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1
00:00:55,106 --> 00:00:58,025
You just want to push up
the people
2
00:00:58,225 --> 00:01:00,945
I've moved here
to get away from.
3
00:01:01,145 --> 00:01:04,616
I haven't spoken
to not one single one of them
4
00:01:04,816 --> 00:01:05,750
Since I left there.
5
00:01:05,950 --> 00:01:10,487
And I don't want any of them
on my film!
6
00:01:10,687 --> 00:01:11,823
You don't understand.
7
00:01:12,023 --> 00:01:13,658
I do understand.
8
00:01:13,858 --> 00:01:14,659
Yeah.
9
00:01:14,859 --> 00:01:16,894
What the fuck is wrong
with that?
10
00:01:17,094 --> 00:01:19,230
Are you really gonna hit me
with the...
11
00:01:19,430 --> 00:01:20,465
I fucking well am!
12
00:01:20,665 --> 00:01:23,768
I'm gonna fucking put you
in hospital!
13
00:01:23,968 --> 00:01:25,569
Why?
Oh, my God!
14
00:01:29,006 --> 00:01:31,408
Yes!
15
00:01:39,984 --> 00:01:44,155
Ginger Baker just hit me
in the fucking nose.
16
00:01:52,964 --> 00:01:55,600
This film is about
Ginger Baker,
17
00:01:55,800 --> 00:01:59,270
A man who stands for something
in life
18
00:01:59,470 --> 00:02:02,940
That probably most of you
do not.
19
00:02:03,140 --> 00:02:04,709
Love and appreciate,
20
00:02:04,909 --> 00:02:11,615
No matter how awkward this
character may appear to you.
21
00:02:11,815 --> 00:02:13,200
God bless him.
22
00:02:13,400 --> 00:02:14,586
May the road rise.
23
00:02:14,786 --> 00:02:17,554
He helped me rise my road.
24
00:02:17,754 --> 00:02:18,922
Love you, Ginger.
25
00:02:19,122 --> 00:02:20,290
Johnny Rotten!
26
00:02:20,490 --> 00:02:21,659
I'm your man.
27
00:02:36,140 --> 00:02:38,292
Ginger Baker is a motherfucker.
That's it.
28
00:02:38,492 --> 00:02:40,644
He personally is what drums
are all about.
29
00:02:40,844 --> 00:02:43,047
He is certifiably nuts.
He's mad.
30
00:02:43,247 --> 00:02:46,017
I think he was kind of
fairly consistently horrible
31
00:02:46,217 --> 00:02:47,318
To people and to himself.
32
00:02:47,518 --> 00:02:48,786
If they've got a problem
with me,
33
00:02:48,986 --> 00:02:50,655
Come and see me
and punch me on the nose.
34
00:02:50,855 --> 00:02:52,924
I ain't gonna sue you.
I'm gonna hit you back.
35
00:02:53,124 --> 00:02:55,727
He's moved around the world,
36
00:02:55,927 --> 00:02:57,678
Getting thrown out
of every country.
37
00:02:57,878 --> 00:02:59,538
He's a rogue.
He's a lovable rogue.
38
00:02:59,738 --> 00:03:01,398
He was a fucking
dope addict, man.
39
00:03:01,598 --> 00:03:02,567
He was into drugs heavily.
40
00:03:02,767 --> 00:03:04,702
Are you surprised
that he's still living?
41
00:03:04,902 --> 00:03:06,003
Yes, I am.
42
00:03:06,203 --> 00:03:08,539
If a plane went down and it was
one person gonna get off,
43
00:03:08,739 --> 00:03:09,740
It would be Ginger.
44
00:03:09,940 --> 00:03:10,742
He was a scary guy.
45
00:03:10,942 --> 00:03:14,211
When I would look at him,
he looked like the devil.
46
00:03:14,411 --> 00:03:16,881
The devil takes care
of its own, yes.
47
00:03:17,081 --> 00:03:18,415
Like a great virtuoso madman.
48
00:03:18,615 --> 00:03:21,752
Maybe you have to be a little
mad to play the way he does.
49
00:03:21,952 --> 00:03:25,089
Probably the greatest drummer
that any of us had ever heard.
50
00:03:25,289 --> 00:03:26,423
He was the hammer of the gods.
51
00:03:26,623 --> 00:03:29,526
- He's a force of nature.
- The world's greatest drummer.
52
00:03:29,726 --> 00:03:33,898
He influenced me as a drummer,
but not as a person.
53
00:03:37,835 --> 00:03:40,137
Ginger Baker on drums!
54
00:03:46,410 --> 00:03:48,245
I was 26 years old,
55
00:03:48,445 --> 00:03:52,683
And my friend popped in a DVD
of this redheaded madman
56
00:03:52,883 --> 00:03:54,786
Driving across
the Sahara Desert.
57
00:03:54,986 --> 00:03:58,790
My initial reaction was,
"This guy has to be dead."
58
00:03:58,990 --> 00:04:01,075
But I searched for his name
on the Internet,
59
00:04:01,275 --> 00:04:03,160
And, lo and behold,
I found this article...
60
00:04:03,360 --> 00:04:06,330
"Ginger Baker vows to strip
in South African court
61
00:04:06,530 --> 00:04:09,000
"To prove that woman
claiming to be his lover
62
00:04:09,200 --> 00:04:11,002
Has never seen his cock before."
63
00:04:14,271 --> 00:04:19,443
Not only was he still alive,
but he's still a fucking madman.
64
00:04:19,643 --> 00:04:21,512
I have to meet this guy.
65
00:04:21,712 --> 00:04:22,213
Ginger.
Ginger.
66
00:04:22,413 --> 00:04:23,681
Hey, Ginger, it's Jay.
67
00:04:23,881 --> 00:04:24,949
Hey, it's Jay Bulger.
68
00:04:25,149 --> 00:04:27,518
I told him I was a writer
for Rolling Stone magazine,
69
00:04:27,718 --> 00:04:28,686
Which was a total lie.
70
00:04:28,886 --> 00:04:30,687
I want to come
and write an article
71
00:04:30,887 --> 00:04:31,889
About your trip to Africa.
72
00:04:32,089 --> 00:04:33,190
But that was my in,
73
00:04:33,390 --> 00:04:36,427
And he invited me to come down
and hear his story.
74
00:04:39,130 --> 00:04:41,132
Oh, are you all right?
75
00:04:42,867 --> 00:04:44,035
Your dog got poisoned?
76
00:04:44,235 --> 00:04:46,203
Hey, feel better.
I'll call you on Wednesday.
77
00:04:46,403 --> 00:04:47,588
I'm coming out there.
Bye.
78
00:04:47,788 --> 00:04:48,773
And I flew to South Africa
79
00:04:48,973 --> 00:04:51,609
And just kind of showed up
at his house.
80
00:04:51,809 --> 00:04:54,445
Mr. Baker,
nice to finally meet you.
81
00:04:54,645 --> 00:04:55,512
Huh?
82
00:04:55,712 --> 00:04:57,348
Thanks for having me.
83
00:04:57,548 --> 00:04:58,315
Yeah.
84
00:04:58,515 --> 00:04:59,884
And I lived with him.
85
00:05:01,552 --> 00:05:03,420
It was a truly humbling
experience.
86
00:05:04,455 --> 00:05:06,891
Why don't you listen
to the fucking story?
87
00:05:07,091 --> 00:05:08,592
This is a fucking nightmare.
88
00:05:08,792 --> 00:05:09,694
Fucking my brain up.
89
00:05:09,894 --> 00:05:12,730
People zapper.
90
00:05:12,930 --> 00:05:17,468
I wrote an article, and it was
published in Rolling Stone.
91
00:05:20,804 --> 00:05:22,173
Thank you, Ginger Baker.
92
00:05:22,373 --> 00:05:25,409
He had gifted me
with a career as a journalist,
93
00:05:25,609 --> 00:05:29,263
But I owed him so much more
than just words on paper.
94
00:05:29,463 --> 00:05:33,175
People needed to meet the man,
hear him play the drums,
95
00:05:33,375 --> 00:05:37,088
And experience this legendary
character for themselves.
96
00:05:43,794 --> 00:05:45,829
Phew.
97
00:05:49,500 --> 00:05:53,304
As we enter
into the Baker compound.
98
00:05:53,504 --> 00:05:57,441
Okay, the laws of South Africa,
which are loose enough,
99
00:05:57,641 --> 00:05:58,609
No longer apply.
100
00:06:08,920 --> 00:06:11,188
My friends.
101
00:06:14,926 --> 00:06:16,177
How are you?
102
00:06:16,377 --> 00:06:17,428
I'm great.
103
00:06:17,628 --> 00:06:21,065
Look.
You got a smile on your face.
104
00:06:21,265 --> 00:06:22,199
You missed me!
105
00:06:22,399 --> 00:06:24,601
- Yeah.
- You missed me!
106
00:06:24,801 --> 00:06:27,004
I can see it in your eyes.
107
00:06:27,939 --> 00:06:30,908
So, you've been practicing
the drums?
108
00:06:31,608 --> 00:06:32,744
Haven't touched them?
109
00:06:32,944 --> 00:06:34,678
Haven't touched them
for months.
110
00:06:34,878 --> 00:06:35,947
Really?
111
00:06:36,147 --> 00:06:38,282
Meet Ginger Baker.
112
00:06:38,482 --> 00:06:38,950
Hello.
113
00:06:39,150 --> 00:06:42,686
The man, the myth, the legend.
114
00:06:42,886 --> 00:06:44,621
The only thing I can say
to that, really,
115
00:06:44,821 --> 00:06:51,495
Is it's far too long a story
to say on one interview.
116
00:06:51,695 --> 00:06:53,030
I'm writing a book.
117
00:06:53,230 --> 00:06:56,333
When the book's published,
read it,
118
00:06:56,533 --> 00:06:59,703
And perhaps you'll understand.
119
00:06:59,903 --> 00:07:02,639
And when were you born?
120
00:07:02,839 --> 00:07:05,576
You know when I was born.
121
00:07:06,777 --> 00:07:07,979
It's in the book.
122
00:07:08,179 --> 00:07:10,381
Fuck the book.
We're not doing the book.
123
00:07:10,581 --> 00:07:14,018
It's the 19th of August 1939,
124
00:07:14,218 --> 00:07:17,888
Three weeks or so
before war was declared.
125
00:07:24,695 --> 00:07:26,430
My dad was a hero.
126
00:07:28,465 --> 00:07:32,469
He died
when I was 41/2 years old.
127
00:07:34,471 --> 00:07:36,507
You don't see bombs dropping,
128
00:07:36,707 --> 00:07:41,012
'Cause the siren goes off,
and you're in the shelter.
129
00:07:41,212 --> 00:07:42,646
You hear them.
130
00:07:49,320 --> 00:07:51,555
They used to go
"bop, bop, bop, bop, bop"...
131
00:07:51,755 --> 00:07:53,157
This funny little
clattering noise.
132
00:07:53,357 --> 00:07:56,827
And then the noise would stop,
and they'd go...
133
00:08:01,365 --> 00:08:02,533
When we went back to school,
134
00:08:02,733 --> 00:08:06,537
There were quite a few
empty desks, yeah.
135
00:08:11,508 --> 00:08:16,047
Yeah, the bombs going off,
you know, to me was great.
136
00:08:17,781 --> 00:08:21,218
I still love explosions
to this day, you know?
137
00:08:21,418 --> 00:08:23,920
You don't know.
Right.
138
00:08:24,120 --> 00:08:25,656
I love disasters.
139
00:08:29,860 --> 00:08:35,716
I was considered a troublemaker,
a smartass, brainless child.
140
00:08:35,916 --> 00:08:41,772
I was part of this school gang,
and we'd go in this record shop,
141
00:08:41,972 --> 00:08:45,742
And the other guys
would be nicking records.
142
00:08:45,942 --> 00:08:47,611
But I was a decoy.
143
00:08:47,811 --> 00:08:51,648
I'd just take records
into the booths and play them.
144
00:08:51,848 --> 00:08:55,686
And then one day, I heard
"The Quintet of the Year."
145
00:09:04,561 --> 00:09:08,165
I didn't even have a
record player, but I nicked it.
146
00:09:08,365 --> 00:09:09,466
All of a sudden,
147
00:09:09,666 --> 00:09:12,436
There was something
that I really could relate to.
148
00:09:12,636 --> 00:09:14,638
You know,
Max on "The Quintet of the Year"
149
00:09:14,838 --> 00:09:18,175
Is just out
of this fucking world.
150
00:09:28,585 --> 00:09:33,757
My mom found the records,
and she went fucking crazy.
151
00:09:33,957 --> 00:09:35,859
Mom used to use the strap
on him,
152
00:09:36,059 --> 00:09:37,777
And it made no difference.
153
00:09:37,977 --> 00:09:39,496
I used to be in my bedroom,
154
00:09:39,696 --> 00:09:42,766
Listening to him being strapped
and screaming.
155
00:09:42,966 --> 00:09:44,301
But it made no difference.
156
00:09:44,501 --> 00:09:47,354
She just said,
"Look, if ever I find you
157
00:09:47,554 --> 00:09:50,407
"Doing something
dishonest like this,
158
00:09:50,607 --> 00:09:52,609
I will call the police."
159
00:09:52,809 --> 00:09:56,380
So I wouldn't talk to the gang
anymore,
160
00:09:56,580 --> 00:09:59,951
And I got beaten up
several times by them.
161
00:10:00,151 --> 00:10:05,289
Started carving me up with a
razor blade with tape around it.
162
00:10:05,489 --> 00:10:08,425
They carved all these lines
all over my arms
163
00:10:08,625 --> 00:10:11,362
And my face and everything.
164
00:10:11,562 --> 00:10:14,298
I wasn't very popular
when I went back to school.
165
00:10:15,766 --> 00:10:21,438
It was about this time that I'd
got the letter from my dad.
166
00:10:21,638 --> 00:10:26,443
He wrote a letter for me
to be opened when I was 14.
167
00:10:26,643 --> 00:10:29,746
"My dear son,
it's just a little advice
168
00:10:29,946 --> 00:10:33,049
"In the way I should like you
to turn out.
169
00:10:33,249 --> 00:10:35,118
"Be a man at all times.
170
00:10:35,318 --> 00:10:37,188
"Hold your own ground.
171
00:10:37,388 --> 00:10:38,455
"Use your fists.
172
00:10:38,655 --> 00:10:42,326
"They are your best pals
so often.
173
00:10:42,526 --> 00:10:44,861
I remain your loving father."
174
00:10:45,061 --> 00:10:49,333
Before that, if people used to
punch me and that,
175
00:10:49,533 --> 00:10:53,069
I just used to cry and think,
"Why are they hitting me?"
176
00:10:53,269 --> 00:10:55,305
I wouldn't retaliate.
177
00:10:55,505 --> 00:10:57,541
And I beat this kid up.
178
00:11:02,879 --> 00:11:04,715
I was gonna kill him.
179
00:11:06,082 --> 00:11:08,152
It's the Baker temper.
180
00:11:08,352 --> 00:11:11,255
I've learnt to control it,
but he hasn't.
181
00:11:13,257 --> 00:11:17,828
I was drumming all the time,
as long as I can remember.
182
00:11:18,028 --> 00:11:21,432
I was always banging
on the desks in school,
183
00:11:21,632 --> 00:11:25,702
And they were all just boogieing
and dancing and going crazy.
184
00:11:25,902 --> 00:11:28,605
There was a party,
and they had a band there.
185
00:11:28,805 --> 00:11:31,508
And all the kids from school
kept saying, "Go on."
186
00:11:31,708 --> 00:11:34,411
Go and play the drums.
Go and play the drums."
187
00:11:34,611 --> 00:11:37,714
And I just sat down,
and I could play.
188
00:11:37,914 --> 00:11:41,618
That's when a light went off...
I went "Fuck, I'm a drummer."
189
00:11:47,924 --> 00:11:50,061
It's a gift from God, Jay.
190
00:11:50,261 --> 00:11:52,729
You've either got it
or you haven't.
191
00:11:52,929 --> 00:11:54,598
I had it.
192
00:11:57,801 --> 00:11:59,453
Had what?
193
00:11:59,653 --> 00:12:01,305
Time.
194
00:12:02,205 --> 00:12:04,074
Natural time.
195
00:12:12,349 --> 00:12:17,888
His drumbeat is so personal
that I always know if it's him.
196
00:12:18,088 --> 00:12:20,491
I started doing quite well,
I guess.
197
00:12:20,691 --> 00:12:25,629
I'd got a sort of reputation
as a jazz drummer.
198
00:12:25,829 --> 00:12:27,198
My boyfriend at the time said,
199
00:12:27,398 --> 00:12:29,500
"Oh, you want to hear
this drummer.
200
00:12:29,700 --> 00:12:31,568
He's really great."
201
00:12:31,768 --> 00:12:35,238
She really could dance.
She had really good time.
202
00:12:36,206 --> 00:12:39,176
And a good body, obviously.
203
00:12:39,376 --> 00:12:41,845
He's always been insecure
deep down.
204
00:12:42,045 --> 00:12:47,451
And I think Ginger did search
for a father figure,
205
00:12:47,651 --> 00:12:50,020
But they were always a drummer.
206
00:12:50,220 --> 00:12:55,058
One night, I was playing
the all-nighter in the Flamingo,
207
00:12:55,258 --> 00:12:59,630
And I'd got offstage
to be confronted by God.
208
00:13:08,805 --> 00:13:12,392
Phil was just
the most amazing drummer.
209
00:13:12,592 --> 00:13:16,179
He was the only drummer
at that time
210
00:13:16,379 --> 00:13:18,615
That brought tears to my eyes.
211
00:13:18,815 --> 00:13:23,520
He said, "You're the first
fucking drummer I've heard here."
212
00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:24,621
Come with me."
213
00:13:24,821 --> 00:13:28,692
So we go down
into his basement flat,
214
00:13:28,892 --> 00:13:32,963
And that is when I got
introduced to heroin
215
00:13:33,163 --> 00:13:35,432
And the African drummers.
216
00:13:35,632 --> 00:13:37,634
He tied this thing
around his arm
217
00:13:37,834 --> 00:13:40,437
And told me,
"When I tell you, undo it."
218
00:13:40,637 --> 00:13:45,208
And his arms were fucking
just a mass of scars
219
00:13:45,408 --> 00:13:47,110
And tracks and stuff.
220
00:13:47,310 --> 00:13:49,713
And he managed to hit a vein,
221
00:13:49,913 --> 00:13:53,116
And I pulled the thing off,
and he shot up.
222
00:13:54,084 --> 00:13:57,988
Then he gets out
all these African records
223
00:13:58,188 --> 00:13:59,190
And Watusi drummers.
224
00:13:59,390 --> 00:14:01,258
African records...
225
00:14:01,458 --> 00:14:03,059
Watusi... African records...
226
00:14:03,259 --> 00:14:07,263
Gets out all these
African records and Watusi...
227
00:14:20,544 --> 00:14:23,347
Phil said, "Where's the beat?"
228
00:14:23,547 --> 00:14:25,916
And I'm doing like a three beat
on it.
229
00:14:26,116 --> 00:14:28,285
And he said,
"No, no, no. Listen."
230
00:14:28,485 --> 00:14:31,988
And he played this four,
the real beat,
231
00:14:32,188 --> 00:14:35,892
And it was like a fucking light
going on it.
232
00:14:36,092 --> 00:14:42,332
Wow! The basic African rhythms
were so fucking cool.
233
00:14:54,411 --> 00:14:57,914
Then Phil's giving me
a great lecture
234
00:14:58,114 --> 00:15:01,351
About how I must never
touch heroin ever,
235
00:15:01,551 --> 00:15:04,788
And I walked back five miles
or something
236
00:15:04,988 --> 00:15:06,757
In the early-morning sunshine
237
00:15:06,957 --> 00:15:10,427
With Africa going through
my head.
238
00:15:10,894 --> 00:15:13,597
I think with Ginger
and the heroin,
239
00:15:13,797 --> 00:15:17,434
It was more he thought
it would improve his playing.
240
00:15:17,634 --> 00:15:20,203
You're fearless
if you use smack.
241
00:15:20,403 --> 00:15:21,705
You don't have any feelings.
242
00:15:21,905 --> 00:15:24,974
You're not scared of anybody
or anything.
243
00:15:25,174 --> 00:15:28,244
Whatever you wanted to play,
you played.
244
00:15:28,444 --> 00:15:30,080
It was just wonderful.
245
00:15:31,114 --> 00:15:32,983
He didn't want to be
a family man
246
00:15:33,183 --> 00:15:35,719
Or anything like that,
really and truly.
247
00:15:35,919 --> 00:15:38,088
Liz discovered
she was pregnant,
248
00:15:38,288 --> 00:15:40,257
And we were only 20 years old.
249
00:15:40,457 --> 00:15:45,596
So she tried to get rid of it,
and it didn't work, thank God.
250
00:15:45,796 --> 00:15:47,298
They didn't want to have
a child,
251
00:15:47,498 --> 00:15:49,199
And my mom took something,
some tablets.
252
00:15:49,399 --> 00:15:53,837
He got some tablets off another
drummer to get rid of me.
253
00:15:54,037 --> 00:15:55,406
I don't care.
254
00:15:55,606 --> 00:15:58,108
They would have been doing me
a bloody favor.
255
00:15:58,308 --> 00:16:00,343
No, I don't mind,
but it didn't work.
256
00:16:01,545 --> 00:16:03,113
No screaming or anything.
257
00:16:03,313 --> 00:16:04,014
The baby come out.
258
00:16:04,214 --> 00:16:05,649
And I'm carefully looking
259
00:16:05,849 --> 00:16:08,619
To make sure it's got all
its toes and fingers and stuff,
260
00:16:08,819 --> 00:16:11,688
You know,
thinking about the time
261
00:16:11,888 --> 00:16:14,758
We tried to abort it and stuff.
262
00:16:14,958 --> 00:16:16,860
There was this little kid.
263
00:16:17,060 --> 00:16:21,080
And that's when I decided
to get straight,
264
00:16:21,280 --> 00:16:25,301
And it took me
another fucking 19 years or so.
265
00:16:25,501 --> 00:16:26,703
So, what's the difference
266
00:16:26,903 --> 00:16:29,806
Between your state
of chemical dependencies now
267
00:16:30,006 --> 00:16:31,975
Than it was
when you were a junkie?
268
00:16:32,175 --> 00:16:34,210
I've no idea.
269
00:16:34,410 --> 00:16:36,647
I take it every day.
270
00:16:36,847 --> 00:16:40,617
It's called degenerative
osteoarthritis.
271
00:16:40,817 --> 00:16:43,053
Is that why you haven't been
playing the drums?
272
00:16:43,253 --> 00:16:44,855
What?!
273
00:16:46,056 --> 00:16:47,590
Don't you fuck...
274
00:16:47,790 --> 00:16:49,125
How I restrain myself
275
00:16:49,325 --> 00:16:53,997
From throwing everything
at you, Jay, I don't know.
276
00:16:54,197 --> 00:16:57,668
There's nothing you can do
about it, is there?
277
00:17:00,971 --> 00:17:03,440
You're not gonna give up?
278
00:17:03,640 --> 00:17:07,878
Sometimes I feel like doing
just that.
279
00:17:18,689 --> 00:17:20,957
When you first met Jack Bruce,
280
00:17:21,157 --> 00:17:25,428
Was it as if you knew you had
met your musical counterpart?
281
00:17:25,628 --> 00:17:27,998
Early on, for sure, yeah.
282
00:17:28,198 --> 00:17:31,902
I mean, he's a fucking
brilliant player.
283
00:17:32,102 --> 00:17:33,904
There's no doubt about that.
284
00:17:34,104 --> 00:17:37,273
Ginger looked like
a complete and utter madman.
285
00:17:37,473 --> 00:17:39,510
He was the loudest drummer
I'd ever heard.
286
00:17:39,710 --> 00:17:44,014
And I wanted to play with him,
so I asked if I could sit in.
287
00:17:44,214 --> 00:17:48,518
Kept bugging us to sit in,
and he wouldn't fucking go away.
288
00:17:48,718 --> 00:17:50,153
So, of course,
they did the thing
289
00:17:50,353 --> 00:17:53,440
That jazz musicians always do,
which is to try and cut you.
290
00:17:53,640 --> 00:17:56,727
I think the first thing
they played was very, very fast.
291
00:17:56,927 --> 00:17:58,461
And he played it.
292
00:18:00,463 --> 00:18:02,733
Which is quite extraordinary.
293
00:18:02,933 --> 00:18:03,867
Jack got the gig
294
00:18:04,067 --> 00:18:07,070
With Alexis Korner's
Blues Incorporated,
295
00:18:07,270 --> 00:18:11,574
And none of them were
terribly happy with the drummer,
296
00:18:11,774 --> 00:18:13,076
Who was Charlie Watts.
297
00:18:13,276 --> 00:18:16,012
I actually don't know how long
Ginger was with the band.
298
00:18:16,212 --> 00:18:20,717
I know he took over for me,
on my recommendation.
299
00:18:20,917 --> 00:18:24,420
Charlie left the band
so that I could join.
300
00:18:27,157 --> 00:18:30,193
Can you tell me the story
of Mick Jagger?
301
00:18:31,895 --> 00:18:36,066
"Can you tell me what it was
like meeting Mick Jagger?"
302
00:18:37,567 --> 00:18:42,138
This effeminate-looking kid
got up and sung one number.
303
00:18:42,338 --> 00:18:46,910
And I'm going, "Jack, who is
this stupid little cunt?"
304
00:18:47,110 --> 00:18:48,244
What's he doing here?"
305
00:18:48,444 --> 00:18:52,548
Jack and I used to put
some jazz things in,
306
00:18:52,748 --> 00:18:55,151
Completely throw him off.
307
00:18:55,351 --> 00:18:57,937
I mean, I was a heavy junkie
at the time,
308
00:18:58,137 --> 00:19:00,724
So I just terrified
the shit out of him.
309
00:19:02,859 --> 00:19:06,930
And then Alexis decided
to get Graham in the band.
310
00:19:07,130 --> 00:19:09,232
My first reaction to that was,
"Fucking no.
311
00:19:09,432 --> 00:19:12,736
Alexis, watch it, 'cause he'll
steal half the band,"
312
00:19:12,936 --> 00:19:14,037
Which is exactly what he did.
313
00:19:14,237 --> 00:19:17,207
Can you contextualize who we're
speaking about right now?
314
00:19:17,407 --> 00:19:19,943
Well, I've just said it,
for fuck's sake.
315
00:19:20,143 --> 00:19:21,995
You just said "Graham."
That's it.
316
00:19:22,195 --> 00:19:24,047
People who don't know
who Graham is.
317
00:19:26,149 --> 00:19:28,051
Graham Bond was a fat guy.
318
00:19:29,753 --> 00:19:33,489
* Well, I was standing on
the corner, waiting to go home *
319
00:19:33,689 --> 00:19:37,176
* When I heard this sound
that made me want to go *
320
00:19:37,376 --> 00:19:40,864
* Well, it was coming from
a doss across the street *
321
00:19:41,064 --> 00:19:43,599
* It was kind of stompy,
with an R&B beat *
322
00:19:43,799 --> 00:19:44,884
* It went... *
323
00:19:45,084 --> 00:19:45,969
Harmonica!
Oh!
324
00:19:46,169 --> 00:19:49,405
Graham Bond Organization
was to musicians
325
00:19:49,605 --> 00:19:51,674
What The Beatles were
to the public.
326
00:19:51,874 --> 00:19:53,209
Brilliant.
327
00:19:53,409 --> 00:19:56,012
Jack Bruce, Ginger Baker,
Dick Heckstall-Smith,
328
00:19:56,212 --> 00:19:57,914
And Graham Bond were at the top.
329
00:19:58,114 --> 00:20:01,752
We were a band trying to be
like a band in Chicago.
330
00:20:01,952 --> 00:20:03,686
But they were something else,
you know?
331
00:20:03,886 --> 00:20:05,756
* Playin' with an R&B band *
332
00:20:05,956 --> 00:20:06,823
* Oh, yeah! *
333
00:20:07,023 --> 00:20:08,959
His reputation was as being,
you know,
334
00:20:09,159 --> 00:20:12,012
Probably the best drummer around
in those days.
335
00:20:12,212 --> 00:20:15,065
It was really Ginger's
first taste of fame, yes.
336
00:20:15,265 --> 00:20:17,600
It's the same with you, Ginger.
337
00:20:17,800 --> 00:20:18,902
This is beat.
338
00:20:20,170 --> 00:20:23,473
Don't worry about
splitting your skins.
339
00:20:23,673 --> 00:20:26,409
They can be replaced.
340
00:20:26,609 --> 00:20:28,144
And so can you.
341
00:20:28,344 --> 00:20:32,248
They did sort of contain the
seeds of their own destruction,
342
00:20:32,448 --> 00:20:35,034
What with Graham
and Ginger's bad habits
343
00:20:35,234 --> 00:20:37,821
And the conflict
between Jack and Ginger.
344
00:20:38,021 --> 00:20:39,089
For two musicians
345
00:20:39,289 --> 00:20:41,858
Who were incredibly
complementary to each other
346
00:20:42,058 --> 00:20:44,427
And who have played
consistently over the years,
347
00:20:44,627 --> 00:20:50,333
It's really remarkable
how well they didn't get along.
348
00:20:50,533 --> 00:20:53,436
It was a very sad
situation, really.
349
00:20:53,636 --> 00:20:57,808
In the early days,
when he was following me more,
350
00:20:58,008 --> 00:21:00,110
The music was
really fucking great.
351
00:21:00,310 --> 00:21:04,180
When I switched from
upright bass to bass guitar,
352
00:21:04,380 --> 00:21:06,249
That wasn't what Ginger wanted.
353
00:21:06,449 --> 00:21:09,485
I think that was when
the problems started.
354
00:21:09,685 --> 00:21:13,790
Jack's like a guy who gets up
before the sun comes
355
00:21:13,990 --> 00:21:15,859
To see the sun rise.
356
00:21:16,059 --> 00:21:19,396
He sees the sun come
halfway over the horizon
357
00:21:19,596 --> 00:21:22,933
And runs home and says,
"I've seen the sun rise."
358
00:21:23,133 --> 00:21:28,471
That was how Jack
got the time things
359
00:21:28,671 --> 00:21:30,440
That I was showing him.
360
00:21:30,640 --> 00:21:33,143
He didn't get the full picture.
361
00:21:33,343 --> 00:21:37,147
I have perfect time, which is
a quite useful thing to have.
362
00:21:37,347 --> 00:21:39,482
Very few people have that.
363
00:21:39,682 --> 00:21:40,717
It's just a gift.
364
00:21:40,917 --> 00:21:44,520
The last number
was always the drum solo.
365
00:21:44,720 --> 00:21:47,306
And I've kicked into
the drum solo,
366
00:21:47,506 --> 00:21:49,893
And Jack's, like,
playing with me.
367
00:21:50,093 --> 00:21:53,696
I wouldn't be playing
during his drum solo.
368
00:21:53,896 --> 00:21:57,300
And I off-loaded
a right-hander on him.
369
00:21:57,500 --> 00:22:01,104
He went down on the ground,
and I'm kicking him.
370
00:22:01,304 --> 00:22:03,756
You know,
"Get up, you little cunt!"
371
00:22:03,956 --> 00:22:06,409
I was kicking the shit
out of him.
372
00:22:08,278 --> 00:22:13,216
I just let go, and I was gonna
kick him to death.
373
00:22:13,416 --> 00:22:16,819
And then he pulled a knife
on me and said, "You're fired."
374
00:22:17,019 --> 00:22:18,754
And I said,
"But you can't fire me.
375
00:22:18,954 --> 00:22:20,690
"It's The Graham Bond
Organization,
376
00:22:20,890 --> 00:22:22,192
And I'm the founding member."
377
00:22:22,392 --> 00:22:23,293
But poor old Graham...
378
00:22:23,493 --> 00:22:25,862
He was well gone
into smack by that time,
379
00:22:26,062 --> 00:22:27,330
So he didn't really care.
380
00:22:27,530 --> 00:22:31,667
Graham was probably a bigger
disaster area than Ginger was.
381
00:22:31,867 --> 00:22:34,871
We would be using a mixture
of cocaine, heroin,
382
00:22:35,071 --> 00:22:37,440
And lysergic acid in a fix.
383
00:22:38,608 --> 00:22:42,595
I was very hurt
by not the knife thing,
384
00:22:42,795 --> 00:22:46,582
But the fact that I was out
of that band.
385
00:22:46,782 --> 00:22:51,321
And it was very stupid of him,
because the band was doing well,
386
00:22:51,521 --> 00:22:54,624
And I was quite an important
part of the band.
387
00:22:54,824 --> 00:22:58,077
The band continued
being very successful
388
00:22:58,277 --> 00:23:01,331
And just reached a point
where I thought,
389
00:23:01,531 --> 00:23:06,136
"I've been running the band
successfully for three years.
390
00:23:06,336 --> 00:23:10,173
Why don't I run my own band
instead?"
391
00:23:21,985 --> 00:23:26,756
The first person I thought of
was Eric.
392
00:23:34,597 --> 00:23:38,034
He saw something in me
that I never saw before.
393
00:23:38,234 --> 00:23:39,836
He would say it was about time.
394
00:23:40,036 --> 00:23:43,473
He had time
that very few people have.
395
00:23:43,673 --> 00:23:44,474
Eric had it.
396
00:23:44,674 --> 00:23:48,278
Ginger was pretty dismissive
and antisocial...
397
00:23:48,478 --> 00:23:50,146
Seriously antisocial.
398
00:23:50,346 --> 00:23:51,815
But he had the gift.
399
00:23:52,015 --> 00:23:55,285
He had the spark, the flair,
the panache.
400
00:23:55,485 --> 00:23:56,787
He had it in spades.
401
00:23:56,987 --> 00:23:58,889
And Jack had the same thing.
402
00:23:59,089 --> 00:24:02,358
He said, "What about Jack
as the bass player?"
403
00:24:02,558 --> 00:24:05,828
And all the red lights
in the world went off,
404
00:24:06,028 --> 00:24:07,663
And I thought, "Oh, God."
405
00:24:07,863 --> 00:24:11,534
I was very surprised
when he came knocking again.
406
00:24:11,734 --> 00:24:13,569
I didn't see that coming.
No.
407
00:24:13,769 --> 00:24:15,105
I didn't expect that, no.
408
00:24:17,340 --> 00:24:23,013
* Feel when I dance with you *
409
00:24:23,213 --> 00:24:27,117
* We move like the sea *
410
00:24:28,284 --> 00:24:32,955
* I feel free *
411
00:24:33,423 --> 00:24:36,192
* I can walk down the street,
there's no one there *
412
00:24:36,392 --> 00:24:38,461
* Though the pavements
are one huge crowd *
413
00:24:38,661 --> 00:24:41,364
* I can drive down the road,
my eyes don't see *
414
00:24:41,564 --> 00:24:44,267
* Though my mind
wants to cry out loud *
415
00:24:45,801 --> 00:24:48,287
When an atomic bomb
went off like that,
416
00:24:48,487 --> 00:24:50,973
Like I think Cream
really represented,
417
00:24:51,173 --> 00:24:53,076
It overwhelmed everything.
418
00:25:01,551 --> 00:25:05,021
When Hendrix came to England,
he wanted to jam with Cream,
419
00:25:05,221 --> 00:25:08,691
Because there was nobody else
that he admired as much.
420
00:25:08,891 --> 00:25:11,961
They were the beginning
of many, many things.
421
00:25:12,161 --> 00:25:13,263
Cream absolutely
might be called
422
00:25:13,463 --> 00:25:14,730
The first progressive band.
423
00:25:14,930 --> 00:25:15,899
The first supergroup.
424
00:25:16,099 --> 00:25:18,334
The first band that played
in big arenas.
425
00:25:18,534 --> 00:25:19,602
The first jam band.
426
00:25:19,802 --> 00:25:23,339
They were breaking out
of the chains of pop.
427
00:25:30,046 --> 00:25:31,447
We were fucking good.
428
00:25:31,647 --> 00:25:34,484
That's how we called ourselves
Cream.
429
00:25:34,684 --> 00:25:38,454
We knew we were the three
best musicians around.
430
00:25:38,654 --> 00:25:40,390
If Cream did not invent
heavy metal,
431
00:25:40,590 --> 00:25:43,459
They certainly were part
of a band of brothers
432
00:25:43,659 --> 00:25:47,596
That were very instrumental
in facilitating it.
433
00:25:47,796 --> 00:25:51,734
The birth of heavy metal
should have been aborted.
434
00:25:52,335 --> 00:25:54,637
He was really at the forefront
435
00:25:54,837 --> 00:25:57,140
Of a complete revolution
of rock.
436
00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:06,415
It's hard to find fault
with the notion
437
00:26:06,615 --> 00:26:08,351
That he was the pioneer
of a rock drummer.
438
00:26:08,551 --> 00:26:11,821
There was no context for him.
There was no archetype.
439
00:26:12,021 --> 00:26:13,023
He is the archetype.
440
00:26:13,223 --> 00:26:14,891
Before Ginger, rhythm was
441
00:26:15,091 --> 00:26:16,892
"Ting, ting, ting-ting,
ting, ting-ting."
442
00:26:17,092 --> 00:26:18,228
And Ginger comes along...
443
00:26:18,428 --> 00:26:21,364
"Dug-a-dug-dug, dug-a-dug-dug,
Dug-dug-dug-a-dug..."
444
00:26:21,564 --> 00:26:25,301
* I'll be with you,
darling, soon *
445
00:26:25,501 --> 00:26:30,373
* I'll be with you
when the stars start falling *
446
00:26:30,573 --> 00:26:34,577
* I've been waiting so long *
447
00:26:35,311 --> 00:26:39,315
* To be where I'm going *
448
00:26:39,515 --> 00:26:46,689
* In the sunshine of your love *
449
00:26:49,592 --> 00:26:51,394
When he was listening to music
as a kid,
450
00:26:51,594 --> 00:26:53,396
He wasn't listening
to the Jimi Hendrix
451
00:26:53,596 --> 00:26:55,565
And guitar-hero bands and so on.
452
00:26:55,765 --> 00:26:57,116
He invented all that stuff.
453
00:26:57,316 --> 00:26:58,468
Jack brought it in as going
454
00:26:58,668 --> 00:27:01,337
"Diddle-a-di-di,
di-di-da-dee-dee, diddle..."
455
00:27:01,537 --> 00:27:02,572
Dingbat, ditty bat.
456
00:27:02,772 --> 00:27:05,491
That's where Jack's head is
writing.
457
00:27:05,691 --> 00:27:08,211
And I said,
"Man, that's terrible.
458
00:27:08,411 --> 00:27:11,747
Why don't you slow it down
and play it backwards?"
459
00:27:11,947 --> 00:27:14,917
Ba-da-da-ba, ba-ba...
460
00:27:15,785 --> 00:27:21,624
Another one is "White Room,"
the 5/4 bolero that makes it.
461
00:27:21,824 --> 00:27:25,828
Da, bum-bum-bum-bum,
bum-bum-bum, da...
462
00:27:26,028 --> 00:27:27,696
Wasn't written like that.
463
00:27:27,896 --> 00:27:29,365
Jack wrote it in 4/4.
464
00:27:29,565 --> 00:27:32,702
He now declares
"I wrote it in 5/4."
465
00:27:32,902 --> 00:27:33,436
I mean, hello?
466
00:27:33,636 --> 00:27:35,621
* In the white room *
467
00:27:35,821 --> 00:27:37,807
* With black curtains *
468
00:27:38,007 --> 00:27:40,910
* In the station *
469
00:27:41,677 --> 00:27:46,782
Today and for the last...
How long is it now?.. 40 years,
470
00:27:46,982 --> 00:27:51,521
Pete Brown and Jack Bruce
have been earning
471
00:27:51,721 --> 00:27:54,757
A hell of a lot more money
from Cream
472
00:27:54,957 --> 00:27:58,294
Than Eric and I will ever earn,
to this day.
473
00:27:58,494 --> 00:28:01,330
The guy who gets the credit
for writing the song
474
00:28:01,530 --> 00:28:03,899
Is the guy who writes the lyric
gets half of it,
475
00:28:04,099 --> 00:28:06,469
And the guy who writes
the melody of the lyric
476
00:28:06,669 --> 00:28:07,570
Gets the other half.
477
00:28:07,770 --> 00:28:10,172
The drums are part
of the arrangement,
478
00:28:10,372 --> 00:28:12,775
And the arrangement
doesn't get royalties.
479
00:28:12,975 --> 00:28:13,576
Zip. Nada.
480
00:28:13,776 --> 00:28:15,645
Cream was my thing.
481
00:28:15,845 --> 00:28:18,881
And it did exactly
what I planned it to do.
482
00:28:19,081 --> 00:28:22,117
Only I'm the guy
who lost out on it.
483
00:28:22,317 --> 00:28:24,287
I'm fucking broke right now.
484
00:28:24,487 --> 00:28:28,258
* Run from themselves *
485
00:28:38,634 --> 00:28:41,003
To Jack Bruce's counterpoint,
he gives rhythm,
486
00:28:41,203 --> 00:28:44,006
And to Eric Clapton's technical
virtuosity, he gives shape.
487
00:28:44,206 --> 00:28:47,009
On their first tour together,
he practiced so intensively
488
00:28:47,209 --> 00:28:49,479
That he left behind him
a trail of hotel bills
489
00:28:49,679 --> 00:28:50,646
For broken furniture.
490
00:28:50,846 --> 00:28:53,015
We asked him
if he still practiced as much.
491
00:28:53,215 --> 00:28:56,218
No.
I don't practice at all.
492
00:28:56,418 --> 00:28:57,520
Not at all?
493
00:28:57,720 --> 00:28:59,555
I used to, but I don't anymore.
494
00:28:59,755 --> 00:29:01,724
I just used to play solos.
495
00:29:01,924 --> 00:29:06,429
Just used to sit on the drum kit
and play it all day.
496
00:29:06,629 --> 00:29:07,430
Can you show us some?
497
00:29:07,630 --> 00:29:10,216
- You want me to play?
- Please.
498
00:29:10,416 --> 00:29:13,002
At this time of the day.
499
00:29:26,549 --> 00:29:31,487
Independence... the ability
to play a different thing
500
00:29:31,687 --> 00:29:33,423
With all four limbs,
501
00:29:33,623 --> 00:29:36,892
Which is how I play things
that sound incredibly fast
502
00:29:37,092 --> 00:29:39,962
When I'm not actually moving
anything very fast.
503
00:29:40,162 --> 00:29:43,299
Because all four beats are
landing in a different place,
504
00:29:43,499 --> 00:29:46,201
So what comes out
is four times as fast.
505
00:29:47,603 --> 00:29:51,240
But it's not how fast you play.
506
00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:53,376
It's what you say.
507
00:30:00,950 --> 00:30:03,386
Ginger Baker's
most notable achievement
508
00:30:03,586 --> 00:30:06,389
That should be recognized
is the first rock drum solo.
509
00:30:06,589 --> 00:30:08,158
And me as a 15-year-old kid
at the time
510
00:30:08,358 --> 00:30:11,193
Was like, "Yeah, yeah, that's
the rock drummer I want to be."
511
00:30:11,393 --> 00:30:12,195
I must have been 16.
512
00:30:12,395 --> 00:30:13,796
I was exactly the sweet spot
513
00:30:13,996 --> 00:30:17,333
Where my brain clicked on
and said, "What's it all about?"
514
00:30:17,533 --> 00:30:18,368
It was Ginger's drums.
515
00:30:18,568 --> 00:30:20,403
I'm here today
because of Ginger,
516
00:30:20,603 --> 00:30:23,322
Because he was
the absolute inspiration
517
00:30:23,522 --> 00:30:26,041
For me being in a band,
playing the drums.
518
00:30:26,241 --> 00:30:30,012
I absolutely thought, "You know,
that's what I'd like to be."
519
00:30:39,288 --> 00:30:40,523
It became Ginger's thing.
520
00:30:40,723 --> 00:30:42,858
He'd do these very long
drum solos.
521
00:30:43,058 --> 00:30:45,361
You either liked them
or you didn't like them.
522
00:30:45,561 --> 00:30:49,198
I liked them because I could go
off and have a smoke, you know?
523
00:30:49,398 --> 00:30:51,133
Cream... How popular were they?
524
00:30:51,333 --> 00:30:52,534
Oh, huge, huge.
525
00:30:52,734 --> 00:30:53,736
How huge is "huge"?
526
00:30:53,936 --> 00:30:56,722
Well, they did three nights
in Madison Square Garden.
527
00:30:56,922 --> 00:30:59,709
They could have done two weeks
and sold out every night.
528
00:30:59,909 --> 00:31:01,844
When a promoter hired
The Cream,
529
00:31:02,044 --> 00:31:05,481
Ginger wanted a case of beer
and two black hookers
530
00:31:05,681 --> 00:31:08,117
And a white limo
or he wouldn't play.
531
00:31:08,317 --> 00:31:09,151
I've been in hotel rooms,
532
00:31:09,351 --> 00:31:11,020
And there's been a knock on
the door.
533
00:31:11,220 --> 00:31:12,154
I've opened the door,
534
00:31:12,354 --> 00:31:14,890
And there's been three groupies
all standing there.
535
00:31:15,090 --> 00:31:17,026
Just queues of chicks waiting.
536
00:31:17,226 --> 00:31:20,062
One would knock on the door
and climb into bed.
537
00:31:20,262 --> 00:31:22,164
We used to call them
"star fuckers."
538
00:31:22,364 --> 00:31:24,066
You know, they'd come
and say like,
539
00:31:24,266 --> 00:31:26,969
"I'd like to give you a blowjob
and see you come."
540
00:31:27,169 --> 00:31:31,006
They all wanted to fuck Cream,
you know?
541
00:31:31,206 --> 00:31:34,410
It was quite a rapid rise
to fame.
542
00:31:34,610 --> 00:31:38,147
I don't know whether it was
too fast for Ginger.
543
00:31:38,347 --> 00:31:39,382
I didn't really care.
544
00:31:39,582 --> 00:31:43,352
We'd lived in a succession
of not very nice places.
545
00:31:43,552 --> 00:31:44,487
And then for once, we thought,
546
00:31:44,687 --> 00:31:47,990
"Oh, we can actually buy
a house of our own."
547
00:31:48,190 --> 00:31:51,494
The family at home
was something totally separate
548
00:31:51,694 --> 00:31:53,629
From being on tour.
549
00:31:53,829 --> 00:31:57,482
His dad died when he was 4
or something like that.
550
00:31:57,682 --> 00:32:01,136
So he didn't really have
someone, a role-model father.
551
00:32:01,336 --> 00:32:06,776
He communicates more through his
drums than through his words.
552
00:32:06,976 --> 00:32:10,513
I told my wife
long before we were married,
553
00:32:10,713 --> 00:32:14,917
"If you get me to choose
between the drums and you,
554
00:32:15,117 --> 00:32:17,019
I'm gonna choose the drums."
555
00:32:18,554 --> 00:32:20,490
We had no other interest.
556
00:32:20,690 --> 00:32:22,792
There was nothing else going on.
557
00:32:22,992 --> 00:32:24,260
There was no family.
558
00:32:24,460 --> 00:32:27,062
There was no desires
for success.
559
00:32:27,262 --> 00:32:29,865
There was no commerciality
involved.
560
00:32:30,065 --> 00:32:31,301
There was no responsibility
561
00:32:31,501 --> 00:32:35,671
Other than to that unique moment
in time when we were together.
562
00:32:35,871 --> 00:32:37,940
And for a short,
sweet period of time,
563
00:32:38,140 --> 00:32:42,211
It was unfettered and extreme
and beautiful.
564
00:32:42,411 --> 00:32:43,279
They were like Vikings.
565
00:32:43,479 --> 00:32:45,664
You know, they just came
on our shore
566
00:32:45,864 --> 00:32:47,850
And just took the women
and the children,
567
00:32:48,050 --> 00:32:50,853
It was scorched earth.
There was no question about it.
568
00:32:51,053 --> 00:32:52,688
They were here to take heads.
569
00:32:52,888 --> 00:32:56,992
We went there to show the Yanks
how to play.
570
00:32:57,192 --> 00:32:59,128
I saw them when they first came
to San Francisco.
571
00:32:59,328 --> 00:33:03,098
They looked and sounded
like giants.
572
00:33:03,298 --> 00:33:07,736
They took off and started
playing supersonic music.
573
00:33:07,936 --> 00:33:11,590
And supersonic music is when
the Holy Ghost takes over
574
00:33:11,790 --> 00:33:15,444
And you're playing something
that, when you hear it back,
575
00:33:15,644 --> 00:33:17,446
You have no idea
what the hell you did.
576
00:33:56,018 --> 00:34:00,189
There was something about that
little chemistry that we had,
577
00:34:00,389 --> 00:34:01,657
Ginger and me and Eric.
578
00:34:01,857 --> 00:34:04,159
It'll never be repeated
by anybody else.
579
00:34:04,359 --> 00:34:08,163
Cream... They were together
shorter than our last tour.
580
00:34:08,363 --> 00:34:11,801
You know, we've been on the road
for two years and two months.
581
00:34:12,001 --> 00:34:14,704
That's two months longer
than their entire life-span.
582
00:34:14,904 --> 00:34:16,639
Sam Kinison would say,
"I've had parties
583
00:34:16,839 --> 00:34:18,373
That lasted
more than two years."
584
00:34:18,573 --> 00:34:23,178
* We... *
585
00:34:24,914 --> 00:34:30,019
Cream only lasted as long as it
did because it was so popular.
586
00:34:30,219 --> 00:34:34,724
I just couldn't handle
working with Jack anymore.
587
00:34:34,924 --> 00:34:36,358
Whatever energy was happening
588
00:34:36,558 --> 00:34:39,662
Between Jack Bruce
and Ginger Baker
589
00:34:39,862 --> 00:34:42,297
Also mounted Eric
590
00:34:42,497 --> 00:34:45,517
To play beyond what he was
playing with John Mayall
591
00:34:45,717 --> 00:34:48,738
Or later on, all the other bands
that he played.
592
00:34:48,938 --> 00:34:51,073
They focused on one another
all the time
593
00:34:51,273 --> 00:34:53,408
For their aggression
and their frustrations,
594
00:34:53,608 --> 00:34:54,610
And it wore me out.
595
00:34:54,810 --> 00:34:57,546
I remember Eric breaking down
in tears once.
596
00:34:57,746 --> 00:35:01,083
That was not very good.
597
00:35:01,283 --> 00:35:02,017
Sorry, Eric.
598
00:35:02,217 --> 00:35:03,953
From time to time,
I would break down
599
00:35:04,153 --> 00:35:06,188
And just go,
"I can't stand this anymore."
600
00:35:06,388 --> 00:35:08,407
'Cause I was really
on the sidelines,
601
00:35:08,607 --> 00:35:10,817
And I knew I couldn't
affect anything,
602
00:35:11,017 --> 00:35:13,028
Because I didn't have
the understanding
603
00:35:13,228 --> 00:35:16,298
Or the power to be able to do
anything about it.
604
00:35:16,498 --> 00:35:17,900
You'd just run, really.
605
00:35:18,100 --> 00:35:20,970
And, you know, when Cream,
I thought, had run its course,
606
00:35:21,170 --> 00:35:24,807
I was quite keen to get out of
there and have a break, really.
607
00:35:28,911 --> 00:35:30,980
A banger...
You know, a firework,
608
00:35:31,180 --> 00:35:33,115
Whatever you call them...
Cracker or whatever...
609
00:35:33,315 --> 00:35:34,950
They only last a second,
don't they,
610
00:35:35,150 --> 00:35:37,286
And they fizzle up
and burn up and that's it.
611
00:35:37,486 --> 00:35:40,506
It's all dead and gone.
And the band was like that.
612
00:35:40,706 --> 00:35:43,726
They were never, ever going to
be a long-lasting band.
613
00:35:43,926 --> 00:35:49,631
* We're going wrong *
614
00:36:02,712 --> 00:36:05,014
Hello, Bonnie.
615
00:36:13,155 --> 00:36:20,229
Mimosa, don't be scared
of the camera.
616
00:36:22,364 --> 00:36:26,902
You're a soldier boy,
aren't you?
617
00:36:27,102 --> 00:36:30,372
Big old, tough soldier boy.
618
00:36:35,510 --> 00:36:39,148
Eric and I decided
that we wanted to get together
619
00:36:39,348 --> 00:36:41,550
With this project
with Blind Faith.
620
00:36:42,151 --> 00:36:45,988
And...
621
00:36:46,856 --> 00:36:48,858
Ginger showed up.
622
00:36:50,860 --> 00:36:54,196
I just hit it off musically
with Stevie
623
00:36:54,396 --> 00:36:57,733
In the same way
as I had hit off with Eric.
624
00:36:57,933 --> 00:37:00,202
Stevie had time.
625
00:37:00,402 --> 00:37:04,539
I actually didn't realize
until quite a bit later
626
00:37:04,739 --> 00:37:06,642
That Eric was so horrified
627
00:37:06,842 --> 00:37:10,195
That he was hooking up
with Ginger again.
628
00:37:10,395 --> 00:37:13,749
The last person
that Eric wanted on drums
629
00:37:13,949 --> 00:37:16,018
With his new venture was Ginger.
630
00:37:16,218 --> 00:37:20,622
I believe he turned up
at a rehearsal and said, "Right."
631
00:37:20,822 --> 00:37:22,624
Where do we start?"
632
00:37:27,696 --> 00:37:30,099
* It's already written *
633
00:37:30,299 --> 00:37:35,437
* That today will be one
to remember *
634
00:37:38,874 --> 00:37:41,911
* The feeling's the same *
635
00:37:42,111 --> 00:37:47,049
* As being outside of the law *
636
00:37:51,887 --> 00:37:56,291
* Had to cry today *
637
00:38:01,630 --> 00:38:06,435
* Saw your sign,
and I missed you then *
638
00:38:07,937 --> 00:38:10,572
We were called a supergroup
from day one.
639
00:38:10,772 --> 00:38:12,007
We hit the road too early.
640
00:38:12,207 --> 00:38:14,977
And, you know,
it overpowered us.
641
00:38:16,245 --> 00:38:20,850
I think Ginger was as happy
as a pig in shit in Blind Faith.
642
00:38:21,050 --> 00:38:24,386
You know, there was no one...
There was Rick Grech...
643
00:38:24,586 --> 00:38:27,673
Great player, you know,
but no Jack Bruce.
644
00:38:27,873 --> 00:38:30,960
And Ginger could fucking do
what he wants.
645
00:38:31,160 --> 00:38:41,603
* Do what you like *
646
00:38:41,803 --> 00:38:47,309
I was driving a Shelby Cobra
up the coast to Los Angeles
647
00:38:47,509 --> 00:38:50,729
With three gorgeous chicks
in the car.
648
00:38:50,929 --> 00:38:53,949
And the radio station
stopped the music
649
00:38:54,149 --> 00:38:59,321
With the news that Ginger Baker,
Blind Faith drummer,
650
00:38:59,521 --> 00:39:02,224
Had just been found dead
in his hotel room
651
00:39:02,424 --> 00:39:04,393
From a heroin overdose.
652
00:39:06,795 --> 00:39:09,999
And I went "Fucking hell.
I must be in heaven," you know?
653
00:39:10,199 --> 00:39:12,935
I'm driving this supercar
with three super chicks.
654
00:39:16,771 --> 00:39:19,608
There was huge amounts
of drugs,
655
00:39:19,808 --> 00:39:25,180
Which at the time, I must admit,
I didn't really know about,
656
00:39:25,380 --> 00:39:27,749
Because I was probably smoking
so much weed,
657
00:39:27,949 --> 00:39:30,319
I didn't really know
what was going on anyway.
658
00:39:30,519 --> 00:39:34,289
Every time
we got to Los Angeles,
659
00:39:34,489 --> 00:39:36,191
The drugs would appear,
660
00:39:36,391 --> 00:39:41,130
So I decided to go to Hawaii
after the tour
661
00:39:41,330 --> 00:39:43,598
To try and get straight.
662
00:39:43,798 --> 00:39:46,635
So Liz come out with the kids.
663
00:39:46,835 --> 00:39:50,172
Considering all the places
we've left him before,
664
00:39:50,372 --> 00:39:52,975
I have to say it was marvelous.
665
00:39:55,344 --> 00:40:01,250
* You are the reason
I've been waiting so long *
666
00:40:01,450 --> 00:40:04,886
* Somebody holds the key *
667
00:40:05,086 --> 00:40:08,323
* Well, I'm near the end *
668
00:40:08,523 --> 00:40:13,495
* And I just ain't got
the time *
669
00:40:14,863 --> 00:40:16,732
* And I'm wasted *
670
00:40:16,932 --> 00:40:22,137
* And I can't find my way home *
671
00:40:22,337 --> 00:40:25,340
Only at that time,
there was more heroin on Hawaii
672
00:40:25,540 --> 00:40:27,810
Than there was in Los Angeles.
673
00:40:28,010 --> 00:40:31,780
It wasn't a good place to be
to get straight.
674
00:40:31,980 --> 00:40:34,566
So we decided to go to Jamaica.
675
00:40:34,766 --> 00:40:37,152
That's when I flew my car out.
676
00:40:37,352 --> 00:40:42,091
That is wild, to fly your car
over to Jamaica.
677
00:40:42,291 --> 00:40:44,193
That's crazy.
678
00:40:44,393 --> 00:40:49,098
You get to feel that the money
is inexhaustible,
679
00:40:49,298 --> 00:40:50,699
Which, of course, it isn't.
680
00:40:50,899 --> 00:40:55,170
It was like nearly three months
after the last gig
681
00:40:55,370 --> 00:40:57,372
That I came back to London.
682
00:40:57,572 --> 00:41:02,244
I'd brought back quite a lot
of dope in some masks and stuff.
683
00:41:02,444 --> 00:41:04,313
And so I went to see Stevie
684
00:41:04,513 --> 00:41:07,983
With a bag of grass
as a little present.
685
00:41:08,183 --> 00:41:11,653
And he told me that Eric
had gone off
686
00:41:11,853 --> 00:41:13,856
With Delaney and Bonnie
687
00:41:14,056 --> 00:41:16,525
And he was getting Traffic
back together.
688
00:41:16,725 --> 00:41:20,395
I take full responsibility
for having, you know,
689
00:41:20,595 --> 00:41:23,798
Strong interests
in going somewhere else.
690
00:41:23,998 --> 00:41:26,968
But they wouldn't have been
quite so strong
691
00:41:27,168 --> 00:41:29,939
If the core of the band
had been better.
692
00:41:30,139 --> 00:41:34,209
Were you hurt at all that Eric
had left without telling you?
693
00:41:34,409 --> 00:41:37,079
No.
You could see it coming.
694
00:41:37,279 --> 00:41:39,748
Something to do with me
getting so fucked up
695
00:41:39,948 --> 00:41:42,017
On the end of the tour.
696
00:41:42,217 --> 00:41:46,288
He's the best friend I've got
on this planet
697
00:41:46,488 --> 00:41:49,624
And always will be, okay?
698
00:41:49,824 --> 00:41:54,163
Whether it be polo
or the drums or drugs,
699
00:41:54,363 --> 00:41:57,399
Ginger seems to always go
full force
700
00:41:57,599 --> 00:41:59,134
Into whatever he's doing.
701
00:41:59,334 --> 00:42:02,137
Compulsion.
We're talking about compulsion.
702
00:42:02,337 --> 00:42:07,376
You know, what's the payoff
in being compulsive?
703
00:42:07,576 --> 00:42:12,214
You know, for Ginger, I'm not
gonna be his doctor in this
704
00:42:12,414 --> 00:42:15,033
Or psychologist
or make a diagnosis.
705
00:42:15,233 --> 00:42:17,852
I can't make a diagnosis
of Ginger.
706
00:42:18,052 --> 00:42:20,589
When I was driving in today,
707
00:42:20,789 --> 00:42:23,758
I thought, "Well, do I know
Ginger well?"
708
00:42:23,958 --> 00:42:25,027
Do I?"
709
00:42:25,227 --> 00:42:28,480
I've been with him
in fairly rarefied situations,
710
00:42:28,680 --> 00:42:31,708
Which allowed me to see
certain sides of him.
711
00:42:31,908 --> 00:42:34,936
I probably haven't seen him
like you've seen him,
712
00:42:35,136 --> 00:42:37,873
Because I didn't take
the effort, the time,
713
00:42:38,073 --> 00:42:41,876
The risk to step into his life
and become a part of it
714
00:42:42,076 --> 00:42:43,478
For any length of time.
715
00:42:43,678 --> 00:42:45,414
You know,
I've always pulled back
716
00:42:45,614 --> 00:42:48,683
When it started to get scary
or threatening
717
00:42:48,883 --> 00:42:51,220
Or just difficult.
718
00:42:52,587 --> 00:42:55,457
You guys want to wait a minute?
'Cause I'm about to cry.
719
00:42:55,657 --> 00:42:56,125
Why?
720
00:42:56,325 --> 00:42:58,360
'Cause, I mean...
721
00:42:58,560 --> 00:43:00,662
I might cry.
722
00:43:00,862 --> 00:43:02,331
Why? Because Ginger is...
723
00:43:02,531 --> 00:43:05,434
He's all by himself, all alone,
in the woods or something.
724
00:43:05,634 --> 00:43:07,068
Well, he's got a wife.
He's got...
725
00:43:07,268 --> 00:43:08,570
Oh!
Well, then I won't.
726
00:43:09,871 --> 00:43:13,708
You guys are trying to live
a pretty quiet life here.
727
00:43:13,908 --> 00:43:16,678
As quiet as possible.
728
00:43:20,782 --> 00:43:23,585
Lisa's a little angel.
729
00:43:23,785 --> 00:43:25,720
Hello, Lisa.
730
00:43:27,522 --> 00:43:29,424
I'm extremely fond of her.
731
00:43:29,624 --> 00:43:31,860
I think of her
like she's my own.
732
00:43:32,060 --> 00:43:33,995
I wasn't studying yesterday.
733
00:43:35,264 --> 00:43:38,167
She's a great little kid.
734
00:43:38,367 --> 00:43:42,070
It's really nice
to have a family again.
735
00:43:43,605 --> 00:43:49,411
If that falls apart,
I really don't know what to do.
736
00:43:49,611 --> 00:43:52,247
So Ginger is a good stepfather?
737
00:43:55,950 --> 00:43:57,886
Stepfather.
738
00:43:59,254 --> 00:44:01,256
Yeah.
739
00:44:01,456 --> 00:44:06,428
Do you find yourself
to be a tragic hero?
740
00:44:06,628 --> 00:44:08,163
Go on with the interview.
741
00:44:08,363 --> 00:44:11,666
Stop trying to be
an intellectual dickhead.
742
00:44:49,304 --> 00:44:51,740
* Tell me *
743
00:44:51,940 --> 00:44:54,976
* Tell me, Toady *
744
00:44:55,176 --> 00:44:56,511
Ginger's not just a player.
745
00:44:56,711 --> 00:44:58,747
He's also a bandleader
and arranger.
746
00:44:58,947 --> 00:45:02,251
We were all brought up
on the big-band era, you know?
747
00:45:02,451 --> 00:45:04,986
And that's what Air force
was like.
748
00:45:05,186 --> 00:45:07,222
* Tell me *
749
00:45:07,422 --> 00:45:10,259
* Tell me, Toady *
750
00:45:10,459 --> 00:45:13,895
I made a stupid decision
of saying, "Okay."
751
00:45:14,095 --> 00:45:17,632
"Well, I've made my money
with Cream and Blind Faith,
752
00:45:17,832 --> 00:45:20,802
So I will pay the band
all the money."
753
00:45:21,002 --> 00:45:23,438
Just ridiculously expensive...
Hotel bills,
754
00:45:23,638 --> 00:45:25,374
The transportation, the wages.
755
00:45:25,574 --> 00:45:28,743
The name came from
the air force section
756
00:45:28,943 --> 00:45:33,181
Of the Duke Ellington Band,
which was the junkie section.
757
00:45:33,381 --> 00:45:34,649
It really was an air force.
758
00:45:34,849 --> 00:45:37,752
I think somebody said that they
were flying at 30,000 feet,
759
00:45:37,952 --> 00:45:39,088
I think it was.
760
00:45:39,288 --> 00:45:40,922
It was a very high band.
761
00:45:43,792 --> 00:45:47,662
Now they're saying Air force
was some kind of a fusion band.
762
00:45:47,862 --> 00:45:49,798
I don't know
what the fuck that is.
763
00:45:49,998 --> 00:45:55,304
You can't put music in boxes,
especially my music.
764
00:46:03,412 --> 00:46:05,247
It was really exciting.
765
00:46:05,447 --> 00:46:06,948
I thought it was gonna last
forever.
766
00:46:07,148 --> 00:46:11,786
But, you know, Ginger's bands
have tended to be like that.
767
00:46:11,986 --> 00:46:13,204
Didn't they?
768
00:46:13,404 --> 00:46:14,423
Like what?
769
00:46:14,623 --> 00:46:16,491
You hear them,
you think, "This is fabulous."
770
00:46:16,691 --> 00:46:17,926
It's gonna go on forever."
771
00:46:18,126 --> 00:46:19,228
And it lasts a week.
772
00:46:19,428 --> 00:46:22,431
Maybe that's just part
of being him, you know?
773
00:46:22,631 --> 00:46:23,965
I don't know.
774
00:46:24,165 --> 00:46:27,769
Because of his fame from Cream
and Blind Faith,
775
00:46:27,969 --> 00:46:29,304
You know, he was considered
776
00:46:29,504 --> 00:46:31,373
The great rock drummer
of his generation.
777
00:46:31,573 --> 00:46:34,409
But as Ginger will tell you,
he was a jazz drummer.
778
00:46:34,609 --> 00:46:37,979
The general public
are so fucking dumb.
779
00:46:38,179 --> 00:46:43,685
That, you know, like, that
anybody could think of Bonham
780
00:46:43,885 --> 00:46:48,657
Was anywhere near
this kind of drummer I am,
781
00:46:48,857 --> 00:46:51,292
It's just extraordinary.
782
00:46:51,492 --> 00:46:53,728
Bonham had technique,
783
00:46:53,928 --> 00:46:57,699
But he couldn't swing
a fucking sack of shit.
784
00:46:57,899 --> 00:47:00,169
Or Moonie, for that matter.
785
00:47:00,369 --> 00:47:04,873
I mean, if they were still alive
today, ask them.
786
00:47:07,041 --> 00:47:08,177
When they think of Ginger,
787
00:47:08,377 --> 00:47:10,144
They think of Keith Moon
and Bonham.
788
00:47:10,344 --> 00:47:12,547
No, no, no, no.
789
00:47:12,747 --> 00:47:15,150
Ginger was nothing like
those players.
790
00:47:15,350 --> 00:47:17,952
His musical capabilities
are full-spectrum.
791
00:47:18,152 --> 00:47:20,388
He can write
and compose and arrange,
792
00:47:20,588 --> 00:47:22,824
And he has an ear,
and he is harmonic.
793
00:47:23,024 --> 00:47:24,559
He's a fully formed musician.
794
00:47:24,759 --> 00:47:27,362
He wanted to be respected
by the jazz drummers,
795
00:47:27,562 --> 00:47:29,030
So Ginger did these drum battles
796
00:47:29,230 --> 00:47:32,367
With the guys he looked up to,
thought were the great drummers.
797
00:48:33,662 --> 00:48:35,530
What always happens
is you end up,
798
00:48:35,730 --> 00:48:37,599
If you're playing
with a good guy,
799
00:48:37,799 --> 00:48:39,434
You end up playing together.
800
00:49:14,569 --> 00:49:16,571
By him taking
all these guys on...
801
00:49:16,771 --> 00:49:20,158
And nobody else really did
in the "rock world"...
802
00:49:20,358 --> 00:49:23,119
He was considered to be
in that elite echelon
803
00:49:23,319 --> 00:49:25,634
Of great jazz drummers,
which, ultimately,
804
00:49:25,834 --> 00:49:28,226
That's what he considered
himself to be...
805
00:49:28,426 --> 00:49:30,990
The great jazz drummer
of his generation.
806
00:49:31,190 --> 00:49:33,555
Not a fucking rock drummer.
807
00:49:33,755 --> 00:49:36,958
So, here you are,
at the height of your career.
808
00:49:37,158 --> 00:49:39,427
You've battled
all the greatest drummers.
809
00:49:39,627 --> 00:49:40,895
You've become a bandleader.
810
00:49:41,095 --> 00:49:44,032
And you decide to go to Africa.
811
00:49:44,232 --> 00:49:45,800
Oh, God.
812
00:49:46,300 --> 00:49:55,009
Way back, when Phil turned me on
to all the African drummers,
813
00:49:55,209 --> 00:50:03,918
It was obviously very high on my
priorities to go to Africa.
814
00:50:05,119 --> 00:50:08,356
Ginger says, "How do you feel
about filming me"
815
00:50:08,556 --> 00:50:09,391
Going across the Sahara?"
816
00:50:09,591 --> 00:50:11,226
And I said,
"How are you proposing
817
00:50:11,426 --> 00:50:12,944
To go across the Sahara,
Ginger?"
818
00:50:13,144 --> 00:50:14,663
And he said, "I'm gonna drive."
819
00:50:14,863 --> 00:50:17,699
* Ah-ah-ah-ah *
820
00:50:17,899 --> 00:50:20,952
* Ah-ah-ah *
821
00:50:21,152 --> 00:50:23,212
* Ah-ah-ah-ah *
822
00:50:23,412 --> 00:50:25,473
* Ah-ah-ah *
823
00:50:30,278 --> 00:50:39,520
* Ah-ah-ah *
824
00:50:48,362 --> 00:50:52,133
There was that questing spirit
of a true artist there.
825
00:50:52,333 --> 00:50:54,969
It was news
that Ginger dropped out,
826
00:50:55,169 --> 00:50:57,171
Or he went following the groove.
827
00:51:01,542 --> 00:51:03,778
From Africa.
828
00:51:08,049 --> 00:51:11,886
He predates everybody else
who later on said,
829
00:51:12,086 --> 00:51:14,188
"We discovered
the sounds of Africa."
830
00:51:14,388 --> 00:51:18,392
The only person that made me
cry before playing was Phil,
831
00:51:18,592 --> 00:51:19,928
And these guys had me crying,
832
00:51:20,128 --> 00:51:24,465
Because the time things they
were doing were just so subtle.
833
00:51:24,665 --> 00:51:27,135
This is why I went to Africa.
834
00:51:31,339 --> 00:51:33,908
When I arrived in Nigeria,
835
00:51:34,108 --> 00:51:37,678
I went straight
to the Afro Spot.
836
00:51:37,878 --> 00:51:41,249
And there was Fela
playing onstage.
837
00:51:41,449 --> 00:51:47,021
And it was just like, "Wow, man.
This is cool."
838
00:51:52,093 --> 00:51:57,832
It was unlike anything
anybody else was playing.
839
00:51:58,032 --> 00:52:00,301
Fela was like,
"That's Ginger Baker!
840
00:52:00,501 --> 00:52:02,637
That's Ginger Baker!"
841
00:52:04,639 --> 00:52:05,974
Who is Fela?
842
00:52:06,174 --> 00:52:09,343
Some say he's the greatest
musician in Africa,
843
00:52:09,543 --> 00:52:13,281
Others that he's a prophet,
still others that he's a rebel,
844
00:52:13,481 --> 00:52:14,315
A revolutionary tribune.
845
00:52:14,515 --> 00:52:17,568
Fela was one of the most
important, influential,
846
00:52:17,768 --> 00:52:20,822
And courageous musicians
of the 20th century.
847
00:52:22,857 --> 00:52:24,726
Ginger got the opportunity
848
00:52:24,926 --> 00:52:27,561
To sit in the drum chair
for a while
849
00:52:27,761 --> 00:52:28,597
Of one of the greatest bands
850
00:52:28,797 --> 00:52:30,899
Ever to play
African popular music.
851
00:52:43,011 --> 00:52:46,547
Ginger was very close
to everybody...
852
00:52:46,747 --> 00:52:49,416
The girls, my father, the band.
853
00:52:49,616 --> 00:52:52,086
It was a color-blind situation.
854
00:52:52,286 --> 00:52:56,024
They smoked together, they drank
together, had women together.
855
00:52:56,224 --> 00:52:58,026
They played together...
Everything together.
856
00:53:27,455 --> 00:53:31,059
The first... or only Western
musician to go out there
857
00:53:31,259 --> 00:53:33,928
And immerse himself
and live in it,
858
00:53:34,128 --> 00:53:36,798
In the squalor of it,
was Ginger.
859
00:53:41,970 --> 00:53:44,939
And this studio became
the first 16-track studio
860
00:53:45,139 --> 00:53:47,241
We've got in our country.
861
00:53:47,441 --> 00:53:49,343
Fela stopped using EMI
862
00:53:49,543 --> 00:53:53,214
And started to use
Ginger Baker's studio.
863
00:53:53,414 --> 00:53:57,768
Now, who leaves England
to go and record in Lagos?
864
00:53:57,968 --> 00:54:03,399
Africa at that time in Nigeria
was an absolute hotbed
865
00:54:03,599 --> 00:54:09,030
Of revolution, of death,
of unaccountable violence.
866
00:54:09,898 --> 00:54:14,035
It was a great place to be
in those days.
867
00:54:18,439 --> 00:54:21,976
I was in Africa
for a period of six years.
868
00:54:22,176 --> 00:54:25,713
It was sort of like
the "flower power" days
869
00:54:25,913 --> 00:54:27,582
In Nigeria, you know?
870
00:54:27,782 --> 00:54:30,885
You can't imagine
the '70s in Nigeria,
871
00:54:31,085 --> 00:54:33,888
How much fun they all had.
872
00:54:41,395 --> 00:54:44,866
Fela... We used to call him
the black president,
873
00:54:45,066 --> 00:54:47,135
And he formed
the Calakuta Party.
874
00:54:47,335 --> 00:54:51,639
And we all used to sit around
a table the shape of Africa,
875
00:54:51,839 --> 00:54:54,408
And I was elected
one of the party.
876
00:54:54,608 --> 00:54:55,726
He was just cool.
877
00:54:55,926 --> 00:54:56,845
He was real cool.
878
00:54:57,045 --> 00:54:58,780
Ginger's a cool white boy.
879
00:54:58,980 --> 00:55:00,798
Meanwhile,
no one in Europe knew
880
00:55:00,998 --> 00:55:02,817
What the fuck was going on
there.
881
00:55:03,017 --> 00:55:03,818
Nobody what?
882
00:55:04,018 --> 00:55:05,219
Nobody in Europe,
883
00:55:05,419 --> 00:55:07,822
All the people you had
left behind, you know?
884
00:55:08,022 --> 00:55:10,424
What people I'd left behind?
885
00:55:11,625 --> 00:55:13,828
I think he just goes.
886
00:55:14,028 --> 00:55:15,496
That's a great thing in music.
887
00:55:15,696 --> 00:55:18,199
You don't want to be thinking
too much when you're playing.
888
00:55:18,399 --> 00:55:21,135
He who hesitates is lost.
889
00:55:21,335 --> 00:55:22,837
Just go.
890
00:55:23,037 --> 00:55:25,840
He really desperately
wanted a boy.
891
00:55:26,040 --> 00:55:29,343
And when he got a boy,
he was awful to him.
892
00:55:29,543 --> 00:55:32,013
He said some nasty things
to my mom.
893
00:55:33,047 --> 00:55:36,484
Like, "I wish I had black kids,"
or something.
894
00:55:36,684 --> 00:55:38,586
Were you guys still in contact
with him?
895
00:55:38,786 --> 00:55:39,520
Yeah, yeah.
896
00:55:39,720 --> 00:55:40,789
He would just call you?
897
00:55:40,989 --> 00:55:44,658
Yeah.
Like, "Hello. I'm in prison."
898
00:55:44,858 --> 00:55:45,860
"Fine."
899
00:55:46,060 --> 00:55:49,130
I was approached
by Range Rover.
900
00:55:49,330 --> 00:55:55,136
Would I join them in a three-car
team for this Show 1000 rally?
901
00:55:55,336 --> 00:55:57,872
Anyway, I arrived
at the checkpoint
902
00:55:58,072 --> 00:56:00,408
And did 180
and came in backwards.
903
00:56:00,608 --> 00:56:03,327
And I heard this voice say,
"Bloody hell!
904
00:56:03,527 --> 00:56:06,247
The way you drive,
you should play polo."
905
00:56:06,447 --> 00:56:08,165
And I shouted out of the window,
906
00:56:08,365 --> 00:56:10,325
"You've got to be
bloody kidding."
907
00:56:10,525 --> 00:56:12,486
He said,
"Okay, Baker. Come with me."
908
00:56:12,686 --> 00:56:13,822
So off we go.
909
00:56:14,022 --> 00:56:15,723
And where do we go?
910
00:56:15,923 --> 00:56:17,425
Lagos Polo Club.
911
00:56:17,625 --> 00:56:22,030
And I've already downed about
eight or nine Bacardi and Cokes,
912
00:56:22,230 --> 00:56:24,899
And Colin comes up to me
and says, "Right, Baker."
913
00:56:25,099 --> 00:56:26,801
It's time you got on a horse."
914
00:56:27,001 --> 00:56:30,038
And Colin gets out a whip
and goes whack!
915
00:56:30,238 --> 00:56:34,708
Boom! It's off
like fucking 900 miles an hour.
916
00:56:34,908 --> 00:56:36,110
Absolutely full gallop.
917
00:56:36,310 --> 00:56:39,080
My sunglasses were around
one side of my face,
918
00:56:39,280 --> 00:56:42,683
And my beard's around the other,
but I was still on the horse.
919
00:56:42,883 --> 00:56:45,586
And I said, "Where's
the fucking brakes, Colin?"
920
00:56:47,488 --> 00:56:50,391
So I'd found
an old pair of boots
921
00:56:50,591 --> 00:56:55,596
And an old polo stick and a hat,
and I became a poloist.
922
00:56:58,799 --> 00:56:59,968
The class of Nigerians
923
00:57:00,168 --> 00:57:03,804
That would have belonged
to the Lagos Polo Club
924
00:57:04,004 --> 00:57:05,373
Were very elite people,
925
00:57:05,573 --> 00:57:08,109
People that Fela would dismiss
as having a so-called
926
00:57:08,309 --> 00:57:09,477
"Colonial mentality."
927
00:57:09,677 --> 00:57:11,212
Those were definitely the people
928
00:57:11,412 --> 00:57:14,848
That Fela was singing against
in the 1970s.
929
00:57:15,048 --> 00:57:15,917
But it was later in the '70s
930
00:57:16,117 --> 00:57:17,618
When Fela really got
more radicalized
931
00:57:17,818 --> 00:57:20,354
And began to live the life
of a musical dissident.
932
00:57:20,554 --> 00:57:22,790
All this nonsense
hanging around here.
933
00:57:22,990 --> 00:57:23,958
They sit there in cars, man!
934
00:57:24,158 --> 00:57:27,979
Fela took on
the government, the army.
935
00:57:28,179 --> 00:57:32,108
He was determined
to become president.
936
00:57:32,308 --> 00:57:35,774
All the government top guys
played polo,
937
00:57:35,974 --> 00:57:39,440
So they were always
at the Lagos Polo Club.
938
00:57:39,640 --> 00:57:41,409
So I was playing polo there
939
00:57:41,609 --> 00:57:45,646
And hanging out with,
as it were, Fela's enemies.
940
00:57:45,846 --> 00:57:49,117
And a lot of the people
on Fela's committee
941
00:57:49,317 --> 00:57:56,157
Didn't like that and soured
Fela's mind against me.
942
00:57:56,357 --> 00:57:58,559
I was pretty upset at the time.
943
00:57:58,759 --> 00:57:59,727
About what?
944
00:57:59,927 --> 00:58:06,334
Well, that Fela wouldn't play
with me, with his band.
945
00:58:06,534 --> 00:58:09,270
On Friday, February 18, 1977,
946
00:58:09,470 --> 00:58:12,073
A thousand-odd soldiers
surround Calakuta,
947
00:58:12,273 --> 00:58:13,524
Machine guns at the ready.
948
00:58:13,724 --> 00:58:14,775
They plunder the house.
949
00:58:14,975 --> 00:58:17,945
Their clubs spare neither
pregnant women nor children.
950
00:58:18,145 --> 00:58:20,014
Fela himself
is seriously beaten.
951
00:58:20,214 --> 00:58:23,017
Fela and his tribe
find themselves in prison.
952
00:58:23,217 --> 00:58:25,153
It was starting to go wrong,
yeah.
953
00:58:25,353 --> 00:58:28,022
But, I mean, I left Nigeria
954
00:58:28,222 --> 00:58:30,674
Because I lost my studio,
really.
955
00:58:30,874 --> 00:58:33,318
It took us three years
to build it.
956
00:58:33,518 --> 00:58:35,963
It's been open
just over two years now.
957
00:58:36,163 --> 00:58:37,565
It's coming along great.
958
00:58:45,873 --> 00:58:48,242
Presumably, there must be
a lot of music there.
959
00:58:48,442 --> 00:58:50,178
Yeah.
We kept pretty busy.
960
00:58:50,378 --> 00:58:52,513
We were working
all the time, yeah.
961
00:58:52,713 --> 00:58:56,683
I think as a businessperson,
he's a walking disaster area.
962
00:58:56,883 --> 00:59:00,854
Ginger's out there, discovering
a whole new world of sound...
963
00:59:01,054 --> 00:59:02,456
Literally a whole new world
of sound...
964
00:59:02,656 --> 00:59:07,328
And recording it in good faith,
not even blind faith.
965
00:59:07,528 --> 00:59:08,897
Along comes
a gangster record company
966
00:59:09,097 --> 00:59:11,031
And says, "We can take advantage
of that."
967
00:59:11,231 --> 00:59:13,083
And Ginger was just taken
for a ride.
968
00:59:13,283 --> 00:59:15,136
He said,
"You can't build a studio here.
969
00:59:15,336 --> 00:59:16,804
This is our territory."
970
00:59:17,004 --> 00:59:20,408
They banned all the artists
they had under contract
971
00:59:20,608 --> 00:59:23,327
From using my studio.
972
00:59:23,527 --> 00:59:26,247
I told him to fuck off.
973
00:59:30,017 --> 00:59:31,219
So shortly after that,
974
00:59:31,419 --> 00:59:34,355
Three armed soldiers entered
the studio.
975
00:59:34,555 --> 00:59:37,325
So I just leapt out of the room,
over the balcony,
976
00:59:37,525 --> 00:59:43,631
Got in the Range Rover, and went
straight towards the road.
977
00:59:44,998 --> 00:59:48,068
I could hear all these gunshots
and ricochets going on
978
00:59:48,268 --> 00:59:50,704
Where the police
are trying to shoot me.
979
00:59:50,904 --> 00:59:52,941
Why did Ginger leave?
980
00:59:53,141 --> 00:59:56,360
I just know
things were not going right.
981
00:59:56,560 --> 00:59:59,780
But when he left,
Fela and him lost contact.
982
01:00:36,684 --> 01:00:40,087
You had been off the scene
in Africa for so many years.
983
01:00:40,287 --> 01:00:43,691
You must have missed being
a rock star to a certain extent.
984
01:00:43,891 --> 01:00:45,626
No, I didn't.
985
01:00:46,627 --> 01:00:51,432
I came back to England to play
with the Gurvitz brothers,
986
01:00:51,632 --> 01:00:53,634
For which I got some money.
987
01:00:53,834 --> 01:00:59,006
I'd just lost a fortune, so it
was a matter of doing some work.
988
01:00:59,740 --> 01:01:02,526
That was really
all he could get, wasn't it?
989
01:01:02,726 --> 01:01:05,513
At that time,
nobody wanted to work with him.
990
01:01:06,947 --> 01:01:08,899
* Now is the time *
991
01:01:09,099 --> 01:01:11,393
* Get it all together *
992
01:01:11,593 --> 01:01:13,887
Shut up, you bloody fool!
993
01:01:14,087 --> 01:01:14,955
* Now is the time *
994
01:01:15,155 --> 01:01:17,791
- Hey!
- * Put yourself together *
995
01:01:17,991 --> 01:01:23,497
Yeah, I grew up in the downward
spiral of his life,
996
01:01:23,697 --> 01:01:25,666
Everything collapsing
and falling apart.
997
01:01:25,866 --> 01:01:30,438
The mistake I made
was letting polo take over
998
01:01:30,638 --> 01:01:32,606
From thinking about work.
999
01:01:32,806 --> 01:01:36,410
The tax people saw this film
the BBC did
1000
01:01:36,610 --> 01:01:40,614
Of these horses arriving
and gave the impression
1001
01:01:40,814 --> 01:01:42,683
That I'd got a hell of a lot
of money.
1002
01:01:42,883 --> 01:01:46,887
Only this week, 30 polo ponies
arrived from Argentina.
1003
01:01:47,087 --> 01:01:51,091
This air shipment guarantees
Ginger Baker's commitment
1004
01:01:51,291 --> 01:01:54,828
To a sport that stands for
everything he isn't.
1005
01:01:55,028 --> 01:01:57,465
I went absolutely broke.
1006
01:01:57,665 --> 01:02:02,503
It was a very bad time
altogether.
1007
01:02:02,703 --> 01:02:08,075
He left my mom for my first
boyfriend's sister.
1008
01:02:08,576 --> 01:02:12,880
That was his second wife,
was my first boyfriend's sister.
1009
01:02:13,080 --> 01:02:15,299
There's a good idea!
1010
01:02:15,499 --> 01:02:17,718
She was 18, you know?
1011
01:02:19,720 --> 01:02:22,356
Well, maybe 17.
I don't know.
1012
01:02:22,556 --> 01:02:25,192
She was still going to school.
1013
01:02:25,926 --> 01:02:29,463
She was a very naughty-type
girl, yeah.
1014
01:02:31,299 --> 01:02:34,252
Very sexy-type girl.
1015
01:02:34,452 --> 01:02:37,405
* Powder blues *
1016
01:02:41,975 --> 01:02:45,378
The tax people go, "You owe us,
you know, £150,000."
1017
01:02:45,578 --> 01:02:48,982
And it's like, you know,
he doesn't have £150,000,
1018
01:02:49,182 --> 01:02:50,518
So they took the house.
1019
01:02:50,718 --> 01:02:52,586
We'd lived in that house
all our lives.
1020
01:02:52,786 --> 01:02:53,954
And then one day you come home
1021
01:02:54,154 --> 01:02:55,723
And there's a whole load
of police
1022
01:02:55,923 --> 01:02:57,024
And a whole load of bailiffs,
1023
01:02:57,224 --> 01:02:59,393
And they just won't let you
back into your house.
1024
01:02:59,593 --> 01:03:01,762
And they just take everything
that you've ever owned.
1025
01:03:01,962 --> 01:03:03,431
I just, you know, took my drums
1026
01:03:03,631 --> 01:03:06,634
And went and lived
on the streets, lived in squats.
1027
01:03:06,834 --> 01:03:08,902
You know, I used to
tie my drums to my hands
1028
01:03:09,102 --> 01:03:12,072
When I went to sleep
so that no one could take them.
1029
01:03:12,272 --> 01:03:14,858
You know, I don't think
he should've had a family.
1030
01:03:15,058 --> 01:03:17,836
I think he would have been
way better off in his life
1031
01:03:18,036 --> 01:03:20,814
If he'd never had kids and just,
you know, did his thing.
1032
01:03:22,182 --> 01:03:25,753
He would have left
a lot less of a mess behind.
1033
01:03:27,020 --> 01:03:30,424
Most of the time Ginger was
with Baker Gurvitz Army,
1034
01:03:30,624 --> 01:03:32,793
He wasn't really
on the hard stuff.
1035
01:03:32,993 --> 01:03:33,661
Oh, yeah.
1036
01:03:33,861 --> 01:03:37,447
I'm a lot, you know...
better in myself.
1037
01:03:37,647 --> 01:03:41,234
Fit and well,
if you like, you know?
1038
01:03:41,434 --> 01:03:42,670
The hard stuff came back
1039
01:03:42,870 --> 01:03:45,673
In the recording
of "Hearts on Fire."
1040
01:03:54,281 --> 01:03:59,052
It was sort of like
a pretty disastrous period,
1041
01:03:59,252 --> 01:04:01,389
So I got back into using.
1042
01:04:01,589 --> 01:04:03,157
And that's
when you sort of realize
1043
01:04:03,357 --> 01:04:08,295
Your idols have feet of clay,
the slight inkling coming in
1044
01:04:08,495 --> 01:04:10,764
That this person isn't
in control.
1045
01:04:10,964 --> 01:04:14,301
The cameraman's in control.
1046
01:04:14,501 --> 01:04:16,236
Hello.
1047
01:04:16,436 --> 01:04:17,971
Um...
1048
01:04:18,171 --> 01:04:20,073
What were you saying?
1049
01:04:43,731 --> 01:04:46,166
Jeff, get us a glass of wine,
will you?
1050
01:04:48,502 --> 01:04:51,171
Fucking hell, man.
I tried hard.
1051
01:04:52,940 --> 01:04:57,077
I'd decided, "I'd better
get away from anybody I know"
1052
01:04:57,277 --> 01:04:59,747
If I'm ever going to
get straight."
1053
01:04:59,947 --> 01:05:02,750
So I decided to go to Italy.
1054
01:05:02,950 --> 01:05:05,553
I went to Italy with Sarah,
1055
01:05:05,753 --> 01:05:09,490
Living on this place right
on top of a fucking mountain,
1056
01:05:09,690 --> 01:05:12,626
And I've never lived
in England since.
1057
01:05:12,826 --> 01:05:14,262
I didn't know anybody.
1058
01:05:14,462 --> 01:05:17,181
I didn't even speak Italian.
1059
01:05:17,381 --> 01:05:20,100
And the house was falling down.
1060
01:05:20,300 --> 01:05:22,936
I met him in '86,
1061
01:05:23,136 --> 01:05:27,140
And I was asked to find him by
a singer called Johnny Rotten,
1062
01:05:27,340 --> 01:05:28,709
Who was in The Sex Pistols.
1063
01:05:28,909 --> 01:05:33,313
He was living
in a pretty obscure situation,
1064
01:05:33,513 --> 01:05:34,782
Rough situation.
1065
01:05:34,982 --> 01:05:38,686
And in the house, which was
completely in kind of shambles,
1066
01:05:38,886 --> 01:05:42,590
I think there was two horses
and seven dogs, no electricity,
1067
01:05:42,790 --> 01:05:44,592
And a room that overlooked
the mountain
1068
01:05:44,792 --> 01:05:46,394
With a drum kit in it...
Only a drum kit.
1069
01:05:46,594 --> 01:05:50,030
But when he played in that room
and it echoed over the hills,
1070
01:05:50,230 --> 01:05:53,534
You could hear people
like five miles away, screaming,
1071
01:05:53,734 --> 01:05:55,102
"Ginger!
'Wheels of fire'!"
1072
01:05:55,302 --> 01:05:59,272
Sarah obviously married him
because she wanted a rock star.
1073
01:05:59,472 --> 01:06:00,508
Hey, you know?
1074
01:06:00,708 --> 01:06:03,010
And he took her
to this little bum-fuck town,
1075
01:06:03,210 --> 01:06:05,479
And she was like,
"Well, what the hell?" you know?
1076
01:06:05,679 --> 01:06:06,814
"Where's all
the rock-star shit?"
1077
01:06:07,014 --> 01:06:09,350
And when I went out there
with some young people,
1078
01:06:09,550 --> 01:06:11,919
She went off with one of them,
and that was the end of that.
1079
01:06:12,119 --> 01:06:13,287
And he was
absolutely devastated,
1080
01:06:13,487 --> 01:06:17,224
Because he couldn't handle
his own medicine, unfortunately.
1081
01:06:18,959 --> 01:06:21,395
Was he heartbroken?
Oh, yeah.
1082
01:06:21,595 --> 01:06:23,930
Yeah.
She fucked him good, yeah.
1083
01:06:24,130 --> 01:06:26,266
I was completely
fucking destroyed.
1084
01:06:26,466 --> 01:06:31,071
I was on my own with all my dogs
and a couple of horses.
1085
01:06:34,374 --> 01:06:37,511
I mean, it was terrible.
1086
01:06:37,711 --> 01:06:40,147
I went out there to get
drum lessons and stuff.
1087
01:06:40,347 --> 01:06:41,315
He had no money,
1088
01:06:41,515 --> 01:06:44,384
So he couldn't get me
a plane ticket back to England.
1089
01:06:44,584 --> 01:06:45,786
So we had to do this gig.
1090
01:06:45,986 --> 01:06:48,689
So I got really, really sick,
right, the day of the gig.
1091
01:06:48,889 --> 01:06:50,991
I was sitting on a chair,
and I was throwing up,
1092
01:06:51,191 --> 01:06:52,859
And I was just, like,
a really bad way.
1093
01:06:53,059 --> 01:06:55,228
I was like,
"I don't know if I can play."
1094
01:06:55,428 --> 01:06:57,598
So, you know,
he chops out a line of cocaine.
1095
01:06:57,798 --> 01:06:58,666
"Take this."
1096
01:06:58,866 --> 01:07:00,801
I'd never done cocaine before,
you know?
1097
01:07:01,001 --> 01:07:02,870
Like, "I'm 15 years old,"
you know?
1098
01:07:03,070 --> 01:07:05,305
So I ended up taking this line
of cocaine.
1099
01:07:05,505 --> 01:07:06,674
Played the gig fine.
1100
01:07:06,874 --> 01:07:10,360
Somehow, it just, like,
you know, makes you feel good.
1101
01:07:10,560 --> 01:07:14,047
So then he put me on a coach
back to England, you know,
1102
01:07:14,247 --> 01:07:15,548
And he took the rest
of the money
1103
01:07:15,748 --> 01:07:17,300
And wouldn't get me
a plane ticket.
1104
01:07:17,500 --> 01:07:19,052
And we made good money
at that gig.
1105
01:07:30,898 --> 01:07:36,169
I started getting these letters
from some guy in L.A.
1106
01:07:36,369 --> 01:07:37,605
He kept saying, "Oh, man",
1107
01:07:37,805 --> 01:07:40,974
You've got a fantastic career
in films."
1108
01:07:43,276 --> 01:07:45,713
So I went to California.
1109
01:07:52,786 --> 01:07:56,389
"The Nasty Boys"
was the most extraordinary,
1110
01:07:56,589 --> 01:07:59,359
Stupid thing I've ever seen.
1111
01:08:01,528 --> 01:08:02,696
"Aah!"
1112
01:08:02,896 --> 01:08:05,533
Hollywood.
Bah.
1113
01:08:05,733 --> 01:08:07,718
That was the end of it for me.
1114
01:08:07,918 --> 01:08:10,395
I mean, it was just so stupid.
1115
01:08:10,595 --> 01:08:12,618
Last one on is a rotten egg.
1116
01:08:12,818 --> 01:08:14,642
I hadn't seen him for years.
1117
01:08:14,842 --> 01:08:17,244
When I arrived in L.A.,
I didn't recognize him,
1118
01:08:17,444 --> 01:08:19,129
'Cause he looked like
an old man.
1119
01:08:19,329 --> 01:08:20,814
And I thought, "Where's my dad?"
1120
01:08:21,014 --> 01:08:24,685
He actually put an ad
on Music Connection magazine
1121
01:08:24,885 --> 01:08:25,953
Looking for a job.
1122
01:08:26,153 --> 01:08:27,521
"Famous drummer from the '60s,"
1123
01:08:27,721 --> 01:08:29,640
You know,
"Ginger Baker from Cream,
1124
01:08:29,840 --> 01:08:31,759
Looking for a band
to play with."
1125
01:08:33,426 --> 01:08:35,295
Are you ready to go?
1126
01:08:35,495 --> 01:08:39,399
Okay. So this is a drum kit,
and I'm Ginger Baker.
1127
01:08:39,599 --> 01:08:42,252
You hold the drumstick thusly,
1128
01:08:42,452 --> 01:08:44,905
And you play the stick
like that.
1129
01:08:45,105 --> 01:08:47,841
The 1960s were heady times
for Ginger Baker.
1130
01:08:48,041 --> 01:08:48,976
He was a drummer
1131
01:08:49,176 --> 01:08:51,144
For some of rock music's
most influential groups.
1132
01:08:51,344 --> 01:08:52,813
We visited Baker
at the ranch he rents
1133
01:08:53,013 --> 01:08:55,916
In the California desert
as he tries to come back.
1134
01:08:56,116 --> 01:08:58,786
Tell me about your relationship
these days with Eric Clapton.
1135
01:08:58,986 --> 01:09:00,087
Do you still speak?
1136
01:09:00,287 --> 01:09:04,091
I don't have a lot in common
with Eric nowadays.
1137
01:09:05,926 --> 01:09:08,862
He's sort of...
1138
01:09:09,997 --> 01:09:11,799
Changed considerably.
1139
01:09:11,999 --> 01:09:13,601
Ginger, the way he is
1140
01:09:13,801 --> 01:09:16,169
And the way, you know,
his self-medication
1141
01:09:16,369 --> 01:09:19,006
And all of the kind of things
that go on in his life,
1142
01:09:19,206 --> 01:09:23,043
I would find quite hard to be
around for any length of time.
1143
01:09:23,243 --> 01:09:25,695
It was quite threatening,
you know, to me
1144
01:09:25,895 --> 01:09:28,306
And I suppose what I would call
my sobriety.
1145
01:09:28,506 --> 01:09:30,918
But I've always
got time for him, you know,
1146
01:09:31,118 --> 01:09:32,520
And I know he knows that.
1147
01:09:32,720 --> 01:09:36,089
There was nothing starlike
about him when I first met him.
1148
01:09:36,289 --> 01:09:38,025
He was pretty much penniless
when we met
1149
01:09:38,225 --> 01:09:42,429
And had spent everything to get
his horses over to America.
1150
01:09:42,629 --> 01:09:43,564
I was pretty happy.
1151
01:09:43,764 --> 01:09:45,532
I was gonna be going into
a master's program
1152
01:09:45,732 --> 01:09:46,934
And following medicine.
1153
01:09:47,134 --> 01:09:49,136
There was a lot of great stuff
ahead of me.
1154
01:09:49,336 --> 01:09:52,305
And then I got
a little derailed.
1155
01:09:52,505 --> 01:09:54,007
Was Karen a good person?
1156
01:09:56,977 --> 01:09:59,847
I don't want to discuss Karen.
1157
01:10:00,047 --> 01:10:03,717
He is somebody
who needs to be cared for,
1158
01:10:03,917 --> 01:10:06,286
And maybe that's what was
so attractive to me.
1159
01:10:06,486 --> 01:10:07,921
It was like,
"I can help this person."
1160
01:10:08,121 --> 01:10:10,423
He was somebody really
interesting to spend time with.
1161
01:10:10,623 --> 01:10:12,192
He started playing the drums,
and actually,
1162
01:10:12,392 --> 01:10:15,929
That was the first time
I really understood the drums.
1163
01:10:22,202 --> 01:10:24,171
Nobody wanted to play with him.
1164
01:10:24,371 --> 01:10:25,272
And this is L.A.
1165
01:10:25,472 --> 01:10:28,742
I mean, there should have been
gigs everywhere for him.
1166
01:10:28,942 --> 01:10:32,212
People were just like, "Mm. No.
It's too much trouble."
1167
01:10:34,147 --> 01:10:37,617
And then finally, he did join
The Masters of Reality.
1168
01:10:37,817 --> 01:10:40,704
* John Brown, bring him down *
1169
01:10:40,904 --> 01:10:43,791
* Pull his body to the ground *
1170
01:10:48,261 --> 01:10:51,364
It was really
quite an enjoyable thing,
1171
01:10:51,564 --> 01:10:53,400
That Masters of Reality.
1172
01:10:53,600 --> 01:10:57,537
They were trying to say it was
heavy metal, which it wasn't.
1173
01:10:57,737 --> 01:11:02,442
It was music
you couldn't put in a box, Jay.
1174
01:11:06,847 --> 01:11:09,149
"Sunrise on the Sufferbus."
1175
01:11:09,349 --> 01:11:11,868
Musician magazine
simply calls "Sufferbus"
1176
01:11:12,068 --> 01:11:14,696
"The best rock album
of the young decade."
1177
01:11:14,896 --> 01:11:17,524
When we were on tour
with Alice In Chains,
1178
01:11:17,724 --> 01:11:18,792
I think it was a mismatch.
1179
01:11:18,992 --> 01:11:21,111
Most of the crowd to begin with
1180
01:11:21,311 --> 01:11:23,230
Didn't know
who Ginger Baker was.
1181
01:11:23,430 --> 01:11:26,633
Kids in the front row
with Megadeth T-shirts on
1182
01:11:26,833 --> 01:11:28,968
Throwing stuff at Ginger.
1183
01:11:29,168 --> 01:11:31,104
How much can a man take?
1184
01:11:31,304 --> 01:11:33,406
He was having to start
all over again,
1185
01:11:33,606 --> 01:11:34,642
Just like a new musician.
1186
01:11:34,842 --> 01:11:37,744
And they were treating him like,
"You know, you should be happy.
1187
01:11:37,944 --> 01:11:38,912
"We got you a tour bus.
1188
01:11:39,112 --> 01:11:40,513
A lot of musicians don't have
tour buses."
1189
01:11:40,713 --> 01:11:44,717
And he's like, "I did this,
you know, 30 years ago."
1190
01:11:44,917 --> 01:11:45,886
I don't want to do this again."
1191
01:11:46,086 --> 01:11:49,222
Do you think Nirvana
is the new Cream?
1192
01:11:50,323 --> 01:11:54,427
He had gotten a taste
of American music business,
1193
01:11:54,627 --> 01:11:58,031
Class of '93,
and he spit it out.
1194
01:11:58,231 --> 01:12:00,834
And I don't fucking blame him
one bit.
1195
01:12:01,034 --> 01:12:03,871
I didn't like L.A. at all.
1196
01:12:04,071 --> 01:12:06,806
He wasn't getting along
with the whole polo community
1197
01:12:07,006 --> 01:12:08,175
In California at that time,
1198
01:12:08,375 --> 01:12:11,644
So he was just ready to move on
and start all over again.
1199
01:12:14,181 --> 01:12:16,299
When he left
to come out here to Colorado,
1200
01:12:16,499 --> 01:12:18,418
Nobody wanted to play with him
anymore.
1201
01:12:18,618 --> 01:12:21,922
So we started a polo club
called Mile High Polo.
1202
01:12:22,122 --> 01:12:23,323
And that worked out beautifully,
1203
01:12:23,523 --> 01:12:25,825
Because he didn't have to go
and play with other people.
1204
01:12:26,025 --> 01:12:27,127
They had to come play with him.
1205
01:12:27,327 --> 01:12:28,845
Here comes Ginger Baker.
1206
01:12:29,045 --> 01:12:30,363
Not only can he play drums,
1207
01:12:30,563 --> 01:12:32,465
But he can hit that ball
down the field.
1208
01:12:32,665 --> 01:12:35,402
People would come out, bring
their kids, bring their dogs.
1209
01:12:35,602 --> 01:12:37,738
We'd have polo
and then jazz in the park.
1210
01:12:37,938 --> 01:12:41,774
He would get off the horse,
come over in his polo uniform,
1211
01:12:41,974 --> 01:12:43,076
And sit down at the drums.
1212
01:12:43,276 --> 01:12:45,512
And then we'd just go
into something from there.
1213
01:12:45,712 --> 01:12:47,797
So it was a pretty wild
experience to see.
1214
01:12:47,997 --> 01:12:50,083
And you could feel
the passion of both things.
1215
01:12:56,990 --> 01:13:03,096
DJQ20... It was probably
the best band I had.
1216
01:13:03,296 --> 01:13:10,170
It was great playing jazz,
again... the music I came from.
1217
01:13:13,606 --> 01:13:15,976
Kofi was living with us
at the time,
1218
01:13:16,176 --> 01:13:19,512
And we used to do
a lot of drum things together.
1219
01:13:26,386 --> 01:13:28,088
He's got a prodigious technique.
1220
01:13:28,288 --> 01:13:30,723
He's got the most amazing
technique.
1221
01:13:30,923 --> 01:13:32,459
He's a hell of a sweet kid.
1222
01:13:32,659 --> 01:13:35,595
It was the closest
I ever got to my dad.
1223
01:13:35,795 --> 01:13:37,564
It was great fun.
1224
01:13:38,465 --> 01:13:40,900
And I actually got to play
with my dad,
1225
01:13:41,100 --> 01:13:43,336
And there was some form
of bond going on.
1226
01:13:43,536 --> 01:13:46,039
I mean, I wish I could have
done that my whole life.
1227
01:13:46,239 --> 01:13:48,008
It would've been great.
1228
01:14:04,958 --> 01:14:08,028
He comes out of jazz,
plays rock, plays world music.
1229
01:14:08,228 --> 01:14:11,298
I just thought, "We should
get some music together"
1230
01:14:11,498 --> 01:14:13,300
"That shows him
as this major cat,
1231
01:14:13,500 --> 01:14:16,436
"Not, you know,
a lesser light than Max Roach,
1232
01:14:16,636 --> 01:14:18,171
But his own personal music."
1233
01:14:18,371 --> 01:14:22,675
Ron so inspired Ginger,
Ginger began to practice.
1234
01:14:22,875 --> 01:14:24,311
He began to rehearse.
1235
01:14:24,511 --> 01:14:26,313
Then, finally,
they came to New York
1236
01:14:26,513 --> 01:14:28,015
And played a gig at the Iridium
1237
01:14:28,215 --> 01:14:31,418
And just blew the doors
off the place.
1238
01:14:31,618 --> 01:14:33,720
It went down
like a fucking bomb.
1239
01:14:41,661 --> 01:14:45,298
At the Iridium in New York,
Max Roach came to the gig.
1240
01:14:45,498 --> 01:14:48,218
The first record he ever bought
was Max Roach.
1241
01:14:48,418 --> 01:14:51,138
I did one of the best solos
I've ever done
1242
01:14:51,338 --> 01:14:53,273
When Max was there.
1243
01:15:06,819 --> 01:15:09,156
I could see Ginger's face
on the break.
1244
01:15:09,356 --> 01:15:10,457
Max hugged him.
1245
01:15:10,657 --> 01:15:13,560
It was like Max was saying,
"Yeah. You're in here.
1246
01:15:13,760 --> 01:15:14,627
You're one of us."
1247
01:15:14,827 --> 01:15:18,298
He just had tears
coming down his face,
1248
01:15:18,498 --> 01:15:21,751
Because he had achieved
the pinnacle of jazz
1249
01:15:21,951 --> 01:15:25,013
For an improvising musician
and a drummer.
1250
01:15:25,213 --> 01:15:28,075
He has a working band
that can go toe-to-toe
1251
01:15:28,275 --> 01:15:31,678
With any band in New York,
let alone planet Earth.
1252
01:15:31,878 --> 01:15:34,797
And he had not only
been accepted,
1253
01:15:34,997 --> 01:15:37,917
But accepted as a peer
and an equal.
1254
01:15:38,117 --> 01:15:40,487
The actual words Max said were,
1255
01:15:40,687 --> 01:15:44,657
"Jesus,
Ginger plays like a nigger."
1256
01:15:46,193 --> 01:15:50,463
That, coming from someone
like Max Roach,
1257
01:15:50,663 --> 01:15:54,934
Was an enormous compliment,
you know?
1258
01:15:55,835 --> 01:15:59,906
Four drummers in my life
that were absolute heroes.
1259
01:16:00,106 --> 01:16:02,175
Phil Seamen was the first one,
1260
01:16:02,375 --> 01:16:06,946
Max Roach, Art Blakey,
and Elvin Jones.
1261
01:16:07,146 --> 01:16:10,717
All four of them
became friends...
1262
01:16:10,917 --> 01:16:12,769
I mean friends.
1263
01:16:12,969 --> 01:16:14,621
Dear friends.
1264
01:16:14,821 --> 01:16:19,159
And that to me is worth...
1265
01:16:19,359 --> 01:16:22,562
More to me
than anything in the world.
1266
01:16:44,517 --> 01:16:48,087
Anywhere Ginger goes,
it's just a matter of time
1267
01:16:48,287 --> 01:16:51,858
Before there's gonna be
controversy going on.
1268
01:16:52,825 --> 01:16:55,462
Somebody did a very nasty
1269
01:16:55,662 --> 01:17:00,032
And resulted in Liz
getting arrested yesterday
1270
01:17:00,232 --> 01:17:02,535
By the immigration people.
1271
01:17:02,735 --> 01:17:04,972
He had an English groom
that was living with us.
1272
01:17:05,172 --> 01:17:08,441
But because her immigration
papers hadn't come through yet,
1273
01:17:08,641 --> 01:17:11,077
She was illegal,
and so they took her away.
1274
01:17:11,277 --> 01:17:13,680
And I started going crazy.
1275
01:17:13,880 --> 01:17:17,617
And there was these two guys,
Louis & Floorwax,
1276
01:17:17,817 --> 01:17:20,286
Who had a radio show
that I was on.
1277
01:17:20,486 --> 01:17:22,955
He came on the radio show
one morning
1278
01:17:23,155 --> 01:17:24,291
And started talking about it.
1279
01:17:24,491 --> 01:17:27,160
And he literally told everybody
to fuck off.
1280
01:17:27,360 --> 01:17:29,396
I mean, this is a foul deed.
1281
01:17:29,596 --> 01:17:32,248
He said something about
the United States of America
1282
01:17:32,448 --> 01:17:34,876
Can kiss my ass or blow me
or something like that.
1283
01:17:35,076 --> 01:17:37,504
I think that's the last thing
he said on our show.
1284
01:17:37,704 --> 01:17:39,406
I believe that was
the final sentence.
1285
01:17:39,606 --> 01:17:41,008
So we ended the interview,
1286
01:17:41,208 --> 01:17:43,476
And next thing we heard,
he was deported.
1287
01:17:43,676 --> 01:17:46,479
He thought he was seeing
the writing on the wall.
1288
01:17:46,679 --> 01:17:48,181
I'm the next target now.
1289
01:17:48,381 --> 01:17:50,417
So he decided to grab his toys
and leave
1290
01:17:50,617 --> 01:17:52,485
Before they could kick him out.
1291
01:17:52,685 --> 01:17:55,722
People are saying it's one of
the best records he's ever done,
1292
01:17:55,922 --> 01:17:56,756
And then he left.
1293
01:17:56,956 --> 01:18:00,193
We just put this record out,
and he just split.
1294
01:18:00,393 --> 01:18:02,128
Kofi would come over
every single day
1295
01:18:02,328 --> 01:18:03,230
And play with his dad.
1296
01:18:03,430 --> 01:18:05,132
And then a couple days
before he left,
1297
01:18:05,332 --> 01:18:07,467
Kind of like you
with the cane to your face,
1298
01:18:07,667 --> 01:18:09,569
Ginger gave a verbal cane
to Kofi's face
1299
01:18:09,769 --> 01:18:11,671
And just basically I think
told him,
1300
01:18:11,871 --> 01:18:13,340
"You're a piece-of-shit drummer,
1301
01:18:13,540 --> 01:18:15,842
And you'll never be what I am,
and you just can't get it."
1302
01:18:16,042 --> 01:18:21,080
And that was it...
His way of saying goodbye.
1303
01:18:21,280 --> 01:18:22,549
Well, I asked him.
1304
01:18:22,749 --> 01:18:25,685
I said, "Do you even care about
anything I do or anything?"
1305
01:18:25,885 --> 01:18:27,620
He said, "No."
So I said, "Fine."
1306
01:18:27,820 --> 01:18:28,621
So I got in my car and left.
1307
01:18:28,821 --> 01:18:30,823
That was the last time
I saw him.
1308
01:18:39,466 --> 01:18:42,369
I don't know
if it's his ability to move on
1309
01:18:42,569 --> 01:18:44,504
Or his inability to stay.
1310
01:18:44,704 --> 01:18:49,709
I think he has trouble staying,
and so moving on is his option.
1311
01:18:49,909 --> 01:18:51,544
I went with him
on several of those moves,
1312
01:18:51,744 --> 01:18:53,380
And then the last one,
I decided, "No."
1313
01:18:53,580 --> 01:18:56,249
I'm not up
for one more of these."
1314
01:19:00,520 --> 01:19:03,907
Maybe it goes back
to when his dad died.
1315
01:19:04,107 --> 01:19:06,834
He was just kind of taken away
abruptly,
1316
01:19:07,034 --> 01:19:09,762
And there was nothing
he could do about it.
1317
01:19:10,630 --> 01:19:15,868
The only time I remember
my dad clearly is on the train,
1318
01:19:16,068 --> 01:19:19,406
When he went off
after his last leave.
1319
01:19:21,541 --> 01:19:25,412
And as the train pulled off,
I broke away from my mom
1320
01:19:25,612 --> 01:19:27,414
And went running
down the platform
1321
01:19:27,614 --> 01:19:30,417
After the train, crying.
1322
01:19:32,084 --> 01:19:37,023
It was like I knew
he wasn't coming back.
1323
01:19:39,626 --> 01:19:44,564
* Ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh, ooh *
1324
01:19:44,764 --> 01:19:50,437
* But I can't find my way home *
1325
01:19:50,637 --> 01:19:54,140
* Can't, ooh, ooh, ooh *
1326
01:19:54,340 --> 01:19:55,242
* Ooh, ooh, ooh *
1327
01:19:55,442 --> 01:20:00,630
* But I can't find my way home *
1328
01:20:00,830 --> 01:20:06,127
* Still I can't find
my way home *
1329
01:20:06,327 --> 01:20:10,060
* And I ain't done
nothing wrong *
1330
01:20:10,260 --> 01:20:13,793
* But I can't find my way home *
1331
01:20:13,993 --> 01:20:17,296
20 years ago,
South Africa was the last place
1332
01:20:17,496 --> 01:20:19,415
I would ever have dreamt
of going,
1333
01:20:19,615 --> 01:20:21,534
Because I was so, you know,
appalled
1334
01:20:21,734 --> 01:20:24,036
At the apartheid regime.
1335
01:20:24,236 --> 01:20:26,339
Well, now it's broken up.
1336
01:20:26,539 --> 01:20:28,575
South Africa has joined
the rest of the world.
1337
01:20:28,775 --> 01:20:31,478
What are you gonna do musically
when you get there?
1338
01:20:31,678 --> 01:20:32,812
Do you have plans?
1339
01:20:33,012 --> 01:20:36,916
I have more plans
than you can dream of.
1340
01:20:37,116 --> 01:20:41,020
I mean, South Africa
is very rich musically.
1341
01:20:41,220 --> 01:20:43,038
Sweethearts
have done it all.
1342
01:20:43,238 --> 01:20:44,857
Fast broads, pretty, ambitious,
1343
01:20:45,057 --> 01:20:47,327
And after all the money
they can get out of a guy.
1344
01:20:47,527 --> 01:20:51,631
Those deadly dames leave behind
a trail of dead husbands.
1345
01:20:51,831 --> 01:20:53,766
If she has to kill somebody,
she's going to.
1346
01:20:53,966 --> 01:20:56,236
Real-life femme fatales.
1347
01:20:56,436 --> 01:21:01,607
I've got some really cool music
in my head.
1348
01:21:01,807 --> 01:21:06,979
I tried to do
the polo and jazz thing here.
1349
01:21:07,747 --> 01:21:12,785
But there's not that many
musicians over here.
1350
01:21:12,985 --> 01:21:14,854
But how much of it
is about you playing
1351
01:21:15,054 --> 01:21:17,390
Because it's
what you love doing?
1352
01:21:17,590 --> 01:21:18,725
Well, it depends.
1353
01:21:18,925 --> 01:21:23,563
To have a good time, it depends
who you're playing with.
1354
01:21:24,664 --> 01:21:26,433
I mean, five years ago,
1355
01:21:26,633 --> 01:21:30,570
The Royal Albert Hall gigs
were just fantastic.
1356
01:21:47,787 --> 01:21:50,657
They were just great.
1357
01:21:50,857 --> 01:21:53,293
It was great to play with Eric,
1358
01:21:53,493 --> 01:21:55,929
And it was great to play
with Jack.
1359
01:21:56,129 --> 01:21:58,565
He did the reunion in 2005
with Cream,
1360
01:21:58,765 --> 01:21:59,732
Got a whole bunch of money,
1361
01:21:59,932 --> 01:22:05,404
And he got 24 horses
he imported from the U.K.
1362
01:22:05,604 --> 01:22:08,641
Yeah.
They cost him a fortune.
1363
01:22:08,841 --> 01:22:11,143
I've got 38 horses.
1364
01:22:12,044 --> 01:22:17,650
Horses don't let you down,
nor do dogs.
1365
01:22:17,850 --> 01:22:20,653
They all know who I am.
1366
01:22:20,853 --> 01:22:23,456
He got $5 million or so
from that reunion.
1367
01:22:23,656 --> 01:22:24,891
Now he's broke as shit.
1368
01:22:25,091 --> 01:22:27,827
He's blown all the money, and
he's got nothing to show for it.
1369
01:22:30,463 --> 01:22:34,784
He will go out of his way,
effortwise and timewise
1370
01:22:34,984 --> 01:22:39,105
And moneywise to do everything
for his animals.
1371
01:22:39,305 --> 01:22:42,609
Sometimes I get the idea
that the animals come first
1372
01:22:42,809 --> 01:22:46,145
And then the people.
1373
01:22:46,345 --> 01:22:47,414
* I *
1374
01:22:47,614 --> 01:22:53,052
* Found out today *
1375
01:22:53,486 --> 01:22:57,524
* We're going wrong *
1376
01:23:20,046 --> 01:23:22,749
Do you think that you might
have to go back
1377
01:23:22,949 --> 01:23:24,851
To playing the drums again?
1378
01:23:25,051 --> 01:23:25,985
Why?
1379
01:23:26,185 --> 01:23:28,588
Because the bank might
foreclose on your property.
1380
01:23:28,788 --> 01:23:30,089
And besides, it's who you are.
1381
01:23:30,289 --> 01:23:35,494
Oh, for fuck's sake,
why are we talking this shit?!
1382
01:23:36,062 --> 01:23:40,867
I think he's realizing
that his time really has come
1383
01:23:41,067 --> 01:23:43,670
To finish playing the drums.
1384
01:23:46,338 --> 01:23:49,809
Dogs in general...
Maybe horses as well,
1385
01:23:50,009 --> 01:23:55,414
But dogs specifically know
when it's the end of the path.
1386
01:23:55,614 --> 01:23:56,683
They just give up.
1387
01:23:56,883 --> 01:23:59,986
You know, they know that this is
the end of the road.
1388
01:24:00,186 --> 01:24:02,354
Obviously some of them
have got fight in them.
1389
01:24:02,554 --> 01:24:03,490
Some doesn't.
1390
01:24:03,690 --> 01:24:08,494
But they realize
that they've had their life.
1391
01:24:08,694 --> 01:24:10,363
They won't die here
in front of you.
1392
01:24:10,563 --> 01:24:16,435
They will go underneath a bed,
where it's private, quiet.
1393
01:24:16,635 --> 01:24:22,108
* We're going wrong *
1394
01:24:22,308 --> 01:24:23,876
* Yeah! *
1395
01:24:26,646 --> 01:24:28,881
Thank you.
1396
01:24:35,521 --> 01:24:39,191
You think you can take
your glasses off for me, Ginger?
1397
01:24:40,059 --> 01:24:41,193
Why?
1398
01:24:41,393 --> 01:24:43,730
I'd like to see your eyes.
1399
01:25:06,953 --> 01:25:11,758
I have terrible skepticism
about musicians that die young
1400
01:25:11,958 --> 01:25:14,661
And create legends
which are kind of mythical.
1401
01:25:14,861 --> 01:25:16,596
There's no myth about Ginger.
1402
01:25:16,796 --> 01:25:19,815
You know,
he is exactly what he is.
1403
01:25:20,015 --> 01:25:23,035
And that's the thing
that we value.
1404
01:25:26,839 --> 01:25:28,608
I don't know what he is.
1405
01:25:28,808 --> 01:25:31,343
He's his own person,
and he's great.
1406
01:25:31,543 --> 01:25:34,881
He's definitely the best
Ginger Baker in the world,
1407
01:25:35,081 --> 01:25:37,850
And I love him.
1408
01:25:45,692 --> 01:25:50,897
It was our last day of filming,
and here I am, saying goodbye.
1409
01:25:51,097 --> 01:25:53,132
He said,
"Where are you going now?"
1410
01:25:53,332 --> 01:25:56,803
And I said, "I'm gonna
go talk to these people"
1411
01:25:57,003 --> 01:25:59,271
Who are a part of your life."
1412
01:25:59,471 --> 01:26:01,674
And he was like, "Nah."
1413
01:26:01,874 --> 01:26:02,875
No, you're not."
1414
01:26:03,075 --> 01:26:08,180
And I don't want any of them
on my film!
1415
01:26:09,916 --> 01:26:11,751
Are you really gonna hit me
with the...
1416
01:26:11,951 --> 01:26:13,486
I fucking well am!
1417
01:26:13,686 --> 01:26:16,889
I'm gonna fucking put you
in hospital!
1418
01:26:17,089 --> 01:26:18,490
Why?
Oh, my God!
1419
01:26:18,690 --> 01:26:20,359
Yes!
1420
01:26:21,794 --> 01:26:25,898
Ginger Baker just hit me
in the fucking nose.
1421
01:26:27,934 --> 01:26:29,769
At first I was really pissed.
1422
01:26:29,969 --> 01:26:32,839
Say you're sorry!
No!
1423
01:26:33,472 --> 01:26:38,861
But then I realized
the madman is alive and well,
1424
01:26:39,061 --> 01:26:44,450
With a precise message
to all those who dare enter...
1425
01:26:44,650 --> 01:26:47,854
Beware of Mr. Baker.
1426
01:26:50,957 --> 01:26:53,726
Ginger Baker! Ginger Baker!
1427
01:26:53,926 --> 01:26:56,695
Ginger Baker!
Ginger Baker!
1428
01:26:56,829 --> 01:26:59,899
Ginger Baker!
Ginger Baker!
1429
01:27:00,032 --> 01:27:01,233
Ginger Baker!
1430
01:27:01,433 --> 01:27:03,435
He seems to go through wars
and bombs
1431
01:27:03,635 --> 01:27:07,139
And comes out the other end
unscathed, amazingly.
1432
01:27:07,339 --> 01:27:08,774
And you've got to admire that.
1433
01:27:08,974 --> 01:27:10,209
You've got to admire that,
1434
01:27:10,409 --> 01:27:13,712
That he doesn't ever
kind of give in and go, "Okay."
1435
01:27:15,381 --> 01:27:20,970
The indomitable Ginger Baker
always gets up off the canvas.
1436
01:27:21,170 --> 01:27:26,759
After selling his horses,
his farm, and his Range Rover,
1437
01:27:26,959 --> 01:27:28,160
He goes back on the road
1438
01:27:28,360 --> 01:27:31,764
And to being the one thing
that he's always been.
1439
01:27:47,479 --> 01:27:49,215
Do what you like.
1440
01:27:49,415 --> 01:27:53,152
If you enjoy doing something
and you do it very well,
1441
01:27:53,352 --> 01:27:56,388
You can be successful
and enjoy life.
1442
01:27:56,588 --> 01:27:58,524
I like playing the drums.
1443
01:28:00,927 --> 01:28:04,430
I know what my life's
experiences are,
1444
01:28:04,630 --> 01:28:08,134
And I like to exemplify them
in music.
1445
01:28:08,334 --> 01:28:10,837
Mr. Baker does the same.
1446
01:28:11,037 --> 01:28:13,873
If that makes him
an unpleasant person socially,
1447
01:28:14,073 --> 01:28:17,543
Well, that's exactly
what is required
1448
01:28:17,743 --> 01:28:21,213
For the music from him
to be so superb.
1449
01:28:21,680 --> 01:28:29,155
And I cannot question anyone
with end results that perfect.
1450
01:29:06,525 --> 01:29:11,730
* Don't take
the wrong direction *
1451
01:29:11,930 --> 01:29:14,533
* Passing through *
1452
01:29:16,235 --> 01:29:19,271
This is a Hollywood movie
here, so...
1453
01:29:19,471 --> 01:29:20,072
Oh...
1454
01:29:20,272 --> 01:29:22,274
It's got to be
really dramatic,
1455
01:29:22,474 --> 01:29:25,211
And I need to get you to cry
at a certain point.
1456
01:29:25,411 --> 01:29:26,879
So if you could just cry
right now...
1457
01:29:27,079 --> 01:29:28,514
Oh, yeah.
1458
01:29:28,714 --> 01:29:30,582
You're dumb.
You know that?
1459
01:29:30,782 --> 01:29:31,851
You really are dumb.
1460
01:29:32,051 --> 01:29:36,355
Good God, I'm talking to
a fucking block of moronic wood.
1461
01:29:36,555 --> 01:29:39,791
Just a single tear,
like really slow-motion,
1462
01:29:39,991 --> 01:29:41,193
Down the side of your face.
1463
01:29:41,393 --> 01:29:44,897
If we could just get that shot,
it would be great.
1464
01:29:48,267 --> 01:29:52,204
Trying to explain to a dumb
American is very difficult.
1465
01:29:52,404 --> 01:29:56,142
If a stick had five right ends
and one wrong end,
1466
01:29:56,342 --> 01:29:59,345
You'd get the wrong end
every time.
1467
01:30:01,247 --> 01:30:03,983
I'm crying for you.
1468
01:30:07,719 --> 01:30:09,321
Hello?
1469
01:30:09,521 --> 01:30:12,358
Spring will be a little late
this year.
1470
01:30:12,558 --> 01:30:14,877
Talk about three short blanks.
1471
01:30:15,077 --> 01:30:17,396
You take the biscuit, boy.
1472
01:30:18,797 --> 01:30:21,600
You drive me fucking crazy.
1473
01:30:23,669 --> 01:30:28,607
* For you will hear
no laughter *
1474
01:30:28,807 --> 01:30:31,443
* Nor see the sun *
1475
01:30:32,945 --> 01:30:37,749
* Life will be one disaster *
1476
01:30:37,949 --> 01:30:40,486
* All the way through *
1477
01:30:43,822 --> 01:30:47,593
* No relaxation *
1478
01:30:48,160 --> 01:30:52,231
* No conversation *
1479
01:30:52,864 --> 01:30:55,835
* No variation *
1480
01:30:56,035 --> 01:31:00,039
* In a very dark blue *
1481
01:31:00,239 --> 01:31:05,244
* Blue condition *
1482
01:31:05,444 --> 01:31:10,116
* Don't take
the wrong direction *
1483
01:31:10,316 --> 01:31:13,385
* Passing through *
1484
01:31:14,586 --> 01:31:19,625
* Instead of deep reflection *
1485
01:31:19,825 --> 01:31:22,261
* Of what's true *
1486
01:31:23,795 --> 01:31:27,466
* For it's a combination *
1487
01:31:27,666 --> 01:31:31,337
* Of judgments made by you *
1488
01:31:32,338 --> 01:31:37,009
* That cause a deep dejection *
1489
01:31:37,209 --> 01:31:39,611
* All the way through *
1490
01:31:43,215 --> 01:31:47,186
* No relaxation *
1491
01:31:47,753 --> 01:31:51,623
* No conversation *
1492
01:31:52,258 --> 01:31:55,227
* No variation *
1493
01:31:55,427 --> 01:31:59,431
* In a very dark blue *
1494
01:31:59,631 --> 01:32:05,370
* Blue condition *
1495
01:32:05,570 --> 01:32:10,675
* No relaxation *
1496
01:32:10,875 --> 01:32:14,896
* No conversation *
1497
01:32:15,096 --> 01:32:18,918
* No variation *
1498
01:32:19,118 --> 01:32:25,257
* In a very dark blue *
1499
01:32:25,457 --> 01:32:29,261
* Condition *115317
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