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Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:04,360 The computer system post office spent an arm and a leg on is faulty. 2 00:00:04,361 --> 00:00:07,040 Oh my god, it's just doubled right in front of my eyes. 3 00:00:07,041 --> 00:00:08,480 I haven't got that money. 4 00:00:08,481 --> 00:00:10,880 The horizon system was working properly. 5 00:00:10,881 --> 00:00:14,800 The losses must have been caused by Mr. Castleton's own error. 6 00:00:14,801 --> 00:00:17,120 How many other sub-postmasters have you found? 7 00:00:17,121 --> 00:00:19,200 Six. We've all gone the record. 8 00:00:19,201 --> 00:00:22,160 I'm thinking, set up a meeting, send out invitations. 9 00:00:22,161 --> 00:00:23,760 See if anyone turns up. 10 00:00:23,761 --> 00:00:27,520 The post office told us you're the only one. 11 00:00:27,521 --> 00:00:31,120 It was a lie from this moment forward. 12 00:00:31,121 --> 00:00:35,280 None of us won't be the only one ever again. 13 00:00:35,281 --> 00:00:43,281 I just think you made a mistake, Sam. 14 00:00:55,841 --> 00:01:01,680 I know, but the set if I plead a guilty, I could have a shot back. 15 00:01:01,681 --> 00:01:04,160 How is that ever going to work? 16 00:01:04,161 --> 00:01:06,960 You'll be a convicted criminal. 17 00:01:06,961 --> 00:01:14,160 Look, I mean, husband, and I have to read about this in the newspaper. 18 00:01:14,161 --> 00:01:16,320 It was on my own in the interview. 19 00:01:16,321 --> 00:01:19,280 I thought I was doing the right thing, jazz. Please. 20 00:01:19,281 --> 00:01:21,200 You're an innocent woman. 21 00:01:21,201 --> 00:01:24,320 You should have pleaded not guilty like we agreed. 22 00:01:24,321 --> 00:01:26,080 Come on. We're going to be late. 23 00:01:26,081 --> 00:01:28,080 We're going to start with out. 24 00:01:28,081 --> 00:01:36,081 It was unbelievable. 25 00:01:47,921 --> 00:01:50,880 The lowest day of my life. 26 00:01:50,881 --> 00:01:57,680 Hi, sorry, I've got a bit lost. 27 00:01:57,681 --> 00:02:03,360 Sorry, are you, is this we're all former supposed masters? Come in. 28 00:02:03,361 --> 00:02:05,680 It's okay. 29 00:02:05,681 --> 00:02:12,640 Please, if I find a seat, I'm just seeing. 30 00:02:12,641 --> 00:02:14,160 Sam, from Warsaw? 31 00:02:14,161 --> 00:02:18,640 Yeah, well, well, we're all sharing our stories. 32 00:02:18,641 --> 00:02:23,520 So, I don't know if you want to. 33 00:02:23,521 --> 00:02:31,200 I had no problems till they sent us a new horizon pimp hat. 34 00:02:31,201 --> 00:02:36,080 They just won't have it that there's something wrong with the thing. 35 00:02:36,081 --> 00:02:40,160 They say I'm piggybacking, going into the till to pay out 36 00:02:40,161 --> 00:02:42,080 of pension with one hand and pay in myself with the other. 37 00:02:42,081 --> 00:02:46,480 I'm guessing they also said you were the only ones having these problems. 38 00:02:46,481 --> 00:02:49,440 Yeah, I'm guessing they said the same too. Everyone else in this room, right? 39 00:02:49,441 --> 00:02:51,360 I'm such a fool. I believed them. 40 00:02:51,361 --> 00:02:53,040 I believed them. 41 00:02:53,041 --> 00:02:54,970 When they said, just confess you took that 42 00:02:54,982 --> 00:02:57,200 L5,000 and you'll be backing your shop tomorrow. 43 00:02:57,201 --> 00:02:59,040 You shouldn't have done that. 44 00:02:59,041 --> 00:03:00,240 It was the new pinpaddy. 45 00:03:00,241 --> 00:03:02,480 It wasn't your fault. It was an air fault. 46 00:03:02,481 --> 00:03:06,320 Actually, I pleaded guilty to you. 47 00:03:06,321 --> 00:03:08,240 So did I. 48 00:03:08,241 --> 00:03:10,400 Wait, you did. 49 00:03:10,401 --> 00:03:15,120 I can't believe it. I thought we were on our own, you know? Not any more. 50 00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:17,520 I'm a mother. 51 00:03:17,521 --> 00:03:20,880 I don't want to go to prison. 52 00:03:20,881 --> 00:03:23,040 No, we're changing you, please. 53 00:03:23,041 --> 00:03:24,640 Okay, not guilty. 54 00:03:24,641 --> 00:03:27,120 And this time I'm coming to court with you. 55 00:03:27,121 --> 00:03:28,000 Hey. 56 00:03:28,001 --> 00:03:32,800 Now, if you're thinking of going to court, just be careful. 57 00:03:32,801 --> 00:03:38,400 Well, there are people here who've done time. 58 00:03:38,401 --> 00:03:43,280 We've all lost our businesses and our savings. 59 00:03:44,480 --> 00:03:48,320 The question is, what are we going to do about it? 60 00:03:48,321 --> 00:03:54,480 Empty is my thing you snore on a minute. 61 00:03:54,481 --> 00:03:56,720 It's time to be nice. 62 00:03:56,721 --> 00:03:58,960 At least you take the trouble to turn it up. 63 00:03:58,961 --> 00:04:04,480 Mrs Hamilton. 64 00:04:04,481 --> 00:04:05,600 That's me. 65 00:04:05,601 --> 00:04:06,800 James, I've got the wrongs. 66 00:04:06,801 --> 00:04:08,080 Thank you for coming. 67 00:04:08,081 --> 00:04:08,880 My pleasure. 68 00:04:08,881 --> 00:04:09,840 Do you come in? Joe's mum. 69 00:04:09,841 --> 00:04:10,841 Hello. 70 00:04:13,360 --> 00:04:16,480 So, one way or another, we're all fighting back. 71 00:04:16,481 --> 00:04:17,680 Everywhere we can. 72 00:04:17,681 --> 00:04:19,920 We're even thinking about suing the post office. 73 00:04:19,921 --> 00:04:22,400 I'd like to see you try with no money. 74 00:04:22,401 --> 00:04:24,240 Well, good job talking to your MP. 75 00:04:24,241 --> 00:04:25,760 Cost absolutely nothing. 76 00:04:25,761 --> 00:04:27,200 It's just homemade. 77 00:04:27,201 --> 00:04:28,160 Well, it looks delicious. 78 00:04:28,161 --> 00:04:28,960 Thank you, I will. 79 00:04:28,961 --> 00:04:33,680 We thought maybe you could talk to the government or something. 80 00:04:33,681 --> 00:04:35,440 Yes, indeed. 81 00:04:35,441 --> 00:04:39,920 There are two other cases in my constituency alone. 82 00:04:39,921 --> 00:04:41,200 Wow, really? 83 00:04:41,201 --> 00:04:42,400 It's very odd, isn't it? 84 00:04:42,401 --> 00:04:44,960 I mean, the post office is a national institution. 85 00:04:44,961 --> 00:04:48,640 You think you could trust them to listen to their own people. 86 00:04:48,641 --> 00:04:50,240 Personally, Mr. 87 00:04:50,241 --> 00:04:51,280 Arbeth? No, James, please. 88 00:04:51,281 --> 00:04:54,240 I wouldn't trust them as far as I could throw them. 89 00:04:54,241 --> 00:04:58,800 I'm going to ask around the house. 90 00:04:58,801 --> 00:05:02,640 See how many members are hearing similar stories. 91 00:05:02,641 --> 00:05:06,240 Make an approach to post office management at the highest level. 92 00:05:06,241 --> 00:05:10,000 I think I feel a campaign coming on. 93 00:05:10,001 --> 00:05:17,200 Oh, that should operate. 94 00:05:17,201 --> 00:05:21,123 And so my client, Mrs. 95 00:05:21,135 --> 00:05:26,080 Corps, seeks permission to change her plea to not guilty. 96 00:05:26,081 --> 00:05:30,240 This is because she had no solicitor with her during her interview under caution. 97 00:05:30,241 --> 00:05:33,200 And because there is also a technical issue 98 00:05:33,201 --> 00:05:37,920 which you may consider requires expert evidence concerning a pin pad. 99 00:05:38,880 --> 00:05:40,640 I can't see anything here. 100 00:05:40,641 --> 00:05:42,000 A pin pad was faulty? Quiet, please. 101 00:05:42,001 --> 00:05:42,800 Very well, Mrs. 102 00:05:42,801 --> 00:05:46,880 Corps. 103 00:05:46,881 --> 00:05:48,000 I vacate your plea. 104 00:05:48,001 --> 00:05:49,840 How do you now plead? Not guilty. 105 00:06:08,400 --> 00:06:09,360 Is that him? 106 00:06:09,361 --> 00:06:11,920 The so-called trade unionist. 107 00:06:11,921 --> 00:06:13,360 He's got a bloody nerve. 108 00:06:13,361 --> 00:06:14,800 Federation, ma'am. 109 00:06:14,801 --> 00:06:17,440 A federation man who calls out of nowhere. 110 00:06:17,441 --> 00:06:19,760 How do we know we can trust him? We don't. 111 00:06:19,761 --> 00:06:22,880 What a call. 112 00:06:22,881 --> 00:06:28,880 Hi, Arlen. 113 00:06:28,881 --> 00:06:29,520 Found a set. 114 00:06:29,521 --> 00:06:34,320 Yeah, that we've been heard of any company. 115 00:06:35,200 --> 00:06:40,000 All right, everyone. 116 00:06:40,001 --> 00:06:41,120 Should we make a start? 117 00:06:41,121 --> 00:06:43,040 Should we make a start? Thanks. 118 00:06:43,041 --> 00:06:44,480 Right. 119 00:06:44,481 --> 00:06:52,481 So, welcome to the second meeting of the Justice for Supposed Masters Alliance. 120 00:06:53,281 --> 00:06:56,800 Now, before we get onto our campaign update, 121 00:06:56,801 --> 00:07:01,120 we have a guest who'd like permission to speak. 122 00:07:01,600 --> 00:07:07,280 This is Michael Rudkin, friends. 123 00:07:07,281 --> 00:07:12,320 An executive officer of the National Federation for Supposed Masters. 124 00:07:12,321 --> 00:07:14,480 Not anymore. 125 00:07:14,481 --> 00:07:17,360 The Federation, the Federation sent me back my membership fee. 126 00:07:17,361 --> 00:07:18,400 He said he won't represent me. 127 00:07:18,401 --> 00:07:20,560 They tell me to get a good criminal lawyer. 128 00:07:20,561 --> 00:07:22,640 And that was the last I heard of them. 129 00:07:22,641 --> 00:07:24,160 I was so called union. 130 00:07:24,161 --> 00:07:27,040 I was being in bed with a post office for years. 131 00:07:27,041 --> 00:07:28,480 I can't believe by the way I came in. 132 00:07:28,481 --> 00:07:29,481 I can tell you my story. 133 00:07:30,560 --> 00:07:31,280 Up to you, Paul. 134 00:07:31,281 --> 00:07:38,560 Now, you think you're the little guys facing up to one powerful enemy. 135 00:07:38,561 --> 00:07:38,960 You're wrong. 136 00:07:38,961 --> 00:07:42,800 Post office don't make the computers, do they? 137 00:07:42,801 --> 00:07:46,880 No, they don't design the kit. 138 00:07:46,881 --> 00:07:48,560 They don't write the software. 139 00:07:48,561 --> 00:07:49,680 They don't run the network. 140 00:07:49,681 --> 00:07:57,200 That's a project to multinational corporation, headquarters in Brattano. 141 00:07:58,880 --> 00:08:01,280 I've been there for someone they can do. 142 00:08:01,281 --> 00:08:05,600 Two years ago, I got myself an invitation to Fujitsu 143 00:08:05,601 --> 00:08:07,222 to sort out the issue with the foreign exchange 144 00:08:07,234 --> 00:08:09,040 stock control that we were all having problems with. 145 00:08:09,041 --> 00:08:12,480 Michael Rudkin, see you, George Delph. 146 00:08:12,481 --> 00:08:14,160 Thanks, Mike. 147 00:08:14,161 --> 00:08:18,160 19th of August, 2008. 148 00:08:18,161 --> 00:08:21,680 Cheers. 149 00:08:21,681 --> 00:08:22,800 Thanks, Mike. 150 00:08:22,801 --> 00:08:25,200 Mr. Ruckin, George Delph, hi. 151 00:08:25,201 --> 00:08:27,040 Hi, good to be here. 152 00:08:27,041 --> 00:08:29,200 And you're welcome to Fujitsu. 153 00:08:29,201 --> 00:08:29,760 Juicer. 154 00:08:29,761 --> 00:08:31,520 Nice to follow me. 155 00:08:31,521 --> 00:08:37,120 Horizon is the largest IT system in Europe. 156 00:08:37,121 --> 00:08:38,160 We're very proud of that. 157 00:08:38,161 --> 00:08:40,160 Outside the military, that is. 158 00:08:40,161 --> 00:08:44,080 Cost of a billion pounds. 159 00:08:44,081 --> 00:08:47,360 We've rolled out 40,000 terminals to your members. 160 00:08:47,361 --> 00:08:50,720 So this accounts for all the James Bond stuff, does it? 161 00:08:50,721 --> 00:08:56,400 All I'm expecting is there'll give me a bit of training I can pass on. 162 00:08:56,720 --> 00:09:01,680 All right, stage of the hour, everything. 163 00:09:01,681 --> 00:09:04,613 I must be a while a lot of my members have been complaining 164 00:09:04,625 --> 00:09:07,120 about your rubbish foreign exchange stock control. 165 00:09:07,121 --> 00:09:08,720 We can help. 166 00:09:08,721 --> 00:09:11,120 A lot of my members have been losing money. 167 00:09:11,121 --> 00:09:12,960 The bottom line. 168 00:09:12,961 --> 00:09:13,680 They included. 169 00:09:13,681 --> 00:09:18,320 Meet your friendly covert operations team. 170 00:09:18,321 --> 00:09:24,480 They get in there, and this guy sits me down at her right and terminal. 171 00:09:25,520 --> 00:09:27,595 All right, so easiest way to help is if I just 172 00:09:27,607 --> 00:09:29,920 show you how to adjust your stock control manually. 173 00:09:29,921 --> 00:09:34,160 Well, I said to him, is this life? 174 00:09:34,161 --> 00:09:36,720 Sure, look at the clock. 175 00:09:36,721 --> 00:09:44,080 So if I start by adjusting this from sterling to Euros, I'll ask her to him. 176 00:09:44,081 --> 00:09:49,840 You're inside some suppose master's horizon, and he doesn't know. 177 00:09:49,841 --> 00:09:54,320 Said, yeah, yeah, I am. 178 00:09:54,800 --> 00:09:59,360 How was am I going to show you how to do this? 179 00:09:59,361 --> 00:10:05,120 And then right in front of my eyes, he starts changing the suppose master's figures. 180 00:10:05,121 --> 00:10:06,560 Excuse me. 181 00:10:06,561 --> 00:10:09,329 I've been telling my members for years, no 182 00:10:09,341 --> 00:10:12,320 one else has access to their branch accounts. 183 00:10:12,321 --> 00:10:15,729 Okay, well, I'd better put the figures back the way 184 00:10:15,741 --> 00:10:18,960 they were then or they weren't balanced tonight. 185 00:10:18,961 --> 00:10:20,960 Yeah. 186 00:10:20,961 --> 00:10:28,961 They're just judgment. Do you know what this means? 187 00:10:34,161 --> 00:10:37,029 It means they can sneak in behind your book, change 188 00:10:37,041 --> 00:10:39,920 your figures, book her off and leave with no trace. 189 00:10:43,280 --> 00:10:48,346 No, no, no, no, no, no. They said that was impossible. 190 00:10:48,358 --> 00:10:53,920 They said that the branch accounts 191 00:10:53,921 --> 00:10:56,480 were totally secure. That's what it told me. They lied. 192 00:10:56,481 --> 00:11:03,040 But if they're getting into our accounts and messing about in there, 193 00:11:03,041 --> 00:11:05,153 then it's a bit rich for them to claim that we 194 00:11:05,165 --> 00:11:07,520 have a 100% responsibility when money goes missing. 195 00:11:07,521 --> 00:11:08,521 Exactly. 196 00:11:10,160 --> 00:11:15,540 So I drive home from Fujitsu, the next morning I 197 00:11:15,552 --> 00:11:21,280 wake up and my wife is stood at the foot of 198 00:11:21,281 --> 00:11:26,160 our bed and there's an order to beside her. 199 00:11:26,161 --> 00:11:34,161 Your post office is now 44,000 pounds in deficit, says he. 200 00:11:38,800 --> 00:11:41,881 Coincidence? Revenge? My wife ran the post 201 00:11:41,893 --> 00:11:45,280 office when I was away on Federation business. 202 00:11:45,281 --> 00:11:53,281 So although I was the postmaster, my poor wife is now a convicted criminal. 203 00:11:55,441 --> 00:12:01,120 You're welcome. 204 00:12:01,121 --> 00:12:03,120 Thank you. 205 00:12:03,121 --> 00:12:11,121 Wait, Mr. Rookill, thank you. 206 00:12:14,241 --> 00:12:16,720 Thank you. 207 00:12:16,721 --> 00:12:20,720 I won't do any good. 208 00:12:34,721 --> 00:12:42,721 So they punished him. They punished him for standing up to him, so they did to me. 209 00:12:43,201 --> 00:12:46,099 They knew how to fight him, but they knew I 210 00:12:46,111 --> 00:12:49,360 didn't stand a chance. They just did it to teach 211 00:12:49,361 --> 00:12:52,510 me a lesson to teach everyone in this room a lesson, 212 00:12:52,522 --> 00:12:55,440 that's what we're up against. That is what we're up against. 213 00:12:55,441 --> 00:13:03,441 The post office is still investigating, so it's 214 00:13:04,836 --> 00:13:12,480 going to take a bit longer than we thought, 215 00:13:12,481 --> 00:13:19,680 as it's now 36 charges? How many? 36 charges. No, no, no, that's totally wrong. 216 00:13:19,681 --> 00:13:23,600 I've got the indictment right here, Jazz. It's definitely now 36 charges. 217 00:13:23,601 --> 00:13:28,000 It was 19, where have all these new ones come from? 218 00:13:28,001 --> 00:13:32,160 I don't know, I don't remember. 219 00:13:32,161 --> 00:13:39,040 And what about this? A shortfall. It's now 11,000, that's more than doubled. 220 00:13:39,041 --> 00:13:41,126 He's selling everyone stamps with a picture of 221 00:13:41,138 --> 00:13:43,280 the queen on them. We love the queen, don't we? 222 00:13:43,281 --> 00:13:51,281 That's all right. Yeah, it's just all these delays that do in both our heads in. 223 00:13:51,361 --> 00:13:55,677 Jazz, I think we should get a medical report when 224 00:13:55,689 --> 00:13:59,840 cases go on and unlike this, it can be hard for the defendant. 225 00:13:59,841 --> 00:14:05,680 She's fine. 226 00:14:05,681 --> 00:14:13,681 I'm just going to see if they're ready for us. 227 00:14:15,921 --> 00:14:22,480 Everyone's eyes are on me. 228 00:14:26,800 --> 00:14:31,520 It's okay. 229 00:14:31,521 --> 00:14:39,521 Sam, can you get the phone? 230 00:14:44,001 --> 00:14:49,635 Hello? Oh, it's Joe. Go, she had me worried there. 231 00:14:49,647 --> 00:14:56,080 I'm just checking in on you. Are you okay? 232 00:14:56,400 --> 00:15:02,245 I'm up and down. Are you getting out at all? Oh, I can't go out. 233 00:15:02,257 --> 00:15:07,840 Not to the good of the world and not even to the supermarket. 234 00:15:07,841 --> 00:15:13,360 I see people I know, sometimes they look surprised to see me and I wonder. 235 00:15:13,361 --> 00:15:18,069 Do they think I've gone to prison already? Oh, Sam. 236 00:15:18,081 --> 00:15:22,800 If I just had the money first, you'd be trying to get it. 237 00:15:23,680 --> 00:15:28,480 I wouldn't be much fun for you, Joe. Oh, God! Sam, what is it? It's okay. 238 00:15:28,481 --> 00:15:33,600 It's okay. I'm a right job. It's just a postman. 239 00:15:33,601 --> 00:15:41,601 Every time the door goes, I think it is them. Come to get me. 240 00:15:43,361 --> 00:15:47,440 Oh, I don't know what you're supposed to say. 241 00:15:47,441 --> 00:15:55,441 No idea this was happening to other people. I thought I was the only one. 242 00:15:56,721 --> 00:16:01,200 Though nights I was just sobbing, didn't know what to do, how to get out this mess. 243 00:16:01,201 --> 00:16:04,080 Sounds like it was very traumatic for you. 244 00:16:04,081 --> 00:16:06,400 Well, it's not just me that it's traumatic for. 245 00:16:06,401 --> 00:16:09,920 I just think that the post office needs to investigate this. 246 00:16:09,921 --> 00:16:12,389 There's just got to be something else going on, 247 00:16:12,401 --> 00:16:15,040 because it can't be happening to this many people. 248 00:16:15,041 --> 00:16:18,880 Joe was crazy. She's a natural. 249 00:16:18,881 --> 00:16:21,040 Yeah, but who was listening? 250 00:16:21,041 --> 00:16:24,800 How can Sam die about these allegations against the post office? 251 00:16:24,801 --> 00:16:26,400 I'm very concerned about this. 252 00:16:26,401 --> 00:16:29,040 Cases seem to be cropping up all over the country. 253 00:16:29,041 --> 00:16:31,280 Who knew it, or the MP could be so nice? 254 00:16:31,281 --> 00:16:33,679 The post office for being, I think, pretty hard-nosed 255 00:16:33,691 --> 00:16:35,920 in the way they've taken the case with the court. 256 00:16:35,921 --> 00:16:39,920 No trouble is nobody watches local news. 257 00:16:39,921 --> 00:16:43,920 I think the bosses need to think again, and be more sympathetic. 258 00:16:43,921 --> 00:16:51,921 They're all. 259 00:17:11,921 --> 00:17:18,165 A tiny number of ex-subpost masters who appear to be making distinct 260 00:17:18,177 --> 00:17:22,560 allegations with respect to the operation of the horizon system. 261 00:17:22,561 --> 00:17:25,522 But in two of the cases, the individuals have 262 00:17:25,534 --> 00:17:28,640 in the past pleaded guilty to false accounting. 263 00:17:28,641 --> 00:17:32,937 I have written back to the Member of Parliament, making clear that post 264 00:17:32,949 --> 00:17:37,440 office limited does not accept any of the allegations that are being made, 265 00:17:37,441 --> 00:17:44,960 and will robustly defend its position if any civil action is mounted against it. 266 00:17:44,961 --> 00:17:48,000 Freedom of information. 267 00:17:48,001 --> 00:17:49,765 Just when you think you've cracked it, they 268 00:17:49,777 --> 00:17:51,760 come up with a new trick to keep us in the dark. 269 00:17:51,761 --> 00:17:53,600 Listen to this. 270 00:17:53,601 --> 00:17:57,223 You're only allowed a question to ask a question that 271 00:17:57,235 --> 00:18:00,800 will take one person less than 18 hours to research. 272 00:18:00,801 --> 00:18:02,880 I mean, what? 273 00:18:05,280 --> 00:18:07,760 What do you think? Hey. 274 00:18:07,761 --> 00:18:15,761 Try and have a life here, Alan. 275 00:18:21,201 --> 00:18:29,201 I just want to be able to take on holiday again. 276 00:18:30,561 --> 00:18:37,680 This is a proper holiday, a broad, not just camping. 277 00:18:37,681 --> 00:18:44,240 And still half of Snowdonia waiting to be quiet. 278 00:18:44,241 --> 00:18:51,360 A, the post office has taken all our money. 279 00:18:51,361 --> 00:18:56,640 B, my knees are way too old for snowed enough. 280 00:18:58,240 --> 00:19:01,359 And see, you can't possibly go on holiday, 281 00:19:01,371 --> 00:19:04,800 too busy campaigning, morning, noon and night. 282 00:19:04,801 --> 00:19:09,360 This is all taking too long. 283 00:19:09,361 --> 00:19:11,360 OK. 284 00:19:11,361 --> 00:19:19,361 Hiya. OK. Sorry of late. 285 00:19:37,360 --> 00:19:40,080 What the hell, nope. So, it's a concept. 286 00:19:40,081 --> 00:19:43,520 It's OK. 287 00:19:43,521 --> 00:19:46,400 So, Sam, what you got? 288 00:19:46,401 --> 00:19:49,360 Sam. 289 00:19:49,361 --> 00:19:51,840 It's OK. 290 00:19:51,841 --> 00:19:52,800 Sam, what have you done? 291 00:19:52,801 --> 00:19:53,600 How have you done this? 292 00:19:53,601 --> 00:19:56,560 Sam, look at me, what? 293 00:19:56,561 --> 00:19:59,200 Why don't you do something? 294 00:19:59,201 --> 00:20:02,480 I need an ambulance, please. 295 00:20:02,481 --> 00:20:08,720 It's a 45 foul field road. Also, WS29WBB for Bravo. 296 00:20:08,721 --> 00:20:16,721 You're too old for me. 297 00:20:20,881 --> 00:20:22,480 I need to help you, OK? 298 00:20:22,481 --> 00:20:25,600 I tried everything. 299 00:20:25,601 --> 00:20:26,640 I don't know. 300 00:20:26,641 --> 00:20:27,520 I don't know. 301 00:20:27,521 --> 00:20:28,320 It's OK. 302 00:20:28,321 --> 00:20:29,920 It's OK, I'm here. 303 00:20:29,921 --> 00:20:31,360 Good luck with you. 304 00:20:31,361 --> 00:20:33,280 Hey, can you stop snaring us? 305 00:20:33,281 --> 00:20:34,400 Just mind your own business! 306 00:20:34,401 --> 00:20:38,800 Come on, it's OK, Sam. 307 00:20:38,801 --> 00:20:41,840 What's the next one? Oh, it's candy. 308 00:20:41,841 --> 00:20:43,760 Candy, OK. 309 00:20:43,761 --> 00:20:45,520 So, if you can find it. 310 00:20:45,521 --> 00:20:48,480 He's doing well, yeah. 311 00:20:48,481 --> 00:20:49,760 We'll be doing the spelling bee soon. 312 00:20:49,761 --> 00:20:51,600 No? Hello. 313 00:20:51,601 --> 00:20:57,641 Mr. Singh? Yeah, yeah. 314 00:20:58,240 --> 00:21:00,880 Can I have a word? 315 00:21:00,881 --> 00:21:04,480 Yeah, two minutes and then burgers, OK? 316 00:21:04,481 --> 00:21:11,360 Hey, how are you doing? 317 00:21:11,361 --> 00:21:13,600 I want to stress you'll be sedated. 318 00:21:13,601 --> 00:21:14,960 Do you want to feel anything? 319 00:21:14,961 --> 00:21:19,760 ECT had a lot of bad press at one point, but re-continue to find it very useful 320 00:21:19,761 --> 00:21:23,760 in giving relief to patients a severely depressed asserman. 321 00:21:26,160 --> 00:21:28,560 And nothing else we've tried has worked, so... 322 00:21:28,561 --> 00:21:34,320 Just don't go home and Google it, Mr. Singh. 323 00:21:34,321 --> 00:21:40,160 We'll talk more later, no. 324 00:21:54,160 --> 00:21:56,240 Like, you're not going to Google it. 325 00:21:56,241 --> 00:21:57,920 Hello? It's mad. 326 00:21:57,921 --> 00:22:00,960 But you're not the worst thing, Joe. 327 00:22:00,961 --> 00:22:08,000 If I don't let her carry on, bleeding guilty, like she wanted to. 328 00:22:08,001 --> 00:22:09,040 In the first place. 329 00:22:09,041 --> 00:22:11,680 All right, yeah. 330 00:22:11,681 --> 00:22:16,800 She might have gone to prison, but... She'd be up by now. 331 00:22:16,801 --> 00:22:18,480 Oh, jeez. 332 00:22:18,481 --> 00:22:21,280 My boy would have a mother. 333 00:22:21,281 --> 00:22:25,920 And Sam would be free. 334 00:22:25,921 --> 00:22:31,360 Great. 335 00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:33,280 Great. 336 00:22:33,281 --> 00:22:41,281 The problem is relatively very small, 337 00:23:00,321 --> 00:23:05,840 very few complaints, but this is a very serious matter for the post office, 338 00:23:05,841 --> 00:23:09,120 whose business rests on our reputation for being trustworthy. 339 00:23:09,121 --> 00:23:16,080 We all represent constituents who tell us that your helpline 340 00:23:16,081 --> 00:23:19,280 is of little value, the training you offer is minimal. 341 00:23:19,281 --> 00:23:21,760 Angela is our head of network services. 342 00:23:21,761 --> 00:23:23,200 Thank you. 343 00:23:23,201 --> 00:23:27,840 Well, the helpline and support are there. 344 00:23:27,841 --> 00:23:32,640 Now, whether staff take it up or not, that's another matter. 345 00:23:32,641 --> 00:23:39,120 Mrs. Venils, is the post office saying that horizon is 100% foolproof, 346 00:23:39,121 --> 00:23:41,478 because that will make it the first perfect 347 00:23:41,490 --> 00:23:44,080 software system ever implemented by government. 348 00:23:44,081 --> 00:23:49,040 The system is robust, and gentlemen, we have nothing to hide. 349 00:23:49,041 --> 00:23:53,680 Indeed, we're ready to mount and fund an independent review. 350 00:23:55,600 --> 00:23:56,720 Well, that's marvelous. 351 00:23:56,721 --> 00:23:59,126 And I'm sure Mr. Bates and the justice for South Post 352 00:23:59,138 --> 00:24:01,920 Monsters Alliance will be thrilled to get involved with that. 353 00:24:01,921 --> 00:24:09,921 Thank you for the missed me, Susan. 354 00:24:16,641 --> 00:24:19,760 How is life in the sleepy old post office? 355 00:24:19,761 --> 00:24:20,240 Is it easy? I wish. 356 00:24:20,241 --> 00:24:24,000 High finance misses you, kid. 357 00:24:24,001 --> 00:24:26,560 I'm a proud public servant now. 358 00:24:26,561 --> 00:24:29,120 Well, that wage is not half as much fun as your old life. 359 00:24:29,121 --> 00:24:32,960 Chasing down villains and fraudsters with me. 360 00:24:32,961 --> 00:24:38,400 Susan, is that what we're doing here? I don't know. 361 00:24:38,401 --> 00:24:41,200 That's why I hired you. 362 00:24:41,201 --> 00:24:49,201 Ah, Angela Vandenberger is head of network services. 363 00:24:49,921 --> 00:24:51,680 Bob Rutherford from Second Sight. 364 00:24:51,681 --> 00:24:53,040 Angela, nice to meet you. 365 00:24:53,041 --> 00:24:54,400 Here to help. 366 00:24:54,401 --> 00:24:58,640 We've pulled a dozen files for you to look at. 367 00:24:58,641 --> 00:25:00,640 All the cases the MPs have been pushing. 368 00:25:00,641 --> 00:25:03,600 Anything else you want, though, we can provide. 369 00:25:03,601 --> 00:25:06,480 Accounts, procedures, backgrounds, are for upper-list. 370 00:25:06,481 --> 00:25:10,240 And I'd like to visit few jits to in Brackenaw. 371 00:25:10,241 --> 00:25:11,920 No problem. 372 00:25:11,921 --> 00:25:15,760 Oh, are you not staying? 373 00:25:15,761 --> 00:25:19,040 Knowing you have old Bob, I imagine you're itching to get on the road. 374 00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:21,280 Thank you all. 375 00:25:21,281 --> 00:25:25,120 Alan, you can't go meet him on your own. 376 00:25:25,121 --> 00:25:28,640 Because how will you know what to ask this investigator? 377 00:25:28,641 --> 00:25:32,800 And because she's my neighbour and she's really nice and she wants to help. 378 00:25:32,801 --> 00:25:37,120 Kaylin L, past master and livery man. 379 00:25:37,121 --> 00:25:42,480 Kaylin L, forensic accountant, Alan, bite around off. 380 00:25:42,481 --> 00:25:43,920 Alan. 381 00:25:43,921 --> 00:25:47,840 Alan Bates. 382 00:25:48,800 --> 00:25:49,360 Yeah. 383 00:25:49,361 --> 00:25:55,840 Kaylin L, past master and livery man of the worshipful company of arbitrators. 384 00:25:55,841 --> 00:25:57,200 You've been looking me up. 385 00:25:57,201 --> 00:26:00,161 And board of the inland revenues form a chief 386 00:26:00,173 --> 00:26:02,880 prosecuting and investigating accountant. 387 00:26:02,881 --> 00:26:04,160 Now that was a fun job. 388 00:26:04,161 --> 00:26:05,920 Shall we? 389 00:26:05,921 --> 00:26:10,076 May I underline that although the post office has 390 00:26:10,088 --> 00:26:14,000 agreed to fund this independent investigation, 391 00:26:14,001 --> 00:26:18,240 Mr. Rutherford's organisation's second site will be working for us, the MPs, 392 00:26:18,241 --> 00:26:24,240 and therefore indirectly for you, justice for sub-person officers' alliance. 393 00:26:24,241 --> 00:26:29,440 So, Alan, Kay, what would you like to know? 394 00:26:29,441 --> 00:26:34,640 Well, I'd like to know exactly what makes you think you're qualified to do this job. 395 00:26:34,641 --> 00:26:38,480 Well, I'm a forensic accountant of many years experience. 396 00:26:38,481 --> 00:26:42,480 I don't doubt your paper qualifications, Mr. Rutherford. 397 00:26:42,481 --> 00:26:48,320 I have them here in front of me, but I see nothing to persuade me that second site is 398 00:26:48,321 --> 00:26:52,160 remotely capable of producing a truly independent report. 399 00:26:52,161 --> 00:26:55,760 One that's ready to bite the hand that feeds you. 400 00:26:55,761 --> 00:26:59,680 Bob Rutherford is a member of the Association of Certified Fraud Examiners. 401 00:26:59,681 --> 00:27:01,893 He has led hundreds of investigations all 402 00:27:01,905 --> 00:27:06,000 over the world into banking fraud, corruption, rogue traders, subprime mortgages. 403 00:27:06,001 --> 00:27:07,120 Doesn't answer my question. 404 00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:13,360 How can we be sure you will investigate fairly and independently? 405 00:27:13,361 --> 00:27:16,320 Because the people who suggested me know me have old, 406 00:27:16,321 --> 00:27:20,880 and that they want to hire me because they know what I like to do best, 407 00:27:20,881 --> 00:27:24,400 which is to clear innocent people who look guilty. 408 00:27:24,401 --> 00:27:29,360 I still don't see how we can trust him when he's taking post office money. 409 00:27:29,361 --> 00:27:32,400 Well, you can't pay him. I can't pay you either. 410 00:27:32,401 --> 00:27:34,720 I'll help him my spare time. 411 00:27:34,721 --> 00:27:38,080 What a really neat is. Lawyers will work for nothing. 412 00:27:38,081 --> 00:27:44,960 One day, you'll find your precious lawyers, and we'll get the scandal into court. 413 00:27:44,961 --> 00:27:49,280 But we'll need evidence, which mortals like us haven't a hope of getting our hands on. 414 00:27:49,281 --> 00:27:52,400 But Bob's outfit, second site. 415 00:27:52,401 --> 00:27:56,720 They'll have access to seven years of raw data. 416 00:27:56,721 --> 00:27:58,640 This Bob. 417 00:27:58,641 --> 00:28:02,880 We can't just look at individual cases, though. 418 00:28:02,881 --> 00:28:06,240 He has to look at horizon as a whole, as a system. 419 00:28:06,241 --> 00:28:10,400 Might take it you're happy to support his investigation. 420 00:28:10,401 --> 00:28:13,360 Well, being is it's the only one we've got. 421 00:28:13,361 --> 00:28:21,361 When I first came to the post office, they were 422 00:28:27,761 --> 00:28:29,921 introducing chip and pen, and it never worked properly. 423 00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:35,074 The base unit, the horizon computer, whatever you 424 00:28:35,086 --> 00:28:39,120 call it, the thing that sits under the counter, 425 00:28:39,121 --> 00:28:42,240 I thought of it as like an alien thing. 426 00:28:42,241 --> 00:28:46,800 Sometimes engineers would come from Fujitsu, the clever badges on. 427 00:28:46,801 --> 00:28:50,320 And I never had any idea what they were doing. 428 00:28:50,321 --> 00:28:58,240 This is probably a really stupid question, Bob. 429 00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:02,000 There were no such things as stupid questions, only stupid answers. 430 00:29:02,001 --> 00:29:09,280 That 36,000 pounds, I'm supposed to have lost. 431 00:29:09,281 --> 00:29:13,920 Where did it go? I haven't got it. 432 00:29:13,921 --> 00:29:15,920 So who has? 433 00:29:15,921 --> 00:29:21,920 I don't know, but I'm gonna find out. 434 00:29:35,921 --> 00:29:37,840 It's been in breakfast now. 435 00:29:37,841 --> 00:29:41,120 We're private people, Bob. 436 00:29:41,121 --> 00:29:43,440 This was our family home. 437 00:29:43,441 --> 00:29:50,000 But the post office gave us no option, you know, the way of making a living. 438 00:29:51,280 --> 00:29:52,080 Thank you. 439 00:29:52,081 --> 00:29:54,960 Jason. 440 00:29:54,961 --> 00:30:01,600 My wife has had it so much harder than me. 441 00:30:01,601 --> 00:30:07,840 Susan was in charge while I was away on Federation business. 442 00:30:07,841 --> 00:30:12,880 She never told me so I had no idea she was in trouble. 443 00:30:12,881 --> 00:30:17,840 Even though at least half my work in Federation was horizon related by then. 444 00:30:20,320 --> 00:30:24,800 I said to her, you were in my fucking career. 445 00:30:24,801 --> 00:30:27,920 You've destroyed our business. 446 00:30:27,921 --> 00:30:33,520 Mr. Radkin, please don't feel obliged to settle. 447 00:30:33,521 --> 00:30:36,240 I said that before, sir. 448 00:30:36,241 --> 00:30:44,160 Are they punished my wife? 449 00:30:45,360 --> 00:30:46,640 Who never stole a penny piece? 450 00:30:46,641 --> 00:30:50,640 Just because I got inside Fujitsu and saw something that I shouldn't have. 451 00:30:50,641 --> 00:30:58,641 I think what I had was a computer book. 452 00:31:02,241 --> 00:31:08,080 They just called a calendar square book that I can't be sure. 453 00:31:08,081 --> 00:31:10,240 But it was real. 454 00:31:10,241 --> 00:31:12,480 It was real. 455 00:31:12,481 --> 00:31:13,481 Other people had it. 456 00:31:14,480 --> 00:31:21,040 Yeah, I tried to tell the court that I just kept sort of saying it wrong. 457 00:31:21,041 --> 00:31:28,880 And the more I tried, the more I can't explain it. 458 00:31:28,881 --> 00:31:36,881 It was like I was on the edge of a great dark hole. 459 00:31:43,760 --> 00:31:46,160 I was just falling into it. 460 00:31:46,161 --> 00:31:53,760 The thing is, I knew that they were lying and I knew that I was telling the truth. 461 00:31:53,761 --> 00:31:58,160 I just thought this is British justice. 462 00:31:58,161 --> 00:32:00,880 That's all I've got to do is tell the truth. 463 00:32:00,881 --> 00:32:06,720 But... Sorry. 464 00:32:06,721 --> 00:32:10,720 Oh, sorry, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. I was just trying to tell you. 465 00:32:10,721 --> 00:32:11,040 No. 466 00:32:11,041 --> 00:32:15,069 No, it's just the more of you people I meet, 467 00:32:15,081 --> 00:32:19,120 unless I know how you're all still standing. 468 00:32:19,121 --> 00:32:27,121 Susan? 469 00:32:27,841 --> 00:32:29,200 I'm expecting you today. 470 00:32:29,201 --> 00:32:32,240 We need to speak now. 471 00:32:32,241 --> 00:32:36,320 Always good to see an old friend, but I do have a diary. 472 00:32:36,640 --> 00:32:37,600 Not to don't, don't. 473 00:32:37,601 --> 00:32:41,040 Lee cast. 474 00:32:41,041 --> 00:32:45,680 You know, the one you handed all the way to the Royal Court of Justice. 475 00:32:45,681 --> 00:32:46,640 That was my predecessor. 476 00:32:46,641 --> 00:32:48,160 Well, you knew he didn't have any money. 477 00:32:48,161 --> 00:32:53,360 You have humiliated him. You have bankrupted him, and I don't get it. 478 00:32:53,361 --> 00:32:57,440 Yes, I don't know why we did that. 479 00:32:57,441 --> 00:32:59,920 Well, let me suggest two reasons. One, you're stupid. 480 00:32:59,921 --> 00:33:03,680 Or two, you want to rub his nose in the dirt, use him to frighten off everyone else. 481 00:33:03,681 --> 00:33:05,520 I wasn't even here then. 482 00:33:05,521 --> 00:33:07,600 Not pleased. What is wrong with you, people? 483 00:33:07,601 --> 00:33:11,395 Are we ever to see the pin pad that Mrs. 484 00:33:11,407 --> 00:33:14,960 Cora ledges was responsible for her shortfalls? 485 00:33:14,961 --> 00:33:17,769 Your honour, I can now confirm that post office 486 00:33:17,781 --> 00:33:20,960 limited is unable to produce the pin pad in question. 487 00:33:20,961 --> 00:33:27,040 Because I'm told it was sent away for repair and has been reprogrammed. 488 00:33:27,041 --> 00:33:29,200 So it was faulty. 489 00:33:29,201 --> 00:33:34,480 In those circumstances, your honour, the prosecution offers no evidence. 490 00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:38,160 This matter has dragged on for three years. 491 00:33:38,161 --> 00:33:44,320 I direct that a not guilty verdict be entered on all 36 counts on the indictment. 492 00:33:44,321 --> 00:33:47,680 Mrs. Cora, you're free to leave. 493 00:33:47,681 --> 00:33:50,960 Court rise. 494 00:34:02,480 --> 00:34:04,080 Hey. See? You were right. 495 00:34:04,081 --> 00:34:06,800 It was faulty. 496 00:34:06,801 --> 00:34:09,840 So I'm three years of our life's supposed to open now. 497 00:34:09,841 --> 00:34:10,560 Okay. No. 498 00:34:10,561 --> 00:34:12,936 Because there won't ever put another picture 499 00:34:12,948 --> 00:34:15,280 in the paper, will they decide on innocent? Come on. 500 00:34:15,281 --> 00:34:23,281 We're making progress. 501 00:34:24,401 --> 00:34:27,600 Now the investigation is properly up and running. 502 00:34:27,601 --> 00:34:32,000 I just thought enough go betweens for the good idea to bring you two together. 503 00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:35,600 I do hope it's been useful for both of you. 504 00:34:35,601 --> 00:34:36,800 Terrific idea. 505 00:34:36,801 --> 00:34:37,920 Thank you James. 506 00:34:37,921 --> 00:34:41,360 And Alan, I do hope you'll take away from this a sure understanding 507 00:34:41,361 --> 00:34:46,160 that post offices is fully committed as you are to resolving this situation. 508 00:34:46,161 --> 00:34:47,840 Thank you. 509 00:34:47,841 --> 00:34:52,720 And if there's anything else? No, I actually. 510 00:34:52,721 --> 00:34:59,760 Why are you only looking at 12 cases? 511 00:35:01,680 --> 00:35:05,200 Well, they are the 12 cases put forward by members of parliament. 512 00:35:05,201 --> 00:35:10,240 All the cases where we are alert to the possibility of miscarriage of justice. 513 00:35:10,241 --> 00:35:12,640 There are a lot more though, Paula. 514 00:35:12,641 --> 00:35:17,440 Victims who were never charged with any criminal offense, 515 00:35:17,441 --> 00:35:20,400 but perhaps your people haven't told you about that. 516 00:35:20,401 --> 00:35:23,389 About all the destitution people sleeping in 517 00:35:23,401 --> 00:35:26,400 their cars losing their house, their health. 518 00:35:26,401 --> 00:35:29,040 Surely you'd like to hear from them too. 519 00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:37,680 Is that your throw away exit line? 520 00:35:37,681 --> 00:35:42,880 I was just thinking, you know, you knew the full story. 521 00:35:42,881 --> 00:35:44,960 You wouldn't want that on your conscience, so. 522 00:35:44,961 --> 00:35:48,960 Well, shall I suggest a few names? Oh, yes. 523 00:35:48,961 --> 00:35:53,600 Good idea. 524 00:35:57,440 --> 00:35:58,800 These are what I have here. 525 00:35:58,801 --> 00:36:06,801 Bob, good to hear from you. 526 00:36:09,441 --> 00:36:10,400 Hi there. 527 00:36:10,401 --> 00:36:11,680 The day you went to few digits. 528 00:36:11,681 --> 00:36:14,480 Are you sure it was the 19th of all? 2008. 529 00:36:14,481 --> 00:36:17,920 Yeah, never forget that. 530 00:36:17,921 --> 00:36:19,200 Last day of our whole life. 531 00:36:19,201 --> 00:36:23,040 Michael, you're not down as a visitor on their security logs. 532 00:36:23,041 --> 00:36:26,880 Post office are denying that your visit ever happened. 533 00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:28,240 Of course they are. 534 00:36:28,241 --> 00:36:29,760 Can you prove it? 535 00:36:29,761 --> 00:36:35,680 Michael, can you prove you were there? 536 00:36:35,681 --> 00:36:39,680 Bob, there's four years ago. 537 00:36:39,681 --> 00:36:42,240 I don't work for the post of us anymore. 538 00:36:46,401 --> 00:36:54,401 I think you knew your best friend, but then you can do a proper job. 539 00:37:02,081 --> 00:37:04,800 It's like, it's lovely to be here. 540 00:37:04,801 --> 00:37:05,360 Thank you. 541 00:37:05,361 --> 00:37:08,240 Paula, how often did you get to visit a place like this? 542 00:37:08,241 --> 00:37:10,960 Probably once a month if I can. 543 00:37:10,961 --> 00:37:12,560 Oh, what kind of police? 544 00:37:12,561 --> 00:37:15,360 I mean, you're the big boss to think they're getting intimidated. 545 00:37:15,361 --> 00:37:18,000 No, this is the post office. 546 00:37:18,001 --> 00:37:20,880 I get treated the same as everybody else and they tell me how it is. 547 00:37:20,881 --> 00:37:25,280 And what it like being the chief executive of a major company? 548 00:37:25,281 --> 00:37:29,840 Well, I think you can tell by the smile on my face that it's great. 549 00:37:29,841 --> 00:37:31,760 Retail is detailed. 550 00:37:31,761 --> 00:37:32,800 Shut up, you have it. 551 00:37:32,801 --> 00:37:34,240 Shut up, you silly cow. 552 00:37:34,241 --> 00:37:36,560 Come on, come on, get your breakfast. 553 00:37:42,481 --> 00:37:47,840 I represent evidence to show that the post office has made failures in support, 554 00:37:47,841 --> 00:37:51,760 investigation, training, and I find clear evidence of two bugs. 555 00:37:51,761 --> 00:37:55,600 Two. We gave you 47 cases. 556 00:37:55,601 --> 00:38:00,480 47. At this draft report of yours only mentions three. 557 00:38:00,481 --> 00:38:04,960 Where's Michael Rooken who could prove their lying about remote access? 558 00:38:04,961 --> 00:38:06,240 He can't prove it, actually. 559 00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:09,760 Well, members of Parliament would certainly like to see more individual cases. 560 00:38:09,761 --> 00:38:13,680 Oh, look, the point is not individual cases. 561 00:38:13,681 --> 00:38:17,760 The point is total systemic failure, which you don't mention. 562 00:38:17,761 --> 00:38:20,000 Well, we haven't found hard evidence of that. 563 00:38:20,001 --> 00:38:23,520 Well, what would you call the endless pinpowder novelies? 564 00:38:23,521 --> 00:38:29,120 And shortfalls doubling before people's eyes and overnight so-called corrections? 565 00:38:29,121 --> 00:38:33,840 Well, there were 68,000 users processing six million transactions a day. 566 00:38:33,841 --> 00:38:37,760 Well, this is just the gospel according to the post column for it to be systemic. 567 00:38:37,761 --> 00:38:42,080 That would have to mean that the whole network was affected, and it just isn't. 568 00:38:42,081 --> 00:38:45,120 What about the way they abuse their power and prosecute people 569 00:38:45,121 --> 00:38:49,280 without investigating properly, and then terminate them. 570 00:38:49,281 --> 00:38:53,040 On three months notice, walk away with their life savings. 571 00:38:53,041 --> 00:38:54,960 Is that not a systemic failure? 572 00:38:54,961 --> 00:38:58,480 We all agreed from the beginning that the report should be accurate. 573 00:38:58,481 --> 00:39:01,840 Post office has left a trail of destruction ever since the day 574 00:39:01,841 --> 00:39:06,160 that Horizon was introduced, and we're just sitting around 575 00:39:06,161 --> 00:39:08,080 chatting about it while they're still ruining lives. 576 00:39:08,081 --> 00:39:10,240 Systemically. 577 00:39:10,241 --> 00:39:14,640 Ah, I agree to this. 578 00:39:14,641 --> 00:39:16,560 I must have been mad. 579 00:39:16,561 --> 00:39:19,040 Well, someone with bees at their bonnets. 580 00:39:19,041 --> 00:39:21,440 I was born in Liverpool. 581 00:39:21,441 --> 00:39:26,080 He's an accountant, Alan. He's naturally cautious. 582 00:39:26,081 --> 00:39:27,120 Cautious like you. 583 00:39:27,121 --> 00:39:29,120 I can be cautious. 584 00:39:29,121 --> 00:39:31,360 What's with me and they're banging the table. 585 00:39:31,361 --> 00:39:34,240 Let's see, you know they will agree before. 586 00:39:34,241 --> 00:39:37,840 All that grandstanding of me. I look that from you, okay? 587 00:39:37,841 --> 00:39:42,000 Ah, I don't get angry. I just get frustrated. 588 00:39:42,001 --> 00:39:50,001 Second sight are going to have to come up with something better than this. 589 00:39:55,120 --> 00:40:02,160 Bob, how's it going? Michael, good. 590 00:40:02,161 --> 00:40:05,360 Erm, any luck? 591 00:40:05,361 --> 00:40:06,240 It's been a long time. 592 00:40:06,241 --> 00:40:08,160 A lot of water under the bridge. 593 00:40:08,161 --> 00:40:11,120 Yeah, okay. 594 00:40:11,121 --> 00:40:12,320 I understand. 595 00:40:12,321 --> 00:40:14,880 But, er, see you touched. 596 00:40:15,760 --> 00:40:23,760 Oh, my fucking good God. 597 00:40:31,841 --> 00:40:36,160 Michael, thank you. 598 00:40:36,161 --> 00:40:38,480 Thank you so much. 599 00:40:43,920 --> 00:40:48,000 So, Bob, I can confirm that in August 2008, 600 00:40:48,001 --> 00:40:52,480 the basement of Fujitsu's building in Brachnott did 601 00:40:52,481 --> 00:40:56,400 contain a horizon testing vitamin note, a test environment. 602 00:40:56,401 --> 00:41:00,800 And that's what we believe you're supposed to master Mr. Redkin saw. 603 00:41:00,801 --> 00:41:02,320 He got the wrong end of the stick. 604 00:41:02,321 --> 00:41:07,680 The test environment wasn't physically connected to the live horizon system, 605 00:41:07,681 --> 00:41:12,000 so it wasn't possible for the transactions he thought he saw to be real. 606 00:41:12,960 --> 00:41:16,720 Got it. Thank you. 607 00:41:16,721 --> 00:41:19,440 Let's clear that up. 608 00:41:19,441 --> 00:41:20,720 Good. 609 00:41:20,721 --> 00:41:24,560 See you out. 610 00:41:24,561 --> 00:41:28,240 Thank you for joining me by conference call. 611 00:41:28,241 --> 00:41:32,080 I'm sorry for the short notice in keeping the board updated. 612 00:41:32,081 --> 00:41:37,760 The Horizon Review Interim Report will be presented to MPs in one week's time. 613 00:41:38,560 --> 00:41:43,440 The report has found no systemic issues with the Horizon Computer system, 614 00:41:43,441 --> 00:41:49,440 but I am concerned that the report from the independent forensic accountant 615 00:41:49,441 --> 00:41:55,440 is not as factual as expected and could lead to loose language. 616 00:42:04,240 --> 00:42:10,480 What are you? poacherton gamekeeper. This report of yours 617 00:42:10,481 --> 00:42:13,760 turns out to be not how bad considering the same price. 618 00:42:13,761 --> 00:42:15,360 I like it. 619 00:42:15,361 --> 00:42:18,320 I just hope it makes a difference. 620 00:42:18,321 --> 00:42:22,320 What got Michael Ruddkin into the final version? 621 00:42:22,321 --> 00:42:28,560 An email inviting him to Brachnott, copied the seven name post office executive. 622 00:42:28,561 --> 00:42:29,561 Hold on. 623 00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:33,251 Okay, first they say he wasn't there, then they say 624 00:42:33,263 --> 00:42:36,560 he was there, but what he's glasses were broken. 625 00:42:36,561 --> 00:42:39,680 I wonder if they even know they're talking volumes. 626 00:42:39,681 --> 00:42:41,040 Welcome aboard Bob. 627 00:42:41,041 --> 00:42:46,400 Yeah, they still say that there's no remote access into your accounts. 628 00:42:46,401 --> 00:42:48,646 I'm sorry, but I don't think I'm going to be 629 00:42:48,658 --> 00:42:52,080 able to prove that they're wrong and that you're right on this one. 630 00:42:52,081 --> 00:42:58,000 Ah, but Alan there are things in documents that I found in the post office files. 631 00:42:58,720 --> 00:43:00,960 But you don't believe going to tell me more? 632 00:43:00,961 --> 00:43:03,760 Someone else I need to tell first. 633 00:43:03,761 --> 00:43:11,761 Hello all. 634 00:43:13,441 --> 00:43:17,360 We've ever seen a sunshine in your gorgeous. 635 00:43:17,361 --> 00:43:20,320 I was hoping you'd be sitting somewhere quiet. 636 00:43:20,321 --> 00:43:23,920 Yeah, I can do that or I can put the kettle on. 637 00:43:23,921 --> 00:43:26,480 Me and Joshua will put the kettle on. 638 00:43:26,880 --> 00:43:32,880 You'll investigate a Ryan Fleming. 639 00:43:32,881 --> 00:43:34,080 The third. 640 00:43:34,081 --> 00:43:36,720 So do you ever see his reporter bay? 641 00:43:36,721 --> 00:43:39,120 No. 642 00:43:39,121 --> 00:43:47,121 17th of May 2006, he recorded that he had analyzed your horizon accounts 643 00:43:47,601 --> 00:43:52,000 and was unable to find any evidence of theft. 644 00:43:52,001 --> 00:43:55,600 I plead guilty to false counting instead. 645 00:43:56,480 --> 00:43:59,717 Yes, no evidence means they had no right to 646 00:43:59,729 --> 00:44:03,280 charge you with theft and therefore no right 647 00:44:03,281 --> 00:44:05,360 to plea bargain you down to false accounting. 648 00:44:05,361 --> 00:44:11,360 Joe, no evidence means they had no right to take you to court at all. 649 00:44:24,880 --> 00:44:32,880 Everything I've gone through, everything I've lost, 10 650 00:44:37,521 --> 00:44:43,040 years of heartache and sleepless nights and always skin. 651 00:44:43,041 --> 00:44:49,920 They destroyed our whole life for a life. 652 00:44:53,920 --> 00:44:55,680 What kind of people are they? 653 00:44:55,681 --> 00:45:03,440 The second site report presented to MPs in Westminster today 654 00:45:03,441 --> 00:45:05,975 was expected to include criticism of the horizon 655 00:45:05,987 --> 00:45:08,320 computer system and of the senior management 656 00:45:08,321 --> 00:45:10,605 of the post office. But while the report 657 00:45:10,617 --> 00:45:13,200 does raise concerns about unreliable hardware 658 00:45:13,201 --> 00:45:15,820 and poor training, a post office spokesman said 659 00:45:15,832 --> 00:45:18,240 the investigation clearly shows its horizon 660 00:45:18,241 --> 00:45:21,047 system as a whole is operating as it should. 661 00:45:21,059 --> 00:45:25,040 MPs praised the post office for the way they dealt with these difficult issues. 662 00:45:40,880 --> 00:45:44,800 Alan Bates? Alan, it's Paul of Annals. 663 00:45:44,801 --> 00:45:49,360 Paula. 664 00:45:49,361 --> 00:45:57,361 Chocking. So I was thinking... Where do we go from here? 665 00:46:00,081 --> 00:46:06,640 Well, um, I've been thinking about that too. 666 00:46:07,920 --> 00:46:11,440 Well, great. It should the two of us try and find a way forward. 667 00:46:11,441 --> 00:46:14,960 If you want something done properly, do it yourself. 668 00:46:14,961 --> 00:46:17,680 Exactly. 669 00:46:17,681 --> 00:46:23,200 Well, how can I help? 670 00:46:28,001 --> 00:46:34,800 d Cardos born is hiding in those weak and drunken hearts d 671 00:46:34,801 --> 00:46:38,400 d 'Cause he kissed the girls and made them cry d 672 00:46:38,401 --> 00:46:42,320 d It was hard face creams, a missing adventure d 673 00:46:42,321 --> 00:46:48,160 d Peep, hippo, hippo, hippo d 674 00:46:48,161 --> 00:46:54,480 d And if you're a sick, give me your hand and I'll hold you d 675 00:46:57,480 --> 00:47:01,480 Preuzeto sa www.titlovi.com 54788

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