer, another old Nazi who has done time for war crimes.

As a young architect, he helped Hitler realise his grand ideas.

And during World War II, he was head of Hitler's war machine.

Albert Speer, reel three.

Although he denies it...

He was also Hitler's best friend.

Welcome to Heidelberg Castle for this special edition of the David Frost Show.

Herr Speer, it's so fascinating to talk to you who was close to this monster

whom I cannot understand, but what were his good points?

I wouldn't say you can find very many points.

only a few points. For instance, a point which is good for every human being is

to have close friends.

He hasn't had any close friends.

When did you first see Adolf Hitler, Asper?

I saw him first in an audience before students in Berlin.

It was about five thousand students and he made a speech there.

A very impressive speech because he was not a normal demagogue. He

usually was.

In a different interview, Speer elaborates on this first encounter with

How far away were you from Hitler?

20, 30 metres.

That's quite a good place.

Did he have any of the SS or of his own guard with him when he appeared?

Not visibly. He was there standing alone.

And would they have had swastikas and other banners up? No. Nothing at all?

The whole thing was done purposely to impress by simplicity.

Can you remember whether he mentioned the Jews or not?

He certainly did, but he wanted to prove that he is able to be the chancellor,

that he is not just an audio.

So everything was modified, was run down.

During the applause, was it simply hand clapping or was it big howls and

saluting? Yes, but there's nothing which the students are doing in Germany by

trembling with their feet.

That's a tremendous noise.

The whole thing is boring.

Like many who will go on to follow

him.

Albert Speer is drawn to Hitler at a time of desperation.

After the global financial crisis of 1929, spiralling unemployment plunges

millions into poverty.

Germany is the worst -hit country in Europe.

The despair was so terrible, as I can't describe it. You had everywhere

beggars, wherever you went in Berlin, you had beggars.

The people came onto the courtyard and were singing and singing just for a

penny.

I supported Hitler because he, after having seen all that depravity,

all that poverty here, was the only one who could do social justice to the

people here. They were a terrible misery.

Hitler channels people's fear and anger.

He continues to blame Germany's problems on the First World War surrender and

the humiliating peace agreement, the Treaty of Versailles, that followed.

Why do you

suppose

it was that so many Germans stood by and let this thing happen and even

supported it i think the atmosphere in germany was one of

great poverty there's no doubt about it it was very distinguishable when one

even came from england which wasn't in a very good way either they'd lost

everything they'd lost the first world war they'd lost every bean they had in

the inflation

And Hitler gave a little piece to every one of them. He told them they'd been

dishonored by losing the war and had never really lost it, and that the

politicians and the Jews were responsible for the inflation, and that

promised to give them back an army, their honor.

He knew exactly how to speak to those kind of people.

1932, election time in Germany.

Hitler's following is growing.

But to win power, he needs to get his message to the masses.

I was with Hitler for the first time and he said to me, Mr.

Bauer, I don't have any trust in your aviation.

I said, why?

He said, I only flew once in my life and swore to myself once and never again.

That makes a bad impression, he said.

Before my speech, every time I have to hand myself over first.

And I said to him, in the meantime, I have flown thousands of pacifiers.

First soldier!

Fire!

An einem Abend ist alles glänzend gegangen.

Record numbers flock to Hitler's rallies, keen to hear the strongman on

of the people.

The whole atmosphere grew more and more hysterical.

Women began screaming.

It was like a mass religious ceremony.

And I feel more and more excited.

I feel I was a member of all those believers.

I could see.

what effect his speech was having on the mass of people below.

And it was quite extraordinary.

They were at best expectant when he started, but he had them in a near

before long, and he kept them there in waves again and again.

Right after this speech, we all went to the Braunhaus and we went into a room

and I was told by my father, go over there on this chair, sit down and keep

quiet. Then the transcript of the speech just delivered began to be

brought into the room by messengers.

Hitler withdrew to a desk, sat down with Goebbels looking over his shoulder, and

I was impressed by the utterly...

calm, rational, critical way in which Hitler went through that manuscript with

Goebbels, quietly saying, this went over very well, let us play that up, this

will cut, and so.

While Hitler plays to his bass,

He gives people an enemy to fight against.

His political opponent, the communists.

There were political marches taking place between the Nazis on the one side,

Communists on the other.

And there were fight and death shootings practically every weekend.

All of a sudden, everybody was a Nazi, Nazis everywhere.

Like mushrooms that just came up, you know.

All night, there was a swastika flag in every window, except ours.

We didn't realize the seriousness of it.

But one night, we saw a young man being beaten by about 12 Nazis in

uniform, and there we were.

were unable to do a thing.

Riding alongside Hitler is his friend and backer, Putzi Hamstengel.

A few things which are always omitted in the films of today,

that is the violence from the other side.

For instance, when we got out of the motor cars, there are so many red

semi -armed and whatnot.

We'll have to storm the hall.

And then it started.

It was simply live or die.

I remember Hitler standing up there with a horse whip. He beat one fellow

who screamed most how.

He beat him right across the face.

I think the ordinary person was absolutely tired of this

situation and was on the lookout for someone who would come along to clean up

the place.

Anything is better than this situation that we're in at the moment.

July 1932.

13 million Germans vote for Hitler.

Though short of a majority, the Nazis are now the largest political party.

And after six months, Hitler is handed the levers of power.

Such is his cocktail of charisma, stagecraft and populist message that

pulled off a staggering political maneuver.

He'd openly campaigned on a promise to dismantle democracy and install himself

as dictator.

Now, with his friends and accomplices behind him, he's going to deliver on it.

Now, Hitler, he came into power by legal ways, and we all expected him

to become a respectable, sensible creature.

But hardly was he in power. He stopped his revolution, and on

it went, and on it went. And the train was not only the wrong train, but it

faster and faster and faster, so nobody could jump off.