All language subtitles for 2_Ensh cc

[CLICK, TAPE RUNNING QUICKLY]

[CLICK, TAPE STOPS, CLICK]

>> Man on recording: There are

stories about this

that haven't been told,

and that may never be told.

It's my prayer that everyone

in this room never goes through

such a thing, but if you know

someone that does, the hardest

thing for those people that go

through this is the loss of

being able to communicate

with anyone else...

the loss of being able to find

someone to intelligently

help them.

People that we thought were our

friends, true friends are the

only ones that survived this

stuff because it's not

talked about.

It's not understood.

It happens, and when it does,

you immediately become an alien

to everyone else. [CLICK]

[♪...]

>> YOU KNOW, ONE OF MY

THERAPISTS NOT TOO LONG AGO

ASKED ME IF I COULD,

IN LESS THAN A SENTENCE,

DESCRIBE WHAT--

OR-- DESCRIBE OR LABEL

THESE EXPERIENCES AND, UH,

ALL I CAN COME UP WITH--

AND THE FIRST THING THAT I CAME

UP WITH-- AND I HAVEN'T BEEN

ABLE TO FIND ANYTHING BETTER

UNFORTUNATE GIFT IN MY LIFE.
THAN THAT-- IS THIS IS AN

THAN THAT-- IS THIS IS AN

I STARTED TELLING, YOU KNOW,

THIS IS NOT SOMETHING I ASKED

FOR OR ACHIEVED OR EARNED OR

ANYTHING LIKE THAT, SO...

WHEN THIS WAS-- WHEN I'M GOING

THROUGH EXPERIENCES THAT I AM

NOW GOING TO GO TO THE PRIEST

AT CHURCH AND HE'S LOOKING AT ME

LIKE, "BOY, WHAT IS WRONG

WITH YOU?"

YOU KNOW, I KNEW MY LIFE WAS

TURNING INTO SOMETHING THAT I

HAD NO CONTROL OVER, AND I

BECAME OUT OF CONTROL.

IT'S NOT EASY TO TELL SOMEBODY

HOW YOU GOT THROWN

UP A STAIRCASE.

IT'S NOT EASY TO TELL SOMEBODY

THAT YOUR BED WAS BOUNCING OFF

THE CEILINGS BECAUSE THE

HEADBOARD POSTS ARE JAMMED

INTO THE SHEETROCK.

WE GOT STENCH AND WE GOT

BLACK TOILETS AND WE GOT

THOUSANDS OF FLIES.

THIS IS JUST LIKE A,

LIKE A FUCKING CARNIVAL, MAN.

I'M GETTING A LITTLE TIGHT

RIGHT NOW.

UM, THIS IS NOT SOMETHING

I ENJOY DISCUSSING.

I DON'T LOOK FORWARD TO THIS

SHIT BECAUSE ONCE I START

TALKING ABOUT IT, EVEN JUST TO

MOMENT, I BECOME STUCK WITH IT.

[GUITAR PLAYING ROCK MUSIC]
BRING YOU BACK TO A MOMENT FOR A

BRING YOU BACK TO A MOMENT FOR A

[MUSIC CONTINUES...]
[CIGARETTE LIGHTER CLICKS]

[CIGARETTE LIGHTER CLICKS]

[MUSIC ENDS]

YOU KNOW, MY MOM USED TO TELL ME

THAT GOOD THINGS HAPPEN TO

GOOD PEOPLE AND BAD THINGS

HAPPEN TO BAD PEOPLE,

HAPPEN TO GOOD PEOPLE, TOO.
BUT THEN SOMETIMES BAD THINGS

BUT THEN SOMETIMES BAD THINGS

>> Man: THE AMITYVILLE HOUSE

APPEARS TO BE

QUITE PEACEFUL NOW.

THERE'S BEEN NO EVIDENCE OF ANY

STRANGE OCCURRENCES HERE SINCE

THE LUTZ FAMILY FLED

MORE THAN 20 YEARS AGO.

>> THIS HOUSE IS NOT HAUNTED.

IT NEVER WAS HAUNTED.

IT WAS A MONEYMAKING FRAUD.

>> IT IS DEFINITELY NOT A HOAX.

THAT HOME HAS BEEN EXORCISED.

>> WAS IT REALLY A HORROR?

OR WAS IT A HOAX PERPETRATED ON

THE WORLD, WHICH STILL REMAINS

MYSTIFIED BY THE TALES OF

BIZARRE HAPPENINGS IN A QUIET

HOUSE IN A COMFORTABLE

LONG ISLAND COMMUNITY?

>> Daniel: I'VE NEVER INTRODUCED

MYSELF AS THAT PERSON.

"THE GUY FROM AMITYVILLE."

>> Woman: O.K. >> EVER.

>> YOU'D RATHER BE SOMEONE

COMPLETELY DIFFERENT?

>> I WAS SOMEBODY COMPLETELY

DIFFERENT. >> BEFORE THAT.

>> AND FOR THE MOST PART

I STILL AM.

>> WHAT-- WHO WERE YOU

BEFORE AMITYVILLE?

WHO WERE YOU?

>> I WAS, I WAS DANNY.

I WAS JUST A REGULAR LITTLE KID,

YOU KNOW.

>> YEAH. YOU WENT TO SCHOOL?

>> I TOLD MOM I WAS

GOING TO SCHOOL.

>> WHAT DID YOU REALLY DO?

>> I WAS ENROLLED IN SCHOOLS.

>> O.K.

AND WHAT DID YOU DO INSTEAD?

>> ALL RIGHT, BEFORE WE REALLY

GET INTO, LIKE, ALL THE HAPPY

STUFF HERE, I DON'T KNOW YOU.

>> O.K., GO AHEAD, YOU'RE RIGHT.

>> YOU DON'T KNOW ME.

AND I KINDA NEED TO KNOW

A COUPLE OF THINGS ABOUT YOU.

>> YOU GOT IT. >> BECAUSE I'M

NOT ONE TO JUST SIT IN-- DOWN

AND START SHARING STORIES.

>> I TOTALLY RESPECT THAT,

SO GO AHEAD.

>> I KINDA NEED TO KNOW, LIKE,

WHAT'S THE MOST TRAUMATIC THING

THAT'S EVER HAPPENED TO YOU?

>> THE MOST TRAUMATIC THING

THAT'S EVER HAPPENED TO ME?

UM... I THINK THE MOST TRAUMATIC

THING THAT'S EVER HAPPENED TO ME

WAS MOVING WHEN I WAS 13.

FROM ONE COUNTRY TO ANOTHER.

>> O.K. >> I THINK THAT WAS,

FOR ME, THAT WAS PRETTY SCARY

AND OVERWHELMING.

I MOVED HERE TO THE

UNITED STATES.

>> ALL RIGHT, UM, BUT FOR ME TO

SIT HERE KNOWING THAT THE MOST

TRAUMATIC THING FOR YOU WAS

MOVING FROM ONE COUNTRY TO

ANOTHER AND THEN READJUSTING,

AND YOU WANT ME TO SIT HERE AND

I'M GONNA START TALKING ABOUT

POSSESSIONS AND EXORCISMS AND

BOUNCING OFF OF CEILINGS?

IT'S NOT GONNA BE THE EASIEST

THING FOR ME TO DO BECAUSE I

KNOW YOU'RE ONLY GONNA BE ABLE

TO CONNECT WITH ME IN A...

>> WELL, LET ME SAY THIS TO YOU,

AND YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT,

I'M NOT GONNA EVER BE ABLE TO

KNOW WHAT YOU WENT THROUGH.

THAT'S IMPOSSIBLE.

YOU'RE 100% RIGHT.

IN WHAT I DO FOR A LIVING AS A

PSYCHOLOGIST, I HAVE CONNECTED

WITH MANY PEOPLE IN SO MANY

DIFFERENT SITUATIONS THAT ARE

MUCH MORE TRAUMATIC THEN WHAT

I'VE BEEN THROUGH AND I NEVER...

>> O.K. >> I'M ALWAYS RESPECTFUL

OF WHAT PEOPLE'S LIFE

EXPERIENCES HAVE BEEN.

IS THERE SOMEONE THAT YOU'RE

HOPING TO BENEFIT

FROM DOING THIS?

>> I WOULD HAVE TO SAY

MY CHILDREN.

>> OH, O.K.

HOW OLD ARE YOUR KIDS?

>> 19 AND 17.

>> OH, TOUGH.

HAVE THEY SPOKEN TO YOU AT ALL

ABOUT IT?

>> [SIGHS] YES, THEY HAVE.

AND THEY ARE CONCERNED THAT, UH,

YOU KNOW, SOME DAY

I GET PAST IT.

>> DO YOU FEEL LIKE YOU HAVE

OR YOU HAVEN'T?

>> I'M READY TO.

[♪...]

IT'S-- THIS IS NOT SOMETHING

THAT I ASKED FOR.

I DIDN'T ACHIEVE THIS.

IT'S NOT AN ACCOMPLISHMENT

IN MY LIFE.

IT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT I WISH

TO BE ASSOCIATED WITH--

HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH.

[GUITAR PLAYING]

[INDISTINCT CONVERSATION]

THIS HAS BEEN FOLLOWING ME

MY ENTIRE LIFE.

I'VE BEEN RUNNING AWAY FROM IT

AND IT FINALLY CAUGHT UP TO ME.

AND I COULDN'T HIDE IT.

[FINGER-PICKING...]

I SAT DOWN WITH MY MOM

AND I TOLD HER, I SAID,

"I HAVE TO GO."

I LEFT AND WENT TO GO FIND

MY OWN PLACE IN THE WORLD.

I DIDN'T WANT TO, YOU KNOW,

BE THE AMITYVILLE HORROR KI.

EVERYWHERE THAT I KNOW,

PEOPLE HAVE PRECONCEIVED NOTIONS

OF ME, AND--

I DIDN'T WANT TO DEAL WITH IT,

SO I WOULD JUST WANDER AND FIND

PLACES WHERE NOBODY KNEW ME

AND TRY AND WORK MY WAY

INTO A COMMUNITY.

[♪...]

[PLAYS FINAL NOTES]

[SIGHS]

ALL RIGHT, WELL, I WAS BORN

DANIEL EDWARD QUARATINO IN 1965

IN WEST BABYLON, LONG ISLAND,

NEW YORK.

MY FATHER AND MY MOTHER WERE

HIGH SCHOOL SWEETHEARTS.

UH, I'M LIKE ONE OF THOSE PROM

BACKSEAT INCIDENCES.

THEY WERE MARRIED VERY YOUNG.

VERY FAMILY-ORIENTED.

YOU KNOW, THE FAMILIES ONLY

LIVED A COUPLE OF BLOCKS AWAY

FROM EACH OTHER.

IT WAS MY WORLD AND IT'S

WHAT I KNEW.

AND MY MOM AND DAD GOT DIVORCED,

I DON'T KNOW, I GUESS I WAS

SEVEN-AND-A-HALF-ISH.

WHEN THE DIVORCE WAS ACTUALLY

FINAL AND DAD HAD MOVED OUT

AND ON WITH HIS LIFE AND WE'RE

NOT GOING TO GRANDMA AND

GRANDPA'S ON SUNDAY ANYMORE,

THERE WAS THIS PERIOD OF TIME

WHERE I REALLY DIDN'T KNOW WHERE

I FIT IN ANYMORE OR WHAT TO DO

WITH MYSELF.

IT HELPED ME GET CLOSER

WITH MY MOTHER.

IT ACTUALLY STRENGTHENED

OUR RELATIONSHIP.

I HAD ASSUMED A LOT OF NEW

RESPONSIBILITIES, YOU KNOW,

I WAS WATCHING MY BROTHER AND MY

SISTER AND WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR

THE HOUSE.

>> Man: AND THEN GEORGE WAS

INTRODUCED INTO THIS?

>> YEAH, I WOULD SAY, UH, THERE

WAS MAYBE A YEAR OR SOMETHING.

YOU KNOW, MY MOM WENT OUT WITH A

COUPLE OF GUYS, BUT, UH,

SHE LIKED GEORGE.

GEORGE WAS AN EX-MARINE,

RECENTLY DIVORCED, OWNED A

HOUSE, HAD A CARRY PERMIT, HAD

CHOPPERS AND A FAMILY BUSINESS

AND BOATS AND CORVETTES AND,

YOU KNOW, HE WAS A VERY

WELL-TO-DO GUY.

SOMEWHERE ALONG THE LINE AFTER

MY MOTHER HAD MET GEORGE,

BETWEEN GEORGE AND MY FATHER

THERE WAS AN AGREEMENT.

HE WOULD ONLY MARRY MY MOTHER

IF HE COULD LEGALLY ADOPT THE

THREE KIDS WITH A NAME CHANGE

IN THE SOCIAL SECURITY AND BIRTH

CERTIFICATES AND, YEAH,

HE WASN'T GONNA PUT HIS NAME AND

LABEL ON SOMETHING THAT WASN'T

ULTIMATELY HIS.

YOU KNOW, THAT'S WHEN I JUST

STARTED DESTROYING THIS GUY'S

WORLD EVERY OPPORTUNITY THAT I

WALKED INTO, AND JUST DO

ANYTHING TO GET HIM--

THAT WE COULD GO BACK HOME.

>> Woman: LET'S PUT IT THIS WAY,

I DON'T THINK IT WAS

THE BRADY BUNCH.

I WAS SOMEBODY THAT AT THE TIME,

FOR A COUPLE OF YEARS, THEY

BECAME FAMILIAR WITH, BUT I

ACTUALLY SAW THESE KIDS AND

INTERACTED WITH THEM

IN THEIR HOME.

I WAS JUST, I WAS SORT OF A

PRESENCE WHEN I WAS THERE.

I CERTAINLY WASN'T HARMFUL TO

THEM, SO I DON'T REALLY THINK

THAT THEY WERE RELATING TO ME

AS A REPORTER.

THEY CERTAINLY KNEW HOW I CAME

TO KNOW KATHY AND GEORGE.

I THINK THAT THERE WAS SOME

NATURAL TENSION THERE BECAUSE

THIS WAS-- YEAH, IT WAS

A STEPFATHER.

DANNY WAS NATURALLY MORE

TACITURN, MORE SELF-CONTAINED,

BUT HE WAS ALWAYS WATCHING AND

HE WAS ALWAYS VERY, VERY AWARE

OF WHAT WAS GOING ON.

JUST AS I WAS PUTTING TOGETHER

A SERIES ON DIFFERENT ASPECTS OF

PSYCHIC PHENOMENA FOR THE

STATION, CHANNEL 5 NEWS, THE

STORY ABOUT THE LUTZES AND THEIR

EXPERIENCE IN 112 OCEAN AVENUE

OR THE "AMITYVILLE HORROR HOUSE"

AS IT'S NOW COME TO BE KNOWN,

BROKE IN NEW YORK NEWSDAY.

EVERYONE WAS TRYING TO GET IN

TOUCH WITH THEM, AND IT TOOK ME

A COUPLE OF WEEKS.

NOBODY KNEW WHERE THEY WERE.

ONCE THEY HAD DONE A PRESS

CONFERENCE, THEY BASICALLY

WENT UNDERGROUND.

I FINALLY MANAGED TO LEAVE

MESSAGES FOR THEM AND TRACK THEM

DOWN, AND GEORGE LUTZ CALLED ME

AND ASKED ME IF I WOULD COME

AND MEET WITH THEM BECAUSE I

TOLD THEM I HAD GOOD CONTACTS IN

THE FIELD OF PARAPSYCHOLOGY.

SO, I DID GO OUT AND MEET WITH

GEORGE LUTZ AT HIS FAMILY-OWNED

SURVEYING FIRM AT THE TIME.

WE HAD A NICE CONVERSATION.

HE TOOK ME BACK TO HIS

MOTHER-IN-LAW'S HOUSE

TO MEET KATHY, HIS WIFE,

AND THE THREE KIDS--

THAT'S WHERE THEY WERE STAYING--

AND OVER THE COURSE OF A

FIVE-HOUR CONVERSATION WHERE

THEY TOLD ME ABOUT THEIR

STORY, THEY DECIDED THAT I WAS

SOMEONE THAT THEY COULD TRUST

AND THAT THEY WOULD ALLOW

CHANNEL 5 TO HAVE THE EXCLUSIVE

ON THE STORY.

SO, THAT'S HOW IT ALL STARTED.

[GUNSHOTS]

ON NOVEMBER 13th, 1974,

THE HOUSE AT 112 OCEAN AVENUE,

AMITYVILLE, BECAME THE SITE

OF A NOTORIOUS MASS MURDER.

23-YEAR-OLD RONALD DeFEO JR.

SHOT TO DEATH HIS FATHER,

MOTHER, TWO BROTHERS AND TWO

SISTERS WITH A .35 CALIBER

MARLIN RIFLE.

ALL SIX VICTIMS WERE DISCOVERED

BY POLICE, FACE DOWN IN THEIR

BEDS, APPARENTLY UNMOVED AND

EACH MURDERED WHILE SLEEPING.

[BELL TOLLING]

TOXICOLOGY REPORTS PROVED THE

FAMILY WAS NOT DRUGGED.

NO SILENCER HAD BEEN USED

ON THE WEAPON.

LINGERING QUESTIONS SURROUNDING

THESE MURDERS HAVE REMAINED FOR

NEARLY 40 YEARS, GIVING WAY TO

WILD CONSPIRACY THEORIES ON

WHETHER OR NOT DeFEO COULD HAVE

COMMITTED THESE CRIMES ALONE.

>> George: WELL, AT FIRST, JUST

MOVING INTO THE HOUSE WAS FINE.

IT'S A LOVELY HOUSE, AND WE

ENJOYED MOVING IN.

WITHIN A WEEK, KATHY'S HAND HAD

BEEN TOUCHED BY SOMETHING THAT

WE DISCUSSED AND COULDN'T

EXPLAIN-- IT WAS JUST

SOMETHING UNSEEN.

>> WE ALSO HAD HORDES OF FLIES

THAT WOULD APPEAR WITHIN TWO

ROOMS, AND NO MATTER HOW MANY

TIMES WE WOULD KILL 'EM,

THEY WOULD REAPPEAR.

>> Didio: THE LUTZ FAMILY

PURCHASED THE HOUSE AT THE

REDUCED PRICE OF $80,000.

VERY SHORTLY AFTER MOVING IN,

THE FAMILY CLAIMED TO HAVE BEGUN

EXPERIENCING MOUNTING PARANORMAL

PHENOMENON.

COLD SPOTS WERE DISCOVERED

RANDOMLY THROUGHOUT THE HOUSE.

GEORGE AND KATHY CLAIMED TO HAVE

WITNESSED TWO RED EYES PEERING

IN AT THEM FROM THE UPSTAIRS

BEDROOM WINDOW.

JOLTING SOUNDS WOULD WAKE THE

FAMILY DURING THE NIGHT.

>> George: My son Danny's hands

were caught in the window

in the sewing room

and they were flattened.

And it didn't just slam down,

it was mushed in such a way

that his hands were actually

deformed-- they were flat.

So we're getting him downstairs

and trying to calm him down.

It was pretty much impossible,

and you go to leave and look

at his hands and he's fine.

It didn't occur to us until much

later that the house never

really wanted us to leave.

>> Didio: THE FAMILY FLED THE

HOUSE ON JANUARY 14th, 1976.

NONE OF THE SUBSEQUENT FAMILIES

WHO HAVE LIVED IN THE HOUSE

SINCE HAVE REPORTED ANYTHING

UNUSUAL.

>> PEOPLE WE TALKED TO SEEM TO

FEEL THAT WHATEVER WAS THE

MOTIVE FOR THIS CRIME, IT HAD

SOMETHING TO DO WITH THE FAMILY.

IT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT'S GOING

TO RETURN TO BOTHER ANYONE ELSE.

>> Didio: IT WILL BE INTERESTING

TO SEE WHAT DANNY FEELS AFTER

ALL THESE YEARS.

AND WHAT'S ALSO, I THINK,

FASCINATING IS HOW MUCH OF WHAT

HE REMEMBERS ACTUALLY HAPPENED

AND HOW MUCH... DOES HE THINK

WHAT HAPPENED?

I KNEW THE CHILD.

I DON'T KNOW THE MAN.

AND YET, AMITYVILLE IS A

THREAD, AND ACTUALLY SOMETHING

THAT HAS DEFINED HE AND HIS

SIBLINGS FOR THEIR LIVES.

SO, I'D LIKE TO KNOW,

"WELL, HOW HAS IT IMPACTED YOU?"

[KNOCKS ON DOOR]

I WANT TO SEE IF HE'S COME TO

TERMS WITH THAT.

DOES HE FEEL THAT THIS IS REAL?

>> WOW... LAURA, COME IN.

WELCOME.

VERY NICE TO SEE YOU.

>> HI, GOOD TO SEE YOU.

>> HOW HAVE YOU BEEN?

>> GOOD, WHAT HAVE YOU BEEN

UP TO FOR THE LAST 30 YEARS?

>> WELL, I'VE BEEN HANGING OUT

IN HERE FOR A WHILE.

>> O.K., THE LAST TIME I SAW

YOU, YOU WERE HELPING YOUR

MOTHER DO DISHES IN THE KITCHEN

OF THE SAN DIEGO HOUSE.

>> YOU CAME TO SAN DIEGO?

>> YES.

...ONE OF THE THINGS ABOUT THE

LUTZES THAT STRUCK ME

IMMEDIATELY WAS THEY WERE NOT

SEEKING PUBLICITY.

THEY WERE VERY, VERY NORMAL.

THEY WERE A YOUNG SUBURBAN

COUPLE, THE THREE KIDS WERE

VERY, VERY NICE.

IF YOU DIDN'T KNOW ANY BETTER,

THEY WERE JUST LIKE THE COUPLE

NEXT DOOR.

I MEAN, WHEN YOU HEARD THE STORY

IT SOUNDED LIKE THEY HAD BEEN

VISITED BY JUST ABOUT EVERY FORM

OF PARAPSYCHOLOGICAL PLAGUE

IN EXISTENCE.

I OFFERED TO PUT THEM IN TOUCH

WITH PARAPSYCHOLOGISTS LIKE

ED AND LORRAINE WARREN.

THEY ACCEPTED THAT AND BASICALLY

AT THAT POINT THEY SAID, "O.K.,

FROM NOW ON ANYTHING WE DO,

YOU CAN HAVE THE EXCLUSIVE.

THERE ARE ONLY TWO CONDITIONS.

ONE, YOU DON'T GO INTO THE HOUSE

BY YOURSELF.

YOU GO IN WITH REPUTABLE

PARAPSYCHOLOGISTS.

YOU KNOW, IT WOULD BE GREAT IF

YOU COULD GET A WHOLE TEAM OF

PARAPSYCHOLOGISTS IN THERE SO

EVERYBODY COULD DO THEIR THING

AND RID THE HOUSE OF WHAT WAS

EVER IN THERE.

TWO, WE WANT OUR PRIVACY

RESPECTED," IS WHAT THEY ASKED

ME, AND THEY DEFINITELY WANTED

THE KIDS KEPT OUT OF IT.

>> THE FAMILY'S PRIVACY IN YOUR

REPORTING OF?

>> YES. >> O.K., ALL RIGHT.

>> UM, LIKE WE WEREN'T GONNA GO

TO YOUR SCHOOLS AND TAKE

PICTURES OR START INTERVIEWING

YOU AND SAYING, "DANNY?"

>> OH, I WISH SOMEBODY WOULD'VE.

>> "WHAT HAPPENED?"

WELL, BUT YOU WERE

A MINOR CHILD.

AND DON'T FORGET THIS WAS--

>> AND VERY GOOD AT SPEAKING

FOR MYSELF.

>> WHAT WOULD YOU HAVE SAID

IF YOU COULD'VE SPOKEN

FOR YOURSELF?

>> I WOULD'VE SPIT IT ALL OUT.

I WOULD'VE TOLD EVERYTHING

THAT HAD HAPPENED.

EXACTLY THE WAY IT HAPPENED

WHILE IT'S AS FRESH IN MY MIND

AS IT COULD POSSIBLY BE.

>> NOW, THAT'S AN INTERESTING

STATEMENT.

I MEAN, HOW FRESH OR DIM IS IT

IN YOUR MIND NOW?

>> IT'S ALL THERE.

I WISH I COULD GET RID OF IT.

[CLICK]

...It's been similar to

something that has been in my

dreams my entire life.

Harry was going through an

episode while the garage was

under possession-- I don't even

what the hell to call it.

The dog was going ballistic.

And George used to keep him on a

leash in the pen, but it was

just long enough for him to jump

over the fence but not hit

the floor.

I went out there to try and get

him from hanging himself, and he

was fighting so much that I was

barely strong enough to throw

him back over the fence.

But that scene to me has been

a reoccurring dream probably

500 times in my life.

Sometimes I would be Harry,

sometimes Harry would be me.

Sometimes I tried to kill him,

sometimes he tried to kill me.

Other times there was nothing

wrong with the garage.

Other times I thought I knew

what was wrong with the garage.

I mean, I was in therapy for

this one for a while.

Um, and again, it's never about

the dream, it's about the

emotions inflicted.

It's kind of hard for me to

explain to somebody, and I would

like to think that I finally got

to the point in my life where I

can articulate what I actually

think, that I'm trying to

explain that which I don't

fully understand.

If I could just bring up-- I had

no knowledge of the murders,

you know, in the news.

I didn't know anything about it

until the day we showed up

to look at the house.

And I said, "Mom, well, what do

you think of the house?"

And she's like, "Oh, God,

there's so many washing machines

in the basement, wait till you

see it," this, that, the other

thing, and they're still

talking with the real estate,

and then, you know, Mom leans

into the car and says, you know,

"There's something I want you

guys to know, that, you know,

there was a family that was

murdered here," and within that

very same two minutes asked us

if she thought that that was

gonna bother us.

Chris was just kind of, like,

looking at everything, going,

you know, what was my reaction,

what is his reaction...

I don't know that he had his

own-- you know, people murdered.

You know, when you're seven

years old, you barely know

what a murder is.

>> Didio: WHAT DO YOU RECALL

WHEN YOU FIRST MOVED INTO

THE HOUSE?

>> THAT I THOUGHT, "I COULD

LIKE IT HERE."

I THOUGHT THAT THE DOCK WAS

GONNA BE MY HANGOUT AND THE

BOATHOUSE AND, YOU KNOW, I WAS

REALLY ANXIOUS AND LOOKING

FORWARD TO... TO BE-- I FIGURED

IT WAS BIG ENOUGH TO KEEP GEORGE

AWAY FROM ME AND EVERYBODY HAD

ENOUGH ROOM AND, YOU KNOW,

"THIS IS PRETTY COOL.

I COULD WORK WITH THIS."

...MOVING-IN DAY, OH, SHIT.

HERE WE GO.

UH, THIS WAS A SELF-MOVE.

THIS WAS THE FAMILY PACKED

THE TRUCK, PACK YOUR OWN BOXES,

IF IT BREAKS IT'S YOUR FAULT

'CAUSE YOU DIDN'T PACK THE BOX

RIGHT.

BY THE TIME WE GOT TO AMITYVILLE

IT WAS, UH, I DON'T KNOW,

MIDMORNING-- 10, 11,

SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

MY JOB WAS JUST TO HAUL BOXES,

THAT'S IT.

I HELPED PACK THE TRUCK AND I'M

UNPACKING THE TRUCK.

AND I RAN DOWN TO THE BOATYARD

AND RAN UP TO THE DOCK AND

COULDN'T BELIEVE THAT THIS WAS,

LIKE, ON THE WATER WITH THE

BULKHEAD AND THE POOL

AND THE BOATHOUSE.

I GOT TO RIGHT INSIDE THE FRONT

DOOR AND I'M LOOKING AT THIS

PICTURE RIGHT HERE WHERE YOU CAN

SEE STRAIGHT UP THE STAIRCASE.

AND I RAN ALL THE WAY UP TO SEE

HOW FAR THE HOUSE WOULD GO AND

IT WAS, LIKE, LITERALLY TWICE AS

BIG AS ANYTHING ELSE WE HAD

LOOKED AT.

I LOVED IT.

I THOUGHT IT WAS GREAT.

SO, DURING THE MOVE, I DON'T

KNOW, MAYBE A QUARTER OF THE WAY

INTO THE TRUCK--

FATHER RAY SHOWS UP.

BUT I SAW HIM COME IN.

I WAS IN THE TRUCK AND I'M

PULLING BOXES OFF.

AT THAT POINT, I WANTED TO KNOW

WHICH WAS MY ROOM 'CAUSE I

WANTED FATHER RAY TO COME TO

MY ROOM TOO TO, YOU KNOW,

SHOW HIM MY ROOM.

>> Didio: SO, DID YOUR MOM

JUST CALL HIM OVER TO BLESS

THE HOUSE?

A LOT OF PEOPLE WILL DO THAT.

THAT'S JUST A NORMAL OCCURRENCE.

>> Daniel: YES.

>> Didio: SO, WHEN DID YOU START

REALLY FEELING THAT-- A SENSE OF

UNEASE, O.K., BEYOND THE--

>> WITHIN THE FIRST TWO HOURS

OF BEING IN THE HOUSE.

I MEAN, I WAS CONFUSED WITH THE

WHOLE FATHER RAY-- AND HERE HE

IS AND HE'S GETTING HIS HOLY

WATER AND HE'S FINDING THE PAGE

IN THE BIBLE AND HE WENT IN THE

HOUSE, AND I'M TAKING BOXES OUT

OF THE TRUCK, AND I HEAR HIM

TALKING TO MY MOM AND I GO BACK

OUT AND GET ANOTHER BOX AND BY

THE TIME I GET BACK, HE'S GONE.

>> WELL, HOW'D-- YOU HAD MET--

>> I DIDN'T EVEN SPEAK TO HIM.

"...MOM, WHY DID FATHER RAY

LEAVE?" YOU KNOW,

"WHAT'S GOING ON?"

AND SHE SAID, "I DON'T KNOW,

BUT, YOU KNOW, HE'LL BE BACK

OR WE'LL SEE HIM ON SUNDAY."

SUBSEQUENTLY, THE NEXT BOX WAS

TO GO UP TO THE PLAYROOM AND

WHEN I WENT IN THERE, THERE WAS

PROBABLY 4- OR 500 FLIES.

AND WE'RE TALKING-- THIS IS

MID-DECEMBER IN LONG ISLAND,

AND I STARTED YELLING AND MOM

CAME RUNNING UPSTAIRS AND SHE

STARTED SCREAMING AND GETTING

NERVOUS, AND IT FINALLY STARTED

CLICKING IN HER MIND--

I'M NOT SURE WHAT IT WAS--

WHY FATHER RAY HAD JUST LEFT.

I WOULD STAND THERE WITH THE

NEWSPAPER SMASHING THEM ON THE

WALL AND SMASHING THEM ON THE

WINDOW, AND KNOWING THAT IN FIVE

MINUTES I HAD JUST KILLED ABOUT

A HUNDRED FLIES, AND I WENT

DOWNSTAIRS TO TELL MOM TO HAVE

HER COME UP TO BE ALL PROUD THAT

YOU KILLED THE FLIES, AND THE

DEAD FLIES ARE GONE.

AND SHE WOULD LOOK AT ME AND

SAY, "WHAT DID YOU DO?

YOU DID WHAT?

WHERE'S THE NEWSPAPER?"

BUT-- I'D JUST LEFT THE

NEWSPAPER ON THE FLOOR.

"WELL, WHERE'S THE DEAD FLIES?"

AND THAT'S WHEN MY CONFUSION

STARTED.

[CAR HORN HONKS]

...YO, WHAT'S UP?!

>> Didio: WHEN DID YOU START

FEELING, SENSING, ANY UNEASE?

OR WHAT WAS YOUR FIRST--

>> Daniel: WHEN MY MOTHER WAS...

COULD NOT-- SHE WAS ABLE TO

DESCRIBE ANYTHING.

IF I WALKED IN, I SAID, "MOM,

WHAT'S WRONG?" SHE WOULD TELL ME

IMMEDIATELY WHAT'S GOING ON.

>> MM-HMM. >> AND SHE WOULDN'T

KEEP THINGS FROM ME.

UM, AND NOW SHE'S KEEPING

SECRETS FROM ME.

AND I SAYS, "MOM, I THOUGHT WE

HAD THIS AGREEMENT HERE?"

AND SHE WAS GIVING ME THESE...

BULLSHIT EXCUSES, YOU KNOW.

OR NOT ANSWERING ME OR PASSING

OFF THAT I WANT TO KNOW

WHAT'S GOING ON.

>> THE HOUSE SEEMED TO REACT

DIFFERENTLY, OR PEOPLE REACTED

DIFFERENTLY TO THE HOUSE.

LIKE, YOUR MOTHER SAID SHE HAD A

FEELING OF PEACE AND DIDN'T EVEN

WANT TO GO OUT TO DO NORMAL

CHORES AND THINGS.

GEORGE ALWAYS SAID HE COULDN'T

GET WARM, AND HE WAS-- ADMITTED

TO BECOMING MORE AGGRESSIVE.

>> MM-HMM. >> AND THEN, UM,

ONE OF THE THINGS THAT THEY--

THERE'S A WHOLE LIST OF THINGS

THAT THEY TOLD ME ABOUT, THAT

I'VE PUT IN BULLET POINTS HERE.

THERE WERE SUBTLE PERSONALITY

CHANGES IN ALL THE FAMILY

MEMBERS, BUT BASICALLY THAT

ALL OF YOU WERE AFFECTED.

YOU HAD VERY SHORT TEMPERS.

VIOLENCE WAS COMMONPLACE, AND

THEY SAID THAT AT ONE POINT--

AND GEORGE SAID THIS-- THAT HE

AND KATHY TOOK WOODEN SPOONS TO

YOU AND YOUR BROTHER AND SISTER,

UM, AND BEAT THEM WITH IT

ONE NIGHT AND ORDERED YOU GUYS

AROUND THE HOUSE LIKE

DRILL SERGEANTS.

DO YOU RECALL THAT?

>> YEAH, WELL, THAT HAPPENED

PROBABLY 50 TIMES AFTER THAT,

TOO, SO IT'S, UH...

>> DID IT HAPPEN BEFORE YOU

MOVED INTO THE HOUSE?

>> IT HAPPENED A COUPLE OF TIMES

IN GEORGE'S HOUSE BEFORE WE

MOVED TO AMITYVILLE.

>> DO YOU THINK--

>> 'CAUSE HE HAD NO PARENT

SKILLS AND HE WAS ONLY EVER

A MARINE-- THAT'S HOW HE KNEW

HOW TO HANDLE THINGS.

I SAID, "THIS IS GONNA BE

A CAKEWALK."

>> DID SHE TRY AND PROTECT YOU

FROM HIM?

OR WERE YOU EXPECTING HER

TO PROTECT YOU?

>> NO, ABSOLUTELY NOT.

MY MOTHER TO PROTECT ME FROM-- ?

NO, NO, NO, NO-- NO.

"I'M HERE TO PROTECT HER

FROM YOU."

I HAD TO SPEAK TO GEORGE

IN "SIR."

I DIDN'T CALL HIM GEORGE,

I DIDN'T CALL HIM LEE.

"MR. LUTZ" OR "SIR."

>> YOU HAD TO CALL HIM MR. LUTZ?

>> OR SIR.

>> BUT AT THAT POINT HE WAS

YOUR STEPFATHER. >> SO?

WHAT, YOU THINK I'M GONNA

CALL HIM DAD?

"YOU'RE NOT MY FATHER."

>> SO, YOU GUYS WERE JUST

REPULSED BY ONE ANOTHER

AT A MOLECULAR LEVEL?

WELL, I CAN'T SAY BY ONE ANOTHER

BECAUSE GEORGE ISN'T HERE,

BUT YOU DIDN'T...

>> I'M SORRY, I CAN'T HELP

BUT SMILE WHEN YOU SAY THAT.

>> WHY, DO YOU THINK HE'S HERE?

>> NO, THAT HE'S DEAD NOW.

>> YOU'RE HAPPY THAT HE'S DEAD?

>> YES, MA'AM, I AM.

AND I'M A FREE MAN, AND I HAD

NOTHING TO DO WITH IT.

THAT I HAD ATTEMPTED ON HIM

PROBABLY 50 TIMES.

>> YOU TRIED TO KILL HIM?

[PLAYING RAPIDLY]
>> YEAH.

>> YEAH.

[SPEAKER BUZZES]

[BIRDS CHIRPING...]

THIS THING'S BEEN STORED

ALL WINTER-- THIS IS THE FIRST

TIME I'M STARTING IT UP.

STORED IT DRY.

PUT OIL IN, CHARGED THE BATTERY,

GET US A GALLON OF GAS.

GOOD TO GO. >> Man: NICE.

>> AS YOU SEE, ALL MY SHIT

STARTS RIGHT UP.

[ENGINE REVVING]

>> Man: TALK TO ME

ABOUT WHITESTONE.

WHERE YOU ARE RIGHT NOW.

>> Daniel: WHITESTONE'S

A PRETTY COOL PLACE.

IT'S, UH, GOT THAT OLD

SMALL-TOWN CHARM.

I'VE BEEN THE U.P.-- UH, I DON'T

KNOW, OOH, CAN I SAY THAT?

CAN I SAY U.P.S.? >> Man: SURE.

>> THE UNITED PARCEL SERVICE

DRIVER FOR BETTER THAN 15 YEARS

IN COLLEGE POINT, WHITESTONE,

AND I KNOW, I'M GONNA SAY 50%

OF THE NEIGHBORHOOD ON A

FIRST-NAME BASIS.

THAT WAS ONE OF THE REASONS

I WAS ABLE TO STICK AROUND IN

THIS TOWN AFTER THE MOVIES CAME

OUT AND EVERYTHING WENT PUBLIC.

...PEOPLE KNOW ME AS GREG,

PEOPLE KNOW ME AS BILLY,

AND PEOPLE KNOW ME AS DANNY.

>> WHY?

>> WELL, BECAUSE MY NAME WAS

THAT IN THIS MOVIE AND THEN MY

NAME WAS THAT IN THAT MOVIE...

>> I SEE, OF COURSE, YES.

>> ...WAS THAT IN THAT MOVIE.

SO, IF I DIDN'T TELL YOU

THE STORY...

>> THEY JUST THOUGHT THAT.

>> AND THE GIRL DOWNSTAIRS

SAID, "THAT'S THE KID FROM

AMITYVILLE," AND YOU

WENT HOME AND...

>> RIGHT.

THAT'S WEIRD FOR YOU.

>> YEAH, AND... THEY DON'T KNOW

UNTIL I GIVE THEM THE ANSWER.

>> YEAH. >> SO THIS WOULD BE,

LIKE, A DAILY CONFUSION THING.

I LEARNED A LOT FROM--

>> DO YOU THINK OF YOURSELF

AS THE AMITYVILLE GUY?

WHEN YOU THINK PRIVATELY INSIDE

YOURSELF? >> YEAH.

'CAUSE I AM THE AMITYVILLE GUY.

ALL RIGHT, IT'S NOT...

>> IS THAT, LIKE, WHO YOU THINK

OF YOURSELF AS FIRST, THOUGH?

>> NO, I'M DANNY.

>> O.K., O.K., SO IT'S NOT YOUR

FIRST THOUGHT ABOUT YOURSELF.

>> AND YOU'RE TALKING TO DANNY,

DANIEL'S BODYGUARD.

>> RIGHT. >> ALL I DO

IS WALK AROUND PROTECTING

THAT 10-YEAR-OLD KID.

>> WELL, THAT'S RIGHT, EXACTLY.

THAT'S WHAT I KEEP THINKING.

THAT YOU HAVE WORKED SO HARD TO

BE YOURSELF, WHEREAS MOST PEOPLE

JUST GET TO BE THEMSELVES.

>> YOU KNOW, THERE'S A...

I WANT TO SAY THIS BUT I CAN'T,

YOU KNOW, LIKE GEORGE, MY

STEPFATHER, WOULD INTRODUCE

HIMSELF AT THE AMITY GUY,

YOU KNOW.

HE COULDN'T BE MORE PROUD

OF ANYTHING. >> YEAH.

>> "I'M THAT GUY.

THIS IS MY NAME.

THIS IS MY STORY.

THIS IS, THIS IS MY FAMILY.

ALL OF THIS, THIS IS

ALL ABOUT ME." >> YEAH.

>> HERE'S THE BIGGEST FUCKING

ASSHOLE YOU COULD EVER MEET.

[♪...]

>> Man: DID YOU FEEL PHYSICALLY

THREATENED LIVING INSIDE

THIS HOUSE?

>> I GOTTA BE HONEST WITH YOU,

MAN, AND IT TOOK ME A BUNCH OF

YEARS TO GET TO THIS POINT.

I... KIND OF GOT MY KICKS

OUT OF IT.

IT FULFILLED SOMETHING IN MY

LIFE THAT, UH...

>> Man: HOW DO YOU MEAN?

>> I MEAN IN THE SADISTIC,

FUCKED-UP SIDE OF MY BRAIN,

I COULDN'T POSSIBLY TOP THIS

WITH MY OWN CREA-- IMAGINATION.

[RECORDER CLICKS, TAPE ROLLING]

...Well, there were cold spots

in the house, um, in hallways

and rooms and things like that.

Meanwhile, the furnace is

jacked up, the fire has got

half a cord in there that

it's so full, it's fucking

choking itself.

You know, he's got blankets

in front of the door and

blankets in front of the,

you know, drafts, and all of

this stuff.

The house is now weatherproofed,

you know, draft-proofed.

You walk in the front door,

the fireplace is to the left,

the dining room is to the right.

If you walk into the dining

room, there's the kitchen.

And there would be literally

20 degrees difference in

five steps.

There was a spot in the middle

of my room, there was a spot

where the lion's head picture is

next to the bathroom, uh, on

the second floor, in the very

center of that platform on the

staircase, and those spots

didn't change.

There was more what I observed

than what had happened to me

in the beginning.

[TAPE CLICKS OFF]

...THIS IS NOT SOMETHING

THAT JUST ONE PERSON SAW.

THE ENTIRE FAMILY'S STANDING

THERE WATCHING THE FUCKING

GARAGE DOOR SLAM UP AND SLAM

DOWN AND SLAM UP AND SLAM DOWN,

AND THE DOG IS FUCKING

HANGING HIMSELF.

...SO I WOULD GO OUT THERE WITH

GEORGE, HE WOULD PICK ME UP

AND I WOULD DO-- I WOULD BE

HANGING OFF ONE SIDE OF THE

DOOR AND HE WOULD BE PULLING

DOWN ON THE OTHER SIDE OF

THE DOOR, AND WE'D GET IT AND

WE'D LOCK EVERYTHING BACK UP

WITH THE HASPS, AND WHEN WE'RE

GOING BACK INTO THE HOUSE--

MY SISTER'S ROOM WAS ABOVE THE

POOL IN THE BACKYARD,

TO THE RIGHT.

>> Man: WHAT DID YOU SEE?

WHAT WAS IN THE WINDOW?

>> IT WOULD'VE BEEN WHAT LOOKED

LIKE A CARTOON CHARACTER

OF A, UH...

AN ANGRY PIG.

WITH, LIKE, WOLF-LIKE TEETH

AND RED EYES.

LASER-BEAM RED EYES.

AND AT THAT, CLOSING THE DOOR,

SEEING THIS FROM MY SISTER'S

ROOM, I RAN INTO THE HOUSE

FASTER THAN GEORGE DID AND MADE

IT UPSTAIRS TO HER ROOM.

AND THE ROCKING CHAIR IS JUST

SITTING THERE, BACK AND FORTH,

BACK AND FORTH, BACK AND FORTH.

[CHAIR CREAKING]

AND GEORGE WENT INTO HER ROOM

AND PICKED THE CHAIR UP

AND HE'S LOOKING AT THE CHAIR,

AND HE'S LOOKING AT THE LEGS

AND HE'S LOOKING AT EVERYTHING

ON THE FLOOR, AND THERE'S

NO LOGICAL EXPLANATION WHY THIS

ROCKING CHAIR HAS BEEN DOING

THIS FOR 20 FUCKING MINUTES.

I THINK IT WAS A FORCE THAT WAS

BEYOND MY CONTROL.

I BELIEVE THAT THERE IS A SUCH

THING AS EVIL AND I THINK THAT

IT CAN MANIFEST ITSELF IN ANY

WAY, SHAPE OR FORM THAT IT

CHOOSES AT WILL, AND I WAS A

VICTIM OF-- TO THAT.

[TAPE RECORDER CLICKS]

>> Man: So, do you believe

you were possessed?

>> Daniel: I don't believe

I was, I know I was.

You know, I know that the spirit

of some other thing passed

right through me.

Right fucking through me.

My mother was standing right

there and she just broke down

and cried.

That, that was like the most

horrible thing she'd ever

seen to that point in her life.

>> Man: And that was in

the house?

>> It was in the house, yeah.

I had just gotten in a fight

with George about-- I don't even

remember anymore.

So, by the time I got to the

second landing of the last thing

to the third floor...

my-- I was projected up the

stairs, into the wall,

and my mother was like

15 feet behind me.

Um, and I stand up and, and

my body just, like, starts...

I no longer have control

of myself.

I'm standing on the floor,

I'm looking at my mother,

I don't know what to say to her,

she doesn't know what to say

to me, and she jumps around

in shock like something just

scraped her or touched her,

and it entered into me,

through me.

And if I have to describe what

it felt like, it would be like

the numbness after being

shocked.

And from somewhere in the room,

it said, "It is you."

It was like sub-bass, like with

a gargle and a crackle to it.

And that stuck with me at least

a decade on a daily basis.

And if anybody ever saw me with

a tear in my eye, it's because

I could not shut it off.

My mother, I would ask her,

you know, throughout the years,

"What did that mean?

Why would," you know.

And she would try and offer

that, you know, maybe it was

the voice of God, and it was his

way of saying that you're going

to be O.K., and I'm just like,

"Yeah, all right, Mom.

It ain't gonna work on me."

[TAPE CLICKS OFF]

>> Didio: WHO WAS POSSESSED?

>> GEORGE AND MYSELF.

>> YOU FEEL THAT YOU WERE

POSSESSED?

>> I WAS, UH, YEAH, I THINK THAT

WHAT HAD HAPPENED AT SOME POINT

WAS EXTREMELY, UH, JUST SO FAR

BEYOND MY CONTROL, YEAH.

>> YOU MEAN IN TERMS OF YOUR

VIOLENCE TOWARDS GEORGE

AND HIS TOWARDS YOU?

>> I THINK, NO, I MEAN, UM...

[SIGHS]

NO, THIS HAD NOTHING TO DO

WITH HATRED.

THIS HAVING TO DO WITH ME NO

LONGER HAVING CONTROL OF MY BODY

OR MY MIND OR WHAT I'M SAYING

OR WHAT I'M DOING.

>> HOW LONG DID THAT LAST?

>> IT FELT LIKE MY WHOLE LIFE.

I DON'T KNOW, A HALF-HOUR.

25, 35 MINUTES.

[THUNDER RUMBLING]

>> Didio: MEN WERE INFESTED WITH

VIOLENT REACTIONS WHILE WOMEN,

KATHY SAID, WERE CHARMED BY

THE HOUSE AND OVERCOME WITH A

FEELING OF "LASSIDITUDE."

THE BOATHOUSE WAS A SOURCE OF

POLTERGEIST ACTIVITY,

LUTZ ALLEGED.

HE HAD GONE OUT TO CHECK IT

ONE NIGHT AND FOUND A

GREEN SLIME, WHICH HE DUBBED

"POLTERGEIST PUKE", OOZING

ALL OVER THE PLACE.

AFTER JANUARY 6th, THE FEAST OF

THE EPIPHANY, WHEN THEY TOOK

DOWN THE CHRISTMAS DECORATIONS,

ALL HELL BROKE LOSE, KATHY SAID.

>> Daniel: IT STARTED OUT AS AN

INCREDIBLE, FOUL, DUMPSTER-JUICE

TYPE OF SMELL-- STENCH.

WE STARTED GOING AROUND OPENING

ALL THE WINDOWS AND THE DOORS

ALL OVER THE HOUSE.

I HAD GOT UP TO THE PLAYROOM--

THE ROOM WITH THE FLIES--

WAS TRYING TO OPEN A JAMMED

WINDOW, AND I GET IT OPEN,

AND I FELT LIKE SUPERMAN.

I WAS LIKE, "WOW, THAT WAS,

LIKE, ONE OF THE STRONGEST

THINGS I EVER DID.

I GOT THIS WINDOW OPEN."

AND MY BROTHER ENTERED THE ROOM,

"HEY, YOU GOT IT?"

AND I TURNED AROUND TO LOOK AT

HIM, "YEAH, I GOT IT."

AND THE WINDOW CAME SLAMMING

DOWN... AND IT CRUSHED

MY FINGERS TO THE POINT THAT IT

WAS SKIN ON SKIN.

LEFT HAND AND RIGHT HAND.

SHATTERED THIS SECTION OF

THIS FINGER.

THIS KNUCKLE'S NEVER BEEN THE

SAME, AND I DON'T KNOW IF YOU

CAN SEE THAT RIGHT THERE,

THAT LITTLE HOOK IN MY PINKY.

ONE HAND COMPARED TO THE OTHER?

CAN YOU SEE THAT?

THAT'S FROM THE WINDOWSILL,

LIKE THAT AND WHEN IT SMASHED.

AND THIS WAS BOTH HANDS.

AND, UH, IT TOOK GEORGE,

MY MOTHER, MY BROTHER, WHOEVER

GEORGE'S FRIEND WAS THERE

HELPING HIM MOVE SHIT AROUND, TO

GET THE WINDOW OFF MY FINGERS.

AND MY MOM STARTS FISHING FOR

ICE AND SHE WANTS TO MAKE PHONE

CALLS AND GET ICE AND DO ALL OF

THESE THINGS.

IN HER TURNING AROUND TO GET A

RAG TO PUT THE ICE CUBES IN TO

PUT IN MY HAND AS WE'RE SITTING

IN THE KITCHEN, THE SIDE DOOR

OPENS.

VERY SLOWLY.

AND WE BOTH STOP WHAT WE'RE

DOING TO PAY ATTENTION, AND

THERE WAS NOBODY THERE.

[SIGHS] WOW, I HATE DOING THIS.

I FUCKING HATE DOING THIS.

WHY ARE YOU MAKING ME DO THIS,

DUDE?

[SIGHS]

I'M JUST-- I JUST GOT TO SPIT

THIS OUT, ALL RIGHT?

A FUCKING SPIRIT COMES INTO THE

HOUSE, INTO THE ROOM, THROUGH

THE DOOR, BUMPS INTO MY MOTHER,

WALKS THROUGH MY HANDS LIKE THIS

THAT ARE HANGING OFF THE TABLE.

KNOCKS THE PEANUT BUTTER AND

AND SITS DOWN IN THIS SPOT HERE.
JELLY KNIFE DOWN ONTO THE FLOOR,

JELLY KNIFE DOWN ONTO THE FLOOR,

>> Didio: DID YOU HEAR A

HUMMING, A BUZZING?

WHAT KIND OF NOISE? >> NO.

>> SO, IT JUST SAT THERE, OR

SOMETHING MADE AN IMPRESSION

ON THE SEAT? >> YES.

>> WHAT DID YOU GUYS DO?

>> UH, WE STOOD--

>> MOST PEOPLE WOULD BE OUT OF

THE HOUSE AT THIS POINT.

>> WELL, I, SHE, "MOM, CAN I

HAVE THE ICE?" YOU KNOW, AND...

>> WHAT HAPPENED SPECIFICALLY?

>> WE'RE DOING THIS AND SHE'S

WRAPPING MY HANDS AND IN THAT

THREE SECONDS IT TOOK TO LOOK

BACK, IT WAS GONE.

>> WHERE WAS GEORGE AT THIS

POINT? >> HE WAS UPSTAIRS

TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT

HAPPENED TO THE WINDOW.

WHY IS IT STUCK?

SO, AS I'M SITTING THERE AND MY

MOTHER FLIPS OVER MY HANDS AND

SHE LOOKING BACK AND SHE'S LIKE

"WOW," 'CAUSE WE'RE TALKING

SKIN ON SKIN HERE.

AND, UH, MY HANDS SWELL UP TO

THE SIZE OF, UH, A CHILD'S

BASEBALL GLOVE.

FIVE TIMES THEIR NORMAL SIZE.

>> NOW, DID THEY TAKE YOU

TO THE DOCTORS?

>> AND IN ONE SECOND, MY HAND

WENT BACK TO NORMAL, EXCEPT FOR

THIS PINKY.

>> SO, THAT PINKY, LET'S SEE.

IT'S STILL-- >> THAT'S PERMANENT

FROM THAT-- >> IT'S STILL BENT.

>> NO.
DID THEY TAKE YOU TO THE DOCTOR?

DID THEY TAKE YOU TO THE DOCTOR?

>> Man: "MY ASSIGNMENT THAT

SATURDAY NIGHT IN MARCH 1976 WAS

TO STAY IN THE HOUSE AND REPORT

ON ANY UNUSUAL ACTIVITY.

A NUMBER OF PSYCHICS,

PARAPSYCHOLOGISTS,

CLAIRVOYANTS AND A

DEMONOLOGIST WERE ALSO THERE TO

DETERMINE, ONCE AND FOR ALL,

IF THE HOUSE WAS POSSESSED BY

SOME DEMONIC FORCE AS GEORGE

AND KATHY LUTZ SUGGESTED TO

CHANNEL 5 NEWS A MONTH EARLIER.

IF THERE WAS A DEMONIC FORCE IN

THE HOUSE THAT MARCH NIGHT,

IT CERTAINLY DID NOT MANIFEST

ITSELF PHYSICALLY WHILE

I WAS THERE.

THE PSYCHIC SUGGESTED THE HOUSE

HAD BEEN NEUTRALIZED,

THE ATMOSPHERE NOT RIGHT AT THE

MOMENT, THAT PERHAPS THE DEMONS,

WELL, THEY WERE SCARED OFF BY

THE CROWD AND OUR CAMERAS."

NOW, THAT WAS ALL ON FILM.

I CAME OUT ON CAMERA IN OUR

NEWSROOM AND I TAGGED THE PIECE

LIKE THIS: "OFTEN I'M ASKED IF I

WAS SCARED DURING MY NIGHT IN

THE HOUSE AT 112 OCEAN AVENUE.

NO, I WAS NOT.

IT WOULD BE MORE ACCURATE FOR ME

TO SAY THAT THE TWO HOURS I

SPENT WATCHING THE MOVIE FRIDAY

NIGHT WITH A ROWDY, DISRUPTIVE,

POT-SMOKING AUDIENCE WAS MUCH

MORE OF A HORROR THAN THE SIX

HOURS I SPENT IN THAT HOUSE

IN AMITYVILLE." [LAUGHS]

>> THE LUTZES, THOUGH, WERE

CONVINCED THEMSELVES,

AND THEY TOOK...

AT TREMENDOUS PERSONAL COST.

WE WANTED TO FIND A STORY.

WE WANTED TO BELIEVE THEM.

THEY CAME ACROSS

AS VERY SINCERE.

>> AFTER I EDITED THE STORY--

WHICH WE HAD TO DO QUICKLY TO

GET IT ON THE AIR-- I WENT BACK

AND LOOKED AT EVERY FOOT

OF THAT FILM.

THERE WAS NOTHING ON THAT FILM

EXCEPT THE PEOPLE WHO WERE ON

THERE TELLING THEIR STORY.

>> THE THING THAT I WOULD FIND

THE MOST CURIOUS THING OF THE

NIGHT THAT I WAS THERE WOULD BE

THE SENSATION FELT BY STEVE

PETROPOLIS, OUR CAMERAMAN.

SO, OUT OF THE BLUE,

HE HAD THESE PALPITATIONS.

AND THIS WAS A MAN WHO HAD

COVERED SOME SERIOUS ASSIGNMENTS

IN WAR ZONES AND RIOTS AND HE--

SUDDENLY HE WAS OVERCOME BY

SOMETHING AND HE COULD NOT

EXPLAIN IT.

HE SAID HE HAD NO HEART

CONDITION, BUT HE CLIMBED THE

STEPS AND SUDDENLY HE STOPPED.

HE HAD TO PUT THE CAMERA DOWN.

AND... UNEXPLAINED-- ANOTHER

OF THE UNEXPLAINED PHENOMENA

IN THAT HOUSE.

>> Didio : I DO RECALL LORRAINE

WARREN WHEN SHE WENT INTO THE

TRANCE SAYING IT WAS A DEMONIC

FORCE FROM DEEP IN THE BOWELS

OF THE EARTH.

>> Scott: WASN'T THAT BEDROOM,

WASN'T THAT IN THE SEWING ROOM?

>> YES. >> THE SEWING ROOM

WAS THE ROOM WHICH SUPPOSEDLY,

AS THE STORY HAS IT, WHERE

THE DEMONIC FORCE WAS SUPPOSED

TO BE THE STRONGEST.

LORRAINE WARREN AND I AND YOU,

WE WENT UPSTAIRS AND WE SAT

IN THE SEWING ROOM.

WE HAD A CANDLE GOING AND I

REMEMBER LORRAINE SAID SHE HAD

NEVER FELT SUCH A FORCE THAT SHE

FELT THAT NIGHT.

IT WAS LIKE FEELING

LIKE SHE WAS IN HELL.

LORRAINE ALSO PRODUCED A

PHOTOGRAPH IN WHICH SHE CLAIMS

THAT THERE IS THE IMAGE

OF A BOY.

>> Didio : THIS IS ONE OF THE

PICTURES THAT THEIR PHOTOGRAPHER

TOOK THAT NIGHT.

YOU AND I BOTH KNOW THAT THERE

WERE NO CHILDREN AND NO ANIMALS

IN THE HOUSE THAT NIGHT.

>> Scott: YOU CAN TAKE A LOOK

AT IT, BUT THEN AGAIN TRY

AND INTERPRET IT FROM

A GRAINY PHOTOGRAPH...

I THINK IT'S ALL VERY BIZARRE.

>> Man: BUT LET'S LOOK AT THE

COUNTER SIDE FOR JUST A MOMENT.

I'M NOT ARGUING IT OR EVEN

DISPUTING ANY OF IT.

I'VE BEEN IN THE HOUSE, I WAS

THERE THE NIGHT OF THE MURDERS.

I HAD THE WEBER INTERVIEW THAT

SUPPOSEDLY EXPOSED THE WHOLE

THING, ALL RIGHT, SO WE'VE ALL

BEEN INVOLVED EXTENSIVELY.

THERE'S NO ARGUMENT THERE,

BUT WHAT ABOUT THE ARGUMENTS

THAT SURFACE FROM ONE SOURCE

OR THE OTHER, THAT--

FOR EXAMPLE, THE REASON THEY HAD

TO LEAVE THE HOUSE WAS BECAUSE

THEY LET IT FORECLOSE.

THEY JUST DIDN'T HAVE THE MONEY.

IT WAS MORE MONEY-- THE LAND

SURVEYING BUSINESS WAS JUST NOT

DOING VERY WELL AND THEN HE HAD

TO SELL THE HOUSE, COULDN'T

SELL THE HOUSE, HAD TO GET OUT,

COULDN'T PAY IT, AS A

STARTING POINT-- THEN WE'LL

TALK ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED.

>> O.K., AS A STARTING POINT.

WELL, I WASN'T PRIVY TO

THEIR FINANCES.

HOWEVER THEY GOT THE HOUSE FOR

$80,000, THE PURCHASE PRICE,

WITH THE POSSESSIONS.

>> I'M GOING TO ASSUME THAT THIS

REALTOR WHO SOLD THEM THE HOUSE

MUST HAVE, AT SOME POINT,

IF THEY DIDN'T ALREADY KNOW

THAT THIS INFAMOUS CASE HAD--

>> Didio: NO, THEY KNEW IT.

THEY KNEW IT.

>> SO, THEY DID KNOW?

>> THEY DID KNOW AND THEY--

>> SO, THIS MAKES IT EVEN WORSE.

>> THEY DID--

>> NOT ONLY YOU DO KNOW THAT IT

WAS THE SCENE OF A MASS MURDER,

NOW THE BELONGINGS OF

THAT FAMILY.

NOW, A COUPLE OF POINTS--

>> O.K., LETS PLAY DEVIL'S

ADVOCATE FOR ONE SECOND THOUGH.

I'VE HEARD ALL THE STORIES ABOUT

THEY GOT INTO FINANCIAL

STRAITS, BUT HOW COULD YOU?

THEY DIDN'T HAVE ENOUGH TIME TO

GET THAT FAR BEHIND IF THEY WERE

ONLY IN THE HOUSE FOR 28 DAYS.

NOW, AS TO THE POINT COULD HE

HAVE BEEN DREAMING UP A SCHEME?

YEAH, HE ABSOLUTELY COULD HAVE.

>> DID YOU-- EXCUSE ME, DID YOU

FIND ANY EVIDENCE THAT HE

UNDERSTOOD THE OCCULT AND

SUPERNATURAL BEFORE THEY MOVED

INTO THE HOUSE?

THAT GEORGE LUTZ, SPECIFICALLY?

>> WHAT GEORGE LUTZ ALWAYS

MAINTAINED TO ME WAS THAT HE WAS

A NON-PRACTICING METHODIST.

THE RUMORS THAT I'VE HEARD,

SECOND-, THIRD-, FOURTH-HAND

OVER THE YEARS, WERE THAT HE HAD

HAD AN ABIDING INTEREST

IN THE OCCULT.

>> Martin: I THINK THAT LUTZ

TRIGGERED SOMETHING OFF

BY BEING OPEN TO IT.

BY PREVIOUS ACTIVITY POSSIBLY ON

THE PART OF RONNIE DeFEO.

THEY WERE FOOLING AROUND AND GOT

THEMSELVES IN VERY DEEP WITH

SOMETHING DARK AND SOMETHING

EVIL THAT THEY TOTALLY DIDN'T

UNDERSTAND, NOR WERE THEY

AWARE OF.

>> YOU KNOW, WE WERE INVITED BY

THE CROMARTYS TO COME IN AFTER

THE LUTZES LEFT.

THE FAMILY THAT MOVED IN.

AND THIS WAS IN DECEMBER OF '77.

SO, WE WENT THROUGH THE

ENTIRE PLACE.

WE TOOK PICTURES.

WE TOOK INFRARED PICTURES.

AND I HAD A PSYCHIC, RON

MANGRAVITE, NO LONGER LIVING,

THAT I HAD WORKED WITH

FOR MANY, MANY YEARS.

SO, RON MANGRAVITE WALKS

THROUGH THE HOUSE.

I SAID, "SO, WHAT DO YOU THINK?"

AND HE SAID, "WOW."

AND I SAID, "WHAT?"

AND HE SAID, "THERE'S A LOT OF

RITUAL MAGIC GOING ON IN THAT

HOUSE OR HAS BEEN."

HE GOES, "WERE THE LUTZES

INVOLVED IN RITUAL MAGIC?"

THIS WAS ALL ABOUT BLACK MAGIC

BEING DONE IN THIS HOUSE AND

THEN HE FELT THE RESIDUAL

AFFECTS OF THAT WERE THESE

PSYCHOLOGICAL,

HALLUCINATORY EXPERIENCES THAT

PEOPLE THOUGHT WERE REAL,

BUT THEY'RE NOT REALLY REAL,

BUT THEY ARE PARANORMALLY

INDUCED.

>> THERE ARE ALLEGATIONS THAT HE

KNEW MORE ABOUT THE OCCULT AND

THE SUPERNATURAL BEFORE THEY

MOVED IN THAN HE'S ADMITTED OR

EVER DID ADMIT IN HIS LIFE.

>> Man: HAD EITHER OF YOU HAD

ANY EXPERIENCE BEFORE WITH THE

OCCULT OR THE SUPERNATURAL?

EVER BEFORE?

>> WE DIDN'T BELIEVE IN IT.

>> Daniel: I WAS PURPOSELY

NOSING INTO GEORGE'S BUSINESS

BUT THERE WERE THINGS-- WHEN YOU

WALKED INTO GEORGE'S HOUSE, IT

WASN'T INVITING AND WELCOMING.

IF YOU READ HIS BOOKCASE,

YOU KNOW, IT WOULD RANGE FROM

TRANSCENDENTAL MEDITATION TO

BUDDHISM, SATANIC HISTORY,

MIND-CONTROL TYPE OF BOOKS

AND HYPNOSIS BOOKS.

THIS GUY WAS INTO SOME

PRETTY DARK STUFF.

WHEN I STARTED THUMBING THROUGH

THESE BOOKS AND THEY'RE

SACRIFICING VIRGINS AT DEVIL

WORSHIP RALLIES AND, YOU KNOW,

SHIT LIKE THIS AND I'M READING

THIS IN THE BOOK AND I WALK OVER

TO MY MOTHER AND SHE JUST

CRACKED ME OVER THE HEAD AND

SAID, "PUT THIS BACK AND DON'T

TAKE IT OFF THE SHELF."

AND I LOOKED AT HER AND I SAID,

"ABSOLUTELY NOT!

YOU MARRIED THIS GUY.

YOU MOVED ME TO HIS HOUSE.

YOU STUPID MOTHERFUCKER.
WHAT THE HELL IS HE INTO?"

WHAT THE HELL IS HE INTO?"

>> GEORGE WAS NOT RIGHT-- YOU

CAN SEE THAT, THE FEAR IN THE

KIDS, IN THEIR ACKNOWLEDGEMENT--

IF HE'S PRESENT, THEY'RE

DIFFERENT, YOU KNOW, AND

EVERYONE WAS, I BELIEVE-- I WAS.

I CAN SAY THERE WAS A LOT OF

FEAR AND ANXIETY IN OUR HOUSE

ABOUT IT.

THERE'S SOMETHING ABOUT HIS

PRESENCE THAT MADE--

THREW YOU OFF....

AS A CHILD YOU KNOW SOMETHING

IS OFF WITH THIS MAN.

SOMETHING NOT RIGHT.

SOMETHING NOT GOOD.

>> Didio : I THINK THAT CERTAIN

PEOPLE CAN TRIGGER THINGS.

AND IN THIS CASE I THINK THAT

WHATEVER HAPPENED AFTER RONALD

DeFEO MURDERED HIS FAMILY, I

THINK IT LINGERED THERE AND I

THINK, I ALWAYS FELT THAT GEORGE

LUTZ WAS THE TRIGGER FOR WHAT

STARTED TO HAPPEN

TO THAT FAMILY.

ED WARREN ALWAYS TALKED ABOUT

CERTAIN PEOPLE WHEN WE WERE IN

THE HOUSE THE NIGHT OF

MARCH 6th.

THERE WERE A COUPLE OF PEOPLE

THERE THAT ED SAID WERE GOING

FROM ROOM TO ROOM ANTAGONIZING

THE HOUSE OR THE SPIRITS.

WELL, I CALLED THE WARRENS UP.

"WHAT ARE YOU AND ED DOING,

LORRAINE?

CAN YOU COME DOWN HERE?

THERE'S THIS CASE THAT'S JUST

BROKEN, IT'S BEEN IN THE NEWS."

I GAVE ED AND LORRAINE

THE BACKGROUND.

THEY SAID, "SURE, WE'LL COME

RIGHT DOWN."

WE DROVE OUT TO THE HOUSE AND

GEORGE WAS MEETING US THERE

AND GEORGE WOULD NOT GO ONTO

THE PROPERTY.

EVERYTHING WAS ON THE TABLE:

THE GINGERBREAD HOUSE THAT KATHY

HAD MADE THE KIDS FOR CHRISTMAS;

THE CLOTHES WERE, YOU KNOW,

STREWN ABOUT, NEWSPAPERS;

THERE WAS FOOD IN THE

REFRIGERATOR.

IT JUST LOOKED LIKE THEY HAD

GONE OUT FOR THE DAY.

LORRAINE WENT INTO ONE ROOM,

WHICH LATER-- ONE OF THE

BEDROOMS-- AND IT TURNED OUT TO

HAVE BEEN RONNIE DeFEO'S ROOM

AND SHE BACKED RIGHT OUT

OF THERE.

AND SO AFTER THAT I TOOK ED AND

LORRAINE TO MEET KATHY,

GEORGE AND THE KIDS.

...IT'S BEEN A LONG TIME.

>> THE LAST TIME I WAS HERE--

I WAS NINE, MAYBE 10.

>> Lorraine: COME IN.

OH... >> WOW... HEY...

>> MY... GOD.

>> HOW ARE YOU? [KISSES]

IT'S SO NICE TO SEE YOU.

HOW ARE YOU?

>> OH, MY GOODNESS...

I'M WELL, THANK YOU.

HOW ARE YOU?

>> MAN... I'M DOING WELL.

GOOD-- GLAD TO BE HERE.

>> OH, IT'S GOOD TO SEE YOU.

VERY, VERY GOOD TO SEE YOU.

>> I HAVEN'T SEEN YOU,

BUT I'M SORRY ABOUT ED.

>> THANK YOU, HONEY.

SO AM I.

SO AM I, HONEY.

YEAH, THERE'LL NEVER BE

ANOTHER ED.

>> NO, THERE WON'T.

NO, THERE WON'T.

WE'LL TALK ABOUT THAT A LITTLE

BIT RIGHT NOW, ALL RIGHT?

>> YES, YES--

HE WAS A MAN AMONGST MEN.

[ROOSTER CROWS]

>> EINSTEIN IS--

THAT'S EINSTEIN--

>> SHOW ME, PLEASE? SHOW ME?

>> COME ON, YOU WANT TO SEE?

>> SURE.

>> WELL, WHAT THIS HOUSE IS

LIKE, THIS IS EINSTEIN

AND LADY JANE RIGHT HERE.

THIS IS EINSTEIN AND LADY JANE.

AND... [ROOSTER CROWS]

AGAIN. [DANIEL CHUCKLES]

RIGHT HERE IS HIS TWIN--

IDENTICAL TWIN...

>> NO WAY. >> YES.

IDENTICAL TWIN ROOSTERS.

[ROOSTER CROWS]

[DANIEL LAUGHS]

THEY'RE GREETING YOU.

>> Daniel: LORRAINE AND MY MOM

HAD A VERY, VERY TIGHT

RELATIONSHIP, THE TWO OF THEM.

THEY WERE REALLY THE ONLY PEOPLE

THAT COULD OFFER SOME TYPE OF

CONDOLENCE TO THE SITUATION

THAT HAD HAPPENED.

>> Lorraine: YES, LET'S GO

DOWNSTAIRS WHERE WE CAN SIT

AND TALK.

>> THIS IS FUCKING NUTS.

>> Lorraine: WHAT TOOK PLACE

IN THAT HOUSE, IT WAS A TRUE

PERSONIFICATION OF EVIL.

HOW DO YOU EXPLAIN EVIL?

I ASKED KATHY IF WE COULD TAKE

YOU THREE KIDS FOR A WALK ON THE

BEACH AND THAT'S WHEN YOU KIDS

TALKED TO ED AND I.

>> I REMEMBER. >> Didio: WHAT

DID THEY TELL YOU?

>> WELL, WE DIDN'T WANT TO

FRIGHTEN THEM, WE TOLD KATHY.

AND WE LET YOU GUYS TALK.

REMEMBER THIS?

AND THEY WENT ABOUT THE NOISES

AND THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT HOW

HE WOULD STAND AT THE TOP OF THE

STAIRS AND YELL AND SCREAM ABOUT

MARCHING BANDS THAT WERE

DOWNSTAIRS AND RUGS THAT WERE

ALL ROLLED UP.

>> DO YOU THINK THAT GEORGE

TRIGGERED WHATEVER WAS

IN THE HOUSE?

THAT IT WAS ATTRACTED TO HIM,

ALMOST LIKE...

>> HIS PERSONALITY? >> MM-HMM.

>> IT'S A STRONG POSSIBILITY.

IT IS A STRONG POSSIBILITY,

BUT YOU HAD TO KIND OF PAD

YOURSELF TO TAKE GEORGE ON.

I MEAN THAT.

YOU HAD TO WALK ON YOUR TIPTOES

BECAUSE ANYTHING COULD

OFFEND HIM.

>> I HAVE TO BE CAREFUL WITH MY

WORDS WHEN IT COMES TO GEORGE.

>> HOW WAS HE AS A FATHER?

>> HE WASN'T.

HE HAD NO FATHER--

PARENT SKILLS WHATSOEVER.

WHATSOEVER.

>> WHO DID YOU TURN TO?

>> I'M REMOVED FROM THE FAMILY,

YOU KNOW, AS A VERY YOUNG

TEENAGER AND MY MOTHER AND

GEORGE SUBSEQUENTLY WOUND UP

GETTING A DIVORCE THREE

YEARS LATER. >> YES.

>> AND MY MOM HAD HER HANDS FULL

WITH HER OWN FAMILY AND SHE WAS

VERY SICK AND I WAS OUT FINDING

MYSELF IN LIFE AND SHE WAS HAPPY

FOR ME, SO, YOU KNOW, WE JUST

KIND OF HAD A--

>> OH, WELL, THAT'S GOOD.

BUT YOU NEVER DID ANYTHING BAD.

SO, I MEAN...

BUT, HE...

HOW OLD WERE YOU WHEN GEORGE

LEFT THE SCENE?

>> I WAS 16, 17. >> HMM.

>> MM-HMM. >> Didio : BUT

AT THAT POINT WERE YOU--

>> I WAS ALREADY GONE FOR YEARS

AT THAT TIME, AND--

>> YOU WERE GONE?

WHERE WERE YOU?

>> DOING MY OWN THING.

AND I COULDN'T HAVE BEEN HAPPIER

FOR HER WHEN I FOUND OUT THAT

MOM WAS GETTING A DIVORCE

FINALLY AFTER ALL OF THESE

YEARS, AND I DIDN'T WANT TO

EVER HAVE TO DO A, "MOM,

I TOLD YOU SO," BUT I DID IT.

"I TOLD YOU SO."

>> DANNY LEFT HOME WHEN HE WAS

15 OR 16.

>> WHERE DID YOU GO?

>> UH... TO THE DESERT.

>> DID YOU LIVE IN THE DESERT?

>> YEAH, I DID.

>> HOW DID YOU--

>> I STAYED WITH FRIENDS,

FRIENDS STAYED WITH ME.

IT TOOK A WHILE.

IT'S VERY EASY TO BE HOMELESS

IN THE DESERT.

IT'S ACTUALLY QUITE

ACCOMMODATING.

DOESN'T GET COLD, YOU KNOW?

>> WELL, IT GETS COLD AT NIGHT

AND YOU ROAST IN THE DAYTIME.

>> YEAH, YEAH.

THERE'S A LOT OF GOOD FOOD

OUT THERE, TOO.

>> DID IT BUILD CHARACTER?

>> A LITTLE BIT, LITTLE BIT.

>> Dr. Bartell: WHEN DID THAT

HAPPEN THAT YOU BECAME SO

COMPLETELY INDEPENDENT?

>> THERE WAS A DAY I WENT

TO MY MOM AND I SAID, "LOOK,

SOMEBODY IS REALLY GONNA GET

HURT AROUND HERE," AND I...

AND I ASKED HER TO LET ME GO.

"MOM, PLEASE."

>> WHERE DID YOU GO AT 13-1/2?

>> WELL, IT'S NOT ABOUT

WHERE I WENT.

I COULD BE IN THE BACK PARKING

LOT BEHIND A DUMPSTER AND BE THE

HAPPIEST SON OF BITCH BECAUSE

NOBODY'S BOTHERING ME!

>> O.K., SO YOU WERE STILL--

>> IT WASN'T ABOUT WHERE.

WITH ME, IT'S NEVER ABOUT

WHERE I AM.

>> OH, O.K.

>> BUT THIS IS WHERE THE PART OF

THE STORY IS NOBODY KNOWS WHAT'S

GOING ON BEHIND OUR FRONT DOOR.

>> WHAT WAS GOING ON BEHIND

THE FRONT DOOR?

>> "MOM, PLEASE LET ME GO."

>> O.K. >> "LET ME GO!" >> O.K.

>> AND IT TOOK A COUPLE OF DAYS

AND SHE MADE ME A COUPLE PEANUT

BUTTER AND JELLY SANDWICHES AND

WASHED MY SOCKS AND SHIT LIKE

THAT, BUT SHE LET ME GO.

>> WOW.

THAT WAS BRAVE OF HER.

>> IT WAS PRETTY COOL.

>> YEAH.

>> Lorraine: CAN I BLAME IT

ON THE PERSONALITY OF PEOPLE

THAT LIVED IN THE HOUSE?

CAN I DO THAT?

DO I HAVE THE RIGHT TO DO THAT?

YOU KNOW, I DON'T HAVE THE RIGHT

TO DO ANYTHING LIKE THAT.

SO-- AND YOU'VE MET WITH THE

CLERGY AND THE CLERGY WEREN'T

TOO FORWARD TO WANT TO GO IN

THERE AND DO ANYTHING MORE AND

TOLD MY HUSBAND, "PLEASE DO NOT

GO IN THAT HOUSE AGAIN.

PLEASE.

ITS GONNA KILL YOU.

DON'T GO IN THAT HOUSE AGAIN."

>> WAS THAT THE LAST TIME

YOU WERE THERE?

DID YOU GO BACK?

>> YES.

>> WHAT ABOUT DANNY?

DID DANNY POSE A THREAT?

>> DANNY WAS A LITTLE BOY.

DANNY WAS JUST A YOUNG,

INNOCENT CHILD.

WERE YOU BAPTIZED? >> YES.

>> SO, SEE, THEY HAD

THAT PROTECTION.

BUT YOU MUST HAVE THE FAITH.

>> I HAVE FAITH. >> YEAH, I KNOW

YOU HAVE FAITH. >> I HAVE FAITH.

>> GOOD.

UM, IS THERE ANYBODY HERE

THAT DOES NOT BELIEVE IN GOD?

>> Man: I [INDISTINCT]

>> YOU BETTER CHIME IN NOW

'CAUSE I'M GONNA CALL YOU OUT

ON IT. >> Man: WHO?

>> YOU! WHAT'S YOUR ANSWER?

>> Man 2: DANNY WANTS TO KNOW

IF YOU BELIEVE IN GOD?

>> Man: I DON'T KNOW.

I'M STILL FINDING MY WAY.

>> THE JURY'S STILL OUT.

>> WHAT DOES THAT MEAN?

>> Man: NO, IT'S JUST I HAVE NOT

HAD THE EXPERIENCES THAT YOU

BOTH HAVE HAD.

>> Didio : SO ARE YOU SAYING

YOU'RE AGNOSTIC?

>> Man 2: WE GOT TWO AGNOSTICS.

>> O.K., WELL, IT'S OUT OF

RESPECT, WHAT I'M SAYING HERE.

I'M OPENING THIS AND THERE'S A

RELIC OF THE TRUE CROSS THAT

CHRIST WAS CRUCIFIED ON.

YOU KNOW?

AND I DON'T KNOW HOW RESPECTFUL

THAT IS TO BRING IT OUT...

>> WELL, LORRAINE, AS ANOTHER

ROMAN CATHOLIC WHO BELIEVES,

CERTAINLY JESUS WAS CONFRONTED

WITH DOUBTERS.

DOUBTING THOMAS, SO...

>> O.K.

O.K., HERE'S...

[ROOSTER CROWS]

THERE IS THE WOOD, RIGHT THERE.

IT'S OFF THE TRUE CROSS THAT

CHRIST WAS CRUCIFIED ON.

THIS IS WRITTEN BY THE

CLERGYMAN.

"THIS CROSS IS GOOD AND TRUE.

THE GOOD YOU DO WITH THIS CROSS

IS THE GOOD YOU DO FOR HIM."

>> DID YOU TAKE THAT INTO THE

AMITYVILLE HOUSE?

>> I DIDN'T HAVE IT.

I DIDN'T HAVE THIS AT THAT TIME.

AND NOW, HERE...

THIS IS HAIR FROM PADRE PIO.

I DID HAVE THIS.

I HAD THIS IN MY HAND,

BUT NOBODY KNEW IT.

NOBODY KNEW I CARRIED

THIS RELIC.

>> Didio : BOTH TIMES?

>> BOTH TIMES.

>> FEBRUARY 23rd AND MARCH 6th?

>> NOBODY KNEW THAT I HAD THIS,

AND THEN HE APPEARED.

>> PADRE PIO APPEARED TO YOU?

>> YES, HE DID, MM-HMM.

>> AND YOU FEEL THAT

THAT PROTECTED YOU?

>> MOST DEFINITELY.

IT WAS LIKE VINDICATION.

THAT'S HOW I READ IT.

THAT'S HOW I SEE IT.

[♪...]

>> THIS IS AMAZING STUFF.

>> WELL, YOU HAVE FAITH.

YOU CAN KISS THAT. >> MAY I?

>> YOU CAN KISS IT, YES.

>> THANK YOU.

THIS IS AMAZING.

THIS IS ABSOLUTELY AMAZING.

>> IT IS AMAZING.

>> THANK YOU.

>> IT'S GOT ME THROUGH.

THIS WAS WITH ED ALL THE TIME

IN THE HOSPITAL.

ED NEVER TRULY RECOVERED.

I BROUGHT HIM HOME

[♪...]
AND HE LIVED FOUR YEARS.

AND HE LIVED FOUR YEARS.

>> Didio: WHAT WOULD YOU SAY

TO SOMEBODY WHO SAYS, "O.K.,

THIS KID OBVIOUSLY HAS A BIG

PROBLEM WITH HIS STEPFATHER."

BUT THAT'S NOT SO UNUSUAL.

THEY COULD PUT IT DOWN TO "O.K.,

YOU'VE NOW GOT A BLENDED FAMILY

AND IT'S NOT THE BRADY BUNCH."

>> O.K.

>> O.K., "DANNY'S SKIPPING

SCHOOL, HE'S DOING WHATEVER

HE CAN TO BE DEFIANT."

>> THERE WAS A SMALL PART OF ME

THAT LOOKED FORWARD TO GETTING

IN TROUBLE AND WOULD DO ANYTHING

'CAUSE IT'S LIKE WHEN THERE WAS

ANGER IN THE HOUSE, MORE SHIT

WAS GOING ON IN THE HOUSE.

THE MORE TRAUMATIC AND THE MORE

DYSFUNCTIONAL IT GOT,

THE WORSE IT GOT.

>> DID YOU FEEL LIKE THE ENERGY

WAS FEEDING OFF OF YOUR

AGGRESSIONS, TENSIONS?

>> YES. YES, THAT'S COME UP MANY

TIMES IN LIFELONG THERAPY, YES.

>> AND HAS ANYBODY EVER SAID TO

YOU, "O.K., DANNY, MAYBE THIS IS

JUST MANIFESTATIONS.

MAYBE YOU IMAGINED ALL OF THIS."

>> YEAH, MAYBE IT WAS IN THE

KOOL-AID TOO, RIGHT?

>> WELL, WHAT DO YOU SAY WHEN

SOMEBODY SAYS THAT TO YOU?

>> I GET UP AND I WALK OUT.

END OF DISCUSSION.

I STOPPED TRYING TO PERSUADE

PEOPLE ABOUT THIS. >> O.K.

>> A REALLY LONG TIME AGO.

>> WHAT MAKE-- TELL ME,

WHAT MAKES YOU SO SURE

AND SO CONVINCED THAT...

THIS REALLY HAPPENED TO YOU?

THAT YOU... DIDN'T IMAGINE IT?

AND I'M SURE YOU'VE HAD THOSE

FEELINGS WHERE YOU'RE SAYING,

O.K.-- IS THERE ANY PART

WHERE YOU SAY--

>> I'M SECOND-GUESSING MYSELF.

>> YEAH, BUT IS THERE ANY--

HAS THERE BEEN ANY POINT IN TIME

WHERE YOU'RE SAYING, "O.K.,

I WAS AN ANGRY KID.

I'M REALLY TICKED OFF."

DID YOU EVER DOUBT YOURSELF

THAT THIS HAPPENED?

>> NO. >> DID YOU-- NEVER HAD

A POINT WHERE YOU SAID--

>> NO, IT WAS ALL TOO CLEAR AND

ALL TOO REAL AND WHAT I SAW,

I KNOW I SAW, AND I COULD

DESCRIBE IT TO YOU 20 YEARS

FROM NOW EXACTLY LIKE I DID

RIGHT NOW.

NOTHING'S GONNA CHANGE.

>> DID YOU HAVE ANY SENSE THAT

WHATEVER WAS THERE WAS-- WOULD

FOLLOW YOU OFF THE PROPERTY?

>> [QUIETLY] YEAH.

>> WHEN DID THAT START

TO HAPPEN?

>> WHEN I WAS WANDERING AROUND

IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD WHILE I'M

[♪...]
SUPPOSED TO BE GOING TO SCHOOL.

SUPPOSED TO BE GOING TO SCHOOL.

...My mother and the three of us

were basically naive to that

which George was into

as his own personal, uh...

>> Man: Recreation?

>> Daniel: Right.

You know, and then only slowly--

he wasn't entering some world

as we met him, he was in full

swing in his world...

in his beliefs and that which he

practiced and one is to be able

to control somebody else's mind,

some of it's to be able

to control an object.

He mastered both of them.

I don't know who taught it

to him, I don't know how long

it took... don't know.

...I THINK SOMEWHERE ALONG

THE LINE THAT GEORGE'S BELIEFS

AND PRACTICES AND THINGS THAT HE

WAS DIRECTLY INVOLVED WITH

TRIGGERED AND WAS A CATALYST TO

WHAT WAS GOING ON IN THE HOUSE,

AND IT WAS KIND OF LIKE

A MAGIC TRICK GONE BAD

THAT YOU COULDN'T SHUT OFF.

>> WHAT WAS HE INVOLVED WITH?

>> UH, LAYING OF HANDS AND, UH,

WHAT DO YOU CALL THAT WHEN YOU

CAN MOVE OBJECTS WITH YOUR MIND

AND WITH YOUR HANDS?

>> TELEKINESIS.

>> TELEKINESIS.

UH, THOUGHT PROJECTION.

>> WHEN DID THIS START?

>> SOON AS, UH, THE FIRST MINUTE

I WALKED INTO HIS HOUSE AND I

REALIZED THIS WAS THE SHIT

THAT'S ON HIS BOOKSHELVES.

>> WELL, I MEAN IF YOU WALKED

INTO-- >> RIGHT.

>> IF YOU WALKED INTO MY HOUSE

AND YOU LOOKED IN MY BOOKCASE,

YOU WOULD PRETTY MUCH SEE A LOT

OF THINGS ON PSYCHIC--

>> DO YOU HAVE SATAN'S BIBLES

WITH BOOKMARKS IN IT?

AND PICTURES AND PHOTOGRAPHS

ALL OVER ON THE WALL?

>> NO, BUT I HAVE A LOT OF BOOKS

ON VARIOUS ASPECTS

OF PARAPSYCHOLOGY,

THE SUPERNATURAL.

I HAVE A COUPLE BOOKS ON

WITCHCRAFT AND MAGIC, BUT LET'S

FACE IT, I MEAN, WHAT DO YOU

THINK THE CHANCES--

REALISTICALLY, WHAT DO YOU THINK

THE CHANCES WERE THAT NO MATTER

HOW MANY BOOKS GEORGE READ

THAT HE WAS GONNA ABLE TO START

MOVING OBJECTS WITH HIS MIND?

>> I WITNESSED IT.

>> YOU WITNESSED WHAT, EXACTLY?

>> GEORGE'S ABILITY TO MOVE

OBJECTS WITHOUT TOUCHING THEM,

WITH HIS MIND.

>> BEFORE-- >> IN HIS GARAGE

BEFOREsWE EVEN GOT TO

AMITYVILLE.

AND HE WAS IN THE GARAGE

WITH HIS FRIENDS.

UH, HE CAN MOVE WRENCHES JUST

LIKE THAT, LIKE THIS AND WALK

OVER AND PUT THEM DOWN.

IT TAKES HIM A COUPLE OF MINUTES

TO GET THERE, IT TAKES ABOUT--

ONCE HE'S GOT IT IN HIS HAND,

IT WOULD TAKE ABOUT A MINUTE TO

DROP IT BUT HE CAN DO IT.

AND I WAS NOT SUPPOSED TO KNOW

THIS, I JUST STUMBLED IN ON IT

AFTER SCHOOL.

AND MY MOTHER DIDN'T KNOW, AND I

WENT RUNNING INTO THE HOUSE--

I DIDN'T KNOW IF SHE KNEW AT

THAT TIME, AND I WENT AND TOLD

HER, AND SHE LOOKED AT ME LIKE,

"WHAT?"

I PULLED HER OUT INTO THE

GARAGE, I SAID, "I WANT YOU TO

SHOW MY MOM WHAT YOU JUST DID

RIGHT NOW," AND THE GUYS GOT UP

AND LEFT.

DIDN'T SAY A WORD.

AND I HAD A DOCTOR'S APPOINTMENT

THAT NIGHT, TOO, AND I WENT AND

I TOLD THE DOCTOR SECOND BY

SECOND WHAT HAD HAPPENED.

HE DIDN'T OFFER AN EXPLANATION,

HE JUST KEPT WRITING.

>> WHAT DO YOU THINK HE SAID?

>> WELL, HE HAD CONVERSATION

WITH MY MOM, YOU KNOW.

I DON'T KNOW, SHE DROPPED ME

OFF, SHE'S IN THE WAITING ROOM,

SHE COMES IN 50 MINUTES LATER,

THEY TALK FOR ANOTHER 20 MINUTES

AND WE GO HOME.

>> AT THIS POINT IF I WERE THE

DOCTOR, I WOULD'VE RECOMMENDED

TO YOUR MOTHER...

>> FIND A NEW BOYFRIEND.

>> OR HE NEEDS-- YOUR SON NEEDS

TO GO FOR TESTS OR SOMETHING.

THIS IS JUST AN INCREDIBLE TALE.

>> YEAH.

SO, THERE'S A DOCTOR OUT THERE

SOMEWHERE WITH THAT STORY

IN HIS FILE CABINET.

IN HANDWRITING.

>> Woman: PEOPLE CAN EXAGGERATE

WHAT THEY'VE EXPERIENCED.

THEY CAN EXAGGERATE A LITTLE

OR EXAGGERATE A LOT.

THEY CAN ADD DETAILS TO AN

EXPERIENCE TO MAKE THE STORY

MORE INTERESTING.

AND THAT THERE ARE LOTS OF

REASONS WHY PEOPLE MIGHT

DO THAT.

I MEAN, FOR ONE THING,

WE REMEMBER BITS AND PIECES OF

EXPERIENCE, BUT WE'LL FILL IN

THE GAPS IN OUR MEMORY WITH

OTHER BITS OF INFORMATION,

THINGS WE LEARNED FROM OTHER

PLACES, INFERENCES WE DREW,

WHICH WE DECIDE PROBABLY

HAPPENED, AND WE USE THOSE TO

FILL IN THE GAPS IN MEMORY.

THERE ALSO MAY BE A MOTIVATION

TO REMEMBER THINGS IN A WAY THAT

IS A LITTLE BIT MORE DRAMATIC

AND A LITTLE BIT MORE

INTERESTING.

DANNY NOW BELIEVES THAT HE SAW

HIS STEPFATHER MOVE OBJECTS

WITHOUT TOUCHING THEM, AND THE

QUESTION IS WHERE DID THAT

COME FROM?

IT MIGHT BE A SPECULATION

THAT IT COULD'VE COME FROM THE

STEPFATHER SAYING, YOU KNOW,

"I CAN DO THIS," AND THE LITTLE

BOY STARTED TO THINK,

"I SAW HIM DO IT."

>> Jordan: WHEN THE STORIES

START TO CHANGE, THEN IT'S TIME

TO BECOME SUSPICIOUS.

I'D BE AFRAID TO BE IN THAT

HOUSE KNOWING THAT THERE HAD

BEEN A MASS MURDER, AND AGAIN,

WE GO BACK TO THE WHOLE THING

ABOUT WHERE DOES THE

IMAGINATION-- >> RIGHT.

>> ...START AND THIS TAKE OFF?

AND THEN THE INFLUENCE OF A

FATHER FEELING THIS ON CHILDREN,

WHO-- I'VE BEEN INVOLVED WITH

SO MANY OF THESE CASES, WHERE

CHILDREN ARE SO SENSITIVE,

NOT ONLY TO WHAT'S HAPPENING

IN AN ENVIRONMENT POSSIBLY

PARANORMALLY, BUT ALSO

TO THE CUES THEY GET

FROM THEIR PARENTS.

MOST PEOPLE DO NOT WANT

THE GLARE OF THE MEDIA.

THEY DO NOT WANT THEIR NAMES

REVEALED BECAUSE OF THEIR

BUSINESS ASSOCIATIONS AND

EVERYTHING ELSE THAT CAN BE

AFFECTED NEGATIVELY.

THEY DON'T WANT TO EXPOSE

THEIR CHILDREN.

VERY IMPORTANT-- DO NOT.

ANY LOVING PARENT DOES NOT WANT

TO INFLICT THAT ON A CHILD.

ANYONE WHO DOES THAT IS AS

DEMONIC AS THE SO-CALLED FORCES

THAT WERE UNLEASHED

IN THIS CASE.

[♪...]

>> Daniel: PSYCHOLOGICAL SCARS

ARE SOMETHING THAT ARE HARD TO

EXPOSE AND SHARE WITH PEOPLE,

AND WHILE I'M AN EXTREMELY

EMOTIONAL PERSON BY NATURE,

THAT DOESN'T MEAN I LIKE

TO SHARE THAT.

>> Loftus: WHEN YOU WATCH HIM

TELL THESE STORIES, HE LOOKS

VERY BELIEVABLE.

AND HE TELLS THE STORY IN A WAY

THAT IS ALMOST GUARANTEED TO GET

OTHER PEOPLE TO BELIEVE HIM.

IT'S DETAILED, HE'S CONFIDENT,

HE EXPRESSES IT WITH EMOTION.

THOSE ARE THE THINGS THAT PEOPLE

LOOK TO, TO DECIDE THAT THEY'RE

HEARING AN AUTHENTIC STORY.

IN MY OPINION, THE SUGGESTION

WITH THIS 10-YEAR-OLD BOY

STARTED WHEN HE WAS 10.

HE LIVED WITH ADULTS WHO

BELIEVED IN THE PARANORMAL,

WHO BELIEVED IN THE OCCULT,

WHO PERHAPS WERE-- WHO HAD

BOOKS ON THE PARANORMAL AND

TELEKINESIS, WHO MAY HAVE BEEN

TALKING ABOUT THINGS.

AND THEN DISCUSSIONS OF FAMILY

MEMBERS AND INTERVIEWS AND ALL

KINDS-- I MEAN, THERE'S A--

HE'S SOAKED IN SUGGESTION.

[MUSIC WAILING]

>> [LAUGHING]

>> Loftus: I THINK ONE EXCELLENT

EXAMPLE OF THAT IS THE STORY

ABOUT A PRIEST COMING

TO BLESS THE HOUSE.

AND THEN FOUR OR FIVE YEARS

LATER, THERE'S A FILM THAT COMES

OUT WHICH SHOWS THAT THAT PRIEST

IS OVERTAKEN BY A SWARM

OF FLIES.

AND NOW THIS ONCE-10-YEAR-OLD

BOY, NOW OLDER, HAS GOT A

RECOLLECTION OF REMEMBERING

FLIES, HUNDREDS AND HUNDREDS

OF FLIES.

SO, DID HE GET THAT FROM THE

POST-EVENT SUGGESTION OF THE

FILM, UH, OR NOT?

[WATER SPLASHING...]

>> Man: THE LAST NIGHT

IN THE HOUSE--

WHEN DID YOU LEAVE?

>> Daniel: IT WAS A SCHOOL DAY.

IT WAS A REGULAR DAY

DURING THE WEEK.

MY BROTHER AND MYSELF, UM...

[SIGHS]

SHARED A LEVITATION EXPERIENCE

IN OUR BEDROOM, IN OUR BEDS.

THIS WOULD BE OUR BEDROOM HERE.

THIS-- MY BED WAS UNDER THIS

WINDOW AND HIS BED WAS THIS WAY

ON THAT WALL.

SO, WE WOULD BE LIKE TOE TO TOE

THAT WAY IN THE ROOM

WHEN YOU WALK IN.

WE BOTH WOKE UP THAT OUR

HEADBOARDS, OUR FOOTBOARDS,

WERE SMASHING EACH OTHER AND

BANGING OFF THE CEILING.

[♪...]

>> George: On the last night

that we were in there, the boys'

beds were being lifted up and

slammed down overhead of me, but

I could not get up out of bed.

Kathy levitated, and I had to

grab her to keep her from going

off the bed.

This is after she had...

turned into an old crone,

a really ugly old woman that

literally took hours and hours

for it to go away.

We tried to talk to Father Ray

a number of times.

We got phone static, got hung up

on, unable to call him from

the house-- I would go

to my office and I'd be able

to talk to him and tell him

what was going on.

We asked him to come back to the

house, to bless it-- you know,

the blessing hadn't worked.

He asked us why we were still

there; that's when it was, like,

slammed home: we gotta leave.

>> I HAD NO SAY IN MOVING AND

MOM DIDN'T SAY "GO PACK A BAG,

WE'RE GOING TO GRANDMA'S,"

JUST "GET IN THE VAN,

WE'RE GETTING OUT OF HERE."

WHATEVER, I DON'T KNOW WE'RE

NEVER COMING BACK HERE.

I DON'T KNOW WE'RE LEAVING EVERY

FUCKING THING I'VE EVER OWNED.

>> O.K., SO YOU JUST RAN OUT?

YOU WERE ALL IN YOUR

NIGHTCLOTHES?

>> YEAH, I WAS WEARING WHATEVER

I GOT SENT, YOU KNOW, IT WAS

HALF PAJAMAS, T-SHIRT AND YOU

KNOW, THAT'S IT.

>> Didio: THEY WEREN'T GOING

BACK TO THE HOUSE.

THEY LEFT ALL THEIR

POSSESSIONS THERE.

LET THE BANK FORECLOSE

ON THE HOUSE.

THEY WERE THE SUBJECT

OF INTENSE SCRUTINY.

GEORGE WASN'T WORKING ANYMORE.

KATHY WASN'T WORKING.

SHE HAD THE THREE KIDS,

AND THEY MOVED.

THEY UP AND MOVED TO THE OTHER

SIDE OF THE COUNTRY.

YOU KNOW, THEY WANTED TO GET

AS FAR AWAY FROM AMITYVILLE

AS THEY COULD.

>> Daniel: WE WERE LOOKING

FOR FAMILY THERAPY.

AND I SAID, "MOM..." [SIGHS]

"WE CAN'T EVEN TALK ABOUT THIS

IN OUR OWN HOUSE AND COME UP

WITH LOGICAL EXPLANATIONS,

AND NOW YOU WANT TO TELL THE

WORLD WHAT WE CAN'T EVEN

FIGURE OUT OURSELVES?

WHY WOULD YOU WANT TO DO THAT?

HOW ARE WE GONNA DO THAT?

WHY ARE YOU DOING THAT?"

...THERE'S NOBODY IN THE

NEIGHBORHOOD WHO DOESN'T KNOW

MY MOM, AND SHE'S GOING ON TV

SHOWS, AND YET I'D SIT THERE

IN, YOU KNOW, IN SCHOOL AS A

GRADE-SCHOOL STUDENT AND, "DUDE,

YOUR MOVIE WAS ON LAST NIGHT.

DID THAT REALLY HAPPEN?"

>> AND WHAT WOULD YOU SAY?

>> [SCOFFS]

I'D WANT TO JUST LIKE FUCKING

PUNCH YOU IN THE FACE AND LEAVE.

>> RIGHT.

>> THEY WERE CHASED

ALL OVER THE COUNTRY.

I MEAN LITERALLY CHASED.

THE KIDS COULDN'T GO TO SCHOOL.

HARASSED.

I MEAN, THIS IS BEFORE

PAPARAZZI.

THEY WOULDN'T LEAVE THEM ALONE.

NO PHONE CALLS, NOTHING.

THAT'S HOW WE TRACKED THEIR

MOVEMENTS WAS THROUGH THE MEDIA.

>> Daniel: ONCE THE AMITYVILLE

THING HAPPENED AND I STARTED

CHANGING MENTALLY AND

EMOTIONALLY, I JUST REDIRECTED

EVERYTHING AND BECAME

HYPER-AGGRESSIVE.

APPARENTLY, THEY GOT A LARGE

ADVANCE TO DO A PROMOTIONAL TOUR

AND IT WAS GONNA BE FOR PROBABLY

CLOSE TO A YEAR, IF NOT MAYBE

A LITTLE MORE.

THEY'RE GOING ON THIS WORLD TOUR

AND I WOUND UP GETTING DUMPED

OFF AT A CATHOLIC CHURCH

MONASTERY SCHOOL.

I HAD AN AUTHORITY PROBLEM AND I

DIDN'T CARE IF THE PRIESTS WERE

BEATING THE SHIT OUT OF ME,

PERFORMING EXORCISMS ON ME,

WHICH, IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN,

THEY DON'T WANT TO TALK ABOUT.

>> Man: TELL ME ABOUT THAT.

WHAT DO YOU MEAN PERFORMING

EXORCISMS?

>> PERFORMING EXORCISMS.

LIKE SPEAKING IN TONGUES, LAYING

ON HANDS, HOLY WATER SPLASHING,

VIOLENT FUCKING BODILY

CONVULSIONS AND--

WHICH PART OF EXORCISM

DO I NEED TO EXPLAIN TO YOU?

>> Man: WELL, WHY WOULD THEY

HAVE DONE THIS?

>> BECAUSE I WAS POSSESSED

BY A SPIRIT THAT I COULD NOT

GET RID OF ON MY OWN.

[♪...]

SO, I RAN AWAY FROM THE CHURCH

A COUPLE OF TIMES.

THE PRIESTS BEAT THE SHIT

OUT OF ME, DUDE.

>> Man: SO, DID GEORGE AND KATHY

HAVE ANY COMMUNICATION WITH YOU

DURING THIS TIME?

THEY JUST DUMPED YOU OFF AND--

>> I DIDN'T TALK TO MY MOTHER

FOR PROBABLY THE BETTER PART

OF A YEAR.

AND TO BE HONEST, WHEN SHE

SHOWED UP, I DIDN'T HAVE

[APPLAUSE, ♪...]
MUCH TO SAY.

MUCH TO SAY.

>> Merv Griffin: In many ways,

it will follow you for a long,

long, long time to come.

Why did you go public?

>> Kathy: Well, before we went

public, some other people

stepped in and did it for us.

And there were very widely

exaggerated stories in the

press, on the media.

And in order to correct some of

those things and be able to live

with ourselves, we had to come

forward and tell our story.

[METAL CREAKING IN DISTANCE]

>> Daniel: The world that I knew

no longer existed.

I could not separate reality

from what was going on there.

There came a point where it was

like this family nightmare

come true, uh, and I could not--

it was almost like being awake

in your own dream.

But I used to live in a life of,

you know, a structured life.

And then all of the sudden,

you know, in a matter of like,

I don't know, a six-month period

of this whole time, you know,

we're gonna be looking for

houses and now I'm gonna-- and

moved and moved and moved and

moved and, you know, I have

no friends.

This guy that beats the shit out

of me and Mom who's no longer

the mom I used to know.

[TAPE RECORDER CLICKS]

...I WOULD SAY BETWEEN 12 AND 15

I PROBABLY RAN AWAY ABOUT

EIGHT TIMES, FOR A TOTAL

OF ABOUT TWO YEARS.

I WOULD'VE BEEN ABOUT, UH...

JUST TURNED 15, SOMETHING.

I HAD A PERMIT AND I WAS GONE.

"LATER."

LIVED IN THE ORANGE GROVES,

SALT LAKE, GOT A JOB

IN A GAS STATION.

DIDN'T GO TO SCHOOL ANYMORE.

[STRUMS GUITAR BRIEFLY]

>> Didio: WHAT HAS BEEN THE

WORST PART OF THE WHOLE

AMITYVILLE EXPERIENCE FOR YOU?

>> Daniel: THAT I DIDN'T GET TO

TELL MY STORY THE FIRST TIME.

>> ARE THERE ANY SILVER

LININGS IN THE CLOUD?

ANYTHING COME OUT OF AMITYVILLE

THAT YOU FEEL WAS GOOD?

>> I'M GONNA GO WITH

STRENGTH BEYOND STRENGTH

THAT I DIDN'T KNOW THAT I HAD.

[♪...]

>> Didio: WAS THERE A TIME WHEN

THE HAUNTINGS OR THE STRANGE

INCIDENTS STOPPED?

>> Daniel: WELL, THEY HAD

STOPPED FOR ME IN ARIZONA

WHILE I WAS BY MYSELF.

>> DO YOU BELIEVE THEY

STOPPED FOR THE REST

>> I DON'T KNOW.
OF THE FAMILY?

OF THE FAMILY?

IT... INVOKED THE ONLY THING IN

LIFE THAT... THAT SCARES ME.

THE ONLY THINGS IN MY LIFE THAT

I TRULY FEAR ARE THE THINGS THAT

ARE JUST BEYOND MY CONTROL.

I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT MANMADE

SITUATIONS THAT ARE BEYOND

YOUR CONTROL.

THERE IS AN ELEMENT OF-- FOR

WHATEVER LABEL YOU WANT TO PUT

ON IT, YOU KNOW, EVIL OR DEMONIC

OR SPIRITS OR WHATEVER THE FUCK

YOU WANT TO CALL IT, IT EXISTS.

UNDER WHATEVER LABEL YOU WANT TO

PUT IT ON, AND THAT...

THAT'S THE HARDEST THING FOR ME

TO CONTINUE TO DEAL WITH,

ALL RIGHT, BECAUSE I KNOW

THAT IT'S TRUE.

[♪...]

>> Jordan: MY FEELING ABOUT IT

HAS ALWAYS BEEN THAT THE LUTZES

MAY HAVE EXPERIENCED WHAT I FELT

OR WHAT I CALL LOW-LEVEL

PARANORMAL PHENOMENON.

SOME OF IT HALLUCINOGENIC,

SOME OF IT NON-HALLUCINOGENIC.

SO, THE QUESTION BECOMES,

LET'S SAY WE COULD DO THIS

ALL OVER AGAIN.

AND LET'S SAY WE KEPT THE PRESS

OUT AND AN INVESTIGATOR WENT IN

AND TALKED TO THE LUTZES

AND TOOK THAT TESTIMONY.

COULD THE AMITYVILLE HORROR

AS WE KNOW IT HAVE BEEN SPAWNED?

MY FEELING IS NO, I DON'T--

EVEN WITH THE BACKDROP.

>> DOES ANYTHING HAPPEN?

>> ...AGAINST THE BACKDROP OF

THOSE MASS MURDERS, I DO NOT

BELIEVE, BASED UPON WHAT THE

LUTZES CLAIMED THAT THEY

EXPERIENCED IN THAT HOUSE, WOULD

BE ENOUGH TO MAKE THIS CASE

STAND OUT.

>> NOBODY COULD HAVE PREDICTED

WHAT HAS ENSUED.

>> SO, SOMETHING HAPPENED.

THE QUESTION IS WHAT?

AND THE EFFECT, PSYCHOLOGICALLY,

ON THE FAMILY.

>> Scott: I DO BELIEVE THE

LUTZES BELIEVE THAT THEY

EXPERIENCED SOMETHING

THAT WAS UNUSUAL.

I WANTED TO BELIEVE THE STORY.

I WANTED TO FIND SOME EVIDENCE

THAT IT WAS TRUE.

AS A REPORTER, WE ARE NATURALLY

VERY SKEPTICAL AND I SAY,

YOU KNOW, SHOW ME THE EVIDENCE.

AND THAT NIGHT I SAW NO EVIDENCE

OF ANYTHING THAT WAS UNUSUAL

IN THAT HOUSE.

>> Didio: I DO BELIEVE THAT

THERE ARE FORCES OUT THERE THAT

ARE BEYOND THE COMPREHENSION OF

OUR NORMAL FIVE SENSES.

I THINK THAT THERE WERE OTHER

FORCES AT WORK AND I THINK IT

WOULD BE VERY, VERY HARD FOR A

BOY WHO HAD JUST TURNED 10 YEARS

OLD TO DISTINGUISH BETWEEN,

IN SOME CASES, FACT, FANTASY,

REALITY, AND I THINK GEORGE'S

PARTICULAR PERSONALITY MADE HIM

SUSCEPTIBLE TO THAT

AND IT FED OFF OF HIM.

>> WELL, WHY DO YOU THINK

DANNY IS OUTRIGHT BLAMING HIM

FOR THE HAUNTING TO TAKE PLACE?

>> BECAUSE DANNY BLAMES GEORGE

FOR TAKING HIS MOTHER AWAY

AND FOR HAVING-- >> IT'S JUST

CONVENIENT FOR HIM TO DO THAT?

>> NO, I DON'T THINK IT'S

JUST CONVENIENT, I THINK

HE REALLY BELIEVES IT.

I MEAN, IN A SENSE IT WAS

A LOSS OF CONTROL.

>> Dr. Bartell: IT'S VERY HARD

TO HAVE GONE THROUGH LIFE HAVING

THE VAST MAJORITY OF PEOPLE

NOT BELIEVE YOU.

>> NOW YOU KNOW WHY I KEPT

MY MOUTH SHUT.

>> EXACTLY, I TOTALLY UNDERSTAND

NOW WHY YOU KEPT YOUR

MOUTH SHUT.

>> [EMOTIONALLY] I JUST WANTED

SOMEBODY TO BELIEVE ME.

>> RIGHT.

IT MUST'VE MADE YOU FEEL CRAZY

NOT HAVING PEOPLE BELIEVE YOU.

[BIRDS CHIRPING IN DISTANCE...]
>> YEAH.

>> YEAH.

>> Man: WOULD YOU BE WILLING TO

SUBMIT TO A LIE DETECTOR TEST?

A POLYGRAPH?

>> I'VE BEEN ASKED THAT MANY

TIMES AND I'VE HAD DOCTORS ASK

ME THAT, PRIESTS ASK ME THAT,

MY FRIENDS ASK ME THAT,

MY EX-WIFE ASKED ME THAT.

UM, IS THERE SOMETHING THAT

THAT LITTLE ELECTRONIC DEVICE

IS GONNA TELL YOU THAT YOU'RE

GONNA BELIEVE MORE THAN ME?

YEAH, WHAT IS THAT?

>> Man: I'M JUST-- I'M LISTENING

TO YOU, WHAT WOULD--

>> AND I'M WAITING FOR YOU

TO ANSWER ME.

>> WELL, IT'S A-- YEAH, I MEAN,

WOULD YOU OR WOULD YOU NOT?

>> UH, I'M GONNA HAVE WORDS

WITH YOU AFTER THIS IS DONE.

DON'T BE PULLING SHIT LIKE THAT

ON ME, ALL RIGHT?

THAT SHIT'S NOT FUNNY.

I WOULDN'T BE DOING THIS IF I

THOUGHT I NEEDED A FUCKING

LIE DETECTOR TEST.

WOULD I? YES.

DO I FEEL I NEED IT?

IS THIS GONNA SATISFY

YOUR FUCKING MIND?

>> Man: I'M NOT SAYING YOU'RE

LYING, DAN-- >> YEAH? >> I'M

JUST ASKING YOU-- A LOT OF

PEOPLE WOULD BE ASKING, WOULD--

>> OH, I KNOW THAT, DUDE.

I KNEW THAT LONG BEFORE

YOU ASKED ME.

>> Man: WELL, I'M JUST VOICING

THE OPINION OF THE AUDIENCE.

>> AND I'M GIVING YOU MY VOICE.

>> Man: WELL, I GUESS

THAT'S THE ANSWER, THEN.

ANYTHING ELSE YOU'D LIKE TO ADD?

>> NO.

[♪...]

[MUSIC ENDS]