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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:07,000 Downloaded from YTS.MX 2 00:00:08,000 --> 00:00:13,000 Official YIFY movies site: YTS.MX 3 00:00:13,086 --> 00:00:14,180 - There's no doubt about it. 4 00:00:14,180 --> 00:00:18,600 It is the most superior form of music. 5 00:00:18,600 --> 00:00:19,443 Love it or hate it. 6 00:00:19,443 --> 00:00:21,920 When you get to the sheer meat and bones 7 00:00:21,920 --> 00:00:26,310 of what classical music is about, it's everything and more. 8 00:00:26,310 --> 00:00:30,400 It pulls at every emotion you could ever bring to the table. 9 00:00:30,400 --> 00:00:32,534 It transcends everything. 10 00:00:41,450 --> 00:00:44,340 - All the music for which Bach is famous 11 00:00:44,340 --> 00:00:46,130 comes after he's met Anna Magdalena. 12 00:00:46,130 --> 00:00:51,130 Either she was his inspiration or she was involved. 13 00:00:51,600 --> 00:00:55,320 - To have found traces of her writing in documents 14 00:00:55,320 --> 00:00:58,290 where it shouldn't be was very exciting. 15 00:00:58,290 --> 00:01:01,230 Of course, Anna Magdalena was a composer. 16 00:01:01,230 --> 00:01:02,960 - I think the forensics are fantastic. 17 00:01:02,960 --> 00:01:04,540 Martin has definitely succeeded 18 00:01:04,540 --> 00:01:07,950 in putting Anna Magdalena Bach at the scene of the crime. 19 00:01:07,950 --> 00:01:09,640 - I've not seen anything that would diminish 20 00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:11,780 or detract from his findings. 21 00:01:11,780 --> 00:01:15,610 - This opens the gates to a new look 22 00:01:15,610 --> 00:01:17,870 at the whole history of music. 23 00:01:17,870 --> 00:01:19,570 - They wanted to expunge Anna Magdalena 24 00:01:19,570 --> 00:01:21,406 from the history books. 25 00:01:26,410 --> 00:01:29,680 The genius of Bach is not in doubt. 26 00:01:29,680 --> 00:01:32,260 He wrote an extraordinary amount of music, 27 00:01:32,260 --> 00:01:35,750 and some of his pieces have been attributed to others. 28 00:01:35,750 --> 00:01:37,993 But was his wife, Anna Magdalena, 29 00:01:38,860 --> 00:01:41,113 not only his copyist, but a composer? 30 00:01:42,390 --> 00:01:44,830 Using modern forensics, this film looks 31 00:01:44,830 --> 00:01:47,720 into new and controversial concepts: 32 00:01:47,720 --> 00:01:50,520 the reality of his working environment 33 00:01:50,520 --> 00:01:53,100 and even the authenticity of manuscripts 34 00:01:53,100 --> 00:01:55,673 autographed Johann Sebastian Bach. 35 00:02:09,987 --> 00:02:11,120 Distinguished musician 36 00:02:11,120 --> 00:02:15,080 and forensic anthro-musicologist, Professor Martin Jarvis, 37 00:02:15,080 --> 00:02:18,360 has spent 25 years investigating his theory 38 00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:20,843 that Anna Magdalena could have been a composer. 39 00:02:21,880 --> 00:02:24,040 But even though I write music for a living, 40 00:02:24,040 --> 00:02:26,440 I found this hard to accept. 41 00:02:26,440 --> 00:02:28,503 Nevertheless, I was intrigued. 42 00:02:34,930 --> 00:02:37,033 But surely not the Cello Suites? 43 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:42,210 Martin told me he'd found 17 musicological reasons 44 00:02:42,210 --> 00:02:43,510 why they were not by Bach. 45 00:02:45,240 --> 00:02:47,350 - My key motivation was really to try 46 00:02:47,350 --> 00:02:49,020 to come to understand the music. 47 00:02:49,020 --> 00:02:51,300 And it was impossible to understand the music 48 00:02:51,300 --> 00:02:53,650 when I thought it was by Johann Sebastian Bach. 49 00:02:55,636 --> 00:02:57,330 And, of course, the more things 50 00:02:57,330 --> 00:02:59,017 that were thrown up in my way, 51 00:02:59,017 --> 00:03:00,820 the more hurdles I had to climb, 52 00:03:00,820 --> 00:03:02,970 the more I was challenged and the more, 53 00:03:02,970 --> 00:03:05,653 intellectually, I wanted to find a solution. 54 00:03:07,320 --> 00:03:08,900 One vital challenge was 55 00:03:08,900 --> 00:03:11,910 the actual calligraphy of music notation. 56 00:03:11,910 --> 00:03:15,470 Normal handwriting has specific characteristics. 57 00:03:15,470 --> 00:03:17,153 But, does music calligraphy? 58 00:03:18,040 --> 00:03:19,530 Martin discovered the answer in 59 00:03:19,530 --> 00:03:22,280 a paper published in the USA in 1980 60 00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:25,933 by Forensic Document Examiner, Jack R. Calvert. 61 00:03:27,910 --> 00:03:29,250 - No doubt about it. 62 00:03:29,250 --> 00:03:32,450 Habits are there and they're established. 63 00:03:32,450 --> 00:03:34,840 And once they're established people writing 64 00:03:34,840 --> 00:03:36,760 with a quill, or with a pen, 65 00:03:36,760 --> 00:03:40,030 will write music calligraphy in the same way. 66 00:03:40,030 --> 00:03:42,470 You should be able to look at one manuscript and say, 67 00:03:42,470 --> 00:03:45,530 that's written by him or her, or whatever. 68 00:03:45,530 --> 00:03:49,020 Once somebody learnt how to drive a quill 69 00:03:49,020 --> 00:03:51,180 they wrote almost exactly the same 70 00:03:51,180 --> 00:03:52,600 as they do with a normal pen. 71 00:03:52,600 --> 00:03:54,830 The only difference being that, of course, 72 00:03:54,830 --> 00:03:57,500 a quill has to be re-inked a lot 73 00:03:57,500 --> 00:04:00,730 which means there are far more pen lifts 74 00:04:00,730 --> 00:04:02,843 as the person has to re-dip the ink. 75 00:04:04,205 --> 00:04:05,410 Anna Magdalena's role 76 00:04:05,410 --> 00:04:08,340 has always been considered as a copyist. 77 00:04:08,340 --> 00:04:11,120 So can we tell whether she is composing, 78 00:04:11,120 --> 00:04:14,820 copying from her own drafts or from her husband's? 79 00:04:14,820 --> 00:04:18,570 - The curious thing about Anna Magdalena's supposed copies 80 00:04:18,570 --> 00:04:22,210 is that they don't exhibit the kind of slowness 81 00:04:22,210 --> 00:04:24,670 and heaviness that you would normally attribute 82 00:04:24,670 --> 00:04:26,640 with somebody who's trying to copy. 83 00:04:26,640 --> 00:04:29,120 All of them look as if that has flowed 84 00:04:29,120 --> 00:04:31,980 from somebody's brain directly to the paper. 85 00:04:34,500 --> 00:04:36,790 So what Martin's claiming is that Anna 86 00:04:36,790 --> 00:04:41,460 is making fair copies, but she's also making changes. 87 00:04:41,460 --> 00:04:43,713 That she's copying her own work. 88 00:04:45,260 --> 00:04:46,800 At the Sydney Opera House, 89 00:04:46,800 --> 00:04:49,520 he meets harpsichordist Elizabeth Anderson 90 00:04:49,520 --> 00:04:52,680 to discuss the provenance of another famous piece, 91 00:04:52,680 --> 00:04:54,840 the C Major Prelude, which actually 92 00:04:54,840 --> 00:04:56,490 bears a striking resemblance to 93 00:04:56,490 --> 00:04:59,210 the first prelude of the cello suites. 94 00:04:59,210 --> 00:05:01,660 Presenting scientific evidence to musicians 95 00:05:01,660 --> 00:05:04,510 like her just wouldn't be enough. 96 00:05:04,510 --> 00:05:06,330 He had to convince Elizabeth that 97 00:05:06,330 --> 00:05:08,920 his musical instincts were right. 98 00:05:08,920 --> 00:05:10,790 A conundrum he hopes to solve is 99 00:05:10,790 --> 00:05:13,450 the mystery of the five missing bars. 100 00:05:13,450 --> 00:05:16,720 This involves a prelude, handwritten in a date order 101 00:05:16,720 --> 00:05:20,090 that Martin believes to be incorrectly recorded. 102 00:05:20,090 --> 00:05:22,260 - In the 1720 notebook, that first version 103 00:05:22,260 --> 00:05:24,930 of the first prelude, is in her handwriting. 104 00:05:24,930 --> 00:05:28,080 It is not in Bach's handwriting, it is in her handwriting. 105 00:05:28,080 --> 00:05:30,610 And it is obviously not a copy of something 106 00:05:30,610 --> 00:05:31,890 because of the way it's laid out, 107 00:05:31,890 --> 00:05:35,030 the fact that there are corrections and adjustments to it. 108 00:05:35,030 --> 00:05:39,750 So that's a working manuscript which screams out to me 109 00:05:39,750 --> 00:05:43,153 that this is in the hand of the composer, Anna Magdalena. 110 00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:47,560 The prelude shows up in Anna's hand 111 00:05:47,560 --> 00:05:52,053 in a music book dated 1725 with five bars missing. 112 00:05:54,490 --> 00:05:56,703 But could this be work in progress? 113 00:05:57,670 --> 00:05:59,080 - Okay, so the version as it appears 114 00:05:59,080 --> 00:06:01,520 in the Anna Magdalena book of 1725? 115 00:06:01,520 --> 00:06:02,353 - Correct. - That's the one. 116 00:06:02,353 --> 00:06:03,483 - That's the one we're gonna look at. 117 00:06:03,483 --> 00:06:06,009 - That's the one I'm going to play right now. 118 00:06:12,803 --> 00:06:14,340 - It's curious, isn't it? - Yes. 119 00:06:14,340 --> 00:06:17,100 So for me, this is the first draft of it. 120 00:06:17,100 --> 00:06:18,780 An earlier version. 121 00:06:18,780 --> 00:06:21,130 In the 1722 version the missing bars 122 00:06:21,130 --> 00:06:24,040 are now in place, as in the modern version. 123 00:06:24,040 --> 00:06:27,500 So was the 1725 version an earlier draft? 124 00:06:27,500 --> 00:06:29,880 If so, it looks to me as if she's composing. 125 00:06:29,880 --> 00:06:32,025 - Would you like to play it now 126 00:06:32,025 --> 00:06:34,256 with those 5 bars that I added? 127 00:06:43,608 --> 00:06:44,557 Yeah, that's lovely. 128 00:06:44,557 --> 00:06:46,753 So the whole point about the mystery 129 00:06:46,753 --> 00:06:48,070 of the missing 5 bars is, in my view, 130 00:06:48,070 --> 00:06:49,720 they weren't missing at the time. 131 00:06:49,720 --> 00:06:51,930 The perception that they were missing 132 00:06:51,930 --> 00:06:55,280 was to say that Anna Magdalena was incompetent 133 00:06:55,280 --> 00:06:57,613 in some way or other and she'd miscopied it. 134 00:06:58,540 --> 00:07:00,280 - I think the forensics are fantastic. 135 00:07:00,280 --> 00:07:02,340 Martin has definitely succeeded in putting 136 00:07:02,340 --> 00:07:05,043 Anna Magdalena Bach at the scene of the crime, 137 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:10,700 but we can't conclusively prove that she did it. 138 00:07:10,700 --> 00:07:14,810 We can see that it's likely that 139 00:07:14,810 --> 00:07:17,390 one version of the C Major Prelude 140 00:07:17,390 --> 00:07:20,360 was an earlier composition than another. 141 00:07:20,360 --> 00:07:22,230 And we can see that, since they're both 142 00:07:22,230 --> 00:07:24,540 in Anna Magdalena's handwriting, 143 00:07:24,540 --> 00:07:27,980 that it's quite possible that she was the composer 144 00:07:27,980 --> 00:07:31,200 of both versions and the fact that a version 145 00:07:31,200 --> 00:07:35,130 in Bach's handwriting doesn't exist supports that. 146 00:07:35,130 --> 00:07:39,453 So we've got likely and we've got quite possible. 147 00:07:41,457 --> 00:07:43,270 But I wish we had another piece of evidence 148 00:07:43,270 --> 00:07:46,330 because I don't believe that we've got proven. 149 00:07:46,330 --> 00:07:47,983 - I'm sure that the only thing 150 00:07:47,983 --> 00:07:50,220 that would convince most people 151 00:07:50,220 --> 00:07:53,010 would be if I found a letter somewhere 152 00:07:53,010 --> 00:07:55,250 that said, I wrote this piece of music, 153 00:07:55,250 --> 00:07:57,162 signed Anna Magdalena Bach. 154 00:08:01,360 --> 00:08:03,460 But cellist, Tilly Cernitori, 155 00:08:03,460 --> 00:08:06,390 didn't need a signature on a piece of paper. 156 00:08:06,390 --> 00:08:10,680 She's 27 years old, half Japanese, half Italian, 157 00:08:10,680 --> 00:08:12,180 and regarded as one of the world's 158 00:08:12,180 --> 00:08:14,073 most gifted young soloists. 159 00:08:15,010 --> 00:08:17,410 She's won over 20 first prizes 160 00:08:17,410 --> 00:08:20,070 in International Cello Competitions, 161 00:08:20,070 --> 00:08:21,900 including the coveted Medal of 162 00:08:21,900 --> 00:08:24,660 the President of the Republic in Rome. 163 00:08:24,660 --> 00:08:27,523 She's currently training in Vienna to be a conductor. 164 00:08:28,760 --> 00:08:30,670 As a very successful musician, 165 00:08:30,670 --> 00:08:33,440 she took quite a risk by releasing a CD 166 00:08:33,440 --> 00:08:37,010 of the Cello Suites under Anna Magdalena's name. 167 00:08:37,010 --> 00:08:40,520 She's the first cellist in the world to do so. 168 00:08:40,520 --> 00:08:42,780 - Everyone was very much asking me, 169 00:08:42,780 --> 00:08:44,483 are you sure you want to do this? 170 00:08:45,740 --> 00:08:47,460 But you were completely sure? 171 00:08:47,460 --> 00:08:49,250 - Yeah of course, I said, I'm not afraid 172 00:08:49,250 --> 00:08:51,200 because if you do what you believe in 173 00:08:51,200 --> 00:08:53,100 you're never gonna be wrong, you know. 174 00:08:54,560 --> 00:08:56,460 Tilly first performed the Cello Suites 175 00:08:56,460 --> 00:09:00,723 as a tribute to Anna Magdalena on Women's Day 2015. 176 00:09:01,630 --> 00:09:04,470 And all proceeds from the concert and the CD 177 00:09:04,470 --> 00:09:08,393 go to a women's aid organization in her hometown, Florence. 178 00:09:09,480 --> 00:09:11,750 - I think this is a strong message 179 00:09:11,750 --> 00:09:14,250 which is important to bring out. 180 00:09:14,250 --> 00:09:15,670 It's a statement. 181 00:09:15,670 --> 00:09:19,740 I did this because I think there is a big parallel 182 00:09:19,740 --> 00:09:22,730 between the physical oppression of women today 183 00:09:22,730 --> 00:09:26,240 and the oppression which was more spiritual 184 00:09:26,240 --> 00:09:29,680 and philosophical of women composers through the centuries. 185 00:09:29,680 --> 00:09:33,650 So it's like this thing of being 186 00:09:33,650 --> 00:09:36,017 wiped out from history, you know. 187 00:09:40,970 --> 00:09:42,540 However, support can turn up 188 00:09:42,540 --> 00:09:44,900 in the most unlikely of places, 189 00:09:44,900 --> 00:09:47,170 as evidenced by the Deputy Director 190 00:09:47,170 --> 00:09:49,910 of RAM, Doctor Timothy Jones. 191 00:09:49,910 --> 00:09:52,790 - I was fascinated by all the work that he'd done 192 00:09:52,790 --> 00:09:55,240 on the forensics of Bach documents. 193 00:09:55,240 --> 00:09:57,450 There are some pieces by Bach whose attributions 194 00:09:57,450 --> 00:09:59,870 are being questioned very seriously. 195 00:09:59,870 --> 00:10:02,500 And there are attributions to other well-known, 196 00:10:02,500 --> 00:10:04,680 even canonic composers down the years 197 00:10:04,680 --> 00:10:06,900 where we might question whether they wrote them or 198 00:10:06,900 --> 00:10:10,530 whether female relatives or women in their creative circle, 199 00:10:10,530 --> 00:10:13,100 were responsible for some of the music. 200 00:10:13,100 --> 00:10:14,950 The greatness of the music doesn't diminish 201 00:10:14,950 --> 00:10:17,373 if the attribution changes one jot. 202 00:10:18,250 --> 00:10:20,750 So what's so unsettling about Mrs. Bach? 203 00:10:21,770 --> 00:10:24,410 Martin's colleague at Charles Darwin University, 204 00:10:24,410 --> 00:10:27,543 Historian Dr. Alan Powell, had one theory. 205 00:10:28,630 --> 00:10:30,480 - There will always be those who find 206 00:10:30,480 --> 00:10:33,640 themselves threatened by any possible change. 207 00:10:33,640 --> 00:10:35,310 And this one's particularly threatening 208 00:10:35,310 --> 00:10:38,802 because it involves a woman. 209 00:10:41,360 --> 00:10:43,530 Myleene Klass is a musician, 210 00:10:43,530 --> 00:10:45,583 model and mother of two. 211 00:10:50,400 --> 00:10:53,400 She understands the challenges only too well. 212 00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:56,680 - As a woman working in the industry that I work in now 213 00:10:57,888 --> 00:11:01,170 you have to be exceptionally versatile. 214 00:11:01,170 --> 00:11:02,540 Every single thing that I do, 215 00:11:02,540 --> 00:11:05,890 even if it doesn't look directly related to classical music, 216 00:11:05,890 --> 00:11:07,580 it's because I'm a classical musician 217 00:11:07,580 --> 00:11:08,480 that I can do these things. 218 00:11:08,480 --> 00:11:11,623 I learnt to diversify and that's the key to classical music. 219 00:11:11,623 --> 00:11:13,380 It's the key to surviving, 220 00:11:13,380 --> 00:11:15,833 and that's Anna Magdalena through and through. 221 00:11:17,200 --> 00:11:19,050 You do what you have to do to get by. 222 00:11:19,050 --> 00:11:21,343 And if that's what the mark for women is, 223 00:11:23,500 --> 00:11:25,970 then yeah, that's your woman, that's Anna Magdalena. 224 00:11:25,970 --> 00:11:27,620 That's a little bit of all of us. 225 00:11:28,610 --> 00:11:31,300 The Fraunhofer Institute in Germany 226 00:11:31,300 --> 00:11:33,613 is well known for Digital Music Technology. 227 00:11:34,940 --> 00:11:38,100 Martin Jarvis traveled there to meet Christof Weiss, 228 00:11:38,100 --> 00:11:40,530 a Digital Analyst who made comparisons 229 00:11:40,530 --> 00:11:43,550 between the Cello Suites and the violin and piano works 230 00:11:43,550 --> 00:11:45,763 and got some fascinating results. 231 00:11:47,500 --> 00:11:49,920 - The movements differ more than, 232 00:11:49,920 --> 00:11:53,450 for example, do the movements of the violin solos. 233 00:11:53,450 --> 00:11:58,230 For example, the violin pieces are matching so good 234 00:11:58,230 --> 00:12:01,980 and the Cello Suites, at least for some movements, do not. 235 00:12:05,260 --> 00:12:08,950 In strictly technical terms, Martin is right. 236 00:12:08,950 --> 00:12:11,900 This is clear evidence that the musical structure 237 00:12:11,900 --> 00:12:16,053 of the Cello Suites is different to other Bach compositions. 238 00:12:17,350 --> 00:12:18,840 So what was it that led Tilly 239 00:12:18,840 --> 00:12:21,240 to challenge the authorship of the Suites? 240 00:12:21,240 --> 00:12:23,380 What made her suspect that Anna's involvement 241 00:12:23,380 --> 00:12:25,323 was more than originally thought? 242 00:12:27,450 --> 00:12:29,890 - When I started to study the Bach Suites 243 00:12:29,890 --> 00:12:31,530 I felt it was something different. 244 00:12:31,530 --> 00:12:34,410 Of course, at the time I couldn't say it was Anna Magdalena 245 00:12:34,410 --> 00:12:38,060 because I had no idea about her, 246 00:12:38,060 --> 00:12:40,793 but I had some kind of feeling. 247 00:12:43,460 --> 00:12:48,100 The six suites are a kind of large spectrum of emotions 248 00:12:48,100 --> 00:12:50,850 and they're very different from each other, you know. 249 00:12:50,850 --> 00:12:53,160 Every suite for me has a different character. 250 00:12:53,160 --> 00:12:56,550 It's like meeting six different people. 251 00:12:56,550 --> 00:13:01,120 And, yeah, I think this contrast 252 00:13:01,120 --> 00:13:03,670 of feelings and emotion are very 253 00:13:03,670 --> 00:13:05,583 much typical of a woman, also. 254 00:13:08,710 --> 00:13:10,080 As a next step, I decided 255 00:13:10,080 --> 00:13:12,000 to visit the famous viola soloist, 256 00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:14,453 Bruno Giuranna, at his home near Venice. 257 00:13:15,710 --> 00:13:18,120 He's performed with many of the world's great musicians, 258 00:13:18,120 --> 00:13:21,090 including Karajan and Barbarolli. 259 00:13:21,090 --> 00:13:22,680 He was also a former professor 260 00:13:22,680 --> 00:13:25,310 at the Hochschule fur Musik in Berlin, 261 00:13:25,310 --> 00:13:27,500 and International Chair at the Royal Academy 262 00:13:27,500 --> 00:13:28,533 of Music in London. 263 00:13:29,670 --> 00:13:32,090 Significantly, he's made a lifetime study 264 00:13:32,090 --> 00:13:33,650 of the Cello Suites and is about 265 00:13:33,650 --> 00:13:35,550 to bring out his second edition, 266 00:13:35,550 --> 00:13:38,453 after more detailed study of all available manuscripts. 267 00:13:39,960 --> 00:13:41,630 So I'd like his opinion on how 268 00:13:41,630 --> 00:13:44,583 they compare musically to Bach's other Suites. 269 00:13:48,940 --> 00:13:51,250 - The other pieces that I know well, 270 00:13:51,250 --> 00:13:55,240 because I studied them, are the Sonatas and Partitas. 271 00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:58,740 I always felt that in the Cello Suites, 272 00:13:58,740 --> 00:14:02,560 more interpretation is necessary 273 00:14:02,560 --> 00:14:05,810 in order to produce a decent performance 274 00:14:05,810 --> 00:14:09,977 than in the Sonatas and Partitas. 275 00:14:11,730 --> 00:14:15,933 The music itself seems to me to be more human. 276 00:14:22,356 --> 00:14:23,802 They are fantastic music. 277 00:14:23,802 --> 00:14:27,260 They are the greatest pieces of music 278 00:14:27,260 --> 00:14:31,640 and they have this quality that allows you 279 00:14:31,640 --> 00:14:35,710 to spend a whole life working on them 280 00:14:35,710 --> 00:14:37,663 and always discovering something. 281 00:14:43,480 --> 00:14:45,740 - I am talking actually about my instinct 282 00:14:45,740 --> 00:14:49,640 because, of course, I can feel this works more near to me. 283 00:14:49,640 --> 00:14:52,240 And, as I'm a woman, I think that a work 284 00:14:52,240 --> 00:14:55,363 by a woman can maybe talk more to me. 285 00:14:57,340 --> 00:15:00,620 But, of course, it's also a matter of sensitivity, 286 00:15:00,620 --> 00:15:03,263 of musicality of the piece itself. 287 00:15:07,490 --> 00:15:09,970 - I can sense the possibility that 288 00:15:09,970 --> 00:15:12,680 some suites have been written by Anna Magdalena, 289 00:15:12,680 --> 00:15:15,130 especially with the distance of centuries. 290 00:15:15,130 --> 00:15:18,783 From whom did God borrow the hand for writing? 291 00:15:23,070 --> 00:15:26,450 - She's only known because she was the second wife 292 00:15:26,450 --> 00:15:29,480 of him and she was a singer, period. 293 00:15:29,480 --> 00:15:31,750 Maybe she didn't write many things, 294 00:15:31,750 --> 00:15:34,430 but she was actually a composer, you know. 295 00:15:34,430 --> 00:15:35,740 But that's something which also 296 00:15:35,740 --> 00:15:38,097 happened to other women in history. 297 00:15:38,097 --> 00:15:40,463 They were just wiped out from the history books. 298 00:15:51,450 --> 00:15:52,660 Martin's evaluation 299 00:15:52,660 --> 00:15:55,370 needs scientific corroboration. 300 00:15:55,370 --> 00:15:58,580 U.S. based Heidi Harralson is a published author 301 00:15:58,580 --> 00:16:02,510 and respected professor in forensic document examination. 302 00:16:02,510 --> 00:16:05,670 She authenticates important historical documents, 303 00:16:05,670 --> 00:16:09,350 works of art, graffiti and symbolic script. 304 00:16:09,350 --> 00:16:11,340 Recently, as an expert witness, 305 00:16:11,340 --> 00:16:14,183 she re-examined Kurt Cobain's suicide note. 306 00:16:16,050 --> 00:16:19,100 Her unbiased opinion of disputed manuscripts 307 00:16:19,100 --> 00:16:20,173 will be crucial. 308 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:24,180 - I am not a music scholar. 309 00:16:24,180 --> 00:16:25,460 I'm a document examiner. 310 00:16:25,460 --> 00:16:27,330 So, from my perspective, 311 00:16:27,330 --> 00:16:29,650 I don't care if Johann Sebastian Bach 312 00:16:29,650 --> 00:16:32,020 wrote them or if his wife wrote them. 313 00:16:32,020 --> 00:16:34,570 That's irrelevant to me. 314 00:16:34,570 --> 00:16:39,440 The whole point is to use scientific methods 315 00:16:39,440 --> 00:16:42,893 to figure out who actually did the writing on the document. 316 00:16:44,130 --> 00:16:47,160 - I'm a full-time composer and a mother of three 317 00:16:47,160 --> 00:16:48,930 and I'm aware the lack of role models 318 00:16:48,930 --> 00:16:51,130 has been an issue for me in the past. 319 00:16:51,130 --> 00:16:54,100 In the history of music women are pretty much invisible. 320 00:16:54,100 --> 00:16:55,800 Could that have made me skeptical? 321 00:16:57,450 --> 00:16:59,450 I was quite shocked at my initial reaction 322 00:16:59,450 --> 00:17:02,300 which was, well, she couldn't have written it. 323 00:17:02,300 --> 00:17:04,350 And then I looked at that reaction and I realized, 324 00:17:04,350 --> 00:17:06,023 that was because, even for me, 325 00:17:06,023 --> 00:17:07,970 that was because she was a woman. 326 00:17:07,970 --> 00:17:12,000 And there is no canon of women composers 327 00:17:12,000 --> 00:17:14,010 and there are no role models. 328 00:17:14,010 --> 00:17:16,910 I started composing quite naturally at the age of four 329 00:17:16,910 --> 00:17:19,200 and I'm sure a little boy would have done the same. 330 00:17:19,200 --> 00:17:21,070 There's no gender difference. 331 00:17:21,070 --> 00:17:23,510 There's something that happens in perception 332 00:17:23,510 --> 00:17:25,390 that tells little girls that this 333 00:17:25,390 --> 00:17:27,420 isn't something that they can do. 334 00:17:27,420 --> 00:17:29,100 These things go very deep. 335 00:17:29,100 --> 00:17:31,450 - Is it really that hard to believe or digest? 336 00:17:31,450 --> 00:17:32,370 Absolutely not! 337 00:17:32,370 --> 00:17:34,040 It's happening even now. 338 00:17:34,040 --> 00:17:37,230 If you look at the ratio of female composers 339 00:17:37,230 --> 00:17:40,030 to male composers who are working in the arena. 340 00:17:40,030 --> 00:17:43,083 I'd say it's not far off from what it was even then. 341 00:17:48,980 --> 00:17:51,670 At Glasgow University Martin delved 342 00:17:51,670 --> 00:17:54,140 into the psychology of women in music, 343 00:17:54,140 --> 00:17:56,480 including historical prejudices, 344 00:17:56,480 --> 00:18:00,730 with Professor John Butt, a global expert on J.S. Bach. 345 00:18:00,730 --> 00:18:03,630 - Many people are still afraid, 346 00:18:03,630 --> 00:18:07,450 or certainly not keen, 347 00:18:07,450 --> 00:18:10,826 to acknowledge that women can be just as creative as men. 348 00:18:10,826 --> 00:18:13,280 And the problem is that quite often, 349 00:18:13,280 --> 00:18:15,100 they've not been given the opportunities to be so. 350 00:18:15,100 --> 00:18:18,182 Anna Magdalena studies have only really just begun. 351 00:18:18,182 --> 00:18:19,740 She seems to have been somewhat neglected. 352 00:18:19,740 --> 00:18:22,530 - I feel now that we do such disservice 353 00:18:22,530 --> 00:18:23,960 to classical musicians. 354 00:18:23,960 --> 00:18:26,170 It's like we almost canonize them. 355 00:18:26,170 --> 00:18:28,370 We make them into these saints 356 00:18:28,370 --> 00:18:29,720 and the reason they could write the way 357 00:18:29,720 --> 00:18:31,760 they could is 'cause they weren't saints. 358 00:18:31,760 --> 00:18:34,160 - I suppose there's a certain degree of shock 359 00:18:34,160 --> 00:18:36,536 when you present certain aspects of your work. 360 00:18:36,536 --> 00:18:37,910 It's almost a sort of a pious reaction, 361 00:18:37,910 --> 00:18:39,873 that you're violating a religion. 362 00:18:40,910 --> 00:18:43,840 My view of Western culture, 363 00:18:43,840 --> 00:18:45,620 particularly classical music culture, 364 00:18:45,620 --> 00:18:48,750 is that it's taken over some of the trappings of religion. 365 00:18:48,750 --> 00:18:50,770 Therefore, people, when they're dealing with it, 366 00:18:50,770 --> 00:18:53,500 sometimes actually behave as if you were 367 00:18:53,500 --> 00:18:56,150 talking about one of their religions. 368 00:18:56,150 --> 00:18:58,780 The emphasis on The Great Master means 369 00:18:58,780 --> 00:19:01,330 that women composers have to find self-assurance 370 00:19:01,330 --> 00:19:04,780 against a historical background that excludes them. 371 00:19:04,780 --> 00:19:07,433 And women's work certainly wasn't valued as highly. 372 00:19:08,840 --> 00:19:11,940 What's more, if Martin's research challenges 373 00:19:11,940 --> 00:19:15,160 the very autographs on Bach documents, 374 00:19:15,160 --> 00:19:17,160 it will devalue manuscripts held 375 00:19:17,160 --> 00:19:19,661 by collectors all over the world. 376 00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:28,480 Heidi met up with Martin, 377 00:19:28,480 --> 00:19:31,253 both eager to press on with research work in Leipzig, 378 00:19:32,560 --> 00:19:34,950 but they hit a serious problem. 379 00:19:34,950 --> 00:19:37,580 They were banned from access to research materials 380 00:19:37,580 --> 00:19:39,850 held at the Bach archive. 381 00:19:39,850 --> 00:19:41,290 Then, it got worse. 382 00:19:41,290 --> 00:19:44,340 Senior staff there also refused to give interviews 383 00:19:44,340 --> 00:19:46,743 or discuss any of Martin's theories. 384 00:19:47,650 --> 00:19:48,767 - Well, I'm very surprised 385 00:19:48,767 --> 00:19:51,163 and very disappointed that they banned us. 386 00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:54,920 They have much to gain from what I've discovered 387 00:19:54,920 --> 00:19:57,270 and I can't see what they've got to lose, to be honest. 388 00:19:57,270 --> 00:19:58,700 - The whole point of an archive is 389 00:19:58,700 --> 00:20:01,600 to give scholars or researchers, 390 00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:06,230 access to documents to study and for research purposes. 391 00:20:06,230 --> 00:20:09,750 And so, I find that very disappointing and disheartening. 392 00:20:09,750 --> 00:20:12,720 However, this unexpected delay allowed Martin 393 00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:16,902 to share some relevant facts and conjectures with Heidi. 394 00:20:20,440 --> 00:20:22,430 - The Toccata and Fugue in D-Minor 395 00:20:22,430 --> 00:20:24,713 was one of his most celebrated works. 396 00:20:25,900 --> 00:20:28,670 Now, most Bach experts agree that it was written 397 00:20:28,670 --> 00:20:31,713 by his pupil, Johann Ludwig Krebs. 398 00:20:33,040 --> 00:20:35,453 So what else wasn't written by Mr. Bach? 399 00:20:38,210 --> 00:20:40,660 And why should a Bach composition attributed 400 00:20:40,660 --> 00:20:43,020 to one writer be acceptable 401 00:20:43,020 --> 00:20:45,513 and another attribution heretical? 402 00:20:46,400 --> 00:20:47,833 Simply because it's a woman? 403 00:20:49,570 --> 00:20:53,670 It's just one of those professions that computes as male, 404 00:20:53,670 --> 00:20:57,500 like surgeon, electrician; composer equals man. 405 00:20:57,500 --> 00:20:59,980 If you look in the Grove Dictionary of Music, 406 00:20:59,980 --> 00:21:02,680 even the most recent one, you look up Bach 407 00:21:02,680 --> 00:21:04,350 and the family tree is there 408 00:21:04,350 --> 00:21:06,823 and all the women have been wiped out. 409 00:21:09,920 --> 00:21:13,590 There are also question marks about Bach's life story. 410 00:21:13,590 --> 00:21:17,060 His first biography wasn't written until 1802, 411 00:21:17,060 --> 00:21:21,403 52 years after his death, by biographer Nikolaus Forkel. 412 00:21:22,400 --> 00:21:25,230 But much of what we believe about Bach today 413 00:21:25,230 --> 00:21:27,980 was based on information given to Forkel 414 00:21:27,980 --> 00:21:31,350 by Bach's son, Carl Phillip Emanuel. 415 00:21:31,350 --> 00:21:35,040 - It was C.P. Bach who actually invented the story 416 00:21:35,040 --> 00:21:35,873 of his father's life, you know. 417 00:21:35,873 --> 00:21:38,050 He was very, very important in terms 418 00:21:38,050 --> 00:21:40,500 of putting the obituary together and then, 419 00:21:40,500 --> 00:21:43,570 equally, if not more important, in informing Forkel. 420 00:21:43,570 --> 00:21:45,550 So you could say that C.P. Bach 421 00:21:45,550 --> 00:21:48,463 was one of the first Bach spin doctors. 422 00:21:49,440 --> 00:21:50,880 - And I said, who wrote these? 423 00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:53,268 That's the first thing you'd ask as a historian. 424 00:21:53,268 --> 00:21:55,020 And you find it's the followers of Bach 425 00:21:55,020 --> 00:21:57,183 and the family of Bach who have written them. 426 00:21:57,183 --> 00:21:59,280 So they're immediately suspect in the eyes of an historian. 427 00:21:59,280 --> 00:22:01,830 Anything that's written by the family or friends 428 00:22:01,830 --> 00:22:04,180 you have to look beyond that to find the truth. 429 00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:07,820 So has a biased and possibly 430 00:22:07,820 --> 00:22:10,230 distorted view of J.S. Bach's life 431 00:22:10,230 --> 00:22:13,113 and work become historical fact? 432 00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:18,180 Professor Melanie Unseld is an historian whose specialty 433 00:22:18,180 --> 00:22:21,534 is family life in the early 18th century. 434 00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:24,537 The focus on him 435 00:22:24,537 --> 00:22:26,770 as an individual composer, standing alone, 436 00:22:26,770 --> 00:22:29,710 is also the picture that we have of him today. 437 00:22:29,710 --> 00:22:31,410 A picture of Bach which has come 438 00:22:31,410 --> 00:22:34,050 down to us from the 19th century. 439 00:22:34,050 --> 00:22:37,340 And it is also this process within the culture 440 00:22:37,340 --> 00:22:39,320 of remembrance, in which everyone 441 00:22:39,320 --> 00:22:43,730 around him tends to be superseded by him as an individual, 442 00:22:43,730 --> 00:22:47,205 by his personality, and are then forgotten. 443 00:22:48,200 --> 00:22:49,910 But not by Martin Jarvis 444 00:22:49,910 --> 00:22:51,630 who had already made the transition 445 00:22:51,630 --> 00:22:54,660 from musician to forensic detective. 446 00:22:54,660 --> 00:22:57,060 So what's the story there? 447 00:22:57,060 --> 00:22:58,670 It's in the genes. 448 00:22:58,670 --> 00:23:01,960 His late father, Superintendant Bernard Jarvis, 449 00:23:01,960 --> 00:23:04,453 was a senior police officer in Wales. 450 00:23:05,700 --> 00:23:07,110 - He became the head of Special Branch. 451 00:23:07,110 --> 00:23:09,763 My father taught me trust nobody. 452 00:23:11,350 --> 00:23:13,563 Don't trust anything that you're told. 453 00:23:14,670 --> 00:23:17,830 You need to examine what's been said and know, 454 00:23:17,830 --> 00:23:20,460 to know that it's true and that's probably 455 00:23:20,460 --> 00:23:22,970 the most important lesson I learnt in my life. 456 00:23:22,970 --> 00:23:25,004 Sleuthing is in the DNA, really. 457 00:23:26,270 --> 00:23:27,900 He desperately needed examples 458 00:23:27,900 --> 00:23:31,683 of musical calligraphy and handwriting proven to be hers. 459 00:23:33,340 --> 00:23:35,480 Then, he unearthed a petition written 460 00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:37,610 by Anna to the Leipzig council 461 00:23:37,610 --> 00:23:40,060 seeking child maintenance support shortly 462 00:23:40,060 --> 00:23:42,030 after her husband's death in 1750. 463 00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:47,450 - I suddenly realized that if I had 464 00:23:47,450 --> 00:23:50,450 an example of Anna Magdalena's handwriting 465 00:23:50,450 --> 00:23:52,860 and an example of her music calligraphy, 466 00:23:52,860 --> 00:23:56,670 surely if I then could find places where 467 00:23:56,670 --> 00:23:59,620 her music calligraphy and handwriting were 468 00:23:59,620 --> 00:24:01,790 where they shouldn't be then I would 469 00:24:01,790 --> 00:24:03,613 be able to prise open the door. 470 00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:06,680 This petition was exactly 471 00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:09,530 what Martin was looking for; a large sample 472 00:24:09,530 --> 00:24:12,570 of Anna's writing, written with care. 473 00:24:12,570 --> 00:24:14,870 It meant he could deconstruct her writing 474 00:24:14,870 --> 00:24:17,120 and compare it to other manuscripts. 475 00:24:17,120 --> 00:24:18,813 It was an exciting breakthrough. 476 00:24:27,354 --> 00:24:30,220 After Martin found Anna's petition to the council, 477 00:24:30,220 --> 00:24:33,580 two more documents dated 1713, 478 00:24:33,580 --> 00:24:36,840 the Weimar manuscripts, were discovered. 479 00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:41,600 Martin found evidence of Anna's hand in both documents. 480 00:24:41,600 --> 00:24:46,093 A canon and an aria, a song for soprano and strings. 481 00:24:47,650 --> 00:24:51,313 But why was the discovery of those documents so important? 482 00:24:52,960 --> 00:24:56,160 In 1713 Bach's musical patron 483 00:24:56,160 --> 00:24:59,800 was Duke Wilhelm Ernst in Weimar. 484 00:24:59,800 --> 00:25:03,150 It was the Duke's 52nd birthday and VIP's 485 00:25:03,150 --> 00:25:06,800 from far and wide would have attended the celebrations. 486 00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:09,550 Consequently, it's very likely that Anna 487 00:25:09,550 --> 00:25:11,870 made the 50 mile journey from the family home 488 00:25:11,870 --> 00:25:15,250 in Zeitz to Weimar with her parents. 489 00:25:15,250 --> 00:25:17,570 Anna was only 12 years old then, 490 00:25:17,570 --> 00:25:21,410 but Bach scholars say they didn't meet until she was 20. 491 00:25:21,410 --> 00:25:25,090 - The handwriting on that document is, 492 00:25:25,090 --> 00:25:27,440 at the very least, in part Anna Magdalena's, 493 00:25:27,440 --> 00:25:30,630 if not entirely, and, significantly, 494 00:25:30,630 --> 00:25:32,793 the music calligraphy is hers. 495 00:25:34,310 --> 00:25:37,220 The second piece that was found in Weimar, of course, 496 00:25:37,220 --> 00:25:40,790 was found in a box which hadn't been opened since 1713. 497 00:25:54,910 --> 00:25:56,210 The original manuscript 498 00:25:56,210 --> 00:25:58,320 of the song, "Alles Mit Gott", 499 00:25:58,320 --> 00:26:02,020 was held in the Duchess Amalia Library in Weimar. 500 00:26:02,020 --> 00:26:05,090 Fortunately, it had been removed for examination 501 00:26:05,090 --> 00:26:10,090 before a serious fire in 2005 destroyed 50,000 books 502 00:26:10,150 --> 00:26:12,470 and a thousand hand written notes 503 00:26:12,470 --> 00:26:14,600 reflecting the music culture in Weimar 504 00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:17,410 in the 18th and 19th centuries. 505 00:26:17,410 --> 00:26:19,890 Who knows how many other priceless documents 506 00:26:19,890 --> 00:26:23,720 were lost forever that might have helped Martin's research. 507 00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:25,330 While waiting for official permission 508 00:26:25,330 --> 00:26:27,460 to examine the original manuscript 509 00:26:27,460 --> 00:26:30,190 he looked at a high quality facsimile. 510 00:26:30,190 --> 00:26:33,120 - No shadow of doubt in my mind that the aria 511 00:26:33,120 --> 00:26:34,903 is in Anna Magdalena's handwriting. 512 00:26:36,780 --> 00:26:40,860 What it proves is that the handwriting of Anna Magdalena, 513 00:26:40,860 --> 00:26:44,210 is in places where tradition says it shouldn't be, 514 00:26:44,210 --> 00:26:46,186 which means that the relationship, 515 00:26:46,186 --> 00:26:48,015 historically, between Anna Magdalena 516 00:26:48,015 --> 00:26:50,860 and Johann Sebastian cannot be as we have assumed. 517 00:26:50,860 --> 00:26:53,740 - When you suddenly tip it and you think, 518 00:26:53,740 --> 00:26:55,120 well, hang on, if this was written 519 00:26:55,120 --> 00:26:58,840 by a woman the approach would be completely different 520 00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:01,330 and people are uncomfortable with that. 521 00:27:01,330 --> 00:27:04,293 The fact that the revelation's come up now 522 00:27:04,293 --> 00:27:07,130 that it has been written by a woman, 523 00:27:07,130 --> 00:27:08,260 makes perfect sense to me. 524 00:27:08,260 --> 00:27:10,093 I think it's made me love Bach more. 525 00:27:10,950 --> 00:27:14,270 In Leipzig, Martin shares his findings with Heidi, 526 00:27:14,270 --> 00:27:16,160 using comparisons with calligraphy 527 00:27:16,160 --> 00:27:19,120 from a rare example of Anna's correspondence. 528 00:27:19,120 --> 00:27:23,780 - The Aria discovered in 2005 and the Canon for Four Voices 529 00:27:23,780 --> 00:27:26,290 were probably written by Anna Magdalena 530 00:27:26,290 --> 00:27:28,867 and certainly not written by Johann Sebastian. 531 00:27:28,867 --> 00:27:30,720 - And your premise that it's not written 532 00:27:30,720 --> 00:27:33,600 by Johann Sebastian is based upon on your research 533 00:27:33,600 --> 00:27:35,690 and looking at the handwriting characteristics? 534 00:27:35,690 --> 00:27:36,523 Yes, absolutely. 535 00:27:36,523 --> 00:27:38,470 - And you could eliminate Maria Barbara, 536 00:27:38,470 --> 00:27:41,277 his first wife, because she was already deceased? 537 00:27:41,277 --> 00:27:42,436 - That's correct, yes. 538 00:27:42,436 --> 00:27:43,490 - So there's only two possible writers 539 00:27:43,490 --> 00:27:46,060 that could have written those particular documents 540 00:27:46,060 --> 00:27:48,167 and that would have been Mr. or Mrs. Bach. 541 00:27:48,167 --> 00:27:49,000 - Yes. 542 00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:50,490 - In my examination of that document 543 00:27:50,490 --> 00:27:53,250 I found fundamental differences 544 00:27:53,250 --> 00:27:55,510 in Johann Sebastian Bach's writing 545 00:27:55,510 --> 00:27:58,043 in comparison to that particular document. 546 00:27:59,100 --> 00:28:02,400 And I found several handwriting characteristics 547 00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:06,950 that I thought were individualizing to her writing 548 00:28:06,950 --> 00:28:08,740 that would support the proposition 549 00:28:08,740 --> 00:28:10,340 that she is, indeed, the writer. 550 00:28:11,420 --> 00:28:12,320 - Good, thank you. 551 00:28:13,260 --> 00:28:15,900 Tilly Cernitori was a child prodigy, 552 00:28:15,900 --> 00:28:18,840 playing the cello proficiently at only nine. 553 00:28:18,840 --> 00:28:21,370 We believe that Bach began collaborating musically 554 00:28:21,370 --> 00:28:23,653 with Anna Magdalena when she was 12. 555 00:28:24,510 --> 00:28:27,423 So, is it possible that Anna was also a child prodigy? 556 00:28:28,470 --> 00:28:31,280 - There are child prodigies today, 557 00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:33,223 so why not in the past? 558 00:28:34,150 --> 00:28:36,000 My next stop is the Middle East, 559 00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:38,793 to catch up with a young English/Israeli composer. 560 00:28:39,750 --> 00:28:41,610 She's about to hear her work performed 561 00:28:41,610 --> 00:28:45,128 at the Tel Aviv Opera House and she's here for rehearsals. 562 00:28:46,540 --> 00:28:49,920 The entire Deutscher family; father Guy, 563 00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:52,860 mother Janie, and younger daughter Helen, 564 00:28:52,860 --> 00:28:56,100 are all gathered here for a very special occasion: 565 00:28:56,100 --> 00:28:58,563 the premiere of Alma's new opera. 566 00:28:59,660 --> 00:29:03,570 A pianist at two, violinist at four 567 00:29:03,570 --> 00:29:07,260 and composer for full symphony orchestra at six, 568 00:29:07,260 --> 00:29:09,803 she's still only 10 years old. 569 00:29:10,690 --> 00:29:15,380 - I've just finished composing my whole opera, 570 00:29:15,380 --> 00:29:19,687 Cinderella, and it's going to be put on in a few days. 571 00:29:22,090 --> 00:29:24,400 I started composing when I was four, 572 00:29:24,400 --> 00:29:27,330 so I was very interested in how Alma created music, 573 00:29:27,330 --> 00:29:28,960 to see if there were any common factors 574 00:29:28,960 --> 00:29:31,863 at play relative to our lives and experiences. 575 00:29:33,110 --> 00:29:37,400 - I can't just press a button and get an idea, a melody. 576 00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:40,510 I usually get it when I'm resting. 577 00:29:40,510 --> 00:29:43,400 For instance, before I fall asleep 578 00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:44,960 or just when I'm waking up. 579 00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:47,863 Also, when I'm skipping and melodies pour into my head. 580 00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:51,805 Also, when I'm improvising at the piano 581 00:29:51,805 --> 00:29:56,805 and then I hear sometimes a human voice singing in my head, 582 00:29:57,760 --> 00:30:00,596 or a violin, or a whole orchestra. 583 00:30:07,470 --> 00:30:10,520 But where do those human voices come from? 584 00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:12,600 I was curious about the building blocks 585 00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:15,670 behind Alma's compositional skills. 586 00:30:15,670 --> 00:30:18,750 - I have an imaginary land called Transylvanian. 587 00:30:18,750 --> 00:30:22,590 Inside it are also lots of imaginary composers 588 00:30:22,590 --> 00:30:25,380 and musicians and sometimes, from the best of them, 589 00:30:25,380 --> 00:30:28,780 I steal music from them and use it as my own. 590 00:30:28,780 --> 00:30:30,087 So, there are lots of composers 591 00:30:30,087 --> 00:30:32,010 and some of the best ones are Anton 592 00:30:32,010 --> 00:30:35,470 and Yellowsink and Shell and Flara 593 00:30:36,350 --> 00:30:39,850 and Bluegold and Greensilver. 594 00:30:39,850 --> 00:30:44,490 Usually my most beautiful melodies come from them. 595 00:30:44,490 --> 00:30:46,400 I can imagine J.S. Bach spotting 596 00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:48,000 the potential of Anna Magdalena, 597 00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:50,343 at the age of 12, as we now suspect. 598 00:30:51,210 --> 00:30:52,720 It seems to me she could well have been 599 00:30:52,720 --> 00:30:54,863 unusually accomplished for her age. 600 00:30:55,958 --> 00:31:00,380 Alma's parents are musicians and she's home educated. 601 00:31:00,380 --> 00:31:02,270 Anna would have been, too, 602 00:31:02,270 --> 00:31:04,453 and her father and uncle were musicians. 603 00:31:05,640 --> 00:31:07,100 What does Alma think of a time 604 00:31:07,100 --> 00:31:09,490 when women were prevented from performing 605 00:31:09,490 --> 00:31:11,493 or being credited as composers? 606 00:31:12,744 --> 00:31:14,670 - 300 years ago then women weren't, 607 00:31:14,670 --> 00:31:17,512 and girls weren't, encouraged to be composers, 608 00:31:17,512 --> 00:31:18,890 weren't allowed to be composers. 609 00:31:18,890 --> 00:31:20,960 And I think I would be quite angry and frustrated. 610 00:31:20,960 --> 00:31:23,820 I wouldn't have been able to compose. 611 00:31:23,820 --> 00:31:26,220 By the 18th century women simply didn't 612 00:31:26,220 --> 00:31:28,970 have the opportunity to write large concert works 613 00:31:28,970 --> 00:31:31,180 or at least to hear them performed. 614 00:31:31,180 --> 00:31:34,030 Meaning that they often stuck to chamber music and songs. 615 00:31:34,980 --> 00:31:37,450 Anna Magdalena may well have had the advantage 616 00:31:37,450 --> 00:31:40,030 over her later counterparts in that she could 617 00:31:40,030 --> 00:31:43,300 have had the opportunity to complete large pieces. 618 00:31:43,300 --> 00:31:45,420 However, these works would automatically 619 00:31:45,420 --> 00:31:47,383 have been credited to her husband. 620 00:31:49,870 --> 00:31:52,170 She would have written under the family brand. 621 00:31:53,680 --> 00:31:55,890 What does Alma think about that? 622 00:31:55,890 --> 00:31:57,260 - I would have minded it very much 623 00:31:57,260 --> 00:32:00,311 because it's not their music, it's mine. 624 00:32:00,311 --> 00:32:05,311 And I know actually, that Felix Mendelssohn, 625 00:32:05,700 --> 00:32:09,030 he visited England and he visited Queen Victoria. 626 00:32:09,030 --> 00:32:11,330 And Queen Victoria wanted to sing some 627 00:32:11,330 --> 00:32:14,330 of Mendelssohn's songs with Mendelssohn accompanying. 628 00:32:14,330 --> 00:32:17,010 And so Mendelssohn said, "Well, choose your favorite song." 629 00:32:17,010 --> 00:32:20,200 And Victoria chose and Mendelssohn blushed 630 00:32:20,200 --> 00:32:22,247 a little bit and said, "Well, that's actually 631 00:32:22,247 --> 00:32:25,208 "not my song, it was composed by my sister". 632 00:32:26,260 --> 00:32:28,060 So even in the 19th century, 633 00:32:28,060 --> 00:32:29,790 the true composer was unveiled 634 00:32:29,790 --> 00:32:32,203 by accident, rather than by design. 635 00:32:33,630 --> 00:32:37,270 But how does Alma think she has achieved so much, so young? 636 00:32:37,270 --> 00:32:39,860 - It's a bit of both of talent and education. 637 00:32:39,860 --> 00:32:42,260 Of course, one needs to have talent or inherit it, 638 00:32:42,260 --> 00:32:44,640 but then one also has to know how 639 00:32:44,640 --> 00:32:49,020 to develop it and have education. 640 00:32:49,020 --> 00:32:50,820 And then, also, it's another talent 641 00:32:50,820 --> 00:32:53,474 to be able to work and concentrate. 642 00:33:00,584 --> 00:33:01,610 - It's very easy for us now sitting 643 00:33:01,610 --> 00:33:04,110 in the 21st century to say well, 644 00:33:04,110 --> 00:33:06,100 the frustration, the anger, all of those things 645 00:33:06,100 --> 00:33:07,310 would have been there and she would 646 00:33:07,310 --> 00:33:09,523 have been trying to right the wrongs, 647 00:33:09,523 --> 00:33:11,671 but I very much doubt that would have been the case. 648 00:33:11,671 --> 00:33:13,664 I think, yes, maybe the frustration and the anger, 649 00:33:13,664 --> 00:33:16,330 but certainly what society was dictating at the time 650 00:33:16,330 --> 00:33:18,210 wouldn't maybe necessarily have allowed her to think 651 00:33:18,210 --> 00:33:21,120 that she could have potentially gone 652 00:33:21,120 --> 00:33:22,410 out there and written those pieces. 653 00:33:22,410 --> 00:33:23,960 Even in the 21st century we don't allow 654 00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:27,110 for her to have written those pieces. 655 00:33:27,110 --> 00:33:30,690 So, I think at the time of writing 656 00:33:30,690 --> 00:33:33,523 did women have that recognition? 657 00:33:34,890 --> 00:33:37,280 I would say the answer is probably not. 658 00:33:37,280 --> 00:33:38,590 But, how could a young girl, 659 00:33:38,590 --> 00:33:40,740 living in the early 18th century, 660 00:33:40,740 --> 00:33:44,192 ever achieve such an advanced level of education? 661 00:33:45,870 --> 00:33:46,850 A family sought 662 00:33:46,850 --> 00:33:49,330 the best possible opportunities for education 663 00:33:49,330 --> 00:33:52,430 within the context of their family network. 664 00:33:52,430 --> 00:33:54,880 That can mean, for example, that children are sent 665 00:33:54,880 --> 00:33:57,330 to school, or they receive instruction 666 00:33:57,330 --> 00:34:00,360 at home in addition to this general education. 667 00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:02,880 Or, for girls in particular, that they are, 668 00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:06,610 in fact, taught at home, by members of the family network. 669 00:34:06,610 --> 00:34:08,700 It could be an aunt or a tutor brought 670 00:34:08,700 --> 00:34:10,643 into the home for this purpose. 671 00:34:18,810 --> 00:34:21,020 However, in order to compose, 672 00:34:21,020 --> 00:34:23,423 you need more than school education. 673 00:34:24,660 --> 00:34:27,500 Because we know that she was trained as a singer, 674 00:34:27,500 --> 00:34:32,160 we can surmise that she did indeed have a musical education, 675 00:34:32,160 --> 00:34:34,623 that she received musical instruction. 676 00:34:36,430 --> 00:34:38,830 So Anna was musically educated 677 00:34:38,830 --> 00:34:41,170 and gifted as a child. 678 00:34:41,170 --> 00:34:42,830 How do professionals who live 679 00:34:42,830 --> 00:34:45,300 and breathe Bach react to that? 680 00:34:45,300 --> 00:34:48,173 Like the Director of the Bach Museum, Jorge Hansen? 681 00:34:49,459 --> 00:34:50,680 That Anna Magdalena 682 00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:53,396 might have produced musical notation at the age 683 00:34:53,396 --> 00:34:55,633 of 12 or 13 would not be surprising at all. 684 00:34:58,440 --> 00:35:00,200 Further documents suggest Anna 685 00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:02,790 could well have been a pupil of Bach. 686 00:35:02,790 --> 00:35:04,840 Her handwriting appears on the cover of a book 687 00:35:04,840 --> 00:35:08,460 of organ works, while she was still a teenager. 688 00:35:08,460 --> 00:35:11,123 This signature is written by her, not by him. 689 00:35:14,120 --> 00:35:16,453 And what might he have been like as a tutor? 690 00:35:17,290 --> 00:35:18,630 - If he thought of himself as superior 691 00:35:18,630 --> 00:35:20,920 it was as superior among equals. 692 00:35:20,920 --> 00:35:22,520 He would have had a God-given mission 693 00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:24,310 to do music and to do it well. 694 00:35:24,310 --> 00:35:27,210 I mean, he had this real sense of career 695 00:35:27,210 --> 00:35:29,590 and the notion, you know, that if anybody insulted 696 00:35:29,590 --> 00:35:32,240 his art he could get really angry. 697 00:35:32,240 --> 00:35:34,850 His rage spilled over after demanding 698 00:35:34,850 --> 00:35:38,320 a transfer to the Court of Prince Leopold in Kothen. 699 00:35:38,320 --> 00:35:40,760 Duke Wilhelm Ernst at the Court of Weimar 700 00:35:40,760 --> 00:35:44,230 reacted badly and Bach was jailed. 701 00:35:44,230 --> 00:35:45,830 The dispute was resolved when, 702 00:35:45,830 --> 00:35:48,970 in 1717, his demands were met and he finally 703 00:35:48,970 --> 00:35:51,583 got the job of Kapellmeister at Kothen. 704 00:35:52,841 --> 00:35:55,470 The Kapellmeister is responsible 705 00:35:55,470 --> 00:35:58,310 for everything musical that happens at court. 706 00:35:58,310 --> 00:36:00,840 That is, he directs the ensembles, 707 00:36:00,840 --> 00:36:03,400 rehearses the works and composes too, 708 00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:05,410 but he is not a composer. 709 00:36:05,410 --> 00:36:08,050 This term does not yet exist in the period 710 00:36:08,050 --> 00:36:10,623 in question, rather he is Kapellmeister. 711 00:36:14,500 --> 00:36:16,490 A few years later, Anna Magdalena, 712 00:36:16,490 --> 00:36:19,360 now 20, got a job there as a singer 713 00:36:19,360 --> 00:36:22,321 and she was hired by Johann Sebastian. 714 00:36:25,410 --> 00:36:27,250 But she was far from home. 715 00:36:27,250 --> 00:36:28,283 Where did she live? 716 00:36:30,550 --> 00:36:33,690 - She's a young girl come into Kothen. 717 00:36:33,690 --> 00:36:35,860 So, where is she gonna stay? 718 00:36:35,860 --> 00:36:37,820 The logical thing is for her to come in 719 00:36:37,820 --> 00:36:41,902 as a tutor living in a household, 720 00:36:41,902 --> 00:36:44,360 in this case, the Bach household. 721 00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:46,120 To many people, the very idea 722 00:36:46,120 --> 00:36:47,317 that Anna Magdalena lived with 723 00:36:47,317 --> 00:36:49,863 the Bach family is unacceptable. 724 00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:54,940 It went without saying that 725 00:36:54,940 --> 00:36:57,880 within musical families and among musicians, 726 00:36:57,880 --> 00:37:00,050 a network was always sought to accommodate 727 00:37:00,050 --> 00:37:01,923 musicians who were passing through. 728 00:37:02,870 --> 00:37:04,510 And she was doing precisely that 729 00:37:04,510 --> 00:37:07,090 when she came to Kothen as a singer. 730 00:37:07,090 --> 00:37:08,780 And so, it is entirely possible 731 00:37:08,780 --> 00:37:11,440 that she was a guest of the Bach family, 732 00:37:11,440 --> 00:37:12,550 that she stayed with them, 733 00:37:12,550 --> 00:37:15,520 and that she was part of the everyday musical life 734 00:37:15,520 --> 00:37:18,233 of the Bach family as a matter of course. 735 00:37:21,760 --> 00:37:23,110 A possible indication 736 00:37:23,110 --> 00:37:25,560 that Anna lived in the Bach family home 737 00:37:25,560 --> 00:37:28,420 is the appearance of Anna's handwriting in a notebook 738 00:37:28,420 --> 00:37:31,990 for Wilhelm Friedemann, Bach's eldest son. 739 00:37:31,990 --> 00:37:33,864 - The first thing I needed to do was 740 00:37:33,864 --> 00:37:35,950 establish whose handwriting was 741 00:37:35,950 --> 00:37:38,350 in the first prelude as it exists 742 00:37:38,350 --> 00:37:39,700 in the Friedemann notebook. 743 00:37:40,700 --> 00:37:45,610 I brought in some examples of Anna Magdalena's handwriting 744 00:37:46,790 --> 00:37:50,010 and I could see quite clearly that we had a match. 745 00:37:50,010 --> 00:37:53,795 - It appears to be the same writer, that's very clear. 746 00:37:58,990 --> 00:38:00,310 What is known is that when 747 00:38:00,310 --> 00:38:02,390 she arrived in Kothen she already had 748 00:38:02,390 --> 00:38:05,170 an impressive reputation as a singer. 749 00:38:05,170 --> 00:38:09,023 Anna's status was reflected in her unusually high salary. 750 00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:12,953 - Why was she paid so much money? 751 00:38:14,030 --> 00:38:17,740 She was a 20 year old woman, only female member of Court, 752 00:38:17,740 --> 00:38:19,903 second most highly paid member of Court, 753 00:38:20,750 --> 00:38:22,610 paid as much as 10 times as much 754 00:38:22,610 --> 00:38:24,450 as any of the other musicians. 755 00:38:24,450 --> 00:38:25,970 Well, clearly she must have been doing 756 00:38:25,970 --> 00:38:29,680 something very special and it wasn't copying. 757 00:38:29,680 --> 00:38:32,780 Interestingly enough, the Court records identify 758 00:38:32,780 --> 00:38:35,893 the copyists and Anna Magdalena's name is not amongst them. 759 00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:40,470 So we know, John, that Anna Magdalena 760 00:38:40,470 --> 00:38:42,563 was paid a large amount of money. 761 00:38:43,660 --> 00:38:45,600 What do you think she was doing for that money? 762 00:38:45,600 --> 00:38:47,990 - I mean, certainly singers did tend to get paid more. 763 00:38:47,990 --> 00:38:49,760 I mean, that's common in opera 764 00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:51,590 and often they get paid more than composers. 765 00:38:51,590 --> 00:38:54,060 It might be Bach pulling a fast one, you know, 766 00:38:54,060 --> 00:38:58,170 but clearly the height of that salary is indicative 767 00:38:58,170 --> 00:39:00,283 of some level of value and excellence. 768 00:39:07,410 --> 00:39:08,690 Every summer the rich 769 00:39:08,690 --> 00:39:11,050 and famous flocked to the town of Karlsbad 770 00:39:11,050 --> 00:39:14,033 for the spa waters and lavish parties. 771 00:39:14,940 --> 00:39:17,440 Prince Leopold and Kapellmeister Bach 772 00:39:17,440 --> 00:39:21,160 were enthusiastic followers of this popular tradition. 773 00:39:21,160 --> 00:39:22,930 Whether Bach was having an affair 774 00:39:22,930 --> 00:39:26,560 with Anna Magdalena is, of course, completely unknown, 775 00:39:26,560 --> 00:39:30,600 but it does seem to fit the evidence. 776 00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:33,570 Bach goes off to Karlsbad with the Prince 777 00:39:34,450 --> 00:39:35,993 and he takes some musicians. 778 00:39:38,340 --> 00:39:40,660 - Classical musicians, let us not forget, 779 00:39:40,660 --> 00:39:42,650 were the pop stars of their time. 780 00:39:42,650 --> 00:39:44,400 They'd be hell-raisers today. 781 00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:46,510 The things that they got up to in their private life 782 00:39:46,510 --> 00:39:48,680 spilled over into their work life. 783 00:39:48,680 --> 00:39:50,920 A lot of them were rogues. 784 00:39:50,920 --> 00:39:52,500 A lot of them were alcoholics. 785 00:39:52,500 --> 00:39:55,725 A lot of them would be making the headlines today. 786 00:39:57,940 --> 00:40:00,440 Even today, guests attend the closing party 787 00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:03,150 of the famous Karlovy Vary Film Festival 788 00:40:03,150 --> 00:40:05,050 in the very same rooms Bach and 789 00:40:05,050 --> 00:40:08,600 his musicians knew almost 300 years ago. 790 00:40:08,600 --> 00:40:10,420 You really would take a singer, 791 00:40:10,420 --> 00:40:13,210 somebody to sing some pretty music 792 00:40:13,210 --> 00:40:15,100 when people are having dinner. 793 00:40:15,100 --> 00:40:18,840 So my conjecture is that Anna Magdalena 794 00:40:18,840 --> 00:40:21,803 accompanied Sebastian on this trip to Karlsbad. 795 00:40:29,300 --> 00:40:31,330 Clearly, that party atmosphere 796 00:40:31,330 --> 00:40:33,500 would lend itself well to perhaps 797 00:40:33,500 --> 00:40:35,310 some goings-on that might be considered 798 00:40:35,310 --> 00:40:38,857 to be unseemly back in Kothen. 799 00:40:55,216 --> 00:40:56,750 Whatever the truth of the matter, 800 00:40:56,750 --> 00:40:59,250 Bach returned from Karlsbad to be informed 801 00:40:59,250 --> 00:41:02,290 that his wife was dead and already buried. 802 00:41:02,290 --> 00:41:04,510 The cause of death remains unknown. 803 00:41:04,510 --> 00:41:07,828 She was hastily laid to rest in an unmarked grave. 804 00:41:09,200 --> 00:41:11,380 Only a commemorative stone exists 805 00:41:11,380 --> 00:41:14,370 in the vast parkland where she was buried 806 00:41:14,370 --> 00:41:17,093 and no one knows exactly where her body lies. 807 00:41:19,090 --> 00:41:20,950 Not being buried in holy ground 808 00:41:20,950 --> 00:41:23,750 is indeed an indication that something untoward 809 00:41:23,750 --> 00:41:25,940 may have occurred before death. 810 00:41:25,940 --> 00:41:27,810 But we can go no further than to say 811 00:41:27,810 --> 00:41:30,163 that this remains a question mark for us. 812 00:41:31,470 --> 00:41:33,100 - He didn't hear about this, 813 00:41:33,100 --> 00:41:35,380 according to his second eldest son, 814 00:41:35,380 --> 00:41:38,210 Carl Philipp Emanuel, until he walked through the door. 815 00:41:38,210 --> 00:41:40,660 First of all, it was the middle of summer 816 00:41:40,660 --> 00:41:42,880 so she could have had a contagious disease. 817 00:41:42,880 --> 00:41:45,870 But the death certificate doesn't say what she died of. 818 00:41:45,870 --> 00:41:47,170 Bearing in mind that only a couple 819 00:41:47,170 --> 00:41:50,453 of years earlier she'd lost the twins. 820 00:41:51,430 --> 00:41:53,160 I think she was probably very depressed 821 00:41:53,160 --> 00:41:55,170 and may well have been depressed 822 00:41:55,170 --> 00:41:57,590 because Johann Sebastian was showing 823 00:41:57,590 --> 00:41:59,750 an interest in Anna Magdalena. 824 00:41:59,750 --> 00:42:01,883 So, she may well have committed suicide. 825 00:42:04,320 --> 00:42:08,020 17 months later Bach married Anna Magdalena. 826 00:42:08,020 --> 00:42:09,353 But not in a church. 827 00:42:12,550 --> 00:42:13,870 In general, one can say 828 00:42:13,870 --> 00:42:16,000 that weddings were subject to a very strict 829 00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:18,470 set of rules, depending on whether it was 830 00:42:18,470 --> 00:42:20,750 the first marriage or the second. 831 00:42:20,750 --> 00:42:23,260 And in that context it was absolutely normal 832 00:42:23,260 --> 00:42:26,480 for the second marriage not to be contracted in public, 833 00:42:26,480 --> 00:42:29,360 but rather that it should be concluded at home. 834 00:42:29,360 --> 00:42:31,230 - He was directed, the word is directed, 835 00:42:31,230 --> 00:42:32,880 to get married in his own home. 836 00:42:32,880 --> 00:42:34,370 So what was the reason? 837 00:42:34,370 --> 00:42:35,530 Was it because there was some sort 838 00:42:35,530 --> 00:42:39,093 of social stigma associated with his relationship with Anna? 839 00:42:41,450 --> 00:42:42,930 Whatever the circumstances, 840 00:42:42,930 --> 00:42:44,520 Bach married a successful, 841 00:42:44,520 --> 00:42:47,660 talented young woman almost half his age. 842 00:42:47,660 --> 00:42:50,730 Life in Kothen seemed secure, surrounded by love, 843 00:42:50,730 --> 00:42:53,410 promise and creative freedom. 844 00:42:53,410 --> 00:42:56,213 But for Anna did that include composing? 845 00:43:00,301 --> 00:43:02,650 As the wife of Johann Sebastian Bach, 846 00:43:02,650 --> 00:43:05,390 she holds a thoroughly preeminent position 847 00:43:05,390 --> 00:43:08,373 within this social fabric, namely as wife. 848 00:43:09,240 --> 00:43:11,330 And the functions of husband and wife 849 00:43:11,330 --> 00:43:13,420 are indeed very strictly regulated 850 00:43:13,420 --> 00:43:15,283 in the 18th century family. 851 00:43:16,280 --> 00:43:18,820 The husband is indeed the head of the family, 852 00:43:18,820 --> 00:43:22,210 but the wife is directly at his side to the extent 853 00:43:22,210 --> 00:43:25,443 that she may also deputize for him when he is absent. 854 00:43:31,640 --> 00:43:33,010 - It was understood that the whole family 855 00:43:33,010 --> 00:43:36,930 was behind the Kappellmeister and Anna Magdalena 856 00:43:36,930 --> 00:43:39,310 was absolutely the Kappellmeisterin. 857 00:43:39,310 --> 00:43:42,180 She would have been doing all the things Bach was 858 00:43:42,180 --> 00:43:44,283 doing and the job included composing. 859 00:43:46,170 --> 00:43:49,043 The partnership was successful and life was good. 860 00:43:50,650 --> 00:43:53,420 However, a shock was in store for the Bachs 861 00:43:53,420 --> 00:43:56,030 with the arrival of Fredericka Henrietta, 862 00:43:56,030 --> 00:43:58,580 bride-to-be of Prince Leopold. 863 00:43:58,580 --> 00:44:03,580 - She suddenly shuts down the funding for the Court. 864 00:44:04,010 --> 00:44:05,740 So he then finds himself in the situation 865 00:44:05,740 --> 00:44:08,390 where he's got to look for employment somewhere else. 866 00:44:10,310 --> 00:44:12,820 Was this because Princess Frederica Henrietta 867 00:44:12,820 --> 00:44:16,010 disliked music, as Bach concluded, 868 00:44:16,010 --> 00:44:18,330 or was she jealous of the close relationship 869 00:44:18,330 --> 00:44:20,510 between the Prince and the Kapell? 870 00:44:21,880 --> 00:44:23,740 Martin might surmise that a whiff of scandal 871 00:44:23,740 --> 00:44:26,640 from Karlsbad was still hanging in the air. 872 00:44:26,640 --> 00:44:28,070 We'll never know. 873 00:44:28,070 --> 00:44:31,920 Whatever the reason, Bach applied for the job of Cantor, 874 00:44:31,920 --> 00:44:35,313 teaching Latin at St. Thomas's School in Leipzig. 875 00:44:36,550 --> 00:44:39,660 The move was probably not a social disaster 876 00:44:39,660 --> 00:44:41,660 and Bach faced bold new challenges 877 00:44:41,660 --> 00:44:44,640 and a fresh outlet for his creativity. 878 00:44:44,640 --> 00:44:47,483 But for Anna it must have been heartbreaking. 879 00:44:49,750 --> 00:44:51,420 For his wife it was indeed 880 00:44:51,420 --> 00:44:53,410 a more serious setback, because she was 881 00:44:53,410 --> 00:44:55,723 no longer able to perform in public. 882 00:44:56,880 --> 00:44:59,080 This ruling against female performers 883 00:44:59,080 --> 00:45:01,680 was specific to Leipzig and must have been 884 00:45:01,680 --> 00:45:04,610 a devastating blow to a young woman who enjoyed 885 00:45:04,610 --> 00:45:08,000 a prestigious career and a substantial salary. 886 00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:10,920 And, to add insult to injury, her husband was not 887 00:45:10,920 --> 00:45:12,969 even first choice for the job. 888 00:45:12,969 --> 00:45:15,054 Not even the second choice I believe? 889 00:45:15,054 --> 00:45:16,163 - Not even the second choice, no, no. 890 00:45:16,163 --> 00:45:18,600 I mean, this is partly to do with the politics of Leipzig. 891 00:45:18,600 --> 00:45:19,490 Right, yeah. 892 00:45:19,490 --> 00:45:22,047 - And what was expected of a cantor. 893 00:45:22,047 --> 00:45:23,730 And one thing that was expected of a cantor 894 00:45:23,730 --> 00:45:25,480 was that he would play a big role in 895 00:45:25,480 --> 00:45:27,660 the academic Latin teaching of the school. 896 00:45:27,660 --> 00:45:29,860 And his Latin was probably not particularly good 897 00:45:29,860 --> 00:45:32,300 and he wasn't keen on doing it anyway. 898 00:45:32,300 --> 00:45:35,410 So, therefore, he appealed more to the party 899 00:45:35,410 --> 00:45:38,400 in the town council that wanted a star musician. 900 00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:39,990 Now, in this respect, Bach was 901 00:45:39,990 --> 00:45:42,320 a good musician but he was not a star. 902 00:45:42,320 --> 00:45:45,070 - In Leipzig he's a teacher at a school. 903 00:45:45,070 --> 00:45:47,960 He's not even really there as a composer in residence. 904 00:45:47,960 --> 00:45:50,970 He's there to supervise the Latin. 905 00:45:50,970 --> 00:45:52,820 He's doing some music, obviously, 906 00:45:52,820 --> 00:45:54,763 but his principal role really is, 907 00:45:55,850 --> 00:45:58,960 basically, as a housemaster in a school. 908 00:45:58,960 --> 00:45:59,930 How Anna coped with 909 00:45:59,930 --> 00:46:02,740 this upheaval is, of course, unknown. 910 00:46:02,740 --> 00:46:05,470 And one can only speculate on the family dynamic 911 00:46:05,470 --> 00:46:07,810 between a teenage girl and a stepmother 912 00:46:07,810 --> 00:46:10,163 who was only five years older than her. 913 00:46:12,070 --> 00:46:14,481 - The relationship between Anna Magdalena 914 00:46:14,481 --> 00:46:15,640 and Catharina Dorothea must have 915 00:46:15,640 --> 00:46:17,120 been a very interesting one. 916 00:46:17,120 --> 00:46:22,020 A 15 year old girl who's just lost her own mother 917 00:46:22,020 --> 00:46:24,000 has a stepmother who she now has 918 00:46:24,000 --> 00:46:25,880 to call mother who's five years older. 919 00:46:25,880 --> 00:46:29,370 I think, I don't think human beings have changed that much. 920 00:46:29,370 --> 00:46:32,227 I think it would be all-out war. 921 00:46:34,290 --> 00:46:37,420 Ultimately, Anna had 13 children of her own. 922 00:46:37,420 --> 00:46:38,843 Only six survived. 923 00:46:40,350 --> 00:46:44,673 So the key question is, could Anna have had time to compose? 924 00:46:48,170 --> 00:46:49,380 It goes without saying 925 00:46:49,380 --> 00:46:50,840 that there were servants. 926 00:46:50,840 --> 00:46:53,240 That is, a cantor household had servants 927 00:46:53,240 --> 00:46:56,560 as a matter of course, but his and her families belonged 928 00:46:56,560 --> 00:46:59,770 to a very extensive musical family network. 929 00:46:59,770 --> 00:47:02,930 That is, everyone assumed tasks which were possible 930 00:47:02,930 --> 00:47:06,270 for them to undertake and which were necessary. 931 00:47:06,270 --> 00:47:09,370 - There's been so much said about 932 00:47:09,370 --> 00:47:12,130 how she couldn't have been a composer. 933 00:47:12,130 --> 00:47:13,100 She couldn't have done it 934 00:47:13,100 --> 00:47:15,120 because she had all those children. 935 00:47:15,120 --> 00:47:17,850 Because she wouldn't have had the education. 936 00:47:17,850 --> 00:47:20,653 Well, all those things have been knocked on the head. 937 00:47:23,080 --> 00:47:27,950 You mentioned that you improvise and extemporize yourself. 938 00:47:27,950 --> 00:47:29,558 Do you think there's something 939 00:47:29,558 --> 00:47:31,300 that stops you from being a composer? 940 00:47:31,300 --> 00:47:34,840 - I always had music in my head but I never wrote it down. 941 00:47:34,840 --> 00:47:37,790 If you grow up and you always hear 942 00:47:37,790 --> 00:47:39,590 women cannot do this and this and that, 943 00:47:39,590 --> 00:47:41,160 they can only do this and this and that, 944 00:47:41,160 --> 00:47:43,370 of course you have a mental conditioning 945 00:47:43,370 --> 00:47:45,530 and that creates psychological blocks. 946 00:47:45,530 --> 00:47:49,720 And not every woman is able to get free 947 00:47:49,720 --> 00:47:51,840 from these mental cages, you know. 948 00:47:51,840 --> 00:47:53,760 It's not easy if you have a society 949 00:47:53,760 --> 00:47:56,000 around you which says what you have to do, 950 00:47:56,000 --> 00:47:58,533 what you cannot do and things like this. 951 00:48:04,310 --> 00:48:06,390 Even at the age of only 10, 952 00:48:06,390 --> 00:48:09,163 Alma is feeling the pressure to make difficult choices. 953 00:48:10,565 --> 00:48:13,140 - When I was little then I said I wanted 954 00:48:13,140 --> 00:48:15,170 to play the violin like Perlman 955 00:48:15,170 --> 00:48:19,210 and play the piano like Barenboim and compose like Mozart. 956 00:48:19,210 --> 00:48:24,210 But now, I realize that I can't really do all these things. 957 00:48:24,640 --> 00:48:27,250 People say that I will have to choose later, 958 00:48:27,250 --> 00:48:30,530 when I grow older, between playing the violin and piano. 959 00:48:30,530 --> 00:48:34,130 And all the pianists say, "Oh, you must choose piano." 960 00:48:34,130 --> 00:48:36,790 And all the violinists say, "You must choose violin." 961 00:48:36,790 --> 00:48:39,210 But it's better this way than the other way round, 962 00:48:39,210 --> 00:48:41,500 if the pianist says, "You must choose violin." 963 00:48:41,500 --> 00:48:44,500 And the violinists say, "You must choose piano." 964 00:48:44,500 --> 00:48:46,203 I want to be a woman composer. 965 00:48:48,040 --> 00:48:49,040 - Children just hear a piece 966 00:48:49,040 --> 00:48:51,550 and they like it for what it is. 967 00:48:51,550 --> 00:48:53,770 They hear a piece and they want to know the story behind it. 968 00:48:53,770 --> 00:48:57,430 Classical music is the key to so many stories 969 00:48:57,430 --> 00:49:00,320 and opening up your imagination. 970 00:49:00,320 --> 00:49:02,600 Suddenly, the purist police come in and say, 971 00:49:02,600 --> 00:49:04,440 well actually no, this is what the composer 972 00:49:04,440 --> 00:49:06,650 was trying to say and this is how he wanted to play it 973 00:49:06,650 --> 00:49:09,153 and these are the rules and these are more rules 974 00:49:09,153 --> 00:49:11,020 and all the fun comes out of it. 975 00:49:11,020 --> 00:49:12,210 Who cares who wrote it? 976 00:49:12,210 --> 00:49:14,910 It's the fact it was written in the first place. 977 00:49:14,910 --> 00:49:17,680 It's the fact that when we hear those notes 978 00:49:17,680 --> 00:49:19,493 do they touch your soul or not? 979 00:49:22,059 --> 00:49:23,760 I started playing the piano when I was four 980 00:49:23,760 --> 00:49:26,119 and the thing that I do remember about it 981 00:49:26,119 --> 00:49:27,814 is having to sit on a cushion and having 982 00:49:27,814 --> 00:49:29,310 these two little legs just dangling. 983 00:49:29,310 --> 00:49:31,240 It's nice to know who wrote it but, ultimately, 984 00:49:31,240 --> 00:49:33,310 when you play a piece to a child 985 00:49:33,310 --> 00:49:35,393 and they'll tell you the honest truth. 986 00:49:36,290 --> 00:49:39,070 They just want to know if they like the piece or not. 987 00:49:39,070 --> 00:49:39,903 It's as simple as that. 988 00:49:39,903 --> 00:49:41,213 It's as black and white as that. 989 00:49:42,580 --> 00:49:45,840 And Tilly Cernitori wants to be a conductor. 990 00:49:45,840 --> 00:49:48,250 But generally, it seems to have taken much longer, 991 00:49:48,250 --> 00:49:50,593 in music, for women to emerge. 992 00:49:51,750 --> 00:49:54,020 So, what is it about music that appears 993 00:49:54,020 --> 00:49:56,410 to make it more difficult for women? 994 00:49:56,410 --> 00:50:01,220 - I think some men are really jealous of our creative power 995 00:50:01,220 --> 00:50:05,200 because women already have creative power in life, 996 00:50:05,200 --> 00:50:08,820 and they kind of feel a bit threatened 997 00:50:08,820 --> 00:50:10,790 if they can create also art. 998 00:50:10,790 --> 00:50:12,509 Even though there are 999 00:50:12,509 --> 00:50:13,670 more women now coming into music, 1000 00:50:13,670 --> 00:50:17,283 as performers, there are still very few composers. 1001 00:50:17,283 --> 00:50:19,720 I just don't know why that is. 1002 00:50:19,720 --> 00:50:23,020 - I think it's the whole psychological conditioning. 1003 00:50:23,020 --> 00:50:27,090 Because I have been prevented also to be a conductor. 1004 00:50:27,090 --> 00:50:30,080 People always said no, you are a girl, you cannot conduct. 1005 00:50:30,080 --> 00:50:32,120 And then I see great women conductors, 1006 00:50:32,120 --> 00:50:35,210 so you just stand up and say I'm gonna do it. 1007 00:50:35,210 --> 00:50:37,090 - You can't write women out of history, 1008 00:50:37,090 --> 00:50:39,505 ultimately, we just won't let it happen. 1009 00:50:40,338 --> 00:50:41,477 It's just not gonna happen. 1010 00:50:43,383 --> 00:50:44,850 Of one thing there's no doubt: 1011 00:50:44,850 --> 00:50:47,610 the Leipzig years produced a prolific upsurge 1012 00:50:47,610 --> 00:50:50,173 of music in the Bach household. 1013 00:50:54,690 --> 00:50:56,780 - The money comes into the same coffers. 1014 00:50:56,780 --> 00:51:00,400 I think that's the case with a family team. 1015 00:51:00,400 --> 00:51:03,410 That you might work on something together 1016 00:51:04,320 --> 00:51:08,160 and you might not really mind very much about the ownership 1017 00:51:08,160 --> 00:51:11,260 of it as long as the money's coming in. 1018 00:51:11,260 --> 00:51:12,320 It's so much to do with that. 1019 00:51:12,320 --> 00:51:13,720 It's about making ends meet. 1020 00:51:14,630 --> 00:51:16,880 So, Johann Sebastian was, effectively, 1021 00:51:16,880 --> 00:51:19,993 the managing director of the Bach family business. 1022 00:51:22,840 --> 00:51:24,970 Is it really team composing now? 1023 00:51:24,970 --> 00:51:26,360 She's composing it. 1024 00:51:26,360 --> 00:51:27,320 He's polishing it. 1025 00:51:27,320 --> 00:51:29,593 They're producing the final result together. 1026 00:51:37,570 --> 00:51:39,870 - If you knew that the person behind 1027 00:51:39,870 --> 00:51:43,560 these pieces had to write, or hide rather, 1028 00:51:43,560 --> 00:51:47,210 under this cloak because it wouldn't have been accepted. 1029 00:51:47,210 --> 00:51:49,740 That, to me, adds another layer to the story. 1030 00:51:49,740 --> 00:51:51,630 For her to be writing and assisting him 1031 00:51:51,630 --> 00:51:53,830 and maybe even the fact that we have 1032 00:51:53,830 --> 00:51:56,080 to recognize he was treating her as an equal, 1033 00:51:57,150 --> 00:52:00,530 trusting her with these pieces, at that level. 1034 00:52:00,530 --> 00:52:02,650 I think that's one of the greatest musical 1035 00:52:02,650 --> 00:52:04,173 and love stories ever told. 1036 00:52:07,230 --> 00:52:09,140 If Anna Magdalena was alive today 1037 00:52:09,140 --> 00:52:11,440 she would certainly have relished the opportunity 1038 00:52:11,440 --> 00:52:13,773 to perform in this iconic building. 1039 00:52:15,110 --> 00:52:17,350 Nobody knows who wrote the beautiful theme 1040 00:52:17,350 --> 00:52:19,573 of the famous Goldberg Variations. 1041 00:52:20,480 --> 00:52:22,690 But the original is in Anna's hand. 1042 00:52:22,690 --> 00:52:26,360 - The aria on which the Goldberg Variations is based, 1043 00:52:26,360 --> 00:52:27,910 I think it's by Anna Magdalena. 1044 00:52:29,340 --> 00:52:31,490 She's written herself a little tune. 1045 00:52:31,490 --> 00:52:35,190 So he takes that tune and writes the variations for it. 1046 00:52:35,190 --> 00:52:38,580 He starts with the aria and finishes with the aria. 1047 00:52:38,580 --> 00:52:41,133 This is, to my knowledge, unique. 1048 00:52:43,030 --> 00:52:46,370 - Bach as a composer, to my way of thinking, 1049 00:52:46,370 --> 00:52:48,780 is more an attitude towards music 1050 00:52:48,780 --> 00:52:50,980 and towards music that pre-exists. 1051 00:52:50,980 --> 00:52:53,360 So, from that point of view, it doesn't actually matter, 1052 00:52:53,360 --> 00:52:54,520 as far as Bach's concerned, 1053 00:52:54,520 --> 00:52:57,020 whether the aria's written by him or someone else. 1054 00:52:58,880 --> 00:53:01,363 - Music is people speaking to people. 1055 00:53:02,910 --> 00:53:05,340 I think, irrespective of if it's 1056 00:53:05,340 --> 00:53:06,750 a man that's written it or a woman 1057 00:53:06,750 --> 00:53:09,330 that's written it, that shouldn't matter. 1058 00:53:09,330 --> 00:53:14,330 However, it does, because people have known 1059 00:53:14,340 --> 00:53:17,710 that they've been speaking to Bach all this time. 1060 00:53:17,710 --> 00:53:20,300 And it's like someone sort of just pulled out the jack lead, 1061 00:53:20,300 --> 00:53:22,780 pulled out the line and said, actually hold the line caller, 1062 00:53:22,780 --> 00:53:25,080 you're actually speaking to this lady instead. 1063 00:53:27,040 --> 00:53:29,790 In spite of all the positive corroboration, 1064 00:53:29,790 --> 00:53:32,260 Martin wanted me to talk to someone who was skeptical 1065 00:53:32,260 --> 00:53:34,610 about his findings and suggested I meet 1066 00:53:34,610 --> 00:53:37,750 Bach expert Ruth Tatlow in Leipzig. 1067 00:53:37,750 --> 00:53:40,300 So, is there anything to say that Anna Magdalena 1068 00:53:40,300 --> 00:53:42,260 actually could have been a composer? 1069 00:53:42,260 --> 00:53:44,020 - I suppose she may have written an aria 1070 00:53:44,020 --> 00:53:48,663 and Bach just chose to write the variations on it. 1071 00:53:50,090 --> 00:53:51,900 It's a very four square. 1072 00:53:51,900 --> 00:53:54,630 I mean, it's a total rigid binary form, 1073 00:53:54,630 --> 00:53:57,180 so you could say it is very simple. 1074 00:53:57,180 --> 00:53:58,420 - What makes us think that because 1075 00:53:58,420 --> 00:54:01,330 it's simple it might be by a woman? 1076 00:54:01,330 --> 00:54:03,460 - If she was an apprentice composer, 1077 00:54:03,460 --> 00:54:05,460 she was learning the skills. 1078 00:54:05,460 --> 00:54:09,010 This is more of the style of piece 1079 00:54:09,010 --> 00:54:11,092 that she could have composed. 1080 00:54:13,400 --> 00:54:15,860 But the Cello Suites are much more complex 1081 00:54:15,860 --> 00:54:18,580 than the theme to the Goldberg Variations. 1082 00:54:18,580 --> 00:54:21,340 It's Martin's assertion that they were written by Anna 1083 00:54:21,340 --> 00:54:23,680 that has caused the most controversy. 1084 00:54:23,680 --> 00:54:25,100 - I most certainly can put my hand on 1085 00:54:25,100 --> 00:54:29,280 my heart and say that Anna Magdalena was the composer. 1086 00:54:29,280 --> 00:54:32,230 Mostly of the Cello Suites, right. 1087 00:54:32,230 --> 00:54:34,540 She's the principal composer. 1088 00:54:34,540 --> 00:54:37,550 I do believe that Johann Sebastian had some input. 1089 00:54:37,550 --> 00:54:39,050 The Cello Suites are 1090 00:54:40,160 --> 00:54:42,010 they're more intimate, they're in a way 1091 00:54:42,010 --> 00:54:44,720 more inward than the Violin Partitas, 1092 00:54:44,720 --> 00:54:46,660 for instance, which are very virtuosic 1093 00:54:46,660 --> 00:54:49,200 and they're performance pieces. 1094 00:54:49,200 --> 00:54:50,930 So, it's not showing off. 1095 00:54:50,930 --> 00:54:53,800 It's not pushing the technique to the limits, 1096 00:54:53,800 --> 00:54:56,240 but it's just really exploring 1097 00:54:56,240 --> 00:54:57,820 the strengths of the instrument. 1098 00:54:57,820 --> 00:54:59,430 - The question of the Cello Suites is a difficult one. 1099 00:54:59,430 --> 00:55:02,442 I don't have any problem at all with them being by Bach. 1100 00:55:02,442 --> 00:55:04,040 They seem to me perfectly within 1101 00:55:04,040 --> 00:55:07,490 the general spectrum of which Bach works. 1102 00:55:07,490 --> 00:55:10,260 But, with that proviso in mind, 1103 00:55:10,260 --> 00:55:12,476 there's not much we know about them. 1104 00:55:12,476 --> 00:55:13,610 And I think part of the problem with 1105 00:55:13,610 --> 00:55:15,960 the Cello Suites is actually the instrument. 1106 00:55:15,960 --> 00:55:17,900 We literally don't know what the instrument was. 1107 00:55:17,900 --> 00:55:19,640 There's a huge theory at the moment 1108 00:55:19,640 --> 00:55:22,199 that the Cello Suites might have been designed 1109 00:55:22,199 --> 00:55:25,623 played like a huge violin. 1110 00:55:26,460 --> 00:55:28,880 So the cello was not a fixed instrument. 1111 00:55:28,880 --> 00:55:32,060 And there's virtually no precedent 1112 00:55:32,060 --> 00:55:34,000 for unaccompanied music for cello. 1113 00:55:34,000 --> 00:55:36,630 - I think there's tremendous value in this research 1114 00:55:36,630 --> 00:55:38,940 because there's absolutely no reason 1115 00:55:38,940 --> 00:55:42,210 to believe that there weren't women composing. 1116 00:55:42,210 --> 00:55:44,090 And the question is, what happened to them? 1117 00:55:44,090 --> 00:55:45,610 What happened to their music? 1118 00:55:45,610 --> 00:55:47,630 And I think it's absolutely believable 1119 00:55:47,630 --> 00:55:50,483 that a lot of them published under their husbands' names. 1120 00:55:51,660 --> 00:55:54,030 One piece of documentary evidence did appear 1121 00:55:54,030 --> 00:55:56,530 to support Anna as a composer. 1122 00:55:56,530 --> 00:55:59,870 Bach family friend, Heinrich Ludwig Schwanenberger, 1123 00:55:59,870 --> 00:56:02,630 had added a credit to Anna on the front cover 1124 00:56:02,630 --> 00:56:06,140 of her personal beautifully handwritten manuscript. 1125 00:56:06,140 --> 00:56:08,300 It seemed unambiguous. 1126 00:56:08,300 --> 00:56:13,095 So given that there's no original manuscript of Bach, 1127 00:56:13,095 --> 00:56:18,095 and one of the main sources is Anna Magdalena's manuscript, 1128 00:56:18,865 --> 00:56:21,430 is there anything to suggest that she might 1129 00:56:21,430 --> 00:56:23,720 actually have been the composer? 1130 00:56:23,720 --> 00:56:25,430 - I would say no, there isn't. 1131 00:56:25,430 --> 00:56:28,120 But I've taken Martin Jarvis's evidence 1132 00:56:28,120 --> 00:56:30,340 very seriously and I've followed it up. 1133 00:56:30,340 --> 00:56:32,290 His argument for Anna Magdalena as 1134 00:56:32,290 --> 00:56:36,890 the composer hangs on one small piece of evidence, 1135 00:56:36,890 --> 00:56:39,350 which is at the bottom of the title page. 1136 00:56:39,350 --> 00:56:44,210 It says, ecrite par Madame Bach son epouse. 1137 00:56:44,210 --> 00:56:47,300 And Martin Jarvis takes this to mean 1138 00:56:47,300 --> 00:56:50,750 that Anna Magdalena was the composer. 1139 00:56:50,750 --> 00:56:54,010 But, he actually failed to emphasize the fact 1140 00:56:54,010 --> 00:56:56,400 that on the title page it also said, 1141 00:56:56,400 --> 00:56:58,445 in Schwanenberger's handwriting, 1142 00:56:58,445 --> 00:57:02,597 composee par Johann Sebastian Bach or J.S. Bach, twice. 1143 00:57:03,830 --> 00:57:07,150 - We have to consider why Schwanenberger wrote those words. 1144 00:57:07,150 --> 00:57:08,930 What was he trying to tell us? 1145 00:57:08,930 --> 00:57:11,130 Was he trying to tell us that he was grateful 1146 00:57:11,130 --> 00:57:13,470 for Anna Magdalena copying them? 1147 00:57:13,470 --> 00:57:15,460 Well, I don't think so. 1148 00:57:15,460 --> 00:57:17,440 Why would he do such a thing? 1149 00:57:17,440 --> 00:57:19,853 - Now, in fact, I did a little experiment. 1150 00:57:20,704 --> 00:57:23,780 I looked up in Christian Ludwig's 1151 00:57:23,780 --> 00:57:26,130 English-German-French dictionary published 1152 00:57:26,130 --> 00:57:29,960 in 1706 and I looked up three words. 1153 00:57:29,960 --> 00:57:34,960 I looked up compose, copy, and I looked up the word write 1154 00:57:35,640 --> 00:57:39,140 to see which of these words came up as ecrirer. 1155 00:57:39,140 --> 00:57:42,030 So these are the results that, 1156 00:57:42,030 --> 00:57:44,170 it is not given, the word ecrite, 1157 00:57:44,170 --> 00:57:48,790 is not given as a synonym for compose in any respect. 1158 00:57:48,790 --> 00:57:53,470 The word ecrite is not given as a synonym for copy either. 1159 00:57:53,470 --> 00:57:55,990 The word ecrite is given as a synonym 1160 00:57:55,990 --> 00:58:00,902 for the physical act of writing by hand or transcribing. 1161 00:58:00,902 --> 00:58:05,610 And Martin's argument lies in the word ecrite, 1162 00:58:05,610 --> 00:58:08,280 which he says has a dual meaning 1163 00:58:08,280 --> 00:58:12,110 of both composed by and physically written. 1164 00:58:12,110 --> 00:58:15,610 His support for this is a modern dictionary 1165 00:58:15,610 --> 00:58:17,760 and this points to the fact that there are some 1166 00:58:17,760 --> 00:58:21,870 methodological flaws in his approach, unfortunately. 1167 00:58:21,870 --> 00:58:24,170 - The fact of the matter is that manuscript describes 1168 00:58:24,170 --> 00:58:27,710 Bach as the composee, the person who put it together. 1169 00:58:27,710 --> 00:58:32,703 Composee means to put together, not to compose the music. 1170 00:58:32,703 --> 00:58:35,240 Ecrit is the verb that I understand, 1171 00:58:35,240 --> 00:58:37,030 from the Paris Conservatoire, 1172 00:58:37,030 --> 00:58:39,840 was the verb used to describe the composer. 1173 00:58:39,840 --> 00:58:41,120 - If people don't want to believe, 1174 00:58:41,120 --> 00:58:43,002 if they don't want to get on board 1175 00:58:43,002 --> 00:58:45,620 because it suits their purpose not to get on board, 1176 00:58:45,620 --> 00:58:48,095 well, that tells you everything you need to know already. 1177 00:58:48,095 --> 00:58:49,370 It tells you the uphill struggle that Mrs. Bach 1178 00:58:49,370 --> 00:58:51,080 would have had and why she wrote, 1179 00:58:51,080 --> 00:58:55,240 or didn't write, in such a public arena. 1180 00:58:55,240 --> 00:58:58,510 Because, even now, centuries down the line, 1181 00:58:58,510 --> 00:59:00,540 people still won't accept it. 1182 00:59:00,540 --> 00:59:02,410 In any event, surely it would have 1183 00:59:02,410 --> 00:59:05,640 been remarkable for anyone other than Johann Sebastian 1184 00:59:05,640 --> 00:59:08,080 to have been credited on the cover page. 1185 00:59:08,080 --> 00:59:10,950 After all, he was the Kappelmeister, and, 1186 00:59:10,950 --> 00:59:14,170 in those days all music came from God. 1187 00:59:14,170 --> 00:59:15,760 - We don't think twice now when you see 1188 00:59:15,760 --> 00:59:18,440 these massive factories, and that's the only way 1189 00:59:18,440 --> 00:59:20,220 you can actually describe them, 1190 00:59:20,220 --> 00:59:22,810 of film composers who are putting 1191 00:59:22,810 --> 00:59:25,290 out score after score after score. 1192 00:59:25,290 --> 00:59:27,260 Why wouldn't it be possible that 1193 00:59:27,260 --> 00:59:28,750 somebody else is helping copywrite? 1194 00:59:28,750 --> 00:59:31,120 In fact, I don't think it can be anything but possible 1195 00:59:31,120 --> 00:59:33,608 that someone else is helping to copy-write 1196 00:59:33,608 --> 00:59:35,540 these pieces or helping to additionally write. 1197 00:59:35,540 --> 00:59:39,650 And yet, the fact that it's a woman just changes everything. 1198 00:59:39,650 --> 00:59:41,730 - But a question mark still exists 1199 00:59:41,730 --> 00:59:44,820 over the words, written by Mrs. Bach. 1200 00:59:44,820 --> 00:59:49,260 The Cover Page shows two parts, or pars, in Latin, 1201 00:59:49,260 --> 00:59:50,920 and Shwanenberger's note is added 1202 00:59:50,920 --> 00:59:53,490 to the second part, the Cello Suites. 1203 00:59:53,490 --> 00:59:58,180 Also, according to the French Academy Dictionary of 1694, 1204 00:59:58,180 --> 01:00:01,410 the word ecrire figuratively means 1205 01:00:01,410 --> 01:00:03,443 composing a spiritual work. 1206 01:00:04,380 --> 01:00:08,600 Figuratively is derived from the Latin word figurare, 1207 01:00:08,600 --> 01:00:11,350 which means to form or fashion. 1208 01:00:11,350 --> 01:00:13,820 So, go figure! 1209 01:00:13,820 --> 01:00:16,070 Why do you think there are so many mistakes 1210 01:00:16,070 --> 01:00:18,400 in Anna Magdalena's manuscript? 1211 01:00:18,400 --> 01:00:21,080 - She's not very accurate, 1212 01:00:21,080 --> 01:00:24,180 especially in slurs and articulations. 1213 01:00:24,180 --> 01:00:26,890 She's very, I would say, enthusiastic. 1214 01:00:26,890 --> 01:00:31,313 She doesn't seem to care too much about those little things. 1215 01:00:45,030 --> 01:00:47,480 I find that young composers very often forget 1216 01:00:47,480 --> 01:00:49,900 to put the details into their scores. 1217 01:00:49,900 --> 01:00:52,250 For instance, whether a note is slurred or short, 1218 01:00:52,250 --> 01:00:55,520 because they hear it so clearly in their own head. 1219 01:00:55,520 --> 01:00:58,030 So, could Anna Magdalena have made this fair copy 1220 01:00:58,030 --> 01:01:00,863 of the Cello Suites from her own draft manuscript? 1221 01:01:05,460 --> 01:01:08,720 - I find that there is a different substance, 1222 01:01:08,720 --> 01:01:11,930 musical substance in the Suites 1223 01:01:11,930 --> 01:01:14,860 than in the Sonatas and Partitas. 1224 01:01:14,860 --> 01:01:16,963 For that reason I say, hmm, why not? 1225 01:01:19,870 --> 01:01:21,550 - It's actually called ornamentation. 1226 01:01:21,550 --> 01:01:24,663 It's a Baroque practice which was very common at the time. 1227 01:01:25,810 --> 01:01:28,400 I learned it actually with my recorder studies, 1228 01:01:28,400 --> 01:01:31,720 but I have never seen applied to the Cello Suites. 1229 01:01:31,720 --> 01:01:35,233 I think it's very much in the style of the time. 1230 01:01:37,070 --> 01:01:42,070 - I always felt that the suites need more interpretation, 1231 01:01:43,530 --> 01:01:48,530 or interpreting decisions, than Sonatas and Partitas. 1232 01:01:49,330 --> 01:01:52,180 When I read the book, I had the feeling 1233 01:01:52,180 --> 01:01:54,860 that something had a resonance in myself. 1234 01:01:54,860 --> 01:01:57,180 So there was something that rang true 1235 01:01:57,180 --> 01:01:59,720 in Martin's book that made you think, well. 1236 01:01:59,720 --> 01:02:04,043 - Yes, exactly, made me think exactly, well, why not? 1237 01:02:10,715 --> 01:02:12,100 But what was Heidi Harralson's 1238 01:02:12,100 --> 01:02:16,000 professional opinion, based solely on her interpretation 1239 01:02:16,000 --> 01:02:18,980 of handwriting on the Cello Suites? 1240 01:02:18,980 --> 01:02:20,489 Do you think that there's 1241 01:02:20,489 --> 01:02:22,060 enough evidence to support the hypothesis 1242 01:02:22,060 --> 01:02:24,223 that Anna Magdalena was the composer? 1243 01:02:25,060 --> 01:02:27,680 - Based upon my examination of the Cello Suites 1244 01:02:27,680 --> 01:02:30,990 I would conclude that Anna Magdalena 1245 01:02:30,990 --> 01:02:32,970 can be identified as the author. 1246 01:02:32,970 --> 01:02:35,370 And I would eliminate Johann Sebastian Bach 1247 01:02:35,370 --> 01:02:38,253 as the author of the Cello Suites. 1248 01:02:39,220 --> 01:02:40,920 - To take the tooth fairy away from so many 1249 01:02:40,920 --> 01:02:45,325 of these respected, esteemed professors and purists, 1250 01:02:45,325 --> 01:02:48,020 you're rocking their very foundations. 1251 01:02:48,020 --> 01:02:49,730 And I don't even think it's their fault. 1252 01:02:49,730 --> 01:02:52,920 They can't believe. 1253 01:02:52,920 --> 01:02:55,490 It's not even they don't want to, they just can't, 1254 01:02:55,490 --> 01:02:57,630 because you're basically telling them 1255 01:02:57,630 --> 01:02:59,803 that black is white, that night is day. 1256 01:03:01,100 --> 01:03:04,350 Martin also had questions over Bach's eyesight. 1257 01:03:04,350 --> 01:03:07,180 The Centre for Anatomy and Human Identification 1258 01:03:07,180 --> 01:03:09,540 in Dundee, Scotland is renowned 1259 01:03:09,540 --> 01:03:14,290 for identifying war victims and recreating famous faces. 1260 01:03:14,290 --> 01:03:17,700 Forensic anthropologist, Dr. Caroline Wilkinson, 1261 01:03:17,700 --> 01:03:19,810 took on the challenge of re-creating 1262 01:03:19,810 --> 01:03:22,560 the head of Johann Sebastian Bach. 1263 01:03:22,560 --> 01:03:24,940 - The original is in the sarcophagus. 1264 01:03:24,940 --> 01:03:27,740 All we had was the cast that was made 1265 01:03:27,740 --> 01:03:30,000 and we made a copy of that. 1266 01:03:30,000 --> 01:03:33,450 We used the skull from when it was exhumed. 1267 01:03:33,450 --> 01:03:35,310 The process that we use is anatomical, 1268 01:03:35,310 --> 01:03:38,060 so we build the muscles of the face directly 1269 01:03:38,060 --> 01:03:40,000 onto the skull, using the shape 1270 01:03:40,000 --> 01:03:41,840 and proportions of the skull to tell us 1271 01:03:41,840 --> 01:03:44,270 about the shape and size of the muscles. 1272 01:03:44,270 --> 01:03:48,303 Then we build the features based on anatomical standards. 1273 01:03:49,200 --> 01:03:51,820 So, the nasal aperture tells us about the nose. 1274 01:03:51,820 --> 01:03:54,550 The teeth tell us about the lips. 1275 01:03:54,550 --> 01:03:56,550 The orbits tell us about the eyes. 1276 01:03:56,550 --> 01:03:59,770 Once we have the finished shape of his head, 1277 01:03:59,770 --> 01:04:01,580 that's then given to our animator 1278 01:04:01,580 --> 01:04:04,230 who puts the textures and skin color and eye color 1279 01:04:04,230 --> 01:04:07,333 and hair et cetera, onto the animation. 1280 01:04:08,170 --> 01:04:10,190 So, what were the important clues 1281 01:04:10,190 --> 01:04:12,700 about Johann Sebastian's lifestyle, 1282 01:04:12,700 --> 01:04:15,200 and critically, his eyesight? 1283 01:04:15,200 --> 01:04:16,700 - There's nothing about his face 1284 01:04:16,700 --> 01:04:19,060 that tells us about his personality. 1285 01:04:19,060 --> 01:04:20,260 But there are a number of things 1286 01:04:20,260 --> 01:04:21,740 that tell us about his life. 1287 01:04:21,740 --> 01:04:24,170 So, for example, we know that he had quite 1288 01:04:24,170 --> 01:04:27,450 swollen eyelids and had a lot of surgery on his eyes, 1289 01:04:27,450 --> 01:04:29,910 which probably contributed to his death. 1290 01:04:29,910 --> 01:04:32,810 And also, his age and the weight he was carrying. 1291 01:04:32,810 --> 01:04:34,530 All of those things will have had an effect 1292 01:04:34,530 --> 01:04:37,030 on his appearance and how other people judged him. 1293 01:04:37,930 --> 01:04:40,120 - Bach's eyesight was deteriorating 1294 01:04:40,120 --> 01:04:43,030 from quite a young age, actually. 1295 01:04:43,030 --> 01:04:48,030 And certainly, by 1740, his sight was getting very bad. 1296 01:04:48,330 --> 01:04:50,653 So somebody else was writing the music. 1297 01:04:51,550 --> 01:04:54,270 - I think that the pain that he will have suffered 1298 01:04:54,270 --> 01:04:56,170 with his eyes must have been significant. 1299 01:04:56,170 --> 01:04:58,980 So that would have had an effect on him emotionally 1300 01:04:58,980 --> 01:05:01,350 and may have affected his musical ability as well, 1301 01:05:01,350 --> 01:05:04,156 if he wasn't able to see as well as he could have done. 1302 01:05:05,760 --> 01:05:07,800 Anna may have copied this work, 1303 01:05:07,800 --> 01:05:10,310 the Credo from the B-Minor Mass. 1304 01:05:10,310 --> 01:05:12,150 This complex music appears to be 1305 01:05:12,150 --> 01:05:15,800 in her hand when Bach was virtually blind. 1306 01:05:15,800 --> 01:05:17,920 Did he dictate it to her? 1307 01:05:17,920 --> 01:05:19,913 Or what, exactly, was her role? 1308 01:05:21,020 --> 01:05:23,280 - Taking music from dictation also requires 1309 01:05:23,280 --> 01:05:26,060 somebody of a very high musical skill. 1310 01:05:26,060 --> 01:05:27,760 If you're going to take music down 1311 01:05:28,920 --> 01:05:33,920 without any errors then you are likely 1312 01:05:34,080 --> 01:05:35,650 to be sufficiently skilled to write 1313 01:05:35,650 --> 01:05:37,090 the stuff yourself, of course. 1314 01:05:37,090 --> 01:05:38,240 That's the point. 1315 01:05:38,240 --> 01:05:40,993 - If she had time to copy she had time to compose. 1316 01:05:42,660 --> 01:05:44,570 And now things really shift. 1317 01:05:44,570 --> 01:05:48,260 Heidi even questions the authenticity of Bach's signature, 1318 01:05:48,260 --> 01:05:51,939 let alone the precision required to put notes onto a page. 1319 01:05:51,939 --> 01:05:54,190 - It would help us to learn more about 1320 01:05:54,190 --> 01:05:55,880 the actual movement of the writing. 1321 01:05:55,880 --> 01:05:59,370 We can trace these signatures on a digital tablet 1322 01:05:59,370 --> 01:06:01,650 to understand kinematic handwriting 1323 01:06:01,650 --> 01:06:05,310 motor movement in greater detail. 1324 01:06:05,310 --> 01:06:07,430 What we can immediately see is that 1325 01:06:07,430 --> 01:06:10,610 the 1720 signature appears to be 1326 01:06:10,610 --> 01:06:12,330 more fluently written in the sense 1327 01:06:12,330 --> 01:06:14,276 that there's more connecting strokes. 1328 01:06:14,276 --> 01:06:15,109 Yeah, yeah. 1329 01:06:15,109 --> 01:06:16,690 - I would even say, as I was writing it, 1330 01:06:16,690 --> 01:06:19,600 it actually felt like a cursive signature, 1331 01:06:19,600 --> 01:06:24,600 a formal cursive signature with a great deal of fluency. 1332 01:06:24,810 --> 01:06:28,890 What I found interesting about the 1748 signature, 1333 01:06:28,890 --> 01:06:32,010 Bach was effectively blind. 1334 01:06:32,010 --> 01:06:35,170 I highly question the ability for a blind person 1335 01:06:35,170 --> 01:06:38,460 to be able to write this fluently. 1336 01:06:38,460 --> 01:06:41,900 In studies about blindness and handwriting, 1337 01:06:41,900 --> 01:06:45,050 what we have found is that people who are blind 1338 01:06:45,050 --> 01:06:48,460 cannot maintain an alignment on their signature base line 1339 01:06:48,460 --> 01:06:50,810 and this signature is quite aligned. 1340 01:06:50,810 --> 01:06:54,443 There's also problems with size and proportions. 1341 01:06:54,443 --> 01:06:56,410 Even the spacing between letters 1342 01:06:56,410 --> 01:06:59,230 and this is spaced very well. 1343 01:06:59,230 --> 01:07:03,970 In fact, the manual control required to effectively print 1344 01:07:03,970 --> 01:07:07,933 this name in some form of calligraphy is quite high. 1345 01:07:08,780 --> 01:07:10,790 I think there would be a correlation 1346 01:07:10,790 --> 01:07:12,990 between the inability to write one's signature 1347 01:07:12,990 --> 01:07:14,870 and to write music calligraphy because writing 1348 01:07:14,870 --> 01:07:17,780 one's signature is actually an easier activity. 1349 01:07:17,780 --> 01:07:22,130 So, if Bach was not able to sign his signature 1350 01:07:22,130 --> 01:07:25,200 in the late 1740's I think it's highly unlikely 1351 01:07:25,200 --> 01:07:27,493 he could write music calligraphy either. 1352 01:07:28,580 --> 01:07:32,200 In the late 1740's, Bach's existing myopia 1353 01:07:32,200 --> 01:07:35,543 was considerably worsened by the development of cataracts. 1354 01:07:36,450 --> 01:07:39,180 And working in poor light, or even by candlelight, 1355 01:07:39,180 --> 01:07:40,560 could have affected his ability 1356 01:07:40,560 --> 01:07:42,993 to notate music quite seriously. 1357 01:07:44,370 --> 01:07:46,420 Martin had already looked into blindness 1358 01:07:46,420 --> 01:07:49,010 and calligraphy and decided to consult 1359 01:07:49,010 --> 01:07:52,100 his optometrist brother-in-law, Melvyn Kaufman 1360 01:07:52,100 --> 01:07:54,998 and Martin's musician sister, Clare. 1361 01:07:54,998 --> 01:07:58,770 - Bach and, I have to say the City Council, 1362 01:07:58,770 --> 01:08:02,420 were very worried that as Bach's eyesight 1363 01:08:02,420 --> 01:08:06,690 was getting worse it was going to impact on them, 1364 01:08:06,690 --> 01:08:09,320 because he wouldn't be able to write as much. 1365 01:08:09,320 --> 01:08:14,220 So, in 1749, 1366 01:08:14,220 --> 01:08:17,250 he was persuaded to actually have 1367 01:08:17,250 --> 01:08:20,800 the operation done by Dr. John Taylor. 1368 01:08:20,800 --> 01:08:23,990 Today, Taylor is recognized as a quack doctor: 1369 01:08:23,990 --> 01:08:28,840 a charlatan whose operations and purgatives often failed. 1370 01:08:28,840 --> 01:08:32,720 - He submitted himself to a couching operation, 1371 01:08:32,720 --> 01:08:35,300 which was quite horrendous, really. 1372 01:08:35,300 --> 01:08:38,150 What they did was they sat people, 1373 01:08:38,150 --> 01:08:41,220 on a chair and someone would actually 1374 01:08:41,220 --> 01:08:43,480 put their arms round them to hold them 1375 01:08:43,480 --> 01:08:47,290 in place so that they couldn't move. 1376 01:08:47,290 --> 01:08:49,950 Remember that we're talking, in Europe, 1377 01:08:49,950 --> 01:08:54,950 pre-anesthesia, pre-antiseptic, pre-antibiotic. 1378 01:08:56,550 --> 01:09:01,550 So, what Dr. John Taylor did was to get a very sharp needle 1379 01:09:02,610 --> 01:09:05,800 and to very quickly put the needle 1380 01:09:05,800 --> 01:09:10,530 into the eye to knock the lens backwards. 1381 01:09:10,530 --> 01:09:15,480 He decided after seven days to do another operation 1382 01:09:15,480 --> 01:09:17,890 because the first operation seemed to work 1383 01:09:17,890 --> 01:09:21,480 for a day or two, but then it wasn't any good. 1384 01:09:21,480 --> 01:09:24,490 So, he operated on Bach's second eye 1385 01:09:24,490 --> 01:09:27,003 and then that was catastrophic for Bach. 1386 01:09:33,210 --> 01:09:36,150 After Bach's death in 1750, 1387 01:09:36,150 --> 01:09:40,870 his elder sons moved on, both musically and geographically. 1388 01:09:40,870 --> 01:09:42,820 They abandoned Anna Magdalena, 1389 01:09:42,820 --> 01:09:45,800 leaving her to survive on City Council handouts 1390 01:09:45,800 --> 01:09:46,893 until she died. 1391 01:09:48,130 --> 01:09:51,730 Anna died on February 27th, 1760 1392 01:09:51,730 --> 01:09:54,433 and was buried in St. John's church in Leipzig. 1393 01:09:55,800 --> 01:09:59,380 The entry in the City Register of Deaths reads: 1394 01:09:59,380 --> 01:10:02,530 a mendicant woman from the Haynstrasse, 1395 01:10:02,530 --> 01:10:06,620 aged 59 years, Anna Magdalena, nee Wilcken, 1396 01:10:06,620 --> 01:10:09,690 widow of Mr. Johann Sebastian Bach, 1397 01:10:09,690 --> 01:10:12,043 Cantor of the St. Thomas School. 1398 01:10:16,590 --> 01:10:19,960 So, what actually did happen after Anna's death? 1399 01:10:19,960 --> 01:10:23,650 The elder sons achieved great success as musicians 1400 01:10:23,650 --> 01:10:25,963 and publicly lauded their great father. 1401 01:10:26,910 --> 01:10:30,360 But stepmother Anna is never referred to. 1402 01:10:30,360 --> 01:10:33,360 - Most mysterious of all is that all of Bach's letters 1403 01:10:33,360 --> 01:10:37,869 and letters to Anna Magdalena all vanished. 1404 01:10:39,550 --> 01:10:41,960 The day books all vanished, as well. 1405 01:10:41,960 --> 01:10:44,580 Of course, paperwork often gets thrown out. 1406 01:10:44,580 --> 01:10:47,060 We'll never know who was responsible, 1407 01:10:47,060 --> 01:10:50,010 or why personal records weren't preserved, 1408 01:10:50,010 --> 01:10:52,650 but very little survived. 1409 01:10:52,650 --> 01:10:54,746 The portrait of Anna Magdalena 1410 01:10:54,746 --> 01:10:57,346 that he had painted in the mid-1730's also vanished. 1411 01:10:58,560 --> 01:11:01,800 So, it's as if somebody quite deliberately 1412 01:11:01,800 --> 01:11:05,390 wanted to destroy any history that, 1413 01:11:05,390 --> 01:11:07,383 in my view, pointed to Anna Magdalena. 1414 01:11:10,690 --> 01:11:12,327 - That's one of the most shameful aspects of it 1415 01:11:12,327 --> 01:11:17,327 and one that I hope will be set to rest, finally. 1416 01:11:17,520 --> 01:11:20,030 They did, I think, try extremely hard 1417 01:11:20,030 --> 01:11:22,650 to keep her out of the picture altogether. 1418 01:11:22,650 --> 01:11:26,130 And made, and that's particularly suspicious 1419 01:11:26,130 --> 01:11:28,890 because if she hadn't done anything worthwhile, 1420 01:11:28,890 --> 01:11:31,140 anything significant, why would they do that? 1421 01:11:32,470 --> 01:11:33,928 What's the point? 1422 01:11:33,928 --> 01:11:36,537 Daybooks exist for most other composers. 1423 01:11:36,537 --> 01:11:38,780 And it does seem surprising that something 1424 01:11:38,780 --> 01:11:42,070 as valuable as a family portrait should vanish. 1425 01:11:42,070 --> 01:11:44,760 Could it really have been deliberate? 1426 01:11:44,760 --> 01:11:46,230 And other questions are raised 1427 01:11:46,230 --> 01:11:48,900 in the issue of Bach's signatures. 1428 01:11:48,900 --> 01:11:52,530 - This was a collection of what was considered known, 1429 01:11:52,530 --> 01:11:54,520 or authentic, examples-- - Yeah, yeah. 1430 01:11:54,520 --> 01:11:57,600 - Of Johann Sebastian Bach's signature. 1431 01:11:57,600 --> 01:12:01,140 If these are supposed to be Bach's signatures, 1432 01:12:01,140 --> 01:12:04,330 there's what we would term, in handwriting identification, 1433 01:12:04,330 --> 01:12:06,970 as a significant range of variation. 1434 01:12:06,970 --> 01:12:08,410 Meaning that there's a lot of internal 1435 01:12:08,410 --> 01:12:11,680 variance within and between the signatures. 1436 01:12:11,680 --> 01:12:15,640 For example, very different capital letter forms, 1437 01:12:15,640 --> 01:12:17,880 such as what appears to be a very different 1438 01:12:17,880 --> 01:12:20,920 form of B in the 1713 signature. 1439 01:12:20,920 --> 01:12:24,730 Another different form of B in the 1720 signature. 1440 01:12:24,730 --> 01:12:26,520 And then even moving forward we have 1441 01:12:26,520 --> 01:12:30,693 yet another form of B in the 1748 signature. 1442 01:12:31,870 --> 01:12:34,870 So it now seems possible that some Bach signatures 1443 01:12:34,870 --> 01:12:38,460 on Bach manuscripts are not actually his. 1444 01:12:38,460 --> 01:12:40,480 This has huge implications, 1445 01:12:40,480 --> 01:12:42,920 not only for the owners of these manuscripts, 1446 01:12:42,920 --> 01:12:45,233 but also for music history itself. 1447 01:12:47,070 --> 01:12:49,313 It seems a fresh look is needed. 1448 01:12:51,750 --> 01:12:53,970 In order to progress the investigation, 1449 01:12:53,970 --> 01:12:57,130 an example of an undisputed Bach signature 1450 01:12:57,130 --> 01:12:58,233 needs to be found. 1451 01:13:01,580 --> 01:13:03,570 Finally, success. 1452 01:13:03,570 --> 01:13:06,270 The Priest at St. Agnes Church in Kothen 1453 01:13:06,270 --> 01:13:10,090 set out the Church Register, opened a certain page, 1454 01:13:10,090 --> 01:13:13,880 and there it was, the signature; Kappellmeister Bach. 1455 01:13:15,140 --> 01:13:19,317 - This is a book that's dated 1719 to 1728 1456 01:13:19,317 --> 01:13:21,800 and it contains the signatures 1457 01:13:21,800 --> 01:13:25,070 of those coming to confess in this church. 1458 01:13:25,070 --> 01:13:26,850 And this is an original book, too. 1459 01:13:26,850 --> 01:13:28,827 It's fantastic, isn't it? 1460 01:13:28,827 --> 01:13:29,920 What does this title refer to? 1461 01:13:29,920 --> 01:13:32,115 Original Bach manuscripts 1462 01:13:32,115 --> 01:13:33,400 are certainly in short supply. 1463 01:13:33,400 --> 01:13:36,140 But Martin and Heidi hear that an elusive original 1464 01:13:36,140 --> 01:13:39,110 is held at the Bachhaus museum in Eisenach. 1465 01:13:39,110 --> 01:13:41,840 - I was very enthusiastic and excited 1466 01:13:41,840 --> 01:13:45,600 about doing the examination of the original, 1467 01:13:45,600 --> 01:13:48,950 authentic example of Johann Sebastian Bach's 1468 01:13:48,950 --> 01:13:50,480 music calligraphy. 1469 01:13:50,480 --> 01:13:54,030 We were allowed to do microscopic analysis 1470 01:13:54,030 --> 01:13:55,610 of that particular document. 1471 01:13:55,610 --> 01:13:58,900 And we were able to also take microscopic photographs 1472 01:13:58,900 --> 01:14:01,720 of some of the more important aspects of that document 1473 01:14:01,720 --> 01:14:03,960 as being highly identifying between 1474 01:14:03,960 --> 01:14:07,097 both Bach's writing and his wife, Anna Magdalena. 1475 01:14:08,370 --> 01:14:10,430 We learned that the lines on the paper 1476 01:14:10,430 --> 01:14:13,300 were also drawn by Johann Sebastian Bach. 1477 01:14:13,300 --> 01:14:15,350 That was unknown before and it still 1478 01:14:15,350 --> 01:14:17,970 doesn't tell you in the new Bach-Edition. 1479 01:14:17,970 --> 01:14:21,423 It means that Bach drew the lines himself to save money. 1480 01:14:23,780 --> 01:14:25,680 These are very fascinating methods 1481 01:14:25,680 --> 01:14:27,663 and I think they promise new insights. 1482 01:14:28,650 --> 01:14:31,200 The whole separation between musician and composer, 1483 01:14:31,200 --> 01:14:33,853 and copyist, that is all nonsense. 1484 01:14:36,570 --> 01:14:39,403 In the Baroque period, all was one. 1485 01:14:40,620 --> 01:14:43,103 Of course, Anna Magdalena was also a composer. 1486 01:14:44,200 --> 01:14:46,930 It seems composers were supported by a team, 1487 01:14:46,930 --> 01:14:49,440 like Stradivarius and Michelangelo. 1488 01:14:49,440 --> 01:14:52,160 Ownership wasn't the issue it is today. 1489 01:14:52,160 --> 01:14:55,160 And when music was regarded as coming from God anyway, 1490 01:14:55,160 --> 01:14:58,900 perhaps the hand holding the pen wasn't important. 1491 01:14:58,900 --> 01:15:00,700 - I've not seen anything that would diminish 1492 01:15:00,700 --> 01:15:02,400 or detract from his findings. 1493 01:15:02,400 --> 01:15:03,850 Scribal work is going to be 1494 01:15:03,850 --> 01:15:07,380 very regimented, formal and structured. 1495 01:15:07,380 --> 01:15:10,410 Instead, what we're seeing in some of those works 1496 01:15:10,410 --> 01:15:14,760 is missing elements, editorial notes, 1497 01:15:14,760 --> 01:15:17,380 things that would suggest that it is a manuscript 1498 01:15:17,380 --> 01:15:20,183 being written spontaneously rather than copied. 1499 01:15:22,040 --> 01:15:23,880 Art and science have had a special, 1500 01:15:23,880 --> 01:15:27,403 almost mystical, connection since Galileo and Copernicus. 1501 01:15:28,320 --> 01:15:30,550 Martin and Heidi have now presented papers 1502 01:15:30,550 --> 01:15:32,290 at numerous forensic document 1503 01:15:32,290 --> 01:15:35,260 examination seminars worldwide. 1504 01:15:35,260 --> 01:15:39,290 Not one of their scientific findings has been contested. 1505 01:15:39,290 --> 01:15:41,410 - This was presented in the proceedings 1506 01:15:41,410 --> 01:15:44,660 of the International Graphonomics Society. 1507 01:15:44,660 --> 01:15:48,990 And that particular society is a collaboration 1508 01:15:48,990 --> 01:15:51,340 between forensic handwriting examiners, 1509 01:15:51,340 --> 01:15:53,180 handwriting neuroscientists, 1510 01:15:53,180 --> 01:15:56,280 people working in robotics and engineering. 1511 01:15:56,280 --> 01:15:58,330 So this was a scientific paper presented 1512 01:15:58,330 --> 01:15:59,570 at those proceedings. 1513 01:15:59,570 --> 01:16:01,420 It was well received. 1514 01:16:01,420 --> 01:16:04,060 It is rare to have one where we're using 1515 01:16:04,060 --> 01:16:06,510 forensic handwriting examination techniques 1516 01:16:06,510 --> 01:16:10,320 to understand authorship in music manuscripts. 1517 01:16:10,320 --> 01:16:11,710 - I think it's very important because 1518 01:16:11,710 --> 01:16:14,560 it's bringing actual facts to the research. 1519 01:16:14,560 --> 01:16:18,090 And I think it's a kind of revolution to bring science 1520 01:16:18,090 --> 01:16:22,283 into arts which was before kind of unthinkable. 1521 01:16:23,310 --> 01:16:25,760 - I peripherally worked on the Dead Sea Scrolls. 1522 01:16:25,760 --> 01:16:27,080 I think it's especially interesting 1523 01:16:27,080 --> 01:16:30,380 to apply forensic techniques to 1524 01:16:30,380 --> 01:16:33,640 the investigation of historical manuscripts. 1525 01:16:33,640 --> 01:16:36,740 But to some degree, as a Forensic Scientist, 1526 01:16:36,740 --> 01:16:40,120 one needs to also maintain neutrality 1527 01:16:40,120 --> 01:16:42,910 and a calm perspective. 1528 01:16:42,910 --> 01:16:47,023 So I stay focused on the technical components of this. 1529 01:16:47,910 --> 01:16:50,893 It's left to someone else to interpret the level 1530 01:16:50,893 --> 01:16:55,263 of nuance that this has on music history. 1531 01:16:59,310 --> 01:17:00,170 The first part of 1532 01:17:00,170 --> 01:17:02,310 the investigation was successful. 1533 01:17:02,310 --> 01:17:04,190 But now, they urgently need access 1534 01:17:04,190 --> 01:17:07,320 to original documents containing both Anna's 1535 01:17:07,320 --> 01:17:11,820 and Johann's writing to date and verify accurately. 1536 01:17:11,820 --> 01:17:14,570 Conservation staff at the Duchess Amalia Library 1537 01:17:14,570 --> 01:17:17,480 finally allowed access to the original manuscript 1538 01:17:17,480 --> 01:17:21,870 of "Alles Mit Gott", thought to be dated 1713. 1539 01:17:21,870 --> 01:17:25,530 Martin had identified Anna's handwriting on a facsimile. 1540 01:17:25,530 --> 01:17:28,710 Now, he had a chance to verify the original. 1541 01:17:28,710 --> 01:17:31,243 This was a historically vital moment. 1542 01:17:32,330 --> 01:17:35,190 - I approach reading music calligraphy 1543 01:17:35,190 --> 01:17:37,080 from a handwriting perspective 1544 01:17:37,080 --> 01:17:38,690 the way I would a foreign language. 1545 01:17:38,690 --> 01:17:40,330 And we can analyze the handwriting 1546 01:17:40,330 --> 01:17:41,560 of a foreign language even if we 1547 01:17:41,560 --> 01:17:43,320 don't know the language ourselves. 1548 01:17:43,320 --> 01:17:45,630 Because we're not really analyzing the language, 1549 01:17:45,630 --> 01:17:48,080 we're analyzing the graphic components of the letters 1550 01:17:48,080 --> 01:17:50,870 and their individualizing characteristics. 1551 01:17:50,870 --> 01:17:53,303 Well, looking at this microscopically, 1552 01:17:55,100 --> 01:17:58,480 what we find very interesting is that 1553 01:18:00,180 --> 01:18:04,610 under 40x magnification we can see that 1554 01:18:04,610 --> 01:18:08,950 there does appear to be what you were thinking. 1555 01:18:08,950 --> 01:18:10,510 You were thinking that there was an overwrite 1556 01:18:10,510 --> 01:18:12,130 and it does appear to be overwritten. 1557 01:18:12,130 --> 01:18:14,610 You can see here on the screen 1558 01:18:14,610 --> 01:18:16,490 that there's two different pens involved. 1559 01:18:16,490 --> 01:18:19,300 One is a kind of brownish looking ink 1560 01:18:19,300 --> 01:18:21,140 and one that's a little darker. 1561 01:18:21,140 --> 01:18:23,800 The t and the o are overwriting 1562 01:18:23,800 --> 01:18:25,880 the original word and we can see 1563 01:18:25,880 --> 01:18:28,270 the original ink underwritten. 1564 01:18:28,270 --> 01:18:31,180 And this is suggestive that there is more 1565 01:18:31,180 --> 01:18:34,395 than one writer involved in this document. 1566 01:18:35,350 --> 01:18:36,840 This has been my first sight 1567 01:18:36,840 --> 01:18:38,600 of Bach's handwriting. 1568 01:18:38,600 --> 01:18:42,010 The exciting thing is that Anna's is there, too. 1569 01:18:42,010 --> 01:18:44,530 We can determine that the actual 1570 01:18:44,530 --> 01:18:47,760 music calligraphy was written by J.S. Bach. 1571 01:18:47,760 --> 01:18:49,890 But the handwriting on the document 1572 01:18:49,890 --> 01:18:52,200 was written by Anna Magdalena. 1573 01:18:52,200 --> 01:18:53,880 You can say that definitely, can you? 1574 01:18:53,880 --> 01:18:54,870 Yes. 1575 01:18:54,870 --> 01:18:59,870 - So that would place her at Bach's side at the age of 12? 1576 01:19:00,280 --> 01:19:01,360 - Yes, it would. 1577 01:19:01,360 --> 01:19:04,040 - I think that there's even more layers to this woman. 1578 01:19:04,040 --> 01:19:05,700 I think that she's so admirable 1579 01:19:05,700 --> 01:19:07,260 because she had to make choices 1580 01:19:07,260 --> 01:19:09,030 that she probably definitely didn't want to make, 1581 01:19:09,030 --> 01:19:13,070 but just purely for salvation, had to, in order to survive. 1582 01:19:13,070 --> 01:19:15,630 In order to remain as Mrs. Bach, 1583 01:19:15,630 --> 01:19:18,200 she was gonna have to be really super savvy 1584 01:19:19,240 --> 01:19:20,730 and she was gonna have to help 1585 01:19:20,730 --> 01:19:23,450 and she was gonna have to be written out of history. 1586 01:19:23,450 --> 01:19:25,543 And in so doing, it's quite funny, isn't it? 1587 01:19:25,543 --> 01:19:27,930 Because she's smashed right back in there 1588 01:19:27,930 --> 01:19:31,113 because she's made a huge impact. 1589 01:19:33,240 --> 01:19:34,850 Harvard University houses 1590 01:19:34,850 --> 01:19:38,223 the most important document in the entire investigation; 1591 01:19:39,090 --> 01:19:41,453 the Perpetual Canon for Four Voices. 1592 01:19:42,670 --> 01:19:45,530 Martin believes it's in Anna Magdalena's hand. 1593 01:19:45,530 --> 01:19:48,473 It's dated 1713, when she was 12. 1594 01:19:52,430 --> 01:19:55,600 If Heidi can verify it, then Mr. and Mrs. Bach 1595 01:19:55,600 --> 01:19:59,260 had a long and fruitful writing relationship. 1596 01:19:59,260 --> 01:20:01,290 And if this is so, we have to take 1597 01:20:01,290 --> 01:20:03,620 a new look at Anna Magdalena. 1598 01:20:03,620 --> 01:20:04,831 Come on in. 1599 01:20:04,831 --> 01:20:06,313 Thank you. 1600 01:20:06,313 --> 01:20:07,146 And possibly at many other 1601 01:20:07,146 --> 01:20:09,493 female relatives of great composers. 1602 01:20:11,119 --> 01:20:13,690 - We were able to verify that it is an original document. 1603 01:20:13,690 --> 01:20:15,870 It is written with iron-gall ink, 1604 01:20:15,870 --> 01:20:19,210 which is typical of the time period. 1605 01:20:19,210 --> 01:20:21,590 In today's examination one of the most important 1606 01:20:21,590 --> 01:20:23,030 things that we were looking at 1607 01:20:23,030 --> 01:20:26,850 was whether the date of 1713 was written 1608 01:20:26,850 --> 01:20:29,930 contemporaneously on the document. 1609 01:20:29,930 --> 01:20:33,460 It's important to point out that 1610 01:20:33,460 --> 01:20:36,500 some people looking at this document 1611 01:20:36,500 --> 01:20:38,770 would assume that Johann Sebastian Bach's 1612 01:20:38,770 --> 01:20:40,930 signature is on this document. 1613 01:20:40,930 --> 01:20:43,760 And yet, the context of the document shows 1614 01:20:43,760 --> 01:20:46,440 that it's not intended as a signature. 1615 01:20:46,440 --> 01:20:49,403 It's not a signature and it's not his handwriting. 1616 01:20:50,750 --> 01:20:53,810 Nothing in my analysis could disprove that 1617 01:20:53,810 --> 01:20:57,520 that date was erroneous or written at a later time. 1618 01:20:57,520 --> 01:20:59,620 It looked contemporaneous. 1619 01:20:59,620 --> 01:21:02,470 The ink was similar, the handwriting was similar. 1620 01:21:02,470 --> 01:21:04,960 It does place Anna Magdalena's handwriting 1621 01:21:04,960 --> 01:21:09,210 in 1713 on that document, the Canon for Four Voices. 1622 01:21:09,210 --> 01:21:12,760 From age 12, Anna was the Master's apprentice. 1623 01:21:12,760 --> 01:21:14,800 Her family were professional musicians 1624 01:21:14,800 --> 01:21:17,270 and she had a musical education. 1625 01:21:17,270 --> 01:21:19,090 Music history has perpetuated 1626 01:21:19,090 --> 01:21:21,570 the image of the sole male creator. 1627 01:21:21,570 --> 01:21:23,800 But was it really like that? 1628 01:21:23,800 --> 01:21:27,530 We now know Anna had the time and ability to compose. 1629 01:21:27,530 --> 01:21:29,410 So there's every possibility that 1630 01:21:29,410 --> 01:21:33,030 the Cello Suites were written by Mrs. Bach. 1631 01:21:33,030 --> 01:21:36,810 - What's crystallized in this is that there 1632 01:21:36,810 --> 01:21:39,150 are issues to do with the involvement of women 1633 01:21:39,150 --> 01:21:43,330 in composition from the 17th century, probably, 1634 01:21:43,330 --> 01:21:46,460 all the way through the 18th and 19th century. 1635 01:21:46,460 --> 01:21:50,463 A problem of establishing recognition for female composers. 1636 01:21:51,870 --> 01:21:53,770 There is a sense that, finally, 1637 01:21:53,770 --> 01:21:55,663 she's going to get recognition. 124452

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